# Combi boiler recommendations.



## Trix

Hi guys, Need to replace an old combo boiler with the new condensing type and was wondering what was a good make. 

I have a three bedroom semi with one bathroom and seven radiators so don't need a monster of a boiler. I'd like a decent warranty and have been looking at Bosch Worcester, Vaillant and Glow Worm which was recommended by my plumber. It also needs to be compatible with my Drayton Wiser smart stat.

Thanking you:thumb:


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## AudiPhil

I had a Worcester bosch greenstar fitted 4 or 5 years ago and I'm really happy with it. It came with a 7 year guarantee and has been faultless.......so far. I dont know about the comptbility with your smart stat though.


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## Steveom2

Plus one for Worcester Bosch greenstar,had mine for over 7 years and it hasn’t missed a beat or serviced:thumb: must get that done though


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## Summit Detailing

Worcester Bosch vote here too.
We had one fitted last year to replace an old and faulty Valliant - sooooo much quieter. Also excellent warranty as a previous poster has mentioned.

cheers

Chris


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## Nick-ST

Worcester or Viessmann would be my choice


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## Nidge76

Just had a Worcester boiler fitted. Only had it a couple of months but very pleased so far. My plumber recommended it to me but I had already checked Which? Magazine online and Worcester were rated very highly. 

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## gatecrasher3

Either Worcester or Ideal according to the plumbers that did the installations on our development.

The Ideal that we have fitted has a 7 year warranty as long as you have it serviced every year.


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## dholdi

Ideal / Vaillant imho, Worcester ok but tricky to work on.


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## GP Punto

Watching this thread with interest. 

My boiler was fitted when the house was built in 1983, it is simply a great big water heater with a seperate Groundfos pump. I keep thinking that I should change it but when I get someone to give advice they say leave it alone, it is simple and reliable, doesnt even get serviced after an engineer said that nothing needed doing, no soot build up, just gas supply and burners to a large steel block.

The only thing I have had done this year was to have the whole system flushed out, the technician connected a huge pump which sent gallons of water round the radiators with an open hose to the drains, the horrible black sludge that came back was appalling, they then added some inhibitor. 

The whole system now works well and I would recommend this flushing process when you have a new boiler.

Next door neighbour replaced his boiler 8 years ago and he has it serviced every year, the last time they told him that it will need a change in a couple of years. That would upset me.


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## Andy from Sandy

My boiler drives the central heating and hot water and was fitted in 1995.

As I have just had a smart meter fitted I can see that yesterday I used £4 of gas.

In the past I was quoted £2000 to have a new boiler fitted.

If a new boiler were 25% more efficient that would take ~ 5 1/2 years to recoup outlay but then add in say £150 per year for a service that would add a further 2 years but as a recurring charge would make it a little longer.

If in the above example the boiler doesn't last say 10 years I may never actually save enough to make it worthwhile changing the boiler for the sake of it.


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## ishaaq

i would also recommend a Worcester Bosch. Worth keeping in mind the Kw of the boiler you are going to choose. around 30kw should be ok for you.


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## cadmunkey

Viesmann. Stainless steel internals.
Worcester Bosch have reduced the quality of their internal parts.


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## Tricky Red

Andy from Sandy said:


> My boiler drives the central heating and hot water and was fitted in 1995.
> 
> As I have just had a smart meter fitted I can see that yesterday I used £4 of gas.
> 
> In the past I was quoted £2000 to have a new boiler fitted.
> 
> If a new boiler were 25% more efficient that would take ~ 5 1/2 years to recoup outlay but then add in say £150 per year for a service that would add a further 2 years but as a recurring charge would make it a little longer.
> 
> If in the above example the boiler doesn't last say 10 years I may never actually save enough to make it worthwhile changing the boiler for the sake of it.


Our plumber services ours for around £60.00 Ours does work out much cheaper, we had it around 5 years ago. On an old boiler, we thought that we couldn't trust that we wouldn't need a repair imminently. (and the tank broke anyway)


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## Andy from Sandy

Tricky Red said:


> Our plumber services ours for around £60.00 Ours does work out much cheaper, we had it around 5 years ago. On an old boiler, we thought that we couldn't trust that we wouldn't need a repair imminently. (and the tank broke anyway)


Yes, I think my figure is double what it ought to be.

If the previous posters assessment is correct that a new boiler lasts around 10 years it is a big outlay that may not be so cost effective.

Clearly if a boiler is beyond economical repair there is no option.

My house has 17 radiators so I have no clue what the cost would be as I have seen it recommended to fit proper stats on each one.


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## dazzh

Have you considered Intergas or ATAG?
Both makes come very highly recommended by the professional installers on the diynot plumbing forum. I think it's because they have very few moving parts so less to go wrong. 
If you post a question on their forum I'm sure they will advise on which one is more suited to your size of property. 
I don't have one so can't really comment but hope this gives you another option.


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## mike13

dazzh said:


> Have you considered Intergas or ATAG?
> Both makes come very highly recommended by the professional installers on the diynot plumbing forum. I think it's because they have very few moving parts so less to go wrong.
> If you post a question on their forum I'm sure they will advise on which one is more suited to your size of property.
> I don't have one so can't really comment but hope this gives you another option.


Had my ATAG for 2 years now, no issues although i would not expect any either, great reviews on trust pilot as a boiler, looked at all the others before choosing this, hardly hear it when on!


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## G.P

I to keep my eye on threads about boilers, ours is 18 years old with my old mans been 40 so I'm preparing. Whilst Worcester get many good reviews, so do the others. Viseman I've no idea on cost but I'm guessing are the most expensive, I'm told are at the top end, but whats the point when you can get a 7/10 year warranty with others, which is also my thought on Worcester, who are more expensive than both Ideal & Glow-worm, So for me, it's flick a coin between Ideal & Glow-worm with Ideal I think still still been under UK ownership unlike the others..


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## funkydunk

It may have a long warranty but you still don’t want it to break down. The after care on some warranties is rubbish too. They try to get out of things and take ages to respond. Worcester’s is excellent and vaillant seem quite good. I have heard ideal isn’t great. 


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## Alfie7777

I’ve been running a Worcester green star for 13 faultless years&#55357;&#56397;


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## Darlofan

funkydunk said:


> It may have a long warranty but you still don't want it to break down. The after care on some warranties is rubbish too. They try to get out of things and take ages to respond. Worcester's is excellent and vaillant seem quite good. I have heard ideal isn't great.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Our last one was a Worcester and have to say aftercare was superb. Was out of warranty, rang them and they said if I took out a breakdown cover they would repair it and annual service too. Guy turned up next day, fixed it, serviced it then came back annually to service it. 
Got an Ideal now as cousin in plumbers merchants recommended it. Faultless so far(touches wood!) It's 4yrs old.


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## Pauly.22

Just had an ideal one fitted. 

Seems ok so far


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## G.P

funkydunk said:


> It may have a long warranty but you still don't want it to break down. The after care on some warranties is rubbish too. They try to get out of things and take ages to respond. Worcester's is excellent and vaillant seem quite good. I have heard ideal isn't great.


Thats true, Worcester are excellent when called out and I'm told have the most vans/engineers on the road in the UK, what I don't know is if thats because they sell more boilers than most or their boilers fail allot more than others. Couple of local installers here in Worcestershire have stopped recommending Worcester together with some employees I know only buying their boilers because of the staff discount. Can the others Ideal/Glowworm be that much worse..


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## RedUntilDead

Have you picked one yet?
Veismann and intergas are excellent but probably overkill for you.
Ideal - not for me. Cheap crap but good supply as they are stocked by merchants and fitted by housing associations.
WB green stars are good and come with loads of recommendations.
I bought a valliant as the Odell I chose had the best performance for my needs.BUT be careful, valliant use their own comms so they may not fully function with other smart controls I.e it will just be on/off and it won’t modulate properly. For proper functionality use valliants own smart controls. Most smart control engineers I have met don’t know this either.
The new Baxi boilers have good warranties, UK made and really easy to install and for this reason we’ll liked by installers.

Don’t over size and pick the model that you fancy. You won’t go wrong with any of the boilers mentioned tbh (I would avoid ideal though from my own experience )
Fitters stick to what they know and what they can get hold off quickly so you won’t always get advice tailored to what works best for you.

Will the boiler be on show? Some are ugly looking. Some are even made to fit inside a standard kitchen unit


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## G.P

RedUntilDead said:


> Have you picked one yet?
> Veismann and intergas are excellent but probably overkill for you.
> Ideal - not for me. Cheap crap but good supply as they are stocked by merchants and fitted by housing associations.
> WB green stars are good and come with loads of recommendations.
> I bought a valliant as the Odell I chose had the best performance for my needs.BUT be careful, valliant use their own comms so they may not fully function with other smart controls I.e it will just be on/off and it won't modulate properly. For proper functionality use valliants own smart controls. Most smart control engineers I have met don't know this either.
> The new Baxi boilers have good warranties, UK made and really easy to install and for this reason we'll liked by installers.
> 
> Don't over size and pick the model that you fancy. You won't go wrong with any of the boilers mentioned tbh (I would avoid ideal though from my own experience )
> Fitters stick to what they know and what they can get hold off quickly so you won't always get advice tailored to what works best for you.
> 
> Will the boiler be on show? Some are ugly looking. Some are even made to fit inside a standard kitchen unit


Boilers seem to be like detailing products!

Having recently spoken with a local boiler R&D employee, think I'll steer clear of Worcester & Baxi. Intergas back up is apparently not so good with Valliant suffering more problems than its lower boiler Glowworm as more to fail on the Valliant.

Kind of leaves me to Glow-worm or the cheap crap Ideal. A local letting agent also fits Ideal when required and has done for the last 6 years, to date no problems so maybe housing associations are right.

For me though, whichever make I pick, I shall oversize as nothing worse than having a boiler that struggles (mainly the cheapest 24kW) when your in the shower and others start using hot water..


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## Russ

I have the ideal vogue combi boiler, 40kw jobby. 

10 year warranty and is fantastic. 

Every quote I got from people all said what a great boiler it was, oddly all said that Worcester were living off their past a little and aren’t what they were. Also the cost for an equivalent Worcester compared to the Ideal was huge.

Ideal had an issue with the ixos range I think it was but the vogue was redesigned up from scratch and back on form.


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## Rundie

We've got an Alpha boiler fitted in our new build, only been here 18mths but it's been superb. Read online feedback before we moved in and they seem a reasonable option.


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## LeadFarmer

Be careful with long warranties, boiler manufacturers will take samples of the water in your system and claim there are too many particles and void your claim. Expect to drain your system and fill with expensive bottled mineral water for it to pass.


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## Rundie

LeadFarmer said:


> Be careful with long warranties, boiler manufacturers will take samples of the water in your system and claim there are too many particles and void your claim. Expect to drain your system and fill with expensive bottled mineral water for it to pass.


Also softened water, most will void warranties if the heating side is filled using softened water even though it has been proven not to be harmful. Use the water softener bypass to fill the heating, not usually an issue on the hot water side as the heat exhanger is stainless.


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## RedUntilDead

G.P is not wrong about picking a boiler. Regarding sizing though, most can modulate down to 10Kw for central heating (talking about the bigger boilers). Rather than picking just on name/brand have a look at the boilers specs. The model I picked for our home was for the hot water flow rate as much as anything. Our Hot water runs as fast as the cold and you can have a shower (mixer) run the bathroom sink and do the dishes all at th3 same time with no performance drop off. My mains in is normally between 1.5 - 2bar at 19 litres a minute.
Ps didn’t intend to insult the Ideal owners, we all have our own experience but I see a lot in my line of work. Maybe ask another good question about best tyres to buy


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## dholdi

There is a famous Clint Eastwood quotation that would be most apt for this thread.


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## spyk3d

Might be worth checking out Plumbnation once you know what specs you are after.

https://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/boilers/


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## LeadFarmer

RedUntilDead said:


> Our Hot water runs as fast as the cold and you can have a shower (mixer) run the bathroom sink and do the dishes all at th3 same time with no performance drop off.


You do the dishes whilst in the shower? Thats a bit weird


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## P4ULT

You can’t go wrong with Worcester to be fair. No boilers are perfect, but their warranty backup is second to none, my only real issue with them now is cost, but not sure there is anything better. I am always wary f warranty. Vanilla to fail miserably in this department, we fitted a new boiler recently which had a fault out of the box and they wanted us to wait 5 days for an engineer, eventually got them out next day.

Bali seem to think they have a 24hour response on warranty calls but never got involved with them. Ideal are a happy medium fitted a couple and no issues as yet.

We fit a considerable amount of boilers and my money would be on Worcester if you could afford it, although I am not keen on the compact range. The I and the CDI Very good, and they have a completely revamped model due in the next few months which is available in a couple of different colours if that’s your thing.


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## G.P

As mentioned above, Worcester been more money (£200-300) more than Ideal/Glowworm for similar specs, anyone know the approx. costs for the comparison Viessmann?

Whilst thinking about this thread I have remembered the last two Worcesters I purchased both packed up within the first year with the one failing a further 3 times thereafter, whereas a Glowowrm and an Ideal I knew of didn't experience any problems as yet.

It'll always be a mine field with folk having very different opinions..


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## P4ULT

Surprised you had so many issues with Worcester. I have fitted or been in involved in the figment of thousands of these and the failure rate has been very low. 

Regarding the Viesmann they have different models same as the other manufacturers if you were to pit them against othe brands they would be very high mid range. They are decent boilers my only concern is the manufacturer warranty backup in real terms. The beauty of them is they can be used with artificially softened water. 

TBF any boiler will do the job just make sure the system is cleaned, even just a chemical clean will do and a system filter is fitted. Power push or Magnacleanse are great optional extras also ensure the use of inhibitors to protect. One last thing good quality chemicals are a must.


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## great gonzo

G.P said:


> As mentioned above, Worcester been more money (£200-300) more than Ideal/Glowworm for similar specs, anyone know the approx. costs for the comparison Viessmann?
> 
> Whilst thinking about this thread I have remembered the last two Worcesters I purchased both packed up within the first year with the one failing a further 3 times thereafter, whereas a Glowowrm and an Ideal I knew of didn't experience any problems as yet.
> 
> It'll always be a mine field with folk having very different opinions..


A thing to factor with a Viessmann is that you have to use there controls which can be an issue in some circumstances.

Gonz.


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## rod87

dholdi said:


> There is a famous Clint Eastwood quotation that would be most apt for this thread.


Are you laughing at my mule?


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## dholdi

rod87 said:


> Are you laughing at my mule?


Not quite the one I had in mind.


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