# Lighting again, Metal Halide



## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

After messing around with various halagons and other forms of lighting for using while correcting paintwork I've decided to go for Metal Halide as it seems the in thing.
My question though is would a 70W Metal Halide unit be OK ? I've got a chance of one for a good price but wondered if the wattage is OK. I guess the beauty of these is the crispness of light more than anything?


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

being an electrician to trade and having fited both i would reccomend the 150w ones as the light is a lot better. The light from a metal halide is just the same as a 3m sun gun.

I have a supplier for these lights at a very good price let me know if you are interested?


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## Sam08ST (Oct 27, 2007)

Ive looked into these too, was thinking of upgrading my halogens:

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/14558...ing/Site-Lights/Double-Tripod-Site-Light-240V

Would there be a benefit if i bought the Metal Halide bulbs for this?


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

ive not done a detail for a couple of weeks, but last time i did i had 3 double halogens running, was a hot day too, i nearly passed out with heat exhaustion :lol:

i want to try these too, been saying that for a while


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## German Taxi (Nov 6, 2007)

P4UL WRX said:


> being an electrician to trade and having fited both i would reccomend the 150w ones as the light is a lot better. The light from a metal halide is just the same as a 3m sun gun.
> 
> I have a supplier for these lights at a very good price let me know if you are interested?


Hello, I'd lke to know more about these too please.

Was thinking of 150w halogen 'on-a-stick' like this:

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/n...efview=lister&ts=1218397625880&isSearch=false

but not sure if it would be of any use as it's 150w


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

You will need the complete fitting as there is balasts that start the lights up and they take time to heat up, they are just the same as HID lights for your car but i would have to enquire regarding the lamps as i know the 3m sun gun lamp is 4700k. I am on the case i will also find out if i can get waterproof units.


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Paul - I'd be interested. I'm having a unit built at the mo, and am looking for lighting. I'm using three sets of halogens at the mo, but they are clunky being on tripods etc.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

i am on the case


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

P4UL WRX said:


> being an electrician to trade and having fited both i would reccomend the 150w ones as the light is a lot better. The light from a metal halide is just the same as a 3m sun gun.
> 
> I have a supplier for these lights at a very good price let me know if you are interested?


Would be interested in a price for the 150w but have now got a 70w unit due but it's only cost me a fiver brand new :thumb:
Same as this one, not for outdoor use but can rush it under cover if required, will try it out and see what it's like. The bulb is a tenner BTW, twice the cost of the unit:lol:

http://www.screwfix.com/search.do;j...=Robus+HID+Rectangular+Spotlight+70W&x=10&y=2

The bulb is rated at 4000k so would they be much different?


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

Got mine yesterday, 70w metal halide, excellent bit of kit !! Such a pure light and shows everything.
These are cheaper and cooler running than halogens too which is a bonus. Can't see that 150w is going to be much of an improvement TBH ?

The guy I got this from has a couple left, very cheap price compared to the screwfix link above. If anyone is interested I'm happy to pass on his contact details, it'll do him a favour clearing the last two and do someone a favour on here too :thumb:


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## kk1966 (Aug 8, 2007)

I would definitely recommend MH for the clarity and crispness of light that they give out.
The one thing that is hard to explain without actually experiencing it is the way they show the true colours of pearlescent paint. A car that is under only MH with no natural light will shimmer through the whole range of colours present in its make up.

Below is a photo i took during a detail on a Mystic Blue e46 M3 the other day which shows a combination of ceiling mounted MH and tripod mounted halogen. Spot which is which?










A couple of others showing MH only although these are taken on a camera phone


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

metal halide is the lighting that they use in car garage show rooms. I am going to get a 150w unit tomorrow and try it out and i will report back. I have a very good supplier so i should be able to offer these very cheap!


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

lighting comes in many different forms from cold to warm and the great thing with metal halide is that you can buy lamps to suit. A good page or describing lighting in KELVIN i.e 4700K is the output of a 3m sun gun check out this linkhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature

:thumb:


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## monzablue16v (Jan 24, 2008)

I'm interested in 2 70w halides if there are any about, been meaning to sort it out for ages


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## Bigpikle (May 21, 2007)

I have a MH spot mounted in place of 1 of the halogen spots on a double tripod - works great for lighting but I need to do beter at mounting it as its too heavy and bulky right now...


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## Chris_4536 (Sep 20, 2006)

Can you just replace the bulbs in a halogen worklight (500w currently) with MH bulbs?

Or do you need funky balasts and ignitors etc etc?


Cheers,

Chris


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

^^ I do believe you need ballasts


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## PJS (Aug 18, 2007)

Chris_4536 said:


> Can you just replace the bulbs in a halogen worklight (500w currently) with MH bulbs?
> 
> Or do you need funky balasts and ignitors etc etc?


Ballast required, just like for a car's Xenon headlights - both use a high voltage to strike the arc.


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

monzablue16v said:


> I'm interested in 2 70w halides if there are any about, been meaning to sort it out for ages


Hi mate, the guy only has a couple left and I've had pm's regarding these. If they don't take up the offer then I'll give you a shout and pass details on

Paul


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

I got my 150w unit today and put 10m of flex on it and it works great and the good thing about my unit is it has a base to sit on so i can have it free standing. The lamp i got with it is a white light and it doesn't specify the K rating so to make the unit better i need to use a different supplier.

corrected panel










i tried to get a good picture of the marks on the paint but i am not good at taking these pictures yet but the thing is that bright that it is hard to get a good picture. It honestly shows up everything on the paint i can't believe how well it works and there is no heat off the unit and is very cheap to run and a lot and i mean a lot brighter than a 500w halogen.



















if i get prices together for these units would u all be interested in just the lighting unit and lamp or do you want me to supply the light, lamp, flex 10m?? and plug and make it up complete ready for use?

Let me know what you would like and the more i buy the cheaper i get them and i will get them at a very good price:thumb:


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

That looks cracking mate. Probably best to check with mods, and see if we can get a proper group buy going. I don't see why there should be any probs, as non of the traders on here supply anything like this.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

do you think i should ask Dave KG about it. I might even get a chance to show him one this week as i don't stay far away from him.


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Well, he's not a mod, but could certainly give an informed opinion.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

i think he stays in dundee


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

who is a mod


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Pm Whizzer.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

i am just organising a meeting with dave kg to see what he thinks and then make a desicion


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## Glasgow_Gio (Mar 24, 2008)

i'm interested also.


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## PJS (Aug 18, 2007)

Whilst Dave's views and opinions are well received and respected, it doesn't matter what he thinks ultimately - Whizzer and Braso are the ones whom you'll still need to discuss with prior to putting up in the GB section, or answer to if you went ahead and posted it up.
As Paul points out, there shouldn't be any hassle.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

PJS said:


> Whilst Dave's views and opinions are well received and respected, it doesn't matter what he thinks ultimately - Whizzer and Braso are the ones whom you'll still need to discuss with prior to putting up in the GB section, or answer to if you went ahead and posted it up.
> As Paul points out, there shouldn't be any hassle.


OK mate i would just like someone's second opinion on the unit and as Dave kg is close to me then he might be able to see something i can't. I would like to get this spot on as i know i am onto something that will help many people out.


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## Chris_4536 (Sep 20, 2006)

I think the 150W is maybe a bit TOO bright! ..hurting my eyes just looking at the pics! :lol::lol:


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

Might be worth looking at the 70W too mate as mine is excellent, don't imagine that you would need much more wattage, still can't stare at the light as it's so bright.

BTW mine is fitted with a 4000k bulb, VERY white light :thumb:


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## Andy M (Apr 7, 2006)

What about buying an ebay HID kit and retrofitting one of the bulbs/ballasts into a halogen light reflector, buy a cheap 10A 240V-12V switch mode supply off ebay, and there you have it, cheap 4300K light.


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

any news on these units?


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

whats the unit actually look like?

have you got it on anything? as in a stand like halogens?


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

i'm guessing it's bulb upgrade for the work lights, that need a ballast like hids? so for a double worklight you could use 2x70w MH bulbs and a 150w ballast? what about just using the blueish natural light type bulbs?


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

ianFRST said:


> whats the unit actually look like?
> 
> have you got it on anything? as in a stand like halogens?


I will take a picture of the unit and post it up. As for the stand it is a lot heavier than the halogens so the stand would have to be heavy duty to withstand the weight. I am sure that people could use something to sit the light on as we should try and keep cost down.


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

come on then p4ul before i **** my pants............


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

3dr said:


> i'm guessing it's bulb upgrade for the work lights, that need a ballast like hids? so for a double worklight you could use 2x70w MH bulbs and a 150w ballast? what about just using the blueish natural light type bulbs?


You want to feel the weight of a ballast mega heavy that is where all the weight is.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

3dr said:


> come on then p4ul before i **** my pants............


I can supply nappies with the unit as well:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

The unit has an adjustable stand on the side for different angles


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

pm me the price?


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

3dr said:


> pm me the price?


I need to know if you want a flex on the light as well to it is RTU out of the box and how long people think the flex should be. Mine is 10m i think that it is enough


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

its getting dark outside and i am going to take a picture of the light on my house to show you how bright the unit is. Me being an electrician i love lights you want to see my electricity bill per month:doublesho


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

10-12m i reckon, same as a henry?


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

btw black flex would be preferable, could you pm a price without the flex?


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2008)

Have you dropped a PM to whizzer with details about GB yet?


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

matt1263 said:


> Have you dropped a PM to whizzer with details about GB yet?


yes and he said it shouldn't be a problem. I will have a deal by the end of the week as i am sorting the prices and options just now.


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

Excellent Paul. I will deffo be buying.


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## Buck (Jan 16, 2008)

I'm interested too!

Subscribed to this thread to make sure I don't miss out!! :thumb:


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

hmm, that looks huge. i dont want a light thats on the floor.

looks like the ones for sale on ebay, cant remember who posted a link to it.

ive been looking at these, they look a bit smaller, and maybe able to put them on a tripod?

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/89527...-Lighting/Robus-HID-Rectangular-Spotlight-70W


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## 3dr (Mar 1, 2008)

ianFRST said:


> hmm, that looks huge. i dont want a light thats on the floor.
> 
> looks like the ones for sale on ebay, cant remember who posted a link to it.
> 
> ...


far canal! :doublesho they are 53 sheets without the bulbs or ballasts!


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

ianFRST said:


> hmm, that looks huge. i dont want a light thats on the floor.
> 
> looks like the ones for sale on ebay, cant remember who posted a link to it.
> 
> ...


This is the one I got for a fiver brand new :thumb: plus £8 for the bulb


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## beardboy (Feb 12, 2006)

Paul - I've not read through the whole thread, but do you know of any pricing yet?

Thanks,

Mark


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

right i have been very busy over the last couple of days but i need to give you an idea of price so you know about cost.

I was detailing a car today and used the light for the first time and it worked a treat but i would have to say it has to be the 150W unit as i think that the 70W will be too dull.

There is a dilema on price as from the end of september start of october i will be able to get them cheaper. But hey ho here are my prices,

*150W metal halide unit with balast's and everthing 
150w metal halide lamp
10M black three core flex 1mm core's rated to 10A (I could get away with smaller but i fell you need a more robust cable)
Plug for end of cable with fuse.*

I will need to find out about carriage but i was thinking if i get an order for 10 i could do them for *£60+carriage with everything*. This is a price for the unit i would be getting at the end of september start of october if iwas suppling just now it would be £85+carriage.

I think that we should build up a list till then and see how we get on with it and see if i get a big enough order i can take the price down.

I did think about just supplying the lights but you would need a cable with it anyway and i can supply the cable to everyone cheaper than they can buy it.

Tell me what you think?


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## PJS (Aug 18, 2007)

Just an opinion - upgrade the flex to Arctic Flex (3183YAG), 1.5mm 3-core is sufficient for 16A use.


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

PJS said:


> Just an opinion - upgrade the flex to Arctic Flex (3183YAG), 1.5mm 3-core is sufficient for 16A use.


Well it's up to u but it is not required to have a cable that big but it would be to your advantage as the cable is super robust.

*The price would have to be £63+carriage*

:thumb:


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## PJS (Aug 18, 2007)

It's not the cable's size that I was getting at (pointing out the more common small size available generally, short of buying a 100m reel) but more the flexibility the cable provides.


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## cheezemonkhai (Jan 29, 2007)

Artic Flex is very good, If i was to buy I'd rather have that


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## tribs (Jun 18, 2007)

Paul

Before you waste too much time on this I thought I'd point out that there are units like this all over ebay without the flex but considerably cheaper. I don't know much about them so I could be missing something but I wouldn't want you to go to all this trouble to set up a group buy that falls flat on its face.

Tribs


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

Have you tried 70w ? Believe me it's bright Artic cable is a good idea, gonna get some for mine.


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## Glossmax (May 9, 2007)

ianFRST said:


> hmm, that looks huge. i dont want a light thats on the floor.
> 
> looks like the ones for sale on ebay, cant remember who posted a link to it.
> 
> ...


That's similar to what I use.
Works very well.


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## Planet Man (Apr 12, 2008)

Great Topic this, however whilst I think Metal Halaide has it's place in Lighting I cannot understand why it is better for this type of work. 

Halogen offers an economical ideal solution for Paint Correction, can be turned on and off with unlimited frequency as well as offering very cheap lamp replacement costs.

While Halide offers better lumens per watt efficiency it will still produce a fair amount of heat, cannot be turned on and off within the same start up time as Halogen and the Halide lamps will have their life shortend if the light fitting is moved while the light is on.

I have to say that Halogens do not like to be moved to much either however it is by far a cheaper lamp to replace.

In summary why re-invent the wheel?

It is a bit like choosing a tyre, if you are going to take your car on a track fit a Pirelli however if you are using your car for work/supermarket/school runs etc, how many people would fit the most expensive tyre on the market.

If you got money to burn go for the metal halide, if not stick with a product that does the job just fine.:thumb:


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

tribs said:


> Paul
> 
> Before you waste too much time on this I thought I'd point out that there are units like this all over ebay without the flex but considerably cheaper. I don't know much about them so I could be missing something but I wouldn't want you to go to all this trouble to set up a group buy that falls flat on its face.
> 
> Tribs


Please can you point this out to me?


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## Jakedoodles (Jan 16, 2006)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/150W-METAL-HA...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14


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## Ultimate Shine (Jun 3, 2008)

QUIXXMAN said:


> It is a bit like choosing a tyre, if you are going to take your car on a track fit a Pirelli however if you are using your car for work/supermarket/school runs etc, how many people would fit the most expensive tyre on the market.
> 
> If you got money to burn go for the metal halide, if not stick with a product that does the job just fine.:thumb:


I take your comments on board but as for the above statement if you are that worried about money on lights then why not buy asda price car wash for washing your car and using a sponge for washing. Also why not use halfords own brand polish for polishing your car????

When you are doing a detailing job on a car i feel that if you use the correct materials e.g good wax good polish, rotary machine or DA polisher and correct microfibre cloths then it makes your job easier and it gives a better finish. I must have invested £1500 in recent months buying and trying different equipment and materials to find the best set up and i have. I was looking into buying a 3m sun gun and as being an electrician i knew i could replicate this gun as a floodlight.

I also agree if you want a cost effective way of doing paint correction and you worry about the price of the replacement lamps e.g halogen £2-£3 or a metal halide £7-£10 then go for a halogen. If you want to make your job easier and you are willing to invest in your passion or job then go for metal halide.

In life you only get what you pay for and if people are only doing there own cars then halogen's but if you do it for more than your own car then halide all day long. If you have a garage then i would fit it out with metal halide. I am light daft and these are the coolest lights and give off the best light.


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## Guest (Aug 24, 2008)

My concern is not the cost of it, if it shows up the swirls, holograms etc better than the Halogen lamps I have at the moment then its worth the money, its mounting it at the right height.

Lets face it, they are heavy and the mounts for the halogen wont accept them.

I need them to be able to be adjustable, not sitting on the floor.


:thumb:


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

Been using my Metal Halide today, loads better than halogen and a fraction of the heat. 
It was on for hours, moved it aound a fair bit too without any problems. My halogen had a habit of blowing bulbs, as already said the metal halide bulbs are about £7 to £10 so not that bad.

I've spent months looking for a decent light, spent a fair bit on them too, wish I'd just gone to metal halide at the start though as they show everything on the paint so clearly.
Good point made earlier, I've spent loads on detailing gear and the twenty odd quid for metal halide was a steal that helps me achieve the perfect finish......no brainer really


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## tribs (Jun 18, 2007)

P4UL WRX said:


> Please can you point this out to me?





Wonderdetail said:


> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/150W-METAL-HA...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14


That is just one example. Go to ebay and search "metal halide floodlight". There are hundreds!


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2008)

Any news?


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