# Rupes Bigfoot Vs Rotary\Flex DA -Questions



## DAN:

Been using a Rotary for past 6 years and seen the Rupes bigfoot is a new machine on the market, Before taking the plunge spending money just thought I'd ask fellow bigfoot users what they like?

I seen it can cut paint well but need to know if it's suitable for all paint finishes as i use alot of Polish and Pad combos with my rotary to acheive the desired results. also not a fan of huge pads and the rupes looks bigger however i think with it being a DA it will be easier to control as stated.

One last question, Is this machine any different from a Flex DA other than the pads and polish?

Cheers
Dan


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## richie.guy

Also interested in the answer to the questions asked...


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## DetailMyCar

I'm being gradually less and less convinced on the Bigfoot, I don't doubt it's a fantastic machine and I'm sure it's great but for £400+ it does sound quite expensive, I know you get pads and polishes but generally the opinion seems to be the pads break up and fall apart and the polishes dust up badly - I've heard that from a few people now....

I think the Flex machine looks superb though, I do know someone who recently purchased one so I'm keen to have a play but don't jump on the band wagon just yet Re the Rupes machine as I think we all need to see a bit more from it, or mainly the pads and polishes they suggest you use with it.


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## DAN:

I have a Flex DA too but No where near the kind of feedback you get from polishing using the my rotary, Be keen to know if it's the same with the bigfoot?

Might be thinking the Bigfoot would suit some applications and not others?

Just looks interesting that it saves alot of time according to the videos....


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## stangalang

I still think if you use the rupes polish on the flex you would get the results. I'm convinced that's where the magic is. The Bigfoot is, all be it with a big throw, just a da. Smoother yes, but magical no. 

HOWEVER although I have used it, I haven't used it against the flex and done a direct comparison so it is foolish to assume anything until it's been done. Another interesting comparison would be scholl polishes with the flex against the rupes system. Large fast breaking abrasives on a stiff da pad!


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## MidlandsCarCare

I'm going to get a Flex DA so that I can form some kind of comparison but these are certainly interesting times in terms of efficient paint correction!

The biggest problem with the Rupes is intricate areas where the throw of the machine makes it a bit of a handful and near impossible to use.

Mario's review suggested the Flex was the better option...


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## stangalang

MidlandsCarCare said:


> I'm going to get a Flex DA so that I can form some kind of comparison but these are certainly interesting times in terms of efficient paint correction!
> 
> The biggest problem with the Rupes is intricate areas where the throw of the machine makes it a bit of a handful and near impossible to use.
> 
> Mario's review suggested the Flex was the better option...


Speaking to miracle he has a 75mm rupes da russ that he says is smoother than your average and still has a 15mm throw. Dont think it will be cheap like lol.


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## Ultra

The rupes or flex is not going to be 300 quid better than a das6 pro, more refined maybe difference in finish none imo.


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## stangalang

dennis said:


> The rupes or flex is not going to be 300 quid better than a das6 pro, more refined maybe difference in finish none imo.


I can not tell you how far removed the 3401 is from a das6 or g220. They don't even compare honestly. 
The mechanics to make a forced rotation da is epic


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## AaronGTi

stangalang said:


> Speaking to miracle he has a 75mm rupes da russ that he says is smoother than your average and still has a 15mm throw. Dont think it will be cheap like lol.


Is this it I take it?

http://www.rupestool.com/p/us/en/0288186448780


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## D.Taylor R26

have to agree with the above comment. i own a G220 and its great for what i do currently but after having a go with a flex at a local detailing company it made my DA feel like a toy in comparison. 

like i said im not knocking the cheaper end DA polishers. it'll always have a place in my kit but one days id love to own a flex DA. 

how much time do you save polishing a car with a flex/bigfoot compared to a regular DAS6 out of interest? sorry im going a bit off topic.


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## stangalang

D.Taylor R26 said:


> have to agree with the above comment. i own a G220 and its great for what i do currently but after having a go with a flex at a local detailing company it made my DA feel like a toy in comparison.
> 
> like i said im not knocking the cheaper end DA polishers. it'll always have a place in my kit but one days id love to own a flex DA.
> 
> how much time do you save polishing a car with a flex/bigfoot compared to a regular DAS6 out of interest? sorry im going a bit off topic.


I reckon you could cut it in half. The pads are huge, the throw is bigger and the flex is a brute trust me


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## HeavenlyDetail

Im very impressed with the Bigfoot so far , had my opinions before owning one but i like it , i havent tried the microfibre system on it yet to see what its like , what i do know is i couldnt imagine having a 21mm throw.


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## craigblues

So the current verdict is mixed.

Sounds simular to when Megs bought out their Microfiber Correction System and there were many many mixed reviews.

I am currently choosing which to buy was going to buy the Flex then heard about the Rupes, unfortunately I know no-one who has either so I can try...

Hmmm... decisions, take the chance or be patient. ha!


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## Ultra

stangalang said:


> I can not tell you how far removed the 3401 is from a das6 or g220. They don't even compare honestly.
> The mechanics to make a forced rotation da is epic


I know how different these machines are  i'm not new to machine
polishing.


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## stangalang

dennis said:


> I know how different these machines are  i'm not new to machine
> polishing.


Forgive me that did not come across as intended, what I meant was YES, I think the flex is worth the extra IMO. Nothing more


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## Clyde

Having attended the training day at KDS last Sunday I can say the flex rotary is an awesome piece of kit. Totally killed my perception of rotarys being the big bad wolf so to say and Kelly gave a great demo of its capabilities. I can see myself getting one in the near future.


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## Kelly @ KDS

MidlandsCarCare said:


> I'm going to get a Flex DA so that I can form some kind of comparison but these are certainly interesting times in terms of efficient paint correction!
> 
> The biggest problem with the Rupes is intricate areas where the throw of the machine makes it a bit of a handful and near impossible to use.
> 
> Mario's review suggested the Flex was the better option...


Russ i have the flex DA

kelly


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## Kelly @ KDS

Clyde said:


> Having attended the training day at KDS last Sunday I can say the flex rotary is an awesome piece of kit. Totally killed my perception of rotarys being the big bad wolf so to say and Kelly gave a great demo of its capabilities. I can see myself getting one in the near future.


http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=275105

kelly


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## craigblues

I want to invest in a Bigfoot but do t want to make the wrong decision. Anyone else had a try or purchased one?


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## tzotzo

you can't even keep close to a flex. It is as hot as hell


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## craigblues

tzotzo said:


> you can't even keep close to a flex. It is as hot as hell


Reasons behind your comment. :wave:


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## CraigQQ

the flex is better than the bigfoot, the rupes forced rotation is also better than the bigfoot.

the festool rotex 125 blows both out the water..

and none of them are as good at correcting as the flex or festool rotaries.

this is my opinion of the current market leaders and "in" machines.


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## craigblues

CraigQQ said:


> the flex is better than the bigfoot, the rupes forced rotation is also better than the bigfoot.
> 
> the festool rotex 125 blows both out the water..
> 
> and none of them are as good at correcting as the flex or festool rotaries.
> 
> this is my opinion of the current market leaders and "in" machines.


Valid Opinion, everyone has to have one. :thumb:

I'm just not sure which direction to go, need/want a new machine. Bigfoot is very tempting.

Hopefully going to give them all a go soon.


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## Eurogloss

CraigQQ said:


> the flex is better than the bigfoot, the rupes forced rotation is also better than the bigfoot.
> 
> the festool rotex 125 blows both out the water..
> 
> and none of them are as good at correcting as the flex or festool rotaries.
> 
> this is my opinion of the current market leaders and "in" machines.


*I am sorry to disagree with you IMHO the Flex XC 3401 VRG is the best DA polisher out there ( at the moment)it will trump the Big Foot 21 mm Orbit I have done the testing with the Flex DA and Rupes Big Foot and the Flex DA won in terms of power torque and correction ability that's just my 2cents worth.

Mario *


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## Goodfella36

Craig there will be a rupes bigfoot and another rupes DA also a Flex DA at the meet


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## craigblues

BespokeCarCare said:


> Craig there will be a rupes bigfoot and another rupes DA also a Flex DA at the meet


So I hear.  I'm looking forward to it. I will just have to wait 9 more days.

Whats your opinion Lee?


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## CraigQQ

Eurogloss said:


> *I am sorry to disagree with you IMHO the Flex XC 3401 VRG is the best DA polisher out there ( at the moment)it will trump the Big Foot 21 mm Orbit I have done the testing with the Flex DA and Rupes Big Foot and the Flex DA won in terms of power torque and correction ability that's just my 2cents worth.
> 
> Mario *


I agree the flex is better than the bigfoot, however the festool is imo the best on the market.
have you tested the rotex 125 Mario?


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## Griffiths Detailing

I've been trying megs 105, 205, scholl etc on hex logic and ccs pads on the big foot and they work very well, the rupes system is very dustys and the pads can be a bit weak.


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## WHIZZER

Think these things are always personal - it depends on how much use - what you are using for - what polishes - what pads etc

I have had a go with the Bigfoot - rupes pads and polishes and i really like it - its smooth very well balanced and corrects well 

I am lucky enough to also have a tried a flex rotary / flex da / makita rotary / porter cable and so on and each has its own unique point for its use ...


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## horned yo

Intresting read

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=263547&highlight=RUPES


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## WHIZZER

horned yo said:


> Intresting read
> 
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=263547&highlight=RUPES


Thats only compares the 21mm throw not the 15mm throw :thumb: and also it uses different pads/polishes so is a little tricky to get a really good comparison - you need to use the same pads and polishes to get a really fair comparison ..

I have both machines and they both have a purpose -


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## craigblues

WHIZZER said:


> Thats only compares the 21mm throw not the 15mm throw :thumb:


Its the 15mm I'm interested in.

I'm undecided between the Festool RO 125 and the Bigfoot LHR15. Hmmm....


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## horned yo

but i couldnt afford to have both machines so which is the machine aimed at people who see Detailing as there hobby and which is detailed at a Pro looking to cut his turn around times down?


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## -Raven-

CraigQQ said:


> I agree the flex is better than the bigfoot, however the festool is imo the best on the market.
> have you tested the rotex 125 Mario?


the Rotex 125 is a nice sander indeed! :thumb:


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## WHIZZER

craigblues said:


> Its the 15mm I'm interested in.
> 
> I'm undecided between the Festool RO 125 and the Bigfoot LHR15. Hmmm....





horned yo said:


> but i couldnt afford to have both machines so which is the machine aimed at people who see Detailing as there hobby and which is detailed at a Pro looking to cut his turn around times down?


The Bigfoot is a great , easy to use machine and imo looks great , handles well and correct's - Polishes/Pads can be changed around


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## Eurogloss

CraigQQ said:


> I agree the flex is better than the bigfoot, however the festool is imo the best on the market.
> have you tested the rotex 125 Mario?


*Yes I have ! And the Festool Rotex 150 FEQ as well!
They are sanders not proper polishers even if they have those functions.

That's why I went for the Flex DA  *
*
It was designed as a polisher not a sander *


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## Eurogloss

horned yo said:


> but i couldnt afford to have both machines so which is the machine aimed at people who see Detailing as there hobby and which is detailed at a Pro looking to cut his turn around times down?


*The only way you are going to know is by trying both machines out , based on the correction ability and speed IMHO *


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## gtechrob

CraigQQ said:


> the flex is better than the bigfoot, the rupes forced rotation is also better than the bigfoot.
> 
> the festool rotex 125 blows both out the water..
> 
> and none of them are as good at correcting as the flex or festool rotaries.
> 
> this is my opinion of the current market leaders and "in" machines.


tssk - makita 9227cb is the come to daddy machine - and you know it :lol:


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## gtechrob

btw - isn't there gonna be some show down at waxstock for this kind of thing? if so i'm in with a makita 9227cb, a bottle of p1 and a 200mm wool pad.


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## CraigQQ

Eurogloss said:


> *Yes I have ! And the Festool Rotex 150 FEQ as well!
> They are sanders not proper polishers even if they have those functions.
> 
> That's why I went for the Flex DA  *
> *
> It was designed as a polisher not a sander *


not sure what it was designed as has any bearing on what it can do.
99% of the rotaries used were designed as grinders.. does that make them bad as well then?



gtechrob said:


> tssk - makita 9227cb is the come to daddy machine - and you know it :lol:


:lol: quiet you!!



gtechrob said:


> btw - isn't there gonna be some show down at waxstock for this kind of thing? if so i'm in with a makita 9227cb, a bottle of p1 and a 200mm wool pad.


isn't that like a bonnet split into 4.. you wouldn't even have to move the wool pad :lol:


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## Giobart

Eurogloss said:


> *Yes I have ! And the Festool Rotex 150 FEQ as well!
> They are sanders not proper polishers even if they have those functions.
> 
> That's why I went for the Flex DA  *
> *
> It was designed as a polisher not a sander *


I agree :thumb:,
although I prefer the Big Foot to the Flex for its balance and ease of use!


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## 3R PROJECT

There is no such thing as a tool that does it all . First decide what you want to acheive then find the tool that does it best . The rotex is not for amatuer detailers unless they are also in woodworking . Though every pro that does not have one should own one . It is way more powerfull than the flex and about 50 times smoother and it can do things the flex can not even dream of but it was not made for a full day of polishing for everyday professional use , it is the best sander ever created . The flex is a 365day polisher, though i just wish it was smoother . The rupes lhr is stupendous but it will not take out heavy defects or 2000grit on ceramic spies hecker or dupont that i use . Though for everything else it is spectacular . Everything has it's place .


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## HeavenlyDetail

The Bigfoot is being used more than my RAP150 Currently.
I also had a one to one training day which is on my facebook page , testing back to back with the Festool and foam and choice of products to the Bigfoot and correction was quicker with limited depth removals between the two. The Rupes rotary he had just bought was a pile of cr%p , hated it and nearly resembled a jetengine 3 foot away , he is now purchasing a Bigfoot as at the end of the day when we did half a bonnet for the best possible results in the shortest time he went straight for that and agreed not only was it quicker but gave a superior finish.


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## MidlandsCarCare

It's not ideal on all panels though, you definitely require the LHR75 as a supporting tool - I think anyone would struggle to correct an entire car just with Bigfoot?


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## HeavenlyDetail

I have a RAP80 for intricate areas...


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## 3R PROJECT

HeavenlyDetail said:


> The Bigfoot is being used more than my RAP150 Currently.
> I also had a one to one training day which is on my facebook page , testing back to back with the Festool and foam and choice of products to the Bigfoot and correction was quicker with limited depth removals between the two. The Rupes rotary he had just bought was a pile of cr%p , hated it and nearly resembled a jetengine 3 foot away , he is now purchasing a Bigfoot as at the end of the day when we did half a bonnet for the best possible results in the shortest time he went straight for that and agreed not only was it quicker but gave a superior finish.


Before being misunderstood , i own both the lhr21 and lhr15 and love them both. I have two questions and since i am a huge fan of your work your answer will determine wether i belong in this community or not . Hard paint , shinex with green pad and 3M fast cut and Bigfoot with blue pad and zephir . Which one will correct faster , which one will have more gloss and which one will haze less ? Do you also consider diamond gloss a polish ?


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## PJS

CraigQQ said:


> not sure what it was designed as has any bearing on what it can do.
> 99% of the rotaries used were designed as grinders.. does that make them bad as well then?


Only when you give them the full beans at 3500 rpm with a wool pad and Farecla G3 - the mess it makes! :detailer:


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## HeavenlyDetail

3R PROJECT said:


> Before being misunderstood , i own both the lhr21 and lhr15 and love them both. I have two questions and since i am a huge fan of your work your answer will determine wether i belong in this community or not . Hard paint , shinex with green pad and 3M fast cut and Bigfoot with blue pad and zephir . Which one will correct faster , which one will have more gloss and which one will haze less ? Do you also consider diamond gloss a polish ?


Firstly thankyou and secondly everyone belongs in this community as our own views are as important as anyone elses , because some people preach their way or the highway doesnt mean its always correct , what is correct is what works for you as an individual for you to achieve the best finish you can with whatever procedure you choose.
I think the best way to reply to that would be to say exactly what we did on the day and the reason why.
The guy on the day is a member on here but like alot of people uses it as a knowledge base rather than posting day in day out and taking points from posts he feels relevant to his own style of work.
When he first spoke to me he said said he would rather concentrate on the rotary as like most people its classed as the big gun in the armoury therefore should be the route to take. From the very outset i said the basis of the day i believe to be most beneficial would be to do measurements for strike through then concentrate on various areas of the bonnet with different procedures.
We basically worked as you stated (and what he had bought along) the 3m system on foam. My bonnet was purchased from a scrap yard and i would say average hardness bordering on medium to medium/hard. 
We machined one side with My Festool and also Rupes rotary with fast cut + but with a yellow 3m because that was what he liked and my whole theory to start with was use what you are used to and lets see if we can improve with different combinations and products. It was to see how many sets in total it would take him to get down to a total perfect hologram free finish which was infact 7. This was all stages including final finishing that side.
The second side and also on a bonnet spin was Bigfoot and microfibre system and also foam again 2 different sections. 
The total amount of sets was 3. 
Im unsure if he would post but this was his machining not mine , im not one for criticising people and how they machine , i believe that the best approach is simplicity in that if we continually go over it again and again eventually it falls into place and encouraging people is important. 
The variations in depths removed were slim but the microfibre system as accurately as possible to measure was probably 2 to 3 microns deeper but its not something that invariably concerns me when i have a surface that in my opinion is optically better and also flatter. 
The foam side with the bigfoot was dramatically improved over the rotary side in all aspects something he pointed out to me before i pointed out to him. 
To sum up if you had the choice like pistols at dawn to get the best possible finish the Bigfoot would sway it in every aspect , for sure its always geing to be difficult when working on architecture with difficult to reach areas or tight spots but thats what other machines are designed for and like a carpenter , he doesnt have just one saw.
I wil add that i used the Rupes system but im impressed with the machine and feel the polishes are slightly on the dusty side and that puts me off. 
I may venture to get into the system but for now im using the machine for 95% of the panels and my RAP80 for the rest. My RAP150 will still be used for sure but ill judge each car on its own merits when deciding which to use.

Just some pics from our day , the bonnet was left under a bird table for a week and broomed by some local kids for me so it was in pretty bad shape as id rather work on something that may only be possible to get 95% correction and understand limitations of what can and cant be achieved rather than a pretty bonnet and after 2 passes looks lovely as i believe that gives people false hopes when they come to detailing their own friends or customers cars..
Regarding the Rupes rotary , id like to think there was something wrong with this machine as he purchased 2 so waiting to see if the second is the same as the first , it felt incredibly strange and the shaft almost felt as if it wasnt seated true , this was on his 3M Backing plate and also my Brand new Festool backing plate and the sound was deafening. Hopefully we shall find out shortly.


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## 3R PROJECT

To say that i am honored by the reply would be the least . For everyone that understands it reveals what you can do with the machine while it also proves why you should own one if you are limited to one tool . It will take you to almost perfect with little effort . Naturally it can not do everything as advertised by some but close enough . It can not finish like a rotary but it will cut with less effort . I love starting with it on used cars and finishing with the rotary for maximum clarity . Though some paints laugh at it most feel right at home with it . As for diamond gloss i do not have anything against it but i do not appriciate it that it is promoted as a fine polish when it is a glaze . As for the polishes most in the world consider them the best there is for years now . I just personally always liked 3M better . The lh18ens although it is not the best tool for horizontal panels it amazing for spot pads and vertical panels due to it's large clearance . Mine is not noisy at all though noone should expect shinex or polishflex quality from it . Needless to say , always a fan and even more now .


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## MidlandsCarCare

3R have you tried the Rotex90?

I've added a Rotex125 to my arsenal today and would be keen to hear your views on the smaller machine which is rather but than the RAP80 (although I'm sure ill end up with that too as I'm sure it'll serve a slightly different purpose/role)

Russ.


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## GJM

gtechrob said:


> btw - isn't there gonna be some show down at waxstock for this kind of thing? if so i'm in with a makita 9227cb, a bottle of p1 and a 200mm wool pad.


Was that the the hologram challenge?


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## Ebbe J

MidlandsCarCare said:


> 3R have you tried the Rotex90?
> 
> I've added a Rotex125 to my arsenal today and would be keen to hear your views on the smaller machine which is rather but than the RAP80 (although I'm sure ill end up with that too as I'm sure it'll serve a slightly different purpose/role)
> 
> Russ.


I've never understood why people buy the Rotex 125, the 150 can be fitted with a 130mm backingplate, so it will take most 140-150mm pads and the vacuum duct can be removed.

Kind regards,

Ebbe


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## craigblues

I'm still undecided on which machine to add to my collection next... Doesn't help that I've been quite busy.

Narrowed it down to: Flex 3401, Festool RO125 and Rupes LHR15 Bigfoot.

Admittedly if I went for the Bigfoot. I would feel the necessity to also buy the LHR75 and a nice large compressor. 

Hmmmm...


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