# Worst case of 'poor detailing' you've ever seen?



## funkysi (Mar 18, 2006)

I came across this on the US 300zx forum. Someone paid to have this done.

Not sure about you guys, but I think this is the worst attempt at rotary buffing I've ever seen.


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## DanSN117 (May 5, 2007)

Thats that Hologram affect paint, its all the rage in the US!

On a serious note, thats really shocking.


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## steveo3002 (Jan 30, 2006)

youd be hard pushed to get that bad if you tried


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## nick-a6 (Jun 9, 2007)

hope it didnt include the dent in the back quater. but that is some really bad holograming


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## Teabag (Dec 17, 2008)

lol.. looks like he has left the wax or polish residue on there...


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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

I work up in the city and you wouldn't believe the state of some of the flash cars you see driving round.

One of the worst I've seen was some guy posing away in his Saab convertible, roof down in the sun. The sun was the worst place for it to be, swirls galore. Actually made the car look silver in strong light.


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## Rickyboy (Oct 14, 2008)

At least the alloys look good!


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## M444 SRV (Sep 13, 2009)

*Oh heck, thats terrible, some serious compound has been used there!* :doublesho


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## mxb74 (Sep 25, 2009)

Jeeeeeeeeeees....

I'm hoping my brothers astra wont look like that seeing it will be my first guinea pig!


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## paddy328 (Mar 4, 2007)

thats a real skill to be able to get it to look that bad.


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## yetizone (Jun 25, 2008)

:doublesho

:lol: :lol:

That really is terrible - as Teabag says, it looks like wax or sealant residue still present!


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

steveo3002 said:


> youd be hard pushed to get that bad if you tried





Emerald Detailing said:


> thats a real skill to be able to get it to look that bad.


guys, that looks like some of my work, :wave:


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## d6dph (Mar 6, 2007)

And that's exactly why I haven't had the guts to try my kestrel da yet.


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## LiveWire88 (Sep 5, 2009)

Reminds me of my car!! 

Saving up my pennies for a paint correction next spring, wish I could do it myself!! :newbie:


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## gug54321 (Apr 30, 2008)

which pad did they finish on?

looks like 40grit to me lol, with a bit of muddy puddle to reduce sticking!


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## Mullins (Aug 7, 2009)

Surely he was not happy with the 'result' what was written about it???


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## [email protected] (Dec 21, 2008)

Found the culprit


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Yep a wool pad without any refinement stages would most definately cause this.

Come across this a lot after the cars visited the bodyshop and they have machined it.
Sad thing is it doesn't usually take much more than a couple of passes with a finishing polish to correct.


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Was that pic in the first post definitely an 'after' shot of the finished job?

Call me cynical, but I can't believe that's genuine and how it was presented to the owner. I know we occasionally see some shoddy jobs posted on here that people have found on other sites, but come on.


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Viper said:


> Was that pic in the first post definitely an 'after' shot of the finished job?
> 
> Call me cynical, but I can't believe that's genuine and how it was presented to the owner. I know we occasionally see some shoddy jobs posted on here that people have found on other sites, but come on.


You would hope not mate, the tyres have been dressed though and not so in the pic of the guy polishing, not conclusive but I would imagine it's one of the last jobs we all do in a detail?
The pics I posted up are how the car was given back to the customer after a re-spray.


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## notsosmall (Sep 13, 2008)

:lol: Wool pad explains it all :lol:


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## martyp (Oct 24, 2006)

Think they put a bit too much pressure when doing the rear panel! :lol:

Otherwise, yeah a fine job indeed! 
j/k.


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## funkysi (Mar 18, 2006)

Viper said:


> Was that pic in the first post definitely an 'after' shot of the finished job?
> 
> .


Oh trust me it was! I believe it's also been washed since! The owner's car was covered in scratches....he's happy that the scratches are no longer there and didn't seem to care about the swirl marks! There is no product on this car, just buffer trails! I have shots from other angles in indirect sunlight showing zero product on the paint.


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## lofty (Jun 19, 2007)

My neighbour has just bought a nearly new Peugeot 308,and beleive me it is worse than that,even my missus noticed it and thats saying something.I dont think he is bothered by it at all so I havn't mentioned it as I will get the job of putting it right.


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## Planet Man (Apr 12, 2008)

Holy Moly:doublesho


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

funkysi said:


> Oh trust me it was! I believe it's also been washed since! The owner's car was covered in scratches....he's happy that the scratches are no longer there and didn't seem to care about the swirl marks! There is no product on this car, just buffer trails! I have shots from other angles in indirect sunlight showing zero product on the paint.


Blimey, I am shocked then! Those scratches must have been horrific if he prefers that mess to how it was before!


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## funkysi (Mar 18, 2006)

Here you go. Proof!


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## dazzlers82 (May 8, 2007)

:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:doubleshoneed i say more


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## David (Apr 6, 2006)

Was it not the Americans that came up with the word detailing? :lol:


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## DE 1981 (Aug 17, 2007)

here a few from a detail i did ages back, i must stress these are before i started machining in case any smart ar$es ask.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

well i thought id share some of my work, Now what i want you to bear in mind is the following. 
i get paid £13 to do this per car. and if i do a car hologram free, they think i have just polished it. i valet for a living and detail for kicks :thumb:


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Err WTF ...


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## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

Is that a joke? I don't get it...


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

nope straight up :buffer:


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

maggi112 said:


> Is that a joke? I don't get it...


Glad it wasnt just me then!


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Lump said:


> nope straight up :buffer:


What kind of dealership asks for that?


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## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

Nanolex said:


> What kind of dealership asks for that?


VW apparently? Why would they ask for it. I still don't get what they asked for? They don't want it to look polished?


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Lump said:


> well i thought id share some of my work, Now what i want you to bear in mind is the following.
> i get paid £13 to do this per car. and if i do a car hologram free, they think i have just polished it. i valet for a living and detail for kicks :thumb:


Confused.:tumbleweed:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

maggi112 said:


> VW apparently? Why would they ask for it. I still don't get what they asked for? They don't want it to look polished?


I guess it "proves" that any work was done? We see this a lot and I guess some people might even think these "accents" are on the option list...


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

Nanolex said:


> What kind of dealership asks for that?


i work in defleet. the cars i get in have the most basic of cleans. and some have never been cleaned in 3 years since they were given out. i use neat acid for the wheels and to MOP i use wool head. as long as there is a shine to the car that is all they seam to car about. I can do up to 20ish machine polishes in a day. 
and these are the people who supply most of the exfleet cars. There understanding of a clean is no dirt. no one really cares about swirls or holograms in my business. One of the reps has a black Saab. he has it cleaned 2/3 times a week. the car is now grey where we wash it with dirty mitts and strong TFR. some times i get cross at the work i do. But its a job, and at the moment with how quite it is out there i have to be grateful to have work. and we all cant be detailers


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Lump said:


> i work in defleet. the cars i get in have the most basic of cleans. and some have never been cleaned in 3 years since they were given out. i use neat acid for the wheels and to MOP i use wool head. as long as there is a shine to the car that is all they seam to car about. I can do up to 20ish machine polishes in a day.
> and these are the people who supply most of the exfleet cars. There understanding of a clean is no dirt. no one really cares about swirls or holograms in my business. One of the reps has a black Saab. he has it cleaned 2/3 times a week. the car is now grey where we wash it with dirty mitts and strong TFR. some times i get cross at the work i do. But its a job, and at the moment with how quite it is out there i have to be grateful to have work. and we all cant be detailers


True words about the job... but have you ever told them? I mean if you do a one stage with a proper pad and some light polish you have much better results than that!? If you did a car porperly and show them the difference they should get the point?

And what about customer complaints?


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

Nanolex said:


> I guess it "proves" that any work was done?


yes pretty much, i have done a few cars where i have taken my time to get it right. and then i get asked if have machined it. where there are no holograms they assumed i have just hand polished it


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

Nanolex said:


> True words about the job... but have you ever told them? I mean if you do a one stage with a proper pad and some light polish you have much better results than that!? If you did a car porperly and show them the difference they should get the point?
> 
> And what about customer complaints?


this is the business im in, They wont pay for good chemicals or pads. a double sided wool pad i can get 60/100 cars done with 1 bottle of product. the money i earn to do it is just over a tenner after tax. they wont pay any more to get a half decent job. The customer :lol: are mostly 2nd hand car sales men. they will then take it and get it done better, but not much to go on to a fore court, then im guessing you guys will pick up the work where and when some one buys a car they care enough about to sort it. and the rest find there way here :thumb:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Lump said:


> this is the business im in, They wont pay for good chemicals or pads. a double sided wool pad i can get 60/100 cars done with 1 bottle of product. the money i earn to do it is just over a tenner after tax. they wont pay any more to get a half decent job. The customer :lol: are mostly 2nd hand car sales men. they will then take it and get it done better, but not much to go on to a fore court, then im guessing you guys will pick up the work where and when some one buys a car they care enough about to sort it. and the rest find there way here :thumb:


I get it... it's a shame though! Maybe you can get a customer base besides the job and quit some time to a full time pro detailer?! I guess it's pretty demotivation if you know you have to do something that you know isn't right...


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

i do some private work at home for cash, where i do 80/90% correction. and i do enjoy doing a car properly. and yes like so many on here i would much rather be doing detailing for a living. But there seams to already be a lot of you and from what i gather your all struggling like the rest of us. So maybe not the best time to go it alone


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Well we're not exactly a detailing business, we have a department that does detailing, but mainly for prepping the cars before they are coated... 

I know there are a lot of detailers in the UK - but IMO quality work will always find people that appreciate it... on the other hand I know how hard it is to establish services... we started to offer ours after 6 months of training at the beginning of this year and things are still not as they could be!


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## Mullins (Aug 7, 2009)

What a waste of a talent, im a carpenter by trade but will not put out anything other than my best no matter what the money. If the money is crap then ill look for something else, i get paid for what i do, so speed is important.

I understand what you are saying, but im sure that if you spoke to the right person explaining the pros and cons of doing a ****e job things could change? If the motors are going straight to dealers maybe the peeps you work for could offer a slightly better detailing job?

Whats the point of proving it been machined by leaving holos on it? So what if it was polished by hand, if they dont think its been machined chuck a cup of water over it and let it sheet off.

Your talent is wasted, find someone to appreciate it.


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

That just seems so illogical to me!


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

what's the point of selling a product to people who dont care. the vendor is only interested in disposal. the buyer only wants to make his mark up. and he is selling to joe public who also dont care. members on here care and we really are the only ones  
and why would i do over the odds. for that sort of money. its only as i now use this site i have learned the error of my ways. before i joined my work was the same it is now


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Wasnt a dig lump just seemsso odd! Especially when the dealers then "could" just go and get a detailer to correct it anyway


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## Guest (Oct 7, 2009)

Money.

£10 for Lump to do the car to what they want, £200 + for a detailer.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

matt1263 said:


> Money.
> 
> £10 for Lump to do the car to what they want, £200 + for a detailer.


its all money and numbers, and disposal of cars in the hundreds :thumb:


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## Guest (Oct 7, 2009)

And I see nothing wrong in what your doing.

They know no different, and your doing what they want.

And as you pointed out, if they care about the car, then it may just end up on here as a before/after detail.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

kingtheydon said:


> Wasnt a dig lump just seemsso odd! Especially when the dealers then "could" just go and get a detailer to correct it anyway





Lump said:


> its all money and numbers, and disposal of cars in the hundreds :thumb:


I agree with Lump here...why would the dealer care about getting a car looking spot on??

It's a bit of stock to turn over as quick as possible, at the best price...probably to people who don't give a s**t, and will take it to a car wash anyway...

No harm done to anyone....IMO...and a mans got to put food on the table somehow...

:thumb:


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## Perfection Detailing (Nov 3, 2007)

I'm in shock!!!


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

i really struggle some times to get them to shell out for the work i already do, if i said oh, im going to charge £200 i wouldn't get a single job :lol:


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Why would a dealer care?? Most dealers do care what they look like. I mean if I went to view a car that was like one that lump posted then I'd say "I like it but get the paint sorted".

So they would either say NO then I'd offer them £200 less then what they had it up for. I know of no-one I know that wouldn't think any different.

Like I said not a dig at lump more the logic.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

as i said the car will get another valet, before the fore court :thumb:


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

kingtheydon said:


> Why would a dealer care?? Most dealers do care what they look like. I mean if I went to view a car that was like one that lump posted then I'd say "I like it but get the paint sorted".
> 
> So they would either say NO then I'd offer them £200 less then what they had it up for. I know of no-one I know that wouldn't think any different.
> 
> Like I said not a dig at lump more the logic.


But *most* people don't care about their paint...that's why us on here are very,very, very much in the minority...

I agree, if I went to buy a car that looked like that, I would walk away, or get a big discount too.....

I would bet that 99% of people would not think anything of buying a car like that......

I have been to loads of garages (as I buy and sell cars part time) and TBH their cars are all minging!! even when they have been cleaned...but still good enough to sell to the masses........

I know you are not digging Lump, but you can't think or look at the situation through your eyes... need to look at it from the un-detailed eyes!

:thumb:

and I am not having a dig at you either BTW...

:thumb:


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## caledonia (Sep 13, 2008)

Lump said:


> i do some private work at home for cash, where i do 80/90% correction. and i do enjoy doing a car properly. and yes like so many on here i would much rather be doing detailing for a living. But there seams to already be a lot of you and from what i gather your all struggling like the rest of us. So maybe not the best time to go it alone


I for one can vouch for your private work m8. I have seen it. :thumb:
I also wish to point out to other members that you have done charity details on another forum, for members.

Must be a hell of a situation to be in Marc. But I know you pride yourself and the quality of your work. 
Gordon


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Lump, you're a brave man - admitting to polishing to that standard on here... the first reaction of many will be, I'm sure, how on earth can you do that to a car?!

But I understand where you are coming from here... Detailers, full-time, part-time, whatever... we are a luck bunch of guys who get people who are willing to pay us to utilise all of our skill base and turn out a perfect car. I am especially lucky, its just a part time business for me, so I can choose to only take on the cars where the owners are happy to let me spend as much time as I need to get the car looking perfect. 

But - a job is a job, and in today's climate, we dont go throwing these away! Paid a tenner, given an hour (max?) to polish a car, of course its going to look like that - but this is what you, and many others like you are paid to do, and like all employees in any job, you do what is in your job description and to the best of your ability. Polishing a whole car in an hour is a non-starter for me, but for many it is a job and there is not a lot you can do other than minimise the damage that will be caused. It is however a job, and while this may go against all our values here and what we preach on the forums, we should also remember (and respect!) that some folks are given a job to achieve a certain result in a certain time at a certain price, and dont have the luxury of a customer who will spend £££ and leave the car for two or three days.

Lump, I admire that you have admitted and posted your work - you'llcertainly have taken a few by surprise here, but its certainly something we can understand. Your honesty here is impressive. What for me is unforgiveable is if a detailer charged £300+ and turn out work like that, which I imagine also happens through lack of knowledge and experience.


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Oh I can see it from the sellers and dealers sides..cheap product for cheapo money. That's business ain't it. Maybe I am overlooking the fact a lot of people who but cars don't give a **** about them....but I'm yet to meet anyone who doesn't!!


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

kingtheydon said:


> Oh I can see it from the sellers and dealers sides..cheap product for cheapo money. That's business ain't it. Maybe I am overlooking the fact a lot of people who but cars don't give a **** about them....but I'm yet to meet anyone who doesn't!!


Lack of understanding plays a major role here for customers... wander round o few of our local car showrooms and the cars are covered in holograms, scratches etc... folk only see the shiny car though, the nice smelling interior and the shiny black tyres - thats it! Paint flaws, folk just dont seem to notice, so to that end why pay to have them fixed? Thats what a dealer will be thinking anyway, many of them probably dont even notice the difference!

Yes, we all care, but then we all know what we want and how a finish can look with hours, days spent on it. But we are a minority.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

caledonia said:


> I for one can vouch for your private work m8. I have seen it. :thumb:
> Gordon


thanks, means a lot :thumb:



Dave KG said:


> Lump, you're a brave man - admitting to polishing to that standard on here... the first reaction of many will be, I'm sure, how on earth can you do that to a car?!
> 
> But - a job is a job, and in today's climate, we dont go throwing these away! Paid a tenner, given an hour (max?)


thanks again, and depending on the car i can bang out average car 20 minutes, using a makita on dial 4/5 :lol: then i may get a white astra van, never been cleaned. and it may take me an hour or so. 
the ones hate are the new Audi and what is more the problem how they arrive to me. the lack of respect people have for company cars gets me down more than the work i do :thumb:


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

MAybe...then those are the type of people that buy these cars using a lona they saw advertised during Jeremy Kyle (which ends up at 2500% apr)...they then go on Jeremy Kyle to moan about the company that sold them the finance and also the dealer who sold them a "scratched car"


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Oh and Lump as said I wasnt having a dig or go at what you do


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

i know, but the work i do is a horror story on here. so i did now i would get slatted for it. but i have a thick skin. and the work i do when i put my heart in to it is what counts. :buffer:


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## egon (Apr 25, 2007)

Money, the root of all evil....still, keeps people like us busy doing what we enjoy....


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

I have to say I wholeheartedly agree with what Dave, Gordon and others have said, and I take my hat off to you for your honesty in posting this up on here. Respect for that, Lump :thumb:


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Lump said:


> i know, but the work i do is a horror story on here. so i did now i would get slatted for it. but i have a thick skin. and the work i do when i put my heart in to it is what counts. :buffer:


The work you do is misunderstood on here...

But down to brass tacks - you dont advertise the perfect finish for a tenner, do you? Thats not the point, you are making a car shiny for its new owner for a cheap price, thats what you have been asked to do... And I respect your job, I couldn't and wouldn't do it, but I respect it like I respect any person's job.

What I cannot stand is when a detailer leaves results like this and charges hundreds of pounds for it and claims to have left the perfect finish... this is unforgiveable. But its completely different from your situation, as a detailer has hundreds of pounds and a lot of time to spend and so should be doing a superb job.


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## Paintguy (Oct 31, 2005)

Nice one Lump!

As you know, I'm in a similar sector of the trade to you so face similar situations. Whereas your average member on here would class swirl marks or holograms as paint defects, for us it's more normal to get foot long key scratches or bonnets that have been used as a practice ground by Torvill & Dean, or the almost daily 'matt black' ex-rental Vauxhall's that have lived in a car wash. People here talk about 2 or 3 stage correction, but the norm for me is finishing down with Fast Cut Plus on a green cutting head. As long as the RDS are gone, and the car has some 'shine', everyone's happy.

Sure it makes me cringe when I see a car drive past our doors with swirl marks that stand out a mile, but I get paid for maximum noticeable correction in a minimum amount of time, so that's what they get. And to be honest, what's the point of doing a 'proper' correction when the car will go immediately through a brushed car wash, then into a valet bay where it'll be leathered off with an old chamois that's been lying around on the floor, then wiped over with some SRP on a dirty applicator and buffed with cheap mixed fibre rag.

Yes there is a tiny minority out there that want perfect paintwork (and why not), but the vast majority of folk just want their cars to look clean with no major scratches or defects.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

Paintguy said:


> Yes there is a tiny minority out there that want perfect paintwork (and why not), but the vast majority of folk just want their cars to look clean with no major scratches or defects.


yes we have had words before  and thank god they great unwashed masses dont understand, or we would be in the **** :thumb:

and to close on this. i have had three cars in this week. all have had major brillo pad cleaning. and for the love of what i do i will give this sort of car a better standard of work. and only because i enjoy it :thumb:

glad i have come out on here :lol::lol:


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## Richard (Feb 1, 2006)

Fair game to you Lump, like many of us we carry out our jobs with the equipment we have and the funds available with the bottom line of how much money there is in a job, and the same applies to the garage retailing those de-hired cars. They in general will use the product with the most fillers and then get the car off the lot as quickly as possible. 

I am now slowly starting to rectify the swirls that were not visible despite my thorough inspection for swirls they were well masked and only came through after about 4 washes....I dont have as much time to keep my cars sooper clean and waxed but I hate swirls and neglect but after running a company car for 6 years and seeing how all my colleagues cars looked compared to mine, and at least twice having other people ask for mine as I upgraded into new posts or mine came for de-hire to buy and then use for partner or resell.


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## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

Respect Lump for posting up.

I buy occasional cars from fleet auctions and most buyers only view pictures so they just want to see a clean car, decent camera and right light you can quite easily hide the holograms.

I have been to disposal places where they just use a yard brush to do the car, and dry with an old chammy, which usually ends up on the floor. 

This is a totally different world and yes I have done it as well, 30 cars a day at a dealer, did not machine them though, but washing was not the 2bm we are all used to. £5 a car they paid, so they were washed with a truck brush and dryed with a leaf blower and chammy. Had to do one in 10 mins to make it profitable.

But thats how I got my business going, dealer valeting first for a year or so then set up by myself doing valeting and learned correction and that was 4 years ago now.


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## Teabag (Dec 17, 2008)

how about this for a bad buffing which i had to sort out over 25 hours..




























rectified!


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## Frothey (Apr 30, 2007)

kingtheydon said:


> Maybe I am overlooking the fact a lot of people who but cars don't give a **** about them....but I'm yet to meet anyone who doesn't!!


Come to my place on a plate change, and I'll show you loads.......

We had a used car event where we had a load of ex-fleet stock, every car was like that and pretty much every one of them sold. can't think of anyone who commented about the paint, they probably thought it looked pretty!


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## Bigpikle (May 21, 2007)

Lump said:


> its all money and numbers, and disposal of cars in the hundreds :thumb:


thats the key - its what the business is all about.

I feel for you, as its a tough old job and clearly not something you want to do, but it is the job you're paid to do...


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

i tell you its a hard job, we don't have a valet bay to wash on, so with winter coming i am again not looking forward to it. id love to work in a nice work shop and do one maybe two cars a day. 
ah we can all dream eh  thanks for all the positive comments though guys mean loads. i didn't get as much of a hard time as i initially thought i would.


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## mattjonescardiff (Dec 12, 2006)

I understand if your a valeter and have to bang cars out at low quality, but why post this on Detailing World?


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

why post any thing, Mountain Bikes, Dogs where you went on holiday all appier here. 
Its about discussing a subject. and at the start of the thread it was about bad holograms. and i wanted to show how and why this sort of thing happens. its not a choice and more so high lights how lucky the people are on this forum to fully understand the paint on a car.


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

what polish do you use? :lol:

ive seen my local dealer do that on forecourt sales cars!! they use a wool pad and AS evo polish


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## OneJohnSheridan (Jun 29, 2006)

mattjonescardiff said:


> I understand if your a valeter and have to bang cars out at low quality, but why post this on Detailing World?


Why not? The honesty in this post adds more value to this site for me than another bog standard showroom post. Credit to Lump.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

ianFRST said:


> what polish do you use? :lol:
> 
> ive seen my local dealer do that on forecourt sales cars!! they use a wool pad and AS evo polish


Farecla Fast track made just for people like me. i mix it with the wax top product of theres. now that is a good product. gives a really great shine in seconds and does have a fantastic cut. i would think about using it on a detail. its water based, i do like using it


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## R32rob (Feb 26, 2008)

mattjonescardiff said:


> I understand if your a valeter and have to bang cars out at low quality, but why post this on Detailing World?


What Lump does during the day is a JOB as in no way attached to detailing, just as my day job is in no way attatched to detailing.

What Lump does in his own time is detailing, just as what I do in my own time is detailing.

At the end of the day a job is a job. :thumb:


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## jus (Aug 8, 2009)

Lump is a legend :thumb:


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## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

Lump said:


> yes pretty much, i have done a few cars where i have taken my time to get it right. and then i get asked if have machined it. where there are no holograms they assumed i have just hand polished it


Perfectly acceptable to me mate, your doing what your being told (and paid!) to do! If thats what they want and you give it to them you have aquitted yourself with honours:thumb:


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## d6dph (Mar 6, 2007)

R32rob has made the best explanation on this thread imo. We all share stuff from our daily lives and that is Lumps.


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## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

mattjonescardiff said:


> I understand if your a valeter and have to bang cars out at low quality, but why post this on Detailing World?


Snob attitude going on here. Why should Lump not post, it is not just a detailing site at the end of the day!!!!! Plus the way you say it it is as if you don't like valeters. I have seen enough weekend warriors turning out worse stuff as well.

What is wrong with valeters, we were all valeters one day. At the end of the day if it was not for the detailing term from the States we would be all Valeters.

And what is wrong with what Lump is doing, I have built my business on it and still do dealer washes if required. Yes I will wash a car with an old sponge and chammy it off. Why not, they are ex lease cars and going to the pound for sale, no one cares and I can add c£50k to my business a year plus employ a few guys.

When it comes to detailing it is a total different mater, but I learnt through valeting and I object to a DW supporter saying why should a Valeter post against a detailer- get a life.

Business is business and some cars will never get the attention that some (less than 2%) of cars on the road get here.

Why worry they will find a home and be happy, they don't all have to be happy to be swirl free.

My detailing side to the business is the total opposite, but not all car owners have over £500 to get the car perfect.


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## Mirror Finish Details (Aug 21, 2008)

OneJohnSheridan said:


> Why not? The honesty in this post adds more value to this site for me than another bog standard showroom post. Credit to Lump.


And me. :thumb:


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## Jordan (Dec 22, 2008)

lets be honest here guys, 

it's a car thats been mistreated it's entire life, and probably will end up being mistreated after the auction sale, washed with a sponge and some fairy liquid.

only the small minority of people, most on this site, would say oh god at it, the other 97% wont, they'll think **** it, its just a car, i'll get the local immigrants to wash it every second sunday, 

it's only his job, going by comments from dave and gordon, i think we can safely say he only keeps it in his job.


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## chunkytfg (Feb 1, 2009)

Mirror Finish said:


> Snob attitude going on here. Why should Lump not post, it is not just a detailing site at the end of the day!!!!! Plus the way you say it it is as if you don't like valeters. I have seen enough weekend warriors turning out worse stuff as well.
> 
> What is wrong with valeters, we were all valeters one day. At the end of the day if it was not for the detailing term from the States we would be all Valeters.
> 
> ...


It's posts like this that make me laugh tbh.

This thread has proved how snobish weekend warriors can be about detailing, and yet the ones who do it day in day out and charge huge sums of money for what is essentially washing a car are quite happy to admit to using an old sponge and chammy because sometimes that is all people want.

12 months ago i thought it was madness to pay more than a fiver to wash your car(2 tokens at a mates petrol station jet wash!) and even now i find it hard to imagine ever paying huge sums for a car to be detailed that is barely worth what the cost of the detail was. Back then if lump had inflicted that damage to my car but made it shine more than it did i would have been over the moon for a tenner and probably given a tip!

At the end of the day 'different strokes for different folks' I think sums it all up perfectly!!


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

Mirror Finish said:


> Snob attitude going on here. Why should Lump not post, it is not just a detailing site at the end of the day!!!!! Plus the way you say it it is as if you don't like valeters. I have seen enough weekend warriors turning out worse stuff as well.





chunkytfg said:


> It's posts like this that make me laugh tbh.
> 
> This thread has proved how snobish weekend warriors can be about detailing, and yet the ones who do it day in day out and charge huge sums of money for what is essentially washing a car are quite happy to admit to using an old sponge and chammy because sometimes that is all people want.
> !


and its also what is wrong with this site at times. i do love coming here as its a busy forum. But there are a few serious Detailing snobs and a few who make nasty spiteful comments. The weekend warriors is a good term. And this site gets talked about behind it back as a really ***** forum. the reason like some of the posts in this thread. some who take it very seriously, the new amongst us feel intimidated. this is why i have no showroom threads. 
I detail for fun. after a week wrecking cars i love nothing more than really taking my time and getting a car looking spot on. and then to post it in the Showroom and have some on rip your work apart. No thanks. 
the elitist attitude and the strive for absolute perfection is some times lost or wasted on those that are trying to have fun.

so lighten up guys and enjoy what you do :thumb:


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## Rilla (Apr 5, 2009)

I have to say, when i saw your first post lump, I thought WTF!!!.

But having read through tho WHOLE tread, fair play mate. You do exactly what your paid to do. How many of the 'pro' detailers on here would get a car in and say to the customer 'tell you what, you only want to spend 10 quid, but ill spend 2 days and 50 quids worth of products on it for you for a tenner'. I am guessing the answer is a big fat ZERO.

I also think you should slip a small business card into every car you do at your day job, and a small note saying if the new owner actually cares about the second most expensive purchase he will make (behind a house), then give you a ring and you will quote to get it looking nice!. Might make you a few extra pennies at the weekend and who knows, might even build up enough trade for you to be able to dump the bread and butter job I know you loath but need to pay the bills!.

Here here to Lump for his honesty.

*EDIT*
Just to say, if any of the 'pro' details have sat there and said 'I would' to my point, then I would like to book my car in ASAP! lol

just my 2p's worth


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## ianking (Jun 6, 2007)

Lump, fair play to you, everyone needs to make a living

Does the de-fleet place make you wool mop every car that comes in or just the dull, bad ones.
Surely there must be a couple cars that have been looked after a wee bit that dont need it and would look worse if they did get a mop with wool?

I used to work as a valeter at a local dealership for 4 years part time when I was at uni (now moved own to detailing as a hobby at weekends but valeting taught me well). We used to get 3 year lease cars handed back in VW, BMW, Audi etc and most were pretty bad, wheels never cleaned etc but there were the ocassional couple that were really well looked after and just needed a wee hand polish with SRP and a coat of megs 16 wax.


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

yep just the REALLY bad one  every 1/100 may have been looked after. and maybe 1/500 will have had a polish or if really lucky a coat of wax. the ones that do come in looks ok makes me easy money :thumb:


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Lump said:


> and its also what is wrong with this site at times. i do love coming here as its a busy forum. But there are a few serious Detailing snobs and a few who make nasty spiteful comments. The weekend warriors is a good term. And this site gets talked about behind it back as a really ***** forum. the reason like some of the posts in this thread. some who take it very seriously, the new amongst us feel intimidated. this is why i have no showroom threads.
> I detail for fun. after a week wrecking cars i love nothing more than really taking my time and getting a car looking spot on. *and then to post it in the Showroom and have some on rip your work apart. No thanks.*
> the elitist attitude and the strive for absolute perfection is some times lost or wasted on those that are trying to have fun.
> 
> so lighten up guys and enjoy what you do :thumb:


I can understand why you'd feel like that, but in all honesty I don't think that happens does it? It certainly never gets brought to our attention via a reported post (which is what should happen). 
I look at all the showroom threads on here in order to spot the rule breakers, and I can't recall anyone making derogatory comments about someone's work; constructive pointers yes, but nastiness? Not that I've seen.

I've said earlier on in this thread that I commend you for having the balls to post this in here, knowing the reaction you'd get, and I stand by that, but I really don't think DW has a reputation for being intimidating to newer members posting up their work, and if it does, it's unjustified imo.


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## Ross (Apr 25, 2007)

Fair play to Lump.I would bet that 99.99% of cars get washed using a grotty old sponge,one bucket and some fairy liquid so this means nothing to the joe public.Why do you think the Showroom Shine is so popular?


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## Lowiepete (Mar 29, 2009)

RosswithaOCD said:


> Why do you think the Showroom Shine is so popular?


Because, if it's used properly, it works very well! Showroom Shine is a modern
technology designed specifically for those who don't have access (by Law!)
to gallons and gallons of water to wash their car. You don't _have_ to believe
the telly-hype. That's aimed at the majority to get sales.

I have ONR for the light duty cleaning and GLSS for the heavier duty stuff, 
and over 6 months into ownership of my new car, you really got to look very
closely for swirls. I successfully use both with a bucketless wash method.

I agree that we are part of a tiny minority, but even within that group there
are those of us who have no choice but to use waterless or bucketless wash
technologies. For me, there's no turning back and life is _so_ much easier!

All credit to Lump! All we can do is to support him through his daily nightmare
and that we can give him strength and encouragement in finding solutions.

Regards,
Steve


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Lowiepete said:


> All credit to Lump! All we can do is to support him through his daily nightmare
> and that we can give him strength and encouragement in finding solutions.


....and to start posting up all his quality weekend work in the showroom!

:thumb:


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## Select Detailing (Feb 19, 2009)

*Lump*

Really respect the fact that you have come on here, and been so honest about what you do.

The fact you have guys on the site like Gordon that I respect and has vouched for your private work says a lot for a Pro Detailer to make a claim like this.

At the end of the day its work and for me, my Army Days were ,If i was told to jump I bloody well did it.

The comments you said about people on the site being stuck up, yes there are some with there heads so far up there they dont even see the sun shine.

Enjoy what you do, and I know for me, I wake up daily and am happy with the job I do.

All the best and it would be nice to see a private job that you have done, also nice one on the Charity Work, we are doing a big charity wash on the 24th for a Cancer Hospice.

All the Best

Regards

Gareth:thumb:


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## Lump (Nov 6, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> ....and to start posting up all his quality weekend work in the showroom!
> 
> :thumb:


ill do some pics on my next one :thumb:


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## karl_liverpool (Sep 25, 2008)

Well in lump for being the first with the balls to post up the daily job method.
we have all done work at that standard at some point. no matter who you are.
when its your boss saying do it like this, you cant argue. if he did he would be handed his p45. 1i used to shudder at some of the things i have seen in my past work, but as we all know we are a very small minority. we have quite a few dealership/rental firm valetors on here and i would bet at least 75% of you are given the same restriction lump is under. he is the first to post it, i think he should have a fearless badge on his name or something like that lol
i was lucky when i began, because i started out in a main dealership where they understood the look of the car makes the sale.

i now do both sides of the industry, the vast majority of my work is valeting work just the basic wash and hoovers. i employ some of the detailing knowledge which creates a better finish than doing it the handwash way.
but i do use some of the handwash methods to save time. im not ashamed to admit it. once you find a product that works for you. a car can be put through to good standards quickly. i had a new 09 plate bmw 6 series come to me a few weeks back less than 200 miles on clock. looked good but dirty when i first seen it but once washed the holograms and buffer trails popped out when i told the owner what it was he went straight back and kicked off.


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## ianFRST (Sep 19, 2006)

Mirror Finish said:


> I can add c£50k to my business a year plus employ a few guys.


really? think i need to go and sort some dealer contracts out then, ill be rich in no time :thumb:


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

I've read through this entire thread and enjoyed it, I find myself agreeing with the majority of posters on here and disagreeing with others, all of which makes DW what it is, thanks for your contributions Lump, :thumb:


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## gug54321 (Apr 30, 2008)

yep well done Lump, big balls but what makes a difference is you know its not right,

even in my job i do horror stories looking for dents especially this time of year i got to try to find small dents on wet forcourts and the quickest way for me to do this is the dreaded blade!!! but this is the quickest way for me to do this and as most of you know forcourt cars are in a terrible state, ive got to find the work and as i said i havnt got time to get my drying cloth out thats saved for my own car. And no my cars never get the blade lol!


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## jyrkiboy (Oct 4, 2007)

Bringing up an old tread.

This Aston came for interior cleaning and I just said WOW, perfect polishing  Yes I has been polished few days ago. And no, I am not going to polish it cause customer is happy the way it is now.


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## Neil M (Jan 28, 2007)

jyrkiboy said:


> Bringing up an old tread.
> 
> This Aston came for interior cleaning and I just said WOW, perfect polishing  Yes I has been polished few days ago. And no, I am not going to polish it cause customer is happy the way it is now.


I'd have wanted that corrected and polished/sealed/waxwd properly, but that's just me these days.

And I've read the whole thread and also applaud Lump for pointing out what happens in the dealer trade. I also spent 12 months hand washing with a grotty sponge, crappy chammy, back to black everywhere, a hoover and a crap mixed fibre duster for the interior. Not fun, but you do what you're paid for, not what you'd like to achieve.


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## jyrkiboy (Oct 4, 2007)

jyrkiboy said:


> Bringing up an old tread.
> 
> Yes I has been polished few days ago.


*What a typo I = it*
It wasn't me :lol:


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

bit of a pointless thread dig up...


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## beginner101 (Jan 19, 2010)

agreed...


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## Bungleaio (Jul 18, 2010)

-Kev- said:


> bit of a pointless thread dig up...


I don't think it is, it fits with the main vein of the original thread.

Fair enough to the owner of the Aston, he's nieve to the world of detailing and is proud of the finish of his newly polished motor.

I'm slightly jealous of him to be honest and I'll tell you why. The vast majority of the population wouldn't and don't see the difference between the finish on the Aston and the finish that a proper detailer can achieve. Since visiting here my eyes have been opened and I'm now aspiring to the perfect finish, it's costing me lots of time and lots of money. I know I appreciate the finish but I will never be able to enjoy the simple appearance of a clean car again, I know only ever see the flaws.


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## Leodhasach (Sep 15, 2008)

Bungleaio said:


> I don't think it is, it fits with the main vein of the original thread.
> 
> Fair enough to the owner of the Aston, he's nieve to the world of detailing and is proud of the finish of his newly polished motor.
> 
> I'm slightly jealous of him to be honest and I'll tell you why. The vast majority of the population wouldn't and don't see the difference between the finish on the Aston and the finish that a proper detailer can achieve. Since visiting here my eyes have been opened and I'm now aspiring to the perfect finish, it's costing me lots of time and lots of money. I know I appreciate the finish but I will never be able to enjoy the simple appearance of a clean car again, I know only ever see the flaws.


It's a bit of a double-edged sword eh?


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## Mr_Scisco (Oct 22, 2009)

Cracking thread that has indeed created a good basis of "chat" between detailers, pro's, valeters, "weekend warriors" & everybody else that's got 2p to throw in. Personally I think it's been one of the most interesting debates in this section for a while.

Big up to you Lump. I think you should post up some private work in the showroom. I was a little daunted at my first post post but I got some good comments, which was appreciated.


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## VinnyTGM (May 10, 2010)

Bungleaio said:


> I don't think it is, it fits with the main vein of the original thread.
> 
> Fair enough to the owner of the Aston, he's nieve to the world of detailing and is proud of the finish of his newly polished motor.
> 
> I'm slightly jealous of him to be honest and I'll tell you why. The vast majority of the population wouldn't and don't see the difference between the finish on the Aston and the finish that a proper detailer can achieve. Since visiting here my eyes have been opened and I'm now aspiring to the perfect finish, it's costing me lots of time and lots of money. I know I appreciate the finish but I will never be able to enjoy the simple appearance of a clean car again, I know only ever see the flaws.


Correct, I'm never happy with my car unless its completely spotless. It's too hard to just enjoy the bloody thing.


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## NovalutionGSi (Apr 19, 2010)

VinnyTGM said:


> Correct, I'm never happy with my car unless its completely spotless. It's too hard to just enjoy the bloody thing.


couldnt agree more! and its worse for me with the dreaded Vauxhall Flame Pink.... Errrr i mean Red.

Lump, as you say there are 1/500 "work" cars that are looked after, i dont clean cars for a living at all, i'm an electrical engineer along with another member on here (we work for the same company). We as a company have got 6 work horses as it were, 4 Astra vans, a Vectra and a Transit, there are all company paid for not leased.
The Transit and 2 of the Astras are a little over 6 months old on 10 plates and even though they are the companies no one respects them, the Transit within a week had been reversed into the building..... even though its got reversing sensors.......
and both the new Astras have marks on them, the one which i try to look after but a pool van anyone can drive as 2 lovely scratches on the tailgate that were not there when i handed it back..... which i've now been told to try and sort out as "I like a Challenge" according to the boss! (watch out for a Showroom post coming soon!)
Alot of people now a days dont have the respect for possesions (sp) and to me if you are given a company car, you should look after it, personally if a sale person turns up in a grubby car that they dont care about then their probably not going to care about thier customers.....

and top marks for stating what you do and how it makes you feel, i'm sure there are plenty more out there who dont like what they are allowed to do like you.:thumb:


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## Blue (Sep 15, 2008)

As has been said a few times Lump, most people will be more than happy with the finish that you deliver for a tenner.

A friend of mine bought herself a secondhand Tigra in black without me being there but after I had done her Clio (thread in showroom) to show her what detailing can achieve (got the paint free of swirls etc.). When she turned up at mine I was stunned to see the whole Tigra covered in huge buffer trails that she hadn't even noticed despite buying it in the sunlight.

When I worked in the dealership, each and every car, new and used was cleaned with the same dirty sponge and cloth, the wash water wasn't changed all day.

The fact is guys, no one cares about this sort of thing except us and a tiny minority of drivers in the UK.


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## SSB Ad (Jul 25, 2010)

how on earth has someone paid for that i mean that is horrendous!! even first timers would have a bit more sense than doing that and givin the car back looking like that surely


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## Jacktdi (Oct 21, 2010)

Fair play Lump, i used to work for a car dealership and I know how hard it is just to bang the car out as quick as possible, all the time I was wanting to take the car further, so it was a choice of spending all day on a car for £10 or getting through 5-6 cars for £50-£60 a day.


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## chrisw87 (Feb 6, 2011)

for big business money is money so if thats what the dealer wants, even after showing them the greener side of the hill, why waste your time? At least that way he is getting a wage  And I do sympathise, on our fleet if a car comes back excessively soiled it gets a quick pressure blast, sprayed with some G101, and scrubbed using wash brooms using AS carnauba wash before being run through a belt washer... fun stuff O_O

Even before joining this site, I was a tad bit of a perfectionist when it came to car finishes, so even though the paint doesn't really matter on a rental car, having to see that car being delivered to a customer, even if its only for a few hours, makes me feel sad. 95% of them couldn't care, and just go "WOW! clean" but there is that 5% of them that do go "WTF" basically.

edit: Sorry >.< I must have left my search window open and accidentally re-hashed an ancient thread.


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Don't worry about ancient threads, they are always a great read. Especially when you get to see which products everyone was raving on about years ago!


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## robtech (Jan 17, 2011)

wow.....lol i actually see stuff like this all the time esp on car dealers forecourts esp a mr Arnold ---ks not as extreme but often bady polished ,ive also seen a lot of car dealers just spray everything with silicone..


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## Planet Man (Apr 12, 2008)

Gutsy call to fess up to that Lump and from your insight I totally understand your situation:thumb:

It is very similar in the bodyshop game. We have a guy just around the corner from me, you cannot fault his paint skills at all. But what lets the job down is when he gets the rotary out and gives the finished paint the once over with G3. 

He needs to get the cars out of the shop once they are finished and get the next one in. Time is so tight he cannot refine the finish with more pads and polish and most of his customers both private and trade go away happy.

He need to do the numbers to make it pay:thumb:

From the posts I have seen on DW many bodyshops operate in the same way. Thankfully not all:thumb:


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## Hondahead1991 (Feb 19, 2011)

M444 SRV said:


> *Oh heck, thats terrible, some serious compound has been used there!* :doublesho


Lol I agree!


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## chrisw87 (Feb 6, 2011)

robtech said:


> wow.....lol i actually see stuff like this all the time esp on car dealers forecourts esp a mr Arnold ---ks not as extreme but often bady polished ,ive also seen a lot of car dealers just spray everything with silicone..


When I had bought a '92 Honda Prelude from a dealer once, that was the case, I think he used 10L of the stuff! every part of the engine bay, every black plastic, even the damn shocks were covered in silicon spray, I'm suprised I didn't slide out of the car when i tried to sit down.


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