# What characteristic do you rate highest?



## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Hi guys and gals!

As you all know we always try to improve our products and there is something I have been thinking of for quite some time - which characteristic do you rate highest when it comes to an LSP?

We used former input (mainly from DW) and introduced both the NanoWax and the Spray Sealant based on it - both for super-easy application, NanoWax that also refreshes the paint and Spray for fast, can't-do-anything wrong application and wax-like, smooth surface...

I'm looking forward to seeing the results of the poll, participation is much appreciated!

Cheers,

Florian


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## beany_bot (Oct 6, 2008)

Gloss all the way, protection is important too but I can re-apply wax once a week if I have to. I want the car looking the best (glossiest) I can.

1. Gloss
2. Ease of application
3. Durability
4. easy to clean
5. Beading


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## Reflectology (Jul 29, 2009)

protection for me, although appearance comes a close 2nd, ease of clean then ease of application, although ease of application could be very useful the ulterior motive for detailing is protection


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## beany_bot (Oct 6, 2008)

who acutally cares about beading? i mean....its just not important? lol


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## Eddy (Apr 13, 2008)

beany_bot said:


> 1. Gloss
> 2. Ease of application
> 3. Durability
> 4. easy to clean
> 5. Beading


Thats my order of preference too :thumb:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

One thing I forgot though is durability 

Would you say durability is a big issue? TBH my experience on DW was that it's actually not so much since most people see it more as a hobby and don't mind reapplying frequently...


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

If you are after our idea of LSP utopia, mine would be an LSP that lasts a really long time, repels everything when cured and looks really glassy too.

Know anyone that does one? :lol::lol::lol:

In all seriousness, i only get to give the car a thorough clean about once a month. So durability is important to me. But, i really like the surface to be hydrophobic. Not so much for the beading but for the dirt not sticking or being flushed away with a sheet of water. Filling swirls would also be a big bonus.



Nanolex said:


> TBH my experience on DW was that it's actually not so much since most people see it more as a hobby and don't mind reapplying frequently...


I clean the car because i like it clean not because i like cleaning (more time for my guitar :lol. If you can reduce my need to clean as much as possible while making it shiny, i'm in.

I'm a sealant fan anyway.


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## Ballistic (Jan 4, 2010)

beany_bot said:


> Gloss all the way, protection is important too but I can re-apply wax once a week if I have to. I want the car looking the best (glossiest) I can.
> 
> 1. Gloss
> 2. Ease of application
> ...


+1 for me. I bought blackfire products to have my phantom black A5 looking as glossy or wet as possible. The car is currently on a wet diamond routine, but I may switch to a wet-ice over fire routine towards summer.


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## Michael172 (Jun 9, 2007)

Id say Protection. However, as a paintwork LSP im more concerned about the looks and durability. best of show does this for me, sheets well after 4 months of washing and provides a wet finish which lasts. The car is easier to wash and far easier to dry.

I will be applying nanolex pro wheel sealant to my wheels this weekend - I hope. I will also provide a report on how it went, and also how durable it is, which in turn should clear a few things up a bit as some people seem to have problems with it.


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## DiscoDriver (Oct 27, 2009)

For me it has to be:

1. Gloss
2. Easy-to-Clean
3. Protection
4. Easy application
5. Beading

I think looks are very important and, as has already been said, given I apply a new coat of wax every other week, Durability/Protection isn't all important. Beading comes from the kind of constituents used, so isn't a requirement for me on its own. I've never had any problem with application with any of the many products I've used, so again it isn't a big deal. Being easy to clean is important, however, since I'll be out there washing the car each weekend :thumb:


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## DiscoDriver (Oct 27, 2009)

Jeez, just realised I was reiterating exactly what Beany_bot had :wall:

Would have been quicker to just agree!


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## Michael172 (Jun 9, 2007)

beany_bot said:


> who acutally cares about beading? i mean....its just not important? lol


I couldnt give a **** mate ! As long as it sheets well i dont care


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## amiller (Jan 1, 2009)

That's what I was thinking just the other day! 

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=150385

Ease of clean and gloss for me! :thumb:


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Given I get the looks I am after from the preparation, not from the LSP, protection is always my priority.


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Michael172 said:


> I couldnt give a **** mate ! As long as it sheets well i dont care


Beading and sheeting are intrisically linked. They are both a result of the water repellancy of a surface - a highly water repellant surface will both bead tightly and sheet quickly, a lower repellancy will have larger beads and slower sheeting. It is not the case, as is often misconstrued, that products that sheet well do not bead well and vice versa. Simply it is how the water strikes the pabel - lots of little droplets of small volume will bead as the water is repelled so forms up in a little bead - the greater the repellancy the smaller and tighter the bead (contact angles). The higher the volume of water (a steady stream from a hoze), the more the water will sheet as its large volume that spreads and is sheeted off the panel by the same water repellancy. So if you want sheeting, you'll need beading


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## Michael172 (Jun 9, 2007)

Dave KG said:


> Beading and sheeting are intrisically linked. They are both a result of the water repellancy of a surface - a highly water repellant surface will both bead tightly and sheet quickly, a lower repellancy will have larger beads and slower sheeting. It is not the case, as is often misconstrued, that products that sheet well do not bead well and vice versa. Simply it is how the water strikes the pabel - lots of little droplets of small volume will bead as the water is repelled so forms up in a little bead - the greater the repellancy the smaller and tighter the bead (contact angles). The higher the volume of water (a steady stream from a hoze), the more the water will sheet as its large volume that spreads and is sheeted off the panel by the same water repellancy. So if you want sheeting, you'll need beading




Lol. Cheers bud. BOS still beads but not like it did to begin with. Its not curently on my car so i dont often see it beading.


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Gruffs said:


> If you are after our idea of LSP utopia, mine would be an LSP that lasts a really long time, repels everything when cured and looks really glassy too.
> 
> Know anyone that does one? :lol::lol::lol:
> 
> ...


Sounds like the Premium Paint Sealant to me


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## Gruffs (Dec 10, 2007)

Nanolex said:


> Sounds like the Premium Paint Sealant to me


Yes.

If only i had the time to fully correct the car (or the money to pay someone) it would be the way to go (along with other such coatings).

But, as Dave KG says. the prep is everything for a great finish. Unless you can come up with a conformal coating for paint that fills the swirls and then dries. Bit hard on vertical surfaces though i guess.


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## alxg (May 3, 2009)

^ or Zaino.....easy now Florian......:lol:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

alxg said:


> ^ or Zaino.....easy now Florian......:lol:


their system is also definitely a good way to protect your car, no doubt about that 

oh and Michael, you'll be fine with the Pro, it's actually the Premium that some customers were fighting with... if you use the Premium, make sure to read the (revised ) Directions For Use...


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## GS4_Fiend (Jan 11, 2010)

Dave KG said:


> Beading and sheeting are intrisically linked. They are both a result of the water repellancy of a surface - a highly water repellant surface will both bead tightly and sheet quickly, a lower repellancy will have larger beads and slower sheeting. It is not the case, as is often misconstrued, that products that sheet well do not bead well and vice versa. Simply it is how the water strikes the pabel - lots of little droplets of small volume will bead as the water is repelled so forms up in a little bead - the greater the repellancy the smaller and tighter the bead (contact angles). The higher the volume of water (a steady stream from a hoze), the more the water will sheet as its large volume that spreads and is sheeted off the panel by the same water repellancy. So if you want sheeting, you'll need beading


OMG! Thank you Sir for this! I needed to know that.


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## supercharged (Feb 1, 2008)

Beading
Gloss
Easy-to-Clean
Protection
Application

If a sealant lasts, I don't care that it could be as difficult as a super glue to apply/remove...given Klasse SG for example, difficult application, but it laaaaaaaaasts...


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

It's really interesting to see how protection and gloss peak out! 

What would you guys say what is the most important for Mr. Joe Average? IMO it's the easy to clean surface and the durability...


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## damocell (Mar 28, 2007)

for me it's:

1, Beading
2, Gloss
3, Easy Application
4, Protection
5, Easy to Clean Surface

I don't mind if I have to reapply often but beading and gloss are the most important to me with beading being just ahead in importance.

Damo


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## martyp (Oct 24, 2006)

1. Gloss
2. easy to clean
3. Durability
4. Beading
5. Ease of application


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Nanolex said:


> It's really interesting to see how protection and gloss peak out!
> 
> What would you guys say what is the most important for Mr. Joe Average? IMO it's the easy to clean surface and the durability...


Its not surprising... there is still, in my humble opinion of course, a common misconception that LSPs can deliver dramiatically to the looks over and above what proper preparation can offer. Joe Average believes his car will look great after a "good polishing"  But for some, the LSP is just not there to offer any looks at all, it is there to protect our hard work from previous efforts.

If you are trying to market to Mr. Joe. Average though, then something to enhance the looks will go down well I'm sure, I would say other cosmetic effects such as beading would be important as this is something else you can see... But durabillity for me will always be king.


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

ease of application for me. nothing is added to the finish imo by an LSP that the prep does'nt


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## organgrinder (Jan 20, 2008)

1. Durability
2. Ease of Application
3. Beading
4. Gloss
5. Easy to clean

Protection is No. 1 for me because I don't always get the time to put an LSP on every week or two, ease of application next because it makes the job so much more enjoyable when you work with a good product and beading next because I just love the look of tight beading. Gloss is important but I would say that depends more on my preparation than the LSP and the differences I have found between LSPs in ease of cleaning are fairly small so it comes last.


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

organgrinder said:


> 1. Durability
> 2. Ease of Application
> 3. Beading
> 4. Gloss
> ...


if you apply a sealant or wax every week or two then you'd be wasting time and product. no need to reapply for a good six to eight weeks or so


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## organgrinder (Jan 20, 2008)

-Kev- said:


> if you apply a sealant or wax every week or two then you'd be wasting time and product. no need to reapply for a good six to eight weeks or so


I thought that most of us wasted product by applying LSP more often than required.

However this winter my multiple layers of Z2 topped with 3 or 4 layers of Werkstat Jett didn't last the 2 months I couldn't wash my car.

I would rather apply LSP more aften than required to make sure that I have the maximum protection at all times. With the acidic seagull dropping season starting in about 2 months I want as many layers of protection on as possible.


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

organgrinder said:


> I thought that most of us wasted product by applying LSP more often than required.
> 
> However this winter my multiple layers of Z2 topped with 3 or 4 layers of Werkstat Jett didn't last the 2 months I couldn't wash my car.
> 
> I would rather apply LSP more aften than required to make sure that I have the maximum protection at all times. With the acidic seagull dropping season starting in about 2 months I want as many layers of protection on as possible.


some peeople might, but i can't see the point. its been mentioned more than once on here that several layers of any given LSP could start removing the layers under it. applied one layer of z2 myself on a clio back in october, owner had washed the car every so often with megs shampoo and some of the panels were still sheeting/beading fairly well when i cleaned it last weekend.


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## Edward101 (Jun 5, 2009)

For me;

Gloss
Easy to clean
Protection
then beading


maybe beading even last if I was using the product in the sumer as then I can re apply anytime :thumb:


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## Guest (Jan 23, 2010)

First choice is easy application, why? If durability is terrible and it's easy to apply it wont take long to do a coat once a month or even once a week if need be.
Protection, this is what a wax is for.Nothing else IMO.
Durability, this comes lower down in my priority list as if its easy to apply I don't mind using it regularly.

Everything else can go :lol:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

-Kev- said:


> ... its been mentioned more than once on here that several layers of any given LSP could start removing the layers under it...


That's definitely possible - and mostly due to the solvents in the sealant fluids. Most chemical systems are solvent based (the solvent's keep the individual particles from reacting with each other in the bottle), which means if you re-apply you basically re-solve the particles of the previous layers and damage/remove them. 
This is why we made clear from the beginning that it is a waste of product and time to layer the Premium and Professional Paint Sealants...


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Nanolex said:


> One thing I forgot though is durability
> 
> Would you say durability is a big issue? TBH my experience on DW was that it's actually not so much since most people see it more as a hobby and don't mind reapplying frequently...


It's not a big issue , well not for me, if something comes in a large container is for personal use and claims to last ages ,then I would question why so much quantity is required? If it is claimed to have good looks then it does not need to have supplimentary Qds and after waxes . Of course it has to look good, that is what the owner and on lookers see , do you really think that on lookers are bothered whether the look lasts 2 months or 3? 6 applications per year vs 4 applications per year, not even worth comparing


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

I think one of the most durable LSPs comes in one of the largest containers... #476S in 18oz 

Durability is more than a raw figure however, as it varies from environment to environment its best not to put numbers on it, but rather consider it to be low, medium, high. A high durability product will appeal to me, not necessarily because I will use its full durability, but the knowledge that it is highly durable is a good one - much like my car will do 140mph, I'll never use that but its nice to know it can do it and it means cruising at 70mph is just a walk in the park to it... I can cite some waxes on my car that struggle to meet a couple of months which is the minimum I'd expect a product to last on a car if I was to use it, whereas a higher durability product will comfortably reach this as it can happily go over it.

As waxes never improve the look of a well prepped machine finish (certainly not in my experience), then looks are irrelevant to the consideration for me...


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Dave KG said:


> I think one of the most durable LSPs comes in one of the largest containers... #476S in 18oz


I just wish the products sometimes came i smaller packages like 100ml grams 3oz whatever, since for personal use they just last too many years and sometimes curiosity leads to wanting to try other ranges just for the heck of it


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## chillly (Jun 25, 2009)

476s does all this for just over a tenner. 

Protection
Beading
Gloss
Easy-to-clean surface
Easy application
Durability

But Florian if you can come up with better for the same price i will have 2 tins please :thumb:


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

chillly said:


> 476s does all this for just over a tenner.
> 
> Protection
> Beading
> ...


we'll see about that...


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## Eddy (Apr 13, 2008)

Nanolex said:


> One thing I forgot though is durability
> 
> Would you say durability is a big issue? TBH my experience on DW was that it's actually not so much since most people see it more as a hobby and don't mind reapplying frequently...


I haven't read any of the replies since my first very early in this thread so I apologise if this has been covered already, but to me what you have said here is exactly true. I love re-applying wax so as long as it can last a month or so when times get busy then it will be fine.

Anything that lasts months and months gets wasted with me


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## Nanolex (Jun 8, 2008)

Eddy said:


> I haven't read any of the replies since my first very early in this thread so I apologise if this has been covered already, but to me what you have said here is exactly true. I love re-applying wax so as long as it can last a month or so when times get busy then it will be fine.
> 
> Anything that lasts months and months gets wasted with me


This is actually exactly why we came up with the Spray and the NanoWax (although both have a durability of ~6 months)...


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## spitfire (Feb 10, 2007)

I agree with Dave KG. After honing the paint to perfection I want to protect it for as long as possible without having to reapply. My first wax was Collinite 476s and during the Zaino boom I bought ZAIO and Z2 pro. I use them mainly on my own car and they have given me 5-6 months protection. The Zaino whilst being much dearer gives a slightly more clinical "feel" to my Titanium Silver paint but that's totally subjective as I don't think anyone could tell the difference between that and the Colly.

So for me,
Durability, although I like to *think* I've added something to the finish

Protection, although I think that that's inextricably linked to Durability

Easy to clean, the easier it is to clean, the less chance there is of damaging the paint

Cost, Zaino was expensive but I just had to try it. Don't mind paying the money if I feel the product is good enough.

Easy application, if it's easy to apply then it's a pleasure to work with. Colly's not the easiest in this respect.

HTH


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