# eating 2500 - 3000 cals a day



## rob warrington (Jan 4, 2012)

Hi all. I've been weight training now for some time, however I've never really taken much notice of calories , I have a big appetite and I thought I ate a lot however when I use any of the calorie counting type apps I seem to really struggle to eat the amount of calories I need to a day. I have a fairly active job and go the gym 3 to 4 times a week, weight training usually. Yet when I add up my calories it appears I'm only getting around 1800 a day yet every app or site I've used says to just maintain I need around 3000 ?? 
I ( like most of us ) am so busy in work I just wouldn't have time to keep stopping to eat ha I'm trying to eat clean also. I'll list my diet 

Porridge oats with large banana and tea spoon honey, protein shake with milk

Snacks during the day 4 Scottish oat cakes with peanut butter usually 2 apples

Lunch either 3 egg omelette with Turkey or salad box with chicken

Dinner chicken breast sweet potato or brown rice veg

After gym protein shake and a little later cottage cheese or similar small snack. 
Maybe I should start trying to drink lots of milk , I just seem to struggle to get the calories I need to without eating burgers and rubbish. Any ideas guys thanks


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## Alfieharley1 (Jun 8, 2014)

A easy option is with your protein shake is also to add powdered oats from somewhere like my protein / go nutrition. I also use whole milk blue. A pint also at night. With this you do then need to keep a eye on Fat & Carbs. 
Your lunch sounds great however calorie wise they won't be that much so try and add something extra into this.


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## rob warrington (Jan 4, 2012)

Thanks for that. I'm one of them slim guys but I have a tendency to have belly fat . Which is so annoying when I eat next to no sugar or fatty foods , I did gain a bit or weight a while back when I was doing 5x5 stringlifts , great for my lifts but not so good for belly fat ha.


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## Alfieharley1 (Jun 8, 2014)

rob warrington said:


> Thanks for that. I'm one of them slim guys but I have a tendency to have belly fat . Which is so annoying when I eat next to no sugar or fatty foods , I did gain a bit or weight a while back when I was doing 5x5 stringlifts , great for my lifts but not so good for belly fat ha.


Sounds like me I took 2 years out of training been back 5 weeks current stats -
11st 4
13% BF
5ft 7.7

My ideal target is like 14stone with a BF of 7-8% but that is going to be a long road yet being Natty (I don't believe in steroids) 
My ideal physique is dwayne Johnson but who doesn't admire the guys physique.

I have done 5x5 for the first 4 weeks of returning and this week has been hit & miss with training use to bank holidays. Next week however it is game on and will be running a 6 week course of Dorian Yates Blood & Guts 4 days a week before doing a dwayne Johnson workout 5-6 days.


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## rob warrington (Jan 4, 2012)

Sounds good ha I've time off next week so will be hitting the gym hard also


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## Bazza85 (Mar 14, 2015)

Your diet is extremely close to mine when I'm training properly.
I also struggled to eat clean yet get enough calories going in. 
I ended up using USN anabolic mass. 

If a mass all in one type supplement isn't for you, fair enough. 

But for me, I took one shake after training (as its around 700calories depending on scoop size) and saw HUGE gains and results. 

As in, after a 6wk cycle my weight was up 1/2 a stone yet because it's not too full of sugars and crap, plus I had a good diet I was still visibly losing body fat as well as getting much bigger. 

As said mate, if you're wanting more diet based advice, fair enough. But I wanted to fill a top out nicely but due to work hours and young family commitments, this worked no end for me
(I train 1 body part per sesh and do 5 30min seshs a wk as have a gym at work)
Found the weight doesn't just drop off when you stop either which is nice.


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## rob warrington (Jan 4, 2012)

Thanks for advice buddy


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

Same problem as I had

Need to eat 3427 calories yet I struggle to eat 1500 so it's bloody hard work


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## rob warrington (Jan 4, 2012)

it's hard when your trying to eat clean isn't it.


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## Bod42 (Jun 4, 2009)

I just bought a big 5kg tub of carbs and then add them to my shakes when I need to increase my calories. Can also add flaxseed. Also use full fat milk and you can get your shakes up to 1000 calories each.

I find calories quite easy, just eat more, bigger portions.
Yeserday my lunch was as follows.
Chicken Breast with Skin 361g 711cals
Rice 250g 388cals
BBQ Sauce 182
Total 1,281 for lunch and who can say chicken and rice isnt healthy.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

i'm trying to stick to 2000cal a day and low carbs to loose fat hopefully targeting abs though i know it comes off everywhere cal isnt to difficult but the carbs is a right pain. So without sounding stupid you guys are eating high amounts to indeed gain muscle mass and bulk up?


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## Bazza85 (Mar 14, 2015)

I personally am mate. 
I'm 6ft and naturally about 13-13.5st. 
When I'm training I tend to hover around 14.5st but never seem to get over it
I'm quite fortunate that I have always got away with eating whatever due to a physical job, it's only the last yr or so I've began to make an effort to eat clean and calorie count. 

But yeah, I'd hate to try and give up carbs!!


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

alan hanson said:


> i'm trying to stick to 2000cal a day and low carbs to loose fat hopefully targeting abs though i know it comes off everywhere cal isnt to difficult but the carbs is a right pain. So without sounding stupid you guys are eating high amounts to indeed gain muscle mass and bulk up?


I have to eat a lot of cals to build lean mass according to the PT, I'm starting the 3000+ calories next week but it's gonna be hard work to get the carbs and protein right as wel as high cals lol

You need either enough carbs or none at all he said, otherwise you run the risk of burning muscle not fat as there are some carbs but not enough to burn so it'll turn to muscle not fat, whereas on 0 carbs then it'll burn fat but you'll have no energy at all so ive had to go for the right amount of carbs or I'll be ****ed at boxing


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## QPRsteve (Mar 4, 2013)

Could add in a egg white omelette later in the evening and a few rice cakes throughout the day


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## Leebo310 (Sep 30, 2013)

rob warrington said:


> Hi all. I've been weight training now for some time, however I've never really taken much notice of calories , I have a big appetite and I thought I ate a lot however when I use any of the calorie counting type apps I seem to really struggle to eat the amount of calories I need to a day. I have a fairly active job and go the gym 3 to 4 times a week, weight training usually. Yet when I add up my calories it appears I'm only getting around 1800 a day yet every app or site I've used says to just maintain I need around 3000 ??
> I ( like most of us ) am so busy in work I just wouldn't have time to keep stopping to eat ha I'm trying to eat clean also. I'll list my diet
> 
> Porridge oats with large banana and tea spoon honey, protein shake with milk
> ...


It looks a decent clean eating plan mate and again similar to what I have, although I also add in a pot of cottage cheese and pineapple in the morning and a wholemeal bagel with the lunch. 
I'm quite surprised that lot only works out to be 1800 calories to be honest mate although I suppose it depends on your portion size on your dinner. 
What is the protein/carb/fat split on that?


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

You don't need to avoid or limit carbs as a hard and fast rule. The most up to date advice is to get your protein to match your target lb weight, eg 180lb target = 180g protein. Fat around .25 per lb and the rest carbs which is dictated by your goal, be it losing weight or gaining.

Eg, I want to be 185lbs and I'm 200 now. Target protein is 185g per day. Fat target is 60g per day. On a 2000 cal limit, it leaves me with 180g of carbs. If you stick to it but don't lose any weight, either move more = cardio, or reduce carbs a little.

If you're after weight gain, as mentioned, the reverse applies.


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## Bod42 (Jun 4, 2009)

Yep, agree with horico, low carb was abit of a fad a few years ago and its still hanging around but the main thing is actually calories in vs calories out.



alan hanson said:


> i'm trying to stick to 2000cal a day and low carbs to loose fat hopefully targeting abs though i know it comes off everywhere cal isnt to difficult but the carbs is a right pain. So without sounding stupid you guys are eating high amounts to indeed gain muscle mass and bulk up?


The bigger you are the more calories you need as a rule. Im 110kgs so I eat 2500 calories on a diet, 3500 when Im on a slow bulk.


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## scottk7 (Jul 7, 2014)

try this to help calculate..

http://iifym.com/iifym-calculator/

I have to disagree with the above .25 of fat. I run at .45 per lbs. No reason to run lower as the above poster said calories in = calories out. Plus a gram of fat equals 9 calories so makes the calories easier to hit. i.e 1 avocado, 2 eggs and a spoon of olive oil has about 470 calories just off fats.

Instead of weight gainers just buy a unflavoured pure protein powder and blend in full fat milk, peanut butter, oats and a banana. Cheaper without the added sweetners/sugar.


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## Leebo310 (Sep 30, 2013)

horico said:


> You don't need to avoid or limit carbs as a hard and fast rule. The most up to date advice is to get your protein to match your target lb weight, eg 180lb target = 180g protein. Fat around .25 per lb and the rest carbs which is dictated by your goal, be it losing weight or gaining.
> 
> Eg, I want to be 185lbs and I'm 200 now. Target protein is 185g per day. Fat target is 60g per day. On a 2000 cal limit, it leaves me with 180g of carbs. If you stick to it but don't lose any weight, either move more = cardio, or reduce carbs a little.
> 
> If you're after weight gain, as mentioned, the reverse applies.


Cheers Horico, I have a couple of questions on that theory though if that's ok?

Firstly does that not depend on what your current and goal body fat percentage/lean muscle mass is rather than just goal weight?
If I'm 200lbs at 15% bf trying to get to 185lbs for example would I not need a different protein intake to someone who is 200lbs and 30% bf, trying to get to 185lbs even though the goal weight is the same? 
This flaw becomes even more evident if you look at an example of just simply maintaining a weight without taking into account bf/lmm%
To maintain 15% bf at 200lbs implies you have effectively 170lbs of "non-fat" yet 30% at 200 indicates only 140lbs so how can the "recommended" protein, fat, carb amounts and overall calorie intake be the same in order to keep that?

I'm also struggling to see how it is a straight forward as simply swapping the overall calories up/down depending on whether you want to increase or decrease weight as they are two totally different things. "Weight" isn't really the correct word to use for both of those. "Losing weight" would generally refer to fat, "gaining weight" generally refers to muscle. Yes I appreciate that it's impossible to purely loss/gain one or the other but you can limit this and surely you need different splits on the protein amounts at least to reflect those goals?

Finally basing intake purely on goal weight, would you not need to take into account the length of time that you want to get to that goal and then adjust as you go? For someone wanting to increase from 180lbs to 200lbs without a massive increase in bf, then that will take considerably longer than someone trying to cut down from 200 to 180.

Should your intakes not be based mainly on what you currently need, with the overall goal in mind rather than effectively ignoring your current weight/bf completely? And also it should take into account whether your training on that day too?? Intake on a non training day surely shouldn't be the same as a training day?

Apologies for the amount of questions, I may be over-thinking this obviously…


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## scottk7 (Jul 7, 2014)

Thats why you drop your calories say 200 off your TDEE for a couple of weeks, if your not loosing weight then drop another 100. Then once you stall you re-calculate your macros


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

Christ it gets confusing, it seems im pretty much the opposite to everyone whilst i want to mantain my muscle and not loose anymore weight i also want to loose fat around the stomach (cant target one area makes sense) im doing 4 runs a week, and then weights on alternate days some the same which i up my calorie and carb intake for those and rest days try and be extra careful.

TBh i dont know enough to get into alot of detail as i should, has no one got a magic wand?


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## RPC (May 11, 2014)

Large dominos pizza has over 2000 cals, i reckon i could easy make up to 3000 with breakfast and lunch


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

scottk7 said:


> try this to help calculate..
> 
> http://iifym.com/iifym-calculator/
> 
> ...


You're actually right, my numbers were a little off fat wise. A range between 0.4g - 0.7g per lb is what Alan Aragon recommends. If you've never heard of him, go do it - there aren't many better in the field that are in it purely for the science of it.



Leebo310 said:


> Cheers Horico, I have a couple of questions on that theory though if that's ok?
> 
> Firstly does that not depend on what your current and goal body fat percentage/lean muscle mass is rather than just goal weight?
> If I'm 200lbs at 15% bf trying to get to 185lbs for example would I not need a different protein intake to someone who is 200lbs and 30% bf, trying to get to 185lbs even though the goal weight is the same?
> ...


I understand your point and your thinking but you're actually over complicating things. As a rule, a more obese person (your 30%er) will need slightly less protein than your skinny person as when you reach much lower bf levels, protein requirements do go up when trying to maintain lean body mass. For the most of us though, we don't need to worry about that.

You mention weight being totally different to 'fat' and you're right. Total energy expenditure will dictate bodyweight while the macronutrients will dictate body composition. To grow more muscle, or maintain what's already there, resistance training is required.

There is a finite amount of muscle that you can build over time once initial newbie gains subside and simply throwing in more protein won't make a difference, that is, unless you invest in some steroids.

I've mentioned Alan Aragon above, also search for brad schoenfeld. If you like YouTube videos, I can recommend a few of those too!


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

quick question guys, on my work out days i eat slightly more carbs and cals plus protein, now ive started uping my runs so 3 days a week i run 7-8 miles a day this burns around 900 cals am i supposed to make that amount back up on food?


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

I would say see how you go depending on whether you're losing or gaining weight. To keep your lean mass, a steady 1-1.5lb a week is fine. Any more and you're going too quick if you want to keep as much lbm as possible.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

i'm definately losing weight shape is starting to change (guessing fat reduction) which to people keep asking your losing weight and not as big as you were. i'm easily more defined now but yes i have lost size with this does that make sense?


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

Yes, you will lose overall size but really, as said above, if the rate is right and youre doing weights you'll give yourself the best chance of retaining lbm. You'll be surprised how much 'smaller' you can get by reducing bf% although the end result is a bit of an illusion that you're actually bigger as the proportions are different.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

it does make sense and i guess i cant have th best of both worlds, i knew i would loose weight and that wa smy intentions guess i didnt think peeps would notice as much. the other main problem is times, i do the runs when its both cooler and quiet on the roads at a time when i'm finished at home spent time with the family etc..... so that usually maeans running at half quarter to 10 and finishing around half or just before, a shake when in but theres no time to eat?


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

It's what you eat over the entire day which is most important. It takes time for things to digest anyway. A shake after is fine and what would he considered a backstop to your nutrition But if everything else is good, the timing is only a personal thing, not something that will massively impact results overall.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

ok thank you my lack of knowledge worries me as i guess its easy to do exercise/strength and not get the full benefit of it quite easily depending on what else i do throughout the day and dont want to see my efforts go to waste  thanks again


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## Bod42 (Jun 4, 2009)

Again i agree with Horico. Its mostly about what you eat throughout the entire day.

As you see below nutrient timing is a small part of the battle.


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

is it bad to eat something that contains alot of carbs just before bed after a run if your trying to get the abs more showing etc...


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

alan hanson said:


> is it bad to eat something that contains alot of carbs just before bed after a run if your trying to get the abs more showing etc...


Yeah or so I'm told

I never eat carbs before bed


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

alan hanson said:


> is it bad to eat something that contains alot of carbs just before bed after a run if your trying to get the abs more showing etc...





Kimo73 said:


> Yeah or so I'm told
> 
> I never eat carbs before bed


It has no bearing whatsoever! Absolutely no need to avoid carbs at any time of the day. Even if you have no carbs all day, then loads immediately before bed.


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## Bod42 (Jun 4, 2009)

alan hanson said:


> is it bad to eat something that contains alot of carbs just before bed after a run if your trying to get the abs more showing etc...


Actually it has swung the opposite way now. They are advocating that carbs before bed is actually better for you. A few pros are eating ice cream right before bed. Personally I dont think it matters.


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## ST - Matt (Mar 27, 2015)

I wouldn't worry about carbs before bed I eat some literally 30 mins before and I'm cutting reason is I try and back load my carbs around my work out so they get used and don't have a chance to be stored as fat. 

If you need to eat 200g of carbs for example for you body to cut say then you need to eat them, I guess every one is difference but one thing is don't be scared of carbs you need them to gain, cut and maintain. Low or 0 carb diets work but you end up going catabolic and burning muscle for fuel, then when you get into starvation you body will store and carbs you consume.

I've just dropped from 4300 to 3000 over the last 4 weeks as I've gone from bulking to cutting for holiday, it's falling off nicely and gradually at 3000cals.

Best to experiment and find what you body needs every one is so different I have a friend who has to eat 5000+ just to gain and cuts on nearly 4000 it's crazy.


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## jbguitarking (Oct 5, 2011)

I was cutting on around 1800 and now im bulking at 3000, loving life now.

Also its worthwhile noting that you need to adjust your intake as you lose weight, I started cutting at 2300 but as you lose weight your body needs less energy to move it around so everytime you lose a few pounds/kgs you need to adjust your total caloric intake.


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## ST - Matt (Mar 27, 2015)

jbguitarking said:


> I was cutting on around 1800 and now im bulking at 3000, loving life now.
> 
> Also its worthwhile noting that you need to adjust your intake as you lose weight, I started cutting at 2300 but as you lose weight your body needs less energy to move it around so everytime you lose a few pounds/kgs you need to adjust your total caloric intake.


As jbguitarking says always monitor your weight weekly and calorific intake as it will need adjusting I'll be dropping it next week as I level off, beauty of bulking on such high numbers is I can also cut on a high number  at the moment any way :lol:


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## Estoril-5 (Mar 8, 2007)

Bod42 said:


> Again i agree with Horico. Its mostly about what you eat throughout the entire day.
> 
> As you see below nutrient timing is a small part of the battle.


What is meant by food composition?


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

morning all,

peoples workout routines, how many rest days a week do peeps have? is there a guideline on how long a workout should last in order to actually have an affect on the body.

this might be a silly question, got tough mudder this weekend once thats finished i'll cut my runs down from 3-4 times a week 7 mile a time to half that 2-3 times a week, would the running at the mo have any negative affect on the effect of my weight workouts? i do both weights and runs on the same day so just curious


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

I train 6 days a week, prob why I don't have as much progress anymore though lol


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## silverfox830 (Apr 4, 2014)

A 20 year study by John Hopkins hospital showed that people who are sedentary live just as long as people who exercise hard every day. The third group lived the longest...those who jog or walk 30 minutes, 4-5 times a week. Moderate exercise was the key. Excessive exercise was not effective in prolonging life, and in fact was found to wear down heart and joints prematurely in most cases.


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Kimo said:


> I train 6 days a week, prob why I don't have as much progress anymore though lol


So you know training 6 days a week is having a negative effect on your gains and you still do it


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## ST - Matt (Mar 27, 2015)

alan hanson said:


> morning all,
> 
> peoples workout routines, how many rest days a week do peeps have? is there a guideline on how long a workout should last in order to actually have an affect on the body.
> 
> this might be a silly question, got tough mudder this weekend once thats finished i'll cut my runs down from 3-4 times a week 7 mile a time to half that 2-3 times a week, would the running at the mo have any negative affect on the effect of my weight workouts? i do both weights and runs on the same day so just curious


Completely down to what you want to achieve if you want to build mass (lean muscle) and strength then yes long distance running will work against that. If you want to build general fitness then no it won't.

Personally I do cardio in the morning and my weights in the evening but my cardio is 15 minute fasted HIT cardio. You need to learn what you body reacts best to not any 2 people are the same. That being said there are some basics that every one should follow.

If you do some research there are some good reads out there but it also can be a mind f**k as there's a lot of contradicting crap out there as well.


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## ST - Matt (Mar 27, 2015)

Kimo said:


> I train 6 days a week, prob why I don't have as much progress anymore though lol


New diet plan should sort that though and mix it up every 4/5 weeks keeps your body guessing and working and avoids your body getting used to your routine and hitting a plateau


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

ITHAQVA said:


> So you know training 6 days a week is having a negative effect on your gains and you still do it


Yes because I enjoy it. Still drop weight and tone up so can't be all bad though

I enjoy boxing so do it 3 times a week and it's very good cardio

Then I do weights on other parts of the body the other 3 days where boxing doesn't train


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

ST - Matt said:


> New diet plan should sort that though and mix it up every 4/5 weeks keeps your body guessing and working and avoids your body getting used to your routine and hitting a plateau


New plan should be with me today and start it next week


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## ST - Matt (Mar 27, 2015)

Kimo said:


> New plan should be with me today and start it next week


Will you continue cutting or bulking now? Keep us updated how you get on, my hunger is starting to kick in big time dropped 30g of fat a day out of my diet and with in 6 days lost 2.5lb bit much really but not going to panic yet should settle end of this week.


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## horico (Jul 17, 2010)

Kimo said:


> New plan should be with me today and start it next week


Where's the plan from?


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

horico said:


> Where's the plan from?


My friend is a PT and a professional body builder


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