# Snow foam - expectations too high?



## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

After hearing a few friends talk about snow foam I decided to invest in a lance and CG No Touch Snow Foam. The CG seemed to be one of the highest rated products.
I first cleaned my car which is black, didn't think it was too bad but my paintwork isn't brilliant either.
Then done my wife's white car (which she hasn't cleaned for about 2 months) and it hardly touched it.
Now I'm questioning my method, was foam to thick/thin, did I leave it long enough? Or is it simply just a pre-wash?


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## whiteclio59 (Aug 13, 2013)

The problems I was having so I brought a mesto foamer lot less hassle lol


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## WhiteRoc_170 (Jan 31, 2013)

Sort of answerd your own question Really. Yes it is just a pre wash. It will never clean a car fully.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

I gave up with snow after busting my old Lance and making a right old mess so have stuck to prewashes since and they work well. 
Tbh I am not sure you will get the touchless wash you are after and as Whiteroc says it's a prewash designed to remove loose dirt etc. 
Having said that I have just brought a mesto foamer so it will be snowing a little round here:thumb:


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

Thats a shame. I was under the impression it was meant to be "no touch". Spray on, dwell, wash off going from some of the stuff I had read.

Oh well its paid for now so il continue to play.

Is it a case of the thicker the foam the better? I think when I did my car it was a little weak so i added more solution and adjusted the flow to make it thicker when doing my wifes.


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## GleemSpray (Jan 26, 2014)

The concept behind using foam is that it wont just run straight off your car like ordinary shampoo & water from a bucket does, but instead will cling to the car for a few minutes and in that time, the foam sitting on top of the dirt will soften or loosen it, so that most of the dirt will then easily power wash off the car.

This should leave a car which is clean enough to safely take a wash mitt to, without fear of grinding big dirt particles into the paint.

So it is very much intended as a pre-wash, to get the worst of it off.

Sometimes it will actually clean a car by itself, if it isn't too dirty to start with, but most of the time it will leave a light film of dirt behind, as will most spray-on, rinse off cleaners.

A second snow foam or a bucket wash will then get the car properly clean.


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

Thanks everyone.

Was slightly skeptical as the idea sounded to good but wanted to check I wasnt doing something wrongs

At least i now have a realistic view going forward.


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

I was in a similar boat with snow foam whereas the few I did try never really seemed to clean the car that well after dwelling on the paint for a while. In fact, it seemed as though the PW was removing the dirt and not the snow foam.

I trialled the ODK snow foam and found that it clung well and cleaned very well indeed, the best I've tried to date.

Personally though, I'm an advocate of the PM TFR as when it's diluted well down and sprayed onto the car via my Hozelock 5ltr pump sprayer, left to dwell for 5mins or so, then PW'd off, the dirt that was on the car is visibly no longer there, something I've never achieved with snow foam alone.

I have 5ltrs of AF Citrus Power, 5ltrs of Carchem S.Foam and approx 3ltrs of BH Autofoam that are just sat in the garage unused since I switched to the PM TFR for winter/harsh weather use and now on the PM Jet Wash n Wax for the not so harsh months.

Only the AF Citrus Power will be used during the summer as I love it for removing sun dried bugs guts etc....


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

james_dean1986 said:


> Thanks everyone.
> 
> Was slightly skeptical as the idea sounded to good but wanted to check I wasnt doing something wrongs
> 
> At least i now have a realistic view going forward.


Don't forget it is still a worthwhile part of your wash regime and for the time it takes so don't bin it:thumb:
I normally mix up prewash with warm water and spray on the car after cleaning the wheels then go off and get the buckets ready whilst it's doing its stuff then pressure wash off before shampooing :detailer:


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Jeez that is alot of foam Nbray....


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

Pittsy said:


> Jeez that is alot of foam Nbray....


I know mate, the Carchem stuff I got last year on a group buy as it was ultra cheap and they threw in a 1ltr of their 1900:1 shampoo which I love, hardly used any of the shampoo!!

BH Autofoam I bought as the reviews were superb, unfortunately, and this is each to their own, I don't rate it too much but then again, I've only ever used it as a snow foam, may give it a go as a stand alone pre-wash via a pump sprayer.

The PM drums I have were just superb value compared to the 1ltr and 5ltr smaller versions. Made sense to buy in bulk to 'save' money over time.

So yeah, quite a bit of foam to use. I did consider selling some stuff in a recent sales thread but posting liquids is dodgy as RM will confiscate it and Hermes etc like to play footy with packages before they launch them over customers garden gates etc....


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

Pittsy said:


> Jeez that is alot of foam Nbray....


Only 8 litres I will not be posting how many litres I have in that case 

Referring to foam only that is.


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## james_death (Aug 9, 2010)

nbray67 said:


> Only the AF Citrus Power will be used during the summer as I love it for removing sun dried bugs guts etc....


I found the Bilt Hamber Surfex HD sees the little cadavers off in a flash just with the trigger spray on hose pipe even when baked on for weeks.


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## james_death (Aug 9, 2010)

Let me think what stocks i have...

4lt autobrite magifoam.

4.5lt Autosmart Hazsafe

5lt autobrite pear foam.

7lt of autobrite super foam was it?

8lt Bilt Hamber Autofoam.

13lt valet pro citrus pre wash.

24 lt of Autosmart Actimousse xls

24lt of powermaxed TFR

Oh may as well count the 23t of turtle wax wash and wax as i throw that out the power washer at the work van...:lol:


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

james_death said:


> Let me thing what stocks i have...
> 
> 4lt autobrite magifoam.
> 
> ...


How long have you had Magifoam James , I have about 4l since it came out, same for no touch about the same time. They perform just the same now, leave a mess all over the drive.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

Flipping heck.... 
I have got 500ml of maxolen foam that came with my mesto foamer and that's it foam wise:thumb:
Got a fair amount of prewashes though although not quite as much as you guys:thumb:


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

nbray67 said:


> I know mate, the Carchem stuff I got last year on a group buy as it was ultra cheap and they threw in a 1ltr of their 1900:1 shampoo which I love, hardly used any of the shampoo!!
> 
> BH Autofoam I bought as the reviews were superb, unfortunately, and this is each to their own, I don't rate it too much but then again, I've only ever used it as a snow foam, may give it a go as a stand alone pre-wash via a pump sprayer.
> 
> ...


I am surprised about the shampoo. 
That and cleanmax are the ones I reach for every time :thumb:


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

Oh god, if I've brought it then its getting used! Il clean the house windows with it if I have to!
... Or just spray passers by for fun!

As I've cleaned both now Il see how I get on with the next wash


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

Pittsy said:


> Flipping heck....
> I have got 500ml of maxolen foam that came with my mesto foamer and that's it foam wise:thumb:
> Got a fair amount of prewashes though although not quite as much as you guys:thumb:


Have you tried the foamer yet. I have used it with two felts removed with the Maxolen and also with the same amount of Magifoam. The Maxolen sprays a lot better but thinner, the Magifoam (got to use it somehow) sticks on for a good while but needs more pressure because it is so thick.

I have also used NT in the unit, similar to Magifoam effect if the OP ever considers it. Not really any good for a whole car but for a clean of the lower sections it is OK.


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

shine247 said:


> Have you tried the foamer yet. I have used it with two felts removed with the Maxolen and also with the same amount of Magifoam. The Maxolen sprays a lot better but thinner, the Magifoam (got to use it somehow) sticks on for a good while but needs more pressure because it is so thick.
> 
> I have also used NT in the unit, similar to Magifoam effect if the OP ever considers it. Not really any good for a whole car but for a clean of the lower sections it is OK.


Picked it up from the post office today but it's been raining on and off all day, hoping to crack on tomorrow... :thumb:
I am already thinking I might have to try some more foams


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Pittsy said:


> Picked it up from the post office today but it's been raining on and off all day, hoping to crack on tomorrow... :thumb:
> I am already thinking I might have to try some more foams


use warm/hot but not red hot water. it will help to remove the dirt:thumb:


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

cheekymonkey said:


> use warm/hot but not red hot water. it will help to remove the dirt:thumb:


It does, I have only hosed the foam off and so far seems pretty good, hence I was considering the 8l version. Topped up to about a litre otherwise you cannot get much air into it.


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## GleemSpray (Jan 26, 2014)

james_death said:


> I found the Bilt Hamber Surfex HD sees the little cadavers off in a flash just with the trigger spray on hose pipe even when baked on for weeks.


Surfex is seriously impressive stuff. As a pre-wash it is fantastic, even at 5%.

I find that at 10:1, it is excellent at cleaning and rejuvenating tired looking black plastic trim prior to re-dressing.


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

Sounds like I've invested in the wrong stuff


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

Autofoam when used right is probably the best prewash you can get, the only people who say otherwise are using it wrong imo ...

As for foams, no the foamier isn't the best. The thin ones always clean better, await the release of the imperial wax foam, it's a nice thickness, clings well, you use 15ml in a bottle rather than 150ml or more like other brands and it cleans very well 

Only 2 pre washes I use now and I have over 10


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

Kimo73 said:


> Autofoam when used right is probably the best prewash you can get, the only people who say otherwise are using it wrong imo ...
> 
> As for foams, no the foamier isn't the best. The thin ones always clean better, await the release of the imperial wax foam, it's a nice thickness, clings well, you use 15ml in a bottle rather than 150ml or more like other brands and it cleans very well
> 
> Only 2 pre washes I use now and I have over 10


Kimo, I read your post's with a wry smile daily just thinking that not everyone on here as your knowledge but more importantly, not everyone as your preferences so it does make my wry smile sometimes cringe when you say members are 'using it wrong'.

Opinions are opinions and everyone is welcome to them, it's a forum at the end of the day, but sometimes mate, just have a think about what you post as personal preference for products doesn't mean people are 'using them wrong' and can sometimes come across as being a tad condescending to other members at times.

The fact that you have over 10 pre washes but now only use 2 kind of proves that it's personal preference and not user error, or were you using the other 8+ wrong :lol:


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## GleemSpray (Jan 26, 2014)

If you just stick 1" of BH Autofoam in a Lance and top it up with water, like other foams, you will get a soapy squirt that won't do much cleaning because it will be watered down too much. 

You need to be able to get it hitting the car paint at 4% or better dilution, which probably means using it almost neat in a foam Lance or mixing it in a pump sprayer of some sort. 

When you do get it working at 4% or better (I use it around 7%) then it really does clean fantastically well. 

You get a thin foam which clings for a couple of minutes, which is all it needs, and is then gone along with the dirt.


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## TrainerFreak81 (Mar 7, 2015)

james_dean1986 said:


> After hearing a few friends talk about snow foam I decided to invest in a lance and CG No Touch Snow Foam. The CG seemed to be one of the highest rated products.
> I first cleaned my car which is black, didn't think it was too bad but my paintwork isn't brilliant either.
> Then done my wife's white car (which she hasn't cleaned for about 2 months) and it hardly touched it.
> Now I'm questioning my method, was foam to thick/thin, did I leave it long enough? Or is it simply just a pre-wash?


Just out of interest are your cars protected with a wax or sealent? IMO snow foam seems to work better with on a well protected paintwork.

On the thick or thin front its down to personal preference usually, I use AF Avalanche and swear by it, no it doesnt produce a uber thick foam but the cleaning power is good. 'Big' dirt runs off during the dwell time and smaller bits come off with the PW afterwards. I hated trying to clean Magifoam up after using it, makes an awful mess that lingers on the drive for hours :lol:


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

GleemSpray said:


> If you just stick 1" of BH Autofoam in a Lance and top it up with water, like other foams, you will get a soapy squirt that won't do much cleaning because it will be watered down too much.
> 
> You need to be able to get it hitting the car paint at 4% or better dilution, which probably means using it almost neat in a foam Lance or mixing it in a pump sprayer of some sort.
> 
> ...


Dwell times seemed to suggested 10+ minutes but I noticed it has started to dry in places. I brought 5L of the stuff so I've got a few attempts to get it right.


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## danwel (Feb 18, 2007)

Very suprised at you comment about no touch. I often use no touch and pressure wash off and it leaves a very clean finish. Not touch less but very acceptable for cold winter washes


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

nbray67 said:


> Kimo, I read your post's with a wry smile daily just thinking that not everyone on here as your knowledge but more importantly, not everyone as your preferences so it does make my wry smile sometimes cringe when you say members are 'using it wrong'.
> 
> Opinions are opinions and everyone is welcome to them, it's a forum at the end of the day, but sometimes mate, just have a think about what you post as personal preference for products doesn't mean people are 'using them wrong' and can sometimes come across as being a tad condescending to other members at times.
> 
> The fact that you have over 10 pre washes but now only use 2 kind of proves that it's personal preference and not user error, or were you using the other 8+ wrong :lol:


I do think about what I post, it is right to me what I post and it is one of the best products in my collection. Just because I don't follow the silly band wagons it doesn't mean I'm wrong any more than it means I'm right to you

I don't care wether people like my views on stuff but at the end of the day I pay for my products so I can say what I want about them

It is actually pretty common that people use auto foam wrong then slate it without doing what it says to do in the first place

The problem on here are people who don't experiment with their products and automatically slate them, or worse still, people who slate products they don't even own!

I will try various ways of using a product before I slate it, and then I feel I am within my right

I only pointed out how many I have, not including ones I've used and given away, as everyone else seemed to like doing it to justify themselves, not as you should need to

But thanks for your concern


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## Pittsy (Jun 14, 2014)

If you wanna give some to me to try feel free


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

Kimo73 said:


> It is actually pretty common that people use auto foam wrong then slate it without doing what it says to do in the first place
> 
> The problem on here are people who don't experiment with their products and automatically slate them, or worse still, people who slate products they don't even own!
> 
> But thanks for your concern


You're bang on their with your reply Kimo, you don't think before you post, as, at no point in this thread, as anyone 'slated' BH Autofoam as you quoted above.

You seem to come back with quite harsh replies in a vain attempt to provoke a similar kind of response from other posters.

I'll leave you to your own views/replies/criticisms etc etc....as I really can't be bothered with members who simply have, at times, complete disregard for others.


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

I don't know if you're reading my posts wrong but they are in no way harsh at all :lol:

Though if you don't like them, add me to your ignore list and you won't even see them 

It would bother me very little as I have more important things to worry about


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## Alfa male (Jun 16, 2009)

Back to the OPs original point, I use Auto Brite lance and Auto Brite Magifoam combo. It gives a really thick lather and cleans the majority of the dirt off the car if left to dwell. 

In winter months I don't bother with the hand wash just foam and jetwash and leave to dry in touched. 

Only issue as pointed out above is that it makes a big mess on the drive ! But on a positive also cleans the drive too so not all bad


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

danwel said:


> Very suprised at you comment about no touch. I often use no touch and pressure wash off and it leaves a very clean finish. Not touch less but very acceptable for cold winter washes


Danwel, let me know your ratio, dwell time etc. as im keen to get the most of of this given all the good stuff I have read.

I used 1:10 on my car then 1:5 on my wifes.

Alfa male, my friend use Auto Brite as they live by the shop so get it rather cheap. He also says its brilliant. Might pick a bottle up the next time I visit him.


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## danwel (Feb 18, 2007)

james_dean1986 said:


> Danwel, let me know your ratio, dwell time etc. as im keen to get the most of of this given all the good stuff I have read.
> 
> I used 1:10 on my car then 1:5 on my wifes.
> 
> Alfa male, my friend use Auto Brite as they live by the shop so get it rather cheap. He also says its brilliant. Might pick a bottle up the next time I visit him.


Probably not very technical but a good glug lol. I remember asking CG Initially and was told 100-150. My preference is to put plenty in probably double that and then dial the thickness up or down with the dial on top that way I got a nice thick foam if I wanted and I found I actually used less


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## shine247 (Mar 1, 2010)

James, have a look at my post a while back, we have all been there.

NT is as good as anything, depending on dirt levels, sometimes snowfoaming is better than others.

I think you just expected better as your title suggests. As part of a routine it is good.

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=353995


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

Autoshyte foam

Eurgh


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## suspal (Dec 29, 2011)

A pre wash is exactly that,It's a PRE wash.
The Idea being to soften any dirt and helping carry the majority of it away before the Main Wash.
Let's take your washing machine as an example A Pre wash Isn't going to clean the clothes as opposed to the main wash cycle,agreed some foams have better cleaning abilities,but where I do take exception is when people quote A Touchless wash,Load of tripe,that statement leads to high expectations that can't be met and in any case anything that needs a thorough clean needs some sort of mechanical action in our case some elbow grease.


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## james_dean1986 (Mar 22, 2015)

I think that's why my expectations were high with the "no touch" element.

Should have known better!

Shine247, interesting reading the comments about the left over foam. I live at the top of a road and it had trickled down in front of neighbors houses. Didnt go until it rained the next day


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## stuartr (Mar 11, 2014)

And make sure you rinse the snowfoam off totally... CG NT is bad at leaving watermarks afterwards. I did it once and just rinsed without washing with a mitt afterwards and the watermarks were like dried APC and a bugger to get off.


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## JODmeister (Mar 14, 2014)

GleemSpray said:


> The concept behind using foam is that it wont just run straight off your car like ordinary shampoo & water from a bucket does, but instead will cling to the car for a few minutes and in that time, the foam sitting on top of the dirt will soften or loosen it, so that most of the dirt will then easily power wash off the car.
> 
> This should leave a car which is clean enough to safely take a wash mitt to, without fear of grinding big dirt particles into the paint.
> 
> ...


This sums it up perfectly.....


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## KEV. (Oct 22, 2007)

I read loads of snow foam threads both positive and negative but decided to try it myself. After the 2nd 3rd time I just wasn't impressed until I really got it set up properly, used the BH Autofoam neat as its intended and now I won't wash without. I've used it as both touchless wash, just to get me through the week (never be a complete replacement for mitt and bucket) but mainly as a pre-wash now. 
I find after jetting it off it leaves a film between the paint and dirt stopping the grinding into the paint.

Just my 2bobs worth.


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## nismohks (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi I havent used foam for a while but I remember foaming my car which had finish kare 1000p on it, pressure washing after foaming took most of the dirt away. Having a good wax / sealant, makes cleaning so much easier.


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## InfinityLoop (Feb 11, 2013)

Yeah I do agree with Nismohks that having a good wax or sealant on the car does make "touch less" washes more to what you are looking for.

As I clean a lot of vans and I want to finish as fast as possible I've come into the habit of putting TFR in the snow foam lance and letting that sit for 2-3 minutes then a coating of snow foam for 2-3 minutes then a good blast off with the pressure washer and 9/10 vans come up perfect looking but this is because in my opinion they have the protection there in the first place which is wax/sealant and trim protection as well.


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