# Does snow foam need to be "thick"?



## rmac86 (Jun 6, 2013)

Is it really necessary to have an inch-thick layer of shaving foam on the car that stays there for 30 minutes or more? Most videos/photos on here seem to show thick clinging foam, but I’m wondering if there’s any advantage to it other than being able to dwell for 10 minutes or more?

Reason for asking is my lance has weak flow and makes a gurgling sound when on ‘full’ setting, forcing me to dial back the gauge slightly. This stops the gurgling but obviously produces a more ‘liquid’ foam which doesn’t cling as long - about 5 minutes. So other than dwell time, is there any other reason for me to need a thick foam?

I’ve almost given up on snow foam completely but seeing as the lance is still semi-useable I’d like to know if watery foam is worth using or should I just stop using it altogether?

Oh and before anyone suggests it, I’ve already gone through the whole disassembly and gauze cleaning and don’t want to do all that again.



Thanks,

R.


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Some foams aren't thick in general such as Bilt Hamber but it cleans very well. 5 mins of dwell is more than long enough to loosen some of the dirt on the car. the only reason I moved from BH to OW Blizzard was due to the thicker cling time and better dilutions. While the foam dwells I clean my alloys and I found the BH didn't dwell long enough to allow me to get around them. Obsession Wax Blizzard with only 25-30ml in a bottle lasts 10-15 mins easy which lets me get the alloys done.


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

Nope

Generally thicker foams aren't as good as thin ones


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

Thick foams are about eye candy, not functionality. A good pro will simply not be concerned about a thick foam.


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

There is a happy medium, if the lance is working correctly you eventually get to a point where you know what is just right for you regarding the foam in use. Something too fluid which may be what you experience will not be as effective as it could be but unnecessarily thick may not work to it's best and can hang around for ages on drives etc.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

I like a thick foam for pictures but there really isn't any difference in cleaning power.... 

The only thing i would say that if you are adding more water from the pw through the lance then the solution will obviously be more diluted there fore possibly less effective:wave:


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## james_death (Aug 9, 2010)

Thick foam does not mean it cleans better and infant could be poor at cleaning.


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## Coachman (Mar 8, 2015)

I'm in these let for a snowfoam. Was looking at the auto finesse one,
I like them thick so any suggestions?


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Angelwax fast foam is really good, cleans well and is nice and thick or as a alternative obsession wax blizzard:thumb:


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## Coachman (Mar 8, 2015)

Pittsy said:


> Angelwax fast foam is really good, cleans well and is nice and thick or as a alternative obsession wax blizzard:thumb:


Thanks  do these come in 5L?


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Ljh1991 said:


> Thanks  do these come in 5L?


Yup:thumb:


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## Coachman (Mar 8, 2015)

Pittsy said:


> Yup:thumb:


£ 40 for a 5l bottle. Ouch...


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Fast foam is alot cheaper but have a look at Brian1612's review.... 

I really like both of them tbh so for me its hard to split them, got something new to try over the weekend so looking forward to seeing the the results:thumb:


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## nappy (Oct 3, 2006)

If your foam is super thick I find it does not clean as effectively. Different companies will give guidance on use. Some foams are generally just crap... 

Really thick foam at this time of year is also hard to shift and you don't want to slip on your bum on frozen foam.


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

A foam should go on thick, that much is correct. If it fails to, it should be considered a prewash or TFR. It should then break down fairly quickly and will carry away dirt as it does so. 

So it should be super foamy but it shouldn't hang around excessively.


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## Blackroc (Dec 10, 2012)

Ljh1991 said:


> £ 40 for a 5l bottle. Ouch...


You have PM fella, I just need you to empty your mail box!


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## Coachman (Mar 8, 2015)

Blackroc said:


> You have PM fella, I just need you to empty your mail box!


I've made some space.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Ljh1991 said:


> I've made some space.


And this is the fella to talk too:thumb:


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## Demetrios72 (Jun 27, 2011)

Just got myself some Angelwax Fast Foam from Remyroc

Reviews are really good :thumb:


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## DrH (Oct 25, 2015)

Just got into the snow foam part of detailing. I have only tried Angelwax Fast Foam which has not produced a thick foam but has cleaned really well.

As a newbee here have been a bit confused that Angelwax does not get much mention here other than maybe they are not a Sponser


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## -Ash-ST (May 15, 2013)

Used valet pro and never looked back. Awesome snow foam and usually good deal at shop n shine


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Just as a bit more info. The obsession blizzard may seem expensive at £40 for 5L but when you break it down per wash it is, as far as I know the cheapest snow foam on the market. 25-30ml per wash compared to the 1" or 100ml of most other snow foams gives you at least 3/4x as many washes from it. I found myself using 100ml of BH foam, may only be £17 per 5L but you only get 50 washes from it. From my calculations it was roughly 10p cheaper per wash with the blizzard, with a nicer clinging foam than what I got with auto foam. Initial price seems steep but when you do the maths, you see what a bargain it is. 

Ps. As pittsy said, my review is in the pre wash section if you want more info on the obsession blizzard.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Lol £40 for 5L I pay a less than that for 25L of AutoGlym advanced TFR. Which you can run neat or diluted to great effect and whilst it uses the TFR label it's not done any damage to any part of our 4 cars in the last year of using it.


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

DrH said:


> Just got into the snow foam part of detailing. I have only tried Angelwax Fast Foam which has not produced a thick foam but has cleaned really well.
> 
> As a newbee here have been a bit confused that Angelwax does not get much mention here other than maybe they are not a Sponser


Angelwax make a lot of the other brands on here. As a brand it would be annoying enough that they are trying to take my customers with their own retail line, coming onto this forum would have me running for a new supplier.


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

nick_mcuk said:


> Lol £40 for 5L I pay a less than that for 25L of AutoGlym advanced TFR. Which you can run neat or diluted to great effect and whilst it uses the TFR label it's not done any damage to any part of our 4 cars in the last year of using it.


You see, this is what gets me about dw. The forum went nuts for high dilution dodo shampoos. People still pay silly money for shampoo and I can get 5l of good trade shampoo for less than many on here pay for 500ml. But suggest it with snow foam and you get comments like yours. I don't get it.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

adjones said:


> You see, this is what gets me about dw. The forum went nuts for high dilution dodo shampoos. People still pay silly money for shampoo and I can get 5l of good trade shampoo for less than many on here pay for 500ml. But suggest it with snow foam and you get comments like yours. I don't get it.


I use Chemical Guys Maxi Suds mainly because I like the smell....I have got 5l of AutoGlym Bodywork Shampoo conditioner and it costs peanuts in comparison to some 500ML bottles as you say.

Not all non branded products are crap...you just are not paying for the fluff and marketing


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## m4rkymark (Aug 17, 2014)

DrH said:


> Just got into the snow foam part of detailing. I have only tried Angelwax Fast Foam which has not produced a thick foam but has cleaned really well.
> 
> As a newbee here have been a bit confused that Angelwax does not get much mention here other than maybe they are not a Sponser


when I use my angelwax snow foam its thick like shaving foam and sticks like **** to a blanket.


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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

I had only used ultra mouse until recently when I was given some Bilt Hamber, Ultramouse is very sticky and visually more pleasing, Bilt Hamber has very little in appearance but has a superior cleaning ability so i drop a bit of ultra mouse in with the BH to satisfy my eyes.


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

nick_mcuk said:


> Lol £40 for 5L I pay a less than that for 25L of AutoGlym advanced TFR. Which you can run neat or diluted to great effect and whilst it uses the TFR label it's not done any damage to any part of our 4 cars in the last year of using it.


Some of us don't like having huge bottles laying about though. Me personally 5L is already pushing it for me and I would only buy items in this size for snow foam, certainly wouldn't have a 25L botle laying around my garage, add to that I don't use TFR, prefer foam and I doubt the TFR is Ph neutral either, likely have an effect on LSP when used regularly.

Everything else I prefer 500-1000ml bottles, just so they can be stored easily in my garage. I can see larger bottle being of use for people who do this as a living but it is only a hobby for me.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Brian1612 said:


> Some of us don't like having huge bottles laying about though. Me personally 5L is already pushing it for me and I would only buy items in this size for snow foam, certainly wouldn't have a 25L botle laying around my garage, add to that I don't use TFR, prefer foam and I doubt the TFR is Ph neutral either, likely have an effect on LSP when used regularly.
> 
> Everything else I prefer 500-1000ml bottles, just so they can be stored easily in my garage. I can see larger bottle being of use for people who do this as a living but it is only a hobby for me.


Economies of scale....bulk is cheap...as for the TFR comment it never caused any issues with the LSPs on all 4 cars here....205 wearing Zaino, My old Saab 93 wearing Ceramic Coating, Wifes old Saab wearing Colly 476 and the Jeep wearing Bouncers Fortify...good cross section of LSP and none affected.

Wifes new Mazda 6 is wearing TAC Systems Sparkle and is still beading as tight as the day I detailed it 3 months ago....

Any foam that has no decent surfactants in it is purely for show...the AutoGlym Advanced TFR and Mutiwash TFR have dilution ratios and you dont just use neat product (although you can with outstanding results)...works well and doenst cause any damage...the other bonus is that you can use them in hand sprayers to do the prewash that way...and the Multiwash can also be diluted and used to clean interiors, engine bays etc so its also an APC.


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

I cannot really comment as I have never used it but in general, TFRs are usually a lot more harsh to LSPs than snow foam. Just my opinion, if you haven't found it to effect your LSP then fair enough but I personally wouldn't use such a product on any of my paint protections. Again it is all own to personal preference. You obviously have the space to store huge bottles, I do not as my garage is used for a lot more than storing my detailing products sadly.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

It does make me laugh....some of the foam products are just the same if not stronger than the "Evil" TFR's AS actimouse being one of them....my buddy used to use that to wash down his workshop floor....

If a product is able to remove dirt without you having to touch it means its got some pretty agresive surfactants in it regardless of its PH levels...dont be sucked in by the fluff and marketing 

I guess I am lucky I do have a fair bit of storage....but I would still buy in 25L as its so much more cost effective. I do store the gardening equipment, gazebo, BBQ and tools in the shed too....all about space management!


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## adjones (Apr 24, 2013)

nick_mcuk said:


> It does make me laugh....some of the foam products are just the same if not stronger than the "Evil" TFR's AS actimouse being one of them....my buddy used to use that to wash down his workshop floor....
> 
> If a product is able to remove dirt without you having to touch it means its got some pretty agresive surfactants in it regardless of its PH levels...dont be sucked in by the fluff and marketing
> 
> I guess I am lucky I do have a fair bit of storage....but I would still buy in 25L as its so much more cost effective. I do store the gardening equipment, gazebo, BBQ and tools in the shed too....all about space management!


Yeah, actimousse and ultramousse are caustic products, using the ingredient behind the bad tfr reputation. Alas, dw is more about speed and ease of cleaning, no one cares about using the least aggressive solution necessary when a corrosive chemical will do it faster, for less money


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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

Every day's a school day, for sale 3l of ultra mouse lol

Am i to clear out my AS stock other than Tardis,G101 and and high style? What are the untouchables where AS is concerned.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Thankfully the 2 AutoGlym products I mentioned are not that lairy but the mere mention of those 3 letters excites some folk


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Not surprised that is the case with AS being a trade type product and not aimed for personal use.


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Have to agree with Simz here. The OP has asked a question which myself and others have tried our best to answer, isn't that the whole purpose of this forum to help educate?


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

So instead of giving a novice an answer, we should attack them and tell them never to use something they don't understand? Really? I think the OP is aware it is no substitute for a full 2BM wash, he merely asked if a snow has to be thick to work well and the short answer is no. Bilt Hamber doesn't cling more than a few minutes but loosens dirt very well.


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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

Thank you for the clarification.


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## Simz (Jun 7, 2013)

Take your point Allen, it's a bit like asking the waiter or a friend what the food is like when you have already seen the menu personal recommendations matter to some.


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## AllenF (Aug 20, 2012)

Ok look at it this way.
Shampoo. Says add two capfuls to five litres. So far? That is the OPTIMAL dilution ratio for the product to work. If I add less it won't clean as well will it? If I add four capfuls will I get double the cleaning power?


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## Brian1612 (Apr 5, 2015)

Lets just leave it at that, silly argument really.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

Right, seeing as this has gone to all out insults, you leave me no choice


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