# Vandalism (inc pic)



## raeno (May 4, 2010)

*Vandalism (inc pics) - update*

Hello to all.

This involves my GF's motor, a lovely 1999 2.8 Z3. All the problems started about 12months ago. She parks her car on a residential street & trains it to work. Upon returning to the car one night, she noticed her ariel was missing. I replaced it, putting it down to kids etc. Same thing happened another 4 times. Finally put an end to it by fitting an internal ariel, on the inside of the windscreen & plugged the old hole.

Whoever then stepped up their campaign, by attempting to rip off her windscreen wipers, failing at their task they just bent the arms/blades etc. At this point we thought it best to not park the car in the same location anymore & started parking outside my house, as I only live another 10min walk away from the residential st she originally parked in.

A few weeks passed, when they struck again, (this time the car was parked outside my house) twisting the wing mirrors round on themselves so they were pretty much facing backwards. Luckily this didnt cause as much damage as first thought & they still worked, albeit with a reduced range of motion.

Next was the weirdest: beetroot! It looked to be the pre-sliced disked variety, as most of the offending vegetable was still present on the bonnet/roof. Again, we were lucky with this & it left no damage.

So its been about 2-3months with nothing & last night she found this:










I haven't seen it personally (pic sent via MMS) but she is pretty sure its paint.

If it is paint, does anyone have any guidance for removal? Or is it a respray?

Goes without saying, I am fuming but concentrating my efforts on fixing the problem


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## bigmc (Mar 22, 2010)

Can't help with removal sorry but I'm gutted for you so understand how you must be feeling!


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Looks like tar to me. Give some tardis a go, then install a cctv camera on your house. You can get a cheap system from Argos and even costco. I've not suffered any vandlism or anything, but I'm seriously considering it.


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

Thats crazy, surely be able to trace it to someone. Use petrol to get the paint off.


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

In theory, I guess you *could* wet sand it away! tape all the surrounding blue paint, and go at it until the "foreign" paint starts dissappearing. Worse that could happen is a respray...

Before that, you could try thinners on a rag, or an aggresive clay


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## grayfox (Apr 15, 2008)

Good advice above - Id begin with Autosmart Tardis, if this removes a lot and just some small patches remain go with an aggressive clay, if the tardis has no effect Id try wetsanding like -Mat- suggests


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

My mates Mums car got paint thrown over it. Easy to remove with petrol, honestly. I know its being glanced over here there will be NO NEED to resort to wetsanding.


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

Spoony said:


> My mates Mums car got paint thrown over it. Easy to remove with petrol, honestly. I know its being glanced over here there will be NO NEED to resort to wetsanding.


No doubt you're right.... And hopefully petrol/tardis etc will be all that is required.... I was just throwing other ideas in as an alternative resort should the "basic" methods not work 

Order to try IMO:
Tardis
Petrol
Clay
Wetsand

not sure if I'd throw polishing in there between clay and wetsand. Depends what the substance is TBH, how thick it is etc...

Oh, try heating it aswell. However, be careful with heat and Petrol/Tardis :thumb:


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## Lakelord (Jun 30, 2007)

Looks like it's tar based to me too. If so, you may be able to get the majority off by applying some heat with a hot air gun (careful) or hair drier. Once the majority's removed, follow recommendations above, tar remover, clay, polish and wax.
Sorry you're having this grief. It really annoys me. One of the neighbours obviously has a problem with your GF using their street as a car park but why can't they discuss it rather than resorting to these cowardly acts?
Hope you get it sorted without too much grief.


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## johnnyguitar (Mar 24, 2010)

God almighty what's wrong with people? I would be staying up all night with a 6 cell Maglight and a breaker bar by the front door until I caught the feckers that were doing this.


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## Keir (Aug 31, 2010)

WTF is wrong with people, angry ex maybe?

Hope it gets sorted for you both (obviously the car is outside your house now, you don't want them to do anything else)


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

I would go with heat and tardis to start off with...

Petrol or WD40 (IIRC) will help if it's paint...

I'm guessing from the story that this happens during the day, as the car is parked at her own house at night?

Since it's now happening in your street, don't your neighbours know anything???

If the attacks have followed the car, from the old street to yours, then someone has a problem with your g/f... and ex maybe?

I would also think about calling the police, they *may* not do anything, but it's best to get it logged, just in case it starts to get worse....

Hope you get it all fixed anyway!

:thumb:


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

The Cueball said:


> If the attacks have followed the car, from the old street to yours, then someone has a problem with your g/f... and ex maybe?


I would say it's going to be someone who lives locally and has a problem with non residents parking their cars in the street. IMO it's going to be the same person that had been doing it before, it might even be some little old lady.

It's started off with some relatively low level easy to fix damage and has steadily started to increase up to a potential more permenant damage, indicationg to me the little **** knows what they're doing.

As the little ****s confidence is on the up, the damage will only get worse. Next could be the roof slashed or a full keying. The op needs to break the cycle of events and as stated the best way is a cheap cctv system. Yes you can film outside your own boundaries as long as it's your own property your filming. Your only problem would be if you start filming children.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Blazebro said:


> I would say it's going to be someone who lives locally and has a problem with non residents parking their cars in the street. IMO it's going to be the same person that had been doing it before, it might even be some little old lady.


I can see that, but if someone is annoyed at people parking in THEIR street, then why would they follow the car to do more damaged after it's away...?

Remember the car is now parked over a 10 minute walk away, so hardly going to be seen or annoy the original person...

Or maybe they are just that f***d up....

I mean, I had problems with people blocking my driveway, I even towed a car away, but once they move from MY bit, it's not my worry anymore...I didn't tow their car away when I saw it parked at the shops.....



:thumb:


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

for the simple reason the said person possibly walks the same route, or regularly walks the route where they come across the car. I would even go as far to say, the person is someone that the op see's regularly or even knows as a neighbour.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

Blazebro said:


> for the simple reason the said person possibly walks the same route, or regularly walks the route where they come across the car. I would even go as far to say, the person is someone that the op see's regularly or even knows as a neighbour.


Naw, that is a bit far fetched for me columbo!

:lol:

:thumb:


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

The Cueball said:


> Naw, that is a bit far fetched for me columbo!
> 
> :lol:
> 
> :thumb:


It's not far fetched, it's more reality than most would like to think. Most would like to think that there's some big issue behind it's causes and a personal vendetta. In reality it's some local idiot who has seen the vehicle being parked up and the driver walking off up the road. Possible has a grievence because when that person gets home, he can't park his car outside his/her house.

As said previously, the cycle of events can be broken very easily by installing a cheap cctv system.


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

just wire the car up to the nearest lamp post, anyone who touches it will be in for a shock


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## alan hanson (May 21, 2008)

i know in your post you said no1 was to get this sorted but surely prevention is the best means. this isnt kids etc as mentioned but someone who means business.

Would be gutted if it were me, but the after the wiper incident didnt you question it more?

Hope ya get is sorted asap and find out whos responsible and why


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## who45 (Feb 8, 2008)

looks like the local i hate people parking here and going on a train type behaviour, or is is specific at this car only or are there others targeted, did she notice others? - couple of days off work and a stakeout are the order of the day


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## kingtheydon (Aug 11, 2008)

Spoony said:


> Thats crazy, surely be able to trace it to someone. Use petrol to get the paint off.


LOL get CSI on the case


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## SNAKEBITE (Feb 22, 2010)

I'd try a bit of 4x2.

Not much good for removing stains but gets rid of other bits of ****.


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## raeno (May 4, 2010)

All good points people, thanks for all/any advice with removal of the black stuff (not 100% certain its paint as I havent seen it myself yet)

Regarding a jelous ex: possible but improbable as we've been 2gether for 7yrs. I know revenge is a dish best served cold but seems like a long enough time for him to get over it (ie why start doing things to her now, after such a long silence)

When she originally parked the car near the train station she was on the railway side ie no houses to park in front of. Its the road alot (30+ motors) of peeps use to park & then train to destination. Forgot to mention the damage started off as spitting on the car, which made me think of kids (the spitting was prior to the removal of the ariel). We never saw any other car effected when hers was damaged. 

None of my neighbours have seen anything. I have lived there for 18 years & get on with them all quite well (always say hello when we see each other).

I have a feeling its someone we both know, hope not but very much doubt its totally random. The damage does happen during the day, while we're at work. We have called the Police etc but doubt they will be able to help any further. I also believe its the same person that was originally damaging the car, as its only 10min walk away from the original location, its not that far fetched to summise they could of seen its new location & continued to cause damage (my house could even be considered "en route" to the train station). 

I hear what peeps are sayin re CCTV but we've already had to change our lives to suit the f**kwits/try to stop the abuse by parking away from the station (GF now has a 10min walk, in the dark during winter with the rain etc which worries me). My blood is boiling at spending time or money to restore the car, back to how it should be AND then swallow the cost of a CCTV system (I know they aint a huge cost but that isnt the point). Even if I install CCTV it wont stop them doing damage (but possible it could act as a deterant), just provides a "play by play" of how they did the damage. That being said, Im aware I have little other options (other than the stakeout). 

:devil:


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

A simple system is about £100 (Argos). It won't stop them, but increases your chances of getting them caught if it does continue. I'd cirtainly do it as it's plainly obvious the severity of the damage is increasing.


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## Neil M (Jan 28, 2007)

Blazebro said:


> A simple system is about £100 (Argos). It won't stop them, but increases your chances of getting them caught if it does continue. I'd cirtainly do it as it's plainly obvious the severity of the damage is increasing.


The point being, if you can catch them on video and they can be identified, the police will then be in a position to do something about it.

Video evidence goes a long way towards a prosecution, so I'd spend the £100 and look at it as a good investment.


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## RandomlySet (Jul 10, 2007)

raeno said:


> I hear what peeps are sayin re CCTV but we've already had to change our lives to suit the f**kwits/try to stop the abuse by parking away from the station (GF now has a 10min walk, in the dark during winter with the rain etc which worries me). My blood is boiling at spending time or money to restore the car, back to how it should be AND then swallow the cost of a CCTV system (I know they aint a huge cost but that isnt the point). Even if I install CCTV it wont stop them doing damage (but possible it could act as a deterant), just provides a "play by play" of how they did the damage. That being said, Im aware I have little other options (other than the stakeout).
> 
> :devil:


Is there no park and ride scheme near the station? or a secure car park to use?


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## raeno (May 4, 2010)

No park & ride or secure CP


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## one_question (Nov 12, 2008)

I'd be tempted to do CCTV too. I know that it costs money but how much will their next 'prank' cost you?

Get all four discreet cameras on your car and, if they do come back, get some stills made and post them in the window of your car, on the lampposts, the local church hall - everywhere.

Then give them a good kicking!

Some of the above advice is probably illegal for one reason or another - unfortunately.

What do you/your wife do for a living? You're not animal testers, or magistrates, or some other job that someone may have taken offence at? 

G


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## tomah (Sep 17, 2010)

As above, I was wondering about her job.

Or, could it be religious/racial?

Is the area well lit? If you had a digital video camera with a hard drive, and it only limited footage to the size of the hard drive, you could place it in the car (under a scarf or something inconspicuous) at the back facing front. Set it on a low quality video and you should get hours and hours of recording (although battery life may be an issue).

A cheap CCTV would be better, though.


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## apmaman (Jun 8, 2010)

Placing bear traps around the car to cover a 5m perimeter might also be an option.

Hope you can find out who is doing it, although I'd check out CCTV. Make sure you get one that has a good PQ. I've seen ones that use HD camera's now instead of the rather poor sub 1megapixel camera's.


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## tuggers (Mar 18, 2009)

Mate take a day off work, catch the ****ers and beta the livin daylights outta them!!

Where is this happening by the way?


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## Itchy (May 18, 2010)

Finding out what the substance is may give you some ideas who it may be that is doing it.


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## CAB (Oct 24, 2007)

Buy a little banger (£100ish).... and use that.... maybe jealous of the car.


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## Ross1308 (Sep 3, 2010)

Someone egged my citroen C2 when i had it, bonnet looked like someone threw stones at it and was never the same after, Luckily i had CCTV and seen who done it.... Whats goes around comes around. Or in their case has come around 

Hope you find who done it mate


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## Keir (Aug 31, 2010)

Are there any schools in the area?

It could be some kid who lives on your street on walks to school via your street and past the train station. Could be a petty grudge held by a kid, that she's something to.


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## raeno (May 4, 2010)

Got some more pics when I got home last night:










Thought I would have a feel of it, as it didnt look set or dried, which it wasnt.









You can see my finger mark top right of the black stuff.

More pics:




























At first I thought it was Tar, but it was still soft/pliable, kinda like plasticine. I was under the impression Tar needs to be heated for it to be pliable, then sets once cooled, anyone shed on light on this or has any idea what the hell this stuff is (could help with tracing the culprit(s). Underseal? Some form of sealent? Roofing product?

Regardless of what it is, it was removed by taking the majority off with a soft edged credit card (blockbuster video card), kinda scooping it off. Then removed the rest from the paintwork with AG Intensive Tar Remover.

So this morning Ive set up my digicam to record all day today, on the lowest quality setting (gives about 9hours), positioned inside an upstairs window, with a pretty good vantage view on the car/approaching area. Im gona look into CCTV this weekend.

In response to peoples questions:

Neither myself or my GF have a job that could be considered controversial. Both boring Office jobs. Cant see it being religious or racial either but you never know (we're both white & not religious). As far as changing the car............no way am I letting some ejit run my GF's life. She loves, well loved that car & I will do everything I can to stop the abuse/give her the freedom & safety everyone is due.


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## The Cueball (Feb 8, 2007)

^^ Glad you got it sorted out...

Very strange looking stuff....maybe some sort of sealant?!?!?!

Hope you catch the 

:thumb:


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## 1984clg (Sep 13, 2010)

Is it not nail varnish ! Hope you catch whoever it is anyway.


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Good call on the digicam. Don't loose faith in it and give it at least 3 months, before you consider stopping it. I can guarantee the moment you stop something else will happen.

Well done in getting it off.:thumb:


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## Alsone (May 19, 2010)

Some ideas:

http://www.henrys.co.uk/cctv/ircameras.htm

http://www.iviewcameras.co.uk/

There are also systems now apparently are using still cameras that take several pictures a second. The reason for this is that CCTV footage is really poor for identification because the quality of stills taken from CCTV is low.

However, a stills camera taking still as the rate of one every couple of seconds produces a time lapse view showing what happens but with high resolution perfect stills.

There's a web site here: http://www.pictureperfectcctv.com/

I know very little about the technology though.


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## Roswell (Aug 11, 2008)

Am i the only one thinking anti vandalism paint .. ironic if it is but that that stuff doesnt sent.


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Roswell said:


> Am i the only one thinking anti vandalism paint .. ironic if it is but that that stuff doesnt sent.


I think you may have hit the nail on the head there. It's still tar based so a tar remover would've sorted it. If it is it could've happend by accident.

Has anyone been putting this stuff on any fence panels where you live?


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## OzMoSiS (Jun 19, 2009)

With the state of the UK economy, and the rapidly rising unemployment rate, as well as the rising uneducated 'ASBO' benefit receiving population, attacks like this will only increase. (BTW I'm British, so I'm not being offensive in any way, just stating the ugly truth )

Its the fact that its a 'fancy' BMW Z3 that got them.

I feel for your GF mate, and thankfully it looks easy to remove and hasn't damaged anything. Be sure to post up pics of the clean-up :thumb:


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## OzMoSiS (Jun 19, 2009)

Blazebro said:


> I think you may have hit the nail on the head there. It's still tar based so a tar remover would've sorted it. If it is it could've happend by accident.
> 
> Has anyone been putting this stuff on any fence panels where you live?


If the case was so, an apology note would have been appreciated


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## stevengeelan (May 10, 2009)

Regarding CCTV, I'm pretty sure that it can't be used as evidence unless you clearly put up signs saying that CCTV is in operation. 

I would go for the stakeout option.


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## ksm1985 (Dec 27, 2008)

stay awake and wait for them to come along, 

baseball bat to the face


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## Rundie (Oct 2, 2007)

stevengeelan said:


> Regarding CCTV, I'm pretty sure that it can't be used as evidence unless you clearly put up signs saying that CCTV is in operation.


Catch some footage and then put the signs up before going to the police/court :thumb:


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## fozzy (Oct 22, 2009)

hope you get this sorted mate, nothing worse


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## apmaman (Jun 8, 2010)

If it was anti vandal paint that would of make your skin go black and be a bugger to remove off your skin......


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

stevengeelan said:


> Regarding CCTV, I'm pretty sure that it can't be used as evidence unless you clearly put up signs saying that CCTV is in operation.
> 
> I would go for the stakeout option.


Sorry complete rubbish. How many times do you think your caught on camera a day? and how many times have you seen any sort of sign?

Walk into your local supermarket and try and see one. I could take it to the extreme and say walk into a casino and look up at the ceiling.


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## Guest (Sep 30, 2010)

Blazebro said:


> Sorry complete rubbish. How many times do you think your caught on camera a day? and how many times have you seen any sort of sign?
> 
> Walk into your local supermarket and try and see one. I could take it to the extreme and say walk into a casino and look up at the ceiling.


Your wrong.

They will have signs (by law) stating that cctv is in operation.

You will find them on lamposts (might be miles away from the camera but since its public area it all counts) and in supermarkets near the entrance.


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

matt1263 said:


> Your wrong.
> 
> They will have signs (by law) stating that cctv is in operation.
> 
> You will find them on lamposts (might be miles away from the camera but since its public area it all counts) and in supermarkets near the entrance.


Go on then, post up the law. The only laws I'm aware of that govern CCTV are the Human rights act and Data protection. In neither does it state anything about a visible sign.


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## Guest (Sep 30, 2010)

Data Protection Act (1998) Law - Legal Requirements.

•Signs should be placed to warn that the public are entering an area covered by CCTV.
•The signs should be clearly visible and legible and will vary in size according to circumstances.
•Signs should give the identity of the person or organisation responsible for the scheme, contact details and the purpose of the scheme.
•It is permitted in extreme circumstances not to have signs, but this rule is subject to stringent conditions.

Taken from directgov :thumb:


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## Blazebro (May 18, 2007)

Probably most hide behind the 4th section and it does say should, not must.

Also worth a note on the same YouGov site:

The Data Protection Act does not apply to individuals’ private or household purposes. So if you install a camera on your own home to protect it from burglary, the Act will not apply


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## Roswell (Aug 11, 2008)

Covering your own property doesnt require signs, had this argument with a council a few years back, camera was clearly coving my property (car) parked on a public highway, intersting as the complaint was raised by the person i believed to be responcible for slashing 4 of my tyres and keying my car at the time ;-)


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## rich1880 (May 26, 2010)

Had a little experience of this, you can have a cctv camera focussing on your land without the need for any signs. 

Roswell - your camera wouldnt be stictly in line with the guidance as your camera is viewing the public highway which means people can be filmed without them knowing and would require a sign. If it was aiming onto your vehicle which was on a drive then that would be allowed. not picking at you there mate 

The fourth point in the data protection act where it referrs to extreme cases, these cases include terrorism or if police are carrying out an operation.

I have been unfortunate enough to have been in the middle of these arguments as part of my job!


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## Roswell (Aug 11, 2008)

No problem the local police had no issue with it nor the council however they had to make the complaint knwo to me and have a word, as you say not stricktly legit but it was the only available parking eg no drive, the council fast tracked me up the garage list due to the damage caused and i removed the camera, it surved its point of protecting my property and as such they couldnt take any action. 

My camera was located in such a way that over 90% of the frame view as of my car ;-) now if your just viewing one side of the car and 90% the public highway i can see a problem. 

So as long as your reasonable with your use you can do it is more the point, thankfully it also confirmed to me my prime suspect ;-)


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## VixMix (May 8, 2008)

One certain couple put a CCTV system up to film their car parked outside their house on the main road as they were having problems with vandalism and ended up filming a twisted witch dumping their pet cat in the wheelie bin! That woman has been charged with causing suffering to the animal and no-one ever mentioned that it may not have been legal to film her in the first place!


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## SteveOC (May 26, 2007)

I read stuff on the internet claiming that you can't have a CCTV camera installed in residential premises that overlooked any part of the public highway, but this does appear to be a misinterpretation of the law, as is the confusion over the requirements for signs etc.

The fact is, according to the law in the UK, it is not illegal to film in a public place for personal or non-commercial use, and there is no requirement to inform or obtain permission from passers-by who may be captured in footage, so why should filming a public place from a different vantage point be any different? 

Then, there seem to be exclusions to the non-commercial use caveat for photos/films taken for 'journalistic' purposes (or not for some police personnel -see next paragraph), as otherwise there would be very few photographs in newspapers if you think about it.

On a closely related topic, it is not surprising that the public don't know what is or isn't permissible as even the PCSO's, Police etc do seem to be ignorant of the laws on filming in public and have variously attempted to use S44 of the Terrorism Act 2000, and S14 and S15 of the Public Order Act to seize or delete film when in fact on a lot of occasions they have no right to do so. Recently, even S19 of PACE has been (mis)used for the purpose of seizing film taken in public. Despite the NPIA issuing guidelines for S44, the problems that continue have meant ACPO having to issue additional guidelines and still the problems continue.

I have on 2-3 occasions had somebody take aerial photographs of my back garden, one of which showed my family out in the garden in the sunshine. My garden is fully enclosed and only overlooked by a single window on a single property - with even that view obscured by trees - so have a very real expectation of privacy, yet somebody can point a telephoto lens onto my private property from above, for commercial gain, and the local Police / Council tell me they can't (be bothered to) do anything other than prosecute the firm if they don't have a hawkers licence to sell the photos door to door.

Given all of the above, I would happily point a CCTV camera onto the public highway outside my home and challenge anybody to demonstrate in law that I can't.

Steve O.


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## VixMix (May 8, 2008)

Indeed there is a lot written just now on Photography blogs about the whole legality issue as many people have fallen foul of overzealous police and security who are spouting utter lies about "the law". Check out I'm a photographer not a terrorist group on facebook for more info...


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