# Working methids for different polishes



## paddy328 (Mar 4, 2007)

I think that those that have used many different polishes, from 3m to menzerna etc should post up the techniques they use when using them.

For example, the zenith technique works very well for menz, ie 700rpm to spread, couple of passes at 1200rpm, then up to 1500-1800rpm until its broken down and then back down to refine.

Some have said that they have done a whole can in next to no time using 3m ultrafina. Would this because you dont need to wait for it to breakdown and go clear or is it becuase it breaksdown really quickly.

Your thoughts please gents. This could be very usefull to people wanting to give other polishes a try.

And yes, i know i put methids instead of methods


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## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

paddy328 said:


> I think that those that have used many different polishes, from 3m to menzerna etc should post up the techniques they use when using them.
> 
> For example, the zenith technique works very well for menz, ie 700rpm to spread, couple of passes at 1200rpm, then up to 1500-1800rpm until its broken down and then back down to refine.
> 
> ...


Personally i find the zenith method works well for polishes that contain mineral oils (oil based) because the polish stays lubricated at higher speeds and doesnt dry out so quick and remains workable. On water based polishes i find slower speeds are needed to reduce heat build up and the ineviatble drying out that follows. Hand Pressure on your machine of choice will also reduce the working time of your pass by generating more heat and in some cases ...damage

As for doing a whole car in next to no time with ultrafina this really is specific to the paint type...ie hard or soft, and also the extent of the level of correction required. To that point then, a honda for example with only light paint corrction required could be done in a relatively short time with ultrafina as opposed to a 'typical' Merc/BMW with the same level of paint correction (hard paint).

Disclaimer: These are my opinions based on MY working methods:buffer: :buffer: :buffer: :buffer:


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## paddy328 (Mar 4, 2007)

Come on lads. Dave kg? ian?


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## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

Generally the Zenith tenchnique works well for me with most polishes, although i will sometimes go straight to 1800 when working the 3M polishes after spreading at 900rpms. I can do a whole car with finishing polish after de-swirling in a couple of hours tops due to the fact that you dont have to worry about correcting the paint, just maximizing gloss and clarity, i will generally do half a bonnet, a whole door etc moving the rotary quite quickly at high rpm's, still takes 2 or 3 minutes at least to fully work it though


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Can only really describe my methods for using the Menzerna and Meguiars ranges as thats the ones I use most primarily, and am testing the Presta range currently with many thanks to Krystal Kleen.

*Menzerna Cerami-Clear - Rotary*
Finishing or Polishing pad as appropriate.
Spread at low speed, around 600rpm. 
Up to about 1000-1200rpm for three or four passes, light pressure and moving the machine quite slowly (couple of inches per sec).
Up to 1500-1800rpm and work until the residue goes clear: takes a good two or three mins and circa ten passes. Light to medium pressure depending on the paint (always less than PC though). Speed of machine movement varying from a couple of inches per sec to three or four inches per sec, occasionally quicker. 
Refine at around 1000-1200rpm for two or three passes, light pressure and slow machine movements.
If the polish doesn't evenly spread, I find using around 1800rpm rather than 1500rpm to work seems to help. If it flashes, gets hot and clumps quickly, something oily like #7 and work as normal if possible.

*Menzerna Power Gloss - Rotary*
Cutting pad.
Spread at 600rpm.
Two or three passes at 1200-1500rpm to get the polish started, light pressure and slow machine movements.
Work at 1800-2000rpm until residue vanishes/polish dusts. Light to medium pressure, machine movement around four inch per sec. Occasionally, step up to >2000rpm, but monitor panel temperature very carefully, have found mild OP can be knocked back like this on some resprays. 
Stop-Spritz, then a pass or two at 1200rpm to respread polish.
Back up to working speed (1800-2000rpm) until residue vanishes again, repeat a couple of times...
Refine at 1200rpm with light pressure and slow machine movement for a couple of passes.

*Meguiars #80 - Rotary*
Finishing or Polishing pad
Spread at 600rpm.
Start to work at 1200rpm for two or three passes and light pressure, slow machine movements
Work at 1500-1800rpm until the polish starts to dust, residue vanishes - takes a good three or four minutes and many passes. Two or three inches per sec machine movement, light pressure.
Refine at 1000-1200rpm for two slow passes with medium pressure (find a little extra pressure seems to work better here for some reason).

*Meguiars #83 - Rotary*
Polishing pad.
Spread at 600rpm
Start to work at 1200rpm for two or three passes and light pressure, slow machine movements
Work at 1800-2000rpm until the polish starts to dust, residue vanishes - takes a good three or four minutes and many passes. Two or three inches per sec machine movement, light to medium pressure as appropriate, monitor panel temps. If pad begins to squeak early, a little QD will help.
Refine at 1000-1200rpm with light to medium pressure.

This is roughly my own personal methods for working these polishes, they get the results for me that I am happy with, although I will vary from paint to paint, day to day - part of getting the best from the rotary is down to being flexible with your methods and learning each car as you go to get the best from the machine and the paint. Machining by equation wont work, but as a general outline, I hope some folk find the above useful.


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## paddy328 (Mar 4, 2007)

Nice one guys.


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## L200 Steve (Oct 25, 2005)

*Menzerna Intensive Polish PO85RD3.02*

When using the Menz these cooler months of the year, take your time to get some heat into the polish spread on the pad before trying to hit any of the high speeds.

I find that after picking up the polish onto the pad, that I run the pad n polish lightly at a slow speed like 1000 rpm for a good few passes until I see the polish residue turn and start to spread. Only when the polish is spreading nicely across the panel do I start to increase the speed up to that of normal polishing speeds and start to apply any real pressure.

The amount of time spent getting the polish to lay out and spread differs from section to section on the same car, but the wait is always worth it. I suffer from very little dust this way.

If I'm going for a LSP ready finish, then I'll take the polish till it turns clear at 1500 to 1800 RPM, then do the last couple of passes at 1000 RPM to refine the finish.

If I'm doing double sets (due to deeper defects etc) then I tend to stop the first set before the polish has turned clear and reapply more polish earlier than normal. I don't bother fully breaking down the first set, or slowing down to refine the finish.

If I'm following up 3.02 with 85RD, then again, I tend not to finish of my sets fully by slowing down. 85RD on a finishing pad more than able to clean up anything left after a high speed 3.02 set. Saves a bit of time in the detail this way.


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

Nice thread, dave you've helped me out with the Power gloss, I've only worked it at 1500 rpm and tend to need a foamed wool or yellow LC foam to get out marks that some can get out with a finer pad

Sonus SFX range

Start at 700 to spread it, half a minute later it's up to 900 and then 1000, sits at 1150 for a minute and I finish up back down at 800 rpm
I find that sonus should not be applied at any speed above 1200, it dries up really quickly and causes holograms that way

Sometimes SFX 1 and 2 won't cut it at those speeds so I reapply it each one starting at 900 and up to 1200 for a long period of time

Menzerna PO91L, 85RD 3.01, 85RD and 106FF

begin at 600 rpm, do one horizontal pass (five or six left to right and right to left movements) and crank it up to 900-1000 for a vertical pass
Then 1250 for a horizontal and once it's not spreading nicely, up to 1500 rpm and I do a horizontal and vertical pass. 

As soon as I notice the polish not spreading nicely (milky 3D lines) I know that it's ready for refining so I back down to 850 and after a quick spritz of water, 650 rpm

I get fantastic colour enhancement this way
Whenever the Menz wants to be funny, glycerin is added to the applicator bottle so that it will spread how I like it too and extend the working time for me (stays nice and creamy)

Driven to Perfection (Finish Restorer)

This lemon scented stuff has heaps of oils and it spreads beautifully at any speed

600 to begin, up to 1000, then 1100, then 1300 and finally 1500 rpm for a couple of passes
It's finished at 750 rpm

Prima Swirl

This is applied at 600, 900, 1200, 1500 and 1600 before going back down to 1000 for a pass, back up to 1300 and then finished at 800

Movement is one to two inches per second until the final passes which are at four inches a second

Dave, May I ask how many hours it takes you to do a complete two or three step full correction with menzerna?


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

good thread chaps 

i have done a whole car with ultrafine SE in about an hour and a half, BUT it wasnt a 100% correction, more like a 50% correction (if that), it was more to show the owner what i could do with a rotary, as apposed to him using a cheap polish by hand


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Using Menzerna polishes, it can typically take two or three of us around six to eight hours for an average car...


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