# Grrrrrr! Wiper judder!



## Fairtony

So I’ve posted about it before in the Gtechniq section, regarding G5. And I think I have the application down, if not exactly perfect. It beads well, and seems to be holding out ok after a month. 
But I’m plagued with wiper judder! I tried the tip of putting a coat of C2V3 and that worked for a time. But it’s clearly worn off again, and I’m out of C2V3 now. 
After a slightly frosty drive home, and absolutely horrendous wiper judder (which as sent my stress levels through the roof) I really need a permanent solution. Another coat of G5? Something else on top? Attempt to remove it (although glass sealants seem to be impossible to remove) and go back to my trusty RainX?

Wiper blade is about 3 months old, and the window is definitely “bedded in”. Please DW help my sanity!


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## derbigofast

i found waxing my wiper rubber helped but only for a week or so but its easy to do regularly when washing the car


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## jbeer

I had this problem when I have used rainx, drove me nuts and could not get it corrected or removed...have since changed my car and I will not be applying anything to the windscreen again apart from washing it with my car shampoo


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## dholdi

jbeer said:


> I had this problem when I have used rainx, drove me nuts and could not get it corrected or removed...have since changed my car and I will not be applying anything to the windscreen again apart from washing it with my car shampoo
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


Imho, this.

I've tried a number of glass treatments over the years and none of them perform better than clean glass.


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## Andyblue

Not what you want to here mate, but this is why I don’t apply anything to the windscreen - drives me potty !! 

If you want to try to remove it, Bar Keepers friend (powder version) and either one of the washing up sponges or some 0000 grade wire wool and some patience, worth a try. 

Think you’re other issue if you don’t remove what’s there and top with something else, that might not bond / lay 100% and you might get more issue


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## shelton

Any glass sealant can cause this unfortunately. It is usually due to the pressure/angle of the wiper itself. If poorly designed, judder can happen even with brand new wipers on perfectly clean glass.

They could theoretically be designed to perform smoothly with the coating, but obviously the manufacturers design the part with uncoated glass in mind. Sometimes the coating is just enough to destabilise the movement.

You could try adding graphite to the blade, especially if it didnt originally come with graphite. We also have a Fusso oil-based wiper blade treatment for judder prevention, although it may not be available where you are....


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## Andyblue

shelton said:


> We also have a Fusso oil-based wiper blade treatment for judder prevention, although it may not be available where you are....


That's sounds an intriguing product - how does it work ?


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## Fairtony

shelton said:


> Any glass sealant can cause this unfortunately. It is usually due to the pressure/angle of the wiper itself. If poorly designed, judder can happen even with brand new wipers on perfectly clean glass.
> 
> They could theoretically be designed to perform smoothly with the coating, but obviously the manufacturers design the part with uncoated glass in mind. Sometimes the coating is just enough to destabilise the movement.
> 
> You could try adding graphite to the blade, especially if it didnt originally come with graphite. We also have a Fusso oil-based wiper blade treatment for judder prevention, although it may not be available where you are....


that does sound really interesting. Im in England.


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## TenaciousTed

I only ever experience wiper judder whenever the windscreen is dry. Essentially what happens is the coating increases the repellency of the glass, the water mostly streams off, the rest is wiped away with a single pass, judder on the next pass because the windscreen is dry, More rain builds up, repeat.

Running my wipers on a slower speed solved it for me


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## Fairtony

<Deleted>


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## Del-GTi

My response is the same as most of the others so far - remove the coating. I had the same issue. So frustrating. 

You could try the graphite though. That's what wipers come coated in when they are new. 

P.s. If you want to remove the costing, buy cerium oxide from eBay.


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## Metblackrat

I was plagued by this too. I cured it by rubbing graphite powder (sold as a lock lubricant) on the wiper rubber. All new blades come with this on and it leaves no smearing at all. Worked a treat.


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## Fairtony

Metblackrat said:


> I was plagued by this too. I cured it by rubbing graphite powder (sold as a lock lubricant) on the wiper rubber. All new blades come with this on and it leaves no smearing at all. Worked a treat.


Where did you buy it from? And is it a perminant solution or if not, how long did it last?

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## tosh

Fairtony said:


> Where did you buy it from? And is it a perminant solution or if not, how long did it last?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Search for graphite powder on eBay. It's that grey coating you see on new wiper blades. Apply with a round make up pad.

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## Fairtony

big thanks to *derbigofast* for the idea of waxing my blades. I tried it last night, cleaned and dried the blades and applied a layer of Megs NXT 2.0 wax (although I doubt the wax matters that much). Been using them all day and its completely silenced them. They also seem to clean way better. If it only lasts a week (ideally 2 weeks) I'll be set. Although I still plan to look into that graphite powder.

Still shouldn't have to deal with this though...


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## Metblackrat

Fairtony said:


> Where did you buy it from? And is it a perminant solution or if not, how long did it last?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I got it from Amazon. It lasts about 3 months before I re-apply both G5 and the graphite powder.

One bottle should last about 10 years given how much you use.

Advanced KASP SECURITY - K30050 - MICROFINE GRAPHITE POWDER -- https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00J6YMWL6/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_mIi2BbT4AVCXE


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## Gixxer6

Fairtony said:


> Still shouldn't have to deal with this though...


I agree, but from what I've seen the issue can happen with different cars and even with new wiper blades. On my previous car, I used H2GO and installed new wiper blades (Bosch) and never had any wiper judder. But on my wifes car, with H2GO and new wiper blades (Bosch) the wiper judder was ridiculous. I used barkeepers friend and 2 hits of glass cleaner and the wipers have been fine since, and I haven't reapplied any glass sealant.


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## TonyHill

Either I'm missing the point or something, but what is the actual purpose of these coatings on the windscreen? 
I've done 20k miles in my current vehicle, without any coating, and never once had any wiper judder! I can see the appeal of coating the side windows, but for the windscreen.....thats what the wipers are for. 
Part of the appeal also seems to be that the water beads and runs off above a certain speed, again...how does that benefit anyone, simply put the wipers on! 
Sorry of this seems like a rant, but I'm simply not sold on these windscreen coatings


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## Andyblue

Fairtony said:


> big thanks to *derbigofast* for the idea of waxing my blades. I tried it last night, cleaned and dried the blades and applied a layer of Megs NXT 2.0 wax (although I doubt the wax matters that much). Been using them all day and its completely silenced them. They also seem to clean way better. If it only lasts a week (ideally 2 weeks) I'll be set. Although I still plan to look into that graphite powder.
> 
> Still shouldn't have to deal with this though...


Well, thats interesting and not one i've heard of before - do you not get any smearing on the windscreen ?


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## Fairtony

TonyHill said:


> Either I'm missing the point or something, but what is the actual purpose of these coatings on the windscreen?
> I've done 20k miles in my current vehicle, without any coating, and never once had any wiper judder! I can see the appeal of coating the side windows, but for the windscreen.....thats what the wipers are for.
> Part of the appeal also seems to be that the water beads and runs off above a certain speed, again...how does that benefit anyone, simply put the wipers on!
> Sorry of this seems like a rant, but I'm simply not sold on these windscreen coatings


Quite a few reasons I love them:
*During heavy rain, you don't have to use your wiper blades. For me, I always find wipers a little distracting.
*At night, in light areas, the beading of the water becomes invisible and it can rain as much as you want, and youd never see it on the windshield.
*Makes deicing/desnowing the car a lot easier
*Easier to clean/slight self-cleaning attributes when it rains etc
*Side windows/mirrors become a million times better to see out of. No more winding the window down at intersections to look left/right, or to wipe the mirrors!

oh and finally
*The BEADSSSS MANNNN!


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## Fairtony

Andyblue said:


> Well, thats interesting and not one i've heard of before - do you not get any smearing on the windscreen ?


Only been a day, but no streaking, or certainly no more than just the coating itself can cause.


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## shelton

TonyHill said:


> Either I'm missing the point or something, but what is the actual purpose of these coatings on the windscreen?
> I've done 20k miles in my current vehicle, without any coating, and never once had any wiper judder! I can see the appeal of coating the side windows, but for the windscreen.....thats what the wipers are for.
> Part of the appeal also seems to be that the water beads and runs off above a certain speed, again...how does that benefit anyone, simply put the wipers on!
> Sorry of this seems like a rant, but I'm simply not sold on these windscreen coatings


Nothing wrong with questioning products. In fact it is exactly the right attitude.
After all, the world is filled with useless rubbish sold by clever liars!

Some people don't get along with glass coatings, and some people don't find them useful. If that is the case, don't let anyone tell you that you "need" one. Obviously, when driving you should be minimizing distraction in whatever way possible. It is up to the driver to weigh up the benefits - they will be the best judge.

It does depend on the type/time of driving you are doing, and the type of rain, but glass coatings can have a significant impact on visibility. It really does improve safety remarkably in some situations.

This year we sold our 100,000,000th glaco product in Japan. No matter how much we all like beading here, there just aren't enough beading enthusiasts to sell like that. We can only sell one hundred million of something to the general public because it actually makes driving in the rain noticeably easier for 99.9% of people.

Of course, the point at which you think 'this is much better than wipers' is different for every person, and depends on the situation too. British weather certainly makes it more random! I think until you experience that feeling, it is difficult to judge on balance whether you want/need the coating. But it is great when you get it.

TL;DR: good question, not a gimmick, can improve safety, your choice. =]


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## shelton

Here is our judder stopper:
http://www.soft99.co.jp/english/products/carcare/wiper/blade_reviver.html?pid=09130

It is a liquid rubber and Fusso solution that fills in any micro-cracks in the rubber and makes a Fusso coating on the surface to minimize friction. It can also be used to repair older blades that are juddering.

If you can't get hold of it locally, I have also heard of people having success with applying the (a?) glass sealant to the wiper blade too, though obviously NOT with ceramic type coatings (which C5 is IIRC). Presumably the wax had a similar effect.

Note: with judder, we are fighting the interplay between the structure of the wiper, glass, and coating, and in some cases nothing can be done to make them compatible. The graphite trick, this Fusso-based liquid, etc. give you a fighting chance of beating the judder, but a small number of people still have problems.


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## Fairtony

Thanks so much Shelton. I’ll search the webs for the above product. But I already think it might not be possible to source in the uk. 

Quick update on the wax trick. Its been 2 days. About 20 miles, and the judder is back. Not nearly as bad as before, but it’s not silent still. 

Graphite power ordered. And I’ll update when it arrives... 


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## jdo

Did you get any of the graphite powder in the end Fairtony?


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## Alfie7777

I had wiper blade judder a bit back it turned out that the hinge part of the arm was seizing up thus not allowing the spring to do it’s job a bit of lube and problem solved


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## Fairtony

jdo said:


> Did you get any of the graphite powder in the end Fairtony?


So really funny story. Been waiting for it to come, seems like there was an issue with it getting delivered to my work address. Think it's been lost in the mail.

But it seems like the wax trick is actually working quite nicely. It'll still judder if it's super cold out. But it is quite reliably quiet if I use the wipers at anything warmer than about 2oC

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## molsal

There's a lesson here, one which I learnt the hard way ( more than once) Never ever put glass sealants on your windscreen, not only do they cause wiper issues,but they cause serious smearing at night when the wipers are used . Just keep your glass clean and throw away your expensive sealants, I have. Or if you are a real die hard, use them on the shower glass, they can't cause issues there.


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## AnthonyUK

Try Gummi Pflege on the wiper blades. The softer and more supple they are the less likely they will judder. The same company make a specific product for wiper blades but Gummi is fine.


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## Andyblue

AnthonyUK said:


> Try Gummi Pflege on the wiper blades. The softer and more supple they are the less likely they will judder. The same company make a specific product for wiper blades but Gummi is fine.


Well, that's definitely not something I'd have thought about trying... :thumb:


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## DimitriUK

molsal said:


> There's a lesson here, one which I learnt the hard way ( more than once) Never ever put glass sealants on your windscreen, not only do they cause wiper issues,but they cause serious smearing at night when the wipers are used . Just keep your glass clean and throw away your expensive sealants, I have. Or if you are a real die hard, use them on the shower glass, they can't cause issues there.


on top of that not all windscreens are equal, my skoda windscreen is miles ahead in comparison to my merc windscreen in terms of smoothness of wiper operation (same brand on both, no sealants)


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## Christian6984

I have H2go on and the screen felt grabby after first wash or two leading to some juddering. Tried Gtechniq C2v3 and all felt slick again and judder vanished. Did the same after another wash and reasonably quickly the judder returns. Applied to wiper blades and its gone again or very rarely, guessing the wipers could be the cause, gonna try changing them. Anyone used the PIAA ones? i know they are dear, and with the ECP black friday a set of bosch wipers will set me back little over £10


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## kev999

Christian6984 said:


> I have H2go on and the screen felt grabby after first wash or two leading to some juddering. Tried Gtechniq C2v3 and all felt slick again and judder vanished. Did the same after another wash and reasonably quickly the judder returns. Applied to wiper blades and its gone again or very rarely, guessing the wipers could be the cause, gonna try changing them. Anyone used the PIAA ones? i know they are dear, and with the ECP black friday a set of bosch wipers will set me back little over £10


Also interested in the PIAA wiper blades if anybody has any feedback.


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## beatty599

Have you seen kimblade wipers? Meant to be permanently zero judder


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## AaronGTi

IPA/ Eraser the blades, ensure they are squeaky clean. If judder still there try applying 303 or Gummi or similar product to the blades.

I can’t bars to drive a car without the screen being coated.


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## chris chappell

Could be the angle of the blade relative to the glass. See what part of the stroke the judder is on then twist the wiper arm to let the blade trail rather than be pointed against the direction of travel. This assumes that judder is in one direction of course.


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## Marc2004

I’ve had this in the past after a few months of use, a change of blades and a good clean of the windscreen helped but took a while to totally improve. Personally I now leave the screen alone and let the wipers do their thing


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## washingitagain

I applied GTechniq a while back an instantly regretted it. It caused terrible judder. Bought new blades in the end (Bosch) which instantly solved the problem. Now I just protect the side and rear and leave the windscreen well alone.


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## beatty599

washingitagain said:


> I applied GTechniq a while back an instantly regretted it. It caused terrible judder. Bought new blades in the end (Bosch) which instantly solved the problem. Now I just protect the side and rear and leave the windscreen well alone.


Did you coat the old wipers with Gtechniq? If you don't you get wiper judder


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## stonejedi

Christian6984 said:


> I have H2go on and the screen felt grabby after first wash or two leading to some juddering. Tried Gtechniq C2v3 and all felt slick again and judder vanished. Did the same after another wash and reasonably quickly the judder returns. Applied to wiper blades and its gone again or very rarely, guessing the wipers could be the cause, gonna try changing them. Anyone used the PIAA ones? i know they are dear, and with the ECP black friday a set of bosch wipers will set me back little over £10


Been running Piaa wipers for many years now on my Subaru they work very well and last ages....I have had the same pair on my car now for a few years with out no failings.SJ.


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## washingitagain

beatty599 said:


> Did you coat the old wipers with Gtechniq? If you don't you get wiper judder


I didn't but probably should have as a last resort before ordering the new blades. I figured if that didn't work that would be the blades ruined but I replaced them anyway so should have tried.


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## kev999

beatty599 said:


> Have you seen kimblade wipers? Meant to be permanently zero judder


Any links to suppliers for these blades.


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## tosh

kev999 said:


> Any links to suppliers for these blades.


They're on Kickstarter at the moment, but it's closed. They haven't shipped any products yet.

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## Christian6984

looks like there expected around January


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## Fairtony

Christian6984 said:


> looks like there expected around January


Oh god Kickstarter. I have zero faith that'll be released...

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## westerman

I've used H2GO for ages now and never had wiper judder. Changed my worn wipers recently for some relatively cheap ones and still no judder at all.

Not sure why some are getting judder? H2Go has never given me a problem?

I might add that using such a coating gives, for me, a much more relaxed driving experience in the rain. I treat all windows and love the way water cannot sit and obscure vision at anything over around 35 mph.

Harry


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## kev999

Fairtony said:


> Oh god Kickstarter. I have zero faith that'll be released...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I think it will be the PIAA ones then.


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## Christian6984

westerman said:


> I've used H2GO for ages now and never had wiper judder. Changed my worn wipers recently for some relatively cheap ones and still no judder at all.
> 
> Not sure why some are getting judder? H2Go has never given me a problem?
> 
> I might add that using such a coating gives, for me, a much more relaxed driving experience in the rain. I treat all windows and love the way water cannot sit and obscure vision at anything over around 35 mph.
> 
> Harry


I didn't on the old car, both mk6 fiesta's. The wipers were transferred across before the old one was wrote off and taken away, there about 4 months old (Bosch). I think the wipers are knack'd. As my previous post C2v3 settled it down and then the judder returned. Applied to wiper blades and its gone again and its been several weeks since last wash :doublesho


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## camerashy

Mine have started to judder badly after applying G5.
Do you think Cleaning the screen with G4 Nanotech Glass Polish would help......anybody tried it, it’s said to remove bonded contaminants.


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## Andyblue

camerashy said:


> Mine have started to judder badly after applying G5.
> Do you think Cleaning the screen with G4 Nanotech Glass Polish would help......anybody tried it, it's said to remove bonded contaminants.


I ended up using bar keepers friend (powder), followed by several passes of glass polish and then some glass cleaner and a replacement set of wiper blades (as these I think were contaminated with the sealant) to remove whatever sealant the dealer had applied to my windscreen - now got a lovely clean windscreen and no smear / judder...

The G4 nanotech glass polish sounds interesting - I might try bar keepers initially if you can as it's dead cheap :thumb:


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## camerashy

Andy how do you apply bar keepers please
Thanks
Dave


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## Andyblue

camerashy said:


> Andy how do you apply bar keepers please
> Thanks
> Dave


Hi mate, 
I got the powder version and either mix a small amount up in an old bowl to a thick cream paste and use one of the non scratch washing up sponges (white ones) to apply or if it's rainy and the windscreen wet, I've put the powder onto the glass and used the rain water / slight spray from a bottle to make it paste - surprisingly worked well, with minimal waste


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## footfistart

I had juddering wipers and I can across bar keepers and it’s amazing. I had a wet waxing sponge and I put a small amount of BKF and applied it to the windscreen. As if your applying a wax to your car or hand polishing. I then rinsed off the screen and then cleaned the wiper blades with some IPA and never had a judder after that. 


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## Fairtony

footfistart said:


> I had juddering wipers and I can across bar keepers and it's amazing. I had a wet waxing sponge and I put a small amount of BKF and applied it to the windscreen. As if your applying a wax to your car or hand polishing. I then rinsed off the screen and then cleaned the wiper blades with some IPA and never had a judder after that.


what glass sealant were you using? cos isn't barkeepers a glass polish? I could imagine it being good for the prep stage.


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## footfistart

Fairtony said:


> what glass sealant were you using? cos isn't barkeepers a glass polish? I could imagine it being good for the prep stage.


No it's not a polish at all. It's kitchen cleaner used to cut through grease which is usually the reason wipers judder. I use rainX and I don't get a problem. Keep your blades clean too

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## Alex L

footfistart said:


> No it's not a polish at all. * It's kitchen cleaner used to cut through grease which is usually the reason wipers judder *. I use rainX and I don't get a problem. Keep your blades clean too
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If that was the case, why do you get wiper judder after polishing the windscreen and applying a glass sealant and cleaning the blades?


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## Del-GTi

I still think it’s a friction thing, caused by the glass and rubber being too clean.

Winter weather amplifies the issue, as cold weather makes the rubber in the blades harder and concentrated screen wash is good at thoroughly cleaning the glass and blades. Sounds daft I know, but new wipers usually solve the issue for a while as they are coated with graphite-like substance but this wears off or is cleaned off. 

I’ve ordered graphite powder to coat the wiper blades with, see if it solves the problem. I’ll post back with the results. Gotta be worth a shot.


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## footfistart

Strange. I’ve never had an issue with wipers judder. Every six months also i clay the screen and then scrub it with BKF and seal it with RainX (two coats) and never have issues. Not sure how graphite will help surely that will just scratch the screen?


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## Del-GTi

footfistart said:


> I had juddering wipers and I can across bar keepers and it's amazing.





footfistart said:


> Strange. I've never had an issue with wipers judder. Every six months also i clay the screen and then scrub it with BKF and seal it with RainX (two coats) and never have issues. Not sure how graphite will help surely that will just scratch the screen?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Bit of a contradiction there! 

Graphite would be very unlikely to scratch the screen as it has a similar hardness level as talc. It helps by acting as a lubricant as it's a very slippery substance.

Anyway the powder arrived yesterday.










However, it had started to rain just as I was about to go out to apply it. I gave it a go anyway and sprinkled some onto a paper towel, rubbed it together then ran it up and down the blades. I did both cars but it's mainly for the wife's, her blades are a bit older than mine (Bosch Aerotwin). Rain was only light but when I flicked the wipers on, smooth and no squeak. She used it today so I asked her how they were and she didn't notice anything (doesn't mean much :lol

Does seem like it worked though. I'll report back again after I've tried them myself. I'd also maybe like to try dipping an acid brush in the graphite and applying it that way, probably with the wipers off the car. Sort of dusting it on.

P.s. the powder was less that £3 for a 60ml bottle.


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