# How good is blackhole compared to red moose?



## ilovepooma (Nov 3, 2009)

I've a black MX-5 which I want to 'do' soon and it is rather swirly in places, I'm not intending on having it corrected until early spring so in the meantime I'm looking for a super-duper filler.

I currently have Red Moose glaze but I'm reading amazing things about Blackhole, is it worth purchasing when I already have Red Moose?

ta!


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## cotter (Aug 31, 2008)

Haven't tried Red Moose, but BH is fantastic stuff, easy to use and very good at what it does


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## zepp85 (Jul 8, 2010)

Ill be honest and say i wasnt blown away. i did only apply it by hand, and have heard it works 4x better via da.


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## deanr201 (Nov 24, 2010)

I think its a great product! I havent used red moose, but here is a picture of the top of my mates (Millz on here) of his Red CTR

















And one from the front









Should work well on the mx-5


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## 888-Dave (Jul 30, 2010)

It is a good product and definitely does add something. 
As a filler it's ok, obviously better to just remove the swirls by polishing. :thumb:


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

I'd stick to the RMG to be honest. 

Blackhole is cheap and comes in 4oz samples to try as well, so no reason not to try it. 

I don't think black hole is as great as everyone makes it out to be. I don't notice much difference at all after 85RD.


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## ilovepooma (Nov 3, 2009)

888-Dave said:


> It is a good product and definitely does add something.
> As a filler it's ok, obviously better to just remove the swirls by polishing. :thumb:


I know!

Still debating whether to buy a machine myself or to pay a pro to do the correction for me, financially both would be about the same.

Honestly not sure how much use I'd get froma machine in the long term as much I do fancy having a go on one.


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## big ben (Aug 25, 2009)

much cheaper to buy it yourself... in a year you will only need to machine polish it again as you will no doubt have some minor swirls again. A DA can be used for applying loads of products to, not just machine correcting


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## paulmc08 (Feb 3, 2009)

I tryed both black hole and prima amigo and found the prima to be better,but that's only my opinion


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## amzchhabra (May 6, 2010)

Some 50/50s using BlackHole:


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## ilovepooma (Nov 3, 2009)

amzchhabra said:


> Some 50/50s using BlackHole:


Feck!

Impressive stuff!

Machine application?


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## amzchhabra (May 6, 2010)

Application as follows:

Megs G220 with Sonus SFX-2 Pad 

BlackHole requires a lot of work, I ended up doing a couple of passes at high speed but no pressure to break it down completely. That may be due to using too much product, but all in all, the car was done in around an hour...

DA is deffo the way to go, BH by hand is a huge waste of time...


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## Phill_S (Mar 30, 2009)

amzchhabra said:


> Some 50/50s using BlackHole:


BH the only product used to get that correction?


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

done with BH :thumb:

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=179093


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## Deanoecosse (Mar 15, 2007)

here's one I did with Blackhole, when its used by DA it's absolutely sh1t hot and very easy to use.








now you see the swirls








and as if by magic, the swirls are hidden:thumb:


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

888-Dave said:


> It is a good product and definitely does add something.
> As a filler it's ok, *obviously better to just remove the swirls by polishing.* :thumb:


In an ideal world, maybe. But with respect that's a bit of a generalisation if you don't mind me saying. There could be any number of scenarios where full bona fide correction isn't the best option and something like BH (or similar) is the more sensible option. I know what you're getting at, but total correction isn't the default paintwork solution for everyone 



type[r]+ said:


> I'd stick to the RMG to be honest.
> 
> Blackhole is cheap *and comes in 4oz samples to try as well*, so no reason not to try it.
> 
> I don't think black hole is as great as everyone makes it out to be. I don't notice much difference at all after 85RD.


Individually? From where? To the best of my knowledge the 4oz samples are only available as part of one of the various Poorboy's 4 bottle sampler kits?

_________________________________

Some impressive 50/50s there ^^ chaps :thumb:


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## GR33N (Apr 5, 2009)

Ive got to be honest, I havent achieved great results with BH by hand or by DA. Whats the best technique to use to get the best our of BH?

These results look amazing, its got me thinking about it again :lol:


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Viper said:


> Individually? From where? To the best of my knowledge the 4oz samples are only available as part of one of the various Poorboy's 4 bottle sampler kits?


I got mine from Autogeek USA last order for free. They got all the poorboys in sample sizes for sale too. 
Sorry, I just assumed you could get them in UK too. I've seen those 4 packs there.


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Ah, okay thanks matey 

I have asked one of our traders to look into getting some Poorboys gear in individual sample sizes, but he's not come back to me yet. I do want to see these available, and what I want I usually get


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Viper said:


> Ah, okay thanks matey
> 
> I have asked one of our traders to look into getting some Poorboys gear in individual sample sizes, but he's not come back to me yet. I do want to see these available, and what I want I usually get


Lol! Sample sizes are great, you can try them out, if you like, you buy the full size! It puts the manufacturers money where their mouths are so to speak. Also, not everyone needs full size products. Like Menzerna 250ml sizes are perfect for anyone that only does their own cars. We don't get those in Australia, so I get mine off a pro detailer here that got the big drums of the stuff.


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## ryand (Jul 18, 2008)

I've not compared these two directly but have both. Used rmg after correction on my red car and very nice as its oily wet look but you can't put sealant over it whereas bh you can. 

Dodo nfs is worth a look by machine too, had some great results with it, part correction, part filled with oils and cleaners. Check my write ups for some images.


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## amzchhabra (May 6, 2010)

Phill_S said:


> BH the only product used to get that correction?


Hi Phil,

thats correct, nothing else at all... If I remember correctly, I spread the BH over the area worked at speed 2, then ramped it up to speed 5 for a few passes until the residue was almost non-existant, and then down to speed 3 for a couple passes just to refine it.

When I first used black hole, it took a lot of experimenting to get it right, but ultimately remember, it needs to be worked a lot to get really good results.


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Yes, I'd go along with the working it well into the surface to get the best results - even by hand that's what I do. Adopting a wipe on, allow to haze and wipe off method is perhaps why some people are a bit underwhelmed with it? 

The same could be said for SRP as well actually as WOWO with that doesn't get the best from it either. 

Can't beat a bit of elbow grease (especially in this weather to warm you up lol!)


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## AcN (Nov 3, 2010)

I have BH and White Diamond, and used the WD on mom's metallic grey Yaris for winter prep. The car was already polished, so there was nothing to be filled, but heck, the added gloss was great (and man, the coconut/pineapple smell makes you want to bite the bonnet LOL  ), and enhanced by the FK 1000p.
But what is to say is : try try try, everything is subjective 
I'm gonna buy some RMG soon to try 

edit : glaze applied by machine, otherwise my arm would have died if i wanted to achieve the same finish


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## Phill_S (Mar 30, 2009)

amzchhabra said:


> Hi Phil,
> 
> thats correct, nothing else at all... If I remember correctly, I spread the BH over the area worked at speed 2, then ramped it up to speed 5 for a few passes until the residue was almost non-existant, and then down to speed 3 for a couple passes just to refine it.
> 
> When I first used black hole, it took a lot of experimenting to get it right, but ultimately remember, it needs to be worked a lot to get really good results.


I'm very, very impressed by the look from those pics, the "correction" looks like a proper paint correction using a compound. Before this thread there are a few other glazes I'd always get ahead of the PB's, but looks like I might have to get me some!


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## ilovepooma (Nov 3, 2009)

Very interesting replies.

Taking it a step further and given that I'm a machine virgin, would it be better to try and fill with a machine or to correct? Seeing as how I will wax the car at least 2-3 times a year surely the fillers will always 'stay in'?

Can just as much damage be caused with glazes as with polish?


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## ryand (Jul 18, 2008)

If you strip the wax back each time then its likely the fillers will go, especially if you clay.


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## Phill_S (Mar 30, 2009)

ilovepooma said:


> Very interesting replies.
> 
> Taking it a step further and given that I'm a machine virgin, would it be better to try and fill with a machine or to correct? Seeing as how I will wax the car at least 2-3 times a year surely the fillers will always 'stay in'?
> 
> Can just as much damage be caused with glazes as with polish?


My advice re - machining is just practise, by the sounds of it you are worried you could cause some damage, but tbh you'd have to be a numpty to do so. Have a read of the guides on here and practise - you'll be fine. :thumb:

I've not as good a result from a glaze or polish with fillers than a cutting polish with regards paint clarity and a look of correction, but regular use of a glaze will keep it looking pretty good and certainly won't damage your paint.


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## ilovepooma (Nov 3, 2009)

Phill_S said:


> My advice re - machining is just practise, by the sounds of it you are worried you could cause some damage, but tbh you'd have to be a numpty to do so. Have a read of the guides on here and practise - you'll be fine. :thumb:
> 
> I've not as good a result from a glaze or polish with fillers than a cutting polish with regards paint clarity and a look of correction, but regular use of a glaze will keep it looking pretty good and certainly won't damage your paint.


I must admit I am a bit worried, especially given the reputation that Mazda paint has!

There is also the financial element, I'm not truly convinced that I will get that much use out of a machine, after all after I've corrected then hopefully a decent washing routine will then stop from having to correct in the (near) future.


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## centenary (Sep 5, 2010)

I've got blackhole on my sapphire black 3 series convertible. Cant say Im that impressed with it. Neither could I recommend it but that's just my opinion.

It made the finish better than it was but that's because BMW's supaguard made the paintwork look dull.

Beep, beep :driver:


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

What was your application method, just out of interest?


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## CamV6 (Dec 14, 2006)

Amz! So this is where you been hiding yourself! How ya doin mate!?

Loving the GTR. WFT you been doing to it to get it that swirly in the 1st place?

I'm confused, who did the polishing with BH, you or the OP?

Might have a go with some of that. I hear it is also a nice product on light colours too and I was looking for something that fills well.


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