# Miscible and Immiscible - Wax and Paint Sealant Bonding



## Mike Phillips (Jan 26, 2007)

*Miscible and Immiscible - Wax and Paint Sealant Bonding*

*Wax and Paint Sealant Bonding*
The topic of bonding as it relates to a wax or a paint sealant bonding to paint comes up on most detailing discussion forums from time to time, and there's a lot of confusion and probably miss-information about this topic.

The idea presented is that in order for a wax or paint sealant to properly bond to an automotive paint finish, the paint finish must be chemically stripped so that the paint is surgically clean and free from any residual polishing oils or any other substances.

The goal is to insure there's nothing on the surface that could potentially interfere with the bonding action between the protection ingredients in a wax or paint sealant and the paint.

*Follow the Manufacturer's Recommendations*
The first and primary consideration goes to the manufactures recommendations. If the manufacturer of a wax or paint sealant officially recommends that the surface of the paint must be stripped clean before their product can properly bond to the paint, then you should follow the recommendations of the manufacturer as they know their products best.

If the manufacturer does not specifically recommend that a painted surface needs to be stripped clean, then whatever recommendations they do provide should be followed as they know their products best.

To my knowledge, there are only a few manufacturers in the wax and paint sealant business that recommend that the surface of automotive paint be surgically clean and bare before their products can be applied. Besides these few companies, most manufacturers either recommend to apply their wax and/or paint sealant to the paint _*after*_ first using their surface prep products which can include, compounds, polishes, paint cleaners and pre-wax cleaners. And of course, sometimes there are no specific recommendations.

Back in February of 2005, this topic came up when I worked for Meguiar's as it related to applying NXT Tech Wax over a surface previously polished using Meguiar's M80 Speed Glaze.

There's a specific thread in the Hot Topics forum on MeguiarsOnline.com called,

*Do Glazes/Fillers affect the bonding of NXT?*

I contacted R&D, communicated with one of the Chemists, and then posted a statement provided to me on this topic.



> A wax, (natural or synthetic), is a substance that when applied to a surface will not adhere properly on its own. Thus, it is necessary to add specialized *miscible oils* to allow the waxy material to spread and adhere evenly to the surface. These oils along with polymers are responsible for improving the functionality of the wax protection, appearance, adherence and the overall application.
> 
> This means the addition of any Meguiar's polishes prior to the wax application will not only enhance the paint finish, but also aid in the appearance, adherence and overall lasting ability of the wax which is applied over the top of it.


Since leaving Meguiar's and joining the Autogeek Team in 2009, the topic of bonding has come up from time to time. I knew I had written on this topic, but could not remember the *keyword* or _words_ to help me locate the above thread. Then I remembered the word, did a search and found the thread.

Here are the key words, and note the portions I've formatted to be _*bold, red and italic*_...

Taken from *TheFreeDictionary.com*

*Miscible*
Relating to two or more substances, such as water and alcohol, that can be mixed together *or can dissolve into one another in any proportion without separating*.

*Immiscible*
Incapable of being mixed or blended together. Immiscible liquids that are shaken together eventually separate into layers. Oil and water are immiscible.​I'm not a chemist and don't ever claim to be one and do everything I can to avoid talking or _*typing*_ over my head. That said, it is my opinion that while the above information is supplied by a chemist at Meguiar's, it's probably true for most _*quality*_ waxes and paint sealants manufactured by reputable companies, unless they state otherwise, i.e., unless they state that the surface must be stripped clean before applying their wax or paint sealant.

So unless a manufacturer specifically states or recommends that an automotive paint finish must be stripped clean for *their* wax or paint sealant to properly bond or adhere, then I think it's safe to say that the chemist behind the brand has created their wax and paint sealant formulas to use the same miscible oils, (or other miscible substances), in their surface prep products to aid in the bonding or adhering of the protection ingredients used in their waxes and/or paint sealants to paint.

This would be called, *Synergistic Chemical Compatibility*.

It's entirely possible that a lot of popular waxes and paint sealants on the market will bond or adhere to paint correctly after the paint has been prepped using compounds, polishes and paint cleaners _*outside the brand *_of the waxes or paint sealants being applied. There's no easy way of knowing or testing, but in my opinion, I would think the chances for this type of chemical compatibility to be more likely than less likely as there is probably some common chemistry involved in surface prep products and protection products that _*overlaps*_ among different polish and wax companies.

That's just my opinion or guesstimate, _*you can make up your own mind*_.

My good friend, _*Tom aka Mosca*_ as he's known on detailing discussion forums, once posted,



Mosca said:


> I've never walked out into a garage only to find out that overnight the wax or paint sealant I applied slipped off the car's paint and _*piled-up on the floor*_ surrounding the car because it didn't bond or stick to the paint.


I would have to agree with Tom.

*To strip or not to strip?*
Do you need to chemically strip your car's paint with some type of solvent before applying a wax or paint sealant to enable the protection ingredients to better bond or adhere to the paint?
*Manufacturer's Specific Recommendation*
Only if the wax or paint sealant manufacturer specifically recommends this procedure.
*Or*​*Personal Preference*
If after researching this topic you personally want and feel the need to chemically strip the paint.
*Or*​*Forum Member's Recommendation*
See what I wrote above under _Personal Preference_​If you use good quality products and follow the manufacturer's directions, plus work clean and use good technique, then you should be able to apply your choice of wax or paint sealant directly to your car's paint after wiping off the residue left by the last surface prep product used on the paint. This, by the way, is my normal practice, and below is my personal recommendation on this topic as taken from here.

*How to Mix IPA for Inspecting Correction Results*

*Excerpt*



Mike Phillips said:


> *Personal Recommendation For Removing Waxes and Paint Sealants*
> To remove any previously applied wax or paint sealant, I recommend using a light paint cleaner or a light polish applied by hand or machine. A light paint cleaner or abrasive polish will effectively remove any previously applied wax or paint sealant AND leave the paint looking clear and glossy. I call this working forward in the process because the goal is to create beauty.
> 
> Chemically stripping the paint will tend to dull the paint; it certainly doesn't increase gloss and clarity. You don't see the dulling effect unless you're working on *black* paint and repeat the process multiple times. Since not everyone works on black paint, and you're not going to make stripping your car's paint a daily routine, it could be you won't see the dulling effect on your car's paint but it does take place.
> ...


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

Thanks for that Mike we had a small discussion here...

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=207477

A Professional told me in no uncertain terms that IPA was the best thing for cleaning the surface after polishing.

He also went on to say if I was finding dirt using something like Werstats Acrylic Prime Strong then I must be polishing wrong.

I disagreed of course as i'm confident in my ability and have seen what Prime strong can do after polishing, it cleanses the surface.

A little bit about Prime strong... http://www.polishedbliss.co.uk/acatalog/werkstat-prime-strong-cat9.html


----------



## big ben (Aug 25, 2009)

food for thought... thanks for sharing


----------



## Mike Phillips (Jan 26, 2007)

big ben said:


> food for thought... thanks for sharing


Topics like this are usually deeper than I like to get but it's a topic of interest especially with so many "bonding" questions related to detailing cars.


----------



## tonyy (Jul 26, 2008)

Thanks for sharing..


----------

