# Integra Type R paint reaction after full repaint....



## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi chaps

Had a full respray in Milano Red on my DC2. My friend is the painter.

I didn't touch the car for 5 weeks or so after painting and then a few Sundays ago I decided to wash it and then give it a light detail.

I have noticed that there are bubbles in the paint on certain panels, almost like air pockets that you could pop with a pin.

Panels affected are A pillar, top of C pillar, top of rear spoiler and tops of wings. So far....

Been and seen my mate and he too is a little puzzled. Needless to say he is repainting the whole car again but wants to wait to see how bad the blistering gets and how many panels it affects. He said where it has blistered he will need to go back to bare metal to cure it.

Now, I've been to see a Honda approved bodyshop and they assumed that water is in the primer coat due to an old piston compressor. My painter said no chance since he recently spent £5K on a latest level compressor to avoid such issues.

Here are the background details of the paint....

1 - Primered in grey primer
2 - Left in body-shop for around 2 weeks in primer before being painted (other priorities)
3 - Painted in November when it was cold....
4 - Painted in 2K paint without lacquer
5 - Flattened and polished back


Any ideas what's gone wrong here? I have a feeling he knows and isn't telling me.

Is he right to suggest waiting to see how bad it gets? He was suggesting March/April. I said no chance, I paid £2K for the paint in November not next year. I want it repainted early January and have had to buy all new Honda stickers etc again (thought I'd forgive him since he is repainted the whole car at his cost and not mine, I know it's his fault but for the sake of £90 or so I'd rather keep our friendship knowing he is already loosing money on this job).

I also noticed that the spare paint in the can he gave me is exactly Milano Red yet the colour on the car is lighter? Mentioned to him and suggested it's not the right colour. He admits this but cannot see how the paint has come out so much lighter (Milano is usually a deep blood red). He thinks this paint discrepancy is down to possibly the primer colour being grey and not black (again, I think he is covering his backside or that of the paintshop which could have mixed him the wrong blasted colour!).

Either way it's getting resolved, bit of a pain but hey that's life.

Another quick question; we painted 2K solid since he said it's far more durable. Honda told me Milano Red should be basecoat and clear, which I knew. 

This time round should we go 2K again with no lacquer or proper basecoat and lacquer? He said it makes no difference to him and I am free to choose (again!).

Advice on blistering appreciated. Some of you guys must be pro painters!

Thanks in advance:thumb:


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Sounds simmilar to the issues aaran had in his restore thread . Sounds to me like it sat in primer to long was it indoors in primer ? I think primers porous tbh so if it was outside in november in porous primer I think that may be the issue


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## Aaran (Sep 18, 2007)

i got water in the primer on a door on mine. MOST annoying. (never had it in the last 3/4 cars we have done)

pops out in small blisters (mine were about 1-2mm in dia and about .5mm high) they only came out after i wet-sanded 5 weeks after laying the clear over the flint black base. im assuming i either had condensation from the roof fall and land on the primer a few hours before i laid the base of for some reason i got some water in the air line. (this is why i need my paint booth up so badly now to save this grief)

you can use a pricey compressor but you need to remember that the air might come out dry right from the tank but its hot (much like compressed air for a turbo or charger) and its cooling in the air line to the gun. everyone i know that paints for a living runs alot of air/water traps in the line. i now run 2 plus a disposable one on gun just to be safe. i know others even force dry the air en route with some dehumidifying machine/system

was it painted in a heated booth and baked? (if it was not baked did you wax the car when you detailed it?)

the color finish can also be affected by the pressure it was sprayed at as well as the primer, i dont spray single stage, but i would imagine on red it wont make that much difference as i believe it lays alot thicker with more coverage compared to base and clear. 

if its moisture in the primer heating the panels will make it pop more (makes it evaporate) it did on mine. it could also be silicones in the paint or maybe even solvent pop (unlikely as they then to show up right away or very quickly)


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi Aaron

Thanks for your reply. Just watched your thread. You are a legend mate! Awesome awesome work. Looking for a CRX now to partner the ITR lol.

Yep small blisters just like your description. Annoying! It was in primer in the workshop but was only flattened back the same day it finally got the 2K paint. In the oven for the paintwork. Yes to heated booth and oven. I did give the car a wax when I washed it but it was there I noticed the paint blisters and figured he's going to have to do it again anyhow so I may aswell wax it! 

Interesting about the pressure for the colour. I even had the Honda bodyshop come out with paint chips, 6 different Milano Red's it wasn't but R502 Versuvio Red turned out to be spot on perfect?? I don't get it. Either he's f'd up and order R502 rather than R81 but why or how he could do that when I showed him the colour code in the doorshut is beyond me!

Would you say I do it base and clear this time round rather than 2K on it's own?

Funny enough today I picked up my Jetta from him (had an ABT spoiler painted and fitted) as we were talking about the Integra as I took it along. He mentioned something about possibly putting it back in the oven as it is to see if the blisters would stick down? I didn't pay it much attention as I've prepared for a full repaint again.

Hi Craig,

Yes it was sat indoors in primer for near two weeks indoors near the oven. But the primer was flattened off until it was getting the paintwork, so it sat in it's grey primer with red spray on top (to see high/low spots I guess when it's flattened).

How long do you guys think I should wait before the repaint? He was saying deep into next year, I said no flippin chance. I'm thinking week two in January. It will have been painted for nearly 2.5 months by then so wherever it's going to blister would have reared it's head by then?

What do you chaps think?

Thanks again!


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## eddie bullit (Nov 23, 2007)

I'm waiting till spring/summer to get my 205 painted..less humidity in the air, warmer etc.


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## Aaran (Sep 18, 2007)

if that happened to me i would have that car in the booth and bake it for a good long time to force all the moisture out of it. was it wetsanded or dry sanded before paint? i always wetsand my primer with p800 but then leave it to dry for a good few days before laying the base ontop (you are right primers are porous and can hold moisture in them)

i prefer the finish on 2k clear and base. make sure you use a very good clear though because milano red turns to milano pink pretty quick (advantage of a single stage is when/if it ever did it you can just cut the pink away and still be left with shiny new red, on clear this wont work)


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

I'm gona be honest here, I know this is your mate but he's coming out with alot of bull****. 
This is down to moisture in the primer, now him saying no way it's 5k compresser I don't care if it cost him 20k I it's not drained properly, has the appropriate water traps, correct filtration. Then there will a chance of moisture/oil getting into the airline in turn transferring into the primer/paint.
As for the grey primer, most reds the primer colour should be white, if he got the paint through his work, then in most cases when you put the colour code into the computer, it will tell you the correct shade of primer to use with that colour.
Painting it in 2k solid colour, that's just trying to save money. It's not more durable as it has no uv protectors in it. So the paint may actually start to fade. Would be much better done in basecoat/clear. As for the colour being wrong I can't work out why he wouldn't do a spray out card first, to check the shade of the colour, not just paint the whole car hoping it would be right.
Baking the car in an oven again, will NOT make any difference to it at all. The damage is already done. 
Chances are this may happen over the whole car. It may jut take longer to come out on the other panels.
It really needs the while car to best stripped back to baremetal an start again, this time using correct shade primer/paint and done in basecoat and clear laquer.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Thanks Andy thanks all.

Yes I think he's f'd up big time. Thing is we were all set for base and clear and then I mentioned 2K. He gave me the option. Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned it lol.

So this time we do base and clear. I've told him the standard of finish needs to be the same as before, no half hearted approaches. He does a lot of our work and has our Audi R8 sat there.

Funny thing is he reckoned 2K and base/clear would cost him the same?! I can't see how if one has a lacquer coat, and we all now lacquer is very expensive! 

How many litres of paint would a full respray require (minus the bonnet as it's carbon)?

Hi Aaron

The primer was dry sanded I'm sure? Maybe it was then wet sanded and missed that stage - I was turning up for pictures here and there.

It's put me off him a bit to be honest. He does churn out spectacular jobs but mine always seem to suffer with some sort of crap. Why I don't know.

This will be our last job through him I think. Found another painted and he seems keen. I'll give him a little spoiler to do in a means to see his finish.

No idea about the paint card. Because the whole car was pink I don't think he had anything to check it against? Now I've dropped him the remaining paint he said he's spraying 2 colour cards with grey base and black base. Quite why now I don't know. Idiot.

How is the colour so much lighter on the car to that in the can? Leads me to question whether the stuff in the tin is actually what he painted with! Maybe he quickly ordered 0.5 litres of the correct R81 to fill the tin with and make look like he used the correct paint! Or maybe I'm being far too paranoid....


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

To give you guys an idea. Recent work I've seen there includes two CL63 AMG's, straight cars, colour changed from champagne to white. These are £35K cars. Stunning jobs.

I've also seen numerous RR Sport's changing colour into white. X6's into white. Bentley GT's into white. My friends R35 GTR into House of Color Candy purple.

He has also painted my sisters RR Sport from black to Kawasaki bike purple (don't ask....the kids persuaded her lol), my nephews E92 M3 V8 from that horrible BMW red into BMW Marakesh brown. He is currently repairing our R8 after a light front smack (I say light, but it needed new A/C pipes and some light aluminium welding, now it's ready for a full respray). He has also painted my brother E30 M3 Sport Evolution and my E30 M3.

I guess what I'm trying to say is he isn't a pokey painter. His work is very specialised and his finish amazing (usually lol). He has all sorts of water traps etc in his facility and I cannot think he would have deliberately painted it the wrong colour! Somewhere there is an F'up but I just don't know where.

To further add to my suspicion, when he give me the spare paint in the 5 litre can, mysteriously the hand written paint code from the paint supplier was missing. I could feel the glue from the sticker where it had been peeled off. I asked him how he knows what colour it is if there is no sticker? I also asked him why the sticker had been peeled off....he's not sure. Sounds like super bulls*** to me. How can you loose the paint sticker from the paint tin?? Why would you peel it off?? 

I just don't get it....


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

Sounds more like he's had some 2k reds laying around, mixed them together to make enough paint to do your car. Theres no reason why you would remove a the sticker only to hide something and cover up what you've used. 
Even if he thinks its not his compressor, how long did the car sit in his work shop with baremetal showing prior to priming. Due to the recent weather conditions left in baremetal over night, and the drop in temperature over night moisture could of got into the metal, he's primed it trapping the moisture in the metal. 
Regardless of the cars he's done in the past, he's trying to cover his tracks. There's no way basecoat and clear will be the same price as 2k, unless he's using cheap sh1t paint, in which case will look ok when first done. Then 6 months time once its cured and weathered it will look more like a satin finish. Put it this way where I work to buy 5ltrs of laquer, 5ltrs of activator, 5ltrs of thinner, your looking around £900. So you can see why he may be using cheaper products, still it's his reputation tha will go down hill.
I'd be very reluctant to let him near the car, ok people deserve a second chance but when he's trying to pull the wool over your eyes, and quite blatantly feeding you a load of ******s. If be had been honest from the outset then yes you could give him that second chance. I'd be more worried how its gona turn out this time. Unless you get him to do it and photograph every single stage if it to prove what he's done. Meaning if there's no photos he hasn't done it, or the excuse on the camera must of deleted them. Again he's hiding something.


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## squiggs (Oct 19, 2009)

Given that this guy is (usually) so good at his job surely he should be able to work out what's gone wrong. It could be water but if he can usually churn out good work he must have traps and filters. Maybe it's a one off problem that he just can't figure out.
I've never used 2k paint, nor an oven - but the problems (which all seen to be higher up on car) sound like solvent pop.
Is it possible to accidentally set an oven too high? Could it result in solvent pop on 2k?


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## pcm1980 (May 4, 2009)

Sounds to me its likely to be moisture causing the problem. Although he says the air is good and clean, whays the conditions in the rest of the workshop? It is a possibility that if the workshop is cold, then the cold car is moved into a warm booth for painting that condensation has formed on the panel before paint was applied. If the shop is cold, the car should of been moved into booth and allowed to warm upto booth temperature ( a short bake cycle is ideal) before anything was applied.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi chaps

Thanks for the responses. Appreciate them.

I hear what you are saying about not letting him touch it again, but when you have a £2K voucher.....I want my monies worth!

I checked the car today. The areas of blistering remain the same, maybe it's grown slightly but oddly enough it hasn't touched the roof which is the flattest section??

I'm going to call him tomorrow and tell him to order R81 Milano Red now so that I can SEE the paint and be happy with the colour before he puts it. That way it won't look like I'm accusing him of being a liar! I know I shouldn't care but I do feel in these sorts of situations it's best to stay polite and agreeable (especially when he has the keys to your R8...).

Defo sounds like moisture. I'm hoping this time around it won't be there; I'm sure the last thing he wants is to paint a car THREE times. This time I'm sure he will go out of his way to make sure the prep is perfect.

To help ease the strain of the situation, I have bought all new Integra stickers etc from Honda (again) so at least he doesn't see it coming out of his pocket. I'll also maybe pay a few hundred extra again to ensure this time we paint inside the door shuts with the doors removed (I decided not to first time - my mistake). That way if he sees some money coming in it's better than none.

I don't know why I am doing this. I guess I'm just a bit fairer than most and certainly don't want a rush job for all the heartache and money this car has cost me.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

P.s - Andy I did think about him possibly mixing together some 2K red knocking around in an attempt to save money. But why on earth would someone do that knowing that I'm the biggest fuss pot in the world? Why would you risk something like that????

Still, you never know. If it means you save a few hundred on buying paint it increases your profit margin.


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## andyrst (Apr 6, 2009)

Andyb0127 said:


> Sounds more like he's had some 2k reds laying around, mixed them together to make enough paint to do your car. Theres no reason why you would remove a the sticker only to hide something and cover up what you've used.
> Even if he thinks its not his compressor, how long did the car sit in his work shop with baremetal showing prior to priming. Due to the recent weather conditions left in baremetal over night, and the drop in temperature over night moisture could of got into the metal, he's primed it trapping the moisture in the metal.
> Regardless of the cars he's done in the past, he's trying to cover his tracks. There's no way basecoat and clear will be the same price as 2k, unless he's using cheap sh1t paint, in which case will look ok when first done. Then 6 months time once its cured and weathered it will look more like a satin finish. Put it this way where I work to buy 5ltrs of laquer, 5ltrs of activator, 5ltrs of thinner, your looking around £900. So you can see why he may be using cheaper products, still it's his reputation tha will go down hill.
> I'd be very reluctant to let him near the car, ok people deserve a second chance but when he's trying to pull the wool over your eyes, and quite blatantly feeding you a load of ******s. If be had been honest from the outset then yes you could give him that second chance. I'd be more worried how its gona turn out this time. Unless you get him to do it and photograph every single stage if it to prove what he's done. Meaning if there's no photos he hasn't done it, or the excuse on the camera must of deleted them. Again he's hiding something.


what kind of clear is that andy?


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

reza_q said:


> P.s - Andy I did think about him possibly mixing together some 2K red knocking around in an attempt to save money. But why on earth would someone do that knowing that I'm the biggest full pot in the world? Why would you risk something like that????
> 
> Still, you never know. If it means you save a few hundred on buying paint it increases your profit margin.


Who knows why he would do that, I've been in the bodyshop trade along time and it never ceases to amaze me the stunts people will pull to save money or cut corners.


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

andyrst said:


> what kind of clear is that andy?


It's Glasurit laquer mate. :thumb:


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## pcm1980 (May 4, 2009)

Glasurit is top end gear and is exspensive. I have the pleasure of using it everyday at work all be it as white label form (bmw proclear).

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

pcm1980 said:


> Glasurit is top end gear and is exspensive. I have the pleasure of using it everyday at work all be it as white label form (bmw proclear).
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2


Same here mate we've got Glasurit, and the bmw white label. Basically two mixing schemes that are the same. We use the pro-clear and racing clear. :thumb:


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

So when I paint again with base and clear I ask him to use Glasurit lacquer?

Mind you what he shows me and actually uses I'll never know.


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## pcm1980 (May 4, 2009)

Just found this on net,

Blistering

Definition
In damp weather, a small quantity of water vapour is absorbed into the paint structure and is then evaporated again in dry conditions (osmosis). This process is normal and does not harm a well constructed finishing process. However, poor processing of the primers will leave hygroscopic/water soluble substances (salts) behind as contaminants. These cause a local concentration of a salt water solution which lift the paint film into water blisters. Blisters can occur in many sizes, patterns and frequency and can form between individual layers or beneath the entire film build. In dry weather most blisters will temporarily recede.

Causes
1.The surface to be painted (filler, bare metal etc) was not cleaned thoroughly. Contamination from salt residue, eg dirty sanding water or hand sweat, was left on the surface under or between coats. The blister pattern may indicate the cause (beading = wipe marks, prints = finger or hand prints). 
2.Wet sanding operations (particularly with polyester based products) without sufficient time to allow water to evaporate before application of top-coats.

How to avoid
1.Thoroughly clean the areas to be painted with clean water. Change sanding and cleaning water regularly, especially in winter when vehicle paintwork in for repair is covered in salt. Consider changing to dry sand operations to avoid water absorption when sanding. Finally (depending on the substrate) clean the area with Glasurit Cleaner 700-1 and Glasurit Wax and Grease Remove 541-5 or Glasurit Panel Cleaner 360-4. 2] Allow sufficient time for water to evaporate when wet sanding (circa 2 hours at 20ºC). Dry sand where possible especially with polyester based products.

Repair

Sand down and remove the paint layers back to a sound substrate. Be prepared to strip the areas back to bare metal where necessary. Refinish with the correct choice of primers fillers and top-coats.


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## pcm1980 (May 4, 2009)

reza_q said:


> So when I paint again with base and clear I ask him to use Glasurit lacquer?
> 
> Mind you what he shows me and actually uses I'll never know.


Glasurit is my product of choice, the lacquer is 923-335 HS multiclear, also get the suitable hardener and thinners from glasurit, don't mix and match.


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## pcm1980 (May 4, 2009)

This may also be of some use??

*Paint Damage Identification with the Sand Through Method*

The sand through method is a simple way to diagnose paint damage more accurately on site and therefore determine the best repair method required. The various layers and products used, are carefully sanded through in one bad area back to the bare substrate (metal or plastic etc.) This allows all of the coats and layers to be clearly identified, their individual film thickness assessed and the fault to be highlighted. The sand through is best carried out by first sanding with P240 back to the substrate. The second stage is to re-sand the same area with as fine a paper as practical (e.g. P600). Finally the area could be polished with a fine polishing paste in order to allow to clear and precise observation of the coats and the problem. The following types of paint damage can be easily assessed using this method.

Blistering (see also Chapter "Blistering"). Blisters are easily detected, showing as different coloured spots as the top coat is removed revealing the layer below.

Crazing (see also Chapter "Crazing"). The depth of a crack in the paint layers can easily be detected in the sanded through areas. To assist even further, wipe Guide Coat into the cracks and allow to dry before sanding and the contrast will ease the identification.

Solvent Boil (see also Chapter "Solvent Boil"). This type of defect is often mistaken for dirt inclusions because of the small size of the defect. By sanding through, the defect can be easily identified as small cavities in the layer concerned.

Cratering (see also Chapter "Cratering"). Cratering shows as the flat recess or dimple in old paintwork, or on the surface of new paintwork and can indicate a poor flow characteristic of the paint.

Pinholing (see also Chapter "Pinholing"). Pinholes will appear as small dots of a different colour than the top-coat and originate from faults such as bubbles or pores in the substrate.

Swirl Marks/Swelling. Swirl marks will appear as colour filled lines in the primer or surfacer in the sanded through layer. The pattern and size of the lines will indicate the method of sanding used (hand or machine) and the grit size of paper used.

Number of Paint Layers of the Old Paintwork. The layers of paint, like the rings in a tree trunk, are exposed by sanding. With this method it is possible to say exactly how many coats of paint have been applied to the car and whether the risk of overloading on repainting is possible.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Thanks for that great description! I'll add that to my ammo belt.

I'll ask about Glasurit, but like I say only God knows what he will do. Now he is on the hook to save cost I wonder what he will throw over the top.

Such a pain all this. Took me about 2 days to clean prep dust etc for engine bay! I'll have to do it all again.....


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

pcm1980 said:


> Glasurit is my product of choice, the lacquer is 923-335 HS multiclear, also get the suitable hardener and thinners from glasurit, don't mix and match.


Exactly the laquer I would of recommended aswell. Hardner will need to be slow so the laquer stays open longer to make it is out better. Same as what we use at work, but now seem to use more of the 923-447 ceramic as most of the Mercs we paint are done in ceramic. 
If this guys painting these marques of cars, and has a merc approval he shouod only be using Glasurit or spies hecker as the the only two approved by merc. I should know as the bodyshop I'm in is mercedes and bmw approved.


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## andyrst (Apr 6, 2009)

he sounds a a cowboy painter that gives the rest a bad name, an i bet he wouldnt use glasurit an he sounds like a boy that tell the customer to get the paint an tbh when a painter/bodyshop tell you that its only going to go down hill from there on, 

a dear job is a cheap job in my eyes

p.s glasurit is great the gloss is super, 932-45 i use


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

That is interesting. Cheers guys.

I'll have a chat tomorrow and see what he says.....


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## Joe24 (Oct 10, 2012)

Any chance of some photos? As with a few of the others I work with Bmw's colorsystem at work but also have PPG, Sikkens and Ixell. It does sound like either solvent pop or moisture trapped under the topcoat. If I was painting a car to high spec I would always use base and clear as it holds up much better and will not go milky over time like straight 2k will. Also guessing his 5k compressor has a dryer on it?


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## Aaran (Sep 18, 2007)

are these ceramic clears that much better than the run of the mill ones? (assuming they are alot harder and more scratch resistant etc)


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

I'll get some pictures this weekend when it's dry and post then up.

Aaron, how much does a good quality 2K cost per litre? And how many litres would a car need?

Would a lash up of 2K solids be causing the popping? Cheap/old paint?

Cheers


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## Aaran (Sep 18, 2007)

from what i can see the glasruit that everyone is going on about seems to fall off anywhere from £250 upwards a gallon depending on which specific type is used.

i have yet to spray anything other than HB body, my work up until now has been DiY and mostly on my cars, so i cant help you with the clear stuff as i just went with what my local factor recommended. about to try some PPG deltron and see how that compares, then have a play with some letcher. maxmayer stuff seems to come recommended as well as a few others. 

im out of my league when it comes to loads of different brands, PCM and andyB will be the recommendations to follow here as they are full time and long time painters, im self taught mostly and have had no official training so just in hours in a booth they will kick my ass hands down. (i only took it up as a hobby because i work a min wage job and i was fed up with getting ****ty finishes from painters or work that would rust out within a few years) but the feed back form people has been so good i can see me starting my own honda resto business next year

it sounds like moisture to me, if your guy has been doing high end work and does a bang up jobs i cant see him getting solvent pop if he turns out good work sounds more like contamination from moisture along the line. i never got it before until this year and this car.

i like to lay my paint heavy but 5lt will easy do the exterior of a teggy incl the shutz. stupid question but did the ITR have any rust in the area's its now bubbeling up in?


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

Aaran said:


> are these ceramic clears that much better than the run of the mill ones? (assuming they are alot harder and more scratch resistant etc)


We've used glasurit and spies hecker ceramic laquers. Out of the two i prefer glasurit. Which will be a far better quality than the cheaper run if the mill ones. Laquers are really down to personal preference really and how much you want to spend.


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## Joe24 (Oct 10, 2012)

There are so many different factors in painting, it could be a whole number of things. Generally solvent pop comes up straight away after baking. It's basically caused by using a too faster hardener thinner combination which basically skins over before all of the solvent has got out. This means the solvent has to get thought the skinned layer and causes the popping effect. Get your painter to infra red lamp different areas, this heats the panels from the metal out pushing any unreleased solvent or water out. 

Cheap paint could cause the reaction, so could miss matching different paint schemes hardeners/thinners. Eg. Glasurit colour with PPG hardener etc. At a guess I would say cold panels going into a hot booth causes a small amount of condensation which could easily get trapped under the 2k. 

As you say your painter normally paints top end cars the likely hood is he probably very rarely uses straight 2k and isn't as used to the way it goes on. Hope this helps!


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

reza_q said:


> I'll get some pictures this weekend when it's dry and post then up.
> 
> Aaron, how much does a good quality 2K cost per litre? And how many litres would a car need?
> 
> ...


Depends what quality laquer you want really its such a minefield with so many different types and prices. 
If your looking for a fairly decent laquer that's not the same price as the likes of glasurit. Your looking at brands like max Meyer, Lechler, ppg, possibly ici, for the private work i do, I use Lechler hs macrofan never had any problems with it, gloss levels are always really good, and flats and polishes really easy.

Most common places for Solvent boil normally will be because of over application, or not left long enough between coats. If you could get some pics up of the areas that are affected then prob be able to give you a better answer. I'm just having trouble working out, how he turns out supposedly decent paint jobs on prestige cars, but manages to completely mess your car up. Only thing concerns me if he's doing these Mercedes if they've been done in ceramic from the factory, is he using ceramic laquer when he paints them as its fairly simple with a merc to tell if its ceramic from the colour code.


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## squiggs (Oct 19, 2009)

Andyb0127 said:


> Only thing concerns me if he's doing these Mercedes if they've been done in ceramic from the factory, is he using ceramic laquer when he paints them as its fairly simple with a merc to tell if its ceramic from the colour code.


What's going to happen to the repaired area if he isn't .....?


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Cheers guys.

In answer to your questions, there was NO bubbling in any of the areas that are now blistering before the paint job. So it's all down to him, the tool.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi Andy

What is the cost of 2K? I mean like 5 litres of the stuff? Is it expensive?


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

squiggs said:


> What's going to happen to the repaired area if he isn't .....?


Nothing will happen to the repaired area. But if he paints just the front end of a Mercedes or bmw which has ceramic lacquer on from the manufacturer. And he doesn't use ceramic laquer, an just paints the front end in a normal hs clear, then it's not going to be anti-scratch or as harder wearing as ceramic and will mark alot easier.


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

reza_q said:


> Hi Andy
> 
> What is the cost of 2K? I mean like 5 litres of the stuff? Is it expensive?


This is the 2k i use never had any problems with it.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&s...0YDwAQ&usg=AFQjCNGrXDzvHsYxB3Ai1D2Aay1xDfMyZw

Price is just for the laquer you would also need the hardner which isn't tha exoensive.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Cheers Andy

Pictures coming tomorrow!

But how on earth do I get them up???


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## 3dom (Oct 30, 2012)

Use Photobucket to host them and then use the IMG link (copy and paste that here)


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)




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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)




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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Hi chaps, picture of the defect shown. This is just above the C pillar along the edge of that panel.

The other shot is of the car. God I love my DC2.


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## 4d_dc2 (Mar 28, 2008)

Are they soft or solid?


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Soft! I think you could push them with your fingernail.....


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Here is the engine bay. A lot of effort has gone into this. The camcover has been professionally repainted in Milano Red standard shade 2K with clear.

Who would have guessed 153000 miles and counting....


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## 3dom (Oct 30, 2012)

I had a DC2 years ago, also in Milano Red, and I loved it to bits. Shame about the paint issues as it looks great other than that.


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## Aaran (Sep 18, 2007)

ya thats exactly what mine did in that door, about the same spacing and size to


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

Looking at those pics I'd definatly say that's moisture in the primer.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Cheers chaps

Defo not a cause of cheap paint Andy?


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

reza_q said:


> Cheers chaps
> 
> Defo not a cause of cheap paint Andy?


No it's not the paint that has caused it, the problems with the primer and moisture in it.
Didn't you say there was a problem with the colour, looking at the rocker cover you've had done. It looks like a deeper red, just seem to remember you saying the colour wasn't right.


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## reza_q (Feb 10, 2011)

Yep colour is too light. Camcover is the correct colour.

I'll keep you posted but it's getting repainted in January, this time in base with clear coat.


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

reza_q said:


> Yep colour is too light. Camcover is the correct colour.
> 
> I'll keep you posted but it's getting repainted in January, this time in base with clear coat.


Good luck with it this time mate. Hope it turns out the way you want it to, please do keep us posted on how it goes. :thumb:


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## funbus (Mar 31, 2010)

Have you had it repainted yet ?


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