# RTC - Who is at fault?



## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Ok. So I've had a prang with another car and i would like to know who people think is at fault based on what I'm going to say. 

I was sitting at a junction with a view to a right turn. I was indicating and had stopped on my side of the road but close to the middle white line. I was allowing the oncoming traffic to go first. I had a Ford Galaxy waiting behind me also waiting to turn right. The road ahead became clear and i checked my mirrors and then started my manouver. At the same time a car behind the Galaxy decided to overtake both of us and as i turned i hit his nearside front bumper.

He is claiming I was parked and hadn't checked it was safe to move off. I have pics which quite clearly show I'm over the white line and the wheels are turning right. 

I feel he is in the wrong for overtaking two cars and in view of a junction.

So wish i hadn't held off buying the in car CCTV. 

Opinions ?

Thanks.


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## danwel (Feb 18, 2007)

I'd say he's at fault but will ultimately come down to your word against his unless you managed to get witness statements


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## STUOOBY (Dec 26, 2012)

mmh thats a hard one. i'd say more him. but also you slightly. for not checking your mirror before moving off. one for the police.


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## STUOOBY (Dec 26, 2012)

just seen. if you did check your mirror. how fast was this guy going that he wasnt there when you looked. or from when you looked. to moving. how long did that take.


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

My view was blocked slightly by the Galaxy behind. I'd say from checking mirror to moving was less than five seconds. 

Police were not interested because it was not blocking the road.

Highway code states that you should not overtake in the vicinity of a junction.

I have the registration and colour of the Galaxy behind so will pass onto insurers.

Not major damage, a new wing and trim on a Pug 106.


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## piston_warrior (Jul 25, 2012)

He is in the wrong for overtaking near a junction however I had a similar scenario where I was following a car doing 15mph so I overtook not realising there was a junction next to my overtaking path and the slow car decided to turn right into my car.

Now I argued the toss saying he should have checked his mirrors, signalled and manouvered of which he did neither. However it does clearly state in the highway code that you should not overtake near a junction (Section 167) so it went 50/50.

Now you were clearly stationary, have evidence of car postion and were indicating so he is 100% in the wrong. Do you have the driver behind you on your side? Is he going to write a statement for you?


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

No but I have vehicle registration and make/model/colour that I'll pass to the insurance company.

I've seen the vehicle around my way so I'm going to take walk tomorrow and see if I can find it and see if they will give me a statement.


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## Shiny (Apr 23, 2007)

Did the chap from behind cross over onto the other side of the road to get past you, or was there an empty lane on your side of the road to the right if you?


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

He was completely over the white line on the right hand side of the road.

http://sdrv.ms/1b7JftT


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

I nearly had one today where somebody decided to race up and cut right in on me when 2 lanes went to 1, why are people so bloody impatient? This is why a huge chunk of accidents happen!

Sounds like he's at fault, he was on the wrong side of the road yes?


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Yeah, I've uploaded a link to a picture. He carried on a little after we collided. He has damage to front nearside bumper and mine is on offside front wing.


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## Buck (Jan 16, 2008)

Did the Galaxy driver stop - he's a witness


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Nope, every one pretty much carried on and just tried to go round us.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

atrose81 said:


> Ok. So I've had a prang with another car and i would like to know who people think is at fault based on what I'm going to say.
> 
> I was sitting at a junction with a view to a right turn. I was indicating and had stopped on my side of the road but close to the middle white line. I was allowing the oncoming traffic to go first. I had a Ford Galaxy waiting behind me also waiting to turn right. The road ahead became clear and i checked my mirrors and then started my manouver. At the same time a car behind the Galaxy decided to overtake both of us and as i turned i hit his nearside front bumper.
> 
> ...


So you were on the carraigeway executing a right hand turn , when a vehicle driven without due care and attention for other road users approached in the same direction but on the opposite lane and collided with your vehicle.

The other vehicle was not adhering to the highway code and attempted their manouvre when it was not safe to do so.


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## Lloyd71 (Aug 21, 2008)

The other guy was clearly driving like a complete bellend, the junction isn't exactly hard to see if it's to the right of that photo and any good driver would have seen the cars with their indicators on and thought "Hang on a minute, these guys might be turning here!"

What a ****. Trouble is, it'll probably end up going 50/50 as you 'should have seen him'.


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## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

bit more ammo

167
DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example

approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road


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## piston_warrior (Jul 25, 2012)

If you don't get a third party witness account then it's your word for his and it will go 50/50 as he sounds like he's content with lying to get out of it. He will just say you weren't indicating and just pulled out on him.


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## Hercs74 (Dec 29, 2011)

Was the vehicle you hit also turning into same junction or was continuing straight a head? Is it a single carriage way one lane in each direction? What is the speed limit for the road and is that a solid white line I see..!!! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Google maps?


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## Shared (Mar 9, 2009)

Hercs74 said:


> Was the vehicle you hit also turning into same junction or was continuing straight a head? Is it a single carriage way one lane in each direction? What is the speed limit for the road and is that a solid white line I see..!!!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I wouldn't have thought its a solid white line running down the carriageway as its only a single one.


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## sgb (Jun 9, 2012)

Was the galaxy also signalling to turn? Also how fast did he overtake. If you couldn't see him because of the galaxy maybe he genuinely couldn't see you either and assumed the galaxy was parked? Just a thought, I wasn't there.


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## Derek Mc (Jun 27, 2006)

You are 100% in the right on this, the galaxy driver is a prat for not stopping and helping.

as said above the Highway code mentions overtaking at junctions, in specific numbered terms, job done, do not accept a 50/50 on this. It is pure impatience from that asshole.


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## majcas84 (Aug 24, 2012)

His fault 100%.

I don't see why you should be expected to look for cars driving on the wrong side of the road behind you. If you're making the right turn you should be concentrating on the cars travelling in the correct direction towards you in order to assess when it is safe to proceed. It sounds as though that's exactly what you were doing.

Stand your ground on this one mate. Good luck with it.


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## mattsbmw (Jul 20, 2008)

have you got sn overhead view from google maps? the pictures and description are just not clear enough to make a judgement.


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## Wingnuts (Sep 3, 2012)

Lloyd71 said:


> The other guy was clearly driving like a complete bellend'.


Never a more true word spoken



majcas84 said:


> His fault 100%.
> 
> I don't see why you should be expected to look for cars driving on the wrong side of the road behind you. If you're making the right turn you should be concentrating on the cars travelling in the correct direction towards you in order to assess when it is safe to proceed. It sounds as though that's exactly what you were doing.
> 
> Stand your ground on this one mate. Good luck with it.


Agree with this totally


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## Shiny (Apr 23, 2007)

I still can't work out exactly what has happened and the road layout from the picture. 

Any chance of drawing a detailed diagram (aerial view), showing the roads, markings, directions and the positions of your vehicles both before and after the accident?


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## ardandy (Aug 18, 2006)

Google map would be easier. 

Im still unsure what's happened tbh!


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## CraigQQ (Jan 20, 2011)

from the photo, it would appear it's a single lane road, traffic flowing in single file either direction.

Car A (106) slowed to a stop to turn right into a junction/street that runs off the main road here.
Car B (Toyota) pulls out to overtake two cars and continue straight on the road as car A finds a gap and attempts to make his right hand turn into said junction or street to his right.
Car A is mid maneuver when car B overtakes two cars and the collision happens.


Now, I'm not a professional advisor in insurance such as Lloyd who will likely know better than me.
But to me, it's 100% fault with him. You are not allowed to overtake a car turning right if the car is indicating right before maneuvering.


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Ok so hopefully diagram below will help:

http://sdrv.ms/11MfAmU

I'm the green blob, sitting on my side of the road waiting for oncoming traffic to pass before making the right turn up the road. As I'm making my turn the driver of the red blob decides to overtake both the blue blob and myself and I collide with him as I make my turn.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

atrose81 said:


> Ok so hopefully diagram below will help:
> 
> http://sdrv.ms/11MfAmU
> 
> I'm the green blob, sitting on my side of the road waiting for oncoming traffic to pass before making the right turn up the road. As I'm making my turn the driver of the red blob decides to overtake both the blue blob and myself and I collide with him as I make my turn.


Just had a look on google maps, I'm not sure what you are 'worried ' about, the guy is driving on the wrong side of the road, whether he thought you were parked or not is irrelevant.


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

right, something is confusing me.

you say you were stationary, waiting to turn right, waiting for oncoming traffic?

if so, and he was queuing behind the galaxy, who was behind you, were you sitting there for a while not going anywhere? only asking as the time it must have taken for him to think that you must be parked up, to pulling out, to passing the galaxy, and then passing you i can only imagine that there wasnt anything coming towads you in that time?


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Nothing coming towards me from in front but i couldn't make the turn up the road i was going into because it has cars both sides and only room for one direction of travel at a time. I was waiting for this to be clear before i could proceed.


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## Shiny (Apr 23, 2007)

If the diagram reflects the incident, you shouldn't have anything to worry about :thumb:


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## TooFunny (Sep 18, 2012)

Completely the other persons fault, let it go to county court and you'll win.


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## wanna veccy (May 7, 2009)

So as far as Mr Toyota is concerned you were just a muppet who was parked up opposite a junction. The road was clear for you to turn but you never so he has assumed you were just parked up. Although I don't agree with his actions I can certainly see why he made his attempt to go around you.( too many ppl don't abide by the Highway Code forcing others to have to ignore it also, just to continue on their journey).i would like to think that he will be deemed liable, but it wouldn't surprise me if this goes 50/50,this down to the fact that so many ppl are ignorant to the Highway Code.


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## Grin (Jun 13, 2012)

Given the apparent width of the road, and your position relative to the white line both in your description and in the photograph, it says something about the driving skills of Mr. Toyota if he thought you were parked that far from the kerb.


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## CleanCar99 (Dec 30, 2011)

Google maps link anyone?


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## Will_G (Jan 23, 2012)

417 Bramford Ln, Ipswich, Suffolk IP1, UK
http://goo.gl/maps/72X0q


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## CleanCar99 (Dec 30, 2011)

If you were both parked, the car behind you would be blocking that drop-curb to the farm.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

kybert said:


> If you were both parked, the car behind you would be blocking that drop-curb to the farm.


I had noticed that, there is little defence for the 3rd party, it's not about what he thought, it's about what actually happened, as long as the OP sticks to facts when he submits the claim, the insurers can argue amongst themselves (which shouldn't take long). Sadly for both their premiums will be affected upon renewal.


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## CleanCar99 (Dec 30, 2011)

My premium has never been effected after an accident; no idea why others are? Shop around a little!


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2013)

If he overtook at a junction then definitely his fault.


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Thanks for all the advice guys. I just wanted to make sure there wasn't anything else I could have done.

I have the details of the vehicle that was behind me but without an address I don't know if the insurance company would contact them.


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## salim (Apr 13, 2013)

Judging by the diagram you should be ok, did you get the number for the witness behind you. That should be enough. Premiums are affected on some policies if claim is not settled by renewal/inception.


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

Well no updates as yet. Had to fill in three report forms as previous company dealing with claim rejected it as i did not want a hire car. 

Just had a quote from body shop for £900 

Got to get one more to send to insurance company. Got a feeling going to be written off although i understand i might be able to buy back depending on category ?


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## atrose81 (Nov 18, 2012)

So, just an update on this.

Still waiting to get sorted by insurance company.

3rd party is saying I was parked even though he was a car further back. Got witness statement now saying I was sitting in the road indicating.

Insurance company telling me I might get partially blamed for not checking my mirror which I did. Told the guy that at some point you have to stop looking in the mirror to make the manoeuvre.

Will see how it goes.


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