# Snow/Winter tyres are they worth it ?



## Talidan (Sep 2, 2014)

I currently have a E46 320D (just a cheap run around), I always have a cheap 4x4 for winter normally a old Shogun or landcruser, I'm saving up for a new car in the summer so I'm thinking of not having the cost of another car to run for winter and then the hassle of selling etc.

Now there's no doubt about they work better in lower temps for braking distance and grip at lower temps.

My main concern is snow I live quite high up on a private road so it's never treated over winter will any tyres help me in snow or shall I just buy a cheap Cherokee or Shogun.

Thanks guys any tyre recommendations welcome 

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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

This is one of those topics that seems to truly divide opinion lol. 

Personally, I've used winter tyres on our cars for the past 10 years or so, and wouldn't be without them. We also live quite high up, and have a large hill to negotiate to get up to our house. The past few years, when we've had snow, our cars appear to be the only cars that can negotiate the hill and get up to the house. They're great for getting you going, but also great at helping you get stopped too, which is fairly important. 

Now, with an e46, it'll obviously be rear wheel drive. Winter tyres will definitely help, but you'll also need to get some weight over the driven wheels, like a few sand bags or a body (joke) to make sure you've got plenty of traction. A good friend and neighbour has an e90 320d, and he used winter tyres last year too, and was able to get in and out of our park.

That's my tuppence worth, bud. Btw, our cars are a mk1 focus, Citroen DS3, and an f30 3 series x drive. 

With regard to tyre recommendations, I've used Pirelli Sottozero, Nokian wrd3, Petlas Snowmaster, Goodyear winter grip, and vredestein snow something. Bizarrely, my favourite were tyres that came on a set of wheels I bought second hand to use as a winter set - they were Sunnytrac. Absolutely incredible in the snow and ice, but as with most winter tyres, a wee bit greasy feeling on a cold, wet road. 

I have Nokian for my wife's car, and they're fantastic too. The Pirelli combined with the x drive on my 3 series makes it incredibly capable in snow and ice. 

If I was buying another set now, I'd probably look at the Nokian WRD3 or WRD4. Fantastic winter tyres and reasonably priced too. 

Cheers. 

Cooks

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## andy__d (Jun 27, 2018)

personal pov ,, not worth it
when you have Fat/wide tyres, they are going to compress the snow, not that good for traction
a OLD landrover with skinny tyres will "dig in" and get grip

as a "get me down just this private road" you could look at "snow socks" (far cheaper than winter tyres/other car) and on/off them at the start/end of the road, "winter/summer/allseason" tyres will all struggle on snow and tbh here, the Tiny + points for winter tyres are a brilliantly marketed thing 
Driving appropriately to the conditions can and does make Far more + points than winter tyres, but that is something Most will never admit as they are All convinced they know better and are The most skillful of drivers
but thats just me, a 50year old who has driven and rode motorbikes since 16 in All weathers and clocked up Nearly a million miles Just for business , doesnt include the hooning about in europe ireland etc on motorbikes , or the sillyness of the IoM

http://www.autosock.co.uk/

i agree with cookies
RWD - throw some weight in the boot , the 3 3x2 paving slabs i used to use in the capri's Could be done better with bags of sand ,,

Do add a small folding shovel if you use sand,, you can always put a spade or 4 worth under the wheels If you loose grip just to get you going


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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

Depends on so much, studies have shown that they perform better when the temp drops than regular tyres (if I recall correctly). 

For me its a no brainer with the amount of snow I get here, plus with kids I want the best safety I can get.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

If you want a do it all tyre stick some Michelin Cross CLimates on, if you want a winter tyre then go for a good quality budget, something lime uniroyal or nexen. I have Nokian winters for my Mini and they are no better than the Nokian winguards i had on the Cupra.

Stocks are low at the minute with supply coming in around early to mid october.


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## Gas head (May 28, 2010)

totally worth it, I had bridgestone whatever they were winter tyres, no contest next to a car without winter tyres, I doubt that a 4x4 without winter tyres will go as far as a 2wd vehicle with in snowy/icy conditions.
and the landrover getting purchase on solid ground using skinny tyres used to be an off road saying also.


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

There are loads of vids on YouTube comparing the various combinations of 2wd, 4wd, winter tyres, summer tyres, and they're a great watch. A friend has a Lexus Nx300h, and she couldn't make it up our hill to the house. 

Maybe something with a diff lock would be different, but the soft roaders on summer tyres really don't seem to be very good, well on our roads anyway. 

Cooks

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## Fentum (May 1, 2017)

Not a choice where I am. Most roads would be closed to me by law between mid November and mid April. Nowadays, in any case, I wouldn’t even think about taking a rear wheel drive out on snow or ice without them, but then I’ve managed both to get stuck and crash in the past doing so...

Peter


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

For where i live, nope they are a waste of time, hardly any hills of note and the hills that do exist in the town, are part of a bus route and are gritted.
If it gets that bad, then the car stays at home and i walk to work in my winter boots.

If i lived somewhere remote then maybe i would use them but as someone else said, a Defender with skinny tyres would probably be my weapon of choice for those conditions.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

I've also had winter tyres for years now, I also used to have battered old Jeeps to use....however.... and this is something that I think a lot of people overlook.....

winter tyres are pointless on a car if it's not something everyone has.

Let me explain.... my car, with winter tyres is great in lower temps, and a small amount of snow can't stop it.... however.... when I get to the main road, or there is heavy snow, I'm stuck along side everyone else without decent tyres.....I can't just drive through all the stuck cars, so I become part of the problem...

So this year, although I'll still have winter tyres on my cars... I'm going back to having a battered old jeep.... for that simple reason.... it doesn't need roads and it doesn't need to sit behind all the other cars.

:thumb:


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## shl-kelso (Dec 27, 2012)

I’ve been a user of winter tyres in the past too and found they make a huge difference in cold/wet handling as well as making a massive difference on snow plus a reasonable difference on ice. 

Now I use the newer generation of all-season tyres simply to save the hassle of changing wheels/tyres plus storage of the unused set. They have come on enough that while they are a compromise they get close enough to the performance of dedicated summer and winter sets that their convenience out weighs these small compromises. 

If you are not in Scotland or hilly parts of rural Northern England then the Michelin Cross Climates are a good choice. If you do live somewhere with more chance of very cold (icy) conditions then it’s worth doing your research to see if some of the other brands will be a better choice at the expense of a drop in peak summer performance as ice is one of the weaker areas of performance of the Michelin’s. 

I live in the rural Scottish Borders so icy roads are a regular occurrence across several months of the year, and winter can feel like it lasts six months and the odd summer day (not this year) has occasionally struggled to see the temperature make it into double figures!


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## tosh (Dec 30, 2005)

I’ve got two rear wheel drive cars. Any hint of snow and ice and they’re stranded or seriously dangerous to drive. 

Winter tyres work and I’ve got a set of winter wheels for each. It’s cheaper than buying another car (in your case). 

New tyres work better than part worn, as the tread blocks have to move; the more tread, the more movement, so over 5mm is a must. 

I’m going to switch to Michelin Crossclimate on the low power car and run them all year, saves one tyre swap per year (but going to use my winters up first, I’m on Continental ts850s but any good brand is recommended)

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## frankc (Aug 30, 2018)

I recommend looking at Youtube. There are cars on there that went out in "the beast from the East" snow storms when there was nothing else on the road.

Will see if I can find a clip, or two, for you.


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## cangri (Feb 25, 2011)

I say Yes!
They are worth it.


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## wish wash (Aug 25, 2011)

Our weather is so random that it's hard to judge. There saying we're going to have the worst winter in years, 4 months of snow. I like some EU countries that make you have winter/ all season tyres on between November and April. It may be over kill but I'd rather people be safe. The downside is you still get the numptys driving too fast for the road conditions.


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

I have used them for the past 6 winters, never been stuck. There is a good you tube vid comparison between a 4WD on all season tyres and a Front wheel drive car on snow tyres climbing an indoor ski slope. The 4WD doesnt make it.

Where I live there are plenty of hills and more than average snowfall, they are peace of mind.


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## Stoner (Jun 25, 2010)

I think they are worth the outlay. I tend to put ours on around mid/late-October when the temp drops below 8*c and keep them on until it's back above that temp in spring.

Whilst the summer wheels are off, its a good time to give them a thorough clean. I will also look at sealing them this year :thumb:


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## andy__d (Jun 27, 2018)

wish wash said:


> Our weather is so random that it's hard to judge. There saying we're going to have the worst winter in years, 4 months of snow. I like some EU countries that make you have winter/ all season tyres on between November and April. It may be over kill but I'd rather people be safe. The downside is you still get the numptys driving too fast for the road conditions.


hell NO to the mandatory tyres 
people do not need nannying but lots seem to think this is The answer, it isnt
Education is

winter tyres allow "That" type of driver , to drive WAY past there own Actual capabilities And far past what the conditions allow with the False sense of security, they are NOT the answer , Teaching them to Drive properly is.

as to the last few years

Auto car, low suspension (factory lowered sports) wide low profile tyres
toyo proxi Tr1 ,, NOT a winter tyre ,, 
i never got Stuck at all and Only had to use the "W" (winter) button on the gearbox when faced with Steep inclines Blocked by other cars who's drivers couldnt cope , Including 4x4s and "suv" Or where the packed snow had been compacted and polished,

Winter tyres are NOT the answer. education is 
and if you Wont realise that, you ARE the problem.


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

Getting a bit testy.

I put winter tyres on my cars to avoid getting stuck on snow covered hills and to reduce braking distances. 

With respect to the previous poster, I dont think that this makes me the problem


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## percymon (Jun 27, 2007)

I've used them for years and wouldn;t be without them - most of my winter miles are during commute hours so its dark and cold, so absolutely perfect for winter tyres irrespective of whether there's snow on the ground or not. Compared to buying insuring and running another vehicle they are a bargain, then factor in the safety aspect and is a no brainer for me.

Ive had Nokian W+ (on golf mk6 and Audi A3), Dunlop Wintersport 3D on MINI , and currently run Dunlop Wintersport 5s on my LEAF. All very good tyres, not silly money and have performed well even in warm spring days where its hit 20'C.

If you have mixed tyre sizes front/rear then perhaps think about running the same size front and rear, the slightly narrower footprint will benefit in deep snow.

Holiday'd in Croatia July / August this year and the hire car had winter tyres on - even in 36'C heat they didnt feel out of place, so forget the old stories of them falling apart , going mushy in warmer temps. They might not be as good as a summer tyre in warm weather but when you really look at what some other motorists drive around on any tyre would be better.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

andy__d said:


> hell NO to the mandatory tyres
> people do not need nannying but lots seem to think this is The answer, it isnt
> Education is
> 
> ...


hmm.... so you're saying that you're all for winter tyres, or no?? :buffer:

I can't tell, your comments are quite on the fence about the whole subject...:tumbleweed:

:lol:

I used to think like that, until I started working in Sweden over the winter.... couldn't be without them, and a reason why Volvo, Saab and the likes give you the car with 2 sets of wheels and tyres...

funnily enough, their accident rates are lower than the UK as well... it's almost like everyone using winter tyres, and ones with studs depending on your location could actually help make it safer for everyone...

don't believe the hype though! 

:thumb:


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## Tricky Red (Mar 3, 2007)

I had Conti Wintercontact TS850 on the Audi and they were good. Still have them available for someone to buy as I have changed cars. 

Now have Michelin Cross Climate + and were equally good last year.


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## m500dpp (Feb 17, 2006)

OK our front wheel drive qashqai is our do everything and has to get us to the stables to look after the horse. The two fronts are up for change and I have been thinking of changing to cross climates on the fronts only, the rears as usual are hardly worn.

What are peoples thoughts on this, how well do they wear compared to normal tyres? they will be on permanently.

At the risk of stating the obvious in snow turn traction control off, it just cuts in all the time and stops the car gaining momentum!


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## Stoner (Jun 25, 2010)

andy__d said:


> hell NO to the mandatory tyres
> people do not need nannying but lots seem to think this is The answer, it isnt
> Education is
> 
> ...


Not sure I follow you logic. It is proven that winter tyres stop quicker and are safer in poor conditions. If education is the answer as you state, surely having equipment that helps isn't an issue? I don't think winter tyres should be compulsory but for those of us that use them, we aren't the problem. We are doing our utmost to keep everyone safer, regardless of our driving ability. Education isn't improving (not just in driving terms), so using better equipment does not make the problem worse, it helps to reduce the risk. When I have my kids in the car, that's what I want to do.


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## andy__d (Jun 27, 2018)

The Cueball said:


> hmm.... so you're saying that you're all for winter tyres, or no?? :buffer:
> 
> I can't tell, your comments are quite on the fence about the whole subject...:tumbleweed:
> 
> ...


mandatory  no , hell no 
Better educated driver = Hell yes
Drivers made aware of things like "road surface/condition" Weather and how it affects drving, Hell yes

stick them on a honda 50 stepthrough for 6months,, they will Very quickly learn about the above,  
(oh and how Not to drive like a ,,,clownshoes, in there t****** mobile cos its a *insert brand* , use things like Indicators, not pull out Expecting others to stop,, etc etc,,) or end up in a box as worm food.

nannying by law i detest and despise, Educate hell yes

but perhaps Some sectors of "alleged" drivers are incapable of learning ,, this is how it seems these days

and  im 50 , i drive a volvo im Supposed to be a grumy old git

Ex biker, wiped out by a clown in a tin box


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## Rob_Quads (Jul 17, 2006)

I think they are a great investment. I had them on my last car. Past winter one morning drove to work and all was fine. When i got in everyone was complaining how bad and slippy the road in was including 2 with exactly the same car but no winter tyres.

I think the key thing is often you don't realise with winter tyres when they are working as they just mean it feels normal

I think another thing to consider is the cost is not actually that high if you swap them each year as it means each set will probably last twice as long thus your actual outlay might be much less than expected.


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

Not sure how education helps when you have no grip and cannot pull away. I agree lots of the problems we have come down to people being stupid like driving at 5 mph when a flake falls and for the amount of snow that we do have doesn't warrant us swapping to winters every year, however winters do make a difference and not just when snow falls but also when roads are cold and wet. I'll keep putting the winters on though.


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

This video is actually quite good. Its shows an e46 M3 on winters, compared to a Jeep on summer tyres.






I agree in part with andy_d in that education is key. However, it's obvious by today's poor driving standards that education simply doesn't work for everyone; the people who have no lane discipline, dont indicate, dont look, etc etc. The solution has to be, sadly, to legislate.

Cooks

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## Sharpy296 (Jan 18, 2017)

I’m sorely tempted this year, my SEAT is ridiculously bad in winter, I drove a back lane that had a light dusting last year and it just dint want to turn, I was doing maybe 15mph... I thought I was being careful, what that made clear was that to be able to stop in a reasonable time I’d need to be going slower... but then I also have a long wheel base 2015 vivaro van and that’s the opposite it’s drives really well in the snow. 

I think education helps but it only go so far, ideally tyres and education is the way forward.... just looking for some winter wheels now! 


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## tosh (Dec 30, 2005)

wish wash said:


> Our weather is so random that it's hard to judge. There saying we're going to have the worst winter in years, 4 months of snow. I like some EU countries that make you have winter/ all season tyres on between November and April. It may be over kill but I'd rather people be safe. The downside is you still get the numptys driving too fast for the road conditions.


The reason that some EU countries have mandatory winter tyres, is because they have months of winter/snow and we don't. We have weeks, and often, no snow at all. Plus they have mountain passes, un-salted roads, etc etc.

It'll never happen here - we'll just keep buying chinese plastic tyres and not driving to the conditions (or staying at home), which simply means that insurance companies will be the only ones that benefit.

This is of course completely different in Scotland - I bet a lot more all-season and winter tyres are sold up there, simply because they're used to snow more often. In the south, we get a tiny bit of snow, and the bodyshops are rubbing their hands in glee.


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## no1chunk (Nov 18, 2012)

There was a very gd video on youtube were they tested a ford kuga wiv normal and snow tyres on both awd and front wheeldrive versions but the if i can remember the snow tyres got the furthest up a snow covered ski slope on both models. I know i would defo have them if i lived somewere i needed them


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

no1chunk said:


> There was a very gd video on youtube were they tested a ford kuga wiv normal and snow tyres on both awd and front wheeldrive versions but the if i can remember the snow tyres got the furthest up a snow covered ski slope on both models. I know i would defo have them if i lived somewere i needed them


Funny, I just watched that last night.

Here it is. 




Here's another comparison video on an ice rink. Very interesting. 





Cooks

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## MSwiss (Sep 25, 2017)

Never used winter tyres in the UK but they are law here in Switzerland, I literally couldn't live without them. We live above the general snowline so we have snow most of the winter and although we both have 4wd cars that wouldn't be enough without decent rubber. 

The cars still drive well when its dry if you want to be a bit more spirited. I had a weekend in the snow in England with an A4 quattro and it was rubbish, couldn't even get up the driveway. I have done a driving course for snow and it doesn't matter how skillful you are if its snowy and you have summer tyres you will struggle.

For me seeing the difference (its not all about snow either wet roads etc) I would have them, then again if you live in a flat area with hardly any snow then its debatable. I would have them if I moved back to the UK, my mom and dad put them on theirs this year and they were the only ones in the village that could get out when you had the big snow falls.

its like most things pros and cons, split opinions etc but for sure they make a big difference in bad conditions.


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## Tyrefitter (Feb 13, 2010)

Plenty of comments about winter tyres but not one about all season tyres,,ive just bought my daughter a fiat 500 & im going to fit a set of Maxxis all-season AP2 tyres today,that way they can stay on the car all year round.

Andy


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## m500dpp (Feb 17, 2006)

Managed to pick up a set of alloys for our qashqai for £240 (new effectively, only done 10 miles!) so now I need to find some winter or all season tyres. I live in Sussex so dont often get much snow but the wife has a horse so we have to be able to get to the stables (up back lanes) no matter what. Dont know whether to go for cross climates or go for all out winter tyres........investigation continues!


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## mar00 (Jun 24, 2018)

something definitely needs to be done about drivers in general in the UK not just winter, we need to have a driver competency tests every couple of years, there would be very few people on the road in Shropshire if they did, 

my partner is Estonian and they have to take a second test in the winter to get a full licence, most of the roads outside of town are still ice covered and never seen an accident, you can understand why so many rally drivers come from that part of Europe when the taxi drivers do scandinavian flicks round corners, 

i've driven my old shogun in snow a lot with normal tires and all weather and the difference is huge,


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## Stoner (Jun 25, 2010)

m500dpp said:


> Managed to pick up a set of alloys for our qashqai for £240 (new effectively, only done 10 miles!) so now I need to find some winter or all season tyres. I live in Sussex so dont often get much snow but the wife has a horse so we have to be able to get to the stables (up back lanes) no matter what. Dont know whether to go for cross climates or go for all out winter tyres........investigation continues!


Auto Express did tests on summer, all round and winter tyres. The all season tyres were only marginally better than summer tyres. The winter tyres were the clear winner. The link to it is one of the earlier posts if you want to take a look :thumb:


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## millns84 (Jul 5, 2009)

I first used winter tyres in 2012 and found the difference to be night and day. Not just on ice/snow, but in cold wet conditions the tyres just functioned better.

A couple of years after that, I had some Dunlop all season tyres fitted on my Seat Ibiza. I know that strictly speaking they're meant to be a compromise but in all honesty they appeared to function as winter tyres in winter and summer tyres in summer. The one criticism I had was that in hot wet conditions, they did feel a bit "greasy" but I understand that considerable progress has been made over the last couple of years in terms of all season tyres.

We're going to be getting a new family car next year and my thoughts are to have it fitted with all seasons from new to avoid messing around later on.


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## percymon (Jun 27, 2007)

m500dpp said:


> Managed to pick up a set of alloys for our qashqai for £240 (new effectively, only done 10 miles!) so now I need to find some winter or all season tyres. I live in Sussex so dont often get much snow but the wife has a horse so we have to be able to get to the stables (up back lanes) no matter what. Dont know whether to go for cross climates or go for all out winter tyres........investigation continues!


If you intend them as a second set then winters, to have the best of both worlds. If you don't have the option to store / change wheels and this is an only set then all season tyres will more than cope with your needs 99% of the time


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## Starbuck88 (Nov 12, 2013)

Just as a heads up as I didn't know this until recently.

Summer, All Season and Winter tyres are tested the same. So if you look at winter tyres you'll see that wet grip braking is usually C or worse, when a summer tyre might be A.

This is because a Winter tyre apparently needs 7 degrees C or less for its compound to work properly so isn't a fair comparison. In 7 degrees or less, the winter tyre would trounce the summer.


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## stealthwolf (Sep 24, 2008)

My own experience:

Bought a Golf GTI in 2009. I lived in Dorset and it was great in the spring, summer and autumn. That winter, it snowed a little and I struggled to get up some roads because of the incline and lack of grip. I resolved to get winter tyres next time.

2010. I had my winter tyres on. It started snowing heavily on a trip from London to Birmingham. Other cars were starting to veer and skid in the road. I was able to go past them with ease. 

I've stuck with winter tyres when the temps drop below 7 degrees as this is when they are most effective. Yes it doesn't snow much in the UK but it does get frosty or icy.

Last winter, I had not gotten round to getting the winters on. It was the first or second week of December and became icy and started snowing lightly. On the route to work, I negotiated the same roundabout I had done daily for over five years and still managed to skid and take out my wheel alignment (and I'd only had it done a few days before). After that, I immediately got my winter tyres on and I was fine.

The only downside is that my car is low-slung so clearance is an issue. When we had that huge snowfall, our whole road was in deep snow. I couldn't move the car off the driveway let alone drive to work.

I can see andy's point about educating drivers. I've seen so many try to move off in first gear, can't understand why they've no traction and hit the gas pedal harder. I've even had to educate the missus about setting off in second gear. We're not used to ice and snow conditions in the UK. Information (like setting off in second gear, driving slowly etc) would be helpful for a lot of people.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

I've never bought winter tyres, I don't do continental skiiing and never will, so the use for them in my book is limited.

I've never been stopped by snow, I have been stopped by stuck or abandoned vehicles though. Buy a tow rope/strap, it will be far more use.


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## spursfan (Aug 4, 2009)

ollienoclue said:


> I've never bought winter tyres, I don't do continental skiiing and never will, so the use for them in my book is limited.
> 
> I've never been stopped by snow, I have been stopped by stuck or abandoned vehicles though. Buy a tow rope/strap, it will be far more use.


always one:wall: you don't live or work in the High Wycombe area then?
what use is a towrope? that means you have already pranged the car.


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## uruk hai (Apr 5, 2009)

I've never bought them and I've never felt the need to, we had snow overnight but I never had a problem getting to work and I didn't see any abandoned or crashed cars on either journey. If I lived out in the sticks a bit though they would probably be worth while.


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## AndyA4TDI (May 7, 2012)

spursfan said:


> always one:wall: you don't live or work in the High Wycombe area then?
> what use is a towrope? that means you have already pranged the car.


High Wycombe is truly awful when it snows and extremely dangerous, switched to Michelin Cross Climates 2 years ago, love them


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## P4ULT (Apr 6, 2007)

Always amaze me how people’s views can be so different. I have the Michelin across Climate n my van and I dhad t rate them at all.


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## should_do_more (Apr 30, 2008)

Short answer, yes
Wow, old thread!


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## AnthonyUK (Jul 25, 2018)

P4ULT said:


> Always amaze me how people's views can be so different. I have the Michelin across Climate n my van and I dhad t rate them at all.


They are amazing. I had no problems in the snow this morning and know my summer set would not have got me off the drive in the RWD Merc.

In what circumstances are you not impressed?


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## Radish293 (Mar 16, 2012)

Hell yeah the are amazing


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Did my journey today on regular tyres, no issues.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

ollienoclue said:


> Did my journey today on regular tyres, no issues.


not all heroes wear capes oliie..

:wave:


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

Where I live is hilly and I sometimes need to leave for work early in the morning. 

I have a 335 and a Golf GT tsi, both cars have Bridgestone Blizzaks on their own steel wheels and I have never been stuck in the snow but have driven past many cars that have been spinning their wheels at 0mph, both front and rear wheel drive. A local garage stores the wheels during the summer and does the refit without charge.

I wouldnt go back to summer tyres in winter conditions unless I had the luxury of being able to go back to bed when I see a good covering of snow from the bedroom window.


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## spursfan (Aug 4, 2009)

uruk hai said:


> I've never bought them and I've never felt the need to, we had snow overnight but I never had a problem getting to work and I didn't see any abandoned or crashed cars on either journey. If I lived out in the sticks a bit though they would probably be worth while.


going to work yesterday, there were cars abandoned along the A413, watchet lane had 2 abandoned cars to go round, brimmers hill had 3, about 6 cars abandoned at top of Amersham hill and slope up to our office was a no go for all the guys, they ended up having to go round the one way street and into Easton street car park next door to exchange.
without the winters on, I would not have been able to get to work, well worth the money and personally, I try to minimise any chance of accidents, hence I pay for the right gear for the conditions, people choices at end of day:wave:


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## spursfan (Aug 4, 2009)

P4ULT said:


> Always amaze me how people's views can be so different. I have the Michelin across Climate n my van and I dhad t rate them at all.


Yeah, you may be right Paul, they are a compromise so don't really do anything really well, my view was to buy a new set when I brought my car last year, so set of new alloys and wintersport 5's all round, jack the car up in march/april and stick the summers on for 6 months or so.
must say that the Wintersport 5's are cracking tyres, very quiet compared to the Sportmax TT's and fuel economy is exactly the same, normally the winters drop a little on fuel economy.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

The Cueball said:


> not all heroes wear capes oliie..
> 
> :wave:


I know, maybe it is just my extreme level of skill, if it has got a throttle then I can drive it.

Snow does not concern me and I have only ever been stopped by actual snow once- when I lived in Exmoor and it didn't matter what tyres were on my Scoob because you needed a snowplough on the front to get anywhere the stuff was that deep.

It is stuck or smashed up vehicles or the police closing roads that stop you and again that won't matter what tyres you have on.

I don't know what people do for work but there is a balance to be struck between driving in conditions you know are bad, and getting to work. I am sure everyone is a HEMS doctor or life saving neurosurgeon who just must get to work on time but if my employer ever gave me grief for arriving late or not at all because of travel conditions I might have something to say about it. If I absolutely had to get somewhere and the conditions were that bad I would pop down the road on foot and borrow a tractor.

For a lot of people it is hard to see what they intend to achieve at work in some circumstances, in the locality last year during the beast from the east not a single truck or delivery van went anywhere and scores of people were not at work for the sole reason that the schools were shut so they had kids at home.

How far are you doing to push the personal safety vs work argument? It is no secret that the roads are frequented by eejits at the best of times, the risk of them crashing into you is not negated by the fact you have caterpillar tracks on.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

Many countries around the world require by law to have winter tyres on, if you listen to the naysayers than all these millions of people cannot drive, or are idiots.
Being brought up simple thinking in the winter you put the heating on, a warmer coat and winter tyres on the cars and trucks (since 1980) 

I live now in the UK, and for what it cost and piece of mind I put winter tyres on our cars.
Why take extra risks, why send a loved one on “the wrong shoes” out in the weather.
If I look at the cost, it’s very little, as a set last twice as long,for both the winter and the summer ones.

I sold last year a car to a local guy, and give him the winter tyres for free.
He laughed about that, “never used them before, don’t need them here”
Fair play for the guy, he ate his pride, and phoned me last winter, and said; should have done these tyres years ago, first time I can drive up to my house when there is snow or ice. 
Maybe not important, but important enough for me!


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## GleemSpray (Jan 26, 2014)

I understand the arguments for winter tyres, but have never bothered because i live in a very urban setting and just commute - if its icy the winter tyres would make no difference and on the rare occasions we get any sort of snow i just work from home or can easily get a bus or tram just a short walk away.

If i moved to a more rural location where car was the only option, i would deff get winter tyres.

Other than that i am very mindful that it takes a few miles for the tyres to heat up, so drive cautiously in winter anyhow.


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

We had about 4" of snow overnight. I thought the Hankooks 
winters on the Mini felt really good. They are better than I thought for a mid-range tyre. 

Normally I go for premium rubber, but it was all that was available. They were only £80 a corner.


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## Radish293 (Mar 16, 2012)

Best investment. I made.


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## NeilG40 (Jan 1, 2009)

GleemSpray said:


> I understand the arguments for winter tyres, but have never bothered because i live in a very urban setting and just commute - if its icy the winter tyres would make no difference


A younger more stupid version of myself would disagree with that after driving down a road at 30mph on an inch or so of solid ice which was result of snow thawing in to slush after which a sudden return of really cold weather turned in to ice.

It's not something I would do again but I didn't have to worry for grip.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

this has been asked year in year out for many years. its a bit like the does a wax add anything to a finish. The true answer is if you feel you benefit from winter tyres, then use them. if you feel you can cope without them, then do so. there is no right of wrong answer. I personally have never felt the need to use them where i live. not everywhere is the same. So if you want to use them, then do so. if you dont think you need them then dont put them on. It is up to the individual.


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## Chris Dyson (Feb 29, 2012)

Since the question was, are they worth it? In most of the UK for most of the winter, probably not because we don't get that much snow for that long. Parts of the North and Scotland excepted. When it's really bad book a duvet day if you can and build a snowman.

However, if the question is are they any better and safer than conventional summer tyres for when we do get snow and ice, then I would say definitely yes. I spent many years in my youth living in Canada and there winter tyres (not studded) went on in November and came off again in April. I would not have dared to use ordinary summer tyres in the winter there. 

At the end of the day, it is a case of whether the cost gives you peace of mind knowing you have the safest tyres for wintery conditions.


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## percymon (Jun 27, 2007)

My twelfth year using winter tyres, would not use anything else from November through April. So much better in greasy autumnal conditions, wet salted roads and obviously any snow


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## MrMatt (Apr 15, 2011)

I was in Basingstoke on Friday and 225/40R18 Eagle F1 asymmetric 3 had zip grip as I expected The sight rises going up to the ring road roundabouts were the main problem apart from wrong tyres due to poor sight lines causing people to stop and not be able to plan to keep moving. Many friendly people were out pushing cars once traffic stopped, myself included. That was at the west end of town rather than the M3 end though.

Planning to chop the car in before next winter but that one will definitely have a winter set of tyres. I have got some Autosocks that are due to be delivered in the mean time. Not sure if they will be any use but they will be in my boot along with the shovel and grit that helped me out on fri.


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## Radish293 (Mar 16, 2012)

Auto socks work well but there needs to be a lost of snow compacted snow works better. Take the. Off as soon as you reach decent tarmac. Don’t leave them on overnight they get brittle. They will certainly get you going. 


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## PugIain (Jun 28, 2006)

I'm currently the top bidder on a set of GT86 alloys and Michelin Primacy tyres.

The plan is keep those for summer use, as in the pictures they look great, and stick some slightly more rufty tufty tyres on my current alloys for use in the less clement seasons.


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## Stuart89 (Feb 14, 2010)




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## Stuart89 (Feb 14, 2010)

So winter tyres are better where temperatures are below 7° Celsius, period. They are not just for snow but have a different rubber compound to be softer at lower temperatures, providing better grip in the cold and wet.

Any issues with cost are null and void, you will be using winter tyres for 5-6 months of the year, meaning you are using your summer tyres for the other 6-7 months. So you half the wear rate of your summer tyres and they will last twice as long... cost is veto'd.


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## mattr8700 (Jan 17, 2016)

Caledoniandream said:


> Why take extra risks, why send a loved one on "the wrong shoes" out in the weather.


I like that comparison. I certainly wouldn't go out in my work shoes in snow and ice, I put on something more suited to the task, and with grip.

I brought some used (they'd done less than 1k) wintersports and 16" alloys this year and the difference they made is well worth the cost. They got me up a 14% hill of snow and ice without issue, no slipping at all.


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## Arvi (Apr 11, 2007)

Agree with the above 2 posts. I have 19" summer wheels and tyres on my RWD Alpina D3 and 17" winter wheels with tyres. Picked up the winter set for £375 with official BMW wheels. 

I got around so easily last year in the snow where some 4x4s struggled. Plus I've not had to replace the expensive 19" tyres for 4 years. When I sell the car I will make a fair bit back on the winter wheels, so cost is minimal / being in profit and safety has increased ten fold.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Stuart89 said:


> So winter tyres are better where temperatures are below 7° Celsius, period. They are not just for snow but have a different rubber compound to be softer at lower temperatures, providing better grip in the cold and wet.
> 
> Any issues with cost are null and void, you will be using winter tyres for 5-6 months of the year, meaning you are using your summer tyres for the other 6-7 months. So you half the wear rate of your summer tyres and they will last twice as long... cost is veto'd.


of cause there will be extra costs, you ether need to buy a second set of wheels, or pay to keep having the tyres changed over and balanced every time.


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

cheekymonkey said:


> of cause there will be extra costs, you ether need to buy a second set of wheels, or pay to keep having the tyres changed over and balanced every time.


Any costs are not necessarily excessive though.

Foe the past 10 years or so, I've bought a second-hand set of wheels for any if the cars I've bought. When I sold the cars, I sold the wheels and got back very nearly what I paid for them.

My last Exeo, I bought a set of genuine Exeo 18" alloys for £280. I sold the 4 summer tyres for £120, which covered the cost of a set of part worn winter tyres.

When I sold the car, I sold the rims for £300, and the 18" winter tyres for £60.

I may have actually made money in those various transactions lol.

Cooks

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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

I keep thinking about them, but I’m looking at 19” alloys on the BMW, so puts me off due to cost for the fairly short amount of bad weather time it causes me an issue...


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## should_do_more (Apr 30, 2008)

Andyblue said:


> I keep thinking about them, but I'm looking at 19" alloys on the BMW, so puts me off due to cost for the fairly short amount of bad weather time it causes me an issue...


Get the smallest wheel size you can get away with. I went for 17" on my car from 19" and it opens up a whole load of choice.


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## GP Punto (May 29, 2007)

The video comparison above was quite an eye opener, especially the massively reduced braking distance from quite a low speed.

I am just thing that had there been a vehicle within that braking zone then any accident would have been my fault, I would have had my £350 excess to pay, possible injuries and time off work not to mention increased insurance costs. No expert in motoring law but I guess that if I go into the back of someone in the snow then the police could be looking at a conviction of some sort.

Makes buying winter tyres and wheels seem cheap.

I have had my current set of steel wheels and winter tyres for 6 years, there is 5mm of tread remaining so possibly two more years of use, and of course when they are on the car there is less risk of damage to the regular alloys and wear on the summer tyres which are also six years old.

I really think that winter tyres not only *have the potential* to save you money but they do give you peace of mind especially when the family are on board.

Having said all that, the winter weather in Yorkshire has been very mild so far.


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

Andyblue said:


> I keep thinking about them, but I'm looking at 19" alloys on the BMW, so puts me off due to cost for the fairly short amount of bad weather time it causes me an issue...


I bought a set of the 18" m Sport rims for my f30 - i've fitted the recommebded 225/45/18 pirelli sottozero.

If you have the performance brakes, I'm reliably informed that the smallest sized wheel you can get away with is 18"

Cooks

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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

should_do_more said:


> Get the smallest wheel size you can get away with. I went for 17" on my car from 19" and it opens up a whole load of choice.


Cheers mate, but think 19" is smallest as I've got the upgraded brakes...


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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

Cookies said:


> I bought a set of the 18" m Sport rims for my f30 - i've fitted the recommebded 225/45/18 pirelli sottozero.
> 
> If you have the performance brakes, I'm reliably informed that the smallest sized wheel you can get away with is 18"
> 
> ...


Oh okay - that's good to know mate, thanks. Not 100% convinced for the fronts as there really isn't a great deal of space between the calliper and wheel - still struggling to find a brush that will fit the gap...

Might have to investigate a bit further :thumb:


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

Andyblue said:


> Oh okay - that's good to know mate, thanks. Not 100% convinced for the fronts as there really isn't a great deal of space between the calliper and wheel - still struggling to find a brush that will fit the gap...
> 
> Might have to investigate a bit further :thumb:


The large wheel woollie won't really fit, tbh. I bought an EZ detail wheel brush, and it works great. A wee bit tight between the caliper and rim, but it's grand. Actually, the rear is closer than the front!!! If you want a few pics, I'll take some later when I'm back home.

Cheers

Cooks

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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

Cookies said:


> The large wheel woollie won't really fit, tbh. I bought an EZ detail wheel brush, and it works great. A wee bit tight between the caliper and rim, but it's grand. Actually, the rear is closer than the front!!! If you want a few pics, I'll take some later when I'm back home.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> ...


Thanks Cooks

That be appreciated :thumb:


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

Andyblue said:


> Thanks Cooks
> 
> That be appreciated :thumb:


Here you go.

The standard 18" m Sport rims are 8.5" rears, and 8" fronts. BMW recommends a square set up with 225/45/18 All round for winter tyres. I clarified with BMW about using the square set up with staggered wheels, and it's not a problem given that 8.5" is 216mm!! So all good.

Cheers.

Cooks









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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

Cheers Cooks. 

Will have to keep an eye open for a set :thumb:


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## Cookies (Dec 10, 2008)

Andyblue said:


> Cheers Cooks.
> 
> Will have to keep an eye open for a set :thumb:


The Pirelli Sottozero star rated runflats are on oponeo at the moment for £134 each including delivery!!

There are loads of good sets of 400m rims on gumtree.

Cooks

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