# what exactly is in the crazy piced waxes



## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

As per title what exactly is in these waxes that cost vast amounts 
Of money . I mean the likes of crystal rock etc the daft money 
Waxes , what do they contain or do against other waxes 
To justify the price tag ? 

Just asking purely out of interest as I noticed as massive 
Improvement moving from cheap waxes to some dodo 
Gear if the same applies the higher you go?


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2012)

craigeh123 said:


> As per title what exactly is in these waxes that cost vast amounts
> Of money . I mean the likes of crystal rock etc the daft money
> Waxes , what do they contain or do against other waxes
> To justify the price tag ?
> ...


100% Snobbery is the soul ingredient - IMO. As a pro detailer said to me..........."wax is wax".

Did you notice a difference because it cost more and you wanted to? I know I did.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

The higher up you get the less of a difference you will notice in terms of aesthetics, feel and durability etc. And some are just over priced, by that I don't mean that £2200 isn't too much, but in relation there are some that don't out perform in ANY aspects and cost vastly more. The main difference with my chosen expensive waxes is how long they not just last, but last well, staying fresh looking and slick like day one. That's the big difference IMO. As to what's in them, i hope something rare like unicorn tears, in reality, just a lot of R and D. 

Are they worth it? YES, cause I like em, simples :thumb:


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## Nanoman (Jan 17, 2009)

Am I allowed to say unicorn poop?

Colli 476 FTW!


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## Ultra (Feb 25, 2006)

Some say that a high end wax contains frankincence and myrrh.


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

Alot of it is called....taking the ****! I agree there cant be that much difference between them wax all goes through the same processes give or take if i got a wax of £ 500 +i would want it wash dry polish seal wax and make the tea why i sat there doing jack all!


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## PootleFlump (Jan 1, 2006)

Expensive/extortionate wax contains alot of expensive cars, well cut suits, nice houses....if companies can make a worthwhile margin in a £10 wax then imagine the margin on a wax that costs £500.


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## -damon- (Aug 19, 2010)

my most expensive wax is swissvax onyx lol you wont find me spending and more than that on a wax


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

It's the law of diminishing returns, just like hi-fi. 

*There is a difference, in my opinion, and if you don't see it or feel it then they are not for you.* 

You pays yer money and takes your choice just like most things in life. :thumb:

Alan W


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2012)

This will give you the answer;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor's_New_Clothes


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## derbigofast (Dec 6, 2011)

i find no difference i use autosmart wax its cheap and what a shine ive tried dodo and swissvax and i see no improvement in finish


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

I don't see no logic on expensive waxes like crystal rock, having not tried it i can't comment, there must be something in those waxes that have the appeal to the user, but what do they really offer to the paint finish ?

I mean there's a 40,000 worth of zymol wax, all sold, thats alot of money.


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## ross-1888 (Feb 22, 2009)

personally i find that in terms of looks there is very slight differences from cheaper waxes to mid to high end ones. 

as for durability then tbh i dont see much difference from colly/megs 16 to something like e-zyme/glasur 

but its just personal for me. i buy decent wax for my car as its something i like to look after. so i dont mind spending some extra cash on it. 


some higher end waxes come in nice containers like crystal rock, vintage etc. which contributes to a higher price tag 

as for the waxes that are in the £1000s then i cant comment having not used them. I wouldnt spend more than £200 on wax. anymore and its unrealistic.


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## Adrian Convery (May 27, 2010)

I have Glasur and I dont see a difference between it and higher end boutique waxes, I think Glasur is as far as I will go for now as I believe you get more with the likes of C1 due to the scratch resistance and high durability I think it would work out better!


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## Adrian Convery (May 27, 2010)

Trip tdi said:


> I don't see no logic on expensive waxes like crystal rock, having not tried it i can't comment, there must be something in those waxes that have the appeal to the user, but what do they really offer to the paint finish ?
> 
> I mean there's a 40,000 worth of zymol wax, all sold, thats alot of money.


Allegedly....


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Adrian Convery said:


> I have Glasur and I dont see a difference between it and higher end boutique waxes, I think Glasur is as far as I will go for now as I believe you get more with the likes of C1 due to the scratch resistance and high durability I think it would work out better!


I know glasur has become a "flavour of the month" so to speak but I have to say it is extremely good. It's more surprising when you have used a few different waxes, particularly high end ones, how good it is. If I was only allowed to buy one wax for ever this would be it, not too expensive to use on mates cars, but punching way way above it's weight


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

I think upto a certain price point the difference is noticeable. I personally see a difference between the colli I have used and the zymol I have used. However on the other side I do believe that there's only so much difference the eye can notice and past that price point it's all just exclusivity and people wanting it on their cars for the reason that it's expensive and therefore they their mind will tell them it's much better, the eyes see what the heart want it to. Some see a difference, some don't. I'm very 50/50 with it tbh.


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

stangalang said:


> I know glasur has become a "flavour of the month" so to speak but I have to say it is extremely good. It's more surprising when you have used a few different waxes, particularly high end ones, how good it is. If I was only allowed to buy one wax for ever this would be it, *not too expensive to use on mates cars*, but punching way way above it's weight


:doublesho I'll be your mate! I'm happy to use megs #16/#26 on my mates cars :lol:


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

JakeWhite said:


> :doublesho I'll be your mate! I'm happy to use megs #16/#26 on my mates cars :lol:


Dude, some mates get vintage and crystal rock. I look after my bro's :thumb:


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

it's all relative... there are expensive waxes.... so what?!?!?

is everyone on here that doesn't get it, or see the value, pay the minimum, cheapest value for everything in life?!? no, of course not...

why?!?

because you have been told, and believe that it's better to spend more on that certain product... do you question all of them as well?!?!?

I mean a £3 t shirt made in china is just the same as the £100 one, made in china but with some gimp designer name on it... 

:thumb:


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

It's all in the buyers perception, I wouldn't spend more than £50 on a wax, beyond that point it's not worth the extra premium for some fancy packaging, funky marketing, and claims that are rarely lived up to. You've got to weigh it all up for yourself imho, do you want longevity? If so undoubtedly a sealant is the way forwards.


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

stangalang said:


> Dude, some mates get vintage and crystal rock. I look after my bro's :thumb:


:doublesho friend request sent! :lol: only kidding dude, honestly though with regards to wax, it's the same principle as 'why do I want and iPhone 4s instead of a 3g?' the 3g will do most things the 4s will do, it does what it's there for i.e call and text but I want the 4s because of all the hype, because it's the 'in thing', because it looks slightly better, comes in a better case. Same as waxes really isn't it? If people are willing to pay for it, I'll buy the £24,000 brough and howarth wax which comes in a hand crafted marble pot, 1 in existence :lol:


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## alteclio (May 10, 2011)

I think thta people who spends so much money in a wax is just because they can afford it. And I'm sure most of them are not going to use it themselves, they will pay a professional to do the job. As Jakewhite said, it's the same than with bags, i.e.: is it necessaty to pay 10000€ for a bag? No, but I can pay it and all my friends will be jealous...


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

alteclio said:


> I think thta people who spends so much money in a wax is just because they can afford it. And I'm sure most of them are not going to use it themselves, they will pay a professional to do the job. As Jakewhite said, it's the same than with bags, i.e.: is it necessaty to pay 10000€ for a bag? No, but I can pay it and all my friends will be jealous...


I know what you mean, I personally opt for the more expensive waxes due to my customers but my own car generally gets something like Chem Guys XXX which is cheap enough and gives what I want. I like to wax regularly so using Zymol on my own car is purely a waste of money


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Super expensive [_insert anything in here: car waxes, watches, clothes, cars_] exist for those who wish to indulge in them - simple as that. They're rarely - if ever - going to be quantified in material terms, nor should they be imo. Why? because it's a free market and there's choice to purchase at a lower amount.


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## KADVR6 (Mar 16, 2008)

i think its called the placibo effect, you spend £200+ on a pot of wax so its gotta be the best wax ever.

sorry but no car wax is worth that money, spend your time making sure the car is as clean as possible before spending what you feel comfy on a wax, and be happy with your results. leave the £200+ pots of wax to the pro's who detail veyrons/enzo's etc and so can pass the cost of there holy grail wax onto the london banker who they are doing the detail for.


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## ercapoccia (Nov 14, 2008)

For someone £2000 is the month salary for someone else is just what the get for few hours playing some sport. 

If you ask anybody in Italy if a £20 wax is cheap, they will tell you "What £20? Are you insane is too much, i can get a £5 wax that has the same finish"

I believe that a boutique wax is like a rare bottle of wine and the price just doesn't matter...


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## ercapoccia (Nov 14, 2008)

For someone £2000 is the month salary for someone else is just what the get for few hours playing some sport. 

If you ask anybody in Italy if a £20 is cheap, they will tell you "What £20? Are you insane is too much, i can get a £5 wax that has the same finish"

I believe that a boutique wax is like a rare bottle of wine and the price just doesn't matter...


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## walker1967 (Sep 12, 2010)

I have a tub of SV Best Of Show which I got for nothing through a family member ( it was half full ) and in all honesty I rate it above anything else in my kit as its so easy to spread and buff off even if left on the car for long periods of time, I reckon one its done I''l no doubt buy some more but I've recently bought fk1000p and only used it once but i am liking the feel of it, easy on easy off and its opposite end of the price scale


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## Mr.Ry (Nov 14, 2011)

Everyone To Themselves...Its Just Personal Preference In My Opinion And What You Yourself Is Happy With


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

ercapoccia said:


> *For someone £2000 is the month salary* for someone else is just what the get for few hours playing some sport.
> 
> If you ask anybody in Italy if a £20 is cheap, they will tell you "What £20? Are you insane is too much, i can get a £5 wax that has the same finish"
> 
> I believe that a boutique wax is like a rare bottle of wine and the price just doesn't matter...


i wish! :lol:


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

If you have the money, theres no problem, will not break the bank, my circumstances, theres no chance i will ever try a boutique wax.


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Better quality ingredients and manufacturing consistancy I would say. It's easy to tell the difference in quality between a botique wax and a mass produced one.

But the question was about the 'crazy priced waxes'. Never used them myself, so can't comment on these! My opinion is they are taking the ****, but that doesn't mean they are bad. I might get a Zymol holiday samlper to try out, but I'd never buy a full pot!


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

If you have the money then 500 quid is no different to joe normal spending a tenner seems to be snob value more than performance how can a wax of this price be that much better than a wax of 50 quid


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

I think it's not fair to label it a "snob" thing to do...

Some people have more money... some people have more interest, so they will spend more on an item...

Quite simple... and nothing to do with being a snob... IMO

:thumb:


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> I think it's not fair to label it a "snob" thing to do...
> 
> Some people have more money... some people have more interest, so they will spend more on an item...t
> 
> ...


Im talking more for the people who have no idea just buy the dearest item they can and think its gotta be the best as its expensive, most of us on here wouldnt spend silly money as we know the crack with products etc


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

For me I am very enthusiastic about detailing so it was a natural progression to try the higher end waxes after the <£100 stuff. I liked what I saw. 

Also, from a business perspective they can make a lot more sense. On a per layer basis Crystal Rock is about £16 (based on 50 layers) which is cheap when compared to 25ml of C1. It's the initial outlay that puts most off. 

I had a couple of customers ask for it specifically so I decided to buy a pot and sell upgrade layers for £30-40. 

Some of the premium waxes really aren't very good though and not something I want to be fighting with after spending 12 hours on a car.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

rsblue said:


> Im talking more for the people who have no idea just buy the dearest item they can and think its gotta be the best as its expensive, most of us on here wouldnt spend silly money as we know the crack with products etc


I understand your point... but that's not my definition of a snob either! :lol:

I would just class that as being stupid... 

Although, I have to admit to buying the dearest a few times, when I know nothing about an item  :wall: but i'm stupid, so that's ok!

:lol:



MidlandsCarCare said:


> Also, from a business perspective they can make a lot more sense. On a per layer basis Crystal Rock is about £16 (based on 50 layers) which is cheap when compared to 25ml of C1. It's the initial outlay that puts most off.


I agree, far too many people look at just the upfront cost, rather than than the value of the items in the long term...and again this is for ALL items.. not just wax.. 

:thumb:


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## Matt_Nic (Apr 15, 2011)

I wouldnt even spend £45 on a tub of HD wax tbh. I've seen it on cars and it's no better than the £16 I paid for my Megs #26

The shine comes from the preperation before you wax it mostly. £2k wax on tired unpolished paint isnt going to look as good as £10 wax on a beautifully prepared surface.


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

just like cars really. Why do people want a car with upgrades, more gadgets etc when essentialy they all do the same thing, get us from A-B. Some do it because they like all those extra touches, some just because they want to try it, and some just because they can. 99% percent of us here have bought a more expensive something because of one of the reasons above whether it be wax,cars,golf clubs,shoes,phones,computers etc so why is wax any different? If detailing is your passion and hobby, of course you're going to try more expensive stuff, just like a golfer spends heaps on clubs and pringle gear, its what they want to use


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

Matt_Nic said:


> I wouldnt even spend £45 on a tub of HD wax tbh. I've seen it on cars and it's no better than the £16 I paid for my Megs #26
> 
> The shine comes from the preperation before you wax it mostly. £2k wax on tired unpolished paint isnt going to look as good as £10 wax on a beautifully prepared surface.


if thats the case, then what about the 2k wax on the same perfect surface as the 10 quid wax?


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## Matt_Nic (Apr 15, 2011)

Valid question. 

I dunno, I've never seen a car with £2k wax on it let alone actually used it. 

But I have used 3 different waxes on mine in the last year and noticed no difference in the finish.

Dodo Light Fantastic
Colinite 476
Meguiars #26


IMO, somethings really are better the more you spend. A £170k 458 Italia really is a better car to drive than £170 MGF

But somethings are just over priced. And I think car wax is one of them. I'd rather spend £150 on a polishing machine + pads and polishes and a cheap wax to finish off the protection than £200 on a tub of "fancy" wax and slap it on a rough surface.


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

Matt_Nic said:


> I wouldnt even spend £45 on a tub of HD wax tbh. I've seen it on cars and it's no better than the £16 I paid for my Megs #26
> 
> The shine comes from the preperation before you wax it mostly. £2k wax on tired unpolished paint isnt going to look as good as £10 wax on a beautifully prepared surface.


True but there are very slight differences there. Lots of industries are the same - premium food ranges, hi-fi, cosmetics - they all do the same thing the higher up the range you go. To some there are differences, to some Clinique is overpriced Boots No7 or PMC speaker on a Mark Levinson amp s sound just the same as a Bush Mini System, as it's the same music.

As suggested above, the difference tends to be retaining that 'just waxed look' for longer. Is that worth paying for? It depends on your level of interest and circumstances I suppose. Some always like to back the good value hero products. There's nothing wrong with that but most people who seem to dismiss high end waxes have probably never tried them....


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

MidlandsCarCare said:


> As suggested above, the difference tends to be retaining that 'just waxed look' for longer. Is that worth paying for? It depends on your level of interest and circumstances I suppose. Some always like to back the good value hero products. There's nothing wrong with that but most people who seem to dismiss high end waxes have probably never tried them....


Again, as is the case with most things... the people who moan and complain the most have never owned or tried said products (whatever they may be - again this is not just about waxes!)

All down to petty jealousy?!?!?!?! hmmmmm

:thumb:


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## MidlandsCarCare (Feb 18, 2006)

JakeWhite said:


> if thats the case, then what about the 2k wax on the same perfect surface as the 10 quid wax?


Upon application, perhaps very little difference. After 3 months the £2k wax would look better I'd imagine.

Great value sealants (£ per layer) like Zaino confuse things further as they retain looks, are more durable and also very cheap, but not everyone likes their 'look'

This debate will always rage on as everyone has different perceptions of value and requirements.


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

The Cueball said:


> Again, as is the case with most things... the people who moan and complain the most have never owned or tried said products (whatever they may be - again this is not just about waxes!)
> 
> All down to petty jealousy?!?!?!?! hmmmmm
> 
> :thumb:


Just buy some Collie man! :lol:


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

type[r]+ said:


> Just buy some Collie man! :lol:


pffft... I'm far too rich and important to use Collie!!!! :doublesho:doublesho

:tumbleweed:

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Joking!!!


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Matt_Nic said:


> But somethings are just over priced. And I think car wax is one of them. I'd rather spend £150 on a polishing machine + pads and polishes and a cheap wax to finish off the protection than £200 on a tub of "fancy" wax and slap it on a rough surface.


only £150? :tumbleweed:


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

The Cueball said:


> pffft... I'm far too rich and important to use Collie!!!! :doublesho:doublesho
> 
> :tumbleweed:
> 
> ...


I think the correct terminology was 'snob'


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

Im just going to buy the most expensive..... Just because i can ha ha  Not!


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## Matt_Nic (Apr 15, 2011)

type[r]+ said:


> only £150? :tumbleweed:


In fact, I think mine was £132

It worked.

Why spend more?

Interesting point some one raised about hi-fi pricing.

I went in a Bose demo shop a while back. They sat me in a little room, put Transformers on and blew me away with their surround sound system. 
I had my bank card in my hand ready to buy it when I realised it wasnt £300, it was £3,000

It was good. But it wasnt £3,000 worth of good.
My Pioneer one was a few hundred new and the Bose one wasnt 10x as good, so why does it cost 10 x as much?

Same goes for waxes. They may be better, but the price difference cant justify it.


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

and i think peopl are focusing too muc on look alone with wax but your also paying for factors such as ease of use,ease of removal,water behaviour,how long the just waxed look lasts even smell! And I'm very passionate about cars and detailing so when I've spent days correcting a car, do I want all that hard work finished by a 10 quid wax? No! I've invested all that time and money in the prep so I want to finish it off with something that's a bit more special and exciting. But saying that i still use my cheaper waxes regularly. This doesnt make me a snob or stupid, i'm just enthusiastic and extremely passionate about my work


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

Why not finish with a £10 wax if it's doing the same job as a £100+ wax? The cheaper waxes like megs #16, FK1000P, collintie 476 & 845 last a lot longer than the dearer boutique stuff anyway. You mention smell, ease of use etc, there's not many waxes that are easier to use or smell better than the Dodo Juice stuff and they can be had for £28 a pot.


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

JakeWhite said:


> and i think peopl are focusing too muc on look alone with wax but your also paying for factors such as ease of use,ease of removal,water behaviour,how long the just waxed look lasts even smell! And I'm very passionate about cars and detailing so when I've spent days correcting a car, do I want all that hard work finished by a 10 quid wax? No! I've invested all that time and money in the prep so I want to finish it off with something that's a bit more special and exciting. But saying that i still use my cheaper waxes regularly. This doesnt make me a snob or stupid, i'm just enthusiastic and extremely passionate about my work


There no 2 ways round it a halfords own jobbie aint going to work as well as one of the top brand cg, sw,rg etc etc etc, just for the pure fact it has not had as much r and d put into it,i agree i wouldnt use rubbish but couldnt even think of buying a 1000 quid plus wax even if i had the money just for the fact it cant be that much better than one of say 100 quid


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

Because in my experience they dont do the same job at all, and for example, my #16 is harder to remove than my Titanium. I'm not going to sell all my more expensive gear just to stock up on turtlewax because for me, it wont do the job I want it too. Thats my personal preference. And on that bombshell, i'm out


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

rsblue said:


> but couldnt even think of buying a 1000 quid plus wax even if i had the money just for the fact it cant be that much better than one of say 100 quid


I'm not having a go at you here... just chatting...:thumb:

But if that is how you feel, why have you bought the car you have now... when a £1,000 banger does everything the same..

i.e. goes, slows, can reach the speed limit, carry people and bags etc...

So what does your car do for you that a cheaper one couldn't????

and apply that mentality to a wax...  :lol:

:thumb:


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

Not sure you can compare a car to a wax, there always things that are going to cost more than will be better all be it doing the same job cars being one of those things , just cant see this in a wax maybe its just me


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

rsblue said:


> Not sure you can compare a car to a wax, there always things that are going to cost more than will be better all be it doing the same job cars being one of those things , just cant see this in a wax maybe its just me


Of course you can... they are both products for consumers.. nothing more, nothing less...

It's just that you chose to pay more for one, and justify it to yourself with whatever internal dialogue needed...

:thumb:


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

Can anyone honestly say that a thoushand pound wax is 10 x better than one of 100 or lower....?.. Regardless of if you have th money etc etc


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## Dan_S (Nov 10, 2011)

Going back to the original question, there are obviously no super expensive ingedients that go into produding 'crazy expensive' waxes. Quality ingedients and production, research, testing, marketing and reputation are a number of the factors I would list for these waxes costing so much.

Obviously the law of diminishing returns applies to waxes, what I don't understand is that this is continually debated by a majority of people who have not used said waxes but claim their cheaper waxes produce similar results. I would assume those who have tried waxes such as CR, Vintage and Royale did so because detailing is their passion/hobby and they could justify spending the money to find out the real truth for themselves, as no amount of photos and debate on the internet are going to prove if they are superior or not.


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

rsblue said:


> Can anyone honestly say that a thoushand pound wax is 10 x better than one of 100 or lower....?.. Regardless of if you have th money etc etc


Professional detailers who up sell it certainly can! 
I think might just be a major point. I personally can't justify spending that much, but if I was making money off it, I'd be all over it! :thumb:

People want to feel special. Just imagine telling Paul Dalton "nah mate, put that Crystal Rock down. I just want Collinite." :lol:


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> Of course you can... they are both products for consumers.. nothing more, nothing less...
> 
> It's just that you chose to pay more for one, and justify it to yourself with whatever internal dialogue needed...
> 
> :thumb:


As i have said maybe its just me with regards to a wax if the performance could justify the difference in price then yeah im good to go just cant see it.


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

Matt_Nic said:


> I wouldnt even spend £45 on a tub of HD wax tbh. I've seen it on cars and it's no better than the £16 I paid for my Megs #26
> 
> The shine comes from the preperation before you wax it mostly. £2k wax on tired unpolished paint isnt going to look as good as £10 wax on a beautifully prepared surface.


You miss the point.

Wax isn't about just looks anymore. Years ago yes. I even seen Dave KG mention different looks from different waxes years ago.

I've used some amount of different waxes since I started detailing, from 476 - Vics - Glasur - Concours - Dodo Juice - Shield - Bos - Celeste.

They all have their niches. Their quirks. Are the big boys worth the money? Imo there is only so much I personally would pay for a wax.

At the same time I buy expensive waxes for the pleasure they give. The experience, the drama. I know on top of some nice glaze the difference will be minimal but whilst comparing the application of 476 vs say a Glasur or Bos there is no contest, the more expensive wins hands down.

People are still hung up on looks, that's only a small percentage of the whole package. Maybe try leaving collinites over night and try buffing it off the next day, then come back and tell me there is no difference.

It's been said, it's all relative. From a personal/amatuer pov I earn enough to be able to treat my car to very good products, I don't earn enough to buy the most expensive waxes out there but if I did there is a good chance I would purchase one or 2.

The drama of the packaging on something like Vintage is what it's all about. As a business it makes even more sense, selling layers etc.


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

I switched to dodo in a panel pot from using turtle wax red . Was 
Always happy with the finish that turtle wax gave but wanted 
To try some carnuba stuff . Massive difference in application 
And removal love the stuff . 

Which is what I was wondering I'd love to try really expensive 
Wax and see what I thought , kind of pointless on my car though , tottally get it on a business level 
As there's profit to be made and everyone likes premium stuff regardless 
Of what sector its in


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

The thing is there is so many waxes on the market, its hard to choose which one to go for under the boutique scale.

But for the boutique range, waxes that are high in price, its limited choice, really depends if you are running a business or have the money to spend that cash, the user will know that the car is protected by the best standards and the applier of the wax will have a different experience, because they know in there mind they have the state of the art wax.

For me, i have never felt or tried a high end boutique wax so can't comment, but i doubt i ever will due to my circumstances.


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

I wouldn't pay over £100 for a pot of wax, absolutely no way. 

I do however plough loads of money into my car. A stupid amount for what it is. That's the thing though... wax, cars, stereos, anything... we all have our passions that we will splash out on, and other things we think the exact opposite and save where we can. 

Do you drink £5 bottles of wine, or £50 ones? 
Do you have 5's on your own and 50's when you're with some tart trying to get your nat-king? 
Do you have a wife because you treat her well, so do without 'treats'? 
Do you have no wife coz you treat burds like a fancy hand and spend all your time sniffing wax in your shed? 

I spend naff all on her, I drink cheap swally, I hate Christmas and I give no-one anything... all because my passion is my car 

Who's right and who's wrong? 

Different strokes for different blokes I say :thumb:

Do what the hell you want, it's your money, you earned it.

I'm wasting no more of my valuable energy talking to you lot. I need a meal now to balance the calorie loss :lol: That's £3.99 you all owe me for a macdees


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

^^Rant and a half right there Dennis... magic 

Have a Mcdees on me... eh, but you pay for it the now, and I'll get the money to you... sometime... 

:lol:

:thumb:

How is the wee buggy getting on anyway?!?! (That's the car btw, not the wife )


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Car's good thanks CB :car::thumb:
Wife's... erm... vocal. :doublesho
Just aswell am a deefy. :lol:


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## Grommit (May 3, 2011)

wee_green_mini said:


> Car's good thanks CB :car::thumb:
> Wife's... erm... vocal. :doublesho
> Just aswell am a deefy. :lol:


Vocal?

This is a car detailing forum? Yes? :thumb:

Ohhh errrrr


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Expensive wax is just a total con imo. :doublesho


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

bero1306 said:


> Expensive wax is just a total con imo. :doublesho


So you have stopped buying that s**t blackfires then eh... good lad...



:lol:

:devil:


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Grommit said:


> Vocal?
> 
> This is a car detailing forum? Yes? :thumb:
> 
> Ohhh errrrr


:lol::lol:
I meant in the complaint dept.
Haven't heard the other type for some time now


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## Grommit (May 3, 2011)

wee_green_mini said:


> :lol::lol:
> I meant in the complaint dept.
> Haven't heard the other type for some time now


You need to take your hand away from her mouth :lol:


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

:lol::lol::lol:


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

OP - you sound new to this lark... what would YOU be happy spending, maximum?


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Grommit said:


> You need to take your hand away from her mouth :lol:


yeah & put something else there instead :doublesho


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## Grommit (May 3, 2011)

ITHAQVA said:


> yeah & put something else there instead :doublesho


I had thought about adding this but thought better of it. :thumb:

Cheers dude :thumb:


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> So you have stopped buying that s**t blackfires then eh... good lad...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


OH No but i do not class this as expensive. I sold my BF Wax though but at £49.00 when i bought it that was more than enough.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

Matt_Nic said:


> I wouldnt even spend £45 on a tub of HD wax tbh. I've seen it on cars and it's no better than the £16 I paid for my Megs #26
> 
> The shine comes from the preperation before you wax it mostly. £2k wax on tired unpolished paint isnt going to look as good as £10 wax on a beautifully prepared surface.


Why would you pay £45 for it, when it's available for £25!!


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Lusso said:


> Why would you pay £45 for it, when it's available for £25!!


For the same reason you would pay £25 when it is available for £8 or less


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

MidlandsCarCare said:


> a Mark Levinson amp s sound just the same as a Bush Mini System, as it's the same music.


You wont hear a sound out of an amp unless it's paired and linked with a playing device, whether it be turntable, cassette player, tuner, cd player or cd transport. You also neglected to mention speakers, speaker wire and interconnects.

I bet to differ over your comparisson though.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

wee_green_mini said:


> I wouldn't pay over £100 for a pot of wax, absolutely no way.
> 
> I do however plough loads of money into my car. A stupid amount for what it is. That's the thing though... wax, cars, stereos, anything... we all have our passions that we will splash out on, and other things we think the exact opposite and save where we can.
> 
> ...


Love it!


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

bero1306 said:


> Expensive wax is just a total con imo. :doublesho


Concur to a degree, but it depends what you call "expensive".


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

Avanti said:


> For the same reason you would pay £25 when it is available for £8 or less


Where can you buy HD wax at £8? I'm having some if you'll be kind enough to show me!!


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## chillly (Jun 25, 2009)

JakeWhite said:


> just like cars really. Why do people want a car with upgrades, more gadgets etc when essentialy they all do the same thing, get us from A-B. Some do it because they like all those extra touches, some just because they want to try it, and some just because they can. 99% percent of us here have bought a more expensive something because of one of the reasons above whether it be wax,cars,golf clubs,shoes,phones,computers etc so why is wax any different? If detailing is your passion and hobby, of course you're going to try more expensive stuff, just like a golfer spends heaps on clubs and pringle gear, its what they want to use


Thats some good points there Jake:thumb:


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## Lupostef (Nov 20, 2011)

Never used any of the several hundred pound wax's but after using zymol concours, glasur and AutoFinesse Spirit, I personally notice the difference in using them and results wise, I will continue in doing so. 
Think with the higher end wax's its more the exclusiveness of owning them, if you compare a wax at £3000 compared to a wax at £30 the more expensive of the two is hardly going to give you 300x better results and ease of use which is the price comparison :lol:. 
Go with what you can afford to use. 
If I was on mega dosh then I wouldn't hessitate to buy some real expensive boutique wax's just to try. Always trying to get my hands in testers just to say I've used them .

Can see this debate going in for a while though :lol:


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## ITHAQVA (Feb 20, 2011)

Grommit said:


> I had thought about adding this but thought better of it. :thumb:
> 
> Cheers dude :thumb:


I wont let the side down :thumb:


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

The persuit of the best finish and product often steers towards the upper echelons of price. The high priced waxes do have good quality ingredients in many cases but technology means the masses catch up at speed. What was once the best can struggle to keep sales because of competition. Someone who spends a lot on a wax will also have done a lot of prep work and get a great result that others see and comment on. That makes them feel good and feel satisfied on their purchase. 

So "what exaclty is in the crazy priced waxes"

Quite possibly good ingredients and certainly a lot of satisfaction and feel good factor. Some get it from certain products, some from others and some from what works for them.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

I think the big boys need to step in this thread, who have the high end boutique waxes, i;m sure they will clarify high end waxes in more detail, as they have used them.

To me a high end wax, is the starting point of raceglaze black label and up the scale...


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

shine247 said:


> The persuit of the best finish and product often steers towards the upper echelons of price. The high priced waxes do have good quality ingredients in many cases but technology means the masses catch up at speed. What was once the best can struggle to keep sales because of competition. Someone who spends a lot on a wax will also have done a lot of prep work and get a great result that others see and comment on. That makes them feel good and feel satisfied on their purchase.
> 
> So "what exaclty is in the crazy priced waxes"
> 
> Quite possibly good ingredients and certainly a lot of satisfaction and feel good factor. Some get it from certain products, some from others and some from what works for them.


This is what I've been trying to say. The differences become smaller and smaller as you reach further up the chain of waxes, but if you have spent 3 or 4 days machining a car and poured your heart and sole into it you are searching for perfection, it can't be attained but you will do your best to get there, so given the effort even if a wax only adds half a percent over the last it's worth it cause nothing else will do. Weather or not YOU can afford it isn't the point, but if you can't "understand" it then perhaps you are spending more time talking about it than doing it.

OP, what's in those waxes is up for debate, but what we are looking for in it is an answer that isn't there. So the search continues :thumb:


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## carlblakemore (Jun 30, 2006)

Do you reach the point of diminishing returns with waxes the higher up the scale you go the result doesnt match the relative increase in price?

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

carlblakemore said:


> Do you reach the point of diminishing returns with waxes the higher up the scale you go the result doesnt match the relative increase in price?
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk


Most defanitly. Let's be honest, some are NOT worth it. Some offer a little more of everything but in no way at the same rate as the price increase. It's the search for the perfect finish, it's not there, but if detailing is your thing you are always gonna try and get a better finish be it at the cost of time or money


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## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Its like this to a certain extent. 

Zymol or Swissvax is not just a wax. It's the feeling you get when you use it, it's the bragging rights, its the exclusivity, it's the fact its makes you FEEL SPECIAL. Its the example of super branding and marketing teamed with simple no fuss products made by an equisite team of chemists and test pilots. 

Does a timex keep better time than a rolex, and how did rolex get to the status it had - are the inners really 10x or whatever the cost better. 

Its all subjective. 

I agree with Alan you pay your money and thats it. 

I walk into Louis Vuitton and I get why people pay that much for a bag, shoes or something else, its about perceived quality and exclusivity. 

Take Ferrari for instance, they don't do cheap and bloody good for them, as given half the chance and the money I would have one. 

Now take Audi for example and then take the R8 built by the same people who mass manufacture the A1, you have just splurged money on a car who also makes a high range hatchback. If I spent that coinage on a "supercar" I wouldn't want to pull up at a set of traffic lights and see a car by the same badge next to me at a much lower price. 

ONE OF MANY reasons I buy my supercar is because I want something fast, something different, something very few people can afford and most importantly something that makes me feel special and the R8 just wouldnt do it. 

I hear quite a lot "its all clever marketing" when infact this is what people they are appealing to a market which is rampant even in this economy. They want to feel special and catered for and Zymol and Swissvax do this very well, they are marketing to the mass and upper affluent even if not directly; the detailers still have to fork out because their client wants THAT wax on their car because their neighbour doesn't have it or simply because they can. 

Anyway thats what I think :lol: and that's that :lol:


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Lusso said:


> Where can you buy HD wax at £8? I'm having some if you'll be kind enough to show me!!


I don't know where you can buy HD for £8, I have some of the waxes mentioned on this thread, as others have mentioned, there is a knee point then diminishing returns,for the OP I wouldn't know what's in a pricey wax compared to a budget offering, personally I favour a £50 wax compared to a budget one, but any wax is good for a quick fling bling, durability does not even come into it, they all last ages


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## evotuning (Oct 16, 2009)

Oh god, how many times one topic can be discussed,and conclusion are always the same...


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

evotuning said:


> Oh god, how many times one topic can be discussed,and conclusion are always the same...


You got me, how many?


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## evotuning (Oct 16, 2009)

At least twice per month I can read that Crystal Rock and Vintage are not worth money, and 476s and AG HD are good enough.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

evotuning said:


> At least twice per month I can read that Crystal Rock and Vintage are not worth money, and 476s and AG HD are good enough.


And people always bang on about "I would never spend £50 on a wax let alone £500". I think these people are insane given you can buy 2, count them 2 pots of wax with applicators in costco for not much than a tenner. The rich wasteful coly using mentalists!


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

I'll reiterate what I said in Post 9 at the beginning of this Thread:



Alan W said:


> It's the law of diminishing returns, just like hi-fi.
> 
> *There is a difference, in my opinion, and if you don't see it or 'feel' it then they are not for you.*
> 
> ...


This 'debate' will run forever and I know what I like! 

Each to their own and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. :thumb:

Amen.

Alan W


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

evotuning said:


> At least twice per month I can read that Crystal Rock and Vintage are not worth money, and 476s and AG HD are good enough.


Half of it, is because some purchase and use what 'everybody' is using 
AG HD does offer different charactieristics to say 476 IME HD last longer too, it is semi difficult to pay RRP for HD, so on price HD would win as it does not need top up sprays to keep it sharp :argie:


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## Lupostef (Nov 20, 2011)

To be fair I've only been on here a couple of months and seen this come up countless times :lol:


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## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

For me I can't afford to buy really really expensive wax , I'd prob 
Pay 50 to 60 . That said if I had the money I would splash out just 
Because I could . For me I've got into dodo juice and got a load 
For Christmas about 5 panel pots and loads of other stuff to go with it . 

I wished I'd got into these better waxes etc when I had my bikes !


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

Avanti said:


> I don't know where you can buy HD for £8


Then why say you can buy HD Wax for £8 if you don't know where from or even if indeed you can!:wall:


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## frankiman (Nov 12, 2011)

I have or tried about all expensive waxes.. it's fun.. I try them... and end up selling them 2-3 month later. Fun hobby, just to say I tried them all! Forum like this one is here for this reason..passing great deal to others.

I still want to try Black label and Spirit tho  I never tried an UK wax.


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## alxg (May 3, 2009)

Lusso said:


> but it depends what you call "expensive".


This is a key element in any buying decision, what some call cheap others call ludicrously expensive. It is always going to be a topic that stirs the soup on here; to be honest it is as boring as "which wax for......" threads.:tumbleweed:

At the end of the day folks, unless you charge per layer for applying LSP you will be exposed to this scenario.

If you are in the fortunate position that allows you to spend a sum of money on wax, and in your own head you can justify that amount then it is not a problem if that wax costs £1 or £1m as it is a personal purchase. Logic is not as powerful a motivator to spend than emotion, which is where clever marketing comes into play.

What is ridiculous is the amount of people who say it is stupid to spend so much on "X" when "Y" does it better - without actually trying that "X" first!


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## Hoppo32 (Nov 18, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> Again, as is the case with most things... the people who moan and complain the most have never owned or tried said products (whatever they may be - again this is not just about waxes!)
> 
> All down to petty jealousy?!?!?!?! hmmmmm
> 
> :thumb:


Says the man who bangs on about his couple of quid bog brush for cleaning wheels and reckons people who use EZ brushes or whatever are overpaying because a bog brush will do the same job. Just the same principal


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Lusso said:


> Then why say you can buy HD Wax for £8 if you don't know where from or even if indeed you can!:wall:


I didn't mention HD though


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

Avanti said:


> Half of it, is because some purchase and use what 'everybody' is using
> AG HD does offer different charactieristics to say 476 IME HD last longer too, it is semi difficult to pay RRP for HD, so on price HD would win as it does not need top up sprays to keep it sharp :argie:


So you spent more on HD than 476 and noticed the difference?

Surely your arguement is null n' void then?

Oh and 476 wipes the floor with anything bar nano sealants for durability. Doesn't mean it's a good wax.



Hoppo32 said:


> Says the man who bangs on about his couple of quid bog brush for cleaning wheels and reckons people who use EZ brushes or whatever are overpaying because a bog brush will do the same job. Just the same principal


And likes expensive suits and pens iirc. Asda suit is the same though as is a bic... :tumbleweed:

Or not.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

gally said:


> *So you spent more on HD than 476 and noticed the difference?
> 
> Surely your arguement is null n' void then?*
> 
> ...


Which argument is that then? I didn't pay for 476 I had it gifted to me, I didn't pay rrp or £25 for the AG HD (although I would have happily paid the rrp for it) , I found MER Hybrid wax more durable than 476, as is RG42 and the waxes I have all appear to comfortably last 3-5 months, perhaps someday in the past 476 was longer lasting than say TW original polish, but modern offerings available nowadays, sometimes makes 476 look over priced, the £8 wax I was reffering to is Simoniz which is no less difficult to use than 476, so to me there is no point paying a premium for 476 irrespective of what the masses say


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

Is HD better to use than 476?

Ie is the more expensive one better?


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

gally said:


> Is HD better to use than 476?
> 
> Ie is the more expensive one better?


IME yes, apply it to the whole vehicle and then buff it off, offers great beading, not too blingy shine and withstands many washes with high ph wash solutions without adding top up sprays :thumb:


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## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

I will settle this arguemnt.
I have some ag hd wax in the garage somewhere and a fair few dodo juice waxes
If someone will send me there bos, crystal rock or any other high end wax i will do a little test and tell you which is best.
And at the end you may get ur expensive wax back :lol:

I would love to try a high end wax one day but i am more than happy with the waxes i have. Durability is great but for me part of the fun of detailing is applying the wax itself. I hate waitin 5 or 6 months to re apply it again. 
I would never see the full potential of an expensive wax as i would get bored to quickly and fancy a change or just wanting to re wax it again. 

I unfortunately (for my bank balance) found this site when i was a student which ended up destroying my social life in the search for saving money for detailing goods. I have no regrets for doing this as its my passion. And i know once i get full time work it will only get worse. 

People will spend more money on their passion than other areas. The gf buys a rediculous amount of shoes wen they never get worn. I have brought the same amount in polishes, glazes and waxes and alot of them wont get used either. But this is my hobby and i wouldn't have it any other way.


And rant over


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

dazzyb said:


> I will settle this arguemnt.
> I have some ag hd wax in the garage somewhere and a fair few dodo juice waxes
> If someone will send me there bos, crystal rock or any other high end wax i will do a little test and tell you which is best.
> And at the end you may get ur expensive wax back :lol:
> ...


There was a mutliwax test thread on a horse van RG55 came out one of the longer lasting ones, when I get a new car I may get a £100 wax (it adds little to the price) and in fairness if I total what is spent on budget products, it totals more than had I just got a tub of BOS and a budget wax for other cars


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

For me i get a great shine from my Sealant/Waxes which i have used and have found that this comes from the prep work done prior to my LSP. Yes i do find that my BF AFPP does add to this but i would not pay £100.00+ for a wax that will only last 3 months tops. Waxes such as SV Mystery (£475.00) & SV Crystal Rock (£795.00) imo are just ridiculous and are only for the rich show offs. 

Ive just bought some Collinite 915 for £23.50 delivered so lets see how that goes eh on my wifes car.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> For me i get a great shine from my Sealant/Waxes which i have used and have found that this comes from the prep work done prior to my LSP. Yes i do find that my BF AFPP does add to this but i would not pay £100.00+ for a wax that will only last 3 months tops. Waxes such as SV Mystery (£475.00) & SV Crystal Rock (£795.00) imo are just ridiculous and are only for the rich show offs.
> 
> *Ive just bought some Collinite 915 for £23.50 delivered so lets see how that goes eh on my wifes car*.


Yes I understand what you write, SV Mystery and CR would rarely be purchased for personal useage, however at the same time you could see how 915 compares to say Simoniz original as it won't be 3 times the performance and the simoniz does not suffer with the water spotting, so the same debate occurs further down the price tag range


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## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

Avanti said:


> There was a mutliwax test thread on a horse van RG55 came out one of the longer lasting ones, when I get a new car I may get a £100 wax (it adds little to the price) and in fairness if I total what is spent on budget products, it totals more than had I just got a tub of BOS and a budget wax for other cars


To be honest i just wanted to try some expensive waxes. Just to say tht i have


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Avanti, the simoniz original is hard stuff to remove but i know you get on with it, its cheap to buy, but the only downfull on that wax is the removal of simoniz, they should of made a new advanced formula that is easy to take off, if that was the case and durability the same, this wax will be a very strong performer on the market, specially for durability.
I have not been to Halfords for a long time, but i went through the car cleaning isle, i noticed every-time the simoniz original was was out of stock on the shelf, i assume people buy it fast.


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

bero1306 said:


> For me i get a great shine from my Sealant/Waxes which i have used and have found that this comes from the prep work done prior to my LSP. Yes i do find that my BF AFPP does add to this but i would not pay £100.00+ for a wax that will only last 3 months tops. Waxes such as SV Mystery (£475.00) & SV Crystal Rock (£795.00) imo are just ridiculous and are only for the rich show offs.
> 
> Ive just bought some Collinite 915 for £23.50 delivered so lets see how that goes eh on my wifes car.


As stated, leave the 915 on the car overnight and then come back to buff it off and then tell me there is no difference between expensive waxes and cheap waxes.

Of course there is. Sadly people have the word "looks" ingrained in their brain.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

dazzyb said:


> To be honest i just wanted to try some expensive waxes. Just to say tht i have


What are differences between the high end waxes and the normal ones you have used, from a to z, how do the expensive waxes behave, smell like, feel like, user application, does it offer a better shine, the construction of the wax tub etc... just go through it with me please.


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Money on products is not a problem for me so i don't mind spending but there is a point when i feel that i am getting conned and wax for some reason seems to be it. Most sealants that i use or have used seem to be reasonably priced but wax can go through the roof with no guarantee its worth it bar a name on the pot. 

Before i got into this site i used AG only with no problems but now its a can of worms. I have learnt loads but sometimes i feel ive learnt too much. :wall:


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

gally said:


> As stated, leave the 915 on the car overnight and then come back to buff it off and then tell me there is no difference between expensive waxes and cheap waxes.
> 
> Of course there is. Sadly people have the word "looks" ingrained in their brain.


Don't do that, it will be a nightmare to buff off, on panel at a time, then buff off, make sure you don't leave it all night on the paintwork.


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

gally said:


> As stated, leave the 915 on the car overnight and then come back to buff it off and then tell me there is no difference between expensive waxes and cheap waxes.
> 
> Of course there is. Sadly people have the word "looks" ingrained in their brain.


Why would i want to leave it on overnight when the instructions tell you not too. This proves nothing, imo its about looks & protection not leaving it on overnight for a silly test. :thumb:


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Money on products is not a problem for me so i don't mind spending but there is a point when i feel that i am getting conned and wax for some reason seems to be it. Most sealants that i use or have used seem to be reasonably priced but wax can go through the roof with no guarantee its worth it bar a name on the pot.
> 
> Before i got into this site i used AG only with no problems but now its a can of worms. I have learnt loads but sometimes i feel ive learnt too much. :wall:


It is a can of worms, I remember when I got this car, I was going to spend £100 on a R222 kit, wish I had to be honest, over the years I would be saving, the R222 wax I have is great, I have reently gotten some of the R222 pre wax cleanser, the mfrs of the high end waxes I don't see market it at the individual user, and as you know anything that goes on the panels will look at least all right, artemis wax seal will suit the 'posse' for bling shine and durability and price. As it happens I have a crate out in the garden that will have to live there through the winter, I could have applied 476 to it, but this time durability was a concern so on went some simoniz original , we not too long ago had a rain shower

side of the crate










and the top


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Would love to know the real real difference between Simoniz paste wax at £7.50 and SV Crystal Rock at £795.00 apart from you get 50g more in the SV.


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## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

Trip tdi said:


> What are differences between the high end waxes and the normal ones you have used, from a to z, how do the expensive waxes behave, smell like, feel like, user application, does it offer a better shine, the construction of the wax tub etc... just go through it with me please.


No idea really. The most expensive wax I have ever used is dodo juice supernatural and even then its only in a panel pot. I found it fairly easy to use compared to some people who say it can be difficult. Lasted well over 6 months. Only reason i left it on and didnt re apply is cause i liked to think to myself that i had an expensive (for me) wax on my car.

My favourite waxes to use are dj blue velvet and dj supernatural hybrid. Wouldn't call either of them bank breaking amounts as they cost around the same as a 360/ps3 game. I am happy with these and I cant honestly see myself splashing out on an expensive wax unless I had a big money win.


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## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

Oh and simonz wax was £12 for 2 tins in costco at the mo. Well it was last friday wen i was in there in milton keynes


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

dazzyb said:


> No idea really. The most expensive wax I have ever used is dodo juice supernatural and even then its only in a panel pot. I found it fairly easy to use compared to some people who say it can be difficult. Lasted well over 6 months. Only reason i left it on and didnt re apply is cause i liked to think to myself that i had an expensive (for me) wax on my car.
> 
> My favourite waxes to use are dj blue velvet and dj supernatural hybrid. Wouldn't call either of them bank breaking amounts as they cost around the same as a 360/ps3 game. I am happy with these and *I cant honestly see myself splashing out on an expensive wax unless I had a big money win.*


A big money win would not tilt me to a >£200 tub, but then I would not have a car above an R8 (which would be a 2nd car) if I had a big money win


----------



## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Would love to know the real real difference between Simoniz paste wax at £7.50 and SV Crystal Rock at £795.00 apart from you get 50g more in the SV.


Here's why some people buy Crystal Rock (Click the 3 other Tabs for further information )

Alan W


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

Trip tdi said:


> Don't do that, it will be a nightmare to buff off, on panel at a time, then buff off, make sure you don't leave it all night on the paintwork.


Ii think you missed the sacarsm slightly.



bero1306 said:


> Why would i want to leave it on overnight when the instructions tell you not too. This proves nothing, imo its about looks & protection not leaving it on overnight for a silly test. :thumb:


Well it provides room for user error. My point is it's easier to use. There is no comparison there.



bero1306 said:


> Would love to know the real real difference between Simoniz paste wax at £7.50 and SV Crystal Rock at £795.00 apart from you get 50g more in the SV.


What about sheeting, beading, ease of use, smell? And the retention of shine and looks.

There is a massive massive difference. I know because i've used expensive waxes and it's not placebo because I havemn't paid for most of them.

I love some cheaper waxes. Vics Red for eg. It's simply not a patch on something like Glasur. This is just fact.

No other carnauba wax I know of sheets water like Glasur so i'm sorry to say you're wrong. There is a difference however small that difference might be.


----------



## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

Avanti said:


> A big money win would not tilt me to a >£200 tub, but then I would not have a car above an R8 (which would be a 2nd car) if I had a big money win


Oh yeh i would only get a wooden pot of supernatural. 
Then again I would only buy an impreza wr1 as my expensive car anyway. Maybe buy my dads e39 m5 off him for some v8 fun


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

dazzyb said:


> Oh yeh i would only get a wooden pot of supernatural.
> Then again I would only buy an impreza wr1 as my expensive car anyway. Maybe buy my dads e39 m5 off him for some v8 fun


Some RG black label for me, although I am well pleased with my smartwax concourse


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Alan W said:


> Here's why some people buy Crystal Rock (Click the 3 other Tabs for further information )
> 
> Alan W


Lost me there mate. Because PB have it on there site and have filled most of the dots in i now need to spend £795.00 on it. :lol:


----------



## dazzyb (Feb 9, 2010)

Avanti said:


> Some RG black label for me, although I am well pleased with my smartwax concourse


Will look into it. Could be another addition to the waxes i dont use


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Lost me there mate. Because PB have it on there site and have filled most of the dots in i now need to spend £795.00 on it. :lol:


You could save £745 and have almost the same wording ", R222 100% Carnauba Wax contains no abrasives, additives, dyes or perfumes, and delivers a jaw dropping finish characterised by incredible richness and *a level of liquidity that looks like you could almost swim in it*."

You may have to apply it more frequently, but then why buy a product and only use it once?


----------



## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Lost me there mate. Because PB have it on there site and have filled most of the dots in i now need to spend £795.00 on it. :lol:


I thought you held PB in high regard and would have respected their opinion on a typical high end wax. 

Alan W


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Alan W said:


> I thought you held PB in high regard and would have respected their opinion on a typical high end wax.
> 
> Alan W


I do but no wax it worth that.


----------



## frankiman (Nov 12, 2011)

Avanti said:


> You could save £745 and have almost the same wording ", R222 100% Carnauba Wax contains no abrasives, additives, dyes or perfumes, and delivers a jaw dropping finish characterised by incredible richness and *a level of liquidity that looks like you could almost swim in it*."
> 
> You may have to apply it more frequently, but then why buy a product and only use it once?


..because your customer don't want to come every 2 week-ends just for a wax job.. and you don't want to do wax-job because it's not worth it compared to a correction job ?

..Because your customer will like to have an expensive wax that will set you a part from the other detailer around?

..Because they are willing to pay more for that wax so at the end.. your pot cost nothing and you get to apply this premium wax for ''free-to-try'' and there's even some left for your own car 

Why there so many hater? because you can't afford it ? Guys, go start your own thread about Collonite 476 and leave the poeple who can afford it alone. 14 pages.. almost no relevelant information.

You can see the difference of a wax when the sun goes up and when the sun goes down and even at night.. the glow will be different. at full sun tho, I agree, no difference to me. If you can't see the difference, go buy glasse, detail even more so you learn to see the difference or.. go back to school so you can get a better job and be able to buy these jars maybe ?


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## frankiman (Nov 12, 2011)

oh and BTW... Collonite 476.. FK1000 etc.. these waxes arent really wax.. they are a lot closer to SEALANT than wax!


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

frankiman said:


> ..because your customer don't want to come every 2 week-ends just for a wax job.. and you don't want to do wax-job because it's not worth it compared to a correction job ?
> 
> ..Because your customer will like to have an expensive wax that will set you a part from the other detailer around?
> 
> ...


I think you are barking at the wrong poster, I'm all in favour of products at various price points, if you check back I have mentioned that the personal user is not likely to splash out on a £500 tub of wax, but I agree, if I took my car to a detailer, then I would be dissapointed if the final icing on the cake is some budget product after they spent hours on the panels, as the cost per application is minimal , like you mention in your later poster FK100o and 476 is more akin a sealant and therefore offer little if any advantage over AG EGP, so some that are shouting 'mugs' maybe themselves be 'mugs'


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

If someone could prove to me that a tub of wax was what i needed due to shine and durability and was worth the price tag i would buy one today but saying nobody seems to be able to do this I'm sticking with my BF AFPP.

THE END. :wave:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> If someone could prove to me that a tub of wax was what i needed due to shine and durability and was worth the price tag i would buy one today but saying nobody seems to be able to do this I'm sticking with my BF AFPP.
> 
> THE END. :wave:


They couldn't , but after spending a few grand on a car, then another £50 is neither here or there, the still water look beats a bling shine IMO, but then we are not paying for each others LSP.


----------



## umi000 (Jan 14, 2011)

I like the look of BFWD, but having said that, it doesn't bead or sheet as well as SNH or Finis Wax, nor did it last as long.


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

umi000 said:


> I like the look of BFWD, but having said that, it doesn't bead or sheet as well as SNH or Finis Wax, nor did it last as long.


I still cannot calculate what BFWD is


----------



## umi000 (Jan 14, 2011)

Avanti said:


> I still cannot calculate what BFWD is


Sorry - *B*lack*f*ire *W*et *D*iamond All Finish Paint Protection. BFWD is the commonly-used acronym on US forums


----------



## frankiman (Nov 12, 2011)

bero1306 said:


> If someone could prove to me that a tub of wax was what i needed due to shine and durability and was worth the price tag i would buy one today but saying nobody seems to be able to do this I'm sticking with my BF AFPP.
> 
> THE END. :wave:


Why would we ? make your own judgement, don't related on other.

And I don't really care if you think my Vintage perform the same as your Blackfire.


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

bero1306 said:


> If someone could prove to me that a tub of wax was what i needed due to shine and durability and was worth the price tag i would buy one today but saying nobody seems to be able to do this I'm sticking with my BF AFPP.
> 
> THE END. :wave:


Bos on Black is in my opinion the best finish i've seen on any Black car. Not all but in most cases.

The oils will wash away eventually and it'll need topped up but that initial show finish BOS pwns imo.


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

The Cueball said:


> Again, as is the case with most things... the people who moan and complain the most have never owned or tried said products (whatever they may be - again this is not just about waxes!)
> 
> All down to petty jealousy?!?!?!?! hmmmmm
> 
> :thumb:





Hoppo32 said:


> Says the man who bangs on about his couple of quid bog brush for cleaning wheels and reckons people who use EZ brushes or whatever are overpaying because a bog brush will do the same job. Just the same principal


No, it's not the same.. I can afford, have bought and thrown away the expensive brushes, so I KNOW 100% fact they are not worth it...



:wall:


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> No, it's not the same.. I can afford, have bought and thrown away the expensive brushes, so I KNOW 100% fact they are not worth it...
> 
> 
> 
> :wall:


But suits and pens are? Right?


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

gally said:


> But suits and pens are? Right?


Bespoke suits are worth every single penny - yes they are.

Nice pens to write with.. in my mind, yes they are, that is why I buy them.

What is the point you are trying to make!??! 

I am not moaning about the price of waxes... I am moaning about the people who have never used them, nor can afford them, saying they are not worth it...

:thumb:


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## impster (May 2, 2007)

This is a great thread. Loving the opinions on here, and as I expected, no clear answer.

Whilst I was at school, I envied my mates who had 'Nike Air' trainers. My trainers were from woolworths, and their 'style name' (printed proudly on the back and side of them) was 'DALLAS' - in a nice 'italic' dark blue print, easily visible to all, and subject to a lot of p!ss taking.

However, for about 4 years I held the record for a form 5 pupil in the school sports for a long jump with a distance of 5m 12cms - whilst wearing my Woolworths 'Dallas' trainers.

Poor anectdote, I know, and has nothing whatsoever to do with wax really.

(But I do know have a pair of Nike Air trainers, and they're really comfy).

I'm happy with Harly Wax by the way, though I do have a pot of Zymol Carbon, which I bought to try out, and to say that I use 'Zymol' on my car. There is a diference in the way they go on, and the way they come off, but what it is, I don't know.

Once my Carbon runs out, I'll probably just stick to Harly Wax as it does the job nicely for me.

But if someone were to offer me a quick coat of the expensive stuff on my car, or even on the bonnet to try out, I'd jump at the chance.

So, there we are, another comment, still with no clear answer...

Impster


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> Bespoke suits are worth every single penny - yes they are.
> 
> Nice pens to write with.. in my mind, yes they are, that is why I buy them.
> 
> ...


You were stating the brush example as fact Cuey. It's not.

I felt the difference between those yellow bristled ones and an EZ brush within minutes of use.

I like nice pens, suits, clothes, cars, waxes etc and I think they are worth the money.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

gally said:


> *You were stating the brush example as fact Cuey. It's not. *
> 
> I felt the difference between those yellow bristled ones and an EZ brush within minutes of use.
> 
> I like nice pens, suits, clothes, cars, waxes etc and I think they are worth the money.


It is to me!!!!!

I only ever state my opinion on things, if I believe it, then it's a FACT to ME...

Why would I think something, but them advise something else... what kind of a moron does that?!?!

so to clarify - just for you and your the other person, who I presume thinks I can either not afford a brush, or I am jealous of expensive brushes, because I use a "bog one":

After spending lots of time on money on different brushes etc (including, but not limited to Wheel woollies and EZ brush) I find that they are a waste of money IMO FACT....

Does that make it better for you?!?!?

If you felt a difference, great, I am overjoyed for you... but I don't and will continue to state that as my FACT and my opinion

I like expensive things as well, but I have to see and feel the value to ME.

I feel a lot of people on here are having a go at expensive things without being able to afford them, nor have they ever even used them... that was my point in the first place...I can't see how it got dragged out about brushes and suits to be honest... I still don't get your point of it all?!?!?

:thumb:


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## Grommit (May 3, 2011)

I think a few folk need to lay off the Red Bull.......

this is a discussion that wont have a good / bad or a right / wrong answer.

Comes down to choice and affordability.


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## MarkSmith (Dec 17, 2010)

I think at the end of the day, any wax is worth what people are willing to pay for it. 

If a pot of wax sells for £10 then its worth £10 = at the same time, if someone, anyone, is willing to pay £2000 for a wax then that wax is worth £2000 as thats how much someone is willing to pay for it.

I recently sold a rusty crappy old Ford Capri - the car was useless, it was a non runner and rusty as hell. My Cougar drives better and looks better. Yet I sold the Capri for double what I paid for the Cougar because even though it was not a better car than my Cougar, it was worth double the price of the Cougar because thats how much someone was willing to pay for it.

Same as Wax, if AG HD is £25 and people are happy to pay that for it, then thats what it is worth. If Ag put the price up to £2000 nobody is likely to buy it, so its not worth £2000. However, if people did still buy it at that price then it would be worth that price.

Everything is worth what people are willing to pay for it, no matter if its a better product or not.


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Good shout Mark. Spot-on.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

MarkSmith said:


> I think at the end of the day, any wax is worth what people are willing to pay for it.
> 
> If a pot of wax sells for £10 then its worth £10 = at the same time, if someone, anyone, is willing to pay £2000 for a wax then that wax is worth £2000 as thats how much someone is willing to pay for it.
> 
> ...


Part of the debate though is what is better?
EG what if a £150 wax was available in a smaller quantity say 30ml for £30, how many would still buy the bigger tub of 'longer lasting' vs the smaller tub?


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## MarkSmith (Dec 17, 2010)

Avanti said:


> Part of the debate though is what is better?
> *EG what if a £150 wax was available in a smaller quantity say 30ml for £30, how many would still buy the bigger tub of 'longer lasting' vs the smaller tub?*


In my opinion, if the bigger tubs sells at £150 and the smaller tub does not sell at £30, then the bigger tub is worth it as thats what peple are willing to pay for it and nobody is buying the smaller tub at £30 so its not worth £30

Crystal Rock is worth every penny of £795 because people are willing to pay that for it, the reasons they are willing to pay that much are irrelevent IMO


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## gally (May 25, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> It is to me!!!!!
> 
> I only ever state my opinion on things, if I believe it, then it's a FACT to ME...
> 
> ...


My fact? Again you're confusing your opinion with relative fact.

You can't say bog brushes are just as good as EZ brushes as fact. Fact can't be drawn from one opinion Cuey.

I expected an educated man like yourself to be more diplomatic.

The statement "My fact" just sounds delusional. It's not a "fact" it's your opinion. It's then maybe up to others to either prove you wrong or agree with you.

Fact is beyond all reasonable doubt imo.


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)




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## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

Can't be bothered to read half of this.

Why do we like expensive waxes? Same as we buy a bigger tv than next door. It's keeping up with the jones' and not a lot else

I appreciate a boutique wax and agree they offer somethings other products don't. But value for money isn't one of them and I accept that. It's my hobby. My money. I'll spend it how I want to


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

MarkSmith said:


> In my opinion, if the bigger tubs sells at £150 and the smaller tub does not sell at £30, then the bigger tub is worth it as thats what peple are willing to pay for it and nobody is buying the smaller tub at £30 so its not worth £30
> 
> Crystal Rock is worth every penny of £795 because people are willing to pay that for it, the reasons they are willing to pay that much are irrelevent IMO


Perhaps you missed the point of my post, ok what if say Swissvax suddenly said all their waxes are going to be the same price as say 476, how many (of the doubters) are still going to purchase the 476? 
the CR I would suspect is not targeted at the high street Sunday summer shopper, CR can be easily up sold as part of a detail package, when one looks at detailer sites how many that are aiming at the high end customer offer a budget product, ok some could say they are applying product (a) yet use product (b) , I do beleive some would notice


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## msb (Dec 20, 2009)

maggi133 said:


> Can't be bothered to read half of this.
> 
> Why do we like expensive waxes? Same as we buy a bigger tv than next door. It's keeping up with the jones' and not a lot else
> 
> I appreciate a boutique wax and agree they offer somethings other products don't. But value for money isn't one of them and I accept that. It's my hobby. My money. I'll spend it how I want to


Tbh i tend to agree with this, for me its about enjoyment in my hobby, so therefore i spend whats in budget, this arguement will go on for ever but is ultimately the same points being repeated over and over:wall:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

msb said:


> Tbh i tend to agree with this, for me its about enjoyment in my hobby, so therefore i spend whats in budget, this arguement will g*but is ultimately the same points being repeated over and overo on for ever* :wall:


There are several points going on, (although I agree , the topic will re-surface in another thread) however when the 'mockers' are earning the money for the others, then they have a right to dictate how and where they spend it :devil:


----------



## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

This is quite a thread and a half, interesting, keep it flowing, nice to here other peoples opinions, but for the people who have tried the high end waxes, they need to come in and join in, maybe post there details on here, by a link.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Trip tdi said:


> This is quite a thread and a half, interesting, keep it flowing, nice to here other peoples opinions, but for the people who have tried the high end waxes, they need to come in and join in, maybe post there details on here, by a link.


What are you calling high end?


----------



## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

it is indeed a big thread, shame the same kind of thread comes up time after time about expensive waxes. if you want to buy one, buy one if you want something cheaper, buy something cheaper


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Avanti said:


> What are you calling high end?


High end to me, starting bracket Raceglaze black label and up the scale from there, such as crystal rock, vintage etc..


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Trip tdi said:


> High end to me, starting bracket Raceglaze black label and up the scale from there, such as crystal rock, vintage etc..


Black label in use


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Thanks Avanti for the link, to be honest with you mate i don't have that kind of cash flying about for one those, or i ever will in my life.

I'm sure over 50% of the DW members on here, if they went in there garage, and looked at there collection, that will easily be worth more than crystal rock alone, us human beings have urges and being on here being OCD plays havoc on people on buying and buying and achieving the best result on there cars.
When a new product lands on here, they do tend to get very hiked up alot on here, so alot of products sell, this is marketing done by the public us, example primo amigo, alot of traders have sold alot these plus vics concours as well.

I have seen these threads on here quite alot, just need one op to start it, and the thread goes on forever and ever.


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## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

Is this still going on? At the end of the day, if you don't want it or can't have it just don't buy it and if you want to and can then do it. Can we all stop arguing the toss about wax as were never going to come to a conclusion. Those who see it a waste of money will always see it at that, those who love it will continue to use it regardless. There's no two ways about it. At the end of the day its just wax! Its not a cure for disease, or a life saving bit of kit its just something that goes on the car whether it be expensive or not so let's just drop it finally shal we?


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## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

My wax is better than your wax Jake! 

na-na na-na-na 

:lol::lol:

:thumb:


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Just stick with sealants. Sorted.


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## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

My wax now makes me dinner beat that!


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## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

rsblue said:


> My wax now makes me dinner beat that!


No you're confusing a few sentances.

Your mrs got waxed

Your mrs makes you dinner


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Trip tdi said:


> Thanks Avanti for the link, to be honest with you mate i don't have that kind of cash flying about for one those,* or i ever will in my life.*
> 
> I'm sure over 50% of the DW members on here, if they went in there garage, and looked at there collection, that will easily be worth more than crystal rock alone, us human beings have urges and being on here being OCD plays havoc on people on buying and buying and achieving the best result on there cars.
> When a new product lands on here, they do tend to get very hiked up alot on here, so alot of products sell, this is marketing done by the public us, example primo amigo, alot of traders have sold alot these plus vics concours as well.
> ...


Every journey starts with but one step, IIRC you are a young man, I remember when I was younger, the 'in' car was like a Capri 2.0S, all we could do is dream about owning one, at the time I would not even dream about having a car a few years old, the last 5 out of 6 cars I have purchased have been paid for without any kind of loan/finance, I'm not in a finance bankers job, but then when I was younger I did not get my wages on Friday afternoon and be discharging it down the pub urinals that same evening (not to say you are either) but if you set your mind on something, then it can be achieved, I'm sure if the owner of the vehicle in the thread had said he was thinking of a new car, perhaps an insignia would have been suggested as an option, of which it is, thing is then what would the owner do with the cash he saved or reduced monthly payments? 
It is no secret that I use some budget end products to good effect and likewise on my own car, a £50 tub suits my needs, I don't need to imagine the difference. Sometimes some purchase on what the concensous do, and their comfort lays within lots have it and saying this or that , look at some wash product threads, you get posters then 'screaming' does it strip wax? Well at a good 30 applications per tub, a tin will last a year at least, sometimes one has to function of fact not what the doubters are crying about


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Just stick with sealants. Sorted.


Is one sealant better than another though?


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Avanti said:


> Is one sealant better than another though?


You know it is. :argie:


----------



## MarkSmith (Dec 17, 2010)

Avanti said:


> Is one sealant better than another though?


:lol:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> You know it is. :argie:


TBH know I don't , I have some Triplewax seal n shine, AG EGP, TW Extra Gloss, I couldn't help but feel purchasing any other brand would be little more than a waste of money with know gain to my current 'stash'.


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## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

The 2 best sealants that i have used are Blackfire AFPP & Menzerna PL. Both of these offer superb looks and superb protection but neither are silly priced. BF AFPP=£32.00, SV Crystal Rock=£795.00. MMMMMMMMM


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Sorry for stealing the image. I'm a bit of a waxaholic and this image is the epitome of fine car care/luxury car care.

It shows a silvery effect which I havent been able to replicate with the entry level waxes. P21s does but for an extremely short period of time.

The car is imho noticeabley darker, has good projection of reflected colour, allowing the flake through, noticeable gloss enhancement.

Also IMHO this won't be when the wax looks its best I always found with the higher carnauaba content waxes (forgetting all the % per volume) it takes a few days to really reach its maximum hieghts.

Now whether this is the carnauaba reaching the top I don't know, I normally find it better to evaluate a carnauaba wax with natural oils at least 24 hours after application as I find there is a difference in the finished article what you might call the true finish.

As I touched on with Marc at Heavenly Detail I think some may not be able to actually visually see a difference the same way that one may pick up a pair of navy blue socks and mistake them for black.


















Thats the porsche with Zymol Glasur









Again with Zymol Glasur









Cant remember if this was supernatural or something else ?









This was the same time

The photos were taken with an old Canon D60 with Pro Glass (dad was an ex photographer - I took the photos though! ha)

So they haven't been played with just the shutter timing so that I can get the natural light coming through as many know catching the ACTUAL look of a wax is so so so difficult.

John.


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> The 2 best sealants that i have used are Blackfire AFPP & Menzerna PL. Both of these offer superb looks and superb protection but neither are silly priced.


But are they any better than the triplewax which I got on special from halfords for £3 ?


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Don't know or care. My point is these are high end sealants but are not priced at hundreds of pounds like some waxes.


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Heres a massive question for the table. Why do we utilise carnauaba wax seeing as there are so many other waxes available ?


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Don't know or care. My point is these are high end sealants but are not priced at hundreds of pounds like some waxes.


But sealants don't look like wax at the end of the day either


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

JJ_ said:


> Heres a massive question for the table. Why do we utilise carnauaba wax seeing as there are so many other waxes available ?


Products have all sorts of waxes in them whether it be beeswax, candilla, carnauba or montan wax.


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

Avanti said:


> But sealants don't look like wax at the end of the day either


Totally agree, i think they look better on my car.


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

gally said:


> My fact? Again you're confusing your opinion with relative fact.
> 
> You can't say bog brushes are just as good as EZ brushes as fact. Fact can't be drawn from one opinion Cuey.
> 
> ...


Seriously?!?!?

Not even going bother...

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

:wall::wall::wall::wall::wall::wall:


----------



## Maggi200 (Aug 21, 2009)

Okay this thread seems to continue to move quickly! 

Can I just make a point that this only seems to happen on here! I have never been to tesco and watched someone pick up tesco value "cornflakes" and heckle someone picking up a branded pack of cornflakes. Nor have I seen anyone ever go into a dealership and tell someone they wasted their money on the top of the range, in fact I've only heard "nice car mate" or words to that effect

I think everyone needs to breath and accept that different products exist because people buy them. And the reason anyone buys anything luxury (and lets face it, ALL car wax is classed as a luxury item) is because they WANT it. Not because they NEED it.


----------



## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

maggi133 said:


> No you're confusing a few sentances.
> 
> Your mrs got waxed
> 
> Your mrs makes you dinner


Ahhhh knew it was something along them lines!:lol:


----------



## rsblue (May 8, 2011)

There only one way to solve this.............. FIGHT!!


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

bero1306 said:


> Totally agree, i think they look better on my car.


And as it is your car and your hard earned monies, then naturally you are onto a winner there, personally I don't like the clinical sterile shine that sealants offer and I'm still waiting for that special lady to get their nails as red and wet look shiny like my waxed car


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

JJ_ said:


> Heres a massive question for the table. Why do we utilise carnauaba wax seeing as there are so many other waxes available ?


Carnauba Wax is used as a vehicle wax as it is one of the hardest naturally occurring waxes.


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Avanti said:


> Products have all sorts of waxes in them whether it be beeswax, candilla, carnauba or montan wax.


Well I should have mentioned these other waxes just took it as a given we included the common waxes.

I suppose what I am getting at for the "100% carnuaba" high end waxes is there anything else which is better than carnauaba not including a blend of waxes like you have mentioned.

:devil:


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

The Cueball said:


> Seriously?!?!?
> 
> Not even going bother...
> 
> ...


Oh, okay.


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

bero1306 said:


> Carnauba Wax is used as a vehicle wax as it is one of the hardest naturally occurring waxes.


I would assume maybe I am wrong that there must be another naturally occuring wax which is just as hard or even harder?

After a quick google - thats how we get all our knowledge these days isn't it ? :tumbleweed:

I found that carnauaba is the hardest naturally occuring COMMERCIALLY available wax - so now I am off to hunt down the hardest naturally occuring wax.

John.


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

JJ_ said:


> Well I should have mentioned these other waxes just took it as a given we included the common waxes.
> 
> I suppose what I am getting at for the "100% carnuaba" high end waxes is there anything else which is better than carnauaba not including a blend of waxes like you have mentioned.
> 
> :devil:


I suppose it is to do with melting points and other properties once processed.
and the processing itself, there are members on here that create theri own home brew, so perhaps they can share their conclusions on any experiments that have been conducted.


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Funny you should mention that JJ... my pioneering blend of candle wax, mini babybel wax and ear wax is about to hit the shelves of a poundland near you!... introducing... BarCan 3000, THE finest blend for your car!... Stinks of cheese and tastes boggin so repels like no other!


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Hey, and no willy jokes! 

It ain't no helmetdale :lol:


----------



## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

wee_green_mini said:


> My wax is better than your wax Jake!
> 
> na-na na-na-na
> 
> ...


:lol: I don't think I can beat your magical blend of ear wax and babybel! Why I am spending my money on zymol when I could have yours? Guys we have finally concluded that wee_green_mini's wax is THE best, it's cheap and will repel water and just about any other earthly substance! So case closed, finished, wrapped up, the end and GOOD NIGHT! :lol:


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)




----------



## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

stangalang said:


> The main difference with my chosen expensive waxes is how long they not just last, but last well, staying fresh looking and slick like day one. That's the big difference IMO. As to what's in them, i hope something rare like unicorn tears, in reality, just a lot of R and D.


+1 This is the main difference . but I don't know why the red and pink waxes such as Vics , RG55 , Fuison , BoS always gives wetter glossier finish than others :lol:!


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

OK... if anyone is interested, and weather permitting what I am (hopefully) going to do this weekend, as I need to wash the XKR is wash clay and cleanse one panel of the car... maybe the boot lid... in fact I may wetsand it first and polish it, just to be nice...

then I am going to give 1 section 2 coats of FK1000P (the cheapest wax I have) and another in 2 coats of Zymol Vintage (yes I do have it  ) 

I will then post the pic and my thoughts, for all to see and get worked up about...

I'm pretty sure no one will be able to tell which is which, but, we'll see...

I will be very interested to see and feel what all the Zymol fuss is about.. 

thoughts?!?!? worthwhile?!?!? pi$$ off Cueball?!?

:thumb:


----------



## JakeWhite (Oct 14, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> OK... if anyone is interested, and weather permitting what I am (hopefully) going to do this weekend, as I need to wash the XKR is wash clay and cleanse one panel of the car... maybe the boot lid... in fact I may wetsand it first and polish it, just to be nice...
> 
> then I am going to give 1 section 2 coats of FK1000P (the cheapest wax I have) and another in 2 coats of Zymol Vintage (yes I do have it  )
> 
> ...


oh no I'll get the popcorn cuey! Although it's hard to show the difference via camera I often find :thumb:


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

Good idea - Looking forward to this! :thumb:

Just waiting for all the 'that side get's more weather'... 'that bit is in the sun'... 'that applicator you used was different to the other' boolsheet.

Bring it on big-boy :doublesho:lol:


----------



## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

The Cueball said:


> OK... if anyone is interested, and weather permitting what I am (hopefully) going to do this weekend, as I need to wash the XKR is wash clay and cleanse one panel of the car... maybe the boot lid... in fact I may wetsand it first and polish it, just to be nice...
> 
> then I am going to give 1 section 2 coats of FK1000P (the cheapest wax I have) and another in 2 coats of Zymol Vintage (yes I do have it  )
> 
> ...


Don't give away which is which in the photos though, see if people can see the difference that the expensive wax brigade harp on about.


----------



## gm8 (Apr 25, 2011)

just do the full car in fk , there will be some 'that's definitely the zymol' on that panel replies. Could be fun to be had lol


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

:argie:


JakeWhite said:


> oh no I'll get the popcorn cuey! Although it's hard to show the difference via camera I often find :thumb:


I knew that would be one of the first remarks! :lol:

and the XKR is silver :devil:



wee_green_mini said:


> Good idea - Looking forward to this! :thumb:
> 
> Just waiting for all the 'that side get's more weather'... 'that bit is in the sun'... 'that applicator you used was different to the other' boolsheet.
> 
> Bring it on big-boy :doublesho:lol:


Yip 



bigmc said:


> Don't give away which is which in the photos though, see if people can see the difference that the expensive wax brigade harp on about.


but of course.... 

:thumb:


----------



## alan_mcc (Oct 28, 2008)

look forward to the test cuey. I wetsanded the boot of my old car and the shine was miles deep - well worth it!! nice easy flat panel too.

:thumb:


----------



## S63 (Jan 5, 2007)

Whether its a wax or any other product, the high end ranges contain a lot of placebo, dammed expensive that placebo but does wonderful things to certain consumers.


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

The Cueball said:


> OK... if anyone is interested, and weather permitting what I am (hopefully) going to do this weekend, as I need to wash the XKR is wash clay and cleanse one panel of the car... maybe the boot lid... in fact I may wetsand it first and polish it, just to be nice...
> 
> then I am going to give 1 section 2 coats of FK1000P (the cheapest wax I have) and another in 2 coats of Zymol Vintage (yes I do have it  )
> 
> ...


Worthwhile, I say Zymol Vintage wipes the floor with FK1000p as it has done with so many I have trialed. :devil::devil::devil::devil::devil:


----------



## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

You'll not see any difference in photos Cuey (See my Thread HERE as an example) but you will notice subtle differences when viewing the actual paint such as depth, clarity, reflectiveness, gloss and sometimes even the colour.  View the panel from different angles and in different lights. 

Water behaviour will be different and the 'just waxed' look should be maintained a lot longer by the higher end wax. :thumb:

I'd recommend 2 layers of each wax, applied 24 hours apart if possible.

Look forward to your results and observations! :thumb:

Alan W


----------



## cleaningfreak (Sep 3, 2011)

my splash dash go and try something will b crystal rock ... and i dont understand who says that spend 100+ for pot of wax is mad ect. ect. ect. if u get around 50 layers from 800 so you have around 2 pounds a month for your car protection(based on 8 month protection from single layer) so... really ... its expensive ??
Zymol Solaris ... this is a bit more expensive but still ... not so expensive  .. so in my opinion ... no expensive waxes


----------



## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

cleaningfreak said:


> my splash dash go and try something will b crystal rock ... and i dont understand who says that spend 100+ for pot of wax is mad ect. ect. ect. if u get around 50 layers from 800 so you have around 2 pounds a month for your car protection(based on 8 month protection from single layer) so... really ... its expensive ??
> Zymol Solaris ... this is a bit more expensive but still ... not so expensive  .. so in my opinion ... no expensive waxes


8 months from one layer? Not a chance! It does look expensive when you'll still get the same durability from £20 bottle of 845 which is then pence/month.


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

Alan W said:


> You'll not see any difference in photos Cuey (See my Thread HERE as an example) but you will notice subtle differences when viewing the actual paint such as depth, clarity, reflectiveness, gloss and sometimes even the colour.  View the panel from different angles and in different lights.
> 
> Water behaviour will be different and the 'just waxed' look should be maintained a lot longer by the higher end wax. :thumb:
> 
> ...


Pretty much all I wanted to say. Photos mean nothing.

The best finish i've seen on a flat colour was after using megs nxt tech. I still wouldn't go out and buy it.


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

I find it amazing that these products that are so good and show something to be much better can't be picked up by a camera...I have a really good camera btw, honest 

:lol:

If photos really do mean nothing, then why do sooo many people post up "finished" pics with cars wearing xxx product... if they mean nothing, and no-one can tell the difference...

Surely a waste of everyone's time??! No?!?!?

On the back of that, why do people then say.. wow, that is a great finish you have got from xxx product?!?!?

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

So what we are saying is, that if from now on, everyone in the showroom started saying here is my finished car wearing Solaris (or whatever that really expensive wax is, that I'm not sure even exisits  ), that not one person could tell the difference and be able to say no it's not?!?!?!?

I'm not doubting you guys, but wow, just wow... 

:thumb:


----------



## bero1306 (Jan 24, 2011)

I think a well polished car will look great in just about every camera shot as i feel they hide a hell of a lot if you want it too but you really don't see the true look until you can see it for real imo. :thumb:


----------



## craigeh123 (Dec 26, 2011)

Christ this has gone further than I expected it would . Still my original 
Question is kind of not answered lol . I noticed that crystal rock has 
71 percent white carnuba , that's a high percentage right there . 

I hope everyone realisises I wasn't questioning the point of these waxes - I 
Was just interested in the ingredients and performance of them . 

Price is irrelevant of you can afford it , if I had the money I'd happilly apply 
Crystal rock or the likes just because I could


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

^^ :lol:... yeah sometimes threads go in a different direction...

Hope you get your answer soon! 

:thumb:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

craigeh123 said:


> Christ this has gone further than I expected it would . Still my original
> Question is kind of not answered lol . I noticed that crystal rock has
> 71 percent white carnuba , that's a high percentage right there .
> 
> ...


It is of no surprise that the thread has gone the length it has, your question will never be kind of answered, the answer in a sense is NOTHING, as you quote 71% carnauba, that is another long thread in itself, is 71% of the wax carnauba and the 29% other waxes , or is 71% of the tub carnauba and the other 29% solvents?

Sometimes success is on balance not the fact one thing has MORE than another.


----------



## The_Bouncer (Nov 24, 2010)

craigeh123 said:


> Christ this has gone further than I expected it would . Still my original
> Question is kind of not answered lol . *I noticed that crystal rock has
> 71 percent white carnuba , that's a high percentage right there *.
> 
> ...


Carnauba % is as misleading as hell > make a wax, cut the head off a chicken, see how fast it will run, Divide by 2 and you can have a made up carnauba %

Nobody will tell you the exact ingredients or true % of a wax components for commercial reasons.

If you happy with the cost of a particular wax and ticks all the boxes of how it works on a car then that's it, no more no less.

Commerce & economics around the world dictates markets and what people pay for what they deem a high end product.

It's a free market out there. In everyone of our daily purchases we make a decision based upon what we as individuals thinks is our 'price point' - Think about it as I reckon each one of us does it more than we realise.

:thumb:
:thumb:


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## Miglior (Feb 12, 2006)

Cueball... I'm not going to enter into the actual topic debate, I knows what I knows and I'm not going to get flamed for it, I like my high end waxes 

What i do want to point out and someone might tear this to shreds.... I don't know. Just an observation from detailing cars all day long and taking photos of them. 

Here goes... 

When we are looking at a detailing car I the flesh were looking at the depth, reflection gloss and all those things. What our eyes are focussing on might be 2 metres away but the reflection in that panel might be 6m away. 

The way we judge distance and with that depth etc is the comparable images each of our eyes send to the brain. The further away our eyes at the better we are at judging distance. (try closing one eye and judging the distance of an object)
I'm almost certain this thing comes into play when photographing detailing work and the finish. I know for one I am always dissapointed that I can't replicate the results of my work on camera. I know quite a few people always tell me my work looks good in the photo but every time I fire up the mac and take a look at the pics they look about 80% as good as it did in the flesh. 

I think this has something to do with the one camera lens taking the shot rather than what I see in the flesh with two lenses (my eyes). I'm not saying this is gospel and I'm a nerd and pretend to know about these things but i do think these subtle differences between waxes me sealants are very hard to pick up on camera but I can spot them with my own eyes. 

Bring on 3d write ups! Haha!

And to clarify I'm not saying this right or wrong but just an observation and maybe a fair point? Haha!


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Well your photos always look better then mine! :lol:

Of course it's a fair point... any point which doesn't descent into petty BS is... 

3d write ups... mmmm... we need smell o vision as well though!

:thumb:


----------



## SarahAnn (Apr 6, 2011)

The Cueball said:


> Well your photos always look better then mine! :lol:
> 
> Of course it's a fair point... any point which doesn't descent into petty BS is...
> 
> ...


As long as it's not 'scratch n sniff' vision :lol:


----------



## Bratwurst (Jan 23, 2009)

I'm no camera expert... I find my instamatic serves me very well :lol:... but would those fancy HDR image thingys not show more detail and give a more 'lifelike' reflection of what our eyes see?..


----------



## DrDax (Apr 16, 2009)

Miglior said:


> Here goes...
> 
> I'm almost certain this thing comes into play when photographing detailing work and the finish. I know for one I am always dissapointed that I can't replicate the results of my work on camera. I know quite a few people always tell me my work looks good in the photo but every time I fire up the mac and take a look at the pics they look about 80% as good as it did in the flesh.
> 
> I think this has something to do with the one camera lens taking the shot rather than what I see in the flesh with two lenses (my eyes). I'm not saying this is gospel and I'm a nerd and pretend to know about these things but i do think these subtle differences between waxes me sealants are very hard to pick up on camera but I can spot them with my own eyes.


You're right about cameras. As a Amateur 'Tog and detailer - The camera sees thing differently to the human eye. 
Cam sensor has a very narrow range, however, the human eye has a good dynamic range. Thats why we can look at dark and light objects at the same time and see both.

Use a SLR on manual when taking shots of your work, you can force the exposure and aperture to show what you want.

On the wax topic... Gtechniq products & C1 (awesome stuff), My other prods Dodojuice BA and poorboys XXXX wax, Megs #16 are gathering dust. BA is the most I spend on wax.

I suppose comparing costs. C1 does work out approx £1000/litre
but u only need 20-25ml for a car!


----------



## Grizzle (Jul 12, 2006)

wee_green_mini said:


> I'm no camera expert... I find my instamatic serves me very well :lol:... but would those fancy HDR image thingys not show more detail and give a more 'lifelike' reflection of what our eyes see?..


Try it tonight on your seedy booze sessions let us know. :thumb:


----------



## gally (May 25, 2008)

DrDax said:


> You're right about cameras. As a Amateur 'Tog and detailer - The camera sees thing differently to the human eye.
> Cam sensor has a very narrow range, however, the human eye has a good dynamic range. Thats why we can look at dark and light objects at the same time and see both.
> 
> Use a SLR on manual when taking shots of your work, you can force the exposure and aperture to show what you want.
> ...


20-25ml? Seriously! No way!

It cost me/Craig about £5-£10 in product to do the Frp! All Gtechnq nano products are the most cost effective on the market. There is no re-application.

G1, C1, C4, C5. Buy and sell on, re-buy every 2 years or whatever!


----------



## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

bigmc said:


> Don't give away which is which in the photos though, see if people can see the difference that the expensive wax brigade harp on about.


Yeah, because photos give a true prospective... :tumbleweed:


----------



## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

type[r]+ said:


> Yeah, because photos give a true prospective... :tumbleweed:


Why all the comments about photos then when someone posts a photo using some >£100 wax? People rave about it like you can see the difference. :tumbleweed:


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

bigmc said:


> Why all the comments about photos then when someone posts a photo using some >£100 wax? People rave about it like you can see the difference. :tumbleweed:


:lol:

My point as well...as above...post #216

Esp when people put up a pic with the whole point of look how good my car is wearing xxx LSP...

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

I get the point that the eye is better than a lens... but even so....

:thumb:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

The Cueball said:


> :lol:
> 
> My point as well...as above...post #216
> 
> ...


I thought post #216 reffered to the pictures in the thread, I agree any product can look good, I dod think though that I have not seen a budget wax posting with a quality like the rs5 in the thread link


----------



## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Avanti said:


> I thought post #216 reffered to the pictures in the thread, I agree any product can look good, I dod think though that I have not seen a budget wax posting with a quality like the rs5 in the thread link


No, just my thoughts on why people bother to post finished pics, if no-one can tell the difference...

How many times do you see, car is finished wearing xxx LSP...

then the next 10 replies are products looks great...

:thumb:


----------



## TOGWT (Oct 26, 2005)

The ingredient that makes most of these waxes so exclusive 'marketing'


----------



## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

bigmc said:


> Why all the comments about photos then when someone posts a photo using some >£100 wax? People rave about it like you can see the difference. :tumbleweed:


Beats me? Always makes me chuckle though!


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

The Cueball said:


> No, just my thoughts on why people bother to post finished pics, if no-one can tell the difference...
> 
> How many times do you see, car is finished wearing xxx LSP...
> 
> ...


Aye, that is because of the mob mentality 
I will never forget the time I cleaned up that Punto, and in another thread I posted requesting if anyone had heard/seen the product range, in the meantime the Punto thread was getting good feedback UNTIL it was revealed that £1 products were used.
It is not just the products though it is the car, post say an R8 and it will get more positive response than a Kia Ceed. Just as this pic the car is wearing boutique vs budget posts.
I still don't feel the 'rip off' is with high end products but more with low/mid range that require top ups, and do not deliver as per packaging


----------



## SarahAnn (Apr 6, 2011)

Avanti said:


> Aye, that is because of the mob mentality
> I will never forget the time I cleaned up that Punto, and in another thread I posted requesting if anyone had heard/seen the product range, in the meantime the Punto thread was getting good feedback UNTIL it was revealed that £1 products were used.
> *It is not just the products though it is the car, post say an R8 and it will get more positive response than a Kia Ceed. Just as this pic the car is wearing boutique vs budget posts.*I still don't feel the 'rip off' is with high end products but more with low/mid range that require top ups, and do not deliver as per packaging


I totally agree with the car thing. There was a thread on here in the showroom which wasnt a top brand car and then another in the same colour appeared but it was a 'higher' brand car. Although the lower brand car was glossier/shinier and looked loads better, the 'higher' brand car got all the praise :lol::lol:


----------



## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

SarahAnn said:


> I totally agree with the car thing. There was a thread on here in the showroom which wasnt a top brand car and then another in the same colour appeared but it was a 'higher' brand car. Although the lower brand car was glossier/shinier and looked loads better, the 'higher' brand car got all the praise :lol::lol:


people will comment because they like the car, not what products used, or how shiny it looked. I know myself I'd rather look at a Ferrari or Lamborghini detail than a regular diesel hatch.


----------



## Woodking (Oct 21, 2011)

I've got far better things to spend my hard earned 'dosh' on, than a high end wax.

Anyhow, IMO Zaino's far better than a wax


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Woodking said:


> I've got far better things to spend my hard earned 'dosh' on, than a high end wax.
> 
> Anyhow, IMO Zaino's far better than a wax


How does that fit in with the debate? Some would debate that zaino is not the be all and end all and can be proven to be just as much a waste of money


----------



## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Avanti said:


> Aye, that is because of the mob mentality
> I will never forget the time I cleaned up that Punto, and in another thread I posted requesting if anyone had heard/seen the product range, in the meantime the Punto thread was getting good feedback UNTIL it was revealed that £1 products were used.
> It is not just the products though it is the car, post say an R8 and it will get more positive response than a Kia Ceed. Just as this pic the car is wearing boutique vs budget posts.
> I still don't feel the 'rip off' is with high end products but more with low/mid range that require top ups, and do not deliver as per packaging


Also, dependant on who has done the correction as well. Just like in real life some people have more followers and friends than others.

It probably depends on the camera plus you have to know what to look for, I think or well I tried to show people on that audi I put up what the difference was in a good quality wax.


----------



## Jesse74 (Jul 19, 2008)

This thread brings a video to mind...


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## Woodking (Oct 21, 2011)

Avanti said:


> How does that fit in with the debate? Some would debate that zaino is not the be all and end all and can be proven to be just as much a waste of money


Er, its my opinion. Sorry of you didn't like it. :wall:

Enjoy your expensive wax lol!


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Woodking said:


> Er, its my opinion. Sorry of you didn't like it. :wall:
> 
> Enjoy your expensive wax lol!


careful, the argument posts get deleted off the thread, it is your opinion, as did I post mine, it is you who does not like what you read , let me get a pic for you 










but yes I will enjoy my wax, it's not as if they are expensive and if they were, I worked for it so spend my money to suit me


----------



## Woodking (Oct 21, 2011)

Avanti said:


> careful, the argument posts get deleted off the thread, it is your opinion, as did I post mine, it is you who does not like what you read , let me get a pic for you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Listen buddy, I posted my opinion of what I thought about expensive waxes. *You* then decided to take it upon yourself further by questioning *my* opinion, I didn't ask you too, nor do I care what you think so please feel free to jog on.

I see what Cueball means with unnecessary negative posts and attempted keyboard bullying. :wall:

My origional post was meant 'tongue in cheek', hence the little smilie.

Some people.


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Woodking said:


> Listen buddy, I posted my opinion of what I thought about expensive waxes. *You* then decided to take it upon yourself further by questioning *my* opinion, I didn't ask you too, nor do I care what you think so please feel free to jog on.
> 
> I see what Cueball means with unnecessary negative posts and attempted keyboard bullying. :wall:
> 
> ...


As said, you need to chill out, how are you so sure my response was not tongue in cheek? It is only you that has taken exception to the response of your opinion, although the thread is about expensive waxes, the same thread could be levied about expensive sealants, is there anything in Zaino that does not feature in seal n shine? 
It's not about keyboard warrioring, your opinion has been expressed and so has mine, I'm too mature to fall out with you over it, so if you wanna keep spitting your dummy publicly then I will leave you to it, though as said usually my opinions come from experience not just mob hysteria


----------



## Woodking (Oct 21, 2011)

Avanti said:


> As said, you need to chill out, how are you so sure my response was not tongue in cheek? It is only you that has taken exception to the response of your opinion, although the thread is about expensive waxes, the same thread could be levied about expensive sealants, is there anything in Zaino that does not feature in seal n shine?
> It's not about keyboard warrioring, your opinion has been expressed and so has mine, I'm too mature to fall out with you over it, so if you wanna keep spitting your dummy publicly then I will leave you to it, though as said usually my opinions come from experience not just mob hysteria


Who's spitting their dummy out publicly? I just don't like negative keyboard warriors :thumb:


----------



## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Woodking said:


> Who's spitting their dummy out publicly? I just don't like negative keyboard warriors :thumb:


Your 1st post on the thread is a negative keyboard warrior statement, nobody asked about sealants vs wax, it was not relevant to the thread, even so, you commented on an overpriced sealant, it is no different to the ones who wish to purchase a wax more than you would care to pay, does that make them a lesser person than you? No, of course it does not, you then try to back track by saying it was tongue in cheek, personally I don't believe you, but then that is just my opinion, of which you are entitled to disagree, there have been plenty of threads about wax vs sealants and have their own space on the forum, negative keyboard warrioring includes rail roading a thread, this thread is about waxes not sealants


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## Woodking (Oct 21, 2011)

Avanti said:


> Your 1st post on the thread is a negative keyboard warrior statement, nobody asked about sealants vs wax, it was not relevant to the thread, even so, you commented on an overpriced sealant, it is no different to the ones who wish to purchase a wax more than you would care to pay, does that make them a lesser person than you? No, of course it does not, *you then try to back track by saying it was tongue in cheek*, personally I don't believe you, but then that is just my opinion, of which you are entitled to disagree, there have been plenty of threads about wax vs sealants and have their own space on the forum, negative keyboard warrioring includes rail roading a thread, this thread is about waxes not sealants


I'll spell it out for you simply,as you being a keyboard warrior you seem too dim to understand written English. The smilie, and my first post were tongue in cheek and meant in a friendly banter type style. Your post to reply was not, nor have been any of your further replies. You replied by asking how my post fitted in with the debate, who put you in charge, and why not just keep your fingers away from the keyboard just because you don't like what you read? It was my opinion, and like I said, if you don't like it then *jog on*.

No wonder people on here get fed up and leave, I've not been on here long but already get a feeling for the place. I won't be replying to any more of your negative replies as frankly I don't care about your opinion. There are far more important things in my life than sitting here facing the brunt of your silliness.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

Woodking said:


> I'll spell it out for you simply,as you being a keyboard warrior you seem too dim to understand written English. The smilie, and my first post were tongue in cheek and meant in a friendly banter type style. Your post to reply was not, nor have been any of your further replies. You replied by asking how my post fitted in with the debate, who put you in charge, and why not just keep your fingers away from the keyboard just because you don't like what you read? It was my opinion, and like I said, if you don't like it then *jog on*.
> 
> No wonder people on here get fed up and leave, I've not been on here long but already get a feeling for the place. I won't be replying to any more of your negative replies as frankly I don't care about your opinion. There are far more important things in my life than sitting here facing the brunt of your silliness.


You don't know why people get fed up and leave, I do know they join to get sensible chat and opinion, had you posted your playground comment in another thread then my response would have been different, so what point don't you understand? Your comments are most welcome in the relevant places, a wax thread is for wax thank you very much, you didn't have the courtesy to reply to what's in zaino compared to a budget sealant or what your post had to do with the topic, so hence why I could not take your post as serious , if you knew you were joking then you would not have taken exception to it. If you post on a public forum, then you have to accept the response it may recieve, the forum has many boards for various topics, we don't have to police it, but people do leave noisy pointless places, raise your opinion in a sealant thread and let the wax thread continue :thumb:


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

Heck, I am worn out reading it, let's all go :detailer:


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## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

Last post from me on this I promise. 

Ok so after mentioning the purple hue noticed on Alan's R32 after the application of Vintage, I thought I would dig out my engineering books and look at light dispersion and refraction. 

Turns out, when a light refracts off a surface with a higher index (such as the natural oils we see in some of the high end waxes) of refraction it gains half a shift in wavelength. 

What I gather is the most normal thing is a slight dispersion of light so in the case of Vintage you are actually experiencing light dispersion and not the natural colour of the paint coming through and since blue travels might slower than red the hue you see is indigo ? 

Anyway thats my flu ridden, tired thoughts on higher end waxes. 

There is obviously a lot more thought on light refraction and light influence than I first gave credit. 

Be interesting if there are any physics guys to chime in at this point. 

If the light is slowed down and caused to refract to a point nearer normal does this mean it has hit a surface with a higher refractive index? 

:lol: I love my geekness.


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## DrDax (Apr 16, 2009)

gally said:


> 20-25ml? Seriously! No way!
> 
> It cost me/Craig about £5-£10 in product to do the Frp! All Gtechnq nano products are the most cost effective on the market. There is no re-application.
> 
> G1, C1, C4, C5. Buy and sell on, re-buy every 2 years or whatever!


Remember you are applying a submicron layer you need only a little bit. Spreads a long way.

Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk


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## DrDax (Apr 16, 2009)

JJ_ said:


> Last post from me on this I promise.
> 
> Ok so after mentioning the purple hue noticed on Alan's R32 after the application of Vintage, I thought I would dig out my engineering books and look at light dispersion and refraction.
> 
> ...


I agree with what you're saying. Unless you have a clear coating you will always get some shift in wavelength. Wax will act as a filter refracting different wavelengths within the the visible light spectrum

Although for some you may not notice until a few layers.
One of the trade detailers did an experiment with waxes to proove the point colour change from waxes.

that's why I like c1 so much. 100% clear. Only adds gloss
And a ton of protection lol.

Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk


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## JJ_ (Oct 26, 2005)

DrDax said:


> I agree with what you're saying. Unless you have a clear coating you will always get some shift in wavelength.


That is interesting, why would the clear coat affect the shift in wavelength would that correct the shift ? If anything I thought it would further change the wavelength.

Now here is the strange thing, on both paint systems I have witnessed the light interference it has been with Vintage and both on Blue coloured cars. The colour witness is normally a indigo/violet spectrum. These cars have modern clear coats.

The only other product I have witnessed this with is Meguiars #7, which is a high oil content product, if the medium is more dense than where the light is coming from it slows the light down - my question is why does light intereference only happen with these products and not other high end waxes??

Now with it being blue, the blue paint I take it absorbs the blue light to a certain degree ? Hence the reason we see the next colour spectrum ?

So this may give a better understanding to what is in the "high end" waxes and why they cost so much more - there seems to be a little more though behind them than I first gave credit for.

John.


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## Tazz (Aug 23, 2010)

i wont spend more than £20 on a wax, and if i was a multibillionaire with a fleet of high end spanking sports cars? still no more than £20, lol

i would however buy the full range of products from a few brands


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

More carnauba for a start, and different ingredients plus the company you buy it from privileges if any, they will last longer than the average waxes on a car, theres lots out there, to many, which makes it harder to go for which one.

Because my cars old its not like the new ones on here you see, and being short on cash due to my health i only use run of mill waxes on mine, but lets say if i had a Aston martin db9, then i will certainly invest in a high end wax because those cars deserve it in my eyes.


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## cleaningfreak (Sep 3, 2011)

bigmc said:


> 8 months from one layer? Not a chance! It does look expensive when you'll still get the same durability from £20 bottle of 845 which is then pence/month.


well, this is personal choice  in my eyes ... it isnt .. what makes it expensive .. its end price 800£ .. if this was 16 pounds and would enough to cover once ... i think it wouldnt be so expensive ... .

p.s or maybe its jealousy that someone cant afford to get stuff like this ?  (only kidding )


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## PWOOD (Apr 30, 2007)

Few years ago DAVEKG and others did a wax test using identical brand new black Corsas after preping them to perfection and for me it proved there was little if any difference in waxes and price had little to do with it.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

PWOOD said:


> Few years ago DAVEKG and others did a wax test using identical brand new black Corsas after preping them to perfection and for me it proved there was little if any difference in waxes and price had little to do with it.


Good one, where is that thread, needs to be posted on here, i can't track it on here, but someone place it on here if they can track it, that will the ending of this thread.

Don't get me wrong i would love to try a high end wax.


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## Avanti (Jan 17, 2006)

PWOOD said:


> Few years ago DAVEKG and others did a wax test using identical brand new black Corsas after preping them to perfection and for me it proved there was little if any difference in waxes and price had little to do with it.





Trip tdi said:


> Good one, where is that thread, needs to be posted on here, i can't track it on here, but someone place it on here if they can track it, that will the ending of this thread.
> 
> Don't get me wrong i would love to try a high end wax.


Initially there will be little difference (I remeber the test and thread too) it would have been interesting to see the vehicles again a few weeks and months later on. To note if they still all look the 'same'


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## The_Bouncer (Nov 24, 2010)

This is a good post already in the depths of DW and may go some way to answering some of your questions..

we pick up on page 4 :thumb:

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=127943&page=4


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## PWOOD (Apr 30, 2007)

Avanti said:


> Initially there will be little difference (I remeber the test and thread too) it would have been interesting to see the vehicles again a few weeks and months later on. To note if they still all look the 'same'


Good point Avanti I dont subscribe to the "their all the same" club you only have to apply a few to know that and longevity is a factor in assessing how good a wax is. The thread has been found


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Nice one Avanti, i have been trying to track this thread for ages, how did you find it mate, very goodwork there mate.


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## amiller (Jan 1, 2009)

Avanti said:


> Initially there will be little difference (I remeber the test and thread too) it would have been interesting to see the vehicles again a few weeks and months later on. To note if they still all look the 'same'


This has always been my thoughts on higher end waxes.

--> Whilst the £10 wax and the £100 wax may both give that 'just waxed' looked; after 2-3 weeks, it is the £100 wax that still gives that 'just waxed' look, whilst the £10 wax either needs reapplication or some kind of 'top-up' product.


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## PWOOD (Apr 30, 2007)

Trip tdi said:


> Nice one Avanti, i have been trying to track this thread for ages, how did you find it mate, very goodwork there mate.


He didn't I did:wave:. Google search using DAVE KG, Big wax test , Vauxhall Corsa.


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## R0B (Aug 27, 2010)

All relative to what the buyer wants to spend and how they feel about there purchase.

Example im looking to buy some new speakers for my lounge Dali Zensor 7's @ £570, a ridiculous price for a pair of floorstanding speakers but i will enjoy them and notice the difference in clarity even if its a placebo effect from the pair that there replacing Wharfedale 10.1's ,in my eyes i will be happy.

Same for waxes, ive had some nice waxes up to Crystal rock are they any better than cheaper ones, in reality, probably not but its up to the purchaser to decide really..


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