# Before we all forget....



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

There have been threads regarding new business here there and everywhere from having little or no experience....

Just to pop an example up is one from another forum...

I wont post any names etc as that is wholly unprofessional but I will post dates from when the first time he picked a machine polisher up to setting up his own business with a unit....now this is not to say that I am having a go at new businesses I am not....just be sure you know your staple products first and foremost....

First time he picked a machine polisher up....on an old banger of a car....

*OCTOBER 2010*

And the business opened in....

*April-May 2011*

In the months that came between he was fishing for answers on pad and polish combos( which is the correct way to do things) but i saw a post somewhere where regarding do you apply Lime Prime before or after wax.....(which is questionable)

Now dont get me wrong these are the questions that need answering but come on....within 6 months the guy went from knowing naff all about machine correction to a business with a unit....

His favourite combo was Menzerna PO85RD on wool and Lime Prime on 3M Yellow....

I will not and cannot comment on his work as I havent seen it in the flesh and maybe very very good....

Comments welcome....


----------



## dave-g (Nov 14, 2009)

If he gets work the good luck to him, but I hope there is insurance involved properly!

It surprises me that people do it, I have a rotary and a lot of kit but I would never dream of touching somebody else's pride and joy.
There is too much involved in it, and a lot a stake from one little mistake.


----------



## svended (Oct 7, 2011)

I stick to doing neighbours and friends cars. I wouldn't dream of starting up a business till I had sufficient training in all techniques required for operating a business of this sort. The car in the second most expensive thing you'll buy after a house and thought some people don't spend a lot of time on them for one reason or another, they will still be suitably pi55ed off if I damaged it. To that end if I come across something I can't mix, I will tell the owner why and what it is and where they can look or I will look on there behalf. Only after they say for me to give it a go and I've explained the possible outcomes will I attempt to tackle (and of course after I've asked a few questions on here).


----------



## moosh (May 8, 2011)

There are loads of them popping up, there was one that stood out for me on another forum with similar questions to you and with in about 6 weeks he was having go's at pro's and long time detailers about advise they were giving out like he knew it all. Hence he very quickly got no help after that.

It takes the **** out of detailing really and these guys have all the gear and no idear! Even locally to me there are many popping up and trying to rival what others are doing. One guy from the £5 wash place told a friend of mine he had an aston martin booked in for a full polish and said he was ****ting himself but the money was worth it :doublesho


----------



## R0B (Aug 27, 2010)

I have a favourite incident like this from another forum.......around 3 months from asking basic questions to being a fully fledged weekend warrior attacking all and sundries cars and charging 3 figures........


----------



## Derbyshire-stig (Dec 22, 2010)

that's nothing, there is a thread on a subaru forum about a guy who asked questions on how to remap at the start of July, now he is charging people to remap their cars, half of the monitoring gear he doesnt have and is a expert in under a few weeks, now that's dangerous imo.


----------



## Junior Bear (Sep 2, 2008)

If people put the initial hard work and research in then what difference does it make wether they set up within 6 months or 10 years.

In 6 months they could have put in more detailing hours of experience in than some of us have in 3-5 years.


I hate experience over ability arguments lol, I know it's a good factor. But if people are willing to pay the person and are happy with the results then I wish them all the best and to carry on


----------



## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

Junior Bear said:


> If people put the initial hard work and research in then what difference does it make wether they set up within 6 months or 10 years.
> 
> In 6 months they could have put in more detailing hours of experience in than some of us have in 3-5 years.
> 
> I hate experience over ability arguments lol, I know it's a good factor. But if people are willing to pay the person and are happy with the results then I wish them all the best and to carry on


not when they are hacking away at the paint it is not as some have said you are dealing in peoples pride and joy you get it wrong they are going to be pissed.. :wall:

experience teaches you how to deal with X problem professionally and properly. Yes some ability is needed but that also in a large amount of cases comes with experience i mean i think many of the long term pro's and even some of the hobbyists could tell you where lime prime sits in the process? 
:lol::wall:

...it is pointless applying X years in the business to it because they could of worked on a small number of cars.


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Hmm… here are my thoughts…

Who cares?!?!?!

There seems to be a great number of “professionals” on here far too worried about everyone else and what they are doing, rather than just concentrating on their own company, and their own work.

So what if someone has the guts to start a business and try and make something of themselves…???

So what if people go to them…??

So what if their car maybe doesn’t get the best treatment…???

What difference does it make??

If these cowboys are really as bad as people make out, then they should be targeting a different customer to the “real” professionals

I do agree we seem to be in the middle of another cycle of people asking loads of questions, and some very stupid ones…and others that obviously can’t be bothered to look up information for themselves…Just hit the back button and get back to work. 

Fads will come and go… cowboys will come and go… quality speaks for itself and will last.

It’s really that simple.

I have loads of people trying to undercut me in my work… I couldn’t give a flying f**k to be honest… 

I know who and what I am, and what I have a proven track record of doing…

I lose no sleep over people trying to get on with their life… even if they “think” they are targeting me.


:thumb:


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

I think alot of the full time guys on here forget where they started from.

I often read threads where they go on about how they were chosen because of this reason or that and not because they cost twice as much etc wk wk wk.

I've been here since the start and long before on the Megs forum and there are only a few detailers who I'd say have any real long term experiance and half of them don't seem to post any more for what ever reason and of the newer full time guys, they are only new to the forum, but have been detailing for years (long before we adopted the American terms).

So times I think posts like these are just an ego stroke for the OP as they don't need to make these threads but for some reason they do.

Sorry I if I upset anyone, but sometimes theres a bit too much brown nosing.


----------



## Miglior (Feb 12, 2006)

this thread is only going to end in tears! haha! Sometimes its best just to bite your lip!


----------



## Hotchy (Jul 22, 2010)

Good on the guy setting up his own business and giving it a go. How else does someone learn? For all you know he detailed hundreads of cars within they 6 months.


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

Alex L said:


> *I think alot of the full time guys on here forget where they started from.
> *
> I often read threads where they go on about how they were chosen because of this reason or that and not because they cost twice as much etc wk wk wk.
> 
> ...


*1.I came from a painting background so I haven't forgotten that I had to run about like a blue ar5e fly with a brush and a bin to boot before I learnt anything....I didnt just think I could pick up a spray gun and within 6 months become a professional painter and open my own accident repair centre...

2.No Ego stroke here buddy....just highlighting the fact that the guy opened his business, bragged about it but yet didnt know what process was what....

3.Havent upset me but I dont get where the brown nosing comes from....surely the thread would be opposite if I were....*

So for your information the OP has almost 30yrs experience in the paint trade working for various marques up and down the country....I dont worry about anyone elses business and wish them all the luck in the world if they know what they are doing....I havent a problem with it....yeah folks are starting up every other month but most who are will probably know where LP sits....

If you read deeper into the initial post and take on board the product knowledge you may understand why it was posted....


----------



## Derbyshire-stig (Dec 22, 2010)

arent all these new small companies actually good for the bigger boys if they get things wrong ?
as they c ock it you they are generating you more work.


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

Most of my comments where a general statement, not all aimed at one individual.

Every so often theres (I hate using this word to describe them) 'Pros' who have only been doing it for 5 minutes who are bagging 'bob' down the road because he charged someone to PC their car even though they've only just picked it up and they ended up going to them to remove the swirls they left. But they seem to forget they have only been doing it 5 minutes themselves (hell I've been doing it all these years and know f all about detailing and still have so much to learn because the industry seems to change so much every year).

I do agree some people just can't be helped, there was a guy on here who got stuck on his roof who had alsorts of free help from members but never listened and I don't think he does it anymore. 

You'd be surprised by the brown nosing, you get this type of thread then loads of people going' your so right, they shouldn't be allowed near a car' etc even though the person probably started the same.

And I put ' I don't mean to upset' because this is an online forum and things like tone of voice and emotion are lost on a wall of words, so something written pleasantly could be taken maliciously


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

Ben Gum said:


> But not at all good for the consumers! I have first hand experience of how much money you can waste on semi experienced detailers... without knowing enough about your detailer, you could be handing over a very expensive vehicle and setting yourself up for a world of pain.


Surely though that's not just limited to detailing?

There's always stories of people dropping their cars off at the garage and at some point during the day it gets driven fast past them on the motorway or the plumber that goes through your undie draw.


----------



## Scotty B (Jul 1, 2009)

Alex L said:


> y or the plumber that goes through your undie draw.


Hate when that happens.


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

Scotty B said:


> Hate when that happens.


We have a show called Target here with gets tradies in and gets them to do the same job and then rates them! Anyway this was the worse http://www.nowpublic.com/strange/ne...ner-masturbation-video-nsfw-nsfl-2930244.html


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

Alex L said:


> We have a show called Target here with gets tradies in and gets them to do the same job and then rates them! Anyway this was the worse http://www.nowpublic.com/strange/ne...ner-masturbation-video-nsfw-nsfl-2930244.html


saw the title and closed it sharpish as my daughter is bang at the side of me but I can imagine....:doublesho


----------



## Mr Blue (Jun 1, 2012)

I started out doing my own cars years ago as i'm in the car trade. All my car's had the edge over what the other traders were selling just because of the level of finish.
Now I detail all sorts of cars and trade less lol

I couldn't ask questions back then because I didn't know others that did this sort of thing. This forum does help the newbys. 

Soo many ''detailers'' are popping up everywhere. Many of them just mask the problem and it's never a a proper paint correction.

Just the other week I got a funny looks by these local hot shot newby "detailers" when I had 2 exotic cars on the drive. Bloody hate living on the main road as I always get spyed on :lol:

We all still ask questions because the product lists are endless and new ones are being released every day.

Leave them to it :thumb:


----------



## moosh (May 8, 2011)

R0B said:


> I have a favourite incident like this from another forum.......around 3 months from asking basic questions to being a fully fledged weekend warrior attacking all and sundries cars and charging 3 figures........


:lol: I think we may be speaking of the same HERO Rob :wall::buffer::thumb:


----------



## moosh (May 8, 2011)

Reflectology said:


> *1.I came from a painting background so I haven't forgotten that I had to run about like a blue ar5e fly with a brush and a bin to boot before I learnt anything....I didnt just think I could pick up a spray gun and within 6 months become a professional painter and open my own accident repair centre...
> 
> 2.No Ego stroke here buddy....just highlighting the fact that the guy opened his business, bragged about it but yet didnt know what process was what....
> 
> ...


Im with you mate, same back round but i aint a pro as they say i am an engineer now but consider myself more than able to comment.


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

I kinda agree and disagree. There are way too many popping up imo, they see it as easy and a quick buck whilst not really providing the job they should.

But until there is some sort of governing body it will continue to happen, the same as manufacturers will continue to sell cheap or re-branded products or even diluted products at a massively inflated price. There is no higherpower to do anything about it.

Have you seen some of the marketing blurb from manufacturers? I feel embarrassed for some of them. 

I do understand your point though. No one will really know if the guys is good enough or not. I personally would lose the love by doing paid work nor do I think I have the finesse that "some" pros have. I mean "some" aswell!

Not quite as bad as getting lots of advice from a pro on business under a false pretence then setting up your own business a week later...


----------



## DetailMyCar (Apr 19, 2010)

Worst ones are the people on here that are actually running full / part time businesses, PM'ing people touting for work and never becoming supporters or owning up to the fact they actually run a detailing business.

We could all sit here and give out advice, and not pay the supporter fee's but it's bang out of order to be PM'ing people and trying to get business that way.


----------



## BellUK (Mar 12, 2012)

Unfortunately we live in a society where people jump to judge others instead of concentrating on their own life / job, who honestly cares? I can understand the frustration especially from those who have vast experience and may find themselves being undercut by someone with less experience or poor results but surely the customer next time will just consider someone different? As they say you learn from your own mistakes.

Everyone deserves to make a go of it, money is tight for many nowadays and I think we should appreciate any individual who generally wants to work and make a go of it, instead of sitting on their own ass and claiming every benefit under the sun

Everyone had to start somewhere and people soon forget that, if they’re trying to persuade your clients to go with them or are intentionally trying to take clients away from you I can understand, but so what if they’re lacking experience or knowledge sometimes you have to make mistakes to learn and progress, let’s just hope for their own sake and the clients they have valid insurance.

I always thought DW said no question was a silly question?


----------



## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

BellUK said:


> Unfortunately we live in a society where people jump to judge others instead of concentrating on their own life / job, who honestly cares? I can understand the frustration especially from those who have vast experience and may find themselves being undercut by someone with less experience or poor results but surely the customer next time will just consider someone different? As they say you learn from your own mistakes.
> 
> Everyone deserves to make a go of it, money is tight for many nowadays and I think we should appreciate any individual who generally wants to work and make a go of it, instead of sitting on their own ass and claiming every benefit under the sun
> 
> ...


true granted they are doing something but for godsake when you get a question of where lime prime sits you really have to go really?...should you be polishing a turd never mind a supercar?...

everyone started somewhere yes probably on scrap panels before gingerly moving onto their own car. Mistakes can be made as i know even by any detailer as a well known detailers insurance claims prove but if you are rushing then that is a big factor some of it is down to luck naturally but everything is.

But in fairness real BASIC errors should be made away from any client cars,more so when still even learning the basics of machining especially


----------



## Larryk (Apr 24, 2009)

I understand fully where the OP is coming from. Like him, I come from a paintshop background, swept the floors, made the coffee etc etc. When I opened up my business, I had many years under my belt of training and understanding of what I am doing. 

In saying that, I am still learning every day, and every car presents a new challenge. No two cars are the same.

For me, when i set up as a full time detailer, it was a big step. It went from being a hobby to paying my bills. I took on a high monthly rent bill for a premises, a loan to fit the place out, high annual rates bill, water charges, etc etc. 

Untrained and unskilled competition used to annoy me and frustrate me, especially when a lot of them are working from the shed behind their house, avoiding rent, rates, water charges etc. But you have to think bigger picture here - if someone is silly enough to bring their car to these people without researching them, then it is their loss when these idiot make a mess of their car. 

A lot of my business is repeat business now at this stage, and word of mouth is my main form of advertising, and thankfully my business is doing well. I am not getting rich, or anything close to it, but I am paying the bills, and having a few beers on the weekends, and I love what I am doing. 

Don't waste time worrying about these fly-by-night detailers, they will come and they will go as quick, if one of them has a brain and a gift for the work they might hang around but within a short time they will have to go big or go home. 

Concentrate on keeping your own customers happy, enough problems in the world without having to worry about people who, in my book, 90% of them will not last 6 months at it


----------



## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

DetailMyCar said:


> Worst ones are the people on here that are actually running full / part time businesses, PM'ing people touting for work and never becoming supporters or owning up to the fact they actually run a detailing business.
> 
> We could all sit here and give out advice, and not pay the supporter fee's but it's bang out of order to be PM'ing people and trying to get business that way.


Think you should have evidence before posting that:thumb:


----------



## DetailMyCar (Apr 19, 2010)

chrisc said:


> Think you should have evidence before posting that:thumb:


Haha, I do and it's being / been dealt with as far as I know but it still annoys me - Think we all know it goes on...


----------



## vroomtshh (Nov 23, 2009)

Ninja59 said:


> true granted they are doing something but for godsake when you get a question of where lime prime sits you really have to go really?...should you be polishing a turd never mind a supercar?...


So to be a professional detailer, you must know at what stage every single product on the market is used?

Its only a basic question because you know the answer. I have no real care about the pros or amateurs, but I don;t think you can slate someone because they ask what a product does.

I do that every single day in my profession - I must be rubbish at it


----------



## traplin (Feb 22, 2012)

Just to be objective and if anyone cares to humour me...going from an absolute noobie i.e. having absolutely no clue about detailing, how long would you say it would take someone to pick up the skills required to be able to give results to a decent level that would satisfy the general public? (remember us on here look at the finite detail eg differences in a wax or sealant etc. To joe public the benefits of a £20/£30 wax would be astonishing / satisfying)

Really, what is difficult about learning:
2BM / APC detailing, wheel cleaning
decontamination
claying
paint correction (may be the most amount of skill is required here but again with a bit of reading up on the topic and common sense you get decent results I think. Take yourself back to your first time)
glaze / LSP application

My point is simple and I'll relate it to myself, I've only ever machine polished my misses' car but have done it twice now and achieved probably 90% correction (being conservative) All who knew the car before the detail and then saw it after were absolutely amazed at the finish. The car went from never being cared for to being pampered. You guys may have been able to critique it but to joe public it was fantastic - the neighbour next door wanted me to correct his nissan GTR after seeing the result :doublesho 

With that knowledge / experience base alone and constant reading up of people's experiences etc on here I know I can deliver a level of detailing to a vast number of people out there if I wanted and give them satisfying results...BUT I am no pro...which is the point that I think is being missed.

Lots of people on here do work for family and friends based upon the same level of experience / confidence they've gained...but I don't think (I'm assuming here) that they consider themselves a pro. Only difference between them and the person referred to by the OP is that they charge and are trying to make a living out of it.

Provided they are not recklessly setting out to damage people's paint and genuinely aiming to get the best result possible and know that they have sufficient knowledge (not experience) to do so, then who is to say that on the job learning should be frowned upon.

Just my 2p worth!


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

Of course it goes on! Touting for business is wrong but doing the job isn't. 

Especially when you'll happily pay your joiner mate/plumber/gas man some cash and some beer to sort something out for you when an established company is losing out.

The whole detailing industry saddens me these days.


----------



## spiros (Mar 30, 2010)

Its all about money .....


----------



## BellUK (Mar 12, 2012)

Ninja59 said:


> true granted they are doing something but for godsake when you get a question of where lime prime sits you really have to go really?...should you be polishing a turd never mind a supercar?...
> 
> everyone started somewhere yes probably on scrap panels before gingerly moving onto their own car. Mistakes can be made as i know even by any detailer as a well known detailers insurance claims prove but if you are rushing then that is a big factor some of it is down to luck naturally but everything is.
> 
> But in fairness real BASIC errors should be made away from any client cars,more so when still even learning the basics of machining especially


Agreed silly question, I would of personally done my own research. I often ask questions on here (after all DW is here to help all), but I try to do as much research beforehand. Much is common sense but never done any harm to double check. :thumb:

Ideally you would practice on scrap metal but some decide not to go down this route again you learn from your own mistakes, I guess it must be hard though with so many different types of vehicles, paint etc technique and work must differ a lot from vehicle to vehicle, I guess you have to learn as you progress and if that means making a mistake, just pray they have insurance or can fix it themselves.

It's a risky business for all, even the experienced.


----------



## cossienuts (Oct 14, 2008)

wow strong views on here...so is it wrong that i would like to set up on my own on a part time basis working late evening and weekends alongside my day job? whilst trying to save up enough to cover the insurance required and kitting out my van and workshop without relying on any handouts or loans?

how do you get expierance without working on others vehicles? surely if you put in the effort to attract a customer via word of mouth or previous work referalls how can that be wrong?

iam realisitic enough to know that building a reputable buisness will take a long time and lots of effort before i see anything back but why not make a few pounds from somthing i really enjoy and get a buzz out of?

id like to think if i can build up and become established buisness other people coming along would not bother me too much if i had the confidence in my own product so to speak

anyway for now i will carry on with my research and i guess i shouldnt ask too many questions on here lol


----------



## Alzak (Aug 31, 2010)

I do not get why people are so jealous in the end is not Your car which has been damaged by unprofessional detailer ... everyone start somewhere moving from friends and family cars can't see why not if they do good job I'm 100% with them if this is how they want to make living.
Looks like few pros on here born with polisher ... 

You all start somewhere some in bodyshop industry so have some advantage of knowing paintwork up to scratch but most of pro turn pro from amateurs working on friends and family cars, how many of You ware working on streets and driveways without any unit, insurance and proper equipment ??


----------



## spiros (Mar 30, 2010)

I think the meaning of this post is that a guy that 5-6 months ago didnt know the difference between glaze ,wax , polish and now is proffesional detailer ..Its not for all the part time detailers


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

> *In the months that came between he was fishing for answers on pad and polish combos and even asked whether he applied Lime Prime before or after wax.....*


I think a lot have missed the point...I have no objection to people learning and starting from the bottom on friends and family cars or even taking a punt with a customers car....its the above quote that is the the highlight....he had *NO CLUE* but was working on customers vehicles...not friends and families but customers....with little knowledge of a really simple product....

yes we learn everyday and anyone that says they dont I ask them this "is it cold up there on your high horse"....

I learn something new everyday and am not afraid to say that....I come across problems as much as the next guy and yep sometimes i have been stumped....one that springs to mind is a Black Audi A1....I went with the mindset its an Audi...hard paint....how wrong i was....it was as soft as the preverbial and totally caught me unawares....

no one is the be all and end all of any trade let alone this one....

so how and when is LP used....


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

spiros said:


> I think the meaning of this post is that a guy that 5-6 months ago didnt know the difference between glaze ,wax , polish and now is proffesional detailer ..Its not for all the part time detailers


:thumb:


----------



## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

vroomtshh said:


> So to be a professional detailer, you must know at what stage every single product on the market is used?
> 
> Its only a basic question because you know the answer. I have no real care about the pros or amateurs, but I don;t think you can slate someone because they ask what a product does.
> 
> I do that every single day in my profession - I must be rubbish at it


I did not state that did I, no need to be a complete so and so. 

If it says paint cleanser or whatever it exactly states then it's usage during the process of detailing would be reasonably obvious to me even if the minor differences between another product and application.Even without understanding a particular product then i have an idea at what stage due to the very nature of the name on the bottle highlighting what it is when it should be used through experience.

I think the fact it also states it on the bottle a lot of the time just reinforces this.

I think it is different when a alleged professional asks end of the day they should understand their market and the products they use and have found useful to them personally if something is brand new like when Iron X came out then yes i can understand it added an additional stage but a product that has not introduced a new stage and says what it does does not really need a question when it states it's use the only real difference is in application which can itself be a can of worms and i can understand people seeking advice then even as a pro.


----------



## Herby (Oct 2, 2009)

I know the word 'professional' is quite subjective but at the end of the day isn't a "professional detailer" just someone who charges for their services and attempts to make a living from it? 

There will be good and bad ones and if someone is silly enough to not do research before spending the best part of £500 on a paint correction detail then more fool them IMO. Before I got into all this I had Rob from gleammachine correct my car. Even though I was pretty clueless at the time I still spent weeks looking at everyone's work and reading testimonials etc. And I was very happy with his work. It was a toss up between him and Miracle detail but the price of rob and quality of his work was a no brainer when I compared the two. But at no point did I ever consider using someone with little history or experience even if their work was/would have been much cheaper.


----------



## Defined Reflections (Jun 4, 2009)

I dont realy see the point of posting this,your always moaning about other people in your area :doublesho

In fact i think i know who you are talking about, d - detailing ?

I have seen some of his work on another forum ( customer posted some pics ) and he looks like he did a good job.


----------



## Herby (Oct 2, 2009)

Deleted


----------



## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

Yes, many will start up. Yes, many will fall promptly. Quality will outlast any chump flashing his cash with all the gear and no idea. Sure, every one has to start somewhere but come on now.... 6 months and its a fully running business!? Dont figure and wouldnt be much of a business. Certainly a lot of shizzle kicking about this year and I as well as many others have noticed the issues that have arisen within the trade, on here and elsewhere ( check th influx of long time pro's on here that have dropped for instance ). As for the school boy Q of LP before or after wax. Im sure myself and a few others that are full time have some interesting pm's, text's etc that open your eyes to the pro industry let alone to hobbyist. Questions of the governing body keep arising yet it will always fail. Said it before and will say it again, no one is qualified, non biased or non corrupt enough to govern such a thing. Another comment of business being conducted through pm's by certain individuals via forums. Majority had been brought up into question behind closed doors as they to were the main culprits ergo them being offered to quieten off or sign up. Reason why I dont come on so much now if im honest. Way too much back biting, *****ing aand back stabbing going on. Strange as it wasnt like it last year.


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

Defined Reflections said:


> *I dont realy see the point of posting this,your always moaning about other people in your area* :doublesho
> 
> In fact i think i know who you are talking about, d - detailing ?
> 
> ...


----------



## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

Beau Technique said:


> . Reason why I dont come on so much now if im honest. Way too much back biting, *****ing aand back stabbing going on. Strange as it wasnt like it last year.


you reckon thats why so many have home pages on facebook showing there work now and not posting on here


----------



## BellUK (Mar 12, 2012)

Some very strong views.


----------



## R0B (Aug 27, 2010)

Beau Technique said:


> Yes, many will start up. Yes, many will fall promptly. Quality will outlast any chump flashing his cash with all the gear and no idea. Sure, every one has to start somewhere but come on now.... 6 months and its a fully running business!? Dont figure and wouldnt be much of a business. Certainly a lot of shizzle kicking about this year and I as well as many others have noticed the issues that have arisen within the trade, on here and elsewhere ( check th influx of long time pro's on here that have dropped for instance ). As for the school boy Q of LP before or after wax. Im sure myself and a few others that are full time have some interesting pm's, text's etc that open your eyes to the pro industry let alone to hobbyist. Questions of the governing body keep arising yet it will always fail. Said it before and will say it again, no one is qualified, non biased or non corrupt enough to govern such a thing. Another comment of business being conducted through pm's by certain individuals via forums. Majority had been brought up into question behind closed doors as they to were the main culprits ergo them being offered to quieten off or sign up. Reason why I dont come on so much now if im honest. Way too much back biting, *****ing aand back stabbing going on. Strange as it wasnt like it last year.


Very true Scott


----------



## mjh760 (Dec 6, 2011)

Not been on here that long to be honest, but what i have noticed is alot of back-biting, sucking up & a hell of a lot of smoke been blown up ars*s.

I aint even getting into the debate, but the "Pro's" doing this for a living are doing it for a reason, the people setting up company's after asking questions etc.... are setting up for a reason - "MONEY". We need it to live end off, would any off these "Pro's" hold there hands up now and say it was just for the money as the passion for detailing has now gone since they maybe turned a hobby into a business??


----------



## Fac (Mar 31, 2012)

.......


----------



## Defined Reflections (Jun 4, 2009)

Reflectology said:


> Who do i moan about then...as you seem to be taking note instead of doing what you do best....
> 
> and yes i did but at least i have the nerve to hold my hands up to my mistake unlike others on here....but what you are saying is that you have never done it which puts you on the high horse then....
> 
> you say you are sick of hearing all the *****ing in this game ...dont listen if thats the case....


Russ you was moaning about him maybe 6 months ago,you were even moaning about a company in the states because they had "Reflectology" in there web url.
:lol:


----------



## BellUK (Mar 12, 2012)

I personally think this thread should be closed, I think everyone has expressed their opinions and we aren't all going to agree, nor should we have to but if individuals (those who do operate a business) are going to start disagreeing or having ago at each other it doesn't look good as a business, especially since potential customers could be reading.

I think points have been raised and discussed enough, that's my personal opinion though before some of you start moaning at me. :thumb:

Edit: Also to add, what has happened to the friendly, helpful fellow DW fans? All I seem to read now are posts where people seem to be judging others work, or posting negative thoughts. Maybe it's just me or has anyone else noticed this?


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

Defined Reflections said:


> Russ you was moaning about him maybe 6 months ago,you were even moaning about a company in the states because they had "Reflectology" in there web url.
> :lol:


Can't recall that tbh but if that's everyone then I think we are all guilty of having a whinge....dont know what your issue is with me but you seem to be turning your posts into a personal attack....

My point doesn't seem have sunk in with you....the transition between hobby and business and the relatively easy to answer question that was posted....

Regarding business names and issues these are generally posted in the closed area for supporters to discuss and not to be brought out onto the open...


----------



## Defined Reflections (Jun 4, 2009)

Reflectology said:


> Can't recall that tbh but if that's everyone then I think we are all guilty of having a whinge....dont know what your issue is with me but you seem to be turning your posts into a personal attack....
> 
> My point doesn't seem have sunk in with you....the transition between hobby and business and the relatively easy to answer question that was posted....
> 
> Regarding business names and issues these are generally posted in the closed area for supporters to discuss and not to be brought out onto the open...


Not a attack at all,just pointing out what i pick up from some of your posts thats all :thumb:


----------



## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

This exact same thread can be found on a photography forum, on a mechanics forum on a personal fitness forum, on a gardening forum.......

If people focus on themselves and not worry about other people they will be a lot happier in life.


----------



## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

Brazo said:


> This exact same thread can be found on a photography forum, on a mechanics forum on a personal fitness forum, on a gardening forum.......
> 
> If people focus on themselves and not worry about other people they will be a lot happier in life.


Another reason why ive steered away if im honest Brazo. Way too much going on and clouds heads.


----------



## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

Taking bookings for weddings now guys as i have my new NEX7. pm for details


----------



## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

HeavenlyDetail said:


> Taking bookings for weddings now guys as i have my new NEX7. pm for details


Nearly spat me apple juice over the lappy:lol:


----------



## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

Dont laugh , my mate reckons im the ****** , took some proper shots of his dog and ive got a memory card aswell 
£100 and you get a 3 ft canvas of my lens cap outside the church...


----------



## Matt. (Aug 26, 2007)

I've spoken to a couple of detailers near me.

The reason they don't use this forum is because there are too many over opinionated people on here.

If you don't know what that means - http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Over Opinionated


----------



## BellUK (Mar 12, 2012)

Brazo said:


> This exact same thread can be found on a photography forum, on a mechanics forum on a personal fitness forum, on a gardening forum.......
> 
> If people focus on themselves and not worry about other people they will be a lot happier in life.


Exactly my point. I actually learnt what iron x was developed for the other day, after weeks of using it as an interior cleaner.


----------



## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

As others have said really OP, if these people are so terrible and do such a crap job, you can sleep easy at night knowing your business wont be effected, I don't really see the need to have another post on here about new business's etc. I will always stick by my belief that age doesn't always equal a decent experience, for example I am 20, always do a correct job and I have had a few cars come from another older detailer to me because they weren't happy with the work, but yet were more than happy to re-book instantly with me, so no, just because someone is older does not mean they are better. If you are comfortable with your ability and that customers recognize you at a much higher level then all these other detailers I don't really see why you have to make a point about it? Surely it doesn't effect you? People can flame me all they want on here for starting up young, but do I really care? No. Because I know in myself that I am confident enough to carry out my work, and that I have satisfied, repeat custom. I won't give up my (genuine) passion for caring for cars because people on a forum tell me I'm wrong. Yeah I don't know every single thing about detailing but does anyone truly stop learning? Much the same as when I had my son 1 year ago, I was young, had no idea what I was doing but does that make me a rubbish dad? End of.


----------



## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

Ok let me first start by apologising for the way this thread has come across....it was in no way meant as a dig at new start ups etc....that's not the way it reads unfortunately...

I have no issues with new ventures and yes everyone has to start somewhere....the point however what I was trying to say was that if this is to be your chosen profession then at the outset have a sound knowledge of the products you intend to use whilst working your way upwards....

Yes there are new products cropping up day in day out and we all need to learn their place but from day one wouldn't it be wise to take a route you are familiar with...

Hope this has cleared a few.things up....


----------



## Nally (May 30, 2012)

svended said:


> I stick to doing neighbours and friends cars. I wouldn't dream of starting up a business till I had sufficient training in all techniques required for operating a business of this sort. The car in the second most expensive thing you'll buy after a house and thought some people don't spend a lot of time on them for one reason or another, they will still be suitably pi55ed off if I damaged it. To that end if I come across something I can't mix, I will tell the owner why and what it is and where they can look or I will look on there behalf. Only after they say for me to give it a go and I've explained the possible outcomes will I attempt to tackle (and of course after I've asked a few questions on here).


here here


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

Funnily enough one of the best detailers in Britain imo doesn't post on here at all... can't think why...


----------



## wylie coyote (Jul 15, 2007)

gally said:


> Funnily enough one of the best detailers in Britain imo doesn't post on here at all... can't think why...


Can I email him? I need some advice...

Hope this thread has been worth it - seem to recall a similar one last week


----------



## deanchilds (Dec 11, 2007)

I would love to post up work I do and know that I do some great work but I always think that I don't want to do write ups on here as there are a lot of politics that go on and I hear about a lot of it from others who keep me in the loop! 

I have made some good friends since being in the trade, namely Scott (Beau) and Rich (Refined) and a few more that don't advertise on here but also have made many enemies from people wanting to **** on you and try to **** things up, luckly I rose above it and make sure the only who can **** things up is me! 

I see where Russell is coming from as it can be frustrating when you spend hours and hours selling yourself to a client and then an newbie gets a job on price with less experience etc but at the same time I don't get to down hearted with it, you will have the last laugh! 

The problem I find with this forum is there is such a huge library of info that anyone could spend x amount of time reading threads that they then convince themselves they are the next best thing. 

I've been going 5yrs and still I learn new things, tips, tricks, methods etc every so often. If we all knew everything there was to know then the job wouldn't be so fun.


----------



## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

gally said:


> Funnily enough one of the best detailers in Britain imo doesn't post on here at all... can't think why...


I do?? :wave:


----------



## Fac (Mar 31, 2012)

.....


----------



## Damien (May 8, 2011)

So I'm guessing a Detailing World Christmas dinner & get together is off the cards now.....


----------



## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

Damien said:


> So I'm guessing a Detailing World Christmas dinner & get together is off the cards now.....


Not at all just no forks only knives :lol:


----------



## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

Fac said:


> I _could_set


Grammar! 
I'm kidding 



Damien said:


> So I'm guessing a Detailing World Christmas dinner & get together is off the cards now.....


Funny you should mention that. I've actually been invited to Cuey's Pied-à-terre next week when I'm up that way. We should descend en masse. 
I'm sure he would be most erm..pleased.


----------



## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

There is one car care guru local to us that has been telling people that the wax/ lsp he applies (one that is getting good reviews on here will protect paintwork from been stabbed with an will break a pencil :lol: ) 


Suddenly i have lost all faith in them it sounds as plausible as the claims some car dealerships make over superguard and the like. Im all for people charging for a good job but not hood winking mates of mine.....


----------



## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

That's why I have started doing different things. Leather repairs, smart repairs, splash and a dash valeting (good money to be made), pdr, tints and more. Detailing is now only half my business.

I don't complain about week end warriors it goes with the job........competition.


----------



## PootleFlump (Jan 1, 2006)

I did my first complete detail on a Renault Megane about 6 years ago. My interest started because I wanted to improve a couple of marks on my Fiat Stilo, found Megs UK forum, then this site started. Part-ex my Stilo for some cash and a mates Megane and cleaned up the Megane before selling it to a neighbour. I did a ****ing good job of turning a terrible looking/smelly car into a mint machine and my neighbour said he was always getting comments about how amazing the paintwork was. Now this was me doing a bit of reading, buying a porter cable and then turning out a virtually immaculate finish inside and out in 2 days, done the same on a couple of other cars and not much since. I wouldn't want to go pro because physically it is quite demanding and I doubt I would be able to earn anything like I do currently, but if someone wants to start a business then I have no doubt gaining the required skill to clean cars in 6 months is perfectly achievable and they should be applauded for doing so.


----------



## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

PootleFlump said:


> I did my first complete detail on a Renault Megane about 6 years ago. My interest started because I wanted to improve a couple of marks on my Fiat Stilo, found Megs UK forum, then this site started. Part-ex my Stilo for some cash and a mates Megane and cleaned up the Megane before selling it to a neighbour. I did a ****ing good job of turning a terrible looking/smelly car into a mint machine and my neighbour said he was always getting comments about how amazing the paintwork was. Now this was me doing a bit of reading, buying a porter cable and then turning out a virtually immaculate finish inside and out in 2 days, done the same on a couple of other cars and not much since. I wouldn't want to go pro because physically it is quite demanding and I doubt I would be able to earn anything like I do currently, but if someone wants to start a business then I have no doubt gaining the required skill to clean cars in 6 months is perfectly achievable and they should be applauded for doing so.


till you find fast cut plus and a wool pad 

Its like any "trade" you keep on learning i suppose new products launched all the time, New materials / processes in car construction (matte paint finishes/ carbon fibre bits/ plastic wings which need more care when polishing) Then hidden things like smart repairs that come to haunt you or accident repair work...

some of which can only be found by experience / skill and special expensive tools such as multi layer Paint thickness gauges which even the average detailer might not possess ....


----------



## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

Fast cut plus on a wool pad is not that agressive in the correct hands. I use Megs 101 with wool, spider pad all the time; but I know what I am doing.

I am looking at opening detailing bays to do £150 cut and buffs, not every mark out but swirl removal, which is easy really then refined so no holograms. Coat of wax then job done, 4 guys working on it in a hour and a half. Stay and have a coffee and play the play station. Very much like in the US and I am sure it will work here. We will do oil changes as well. Just trying to sort out figures and company name at companies house. My way of competing with the weekend warriors, play them at their own game.

At the end of the day machining is not rocket science and I think the days of the uber expensive detail will die off and become more affordable; which will mean more business in the end.


----------



## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

Mirror Finish Details said:


> *Fast cut plus on a wool pad is not that agressive in the correct hands*. I use Megs 101 with wool, spider pad all the time; but I know what I am doing.
> 
> I am looking at opening detailing bays to do £150 cut and buffs, not every mark out but swirl removal, which is easy really then refined so no holograms. Coat of wax then job done, 4 guys working on it in a hour and a half. Stay and have a coffee and play the play station. Very much like in the US and I am sure it will work here. We will do oil changes as well. Just trying to sort out figures and company name at companies house. My way of competing with the weekend warriors, play them at their own game.
> 
> At the end of the day machining is not rocket science and I think the days of the uber expensive detail will die off and become more affordable; which will mean more business in the end.


I was just having a friendly leg pull with pootle above having just seen his slight mishap hope the poor sod manages to get some sleep tonight and it sorted ok with his neighbour

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=274909


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

We all muck up, I went to help Alex (Ahaydock) to try and remove a scratch from his front bumper on his old blue A3. Felt like a complete Dk when the smart repair bubbled up. but he was very good about it and I happily paid to get it fixed.

I did it fulltime for a while before I moved out here, wouldn't do it again though. Too much hard work lol


----------



## Deeper Detail (Oct 31, 2010)

Defined Reflections said:


> I dont realy see the point of posting this,your always moaning about other people in your area :doublesho
> 
> In fact i think i know who you are talking about, d - detailing ?
> 
> I have seen some of his work on another forum ( customer posted some pics ) and he looks like he did a good job.


I've just came across this post and TBH I hope you're not talking about me! I've read a few pages and got to this post, which I think is directed to me.

I know DF may be wrong in terms of who the OP is directed at, as I know a certain individual that was asking the same question a while back, but I knew where LP sat from the start, lol.

I started professionally last year, after years of learning and asking questions, then getting made redundant @ BAE, then making the step, working for a trader pretty much full time for a time before doing any clients cars.

My first correction experiences were flatting back paintwork I'd done for my own car and friends way back and machining back up....


----------



## georgey2011 (Oct 24, 2011)

There are a lot of naive people out there who claim to know all the ins and outs of detailing yet dont know their **** from their elbow. Ive done about 7 cars to date was a newbie a year ago and never had one dissapointed customer and never ****ed up someones car either. I wouldnt class myself as experienced either but i know my stages, what each product is and does, pads and all the rest of it, if i didnt i wouldnt go near other peoples cars.. but with everything in life there is always some numpty out there ready to ruin it for the rest of us !


----------



## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

As I say competition. 
That was a big part of my Economics Degree.

I have worked for IBM, Compaq and Dell in my life and we fought like cat and dog over tenders for public sector. In the end Dell won, the cheaper company with better service won.

That was a past life.

I have my pricing that even though I have put my prices up by 20% I am still winning good business. I will play the weekend warrior at his game and use the old sales technique and close. I win some and even get the revenue up.

Detailing is all about passion, sales skill, pricing and closing the customer down.

No use moaning about it, competition is everywhere, we live in a compatative world and no way could detailing prices be fixed. Just get on with it and learn from the jobs you loose.

As an ex Sales Director for Dell Computers I should be selling my sales skills!!!???


----------



## tom-225 (Aug 30, 2009)

Mirror Finish Details said:


> As I say competition.
> That was a big part of my Economics Degree.
> 
> I have worked for IBM, Compaq and Dell in my life and we fought like cat and dog over tenders for public sector. In the end Dell won, the cheaper company with better service won.
> ...


I agree with you there buddy i have no problem with competition, infact with detailing i find it can actually help get the ideas of detailing out there.

My only problem is absolute cowboys who havent got a clue what they are doing.


----------



## Defined Reflections (Jun 4, 2009)

Deeper Detail said:


> I've just came across this post and TBH I hope you're not talking about me! I've read a few pages and got to this post, which I think is directed to me.
> 
> I know DF may be wrong in terms of who the OP is directed at, as I know a certain individual that was asking the same question a while back, but I knew where LP sat from the start, lol.
> 
> ...


No its not you!


----------



## Deeper Detail (Oct 31, 2010)

Defined Reflections said:


> No its not you!


Thanks for the info mate and the pm's I've received off you and Russ, I was getting paranoid last night :thumb:


----------



## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

I was sent a book by my detailing friend in the US Renny Doyle; the guy who detailed Air Force One. The book is an inspiration, not a detailing book but how to run a detailing business. It has changed my outlook. Hence why I put my prices up. 

But.....i will still attack the weekend warrior as it's a war out there. Example, a potential customer rang me and said XX company quoted £210 for a correction, told him to go for it as I will not compete. He asked me why I said I would only do an enhancement for £210. Talked to him, asked loads of open ended questions, the guy XX could only do it a weekend was doing it part time. I sold him my service, added an extra £100 to the deal and closed him as I had my diary to hand I could tie him down and take a deposit. Bish bash I make £310 for the day and a £100 deposit sat in the bank.

His servive was a quick tickle with a finishing polish and did not guarantee to remove swirl marks. I can easily de swirl an Accord in a day but not the deeper scratches. The XX company did not even know about the possible scratches. he may be prepared to pay me an extra day for the deeper scratches if need be. So looking at possibly more wonga.

Detailing is passion, you must have petrol as blood, being a sales person first a detailer second and be able to sell your skills and company and beat the competition. If you can't do that and moan about the weekend warriors/competition then I would just pack up.

To conclude sales ability is paramount, plus I offered this guy a receipt and he could pay by card. The other guy wanted cash.

As I say I will win the war from the weekend warriors, I am just playing my game with my sales ability and being a pucker company.


----------



## tom-225 (Aug 30, 2009)

Mirror Finish Details said:


> I was sent a book by my detailing friend in the US Renny Doyle; the guy who detailed Air Force One. The book is an inspiration, not a detailing book but how to run a detailing business. It has changed my outlook. Hence why I put my prices up.
> 
> But.....i will still attack the weekend warrior as it's a war out there. Example, a potential customer rang me and said XX company quoted £210 for a correction, told him to go for it as I will not compete. He asked me why I said I would only do an enhancement for £210. Talked to him, asked loads of open ended questions, the guy XX could only do it a weekend was doing it part time. I sold him my service, added an extra £100 to the deal and closed him as I had my diary to hand I could tie him down and take a deposit. Bish bash I make £310 for the day and a £100 deposit sat in the bank.
> 
> ...


This here is IMO the best way to beat the weekend warrior :thumb: however the cowboy who can talk the talk but gives out rubish work is IMO abit harder to combat.

BTW congrats on what sounds like some superb sales ability there !!!


----------



## deanchilds (Dec 11, 2007)

Problem is tho, some people will only want to pay the lower price regardless of what's included. I had a div email wanting a quote for a correction, wanting a courtesy car and really stupid questions then said he has sent it out to loads of companies as he wants to pay the best price some told him I wouldn't quote and he got pissed off and started emailing insults, sent me a copy of an email from another company saying that he had been quoted £800 for a SV detail and that he was getting it done with them and I'm **** etc! So I phoned him up to tell him he was a plum. Next thing I hear a month later he is still ringing around for quotes from a mate of mine who also told him where to go. 

Some people are really to pay the cheapest price no matter what, there was one on here a few weeks ago who emailed for a new car detail but just want the exterior done so I quoted a bit less and was going to do then he followed on twitter and I saw the moaning he does and just ready to spout rubbish I thought I'd let him find someone else so retracted my quotation as there are some people out there that sometimes good enough just isn't good enough!


----------



## DetailMyCar (Apr 19, 2010)

Mirror Finish Details said:


> As I say I will win the war from the weekend warriors, I am just playing my game with my sales ability and being a pucker company.


I think you could mention this a few more times in your posts :thumb:

It doesn't need to be a war, just stick to what you're good at, and as you keep saying your sales ability will win through in the end anyway, you shouldn't need to compete / win a war if you're good at what you do - Give a price, if they don't like it they'll go elsewhere, if they really rate you they will pay it regardless.


----------



## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

So whats a WEEKEND WARRIOR then?


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

chrisc said:


> So whats a WEEKEND WARRIOR then?


Someone who only works at the weekends... ?!?!?!?!?!

Me, for example...I can only detail at the weekends.....

:thumb:


----------



## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

That's cleared that up thanks Mr cueball:thumb:
So it is possible to be good and only do it on a weekend then:lol:.
Make me laugh some of the posts it's us weekend warriors what have gone to alot of there polishing courses


----------



## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

I would say yes....when I used to run my sideline company I had a number of regular customers, and just because I only worked weekends never bothered them..

Infact I had work in to rectify "other professionals" work.

I had to give it up though as my new job just has me away from home and when I am at home I dont want to be loosing my weekends.

So in answer to your question yes you can be a part-time detailer and produce as good a results as a full time pro.


----------



## mejinks (Nov 22, 2009)

Im a part time valeter. I'm no detailer and I probably won't be for a while. I've been doing it for two years now and am considering getting a unit and moving to full time.

I can see things from both side of the coin. I love what I do, but at the moment its only evenings and weekends, I don't do corrections. Yet. I do want to learn that side of things, but I have to make a decision.

I could open a unit full time and become (eventually) a professional detailer, working on 3 or 4 cars a week, which gives me a little experience, but people drive past and see only a few cars, they automatically assume I'm not very good or too expensive and go elsewhere.

Or I could play the Polish at their own game and have a fast turn around, earning £5 for a splash and dash, but turn around 30 - 40 cars a day. People see lots of cars and they make the assumption that since there are a lot of people going there, it can't be bad.

Before you became a professional, what did you care when you saw a shiny car how it achieved that shine? Joe public thinks like that. 

Competition comes and goes. Sometimes the bad ones stay because they are very lucky, sometimes the good disappear because they get tired of competing and being undercut by cowboys. Don't stagnate, add lots of ancillary services. Did you know that all insurance companies apart from Admiral lose money? They pay out 110% of what they take in premiums, but where they make their money is in offering extras or taking your premium and playing the stock market.

Food for thought.


----------



## Gtiracer (Jul 17, 2008)

I think the OP should not be so quick to judge. You say it is unprofessional to name and shame, but actually its probably more unprofessional to judge someone before you know them or their work.

We are all human beings and some people learn skills exceptionally quick, thats what makes us special, just because its a short period of time or doesn't use your methods does not make him inadequate as a car detailer - You can only judge by someones work when you see it in the flesh.


----------



## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

I'm with the OP Russ here! (and I'll judge the crap out of the guy he's talking about too! :lol

Scary thoughts about what this guy is doing to other people's cars! :doublesho

Do your research on the pros work and ability before handing over your car and money......


----------



## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

mejinks said:


> Or I could play the Polish at their own game and have a fast turn around, earning £5 for a splash and dash, but turn around 30 - 40 cars a day. People see lots of cars and they make the assumption that since there are a lot of people going there, it can't be bad.


You wont do it we tried it and managed 2 years the last 12 months were tough....really tough. You cant compete with the Polski car washes they pay the staff something daft like £20 a day...the best we did with 2 of us on a weekend was 80 cars and that was us working our [email protected]@ls off.

It aint worth it....trust me


----------



## DetailMyCar (Apr 19, 2010)

nick_mcuk said:


> You wont do it we tried it and managed 2 years the last 12 months were tough....really tough. You cant compete with the Polski car washes they pay the staff something daft like £20 a day...the best we did with 2 of us on a weekend was 80 cars and that was us working our [email protected]@ls off.
> 
> It aint worth it....trust me


Absolutely agree!!

Opposite the Unit I work from, there's a large hand car wash place with a drive in, drive out option and it's mainly Romanians - They're all nice lads, and when I roll a car out of the unit they usually come over for a quick look and are blown away by it.

I got chatting to one of them and he said he gets £30 for a whole day, (Sunday) working 8am til 6pm and washing 15 cars.

That's £2 per car he does!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely terrible, no idea how the poor guys actually manage to live on this but it shows how bad they must have it at home if they're still prepared to move here and work that hard for such little cash!

You will never compete with that end of the market so best left to it, they provide a good service to the people that use them so I'm happy to leave well alone!


----------



## DetailMe (Jan 13, 2011)

Miglior said:


> this thread is only going to end in tears! haha! Sometimes its best just to bite your lip!


Jay, you said the right thing at the very beginning!


----------



## Alzak (Aug 31, 2010)

nick_mcuk said:


> You wont do it we tried it and managed 2 years the last 12 months were tough....really tough. You cant compete with the Polski car washes they pay the staff something daft like £20 a day...the best we did with 2 of us on a weekend was 80 cars and that was us working our [email protected]@ls off.
> 
> It aint worth it....trust me


I feel bit offended bu this statement I'm Polish and I can assure You no one work for this kind of money ... there is something like minimum pay which every employer is legally obliged to pay

I know You angry as they put You off Your business ... but do not write untrue assumptions


----------



## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

Alzak said:


> I feel bit offended bu this statement I'm Polish and I can assure You no one work for this kind of money ... there is something like minimum pay which every employer is legally obliged to pay
> 
> I know You angry as they put You off Your business ... but do not write untrue assumptions


Yes there is a minimum wage which employers are legally obliged to pay, but this does not mean they always pay it. Many a time it pops up on border force programmes where these car wash places get investigated and they often employ illegal immigrants who work for less than minimum wage.


----------



## Alzak (Aug 31, 2010)

And yes this is problem with illegal immigrants as they have no different option to fight for their rights since Poland, Romania and other Eastern European countries are in UE we have same right to work and live as UK born people ...

I'm not saying is right but we do not decided about that


----------

