# 2015 Tiguan - Wrong decision?



## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Hi everyone,

After reading this thread;

https://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=412263&page=5

I'm starting to think I've made a terrible and uneconomical decision.

We used to have a Polo on PCP and last week we were invited to one of these "VIP" events. Our Polo was due to be handed in anyways and as we're tall people and wanting a make a family soon, we wanted a bigger car.

Cutting a long story-short. We got a 2015 Tiguan 2.0 TDI. It's a lovely car BUT we rarely drive on motorways and if we do, it's to Newcastle to Sunderland and back, which is like... 25miles (ish). Most of our daily commutes are in stop and start traffic.

After reading that thread and stuff online, I've began to really kick myself for making such a stupid decision and being so easily sold to.

We are allowed to exchange the car for something at the same price or more, but will have to do it soon. Think we have 3 weeks left to do that.

I'm stressing. Help.


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

If you've posted your concerns on here then you need to change it for something else as you'll never get to like the Tiguan if you are in this much doubt already.

We have a Kuga diesel and love it but if we were going back to a car it'd definitely be a petrol due to the diesel 'hate' that seems to be building up a head of steam.

Golf petrol model maybe?


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Don't get me wrong, I do like the Tig, I like the height, the space and the torque lol. I'm just thinking about the long run costs and technical issues diesels get if they're used alot for shorter journeys.

The annoying thing is, we were offered a new golf for a similar price per month. However I can't remember if it was petrol or diesel. 

Worse case scenario I'll have to keep it (not much available on their website, in are budget) and it's a lesson leant for next time.


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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

Ignoring what was in that other thread - you liked the car, sounds like it was a good test drive and you didn’t have any doubts at that point - so, what’s concerning you / what are you worried about ? How long are you planning on keeping the car ? 

Also, have you bought it or is it on another scheme ?


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## BrummyPete (Jun 10, 2010)

I do a lot of stop start driving in my diesel passat, so far no issues or with any other of the diesels I've owned

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## beatty599 (Sep 18, 2016)

You can hand the car back, and get your deposit back you might get charged some fees but at least you'll have freedom to chose again. 

I was in the same situation 3 weeks ago albeit I used Hire Purchase. But I got my deposit back and searched and then bought from the same place again and got a new GTD ( I went from 1.5 petrol to the GTD )


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## Will-S (Jun 5, 2007)

I had a 59 plate Tiguan 2.0 TDI when they were relatively new on the market. Ran it for three years and it never missed a beat. My daily commute was 15 miles on the motorway at peak times, so not much more than 45mph and lots of start stop.
Your concern about diesel gate is valid. Sales of new diesels have dropped and many manufacturers are announcing moving away from diesel in future.
You need to consider the future value of the car in any trade in as a result of this. 
As others have said, perhaps a petrol would suit your lifestyle better.


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Andyblue said:


> Ignoring what was in that other thread - you liked the car, sounds like it was a good test drive and you didn't have any doubts at that point - so, what's concerning you / what are you worried about ? How long are you planning on keeping the car ?
> 
> Also, have you bought it or is it on another scheme ?


It's on PCP for 4 years. It's a nice drive I do like it but the only things concerning me if the efficiency of the car, the costs to run it and overall not being the best to drive for short daily commutes, in traffic. Which, from what I have read is not good for the engine but also burns a lot more diesel compared to petrol.


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Thanks for the replies, sorry I only saw them after posting my last reply.

I'm glad to hear others have not had any issues with the engines doing short trips.

And actually that is another worry I have, as diesal are slowly getting pushed out the market... In 3-4 years, what is the depreciation going to be like over those years and will they allow me to change cars or will I have to pay a big difference?

I think I'm going to give the dealers a call and see what options I have. Even if it means I have to pay that little bit more per month... Over the long haul, will getting a newer (petrol) car be better to trade in in a few years.


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## Darlofan (Nov 24, 2010)

Trade in is personal to you and depends on your circumstances. Reading your posts and mileage done and fall of diesel prices you're not going to get what you want when trade in comes up.
Me though, I buy a car at a yr old doing 30 odd thousand a year, mainly my own servicing and keeping the car for 5+yrs then depreciation/ trade in value has never concerned me. Be lucky if I get offered £1500 when It comes to part ex!


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

As you have it on PCP you should of got a Guaranteed Minimum Future Value. This I understand is set in stone and cannot be changed. So you will get that sum regardless of how badly diesel sales go over the next 4 years.


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## Titanium Htail (Mar 24, 2012)

No test ride is sufficient to cover all aspects, at the last moment of buying a Honda CR-V my wife said her seat was uncomfortable, no amount of upselling was going to change that, the hype of the decline in diesel may be charged more in the big city over time or increase of road fund.

At least you know what you do not want, plus have the option to change to a petrol or even another model. It is ok to change your mind, our local trip will all the stop/start with the amount of daily traffic, I would seem to spend a large amount of time in a queue other than our short motorway trips. Good luck all will be fine. 

John Tht.


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Thanks again everyone,

They have a deal on for a Golf 1.5 TSI EVO 130PS, which is within our budget. It's not as big as the Tig of course but I'm thinking hopefully in 3/4 years time, my circumstances will be better. I'm currently working part time, studying and getting married on top that, so money is tight. So by then with being back to full time I could trade in the Golf (which should not depreciate as much as a diesel) and get a bigger car then?


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## Christian6984 (Dec 20, 2007)

-Perry- said:


> Thanks again everyone,
> 
> They have a deal on for a Golf 1.5 TSI EVO 130PS, which is within our budget. It's not as big as the Tig of course but I'm thinking hopefully in 3/4 years time, my circumstances will be better. I'm currently working part time, studying and getting married on top that, so money is tight. So by then with being back to full time I could trade in the Golf (which should not depreciate as much as a diesel) and get a bigger car then?


I'm not sure if I read of a problem with this engine the other day. Seemingly has a on going problem
That affects the manual gearbox's. Could be worth checking up on it

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/news/o...-acknowledges-problem-with-15-tsi-evo-engine/

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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

-Perry- said:


> It's on PCP for 4 years. It's a nice drive I do like it but the only things concerning me if the efficiency of the car, the costs to run it and overall not being the best to drive for short daily commutes, in traffic. Which, from what I have read is not good for the engine but also burns a lot more diesel compared to petrol.


Well, if it's on the PCP, you'll have a guaranteed value at the end of it, so regardless if it's value is what it should be or isn't, you have a final value, so that's 1 big worry out the door :thumb:

Should you stick / should you pass - difficult choice as it depends on what you want, do you really want something that size or was it a spur of the moment, as we've all had ...

Maybe go and look at it again and look at the golf with fresh eyes and see which you prefer, good luck :thumb:


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

I'll have to take a look into the guanteed value at the end, I can't recall that being mentioned. I got it from VW Pulmans in Sunderland. So they're not a small shady dealer, so I'm hoping I have the guarantee. 

In regards to what we wanted, size was definitely at the top of our list. We need something with height and we were also thinking on advance for when we have a child, we don't want to break out backs leaning in and out with a car seat, in a smaller car.

Was it a spur of the moment thing? A little, yes. Although I've always fancied a Tiguan. But never took the economics into consideration (school bot error). We did go there, just for a look, at first... But we got sucked into the "only a one time offer" bs. They were offering a year's free tax, full tank along with 2 years free servicing etc.. So it wasn't the worst deal we got.


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## Rayaan (Jun 1, 2014)

Why don't you just take it for a decent run every now and then?
25 miles would be plenty to remove the crap from the DPF anyway


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## Mikesphotaes (Jul 24, 2016)

I don't understand the reason for posting?

You say size was at the top of your list and you're thinking you should have bought a Golf?

Forget all this diesel nonsense and stick with your Tiguan!


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## Arvi (Apr 11, 2007)

Can they get a Petrol Tiguan in for you to swap to? Usually they can get a car into your garage from the VW network. Worst case you’ll have a cooling off period to hand the car back. 

If you did go to a Golf don’t worry about any issues getting a baby in and out. We have a Q3 and a BMW 3 Series. They are both as easy for us to get our baby into. We’ve got a 360 degree spin chair that spins towards the door to strap her in now. Even without the 360 it was never an issue.


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Mikesphotaes said:


> I don't understand the reason for posting?
> 
> You say size was at the top of your list and you're thinking you should have bought a Golf?
> 
> Forget all this diesel nonsense and stick with your Tiguan!


Only said the Golf as that is the only one available, within our price range at the moment. There are petrol Tigs available, but they are the newer models and more than we can afford right now.



Arvi said:


> Can they get a Petrol Tiguan in for you to swap to? Usually they can get a car into your garage from the VW network. Worst case you'll have a cooling off period to hand the car back.
> 
> If you did go to a Golf don't worry about any issues getting a baby in and out. We have a Q3 and a BMW 3 Series. They are both as easy for us to get our baby into. We've got a 360 degree spin chair that spins towards the door to strap her in now. Even without the 360 it was never an issue.


That's good to know thanks, if you don't mind me asking, how tall are you and your partner?

I've had a look on their website, only 2015 diesels available. However I am going to email and ask, you never know.


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## mikster (Jan 4, 2016)

Getting a vw is always ”the wrong decision”


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## Christian6984 (Dec 20, 2007)

There is the new T-Cross coming out soon, but could be out of budget. Also T-cross although quite rare comes with a 2.0 TSI as well as the 1.5 Evo but depends on your concerns of the kangaroo-ing if your buying a manual gearbox and again they are not that cheap yet, Alternatively do they have an Skoda or Seat Equivalents in stock?


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

mikster said:


> Getting a vw is always "the wrong decision"


If I had the money I would be sitting in a Tesla hehe! :car:


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## piston_warrior (Jul 25, 2012)

Christian6984 said:


> There is the new T-Cross coming out soon, but could be out of budget. Also T-cross although quite rare comes with a 2.0 TSI as well as the 1.5 Evo but depends on your concerns of the kangaroo-ing if your buying a manual gearbox and again they are not that cheap yet, Alternatively do they have an Skoda or Seat Equivalents in stock?


I think you can only get the T-Cross with a 1.0 TSI even in the R-Line trim. Bit ****e really!


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## griffin1907 (Mar 4, 2006)

I have a Mercedes C220 CDI. I used to do 80 miles a day round trip. I then changed my job & now do 8 miles a day round trip. I still have my Mercedes. I take it for a run every weekend to stretch it's legs & it gives me no issues. I love the torque a diesel offers, as such will remain a dirty diesel driver.


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## BrummyPete (Jun 10, 2010)

You might want to have a sit in a Golf, I'm 6'2" and didn't find it the most comfortable car and with how far I had the seat back only a child could get in behind me. I understand your issues with diesel but for me it doesn't bother me, I bought another diesel 3 months ago and intend to keep it for ages, my next car may be petrol though, have my eyes on the Arteon already 

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## Summit Detailing (Oct 9, 2006)

-Perry- said:


> I'll have to take a look into the guanteed value at the end, I can't recall that being mentioned. I got it from VW Pulmans in Sunderland. So they're not a small shady dealer, so I'm hoping I have the guarantee.


PCP's are designed to make getting in to a new car affordable to more people and this is how a large percentage of new car purchases are secured.

Because of the GFV at the end of the term, it means you only need to stump up a relatively small deposit at the start which again makes cars more attainable to more people.
Your monthly rentals are essentially covering the depreciation on the car over the term of ownership.

At the end of the term you have 3 options - 
>Pay the GFV and keep the car.
>Hand the car back, owe nothing, own nothing - expensive way of renting essentially!
>Part-exchange the car and any equity over and above the GFV can be used towards a deposit on a new car - people seem blinkered to this and feel tied to the brand and get into a vicious cycle of PCP.

HTH

Chris


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

It seems however that the OP doesn't know about GFV and it wasn't explained to him by the salesman.

It is clear by his posts referring to how much he is going to lose out with depreciation.

I wrote about Guaranteed Minimum Future Value in post #11 but it wasn't picked up.


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## Philb1965 (Jun 29, 2010)

I don’t think gmfv exists anymore. It’s been replaced with ‘final optional payment’ or words to that effect.

So if your FOP is £5k for arguments sake, and the car is worth £3k you either hand it back or pay for it at the end of the agreement. If you take out another pcp then the trade in is £3k not £5k and it will be up to the dealer if they wipe out the negative equity or not. 

Have a read of your agreement but don’t rely on a gmfv. I’d be interested to know what the OPs agreement says but I’m pretty sure it will be a final optional payment.


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

Having never had PCP I don't know. The searches I made to find out about PCP referred to it as part of the contract and a reason some might pick PCP over HP.


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

BrummyPete said:


> You might want to have a sit in a Golf, I'm 6'2" and didn't find it the most comfortable car and with how far I had the seat back only a child could get in behind me. I understand your issues with diesel but for me it doesn't bother me, I bought another diesel 3 months ago and intend to keep it for ages, my next car may be petrol though, have my eyes on the Arteon already
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Saw an Arteon the other day and its such a beautiful design!



Summit Detailing said:


> PCP's are designed to make getting in to a new car affordable to more people and this is how a large percentage of new car purchases are secured.
> 
> Because of the GFV at the end of the term, it means you only need to stump up a relatively small deposit at the start which again makes cars more attainable to more people.
> Your monthly rentals are essentially covering the depreciation on the car over the term of ownership.
> ...


Thank you very much for that explanation, it's only my 2nd car on PCP, so I have a lot to learn for my next encounter with them lol. Much appreciated.



Andy from Sandy said:


> It seems however that the OP doesn't know about GFV and it wasn't explained to him by the salesman.
> 
> It is clear by his posts referring to how much he is going to lose out with depreciation.
> 
> I wrote about Guaranteed Minimum Future Value in post #11 but it wasn't picked up.


I did pick it up  and thank you. I did email the sale rep yesterday, but yet to receive a reply. I will call him on Monday as he might have the weekend off.

It was one of my worries, purely because manufacturers are pushing diesels out the market, but aslong as I can hand it in, in a few years and not have to pay a rediculous fee or deposit for a new car, then I'll be happy lol. Hopefully electric/hybrids will be cheaper by then.

I do appreciate the time you take replying. Thank you.


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## Philb1965 (Jun 29, 2010)

Definitely used to be Andy, I guess it’s now weighted more on the dealers side. If you are in negative and want another pcp they’ll hope you’ll be tied in to the brand and this is quite an effective way to do it.


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## Philb1965 (Jun 29, 2010)

Just looked at VW pcp page and it does say agreed future value dependant on mileage and term.

It then goes on to say 'optional final payment' at the end of the agreement.

There is no mention of guaranteed future value. This product does give you the option to walk away if the car is worthless at the end of the agreement but it doesn't guarantee you a trade in figure at the end.

Clever change of wording by the finance companies.

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/car-finance/pcp-solutions


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## mike90 (Jan 30, 2016)

Hi we bought a 2015 Tiguan from Pulmans Durham just before Christmas and I love it. We moved from a golf. Ours does quite a lot of miles but when we first got it due to being standing the DPF light came on I ran it down the dual carriageway for 15mins and it was cleared. My partner was worried about the fuel economy but it’s really not that bad we can get 40mpg around the doors and have had 500miles out of a tank. If you have any other questions just Pm me. 

Regards Michael. 


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## mike90 (Jan 30, 2016)

Just noticed you don’t say whether it is 2 or 4 wheel drive. Ours is a 4wd Rline. 


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## -Perry- (Mar 6, 2019)

Philb1965 said:


> Just looked at VW pcp page and it does say agreed future value dependant on mileage and term.
> 
> It then goes on to say 'optional final payment' at the end of the agreement.
> 
> ...


Thanks for checking that out. We did not get it direct from VW but from Pulmans, so it might be slightly different. If I don't have one, then it'll be a lesson learnt and I'll just hand the car in and walk away at the end.



mike90 said:


> Hi we bought a 2015 Tiguan from Pulmans Durham just before Christmas and I love it. We moved from a golf. Ours does quite a lot of miles but when we first got it due to being standing the DPF light came on I ran it down the dual carriageway for 15mins and it was cleared. My partner was worried about the fuel economy but it's really not that bad we can get 40mpg around the doors and have had 500miles out of a tank. If you have any other questions just Pm me.
> 
> Regards Michael.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Great, we got ours from the Sunderland branch. I take it yours was pre-owned as well? Did you get a guaranteed value at the end?

It's a 2015 2wd model.

We're due to go on quite a long trip this week, so will be a great opportunity to clean out the DPF. I was thinking of also filling the tank with DPF and Turbo cleaner to increase the cars efficiency and MPG.


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## Christian6984 (Dec 20, 2007)

-Perry- said:


> Thanks for checking that out. We did not get it direct from VW but from Pulmans, so it might be slightly different. If I don't have one, then it'll be a lesson learnt and I'll just hand the car in and walk away at the end.
> 
> Great, we got ours from the Sunderland branch. I take it yours was pre-owned as well? Did you get a guaranteed value at the end?
> 
> ...


The dealer should have given you some paperwork that will have the car price, deposit, monthly payments and if its pcp a final optional payment?


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## mike90 (Jan 30, 2016)

-Perry- said:


> Thanks for checking that out. We did not get it direct from VW but from Pulmans, so it might be slightly different. If I don't have one, then it'll be a lesson learnt and I'll just hand the car in and walk away at the end.
> 
> Great, we got ours from the Sunderland branch. I take it yours was pre-owned as well? Did you get a guaranteed value at the end?
> 
> ...


Yes ours was pre owned not aware that we got any guaranteed value at the end but we bought ours cash.

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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Not all PCP's have a guaranteed value, some have a guide figure but it does depend on mileage, age and who is financing the PCP. They usually make you aware of this when completing the paperwork.

EGR's are still an issue on VW's, don't forget to keep an eye on the Adblue - assuming yours has it. Personally i'd give it a good run at motorway speeds once every 3 weeks of at least 40 miles, or just go a bit further when you go on your 25 mile run. Hopefully yours isn't one of the cars that had the emissions fix (you can check)

I would also have the oil changed every 10k and keep away from supermarket diesel.

Of more of a concern is your limited budget and you have signed yourself up to a 4 year PCP and you are hoping to get married and a change in job, you would have been better off keeping the Polo short term, even if that meant a bank loan. PCP's at some point will become the next PPI


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## Arvi (Apr 11, 2007)

-Perry- said:


> Only said the Golf as that is the only one available, within our price range at the moment. There are petrol Tigs available, but they are the newer models and more than we can afford right now.
> 
> That's good to know thanks, if you don't mind me asking, how tall are you and your partner?
> 
> I've had a look on their website, only 2015 diesels available. However I am going to email and ask, you never know.


I'm 5'10" and wife is 5'4.We bought the Q3 to replace wifes 2 door convertible when we knew we wanted a family and the 2 door needed replacing anyway so we were future proofing. Boot space is poor on the Q3 though so a Tiguan/XC60 sized car will be its next replacement.


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## johanr77 (Aug 4, 2011)

SteveTDCi said:


> Of more of a concern is your limited budget and you have signed yourself up to a 4 year PCP and you are hoping to get married and a change in job, you would have been better off keeping the Polo short term, even if that meant a bank loan. PCP's at some point will become the next PPI


He should be able to come out of the deal at half way with no penalties. That being said they would have to get another car and they would have no equity in the deal to roll into another car.

Do agree about the potential for PCP deals becoming the next miss-selling scandal. I hear far too often for my liking that people aren't sure about what they signed up to or even their basic rights with the deal. At the same time though dealerships can't be held responsible for some customers lack of understanding about what they sign up to, too many people are purely looking at what they are paying per month and not what they are actually getting for it.


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## percymon (Jun 27, 2007)

Personal view, but as you are concerned about the future potential issues from your limited mileage and the car not getting sufficient use to keep the pdf clean then it might be better to make use of the exchange option.

Something like this might be a viable alternative..

https://pulmanusedcars.co.uk/used-cars/skoda/octavia-hatchback-1-4-tsi-150-se-l-5dr

more than enough bhp for swift progress, better handling and ride than the Tiguan, similar boot space, more cabin space. You'll probably only get 35-38mpg in stop start town traffic, but ona steady 70mph m-way run you should see 50mpg.

I ran a Mk6 Golf and Audi A3 1.6TDI with little issue (well the HP fuel pump went on the Golf at 2 years old, but VW stumped up the £1500+ on that one) - my commute was 25 miles each way, with one route being 90% largely uninterupted dual carriageway . Never had any issues with the car getting hot enough, although the Golf did a dpf forced regenration cycle every 4-5 weeks; which i only knew about as the economy dropped 10mpg on those trips).


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

johanr77 said:


> He should be able to come out of the deal at half way with no penalties. That being said they would have to get another car and they would have no equity in the deal to roll into another car.
> 
> Do agree about the potential for PCP deals becoming the next miss-selling scandal. I hear far too often for my liking that people aren't sure about what they signed up to or even their basic rights with the deal. At the same time though dealerships can't be held responsible for some customers lack of understanding about what they sign up to, too many people are purely looking at what they are paying per month and not what they are actually getting for it.


Thats after 50% of the agreement/loan value including interest etc, not 50% of the payments just incase OP 

Realistically PCP doesn't break even until 24/36 months on a 4 year PCP.


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## Ducky (Mar 19, 2007)

We brought a 'Tiggy' back in 2008 when they came out, have to say its been a brilliant car for the last 10 years, but sadly after 180,000 miles it was time to let it go last year because of an engine issue.

We would have brought another, but wanted something bigger this time around.

:thumb:


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