# Headlight correction: C4 before wrap?



## HEADPHONES (Jan 1, 2008)

Despite using Gtechniq C4 after headlight correction, hazing returns after a year or 2.
Plan was to correct them and use a clear wrap to keep hazing at bay.
Any harm in putting C4 before the wrap?

Anyway, I had my selection of wet and dry, some pads and various polishes.
Wet sanded using 2000, 2500, 3000 then 5000.
This revealed some crazing at certain angles.


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## HEADPHONES (Jan 1, 2008)

Being a bit worried that my inexperience with this crazing may result in a machine making it worse, I proceeded by hand.

Started off with Megs NXT Metal Polish.
This left quite deep swirls still, so hit it again with an ancient bottle of Menzerna ultra fine polish and started to get better results.
















Sent from my Redmi Note 7 using Tapatalk


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## HEADPHONES (Jan 1, 2008)

And lastly side by side before and after shots
















Sent from my Redmi Note 7 using Tapatalk


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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

Great job, looks much clearer now :thumb:


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## Itstony (Jan 19, 2018)

HEADPHONES said:


> Despite using Gtechniq C4 after headlight correction, hazing returns after a year or 2.
> Plan was to correct them and use a clear wrap to keep hazing at bay.
> Any harm in putting C4 before the wrap?
> 
> ...


Going back to the start, same plan of attack I use on grades. For me the secret is patience. Take time on each grade, it hurts nothing. Dry it off and inspect to see what haze you have and what may have been missed or not and it's a uniform haze.
Go through the grades same way.
I may not be seeing it right, it does appear you went on without checking as those marks should have been identified and eliminated earlier. At 2-2500 those should not be there.
The polishing stage needs to be as easy as it can be without rectifying scratches or marks at that late stage. After the 5000 stage it should be obviously ready to just polish from a fine haze.
Keeping the polishing down, to a quick stage, prevents the chances of heat build up and struggling on Polycarbonate. 
No coating will last two years, UV will get to them and the main enemy over the elements.

Looks like you got there as they look very nice. Just be sure to clean them after a couple of months and re apply protection. :thumb:


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## \Rian (Aug 23, 2017)

Awesome improvement, when say wrap, are you reffereing to some sort of PPF clear wrap etc if so I can see C4 having an effect on the wrap adhesive, 

If it was me I would be applying c4 to the wrap


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## detailR (Jul 23, 2016)

Apply the PPF, then coat over it.
Which film are you using? The better ones will have a hydrophobic top coat


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

Great thread guys.

I need to restore the lights on my Clio II:

















As you can see, they're really bad. I was thinking of doing this by hand per Tony's suggestion. Considering how bad these are what grit would I need to start off with?

Also, I don't have a polisher. Would polishing by hand be possible or would I not get good results? I do have a cordless drill with 400 and 1450rpm speeds.


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

@Rakti

I had a Clio182 Cup same shape and same headlights as yours.

I wet sanded mine during the 5 years I had it and immediately before sale.
All by hand

I had P1000, P1500, P2000, P2500 and P3000

Got rid of the opaque finish and the roughness that you feel.
Left them looking like new (ish)

Huge huge improvement and yes its definitely possible by hand and hand polishing.
I used Megs PlastRX too.


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

BTT , lovely improvement there Headphones on the Z headlights :thumb:

I've got my CR-V headlights to tickle up in the next few days.
Mrs has bought me the Sealey 12.2v mini polisher with the Autoglym kit to do that. Early Fathers Day present 

PS
Don't know about C4 under the PPF, but certainly over the top sounds alright .

I plan on putting Gtechniq C1.5v2 Silo Seal on mine, maybe with C2v3 on top, or vice versa.

Also have some C5 which is unopened but if I open that it means I'll have to do the Clio Wheels to make it worthwhile


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

James_R said:


> @Rakti
> 
> I had a Clio182 Cup same shape and same headlights as yours.
> 
> ...


Thanks James:thumb:


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

I've spent ages looking through Wet N Dry options on both Amazon and ebay. I thought I knew what I wanted, but now I'm not so sure.

I was going to get;

2x 1500
2x 2000
1x 2500
1x 3000
1x 5000 (or maybe leave this out)

But now I'm wondering if I've got that the wrong way round. Maybe I need less of the agressive and more 2500, 3000 to get the 1500 marks out. Any help appreciated. I was looking at Starcke.


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

Rakti said:


> I've spent ages looking through Wet N Dry options on both Amazon and ebay. I thought I knew what I wanted, but now I'm not so sure.
> 
> I was going to get;
> 
> ...


For what they cost I'd go for:
2x 1000
2x 1500
2x 2000
2x 2500
2x 3000

AT the most. If you're getting standard sheets, 1 of each will probably do you fine.
You're best to cut them into quarters and use them with a Meguairs sanding block.

You'll only buy them once if its JUST for your car.
I bought 1 sheet of 1000,1500,2000,2500,3000 and I've never bought any more.

Did my Clio headlights twice and the old CRV headlights and the remains are in the garage in a drawer


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## Itstony (Jan 19, 2018)

Headlights tend to not get the same attention as Panels, trims wheels etc. The Polycarbonate will look great after refurb, but they need to be taken care of.
It's so easy to add the sealant/protection and believe they will be fine for a long time. They wont. Believing the coating will last 3, 6 or 12 months is first mistake.
For the time it takes and the amount of product needed, it will be a smart move to redo every month or two at most.
PW and remove any previous, reapply and know they are protected from Uv rather than assume, while they are degrading each day. Then need to go through the whole sanding deal again. Why would you want to?
Even a small sample size bottle of a decent protection with Uv protection would last well over a year apply every two months.
It's really a no brainer, quick n easy.:thumb:


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

Thanks Tony.

I take it from your previous posts on the subject, you wouldn't advocate the use of a block (as James suggested). The Clio headlights are completely curved so I'd guess the paper needs to stay flat against the curved surface.

For anyone looking in wondering where to buy their Wet N Dry from, as well as the usual ebay and Amazon suspects, I found these two online suppliers for Starcke last night (I'm sure there are more). If you're buying around 6 or 7 sheets they are probably cheaper even with a postage charge, so don't believe those ebay sellers that say free postage; it's all included in the price.

https://alldrew.co.uk/

https://www.thepolishingshop.co.uk/home


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

Rakti said:


> Thanks Tony.
> 
> I take it from your previous posts on the subject, you wouldn't advocate the use of a block (as James suggested). The Clio headlights are completely curved so I'd guess the paper needs to stay flat against the curved surface.


In fairness, I started with the block on the harder to remove defects. Its slightly flexible so does conform to the shape a bit. Gives you a bit more bite. :thumb:

I've recently got a small machine and 75mm dia sanding pads and 3m Trizact foam backed P2000 and P3000 discs.
What a revelation 

I'll get out of here and post up my own thread


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

James_R said:


> In fairness, I started with the block on the harder to remove defects. Its slightly flexible so does conform to the shape a bit. Gives you a bit more bite. :thumb:


Ah, so it's a flexible block. I didn't know that, sorry! Do you have a link to that specific block?


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## Itstony (Jan 19, 2018)

As you ask, I would not use a block, although I have. and as per ^^^^^^^ you must appreciate many of us go into detail and sit for ages explaining every detail. Then there is no Thanks for doing so. So regulars start to ease off and be brief, because it's all there to be seen if people would just use the "search".

There is no right or wrong way, just what gets you there and there will always be different views. 
That's my refereeing and hope that explains.
It depends on the condition of the surfaces. Right there it may changes and you have to use what you need to use and that may or may not include a block. If so then once done, stop using it and only go on with W&D as small parts of grit from the blocks can get caught in the W&D and damage the surface. Don't ask how I know.

So to answer your questions based on what I do only.
Starcke is decent quality and what I use.
Once it comes to sanding you need to judge the grade. Could be 800-1000?
Others have also covered this with their input.
Cut the small pieces to work with and fold. If you do not fold its hard to control for slipping.
Just slowly sand across then up n down, be sure to go to all corners and edges. Plenty of water spritzing.
Stop, spritz and wipe over. It will dry quickly and inspect the haze. It needs to be uniform all over (your fired).
If not make it so. Them move through the grades to a min of 2500, more the better and be sure the haze is uniform.
If you go to 3000 it will be a very fine haze, then it just needs polishing up. Use a DA if you can, it's safer. Use a pad on a drill and not careful you can easily make a flat. I am personally not a fan of using drill attachments on Polycarbonate lens's. 
I'm patient and I prefer to take my time, but there are are more ways to skin a cat right?
Your choice 

Hope that helps.:thumb:


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

Sorry I might have confused by saying a sanding block.
I don't mean a block with say 240 grit or 1000 grit built in, just a flexible sanding backing pad, to wrap your wet and dry sheets around.

Appears Megs have discontinued theirs, but I got mine from CYC years ago.
Seems the current option is the Flexipads one below

https://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/flexipads-wet-sanding-backing-pad


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## James_R (Jun 28, 2007)

@Rakti

https://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=421194


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## Itstony (Jan 19, 2018)

No James I got that. I just found using them as you do was not best for me. I have tried many ways and just using them w&d by three fingers I can feel the work better.
The only part I dislike is covering up with cling film and tape.
Worse thing is .... it will all be asked again


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

Finally got round to restoring my Clio headlights yesterday (offside) and today (near side).

Products used were;

*Starke *Wet N Dry in grades 800, 1500, 2000, 3000 and 5000.
*Raceglaze* Headlight restoration kit which includes a polish and a sealant (I tried the polish on its own about 6 months ago but it had very little effect).

I used an old foam sanding block to wrap the paper round. After the first headlight, I realized I'd missed bits on the edges, so this morning I bought a thick plastic pencil eraser and wrapped small pieces round it to do the edges on the other side.

Here's some photos of the near-side that I did today;

Before work started it looked like this;









After 800









After 1500, 2000, 3000 and 5000









After polish









Quite pleased with how they turned out. Now just praying that the sealant is effective (supposed to last at least 6 months).

Many thanks to those that gave me advice:thumb:


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## SadlyDistracted (Jan 18, 2013)

Itstony said:


> ...
> It's so easy to add the sealant/protection and believe they will be fine for a long time. They wont. Believing the coating will last 3, 6 or 12 months is first mistake.
> For the time it takes and the amount of product needed, it will be a smart move to redo every month or two at most.
> PW and remove any previous, reapply and know they are protected from Uv rather than assume, while they are degrading each day. Then need to go through the whole sanding deal again. Why would you want to?
> ...


Agree that coatings do not prevent further degradation, my last attempt post polishing was to 2k lacquer them, and so far this year post our summer sunshine, if you can remember it, currently there's no hint of yellowing or hazing etc. :thumb: (although having said this I hope its not a kiss of ***) :doublesho

A further year on, still fine and dandy, no yellowing or hazing etc.Dare I say it might be a permanent fix


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## Rakti (Nov 11, 2019)

Just a diary note to say that I re-applied the *Raceglaze sealant* today and can report that the original sealant application was still going, which is 7mths and 24 days (courtesy of timeanddate.com).


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## ridders66 (May 24, 2019)

Don't put C4 on before the wrap, it will mean that the wrap won't stick and it would just be a waste of C4 anyway. I don't think coating the wrap will do anything to stop the lights fading again, nor do I think that wrapping them will stop the lights fading again.


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