# Audi S1



## Soul boy 68

Anyone seen the new Audi S1 which was revealed today?:car:


----------



## rob_vrs

Yes I want one, fits in the range fairly well


----------



## RisingPower

Wish I hadn't, ugly and slow.


----------



## Soul boy 68

rob_vrs said:


> Yes I want one


Me too, pretty quick off the mark by all acounts and it's limited to 155 MPH, for a car of this size that's wow.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Wish I hadn't, ugly and slow.


0 to 60 in 5.2 seconds, with 340 NM of torque and limited to 155 MPH, that's hardly slow is it?


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> 0 to 60 in 5.2 seconds, with 340 NM of torque and limited to 155 MPH, that's hardly slow is it?


5.8 according to top gear and a lot of other places. which is as close to 6 seconds as not mattering.

340nm of torque really isn't that much and I doubt it would hit 155.

For reference sake

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2014/02/audi-s1-revealed-231hp-scowling-fascia.html

There is no reason for a tiny car to have four doors, it just looks stupid and makes it heavier.


----------



## suspal

A little beauty


----------



## RisingPower

Oh and, audi also clearly think that sticking bits of black, a tacky cheap spoiler, a diffuser on a car that doesn't need one and significant arch gap makes a car look attractive.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> 5.8 according to top gear and a lot of other places. which is as close to 6 seconds as not mattering.
> 
> 340nm of torque really isn't that much and I doubt it would hit 155.


When it gets taken down to the race track come test time you will see that it will reach the reported 155mph. I think it will blow away the fiesta st and more than capable of matching the Golf GTI. It's all early but these stats are based on Audi figures.


----------



## Soul boy 68

suspal said:


> A little beauty


I agree, a little beauty. Not sure about the yellow though, would like to see the other colours available before deciding.:car:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> 0 to 60 in 5.2 seconds, with 340 NM of torque and limited to 155 MPH, that's hardly slow is it?


Ignore him, hes just trolling


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> When it gets taken down to the race track come test time you will see that it will reach the reported 155mph. I think it will blow away the fiesta st and more than capable of matching the Golf GTI. It's all early but these stats are based on Audi figures.


Tbh I find none of those interesting either really, but I find 4 doors on a tiny hatch, stupid.

I think the abarth is a fun little car, I'm not really sure what the others appeal on.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Ignore him, hes just trolling


It's not that quick, 5.8 seconds! Tiny hatches aren't generally and I do find this ugly compared to the competition.


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> It's not that quick, 5.8 seconds! Tiny hatches aren't generally and I do find this ugly compared to the competition.


In your opinion of course, its just a tad biased :lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Tbh I find none of those interesting either really, but I find 4 doors on a tiny hatch, stupid.
> 
> I think the abarth is a fun little car, I'm not really sure what the others appeal on.


The four doors is more for practicality but I prefer the three door version, the Golf also comes in four doors and is of a similar size so are pretty much other cars in this tough segment.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> I agree, a little beauty. Not sure about the yellow though, would like to see the other colours available before deciding.:car:


Yes interested to see it in other colours :thumb:


----------



## DW58

RisingPower said:


> Wish I hadn't, ugly and slow.





RisingPower said:


> 5.8 according to top gear and a lot of other places. which is as close to 6 seconds as not mattering.
> 
> 340nm of torque really isn't that much and I doubt it would hit 155.
> 
> For reference sake
> 
> http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2014/02/audi-s1-revealed-231hp-scowling-fascia.html
> 
> There is no reason for a tiny car to have four doors, it just looks stupid and makes it heavier.





RisingPower said:


> Oh and, audi also clearly think that sticking bits of black, a tacky cheap spoiler, a diffuser on a car that doesn't need one and significant arch gap makes a car look attractive.





RisingPower said:


> Tbh I find none of those interesting either really, but I find 4 doors on a tiny hatch, stupid.
> 
> I think the abarth is a fun little car, I'm not really sure what the others appeal on.





RisingPower said:


> It's not that quick, 5.8 seconds! Tiny hatches aren't generally and I do find this ugly compared to the competition.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> The four doors is more for practicality but I prefer the three door version, the Golf also comes in four doors and is of a similar size so are pretty much other cars in this tough segment.


It's a tiny hatch! Who buys a tiny hatch for practicality?!

Lower it significantly, give it a ramped profile and not like that other abomination of an audi which I forget the name of, just looked like a cube on wheels and sat really high.

I thought the audi s1 was the same size as the fiesta st, if not, how does it fit in that segment?


----------



## RisingPower

DW58 said:


>


Oh go back to your derv golf shoe


----------



## Soul boy 68

DW58 said:


>


:lol: Don't worry fella, I am not going to sulk at these responses as the car will speak for itself.


----------



## DW58

No derv for me sunshine - not very observant are you?


----------



## DW58

Soul boy 68 said:


> :lol: Don't worry fella, I am not going to sulk at these responses as the car will speak for itself.


You can be guaranteed that at least one or more of the three usual anti-VAG trolls will show up, RP is here just waiting for the other usual suspects to show up now


----------



## 182_Blue

So, back to the car, any pictures other than the yellow ?


----------



## RisingPower

DW58 said:


> No derv for me sunshine - not very observant are you?


You had a derv golf I thought? Or was it a 1.4 petrol? Tbh, I'm getting old and forgetting, like the name of that crossover audi produced in the late 90's / early 00's.


----------



## gaz_vxr

Sure it was a red one that was in last weeks autocar? Might be nippy but it still looks like an A1 at the end of the day! Just not my taste really.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> So, back to the car, any pictures other than the yellow ?


There are some in red iirc in the link I posted.

Wait, the link I didn't post yet.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Shared...ialPictures;kvEngineType=Petrol;kvPrice=2025;

It even has 3 doors and a far more sensible profile! Looks much better than the yellow.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> It's a tiny hatch! Who buys a tiny hatch for practicality?!
> 
> Lower it significantly, give it a ramped profile and not like that other abomination of an audi which I forget the name of, just looked like a cube on wheels and sat really high.
> 
> I thought the audi s1 was the same size as the fiesta st, if not, how does it fit in that segment?


I have driven the st and I don't like it one bit. from the back of it looks like a shrunken focus and it's poorly built with cheap interior plastics poorly screwed together and unexciting dash board. alltough it does handle well, but at the end of the day it's a fraud. I am now bracing my self for an onslaught of st owners. hey folks go easy on me now, it's all about opinions right?


----------



## Kriminal

RisingPower said:


> There are some in red iirc in the link I posted.
> 
> Wait, the link I didn't post yet.
> 
> http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Shared...ialPictures;kvEngineType=Petrol;kvPrice=2025;
> 
> It even has 3 doors and a far more sensible profile! Looks much better than the yellow.


^ Blimey! :doublesho RP posted something useful :thumb:


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> In your opinion of course, its just a tad biased :lol:


Biased how? I hate boring, samey cars. Which is what all of the mini hatches like the st, rs200 seem to be.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> There are some in red iirc in the link I posted.
> 
> Wait, the link I didn't post yet.
> 
> http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Shared...ialPictures;kvEngineType=Petrol;kvPrice=2025;
> 
> It even has 3 doors and a far more sensible profile! Looks much better than the yellow.


Have to agree with you fella that it does look better in Red, I would like to see the other colours aswell.


----------



## Kerr

I'd like to see another colour than yellow. 

Looks quite cute. 

It will be interesting to see how it performs. I'm not sure 228bhp from a 1400+kg car is anything groundbreaking though. 

5.8-5.9secs for 60mph seems disappointing given the performance of other new hot hatches with 4wd. Quite a few FWD hot hatches for similar money can match that. 

For all it is cute, I apologise that I'm not that excited.


----------



## DW58

RisingPower said:


> You had a derv golf I thought? Or was it a 1.4 petrol? Tbh, I'm getting old and forgetting, like the name of that crossover audi produced in the late 90's / early 00's.


Nope, I haven't owned a derv car since I sold my second Isuzu Trooper 2.8TD in January 1992.


----------



## RisingPower

Kriminal said:


> ^ Blimey! :doublesho RP posted something useful :thumb:


It's like the fiat 500, it's now been turned into a sodding people carrier, I mean wtf?


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Have to agree with you fella that it does look better in Red, I would like to see the other colours aswell.


It was the 3 doors and not being able to see those vile black bits, which were also hideous on the allroad audis.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Lone_Par said:


> Sure it was a red one that was in last weeks autocar? Might be nippy but it still looks like an A1 at the end of the day! Just not my taste really.


So what is your taste then?


----------



## RisingPower

DW58 said:


> Nope, I haven't owned a derv car since I sold my second Isuzu Trooper 2.8TD in January 1992.


Ah well, it was still a run of the mill golf


----------



## slineclean

Thought something might of appeared on the Audi website? can not see anything


----------



## Soul boy 68

DW58 said:


> You can be guaranteed that at least one or more of the three usual anti-VAG trolls will show up, RP is here just waiting for the other usual suspects to show up now


I wonder if these anti VAG trolls are fraud lovers!


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I wonder if these anti VAG trolls are fraud lovers!


I just dislike boring cars generally. The audi s1, the proper group b car, that was awesome, I love lambos, I struggle to think of any interesting vws that have gone to production, there were some that didn't.


----------



## gaz_vxr

Soul boy 68 said:


> So what is your taste then?


Not an Audi A1, that fine by you?!


----------



## Soul boy 68

Lone_Par said:


> Not an Audi A1, that fine by you?!


Not answered my question, what is your taste then or are you shy?


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> I just dislike boring cars generally. The audi s1, the proper group b car, that was awesome, I love lambos, I struggle to think of any interesting vws that have gone to production, there were some that didn't.


You love Lambos! me too but like yourself we can only dream of having one.
any other makes or models that float your boat I could do with a :lol:


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> You love Lambos! me too but like yourself we can only dream of having one.
> any other makes or models that float your boat I could do with a :lol:


I like mustangs, the ford gt, vettes, ultimas, the hennessey venom, viper, monaro, nsx, r34 gtr, vx220, nobles, radicals.

I can name lots that floats my boat. All of them i'd class as more interesting than a small hatch like the s1, st, corsa vxr etc etc.

I'm still waiting to hear what shaun thinks my bias is, especially as he knows I quite liked his scirocco in terms of design.


----------



## 182_Blue

^that's not really going to keep us on topic though is it ?


----------



## gaz_vxr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Not answered my question, what is your taste then or are you shy?


If you are that desperate and taking the fact that I don't like the A1/S1 model personally then I like a lot of different cars. Just not one of them!!! And if you are angling for anti VAG then my last car was a MK5 GTi. Happy?


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> ^that's not really going to keep us on topic though is it ?


Some people have said they like the s1, some haven't.

This was an opinions thread no? Comparisons generally make a good basis for opinions.


----------



## gaz_vxr

RisingPower said:


> Some people have said they like the s1, some haven't.
> 
> This was an opinions thread no? Comparisons generally make a good basis for opinions.


Agree but it shouldn't be a thread that justifies why you don't like it, because it's at odds with the OPs opinion!

Like you say, each to their own.


----------



## RisingPower

Lone_Par said:


> Agree but it shouldn't be a thread that justifies why you don't like it, because it's at odds with the OPs opinion!
> 
> Like you say, each to their own.


Does this mean I can start a thread for a love in on the new corvette c7 and nobody is entitled to have any other opinion than it's awesome (like that's possible)


----------



## possul

DW58 said:


> You can be guaranteed that at least one or more of the three usual anti-VAG trolls will show up, RP is here just waiting for the other usual suspects to show up now


:wave: or is it not me


----------



## Soul boy 68

Lone_Par said:


> If you are that desperate and taking the fact that I don't like the A1/S1 model personally then I like a lot of different cars. Just not one of them!!! And if you are angling for anti VAG then my last car was a MK5 GTi. Happy?


Yes happy now your not anti VAG.


----------



## Kerr

Just read back the rest of the thread. 

I think we should ban VAG talk on this forum. 

It does seem to be the only car threads that are active due to the amount of VAG enthusiasts on this site. 

Every VAG thread ends up the same, hundreds of PRO VAGERS getting wet about a car and taking exception to anyone who dares questions that. 

I know a comment was aimed at me before, and I'll probably get it in the neck again. 

Just what excites people about the S1? What do you think it has that we haven't seen before? 

The market is getting really busy with hot hatch backs of all various descriptions and drivetrains avaliable.

The S1 isn't that small, it isn't that light and 228bhp isn't exactly that much in today's hot hatch battle. 

Explain to me, other than the brand name, what does this car do for you?


----------



## johanr77

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/polo/85376/volkswagen-polo-r-250bhp-4wd-prototype-driven

Have to say i'd wait for that


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> Just read back the rest of the thread.
> 
> I think we should ban VAG talk on this forum.
> 
> It does seem to be the only car threads that are active due to the amount of VAG enthusiasts on this site.
> 
> Every VAG thread ends up the same, hundreds of PRO VAGERS getting wet about a car and taking exception to anyone who dares questions that.
> 
> I know a comment was aimed at me before, and I'll probably get it in the neck again.
> 
> Just what excites people about the S1? What do you think it has that we haven't seen before?
> 
> The market is getting really busy with hot hatch backs of all various descriptions and drivetrains avaliable.
> 
> The S1 isn't that small, it isn't that light and 228bhp isn't exactly that much in today's hot hatch battle.
> 
> Explain to me, other than the brand name, what does this car do for you?


Mini JCW is 215 HP
Fiesta st is 197 HP
KIA pro Ceed GT 215 hp
Skoda Octavia VRS 218 HP
these are to name but a few all fall short on the power of the S1 and all of similar size and I have owned ST, and Mini and I think the Audi is well built with quality interior and very strong performing not to mention award winning engines. and a desiarable image which will hold it's value come resale time. that's what the car does for me.


----------



## Soul boy 68

johanr77 said:


> http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/polo/85376/volkswagen-polo-r-250bhp-4wd-prototype-driven
> 
> Have to say i'd wait for that


The S1's little sister


----------



## RisingPower

johanr77 said:


> http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/volkswagen/polo/85376/volkswagen-polo-r-250bhp-4wd-prototype-driven
> 
> Have to say i'd wait for that


Wow, it's like... Identical.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Wow, it's like... Identical.


Should have looked like a Lambo:lol:


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Should have looked like a Lambo:lol:


A lambo with a 2.0 4cyl engine? If they stick a 8 litre v12 in it :thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> A lambo with a 2.0 4cyl engine? If they stick a 8 litre v12 in it :thumb:


Now that would be a monster. you can only dream


----------



## johanr77

Soul boy 68 said:


> The S1's little sister


Strictly speaking its the other way round the S1 is based on the polo wrc.

Polo will be cheaper has more power and for me looks nicer.


----------



## Soul boy 68

johanr77 said:


> Strictly speaking its the other way round the S1 is based on the polo wrc.
> 
> Polo will be cheaper has more power and for me looks nicer.


yes your right, the A1 is based on the Polo but I doubt it will have 250hp, it's all speculation and I don't think the Polo is as nice looking:thumb:


----------



## robertdon777

How much is the S1?

If it's about 23K it will sell well. Should hold good value too, and hopefully running a K04 or similar for an easy 300bhp remap.

Or is it just a tuned 2.0 K03 TFSi?


----------



## Soul boy 68

robertdon777 said:


> How much is the S1?
> 
> If it's about 23K it will sell well. Should hold good value too, and hopefully running a K04 or similar for an easy 300bhp remap.
> 
> Or is it just a tuned 2.0 K03 TFSi?


I think it's between 23 and 25k with a fair bit of kit on it plus the revised suspention, bigger brakes and with lots of grip and improved traction, can't wait for the official spec. I don't think you will see many on the road and it will not be as common as say the fiesta st. So I guess it will feel more exclusive.


----------



## rob_vrs

RisingPower said:


> Tbh I find none of those interesting either really, but I find 4 doors on a tiny hatch, stupid.
> 
> I think the abarth is a fun little car, I'm not really sure what the others appeal on.


Haha abarth will be way slower haha someone has a grudge against audi me thinks


----------



## rob_vrs

At £23k that will be a serious contender when i come to renew in 18months time


----------



## Nanoman

I was really hoping for an interesting thread on the new S1 but it seems to be getting trolled by people who say sub 6.0s 0-60 isn't fast, 220+ bhp isn't powerful and it isn't interesting compared to Lambos and Mustangs.

Who are these people?

Sub 6.0s 0-60 is 'fast' compared to most cars on the road.
220+bhp is 'powerful' compared to most cars on the road.
The spec list on this is 'interesting' compared to most cars on the road.

Also, my wife needs something when we get rid of the SLK280 and the S1 would fit the bill nicely - especially with 5 doors.

Compared to mustangs and lambos it's not special but compared to most cars on the road it is.

Any chance of starting the thread again without trolls?

Playing chess with pigeons...


----------



## RisingPower

rob_vrs said:


> Haha abarth will be way slower haha someone has a grudge against audi me thinks


So what if it's slower?


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> I was really hoping for an interesting thread on the new S1 but it seems to be getting trolled by people who say sub 6.0s 0-60 isn't fast, 220+ bhp isn't powerful and it isn't interesting compared to Lambos and Mustangs.
> 
> Who are these people?
> 
> Sub 6.0s 0-60 is 'fast' compared to most cars on the road.
> 220+bhp is 'powerful' compared to most cars on the road.
> The spec list on this is 'interesting' compared to most cars on the road.
> 
> Also, my wife needs something when we get rid of the SLK280 and the S1 would fit the bill nicely - especially with 5 doors.
> 
> Compared to mustangs and lambos it's not special but compared to most cars on the road it is.
> 
> Any chance of starting the thread again without trolls?
> 
> Playing chess with pigeons...


So, what makes it any different to any other hatchback in its class, as kerr said?

Why not buy a fiesta st, corsa vxr, renault clio rs200?

Do you need 5 doors? If so, wouldn't a saloon/larger hatchback be more practical?


----------



## robertdon777

Suppose a 5dr Clio rs is a good comparison.

But the Clio seems expensive. The interior is poor, the engine ain't the best, nor the gearbox. So an extra 4k will get you a much more desirable badge, a very classy interior, a far superior engine and 4wd.

It ain't a bad little car.

Personally I'd buy a second hand M135i 5dr for 25k if I was looking.


----------



## RisingPower

robertdon777 said:


> Suppose a 5dr Clio rs is a good comparison.
> 
> But the Clio seems expensive. The interior is poor, the engine ain't the best, nor the gearbox. So an extra 4k will get you a much more desirable badge, a very classy interior, a far superior engine and 4wd.
> 
> It ain't a bad little car.
> 
> Personally I'd buy a second hand M135i 5dr for 25k if I was looking.


The interior looks quite good on the rs, the engines don't seem much different (they're both small turbocharged petrol engines). So you're buying a badge and something that is heavier?


----------



## possul

Considering its a 2.0 petrol turbo it better had more power than others seeing as there a 1.6 turbo
(goes off to check specs)

But as kerr said apart from brand image what is about vag cars that gets everyone going? Be interested to see the answers to


----------



## RisingPower

possul said:


> Considering its a 2.0 petrol turbo it better had more power than others seeing as there a 1.6 turbo
> (goes off to check specs)
> 
> But as kerr said apart from brand image what is about vag cars that gets everyone going? Be interested to see the answers to


The only answer i've seen so far is a badge.

I wonder what kind of person wakes up in the morning and thinks, I must have an audi, or I must have a ford, or maybe, I must have a renault as nothing else will do?


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> So, what makes it any different to any other hatchback in its class, as kerr said?
> 
> Why not buy a fiesta st, corsa vxr, renault clio rs200?
> 
> Do you need 5 doors? If so, wouldn't a saloon/larger hatchback be more practical?





possul said:


> Considering its a 2.0 petrol turbo it better had more power than others seeing as there a 1.6 turbo
> (goes off to check specs)
> 
> But as kerr said apart from brand image what is about vag cars that gets everyone going? Be interested to see the answers to


There's lots that's different to others in it's class. We've looked at Corsa, Fiesta, Ibiza, Clio, DS3... None are as refined IMHO, our best experience with aftersales has been from audi, we like the styling, we like the 4wd... We want something small but with 5 doors, with decent performance, which is new...

I'm not a VAG fanboy or any other brand for that matter. I'm just looking to chat about the newly announced S1. Between the wife and I we've owned A metro, a punto, a 106, a corsa, an IS200, an A3, an SLK280 & an x-trail.

This is trolling (and in many ways inaccurate and unreasonable):


RisingPower said:


> Wish I hadn't, ugly and slow.


Can you stop trolling please and let people talk about the car or are you going to continue to be the pigeon on the chessboard? I enjoy DW but took a break from posting for a while due to the amount of trolling nonsense that goes on. I've started getting involved again but this is the kind of rubbish that will make me (and others no doubt) want to go somewhere else.

Feel free to start a thread 'best hot hatch debate' or 'why VAG cars are crap' or something. Feel free to contribute something relevant, helpful, useful. But if you just going to troll, why not find something else to do with your time so others can enjoy the site.

I think I'll unsubscribe to this one for now since it's been **** all over.


----------



## Soul boy 68

rob_vrs said:


> Haha abarth will be way slower haha someone has a grudge against audi me thinks


Yes there are a few on this forum that don't like Audi's. Can not understand why


----------



## Soul boy 68

rob_vrs said:


> At £23k that will be a serious contender when i come to renew in 18months time


I think the S1 is well worth a look :car:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Nanoman said:


> I was really hoping for an interesting thread on the new S1 but it seems to be getting trolled by people who say sub 6.0s 0-60 isn't fast, 220+ bhp isn't powerful and it isn't interesting compared to Lambos and Mustangs.
> 
> Who are these people?
> 
> Sub 6.0s 0-60 is 'fast' compared to most cars on the road.
> 220+bhp is 'powerful' compared to most cars on the road.
> The spec list on this is 'interesting' compared to most cars on the road.
> 
> Also, my wife needs something when we get rid of the SLK280 and the S1 would fit the bill nicely - especially with 5 doors.
> 
> Compared to mustangs and lambos it's not special but compared to most cars on the road it is.
> 
> Any chance of starting the thread again without trolls?
> 
> Playing chess with pigeons...


I agreed with every word you said my friend, you got to be realistic and how many people can afford Lambos and the like and you can not compare the S1 with these cars as they cost a heck of a lot more than 25k. Compare the S1 to it's rivals.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> There's lots that's different to others in it's class. We've looked at Corsa, Fiesta, Ibiza, Clio, DS3... None are as refined IMHO, our best experience with aftersales has been from audi, we like the styling, we like the 4wd... We want something small but with 5 doors, with decent performance, which is new...
> 
> I'm not a VAG fanboy or any other brand for that matter. I'm just looking to chat about the newly announced S1. Between the wife and I we've owned A metro, a punto, a 106, a corsa, an IS200, an A3, an SLK280 & an x-trail.
> 
> This is trolling (and in many ways inaccurate and unreasonable):
> 
> Can you stop trolling please and let people talk about the car or are you going to continue to be the pigeon on the chessboard? I enjoy DW but took a break from posting for a while due to the amount of trolling nonsense that goes on. I've started getting involved again but this is the kind of rubbish that will make me (and others no doubt) want to go somewhere else.
> 
> Feel free to start a thread 'best hot hatch debate' or 'why VAG cars are crap' or something. Feel free to contribute something relevant, helpful, useful. But if you just going to troll, why not find something else to do with your time so others can enjoy the site.
> 
> I think I'll unsubscribe to this one for now since it's been **** all over.


Why do you want something small with five doors? All audis pretty much are styled the same. Refinement, quite possibly, but I'm not entirely sure all audis are that refined to drive. 4wd in a hot small hatch though, it just makes it heavy and handle worse, which begs the question why it is necessary?

Why is what I said inaccurate and unreasonable? It's an opinion. It's not a fact and therefore is completely open to interpretation.

I don't think vag cars are crap, they make lambos for one thing, I just find the mass produced average cars not something to fall in love with.

Trolling would imply I actually care about your response, more than it just being an interesting debate.


----------



## Nanoman

Soul boy 68 said:


> I agreed with every word you said my friend, you got to be realistic and how many people can afford Lambos and the like and you can not compare the S1 with these cars as they cost a heck of a lot more than 25k. Compare the S1 to it's rivals.


Thanks. The fact it's got 5 doors is a big plus for us. They won't get used often but with 3 disabled people in the family who can't get into the back of a 3 door it's something we'll need. The thought of downsizing after the SLK280 was proving to be a bit of a worry until we spied this being announced earlier on PH twitter feed.



RisingPower said:


> Why do you want something small with five doors? All audis pretty much are styled the same. Refinement, quite possibly, but I'm not entirely sure all audis are that refined to drive. 4wd in a hot small hatch though, it just makes it heavy and handle worse, which begs the question why it is necessary?


lots of reasons as I just described.



RisingPower said:


> Why is what I said inaccurate and unreasonable? It's an opinion. It's not a fact and therefore is completely open to interpretation.


An opinion can be ridiculous to enough people to justify it being ridiculous.


RisingPower said:


> Trolling would imply I actually care about your response, more than it just being an interesting debate.


[/quote]
Trolling implies the opposite. Trolls don't care about others - they just want to be the pigeon.

And 4WD is a must on the icy hill we live at the top of up here even with winter tyres - hence the x-trail.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Nanoman said:


> There's lots that's different to others in it's class. We've looked at Corsa, Fiesta, Ibiza, Clio, DS3... None are as refined IMHO, our best experience with aftersales has been from audi, we like the styling, we like the 4wd... We want something small but with 5 doors, with decent performance, which is new...
> 
> I'm not a VAG fanboy or any other brand for that matter. I'm just looking to chat about the newly announced S1. Between the wife and I we've owned A metro, a punto, a 106, a corsa, an IS200, an A3, an SLK280 & an x-trail.
> 
> This is trolling (and in many ways inaccurate and unreasonable):
> 
> Can you stop trolling please and let people talk about the car or are you going to continue to be the pigeon on the chessboard? I enjoy DW but took a break from posting for a while due to the amount of trolling nonsense that goes on. I've started getting involved again but this is the kind of rubbish that will make me (and others no doubt) want to go somewhere else.
> 
> Feel free to start a thread 'best hot hatch debate' or 'why VAG cars are crap' or something. Feel free to contribute something relevant, helpful, useful. But if you just going to troll, why not find something else to do with your time so others can enjoy the site.
> 
> I think I'll unsubscribe to this one for now since it's been **** all over.


I agree yet again with someone on this thread. We don't need trolls on here, just a good honest debate about cars and detailing in general:thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Nanoman said:


> Thanks. The fact it's got 5 doors is a big plus for us. They won't get used often but with 3 disabled people in the family who can't get into the back of a 3 door it's something we'll need. The thought of downsizing after the SLK280 was proving to be a bit of a worry until we spied this being announced earlier on PH twitter feed.
> 
> lots of reasons as I just described.
> 
> An opinion can be ridiculous to enough people to justify it being ridiculous.
> 
> I drive an A1 sport back and it handles and drives very well and it's fun too. Especially going round major round a bouts at speed. It just sticks like glue with hardly any body roll, space in the back is a little tight if your over six foot tall other wise for average height it's fine.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> Thanks. The fact it's got 5 doors is a big plus for us. They won't get used often but with 3 disabled people in the family who can't get into the back of a 3 door it's something we'll need. The thought of downsizing after the SLK280 was proving to be a bit of a worry until we spied this being announced earlier on PH twitter feed.
> 
> lots of reasons as I just described.
> 
> An opinion can be ridiculous to enough people to justify it being ridiculous.


Trolling implies the opposite. Trolls don't care about others - they just want to be the pigeon.

And 4WD is a must on the icy hill we live at the top of up here even with winter tyres - hence the x-trail.[/QUOTE]

Why not an audi s3 then? Or an s4? Is there enough space in the back of the s1 for it to be practical? If you take a very small hatch like the abarth, the rear seats may be there, but are impractical.

Does it need to be small, is it going to be more of a town car?

An opinion is merely that.

Trolling imply any actions are done to elicit emotions. I'm not interested in emotions, only reasoning.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Why do you want something small with five doors? All audis pretty much are styled the same. Refinement, quite possibly, but I'm not entirely sure all audis are that refined to drive. 4wd in a hot small hatch though, it just makes it heavy and handle worse, which begs the question why it is necessary?
> 
> Why is what I said inaccurate and unreasonable? It's an opinion. It's not a fact and therefore is completely open to interpretation.
> 
> I don't think vag cars are crap, they make lambos for one thing, I just find the mass produced average cars not something to fall in love with.
> 
> Trolling would imply I actually care about your response, more than it just being an interesting debate.


I think you will find that most car makes are styled the same as well, all frauds look the same to me as Citron, BMW,Toyota as with most of them so it's unfair to say that Audi's look the same. Anyway that's the way Audi's roll


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I think you will find that most car makes are styled the same as well, all frauds look the same to me as Citron, BMW,Toyota as with most of them so it's unfair to say that Audi's look the same. Anyway that's the way Audi's roll


Ford mustang, toyota ft1, bmw z4, subaru brz

Audis are looking more and more alike these days, just like bmws, vws, etc etc.

There is the r8, but that's the only one I can think of. Unlike the mustang and z4, they're not really mass market.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Trolling implies the opposite. Trolls don't care about others - they just want to be the pigeon.
> 
> And 4WD is a must on the icy hill we live at the top of up here even with winter tyres - hence the x-trail.


Why not an audi s3 then? Or an s4? Is there enough space in the back of the s1 for it to be practical? If you take a very small hatch like the abarth, the rear seats may be there, but are impractical.

Does it need to be small, is it going to be more of a town car?

An opinion is merely that.

Trolling imply any actions are done to elicit emotions. I'm not interested in emotions, only reasoning.[/QUOTE]

the S3 and S4 are far more expensive, the S1 is a more affordable option.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Why not an audi s3 then? Or an s4? Is there enough space in the back of the s1 for it to be practical? If you take a very small hatch like the abarth, the rear seats may be there, but are impractical.
> 
> Does it need to be small, is it going to be more of a town car?
> 
> An opinion is merely that.
> 
> Trolling imply any actions are done to elicit emotions. I'm not interested in emotions, only reasoning.


the S3 and S4 are far more expensive, the S1 is a more affordable option.[/QUOTE]

5k isn't going to be a dealbreaker on a 25k car is it?


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> the S3 and S4 are far more expensive, the S1 is a more affordable option.


5k isn't going to be a dealbreaker on a 25k car is it?[/QUOTE]

The S4 is pushing 40k and a well spec S3 is well over 30k. Big difference me thinks.


----------



## rob_vrs

RisingPower said:


> So what if it's slower?


You said the s1 it's slow


----------



## Soul boy 68

rob_vrs said:


> You said the s1 it's slow


Short memory I think, well this has been a long and enjoyable thread


----------



## RisingPower

rob_vrs said:


> You said the s1 it's slow


The s1 is slow and has no characteristics that I think make it stand out massively from the competition.

The abarth isn't like any other small car i've seen, it's fun, light and has character.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> 5k isn't going to be a dealbreaker on a 25k car is it?


The S4 is pushing 40k and a well spec S3 is well over 30k. Big difference me thinks.[/QUOTE]

The s1 and s3 both in basic spec are 25k and 30k respectively. That's not a huge difference.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> The S4 is pushing 40k and a well spec S3 is well over 30k. Big difference me thinks.


The s1 and s3 both in basic spec are 25k and 30k respectively. That's not a huge 
How many people will buy these cars with basic spec so I stand corrected, S3 well over 30k with descent spec at least 8 or 9k more


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> The s1 is slow and has no characteristics that I think make it stand out massively from the competition.
> 
> The abarth isn't like any other small car i've seen, it's fun, light and has character.


The abarth has 165 hp. It's a snail, and it's a birds car.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> The s1 and s3 both in basic spec are 25k and 30k respectively. That's not a huge
> How many people will buy these cars with basic spec so I stand corrected, S3 well over 30k with descent spec at least 8 or 9k more


And the s1 similarly equipped?


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> The abarth has 165 hp. It's a snail, and it's a birds car.


I think it's cute


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> I think it's cute


 That's why it's a birds car, it's cute

Gonna start saving for that lambo.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Soul boy 68 said:


> That's why it's a birds car, it's cute
> 
> Gonna start saving for that lambo.


You should have that Lambo if you are in that pot of Gold


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> That's why it's a birds car, it's cute
> 
> Gonna start saving for that lambo.


Well if it attracts guys, maybe I need to get one


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Well if it attracts guys, maybe I need to get one


Better start saving now then, I am off to order my S1 have not got that pot of Gold for a Lambo


----------



## Wingnuts

Really not a fan it's fugly beyond belief


----------



## Doug_M

RisingPower said:


> The s1 is slow and has no characteristics that I think make it stand out massively from the competition.
> 
> The abarth isn't like any other small car i've seen, it's fun, light and has character.


Its 4wd... Thats a stand out feature


----------



## Soul boy 68

Wingnuts said:


> Really not a fan it's fugly beyond belief


Yes the 500 is dam fugly:driver:


----------



## WHIZZER

Quite like the s1 but think the polo r could be a good car too .... hmmmmmm ( new car for the other half me thinkies !!)


----------



## Soul boy 68

Doug_M said:


> Its 4wd... Thats a stand out feature


It will have lots of grip with plenty of torque and with improved suspension set up, it should be fun to drive.:driver:


----------



## Soul boy 68

WHIZZER said:


> Quite like the s1 but think the polo r could be a good car too .... hmmmmmm ( new car for the other half me thinkies !!)


Should be quiet interesting considering they both share the same DNA, I think it will go down to desirability .


----------



## 182_Blue

WHIZZER said:


> Quite like the s1 but think the polo r could be a good car too .... hmmmmmm ( new car for the other half me thinkies !!)


Having driven both a new polo (owned actually) and a new A1 i think the A1 feels like a bigger car inside, maybe not size but the feel of it, to me it felt golf like and a bit better put together than the polo, will be interesting to see them both in the flesh though.


----------



## WHIZZER

i agree we drove the gti polo and an A1 the other day and the a1 definitely feels a bigger car, I preferred the a1 the other half preferred the polo!!!


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Mini JCW is 215 HP
> Fiesta st is 197 HP
> KIA pro Ceed GT 215 hp
> Skoda Octavia VRS 218 HP
> these are to name but a few all fall short on the power of the S1 and all of similar size and I have owned ST, and Mini and I think the Audi is well built with quality interior and very strong performing not to mention award winning engines. and a desiarable image which will hold it's value come resale time.


The Audi starts at £25K according to the press release. The Fiesta is £17k. So the Audi costs almost 50% more. That's not on a level playing field.

It will be interesting to see how good it is, but I just can't jump to the conclusion it will be good. There is also so much alternative cars out there for similar money already.

228bhp is low hot hatch power levels these days and it's no lightweight.

I'm not sure what engine awards it has gained, but looking at the international engine of the year awards, I see the VAG 2.0 TFSI came second in the 2.0 litre class. Second behind their main rival who doesn't come with the hype.

It should sell well as Audi has a lots of followers. I did think before the latest S3, but they have suddenly become rare.

It is cute in a Fiat 500 or Vauxhall Adam kind of way, but I don't see it pulling many guys down from a full size hot hatch.

I do like my car chat and join in most of the car chats. We just seem to only ever discuss VAG cars on this site. Every other brand either gets ignored or lasts just a couple of pages at best.

It would be nice if there wasn't as much bias on here.


----------



## rob_vrs

WHIZZER said:


> i agree we drove the gti polo and an A1 the other day and the a1 definitely feels a bigger car, I preferred the a1 the other half preferred the polo!!!


The 1.4tsi engine sends shivvers down my spine haha. My fabia vrs i used to have had a new engine and 2 friends who both have polo gti's have had new engines.


----------



## RisingPower

Doug_M said:


> Its 4wd... Thats a stand out feature


On a small hatch, that's clearly the thing you need most


----------



## 182_Blue

I wouldn't want the 1.4tfsi either!, that said it makes for a fast little car, i imagine the 2.0l will make it a mad little'ish car, I genuinely look forward to having a try of both it and the polo.


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> On a small hatch, that's clearly the thing you need most


4WD often doesn't work well on cars with short wheelbases. I'm not sure if the S1 is quite as small as people say though.


----------



## Soul boy 68

WHIZZER said:


> i agree we drove the gti polo and an A1 the other day and the a1 definitely feels a bigger car, I preferred the a1 the other half preferred the polo!!!


That should cause quite a stir in your household, dare I say it that the Polo is more attractive to the woman driver:driver:


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> 4WD often doesn't work well on cars with short wheelbases. I'm not sure if the S1 is quite as small as people say though.


The sportback really doesn't look much smaller than the s3.

Which brings me back to another point, why the fiat 500 people carrier and why have such a small car being as heavy as the s3 almost.

The fiat 500 weighs very little, so what on earth are they putting into the s1 that makes it so heavy? Large blocks of lead?

Is this not one of the most absurd cars?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> The Audi starts at £25K according to the press release. The Fiesta is £17k. So the Audi costs almost 50% more. That's not on a level playing field.
> 
> It will be interesting to see how good it is, but I just can't jump to the conclusion it will be good. There is also so much alternative cars out there for similar money already.
> 
> 228bhp is low hot hatch power levels these days and it's no lightweight.
> 
> I'm not sure what engine awards it has gained, but looking at the international engine of the year awards, I see the VAG 2.0 TFSI came second in the 2.0 litre class. Second behind their main rival who doesn't come with the hype.
> 
> It should sell well as Audi has a lots of followers. I did think before the latest S3, but they have suddenly become rare.
> 
> It is cute in a Fiat 500 or Vauxhall Adam kind of way, but I don't see it pulling many guys down from a full size hot hatch.
> 
> I do like my car chat and join in most of the car chats. We just seem to only ever discuss VAG cars on this site. Every other brand either gets ignored or lasts just a couple of pages at best.
> 
> It would be nice if there wasn't as much bias on here.


I am all for talking about other cars on this site too as I love cars in general. Please feel free to start thread on another car and I will be happy to join in. On another note 230hp is warm hatch what about the others I mentioned with lower BHP, they must be cold hatches then, nice looking cars though especially the pro Ceed GT.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I am all for talking about other cars on this site too as I love cars in general. Please feel free to start thread on another car and I will be happy to join in. On another note 230hp is warm hatch what about the others I mentioned with lower BHP, they must be cold hatches then, nice looking cars though especially the pro Ceed GT.


Why another thread, isn't this a discussion of how the audi s1 compares with its rivals?


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> The sportback really doesn't look much smaller than the s3.
> 
> Which brings me back to another point, why the fiat 500 people carrier and why have such a small car being as heavy as the s3 almost.
> 
> The fiat 500 weighs very little, so what on earth are they putting into the s1 that makes it so heavy? Large blocks of lead?
> 
> Is this not one of the most absurd cars?


Fiat aren't half jumping on the bandwagon with the 500 range.

Does seem to be a case of finding a cute car and pushing it as far as you can. Quite a few at it too. Mini probably the worst offender at the moment as I'm lost at the amount of models.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Why another thread, isn't this a discussion of how the audi s1 compares with its rivals?


Being is that you say everyone talks about VAG cars I am saying feel free to start a thread about other cars at another time so we can all joins in.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Being is that you say everyone talks about VAG cars I am saying feel free to start a thread about other cars at another time so we can all joins in.


I did already!


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> I am all for talking about other cars on this site too as I love cars in general. Please feel free to start thread on another car and I will be happy to join in. On another note 230hp is warm hatch what about the others I mentioned with lower BHP, they must be cold hatches then, nice looking cars though especially the pro Ceed GT.


There has been hundreds of car threads about other cars. They rarely last a couple of pages.

VAG threads are as common as what wax for my white car.

The little Fiesta is a cracking little car. It is aimed at the younger people looking to get into a performance car.

You can also spec the Mountune performance pack for a small amount of money. Still keeps full manufacturer's warranty.

The Fiesta is all about fun. Everyone loves it who drives it.

As soon as you start adding weight, 4WD drive etc, you can start affecting the fun part.


----------



## 182_Blue

ironically it's you helped by RP that makes them such long threads though :lol:



Kerr said:


> There has been hundreds of car threads about other cars. They rarely last a couple of pages.
> 
> VAG threads are as common as what wax for my white car.
> 
> The little Fiesta is a cracking little car. It is aimed at the younger people looking to get into a performance car.
> 
> You can also spec the Mountune performance pack for a small amount of money. Still keeps full manufacturer's warranty.
> 
> The Fiesta is all about fun. Everyone loves it who drives it.
> 
> As soon as you start adding weight, 4WD drive etc, you can start affecting the fun part.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> There has been hundreds of car threads about other cars. They rarely last a couple of pages.
> 
> VAG threads are as common as what wax for my white car.
> 
> The little Fiesta is a cracking little car. It is aimed at the younger people looking to get into a performance car.
> 
> You can also spec the Mountune performance pack for a small amount of money. Still keeps full manufacturer's warranty.
> 
> The Fiesta is all about fun. Everyone loves it who drives it.
> 
> As soon as you start adding weight, 4WD drive etc, you can start affecting the fun part.


Fiestas are nice, been around a long time but the competition is now better, the Corsa VXR is a cracker so too is the Sazuki Swift.

You seem to have a fixation with 4WD and weight, 4WD are much lighter than what they used to be and it gives the added edge of better road holding and traction.


----------



## johanr77

RisingPower said:


> Why another thread, isn't this a discussion of how the audi s1 compares with its rivals?


No it would seem it is the Audi S1 is marvellous don't disagree with me thread.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> ironically it's you helped by RP that makes them such long threads though :lol:


I love long threads, the more people join in the better, some long threads go on for days on end


----------



## DW58

Shaun said:


> ironically it's you helped by RP that makes them such long threads though :lol:


Hear hear!

The Detailing World two-man anti-VAG :spam: crew.


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Fiestas are nice, been around a long time but the competition is now better, the Corsa VXR is a cracker so too is the Sazuki Swift.
> 
> You seem to have a fixation with 4WD and weight, 4WD are much lighter than what they used to be and it gives the added edge of better road holding and traction.


It's not a fixation. I just think it is major overkill and unnecessary in most circumstances.

Weight is hugely important to a car. There isn't any argument on that. Cars are getting too heavy and even though we are throwing more power at them, they aren't much faster than 13-15 years ago.

A 2001 Civic type R with 197BHP records the same 0-60 and 0-100mph times as a new 276bhp Astra VXR.

Steering a light nimble car around a corner is easier than a heavy weight.

Weight affects performance and handling hugely.

4WD does help traction issues. It doesn't always assist with road holding though.

I think you think 4WD is far more important than it really is, especially on such a small car.


----------



## Soul boy 68

DW58 said:


> Hear hear!
> 
> The Detailing World two-man anti-VAG :spam: crew.


Actually one man anti VAG which is not me, I like VAG


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> ironically it's you helped by RP that makes them such long threads though :lol:


People love my attention, what can I say?


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Fiestas are nice, been around a long time but the competition is now better, the Corsa VXR is a cracker so too is the Sazuki Swift.
> 
> You seem to have a fixation with 4WD and weight, 4WD are much lighter than what they used to be and it gives the added edge of better road holding and traction.


Having owned a current fiesta I can say they are an OK car but after 6 months or so they start to rattle a bit and aren't built as well as what say an A1 is, they are cheaper for a reason, I was hoping they would do a RS fiesta but after owning a new fiesta I think I would avoid it unless they improve the build quality.


----------



## RisingPower

DW58 said:


> Hear hear!
> 
> The Detailing World two-man anti-VAG :spam: crew.


You know full well i'm not anti vag, i'm just not vag to the exclusiveness of everything else.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> It's not a fixation. I just think it is major overkill and unnecessary in most circumstances.
> 
> Weight is hugely important to a car. There isn't any argument on that. Cars are getting too heavy and even though we are throwing more power at them, they aren't much faster than 13-15 years ago.
> 
> A 2001 Civic type R with 197BHP records the same 0-60 and 0-100mph times as a new 276bhp Astra VXR.
> 
> Steering a light nimble car around a corner is easier than a heavy weight.
> 
> Weight affects performance and handling hugely.
> 
> 4WD does help traction issues. It doesn't always assist with road holding though.
> 
> I think you think 4WD is far more important than it really is, especially on such a small car.


For similar money to it's rivals 4WD will have the edge and they are much lighter than they used to be, just that most makes want to keep the costs down, imagine how much an st could cost if it was 4WD, much more than 20k I can tell ya.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Having owned a current fiesta I can say they are an OK car but after 6 months or so they start to rattle a bit and aren't built as well as what say an A1 is, they are cheaper for a reason, I was hoping they would do a RS fiesta but after owning a new fiesta I think I would avoid it unless they improve the build quality.


I am only curious as i've seen rattles develop in quite a few marques and it seemed to be more to do with age and how the car had been driven more than anything else.

Partner had a fiesta, it never rattled however many years after purchasing, yet some brand new bmws/audis i've been in have been full of rattles.

There is surely such thing still as a friday afternoon car? My m3 certainly seemed that way.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> I love long threads, the more ore people join in the bbetter etter, some long threads go on for days on end


Oh yes it's not an issue but you can't complain about thread length when you play such a major part in that thread length.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> For similar money to it's rivals 4WD will have the edge and they are much lighter than they used to be, just that most makes want to keep the costs down, imagine how much an st could cost if it was 4WD, much more than 20k I can tell ya.


Why do you think that 200ish bhp is enough to overwhelm the front driven wheels in most scenarios? I'm sure in winter or snowy conditions it may be better, but even then.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Oh yes it's not an issue but you can't complain about thread length when you play such a major part in that thread length.


Personally, I was just wondering why the corvette thread had sparked such little interest in comparison to this thread.


----------



## DW58

Soul boy 68 said:


> Actually one man anti VAG which is not me, I like VAG


I didn't say that you were, but it's still two-man, the same two always appear every time without fail, RP and Kerr as implied by Shaun in his post.


----------



## 182_Blue

We have had 3 reasonably current Fiestas and all were pretty good, but all where put together at a price and developed little rattles and noises, they just aren't built as well as they could be, if they do a RS I would take a look but would hope for improved build quality.



RisingPower said:


> I am only curious as i've seen rattles develop in quite a few marques and it seemed to be more to do with age and how the car had been driven more than anything else.
> 
> Partner had a fiesta, it never rattled however many years after purchasing, yet some brand new bmws/audis i've been in have been full of rattles.
> 
> There is surely such thing still as a friday afternoon car? My m3 certainly seemed that way.


----------



## johanr77

Yeah but I can't see Ford doing a 4wd version. They didn't use it on the last Focus RS when punting up to 345hp through the front wheels, the only thing Ford seem keen to use 4wd on is the Kuga and Ranger.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Having owned a current fiesta I can say they are an OK car but after 6 months or so they start to rattle a bit and aren't built as well as what say an A1 is, they are cheaper for a reason, I was hoping they would do a RS fiesta but after owning a new fiesta I think I would avoid it unless they improve the build quality.


I agree with 110% frauds don't build cars to last, I once owned the focus st and the build quality was shocking, some examples, after about a year the fraud badge become so tarnished that I could no longer see it, the wheels become tarnished also. The stitching on the gear lever came off the I could hear some squeaks and rattles. That why I won't buy their cars again, especially now their cars are built in Eastern Europe .


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> We have had 3 reasonably current Fiestas and all were pretty good, but all where put together at a price and developed little rattles and noises, they just aren't built as well as they could be, if they do a RS I would take a look but would hope for improved build quality.


Strange, I really haven't noticed that in any focus's/fiestas i've been in.

Then again, I am used to the zed and there's no question about build quality there :lol: About as bad as the m3 was.

If it's only wheels getting tarnished and a badge, I'd be happy with that. it's inevitable that wheels will tarnish.


----------



## johanr77

Skodas are built in eastern europe and they come ahead of most manufacturers in reliability surveys.


----------



## RisingPower

johanr77 said:


> Yeah but I can't see Ford doing a 4wd version. They didn't use it on the last Focus RS when punting up to 345hp through the front wheels, the only thing Ford seem keen to use 4wd on is the Kuga and Ranger.


I still think 345 is pushing it a little at the front wheels, would have been interesting to see how a rwd or 4wd compared.


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> For similar money to it's rivals 4WD will have the edge and they are much lighter than they used to be, just that most makes want to keep the costs down, imagine how much an st could cost if it was 4WD, much more than 20k I can tell ya.


What makes you assume the cost would jump so much?

Looking at BMWs, there is only £1500 between their 4wd models.

Ford deemed 4wd unnecessary on the 300BHP Focus RS. I don't remember any the reviews saying that car would be better with 4wd.

In the head to head of the last S3, quite a few of the FWD cars were faster around the track.

The new S3 was ripped to bits on the track by the M135i. A car with an open diff that will only drive through one wheel with the least grip when struggling.

So if 4wd is so effective, how can part time one wheel drive cars still go faster?


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Hmmm, methinks some of the BM lovers are a little jealous and feel a little left out because VAG bring out more cars


----------



## Kerr

DW588 said:


> I didn't say that you were, but it's still two-man, the same two always appear every time without fail, RP and Kerr as implied by Shaun in his post.


Can you change the record? How many times do you need to keep posting the same things over and over? Same every thread even when it is on topic.

You seem to want to get a reaction? Why are you so sensitive about VAG?

What don't you join in constructively or move on?


----------



## DW58

Pot/Kettle - it's no different from your constant and very tedious "BMW can always do better" - you're so very boring.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> What makes you assume the cost would jump so much?
> 
> Looking at BMWs, there is only £1500 between their 4wd models.
> 
> Ford deemed 4wd unnecessary on the 300BHP Focus RS. I don't remember any the reviews saying that car would be better with 4wd.
> 
> In the head to head of the last S3, quite a few of the FWD cars were faster around the track.
> 
> The new S3 was ripped to bits on the track by the M135i. A car with an open diff that will only drive through one wheel with the least grip when struggling.
> 
> So if 4wd is so effective, how can part time one wheel drive cars still go faster?


The Audi RS3 would knock spots off the Focus RS for performance. No doubt about it.


----------



## Soul boy 68

DJ X-Ray said:


> Hmmm, methinks some of the BM lovers are a little jealous and feel a little left out because VAG bring out more cars


VAGS have a better line up for me even tough I also like BM's


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> Hmmm, methinks some of the BM lovers are a little jealous and feel a little left out because VAG bring out more cars


I don't think more necessarily means better, in fact probably the opposite


----------



## Soul boy 68

DW58 said:


> Pot/Kettle - it's no different from your constant and very tedious "BMW can always do better" - you're so very boring.


Pot/kettle, two sugars for me please


----------



## WHIZZER

Kerr said:


> What makes you assume the cost would jump so much?
> 
> The new S3 was ripped to bits on the track by the M135i. A car with an open diff that will only drive through one wheel with the least grip when struggling.
> 
> So if 4wd is so effective, how can part time one wheel drive cars still go faster?


But I would say in the real world driving (not track) the S3 would be better/quicker/safer as most of the time roads are damp or wet here


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> Strange, I really haven't noticed that in any focus's/fiestas i've been in.
> 
> Then again, I am used to the zed and there's no question about build quality there :lol: About as bad as the m3 was.
> 
> If it's only wheels getting tarnished and a badge, I'd be happy with that. it's inevitable that wheels will tarnish.


Well I had a focus st3 and it never let me down or rattled, it was a very good car indeed and even had some nice soft touch interior trim, the only down side was MPG and some image issues LOL.


----------



## Soul boy 68

WHIZZER said:


> But I would say in the real world driving (not track) the S3 would be better/quicker/safer as most of the time roads are damp or wet here


Your quite right, 4WD is far better for grip, traction and road holding and especially on our poor UK roads, and they are fun too.


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> The Audi RS3 would knock spots off the Focus RS for performance. No doubt about it.


A Focus RS was £25k. Again you're comparing cars on completely different price levels.

The RS3 was a poor car. It was overhyped to the max before Chris Harris put out his review out. Then it was accepted it wasn't good. Great engine though.

Now nobody talks about them. Try selling one now as there is no demand.


----------



## RisingPower

WHIZZER said:


> But I would say in the real world driving (not track) the S3 would be better/quicker/safer as most of the time roads are damp or wet here


You have to think, how much of that power should you a) be using on the public roads b) in the wet.

This is where opinions differ. I personally think a quick car is for the track, a daily for normal roads where power never really comes into play.

Wasn't it young jd who thought that it's perfectly safe to use 100% of the power in any car and any conditions?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Well I had a focus st3 and it never let me down or rattled, it was a very good car indeed and even had some nice soft touch interior trim, the only down side was MPG and some image issues LOL.[/QUOTE
> ]
> I think frauds do have an image problem, they try to match the more upmarket German rivals, not a chance in my books


----------



## WHIZZER

RisingPower said:


> You have to think, how much of that power should you a) be using on the public roads b) in the wet.
> 
> This is where opinions differ. I personally think a quick car is for the track, a daily for normal roads where power never really comes into play.
> 
> Wasn't it young jd who thought that it's perfectly safe to use 100% of the power in any car and any conditions?


agree about power but personally would rather have the safety of 4 wheel drive than 2 wheel - and show me a BM car that can pull itself up any sort of incline ( without snow tyres or their new launch x drive -now why did the launch x drive ???????  ) when there is any sort of snow


----------



## slineclean

Got to take my car for it's first MOT on Monday , might drop the hint about the S1 and see what part ex they would give ha ha 

I just like the idea of the 4 x 4 , 1.4 engine would do me ha ha I don't like high petrol prices ha ha


----------



## Kerr

WHIZZER said:


> But I would say in the real world driving (not track) the S3 would be better/quicker/safer as most of the time roads are damp or wet here


I don't agree.

If you are driving to the extent that you need 4wd, you aren't driving to the road conditions or at real world speeds.

You are far more likely to understeer off the road than require the traction of 4wd in most circumstances.

My opinion is if you are driving to the extent 2wd can't handle it, you are driving dangerously for the road conditions.

There is strong arguments you don't really need 300BHP for pubic roads. Most modern 300bhp cars are exceeding all limits in 5-6secs.


----------



## Soul boy 68

slineclean said:


> Got to take my car for it's first MOT on Monday , might drop the hint about the S1 and see what part ex they would give ha ha
> 
> I just like the idea of the 4 x 4 , 1.4 engine would do me ha ha I don't like high petrol prices ha ha


Have to agree with Whizzer in that 4x4 are much safer and with some form of performance level too, go ahead check out the s1, I will. Not too sure about the yellow though:car:


----------



## 182_Blue

Using your argument I would say the same about rear wheel drive though, people go on about how good it is but I don't think it's potential can be explored on a public highway?, the only thing I ever see is people like to go sideways around roundabouts with them!!, one very nearly hit me the other day actually whilst doing it!



Kerr said:


> I don't agree.
> 
> If you are driving to the extent that you need 4wd, you aren't driving to the road conditions or at real world speeds.
> 
> You are far more likely to understeer off the road than require the traction of 4wd in most circumstances.
> 
> My opinion is if you are driving to the extent 2wd can't handle it, you are driving dangerously for the road conditions.
> 
> There is strong arguments you don't really need 300BHP for pubic roads. Most modern 300bhp cars are exceeding all limits in 5-6secs.


----------



## wylie coyote

Unbelieveable!!! I've just read 16 pages and not one post mentioned what else you could get for the same money!

Surely these weren't all used up on the Golf R thread???

For the record, I think Audi have tried a little too hard to make it funky and attractive for younger drivers. None of them will be able to get insurance so what is the real target market it's aimed at (I would include the Polo R here as well for balance)?


----------



## Nanoman

Just getting round to catching up on this thread...


RisingPower said:


> Why not an audi s3 then? Or an s4? Is there enough space in the back of the s1 for it to be practical? If you take a very small hatch like the abarth, the rear seats may be there, but are impractical.
> Does it need to be small, is it going to be more of a town car?
> An opinion is merely that.
> Trolling imply any actions are done to elicit emotions. I'm not interested in emotions, only reasoning.





RisingPower said:


> the S3 and S4 are far more expensive, the S1 is a more affordable option.
> 
> 5k isn't going to be a dealbreaker on a 25k car is it?


S3 and S4 are much more expensive and bigger than we need for a start. It's a bit of a strange question when I've mentioned the only other cars we've considered are Corsa/Fiesta/Ibiza - You seem to be assuming everyone who wants to talk about liking the S1 is a VAG fanboi.

It must be nice to live in a world where £5k isn't a lot of money; 220+bhp in a small hatchback isn't a lot of power; and sub 6.0s 0-60 isn't fast. I'm afraid that's not the world most of the population lives in. I assume you've come into money and aren't driving around in that boring old Datsun any more. It would be a bit sad if you were and you're on here saying £5k doesn't make much difference, talking about Lambos, Mustangs and 'Vettes. I might even feel a bit sorry for you if that was the case.

Also to those complaining that only VAG threads go the distance... maybe it's because people are interested in them. Also it might be because a couple of members seem to get involved in trolling them which makes them last. Maybe other threads e.g. 'vette get less attention because we're not all made of money like RP with his fleet of interesting hypercars. You'd think with that amount of money and a fleet like that he'd spend more time doing something other than trolling threads where mere mortals talk about splashing out £25k peasant wagons.


----------



## johanr77

Ahem I said for almost the same money you could get the Polo R :thumb:


----------



## DJ X-Ray

RisingPower said:


> I don't think more necessarily means better, in fact probably the opposite


:lol: I'm not saying better, that's down to the individual to decide, through ownership...that's how i judge cars anyway


----------



## Nanoman

johanr77 said:


> Ahem I said for almost the same money you could get the Polo R :thumb:


But that would have the annoying join in the plastics at my left knee which is incredibly uncomfortable.


----------



## Kerr

Shaun said:


> Using your argument I would say the same about rear wheel drive though, people go on about how good it is but I don't think it's potential can be explored on a public highway?, the only thing I ever see is people like to go sideways around roundabouts with them!!, one very nearly hit me the other day actually whilst doing it!


Not at all. Everyone assumes RWD means it's all about getting the rear out. That isn't the case at all.

It is purely balance and feel. The rear does the pushing, the front does the steering.

It's the most natural drivetrian there is. Hence why most mechanically driven things use the same uncomplicated method.

Some of the best fun RWD cars are things like a Mazda MX5 which isn't exactly an overpowered drifiting car.

The GT86 got slated on here for not being powerful enough with people completely missing the point.


----------



## WHIZZER

Kerr said:


> I don't agree.
> 
> If you are driving to the extent that you need 4wd, you aren't driving to the road conditions or at real world speeds.
> 
> You are far more likely to understeer off the road than require the traction of 4wd in most circumstances.
> 
> My opinion is if you are driving to the extent 2wd can't handle it, you are driving dangerously for the road conditions.
> 
> There is strong arguments you don't really need 300BHP for pubic roads. Most modern 300bhp cars are exceeding all limits in 5-6secs.


Disagree with you about driving to the extent of using 4x4 -I would rather have 4 wheel drive than 2 wheel drive on damp/icy roads etc but will agree to disagree ....

I come back to my previous comments re SNOW ! Fact BM/Mercs (rear wheel drive) are useless in the snow unless fitted with some form of snow tyre or traction aid.


----------



## johanr77

Nanoman said:


> But that would have the annoying join in the plastics at my left knee which is incredibly uncomfortable.


Can't say I noticed it.


----------



## Kerr

WHIZZER said:


> Disagree with you about driving to the extent of using 4x4 -I would rather have 4 wheel drive than 2 wheel drive on damp/icy roads etc but will agree to disagree ....
> 
> I come back to my previous comments re SNOW ! Fact BM/Mercs (rear wheel drive) are useless in the snow unless fitted with some form of snow tyre or traction aid.


4wd helps give you drive in the snow.

It doesn't help you stop or steer which is the important part.


----------



## 182_Blue

Funny enough it was a Mx 5 that nearly hit me.



Kerr said:


> Not at all. Everyone assumes RWD means it's all about getting the rear out. That isn't the case at all.
> 
> It is purely balance and feel. The rear does the pushing, the front does the steering.
> 
> It's the most natural drivetrian there is. Hence why most mechanically driven things use the same uncomplicated method.
> 
> Some of the best fun RWD cars are things like a Mazda MX5 which isn't exactly an overpowered drifiting car.
> 
> The GT86 got slated on here for not being powerful enough with people completely missing the point.


----------



## WHIZZER

Kerr said:


> 4wd helps give you drive in the snow.
> 
> It doesn't help you stop or steer which is the important part.


As this part seems to be turning into a 4wd v 2wd - 
Granted it doesnt help you stop or steer but if driving carefully would at least give you a chance of getting to work, whereas with a rear wheel drive i might have to rely on public transport with somebody else at the wheel to drive me, merely looking at last years snow the amount of abandoned mercs/bmw was high but i digress I would rather have as I previously said 4wd drive over 2wd as a day to day car

" four-wheel drive is best for avoiding skidding and loss of control on less-than-ideal roads. Four-wheel drive is also safer for vehicles towing or hauling large weights, since the presence of four drive wheels provides greater stability if the load shifts" AWD systems also offer what is commonly called torque vectoring, in which sensors direct engine power to the wheels with the most traction, regardless of which end or side they are on and thus allow traction where as a rwd could and probably would break traction

Back on topic I think (IMO)the S1/POLO R will be worlds apart from something like a ford fiesta st


----------



## RisingPower

WHIZZER said:


> agree about power but personally would rather have the safety of 4 wheel drive than 2 wheel - and show me a BM car that can pull itself up any sort of incline ( without snow tyres or their new launch x drive -now why did the launch x drive ???????  ) when there is any sort of snow


I don't think how many wheels are driven has any effect upon safety, it's how it is driven that matters.

I drove the m3 in snow up an incline with vreds just fine.


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> :lol: I'm not saying better, that's down to the individual to decide, through ownership...that's how i judge cars anyway


I judge them by the noise they make, how they look and how impractical they are


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> I don't think how many wheels are driven has any effect upon safety, it's how it is driven that matters.
> 
> I drove the m3 in snow up an incline with vreds just fine.


I've needed a push two or three times in 4 years.

4wd will assist with towing, but I doubt I'll see a caravan attatched to the back of a S1.

Drivers assume too much these days. There is only so much traction control, ABS, stability control, 4wd etc can do to save a bad driver.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> Just getting round to catching up on this thread...
> 
> S3 and S4 are much more expensive and bigger than we need for a start. It's a bit of a strange question when I've mentioned the only other cars we've considered are Corsa/Fiesta/Ibiza - You seem to be assuming everyone who wants to talk about liking the S1 is a VAG fanboi.
> 
> It must be nice to live in a world where £5k isn't a lot of money; 220+bhp in a small hatchback isn't a lot of power; and sub 6.0s 0-60 isn't fast. I'm afraid that's not the world most of the population lives in. I assume you've come into money and aren't driving around in that boring old Datsun any more. It would be a bit sad if you were and you're on here saying £5k doesn't make much difference, talking about Lambos, Mustangs and 'Vettes. I might even feel a bit sorry for you if that was the case.
> 
> Also to those complaining that only VAG threads go the distance... maybe it's because people are interested in them. Also it might be because a couple of members seem to get involved in trolling them which makes them last. Maybe other threads e.g. 'vette get less attention because we're not all made of money like RP with his fleet of interesting hypercars. You'd think with that amount of money and a fleet like that he'd spend more time doing something other than trolling threads where mere mortals talk about splashing out £25k peasant wagons.


I think 25k is a lot of money tbh and if you can afford that, you can probably afford the s3. It's a 5th of the purchase price, which doesn't really seem that much as a pecentage and I'd worry if you were buying a car on the cusp of affordability.

I assume nothing of the sort of being a fanboy, I am merely trying to understand its purpose and how it differs to other cars in that segment.

The s3 really doesn't look much bigger than the s1 sportback and is just big enough to be a practical 5 door car imho.

So, why are people only interested in vag cars? Why should someone aspire to a vag car and not a vette? Also, a vette, isn't a hypercar.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> I've needed a push two or three times in 4 years.
> 
> 4wd will assist with towing, but I doubt I'll see a caravan attatched to the back of a S1.
> 
> Drivers assume too much these days. There is only so much traction control, ABS, stability control, 4wd etc can do to save a bad driver.


It boils down to the weight over the driven axles, if there's no weight, how is it ever going to get traction?


----------



## WHIZZER

RisingPower said:


> It boils down to the weight over the driven axles, if there's no weight, how is it ever going to get traction?


Is that why Bm drivers stick bags of sand or the like in their boots


----------



## RisingPower

WHIZZER said:


> Is that why Bm drivers stick bags of sand or the like in their boots


I never had that issue in the m3, a lot of times in the zed though. Literally no weight over the rear axle.

Sand/salt bags made no odds.


----------



## WHIZZER

RisingPower said:


> I don't think how many wheels are driven has any effect upon safety, it's how it is driven that matters.
> 
> I drove the m3 in snow up an incline with vreds just fine.


Each to their Own - Like "i" have said "I" would prefer awd over rwd as an everyday car

And Im glad you managed to drive an m3 in snow up an incline with vreds just fine I applaud you , BUT most who seem to drive them would'nt even be able to get it to move .... ( I have owned several rear wheel drive cars, several front wheel cars and quite a few Awd and in my experiences AWD wins hands down on an average day to day driving experience IMO)


----------



## RisingPower

WHIZZER said:


> Each to their Own - Like "i" have said "I" would prefer awd over rwd as an everyday car


Fair enough and it definitely comes into play where you live :thumb:

Cambridge isn't exactly hilly.


----------



## johanr77

Used to put a concrete slab in the boot of my brothers sierra to help with traction. It worked too and made the rear slide that little bit easier. 

Reckon they should teach learners about these things, stop them pooping themselves when the car goes tail happy.


----------



## Kerr

johanr77 said:


> Used to put a concrete slab in the boot of my brothers sierra to help with traction. It worked too and made the rear slide that little bit easier.
> 
> Reckon they should teach learners about these things, stop them pooping themselves when the car goes tail happy.


Good suggestion.

Some of the Scandinavian countries have the skid pan as part of their driving course. People suggest their training is part of the reason they are considered better drivers.


----------



## Kerr

I see Auto express lead with the headline about the S1 being as fast 0-60mph than a 30 year old 911 or 328. 

Is that really a valid headline or sensationlism? 

What shock can there be that a 228bhp car is as fast as a very old 231bhp car?

There is and has been nunerous hatchbacks doing the same and faster for a long time. 

The hype is certainly getting whipped up a lot.


----------



## Soul boy 68

wylie coyote said:


> Unbelieveable!!! I've just read 16 pages and not one post mentioned what else you could get for the same money!
> 
> Surely these weren't all used up on the Golf R thread???
> 
> For the record, I think Audi have tried a little too hard to make it funky and attractive for younger drivers. None of them will be able to get insurance so what is the real target market it's aimed at (I would include the Polo R here as well for balance)?


At 25k I struggle to find any other cars that it can compete with, I think the Mini JCW that it's competing against. might need some help with this one.


----------



## Kerr

soul boy 68 said:


> At 25k I struggle to find any other cars that it can compete with, I think the Mini JCW that it's competing against. might need some help with this one.


For £25k, if for some reason you really need a small car, you can have the Mini or Fiesta with Mountune pack and still have lots of cash/less finance.

If you are could do with more space a Focus ST can be had with lots of change and again a manufacturer approved Mountune tuning pack taking the car up to better than Focus RS performance, for I think £1200. An Astra VXR can easily be had for £25k new. A Megane RS. There is no lack of choice of good hot hatch backs at the moment.

Just a couple of more grand and you could have a 320bhp M135i. A Golf GTi, new Leon Cupra R.

Honda are talking about a 300bhp Civic for £25k but I think that's a while off yet.

If 4WD is a must (not in my opinion) for a few grand more you could have cars such as the Golf R, S3 on the new Impreza STi with 300bhp+.

Not only are you getting a biggerl car in quite a few of the above, they are substantially faster too. To me that defines a hot hatch. Fast and big enough to be a family car.

I guess that will always leave the question, would you be happy to give up space and performance for a few grand? If you are happy to give up performance for a few grand, surely that would then make more sense to buy the Fiesta and save more? I'd bet the Mountune ST is barely slower.

It does appear that Audi are filling a market that didn't exist before. However to me, adding 4wd to a smallish car that weighs over 1400kg with 228bhp, doesn't on paper add up to anything special.

They've priced it well above cars of similar size, but not that far below more powerful, faster and bigger cars.

I guess it obviously appeals to people with very specific wants and needs.

What is the size difference between a S1 and S3?


----------



## Guest

I quite like the idea of the S1, in a good colour that will be quite a sleeper.


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> I think 25k is a lot of money tbh and if you can afford that, you can probably afford the s3. It's a 5th of the purchase price, which doesn't really seem that much as a pecentage and I'd worry if you were buying a car on the cusp of affordability.
> 
> I assume nothing of the sort of being a fanboy, I am merely trying to understand its purpose and how it differs to other cars in that segment.
> 
> The s3 really doesn't look much bigger than the s1 sportback and is just big enough to be a practical 5 door car imho.
> 
> So, why are people only interested in vag cars? Why should someone aspire to a vag car and not a vette? Also, a vette, isn't a hypercar.


Regarding your last question I can't answer because it's not me. I'm not sure there's any more VAG fanboys than there are BMW, Vauxhall, Ford and alfa fan boys. Maybe it's because VAG sell more desirable/premium cars than anyone else in europe (last time I checked). There's also a difference between what you aspire to and dream of and what you can realistically afford. I think there's might be a few more VAG drivers on here that 'vette drivers.

Hypercar/Supercar - there's no dictionary definition I'm aware of so I'm not sure your statement stands up.

Anyway... help me narrow down my search and give me some ideas...

Small car (up to astra/a3 sized), 5 doors, 180bhp+, 4wd, up to about £25k cash price. Cruise, heated seats, prefer 17" rims, decent level of refinement.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> Regarding your last question I can't answer because it's not me. I'm not sure there's any more VAG fanboys than there are BMW, Vauxhall, Ford and alfa fan boys. Maybe it's because VAG sell more desirable/premium cars than anyone else in europe (last time I checked). There's also a difference between what you aspire to and dream of and what you can realistically afford. I think there's might be a few more VAG drivers on here that 'vette drivers.
> 
> Hypercar/Supercar - there's no dictionary definition I'm aware of so I'm not sure your statement stands up.
> 
> Anyway... help me narrow down my search and give me some ideas...
> 
> Small car (up to astra/a3 sized), 5 doors, 180bhp+, 4wd, up to about £25k cash price. Cruise, heated seats, prefer 17" rims, decent level of refinement.


Corvette c6s used fall into the same sort of price region and I don't think they'd be unusually expensive to run as a second car.

Hypercar vs supercar, you're right, no dictionary definition, but you could class maybe the m3 as a supercar and a koenigsegg as a hypercar, maybe.

That's not really a small car, but maybe an alfa 159, v40 costs a bit more for the t5 (more in line with the s3, which seems to make more sense), Subaru impreza sti probably doesn't fall under the category of refined, but I do wonder how much difference there is these days, I think passats are horrendous and the a3 wasn't exactly brilliant (If you put a diesel 4 pot in a car, I doubt it'll be refined).


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> Corvette c6s used fall into the same sort of price region and I don't think they'd be unusually expensive to run as a second car.
> 
> Hypercar vs supercar, you're right, no dictionary definition, but you could class maybe the m3 as a supercar and a koenigsegg as a hypercar, maybe.
> 
> That's not really a small car, but maybe an alfa 159, v40 costs a bit more for the t5 (more in line with the s3, which seems to make more sense), Subaru impreza sti probably doesn't fall under the category of refined, but I do wonder how much difference there is these days, I think passats are horrendous and the a3 wasn't exactly brilliant (If you put a diesel 4 pot in a car, I doubt it'll be refined).


So in summary you can't think of any car that meets my needs like the S1 does? They don't make the alfa or the subaru any more and I don't think they're as refined, the 4WD Volvo is £35k.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> So in summary you can't think of any car that meets my needs like the S1 does? They don't make the alfa or the subaru any more and I don't think they're as refined, the 4WD Volvo is £35k.


I honestly didn't know they stopped producing the alfa or subaru, I thought the volvo was 31k?

Personally, I think the audi s3 or v40 do meet your needs, the fact you mentioned the size of the astra doesn't really tie in with the size of the s1.

I'm also unsure how much difference 4wd makes on such a small car, maybe it's one of the reasons you don't see many of them? You surely need some weight to make 4wd really work and is there going to be that weight over the rear?

Think how many really small cars have cruise control or heated seats.


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> I honestly didn't know they stopped producing the alfa or subaru, I thought the volvo was 31k?
> 
> Personally, I think the audi s3 or v40 do meet your needs, the fact you mentioned the size of the astra doesn't really tie in with the size of the s1.
> 
> I'm also unsure how much difference 4wd makes on such a small car, maybe it's one of the reasons you don't see many of them? You surely need some weight to make 4wd really work and is there going to be that weight over the rear?
> 
> Think how many really small cars have cruise control or heated seats.


Like I said previously even with winter tyres a 2WD car can struggle to get up the icy hill. V40 and S3 are £5k over budget. We're not going over £25k. I can't remember seeing a small car where we couldn't spec up heated seats and cruise but I'm sure they exist.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> Like I said previously even with winter tyres a 2WD car can struggle to get up the icy hill. V40 and S3 are £5k over budget. We're not going over £25k. I can't remember seeing a small car where we couldn't spec up heated seats and cruise but I'm sure they exist.


Then maybe you need a proper 4x4? For all the fanciness of these 4wd systems, I don't honestly believe they're going to cope as well as a jeep or landy in poor conditions.

I honestly can't think of really small cars like 500 having that, but maybe the slightly larger mito/fiestas do. They really are meant to be town cars, which, doesn't tie in with those features.

There may be some clearance with the s1, but it's not massive and given where you are, I'd have thought it possible to exceed that.


----------



## Derekh929

Wow i thought i had looked into Piston Heads this thread is terrible, and the arguments For are very weak and against pretty poor as well.
The full reviews might be better to wait and see what it can do on road and track and bench marked against it's key rivals.
Do people honestly buy these cars for looks ? or is it to utilize the cars performance as it is sold as performance car? I have driven many older Audi's and some newer performance ones and the key thing for a lot of performance car buyers is how does it stack up against it's direct rivals on track & Road or cars can Flop simples just need to look at Used RS3 values to see this.
The old RS4 was a fantastic car and to date is one of Audi's best performance cars by fare and i have driven the S5 & RS5 

Also people keep quoting £25k how many people buy these without adding extra's , just look at average price of a Cooper S it will be nearer £30k before you get the toys you want

It's getting boring with some of the nonsense on here is embarrassing tbo:doublesho


----------



## RisingPower

Derekh929 said:


> Wow i thought i had looked into Piston Heads this thread is terrible, and the arguments For are very weak and against pretty poor as well.
> The full reviews might be better to wait and see what it can do on road and track and bench marked against it's key rivals.
> Do people honestly buy these cars for looks ? or is it to utilize the cars performance as it is sold as performance car? I have driven many older Audi's and some newer performance ones and the key thing for a lot of performance car buyers is how does it stack up against it's direct rivals on track & Road or cars can Flop simples just need to look at Used RS3 values to see this.
> The old RS4 was a fantastic car and to date is one of Audi's best performance cars by fare and i have driven the S5 & RS5
> It's getting boring with some of the nonsense on here is embarrassing tbo:doublesho


You mean you wouldn't have one?!? But surely you'd buy a vette


----------



## Kerr

Nanoman said:


> So in summary you can't think of any car that meets my needs like the S1 does? They don't make the alfa or the subaru any more and I don't think they're as refined, the 4WD Volvo is £35k.


What do you drive now?

Why are your specific car needs so tight?

The 5 door S1 is going to cost more than the 3. Another £1k in reports.

A few guys asked in other threads help me choose between car a, b, c, d and they were complete opposites. A coupe with 2 seats, a large 4wd diesel, a small hot hatch and a big engined hot hatch.

I got slated for saying that I failed to understand how the shortlist could be so varied.

There is plenty of cars that fill your needs. It's just your desire to have 4wd that shortens your odds.

I asked the question above why 4wd, and the reasons I see still don't justify it. There is little need for 4wd in most circumstances and with a small car and 228bhp, even less.

Not sure what BMW's position is with xdrive. I've not even bothered checking on the 1 series as I have so little interest.

It was a £1500 premium on a 3 series, but I ruled it out right away as a waste of money.

The xdrive drivetrain by reviews is better than the Haldex system though.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Nanoman said:


> So in summary you can't think of any car that meets my needs like the S1 does? They don't make the alfa or the subaru any more and I don't think they're as refined, the 4WD Volvo is £35k.


What I think Audi offer over other makes is that it's (A) primium feel (B) excellent build qulity (C) disiarability (D) excellent very strong high performance engines across all models (E) head turning looks ie R8. some very good:driver: reasons to consider an Audi, if it meets your buget and needs.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> What I think Audi offer over other makes is that it's (A) primium feel (B) excellent build qulity (C) disiarability (D) excellent very strong high performance engines across all models (E) head turning looks ie R8. some very good:driver: reasons to consider an Audi, if it meets your buget and needs.


Maserati? I don't think the inside of the a3 has/had a premium feel, I certainly never have had a desire for one (maybe the s1 group b but not because it was an audi) there are build quality issues on virtually all cars including audis, some of their engines are strong but not all and very few have head turning looks.

Btw was that just an audi ad?


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Maserati?


Maserati :doublesho like how much brand new?


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> Then maybe you need a proper 4x4? For all the fanciness of these 4wd systems, I don't honestly believe they're going to cope as well as a jeep or landy in poor conditions.
> 
> I honestly can't think of really small cars like 500 having that, but maybe the slightly larger mito/fiestas do. They really are meant to be town cars, which, doesn't tie in with those features.
> 
> There may be some clearance with the s1, but it's not massive and given where you are, I'd have thought it possible to exceed that.


I've got a proper 4x4. I'm looking for a little car for the Mrs which can get up the icy hill. Not sure what you're talking about clearance.



Kerr said:


> What do you drive now?
> 
> Why are your specific car needs so tight?
> 
> The 5 door S1 is going to cost more than the 3. Another £1k in reports.
> 
> A few guys asked in other threads help me choose between car a, b, c, d and they were complete opposites. A coupe with 2 seats, a large 4wd diesel, a small hot hatch and a big engined hot hatch.
> 
> I got slated for saying that I failed to understand how the shortlist could be so varied.
> 
> There is plenty of cars that fill your needs. It's just your desire to have 4wd that shortens your odds.
> 
> I asked the question above why 4wd, and the reasons I see still don't justify it. There is little need for 4wd in most circumstances and with a small car and 228bhp, even less.
> 
> Not sure what BMW's position is with xdrive. I've not even bothered checking on the 1 series as I have so little interest.
> 
> It was a £1500 premium on a 3 series, but I ruled it out right away as a waste of money.
> 
> The xdrive drivetrain by reviews is better than the Haldex system though.


S1 5 door is £25k. S3 5 door is £31k.
I'd like 4x4 for reasons I've gone into a few times. I was being asked to justify my interest in the S1 and why not something else. I justify it then people disagree with the justification.


----------



## RisingPower

Nanoman said:


> I've got a proper 4x4. I'm looking for a little car for the Mrs which can get up the icy hill. Not sure what you're talking about clearance.
> 
> S1 5 door is £25k. S3 5 door is £31k.
> I'd like 4x4 for reasons I've gone into a few times. I was being asked to justify my interest in the S1 and why not something else. I justify it then people disagree with the justification.


Ground clearance, it's not that high, with snow it can be an issue (it is in the zed).

I thought according to audis site they're 25k and 30k respectively?

I'm merely trying to understand why the s3 doesn't meet your requirements..


----------



## Soul boy 68

Nanoman said:


> I've got a proper 4x4. I'm looking for a little car for the Mrs which can get up the icy hill. Not sure what you're talking about clearance.
> 
> S1 5 door is £25k. S3 5 door is £31k.
> I'd like 4x4 for reasons I've gone into a few times. I was being asked to justify my interest in the S1 and why not something else. I justify it then people disagree with the justification.


Do what please's you most, check out the S1 rivals and see what they offer that is better for example check out the Mini JCW or Alfa Mito. you might be hard pused to find better out there. Lets not forget that the Audi A1 won awards for best car when it's was first launched in 2010 so the S1 has a very good base to start with,:thumb:


----------



## Turkleton

Just going to back pedal a few pages here on the whole AWD argument...
Aren't all Audi's haldex based so FWD until they lose traction, then a bit goes to the rears as well? So you're dragging two wheels around and all that weight whilst under the influence that your car is AWD and sitting on your high horse?


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Maserati :doublesho like how much brand new?


You said over other makes.


----------



## Nanoman

RisingPower said:


> Ground clearance, it's not that high, with snow it can be an issue (it is in the zed).
> 
> I thought according to audis site they're 25k and 30k respectively?
> 
> I'm merely trying to understand why the s3 doesn't meet your requirements..


The £6k difference in price makes it well outside my requirements.
Ground clearance isn't an issue. The hill becomes a sheet of ice.



Turkleton said:


> Just going to back pedal a few pages here on the whole AWD argument...
> Aren't all Audi's haldex based so FWD until they lose traction, then a bit goes to the rears as well? So you're dragging two wheels around and all that weight whilst under the influence that your car is AWD and sitting on your high horse?


No high horse here. Aren't most 4x4 cars these days 2WD most of the time for fuel economy with a 4x4 mode or other mechanism that give 4x4 when required? I just want the wee extra push required to get up the hill.


----------



## DJ X-Ray




----------



## 182_Blue

Turkleton said:


> Just going to back pedal a few pages here on the whole AWD argument...
> Aren't all Audi's haldex based so FWD until they lose traction, then a bit goes to the rears as well? So you're dragging two wheels around and all that weight whilst under the influence that your car is AWD and sitting on your high horse?


No , they arent all Haldex systems, in fact i think its only the S3 and A3 Q3 that have it in the Audi range, i dont know whats going in the S1 though.

http://www.audi.co.uk/audi-innovation/our-technologies/quattro.html


----------



## Derekh929

WHIZZER said:


> agree about power but personally would rather have the safety of 4 wheel drive than 2 wheel - and show me a BM car that can pull itself up any sort of incline ( without snow tyres or their new launch x drive -now why did the launch x drive ???????  ) when there is any sort of snow


They Launched X Drive to steel Audi customers , that wanted AWD as they feel safer driving them, i have found that people with AWD drive faster thinking they are safer and have more grip of the road?
Have a look over at F30 Forum to here wath the converts are saying, some very balanced sensible stuff on there about cars. Also its to fill another niche

It's the 4 bits of rubber that is most important and a RWD or FWD car with winters will go up past any AWD car on standard tyres.
I have driven the new 3 X Drive a good bit but i felt even in NE Scotland the benefits of a couple of days a year could not justifie, and its others on road that have never driven in snow or car drive within the cars abilities i worry about more when out.
My new car has 258bhp and in the wet on standard tyres very little interference of traction control even giving it a bit and lateral grip is very very good due to center of gravity and weight distribution.

Why did i not buy the X Drive as its not a proper AWD system like RR etc it just like Audi system , but in the mind it sometimes fools people to push a bit more above their and car ability, i have driven to Scottish ski resorts since the 80's and got passed many many times by AWD car to find them lose control in front of me and do a 4 wheel slide into verge, i will also confirm i have never had winter tyres either

Been looking at the Dyno's for the new 335d X Drive and 330d RWD and the performance is very similar , due to the drive train drag and extra 100kgs, dont get me wrong i have drive the X drive a few times and nice car seem to have good traction , but anything under a 3ltr anit going to utilize the extra grip IMHO


----------



## Kerr

You are unlikely to see full time 4 wheel drive cars in the smaller classes. 

4wd systems are a drain on power which affects economy and emissions. That is what the manufacturers are avoiding.


----------



## PLuKE

I don't like the look of the A1 in any form, it looks odd, but looks are always subjective.

Have you seen the offset in the pedal to driving position?!

Luke


----------



## Derekh929

Shaun said:


> No , they arent all Haldex systems, in fact i think its only the S3 and A3 Q3 that have it in the Audi range, i dont know whats going in the S1 though.
> 
> http://www.audi.co.uk/audi-innovation/our-technologies/quattro.html


Most are Haldex or Torsen

This explains this system is very basic terms

Torsen is ALWAYS AWD and the Haldex is normally 2WD unless ... You can have a Haldex system


----------



## 182_Blue

PLuKE said:


> I don't like the look of the A1 in any form, it looks odd, but looks are always subjective.
> 
> Have you seen the offset in the pedal to driving position?!
> 
> Luke


Is that the left hand drive your looking at though ?, they have a big foot rest which always makes them look off, right hand drive are different in most vag cars so until i see otherwise then i will assume its the same.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Best to wait until official tech bits and the full reviews from the motoring press, then we can make a judgement. I still think it will cause some serious embarrasses ment on our roads and I think it will be too good for the Abarth, JCW, and the Mito which this car is aimed at.:driver:


----------



## SteveTDCi

Have I missed anything between page 8 and 20, I got that hored I thought I was driving an Audi.

Does the s1 have any rivals ? Most are 2wd and a million pounds cheaper. As for the s1 being better than the jcw mini, well at that price point it's more of a rival for the gp2 and have you seen the reviews for that ? With the exception of the b7 rs4 has any audi ever been praised ? They make some nice engines but the cars driving tend to be a little bland.

Please feel to class me as a vag hater but bare in mind I have probably purchased more new vw's than most on here.


----------



## Soul boy 68

SteveTDCi said:


> Have I missed anything between page 8 and 20, I got that hored I thought I was driving an Audi.
> 
> Does the s1 have any rivals ? Most are 2wd and a million pounds cheaper. As for the s1 being better than the jcw mini, well at that price point it's more of a rival for the gp2 and have you seen the reviews for that ? With the exception of the b7 rs4 has any audi ever been praised ? They make some nice engines but the cars driving tend to be a little bland.
> 
> Please feel to class me as a vag hater but bare in mind I have probably purchased more new vw's than most on here.


You clearly like VW's


----------



## SteveTDCi

I clearly have poeple who are blinkered by the badge, ok they get the choice of skoda/seat/vw but they all choose the golf without question.


----------



## Soul boy 68

SteveTDCi said:


> I clearly have poeple who are blinkered by the badge, ok they get the choice of skoda/seat/vw but they all choose the golf without question.


I have driven fraud, Hondas , Toyota, Renalts, Kia, Astra ,so for me it's not about the badge but the real build quality, performance and desirability, so for me Audi is the one I enjoyed the most and will probably go for Mercs and BMs next.:driver:


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I have driven fraud, Hondas , Toyota, Renalts, Kia, Astra ,so for me it's not about the badge but the real build quality, performance and desirability, so for me Audi is the one I enjoyed the most and will probably go for Mercs and BMs next.:driver:


Hang on a minute, you enjoyed driving an audi or not?


----------



## Kerr

SteveTDCi said:


> Have I missed anything between page 8 and 20, I got that hored I thought I was driving an Audi.
> 
> Does the s1 have any rivals ? Most are 2wd and a million pounds cheaper. As for the s1 being better than the jcw mini, well at that price point it's more of a rival for the gp2 and have you seen the reviews for that ? With the exception of the b7 rs4 has any audi ever been praised ? They make some nice engines but the cars driving tend to be a little bland.
> 
> Please feel to class me as a vag hater but bare in mind I have probably purchased more new vw's than most on here.


VAG hater.

For all that I get accused of being a VAG hater and a BMW lover, I've only owned one BMW and it's not that likely my next car will be another.

I don't actually dislike VAG as people seem to assume.

If you strip back most of the posts I've ever made, most concede that many are good cars, but I feel they are overhyped and over priced.

There is also a few that are pretty bad cars.

If VW or Audi brought out a good car at the right price, I'd have no issues buying one at all.

Even on the secondhand market, they just don't offer value for money as far as I'm concerned.

With the S1 I just can't see the fuss as 228bhp is common practice these days.

I've said for a while car prices are out of control and if we start banging on about a small reasonably powered car is a bargain at £25k, prices won't come down soon.

I can restrain myself to stand back and look at the car for what it is rather than automatically get carried away with simply the fact it's another Audi.

I do hope it turns out to be good. I'm not fully confident though.


----------



## Derekh929

Soul boy 68 said:


> Best to wait until official tech bits and the full reviews from the motoring press, then we can make a judgement. I still think it will cause some serious embarrasses ment on our roads and I think it will be too good for the Abarth, JCW, and the Mito which this car is aimed at.:driver:


:lol: maybe if you had said that from the start we would had non of the nonsense on this thread like I quoted in my 1st post, I have a VAG in the Garage as well as best met my requirements so keep open mind Stevetdi has had some good debates with us on hear with out all the no knowledge or based on actual facts garbage we seems to get of late, Stevetdi loves his VAG equipment but see's past the badge to get the best car for his needs like I do.
Just have a look at dynamic bench marks of the cars you are speaking about plenty of power and a Haldex means nothing if its a Porker , power to weight so important that why a nice Elise is so good handling , because the roads are not all straight we need good dynamics in a performace car IMHO .
RS5 would you put your hard earned into that or M3 or porche ?


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Hang on a minute, you enjoyed driving an audi or not?


These are all the cars driven BEFORE MY 1st AUDi. Thought I clear this fact up


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> These are all the cars driven BEFORE MY 1st AUDi. Thought I clear this fact up


You also didn't specify which cars. Honda nsx is slightly different to a civic.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> You also didn't specify which cars. Honda nsx is slightly different to a civic.


Too many to mention, I will name two, 1st generation Type R and focus RS:car:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Too many to mention, I will name two, 1st generation Type R and focus RS:car:


What made you go from hot hatchbacks to an Audi A1(what A1 do you have?), then want to return to another hot hatch?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> What made you go from hot hatchbacks to an Audi A1(what A1 do you have?), then want to return to another hot hatch?


A young family to raise as then so had to tone down a bit, running costs, you know the score, now ready to return to the hot hatch. Are you now saying the S1 is a hot hatch


----------



## Derekh929

Soul boy 68 said:


> I have driven fraud, Hondas , Toyota, Renalts, Kia, Astra ,so for me it's not about the badge but the real build quality, performance and desirability, so for me Audi is the one I enjoyed the most and will probably go for Mercs and BMs next.:driver:


So are we talking ST & RS ford? Type r Honda, GT86 Toyota ,Megane RS or Clio RS Renault sport, Kia ceed GT, Astra VXR Vaxhaul ?

So am I correct as I'm using your build quality , performance, desirability criteria , all be in I think we could miss of build quality for a couple no? If I'm wrong how wrong I'm I with your criteria


----------



## Soul boy 68

Derekh929 said:


> So are we talking ST & RS ford? Type r Honda, GT86 Toyota ,Megane RS or Clio RS Renault sport, Kia ceed GT, Astra VXR Vaxhaul ?
> 
> So am I correct as I'm using your build quality , performance, desirability criteria , all be in I think we could miss of build quality for a couple no? If I'm wrong how wrong I'm I with your criteria


Driven 1st Gen Type R And RS to name but a few, both very good cars but they just lacked that something, that quality materials you know those nice soft touch plastics and build quality.


----------



## Derekh929

Soul boy 68 said:


> Driven 1st Gen Type R And RS to name but a few, both very good cars but they just lacked that something, that quality materials you know those nice soft touch plastics and build quality.


Are you a politician , as you don't answer the questions, a test drive round the block no good to judge a cars ability:doublesho, I thought your criteria was for cars you had owned not taken for joy ride :doublesho
So is all this info you have just from the back of the max power mag?


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> A young family to raise as then so had to tone down a bit, running costs, you know the score, now ready to return to the hot hatch. Are you now saying the S1 is a hot hatch


It's on the lower scale for hot hatch backs. This year around 300bhp will start becoming normal.

I'd also want more space. That is what hot hatches are supposed to be. A performance car that can take the family and luggage, then be a hoot at other times.

The S1 looks as if it gives good performance, but not as good as many. It doesn't really give enough space for the family either. It seems to enter a market that nobody has had the need to fill before.

I like my comforts and like space. So I wouldn't go back to small cars.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> These are all the cars driven BEFORE MY 1st AUDi. Thought I clear this fact up


You don't need to justify what your next car will be or why, read some reviews go for a test drive and if it's good and YOU like it buy it and enjoy it, if you listened to each and everyone on here you wouldn't buy anything ever.


----------



## SteveTDCi

I like smaller cars for everyday usability, they are easier to park, not because I'm crap at parking but because spaces haven't grown in size at the same rate as cars. Having said that my mini clubman is the same size as the mk1 focus I had many years ago.

For the price of the s1 you could have the new seat Leon cupra, no doubt the audi will be basic and you will need to spend at least 2k on options, they are that tight that cruise control and Bluetooth will not be standard.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Derekh929 said:


> Are you a politician , as you don't answer the questions, a test drive round the block no good to judge a cars ability:doublesho, I thought your criteria was for cars you had owned not taken for joy ride :doublesho
> So is all this info you have just from the back of the max power mag?


These were cars I owned and not just taken for a joy ride or test ride, they were good cars.Performed well, but they just lacked that some thing, read what I said above fella you will get my point


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> You don't need to justify what your next car will be or why, read some reviews go for a test drive and if it's good and YOU like it buy it and enjoy it, if you listened to each and everyone on here you wouldn't buy anything ever.


That's exactly what I always do, research, test drive, buy, and enjoy:thumb: your right on that fact, if anyone takes notice of every comment then they might as well take the bus.:car:


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Personally i look at reviews just to get the gist/taster of things but at the end of the day i decide on a test drive not from anonymous opinions on a website.
IMO, the S1 looks like a nice stylish little car and is plenty quick enough for zipping about, plus you can always map it if you want more welly.


----------



## Soul boy 68

DJ X-Ray said:


> Personally i look at reviews just to get the gist/taster of things but at the end of the day i decide on a test drive not from anonymous opinions on a website.
> IMO, the S1 looks like a nice stylish little car and is plenty quick enough for zipping about, plus you can always map it if you want more welly.


I agree, the S1 is a nice stylish hot hatch with decent enough power and good take off from stand still, for a car of this size it should really move.


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> I agree, the S1 is a nice stylish hot hatch with decent enough power and good take off from stand still, for a car of this size it should really move.


Reading the articles in the magazines, they say 1420kg. Audi says the S3 weighs 1415kg. That also means the Focus ST is about 60kg lighter.

That seems a bit odd, or the S1 is a bit on the podgy side.

I used to head along to Crail for quarter mile races years ago.

4wd is great for a start when the driver gives it the full beans and goes for it. Due to the fact of the extra grip and little wheelspin, it's the transmission that takes an absolute hammering.

It is a lot of strain on any car, but the 4wd cars are hit the worst.

4wd cars are always going to set good 0-60mph times. Audi have confirmed that as 5.8/5.9secs. That's FWD territory these days and with the extra power, the more powerful FWD cars will move away once on the move.

I also doubt it will manage 155mph. Hatchbacks aren't aerodynamic and most fall short of the claimed top speed.

Off the top of my head, I can't think of any sub 250bhp hatchbacks that claim the magic 155mph barrier.

Most that claim similar fall short. I remember on test, that some of the 150mph+ cars fell as short as 138mph.


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> New 2014 Audi S1 Sportback Trailer - YouTube


Interesting. It does look to be more of a city car, looks lower than I thought, still don't like the back, sounds dull and doesn't look that inspiring, nor does the trailer.

I think putting "quattro" on that is an insult to the group b car.

It just looks a little like something between a 500 and s3 but closer in size to an s3.

It doesn't look bad, but I just don't think there's anything there to inspire you to buy one, the advert or the car. Just lacks imagination.

If they could make the ad like the ad for the jaguar xf, well. It's just a bit..meh.

It doesn't seem to be targeted as a hot hatch either in that trailer.


----------



## RisingPower

Oh and for those who think I hate audi, I think this is probably one of the best cars ever made.

This, is an s1.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Yeah that's filth


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> Reading the articles in the magazines, they say 1420kg. Audi says the S3 weighs 1415kg. That also means the Focus ST is about 60kg lighter.
> 
> That seems a bit odd, or the S1 is a bit on the podgy side.
> 
> I used to head along to Crail for quarter mile races years ago.
> 
> 4wd is great for a start when the driver gives it the full beans and goes for it. Due to the fact of the extra grip and little wheelspin, it's the transmission that takes an absolute hammering.
> 
> It is a lot of strain on any car, but the 4wd cars are hit the worst.
> 
> 4wd cars are always going to set good 0-60mph times. Audi have confirmed that as 5.8/5.9secs. That's FWD territory these days and with the extra power, the more powerful FWD cars will move away once on the move.
> 
> I also doubt it will manage 155mph. Hatchbacks aren't aerodynamic and most fall short of the claimed top speed.
> 
> Off the top of my head, I can't think of any sub 250bhp hatchbacks that claim the magic 155mph barrier.
> 
> Most that claim similar fall short. I remember on test, that some of the 150mph+ cars fell as short as 138mph.


We will just have to see when the motoring press give it a good go around the race track and check for lap times and the 0 to 60 times too, just remember one fact. ANY HOT HATCH WILL HAVE IT'S PROS AND CONS, it will always be down to what people like best in terms of branding, style, image and practicality as well as performance. I don't think you will see many S1 on the road and will not be as common as muck as say the ST. It will feel more exclusive


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> We will just have to see when the motoring press give it a good go around the race track and check for lap times and the 0 to 60 times too, just remember one fact. ANY HOT HATCH WILL HAVE IT'S PROS AND CONS, it will always be down to what people like best in terms of branding, style, image and practicality as well as performance. I don't think you will see many S1 on the road and will not be as common as muck as say the ST. It will feel more exclusive


The ST, as you put it is " as common as muck" because it offers a lot for the money against the competition.

I wouldn't say they are anywhere near as common as many other performance hatches on the road.

If the S1 is good, it will be as common as muck just like most of the German cars.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

And just in case people think i'm biased towards the four rings, here's a PROPER BM


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> The ST, as you put it is " as common as muck" because it offers a lot for the money against the competition.
> 
> I wouldn't say they are anywhere near as common as many other performance hatches on the road.
> 
> If the S1 is good, it will be as common as muck just like most of the German cars.


there is a heck of a lot more frauds out there and yes your right the S1 is good


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> And just in case people think i'm biased towards the four rings, here's a PROPER BM BMW M1: The Forgotten Supercar - XCAR - YouTube


I never said you were, I know you're not, but I don't agree with you on the s1 (the slow one that is)


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> I never said you were, I know you're not, but I don't agree with you on the s1 (the slow one that is)


It's been such a long and enjoyable thread I forgot he said that (the slow one) 230 BHP, so what does it make the fiesta st 197BHP, Mini JCW 215BHP, 500 Abarth 165BHP. feel like then?


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Driven 1st Gen Type R And RS to name but a few, both very good cars but they just lacked that something, that quality materials you know those nice soft touch plastics and build quality.


Tbh when I had my type r, the interior wasn't what I was thinking about when I was driving it, it was the handling, the slick gearchanges, the noise etc etc.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> It's been such a long and enjoyable thread I forgot he said that (the slow one) 230 BHP, so what does it make the fiesta st 197BHP, Mini JCW 215BHP, 500 Abarth 165BHP. feel like then?


The fiesta st is lighter, I hate the fat jcw, the abarth is again much lighter.

Lighter = more fun.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Tbh when I had my type r, the interior wasn't what I was thinking about when I was driving it, it was the handling, the slick gearchanges, the noise etc etc.


Your right, it's like I said both very good cars:car:


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> The fiesta st is lighter, I hate the fat jcw, the abarth is again much lighter.
> 
> Lighter = more fun.


I have an A1 and I think that fun to drive even if it is a little heavier, it really does stick to the road like glue with hardly any body roll and it's FWD too:car:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> there is a heck of a lot more frauds out there and yes your right the S1 is good


The more you post, the more I'm know you are too baised. We've already discussed the S1 in other threads and it seems you're a bit wrapped up in it.

You automatically assume the S1 is going to be great and knocking the competition as "common as muck" and using "Fraud" rather than Ford.

If I used derogatory words when in VAG threads, even if to be amusing, I'd have a barrage of complainers.

If you want to feel exclusive with a car, don't buy Audi, VW, BMW or anything of that nature as you will be "common as muck".

Look at the last S3, they were hugely popular. If Audi make a good car, it will sell. It they make a good car for £25K, it will sell like hot cakes.

All this talk of the S1 showing its worth on track will be interesting. It's not what Audis are built for and usually always where they fall short of their direct competition.

4wd certainly isn't needed for smooth high grip race circuits.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> The more you post, the more I'm know you are too baised. We've already discussed the S1 in other threads and it seems you're a bit wrapped up in it.
> 
> You automatically assume the S1 is going to be great and knocking the competition as "common as muck" and using "Fraud" rather than Ford.
> 
> If I used derogatory words when in VAG threads, even if to be amusing, I'd have a barrage of complainers.
> 
> If you want to feel exclusive with a car, don't buy Audi, VW, BMW or anything of that nature as you will be "common as muck".
> 
> Look at the last S3, they were hugely popular. If Audi make a good car, it will sell. It they make a good car for £25K, it will sell like hot cakes.
> 
> All this talk of the S1 showing its worth on track will be interesting. It's not what Audis are built for and usually always where they fall short of their direct competition.
> 
> 4wd certainly isn't needed for smooth high grip race circuits.


Audis do feature on the ring, but wayyyy below porsches and vettes.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> The more you post, the more I'm know you are too baised. We've already discussed the S1 in other threads and it seems you're a bit wrapped up in it.
> 
> You automatically assume the S1 is going to be great and knocking the competition as "common as muck" and using "Fraud" rather than Ford.
> 
> If I used derogatory words when in VAG threads, even if to be amusing, I'd have a barrage of complainers.
> 
> If you want to feel exclusive with a car, don't buy Audi, VW, BMW or anything of that nature as you will be "common as muck".
> 
> Look at the last S3, they were hugely popular. If Audi make a good car, it will sell. It they make a good car for £25K, it will sell like hot cakes.
> 
> All this talk of the S1 showing its worth on track will be interesting. It's not what Audis are built for and usually always where they fall short of their direct competition.


I have driven fords as well as Hondas, toyotas,Vauxhal, BMW all good cars in their own right so I am not really baised. I just think German cars in general are better engineered and it's because this thread is about the S1 that it's being debated about more.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I have an A1 and I think that fun to drive even if it is a little heavier, it really does stick to the road like glue with hardly any body roll and it's FWD too:car:


CTR had no body roll and was fun to fling about, sticking to the road doesn't make it fun, the m3 stuck to the road and wallowed a lot because of the weight.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I have driven fords as well as Hondas, toyotas,Vauxhal, BMW all good cars in their own right so I am not really baised. I just think German cars in general are better engineered and it's because this thread is about the S1 that it's being debated about more.


Why are german cars better engineered? The s1 is being debated more because there's more of a following for vag (read ignorant to other cars) on dw.


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Why are german cars better engineered? The s1 is being debated more because there's more of a following for vag (read ignorant to other cars) on dw.


That's not my fault there is a following for VAG and I am not ignorant to other cars. I appreciate a lot of other peoples nice looking cars on this forum and the care and dedication they take in looking after their pride and joy. I just love cars and detailing in general.:thumb:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> I have driven fords as well as Hondas, toyotas,Vauxhal, BMW all good cars in their own right so I am not really baised. I just think German cars in general are better engineered and it's because this thread is about the S1 that it's being debated about more.


If German cars are so well engineered, why do they get slaughtered by the Japanese for reliability?

Audi finished 2nd last (only ahead of Rover) in warranty direct's engine reliability survey.

What does that say for the engineering?


----------



## 182_Blue

I think people need to remember that VAG covers at least 4 brands (not including the high end stuff) so there's bound to be more talk about them as in theory they produce at least 4x more cars than say renault.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Thanks.t's not my fault there is a following for VAG and I am not ignorant to other cars. I appreciate a lot of other peoples nice looking cars on this forum and the care and dedication they take in looking after their pride and joy. I just love cars and detailing in general.:thumb:


Your flogging a dead horse TBH


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> If German cars are so well engineered, why do they get slaughtered by the Japanese for reliability?
> 
> Audi finished 2nd last (only ahead of Rover) in warranty direct's engine reliability survey.
> 
> What does that say for the engineering?


Lets not forget about Pergeot,Renault,Toyota,they have also had recalls and warranty issues too. you have to look at it on balance and I still think German cars are better engineered and better built.:car:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Lets not forget about Pergeot,Renault,Toyota,they have also had recalls and warranty issues too. you have to look at it on balance and I still think German cars are better engineered and better built.:car:


Hey now, i have a Toyota


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Lets not forget about Pergeot,Renault,Toyota,they have also had recalls and warranty issues too. you have to look at it on balance and I still think German cars are better engineered and better built.:car:


I don't forget that at all and the figures are balanced.

Everyone just makes the assumption that German cars are more reliable, or better engineered, completely missing the facts that they aren't.

A better quality feel of plastic doesn't define great engineering to me.

All cars and manufactures have issues and faults. I also think if you pay a premium price, quality and reliability should go up.

This isn't the case.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

RisingPower said:


> The fiesta st is lighter, I hate the fat jcw, the abarth is again much lighter.
> 
> Lighter = more fun.


I just don't like the look of the Fiat's tbh.
It's probably the same in Cambridge rp, but here in London you can't walk down the street without trippin over one! They're like the bloody ipod of the road.
I suppose you'd get the Gucci one eh? :lol:


----------



## Guest

Agreed, my BMW wasn't the best when it came to reliability, plus all four alloys deformed!!!, I was treated dreadfully By BMW and i expected more from supposed germanic build quality etc etc.



Kerr said:


> I don't forget that at all and the figures are balanced.
> 
> Everyone just makes the assumption that German cars are more reliable, or better engineered, completely missing the facts that they aren't.
> 
> A better quality feel of plastic doesn't define great engineering to me.
> 
> All cars and manufactures have issues and faults. I also think if you pay a premium price, quality and reliability should go up.
> 
> This isn't the case.


----------



## Deniance

25 000 pounds, i aint rich ill have the fiesta


----------



## WHIZZER

Kerr said:


> I don't forget that at all and the figures are balanced.
> 
> Everyone just makes the assumption that German cars are more reliable, or better engineered, completely missing the facts that they aren't.
> 
> A better quality feel of plastic doesn't define great engineering to me.
> 
> All cars and manufactures have issues and faults. I also think if you pay a premium price, quality and reliability should go up.
> 
> This isn't the case.


Well it has been in my case .... quality is better , the reliability is better and the service i have had has been much better but again this is my experience :thumb:

i'll give you a for instance - We had a VW toureag for just under 5 years in the whole time the only thing we had to do was change one light bulb nothing else went wrong it , was still as good as the day we got it when we sold it

Other half had a fiat 500 - gearbox went wrong, clutch went wrong, blown 3 bulbs, leather seats worn through - Did fiat want to know - no chance - Leather thats our problem as we wore jeans - who doesnt? - gearbox/ clutch thats still and ongoing issue - parts replaced only after 5 visits of being fob off ....


----------



## 182_Blue

Actually my VAG ownership has been faultless as has the service from my local Vw garage.


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> I just don't like the look of the Fiat's tbh.
> It's probably the same in Cambridge rp, but here in London you can't walk down the street without trippin over one! They're like the bloody ipod of the road.
> I suppose you'd get the Gucci one eh? :lol:


Audis are the ipod of the road, I never see 500's


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> I think people need to remember that VAG covers at least 4 brands (not including the high end stuff) so there's bound to be more talk about them as in theory they produce at least 4x more cars than say renault.


That's gone unoticed by a lot of people, VAG does cover at leat 4 brands so a lot to talk about. Good point:thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Hey now, i have a Toyota


Iam sure you have had no issues with yours but we all know Toyotas have had some issues, remember the issues with their brakes, can't remember what car it was tough. On another note the GT86 is a cracking car, don't you think?


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Iam sure you have had no issues with yours but we all know Toyotas have had some issues, remember the issues with their brakes, can't remember what car it was tough. On another note the GT86 is a cracking car, don't you think?


There is actually a GT86 thread on here.

It got slated. The major points were not enough power and not worth £25k.

That would be an exclusive car for you to buy.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> I don't forget that at all and the figures are balanced.
> 
> Everyone just makes the assumption that German cars are more reliable, or better engineered, completely missing the facts that they aren't.
> 
> A better quality feel of plastic doesn't define great engineering to me.
> 
> All cars and manufactures have issues and faults. I also think if you pay a premium price, quality and reliability should go up.
> 
> This isn't the case.


Bmw wring every oz of na power out of the m3 and m5, that makes them less reliable than an understressed big v8.

They also then put cheapass coil packs in which went wrong.

Simpler the car, the more reliable it'll be.


----------



## Soul boy 68

WHIZZER said:


> Well it has been in my case .... quality is better , the reliability is better and the service i have had has been much better but again this is my experience :thumb:
> 
> i'll give you a for instance - We had a VW toureag for just under 5 years in the whole time the only thing we had to do was change one light bulb nothing else went wrong it , was still as good as the day we got it when we sold it
> 
> Other half had a fiat 500 - gearbox went wrong, clutch went wrong, blown 3 bulbs, leather seats worn through - Did fiat want to know - no chance - Leather thats our problem as we wore jeans - who doesnt? - gearbox/ clutch thats still and ongoing issue - parts replaced only after 5 visits of being fob off ....


there does seen to be quality issues with the 500, my nighbour had rainwater leaking inside through the door seals.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> there does seen to be quality issues with the 500, my nighbour had rainwater leaking inside through the door seals.


Never happens to audis.

http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?132436-Water-leaking-through-front-door-trims


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> There is actually a GT86 thread on here.
> 
> It got slated. The major points were not enough power and not worth £25k.
> 
> That would be an exclusive car for you to buy.


Not read the thread, but it does look like a cracking car
i guess for you it's slow aswell:lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Never happens to audis.
> 
> http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?132436-Water-leaking-through-front-door-trims


OOPS! WE CAN'T WIN CAN WE. you would just have to go with what's best for you. Like I said on an earlier post, all hot hatches will have issues and the pros and cons:driver:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Not read the thread, but it does look like a cracking car
> i guess for you it's slow as well:lol:


I like the GT86 and understand what they have done.

At £25k I do think It's a bit pricey, but what car isn't these days? Being RWD and having thing like a limited slip diff bumps up the price. A similar spec Mazda MX5 isn't much cheaper.

It is a fun little car to drive and every single credible reviewer said that. DW is the only place that didn't get it.

I wouldn't want to give up the space and performance of my car. I do too much miles on the motorway which isn't the GT86s strong point.

But if I was looking for a £25k fun car and could manage with a smaller car, the GT86 would be a very strong contender.


----------



## 182_Blue

DW wasn't the only place that didn't get it, I'm on a few forums and all had the same comments as here eg piston heads, golf gti forum, scirocco forum etc etc, just Google 'gt86 too slow' to see.



Kerr said:


> I like the GT86 and understand what they have done.
> 
> At £25k I do think It's a bit pricey, but what car isn't these days? Being RWD and having thing like a limited slip diff bumps up the price. A similar spec Mazda MX5 isn't much cheaper.
> 
> It is a fun little car to drive and every single credible reviewer said that. DW is the only place that didn't get it.
> 
> I wouldn't want to give up the space and performance of my car. I do too much miles on the motorway which isn't the GT86s strong point.
> 
> But if I was looking for a £25k fun car and could manage with a smaller car, the GT86 would be a very strong contender.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> DW wasn't the only place that didn't get it, I'm on a few forums and all had the same comments as here eg piston heads, golf gti forum, scirocco forum etc etc, just Google 'gt86 too slow' to see.


If you had 25k what would you go for?


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> If you had 25k what would you go for?


Well we now have two big cars, we are may get something a little smaller for work and shopping and running about, in my mind I have Mini JCW, Polo R, Golf R, and Audi S1 now of course.

Then again I change my mind and start to think about evokes, discoveries, Q5's and maybe X3 LOL.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Shaun said:


> Well we now have two big cars, we are may get something a little smaller for work and shopping and running about, in my mind I have Mini JCW, Polo R, Golf R, and Audi S1 now of course.
> 
> Then again I change my mind and start to think about evokes, discoveries, Q5's and maybe X3 LOL.


Or..


----------



## Kerr

Shaun said:


> DW wasn't the only place that didn't get it, I'm on a few forums and all had the same comments as here eg piston heads, golf gti forum, scirocco forum etc etc, just Google 'gt86 too slow' to see.


To be fair pistonheads is a joke and the rest are VW sites, where I think biased is a fair account.

On all sites I use there was some some criticism, but largely good. It was never going to please everyone, but some of the stuff spouted was nonsense.

The GT86 has a slow 0-60mph time of 7.4secs which is hard to understand. A 200bhp rear wheel drive car should be much faster.

That said it's 0-100mph time is 17secs which is pretty much Golf GTi fast.

So often people being critical of a car being slow, often missed the fact their car was no faster.


----------



## 182_Blue

My point is it wasn't just DW, Google it, sorry my example where Vw sites but plenty other non VAG sites said the same, eg EVO site, focustoc, even singletrack bike forum 


Anyway we are going off topic, not that it's really been on topic for a while.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Back to the thread, if you want something smaller that still offers big car quality, fun and performance then the S1 is the car for you.

other contenders in this segment are the Mini, Suzuki Swift Sport,Clio, and fiesta.

Then there is Hyundai i10,Kia Picanto which are all impressive :thumb:


----------



## robertdon777

Shaun said:


> Well we now have two big cars, we are may get something a little smaller for work and shopping and running about, in my mind I have Mini JCW, Polo R, Golf R, and Audi S1 now of course.
> 
> Then again I change my mind and start to think about evokes, discoveries, Q5's and maybe X3 LOL.


Golf R, Kerr found them for under £300 a month with maintenance!

Can't see past the R at that price from your list. So I've sorted your next car for you.....simples. Lol.


----------



## WHIZZER

DJ X-Ray said:


> Or.. 2014 Audi SQ5 Review-New King Of Small Performance Crossovers? - YouTube


Now that's a good car


----------



## Soul boy 68

WHIZZER said:


> Now that's a good car


It has to be an Audi, of course


----------



## Derekh929

Soul boy 68 said:


> It has to be an Audi, of course


:doublesho don't you know what Whizzer drives:thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Derekh929 said:


> :doublesho don't you know what Whizzer drives:thumb:


NO


----------



## Derekh929

A little clue give you a S give you a Q give you 12345 you did realise this is a VAG forum under disguise of Detailing site lol

And I can't believe this ain't been closed ages ago , like others tbo


----------



## Derekh929

Ok i know this picture is going to shock a lot of members and might get me banned but hey it's worth it.



I Bet that has shocked the establishment :doublesho

A RWD at Gleenshee with a few inch on Snow on the roads with standard tyres:doublesho ,


----------



## CoOkIeMoNsTeR

Thanks for the proof it can be done :thumb: I used to drive my last CLK in all weathers including snow, never hand an ounce of trouble.

Regarding the S1, having read the entire thread, for those of you not sure how big an A1 is, it's tiny, same size as a Polo. I've been in one, and even at 5'8 I felt hemmed in, mostly the black roof lining though, I have one in the X5, and it manages to make that feel small too. But I'd not class it as a family car, it's deffo a supermini.

I won't get into the power debate, I'd say the S1 would probably appeal to the more mature customer than the Fiesta ST on the whole, and I still think the A1 is on the whole expensive (notice not too expensive) but will sell.

I don't agree with the way everything is an option, I think all new Audis are a rip off and I wouldn't actually say the interiors are that high quality, the dash might be, but the plastics around the floors isn't any better than other manufacturers.

Please don't tar me with the pro BMW camp because I have one, the X5 is only my second BMW, and I never even intended to buy it :doublesho

For me, £25k is too much for such a small car, but then £20k for a Clio RS isn't exactly a bargain. £25k could see you in a Focus ST, Astra VXR, GT86, so at that price point, I see the S1 being not comparable, and it's more expensive than its rivals, so being on its own in the market is why it will sell.

On the plus, the A1 is a good looking car, but I'd only consider a 3 door


----------



## Bristle Hound

Having owned (or the wife did really ) an Abarth 500 I can honestly say they are not the car people think they are. We couldnt wait to get rid of ours after 9 months of ownership

The build quality is wooful, the performance is underwhelming, the ride is harsh beyond belief, the Dealer back up is a disgrace, the servicing costs are ridiculous. I could go on!

At least I am able to speak with a bit of authority on the matter rather than guess how good Abarth 500's are, as some other posters on here have done

Surprise surprise to see all the VAG bashers out in force on this thread AGAIN. Come on lads its getting a bit boring now, really :wall:


----------



## Bristle Hound

Derekh929 said:


> Ok i know this picture is going to shock a lot of members and might get me banned but hey it's worth it.
> 
> 
> 
> I Bet that has shocked the establishment :doublesho
> 
> A RWD at Gleenshee with a few inch on Snow on the roads with standard tyres:doublesho ,


But the owner is looking in the boot for his mobile phone to get a tow back down Derek because he's stuck!  :lol::lol::lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

CoOkIeMoNsTeR said:


> Thanks for the proof it can be done :thumb: I used to drive my last CLK in all weathers including snow, never hand an ounce of trouble.
> 
> Regarding the S1, having read the entire thread, for those of you not sure how big an A1 is, it's tiny, same size as a Polo. I've been in one, and even at 5'8 I felt hemmed in, mostly the black roof lining though, I have one in the X5, and it manages to make that feel small too. But I'd not class it as a family car, it's deffo a supermini.
> 
> I won't get into the power debate, I'd say the S1 would probably appeal to the more mature customer than the Fiesta ST on the whole, and I still think the A1 is on the whole expensive (notice not too expensive) but will sell.
> 
> I don't agree with the way everything is an option, I think all new Audis are a rip off and I wouldn't actually say the interiors are that high quality, the dash might be, but the plastics around the floors isn't any better than other manufacturers.
> 
> Please don't tar me with the pro BMW camp because I have one, the X5 is only my second BMW, and I never even intended to buy it :doublesho
> 
> For me, £25k is too much for such a small car, but then £20k for a Clio RS isn't exactly a bargain. £25k could see you in a Focus ST, Astra VXR, GT86, so at that price point, I see the S1 being not comparable, and it's more expensive than its rivals, so being on its own in the market is why it will sell.
> 
> On the plus, the A1 is a good looking car, but I'd only consider a 3 door


Your right,the A1 is a nice looking car and it won car of the year when first launched,don't forget it is competing against BMWs mini JCW, the 500 Abarth, the Suzuki Swift Sport, fiesta st. And yes it may be considered expensive it is a premium brand, like it or not.:car:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Bristle Hound said:


> Having owned (or the wife did really ) an Abarth 500 I can honestly say they are not the car people think they are. We couldnt wait to get rid of ours after 9 months of ownership
> 
> The build quality is wooful, the performance is underwhelming, the ride is harsh beyond belief, the Dealer back up is a disgrace, the servicing costs are ridiculous. I could go on!
> 
> At least I am able to speak with a bit of authority on the matter rather than guess how good Abarth 500's are, as some other posters on here have done
> 
> Surprise surprise to see all the VAG bashers out in force on this thread AGAIN. Come on lads its getting a bit boring now, really :wall:


Shocking why so many VAG haters here, I cannot understand why
Going back to your point about the Abarth, a friend of mine had the normal 500 and he also had nothing but problems too


----------



## Guest

Soul boy 68 said:


> Shocking why so many VAG haters here, I cannot understand why
> Going back to your point about the Abarth, a friend of mine had the normal 500 and he also had nothing but problems too


I fail to see why certain people feel the need to convert VAG (not just VAG but any brand) owners to buying other cars !, what business is it of theirs ?, by all means have your say but the amount of posts and the length of some of them is just plain ridiculous, looking through certain members history its getting obvious that they are on a constant wind up mission, grow up , seriously :thumb:

PS not a VAG owner, far from it, never owned one, but i may just buy one to wind the preachers up :wave:


----------



## Derekh929

Bristle Hound said:


> But the owner is looking in the boot for his mobile phone to get a tow back down Derek because he's stuck!  :lol::lol::lol:


 up north we tend to remove our Ski boots before driving and place them in the boot :thumb:

Every car is just as good as the driver behind the wheel & the experience they have:thumb:

I used to have a Manta GTE in the 80's when snow was very bad, and always managed it because scotland we dont shut the country down for an 1" of snow , that why you got so many 4X4 on the road :lol: it's to make people think they can drive up a 45 Degree mountain in a foot of snow:thumb:

I think a lot on this thread is nonsense but the OP has brought some of it on by his comments as well tbo but a few have been to far for the against argument as well imho, but just like always know on here never get a proper debate on lots of area's before it ends up with the dummy out childish rubbish, i won't enter the poor service threads or Benefits threads and a lot more know tbo as the debates are not on facts or anything else.

I enjoyed my time on this site and contributing to it with my many threads but losing interest fast as my contribution seems little valued tbo


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Shocking why so many VAG haters here, I cannot understand why
> Going back to your point about the Abarth, a friend of mine had the normal 500 and he also had nothing but problems too


I'm sick of hearing the term VAG haters on here.

I'll tell you what gets on the nerves of lots of people on here, is the fact so many people talk about them and dismiss everything else in such a condescending and arrogant attitude. Then don't even realise they are.

I've owned various car brands and I've used various car forums and I've never seen behaviour like this before.

Yesterday we had the justification that VAG have 4 times as many cars as they have all the brand under their umbrella. Have a look around the forum all the car chat is VW or Audi. It isn't VAG, because I don't remember much Skoda threads lasting countless pages and the last Seat thread, namely their highest profile car, the Cupra R. Another FWD hot hatch with 280BHP and claimed 0-60mph times of 5.7secs lasted just( I think) 2 pages.

It's the only car brand that people with an interest in cars get to discuss. I'd talk cars all day on a forum, but most go nowhere on here.

Start a BMW thread and it will go, I don't like BMWs, they are ugly. Rear wheel drive is crap and gets stuck in the snow. Yet nobody seems to bother when the BMW cars are abused.

Risingpower started a thread about the Corvette the other day and it got the usual "typical American junk", "vulgar", "small *****" etc etc.

Nobody seems to bother about comments that overstep the mark in those threads. I haven't seen those threads threatened with locking due to unsavoury language.

The Audi S1 thread has been sizzling on for days. It was reasonably happy soldiering on in various directions with a few sub discussions.

People making naive comments about driving, they get a fair response, then suddenly the thread has to get back on topic. It was fine before.

The Toyota GT86 was happily introduced to the discussion. Again more points coming into the discussion, but when a fair point made my me, about VW drivers slating the GT86 for being slow when it is as fast as their premium cars, that then results in the desperate need for the thread to get back on topic.

The same thing has happened in countless threads before. Many people are freely able to wonder well off topic, everyone is happy to join in, yet as soon as someone puts forward a fair counter argument, yet seen to be anti VAG, that automatically leads to a thread locked or threatened with a lock.

There is absolutely no consistency how threads run on here, and why people are happily able to dish abuse out to other brands, then get upset when they get some back.

If you start a thread you should have to accept varying opinion, but obviously to an acceptable level.

You've used words describing other people's cars "as common and muck" and "Frauds" and have the cheek to have a go at anyone who in not that positive about a VAG. See the issue there?

We need things to be balanced here, or VAG talk left for the VAG forums.

It's a bit like a football team forum. It's probably fun when you support that team, but for outsiders reading the nonsense, it does become offensive and irritating.


----------



## johanr77

Derekh929 said:


> I think a lot on this thread is nonsense but the OP has brought some of it on by his comments as well tbo but a few have been to far for the against argument as well imho, but just like always know on here never get a proper debate on lots of area's before it ends up with the dummy out childish rubbish, i won't enter the poor service threads or Benefits threads and a lot more know tbo as the debates are not on facts or anything else.
> 
> I enjoyed my time on this site and contributing to it with my many threads but losing interest fast as my contribution seems little valued tbo


I wouldn't chuck your toys out of the pram, people aren't going to agree that's life. One of most noticeable problems on here is people can't see past their own opinions and get in a strop because someone else won't agree with them. The OP likes the S1, great crack on and get one, wouldn't spend my cash on it. I see little point in trying to convince someone else to buy something they don't want.


----------



## Guest

Oh look, another huge post, get a grip !


----------



## Kerr

wraith68 said:


> Oh look, another huge post, get a grip !


Why do I find you following me these days?

Everywhere I post you are there, usually making anti BMW comments to get a reaction. Notice I just ignore them?

I don't actually care too much.


----------



## Bristle Hound

Derekh929 said:


> up north we tend to remove our Ski boots before driving and place them in the boot :thumb:
> 
> Every car is just as good as the driver behind the wheel & the experience they have:thumb:
> 
> I used to have a Manta GTE in the 80's when snow was very bad, and always managed it because scotland we dont shut the country down for an 1" of snow , that why you got so many 4X4 on the road :lol: it's to make people think they can drive up a 45 Degree mountain in a foot of snow:thumb:
> 
> I think a lot on this thread is nonsense but the OP has brought some of it on by his comments as well tbo but a few have been to far for the against argument as well imho, but just like always know on here never get a proper debate on lots of area's before it ends up with the dummy out childish rubbish, i won't enter the poor service threads or Benefits threads and a lot more know tbo as the debates are not on facts or anything else.
> 
> I enjoyed my time on this site and contributing to it with my many threads but losing interest fast as my contribution seems little valued tbo


Only pulling your chain Derek my friend :lol:

I agree it is a shame, because when someone does make some informed logical comments there always seems to be some sarcastic moron willing add there ill informed tupence worth just to wind people up

I'm not a BM fan but I dont search out every BMW thread just to hammer BM at every chance. & yes I have owned BMW's in the past

Our local BMW dealer is worse to deal with than 'Shady Joe's' the back street used car dealer. The dealer is shocking. The management there want to wake up and sort there staff out. Not only are they losing business because of it but it effecting the brand too

Rant over! :lol:


----------



## 182_Blue

> The Toyota GT86 was happily introduced to the discussion. Again more points coming into the discussion, but when a fair point made my me, about VW drivers slating the GT86 for being slow when it is as fast as their premium cars, that then results in the desperate need for the thread to get back on topic.
> 
> The same thing has happened in countless threads before. Many people are freely able to wonder well off topic, everyone is happy to join in, yet as soon as someone puts forward a fair counter argument, yet seen to be anti VAG, that automatically leads to a thread locked or threatened with a lock.


I don't think anyone can help but notice you and your posting, i assume your having a dig at me in your post about inconstancy ?


----------



## Kerr

Shaun said:


> I don't think anyone can help but notice you and your posting.


You took you head off the wall before I quoted you there.

It isn't like you to put a dig in Shaun.


----------



## 182_Blue

Kerr said:


> You took you head off the wall before I quoted you there.
> 
> It isn't like you to put a dig in Shaun.


just bored of this all the time TBH


----------



## Kerr

Shaun said:


> I don't think anyone can help but notice you and your posting, i assume your having a dig at me in your post about inconstancy ?


It's not a dig.

You've done it numerous time. You introduced cars into your argument in previous VW threads, and only when someone responds to your post to put a fair point forward, you threaten to lock it.

It isn't fair to make a point that deserves a response then keep suppressing others for doing only what you've done.

You are clearly a huge VW fan, and it doesn't lead to balanced forum the way you are too supportive of one side of the fence.


----------



## Kerr

Shaun said:


> just bored of this all the time TBH


We all are.


----------



## Derekh929

johanr77 said:


> I wouldn't chuck your toys out of the pram, people aren't going to agree that's life. One of most noticeable problems on here is people can't see past their own opinions and get in a strop because someone else won't agree with them. The OP likes the S1, great crack on and get one, wouldn't spend my cash on it. I see little point in trying to convince someone else to buy something they don't want.


:lol: no no pram toys being thrown this is not about this thread re my comments but of many other subjects on here of late afraid , i have another project i'm working on so need to be fully focused on it, and certainly don't expect everyone to agree with me:thumb:


----------



## Bristle Hound

Kerr said:


> I'm sick of hearing the term VAG haters on here.
> 
> I'll tell you what gets on the nerves of lots of people on here, is the fact so many people talk about them and dismiss everything else in such a condescending and arrogant attitude. Then don't even realise they are.
> 
> I've owned various car brands and I've used various car forums and I've never seen behaviour like this before.
> 
> Yesterday we had the justification that VAG have 4 times as many cars as they have all the brand under their umbrella. Have a look around the forum all the car chat is VW or Audi. It isn't VAG, because I don't remember much Skoda threads lasting countless pages and the last Seat thread, namely their highest profile car, the Cupra R. Another FWD hot hatch with 280BHP and claimed 0-60mph times of 5.7secs lasted just( I think) 2 pages.
> 
> It's the only car brand that people with an interest in cars get to discuss. I'd talk cars all day on a forum, but most go nowhere on here.
> 
> Start a BMW thread and it will go, I don't like BMWs, they are ugly. Rear wheel drive is crap and gets stuck in the snow. Yet nobody seems to bother when the BMW cars are abused.
> 
> Risingpower started a thread about the Corvette the other day and it got the usual "typical American junk", "vulgar", "small *****" etc etc.
> 
> Nobody seems to bother about comments that overstep the mark in those threads. I haven't seen those threads threatened with locking due to unsavoury language.
> 
> The Audi S1 thread has been sizzling on for days. It was reasonably happy soldiering on in various directions with a few sub discussions.
> 
> People making naive comments about driving, they get a fair response, then suddenly the thread has to get back on topic. It was fine before.
> 
> The Toyota GT86 was happily introduced to the discussion. Again more points coming into the discussion, but when a fair point made my me, about VW drivers slating the GT86 for being slow when it is as fast as their premium cars, that then results in the desperate need for the thread to get back on topic.
> 
> The same thing has happened in countless threads before. Many people are freely able to wonder well off topic, everyone is happy to join in, yet as soon as someone puts forward a fair counter argument, yet seen to be anti VAG, that automatically leads to a thread locked or threatened with a lock.
> 
> There is absolutely no consistency how threads run on here, and why people are happily able to dish abuse out to other brands, then get upset when they get some back.
> 
> If you start a thread you should have to accept varying opinion, but obviously to an acceptable level.
> 
> You've used words describing other people's cars "as common and muck" and "Frauds" and have the cheek to have a go at anyone who in not that positive about a VAG. See the issue there?
> 
> We need things to be balanced here, or VAG talk left for the VAG forums.
> 
> It's a bit like a football team forum. It's probably fun when you support that team, but for outsiders reading the nonsense, it does become offensive and irritating.


You know what they say Kerr, if you ain't happy with the way the site is run you don't have to come on here

It just seems to me that you always have to try and justify your dislike for the VAG brand

If there's a thread about a VAG branded car you are ALWAYS WITHOUT FAIL there posting your negative comments

Yes, we all know you don't like the VAG brand, but give it a rest, really!

I can accept that, if you don't like 'em so be it, but what I find difficult to accept is that you fail to take criticism your self over some of your more inflammatory remarks

I really sometimes wonder Kerr whether you are just a wind up merchant or do have some constructive comments to make


----------



## 182_Blue

Why am i a huge VW fan ?, you have no clue what car i own presently and its not a VW, i have owned a VW true but i have owned more Renaults and fords, even a dreaded BMW.

i dont even bother talking about my cars these days as TBH i dont care what people think.



Kerr said:


> It's not a dig.
> 
> You've done it numerous time. You introduced cars into your argument in previous VW threads, and only when someone responds to your post to put a fair point forward, you threaten to lock it.
> 
> It isn't fair to make a point that deserves a response then keep suppressing others for doing only what you've done.
> 
> You are clearly a huge VW fan, and it doesn't lead to balanced forum the way you are too supportive of one side of the fence.


----------



## Derekh929

Bristle Hound said:


> Only pulling your chain Derek my friend :lol:
> 
> I agree it is a shame, because when someone does make some informed logical comments there always seems to be some sarcastic moron willing add there ill informed tupence worth just to wind people up
> 
> I'm not a BM fan but I dont search out every BMW thread just to hammer BM at every chance. & yes I have owned BMW's in the past
> 
> Our local BMW dealer is worse to deal with than 'Shady Joe's' the back street used car dealer. The dealer is shocking. The management there want to wake up and sort there staff out. Not only are they losing business because of it but it effecting the brand too
> 
> Rant over! :lol:


BH this was not re your post aware you was jesting :thumb: just about how other subjects have gone of late on hear the rant was aimed at not yours, my skin is as thick as an elephants


----------



## Kerr

Bristle Hound said:


> You know what they say Kerr, if you ain't happy with the way the site is run you don't have to come on here
> 
> It just seems to me that you always have to try and justify your dislike for the VAG brand
> 
> If there's a thread about a VAG branded car you are ALWAYS WITHOUT FAIL there posting your negative comments
> 
> Yes, we all know you don't like the VAG brand, but give it a rest, really!
> 
> I can accept that, if you don't like 'em so be it, but what I find difficult to accept is that you fail to take criticism your self over some of your more inflammatory remarks
> 
> I really sometimes wonder Kerr whether you are just a wind up merchant or do have some constructive comments to make


find one thing in this thread you feel oversteps the mark and can't be understood as being fair?


----------



## Bristle Hound

Kerr said:


> find one thing in this thread you feel oversteps the mark and can't be understood as being fair?


Here you go, post #304



Kerr said:


> It's not a dig.
> 
> You've done it numerous time. You introduced cars into your argument in previous VW threads, and only when someone responds to your post to put a fair point forward, you threaten to lock it.
> 
> It isn't fair to make a point that deserves a response then keep suppressing others for doing only what you've done.
> 
> You are clearly a huge VW fan, and it doesn't lead to balanced forum the way you are too supportive of one side of the fence.


I rest my case! :wave:

I have noticed quite alot of criticism you level at Shaun (DW Site Admin) in a fair few posts Kerr

You are clearly not happy with the way the site is run so why come on here and continually criticize the way DW is run


----------



## 182_Blue

Derekh929 said:


> :lol: no no pram toys being thrown this is not about this thread re my comments but of many other subjects on here of late afraid , i have another project i'm working on so need to be fully focused on it, and certainly don't expect everyone to agree with me:thumb:


I actually apologise to you if you feel i make you feel unwelcome, i certainly dont mean to and i truly think you add something to the forum :thumb:

What we all need to remember is for most a car is the second biggest investment they make so for it to be attacked (whatever make) constantly its going to cause friction, we ALL need to be mindful of other people choices and feelings.


----------



## Kerr

Bristle Hound said:


> Here you go, post #304
> 
> I rest my case! :wave:
> 
> I have noticed quite alot of criticism you level at Shaun (DW Site Admin) in a fair few posts Kerr
> 
> You are clearly not happy with the way the site is run so why come on here and continually criticize the way DW is run


You were talking about my attitude towards VAG cars. This isn't the question that was asking. The issues in this thread has started before that post, that wouldn't have been made otherwise.

Shaun asked me a direct question. I gave him a response to his question.

You've twisted this into something else now.


----------



## Kriminal

So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...

yay or nay?
:thumb:


----------



## 182_Blue

Kriminal said:


> So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...
> 
> yay or nay?
> :thumb:


I am on the fence :lol:


----------



## Bristle Hound

Kriminal said:


> So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...
> 
> yay or nay?
> :thumb:


Yay from me :wave:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> I don't think anyone can help but notice you and your posting, i assume your having a dig at me in your post about inconstancy ?


I never slated the GT 86 I think it's a cool looking motor and the first high performance car Toyota released in a long time


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> I never slated the GT 86 I think it's a cool looking motor and the first high performance car Toyota released in a long time


I dont have a GT 86 LOL, i need a bus to carry loads of kids about and my bike


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> Why do I find you following me these days?
> 
> Everywhere I post you are there, usually making anti BMW comments to get a reaction. Notice I just ignore them?
> 
> I don't actually care too much.


He loves you more than me, ironically less than an audi though.


----------



## RisingPower

Kriminal said:


> So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...
> 
> yay or nay?
> :thumb:


It's awesome and is the best car in the entire world, in fact, it makes a zonda look like cheap **** :thumb:


----------



## Guest

RisingPower said:


> He loves you more than me, ironically less than an audi though.


Ooooooeeeeeerrrrrr, man love


----------



## RisingPower

Bristle Hound said:


> You know what they say Kerr, if you ain't happy with the way the site is run you don't have to come on here
> 
> It just seems to me that you always have to try and justify your dislike for the VAG brand
> 
> If there's a thread about a VAG branded car you are ALWAYS WITHOUT FAIL there posting your negative comments
> 
> Yes, we all know you don't like the VAG brand, but give it a rest, really!
> 
> I can accept that, if you don't like 'em so be it, but what I find difficult to accept is that you fail to take criticism your self over some of your more inflammatory remarks
> 
> I really sometimes wonder Kerr whether you are just a wind up merchant or do have some constructive comments to make


Maybe that's because of the tripe that audi are producing of late?

It's strange how vag is only seen as being audi/vw by you, did they just stop all production of lambos, skods etc?

Let's see whether there are inflammatory remarks in other threads that aren't about audis? Oh wait, there's no need, of course there are.


----------



## RisingPower

Here's some vag for you. Any remarks?


----------



## 182_Blue

> Here's some vag for you. Any remarks?


Yes, that picture is huge


----------



## Kerr

It's not bad for a VAG. :lol:

Lambos will always excite. They are getting too sensible as they don't break down as often as they used to. That was the romance of them.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

RisingPower said:


> Here's some vag for you. *Any remarks?*


Yeah, I'll have one in black


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Yes, that picture is huge


Couldn't find a small picture using an ipad :lol:

To be fair, it's not a small car


----------



## possul

Kriminal said:


> So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...
> 
> yay or nay?
> :thumb:


Now answering that question will open up a can of worms. The whole debate will start up again!

But, for me if I wanted a small sport hatch id buy a fiesta ST or the Clio.
They have been in the game for alot longer which can be backed up with there history.
I think 4 wheel drive in a car of that size is to much and takes away what a small sporty hatch should be, light, nimble, sporty looking, quick. Should give more of a buzz in the corners than a stright line. 
228bhp for the S1 with the added weight of the car isnt that good. It has roughly 20 bhp per tonne more than the fiesta ST. How much power will be zapped from the 4x4??

Power doesnt mean fun, I want a car i can enjoy whilst I drive it. I dont go touching up my interior plastics or dash board and bang on about quality as the excuse why this car is so good. Hell my golf has 140bhp and weighs 900kg. Garantee that will be more fun than alot of newer hatch backs on the market. Testiment power isnt everything.

Obviously just my 2p worth


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> It's not bad for a VAG. :lol:
> 
> Lambos will always excite. They are getting too sensible as they don't break down as often as they used to. That was the romance of them.


Oh cmon, I still think they're awesome, just not scary fireball death awesome


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> Yeah, I'll have one in black


Lambos should be in bright, lurid colours. You don't want subtle with a lambo


----------



## Kerr

possul said:


> Now answering that question will open up a can of worms. The whole debate will start up again!
> 
> But, for me if I wanted a small sport hatch id buy a fiesta ST or the Clio.
> They have been in the game for alot longer which can be backed up with there history.
> I think 4 wheel drive in a car of that size is to much and takes away what a small sporty hatch should be, light, nimble, sporty looking, quick. Should give more of a buzz in the corners than a stright line.
> 228bhp for the S1 with the added weight of the car isnt that good. It has roughly 20 bhp per tonne more than the fiesta ST. How much power will be zapped from the 4x4??
> 
> Power doesnt mean fun, I want a car i can enjoy whilst I drive it. I dont go touching up my interior plastics or dash board and bang on about quality as the excuse why this car is so good. Hell my golf has 140bhp and weighs 900kg. Garantee that will be more fun than alot of newer hatch backs on the market. Testiment power isnt everything.
> 
> Obviously just my 2p worth


The Fiesta weighs 1169KG giving is a power to weight ratio of 153bhp per tonne.

For £600 you can get a manufacturer approved Mountune remap and air filter taking the car up to 215BHP.

That makes the car 184bhp per tonne.

The fact the remap is still covered by warranty and doesn't cost a fortune, is a no brainer decision for me.

The Audi is given as 1420KG(that seems very heavy) giving it a power to weight ration of 160bhp per tonne.


----------



## DJ X-Ray

RisingPower said:


> Lambos should be in bright, lurid colours. You don't want subtle with a lambo


That particular model (Aventador) i'd want in black though. Black rims, windows, everything...like Batman:lol: All the Classics, like a Countach, Yellow, green or orange:thumb:


----------



## 182_Blue

A Fiesta RS with a slip diff would be right up my street.


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> That particular model (Aventador) i'd want in black though. Black rims, windows, everything...like Batman:lol: All the Classics, like a Countach, Yellow, green or orange:thumb:


Gawd it's always the audi drivers with their need to be subtle


----------



## possul

Kerr said:


> The Fiesta weighs 1169KG giving is a power to weight ratio of 153bhp per tonne.
> 
> For £600 you can get a manufacturer approved Mountune remap and air filter taking the car up to 215BHP.
> 
> That makes the car 184bhp per tonne.
> 
> The fact the remap is still covered by warranty and doesn't cost a fortune, is a no brainer decision for me.
> 
> The Audi is given as 1420KG(that seems very heavy) giving it a power to weight ration of 160bhp per tonne.


Ahh I got the audis weight wrong!

But even still. Fwd, 160bhp is plenty for a car of that size. Would still be fun! Id rather fit an lsd to. Still ve less money and alot more fun after both!


----------



## possul

Shaun said:


> A Fiesta RS with a slip diff would be right up my street.


Beaten to it!


----------



## 182_Blue

possul said:


> Beaten to it!


I had a 16v RS1800 fiesta back in the day and i thought i was king of the road LOL, kind of want to re live my youth whilst i am still able !


----------



## RisingPower

Is this subtle enough for you dj?


----------



## DJ X-Ray

RisingPower said:


> Is this subtle enough for you dj?
> 
> Lamborghini Veneno SOUND - Start Up and REVS!! - YouTube


I need some Kleenex


----------



## Kriminal

possul said:


> *Now answering that question will open up a can of worms. The whole debate will start up again!*


^ I know. But it's quite enjoyable asking one question and getting another 32 pages of drivel. 

I just sit here, open the popcorn, and leave you guys to it


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> I need some Kleenex


I'm still not sure, I still think I have a bias against all vag cars....

Oh ok, it's how a lambo should be and I'd probably wee myself if I saw/heard one.


----------



## RisingPower

Kriminal said:


> ^ I know. But it's quite enjoyable asking one question and getting another 32 pages of drivel.
> 
> I just sit here, open the popcorn, and leave you guys to it


Oy, what's wrong with my americn popcorn?


----------



## Kriminal

RisingPower said:


> Oy, what's wrong with my americn popcorn?


You ain't sharing it with the rest of us....that's what's wrong!


----------



## RisingPower

Kriminal said:


> You ain't sharing it with the rest of us....that's what's wrong!


I tried, nobody seemed interested though


----------



## possul

Kriminal said:


> ^ I know. But it's quite enjoyable asking one question and getting another 32 pages of drivel.
> 
> I just sit here, open the popcorn, and leave you guys to it


Think ive posted less than five times in this thread. Didnt want a vag audi bashing!


----------



## RisingPower

possul said:


> Think ive posted less than five times in this thread. Didnt want a vag audi bashing!


I love a bashing, but not with an s1


----------



## possul

RisingPower said:


> I love a bashing, but not with an s1


We all know what sort of bashing you like RP, a fat overweight american


----------



## RisingPower

possul said:


> We all know what sort of bashing you like RP, a fat overweight american


I like trim, shouty, loud, brash americans


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kriminal said:


> So after 32 pages have we made a decision about the S1...
> 
> yay or nay?
> :thumb:


A BIG yes for me, being that the standard A1 is so good, and won car of the year, the S1 has such a good base to start from. :driver:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> A BIG yes for me, being that the standard A1 is so good, and won car of the year, the S1 has such a good base to start from. :driver:


Who awarded it car of the year? What car?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> Who awarded it car of the year? What car?


What car magazine


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> What car magazine


There is that many car of the year awards you can't keep up.

You'd be surprised at some of the picks. The European car of the year is often interesting.

Some are actually laughable.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Car_of_the_Year

Fiat have won it most.


----------



## harmonic

Small hot hatches just seem to be getting heavier and more complex. They need ever increasing power to shift the ever increasing lard and all the electronics and clever traction systems just take away the fun and the feedback.

I gave up on new cars when I stopped having company cars. If I had £25K for something 4WD and fun, it would go on a 996 C4S


----------



## Soul boy 68

harmonic said:


> Small hot hatches just seem to be getting heavier and more complex. They need ever increasing power to shift the ever increasing lard and all the electronics and clever traction systems just take away the fun and the feedback.
> 
> I gave up on new cars when I stopped having company cars. If I had £25K for something 4WD and fun, it would go on a 996 C4S


What is a 996 C4S ? never herd of it!


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> What is a 996 C4S ? never herd of it!


A Porsche 911 996 model carerra S with 4 wheel drive.

Porsche fans say the 2wd version is better.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> A Porsche 911 996 model carerra S with 4 wheel drive.
> 
> Porsche fans say the 2wd version is better.


I would have thought the Porsche 911 996 would cost a lot more than 25k, unless it's second hand

I don't know to much about Porsche's so can not comment on the 2WD version.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> I would have thought the Porsche 911 996 would cost a lot more than 25k, unless it's second hand
> 
> I don't know to much about Porsche's so can not comment on the 2WD version.


Oh dear. I suggest google.


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> I would have thought the Porsche 911 996 would cost a lot more than 25k, unless it's second hand
> 
> I don't know to much about Porsche's so can not comment on the 2WD version.


You'll get a 997(newer model) rather than a 996 for £25k.

I've been looking at new cars for too long, but can't quite find the right car to pull the trigger.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...11/price-to/25000/page/3/radius/200?logcode=p

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...d/used,nearlynew,new/price-to/25000?logcode=p

Running costs of a 911 are actually reasonable. Insurance is low too.

It is always the fear something major goes wrong. I've seen some of the bills and they are eye watering.

A few guys at work have 911s, nobody has had an issue yet.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> You'll get a 997(newer model) rather than a 996 for £25k.
> 
> I've been looking at new cars for too long, but can't quite find the right car to pull the trigger.
> 
> http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...11/price-to/25000/page/3/radius/200?logcode=p
> 
> http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...d/used,nearlynew,new/price-to/25000?logcode=p
> 
> Running costs of a 911 are actually reasonable. Insurance is low too.
> 
> It is always the fear something major goes wrong. I've seen some of the bills and they are eye watering.
> 
> A few guys at work have 911s, nobody has had an issue yet.


I've never seen the point of the boggo carrera, only the turbo and gt3.

Still didn't like the gt3 that much that I drove.


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> I've never seen the point of the boggo carrera, only the turbo and gt3.
> 
> Still didn't like the gt3 that much that I drove.


They ain't boggo carreras. They are the S models.

You better use Google too.:lol:


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> They ain't boggo carreras. They are the S models.
> 
> You better use Google too.:lol:


The s standing for sod all difference. If it isn't a gt3, gt2 or turbo, what's the point?


----------



## slineclean

The picture to end is debate.



im A1 owner but I fully agree with the text written


----------



## possul

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
:lol: finally some sense from audi driver


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> The s standing for sod all difference. If it isn't a gt3, gt2 or turbo, what's the point?


The S had more power, better brakes and I think different suspension.

With 355bhp, they are still faster than you think. Will be hitting 100mph in 10 secs.

That's plenty quick for the road.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> The S had more power, better brakes and I think different suspension.
> 
> With 355bhp, they are still faster than you think. Will be hitting 100mph in 10 secs.
> 
> That's plenty quick for the road.


Not enough difference  Turbo, gt3 or go home


----------



## Kerr

slineclean said:


> The picture to end is debate.
> 
> 
> 
> im A1 owner but I fully agree with the text written


I am surprised they used the S1 name.

The S1 is a legend in anyones book. Maybe 1S, like someone else twisted the name to stop stepping on the toes of an icon?


----------



## DJ X-Ray

slineclean said:


> The picture to end is debate.
> 
> 
> 
> im A1 owner but I fully agree with the text written


See if you feel the same when your sitting at the lights next to one


----------



## Soul boy 68

DJ X-Ray said:


> See if you feel the same when your sitting at the lights next to one


With me inside it pulling away at the traffic lights when in Green and leaving the other cars behind:thumb:


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> With me inside it pulling away at the traffic lights when in Green and leaving the other cars behind:thumb:


Remember it's a manual, you might stall it.:lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

DJ X-Ray said:


> See if you feel the same when your sitting at the lights next to one


The car will turn heads matey


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> Remember it's a manual, you might stall it.:lol:


I just put the peddle to the metal


----------



## possul

:lol:


----------



## Kerr

Pedal to the metal.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> Pedal to the metal.
> 
> Focus NO More - Catching Fire - YouTube


It's FWD what do you expect!:lol:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soulboy what colour are you thinking of if you buy one?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Soulboy what colour are you thinking of if you buy one?


I really don't know Shaun, I need to check out the other colours, the yellow looks a bit too loud for me., I am glad there is a few on Here who don't like the car so we won't see many on the road then:lol:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> I really don't know Shaun, I need to check out the other colours, the yellow looks a bit too loud for me., I am glad there is a few on Here who don't like the car so we won't see many on the road then:lol:


They are talking about doing it in Sepang blue which is a nice colour, not sure how it will look on the small cars though.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> They are talking about doing it in Sepang blue which is a nice colour, not sure how it will look on the small cars though.


Do you happen to have a picture of Sepang Blue by any chance?


----------



## DJ X-Ray

I'd get Suzuka Grey, if that's an option:thumb: But as we know, Audi/VW have the best paint palette in the whole wide world so whatever you go for will look class:beer:


----------



## 182_Blue

On my phone so hard to do pics but

http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=306731


----------



## 182_Blue

DJ X-Ray said:


> I'd get Suzuka Grey, if that's an option:thumb: But as we know, Audi/VW have the best paint palette in the whole wide world so whatever you go for will look class:beer:


Suzuka is a good choice, I very nearly bought a S3 in that colour, shame the salesman was such a plank!


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> Pedal to the metal.
> 
> Focus NO More - Catching Fire - YouTube


Thank **** it caught fire :lol: Wonder whether you'd see an audi s1 in a supermarket like that


----------



## minimadgriff

We (AmD) have our name down for one. I agree it shouldn't be called an S1, much the same as Ford should never have used the RS500 name and BMW the mini name.


----------



## 182_Blue

A bit more info now available on Audi uk, it's actually quite well equipped, i guess it should be at that price.

Sportback
http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1-sportback/specifications.html

3 door 
http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1.html


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Soul boy 68 said:


> Do you happen to have a picture of Sepang Blue by any chance?











Sepang Blue ( right) Sprint Blue (left)








Suzuka Grey (left)


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> A bit more info now available on Audi uk, it's actually quite well equipped, i guess it should be at that price.
> 
> Sportback
> http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1-sportback/specifications.html
> 
> 3 door
> http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1.html


What is a "specific engine sound"? Is that some sort of artificially generated crap?


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> What is a "specific engine sound"? Is that some sort of artificially generated crap?


No idea, perhaps email Audi if your really interested LOL.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> No idea, perhaps email Audi if your really interested LOL.


Urr  I guess it's the way with new cars now and emissions crap


----------



## 182_Blue

Well it's not a V engine so it's not going to sound special i guess.


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Well it's not a V engine so it's not going to sound special i guess.


Oh cmon, there are straight sixes that sound fantastic. I don't think they could fit an rb26 in somehow though


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> What is a "specific engine sound"? Is that some sort of artificially generated crap?


It is getting to be a common thing these days.

They are doing it on the Golf R, so same engine I'd imagine it would be likely again.


----------



## TheStig89

The I5 from the TTRS/RS3 fits a treat a la









http://www.audi.co.uk/audi-innovation/concept-cars/a1-clubsport-quattro.html


----------



## RisingPower

DJ X-Ray said:


> See if you feel the same when your sitting at the lights next to one


If I sat at the lights next to the proper s1, I'd be drooling.

With the other s1, I wouldn't think that much to look at it or hear it. It's subtle, like most modern audis, if it pulled away, I don't think I'd really care?


----------



## RisingPower

TheStig89 said:


> The I5 from the TTRS/RS3 fits a treat a la
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.audi.co.uk/audi-innovation/concept-cars/a1-clubsport-quattro.html


That's really nice. Not entirely sure about the side exit exhausts, but, really nice :thumb:

I'd like even a bit more aggression, like rear arch vents and more aggressive bonnet intakes.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> It is getting to be a common thing these days.
> 
> They are doing it on the Golf R, so same engine I'd imagine it would be likely again.


Hummf, next they'll be switching v8s for it


----------



## TheStig89

RisingPower said:


> That's really nice. Not entirely sure about the side exit exhausts, but, really nice :thumb:


Nicer than the S1 and the A1Q IMO, but it was a 1 off 

I reckon if I get an S1 it won't be long till a 5 cylinder gets dropped in, at least then theres some similarity to the original. Theres obviously some nice styling in the Club sport too

I also prefer the two 3" exhaust over the 4 "traditional "S" cars get, the old S3 didn't have 4 so no need for the super hatches to have them now :/


----------



## 182_Blue




----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> 2014 Audi S1 Sportback - YouTube


That's even more boring than their ad and correct me if i'm wrong, it's a review, by audi?

Ah, just endorsed by them.


----------



## Kerr

RisingPower said:


> That's even more boring than their ad and correct me if i'm wrong, it's a review, by audi?


The end gives that away.

I watching it thinking it seemed more of an advert than a review. The end tells you it was an Audi communication.


----------



## RisingPower

TheStig89 said:


> Nicer than the S1 and the A1Q IMO, but it was a 1 off
> 
> I reckon if I get an S1 it won't be long till a 5 cylinder gets dropped in, at least then theres some similarity to the original. Theres obviously some nice styling in the Club sport too
> 
> I also prefer the two 3" exhaust over the 4 "traditional "S" cars get, the old S3 didn't have 4 so no need for the super hatches to have them now :/


More exhausts is better these days... Apparently. Even when they're fake.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> The end gives that away.
> 
> I watching it thinking it seemed more of an advert than a review. The end tells you it was an Audi who made it.


Here's a sporty car... Here it is, going in a straight line very slowly.... Oh and here's the boot.


----------



## Kerr

It does look tidy inside.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> It does look tidy inside.


It looks like a standard audi interior, functional and reasonably well put together.

That engine rattling as it started though


----------



## 182_Blue

I'm begining to sense you two aren't keen on it?


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> I'm begining to sense you two aren't keen on it?


I don't think it's ever going to provoke any emotions in me and it probably needs a proper review.


----------



## slineclean

I think the present s line model looks better. Will this be available in 3 door


----------



## 182_Blue

slineclean said:


> I think the present s line model looks better. Will this be available in 3 door


Yes I linked to both versions.


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> That's exactly,even more boring than their ad and correct me if i'm wrong, it's a review, by audi?
> 
> Ah, just endorsed by them.


No idea, just found it on Google (link below) , just trying to find more info for people who actually have a real interest in the car

http://www.performance-car-guide.co.uk/concentrated-quattro-the-new-audi-s1-and-s1-sportback.html


----------



## rob_vrs

RisingPower said:


> I don't think it's ever going to provoke any emotions in me and it probably needs a proper review.


What car do you have?

I really want one


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> On my phone so hard to do pics but
> 
> http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=306731


I think I am sold on the Sepang BLue Shaun, it would look really nice, what a nice colour, thanks for down loading the picture:thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

DJ X-Ray said:


> I'd get Suzuka Grey, if that's an option:thumb: But as we know, Audi/VW have the best paint palette in the whole wide world so whatever you go for will look class:beer:


That's an interesting fact DJ, I must say they do have a nice range of colours:thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Suzuka is a good choice, I very nearly bought a S3 in that colour, shame the salesman was such a plank!


Do you happen to have a picture of that colour also Shaun, at this rate you could be my salesman:lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

RisingPower said:


> Thank **** it caught fire :lol: Wonder whether you'd see an audi s1 in a supermarket like that


Not yet, I don't think you would see many boy racers in an S1:lol:


----------



## Soul boy 68

minimadgriff said:


> We (AmD) have our name down for one. I agree it shouldn't be called an S1, much the same as Ford should never have used the RS500 name and BMW the mini name.


I guess Audi named it the S1, just like the S3,S4 and so on. It's all part of the S range they have.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> A bit more info now available on Audi uk, it's actually quite well equipped, i guess it should be at that price.
> 
> Sportback
> http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1-sportback/specifications.html
> 
> 3 door
> http://www.audi.co.uk/new-cars/a1/s1.html


Impressive kit list:thumb: thanks for the link Shaun


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Well it's not a V engine so it's not going to sound special i guess.


From what I understand the engine sound can be heard from inside the cabin through speakers that are hidden away to give that sport car sound. Sounds like a gimmick but with out experiencing it I can not judge.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Do you happen to have a picture of that colour also Shaun, at this rate you could be my salesman:lol:


It was posted a while



DJ X-Ray said:


> Sepang Blue ( right) Sprint Blue (left)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Suzuka Grey (left)


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> From what I understand the engine sound can be heard from inside the cabin through speakers that are hidden away to give that sport car sound. Sounds like a gimmick but with out experiencing it I can not judge.


I still don't understand why a car is sufficiently dampened so you can't hear the engine, then, they use speakers, to provide that sound? I can only imagine what you're hearing is not what it sounds like.


----------



## RisingPower

Soul boy 68 said:


> Not yet, I don't think you would see many boy racers in an S1:lol:


That's definitely one thing it has going for it :thumb:


----------



## rob_vrs

Why wont they?


----------



## Kerr

Soul boy 68 said:


> Not yet, I don't think you would see many boy racers in an S1:lol:


You'd be suprised how many boy racers do indeed have costly cars. They don't all drive bangers.

A lot seem to favour hatchbacks.


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Impressive kit list:thumb: thanks for the link Shaun


Are you considering DSG ?, i am not sure its going to an option though ?, i like the idea of auto again, they are amazing for the traffic light GP :lol:


----------



## Bristle Hound

RisingPower said:


> I still don't understand why a car is sufficiently dampened so you can't hear the engine, then, they use speakers, to provide that sound? I can only imagine what you're hearing is not what it sounds like.


Must admit RP I can't understand the latest trend by some manufacturers to 'enhance the engine sound' through the speakers. Why strangle the sound so much you have to then atificially enhance it :wall:

Noticed the BMW M135i & the new M5 both have this too. Apparently BMW call it active sound 

On the BM forums they are saying if you disconnect it the stereo equipment in the car won't work!


----------



## RisingPower

Bristle Hound said:


> Must admit RP I can't understand the latest trend by some manufacturers to 'enhance the engine sound' through the speakers. Why strangle the sound so much you have to then atificially enhance it :wall:
> 
> Noticed the BMW M135i & the new M5 both have this too. Apparently BMW call it active sound
> 
> On the BM forums they are saying if you disconnect it the stereo equipment in the car won't work!


I understand you want lots of sound deadening to get rid of road noise, but really, there has to be a limit.

I think either you want to hear the engine or not, I think the clio even offers different sounds?

You probably don't want to hear a rattly 3/4 cyl derv, so just have deadening, not the silly speakers.

I think there's probably too much sound deadening in the s1 and that's what makes it so sodding heavy, for christ sakes my zed weighs 1440kg and it must be twice the size.


----------



## Bristle Hound

Nope quite happy here to hear a bit of road noise, because if I'm hearing a bit of road noise surely I'll be hearing the engine more too. Wont I ? 

Can't believe the new M5 has this 'active sound' b0ll0x. Shame on you BMW


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> I think there's probably too much sound deadening in the s1 and that's what makes it so sodding heavy, for christ sakes my zed weighs 1440kg and it must be twice the size.


Where have you seen info on the weight of the S1 ?


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Where have you seen info on the weight of the S1 ?


I thought there were repeated mentions of 1435kg?

Must say I don't know where that figure came from though...


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> I thought there were repeated mentions of 1435kg?


Where ?


----------



## RisingPower

Shaun said:


> Where ?


I thought i'd seen it on this thread 

Yeah, thought it seemed a little strange 

Seeing the a1 only weighs around 1100kg.


----------



## 182_Blue

RisingPower said:


> I thought i'd seen it on this thread
> 
> Yeah, thought it seemed a little strange
> 
> Seeing the a1 only weighs around 1100kg.


Indeed, Kerr mentions seeing 1400 odd but didnt provide a link, even with a heavy diesel engine they are about 1150KG

The only reason i asked is i have a friend who works at a Audi dealers and he showed me the full info they have on the S1 and it doesn't include weight, not sure how magazines could know the weight as they haven't been near one and i cant see them getting more info than a dealer.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Are you considering DSG ?, i am not sure its going to an option though ?, i like the idea of auto again, they are amazing for the traffic light GP :lol:


Really don't know Shaun, I have never driven DSG, but I think I would prefer manual, nothing like having control of a car via manual gear shifts:driver:


----------



## Bristle Hound

Back on topic ...

Shame on you Audi for putting a noise generator on the interior of the new S1 :wall:

Wouldn't stop me buying one tho' 

Makes me wonder whether MINI will put 'active sound' on the new F56 John Cooper Works ...


----------



## Soul boy 68

Bristle Hound said:


> Back on topic ...
> 
> Shame on you Audi for putting a noise generator on the interior of the new S1 :wall:
> 
> Wouldn't stop me buying one tho'
> 
> Makes me wonder whether MINI will put 'active sound' on the new F56 John Cooper Works ...


Not sure why manufactures are now doing this, would be interesting to hear from a technician the reason for this. I think you can not beat a real engine sound roaring from the engine bay:thumb: so far to me it's just a gimmick. If anyone knows a good reason for this, we would love to know.


----------



## possul

http://www.dreamcarsite.com/audi/2014-audi-s1-sportback/

1495kg according to the above site


----------



## 182_Blue

possul said:


> http://www.dreamcarsite.com/audi/2014-audi-s1-sportback/
> 
> 1495kg according to the above site


Cant be right, thats more than a S3, i cant trust the info as they even have the S1 longer than a S3 , I.E 4373 mm for the S1 and the s3 sportback is 4324 mm LOL, they even say its wider than a S3 !


----------



## possul

Well have to wait until it comes out and official figures are published


----------



## Kerr

I Googled to see reviews on the first day and it was a few of them that quoted 1400+KG and one specifically 1420KG. I can't see them at the moment as there is hundreds of pages now. 

That is very heavy, but I see figures quoted for the S3 and TTS from 1415-1500kg. With the same running gear, it wouldn't be surprising if the weight was similar. 

The TTS with 265bhp is doing 0-60mph in 5.4secs with manual box, so 0-60mph in 5.9 secs would suggest that the power to weight ratio is down by a margin. I know it is 35bhp down, but if the car was lighter, the times would be closer.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> I Googled to see reviews on the first day and it was a few of them that quoted 1400+KG and one specifically 1420KG. I can't see them at the moment as there is hundreds of pages now.
> 
> That is very heavy, but I see figures quoted for the S3 and TTS from 1415-1500kg. With the same running gear, it wouldn't be surprising if the weight was similar.
> 
> The TTS with 265bhp is doing 0-60mph in 5.4secs with manual box, so 0-60mph in 5.9 secs would suggest that the power to weight ratio is down by a margin. I know it is 35bhp down, but if the car was lighter, the times would be closer.


Best to wait for official reviews and data stats to come, would still probably get one though


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Best to wait for official reviews and data stats to come, would still probably get one though


Yes, when I see official figures i will believe it, still 5.9 secs is not hanging around, the 1.4tfsi I drove was rapid so the 2.0 should make me giggle, if that's not quick enough then a +40-60 bhp remap should be possible.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Yes, when I see official figures i will believe it, still 5.9 secs is not hanging around, the 1.4tfsi I drove was rapid so the 2.0 should make me giggle, if that's not quick enough then a +40-60 bhp remap should be possible.


I drive the 1.4 TFSI and is a modest 120 BHP and I think that's quiet nippy, strong with a nice raspy sound, so imagine how much quicker 230 houses can be. 5.9 seconds is not to be sniffed at:car:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> I drive the 1.4 TFSI and is a modest 120 BHP and I think that's quiet nippy, strong with a nice raspy sound, so imagine how much quicker 230 houses can be. 5.9 seconds is not to be sniffed at:car:


I'm sure the one we drove was aprox 180 BHP, like the polo Gti engine


----------



## Bristle Hound

Shaun said:


> I'm sure the one we drove was aprox 180 BHP, like the polo Gti engine


The 180bhp A1 is the one with the DSG box is it not Shaun?


----------



## Kerr

Bristle Hound said:


> The 180bhp A1 is the one with the DSG box is it not Shaun?


I read they aren't offering the DSG in the S1.

Wonder why they'd do that?


----------



## Bristle Hound

Kerr said:


> I read they aren't offering the DSG in the S1.
> 
> Wonder why they'd do that?


Must admit that is a strange one 

Could be a big mistake by Audi IMHO :doublesho


----------



## 182_Blue

Bristle Hound said:


> The 180bhp A1 is the one with the DSG box is it not Shaun?


Yes it was, they don't mention DSG (or Stronic as Audi call it) on the S1 dealer info, I wonder if it has to do with the addition of the Quattro system on the A1 chassis, perhaps it simply won't fit.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Yes it was, they don't mention DSG (or Stronic as Audi call it) on the S1 dealer info, I wonder if it has to do with the addition of the Quattro system on the A1 chassis, perhaps it simply won't fit.


Morning Shaun, that's an interesting theory that could make sense as if it was possible then they would have added that to the spec, or is it that it's Audi's small hatch and there is no need for one:thumb:


----------



## 182_Blue

Soul boy 68 said:


> Morning Shaun, that's an interesting theory that could make sense as if it was possible then they would have added that to the spec, or is it that it's Audi's small hatch and there is no need for one:thumb:


Morning :thumb:, I don't know really, I do want DSG in my next car though , on a side note I did find that the limited run A1 Quattro weighed 1420kg though so the S1 is very likely to weigh the same, not an issue at all for me, but maybe for some.

Now off to get ready for my trip to VW for a chat about the Golf R in blue :lol:


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Morning fellas, i did read somewhere that DSG would be an option. I'll try and find the link


----------



## DJ X-Ray

Scroll down to the last paragraph http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/S...di-S1-Sportback-2014-first-official-pictures/


----------



## 182_Blue

DJ X-Ray said:


> Morning fellas, i did read somewhere that DSG would be an option. I'll try and find the link


:thumb:
I did too but I think it's guess work at the moment, post it if you find it though.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> Morning :thumb:, I don't know really, I do want DSG in my next car though , on a side note I did find that the limited run A1 Quattro weighed 1420kg though so the S1 is very likely to weigh the same, not an issue at all for me, but maybe for some.
> 
> Now off to get ready for my trip to VW for a chat about the Golf R in blue :lol:


the Golf R looks a tasty motor, I do like the blue that I saw posted and it was well received by the motoring press:thumb:


----------



## B17BLG

Lol at some of the tags on the thread :lol:

Back on topic,

DSG is a great system, it would be something I would specify in my next car ( or equivilant dependant on manufacturer). This System I would say is more tried and tested then other Auto boxes in the category, that has to be a benefit.

AWD agreed weighs the car down some what, and weight is the biggest factor in performance, not only in straight line speed but more importantly cornering, handleing, and certainly braking. 

Lets not forget here that Audi have made some absolute tanks in the past but have managed to get them to turn stop and accelerate in quick fashion for the past two years.

Somebody tell me the RS6 or the E63 AMG weigh too much and they don't perform!


----------



## Soul boy 68

B17BLG said:


> Lol at some of the tags on the thread :lol:
> 
> Back on topic,
> 
> DSG is a great system, it would be something I would specify in my next car ( or equivilant dependant on manufacturer). This System I would say is more tried and tested then other Auto boxes in the category, that has to be a benefit.
> 
> AWD agreed weighs the car down some what, and weight is the biggest factor in performance, not only in straight line speed but more importantly cornering, handleing, and certainly braking.
> 
> Lets not forget here that Audi have made some absolute tanks in the past but have managed to get them to turn stop and accelerate in quick fashion for the past two years.
> 
> Somebody tell me the RS6 or the E63 AMG weigh too much and they don't perform!


1435kg on a quattro does sound to bad, carn't (weight) get it, sorry for that, to see official stats.


----------



## B17BLG

Soul boy 68 said:


> 1435kg on a quattro does sound to bad, carn't (weight) get it, sorry for that, to see official stats.


There is that but the Astra VXR (H) weighs in officially at 1318KG,Now for a bigger car with more power it does seem to weigh alot.

However 0-60 seems close, but that would be with the added traction that the AWD gives.

Everbody seems to go on about 0-60 times and how fast a car will be! The trouble with the 0 is that in the real world this comes down to way too many factors, road condition, tyres, drivers, modifications and drivetrain that a car has.

Itmay be interesting to see how quick a car covers 30-70 or similar to gauge a real test to see how quick the car actually is.

My guess would be that the weigh would come into play then more so as grip plays a lesser part.

For example, at the traffic light championships in my local area i get teenager after teeanger in the Saxo's and 106's and the likes challeneging me at the lights. I now know there is zero point, I have too much torque through gears one and two to be competitive as they wheel spin through first and second hit every limiter on there way. They have less power,but its easier to get it down off the lights.

So many factors as to what people regard a fast car, i for one love mid range acceleration, others prefer standstill starts!


----------



## Starbuck88

Forget the rest of this thread I've just noticed the Tags at the bottom haha


----------



## Slabs

The Configurator for the S1 is available on the audi german website if anyone is interested! No DSG.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Slabs said:


> The Configurator for the S1 is available on the audi german website if anyone is interested! No DSG.


I can not find it Slabs! can you provide the link please if possible :thumb:
Are you interested in the S1?


----------



## Slabs

Soul boy 68 said:


> I can not find it Slabs! can you provide the link please if possible :thumb:
> Are you interested in the S1?


This should take you straight to it?

http://www.audi.de/de/brand/de/neuwagen/a1/s1/motor.html

Yeah am interested in one! Don't know when they hit our dealerships though, no one has any information.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Slabs said:


> This should take you straight to it?
> 
> http://www.audi.de/de/brand/de/neuwagen/a1/s1/motor.html
> 
> Yeah am interested in one! Don't know when they hit our dealerships though, no one has any information.


According to my local Audi, order books open from 11th March, thanks for the link fella :thumb:


----------



## Soul boy 68

Soul boy 68 said:


> According to my local Audi, order books open from 11th March, thanks for the link fella :thumb:


Can you read German?


----------



## Slabs

Soul boy 68 said:


> Can you read German?


I wish! Have to do a bit of guess work! 😁 Just heard that there will be one in our local dealership by the beginning of April.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Slabs said:


> I wish! Have to do a bit of guess work! 😁 Just heard that there will be one in our local dealership by the beginning of April.


Any idea what colour you are going for?


----------



## Slabs

Soul boy 68 said:


> Any idea what colour you are going for?


Scuba blue, yellow or Daytona! Tough choice! You?


----------



## Soul boy 68

Slabs said:


> Scuba blue, yellow or Daytona! Tough choice! You?


 The Yellow is a bit loud for me, I like the Sepang Blue as my choice so far, what colour is Dayona?


----------



## slineclean

Daytona Grey ?


----------



## Soul boy 68

slineclean said:


> Daytona Grey ?


What colour would you go for Slineclean ?


----------



## slineclean

Soul boy 68 said:


> What colour would you go for Slineclean ?


I think I couldn't stick with the same colour because it might not feel as if ive had a new car ha ha ( even thought I would notice the power difference ha ha ) I think white white or Red?


----------



## Soul boy 68

slineclean said:


> I think I couldn't stick with the same colour because it might not feel as if ive had a new car ha ha ( even thought I would notice the power difference ha ha ) I think white white or Red?


The Red I saw looks nice to, but for me the Sepang Blue swings it. :thumb:


----------



## 182_Blue

No DSG is a mistake IMO


----------



## Soul boy 68

Shaun said:


> No DSG is a mistake IMO


I guess there is not much we can do about it Shaun :thumb: maybe it's because of the size of the car, only Audi dealership may know .


----------



## Kerr

I see a few magazines are now running first drive articles about the S1.

Strangely they have done the exact same as the Golf R and allowed the test drives on studied tyres whilst on snow. 

Reviews seem positive for little as the test could show, but the pricing is questioned. Seat Leon 265 pointed out as probably being the better selection. 

Manual only as we already knew.

Also the weight is 1415kg afterall for the sportback. It is on the heavy side for such a small car. That's the weight of cars significantly bigger and more powerful.


----------



## Kerr

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1388851&nmt=

Here is one.

Green does nothing for it. Neither does those wheels.

The colouring on the interior looks awful.


----------



## possul

A 100% waste of a test imo. Cus the winters here are that bad! Yeah right
It could be poo brown and still be cool


----------



## Kerr

Quite a few of the reports are picking up on the turbo lag again. 

It has been much complained about on the Golf R, but I thought with less power the S1 might have had a smaller turbo and removing the issue.

Turbocharging has got much better in recent years. You'd kind of hope noticeable lag was a thing of the past. 

Lag before 1800rpm, pulls hard from 2500rpm and runs out of puff after 6000rpm.


----------



## Soul boy 68

Kerr said:


> http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1388851&nmt=
> 
> Here is one.
> 
> Green does nothing for it. Neither does those wheels.
> 
> The colouring on the interior looks awful.


I agree, Green looks horrible and the wheels look like they have come from the standard A1. There will be better colours to choose from. I never doubted that the S1 would be a cracking car to drive. :thumb:


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> I see a few magazines are now running first drive articles about the S1.
> 
> Strangely they have done the exact same as the Golf R and allowed the test drives on studied tyres whilst on snow.
> 
> Reviews seem positive for little as the test could show, but the pricing is questioned. Seat Leon 265 pointed out as probably being the better selection.
> 
> Manual only as we already knew.
> 
> Also the weight is 1415kg afterall for the sportback. It is on the heavy side for such a small car. That's the weight of cars significantly bigger and more powerful.


That's not heavy, that's clinically obese.


----------



## PugIain

1415kg is nearly what my car weighs. And mine is a proper sized car with heated leather armchairs and a Wärtsilä-Sulzer RTA96-C under the bonnet.


----------



## Nanoman

PugIain said:


> 1415kg is nearly what my car weighs. And mine is a proper sized car with heated leather armchairs and a Wärtsilä-Sulzer RTA96-C under the bonnet.


Ha ha ha ha ha!

Green and yellow are minging. Strangely I'm going off it which is unusual as cars tend to grow on me. It's a rare beast that I like less over time.


----------



## Kerr

Just had a little drive around the dealers on the way past.

I see Audi have a demo S1 at Aberdeen now.


----------



## RisingPower

Kerr said:


> Just had a little drive around the dealers on the way past.
> 
> I see Audi have a demo S1 at Aberdeen now.


Isn't that an a1?


----------

