# Menzerna Polish Range - Removal Rates Test (to destruction!)



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Another example thread, this time looking at removal rates and correction achieved from the full Menzerna range of polishes. The point - to see how the polishes perform, what paint removal corresponds to what correction, the abilities of the polishes and at the end, where it all goes wrong (purposefully in this case ).

So here we have our test panel - its the roof of my trusty banger, a Vauxhall Astra which is living out the last days of its life being polished before it goes to the scrappy! A test mule  Out with the wire wool, lets get some scratches:










Now, we measure the thicknesses here using multiple readings and taking the average, and we calculate the absolute error in each reading also. The starting thickness here was measured to be:

*Starting Thickness = 107.4 +/- 0.7um*

For all of the ceramiclear abrasive polishes, the classic Zenith Point Technique was used: spread at 600rpm, work at 1500 - 1800rpm, refine at 1200, then 900rpm.

First up was 85RD Final Finish on a finishing pad, which delivered the following results:



















Note how much worse the paint looks under the strip lighting - deeper marks are masked by the bright light sources such as the Sun Gun. Good level of correction though for a finishing polish on a finishing pad!

Paint thickness after 85RD:

*After 85RD = 106.1 +/- 0.8um*
*No removal rates calculated, only remaining thicknesses here. Subtraction gives removal rates, sum of the squares square rooted of the percentage error gives a measure of the error in this value for those interested 

Next stage: 106FA on a polishing pad (W8006 from Meguiars), and we get:



















Notably better correction, we are now just down to the deeper RDS. Paint left:

*After 106FA = 102.9 +/- 0.8um*
Looks to be more paint removed, as would be expected. This paint was prepolished to ensure soft upper layers removed.

Next stage: 203S Power Finish on a polishing pad:



















A little better but not hugely, the remaining marks are deeper than it would seem, but then 203S did not seem to remove much paint:

*After 203S = 101.8 +/- 0.8um*

Certainly not compared to 106FA - into harder paint perhaps, or a slightly different abrasive style not being suited to this paint... Intensive Polish was next, so we'll see what that delivers:



















A bit more in terms of correction, but at what cost in paint?:

*After 85RD3.02 = 101.0 +/- 0.8um*

Again, seems low, so looks like we are into harder paint now - this points more to there being a gradient in paint hardness on a finish, starting soft and getting harder the deeper you go which further supports the idea of there being UV degredation of upper clearcoat layers.

Now, we move to a different style of abrasive - a brittle, sharp abrasive compared to the ceramiclear's rounder abrasives. That of S34A Power Gloss, applied as above using Zenith method which although not typically Power Gloss, I wanted to keep the application the same here to avoid this being a variable.

The results:



















Correction level superb, finish not bad either considering its a heavy cutting compound on a soft paint! Or is the paint soft? Debate :lol:

The paint left:

*After S34A = 93.7 +/- 0.9um*

A big amount of paint removed! Does this mean that the sharper abrasives better suit this paint for removal?

Now, at this stage, a second hit of Power Gloss would not be advised on a real detail... but as this is an experiment, lets do it, and see why its not advised!! :lol: Note the strike through after two hits:



















Using the readings, you could see this coming - big chunk of paint removed first time, paint level now low, all factors pointing to another hit of PG being a no no! Paint left now:

*After 2x S34A = 85.3 +/- 0.7um*

Well into the strike though level...

So, what can we say after this little bit of fun?

First open ended question - different styles of abrasives... PG is more aggressive but it is hugely so here, is it that the sharper abrasives better suit this paint? Testing with the PO91L version of IP will tell us this answer here, so watch this space  But an interesting observation.

Note also, the removal rates slowing down again, pointing to paint getting harder the deeper we go for the same abrasive type. This is more consistent results with previous tests.

And, also interesting to see the Meznerna range's cutting and finishing abilities 

Many thanks to Alex_E for his help with this test


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## Odd (Nov 1, 2007)

Nice one!  Is Power Finish better to work with then old IP 3.02? Break down faster...dont need 10+ pass.

Tested Super Finish? There is also a new Power Finish-Intensive Polish out...


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## tfonseca (Jul 31, 2008)

Nice test!
I would like to see a test like that using a DA and with the new powergloss S100.


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## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Always a pleasure to read your post David :thumb:


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

wow lucky I stopped using Menzerna PG, SIP and 106 to correct paintwork
softening the paint making it easier to correct is what I am doing these days, so that only a finishing polish or Gtechniq P1 with polish or finish pad is needed.


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## toni (Oct 30, 2005)

And how do you soften paint? :tumbleweed:


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Great test there Dave :thumb: Very interesting and informative (wouldn't expect anything less really )


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## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Odd said:


> Nice one!  Is Power Finish better to work with then old IP 3.02? Break down faster...dont need 10+ pass.
> 
> Tested Super Finish? There is also a new Power Finish-Intensive Polish out...


Power Finish - Intensive Polish


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## Odd (Nov 1, 2007)

Porta said:


> Power Finish - Intensive Polish


Yes. i'm confused too. The Power finish is not the same as Intensive Polish.

http://www.autogeek.net/menzerna-of-germany.html - list of all.

http://www.prorecond.se/webshop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=427

Right...?


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## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Odd said:


> Yes. i'm confused too. The Power finish is not the same as Intensive Polish.
> 
> http://www.autogeek.net/menzerna-of-germany.html - list of all.
> 
> ...


Menzerna is selling RD3.02 and PO203S under the same name (stupid, yes I know) but with different colours on the caps and stickers.


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Porta said:


> Menzerna is selling RD3.02 and PO203S under the same name (stupid, yes I know) but with different colours on the caps and stickers.


Haven't they sorted this label issue out now... My RD3.02 says Intensive Polish, white cap. My 203S says Power Finish, blue cap.


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## Odd (Nov 1, 2007)

Did order some 106FA. Is this faster to work with then the old FF?

I dont think all webshops have the correct pic of tall the products.


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## Porta (Jan 3, 2007)

Dave KG said:


> Haven't they sorted this label issue out now... My RD3.02 says Intensive Polish, white cap. My 203S says Power Finish, blue cap.


The last RD3.02 batch( who came in in the end of last week) says Powerfinish...
Menzerna is doing it again


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Odd said:


> Did order some 106FA. Is this faster to work with then the old FF?
> 
> I dont think all webshops have the correct pic of tall the products.


106FA has a little more lube than 106FF, but I find them practically the same in working style


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

Glare Zero with a glare black pad


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## toni (Oct 30, 2005)

Just read about this Glare Zero stuff. I must say, it's pretty impressive stuff it it does what it says on the bottle (although damn expensive).

Maybe you'll show us what it performs when you have the time. :thumb:


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## Alladin (Mar 28, 2009)

Hi,
Dave, would 85RD Final Finish on a polishing pad have made any significant difference compared with a finishing pad during the initial stages of your experiment?


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

toni said:


> Just read about this Glare Zero stuff. I must say, it's pretty impressive stuff it it does what it says on the bottle (although damn expensive).
> 
> Maybe you'll show us what it performs when you have the time. :thumb:


yeah there are a few videos I've done with it on you tube but they were for a friend of mine and don't go in depth enough regarding orange peel burial, paint deep cleaning, wet sand scratch reduction, surface deoxidising (ext trims and such), softening and hardening paint and making polishing more effective and easier with longer working times

yes it's expensive but with so many revolutionary uses and so little product needed to do the job, its all worth it


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