# Studio threads.



## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Hi all, right something has been puzzling me.

There is an apparent lack of interest and feedback in the Studio section (pro supporters) for the last couple of years, when compared to the Showroom threads and years gone by

From a personal perspective I would genuinely like to know what forum members would like to see or what changes could be made to gather more interest in the threads?

Maybe you just use the forum as a source of information?
Perhaps it's the just boring seeing a guy that details for a living showcase his work?
I'm just fishing really and trying to gain some feedback.

I have always welcomed and appreciated honest and true feedback, so please offer your constructive suggestions in regards to what (if anything) deters you posting.

Thanks you for your time.

Best regards

Rob.


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## davies20 (Feb 22, 2009)

"Perhaps it's the just boring seeing a guy that details for a living showcase his work"

This.

If its a rookie or amature showing off their work, then it interests me to see what joe blogs really can do.

Seeing a pro, with a nice unit, all the gear, plenty of space etc just takes the sparkle out of it!

Come round my garage, slide down the pile of kindling, then past my bike, past the kids toys & finally the freezer and do as good a job & I might give you a 'Thanks' lol

Nothing personal in all the above btw :thumb:


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

Hi Rob,
I think for a lot of people they think that sort of level is unattainable until they have paid their dues so to speak. This is just human nature. Maybe a few how to threads in the studio would raise a bit more interest, say a thread on stone chip removal but with a video so people can see the work in action. Now this is all dependant on time, resources and your work load but it might be something to think about. Or how to use the two bucket method by video, all could help new people get up to speed and draw more regular visitors in to the studio.
Just a thought :thumb:


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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

I think most amateurs are more interested in what other amateurs are doing. These threads lead to comments and chat that lead to more views, usually by the same people. 

It's about having things in common.


With the professional threads people just browse and don't feel as if they can offer an opinion. So they'll view, maybe say that's nice, then that's the end of it. I think most people still have a little nosy, especially if the car is something different.

The view count will be lower because there is no discussion. Most of the showroom threads with lots of views are threads that have been running for ages with updates.

I think most people still pop in for a nosy.


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## Prydar (Jul 22, 2015)

I find that restoration threads are more interesting than enhancements, I still like studio threads though you can pick up helpful tips from reading them


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

because there too adverty mucky car-clean car

Lack of whats actually done
Lack of indepth like gordon lee and dave kg used to do.
No real world cars all fancy what most people cant afford
all about the out side
Facebook many on there now as things move on
dw got too retail and scared people off was aimed more at the traders than the members
moderators are not as good as they used to be imo


could go on


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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

Personally I enjoy looking at the work of professionals, there's a lot to be learned there.

Perhaps what would be useful is some tips or tricks to make the work easier or the results better.

I also note that some posts say something along the lines of "the wheels were cleaned with a safe wheel cleaner", while this doesn't bother me, i'm always curious to know what the pro's are using, and is this something that I could add to my bag.

Just my thoughts, I'm sure others will have more thoughts.


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

I personally love seeing the work of you, Andy, Rob and G etc, it's nice to see awesome cars deserving the care and attention they deserve. 

It's worrying when you see some of the jobs by some 'pros' that aren't doing as good as some amateurs so when you see all you good guys threads it sort of restores confidence again


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## -Raven- (Aug 26, 2010)

Your threads are great Rob, how they all should be.

Unfortunately most of the pro threads are boring. Just one or two pics of a shiny car. No processes shown, no products used, no correction shots...... Why bother looking?


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

for me I love looking at the threads, but would love to know what products and pads have been used to obtain the finish.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

chrisc said:


> because there too adverty mucky car-clean car
> 
> Lack of whats actually done
> Lack of indepth like gordon lee and dave kg used to do
> ...


There are some things going on behind the scenes to bring certain types of things back but that is dependant on people contributing to the forum, i know Dave KG is tied up with his career right now but if someone else with the knowledge wanted to put articles forward for inclusion, i am sure they will be greatfully received.
dw got to retail. Well if someone sponsors the site, we can't really stop them from selling products or doing stuff to promote their shop or brand, that's just a side effect of having people sponsor sub forums, however i am sure that WHIZZER or johnnyopolis would disagree that it is all about the traders now and not the members.

As to the moderators not being as good as they used to be, a lot of the more active mods are new in the role due to others moving on, not wanting to take grief from people over stupid things, the same people bickering all the time. So give us a chance to grow with the role and maybe we might restore your faith in the moderating team .

I hope this has addressed some of your points without sounding like a 'I love DW' leaflet, yes the site has changed -even in the time i've been here - but unless people help to make it the way they want the site, it will take time to implement any changes and all we ask is that people are patient while we bring about any changes planned


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Thanks for your input guys, I suppose times have changed a little in the last 8 or 9 years, the studio did used to be a more active section. 
I did ask the same question as above back in 2009 and the consensus was not enough everyday car transformations.
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=127737

In a way prices have dictated the level of marque that comes through the doors, although many still require the same process, paint is paint.
I'll read through the comments this evening and make some replies etc.. but thanks for taking time so far to add feedback.


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Not much wrong with your Studio Threads Rob :thumbor your Showroom Threads Matty ) and I can only agree with the majority of what has been posted above, ie the Threads generally contain a few nice before and after photos and a complete lack of words! No description of the process, products used and difficulties encountered and how they were resolved, no technical content and nothing to be learnt from them. 

I appreciate that good Studio and Showroom Threads take a considerable amount of time and effort to write and upload but the detail is necessary to show and inspire young enthusiasts what is possible and push the bounds of our hobby.

I hope a solution can be found because I find myself surfing DW less and less these days due to the content.

Alan W


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## DJ X-Ray (Sep 2, 2012)

I do look, but rarely comment anymore. Although I suppose I should really if I see something that I rate.
Just gets a bit formulaic, with all the other " Nice work" "Good job" Stunning finish"etc.


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## Kotsos (May 7, 2011)

Your work is always great Rob.

These days most of studio threads looks like edvertisement for the brands pros are using instead of their work. I know that making write ups with dozens of pics it is so lengthy but most of people here are looking for information.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

All very valid points, if someone wants to do a 'How to' article on something, then i am sure WHZZER or johnnyopolis will be very appreciative.


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

I love DW leaflet :lol: cheered my ****e day up that


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

chrisc said:


> I love DW leaflet :lol: cheered my ****e day up that


I do my best to make people happy :thumb:


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

I honestly think Dw is just a quieter place now than it used to be. Its a vicious cycle i guess, put lots of effort in, place gets a bit more quiet so some put less effort in. Less effort put in means even less are on and looking/commenting and so it goes on. 
For sure there are on average half the threads there used to be, only a couple of years ago between my morning log in and evening catch up there would be 10-12 threads when i hit the "new post" button, now there will be 4, 5 max. 

There are so many Facebook pages now for detailing, and beading etc but there are SOOO many morons on there spouting rubbish i genuinely think DW will come good again. The cream will always rise to the top as they say and i think in the same place


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## Bevvo (Feb 1, 2013)

Could it be something as simple as where the Gallery section appears in the list? Gallery is almost half way down the very very long list of Topics so maybe people don't get that far down too often before something else catches the eye.
Why not switch Gallery with Waxstock in the running order? After all, Waxstock is only really topical for 2 or 3 months a year. It can always be moved back up the list each Spring.


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## Kimo (Jun 7, 2013)

stangalang said:


> I honestly think Dw is just a quieter place now than it used to be. Its a vicious cycle i guess, put lots of effort in, place gets a bit more quiet so some put less effort in. Less effort put in means even less are on and looking/commenting and so it goes on.
> For sure there are on average half the threads there used to be, only a couple of years ago between my morning log in and evening catch up there would be 10-12 threads when i hit the "new post" button, now there will be 4, 5 max.
> 
> There are so many Facebook pages now for detailing, and beading etc but there are SOOO many morons on there spouting rubbish i genuinely think DW will come good again. The cream will always rise to the top as they say and i think in the same place


I'm sure the Facebook scene will die off some time I imagine

There's only so many bandwagons and so much ****e that can be spouted

I find it funny watching the uneducated giving terrible advice to the even more uneducated


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## The captain (Sep 25, 2015)

I hope it's just me but today's the first time I've ever looked in the studio section, despite having browsed for a while before joining. Why? Because numpty here thought that when it said a paid subscription that meant me, and so I never bothered to click. Pretty sure not everyone's as daft as me though


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## jonnyw59 (Jan 31, 2009)

This is not directed at you personally. I find the pro write up's to be very generic these days. A few before during and after pics that give the impression they are maybe just thrown together for the sake of it just to have something posted. I know in depth posts take time and you pros have lives to lead and be getting on with as well. For us mere mortals we are on here for information so a little more information is appreciated, what prewash was used what pad polish combo and at what speed etc etc. The pros on here do great work no one would deny that, but some times its just nice to see Joe bloggs turn his daily driver around in his own garage. I think it can get a little boring always looking at Porsche's and top of the range BMW Audi etc. Lastly it maybe gets a little monotonous writing "good work" "great job" "lovely finish" etc etc there are only so many ways to say the same thing, so people just say nothing instead.

This is just my humble opinion so pro's please do not take offence.


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## Will_G (Jan 23, 2012)

As said before I think its due to lack of information from some of the threads. Lots of pretty pictures but a bit of text does the world of good. The ones Clark @ PB used to do were good. They spelled out every product used at each stage. He even spoke about what RPM he'd have the machine at and whether it needed stepped up at points. Personally I want to learn from the threads not just see pretty pictures


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## suds (Apr 27, 2012)

What's the difference (for viewers) between Studio, Showroom and International showroom? Expensive cars seem to receive very high viewings in the international showroom along with any popular cars (popular as in all time favourites and dare say whatever is currently "in fashion"). So exotic or expensive isn't a turn-off. Are the most popular threads generally the ones with most detail included? Put a Veyron in any section with lots of info and pics and I suspect the hit-rate will escalate! We shouldn't be concerned with the accompanying posts but the number of views...
Merge some sections, hold regular polls/competitions to vote car of the month, winner running in to car of the season and end with season winners going head to head for annual poll?
Personally when I read "studio" I expect detailed information otherwise how does it justify having a separate section?


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

Thanks guys for the constructive comments, and definately some food for thought moving on.:thumb:



muzzer42 said:


> Hi Rob,
> I think for a lot of people they think that sort of level is unattainable until they have paid their dues so to speak. This is just human nature. Maybe a few how to threads in the studio would raise a bit more interest, say a thread on stone chip removal but with a video so people can see the work in action. Now this is all dependant on time, resources and your work load but it might be something to think about. Or how to use the two bucket method by video, all could help new people get up to speed and draw more regular visitors in to the studio.
> Just a thought :thumb:


I'll look into producing some how to's in the coming months, a valid point though.



Kerr said:


> I think most amateurs are more interested in what other amateurs are doing. These threads lead to comments and chat that lead to more views, usually by the same people.
> 
> It's about having things in common.
> 
> ...


The discussion probably lies with "what or why did you choose that product" or "how did you achieve so and so"



chrisc said:


> because there too adverty mucky car-clean car
> 
> Lack of whats actually done
> Lack of indepth like gordon lee and dave kg used to do.
> ...


I'm not sure it got too retail, at the end of the day it costs someone's time etc.. to run & moderate it daily. Having manufacturers and professionals onboard is surely a good thing for the growth of the forum.
For me DW lost a lot of good members and the friendly banter. I met a lot of good friends in the early days and would often give up my time for various meets and demo's, it has sort of lost that vibe for now.



cossiecol said:


> Personally I enjoy looking at the work of professionals, there's a lot to be learned there.
> 
> Perhaps what would be useful is some tips or tricks to make the work easier or the results better.
> 
> ...


For me personally I try to list the jobs and products as often as possible, although it would lead to it's own discussion if someone replied with "what did you use". I had it this morning with someone asking about the interior proofing and leather products.



Kimo said:


> I personally love seeing the work of you, Andy, Rob and G etc, it's nice to see awesome cars deserving the care and attention they deserve.
> 
> It's worrying when you see some of the jobs by some 'pros' that aren't doing as good as some amateurs so when you see all you good guys threads it sort of restores confidence again





-Raven- said:


> Your threads are great Rob, how they all should be.
> 
> Unfortunately most of the pro threads are boring. Just one or two pics of a shiny car. No processes shown, no products used, no correction shots...... Why bother looking?


Raven & Kimo, thank you for your support.



justina3 said:


> for me I love looking at the threads, but would love to know what products and pads have been used to obtain the finish.


Just ask mate, I for one would be glad to share.



Alan W said:


> Not much wrong with your Studio Threads Rob :thumbor your Showroom Threads Matty ) and I can only agree with the majority of what has been posted above, ie the Threads generally contain a few nice before and after photos and a complete lack of words! No description of the process, products used and difficulties encountered and how they were resolved, no technical content and nothing to be learnt from them.
> 
> I appreciate that good Studio and Showroom Threads take a considerable amount of time and effort to write and upload but the detail is necessary to show and inspire young enthusiasts what is possible and push the bounds of our hobby.
> 
> ...


Thanks Alan, I'm probably guilty in some way of providing more detailed write-ups of late, I start of a detail with the best will in the world of capturing most stages, then get engrossed in the detail and start forgetting the pictures.



DJ X-Ray said:


> I do look, but rarely comment anymore. Although I suppose I should really if I see something that I rate.
> Just gets a bit formulaic, with all the other " Nice work" "Good job" Stunning finish"etc.


Yes indeed, whilst it's always nice for the comments, it doesn't gather much interest for the viewer.



Kotsos said:


> Your work is always great Rob.
> 
> These days most of studio threads looks like edvertisement for the brands pros are using instead of their work. I know that making write ups with dozens of pics it is so lengthy but most of people here are looking for information.


For me I do like to mention some of my brand supporters where necessary, its part and parcel of being accredited to a manufacturer/brand.



stangalang said:


> I honestly think Dw is just a quieter place now than it used to be. Its a vicious cycle i guess, put lots of effort in, place gets a bit more quiet so some put less effort in. Less effort put in means even less are on and looking/commenting and so it goes on.
> For sure there are on average half the threads there used to be, only a couple of years ago between my morning log in and evening catch up there would be 10-12 threads when i hit the "new post" button, now there will be 4, 5 max.
> 
> There are so many Facebook pages now for detailing, and beading etc but there are SOOO many morons on there spouting rubbish i genuinely think DW will come good again. The cream will always rise to the top as they say and i think in the same place


I'm of much the same opinion, I struggle to find interest after all these years in the industry, and it's more often than not the same questions. There is also a lack of friendliness, with more guys doing it for a living and not willing to share.



The captain said:


> I hope it's just me but today's the first time I've ever looked in the studio section, despite having browsed for a while before joining. Why? Because numpty here thought that when it said a paid subscription that meant me, and so I never bothered to click. Pretty sure not everyone's as daft as me though


ha ha nothing to stop you now.



jonnyw59 said:


> This is not directed at you personally. I find the pro write up's to be very generic these days. A few before during and after pics that give the impression they are maybe just thrown together for the sake of it just to have something posted. I know in depth posts take time and you pros have lives to lead and be getting on with as well. For us mere mortals we are on here for information so a little more information is appreciated, what prewash was used what pad polish combo and at what speed etc etc. The pros on here do great work no one would deny that, but some times its just nice to see Joe bloggs turn his daily driver around in his own garage. I think it can get a little boring always looking at Porsche's and top of the range BMW Audi etc. Lastly it maybe gets a little monotonous writing "good work" "great job" "lovely finish" etc etc there are only so many ways to say the same thing, so people just say nothing instead.
> 
> This is just my humble opinion so pro's please do not take offence.


Fair point and no offence taken here.



Will_G said:


> As said before I think its due to lack of information from some of the threads. Lots of pretty pictures but a bit of text does the world of good. The ones Clark @ PB used to do were good. They spelled out every product used at each stage. He even spoke about what RPM he'd have the machine at and whether it needed stepped up at points. Personally I want to learn from the threads not just see pretty pictures


Yes Clark always provided great threads, the product mentions also added as a marketing tool for the shop though, but hey who wouldn't.


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## wylie coyote (Jul 15, 2007)

I enjoy reading the studio threads, but agree with many of the comments above. One of the most frustrating things about many of them is that when there is discussion on the thread, people often ask questions but the pro doesn't answer as if the thread has been forgotten about. There seems to be a lack of connection between the pro and the rest of us...a little bit like we're an irritation to them in some ways

I think DW in general could do with a re-ordering of sections, perhaps even bringing some to more prominent positions depending on the time of year...


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## indyjukebox (Feb 20, 2011)

For me it is a lack of detail. There are only so many pictures you can look at.

Then a lack of standard cars rather than the ever so common Mcar/Audi/supercar.

We bought a run of the mill new car recently. Contacted 5 of the recommended detailers in the region. Had a budget of £550 to spend on a detail. Not one response. So it is quite clear that the pro's are only interested in exotica/expensive stuff. Indirectly it makes me less interested in what they do.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

indyjukebox said:


> For me it is a lack of detail. There are only so many pictures you can look at.
> 
> Then a lack of standard cars rather than the ever so common Mcar/Audi/supercar.
> 
> We bought a run of the mill new car recently. Contacted 5 of the recommended detailers in the region. Had a budget of £550 to spend on a detail. Not one response. So it is quite clear that the pro's are only interested in exotica/expensive stuff. Indirectly it makes me less interested in what they do.


That honestly amazes me! Work is work, and if someone has the passion to want it doing that is more than enough. Not wanting you to name and shame, but what area and what car? Just out of personal curiosity?


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

I stopped posting in the studio and well DW all together a few years ago. 

When I used to do the studio posts I did full step by step pictures and descriptions and put a lot off effort in but it did add a lot of time to the details as well as extra time when I got home to do the write up. But I started to get a bit annoyed and put off posting when detailing threads became more about how good of a photographer you were rather than how good a Detailer! 

Then it was all the "rules" getting told off for posting in the wrong section or mentioning the wrong products etc etc. but again this is detailing in general not just dw. I've recently been banned from detailing addicts on Facebook as I know what I'm talking about and was happy to help people. It does seem all detailing places would rather amateurs told people absolute rubbish than let pros tell them the truth. 

I have also noticed a huge drop in studio action and that's the reason I've never signed back up on here and them the reason I very rarely post as I don't want to get in trouble for not being paid up. 

The other big difference I see in he studio is a lot of the threads in there are absolute crap! A pic of a dirty car then a dozen pics of a clean car and no reasoning of how it got there? 


Kids if you want to see good studio threads go back 4-6 years and look at what the pros did then. They were PROPPER write ups.


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## m1pui (Jul 24, 2009)

wylie coyote said:


> I think DW in general could do with a re-ordering of sections, perhaps even bringing some to more prominent positions depending on the time of year...


I've thought this for some time and said it on occasions too. There's too many sub-forums/sub-sub-forums so inevitable I just use the "New Posts" button and usual get and "ah god" feeling if I need to click through sub sections to try and find something.

Other reasons I think, some which have already been said;
- People browsing on Phones/Tablets can't be bothered scrolling through umpteen pictures on a small screen.
- Facebook
- Forum is generally quieter


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

Another thing that I've found and it seems to be mentioned a lot. Is the sheer amount of 

Forum topics and sub forums and sub sub topic forums with a hidden floor that goes to a submarine topic! 

It has got harder and harder to find anything on here anymore. 

Why not just have a gallery for details? Just one! Where pros and amateurs can post threads in harmony.


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

Simple reason why we have seperate sections for amateurs and pros is because the pros pay to post their work and as such do require a seperate section. How would we weed out the blatant pros trying to sneak under the radar otherwise?


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

-Kev- said:


> Simple reason why we have seperate sections for amateurs and pros is because the pros pay to post their work and as such do require a seperate section. How would we weed out the blatant pros trying to sneak under the radar otherwise?


This reply makes absolutely no sense what so ever?

Would it not make it easier for you if you only had 1 section to police?

I'd like a pro to post in the showroom instead of the studio and gauge if there was more interest in there.


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

It makes plenty of sense, the pros pay to advertise and have a dedicated section. Imo its easier for us to watch two sections as one single section would be way too busy - threads would soon be pushed onto the next page and missed


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

This is also another problem with all he detailing community's not just here. 

Instead of welcome "pro" detailers and encouraging there Input and wisdoms for the members they are shunned unless they pay to be around. But people who sit at there computer all day and spout a load of bol lox about detailing having never actually done it are welcomed with open arms. 

I understand having to pay to advertise but maybe a pay per post in the studio. Would work better than a blanket payment plan for the year. 

If you had to pay per thread posted in there you would also make sure you were only posting good material in there and wouldn't think well I've paid for the year so I best get my money worth and just post in there every time I pick up a mitt


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

-Kev- said:


> It makes plenty of sense, the pros pay to advertise and have a dedicated section. Imo its easier for us to watch two sections as one single section would be way too busy - threads would soon be pushed onto the next page and missed


So you currently just need to police the showroom?


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## nappy (Oct 3, 2006)

From the view counter. A lot of people have a look, but might not comment. As you end up getting shot down by someone or alternately it ends up in a battle of the products debate. 

That's why I don't comment or even log in sometimes. As what you type is not private and all can see


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

indyjukebox said:


> For me it is a lack of detail. There are only so many pictures you can look at.
> 
> Then a lack of standard cars rather than the ever so common Mcar/Audi/supercar.
> 
> We bought a run of the mill new car recently. Contacted 5 of the recommended detailers in the region. Had a budget of £550 to spend on a detail. Not one response. So it is quite clear that the pro's are only interested in exotica/expensive stuff. Indirectly it makes me less interested in what they do.





stangalang said:


> That honestly amazes me! Work is work, and if someone has the passion to want it doing that is more than enough. Not wanting you to name and shame, but what area and what car? Just out of personal curiosity?


I'm inclined to agree with Matt, that is quite amazing that nobody responded to your enquiry, most of my new car prep are on run of the mill cars, and I enjoy them equally as much as any supercar. Also £550 is a fair budget and pretty much on the money for coatings.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

nicp2007 said:


> So you currently just need to police the showroom?


We have to police all sections of the forum not just one particular section, kev's point is pretty valid. It's easier to observe any paid pros posting their work in the showroom and redirect them to the studio. 
Anyway, getting this back on topic, maybe some of our professional supporters could get together to do a series of how to articles rather than just one person. Say Rob at Gleammachine could do a how to wash and dry your car article, with pics and or video. Then maybe stangalang could do a how to decontaminate your car properly etc. 
Not sure how many paid professionals would be open to this but it would give the average person some insight into how pros do their work and also helps anyone new to detailing to get a better idea of what they can acheive.

Just a suggestion


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## Blackmondie (Mar 13, 2011)

Haven't read it all, so could be said already,

Personally I love the pro's thread, but you can't comment on it and give advice.

Also an amateur uses wax A today and next thread sealant B and so on. Pro's tend to use the same brand and products every time. So you almost know what they are using.

Next is the coating stuff. Lot's of pro's use coatings these days. I miss some nice wax threads. But I understand that for the money people pay, they want longer protection.

Hope this helps
BM


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## Toto (Oct 6, 2014)

As a fellow pro Rob your threads are great nice unit nice cars and your work is second to none. I personally would like to see you do a real minger inside and out no machine work just a good old fashioned valet just to show some of the rookies on here how it's done by a pro.


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## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

For me I generally look at the Studio, but don't comment because:

A - nobody answers any questions, I'm still waiting for someone to reply regarding using a spray gun to apply fabric protection. But they can reply to people saying how good the work is.

B- do you really need people to say how wonderful everything is? If I like the detail I just use the thanks button :thumb:

C- Photography, it can really make a thread and imho phone pics just don't cut it, you don't need a Canon 5D. But a half decent camera can be had for pretty cheap these days.


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

nappy said:


> From the view counter. A lot of people have a look, but might not comment. As you end up getting shot down by someone or alternately it ends up in a battle of the products debate.
> 
> That's why I don't comment or even log in sometimes. As what you type is not private and all can see


I think thats the case, people look but don't/won't/can't comment, nobody should be shot down for asking a question, no matter how basic it may seem.



Blackmondie said:


> Haven't read it all, so could be said already,
> 
> Personally I love the pro's thread, but you can't comment on it and give advice.
> 
> ...


Thanks BM, it does get a bit "same old" with the products, the only difference is typically the LSP.



Toto said:


> As a fellow pro Rob your threads are great nice unit nice cars and your work is second to none. I personally would like to see you do a real minger inside and out no machine work just a good old fashioned valet just to show some of the rookies on here how it's done by a pro.


Thanks mate, much appreciated. 
I'd happily valet/detail a "minger" but I rarely ever get that type of business.



Alex L said:


> For me I generally look at the Studio, but don't comment because:
> 
> A - nobody answers any questions, I'm still waiting for someone to reply regarding using a spray gun to apply fabric protection. But they can reply to people saying how good the work is.
> 
> ...


Thanks Alex.

A: Many don't answer questions, nobody is everyone and I definately respond to all questions.

B: No I'm not looking for praise, or my lack of ego to be inflated. But if a thread has say 10000 views, 10-12 comments and 3-4 Thanks, in a way it reflects poorly for visitors or potential customers viewing the forum. 
Why have so many of the Pro's from 4-8 years ago disappeared from a forum that advertise's to a direct audience, I know most are still trading?

C: I certainly agree Alex, some phones do take quality pictures though, it all depends whether you can see the true shot.


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## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

Gleammachine said:


> A: Many don't answer questions, nobody is everyone and I definately respond to all questions.
> 
> *That was aimed at a few, but probably over generalised on my part *
> 
> ...


And a lot does come down to how much people like a certain car, me personally as I've gotten older I've gone off Japanese cars, so tend not to look as much. 5/10 years ago I would have been all over them.


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## Franzpan (Mar 2, 2009)

Yeah I would rather look at showroom threads rather than the pro studio. Not that I don't enjoy looking at the studio threads, its just a lot of them seem to have a gazillion photos of swirly pannels 'before' and then another gazilion of 'after' shots. Very few show an in depth look at the decontamination process.

I'd also rather see a ten year old Mondeo thats in a real state turned around than a six month old Ferrari with a few little swirls.


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

chrisc said:


> because there too adverty mucky car-clean car
> 
> Lack of whats actually done
> Lack of indepth like gordon lee and dave kg used to do.
> ...


Chris can i just ask Why do you still visit DW then ???


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

Gleammachine said:


> Hi all, right something has been puzzling me.
> 
> There is an apparent lack of interest and feedback in the Studio section (pro supporters) for the last couple of years, when compared to the Showroom threads and years gone by
> 
> ...


Rob bear with us we have something planned for this - its going to take a bit of time and effort but I think it will help you and the pros on DW a lot -


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

stangalang said:


> I honestly think Dw is just a quieter place now than it used to be. Its a vicious cycle i guess, put lots of effort in, place gets a bit more quiet so some put less effort in. Less effort put in means even less are on and looking/commenting and so it goes on.
> For sure there are on average half the threads there used to be, only a couple of years ago between my morning log in and evening catch up there would be 10-12 threads when i hit the "new post" button, now there will be 4, 5 max.
> 
> There are so many Facebook pages now for detailing, and beading etc but there are SOOO many morons on there spouting rubbish i genuinely think DW will come good again. The cream will always rise to the top as they say and i think in the same place


A few stats from the last few months for you

New Registrations

June 872
July 1008 
Aug 558

Average of 800+ members a month joining

New Posts
June 18633
July 22028
Aug 20565

New thread started 
June 1444
July 1722
Aug 1577

Bearing in mind this is supposed to be the quiet times on the forum ...

I dont know any facebook page that can boast figures like that


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## PaulN (Jan 17, 2008)

I love the simple stand Studio threads...... I loved PolishedBliss's old threads.... the work, work shop and photos were amazing.... i dont like a video or other things, just love looking through the whole detailing process via pics.

I think the Pros work and making the time to post them up is amazing.... 

Keep up the great work guys.

Paul


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## Megs Lad (Nov 27, 2012)

I love the studio threads but I do find that a lot do feel a little commercial like as if there more of a quick few snaps and a bit of write up to promote your business and work (which is essentially what they are for )but this is were they differ from the showroom, as an amateur I can relate to the showroom a lot more, I feel that the studi section and me are way too far apart my last detail mainly consisted of my pressure washer constantly popping fuses the dog escaping from the house every time I opened the door and constantly battling with the mass amount of leaves falling all over my car 

There is some great detailers in the studio and Its incredible what some can do and the knowledge and enthusiasm they have but I just feel that sometimes once you've seen a few threads on the studio you've seen em all 

Just my opinion


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

PaulN said:


> I love the simple stand Studio threads...... I loved PolishedBliss's old threads.... the work, work shop and photos were amazing.... i dont like a video or other things, just love looking through the whole detailing process via pics.
> 
> I think the Pros work and making the time to post them up is amazing....
> 
> ...


This really sums it up for me alsoWhen polishedbliss use to do a studio thread it was in depth every detail of what it took from start to finish,what products was used the techniques etc...and superb pictures.But more recently it went from the car no wash pictures,just the odd polishing shot then a couple finishing "Money Shots" and that's it.I love a whole procedure detail,even though I know how to detail proper alreadyI still love reading the "real" pros methods technique s and products used.SJ.


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## Naranto (Apr 5, 2007)

I just browse now when I see a car that interests me.

Once asked a genuine question regarding how they clean behind wheels when they are still on the cars and was met with some less than friendly replies. As many say the 'Showroom' is a much more interesting and friendly place to be.. or maybe not.


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## wylie coyote (Jul 15, 2007)

stonejedi said:


> This really sums it up for me alsoWhen polishedbliss use to do a studio thread it was in depth every detail of what it took from start to finish,what products was used the techniques etc...and superb pictures.But more recently it went from the car no wash pictures,just the odd polishing shot then a couple finishing "Money Shots" and that's it.I love a whole procedure detail,even though I know how to detail proper alreadyI still love reading the "real" pros methods technique s and products used.SJ.


So perhaps it would be worth DW surveying the Pros to see if, in return for paying a little less they would undertake to post at least 2 in depth details a year - showing every stage and product? Those who just want to advertise and post up a more 'commercial' before and after could pay the full amount as now...?


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

WHIZZER said:


> A few stats from the last few months for you
> 
> New Registrations
> 
> ...


Not arguing about the "stats" bill, but facts are facts. Some FB pages i can hardly keep up with the new threads on the go, here i would say that there is 50% LESS in the "new posts" section than only a couple of years ago. But i stand by what i said, the Fb pages is 90% BS, a lot of people just trying to look better than they are whilst ripping off others ideas. I still feel that more "quality" does and will always come through here. DW is still for me THE place to come to. But it doesn't change the fact there are a lot less threads being created and replies being submitted. Im sure most users who have been on for more than a minute will agree.

Detailing is seasonal, and the world has a way of working in waves though and again i stand by what i said before, i think it WILL come back round and Dw will return from being a place that many use purely as a selfish resource and more as a place to share and help, and display genuine innovation for others to use


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## chrisc (Jun 15, 2008)

WHIZZER said:


> Chris can i just ask Why do you still visit DW then ???


Because i like comeing on still just think it needs issues sorting out


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## justina3 (Jan 11, 2008)

Will_G said:


> Personally I want to learn from the threads not just see pretty pictures


me to :thumb:


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

wylie coyote said:


> So perhaps it would be worth DW surveying the Pros to see if, in return for paying a little less they would undertake to post at least 2 in depth details a year - showing every stage and product? Those who just want to advertise and post up a more 'commercial' before and after could pay the full amount as now...?


See I generally put a fairly decent write up together once or twice a month if I feel it has enough quality pictures, others in that section will post every car they do and flood the section. They then wait for someone to comment and add a cheers mate reply and bump their thread to the top. The average viewer in the studio will only read down the list to about 3 or 4 cars, and then before you know it your thread has gone into obscurity, many of the pros won't comment on other pro's work (comparable to a few years back).
Like I mentioned there is a lack of etiquette or mutual respect nowadays, and sorry if I keep harping on "the good old days". Everyone is a detailer or knows someone that is, and obviously because it's more mainstream.. a victim of its own success.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

As Bill said, there are plans to bring new content to the site in general, we just need time and patience/support. Watch this space as they say :thumb:


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

wylie coyote said:


> So perhaps it would be worth DW surveying the Pros to see if, in return for paying a little less they would undertake to post at least 2 in depth details a year - showing every stage and product? Those who just want to advertise and post up a more 'commercial' before and after could pay the full amount as now...?


I don't think that this particularly should be about fee's,I just think that 90% of users of this site are hobbyists detailer's like myself,who simply enjoy keeping their cars clean and finding out what easy to use products work in real life conditions,and it's nice when the pros share some of their knowledge as it then feels that they are giving back to the DW community so to speak,but saying that they are not to bad on here thoughWith companies opening up there doors to us and the excellent bouncers&ODK Spellbound day which was fun to be apart of.I just think the more we all put in is the more we will all get back,if you get my drift.SJ.


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

Gleammachine said:


> Hi all, right something has been puzzling me.
> 
> There is an apparent lack of interest and feedback in the Studio section (pro supporters) for the last couple of years, when compared to the Showroom threads and years gone by
> 
> ...


As a pro, Im too busy working on vehicles or doing R & D work to spend time looking at other guys work on a forum 
Facebook and future social media sites will replace forums totally

people love to see new things and if you don't provide that by doing something new, different or unique, eventually the interest wanes.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Dream Machines said:


> As a pro, Im too busy working on vehicles or doing R & D work to spend time looking at other guys work on a forum
> Facebook and future social media sites will replace forums totally
> 
> people love to see new things and if you don't provide that by doing something new, different or unique, eventually the interest wanes.


BookfaceIt might be a good PR tool for businesses,but its not a medium that I have ever used or will ever use.Big brother in disguise.SJ.


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## m1pui (Jul 24, 2009)

Gleammachine said:


> B: No I'm not looking for praise, or my lack of ego to be inflated. But if a thread has say 10000 views, 10-12 comments and 3-4 Thanks, in a way it reflects poorly for visitors or potential customers viewing the forum.
> Why have so many of the Pro's from 4-8 years ago disappeared from a forum that advertise's to a direct audience, I know most are still trading?


I'd counter that the majority on here aren't an audience to advertise to. Probably 90% of the people on here are here because they want to do it, or learn how to do it, themselves. So they aren't casting an eye over the Studio to audition someone to detail their car.

Stick it on your FaceBook page and you will get clients liking/sharing it and potential clients asking about it.


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

m1pui said:


> I'd counter that the majority on here aren't an audience to advertise to. Probably 90% of the people on here are here because they want to do it, or learn how to do it, themselves. So they aren't casting an eye over the Studio to audition someone to detail their car.
> 
> Stick it on your FaceBook page and you will get clients liking/sharing it and potential clients asking about it.


That's a valid point but the amount of threads i've seen recently where some of the newer members have asked the same question regarding what part of the process they want to learn

"How do i do/clean/get rid of/apply this?"

So there is still the audience on dw for knowledge and they see the professional detailers as the guys who know, for obvious reasons. Maybe social media is part of the future but it isn't the only thing we can use. The Studio still has a big part to play, it just needs a little bit of thought and maybe a few ideas to give it new impetus and as WHIZZER mentioned earlier, things are in the pipeline to facilitate that


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## SPARTAN (Nov 20, 2014)

stonejedi said:


> BookfaceIt might be a good PR tool for businesses,but its not a medium that I have ever used or will ever use.Big brother in disguise.SJ.


Couldn't agree more SJ. :thumb:


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## nicp2007 (Apr 25, 2007)

Gleammachine said:


> See I generally put a fairly decent write up together once or twice a month if I feel it has enough quality pictures, others in that section will post every car they do and flood the section. They then wait for someone to comment and add a cheers mate reply and bump their thread to the top. The average viewer in the studio will only read down the list to about 3 or 4 cars, and then before you know it your thread has gone into obscurity, many of the pros won't comment on other pro's work (comparable to a few years back).
> 
> Like I mentioned there is a lack of etiquette or mutual respect nowadays, and sorry if I keep harping on "the good old days". Everyone is a detailer or knows someone that is, and obviously because it's more mainstream.. a victim of its own success.


I was the same I only really tried to post interesting threads and keep them in depth. One thing that annoys me about the studio now is the amount of times you see the same names popping up and all they've done is a mini valet to 20 cars that week and posted a pic of each in its own thread.

One of my most popular threads was a ford fiesta!! As people could relate to it and it was actually a mammoth job.


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

chrisc said:


> Because i like comeing on still just think it needs issues sorting out


Then please in the future follow the rules with regards to the forum and its staff



> Please do not question the moderation of the forum (or the moderating decisions) on the open forum (if you have a query contact a moderator/ admin via pm), Doing so could result in a ban. You must not post a complaint about identifiable users, DW moderators or moderating action. If you are concerned about a moderating decision, posts or communications from a moderator, the forum rules or another user's behaviour /profile/post/private message, please use the Report Message Link.


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## wylie coyote (Jul 15, 2007)

stonejedi said:


> I don't think that this particularly should be about fee's,I just think that 90% of users of this site are hobbyists detailer's like myself,who simply enjoy keeping their cars clean and finding out what easy to use products work in real life conditions,and it's nice when the pros share some of their knowledge as it then feels that they are giving back to the DW community so to speak,but saying that they are not to bad on here thoughWith companies opening up there doors to us and the excellent bouncers&ODK Spellbound day which was fun to be apart of.I just think the more we all put in is the more we will all get back,if you get my drift.SJ.


I was thinking how we might encourage more Pros to post detailed details. Surely we see two types of pro posting - those who want to advertise their business and show how good they are, and those who are maybe 'enthusiast' Pros......perhaps they started up as a result of DW rather than just thinking it was a good business to be in.
May be worth the mods starting a poll so that users can vote for what they would like to see and be more inclusive as you say SJ.:thumb:


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## -Kev- (Oct 30, 2007)

chrisc said:


> Because i like comeing on still just think it needs issues sorting out


Please elaborate further by pm to one of us, we do accept critisim and use it to improve the forum where possible


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## m1pui (Jul 24, 2009)

muzzer42 said:


> That's a valid point but the amount of threads i've seen recently where some of the newer members have asked the same question regarding what part of the process they want to learn
> 
> "How do i do/clean/get rid of/apply this?"
> 
> So there is still the audience on dw for knowledge and they see the professional detailers as the guys who know, for obvious reasons. Maybe social media is part of the future but it isn't the only thing we can use. The Studio still has a big part to play, it just needs a little bit of thought and maybe a few ideas to give it new impetus and as WHIZZER mentioned earlier, things are in the pipeline to facilitate that


You've sort of just repeated what I've said and missed the point what I was getting at.

Gleammachine has put it across that the studio should, in theory, get more attention because it' "advertises to a direct audience" when my opinion is that we are more a like minded audience than one to be selling yourself to.

Like you and I both said, people are coming on here asking "how to.." which is not "I'm looking for a detailer to..." and from that, there are other specific sections that are more relevant to ask a question.

Social media is a massive part of the present. To say it's only part of the future is way behind the times. Valeters/Detailers always say that huge parts of their business growing is word of mouth but the reality is that word of mouth now is shares and likes on Facebook, twitter, instagram, etc more than it is someone passing on a business card.

The Studio section is by it's own definition a place to "display their work for viewing" so maybe it's not the first instinct for someone to ask a lot of questions and start a discussion. They might feel they're dragging the thread away from it's intended origin and, lets be honest, there are a lot of people with differing opinions on here so there's also chance for it to descend into people disagreeing with a bickering war on a thread that is meant to promote.

In my opinion the Studio is all about Likes/Thanks and "Good Work" and a bit of drooling over exotica car porn. If you want interaction and discussion, then the detailer need to pose a question of give something to discuss. Just saying something like 'any critique welcome' isn't really going to get anything going.

As someone that's in the hospitality industry, I know how hard it is to get people to publicly pat you on the back using their own initiative. If you're getting 1,000 views and a handful of positive responses, then that's a lack of interaction rather than interest. Just take it you're doing a grand job! :thumb:


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## mayhem85 (May 8, 2012)

I do enjoy the studio threads, but do get envious of the pros with all the latest tools and equipment, nice studios and products that would take me months to save for. But as it is their source of income i can understand why they have a vast array of items. Id be happy for a driveway atm lol. The studio threads are very useful as to see how far you can go with detailing, but for some people like myself it will just not be possible to to achieve the results that some others do., due to various situations. It would be nice to see some more pros and like gleammachine said a bit more mutual respect from people, some threads over the last few months have gone a bit astray in the comments. I came off fb due to the lack of respect by some people in comments.


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## Dream Machines (Mar 13, 2006)

one thing that is always a preference for me is videos, combining photos and text with a few videos on a thread would be good for sure


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## suds (Apr 27, 2012)

M1pui has hit the money Rob. The Studio is billed for showcasing your work. As to why fewer comments are now being left, I guess apart from reasons already offered, the main change has been in demographics and how communications are currently conducted. Traditional conversation was replaced by txt speak which is now being replaced by communicating solely with emojis. The market is now more fast paced than ever with the majority of viewers just wanting to dip in and out. (As an aside, Social media professionals recognized that the most productive communications were by infographics which are now supported by Brand ambassadors promoting businesses by building relationships with communities).
If you can't beat 'em.... Perhaps swapping thanks for likes and introduce share buttons for favourite photos/posts is worth trying as M1pui said. The future of this forum will not reply on people like me and my seagull feather quill pen 
And to prove the point I've had to write this 3 times because I was timed out


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## ColinG (Jan 20, 2013)

I personally love the Studio threads you Pros do a great job and I'm sure the majority of us amateurs are in awe of the quality of the finish you guys can achieve.

I hear and agree with some of the other comments as to why people either don't visit or comment, I don't think it's in anyway to do with the quality of the work.

Personally I don't agree that Facebook etc will ultimately replace Forums, I'm not and have never been on Facebook but maybe I'm just old... A dedicated forum would always be my preference.

I've not been around all that long so not sure what else happened in the good old days, particularly in the Studio section? I'm getting a sense that maybe the community was more intimate with a more regular or committed group of pros and amateurs alike?

To admins, mods and pros keep up the good work, interested to hear and see some of the future changes Whizzer and Muzzer alluded to. Having just visited the the Autoglym visit thread, maybe some of the pros could do something similar if anyone was up for it?

Cheers,
Colin.


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## Alan W (May 11, 2006)

Nice post suds! :thumb:

Alan W


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## suds (Apr 27, 2012)

Btw, Interaction on the forum can be increased dramatically - given that at any one time only 16% of users are logged in, is it possible to enable the thanks/like button for "guests"? Alternatively would it risk losing too much revenue by insisting everyone logs in for each visit?


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## muzzer (Feb 13, 2011)

There is more to come on the Autoglym front and the other thing will take a bit of time but hopefully will be something amazing for the forum


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## Prism Detailing (Jun 8, 2006)

Studio threads used to be interesting, detailers would spend time explaining what they did step by step, the challenges involved and how they were overcome. New products were showcased or tested for everyone to see and then discuss, but times have changed...

Why am i not a supporter anymore? because i dont have time to write long detailed threads. 

Also back in the day people were willing to discuss techniques etc...but I think people (including myself) want to keep our own techniques to ourselves....why ? scrutiny from those who are hero worshipped by the forum could be one or maybe because its a technique thats be developed over time and detailers feel thats their "edge" over competition...the list could go on.

The market place has changed, businesses probably dont get as much traffic via here, so whats the point in investing the money for no return as people on here want to detail themselves not have someone detail their cars and if anyone asks for a detailer usually the same names are mentioned...again for a business sense, whats the point.

As for non pro's, I think people are not posting because of the lack of interaction/engagement within the posts. A bunch of pics of nice work on a nice car is only that...nice.


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