# top coat lifting



## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

Hi Guys, 
im after some advice. as title say, my top coat lifted after applying last layer of 2k clear coat.

after painting finished, ive 800 wet whole piece again, used isopropyl alcohol to remove all grease, only lightly cos ive noticed that its still dissolving the paint. 
when dry, ive applied two coats of k2 clear, and at the morning it was beautiful. 
it only had a slight orange peel and couple of small areas of lifting, but i thought, one more sanding with 1000 wet, dry off, alcohol wipe, let it air for about 10 mins, and last 2k clear coat would make it look ace. 
However, 30 seconds after last clear coat, whole top coat lifted horribly. 
any ideas what went wrong?
ive attached some pics, you can also see on the table sanded pieces before last (third) clear coat and there was no wrinkling.

cheers
joe


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## Andyblue (Jun 20, 2017)

I'm not a painter, but that looks like either a reaction or contamination...

Wondering if the sanding / cleaning etc you did with the alcohol has done something to the base coat and solvents etc still present when you re-applied lacquer ???

Does look like you're going to have to start ffrom scratch again, unfortunately...


Oh, and welcome to DW :thumb:


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## SamD (Oct 24, 2015)

Once you apply base coat you shouldn’t be sanding or using water/grease removing products these stages should be done before base coat.

You’ve pretty much wet your base coat and applied clear over wet paint and this causing it’s fry up in such a way.

You need to start again unfortunately.


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## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

thanks guys, i know i need to start again, dont have skin on my fingers from sanding no more. 

*"Once you apply base coat you shouldn't be sanding or using water/grease removing products these stages should be done before base coat.
You've pretty much wet your base coat and applied clear over wet paint and this causing it's fry up in such a way."*

this sort of make sense thinking of it. the good finish at the morning was when white part was glossy one. so basically ive contaminated the coats with water/alcohol ? 
would it helped if I would leave it for day or two to dry before applying another coat?

i sort of need to sand in between to remove impurities and high spots from using the masking tape, and I thought that it is a normal practice to fine sand clear coat to remove the "orange" peel look and apply one more clear to make it smooth gloss?

generally it take me few days to finish my pieces, hence degreasing sanding process. 
what i do is: 
key and degrease the piece, apply primer (base) , smooth sand, because im touching it while sanding im degreasing it before top coat (actual paint), then if i leave day or few in between top coats again bit of sanding and degreasing, and sanding high spots if i use masking tape, degrease because again im touching the piece, and clear coat.

im not a painter by any means, so if my process is wrong please correct me but this seems to be the way in youtube videos, they just dont say how long between the coats and that sanded paint will suck up the water...

cheers 
joe


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## Sicskate (Oct 3, 2012)

I agree with the above, but I'll also add that you're window for coats had closed as it looks like it hasn't bonded on. 

If you do decide to, maybe you'd be better off using a grey scotch instead of 1000 and giving it a good wipe down with a tack rag. 

Sent from my COR-L29 using Tapatalk


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## SamD (Oct 24, 2015)

Using gloves, tack rag and keeping your work area clean should lower the risk of dirt in your base coat.


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## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

Sicskate said:


> I agree with the above, but I'll also add that you're window for coats had closed as it looks like it hasn't bonded on.
> 
> If you do decide to, maybe you'd be better off using a grey scotch instead of 1000 and giving it a good wipe down with a tack rag.
> 
> Sent from my COR-L29 using Tapatalk


i need to leave paint to dry, otherwise if i put masking tape over it itll mark the non dry paint?

that will prolonge time and yes, time between the coats will increase.

cheers
jo


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## SamD (Oct 24, 2015)

mjojom said:


> i need to leave paint to dry, otherwise if i put masking tape over it itll mark the non dry paint?
> 
> that will prolonge time and yes, time between the coats will increase.
> 
> ...


Make sure your white base coat is dry before boxing off any areas to add new colour, you shouldn't have any issues that way and don't be disheartened by the mistakes made anything can be fixed! Apart from my last relationship.

Also you're going to be able to feel your edges on your 2nd colour i would suggest after clearing it the first time wate a week or so wet and dry and adding 2 more coats of clear


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## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

SamD said:


> Make sure your white base coat is dry before boxing off any areas to add new colour, you shouldn't have any issues that way and don't be disheartened by the mistakes made anything can be fixed! Apart from my last relationship.
> 
> Also you're going to be able to feel your edges on your 2nd colour i would suggest after clearing it the first time wate a week or so wet and dry and adding 2 more coats of clear


so once white base is dry, i need to slightly key it before boxing and applying new colour for good adhesion? 
also, whats best to use for degreasing?

joe


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## SamD (Oct 24, 2015)

No need to key your base coat at all mate


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## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

SamD said:


> No need to key your base coat at all mate


even when fully dry? its hard to do it in between my daily job, so finding time when i can sometimes mean few days in between.

joe


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## SamD (Oct 24, 2015)

You should be keying prior to base coat that’s what will help your paint adhere to your parts

Clear over the top of your base no need to clean/wet/key


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## mjojom (Feb 5, 2013)

thank you, 
im going to give it another go when supplies arrive. 


joe


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## Andyb0127 (Jan 16, 2011)

Looks like the ipa has softened the base coat causing it to react with the clear coat. You don't need to flat base coat prior to applying clear you'll loose adhesion. I take it your using solvent base coat, as most of them have a window of around eight hours open time depending on brand. If you know the make of base coat I may be able to tell you how long you can leave it. Also using a fine line tape will give you neater edges on the different colours your applying.


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