# Porsche 911 - £9,350 ....SCAM ?



## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

Hello all,

I spotted the attached advert in our local rag on Saturday (sorry for the quality - phone camera) - it says:
"PORSCHE 911 TURBO
3.6ltr, 2003, Silver Coupe,
44000 mls, excel cond, 11
mths mot, 11mths tax, FSH,
ABS, A/C, alarm, airbag
£9,350 ono
020 36033850"

What a bargain, a ~£25K Porsche for £9,350 and its "ono" too!! :doublesho

What the heck, I rang the number, 'the person you rang is unavailable at the moment, please leave a message' - I didn't.

Well lo-and-behold, an hour or so later I get a text message:
"Hi, My name is George,I have received your message regarding my 2003 PORSCHE 911.Is still for sale,for more info contact me by mail at <name>@hotmail.com" - Punctuation and grammer as per text and I've withheld the email name - I don't want any one else getting my bargain :lol:

So sent email ...

Me to George
"Hello George,

Could you send me some details about your car please, and some photos if you have them.

thank you,
"

George to Me
"Manufacturer: Porsche
Colour: Silver Model: 911
Engine Size: 3600 cc Type: Coupe
Mileage: 44000
Power: 420

Navigation System, AM/FM Stereo, CD Player, Premium Sound System Service History: Yes
Interior/Comfort Options: Power Seats, Air Conditioning, Power Windows, Climate Control, Power Locks, Leather Seats, Power-assisted Steering (PAS), Sunroof Safety Features: Anti-Lock Brakes (ABS), Passenger Airbag, Electronic Stability Program (ESP), Immobiliser, Driver Airbag, Xenon headlights, Alarm, Side Airbags, 4-Wheel Drive
"
With 19 photos of the car attached.

Me to George
"George,

That looks very nice. I hope you don't mind, I have a few questions.
You are asking £9,350? 
Is it mechanically sound? 
Has it had any major work or require any major work?
Has it been an insurance write-off?
Is it HPI clear?
How much Service History?
Where can it be viewed?

thanks
"
George to Me
"The car is in excellent condition, with everything working on it. All consumables(oil, filters, brakes) changed, tires in very good shape.HPI clear,Full Service History.The car is located in Berlin, Germany and so am I. We've recently moved to Germany and brought it with us. It's in showroom condition, no scratches, no dents, accident-free. 2003 model and still UK registered. RHD, UK supplied (NOT AN IMPORT). 44000 miles. The price I'm after is 9350 pounds sterling including delivery to your home address and full insurance during shipping. Please let me know if you're interested so I can provide you with further details.

Thanks for the interest
"

Me to George
"Just a couple of more questions -

Is it taxed and MOT'd (if so, for how long)?
Why are you selling it so cheaply?

thanks
"

Awaiting a reply to that one ....

So alarm bells ....
(1) £9,350 for a £25K car
(2) A London number 020 in a midlands rag
(3) A text message saying the car was still for sale even though I left no message - I could have been calling about anything
(4) Just moved to Germany - erm!

So the photos he sent showed the car reg, so I looked it up on 'Free Reg Check' - says its a Porsche 911 Turbo, 2003, Silver - taxed until May (George's advert said 11 mths tax).

A little more digging on Google turned up ....
http://www.mobiya.co.uk/view/ajptpdgtw (Chingford London - 07006262613 - beware, this is a 'follow me' number so could be expensive to ring)
http://www.thecarexchange.co.uk/car_sales/SearchCars/SalesAdvertsSQL.asp?ID=44195 (London, Avon)
http://www.autoweb.co.uk/used/car/porsche/911_turbo/13095005 (London, Cheshire)
http://www.clickcars.co.uk/FullAdDetails.aspx~AdRef~TW1524675 (London, E4)

I just wonder how many local newspapers and web sites the add has been run in. Opinions please?

To be continued .....


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

it's a scam... or possibly a scamola...

:thumb:


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

dont know why you need to ask to be honest


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

Of course it's a scam.


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## OCDDetailer (May 17, 2011)

If it sounds to good to be true, it more than often is!


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

I was just hoping it could have been another 'Tim Shaw' moment - remember that one? Shaw's wife, sold his Lotus Esprit, worth £25,000, for 50p on eBay


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

tommy1257 said:


> I was just hoping it could have been another 'Tim Shaw' moment - remember that one? Shaw's wife, sold his Lotus Esprit, worth £25,000, for 50p on eBay


Buy it then report back :wave:

Dont by the way !!!


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

Oh and the car is actually for sale on eBay for 35k , he must be doing a discount for selling out of eBay ;-)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/03-03-POR...3844517?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item19c70f3325


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Shaun said:


> Oh and the car is actually for sale on eBay for 35k , he must be doing a discount for selling out of eBay ;-)
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/03-03-POR...3844517?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item19c70f3325


:lol:

that's just round the corner from me...

:thumb:


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

nice plate and it is registered to the car as well not a made up one one owner from new bet he is gutted who ever is selling it the money they must have lost on that bonkers


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

Shaun said:


> Oh and the car is actually for sale on eBay for 35k , he must be doing a discount for selling out of eBay ;-)
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/03-03-POR...3844517?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item19c70f3325


Going by listing, final value and paypal fees....a £25k+ discount for cash may not be far off :lol:


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## RaceGlazer (Jan 10, 2007)

Clear scam - you'd not even get a dog of an SC for this money now..

One of my staff had a similar experience with a Beetle Cabrio which was located in Spain, didn't take too long to expose that attempt


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Bottom price for 996 Turbos is approx £30k right now, give or take. Still a bargain considering the performance, tuning potential, and that they were nigh on £100k new with a few options fitted.


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

Ask for the chasms number, lol


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## lofty (Jun 19, 2007)

Google the email address, if the seller is a frequent scammer there will be a record somewhere.


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

Me to George
"Just a couple of more questions -

Is it taxed and MOT'd (if so, for how long)?
Why are you selling it so cheaply?

thanks
"

George to Me
"I'm selling the car because I don't have time to enjoy it plus that I have some financial problems and I need money very soon.MOT Expiry: Jun 2012 Road Tax: May 2012
Since I have a written contract with the shipping company they will handle this sale for me and they will act as a third party between us. I can give you the website of the Germany shipping company where my car is held and you can get in touch with them. They will explain the entire procedure regarding payment and shipping. I also hope that the car being in Germany is not a major inconvenience for you. I know that at this price I will find a buyer in no time, so this isn't a major inconvenience for me.
"

To "The Cueball" - do KLASSICKS MOTOR COMPANY know their car is with a shipping company in Germany? If not you'd better show them this thread :thumb:

Right - next email to George coming up, see if I can coax an address out of him ...


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## RaceGlazer (Jan 10, 2007)

This is exactly how it went with the Beetle...


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## Liverpool-Lad (Jun 27, 2006)

Keep the scam baiting rolling


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

The next installment ....

Me to George
"Yes please, give me details of the website.

I've finally got my brother to agree to go and view the car for me - he's in the 5th Battalion of The Rifles, stationed in Paderborn (says its about a 4 hour drive to Berlin) - so if you can give me your address we can arrange a day and time.

thanks 
"

George to Me
"Please check with the shipping company even now on www.logistictransporting.com ,go to the page Contacts and on the left side of the page you will see a live help, click on start chat. They do have a live help operator there, just click on the button called 'Live Support' on the top of the page and he will help you with the info you need. Just ask about my car which is there, in their warehouse,already inspected,with all its papers and ready to be shipped. They will give you all the info you need regarding delivery and payment details because I have already signed a contract with them and they will act as a third party between us.

Best Regards
"

Now this is interesting - it looks like a bona-fide site; however, there is another site with a similar name "www.logisticstransport.com" and on their site they have a Car Shipping Warning 
"WARNING: Please be aware of online fraudulent activities concerning the delivery of cars that have been advertised for sale on line.

*************WE DO NOT TRANSPORT CARS, WE ARE A BROKERAGE OF ALL FORMS OF STORAGE AND DISTRIBUTION SERVICES**************

These parties are demanding a deposit upfront and that the likes of LogisticsTransport.com will deliver the car. LogisticsTransport.com would like to make our customers aware that we have no links to this form of distribution and beware of any organisation that mentions us in connection with this activity.

They may use email addresses with extensions such as logisticstransport @ secureroot.com. Whereas our email addresses are @logisticstransport.com
"

The IP for George's shipping is company is 98.138.19.88 which is registered in CA and appears to be associated with Yahoo.

The plot thickens!


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## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

It amazes me that folk get caught out with things like this - I know of someone that got stung for nearly £35K when buying a black M3 CSL a few years ago! :doublesho


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

A quick look in Google with LogisticTransporting address from their Contact page - "logistics companies berlin SIEGFRIEDSTR. 34, 10365" turns up a couple of hits with 
- Whitehorse-Movers
- Versandco

and a SCAM reporting website that has exposed these 2 - just signed up awaiting verification, so I can report it there.

Already reported in on actionfraud.org.uk


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

i'm using their online chat just now for a laugh: -

Arthur12:51:40
Are you familiar with our 6 steps transaction?
Visitor12:51:46
no
Arthur12:51:55
Please follow me and I will explain.
12:52:04
1. Both parties agree to terms of the transaction, which includes a full and accurate description of the merchandise, sale price, number of days for the Buyer's inspection (2-3 days).
2. We will provide you the payment details.
12:52:13
3. You will have to submit the payment, by bank transfer, into our bank account in maximum 24 hours after you will receive the payment details. The money will remain in our account and will NOT be forwarded to the seller until the buyer receives, inspects and accepts the vehicle.
4. As soon as the vehicle leaves our warehouse we will send you the tracking number.
12:52:22
5. The Buyer has a number of 2-3 days for an inspection and the option to accept or reject the vehicle.
6. If the buyer accepts the vehicle, we will forward the payment to the seller. Should you dislike the vehicle for any reason, we will refund you in FULL in maximum 48 hours and return the vehicle to the seller at his expense.

----

Might as well waste some of his time


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

Excellent :thumb:

Well I suppose there is a bit of truth in there:
"The money will remain in our account and will NOT be forwarded to the seller .." They are the 'seller' and it will remain in their account (briefly)

Ask if you can inspect the car before you send any money.


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

I asked a bunch of stuff - I can inspect the car in Berlin once it's paid....but not before 'as they're a shipping company, not a showroom'

I've been barred from their live chat now :-(


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## toomanycitroens (Jan 14, 2011)

Just bought it!
£5k cash in hand, what a bargain-----ooh hang on, the rozzers are following me, must go, sorry!


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

George is getting keen .....

George to Me
"Please let me know if you are able to complete the transaction with my shipping company or no.
Mail me asap.
Thanks 
"
I'll have a chat with his transport company (when their Live chat comes online) - I'll start off in German 

Also posted an alert on "http://fraud.forumandco.com" and sent an email to "Klassicks Motor Company" to alert them of whats going on.


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## EliteCarCare (Aug 25, 2006)

And the moral of this story is..................

there's no such thing as a cheap 911! 

Alex


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

Alex - all too true

Anyway back on the case ......... online chat with the German Warehouse ...

Rough translations
(Sie sind haben ein Auto für einen Klienten? = you have a car for a client)
(es wird gestohlen? = Is it stolen)
(Erklären Sie? = Explain this)

Here we go .....

Albert10:12:57 Hello!

Visitor10:13:00 guten Morgen
10:13:11 Sie sind haben ein Auto für einen Klienten?

Albert10:13:42 I think it's better to speak english.
10:13:54 Tell me what car are you interested in?

Visitor10:14:11 porsche 911

Albert10:14:21 Seller name?

Visitor10:14:35 George

Albert10:14:43 One moment please!

10:16:13 I have found the vehicle as being a Flag this message 2003 PORSCHE 911 996 TURBO TIPTRONIC S, owner George Roberts.

10:16:17 is this correct?

Visitor10:17:01 ja 
10:17:02 yes

Albert10:17:08 The vehicle is in our warehouse and it has been inspected by our certified inspectors along with all its papers.
10:17:26 Are you familiar with our 6 steps transaction?

Visitor10:17:32 nein 
10:17:34 no

Albert10:17:49 Please follow me and I will explain.

Guff Guff Guff (as per Bero conversation)

10:18:42 Read them carrefully and ask me any question you may have.

Visitor10:19:26 es wird gestohlen?

Albert10:19:54 The vehicle has never had any accidents. It has never been stolen. The service book is up to date.

Visitor10:20:10 http://www.klassicksmotorcompany.co.uk/used-cars/porsche-911-2dr-coatbridge-201128401644935

10:20:31 Erklären Sie?

Then I got this "You have been banned!"

How unsporting !!

I think I will ask George ([email protected]) about it.....


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## Bero (Mar 9, 2008)

tommy1257 said:


> Then I got this "You have been banned!"
> 
> How unsporting !!


:lol: - i logged in a few times before he realised i was winding him up and barred me.

Everyone else on DW should waste some of his time too.

www.logistictransporting.com - don't worry they're not a real transport company, it's a front to get you onto their online chat.


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

EliteCarCare said:


> And the moral of this story is..................
> 
> there's no such thing as a cheap 911!
> 
> Alex


Not strictly true I know of a few people DESPERATE to get out of there 911,s and even more people trying to move on there bmw 6series but in general you are correct


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## impster (May 2, 2007)

Result!

10 minutes on the chat with Albert, asking questions, being 'keen', then - bang! the killer question:

"Is it as good as this one do you think? http://www.klassicksmotorcompany.co....01128401644935"

reply:
"You have been banned!"

That's a 'win' in my book!


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## tommy1257 (Jan 30, 2012)

Told George I got banned from his Shipping Company's web chat ...
" 
So I've just got 3 words to say

Thief, liar and scum!!! 
"

Can't understand why he hasn't replied yet


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## MPS101 (May 6, 2011)

Using the IP you have the ISP is Yahoo, just report them and the transport website to Yahoo at:
[email protected]

and they should close him down, won't stop them but will cause him some problems


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