# Not Too Happy With Ford!! Re the ST Fiesta.



## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Back in October/November when I was about to order the Fiesta ST2 as I had heard a few rumours I asked salesmen at various dealers whether an ST3 would appear & was told NO. Fair enough as they can only pass on info they receive from the manufacturer. On speccing up a car I also asked if rear parking sensors could be ordered but no.

Before ordering I then contacted Ford CRC & asked if there was going to be a Fiesta ST3 or RS & was told definitely NOT. I also asked if I was to order an ST2 can I have rear parking sensors as on other Fiesta models? I was told no for this too.
I am now somewhat annoyed as I ordered an ST2 with every option bar one & I now know you can order an ST3 which includes all those options bar metallic paint & rear centre head rest. To add to this you can also have factory fitted rear park sensors.
I feel I have been lied to or mislead by Ford UK as I specifically asked those questions as I wanted the top model & ordered the 2 as they said NO 3.

Whilst it may not on the surface really matter but it will when I come to sell/PX it in 2 years as the residual value will be on an ST2 & pretty much kiss goodbye to the money I paid out on options whereas the ST3's residual will be based on the list price of that car which has all the options I have paid extra for.

I have complained to Ford UK by phone & they said they would call the dealer. I said the dealer has done nothing wrong as they sold only the product listed but typical manufacturer phone up the dealer & says the customer feels you (Dealer) has lied/mislead him on the spec of the car. I found that to be true when The business manager rang me this afternoon but at least I could put his mind at rest as there was & is nothing he/they could do.

My gripe as I said to the woman from Ford CRC earlier today was with Ford UK as they were the ones that told me I couldn't have an ST3 (or park sensors). To the credit of the dealer he said that if I was really annoyed I could cancel the car & have a full refund even though the reg plates were put on it yesterday & if I wanted then re order an ST3. I said I won't do that as they are not the problem

She said if you don't get a resolution from the dealer then call us back to see what we can do so I said I will likely be on the phone in the morning as the dealer is not at fault. I will be on the phone in the morning. To be fair I think Ford should offer something to counteract the residual difference when I come to sell?


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Maybe 4/5 months ago there wasn't any plans for an ST3. 

Things change and they might have reacted to the market and demand. 

I can't see you getting any success, although I can see where you are coming from. Details might have been correct at time of sale or they would have sold you an ST3.


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## tommyzooom (Aug 15, 2009)

I'd definitely cancel, and get the car you really want. The dealer will always sell it on, and will happily take your new order. They can complain to ford UK, and will probably get a discount on your old/next ST


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## slineclean (Dec 23, 2011)

I can understand you not wanting to blame your dealer and its Ford you not happy with , but if they have offered to cancel your order? I would of snapped his hands. You wont get nothing out of Ford and the most you get is to be able to feel you stuck up for yourself and kicked up a fuss but you will soon be forgotton about.


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Thanks guys, not sure what to do if Ford do nout which will likely be the case as the other issue is another 3 Month wait. 
The strange thing is that the ST3 which includes the options I have or will be paying for on my ST2 actually works out dearer than ordering an ST2 & adding the bits. I can't for the life of me work that one out! Should be cheaper as you are buying a specific package/bundle. 

All really boils down to the residual value & whether it will be better for me to get the ST3? I will ask the dealer business manager for his advice in the morning.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Residual value won't be much better on the st3, yes it might be a bit more but less than £500. I don't think you can really blame the dealer or ford customer service for them not telling you a st3 was on its way, people that deal with the public are always the last to know.
If you are happy with the st2 then just accept it and wait for it, grumble a little and see if you can get a free service although in reality they owe you nothing. As for parking sensors on a fiesta ......


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## eddie bullit (Nov 23, 2007)

You seem unhappy with the ST2 but now you have the option to have the car you think you want you're talking yourself out of it. Business manager isn't exactly the best place for impartial advice either. 
If you want the ST3 then re order and wait. I don't think second hand values will be that different tbh. If you do reorder at least you'll get your new car when all the ****e weather has passed.
good luck


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## Keir (Aug 31, 2010)

You clearly want an ST3 so cancel and order that instead.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Just get an ST3 if you really want it.


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## suspal (Dec 29, 2011)

The balls in your court,it's a no brainer really


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

People don't realise that dealers are franchises and Ford UK are just a distribution network, they're not 'Ford' as such and have no design input etc.

Surely the ST3 comes with something unique? Seats?


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## danwel (Feb 18, 2007)

Accept the offer to cancel and re order the ST3 simplez


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

IMO cancel the order.

I was in a similar situation back in August and wish I had the opportunity to cancel. I ordered my new Jaguar XF Sport in August and at the time I was torn between the Sport and the Premium Luxury. The Sport only came with a 2.2.d (200) engine and the PL was available with the 2.2, the 3.0 V6 (single turbo) and the 3.0 V6 (twin turbo) engines. I wanted to go for the 3.0 (single turbo) engine but extra cost of the PL was far greater than the Sport with the options I wanted. The 3.0 just didn't justify the extra £6-7k. So I ordered the 2.2d Sport. Litterally a few weeks later the R Sport came out and was available with the 2.2 (163 & 200) as well as the 3.0 V6. It was also available with adaptive dynamic suspension if you went for the 3.0 V6. The extra cost was £1500 and was well worth it. Too late to cancel by then as my car had already been made and was awaiting it's final checks before being sent to the dealer.


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## MEH4N (Mar 15, 2012)

Cancel the order and buy the ST3, you know you really want to do it so just do it.


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## daydotz (May 15, 2011)

I'm surprised it's taken ford so long to offer parking sensors on the ST


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## GNshaving (Feb 13, 2014)

As said go for the ST3


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

What extras does the ST3 get ?, i cant find info on it.


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

STD anyone?


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

ardandy said:


> STD anyone?


:lol: No thanks!! I've had one!!


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Didn't the op say the st3 was more expensive than the st2 with all the extras though ?


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## Nick-ST (Mar 4, 2013)

Where is the confirmation of an ST3? I cant find any info on it?


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

If you really want the 3 and the dealers offering to cancel id go for it


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## tommyzooom (Aug 15, 2009)

And get them to price match the 3 to the 2 for the inconvenience


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## woodys (Dec 20, 2010)

Bit off topic but tried to order a new Ford Ranger with a local dealer 7 weeks ago. Told the salesman what I wanted from the accessories list could he do a price so I'd done all the legwork from the configuration tool on the Ford site, and also could I have a go in the demonstrator, when it was convenient for him. Went in after a week to remind him, to be told sorry not forgotten you been very busy with new car orders. Never heard from the guy so presume Ford salesmen are on wages not commission as the local Toyota and Mitsubishi dealers were able to price up and offer a test drive within 15 minutes of asking for the information.Fords loss.


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## redit5 (Dec 16, 2013)

Sorry to chime in but I think you should cancel the 2 and get the ST3. It will be the top model trim wise and so always more desirable, even if not worth that much more, it will be more desirable in the marketplace and so easier to sell. I am biased, having owned an Focus ST3 though! (But they are the only model to wear leather and so it was perhaps easier!)

Seriously though sounds like you want the ST3 to most of us so - go get it and enjoy!


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

A mate of mines after an st focus and wont even look at 2's only 3's due to leather and xenons . I think the 3 will sell easier in the future but only if it is much better specced


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Well I was literally passing the dealer this afternoon so popped in & spoke to the Sales Manager/Business Manager & I believe the other guy in the office was the finance manager. I told them that I had rang back Ford CRC this morning & this time spoke to a guy who really got my back up to be fair - just going round in circles, he said that CRC staff did not know what was or was not in the pipeline & any vehicle price & spec enquiries are suggested to visit a showroom. My reply to this was I know this 100% but the CRC staff member went to a Ford internal dept called "Brand" whom by the title suggests to me that they are in charge of the products so should know what is or is not coming.
It was suggested by the sales manager that & I have thought this that Ford probably get dozens of calls from undercover reporters trying to get info on forthcoming cars & therefore everyone gets told the same. If this is the case then perhaps a reply like "We can't comment on any forthcoming models for whatever reason" would have been better & more friendly than a blunt No ST3 or RS (or parking sensors).

Apparently spec is NOT shown yet on the Ford website but I was told the spec of the ST3 (over the standard ST2). Pretty sure this is correct :-

* ST Convenience Pack.
* Auto Wipers/Lights & Auto Dip Rear View Mirror.
* Cruise Control.
* EATC (climate aircon).
* Sony Navigation/DAB etc.

Currently ST Style Pack is still FOC on all ST's.

Now I have ordered all the above options plus the Molten Orange special paint, Spare Wheel, Rear Centre Head Rest - these are still optional on ST3.

ST3 does not (so I believe) have leather seats like Focus ST3 or any other option that is not available on ST1 or 2 like Xenons. Rear Park Distance Sensors are as of now an option on ST2 & 3.

So apart from the loadspace floor option my ST2 is fully specced

Apparently the reason the ST3 worked out yesterday slightly more (about £300) than my ST2 with the equivalent options is because my dealer gave me "Dealer Wholesale" discount on those options which is a higher discount that can be applied to a whole car from list price (learn something every day). They did say that they would match any discounts on a new ST3 that I have on my ST2. We also had a chat about residials in 2 years time but they don't have yet the GMFV of the 3 yet but the difference between an ST1 & 2 is £600 so we guess about the same between 2 & 3. The sales manager said to me when he goes to auction he always buys the cars & pays more for ones with sat nav & the other options on mine will make some difference. General concensous of opinion is that overall there will probably only be around £500+ difference between my car & an standard ST3 after 2 years.

After the conversation with the bod at Ford CRC this morning I felt like just cancelling the order to say stuff it as a snub to the brand & simply not buy anything but as I said in the office at the dealer today they have been so helpful, generous etc that I feel if I do this & walk away that I have taken the ***s. Then there is the fact that my lovely new car is sitting there ready for me to prep next Thursday (day after my Birthday lol) for new March 1st Reg & starting the order process all over again so I have decided after the office talk today to stick with my ST2. Pretty sure they will look after me when I P/X it as they know how I look after my cars!! It was never a case of me not liking the ST2 it was the principle of what I was told by Ford themselves that made me angry.

All I really want from Ford given the initial complaint is some sort of recompense to alleviate the difference in residual & that's that.



Re Parking sensors on a Fiesta = Yes I know they aren't really needed but I like these extras as they give the car (IMO) a more expensive look.

As I am having the grey plastic inserts in the front & rear bumpers painted Gloss black so they have to remove the rear only bumper they are probably going to do me a very good price to fit the dealer fit X-Vision sensor kit. They are also fitting the gloss black front splitter for me!


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

As long as your happy, I'm sure were happy!! :thumb:


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

£16869 for an ST3 with paint and reverse sensors I can find it for.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

If ford have upset you then why not consider the competition as they are just as good if not better, there is the Peugeot 208 GTI which is their best car in years, has a more upmarket cabin and a strong fast engine. Then there is also the Clio RS which is fast and long been king of it's class. they are well worth a look.:thumb:


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Soul boy 68 said:


> If ford have upset you then why not consider the competition as they are just as good if not better, there is the Peugeot 208 GTI which is their best car in years, has a more upmarket cabin and a strong fast engine. Then there is also the Clio RS which is fast and long been king of it's class. they are well worth a look.:thumb:


Because the Fiesta is a better car.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Puntoboy said:


> Because the Fiesta is a better car.


how do you know for sure? did you test drive the other two?:car:


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Soul boy 68 said:


> how do you know for sure? did you test drive the other two?:car:


Nope, but a lot of people have and all agreed the Fiesta is better.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Soul boy 68 said:


> If ford have upset you then why not consider the competition as they are just as good if not better, there is the Peugeot 208 GTI which is their best car in years, has a more upmarket cabin and a strong fast engine. Then there is also the Clio RS which is fast and long been king of it's class. they are well worth a look.:thumb:


Fiesta for me out of those.

To the OP have you tried a different dealer, i would have thought there would be some in stock somewhere ?


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Puntoboy said:


> Nope, but a lot of people have any all agreed the Fiesta is better.


That's peoples opinions only, if I was you it won't cost you anything to test drive these cars and you just might be surprised


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Soul boy 68 said:


> That's peoples opinions only, if I was you it won't cost you anything to test drive these cars and you just might be surprised


Having never liked French cars, I doubt it. They'd have to be far, far better than the Fiesta.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Puntoboy said:


> Having never liked French cars, I doubt it. They'd have to be far, far better than the Fiesta.


why didn't you say you don't like French cars then, i could have saved time typing my replies out:lol: How about the Mini JCW or Fiat 500 Abarth or evan the Skoda Fabia VRS, so there is still more alternatives:car:


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Having owned a Fabia vRS I'd go for the Fiesta!


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Soul boy 68 said:


> why didn't you say you don't like French cars then, i could have saved time typing my replies out:lol: How about the Mini JCW or Fiat 500 Abarth or evan the Skoda Fabia VRS, so there is still more alternatives:car:


Because I shouldn't need to  All the reviews should speak for themselves.

We recently ordered a 500 Abarth for my Mrs.


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## LeadFarmer (Feb 23, 2011)

Rid yourself of any guilt/emotions towards the dealer, they may not have done anything wrong but so what! Cancel the order and go with the ST3. The dealer will move your ST2 on easily, so don't feel sorry for them. Take them up on their offer and order the ST3, then *you* will have the car that *you* wanted.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Soul boy 68 said:


> why didn't you say you don't like French cars then, i could have saved time typing my replies out:lol: How about the Mini JCW or Fiat 500 Abarth or evan the Skoda Fabia VRS, so there is still more alternatives:car:


Hes not expressed an interest in other cars yet though, if he does we can discuss, we don't want it turning into a VAG thread do we :thumb:


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## Starbuck88 (Nov 12, 2013)

Puntoboy said:


> Having never liked French cars, I doubt it. They'd have to be far, far better than the Fiesta.


Can I ask....why do you not like French cars?

I've personally never liked Fords, the ones my parents owned were OK when they were running but all ended up being moved on until they decided to try Peugeot and they stuck with them ever since.

I had a Ford Focus MK1 given to me and I liked it up until it decided to drop all the bottom end of the engine...

I have driven the new Fiesta a few times and I do like it but the 208 is a real contender as that is great to drive and definitely a step up in build quality from the 207.

I never like SEATs either until I got my Seat Exeo in November...(suppose it is an actual Audi though underneath unlike the other SEATs)...

*EDIT:*



Shaun said:


> Hes not expressed an interest in other cars yet though, if he does we can discuss, we don't want it turning into a VAG thread do we :thumb:


Sorry, I must have been writing my reply whilst you posted that.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Shaun said:


> Hes not expressed an interest in other cars yet though, if he does we can discuss, we don't want it turning into a VAG thread do we :thumb:


OHH YEH!:doublesho Skoda is part of VAG, still there is Fiat, and BMW then.:thumb:


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Soul boy 68 said:


> OHH YEH!:doublesho Skoda is part of VAG, still there is Fiat, and BMW then.:thumb:


I mean the thread being derailed and other brands being added when its not been asked for etc :thumb:


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## Mr T (Dec 1, 2013)

Mate just cancel the order. Mum always told me don't pay for something your not happy with. 

T


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Shaun said:


> I mean the thread being derailed and other brands being added when its not been asked for etc :thumb:


It's just a thought, if someone is not happy with a company then it's worth checking out other makes aswell. what about if the fiesta never existed, he might aswell take the bus:lol:


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Mr T said:


> Mate just cancel the order. Mum always told me don't pay for something your not happy with.
> 
> T


Listen to mums.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Soul boy 68 said:


> It's just a thought, if someone is not happy with a company then it's worth checking out other makes aswell. what about if the fiesta never existed, he might aswell take the bus:lol:


Just trying to be fair, if the OP wants to talk other brands then go for it, let see what he says though.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Shaun said:


> Just trying to be fair, if the OP wants to talk other brands then go for it, let see what he says though.


Sounds good too me, hopefully the OP will look at other cars then we chat about them:thumb:


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Anyone got a link to a ST3 fiesta ?


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

Andy has made a deal for the Fiesta. 

The chat isn't car chat and what alternatives to make a discussion. I like taking cars, but most folk understood what was going on. 

All he is asking is more to do with financial side and the morals of Ford. 

We're on to plan C before plan A has been dealt with.


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Puntoboy said:


> Having never liked French cars, I doubt it. They'd have to be far, far better than the Fiesta.


I also have a lifelong hate for French cars. Mini - yes would be nice as it is still partly British but got the BMW options list disease plus the dealer never bothered ringing me back after discussing spec etc, Fabia RS did look at but the cabin & spec was poor, Polo GTi - VW dealer/s were hopeless as couldn't even find a demo in the country & their knowledge of the GTi was limited, one even saying GTi - we don't have one of those no one buys them & I have heard bad things about the DSG box then to add you never see one so that must say something.
I have never been interested in buying a new Ford in my life, had a Mk2 Escort 1.3GL back in 1983 for a year + * was other than rust a good car then had a Cortina 2.0 Ghia for a few weeks & hated it then since then Ford IMO have just been too supermarket.

I don't need the Fiesta or anything else to be fair I just got wowed by the ST & said I would have one as a plaything really. I only looked at some of the others to compare price & spec etc then decided to go for Fiesta ST & break the mould & get a new Ford which made my family shreak as they never expected me to say that lol.
I have no issue with the ST2 it is only the difference in depreciation to the ST3 that is my concern to be fair.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

Kerr said:


> Andy has made a deal for the Fiesta.
> 
> The chat isn't car chat and what alternatives to make a discussion. I like taking cars, but most folk understood what was going on.
> 
> ...


fraud have no morals:devil:


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## D.Taylor R26 (Feb 5, 2012)

Have you considered the fact are also likely not being truthful about the production of a fiesta rs? Consider what that could do to the resale value of the current ST. 

From what ive heard from ford personally it seems like a strong possibility due to the sucess of the mk7 ST. 

Dave


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Free service package? Prob worth several hundred.


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## SteveyG (Apr 1, 2007)

Soul boy 68 said:


> fraud have no morals:devil:


It's Ford not 'Fraud'.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

SteveyG said:


> It's Ford not 'Fraud'.


:doublesho YOUR BACK!!


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Tbh if its ready and you want it take the 2 . Its cheaper, the difference when you come to sell will prob be the difference you pay now anyway . If they are charging fir the gloss black bits see if they will throw them in . As for walking away i wouldn't feel guilty its a business , and that car will sell easily if you don't take it


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

craigeh123 said:


> Tbh if its ready and you want it take the 2 . Its cheaper, the difference when you come to sell will prob be the difference you pay now anyway . If they are charging fir the gloss black bits see if they will throw them in . As for walking away i wouldn't feel guilty its a business , and that car will sell easily if you don't take it


I think given the conversation yesterday the overall cost difference won't be that much. I may just call them for an exact price.


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

How much are you paying for the ST2 & 3 in total?


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

D.Taylor R26 said:


> Have you considered the fact are also likely not being truthful about the production of a fiesta rs? Consider what that could do to the resale value of the current ST.
> 
> From what ive heard from ford personally it seems like a strong possibility due to the sucess of the mk7 ST.
> 
> Dave


Very true, hot cars seem to be making a bit of a comeback and i think Ford have been waiting for the right time to do a fiesta RS.


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

On road price for my ST2 including every option in the previous post is £18,615. They are making a loss on that I have been reliably told but extra throughput means a higher overall dealer discount from Ford if they meet a certain target.
Still waiting for the ST3 price with same spec.


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Making a loss my ring piece !


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Did you see the deal i posted for st2 the other day 13k but the catch was you had to be millitary . If they can sell them for 13kni doubt very much there's a loss at over 18


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

craigeh123 said:


> Making a loss my ring piece !


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Starbuck88 (Nov 12, 2013)

When I was selling cars at Citroen...

For a new car, the standard margin began at 4%....on a 12k car that's only about £500.

The money for the Dealerships when it's all weighed up is through the Dealer Bonus. Sell so many of this model and we'll give you 8% off all your sales for that month, plus an extra 5% as a bonus etc etc...

It's difficult for a dealer as sometimes they try and make deals to make the bonuses so lose money and then the gamble doesn't pay off. Happened to our useless sales manager a few times


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

DTD are selling a new ST3 with paint and reverse sensors for £16,800 ish. 

Doesn't sound like a good deal to me?


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

asonda said:


> When I was selling cars at Citroen...
> 
> For a new car, the standard margin began at 4%....on a 12k car that's only about £500.
> 
> ...


Did you get out of the car sales game completely ?

To the op, forget residuals you cannot predict what they will be, you will only pay more in interest - assuming you are borrowing that may negate any savings. If depreciation bothers you go and buy a used st.


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

craigeh123 said:


> Did you see the deal i posted for st2 the other day 13k but the catch was you had to be millitary . If they can sell them for 13kni doubt very much there's a loss at over 18


That's called TAX which isn't margin.

If there is any dealer finance involved it would also mean you're fine to go below cost on the vehicle. Car dealers make far more on finance than they do on selling cars.

You can also put some protection around residuals by doing a PCP with a GFMV.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

True, we complain about the price cars and forget about VAT, i just had a car quote and vat came to £5,081.23 !!!!


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

I just Googled Fiesta RS, kicked up some "interesting" pictures!!


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

At £16800 its a bargain for what you get v


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

craigeh123 said:


> Did you see the deal i posted for st2 the other day 13k but the catch was you had to be millitary . If they can sell them for 13kni doubt very much there's a loss at over 18


It was Military - I rang them up.

A development today - - Got a call from Ford UK, I guess a supervisor/manager. She said I/we would like to resolve the issue & how can we do this? I said either a direct swap an ST3 for mine asap given they don't start building them till March 4th or some recompense on my current car for the depreciation difference.
She said she will call me tomorrow!


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

Shame you don't have a relative that works for Ford, My ol dear is 84 and to this day she can get a very good "staff" discount on new cars, in her retirement package, my problem is, I cant take advantage of it again as I'm skint!!


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Do you know anyone in the millitary !


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

craigeh123 said:


> Do you know anyone in the millitary !


If it's tax free there are a number of conditions... they must be based abroad and exporting the car for a start... There are also numerous conditions for the additional discounts where you're not buying tax free. Generally the forces deals aren't particularly easy to pass on to a mate.



> Military and Diplomatic Tax Free Sales
> You can buy a vehicle free of UK VAT if you are:
> a full time serving member of HM Forces or the Diplomatic Service posted overseas, and are taking the vehicle with you
> a foreign national on posting to the UK as a member of the Visiting Forces or the Diplomatic Service
> ...


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Nanoman said:


> If it's tax free there are a number of conditions... they must be based abroad and exporting the car for a start... There are also numerous conditions for the additional discounts where you're not buying tax free. Generally the forces deals aren't particularly easy to pass on to a mate.


He wasn't talking about it being tax free, he was talking about an offer a dealer had for military personnel only.


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

Puntoboy said:


> He wasn't talking about it being tax free, he was talking about an offer a dealer had for military personnel only.


And if you read the bit you quoted you'll see I mentioned that there are numerous conditions where you're not buying tax free and they're not particularly easy to pass on to a mate.


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## Puntoboy (Jun 30, 2007)

Who actually said it's tax free?


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

Puntoboy said:


> Who actually said it's tax free?


Ford do two options for military. One is tax free, the other is not particularly better than what can be had with a little effort.

No-one said it is tax free. I said whether it's tax free or not it's difficult to pass on to a mate either way.

What's your point? Not sure this is adding to the thread in any way.


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Why are you still going forward with the sale? Its about £1500 dearer than elsewhere?

Cancel it and re-order.


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## R14CKE (Aug 10, 2012)

Tax free is for overseas based military ie Germany


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

R14CKE said:


> Tax free is for overseas based military ie Germany


That's what I said..


Nanoman said:


> I*f it's tax free there are a number of conditions... they must be based abroad and exporting the car for a start...* There are also numerous conditions for the additional discounts where you're not buying tax free. Generally the forces deals aren't particularly easy to pass on to a mate.





> Military and Diplomatic Tax Free Sales
> *You can buy a vehicle free of UK VAT if you are:
> a full time serving member of HM Forces or the Diplomatic Service posted overseas, and are taking the vehicle with you*
> a foreign national on posting to the UK as a member of the Visiting Forces or the Diplomatic Service
> ...


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Loads of clauses , but nice to see the military getting a good deal . Also as said that deal you've got us expensive tbh id be getting some other quotes together and using them and the fact your not happy to get it at a better price


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## R14CKE (Aug 10, 2012)

Nanoman said:


> That's what I said..


I didn't read every post but I have taken advantage off it in the past being German based years ago.


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## eddie bullit (Nov 23, 2007)

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.662115947153788.1073741829.508350439197007&type=3

details of the ST3..looks like it has leather seats which the OP was told wasn't included.
If so I'd cancel and re-order.


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

To be honest if it were me and I accepted the ST2 every time I got into it or saw an ST3 I'd kick myself!!


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Pretty sure the ST3 seats are the same as the ST2 as there is no info in the dealers to say otherwise & to be fair I prefer half leather providing the fabric half is decent which in this case it is. Either way I am staying with my ST2 now, the car is there, it's lovely & the 3 will be identical to mine except the log book etc. The sales manager says he always pays extra for cars with satnav etc so I will remind him when the time comes lol.

Ford themselves have said they are going to send me some goodwill vouchers that can be used in the dealer for anything. Will find out the amount on Tuesday.


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## eddie bullit (Nov 23, 2007)

Great stuff! As long as you're happy that's the main thing.
Enjoy your new motor!
Quite fancy a look at one of these myself:car:any plans to Mountune it?


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## milner3226 (Apr 14, 2011)

Ive stole these pictures off the STOC website. Hope this clears up the differences between the ST2&3 for everyone.


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## Rob_Quads (Jul 17, 2006)

i would just cancel and order the car you you want i.e. the ST3

As for the whole argument about not being told about the ST-3. Until its officially announced you can't expect anything else even from the brand department.


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

eddie bullit said:


> Great stuff! As long as you're happy that's the main thing.
> Enjoy your new motor!
> Quite fancy a look at one of these myself:car:any plans to Mountune it?


Thanks, really looking forward now, dealer is painting the grey bumper inserts gloss black for me & fitting the front splitter that I'm getting. I am doing the prep on Thursday at the dealer & will probably use Gteqnik C1 after going round with clay then the P1.

RE Mountune, not sure though probably not as I was impressed with the car I drove that was standard kit & to be fair £600 is a too expensive. If it were half that then yes!


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

andystevens said:


> Thanks, really looking forward now, dealer is painting the grey bumper inserts gloss black for me & fitting the front splitter that I'm getting. I am doing the prep on Thursday at the dealer & will probably use Gteqnik C1 after going round with clay then the P1.
> 
> RE Mountune, not sure though probably not as I was impressed with the car I drove that was standard kit & to be fair £600 is a too expensive. If it were half that then yes!


£600 isn't too bad considering you also keep the warranty.

Remap it elsewhere for half the cost and if something does go wrong, Ford would be entitled to tell you to go away.

I think a Mountune pack would make the car more desirable and should see a big part of the £600 back at resale time.


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## andystevens (Dec 12, 2011)

Kerr said:


> £600 isn't too bad considering you also keep the warranty.
> 
> Remap it elsewhere for half the cost and if something does go wrong, Ford would be entitled to tell you to go away.
> 
> I think a Mountune pack would make the car more desirable and should see a big part of the £600 back at resale time.


Yes I understand what you mean & there is no way I would go aftermarket. If I do it it would only be Mountune. Heard mixed comments from some dealers in as much as some say yes you will get more & some not. My view was before I had asked this question was that you would probably get less as one would assume if it has a performance upgrade then the cart has likely been thrashed? 
Will decide at some point. If it was my only car then I likely would but got to be sensible with funds lol.


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