# Living with a hot hatch



## muzzer

I thought about doing this ages ago and finally decided to make a start on it. This is not intended as a 'Why you should buy this car' type thread, it's just going to be me posting what i think about my new car, a Peugeot 308 GTi by Peugeot Sport.

Ok so a little about the car first. She is Nera Black, is a 270 bhp model with the LSD and 380mm discs. I picked her up about 5 weeks ago and at the time was working 30 or so miles away and i was beginning to wonder if i had made a colossal mistake in buying the car due to petrol consumption, however my job has changed to one 1.5 miles away so it's no longer an issue. 

Colour: It's gorgeous, has lots of little flecks of metal in it which seem to change colour now and then, guess that is down to the light, but it does show the dirt a lot. So it means i have to rediscover my passion for cleaning after last years low point

Interior: Alcantara and Leather massage buckets seats, which are very very comfy, has a small steering wheel set quite low down. now this is where so many people say this car is rubbish. They say the steering wheel cuts off half of the dials and you can't see through it properly. Well... Peugeot designed it so that you look over the steering wheel, not through it, hence why it is set low down and despite being a shortie, i can get it set just right thanks so if anyone says that it's a rubbish design, they are obviously too bothered to take the time to set it properly.

Ride comfort: Despite being on ridiculously low profile tyres, 35's, it rides very softly. Not sure how Peugeot engineers have managed that but it's one of the nicest rides in a sports/hot hatch i have ever had.

Economy: i was averaging about 38.1 to the gallon on a cross country run, not bad considering a lot of it towards the end of the journey was dual carriageway.

Performance: Ahh yes, this little beastie is only a 1.6, yet she will pull hard through the gears and i have no doubt will head butt the limiter at 155 quite easily. The car does have a sport button which sharpens everything up(Why was it not set to kill from the factory?) and if you press that then it really does get a move on. On a private facility, i got up to 110 and then stepped on the accelerator hard and it shot round the dial before i had to back out due to a panicking wife.

Looks: She is a subtle little thing, the only clues are the twin tail pipes, the 19" alloys and the red 4 pot callipers. So much more nicer than some hot hatches on sale today

Boot space: Not great compared to a skoda octavia but surprisingly spacious all the same.


There are some pics of her around on DW but i shall take some more and get them posted in here when i update this.


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## Rowan83

Nice review 

I think it's the best hot hatch Peugeot have brought out in a while, would love to test drive one.


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## SBM

From what I see around and your excellent write up (sub'd) Peugeot are back at there best and for me the last time that was, was when they had the 205 1.9 GTi.

will keep up with this thread over the coming months as I am genuinely interested to see how she is to live with for you Muzzer :thumb::thumb:


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## muzzer

SBM said:


> From what I see around and your excellent write up (sub'd) Peugeot are back at there best and for me the last time that was, was when they had the 205 1.9 GTi.
> 
> will keep up with this thread over the coming months as I am genuinely interested to see how she is to live with for you Muzzer :thumb::thumb:


I intend to take some pics tomorrow to upload onto here and will add a few more thoughts. As time goes by i am sure i will be immensely glad i bought her.

Just a quick point, since i've done 2k mileage in her, the exhaust has developed quite a throaty burble on start up :driver:


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## andy665

muzzer said:


> I intend to take some pics tomorrow to upload onto here and will add a few more thoughts. As time goes by i am sure i will be immensely glad i bought her.
> 
> Just a quick point, since i've done 2k mileage in her, the exhaust has developed quite a throaty burble on start up :driver:


Had mine 11 days and done 24 miles

Nice to see a less common choice of hot hatch featured, I like the stealth look, perhaps a sign of advancing years (for me anyway)


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## Soul boy 68

I agree with Rowan, I think it's one of Peugeots best hot hatches for some time, a nice honest review Muzzer and what's important is that you are enjoying it. I look forward to seeing the pictures too.:car:


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## Ross

I like the look of them,something different.


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## muzzer

Pics might have to wait as some prat spanked the wifes Qahqai so she needs the Pug to get to work while i take hers to the bodyshop to see what has been done to it


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Pics might have to wait as some prat spanked the wifes Qahqai so she needs the Pug to get to work while i take hers to the bodyshop to see what has been done to it


That is all you need Muzzer, hope there's not to much damage and the qasqai gets repaired to your satisfaction.


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> That is all you need Muzzer, hope there's not to much damage and the qasqai gets repaired to your satisfaction.


Bumper has been shifted out of place by a good 1/4 of an inch


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## muzzer

Anyway, another update.

If you want to drive it normally then it will quite happily bimble about without having to go nuts and with no sign of what lurks behind the deceptive facade. However, if you do push it.....then you best be ready because it will deposit itself on the other side of the horizon quite nicely.

ICE: Now one of the things i like about the Pug is that pretty much everything is controlled from a central touch screen display. The only things not on the touch screen are the lights, wipers and cruise control. Oh and the stop start button, sport button and handbrake.

So on the touchscreen i can access settings for the following
Sat Nav
Phone
Heating/Air Con
Stereo
Car settings etc.

If you look on the inside of the car, everything is hidden pretty much like a BMW is so very understated. Ooh i have DAB too, when it works :lol:








More updates to follow


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## nick_mcuk

SBM said:


> From what I see around and your excellent write up (sub'd) Peugeot are back at there best and for me the last time that was, was when they had the 205 1.9 GTi.
> 
> will keep up with this thread over the coming months as I am genuinely interested to see how she is to live with for you Muzzer :thumb::thumb:


Having both a 2015 208 GTI Prestige and a 1988 205 GTI 1.9 I can hand on heart say that Peugeot have gotten the GTI thing very right again couple that with the great edition of the 308 GTI to the pack honestly no other brand comes close.

Try have made tractable cars that drive nicely day to day and go like the stink when you want some fun.

I get 40+ mpg out of the 208 easily on normal driving/commuting

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SBM

muzzer said:


> Anyway, another update.
> 
> If you want to drive it normally then it will quite happily bimble about without having to go nuts and with no sign of what lurks behind the deceptive facade. However, if you do push it.....then you best be ready because it will deposit itself on the other side of the horizon quite nicely.
> 
> ICE: Now one of the things i like about the Pug is that pretty much everything is controlled from a central touch screen display. The only things not on the touch screen are the lights, wipers and cruise control. Oh and the stop start button, sport button and handbrake.
> 
> So on the touchscreen i can access settings for the following
> Sat Nav
> Phone
> Heating/Air Con
> Stereo
> Car settings etc.
> 
> If you look on the inside of the car, everything is hidden pretty much like a BMW is so very understated. Ooh i have DAB too, when it works :lol:
> 
> More updates to follow





nick_mcuk said:


> Having both a 2015 208 GTI Prestige and a 1988 205 GTI 1.9 I can hand on heart say that Peugeot have gotten the GTI thing very right again couple that with the great edition of the 308 GTI to the pack honestly no other brand comes close.
> 
> Try have made tractable cars that drive nicely day to day and go like the stink when you want some fun.
> 
> I get 40+ mpg out of the 208 easily on normal driving/commuting
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Awesome! This car sounds exactly like THE hot-hatch to have :argie: I also think majority will go for the Type R, Golf R or Focus RS. Thats fine by me. Fewer Pugs on the road will keep the exclusivity up and hopefully resale values. :thumb:


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## nick_mcuk

SBM said:


> Awesome! This car sounds exactly like THE hot-hatch to have :argie: I also think majority will go for the Type R, Golf R or Focus RS. Thats fine by me. Fewer Pugs on the road will keep the exclusivity up and hopefully resale values. :thumb:


Hahah wouldn't put money on that when Peugeot launched the 208GTI in 2013 the got a bit burnt with the GFV's on the PCP finance at the end of the leases.

They have adjusted it now but they got it more than a bit wrong 

I think when the 208 comes up for 3 years I will add a 308 GTI to the pack....gotta have the set


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> Hahah wouldn't put money on that when Peugeot launched the 208GTI in 2013 the got a bit burnt with the GFV's on the PCP finance at the end of the leases.
> 
> They have adjusted it now but they got it more than a bit wrong
> 
> I think when the 208 comes up for 3 years I will add a 308 GTI to the pack....gotta have the set


Do it Nick, it's a stunning car. Not as good for pure driving as the 208 gti according to Evo magazine but it's a blinding car and will make a great little family runaround :lol:


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## packard

Daft question what's the interior storage like and glove box ?


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## muzzer

packard said:


> Daft question what's the interior storage like and glove box ?


Door pockets are not great but there is an armrest over one storage box and another immediately in front of that with a fold away cup holder. Glove box is not massive as the fuse box protrudes into one part of it but overall not that bad. Sure you could find more in a competitor but then you can say that about any car i guess.


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## Bristle Hound

Interesting reading Muzzer :thumb:


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## nick_mcuk

on the 208 its pretty crap...on the 308 I was lent by Peugeot UK it wasnt much better but the door pockets etc are good.


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## sshooie

I had a superb 2010 407 sw 163bhp for 4 years, the longest I've kept a car in ages.

I swapped this for a 2014 508sw gt 204bhp and as much as I loved the looks of the car and the gadgets on it, I had so many niggly issues with it that 2 dealers struggled to rectify I ended up selling it after 8 months. 

I love the look of the 208 although I'm an estate guy and the 1.9 205 is one of my favourite all time cars and although I'm sure I was just unlucky I doubt I'd buy again.


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## Brian1612

Seem to be good cars, unfortunately the competition is strong and arguably better. I think they look good though, a little too subtle for me though personally.


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## muzzer

Brian1612 said:


> Seem to be good cars, unfortunately the competition is strong and arguably better. I think they look good though, a little too subtle for me though personally.


Fair point but for the money you wont be able to match the performance. Yes there are quicker cars to 60, megane, golf r, focus rs etc but they all cost quite a bit more. An RS3 for example is the best paft of 40k before you start. The Focus RS is the closest price wise but looks a bit too spaceship inside.
Also, yes there are more powerful cars out there, leon nurburgring, 135i and the AMG a45 but they are all 2 litre plus, the peugeot is only a 1.6 but by far and away one of its best features is......

.....it's a timing chain not a belt.


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## nick_mcuk

Agreed and in the 208 market the only real competition is the Fiesta ST...but this is in my view a far more track focused car...having driven one a bit its just a bit hard and crashy for my liking...mind you Peugeot have covered that off now with the 208 GTI By Peugeot Sport...gotta rememeber there are 3 versions of the 208GTI now and the list prices are exactly that a list price...I paid £17k all in on the road for my 208...only additional cost was a flight to Edinburgh a hotel and beers and dinner....oh and a couple of tanks of fuel to get home 

The Clio...well tbh that is just not even on the same page..ignore the 4 doors bit that autogearbox is hateful...destroys the car, and all the XBOX esque sound simulations, well i rest my case


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## Starbuck88

muzzer said:


> the peugeot is only a 1.6 but by far and away one of its best features is......
> 
> .....it's a timing chain not a belt.


I had a 207GTi with the 1.6 175bhp engine. Think it's an earlier incarnation of the same one in your 308. Code named 'Prince' I think.

The chain was actually the worst part about it.

The tensioner would get too soft when the car was turned off and would allow the chain to rattle and eventually jump teeth when started from cold.

It was a massive problem, it had ALL the timing gear replaced 4 times by Peugeot and at the time PSA just couldn't seem to fix it. The forums are a wash with 'Death Rattle' with these turbo'd 1.6 engines. The RCZ and DS3 all started having issues with it too (not sure if it was just the early ones).

I hope more recently they have managed to sort the issue.

It was an engine co-developed by PSA and BMW Mini. BMW Dropped that engine all together in the latest Mini due to all the issues as far as I recall.

I sold the car because of it, it was my first hot hatch and honestly it got bad reviews all over the place but it was very good fun, stuck to the road like nobodies business and when it ran right, it went like stink.

I'd have a 208 or 308 GTi any day of the week, aslong as pug could proove to me that chain/tensioner issue is no longer a problem.


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## Brian1612

muzzer said:


> Fair point but for the money you wont be able to match the performance. Yes there are quicker cars to 60, megane, golf r, focus rs etc but they all cost quite a bit more. An RS3 for example is the best paft of 40k before you start. The Focus RS is the closest price wise but looks a bit too spaceship inside.
> Also, yes there are more powerful cars out there, leon nurburgring, 135i and the AMG a45 but they are all 2 litre plus, the peugeot is only a 1.6 but by far and away one of its best features is......
> 
> .....it's a timing chain not a belt.


I thought the 308s were 25-30k for them new?

Definitely appreciate the smaller capacity engine though. I have a 1.4 with 200 bhp in my little abarth, had it out sunday for a car show with a lot of back road blasts and still got home with 35mpg... couldn't believe it lol.


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## muzzer

Brian1612 said:


> I thought the 308s were 25-30k for them new?
> 
> Definitely appreciate the smaller capacity engine though. I have a 1.4 with 200 bhp in my little abarth, had it out sunday for a car show with a lot of back road blasts and still got home with 35mpg... couldn't believe it lol.


yes they are 28k new but compare that to say a 135i which starts at 32k, or an S3 which starts at 31k or even an A45 AMG and it starts to look quite cheap by comparison. Like i said, they might be quicker to 60 but they all, with the exception of the Focus RS and i think the Megan, hit the limiter at 155.

I love the smaller engine, it's a godsend on fuel economy and VED too :thumb:


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> yes they are 28k new but compare that to say a 135i which starts at 32k, or an S3 which starts at 31k or even an A45 AMG and it starts to look quite cheap by comparison. Like i said, they might be quicker to 60 but they all, with the exception of the Focus RS and i think the Megan, hit the limiter at 155.
> 
> I love the smaller engine, it's a godsend on fuel economy and VED too :thumb:


I think these 155 limiters are irrelevent as you could never achieve this in a million years on UK roads, well that's if you like to risk losing your license and lets be honest, how many people will actually use these kind of cars on the track? especially if they own one


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## Brian1612

muzzer said:


> yes they are 28k new but compare that to say a 135i which starts at 32k, or an S3 which starts at 31k or even an A45 AMG and it starts to look quite cheap by comparison. Like i said, they might be quicker to 60 but they all, with the exception of the Focus RS and i think the Megan, hit the limiter at 155.
> 
> I love the smaller engine, it's a godsend on fuel economy and VED too :thumb:


Have to say I think the Megane RS would be my first choice with all things considered, even now being years old it's still every bit as good as newer FWD hot hatches.

If money was no object the best FWD car available at the moment is the Type R or Seat Cupra. Seat is a little dull though and the Type R is 30k. The Pug is definitely filling a small hole in that side of the market.


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## muzzer

Brian1612 said:


> Have to say I think the Megane RS would be my first choice with all things considered, even now being years old it's still every bit as good as newer FWD hot hatches.
> 
> If money was no object the best FWD car available at the moment is the Type R or Seat Cupra. Seat is a little dull though and the Type R is 30k. The Pug is definitely filling a small hole in that side of the market.


Granted, if i didn't need 5 doors then a megane would have been the car i would have bought but having a granddaughter i might need to make in the car dictated a 5 door. Well it does for a trashed old coot like me at least :lol:

Now you see, i can agree with you on the Seat maybe but that Type R is hideous. I thought about that and when we were ordering the wife Qashqai, the Honda dealers across from Nissan have a red Type R outside and i had a good nosy around it. ye gods that thing is hideous, all boy racer vents and bits and bobs, tacky design and just generally naff imho. I'm sure it's a great car but in a test with the Megan and the Seat, it was a shade over a second a lap slower around Bedford than the Seat which itself was a 1/4 of a second slower than the Megan.

The Seat i can see but that Honda is just.....well i'd rather have a standard Civic than the Type R, i think Honda dropped the ball styling wise. Having said that, i think it will be an incredible drive but not for me.

Agreed, the Pug fills a hole for people who want that sort of performance with practicality but who want to be a bit different from the norm. The Golf will always be the big seller in this category but with a bit of imagination, there are others that fill the gap nicely. I would have had a Focus RS but the local dealers had no interest in selling me one, this was their second chance after i inquired about a brochure for an estate Focus St some time ago and got fobbed off. I only give two chances and then that's it.


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## Brian1612

Seems a regular occurrence of the Ford dealers. Seem very 'snobby' with regards to the RS Focus. 

That is a fair point but with me being only 25 I think if a car is a hot hatch, it should look like one. That's why I think the Type R is spot on looks wise and cars like the Golf R, Cupra and S3 are missing the point of a hot hatch. It should look wild in my own opinion but I suppose the market is different to what it was now and car makers are more interested in appealing to as wide of a market as possible.


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## nick_mcuk

Muzzer and Me come from the old school though and the original "hot hatch" era, whilst they need to look different the whole ethos was slightly sportier looks with powerful engines. the Type R is just too damn blingy...Peugeot have it right as do Ford/VW funnily enough and these were the original big hitters in the original 80's/90's hot hatch era

Renault have lost their ways of late too....

look at the 205 vs the 208, perfect example of it both look like a normal run of the mill version of the cars but with subtle "beefed up" elements


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## Cookies

I agree with nick (and Muzzer). I suppose I'm 42 so the 205 era was in my 'i want one' teen age.

I love the subtlety of the 308 gt. I passed one (ahem) the other day and it really caught my eye, initially because of the way it 'sat' on the road. Slightly bigger alloys, lower ride height, wider stance and you begin to realise that it's something special. 

As some of the guys have said, there are some stunning hot hatches nowadays, the Seat is a cracking car, but a little too understated for my liking. The megane and 308 are bang on. The Honda is just too much in my opinion. One I haven't seen mentioned is the VXR astra. Gibbo555 detailed one a while back, and in white it was stunning. 

I just wish I didn't need a diesel.....

Cooks



Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk


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## nick_mcuk

Cookies said:


> I just wish I didn't need a diesel.....


Thing is you probably dont need one petrols are so much better now...8k miles and I have spent £997 in petrol cost about 12p a mile...yeah it might be less in Derv but you know what F**k it you only live once so you gotta enjoy it!

Do it ditch the rattly, smelly oil burner and get a proper car!!


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## PugIain

I don't need a diesel, but 508 GTs don't come in petrol 

Sent from my Vodafone Smart ultra 6 using Tapatalk


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## nick_mcuk

No they dont....still on the fence about the 508....


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## PugIain

nick_mcuk said:


> No they dont....still on the fence about the 508....


I like mine, it's smashing.

Sent from my Vodafone Smart ultra 6 using Tapatalk


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## Brian1612

Spose we all have different tastes. The 208 gti again is far to plain for me. Hate that little sleek exhaust tip on the rear as well, just doesn’t work for me. Think the Peugeot interiors have really jumped in terms of quality though, apart from the awkard steering wheel position the interior is rather nice I have to say!


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## muzzer

Brian1612 said:


> Spose we all have different tastes. The 208 gti again is far to plain for me. Hate that little sleek exhaust tip on the rear as well, just doesn't work for me. Think the Peugeot interiors have really jumped in terms of quality though, apart from the awkard steering wheel position the interior is rather nice I have to say!


Now i have to disagree with you about the steering wheel position being awkward. I read all the comments and went in to it with an open mind, and if you take the time to get the seat position right and the steering wheel set right, then there is no issue. All the warning lights are at the top of the dials so there isnt anything you can't see.


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## Christian6984

Think the Peugeot is a good looking car and the effort they've put in clearly shows, mine was the same price as nick_mcuk's at £17k for a top of the range ST-3. Its not as radical looking and the suspension is firm but gives it a great drive. Low speed round town is where its a bit choppy. The Mini Cooper S is what I wanted but after options its just ridiculous money.










it does 39mpg on short journeys which is pretty respectable imo considering i only get 52mpg out of the diesel 1.6 and is slightly more to insure as well as the ST gets the big NCD


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## nick_mcuk

Brian1612 said:


> ..... apart from the awkard steering wheel position...


The steering where position is not awkward if you set it up right. Different yes, awkward no.

It's actually more comfortable than a regular position believe it or not.

When the likes of fifth gear tested it and moaned about it the were just proving their lack of ability to read the press pack that comes with the car. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Brian1612

nick_mcuk said:


> The steering where position is not awkward if you set it up right. Different yes, awkward no.
> 
> It's actually more comfortable than a regular position believe it or not.
> 
> When the likes of fifth gear tested it and moaned about it the were just proving their lack of ability to read the press pack that comes with the car.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I don't know if the higher spec models change etc but I did get a shot of my mates what looked like purple 208 to me. I hated the steering wheel and the position of it, I couldn't get comfortable looking over the wheel as opposed to the normal through it.

Played about with it a little and when I was comfy I still found the top of the wheel obscuring the dash. I suppose it all depends on your preferred driving position but he also said he found it annoying so it wasn't just myself. He used it for 2 years as his daily and had the same issue before recently getting one of those Tuscon Hyandai Jeeps?


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## lick0the0fish

Brian1612 said:


> I don't know if the higher spec models change etc but I did get a shot of my mates what looked like purple 208 to me. I hated the steering wheel and the position of it, I couldn't get comfortable looking over the wheel as opposed to the normal through it.
> 
> Played about with it a little and when I was comfy I still found the top of the wheel obscuring the dash. I suppose it all depends on your preferred driving position but he also said he found it annoying so it wasn't just myself. He used it for 2 years as his daily and had the same issue before recently getting one of those Tuscon Hyandai Jeeps?


My other half has an XY 208, the steering wheel should be positioned so you can see the entire bottom part of the dash. Usually the seat will be as low as possible (for anyone over 5' 8").

I used to sell them and when set up properly the driving position is designed to be more comfortable and easier to steer than the norm. Agreed it is different but give it a while in the right place and it's great.


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## muzzer

So i cleaned the car today and took the opportunity to take some pics and of particular relevance is the position of the steering wheel. Bear in mind i am 5' 6" ish but this is my exact view of the dashboard


As you can see there is no major issue with seeing over the steering wheel.

A few more internal pics



The dials with Sports Mode activated



The touchscreen control system and the rest of the dash. As you can see it is quite a minimalistic dashboard.

Been driving it to work all week, all 1.9 miles of it each way and i have to say, it does handle the commuter journey very well, no signs of being grumpy because it isn't going hyper. Just a proper ball ache to keep clean, especially when you don't have any decent facilities.

More updates to follow


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## Kerr

They shouldn't have made the Rev counter the opposite direction. 

Normally it's sound and feeling for changing gear, but sometimes a glance at the Rev counter and speedometer is needed. One clock going one way and the other moving the other doesn't help for judgement.


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## muzzer

Kerr said:


> They shouldn't have made the Rev counter the opposite direction.
> 
> Normally it's sound and feeling for changing gear, but sometimes a glance at the Rev counter and speedometer is needed. One clock going one way and the other moving the other doesn't help for judgement.


Maybe you're correct but apparently it's everything meets in the middle, theoretically


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## nick_mcuk

Kerr said:


> They shouldn't have made the Rev counter the opposite direction.
> 
> Normally it's sound and feeling for changing gear, but sometimes a glance at the Rev counter and speedometer is needed. One clock going one way and the other moving the other doesn't help for judgement.


You get used to it faster than you would think....took me about 2 days and it was the norm....then when I got in a regular car it was all confusing!


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## Soul boy 68

BMW cars have the Rev counter on the right hand side, well at least it did on the demo car I drove a few months ago, it posed no problems for me at all.


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> BMW cars have the Rev counter on the right hand side, well at least it did on the demo car I drove a few months ago, it posed no problems for me at all.


To be fair, kerr means the needle goes right to left not the normal left to right.


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> To be fair, kerr means the needle goes right to left not the normal left to right.


Oh I see, I wasn't aware of that fact, you live and learn.


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> Oh I see, I wasn't aware of that fact, you live and learn.


It's designed so that everything meets in the middle so that if you are going hard on the track, you dont need to take your eyes off the tarmac ahead. Quite clever really but a simple HUD would have been just as effective :thumb:


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## CoOkIeMoNsTeR

My DB9 had a rev counter that worked like that.



Never got used to the stupid thing!!

I really like the 308 interior, very nice design and finish; I've sat in a few and with the glass roof and leather it's a lovely place to be, to think the same manufacturer made my old 407sw I can't honestly believe it.

Love the sports mode dials and the little steering wheel is such a good idea; I like French motors, they always bring something different to the table. Part of me would love to get one of these in the half red half black paint just for the giggles :thumb:


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## muzzer

CoOkIeMoNsTeR said:


> My DB9 had a rev counter that worked like that.
> 
> 
> 
> Never got used to the stupid thing!!
> 
> I really like the 308 interior, very nice design and finish; I've sat in a few and with the glass roof and leather it's a lovely place to be, to think the same manufacturer made my old 407sw I can't honestly believe it.
> 
> Love the sports mode dials and the little steering wheel is such a good idea; I like French motors, they always bring something different to the table. Part of me would love to get one of these in the half red half black paint just for the giggles :thumb:


You should do it, they are seriously rapid and it's when you find yourself travelling waaaay faster than you should be, that you have to remind yourself it's only a 1.6.

Mine doesn't have the glass roof but i wish i'd specced it on the car now


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## muzzer

Further to living with my little Pug, i do have to say that some of the build quality is shocking. You can flex both the bumpers with one hand and without trying too, which is not so great and whilst cleaning it today i noticed one of the rear window rubbers is lifting, so off to Peugeot it will be going.

On the plus side, it took a shade over 26 to fill half the tank at 1.08 a litre and in a week of driving to and from my new job, and the wife taking it 20 miles each way to her job twice, it used a shade over a 1/4 of a tank


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## Christian6984

Off topic i know but weirdest one ive ever seen is fuel gauge in the Seat Ibiza that goes back to front to what we would call the usual


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## rf860

Christian6984 said:


> Off topic i know but weirdest one ive ever seen is fuel gauge in the Seat Ibiza that goes back to front to what we would call the usual


That's because when it's empty it points to the side of the car the fuel cap is on. I owned two of them, that's how i know!


----------



## muzzer

Haven't updated this for a while, so here goes.
New job means occasionally using my car for business use which yesterday meant transporting 2 iClave Mini from our warehouse back to the office. These things weigh about 10 kg each and are about a foot high by about 8 inches long and 6 inches wide. The boot which appeared to be quite small swallowed them up without a problem with room to spare.

Did a 4 adult trip the other day and as long as two adults are quite small, it does carry four adults. In reality its a 2 adults and 2 kids car. Rode quite comfortably 4 up too.


Still doing 38 mpg despite having a daily commute of 4 and 1/2 miles.


----------



## muzzer

Since swapping my job, i've been keeping a check on fuel economy and i have to say its disappointing.

Let me qualify that. 1 full tank lasted 4 weeks, pretty good considering i used to use a tank and a quarter a week, however that tank and 1/4 used to get me 300 or so miles. 4 weeks to a tank is a little over 200 miles. Now, admittedly my old job was 30 something miles away so the car got a run but my new job is almost close enough to walk, hence the lack of range to a tank. Still averaging 34 tho.

Oh and when she's been standing for a few hours, she has a very deep burble on start up for about 3 or 4 minutes until she settles down. Very satisfying. 

Would i have bought it if i already worked where i do now? Probably not but i do still love her*












*she is q pig to keep clean though


----------



## nick_mcuk

34 mpg from a urban commute of 4.5 miles is very very good considering the type of car. 

I would be happy with that 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> 34 mpg from a urban commute of 4.5 miles is very very good considering the type of car.
> 
> I would be happy with that
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I am but it's a bit of a shock after getting nearly 40. Still, she will hopefully be doing even less mileage soon, a pushbike beckons for my daily commute.


----------



## muzzer

Slight miscalculation on the fuel front, it's less than 30 on a typical day but having thought about it, that isn't bad for a nigh on 300 bhp hot hatch that does a 1.5 mile commute and hardly has time to get warm. Come december, i'll be buying a pushbike and cycling to work anyway, so overall i am quite happy with my little(little?? have you seen the size of it?) Pug.


----------



## nick_mcuk

not as little as a 208


----------



## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> not as little as a 208


True


----------



## muzzer

Okay, so i've been singularly un interested in cleaning the car and looking after it in general recently, bad time at work and one or two family issues that i had to forcibly sort out have distracted me, however, this last week we have been on us holibobs and so....

After a long dusty drive down to Cornwall, via Gloucestershire, i have the following things to add to this thread.

Peugeot claim 47.1mpg on a combined cycle....hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah....yeah right, best i got was 38.6. However, she swallowed all of the luggage without a hitch and was very very comfy all the way there. Slight detour round Okehampton due to a car fire and i had one seriously dusty little Pug.

We bought way too much stuff, did way too many miles and the only hiccup is Peugeot build quality. She has developed a very annoying rattle between 10 and 40mph. Stealers, here i come.


Why oh why oh why did i buy a black one because she is a nightmare to keep clean. However, still only seen 3 on the road, of which mine is one. So still very rare and judging by the amount of second glances we got, subtle too. She needs some tender loving care from the dealer about this rattle and i got very hot and sweaty cleaning her this morning but i wouldn't have it any other way.

hopefully, things will be back to normal now, so updates will be more frequent.


----------



## Ben108

muzzer said:


> So i cleaned the car today and took the opportunity to take some pics and of particular relevance is the position of the steering wheel. Bear in mind i am 5' 6" ish but this is my exact view of the dashboard
> 
> 
> As you can see there is no major issue with seeing over the steering wheel.
> 
> A few more internal pics
> 
> 
> 
> The dials with Sports Mode activated
> 
> 
> 
> The touchscreen control system and the rest of the dash. As you can see it is quite a minimalistic dashboard.
> 
> Been driving it to work all week, all 1.9 miles of it each way and i have to say, it does handle the commuter journey very well, no signs of being grumpy because it isn't going hyper. Just a proper ball ache to keep clean, especially when you don't have any decent facilities.
> 
> More updates to follow


I never knew you were so local to me ha! I'd seen one of these around stevenage, so quite possibly yours it was

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## muzzer

Yeah it would have been mine if it was a black one. Been up to a warehouse not far from your work a couple of times recently. I've only ever seen three on the road, mine, a white one sold in Letchworth and a blue 250bhp one based in Ware. Fairly rare cars at the minute i guess. 

Oh and just checked the depth of the paint. Average is about 100 microns except on the bonnet which is about 30!


----------



## nick_mcuk

muzzer said:


> Peugeot claim 47.1mpg on a combined cycle....hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah....yeah right, best i got was 38.6. However, she swallowed all of the luggage without a hitch and was very very comfy all the way there. Slight detour round Okehampton due to a car fire and i had one seriously dusty little Pug.


Give it a bloody chance  

You have only done 2k in it no engine is going to perform its best until is done well over 6k (more in the case of dervs).

Its never ever going to get the book figures but I bet you will get much closer to 40 when its properly run in on a good run.


----------



## muzzer

4k now mate and it doesn't bother me, i was just updating this. if it never gets 47 mpg then so be it


----------



## nick_mcuk

Nearly run in then 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Ben108

muzzer said:


> Yeah it would have been mine if it was a black one. Been up to a warehouse not far from your work a couple of times recently. I've only ever seen three on the road, mine, a white one sold in Letchworth and a blue 250bhp one based in Ware. Fairly rare cars at the minute i guess.
> 
> Oh and just checked the depth of the paint. Average is about 100 microns except on the bonnet which is about 30!


Nice, yeah must admit I've not seen any others, Hatfield Peugeot had one for a bit but not seen it there recently!


----------



## bigmac3161

Funny there's more in cookstown than golfR's


----------



## Kerr

bigmac3161 said:


> Funny there's more in cookstown than golfR's


That would be really odd. According to how many left there's only 160 308 GTis.

There's over 11,000 MK7 Golf Rs so far. That's mental numbers for a £30k hot hatch.

I don't think I've seen a 308 GTI yet. Some days I'll see 20+ Golf Rs although the numbers do appear to be dwindling. I guess they'll all be going back now after the 2 year leases are up.


----------



## muzzer

Ben108 said:


> Nice, yeah must admit I've not seen any others, Hatfield Peugeot had one for a bit but not seen it there recently!


You wont because that one is mine mate :thumb:


----------



## muzzer

bigmac3161 said:


> Funny there's more in cookstown than golfR's


GTi's? How many are there?


----------



## bigmac3161

There's roadside motors just down the road, there's currently 5 blue ones and 3 black doing the rounds plus Keith the salesman has currently another black one previously had a blue one. Norn iron is a wash with them ull see a couple everything time u go anywhere. Honestly haven't seen more than10 golfR's over here since I had mine. I see more M3/M4's than golfR's all driven by women


----------



## muzzer

Crumbs, that is quite a lot then. I've only seen 3 including mine


----------



## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Okay, so i've been singularly un interested in cleaning the car and looking after it in general recently, bad time at work and one or two family issues that i had to forcibly sort out have distracted me, however, this last week we have been on us holibobs and so....
> 
> After a long dusty drive down to Cornwall, via Gloucestershire, i have the following things to add to this thread.
> 
> Peugeot claim 47.1mpg on a combined cycle....hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah....yeah right, best i got was 38.6. However, she swallowed all of the luggage without a hitch and was very very comfy all the way there. Slight detour round Okehampton due to a car fire and i had one seriously dusty little Pug.
> 
> We bought way too much stuff, did way too many miles and the only hiccup is Peugeot build quality. She has developed a very annoying rattle between 10 and 40mph. Stealers, here i come.
> 
> Why oh why oh why did i buy a black one because she is a nightmare to keep clean. However, still only seen 3 on the road, of which mine is one. So still very rare and judging by the amount of second glances we got, subtle too. She needs some tender loving care from the dealer about this rattle and i got very hot and sweaty cleaning her this morning but i wouldn't have it any other way.
> 
> hopefully, things will be back to normal now, so updates will be more frequent.


Hope your personal worries are behind you Muzzer, don't worry about those rattles, it will get fixed, all under warranty of course.


----------



## 182_Blue

bigmac3161 said:


> There's roadside motors just down the road, there's currently 5 blue ones and 3 black doing the rounds plus Keith the salesman has currently another black one previously had a blue one. Norn iron is a wash with them ull see a couple everything time u go anywhere. Honestly haven't seen more than10 golfR's over here since I had mine. I see more M3/M4's than golfR's all driven by women


I see 10 Golf Rs a day here :lol: seriously though i went to VW in Derby and they had at least 15 in stock !!!!, there must have been a load come from end of lease deals, it really did kill the resale of mine !!


----------



## muzzer

182_Blue said:


> I see 10 Golf Rs a day here :lol:


I'd have to take take my shoes and socks off to count the ones that are within 5 miles of me.


----------



## 182_Blue

muzzer said:


> I'd have to take take my shoes and socks off to count the ones that are within 5 miles of me.


There are at least four local to me now!


----------



## Bristle Hound

Apologies for being a bit off topic

I see more of the new Range Rover Sports than Golf R's where I live. Every bu99er got one & then all driven by women :lol:

Only seen 2 other S4 saloons since I ordered mine 18 months ago

That How many left website shows 619 S4 BE saloons in the Uk whereas there are 46000 of the wife's Mk2 Ka Zetec's :lol:


----------



## PugIain

I've seen one other 508 GT since I bought mine, and never seen ANY spec 508 in my colour 

Sent from my Vodafone Smart ultra 6 using Tapatalk


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## robertdon777

Is funny how usually when you buy a car, over the first few months all you start to see is the same car as your own.


----------



## muzzer

Yes it is, seen loads of 308's but no GTi's


----------



## c87reed

I like the new Peugeots on the outside, but not a fan of the interiors on either the 208 or 308. All down to individual tastes. I liked the 208 Gti 30th inside better, but not at that price.


----------



## nick_mcuk

c87reed said:


> I like the new Peugeots on the outside, but not a fan of the interiors on either the 208 or 308. All down to individual tastes. I liked the 208 Gti 30th inside better, but not at that price.


The only thing on the 30th Edition thats different are the seats though?


----------



## c87reed

nick_mcuk said:


> The only thing on the 30th Edition thats different are the seats though?


To my knowledge, or rather at least the others that I had seen had the fading red to black coloured trim on the inside, which I really didn't like. The 30th edition was the first I saw that didn't have that, and had the nicer seats. Externally, I like the wheels on the 30th instead of the standard design. Inside, I also don't like the positioning of the screen/shape of dash.


----------



## sshooie

PugIain said:


> I've seen one other 508 GT since I bought mine, and never seen ANY spec 508 in my colour
> 
> Sent from my Vodafone Smart ultra 6 using Tapatalk


I sold my 508 GT sw just before Xmas. seen a few but not many


----------



## muzzer

Not updated this for a while so here goes.

Did a thousand miles to, around and back from Cornwall. Fairly comfy for something with very low profile tyres and sports suspension, thirsty little thing though. Oh and by heck does it turn heads.....especially the men.


I will never get tired of hearing the waste gate vent excess boost pressure

Nearly 5k mileage wise and the trip to Cornwall seems to have caused a rattle towards the back of the car and possibly underneath. Rang the dealers and asked someone to call me back. That was in july and i'm still waiting. They have until the end of this month and then all hell breaks loose.


----------



## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Not updated this for a while so here goes.
> 
> Did a thousand miles to, around and back from Cornwall. Fairly comfy for something with very low profile tyres and sports suspension, thirsty little thing though. Oh and by heck does it turn heads.....especially the men.
> 
> I will never get tired of hearing the waste gate vent excess boost pressure
> 
> Nearly 5k mileage wise and the trip to Cornwall seems to have caused a rattle towards the back of the car and possibly underneath. Rang the dealers and asked someone to call me back. That was in july and i'm still waiting. They have until the end of this month and then all hell breaks loose.


Rattling noises is not what you need from a new car, Peugeot need to get their finger out, hope it's rectified soon Muzzer.


----------



## Zetec-al

muzzer said:


> Not updated this for a while so here goes.
> 
> Did a thousand miles to, around and back from Cornwall. Fairly comfy for something with very low profile tyres and sports suspension, thirsty little thing though. Oh and by heck does it turn heads.....especially the men.
> 
> I will never get tired of hearing the waste gate vent excess boost pressure
> 
> Nearly 5k mileage wise and the trip to Cornwall seems to have caused a rattle towards the back of the car and possibly underneath. Rang the dealers and asked someone to call me back. That was in july and i'm still waiting. They have until the end of this month and then all hell breaks loose.


Its now september and your giving them till the end of the month to call back?
I think they may have forgotten by now.

Get back on the phone and hassle!!


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## muzzer

Well the point being if i give them the time, i then enough ammunition to use against them when the brown smelly stuff hits the fan. And it will.


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## insanejim69

EEwww.... too much info. No wants wants to see brown smelly stuff hit the fan, the smell of coffee would be around for days  

In all seriousness, yes sometimes the best way to deal with dealers is to wait and wait and wait. Then you can come at them with as you say ammunition. I know a few people who went the other way and lost their head right away and have since been banned from certain VX dealer in Aberdeen. lol.

James


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## sshooie

Sorry, but I would chase once, say after a week, after his long it's obvious the post it/*** packet they wrote your details down on has long been filed under 'b'. From another perspective, they will think you can't be that bothered if you left it 2 months...


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## muzzer

Well an update is due.
I rang the dealers in question and did a good impression of an ICBM. Turns out the fool i left the message with is no longer with the company. Long story short, after a good 20 minute rant which involved me saying put the dealer principal on the phone at least twice, i am now high priority number 1.
So its at the stealers this morning to find out what the issue is.










To be continued......


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## nick_mcuk

...remind me again what the problems are?


----------



## PugIain

With regards the rattling.
In the owner's pack you should have got a selection of sticky fabric pads and a roll of self-adhesive foam...


----------



## bigmac3161

Or like my 206 turn the stereo up to 11.


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> ...remind me again what the problems are?


Rattling from back end underneath the car. Turns out the rear axle is a weldee assembly with laminated plates acting as an anti roll bar and they are vibrating and resonating through the axle. Not a problem to warrant the car coming off the road but they are doing it under warranty anyway.


----------



## nick_mcuk

I had a clonk on the 208 after I drove it home 500 miles from Scotland so went into my local pug dealers just before chrimbo last year turned out fantastic service, master tech came out too car for a test drive the put it on the ramps found out it was a ARB bush that had been put on wrong. Car was booked in and the fixed it while I waited. Couldn't fault the customer service at Robins Day Peugeot Guildford.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## muzzer

Another update and it isn't good.....








it seems there was a service recall issued as the clever tyre valves fitted to the 308GTi could potentially fail and leave you with a flat tyre. No problem said the stealers, we'll get them in and do it under warranty etc.

That was 4 weeks ago......








....got fed up and rang the stealers again today....a theme developing here.....only to find out that in 5 days, the dealers is going to become a VW van franchise.

So where does that leave me and the safety recall i asked

Find another dealers locally they said.


I might have actually got a bit grumpy and sent rather an angry e-mail to the group CEO which i suspect won't get answered, the point being that i think their customer service is abysmal.

Back to the car? Beginning to wish i had never bought the car to be honest, every time there is an issue it seems i have a massive run around to get anything sorted. It still goes like stink when you need to

A trip from hertordshire to Lizard Point in Cornwall in very short time proves that.

On a long sensible drive it returns around 38 to the gallon, not why i bought it granted.


It's just..............i can't get enthusiastic about something i am having so much aggro with.


----------



## andy665

muzzer said:


> Another update and it isn't good.....
> 
> it seems there was a service recall issued as the clever tyre valves fitted to the 308GTi could potentially fail and leave you with a flat tyre. No problem said the stealers, we'll get them in and do it under warranty etc.
> 
> That was 4 weeks ago......
> 
> ....got fed up and rang the stealers again today....a theme developing here.....only to find out that in 5 days, the dealers is going to become a VW van franchise.
> 
> So where does that leave me and the safety recall i asked
> 
> Find another dealers locally they said.
> 
> I might have actually got a bit grumpy and sent rather an angry e-mail to the group CEO which i suspect won't get answered, the point being that i think their customer service is abysmal.
> 
> Back to the car? Beginning to wish i had never bought the car to be honest, every time there is an issue it seems i have a massive run around to get anything sorted. It still goes like stink when you need to
> 
> A trip from hertordshire to Lizard Point in Cornwall in very short time proves that.
> 
> On a long sensible drive it returns around 38 to the gallon, not why i bought it granted.
> 
> It's just..............i can't get enthusiastic about something i am having so much aggro with.


I' m the same - a couple of minor things can seriously ruon a bond with a car. Only problem I have had with the BMW is a puncture (hardly the cars fault) - BMW customer servicexwas excellent - car recovered (it was at home) inside an hour, new 3 Series hire car dropped after, car returned to me 2 days later, maintenance / tyre cover meant no charhe, nothi g to sign - completely efficient and painless


----------



## nick_mcuk

TBH Muzzer I think you are having a bad experience because of the dealers....I have had nothing by amazing service from Robins Day Guildford....polite, professional and would put any of the pseudo premium German brand to shame.

Do you know who your next nearest/local dealers is?


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> TBH Muzzer I think you are having a bad experience because of the dealers....I have had nothing by amazing service from Robins Day Guildford....polite, professional and would put any of the pseudo premium German brand to shame.
> 
> Do you know who your next nearest/local dealers is?


Yep and the reason i didnt buy it from them?

Salesman couldn't be bothered to deal with us. Fortunately, their service department is completely different.


----------



## muzzer

So today it has been in to the next local dealers for the service recall and a few things have come to light.
1: The dealers i bought the car from knew over a year ago they were being ditched by Peugeot. The fact they still took an order for a car north of £28k knowing full well they would not be able to do any warranty or service work does not make me a happy bunny.

2: The dealers i am using now, their service department at least care, even if their sales team don't.

3: 'kin hell the front brakes are chuffin expensive :doublesho

4: 208's are horrible cars


5: The bond is still not great with this car, some idiot scratched the wing mirror a while back and i just can't be bothered with it right now. This might also have a lot to do with the fact i have virtually no facilities to keep it clean how i want to.



Overall so far, i wish i hadn't bought the car right now but that is down to the dealers i bought from and in hindsight, i don't think they ever put the order through to Peugeot, they just searched the country for the car in the spec and colour i wanted. 
There are days when i think yep, i bought the right car but right now they are few and far between. Time will tell if this will change.


----------



## Soul boy 68

I can understand you not bonding with your Car maybe you should consider trading it in for something else like another make and model and cut your losses and hopefully the next car will be more of a pleasurable experience.


----------



## nick_mcuk

muzzer said:


> 4: 208's are horrible cars
> .


Errr excuse me they are not!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## andy665

Tbh - why should a dealer who was on run out with the brand not take your order. They still had targets to meet, wages to pay etc - the price of the car is irrelevant, your warranty is completely intact, you havent lost out apart from poor service that may well have been as a consequence of them leaving the brand.


----------



## muzzer

andy665 said:


> Tbh - why should a dealer who was on run out with the brand not take your order. They still had targets to meet, wages to pay etc - the price of the car is irrelevant, your warranty is completely intact, you havent lost out apart from poor service that may well have been as a consequence of them leaving the brand.


From what i can gather, Peugeot dumped them as a franchise or at least informed them they were being dumped as a franchise, so i suspect they were just marking time until they picked up the next franchise. To be fair, the salesman was first class it's just everyone else i had to deal with who was useless. I would have bought from this other dealers i am using now but their salesman wasn't interested, probably thought i was just out to mess him about.

SB - it would mean getting an older car and to be fair, i can't see the point of trading a six month old car for one that will possibly be two years old.

Nick - the one i had on loan yesterday was horrible, okay it was a basic model but nonetheless, it was horrible. Mind you, the basic model of the 308 is horrible too.


----------



## nick_mcuk

andy665 said:


> Tbh - why should a dealer who was on run out with the brand not take your order. They still had targets to meet, wages to pay etc - the price of the car is irrelevant, your warranty is completely intact, you havent lost out apart from poor service that may well have been as a consequence of them leaving the brand.


Very true...prime example of this in my line of work I know when products are going Stop Order Take, but there are still X number in the warehouse. I dont tell the sales guys this because it will stall deals...

Same thing the dealer may have been changing but as Andy says they still have wages to pay and targets to try and hit.

TBH I think Murray that you are just in an unhappy place at the moment that is clouding your views.

Ok I am a fairly big fan of Peugeot...but I am also very very keen on being treated right as a customer in the 12 months that I have owned my 208 GTI i have had nothing but excellent service from Robins and Day Guildford the first encounter was a warranty job last Christmas to fix a badly mounted ARB bush...they got the car in at short notice considering it was Christmas time and had it fixed and back to me within a day, now remember I didn't buy the car from them it came from my friend who works at Arnold Clarke in Kirkcaldy Scotland (500 miles north of me!), I have no previous dealings with Robins Day at all!

My second encounter was for the cars first service...and again absolutely amazing service, on a par if not better than any prestige German brand could offer...only down side with owning a GTI is that the service costs are somewhat higher but thats a so what.

1 year on and 13 odd K miles later my 208GTI is still rattle free, comfy and a fantastic little car.

I think you need to step back and reset your expectations and quite frankly I don't think you quite know what you want either. As I said Murray, you clearly not in a happy place and I strongly believe this is clouding your judgement and thoughts, step back and re-group would be my advice.

Having spoken to a couple of my contacts at PSA...the 308GTI is as good as the 208GTI was when it launched and they havent encountered any major issues with the press fleet cars and they get the S**t kicked out of them trust me.


----------



## nick_mcuk

muzzer said:


> Nick - the one i had on loan yesterday was horrible, okay it was a basic model but nonetheless, it was horrible. Mind you, the basic model of the 308 is horrible too.


Yeah but so are basic Corsa's, Fiestas, Mazda, Fiat etc etc...they are what I like to call "Ronseal cars" the do what it says on the tin....


----------



## ed87

I think 'horrible' is a strong word to describe even the basic 208's & 308's - they are built very well and are very nice cars (I've owned both and still own the 308). I've owned my 308 1.2 sportium for 19 months now since new and put 22,000 miles on her with no real issues. I've driven other brand new cars recently including Jags and believe me they rattle and squeak with the best of them (I'm not picking on Jaguar - they're lovely cars, I'm just stating an example). Not everyone can afford the higher spec cars and I think it's poor form to say they're horrible, especially without stating the reasons why. Everyone can have an opinion and mine is that the basic models are not horrible at all, just perhaps lacking in features or the performance that you may have gotten used to.


----------



## Starbuck88

I had incredible customer service when I had my 207GTi. Got the dreaded timing rattle and they sorted it no less than 3 times. (I see older DS3s and RCZs and even 208GTis) are starting to crop up with this issue.

I fell out of love with that car because of that issue and sold it.

My only other new car I had the Seat Exeo had to have steering pump, rack, needed throttle body cleaning and bonnet resprayed due to corrosion all under 30k miles and that dampened things but I actually still loved the car. Although the SEAT dealer was a nightmare to deal with, where as the Peugeot dealer was a joy.

I think it depends on as much as how much you love the car in the first place as I could forgive the Exeo but not the GTi.


----------



## muzzer

ed87 said:


> I think 'horrible' is a strong word to describe even the basic 208's & 308's - they are built very well and are very nice cars (I've owned both and still own the 308). I've owned my 308 1.2 sportium for 19 months now since new and put 22,000 miles on her with no real issues. I've driven other brand new cars recently including Jags and believe me they rattle and squeak with the best of them (I'm not picking on Jaguar - they're lovely cars, I'm just stating an example). Not everyone can afford the higher spec cars and I think it's poor form to say they're horrible, especially without stating the reasons why. Everyone can have an opinion and mine is that the basic models are not horrible at all, just perhaps lacking in features or the performance that you may have gotten used to.


Let me address my original comment. The car i had as a loan was okay equipment wise, it was even a good looking car but it had a three cylinder engine in it that was dreadful and the highest clutch action i've ever encountered.
I am probably a bit biased right now due to a very dodgy experience with the dealer. I know not all dealers are the same and i also know not all cars are the same and whilst i appreciate that lesser models wont have the performance of the GTi, the loan car i had didnt leave a favourable impression.

I am sure things will change but we shall see


----------



## muzzer

Oh and i didn't complain about the build quality, i had a skoda that had attrocious build quality and that is essentially a volkswagen.

There are lots of things i like about the 308 design but right now the after sales experience is letting the brand down for me.



My plan for next year is for me to spend less time driving the car and more time walking to work. It will need a good run once a week though so hopefully the old saying about abscence making the heart fonder will be accurate.


----------



## Blueberry

I have to agree with Muzzer on the basic 208. I've just had two on loan whilst my Sat Nav was been fixed under warranty. It's the worst car I've ever driven. I had to have the seat so far back that I couldn't look right because of the pillar in the way. The gear change is awful. Everything feels on top of you and I couldn't see the dials for the steering wheel (yes I did try adjusting it).


----------



## ed87

Blueberry said:


> I have to agree with Muzzer on the basic 208. I've just had two on loan whilst my Sat Nav was been fixed under warranty. It's the worst car I've ever driven. I had to have the seat so far back that I couldn't look right because of the pillar in the way. The gear change is awful. Everything feels on top of you and I couldn't see the dials for the steering wheel (yes I did try adjusting it).


That's subjective though, I personally found the driving position nice. Not as nice as the 308 but it certainly wasn't bad


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## Blueberry

ed87 said:


> That's subjective though, I personally found the driving position nice. Not as nice as the 308 but it certainly wasn't bad


Well it's subjective in that it's those sort of things that determine whether someone buys a car or not ! There was no support in the seats either. My shoulders and upper back were really aching after driving it.


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## muzzer

ed87 said:


> That's subjective though, I personally found the driving position nice. Not as nice as the 308 but it certainly wasn't bad


Granted it is subjective but as far as the 208 goes, or to be more specific the baee model, i found the driving position a bit...........well.......strange to he honest.

Overall i'm sure they are great cars but it's not for me. I prefer the driving position in the 308 and believe me i looked at lots of different makes too


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## nick_mcuk

But the 308 has the same driving ergonomics as the 208, small wheel ad the looking over the wheel rather than through it setup. 

I found them identical in the position and I was lent a 308 GT Line for 3 odd months by Peugeot UK whilst my 208 GTI was being built.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> But the 308 has the same driving ergonomics as the 208, small wheel ad the looking over the wheel rather than through it setup.
> 
> I found them identical in the position and I was lent a 308 GT Line for 3 odd months by Peugeot UK whilst my 208 GTI was being built.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's all down to the individual driving experience imho and the easiest way i can describe the difference is this:

In the 308 i feel like i am sat in the car

In the 208 i felt like i was sat on the car

I adjusted the steering wheel and the seat to how i have mine set and for me personally, it just didnt feel right.

Anyway, we are getting away from the main topic somewhat, so we shall see how things develop from here on. Did i buy the wrong car? I don't think so, there were a couple of other cars i could have chosen but then they were far more expensive and with the exception of one, don't offer that much more performance.

Watch this space as they say.......


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## nick_mcuk

Yep get yourself back to a happy place and regroup mate 


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## muzzer

Well the Pug is todays transport of choice for the family fist fight.........i mean get together....and so we shall see how she performs. I don't expect any motoring dramas but it will give me a chance to increase the mpg a little. Currently does about 32 mpg but then i only do about 4 miles a day to and from work and i've been advised that i need to give it a proper run at least once a week or there will end up being issues with the vvt.



Oh and the nice man at the local dealers took great delight in telling me how much new discs and pads will cost when it needs them :doublesho


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Well the Pug is todays transport of choice for the family fist fight.........i mean get together....and so we shall see how she performs. I don't expect any motoring dramas but it will give me a chance to increase the mpg a little. Currently does about 32 mpg but then i only do about 4 miles a day to and from work and i've been advised that i need to give it a proper run at least once a week or there will end up being issues with the vvt.
> 
> Oh and the nice man at the local dealers took great delight in telling me how much new discs and pads will cost when it needs them :doublesho


Take that advice on board Muzzer and give your GTI a good blast from time to time to get rid of those cob webs so to speak and as with all high performance vehicles 🚗 comes the dreaded servicing costs, och :doublesho


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> Take that advice on board Muzzer and give your GTI a good blast from time to time to get rid of those cob webs so to speak and as with all high performance vehicles 🚗 comes the dreaded servicing costs, och :doublesho


Oh i do, just not when my mrs is in the car :lol:

Yeah true.......£1500 for discs and pads apparently :doublesho


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## Harry_p

Lols.

All main dealers charge a fortune for disks and pads, but £1500 for a Peugeot hot hatch, I think they're either pulling your leg or royally taking the pee.

A set of four two piece alloy belled drilled floating disks for an m3 won't cost that much from BMW.


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## muzzer

Harry_p said:


> Lols.
> 
> All main dealers charge a fortune for disks and pads, but £1500 for a Peugeot hot hatch, I think they're either pulling your leg or royally taking the pee.
> 
> A set of four two piece alloy belled drilled floating disks for an m3 won't cost that much from BMW.


They are 380mm drilled and grooved discs with 4 pot Alcon calipers so quite a setup for a Peugeot to be fair and it is limited to 155mph. It's quite a potent little car to be honest and really motors when you push it, so big brakes are a must to be fair.


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## footfistart

Harry_p said:


> Lols.
> 
> All main dealers charge a fortune for disks and pads, but £1500 for a Peugeot hot hatch, I think they're either pulling your leg or royally taking the pee.
> 
> A set of four two piece alloy belled drilled floating disks for an m3 won't cost that much from BMW.


My God. I know someone who has a c5 rs6 avent and they are 1200 for a set! Trying to pull a fast one I think. You could even upgrade to ap or similar for that price!

Sent from my EVA-L09 using Tapatalk


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## wish wash

My dad had a pug convertible a few years ago. It must of had 2-3k worth of warranty work on it. It use to break monthly. Worst car he's had and will never buy another again.


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## muzzer

wish wash said:


> My dad had a pug convertible a few years ago. It must of had 2-3k worth of warranty work on it. It use to break monthly. Worst car he's had and will never buy another again.


The only french cars i've had issues with were a 120,000 mile Renault 11, hardly surprising really. And an early 90's 306 automatic with an adaptive gearbox, the gearbox was dreadful and used to go into limp home mode regularly.

Otherwise i've had several french cars without a hitch including a 100,000 mile 172, an 80,000 mile saxo vts and a Citroen C4 that had about 65,000 when i got rid of it. All three had no problems, had very little if no warranty work and didnt need lots of repair work either.


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## Mr Kirk

I had a clio 172 up to 120,000 miles. Nothing went wrong with it. Apart from I had to loosen all the screws holding the dashboard in for the indicators to work.


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## bigmac3161

Keep hearing about French cars being unreliable my rcz similar engine was the most reliable car I've ever owned. Nearly 3 years and all I did was top up the oil once whereas the previous 2 so called quality German BMW's lived at the dealerships for warranty work I'll never buy an other. Those thp engines do like to be reved and driven hard. Those who seemed to have problems with them all pussyfooted about and didn't drive them like they stole em.


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## muzzer

bigmac3161 said:


> Keep hearing about French cars being unreliable my rcz similar engine was the most reliable car I've ever owned. Nearly 3 years and all I did was top up the oil once whereas the previous 2 so called quality German BMW's lived at the dealerships for warranty work I'll never buy an other. Those thp engines do like to be reved and driven hard. Those who seemed to have problems with them all pussyfooted about and didn't drive them like they stole em.


I keep telling the wife it needs to be driven hard or i will have problems but she wont have it, bless her she is not a great passenger at all. Oh well, guess i will have to selflessly give it a hooning on my own.


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## Harry_p

Not exclusive to French cars, but all cars need a decent run now and then. Sympathetic abuse is the term I like to use. Let them warm up properly, then don't be afraid to give it death through the gears.

Cars that do tiny mileages seem to cost just as much if not more to keep in good order than those used regularly.


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## Rayaan

muzzer said:


> They are 380mm drilled and grooved discs with 4 pot Alcon calipers so quite a setup for a Peugeot to be fair and it is limited to 155mph. It's quite a potent little car to be honest and really motors when you push it, so big brakes are a must to be fair.


They're taking the mickey. The 15inch slotted brembos on the RCF are £1200 all fitted.


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## muzzer

Oh yes, forgot to add:
a few weeks back we were travelling along the road when there was an almighty crack....looked at the windscreen...nothing showing there and so i thought nothing of it.......until i got a look at the bonnet.

Yep, there were not one...but three massive chips and a sizeable ding on the bonnet. So thanks Mr Anonymous Lorry Driver, i now need to think about getting it taken care of.

Why have i not mentioned it before? Because i had a) forgotten about it and b) because i haven't washed the car for a while.


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Oh yes, forgot to add:
> a few weeks back we were travelling along the road when there was an almighty crack....looked at the windscreen...nothing showing there and so i thought nothing of it.......until i got a look at the bonnet.
> 
> Yep, there were not one...but three massive chips and a sizeable ding on the bonnet. So thanks Mr Anonymous Lorry Driver, i now need to think about getting it taken care of.
> 
> Why have i not mentioned it before? Because i had a) forgotten about it and b) because i haven't washed the car for a while.


It's such a shame Muzzer you're having problems with your car and now this episode of stone chips, it spoils the overall owning experience. Good luck in repairing it.


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## nick_mcuk

bigmac3161 said:


> Keep hearing about French cars being unreliable my rcz similar engine was the most reliable car I've ever owned. Nearly 3 years and all I did was top up the oil once whereas the previous 2 so called quality German BMW's lived at the dealerships for warranty work I'll never buy an other. Those thp engines do like to be reved and driven hard. Those who seemed to have problems with them all pussyfooted about and didn't drive them like they stole em.


Was the same with my last ever Audi....thing was a compete turd...and really didnt wear well in the 4 years I owned it.

My 208 GTI is 1 year old done a dollop of miles and used half a litre of oil in that time...and I dont drive it gentle all the time...it occasionally gets the absolute S**t kicked out of it (on private roads of course)


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## Ross

My first car was French and it ran like clockwork only thing that went wrong was a rear drum locked because the drum shoes were shot apart from that it was perfect.


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> It's such a shame Muzzer you're having problems with your car and now this episode of stone chips, it spoils the overall owning experience. Good luck in repairing it.


I have a smart insurance out for things like that, i just need to find the paperwork out and go through the procedure for claims etc.

Yeah, not having a great time of it but then......when it's clean, the roads are empty and i have a full tank of petrol....it is a joy to listen to the engine note harden and feel the push as it gathers itself up and goes.

One of the best experiences i had was very early one morning heading through Cornwall and Devon, sun coming up and shades on, tunes playing and hustling along the roads. Great fun and why i bought the car in the first place. :driver:


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## muzzer

Another update and predictably, it's another 'Ohhhh dear' moment.

It seems that the smart unlock and lock facility, designed so you can unlock doors and lock them with your hands full has packed up.


Oh and the 7" monitor is showing signs of giving up the ghost.

Time to move it on and get something reliable i think, maybe a fiat or an Alfa, anything but this unreliable waste of metal and plastics. I really really could not care less about this car now, it seems every time i get in it there is a problem and of course, the minute you take it to the dealers......they can't find the problem.

Hateful, hateful piece of junk


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## Kerr

That is not good to hear. There's nothing worse than a car you've lost faith in. 

It'll be really expensive to get shot of. Initial depreciation is really heavy on these. There's year old cars at main dealers for under £17,000. 

Hopefully the dealer will manage to solve the issues, then a good polish will bring the feelgood factor back.


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## muzzer

Kerr said:


> That is not good to hear. There's nothing worse than a car you've lost faith in.
> 
> It'll be really expensive to get shot of. Initial depreciation is really heavy on these. There's year old cars at main dealers for under £17,000.
> 
> Hopefully the dealer will manage to solve the issues, then a good polish will bring the feelgood factor back.


Really not bothered anymore, the car is just a means of transport now and it isn't reliable at that. Can't even bring myself to clean it anymore.


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## nick_mcuk

muzzer said:


> Another update and predictably, it's another 'Ohhhh dear' moment.
> 
> It seems that the smart unlock and lock facility, designed so you can unlock doors and lock them with your hands full has packed up.
> 
> Oh and the 7" monitor is showing signs of giving up the ghost.
> 
> Time to move it on and get something reliable i think, maybe a fiat or an Alfa, anything but this unreliable waste of metal and plastics. I really really could not care less about this car now, it seems every time i get in it there is a problem and of course, the minute you take it to the dealers......they can't find the problem.
> 
> Hateful, hateful piece of junk


I think you have just gotten a bad one there fella 308 is generally a very very good car.


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## ed87

I love my 308 and to be honest have had very little in the way of trouble with it for the 23,000 miles I've owned it (touch wood)


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## muzzer

nick_mcuk said:


> I think you have just gotten a bad one there fella 308 is generally a very very good car.


You think?
Really wish i had never bought it and if it wasn't for the depreciation,as kerr correctly pointed out, it would be gone by the weekend.

Worst car i have ever owned for continually throwing up issues and quite frankly i would rather take the bus than use it at the minute.


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## storm2284

shame to hear, my hubby has said point blank that he will not let me buy anything french after 2001 as then onwards they went downhill


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## Soul boy 68

muzzer said:


> Another update and predictably, it's another 'Ohhhh dear' moment.
> 
> It seems that the smart unlock and lock facility, designed so you can unlock doors and lock them with your hands full has packed up.
> 
> Oh and the 7" monitor is showing signs of giving up the ghost.
> 
> Time to move it on and get something reliable i think, maybe a fiat or an Alfa, anything but this unreliable waste of metal and plastics. I really really could not care less about this car now, it seems every time i get in it there is a problem and of course, the minute you take it to the dealers......they can't find the problem.
> 
> Hateful, hateful piece of junk[/QUOTE
> 
> I think Skoda, Kia,Toyota,Mazda and Honda have fared better in the reliability stakes than Fiat and Alfa Muzzer, they all usually make the top 10 in the driver power reliability and satisfaction surveys in recent years.


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## muzzer

Soul boy 68 said:


> muzzer said:
> 
> 
> 
> Another update and predictably, it's another 'Ohhhh dear' moment.
> 
> It seems that the smart unlock and lock facility, designed so you can unlock doors and lock them with your hands full has packed up.
> 
> Oh and the 7" monitor is showing signs of giving up the ghost.
> 
> Time to move it on and get something reliable i think, maybe a fiat or an Alfa, anything but this unreliable waste of metal and plastics. I really really could not care less about this car now, it seems every time i get in it there is a problem and of course, the minute you take it to the dealers......they can't find the problem.
> 
> Hateful, hateful piece of junk[/QUOTE
> 
> I think Skoda, Kia,Toyota,Mazda and Honda have fared better in the reliability stakes than Fiat and Alfa Muzzer, they all usually make the top 10 in the driver power reliability and satisfaction surveys in recent years.
> 
> View attachment 49569
> 
> 
> 
> My point was that even they are more reliable than this piece of ****
Click to expand...


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## muzzer

I think i'm going to close this thread now as i no longer have an interest in the car and i won't be updating this, so for that reason the thread will be closed.


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