# Polish drop back



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

is this a factor in the detailing world? drop back is when you polish a surface and all looks fine but after some time (a couple of weeks for eg) defects start to appear. why? a lot of polishes use mineral oils as part of their makeup which mask imperfections - only for the imperfections to reappear once the oil has gone.


----------



## NKS (Feb 22, 2007)

To answer your question. Yes it is a factor on DW with the use of products like Autoglym Super Resin Polish.


----------



## richie.guy (Apr 10, 2006)

It depends on what's being used and how you are prepping the surface after polishing. 

An IPA wipedown or pure paint cleaner should remove any 'filling' oils.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

ipa doesn't remove everything - the infra red lamps they use in body shops are much more effective.


----------



## richie.guy (Apr 10, 2006)

loboil said:


> ipa doesn't remove everything - the infra red lamps they use in body shops are much more effective.


Any more info?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

info about the lamps? - pretty much every body shop has one - 3x3 bar infra red lamps - heats the surface up to about 90 to 100 degs C. If you've just polished from flat sanding and you think you have a perfect job done put one of these guys on for 20 mins.


----------



## richie.guy (Apr 10, 2006)

loboil said:


> info about the lamps? - pretty much every body shop has one - 3x3 bar infra red lamps - heats the surface up to about 90 to 100 degs C. If you've just polished from flat sanding and you think you have a perfect job done put one of these guys on for 20 mins.


And what happens - the oils evaporate?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

richie.guy said:


> And what happens - the oils evaporate?


not sure if they evaporate or melt away but the result can be pretty disappointing.


----------



## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

loboil said:


> a lot of polishes use mineral oils as part of their makeup which mask imperfections - only for the imperfections to reappear once the oil has gone.


To my understanding (please correct me if i am wrong) mineral oils dont necessarily mean 'fillers'. I use the Presta range of compounds and polishes for paint correction and these are heavy in mineral oils and yet give absolutely no filling effects at all. The mineral oil is what makes these more workable than say the Farecla range which are waterbased and dry out before they have achieved any desired results on hard paints especially.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Krystal-Kleen said:


> To my understanding (please correct me if i am wrong) mineral oils dont necessarily mean 'fillers'. I use the Presta range of compounds and polishes for paint correction and these are heavy in mineral oils and yet give absolutely no filling effects at all. The mineral oil is what makes these more workable than say the Farecla range which are waterbased and dry out before they have achieved any desired results on hard paints especially.


we've not tested that range but all the compounds that we have tested that are full of oils do drop back. technique is a large component and tbh i would imagine most detailing enthusiasts have well above the standard of finishing techniques you get in your average body shop not least because you are not under pressure to get the job out the door in 20 minutes!


----------



## TOGWT (Oct 26, 2005)

loboil said:


> info about the lamps? - pretty much every body shop has one - 3x3 bar infra red lamps - heats the surface up to about 90 to 100 degs C. If you've just polished from flat sanding and you think you have a perfect job done put one of these guys on for 20 mins.


US standard method for paint inspection after polishing is an IPA wipe-down and then to inspect the surface with an inspection light (SunGun, Halogens, etc)

I would be interested in how the infra-red lamp process works to show any paint defects. And would a pro want to wait for twenty mins when an IPA wipe-down is almost immediate?


----------



## PhillipM (Jun 7, 2007)

Bloody good for putting hard waxes down too though...


----------



## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Yes, I have seen evidence of this. It can happen with Menz if you don't work a small enough area/let is break down properly. Red car with bad oxidisation. Oxidisation had gone when it was polished, then on half of the bonnet returned after a week. You could even see the tape line!


----------



## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

I've had this happen, polished using halogens as a light source - everything gone put the sun gun on and it showed up quite a bit.

Is this the sort of lamp your on about?

http://www.shanetodd.co.uk/contentitempage.aspx?contentid=321031


----------



## richie.guy (Apr 10, 2006)

That's interesting, never heard of it before.

I'll machine a couple of panels and see how they fare over a few weeks.


----------



## V8burble (Jul 3, 2007)

Is this not just normal, in varying degrees with polish of most types? Most polishes feed the paint and so improve the surface gloss and reduce the effects of minor remaining imperfections. As the paint dries out the finish is reduced and the defects more noticable. I would guess that using an IR lamp would accelerate this natural drying out. Are you not better off sealing the surface with a wax or sealant to slow down the drying out, rather than promote it? Just my thoughts, not backed up by experience :buffer:


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

think there is quite a lot of misinformation being fed by wax companies re feeding paint.

these are the kind of lamps body shops use:
http://store01.prostores.com/bodyshopequipment/catalog/SRIV.JPG

drop down is a problem for car manufacturers who flat and then polish eg RR Bentley Aston etc.


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

Rob, did you test Scholl Concepts polishes?


----------



## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

Bence said:


> Rob, did you test Scholl Concepts polishes?


I was given three 1 litre bottles of Concept's Surface polishes for testing last week. i have used them briefly on a couple of panels and find them to be a bit too quick on drying out for my liking. Although the glaze seems quite good initially


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Bence said:


> Rob, did you test Scholl Concepts polishes?


no - tbh we were only testing ours against what the already mentioned manufacturers are currently using.


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

That's why I'm asking this, because Audi and Suzuki (for Suzuki and Fiat brands) are using Scholl Concepts in their Hungarian plants.

How was Menzerna's results?

Krystal-Kleen, Concept Chemicals and Scholl Concepts are different companies. Scholl Concepts is a German manufacturer of detailing supplies and chemicals.


----------



## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

Bence said:


> That's why I'm asking this, because Audi and Suzuki (for Suzuki and Fiat brands) are using Scholl Concepts in their Hungarian plants.
> 
> How was Menzerna's results?
> 
> Krystal-Kleen, Concept Chemicals and Scholl Concepts are different companies. Scholl Concepts is a German manufacturer of detailing supplies and chemicals.


I thought it was a typo....going back to sleep now


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Bence said:


> That's why I'm asking this, because Audi and Suzuki (for Suzuki and Fiat brands) are using Scholl Concepts in their Hungarian plants.
> 
> How was Menzerna's results?
> 
> Krystal-Kleen, Concept Chemicals and Scholl Concepts are different companies. Scholl Concepts is a German manufacturer of detailing supplies and chemicals.


how much polishing do they do in these plants?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

not tested menzerna - but from other posts it sounds like they should suffer the same issue. all the menz i've used is full of oil so not suprised that others have suffered this problem.


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

I just know that Scholl is a supplier to these plants.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Bence said:


> I just know that Scholl is a supplier to these plants.


wow quick reply!

would be interesting to know - they certainly don't hand finish any of those cars. btw - just rememberd I've not sent you samples of C1 or P1 - drop me a mail or pm to remind me if you still want it!!


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

Which brands fared well?


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

OK, email sent!


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Bence said:


> Which brands fared well?


on drop back and rub throughs - you are getting a sample of it


----------



## Bence (Dec 21, 2006)

Ok!


----------



## Glossmax (May 9, 2007)

The rest of us just have to guess?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

it's called G|techniq P1 nanoscopic polish - £65/ US gallon - pm me if you want some.


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

loboil said:


> I've not sent you samples of C1 or P1 - drop me a mail or pm to remind me if you still want it!!


Hi Rob :wave: Cough Cough


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

drive 'n' shine said:


> Hi Rob :wave: Cough Cough


golly yes - erm well - im off to the post office!


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

bence & drive n shine
i'll bung in samples of our nano window coating and nano fabric/leather coating too. they are awesome (if i do say so myself!  ).


----------



## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

so was this thread just to advertise "YOUR" polish then?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

ianFRST said:


> so was this thread just to advertise "YOUR" polish then?


no!

a genuine question to see if this is a factor in the detailing market. as the product is packaged in us gallon containers it's not really targeted at the enthusiast market. But that could all change :buffer: :thumb:


----------



## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

fair enough.

but most people on here dont have a polish as the LSP. most will machine polish the car (using menz, 3m, megs, which dont contain fillers) and then use a pre wax paint cleaner, then add a wax as an LSP, so the polish lasting or not, doesnt really come into in imo


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

ianFRST said:


> fair enough.
> 
> but most people on here dont have a polish as the LSP. most will machine polish the car (using menz, 3m, megs, which dont contain fillers) and then use a pre wax paint cleaner, then add a wax as an LSP, so the polish lasting or not, doesnt really come into in imo


sorry to be a pedant but 3m fast cut/fast cut plus etc. and their whole polish range is full of mineral oils which act as fillers. therefore it does drop back (this is in independent tests - this is not us testing it in our lab). not seen tests for menz but it's oily ergo it will drop back. megs i've not used. but i am talking about polishing from trisac or equivalent. most detailers are only dealing with defects such as swirl marks so it's probably a complete non-issue for 99% of detailers.


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

loboil said:


> sorry to be a pedant but 3m fast cut/fast cut plus etc. and their whole polish range is full of mineral oils which act as fillers. therefore it does drop back (this is in independent tests - this is not us testing it in our lab). not seen tests for menz but it's oily ergo it will drop back. megs i've not used. but i am talking about polishing from trisac or equivalent. most detailers are only dealing with defects such as swirl marks so it's probably a complete non-issue for 99% of detailers.


Spot on, as you say as we are only really dealing with swirls etc 99% of the time its not such a big issue but there are the occasions where we would like to know we wont suffer from this "drop back", especially as a few of us are looking further into the machine sanding of cars for next year 

Still to try out your sample of polish mate, must get round to it asap!


----------



## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

f**k me, what a complicated thread, being a newbie, this thread is almost putting me off detailing!


----------



## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Hello Rob, I forgot to answer your PM  

I must make a order from you, I will send you an email.


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

loboil said:


> sorry to be a pedant but 3m fast cut/fast cut plus etc. and their whole polish range is full of mineral oils which act as fillers. therefore it does drop back (this is in independent tests - this is not us testing it in our lab). not seen tests for menz but it's oily ergo it will drop back. megs i've not used. but i am talking about polishing from trisac or equivalent. most detailers are only dealing with defects such as swirl marks so it's probably a complete non-issue for 99% of detailers.


My turn to be a pedant - when I came to see you and tried the P1 polish, I left you with some Menzerna IP 3.02 to try. I'm sure you told me you had subsequently tried it, put it under the lamp and found that it doesn't fill defects. I might be wrong though, maybe you just tried it and gave an IPA wipedown.

I've got to say, I've tried using the polish numerous times and I just don't find it as good to use as Menzerna, and the fling that goes with it is just terrible.


----------



## TOGWT (Oct 26, 2005)

bidderman1969 said:


> f**k me, what a complicated thread, being a newbie, this thread is almost putting me off detailing!


Don't let this put you off, I've been detailing for five decades and I've never used a polish as a last step product (LSP) Most detailer's will wipe-down the surface with an IPA to avoid the oils / silicone interfering with sealants / waxes.


----------



## richjohnhughes (Sep 24, 2007)

IPA....sorry being a bit thick???????


----------



## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

TOGWT said:


> Don't let this put you off, I've been detailing for five decades and I've never used a polish as a last step product (LSP) Most detailer's will wipe-down the surface with an IPA to avoid the oils / silicone interfering with sealants / waxes.


:thumb: :thumb: kind of the point i was trying to make.

IPA = isopropynol alcohol

spray it on a car after youve polished it, and it will removed ALL the polish. leaving you with a true finish


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Reg Hollis said:


> My turn to be a pedant - when I came to see you and tried the P1 polish, I left you with some Menzerna IP 3.02 to try. I'm sure you told me you had subsequently tried it, put it under the lamp and found that it doesn't fill defects. I might be wrong though, maybe you just tried it and gave an IPA wipedown.
> 
> I've got to say, I've tried using the polish numerous times and I just don't find it as good to use as Menzerna, and the fling that goes with it is just terrible.


pedant away 

we found our test rig wasn't producing the same results even with products that when tested independently did drop back. so yes we did test the menz and we did test 3m but we couldn't replicate the results. but it sounds like others on here have noticed this as being an issue with menz.

having almost no oils in the polish of course the fling is going to be worse. but fling can be eliminated by changing technique. drop by to kings langley any time - janis will be more than happy to demonstrate. we could also prep a panel to replicate the test using a proper paintshop infra red lamp which is how the tests that did show drop back were run.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Clark said:


> Spot on, as you say as we are only really dealing with swirls etc 99% of the time its not such a big issue but there are the occasions where we would like to know we wont suffer from this "drop back", especially as a few of us are looking further into the machine sanding of cars for next year
> 
> Still to try out your sample of polish mate, must get round to it asap!


if you can, try it with the wool pad i sent on some flat sanding (will work up to 1000 but recommend >1500). will be interested to hear what you think - some people love it some hate it. one thing is for sure is that it will be unlike any polish you've used before.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

paul - just spoken to janis - his recommendation to avoid fling is to first spread polish out at v.low rpm (min on the makita) and then up to polishing speed which is 2 to 3 on the makita (iirc 900 to 1200). you do not need any more speed than this.

rob


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

Nice one Rob. I'll give you a shout when I'm out your way next to see if its convenient to drop in. After seeing Janis demonstrate last time, I just can't replicate the same results and I guess it is just down to technique. After spending the money, I'd like to se it!


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Reg Hollis said:


> Nice one Rob. I'll give you a shout when I'm out your way next to see if its convenient to drop in. After seeing Janis demonstrate last time, I just can't replicate the same results and I guess it is just down to technique. After spending the money, I'd like to se it!


no worries - as mentioned some really dig it some not - we've got quite a few body shops using it now and they love it. the default they were using before was 3m or farecla.


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

I've got an XJ6 booked in for a couple of days this week, needs some severe correction. I've got the pleasure of my own garage to do it in, so I will have another play.


----------



## talisman (Nov 20, 2006)

can somebody give me details of loboils web site so i can take a look, pm me please if this will cause a problem.....thanks


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

loboil said:


> if you can, try it with the wool pad i sent on some flat sanding (will work up to 1000 but recommend >1500). will be interested to hear what you think - some people love it some hate it. one thing is for sure is that it will be unlike any polish you've used before.


any tips on how to work the polish?


----------



## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

I must admit I have followed this thread closely and am still in two minds:

In theory after an IPA wipedown you are left with wysiwyg and swirls cannot just magically reappear as proven on numerous occcasions when I have returned to customers cars and their wash routine has been spot on. 

However and on the other hand upon doing some serious wet sanding and wool padding upon my own car I did have to return to the back bumper as whilst initially I thought it looked great; direct sunlight still showed wool pad marks.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Brazo said:


> I must admit I have followed this thread closely and am still in two minds:
> 
> In theory after an IPA wipedown you are left with wysiwyg and swirls cannot just magically reappear as proven on numerous occcasions when I have returned to customers cars and their wash routine has been spot on.
> 
> However and on the other hand upon doing some serious wet sanding and wool padding upon my own car I did have to return to the back bumper as whilst initially I thought it looked great; direct sunlight still showed wool pad marks.


i like that you have used the wysiwyg acronym! i was toying with using it on product labelling.

a couple of tests we were part of demonstrated that ipa didn't remove everything but in a third one it did. i can try and recreate the test next week with a proper infra red lamp unit.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Clark said:


> any tips on how to work the polish?


clark - drop me a mail and i'll send you a pdf file I have just put together. Anybody else who needs instructions please feel free to mail me too.

robearle at gtechniq dot com


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

Ok tried my sample of Robs polish today, got a mega swirly Bentley Arnarge to do over the next few days so i would thought it would make a good test mule.

Rear pillar before










I know on the video rob enclosed, it show use with a wool pad, i never use a wool pad, so i thought i would try it using my normal megs polishing pad.

One thing i did find was i had to use probably 1.5 times as much product than i would normally use, but the results after one set were pretty impressive, only downside was i found it to be very dusty, but maybe i overworked it.

Any rear pillar after one set, knocked out most of the swirls/rds so could be a winner, but i will do some further playing around to see if i can improve it in any way


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

good test - although i think the boys at crewe would take issue with you calling an arnarge a mule!!

sounds like you are probably using too much polish tbh. useage will be a bit higher but not 1.5 and I suspect that the dust is a result of this. the polish is a bit dustier because it's got no oil in it but it should not be so great an issue.

seeing that winter is a relatively quiet time for detailing - would a day spent trialling different systems on scrap panels be of interest? we could prep so that some have been recently painted and flatted, some heavily swirled old paint etc. we could host it in our Kings Langley workshop - will fire up the heater and make sure there's a good supply of coffee if someone can bring the biscuits.



first one is in russian (janis has sold loads of product back east) - second is of Chong in Hong Kong - he is our Jedi grand master and third is of Janis - with some terrible commentary by myself - this and the last one aimed at the marine market so we are using a bit more product than for auto.


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

loboil said:


> good test - although i think the boys at crewe would take issue with you calling an arnarge a mule!!
> 
> sounds like you are probably using too much polish tbh. useage will be a bit higher but not 1.5 and I suspect that the dust is a result of this. the polish is a bit dustier because it's got no oil in it but it should not be so great an issue.
> 
> seeing that winter is a relatively quiet time for detailing - would a day spent trialling different systems on scrap panels be of interest? we could prep so that some have been recently painted and flatted, some heavily swirled old paint etc. we could host it in our Kings Langley workshop - will fire up the heater and make sure there's a good supply of coffee if someone can bring the biscuits.


Think the boys from Crewe would disown it :lol:The car looks like its been used to test EVERY swirlomatic in the UK.

I only use very small amounts of Menz normally around 4 pea sized drops, and knowing your polish was water based rather than oil i put 6 largish pea sized drops on as i didn't fancy polishing with a dry pad, but as you say maybe i used too much products hence the dusting. But i was pretty impressed at how much of the defects its knocked out in one hit

I like the sound of having a day up at your place Rob, and its not too far for me either, i'm sure a few others would be interested as well. :thumb: And i'm sure i could stretch to a packet or 2 of choccy digestives


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

ok will check the diary and propose some dates - choccy digestives very acceptable!


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

I'd be up for this too. As I said I would, I used it yesterday to get the bulk correction done on a 1997 Jaguar XJ6. Exactly as Bryan, I can't stand using that wool mop and I think that contributes to the splatter I was getting so much of. So I used a regular Megs Yellow polishing pad, less product and the splatter was greatly reduced. Still evident though, and the dusting was out of this world. Just waiting for the rain to ease off so I can get it outside to wash off before I continue today. Will post some pictures later.


----------



## rydawg (Apr 25, 2007)

Clark said:


> Spot on, as you say as we are only really dealing with swirls etc 99% of the time its not such a big issue but there are the occasions where we would like to know we wont suffer from this "drop back", especially as a few of us are looking further into the machine sanding of cars for next year
> 
> Still to try out your sample of polish mate, must get round to it asap!


Hey Clark:wave:

Which machine sanding are you looking into?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Reg Hollis said:


> I'd be up for this too. As I said I would, I used it yesterday to get the bulk correction done on a 1997 Jaguar XJ6. Exactly as Bryan, I can't stand using that wool mop and I think that contributes to the splatter I was getting so much of. So I used a regular Megs Yellow polishing pad, less product and the splatter was greatly reduced. Still evident though, and the dusting was out of this world. Just waiting for the rain to ease off so I can get it outside to wash off before I continue today. Will post some pictures later.


you really do need the wool mop to get the polish working properly. it does work ok on foam but it's so much slower. even with the wool pad you still have great edge security - we've timed it on edges (scrap panels!) - it's around 20 seconds! for reg abrasives you have 3 seconds - maybe less.

for the dust - make sure the pads are very clean and try to avoid running the pad over edges too much.


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

I don't avoid using the wool mop because of fears of damage, I just find it to be a pain in the butt. Its unweildy (but I guess you get used to it), clogs and needs washing out all the time and I'm sure its what causes most of the fling. I thought I'd try it with the regular Megs pad, and the results were good as per Bryan's)

From









To









From









To


















This was the dust left on the boot after doing the back part off the roof.









To be fair, I'd say I was using similar amounts of polish to Bryan, but if I used less then it just seemed again to be a pain to work, drying up almost straight away, then needing water or QD, then turning into a splatter fest.

If it is a case of further adjustment to technique, I'm very happy to be educated because I think the polish results are great.


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

Agree with Reg on all of the above, and i really want to stick with it as i can see it being a very good polish, especially when the menz doesn't want to play ball


----------



## tdekany (Jul 22, 2006)

drive 'n' shine said:


> Agree with Reg on all of the above, and i really want to stick with it as i can see it being a very good polish, especially when the menz doesn't want to play ball


The videos that I have seen showed no dusting. Have you tried to duplicate the amount of polish used and the technique? Or is this polish very tepm dependent?


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

I've tried all sorts but end up going from splatter to dust, not really anything in between. I personally don't think temp has anything to do with it, the cold certainly doesn't seem to affect it all. 

I think going to see Janis will be a worth while exercise, hopefully he can pin point where I'm going wrong.


----------



## tdekany (Jul 22, 2006)

Reg Hollis said:


> I've tried all sorts but end up going from splatter to dust, not really anything in between. I personally don't think temp has anything to do with it, the cold certainly doesn't seem to affect it all.
> 
> I think going to see Janis will be a worth while exercise, hopefully he can pin point where I'm going wrong.


I'd love to hear how that will turn out.


----------



## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

Reg a good metal spur will make the wool mop so much easier to use as will the odd spritz of qd and then holding a screwed up m/f against the pad and carefully spinning the rotory.


----------



## Frothey (Apr 30, 2007)

Hi

bit late to this one......

we had a guy turn up at work offering a smart repair polishing type of service to knock back swirls etc. I played dumb (no hard!) and watched.... he was using a wool pad at slowish speeds and kept going on about the product being a newish american product, kept mentioning nano-technology (which seems to be the latest buzz word) - also said the polishes were designed for darker paints, didnt work too well on lighter colours (which screamed fillers to me?) and didnt need wax/sealant over the top. similar product?

people at work were impressed, but it did leave a lot of pad marks, but that might be more down to the time spent working and the fact most normal people dont see that type of thing!


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

how does next friday (14th) look for anyone?

i have three makitas - will get a bunch of scrap panels to play around with - some with new some with old paint - some just swirled and some prepp'd to the trisac stage.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Frothey said:


> Hi
> 
> bit late to this one......
> 
> ...


nano is the latest buzz word - beginning to loose credibility as it is often misused.

would help to know what the product was called 

we don't recommend finishing with wool as you will get holograms. our polish leaves nothing on the surface so it doesn't sound similar to the product you were demo'd


----------



## Frothey (Apr 30, 2007)

loboil said:


> would help to know what the product was called


sorry - no idea. wasnt really interested at the time!

_nano is the latest buzz word - beginning to loose credibility as it is often misused. _

hair shampoo's will be the next ones :lol:


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

loboil said:


> how does next friday (14th) look for anyone?
> 
> i have three makitas - will get a bunch of scrap panels to play around with - some with new some with old paint - some just swirled and some prepp'd to the trisac stage.


If i get excused from jury service i'll be up for it :thumb:


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

I can make next Friday too, my regular Friday client has asked to change to Saturday as a special anyway.

Bryan -just foul yourself on the jury bench on day 1, they will think you are crackers and dispense with you!


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

Reg Hollis said:


> Bryan -just foul yourself on the jury bench on day 1, they will think you are crackers and dispense with you!


:lol:Better get a packet of extra strength laxatives for brekky on monday morning


----------



## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Sounds good to me will try to make it if theres room for another.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

ok i have people coming from as far as germany for this - janis is down at the scrappy getting a van load of bonnets. got three 9227cbs, a porter cable here - plenty of power supplies 240 and 110, several types of biscuits on offer and nano paint, glass, rims and fabric coatings to play around with plus a couple of long term test panels which have got several leading sealants and waxes applied to check out.

shall we aim for 1030? should avoid most of the horrors of the m25 by then.

places are going fast so let me know asap if you want to come.

rob


----------



## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Im in after the email if there is room for me


----------



## Exclusive Car Care (Jan 14, 2007)

thanks for email and invite... will try and make this aswell if there is still room


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

cool - see you tomorrow.


----------



## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

Hi Rob

Thanks for the invite. Unfortunately i will not be able to attend as i am a bit snowed under at the moment with work commitments.

I will however look forward to the reviews and opinions of those attending, especially the 'c1'

Many Thanks

Marc


----------



## Exclusive Car Care (Jan 14, 2007)

Hi Rob, i will not be attending tommorow aswell due to work commitments. Sorry


----------



## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Im coming, Who else is going??


----------



## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Its 7:10 and no feedback....come on guys, no secrets


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

I think i can say we were all impressed with the polish.

And @ James best impression of a kosavan sponge jockey (just kidding James it was all in the name of scientific research :lol

So heres a few pics

First up was demo of the polish and pad system on a loverly micra bonnet finished in a rather fetching shade of single stage blue



















Pretty fecked

Then after polishing a masked off section with a wool pad - spot Reg taking it easy with a cuppa










This was then refined with a foam pad using the same polish but i forgot to take a pic!

James then had a play










Then the cringing bit - to test the scratch resistance of the sealant a prep'd bonnet was washed with a sponge scientifically loaded with grit and dirt - for that read Rob went and scooped some up from the car park.










Wash ya mota mister only a fiver










Sorry didn't get anymore pics, but it was an interesting day out many thanks to Rob & Janis for their hospitality and good to meet a few more DW'ers


----------



## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Dam i pull some funny faces when im polishing i just relised i must stay like that for 4-6 hours a day lol, i also wanted to thank the guys at G techniq, the polish and the pads where very impressive, as to was the sealants, but as you know where the real thing that will stand it apart will be the durabilty so iv already done a few test sections on my van


----------



## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Sounds like you guys had a nice little pow wow  shame that I live like 30 000 klicks away..


----------



## Paul-T (Nov 2, 2006)

Great to meet James and Bryan, and of course Rob and Janis. Once again impressed with what I saw, I don't think my technique is far off, just more work required. I'll certainly stick with it. I gave the van a quick wash last night (at 1 degree celcius), and tried the quick wax on the bonnet and wings. Certainly gave a nice shine and instant feel, I'll see how it gets on in the next couple of weeks. I'm really looking forward to trying the other bits too.


----------



## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Reg Hollis said:


> Great to meet James and Bryan, and of course Rob and Janis. Once again impressed with what I saw, I don't think my technique is far off, just more work required. I'll certainly stick with it. I gave the van a quick wash last night (at 1 degree celcius), and tried the quick wax on the bonnet and wings. Certainly gave a nice shine and instant feel, I'll see how it gets on in the next couple of weeks. I'm really looking forward to trying the other bits too.


 i got the sealant on the wing of my van already :wave:


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

thanks for coming guys - i don't think a nissan micra or rover sterling bonnet have seen that much attention ever!

naturally i'm pretty chuffed you found pSystem to be worthwhile. i guess since i have more experience in marine applications i find it reassuring that the best detailers in the land  find there is merit in the system. as mentioned it's not going to be all things to all men.

for the c1 - i'm sure that it goes without saying but before applying ensure that the surface is entirely free from any other coatings before application as otherwise c1 will not be able to bond correctly - buffing by hand with p1 and a wipe down with ipa is what we do.


----------



## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

loboil said:


> for the c1 - i'm sure that it goes without saying but before applying ensure that the surface is entirely free from any other coatings before application as otherwise c1 will not be able to bond correctly - buffing by hand with p1 and a wipe down with ipa is what we do.


that is exactly what i done i P1ed the pannel then IPA wipe down applied the C1 and then buffed off with two MFs (1 to remove and 1 to buff it up) then i taped half off and use the Nuba spray on 1 half :thumb: i will keep an eye on it and see who it acts when washed etc etc


----------



## Mike_001 (Apr 7, 2007)

How would that G Techniq stuff compare to the Meguiar's SOLO System?
TBH it sounds like pretty much the same.
One liquid.... wool pad.... foam pad.... rotary....


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

I'm going to try and get the sealant on my dads car today if i get finished on an S3 early, certainly seems to be promising stuff!


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Mike_001 said:


> How would that G Techniq stuff compare to the Meguiar's SOLO System?
> TBH it sounds like pretty much the same.
> One liquid.... wool pad.... foam pad.... rotary....


what is the meguiars's solo system? in principle yes. but looking at the meguiar's tech info the rpm they recommend to buff at is much higher than for our pSystem. They recommend up to 2k rpm - ours works best at around 900 to 1200.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Clark said:


> I'm going to try and get the sealant on my dads car today if i get finished on an S3 early, certainly seems to be promising stuff!


did you get all the instructions for applying it? trick is to buff immediately and make sure you don't have any half cured coating in your application pad or mf buffing cloths. rotate each after 3 apps/buffs. you need two mfs at a time - one basically spreads the other removes residue.


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

loboil said:


> did you get all the instructions for applying it? trick is to buff immediately and make sure you don't have any half cured coating in your application pad or mf buffing cloths. rotate each after 3 apps/buffs. you need two mfs at a time - one basically spreads the other removes residue.


yeah i got the instructions and had a quick watch of the DVD, just havent had the time to get to play with it properly yet! 

Got little make up remover pads to apply the sealant and i was planning on changing mf's every panel to prevent clogging them up as you say. So apply to say a front wing and then buff off straight after,followed by another clean mf to remove all residue,using the QD if needed?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

yup - no need for the qd though. with current temperatures you've got a lot of time to play with but do a panel at a time. be liberal with the amount of mfs you work with - two even three on the go at a time.


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

what do you recommend to do with the used MF's? put them in a bucket of water till they get washed or...?


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

exactly - otherwise they go rock hard!


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

sorted! hopefully i'll get the chance to play about with the stuff later on this afternoon, cheers mate :thumb:


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

how did you get on?


----------



## Mike_001 (Apr 7, 2007)

Any chance to get some samples of those products to Germany? :wave:


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

loboil said:


> how did you get on?


didnt get finished as early as i'd have liked mate, got an S4 to do over the festive break so i think i may try the sealant on that as its my mates car and if i dont like it i can always re-do it


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

detailing on christmas day - that's dedication :buffer: 

course you won't want to redo it you cheeky bleeder  only if you muck it up


----------



## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

I throw my MF:s in a bucket with water and Allbrites - Rug and upholstery schampo. 

Will post some pictures of my sisters Audi that I sealed with C1 in june.


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

Porta said:


> I throw my MF:s in a bucket with water and Allbrites - Rug and upholstery schampo.
> 
> Will post some pictures of my sisters Audi that I sealed with C1 in june.


look forward to seeing the pics


----------



## drive 'n' shine (Apr 22, 2006)

loboil said:


> look forward to seeing the pics


This was polished using the P1 & pads from Rob :thumb:

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=52322


----------



## gtechrob (Sep 11, 2006)

drive 'n' shine said:


> This was polished using the P1 & pads from Rob :thumb:
> 
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=52322


3 hours saved time - like it! did you finish just using the wool? that's a good result for a black car.


----------

