# UK money problems



## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

Just browsing the beeb news site and found THIS, apparently the uk plc is borrowing £40bn to give to the IMF to cover bad debtors and places like Greece etc. Not only are we broke as a nation but we're now borrowing money to put into a fund for the fecking EU zone :wall:


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## uruk hai (Apr 5, 2009)

It does make me laugh


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## centenary (Sep 5, 2010)

uruk hai said:


> It does make me laugh


well yes, but its not quite accurate is it?

Its up to 40bn (not an inconsiderate amount!) and its to the IMF not the EU.

Besides, hug a hoody Dave says it mustnt be used for countries like greece


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

I thought we had a 40Bn deficit that all these cuts we put in place to deal with, plus this 40Bn = 80Bn in debt = this will never end & politicians will use this as an excuse all the time to screw us all in the ASS till the day we die, have I missed anything?


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

centenary said:


> well yes, but its not quite accurate is it?
> 
> Its up to 40bn (not an inconsiderate amount!) and its to the IMF not the EU.
> 
> Besides, hug a hoody Dave says it mustnt be used for countries like greece


From what i've heard it's to the IMF, but that it's likely to go to the EU in the end. It's a political move, as it would sound worse if it was handed directly to the EU to bail out the banks AGAIN.

The simple solution is that each country issues their own currency interest-free!!!! Why does each country pay private bankers (@ interest) for the priviledge to issue the nations currency?

We have the Bank of England & the Royal mint FFS!!!:wall:

Obviously this is rhetorical  as each country is supposed to be in debt to the bankers which can never be paid off!!!

IIRC the Axis of evil countries (see G. Bush) are the only countries where the national currencies are issued interest free & are not in-debted to the IMF (well now Libya will be) 






One of a handful of politicians i truely trust!!!! Much Respect for Ron Paul, i urge everyone to look him up!


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)




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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Ron Paul is the man!!!!

:thumb:


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

The Cueball said:


> Ron Paul is a man!!!!
> 
> :thumb:


He indeed is! I've been watching the tv debates on youtube & he's amazing how he sticks to his principles no matter how he may come across.

Here's another schooling of the financial problem recommended to watch!!!!:


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## Goldbug (Sep 23, 2011)

ITHAQVA said:


> I thought we had a 40Bn deficit that all these cuts we put in place to deal with, plus this 40Bn = 80Bn in debt = this will never end & politicians will use this as an excuse all the time to screw us all in the ASS till the day we die, have I missed anything?


We don't have £40b, they are going to borrow it off our kids. They are just not going to ask them.

It's only 600GBP per person, barely more than the latest iphone.
are people in this country really so tight fisted that they resent our obligation to help hard working Greek families and Greek public sector key workers?


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## Goldbug (Sep 23, 2011)

bigmc said:


> Just browsing the beeb news site and found THIS, apparently the uk plc is borrowing £40bn to give to the IMF to cover bad debtors and places like Greece etc. Not only are we broke as a nation but we're now borrowing money to put into a fund for the fecking EU zone :wall:


We are at a point in history where the only thing that can save the British People from their own government would be if the British Army removed the government and held fresh elections with the political parties legally required to stick to their manifesto, with any variance whatsoever from that manifesto requiring a referendum.


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## Goldbug (Sep 23, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> Ron Paul is the man!!!!
> 
> :thumb:


Hero worship I shall, He is worth a thousand Barry Obama :thumb:


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Goldbug said:


> We are at a point in history where the only thing that can save the British People from their own government would be if the British Army removed the government and held fresh elections with the political parties legally required to stick to their manifesto, with any variance whatsoever from that manifesto requiring a referendum.


:devil: Good idea, when can we start :thumb: :devil:


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## Goldbug (Sep 23, 2011)

Easy - you just let people opt out from being governed by the state. Just leave the rest to enjoy their red/blue fantasies until it collapses.


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Goldbug said:


> Easy - you just let people opt out from being governed by the state. Just leave the rest to enjoy their red/blue fantasies until it collapses.


Like it, no need to resurrect old rotten politics, a new start, i wonder how long until the rest of the world would follow & that's is why this would probably be stopped (Legally?) by our concerned governments. :thumb:


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## Goldbug (Sep 23, 2011)

ITHAQVA said:


> i wonder how long until the rest of the world would follow & that's is why this would probably be stopped (Legally?) by our concerned governments. :thumb:


M,ost people in the western world are deluded imbeciles:wall:


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Goldbug said:


> M,ost people in the western world are deluded imbeciles:wall:


Thats unfair!!! its 99.9% 

Joe public: "Think for myself, NO WAY", is it safe? 

I remember a good CRASS song, very apt here "Your already already dead" :thumb:


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah,

I know what the problems are.........................give me viable solutions or it's just another load of rhetoric.


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Gruffs said:


> Yeah, Yeah, Yeah,
> 
> I know what the problems are.........................give me viable solutions or it's just another load of rhetoric.


Think we the UK would do very well if we could redevelop the political system, with more input & responsibility given to us all, make us manage our country as it were, but not in a communist way, i really don't see me in a grey boiler suit 

If we have an immigration issue lets work together to resolve in a sensible but fair way, none of this sun newspaper rubbish.

In fact the media seems to have a lot to answer to in many respects, but then again so have government & i mean all parties.


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

Very interesting from the U.S.!!!
I say let's audit the Bank of England too!!!

The video's at the bottom are quite interesting!

http://www.prisonplanet.com/ron-paul-inside-sources-told-me-fed-is-panicking-at-mass-awakening.html


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

kh904 said:


> Very interesting from the U.S.!!!
> I say let's audit the Bank of England too!!!
> 
> http://www.prisonplanet.com/ron-paul-inside-sources-told-me-fed-is-panicking-at-mass-awakening.html


Dated 27th May 2010.

That went well then.


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

Gruffs said:


> Dated 27th May 2010.
> 
> That went well then.


The Fed Res. was forced by congress to declare the Bank Bailout recipients:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703865004575649160241029520.html?mod=e2tw

The Occupy movement around the world this year etc, more people are definitely lookin deeper into this area.


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

kh904 said:


> The Fed Res. was forced by congress to declare the Bank Bailout recipients:
> 
> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703865004575649160241029520.html?mod=e2tw
> 
> The Occupy movement around the world this year etc, more people are definitely lookin deeper into this area.


Ok,

So people are being informed and looking into the area of our financial prison as it were.

I still stand by my previous statement.

I have read a lot of the articles and watched some of the hellishly boring but at the same time interesting videos and I realise the financial problems we have.

But, I have still to see a viable, workable alternative that isn't ideological communism that we already know doesn't work in reality.

I have an ideal analogy for this;

It's like a group of process engineers sitting in a meeting saying;

"We have a problem with X,Y,Z".
"So what are we going to do about it"?
"That would be Manufacturing's problem"

I've got your point, I'm awake and reading it.

What is the alternative? It has to be offered otherwise you just sound like, well David Icke.


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

Gruffs said:


> Ok,
> 
> So people are being informed and looking into the area of our financial prison as it were.
> 
> ...


I would recommend looking up Ron Paul (look up his debates & policies).
Essentially he would like to end the Fed. Reserve & have a currency linked to gold IIRC & stop a central bank having a monopoly on the nations money supply.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Gruffs, see my answer to your question in the original money thread, it's quite simple really, but it will never happen as people will lose their control....

:thumb:


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

But which nation's have the Gold? And what of those that do not have Gold? Can we expect the USA to share out it's Gold? This system and ideological change has to be universal otherwise trade would be thrown into chaos regardless of what the money system is based on.

Ron Paul has great ideas but he is still an American and Americans look after America first................as they should do. What about the UK? We don't have any Gold to speak of left, the Socialist party with the people's interests at their core sold it all. So how do we as a nation support this change?

I understand what is being said, I understand what is wanted. *HOW* is it going to be done? If the existing mentality is so entrenched, it is going to take one hell of a coup d'etat to change it, a massive swing in public understanding and motivation.

Seeing as the system is so entrenched, that realistically means civil war. In America and Europe. Which means a Global War. Again.

For what?

The greedy and powerful, clever men to lead us into another form of sub-conscious slavery. Be it religious or monetary. After all, that was was existed before the world got into debt (twice).

The people do not care, they don't even think far enough to have a concept of what you and I are discussing here. They are so ineffectually lazy that the only thing that motivates them is the box in the corner of their room.

Sadly, For all his great ideas, Ron Paul has not been effectual in the last 30 years. That should tell us something about the population and their apathy.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Yeah, I agree with what you are saying, I don't think it will ever change, as it just can't....end of... hence why the last part of my post was: basically, we are all f***d

Even if we didn't go back to a gold standard, we could keep it "fiat money" and the governments could print their own, to use without paying interest...that would help.

I don't believe there are any laws, set in stone, that they must borrow all money from private banks at interest...so I always wonder why we continue to do it...

Just think of all the money that could be saved by doing this one thing. interest rates could come down, it could work.

At the end of the day, all interest is just numbers on a computer screen, it's not real, so it could, and should be wiped out...

But that is not going to happen either! :lol:

:thumb:


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

We both know exactly why.

Debt controls the population.

For you and I who understand it, it seems daft. 

For those that earn X and cover their debts every month which also equal X, they are directly controlled by interest rate.

If you are careful with your money, you can absorb the changes and lament the stupidity of others.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Yip, there is no money without debt in this world....fecking crazy, what a system... :wall::wall::wall:

Living without debt is hard sometimes, but it's something I have been careful to avoid, even though I would love to go out and get a new lambo on the never never, I just couldn't sleep at night knowing I owe money out...

It's a shame that we live in a world that deems that possesions maketh the man....


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## kh904 (Dec 18, 2006)

It doesn't neccessarily have to be backed by gold but any other commodity ie silver, copper, wheat etc etc.
Basicially the money is backed by or a receipt of that commodity (as £sterling & $ used to be), so that the banks where not allowed to create money from thin air by entering it on a computer screen or book-keeping entry. Nearly all of the problems stem down to fractional reserve banking & creation of credit out of thin air.

Can we do anything about it? It's very difficult, but imo not impossible. If enough people question it & put pressure on the powers that be in a smart way then slowly but surely we will head in the right direction.

If the public are more aware & educated then we should be able to see through the rhetoric & spin and not be so easily seduced by politicians.

Ultimately the power is with the people. The system can't function properly if nobody cooperates with it (ie national civil disobedience/strike). See how effective the Poll tax riots were if everyone comes together for a common cause.
Wars can't go on for long if nobody decides to fight in them etc etc.

Look at the Greek people, that are coming together & putting consistant pressure on their government. Will the end result be different? May be, maybe not, but they are causing grief to their government, Euro-zone & IMF

Maybe i'm naieve & have blind faith where there is non, but just rolling over accepting defeat without a fight (i don't necessarily mean physical) is exactly what 'they' want & how they succeed.

'All it takes for evil to succeed is for enough good men to do nothing' or something like that!


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