# Paving slabs, pointing?



## 182_Blue

OK, I have just cleaned my paving slabs with my Karcher and now I am removing the cement pointing, question is do I re cement or use sand or something else?

This is the area I mean, it's quite a large area so need something that's easy but lasts?


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## Clancy

To get rid you just need to rake it out, chisel and some patience will do it, may need a hammer for any hard spots 

Replacing wise there are loads of options now days, avoid cement based as these are what fail for a past time. Too strong and they crack with differential settlement and too weak the weather just eats it 

Have a google at different options and see what sounds suitable


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## turbosnoop

When I paved out my car maintainance area I think I just used a 3 to 1 wet sharp sand and cement mix. I'm no expert and I'm not going to say it could be the best thing going or anything. But one year on and it looks the same as when I first did it basically, and it gets cars driven over it. 

In my experience with cement , as expected, one of the most important things is to get the ratios right and well mixed. Paying an extra pound or so for the cement in plastic bags makes life loads easier as the paper bagged cement rips and cement tends to spill out the rips, its messy, plus the plastic helps keep moisture out. If there's any movement in the slabs, don't leave it, as it will cause the pointing to fail earlier.

However I understand you can point with dry mixes, or resin or god knows what else.

Have you checked out the paving expert site?


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## Juke_Fan

Recently did mine, used a hammer and a cheap flat screwdriver to get the mortar out. Took ages and god did my back hurt 

Filled in between the slabs using two different methods:-

1. mortar mix brushed in and then gently sprayed with water.
2. pre-mixed the mortar and applied using small brick laying trowel and a brick jointer to finish off.

No 1. was definitely quicker but No. 2 looks better and I believe will be stronger as I was able to compress the mortar into the joints.

You could try one of these...


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## robertdon777

I used the pre mixed brush in stuff last time, then watered and it sets.

This makes it easy and quick.....But, there's always a But with easy and quick. Its not as good a finish compared yo where I did another bit of work using the old method of making my own and then pushing it in manually and smoothing.

The proper stuff has also kept well, the brush in stuff has started to break up. I think the issue with brush in stuff is it gets air pockets so doesn't bridge the gaps as well as the traditional methods.


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## robertdon777

Forgot to say I got about 4 years out of the brush in pre mix til it started breaking up a bit.


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## turbosnoop

Got to admit I'd be tempted to use an angle grinder and a couple of masonry discs to get a head start on removing any old mortar


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## 182_Blue

Juke_Fan said:


> Recently did mine, used a hammer and a cheap flat screwdriver to get the mortar out. Took ages and god did my back hurt
> 
> Filled in between the slabs using two different methods:-
> 
> 1. mortar mix brushed in and then gently sprayed with water.
> 2. pre-mixed the mortar and applied using small brick laying trowel and a brick jointer to finish off.
> 
> No 1. was definitely quicker but No. 2 looks better and I believe will be stronger as I was able to compress the mortar into the joints.
> 
> You could try one of these...


Now thats what i need :lol:


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## Clancy

turbosnoop said:


> Got to admit I'd be tempted to use an angle grinder and a couple of masonry discs to get a head start on removing any old mortar


Can do that no issue, angle grinders have tendency to jump though so helps if your used to that. Also helps if the slabs are fairly straight, just saves any damage


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## 182_Blue

Slabs now have the grout removed (used a small cold steel chisel), myself and my wife spent most of the day doing it, its not a enjoyable job !

Now to the grouting !


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## streaky

I have seen on site a ready mixed mortar, comes in smallish tubs and is possibly a resin type? Might be worth looking up


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## Clancy

182_Blue said:


> Slabs now have the grout removed (used a small cold steel chisel), myself and my wife spent most of the day doing it, its not a enjoyable job !
> 
> Now to the grouting !


Decided what to go for yet ?


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## VIPER

As others have said, the ratio is critical for this (for the reasons given), but a mortar gun (like a big metal mastic gun, but made for cement mixes) will make life so much easier and quicker (and in this heat and humidity, trying to get in with a small pointing trowel can take ages and all the time the mix is going off).

The only thing to watch out for is if you do get the mix wrong, the gun can tend to just squeeze the water out of the mortar, leaving a very dry mix in the tube which is then too thick and solid to be pushed out. The key is to really make sure it's mixed very well into almost a 'creamy' consistancy. This can be a bit of a pita and a what seems like a lot of work before you've started, but once it's flowing out of the gun smoothly, the speed you can then get on with the job makes the preparation worth it. If you can get some sort of 'stiring device' into a drill, it will make the mixing a lot easier.

One of these









Hope that helps


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## 182_Blue

Clancy said:


> Decided what to go for yet ?


Nope


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## acake

When I did my patio I went for vdw 850 resin pointing.Easy to use indestrutable so say and one of the best on the market basically industral gout and total over kill for a patinly down side is price at £85 for 25 kg.take alook at www.pavingexpert.com/point_ncc01.htm to see a revew.Also loads of ebay video's on it as well.

The only other one that is any good of the cheeper brushin types is marhalls weather point 365.the rest are no good when you look in to it


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## VIPER

Tricky isn't it? It's not something you want to be doing a second time if you get it wrong, so although my shout for the motar gun still stands, as I said, it's easy to not achieve the correct mix and have it not work, then you'll have bought it for nothing, have it all to clean out, be back to square one and have my guts for garters for suggesting it lol!. So that said, maybe something like this:

http://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-Pati...2|pkw||pmt||&gclid=CJfqor3ZjM4CFc8aGwodf68H3A

is worth a look. Apart from the odd one, the reviews seem largely very good. All the usual DIY places should do their own version or Screwfix, Toolstation etc. I should add that I haven't used any of these types of product personally, so I'm not speaking from experience - I've always either used the gun or done it the 'old fashioned' way with a pointing trowel.


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## RichardC

acake said:


> When I did my patio I went for vdw 850 resin pointing.Easy to use indestrutable so say and one of the best on the market basically industral gout and total over kill for a patinly down side is price at £85 for 25 kg.take alook at www.pavingexpert.com/point_ncc01.htm to see a revew.Also loads of ebay video's on it as well.
> 
> The only other one that is any good of the cheeper brushin types is marhalls weather point 365.the rest are no good when you look in to it


+1 on this. I used it on 90sqm and my builder who had never used it was impressed. Not the cheapest product but saves masses of time.


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## Soul boy 68

What ever the out come, I'm sure it will look lovely when finished.


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## 182_Blue

acake said:


> When I did my patio I went for vdw 850 resin pointing.Easy to use indestrutable so say and one of the best on the market basically industral gout and total over kill for a patinly down side is price at £85 for 25 kg.take alook at www.pavingexpert.com/point_ncc01.htm to see a revew.Also loads of ebay video's on it as well.
> 
> The only other one that is any good of the cheeper brushin types is marhalls weather point 365.the rest are no good when you look in to it


Is this stuff available in stores ?


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## acake

182_Blue said:


> Is this stuff available in stores ?


No. its avalible from here www.nccstreetscape.co.uk/Shop/Category.mvc/Detail/1 there are the uk importers of it. Got mine from them they are really helpful and quick with delivery and any questions.


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## 182_Blue

acake said:


> No. its avalible from here www.nccstreetscape.co.uk/Shop/Category.mvc/Detail/1 there are the uk importers of it. Got mine from them they are really helpful and quick with delivery and any questions.


OK, Thanks, do you have to do the squeegee method?, my slabs aren't flat and I would say they are quite absorbant, so would worry about removing the residue, plus in places my gaps are quite wide?


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## redaprilia

Used the Wickes Patio grout or two separate jobs ( one in grey & the other in sand colour ) , its easy to use and the finished job looks fantastic .


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## acake

182_Blue said:


> OK, Thanks, do you have to do the squeegee method?, my slabs aren't flat and I would say they are quite absorbant, so would worry about removing the residue, plus in places my gaps are quite wide?


Its is the squeegee method.
My slabs are ruff kandla grey sandstone was unsure but just go by there instructions and use lots of water to wet the area befor you start and spend time hosing it down at the end.I would say i was scared to use it at first in case it went wrong.But i check out utube vids on it along with the instructions its quite easy to use.
As for a residue it says it dose not stain i only found it left a slight oily film that washed off as i was cleaning up at the end

first vid on utube that shows the proscess quite well 



 there are others


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## 182_Blue

acake said:


> Its is the squeegee method.
> My slabs are ruff kandla grey sandstone was unsure but just go by there instructions and use lots of water to wet the area befor you start and spend time hosing it down at the end.I would say i was scared to use it at first in case it went wrong.But i check out utube vids on it along with the instructions its quite easy to use.
> As for a residue it says it dose not stain i only found it left a slight oily film that washed off as i was cleaning up at the end
> 
> first vid on utube that shows the proscess quite well
> 
> 
> 
> there are others


It does look very good, I'm probably looking at over £500 to do it though at £85 each :doublesho


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## VIPER

Youch!  That's some cost for slab pointing/grouting! I'd need to be absolutely 100% it was going to work well, look good and most importantly last for that kind of outlay - especially when you've to factor in your own time to do it. Personally I think I'd be choking a bit on 500 if I were paying someone else to do the entire thing, but then I'm tight lol!


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## Andpopse

Just doing 80sq/m of Indian sandstone, and I am using the yellow point master, which after initial trail and error, is working well. The mix needs to be super creamy which I am using 1 to 3 cement sand and plasticiser. It literally slops off the small spade I am using to load the pointmaster. 
I decided that the various resin type grouts are quite expensive and need certain width and depth of joint. Also they do not usually stick the the slabs.

It's taken me 2 days to do about 40 sq/m. The time is in cleaning and getting any overspill off, which is backbreaking work.

All in all I am pleased with the result so far and cost wise it's been £35 so far £22 of that was for the pointmaster.

Hope this helps.
Andy


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## 182_Blue

Andpopse said:


> Just doing 80sq/m of Indian sandstone, and I am using the yellow point master, which after initial trail and error, is working well. The mix needs to be super creamy which I am using 1 to 3 cement sand and plasticiser. It literally slops off the small spade I am using to load the pointmaster.
> I decided that the various resin type grouts are quite expensive and need certain width and depth of joint. Also they do not usually stick the the slabs.
> 
> It's taken me 2 days to do about 40 sq/m. The time is in cleaning and getting any overspill off, which is backbreaking work.
> 
> All in all I am pleased with the result so far and cost wise it's been £35 so far £22 of that was for the pointmaster.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Andy


Who makes this ?, when i google "yellow point master" i get some weird results LOL , do you have a link ?


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## lofty

Sika do a paving grout, it's good stuff, it stinks for a few days but sets like bell metal.


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## acake

VIPER said:


> Youch!  That's some cost for slab pointing/grouting! I'd need to be absolutely 100% it was going to work well, look good and most importantly last for that kind of outlay - especially when you've to factor in your own time to do it. Personally I think I'd be choking a bit on 500 if I were paying someone else to do the entire thing, but then I'm tight lol!


Yes it is a lot but you paying for one of the best out there and dont need to worry about it failing like the cheep stuff after a few years.


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## Andpopse

182_Blue said:


> Who makes this ?, when i google "yellow point master" i get some weird results LOL , do you have a link ?


 pointmaster.co.uk. Should get you to it.


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## gillywig2

We use Flowpoint on most of our jobs.
http://www.instarmac.co.uk/ultrascape-products/flowpoint-rapid-set-flowable-grout/
This one has has a small aggregate in, but you can get a smooth version.


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## Kev.O

182 Blue, I have a point master you can borrow if you like? I done 80m2 last year and like others have said as long as you get the mixture right it's so much easier.


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## Kev.O

Kev.O said:


> 182 Blue, I have a point master you can borrow if you like? I done 80m2 last year and like others have said as long as you get the mixture right it's so much easier.


I found this in the shed yesterday, do you want o borrow it 182 Blue?


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