# Wet sand then polish but still scratches



## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Ok so been painting car parts and im at the flatten and polish stage on 2K paint anyway im wetsanding using 600-800-1000-1500-2000 then using my orbital polisher with G3 then sonus anti swirl but ive still got scratchs from the sanding what am I doing wrong ?


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## JCoxy (Dec 21, 2011)

I wouldn't start at 600 and go all the way up, I would just 1500 or 2000 and compound + polish, Id say they're sanding scratches from the courser grits that haven't came out


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## Mcpx (Mar 15, 2016)

I'm no expert but you're going to really struggle to polish out 2000 grit, you need to go down to 2500, 3000 and maybe further, then you'll still need to start with a pretty agressive compound. I have seen a microfibre cutting pad on a DA get 2500 grit marks out but it took some doing.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

im sanding from 600 because the best spray finish I get is this 


will try and drop another couple grades and see if that smooths it out.


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## chongo (Jun 7, 2014)

Start at 2500, 3000 grit then with a Micro fibre pad and Meguaires D300 compound or 105, that should remove what's left of the sanding marks, then refine with a finishing polish of your choice.


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## steveo3002 (Jan 30, 2006)

no way id sand with 600 , 1200 ought to be plenty to start with

as for the finish , well you need to do something about that , your tecnique and or mixture needs some adjustments


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## Mcpx (Mar 15, 2016)

I think what has maybe happened is that you have had to go in at 600 to flatten off the finish but then might have worked up through the grades too quickly so you are left with heavier marks that the higher grades of paper can't get out, and that the polishes certainly can't get out. Maybe go back to a mid grit and work up again. 

There is a definite possibility here that to correct this you might have to sand too much, ruining the finish anyway, so it may well be better to cut your losses and start over, concentrating on getting a better starting point as Stevo says.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

cant seem to get a better finish its an apollo 3 stage turbine sprayer and ive tryed various methods the only way I get a good lay is to put it down super wet and hope I dont get runs bubbles or insects in the paint.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Assuming this is a "test" panel, and breaking through isn't an issue, i would start again, with 1500 grit. You have no idea of knowing which grit has left the marks. Work slow and methodically until you are sure the only lines left are from the 1500. Then go to your 2000. Ideally you want to get a couple of finer grades but if not compound from here. Don't assume a single set will remove the marks. You may have to do multiple compounding sets and STILL dig out the odd isolated mark here and there. 

Just go slow. Slow is steady, steady is fast


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Decided to flatten it right back all over getting rid of as many scratches as I can then on a warmer day this week il put another coat on and as advised sand back with 1500 to start hopefully I can get an even coat down so I can sand with 1500


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## m4rkymark (Aug 17, 2014)

I think you need to re-evaluate your painting methods, that isn't right. The only thing I've seen going on like that is body shutz, I've never ever seen paint like that.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Yeah just can't seem to get a decent finish and no one seems to have any advice on using a turbine sprayer 


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## m4rkymark (Aug 17, 2014)

shiffty said:


> Yeah just can't seem to get a decent finish and no one seems to have any advice on using a turbine sprayer


Have you spoke to the shop you bought it off? Ive never used a turbine sprayer before so no idea what they are like.

Paint should be going on in light coats, how long are you leaving between coats?


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Bought it from gumtree 
Coat wise I leave it about 10 minutes apart 


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## steveo3002 (Jan 30, 2006)

shiffty said:


> Yeah just can't seem to get a decent finish and no one seems to have any advice on using a turbine sprayer


throw it away and use a conventional gun and compressor


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Not got the space for a decent compressor setup but turbines can give decent finish its a case of finding the technique apparently but no one wants to share that with me lol although I did read that gravity fed is the gun to get to avoid orange peel as they can creat enough pressure to draw paint out of a cup so looks like il be investing in a new gun


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## steveo3002 (Jan 30, 2006)

try more thinners and/or slower thinners so that it flows a bit more once sprayed


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Yeah will give it a go thanks


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## JCoxy (Dec 21, 2011)

I start off with a mini gravity gun, low air consumption so a small compressor will handle it, 1.2mm tip will work with colour and clear. you should be able to get an off the gun finish and remove dirt only. a DA polisher will do the job but takes much longer than a rotary, you need to get some heat into the panel to really get the scratches out


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## Sportsvan jay (Mar 14, 2015)

shiffty said:


> im sanding from 600 because the best spray finish I get is this
> 
> 
> will try and drop another couple grades and see if that smooths it out.


I've never used a turbine spray gun but it looks to me that you've applied the paint with to much pressure and the paint seems to thick as said get your self a small compressor and gun set up that's the sort of finish you should get when your using a shuts gun on sills and lower panels of a vehicle


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## Slammedorion (Apr 13, 2014)

1500, 3000 and polish it up with a rotary with lambs wool on
You'll struggle to polish flatting marks out with da... Rotary will cut faster due to the heat build up...
Your paint finish looks dry, get some more on


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## ninja250r (Jun 3, 2015)

Heard it a billion and one times. Buy cheap do it twice and cost more than if you did it right from the start. Even pro paint "decorators" don't use them. Only tv shows use them due to the lack of filming time. Being serious. Get a gun and a compressor. You can buff a turd all day long and when you are done it still looks like a turd but a shiny turd


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Why do smart repair guys use them then ? And I bought one under numerous recommendations from guys who have painted entire cars with them and yes I've asked there advice but nearly all of the are auto body guys and just say practice it's not the same as a compressor. 
Never seen em on tv you know I'm not on about the cheapo one stage turbine you can buy at home base right. 


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## JCoxy (Dec 21, 2011)

Smart repair guys don't use them, they have a small compressor in their van and mini gravity gun


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Guys that used to come to my work used em


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## squiggs (Oct 19, 2009)

In my almost 10 years of being a Smart repairer I've probably had contact with about 300 other smart repairers (mainly independent). 
During this time there have only been one or two (very,very much in the minority) that used turbines - but they did swear by them.

As far as I recall you need a compatible gun. 
I think they're different from the guns that 99.99% of us use (don't ask me why, what or how).

I stand to be corrected but I think the only places that sell the guns are the same as those that supply the turbines as it's such a niche market. 
(If I'm correct the chances of you picking up a cheap one on fleabay would be about nill!)

Are you using a gun designed for use with a turbine? 
If not get onto some turbine suppliers and ask them for some gun advice.

http://www.hvlpshop.co.uk/Category/hvlp_guns


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

I'm using the gun that came with it originally and yeah needs a gun designed for turbines and again yeah finding one on eBay is next to impossible mind you one popped up Sunday and I nearly got it but out bidded at the last second. 
I've looked around quite a bit already and found 2 guns that fit the bill both just over £200 so will have to be a payday purchase. 
Think turbines are huge in the state from what I've read entire body shops use them instead of compressors although there 4 and 5 stage units don't ask me what that means just that 3 stage is the minimum to get a professional job. 


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## Mcpx (Mar 15, 2016)

Surely if you were going to spend that kind of money it would be better off going towards an air gun and comp in the long run.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

As said I don't have the space the turbine is a small box which tucks away nicely in the corner even a small compressor is twice the size and will run out of pressure before I've finished a panel. 
I do a agree though if I had the space I could have picked up a cheap compressor then spent the rest on a decent gun but that wasn't an option. 


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## savvyfox (Oct 3, 2015)

If you say the set up is compatible eg gun is correct for turbine, then you have a flow issues. Paint looks like its too thick so needs thinning out. Either that or your technique is all wrong.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Most likely my technique needs work. 
Thinning wise I've gone from 10% to 30% should I go more I don't want to risk clouding. 


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## savvyfox (Oct 3, 2015)

Think you answered the flow problem in an earlier post. " only way I can get it smoother is lay it on super wet"! That's the way to smooth finish. You can't dust paint on an expect it to flow! Are you air drying or heat lamp?


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Well that's another issue I'm outside so air drying and temp has been hit and miss really I'm out of direct sun in a tent but still the temp is up and down may have to wait till summer kicks in and the temp is more stable


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## savvyfox (Oct 3, 2015)

Air drying 2k in 7-8c is a slow job indeed! Are you using fast activators and thinners? This will help but heat is the answer.


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

I'm not sure I think it's a fast activater but not sure about the thinner


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

The only heat I have is from a heat gun and that opened up a whole other can of worms when I over heated an area lol


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## savvyfox (Oct 3, 2015)

I'm amazed you got any kind of finish  practice makes perfect, keep trying, end of the day you can always buy a new part!!


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Lol not for my car if it doesn't come from Japan then it costs a fortune here just frustrated cos I've used 2l off celly and now 1/4l of 2k and paint ain't cheap lol


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## savvyfox (Oct 3, 2015)

At this moment is panel in rough paint or smooth and scratched?


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## shiffty (Jun 30, 2008)

Smooth but scratched


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