# Seriously PI$$ED OFF



## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

Did a 12 hour detail yesterday and LUCKILY for me it was on a very good friends Bentley GT......

Started at 6am and finally got it finished by 6pm....long day to say the least.

Okay!!!!!

Pretty much the final part of the detail on the rear bumper. Had some scratches on it which i was trying to remove and geting good success with...they were flattening out nicely.

Then disaster struck........The BRAND NEW 4" Fcuking Lake Country pad split, and the pad base hit the bumper end and took the paint clean off!!!!!!!! leaving the plastic bumper........VERY nearly throught the PC right across the workshop......so pi$$ed off i cant tell you...

I`d only put this $hit pad on to get in the tighter spot, uptil then i`d been using Edge pads with no problem whatsoever.

The owner was totally understanding and was more annoyed for me as he could tell how pi$$ed i was and what and knows what i`m like with cars....beside the fact i`d been at it since 6am.

I will NEVER EVER use another Lake Country pad ever again...EVER!!!! A brand new pad, with hardly any pressure on it simply SHOULD NOT SPLIT....this if this had been a clients car this could have cost me a lot of cash, all for the sake of a crappy made pad....

NOT IMPRESSED at all....

Will post pics soon when i`ve finished steaming:evil: 

Daz


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## bigsyd (Jul 2, 2006)

jesus m8. that was bad luck....all you need after a full day at it


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Not good, any chance the pad although unused was an old one and this affected it somehow?

As you say irrelavent who owned the car its the could have happened to any car!!

Gutted for you


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## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

Ouch!!! Had 4inch pads fly off but never split!


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

Its just so lucky that it was a friends car as i`m sure as hell a Bentley GT bumper re-spray isnt cheap....he`s very understanding and didnt really seem overly bothered - but to me its as though its happend to my own car.

Its not that old and was fresh out of the pack - had been stored in the house so not damp of anything like that - and i am so incredibly careful when i`m doing a car.

I`m just so annoyed that it should have happened. I`d gone back for a second attempt to remove the remains of the scratches THATS what annoyed me more than anything as thats when it happened.

I`ve had a pad come loose before Mark but you can tell its happening - when it spilt the first in new of it was the 3" long and 4mm wide scuff on the bumper edge.

Whats even more infuriating is that the car was so badly swirled and marked is that i was on a complete mission to make it mint for him which i`d pretty much done. As it goes the marks on the bumper would not have come off completely so he decided it was a shame for any marks to be present so is going to get it re-sprayed....doesnt make me feel any better mind you.

Daz


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## Auto Finesse (Jan 10, 2007)

Dam i fell for you it kind of ruins the whole job dont it, some thing simalar happened to me well i put the roof down on a convertable and then it did not go back up properly all you need on a 12h day, i felt kind of embaresed its not a good felling luckly it was only and electronic reset

I must admit i hear some thing about the glue on the LC pads but dot heard of them spliting, this is the reason i dont like the idea of these edge pads its that big spindle of bare metal spining mm from the paint work


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## Finerdetails (Apr 30, 2006)

Brazo said:


> Ouch!!! Had 4inch pads fly off but never split!


ditto.

Always very wary around any corner with the four inch pads. I find them much easier on the rotary as the orbit of the PC really doesn't help matters.


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Blimey mate. Is there no comeback from Lake re this? SUrely they have sold you something defective so vicariously they are responsible?


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## Timmo (Mar 21, 2006)

Would have thought that as the pad suffered a aserious defect you should be able to get some form of compensation of lake country for the damage caused by the pad to the car?? 
Not a nice thing to happen though! Especially when your towards the end of the job! had it once or twice when towards the end of a pick up the stickyness holding the velcro tot he back of the backing plate has got so hot its come away and sent it and the pad off across the valeting bay! 

Like you said though, lucky it was a mate as oterwise it would prove costly! and also a good advert i suppose for detailing/valeting insurance!!


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## A20 LEE (Feb 20, 2007)

gutted for you. Must have really soured what was turning into a cracker.


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## Neil_S (Oct 26, 2005)

Finerdetails said:


> ditto.
> 
> Always very wary around any corner with the four inch pads. I find them much easier on the rotary as the orbit of the PC really doesn't help matters.


L200 Steve let me run a rotary at 700 rpm on the back of my hand with a 4 inch pad today and I was rather surprised how the heat built up quickly, intense too, I believe because the pad is too small to help the heat dissapate effectively.

How do you get on with 4 inch pads on the rotary, day in day out? It seems that you would have to be extra careful on plastics because of this heat issue?


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

james b said:


> Dam i fell for you it kind of ruins the whole job dont it, some thing simalar happened to me well i put the roof down on a convertable and then it did not go back up properly all you need on a 12h day, i felt kind of embaresed its not a good felling luckly it was only and electronic reset
> 
> I must admit i hear some thing about the glue on the LC pads but dot heard of them spliting, this is the reason i dont like the idea of these edge pads its that big spindle of bare metal spining mm from the paint work


TBH i hadnt heard a thing to diminish LC pads - if i had i wouldnt have bought any in the first place...interesting now that you and others have mentioned it..

The Edge pads. I know exactly what you mean about that. I did alot of test with the softest one i own including leaning on my pc so hard it stopped moving on a scrap panel to try and get the QR mechanism to hit....didnt get close to it...they`ve very well designed and also very secure too so i`m at ease with them now.



drpellypo said:


> Blimey mate. Is there no comeback from Lake re this? SUrely they have sold you something defective so vicariously they are responsible?


Am not sure actually. TBH i was so annoyed at the whole event that i hadnt even considered it until you mentioned it....but i do think it was defective. I`ve never had any pad actually split.



Timmo said:


> Would have thought that as the pad suffered a aserious defect you should be able to get some form of compensation of lake country for the damage caused by the pad to the car??
> Not a nice thing to happen though! Especially when your towards the end of the job! had it once or twice when towards the end of a pick up the stickyness holding the velcro tot he back of the backing plate has got so hot its come away and sent it and the pad off across the valeting bay!
> 
> Like you said though, lucky it was a mate as oterwise it would prove costly! and also a good advert i suppose for detailing/valeting insurance!!


Thing is though you can normally tell when a pad is about to fly off - it just doesnt feel right. This pad splitting tho gave no warning signs at all, the first i knew anything about it was the damage. Had i been putting lots of pressure down i dread to think how much worse it would have been.

Personally i never use 4" pads at all if i can help it. From now on anything small and fiddly and its being done by hand only.

Lesson learnt

Thanks for the nice comments guys - making me feel a whole lot better:thumb:

Daz


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## pcc (Oct 11, 2006)

Ive had similar probs with LC pads. Fresh out the packet and the backing started to fail on a cutting then poishing pad. If the backing had failed completely on the cutting pad i would have had an extremely expensive repair bill on my hands due to the car i was working on.
Sent them back to CYC for a full refund and was told that they have sorted out the problem but ill never use them again.
Ive since heard from others that have experianced similar problems. My advice, steer clear of LC pads.
My Megs pads have never showed any signs of failure in any way,shape or form so ill stick with them from now on.


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

pcc said:


> Ive had similar probs with LC pads. Fresh out the packet and the backing started to fail on a cutting then poishing pad. If the backing had failed completely on the cutting pad i would have had an extremely expensive repair bill on my hands due to the car i was working on.
> Sent them back to CYC for a full refund and was told that they have sorted out the problem but ill never use them again.
> Ive since heard from others that have experianced similar problems. My advice, steer clear of LC pads.
> My Megs pads have never showed any signs of failure in any way,shape or form so ill stick with them from now on.


Mine neither. Ive got Megs pads, Sonus and Edge. Now the Edge pad got some serious hammering yesterday and started to fail slightly in the centre of the pad.....made no difference in the use of it and carried on fine on the rest of the car. The difference is in total the Edge pad with a heavy cutting compound was in constant use for over 6 hours with some heavy pressure being applied to it. The 4" LC pad had about 5 minutes of use with a medium cut compound as it was on a plastic bumper with not much pressure and failed totally.

Has anyone got an e-mail address for LC and is there a solicitor here that could offer some free advice?? I`d like to get him the money back for the repair to his car as it is the result of a faulty product, not fit for purpose.

Thanks

Daz


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## detailfinish (Jul 16, 2006)

I think you should talk to LC.

I've been using them for about 4 months now and not had a single problem.

My thoughts are with you mate, gutting experience.


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## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

Daz I suspect the burden of proof would be too much mate 

Don't take this the wrong way am just looking at it from LC's legal team who don't wish to pay up!

Did the pad really split?
Was it user error?
Was the damage caused in some other way?
Why did it happen on a Bentley and not a Fiesta?

I should imagine their liability is limited to replacement cost of a new pad.


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## xlfive (Feb 18, 2006)

Bad news mate :doublesho just done a quick Google and found this

http://www.lakecountrymfg.com/contactus.html,is this the same company your looking for


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## vindaloo (Jan 5, 2006)

Brazo said:


> .........I should imagine their liability is limited to replacement cost of a new pad.


Absolutely right, no company will have any legal obligation to pay out on consequential loss, I know it doesn't make you feel any better but al least you should get a new pad out of them.....that's if you want one of course.


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

Brazo said:


> Daz I suspect the burden of proof would be too much mate
> 
> Don't take this the wrong way am just looking at it from LC's legal team who don't wish to pay up!
> 
> ...


i Know what you`re saying Mark but....

The pad is there to be tested by anyone

User error is a difficult one but after 6 odd hours with a different pad an no problems - not proof but common sense besides you can tell by the pad its a fresh one.

Its obvious by the damage that it was caused by the pad in question - again i`m more than happy to have this inspected.

A Bentley is much more likely candidate to be being detailied than a Fiesta  y`know what i`m saying but thanks for the logical questions Mark, its always good to have another perspective on things.

If you buy a washing machine and it sets on fire then your house the manufactureers are to blame - defective product, not fit for purpose results in furthur damage. This does apply to every item.

I`ll just get some advice i think, i know some good solicitors and to be honest i`ll only feel happy when i get some recompense from it....

Daz


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

xlfive said:


> Bad news mate :doublesho just done a quick Google and found this
> 
> http://www.lakecountrymfg.com/contactus.html,is this the same company your looking for


Thanks for that matey:thumb:

Daz


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## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

Daz don't get me wrong mate I wasn't doubting you in any way just offering another perspective that 'they' may take :thumb:


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## jedi-knight83 (Aug 11, 2006)

gutted... would PLI cover this? i know some policies dont cover things worked upon but in the case of equipment failure... what the score??


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## Rich @ PB (Oct 26, 2005)

That's not good; first time I've heard of a LK pad splitting with no notice - the only failures I've seen are the velcro backs delaminating, which is a manufacturing defect and results in replacement pads being issued. It would be worth contacting LK about the issue; most manufacturers will have product liability insurance in place, and if you send the pad back to the factory and they can confirm a manufacturing fault you might get lucky, particularly given the vehicle involved. Really feel for you, we all know that accidents will happen from time to time no matter how much experience we gain, but it is gutting all the same when reality bites...


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

Brazo said:


> Daz don't get me wrong mate I wasn't doubting you in any way just offering another perspective that 'they' may take :thumb:


Oh i know that Mark no worries my mate, took it exactly as you meant it matey :thumb:

You`re probably the best at thinking forward your advice its always good mate.....i do appriciate it 

Daz

We had a long chat, me and the guy whose car it is and he had a good look at the pad. Although he`s not overly bothered about the damage he`s more bothered that i was so annoyed and upset about it, he`s a really good friend.

He`s actually offered to plough money into possible court action - not to re-coup money for his car but more to make a stand and a point out of it. Like he quite rightly said if that had been a customers car for me or for any of you guys here it could`ve cost us dear......even if it was a less undersatanding friend of anyone of us a simple favour could have cost a four figure sum to recify.


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## Seano (Feb 24, 2007)

Bloody hell Daz....:doublesho absolutely gutted for you mate, good to have such an understanding customer / friend although I can accept it doesn't make you feel any better, and yes it is something that we all take personally when this kind of thing happens, hope you get it sorted without too much hassle mate....:thumb: 

Sean.


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## drnh (Jun 2, 2006)

Seano said:


> Bloody hell Daz....:doublesho absolutely gutted for you mate, good to have such an understanding customer / friend although I can accept it doesn't make you feel any better, and yes it is something that we all take personally when this kind of thing happens, hope you get it sorted without too much hassle mate....:thumb:
> 
> Sean.


Cheers Sean :thumb:

It really is gutting especially when you`re always so careful and it was such a nice car too......

Lesson learnt though, will never place too much confidence in any part of my detailing equipment again.

Daz


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## Arousa (Jun 13, 2006)

Most businesses have a policy which the only liability is the replacement of product. I believe there are too many loop holes for something like this to be resolved in your favour. Unless they will do it out of good will.

A lesson learned. You must have insurance and just accept that crap will happen one way or another to a customers car while in your posession. It should not bother you, its part of being a professional and dealing with the day to day.


I tell all my customers, and I make sure they sign my work order form, that although this is not rocket science crap will happen. That I am fully insured and what ever I make wrong that I will also make it 100% right. Just last month after I finished detailing a car I backed it up forgetting there was a post in the way. lol Oh well, 400 euros later it has less orange peel on one rear quarter panel as a result of a good respray and a new light. lol

Three things I recomend to you are find insurance if you dont already have some, I am covered for 500,000euros. Find a really good body shop that will produce quality work for when you need it. And lastly get work order/inspection forms done up to CYA. Even though in this case that would not help, but in others it might.


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## leistrum (Feb 10, 2007)

Sorry to hear what happened Daz, I'm sure you'll get it sorted and I hope Lake will show some form of goodwill gesture. Interested how it works out as the pads I got from Alex L are lake country and i have yet to use them. I have some 4" pads on order from Elite too! A bit of an eye opener of just what can happen with a rotary no matter how careful you are - and I still have to have a go on a scrap panel yet.........


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## Arousa (Jun 13, 2006)

What became of this? Have you taken it further?


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