# How dangerous is bilt hamber snow foam?



## Raynkar (Dec 6, 2011)

I've always used autobrite direct magifoam as my snow foam and have had pretty good results with it. After reading up on this site I saw many posters recommend bilt hamber snow foam, so I thought I'd try some as it had good reviews and was a fair bit cheaper too.
A five litre bottle has arrived today but it has a safety section on the bottom of the label saying its corrosive to skin and eyes. The label says that gloves should be worn when using the snow neat (I'm guessing in its neat form).
Just how corrosive is this stuff? I've never had an issue with the magifoam and I do tend to spill things on a regular basis due to nerve damage in my hands. I've also had snow foam blow back onto me during some washes due to changing wind direction.
I also find it a bit odd that the product is corrosive enough that is says seek medical attention after contact, but is good for the cars body and wax coatings etc.

Any advice would be appreciated 

Edit: if ths stuff is corrosive to skin how dangerous is it to cats or dogs that may walk on any foam left on the floor after a wash?


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

I can't see BH being any more corrosive than Magifoam. But I could be wrong.


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## cufc1111 (Aug 20, 2014)

Isn't this something to do with new rules about what must go on labels for containers of chemicals? I read something about it on here a few weeks ago.


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## EliteCarCare (Aug 25, 2006)

It's actually safer than Magifoam in my opinion and after having used both.

The warning label is there for regulations, all chemicals are undergoing a change in classification so you'll see this on more and more products.

It's nothing to worry about, the product is perfectly safe. :thumb:

Alex


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## slim_boy_fat (Jun 23, 2006)

Just don't go drinking it......:lol:


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## Obi- Dan Karnubi (Jun 16, 2011)

Its not corrosive, that symbol also means dangerous to eyes, its part of the new regulations that have come in and every product in every sector has been effected. Even fairly liquid has these warning symbols. In its concentrated form these symbols count. If you pour the foam from the bottle into your eyes, it wont do you much good. These warnings however are totally void when diluted with water. Its just how things are going, my snow foam has the same labels, still ph neutral lsp safe mate. Don't worry.


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

It's an interesting question, I've never read the instructions and spilled it on my hands a number of times with no conceivable effect. As a casual weekend warrior I suspect the risk is minimal. 

The foam will be classed as dilute, it's 96% water if the right PIRatio. Straight out the bottle will be neat (obviously).

-------


The following is not directed at BH, but all companies who sell to consumers. The biggest danger in a modern over the top regulated CYA society is plastering everything in safety notices for miniscule risks. The majority of people don't read them and the remainder don't follow the guidelines as they are over the top for a non-risk 99.9% of the time.

Then the 0.1% of the time when there IS a risk the same approach is taken. There should be a scale of 1-10, or mild irritant to the majority of people, through long term exposure causes XXXX, to death.


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## svended (Oct 7, 2011)

It's just new nuisance labelling from the E.U. I bought some Envy Car Care FA and you'd think I bought super strength hydrochloric acid.


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## Raynkar (Dec 6, 2011)

Thanks for all the replies so far 

I don't have the safety data sheet as I've only just bought ths for the first time, but this is what it says on the bottle:

Contains ethoxylated alcohol
H318 causes serious eye damage
P101 if medical advice is needed have product container or label at hand
P102 keep out of reach of children
P280 wear protective gloves/eye protection
P305.P351.P338 IF IN EYES rinse cautiously with water for several minutes Remove contact lenses if present and easy to do Continue rinsing 
P310 immediately call a qualified first aider

(The random capital letters and lack of full stops are how it's printed)

What stands out for me is the 'wear gloves' part as I wouldn't want to risking burning dogs or cats paws during or after a wash. I have to admit that I can be fairly lax with H and S and don't even use gloves when using things like nitromors paint stripper.

I'll soon find out if it stings if spilt neat as my hands have damaged nerves and I spill everything lol.


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

If definitely does not sting in the slightest, it just feels like fairy liquid, pretty much the same as any other snow foam.

All that warning sound like normal advice for anything. Your pressure washer instructions probably say the same except for the H318 part.

Reinforcing it's benignity is the 'call a qualified 1st aider' part. No 1st aider in the land would know what to do about ethoxylated alcohol on the hand / eye other than washing it off.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Autofoam is safer and better for both you and your car, they are just being honest. Think what is happening all over the world with people using cheap and nasty chemicals that DONT get that information


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## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Matt, when will Artdeshine products have EU labels?


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## Raynkar (Dec 6, 2011)

Thanks for all the replies  I had a feel of the BH foam and yes it's just like washing up liquid to touch.
I got to try the bilt hamber stuff this afternoon, and the difference between the BH and magifoam is massive IMHO.
The BH foam will be used on the daily runabout from now on, or maybe just thrown in the bin, and I'll be ordering more magifoam for my own car.


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## sm81 (May 14, 2011)

Raynkar said:


> Thanks for all the replies  I had a feel of the BH foam and yes it's just like washing up liquid to touch.
> I got to try the bilt hamber stuff this afternoon, and the _difference between the BH and magifoam is massive IMHO._
> The BH foam will be used on the daily runabout from now on, or maybe just thrown in the bin, and I'll be ordering more magifoam for my own car.


In which way? Cleaning ability is most important think. Not how it looks.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Porta said:


> Matt, when will Artdeshine products have EU labels?


You will have to speak with the manufacturers, i have no weight there whatsoever 
I am too focused on making sure the packaging, labelling, lids etc are all future proofed on the products we are having made for our own brand. Making sure they comply with all the new and upcoming requirements. And also supplying all the respective ppe too. I can see why brands like autosmart and what was maxolen get upset with a lot of "manufacturers"


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## footfistart (Dec 2, 2013)

I think these labels are also there to cover their backside in case someone decides to try and make a claim. But like everyone else is saying the labels are changing. I have found this at work with sprays, grease and other bits have new labelling on them.


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

This is the problem with the new regulations - it is hard to differentiate between high surfactant products, which are actually pretty safe unless you get them into your eyes, and really extreme pH products which would burn the life out of you.

Unfortunately it is now important to read the text closely - that 'corrosive' symbol does NOT mean corrosive. It can mean anything from the product containing 3% of industrial surfactant right through to being neat hydrochloric acid/caustic soda. For an area like this, the hazard symbols are more likely to confuse than clarify. In the case of this product, based on the info posted, the product has an H318 code so this is a case of the product being a higher level eye irritant which would formerly have been an 'X'. As far as the recommendation for gloves is concerned, this is just good chemical practice. Unless a product is actually intended for skin contact and especially if you use it with any frequency, you should consider wearing gloves and goggles. This is no different from not letting cleaning chemicals dry on paint - it should be routine practice.

Overall, anyone who tells you not to worry about the safety info is, and I am sorry to be rude, an idiot. You just have to read the full information and pay it attention.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Always wear gloves, they are cheap and so no reason not too. 
Just had a H&S meeting covering gloves and its amazing the damage to skin that can occur when handling any sort of chemicals:thumb:


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

adjones said:


> This is the problem with the new regulations - it is hard to differentiate between high surfactant products, which are actually pretty safe unless you get them into your eyes, and really extreme pH products which would burn the life out of you.
> 
> Unfortunately it is now important to read the text closely - that 'corrosive' symbol does NOT mean corrosive. It can mean anything from the product containing 3% of industrial surfactant right through to being neat hydrochloric acid/caustic soda. For an area like this, the hazard symbols are more likely to confuse than clarify. In the case of this product, based on the info posted, the product has an H318 code so this is a case of the product being a higher level eye irritant which would formerly have been an 'X'. As far as the recommendation for gloves is concerned, this is just good chemical practice. Unless a product is actually intended for skin contact and especially if you use it with any frequency, you should consider wearing gloves and goggles. This is no different from not letting cleaning chemicals dry on paint - it should be routine practice.
> 
> Overall, anyone who tells you not to worry about the safety info is, and I am sorry to be rude, an idiot. You just have to read the full information and pay it attention.


This is the thing that has bothered me for a while, and something i try to cover with people who come to me for tuition. If a product is known to separate lacquer from paint, and you are told not to let it dry, and you already know it discolours trims, then its not too difficult to think you don't want it drying on your skin, you don't want to inhale, nor do you want it touching eyes etc. How hard is it to put on some gloves and a pair of safety glasses, you don't even look stupid given how they look now! But the amount of people who just don't think that way, they worry about their wheels and not their body lol


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

stangalang said:


> This is the thing that has bothered me for a while, and something i try to cover with people who come to me for tuition. *If a product is known to separate lacquer from paint, and you are told not to let it dry, and you already know it discolours trims, then its not too difficult to think you don't want it drying on your skin, you don't want to inhale, nor do you want it touching eyes etc.* How hard is it to put on some gloves and a pair of safety glasses, you don't even look stupid given how they look now! But the amount of people who just don't think that way, they worry about their wheels and not their body lol


What it does to trim or paint work is 100% irrelevant to what it does in your eye, stomach, skin or to fido. Tomato sauce would discolour trim....what's your point? Coke / lemon juice / vinegar could negatively effect a poor paint job.

Weed killer has no effect on my paint.......can I use it as an eye wash!?



Raynkar said:


> Thanks for all the replies  I had a feel of the BH foam and yes it's just like washing up liquid to touch.
> I got to try the bilt hamber stuff this afternoon, and the difference between the BH and magifoam is massive IMHO.
> The BH foam will be used on the daily runabout from now on, or maybe just thrown in the bin, and I'll be ordering more magifoam for my own car.


Magifoam goes on lovely and thick, and looks the part....but for cleaning ability AF beats it all day long!


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

Bero said:


> What it does to trim or paint work is 100% irrelevant to what it does in your eye, stomach, skin or to fido. Tomato sauce would discolour trim....what's your point? Coke / lemon juice / vinegar could negatively effect a poor paint job.
> 
> Weed killer has no effect on my paint.......can I use it as an eye wash!?


The point is to take a professional stance and generically avoid contact with chemicals where you can. Generally speaking, automotive chemicals are going to do more harm to your person than they are to paint work. Unless you are talking about fairy liquid, which we all know is harmless to your person but will make your paint melt...


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Bero said:


> What it does to trim or paint work is 100% irrelevant to what it does in your eye, stomach, skin or to fido. Tomato sauce would discolour trim....what's your point? Coke / lemon juice / vinegar could negatively effect a poor paint job.
> 
> Weed killer has no effect on my paint.......can I use it as an eye wash!?
> 
> Magifoam goes on lovely and thick, and looks the part....but for cleaning ability AF beats it all day long!


The point is if it damages paint and or trim, if letting it dry causes damage, if it's caustic and ruins trim, it's very likely going to damage you too. Would it be fair to say that damage to a car warrants a modicum of care to ones person?

Also coke is very bad for you both inside and out, and I wouldn't want to squirt lemon in my eye. Not wanting to start an argument, but is it safer to say if it's dangerous to paint its dangerous to you, or is it more sensible to say if it's dangerous to paint then it may not be dangerous to you so don't worry about it?

I guess for me from a manufacturers stand point it's a matter of professionalism and care, and from a users perspective it's a matter of common sense and self preservation. It's all important I think for us to all remain healthy. It's all we really have


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

magifoams good but never dissolves bh does id throw the magifoam away first or sell it on like i did


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## spursfan (Aug 4, 2009)

slim_boy_fat said:


> Just don't go drinking it......:lol:


Oooops!!


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## lemansblue92 (Aug 6, 2015)

chrisc said:


> magifoams good but never dissolves bh does id throw the magifoam away first or sell it on like i did


I take it you'd recommend bh auto foam over magifoam?


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

lemansblue92 said:


> I take it you'd recommend bh auto foam over magifoam?


yes problem with magifoam even when its on floor and you try to get rid it just creates even more foam which got annoying


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

stangalang said:


> The point is if it damages paint and or trim, if letting it dry causes damage, if it's caustic and ruins trim, it's very likely going to damage you too. Would it be fair to say that damage to a car warrants a modicum of care to ones person?
> 
> Also coke is very bad for you both inside and out, and I wouldn't want to squirt lemon in my eye. Not wanting to start an argument, *but is it safer to say if it's dangerous to paint its dangerous to you, or is it more sensible to say if it's dangerous to paint then it may not be dangerous to you so don't worry about it?*
> 
> I guess for me from a manufacturers stand point it's a matter of professionalism and care, and from a users perspective it's a matter of common sense and self preservation. It's all important I think for us to all remain healthy. It's all we really have


I think it's safest to presume what with two totally different substrates, one impermeable paint, plastic and metal is TOTALLY different to a living human with skin, blood streams, eyes and lungs that a chemical will have totally different safe exposure level.

Following your theory infers that something that if fine for paintwork will be fine for humans and this is certainly not true, and very dangerous to think.


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## lemansblue92 (Aug 6, 2015)

chrisc said:


> yes problem with magifoam even when its on floor and you try to get rid it just creates even more foam which got annoying


from what I've seen magifoam seems to foam up great but I could do without it lingering on the driveway all day. was close to getting one of the autobrite snow foam lance group buys with 500ml magi foam included but instead went for this option £20 cheaper and so far its performed great, 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pressure-Washer-Jet-Wash-Nilfisk-Alto-Compatible-Snow-Foam-Lance-500ml-Foam-HD-/131569484783?hash=item1ea22703ef&clk_rvr_id=883450782337&afsrc=1&rmvSB=true

only thing is once the white blizzard foam runs out iv got the option of using this but unsure if its ph neutral? 2 x 5 litre bottles from costco for £4 so i couldn't help myself lol 
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Holts-Simoniz-Pressure-Washer-Detergent/dp/B005BP7MWS


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

three main ones i have is achem carchem and bh all three are good


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Magnifoam is garbage from my experience. Smells crap, cleans crap and leaves foamy crap all over your drive for hours. Also way overpriced, which adds to your disappointment after you have used it.


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## sant (Mar 3, 2012)

Depends on what car and trim you are you sing it on


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Bero said:


> I think it's safest to presume what with two totally different substrates, one impermeable paint, plastic and metal is TOTALLY different to a living human with skin, blood streams, eyes and lungs that a chemical will have totally different safe exposure level.
> 
> Following your theory infers that something that if fine for paintwork will be fine for humans and this is certainly not true, and very dangerous to think.


No no, my point is its safest to assume ALL things are bad for us, and to avoid contact and inhalation of ANYTHING that attacks paint work and or trim. All be it two totally different surfaces, who cares! We only have one life is my honest view. I choose not to use for example a snow foam that eats fake chrome trim, as it damages trim. My assumption, right or wrong, is that if it ruins that trim its going to cause more damage to me. As a rule, surely we all agree this is safest, most sure fire way to use chemicals? Shoot, i still wear gloves and a mask when I'm polishing to be extra careful.


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