# Best Sealant for Glassy Look.... that won't break the bank



## Taxboy (Aug 23, 2006)

As per the title I'd like to try out a sealant for my Sophisto Grey BMW to try and achieve a sharp glossy look. Currently Im using Bilt Hamber Finis topped with Foshow but would like to go for a glassy feel


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## steelghost (Aug 20, 2015)

I don't think there can be any other answer than Finish Kare 1000P?
Actually you could probably try Bilt Hamber Double Speed which definitely looks a bit "sharper" than its older brother. Or the Carlack Acrylic system. Or Auto Finesse Tough Prep / Tough Coat. None of these are hilariously expensive, even the full three part Carlack system (Complete, Long Life and Fast Detailer) is still under £50, and has enough to last you a long while.


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## Serious Performance (Oct 26, 2005)

steelghost said:


> I don't think there can be any other answer than Finish Kare 1000P?
> Actually you could probably try Bilt Hamber Double Speed which definitely looks a bit "sharper" than its older brother. Or the Carlack Acrylic system. Or Auto Finesse Tough Prep / Tough Coat. None of these are hilariously expensive, even the full three part Carlack system (Complete, Long Life and Fast Detailer) is still under £50, and has enough to last you a long while.


Finish Kare 2180.... Won't protect as well as 1000P but an even glassier finish!


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## rob267 (Nov 27, 2015)

I use Finish kare 1000p. Very glassy. 
Also autoglym extra gloss protection is very good.

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## Rowan83 (Aug 21, 2007)

Sonax Xtreme Protect & Shine Hybrid.... an awesome product IMO.

http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/sealants/sonax-xtreme-protect-shine-hybrid-npt/prod_1200.html


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## Taxboy (Aug 23, 2006)

Rowan83 said:


> Sonax Xtreme Protect & Shine Hybrid.... an awesome product IMO.
> 
> http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/sealants/sonax-xtreme-protect-shine-hybrid-npt/prod_1200.html


How does this compare in the looks department TO BSD?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

LSP -Glassy finish 
Menzerna Power Lock - glassy look
Supernatural wax - pure finish 
R222 Concours wax - glassy and wet 
Victoria Collectors wax - glassy and wet 
Supernatural Acrylic Spritz - glassy look


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

Taxboy said:


> As per the title I'd like to try out a sealant for my Sophisto Grey BMW to try and achieve a sharp glossy look. Currently Im using *Bilt Hamber Finis* topped with Foshow but would like to go for a glassy feel


Is BH Finis Wax a sealant or a Carnauba Paste Car Wax? According to the BH page it is carnauba wax. Am i wrong or wouldn't a sealant i.e GTechniq/C.Quartz give you that glassy look?


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## Taxboy (Aug 23, 2006)

cargainz said:


> Is BH Finis Wax a sealant or a Carnauba Paste Car Wax? According to the BH page it is carnauba wax. Am i wrong or wouldn't a sealant i.e GTechniq/C.Quartz give you that glassy look?


I understood it to be a hybrid but just fancy a change


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## President Swirl (Oct 23, 2011)

Collinite 845 is excellent.


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## pt1 (Feb 8, 2014)

double speed wax or colly 845 which is so easy to use


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## HITMANVW (Apr 29, 2013)

Gyeon CanCoat topped up with WetCoat during its next wash.


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## Taxboy (Aug 23, 2006)

President Swirl said:


> Collinite 845 is excellent.


Does this give a glassy finish looks wise as it's a wax... albeit a very durable one


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

Taxboy said:


> I understood it to be a hybrid but just fancy a change


You understood it to be a hybrid? Why or how considering it is a Carnauba Paste Wax. It hasn't got hydrophobic polymers like BH double speed wax so why do you think it is a hybrid wax?


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## Juke_Fan (Jul 12, 2014)

AS Topaz.


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## President Swirl (Oct 23, 2011)

Yes, for me it does leave a " glassy " look. Auto finesse Tough Coat could be another to look at. 845 is very oily and slick. 2 coats an hour apart looks the nuts with good prep.


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## steelghost (Aug 20, 2015)

cargainz said:


> You understood it to be a hybrid? Why or how considering it is a Carnauba Paste Wax. It hasn't got hydrophobic polymers like BH double speed wax so why do you think it is a hybrid wax?


What is a "hybrid" wax? Pure carnauba wax is hard, and uh, waxy - you can't just apply it to a car in that state. You have to soften it with - something. What makes up the "something", and what is left behind after you've buffed it off, well there's the rub (if you'll forgive the pun ).

So, have a look at the Finis Wax page on the Bilt Hamber site. First of all, they refer to Finis as an


> *enhanced* carnauba paste wax.





> Inferior waxes rely on heavy use of oils to plasticise the wax film thereby irreversibly reducing the properties of the waxes in the formulation, we avoid the use of any materials that reduce the effect of carnauba wax. *However we do enhance its ability to provide protection by the reaction of it with unique in-house materials*.


 (emphasis mine in both cases)

So is it a hybrid, or isn't it? At what point do we draw the line?

(FWIW I don't think you can, and I don't think there's any point - I judge any LSP it on how it performs, be that looks, protection, durability, whatever)


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## ICBM (Feb 7, 2015)

If it is sharpness you want rather than a glossy look, I think Carlack wins every time. I actually stopped using it on the white Audi as it was such a "sharp" finish I wanted a bit more glow that I get from Zaino.


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

steelghost said:


> What is a "hybrid" wax? Pure carnauba wax is hard, and uh, waxy - you can't just apply it to a car in that state. You have to soften it with - something. What makes up the "something", and what is left behind after you've buffed it off, well there's the rub (if you'll forgive the pun ).
> 
> So, have a look at the Finis Wax page on the Bilt Hamber site. First of all, they refer to Finis as an
> 
> ...


What would I consider a hybrid wax? One with wax/sealant properties e.g. one like Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid Paste Sealant. i.e. this is what they state.

*Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid Sealant, the ultimate in Dodo protection.
It's the age old puzzle- wax or sealant? Some go for a layer of each, if you're Dodo Juice you create something that contains them both- Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid.
Supernatural Hybrid takes the best of both worlds, the Brazilian carnauba from its waxes and the synthetic polymers that make sealants so damn tough. You then end up with a really glossy finish that is durable. It can withstand the rain and heat making it a good all year round sealant.*

To an extent detailing product manufactures seem to have lots of latency to state/disclose as little or as much info as they like. If they stated all the ingredients and in what quantities then this would be easier like the msds data sheet.

Look at other industries i.e. protein powders which is a multi-million pound industry. Go and buy a tub of protein and it states the protein % (this can be tested at independent labs and trading standards prosecute companies that sell protein labelled at 70% but when tested has more sugar than a McDonald's milk shake).


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

From what I have understood, if a wax is a durability of more than a month,it's fortified with polymers of some sort... Ie a hybrid 

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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

graham1970 said:


> From what I have understood, if a wax is a durability of more than a month,it's fortified with polymers of some sort... Ie a hybrid
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


Its up to you really what you consider finis wax to be - its listed on ultimatefinish under "Carnauba waxes" but then so is BH Double Speed Wax which has "Highly Hrdrophobic Carnauba & Polymer" in the description.

horses for courses


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Just because it contains carnauba doesn't mean it's not a hybrid surely?!
Not arguing, just trying to define the two classifications.



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## steelghost (Aug 20, 2015)

cargainz said:


> What would I consider a hybrid wax? One with wax/sealant properties e.g. one like Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid Paste Sealant. i.e. this is what they state.
> 
> *Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid Sealant, the ultimate in Dodo protection.
> It's the age old puzzle- wax or sealant? Some go for a layer of each, if you're Dodo Juice you create something that contains them both- Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid.
> ...


I'm not sure the comparison to protein powders is really relevant - clearly anything you're going to ingest should be safe, and contain what it says. But manufacturers of all sorts of chemicals are under no obligation to disclose their formulae, because they are trade secrets. There's no list of ingredients on a tin of varnish or paint, for instance.

Material Safety Data Sheets only cover potential hazards - not every single ingredient in a product.

I'm just not sure that trying to categorise everything into boxes labelled "wax" or "sealant" or "hybrid" is a useful way to think about it. It's like trying to cut orange juice into slices, it just doesn't work. Sure, there are things at either end of the spectrum that are fairly clearly one thing or the other, but there's a huge amount of grey in the middle. Judge the product on how it works, not whether it is, or is not a "hybrid", something that is almost impossible to define.


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## Hunty (May 21, 2009)

For a glassy/reflective look I would go for Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid. It is really reflects the light well. This is a black Scirocco I did for a friend a few years back. No filters or owt, just polishesld with Schools S30+ and two layers of SNH.





Sorry for the pics, but hope they show what I mean. Not a deep wet look at all. Just glassy.


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

graham1970 said:


> Just because it contains carnauba doesn't mean it's not a hybrid surely?!
> Not arguing, just trying to define the two classifications.
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


What do you define as a wax? What do you define as a sealant? What do you define ad a hydrid? If I wanted to pay premium ££ for Carnauba wax would I pay for Carnauba and potentially fillers?


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Fillers that add durability?


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

steelghost said:


> I'm not sure the comparison to protein powders is really relevant - clearly anything you're going to ingest should be safe, and contain what it says. But manufacturers of all sorts of chemicals are under no obligation to disclose their formulae, because they are trade secrets. There's no list of ingredients on a tin of varnish or paint, for instance.
> 
> Material Safety Data Sheets only cover potential hazards - not every single ingredient in a product.
> 
> I'm just not sure that trying to categorise everything into boxes labelled "wax" or "sealant" or "hybrid" is a useful way to think about it. It's like trying to cut orange juice into slices, it just doesn't work. Sure, there are things at either end of the spectrum that are fairly clearly one thing or the other, but there's a huge amount of grey in the middle. Judge the product on how it works, not whether it is, or is not a "hybrid", something that is almost impossible to define.


Detailing products don't have the same level of scrutiny as other products because its a much, much smaller market. However consumer law still applies.

The core of the issue is an understanding/perception issue. I want to know what I'm being sold and why? Its not marketing hype and trade gimmicks that I fall for.


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

Hunty said:


> For a glassy/reflective look I would go for Dodo Juice Supernatural Hybrid. It is really reflects the light well. This is a black Scirocco I did for a friend a few years back. No filters or owt, just polishesld with Schools S30+ and two layers of SNH.
> 
> 
> Getting back on topic, nice glassy look.
> ...


Nice glassy look.


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

As I understand it a show wax contains nothing except high grade carnauba and oils that enhance the usability and gloss.
Durability is not even an issue,for that,polymers are added,that product is then a hybrid. 
For instance,the wax I use,bf midnight sun, contains the same polymers that the bf paint sealant it sits on contain,thus they cross bond increasing an already increased durability.
If I were to apply a show wax over the sealant the wax would not cross bond and tail off in a matter of weeks,the same way it would if it were on bare paintwork



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## steelghost (Aug 20, 2015)

cargainz said:


> Detailing products don't have the same level of scrutiny as other products because its a much, much smaller market. However consumer law still applies.
> 
> The core of the issue is an understanding/perception issue. I want to know what I'm being sold and why? Its not marketing hype and trade gimmicks that I fall for.


I'm more than happy to learn something new on this point, but as far as I am aware there is no law requiring any manufacturer to disclose all the ingredients of any given product. Walk around B&Q - look at all the paints, glues, sealants, etc - none of them have a full list of ingredients (or anything like).

But honestly, what would you do with such a list if you had it? Unless you were sufficiently well versed in the relevant fields of chemistry and materials science, it would be useless. It might tell you that there was (or was not) certain types of wax or oil in a given LSP. By the time you get into the Double Speeds and Supernatural Hybrids of the LSP world, I'm going to bet there would be a list of compounds as long as your arm, which most people would struggle to pronounce, let alone understand the significance of. Even then, it doesn't tell you in what order they were combined together, under what temperatures, pressures, with what catalysts, etc etc etc.

This is of course where forums like this are invaluable, since they allow you to draw on the collective experience and expertise of thousands of people, so that regardless of what goes into a given product, you can get a feel for what it does, how well it does it, and do you want to pay £xx(xx!) for it.


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## cargainz (Jul 25, 2016)

steelghost said:


> I'm more than happy to learn something new on this point, but as far as I am aware there is no law requiring any manufacturer to disclose all the ingredients of any given product. Walk around B&Q - look at all the paints, glues, sealants, etc - none of them have a full list of ingredients (or anything like).
> 
> But honestly, what would you do with such a list if you had it? Unless you were sufficiently well versed in the relevant fields of chemistry and materials science, it would be useless. It might tell you that there was (or was not) certain types of wax or oil in a given LSP. By the time you get into the Double Speeds and Supernatural Hybrids of the LSP world, I'm going to bet there would be a list of compounds as long as your arm, which most people would struggle to pronounce, let alone understand the significance of. Even then, it doesn't tell you in what order they were combined together, under what temperatures, pressures, with what catalysts, etc etc etc.
> 
> This is of course where forums like this are invaluable, since they allow you to draw on the collective experience and expertise of thousands of people, so that regardless of what goes into a given product, you can get a feel for what it does, how well it does it, and do you want to pay £xx(xx!) for it.


I'll probably update this later properly when I get home, after making dinner and a quick detail of the car lol. The trade descriptions act does not have any exemptions.



> The Trade Descriptions Act 1968 is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom which prevents manufacturers, retailers or service industry providers from misleading consumers as to what they are spending their money on.


As a simple example this morning while grabbing a sandwich for later in the day i walked into the store and whilst walking past the car cleaning product i saw Simoniz Quickshine Detailer on sale for £4.80 which normally costs something like £6.

I held up the bottle and there is no list of ingredients (does it have polymers, abrasives, inferior waxes)? I was planning to do some "charity" car washes for friends & family and wanted to use

* something with no abrasives
* a carnauba based wax

The web description says "Provide your car's paintwork with fast-acting protection and a high-shine finish using the Simoniz Carnauba Speed Wax. Especially formulated with decades of experience, the Wax & Polish contains carnauba to help give your car's paintwork a quick-lift with a simple application and rinse. The 500ml Simoniz Carnauba Speed Wax can be used on metallic, pearlescent and modern clear-coat paintwork."

As you can imagine I work fulltime in a day job and I'm not insured to work on other people's cars. Any charity car washes are off my pocket really so i need to be careful about what i use.

By not stating the ingredients, one can mask/hide things (i'll update this later).


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## Taxboy (Aug 23, 2006)

steelghost said:


> I'm not sure the comparison to protein powders is really relevant - clearly anything you're going to ingest should be safe, and contain what it says. But manufacturers of all sorts of chemicals are under no obligation to disclose their formulae, because they are trade secrets. There's no list of ingredients on a tin of varnish or paint, for instance.
> 
> Material Safety Data Sheets only cover potential hazards - not every single ingredient in a product.
> 
> I'm just not sure that trying to categorise everything into boxes labelled "wax" or "sealant" or "hybrid" is a useful way to think about it. It's like trying to cut orange juice into slices, it just doesn't work. Sure, there are things at either end of the spectrum that are fairly clearly one thing or the other, but there's a huge amount of grey in the middle. Judge the product on how it works, not whether it is, or is not a "hybrid", something that is almost impossible to define.


I appear to have opened a can of worms here 

My post was to ask about a glassy finish LSP and I generically used the term sealant in a casual manner as I believed these typically tend to give this look.

I fully agree that the effect the product gives is the most important rather than categorizing it into wax, sealant, hybrid or rehydrated unicorn. However it seems that others may have a different perspective and so be it, especially as one man's wax is another's hybrid.

I would like to thank all suggestions though


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