# Not Hapy with Ceramic Coating



## cossieian (Mar 13, 2009)

Deleted


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## wish wash (Aug 25, 2011)

I've been a convert to them for years as normally they do what they say. What was applied to your car


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

What coating was it?

Oh and a ceramic coating will never result in swirl free washing if you've not got a good technique


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## suspal (Dec 29, 2011)

Have you had a disscussed your concerns with the person who applied the coating before posting on the forum to see what may be "wrong"?


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## heavyd (Jun 11, 2006)

I'd be interested to hear what coating it was. 2 months sounds rubbish. Have you not topped with a Carpro reload type product? I would have thought tar would stick to any paintwork never mind what coating is on it


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## Alasar (Dec 8, 2010)

cossieian said:


> I was promised that the car would feel silky smooth for 2 years, which not even 2 months on feels like there's nothing on the paint at all.
> 
> Was also promised that washing would be easy and dirt would just fall off, which it certainly does not.
> 
> ...


Very similar promises from ceramic pro... 

promised - silky smooth.. he-he. 
silky smooth stays only 2-3 washes. and must be reloaded every 2-3 washes.

on soft clearcoats anti tag and anti scratch effects not the same that on hard clearcoats (bmw, audi etc) .
coatings have anti scratch effect , but not very strong. You should remember it.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

I too was very sceptical about the coatings too but then I applied one to my Saab 93....well over a year later and it was still beading as good as the day I applied it, it also had next to no damage or marks and it was indeed easier to clean.

The wifes 4 month old Mazda 6 has TAC Systems Sparkle on it and 4 months on its a dream to wash and again no marks or swirls in the paint and trust me Mazda paint is mega soft and marks if you look at it wrong (Its dark metallic blue).

I think you need to go back to where the work was done and air your disappointment there...really does sound like its either failed prematurely or its not been applied right in the first place.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

so what is the coating then? may help to list through your wash routine/techniques and wash media?


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## cossieian (Mar 13, 2009)

Deleted


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

I sounds to me if the coating has failed....wash routine sounds ok I have used a variety of shampoo's on our coated vehicles and none of them have been affected.

I will also add that I foam/prewash all our cars with either AutoGlym MultiWash TFR or Advanced TFR and they have not had any effect or killed the coatings hydrophobic qualities.


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## heavyd (Jun 11, 2006)

Well, here's a car I coated a while ago that has a different type of coating on either half of the bonnet. This was filmed a week later. Can you spot the difference..


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## cossieian (Mar 13, 2009)

heavyd said:


> Well, here's a car I coated a while ago that has a different type of coating on either half of the bonnet. This was filmed a week later. Can you spot the difference..


Mine reacts very similar to the one on the right


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

If you're not prepared to say what coating it is then how do you expect people to tell you about typical durability and properties :/

Hardly damaging the product if it's the fact it's been incorrectly applied rather than a crap product


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## mikethefish (Feb 4, 2011)

You've been into detailing for years !!!!! Why do you need the forum for help surely you would have experience of various coatings, the application of and longevity, from applying yourself !!!!!

In your experience what is the best coating you have applied yourself !!!!!


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## cossieian (Mar 13, 2009)

mikethefish said:


> You've been into detailing for years !!!!! Why do you need the forum for help surely you would have experience of various coatings, the application of and longevity, from applying yourself !!!!!
> 
> In your experience what is the best coating you have applied yourself !!!!!


I thought a forum was a place to seek advice when needed??
Yes I have been detailing for years, I'm No professional by any stretch of the imagination but consider myself better than the average Joe who just brings their car to a £3 car wash.

If I've offended anyone by asking a question then please accept my apology

As for my favourite coating, I've tried quite a few but I've found that Autofinnesse Desire topped with Illusion works really good, gives good protection and looks good on red cars.

I just thought with the arrival of my new car I'd tried something different and heard good things about ceramic


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## organgrinder (Jan 20, 2008)

I applied my own C1 and EXO and was blown away by the finish and the hydrophobic abilities of the EXO. After about 6 mths I noticed some fall off in the beading etc. I improved it a bit by using some citrus wash but I have started to use a bit of Gtechniq QD and it has returned most of the hydrophobic abilities. Not quite what it was but still very good.

I think one of the problems with these types of coating is that there is an expectation that the car will retain its "just done" look for longer than is reasonable.

I am happy to use QD every now and again and it has sharpened up the looks a good bit. The main thing for me is that these coatings give long term protection from bird droppings and other airborne problems.

I also quite like being involved again using the QD.

Despite the claims of several years protection I will still give mine another coating of C1 and EXO in the spring and the good thing is I look forward to the day I can do it.

It sounds like you have had a bad experience with something not applied correctly but remember that most, if not all of these coatings require some kind of maintenance.


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## empsburna (Apr 5, 2006)

Could you try a different shampoo?


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

If you've been told to use reload I presume it's c cquatrz then


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

As far as the claims made on durability, and what it will "withstand" etc. These will be manufacturer claims i think, which lots make. And the detailer of course regurgitates them. Take the tar for example, i know a detailer who dropped an entire line as he had to redo a car for free, as the owner was rightly under the impression tar wouldn't stick. It of course would, and did, and the detailer was banged to rights. 

Coatings are great, but not the magic bullet some think, or portray them to be. 

The manufacturer is not important. the detailer needs to se the vehicle and wash it with you so you can both asses what is happening. It could be covered in fall out (lets say you work near a train track or steel manufacturer), it could be your shampoo has a sealant/wax content and is hindering the finish, it could be its failed due to improper application, or faulty product. Certain steps need taking to ascertain what they are and its the detailer that needs to do them


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## delz0r (Mar 5, 2014)

I've yet to try a coating. Hearing people coating their cars then saying they need to apply a "top up" product completely puts me off. In that case why bother? Its like painting your bedroom a nice colour then getting a different colour paint and rubbing it over it.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

No need to apologise this is defo the right place to ask and your entitled to ask pretty much anything you want. I do agree with Kimo that you've made it clear from response etc it is most likely down to poor application in this instance as is the case 95% of the time when a product doesn't live up to expectation. But ultimately if you don't feel comfortable it's your choice.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

delz0r said:


> I've yet to try a coating. Hearing people coating their cars then saying they need to apply a "top up" product completely puts me off. In that case why bother? Its like painting your bedroom a nice colour then getting a different colour paint and rubbing it over it.


Waxing you have to top up, sealants too the ceramic coatings are very very good though so tbh most types of lsp require topping up time to time


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## Offset Detailing (May 7, 2007)

I think what some people forget is that these coatings do need topping up after every few washes (as mentioned). Some of these coatings do last very, very well when applied properly, if they aren't then you have the problem Cossieian's experienced. Like anything, nothing lasts forever, and even with a wax you'll need to top it up now and again.

Sorry to hear of your experience Cossieian. I have Kamikaze and Gtechniq on two separate cars at home and they are very easy to maintain. I was down in Dorset with mine that has just a couple of coats of Kamikaze Infinity wax on during a massive storm and the car sat by the coast all week having salt water in the air/rain/spray I saw the beads getting flatter and flatter and the car looked like crap - oh dear I thought. A good citrus power degrease and usual weekly wash routine when back home the Infinity wax was bang on again. I presume it was the dirt on there that made it look like my protection had gone - but still works an absolute treat and am very happy with it. I think what's happened to you is down to application. 

I top mine up with QD's like C2V3, Kami overcoat, Gyeon Cure etc etc and make my life a lot easier on my daily cars. Maybe give something like that a try after a gentle, thorough bath and see what happens. 

Also interested to hear what coating you have.


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## delz0r (Mar 5, 2014)

alan hanson said:


> Waxing you have to top up, sealants too the ceramic coatings are very very good though so tbh most types of lsp require topping up time to time


That's expected with a wax but if you look at the marketing material for coatings they lead you to believe they are much more permanent.

Theres a marketing machine at play here. You could buy a 6 pound bottle of Sonax BSD and use nothing but it. Apply it every 3rd wash while drying and have amazing beading/water behaviour, fresh look etc etc. I'd expect a coating to offer me much more than that.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

The top costings do offer you far more than that and excel in just about everything I think most people would use them except for application has to be spot on temp etc.... And you lose the novelty of applying products which wax users like


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## organgrinder (Jan 20, 2008)

delz0r said:


> I've yet to try a coating. Hearing people coating their cars then saying they need to apply a "top up" product completely puts me off. In that case why bother? Its like painting your bedroom a nice colour then getting a different colour paint and rubbing it over it.


Virtually any LSP is a sacrificial layer which takes all the weather and everything else thrown at it and gradually wears/fades away as the car is washed, dried and driven.

The Nano/ceramic coatings generally last a lot longer than waxes and keep the car cleaner so are a "less maintenance" product.

Horses for courses - it's up to you what you want or what you have time for but an occasional QD top up and a full product application once a year is hardly a hardship.

I have used countless waxes and none have kept my car as clean or as well protected for as long as the sealants. I completely get the pleasure in waxing and the subtly different looks but I don't have the time anymore to wax the car as often as I would want to get the finish I want on a permanent basis. I get that from a sealant though which is why I now use them.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

this summer will be the first time ive used a wax for around 4 years, winter though will always be a sealant


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## k9vnd (Apr 11, 2011)

How long ago was this applied?... sounds to me like its been applied before the xmas period? Couldn't be bothered washing correctly and resorting to the polish style car washes over winter?... if so there wash will strip and degrade the coating that's why its degraded and your unhappy about it.

Oh...forgot to say applied in December? Its not officially a month in so your going to have to rethink your original post.


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## MAUI (Feb 1, 2008)

heavyd said:


> Well, here's a car I coated a while ago that has a different type of coating on either half of the bonnet. This was filmed a week later. Can you spot the difference..


Wow I like the sheeting action on the right. Where can I get that coating?


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## heavyd (Jun 11, 2006)

Not naming either, sorry!


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## TonyHill (Jul 28, 2015)

heavyd said:


> Not naming either, sorry!


Errrmmm why?? Thought this forum was for sharing ideas, experiences, product recommendations etc...?


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Failed coating coating be from a number of things like really crap prep work, to some coatings not working on single stage paint.

Sounds as if they've just glazed your car then applied coating straight over the top. 

I'd be talking to the detailer who did your car. It's not right at all. I can't see it being anything you did in 2 months.


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## Alasar (Dec 8, 2010)

I see you not understanding true problem.
Problem is - lies in the promises.
"silky smooth for 2 years" are you serious? 
imho, guy was cheated.
(p.s. do not be offended at me)


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## In House (Dec 3, 2015)

2 years...maintain with Reload...is it Finest?


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## great gonzo (Nov 4, 2010)

I think we are going to see a lot more of these types of threads regarding coatings. 

Gonz.


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## Leebo310 (Sep 30, 2013)

cossieian said:


> My washing techniques I'm pretty confident are good as I've been into detailing for years.
> 
> I am NOT on here to disrespect any company, I am simply asking an opinion or to see if my expectations were maybe a bit too high.


I think it's a bit of both mate, your expectations were too high but to be honest the detailer seems to have oversold it (at least based on your quotes)

Firstly your wash technique must be off a bit if you're causing wash marks of any sorts. It may look ok written down as you've done, but you could have one piece of dirt trapped in one of your mf towels or mitt that is causing this for example.
Even if the coating reduces the risk of wash marks, it's impossible to say that they aren't less than they would be if the coating wasn't there. The fact you are causing them means your wash technique must be off a bit regardless.

Again claims of "washing would be easy and dirt would just fall off" is impossible to justify as you cannot say if the process would have been harder or easier without the coating on there. Same with the tar not sticking. Tar may be sticking to it _less_ and therefore the claims are sort of valid but it's impossible to tell as you have nothing to compare it to. Out of interest how many times have you washed it since and did the marks appear after the very first wash?

Was the car fully corrected before application of the coating?

Finally why weren't you happy with the coating from the start?

Like Stangalang and others have said, take it back to the detailer and get them to check it out. Based on what you've said so far they seem to be pretty helpful. If possible see if they can at least wash a section with you and see if there is any more damage caused. Although if the whole car is swirled already then it'll be pretty hard to work out what are new wash marks...


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## nichol4s (Jun 16, 2012)

Is it a ceramic coating you've had applied, as in one of your posts you say "one of your favourite coatings is desire and illusion" 

I've found on C1+EXO a quick ironx brought it back to life


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## k9vnd (Apr 11, 2011)

I think the op may be mixed up in the term where "coating" was mentioned by the detailer, it could be as said finished with A "coating of wax?... A coating of sealant?.. A coating of cherry glaze for all we know.
To try and work it out were looking at something that's not lasted the month if its been applied in December, personally think it could be down to the washing or pre wash only state that as the 22ple coating I had applied in august was removed within minute's after using the dodo juice tfr last week.


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Alasar said:


> I see you not understanding true problem.
> Problem is - lies in the promises.
> "silky smooth for 2 years" are you serious?
> imho, guy was cheated.
> (p.s. do not be offended at me)


Have you ever used a coating before?


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

k9vnd said:


> I think the op may be mixed up in the term where "coating" was mentioned by the detailer, it could be as said finished with A "coating of wax?... A coating of sealant?.. A coating of cherry glaze for all we know.
> To try and work it out were looking at something that's not lasted the month if its been applied in December, personally think it could be down to the washing or pre wash only state that as the 22ple coating I had applied in august was removed within minute's after using the dodo juice tfr last week.


TFRs can leave a film behind so it might not have removed the coating it could just have something on it stoping it being hydrophobic...give it a wipe with IPA and see if the beading comes back...


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## Alasar (Dec 8, 2010)

nick_mcuk said:


> TFRs can leave a film behind so it might not have removed the coating it could just have something on it stoping it being hydrophobic...give it a wipe with IPA and see if the beading comes back...


pure IPA or 70% can damage "ceramic" coating.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Alasar said:


> pure IPA or 70% can damage "ceramic" coating.


What fool uses Pure IPA on their paint?

Mine is always mixed 100ml IPA 400ml water.

Never done the TAC Coatings any harm


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