# dealership detailing



## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

does anyone on here do any volume work for say ford, vardy's, vauxhaul etc.....do you think it would be worth approaching these companies or do you think you would have to discount the price too much to be worth while doing....

im planning on going to see them all in my local/immidiate area, any hint, tips or advice would be warmly welcomed :thumb:

cheers

mundo :thumb:


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## Tweak (Sep 17, 2010)

I doubt the likes of Ford, would be interested in a full detail. They are supposed to be affordable cars, and a full on detail would eat into their profits. So I reckon the only business you would get would be splash and dash work tbh, steady work if you did manage to get on with them tho


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

thanks fella's

mundo


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## R0B (Aug 27, 2010)

i think as above the likes of ford etc work on a price per car budget that includes prep etc to get it out of the doora friend of mine told me who works at 1 of there dealerships and a detail wouldnt be in that costing,nowhere near tbh but as said the likes of audi bmw porsche etc might be a channel to explore,as ypou must have noticed if you look at a new vaux or ford etc they come brand new from the dealer with the fitted option of swirl marks:lol:


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## gary cooper (Jul 27, 2006)

I agree people who sell the more expensive cars might use a detailer' But most just want to sell the car quick and with as much profit as possible therefore a quick and cheap valet is what is normal.


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## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

I deal with 2 trade clients that see the benefit of using a detailer and having rotary work done to enhance the paints finish, both deal with slightly more heavy weight cars.
A vast majority of main dealers will only have standard valeting companies in due to absorbtion rate on the profit margin of the cars.
Ive done work for main dealers but they are few and far between.


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

have you not literally only just learnt to machine polish?


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

^^^ lol ^^^

We all know we can pick up a silverline for £30, do our own car with zero practice and then go pro. Isn;t that how all the others do it? :lol:

I have seen a lot of people recently buying Silverlines, and jumping straight onto their car, kinda scared to think about it!

Anyway, back on topic, only you know if it's worth it, and you'd need to speak to the dealers. No point asking us if they'll accept your offer, only the dealer can answer that :thumb:


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## 888-Dave (Jul 30, 2010)

My experience is very few mainstream dealerships will feel the need for a detailer when their army of 50 guys working for pennies a day do an ok job.
Most employ contract valeting companys for value for money.
I'd stick to retail customers unless you can get into top end dealerships who would probably see more of a benefit for a detailer, even then they'd want up to a 50% discount which imo is just daft.
Good luck anyway :thumb:


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## PETER @ ECLIPSE (Apr 19, 2006)

years ago when i first started out got asked to do a few cars at a local dealer as the valeters were all ill or had left ,so agreed , big mistake , the arrangement was to do four cars , after about two hours the sales manager appeared and started saying oh thats ok i need this one doing , leave that do this , i stuck it out for a bit and then told him i either do it to my standard or i dont do it at all, as my standards were way above what they usually do , but obviously the time to do that is also longer which they cant tollerate .
and at one stage told the guy to xxxx off as he was in my face every two minutes .
which sort of backs up why nobody was there .
so you get what im saying its quantity not quality , but good learning curve for me back then , as it moved me away from what i thought might of been an outlet for work .
plus i had to chase them for the money which i had to wait for, all part of learning .


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## alan_mcc (Oct 28, 2008)

-Mat- said:


> I have seen a lot of people recently buying Silverlines, and jumping straight onto their car, kinda scared to think about it!


Whats wrong with silverline rotary polishers?


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

alan_mcc said:


> Whats wrong with silverline rotary polishers?


Their users? Lol :driver:


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

ianFRST said:


> have you not literally only just learnt to machine polish?


yes i have ian why do you ask?

i know i dont have as much experiance with one as yourself or others on here but that doesn't necesserally mean i'm not very good at it....

its all i have done since i learnt the basics mate practice practice and some more practice.....im an intellegent man and know not to go gun hoe at it plus i have different pads and different polishes

polish up on the basics if you pardon the pun.....no-body is born a really good machine polisher eh.....usually people have who have been polishing for a long time pick up bad habbits with out realising and jump straight in on a paint that they think should be hard like say on a bm but that really isnt the case at all is it.....most of them are but not necesserally the one infront of you that could've been the last one before the end of the shift without the correct hardner in the mix so to say.......i look at each car as a test piece which is exactly what it is so i work from the less aggressive up as to not cause any un-necessary damage to the tc.....

i have all the tools (maybe not as good as others) to do a fantastic job which i might add helps a great deal

most of the products i use are of a professional nature.....all of them proved so on here with fella's who have done the thing for years....

i might not be as good as you are my friend, and i might be a novice (so to say) but this doesn't mean that i dont know what to do or exactly how to do it

as the saying goes "practice makes perfect" and my saying is perfect makes money!!!

but like i said mr joe public is really happy with the work i have done so far some of them are really really happy....maybe if one of yourt detailed cars was next to mine they would probably realise mine isnt as good as yours....maybe  but they are able to pass the customer test of happy.

im not being argumentive and i understand totally what you are saying matebut, remember some people pick things up pretty quickl....especially intellegent ones 

mundo :thumb:


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

alan_mcc said:


> Whats wrong with silverline rotary polishers?


Nothing is wrong with them! I started with one and still have it....

What I'm saying is people come on here, see the studio, buy a Silverline (9 times out of 10) because they are cheap. They do 1 car, and think that they can go straight onto making a living/becoming a pro at it!


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## alan_mcc (Oct 28, 2008)

-Mat- said:


> Nothing is wrong with them! I started with one and still have it....
> 
> What I'm saying is people come on here, see the studio, buy a Silverline (9 times out of 10) because they are cheap. They do 1 car, and think that they can go straight onto making a living/becoming a pro at it!


I didn't, I didn't and I don't :lol:


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

Mundo: You may have the tools, but do you have the knowledge? That's what counts. How many different cars, and paint types have you practised on?

Looking at your recent threads, you've asked noobish questions like "How to wet sand", can you use Menz polish on a 3M pad", "wool compounding" etc etc....

I'm not having a personal dig, but can you honestly say you can be given any car, with any number of defects, and fix the problem there and then without asking anyone else for advice?

I know we all start somewhere, but you need to know the techniques, possible problems, etc etc before going full time


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

-Mat- said:


> Nothing is wrong with them! I started with one and still have it....
> 
> What I'm saying is people come on here, see the studio, buy a Silverline (9 times out of 10) because they are cheap. They do 1 car, and think that they can go straight onto making a living/becoming a pro at it!


It's how it works mat. I bought a football the other day, next week I'm going to sign for united at 250k a week!

Mundo I don't doubt you are good and Ian wasn't insulting. But detailing requires a serious amount of knowlege to be able to tackle any car in front of you day in day out. Approach the dealers, what's the worst that can happen.


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

Spoony said:


> It's how it works mat. I bought a football the other day, next week I'm going to sign for united at 250k a week!
> 
> Mundo I don't doubt you are good and Ian wasn't insulting. But detailing requires a serious amount of knowlege to be able to tackle any car in front of you day in day out. Approach the dealers, what's the worst that can happen.


Without the necessary insurance then alot could go wrong.


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

alan_mcc said:


> Whats wrong with silverline rotary polishers?


nothing at all!

some people think cos the use a £400 rotary to do their job that they are the bees knees at polishing!

but i dopnt see everyone using crystal rock for their everyday shine, does this mean that all the other waxes are crap too cos theyre not as expensive?

bullsh!t

sorry for my language but it pathetic!

mundo


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## Black Magic Detail (Aug 17, 2010)

well said mundo


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

mundo: no-one slated the silverline....chill out.....

BTW: do you have a full time job at the moment?


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## alan_mcc (Oct 28, 2008)

mundo said:


> nothing at all!
> 
> some people think cos the use a £400 rotary to do their job that they are the bees knees at polishing!
> 
> ...


wasn't referring to you, was referring to mat. have you got a scrap panel?


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

I use a Makita and a Kestrel and it isn't anything to do with the tools it's all about the skill, patience, determination, knowledge and experience IMO.

We have detailed over 60 vehicles this year and valeted god knows how many more for Audi and believe me - It is not easy and insurance and the above are all required


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

shy kids dont any sweets


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

thought you had a unit....


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

Showshine said:


> I use a Makita and a Kestrel and it isn't anything to do with the tools it's all about the skill, patience, determination, knowledge and experience IMO.
> 
> We have detailed over 60 vehicles this year and valeted god knows how many more for Audi and believe me - It is not easy and insurance and the above are all required


Detail them with the gtech next lol


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

Spoony said:


> Detail them with the gtech next lol


We've already started that review my friend - I must say (It's bloody good stuff :thumb


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

mundo said:


> shy kids dont any sweets


****y kids get a slap round the legs.....

Seems like you've missed my quite lengthy post to yourself..... I could be a bit more blunt if I wanted, but TBH, it ain't worth it!

Good luck, and just hope you don't **** up, and have good insurance

OH, and I bet your on the rock n roll and think this is an easy career to get into?


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

Showshine said:


> I use a Makita and a Kestrel and it isn't anything to do with the tools it's all about the skill, patience, determination, knowledge and experience IMO.
> 
> We have detailed over 60 vehicles this year and valeted god knows how many more for Audi and believe me - It is not easy and insurance and the above are all required


im not pointing fingers at anyone in paticular

but i cant see the point in spending an absolut fortune on a machine when its actually the pads polishs and knoledge that are the main thing........

i actually dont know why im writing this now....ive lost my way 

mundo :buffer::buffer::buffer::buffer::buffer::buffer:


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

you're knowledge is pants... different machines are different. Some will keep a continuous speed, regardless of pressure, some will slow down when pleasure is applied.........

You might want to research more info on machines.... oh, and backing plates whilst you're at it

one other thing, you said you have the knowledge, and everyone is happy with your work, yet only today you asked about jewelling?
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=189988

You sound over-confident dude! Get more practise in (I'm talking months/years) before going full time


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

mundo said:


> im not pointing fingers at anyone in paticular
> 
> but i cant see the point in spending an absolut fortune on a machine when its actually the pads polishs and knoledge that are the main thing........
> 
> ...


Nor me matey and in fact I was re-enforcing your point.

Ok lets get this thread back on track before it gets OTT and silly !

If you feel that it is something you want to do then just do it and see how you go. Just be a little careful as they may ask you about public liability etc etc. Maybe an insurance policy to move their vehicles around their site.

Also from my experience, dealerships will want alot from you and it can be stressful and not easy.

No harm in you trying it if you feel confident in everything you could offer them.

:thumb:


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

agree with Lee, if you wanna do it, go for it.... good luck


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## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

In time you will learn that better equipment does have its place as does better materials to work with.
its not easy setting up, even more so to target a main delaership, it would be very hard going.
Borderline head against a brick wall imo.
I had a contract valeting firm in 2005 which if a large corporation didnt come in and cut costs so dramatically, i may of been still there.
In total I cvered 3 main dealerships all with 90+ car pitchs and a small bodyshop contract aswell.
It took a fair old few years of understanding the whole trade and learning people skills, training 10 staff and more.
They look more so for cost effective, tidy valeting and if you mentioned anything above the £30 marker you would be laughed at usually which isnt detailing money.
As has already been mentioned, the private sectors is best for such trade and having sufficent knowledge of the trade really does help.


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

There is no need for this thread to turn nasty folks really so :-

GROUP HUG


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

no mat i never missed your post mate 

yes im asking questions and yes im a noobie at the polishing i dont deny that

but no im not on the dole.....what made you think i was on the dole? curious?

yes i have a unit it is 3500sq ft and we valet cars along with a scratch free car wash

oh yeah i nearlly forgot we do detailing now too 

no mallice meant btw im just venting my views

mundo :thumb:


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

Well said mundo, just because you buy boutique label waxes and expensive rotary polishers doesn't mean you're going to a better job than someone with a £40 silverline and some ag stuff! I used my new rotary for the first time last weekend and it was a piece of cake tbh, if anything easier than a da.


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

bigmc said:


> Well said mundo, just because you buy boutique label waxes and expensive rotary polishers doesn't mean you're going to a better job than someone with a £40 silverline and some ag stuff! I used my new rotary for the first time last weekend and it was a piece of cake tbh, if anything easier than a da.


Technically incorrect because lets face it - Zymol Glasur vs AG Lifeshine - tested and proven that Zymol is nicer to use, better durability, looks better .......


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

wish id never asked..............................


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## PJM (Jan 23, 2010)

Showshine said:


> Technically incorrect because lets face it - Zymol Glasur vs AG Lifeshine - tested and proven that Zymol is nicer to use, *better durability*, looks better .......


Sorry mate but I think you're forgetting it lasts a lifetime!


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## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

PJM said:


> Sorry mate but I think you're forgetting it lasts a lifetime!


Oh yeah - Lifeshine that lasts erm - at best 1 month :lol:


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## TriBorG (Feb 14, 2007)

Kids as young as 10 wash cars does not mean they are any good at it

I can tile a wall but I am not a tiler

I can cut grass this does not make me a garderner

I can fit a light fitting does not make me a sparkie

I can was my own car and even polish it with a machine does not make me a detailer

Years of practice is what makes for a skilled person


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## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Ah good old DW, always good for a laugh this thread brightened up my day LOL. 

I remember not so long ago the very "pro detailers" giving the guy a hard time asking the same retarded questions, i guess thats what you call pecking order


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## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

I do 2 days a week for a car supermarket doing the high end Audi's, BMW's etc and they have noticed their sales figures increase since I started. I still bill them my daily rate less 10%.
I also do 1 day a week at another German car dealer and they want me 2 days a week at my usual rate.
Private work takes up the rest of the week, but the way it's going will all be trade work soon, then th edreaded VAT, invoices and 30 day payments.

Ho hum, but is what I wanted the business to do this year as trade is very regular work plus I can work inside without getting a unit. Win, win in my book.

Plus staying self employed I can still control my business the way I want to run it and have time off when I want.


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

i know some of you think im doing a sprint before i can even walk but i am actually quite good even if i say so myself......

fair enough im not paul dalton (yet) but im certainly no amaeture (sp) at what im doing novice maybe or even an intermidiate! i dont know but im getting better with every day that goes by, im also gaining in experience from what im doing......i think im ready to charge for my paint correction sevices tbh

we all get better with every one we do learning from each car we touch cos after all theyre all individual....

im not a young lad trying to latch onto something that will make me afew quid every now & then, im a business man trying to expand into something different something i feel very passionate about.

i get every car/van's paintwork to the best of my ability and at the moment its good enough for the market that im aiming at.......im not knocking on porche's door asking to do a full correction on their vehicles, im doing joe publics daily rides at the moment but i do plan on doing up markets motors as quickly as possible.....when im ready....only when im ready too but that shouldnt be too long (i hope)

thats why i asked about ford , vardy's etc i know my own limitations.....

did any of the experienced lads on here wait for someone to tell them that theyre good enough or did they think right im ready lets do it.....i think the latter will be most true!

anyway thats why i joined this community, ya know for help and encouragement and not getting slated for believing in my own abilities

well thats my moan over now so anyone who would be willing to share their knowledge with me i would be very gratefull....if not then thats ok too, there would be no hard feelings

cheers

mundo


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

I see both sides of this.

Some Pro's make 'detailing' out to be come kind of 'dark art' that only very special people could ever master, but go back a couple of years and read some older threads - everyone started somewhere, and asked lots of silly questions along the way. Yes you need product knowledge, experience, customer service, business and Marketing skills, but beyond that, paint correction isn't rocket science. Experience pays dividends, and it's relatively easy to pick up and learn.

On the flip side of this, its very apparent that the 'valeting' community see detailing as a 'quick buck' - their way to charge more money for a bit more work, and more and more people are using detailing terminology to market themselves - arguably this is shrewd business logic, but often it is used out of context.

I think part of the problem for 'detailing' long term is that as more and more people begin to offer paint correction, prices will come down, and it will leave the industry on its ****, with only the very best people, consistently correcting prestige cars, will survive. We often see '**** ups' on here by 'valeters', which are currently being 'fixed' by Detailers, but it won't take long for people to become skilled and catch up. This point, along with technical advancements in polishes/compounds may be the end of '3 day details' and big money changing hands.

Just my thoughts...

mundo, you carry on anyway - good luck to you. I would recommend that you buy decent gear though - I wouldn't fancy correcting a car every day with a Silverline. Also, perception is key in detailing and indeed how you market yourself. If you want to charge good money, then you need to be seen to be using premium products. People generally are becoming more aware of 'detailing' and anyone asking you to 'detail' their car has probably been on here at some point, and will know the difference between AutoGlym LifeShone and Crystal Rock. If I was paying top dollar for a detailer, then I'd expect them to be using quality products.


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

RussZS said:


> I see both sides of this.
> 
> Some Pro's make 'detailing' out to be come kind of 'dark art' that only very special people could ever master, but go back a couple of years and read some older threads - everyone started somewhere, and asked lots of silly questions along the way. Yes you need product knowledge, experience, customer service, business and Marketing skills, but beyond that, paint correction isn't rocket science. Experience pays dividends, and it's relatively easy to pick up and learn.
> 
> ...


atlast costructive critisism

cheers mate....i do have top end products to use on detailing, obviously the valets are done mainly with AS products but the custys are able to upgrade there choice of waxes

i dont use a silkverline either russ but i understand exactly what you are saying

thanks

mundo :thumb:


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## Black Magic Detail (Aug 17, 2010)

more power to you mundo,im just starting out machine polishing and look at this site for information every day ,and im learning a lot .no one starts off as a pro, every one has to learn in some way ,it maybe that one man needs to do 100 cars to reach a certain level and another man may only need to do 25 cars to reach the same level.and yes experiance can only come with time .but asking others with more experiance can only help some ones skills .im sure every pro here has asked for advice at sometime .


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

my thoughts exactly brother

mundo


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

iirc you've got a kestrel sim180, which is a silveline in wolfs clothing 
didn't you only attend a machine polishing class recently? I'd be getting alot more practise before offering correction services - which iam personally


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

-Kev- said:


> iirc you've got a kestrel sim180, which is a silveline in wolfs clothing
> didn't you only attend a machine polishing class recently? I'd be getting alot more practise before offering correction services - which iam personally


yes mate i already said this afew pages back but thanks for the advice kev its taken onboard mate

but like i said i could be a really quick leaner :buffer:

mundo :thumb:


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

As long as you don't go wading in and try and rush correction, then with a hint of common sense its difficult to mess things up. I'm sure everyone has made a mistake on here at some point - that helps build experience too, but as suggested by a number of people already in this thread, unless you're prepared to cough up yourself for your mistakes, then you're definitely going to need some level of insurance before even contemplating contract work for a car dealer, not to mention liability insurance.

As for the amount of practice, I'd have to agree with Kev and suggest that you at least practice on your own/friends/familys' cars before effectively charging for work which is in itself practice. Of course you'll be learning constantly along the way, but the basics of handling a machine, breaking down and working polishes, along with which combination of pad and polish to use, and when, should all be done away from paying customers' cars in my opinion. The challenge is taking these learnings, and applying them to every new car/paint which you come across. I'm certainly no Pro - not even anywhere close to it - but I've done a few cars now, and I'm constantly learning. I think the only thing I have learnt definitively is that I could never hack doing this for a living. With that in mind, I would suggest that you also do 10 or so cars, before getting yourself tied into a lengthy contract with a dealer, leaving you in a position where you have to do something which you may not enjoy.


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## mundo (Sep 7, 2010)

RussZS said:


> As long as you don't go wading in and try and rush correction, then with a hint of common sense its difficult to mess things up. I'm sure everyone has made a mistake on here at some point - that helps build experience too, but as suggested by a number of people already in this thread, unless you're prepared to cough up yourself for your mistakes, then you're definitely going to need some level of insurance before even contemplating contract work for a car dealer, not to mention liability insurance.
> 
> As for the amount of practice, I'd have to agree with Kev and suggest that you at least practice on your own/friends/familys' cars before effectively charging for work which is in itself practice. Of course you'll be learning constantly along the way, but the basics of handling a machine, breaking down and working polishes, along with which combination of pad and polish to use, and when, should all be done away from paying customers' cars in my opinion. The challenge is taking these learnings, and applying them to every new car/paint which you come across. I'm certainly no Pro - not even anywhere close to it - but I've done a few cars now, and I'm constantly learning. I think the only thing I have learnt definitively is that I could never hack doing this for a living. With that in mind, I would suggest that you also do 10 or so cars, before getting yourself tied into a lengthy contract with a dealer, leaving you in a position where you have to do something which you may not enjoy.


i love it man seeing the end result is so rewarding

cheers

mundo :thumb:


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## DetailMyCar (Apr 19, 2010)

RussZS said:


> I see both sides of this.
> 
> Some Pro's make 'detailing' out to be come kind of 'dark art' that only very special people could ever master, but go back a couple of years and read some older threads - everyone started somewhere, and asked lots of silly questions along the way. Yes you need product knowledge, experience, customer service, business and Marketing skills, but beyond that, paint correction isn't rocket science. Experience pays dividends, and it's relatively easy to pick up and learn.
> 
> ...


Fantastic post Russ, agree with everything you say!


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