# Considering switching to ONR washing - a few questions



## Eliasasas (Feb 22, 2014)

So I've read the stickies, watched some videos, and browsed the first few pages of this forum section. I do have a couple of questions however.

1. Why are people against using 2 buckets for ONR washing? Aside from filling up an extra bucket with water, I fail to see how this would be a bad thing. Sure, you will be transferring some pure water into the wash bucket and therefor "weakening" the solution in terms of dilution ratio. However, couldn't this just be solved by adding a little bit of extra ONR into the wash bucket around halfway through the wash? Does this make any sense? I just think it would be nice to rinse in clean water. Or rather, I'm afraid to transfer the dirt back into the wash mitt/sponge and onto the car.

2. Sponge? Wash mitt? If so, what kind? For normal 2BM washing I've been using Carpro merino wool mitts and I think they're great. Are these bad for ONR washing? I've read a lot about using sponges or wash mitts that are generally considered worse in terms of quality and paint safety compared to wool mitts (for 2BM washing). What I love about my merino wool mitts is how easy it is to rinse them clean in a bucket. This seems like a perfect property for a wash mitt to be used for ONR, but I read people don't prefer these. It all seems a little backwards to me since I'm still a little skeptical about the whole ONR thing.

3. How much ONR solution should I count on using as pre-soak for one wash? My car is a Kia Ceed 2013 SW, around the same size as Golf Wagon, so pretty average in size. I'm asking because I'm not sure how big of a container my pump sprayer needs to have. Will 1L be enough? Or do I need 2L? Or even more?


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## lowejackson (Feb 23, 2006)

1. If you are keen to use two buckets then feel free, add some ONR to the second bucket, nothing horrible will happen. I find one bucket is enough but if you want two, then no problem

2. I use a cheap noodle mitt whereas others prefer a sponge. I have no idea if your mitt will work although presumably as long as you rinse the mitt to release any dirt you should be fine

3. I use a 1L bottle and also used a 0.5L bottle on many occasions


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## Rayner (Aug 16, 2012)

I use the carpro mitt for rinseless although I've gone off ONR and using something else. I also use 2 buckets and no matter what anyone says it works and I'll do it that way. Your mitt will get stained and you will question it! The one I use releases dirt rather than staining the mitt like onr but onr is good. 

500ml solution is usually adequate but 1L is obviously better in case you do go over 500ml.


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## lowejackson (Feb 23, 2006)

Quick bit of checking and it seems the wool mitt is not possibly the best product, for example

*The reason we recommend Microfiber towels is that there are anywhere from 50,000 pores per square inch for an average microfiber to 200,000 pores per square inch for a very plush Microfiber towel. These pores are active sites to trap dirt and remove it from the surface. Therefore you get a much greater cleaning and protecting effect from a microfiber towel than a wool mitt, etc. The towels we offer are on the upper end of the range I mentioned. The only draw back when using a Microfiber towel as the wash media is that it is hard to remove the dirt that is trapped by No Rinse from the towel unless you use a strong detergent like Power Clean.

Another great wash media is a soft sponge (minimum 80 PPI) that works great for washing with No Rinse. The advantages of sponge over Microfiber is that dirt particles can get adsorbed into the sponge and away from the surface. We are working with a foam manufacturer to develop a mitt that not only is safe and gentle for the automotive paint but also has good cleaning and dirt release properties. Once we complete all the testing and development, we will make this new foam mitt available to help make the wash process with Optimum No Rinse easier. 
*
http://optimumforums.org/index.php?showtopic=1247&hl=wool#entry7754

I would not see using a noodle or sponge as a step backwards but rather using the tools which will give the best results


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## Rayner (Aug 16, 2012)

lowejackson said:


> Quick bit of checking and it seems the wool mitt is not possibly the best product, for example
> 
> *The reason we recommend Microfiber towels is that there are anywhere from 50,000 pores per square inch for an average microfiber to 200,000 pores per square inch for a very plush Microfiber towel. These pores are active sites to trap dirt and remove it from the surface. Therefore you get a much greater cleaning and protecting effect from a microfiber towel than a wool mitt, etc. The towels we offer are on the upper end of the range I mentioned. The only draw back when using a Microfiber towel as the wash media is that it is hard to remove the dirt that is trapped by No Rinse from the towel unless you use a strong detergent like Power Clean.
> 
> ...


So they're saying that 200,000 PPI is good but a sponge at 80PPI is a good alternative?

Funny... Some people are good at marketing


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## lowejackson (Feb 23, 2006)

I tried both MF towels and sponges but for me the noodle mitt was much better.


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## mattyh2013 (Aug 5, 2013)

1. I use to use 2 but recently started using 1 and a grit guard. Tbh I've not noticed any differnece, so sticking with 1 as it's easier. 
2. Tried grout sponges and zymol but finally settled on the ddj supernatural sponge which I love. Other than that it would be a cheap kent noodle mitt. 
3. I use a hozelock 1.5 l sprayer which is enough for the pre soak of the whole car (vauxhall corsa) and I still have around 0.5 l left for rinsing the wheels at the end.


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## Eliasasas (Feb 22, 2014)

I just can't understand the benefits of using a sponge, regardless of how many buckets you use, grit guards or not, quality of the sponge etc. The only benefit I see is the fact that they're easy to rinse out. This is mainly due to the fact that dirt doesn't get absorbed by a sponge very well, it sort of sticks to the surface of the sponge. This means that you risk dragging dirt along your paint as you glide your sponge over it.

What am I missing here?


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## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

The dirt doesn't stick to the sponge because the dirt is encapsulated within the ONR polymers. The dirt will have been removed with the ONR Pre Soak before you even place the sponge on the car.

You will be very surprised by how clean the sponge and the water stays.

I use 2 buckets, I use a Dodo Supernatural sponge and the 2 work really well together.


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## Rayner (Aug 16, 2012)

Eliasasas said:


> I just can't understand the benefits of using a sponge, regardless of how many buckets you use, grit guards or not, quality of the sponge etc. The only benefit I see is the fact that they're easy to rinse out. This is mainly due to the fact that dirt doesn't get absorbed by a sponge very well, it sort of sticks to the surface of the sponge. This means that you risk dragging dirt along your paint as you glide your sponge over it.
> 
> What am I missing here?


Your not missing anything. That's why I stopped using ONR, my drying towels always ended up dirty because the dirt isn't released on rinsing the sponge/mitt/mf. Have a look at this stuff... Personally I find it has better cleaning power, feels more slick on the mitt and also and most importantly it doesn't stain the mitt/mf, the dirt gets released into the bucket not dragged around the surface. http://www.seriousperformance.co.uk/Products,108,toView_1010.html


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## SteveTDCi (Feb 8, 2006)

my tip, wear gloves, using ONR brings my hands out in a rash


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## m500dpp (Feb 17, 2006)

My tip is just use it! I use a MF cloth and plush drying towel. I can wash the cars in much less time, and even wash black cars in bright sun without smearing.

I still use the hose etc for wheels and if the cars are really dirty I prefer a full wash, it's using the appropriate product for the circumstances.......


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