# How to use Poorboys Black Hole



## Han5y

Hi guys!

I just wondering, i have PB black hole, and i tryed yo use it, but i didnt se any differents on the paintwork.

So:
- How much RPM?
- How many passes?
- How much weitght on the machine?
- DA og Rotation?

Thankyou for answers


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## big ben

cant help with this one, as i to would like to know the answer...

but i dont think you will really realise much added gloss if you havent got any minor swirls and you used a good polish before hand


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## petemattw

very slow passes, like number 2 max on a megs DA, just gently glide over the paintwork with little pressure to cover any swirls not polished out


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## empsburna

Finishing pad at low speed (2/3 once spread) (if you have a PC that is).

small blobs worked until it starts to dry out. leave for a few mins to cure (swipes off cleanly) and then stand back and admire.


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## sanchez89

Han5y said:


> Hi guys!
> 
> I just wondering, i have PB black hole, and i tryed yo use it, but i didnt se any differents on the paintwork.
> 
> So:
> - How much RPM?
> - How many passes?
> - How much weitght on the machine?
> - DA og Rotation?
> 
> Thankyou for answers


ahh im not alone. im in the same boat as you buddy. when i applied black hole to the saxo i couldnt really see any difference at all, i think it filled a few (and only a few) swirls but that was really it, no glossier or wetter looking than before.

i applied by das-6 on menz finish pad at about speed 4 i think. have i gone wrong somewhere with that?


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## Clark @ PB

usually speed 3 or 4 with a glazing/polishing pad for me if by machine, Microfibre or CCS Polishing Pad with firm pressure if by hand


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## yetizone

I've never actually used it - but I have used Chemical Guys EZ Glaze which is similar and used that via Kestrel DA on speeds 3-4 on a finishing pad.

Hopefully I'll be trying Black Hole by machine in the spring and experimenting by popping some Zaino Z2 or Gloss-IT Concorso on top :buffer:


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## BigLeegr

Steve (Of PBW) said this:"we prefer to use Black Hole with a finishing pad and a speed of about 2-3 with a PC"


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## alxg

yetizone said:


> I've never actually used it - but I have used Chemical Guys EZ Glaze which is similar and used that via Kestrel DA on speeds 3-4 on a finishing pad.
> 
> Hopefully I'll be trying Black Hole by machine in the spring and experimenting by popping some Zaino Z2 or Gloss-IT Concorso on top :buffer:


do you think Z2 will go on top of BH okay?
I was always led to believe that Zaino is quite fussy and likes either totally clean or z-aio as it's base?

Back to BH, speed 3-4 on a finishing pad on my G220 with slowish passes until you start to see a shine, then leave to haze and buff off.
Really good stuff, especially on black.


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## goo

I used Black Hole + EX-P on the wife's Magnetic Blue Civic a few weeks ago and whilst it didn't immediately take on a breathtaking shine, the shine is still there now. If anything, it's more glossy since I've washed it (Dodo BTBM) than it was on the day I Black Holed it. Maybe you could try EX-P on top?


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## PaulN

alxg said:


> do you think Z2 will go on top of BH okay?
> I was always led to believe that Zaino is quite fussy and likes either totally clean or z-aio as it's base?
> 
> Back to BH, speed 3-4 on a finishing pad on my G220 with slowish passes until you start to see a shine, then leave to haze and buff off.
> Really good stuff, especially on black.


From past advice and doing it myself Z2 is fine over Black hole.

Cheers

PaulN


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## yetizone

alxg said:


> do you think Z2 will go on top of BH okay?
> I was always led to believe that Zaino is quite fussy and likes either totally clean or z-aio as it's base?
> 
> Back to BH, speed 3-4 on a finishing pad on my G220 with slowish passes until you start to see a shine, then leave to haze and buff off.
> Really good stuff, especially on black.


I have no idea :lol:

As a matter of course, I tend to use Zaino AIO followed Z2/3/5 LSP. I still have a few RDS marks on my old Golf and I'm hoping Black Hole may help out a little? Worth a try - Its just going to be an experiment to see if it works. I like the Zaino system and indeed it has become my staple LSP (alongside Collinite 845 for friends and family cars), but I just want to play with a few products alongside Z2 and Z5 to see if the big Z can be complemented and how these products react with each other etc.

I won't be doing this until the weather improves in the spring :thumb:


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## yetizone

PaulN said:


> From past advice and doing it myself Z2 is fine over Black hole.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> PaulN


Great - good to know! :thumb:

I thought it would be ok as IIRC, BH is water and acrylic based?


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## getcha

I must be very different from everyone else.

When I use glazes especially things like blackhole and CG ez creme I get much better results working them aggresively.

I put them either on a finishing pad or a mild polishing pad and work them in at speed 6 on the PC lightening up on the last couple passes. I work them as I would a polish - until they are close to dissapearing.


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## 03OKH

getcha said:


> I must be very different from everyone else.
> 
> When I use glazes especially things like blackhole and CG ez creme I get much better results working them aggresively.
> 
> I put them either on a finishing pad or a mild polishing pad and work them in at speed 6 on the PC lightening up on the last couple passes. I work them as I would a polish - until they are close to dissapearing.


Cant comment on CG because I havent used it, but BH, yes you can use this method, for me it hepends what you have/havent used underneath, where the panels had been mopped with a polish I only used speed 3 on a PC.

On the roof where it hadnt been polished, I used speed 5, after spreading at speed 3.

Tony


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## aron147

it has a lot of filling capacities, don't you ruin them with working it aggresive?

anyhow, the method i learned:
finishing pad (i use a black lc)
speed 2.5 
work a pass or 2, til it's almost dry.
wait a couple of second, till it haze's
then buff off

still i prefer dodo's limeprime (lite) since it give's me more gloss, but the dodo doesn't fill.


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## getcha

03OKH said:


> Cant comment on CG because I havent used it, but BH, yes you can use this method, for me it hepends what you have/havent used underneath, where the panels had been mopped with a polish I only used speed 3 on a PC.
> 
> On the roof where it hadnt been polished, I used speed 5, after spreading at speed 3.
> 
> Tony


Blackhole is made by WarnerChemical/Instafinish here in the US. The BH and EZ creme are basically sister products both produced by them.

Either way I get much better results working them aggresively(relatively of course) at first and finishing with lighter passes.


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## 03OKH

aron147 said:


> it has a lot of filling capacities, don't you ruin them with working it aggresive?


On that one I admit, I am not sure. Hopefully someone with more experience will pop along and comment. 

Tony


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## aron147

following foto was ripped from a dutch forum..
wich ripped it from the original poster (deanoecosse)










all that was from poorboys blackhole..

would be a shame if you worked in too hard?


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## sanchez89

aron147 said:


> following foto was ripped from a dutch forum..
> wich ripped it from the original poster (deanoecosse)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> all that was from poorboys blackhole..
> 
> would be a shame if you worked in too hard?


surely that cant be from black hole alone? looks like its got good correction(filling). probably used on a polishing pad so it got tiny bit of cutting action?


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## Stew

Could easily be from blackhole alone. The tape line might be fooling you a bit.

I find blackhole effective.


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## sanchez89

Stew said:


> Could easily be from blackhole alone. The tape line might be fooling you a bit.
> 
> I find blackhole effective.


iv just found the original thread that image was from so i retract my earlier statement.
i think i need to try my black hole again, i had almost lost faith with it. plus i need to do a 50/50 with blackfire GEP to see which i prefer.


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## caledonia

BH or WD are get for there cleansing and filling abilities.
Here are a few pictures at 370 Magnification.

Before Application of WD. The deeper mark was created as a benchmark area. To help in repositioning after further applications, by hand.










After first coat of WD. Some of the finer marks already starting to disappear.










After second coat of WD. Again most marks have gone. I could have probably masked the remainder with a third coat.










Hope this helps.
Gordon.


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## Dipesh

Wow, that's really cool Gordon.


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## sanchez89

caledonia said:


> BH or WD are get for there cleansing and filling abilities.
> Here are a few pictures at 370 Magnification.
> 
> Before Application of WD. The deeper mark was created as a benchmark area. To help in repositioning after further applications, by hand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After first coat of WD. Some of the finer marks already starting to disappear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After second coat of WD. Again most marks have gone. I could have probably masked the remainder with a third coat.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Gordon.


so what was the product you used here? a can only assume WD standing for Wet Diamond so was it Blackfire A.F.P.P or G.E.P?


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## caledonia

sanchez89 said:


> so what was the product you used here? a can only assume WD standing for Wet Diamond so was it Blackfire A.F.P.P or G.E.P?


 Poorboys White Diamond. Same as Black hole but more for light coloured cars.

Paint cleanser and heavy in fillers. Applied by hand till almost dry, left to cure and buffed off. As long as the first layer has set up the cleaners will not remove the first layer. So in short masking the defects further.
Gordon.


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## Paintguy

caledonia said:


> As long as the first layer has set up the cleaners will not remove the first layer. So in short masking the defects further.
> Gordon.


Interesting stuff, thanks.

I'd just assumed that repeat applications would make no difference as the cleaners would simply remove the fillers from the first. Looks like I'll have something to do at work on Monday after all!


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## sanchez89

caledonia said:


> Poorboys White Diamond. Same as Black hole but more for light coloured cars.
> 
> Paint cleanser and heavy in fillers. Applied by hand till almost dry, left to cure and buffed off. As long as the first layer has set up the cleaners will not remove the first layer. So in short masking the defects further.
> Gordon.


oh ritey. all is clear now. i also didnt no it had cleaning capabilities, i thought it was just glazing oils and fillers. learn something new everyday. thanks mate. :thumb:


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## Deanoecosse

sanchez89 said:


> surely that cant be from black hole alone? looks like its got good correction(filling). probably used on a polishing pad so it got tiny bit of cutting action?


Yep I can vouch that was all from Black Hole on a polishing pad, it was me who did it (interesting to hear it ended up on some Dutch forum). There would have been a little bit of correction from the polishing pad but it wasn't worked long enough to provide much correction, so I reckon 90% of my result was down to the filling capabilities of Black Hole which is pretty impressive when you see the state of the untouched panel.


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## D.Taylor R26

great product which ive not used in a while but I personally apply it with a red CG final finish pad on low speed over 2 passes. very easy to use by hand as well though. 

some great pictures above showing how well it fills in swirls 

Dave


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## alfatronics

the only thing i need to know is.................

*will blackhole remove the water marks/ spots i have waxed on top of?*


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## OldskoolRS

I don't think it will...it doesn't have any abrasive or cleaning abilities as far as I know. To remove the limescale deposits will take some chemical or physical action which the SRP would achieve. By all means add the Blackhole after SRP, but you'll need to seal it with something (EGP if you want to stay with AG products).


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## Bianco

I've been very disappointed by the BH (applied with a shinearama foam applicator) myself.

Few leads I have transcribed in these questions:
How much of it do you use? It's like very few or very very few?
Circular or linear movements?
"till a glossy shine appears". It never seems to appear with me. Do I use too much BH, do I not work it long enough, do I not know what glossy means, or maybe another reason???



caledonia said:


> Paint cleanser and heavy in fillers. Applied by hand till almost dry, left to cure and buffed off. As long as the first layer has set up the cleaners will not remove the first layer. So in short masking the defects further.


You buffed the three layers or just the last one?
(Silly question maybe)



alfatronics said:


> the only thing i need to know is.................
> 
> *will blackhole remove the water marks/ spots i have waxed on top of?*


Dodo Juice Lime Prime worked considerably better on old limestone (calcareous? not a native







) deposits better for me.


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## G4V JW

caledonia said:


> BH or WD are get for there cleansing and filling abilities.
> Here are a few pictures at 370 Magnification.
> 
> Before Application of WD. The deeper mark was created as a benchmark area. To help in repositioning after further applications, by hand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After first coat of WD. Some of the finer marks already starting to disappear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After second coat of WD. Again most marks have gone. I could have probably masked the remainder with a third coat.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Gordon.


Well explained , nice one :thumb:


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## Stevesuds

I've applied it twice now to my black FN2 civic type r. The first time I simply put too much on so had to buff it off a couple more times. The second time I applied it I used a Megs mf pad and put it on real thin, waited, buffed and repeated. I think it's bloody good. Covered the vast majority of swirls, great finish, amazing beading and lasts twice as long as my previously preferred product, SRP. Next time I'm going to top it up and then put EXP over the top.


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## Bianco

Thanks for the feedback!

How did you apply it? Circular and/or linear movements?
How thin was the layer? Thin like you could barely see it before it hazes?


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## Stevesuds

Circular motion. Not a lot of pressure and just pushed it until I started to loose coverage. Just two pea sized blobs on the pad each time.


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## Bianco

Thanks.

Well, that just doesn't work for me :-/

Well, I guess the swirls are too deep :-(


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## Guitarjon

Would you apply it by da or just by hand?


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## Stevesuds

Im sure it's stated earlier in the thread that you can.


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## Guitarjon

Yep, sorry that will teach me to read properly.


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## dogfox

I have been playing with Blackhole on the bonnet of my 7 year old dark blue german car.

It has the Nano clearcoat which is notoriously hard.

I have machine polished it with the DA three times now (PTG checked).

This time, I gave it a couple of coats (thinly applied by hand) of BH which
covered up the minor imperfections nicely.

Having read that it has cleaner & sealer qualities, I planned to give it 2 coats of Victoria Concours wax straight on top.

This proved to be highly unsuccessful, it coarsened the finish & 
clarity immediately. So I took it off & once again applied BH.

I am now putting a couple of coats of FK1000P on the BH which is an instant success, it bonds easily & retains the clarity of the Flake Pop & hopefully is
providing protection for the fillers ...:tumbleweed:

dogfox


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## Stevesuds

A great combo no doubt about it


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## jd26

Does the car need to be fully dry as a bone before applying? Using for the first time this evening and dont want to spoil results


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## imycool

Does bh mute flake pop

How dowels it compare to prima amigo - a lot of people seem to be raving about it ?


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## PLuKE

So my black Leon FR is I'm need for a machine. But for now it's going to be a masked up job. 

Will Blackhole cover and mask the swirls? There isn't any defects as such, just the usual black car look that's been car washed, when it's in direct sunlight, which I know is rare this time of year!

Luke


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## Rainbow

It will do the task, but don't forget to protect it with some decent was/sealant afterwards, because your result will be gone after few days.


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## PLuKE

I use 496 this time of year, so that should seal in the fillers of Blackhole?

Luke


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## Rainbow

476 or 496? 

Nevermind, both are fine.


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## PLuKE

476, for some reason my fingers type 496?.

Thanks
Luke


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## Phillloyd

Black hole on BMW silver grey
Natty s on top


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## dan4291

Just bought some Blackhole for use with DAS-6 Pro and black Hexlogic finishing pad on my red Skoda Fabia Monte Carlo estate. Hoping to get some good results after using the Junkman combo (Megs 105 & orange Hexlogic then Megs 205 & white hexlogic).


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## Andy from Sandy

dan4291 said:


> Just bought some Blackhole for use with DAS-6 Pro and black Hexlogic finishing pad on my red Skoda Fabia Monte Carlo estate. Hoping to get some good results after using the Junkman combo (Megs 105 & orange Hexlogic then Megs 205 & white hexlogic).


I would of thought that if you have done the procedure to its full conclusion there would be no need for the black hole.


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## G4V JW

Agreed , shouldn't need blackhole if you achieved good correction , have you still got swirls ? :buffer:


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## dan4291

Haven't tried it yet. The car was bought brand new in December so won't need much correction, if any. Just thought the Blackhole would be good to add shine during details when no correction is needed.


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## Berylburton

If you just bought the car new then 105 and orange hex appear a bit aggressive. I use megs ultimate compound and green hex for tougher jobs on a 7 year old Volvo, mainly use 205 on white or black.
Be careful.


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## dan4291

Berylburton said:


> If you just bought the car new then 105 and orange hex appear a bit aggressive. I use megs ultimate compound and green hex for tougher jobs on a 7 year old Volvo, mainly use 205 on white or black.
> Be careful.


Yeah was only going to try 205 for its first detail (and my first time using a DA). Black pad then white pad if needs be. No 105 and orange pad this time, or Blackhole. Will try 105 on other cars that I might do.


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## Junkman2008

Andy from Sandy said:


> I would of thought that if you have done the procedure to its full conclusion there would be no need for the black hole.


BINGO. Buy this man a beer.


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