# Mothers CMX 3 in 1 Polish and Coat - Coating primer test!



## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Hey Everyone!

Today I decided to put the "Good Paint" Fender under the knife and test out Mothers new CMX 3 in 1 Polish and Coat - a multi purpose paint polish that corrects, primes, and even repairs Ceramic Coatings. I'm not testing the "repair" function of this product today, but I am going to test it as a polish and primer for both Mother CMX Spray Coating and Carpro CQuartz Lite paint coating.

Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

My goal is to see if this is a suitable base for coatings, as it promised to skip a lot of the panel wiping and prepping that needs to be done after polishing before applying a ceramic type coating. There is other companies that make coating primer type products (Gyeon comes to mind) but you can't apply the coating immediately after using the primer unless you panel wipe - a step that you wouldn't need to to with the Mothers product.

mothers cmx 3 n 1 by brianjosephson1, on Flickr Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

Below is the verbage pulled straight from the Mothers website.



> Mothers® CMX® Ceramic 3-in-1 Polish & Coat takes the guesswork out of applying and maintaining ceramic coatings, and can be used at all stages of the ceramic coating process. From pre-coat paint correction to priming your paint for ceramic application or even to repair and refresh an existing coating, this 3-in-1 formula does it all. Cutting-edge abrasives quickly remove imperfections on any coated or uncoated painted surface, while laying down an acrylic-Si02 ceramic foundational primer layer for optimal coating adhesion and a lasting bond. Best of all, this formula does not contain waxes or oils that negate surface adhesion so coatings can be applied immediately after use. Use independently or follow with Mothers® CMX® Ceramic Spray Coating to further enhance your paint's color, gloss, clarity and ceramic protection.


They don't list exact instructions on their website, but I have put a picture of the back of the bottle above for you to read. So far first impressions are good. The bottle is refreshingly premium for a product in this price class. The dispenser is the most premium it gets for a polish type product out there - hats off to mothers for using this style bottle/top combo! I can't count how many times those push down flip up tops, or the Autoglym bottle for SRP has barfed it's contents all over the floor, car, my hand, and clothing when I accidentally picked up the bottle or opened it in the wrong orientation.

As for the setup, here is all the products used below.

Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

In order to test this out with a reference point, I have split the fender into 2 sides. The panel was prepped by first wiping down with Meguiars APC, followed by panel wipe (the panel was not dirty, just dusty). The split is so I can test a "proven" preparation versus the Mothers 3 in 1, and see if there is any bonding/adhesion differences. Thus, one side was polished with Mothers CMX 3 in 1, while the other was polished with Meguairs M205, followed by a panel wipe. To further test the claims of CMX 3n1, I also applied Carpro Cquartz Lite over top of both sides to see if this prep works for a true coating - one that needs a bare panel to adhere properly.

CMX 3n1 after polishing with a Porter Cable 7424XP polisher.
Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

As you can see, the paint is in great shape with no swirls or holograms.
Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

Here is Cquartz lite after being applied.
Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

Below is how much CMX 3n1 was used for half the fender. A bit on the heavy side but the pad had not been primed so I wanted to make sure I had enough.
Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

Same but with M205.
Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

This is where I stand right now. Mothers CMX spray coating can be layered after 24 hours, and CQL needs to go 4 hours without water. Since I am testing adhesion, I will be going 2 weeks before washing with any chemicals, but I will put up beading photos and video after 1 week. I will not be adding additional coats to either product to help keep this as simple and realistic as possible.

OOOOOKKKKAAAAYYY.

So I did take initial water behavior clips, but for whatever reason I didn't want to upload them as a separate video from the main test. Instead, I give you the full video comparing the 2 sections, with both regular washing and APC used to determine how well the products adhered to the panel. Remember, we're not looking for CMX spray coatings to last longer than Cquartz Lite - that's never going to happen. What you're looking for is a difference in decay between the sides. If the CMX polish and coat left behind anything to interfere with the coatings bond, that side would fail before the M205 Polish and panel wiped side. I don't want to spoil it, so enjoy the video, comment, like, and subscribe!

Ugh, I feel dirty saying that.






Below is the video footage showing the difference between a freshly applied and buffed CMX 3n1 with a section that was stripped after it's application. The tape line is where the CMX 3n1 still remains, where as the section before it is the stripped area. From my perspective, it looks very comparable. I would say the section with CMX still applied looks slightly richer, but the defect level is very even and comparable.

Untitled by brianjosephson1, on Flickr

Ok, after a couple weeks of curing and having my time sucked up (planned to do this a week ago) I have finished and uploaded the Polymer sealant / carnauba wax test with CMX 3n1 as the base layer. As before, this was compared to a properly prepped panel to showcase the differences, and if determine if CMX 3n1 Polish and Coat is suitable for priming non-cermaic LSPs. Enjoy the video!


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## roscopervis (Aug 22, 2006)

Yes! I am surprised I haven’t seen the big YouTube players do something along these lines yet. This is important to find out how cross compatible these primer polishes are with different coatings, if at all or if they do compromise the coating a bit, and is it a compromise worth taking.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

roscopervis said:


> Yes! I am surprised I haven't seen the big YouTube players do something along these lines yet. This is important to find out how cross compatible these primer polishes are with different coatings, if at all or if they do compromise the coating a bit, and is it a compromise worth taking.


As far as I've seen only 1 person has put up videos on this product and they're not the most convincing. I hope to have time soon to put together a better, more comprehensive video on the product. Luckily at work I'm not short on test vehicles!


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Main post updated with additional photos and information, and a thorough spell check.

God my typing is getting worse.


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## LeeH (Jan 29, 2006)

Sheep said:


> Main post updated with additional photos and information, and a thorough spell check.
> 
> God my typing is getting worse.


Have you tried the ceramic wash? I've got a bottle in my eBay basket that I don't really need...


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## atbalfour (Aug 11, 2019)

Good test, big fan of Essence.. might do a similar proof of concept with it and Cancoat.


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## noorth (Jul 10, 2019)

I put cosmic V2/rapidwaxx over gyeon primer with one top up about 2-3mths after initial application. Holding up nicely about 6 mths in.

I have a test panel and was hoping to get another one next week. Maybe i will try cquk3 on top of primer on one section and cquk3 alone on another section and lay it in my backyard.....i really like gyeon primer, its the "finisher" for me. 

Off topic; After using sonax perfect finish and 3D one a lot the last 3 or 4 days. There very comparable, i just like the smell of 3D one better.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

LeeH said:


> Have you tried the ceramic wash? I've got a bottle in my eBay basket that I don't really need...


No I haven't tried any of those yet (Turtle Wax, Mothers, or the new Meguiars one). Half of me wants to, as I very seldom need a rinse free wash, but at the same time I'm usually running a test which means I don't want a soap messing with the results



atbalfour said:


> Good test, big fan of Essence.. might do a similar proof of concept with it and Cancoat.


If this product works I am going to buy a case of them. I think for a future test I'll try it with other types of LSPs.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Hey Everyone!

After over a month of curing in the garage, I have completed the test for this panel. I still need to put the video together and add in some voice over but I will hopefully get that done in the next few days (had a really rough week with the little guy - Fever and rashes). Thanks for being patient!


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Full Video is up in the initial post! Thanks for looking!


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## Woodsmoke (Feb 12, 2018)

interesting, 

I'm looking into these ceramic primers that have a bit of fill to them as I'm looking to get a machine polisher this year but i know i have very soft and thin paint, so correction is never going to happen, but if I can get some longish lasting fill that is compatible with a lite/spray coating that would be great.

Have you had a chance to see what its light cut and fill abilities are? Im not after perfection as that would be risky with my car butif i can get a marked improvement and top with some solid protection like can coat, or adams spray ceramic that would be cool


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Woodsmoke said:


> interesting,
> 
> I'm looking into these ceramic primers that have a bit of fill to them as I'm looking to get a machine polisher this year but i know i have very soft and thin paint, so correction is never going to happen, but if I can get some longish lasting fill that is compatible with a lite/spray coating that would be great.
> 
> Have you had a chance to see what its light cut and fill abilities are? Im not after perfection as that would be risky with my car butif i can get a marked improvement and top with some solid protection like can coat, or adams spray ceramic that would be cool


I haven't looked at it on a non-clean panel. I would expect it to be in the finishing polish category, so mild cut and no leftover hazing/marks from a machine polisher. It did clean up this panel really well but I haven't tested the filling/repairing abilities it has.


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## Woodsmoke (Feb 12, 2018)

Sheep said:


> I haven't looked at it on a non-clean panel. I would expect it to be in the finishing polish category, so mild cut and no leftover hazing/marks from a machine polisher. It did clean up this panel really well but I haven't tested the filling/repairing abilities it has.


Well... get too it then


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Woodsmoke said:


> Well... get too it then


I will be running this again on Saturday on the swirled fender, and testing topping it with Polymer sealants and carnauba waxes as well.

Stay Tuned!


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## atbalfour (Aug 11, 2019)

Sheep said:


> I will be running this again on Saturday on the swirled fender, and testing topping it with Polymer sealants and carnauba waxes as well.
> 
> Stay Tuned!


If you have the time it would be extremely interesting to measure the filling vs correction capability - i.e. could you polish the entire panel, put tape down the middle and immediately after use panel prep to degrease one side (in the process lifting the fillers which have not yet cured). Comparing the two sides 50/50 would give you the answer and not sure I've seen a test like that done :thumb:


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

Great work again Sheep. Looks like this could be a fantastic product for people without a garage or are in the trade and mobile. That couples with CQuartz lite or CanCoat....seems like a bit of a winner?


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## Woodsmoke (Feb 12, 2018)

atbalfour said:


> If you have the time it would be extremely interesting to measure the filling vs correction capability - i.e. could you polish the entire panel, put tape down the middle and immediately after use panel prep to degrease one side (in the process lifting the fillers which have not yet cured). Comparing the two sides 50/50 would give you the answer and not sure I've seen a test like that done :thumb:


Ooo like that idea.. though it sounds like it would need to cure quick to be ably to apply a ceramic lite product straight after? Or do we think it. Can cure through the ceramic while allowing it to bond?


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Well that’s where this product gets interesting. It polishes, primes, and repairs. And since it can be topped straight away, I’m not sure if things will be set or not.

I will play around with it over the next few days and see where things go. I was thinking about applying it with a soft hand applicator lightily so there is minimal correction done. But, working it in and then stripping it off would also work. I also need to test itself stand alone and see what it does without any topper. One point I’d like to make is that my swirled panel isn’t 100% even, as the last products I tested all left slight differences in gloss. I have tried with multiple hits of have solvent based prep sprays as well as tar remover and everything else in between, but the faint differences are still there. Will think on it and try to find a way to do this fairly.


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## Woodsmoke (Feb 12, 2018)

Thanks Sheep, 

As an outside only hobbyist, with super thin soft paint this kind of product might let me get a decent enough finish to use a lite ceramic on my paint and it look half decent. otherwise its a wax with a serious glaze under it which isnt the best


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Progress this morning, and more tomorrow. The swirl free test label was stripped of CMX and CQL via da and D300 MF compound. After that it was thoroughly panel wiped and the treated to a round of CMX 3n1 which will be topped with various products to see if they can sit on top of it (none will be “ceramic” based). To compare this I will polish my other, trashy fender and use it as a reference point for beading and adherence. Before I do this though, I ran CMX 3n1 over it via machine and then taped up and panel wiped a section to see the correction vs fuill ratio. I filmed it with the phone light on so help highlight the difference. I though it was nearly indistinguishable between the 2, save for a slightly richer look on the non wiped side. I will also subject the CMX 3n1 not topped to water tomorrow to see if it has any hydrophobic properties worth reporting. It might take another week before I can actually film thewater test, but at least everything will get a good cure.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

All Polymer/Carnauba waxes/sealants were applied to both fenders this morning. The Good paint fender was used as the CMX base, and the poor paint fender was used as the Conventional Polish and Panel wipe reference point. All 5 products applied using their respective instructions, and I left a bare CMX 3n1 only section on the good fender, to see if it has any protective qualities of it's own. Chemical testing will take place next Saturday, giving each product a week to cure indoors out of the environments. I have posted up the Video of CMX after being stripped using a panel wipe (to the main post), to showcase any differences between it's residue and it's base correction. As per the request, this was done immediately after CMX 3n1 was applied to try to remove as much product/filler as possible.


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## toni (Oct 30, 2005)

I checked the compatibility of various ceramic sealants with Sonax Premium Class Paint Cleaner and all worked fine, without any durability penalty. Although it's paint cleaner, they rarely are just that but most of they they contain some waxes or polymers. This one seems to be pretty clean in that respect.

I'm tempted to try TW Ceramic polish&wax in a similar way. Pretty similar to Mothers stuff based on description.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

toni said:


> I checked the compatibility of various ceramic sealants with Sonax Premium Class Paint Cleaner and all worked fine, without any durability penalty. Although it's paint cleaner, they rarely are just that but most of they they contain some waxes or polymers. This one seems to be pretty clean in that respect.
> 
> I'm tempted to try TW Ceramic polish&wax in a similar way. Pretty similar to Mothers stuff based on description.


The problem with TW Polish and Wax is that it needs 24hours of curing before you can top it up with anything. I'm not sure if it will work well with other products but it does work with Ceramic Spray Coating. The fact that CMX 3n1 needs no cure or wipe down afterwards, while still providing some amount of correction makes it the better choice. It also has a great bottle and dispenser.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

This has convinced me to get some of this over any of the other primer polishes out there atm. It's a good base for any LSP and it's only £14 a bottle in the UK.

Can I ask how you applied the polish? By which I mean did you do sets with 4-6 passes and work it like a polish, or did you just spread it by machine like a glaze?


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> This has convinced me to get some of this over any of the other primer polishes out there atm. It's a good base for any LSP and it's only £14 a bottle in the UK.
> 
> Can I ask how you applied the polish? By which I mean did you do sets with 4-6 passes and work it like a polish, or did you just spread it by machine like a glaze?


I applied it like a regular polish. I believe you can use it like more of a glaze as well but its does have cut.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

Superb, thanks Sheep. I noticed in your photos that you had a White LC pad on; that's the light polishing one, isn't it?

I appreciate I could Google the answer to that but then there would be no conversation.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> Superb, thanks Sheep. I noticed in your photos that you had a White LC pad on; that's the light polishing one, isn't it?
> 
> I appreciate I could Google the answer to that but then there would be no conversation.


Yes, lake country white CCS pads. Haven't bought any of the newer ones yet, mainly because I still use a porter cable polisher that doesn't throw down a ton of power.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

I've ordered some of the polish now Sheep, thanks for the review. I feel like these primer polishes are just a good base for any LSP, regardless of whether you go down the ceramic route or not. One that doesn't need to "set up" definitely has an advantage right now.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> I've ordered some of the polish now Sheep, thanks for the review. I feel like these primer polishes are just a good base for any LSP, regardless of whether you go down the ceramic route or not. One that doesn't need to "set up" definitely has an advantage right now.


Yeah I'm testing that right now. Will hit the panel with soap and APC on Saturday and check the results. Save for some products like SRP that plays nice with EGP and HD wax, this could be a great alternative to the AIOs as it lets you use a quick applying ceramic spray product (or potentially other types) while still cutting and prepping in one.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

It's an interesting point that you bring up SRP there because it's the one we all think of for layering, but I find that it still doesn't last that long with EGP on top Vs EGP on bare paint/clear. And it's not great with anything else on top in my experience, although I recently realised I was using the old formula stuff so maybe it's improved. I've since moved to Bilt Hamber Cleanser Polish now but that's kinda limited to the UK.

This is where I see the Mother's coming in to its own - I suspect it can take anything from Collinite 845 to a ceramic spray sealant of your choice and help them all meet their best possible longevity hopes. Could be completely wrong though, although I think you share the same expectations?


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> It's an interesting point that you bring up SRP there because it's the one we all think of for layering, but I find that it still doesn't last that long with EGP on top Vs EGP on bare paint/clear. And it's not great with anything else on top in my experience, although I recently realised I was using the old formula stuff so maybe it's improved. I've since moved to Bilt Hamber Cleanser Polish now but that's kinda limited to the UK.
> 
> This is where I see the Mother's coming in to its own - I suspect it can take anything from Collinite 845 to a ceramic spray sealant of your choice and help them all meet their best possible longevity hopes. Could be completely wrong though, although I think you share the same expectations?


I never had issues with SRP layered with HD or EGP, but you do need to wait between SRP and the topper. You should also left SRP haze before buffing in my experience (pretty sure it says do to that on the bottle, but either way it works and makes it even easier to use). I haven't tried SRP with anything else, as if I'm already only doing that level of "improvement", the product on top isn't going to be anything super durable like a true Ceramic Coating.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

The Polymer and Carnauba wax test video is up top ready to watch! Took a couple weeks to get to it but I think you'll find it was worth the wait.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

Cracking video! Did you find (where it worked) that the CMX would be quicker to get a car protected overall as you don't have to wipe down? I assume so of course, but wanted to ask.


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## roscopervis (Aug 22, 2006)

Sheep said:


> The Polymer and Carnauba wax test video is up top ready to watch! Took a couple weeks to get to it but I think you'll find it was worth the wait.


This is really the testing we need, thanks!

I wonder what it is in Contact 121 that is not bonding well and whether it is used in other products? I then wonder if you could see if Contact 121 behaves the same with, say, Essence or Turtlewax Hybrid Ceramic Polish to see if it is a consistent issue or just a CMX one.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> Cracking video! Did you find (where it worked) that the CMX would be quicker to get a car protected overall as you don't have to wipe down? I assume so of course, but wanted to ask.


Yeah, it was easy to use, easy to buff, and seemed to do it's job quickly. I never dusted and didn't smell either. Combine this with CQL and it's a great 1 2 set for doing a coating properly and cheaply.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

roscopervis said:


> This is really the testing we need, thanks!
> 
> I wonder what it is in Contact 121 that is not bonding well and whether it is used in other products? I then wonder if you could see if Contact 121 behaves the same with, say, Essence or Turtlewax Hybrid Ceramic Polish to see if it is a consistent issue or just a CMX one.


I'm not sure. AS you saw, it didn't affect everything, so there could very well be other ceramic coatings that don't like it. It was interesting to see that of all the products Contact 121 didn't bond properly.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

Sheep said:


> I'm not sure. AS you saw, it didn't affect everything, so there could very well be other ceramic coatings that don't like it. It was interesting to see that of all the products Contact 121 didn't bond properly.


The problem with failures is you then have test it multiple times to see if that's a one off or consistent. Not that you need to do that for us of course, and I know in your case it's unlikely to be user error. I used to be a software tester, can you tell??

Thanks for outfit this hard work in for us dude. It hasn't put me off getting some (or should I say, it hasn't made me want to return my bottle!).


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> The problem with failures is you then have test it multiple times to see if that's a one off or consistent. Not that you need to do that for us of course, and I know in your case it's unlikely to be user error. I used to be a software tester, can you tell??
> 
> Thanks for outfit this hard work in for us dude. It hasn't put me off getting some (or should I say, it hasn't made me want to return my bottle!).


I can't fault this product that at all for the results I got in my last test. It doesn't say it works with non ceramic/SiO2 products, and therefore it doesn't owe me. I have a detail lined up which is going to feature CQuartz uk 3.0, so I am going to polish the panel and test it under CMX to determine if I can go that route before the car arrives. Didn't want to crack the bottle before I had the detail lined up but a couple weeks shouldn't hurt the coating. I'll share the results of that test once I have them.


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## SuperchargedLlama (Apr 25, 2008)

That'll be a very interesting one. I look forward to it and thank you once again for your efforts.

I'm Supercharged Llama on YouTube btw.


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## Sheep (Mar 20, 2009)

Mother-Goose said:


> That'll be a very interesting one. I look forward to it and thank you once again for your efforts.
> 
> I'm Supercharged Llama on YouTube btw.


I'm not sure if I'm going to do a full test on that one, but I will report back if it works.

And yeah I figured that was you based on your way of typing.


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## noorth (Jul 10, 2019)

What is everyone's thoughts on the CMX 3-in-1 Polish now?


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## roscopervis (Aug 22, 2006)

Still great.


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## noorth (Jul 10, 2019)

Much cut? I will probably use a lake county orange HDO pad.


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## roscopervis (Aug 22, 2006)

No, but plenty for soft Porsche paint.


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