# payday loans



## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

interesting read, if you cant be bothered to read it all this was the most shocking bit

PS. One of the first responses on my facebook page to this blog was the following - which is exactly why I wrote it, "My 18year old daughter borrowed £76 from a payday lender she now owes £900…they make it too easy 4 kids 2 get in2 debt!! Should raise the age 2 at least 21!

the thread in total

http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/2...national-debt-over-14-trillion-after-7-years/


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

They want us in debt, it keeps all the money in public circulation as opposed to private (by this i mean the general public) bank accounts.

There is at last and end to Boom and Bust.


It's all Bust.

And, if the 18 year old wanted £76 so badly, why did her parents not help her? If she borrowed it to buy shoes, Then more fool her.


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## PaulN (Jan 17, 2008)

Its shocking. We have been talking about this in the office. Basically legal loan sharks....


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## Flair (Dec 11, 2010)

What's more shocking is the way idiots use it. Used correctly they can be usefull, I forget what one I use but I borrowed 50 to cover some stuff going out the Bank to avoid all the charges from the banks. But the one I was with gave you 48 hours to pay it back with no charges. So that's what I did paid it on the Friday when I got paid without it costing me a single penny.


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

justina3 said:


> "My 18year old daughter borrowed £76 from a payday lender she now owes £900…they make it too easy 4 kids 2 get in2 debt!! Should raise the age 2 at least 21!


Then get her put down for her stupidity.


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

PaulN said:


> Its shocking. We have been talking about this in the office. Basically legal loan sharks....


You see, I disagree - for reasons such as this:



Flair said:


> What's more shocking is the way idiots use it. Used correctly they can be usefull, I forget what one I use but I borrowed 50 to cover some stuff going out the Bank to avoid all the charges from the banks. But the one I was with gave you 48 hours to pay it back with no charges. So that's what I did paid it on the Friday when I got paid without it costing me a single penny.


I used to work for one of the big boys of the industry, and I'm sorry but there IS a place for them. With overdraft charges in many cases unreasonable at best, there is a valid case for a short, fixed term loan for when it hits the fan. As an example, I need to put two new tyres on my car next month, and I don't have the money to do it this month. If one goes pop, I'll consider one of these places (I probably could just about scrape it with my 'reserves', but for argument's sake let's say I couldn't) to help me bring that money forward for a week so that I can cover it.

To do so with one of my banks would incur a daily charge for my overdraft, and over two weeks would cost four times as much as the most competitive lender.

The problem is the petition half-way down the page. Education. We do not teach out children how to work money, yet our lives would be nothing without it. So many people now go to University 'because it's their right', racking up tens of thousands of pounds of debt, thinking nothing of it, getting excessive amounts to fund not just their course and accomodation but also laptops, cars, excessive alcohol consumption, not knowing or appreciating what impact it'll have later in life as they start earning - and then when they finally start paying it back they realise what a monumental challenge they face for, essentially, a jolly good ****-up with their mates and a bit of paper that they then realise is worthless because Media Studies degrees don't give you £50k jobs.


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

The best is when they borrow from one, like this, cant afford to pay it back - then borrow from wonga or something to pay it back!! Madness!

TBH i've been raised with if you cant afford it, save for it, and then buy it. And these are rules i follow - debt will only make life a misery - i'd rather do without than be in debt!

Bar my mortgage of course - i could never save that much lol


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## toomanycitroens (Jan 14, 2011)

davies20 said:


> The best is when they borrow from one, like this, cant afford to pay it back - then borrow from wonga or something to pay it back!! Madness!
> 
> TBH i've been raised with if you cant afford it, save for it, and then buy it. And these are rules i follow - debt will only make life a misery - i'd rather do without than be in debt!
> 
> Bar my mortgage of course - i could never save that much lol


I agree:thumb:
I bet our credit rating is pants though:lol::lol::lol:


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## dominic84 (Jan 27, 2007)

People always want to blame someone else, or have the Government do something to sort out their inability to solve their own problems/stupidity.

Time to get a grip!


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## PaulN (Jan 17, 2008)

OvlovMike said:


> You see, I disagree - for reasons such as this:
> 
> I used to work for one of the big boys of the industry, and I'm sorry but there IS a place for them. With overdraft charges in many cases unreasonable at best, there is a valid case for a short, fixed term loan for when it hits the fan. As an example, I need to put two new tyres on my car next month, and I don't have the money to do it this month. If one goes pop, I'll consider one of these places (I probably could just about scrape it with my 'reserves', but for argument's sake let's say I couldn't) to help me bring that money forward for a week so that I can cover it.
> 
> ...


Im sorry if this offends anyone but in my life ive always been taught budget and plan ahead. Im not talking having £5k in the bank just in case but someone at work needed petrol and for what ever reason our wages didnt go in the bank as early as normal and his card got refused.... Now there is no excuse for not having a £50 back up plan in your account or where ever.

This isnt a one day problem its a few years plus of bad budgeting resulting in not a spare penny at all.

They may have an old dear dancing around on the advert but its still a loan shark plain and simple. And im not saying every single bank is any better cause they will screw anyone in need too....

Ps im not bitter and have never been burnt, just dislike the way we are going here.


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

toomanycitroens said:


> I agree:thumb:
> I bet our credit rating is pants though:lol::lol::lol:


hahah! welll...I take out a credit card, 12month interest free for my insurance, pay it off monthly - saves putting interest in insurance companys pockets!

Boom - good credit rating!


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

PaulN said:


> Im sorry if this offends anyone but in my life ive always been taught budget and plan ahead. Im not talking having £5k in the bank just in case but someone at work needed petrol and for what ever reason our wages didnt go in the bank as early as normal and his card got refused.... Now there is no excuse for not having a £50 back up plan in your account or where ever.
> 
> This isnt a one day problem its a few years plus of bad budgeting resulting in not a spare penny at all.
> 
> ...


Try having anything in the bank when you've got an ex who has left you with £40k of debt plus a mortgage, and your partner has a sponging ex earning twice as much as both of us together yet 'isn't sure he can take on all the bills' and having enough for toilet paper to wipe your **** with at the end of the month.

Now, I'm glad there are a great many people on here who have happy lives which pan out the way they like, but there are a great many people now who get left high and dry and I consider myself to be doing well when I can have £300 left at the end of the month. Unfortunately, £300 is barely enough for a pair of tyres so I can't just go out and spend that and hope nothing else happens...

As above, not having a dig at you directly but it's all too easy to sit on the Holier-than-thou fence saying how easy it is to keep your house in order when you land yourself a perfect existence...


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## dominic84 (Jan 27, 2007)

> They may have an old dear dancing around on the advert but its still a *loan shark plain and simple*. And im not saying every single bank is any better cause they will screw anyone in need too....


I disagree, a loan shark, or illegal money lender will typically lend money without the borrower knowing what they're getting into. I.e. the 'shark' says how much they've paid back which may or may not be correct, adds on charges as s/he see's fit, and often backs all this up with physical menace or other intimidation.

So called pay day lenders are totally different, they operate within the law, all their charges are clearly available at the start, you know how much you're borrowing, how much you've paid back and what it will cost etc.

OK so the rates are high, but they don't force anyone to borrow. It's like cutting your hand on a power saw and then calling for them to be banned imo.


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

OvlovMike said:


> Try having anything in the bank when you've got an ex who has left you with £40k of debt plus a mortgage, and your partner has a sponging ex earning twice as much as both of us together yet 'isn't sure he can take on all the bills' and having enough for toilet paper to wipe your **** with at the end of the month.
> 
> Now, I'm glad there are a great many people on here who have happy lives which pan out the way they like, but there are a great many people now who get left high and dry and I consider myself to be doing well when I can have £300 left at the end of the month. Unfortunately, £300 is barely enough for a pair of tyres so I can't just go out and spend that and hope nothing else happens...
> 
> As above, not having a dig at you directly but it's all too easy to sit on the Holier-than-thou fence saying how easy it is to keep your house in order when you land yourself a perfect existence...


Sorry fella, they are very very difficult circumstances.

I feel sorry for you as you cant help your situtation, however we're talking about people who can - but insist on living beyond there means - borrow silly money from places as mentioned - then wonder why they cant pay it.

Cant afford it - dont buy it. meaning, luxeries there by the way!


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## DMH-01 (Mar 29, 2011)

OvlovMike said:


> As an example, I need to put two new tyres on my car next month, and I don't have the money to do it this month. If one goes pop, I'll consider one of these places (I probably could just about scrape it with my 'reserves', but for argument's sake let's say I couldn't) to help me bring that money forward for a week so that I can cover it.


Or why not have a 0% interest credit card for emergencies? I'd never use one of these short loan solutions and as mentioned I fully agree with this...



davies20 said:


> TBH i've been raised with if you cant afford it, save for it, and then buy it. And these are rules i follow - debt will only make life a misery - i'd rather do without than be in debt!
> 
> Bar my mortgage of course - i could never save that much lol


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

dominic84 said:


> I disagree, a loan shark, or illegal money lender will typically lend money without the borrower knowing what they're getting into. I.e. the 'shark' says how much they've paid back which may or may not be correct, adds on charges as s/he see's fit, and often backs all this up with physical menace or other intimidation.
> 
> So called pay day lenders are totally different, they operate within the law, all their charges are clearly available at the start, you know how much you're borrowing, how much you've paid back and what it will cost etc.
> 
> OK so the rates are high, but they don't force anyone to borrow. It's like cutting your hand on a power saw and then calling for them to be banned imo.


Yes and no, what the big fuss about is the companies offering people to not repay this month keep the money and the interest rate stays the same, what they don't say is the rate stays the same but it is calculated a totally different way whilst within the law the person gets trapped into a penalty rate of interest which is in the thousands of percent.

All in all very underhand


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## PaulN (Jan 17, 2008)

OvlovMike said:


> As above, not having a dig at you directly but it's all too easy to sit on the Holier-than-thou fence saying how easy it is to keep your house in order when you land yourself a perfect existence...


I know its not a dig directly but...

Just for the record I dont work full time whilst running a business just cause i enjoy the crack at work.

I understand debt, and i understand alot have it pushed on them, i just dont agree with this short term high interest fix.

Debt is not evil, a mortage is a good thing, £50 on payday.co.uk for trainers a week early isnt.

Cheers

PaulN


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

davies20 said:


> Sorry fella, they are very very difficult circumstances.
> 
> I feel sorry for you as you cant help your situtation, however we're talking about people who can - but insist on living beyond there means - borrow silly money from places as mentioned - then wonder why they cant pay it.
> 
> Cant afford it - dont buy it. meaning, luxeries there by the way!


I think we're talking about two different types of people, indeed - people who use it because they've been **** on (TV going bang - if it was going to cost me £30 to borrow the money to replace my TV, is that a bad thing? Ditto for more 'essential' stuff - washing machine, fridge, freezer, oven, hob etc) and then people who use it to buy a new pair of shoes a week early or two weeks early, then because they're irresponsible enough to do that they're usually irresponsible enough to 'forget' about it, spend all their money, then when the proverbial man comes a'knocking they have to borrow again.

My opinion is in a world where banks won't lend a penny or if they do, they charge through the nose, these places have their place. Unfortunately, they can't distinguish between those who 'need' it, and those who 'want' it.

0% cards are a good idea but these are finite in their interest-free period and also require a reasonable credit score to obtain. I'd walk it (I've got a better credit rating than the US government, FFS!) but there are a great many who come out of situations like mine much worse off...


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## tonz (Sep 21, 2008)

Flair said:


> What's more shocking is the way idiots use it. Used correctly they can be usefull, I forget what one I use but I borrowed 50 to cover some stuff going out the Bank to avoid all the charges from the banks. But the one I was with gave you 48 hours to pay it back with no charges. So that's what I did paid it on the Friday when I got paid without it costing me a single penny.


Even being paid back within 48 hours it would of cost something , they also have a basic setup charge before adding the daily interest , they don't hand out even £50 free of charge


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

PaulN said:


> Debt is not evil, a mortage is a good thing, £50 on payday.co.uk for trainers a week early isnt.


All I'm trying to say is that there are a great many people who turn to these places for perfectly legitimate reasons - for example, if I have a 'tight-belt' month, I could probably scrounge £500 at the end of it - if my 'work' computer spits it's guts, I've got to find in excess of a grand...

I can't do without that computer, so I'd have to do something!

There are people who may be able to scrounge £100 at the end of a month - they have 2 kids, their washing machine packs up 2 weeks before they get paid. They weren't expecting for the washing machine to pack up, and Currys want £170 for a new one. If they can scrounge £100 a month, they only need to borrow the money for a short period of time, pay a small (£10-20) fee for borrowing and not have to explain to the kids that they mustn't spill their lunch on their clothes for the next three weeks while mummy saves some money for a washing machine...


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

OvlovMike said:


> I think we're talking about two different types of people, indeed - people who use it because they've been **** on (TV going bang - if it was going to cost me £30 to borrow the money to replace my TV, is that a bad thing? Ditto for more 'essential' stuff - washing machine, fridge, freezer, oven, hob etc) and then people who use it to buy a new pair of shoes a week early or two weeks early, then because they're irresponsible enough to do that they're usually irresponsible enough to 'forget' about it, spend all their money, then when the proverbial man comes a'knocking they have to borrow again.
> 
> My opinion is in a world where banks won't lend a penny or if they do, they charge through the nose, these places have their place. Unfortunately, they can't distinguish between those who 'need' it, and those who 'want' it.
> 
> 0% cards are a good idea but these are finite in their interest-free period and also require a reasonable credit score to obtain. I'd walk it (I've got a better credit rating than the US government, FFS!) but there are a great many who come out of situations like mine much worse off...


Sorry mate i'm really confused lol (not hard hey!). I thought you were getting "touchy" because were slating them, but people like you who may NEED to use them need it - thus defending them.

sorry for any crossed wires fella - i wasnt having a dig at you.

I basically meant like i said above. People who buy non-essential items with loans, and then winge about people not helping them when there up the creek with £££ above there head - thats what annoys me!


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

Not getting touchy at all, I just think that society is looking to blame a business providing a service which is invaluable for many, because it didn't teach their children about money who then go and just borrow money for trivial sh*t and end up, up to their armpits in it.

At the end of the day, it's like porn sites, and Grand Theft Auto games. I thought GTA was hilarious, and at 16 I thought porn sites were fantastic. Now they're the work of the devil himself because 'they cause people to go out and rape and murder and steal cars'.

Last time I checked I'd only been accused of one of those and that was very quickly withdrawn - I certainly have never done any much like most of this forum!


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

I'd just like to say at this point - that i'm out!

This topic is getting whayyy to deep for me!


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## dominic84 (Jan 27, 2007)

> Yes and no, what the big fuss about is the companies offering people to not repay this month keep the money and the interest rate stays the same, what they don't say is the rate stays the same but it is calculated a totally different way whilst within the law the person gets trapped into a penalty rate of interest which is in the thousands of percent.
> 
> All in all very underhand


So they've basically failed to obtain all the facts, if they've been lied to then that it isn't very good, but I assume there must be a contract with these terms in.

Unfortunately, there are hundreds of things; warranties, holiday deals, time shares, insurance, investment products and even supermarket offers that may be potentially mis-sold, or that you need to fully understand exactly what you're going into.

It's buyer beware imo - always check the small print, do your research and don't be too trusting. At the end of the day if it all goes wrong, then you have no one to blame but yourself.

Adults need to be adult, we don't need the Government to be our parents, and act as a nation of children who need our whole existence to be wrapped in cotton wool and spoon-fed to us.


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

dominic84 said:


> Adults need to be adult, we don't need the Government to be our parents, and act as a nation of children who need our whole existence to be wrapped in cotton wool and spoon-fed to us.


Perfectly sums it up IMO.

Yes, Shock horror 4000% APR headline, but as is highlighted in the article this isn't the way to measure this (as a moneylender it's a legal requirement that they advertise this), as he says a pint (£3) for borrowing £20 off your mate for a week is more expensive than 4000% APR with Wonga...


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## Shug (Jul 13, 2007)

OvlovMike said:


> At the end of the day, it's like porn sites, and Grand Theft Auto games. I thought GTA was hilarious, and at 16 I thought porn sites were fantastic. Now they're the work of the devil himself because 'they cause people to go out and rape and murder and steal cars'.


On that sidenote, a study was done (I forget where, poss in a US state) and they concluded that greater access to porn lowered the incidence of rape.


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## OvlovMike (Jul 19, 2011)

Shug said:


> On that sidenote, a study was done (I forget where, poss in a US state) and they concluded that greater access to porn lowered the incidence of rape.


Awesome. I see a new porn site tag line:

"Saving women's lives since 'xx".


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## Shug (Jul 13, 2007)

OvlovMike said:


> Awesome. I see a new porn site tag line:
> 
> "Saving women's lives since 'xx".


I think you mean "Saving womens lives since 'xxx' "
I'll get me coat....


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

shug said:


> i think you mean "saving womens lives since 'xxx' "
> i'll get me coat....


leg-end!


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## Flair (Dec 11, 2010)

tonz said:


> Even being paid back within 48 hours it would of cost something , they also have a basic setup charge before adding the daily interest , they don't hand out even £50 free of charge


I didn't cost me nothing, and nerly all of them offer at least a 24 hr period. And they tell you this when call up, I was even told this by quick who I have used before too.
IIRC it was pay day uk who I had mine with, it was a while a good year or two ago IIRC so maybe i did pay there 66p intrest.

And simple scan through payday uks payday loan T&CS you have this too.

So you could take you payday loan out with them pay it back a week or so later when you paid and pay next to **** all for it.

Right of withdrawal

You have the right to withdraw from this agreement under section 66A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA) (without giving any reason). Your right of withdrawal will start on the day that the agreement is made and will end 14 days after that day.

If you wish to withdraw from the agreement, you must notify us by calling us on 0800 280 2544 or by writing to MEM Consumer Finance Ltd., PO Box 255, Bicester, Oxon. OX26 4ZU.

If you withdraw from the agreement, you will be required to repay to us the credit, and any accrued interest from the date the credit was provided to the date of repaying it, without delay and in any event within 30 days of the day after the day that you gave notice of your withdrawal. If after 30 days the credit and the interest have not been repaid we will debit those sums from the Debit Card.

The amount of interest payable per day is £0.66p


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