# Flex vs Rupes



## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

If you have to choose one between the flex 3401 vrg or rupes
bigfoot 21 which one will you choose and why.


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Most likely the flex. 

Reason being you can change the backing plate so overall it can be 1 machine for all. 

The 21 will be only good for large panels.


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## Guitarjon (Jul 13, 2012)

I went for the flex in the end just because I'd had some experience using one. I did consider a rupes machine but wasn't sure I could justify the extra cost knowing the flex would do what I needed it too. Although I have heard the rupes machines vibrate less.


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## Guitarjon (Jul 13, 2012)

Is there anyway you can try some of the machines buddy? I would have liked to have tried a rupes machine and still would. A lot of pros use them but they also use the flex machines too.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

You have to try them to see their strengths and weaknesses, and also so someone who uses them frequently can pass on tips on how to get the best from them. I do still feel that the rupes is not versatile enough and vastly over priced


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Since I don't know anyone with these machine it's hard for me to try it for myself.
I'm looking to see which one is smoother, less vibration, and more efficient at removing defect quicker. Thanks for the response guys.

cheers


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## Guitarjon (Jul 13, 2012)

Where abouts are you buddy, your more than welcome to try my flex if your interested. I'm in South Yorkshire (Rotherham).


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## envious89 (Aug 24, 2010)

i bought both. Both very handy machines to have laying around. My biggest gripe with the flex though is that if im going to put so much effort into moving the machine around you might as well use the rotary.


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## envious89 (Aug 24, 2010)

thats my opinion though, id like to know everyone elses thoughts?


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

Rupes LHR15 with microfibre pad and Zephir compound will correct far easier and quicker than rotary and produce more gloss.

I havent used a rotary for over a year now, there is no need if you know how to use the bigfoot correctly.

But hey what do I know 

Kind Regards
Paul Dalton

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## Obsessed Merc (Apr 10, 2011)

I have both.
I reach for the Rupes most of the time, in particular vans, boats or proper grotty cars.
Found the sweet spot speed on my machine - I can use it one handed if needs must.


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

Obsessed Merc said:


> I have both.
> I reach for the Rupes most of the time, in particular vans, boats or proper grotty cars.
> Found the sweet spot speed on my machine - I can use it one handed if needs must.


Exactly! Its a piece of cake and no hard work needed unlike the rotary... have you tried it with microfibre pads? Super quick correction on hard paint.

Kind Regards
Paul
Miracle Detail


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

But paul you have dozens of rupe machines. 

Every single size and multiples. 

This guy is after one machine i think. 

Unless he can afford to buy 3 or so rupes for all sizes. 
Large 21. Medium 15 and spot pad one. 

A very good system as you say paul but expensive too.


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Very impressive collection you have paul.

Someone sent me this. I think its your place?


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## Black.MB (Aug 22, 2012)

Owned Flex 3401, later also tried the Bigfoot. Very different machines. Flex behaves like a rotary but spins counter clockwise, which i actually liked, but some people don't. In your hand feels like a rotary and you can get the feeling it's a little grabby. I mean you have to hold it "firmly", otherwise it can "run off" your hands. Bigfoot, on the other hand, runs much smoother and you can get the feeling you can almost run it with one hand only. As far the ease of use, bigfoot is the winner for me between these two. I've seen a lot of people changing the LHR21 backing plate to smaller an use 150mm pads, so i don't see any difference in this point when comparing BF and 3401. I've seen bigfoot 21 to wear the pads out quite fast because of its large throw, so here maybe goes a plus for 3401. No one is magic and whatever people tell you, no one cuts as fast as rotary using the same polish and pad combo.
My opinion is that both are great machines, but quite overpriced if you don't get good offer. Instead of buying kind of a "hybrid" polisher that offers me decent cut and "hologram free finish", i opter for two machines: rotary and DAS6. It costed me about the same money, i have no problems with smaller pads (even the 80mm), can do the hardest cutting with no problems and finish hologram free (I recently use the rotary for finishing/jewelling). I can do whatever i want now:thumb:
But to answer your question: if i had to choose between 3401 and LHR21 i'd go for the big foot. Probably because nice, smooth and simple ease of use.


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## Guitarjon (Jul 13, 2012)

I was thinking of you when I mentioned a lot of the pro's use the Rupes Paul.


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

Rascal_69 said:


> Very impressive collection you have paul.
> 
> Someone sent me this. I think its your place?


lol yes! 

there for Bigfoot training mostly..

Kind Regards
Paul


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

I wonder whats coming next lol 




Or maybe not...


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

Rascal_69 said:


> But paul you have dozens of rupe machines.
> 
> Every single size and multiples.
> 
> ...


No you can fix a whole car with the 15mm.


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## Strongey (Apr 16, 2013)

I've been looking at trying a Bigfoot recently might look into buying soon. Currently have a flex pe14-3


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## Miracle Detail (Jun 4, 2010)

Strongey said:


> I've been looking at trying a Bigfoot recently might look into buying soon. Currently have a flex pe14-3


You wont regret it, awesome piece of kit, makes correction fun fun fun! 

Just not for ones who havent got one or dont know how to use it lol.

Kind Regards
Paul


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Guitarjon said:


> Where abouts are you buddy, your more than welcome to try my flex if your interested. I'm in South Yorkshire (Rotherham).


I'm not located next to you but thanks for the offer.


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

I have a old da polisher that is weak so I was looking into a flex or a rupes 
something that is a upgrade from what I have. I have a rotary with all sizes
backing plates and pads but I don't what to use a rotary for minor correction I could but don't want to and that where the flex or rupes comes into play.


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Thanks for all the replies everyone. 
cheers


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Rupes 15 is what am getting for birthday next month. 

But i already have 

2 rotarys
Flex vrg 
Da6 

Just need to find whos cheapest for the kit


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## Audiquattro (Sep 9, 2010)

Personally, having the 3401 on the armour, and even thinking to buy the Rupes, some months ago, I literally stopped to want one.
Maybe the Rupes will have less vibrations, but the Flex forced rotation still remain a must for me.
I can't think to have a similar expence for a bigger das-6 with a more sponsored brand...
Talking about the tool's bigger orbit compared with the Flex, It will be a good argument to specify what kind of car are we working on.
Some bodyshops on my area, are actually using the Rupes BF 21, but for everyday cars and really fast works on big panels.
Personally, to work with that tool on contoured curves of a Porsche or Ferrari as my daily bread was till some weeks ago, was not the max I was dreaming...


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## B0DSKI (Nov 25, 2011)

Love my Bigfoot and as Paul says you can correct even the hardest paint with the correct pad choice, a microfibre pad simply works wonders and finishes down really well. Certainly better than a rotary. 

For a single stage polish with say a Rupes white pad and Menzerna PF2500 you'd be amazed at the correction possible whilst still getting great gloss and shine


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## Twenny Benson (Mar 22, 2011)

Also been tempted by the bigfoot for some time now, which microfiber pads are you guys using and what is the durability like on the Rupes machine?


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## sm81 (May 14, 2011)

Is flex 3401 vrg only forced DA?


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

sm81 said:


> Is flex 3401 vrg only forced DA?


Yep. What else did you think it was?


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## sm81 (May 14, 2011)

Rascal_69 said:


> Yep. What else did you think it was?


I mean that there isn't any others in the market?


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## Steampunk (Aug 11, 2011)

sm81 said:


> I mean that there isn't any others in the market?


Actually, there's also the Festool Rotex series, as well as the Makita BO6040 off the top of my head. All of them have smaller orbital throws than the Flex, though, and also have more limited backing plate sizes.

Hopefully this helps...

Steampunk


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

sm81 said:


> Is flex 3401 vrg only forced DA?


No there is a festool, makita and rupes forced machine also, and I'm sure others available also


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## Black.MB (Aug 22, 2012)

sm81 said:


> Is flex 3401 vrg only forced DA?


I'm not 100% sure, but I think *Makita BO6040* is a two mode machine: random orbital or random orbital with forced rotation.


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## wylie coyote (Jul 15, 2007)

Do you find the Bigfoot vibrates a lot at low speeds? I assume the smaller backing plate is the best for balance, vibration and correction for the non pro?:thumb:


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Thanks for everyone comments and opinions cheers.


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## GJM (Jul 19, 2009)

Miracle Detail said:


> Rupes LHR15 with microfibre pad and Zephir compound will correct far easier and quicker than rotary and produce more gloss.
> 
> I havent used a rotary for over a year now, there is no need if you know how to use the bigfoot correctly.
> 
> ...


Which pad are you recommending?

Must say not overly blown away by the bigfoot, surprised you find it that smooth using it for prolonged periods, yes it's at it's smoothest when flat out but still feel it over time.

I know dust is something that comes with the territory but do people not find it's a bit excessive even with serious spurring which is time consuming


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## GJM (Jul 19, 2009)

B0DSKI said:


> For a single stage polish with say a Rupes white pad and Menzerna PF2500 you'd be amazed at the correction possible whilst still getting great gloss and shine


So use for my old 203s you think then, on what paint are you pitching that at with success, pretty soft?

Any other pads recommendation for the LHR15 see if my opinion improves on it?


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## B0DSKI (Nov 25, 2011)

GJM said:


> So use for my old 203s you think then, on what paint are you pitching that at with success, pretty soft?
> 
> Any other pads recommendation for the LHR15 see if my opinion improves on it?


Not really no. These two were both done with the Rupes, single stage with Menzerna PF2500


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

As far as the rupes goes, since it has a bigger throw or orbit size than the das6 does
it more vibration?


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Will be breaking out my 15 kit inabit. Will let you know what I think. 

First time using a Bigfoot


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## GJM (Jul 19, 2009)

B0DSKI said:


> Not really no. These two were both done with the Rupes, single stage with Menzerna PF2500


Is PF2500 not the new name for the old 203s?

When you mentioned using a microfibre pad on harder paints what combo have you tried and tested?


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## Dummer (Jul 28, 2008)

how does the rotex from festool compare to the two?

Is BF not a forced DA?


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## B0DSKI (Nov 25, 2011)

GJM said:


> Is PF2500 not the new name for the old 203s?
> 
> When you mentioned using a microfibre pad on harder paints what combo have you tried and tested?


Yeah it is

I've used Flexipads, Chemical guys and Maguiars microfibre pads, all with either PF2500 or FF3000.

To be honest I've not found I've needed to resort to a microfibre pad with the Rupes on too many occasions, even that Vantage which was VERY poor didn't need one to correct and enhance.

I'd class the Vantage paint as medium/hard. All that I used on that was a Rupes yellow pad and PF2500. It simply didn't require a more aggressive combo to work.

This is what it looked like when it arrived.







Don't be scared that a Rupes won't do the job because it will. I don't care what paint you have to work on it will simply do it


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Dummer said:


> how does the rotex from festool compare to the two?
> 
> Is BF not a forced DA?


Rotex is a great machine, really is. BF is just a standard da with a big throw, not forced rotation


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

How is the festool rotex compare to the flex 3401?


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

diesel x said:


> How is the festool rotex compare to the flex 3401?


It resembles a standard da in use and feel, but has the added bonus of being switchable from non forced to forced. Its an expensive tool but feels refined for a da and is quality through and through


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

stangalang said:


> It resembles a standard da in use and feel, but has the added bonus of being switchable from non forced to forced. Its an expensive tool but feels refined for a da and is quality through and through


 Thanks for the quick reply.


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Really impressed with the Bigfoot yesterday.


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Rascal_69 said:


> Really impressed with the Bigfoot yesterday.


 Does it have any more vibration than the das6 since the orbit size is bigger?


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

diesel x said:


> Does it have any more vibration than the das6 since the orbit size is bigger?


Less vibration.

And at 4-6 its really smooth


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## diesel x (Jul 27, 2013)

Rascal_69 said:


> Less vibration.
> 
> And at 4-6 its really smooth


 I read that it's smooth at full speed or highest speed setting and vibration is at its worst the lowest the setting gets.


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## B0DSKI (Nov 25, 2011)

A lot smoother than my DAS6 Pro IMO


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## GJM (Jul 19, 2009)

Rascal_69 said:


> Less vibration.
> 
> And at 4-6 its really smooth


Compared to an old school DA I would have to agree 100%

But in relation to other machines out there I don't think it's that smooth and I feel it with not even prolonged use in comparison to a rotary.


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Its a hell lot smoother than my vrg 3401. 

For a dual action its really smooth. 

Tbh i find it a joy to use. Great machine.


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## GLN (Mar 26, 2011)

Has anyone been using the 5" backing plate on the 21 yet? still not 100% sure how the warranty stands doing this but It sure would make the machine more versatile 

Can't make my mind up if I'm going to do this or just buy the 15


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

GLN said:


> Has anyone been using the 5" backing plate on the 21 yet? still not 100% sure how the warranty stands doing this but It sure would make the machine more versatile
> 
> Can't make my mind up if I'm going to do this or just buy the 15


Just bought the 15 to save the hassle just incase something goes wrong. 
It's an expensive mistake if something goes wrong and they refuse to fix it

Infact am using the full rupes system. Pads and polish too. Find it all great.

Wish I got one sooner. The finish it leaves is amazing.


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## GLN (Mar 26, 2011)

Thanks mate :thumb:

Think im gonna do the same aswell I've got the vrg 3401 aswell if I need to work on big panels

Just looking to buy the rupes since it's smoother


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

It doesn't like tight curves or areas. 

Just need them to release the smaller one and it will be all you need for detailing.


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## Rascal_69 (Sep 20, 2009)

Yellow pad. Yellow polish. Spread at 5. Cut at 5. Refined at 3.

One thing takes time to get used to is start up. There's no soft start.

Hit the button and it just makes a little noise and it on lol.


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## GLN (Mar 26, 2011)

Would you say it's just as noisy as the flex?


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## GJM (Jul 19, 2009)

Rascal_69 said:


> Its a hell lot smoother than my vrg 3401.
> 
> For a dual action its really smooth.
> 
> Tbh i find it a joy to use. Great machine.


Never used a 3401 and yes for a DA compared to Megs etc, its very smooth.

Was comparisons in relation to rotaries that I read and now after using one I dont really agree with, I could use a Makita for a lot long than a Bigfoot that's for sure


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## mb1 (Oct 5, 2016)

I can.t see swissvax uk on miracle detail


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## uberbmw (Jan 31, 2006)

mb1 said:


> I can.t see swissvax uk on miracle detail


2013 thread:doublesho

https://miracledetail.co.uk/car-detailing-services/swissvax-how-to-video/


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## mb1 (Oct 5, 2016)

I mean www.Swissvax.co.uk


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## mb1 (Oct 5, 2016)

I mean www Swissvax.co.uk


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