# PCP - Convince Me?



## Bristle Hound (May 31, 2009)

Reading an article in the motoring press recently, which said over 60% of all new cars sold were purchased on PCP :doublesho

How do these figures stack up?

I have a couple of neighbours who have cars on PCP & after a chat with them this is what they are paying

Abarth 500 convertable - 3 year PCP deal £391 / month with £1200 deposit

other neighbour Range Rover Evoque diesel with Pure tech pack (?) - 3 year PCP deal £635 / month £1900 deposit

How on earth do the figures stack up?

I have always putchased my cars with personal loans. I did a PCP deal once and felt it was not economically viable (BYW it was a BMW 3 series Coupe)

Thoughts :thumb:


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## Porkypig (Jun 20, 2012)

They will also have what is called a GMFV or guaranteed minimum future value. This is based on the cars predicted residual value after 3 years and whatever the milage agreement was at the start of the deal, i.e 10 k per annum. In the cas eof the evoque say it could be £15k (not a real figure just using it as an example) giving an OTR of £39760.00, or a least a total value of finance to repay.

At the end of the 3 years various options are available, yoy hand teh car back with nothing to pay, you pay the balnace in one lump and own the vehickle, you continue with a new agreement at the same mopnthly installment until it is cleared or, if the car is worth more than the GMFV at that time they give you lump sum towards you next new vehicle when you hand the current one back.

Hope this helps!


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## Beancounter (Aug 31, 2006)

I'm all for PCP and have done numerous ones over the years. It's certainly not the most cot effective way to manage cars, but if you strike a good deal it can become marginal. Especially if you are not in to cars for the long term and change them.....like me....

Oh, and the guy paying £391 for PCP on an Arbarth ......he has been royally ripped off IMHO


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## LukeWS (Sep 9, 2012)

Im on one and wouldnt recommend them tbh they are just a car rental if your want them to be.

I think it works at say the cars worth 15k

You pay 5k and say over 3 years youll do 5000miles a year so at the end woth 15k miles on the clock the minimum theyll buy the car back for it say 5k

So you pay the 5k difference inbetween.

Then at the end theirs 3 choices

1. Pay the final £5000 and own the car

2. Give the car back and that clears the debt owned as long as your within the milage

3. Try and shop around to get more then the owed £5k so you can pay pff the remaining owed and put a deposit down on the next car.

Really your constantly paying for a car but its a cheaper way to own a new car every 3 years.

Im currently paying for mine while saving to buy it as i stupidly rushed into it and regret it now lol


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## Bristle Hound (May 31, 2009)

Porkypig said:


> They will also have what is called a GMFV or guaranteed minimum future value. This is based on the cars predicted residual value after 3 years and whatever the milage agreement was at the start of the deal, i.e 10 k per annum. In the cas eof the evoque say it could be £15k (not a real figure just using it as an example) giving an OTR of £39760.00, or a least a total value of finance to repay.
> 
> At the end of the 3 years various options are available, yoy hand teh car back with nothing to pay, you pay the balnace in one lump and own the vehickle, you continue with a new agreement at the same mopnthly installment until it is cleared or, if the car is worth more than the GMFV at that time they give you lump sum towards you next new vehicle when you hand the current one back.
> 
> Hope this helps!


Cheers Porky, :thumb: I was aware of this mate, having done a PCP deal on a 3 series coupe

The figures for me didn't & don't stack up, to the point I wouldn't do a PCP deal again

Its justs seems a very expensive way to purchase a new car (to me anyway)


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## Dixondmn (Oct 12, 2007)

The final balloon payment is what makes the monthly payments low (although I still think anyone paying over £600 a month for a car has more money than sense.)

I understand people need/want a reliable new car, but if you can't afford it....... blah blah...... but its something you get over once you've passed that "look what I've got" stage in life.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

Ive always looked into this but for me it never works or is worth it because I drive 15k miles per year... so I just end up buying a quality used car because I cant jusitfy spending that much on a car I will never own. Plus I cant be doing with servicing it a main dealer... I do it my self for the total of about £40


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

I have worked in and around PCP / automotive finance for about 20 years so probably have a little knowledge / experience I can share.

I find it really frightening that so many people enter into PCP agreements when they clearly don't fully understand how they work.

Firstly, PCP is great for some customers and not so great for others - it depends entirely on the customers circumstances and requirements

It is completely wrong to say that the GMFV is always set low so that the customer as equity at the end. Recent experience with working with Mercedes is that very few customers have equity at the end, it depends on what manufacturers are trying to achieve. If they want to sell a lot of cars today, set the GMFV high so that payments are lower - deal looks attractive so more cars sold. If the manufacturer wants to play the long game and stand a chance of keeping the customer happy then the GMFV will be set lower. Whilst this increases the monthly payments it should enable customer to be left with some equity at the end thus increasing the ease / likelihood of retaining the customer

Most manufacturers support PCP deals more so than HP, rare to see things like deposit subsidies on HP deals but ten a penny on PCP

End of agreement - you can pay the GMFV and keep the car ( most manufacturers can offer HP to pay this off), hand it back to the manufacturer (only ever done if car is worth less than the GMFV) or p/x it against another car - the car can be p/x'd absolutely anywhere

If the car is handed back you are liable for any excess mileage over and above that agreed on day one and any damage that goes beyond reasonable fair wear and tear

If you p/x the car the dealer (remember this can be any dealer for any manufacturer) will value the car, whatever the car is worth over and above the GMFV is yours to use however you want, if the car is worth less than the GMFV then you simply hand it back to the finance house (NOT the dealer you bought the car from) with nothing to pay (unless undue wear and tear / excess mileage charges are applicable)

A PCP is just a HP deal with a different payment profile and therefore subject to exactly the same rules and regulations. You can VT (Voluntarily Terminate) the agreement once half the total amount payable as been paid. Usually with a PCP this point is very close to the end of agreement due to the payment profile. When a right to VT is exercised a customer is still legally bound to pay for any damage beyond fair wear and tear and excess mileage. Also, a VT never appears on a credit check as it is a legal entitlement to VT

Just like a HP agreement you can also settle a PCP at any point in the agreement.

Fair wear and tear is usually based on the BVRLA (British Vehicle Rental + Leasing Association) guidelines 

In the current marketplace I would strongly advise that any customer looking to fund a new car looks at PCPas they are generally the most cost effective deals because of the amount of manufacturer that is offered. Examples - VW will give you £2k towards your deposit on a Golf if bought on PCP, Mercedes will give you circa 4.5k towards your deposit on a C Class if bought on PCP

If anyone wants some specific advice please feel free to PM me


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## Bristle Hound (May 31, 2009)

Thanks 'andy665' - very informative :thumb:


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Bristle Hound said:


> Thanks 'andy665' - very informative :thumb:


No problem, as is the case with most things what suits one person may not suit another, also what did not necessarily work for you before might be perfect now, especially as most manufacturers are making sure that the best rates and most £ support


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## ron burgandy (Apr 18, 2007)

I have an Audi s3 on pcp and I'm doing far more miles than we agreed I think it will be about double by the time I hand it back is it going to cost me big time? Not sure what to do about it. If I'm in equity at the end, will the mileage difference will it be taken off the equity ?


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

ron burgandy said:


> I have an Audi s3 on pcp and I'm doing far more miles than we agreed I think it will be about double by the time I hand it back is it going to cost me big time? Not sure what to do about it. If I'm in equity at the end, will the mileage difference will it be taken off the equity ?


Yes it will, if you choose to you can contact Audi Financial Services and get your agreement re-structured to take account of the additional mileage, could save a large bill at the end of the agreement

Of course you only pay for the excess mileage directly if you choose to hand the car back.

If you p/x the car the p/x value will simply reflect the mileage and if the p/x figure then falls beneath the GMFV then you pay the difference (to be fair Audi GMFVs are usually set fairly conservatively so hopefully it won't be a problem).

If you pay the GMFV the mileage is totally irrelevant


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

I've done it once and never again. For me PCP works if you never want to own a car, if you cover less than 10k per year or cannot afford to buy a certain car outright. Mercedes have some very good lease rates at the moment, so much so that is often much cheaper to lease a c class compared to a mondeo

If you intend to own the car outright at the end of the lease then you are better off paying a personal loan IMO, otherwise you end up paying interest twice. I would always look at the amount paid, both in deposit and regular payments and any contribution from the dealer. Work this out against what you would lose in terms of depreciation if you pay less on a PCP then go that route, if you pay more going for PCP then consider a personal loan.

For me a personal loan would be preferable as the APR tends to be lower and you can sell the car without having the car show up on a data check.

List prices don't have an impact either, as an example i had 2 quotes on Skoda Fabia Estates, one petrol, one diesel. The diesel was £500 more expensive but works out £20 per month cheaper to lease. I think PCP's started in america where its even more popular than here.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

SteveTDCi said:


> For me PCP works if you never want to own a car - correct - not designed for people who want outright ownership but provides the opportuity to do so if you want
> 
> If you intend to own the car outright at the end of the lease then you are better off paying a personal loan IMO, otherwise you end up paying interest twice - only if you have to re-fiance the GMFV
> 
> ...


Horses for courses


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

I bought my car on PCP, over 2 and a half years and pay only £183. I put the max deposit down to obviously reduce the interest paid. The reason I went for PCP was because of the low monthly payments compared to the traditional finance. As I'm in my last year if my apprenticeship my wages are creeping up and be qualified next year with the ability to do a lot of overtime and night work and will be able to afford the final payment on my car at the end of the term. 

So by taking on a PCP it allowed me to afford a brand new car on my originally low wage, with the benefits of a years road tax and 3 years service plan and 3 years rac breakdown cover.

Also the final payment as long as you've been honest with the your milage should leave you with equity in the car. If at the end of the term my dealer buy the car off you and pay your finance off if thats the route you wanted so the car actually never gets sent back to the manufacturer.


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Too many people buy a car based on being able to make the monthly payments. 

They don't actually give any real thought the actual cost.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Kerr said:


> Too many people buy a car based on being able to make the monthly payments.
> 
> They don't actually give any real thought the actual cost.


I looked at total cost as thats how i budget everything. Like paying insurance as lump and my gym membership i pay yearly and save it up monthly to myself.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Kerr said:


> Too many people buy a car based on being able to make the monthly payments.
> 
> They don't actually give any real thought the actual cost.


Been like that for decades and unlikely to change - as long as you can afford the payments I think the total cost is somewhat irrelevant if it gets you what you want and you're happy with it


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

ron burgandy said:


> I have an Audi s3 on pcp and I'm doing far more miles than we agreed I think it will be about double by the time I hand it back is it going to cost me big time? Not sure what to do about it. If I'm in equity at the end, will the mileage difference will it be taken off the equity ?


What would be the likelihood you would be in equity given you have done double the agreed mileage?

The S3 holds its value very well but to do double the miles the agreement permitted for could be really tough.

Some excess mileage charges are silly.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Kerr said:


> What would be the likelihood you would be in equity given you have done double the agreed mileage?
> 
> The S3 holds its value very well but to do double the miles the agreement permitted for could be really tough.
> 
> Some excess mileage charges are silly.


Totally depends on the original agreed mileage

Doing 20k instead of an agreed 10k will be far less of a problem than doing 50k instead of an agreed 25k


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

It may be a case where you just simply break even, depends on your agreement. Have a look at trade prices of s3 at the age you'll be handing back with the expected milage you'll be doing.


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

andy665 said:


> Totally depends on the original agreed mileage
> 
> Doing 20k instead of an agreed 10k will be far less of a problem than doing 50k instead of an agreed 25k


For sure that is the case.

Got a local newspaper in front on me just now with Mercedes, Range Rover and Kia PCP deals.

All look for between 12-15p per mile.

The Mercedes is a 48x10,000 mile a year agreement. That would be £6000.

The Kia has a future value of £3200 and if you doubled the mileage the charges would be more than the car was worth.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Mine with VW Finance i believe is something like 5.8p or 6.8p sure its the 5p one but cant quite remember, suppose higher the value car maybe more depreciation with higher milage.


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## Beancounter (Aug 31, 2006)

Mines around the 3% mark, started off at 8%.....amazing how much scope there is when the base rate is 0.5%


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## Porkypig (Jun 20, 2012)

Bristle Hound said:


> Cheers Porky, :thumb: I was aware of this mate, having done a PCP deal on a 3 series coupe
> 
> The figures for me didn't & don't stack up, to the point I wouldn't do a PCP deal again
> 
> Its justs seems a very expensive way to purchase a new car (to me anyway)


Thought you might just after I wrote that!! Andy665 explains it pretty well. I have done both but always looked at the whole life cost and made my decision based on what worked best. A low miler on PCP was a good deal but when I was doing 50 - 60k a year PCP was out of the question with few manufacturers wanting to touch it and rentals sky high, straigh HP was a better deal, then whe rates dropped I borrowed elsewhere (against the mortgage as it was cheapest and paid of the balance of finance. 
Hope you make the right choice for you!


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Have you considered just leasing the car? 

I've seen some great lease deals. 

Quite a few guys jumped on an offer for a BMW 640d. 

It was £399x24 with 6x £399 as deposit. 

Sounds a lot to pay £12, 000 over two years but if you did buy the car new it would have lost over £12, 000 before you left the forecourt. 

Obviously this is an expensive example but I wonder how well some other cars would work out.


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## Porkypig (Jun 20, 2012)

Kerr said:


> Have you considered just leasing the car?
> 
> I've seen some great lease deals.
> 
> ...


Good point this. here are from time to time some exceptional looking short term lease delas kicking about.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

andy665 said:


> Been like that for decades and unlikely to change - as long as you can afford the payments I think the total cost is somewhat irrelevant if it gets you what you want and you're happy with it


but dont these people stop and add it up and say to themselves '' well this is going to cost me £14k by the end of 5 years" and then realise there is a second hand car that fits their bill (if they're really honest) a little bit more than their deposit and perhaps a few hundred quid on top of that they could go and buy now.

Then they have a car they own, they can drive as much as they like, service where they want and sell it if needs be.

everybody wants to give the impression of extreme wealth when really 9 times out of 10 they're fooling nobody unless they have a fantastic job and are very lucky. Then they moan they cant afford a house and rack up even more debt.. but its ok we get a nice new car in a few years....

I just laugh at these people who think "its time for a new car after 3 years" yeah if you'd looked after it it would have lasted you another 10 years at least....

I'm not saying this is everyone but just speaking from experience of friends of friends who do this in their early 20's... boils my blood.


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## LukeWS (Sep 9, 2012)

avit88 said:


> I'm not saying this is everyone but just speaking from experience of friends of friends who do this in their early 20's... boils my blood.


This was me  haha even tho the stealer said to me several times return the car we'll clear the 7k balloon payment and put the same amount as a deposit on the next car, he said this several times which i worked out to be £14k and the car news worth 19 haha so i signed away (yes i didn't read into it fully) later realised what really happens then went back to question it to find out the salesman no longer worked their haha

But i also see it as I'm living at home so its my only main big payment and I've learnt my lesson, a very expensive lesson but that'll teach me

Don't rush into things! And if it sounds to good to be true, it usually is 

The servicing and warrantee was a win though as its been back many times and i dont know how much or how to service the dsg is


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Im 21 and i like to think I'm rather sensible with money and abit anal when it comes to budgeting and plan ahead. I know that in 3-4 years time I'm going to want to move out so am saving now for a 15k deposit. I lived away from home with my first year of my apprenticeship meaning i did not need a car, so out of a 4 weekly wage of £560 i saved £400-£450 depending whether i went out or not. With my old and savings gave me a nice deposit for my fabia at the time but now the octavia with some left over for my final payment, meaning as my wages raised i can save a little extra, so instead of getting 5 years finance like my mates do with the corsa vxr nurburgrings and astra's and other stuff i only have pcp over 28months putting me in a much better position than a lot of others my age with child like mentality, and as i said earlier i got benefits with pcp such as breakdown cover for 3 years which probably saved me £60 a year, free servicing for 3 years probably saved me £350 over 3 years and then first years road tax at £130.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

Just looked at the Golf deal with £2k towards deposit from VW....

£125 acceptance fee! I wouldnt spend that on repairs and wear and tear on my car in a year!
£60 option to buy.. 
"Servicing" with VW at prob £250 per time what a joke.... 
Breakdown..... £55 with my insurance top spec, nationwide etc.
£3k deposit from customer....

All that money and it could still go wrong, you dont own it, you still have to insure it I'm guessing? petrol, charges for going over 10k in most cases
Annnddd all for a 1.2 tsi Golf...... Just for the sake of owning a new car.

Personally I just dont get it!

Oh yeah I forgot- and only 35 monthly payments of £225! :doublesho

I spend £250 a month fueling *2* cars that travel 15k a year each for the price of just owning that Golf.

Oh then theres tax est £80 and tyres.....


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

At the end you can trade the car in anywhere and if you done it properly you have equity left over after the finance been paid off. My dealer have never sent a car back they buy it off the customers at trade price as long as the car in good condition and then the customer keeps the equity as a deposit for a new car or they carry on with pcp


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

:lol::lol: That golf would cost me in ownership:

approx £21K minimum that accounting for petrol, insurance (i have no points etc) and everything else. 

That's a deposit for a house right there. 

I'll stick with my 1.6 Golf thanks! But as I say thats just me, everyone else must have a magic wand or something lol

I could go out and buy 2 more mk4 golfs and run them and spend the same... 
That Golf is not 19k better than my car, no way!

Just my opinion.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

So, leasing ... taking the example above for the GOlf, whilst the large deposit is tempting surely paying less and having the latest model is better ?

http://www.carleasespecialoffers.co.uk/offer.php?id=1431


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

It depends what you want, id rather pay what i pay per month that run about in an hold heap that may cost a fortune if it breaks.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

SteveTDCi said:


> So, leasing ... taking the example above for the GOlf, whilst the large deposit is tempting surely paying less and having the latest model is better ?
> 
> http://www.carleasespecialoffers.co.uk/offer.php?id=1431


not knowing all the other details of it I cant comment.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

rob_vrs said:


> It depends what you want, id rather pay what i pay per month that run about in an hold heap that may cost a fortune if it breaks.


There are many cars out there that arent old heaps, you pay a fortune with deals like that golf, which might go wrong, use a ton of oil etc you dont know.

For example my rents just bought a late reg mk5 golf 1.6, immacute low mileage, fsh, from VW directly for £8k it had £15k miles on the clock. It is not ever going to cost them £21k over 3 years and being a golf they would be able to sell it or px for a nice figure too.

There is no way on earth a 1.2 mk6/7 golf if worth the extra over it as it just isnt that much better of a car or should I say: what is better than the mk5 is certainly not worth the extra thousands of pounds VW will charge..

Just saying..


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## Teddy (Dec 15, 2007)

It's a sign than things have changed when you walk into a showroom and the purchase price isn't even shown on the windscreens...it just shows what you can have for each monthly payment. 
If you insist on a new car every 2 or 3 years these deals make sense but the car is never getting to the stage where it's earned its existance. The feeling of owning a car that's yours and not owing money on it is great.
It might not be as flash as a brand new car but it's an asset rather than a liability.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Surely though people don't walk straight in to dealership and pay the screen price, i walked in with my deposit they wanted £46 more than what i pay now per month, don't people go round different dealerships and barter?? 

Plain stupidity


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## Derekh929 (Aug 28, 2011)

Thanks Andy that was very helpfull


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Some lease (pcp) deals are far better than buying with your own money. Depends on the car etc. 

I posted a thread on here a while ago with an offer on a Corsa VXR (£167 a month inc VAT I think the deal was) where the option of buying with your own cash just would never ever make finacial sense.

The Abarth for nearly £400 a month is a right rip off. BMW were doing run off 3 series M-Sports Sport Edition (full leather etc.) for £250 (318i bit more for 320d) a month with 3 payments down for a 24 month period last year.

1 year ago you could get a VRS Octavia 2.0TFSi for £219 and 6 payments deposit with maintainence and tyres! - Buying with your own cash would be a No No if deals like this can be found.

Mercs are always good too, I think Merc sub them somewhat, usually e220cdi Estates come in at £229 (£275inc VAT) with 6 payments down and 10K mileage over 36 months. Now that is cheap motoring (especially if you do lowish miles) £11.5K over 3 years, that Merc will loose that easily over 3 years if purchased using your hard earned!

I've never purchased through PCP but our next one, I think i will choose carefully


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## james_19742000 (May 8, 2008)

I never used to take PCP deals, never believed in them etc etc, always took a bank loan or soemthing etc to fund my vehicles.

Bit about 3 years ago I popped into my local VW/Skoda dealer for a brochure and the guy that works in there is a friend, anyway, sat there and had a chat about future financing deals and he suggested a PCP, I immediately dismissed it, but then when he 'sold' it to me, it just makes perfect sense (for us) we always want a relatively new car, always like a nice spec, never keep a car longer than 3 years, ideally want to be able to predict my motoring costs as much as possible etc etc so once he explained it all, and said that I would get a deposit paid scheme, 3 years breakdown and servicing for free in the deal, and all I would be liable for would be tyres, consumables etc etc then it made perfect sense.

Initially I ordered a 2.0TSI/DSG Octavia VRS and got a good deal, kept that about 8 months and got fed up with the fuel costs as it was very thirsty, so popped in and had a chat with him about my options, no problem, swap to diesel, so ordered the exact same car, but with a couple more extras (!) and they paid the deposit, my car even after about 11 months (by the time the new car came through) had some equity in it, so that went in on top of the deposit paid scheme, so for about an extra £20 per month I got another new car, more toys, diesel economy and with a good chance of knowing my motoring costs wont change too much over the term of the deal, I love this car, so will in honesty probably go to about two and a half years and then look at my options before the first MOT is due, hopefully will get in another new car as the MOT is due, it should have some equity in it as the Skoda GMFV seems conservative, whether I stay within the VAG group or not I have no idea, see whats around then.

For me, it works, I have predictable stable motoring costs, no £500 repair bills, no MOT to worry about etc, its set for annual servicing so I get three services during the length of the agreement, which is in the interests of the dealer and me, I get lots of stamps in the book and they get a car back with FSH, they also know that my car will come back mint, it will be a case of just sticking the price in the window of the car, they always give me top book plus a bit more, as there is a relationship there with teh dealer.

Also, its about reliability, my wife has health issues, and I also have two young children when they are out in the car I have the peace of mind that they will get home in something that is relaible, comfortable, offers all the lovely features and safety of a modern car etc

We also have a run around car at home, and whilst its good to have a little run around, it does cost money to run, servicing, MOT, repairs etc so much so that an VW Up! can be had for about £79 per month I think on a PCP and thats seriously worth considering!

I agree, a PCP doesnt suit everyone, and everyone looks at cars in different ways but for us, its about having a modern relaible car, we always have some sort of finance to pay on a car and this keeps our costs down as much as possible (woth the obviosu exception of the PCP monthly payment) which means we can budget accordingly.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

^^^ how does the above work with mileage then? is 10k your limit?
Am I right in thinking free servicing and breakdown is a rare offer or not as I havent seen that very much?
Is the above deal honestly through the fact you know the dealer?
Genuine questions as it has always interested me but as I say I can never make it add up for me! What kind of deposit are we talking for this?


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

robertdon777 said:


> Some lease (pcp) deals are far better than buying with your own money. Depends on the car etc.
> 
> I posted a thread on here a while ago with an offer on a Corsa VXR (£167 a month inc VAT I think the deal was) where the option of buying with your own cash just would never ever make finacial sense.
> 
> ...


http://www.vauxhall.co.uk/offers-finance/cars_offers/new_corsa/flexible_finance0apr.html

vxr corsa deposit 4.5k
i can buy a beast of merc clk for that second hand and no monthly payments....


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Ill give you my sums too if you like:
£4400 deposit max i could put it.
27x £180
£9100 final 

From looking at prices of octavia vrs tdi at 3 year old with 30k on clock looking at £12-£13k dealer price and £11k trade.

So pay a total of erm...£18k...ish!! Including interest too.

Based on 10k a year.

Thats for a brand new skoda octavia vrs tdi. Then as said earlier free servicing and breakdown cover. I also got it for piece of mind and knowing i can afford the final payment.

Hope it helps your understanding.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

rob_vrs said:


> Ill give you my sums too if you like:
> £4400 deposit max i could put it.
> 27x £180
> £9100 final
> ...


hmm not much in it then once you factor doing more than 10k a year and running costs ie petrol for 3 years...


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

avit88 said:


> hmm not much in it then once you factor doing more than 10k a year and running costs ie petrol for 3 years...


Well obviously fuel but thats the same for all cars. Cheaper road tax generally with new cars and the thing that made me want a new car was that my 06 corsa needed a new steering rack 400-500 and a new exhaust, so i made the dive and bought the new car without having the worry of repair costs and as another person stable known costs.


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## Estoril-5 (Mar 8, 2007)

Kerr said:


> Have you considered just leasing the car?
> 
> I've seen some great lease deals.
> 
> ...


I've always said I wouldn't buy a brand new car due to the depreciation, the only way I'd get into one is if I had a company car etc.

But I'd ole to have a brand spanner at least once to experience it.

That 640d is good, it's a nice car, I've actually changed my mind, once I've paid off the mortgage, I might give it a go so at least I have experienced it.

Plus no hassle of it breaking down and you forking out the bill, no mot and it will be easier to blah a test drive in an m6 lol


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## Buck (Jan 16, 2008)

Good explanation from Andy. 

PCP can also be had on used cars. I got my one year old car on PCP then paid it off part way into the deal as I had some spare capital. 

Key for me is not the monthly payment alone but the cost over the ownership period taking into account (lower) running costs/repairs and the view of where you will be financially at the end of the PCP i.e.able to buy your next car / need another PCP to stay in a new car / pay this one off and keep it?


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

I have just bought two cars on PCP deals, they will both be paid off straight away though, I only went the PCP route because of the deals you get compared to HP or buying outright, I.e a deposit allowance of £2000 , 3 years servicing deal , free insurance , we also got a healthy discount on each car too.

It's a no brainer for me but I wouldn't like to do one and have to run the whole length of the agreement.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

avit88 said:


> http://www.vauxhall.co.uk/offers-finance/cars_offers/new_corsa/flexible_finance0apr.html
> 
> vxr corsa deposit 4.5k
> i can buy a beast of merc clk for that second hand and no monthly payments....


No No No, nver buy direct from the main dealer. Most of the deals are through agents such as on www.contracthireandleasing.com

The Corsa VXR deal was 3 payments down and £167 a month over 3 years and 10K miles. or £1500 down and £142 inc VAT over 2 years!

Thats £200 a month for a brand new Corsa VXR. Now I know if you purchased private the Corsa would loose more than £200 a month when you come to trade it in after 2 years otherwise it will keep 66% of it's retail value - that's never going to happen on any VX Corsa, or just about any other car.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Another example

New Golf (new shape): 
2.0 Tdi GT DSG Auto Leather, Metallic

£1300 down and then 24 x £227 inc VAT = £6748. That's cheap for such a car, my Nursery fees make that look like small change!

Now they retail at about £26K (with those options) so try financing that for £227 a month on a personal loan etc. - Never going to happen.

Plus surely it's better to keep your hard earned cash (a personal loan would be about £500 min) in an appreciating asset rather than a car that just looses value.

Depreciate = Rent
Appreciate = Buy

I'm going PCP next, never done it before but deffo going to give it a go.


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## White-r26 (Dec 14, 2010)

Find me a megane 250/265 deal


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## ron burgandy (Apr 18, 2007)

andy665 said:


> Totally depends on the original agreed mileage
> 
> Doing 20k instead of an agreed 10k will be far less of a problem than doing 50k instead of an agreed 25k


i budgeted for 15 000 miles after 3 years, but it will just be over 30 000 when i hand it back.

gmfv is £16 500 the thing is though i really lik the car and i might just buy it outright, but i dont know what our circumstances will be in 12 months so who knows.


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

Cash for me. I'd rather have it on the drive and paid for than have money going out on it every month. Or the chance of someone popping along to take it back because I couldn't afford a payment.
My view has always been, if I haven't got the cash I don't get anything.
Only exception is a mortgage, I don't know anyone with a spare £100k to buy a house with!


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

PugIain said:


> Cash for me. I'd rather have it on the drive and paid for than have money going out on it every month. Or the chance of someone popping along to take it back because I couldn't afford a payment.
> My view has always been, if I haven't got the cash I don't get anything.
> Only exception is a mortgage, I don't know anyone with a spare £100k to buy a house with!


You don't buy the car on finance if you cant afford the monthly payments. As iv said before its entirely what the individual wants, some don't want monthly payments, i don't mind them. I just rather not have all the hassle of MOT's, potential failures, i feel its a much nicer place to be in a new car when im driving and i like driving and my cars, i dont drink (lots) i dont smoke so why not, i manage to have 2 nice holidays every year all paid for.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

robertdon777 said:


> Another example
> 
> New Golf (new shape):
> 2.0 Tdi GT DSG Auto Leather, Metallic
> ...


Whilst I agree that is a cheap way to get a brand new GOlf and the depriciation and lease cost's will be similar the problem i have is that you pay £6700 and own nothing, where as pay £7000 for a car and then in 2 years it will be worth £4000 you physically have something to show for your money. I'm not against PCP's far from it, its just for me it would limit me, i'd want to change things on the car taking it away from standard which could lead to complications down the line. We also have 2 cars and having them both on PCP's would mean £600 per month going out on 2 cars for the rest of our life


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

White-r26 said:


> Find me a megane 250/265 deal


you won't find a cheap deal because its not really a car that works well on PCP. I bet if you find one it will be expensive.


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

rob_vrs said:


> You don't buy the car on finance if you cant afford the monthly payments.


No?
I bet there are plenty of people who do, I know of at least one website who sell re possessed cars reclaimed by finance companies. Same as people who buy bloody TVs on finance, just why.

I digress, each to his own, finance, or whatever you want to call it is something I'd rather not get involved in :thumb:
I'd rather buy a few year old car with cash, run it for a few years and then sell it on.
Next move I think, is keep the 407 a couple more years then a 4/5 year old 508


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Thats the own individual stupidity, it seems to be that people don't seem to trust there self been able to budget money and afford monthly payments.

If you take my dads deal. He had the cash in the bank to buy a car earning 3.5% interest.

He put maximum deposit in on his car and took a pcp deal that was 0% interest over 3 years. So why would he pay cash for the car when he can pay monthly and earn the interest on the money in the bank. With the ability to hand the car back with no questions asked half way through the term.


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

rob_vrs said:


> Thats the own individual stupidity, it seems to be that people don't seem to trust there self been able to budget money and afford monthly payments.
> 
> If you take my dads deal. He had the cash in the bank to buy a car earning 3.5% interest.
> 
> He put maximum deposit in on his car and took a pcp deal that was 0% interest over 3 years. So why would he pay cash for the car when he can pay monthly and earn the interest on the money in the bank. With the ability to hand the car back with no questions asked half way through the term.


interest in a bank haha whats that these days?!?!


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

avit88 said:


> interest in a bank haha whats that these days?!?!


As i said 3.5%


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## avit88 (Mar 19, 2012)

rob_vrs said:


> As i said 3.5%


thats peanuts, but good for todays market.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

On 20k it would do me nicely, so thats where pcp comes in with 0% may aswell leave dosh in bank and earn interest on it


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

rob_vrs said:


> Thats the own individual stupidity, it seems to be that people don't seem to trust there self been able to budget money and afford monthly payments.
> 
> If you take my dads deal. He had the cash in the bank to buy a car earning 3.5% interest.
> 
> He put maximum deposit in on his car and took a pcp deal that was 0% interest over 3 years. So why would he pay cash for the car when he can pay monthly and earn the interest on the money in the bank. With the ability to hand the car back with no questions asked half way through the term.


Actually, sometimes, circumstances change. But yeah, pcp can actually make more financial sense sometimes than buying outright.


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

PugIain said:


> No?
> I bet there are plenty of people who do, I know of at least one website who sell re possessed cars reclaimed by finance companies. Same as people who buy bloody TVs on finance, just why.
> 
> I digress, each to his own, finance, or whatever you want to call it is something I'd rather not get involved in :thumb:
> ...


A 4-5 year old pug? Is there any part which isn't rust?


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

RisingPower said:


> A 4-5 year old pug? Is there any part which isn't rust?


ssh you great chimp


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

SteveTDCi said:


> Whilst I agree that is a cheap way to get a brand new GOlf and the depriciation and lease cost's will be similar the problem i have is that you pay £6700 and own nothing, where as pay £7000 for a car and then in 2 years it will be worth £4000 you physically have something to show for your money. I'm not against PCP's far from it, its just for me it would limit me, i'd want to change things on the car taking it away from standard which could lead to complications down the line. We also have 2 cars and having them both on PCP's would mean £600 per month going out on 2 cars for the rest of our life


I agree fully and that's how I've always done it, but I never see my asset because it goes down on my deposit for my next second hand car. I never seem to be better off running my second hand cars so I'm going to go pcp and have a new car for much the same as I'd spend on a second hand one.

I


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

White-r26 said:


> Find me a megane 250/265 deal


I'm looking at the new Clio RS, I know not everyones cup of tea because of the non 3dr and lack of sweet revving N/A engine but the new one fits my checklist perfect:Smallish 5dr 200bhp Petrol Auto.

It may not sit well with the RS enthusiast but it certainly tempting me away from something like a Focus ST, Golf GTi purely because of price and Renaults ability to produce the best Hot Hatches.

Just hoping there are some good sub £250 a month deals like the Corsa VXR one but I doubt it very much.

But then again a nice e90 07/57 plate Touring M-Sport 335i would be about the same on a personal loan mmmmmmm.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

robertdon777 said:


> I'm looking at the new Clio RS, I know not everyones cup of tea because of the non 3dr and lack of sweet revving N/A engine but the new one fits my checklist perfect:Smallish 5dr 200bhp Petrol Auto.
> 
> It may not sit well with the RS enthusiast but it certainly tempting me away from something like a Focus ST, Golf GTi purely because of price and Renaults ability to produce the best Hot Hatches.
> 
> ...


Dont want to teach you to suck eggs, but pick 3 dealers (different companies) go in to the first one where you want to buy the car from and get a price then go to the other 2 and ask them to beat the cheapest price you have. Go back to the dealer you got your first price and say i have this price if you can "BEAT" it ill order the car now. Maybe try get service plan chucked it too


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

rob_vrs said:


> Dont want to teach you to suck eggs, but pick 3 dealers (different companies) go in to the first one where you want to buy the car from and get a price then go to the other 2 and ask them to beat the cheapest price you have. Go back to the dealer you got your first price and say i have this price if you can "BEAT" it ill order the car now. Maybe try get service plan chucked it too


I know me though, I'll end up with the second hand BMW Touring!

I've been looking at PCP's for the last 8 years!


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## Byron (Jan 31, 2009)

My last PCP deal was on a new Clio 197 Cup back in 2008. 12 months, 10k total miles (did 3k!), 1 month deposit and £80 a month. 

Strong manufacturer discount, great residual values (desirable come resale), plus a low interest rate and profit margin worked in my favour.


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## White-r26 (Dec 14, 2010)

Byron said:


> My last PCP deal was on a new Clio 197 Cup back in 2008. 12 months, 10k total miles (did 3k!), 1 month deposit and £80 a month.
> 
> Strong manufacturer discount, great residual values (desirable come resale), plus a low interest rate and profit margin worked in my favour.


£80 a month??


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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

I've never been a fan of PCP deals as I want to own something after I'd paid for it for 2-3 years. 

Ok, so my Megane took me four years to pay off but I paid off every penny and still own it nearly 7 years later. When it came to my Twingo Gordini, I put down a decent deposit, pay £300 a month which was what I am comfortable with paying and in 9 months time will own that outright as well. 

I've always seen PCP deals as a way of leasing a car that you're not in a financial position to actually buy. Yeah so you can keep paying monthly but when such a time comes that you don't want to or can't afford to keep paying monthly, you're a bit stuck.

The only time I've considered these deals is if me and the other half buy a car together. I am happy to effectively lease a car for 3 years at a cost of £100-150 a month if we're going halves on it (as in £300 in total) for the sake of her having a safe, modern, family car but only because I have my own cars that I already own.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Alex_225 said:


> I've never been a fan of PCP deals as I want to own something after I'd paid for it for 2-3 years.
> 
> Ok, so my Megane took me four years to pay off but I paid off every penny and still own it nearly 7 years later. When it came to my Twingo Gordini, I put down a decent deposit, pay £300 a month which was what I am comfortable with paying and in 9 months time will own that outright as well.
> 
> ...


PCP is the exact same as taking a loan out or finance just juggling numbers around differently, you can still own the car at the end :s. People have some strange thoughts.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

rob_vrs said:


> PCP is the exact same as taking a loan out or finance just juggling numbers around differently, you can still own the car at the end :s. People have some strange thoughts.


Absolutely 100% correct - PCP is 100% Hire Purchase with a different payment profile and some additional safeguards.

Hypothetically - you buy a car today and use HP. Something happens to the world economy that means that your car becomes worth far less than would normally be the case - who is liable for that larger than expected loss - YOU

Same car bought on PCP, same situation arises - who takes the financial loss - the finance company


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

225, I see what you're saying but you've just paid a fortune for something thats now worth not a lot, not being personal I'm talking about buying any car outright. I've purchased my last 12 cars the same as you and all been paid for and owned outright but I've never come away at the end of paying for them with cash. If I sold them I'd have cash but no car!.

I can see the benefit of buying yourself if you plan on keeping a car long term, like you and your 225 and me and my 205 (17 years) . As a daily tool though I think some of the pcp deals are hard to ignore. 

Last year a Passat cc (run out model) could be had for £199 inc VAT with 6 down on 24 month 10k. I can't see how even a second hand one would cost much less even including depreciation over the same term. These deals are quite regular too as models are on 4 year life cycles with 2 year facelifts quite common with Mercedes-Benz, Audi and BMW etc.


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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

rob_vrs said:


> PCP is the exact same as taking a loan out or finance just juggling numbers around differently, you can still own the car at the end :s. People have some strange thoughts.


Ok so you do own it, provided you pay the balloon payment at the end.

So you pay for a car for 3-4 years then at the end of paying say £200-300 per month you then owe then have to pay for the rest of the car. Unless I'm confused I thought the point of PCP is that you get it cheaper per month because at the end you then pay the rest in a lump sum.

Or you hand the car back and you're quits and debt free.

Where as I'd rather opt for a cheaper car (hence the 133 Twingo rather than Megane 250) and then after 3 years own a £6-7k car. Yeah I've paid the depreciation, that's what you get with any new car.



robertdon777 said:


> 225, I see what you're saying but you've just paid a fortune for something thats now worth not a lot, not being personal I'm talking about buying any car outright. I've purchased my last 12 cars the same as you and all been paid for and owned outright but I've never come away at the end of paying for them with cash. If I sold them I'd have cash but no car!.
> 
> I can see the benefit of buying yourself if you plan on keeping a car long term, like you and your 225 and me and my 205 (17 years) . As a daily tool though I think some of the pcp deals are hard to ignore.


Don't get me wrong, I do agree that for a daily runner that you'll gladly chop in, in a few years PCP is a good tool. Hence my comment about going halves with my other half on a car if it's cheap enough so we've got a brand new car, under warranty that is cheap every month.

Thing is though as my comment about my Twingo, should I choose too after 3 years I'll own it outright and it'll be worth in the region of £6-7k. I'm then in a position to sell up and either put it down on another car £15k loan with £7k on top for example or keep it.

I know it's a different way of balancing up the figures to an extent but if I've owned a car for 3 years and loved it, I would then need to start paying again for the balloon payment. I don't much fancy that personally that's all it is.

Also for someone who has a second car, maybe a project but wants a modern reliable car I can see some sense in it. It's just I've seen people use PCP to buy a car well beyond their means then get stitched at the end with a balloon payment they've got no hope of paying. Mate got a company car allowance, so used that plus his own money to buy a £30k Saab convertible at 20 years old, balloon payment came up at something like £18k so he handed it back after paying God knows how much. Just puts me right off.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

The balloon payment just been whats left after the monthly payments and deposit. Just the same as what you'd pay after interest with a loan or finance. PCP you just get more flexibility.


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## Derekh929 (Aug 28, 2011)

There is another option lease purchase I have always got the best rate on this and bear in mind I got £6250 disc on current car dec 2006 and that was BMW 330d m sport big discount to let dealer get year end figure so good time to buy or month end


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

White-r26 said:


> £80 a month??


Not quite a 197 but how about a cheap runaround. Doing less than 5K a year?

£1K down and *£52*:doublesho a month! (+VAT) over 24 months

Skoda Citigo (a rebadged VW UP)

OR

Treat yourself for Christmas: (personal lease so don't add VAT!)
*
Merc C Class Diesel Coupe C250 CDI AMG Sport*

£1700 down, £285 a month over 23 months 10K a year, inc Road Tax and Breakdown.

So that's a £34K Merc for £8255 over 2 years.

Now do you reckon you would be able to trade in the same Merc private or sell private for £25,745 after 2 years. If you can you would be better off buying private, but I reckon a trade in would be about £22K and private sale a maximum of £24K.

Just looking on Autotrader you'd be lucky to get 24K for a 1 year old one! Jesus you'd be mental to buy one with your own cash, you'd loose well over 10K in the first year!


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Derekh929 said:


> There is another option lease purchase I have always got the best rate on this and bear in mind I got £6250 disc on current car dec 2006 and that was BMW 330d m sport big discount to let dealer get year end figure so good time to buy or month end


But lease purchase gives you zero flexibility at the end and zero protection in terms the final payment - if the car ain't worth the final payment then tough - you have no option to walk away

PCP has been used very badly by manufacturers since day one in the UK - its been marketed as the way to get into a car for the lowest possible monthly payment - this is often achieved by ramping up the GMFV to a point where there will be little or no equity at the end - for some people this may be fine but for many others its not.

IMHO most people are looking for a balance between deposit / monthly payment payment and end of agreement equity - most manufacturers go for high deposit / high GMFV and low monthly payment - this is totally the opposite of what I used to advise - I was interested in two things:

1. Getting the customer a deal they were happy with today and affordable

2. A deal that would enable me to most easily get the customer out of their car and into a new one towards the end of their agreemen

If a customer of mine said that ownership was important I would generally advise against PCP

If PCP was right, the deal I would recommend would be based on what the customer wanted and I would structure accordingly - very few Business Managers do this

Whilst there is no such thing as a deal thats right for everyone, generally speaking the best starting point is:

Small deposit - max 10% - sensible monthly payment - GMFV that is set at a level that will leave the customer an amount of equity roughly equal to the deposit they originally put in

EVERY PCP scheme has the flexibility to be tailored to the customers needs - its a pity that a proper discussion rarely takes place - this is where customers are let down

There is also a lot of confusion between personal lease and PCP - they are quite different products and suit different kinds of customers


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Byron said:


> My last PCP deal was on a new Clio 197 Cup back in 2008. 12 months, 10k total miles (did 3k!), 1 month deposit and £80 a month.
> 
> Strong manufacturer discount, great residual values (desirable come resale), plus a low interest rate and profit margin worked in my favour.


I find it very hard to believe that you paid a total of £1040 (£80 deposit + 12x £80) to fund a new 197 for a 12 month period - just does not add up?????


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## Derekh929 (Aug 28, 2011)

I just pay the balance and keep the car


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

rob_vrs said:


> The balloon payment just been whats left after the monthly payments and deposit. Just the same as what you'd pay after interest with a loan or finance. PCP you just get more flexibility.


I'm not sure that is entirely true, but money wise it is more flexible.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

For you RisingPower!

C CLASS AMG COUPE *C63* 2dr Auto

6 payments deposit + 23 of £530 +VAT

10K mileage

or C CLASS AMG *ESTATE C63* 5dr Auto

6 payments deposit + 23 of £444 +VAT

10k mileage


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

robertdon777 said:


> For you RisingPower!
> 
> C CLASS AMG COUPE *C63* 2dr Auto
> 
> ...


Now that IS renting and something that is very restrictive - good value but zero flexibility


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

andy665 said:


> I find it very hard to believe that you paid a total of £1040 (£80 deposit + 12x £80) to fund a new 197 for a 12 month period - just does not add up?????


I once had one through my Business many moons ago: Brand New (1998) Pug 306 1.4 XL with Metallic whooooo. for £99 a month, No deposit over 12 months!

I couldn't refuse it and it was a better car than the new e36 that followed it which was treble the price.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

andy665 said:


> Now that IS renting and something that is very restrictive - good value but zero flexibility


Restrictive is the right word. 6.2L V8 with 451bhp and a 70mph speed limit


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

I'm sorry but there are some ejits posting in this thread. Depending on what the individual wants and the individual circumstances then you choose what's right for you... buy an old car cash, traditional HP or PCP HP. There's no right and wrong.

I bought a new A3 on a PCP in 2009 over 4 years and it ends in January. I've paid £17520 in 4 years. The car would have cost me £24000 to buy outright. There's £7700 final payment due. Total cost is £25200. The car is worth at least £8000. So that brings it down to £24900 for a car that would have cost me £24000 4 years ago. I've not had to save £24000 before buying the car OR I've had £24000 sitting in my bank account making interest. I've also had the benefit of being able to hand the car back if the value didn't hold up. IMO I would have been mental to stump up £24000 cash to buy that car. PCP worked best for me and my individual circumstances at the time.

Shortly after buying the Audi I bought the wife an IS200 paying £1500 cash and handing over our old Corsa. It's cost us £1500 to keep running and costs a fortune in fuel but it's got leather, heated and automatic everythings. We couldn't have afforded to buy or lease another car on top of the Audi. Buying an old car worked best for me and my individual circumstances at the time.

If you want to own something after paying for it for 3 years then buy something cheaper and not as good or save up enough to pay the final payment when it's due as well as the monthly payment.

As has been said there are some phenomenal deals to be had if you're flexible about make/model/spec/colour etc that would make it crazy to buy cash or second hand.

It doesn't take long to scribble the sums on the back of a notepad to work out what's the best deal at the time.


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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

rob_vrs said:


> The balloon payment just been whats left after the monthly payments and deposit. Just the same as what you'd pay after interest with a loan or finance. PCP you just get more flexibility.


Although I guess my lack of enthusiasm is that I'm paying 0% interest on the finance on my Gordini.



Nanoman said:


> ... or save up enough to pay the final payment when it's due as well as the monthly payment.


As much as I do totally agree, I mean if you save up so you've got the balloon payment ready then you get to keep the car and had the benefit of cheaper monthly finance. But if you're saving the money up anyway why not just put that towards paying a higher monthly amount and do normal HP?

Having seen people I know use this type of finance, I usually get the impression the idea is more to be able to get a better car than they could afford to pay off conventionally and then deal with the balloon payment at the end. The lure of a new car and cheaper monthly payments being enough to make many people forget that at the end they either give the car back or pay what the car is worth at that moment in time.

I'm not saying that's everyone and I don't doubt people reading this are by no means ignorant to it. I'm not out to cause offence or be an 'edjit'!!

It's not a handy tool for certain circumstances such as the one I mentioned whereby me and my other half may consider it for the convenience of having a new car and it costing us very little.

For me personally, I just hate the idea of PCP contract after PCP contract that after 10 years you come out and still don't have anything to put down.

My friends brother does just that, always pulling up in a new BMW of some kind yet he's paying the minimal monthly payments and never ever owns it.

I think maybe I'm just old skool that I like to have something in my posession after seeing a lot of my money go towards it. I'm just prepared to go for the car I can easily afford to buy which I don't think the average person on the street who sees the easy option of a new car does. :thumb:


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Whats it really matter if you own the car or not?

If you want to pay monthly and rather have a new car to run about in with less reliability cost issues and more efficiency then go do that.

If you would rather pay cash and cant afford to buy a new car cash then go buy an old car. 

I know that id much rather drove around in my car and pay what i pay for it, knowing ill own it at then end of my term with out the worry of needing an MOT, will it pass, oh my car needs a service another cost to go out. 

Thats my opinion other people would rather drive an old car say they own it and thats fair enough carry on.


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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

rob_vrs said:


> Whats it really matter if you own the car or not?
> 
> Thats my opinion other people would rather drive an old car say they own it and thats fair enough carry on.


To me it does matter about owning the car, I can then say it's actually mine! Then have the option to choose to use their value on another car I'm then pleased to have X amount to put down.

I've bought three cars brand new and I still own two of them. Yeah one of them is 7 years old now, the other will be 3 years old when I own it outright (next August) and I'll be proud to be able to say I own both of them outright from new. Not for the sake of what they're worth but because I've worked hard to have them parked on my drive and no one can take them off me.

That's is purely my preference. In terms of PCP, if I wanted to push myself, I'd whack a deposit down on a £35k motor but it just doesn't appeal to me personally to pay off only the depreciation then have £10k still owing after four years.

As you say it's totally down to the individual.


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## rob_vrs (Jan 4, 2012)

Alex_225 said:


> To me it does matter about owning the car, I can then say it's actually mine! Then have the option to choose to use their value on another car I'm then pleased to have X amount to put down.
> 
> I've bought three cars brand new and I still own two of them. Yeah one of them is 7 years old now, the other will be 3 years old when I own it outright (next August) and I'll be proud to be able to say I own both of them outright from new. Not for the sake of what they're worth but because I've worked hard to have them parked on my drive and no one can take them off me.
> 
> ...


It is indeed, and in my case being an apprentice at the start if my term of 28months, i put max deposit in, pay the monthly payments then as my wages go up and i work nights and weekends pop the extra money to one side which goes towards my final payment. Which normal finance wouldn't of enabled me to do and my old car (being an 5 year old 06 plate corsa) needed a £1000 spending on it, so seemed wise to get a new car with all its benefits.


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## Bod42 (Jun 4, 2009)

I always said to people if you like to change your car a lot, e.g. every 1,2 or 3 years then you should PCP or lease as normally your finacially better off and take risk out of the equation. If you keep your cars longer then get a personal loan, etc.

The mercedes examples above, Im sure if you owned those cars for 10+ yrs then things would even but as they have stated you wouldnt get the 25k back, you would probably get max 24k back and thats through a private sale.

There are some stupidly good deals out there if you get the timing right.

Robertdon: Out of interest where did you see that Skoda Citigo deal


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

> As much as I do totally agree, I mean if you save up so you've got the balloon payment ready then you get to keep the car and had the benefit of cheaper monthly finance. But if you're saving the money up anyway why not just put that towards paying a higher monthly amount and do normal HP?


Because it's often cheaper to PCP it then put it on trad HP. It's just the way manufacturers do it.

Like I said... do the sums and work out what is best for you at the time..

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Bod42 said:


> I always said to people if you like to change your car a lot, e.g. every 1,2 or 3 years then you should PCP or lease as normally your finacially better off and take risk out of the equation. If you keep your cars longer then get a personal loan, etc.
> 
> The mercedes examples above, Im sure if you owned those cars for 10+ yrs then things would even but as they have stated you wouldnt get the 25k back, you would probably get max 24k back and thats through a private sale.
> 
> ...


On Contracthireandleasing.com through a Skoda Dealer (simpsons - Preston), one of the main banners. It's cheaper than a Bus Pass!

or £55 a month for a Seat Mii through Bristol Street Motors.


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## Bristle Hound (May 31, 2009)

Very very interesting reading here :thumb:

Main point I can take from all the advice is ... DO YOUR HOMEWORK!

Might not be so quick to write PCP off in the future

Maybe we should have a 'PCP Best Deals' thread ...


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## james_19742000 (May 8, 2008)

avit88 said:


> ^^^ how does the above work with mileage then? is 10k your limit?
> Am I right in thinking free servicing and breakdown is a rare offer or not as I havent seen that very much?
> Is the above deal honestly through the fact you know the dealer?
> Genuine questions as it has always interested me but as I say I can never make it add up for me! What kind of deposit are we talking for this?


With a Skoda you get 3 years breaksown anyway (well it is a Skoda), the 3 years servicing and the deposit allowance was conditional on taking Skoda finance.

I dont believe the deal was exclusive as I knew the dealer, but my trade in value was probably better because of that, also being a long standing customer probably helps as well, I dont believe that I get all I want, but once the deal was completed I then proceeded to pick up the accesories brochure and just picked out everything I wanted and they were like 'ok whatever, just list ot down and we will sort it' then a few weeks later they said bloody hell wish we had chjecked what you wanted as you picked all the high value items didnt you!

Its all horses for courses, they still made money, I was happy, everyones a winner.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Bristle Hound said:


> Maybe we should have a 'PCP Best Deals' thread ...


That's a good idea, but a very bad one for my bank balance.


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## Bristle Hound (May 31, 2009)

robertdon777 said:


> That's a good idea, but a very bad one for my bank balance.


http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=3863392#post3863392

:doublesho Have a feeling this is going to cost me ... :lol:


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