# Meguiars #205 - A Polish To Rival The Best!



## Dave KG

Meguiars has a long standing reputation for producing high quality detailing products that are also excellent value for money ... No silly priced waxes, just a pair (#16 and #26) of high performing and very durable products that are amongst the best value of the market. Much the same can be said for the range of polishes they produce, two of the most popular being #80 Speed Glaze and #83 Dual Action Cleaner Polish.

The #80-series of polishes have themselves been around for quite some time, and have gained a reputation for being high quality polishes that are reliable in use and capable of excellent correction and finishing abilities - certainly good enough to warrant their attention in the markets in which they compete! Times have been changing fast in the world of detailing however. German company Menzerna have in the past couple of years come to prominence in the world of detailing with a range of superb polishes including the mighty PO85RD3.02 Intensive Polish and what is for me on of the best finishing polishes on the market - PO85RD Final Finish. These polishes have begun to overshadow Meguiars somewhat, certainly in forum air time. 3M have a recently revamped lineup including Fast Cut Plus and Ultrafina which have come very close to Menzerna in terms of performance (though in my opinion, ultimately they have not matched them).

With all of these recent product ranges, the air time received by Meguiars has diminished despite their #80-series being of superb quality and still able to hold their head high... However, Meguiars certainly aren't a company to sit back, and they too have now started in introduce a new range of exciting polishes to the market that are set to upset the apple carts of Menzerna, 3M and indeed any other company with a finger in the machine polishing pie! It started with the Ultra Cutting Compound, #105, which combined extreme cutting abilities with ease of use not normally known of heavy cutting compounds.

Now, Meguiars have introduced a new finishing and light cutting polish - squarely aimed at the likes of 3M Ultrafina SE, Menzerna Final Finish: #205. A light cutting and finishing polish, not yet available in the UK but it will be soon - for now, and thanks to pete001 for the sample, its time to put the product through its paces!

Starting with our favourite - a nicely swirled test panel, in this case a metallic silver grey bonnet of a Toyota Carina II:










Previous testing has revealed this paint to be fairly soft so one would expect easy correction from a light to medium polish, though the bigger challenge with the soft paint will be achieving a high quality finish - just the paint to put a finishing polish through its paces!

Given the recent market for machine polishing, I would venture to say that one of the best finishing polishes, and certainly one of the main competitors for #205 is Menzerna PO85RD Final Finish... so this test will compare both of these products and look to see just how close to the mark Meguiars has come with this new product.

*Correction*

While finishing polishes are not really aimed at correction, those with a light cut can be used for this purpose, especially on lightly marred or softer paint types, for example the Toyota in this test. So it was certainly interesting to see what #205 and 85RD would be able to do with the same heavily swirled bonnet, full of swirls and general RDS as shown:





































First up - Meguiars #205.  Previous testing has revealed that with this product, the super long working times of the #80-series polishes may be becoming a thing of the past as the #205 cuts faster (abrasive cut quicker and break down faster), and finishes down in less passes than either #80 or #83.

For correction purposes here, the polish was tested using a Meguiars W8006 yellow polishing pad, and applied using a Zenith point technique as follows:


Spread at 600rpm
Couple of passes at 900rpm to begin working
Up to 1200rpm for a couple of passes
Then work on speeds 1500 - 1800rpm until residue goes clear (two mins tops)
Refine at 1200rpm for a couple of passes
Burnish at 900rpm to a finish

The polish responded smoothly, spreading easily and working without pulling or dragging on the pad. As mentioned above, the correction you could see occur more quickly than with #80, and in this test, also more quickly than 85RD. The overall working time was shorter than both also ... indeed on soft paints, #80 would have left light hologramming with a short work time, while #205 left a hologram free and crystal sharp finish as shown below:














































The correction level from the polish is also very good here with all of the light to medium swirls corrected, leaving only the deeper RDS as one would expect from a light cutting polish. This deeper scratch served as a good marker to show what was remaining:










A high standard for sure set by #205 ... It also has shown to be a little more user friendly this far than #80, as shorter working times deliver better cut and better finishing, while the #80 requires a little more practice to ensure it is fully worked. Not that #80 is a difficult to use polish, but Meguiars have made #205 just a little more easy to use.

So over to Menzerna 85RD, an established finishing polish reknowned for its simply superb finishing abilities, but not known for its specific correction abilities... The other version of Final Finish, 106FA, is the better option for correction and is the more flexible of the two polishes, however for the purposes of this test I wanted to compare them products as _finishing polishes._

85RD was worked with a W8006 Meguiars finishing pad, as follows:


Spread at 600rpm
Couple of passes at 900rpm
Couple of passes at 1200rpm
Worked at 1500rpm until the residue went clear
Refined at 1200rpm for a couple of passes
Burnished at 900rpm for a couple of passes

The polish spread easily and worked smoothly on this paint... much is said of problems with Menzerna in cold temperatures, but in <10degC the polish worked easily here and there was no evidence of the sticky paint. Correction was slower than #205, but in the same set it achieved equivalent correction on the swirls and _nearly_ as much correction on the more moderate marks. The finish, as you would expect from 85RD, was crystal sharp and hologram free:




























Looking at the deeper mark used as a guide, we see an improvement to the mark but not quite to the level delivered by #205 in the flesh...










Certainly not a lot in the correction levels however, as this close up shows:

Meguiars:









Menzerna:









Overall both products here offer notable correction on the soft paint, even for finishing polishes and both also offer ease of use and a lovely crystal sharp finish. Meguiars #205 worked a little faster than 85RD, but both polishes worked smoothly from start to end of the set with no machine chatter or squeal and no dragging of the pads.

Very little if anything to tell them apart in this part of the test, the edge maybe slightly with #205 for the slightly better correction of the deeper marks.

*Finishing*

The bigger challenge, and that is of the finishing abilities of both of these finishing polishes... The polishing pad was swapped for a Meguiars W9006 tan finishing pad in both cases, and the same regions of the bonnet were machine polished again to look for improvements to the finish from the best working technique.

First up was #205, and again the first thing that became apparent was the shorter working time of this product, especially compared to #80 but also comapred to 85RD ... Indeed, if worked for too long this product would dry causing the pad to drag and squeal, contrary to 85RD that could be worked on and on and on. On the one hand, #205 is easy to use with a nice short working time and no tendancy to leave light holograms if only worked for a short period of time. On the other hand, it looses out a little of its userfriendly nature as when taken too far in working time (and many detailers like a long working finishing polish, myself included) it becomes draggy and the pad will squeal.

To get the best from this product for finishing, I worked it as follows:


Spread at 600rpm
Begin working at 1200rpm
Work at 1500rpm for a couple of minutes until the film looks clear on the paint
Couple of passes at 1200rpm to refine
One pass at 900rpm to burnish a little further

Much more than a couple of minutes at 1500rpm would result in pad squeal on this paint. However, despite this short working time, the finish was highly impressive with a crystal clarity and sharpness and the metallic flake proudly pinging through:




























No hologramming, and a beautiful finish certainly setting the bar high again for Menzerna.

85RD felt perfectly at home with a finishing pad and worked with a traditional Zenith point technique to get the best from it, you could be flexible with hte working time and the polish would just keep working... here, to get the best results on this paint, I went for the following method:


Spread at 600rpm
Begin working at 1200rpm
Work at 1500rpm until the residue goes clear (three to five minutes)
Refine at 1200rpm
Burnish at 900rpm

The results were the typical crystal sharp finish we've all come to expect from 85RD, the finish that sees it rated as one of the best finishing polishes on the market today...




























In terms of finishing ability, there is again very little to choose between these two polishes - they are both excellent, and IMHO they are both at the top of the market in terms of finishing ability and good though 3M Ultrafina is, both of these polishes show it a clean pair of heels on very soft paints in terms of ultimate sharpness and clarity...

But to choose between the two on test was very difficult indeed! Under the direct light of the Sun Gun, with #205 you could make out just a little mote of the detail of the light in the reflection but this was very slight, and may just be a figment of my imagination, so close are these two products... In ultimate finish I would say that there really is nothing in it between these two, however 85RD has the edge on ease of use here as it is more forgiving of long working times... By contrast, #205 has the advantage of being the faster working polish and where time is a little more important, it holds an advantage over 85RD here...

But ultimately there is little to nothing to choose between these two products, as these final pictures show: Meguiars on the passenger side, Menzerna on the driver side and the difference in gloss and clarity under the garage lighting is impossible to see:
































































So how does #205 stand up?

It has shown itself in this test to be at least a match in performance for one of the best finishing polishes on the market: 85RD. In terms of correction it offers a little more yet retains an ability to finish down with equal clarity and sharpness, and perhaps arguably just a little extra in terms of finish. It looses out slightly in terms of ease of use to 85RD by being a little more finnicky when overworked, and has a restricted working time... However, it does work and cut faster, which in itself is an advantage depending on your polishing style.

There is little or nothing to choose between #205 and the best finishing polish on the market - Meguiars is here with a product to rival the best, and knowing Meguiars it will be well priced!

I for one am looking forward to seeing this product arriving on our shores in the UK :thumb:


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## spitfire

Interesting write up again Dave, thanks:thumb:


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## Sandro

good write up matey!! very interesting and good to see Megs stepping up!


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## hartzsky

Cool............Nice commentary..


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## Dav_C

Over here in Singapore, #205 is also not available yet. Really looking forward to give it a try. Actually 85 RD didn't impress me that much too.

I think if you test them on a black car, the difference would be more prominent. We've tried 85RD against Flex Special abrasive polish (when used with soft sponge, it only removes hologram and becomes very mild). The difference cannot be seen. Until we put the car under the sky in the afternoon and look at the reflection on the cloud. the reflection of the 85RD was 'darker', like over-exposed X-Ray (or under exposed film), meaning the reflection is darker. For Flex on the other side, it's more mirror-like with a brighter reflection meaning the cloud is 'whiter'. It depends on taste, I just prefer a brighte reflection because when I park beside another car, I want my car to look brighter. But in most situation, this difference is not even visible unless you do an A/B test, and watch carefully.


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## R31Heaven

Good review Dave, it is good to see it compares well to 85RD now to win me over it will have to match or better $42 I pay for the Menz product Here in Oz.


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## pete001

Thank you for another great review there dave :thumb:.Looks like meguiars are onto a real winner with this one.


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## tdekany

Excellent post Dave. Do you have enough left of 205 to test it on dark color by any chance?


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## petenaud

great write as usual dave, many thanks.

Think megs have a winner here.


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## Waxamomo

Great write up and very interesting. This should be available soon shouldn't it??


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## Dipesh

great write up that dave.


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## saxoboy07

Interesting write up:thumb: look forward to seeing this out next year hopefully, i'll stick to 85rd for the time being as it's a great polish


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## TimG

Thanks. Great read indeed. Still waiting to get my gallon to test out.


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## Bigpikle

nice one Dave - read a lot about this already in the US, so was looking forward to your review as well. 

It seems like the slight extra cut might be just what is needed for a light tidy up on cars with harder paint and just very light swirls or marks, to cut those back AND bring up the gloss in 1 step.

Look forward to getting some of this to play with next year :thumb:


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## Dave KG

Dav_C said:


> Over here in Singapore, #205 is also not available yet. Really looking forward to give it a try. Actually 85 RD didn't impress me that much too.
> 
> I think if you test them on a black car, the difference would be more prominent. We've tried 85RD against Flex Special abrasive polish (when used with soft sponge, it only removes hologram and becomes very mild). The difference cannot be seen. Until we put the car under the sky in the afternoon and look at the reflection on the cloud. the reflection of the 85RD was 'darker', like over-exposed X-Ray (or under exposed film), meaning the reflection is darker. For Flex on the other side, it's more mirror-like with a brighter reflection meaning the cloud is 'whiter'. It depends on taste, I just prefer a brighte reflection because when I park beside another car, I want my car to look brighter. But in most situation, this difference is not even visible unless you do an A/B test, and watch carefully.


Interesting comments re: 85RD, what machine (DA or rotary) are you testing it on, and on what paint types (soft, hard, solid, metallic?) ... In my experience of it, it has consistently been one of, if not the best finishing polish on the market both by DA and rotary polisher but different working styles may contribute to yielding better or worse results from a polish, and 85D I find benefits from increased working time and the use of small areas to ensure the working time is kept long. Its also sensitive to amount of polish used - should be very small, too much will detriment the finish that you achieve as you dont fully work all of the product.

I ask what machine and paint type, as by DA I find the way the Menzerna abrasives work lends themselves to being very userfriendly by DA and perceived better performances than other polishes - and perhaps arguably a very slight edge over is competition... However, the strong abrasives used in the ceramiclear Menzerna polishes can manifest themselves on softer paints with a poorer finishing ability if not correctly worked - this is an issue that has been raised before by Rich at Polished Bliss, who has commented that if the technique is not absolutely spot on with these polishes they will not perform to their best and can leave marring on softer paints, and indeed recommends the more brittle abrasives of Final Polish II and PO91L Intensive Polishes for these cases, a little bit of added userfriendly nature... If the car you performed the comparison on was a soft paint type, then perhaps this described situation was manifesting itself a little...

I've also tested the #205 of a soft dark red paint, and likewise found little tenable differences between it and 85RD... I tend not to use blacks to these types of test, as while it may seem the best colour, I find that in practice it isn't as a good finish will still look outstanding on black and while the eye will tell a difference between good and great, a picture certainly wont... more medium colours (greys, reds, blues) I find are actually superior for telling product performances, which is one reason I do not use my own black car for these tests... Further, I would advise using the naked eye to look at the clarity with which the metallic flake "pings" if the finish is metallic.... polishing is burnishing the finish smooth, and the optical clarity of a smooth interface layer (between air and paint) will allow the flake to be viewed most sharply by the naked eye, a rougher interface will induce scattering and mute the flake - its one of the best methods IMHO for looking at finish clarity when you don't have a gloss meter with which to judge.


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## Dave KG

saxoboy07 said:


> Interesting write up:thumb: look forward to seeing this out next year hopefully, i'll stick to 85rd for the time being as it's a great polish


If you have a lot of 85RD then I would personally stick with it, as it is to me comparitive with this new #205. But when you run out, you may want to contemplate a change over to Meguiars just for fun...


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## saxoboy07

Dave KG said:


> If you have a lot of 85RD then I would personally stick with it, as it is to me comparitive with this new #205. But when you run out, you may want to contemplate a change over to Meguiars just for fun...


i have two 250ml sample bottles of 85rd to get through yet i really like 85rd as it really does add something to my Icelandic grey colour which some polishes don't, but if i run out i may consider#205 maybe


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## ahaydock

Thanks for sharing this - sounds like another prodcut to add to the list when it becomes available.


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## Dav_C

Dave KG said:


> Interesting comments re: 85RD, what machine (DA or rotary) are you testing it on, and on what paint types (soft, hard, solid, metallic?) ... In my experience of it, it has consistently been one of, if not the best finishing polish on the market both by DA and rotary polisher but different working styles may contribute to yielding better or worse results from a polish, and 85D I find benefits from increased working time and the use of small areas to ensure the working time is kept long. Its also sensitive to amount of polish used - should be very small, too much will detriment the finish that you achieve as you dont fully work all of the product.
> 
> I ask what machine and paint type, as by DA I find the way the Menzerna abrasives work lends themselves to being very userfriendly by DA and perceived better performances than other polishes - and perhaps arguably a very slight edge over is competition... However, the strong abrasives used in the ceramiclear Menzerna polishes can manifest themselves on softer paints with a poorer finishing ability if not correctly worked - this is an issue that has been raised before by Rich at Polished Bliss, who has commented that if the technique is not absolutely spot on with these polishes they will not perform to their best and can leave marring on softer paints, and indeed recommends the more brittle abrasives of Final Polish II and PO91L Intensive Polishes for these cases, a little bit of added userfriendly nature... If the car you performed the comparison on was a soft paint type, then perhaps this described situation was manifesting itself a little...
> 
> I've also tested the #205 of a soft dark red paint, and likewise found little tenable differences between it and 85RD... I tend not to use blacks to these types of test, as while it may seem the best colour, I find that in practice it isn't as a good finish will still look outstanding on black and while the eye will tell a difference between good and great, a picture certainly wont... more medium colours (greys, reds, blues) I find are actually superior for telling product performances, which is one reason I do not use my own black car for these tests... Further, I would advise using the naked eye to look at the clarity with which the metallic flake "pings" if the finish is metallic.... polishing is burnishing the finish smooth, and the optical clarity of a smooth interface layer (between air and paint) will allow the flake to be viewed most sharply by the naked eye, a rougher interface will induce scattering and mute the flake - its one of the best methods IMHO for looking at finish clarity when you don't have a gloss meter with which to judge.


It's on a Glasurit 923-109 HS UV Clear with a rotary. It's my friend's car. Mine is on Sikkens (too bad it's silver, not suitable for testing).

Meg is good. Menzerna good. Mirka good. Sonax good. All are good. On light coloured car, I can't see the difference at all. Only when we do a 50/50 test on a dark colour car then only we can see the small difference.


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## Tunero

Very interesting... shocking with the result... awesome!


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## Tiauguinho

I love 85RD, its a great finishing polish with a fantastic working time. Nonetheless, I will try some #205 one of these days.

Thanks for this Dave!


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## mygokhan

Perfect


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## khurum6392

hi anyone know how to get best results with m205 on a audi paint


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