# Should you still buy a diesel?



## beatty599 (Sep 18, 2016)

Hello All,

I was wondering what everyones thoughts are on buying diesels now following the hatred of them suddenly? 

As I’m considering trading in for a Scirocco 2.0 tdi, but don’t want to be getting bent over by taxes.

Edit;

I do about 20k miles a year for work, and currently do them in a 1.4 polo that averages around 39mpg. Not really about the price of fuel etc I’m changing for something more comfortable.



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## petemattw (Nov 3, 2008)

yes if it suits your needs, no if it doesn't.

I won't move from diesel but that's because all my driving is motorways and high annual mileage, shortest journey I tend to do is 20 miles, so diesel is totally worth it. If you're city hoping then diesel is a waste of time. This is the problem, people all believe that diesel was the best option for them without knowing how it works, most people in cities don't get the engine warm on a journey before stopping and so that's why diesel has caused so many issues. If the spec works for you then i'm sure there will be no issues in time to come when you want to move it on...


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## beatty599 (Sep 18, 2016)

petemattw said:


> yes if it suits your needs, no if it doesn't.
> 
> I won't move from diesel but that's because all my driving is motorways and high annual mileage, shortest journey I tend to do is 20 miles, so diesel is totally worth it. If you're city hoping then diesel is a waste of time. This is the problem, people all believe that diesel was the best option for them without knowing how it works, most people in cities don't get the engine warm on a journey before stopping and so that's why diesel has caused so many issues. If the spec works for you then i'm sure there will be no issues in time to come when you want to move it on...


Thanks for the reply Pete, diesel would suit me as I do about 20k miles a year for work and a minimum of 20 miles going to work.

What diesel do you have of out interest?

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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

I had this same thought when buying my current car.

To get the vRS in 4x4 I had to take a diesel, however the next car will 100% be petrol, I'm done with the cost of fuel for diesels, I've never really liked the driving feel for the car plus I now work closer to home so I can now justify a petrol.

From memory if your doing <17k per year a petrol is the way to go, obviously there are other factors too though.


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## Starbuck88 (Nov 12, 2013)

Just adding my thoughts, the next 'new/nearly new' car we buy, won't be diesel. After always having a diesel on hand throughout my entire driving life, we'll be going total petrol when the time comes.

Down here, driving to get to decent shops is a good 20-25 minute drive away, everywhere is a decent drive away so it makes 'sense' to have a diesel but now petrol turbos with active cylinder technology are available and reliable, cheaper at the pump, returning strong MPG and you get the nice smooth sound of a petrol engine.

I've also had enough of those strong wafts of fumes with the window down and the wind blowing in the right direction. Or if your passenger gets out with the car running and that acrid smell fills the car in seconds.


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## macca666 (Mar 30, 2010)

I'm on my 3rd diesel now and it'll be my last. I'm down on mileage just now but on average I do anywhere between 15 to 18k a year and mainly motorway.

With the advances in petrol technology i'm reckoning I can get a decent spec performance petrol and still get around 40 mpg. Compared to approximately 50mpg with the diesel the difference is getting less and less and what with diesel currently being 10p a litre dearer for me just now again I think it's only going to increase in price.

I like diesels and have no objection to them however the way things are going they're just going to get more costly so IMO it's not going to be worth it soon.


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## petemattw (Nov 3, 2008)

beatty599 said:


> Thanks for the reply Pete, diesel would suit me as I do about 20k miles a year for work and a minimum of 20 miles going to work.
> 
> What diesel do you have of out interest?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I've got a BMW 520d, if i drive consistently at 70mph on the motorway I can do just over 1,000 miles on a tank. This makes a difference. Yes petrol is cheaper and is getting better mpg than ever but still doesn't do this so £ for £ i'm better off with diesel, plus I like the way it pulls


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

I feel this poses a massive question in the 'older' second hand car market.

I need a second family car/ work car. I would have to go for a large petrol engine to even consider moving the type of car i'm going for, Large MPV, saloon etc.

This then cancels everything out, High tax brackets, high fuel costs etc - this forces my hand to buy a derv.


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## macca666 (Mar 30, 2010)

petemattw said:


> I've got a BMW 520d, if i drive consistently at 70mph on the motorway I can do just over 1,000 miles on a tank. This makes a difference. Yes petrol is cheaper and is getting better mpg than ever but still doesn't do this so £ for £ i'm better off with diesel, plus I like the way it pulls


1000 miles on a tank is excellent :thumb: I got rid of my 520d 2 year ago (one of the worst cars I've had unfortunately for repairs and cost me a fortune before I sold it) having bought it new and kept it for 7 year. I did mainly motorway miles and averaged around 50mpg I think I was getting around 700 to a tank.


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## andy__d (Jun 27, 2018)

no
unless your happy to churn out noxious chemicals and gasses whenever you drive and Try to justify it "its cheaper" ...


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## petemattw (Nov 3, 2008)

andy__d said:


> no
> unless your happy to churn out noxious chemicals and gasses whenever you drive and Try to justify it "its cheaper" ...


because other fuel options don't do this???

No vehicle operates without there being noxiuos chemicals and gasses produced at some point in the chain....


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

If you are a rep or salesman motorway munching I cannot see any alternative anytime soon to a diesel in respect of MPG.

Hybrids appear to be a joke in the real world - did you see the report showing sales fleets are being purchased for the discount with the vehicles returning very poor mpg figures?


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

With diesel fuel prices increasing and the difference almost 40p per gallon the gap between the two in terms of running costs will be getting less and less. I personally wouldn't go diesel but could understand why on 20k per year it might work out cheaper for you.

However changing for the scirroco isn't going to increase your comfort, visability is poor and the 2.0tdi isn't exactly reliable. If you want comfort look towards a C Class SE on tiny wheels. The mercs are way better on fuel too.


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## m500dpp (Feb 17, 2006)

SteveTDCi said:


> However changing for the scirroco isn't going to increase your comfort, visability is poor and the 2.0tdi isn't exactly reliable. If you want comfort look towards a C Class SE on tiny wheels. The mercs are way better on fuel too.


So refreshing to see such a sensible comment from someone else on a motoring forum. So many people insist on putting 19s and some even 20" wheels on their C Class and then pretend the ride is comfortable!!! It isnt. I had a C Class on 16s and the ride was excellent, My new C Class (diesel) estate is om 17s and it's OK. Big wheels are just a fashion item, destroys the ride and often results in cracked alloys.

In addition to the Merc our qashqai is diesel and does a regular 8 mile round trip to the stables daily without complaint. We have a couple of feet in the petrol camp, MX5ND 2.0, and Merc SLK 3.0 V6, all our cars do a lot of short journeys with no real issues.

I do like the power delivery of my Merc Diesel, but of course the petrols are smoother and more sporty. If the OP is doing a lot of miles then yes a diesel C Class is a gret choice, I drove back from Scotland (600 miles) with just a 10 minute break, these cars eat the mileage. (55 mpg cruising at speeds I wont mention on here for hours on end!)


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## AndyN01 (Feb 16, 2016)

I set up a spreadsheet which allowed me to compare costs of various petrol/diesel prices with a few annual mileages.

Because we need a decent sized car to accommodate our 2 guide dog puppies I found that for us, with our annual mileage, it was quite significantly cheaper to go.....

Diesel. 

Having said that I'm running a 10+ year old car so there's pretty much nothing in depreciation. Obviously if you're going new(ish) then that will have a big impact particularly on the image of a diesel and it's resale value.

Remember that, in general, depreciation makes running costs look like petty cash.

As for environmental issues as far as I'm aware the vast majority of environmental impact/damage is created by the actual production of a new car. It's subsequent "running" is only a small proportion of it's overall cradle to grave environmental damage (measured by use of irreplaceable resources etc. not simply by the financial cost we attribute to it). Happy to be better informed if my understanding is wrong.

Good luck with your search.

Andy


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## fatdazza (Dec 29, 2010)

beatty599 said:


> Hello All,
> 
> I was wondering what everyones thoughts are on buying diesels now following the hatred of them suddenly?
> 
> ...


no.,,,,,,,,


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## Darlofan (Nov 24, 2010)

Buy a diesel, give it 4or5 years and scientists will decide petrol is worse and the pendulum will swing the other way. 

I do knocking on 30k a year and tow a caravan so diesel is best for me. Insignia 2.0 cdti at the moment, just had dmf replaced so she'll be with us a while yet.😀😀


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

as a taxi owner, i have lots to consider, the Kia really is a good car on the whole, few niggly things, but on the whole i do love it, but sometimes i do have to let the head rule most times.

the Kia has been remarkably reliable, on 160+K miles now, do my own servicing as much as i can, £120 VED, averaging around mid 40's (mix of roads), very pleasant to drive, all quite positive, but, im now finding that if some stuff does go wrong, it will not be cheap, and as diesels are now becoming more and more complex, im seriously considering going back to petrol (i actually started off my independent taxiing in a 1.8 petrol Mondeo which was absolutely 100% reliable, never broke down once, knocked up quite an impressive mileage, and now cities are starting to crack down on diesels, i feel im being forced into having to seriously consider petrol again, and at the minute, the one that is tempting, is the Infinity Q50 2.0T, but they're much too expensive for me at the minute, although the 2.1 they do for the same model is VERY tempting. amazing MPG figures, but then i have to think about running costs on it, spares etc, even the Infinity M 3.0TD looks, interesting.

im always on the look out all the time, for the "just in case" scenario if my suddenly blew up, what would i go for right now, and it would have to be an older E Class, around the 2005 mark, diesel, it would do me for a short while


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## telewebby (Apr 27, 2009)

Andy from Sandy said:


> If you are a rep or salesman motorway munching I cannot see any alternative anytime soon to a diesel in respect of MPG.
> 
> Hybrids appear to be a joke in the real world - did you see the report showing sales fleets are being purchased for the discount with the vehicles returning very poor mpg figures?


my current lexus ct200h (prius in drag is averaging me between 53 and 59mpg on a mix of a roads and motor way. best i have seen is 67 on a motorway run

alex


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

I've had quite a few diesels, but my last two consecutive cars have been petrols.

One point because I didn't want a diesel rcz, and the other point being you can't get a diesel GT 86.

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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

I've done commuting or serious business mileages with both. I agree that unless you are doing at least 15K a year a diesel doesn't really make any sense, and where you do smaller mileages, as some people do, even a honking great petrol engine can be justified, even if it does cost a bit more for an annual holiday trip or caravan haul.

You can't beat the smooth and quiet nature of a petrol engine and I quite like the strange feel of starting one on a cold frosty morning, you just can't beat 6 (or 8) cylinders.

I would not hesitate to buy a petrol or even hybrid now, particularly if I was having to enter congestion zones, the ability to drive 30 miles on battery alone could be very useful for a lot of our typical journeys- even though I live in a rural location, 10 or 15 miles is easily enough to get to a supermarket, petrol station or the like.


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## petemattw (Nov 3, 2008)

ollienoclue said:


> I would not hesitate to buy a petrol or even hybrid now, particularly if I was having to enter congestion zones, the ability to *drive 30 miles on battery *alone could be very useful for a lot of our typical journeys- even though I live in a rural location, 10 or 15 miles is easily enough to get to a supermarket, *petrol station* or the like.


n

such irony.....:lol:


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## Pauly.22 (Nov 15, 2009)

I’d stick with a petrol, diesel or hybrid. 

The whole country will be some big changes to the grid if everyone on your street started plugging in 30amp car chargers, and thats if they only have one electric car, 

Turn on an electric shower or heater and you’ll probably getting close to the max amps you can have or even blowing the main fuse in your house. 

I think it’s best to wait until the government starts to sort out the Charging infrastructure before going to electric only. 

That’s what I think anyway

Long live the V8


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

Interesting thread and answers, especially as I am looking at a new car and have always liked diesels, especially big engined diesels and also had 60 1.8 diesel Mondeos out on hire as taxis, they used to run for 300-400,000 with no engine work, some of the engines only stopped for servicing and to fill up with fuel.

I agree the OPs comment on older diesels going to be a tax target in the Budget, but there seems to be no new superclean large diesels coming out of Japan and not much to be excited about from the Germans.


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## andyymurphyy (Nov 25, 2018)

I also have recently changed car. I deviated from VAG a couple times but always find myself drawn back. And always a diesel. Better MPG, decent tax (£20/30 pa) and nice pull. I do less than 10k miles p/a but have use of a 2nd car (and m/bike).
I've wondered about the 10p a litre difference but feel that the better MPG offsets this.
Comfort vs style/performance is an old argument and one u could have with yourself over and over again with different outcomes each time. All based on finances, mood, circumstances at that time, etc.
Golf and A3 are better options than the Scirocco imo and Passat or CC trump both in comfort/luxury dept (based on perceived budget).
All personal opinion though.... Best of luck mate 

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## Boothy (Aug 19, 2010)

I couldn't bring myself to buy I diesel for a long time and then my last three have all been diesel. BMW e90 320d, Golf MK7GTD and finally a BMW f30 330d. I seriously considered going back to petrol but why wouldn't you want a 260bhp car that does good mpg, goes like stink and isn't £400 tax every year, lol. 

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## Alex_225 (Feb 7, 2008)

Well I own a couple of petrol cars but they don't see much mileage, one being a V8 equates to terrible MPG and obviously the costs associated with that. 

By contrast my 'daily' car is an E320 CDI Merc but when I say daily it's still 99% weekends and all motorway mileage. I do a five to six hour round trip four or more times per month, I need space, comfort and decent MPG. My E Class gives me nearly 50mpg whilst also being decent to drive and plenty powerful enough. 

My next main car will be a Merc S320 or S350 CDI as well. I commute by train/bus every day for work, so I don't feel that my proper usage of a diesel is a huge issue. Admittedly I'm looking at buying cars that have lost 70% of their value so diesel popularity doesn't phase me too much.


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

> I deviated from VAG a couple times but always find myself drawn back.


I bought my first diesel powered car in 2000, a BMW 320d Touring. The (sound deadening perhaps) engine was very quiet on starting from cold not the usual clatter from a diesel.

Similar to VW the MPG is very good and the power output is also very good.

I am now on my 3rd BMW diesel as in a similar way I cannot find anything better that suits me.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

I am not sure if I am imagining it or not but the dieseasels we have running on Shell V power seem to be a little quieter at cold idle than when on regular zoopla?


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## tosh (Dec 30, 2005)

ollienoclue said:


> I am not sure if I am imagining it or not but the dieseasels we have running on Shell V power seem to be a little quieter at cold idle than when on regular zoopla?


I get that a lot; on some cars it's makes a lot of difference, on others it's minor. But it's always there.


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## Radish293 (Mar 16, 2012)

I would buy another diesel in a heartbeat. They are way better to drive. Just ride the torque curve. ! I have run diesels since 1996. I recently swapped my BMW 116 for a MINI 1.5 petrol. OMG the fuel consumption is dire. I was getting 65mpg now I’m lucky to see 40. Modern diesel is clean. And you use a hell of a lot less of it. 


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Radish293 said:


> I would buy another diesel in a heartbeat. They are way better to drive. Just ride the torque curve. ! I have run diesels since 1996. I recently swapped my BMW 116 for a MINI 1.5 petrol. OMG the fuel consumption is dire. I was getting 65mpg now I'm lucky to see 40. Modern diesel is clean. And you use a hell of a lot less of it.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Agree with a lot of what you said but better to drive? No.

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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

Brian1612 said:


> Agree with a lot of what you said but better to drive? No.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


IYO :thumb:


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## Christian6984 (Dec 20, 2007)

Radish293 said:


> I would buy another diesel in a heartbeat. They are way better to drive. Just ride the torque curve. ! I have run diesels since 1996. I recently swapped my BMW 116 for a MINI 1.5 petrol. OMG the fuel consumption is dire. I was getting 65mpg now I'm lucky to see 40. Modern diesel is clean. And you use a hell of a lot less of it.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I drive a Fiesta 1.6 Tdci and it does 53mpg average, I choose it for a compromise of a bit of power and economy, the 1.6 petrol and the 2.0 ST may be faster and more powerful but much thirstier and dearer to tax. When i want a some fun i also own the mk7 ST 1.6 which is great but does 36 mpg.

For a brief stint i did own the 1.5 Cooper and found it very nice for a 3 cylinder and did nearer to 50 than 40mpg. The size of the fuel tank is ridiculous mind, i could get about £30 in it max. Mine runs are on main roads doing mainly 50mph so that may have helped my economy.


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## Scotie (Aug 24, 2016)

Brian1612 said:


> Agree with a lot of what you said but better to drive? No.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


go drive a 335D remapped, and say that again


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## macca666 (Mar 30, 2010)

Scotie said:


> go drive a 335D remapped, and say that again


I've got both a diesel and a petrol in the house I think I'm now on to about my fifth diesel my first being a '94 106 diesel many years ago which I needed for fuel consumption as I was doing over 2000 miles a month.

Think this will be my last diesel as I mentioned earlier what with the advancements in petrol engines. Its annoying paying an extra 10p a litre as well.

There are massive differences depending in what engine is in a car. Yes I agree a 335d would be a better drive than 1.0l petrol however a 1.6d wouldnt be a better drive than a petrol sports ie m3, rs4

Too many variables between cars and between the choice for buying a diesel ( most of mine have been as a result of fuel consumption) to say that one is better than the other.

Edit: meant to quote Brian1612 as well not sure what happened :thumb:


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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

Scotie said:


> go drive a 335D remapped, and say that again


I have owned a 530d 325d and an X5 3.0d, also a Focus ST running 315bhp a Mini cooper 1.6 petrol a Z4 3.0 and now a Volvo C30 Diesel, by far the most enjoyable are the diesels IMHO as they just put the power down better, the Focus was like a puppy on a lead lol great fun but not really enjoyable.

I also have a bike which is obviously petrol lol


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Scotie said:


> go drive a 335D remapped, and say that again


I've driven several 335d's and they all sound like tractors. Yes they are quick in the real world but would you rather hit a limiter at 7000rpm get a crackle from an upshift or change at 4000rpm with the sounds of ball bearings in biscuit tins.

Diesels have there place, usually as generators or tractors  The RFL saving no longer exists and diesel is regularly 10p a litre more expensive.


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

What I regularly come up against is cars that lack any power queuing behind a lorry.

They can't overtake and they won't leave a gap to allow more able vehicles to overtake.

Small engine cars that might go to the moon and back on a tank of petrol but darn right frustrating to follow.

My car isn't very powerful, BMW 1er Hatchback (F21 LCI, facelift 2015), at 150HP and 320Nm torque but it does the job mostly.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

I had a die-sel once... a Lexus... it was so slow I got caught speeding... 


Changed back over to a petrol the next week... cars gods happy again, speeding got flung out of court because the policy officers couldn't follow their own rules..

:thumb:


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Got a new BMW 520D on hire now. Fine smooth motorway car, but it's not going to change my opinion about diesel. 

350 miles on the motorway returned 47mpg. It's a big car, but I would hope for more as it was clear roads all the way. Some of the 3.0l petrol BMWs return not too far short of that. Then you have the power when needed. 

Weird steering on the new 5 series. There's a deadness around the middle when straightening up.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Kerr said:


> Got a new BMW 520D on hire now. Fine smooth motorway car, but it's not going to change my opinion about diesel.
> 
> 350 miles on the motorway returned 47mpg. It's a big car, but I would hope for more as it was clear roads all the way. Some of the 3.0l petrol BMWs return not too far short of that. Then you have the power when needed.
> 
> Weird steering on the new 5 series. There's a deadness around the middle when straightening up.


Have you not got a plan B yet ?


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

SteveTDCi said:


> Have you not got a plan B yet ?


I'm on plan Z.

I travelled in the 520d to go see a Megane RS Cup today after putting down a deposit. The car was all over the road with suspension issues.

Thrifty let me keep the 520d until tomorrow.


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

Andy from Sandy said:


> What I regularly come up against is cars that lack any power queuing behind a lorry.
> 
> They can't overtake .


Follow lots of GT 86s then 

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## -Stuart W- (Dec 28, 2007)

Kerr said:


> Got a new BMW 520D on hire now. Fine smooth motorway car, but it's not going to change my opinion about diesel.
> 
> 350 miles on the motorway returned 47mpg. It's a big car, but I would hope for more as it was clear roads all the way. Some of the 3.0l petrol BMWs return not too far short of that. Then you have the power when needed.
> 
> Weird steering on the new 5 series. There's a deadness around the middle when straightening up.


That does seems a little low on the mpg for such a journey. I average 45 mpg on a motorway run in a 435d and have had 50 mpg on an extended run. Admittedly, this is with limited spirited driving :driver:


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Stu Blue 182 said:


> That does seems a little low on the mpg for such a journey. I average 45 mpg on a motorway run in a 435d and have had 50 mpg on an extended run. Admittedly, this is with limited spirited driving :driver:


Another 250 miles at 80mph on the way back up and it's crept up to 48mpg. I'm sure dropping 10mph would make a good difference.

It's a comfy mile muncher.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Kerr said:


> Got a new BMW 520D on hire now. Fine smooth motorway car, but it's not going to change my opinion about diesel.
> 
> 350 miles on the motorway returned 47mpg. It's a big car, but I would hope for more as it was clear roads all the way. Some of the 3.0l petrol BMWs return not too far short of that. Then you have the power when needed.
> 
> Weird steering on the new 5 series. There's a deadness around the middle when straightening up.


that ether down to you or a problem with the car, drove a few 520d of late, way better return than that. never had a problem with the steering ether.


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## Bulkhead (Oct 17, 2007)

One major thing to factor in if you're doing high mileages in a modern direct injection diesel is a new set of injectors. My injectors in the Land Cruiser (D4D engine) are probably well over their normal service life and come in at $1000 aussie dollars each (I'll need 4!). For me though, the diesel has been trouble-free and returns reasonable mpg. The only alternative we have over here is the 4.0l V6 - a very nice and reliable unit but a bit thirsty. When you do 20k miles a year, it makes a big difference. Also, with 180l fuel capacity, I can do some big trips away and not have to worry about filling up!


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Unless you are doing the miles each year diesel just doesn't stack up financially.

When my mileage returns to sub-10,000 a year I will invest in a munter of a petrol engine and enjoy the last vestiges of fossil fuel use. T6 Volvo be right up my street.

There is no rev range in a diesel and you just can't drive them the same. I'm trying to imagine the heel and toe fun of a 911 but with a dieseasel power plant... err.....


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## Radish293 (Mar 16, 2012)

Christian6984 said:


> I drive a Fiesta 1.6 Tdci and it does 53mpg average, I choose it for a compromise of a bit of power and economy, the 1.6 petrol and the 2.0 ST may be faster and more powerful but much thirstier and dearer to tax. When i want a some fun i also own the mk7 ST 1.6 which is great but does 36 mpg.
> 
> For a brief stint i did own the 1.5 Cooper and found it very nice for a 3 cylinder and did nearer to 50 than 40mpg. The size of the fuel tank is ridiculous mind, i could get about £30 in it max. Mine runs are on main roads doing mainly 50mph so that may have helped my economy.


My fuel consumption probably has a lot to do with the heavy right foot. I enjoy the way the 3cyl pops and bangs. And the 7speed DCT box is cracking but to get the best needs to be in sport. Don't think the convertible roof helps. But I love it. But I love diesel too.

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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

cheekymonkey said:


> that ether down to you or a problem with the car, drove a few 520d of late, way better return than that. never had a problem with the steering ether.


There's really not much I can do sitting at a constant speed on the motorway. I usually always get really good figures.

Just over 700 miles and the car returned 48mpg and that was 99% motorway. It's not bad, but at 1800rpm I'd have expected a little more.

The steering had little very little around the centre. The car drove well. It was an 18 plate with 10,000 on the clock.

I'm also still not sure about the new idrive. It will maybe take me more time to adjust, but I prefer the last version.

The new 5 series is very comfortable. I liked it.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Kerr said:


> There's really not much I can do sitting at a constant speed on the motorway. I usually always get really good figures.
> 
> Just over 700 miles and the car returned 48mpg and that was 99% motorway. It's not bad, but at 1800rpm I'd have expected a little more.
> 
> ...


48 mpg isn,t good, but is that what the computer says or is it what you have worked out?. The I drive has never really been brilliant and at times can be a real headache.


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

cheekymonkey said:


> 48 mpg isn,t good, but is that what the computer says or is it what you have worked out?. The I drive has never really been brilliant and at times can be a real headache.


That's what the computer says. Normally they are on the high side. It was a rental car, so I didn't brim the tank for a calculation.

A quick search says Honest John members have their average at 44mpg and Whatcar managed 43mpg on their test car.

Around about town was also mid 40s for me before my long run. I guess the sweet spot is as per most other cars is around the 50-60mph mark.


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## Scotie (Aug 24, 2016)

Andy from Sandy said:


> What I regularly come up against is cars that lack any power queuing behind a lorry.
> 
> They can't overtake and they won't leave a gap to allow more able vehicles to overtake.
> 
> ...


Ever thought about a remap? you can get an easy 200hp and 400nm+ out of a stage 1 remap


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Scotie said:


> Ever thought about a remap? you can get an easy 200hp and 400nm+ out of a stage 1 remap


150bhp is enough for the roads. It's some of the cars with <70bhp that are the real problem.

I had a 3 Cylinder Citroen C3 the other week. Perfectly good town car and surprisingly good at a constant speed on the motorway. Acceleration at higher speeds was dreadful even with only me in the car.


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

Scotie said:


> go drive a 335D remapped, and say that again


I've got a BMW X5 40d, twin turbo diesel and my other car is a Toyota Supra 3 litre petrol twin turbo at around 380 bhp. To be fair I love both, the BMW is obscene power wise for the size of car and a joy to drive and you wouldn't know it was a diesel as it's so refined.


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

I have a 2016 320d auto, and it's a lovely thing to drive, loads of torque. The only thing I'd change is the sound, so I'll probably buy a 330d in the new year, as the straight 6 is a much more charismatic engine. 

On a daily basis, I drive a little 2004 ford focus 1.8 tdci. It has 115 bhp and plenty of torque, which means I rarely have to rev it above 2500 rpm. It makes for a very relaxing drive tbh. 

At the minute, diesel works for me, so I can't really see me changing in the near future. 

Cooks

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## Christian6984 (Dec 20, 2007)

Radish293 said:


> My fuel consumption probably has a lot to do with the heavy right foot. I enjoy the way the 3cyl pops and bangs. And the 7speed DCT box is cracking but to get the best needs to be in sport. Don't think the convertible roof helps. But I love it. But I love diesel too.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I used to give it a bit of stick now and then, but mine was a manual which prob helps a few mpg. It was certainly enough power, I wouldn't buy a lower powered Mini One for example. I would like another at some point and also with the auto gearbox, the last fiesta diesel was a like-for-like replacement after the other one got wrote off few months back (need to buy a house next :lol But in the future I cant see me continuing with diesel. Although i do a fair few miles, the Fiesta mk6 doesn't have a DPF which is something else that puts me off, as it seems they need a specific consistent speed to run their cycle and cant always guarantee it with the roads and journeys i do and for that reason i dont think it makes sense for me after this one


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

When blokes start talking about their fuel mileage in the local its a sad day. Life is too short.


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## slimjim (Mar 22, 2007)

We have an F30 335D , I love it fast , powerful don’t need to rag it to get power from it and good mpg and tax is ok.
Winner winner chicken dinner .


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## BrummyPete (Jun 10, 2010)

I've just bought a diesel today, passat r line, I do around 15k a year

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## Bulkhead (Oct 17, 2007)

On the downside of diesels, mine is currently in for its 200k service plus transmission oil change and in a few hours time, my wallet will be relieved of over 900 quid.


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## AndyN01 (Feb 16, 2016)

Bulkhead said:


> On the downside of diesels, mine is currently in for its 200k service plus transmission oil change and in a few hours time, my wallet will be relieved of over 900 quid.


How many petrol cars will cover 200K (possibly big V8's excepted)?

It's quite possible you'd have been on your second or ever third engine by now which would probably cost more than £900.

Just a thought. Maybe I'm missing the point?

Andy.

PS I've now realised where you live so big V8's are probably the norm!!!


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

AndyN01 said:


> How many petrol cars will cover 200K (possibly big V8's excepted)?
> 
> It's quite possible you'd have been on your second or ever third engine by now which would probably cost more than £900.
> 
> ...


I've never understood why people think diesel cars are more reliable than petrol. The facts prove it's the total opposite.

One of the warranty companies provided their data to show diesel cars are 3 times more likely to breakdown and cost 20% more to fix.

The gap will get even wider with the modern diesel engines and especially those used in normal day to day driving conditions.

There is more diesels with high mileage simply because diesels are the cars people who do high mileage have to buy due to costs and taxation. They get used for the less stressful motorway cruises. Plenty of petrol engines will happily do 200k. The rest of the car is often beyond repair before the engine is done.


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## AndyN01 (Feb 16, 2016)

Kerr said:


> I.........Plenty of petrol engines will happily do 200k. The rest of the car is often beyond repair before the engine is done.


I've had a 2 litre petrol car - a Toyota and a 1.8 petrol, a Mazda.

Both were well maintained and both were all but fault free.

However, both died between 100K & 150K with totally uneconomic to repair engine related issues.

I'm wondering if anyone on here has examples of 200K petrol cars?

Andy.


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## Rayaan (Jun 1, 2014)

Pretty sure there are some Lexus and Toyota hybrids in the US which have done over 600k miles lol


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

There will be thousands of cars in the US that are petrol that have done big miles and in more extreme conditions, too.

A quick snipe on autotrader and there are no end of high mileage petrols.

Modern lubrication is vastly improved compared to yesteryear. Once upon a time 60,000 miles meant a virtual engine rebuild!

Today its normally something else that needs replacement that exceeds the value of the car. My wife had a Toyota estate for years, did 200K in that, never really let her down, she used to drive to Glasgow from home and back routinely then used it for her work later on.

Can't remember what needed doing but one day garage man was like this isn't worth doing so down teh scrappers it went.


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## Bill58 (Jul 5, 2010)

AndyN01 said:


> I'm wondering if anyone on here has examples of 200K petrol cars?
> 
> Andy.


In 1995 I bought a petrol Toyota Corolla which I sold to my dad when it had done 78k. He gave the Corolla to my sister when it had 180k and she then used it as a runaround for another 2-3 years. I know it was still a runner when she got rid of it!


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

I had a Mazda 626 coupe, 2.0 petrol that had 185k miles on it when I got rid of it, so reliable that car was


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## LeeH (Jan 29, 2006)

200k Mitsubishi 1.8 Galant. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

Lab testing shows the results are rigged (but only if this article is true).

https://www.petrolprices.com/news/worst-new-diesel-cars-emit-11-times-legal-pollution-limit/

To enter the ULEZ
Petrol cars that meet the ULEZ standards are generally those registered with the DVLA after 2005, although cars that meet the standards have been available since 2001.
Diesel cars that meet the standards are generally those registered with the DVLA after September 2015.


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## beatty599 (Sep 18, 2016)

AndyN01 said:


> How many petrol cars will cover 200K (possibly big V8's excepted)?
> 
> It's quite possible you'd have been on your second or ever third engine by now which would probably cost more than £900.
> 
> ...


I don't think one is more reliable than the other without stringent testing. Diesel engines have higher miles because they're the normal for long distance driving, and petrol just down to the shops and back.

Where diesels have the time to heat up fully etc, petrols are barely warm if even! one of the 7, 1 million+ mile cars was a E30 BMW 325i, a bulletproof engine but it's just an example that they can happily do to miles.

It's the heat cycles, and improper care that kill!


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

LeeH said:


> 200k Mitsubishi 1.8 Galant.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


My cousin had the next one up, 24 valve? Did crazy mileage in that as well, great car. Might have been AWD? Went well.


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

Another article for the diesel die-hards:
https://www.petrolprices.com/news/diesels-arent-actually-dirty-new-tests-show/


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## Lexus-is250 (Feb 4, 2017)

I've only ever owned petrol cars but I may very well be moving to diesel in the next few months. Trying to find a car that I want ( an estate ) with a bit of get up and go is very difficult. I have had Japanese cars for nearly 20 years and don't want to go down the German route. 

So it looks like a mazda 6 estate for me. 

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## percymon (Jun 27, 2007)

Volvo V60 D4 ? Or a V90 if you're looking lightly used

190bhp so not exactly slow


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## BrummyPete (Jun 10, 2010)

Lexus-is250 said:


> I've only ever owned petrol cars but I may very well be moving to diesel in the next few months. Trying to find a car that I want ( an estate ) with a bit of get up and go is very difficult. I have had Japanese cars for nearly 20 years and don't want to go down the German route.
> 
> So it looks like a mazda 6 estate for me.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


My old man had a mazda 6 estate in the 2.2 diesel spec 150bhp, great car and loads of toys but the fuel economy wasn't great, if your not too worried about fuel then they are great but there are other cars out there that do offer a lot more mpg

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


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## CoOkIeMoNsTeR (Mar 6, 2011)

AndyN01 said:


> I'm wondering if anyone on here has examples of 200K petrol cars?
> 
> Andy.


My 911 has 200k on the clock. Original engine, has now been apart but only seals and gaskets replaced. Used to use it every day. The old 3.0 air cooled sixes are awesome :thumb:


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## Andysp (Jan 1, 2017)

I cant really remember the last petrol car i had.

Currently got a Golf GTD and i absolutely love it,tuned to 245bhp and 470nm and believe me it is immense to drive,best of both world driving for me,pootle along and get 50+mpg hit the loud pedsl and put a smile on your face,the only thing i wish for is 4wd as the torque can light it up quite easily in 3rd.

Saying that give it a few years for full electric cars to come doa reasonable price and the range to increase to a real world 400 miles and i'd seriously consider solar panels and some sort of powerpack battery to power my fully electric Golf R(when available).


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## mar00 (Jun 24, 2018)

CoOkIeMoNsTeR said:


> My 911 has 200k on the clock. Original engine, has now been apart but only seals and gaskets replaced. Used to use it every day. The old 3.0 air cooled sixes are awesome :thumb:


i had a 1986 Audi 80 Quattro with around 200k on original engine,

amazingly i had a 996/911 with 160k without a rebuild not even RMS ,


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## Derek Mc (Jun 27, 2006)

I have switched from Diesel back to petrol on my next can as the diesel would have cost £49/om more and as peterol is 10p or so cheaper a litre, and I drive about 14K miles a year I am not out of pocket rather as at todays rate will be "in" pocket £240 a year.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Lexus-is250 said:


> I've only ever owned petrol cars but I may very well be moving to diesel in the next few months. Trying to find a car that I want ( an estate ) with a bit of get up and go is very difficult. I have had Japanese cars for nearly 20 years and don't want to go down the German route.
> 
> So it looks like a mazda 6 estate for me.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


Unfortunately Japanese reliability does not extend to the Mazda diesel. Stay with petrol.


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## Lexus-is250 (Feb 4, 2017)

percymon said:


> Volvo V60 D4 ? Or a V90 if you're looking lightly used
> 
> 190bhp so not exactly slow


Yeah I've looked at these but they don't really float my boat. Can quite imagine driving a volvo just yet

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## Lexus-is250 (Feb 4, 2017)

BrummyPete said:


> My old man had a mazda 6 estate in the 2.2 diesel spec 150bhp, great car and loads of toys but the fuel economy wasn't great, if your not too worried about fuel then they are great but there are other cars out there that do offer a lot more mpg
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk


Fuel economy isn't on my radar after running my Lexus, anything would be more economical. Looking at a 15 plate Mazda 6 so the 175bhp version with an auto box. Loads of kit in them.

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## Lexus-is250 (Feb 4, 2017)

SteveTDCi said:


> Unfortunately Japanese reliability does not extend to the Mazda diesel. Stay with petrol.


I know they have or can have their issues but the newer ones in looking at seem to have resolved most of the issues. There's always bits to still look out for.

The petrol versions are just a bit gutless and ideally wanted another auto.

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## Arvi (Apr 11, 2007)

AndyN01 said:


> How many petrol cars will cover 200K (possibly big V8's excepted)?
> 
> It's quite possible you'd have been on your second or ever third engine by now which would probably cost more than £900.
> 
> ...


I had a Celica 190 VVTl-i which I sold still going strong at 200,000 miles. Oil change every 5000 miles, rev limiter was at 9000rpm, but it still remained a solid car.

Mk 3 Golf Petrol I sold at 130k still going strong. Currently on my 100k Alpina D3. All cars have 5000 mile oil services and the Celica and BMW ran on Optimax.


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

Arvi said:


> I had a Celica 190 VVTl-i which I sold still going strong at 200,000 miles. Oil change every 5000 miles, rev limiter was at 9000rpm, but it still remained a solid car.
> 
> Mk 3 Golf Petrol I sold at 130k still going strong. Currently on my 100k Alpina D3. All cars have 5000 mile oil services and the Celica and BMW ran on Optimax.


I had Hondas in the 80s and 90s, used to do 50,000 in one, sell it to a friend, he kept it for a couple of years, then sold to his brother and so on, they all have 200,000+ with no engine work, just regular oil changes, including the first one that I used to do at 1000 miles, which seems to be a thing of the past now.


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## Harry_p (Mar 18, 2015)

I have a 1.6 316i with 155,000 miles, a 2.2 320i with 150,000 miles and a 3.2 m3 with 280,000 miles on the clock which has only had standard servicing, run on supermarket super unleaded and regularly sees the red line.

People who think petrol cars need 2 or 3 engines by 200k are still living in the 1950s!

Modern diesels seem to have far more issues with turbos, dpfs, egrs, and high pressure pumps.

You might see more high mileage diesels because as has been said, they're often chosen by people who do lots of miles plodding along at constant speeds.

I wouldn't buy a diesel for a number of reasons. I hate the way they sound, both inside and outside. I hate the uneven vibrations even modern 6 cylinder ones product that no fancy engine mounts can disguise. The most sophisticated diesel isn't a patch on the most basic petrol in terms of basic nvh.

I hate the slippery oily pumps, or having to put on gloves when you refuel.

I hate the nothing - tons of torque - flat as a fart power delivery. I'll take an exciting and interesting petrol engine over a limited rev range torquemonster any day of the week.


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## DimitriUK (Jan 18, 2017)

Harry_p said:


> I hate the way they sound, both inside and outside.


Have driven petrols all my life as i do low miles.

Drove a rental BMW diesel and to be fair you can hear the tractor sound only at idle when you start moving you cannot tell the difference.


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

Harry_p said:


> I have a 1.6 316i with 155,000 miles, a 2.2 320i with 150,000 miles and a 3.2 m3 with 280,000 miles on the clock which has only had standard servicing, run on supermarket super unleaded and regularly sees the red line.
> 
> People who think petrol cars need 2 or 3 engines by 200k are still living in the 1950s!
> 
> ...


The first BMW I bought was after meeting someone with a 316 with 125,000 trouble free miles that had spent all its life within the M25, this was a long time ago and my company had a Ford only buying philosophy at the time because the main agent was a client, the reliability was just bad. I bought a 525e and never looked back.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Harry_p said:


> I have a 1.6 316i with 155,000 miles, a 2.2 320i with 150,000 miles and a 3.2 m3 with 280,000 miles on the clock which has only had standard servicing, run on supermarket super unleaded and regularly sees the red line.
> 
> People who think petrol cars need 2 or 3 engines by 200k are still living in the 1950s!
> 
> ...


Exactly, they do tend to be a bit coarse they do vibrate a fair bit and it is a myth they are any tougher. Maybe in yesteryear but not today. Today the modern diesel has a heck of a lot more ancillary systems than a petrol equivalent when you really look in the engine bay. Even a V6 petrol is actually a simpler device compared to a diesel.

With decent oil and correct servicing there is no reason that a modern petrol car won't do high mileages.

I would happily have a big petrol lump sat outside the house if the mileage requirements dropped, they are quieter, smoother and warm up faster. Plus I like it.


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## Starbuck88 (Nov 12, 2013)




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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

> … and it is a myth they are any tougher


The actual engine parts of a diesel engine are way tougher than in petrol engines. It is the technology that has been added to them that are the weak link.

https://stillrunningstrong.com/car-m...gine-problems/


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