# 5.5" or 7" pad for DA?



## a6l3i (Nov 4, 2011)

Hi Mike,

Just want to order my first DA (G220-V2), but still not sure about pad size (5.5" or 7")!!

Many people don't suggest any pad bigger than 5.5" for DA due to reduction of cleaning ability. While Meguiar's has been using 7" Softbuff 2.0 in most video clips, workshops, etc.

Obviously, I'll order some 4" pads for bumpers and some tight sections. But can't decide between Hex-Logic 5.5" pads and Meg's Softbuff 2.0 pads!!?

My car is brand new Black Metallic Nissan Teana (avatar) and there would be no deal with heavy swirls and scratches for some while.

Thanks in advance


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## umi000 (Jan 14, 2011)

Not Mike, but I would get 5.5" pads rather 7" ones. I know that Meguiar's say that you can use their 7" pads with their DA without any issues, but during a training day we had at the local Meguiar's distributor, you could see how easy it was to stop a 7" pad from rotating, even at speed 6 - and this was with the trainer using it!


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## Mike Phillips (Jan 26, 2007)

I of course worked for Meguiar's for a total of 11 years, from 2002 to 2003 my title was Corporate Writer, after that I moved into the Training Department and taught a majority of all the Saturday 101 and 102 classes as well as brought up the MeguiarsOnline.com Discussion forum from scratch in 2004 and ran it till 2009 and at that point left Meguiar's to work for Autogeek, so I know a little bit about the company.

The 7" pads were made that size so they could be used with a rotary buffer or a DA Polisher, _*dual use, dual markets*_.

Is the 7" size the best for a DA? Not really but it works best for a dual purpose pad to sell to two tool markets. Will they work? "yes". It's best to have a few extras and as the pads become wet with product switch to a dry pad and you'll see rotation improve.

What you want in a DA pad is

*

Thin
Small diameter
*
*Thin vs Thick*
Thick foam pads on a tool with a _*free floating spindle bearing assembly*_ absorb and dissipate the energy coming out of the tool. You see this as a lack of ability to rotate a pad.

*Small vs Large*
The larger the diameter the more surface area the tool has to move over the surface and the harder it is for DA polishers to do effectively.

*Things get worse when the pads start becoming wet with product.*

I cover this in my how-to book and in multiple articles on this topic. Do a Google search using these titles,

*Thin is in... New Lake Country Hydro-Tech Low Profile 5 1/2 x 7/8 Inch Foam Pads *

*The Free Floating Spindle Assembly - The Story Behind The Story...*


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## a6l3i (Nov 4, 2011)

umi000 said:


> Not Mike, but I would get 5.5" pads rather 7" ones. I know that Meguiar's say that you can use their 7" pads with their DA without any issues, but during a training day we had at the local Meguiar's distributor, you could see *how easy it was to stop a 7" pad from rotating*, even at speed 6 - and this was with the trainer using it!


Thanks for sharing your practical experience. interesting :speechles !!



Mike Phillips said:


> I of course worked for Meguiar's for a total of 11 years, from 2002 to 2003 my title was Corporate Writer, after that I moved into the Training Department and taught a majority of all the Saturday 101 and 102 classes as well as brought up the MeguiarsOnline.com Discussion forum from scratch in 2004 and ran it till 2009 and at that point left Meguiar's to work for Autogeek, so I know a little bit about the company.
> 
> The 7" pads were made that size so they could be used with a rotary buffer or a DA Polisher, _*dual use, dual markets*_.
> 
> ...


Thank you Mike for your honest reply.
Indeed, these are brilliant points for any newbie like me in detailing word! :thumb:

After creating this post, i searched a lot and found many of your informative topics at Autogeekonline via Google, including above mentioned articles!! 

But your post here, has cleared all issues about the size for me. So, there is no doubt that as the first shot i'll go with *5.5" pads on 5" (4 7/8") backing plates* as well as *4" pads on 3.5" BPs.*

------------------------------------​Just one issue remains for me and it's backing plate!

*on one hand* many folks have been saying that there is no sensible difference between many backing plates in market and buying expensive backing plates is wasting the money.

*on the other hand*, for example Meguiar's has used "Micro-Hook" on its W67DA and S3BP and has announced less warmth producing, especially in 4" pads.

for me here in Germany, both W67DA and S3BP cost about double compared with other brands. for instance:

*3.5"* Backing Plates:
Chemical Guys ..... 10 €
S3BP .................. 21 €

*5"* Backing Plates:
Chemical Guys ...... 16 €
W67DA ................ 28 €

I can afford both S3BP and W67DA. just want to be sure if they are really worth for a such price.

I just wonder if this reduction in heat, be considerable more for those who detailing is their day-to-day business and are professional (like you) and their DAs have been turning several hours a week (or a day), not for home users who turn their DA monthly or every quarter.:buffer:

But if i find that such anti-heat technology is workable and sensible, reduce the pad damaging and make any increase in detailing result for home users, there is no reason not to pay these amount to make my brand new black car more glossy 

I just want to know *the real story behind the story of backing plates for home users *.

Sorry for long write up 
Thanks in advance . . .


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## Mike Phillips (Jan 26, 2007)

a6l3i said:


> for me here in Germany, both W67DA and S3BP cost about double compared with other brands. for instance:
> 
> *3.5"* Backing Plates:
> Chemical Guys ..... 10 €
> ...


The Meguiar's backing plates are nice in my opinion because they are thin. I have not seen the CG plates and I'm preparing for Detail Fest.

If you post a picture and a link to this thread I'll pop back in and take a look.

To be honest, as long as there's good attachment strength you can get buy with any backing plate. Also, the hooks on backing plates wear out, they don't last forever so if you do enough buffing sooner or later you will have to purchase a replacement.


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## a6l3i (Nov 4, 2011)

Thanks for fast reply Mike.



Mike Phillips said:


> ... Also, the *hooks on backing plates wear out*, they don't last forever so if you do enough buffing sooner or later you will have to purchase a replacement.


Is this fact true even for W67DA and S3BP?

I've just exampled CG backing plate because i want to buy their 4" and 5.5" pads (i have seen good feedback from their pads regarding quality and durability here in Europe)

here are some cases i found so far:

1) CG 3.5" (10€)







link

2) CG 5" (16€)







link

3) Lake Country 3.5" (10€)







link

4) A 75mm urethane backing plate (8€)







link

How much did you feel heat-reduction ability of micro-hooks in Meg's pads or any improvements in results?


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## Mike Phillips (Jan 26, 2007)

a6l3i said:


> Thanks for fast reply Mike.
> 
> Is this fact true even for W67DA and S3BP?


Yes. Nothing lasts forever... every time you pull a pad off a backing plate you stretch the hooks, no matter what the design, over time the plastic relaxes and grip strength is reduced.



a6l3i said:


> I've just exampled CG backing plate because i want to buy their 4" and 5.5" pads (i have seen good feedback from their pads regarding quality and durability here in Europe)


In my how-to book I recommend when possible, purchase your backing plates from the company that also provides foam pads because theoretically, if they've done their homework and they're a reputable company the hook and loop will match.

The backing plates you posted all look like they will work fine. Most backing plates are re-enforced for all the reasons I outline in my how-to book and you'll see more rivets holding the solid inner plate to the flexible outer plastic, epoxy or urethane material.



a6l3i said:


> How much did you feel heat-reduction ability of micro-hooks in Meg's pads or any improvements in results?


You won't see any difference as far as how the paint looks, the heat issue is all about causing any adhesives to give up prematurely. Heat is the enemy to the adhesives, and basically the entire backing plate.

The longer the distance between the pad and the actual surface of the backing plate enables wiggling or jiggling to take place and the more wiggling the more friction and the more friction the more heat.

By using micro-hooks and matching loop material you decrease the distance between the surface of the backing plate and the surface of the back of the buffing pad thus you reduce friction and thus heat.

Don't overcomplicate something very simple, that is don't make washing and waxing your car rocket science.

Millions of cars have been successfully buffed out with the people doing the buffing knowing nothing about hook & look material and even using mis-matched pads and backing plates.


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## a6l3i (Nov 4, 2011)

Great,,, thank you for in depth description. too informative and praiseworthy :thumb:
Now it's time to get ride of being freak and order a suitable combination.

Cheers . . .
Ali


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