# Pushing it too early?



## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

Hey all, I've not done any training now for 2-3 months. I'm not a die hard trainer just 20-30 mins 3 times a week until I hurt myself. I use a multigym (boo!) decided to try do lat pull down behind neck with the same weight i was pressing...ouch! Put me out till now. Believe I've damaged 'rotator cuffs'??? I was away this weekend and decided to have a little swim... top of arms hurt a wee bit, but not too much. I'm deciding whether or not I could go back on the multigym and start off light in hope to increase again. My question really is am I ok to start again do you think or is it too early?

Any suggestions would be greatly received as I don't want to be put off altogether or indeed hurt myself further.

Many thanks,


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Hey all, I've not done any training now for 2-3 months. I'm not a die hard trainer just 20-30 mins 3 times a week until I hurt myself. I use a multigym (boo!) decided to try do lat pull down behind neck with the same weight i was pressing...ouch! Put me out till now. Believe I've damaged 'rotator cuffs'??? I was away this weekend and decided to have a little swim... top of arms hurt a wee bit, but not too much. I'm deciding whether or not I could go back on the multigym and start off light in hope to increase again. My question really is am I ok to start again do you think or is it too early?
> 
> Any suggestions would be greatly received as I don't want to be put off altogether or indeed hurt myself further.
> 
> Many thanks,


See a sports physio, get yourself cleared/fit first before going further with your fitness regime.

Read this thread: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=238868&page=288

You don't need to lift heavy, just follow the basic principles outlined on the thread, eat a balanced diet with reduced starchy carbs. Ensure your consuming enough protein for your lean body weight.

Sport/fitness = You are your biggest hurdle to climb and your body will fight you all the way. Learn to master yourself and be the master of yourself. You will fall, pick yourself up and keep picking yourself up every time you fall.

:thumb:


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## djgregory (Apr 2, 2013)

Technique over Weight.

Start off light, write down how much you can lift on every exercise then slightly increase this weight every 2 weeks etc.


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## Kriminal (Jan 11, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> Hey all, I've not done any training now for 2-3 months. I'm not a die hard trainer just 20-30 mins 3 times a week until I hurt myself. I use a multigym (boo!) *decided to try do lat pull down behind neck* with the same weight i was pressing...ouch! Put me out till now. Believe I've damaged 'rotator cuffs'??? I was away this weekend and decided to have a little swim... top of arms hurt a wee bit, but not too much. I'm deciding whether or not I could go back on the multigym and start off light in hope to increase again. My question really is am I ok to start again do you think or is it too early?
> 
> Any suggestions would be greatly received as I don't want to be put off altogether or indeed hurt myself further.
> 
> Many thanks,


^ that's where you went wrong. Pulldowns behind the neck is probably the most unproductive back exercise you could possibly do - if not the most dangerous; pulling a bar towards the top of your spinal cord is a recipe for disaster....let alone the forward extension of the neck to make sure the bar misses the back of your head. A definite no-go exercise, imo.

Where exactly in the 'top of your arms' are you hurting, and what exercises did you exactly do before this pain?


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## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

Hi Kriminal,

I did 3 reps of 12 (bicep curls) then did same 3 reps of 12 but bench press (these exercicises are all on wires -multigym) then tried the lat pull down behind neck with the same weight i pressed. The top left of my arm felt like it cracked, like when you crack your knuckles?! The muscles that are at the very top of my arms are sore to touch. Even when I'm in the shower washing my hair i.e lifting my arms above my head it's painful. This of course has got less painful over the last 2-3 months, but when I try lifting something above head height I go through pain again for about a week and it goes round in circles. Difficult to explain, but hopefully you get my drift???


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## Leebo310 (Sep 30, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> Hi Kriminal,
> 
> I did 3 reps of 12 (bicep curls) then did same 3 reps of 12 but bench press (these exercicises are all on wires -multigym) then tried the lat pull down behind neck with the same weight i pressed. The top left of my arm felt like it cracked, like when you crack your knuckles?! The muscles that are at the very top of my arms are sore to touch. Even when I'm in the shower washing my hair i.e lifting my arms above my head it's painful. This of course has got less painful over the last 2-3 months, but when I try lifting something above head height I go through pain again for about a week and it goes round in circles. Difficult to explain, but hopefully you get my drift???


Mate if you've been injured for 3 months then as ITHAQVA says, just get yourself to a physio as that is a long time. 
Especially as you're saying that it still hurts for a week after you raise something above your head...


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## steviebabe0 (May 14, 2013)

If you heard a crack it could have been a tendon snapping as others suggest see Dr pronto. Lad at work did it and when scanned tendon was snapped, operation job, needs checking out.


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## Leebo310 (Sep 30, 2013)

steviebabe0 said:


> If you heard a crack it could have been a tendon snapping as others suggest see Dr pronto. Lad at work did it and when scanned tendon was snapped, operation job, needs checking out.


Quality avatar by the way mate :thumb:


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Kriminal said:


> ^ that's where you went wrong. Pulldowns behind the neck is probably the most unproductive back exercise you could possibly do - if not the most dangerous; pulling a bar towards the top of your spinal cord is a recipe for disaster....let alone the forward extension of the neck to make sure the bar misses the back of your head. A definite no-go exercise, imo.
> 
> Where exactly in the 'top of your arms' are you hurting, and what exercises did you exactly do before this pain?


As Kriminal says, some exercises do not suite some, the upright row has had bad press over the years, however I have used it "heavy style" for many years and no problems.

All lifts should be started with an empty bar, build up slowly and keep a record of your progress.

If you must do a lat pulldown, doing from the front is always the safest way. Don't get to bogged down with "hitting the muscle from all angles" its all bull****. Simple heavy compounds hit all the muscles you will ever need due to the stabilising muscles being incorporated when you lift. The only person who would even consider isolation exercises would be a competing bodybuilder.

A lot of the issues arising with certain exercises is the flexibility and build of the person training. Start with an empty bar, keep checking your form/technique (No matter how long you've been training). Learn to listen to your body.

:thumb:


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

In the area were it is painful is there any or was there any bruising?


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

Shoulders can be a sod, trust me! Get to the physio or doc and they will set you right. There are specific exercises for rotator cuffs you can do which will help things. See what the pros say and go from there.


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## Kriminal (Jan 11, 2007)

steviebabe0 said:


> If you heard a crack it could have been a tendon snapping as others suggest see Dr pronto. Lad at work did it and when scanned tendon was snapped, operation job, needs checking out.


^ as above, and as ITHAQVA has suggested, I'd go and get it checked out.

It could be something at the moment as simple as inflammation of the tendons, or a possible micro-tear (which can self-heal providing you lay off the weights for a while), so don't worry TOO much.

Just make sure you book in at the Docs and get it checked out before starting the weights again, and please lay off the Pulldowns to the rear - as ITHAQVA has mentioned, Pulldowns to the front are the way to go. :thumb:


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## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

ITHAQVA said:


> In the area were it is painful is there any or was there any bruising?


No, no bruising to look at. Very tender to touch still now, but maybe from the swim at the weekend.


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> No, no bruising to look at. Very tender to touch still now, but maybe from the swim at the weekend.


You shouldn't be tender from swimming :doublesho


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## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

Physio booked for 9.30 Saturday morn so will let ya know how it goes. Assessment and start repair treatment 30 mins, £30. Sounds like a plan. Thanks all for advice. Looking forward to recovery and starting some 5x5


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## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

Rotator Cuff muscle damage was the verdict. Started repair process and am booked in again and for next 3 weeks. Physio has said possible tears and if no progress after 3 weeks need to go for a scan which could mean surgery dependant on amount of damage! Have been given exercises to do twice a day to strengthen rotator cuff muscles along with visits for therapy etc so will crack on with that in hope to improve and dodge the dreaded hospital. So much for thinking they would fix there and then. Hmmm no 5x5 training for me in near future, gutted!


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## steviebabe0 (May 14, 2013)

Rotator cuff muscle damage doesnt narrow it down a great deal, unless you can raise both arms above head, to front side back etc ie full ROM all round still dont think I'd do too much until it has been scanned. Its already been a while since you did it with no real improvement if I understand your situation correctly, and if it does ultimately require an op, longer you leave it harder it is to finally do.


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

[email protected] said:


> Rotator Cuff muscle damage was the verdict. Started repair process and am booked in again and for next 3 weeks. Physio has said possible tears and if no progress after 3 weeks need to go for a scan which could mean surgery dependant on amount of damage! Have been given exercises to do twice a day to strengthen rotator cuff muscles along with visits for therapy etc so will crack on with that in hope to improve and dodge the dreaded hospital. So much for thinking they would fix there and then. Hmmm no 5x5 training for me in near future, gutted!


In brief :tumbleweed:

Good idea to do rotator exercises as this is the way to repair any muscle (rest will allow scar tissue to form and leave the area susceptible to re injury)

Go here:

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_healing_avoiding_injuries

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_training_through_around_injuries

The videos are not specific but that's the point, they explain in simple terms how each type of injury should be approached.

Brief over view of the Bill star rehab: http://startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Injuries

*Using Ice on the injury even after this time will help *

The RICE method combined with exercises for the particular area is the most important part of your repair process, I don't know why but everyone and I mean everyone who I know who has suffered an injury just doesn't seem to or they are incapable of believing how beneficial it is to successful rehab.

I tore my hamstring twice 12 months ago, I'm now squatting 200kg and deadlifting 205kg no worries and I'm 45. ICE rocks! 

One more thing: you may find this hard to believe but the human body doesn't not repair muscle tissue correctly (hence the build up of scare tissue)

Imagine healthy muscle fibres look like this ||||||||| all nice and straight, when you injure your muscles they repair like this \X/\X\/X/XX a complete knotted mess of muscle fibres (if you just use rest).

Exercising the muscle (Following for example the Bill star protocol) forces the muscle to repair in its natural path.

The body does however repair bone very well by building up more dense calcium making the injured area stronger than the surrounding bone, so its not all bad 

Bod42 on the strength thread has similar issues and can probably give you some more in depth and very sound rehab advice :thumb:

:thumb:


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## [email protected] (Nov 3, 2011)

Well, ended up having 4 sessions, would of been 5, but did miss one Saturday two weeks ago as I was in Cardiff. The first sesh hurt as did second, but progress from second to third then to forth was good and I feel much better. I can sleep on my side and am consciously lifting things with both hands now rather than the one just to be sure. Physio has said ease back in to training with light weights and see how you get on before getting back to where I was before damage was done which won't take long as I never lifted heavy in the first place lol

I've decided to start again Tuesday then see how my body reacts. I keep looking for a rack on fleabay, gumtree, freeads etc as I'm quite keen on starting the 5x5 stuff.

Thanks to all who recommended a physio! Never believed in them before now  Amazing what they can do!


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