# VAG cars...



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

This is not a personal dig at anyone on here, or your choice of cars – each to their own, and all the better for it.......

I have recently had the unfortunate pleasure of driving the following cars, all from the above group:

New golf bluemotion
New Passst 
3 year old Phaeton W12
3 year old V10 S8
New Seat Leon

And I have to say, they are the most boring, soul less things I have ever been in.... they are terrible, generic pieces of s**t...

I hate the driving positions, I hate the plastics, the layouts, and the engines...yes, even the lambo sourced V10... how the f**k did VAG manage to rip the guts and sounds from a V10....

Sitting in the passat today, I could not help feel like it’s a cabin for people that are failures...that have gave up....can't be bothered...also rans...it's just soooo dull and euuuugh..... :wall::wall::wall::wall::wall:

They are just so depressing to be in...and then you turn around and there is another, and another, and another...all the same, all with the same bland looking drivers with emotionless faces........ 

I even began to think that maybe my mondeo with the fancy badge isn't quite that bad...:devil:

Yes....that is how dull and sh**y I think VAG cars are!!! :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho

I was quite surprised at this...and esp the S8...that was shortlisted to be my next car.... 

Now I know that they are obviously very popular cars, but I have no idea what people see in them...I really don’t!

:thumb:


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Try sitting in a Ford or Vauxhall then!

Agreed VW's have alwasy felt a bland car to me....Audi are better Skoda and Seat are jsyt cheap feeling (much better than before though)

I think the term you are looking for is fucntional


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## DagenhamGeoff (Mar 20, 2011)

I found myself reading this in a Jeremy Clarkson voice lol.sadly I`ve got to agree, I`ve never felt "right" driving any VW and I love driving anything.think I`ll stick to my Mundano:thumb:


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## Shug (Jul 13, 2007)

What new mass produced cars do actually have any soul or character tho?
Car industry worldwide is suffering so cheaper mass production is just one survival 'go-to'
Take the lambo v10. A lambo owner will prob take care of it and service it on time etc, in a more mass produced car like an s8, they have to accept people aren't gonna treat it the same way so may well have dumbed it down respectively.
Anyway, classic cars is where its at


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## Grizzle (Jul 12, 2006)

Like you say each to there own but even after owning a VAG van from a Ford van it was a world of difference and made me want a VAG car, then going from a 5 series to a Skoda admittedly the interior isn't as good, fixture and fittings on the BM were great and the drive was out of this world, but then the Skoda is more than half the price new of a 5 series m sport.

But i just feel more comfortable driving the Skoda than i did the BM no idea why althought the seats in the Skoda are shocking!!!! I think its because i know the basics on VAG's compared to BMW's although i was learning things on the 5 Series its just to complicated to do basic things on, you tried changing an airfilter on a 525d? jesus god its brutal. 

Look at the cars you have (please dont think i'm looking for an argument here its just a simple comparison)

Jeep only drove one yards but... the interior plastics are cheap, leather seats are shoddy more like 1970's vinyl, styling is typical american.

Jag massive car tiny cabin never understood that same with the old XJ suppose its to hold that big lazy engine(which sounds good)

Mondeo?(didnt know you had one) rep mobile one of the better ones but again cheap inside and out.

Cars these days are throw away items like a washing machine tumble dryer, evrything is plastic (wings etc) mostly to conform with EU regulations, i love 50 & 60's american cars and 70's and early 80's British & European cars its true what they say they dont build them like they used too.


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## Dixondmn (Oct 12, 2007)

agreed. i dont like our mk6 Golf, glad i dont have to drive it everyday


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> This is not a personal dig at anyone on here, or your choice of cars - each to their own, and all the better for it.......
> 
> And I have to say, they are the most boring, soul less things I have ever been in.... they are terrible, generic pieces of s**t...
> 
> ...


Lol.. I do wish people wouldn't "beat about the bush" and just say what they mean...

I'm the exact opposite I love em..



> they are the most boring, soul less things I have ever been in.... they are terrible, generic pieces of s**t...


For one they pretty much created the "Hot hatch" market place with the advent of the Golf Gti. 35 years on the Golf GTi is still a car at the top of it's gain. Soul-less and boring are about as far off the mark as you could be. The Gti does it's job probably better than any car on the market, just because it's quick it doesn't need to shout about if by being clad in silly spoiler, air scoops and decals.



> I hate the driving positions, I hate the plastics, the layouts, and the engines...


Now the driving position and seats are just some of the best in the industry, maybe the rubber ring you sit on to protect your piles needs blowing up again..
Vdud were putting "soft feel" plastics and quality switch gear in vehicle when other still looked like airfix kits. Some of the cars out their today look like there interior has been designed by design students on drugs, switches scattered to the four corners of the cabin that light up like a Xmas tree at dusk. Vdub interiors just do the job end of. I can't really comment on engines I've never had one go wrong, so I assume they're OK.



> They are just so depressing to be in..... all the same, all with the same bland looking drivers with emotionless faces........


They're no emotionless, they're just watching the road ahead. You've just gotten used to seeing and hearing other drivers with their sub-woofs turned up so load to cover up the sound of the big ends rumbling and suspension clunking.. Your not seeing emotion your seeing fear and deperation..:doublesho



> I was quite surprised at this...and esp the S8...that was shortlisted to be my next car....


You boring old fart..

Told you they were good..:lol::lol::lol:


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## Deano (Jul 7, 2006)

i hated my a4 when i first got it, for all the reasons cuey said. very well built but lacking any passion. after a little personalisation though you can get good mix of teutonic quality and a bit more excitement.


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## Prism Detailing (Jun 8, 2006)

I loved my old mk3 GTI but i would agree with more recent VAG cars, i think they lack character and quite generic


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## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

I totally agree with you  they're everywhere, I'm happy in the knowledge that there's only 150 or so 133 cups around, and the interior whilst sparse and plastic isn't too badly built but for the price I paid... vags seem massively overpriced to me and I just don't find them interesting in the slightest! I've also spoken to a lot of people who have had no luck with any vag car and how unreliable they really can be :lol:


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## Kriminal (Jan 11, 2007)

I love 'em - some call the interiors bland, I call 'em discreet and easier to clean :thumb:


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## Deano (Jul 7, 2006)

there is no such thing as a reliable car marque.


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## Paulo (Aug 11, 2007)

deano said:


> there is no such thing as a reliable car marque.


Lexus.....


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## Grizzle (Jul 12, 2006)

Paulo said:


> lexus.....


If you can get them to stop :lol:


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## Deano (Jul 7, 2006)

Paulo said:


> Lexus.....


google lexus problems. or read my article on alphamen.


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## Paulo (Aug 11, 2007)

Deano said:


> google lexus problems. or read my article on alphamen.


_Can't find your Alphamen post, I know all cars have problems but Lexus have won JD Power Surveys for years in both UK and US....

I don't drive a Lexus by the way.....:lol:

Found your thread.....:thumb:_


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## Kriminal (Jan 11, 2007)

Paulo said:


> Lexus.....


The engine never failed, but the plastics were horrid - oh, and the back seat was fixed (IS200) in place so boot space was smaller than you would've thought.

Apart from that - bloomin' reliable :thumb:


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## Deano (Jul 7, 2006)

but the survery takes into account how dealers handle problems. not much good if you buy used.


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

Yep,Vw and Audis are really dull.Most of them dont even have the good grace to develop a trim rattle or two to give them character.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

PugIain said:


> Yep,Vw and Audis are really dull.Most of them dont even have the good grace to develop a trim rattle or two to give them character.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

I don't believe Volkswagen Group products are any more / less boring and bland than any other manufacturer

Add character and some will see the character as a fault

My 9 month old Mondeo is totally functional - its fit for purpose, has done 34000 miles - never in a million years would I become attached to it - its a machine that does its job - end of.

My GTV or 328i - they are cars I give a backward glance to, look good, sound good, fun to drive but neither are anything like as efficient as A to B transport as the Mondeo

90% + of people are happy with soulless, bland but efficient vehicles - those that dare to offer something different suffer at the hands of the marketplace - look at Citroen - sales have increased in proportion to their product becoming mainstream

I was in a meeting last week with a prestige Japanese manufacturer - they are keen to inject some passion / desire in their brand but admit that this is 100 times harder than producing an efficient, safe, reliable vehicle


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

not my cup of tea either tbh. the ride in the mk5 golf our family have is awful it crashes into potholes without any damping at all more than any car i have been in IMHO, the dealer might as well not bother even pulling their finger out tbh, and i dont know the seats after the ovlovs well there a joke put simply, it stalls sometimes randomly as well and no its a DSG dealer interested nope :lol: I also develop a long face when in it because i just personally want to get out/run away from it thats how much i dont like it tbh. 

then if you look at most of the same family group thanks to parts sharing it is just more of the same. personally i would prefer to have what i have and not it be not like every other medium size car tbh. and as for trim rattles cannot really say i have tbh, my fiat was a different matter :lol:

and as for deano's point regarding reliability i agree :lol: also again thanks to parts sharing between different brands and models if there is a problem with one compenent as displayed by toyota it spreads like wildfire


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## SteveyG (Apr 1, 2007)

nick_mcuk said:


> Try sitting in a Ford or Vauxhall then!
> 
> Agreed VW's have alwasy felt a bland car to me....Audi are better Skoda and Seat are jsyt cheap feeling (much better than before though)
> 
> I think the term you are looking for is fucntional


Have you driven the new mondeo? They are top notch, especially the Titanium X Sport :thumb:


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

SteveyG said:


> Have you driven the new mondeo? They are top notch, especially the Titanium X Sport :thumb:


I'd say just as bland as any other car on the road - and I drive one - see it as nothing more than an appliance to do a job - admittedly nit does the job well but no better than my kettle boils water or my lawnmower cuts grass


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

its not till you own a specific car, that you realise how common they can be. take my mk4 golf, 1 in every 5 cars is a mk4 :lol:

not really sure why everyone raves about them tbh. think im gona sell the gti after owning it only a few weeks :lol:


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

SteveyG said:


> Have you driven the new mondeo? They are top notch, especially the Titanium X Sport :thumb:


Not driven the latest one but the last one was better than the equivalent BMW nevermind the pissrat.

VAG cars are dull, none too reliable and over-priced, yes the plastics may have been better than their 90's counterparts but not so anymore. They don't drive as well as their rivals now either, look at the leading cars to drive ini the B,C and D segment cars and they're a patch on the Ford cars in that segment let alone the vauxhall, toyota and mazda versions.


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## jontymo (Feb 17, 2007)

I have recently moved from bmw to audi and have to say the interior is far nicer than in the bm and the drive is a damn site better than the beemer as it had 19"wheels with runflats on.

I will agree though the audi's do have a habit of annoying rattles that come and go.

But i do really enjoy my TTS and it does have a great engine.


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## JenJen (Jun 30, 2010)

Prism Detailing said:


> I loved my old mk3 GTI but i would agree with more recent VAG cars, i think they lack character and quite generic


Robert what a load of bull you said you loved the TT & the BMW & the Golf i had!!!

Its personal pref at the end of the day, I myself didnt enjoy the Golf as much as I have enjoyed my Audi's. I would say my A4 is a little bland compaired to that of the A5 & the TT that I had but the engine makes up for it! And i found the BMW boring...

Just depends what you want out of a car and as someone said persoanalisation helps :thumb:


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## johnnyguitar (Mar 24, 2010)

My mrs's Golf V is really nice - it's no driver's car but it's alright, got lots of standard kit and does the job. Plenty econmical, comfy, not expensive to run - it's all good really. I've decided that for me, the perfect car does't exist so I'm happy to take one that does the job these days.


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## Lee.GTi180 (Apr 28, 2010)

Love my Fab VRS and it is a hell of a lot better than my past two cars (206 GTi 180 and Fiesta). Don't like them, don't drive them :thumb:


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

The Cueball said:


> Now I know that they are obviously very popular cars, but I have no idea what people see in them...I really don't!


I'm afraid I agree cuey, with the one exception that I can think of, the scirocco.

I think it's gorgeous to look at and whilst it's similar to most vag interiors, it's still quite nice. It's something a bit different in vag land for me.

They've made the golf from what was originally quite epic, now to dull humdrum run of the mill hatchback land.

I really can't think of another vag I like.


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

andy665 said:


> I don't believe Volkswagen Group products are any more / less boring and bland than any other manufacturer
> 
> Add character and some will see the character as a fault
> 
> ...


I think generally, they don't have a high rate of interesting cars to soulless cars tbh compared to some other manufacturers.

Nissan have the gtr, skylines previous to that, silvia, etc etc. Ford have mustangs, the focus rs, GT, f150, how about some cosworths? Honda have the s2000, civic type r's of various generations, the nsx, legend. Heck, mazda have a lot of soul in their cars like the rx7, rx8, mx5.

I really struggle to think of many german cars with soul tbh. They may be great cars, efficient, some of them can be reliable, well built, but they lack that certain something.


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

Shug said:


> What new mass produced cars do actually have any soul or character tho?
> Car industry worldwide is suffering so cheaper mass production is just one survival 'go-to'
> Take the lambo v10. A lambo owner will prob take care of it and service it on time etc, in a more mass produced car like an s8, they have to accept people aren't gonna treat it the same way so may well have dumbed it down respectively.
> Anyway, classic cars is where its at


Civic type R?


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

i'd kind of agree with that statement, i've had the Golf and the A3 and now have the Leon although in Cupra flavour. I do like the Leon, yes its not the same quality as the A3 but i like the looks and the way it goes.

We also have the TT, which is nice to look at and ok to drive and the Polo which gets us from A-B, none have soul, in fact the only thing i have driven in a while that made me smile was a Fiat 500 Sport.

Most cars today a means of getting around, some look pretty but thats not always enough. Most of the Korean stuff is boring, Germans tend to be built well but but to clinical, the exception to that for me is the M3CSL the best car i have driven. I'm sure the more the press rate something the worse it might be, in fact i even like the little Vauxhall Corsa VXR, if its rough i think it has a certain charm.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

RisingPower said:


> I think generally, they don't have a high rate of interesting cars to soulless cars tbh compared to some other manufacturers.
> 
> Nissan have the gtr, skylines previous to that, silvia, etc etc. Ford have mustangs, the focus rs, GT, f150, how about some cosworths? Honda have the s2000, civic type r's of various generations, the nsx, legend. Heck, mazda have a lot of soul in their cars like the rx7, rx8, mx5.
> 
> I really struggle to think of many german cars with soul tbh. They may be great cars, efficient, some of them can be reliable, well built, but they lack that certain something.


Of the cars you mention only GTR and MX5 are current production cars officially available for sale in the UK - hardly fair to plunder other manufacturers past to compare to the current Volkswagen Group products.

IMHO very few manufacturers of mainstream cars produce stuff that could be considered genuinely interesting and characterful - partly its down to the accountants who run the businesses now but also its simply a case of giving the buying public what they want.

Toyota did not become the worlds biggest car manufacturer by producing characterful cars


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## SteveyG (Apr 1, 2007)

People need to stop using the term VAG. It makes half of the sentences in this thread so wrong...



RisingPower said:


> I really can't think of another vag I like.


Really???


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## Alzak (Aug 31, 2010)

VAG cars hmm what to say I drive now SEAT leon with DPF and is pain in ass all I can say this filter is a nightmare


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

andy665 said:


> Of the cars you mention only GTR and MX5 are current production cars officially available for sale in the UK - hardly fair to plunder other manufacturers past to compare to the current Volkswagen Group products.
> 
> IMHO very few manufacturers of mainstream cars produce stuff that could be considered genuinely interesting and characterful - partly its down to the accountants who run the businesses now but also its simply a case of giving the buying public what they want.
> 
> Toyota did not become the worlds biggest car manufacturer by producing characterful cars


I'm not just comparing current vw group products though, I struggle to think into the past of anything interesting either.


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

SteveyG said:


> Really???


Yup. I really can't think of any. S5, no, S4, no, RS6/RS4, no, S8 (love the v10, but interesting, not really), golfs no, passat hell no, polo, bora (aptly named), skodas.


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## Richf (Apr 26, 2008)

Of course they are boring most cars are boring , but boring isnt the same as bad 

Listening out for the slightest noise in case it turns out to be something expensive or terminal isnt boring but its not fun either 

Boring = reliable , dependable , good 

Sure they are dull but they do what it says on the tin


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## Mick (Jan 23, 2010)

RisingPower said:


> I'm not just comparing current vw group products though, I struggle to think into the past of anything interesting either.


Old scirocco, corrado, mk1 golf gti, audi quattro (the rally one), all pretty interesting cars, with character.

Agreed though, the current lineup is quite dross.


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## SteveyG (Apr 1, 2007)

RisingPower said:


> Yup. I really can't think of any. S5, no, S4, no, RS6/RS4, no, S8 (love the v10, but interesting, not really), golfs no, passat hell no, polo, bora (aptly named), skodas.


Hilarious :lol:


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## Deano (Jul 7, 2006)

is it vags fault or is it modern safety/emissions regs? I'm sure if it wasnt for these, we'd have the reborn, fire snortingly modern quattro by now.


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## andy665 (Nov 1, 2005)

Its a case of manufacturers giving the majority of buyers what they want. Just look at the expotential growth of Volkswagen Group over the last few years in terms of sales - now a serious contender to be the world number 1 in terms of volume.

I can't honestly think of a mainstream manufacturer that is performing well and at the same time delivering cars with character


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

erm cueball take a look here, my brother inlaw just purchased a motor from them:

www.4starclassics.co.uk

oh and the e30 M3 Sport Evo is mine, picking it up tomorrow after my 137m Euro Lottery win tonight, its only 50K after all!

not one boring car here, but yes most new cars are the same VAG/BMW Ford/Vx etc. they all share too many parts with their own lower end models etc making them all very similar ie. an A3 drives much like an A6 and feels much the same.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

It's only a mater of time until the VAG Group is the No.1 in the world.. They own more companies then you can shake a stick at.. €7.1 billion profit last year, bucking the trend seen by many other manufacturers.

"Resistance is futile"...

Volkswagen
Audi
SEAT
Skoda
Volkswagen Commercial Vehicles
Bentley
Bugatti
Lamborghini
Scania.
Soon to be Porsche too.

It truth you could have picked any manufacturer for a thread like this. People choose their cars because of what they like, if they're lucky enough to have the money to do that. Even more just buy what they can afford to run.

I like Vdubs in particular, because they're understated and the interiors are just plain and functional. Some say reliability isn't all it's carcked up to be but after 4 Vdubs over almost 20 years (touchwood) the only fault I had was a dud battery.

Come over to the dark side, you know you want to.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

robertdon777 said:


> erm cueball take a look here, my brother inlaw just purchased a motor from them:
> 
> www.4starclassics.co.uk
> 
> ...


very good...cheers....hope you get that car!

:thumb:


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> Soon to be Porsche too.


It's actually Porsche that own 35% of VW, or VAG, or whatever they are called these days...

I do love that VW advert though...... :lol:

:thumb:


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

robertdon777 said:


> erm cueball take a look here, my brother inlaw just purchased a motor from them:
> 
> www.4starclassics.co.uk
> 
> ...


lovely motors! in honesty if i had to own something german then it would be BM or Merc tbh i quite like the previous gen CLS, the new e class is nice prefer it as a coupe or cab though. as for BM in honesty i dislike the majority but a few have creeped through :lol: e93 M3 aint bad, new m5 but unfortunately then i start looking at the E30 M3's and E39 M5's and just go no to the modern ones:lol:


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

The Cueball said:


> It's actually Porsche that own 35% of VW, or VAG, or whatever they are called these days...
> 
> :thumb:


Yep, VAG own PHS Porsche Holding Salzburg not Porsche, and next year should see the merger of Porsche and VAG.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Ninja59 said:


> Yep, VAG own PHS Porsche Holding Salzburg not Porsche, and next year should see the merger of Porsche and VAG.





> The Lada Samara was partly developed by Porsche in 1984


:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho

Got to ask the question...but what bits?!?!?!

:lol:


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> It's actually Porsche that own 35% of VW, or VAG, or whatever they are called these days...
> 
> I do love that VW advert though...... :lol:
> 
> :thumb:


_I think that was the plan but porsche came unstuck and VW now hold a 50.1% share in Porsche with options on the remaing shares by 2012-14.

Volkswagen and heavily indebted Porsche ended a bitter feud last year by agreeing to merge by the end of 2011, in a move that would add the sports car producer to VW's then 10-strong stable of brands._


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

The Cueball said:


> :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho
> 
> Got to ask the question...but what bits?!?!?!
> 
> :lol:


Volkswagen is acquiring all automobile operations of PHS such as the wholesale and retail business, Porsche Informatik, Porsche Bank, Porsche Immobilien and Porsche Versicherung as well as PGA Motors headquartered in Paris

but :lol:

the deal for the merger between the two wont be completed till next year

which iirc hearing on the great vine porsche will develop certain aspects of what will end up in lambo? parts sharing fun :lol:


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> _I think that was the plan but porsche came unstuck and VW now hold a 50.1% share in Porsche with options on the remaing shares by 2012-14.
> 
> Volkswagen and heavily indebted Porsche ended a bitter feud last year by agreeing to merge by the end of 2011, in a move that would add the sports car producer to VW's then 10-strong stable of brands._


Is it not the Quatar holdings that have the 50%...

All gets a bit mucky and I guess it doesn't really matter! :lol:

I can see their new product line with the people they own...

A film (Miramax films), about a footballer (Everton, PSG), takes a car (VAG group) to the shops (Harrods)

:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

Percentage Shareholder name
32.2% Porsche Automobil Holding SE
23.3% Foreign institutional investors
16.4% Qatar Holding LLC
12.9% State of Lower Saxony
11.0% Private shareholders / others
2.9% German institutional investors
1.5% Porsche Holding GmbH, Salzburg

you cannot forget though when VAG bought bentley they thought they had both Bentley and Rolls :lol:


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

It's actually quite disturbing just how big some modern companies are, and the power that wealth brings.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> It's actually quite disturbing just how big some modern companies are, and the power that wealth brings.


It is.....the worst ones for me are actually the media companies...

Have a look into people like CBS corp, News Corp, Time Warner...

These companies own mostly every single tv, magazine, paper in the world... i.e. every bit of MEDIA that the masses get hit with......

And some people still think that the media is unbiased and free to publish what they want...


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## RisingPower (Sep 21, 2007)

Mick said:


> Old scirocco, corrado, mk1 golf gti, audi quattro (the rally one), all pretty interesting cars, with character.
> 
> Agreed though, the current lineup is quite dross.


Fair enough with those :thumb:


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

Oh eck you've got me looking for my soap box now...

I saw something little while back how they huge companies dodge huge amounts of tax as they label themselves "Tax Efficient". It basically means the scatter their money to the four winds,form country to country with different tax laws. Up-shot is their true tax worth is unfathomable. If you or I tried to dodge the tax man we'd be locked up. The blokes who work these fiddles are paid millions in bonuses have share options gilt pensions. Makes my blood boil.

The private sector screws Jo public for billions each year, but when Joe public says there pensions are being fiddled with there's media outrage. You have to worry who might be pulling the medias strings?

What really gets me going is the almost witch hunt mentality to find people who aren't working because they off il,l and get them working. At the moment there aren't enough jobs for able bodied folk let alone someone who has a disability. Yes there are people that milk the system, but there are more that need that little bit of help that the government provides.

But the biggie in my book is what about looking at recovering some of the billions and billions of public money that went into the banks. I've not heard so much as a sentence from any political party on doing that. Perhaps because they're all in the pockets of these companies.

Anyway, off for a dull, boring, relaxing drive in me Polo..


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> Oh eck you've got me looking for my soap box now...
> 
> I saw something little while back how they huge companies dodge huge amounts of tax as they label themselves "Tax Efficient". It basically means the scatter their money to the four winds,form country to country with different tax laws. Up-sot is their true tax worth is unfathomable. If you or I tried to dodge the tax man we'd be locked up. The blokes who worth these fiddles are paid millions in bonuses have share options gilt pensions. Make my blood boil.
> 
> ...


Part of my role is to make companies tax efficient...  Sorry! :lol:

I hear what you are saying though...companies like Vodafone and Deloittes have been let off with BILLIONS in tax payments by the the CON DEM muppets...

hmmm maybe something to do with the support from these companies, or the fact the top people in HMRC are linked and work very closely with Deloittes, who in turn are board members of Vodafone.......

It's all very, very immoral... and we, the tax payers feel the brunt of it...

:thumb:


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> Part of my role is to make companies tax efficient...  Sorry! :lol:
> 
> It's all very, very immoral... and we, the tax payers feel the brunt of it...
> 
> :thumb:


LOL.. you'll go to Volkwagen Hell for that, every car will be a brown Polo fox.

Yeah it's all very immoral, unless you're on a significant income you can't not be feeling the pinch. Vat 20%, Fuel duty, food, Gas, electricity.

I really noticed in the week, some friends took me out for a meal. We'd been there about 2 years back and you couldn't move. This time it was all but empty. I think it's a sign of the times, people just can't afford to go out like they did to have a meal and a drink.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

DampDog said:


> LOL.. you'll go to Volkwagen Hell for that, every car will be a brown Polo fox.
> 
> Yeah it's all very immoral, unless you're on a significant income you can't not be feeling the pinch. Vat 20%, Fuel duty, food, Gas, electricity.
> 
> I really noticed in the week, some friends took me out for a meal. We'd been there about 2 years back and you couldn't move. This time it was all but empty. I think it's a sign of the times, people just can't afford to go out like they did to have a meal and a drink.


Thanks very much :doublesho

I still see people out mind you...but as you say, it has changed.... seems to be lots of "pre loading" going on (drinking lots in the house) and this is leading to more drunks etc and causing the police/NHS more issues.....

Last meal I was out with mates...6 of us....was £60 per head.... not cheap, and tbh, not really worth it.....

The Swedish have it the right way around...everyone goes out sober, has a few drinks, then go home to get drunk....

:thumb:


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## TubbyTwo (Apr 14, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> This is not a personal dig at anyone on here, or your choice of cars - each to their own, and all the better for it.......
> 
> I have recently had the unfortunate pleasure of driving the following cars, all from the above group:
> 
> ...


I agree with you 100% My Seat LCR is the one car of all the ones I have owned that I hate the most. Its poorly built, dull to drive and just doesnt excite me. I went from 3 MR2 turbos all tuned and all of them were tracked and abused at the weekends, and not one broke, ever.

Since owning my LCR its been nothing but hassle, blows coil packs cabin leaks when it rains, engine note is just like a mechanical scream of pain. and to top it all off for a "hot hatch" it doesnt even have independant rear suspension or an LSD. Just some over powering, fun killing traction control system then even when its off it still kicks in.

Problem is every VAG car i have been in is the same. I wont buy one again, Parents have a brand new A4 TDi sport and the build quality and components are laughable, its been in and out of Audi to see their "master technicians" and they still have problems.

Give me an old car any day, one thats designed properly with soul, none of this drive by wire crap and over servoed brakes and steering.

Im the same as you been in loads of VAG motors and every single one, even the fast ones just all feel the same:

Bland, dull, no feeling of driver involvement and a general feeling of soul destroying boredom.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> Thanks very much :doublesho
> 
> I still see people out mind you...but as you say, it has changed.... seems to be lots of "pre loading" going on (drinking lots in the house) and this is leading to more drunks etc and causing the police/NHS more issues.....
> :thumb:


That's very true, loading up before you get out the door seams to be the way, young friend who is a bit of a beer monster to be honest, thinks nothing of have half a bottle of "Vodee" before going out.


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

Re VAG cars it's always a bit of a giggle to have a pop at any car or manufacturer. There's always the fore and against camp.

If you buy a car and it's reliable any you enjoys driving them it's great. It's one you buy that turns into a money pit that we all dread.Only ever had one of those and it was a FIAT X1/9 the blinkin think couldn't drive past a garage with coughing or a bit falling off... Never had a FIAT since.


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## TubbyTwo (Apr 14, 2011)

DampDog said:


> Re VAG cars it's always a bit of a giggle to have a pop at any car or manufacturer. There's always the fore and against camp.
> 
> If you buy a car and it's reliable any you enjoys driving them it's great. It's one you buy that turns into a money pit that we all dread.Only ever had one of those and it was a FIAT X1/9 the blinkin think couldn't drive past a garage with coughing or a bit falling off... Never had a FIAT since.


Very true, however after having a Passat TDi, Golf GTi, Golf Tdi and a Seat I think I will pass on every buying one ever again lol.


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## Rick_1138 (Jan 24, 2008)

I am in the lucky position of always running about in 10-15 year old japanese shyte boxes or mk3 golf era stuff so am used to hard plastic interiors that only about 80% of the switches worked 

So buying a modern Golf GTD is like buying a Rolls Royce in terms of fit and fixtures.

so i will love my golf 

Besides i like VAG cars, always have, though all my bad luck has been in Vag cars, so hopefully i can break that habit


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## stargazer (Aug 9, 2006)

robertdon777 said:


> erm cueball take a look here, my brother inlaw just purchased a motor from them:
> 
> www.4starclassics.co.uk
> 
> ...


Great website. Thanks for the link. Those cars are gorgeous! :thumb:


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## SteveyG (Apr 1, 2007)

DampDog said:


> Re VAG cars it's always a bit of a giggle to have a pop at any car or manufacturer. There's always the fore and against camp.
> 
> If you buy a car and it's reliable any you enjoys driving them it's great. It's one you buy that turns into a money pit that we all dread.Only ever had one of those and it was a FIAT X1/9 the blinkin think couldn't drive past a garage with coughing or a bit falling off... Never had a FIAT since.


I was reading an article in a magazine yesterday that mentioned 31% of VW Golfs built since 2001 needed expensive work doing on them every year averaging £650 a pop. Something like the 7th most unreliable car in the UK :doublesho The Audi A3 is supposed to be even more unreliable, and were always on watchdog.


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## Richf (Apr 26, 2008)

SteveyG said:


> I was reading an article in a magazine yesterday that mentioned 31% of VW Golfs built since 2001 needed expensive work doing on them every year averaging £650 a pop. Something like the 7th most unreliable car in the UK :doublesho The Audi A3 is supposed to be even more unreliable, and were always on watchdog.


Think that has more to do with VW dealers than the cars , the Skoda range shares many parts with VW but the cars seem to do much better in reliability stakes

Mind you our old Beetle V5 went into VW for a routine service they said it needed almost £800's worth of additional work , I got an independent garage to do the mot and required repairs and the total bill was £80 inc the mot most of what VW said was wrong with the car was simply made up the stuff that did need doing was overpriced by a factor of 10


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## DampDog (Apr 16, 2011)

Richf said:


> Think that has more to do with VW dealers than the cars , the Skoda range shares many parts with VW but the cars seem to do much better in reliability stakes
> 
> Mind you our old Beetle V5 went into VW for a routine service they said it needed almost £800's worth of additional work , I got an independent garage to do the mot and required repairs and the total bill was £80 inc the mot most of what VW said was wrong with the car was simply made up the stuff that did need doing was overpriced by a factor of 10


Couldn't agree more, I've had me Vdubs from a number of garages (Main Dealers) some have been great others have been clueless, boarderline robbers.

I was lucky to find a couple of great little independants locally. Votex in Congleton who are proper Vdub enthusiasts and very good. Also most recently PSI tuning, also seamed OK.


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