# Pressed Metal Number Plates - Police's View



## Millz

Morning all :wave:

I've been looking at getting a set of pressed metal number plates (from dubmeister, as they sell 'uk road legal' plates which supposedly conform to all of the standards etc). Just to be sure, I thought i'd ask the local police what their view of using these plates were.

Mails below, but thought i'd pass on the information - may come in useful for someone!

---------------------------------------



> Hello
> 
> I have a query regarding the legality of pressed metal number plates. When the subject has been discussed, there have been mixed opinions, and cases where friends have been told to remove them, however I've read through "The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001" (source: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/schedule/2/made) which the extract below explains that providing the plates conform to the BSI standards, then they are legal.
> 
> _PART 1
> VEHICLES REGISTERED AND NEW REGISTRATION PLATES FITTED ON OR AFTER 1ST SEPTEMBER 2001 (MANDATORY SPECIFICATION)
> 1. The plate must be made of retroreflecting material which, as regards its construction, colour and other qualities, complies with the requirements of-
> (a)the British Standard specification for retroreflecting number plates published on 15 January 1998 under number BS AU 145d(1),
> or
> (b)any other relevant standard or specification recognised for use in an EEA State and which, when in use, offers a performance equivalent to that offered by a plate complying with the British Standard specification,and which, in either case, is marked with the number (or such other information as is necessary to permit identification) of that standard or specification.
> 2. Where the registration mark is displayed on the front of the vehicle, it must have black characters on a white background.
> 3. Where the registration mark is displayed on the back of the vehicle, it must have black characters on a yellow background._
> 
> I've seen a response on a forum from a supplier of pressed metal number plates that display them as road legal, who explained the following:
> 
> _Our plates have been developed with a large plate manufacturer that supplies for example official Netherlands plates and serves other countries and manufactures to many differing standards world wide.. They don't have to be tested by BSI, just be designed to comply, and actually comply if tested, and this is what we have done.
> 
> The BSAU 145d regulation has been finely gone through by our manufacturer and relevant sections have be exceeded or met, including a section specifically designed to exclude metal plates, which necessitated a subtle exclusive redesign of the metal base plate and different material to 'regular' Euro show plates, as well as altered letter tooling and lastly permanent laser marking of supplier info and maker info and the standard they are made to.
> 
> They have been fully tested by our manufacturer and pre tested against the BS145d standard by the German DIN institute - (in case any major flaws we hadn't picked up on), who have set up testing environments for BSAU145d now, are testing and will award a certificate to this effect on completion.
> 
> We are fully satisfied they comply or exceed BSAU145d and have been told by a British Standards institute they can be marked as such if we are sure they comply by cross referencing DIN regs that duplicate/exceed sections of BS145d and amendments we have made, and they offered additional help if we needed, which we don't.
> 
> No UK authority has the knowledge or means to test plates other than British Standard Institute. No Police or local authority can challenge a user as they are marked correctly as to comply, and that's the end of it as far as prosecution of the user.
> If they want to test them they would have to send off to BSI and pay the £6000 to £15,000 fee...and result would be they pass anyway.
> 
> Our dealers/suppliers take proper relevant driver/vehicle ID which is a major part of plates being legal, correct lettering and physical plate spec alone is not sufficient as prevention of vehicle cloning is probably the main issue in 'illegal' plates and prosecutions._
> 
> Can you please confirm the stance on this matter? Where would I stand if I had metal number plates which conform to BSI rulings but an officer requested I removed the plates and/or issued a fixed penalty notice.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Paul


I then got the following (very quick - surprisingly) response:



> Paul
> 
> The answer to your query is in the first section of "PART 1" below and quote
> 
> " The plate must be *MADE OF* retroreflecting material "
> 
> Steel is not a retroreflecting material.
> 
> The section you have included from the number plate supplier does not state the plates have been tested and met the British Standard . It states the manufacturer of the plates has done their own testing . It also states they have been told they can mark the plates with the BS mark " IF THEY ARE SURE THEY COMPLY" which still does not show standards have been met and purely infers it.
> 
> Please note that it is the responsibility of the driver/keeper of a vehicle to ensure their vehicle is road legal and anything that casts a doubt on the legality of the registration plate should make you wary of using it.
> 
> There is suggestion on the internet that some unscrupulous sellers of show plates could offer to mark the plates to BS standard however they do so knowing that it is the driver who will have to answer the questions at the road side and pay the fine.
> 
> Plates have a fixed font style and size. Retroreflective means the plate should reflect light back to its source with a minimum scattering of light which is met by using the vinyl reflective material on the backing of the plate similar to the backing of road signs and the livery on the sides of emergency vehicles which cannot be met by simply painting a metal plate orange or white.
> 
> The standards for plates is to allow clear reading of plates and clear photography of plates by roadside cameras and automatic number plate recognition cameras and if your plate fails to meet the standard and you get stopped by police then you are open to prosecution.
> 
> You will probably have heard of a spray that was available to stop speed cameras seeing a number plate. This spray directly affected the refelectivity of the plate and could open the owner to other more serious offences than just plate offences.
> 
> If you affix such plates to your car then where stopped by police and issued with a fine then your only recourse would be to dispute the case in court in front of a magistrate which would probably still incur you being fined ( now with additional court costs ) the only difference being that the plate manufacturer would then be under scrutiny for supplying the plates.


Also worth pointing out (which the officer above didn't mention) is that ANPR cannot read pressed metal plates as the letters aren't flat to the plate - they stick out, which flags you up to their systems (a friend has been pulled for this, while using 'uk road legal pressed metal plates' since I sent this mail).

So bottom line is, even if a seller advertises them as being road legal, don't always take their word for it :thumb:

Cheers


----------



## Troon

The other bottom line is: wow, what an impressive and apparently knowledgeable response from your local plod. Thumbs up to them!


----------



## Spuj

I was talking to a friend about this the other day who is an MoT tester.

He said that if they weren't reflective, they couldn't pass them through the MoT.

Backs up that theory I guess, there goes me getting some


----------



## Millz

Well apparently being reflective isn't enough. The actual _material_ the plate is made with needs to be reflective, which is why he highlights that it needs to be 'MADE OF' a retroreflective material, not just by painting the face with a reflective paint.

It's certainly interesting stuff, and yeah I agree, a very informative response which I wasn't expecting.


----------



## divine3779

I have them on my M3









I have had a traffic cop drive by, & put his thumb up as he passed!
However I have been pulled over by a couple of jobs-worths, they said "we haven't got a problem with your plate, the only thing that makes it dodgey is the D for Deutchland, get a GB sticker mate & we won't bother you again"
I haven't bothered, & it's been through the MOT fine.
The newre pressed plates are reflective.. Go for it mate!


----------



## EliteCarCare

We've sold a number of pressed plates, ours are BS145au marked and yes the letters are raised. We've had feedback from a number of customers (some of which have been stopped and had their plates looked at). The result is that none of them have been prosecuted.

Obviously the quality of the plates does vary from one manufacturer to another but we did research this carefully before selling them so we were satisfied that they did comply.

Also, the raised lettering not complying with legal requirements isn't completely true as most older classic cars have legal numberplates which are reflective, yet have the raised lettering.

You can all stop running for the hills now! :thumb:

Alex


----------



## dominic84

Is it me, or is the confusion arising from an actual pressed metal plate and one made of the proper material but with raised letters?


----------



## Millz

I sway to agree with Alex, that providing they conform then it _should_ be fine, but you can guarantee there'll be jobs-worth officers out there which would give people a hard time over them.

Unless the plates had been TESTED by the BSI, and not just 'ensured they are made to comply with' then the BS145au stamp doesn't really mean a great deal when trying to argue with the law.

If people are happy taking the risk, then that's up to them. Personally I'm not willing to take that risk without having confirmation from the police that it would be fine, which I didn't get, so thought I'd pass on the information to let people see the other side of the arguement, and let them make their informed decision from that :thumb:


----------



## divine3779

Oh... One other thing i forgot to mention, they had a moan because apparently the plates should now have the suppliers name @ the bottom, e.g Halfords or whoever.


----------



## David

heres my pressed plates with the GB band - never been stopped/warned/prosecuted/fined for them in 3 years and i must have driven by cops and traffic cops and anpr's before


----------



## EliteCarCare

divine3779 said:


> Oh... One other thing i forgot to mention, they had a moan because apparently the plates should now have the suppliers name @ the bottom, e.g Halfords or whoever.


That's correct, that way they can check with the supplier if there are any issues (ie plates on a stolen car etc). :thumb:

Alex


----------



## bigmc

Millz said:


> Well apparently being reflective isn't enough. The actual _material_ the plate is made with needs to be reflective, which is why he highlights that it needs to be 'MADE OF' a retroreflective material, not just by painting the face with a reflective paint.


That would make the "normal" plastic plates illegal then as the plastic isn't reflective it's the 3M backing material that is in much the same way the paint is on a pressed plate. There's nothing to state what the plate is made of just that it must be reflective.


----------



## VIPER

EliteCarCare said:


> That's correct, that way they can check with the supplier if there are any issues (ie plates on a stolen car etc). :thumb:
> 
> Alex


Is that applicable retrospectively Alex do you know? So anyone without that info on their plates is required to replace them?

Just a general point on this whole numberplate issue: Whenever it's raised on here or anywhere else, there seems to be as much conflicting information as facts, and I for one am never sure 100% what's actually required by law to be displayed and what's illegal.


----------



## Millz

bigmc said:


> That would make the "normal" plastic plates illegal then as the plastic isn't reflective it's the 3M backing material that is in much the same way the paint is on a pressed plate. There's nothing to state what the plate is made of just that it must be reflective.


http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/schedule/2/made

Part 1 states 'made of'.

I'm not trying to argue against the use of them, I like them, and wanted a set myself hence sending the original mail, I was just passing on the response from the police.


----------



## EliteCarCare

Viper said:


> Is that applicable retrospectively Alex do you know? So anyone without that info on their plates is required to replace them?


Viper, are you referring to metal pressed plates without this info, or just plates in general without this info?

If it's just general plates then it shouldn't be an issue as some cars will have had their plates on long before the current legislation came into play. If it's for pressed plates recently purchased then it's advisable but again, it's also down to pot luck to a certain degree.

Alex


----------



## bigmc

I'm not arguing for or against them but most coppers can't clarify the law themselves, there's nothing in BSAU145D that says the can't be metal, or have to be plastic just that the must be retroreflective, they could be made of kryptonite if it was reflective.


----------



## Kiltox

Tempted by these for my new car however I just don't want the hassle of being pulled over for something as stupid as a number plate.

Think I'll just buy standard EU GB plastic ones from eBay for £9 delivered  (I like to lose the dealer plates when I get a car)


----------



## Gruffs

True bigmc. But, surely the 'plate' is made of the retroreflective material. It's the clear stiffener and the letters that aren't.



Just be faceatious. For a change.


----------



## Flair

I got done by a real anal officer when I was 18, I had plates on my Mr2 that where exactly as they should be, but they never had the BSAU145D mark and the postcode etc and I got fined for it but just escaped points. The only reason they did it is because the c***s didn't like the Jap car club meet that was on private land, so they just sat outside being as anal as they could with everyone. But from teh copys of the info he gave me and the what is on the net, if they dont show that, there not legal.


----------



## divine3779

bigmc said:


> I'm not arguing for or against them but most coppers can't clarify the law themselves, there's nothing in BSAU145D that says the can't be metal, or have to be plastic just that the must be retroreflective, they could be made of kryptonite if it was reflective.







:lol:


----------



## uruk hai

As far as I'm aware pressed plates are illegal and people do get fined and told to remove them. I think when and who that happens to is a case of luck as some officers simply cant be bothered with things like this and some will pull you for it !


----------



## bigmc

Under what regulation or law are they illegal though? As long as the font, size and spacing is legal, it's the correct colour and displays the correct markings metal plates aren't illegal afaik, any copper wishing to fine you for it would be on a wild goose chase.


----------



## Kiltox

uruk hai said:


> As far as I'm aware pressed plates are illegal and people do get fined and told to remove them. I think when and who that happens to is a case of luck as some officers simply cant be bothered with things like this and some will pull you for it !


How do companies get away with describing them as road legal then? Companies like Dubmeister that are registered plate suppliers surely can't just sell this stuff marked up as legal if it's not?

TBH I think it's got a lot to do with the car you drive whether you attract police attention or not, the plate is usually the least of their worries.


----------



## uruk hai

bigmc said:


> Under what regulation or law are they illegal though? As long as the font, size and spacing is legal, it's the correct colour and displays the correct markings metal plates aren't illegal afaik, any copper wishing to fine you for it would be on a wild goose chase.


Not really the case as I could could point you in the direction of a VW forum where quite a few members have been fined and told to remove them !



Kiltox said:


> How do companies get away with describing them as road legal then? Companies like Dubmeister that are registered plate suppliers surely can't just sell this stuff marked up as legal if it's not?
> 
> TBH I think it's got a lot to do with the car you drive whether you attract police attention or not, the plate is usually the least of their worries.


To be honest I havent looked at any of the web sites selling these types of number pates, I am going on the above mentioned forum who's members have had problems and other cases of number plate related issues that have in some cases made it to court !


----------



## JenJen

I run the Golf on pressed plates and I have never had any problem from the police, mine has the british standard marked on them as well.

May i add, i have had the Golf looked over with a fine toothcomb in both england and scotland while it was dressed up as a german cop car and the police could not fault anything on my car. That was normal beat cops and traffic cops


----------



## bigmc

uruk hai said:


> Not really the case as I could could point you in the direction of a VW forum where quite a few members have been fined and told to remove them !


They were probably for having german font and a D mark plates rather than UK legal font etc.


----------



## uruk hai

bigmc said:


> They were porbably for having german font and a D mark plates rather than UK legal font etc.


Perhaps mate, I'm trying to find the thread regarding this issue 

I will ask the Police I deal with, be interesting to see what they would do, if anything ?


----------



## Natalie

My ex had them on his old 306 GTI-6, he is a copper so it was parked up outside a police station most days. He said he never got any bother about them, but that could be someone turning a blind eye?


----------



## Hondahead1991

They're illegal and here in Ireland the police would give you a fine without a sweat


----------



## bigmc

Hondahead1991 said:


> They're illegal and here in Ireland the police would give you a fine without a sweat


Care to substantiate that claim with some law/regs etc?


----------



## Rundie

Millz said:


> Unless the plates had been TESTED by the BSI, and not just 'ensured they are made to comply with' then the BS145au stamp doesn't really mean a great deal when trying to argue with the law.


Not my field of expertise but I work for BSI testing, the 'BS145au' is a standard written/supplied by BSI and doesn't always mean it's been tested by BSI.
Any UKAS accredited lab can test to this standard as long as it's within their scope.
Unless they have been tested somewhere qualified to certify to the standard then they shouldn't be carrying the BS145au mark as it's misleading imo.

We've got labs at work that deal with reflective signs etc. so I'll have a chat them to see what they think on the subject.


----------



## burger

Had my elite pressed plates on my skoda for a while, even had a copper have a good look at them earlier this year and he didnt even mention them.

Ive passed 100's of ANPR's and never been pulled and had loads of traffic cars behind me.

It might just be luck but until i have a £30 fine i wont remove them.


----------



## Flair

As far as new the only real legal pressed plates, where the refletive pressed plastic ones.


----------



## uruk hai

burger said:


> Had my elite pressed plates on my skoda for a while, even had a copper have a good look at them earlier this year and he didnt even mention them.
> 
> Ive passed 100's of ANPR's and never been pulled and had loads of traffic cars behind me.
> 
> It might just be luck but until i have a £30 fine i wont remove them.


After everything I've heard and read I would think that is the most sensible approach, you may be lucky or you may not. I think the fine may be higher than £30 now though ?


----------



## bigmc

It's £60 now.


----------



## EliteCarCare

burger said:


> Had my elite pressed plates on my skoda for a while, even had a copper have a good look at them earlier this year and he didnt even mention them.
> 
> Ive passed 100's of ANPR's and never been pulled and had loads of traffic cars behind me.
> 
> It might just be luck but until i have a £30 fine i wont remove them.


The plates we supply have actually been tested and meet the BS145au standard, so they ARE road legal and reflective. That's why you had no issues. :thumb:

Alex


----------



## -tom-

I can vouch for this as i have been stopped around 3 times in over a year twice over christmas and one few weeks back. they never said any think on the third one in january it was a A and P R system as it was showing my plates were on my old car. She didnt blink a eye lid at them and they do reflect.

So in all Alex plates are top notch and dont worry about them. i will get some close up pics to show the details at the bottom off the plates.



EliteCarCare said:


> We've sold a number of pressed plates, ours are BS145au marked and yes the letters are raised. We've had feedback from a number of customers (some of which have been stopped and had their plates looked at). The result is that none of them have been prosecuted.
> 
> Obviously the quality of the plates does vary from one manufacturer to another but we did research this carefully before selling them so we were satisfied that they did comply.
> 
> Also, the raised lettering not complying with legal requirements isn't completely true as most older classic cars have legal numberplates which are reflective, yet have the raised lettering.
> 
> You can all stop running for the hills now! :thumb:
> 
> Alex


----------



## adlem

I've had my 'fully uk raod-legal' pressed metal plates from craigsplates.com on almost a year now and haven't had any problems/been pulled/had it mentioned at all and i spend a fair bit of time on the road up and down england and wales.

The one's i've got are the correct font, size, spacing etc, have the BSAU stamp and the company's name and postcode along the bottom, are reflective and have the GB banner


----------



## Millz

EliteCarCare said:


> The plates we supply have actually been tested and meet the BS145au standard, so they ARE road legal and reflective. That's why you had no issues. :thumb:
> 
> Alex


Do you have test evidence? I'd love to take some plates along with test evidence to the police station and say "try to find something wrong with them".


----------



## grayfox

I havent read every reply so this may have already been answered - what if the car is pre 1970 and has non-reflective raised metal L-Plates as standard? Do they need changing in these cases?


----------



## bigmc

grayfox said:


> I havent read every reply so this may have already been answered - what if the car is pre 1970 and has non-reflective raised metal L-Plates as standard? Do they need changing in these cases?


No none need changing, as long as the plates are UK legal font, spacing and colour they *can* be made of metal, until someone provides a law or regulation that disproves this. The phrase "put up or shut up" springs to mind tbh.


----------



## scragend

bigmc said:


> No none need changing, as long as the plates are UK legal font, spacing and colour they *can* be made of metal, until someone provides a law or regulation that disproves this. The phrase "put up or shut up" springs to mind tbh.


And also, if they were legal under the regulations at the time then they are still OK.

For example the wider font that was used pre-2001. A car registered after 2001 isn't allowed those plates, but if those plates were put on the car before 2001 they can stay on.


----------



## james_death

Koshka said:


> My ex had them on his old 306 GTI-6, he is a copper so it was parked up outside a police station most days. He said he never got any bother about them, but that could be someone turning a blind eye?


The thing is all the Police officers private road bikes around the back of the local station all wear illegal plates far to small a plate and font. :wall:


----------



## Bulkhead

Here in Oz the plates are pressed steel with raised letters and numbers. They're about half the size of UK ones so don't ruin the front or back of the car and you can have them in pretty much any colour combination you want. I had orange front and rear on the last car but have white front and rear on the Focus, which is Electric Orange and would clash! I've seen black, blue, pink, purple, green and yellow plates. I've never understood why the UK is so pedantic about these things. Do they really think it matters? I remember being pulled over in Oxford on my motorbike and they actually measured my numberplate. The letters were the right size but they said the surround was 3mm too small! I don't want to state the obvious but they must have more important things to do.


----------



## Edstrung

Bulkhead said:


> I've never understood why the UK is so pedantic about these things.


It simply comes down to the ANPR system over here. If ANPR works, Scameras work, which is revenue. If the font is off, the ANPR might not be able to read the plate.

The big one about this thread is the reflective surface of the plate. Metal plates are absolutely fine as long as they are completely covered in the reflective surface, and the black alpha-numerics stop the light reflecting. This means you end up with a negative photo. If the surface isnt reflective, you end up with a blank plate once the photo is taken. Loss of revenue.

Easiest way to check for yourself is to take a photo of your plates using a camera with a flash...


----------



## centenary

grayfox said:


> I havent read every reply so this may have already been answered - what if the car is pre 1970 and has non-reflective raised metal L-Plates as standard? Do they need changing in these cases?


Does not affect pre 70's cars. Cars registered before a specific date (around 2001?) dont need the manufacturer and post code of manufacturer on them either.

As always, changes to plate style (non reflective, reflective, font size etc) only takes effect from the day the legislation specifically states.


----------



## powelly

I have die pressed aluminium plates on my BMW, the have the BSAU mark on them and as far as i'm aware are perfectly legal, I got them from Craigplates about two years ago, they are the correct font and spacing and I chose not to have badges because they look sh1t in my opinion, never had any issues with MOT or Police. I don't really see how the can say the plate must be made of a retroreflective material, plastic ones aren't, it's just a clear acrylic with a reflective backing, the new printed ones are just a plastic plate with the reflective coating and black lettering printed over it, my pressed ones are much the same except the lettering is pressed through.
Here you go...


----------



## Bulkhead

Edstrung said:


> It simply comes down to the ANPR system over here. If ANPR works, Scameras work, which is revenue. If the font is off, the ANPR might not be able to read the plate.
> 
> The big one about this thread is the reflective surface of the plate. Metal plates are absolutely fine as long as they are completely covered in the reflective surface, and the black alpha-numerics stop the light reflecting. This means you end up with a negative photo. If the surface isnt reflective, you end up with a blank plate once the photo is taken. Loss of revenue.
> 
> Easiest way to check for yourself is to take a photo of your plates using a camera with a flash...


We have cameras here as well. In fact, we have more cameras than back in the UK as in addition to speed cameras we also have toll roads which read you number plate and charge you accordingly. Many plates here do not reflect but are still read. My plates are just plain black letters on a white background but the RTA have no problem in photographing my plates and charging me. Maybe it's just sunnier here so they show up!!


----------



## STEALTH K3

I have pressed plates and not been tugged want to thought to have a argument with the filth about it.


----------



## durmz

had em on for a while, passed plenty of police, not had a problem.

I love em, however im positive there not legal, given the font etc


----------



## apmaman

Just by a pre-72 car if you want pressed metal plates. The proper black ones too!


----------



## Ratchet

Got pressed plates from dubsmeister on my c2, passed mot last week, no problem. :thumb:

I even went my local police station to see where I stood and was told all was fine with them. :thumb:


----------



## andy monty

If anyone is bored have a read of my thread i made on Alex's / Elite car cares Plates on the Forum i mod on....

Im more than happy they are legal after having a chat with the manufacturer that Alex deals with......

http://www.fiatforum.com/punto-evo/297476-got-my-pressed-plates.html

Oh and call me organised i have the full booklet printed and stashed in the car

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/pdfs/uksi_20010561_en.pdf


----------



## mr v6

I had a set of pressed plates on the coupe about 4 years ago. Past a traffic cop (in traffic about 5mph) by the roadside dealing with another matter, looked in my rear view mirror & saw them both look at the car, jump in their BM-Troubleyou & come after me like I'd committed an armed robbery..

The result was a £30 fine & told to remove the plates. These were apparently road legal ones too. Jumped up plod wench didn't even want to listen to what I had to say, whilst senior muppet was on his radio checking out the car, tyres etc looking for anything else could sting me for, before letting me go.

Is it worth it? I couldn't be bothered with the whole fiasco again.


----------



## andy monty

mr v6 said:


> I had a set of pressed plates on the coupe about 4 years ago. Past a traffic cop (in traffic about 5mph) by the roadside dealing with another matter, looked in my rear view mirror & saw them both look at the car, jump in their BM-Troubleyou & come after me like I'd committed an armed robbery..
> 
> The result was a £30 fine & told to remove the plates. These were apparently road legal ones too. Jumped up plod wench didn't even want to listen to what I had to say, whilst senior muppet was on his radio checking out the car, tyres etc looking for anything else could sting me for, before letting me go.
> 
> Is it worth it? I couldn't be bothered with the whole fiasco again.


surely they gave you the option of a on the spot or a court appearance... Surely once its put to the CPS it wouldnt get that far or they do their howe work before submitting it

Ive been in situations before where knowing the law has got me out of similar situations (air gun law and cycle lights believe it or not) By standing my ground they seek advice from above and usually its sorted out and clarified on the spot, Its not about been a clever sod or a clever one but you cant expect every officer to be an expert but should be clever enough to check up


----------



## mr v6

andy monty said:


> surely they gave you the option of a on the spot or a court appearance... Surely once its put to the CPS it wouldnt get that far or they do their howe work before submitting it


As said Andy, plod wench seemed to have had the ticket wrote out before I said a word.. It was a straight ticket, a fine, no amount of arguing the toss with her was going to change anything, I'm a very argumentative type & she was just sour-faced.


----------



## andy monty

mr v6 said:


> As said Andy, plod wench seemed to have had the ticket wrote out before I said a word.. It was a straight ticket, a fine, no amount of arguing the toss with her was going to change anything, I'm a very argumentative type & she was just sour-faced.


no appeal information on the ticket?


----------



## mr v6

andy monty said:


> no appeal information on the ticket?


Nothing mate. If there was a loophole, believe me, I'd have found it, given I'm a tight northerner:thumb:.


----------



## P-Nutty

i had pressed metal plates on my old car, carried the bsau markings etc - thought thats what made it legal etc for post 2001 cars? was in the charles wright font etc as well. Passed MOT fine too. Bought them off ebay.


----------



## gidged500

Think it depends on the cops sometimes , I had pressed plates on my car got pulled and got told they were illegal due to the spacing and not being reflective , got a little ticket I had to take to my mot tester to say I had changed my plates to legal ones , the plates were from Craig's plates/ French plates , friends with plates from dubmeister don't have problems might also be the fact I drive a Corsa lol


----------



## The Cueball

I have the pressed plates from Elite Car Care on both my cars.... never had any issues with the police, they are 100% legal...

:thumb:


----------



## Scotty B

Mine passed it's MOT with pressed plates.


----------



## Jon_P

The regulations simply state that the plates must be made out of a material which is retro-reflective. The regulations say nothing about *what* that material should be. Now, as we know that plastic itself is not reflective, and it is the coating applied to it which makes it reflective then there is no reason why metal plates cannot have the same coating applied to them to make them reflective. The regulations say nothing about *what* that material should be.

However, the rgulations do mention "International distinguishing signs and other material", and reading through this section it would seem to suggest that if you have a marking on your plate (e.g. the earlier post with 'D' for Germany) then this is illegal (unless obviously the car is German)

_No material other than a registration mark may be displayed on a registration plate
except material complying with the requirements of any of the relevant standards mentioned in Schedule 2.

(2) Where a mark is displayed on a dual purpose plate-
(a) no material other than the international distinguishing sign of the United Kingdom
displayed in accordance with the Council Registration may be placed in the space
provided on the plate for that purpose..._


----------



## robtech

simple way to avoid BS from the cops is to simply have standard plates and lights. and spend the money you would waste on stupid things on things that really matter.


----------



## The Cueball

robtech said:


> simple way to avoid BS from the cops is to simply have standard plates and lights. and spend the money you would waste on stupid things on things that really matter.


like a million 'special' cleaning products, magic buckets and super brushes...



:lol:


----------



## LittleMissTracy

The Cueball said:


> like a million 'special' cleaning products, magic buckets and super brushes...
> 
> 
> 
> :lol:


Special cleaning products matter to me  In fact so would a nice personal number plate if I could find one I want.

Each to their own.


----------



## horico

I too have the elite plates. Std everything and they are 100% legal. They reflect exactly the same as normal plates and can be read by anpr cameras etc.


----------



## Jon_P

horico said:


> I too have the elite plates. Std everything and they are 100% legal. They reflect exactly the same as normal plates and can be read by anpr cameras etc.


Could you take a flash photo in the dark so we can see how they reflect?


----------



## MEH4N

ive got the legal ones and been pulled for them, argued with plod and been told to get on my way.

I knew what is needed so pointed it out, as below: -
1-must be charles wright uk font and be spaced correctly
2-must be reflective
3-must display seller name and post code under the reg number in the middle
4-must have bsau 145d stamped on the bottom right of the plate


----------



## horico

Jon_P said:


> Could you take a flash photo in the dark so we can see how they reflect?


Here are a couple of shoddy snaps with the iPhone which is terrible with the flash. The BMW has metal plates, vauxhall std uk plates.

I took a few of both but the flash was just confusing the iPhone. IMO, there was no difference between to two and I've previously tested with a lenser p7 torch against a line of cars parked up side by side.


----------



## EliteCarCare

FYI - I was pulled over last night by the Metropolitan's finest and they checked the plates during the PNC process and didn't say a word about them. They reflect and are seen by automatic car park numberplate recognition systems, speed cameras (guilty ). 

Not a single problem EVER for us or our customers.

Alex


----------



## Nally

Can't remember if mine are up here but this is them


----------



## saloonsean

I was a naughty boy a few years ago and used these ^

Went up and down the country with them on, I even had traffic police etc behind me in some instances and i never had one bit of bother.

Nowhere near as bad as some of the plates you see about!


----------



## iPlod999

I've never stopped myself over mine.


----------



## kh904

iPlod999 said:


> I've never stopped myself over mine.


So what's the opinions from someone in the police force?

Any recommendations what to say if someone gets pulled for pressed plates that seem to abide by the legal requirements?


----------



## andy monty

kh904 said:


> So what's the opinions from someone in the police force?
> 
> Any recommendations what to say if someone gets pulled for pressed plates that seem to abide by the legal requirements?


Do what i did download the PDF and print it off and stick under the boot carpet ....

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/contents/made

Then you have the actual Law to refer to 

as of what to say

Err

My plates comply with BsAu145d they are the correct colour, reflective, The correct font 3d lettering is permitted in the regs, And spacing and were made by a government approved supplier, They are legal under the The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001 ....

Your move officer


----------



## iPlod999

When I am back at work. I will ask one of my rat/traffic colleagues what their view is.


----------



## horico

In truth, while we believe they are fully legal, it will never be tested until someone goes to court for it and we hear if the results.


----------



## Mr THX

EliteCarCare said:


> The plates we supply have actually been tested and meet the BS145au standard, so they ARE road legal and reflective. That's why you had no issues. :thumb:
> 
> Alex


Hi,

I can't see these on your website, where can I find out more info about where to order and price please 

Thanks


----------



## andy monty

Mr THX said:


> Hi,
> 
> I can't see these on your website, where can I find out more info about where to order and price please
> 
> Thanks


You need to ask nicely 

either drop alex a PM, email or ring them

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/member.php?u=3042

Tel: 01628 671213

[email protected]


----------



## DMH-01

Mr THX said:


> Hi,
> 
> I can't see these on your website, where can I find out more info about where to order and price please
> 
> Thanks


Or from this thread :thumb:...

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=173997


----------



## Glaschu

I've never understood the attraction of retrofitting pressed plates, back in the day they were a sign that either the driver was a cheapskate, or the car was an old ex-fleet wreck :lol:


----------



## Glaschu

divine3779 said:


> :lol:


What a complete and utter tool that guy is, kudos to the police officers for not losing their rag with him.


----------



## bidderman1969

Glaschu said:


> What a complete and utter tool that guy is, kudos to the police officers for not losing their rag with him.


Kind of agree with you, however, I think it kind of highlights the fact that a lot of us don't realise that the police lead us to believe they can say what they like and we HAVE to do it, which obviously isn't the case otherwise they would have just opened the door and dragged him out if so, lol

No offence to the police force in general as I think they have a tough job to do day in day out


----------



## Glaschu

bidderman1969 said:


> Kind of agree with you, however, I think it kind of highlights the fact that a lot of us don't realise that the police lead us to believe they can say what they like and we HAVE to do it, which obviously isn't the case otherwise they would have just opened the door and dragged him out if so, lol
> 
> No offence to the police force in general as I think they have a tough job to do day in day out


The guy was talking ballhooks on almost every point, never mind the fact he claimed to be a sovereign :lol:

They should have done him for those front tints too...


----------



## bidderman1969

But that's the point, they didn't

But what else don't they have the power to do? Or seem not have the power to do?


----------



## Glaschu

bidderman1969 said:


> But that's the point, they didn't
> 
> But what else don't they have the power to do? Or seem not have the power to do?


I don't think in this case that they didn't have the powers to do anything, more that he was just a PITA and charging him for every infraction would have tied the poor bobbies up with paperwork until they retired :lol:


----------



## Bero

Glaschu said:


> I don't think in this case that they didn't have the powers to do anything, more that he was just a PITA and charging him for every infraction would have tied the poor bobbies up with paperwork until they retired :lol:


They can't come in for the same reason they can't drag you out of your house if they fancy it...unless you let them of course.

They need a warrant I believe - I understand the one exception (WRT cars) is if they have reasonable enough suspicion to search it for drugs.


----------



## Glaschu

Bero said:


> They can't come in for the same reason they can't drag you out of your house if they fancy it...unless you let them of course.
> 
> They need a warrant I believe - I understand the one exception (WRT cars) is if they have reasonable enough suspicion to search it for drugs.


The car was registered to a woman ( the driver's mother iirc) the discrepancy in the name/sex, along with his refusal to provide his name would be enough to detain him.

I'd also put money on that car being improperly insured...


----------



## bidderman1969

So, What else don't we know,


----------



## avit88

Glaschu said:


> What a complete and utter tool that guy is, kudos to the police officers for not losing their rag with him.


this man isnt a tool but he is going out of his way to make it obvious to the rest of us that the police often have no powers and you dont have to do anything, as long as you have done nothing wrong. too many police abuse their powers thinking they rule the world.

alot of what he is saying is true you dont have to say anything and the police cant do ****... take this guy for example


----------



## mastacrx

Did you get my PM and email?


----------



## Gravit8

Millz said:


> I then got the following (very quick - surprisingly) response:
> 
> Quote:
> Paul
> 
> The answer to your query is in the first section of "PART 1" below and quote
> 
> " The plate must be MADE OF retroreflecting material "
> 
> Steel is not a retroreflecting material.


I just wanted to add, this officer is completely wrong. I performed experiments on retroreflecting materials at a London University. There are 2 main types. The type in use mostly in 'reflective' vests and on roadsigns is actually a retroreflective coating/paint. It is made up of small glass or plastic spheres embedded in paint that coats about 1/2 the sphere in reflective paint. This makes the paint+ sphere retro-reflective as opposed to just reflective. Therefore even a standard plastic number plate is not 'made of' retroreflective material all the way through, it is just ordinary plastic coated with retroreflective paint/coating on the surface. Clearly you can do the same to a steel plate too.

So going by that officers quote above, all number plates are illegal, because they are not completely composed of retroreflective paint.
its only on the surface


----------



## SurGie

Does anyone know of a company that can make legal pressed plates to a width size of 460mm ?

My plate has no I's or 1's and is a 7 digit number plate ???

My cars bumper where the plates originally fit has a recess and is 460mm wide, yet it seems due to the law being changed I cannot get anyone to supply the sized plate my car requires.


----------



## andy monty

SurGie said:


> Does anyone know of a company that can make legal pressed plates to a width size of 460mm ?
> 
> My plate has no I's or 1's and is a 7 digit number plate ???
> 
> My cars bumper where the plates originally fit has a recess and is 460mm wide, yet it seems due to the law being changed I cannot get anyone to supply the sized plate my car requires.


Dont know if alex @ elite car care can do them?


----------



## SurGie

Thanks but I did call them n never got a call back so I guess its a no


----------



## Starbuck88

Is there any further movement on these plates? Any more issues being pulled over etc? Anybody been to their local station to show them their car with them on?


----------



## DMH-01

asonda said:


> Is there any further movement on these plates? Any more issues being pulled over etc? Anybody been to their local station to show them their car with them on?


I've had mine on for nearly 2 years and in that time been pulled over plenty of times (young guy, nice car ) and my plates have never been questioned (they're legal anyway).

It also sailed through the MOT and again the plates were never mentioned.


----------



## EliteCarCare

We use them on our own cars and again they all pass MOT's they are ANPR friendly, the lettering is completely legal in terms of font, size and spacing, they have all the correct markings and are reflective. :thumb:

Alex


----------



## Ryan

EliteCarCare said:


> We use them on our own cars and again they all pass MOT's they are ANPR friendly, the lettering is completely legal in terms of font, size and spacing, they have all the correct markings and are reflective. :thumb:
> 
> Alex


I have had a set from Elite Car Care on my car for just over a year now and have had absolutely no problems whatsoever. I have been pulled over by police for other things (random checks etc) and they have never commented :thumb:


----------



## Samba1360

Then there is the whole debate on _italics_.


----------



## Tank.

what argument on italics? 
Theres only one recognised font for plates and thats not it.

My concern was going to be about reflectiveness and ANPR as access to the missus works car park uses ANPR scanners to get into the car park, i do also have a swipe key but rather not have to open the window and swipe if i dont have to 

Good to see elite do reflective totally legal plates
I have a question for those with plate surrounds where the plate is mounted into, whats the security on them like, how easy is it to get a plate on and more importantly off, are they easily stolen.
If im getting pressed plates id rather have them mounted in a surround then i can put show plates on when at shows but not if plates are easily removed/stolen


----------



## DMH-01

Tank. said:


> I have a question for those with plate surrounds where the plate is mounted into, whats the security on them like, how easy is it to get a plate on and more importantly off, are they easily stolen.
> If im getting pressed plates id rather have them mounted in a surround then i can put show plates on when at shows but not if plates are easily removed/stolen


The surround has tabs which lock the plate in and you use a plastic key to unlock.

As with most things though, if someone really wanted them they could get them off just as you could with the majority of other number plates.


----------



## SurGie

I managed to get my number plates, not pressed but are just how I want them, ie size, add ons like boarder and name graphics at the bottom. All are legal just apart from the general size, 100mm high and same width my car needs but the smaller one looks just the right size so would be very hard to tell, cheap too


----------



## craigeh123

Id say its when plates are mis spaced with dodgy fonts etc is when police are most interested


----------



## andystevens

I still have a set of Pressed Aluminium plates that were on my brand new 1985 Metro VandenPlas, they reflect.


----------

