# changes to MOT...



## J1ODY A (Nov 28, 2008)

_"There are to be some changes to the MOT test from 1st January 2012 which are being introduced in response to European Commission Directive 2010/48/EU of the 5th July 2010 and which will effect those with aftermarket HID headlights and remapped ECUs:

4.1.4 Compliance with requirements:
(a) Lamp, emitted colour, position or intensity not in accordance with the requirements 
(b) Products on lens or light source which obviously reduce light intensity or change emitted colour 
(c) Light source and lamp not compatible

4.1.5. Levelling devices (where mandatory):
(a) Device not operating.
(b) Manual device cannot be operated from driver's seat.

4.1.6 Headlamp cleaning device (where mandatory):
Device not operating.

For anyone with a remap, section 6.1.9 may be relevant.

6.1.9 Engine performance:
(a) Control unit illegal modified.
(b) Illegal engine modification.

(by 'illegal', it is assumed that they mean changed/programmed differently from OEM specifications)

There will also be a new check on the general condition of the wiring:

4.11. Electrical wiring
(a) Wiring insecure or not adequately secured.
(b) Wiring deteriorated.
(c) Damaged or deteriorated insulation

and on the function of airbag and seat belt pre-tensioner systems:

7.1.4. Safety belt Pre-tensioners: 
Pre-tensioner obviously missing or not suitable with the vehicle.

7.1.5. Airbag: 
(a) Airbags obviously missing or not suitable with the vehicle.
(b) Airbag obviously non-operative.

7.1.6. SRS Systems: 
SRS MIL indicates any kind of failure of the system."_

So, does that mean that all the good work AMDEssex & the like do, will make the car an MOT failure?!?


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## Stumper (Apr 5, 2009)

J1ODY A said:


> So, does that mean that all the good work AMDEssex & the like do, will make the car an MOT failure?!?


Only if all test stations spend a fortune on kit to check what software is on each and every car's ECU, and I can't see that happening!


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## MuZiZZle (Apr 18, 2011)

oh deary me, but it's not illegal ?!?!?


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## Raife (Jul 14, 2009)

I think this is a little vague. "Illegal"??


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

J1ODY A said:


> [
> 
> So, does that mean that all the good work AMDEssex & the like do, will make the car an MOT failure?!?


Not a chance, they would have to spend thousands and thousands on equipment to find out we have been playing. If most dealers can't even tell we have been there how can an MOT tester :lol:

I think they are talking more about these "tuning boxes" that plug into injector looms, temp sensors etc.


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## J1ODY A (Nov 28, 2008)

Interesting though, makes me glad I've just sold my remapped truck & making me wonder about getting my new car done... 

Argh Ben, thought you'd like this thread... yeah I was wondering how they would know & yes the naff tuning baoxes stick out a mile so easier to see... how much for a 1.8tdci focus remap


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## Elliott19864 (May 11, 2008)

Well that's a load of ****e because they won't be able to tell if it's mapped as said. And everyone will just remove the HIDS and fit the standard bulbs for the test!


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

There is no way they would be able to enforce it, this rumour has been floating around for a while and the only thing they can see is tuning boxes. 

£399.95 on the TDci's less 10% DW discount of course.


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## nick-a6 (Jun 9, 2007)

This has been posted before ages ago. you can read it on the vosa website and it actualy says the Illegal performance mods was just an idea and they haven't looked into the in's and outs of it.
If your car doesnt fail an mot for tinted front windows it aint gonna fail for a remap!


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## *Das* (Aug 9, 2010)

J1ODY A said:


> _ and which will effect those with aftermarket HID headlights :
> 
> 4.1.5. Levelling devices (where mandatory):
> (a) Device not operating.
> ...


_

As someone's already said this has been rumoured for ages, however as I have a fully retrofitted headlight washers and as the Vec comes with a manual levelling device that can be operated from the drivers seat I don't care, lol. _


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## J1ODY A (Nov 28, 2008)

nick-a6 said:


> This has been posted before ages ago. you can read it on the vosa website and it actualy says the Illegal performance mods was just an idea and they haven't looked into the in's and outs of it.
> If your car doesnt fail an mot for tinted front windows it aint gonna fail for a remap!


Yes this is taken from the VOSA website - makes you wonder though, and as for the tints there'd be a lot of cars in London that would fail instantly :lol:


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## nick-a6 (Jun 9, 2007)

Yup that's why the police can only really fine you for the tints.
Because its not an MOT fail, the garage won't pay for the light testing equipment. So they are never gonna pay for equipment to read everyones ECU etc.
Can you imagine how much they would charge for an MOT if they did that!! lol


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## *Das* (Aug 9, 2010)

nick-a6 said:


> Yup that's why the police can only really fine you for the tints.
> Because its not an MOT fail, the garage won't pay for the light testing equipment. So they are never gonna pay for equipment to read everyones ECU etc.
> Can you imagine how much they would charge for an MOT if they did that!! lol


A garage has no choice in the matter, if they don't meet the required operational standards they'd loose their ticket to do MOT's, and its VOSA that sets the maximum cost of an MOT, its up to individual garages if they charge less.


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## BAXRY (Aug 11, 2009)

I don't see how a remap is illegal, especially on turbo diesels that actually make them more fuel efficient when you drive them properly. 

I can't see this working to be totally honest.


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

BAXRY said:


> I don't see how a remap is illegal, especially on turbo diesels that actually make them more fuel efficient when you drive them properly.
> 
> I can't see this working to be totally honest.


Jumped up muppets making the rules who don't know what they are talking about :thumb:


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## Rob_Quads (Jul 17, 2006)

lol @ VOSA...

"No final decision has been made on how to incorporate these checks into the current MOT scheme at this time. However work is currently ongoing with the Department of Transport and the transport industry to ensure that the manner of introduction of any new directive requirements meets the Commission s criteria."

So lets create a rule we have no idea how we are going to check.


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## Derbyshire-stig (Dec 22, 2010)

How would you class a imported car thats had a remap for UK fuel? it wont be a standard OEM map.


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## Multipla Mick (Feb 5, 2006)

Time was when an MOT test was purely a safety check. You could have the turbo off a Volvo truck and Nitrous Oxide on a Reliant Robin and as long as the flames shooting out the exhaust didn't burn the testers trousers it would pass. Now they seem to want to use it as a way for the fun police to spoil people's fun. And what exactly is illegal or unsafe about ECU mods and whatnot anyway?


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

graeme_t said:


> Only if all test stations spend a fortune on kit to check what software is on each and every car's ECU, and I can't see that happening!


Surely if its an upgrade to compliance they have to have the equipment or they couldn't provide mots ?


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## J1ODY A (Nov 28, 2008)

Multipla Mick said:


> Time was when an MOT test was purely a safety check. You could have the turbo off a Volvo truck and Nitrous Oxide on a Reliant Robin and as long as the flames shooting out the exhaust didn't burn the testers trousers it would pass. Now they seem to want to use it as a way for the fun police to spoil people's fun. And what exactly is illegal or unsafe about ECU mods and whatnot anyway?


Were those the days when they simply checked that the cart's wheels were still attached & the horse could stand up still?!?

I suppose if the car has been remapped so much that the car cannot handle teh power it now has, that it would be classed as unsafe?!? How many youngsters tune cars way beyond it's capability then crash them because of it?!?


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

In my experience mot stations now go completely overboard on failing cars in fear of the ministry handing out obscene no the spot fines if they walk into a garage.


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## Stumper (Apr 5, 2009)

justina3 said:


> Surely if its an upgrade to compliance they have to have the equipment or they couldn't provide mots ?


Or more than likely, as the equipment will cost thousands, if not tens of thousands of pounds to buy or lease, garages will stop offering MOT's.

As minimadgriff says, it'll never happen. Imagine the cost of an MOT if this kind of thing comes into force? I'd imagine it'd have to go up three or four fold just to cover the costs involved.

It's like the recent thing which the government and DofT were talking about, bi-annual MOT's. It's pie in the sky which won't happen any time soon!


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

J1ODY A said:


> Were those the days when they simply checked that the cart's wheels were still attached & the horse could stand up still?!?
> 
> I suppose if the car has been remapped so much that the car cannot handle teh power it now has, that it would be classed as unsafe?!? How many youngsters tune cars way beyond it's capability then crash them because of it?!?


more to the point they drive them beyond their limits and not to the road conidtions. A gun isn't dangerous........


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

It won;r happen unless manufacturers start putting the obd socket in an easily accesible place as an MOT tester isn't allowed to dismantle anythig to facilitate checks, so as long as the obd socket is covered by some trim they can't check. 
HIDS I agree with, anyone fitting them in halogen lamp units should have their car impounded.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

I'd imagine that the only ECU mods they're really after are the ones that take the car outside the prescribed emission levels for that particular model. They can't measure hp during an MOT so emissions would be their only clue, and at tick-over would be nigh on impossible.

As for the HID stuff, about time, I'm sick of boy racers burning my retinas out in the middle of the day.


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> I'd imagine that the only ECU mods they're really after are the ones that take the car outside the prescribed emission levels for that particular model. They can't measure hp during an MOT so emissions would be their only clue, and at tick-over would be nigh on impossible.
> 
> As for the HID stuff, about time, I'm sick of boy racers burning my retinas out in the middle of the day.


You generally don't touch the idle map on a car when mapping (unless it is a standalone ECU and the map is being written from blank) and a car can be outside emmisions if a cat is failing, the lambda isn't working correctly, MAF is failing or even an air leak. So they could be blaming the map for another issue.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

minimadgriff said:


> You generally don't touch the idle map on a car when mapping (unless it is a standalone ECU and the map is being written from blank) and a car can be outside emmisions if a cat is failing, the lambda isn't working correctly, MAF is failing or even an air leak. So they could be blaming the map for another issue.


I agree, don't see how it could be implimented. If it's a simple look to see if there's a "box" plugged in? People will just take off for MOT.


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## james_death (Aug 9, 2010)

As stated this came up a good while back same as possibly going way of europe and an MOT every 2 years.
Too difficult to implement the new tests as for illegal the consensus seam so be if its not disclosed to insurance as then its illegal.
My rover is not mapped its actually chipped to return the BMW 320 engine more to its original state so not 116 bhp but 155.
I also have the factory option xenons not Hids and they are self levelling.
You take your car and see what happens.


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## minimadgriff (Jul 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> I agree, don't see how it could be implimented. If it's a simple look to see if there's a "box" plugged in? People will just take off for MOT.


The only thing they can fail it on is tuning boxes, as you can usually find these flapping around in engine bays with dodgey connectors and wiring!


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

james_death said:


> My rover is not mapped its actually chipped to return the BMW 320 engine more to its original state so not 116 bhp but 155.


off topic but any chance you could PM me some more details of this? The 115 is the big off puttuing factor for what is a lovely car.


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

graeme_t said:


> Or more than likely, as the equipment will cost thousands, if not tens of thousands of pounds to buy or lease, garages will stop offering MOT's.
> 
> As minimadgriff says, it'll never happen. Imagine the cost of an MOT if this kind of thing comes into force? I'd imagine it'd have to go up three or four fold just to cover the costs involved.
> 
> It's like the recent thing which the government and DofT were talking about, bi-annual MOT's. It's pie in the sky which won't happen any time soon!


I am not questioning the fact that it more than likely wouldn't come into effect all I was pointing out to be able to issue mots you have to comply with all mot requirements


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## Grizzle (Jul 12, 2006)

Dunno about remaps personally i think they are a good thing and dont see why they need to make them "illegal"

HID's yes ban em, ban em all!!!!


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## andygenders (Apr 14, 2007)

I have Dreamscience remap on my Focus ST - on / off with a handheld unit - so easy to remap to stock before a dealer or mot check..... no sign it has been installed / deinstalled


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

glad they have brought rules in for these bloody aftermarket HiD's.

Lost count of the times I have been blinded by cars and bikes with these bloody things fitted to standard lights!


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## zippo (Mar 26, 2008)

2014 more mot changes are rumored. E.U. bull again. I Admit i don't understand the bulk of it . There is an article though in this months Performance BMW. They're Not painting a pretty picture. How much is fact and not just scare mongering i don't know. AS soon as i hear the E.U though i always dread the out come.Ill conceived rules knee jerk reactions What they don't know at best they guess at worsted they lie


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

Do a search on here through my posts. I looked into this in great detail. Nowt to worry about and doesn't really make any changes. Just different wording to what's already there to make it even across the EU.

edit: here>>> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=192338&highlight=legislation check page 6


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## BAXRY (Aug 11, 2009)

J1ODY A said:


> How many youngsters tune cars way beyond it's capability then crash them because of it?!?


Not many... To take a car beyond the limits is extremely expensive. The type of money "youngsters" don't have. I hate stereotypes it's because of opinions like that that my insurance is sky high just because I'm 21.


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

BAXRY said:


> Not many... To take a car beyond the limits is extremely expensive. The type of money "youngsters" don't have. I hate stereotypes it's because of opinions like that that my insurance is sky high just because I'm 21.


It's not expensive, chucking a C20 or Z20 into a corsa costs around £500 and they handle like a shopping trolley with a wonky wheel.
Your insurance is high because you're a young male and statistaically they're the most likely to have a crash, nothing to do with stereotyping, it's maths.


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## BAXRY (Aug 11, 2009)

bigmc said:


> It's not expensive, chucking a C20 or Z20 into a corsa costs around £500 and they handle like a shopping trolley with a wonky wheel.
> Your insurance is high because you're a young male and statistaically they're the most likely to have a crash, nothing to do with stereotyping, it's maths.


Corsa chassis can handle 250bhp easily hence why it's a popular engine swap, to make a car dangerous due to much power you would have to be pushing 500-600

And an engine swap isn't a re map as the OP stated.

And what exactly are you basing the fact that it's mainly young males who crash on? What is young ? That is a blanket statement it's like saying the majority of people that die every year are old people when in actual fact it might not be.


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## Captain Pugwash (Mar 23, 2011)

I have after market HID's fitted and its the best thing I could have done to the headlights, Have tried countless expensive so called brighter bulbs and none have been as good as the HID's.

at least now in the dark I can see the road a lot clearer, so its got to be safer? and yes you get some people that fit them incorrectly, same as a few other things is that not why they should have more police to inforce the laws rather than just simply ban things outright ..window tints was great till they started fitting limo tints all round the car. So they start banning them. I would say the cars that run around with one headlight or fog lights on are just as bad, or even get a Range rover behind you now they dazzle like hell.


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

BAXRY said:


> Corsa chassis can handle 250bhp easily hence why it's a popular engine swap, to make a car dangerous due to much power you would have to be pushing 500-600
> 
> And an engine swap isn't a re map as the OP stated.
> 
> And what exactly are you basing the fact that it's mainly young males who crash on? What is young ? That is a blanket statement it's like saying the majority of people that die every year are old people when in actual fact it might not be.


A standard one can't. It was an example of taking a car over the limits which a c20 does in standard corsa. 
I'm basing the fact young males pose the highest risk on insurance industry figures, it's not a blanket statement it's statistical fact.


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## simonjj (Sep 25, 2010)

I totally agree with the aftermarket HID / Xenon problems with poorly fitted kits BUT when i bought a new Evo 8 a few years ago it was delivered to Portishead docks without HID's, these were then fitted by CCC / Mitsubishi / Ralliart as part of the UK specification and then the car was picked up by me from the main dealer but there was no headlight wash or levelling system. These were the official cars sold by main dealers - UK spec cars what happens to these at MOT time? ( not my problem as i only kept it 6 months but just interested )


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

Wax Attack said:


> I totally agree with the aftermarket HID / Xenon problems with poorly fitted kits BUT when i bought a new Evo 8 a few years ago it was delivered to Portishead docks without HID's, these were then fitted by CCC / Mitsubishi / Ralliart as part of the UK specification and then the car was picked up by me from the main dealer but there was no headlight wash or levelling system. These were the official cars sold by main dealers - UK spec cars what happens to these at MOT time? ( not my problem as i only kept it 6 months but just interested )


As per my link there is no reference to HIDs just that the headlights fitted must be type approved. They would have been type approved when they were fitted so there's no issue.


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## centenary (Sep 5, 2010)

graeme_t said:


> Only if all test stations spend a fortune on kit to check what software is on each and every car's ECU, and I can't see that happening!


Surely if an mot station doesnt have the equipment to carry out the full mot test, whatever the current test requisite's are, that station would have it's license revoked?

I would presume lots of people say it wont happen but if these new items are part of the mot, stations will either have to spend the money for equipment or software or face losing the ability to do the test.

And fewer stations will mean less competition meaning car owners will more than likely have to start paying the full, official test fee.


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

centenary said:


> Surely if an mot station doesnt have the equipment to carry out the full mot test, whatever the current test requisite's are, that station would have it's license revoked?
> 
> I would presume lots of people say it wont happen but if these new items are part of the mot, stations will either have to spend the money for equipment or software or face losing the ability to do the test.
> 
> And fewer stations will mean less competition meaning car owners will more than likely have to start paying the full, official test fee.


If you're referring to the equipment to check if the ECU has been remapped then it's pointless anyway. This is not in the legislation.


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## GR33N (Apr 5, 2009)

Im sure £20 would see my local MOT tester off my back 

either way im not really bothered, when I get around to buying my new car its going to AMD for a remap


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## Lloyd71 (Aug 21, 2008)

If it did come into force, there's a simple solution:

Retro.


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## andy-d (Sep 30, 2009)

i like the bit you missed, "test the 13pin towing socket"
why? there is NO legal requirement to have them All wired Exactly the same, you can wire Your caravan + car to match each other totally safely and get all the functions to work as they should.
Mate has his wired like this, so if anyone else nicks his caravan they have fogs on all the time, its his hope that would get them stopped by the cops. he's had 2 vans stolen despite wheel clamps .
so thats now a "fail" ?
,,,,utter "euro BS" and then some,


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