# Chemical Guys E-Zyme Paste Wax



## Grizzle (Jul 12, 2006)

Got a sneak peek of it today, WOW its smells awesome looks brilliant the packaging looks very classy also.


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## Detail My Ride (Apr 19, 2006)

That is rather funky. Is it any good though? :lol:


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## Sam08ST (Oct 27, 2007)

Looks cool, reminds me of a pot of hair wax


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## ads2k (Jul 12, 2006)

Gaz W said:


> That is rather funky. Is it any good though? :lol:


Also whats the price going to be ,are we talking a cheapsub £20 or a more wallet lightening +£100

Does anyone know


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

More like £180 I'd imagine...


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Mmmmmmmmmm..................NICE! 

Alan W


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

I'm waiting for the postman on Monday then


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## brianfocus (Jun 25, 2008)

Here in Holland it's about €200/€225, but just a few available...


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Interesting, yet another into a crowded market - but does it offer anything extra to compete with the established??


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Dave KG said:


> Interesting, yet another into a crowded market - but does it offer anything extra to compete with the established??


That's what we like to see Dave an open mind for new products :lol:

Sorry couldn't resist:lol:


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Epoch said:


> That's what we like to see Dave an open mind for new products :lol:
> 
> Sorry couldn't resist:lol:


My mind is always open - the market however is crowded and to stake a place in it as a newcomer (as with all products across the board) it has to offer something to make someone want to part with the cash over something already there... Dodo Juice for example achieve this by quirky products and a fun product range, I'll be keen to see how this wax attempts to establish itself on both a marketing and performance front


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

I got shot down on detailingbliss when asking for more info about the 'enzyme' factor.

This could be an interesting point of difference for the wax, and may give a curing or performance advantage if it is scientifically backed up (rather than just another myth in the marketing dept toolkit... I am more cynical than most being a practitioner of the black arts myself!). I would love to see some substantive marketing from CG re the enzymes but couldn't find a lot of deep and meaningful info in the current info for it. But that doesn't mean it doesn't exist... just that I couldn't find it. I'd like to find out more. Maybe Dave knows?

Even Zedmol is derived from Zyme and Ol as a name, and they used to whitter on about propolis (a natural resin created by bees for use in their hives and therefore found in beeswax etc) as being a natural enzyme from memory. Enzymes are basically natural catalysts, so there is a possibility they can do something. If it is has a real benefit I think we'd all like to know and fair play to CG for concentrating their development in that area if it does.

I wrote an email to CG from a hotmail account and heard nothing back re explaining the enzyme question though (been two weeks now). Maybe they twigged it was me. I also think the whole 'natural' thing is always in danger of being overstated in the marketplace, not least because many of the natural products get heavily refined before being used by the wax manufacturers.

It looks like a nice product and maybe something like pure orange oil gives it that nice amber glow, but that is just guesswork. I'm sure it's a cracking wax as CG do some nice stuff and this is very expensive for the brand


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

As ever on these topics Dom, you make a very good balanced set or arguments about the product in question with good testing questions into the marketing being used... most notably for this wax it is the enzymes which as you rightly say are catalysts so maybe the change the stae of the wax as you suggest during the curing process to enhance the curing and thus performance... I have my doubts as I've yet to see a convincing scientific argument for this, but then Zoomol have been marketing this blurb for years... be interesting if anyone can shed some real light on this topic to give some sound insight as you say 

The other excellent point you make is the expense of this product - if it is >£100, it throws itself into a market with BoS, ***** Concours in price range and from a status point of view its onto an instant looser as the Chemical Guys name holds little cache in this market being a manufacturer of good value for money products. For those of us who dont give a monkey's about brand name, there is the performance aspect to consider but then it finds itself up against every wax on the market and thus Collinite to beat for durability and, well, take you pick to beat on looks  ... So it needs a little something, IMHO, to make it "special" to make user's without the interest in buying wax for the sake of it purchase it (I probably will, just cause I like wax :lol. Going so far away from what I see Chemical Guys as being, I wonder how many of the CG faithful will part with the cash for it when 50/50 can be had for under 30 quid...

Time will tell - what cannot be denied is that its a funky colour!


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

Well, it may be an interesting route to go down, this enzymes route.

But the ones that stir my interest as a wax manufacturer are the clever crosslinking sealant ingredients and even some of those nano thingummies. I may be barking up the wrong tree looking at these synthetic ingredients to raise the game rather than natural enzymes... but we shall see.

It is certainly a funny price point; at half the price it would still be double Pete's 53 and be well into our Supernatural territory. The packaging is nice but not overly costly so maybe those enzymes are damn pricey.


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## mattyb95 (Apr 21, 2008)

If you look under the Chemical Guys logo it says professional, not something I've seen before but could well be wrong so perhaps they are looking to bring out a few more boutique products so to speak.


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

mattyb95 said:


> If you look under the Chemical Guys logo it says professional, not something I've seen before but could well be wrong so perhaps they are looking to bring out a few more boutique products so to speak.


I think you're right, similar to the way that AG will be expanding their 'High Definition' range, I assume this would be the start of a new premium range.


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Not withstanding all of the above (which is way over my head! :lol CG state:

"Due to naturally derived seasonal oils and enzymes, *E-zyme will only be produced mid-year in small runs*. Due to rare ingredients, *availability may be limited."*

A limited edition product will always be seen by some as worth paying extra for the cache of owing and using it.

I must admit to being pretty tempted by this myself but only if it offers something extra and the performance and durability justify the cost.

Bring on the trials Dave! 

Alan W


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

Seasonal oils and enzymes... hmmm... I'd love to know why these ingredients are only available mid-year etc. I'm sure CG will get around to elaborating on that one day.


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Just like to point out that the colour is very similar to Juiced.


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Alan W said:


> Not withstanding all of the above (which is way over my head! :lol CG state:
> 
> "Due to naturally derived seasonal oils and enzymes, *E-zyme will only be produced mid-year in small runs*. Due to rare ingredients, *availability may be limited."*
> 
> ...


CG 50/50 Concours wax was also supposed to be limited. Funny how they can make it in sufficient quantities to satisy the world market.


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## jasonbarnes (Sep 10, 2008)

looks good, will wait for a review on someone else who invests before i will be when they release it


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## david g (Dec 14, 2005)

Well this wax looks to have caused a fair bit of interest .Until i get the chance to actually use it then my opinions on it are very limited .

CG dont believe in fun or quirky products ,they believe in good performing products that represent good value for money.Whilst marketing of products is important CG spend far more money on product development as its an ever changing marketplace that we detail within.

CG understand that other competitors and other manufacturers may feel threatened by the launch of new products but divulging ingredients and recipes is something they are not keen on doing.Its a bit like Nestle going to Cadburys and asking for the ingredients of their latest product launch.

Again until i get the chance to test this im limited in what i can say ,one thing i will comment on is its scent.Most waxes that i have used in the past have scents that are similar to certain items ,i.e xxx has a scent thats similar to banannas ,this new wax isnt similar in scent its identical to citrus .

Im hoping to get a chance to experiment with this wax on a dark coloured sometime this week


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## Bigpikle (May 21, 2007)

Dodo Factory said:


> Seasonal oils and enzymes... hmmm... I'd love to know why these ingredients are only available mid-year etc. I'm sure CG will get around to elaborating on that one day.


the bees have very limited production capacity so are only selling to CG during the previous holiday shutdown period in the first 2 weeks of the summer. Its only happening as a result of a 2 poor summers recently and the bees have been suffering a little with cashflow issues as a result


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Bigpikle said:


> the bees have very limited production capacity so are only selling to CG during the previous holiday shutdown period in the first 2 weeks of the summer. Its only happening as a result of a 2 poor summers recently and the bees have been suffering a little with cashflow issues as a result


PMSL!! :lol::lol::lol:


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

david g said:


> CG dont believe in fun or quirky products ,they believe in good performing products that represent good value for money.Whilst marketing of products is important CG spend far more money on product development as its an ever changing marketplace that we detail within.


I'm probably qualified to ask a few pertinent questions, so please take these the right way Dave as you know we get on pretty well (and I want to keep things that way) 

OK, I absolutely agree with you re CG's products (which is why I have some myself). But will the new Natura wax offer good value for money? 50/50 certainly does. Will Natura offer a performance advantage to justify the extra cost. As someone who sources wax packaging I can promise you that the packaging doesn't justify all of that additional increase in cost.

And do you know how much CG money spends on product development or is it just an educated guess? Do they buy some products in from a bulk manufacturer for example, and relabel them? Or do they make all their waxes, polishes and shampoos in-house? It's a fair question if you make a statement like that.



david g said:


> CG understand that other competitors and other manufacturers may feel threatened by the launch of new products but divulging ingredients and recipes is something they are not keen on doing.Its a bit like Nestle going to Cadburys and asking for the ingredients of their latest product launch.


Well, for a start, we don't feel threatened (we know where we want to be and what we have to do and CG isn't really on the radar). Natura's not a direct competitor to Supernatural, probably because of the price. Although it is interesting how Natura is found within the name of our product so maybe we helped with some inspiration  To be honest, I think Ben's Rubbishboy wax and the interest in homemade natural waxes may also have added momentum as well.

As for the divulging ingredients chestnut, it's as old as the hills  Food and confectionery manufacturers have to list what is in their products by law, although amounts and suppliers are kept private. Fat and sugar content are also disclosed according to certain guidelines and thank the Lord carnauba contents aren't treated in the same way in the world of paste waxes, LOL.

The simple fact is that the way you make a wax tends to be more important than what you put in it, although you are right regarding some of the specific magic ingredients. However, there is a fine line between protecting your interests as a wax manufacturer and protecting the consumer's interests. And it is interesting what an IR spectrometer can reveal about chemical content of a competitor's wax anyway.

The only reason I posted on the thread is because the 'enzyme' angle needs some form of context. Enzymes themselves are not a guarantee of additional performance - they need to catalyse _something_. Whether that is curing, bonding or whatever. They also tend to need oxygen or whatever to be able to work as they should. With a little consumer info, people may have a better understanding of WHY the wax is better and how they could use it properly. Instead, they are just TOLD it is better with little explanation.

This industry needs more transparency, not another buzz word. If enzymes work well, CG should shout it from the rooftops because it will be months or years before competitors could catch up. But the industry has known about propolis for years thanks to Zedmol (of course it may not even be propolis) and in any case, the science seems to be heading towards synthetic sealant technology and even nano-crystalline products. Enzymes are almost a forgotten chapter in wax manufacture, so it is interesting why they get introduced now. CG still haven't answered my email, so I'm none the wiser. Maybe CG consumers will ask the question.

The sad thing about this 'hiding' of ingredients is that if Natura was an unbridled success (and I'm sure it's a great wax, enzymes or not) rival manufacturers could just add a small amount of enzyme ingredient into a wax and bring out their own version. Whether the enzyme does anything or not. It can easily happen in a less-regulated industry where products aren't independently checked or analysed. So it wouldn't matter whether CG revealed what its enzyme was anyway. We'd just add 1 per cent propolis to Supernatural and call it Supernatural-E or something.



david g said:


> Again until i get the chance to test this im limited in what i can say ,one thing i will comment on is its scent.Most waxes that i have used in the past have scents that are similar to certain items ,i.e xxx has a scent thats similar to banannas ,this new wax isnt similar in scent its identical to citrus .


Sounds like limonene - Ben's Rubbishboy wax has a wonderful smell of fresh oranges because of the orange oil content and it is a nice natural solvent with a wonderful smell. However that is just conjecture. Pure orange oil is expensive and although I discovered no advantage over modern solvents (apart from the smell) it is an interesting and deserving ingredient 

I hope you don't see these comments as being too gladiatorial. They are made in the spirit of open, frank and fair discussion - as forums should be here for. I am a CG customer myself, as well as a competitor. But I only ever started making waxes due to carnauba contents being mismarketed and maybe I have a semi-religious zeal to question, interrogate and analyse the way products in the car care market are presented. All my questions are hopefully seen to be fair... I just ask for more information, justification or substantiation where I can see none myself. It may exist elsewhere. And CG always have every legal right to ignore me and tell me to feck off 

All the best
Dom


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## ads2k (Jul 12, 2006)

^^^ very far and frank post Dom


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## Guest (Oct 19, 2008)

Very fair approach by Dom (and Dodo)

:thumb:


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## rubbishboy (May 6, 2006)

I did a little research into propolis last year. I didn't get as far as trying it in a wax, but what I learnt was that the propolis itself is a resin that would appear to have some quite carnauba like properties. It gets used by wood workers and in specialist varnishes, one of it's characteristics in these cases is increased durability of the product.

Something else I learnt was that it's quite difficult to extract a consistent batch of propolis, because it's actual make up varies by hive, region and season. It's possible the bees may not have collected one of the essential tree saps or pollens that makes the final propoplis do what you need.

It's also pretty expensive, 100g was going to cost about £60 IIRC, compare that to carnauba at about £17 for 1Kg.


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

But does it do 'owt?

Is it an enzyme?

And is it in CG Natura?

The world wants answers  Looks like further research required


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## blake_jl (Apr 26, 2008)

If propolis was some magic ingredient, do you really think Z would advertise it as an ingredient like they do?

Just the same as it would be "IF" it contained PDMS. Do you see that listed on the ingredients?


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## david g (Dec 14, 2005)

Dom i for one have no issues at all with you or anyone else asking questions in connection with any of our products never mind this one :thumb:

As already stated i havent had the chance to use the wax yet ,its hidden away from anyones reach in our unit until next week when i have a lovely Red Audi TT to test it out on.I *suspect* that this wax will defo offer a performance advantage over our other waxes but next week will be judgement day:argie:You just have to look at the feedback on the US site

*Dear Chemical Guys,

My hat goes off to you gentlemen. The new E-Zyme paste wax is unbelievable. I would normally say, " The pictures speak for themselves", but seeing the finish of these two cars in person is even better, they look gorgeous. The depth, clarity and shine are just breath taking. With a client base as picky as mine, only perfect is good enough.We have so many expensive products in the shop, I sometimes wonder if I am going crazy. Nothing I have used has come close the finish of your new paste.....it's perfect. *

This packaging certainly doesnt merit an increase in price at all and it would be ludicrous to think otherwise.Paul has spoken to me very briefly regarding this wax as he wanted me to try it first as he has guaranteed it will *blow my socks off *,im certainly hoping so.

CG manufacture their own products from scratch and have over 150 employess to date ,ranging from sales reps right down to several chemists employed by the company on a full time basis.CG dont believe in fancy marketing or packaging and from speaking with Paul they spend a whole lot more in new product development than in advertising or marketing .

I for one was not meaning that you Dom or Dodo Juice were direct competition or indeed feeling under threat in any way it was more of a general statement and the old divulging ingredients chestnut is very viable indeed whether it be the food ,wax making or any other industry for that matter.
I find that product performance is of more importance to me as a retailer and a consumer (i do have most if not all manufacturers wax for my personal use )than the make up or scientific elements involved in wax making etc.

I for one dont have the same experience in the scientific approach on this subject but as i have already mentioned what is more important to me is the performance from both my own and from our customers experience.At the end of the day thats what counts most of all.

As soon as i have more info on this new product i will let you all know but im just eager to try it in the flesh to satisfy my own curiosity ,when new products come out from CG im like a kid in a sweety shop to say the least .
Roll on next week


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

Fair play Dave 

The customer feedback probably deserves italics rather than bold though - even we take the praise from our own customers with a certain pinch of salt.  

You are right about product performance being king though. Indeed I hope your socks are well and truly removed, but even I struggle to see the difference between our entry level waxes and top performers on a well prepped machine polished surface. I don't know, I think I must be into 'reality marketing' or something these days... I am getting suspicous of hyperbole - even my own! LOL.

Anyway, please forgive any hint of negativity. It is not meant to be a dampener. Probably more a reaction to the american way of doing things with more fanfare than facts.

Good luck with the wax in the UK. I'm sure it will be very good as 50/50 (old version) was a nice solid performer and this will surely be above it  Remember to send me a sample and I promise it won't get IR analysed


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## david g (Dec 14, 2005)

Dodo Factory said:


> Fair play Dave
> 
> The customer feedback probably deserves italics rather than bold though - even we take the praise from our own customers with a certain pinch of salt.
> 
> ...


cheers Dom ,im still awaiting the sample of SNV2


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

I asked the guys to send it ages ago (all samples go out directly from the unit). Maybe they spotted your address and thought a mistake had been made  I'll rectify it. I'll send you some juicy natural stuff as well.

ATB
D


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## david g (Dec 14, 2005)

Looking forward to it Dom.You got the new 50/50 yet ?


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

A good fair and frank discussion and frank discussion which is great to see between manufacturers and sellers which as an end user with an inquisitive mind feeds the imagination nicely 

The E-zyme does look interesting, and speaking personally without my objective analytical hat on, I'd love to see it do well and smash a chunk out of *****'s sales!! 

Analytical hat back on - we're back to the "old chesnut" for me which is exacty how much a wax really adds to a well prepped surface? Anecdotal and experimental evidence now shows more conclusively than ever that the difference on well prepped paint is nothing more than differences in the mind, while there is little concrete evidence to suggest waxes do make tenable differences to the finish... I'd argue some make slight changes, some dont, but on a finish machined to perfection, you'd be hard pressed to see it... And this is where my issue with expensive waxes comes: just how can it justify a price differential if it doesn't make a tenable difference to the looks? Well, on durability, but then is it better than Collinite or Zaino on this front? This is taken from an end user's point of view - in my shoes right now, the wax fan in me mkes me think: yeah, another wax, worth a punt just for fun  But then I am put off simply by the price tag, in the case of this wax to the point where if its notably above £100 then its unlikely I will buy it... Though small panel pots of it like Dodo Juice do with Supernatural may be an idea to let folks try before they comit large sums of money for a product which questionably warrants the price tag.

Regrading enzymes, I am looking forward to an explanation about their funtion in this wax and how it makes it better than the competition - as Dom rightly points out in the industry, there's a lotof smoke and mirros going on. We are being told something is better but with no justification as to why, which leads the more inquisitive mind to question whether or not it is all just marketing bumff or whether there has actually been a real technological advancement - if it was the latter, I'm sure it would be shouted from the roof tops so it will be interesting to hear the science behind how this wax outperforms the competition... Until then, we ca only base our judgements on reviews of the product.


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

Nope. Haven't used the old one up  Still got my Pete's as well. We should definitely have a wax sample amnesty


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## Dodo Factory (Apr 11, 2007)

Yoda makes a great ref as ever  Well put Mr KG.


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## blake_jl (Apr 26, 2008)

I find tubs of wax so collectable. Maybe that's why these products continue to sell and probably always will regardless of their performance.


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## ELBOW GREASE (Sep 1, 2008)

*i seen this product......*

this product is amazing it smells great too. easy to use and wonderful paint reaction.:thumb:


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

ELBOW GREASE said:


> this product is amazing it smells great too. easy to use and wonderful paint reaction.:thumb:


Excellent :thumb:

What would you say the wax added to the finish? I've currently got a wax on test which I think adds a very subtle gloss though I'm not sure if its my mind playing tricks on me...


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

Firstly,

I think it is, quite frankly, awesome that this type of discussion happens on this forum and what makes it different from the norm.

Thanks 

David g, Dom and Dave.

If my GCSE biology is still working, aren't Enzymes chemical 'breakers' that break down large molecules into smaller ones?

e.g. Amylase for complex carbs to simpler carbs in human digestion?

In the interests of discussion and just because i'm a nosey so and so...

How is this likely to be of any use in a wax? Would the presence of Oxygen allow an Enzyme to break a softer material down into an altogether harder and more durable substance for example?


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## yetizone (Jun 25, 2008)

Any more news on this tantalising new wax yet..?


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

yetizone said:


> Any more news on this tantalising new wax yet..?


Yes, have a look at THIS Thread. 

Alan W


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## yetizone (Jun 25, 2008)

Thanks Alan - totally missed that thread..!

Will have a good read. :thumb:


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

More crucially, any durability reports on the wax yet?


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

yetizone said:


> Thanks Alan - totally missed that thread..!
> 
> Will have a good read. :thumb:


I did a short review of the wax on page 3. 

Alan W


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Dave KG said:


> More crucially, any durability reports on the wax yet?


Too early to tell Dave and I'm not sure if David G will be seeing the TT again, unfortunately. However, I'll ask him if he can get us an update from time to time if possible.

Alan W


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## Kron (Aug 29, 2007)

Its not really too early to tell, Quite a few people over at detailingbliss have been using it for the last couple of months so there should be a few opinions on there.


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## david g (Dec 14, 2005)

Alan W said:


> Too early to tell Dave and I'm not sure if David G will be seeing the TT again, unfortunately. However, I'll ask him if he can get us an update from time to time if possible.
> 
> Alan W


I will be able to keep up to date on the durability side of things :thumb:


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

david g said:


> I will be able to keep up to date on the durability side of things :thumb:


Great news! 

Thanks David! :thumb:

Alan W


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Kron said:


> Its not really too early to tell, Quite a few people over at detailingbliss have been using it for the last couple of months so there should be a few opinions on there.


Although a couple of guys on DB have used the wax there are no mentions of durabilty yet.

Hopefully David can keep an eye on the TT and there'll be a few more people in the UK using it soon! 

Alan W


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