# Car thieves



## TimInBrum (Apr 13, 2020)

My wife was working yesterday afternoon looking out of our front bed room window which was open. There were two men looking at my car and she heard one say 'oh its got a steering lock on'.

Fairly confident that has thwarted another car being stolen off my drive. I watched my Mondeo be driven away last year without the keys (not keyless entry either!).

I've put off moving the Obd2 port, that'll be done later today. My only concern is that if they really want it, they'll go for the keys in the house. Not a great feeling.


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## VW STEVE. (Mar 18, 2012)

My car lives on the road as the garage is too small & the drive is not much better but like you i always fit the stop lock pro & dead lock the doors & key is in a faraday pouch. It is a quiet road but you still never no?. Just carry on taking the best security precautions you have.


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## Tyrefitter (Feb 13, 2010)

Best to park on street if you can,that way random thieves don’t know which house keys are in,unless of course they’ve followed you.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

If you have a car they really want, don’t make it too difficult for them.
I much rather loose my car then my life or my loved ones.
I instructed my wife, if you get hold up or threatened for your car keys, phone or handbag just hand it over, it’s not worth it.
I rather have that they nick it of my drive without getting in the house than having them standing at my bedside with a knife to give them the keys.


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## AndyQash (Jul 28, 2019)

A couple of scumbags no doubt, let's hope the steering lock deteres them and they move on.

Mine is parked on the drive, with the gates locked. Unfortunately the Qashqai has keyless entry, so that option is turned off, but the code can still be grabbed from the air, keys are in signal blocking pouches and the pouches are kept in a tin.

Also, I've gone old school and fitted a disklok, just to make life more difficult for any prospective thief.

But like you say, if they want it they will take it.


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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

TimInBrum said:


> My wife was working yesterday afternoon looking out of our front bed room window which was open. There were two men looking at my car and she heard one say 'oh its got a steering lock on'.
> 
> Fairly confident that has thwarted another car being stolen off my drive. I watched my Mondeo be driven away last year without the keys (not keyless entry either!).
> 
> I've put off moving the Obd2 port, that'll be done later today. My only concern is that if they really want it, they'll go for the keys in the house. Not a great feeling.


Moving the OBD port is a start but keep in mind that there are many ways to gain access to and take a car, i.e. you can gain access to the BUS from many locations, as an example on certain makes you can start the car in under 90 seconds from the connections behind the front mounted radar!

If you are planning to move the OBD port I would recommend looking at autowatch ghost which should also help mitigate keyless thefts.

The more I think about it (as car hacking is my hobby) the more the "old school" approach combined with modern advances appeals to me, steering lock, hand break and gearstick lock, combined with Autowatch Ghost and keeping my keys in a faraday bag would really slow someone down to the point that they may looks somewhere else.

The above is all fine and well, however lets say that you have a £250k car in the drive and all these security features in place and someone really wants that car, if this does happen then there's only one place they are going to go for the keys.........and that's a whole different set of worries and before anyone jumps in and says "I'd take however enters my house etc" I would simply say that all it would take is one unsighted punch and you've a whole other problem.


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## Kenan (Sep 7, 2015)

So car theft is still a regular thing up country then? I don't know anyone down here who's had a car taken of attempt made at taking a car.


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

As VW Steve says, you can take the best security you can, I have a ghost alarm fitted to my car, steering lock, a metal lockable post in bedded in to the drive, Arlo security camera and my sons car Is also parked in front of mine, if my car gets stolen I’ll eat my cap. All you can do is make it as hard as you can for those


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## leeandfay (May 2, 2017)

Funny you post this as I had to get out of be at 1am this morning as the wife was holding the little one by the window as she was a tad hot she saw a hooded scut bag by our cars.

I did the stupid thing of getting dressed to confront the rat and give him a good hiding but luckily for him and I suppose me maybe he had ran into the pitch black park leading to the main road and dissappeared. We're going to buy some 4k night cameras and a decent set up today for at least some evidence of when I catch the sod it was self defence.


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## kingswood (Jun 23, 2016)

what car is it? 

tbf the people could have being walking by and talking about the car and just be saying - thats good at least its got a steering lock on. my golf is parked straight infront of my living room window and when its clean some people do stop to look and it gets my attention - thinking what are they doing?! but sometimes it is just innocent 

before people think ive gone soft the above could have happened but working in a jail i spend alot of time with car theives! and anyone serious wouldnt be walking down the street talking loud about cars with steering locks on!

most criminals are lazy, make it hard from them and they'll look elsewhere. dont worry massivily about them coming through the front door for keys as that carries a massive charge, more so if they confront you with weapons.

keyless is where its at at the moment. money for nothing, they dont even get charged with much. literally TWOC - like the 90's all over again. a 100k Rangie driven off the drive for the same charge as screw driving a metro.


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

Oddly enough, a lad I know, not a mate btw as he's a ****, has just bought himself a car trailer and is transporting cars around the UK, bragging about his new business venture.

He posted a pic on FB of him picking up a McLaren 720S for delivery and my first words to the wife were, he'll get jacked/robbed/house broken into etc etc..... if he keeps bragging on FB about what he's picking up, especially if he picks stuff up late or gets delayed and has to store it overnight at his address etc....

As with most things in life, you simply can't educate pork.

For the OP though,you can buy a cheapo IP camera to look out onto your drive for evidence/deterrent. Thankfully for us, we have a garage behind locked 6ft wooden gates or else otherwise, I'd be going along the route of Disklok etc....


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## mbarn (Mar 2, 2019)

I live on a newbuild estate, and two years ago a few cars were stolen. Newbuild regs mean the houses have to have a thumb turn lock on the front door, which I believe it’s for fire safety. The crims clearly know this and put a device through the letter box and opened the doors. I only know this because just after the thefts, a hard sell “fear” locksmith showed me, and it took him less than 15 seconds to get in to my house. He also showed me the kit was available on eBay for £25. The lock we all had was a top level 3 star rated one, but with thumb turn. 

A number of us changed our locks, and I also got a pat lock for the patio doors. Then one night someone else on the estate heard a big smash, went down stairs and 4 guys had smashed through his patio doors, demanding to know where his keys were. They took his BMW 140 and his wife’s Audi TT.

The police were great, started regularly patrolling the estate. The cars and many many more were found in a warehouse when the crims missed that one car they had stolen had a tracker. I assume the police were slow on following up, and the crims thought it was clean. 

There haven’t been any issues now for a couple of years. 

I store my keys downstairs, wouldn’t ever try stop someone who broke in for the car, even though it’s my pride and joy. However, if they came upstairs where my young daughter is, I wouldn’t think twice about beating them with a golf club. 
It’s about time home owners had some legal protection. Go upstairs and the homeowner beats you, it shouldn’t be the homeowner who gets done.


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## gatecrasher3 (Jul 21, 2006)

Same here with our house on a new build estate. One of the first things I changed was the cylinders in all of locks along with laminated sealed units in the French doors.


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## GeeWhizRS (Nov 1, 2019)

nbray67 said:


> For the OP though, you can buy a cheapo IP camera to look out onto your drive for evidence/deterrent.


This 👆
You can get set up with a camera and memory card for about £60. Sure they can wear masks but they don't know if the camera is linked to an alert system.


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## pt1 (Feb 8, 2014)

You can only do so much, i think a old school steering wheel lock is the best deterrent and use a signal blocker pouch. Hopefully then they will look for a easier option 

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## RS3 (Mar 5, 2018)

Another Autowatch Ghost user here. Fantastic security but it will mean someone coming in the house if they really want the car.


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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

RS3 said:


> Another Autowatch Ghost user here. Fantastic security but it will mean someone coming in the house if they really want the car.


It is a very secure system, although I do know of one bypass for it, the company were investigating it back in Jan so I would have thought a fix will have been implemented by now.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Soul boy 68 said:


> As VW Steve says, you can take the best security you can, I have a ghost alarm fitted to my car, steering lock, a metal lockable post in bedded in to the drive, Arlo security camera and my sons car Is also parked in front of mine, if my car gets stolen I'll eat my cap. All you can do is make it as hard as you can for those


THIS! It's exactly what i do,thief's in general are opportunist so i just make my security layered i have full Thatcham approved alarm and immobiliser a disconnect steering wheel,CCTV house alarm and before anyone can get to me they have to get through Banner!









.SJ.

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## Kerr (Mar 27, 2012)

What car is it?

The Birmingham area is rife for car crime. So many thefts and so many dodgy cars up for sale.


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## RS3 (Mar 5, 2018)

cossiecol said:


> It is a very secure system, although I do know of one bypass for it, the company were investigating it back in Jan so I would have thought a fix will have been implemented by now.


The only breach was via the app which has indeed been sorted. You should have received an update if you have a ghost.
I don't use the app anyway.


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## wayne451 (Aug 15, 2016)

mbarn said:


> It's about time home owners had some legal protection. Go upstairs and the homeowner beats you, it shouldn't be the homeowner who gets done.


Erm, they have! This happened local to me a good few years back...

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...e-clear-bramhall-homeowner-who-stabbed-872616

I remember at the time all the friends and family of said ****bag were placing flowers on the guys front lawn!?! Personally I'd have stuck them all in the recycling bin or burnt them. Bloody cheek of them.


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## TimInBrum (Apr 13, 2020)

Focus, I agree with most crims wouldn't stand in the drive discussing but they were doing it on other drives and lingering which is very unusual. Unfortunately parking off drive would mean a side street which has no houses on the start of it, potentially even easier to steal it from!

I was looking at Ghosts after the reviews that PTP did of a number of systems:

https://www.pentestpartners.com/security-blog/gone-in-six-seconds-exploiting-car-alarms/

Interesting stuff!


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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

stonejedi said:


> THIS! It's exactly what i do,thief's in general are opportunist so i just make my security layered i have full Thatcham approved alarm and immobiliser a disconnect steering wheel,CCTV house alarm and before anyone can get to me they have to get through Banner!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Even I'd feel safe with a dog like yours. If only I could remove my cars steering wheel, especially when I'm away from home.


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## kingswood (Jun 23, 2016)

mbarn said:


> I store my keys downstairs, wouldn't ever try stop someone who broke in for the car, even though it's my pride and joy. However, if they came upstairs where my young daughter is, I wouldn't think twice about beating them with a golf club.
> It's about time home owners had some legal protection. Go upstairs and the homeowner beats you, it shouldn't be the homeowner who gets done.


You have the right to protect yourself under common law and also the human right act - article 2. The right to life.

As long as force is -
Reasonable, proportionate and no more force than necessary is used you're golden to defend yourself.

As you said, if you left the keys downstairs and they proceeded to come up stairs shouted threats, it's dark, you panic and whack them with the first thing that came into your hand. And only wack them once, or until they run off, or stop trying to attack you, you're ok. Even if, as in Rocky 3 - he dies, he dies. You was fearful for your life so it was proportionate.

Goes wrong when people chase them down, or shoot them in the back as they run away where it gets messy.

I aren't saying there's anything wrong with that, I'm just pointing out we're you're covered by law

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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Soul boy 68 said:


> Even I'd feel safe with a dog like yours. If only I could remove my cars steering wheel, especially when I'm away from home.


Yeah SB the snap off boss is nice...









A very good deterrent to have.SJ.

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## Soul boy 68 (Sep 8, 2013)

stonejedi said:


> Yeah SB the snap off boss is nice...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


To me that trumps every car security out there. Such a great deterrent to have. Especially on a car like yours


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## TimInBrum (Apr 13, 2020)

There was a car stolen by us with the steering lock still on! Guy drove it from the passenger side (there was video!), dumped it soon after.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

The last car they stole where I lived in Birmingham, they rolled the car behind it on its side and drove the other car straight out. 
If they stole our cars I wouldn’t even argue with them, there are still cars when I am not here anymore, it’s a car, not a living creature.

The worst thing is when they find your stolen car back, I rather have that I never see it back anymore or they burn it out. 
Don’t want it back under no circumstances


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## BrummyPete (Jun 10, 2010)

It's the reason why I got rid of my Focus St, driving home through Brum after a night shift, decided to stop off and get a drink as I hadn't slept before my shift and wanted some red bull, pulled up outside a shop, just as I was getting out 2 lads approaches the car and one had a metal bar up his hoody sleeve and was tapping on my window, I completely lost the plot, charged out the car and body slammed the guy into the floor and as i looked round the other ran off, probably not the best reaction to car theft and I wouldn't suggest it was the right thing to do, but my car had child on board signs etc and my son could have easily been in the car, that's what I think annoyed me the most and it is the only time I feel I have not been in control of my emotions 

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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Caledoniandream said:


> The last car they stole where I lived in Birmingham, they rolled the car behind it on its side and drove the other car straight out.
> If they stole our cars I wouldn't even argue with them, there are still cars when I am not here anymore, it's a car, not a living creature.
> 
> The worst thing is when they find your stolen car back, I rather have that I never see it back anymore or they burn it out.
> Don't want it back under no circumstances


I fully understand what your saying mate about it being just a metal object, but my reasoning is that it could be made out of straw but i work dam hard for everything that i own and no dirty scumbag low life is welcome to just walk up and take my belongings i would rather end anyone of that persuasion first to protect what is mine....But i guess that it comes down to the individual...Saying that i have never been the kind of man to just roll over and show anyone my belly!.SJ.


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## mbarn (Mar 2, 2019)

kingswood said:


> You have the right to protect yourself under common law and also the human right act - article 2. The right to life.
> 
> As long as force is -
> Reasonable, proportionate and no more force than necessary is used you're golden to defend yourself.
> ...


Thanks.
I wasn't aware it was quite as good as that. 
Anyone breaks in and I'd fear for my life, but I'm not going downstairs. They come upstairs and I wake up before they arrive, I would batter them out of instinct.

I got a beware of the dog sign for my side gate for £2 on eBay. I don't have a dog 
My thinking is the harder it is the less chance they will pick me.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

stonejedi said:


> I fully understand what your saying mate about it being just a metal object, but my reasoning is that it could be made out of straw but i work dam hard for everything that i own and no dirty scumbag low life is welcome to just walk up and take my belongings i would rather end anyone of that persuasion first to protect what is mine....But i guess that it comes down to the individual...Saying that i have never been the kind of man to just roll over and show anyone my belly!.SJ.


You are maybe right. but i am too old for that, too many people are killed or badly injured, run over by their own car.
The courts do not always rule in your favour when you hit an intruder, the position i have a jail term or any conviction could do me a lot more damage than my pride and joy been taken. 
Gentlemen criminals just do not exist anymore, it is just scumbag who do not care if they get a couple of years indoors, and they do not hesitate to use force.


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## cossiecol (Jun 29, 2014)

RS3 said:


> The only breach was via the app which has indeed been sorted. You should have received an update if you have a ghost.
> I don't use the app anyway.


Not entirely true I'm afraid, I know for a fact that it WAS possible to start the car with Ghost active on a Focus RS via the BUS within the car. In Jan they were investigating.

However the above being true it's an awesome system and well worth having. I've every confidence that they resolved the bypass since then and I'd trust my car with it.


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## kingswood (Jun 23, 2016)

stonejedi said:


> THIS! It's exactly what i do,thief's in general are opportunist so i just make my security layered i have full Thatcham approved alarm and immobiliser a disconnect steering wheel,CCTV house alarm and before anyone can get to me they have to get through Banner!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


can he put out fires?!:devil:

give me £5 mister and i'll watch your car :lol:


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

kingswood said:


> can he put out fires?!:devil:
> 
> give me £5 mister and i'll watch your car :lol:


I wish i understood what you meant,but frankly i don't have a scooby.SJ.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

stonejedi said:


> I wish i understood what you meant,but frankly i don't have a scooby.SJ.


The joke is here around Liverpool, the guy turns up with a big Rottweiler in his car for the football.
Little guy walks around, and says to the guy, "a fiver for watching your car sir"
And the guy says, no need for have a big Rottweiler in there, he will eat anybody alive getting in my car.
So the little lad says "does he put out fires sir?"
Guy gives the little lad 20 pound and goes watching the football.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Caledoniandream said:


> The joke is here around Liverpool, the guy turns up with a big Rottweiler in his car for the football.
> Little guy walks around, and says to the guy, "a fiver for watching your car sir"
> And the guy says, no need for have a big Rottweiler in there, he will eat anybody alive getting in my car.
> So the little lad says "does he put out fires sir?"
> Guy gives the little lad 20 pound and goes watching the football.


:lol:I could just imaging that!:thumb:.SJ.


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## RS3 (Mar 5, 2018)

cossiecol said:


> Not entirely true I'm afraid, I know for a fact that it WAS possible to start the car with Ghost active on a Focus RS via the BUS within the car. In Jan they were investigating.
> 
> However the above being true it's an awesome system and well worth having. I've every confidence that they resolved the bypass since then and I'd trust my car with it.


Are you able to share any links. Iv'e been in touch with my installer who knows nothing about any breach other than the one I mentioned.


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## Rab W19 (May 17, 2017)

I have this fear as the ford keyless system is not known for being the most secure and ST/RS's being the prime targets.

I stick the keys in a faraday pouch, have a furry/barky alarm if they were to try the house and a perfectly sized bat if they were to try and come up to the bedrooms.
realistic measures without putting myself out.

Like what has been said already I am not gonna go attack them (thats why I pay insurance) but I will defend myself and family. If they really want something they will manage to take it, not worth a hospital visit or your life for a car.


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## Richf (Apr 26, 2008)

I put a Ghost on my M235i and Fiesta ST MK8 , fit and forget , don't use the app either and have the same sequence for both. I use the disklock on the Fiesta if I park anywhere dodgy but to be honest they are only a deterrent to the average scally and pretty easy to get past in seconds 


The Midlands is a real hotspot for car crime at the moment


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## streaky (Dec 2, 2006)

kingswood said:


> what car is it?
> 
> tbf the people could have being walking by and talking about the car and just be saying - thats good at least its got a steering lock on. my golf is parked straight infront of my living room window and when its clean some people do stop to look and it gets my attention - thinking what are they doing?! but sometimes it is just innocent
> 
> ...


I agree, two blokes in broad daylight talking loudly about a steering lock doesn't sound like a serious pair of car theives


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## mbarn (Mar 2, 2019)

I slept through my own car alarm at 00.30 the other night. I don’t see myself a particularly deep sleeper, wake up quite easily normally, but clearly was dead to the world that night. 

My neighbour looked out of the window as my alarm was going off, and saw 3 guys running off with torches. 

I had no idea until my neighbour told me, and sure enough the dash shows the alarm was activated. Keyless entry is now an option, which I didn’t choose. There’s no marks on the car, so I wonder if they were just opportunists checking houses and car doors. The Alfa alarm is on the sensitive side.

Another neighbour has a nice 69 plate BMW 330e, a few nice Audi A4’s on my street, and some top spec X5’s. I’d just assume since the Alfa is rare and stands out, whether they would choose it over the BMW and Audi’s if they were there to steal a car. 

I’ve ordered cctv and a steering wheel lock. Stop lock pro elite, as the full wheel covers just seem like too much hassle.


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## kingswood (Jun 23, 2016)

mbarn said:


> I've ordered cctv and a steering wheel lock. Stop lock pro elite, as the full wheel covers just seem like too much hassle.


get some powerful lighting aswell.

what would the CCTV have shown? three scallys in caps and hoodies? old bill wouldnt even look at it.

light and sound are the best deterants, and proactive rather than reactive like CCTV. the sound part proved right as they ran off when the alarm went off


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## mbarn (Mar 2, 2019)

kingswood said:


> get some powerful lighting aswell.
> 
> what would the CCTV have shown? three scallys in caps and hoodies? old bill wouldnt even look at it.
> 
> light and sound are the best deterants, and proactive rather than reactive like CCTV. the sound part proved right as they ran off when the alarm went off


You're right with regards to the cctv. It's more of a deterrent than truly useful. Same with a steering lock. It's a good quality one, as some mainstream ones are a joke. They could cut the wheel around the lock or break it in 5 mins, if they know what they are doing. It's just another hassle for them. 
I have a light at the front, but it's not that powerful.

The car also has a tracker and the ability to fully immobilise it once they stop.


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## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

stonejedi said:


> Yeah SB the snap off boss is nice...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's just brought back memories of this:

Mr bean level security


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## GSD (Feb 6, 2011)

I saw a police interceptor thing this week they caught some scrote driving a car with a big pair of mole grips to steer it with.


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## ianrobbo1 (Feb 13, 2007)

I agree with lights and a CCTV system work well, it also helps to have a buzzer/trip wired noisy thing so the would-be tea leaves know they have been detected, the only downside though is bloody cats!! they seem to like being bathed in bright lights to the sound of buzzing.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

andy monty said:


> That's just brought back memories of this:
> 
> Mr bean level security
> 
> Picnic | Mr. Bean Official - YouTube


:lol:Thats the idea!:thumb:.SJ.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

GSD said:


> I saw a police interceptor thing this week they caught some scrote driving a car with a big pair of mole grips to steer it with.


:thumb:That really made me chuckle,i doubt that any thief could handle my kind of power with mole grips:lol:.SJ.


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## DIESEL DAVE (Jul 26, 2007)

Put the ***** to the wall !


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

glad i drive a kia :lol:


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## J306TD (May 19, 2008)

bidderman1969 said:


> glad i drive a kia


Blimey Bryan. Didn't know you still had it. Must be coming up to 6 years since you got it!!

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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

J306TD said:


> Blimey Bryan. Didn't know you still had it. Must be coming up to 6 years since you got it!!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


be 6 years start of july :thumb:

damn fine car :thumb::thumb:


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## J306TD (May 19, 2008)

bidderman1969 said:


> be 6 years start of july :thumb:
> 
> damn fine car :thumb::thumb:


Was a nice looking car from what I remember

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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

J306TD said:


> Was a nice looking car from what I remember
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


:doublesho was? WAS ????? what are you saying??????? :lol:


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## J306TD (May 19, 2008)

bidderman1969 said:


> :doublesho was? WAS ????? what are you saying???????


Ok IS still a nice looking car 

Looks even better than how I remember it 
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## andy monty (Dec 29, 2007)

bidderman1969 said:


> glad i drive a kia :lol:


Don't get too complacent a member on a dacia group woke to find her passenger window smashed and the entire drivers door removed and stolen on a Dacia Sandero


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## bidderman1969 (Oct 20, 2006)

andy monty said:


> Don't get too complacent a member on a dacia group woke to find her passenger window smashed and the entire drivers door removed and stolen on a Dacia Sandero


desperate times :doublesho


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## Pespro (Feb 27, 2019)

What do people recommend for the basics of house security?
Got so many options its confusing. So looking at sash jammers for doors and windows, but then told they are too weak.

Have 3 star locks on the door after a previous break in. Got an alarm that needs fixing, CCTV to be fitted. 

Thinking of beefing up with a door chain that goes round the door handle, sash jammers and a patio door stick thing, where the patio door cant be opened from the outside. Even considered film for the glass if they tried to put the window through on the patio door.
Lastly a bollard on the drive.

If you had £100-£200 to spend, what would you recommend?


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## sshooie (May 15, 2007)

Pespro said:


> If you had £100-£200 to spend, what would you recommend?


Physical security, both for the car and home, look at anti snap/bump locks 1st.

A really cheap and effective solution is a covert cut of switch to the fuel system feed or similar.

Alarms are OK but ineffective for the short duration it takes to obtain keys, police response is so variable nowadays, when I started we put a 10 minute delay on the external sounder to give the police time to attend, most forces had someone on your doorstep within 9 minutes back in the day, now you'll be lucky if you get a call back.

CCTV again is OK but most if not all car thieves are aware of it and cover up accordingly. The amount of badly positioned CCTV I see is astounding, usually high up, under a soffit getting great footage of a bald patch.

I've worked in the security industry for nearly 30 years and seen it all sadly, I'm also sort of numb to it as I've seen every form of theft, burglary, robber etc. and as above if they want something bad enough they will take it.

There's a train of thought to leaving your car keys half way up your stairs, if they come that far up they will come into your bedrooms so let them have it.

Lots of people will say how they will handle the thieves but in reality it happens so fast and you are often on the back foot, remember they have nothing/little to lose and all it takes is a screwdriver in the neck and it's all over for you, for what? an insured asset?


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Those wheel lock things are only going to deter the most amateur of criminals, the professionals can have them off in no time at all- battery angle grinder or just bolt croppers through the steering wheel.

Big dog- yeah, that's been tried many times in this region, they just drug the dog, wallop it over the head or steal it and ransom it back to you. I wouldn't have an aggressive dog anyway as the risk to the kids is off the scale.

For professional thieves if they want in they will get in. Zero police presence around here either.

I'm not even sure CCTV is much use, most travelling gangs here have false plates and wear hats etc so can't be identified on CCTV.

All well and good rushing out to confront people but there is every likelihood there are more than one of them and they will be tooled up.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

ollienoclue said:


> Those wheel lock things are only going to deter the most amateur of criminals, the professionals can have them off in no time at all- battery angle grinder or just bolt croppers through the steering wheel.
> 
> Big dog- yeah, that's been tried many times in this region, they just drug the dog, wallop it over the head or steal it and ransom it back to you. I wouldn't have an aggressive dog anyway as the risk to the kids is off the scale.
> 
> ...


Where do you live Venezuela!Your not to clued up are you mate?...I laugh every time i hear people say "if a thief wants it he will get it"...By your post you might as well have no deterrent or security Lol...A thief is not that clever you know mate or they would not steal!,and regarding dogs I have trained protection dogs for over 30 years now and owned dogs even longer,have you owned a dog yourself that has attacked a child?if not i would advise you to not make statements that you cannot quantify and stop scaremongering:thumb:.SJ.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

stonejedi said:


> Where do you live Venezuela!Your not to clued up are you mate?...I laugh every time i hear people say "if a thief wants it he will get it"...By your post you might as well have no deterrent or security Lol...A thief is not that clever you know mate or they would not steal!,and regarding dogs I have trained protection dogs for over 30 years now and owned dogs even longer,have you owned a dog yourself that has attacked a child?if not i would advise you to not make statements that you cannot quantify and stop scaremongering:thumb:.SJ.


Children never get bitten by dogs? New one to me.
Regarding they get if they want, seen two cases, one where they came with a recovery truck, rolled the car behind it over to its roof, and loaded the car onto a sliding bed while the alarms where bleating and recorded on CCTV.
The other one they broke into the house while the people where away, they disarmed the alarm, and waited until the car arrived home, waited until the people entered the house, threatened them with a gun, and took the keys of them, disappeared with the car.
This was Birmingham and not Venezuela, believe me if your car is marked, they take it.
These are not the boys who steal to dismantle cars for parts, these are stealing on order (customer orders certain car, certain spec) and is mainly export.
Ever driven around Bulgarije, Russia, Romania or former Yugoslavia and wonder why there are RHD high spec cars driving around?
Some are expat, Some are not.
In 2018, 106.000 cars where stolen in the UK, they where not all opportunity thefts, to think that is a bit naive.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Caledoniandream said:


> Children never get bitten by dogs? New one to me.
> Regarding they get if they want, seen two cases, one where they came with a recovery truck, rolled the car behind it over to its roof, and loaded the car onto a sliding bed while the alarms where bleating and recorded on CCTV.
> The other one they broke into the house while the people where away, they disarmed the alarm, and waited until the car arrived home, waited until the people entered the house, threatened them with a gun, and took the keys of them, disappeared with the car.
> This was Birmingham and not Venezuela, believe me if your car is marked, they take it.
> ...


:lol:Another comedian,what do you think is the average owned car on DW is? I doubt not even 1% of the cars owned on here would be on any international collectors car shopping list and shipped away to a crime syndicate on the other side of the world!....been watching "Gone in 60 seconds"with Nicholas cage.And the same question goes to you mate regarding dogs...have you owned a dog personally that has attaked a child?.SJ.


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

stonejedi said:


> Where do you live Venezuela!Your not to clued up are you mate?...I laugh every time i hear people say "if a thief wants it he will get it"...By your post you might as well have no deterrent or security Lol...A thief is not that clever you know mate or they would not steal!,and regarding dogs I have trained protection dogs for over 30 years now and owned dogs even longer,have you owned a dog yourself that has attacked a child?if not i would advise you to not make statements that you cannot quantify and stop scaremongering:thumb:.SJ.


Bit harsh that SJ as aggravated car theft in certain parts of the UK is rife.

Thieves, especially car thieves are a lot more switched on nowadays where a prestige marque is the target anyway.

Those that rob Fiesta's etc....are scrotes, those that take BMW's, Audi's, R.Rovers etc.....are very well organised and will attack people who challenge them.

Well trained dogs could bite a child but I very much doubt it, chances are slim to non, protection dogs I'd say definitely not.

We're lucky, nice area, car in a locked garage behind locked double high gates.

If I was to worry, it'd be if the boss was driving the car on her own in a shady area, again, chances of that ever happening are zero.

But, if they want it nowadays, they'll take it. Aggravated vehicle theft is on the rise, especially when the CPS intervene and drop charges due to lack of evidence, this alone makes the problem worse than it ever was I'm afraid.


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## Downward (Aug 18, 2017)

A bit close to home.
http://b31.org.uk/2020/06/video-kings-norton-man-pregnant-wife-subjected-to-violent-carjacking/

Just bought a Cupra too....


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

What you need to understand is that any dog can bite!...regardless of size...it comes down to training and how the dog is reared up from a puppy,if a dog is just knocked around and unloved what do you expect?Its going to have mental issues!...the same reasoning goes for humans if you didn't know.SJ.


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## nbray67 (Mar 22, 2012)

Downward said:


> A bit close to home.
> http://b31.org.uk/2020/06/video-kings-norton-man-pregnant-wife-subjected-to-violent-carjacking/
> 
> Just bought a Cupra too....


As I and others have said, if they want it, they'll take it.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

nbray67 said:


> Bit harsh that SJ as aggravated car theft in certain parts of the UK is rife.
> 
> Thieves, especially car thieves are a lot more switched on nowadays where a prestige marque is the target anyway.
> 
> ...


I just get annoyed when i hear people say "if a thief wants it he will get it" not from me he won't.As according to some you might as well live in a cardboard box and drive a skateboard I don't subscribe to that way of thinking,maybe its just how I was raised!...came off my mothers breast at a young age.SJ.


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## Andy from Sandy (May 6, 2011)

> If I was to worry, it'd be if the boss was driving the car on her own in a shady area, again, chances of that ever happening are zero.


Any red traffic light any where if you really want to worry.


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## Caledoniandream (Oct 9, 2009)

stonejedi said:


> :lol:Another comedian,what do you think is the average owned car on DW is? I doubt not even 1% of the cars owned on here would be on any international collectors car shopping list and shipped away to a crime syndicate on the other side of the world!....been watching "Gone in 60 seconds"with Nicholas cage.And the same question goes to you mate regarding dogs...have you owned a dog personally that has attaked a child?.SJ.


Yes I did own a dog who bit a child, and yes I have been between dogs my whole life, my mom was a breeder of Dobberman Pinchers, mainly for the purpose as guard / protection dogs.
We had of all breeds a American ****er Spaniël, had it for several years, was reliable, around kids whole it's life, and attacked out of the blue a kid (that looked very similar to my stepson) that stepped through the front door. 
I have worked a lot in high risk countries, SA, former Eastern Europe, Italy in the early 80's when cars and trucks where stolen on an hourly base.
We lost two trucks in a week, one the driver got murdered, the other one they found the driver bundled up in a warehouse in centre Milan.
No I never seen gone in 60 seconds, but seen enough crime, to be very wary, and realise that all tat in the world is not worth my life.
If you touch my loved ones I will make you suffer, if you steal my car, while I make sure it has maximum protection, you can have it, I don't going to fight for it.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ews/car-thieves-breaking-homes-steal-17806773


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## kingswood (Jun 23, 2016)

stonejedi said:


> I just get annoyed when i hear people say "if a thief wants it he will get it" not from me he won't.As according to some you might as well live in a cardboard box and drive a skateboard I don't subscribe to that way of thinking,maybe its just how I was raised!...came off my mothers breast at a young age.SJ.


to many variables to have a reasonable debate about car thieft.

all you can do is take precautious that are viable, affordable and relative to the level of threat you perceive to be applicable.

i.e if golf R/S3 are being targated in your area make yours is harder to steal than the next persons. theifs arent stupid but are lazy in that they dont want to do more than they have to.

but ultimately if an organised crime group want a specific car youre ill prepared to stop it. unless youre part of an OCG yourself.


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## The happy goat (Jun 26, 2019)

I can see both sides of the argument but either way your family lives could be threatened, you could lose your car or your life!

If your brave enough to take on these people and win (would I take on a gang of organised car thieves?) they run off in to the night to live another day, while you sit there wondering if they are coming back to finish what they started or will they come back when your wife/children are home and your not.

The outcome is simple you will lose no matter, either a hike in insurance premiums, your life or your peace of mind, a lot of people can’t cope with the fact they have been burgled let alone threatened.

Life is precious, what price do you put on it? 30k,40k even 50k?..............if it’s above the price of your car then let them have it.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

kingswood said:


> to many variables to have a reasonable debate about car thieft.


Agree:thumb:



kingswood said:


> but ultimately if an organised crime group want a specific car youre ill prepared to stop it. unless youre part of an OCG yourself.


Not so much!...As I will say once again a professional car thief is not going to go through the effort and risk to steal a £500 sh1tbox!...that is in the territory of a scrote!.The main reason why your first point on your post is valid,but not all folks need to be part of a gang or the culture to protect what is theirs mate.i grew up in the 70's and was raised to be street wise and that is a quality that you need to be double in these days...especially living in the inner city's.SJ.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

In all honesty i think their is a lot of people talking on this subject from different walks of life and differing points of view...so i fully understand that some points are going to rub people up the wrong way,i have grown up as they say "from the school of hard knocks" so my everyday life survival tactics have been adapted through my own life experiences,so i don't expect everyone to understand,as my Dad use to say whatever works for you son!*"each to their own"*.SJ.


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Caledoniandream said:


> Yes I did own a dog who bit a child, and yes I have been between dogs my whole life, my mom was a breeder of Dobberman Pinchers, mainly for the purpose as guard / protection dogs.
> We had of all breeds a American ****er Spaniël, had it for several years, was reliable, around kids whole it's life, and attacked out of the blue a kid (that looked very similar to my stepson) that stepped through the front door.
> I have worked a lot in high risk countries, SA, former Eastern Europe, Italy in the early 80's when cars and trucks where stolen on an hourly base.
> We lost two trucks in a week, one the driver got murdered, the other one they found the driver bundled up in a warehouse in centre Milan.
> ...


Sorry i must of missed this post...so your dog bit another child that was not part of your family?I understand what your saying about material things etc...and I agree,But sometimes theirs situations when both those things come hand in hand meaning family and property both in the same situation!I am not talking about being a hardman I'm just saying some people are prepared to roll over and some are not regardless of the situation!.SJ.


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## The happy goat (Jun 26, 2019)

stonejedi said:


> Sorry i must of missed this post...so your dog bit another child that was not part of your family?I understand what your saying about material things etc...and I agree,But sometimes theirs situations when both those things come hand in hand meaning family and property both in the same situation!I am not talking about being a hardman I'm just saying some people are prepared to roll over and some are not regardless of the situation!.SJ.


As you said 'each to their own' there's not a wrong or a right to this situation it's down to what you value the most.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

You can joke all you want but rural crime is a big issue for some around here. I had a client whose Gator was stolen from right outside his house after the thieves rammed through a pair of electric timber gates to enter his property. He raced downstairs, jumped into his pickup and pursued them up the road, thieves realised they were being chased so jumped out and into their waiting car. My client then chased after them and rammed them when they tried to slow for a roundabout, launched their (probably stolen) Astra into the air. Police arrived instantly (Frome station which is less than 10 miles away from the scene) and promptly arrested my client with the intention of trying to pin him with dangerous driving and attempted murder. Thieves all legged it into the darkness and were never pursued by police.

Yeah big aggressive dogs, all been tried, they aren't a huge deterrent, easily drugged, shot with air rifles or subdued or just stolen never to be seen again.

I don't envy people living on quiet housing estates who worry about car thieves taking their Audi, but rural crime, trespass and opportunity theft is a real issue here mostly by folk of the no fixed abode community. Yeah, big man says he will go out and take a shotgun, you'll only do it once because the fudgers will be back another night to torch your house/barn/car.

If folk are that determined to steal your car, they will. It's only a fudging car that will be sold on or scrapped at some point anyway, why would I risk my neck for an insured vehicle that could be driven into and written off by a moron tomorrow morning anyway?

I've met people in hospital recovering from assaults, it is one thing to survive a violent attack but a large number of victims do not make an entire recovery. A stab to the buttock, for example, whilst rarely fatal, will immobilise a person and carries the risk of permanent nerve damage and the very last thing any man wants is issues with anything relating to the plumbing in that region. This is the kind of thing these non-law abiding folk do they are unpleasant people with very little to lose and minimal fear of the police. I'd be quite happy to lean out the window and issue a verbal challenge knowing I have a shotgun but quite another to venture outdoors and pursue an unknown number of intruders who could be armed themselves.


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## The happy goat (Jun 26, 2019)

ollienoclue said:


> You can joke all you want but rural crime is a big issue for some around here. I had a client whose Gator was stolen from right outside his house after the thieves rammed through a pair of electric timber gates to enter his property. He raced downstairs, jumped into his pickup and pursued them up the road, thieves realised they were being chased so jumped out and into their waiting car. My client then chased after them and rammed them when they tried to slow for a roundabout, launched their (probably stolen) Astra into the air. Police arrived instantly (Frome station which is less than 10 miles away from the scene) and promptly arrested my client with the intention of trying to pin him with dangerous driving and attempted murder. Thieves all legged it into the darkness and were never pursued by police.
> 
> Yeah big aggressive dogs, all been tried, they aren't a huge deterrent, easily drugged, shot with air rifles or subdued or just stolen never to be seen again.
> 
> ...


I don't think anyone has made a joke about this?


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

stonejedi said:


> What you need to understand is that any dog can bite!...regardless of size...it comes down to training and how the dog is reared up from a puppy,if a dog is just knocked around and unloved what do you expect?Its going to have mental issues!...the same reasoning goes for humans if you didn't know.SJ.


I would never fully trust any dog. And I wouldn't have one of the dubious breeds on the place on principle. It's not worth the risk.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

The happy goat said:


> I don't think anyone has made a joke about this?


_Do you live in Venezuela?_


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## The happy goat (Jun 26, 2019)

ollienoclue said:


> _Do you live in Venezuela?_


Nope UK, you?


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## Darlofan (Nov 24, 2010)

Gone are the days where you'd just take the rotor arm off😂


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## Pespro (Feb 27, 2019)

Got the car now. Still in my mind think its going to go. When looking at insurance, i considered the lower excess as it would be less financial hit when it gets stolen.

When the Golf got taken it looked like opportunist, although they did wave at CCTV of neighbour so believe car was tracked home.

Even had the idea of parking the car on the street, so not obvious which house the keys are in.
But i would be horrified if the closest house got broken into for the keys. It would have to be a hope that they just wouldn't risk it.
Hopefully will not got stolen though.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Around here, key targets for vehicle thefts are pick up trucks and Land Rover products. Certain breeds of dogs, including working dogs are stolen quite often, too.

I had two clients where thieves entered their properties to take keys off the hook and both vehicles were gone clean away, never recovered. Land Rover Defenders in particular were hot because of their resale values I presume.

It's a pants situation, as I said, I have sympathy for people living in built up areas but the south or very rural locations are not crime free either.


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

Darlofan said:


> Gone are the days where you'd just take the rotor arm off😂


Or take the cap off the distributor. I can remember some people even resorted to taking the whole battery out.


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## Darlofan (Nov 24, 2010)

ollienoclue said:


> Or take the cap off the distributor. I can remember some people even resorted to taking the whole battery out.


My dad to stop me taking the car after I passed my test!😂


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## ollienoclue (Jan 30, 2017)

I can remember people hiding their fuel gauges as people use to steal fuel out of parked cars. Haven't heard of fuel being stolen like that now.


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## gatecrasher3 (Jul 21, 2006)

ollienoclue said:


> I can remember people hiding their fuel gauges as people use to steal fuel out of parked cars. Haven't heard of fuel being stolen like that now.


I recall that. Wasn't it Ford that had their fuel gauges still showing a reading when the ignition was switched off?


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## rob267 (Nov 27, 2015)

gatecrasher3 said:


> I recall that. Wasn't it Ford that had their fuel gauges still showing a reading when the ignition was switched off?


Yep it was fords.

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