# Engine Flushing???



## Zero Defects

G'day, I have a petrol fueled,1.8i k-series landrover engine! Been using wynns engine flush before the last couple of oil changes letting it idle for 30 mins or so before draining. Replacing with new oil (Castrol Edge Sport) and adding wynns valve lifter treatment.

Speaking to some other people they said its fine to run it with the engine flush in, for a day or so before draining and results are better, I have no issues with this, but I have also heard that FORTE ADVANCED FORMULA ENGINE FLUSH is a well respected flush. 

I have then read that the best way to flush it is by replacing the oil with DIESEL ENGINE OIL and running it for 1500 miles or so and this is a much more thorough cleanse than the quick fix flushes such as wynns, stp etc

Diesel engine oil contains higher amounts of detergents but apart from that should cause no distress to my engine, 

I need to know if any of you can advise or tell me your experience of flushing your engines in any of the above ways???

Thanks for reading please help


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## kenmac

Dont add flush (nasty stuff) then drive your car it will have the same amount of protection as using water instead of oil and will break down you new oil's protection when you refill with fresh oil,as the idea behind flushing is to shift the sludge in certain parts of the engine where oil just sits and builds up as sludge because it cant drain in to the sump,but the flush the sits in these same places so then you add fresh oil start your car you then mix the flush in with it,and flush is very very strong to break down oil,diesel oil is the best way to clean out an engine,but if your only doing average mileage you don't need to flush every change.


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## PJS

A bit of a contentious issue, but I personally don't rate Wynns for effectiveness.
Have used and believe is effective, Liqui Moly Proline, but will be trying BG Products Quick Clean.

The comment about using diesel oil because of the additional additives is one that I've read before, but believe it is mineral oil rather than synthetic.

Forté is well respected, since they are generally used routinely by your local Vauxhall dealership.

Use google uk for further info on the Liqui Moly and BG Products.


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## shiny_cougar

Has anyone heard of using diesel as an engine flush? Sure I read somewhere that you could add about a pint and that worked a treat!!! I usually get some cheepo stuff from supermarket for about a fiver and flush current oil, top up with that, run engine for around 30 mins then drain out again. Fit new filter and fill with the good stuff!!! As above mate, flushes can be very nasty...


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## TinyD

Dont use diesel or fluhing products in a petrol engine. 

You may remove deposits that are preventing leaks on older engines. 

A £5 cheapo mineral oil from Asda, a Halfrauds filter and a half an hour Blat getting some high revs before changing out the oil again is much better plus you do not run the risk of leaving flushing products in your engine after you have refilled with your new expsensive oil.

Hotdrain and flush with cheapo oil is the way forward. :thumb:


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## kenmac

A mate f mine had an old Nissan Sylvia Turbo and it was a fantastic car not a sound from the engine,flushed it after I told him not to and then the tappets sounded like an old Cortina OHC and never was able to silence them..


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## nicholassheppard

Product Code: AEF
Amsoil Crankcase Cleaner & Engine Flush 
480 ml Can - £6.99 
AMSOIL Fast Acting Engine Flush is made from a carefully selected blend of solvents and special cleaning agents that dissolve and disperse harmful deposits formed in the crankcase, cylinder walls, pistons and rings of an internal combustion engine. When used as directed, it cleans and restores operating efficiency to valves, valve lifters, rocker arms, and pistons for improved horsepower, fuel economy, and performance.
One treatment of AMSOIL Engine Flush cleans engines for reduced wear and longer engine life. Use before changing oil. 

Why Clean Your Engine? 

Chances are, when your engine was new it delivered the power and fuel efficiency it was designed for. But now, as your engine accumulates miles, things are happening that are adversely affecting its performance. Slowly but surely, your engine is gathering harmful deposits that will eventually cost you money. 

Even though you may follow a routine service schedule, your driving conditions may be far from routine. Stop and go driving, prolonged periods of idling, short trips that don't allow your engine time to warm up, towing a trailer, the ingestion of airborne dirt, fuel dilution, water condensation, and oxidized oil will eventually cause the formation of a thick, gummy deposit known as sludge. Settling throughout the engine, sludge will clog oil passages, restricting the flow of oil to vital engine parts, especially in the upper valve train areas. 





It's the only product I use.


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## Guest

^^^^^

I've used this, But.... only at 65,000 miles when deciding to change over to synthetic. Your to pour it in and just let the engine _idle_ for about 20 minutes then drain. It really thins your oil out. Did it do a good job? I don't know, but I would NOT be using a flush at each and every oil change. I however highly recommend AMSOIL products.


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## Guest

No expert, just from what I have read:



kenmac said:


> Dont add flush (nasty stuff) then drive your car it will have the same amount of protection as using water instead of oil


I agree with what you are saying but I think saying its as good as water is a bit of an exaggeration- providing you follow the instructions 

Anyhow moving on - After reading up this a lot it is still a subject of huge debate and *none* of the major car manafacturers reccomend using engine flush (maybe bar one or two actually), now of course they could just be doing that for marketing reasons or to cover their backside, but it should be noted. Same with fuel system cleaner for that matter.

You would probably be better, instead of using an engine flush, just switch to a good quality oil and increase the frequency of changes, the so-called detergents in the oil should do the job, albiet slower, except you don't run the risk of causing any damage from inadaquate lubrication.



> A £5 cheapo mineral oil from Asda, a Halfrauds filter and a half an hour Blat getting some high revs before changing out the oil again is much better plus you do not run the risk of leaving flushing products in your engine after you have refilled with your new expsensive oil.


Hmm that just sounds like creating engine wear for no reason that... As above you'd be much better just switching to a good quality oil, and then changing after 3k/3 months or whatever.


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## richie.guy

I've always run forte through before any oil changes in all my cars.

I run the flush for longer than the tin says, usually for around 50 miles.

Engines are still going strong all be it in different shells :lol:



TinyD said:


> You may remove deposits that are preventing leaks on older engines.


Do it for the life of the engine then, you're kidding yourself if you think an engine is fine because it's being 'held together' by useless deposits and not flushing it is keeping the engine healthy. If the engine is in that state it's shot anyway and will die sooner or later.


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## chrisc

buy some cheap 20-50 crapo oil as good as flushing oil the drain off its not dear for 5 litres


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## richie.guy

chrisc said:


> buy some cheap 20-50 crapo oil as good as flushing oil the drain off its not dear for 5 litres


The whole point of 'flushing oil' is that it's thinner than the normal oil used, why use something as thick as 20-50?


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## chrisc

yeah aknow what i meant to say was what i used to do was add concentrated flushing oil.then drain.then add either 20-50 or flushing oil.theres a difference between concentrated and flushing oil but first lot gets rid of lots of crap then second lot with either20-50-or flushig oil gets rid of whats left.in my opion.used to work for oil company and this what i always did.


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## chrisfoster1971

I have used Forte as they are by far the easiest and best for the money you pay for them. Amisol is also very good but I've found it to be more expensive.

Forte for me everytime.


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## DaveDesign

How about pooring a solvent in or white spirit or something, Idle for 15 min then drop the oil, new filter new oil?

Got to be better than the £7 flush I just brought:wave:


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## Cliff

I rate all Forte products very highly :thumb:


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## Guest

DaveDesign said:


> How about pooring a solvent in or white spirit or something, Idle for 15 min then drop the oil, new filter new oil?
> 
> Got to be better than the £7 flush I just brought:wave:


I wouldn't have thought that is a very wise idea!


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## Fat Audi 80

Everyone. Ignore ALL of the DIY advice and stick to a well respected "Engine Flush" product and follow the instructions. 

If it says "DONT DRIVE WITH IT IN" Don't. the warning is there for a reason!

If you don't want to flush, increase the quality of your oil, and the quantity of your oil changes...

Its simple really.

Cheers,

Steve.


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## Benn

Never use flush, it does more damage most of the time than good.
As it can get traped in tappets and other parts of the engine, it can also remove oil and build up (doesnt sound good but it can be) and some can damage the rings too.


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## PootleFlump

I reckon just ensuring that the car gets regular oil changes say every 7000 miles or 6 months and use decent quality oil and there will be no need to any flushing.


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## Schnorbitz

If you have regular oil changes, (6 monthly) no need for 'flushes'. I have read oil experts on t'internet criticising them saying they just dislodge the crap inside your engine and could do more harm than good. I am a big fan of regular oil changes. It can't do any harm to the engine! Most people say it is the best thing you can do to keep your car in tip-top shape. If you want to do anything, use a flushing oil, or ensure that you heat up the engine before changing the oil to flush all the crap out. Far better to change the oil every six months, regardless of 'manufacturers service intervals' which are mostly to reduce fleet costs i reckon. I try and change the oil every three months or 3,000 miles if i can (VTEC Honda).


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## Nickos

don't use "flushes". Get some cheapy oil from tesco (or the like) and use that along with a new filter. Drain old crap, cheapy oil and filter refill, run for a little while or go for a drive. Return, drain, change filter, refill with descent oil & job done.

**disclaimer** This is advice, not instruction!! I take no responsibility if it goes wrong in any way.


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## Guest

Nickos said:


> don't use "flushes". Get some cheapy oil from tesco (or the like) and use that along with a new filter. Drain old crap, cheapy oil and filter refill, run for a little while or go for a drive. Return, drain, change filter, refill with descent oil & job done.
> 
> **disclaimer** This is advice, not instruction!! You do it at your own risk.


Basically all you have done is an oil change with a life of what? 10,25,50,100 miles and just pi$$ed your money away and then you do another change with more expensive oil.

What did the short 10,25,50,100 mile oil change accomplish?


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## PJS

All good advice, but to someone buying a used car, you've no idea what quality of oil they used or how they drove it, etc.

As for usage, I forgot to mention I change the old filter out, replace with a new one (£4-5 equivalent OEM one) run the flush treatment either static or drive at low rpm for 50 miles or so, then drain properly (no via sucking the oil out through the filler cap, as some low price places do, to save time!), then refill with high quality oil.

The problem is, 99% of owners will NOT do an intermediary check on their oil state - £16 for oil analysis by Amsoil's UK distributor - performanceoilltd.co.uk - which would give you plenty of info on what state the oil was in, whether its usefulness was up or not, and what the wear metals might indicate regarding various elements of the engine's internals.
If you have an oil that has no reserve alkalinity to absorb the acidic compounds produced by the combustion process, then you are running with acidic oil causing more damage than it's preventing.

The laughable thing is, everyone will quibble over an extra £10-20 per oil service/annum for the sake of going with an adequate oil, rather than exceptional oil.
Bearing in mind the cost of an engine, or work needing doing on one if it should go wrong, and suddenly the £20 or so doesn't seem like such a bad deal from an insurance standpoint.
To that end, I consider Motul and Amsoil to be pretty much the top tier oil manufacturers, and have just gone for a full Motul fluids change with their 8100 engine oil, 300 gear oil, ATF/steering fluid, and Inugel ultra for coolant, and Amsoil's oil filter - at 2x the price of the OEM one.

I don't see the point in being wasteful of oil though, so would never suggest adopting the 3-5K miles rule that a lot of US drivers tend to do.
If your routine is regular, then the oil analysis will be useful knowledge for the future, if you plan on hanging on to the car, and stick with the same oil brand and type.


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## chrisfoster1971

I use Fuchs oil in my mitsi which seems to be pretty good so far but would consider other recommendations


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## PJS

chrisfoster1971 said:


> I use Fuchs oil in my mitsi which seems to be pretty good so far but would consider other recommendations


Motul 300v or Amsoil - a fair bit more than what you're paying for the Fuchs, but then, like a lot of things, you only get what you pay for.
Presume you're referring to an Evo?
If a regular Mitsubishi, then you could save a bit dropping down to the Motul 8100 range, which I would consider better than Fuchs for similar money.


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## SiGainey

Shell Helix Ultra. I've used this in red top Vauxhall engines on a race circuit and it's clean and no wear in the engine after a full season racing... Can't say much more than that....


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## Guest

PJS said:


> Motul 300v or Amsoil - a fair bit more than what you're paying for the Fuchs, but then, like a lot of things, you only get what you pay for.
> Presume you're referring to an Evo?
> If a regular Mitsubishi, then you could save a bit dropping down to the Motul 8100 range, which I would consider better than Fuchs for similar money.


Out of intrest why do you say Motul is better than Fuchs PJS? (I ask because I am about to order some from opieoils :lol


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## rapidseven

The best way to know if you need a flush is the colour of the oil on the dipstick.

If the oil is clean, you dont need a flush.

If you decide you want to flush, ive used forte since the 90's.

There is no subsitute for expensive oil if you care for your car.


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## Guest

How does the colour of the oil on the dipstick indicte whether you need a flush? in the winter especially the colour will go black in weeks/days, even hours (of running) of adding new oil.


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## Mackerfly

We put a couple of engine flushes through a car at work and it ended up needing a new turbo because the engine flush had eaten away at the seals. But thats just what happened in this case. Also had a fiesta which had a missfire and someone in the office said to put an engine flush through it and then it started smoking really really bad. But from working in a garage I always see cars when something is wrong with them.


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## PJS

G220 said:


> Out of intrest why do you say Motul is better than Fuchs PJS? (I ask because I am about to order some from opieoils :lol


From what info I've been able to glean from here, there, and everywhere, and as Fuchs plays second fiddle to its bigger named cousin - Silkolene - Motul appears to be a better oil on the 8100 front, and the 300V against the Pro S.

Don't get the impression I'm relegating Fuchs to the same thought of position as Halfords' own brand oils, but in the overall landscape of who lines up where, I put them behind Motul's 8100.


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## tmagnet

I'll add my 2p while i'm here 
The girlfriend has a 1959 Morris Minor. The engine has probably had a hard life as we only aquired it 2years ago so who knows how it was treated the previous 48years. In the past 18-24months we have given it 4-5 oil and filter changes, each time it has been new 20/50 halfords oil going in it which has quite a green colour to it. Then a few months later and not many miles when i've drained the oil it has always been very black.
I thought i'd try something out on it as we have a few spare engines, so I used some Electrical insulating oil to flush it. The oil is very thin, not much thicker than water and offers basically no lubricating properties as it is not a lubricating oil. I must have run the engine 3times in a row on this oil, each time draining it and putting new 'flush' oil in. All 3lots of this oil came out black(this oil is a watery/very light yellow colour new). When i drained the oil i tried to shine a light through it...couldn't see the light through it. Anyway, i flushed it 3times just leaving it to tickover for 3-4mins before draining it. After the 3rd lot of 'flush oil' I left the sump plug out and put some new 20/50 oil in just to flush out the 'flush oil' (if that makes sense)
Sump plug back in, new filter and dropped the new oil in. It's been quite a few months now and the oil is still like new! Nice and green, I can't believe how much rubbish it flushed out!
It's had no adverse problems to the engine and this is still an original engine with many miles on it. I'm not too sure what it would do to a modern engine but doubt it'd do too much damage left on tickover for a couple of minutes.


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## TheSam101

always change the filter aswell when doing an oil change if you just leave it, as soon as your fresh oil runs through the old filter it will get contaminated with the nasty stuff thats sat in there


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## fdrightup

tmagnet said:


> I'll add my 2p while i'm here
> The girlfriend has a 1959 Morris Minor. The engine has probably had a hard life as we only aquired it 2years ago so who knows how it was treated the previous 48years. In the past 18-24months we have given it 4-5 oil and filter changes, each time it has been new 20/50 halfords oil going in it which has quite a green colour to it. Then a few months later and not many miles when i've drained the oil it has always been very black.
> I thought i'd try something out on it as we have a few spare engines, so I used some Electrical insulating oil to flush it. The oil is very thin, not much thicker than water and offers basically no lubricating properties as it is not a lubricating oil. I must have run the engine 3times in a row on this oil, each time draining it and putting new 'flush' oil in. All 3lots of this oil came out black(this oil is a watery/very light yellow colour new). When i drained the oil i tried to shine a light through it...couldn't see the light through it. Anyway, i flushed it 3times just leaving it to tickover for 3-4mins before draining it. After the 3rd lot of 'flush oil' I left the sump plug out and put some new 20/50 oil in just to flush out the 'flush oil' (if that makes sense)
> Sump plug back in, new filter and dropped the new oil in. It's been quite a few months now and the oil is still like new! Nice and green, I can't believe how much rubbish it flushed out!
> It's had no adverse problems to the engine and this is still an original engine with many miles on it. I'm not too sure what it would do to a modern engine but doubt it'd do too much damage left on tickover for a couple of minutes.


if your engine oil is going black quick then the piston rings are worn


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## tmagnet

fdrightup said:


> if your engine oil is going black quick then the piston rings are worn


You would have thought so, however the oil isn't going black anymore, and it doesn't seem to be burning oil. Had the head off over christmas to put a new one on. Checked the bores and they looked to be in good condition...although they were a bit smooth.


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## fdrightup

tmagnet said:


> You would have thought so, however the oil isn't going black anymore, and it doesn't seem to be burning oil. Had the head off over christmas to put a new one on. Checked the bores and they looked to be in good condition...although they were a bit smooth.


did you give the bores a hone


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## PhillipM

Oil is supposed to go black, it tells you the detergents are doing their job.


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## Guest

PhillipM said:


> Oil is supposed to go black, it tells you the detergents are doing their job.


Yeah, in all our cars the oil has gone fairly black in a few weeks (even days) of an oil change after a few thousand miles. I don't think you can conclude there is anything wrong because of that.


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## tmagnet

fdrightup said:


> did you give the bores a hone


Would have been nice to rough the bores up a bit, but as it wasn't a full rebuild i didn't bother.

Just to add to the two comments above, what engines are you talking about? I ask this as in diesels, the oil goes black as it cleans the engine. Oil for petrol lubricates and leaves the 'dirt' on the engine instead of in the oil.
If ever you get to strip down diesel and petrol engines you will find the diesel engine to be cleaner than the petrol.


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## cosmos

Hi all,

For what it's worth, I can't recommend Forte products highly enough. I have used the flush in trade work under the Good garage scheme.

The amount of extra 'sediment' and black bit's which would come out on an oil change - especially diesels - was astounding. 

I personally carried out an oil flush on a Volvo 850 T5 with the gas treatment for petrol. Before and after compression tests showed at least a 1.5 bar increase with one cylinder nearer 2 bar. All cylinders were within 5psi of each other.

I am not affilitated with forte in any way, but will continue to use them :thumb:


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## PhillipM

tmagnet said:


> Would have been nice to rough the bores up a bit, but as it wasn't a full rebuild i didn't bother.
> 
> Just to add to the two comments above, what engines are you talking about? I ask this as in diesels, the oil goes black as it cleans the engine. Oil for petrol lubricates and leaves the 'dirt' on the engine instead of in the oil.
> If ever you get to strip down diesel and petrol engines you will find the diesel engine to be cleaner than the petrol.


All oils clean the engine, pretty much every oil on the market has a detergent package of differing strengths, diesel specific oils have stronger detergent packages to remove the carbon buildup from diesel blowby on the piston rings.

This isn't really an issue with a petrol as it burns far 'cleaner' in normal operating conditions, so they have lesser amounts of detergents, they still have some however, as there are still some carbon deposits to remove, especially from burnt on oil under the pistons and around the bores that can occur at high operating temperatures (I.E, giving it some serious welly on crap oil...)


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## shaqs77

i prefer to hot flush.

i own a halfords trade card so i can get service very cheap,

oil filter of my 98 a4 avant 1.9tdi

£9.36 without trade discount

£2.35 with trade discount!!!!

so i personally change my oil and oil filter 2 or 3 times a year which is alot better than ANY additive!!!


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## stevee

I used to have an R5 GT Turbo - was told not to flush the engine, as there was an oil reservoir to aid getting oil to the 'top' of the engine when cold (which would have stored some 'flushed' oil)- not sure if it's true, but it stopped me doing it!!!

Used to refresh with Mobil 1 every 3000 miles - that was an expensive pastime!!


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## Nickos

Some people on the bimmer forums use a 50/50 mix of atf / standard oil. Use a new filter for the flush. Don't drive, just let it circulate on the spot for 15 - 25 mins, drain and do it again, Then change the filter and fill with the good stuff.

This shouldn't be a regular thing and is more like once every 100k....

Of coarse, i take no responsibility for anything going wrong.


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## Dixondmn

I too perform 6 monthly or 6k oil changes will the correct specified oil.

I only do about 9k a year so usually change the oil every 6 months.


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## msb

forte products are fantastic because the engine flush doesnt degrease like alot of others so its perfectly safe to put in and run the car! i usually do it about 2/3 days before changing the oil, its been known for some people i know to do up to a couple of hundred miles with the flush in with no adverse effects! tbh my local garage reckon the biggest problem is people dont leave them in long enough to work!


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## Mirror Finish Details

My car has 187k on the clock and never used a flush. I just change the oil and filter every 5,000 miles. Never had a problem.

Had to change the sump once on a 300k mile Mondeo Diesel that had the oil changed every 5,000 miles. No sludge in sight whatsoever.


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## Mirror Finish Details

G220 said:


> How does the colour of the oil on the dipstick indicte whether you need a flush? in the winter especially the colour will go black in weeks/days, even hours (of running) of adding new oil.


May do on a diesel but the wifes Rav had an oil change in September and the oil is still clean on the dip stick, meaning it is still doing it's job and that was 4,000 miles ago. Will be changed in March when it has it's service.


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## alexf

I try to change the oil every 3k miles on the golf (1983) and refuse to use an engine flush because I just do not trust them. Regular oil changes on an old engine are the best thing to do. I use the very good green comma 20w50 in mine, not the 10w40 as everyone else does on the mk1 forum for the simple reason that I dont want to be spending an absolute fortune due to more regular top ups in between with the lower grade.


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## ivor

Mirror Finish said:


> May do on a diesel but the wifes Rav had an oil change in September and the oil is still clean on the dip stick, meaning it is still doing it's job and that was 4,000 miles ago. Will be changed in March when it has it's service.


hate to tell you this but if an oil is staying clean on your dipstick it's not doing it's job as it's designed to remove all the carbon and deposits from the combustion process as well as lubricate.

I've used an oil flush before but opinions are well and truly divided as to wether you should or not some say yes it will do your engine good by removing all the crap that's built up over the years others say not to as the crap that's built up is stopping the engine from leaking oil as it's well and truly bedded in. If you think you need a flush through i would just get it refreshed of course it depends on the engine mileage and oil consumption.

First thing I would do with that engine is take the head off and replace the gasket as these are a notorious weak point on that engine


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## sitewideelectrical

Wow there are a lot of chicken little sky falling people out there! Farmers have been using diesel to clean engines since engines have been invented.. Yes you can put a small amount of diesel in a petrol engine to clean it out! You saw it YES The deisel acts as a detergent!,,,, I'm talking 500mL of deisel into the sump and run the engine for 10 minutes at idle, no longer. Dump the oil, replace the oil filter then fill with oil and your away. Benefits = it cleans the gunk out of your engine, engine will run a lot better, you will feel the difference. Against = some company will miss out on your money... , chicken little people will get something to whine about...that's about it.... The deisel acts as a detergent! Cleaning the galleries out!.... I said it again... It will not damage a motor in anyway if you just do that!.. No it wont damage seals, gaskets bearings or anything.... Farmers have been using this method because it works!.... And its cheap!,,, It's not rocket science!... Not many farmers know much about rockets but they know about engines because they use and rely on them alot! It's a motor, it spins at high rims, it's made of steel or alloys, you won't break it cleaning it... you will break it if you dont clean it and leave all that gunk inside it, as it will build up and block the oil galleries eventually... leading to major damage! Have some faith people! Don't believe chicken little and get busy cleaning out your engine! Do the Oil change and clean engine every 5k to 10000kms. ( up to you ) The very fact your looking after it will mean it WILL last longer! Your engine will run a long long time if you do that. If you are chicken little, go and try it and see thru your BS...for a change! Enjoy Coca Cola!


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## BrummyPete

Wow another 12 year old thread back from the dead


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## macca666

BrummyPete said:


> Wow another 12 year old thread back from the dead


I'm seeing at least one a day I know I'd posted a thread about SPAM accounts it's getting a right PITA.


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## ridders66

macca666 said:


> I'm seeing at least one a day I know I'd posted a thread about SPAM accounts it's getting a right PITA.


I’ve given over reporting them as nothing seems to be done, have we any mods left? Are there any other detailing forums which are as good as DW used to be?


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## garage_dweller

I know it’s odd that a 12 year old post has been resurrected but I can’t see in any way why the actual post itself is spam. Username is an odd one though.
I would agree that there’s something going on with all these new posters posting on very old threads and it does need looked at


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## Andy from Sandy

Well now it has been resurrected ...

In this day and age I don't think an engine needs flushing. All the oils I have seen say they contain latest detergents, dispersants, anti corrosion additives and what-not make it unnecessary.


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## AndyN01

Just a thought. Does anyone know if there's ever been a court case (I'd guess in the USA) where an "Engine Flush" manufacturer has been sued for damaging or reducing the life of an engine? I did a quick Google search but came up with all sorts of irrelevant stuff.

On the basis that someone is currently suing about Kraft "Mac & cheese" prep time (Florida woman sues Kraft mac and cheese over preparation time) I'd have thought that if it's happened then someone would have jumped all over it?

Andy.


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## Trip tdi

Millers do one its detergent based, the others are solvent based on the market.
As mentioned on this thread forte are good but I never used there flush wynns own them, the company that started forte are now 4tec, hope this is some help.


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## macca666

garage_dweller said:


> I know it’s odd that a 12 year old post has been resurrected but I can’t see in any way why the actual post itself is spam. Username is an odd one though.
> I would agree that there’s something going on with all these new posters posting on very old threads and it does need looked at


Couple of thoughts.

Firstly they'll either post spam or here until they get a decent post count or "appear" to be a regular user meaning if they posted a link it's more likely to be clicked on by others.

Secondly potentially they're spamming many forums creating an overall online profile on a websearch which appears genuine allowing them to carry out whatever scam they're working on.....


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## garage_dweller

macca666 said:


> Couple of thoughts.
> 
> Firstly they'll either post spam or here until they get a decent post count or "appear" to be a regular user meaning if they posted a link it's more likely to be clicked on by others.
> 
> Secondly potentially they're spamming many forums creating an overall online profile on a websearch which appears genuine allowing them to carry out whatever scam they're working on.....


I get where you’re coming from but why contribute to such old posts, would be easier to post on new ones surely and would be less suspicious. Also why such a lengthy post, obviously it could just be copy/paste. 
just seems a very convoluted way to create an online person.


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