# Meguiars Microfibre DA Correction System - Test 1



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

This is just a quick thread to give an initial flavour of the new Meguiars Microfibre DA correction system, which I will be testing over the coming weeks in a variety of different tests. 

So - my first introduction to microfibre being used with a DA for correction was with the Chemical Guys microfibre pads and using V36/38 Optical polishes, the latter not being specifically designed for use with microfibre but despite this they worked very well... So this was to be the benchmark which I would measure the Meguiars against, as well as comparing to correction by foam and on the rotary (subjects of future threads).

One of the things that struck me when reading the bottles of the products (Correction Compound and Finishing Wax) was the short working time suggested, as I for one am a fan of long work times to ensure the product is fully worked... but this gave me an idea for the first part of the testing - if the work times are short, then this lends itself to ease of use on a sunny day where long work times are not always possible because the heat can dry out the product. So, to put this to the test, take one sunny afternoon (rare summer weather! :lol, and a red Astra with moderate defects and hazing.

The bonnet of the test car before...










Now, the Meguiars system comes with two different pads and products: a cutting microfibre and a finishing microfibre, and a cutting compound (Correction Compound) and finishing product (Finishing Wax) which combines refinement and the waxing stage... On this panel, I decided to start off with the Correction Compound on the cutting pad. The cutting pad has stiffer burgandy foam supporting the microfibre:










Applying the correction compound:










Priming the microfibre by massaging the compound into the microfibre pad...



















Additional working compound added:










A lot of product is used at this stage, but then you only need a couple of beads to top up between sets in testing. Between sets it is also essentially just to use your fingers to ruffle the microfibre back up so it doesn't clog and lie flat.

Application was with the new G220 V2 (separate thread on my thoughts on this to follow), spreading the product over a 1' square area at speed 2 and then working the product on speed 5. Working was with firm pressure, between 10 and 15lbs, and with very slow hand movements (slower than typical for foam at less than 1" per second)... only six or seven passes were made over a two minute period with the product before switching the machine off. This seemed like a very short set, but the residue had gone clear at this stage and in the sunlight the finish appeared to be corrected and quite well refined... The results after a short set with the compound:



















I was impressed as the short work time still gave significant correction and to my eyes very good finishing as well with no micromarring evident and a nice gloss with good clarity. Still the finishing stage to go. The abrasive style of the new Correction Compound seems to cut hard and break down quickly so it gets the correction quickly before breaking down to refine so you need less work time, which was handy in this direct sunlight! Longer work times will be experimented with in due course, but these are the results roughly following the instructions on the bottle 

Anyways, with these results, it was time to refine the finish using the Finishing Wax on a finishing microfibre. The difference between the two microfibre pads is the supporting foam, and the finishing pad has got softer black foam supporting the microfibre:










Applying the Finishing Wax, the pad was primed as above:










Spread at speed 2, worked at speed 4 for a couple of minutes again - this time using lighter pressure (5 - 10lbs) but still slow hand movements. This product seemed to have a longer work time, but I stuck roughly to the short work times for this test and will look at longer work times in future tests. The residue buffed off with real ease, almost as easy as CG 50/50 wax and this was one thing that really appealed to me. The results...



















The clarity seemed very good at this stage, though I reckon it can still be improved upon with longer sets with the Finishing Wax especially, so I will be experimenting with that in due course  However, I was impressed with this initial set of results given the speed at which they were achieved in terms of work time. Some more finished shots... Only about one third of the bonnet completed so far:














































Now, the Finishing Wax suggests that the job is done at this stage, so I will be testing the finish and durability offered by this product too - so a couple of water tests, showing how the product performs with water: driver's side of bonnet treated, passenger side just washed and clayed, and you can see a clear difference in the water sheeting, the Finishing Wax delviering decent sheeting ability though for me below what I would achieve using a dedicated wax such as Meguiars #16 (please excuse my dad who was pouring the water on the car who saw the cat that sits on and scratches his car bonnet and digs in the garden - I think he was seeking revenge with the watering can :lol::lol:





Of course, there is nothing to stop you applying a wax after the Finsihing wax to enhance the water beading and sheeting, and as a stand alone the Finishing wax does perform well in its own right.

So - first impressions are very positive so far, the speed and ease of use being big plus points and the results for me speaking for themselves even very early in the testing. This is just the start, so watch this space for further threads as the system is put through its paces


----------



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

PS - just to point out, this car has been resprayed at the front so is not standard Vauxhall - it seems harder than your typical Vauxhall and also has a clearcoat now.

Further tests will be carried out on this car, as you can see it leads a hard life...



















so it will be the perfect test for the new system


----------



## Beau Technique (Jun 21, 2010)

Looks impressive. Still watching with the micorfibre pads. Surprising its taken so long for the concept to finally be released.


----------



## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

Very interested in these, more so now!


----------



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

I also reckon that longer work times with the compound (and there are a variety of ways we could achieve this) would deliver better correction on the deeper marks that also exist on this car - between cats and gorse bushes, it doesn't exactly lead an easy life paintwork wise :lol: But will put a correction system through its paces. I didn't want to do repeat hits or long work times in this test, just wanted to see what could be achieved with a short work time as stated on the bottle and a single correction and single finishing set


----------



## Dre (Jun 6, 2010)

Looks great! Thanks for the write up.

Did you import it? Or is this as a set already to buy in the UK?


----------



## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

great review, thanks for your time on this post


----------



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Dre said:


> Looks great! Thanks for the write up.
> 
> Did you import it? Or is this as a set already to buy in the UK?


You can buy these products from a few traders in the UK


----------



## Dre (Jun 6, 2010)

Dave KG said:


> You can buy these products from a few traders in the UK


Ow cool! completely overlooked! Am very curious how this system works on hard VAG paint and faded paint.


----------



## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

Nice little test Dave , its a very odd system to get your head around but it does work and works well, i found as you may have after speaking to people that have been using this system for a long time aswell as testing for the manufacturers that everything slows down slightly including time , the biggest issue that is for me anyway and most people is cleaning the pad , airline is the choice of Pro,s in the US using it but not something i have at hand , therefore its lots of pads as i dont want to be damaging the microfibre brushing etc , it needs to be blown clean ideally.


----------



## Mr Face (Jan 22, 2009)

Nice one :thumb:


----------



## johandc (May 8, 2011)

Will these pads work on any DA backing plate?


----------



## prokopas (Apr 29, 2010)

johandc said:


> Will these pads work on any DA backing plate?


I can't see why they won't


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

I've been using these for a while now and have been impressed - especially on sticky paints, I still find at this point in time I prefer to switch to a foam for finishing instead of the MF disc though


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

Heavenly said:


> Nice little test Dave , its a very odd system to get your head around but it does work and works well, i found as you may have after speaking to people that have been using this system for a long time aswell as testing for the manufacturers that everything slows down slightly including time , the biggest issue that is for me anyway and most people is cleaning the pad , airline is the choice of Pro,s in the US using it but not something i have at hand , therefore its lots of pads as i dont want to be damaging the microfibre brushing etc , it needs to be blown clean ideally.


This is definitely a downside, I've found you need to use compressed air/black baron to properly clean them, either that or you'll need to have a good few to hand and keep washing/rotating them about.


----------



## Kevin Brown (May 10, 2008)

From another thread:

Rake+hair=FAIL

The post:

_*USE A RAKE TO COMB YOUR HAIR? I DON'T THINK SO!*_

Imagine having to remove some sort of gritty, oily, caked on goop from your hair using nothing more than a common leaf rake. For guys like me, _imagining_ a full head of hair is merely a harsh reminder of what once was, but I digress. For the hairy-headed among us, think about how futile such an attempt might be.

Unless the rake's teeth were able to force their way between the hairs and strip the goop away, all that would likely occur is perhaps a haphazard _redo_ of your _'do!_ I think it's pretty safe to say that most of the hair on your head would stay packed tightly together. The probability of cleaning and separating thousands of hair strands using the comparatively thick and flimsy raking teeth is undoubtedly very low.

Yet, in the midst of a polishing session, many of us attempt to clean our buffing pads using nothing more than a run of the mill, nylon bristled brush. Unless the pad is coated in dry or crusty residue, agitating the fibers or pores of a pad won't do a whole lot of good. In fact, other than seeing some foam or fibrous pad remnants and a few crusty residue bits, I don't recall seeing any oil or grease droppings oozing from the brush. Isn't there a better way to clean *foam*, *microfiber*, or *microfinger* pads on the fly?

Back to the hair: I suppose that if we didn't have shampoo and water handy, most of use would reach for a towel in an attempt to wipe the goop away. Perhaps we would first wipe our hair with the towel, then agitate it with a brush, and repeat both steps until we were satisfied that we had removed all we could.

In fact, lots of us use this exact method for cleaning our pads when we are polishing paint using *random orbital* machines. First, we agitate the pad with a brush. Then, we place the face of the pad against a towel and run the machine until the pad looks pretty clean. Some guys will go one step further and mist the pad with water, then repeat the towel step (I do this while cutting, but never for finishing). Three steps later, the pad usually looks pretty darned good!

Sounds like a lot of work, and it is. Luckily, *there is a much better way*.

The best way to clean a buffing pad in the midst of a polishing session is to *blow it clean using compressed air*. A high-pressure blast of air aimed directly at the pad's face loosens stuck-on contaminants, and will have no problem separating fibers or cleaning pores with ease. Compressed air works incredibly well on wool pads, so the need to spur a pad is virtually eliminated. With air, there's no way I'm transferring trace amounts of plastic or metal onto my pads as I clean them. One less *big* deal to worry about.

Most detailers and paint polishing enthusiasts don't keep a portable air compressor in their polishing kits, so perhaps it's not a reasonable option for most folks right now. But rest assured, as our pads become more fibrous and our compounds feature finer and more capable abrasives, you're going to need an air compressor.

So the next time the desire hits to buy that "must have" polishing machine, consider purchasing a small air compressor instead. Once you make the switch, you may just realize that you didn't _need_ that new machine after all.


----------



## Kevin Brown (May 10, 2008)

johandc said:


> Will these pads work on any DA backing plate?


Backing plate choice is pretty much up to the user, although Meguiar's does recommend their *W67DA* for the 5-1/2 pads, and their *S6BP* for the 6-1/4" pads.

Recently posted this about backing plate choice in reference to the discs: BP's for DA Discs


----------



## Kevin Brown (May 10, 2008)

*Oh, and sorry for the hi-jack of your thread, Dave.*

I am a *HUGE FAN *of your write-ups, :argie: as you know, and *I REALLY LIKE THESE DISCS*!!!!


----------



## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

Great write up Dave, looks like a great new system, and definitely something I'll be buying into.

How many pads do you think you'd need to buy to polish a whole car, without cleaning? Say a Golf sized car for example. Seems the easiest way, then clean at home afterwards.


----------



## Typhoon 180 (Oct 26, 2006)

Clark @ PB said:


> I've been using these for a while now and have been impressed - especially on sticky paints, I still find at this point in time I prefer to switch to a foam for finishing instead of the MF disc though


so how many pads would you say you use on a average size car with medium to hard paint if you was to rotate the use of them so you didnt want to clean the pads, and how long do they last, is it worth it compared to foam pads?

sorry for the questions as its something i would look into to use myself :thumb:


----------



## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

steves cleenz said:


> so how many pads would you say you use on a average size car with medium to hard paint if you was to rotate the use of them so you didnt want to clean the pads, and how long do they last, is it worth it compared to foam pads?
> 
> sorry for the questions as its something i would look into to use myself :thumb:


I dare say it will differ from person to person but I found the performance of the pad dropped if it wasn't cleaned after every polishing set (i.e after every 2 x 2 section on a bonnet etc) so you would need a fair few if you were to rotate. If you keep them clean by compressed air etc then you should see at least several cars through with a couple of discs. I've had 2 cutting and 2 finishing discs to play with for the last few months and while I haven't really used the finishing ones much I've done 3 full cars and a test bonnet with the cutting ones so far and they're holding up very well.


----------



## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

The need for compressed air for the best way of cleaning the pads up is one of the disadvantages and I will be investigating other possibilities throughout my testing of the pads for those of us who do not have an air compressor around... I would also clean the pad through after every polishing set, I was experimenting using a foot pump to blow the pads clean with the nozzle for blowing up a paddling pool (yes, seriously  - but many of us don't have an air compressor), and with gently ruffling the fibres. The fibres clogging and remaining flat are not something I would then want to just add polish too.

On a car, you could get through with two and rotating them, I haven't got any personal experience as yet of the durability of the pads but Clark above seems to be getting his to last... personally, to be comfortable, I'd probably double that amount to four and have them in rotation 

Regarding finisihing, this is an interesting point and certainly something I will be investigating further... personally, I can see the microfibre certainly matching foam finishing by DA (though a lot of testing with a variety of working techniques and abrasives on the market is required to put this through its paces), and perhaps we will see it exceeding it but I can't say whether it will or not until I have spent more time trying new methods - it will likely be the case that they will suit some but not others for finishing. I am not a fan of the DA for refining, though I know others use them more extensively, personally I much prefer the rotary but again it is all down to styles, and beliefs about how abrasives are breaking down.


----------



## Typhoon 180 (Oct 26, 2006)

Thanks for the replys


----------



## spiros (Mar 30, 2010)

Dave KG said:


> The need for compressed air for the best way of cleaning the pads up is one of the disadvantages and I will be investigating other possibilities throughout my testing of the pads for those of us who do not have an air compressor around... I would also clean the pad through after every polishing set, I was experimenting using a foot pump to blow the pads clean with the nozzle for blowing up a paddling pool (yes, seriously  - but many of us don't have an air compressor), and with gently ruffling the fibres. The fibres clogging and remaining flat are not something I would then want to just add polish too.
> 
> On a car, you could get through with two and rotating them, I haven't got any personal experience as yet of the durability of the pads but Clark above seems to be getting his to last... personally, to be comfortable, I'd probably double that amount to four and have them in rotation
> 
> Regarding finisihing, this is an interesting point and certainly something I will be investigating further... personally, I can see the microfibre certainly matching foam finishing by DA (though a lot of testing with a variety of working techniques and abrasives on the market is required to put this through its paces), and perhaps we will see it exceeding it but I can't say whether it will or not until I have spent more time trying new methods - it will likely be the case that they will suit some but not others for finishing. I am not a fan of the DA for refining, though I know others use them more extensively, personally I much prefer the rotary but again it is all down to styles, and beliefs about how abrasives are breaking down.


hey dave can we use the compound with foam pads?


----------



## DE 1981 (Aug 17, 2007)

I must have been one of the first to import this system when it first came out in the states and my thoughts are as follows.

To me its one of those system that changes the goal posts, I liken it to the introduction of automotive clays and the impact it had ie huge time savings. This system will allow even a novice to achieve superb results.

On certain applications the correction compound can finish down lsp ready and I know a few guys in the states have said the same thing, personally I prefer to follow up the correction compound with for example menz 85rd on the rotary but that's just my personal preference.

Another option which I've used if I require just a but more cut is megs 105 on the correction pad which have yielded impressive levels of cut and correction along with 105 excellent finishing down abilities making the finishing step a pleasure.

If I require maximum levels of cut I plump for megs 105 on a surbuf pad followed by the microfibre system in effect making a 3 stage process. 

It really is huge technological advance in paint correction terms making it much easier for enthusiasts and professionals alike to achieve great levels of correction in a much safer and easier way. I'm just glad the likes of cleanyourcar and elite are stocking as it is expensive to import from the states.

Big thumbs up to meguiars for genuine 'game changing' technology-it's been a long time in development but the wait was worth it.


----------



## DE 1981 (Aug 17, 2007)

Forgot to add a few things.

Pad priming is obviously very important, not saturated but primed. Once primed it's amazing how little product you need, this stuff will last a long time. Two small pea sized dots are enough, arm speed is another important factor, very slow machine movement almost to the point you think it's to slow will yield the best results.

With regards to cleaning of pads, compressed air is the best most effective cleaning during the process however I took the decision to make sure I have and use lots of pads during a paint correction commission-I generally and this is just me use a fresh pad per panel and thoroughly blow out pads in between passes using compressed air.


----------



## twissler (Apr 6, 2009)

Any real downsides to the MF pads, except the cleaning issue? On a rotary I assume they'll create too much heat risking paint burn and also not allowing any time for the polish to work which is why it's for DA use? Ive no experience of rotary polishing just DA so I'm making a somewhat educated guess here.


----------



## uberwax (Feb 14, 2006)

DE 1981 said:


> I must have been one of the first to import this system when it first came out in the states and my thoughts are as follows.
> 
> To me its one of those system that changes the goal posts, I liken it to the introduction of automotive clays and the impact it had ie huge time savings. This system will allow even a novice to achieve superb results.
> 
> ...


Hiya
As above, i also got these in when they first came out in America.

I have been really impressed with the cutting ability of the pads. I have tried this out with lots of makes of cars, and have found on some of the softer paints (ie hyundai) the polishing pad and liquid can do a great amount of correction. If needed the correcting pads the liquid are great, however have found two hits are needed with vag paint, so i too used 105 which worked amazingly and suprisingly polished down very well and pretty much lsp ready.


----------



## dschia (Sep 21, 2008)

Thanks for sharing Dave.

Anyway some observations from using the DA system in my previous detail. I experience DA marring mark with the d300 compound + MF cutting disc on a moderately hard paint. It could be my technique but I do doubt it can be finish marr-free on most paintwork. Not a big deal actually considering that how much defect this combo can remove plus so much safer to use.

Like most mentioned, cleaning is a problem. Be it spuring or wiping with MF, it is really nothing like compress air. Compress air will force the DA to orbit fast enough and it is this motion plus the air that will spur out the residue. Foot pump doesn't sound forceful enough.


----------



## tom-225 (Aug 30, 2009)

these new DA systems seem good, i have got hold of a Surebuff pad that i have been testing out with the Gtechniq P1 system and so far find it to offer a great level of correction while also finishing down very well. only thing i have found is that with a normal polish the finish left isnt the best and very hazy.

i am looking for a system that is going to enable me to stick with using a DA so i dont have to fork out for a rotary but i want to be able to up the level of correction i can produce.


----------



## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Good stuff Dave!

On Autogeek store site, the Meg's reps with Mike were using speed 4 for compounding, and speed 3 for the finishing wax.

This should certainly help with your work times! :thumb:


----------



## Leemack (Mar 6, 2009)

Cheers for the review Dave.

Interesting concept - Weird looking at those MF pads though 

Worth a try i guess


----------

