# 5 x 5 / Stronglift / Strength Thread



## Bod42

As a number of people have been talking about 5 x 5 and other forms of training in various thread I thought (well actually ITHAQVA thought of it, just thought I make it while your all a sleep) I would make a thread where people can put their 5 x 5 / Strength Workouts up and discuss anything to do with them.

I know this is a detailing forum but there are alot of people on here whi have other passions as well so why not keep it on one website


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thanks Bod :thumb:

Will be nice to inspire each other through the sticking points & discuss different ways to reach our goals :thumb:


To answer your question from the other workout thread, yep, ive got those little 0.5Kg plates :thumb:. Also got 1,1.5,2,5,7.5,10 & 20KG, was an old Bodysculpture set i bought in 1984 :doublesho, how's that for value for money 

Im bloody itching to buy an Olympic set once i get to my standard bars limits (i think the forums say around 120KG is the safe limit, so will be a little while yet)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Re post to start us all off 

Sat 5X5

*Squat 108KG/243LB 5X5 *

*Bench Press 83KG/186.75LB 5X5* last two sets were hard, getting 5 reps was a reall bugger (had to hate the weights GRRRRRRR! )

*Bent over Row (Over hand grip) 75KG/168.75LB 5X5 *

Another 2KG/4.5LB added to all exercises for next week :thumb:


----------



## President Swirl

Man i miss my gym days. I used to train at ironworks in kings norton ( Birmingham ) haven't been for maybe 3 years. I lost motivation when my training partner gave up. Does anyone do super sets or tri sets? a super set being say incline bench followed immediately by incline flyes. tri sets being just that, three sets of different excersizes, targeting the same muscle group. Feel the burn! DO NOT do these all the time as you WILL burn out. Just occasionally to shock things up. We used to get funny looks running from one part of the gym to the other! but, who cares. That pumped up swolen feeling you get after leaving can only be beaten by female company.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA: Thats why I'm so glad I brought my own gym, cant see me ever getting rid of it so value for money is amazing. I havent uploaded it yet but I moved my Rack Sunday so now I can get my car in the garage, its a tight fit but its in and has enough space to work on.

I reconmend those small weights to everyone, they are perfect for arms as I find stepping up 2.5kg on each arm on say Dumbell Curls is too much but 0.5kg on each arm is doable.

President Swirl I normally do straight training for strength but when I have trained rugby players (90% of people I train are rugby plaers) and they get near the start of the season I start using drop sets for a few weeks to build up their Lactic Acid Torrelence and I use supersets but for antagonistic body parts, that way you can keep the rest low, 30-60 seconds, whcih keeps the heart rate up but still allows you to move resonable weights. Try a Back / Chest Super Set workout and then you feel hugh walking out the gym.

My absolute favorite for Rugby players or anyone in a contact sport is the circuit of death as its now named. 10 Squats, 30 secs Rest, 10 Chin Ups, 30 secs Rest, 10 Deadlifts, 30 secs Rest, 10 Dips with added weight, 2 mins Rest then repeat 3 more times. Try and complete as close to 20mins as possible


----------



## Bod42

Mondays Workout:
Squat 120kg 3 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press 52.5kg 5,5,5,4,3
Deadlift 152.5kg 1 x 5

Wednesdays Workout:
Squat 122.5kg 3 x 5
Bench Press 102.5kg 5,5,5,4,3
Bent Over Rows 80kg 5,5,4,4,4 3 weeks and still didnt hit weight so deload by 20% so next time 64kg and build back up.

Fridays Workout:
Box Squats: 125kg 3 x 5 (14" Box)
Seated Shoulder Press: 52.5kg 5,5,5,5,5
Conventional Deadlift: 157.5kg 1 x 3


----------



## ITHAQVA

Monday 5X5

Squat 110KG/247.50LB 5X5 

Standing overhead Press 56KG/126LB 5X5 (last set was very hard)

Dead Lift 110KG/247.50LB 1X5

Another 2KG/4.5LB to add to all exercises :thumb:


Bod, what would be a sensible goal for the front press (Good Form) single lift?


----------



## Bod42

Monday:
Squat 127.5kg 3 x 5 - The weight didnt feel heavy but God I was slow off the box, I had no power so maybe a will use a few more sets next time t warm up.
Bench Press 102.5kg 5,5,5,5,5 was please to get 5 x 5 as last time was hard.
Bent Over Rows 70kg. Was going for 65kg but decided on 70kg so I can keep using the biggest plate to keep my body exactly the same angle.

ITHAQVA: Alot of people say the shoulder press is more important than the Bench Press and alot of Powerlifters say that Shoulder Press strength carries over to Bench Press but not the other way around. 

Charles Poliquin states this for his recommendation on Shoulder Strength Ratio. "The weight done for 8 reps on each dumbbell should represent 29 percent of the close-grip bench press measure. In other words, a man able to close-grip bench about 220 pounds for a single would use a pair of 65’s for 8 reps in the seated dumbbell overhead presses.
He also states in his Muscle Balance Ratio that the Press Behind the Neck should be 66% of your Close Grip Bench Press. 

I dont recommend behind the neck press to anyone and you should be able to press more the standard way but hopefully this gives you an idea.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thanks for the info Bod :thumb: :thumb:

Agree on the behind neck press, I’ve not had any problems but have read of so many with shoulder problems possibly caused by this movement, does feel a little unnatural when executed, i prefer front now.


My last 5x5 i got stuck on 60KG/135LB for 5X5 reps  however i didnt deload, this time i'll follow the rules a bit  :thumb:


----------



## vroomtshh

What is 5x5?
I hear people talking about it all the time. I assume its 5 sets of 5 reps?
But do you stick to one bodypart with it or mix it up?

I have a pretty good routine but trying something new never does any harm


----------



## ITHAQVA

vroomtshh said:


> What is 5x5?
> I hear people talking about it all the time. I assume its 5 sets of 5 reps?
> But do you stick to one bodypart with it or mix it up?
> 
> I have a pretty good routine but trying something new never does any harm


*Typical 5X5 routine:*

*Week 1*

MONDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

WEDNESDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

FRIDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

*WEEK 2*

MONDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

WEDNESDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

FRIDAY

SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

You usually do 10 weeks of the above alternating week 1 workout then week 2 etc.. Adding weight after 5 sets of 5 reps achieved on any exercise.

There are many variations of this workout & normally you just use multi joint exercises.

Site to help give more info here: http://stronglifts.com/

PDF of the principles/techniques' etc...http://gainmusclesize.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/stronglifts-5x5.pdf

I havent put the weights in as this is something you'll decide at the beggining with the info supplied from the pdf & website. :thumb:

the above is just an example, once ive done 10 weeks i'll change some of the exercises & do another 10 weeks etc...


----------



## sidewalkdances

Starting Strength is the original and the best (Well Bill Starrs 5x5 is the original, but I like the Rippetoe version :lol: ) 

I started with SS and now my lifts are....

Squat 320
Bench 200
Deadlift 265
OHP 105


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Starting Strength is the original and the best (Well Bill Starrs 5x5 is the original, but I like the Rippetoe version :lol: )
> 
> I started with SS and now my lifts are....
> 
> Squat 320
> Bench 200
> Deadlift 265
> OHP 105


I think Stronglift (SL) did get most of his info from Starting Strength (SS) but I will always start beginners on Stronglift 5 x 5 simply as it gives them more volume to practice their form and once you deload twice you move to 3 x 5 which is basically SS anyway. Also the Clean is a very technical exercise so for beginners I like Rows.

If those numbers are lbs, nice lifts, if those numbers are kgs then I sulute you Sir :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Box Squats: 130kg 5, 3, 3
Seated Shoulder Press: 55.0kg 4,3,3,3,3
Conventional Deadlift: 157.5kg 1 x 2

This workout was far from my best but my rens are arriving today my the UK for 3 weeks so thought it was abit harsh to train at night while their here so trained at 6am and felt like ****. Had to ge up between squats to stop myself falling asleep sitting down. The downlifts I tried once and couldnt even get the weight up but then tried again and got 2 reps when I was aiming for 4, not good


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Box Squats: 130kg 5, 3, 3
> Seated Shoulder Press: 52.5kg 4,3,3,3,3
> Conventional Deadlift: 157.5kg 1 x 2
> 
> This workout was far from my best but my rens are arriving today my the UK for 3 weeks so thought it was abit harsh to train at night while their here so trained at 6am and felt like ****. Had to ge up between squats to stop myself falling asleep sitting down. The downlifts I tried once and couldnt even get the weight up but then tried again and got 2 reps when I was aiming for 4, not good


Tired or no mate, they aren't shoddy weights your humping at 6am, way to go BOD!!! :doublesho

How do you rate seated shoulder presses over standing Bod?

I'm getting close to 60Kg for 5X5 reps, in your experience how heavy does the average guy go on the barbell, don't know why but just don't see myself going much heavier than 75-80KG for reps with good form. Sorry for the silly questions but I've never trained with anyone so what I've achieved is all on my own with the help of some good reading.


----------



## Guest

vroomtshh said:


> What is 5x5?
> I hear people talking about it all the time. I assume its 5 sets of 5 reps?
> But do you stick to one bodypart with it or mix it up?
> 
> I have a pretty good routine but trying something new never does any harm


5x5 (5 sets of 5 reps) or 3x5 (3 sets of 5 reps) are compound barbell programs designed for quickly building whole body strength.

As already mentioned, a 5x5 program will become a 3x5 program once the weights get too heavy for your body to recover in time for your next session.

As I understand it, the only benefit to 5x5 is that you start off doing more reps (25 reps total as opposed to 15 reps) and thus program your muscle memory for each movement (lift) earlier on. I don't believe there is much strength benefit at all.

Here is a pretty good explanation of Mark Rippetoe's 3x5: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=712752

I also found this page, which has some interesting quotes from Mark Rippetoe. The chap who owns the site can squat too (I wonder how much is on that bar?): http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Blog...able-Strength-Lessons-From-Mark-Rippetoe.aspx


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> If those numbers are lbs, nice lifts, if those numbers are kgs then I sulute you Sir :thumb:


They are kilos :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursdays 5X5

Squat 112KG/252LB 5X5 

Bench Press 85KG/191.25LB 5, 4, 4, 2, 2

Bent Over Row 77KG/173.25LB 5X5

Everything felt heavy today even though the weights were not, not over worried about the bench, i managed to lift thats the main thing, i will aim to add reps over the next few weeks until i get my 5X5 on the bench :devil:

I used to use a 1-4 rep range in my heavier days, as long as you lift thats the main thing  :thumb:

2KG/4.5LB added to Squat & Bent over row, Bench needs work & more HAAAATRED!!!! :devil: :devil:


----------



## MarkH

I used to do Olympic style weight lifting, if anyone has any questions about thisl free to ask?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> I used to do Olympic style weight lifting, if anyone has any questions about thisl free to ask?


Any help on improving my Bench Press & Over Head/Front Press strength would be great mate as I seem incredibly weak in these lifts. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday's 5X5

Really strange, felt low on energy. But had good results, perhaps the curry last night helped  :devil: :devil:

*Squat 114KG/256.5LB 5X5 :thumb:*

*Overhead Press 58KG/130.5LB 5X5, very pleased with this *

*Dead Lift moved up to 130KG/292.5 just to see how it felt, result 1X5 *:thumb: :thumb: Felt light, but I'll stick to adding 2KG/4.5LB for a few weeks.

Adding another 2KG/4.5LB to all exercises except my bench which is still a measly 85KG/191.25LB


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> Any help on improving my Bench Press & Over Head/Front Press strength would be great mate as I seem incredibly weak in these lifts. :thumb:


I would put them at the start of the workout, I don't know your current routine but if you are only training these body parts once a week, think about doing them twice a week, one heavy one medium light?


----------



## MarkH

I would also avoid doing singles only rarely and I personally think 5x4 reps is a better routine as the time taken to do 5 reps means the white fast twitch fibres are getting to the end of their use.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> I would put them at the start of the workout, I don't know your current routine but if you are only training these body parts once a week, think about doing them twice a week, one heavy one medium light?





MarkH said:


> I would also avoid doing singles only rarely and I personally think 5x4 reps is a better routine as the time taken to do 5 reps means the white fast twitch fibres are getting to the end of their use.


Just started to do Benches at beginning, the squats were taking it out of me :thumb:

I have tried incorporating a light training day many years ago & soon lost inspiration, its all or nothing for me 

Bench Press is done once one week, twice following week, then i repeat.

I have always trained for strength not for size, even when doing bodybuilding exercises the emphasis was always low reps & progressively add weight for strength.

However I like the idea of 5X4 as many years ago I used to do a 1-4 rep range, adding 2KG/4.5LB, once 4 reps was achieved. As the weights get heavier doing 5 reps is tiring, I can also see why you bring the total number of sets down. My best strength gains were with the 1-4 rep range too; ironically this is where I gained the most size which goes against all the books ive read 

This first 5X5 phase requires I Squat 3 times a week; I'm beginning to think twice is more than enough, what do you think Mark? And replace with perhaps a Standing calf raise, 1-4 reps, powerlifting style?


----------



## MarkH

To be honest there are so many routines and variety of routines out there it is easy to get overloaded by information and let common sense pass you by.

A lot of people write routines and books because they are good at writing and trying to make a living, some champions will tell you how they train but you can't train the same way, because you are not the same and will have to change your routine to overcome your own weakness, if you don't you will always be weak!

If you don't like an exercise or are weak at it, do it as soon as you walk in the gym, do it more and more frequently and you will master it and become stronger at it.

Becoming stronger is not about strength training, it is about weakness training!

In the end what do you want to achieve out of your training?


----------



## Matt.

Doug, i'm calling on you here.

How do you know what certain excersises are. Such as - Bent Over Row - Overhand Grip? 

I really want to get a bit of shape for my holiday and then keep it up. It's a incentive for me.


----------



## MarkH

Overhand means your knuckles are on top of the bar

Underhand=reverse

And for demos get a smartphone app or have a look at youtube?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> To be honest there are so many routines and variety of routines out there it is easy to get overloaded by information and let common sense pass you by.
> 
> A lot of people write routines and books because they are good at writing and trying to make a living, some champions will tell you how they train but you can't train the same way, because you are not the same and will have to change your routine to overcome your own weakness, if you don't you will always be weak!
> 
> If you don't like an exercise or are weak at it, do it as soon as you walk in the gym, do it more and more frequently and you will master it and become stronger at it.
> 
> Becoming stronger is not about strength training, it is about weakness training!
> 
> In the end what do you want to achieve out of your training?


I want maximum strength gains/the ability to execute the following barbell exercises with the most weight possible for me in good form for 1-4/5 reps

Squat
Deadlift
Standing Calve Raise
Flat Bench press
Standing Overhead Press
Bent over row (Overhand & underhand grips)
Close Grip Bench Press
Shoulder Shrug
Upright Row

Goal weights for single rep lifts:

Squat: 500LB 
Deadlift: 500LB
Bench Press: 450-500LB
Overhead Press: Have no idea one what is a sensible goal on this lift

I was intending to do 10 week phases of the 5X5, on each new 10 week phase remove some exercise & replace with some of the above & max out. And move them around for instance doing more deadlifts than squats on one 10 week phase.

This first 10 week phase i emphasise Squat, Deadlift, bench, Overhead press & bent over row (Overhand grip)

Next 10 week phase replace one of the squat days with the Standing calf raise & the bent over row over hand grip with a bent over row underhand grip.

And so on until I've done all the above exercises then start again & keep going through these 10 week phases, with one week off between phases & as the weight gets heavier reduce the amount of sets & bring reps down to 4.

Hope this makes sense 

If you want to know why i want to train in such a way, i love the challenge of lifting heavy weights, it just makes me feel reall good, im happiest when im training, i love to hate the weights. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Doug, i'm calling on you here.
> 
> How do you know what certain excersises are. Such as - Bent Over Row - Overhand Grip?
> 
> I really want to get a bit of shape for my holiday and then keep it up. It's a incentive for me.


Hiya matt also go here: http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercises/

Shows you loads of exercises with videos :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Bent over rowing, I have always found to be an injury promoting exercise along with a fair few other people, so I like to do that one concentrating on form and function more than the weight I lift.

Standing calf raise, I can move **** loads of weight on that, but have never heard of anyone wanting to break any records with that exercise before 

Shrugs who can say what is a good shrug or a bad one, I think again form is more important with this one?

In powerlifting the heaviest is usually dl then squat then bp, who's routine are you following?


----------



## Matt.

Do you guys take any supplements? Creatine or tablets?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Bent over rowing, I have always found to be an injury promoting exercise along with a fair few other people, so I like to do that one concentrating on form and function more than the weight I lift.
> 
> Standing calf raise, I can move **** loads of weight on that, but have never heard of anyone wanting to break any records with that exercise before
> 
> Shrugs who can say what is a good shrug or a bad one, I think again form is more important with this one?
> 
> In powerlifting the heaviest is usually dl then squat then bp, who's routine are you following?


Totally agree Mark, every exercise i do is with strict form :thumb:

Not into breaking anyone else's records, just setting my own goals, i train alone.

I'm following the stronglifts 5X5 for my first 10 week phase. Nice mix of core multi joint exercises.

Always welcome input though from others :thumb:

I like your attitude "weakness training" :thumb: Something to remember :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Do you guys take any supplements? Creatine or tablets?


*Never! i eat whole foods, if i need proptein i eat nuts & drink milk or add extra meat/fish to my weeks food intake :thumb:*


----------



## MarkH

Hi Matt, I found creatine worked but it is a very individual thing, I take multivitamins, flax seed oil helps my joints, vitamin d3, zinc, magnesium and extra protein.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Hi Matt, I found creatine worked but it is a very individual thing, I take multivitamins, flax seed oil helps my joints, vitamin d3, zinc, magnesium and extra protein.


At my age (43), would it be beneficial to take flax seed oil for my old joints Mark?


----------



## JJ_

If I am just doing your normal 10x3 would 5x5 allow me to get "bigger" I have always stuck to (10) reps and trying to lift more, I am not too sure if this is the right way to go about it. Basically I just want to get bigger, I already high quality food about 6 times a day quite a lot of protein but my but a decent amount of carbs as I find sometimes I can get a bit hypo if I haven't taken enough decent carbs on, diet has always been protein heavy, im near 6 foot and 14 stone.


----------



## JJ_

ITHAQVA said:


> At my age (43), would it be beneficial to take flax seed oil for my old joints Mark?


You could look at glucosamine, flax seed is worth taking. One of the important things when training hard as you'll know is waste, not the nicest of topics but you want to keep things moving and most of these oils will help you as well as staying hydrated.

On a seperate note what's your take on fish oils guy ? I have been reading most of use have a real problem with getting enough fish oil in our diet. I am a bit supplement heavy with protein shakes before and after and two types of vits as well as omega oils and sometimes ecinachea. Never taken creatine and I don't have any caffeien unless I feel my recovery is slow and will start on green tea which is superb, I really feel a benefit.

I find when I lift heavy that day and the next I need to up my intake of high iron content products, I do have a problem that my white a red cells are the same size so this is only really an issue when I am pushing myself.


----------



## ITHAQVA

JJ_ said:


> If I am just doing your normal 10x3 would 5x5 allow me to get "bigger" I have always stuck to my lifting less (10) reps and trying to lift more, I am not too sure if this is the right way to go about it. Basically I just want to get bigger, I already eat good food about 6 times a day quite a lot of protein but my diet has always been protein heavy, im near 6 foot and 14 stone.


The low rep stuff makes me go bigger, but if you read the forums & books they say a higher volume 6-8 rep range is more for size.

I have done a 10 week 6-8 bodybuilding style workout & it did increase my size also.

Its always worth trying a 10 week low rep workout, you might have the same genetics as me & increase size & strenght.. Bonus :thumb:

Loads of different 5X5 routines online, stronglifts, madcow & several on Bodybuilding.com :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JJ_ said:


> You could look at glucosamine, flax seed is worth taking. One of the important things when training hard as you'll know is waste, not the nicest of topics but you want to keep things moving and most of these oils will help you as well as staying hydrated.
> 
> On a seperate note what's your take on fish oils guy ? I have been reading most of use have a real problem with getting enough fish oil in our diet. I am a bit supplement heavy with protein shakes before and after and two types of vits as well as omega oils and sometimes ecinachea. Never taken creatine and I don't have any caffeien unless I feel my recovery is slow and will start on green tea which is superb, I really feel a benefit.
> 
> I find when I lift heavy that day and the next I need to up my intake of high iron content products, I do have a problem that my white a red cells are the same size so this is only really an issue when I am pushing myself.


I have not gotten too involved with supplements as I've always tried to get my nutrition from whole foods. There is so much hype about supplements i steer clear, just learn ya nutrition & keep your diet balanced with whole foods fresh veg & fruit, for me I'm not into competition so as long as i can reach my strength/lifting goals i take it my body is getting all it needs :thumb:

I think your mind set is more important, hate those weights grrrrrrrrrrrrrr 

Yes its a loose attitude to nutrition but it does work for me


----------



## stuart1164

I have been training for 24 years now mainly Powerlifting but at 47 it's not quite Powerlifting compared to 20 years ago.

I still do heavy on the square, bench and deadliest.

I take a decent protein and some no-explode ( nitres oxide ) for huge energy on training days.

Some excellent advice being given here with the different routines etc.

Wow, Squats and Deadlift on the same day that is knackering that will take a huge amount out of you so don't be surprised if energy is depleted after doing that.

Bench I would do twice per week to help improve it you will be surprised how this will help and all of a sudden your weights will take a surge then you will stay there for a while then another surge.

You could also use different hand grips such as narrow, normal, wide for 6 weeks or so this will help shock the muscle group and help develop growth.

As said before everyone is different so change thing around to see what is suitable and do supplement exercises although you are probably doing this already I've just not picked up on it.

It's all worth it.

Stuart.


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> At my age (43), would it be beneficial to take flax seed oil for my old joints Mark?


I only take flax seed as I can't tolerate fish oil, which I think is superior, I believe most scientists agree that if you can take one supplement fish oil is the one!


----------



## MarkH

It is nice to talk about training in a relaxed way a lot of threads/forums, have threads where it all gets aggressive


----------



## MarkH

One thing I would say is not to bogged down in one particular rep/set range or exercises, training variety/exercises is hugely important and will keep you mobile for longer and lifting for longer.

If you are 43 the reality is you have to be careful, I am 45 and last year I was training six days a week and unfortunately fractured my spine squatting. I was lucky and it had no long term consequences, but strength training has it's price to pay. Avoid big singles though, they do little to improve strength they are only an indicator of strength!


----------



## JJ_

What would you suggest mark for increasing size ?


----------



## MarkH

JJ_ said:


> What would you suggest mark for increasing size ?


Sorry bud, I don't know your personal circumstances, and I have never trained for size.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> I only take flax seed as I can't tolerate fish oil, which I think is superior, I believe most scientists agree that if you can take one supplement fish oil is the one!





MarkH said:


> It is nice to talk about training in a relaxed way a lot of threads/forums, have threads where it all gets aggressive





MarkH said:


> One thing I would say is not to bogged down in one particular rep/set range or exercises, training variety/exercises is hugely important and will keep you mobile for longer and lifting for longer.
> 
> If you are 43 the reality is you have to be careful, I am 45 and last year I was training six days a week and unfortunately fractured my spine squatting. I was lucky and it had no long term consequences, but strength training has it's price to pay. Avoid big singles though, they do little to improve strength they are only an indicator of strength!


Many thanks for your replies Mark.

On your points:

1) I will look into fish oil a it is constantly stated that some oil is good for joints & i feel joint health IS important as your bones/joints are the foundation on which your muscles are layered upon :thumb:

2) I totally agree Mark, i see no point in all the ego manly aggression stuff, i mean why, doing weights is my passion I'm not going to be mean to anyone who disagrees with my take on the sport & you never know i might learn something by listening to all the differing opinions :thumb:

3) Agree on changing exercises, that's why I'm doing 10 week phases to give variety 

4) I only do singles just to gauge my strength, once i reach my goal weights I'll just keep training. I've only done two single deadlifts this month :thumb:

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

stuart1164 said:


> I still do heavy on the square, bench and *deadliest*. :lol::lol::lol:
> Wow, Squats and Deadlift on the same day that is knackering that will take a huge amount out of you so don't be surprised if energy is depleted after doing that.


It's not too bad as i only do Squat 5X5 (3 times a week, going down to twice soon) & 1X5 Deadlift (Once/Twice a week, depending what week it is)

At the moment my weights are:

Squat: 116KG/261LB
Deadlift: 132KG/297LB, I'm not really pushing myself so energy isn't such an issue...Yet  :thumb:

Doug


----------



## stuart1164

ITHAQVA said:


> It's not too bad as i only do Squat 5X5 (3 times a week, going down to twice soon) & 1X5 Deadlift (Once/Twice a week, depending what week it is)
> 
> At the moment my weights are:
> 
> Squat: 116KG/261LB
> Deadlift: 132KG/297LB, I'm not really pushing myself so energy isn't such an issue...Yet  :thumb:
> 
> Doug


If you saw how some perform the dead lift you would call it the deadliest :lol:

OK it was prediction text and I was knackered :lol:

To help with Bench do you do a lot of tricep work, that is one of the main elements of bench press more so than shoulders but shoulders are needed for additional strength and balance.

What depth are you doing with the Squats and do you touch the chest when benching?

The weights you are lifting are very good considering Squats and dead lift on the same day both of these are full body exercises.

Last question, Do you do much ancillary work for each muscle group?

This morning is back and shoulders day for me including the Dead lift.

My weakest point is by far shoulders but I keep on it all the same.

Just when I think I'm getting good gains I get a slight injury oh well must be genetic yet another flaw in my make up.

Stuart.


----------



## Guest

Matt. said:


> Do you guys take any supplements? Creatine or tablets?


I use whey based protein to boost my intake. I've just started taking Creatine (CreaPure) and Fish Oil.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stuart1164 said:


> *If you saw how some perform the dead lift you would call it the deadliest :lol:
> 
> OK it was prediction text and I was knackered :lol:* :lol::lol:
> 
> * I Ensure I deadlift slow up & down, I never drop the weight, always make sure i use my legs in the lift & not to move my back too much :thumb:*
> 
> *To help with Bench do you do a lot of tricep work,*
> 
> *The next phase I'm considering putting the Close Grip Bench Press in, i really feel the triceps power with this exercise & I love it :thumb: *
> 
> *What depth are you doing with the Squats and do you touch the chest when benching?*
> 
> *Squats are around horizontal for starting position but was thinking about going lower.
> On the bench i touch my lower chest. Think I need to work on technique as I've watched a few YouTube examples by coaches & I'm doing it bodybuilding style at the mo, i need to bring my feet back & arch my back slightly, i have done this in the past but never realise it was a specific for powerlifting *
> 
> The weights you are lifting are very good considering Squats and dead lift on the same day both of these are full body exercises. *Thanks Stu :thumb:*
> 
> *Last question, Do you do much ancillary work for each muscle group?*
> 
> *On my last 10 week phase i did Barbell Curls, shoulder shrugs, upright rows(love this movement, you really feel your whole arms work :thumb, close grip bench press & some standing triceps extensions. Bent over rows (Overhand & underhand, love the rows :thumb absolutely hate dumbells, I love the barbell :thumb:*
> 
> This morning is back and shoulders day for me including the Dead lift.
> 
> My weakest point is by far shoulders but I keep on it all the same.
> 
> Just when I think I'm getting good gains I get a slight injury oh well must be genetic yet another flaw in my make up.
> 
> *I was watching the weightlifting on Eurosport last night & the commentator said something to the effect of "Injuries are the breaks between competitions"!  :lol: *


Doug


----------



## stuart1164

ITHAQVA said:


> [/COLOR]
> Doug


Doug, Your style seems to be perfect.

I would break up the major lifts rather than doing it all on the one day.

Powerlifters generally only do these lifts together when nearing a competition.

After Squats consider leg press/hack Squats.

You are right regarding the bench with positioning your body with arching and you can endorse 
this by pressing on a normal, high and low basis building inner, outer and central chest not to mention your strength.

Try wide grip and pressing from the top of your chest not much movement but wow you will feel it.

It would be good to know what gains you have made in around 8 weeks time.

Stuart.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stuart1164 said:


> Doug, Your style seems to be perfect.
> 
> I would break up the major lifts rather than doing it all on the one day.
> 
> Powerlifters generally only do these lifts together when nearing a competition.
> 
> After Squats consider leg press/hack Squats.
> 
> You are right regarding the bench with positioning your body with arching and you can endorse
> this by pressing on a normal, high and low basis building inner, outer and central chest not to mention your strength.
> 
> Try wide grip and pressing from the top of your chest not much movement but wow you will feel it.
> 
> It would be good to know what gains you have made in around 8 weeks time.
> 
> Stuart.


Thanks Stu :thumb:

Can't really do anything but Squats, Deadlifts & standing Calf raises. This is the equipment i have http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211 :thumb: I love my Power rack!  

I do feel that the stronglifts 3 x week squat regime is a bit much, but it's only for the first 10 week phase until you can squat 1.5 times body weight approx. 140/150 KG, not sure if this is for reps or a single lift. I'm considering doing 3X5 deadlift on one of the squat days & replacing the 1X5 deadlift space with another exercise, possibly a 3X5 Close Grip Bench Press (Start light with 40KG/90LB to get the feel of it again) :thumb:

As of next week I'm doing bench press before squats all the time now :thumb:

Goals/gains, I would love to keep adding 2KG/4.5LB each session until I've done 10 weeks, but if i manage this at least once a week for every exercise i will be very pleased.

Conservative projected 5 rep goals in 5 weeks time. Bench Press, Bent over row & Overhead press will be the hardest to achieve goals on.

Squat: 126KG/283.5LB

Deadlift: 140KG/315LB

Bench Press: 95KG/213.75LB

Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip) 89KG/200.25LB

Overhead Press: 70KG/157.5LB

Doug


----------



## stuart1164

Hi Doug, very nice piece of equipment looks so secure and well made.

There is a huge amount of exercises you can do on this I know I done it when staying at different hotels for a few years.

Incline/decline bench plus what was mentioned in the last post.

Squats you can introduce heals raised as well as front Squats.

For back you can do rack deadlift which you will handle more weight so then when doing deadlift off the floor it will seem lighter than normal.

So lots of alternative things you can do.

As for your goal for 140/150KG squat to get 1.5 of body weight yes that is 
generally for a single but as you are doing 5 reps with 126KG then that should be achievable now.

When getting to these weights a belt and knee wraps should be used plus they give more confidence.

Go for gold but be safe.

Stuart.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stuart1164 said:


> Hi Doug, very nice piece of equipment looks so secure and well made.
> 
> *I'm really pleased with it, excellent value for money :thumb:*
> 
> There is a huge amount of exercises you can do on this I know I done it when staying at different hotels for a few years.
> 
> Incline/decline bench plus what was mentioned in the last post.
> 
> Squats you can introduce heals raised as well as front Squats.
> 
> *Front Squats always feel really weird; bet they are also good for upper body strength? *
> 
> For back you can do rack deadlift which you will handle more weight so then when doing deadlift off the floor it will seem lighter than normal.
> 
> *Rack Deadlift? Just seen this on YouTube, like the idea of that for future use.* :thumb: :thumb:
> 
> So lots of alternative things you can do.
> 
> As for your goal for 140/150KG squat to get 1.5 of body weight yes that is
> Generally for a single but as you are doing 5 reps with 126KG then that should be achievable now.
> 
> When getting to these weights a belt and knee wraps should be used plus they give more confidence.
> 
> *I like to not use any supports as it seems to defeat my goals, if I can't lift raw, i feel that using supports is cheating myself, one heavy single lifts I will agree though* :thumb:
> 
> *I feel confident i can Squat & deadlift much more as long as i keep my from strict & warm up were needed.* :thumb:
> 
> *Always welcome feedback from yourself & others as I've always trained alone, I'm a little naive on the subject, i just read as much as i can & listen to my own body. *
> 
> Go for gold but be safe. *100% with you Stu, im not breaking my body for my goals, but want to grow to achieve my goals * :thumb:
> 
> Stuart.


:thumb: :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wo been away from here for a few days due to family issues and looks like there is some really good info on here now.

With regards to program I dont thing there is any magic programs out there, programs are only as good for as long as they are working. I have hundreds of spreadsheets that I have made of different workouts that I used to do that I thought looked good but I was defiently one of these people guilty of program jumping trying to find the holy grail program. Now I have decided on a program and I will stick with it until I stop making any gains.

Deadlift / Squat / Bench Press Frequentcy I think these is one of these subjects that is down to personnal preference. I would say the rule of thumb is that the stronger you become the longer it takes you to recover so you can hit certain exercises less frequent but then I know some really strong Olympic lifters who train 1 exercise a number of times a week for crazy volume. Smolov Squat routine for example. I know that I cannot keep doing 5x5 3 times a week for squats as my recovery isnt good enough so your 2 main choices are cut your volume or cut your frequentcy of exercise. Other people change the exercise every few weeks even every week but keep it close to the original exercise, Bench Press to Close Grip Bench Press fr example.

I take supplements but I dont really take any of the marketing hype supplements just the supplemtns that help your diet really. Whey Protein is always good as it is hard and expensive these days to get protein in your diet, fish oil as not alot of people have good quality fish a few times a week, multi vit as you need a varied diet to hit all your vitamins and minerals so it easier to haveeverything covered, I have tried with creatine but different people have different results and alot of people I know have had digustion discomfort with it. The last one that I sometimes take is ZMA, nothing to do with all the hype and claims but purely because people who weight train are normally low in Zinc and Mag so it is a good supplement to keep you balanced


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wo been away from here for a few days due to family issues and looks like there is some really good info on here now.
> 
> With regards to program I dont thing there is any magic programs out there, programs are only as good for as long as they are working. I have hundreds of spreadsheets that I have made of different workouts that I used to do that I thought looked good but I was defiently one of these people guilty of program jumping trying to find the holy grail program. Now I have decided on a program and I will stick with it until I stop making any gains.
> 
> Deadlift / Squat / Bench Press Frequentcy I think these is one of these subjects that is down to personnal preference. I would say the rule of thumb is that the stronger you become the longer it takes you to recover so you can hit certain exercises less frequent but then I know some really strong Olympic lifters who train 1 exercise a number of times a week for crazy volume. Smolov Squat routine for example. I know that I cannot keep doing 5x5 3 times a week for squats as my recovery isnt good enough so your 2 main choices are cut your volume or cut your frequentcy of exercise. Other people change the exercise every few weeks even every week but keep it close to the original exercise, Bench Press to Close Grip Bench Press fr example.
> 
> I take supplements but I dont really take any of the marketing hype supplements just the supplemtns that help your diet really. Whey Protein is always good as it is hard and expensive these days to get protein in your diet, fish oil as not alot of people have good quality fish a few times a week, multi vit as you need a varied diet to hit all your vitamins and minerals so it easier to haveeverything covered, I have tried with creatine but different people have different results and alot of people I know have had digustion discomfort with it. The last one that I sometimes take is ZMA, nothing to do with all the hype and claims but purely because people who weight train are normally low in Zinc and Mag so it is a good supplement to keep you balanced


Hope things are ok mate & Family issues get sorted :thumb:

Nice to see input from some experienced guys. :thumb:

I'm pretty much in love with the 5x5 & will stick to it & a few variations of my own as mentioned already. It feels so right for me.
I agree with the Recovery stuff from both yourself, Stu & Mark, I will be reducing my squats to twice a week as soon as I do my 1.5 times body weight single lift, might have a go within two weeks :thumb: :devil:

I'm actually very surprised how well I'm doing, i thought my age would hinder me, my confidence in my own ability to lift is increasing even with my Bench setbacks & I know there will be some plateaus, but my plan is to reduce sets when I get a sticking point & just enjoy the ride 

Many thanks for the help & support guys :thumb: 

Doug.


----------



## Bod42

Rens came all the way to NZ and my Dad has been in hospital from day 1 with Kidney stones so not the best holiday for them so far. Been trying to fit training in but not themost important thing right now.

You need to find out what works best for your body, lower volume or lower frequentcy. The natural progresion from 5x5 is Madcow and he keeps squatting 3 times a week but one day is a light day so this doesnt effect recovery that bad. 5x5 is straight sets but Madcow uses progressive sets where the weight gets heavier each set so really your only doing 1x5. This is similar to 5/3/1 where you do one all out set and it works. It sounds easy but I dont think you cant do a workout like this until you can squat 1.5xBW as it hasnt got enough volume.

I think 5x5 is one of the best programs out there and I must say I have never trained anyone who hasnt progressed on the pogram.

For the people on here who want to put on size, I always recommend not listening to the magazines you buy that list Ronnie Coleman's workouts as it wont be right for you as he/they are on massive amounts of gear. What I recommend is to train for strength so in the 3-6 reps range (I dont recommend under 3 reps for beginners as form breaks down), I had alot of people argue that the best hypertrophy range is 12-15 reps and there is alot of reserch to prove this but if you start weightlifting tomorrow with just the 20kg bar and in 6 months you can do 100kg there is no way that your arms and chest wont grow. Also putting on arm size curling 5kg DBs is got to be harder than putting on size curling 25kg DBs so just work on strength.

Thanks for everyones input so far.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> How do you rate seated shoulder presses over standing Bod?


The only reason I do Seated Shoulder press is that the weights hit the floor above so I cant do standing Shoulder Press. I would always recommend doing standing as it works your core alot harder as your transfering the force through your feet up through your body up to the bar. I dont use a back support like you see people using for DB press, this way it uses my core and I still have to concentrate on getting my head/shoulder under the bar.

BUT when I'm testing peoples strength say at the local rugby club I would do Seated Shoulder Press purely as its a level playing field then as I found some people would push press using a big leg drive and others wouldnt which made it unfair. The same reason I use a Box squat, that way there is no doubt if the lift was to the correct depth or not.


----------



## MarkH

Bod42 said:


> Deadlift / Squat / Bench Press Frequentcy I think these is one of these subjects that is down to personnal preference. I would say the rule of thumb is that the stronger you become the longer it takes you to recover so you can hit certain exercises less frequent but then I know some really strong Olympic lifters who train 1 exercise a number of times a week for crazy volume. Smolov Squat routine for example. I know that I cannot keep doing 5x5 3 times a week for squats as my recovery isn't good enough so your 2 main choices are cut your volume or cut your frequency of exercise


I used to train with a lot of volume work, training for six days a week and squatting for five of those, and the main hurdle you face is psychological, saying to yourself you can't do it, or thinking you have some twinge that means you can't train. The reality is you can do it, but you are walking into a gym with sore muscles and training them again.

Then you realise you have to focus on your recovery, getting enough sleep, good food and supplements. Also you have to make sure you have a good routine written by someone who actually knows what they are talking about.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Cheers for all the feedback guys  :thumb:


I will stick to the Standing Overhead press; need to raise the power rack up just a little as I touch the top of the rack on full extension of the exercise.

Hopefully tonight’s session will go well.

I will continue with a 1-4 or 5 rep range as my goals are for strength.


Many thanks to all of you for your support guys :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Very Pleased.*

Mondays 5X5

*Bench Press: 85KG/191.25LB 5X5 *:thumb: :thumb:

*Squat: 116KG/261LB 5X5 *:thumb:

*Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip): 79KG/ 177.75LB 5X5 *:thumb:

Really good session, felt good in all exercises, Bench seemed to be no problem, Squat & Bent over row felt very posative too.

Another 2KG/4.5LB added to all exercises  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday (missed Monday as Picking Dad up from Hospital)

Squats 110kg 3 x 5
Bench Press 105kg 5,5,5,4,3
Pendlay Rows 72.5 5 x 5

Squats, the reasons I lowered the weight were firstly because I was basically being a pussy and couldnt be bothered to hit it hard at 5:30am and the second reason was, I know this sounds weird, but because I was watching video's of my Golf Swing from the range Sunday and realised that I'm trying to cure the symptons of my squat problems not the problem itself. For years I have hit the ball with my head behindthe ball and coaches and I have tried all sorts of things to cure it but the entire reason I move my head away from the ball at impact is because I reverse pivot and move my head towards the target on the backswing, cure this and I dont need to move my head away from the target. Anyway on squatting I come out of the hole fast and then struggle to straighten my back, I tried to keep my chest/head up, tried to force my elbows forward, taken a narrower grip so my upper back is tighter, tried to strengthen my lower back with direct work, they all helped but didnt cure the probelm. Looking at my form I am moving forwards off the box which makes the exercise easier as it puts the pressure on my quads which are stronger but then increases the angle of my back which I then struggle to straighten. Today I concentrated on pusing through my heels and using my posterier chain to get off the box, this resulted in my hips going straight up instead of forwards meaning I kept my back angle easier so hopefully in a few weeks I will be breaking PRs as my form has improved. I know your probably thinking how the hell did I compare squatting to golf but I analyze evrything.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hiya Bod,

Hope all is well with ya dad mate :thumb:


Power lifting & Golf, that’s a Bit like eating spaghetti with marshmallows  

Still impressive weights Bod any way you look at it mate :thumb:


This thread is therapy for power lifters.

"Hi, my names Doug & my bench press really sucks major balls"


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hiya Bod,
> 
> Hope all is well with ya dad mate :thumb:
> 
> Power lifting & Golf, that's a Bit like eating spaghetti with marshmallows
> 
> Still impressive weights Bod any way you look at it mate :thumb:
> 
> This thread is therapy for power lifters.
> 
> "Hi, my names Doug & my bench press really sucks major balls"


Ya but on a Forum we dont have to do the group therapy thing and hug :lol:

Rugby and Golf were my 2 main sports, got offered scholarships for them both but couldnt decide so took neither and thought the chancesof making ti pro were to slim. Started lifting weights for rugby and you be surprised how much it helps golf, after all it is a power sport really as your swing the club at 120+mph.

My problem is when I start thinking the weights are impressive, last times I got to 140kg Bench Press, I remember thinking awesome I hit my goal and then I kind of stoped trying so hard. Suppose thats why they say you should always train with people stronger than you. My goals are double all those weights so not impressive yet but one day they will be


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Very pleased again*

*Wednesday 5X5*

*Overhead Press: 60KG/135LB 5X5 *:thumb::thumb:
Really wierd the first set felt the hardest, by the time i got to the last two sets it was easy, ive never had this before any ideas guys 

*Squat: 118KG/265.5LB 5X5 *:thumb:

*DeadLift: 132KG/297LB 5X5 * :thumb:
Felt heavy & grip was a little uneasy on the last rep, but hey i got 1X5 

Another 2KG/4.5LB to all exercises, i havent lifted as well as this since i was in my early thirties, it makes a huge difference knowing there is something there to keep things safe :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

It can be a weird thing with shoulder press they can take a few sets to warm up properly and the last sets are the strongest


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> It can be a weird thing with shoulder press they can take a few sets to warm up properly and the last sets are the strongest


Strange you say that, i thought the same but also thought id sound a git if i said it & was wrong 

Thanks for the info Mark :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Good stuff maybe try bumping the weight up on the last couple of sets  ?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Good stuff maybe try bumping the weight up on the last couple of sets  ?


Now that sounds like a plan, cheers Mark :thumb:


----------



## JamesGarner

Was well chuffed to get up to 150kg dead-lift last night 
right up to the point an instructor told me it was only a female Olympic bar (biggest they have)
F**k F**k F**k F**k F********k

tried banging 5kg on for a final few reps but i was to knackered to lock out :wall::wall::wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JamesGarner said:


> Was well chuffed to get up to 150kg dead-lift last night
> right up to the point an instructor told me it was only a female Olympic bar (biggest they have)
> F**k F**k F**k F**k F********k
> 
> tried banging 5kg on for a final few reps but i was to knackered to lock out :wall::wall::wall:


Nice weight mate grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr give it some 150KG :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday 5X5

*Bench Press: 87KG/195.75LB 5X5*, felt heavy & every rep was hard work, pleasantly surprised, I made a full 5X5.

*Squat: 120KG/270LB 5X5*, this felt so light I thought I'd put the wrong plates on, WTF is going on?

*Bent over Row (Overhand Grip): 81KG/182.25LB 5X5*, lower back felt very good & strong, any ideas how heavy I can safely go guys, what are your experiences, I will of course listen to my body at all times. Tempted to rest my head on the bench so that I reduce the stress on my lower back when this gets really heavy, anyone have any experience with this?

Going to order the Olympic weight set very soon, has anyone successfully done barbell curls with a 7' Olympic bar?

Failing that I will need to purchase one of these in the future:

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/olympic_bars/bodypower_olympic_combo_bar/3209_p.html

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/olympic_bars/bodypower_olympic_ez_curl_bar/3206_p.html


----------



## Bod42

Looks like your workouts are going well mate, keep it up.

5x5 is weird with Squats 1 workout you can be dead after squats and think in 2 days times I'm never gona be able to do more weight and then its easy. Just means your body is progressing and adapting well.

I have curled with an Olympic Bar but I have one of those EZ Curl Bars and also a Tricep Extension Bar, that way I should ahve nearly everything covered but it will be a while before I use them


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Looks like your workouts are going well mate, keep it up.
> 
> 5x5 is weird with Squats 1 workout you can be dead after squats and think in 2 days times I'm never gona be able to do more weight and then its easy. Just means your body is progressing and adapting well.
> 
> I have curled with an Olympic Bar but I have one of those EZ Curl Bars and also a Tricep Extension Bar, that way I should ahve nearly everything covered but it will be a while before I use them


Thanks mate, I'm really pleased so far, I'm sure there will be a few plateaus from time to time, but I'll just reduce the sets & keep bashing at it 

Thinking about keeping my standard bar & weights for warming up, saves me changing plates on my main Olympic bar & I'll be able to use my Triceps & Curl bars with the standard weights too


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> *Bent over Row (Overhand Grip): 81KG/182.25LB 5X5*, lower back felt very good & strong, any ideas how heavy I can safely go guys, what are your experiences, I will of course listen to my body at all times. Tempted to rest my head on the bench so that I reduce the stress on my lower back when this gets really heavy, anyone have any experience with this?


Wear a belt. There is no 'unsafe' amount to row.

I do all my rowing sets with a belt these days. Resting your head on a bench is a foolish idea IMO.

I hit a Bent Row PR at the weekend- 125kg 5x5 - since i've starting hammering my back again, my bench has gone up - 132.5x3 this weekend. Have a comp at the end of Jan, where I want to lift 240/150/250 raw. Then it'll be time to gear whore it up for a multiply British qualifier in April/May!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Wear a belt. There is no 'unsafe' amount to row.
> 
> I do all my rowing sets with a belt these days. Resting your head on a bench is a foolish idea IMO.
> 
> I hit a Bent Row PR at the weekend- 125kg 5x5 - since i've starting hammering my back again, my bench has gone up - 132.5x3 this weekend. Have a comp at the end of Jan, where I want to lift 240/150/250 raw. Then it'll be time to gear whore it up for a multiply British qualifier in April/May!


Cheers mate, looks like I need a belt... SANTA!!!!!! 

Your weights are impressive mate, best of luck in your competition. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday Workout: (Missed MOnday workout as had to pick Dad up from hospital again)
Box Squats: 112.5kg 3 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 55kg 5,4,4,3,3
Conventional Deadlift: 125.0kg 1 x 5
Chin Ups: 10 x 3

As you may have noticed this is only the 3rd time I have worked out in as many weeks so I thought about deloading to start back in but then thought I was being a pussy as it was 5:30am and I just wanted an easy workout. So glad I decided to stick with Shoulder Press weight as this the best reps I got so far on this exercise. Deloaded Deadlift though. Have been doing 10x3 Chin Ups throughout the workout, I have been doing them at the end but now I start during my workout warm up sets and do chin ups between every set on Deadlift day. 10x4 next time


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers mate, looks like I need a belt... SANTA!!!!!!
> 
> Your weights are impressive mate, best of luck in your competition. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:


Thanks mate, Strength Shop do some decent belts :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Thanks mate, Strength Shop do some decent belts :thumb:


Thanks mate just googled them, excellent stuff :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Fail!!!!*

*Tuesdays 5X5 *

*Really poor workout today.*

*Over Head Press: 62KG/139.5LB 2,1,2,2,2* WTF!!!!!!! must try harder :devil:

*Squat: 122KG/274.5LB 5X5*

*Deadlift: 134KG/301.5LB 1X5 *

Felt very weak in the over head press, wasn't able to focus properly. I will now just concentrate on increasing the reps until i reach a 5X5 :thumb:

Deadlift felt heavy & grip is becoming a little bit difficult, but i train deadlifts Bodybuilding style, let weight just touch floor & go straight back up.

Am I right that a Deadlift powerlifting style is allow the weight fully rest on the floor before going back up, hence deadlift?

One thing that is very good is i didn't allow the low reps on the overhead put me off & i did all 5 sets & carried on with the rest of the workout :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> *Over Head Press: 62KG/139.5LB 2,1,2,2,2* WTF!!!!!!! must try harder :devil:
> 
> Deadlift felt heavy & grip is becoming a little bit difficult, but i train deadlifts Bodybuilding style, let weight just touch floor & go straight back up.
> 
> Am I right that a Deadlift powerlifting style is allow the weight fully rest on the floor before going back up, hence deadlift?


Sometimes you just get workouts like that mate, everyone has had days where you feel great but your last warm up set feels heavy let alone your working set but it works the other way sometimes, you walk in the gym feeling half dead but check the weight after your 1st set as it was so easy.

I used to Deadlift tap and gp style but its seems more suited to Body Buiders as it gives you your time under tension and I personally like a stop and reset between each rep as it helps my form. Like alot of things in weight lifting it is personal preference as I watched video's on youtube of top deadlifters doing it both ways.

I strengthened my grip by doing a timed Hang after every workout which has really seemed to help me and get chalk if you havent already got some. I got s**t loads just sitting thereback in the UK if you need some, either dust or blocks


----------



## sidewalkdances

Always dead stop a deadlift for reps IMO. 

The reason being you end up getting horribly out of position if you touch and go. On a set of 5, you could do 1 rep right, then spend 80% of your set reinforcing bad form. 

And a tip for the OHP - squeeze your glutes HARD - almost like your humping the air, it should be violent to help drive the weight off your shoulders. Very very violent. Do not confuse this with using leg drive (bending the knees and doing a push press) - its just forcefully squeezing the glutes and abs to create a more stable platform.

As it goes, I did OHP - 80x5x5 - which is a PR for reps (my best 1RM OHP is 105kg I think) - hopefully going to do this to get my bench to go up.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Sometimes you just get workouts like that mate, everyone has had days where you feel great but your last warm up set feels heavy let alone your working set but it works the other way sometimes, you walk in the gym feeling half dead but check the weight after your 1st set as it was so easy.
> 
> I used to Deadlift tap and gp style but its seems more suited to Body Buiders as it gives you your time under tension and I personally like a stop and reset between each rep as it helps my form. Like alot of things in weight lifting it is personal preference as I watched video's on youtube of top deadlifters doing it both ways.
> 
> I strengthened my grip by doing a timed Hang after every workout which has really seemed to help me and get chalk if you havent already got some. I got s**t loads just sitting thereback in the UK if you need some, either dust or blocks


Cheers Bod, ive got chalk already thanks mate :thumb:  :thumb:

Im going to Deadlift Powerlifting style from now on, totally understand the form issue if doing Tap & go :thumb:

Whats a timed Hang Bod? 

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Always dead stop a deadlift for reps IMO.
> 
> The reason being you end up getting horribly out of position if you touch and go. On a set of 5, you could do 1 rep right, then spend 80% of your set reinforcing bad form.
> 
> And a tip for the OHP - squeeze your glutes HARD - almost like your humping the air, it should be violent to help drive the weight off your shoulders. Very very violent. Do not confuse this with using leg drive (bending the knees and doing a push press) - its just forcefully squeezing the glutes and abs to create a more stable platform.
> 
> As it goes, I did OHP - 80x5x5 - which is a PR for reps (my best 1RM OHP is 105kg I think) - hopefully going to do this to get my bench to go up.


Going to take on board what you & bod are saying, going to stop after each rep Power lifting style. Yep the touch & go last night was not as good as I would like & can see the reason behind a stop & go approach :thumb:

Will give the AIR HUMPING a go, sounds like a good idea, I can see that creating a stable body platform will help me drive the weight up. Excellent stuff.

80KG 5X5 holy F*****G S**T!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nice!!! :thumb:

I'm only on 62KG 

But the good thing is, you guys are actually pushing me on with your advice & the weights your throwing around :thumb: :thumb: 
All positive stuff me thinks :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

what if you cant do standing OHP. Ive got my gym in the conservatory and nearly put the polycarb roof through when doing OHP. That was with small plates.

Once i put the bigger plates on i wont be able to do it standing.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Zavikas Presses :thumb:

Or go outside :thumb: 

My press needs to get to 100x5x5 - it's been a goal of mine for a while


----------



## Bod42

Estoril-5 said:


> what if you cant do standing OHP. Ive got my gym in the conservatory and nearly put the polycarb roof through when doing OHP. That was with small plates.
> 
> Once i put the bigger plates on i wont be able to do it standing.


Just do seated without a back rest, its what I do. That way you can still move your face out of the way on the way up and drive forcefully between your arms for the lockout. You see people use back rests but the finishing position of an OHP should be with the bar behind your head. Sounds weird but get someone to take a picture of you from the side in the top position and the weight should finish in a dead straight line from yoru shoulders up


----------



## Bod42

Thursday

Squats 115kg 3 x 5
Bench Press 105kg 5,5,5,5,3
Pendlay Rows 75kg 5 x 5

Squats are feeling good hopefully I can smash my sticking point before as my back feels less stressed and more upright now I'm pushing through my heels.

Bench Press, only one more rep but one more rep is still progression.

Pendlay Rows, moved my grip more into my fingers and it seems to allow me to pull better.

ITHAQVA: Timed Hangs are just hanging off the Chin Up Bar for as long as you can. I normally do these on my Deadlift and Chin Up day so my grip is already fried and on my last set of Chins I do a negative last rep and then hang in the bottom position (keep your lats tensed tho so your shoulder joints dont take the strane) until my grip fails. Dont know if these help but its similar to a timed DB/BB hold but with no additional setup time.

I changed from Touch and Go to Dead stop and my Deadlift is going well considering it used to be my worst exercise and my body is def suited to Sumo Style but I gone back to Conventional as it has more carry ver to sport. Dont know if thats the Dead stop or not but I feel more confident pushing the weight harder

Sidewalkdance: ITHAQVA tooks the words right out of my mouth holy F*****G S**T!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nice!!! 105kg is awesome, I been pleased with my progress on OHP and Im half that. OK I can do more standing but not double. Respect

Re: OHP check this out http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/ssbbt3_learning_to_press


----------



## MarkH

sidewalkdances said:


> Wear a belt. There is no 'unsafe' amount to row.


With all due respect what makes you say that?


----------



## Modmedia

Makes my figures weak, I've only been doing SS for a few weeks.

Squat 70kg
Bench 42.5kg
Deadlify 80kg
Overhead Press 32.5kg (hard, I hate these)
Rows 40kg I think from memory


----------



## Bod42

Modmedia said:


> Makes my figures weak, I've only been doing SS for a few weeks.
> 
> Squat 70kg
> Bench 42.5kg
> Deadlify 80kg
> Overhead Press 32.5kg (hard, I hate these)
> Rows 40kg I think from memory


Thats good for just a few weeks mate keep hitting the gym and they will increase in no time. I started a couple of the forwards at the rugby club with just the bar. God they were pissed but some still struggled to hit parallel on squats with jus the bar.


----------



## Bod42

MarkH said:


> With all due respect what makes you say that?


I kind of agree with sidewalk dance as when rowing your back should be totally locked into place, I know you watch people on the Lat Pull Down and doing Rows moving their upper body a stupid amount but this is wrong. You should be using the static strength of your back and everyones static strength far outweights your concentric strength so you should never really injure your back doing rows unless you got awful form.


----------



## MarkH

Thanks bod, do you guys train together?


----------



## Bod42

MarkH said:


> Thanks bod, do you guys train together?


Na I'm in New Zealand at present so its abit far to commute to the gym.

It would be good to train with someone like him though as you should always try and train with people who are stronger than you, its give you more determination to succeed when watching other people move crazy weights.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I kind of agree with sidewalk dance as when rowing your back should be totally locked into place, I know you watch people on the Lat Pull Down and doing Rows moving their upper body a stupid amount but this is wrong. You should be using the static strength of your back and everyones static strength far outweights your concentric strength so you should never really injure your back doing rows unless you got awful form.


Totally agree bod :thumb:

When I do rows I keep my back stiff & slightly above the horizontal, keep my knees bent & pull the weight to upper part of my stomach using strength not by pulling & jerking my body which I think is asking for major lower back trouble.

I've seen people on YouTube film themselves for form & holy hell it's awful, they are moving their body up & down because the weight is too heavy to lift in good form.

If I cant lift it safely then I'm not ready to lift that weight, therefore I need to train this weakness until I can lift in good form :thumb:

One thing about the overhead press guys, for some reason when I press I naturally pull my head back & look up as the weight goes up, it feels much safer & stable, when I try to press then allow the weight to go behind my neck it feel off balance, is there any problem with this? I have read that shoulder presses can be very unique to our builds & to go away from our natural movement can cause shoulder issues, also read that press from behind neck can be very damaging to the shoulders etc... I find front presses feel more natural than a press from behind the neck :thumb:

Bod your bench is coming on great mate :thumb: :thumb: I would love toget to 100Kg at the end of this 10 week cycle but that may be a little too much this time around.

And Sidewalkdances Overhead press 100KG 5X5!!!! Youve inspired me mate, always wonderd what would be a good goal for the overhead press :thumb:

Only thing that leaves me 40KG to go to get to it  

This thread is really great, im finding added inspiration from it, cheers chaps :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Bod42 said:


> Na I'm in New Zealand at present so its abit far to commute to the gym.
> 
> It would be good to train with someone like him though as you should always try and train with people who are stronger than you, its give you more determination to succeed when watching other people move crazy weights.


Completely agree I used to train at Crystal Palace and you learn a lot from being surrounded by people who are insanely strong.
Where in NZ are you, I trained in precious McKenzie's gym, when I was there?


----------



## MarkH

Bod42 said:


> I kind of agree with sidewalk dance as when rowing your back should be totally locked into place, I know you watch people on the Lat Pull Down and doing Rows moving their upper body a stupid amount but this is wrong. You should be using the static strength of your back and everyones static strength far outweights your concentric strength so you should never really injure your back doing rows unless you got awful form.


Just to clarify for the sake of any beginners out there, that there is a limit to what you weight you can use safely for any exercise, and that is when you sacrifice your form or technique, as Bod mentioned above.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Just to clarify for the sake of any beginners out there, that there is a limit to what you weight you can use safely for any exercise, and that is when you sacrifice your form or technique, as Bod mentioned above.


+1 :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

MarkH said:


> With all due respect what makes you say that?


Because if you can keep correct form, then the movement is not unsafe. Its picking a barbell up, rowing it into the chest/upper ab region and lowering it. It's just exercising. Unless you do your training over a fire pit whilst people shoot at you?


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> And Sidewalkdances Overhead press 100KG 5X5!!!! Youve inspired me mate, always wonderd what would be a good goal for the overhead press :thumb:


I want to be able to strict press 140kg, if you can do that, you're a bad ass! But for powerlifting it's kind of a secondary goal. Although I do feel it helps my bench press a fair bit.

http://train.elitefts.com/exercises-by-body-part/delts-exercises-by-body-part/barbell-rows/ - that has a video of barbell rows. Some body movement, but he's fully in control. There is a huge difference between jerking the weight around, and using some controlled body movement on an exercise. In some cases (i.e. when the weight is higher than your own bodyweight) trying to keep completely still whilst rowing is more likely to cause injury.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I want to be able to strict press 140kg, if you can do that, you're a bad ass! But for powerlifting it's kind of a secondary goal. Although I do feel it helps my bench press a fair bit.
> 
> http://train.elitefts.com/exercises-by-body-part/delts-exercises-by-body-part/barbell-rows/ - that has a video of barbell rows. Some body movement, but he's fully in control. There is a huge difference between jerking the weight around, and using some controlled body movement on an exercise. In some cases (i.e. when the weight is higher than your own bodyweight) trying to keep completely still whilst rowing is more likely to cause injury.


Like the idea of 140Kg mate :doublesho :thumb:, if possible, what is a average Over head press (good form) goal to realistically go for?

Also the guy in your vid moves a million times more than me, I like the way he bends his knees, saving his back :thumb: I hardly move at all & lift slower, although I'm only on 87KG 5X5 at the mo


----------



## sidewalkdances

Why put limits on your training, worrying about what the average is? 

I train to be awesome!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Why put limits on your training, worrying about what the average is?
> 
> I train to be awesome!


I would love to be awesome  but ive always had a humble approach to my training, im already having probs on 62KG, how crap is that 

And also having a figure/goal to aim for helps motivate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

The following numbers are decent to aim for as an 'i'm pretty strong' type of deal.

OHP 1xBW
Bench 1.5xBW
Squat 2xBW
Deadlift 2.5xBW

Don't forget, training is a marathon, not a sprint. Don't be afraid to take a step back if it means you can make a 3-4 steps forward. Say you get stuck at 60kg on the press, go back to 55 and dominate it. Then move up again in the following weeks. Chances are you'll move past your sticking points.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> The following numbers are decent to aim for as an 'i'm pretty strong' type of deal.
> 
> OHP 1xBW
> Bench 1.5xBW
> Squat 2xBW
> Deadlift 2.5xBW
> 
> Don't forget, training is a marathon, not a sprint. Don't be afraid to take a step back if it means you can make a 3-4 steps forward. Say you get stuck at 60kg on the press, go back to 55 and dominate it. Then move up again in the following weeks. Chances are you'll move past your sticking points.


Thanks mate, i will aim for these...Then train to be awesome :thumb: :thumb:

Am i right in assuming these are single lifts?


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Better.*

Thursdays 5X5.

Much better workout, pleased with end results 

*Bench Press 89KG/200.25LB 5X5 Felt good!*

*Squat 124KG/279LB 5X5.*

*Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip) 83KG/186.75LB 5X5.*

Another 2KG/4.5LB to add :thumb:

Loaded the bar up for Sat workout Overhead Press, Not sure but on the night I failed 62KG I may of accidentally put 72KG on the bar, but when I lift sat I will soon find out


----------



## Modmedia

Bod42 said:


> Thats good for just a few weeks mate keep hitting the gym and they will increase in no time. I started a couple of the forwards at the rugby club with just the bar. God they were pissed but some still struggled to hit parallel on squats with jus the bar.


Thanks.

I'm squatting more than I weigh, so I suppose I should be happy with that for a few weeks work.

I'm going to try and improve my Bench and overhead press... I feel as though I could get to 100KG on the squats easy, but even a few more KG on the Bench is hard work.

Trying to focus on proper form, I always read the tutorials on the SS website before each workout just to make sure I'm not cheating and doing it properly.


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks mate, i will aim for these...Then train to be awesome :thumb: :thumb:
> 
> Am i right in assuming these are single lifts?


Yeah, then aim to do them for reps!

One thing I forgot to add, be able to do 10 clean pull ups too :thumb:

I had a decent session,

Worked up to 235kgx3 off blocks on the deadlift (shortens range of motion by 6" to work on my lockout) then an easy 185x5 back off set. 5 sets of pull ups, 4 sets of Giant Cambered Bar GM's and some abs and done. Then home to eat my face off with chicken, fish, rice, sweet potato and olive oil!


----------



## MarkH

sidewalkdances said:


> Because if you can keep correct form, then the movement is not unsafe. Its picking a barbell up, rowing it into the chest/upper ab region and lowering it. It's just exercising. Unless you do your training over a fire pit whilst people shoot at you?


Never saw you mention correct form in the first post, glad you have clarified it for the sake of the beginners out there:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Yeah, then aim to do them for reps!
> 
> One thing I forgot to add, be able to do 10 clean pull ups too :thumb:
> 
> I had a decent session,
> 
> Worked up to 235kgx3 off blocks on the deadlift (shortens range of motion by 6" to work on my lockout) then an easy 185x5 back off set. 5 sets of pull ups, 4 sets of Giant Cambered Bar GM's and some abs and done. Then home to eat my face off with chicken, fish, rice, sweet potato and olive oil!


Like the sound of this :thumb:

I intend on changing Bent over rows for pull ups & chin ups and to incorporate dips at some point in the future :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Dont change Rows for Pull ups, you want to work your back through both planes of motion. Vertical and horizontal. 

If you're doing SL/5x5 then alternate between the two IMO


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Dont change Rows for Pull ups, you want to work your back through both planes of motion. Vertical and horizontal.
> 
> If you're doing SL/5x5 then alternate between the two IMO


Good idea, thanks, a bit of variation will be nice :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Not too bad*

Saturdays 5X5

*Overhead Press: 62KG/139.5LB 3, 3, 3, 3, 3*. Not a 5X5 but better than last time & yes the weight was right it's just I'm weak  

*Squat: 126KG/283.5LB 5X5*

*Deadlift: 136KG/306LB 5X5*

Another 2KG/4.5LB to all exercises except the overhead press, if I cannot manage a 5X5 on it next time around I'll de load back to 60KG & dominate the weight!


----------



## sidewalkdances

I did a max effort bench this morning.

Worked up to 125x5, then 145x5 w/Slingshot (www.howmuchyabench.net) and a back off set with 80% of 100x8 easy. Had a fair bit left in the tank on all bench sets. Worked a lot on my set up.

Assistance was dips +20x5x5, Barbell Rows 132.5x5x5, Rolling DB Extentions 20x15x4 and rear delt flyes 17.5x12x4. The rear delts are very important in the bench press and for overall shoulder health to balance out the amount of pushing exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I did a max effort bench this morning.
> 
> Worked up to 125x5, then 145x5 w/Slingshot (www.howmuchyabench.net) and a back off set with 80% of 100x8 easy. Had a fair bit left in the tank on all bench sets. Worked a lot on my set up.
> 
> Assistance was dips +20x5x5, Barbell Rows 132.5x5x5, Rolling DB Extentions 20x15x4 and rear delt flyes 17.5x12x4. The rear delts are very important in the bench press and for overall shoulder health to balance out the amount of pushing exercises.


Bloody Nice bench mate :thumb: :thumb:

Question Sidewalk 

There are two schools of thought, to use belts straps etc... Or not.

What are your thoughts on this mate; I'm sort of leaning towards training RAW, but think safety is very important too.

I've only recently got into powerlifting but have played with the weights for many years, i must say powerlifting is now my first love, don't want to train any other way now


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'd always advocate belt and wrist wraps for anyone, but there are many types of powerlifting. 

Are you ready to get throughly confused?!

There are about 4 types of powerlifting

100% raw - no wraps, belts are allowed, as are wrist wraps I think. Basically no knee wraps. 

Raw Powerlifting - can use knee wraps, wrist wraps and belts. Seen by many as the purest form of powerlifting. 

Single Ply - use of supportive gear (Squat suit, deadlift suit, bench shirt) is allowed. These items of kit essentially let you lift more weight! 

Multi Ply - this is my favourite haha! Supportive Gear of multiple ply can be worn. This type of kit provides EXTREME carryover (carryover is what you can lift equipped minus your raw lifts). For me, I can get about 100-110kg out of a squat suit and briefs, 20kg out of my deadlift suit (I use a squat suit because I sumo pull) and 40-50 out of a bench shirt (don't have one that fits properly). Some lifters get much more out of their gear 200-300lbs out of squat suits and bench shirts are common for very good lifters. 

Equipped lifting is a different ball game really. The strength curve is different as is the technique. So don't worry about all this too much, just throwing it out there. 

ITH... - have you any plans to compete? There is a raw competition (wraps and belt type) in London on Jan 28th. Focusses the training for sure.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I'd always advocate belt and wrist wraps for anyone, but there are many types of powerlifting.
> 
> Are you ready to get throughly confused?!
> 
> There are about 4 types of powerlifting
> 
> 100% raw - no wraps, belts are allowed, as are wrist wraps I think. Basically no knee wraps.
> 
> Raw Powerlifting - can use knee wraps, wrist wraps and belts. Seen by many as the purest form of powerlifting.
> 
> Single Ply - use of supportive gear (Squat suit, deadlift suit, bench shirt) is allowed. These items of kit essentially let you lift more weight!
> 
> Multi Ply - this is my favourite haha! Supportive Gear of multiple ply can be worn. This type of kit provides EXTREME carryover (carryover is what you can lift equipped minus your raw lifts). For me, I can get about 100-110kg out of a squat suit and briefs, 20kg out of my deadlift suit (I use a squat suit because I sumo pull) and 40-50 out of a bench shirt (don't have one that fits properly). Some lifters get much more out of their gear 200-300lbs out of squat suits and bench shirts are common for very good lifters.
> 
> Equipped lifting is a different ball game really. The strength curve is different as is the technique. So don't worry about all this too much, just throwing it out there.
> 
> ITH... - have you any plans to compete? There is a raw competition (wraps and belt type) in London on Jan 28th. Focusses the training for sure.


Like the look of 100% RAW :thumb::thumb:

RAW is also an option :thumb: :thumb:

Not too keen on the other forms of powerlifting, i would feel as though i was cheating myself (Bloody idealist me eh )

Compete me? Have you seen the weights I'm lifting at the mo, wouldn't want to waste my time or others mate.

I will keep bashing at it though, i love the challenge, even if i achieve my goals i will continue to train for reps :thumb: :thumb:

Thanks for the info though mate :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Trust me, when your straining to touch the weight to your chest in a shirt and then trying to lockout 80kg more than your raw max, it's doesn't feel like cheating :lol: 

It's a whole different ball game!

If you want to compete then do, having the balls to get on the platform gets you respect. No one is looked down on for the amount they lift. Everyone starts somewhere.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Trust me, when your straining to touch the weight to your chest in a shirt and then trying to lockout 80kg more than your raw max, it's doesn't feel like cheating :lol:
> 
> It's a whole different ball game!
> 
> If you want to compete then do, having the balls to get on the platform gets you respect. No one is looked down on for the amount they lift. Everyone starts somewhere.


:thumb::thumb::thumb:

I am intrigued mate, I'll see how i get on, if i feel confident enough i might go & compete, but i feel I've have a lot more strength to gain for some time yet before i do :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Get competing bud 

Try and find a powerlifting gym somewhere nearby as some of the referees/rules can be uber strict.


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Yeah, then aim to do them for reps!
> 
> One thing I forgot to add, be able to do 10 clean pull ups too :thumb:
> 
> I had a decent session,
> 
> Worked up to 235kgx3 off blocks on the deadlift (shortens range of motion by 6" to work on my lockout) then an easy 185x5 back off set. 5 sets of pull ups, 4 sets of Giant Cambered Bar GM's and some abs and done. Then home to eat my face off with chicken, fish, rice, sweet potato and olive oil!


Loving the 185 easy back off set, its stuff like this that makes you want to go and smash the gym right now.

Those Body Weight Goals are spot on, they are basically what I am aiming for.

SideWalkDance: How much are you weighting right now for your lifts. Are the numbers your posting RAW?

ITHAQVA: When Im doing 5x5 I only do 1x5 on deadlifts so I just put chin ups after deadlifts. I feel everyone should do Chin Ups as they are really good for strengthening the upper back which in turn improves shoulder health.

My bench has always been pretty good, naturally thick rib cage and short arms so my range of motion on the bench press is very small which makes things easy with triceps that seem to strengthen easily.

I'm living in auckland but there are no powerlifting gyms round here so got fed up getting lectured by personal trrainers in the gym saying squatting is bad, bla, bla, bla so brought my own gym


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hiya Bod,

I only do 1X5 deadlifts too mate:thumb:

My first REAL 5X5 so im getting back into the weights slowly :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

At the moment 117kg - I'm currently dropping some bodyweight at the moment however. Aim to be 109/110 by the time I compete in Jan then 100 by April's comp. 

Raw numbers I'm pretty unsure of, I'm not maxing in any lift from now until the comp. The last times I tested gave me the following numbers

Squat 225 - this was fairly recent. Will be 240/245 in Jan
Bench 142.5 - my comp aim is 150
Deadlift 232.5 conventional, 240 Sumo - will be 250 in Jan.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> At the moment 117kg - I'm currently dropping some bodyweight at the moment however. Aim to be 109/110 by the time I compete in Jan then 100 by April's comp.
> 
> Raw numbers I'm pretty unsure of, I'm not maxing in any lift from now until the comp. The last times I tested gave me the following numbers
> 
> Squat 225 - this was fairly recent. Will be 240/245 in Jan
> Bench 142.5 - my comp aim is 150
> Deadlift 232.5 conventional, 240 Sumo - will be 250 in Jan.


:thumb::thumb::thumb:

Awesome stuff mate


----------



## Andyb0127

Been looking into this 5x5 training must admit every report/review I've read seems to really praise it, its the right training program I'm trying to find as I've seen a few different ones so I know I probably need to find what suits me but any advice would be appreciated. :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Andyb0127 said:


> Been looking into this 5x5 training must admit every report/review I've read seems to really praise it, its the right training program I'm trying to find as I've seen a few different ones so I know I probably need to find what suits me but any advice would be appreciated. :thumb:


It all depends where you are in your training but if your a beginner the 5x5 is a brilliant program.

I think the 2 main programs out there these days are either Stronglifts or Starting strength, both have good websites so check them out as they have loads of info. The only difference between the two is that Stronglift starts you on 5x5 (5 sets of 5 reps) whereas starting strength starts you on 3x5 (3 sets of 5 reps). 5x5 has been around since the 40s maybe earlier so there are hundreds of programs out there but once you pick a program try to stick with it for the long haul.


----------



## Andyb0127

Bod42 said:


> It all depends where you are in your training but if your a beginner the 5x5 is a brilliant program.
> 
> I think the 2 main programs out there these days are either Stronglifts or Starting strength, both have good websites so check them out as they have loads of info. The only difference between the two is that Stronglift starts you on 5x5 (5 sets of 5 reps) whereas starting strength starts you on 3x5 (3 sets of 5 reps). 5x5 has been around since the 40s maybe earlier so there are hundreds of programs out there but once you pick a program try to stick with it for the long haul.


thanks for the info mate, I've been training with wieghts for fifteen years, main reason for wanting to change is even tho I change my routine around every six weeks to shock muscles, i feel like I need to change and try something new and 5x5 sounds perfect for what I want I'm hoping to stay around the same weight currently 14st 7lb Which I've managed to get to naturally its taken alot of hard work and dedication but it's worth it as I was about eleven stone when I started, but I will defiantly be trying this program and posting up how I get on :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

The thing with 5x5 is that if you've been lifting for a while it can be very tough on the recovery side of things. Personally I couldn't squat 5x5 3 times a week! 

Andy - do you train at the Leisure Trust in Brentwood (spied your location!)? I've been there a couple of times with work. We've just put a couple of MyProtein vending machines in there! 

Squat night tonight!!!! Safety Squat Bar makes it a little less exciting though!


----------



## Andyb0127

sidewalkdances said:


> The thing with 5x5 is that if you've been lifting for a while it can be very tough on the recovery side of things. Personally I couldn't squat 5x5 3 times a week!
> 
> Andy - do you train at the Leisure Trust in Brentwood (spied your location!)? I've been there a couple of times with work. We've just put a couple of MyProtein vending machines in there!
> 
> Squat night tonight!!!! Safety Squat Bar makes it a little less exciting though!


yeah squats 3 times a week could be hard but I'm willing to go for it no pain no gain lol.

No mate I train at Absalute gym in Romford probably one of the best gyms ive trained at set out really well, a lot of big guys there that compete but there helpful and there's no attitude in there unlike some gyms I've been in. I do use a lot of my protein products great value for the price :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Thats what I mean by depends where you are in your training. Your see by my log that I got to 130kg with 5x5 3 times a week but I was Dead the next day after every training session meaning I wasnt recoveing from the sessions properly. Following the Stronglift protocol you then move down to 3x5 then 1x5. The you got the intemediate programs like Texas Method and Madcow that lowers the squats to twice a week and you get a light day then when your lifts get up to around the Body Weight strength goals SidewalkDance put up then you can move to something like 5/3/1 that only trains squats once per week. 

There are thousands of programs in between but these are just a few.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 117.5kg 3 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 55kg 5,5,5,4,2
Conventional Deadlift: 130.0kg 1 x 5
Chin Ups: 3 x 4, 7 x 3 Alternate Grips

Box squats seem kind of easy but slow, I always thought some speed work would really help my squat out.

Really pleased with the extra reps on shoulder press but thats 3 weeks of not getting shoulder press now and the second deload so 3 x 5 from now on. Also please as the 4th rep of the 4th set was a real grinder and I hardly got any shoulder pain which I got a few weeks back so something in this program seems to be really helping my shoulder.

Deadlift is only the 2nd workout after Deloading so pretty easy.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Andy - I know Ab Salute. Quality gym. Joey is a great guy. 

I started my new program today written by Brian Carroll (1185lb squat at 125kg) - lots of volume. The email arrived whilst I was doing SSB Squats. So I took that as my warm up and moved on to low box squats working up to a heavy 5. Got up to 160x5 with a good pause on the box each rep. This really builds form and hip strength. 

Assistance was brutal - 2 sets of 30 on the leg press (I used 150/175 on the old leg press which is hard to move), 1 set of 50 standing calves (100kg) then abs. 

Looking forward to seeing how it progresses. Not looking forward to
DOMS in the morning!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Happy!*

Good lot of workouts going on here guys, trying to train to be awesome as best I can, the old man in the group needs time  :thumb:

*Bench Press: 91KG/204.75LB 5X5 *I felt very strong in this today, as soon as i completed my first 5 reps i was confident of a full 5X5 :thumb:

*Squat: 128KG/288LB 5X5.*

*Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip): 86KG/193.5LB 5X5*

Will be adding 2.5KG to all exercises soon as the new olympic set has 1.5KG discs as the lowest weight.

Funny day today, felt very strong in all lifts & didnt rest much between sets, if all days were like this it would be amazing :thumb:

Not sure i need to keep doing Squats 3 times a week for much longer, but as its only 3 weeks to go & my first 10 week phase is over i will keep them up until then.
Would love to get to 100KG/225LB Bench Press 5X5 by the end of this phase. Then i might try a 150KG/337.5LB Bench Press single lift, but we will see


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Not looking forward to
> DOMS in the morning!!


Question guys:

Why dont you gets Doms when doing powerlifting? Am I right in assuming its the lower reps?


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Question guys:
> 
> Why dont you gets Doms when doing powerlifting? Am I right in assuming its the lower reps?


It depends on what assistance work you do, or changing an exercise. Basically any huge change is going to make you sore. Some more sore than others.

Oh, and without sounding like a smart ****, a 100x5x5 will NOT be close to whats needed for a 150kg bench press. I benched 125x5 at the weekend and I doubt it's enough for a 150kg press. Looking for things to be nearer 130x5 maybe higher for a 150kg bench. The general rule of thumb is 80-85% of your 1RM is your 5RM. So if your 5RM is 100, 115-120 might be doable.

Just don't want to see you get hurt :thumb:


----------



## Andyb0127

Well first time tonight using 5x5 technique knew roughly what weight I could manage so did all the neccesary warm ups it was time to hit the wieghts the out come was as follows.

Squats 90kg

Dead lifts 80kg

Barbell rows (Olympic bar) 70kg

Bench press 85kg

Didn't feel to bad at those wieghts but time will tell specially with squats three times aweek, mind you I've always liked training legs and pushing them hard, like I said this is the first time so we will see how it goes seeing as how I'm
Not as young as I used to be at 43 still age is only a number your as young as you feel :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Andy - I know Ab Salute. Quality gym. Joey is a great guy.
> 
> I started my new program today written by Brian Carroll (1185lb squat at 125kg) - lots of volume. The email arrived whilst I was doing SSB Squats. So I took that as my warm up and moved on to low box squats working up to a heavy 5. Got up to 160x5 with a good pause on the box each rep. This really builds form and hip strength.
> 
> Assistance was brutal - 2 sets of 30 on the leg press (I used 150/175 on the old leg press which is hard to move), 1 set of 50 standing calves (100kg) then abs.
> 
> Looking forward to seeing how it progresses. Not looking forward to
> DOMS in the morning!!


Thats alot of volume for a strength program but I am seeing that more and more. Hit the main exercises hard with low reps and then hit the assistant exercises for higher reps. I think the higher reps are good for getting blood pumping round the muscle and building size.

I do box squats 90% of the time because I think they are better but also because when I get a new PR I want to know 100% that it is a PR and there is no way of cheating with Box Squats.

160kg for 5 reps. Real nice. This is where I used to be as just before I started traveling I hit 180kg Box squat, thats why I'm so confused that my squat keeps stalling around 130kg. I have only been tranining twice a week while my parents have been here and I feel so much better so maybe my recovery isnt cut out for squatting 3 times a week


----------



## Estoril-5

whats box squats? (as opposed to normal squats - bar behind/ontop of shoulders)


----------



## sidewalkdances

Estoril - box squats are squats where you sit on a box rather than 'free squatting'.

My best off a box is 210kg + 60kg of chains I think. Can't remember if that was in briefs or not.


----------



## Estoril-5

so you dont go below parrallel?

so you squat till your bum hits the box and then back up again?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Estoril-5 said:


> so you dont go below parrallel?
> 
> so you squat till your bum hits the box and then back up again?


Depends how high you set the box :lol: - I use boxes all the way from 1" above to 3" below in my training.

This is a decent box squat video


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> It depends on what assistance work you do, or changing an exercise. Basically any huge change is going to make you sore. Some more sore than others.
> 
> Oh, and without sounding like a smart ****, a 100x5x5 will NOT be close to whats needed for a 150kg bench press. I benched 125x5 at the weekend and I doubt it's enough for a 150kg press. Looking for things to be nearer 130x5 maybe higher for a 150kg bench. The general rule of thumb is 80-85% of your 1RM is your 5RM. So if your 5RM is 100, 115-120 might be doable.
> 
> Just don't want to see you get hurt :thumb:


Thanks mate, sound advice :thumb:, Injuries are not what I want.

I will strive for a 5X5 100KG bench on this phase, then will keep trying to build up until i get around a 125/130KG 5X5 before attempting the 150KG :thumb:

Not sure how long it will take but if i manage 130KG 5X5 in 25 weeks I will be very very happy & then work to go heavier :thumb:

Cant wait for my Olympic set to arrive, I need it in my life NOW!


----------



## sidewalkdances

Strength Shop have some very good bars at a reasonable price.

I've got my eye on a Texas Power Bar though - not cheap but will last a lifetime! We have one at the gym, but not allowed to use it! :lol: 

It's taken me over 18 months to get my bench from 100x5 to 125x5. Granted i've had strength sapping diets and surgeries in this time, but its still a long old time! I want to get 5 reps with 140 next. I think thats a pretty swish bench, full reps with 140kg. Truly awesome is 180+ for reps!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Strength Shop have some very good bars at a reasonable price.
> 
> I've got my eye on a Texas Power Bar though - not cheap but will last a lifetime! We have one at the gym, but not allowed to use it! :lol:
> 
> It's taken me over 18 months to get my bench from 100x5 to 125x5. Granted i've had strength sapping diets and surgeries in this time, but its still a long old time! I want to get 5 reps with 140 next. I think thats a pretty swish bench, full reps with 140kg. Truly awesome is 180+ for reps!


I've just ordered this: http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...odypower_235kg_olympic_weight_set/9028_p.html

Full reps with 140KG swish :doublesho, I should bloody say so mate, 180KG for reps GOD LIKE:devil::devil:!!!! :thumb:

I would love to ultimately achieve a 500LB single lift Bench Press, but I'm not sure if its asking too much of myself at my age. But as you say mate, take the slow road, each little step and one at a time.

Like your motto mate & I'm trying to "train to be awesome!"  But apart from that i just love lifting weights so either way its a win win situation :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> I've just ordered this: http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...odypower_235kg_olympic_weight_set/9028_p.html
> 
> Full reps with 140KG swish :doublesho, I should bloody say so mate, 180KG for reps GOD LIKE:devil::devil:!!!! :thumb:
> 
> I would love to ultimately achieve a 500LB single lift Bench Press, but I'm not sure if its asking too much of myself at my age. But as you say mate, take the slow road, each little step and one at a time.
> 
> Like your motto mate & I'm trying to "train to be awesome!"  But apart from that i just love lifting weights so either way its a win win situation :thumb:


That kit is very good value for money mate. May have to invest myself at some point, just so I have some kit at home to thrash about with!

500lb raw is elite level strength. Very few manage this, even fewer without 'ergogenic help'. :lol: - how old are you?

500lb in a shirt would see me a happy man at the moment, got my new Metal Jack Bencher on order at the moment! I can't wait for it to arrive!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> That kit is very good value for money mate. May have to invest myself at some point, just so I have some kit at home to thrash about with!
> 
> 500lb raw is elite level strength. Very few manage this, even fewer without 'ergogenic help'. :lol: - how old are you?
> 
> 500lb in a shirt would see me a happy man at the moment, got my new Metal Jack Bencher on order at the moment! I can't wait for it to arrive!


Though it would be ideal for home workouts & priced so well too :thumb:

I'm a very young 43  Don't worry mate i don't feel any older than 30 :thumb:

I would like to have a good ultimate goal for my Bench, what do you think is more realistic? 
I'm happy to go for a RAW 150KG bench as my interim goal for the next year or so, I'm not rushing it & want to make sure I don't get any injuries :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Estoril-5 said:


> whats box squats? (as opposed to normal squats - bar behind/ontop of shoulders)


I consider there to be 2 typres of Box squats, proper Box squats where you pause on the Box for a second or two which takes away your stretch reflex energy and I think builds better power as yoru starting from a full stop.

And then there are touch and go Box Squats where your just using the Box to gauge your depth so you just feel the bench but dont actually put any weight on the box at all. I do like these as you know when you got perfect depth but I dont find myself suggesting them very much as some (alot) of people use the Box in the same way they use their Chest in the Bench Press, try to bouce off of it to lift heavier weights which is when you could injure yourself.

I'm Very much the same as SideWalkDAnce, I started 1" above paralell and worked down to a lower Box. Some people are not flexiable enough to squat properly so you can use higher boxes whilst working on their mobility and flexibility.


----------



## Bod42

Thursday Workout: 
Box Squats: 120kg 3 x 5 
Bench Press: 105kg 5 x 5
Pendlay Rows: 77.5.0kg 5 x 5 

Squats are still really slow but this could be as I'm still training in the morning and havent woken up yet. Who Knows?

WOOHOO I got 105kg for 5x5 was really happy with this as the 4th rep was hard but I just concentrated on my form and obviously got it right. This is the where the Rack pays for itself, I wouldnt have even considered taking on the 5th rep if I was training on my own without the Rack.

Pendlay Rows feel Good, just building back up to where I was. Maybe start leaving longer than 2mins rest between sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thursday Workout:
> Box Squats: 120kg 3 x 5
> Bench Press: 105kg 5 x 5
> Pendlay Rows: 77.5.0kg 5 x 5
> 
> Squats are still really slow but this could be as I'm still training in the morning and havent woken up yet. Who Knows?
> 
> WOOHOO I got 105kg for 5x5 was really happy with this as the 4th rep was hard but I just concentrated on my form and obviously got it right. This is the where the Rack pays for itself, I wouldnt have even considered taking on the 5th rep if I was training on my own without the Rack.
> 
> Pendlay Rows feel Good, just building back up to where I was. Maybe start leaving longer than 2mins rest between sets.


Excellent stuff Bod, Nice Bench mate 105KG 5X5 :devil:, know what you mean about the rack. :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Though it would be ideal for home workouts & priced so well too :thumb:
> 
> I'm a very young 43  Don't worry mate i don't feel any older than 30 :thumb:
> 
> I would like to have a good ultimate goal for my Bench, what do you think is more realistic?
> I'm happy to go for a RAW 150KG bench as my interim goal for the next year or so, I'm not rushing it & want to make sure I don't get any injuries :thumb:


I think 140-150 is a reasonable goal. I try not to think too long term, short goals will always rack up to big numbers!

For me, I know I need a fair bit of work on my technique, although this is getting better, especially on my bench. It's fine tuning now, but thats where the big improvements come from.

I've got a lot of work on my bench to get to the point I can go to Vegas this year for the Worlds, but with my coach in my corner, i'm confident we can get me there! A lot of it depends on who competes at 100kg in the British. I'll just focus on my own game though, build my lifts, then on the day, build a total.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I think 140-150 is a reasonable goal. I try not to think too long term, short goals will always rack up to big numbers!
> 
> For me, I know I need a fair bit of work on my technique, although this is getting better, especially on my bench. It's fine tuning now, but thats where the big improvements come from.
> 
> I've got a lot of work on my bench to get to the point I can go to Vegas this year for the Worlds, but with my coach in my corner, i'm confident we can get me there! A lot of it depends on who competes at 100kg in the British. I'll just focus on my own game though, build my lifts, then on the day, build a total.


Im on 93KG this week so im hoping I can get to 150KG within 12 months, would be nice to get there quicker.

The very best of luck with your competition Sidewalk :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Good luck, i've been chasing after making my bench go from 140 to 150 for nearly a year!

I'm sure the comps will go well, just got to plan smart numbers, make sure I get my self dialled in at the right time. 3 comps in a year is ambitious, especially if one is the other side of the World!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Good luck, i've been chasing after making my bench go from 140 to 150 for nearly a year!
> 
> I'm sure the comps will go well, just got to plan smart numbers, make sure I get my self dialled in at the right time. 3 comps in a year is ambitious, especially if one is the other side of the World!


Looks like I didn't realise how hard this game was. I'll set myself a 150KG goal & just see how it goes for the next year or so, either way I'll just keep training :thumb:

We will be rooting for you mate; will any of your comps be televised on Eurosport or anything?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Thats the best way, just keep training. Progress does halt. It's inevitable. 

I doubt they will be televised, powerlifting is a hard sport to make spectator friendly :lol: - bunch of fat blokes stuffed into polyester suits too tight for them and backwards shirts so they look like mummies! Haha! 

Stuff like the Worlds are usually streamed online via UStream or something though.

Todays training was a toughy, but a goodie.

Deadlift (conventional) 5x5 working up to a top set - 140/160/180/200x5 - I wanted 210x5 but it wasn't on the cards for today. Still 200x5 is still a rep PR.

Deadlift off 6" blocks 3x3 - I went 215/230/240x3 - 240x3 is a PR off blocks. In order to pull 320kg this needs to come up A LOT! 

Lying Leg Curls 70x20x3
Seated Calves 150x20x3
Standing Band Crunches - 2 Average Bands x15x3

Now its time to stretch my calves out and watch telly! 

For those interested in the diet side of things, my PWO consumption has been
PWO Shake (50g Whey Isolate, 50g Waxy Maize)
2 cups brown rice
4oz sweet potato
16oz chicken
2 tbsp Olive Oil 
1/2 a jar of curry sauce
Some brocolli
An apple

I'll have another shake and 2 tablespoons of cashew butter later on :thumb: - 3080kcal on training days!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Thats the best way, just keep training. Progress does halt. It's inevitable.
> 
> I doubt they will be televised, powerlifting is a hard sport to make spectator friendly :lol: - bunch of fat blokes stuffed into polyester suits too tight for them and backwards shirts so they look like mummies! Haha! :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
> 
> Stuff like the Worlds are usually streamed online via UStream or something though.
> 
> Todays training was a toughy, but a goodie.
> 
> Deadlift (conventional) 5x5 working up to a top set - 140/160/180/200x5 - I wanted 210x5 but it wasn't on the cards for today. Still 200x5 is still a rep PR.
> 
> Deadlift off 6" blocks 3x3 - I went 215/230/240x3 - 240x3 is a PR off blocks. In order to pull 320kg this needs to come up A LOT!
> 
> Lying Leg Curls 70x20x3
> Seated Calves 150x20x3
> Standing Band Crunches - 2 Average Bands x15x3
> 
> Now its time to stretch my calves out and watch telly!
> 
> For those interested in the diet side of things, my PWO consumption has been
> PWO Shake (50g Whey Isolate, 50g Waxy Maize)
> 2 cups brown rice
> 4oz sweet potato
> 16oz chicken
> 2 tbsp Olive Oil
> 1/2 a jar of curry sauce
> Some brocolli
> An apple
> 
> I'll have another shake and 2 tablespoons of cashew butter later on :thumb: - 3080kcal on training days!


BUUURN those calories Sidewalk!!!!! :thumb: :devil::devil::devil:

Let us know if there is any way to watch & the dates mate, will be good to see how the pros do it :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Will do :thumb: 

Lovely off day today!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Will do :thumb:
> 
> Lovely off day today!


I've got a short one today, Overhead Press & Deadlift, I'm going to remove Squats from one of the 3 workouts in the week, brining squats down to twice a week & replace with something below 

Squatting 3 times a week is s bit too much & also I want to mix it up with a bit more variation as my jeans are getting too tight around the legs & ass already :doublesho

Choices are 

Gloss Grip Bench Press
Bent over Row (Underhand Grip)
Pull Ups: weighted after achieving a 5X5 with body weight.
Chins: weighted after achieving a 5X5 with body weight.
Dips: weighted after achieving a 5X5 with body weight.
Shrugs
Calf Raises (Standing)
:thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

On the bodyweight work up to sets of ten before adding weight IMO 

I'd always add in an extra pulling exercise, so rows for me, over hand grip! Underhand is rubbish and limits the weight you can use + is riskier on the old biceps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> On the bodyweight work up to sets of ten before adding weight IMO
> 
> I'd always add in an extra pulling exercise, so rows for me, over hand grip! Underhand is rubbish and limits the weight you can use + is riskier on the old biceps.


Is there a risk of Bicep tearing with heavy underhand rows sidewalk?

I'm not over concerned with adding more rows as I'm already doing overhand rows & they always feel more natural than underhand rows :thumb:

Like the idea of:

Pull-ups or Close Grip Bench press, would like to get stronger triceps to help in the bench :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Underhand grip focuses more on your lower lat protecting your lower back, slight chance of pulling a bicep.

Overhand grip focuses more on upper lat, with more chance on pulling back erector muscles.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Personally, I think that the risk of a bicep tear is higher than the risk on an erector injury. The lower back is much tougher than the bicep all things considered. 

Pull Ups are much more awesome than Close Grips though!


----------



## MarkH

Not if you look at basic biomechanics, and I'd rather tear a bicep than a spinal muscle.


----------



## Bod42

Just to add my 2p worth.

Overhand or Underhand Rows have exactly the same inpact in the lower erector muscles as you should be setting your back at the start of the exercise so if both kinds of Rows are held in the hands and your hands attach to your arms which hang from your shoulders then the angle of pull in comparision to your lower back is identical. As disgusts a few pages back you should never be able to hurt your back doing Rows as they are alot lower weight than Deadlifts and your using Static strength which far exceeds your concentric strength.

Look at Deadlifts to decide which grip has the most chance of ripping your biceps as you use more weight so its more likely to happen. Watch power lifting and Strongman videos and you will notice that most of the time when people use a mixed grip it is the Underhand grip hand that the tear happens on.

Lowering your Squats down to twice a week is probably a good choice as thats basically the same as moving to Texas Method or Madcow as they have one less Squat day. I would defiently go for Chin Ups mate, my shoulder has never felt so good since doing them regulary. If your just starting choose a number like 30,40 or 50 and get that many reps in as many sets as it takes


----------



## ITHAQVA

Cheers guys lots of info here :thumb:

I will stick to overhand rows as my default rowing exercise, just feels right :thumb:

Haven’t seen the other workouts yet: Texas, madcow 

I’m not very good at pull-ups, but will try some today, if i struggle ill just keep going at it, or would it be more beneficial to do 5-10 weeks close grip benches to get the triceps strength up to help pull-up more successfully? :thumb:


I’m more inclined to do pull-ups, chin-ups & Dips as the same, with 5 reps then add weight, surely this is the rep range for strength?


----------



## MarkH

Have to disagree there Bod, the weight you can handle in underhand is a less, and also the arm position is to the side on overhand and on underhand the elbows point to the rear, bringing the weight closer to your centre of gravity.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just to add my opinion on different exercises/injury & range of movement.

I think we all must agree there are some factors that affect the above & that they are personal to us all.

1. Form is important, even if the exercise suites the body, you start throwing heavy weights around like an idiot & you’re asking for trouble.

2. Your particular frame/physic type & this is where i see discussion go one for ever, we are all built slightly different & certain exercise affect us all in slightly different ways.

My way is to follow what the experienced guy’s n gals say, but also learn to listen to your own body. This may not be orthodox but there are some injuries that actually get better with training.

I had a strange shoulder problem a few years ago, i hadn’t done any weights that year, i just woke with this pain, listened to the doctors etc. Then after 12 months of it though FUUk it I’m training regardless, I’ve done enough resting! Within a few weeks of progressive training the shoulder cleared up :doublesho

But also there are injuries were the opposite is true. There are way too many variables within our physiques to always have a 100% answer but i think if you follow sound fundamentals & learn to listen to your body you’ll be fine, a little ambiguous but it has worked for me for all the years I’ve been playing with the weights. I have had 3 injuries since training (1985 - present day).

1. Two shoulder injuries ( I used to only do behind neck shoulder presses, since reading there are many shoulder problems caused by this I only do front presses & they feel 100% right for me). :thumb:

2. One torn calf whilst doing a standing calf raises with around 600-700LB, i had cows not calves in those days, i still have large calves after all these years, bonus :thumb:  


Many years ago I benched 180KG plus (1-4 rep range) on what was called a “Mass Goliath builder” or was it a “goliath mass builder” I’ve been trying to find pics, but we are talking over 20 years ago, it was very archaic but was also very close to actual free weights.
Has anyone seen one or heard of it?


----------



## Bod42

MarkH said:


> Have to disagree there Bod, the weight you can handle in underhand is a less, and also the arm position is to the side on overhand and on underhand the elbows point to the rear, bringing the weight closer to your centre of gravity.


When your arms are at full length then gravity pulls the weight from the shoulder into exactly the same position no matter which way round your hand is. As for the actual rowing position I always Row to my lower chest so when I do Rows the weight is in exactly the same position at the top and bottom no matter how you move your arms.

I agree that you can handle less weight in underhand but thats not comparing apples to apples, thats like saying if I do 20kg Bench Press it is safer than 120kg which is true but thats not the name of the game, getting stronger is. You want maximum weight to stimulate the muscle the most.

Also how can you damage your erectors with say 80kg of staic strength during Rows when your strong enough to do 150kg of concentric strength whilst doing Deadlifts. Cant see it personnally more likely to tear a bicep that only normally contracts with say 50kg and its contracting with 80kg but hey this is why I like reading about weightlifting as even the best trainers out there have different views on things.

I know one of the famours Body Building legends (forgot his name its late) would not allow anyone in his gym to do squats as he thought they thickened your waist which would make you look worse as a Bodybuilder


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> When your arms are at full length then gravity pulls the weight from the shoulder into exactly the same position no matter which way round your hand is. As for the actual rowing position I always Row to my lower chest so when I do Rows the weight is in exactly the same position at the top and bottom no matter how you move your arms.
> 
> Also how can you damage your erectors with say 80kg of staic strength during Rows when your strong enough to do 150kg of concentric strength whilst doing Deadlifts. Cant see it personnally more likely to tear a bicep that only normally contracts with say 50kg and its contracting with 80kg but hey this is why I like reading about weightlifting as even the best trainers out there have different views on things.
> 
> I know one of the famours Body Building legends (forgot his name its late) would not allow anyone in his gym to do squats as he thought they thickened your waist which would make you look worse as a Bodybuilder


 No Squats WTF!!!!! :doublesho

In my opinion Squats for a healthy individual is one of THE fundamentals, we all know of the mahoosive amount of muscle groups that come into play with the squat, it's got to be one of the top 5 exercises of all time IMHO, in all its flavours :thumb: But I'm biased as i love barbell multi joint exercises above anything else.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers guys lots of info here :thumb:
> 
> I will stick to overhand rows as my default rowing exercise, just feels right :thumb:
> 
> Haven't seen the other workouts yet: Texas, madcow
> 
> I'm not very good at pull-ups, but will try some today, if i struggle ill just keep going at it, or would it be more beneficial to do 5-10 weeks close grip benches to get the triceps strength up to help pull-up more successfully? :thumb:
> 
> I'm more inclined to do pull-ups, chin-ups & Dips as the same, with 5 reps then add weight, surely this is the rep range for strength?


I can always send you an Excel sheet for the other workouts mate, I got loads.

I would always recommend Chin/Pull Ups but you seem set on close grip mate so if you really want to do them you should do them for a few weeks and see how you feel cos nobody puts 100% into somehting if they dont really want to do it, if you get what I mean. Anyway weights is a learning game so your not going to lose anything.

Remember though that Chin/Pull Ups are very good for shoudler health, you should be doing 2-3:1 ratio of pulling to pulling exercises and Chin/Pull Ups will make your back thicker and wider. Thicker lower the ROM you have to move the weight which makes you stronger and wider gves you more control and strength while lowering the weight so they will actually help.

Is your lockout your problem on Bench Press?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> No Squats WTF!!!!! :doublesho
> 
> In my opinion Squats for a healthy individual is one of THE fundamentals, we all know of the mahoosive amount of muscle groups that come into play with the squat, it's got to be one of the top 5 exercises of all time IMHO, in all its flavours :thumb: But I'm biased as i love barbell multi joint exercises above anything else.


Totally agree mate, squats and Deadlifts are joint Number 1.

Thats one of my rules, anybody I train or write a program for has to squat no matter what as any program without then isnt worth the paper its written on but again I'm bias as I train people for Rugby so heavy weights RULE

Vince Gironda was his name, didnt like squats especially Power Lifting Style


----------



## MarkH

Bod42 said:


> When your arms are at full length then gravity pulls the weight from the shoulder into exactly the same position no matter which way round your hand is. As for the actual rowing position I always Row to my lower chest so when I do Rows the weight is in exactly the same position at the top and bottom no matter how you move your arms.
> 
> Also how can you damage your erectors with say 80kg of staic strength during Rows when your strong enough to do 150kg of concentric strength whilst doing Deadlifts. Cant see it personnally more likely to tear a bicep that only normally contracts with say 50kg and its contracting with 80kg but hey this is why I like reading about weightlifting as even the best trainers out there have different views on things.


I personally don't like OH grip for bent over rowing, after 27 years of competing at weightlifting, I have bumped into a fair few people who think the same, and my suspicions were again confirmed when I talked to some of my competitors at the Euro champs.

The bar path is different in underhand compared to over hand, in OH the bar usually ends up at the lower chest, in UH the bar ends up usually ends in the ab region. With the bar being further away from lower back it increases the load on it, because your centre of gravity has changed.

You have hit the nail on the head, the problem is static strength, the exercise is loading one particular region of the erector spinae, eventually that is overloaded gives way and injury results. If the load was changing through a range of movement for that region like in good mornings then the full range of that muscle would be used.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I can always send you an Excel sheet for the other workouts mate, I got loads.
> 
> I would always recommend Chin/Pull Ups but you seem set on close grip mate so if you really want to do them you should do them for a few weeks and see how you feel cos nobody puts 100% into somehting if they dont really want to do it, if you get what I mean. Anyway weights is a learning game so your not going to lose anything.
> 
> Remember though that Chin/Pull Ups are very good for shoudler health, you should be doing 2-3:1 ratio of pulling to pulling exercises and Chin/Pull Ups will make your back thicker and wider. Thicker lower the ROM you have to move the weight which makes you stronger and wider gves you more control and strength while lowering the weight so they will actually help.
> 
> Is your lockout your problem on Bench Press?


Would love some excels Bod :thumb::thumb:, I've got loads of E books on all aspects of weights/nutrition etc... Always happy to email to you mate & anyone else of course :thumb: 

Thinking of Close grips so i can get my strength up to pull-up successfully, but I'm going to have a workout today & will try them & see, i weigh around 16 stone so pull-ups are a real bugger for me & I've never really done many over the years 

My bench weakness is at the lower most part of the movement, once i start to move its ok :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Totally agree mate, squats and Deadlifts are joint Number 1.
> 
> Thats one of my rules, anybody I train or write a program for has to squat no matter what as any program without then isnt worth the paper its written on but again I'm bias as I train people for Rugby so heavy weights RULE
> 
> Vince Gironda was his name, didnt like squats especially Power Lifting Style


Cant forget the Deadlifts (Or deadliest as someone put it here :thumb: !!!!) I love the way Deadlifts really invole your upper body another of my faves too mate :thumb: They just feel right :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> I personally don't like OH grip for bent over rowing, after 27 years of competing at weightlifting, I have bumped into a fair few people who think the same, and my suspicions were again confirmed when I talked to some of my competitors at the Euro champs.
> 
> The bar path is different in underhand compared to over hand, in OH the bar usually ends up at the lower chest, in UH the bar ends up usually ends in the ab region. With the bar being further away from lower back it increases the load on it, because your centre of gravity has changed.
> 
> You have hit the nail on the head, the problem is static strength, the exercise is loading one particular region of the erector spinae, eventually that is overloaded gives way and injury results. If the load was changing through a range of movement for that region like in good mornings then the full range of that muscle would be used.


Question for you guys:

I'm training to basically max out the weight for all my exercises (It's how I roll ) I love heavy with everything & to not train heavy causes me to lose interest, i love the challenge & discipline etc..

I can see the Row can be a little dangerous on the lower back when getting heavy (I keep my form slow & strict). Before i get to round 90-100Kg on this lift would I be right in assuming it would be better to move over to chins & pull ups as my main back & multi joint exercise?


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> Question for you guys:
> 
> I'm training to basically max out the weight for all my exercises (It's how I roll ) I love heavy with everything & to not train heavy causes me to lose interest, i love the challenge & discipline etc..
> 
> I can see the Row can be a little dangerous on the lower back when getting heavy (I keep my form slow & strict). Before i get to round 90-100Kg on this lift would I be right in assuming it would be better to move over to chins & pull ups as my main back & multi joint exercise?


Not sure if you have posted it already, what does your schedule look like?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Not sure if you have posted it already, what does your schedule look like?


Today's Workout (been a bit rubbish this week & will be down to two times again next week as there has been a death in the family, lots of traveling & focus a little bit shaky)

*Overhead Press: 62KG/136.4LB.* *4,4,4,4,4* felt able to do 5 reps on first two sets but saved my strenth to get a full 4 reps on each set, the weight is now feeling much easier, will push for a full 5X5 next week :thumb:

*Deadlift: 138KG/303.6LB 5X5*, feeling heavy now & its tearing at my calluses on my hands. Need your advice guys, should I now use straps or gloves or just keep going until i cannot hold onto the bar for a full 5X5?

Tried pull ups & chins after this workout. really crap results.
Wide grip Pullup= Half rep.
Chin (normal grip) = 2 reps.
Normal Grip pullup = 1 rep.

As for my schedule Mark, i alternate between week one & two :thumb:

*Week 1
2KG added after 5X5 reached, this will increase soon as my new olympic set only goes down 2 X 1.5KG plates..

MONDAY

BENCH PRESS 5 X 93KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X 130 KG____ ____ ____  ____ ____
BENT OVER ROWS 5 X 88KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

WEDNESDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS 5 X 62KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT 1 X 140KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

FRIDAY OR SAT

BENCH PRESS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROWS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

Week 2
2KG added after 5X5 reached, this will increase soon as my new olympic set only goes down 2 X 1.5KG plates.

MONDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT 1 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

Wednesday

BENCH PRESS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROWS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

Friday or Sat

OVERHEAD PRESS 5 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT 5X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT 1 X KG____ ____ ____ ____ ____

Please remember I will now be reducing my squats to twice a week.* :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Something else I don't agree with is using 'slow' bar speed for anything if your goal is strength. 

Power = Mass x Velocity. 

You need to aim to move weights as fast as possible, even if due to load, it doesn't move that fast. That's not to say use sloppy form or do things dangerously, but for strength, the intention should be to move as fast as possible. 

I always row to where I touch my bench. I'm doing rows to build my lag strength for the bench press, I just try and make the row a reverse bench as much as possible including the overhand grip. Granted, biomechanics don't always make this possible, but it's a good place to aim for. Owing to my bench form, I touch around the upper abs anyway. Especially in a shirt. 

Today's bench day was interesting - no barbell pressing work at all - flat DB's for 10, inclines for 12, 3 sets of 15 strict rows, 3 sets band flys, 3 sets strict DB extensions, 3 sets heavy pushdowns. Lots more volume than I'm used too.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Something else I don't agree with is using 'slow' bar speed for anything if your goal is strength.


Not sure i train slow, i would say my bent over rows for instance, 1 second up & 1 second down, I make sure i contol my training speed to ensure very little body movment :thumb:

Something i have never understood about what people consider pure strength.

Looking at it in very simple terms.

If I can manage a 5X5 bent over row with 80plus KG in controlled form surely i am relying 100% on strength & not momentum?

If you train fast doesn't the momentum help you execute/finish the exercise therefore you're not using as much strength?

I hope I've written that in a way you all understand as this is something I've heard people debate for years.

I understand the concept of explosive power, but the definition of pure muscle strength has always been unclear in my mind.

Always open to new ways of approaching my training & interested in what you all think on this subject.

Just an example: a weight lifter isn't necessarily strong, but they understand technique & how to best use their strength combined with good technique to get a weight to point 1 to point 2

*Power* for me is basically as with the weight lifter example above: some strength/technique & momentum.

Possibly my own definition of* strength *needs clarifying in regards to using weights: to be able to move a weight in controlled fashion without the help of momentum but with pure muscle strength alone.

*So am i really a power lifter or a strength athlete?*

Hope this clarifies guys


----------



## Bod42

Sorry ITHAQVA I totally mis-read your post, I thought you were reffering to Close Grip Bench Press not close grip Chin Ups. Wide Grip Chin Ups are better for developing the back but I personally cant do them as they put more stress on my shoulder so I do all 3 grips, overhand, neutral and underhand but closer grip. Some peoples shoulders are designed to do Chin Ups, Shouder Press' and Bench Press and some peoples arent.

I agree with moving the weight as fast as possible as well but its abit hard to put in words. Its like the Bench Press, the weight touches the chest and them you explode with 100% power pushing the Bar up but if your on your last rep of your last set of a Personal Record there is no way that the Bar is going to move fast, normally even trying to throw the bar through the ceiling it will take ages to lock out the rep.

Thats why I like Pendlay Rows now as you have no way of getting the weight to touch your chest unless your using full power meaning your muscles are contracting as hard and as fast as possible.

Rows hit the back differently from Chin/Pull Ups. Their basically the 2 exercises that are the opposite of Shoulder and Bench Press and you shouldnt really drop either of them

I could only do 2 close grip chins when I started but I did 30sets of 1 Chin throughout the workout as Chin Ups seem to be best trained using total volume


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Sorry ITHAQVA I totally mis-read your post, I thought you were reffering to Close Grip Bench Press not close grip Chin Ups. Wide Grip Chin Ups are better for developing the back but I personally cant do them as they put more stress on my shoulder so I do all 3 grips, overhand, neutral and underhand but closer grip. Some peoples shoulders are designed to do Chin Ups, Shouder Press' and Bench Press and some peoples arent.
> 
> I agree with moving the weight as fast as possible as well but its abit hard to put in words. Its like the Bench Press, the weight touches the chest and them you explode with 100% power pushing the Bar up but if your on your last rep of your last set of a Personal Record there is no way that the Bar is going to move fast, normally even trying to throw the bar through the ceiling it will take ages to lock out the rep.
> 
> Thats why I like Pendlay Rows now as you have no way of getting the weight to touch your chest unless your using full power meaning your muscles are contracting as hard and as fast as possible.
> 
> Rows hit the back differently from Chin/Pull Ups. Their basically the 2 exercises that are the opposite of Shoulder and Bench Press and you shouldnt really drop either of them
> 
> I could only do 2 close grip chins when I started but I did 30sets of 1 Chin throughout the workout as Chin Ups seem to be best trained using total volume


Cheers for the replies/clarification Bod :thumb: :thumb:

I would say that I train as you describe pushing/pulling hard, but as the weight is heavy it doesn't really move that fast, so yes I do power the weight in the movement. Note to self, read post properly! 

I like you're thinking about the opposite exercises, I think I will persevere with a mix of approx. shoulder wide chins & pull-ups as some describe these & the dips as Squats for the upper body & I've always had a thing for multi joint exercises :thumb:

Also about the de-loading on the 5X5.
I'm trying an alternative approach. My overhead press is a good example, once i went to 62KG i started to struggle with 5X5, so i just did what i could, then the following week tried to add another rep to each set & so on, this week I've done a 5X4 & the weight is already feeling much lighter. My view is just because i can't do 5 reps doesn't mean i can't lift it, after all i did some reps on each set, this is something i picked up from bodybuilding books, train in your range & add reps until you reached you goal then add more weight & so on. Progressive overload? :devil:

Although I'm doing the 5X5 & will strive to maintain this, i will now consider my rep range 1-5, if i can manage one rep & build on it why not, if it means after a few weeks i reach my 5X5 then so be it & i don't have to reduce the weight but force my body to grow strong, don't know how well it will work but judging by yesterday overhead press It seems to be a good idea, I can't believe how much lighter the weight felt in what is my weakest exercise, think I should incorporate every time I fail 5X5. As you say Bod your Chins started with one rep sets & you built on it & you forced your body to grow strong :devil:

Thanks again to all who have posted here, you guys are in a way my training partners & you have inspired me in a sport which I love. Excellent! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> I personally don't like OH grip for bent over rowing, after 27 years of competing at weightlifting, I have bumped into a fair few people who think the same, and my suspicions were again confirmed when I talked to some of my competitors at the Euro champs.
> 
> The bar path is different in underhand compared to over hand, in OH the bar usually ends up at the lower chest, in UH the bar ends up usually ends in the ab region. With the bar being further away from lower back it increases the load on it, because your centre of gravity has changed.


When doing Bent over rows (overhand grip) the bar comes up to touch my stomach, tucking my arms in which i feel is better, putting much less stress on my lower back, i agree with you Mark, rowing up to your chest must be more risky to the back. I like to involve the back as well as my arms, love the final squeeze at the end; you can really feel the old back working to finish the manoeuvre :thumb:

If I do an underhand row the bar comes closer to my chest, is that a typo above Mark? Or am i just weird? 

When rowing i like to use my arms for the initial part then bring my back/lats into action about half way through the lift to complete the movement & bring the bar up against my stomach, i row just above horizontal with legs slightly bent & move ever so slightly up by using my legs as i complete the exercise. :thumb: I do love Overhand grip Bent over rows, so I'm biased


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers for the replies/clarification Bod :thumb: :thumb:
> 
> I would say that I train as you describe pushing/pulling hard, but as the weight is heavy it doesn't really move that fast, so yes I do power the weight in the movement. Note to self, read post properly!
> 
> I like you're thinking about the opposite exercises, I think I will persevere with a mix of approx. shoulder wide chins & pull-ups as some describe these & the dips as Squats for the upper body & I've always had a thing for multi joint exercises :thumb:
> 
> Also about the de-loading on the 5X5.
> I'm trying an alternative approach. My overhead press is a good example, once i went to 62KG i started to struggle with 5X5, so i just did what i could, then the following week tried to add another rep to each set & so on, this week I've done a 5X4 & the weight is already feeling much lighter. My view is just because i can't do 5 reps doesn't mean i can't lift it, after all i did some reps on each set, this is something i picked up from bodybuilding books, train in your range & add reps until you reached you goal then add more weight & so on. Progressive overload? :devil:
> 
> Although I'm doing the 5X5 & will strive to maintain this, i will now consider my rep range 1-5, if i can manage one rep & build on it why not, if it means after a few weeks i reach my 5X5 then so be it & i don't have to reduce the weight but force my body to grow strong, don't know how well it will work but judging by yesterday overhead press It seems to be a good idea, I can't believe how much lighter the weight felt in what is my weakest exercise, think I should incorporate every time I fail 5X5. As you say Bod your Chins started with one rep sets & you built on it & you forced your body to grow strong :devil:
> 
> Thanks again to all who have posted here, you guys are in a way my training partners & you have inspired me in a sport which I love. Excellent! :thumb:


Your rep idea sounds good to me. I used a very similar idea on Incline Dumbell Press as the Dunbell's at the gym went up 2.5kg so the minimum you could increase the weight was 5kg which is to much so I worked up to 3 sets of 6 reps then increased the weight and did 3sets of 3 and worked my way up. One weird thing I did do was to increase the reps on the last set first, then 2nd set then first set e.g. Week 1 - 3,3,4 Week 2 - 3,4,4 Week 3 - 4,4,4 Week 4 - 4,4,5 and so on. It seems slow progress but after 10 weeks thats 5kg on Dumbell Press and it never seemed to fail. Only good increasing that slow if your right at your limit.

Dips and Chins are brilliant exercises but I starting to think ore like Jim Wendler these days, assistant exercises are exactly that, just assistant to the main lifts so yes they help but if one week you do Chin Ups and then the next dips, as long as your doing your main lifts really its not going to make that much different. I try to use the Assistant exercises to bring up weak muscle and fix inbalances and for me my Triceps are quite strong and grow better than my chest from Bench Press so Chins are my Main focus at the min.

Cheers everyone who given their thoughts and views. This is why I love reading about weights, fitness, health etc as noone is ever 100% right. Some professional Bodybuilders strength people swear by low reps others by higher reps, its finding what works for you


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Your rep idea sounds good to me. I used a very similar idea on Incline Dumbell Press as the Dunbell's at the gym went up 2.5kg so the minimum you could increase the weight was 5kg which is to much so I worked up to 3 sets of 6 reps then increased the weight and did 3sets of 3 and worked my way up. One weird thing I did do was to increase the reps on the last set first, then 2nd set then first set e.g. Week 1 - 3,3,4 Week 2 - 3,4,4 Week 3 - 4,4,4 Week 4 - 4,4,5 and so on. It seems slow progress but after 10 weeks thats 5kg on Dumbell Press and it never seemed to fail. Only good increasing that slow if your right at your limit.
> 
> Dips and Chins are brilliant exercises but I starting to think ore like Jim Wendler these days, assistant exercises are exactly that, just assistant to the main lifts so yes they help but if one week you do Chin Ups and then the next dips, as long as your doing your main lifts really its not going to make that much different. I try to use the Assistant exercises to bring up weak muscle and fix inbalances and for me my Triceps are quite strong and grow better than my chest from Bench Press so Chins are my Main focus at the min.
> 
> Cheers everyone who given their thoughts and views. This is why I love reading about weights, fitness, health etc as noone is ever 100% right. Some professional Bodybuilders strength people swear by low reps others by higher reps, its finding what works for you


Im finding this very small section hidden in a detailing forum the most helpfull of them all :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Glad someone else explained the whole 'moving weights fast' thing better than I did.

Power comes from full muscular contraction, you should always be trying to push every load as fast as possible, because it conditions the muscle to do it every time! That way when you have your 1RM max on the bar, you're recruiting the maximum motor units possible!

Have a look at these YouTube videos of the Dynamic Effort





 - Travis Bell DE Bench




 - Travis Bell (Straight Weight) DE

That way, when he does a max effort lift, he recruits all his muscle





 - Travis Bell ME Bench

Then in his shirt





 - 700lbs guest lifter spot

I picked Travis because he's the first name that came up when I YouTubed DE Bench!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

I would say i lift exactly as the first vid shows, slightly slower on the return. 

Is this good?

Looking at my weights guys do you think I should be looking at a belt? Also do I need straps for the deadlift? My calluses look like they are about to be torn off when I deadlift now 


Whats with the chains on the first Vid?


----------



## sidewalkdances

As I said, the intention should be to move the weights as fast as possible. Those weights are deliberately sub-maximal (around 50%) to increase force development.

The chains are there to add something called accommodating resistance. This means that as the weight moves through the range of motion it gets heavier towards the top, as more links of chain come off the ground, changing the strength curve. This is especially useful in a bench shirt as it teaches you to push all the way through to lockout. This is where the weight gets heaviest in a shirt.

And in regards to belts/straps - belt yes, straps no. I belt up from every set over 140 on squats and deadlifts. I would never use straps to deadlift, I think they have their place in stuff like shrugs and sometimes rows, but not deadlifts. Mainly because I can't use straps in a PL meet, so using straps could cause my grip to fall behind my strength. No point being able to deadlift a weight with straps you cant hold on to!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> As I said, the intention should be to move the weights as fast as possible. Those weights are deliberately sub-maximal (around 50%) to increase force development.
> 
> The chains are there to add something called accommodating resistance. This means that as the weight moves through the range of motion it gets heavier towards the top, as more links of chain come off the ground, changing the strength curve. This is especially useful in a bench shirt as it teaches you to push all the way through to lockout. This is where the weight gets heaviest in a shirt.
> 
> And in regards to belts/straps - belt yes, straps no. I belt up from every set over 140 on squats and deadlifts. I would never use straps to deadlift, I think they have their place in stuff like shrugs and sometimes rows, but not deadlifts. Mainly because I can't use straps in a PL meet, so using straps could cause my grip to fall behind my strength. No point being able to deadlift a weight with straps you cant hold on to!


Thanks for the reply mate. :thumb::thumb:

Any tips on Deadlifting, or should i just carry on & let my skin toughen up?


----------



## Bod42

I dont wear a Belt simply because I cant wear one on a rugby pitch so why would I wear one when training for rugby but I know they do have benefits.

I would say no to straps as well from experience. I used to use hooks which as fantastic you dont have to worry about your grip at all but I had a 180kg Deadlift with Hooks but couldnt even pull 140kg due to my grip. If I ever competed your lifts are only as good as your weakest body part so now I dont use straps for anything.

I read on some of the power lifting sites that they reccomend buying a surgical scalpal and remove your calluses every so often as when they grow to much you got more chance of tearing them off.

You can also use Bands for Accommodating Resistance and I have had good success with some of the rugby players in the past but I think their more of an advanced type of training.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: 
Box Squats: 122.5kg 3 x 5 
Seated Shoulder Press: 45kg 3 x 5 
Conventional Deadlift: 135.0kg 1 x 5 
Chin Ups: 4 x 4, 6 x 3 Alternate Grips 

Back to evening time so feeling alot better.

With squats I got to stop being a pussy and looking for flaws in my technique and just lift the weight. I got more zoned in last night because I was angry as some delivery driver hit me up the **** while I was sitting at the traffic lights and wouldnt give me his deatils as he said my car was old anyway, it did make this weight feel easy though so silver lining and all lol. I need to except that no matter what Squats are going to feel hard on all parts of the Body. 

Deadlift and overhead press felt easy as still working back up from a Deload.

I brought some protein shakes at the weekend and have started on these again and felt great in the gym, dont know if it had anything to do with this or not really.


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks for the reply mate. :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Any tips on Deadlifting, or should i just carry on & let my skin toughen up?


You can do some plate pinches or buy some Fat Gripz from Strength Shop and after you deadlift do some timed fat bar holds.

I tend to file down my callouses - a torn callous is horrendously painful - especially when you're just starting a session! A bit of chalk is always good. Either 'proper' Mag Carbonate or Liquid Chalk if you dont want the mess!

I trained last night - squats - check it out.

Box Squats (Below Parallel, slight pause on box) - work sets were 160x3/170x3/180x3/185x3 - maybe had 190 in me, but the idea is never to miss in training!

Wide Stance Pause Squats - pause in the hole for a 2 count - worked up to 180x3 - my training partner left me in the hole a long time on these!!!

Leg Press - 200x35x2 - these were horrible. Pushed through my toes the whole time as I couldn't find a good foot placement.

Calf Raises 150x15x6 - 2 sets of each - toes in/out/straight.

Planks 3 sets of 45 seconds

Tonight is my recovery/rehab/pre-hab/stretching day - lots of reps!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> You can do some plate pinches or buy some Fat Gripz from Strength Shop and after you deadlift do some timed fat bar holds.
> 
> I tend to file down my callouses - a torn callous is horrendously painful - especially when you're just starting a session! A bit of chalk is always good. Either 'proper' Mag Carbonate or Liquid Chalk if you dont want the mess!
> 
> I trained last night - squats - check it out.
> 
> Box Squats (Below Parallel, slight pause on box) - work sets were 160x3/170x3/180x3/185x3 - maybe had 190 in me, but the idea is never to miss in training!
> 
> Wide Stance Pause Squats - pause in the hole for a 2 count - worked up to 180x3 - my training partner left me in the hole a long time on these!!!
> 
> Leg Press - 200x35x2 - these were horrible. Pushed through my toes the whole time as I couldn't find a good foot placement.
> 
> Calf Raises 150x15x6 - 2 sets of each - toes in/out/straight.
> 
> Planks 3 sets of 45 seconds
> 
> Tonight is my recovery/rehab/pre-hab/stretching day - lots of reps!


Nice weights mate, ive got a long way to go, but im enjoying the ride :thumb: :devil::devil::devil:

Im going to have to look up plate pinches, timed fat bar holds.

Like the idea of liquid chalk as my chalk does make a mess, is it as good as proper chalk?


----------



## sidewalkdances

I've never used liquid chalk personally, I just use real stuff! 

The weights are a little light for where I need to be for now. But they aren't bad. The point of the paused work and the box is to really hammer the hips and glutes hard. I have to keep reminding myself that these are the things that will make my equipped squat go up more so than my raw squat. That's where the main goal is.


----------



## ITHAQVA

No weights this week loads on 

But good news is my olympic set arrived this evening, been humping the sods into the gym room, the bar is mahoosive, weight plates look awesome. :thumb:

Will have a play Thursady, does anyone want any pics & quick review? :tumbleweed:

*This also means all my standard weights & bars are up for grabs, anyone?*


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice weights mate, ive got a long way to go, but im enjoying the ride :thumb: :devil::devil::devil:
> 
> Im going to have to look up plate pinches, timed fat bar holds.
> 
> Like the idea of liquid chalk as my chalk does make a mess, is it as good as proper chalk?


I only realised how many types of grip strength there are when I started looking into it. Watch and feel how your grip is failing as for different eople its different things, I seen people who cant keep their thumb wrapped so the weight is just being held by their fingers, people who are the opposite and their fingers get pulled open, people who lose their pinkie finger first, etc. Plate Pinches will train your thumb alot so they are always good. I have Captain of Crush grippers and my mates and had a drunk comp one night and I could close the number 2 and no 1 else could but my chippy mate could close the number 1 gripper more times than me, just different typres of strength.

I use Chalk Blocks not poweder and just rub it on over a bucket and its pretty clean. Dust used to get everywhere but its personnal preffernce as my old training partner hated blocks whereas I prefer them so we had a massive bucket with both in


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> You can do some plate pinches or buy some Fat Gripz from Strength Shop and after you deadlift do some timed fat bar holds.
> 
> I tend to file down my callouses - a torn callous is horrendously painful - especially when you're just starting a session! A bit of chalk is always good. Either 'proper' Mag Carbonate or Liquid Chalk if you dont want the mess!
> 
> I trained last night - squats - check it out.
> 
> Box Squats (Below Parallel, slight pause on box) - work sets were 160x3/170x3/180x3/185x3 - maybe had 190 in me, but the idea is never to miss in training!
> 
> Wide Stance Pause Squats - pause in the hole for a 2 count - worked up to 180x3 - my training partner left me in the hole a long time on these!!!
> 
> Leg Press - 200x35x2 - these were horrible. Pushed through my toes the whole time as I couldn't find a good foot placement.
> 
> Calf Raises 150x15x6 - 2 sets of each - toes in/out/straight.
> 
> Planks 3 sets of 45 seconds
> 
> Tonight is my recovery/rehab/pre-hab/stretching day - lots of reps!


Awesome weights there mate. So are you training for a RAW or Geared comp next.

I never used gear but been told Box Squats have a bigger carry over to geared lifters as they teach you to sit back more and the more you sit back the more you get from the suit so your training sounds spot on to me.

I really want those Fat Gripz they just started selling them over here in NZ so hopefully Santa will be good to me this year.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Raw next in the 110kg class. That's Jan 28th. Then i'll be prepping for the BPC South Eastern Qualifier (Equipped) - hoping to drop to the 100's for that one.

Targets at that meet are 320/210/285.

I just want to do enough to qualify to lull the others into a false sense of security for the British! Then go and smash a 900+ total via 360/240/310! Should put me there or there abouts to qualify for worlds.


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> When doing Bent over rows (overhand grip) the bar comes up to touch my stomach, tucking my arms in which i feel is better, putting much less stress on my lower back, i agree with you Mark, rowing up to your chest must be more risky to the back. I like to involve the back as well as my arms, love the final squeeze at the end; you can really feel the old back working to finish the manoeuvre :thumb:
> 
> If I do an underhand row the bar comes closer to my chest, is that a typo above Mark? Or am i just weird?
> 
> When rowing i like to use my arms for the initial part then bring my back/lats into action about half way through the lift to complete the movement & bring the bar up against my stomach, i row just above horizontal with legs slightly bent & move ever so slightly up by using my legs as i complete the exercise. :thumb: I do love Overhand grip Bent over rows, so I'm biased


Definitely weird and you will get even weirder if you carry on powerlifting 

So are you going to try and compete, or are you happy doing your own thing?

I used straps all the time when lifting and wean myself off a couple of weeks before a comp, but my sport is a different kettle of fish!

Callus management is a bit of an art really , best thing I ever found for it was a boots hard skin remover for your feet, like a weird scalpel. But it just takes enough off, take off too much and they will be sore, if you leave them they will rip off:devil:

A halfway house is a gymnastics wrap, it's just a piece of leather but if your hands are sore it can give them time to recover.

My personal perspective on belts is to do 95% of your training without one and that will strengthen your core muscles, then when going for a pb stick one on and it will just protect you from any surprises


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I only realised how many types of grip strength there are when I started looking into it. Watch and feel how your grip is failing as for different eople its different things, I seen people who cant keep their thumb wrapped so the weight is just being held by their fingers, people who are the opposite and their fingers get pulled open, people who lose their pinkie finger first, etc. Plate Pinches will train your thumb alot so they are always good. I have Captain of Crush grippers and my mates and had a drunk comp one night and I could close the number 2 and no 1 else could but my chippy mate could close the number 1 gripper more times than me, just different typres of strength.
> 
> I use Chalk Blocks not poweder and just rub it on over a bucket and its pretty clean. Dust used to get everywhere but its personnal preffernce as my old training partner hated blocks whereas I prefer them so we had a massive bucket with both in


Are chalk blocks less messy than chalk balls (mine is a sort of porous bag full of chalk & is a bit messy looks a bit like a large white testical  ).

My grip seems a bit loose on my first & second fingers, not too much to worry about as I havent dropped the weight yet , im going to keep going up with my deadlift weight & force my grip to improve.

My view is SOD MY BODY, I WANT TO LIFT THAT WEIGHT!!!!  :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Definitely weird and you will get even weirder if you carry on powerlifting
> 
> :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
> 
> So are you going to try and compete, or are you happy doing your own thing?
> 
> *I have no plans, but would love to get strong enough to do some competing :thumb:*
> 
> I used straps all the time when lifting and wean myself off a couple of weeks before a comp, but my sport is a different kettle of fish!
> 
> Callus management is a bit of an art really , best thing I ever found for it was a boots hard skin remover for your feet, like a weird scalpel. But it just takes enough off, take off too much and they will be sore, if you leave them they will rip off:devil:
> 
> A halfway house is a gymnastics wrap, it's just a piece of leather but if your hands are sore it can give them time to recover.
> 
> My personal perspective on belts is to do 95% of your training without one and that will strengthen your core muscles, then when going for a pb stick one on and it will just protect you from any surprises


*At present I'm not using anything & I want to train as heavy as I possibly can without any extra equipment, I think the only thing I would consider is a belt, but only if I really have to, I used to feel better without one when squatting 180Kg plus in the past. *

*My new olympic set is a thing of beeeeeuteeee!!! Your right Mark, powerlifting does make you weird *


----------



## ITHAQVA

Took half a day off work to trial my new Olympic set 

*Overhead Press: 62.5KG/137.5LB *5,5,4,4,4. Due to the plate configurations being different I had to settle for .5KG over last week's weight of 62KG, So good result :thumb:

*Squat: 130LG/286LB 5X5 *:thumb:

*Deadlift: 140KG/308LB *tried a couple reps as the bar is thicker, felt a bit awkward & my grip wasn't as good, I'm hoping my grip strength will improve & I adjust to the thicker bar over the next few weeks. If not should I lower the weight to get used to the new bar on the Deadlift?


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Raw next in the 110kg class. That's Jan 28th. Then i'll be prepping for the BPC South Eastern Qualifier (Equipped) - hoping to drop to the 100's for that one.
> 
> Targets at that meet are 320/210/285.
> 
> I just want to do enough to qualify to lull the others into a false sense of security for the British! Then go and smash a 900+ total via 360/240/310! Should put me there or there abouts to qualify for worlds.


Jesus I need to start moving some serious weight as I would basically be in the same weight class and I'm nowhere near your standard. RESPECT


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Took half a day off work to trial my new Olympic set
> 
> *Overhead Press: 62.5KG/137.5LB *5,5,4,4,4. Due to the plate configurations being different I had to settle for .5KG over last week's weight of 62KG, So good result :thumb:
> 
> *Squat: 130LG/286LB 5X5 *:thumb:
> 
> *Deadlift: 140KG/308LB *tried a couple reps as the bar is thicker, felt a bit awkward & my grip wasn't as good, I'm hoping my grip strength will improve & I adjust to the thicker bar over the next few weeks. If not should I lower the weight to get used to the new bar on the Deadlift?


Good Man taking time off to play with the new weights. I be dissappointed if brand new Olympic weight staring at you all week and you didnt hit the gym.

Nice weights considering its a new set, new feel, etc


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout: 
Box Squats: 125kg 3 x 5 
Bench Press: 107.5kg 4,4,4,4,4
Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,5,3,3 

Couldnt quite get the bar to sit in the right place tonight on squats and think I had it abit to low as after I finished my shoulder hurt for the first time in ages.

Decided to just go for 4reps and on the first few sets I could have defiantly got 5 reps but my shoulder was hurting and sending a pain down through my bicep so I thought I choose my battles and not go all out on bench tonight as if I blow my shoulder out I could be out for months.

Pendlay rows showed me exactly why you keep a log of your weights, I was Rowing 80kg thinking my God this is hard I'm so s**t as I only deloaded a few weeks ago so I checked my log and the best I have done on 80kg after 3 weeks is 5,5,4,4,4 so I did ok actually. Its little things like that, that spur your training on as you know your improving.

Note: I really want to change to Madcow or Texas Method as my lower back is really taking a pounding Squating 3 times a week and during the Squat/Press/Deadlift workout all 3 exercises are loading my spine. I even missed a rep during my warm up but I want to stick to this program until I have run it all the way through and I seem to be progressing steadily so not sure really. Keep thinking the sets of Bench Press and Rows will be lower to 3 sets of 5 soon which will bring the volume down but probably not help the recovery of my lower back


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Good Man taking time off to play with the new weights. I be dissappointed if brand new Olympic weight staring at you all week and you didnt hit the gym.
> 
> Nice weights considering its a new set, new feel, etc


* I just couldn't leave them alone in the gym, i just had to something with them & they looked awful lonely in the gym on their own  

Thanks James, the only odd feeling was the deadlift as the bar is thicker, but having done some research after your advice on grip training, the thicker bar is a good way to increase grip, onward & upward :thumb: *



Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Box Squats: 125kg 3 x 5
> Bench Press: 107.5kg 4,4,4,4,4
> Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,5,3,3
> 
> Couldnt quite get the bar to sit in the right place tonight on squats and think I had it abit to low as after I finished my shoulder hurt for the first time in ages.
> 
> Decided to just go for 4reps and on the first few sets I could have defiantly got 5 reps but my shoulder was hurting and sending a pain down through my bicep so I thought I choose my battles and not go all out on bench tonight as if I blow my shoulder out I could be out for months.
> 
> Pendlay rows showed me exactly why you keep a log of your weights, I was Rowing 80kg thinking my God this is hard I'm so s**t as I only deloaded a few weeks ago so I checked my log and the best I have done on 80kg after 3 weeks is 5,5,4,4,4 so I did ok actually. Its little things like that, that spur your training on as you know your improving.
> 
> Note: I really want to change to Madcow or Texas Method as my lower back is really taking a pounding Squating 3 times a week and during the Squat/Press/Deadlift workout all 3 exercises are loading my spine. I even missed a rep during my warm up but I want to stick to this program until I have run it all the way through and I seem to be progressing steadily so not sure really. Keep thinking the sets of Bench Press and Rows will be lower to 3 sets of 5 soon which will bring the volume down but probably not help the recovery of my lower back


*Nothing wrong with that workout mate, I'm a bit like you though, always keep being hard on myself, You gotta hate those weights :devil:

As of next week I'm squatting twice a week only & going to incorporate chin-ups & pull-ups, would love to deadlift twice a week too at some time, but only do another 1X5 on a different day :thumb:

I'm also going to stick with my version of the deload (Rep Deload ) & reduce reps & build on them, as long as i make one rep each set ill not deload the weight :thumb:*


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Are chalk blocks less messy than chalk balls (mine is a sort of porous bag full of chalk & is a bit messy looks a bit like a large white testical  )./QUOTE]
> 
> Yep I have one of those white testical things, brought one as not allowed to use chalk in my old gym and these are not supposed to make any mess which I think is crap. I find that when I use the testical chalk drops from the bag and seems to fill the air but when I used Blocks I would just rub it on my hands above a bucket and it seemed to make less mess. I also found you could get more chalk on there if you really wanted it


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I find that when I use the testical chalk drops from the bag and seems to fill the air


:doublesho 

I'll look into a block mate, thanks :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=114&pid=5097

I hope this isn't against the rules....

I urge you all to buy this training related ebook. Its from EliteFTS (if you dont know this site, you should!) The book is supporting Make A Wish and is gold!!!!

Please give what you can to this great cause. I guarantee you will learn something from the book!


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> Jesus I need to start moving some serious weight as I would basically be in the same weight class and I'm nowhere near your standard. RESPECT


Those are all equipped numbers

I want 240/150/250-255 raw in Jan.

My new bench shirt that I thought had been dispatched is the wrong one  they've sent me an Ace instead of a Jack - so i've got to wait for it to come to the UK, then send it back and get the new one shipped over.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=114&pid=5097
> 
> I hope this isn't against the rules....
> 
> I urge you all to buy this training related ebook. Its from EliteFTS (if you dont know this site, you should!) The book is supporting Make A Wish and is gold!!!!
> 
> Please give what you can to this great cause. I guarantee you will learn something from the book!


Thanks mate, looking at the site now :thumb:

And for a good cause too :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

sidewalkdances said:


> Those are all equipped numbers
> 
> bench shirt
> 
> 
> 
> is it just a shirt for benching? :newbie:
Click to expand...


----------



## sidewalkdances

Estoril-5 said:


> sidewalkdances said:
> 
> 
> 
> Those are all equipped numbers
> 
> bench shirt
> 
> 
> 
> is it just a shirt for benching? :newbie:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes
> 
> http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=204&pid=5085 - thats the shirt I have on the way
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=114&pid=5097
> 
> I hope this isn't against the rules....
> 
> I urge you all to buy this training related ebook. Its from EliteFTS (if you dont know this site, you should!) The book is supporting Make A Wish and is gold!!!!
> 
> Please give what you can to this great cause. I guarantee you will learn something from the book!


Already done this and donated. Its for a good cause anyway but you get E-books worth more than the $10 bucks so everybody wins. Sign up to Elietfts and you can get Date Tate's Vault E-Book free as well which is pretty good.



sidewalkdances said:


> I want 240/150/250-255 raw in Jan.


There the same Raw numbers that I want. I think I will eventually hit the Squat and Bench but dont know about that Deadlift as I hate Deadlifts but seem to be improving on them alot easier this time than squats which is weird as I always been a strong squatter. I trained at a Power lifting gym before and they were really a Bench Press special gym and they were constanly asking me to start equipped as they were saying my body shape is perfect for a big bench so hopefully 1 day (soon) I will get a 150kg Bench.

Shame about your Bench Shirt mate, I know there's a real science to picking the correct shirt


----------



## sidewalkdances

Just got in from the gym and eaten. Even though I feel like absolute crap (I think i'm coming down with some sort of cold) I managed a deadlift PR. It involved a lot of grunting at the bar to get it done, but it happened! 230kg x3 (Dead Stop)

Then moved on to 4" Conventional block pulls - 180/190/200x5 a piece and then 210x3 and 220x3 before I just ran out of steam. On another day, i'd have had them no trouble - just felt weak from the cold i've got. Finished up with back extentions (weighted), calf raises, DB Shrugs and Abs.

I'm still 7 weeks away from the raw comp, so i'm feeling pretty confident of hitting that 250 with my sumo stance!


----------



## Modmedia

Anyone joined the SL Inner Circle? I have and it's really good


----------



## MarkH

A little article that may be of interest for you?

http://www.andyboltonstrength.org/2011/12/07/off-season-training-for-strength-athletes/


----------



## sidewalkdances

When you get a bit stronger, waving intensities is always a good idea. 

Squats tonight, think i'm off a low box again!


----------



## Estoril-5

Modmedia said:


> Anyone joined the SL Inner Circle? I have and it's really good


is there a cost to joining the inner circle?


----------



## sidewalkdances

If there is, I wouldn't bother.

Watch this video (NSFW Bad Language) -


----------



## Bod42

after abit of advice and views really.

I been doing stronglift for a while now and I moved down from 5x5 to 3x5 as I deloaded twice but still squatting 3 times a week. All my lifts are increasing except for my squat it seems and I think this is to do with the 3 times a week squatting. I havent been to the gym 3 times in 1 week in quite a while so last week I made an effort to make sure I did so I hit the gym Mon & Wed but on Fri when my alarm went off the first thing I remember thinking was cool I got the gym today, ah s**t I got squats again and ended up not going.

I'm thinking of moving squatting to twice a week as I think I'm not recovering fully between workouts. Problem is I said I would not program jump this time and would see every program through to the end so not sure to do this or except that my recovery isnt good enough and change the workout.

In some ways I want to lower the squat ratio but in others I dont as when I started this workout I was constantly solid, my legs were rock hard all the time and I felt good, now I seem to be doing 2 workouts a week and I seem to be softing up.

Thinking maybe I should man up and complete the program and then move on. Stronglift does state once your lifting 300lb squats most people move on and I'm squatting 291.5lb.

Opinons Please?


----------



## chunkytfg

After some advice please.

My step son want some 'cast iron weights' for Xmas as he is looking to bulk up and if i'm honest they would be a useful addition to my Homegym/Garage!

Can anyone point me in the right direction for a good starter set? Budget I would hazard a guess at the £100-£150 range. Could go for more if it is something special.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> after abit of advice and views really.
> 
> I been doing stronglift for a while now and I moved down from 5x5 to 3x5 as I deloaded twice but still squatting 3 times a week. All my lifts are increasing except for my squat it seems and I think this is to do with the 3 times a week squatting. I havent been to the gym 3 times in 1 week in quite a while so last week I made an effort to make sure I did so I hit the gym Mon & Wed but on Fri when my alarm went off the first thing I remember thinking was cool I got the gym today, ah s**t I got squats again and ended up not going.
> 
> I'm thinking of moving squatting to twice a week as I think I'm not recovering fully between workouts. Problem is I said I would not program jump this time and would see every program through to the end so not sure to do this or except that my recovery isnt good enough and change the workout.
> 
> In some ways I want to lower the squat ratio but in others I dont as when I started this workout I was constantly solid, my legs were rock hard all the time and I felt good, now I seem to be doing 2 workouts a week and I seem to be softing up.
> 
> Thinking maybe I should man up and complete the program and then move on. Stronglift does state once your lifting 300lb squats most people move on and I'm squatting 291.5lb.
> 
> Opinons Please?


Bod,
I'm only on 286LB squats for reps & I'm already going to move squats to twice a week as of tomorrow. I listen to my body & i feel that squatting 3 times a week is too much.

I will replace the 3rd squat session as below & cycle my sessions in 8 week phases.

Brief over view.

Phase 2: 8 weeks: 3rd squat session replaced with chin ups; pull ups.
Phase 3: 8 weeks 3rd Squat session replaced with standing calf raises.
Phase 3: 8 weeks, Squat session replaced with close grip bench presses.
Phase4: 8 weeks, Squat session replaced with shrugs.
Phase5: 8 weeks, Squat session replaced with uprights rows.
Phase6: 8 weeks, Squat session replaced with Deadlifts (1X5)

I will keep the fundamentals as they are overhead press, bench press, overhand grip bent over row & keep squats 2 x a week.

Rather than de load the weight, wherever possible I will just de load the reps & work on them until I attain 5X5 on the exercise then add weight.

In the next few weeks I will also incorporate 30 mins aerobic work on the air walker 3 times a week to help reduce some body fat.
:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> If there is, I wouldn't bother.
> 
> Watch this video (NSFW Bad Language) - EliteFTS.com -Jim on the net - *strong profanity - YouTube


Perfect, lift weigths!!!!!!!!!! :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## chunkytfg

chunkytfg said:


> After some advice please.
> 
> My step son want some 'cast iron weights' for Xmas as he is looking to bulk up and if i'm honest they would be a useful addition to my Homegym/Garage!
> 
> Can anyone point me in the right direction for a good starter set? Budget I would hazard a guess at the £100-£150 range. Could go for more if it is something special.


anyone?


----------



## ITHAQVA

chunkytfg said:


> anyone?


I have done a review of the 235KG version of the below set, hopefully it will give you a good idea Tim :thumb:

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...dypower_105kg_olympic_weight_set/11214_p.html

Review: 
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372

I have used both these sites for major purchases :thumb:

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesdy's 5X5

Felt very low on energy, but the workout when well considering, bench a bit pants on last two sets.

*Bench Press 92.5KG/203.5LB 5, 5, 5, 2, 3.

Squat 132.5KG/291.5LB 5X5

Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip) 87.5KG/192.5LB 5X5*

:thumb:


----------



## Modmedia

sidewalkdances said:


> If there is, I wouldn't bother.
> 
> Watch this video (NSFW Bad Language) - EliteFTS.com -Jim on the net - *strong profanity - YouTube


Lift for 10-12 years _then_ check out if my form is correct?

No thanks. :thumb:


----------



## chunkytfg

ITHAQVA said:


> I have done a review of the 235KG version of the below set, hopefully it will give you a good idea Tim :thumb:
> 
> http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...dypower_105kg_olympic_weight_set/11214_p.html
> 
> Review:
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372
> 
> I have used both these sites for major purchases :thumb:
> 
> http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/
> 
> http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/


Many thanks for your help.

On further talking with the step son he doesnt want a bar just dumbells so I have bought him the 75kg olympic plate set

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-olympic-cast-iron-weight-plates.php

And a pair of the olympic short bars

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/powerhouse-olympic-chrome-dumbbell-bar-single.php

That should do him and when he comes back from uni next april they will be in my garage so i'll by a proper bar aswell and some extra weights:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday Workout: 
Box Squats: 127.5kg 3 x 5 
Seated Shoulder Press: 47.5kg 3 x 5 
Conventional Deadlift: 140.0kg 1 x 5 
Chin Ups: 5 x 4, 5 x 3 Alternate Grips 

As usual Box squat felt slow and I eally felt it in my legs tonight.
Shoulder Press and Deadlifts have recently been deloaded so I'm still working back up to maximum weight so these were quite easy. 

Thanks for the advice ITHAQVA, thats exactly what I'm thinking, my body is telling me thats its struggling squating 3 times a week but I promised myself that I would not program jump so last nights session felt really good so I'm thinking of pushing the squatting 3 times a week as far as it will go because if its to much and I cant recover then I will have to deload and after 2 deloads you lower the volume, then after 2 deloads at lower volume I then change to squatting twice per week so I may only be on the program for a few more weeks. The biggest thing is that 5x5 works so well with my Bench Press as well, every time I gone on 5x5 my Bench flyes up.

As you say I just got to start hating those weight especially on squats gggrrrr


----------



## Bod42

chunkytfg said:


> anyone?


Not to try and flog peoples things but I know both me and ITHAQVA have normal sized (not olympic) weights that we no longer use as we have upgraded. I think we both have Benches as well as we have upgraded to full Power Racks. Where are you based mate?









This is the Bench I have and used for years, I have proper Cast Metal weights tho not the concrete filled plastic ones in the picture.

ITHAQVA may chime in and tell me I'm talking utter crap so have to wait for him to confirm but I'm sure I read it somewhere lol.


----------



## chunkytfg

ITHAQVA has already offered me some of his old kit but he's in cornwall and i'm in Norfolk so about as far away from each other as possible!

Thanks for the offer but i've bought what I need for the time beeing as will be a good base to start him off with I rekon! Not that I think he'll stick with it but if that's the case I'll be happy to add to it and make use of it myself.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Not to try and flog peoples things but I know both me and ITHAQVA have normal sized (not olympic) weights that we no longer use as we have upgraded. I think we both have Benches as well as we have upgraded to full Power Racks. Where are you based mate?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the Bench I have and used for years, I have proper Cast Metal weights tho not the concrete filled plastic ones in the picture.
> 
> ITHAQVA may chime in and tell me I'm talking utter crap so have to wait for him to confirm but I'm sure I read it somewhere lol.


I've got a local buyer hopefully, will be glad to get rid of all that kit  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I've got a local buyer hopefully, will be glad to get rid of all that kit  :thumb:


Thats good mate, my stuff is all stored at my rens so keep getting moaned at to move it considering I'm across the world.

Gave it to my cousin as he wanted to get in shape but his Girlfriend has convinced him not to do it as she done Sports Science at Uni and was taught that weight lifting, protein and creatine are all dangerous. Amazing!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> but his Girlfriend has convinced him not to do it as she done Sports Science at Uni and was taught that weight lifting, protein and creatine are all dangerous. Amazing!


Goes to show how mislead some experts are :thumb:, I feel at my best when lifting. When not lifting i feel my life is lacking something......... WEIGHTS! 

I'm glad I lift weighs & I'm glad its unfashionable too


----------



## Bod42

ithaqva said:


> goes to show how mislead some experts are :thumb:, i feel at my best when lifting. When not lifting i feel my life is lacking something......... Weights! :d
> 
> i'm glad i lift weighs & i'm glad its unfashionable too :d


well said


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursday 5X5

*Overhead press 62.5KG/137.5LB, did two sets got 3, 3, so lowered weight back to 60KG/132LB & got 5,5,5 

Will stick with the 60KG for a very strict 5X5 before increasing weight again :thumb: *

*Pull ups & Chin ups 1,1,1,1,1, first rep was ok after that only achieved half reps  *

*Deadlift 140KG/308LB 1X3 Grip is starting to feel better already & I could of done another rep or two but want to get used to the new bar & slowly increase my grip strength :thumb:*

Would much appreciate some advice please guys, would it be better to do some underhand Bent over rows instead of the pull ups/chin ups, bear in mind I'm already doing Overhand grip Bent over rows, basically should i forget the pull ups/chin ups for a while & go through all my other exercises & build up my strength?

On my to do list, in no particular order 

*Dips
Standing Calf raises
Close Grip Bench Press
Underhand Grip Bent Over Rows
Shrugs
Upright Rows*


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Would much appreciate some advice please guys, would it be better to do some underhand Bent over rows instead of the pull ups/chin ups, bear in mind I'm already doing Overhand grip Bent over rows, basically should i forget the pull ups/chin ups for a while & go through all my other exercises & build up my strength?
> 
> On my to do list, in no particular order
> 
> *Dips
> Standing Calf raises
> Close Grip Bench Press
> Underhand Grip Bent Over Rows
> Shrugs
> Upright Rows*


I would personally stick with Chin/Pull-Ups as underhand Rows will hit your back slightly different than Overhand Rows but not a great deal whereas the Chin/Pullups hit your back from a completely different angle. You should progress pretty fast with Chin Ups, I know I did. Also I used to have a 120kg Row but couldnt do more than 1or 2 Chin Ups as it hits different muscles and I find Chin/Pull Ups are great for shoulder health and easy to get extra pulling volume into your workout.

I started with 30 sets of 1 and Im now doing 6 sets of 4 reps and 4 sets of 3 reps. I also got my Mrs who couldnt do one Chin Up to do 20 sets of 1 rep, anyway she could using jump Chins and next workout she did 2 full reps as it has such an impact on her strength.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Box Squats: 130kg 3 x 5
Bench Press: 107.5kg 5,5,5,4,4
Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,5,4,4

I just need to man up and hit my squats hard cos yes they were hard tonight but no where near my limit and they were a PR since starting training again. Really felt it in the right places tonight so hopefully next time I can increase again.

Bench Press was going really well until I learnt why my Power Rack was worth the money otherwise I be writing this with no face. Hit a horrible rep on the way down and it got miles to far towards my face on the way up but kept pushing it and then was basically doing a skull crusher before it arced straight for my face. 107.5kg falling onto your face would have hurt.

Rows were another PR as well so its going well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I would personally stick with Chin/Pull-Ups as underhand Rows will hit your back slightly different than Overhand Rows but not a great deal whereas the Chin/Pullups hit your back from a completely different angle. You should progress pretty fast with Chin Ups, I know I did. Also I used to have a 120kg Row but couldnt do more than 1or 2 Chin Ups as it hits different muscles and I find Chin/Pull Ups are great for shoulder health and easy to get extra pulling volume into your workout.
> 
> I started with 30 sets of 1 and Im now doing 6 sets of 4 reps and 4 sets of 3 reps. I also got my Mrs who couldnt do one Chin Up to do 20 sets of 1 rep, anyway she could using jump Chins and next workout she did 2 full reps as it has such an impact on her strength.





Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Box Squats: 130kg 3 x 5
> Bench Press: 107.5kg 5,5,5,4,4
> Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,5,4,4
> 
> I just need to man up and hit my squats hard cos yes they were hard tonight but no where near my limit and they were a PR since starting training again. Really felt it in the right places tonight so hopefully next time I can increase again.
> 
> Bench Press was going really well until I learnt why my Power Rack was worth the money otherwise I be writing this with no face. Hit a horrible rep on the way down and it got miles to far towards my face on the way up but kept pushing it and then was basically doing a skull crusher before it arced straight for my face. 107.5kg falling onto your face would have hurt.
> 
> Rows were another PR as well so its going well.


I will do that mate :thumb:, just to see how I progress, if I start to increase my chin/pull up reps ill be very happy, I used to do more, so onward & upward :devil:

That's sounds scary Bod, nearly a real scull crusher, I always make sure I lower below my chest, but know what you mean, anything for the extra rep!!! , good old power racks, 107.5KG on the face that'll smart some :doublesho

I would love to get my bench to 107KG in the next month or so :argie:, you lucky bugger


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Well Pleased!*

Saturdays 5X5

*Bench Press: 92.5KG/203.5LB 5X5 :thumb:

Squat: 135KG/297LB 5X5 :thumb:

Bent Over Row (Overhand Grip): 90KG/198LB 5X5* :thumb:

*Observations noticed since started squatting twice a week:*

Feel less drained.
Still go plenty of energy after workouts.
Felt much stronger in all my lifts.
Body isn't aching during non-training & training days.

I'm assuming the above is due to my body being able to recover properly, what do you guys think?

I felt so strong in the 90Kg bent over rows I checked the weights…twice 

A great workout, today I will feel EPIC & will be walking around carrying bags of WIN in my pockets! 

*One more question guys:*

My squat feels really good & i felt no pain or twinges at all, I would like to squat for as long as it feels safe without a belt, am i being very silly or do you guys think its ok to keep training as long as my body feels safe & pain free. Honest opinions please chaps  :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Modmedia said:


> Lift for 10-12 years _then_ check out if my form is correct?
> 
> No thanks. :thumb:


I think you've missed the point there a little bit...

I've managed to bugger my shoulder up replacing the battery in my old car :wall: - I'm selling the ruddy thing and it needed a new battery (roadside repairs!) and i've twisted it up something chronic. Just started aching on Friday through the day and by Friday night I couldnt take my t-shirt off without excruciating pain. So what did I do Saturday?

GYM!!!

Warmed it up and it felt a bit better, so just did a set at a time. Worked up to 120x5 and 125x3 on the floor press, 40x5x3 on the Incline DB's (these hurt a fair bit :lol: ), BB Incline Skulls, Band Flys, Pushdowns and done.

Heat seems to be making the pain subside a little bit, but i'm still going to get a massage in the week to see if there is an impingement in the shoulder area or if it is just a strain.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesdays 5X5

*Overhead Press: 60KG/132LB 5X5

Pull-ups/Chin-ups: bodyweight: 1.75, 1, 1.5, 1.5, 1.5

Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 1 X 2.*

Lesson learnt, do pull-ups & chin-ups after my deadlift, my grip started to fail after two reps


----------



## Bod42

^^^^^^^

I agree with that lesson. Always do your Main exercises first.

And the grip issue I think that is why my Deadlift grip is so much stronger as I have been doing high volume Chins, really hits your grip more than you think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Also as im on 140KG Deadlift, i finally gave in & bought one of these, really well priced :thumb:

RDX Cow Hide Leather Weight lifting Belt Fitness Training Gym: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Leisure

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I used to wear a belt when I very first started lifting but I never felt right in one so havent worn one since.

I would personally do abit more volume on Chin Ups, just from experience I used to do 3-5 sets of max reps at the end of the workout and it didnt do much but as soon as I started adding more volume I got alot better at them. Check out Harry Selkow on Elitefts in the Q&A section, he is always writting people Chin Ups Programs and normally advocates 10 sets


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I used to wear a belt when I very first started lifting but I never felt right in one so havent worn one since.
> 
> I would personally do abit more volume on Chin Ups, just from experience I used to do 3-5 sets of max reps at the end of the workout and it didnt do much but as soon as I started adding more volume I got alot better at them. Check out Harry Selkow on Elitefts in the Q&A section, he is always writting people Chin Ups Programs and normally advocates 10 sets


Going there now Bod, cheers mate.

So 10 sets of basicaly max reps? So at the moment it would be 10 sets 1 to 2 reps?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thanks for the link to Elite lifts :thumb:

Loads of really good power lifting info, its in my favourites & I’ve got all Christmas to take in the information, like the idea of doing negative pull ups to help improve my reps, I used to do these years ago, they are going to hurt loads in the morning  :devil:

And even though I am one of those who has warmed up very little over the years & got away with it , I think now I should start to take it more serous as I do wish to achieve my Deadlift/Squat 500LB & Bench Press 330LB goals without inury :thumb:


----------



## Modmedia

Anyone see the new app for Stronglifts?

I have it and it looks to be fantastic. Only released today!


----------



## sidewalkdances

Harry Selkow's Pull Up Progression is largely as follows. I'll use someone who can do 5 reps as an example

Week 1 5 sets of 3
Week 2 5 sets of 4
Week 3 5 sets of 5
Week 4 6 sets of 5
Week 5 7x5
Week 6 8x5
Week 9 9x5
Week 10 10x5 

Week 11 5x6 and 5x5
Week 12 6x6 and 4x5
Week 13 7x6 and 3x5

etc etc


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> *Upright Rows*


Mate, you might want to google for info about these before you do them. There is a risk of tendon damage with this exercise.


----------



## Edstrung

PS, ITHAQVA's thread on his rack and weights setup convinced me to cancel my gym membership in the new year and save up toward the rack.

I'm sick and tired of going to the gym with friends, and all they want to do is Chest and Bicep  They still wont even listen to me that to get bigger arms, you do tricep, not bicep only 

I want to get back to squating/deadlift/bench/shoulderpress, with some core work and toning up after. Can't wait to join the 5x5 

One thing I have been able to get my training partners to do is super sets and drop sets. I'm enjoying seing my friends in pain for the first time


----------



## ITHAQVA

Edstrung said:


> PS, ITHAQVA's thread on his rack and weights setup convinced me to cancel my gym membership in the new year and save up toward the rack.
> 
> I'm sick and tired of going to the gym with friends, and all they want to do is Chest and Bicep  They still wont even listen to me that to get bigger arms, you do tricep, not bicep only
> 
> I want to get back to squating/deadlift/bench/shoulderpress, with some core work and toning up after. Can't wait to join the 5x5
> 
> One thing I have been able to get my training partners to do is super sets and drop sets. I'm enjoying seing my friends in pain for the first time


The Tricep is the biggest part of your arm, let em do their crap mate, you get your rack & build some big guns :thumb:

Im taking a training day off as its christmas week :thumb:

Glad your going for the power rack, if you need to know anything about my set up just ask :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Mate, you might want to google for info about these before you do them. There is a risk of tendon damage with this exercise.


I agree, however I train slightly different when I do my upright rows, got to 40KG/88LB with no issues.

*For those who are considering the upright row:*
When I execute the upright row I bring the bar up to the lower chest region so that I'm in fact only using my arms, I don't try to bring the bar up higher as you are then involving the shoulders in a sort of close grip shrugging movement & what I consider an unnatural movement especially with heavy weight on the bar, this can cause all sorts of shoulder problems & shoulder injuries take ages to go away. For me the upright row is an arm development exercise :doublesho so i have no need to take it all the way up & put my shoulders at risk 

Try it like the above, you'll see your biceps & triceps flare out like buggery :thumb: :thumb:

I Also checked out the elite lifts videos & see why they bench the way they do, doing a body build style bench press with loads of weight could put far too much stress on your shoulders & from my experience the shoulders are probably the most troublesome parts of my body :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Edstrung said:


> PS, ITHAQVA's thread on his rack and weights setup convinced me to cancel my gym membership in the new year and save up toward the rack.
> 
> I'm sick and tired of going to the gym with friends, and all they want to do is Chest and Bicep  They still wont even listen to me that to get bigger arms, you do tricep, not bicep only
> 
> I want to get back to squating/deadlift/bench/shoulderpress, with some core work and toning up after. Can't wait to join the 5x5
> 
> One thing I have been able to get my training partners to do is super sets and drop sets. I'm enjoying seing my friends in pain for the first time


Yep me and ITHAQVA have exactly the same Bench and Cage set up. Must say its the nuts. Explain to your friends that 2/3 of your arm is triceps and most importly I know people with well defined biceps but unless your a bell end no one walks around with their arm bent with their bicep tensed whereas where you have good triceps your arms look big when their by your sides.

ITHAQVA: Side walk dance has outlined Harry's typical recons and he normally doesnt say do max rep, if you can do 5RM he wld normally say do high volume of sub maximal reps so 10 sets of 3. I started with 10 sets of 2 and just increased by 1 rep each workout so with stronglift that is 3 reps every 2 weeks so it doesnt take long to improve.

Negative Chin Ups are the best, I use them at the end of every workout. I used to train one of the Wingers at the rugby club and his Chin Ups were insane, 1 because he was naturally good at them when he started, 2 cos I told him Chin Up strength has a massive corralation with sprint speed and also cos he was under 10% BF so his Power to Weight ratio was really good. He weighted 75kg but was doing 10 rep Pull Ups with 40kg extra on a dip belt. And I'm talking proper Pull Ups with hands real wide and chest touching the bar, crazy.


----------



## Bod42

Modmedia said:


> Anyone see the new app for Stronglifts?
> 
> I have it and it looks to be fantastic. Only released today!


I just received an E-mail about this today so downloaded it. Looks good and very good for beginners as I think beginners mess with workouts to much whereas this lays out everything.

It should be coming out on the better Android soon as well


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Yep me and ITHAQVA have exactly the same Bench and Cage set up. Must say its the nuts. Explain to your friends that 2/3 of your arm is triceps and most importly I know people with well defined biceps but unless your a bell end no one walks around with their arm bent with their bicep tensed whereas where you have good triceps your arms look big when their by your sides.
> 
> *+ :thumb: for the set up, it has given me so much more confidence to train hard & heavier :thumb:
> Exactly, I love doing heavy triceps training: Close Grip Bench Press & weighted Dips are my favourite triceps exercises.*
> 
> ITHAQVA: Side walk dance has outlined Harry's typical recons and he normally doesnt say do max rep, if you can do 5RM he wld normally say do high volume of sub maximal reps so 10 sets of 3. I started with 10 sets of 2 and just increased by 1 rep each workout so with stronglift that is 3 reps every 2 weeks so it doesnt take long to improve. :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Negative Chin Ups are the best, I use them at the end of every workout. I used to train one of the Wingers at the rugby club and his Chin Ups were insane, 1 because he was naturally good at them when he started, 2 cos I told him Chin Up strength has a massive corralation with sprint speed and also cos he was under 10% BF so his Power to Weight ratio was really good. He weighted 75kg but was doing 10 rep Pull Ups with 40kg extra on a dip belt. And I'm talking proper Pull Ups with hands real wide and chest touching the bar, crazy.


*Dont think i would train Negative chins/pull ups 3 x a week though, negatives hit the recovery really hard, im going for twice one week once the second & alternate & build from there first* :thumb:

I will be following this routine for fat gits:  http://articles.elitefts.com/articl...ogression-part-ii-super-heavy-weight-edition/

I estimate my body fat to be around 22-24%% so im not very lean at the moment & chinning nearly 16 Stone is really bloody hard  However the pull & chin up ARE squats for the upper body & I want to achieve some real power in these exercises. I some respects being heavy is good because if i can get to doing a 5X5 on positive pull ups there will be a considerable power increase on my upper body.

I can see http://www.elitefts.net/ being my second home.

Found this Bench Press link to be very usefull: 
http://articles.elitefts.com/articl...ave-tate-teaches-the-bench-press-at-the-ugss/ :thumb: :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Good results from today's 5X5!*

Saturday's 5X5

*Bench Press: 95KG/209LB 5X5, well pleased with this, followed Dave tates advice & squeesed my triceps & lats during each rep, wont say it felt easy but felt easier to achieve my designated reps :thumb::thumb:

Squat: 137.5KG/302.5LB 5X5, going to read info on elite lifts as this is now starting to feel heavy 

Bent over Row (Overhand Grip): 92KG/202.4LB 5X5*

Used my belt on two sets of the squats not sure if it really helped to be honest, but either way I will need one very soon me thinks 

*Questions guys*

1. Even though I completed the bent over rows with a 5X5, they were quite heavy & made my back a little sore, I'm seriously considering replacing these with the positive/negative chins & pull-ups, what do you think?

2. Also very tempted to reduce the Squats down to 3 sets of 5 reps as todays workout was really tiring, not sure if it was due to training this morning which I don't normally do, or that the weight is now at a point where I should be reducing sets, what do you guys think?


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 132.5kg 3 x 4
Seated Shoulder Press: 50kg 3 x 5
Deadlifts: 145kg 1 x 3

Not the best workout but I know deep down that I want to change to Madcow or 5/3/1 so I'm not putting 100% into this workout but my New Years reso is to smash the gym hard 3 times a week no matter what. Trying to talk a few of my mates into being training partners as this always ups the intensity.

ITHAQVA: I wouldnt personally drop Rows. Its best if you have one horizontal and one Verticle Row. Maybe try different variation like T-Bar Rows or Pendlay Rows. I used to Row with my legs slightly bent and bent at the hips so my head was quite far away from my legs but now I push my **** back and use that weight to counter balance the bar weight. This also seems to have less stress on my lower back, pendlay rows also hit the lower back less.

Maybe try finishing with high rep back extentions as well. So many options


----------



## sidewalkdances

I agree, don't drop rows. Nor should you drop sets either - training is meant to be tiring!

I've had an up and down week with training. Xmas Eve I hit 127.5x2 on the bench. Frankly awful! Putting it down to tiredness. Deadlifts were fine, if a little heavy feeling - they were only light weights anyway. Squats yesterday were fine enough, my top set (192.5x2) felt a bit ropey, more because I was worried about not tearing my shorts, so I descended really really slowly! Lost all my pop at the bottom. Think I cut it slightly high too.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I agree, don't drop rows. Nor should you drop sets either - training is meant to be tiring!
> 
> I've had an up and down week with training. Xmas Eve I hit 127.5x2 on the bench. Frankly awful! Putting it down to tiredness. Deadlifts were fine, if a little heavy feeling - they were only light weights anyway. Squats yesterday were fine enough, my top set (192.5x2) felt a bit ropey, more because I was worried about not tearing my shorts, so I descended really really slowly! Lost all my pop at the bottom. Think I cut it slightly high too.


I thought as the weight got heavier it was correct to lower sets down to 3 on squats.

I'm only on a 97.5Kg Bench, would love to be able to bench 127.5KG mate :thumb:

As for 197.5KG being ropey :doublesho Roll on me being ropey


----------



## ITHAQVA

*8 weeks Progress.*

I have completed my first 8 weeks of the 5X5, as it's the Christmas holidays I will be only doing a few sets/exercises this week, I plan to do Bench Press & Overhead press this week then get back into another 8 week phase starting 2 Jan 2011.
Have decided to incorporate positive/static & negative pull-ups in the next 8 weeks phase, however I will stick to the same formula, as it is still giving me good results.

Progress report.

*Exercise------Starting Weight------finishing weight------weight Increase

Squat-------- 92KG/202.4LB------ 137.5KG/302.5LB-----45.5KG/100.1LB

Deadlift------100KG/220LB-------- 140KG/308LB---------40KG/88LB

Bench Press-- 77KG/169.4LB------95KG/209LB-----------18KG/39.6LB

Overhead Press--40KG/88LB------60KG/132LB------------20KG/44LB

Bent Over Row --67KG/147.4LB---92.5KG/203.5LB-------25.5KG/56.1LB*

Conclusion:

I am very pleased with my results, but realise that progress may slow down as the weights get heavier, as an example from above, even though I've added 18KG/39.6LB to my Bench Press, I feel it will be very difficult to add the same again over the next 8 weeks, but I will continue to aim for more weight & each time I plateau I will go back just one step & follow sidewalks advice & dominate the weight before trying to move on again with more weight, this I feel is far better approach than keep on de loading as per the strong lifts 5X5 recommendation.
Hope this inspires anyone wishing to have a go at this amazing/challenging sport.

A big thank you to the guys on this thread, who have inspired me :thumb::thumb:

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

Friday's partial 5X5

Made some fundamental changes to my training due to the training weights feeling heavier.

1. Wearing my Weight lifting belt throughout my workouts :thumb:

2. Spend 6 minutes stretching before starting my 5 warm up sets :thumb:

*Bench Press: 97.5KG/214.5LB 3, 4, 4, 4, 4.* :thumb:
I have always done the Bench Press from the lowest point, but after not being able to lift well on the first set, I decided to do it as most power lifters do, start at the top. This enabled me to lift/carry on, so lesson learnt, it also felt easier to start at the top.

*Bent over row (Overhand grip): 95KG/209LB 5, 5, 3, 4, 3. * :thumb:

As i do almost horizontal (Pendlay rows as some call it, but to me it's just a proper Bent Over row) the weight above is now getting difficult & feeling HEAVY 

On elitefts they seem to do a more erect position row (Barbell Row) & use momentum & loads of body movement.

http://train.elitefts.com/exercises-by-body-part/delts-exercises-by-body-part/barbell-rows/

I move my torso up approx.. 5-6" from the horizontal to complete the last one or two reps, legs stay bent throughout the movement.

Not dissing the guy in the vid, he looks like a powerhouse, but as I have done mainly weight training, his form seems shocking to me, opinions please Bod/Sidewalk/Mark, does this excess movement not put more strain on the joints/back & increase the risk of injury? I'm sure I could do much more than my measly 95KG I'm using now if i rowed in his loose style.

Will do another partial workout this Saturday or Sunday consisting of:
Overhead press & deadlift 

In the new year I will be only squatting once one week & twice the following week & alternating this cycle, the removed squat sessions will be replaced with negative/static/positive pull-ups, giving me a nice variation in my training :thumb: :thumb:

Happy New Year guys! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Box Squats: 132.5kg 5,5,3
Bench Press: 107.5kg 5,5,3,0,0
Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,3,0,0

I was so tired during this workout, I wasnt going to go but made a deal with myself that no matter how I feel I go to the gym. The first 2 sets were hard but I just ran out of energy on set 3 and this is where you need a training partner shouting at you because during my 3rd set I was trying to add up how many reps I done total and so didint think i
of my actual reps. 

Doug:Check out Eric Cressey Maximum Stregth 2 Warm Ups, thats what I use everytime I warm up. Its a group of stretches and mobility exercises. Joe Defranco also has his own warm ups which are basically the same, stretches and mobility exercises.

Pendlay Rows arent just horizontal Rows, they are a row where you stop the weight on the flloor between each rep. Makes the rows slightly harder as it takes your stretch reflex and the momentum out of the movement.

I dont think bad form should ever be used but I do think cheat reps have their place, try for instance really strict barbell curls and feel how much your arms hurt and then do really strict reps plus a few cheat curls at the end and feel how much more your arms hurt. Trouble is the line between bad/dangerous form and cheat reps is different for every person. If you read AST workouts they recommend that you use what they call natural body movement for all exercises as they say this is the way the body naturally moves so why would yopu train different.

The 3 squat workouts in 2 weeks sounds good. With you lowering the squat sets from 5 down to 3 sets, the reason you do this on stronglift is that you are lowerig the volume but keeping the frequency the same so your only changing one variable. If you are gaining good results on 5x5 maybe you should look at the Texas Method as this involves 1 5x5 high intensity/high volume workout a week, 1 low intensity/low volume and then 1 high intensity/low volume workout. Its an intermediate workout populised by Glen Pendlay.

I used to think you shouldnt work a muscle more than once per week but now Im starting to learn that it all depends on the intensity/volume of your workout. If you keep the overall intensity/volume low then you can workout more often, if you kill yourself in the gym then your body needs longer to recover so its finding a balance of this. You want to keep the intensity/volume as high as possible to force adaption as fast as possible but you want it low enough so you dont overtrain.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Box Squats: 132.5kg 5,5,3
> Bench Press: 107.5kg 5,5,3,0,0
> Pendlay Rows: 80.0kg 5,5,3,0,0
> 
> I was so tired during this workout, I wasnt going to go but made a deal with myself that no matter how I feel I go to the gym. The first 2 sets were hard but I just ran out of energy on set 3 and this is where you need a training partner shouting at you because during my 3rd set I was trying to add up how many reps I done total and so didint think i
> of my actual reps.
> 
> Doug:Check out Eric Cressey Maximum Stregth 2 Warm Ups, thats what I use everytime I warm up. Its a group of stretches and mobility exercises. Joe Defranco also has his own warm ups which are basically the same, stretches and mobility exercises.
> 
> Pendlay Rows arent just horizontal Rows, they are a row where you stop the weight on the flloor between each rep. Makes the rows slightly harder as it takes your stretch reflex and the momentum out of the movement.
> 
> I dont think bad form should ever be used but I do think cheat reps have their place, try for instance really strict barbell curls and feel how much your arms hurt and then do really strict reps plus a few cheat curls at the end and feel how much more your arms hurt. Trouble is the line between bad/dangerous form and cheat reps is different for every person. If you read AST workouts they recommend that you use what they call natural body movement for all exercises as they say this is the way the body naturally moves so why would yopu train different.
> 
> The 3 squat workouts in 2 weeks sounds good. With you lowering the squat sets from 5 down to 3 sets, the reason you do this on stronglift is that you are lowerig the volume but keeping the frequency the same so your only changing one variable. If you are gaining good results on 5x5 maybe you should look at the Texas Method as this involves 1 5x5 high intensity/high volume workout a week, 1 low intensity/low volume and then 1 high intensity/low volume workout. Its an intermediate workout populised by Glen Pendlay.
> 
> I used to think you shouldnt work a muscle more than once per week but now Im starting to learn that it all depends on the intensity/volume of your workout. If you keep the overall intensity/volume low then you can workout more often, if you kill yourself in the gym then your body needs longer to recover so its finding a balance of this. You want to keep the intensity/volume as high as possible to force adaption as fast as possible but you want it low enough so you dont overtrain.


Thanks for all the extra info James :thumb:

Checking out Eric Cressey Maximum Stregth 2 Warm Ups now mate :thumb:

Im going to stick with the basic 5X5 with the changes already mentioned & see how it goes over the next 8 week phase. :thumb:

Now I know what a Pendlay Row is :thumb: I basically do a bent over barbell row, might change to pendlay's in the future, like the idea of stopping the weight after each rep.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks for all the extra info James :thumb:
> 
> Checking out Eric Cressey Maximum Stregth 2 Warm Ups now mate :thumb:
> 
> Im going to stick with the basic 5X5 with the changes already mentioned & see how it goes over the next 8 week phase. :thumb:
> 
> Now I know what a Pendlay Row is :thumb: I basically do a bent over barbell row, might change to pendlay's in the future, like the idea of stopping the weight after each rep.


Sorry mate, went on abit with that last post.

Only you know your body so I think if your doing your research and looking at your workout properly then theres no wrong way of doing a woorkout really. Your doing only compound movements so you won half the battle there I think.

I only started doing Pendlay Rows a few months ago and had to lower my Row Weight quite abit and it hit my back really well but now they dont feel as good so the change was good but I think it may be time for a change to normal Rows. Its good to change exercises once in a while but I like keeping the move very similar. Bent Over Rows for Pendlay Rows, Bench Press for Incline Press, Etc.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Sorry mate, went on abit with that last post.
> 
> Only you know your body so I think if your doing your research and looking at your workout properly then theres no wrong way of doing a woorkout really. Your doing only compound movements so you won half the battle there I think.
> 
> I only started doing Pendlay Rows a few months ago and had to lower my Row Weight quite abit and it hit my back really well but now they dont feel as good so the change was good but I think it may be time for a change to normal Rows. Its good to change exercises once in a while but I like keeping the move very similar. Bent Over Rows for Pendlay Rows, Bench Press for Incline Press, Etc.


No not at all mate, always good to hear other opinions :thumb:

Always loved compound barbell exercises, they feel right if you know what i mean. I would love to get my Bent over rows to 100KG, then change to Pendlays & see how they feel too :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## MarkH

Buddy no stretching before a workout only after, unless your inflexibility is restricting your workout, it has a tendency to cause injury in power movements and also relaxes the muscle too much, making you weaker!


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Buddy no stretching before a workout only after, unless your inflexibility is restricting your workout, it has a tendency to cause injury in power movements and also relaxes the muscle too much, making you weaker!


Didn't know this Mark, thanks for the update, however after the stretching I'm doing a full warm up, does this still put me at risk?

*Today's 5X5

Bench Press: 97.5KG/214.5LB 5X5 :thumb: Woohooo!!!! :thumb:

Squat: 140KG/308LB 3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Rows: 95KG/209LB 5X5 :thumb: *

Have changed Bent over rows to barbell rows (slightly more upright position), but keeping good form, as the horizontal position was becoming difficult to keep & my back was a little sore for a few days after.

*I'm struggling to squat when I wear the belt, any reason why guys? It feels like I've lost flexibility & this seems to be restricting my movement/feels unsafe, tried with & without & the 140KG felt a lot easier without. The whole lift feels wrong with it on. Can you safely lift for reps without a belt up to around 480LB?*

I'm doing more warm ups & on tonight's bench I did a pre lift of 97.5Kg X 3 then the full 5X5, am I right in assuming the heavier the weights get the more important warming up is not just for safety but also to enable you to achieve the weight/reps goals? This first became apparent on the overhead press a few weeks ago.

Anyhow next bench session is with 100KG/220LB, really pleased, I did want to achieve this before 2012 so only a week out, down to me being a lame git & not training as much over the Christmas break


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 120kg 1 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 52.5kg 5,5,4
Deadlifts: S**T

I deloaded my squats as Im not making any progress but even the 120kg felt heavy. All I can think of why the gym is feeling so crap the last few weeks is that Im not eating enough. Squats are also killing my bad shoulder, its hurting so much that the pain runs all the way down my bicep and I actually have trouble closing my hand. I been told by a few doctors/surgeons that my shoulder will never be any good without surgury but its just annoying that my shoulder has felt great for weeks and when ever I get around this weight it starts playing up.

Shoulder press was crap also as my shoulder hurt so much.

Deadlift. I was planing on workout up to last workouts weight but my bicep felt like it was going to rip so I called it a day.

I think it must be time for a workout change as when i first began this workout I was progressing nice and fast, I felt great and was getting bigger and stronger. Now my shoulder is shagged and I seem to be getting weaker which I dont get.

Whats doing my head in is that I have always progressed on 5x5 really well, I gain strength and size and really harden up but I cant keep it up for very long as I over train. I need to find a middle ground workout so after the 1 x 5 for squats I will be moving to Madcow where you only squat twice per week and only have one hard set per workout. Im going to try this and then try The Texas Method as this keeps the 5x5 once per week


----------



## Bod42

I find a squat belt very restrictive and cant squat properly in one. Have you tried Dave Tates advice, instead of wearing the belt really tight, leave it 1 notch loose and fill your diaphram with air and push your belly into the belt until it is tight. This should really tighen up your core.

With regards to stretching before working out I think mobility exercises like Eric Cressey and Joe Defranco advise but do not do static flexibility strectches as this weakens your muscles which is not what you want to do before a workout. I consider flexibility stretches holding a stretch for 30secs + and really pushing the stretch, different from just warming up


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: 120kg 1 x 5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 52.5kg 5,5,4
> Deadlifts: S**T
> 
> I deloaded my squats as Im not making any progress but even the 120kg felt heavy. All I can think of why the gym is feeling so crap the last few weeks is that Im not eating enough. Squats are also killing my bad shoulder, its hurting so much that the pain runs all the way down my bicep and I actually have trouble closing my hand. I been told by a few doctors/surgeons that my
> shoulder will never be any good without surgury but its just annoying that my shoulder has felt great for weeks and when ever I get around this weight it starts playing up.
> 
> Shoulder press was crap also as my shoulder hurt so much.
> 
> Deadlift. I was planing on workout up to last workouts weight but my bicep felt like it was going to rip so I called it a day.
> 
> I think it must be time for a workout change as when i first began this workout I was progressing nice and fast, I felt great and was getting bigger and stronger. Now my shoulder is shagged and I seem to be getting weaker which I dont get.
> 
> Whats doing my head in is that I have always progressed on 5x5 really well, I gain strength and size and really harden up but I cant keep it up for very long as I over train. I need to find a middle ground workout so after the 1 x 5 for squats I will be moving to Madcow where you only squat twice per week and only have one hard set per workout. Im going to try this and then try The Texas Method as this keeps the 5x5 once per week


My left shoulder is a bit painful from a injury I woke up with two years ago :doublesho, wasn't doing any weights at the time either, have no idea were it came from, makes over head presses painful & stops me lifting heavy sometimes, I'm changing to my version of upright rows for the next 8 week phase & see how they feel.

Do you take a week off every 8 weeks Bod? I find it helps a lot :devil: :thumb:

I have now reduced squats to 3 sets per session otherwise my legs will get too big, I might put deadlifts up to two sets per session as I find they really hit the whole body not just legs & are great for upper body power.

Also, I stopped squatting 3 times a week a few weeks ago & it made a huge difference to how I felt during my non training hours. I don't eat much either, as long as my strength keeps improving I see no need to BULK UP, I don't want to be a mahoosive beast.

My next 8 week phase (two week cycle).

*Week 1

TUESDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ 
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

THURSDAY

DEADLIFT KG ____ _____
PULL-UP (P/S/N) KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
UPRIGHT ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

SATURDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ 
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

Week 2

TUESDAY

DEADLIFT KG ____ _____
PULL-UP (P/S/N) KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
UPRIGHT ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

THURSDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ 
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

SATURDAY

DEADLIFT KG ____
PULL-UP (P/S/N) KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
UPRIGHT ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____*

Note:: the PULL-UP (P/S/N) = Positive/static/negative reps, once I reach positive failure on each set i will then complete the 5 reps with a static hold followed by a negative rep :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I find a squat belt very restrictive and cant squat properly in one. Have you tried Dave Tates advice, instead of wearing the belt really tight, leave it 1 notch loose and fill your diaphram with air and push your belly into the belt until it is tight. This should really tighen up your core.
> 
> With regards to stretching before working out I think mobility exercises like Eric Cressey and Joe Defranco advise but do not do static flexibility strectches as this weakens your muscles which is not what you want to do before a workout. I consider flexibility stretches holding a stretch for 30secs + and really pushing the stretch, different from just warming up


Already tried wearing loose, still not good 

Will cut some extra holes in it & make even looser & try again


----------



## sidewalkdances

Are you wearing it too low? 

I'm enjoying a nice day off from training today, did my squat opener on Monday - 190kg. Planned attempts are 190/230/240

Missed a 145kg bench attempt on Saturday. Just flat out wasn't strong enough! Lol, missed the weight off my chest. I've added some extra's in on my weak point day to try and combat this. 

Deads tomorrow, up to my last warm up of around 210 (Opener will be 230) - need to dominate it. Then its up to my second attempt off blocks (242.5kg). 

All go now for the comp!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Are you wearing it too low?
> 
> I'm enjoying a nice day off from training today, did my squat opener on Monday - 190kg. Planned attempts are 190/230/240 :devil::devil:
> 
> Missed a 145kg bench attempt on Saturday. Just flat out wasn't strong enough! Lol, missed the weight off my chest. I've added some extra's in on my weak point day to try and combat this.
> 
> Deads tomorrow, up to my last warm up of around 210 (Opener will be 230) - need to dominate it. Then its up to my second attempt off blocks (242.5kg). :devil::devil:
> 
> All go now for the comp!


Possibly, I'm wearing it so it just sits on top of my pelvic bone, I don't have it tight at all  Just feels all wrong when i use it & lifting without feels good. I think I need to persevere with it.

My belt http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004XJOV...ve=22134&creativeASIN=B004XJOVVS&linkCode=asn

Do you think i need something wider at the front?

Best of luck with your lifts & your competition mate :thumb::thumb:, let us all know how you got on :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Are you wearing it too low?
> 
> I'm enjoying a nice day off from training today, did my squat opener on Monday - 190kg. Planned attempts are 190/230/240
> 
> Missed a 145kg bench attempt on Saturday. Just flat out wasn't strong enough! Lol, missed the weight off my chest. I've added some extra's in on my weak point day to try and combat this.
> 
> Deads tomorrow, up to my last warm up of around 210 (Opener will be 230) - need to dominate it. Then its up to my second attempt off blocks (242.5kg).
> 
> All go now for the comp!


Looking good mate.

Good luck in your comp.

I'm really considering signing up for a comp, i no where near where I want to be strength wise but I'm hoping it will give me something to train for so I smash each workout.


----------



## Bod42

Box Squats: 122.5kg 1 x 5
Bench Press: 95kg 5 x 5
Pendlay Rows: 70kg 3 x 5

I figured out why my shoulder is killing from squats, as per everybody advice on Elitefts I am driving my elbows down while squatting to help keep my chest up. With the amount of mobility I have in my shoulder I can not do this so I'm squatting as per Mark Rippletoe and pinching the elbows together behind. This makes the shelve I put the bar on more tense which in turn doesnt put so much downwards pressure on my arms which in turn pulls my shoulder.

This workout was better but 1 set of squat at a deload weight was still hard. This is what I love/hate about weight lifting. I hit 127.5kg for 5 x 5 a few months ago and now Im struggling with 122.5kg for 1 x 5. Doesnt make sense. When I started Stronglift I seemed to grow really fast, got really hard and my legs got alot bigger and harder. Now I feel the same as when I wasnt training. I'm getting weaker and seem to be shrinking.

Thanks for the advice Doug, I'm defiantly going to lower the amount I squat per week. I'm changing to Madcow which is 5 x 5 but its ramping sets so the volume above 90% of 1RM isnt as high as you start at 50% and work your way up. I'm doing this workout instead of Texas Method as with that workout you do 5x5 straight sets so the workout takes like an hour and a half on a Monday. I also like the look of Madcow as the warmups are structured and some times I dont think I warm up enough.

I probably change to Texas Method after Madcow as it will bring the volume back up and be more of a shock to my Body.

I also added a rotary cuff triset at the end of Bench & Row day to hopefully help my shoulders


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Box Squats: 122.5kg 1 x 5
> Bench Press: 95kg 5 x 5
> Pendlay Rows: 70kg 3 x 5
> 
> I figured out why my shoulder is killing from squats, as per everybody advice on Elitefts I am driving my elbows down while squatting to help keep my chest up. With the amount of mobility I have in my shoulder I can not do this so I'm squatting as per Mark Rippletoe and pinching the elbows together behind. This makes the shelve I put the bar on more tense which in turn doesnt put so much downwards pressure on my arms which in turn pulls my shoulder.
> 
> This workout was better but 1 set of squat at a deload weight was still hard. This is what I love/hate about weight lifting. I hit 127.5kg for 5 x 5 a few months ago and now Im struggling with 122.5kg for 1 x 5. Doesnt make sense. When I started Stronglift I seemed to grow really fast, got really hard and my legs got alot bigger and harder. Now I feel the same as when I wasnt training. I'm getting weaker and seem to be shrinking.
> 
> Thanks for the advice Doug, I'm defiantly going to lower the amount I squat per week. I'm changing to Madcow which is 5 x 5 but its ramping sets so the volume above 90% of 1RM isnt as high as you start at 50% and work your way up. I'm doing this workout instead of Texas Method as with that workout you do 5x5 straight sets so the workout takes like an hour and a half on a Monday. I also like the look of Madcow as the warmups are structured and some times I dont think I warm up enough.
> 
> I probably change to Texas Method after Madcow as it will bring the volume back up and be more of a shock to my Body.
> 
> I also added a rotary cuff triset at the end of Bench & Row day to hopefully help my shoulders


 I've had sticking points like this in the past. Every time I move up 2.5KG I forget about making 5 reps & concentrate on achieving as many reps as possible on each set, I would only take the 2.5KG off if I couldn't reach at least 1 rep in each set after at least trying for two sessions on any barbell exercise.

My overhead press went a bit slow when I went up to 60KG, so I just kept going at reaching as many reps in each set until I reached my 5X5. I think my Bench had the same problem.

I look at it this way; I'm training for strength only. If I add 2.5KG to a lift but only achieve say 3,2,1,1,1 I'm still able to lift it so I then work on adding reps until I reach 5X5, then add more weight :thumb:

The pull ups are a good example of adding even more flexibility into an exercise to attain a goal, when I do 5 sets this week it will look something like this 1,1,0,0,0, I will then do statics & negatives until I can perform 5 positive reps on each set until I get a full 5X5, then I will start to add weight to my bodyweight. 
Strength is an unnatural state for the body so you do need to force it any way you can to grow stronger :thumb:

The only enemy in weight training is yourself, both your body & mind will conspire to put you off  :thumb: I think the level of discipline required to lift heavy is good for the character :thumb:

You gotta hate those weights!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Possibly, I'm wearing it so it just sits on top of my pelvic bone, I don't have it tight at all  Just feels all wrong when i use it & lifting without feels good. I think I need to persevere with it.
> 
> My belt http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004XJOV...ve=22134&creativeASIN=B004XJOVVS&linkCode=asn
> 
> Do you think i need something wider at the front?
> 
> Best of luck with your lifts & your competition mate :thumb::thumb:, let us all know how you got on :thumb:


Should be higher than that by the sounds of things. More around your belly than sat on the pelvic bone - plus that belt looks awful! You want something the same width all the way round. Mine sits about 2" above my pelvis, sort of around my belly button. The only people I know who wear a belt low like that are powerlifters with huge bellies, whilst wearing squat suits as they use the belt to 'stop' them in the hole when squatting. This is a pretty advanced technique, and one that 99.9% of people dont need to worry about


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Should be higher than that by the sounds of things. More around your belly than sat on the pelvic bone - plus that belt looks awful! You want something the same width all the way round. Mine sits about 2" above my pelvis, sort of around my belly button. The only people I know who wear a belt low like that are powerlifters with huge bellies, whilst wearing squat suits as they use the belt to 'stop' them in the hole when squatting. This is a pretty advanced technique, and one that 99.9% of people dont need to worry about


*Now that sounds like a plan, could you recommend a fuller belt for me please mate :thumb: *

Odd you say it should be around the belly area as when I lift it feels like the belt is forcing everything up & it's a bit uncomfortable.

Just tried it on your way & squatting down is far easier, I feel much more flexible, thanks for the advice Sidewalk :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Titan Toro Lever belt is the one I use


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Titan Toro Lever belt is the one I use


Thanks..... for spending my money for me , the missus will go spare....again :lol:

I need a belt like this in my life :argie: 

Out of stock 

How about these?

http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/accessories/powerlifting-belts/ocelot-vcl-lifting-belt/prod_26.html

http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/accessories/powerlifting-belts/ocelot-vlp-lifting-belt/prod_25.html

http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...ather-training-powerlifting-belt/prod_20.html


----------



## sidewalkdances

I wouldn't touch any of those :lol: - buy nice, don't buy twice.

http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...m-suede-lever-powerlifting-belt/prod_679.html

Thats a nice one.

Or get that one

http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-2-powerlifting-belt--jet-black-28-p.asp - they run out of stock quickly, but they are very good belts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I wouldn't touch any of those :lol: - buy nice, don't buy twice.
> 
> http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...m-suede-lever-powerlifting-belt/prod_679.html
> 
> Thats a nice one.
> 
> Or get that one
> 
> http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-2-powerlifting-belt--jet-black-28-p.asp - they run out of stock quickly, but they are very good belts.


:lol::lol::lol:

Will order one of these tonight, thanks for your help mate :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> Didn't know this Mark, thanks for the update, however after the stretching I'm doing a full warm up, does this still put me at risk?


The stretches will make you more prone to injury irrelevant of the warm up, also they will reduce the amount of power you can produce.

The only way to stretch before a power/strength workout is dynamic stretches or just hold the stretch iirc for less than four seconds.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> The stretches will make you more prone to injury irrelevant of the warm up, also they will reduce the amount of power you can produce.
> 
> The only way to stretch before a power/strength workout is dynamic stretches or just hold the stretch iirc for less than four seconds.


Cheers Mark, I'll only hold stretchtes a few seconds :thumb:. Dont want to lose what little power i have 

Got deadlifts,pull-ups & Upright rows tonight :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays 5X5

*Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 1X3 ¾,* weight felt easy to lift but my grip started to give on rep 4 

*Deadlift 140KG/308LB 1 rep then held for 8 seconds*, I will increase the time hoping this will improve my grip strength.

*Pull-Ups: Body weight 1/4, 1/4, 1/4*. (Key= Positive reps/ Negative reps)

*Upright row: 30KG/66LB 5X5* felt too light but wanted to do first few sessions getting a feel for the movement again.

Overall ok workout, really annoyed my grip won't let me workout what is a reasonably easy weight to lift.

Grip was fried after the deadlifts so did only 3 sets of positive & negative pull-ups, I will increase the sets up to 5 over the next few weeks.


----------



## Bod42

Squats 125kg 1 x 5
Shoulder Press 52.5kg 3 x 5
Deadlift 145kg 1 x 5
Pull Ups 6 x 4 / 4 x 3

1 x 5 squats is easy as its very easy mentally to push just 1 set but I'm wondering if there is enough volume in this workout as I'm only actually doing 5 sets for the entire workout which seems really low but I suppose if I actually workout 3 times a week instead of the 2 times I have been then I'm hitting each lift more often. I'm pushing the 1 x 5 squats as far as possible but as soon as I have to deload again I'm going to have a week off and change to Madcow

Shoulder was alot better today not forcing my elbows down and forward.

Deadlifts went really well considering the last few weeks.


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> Fridays 5X5
> 
> *Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 1X3 ¾,* weight felt easy to lift but my grip started to give on rep 4
> 
> *Deadlift 140KG/308LB  1 rep then held for 8 seconds*, I will increase the time hoping this will improve my grip strength.
> 
> *Pull-Ups: Body weight 1/4, 1/4, 1/4*. (Key= Positive reps/ Negative reps)
> 
> *Upright row: 30KG/66LB 5X5* felt too light but wanted to do first few sessions getting a feel for the movement again.
> 
> Overall ok workout, really annoyed my grip won't let me workout what is a reasonably easy weight to lift.
> 
> Grip was fried after the deadlifts so did only 3 sets of positive & negative pull-ups, I will increase the sets up to 5 over the next few weeks.


This may sound like a silly question but how are you gripping the bar?

Most people naturally grip the bar with their fingers underneath pointing down, but your knuckles should be under the bar pointing down.


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> This may sound like a silly question but how are you gripping the bar?
> 
> Most people naturally grip the bar with their fingers underneath pointing down, but your knuckles should be under the bar pointing down.


I'm gripping with fingers pointing down, never thought to do knuckles under the bar pointing down, just went into the room & tried the new grip, feels really weird, will try it out next workout (Tuesday) as its deadlift day :thumb:

If this works Mark I bloody owe you one mate :thumb:

Sundays 5X5 (second 8 week phase).
After doing pull-ups, positive & negative reps my back is friiiied & I've got a bit of dom's so I felt I would leave out the rows.

Bench Press: 100KG/220LB 3,3,3,3,3 
Squat: 142.5KG/313.5LB 5,5,5.

Trained this after noon 12.30 ish, everything felt heavy, especially the squats, but seemed to be more of a lack of energy issue, due to training at a different time than normal.


----------



## Bod42

MarkH said:


> This may sound like a silly question but how are you gripping the bar?
> 
> Most people naturally grip the bar with their fingers underneath pointing down, but your knuckles should be under the bar pointing down.


Is there a reason for this Mark, does it put the bar more in the palm of your hand or something?


----------



## MarkH

Bod42 said:


> Is there a reason for this Mark, does it put the bar more in the palm of your hand or something?


You making your hand more biomechanically efficient as your removing a fulcrum out of the equation.

If the weight is further along the finger joints the greater the load on the forearm muscles.


----------



## ITHAQVA

As of yesterday I have started to incorporate aerobic activity to help with overall fitness & hopefully a little body fat reduction.

I have started with 20 minutes on the air walker & will work up to 30 minutes 3 times a week, after approximately a month I will then work up to 30 minutes 5 times a week :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'm having a lovely light week this week, feel very burned out. Ideally I wouldnt have one so close to a comp, as i'll be deloading the week before anyway, but i'm spinning my wheels so it should do me some good. I feel a bit better already. Going too hard for too long can be bad.

My squat training last night

Squat 3 sets of 5 - 80kg 
Standing Ab Crunch - Average Bands x15 x3
Leg Extentions - some weight x 15 x 3 

I also did some knee wrapping for my training partner who took his opening attempt for a double and did some accessory work. 

Only 7lbs to lose now before comp day!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I'm having a lovely light week this week, feel very burned out. Ideally I wouldnt have one so close to a comp, as i'll be deloading the week before anyway, but i'm spinning my wheels so it should do me some good. I feel a bit better already. Going too hard for too long can be bad.
> 
> My squat training last night
> 
> Squat 3 sets of 5 - 80kg
> Standing Ab Crunch - Average Bands x15 x3
> Leg Extentions - some weight x 15 x 3
> 
> I also did some knee wrapping for my training partner who took his opening attempt for a double and did some accessory work.
> 
> Only 7lbs to lose now before comp day!


Hi Sidewalk,

What weights for my main lifts (Squat,Deadlift & bench) should i get to before i consider moving from the 5X5 to a workout with a light routine in it?

I could do with losing some poundage too mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

It's up to you really mate, if your recovering well then there is no need to take the time off. I've gone about 16 weeks heavy every week. It's really starting to show now though. Just hoping that some rest will do me some good. The only exception is i'm still going to push two of my assistance exercises hard tonight as they have the ability to make my bench recover a bit.

The alternative, is to do a program like Wendler's 5/3/1 - the ebook is gold btw - that has a built in deload every 4th week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday 5X5

Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 3 Utter !!!!, grip gave out again, kept eye on grip but as I started the third rep my hand just started to open up & loose grip 

Pull-ups 2/3, 1¾/3, 1½/3. Better :thumb:

Upright Rows: 40KG/88LB 5,5,5,5,5 :thumb:

20 minutes on air walker approx. 1500 plus reps.

The old man will sleep well tonight 

Deadlift is really becoming disappointing, the weight feels easy to lift now, but grip is a complete fail. I will keep at it :thumb:

Cheers sidewalk for the heads-up on the wendler 5/3/1, got a pdf of it now, will read over the next few days :thumb: 

Guys, if there are any ways to improve my grip that you know of please let me know, i want that 500LB deadlift :devil:

Just to add, my grip began to fail as soon as i started to use the Olympic bar as its thicker, my old standard bar was 1" diameter, what is the standard diameter of an Olympic bar? I’m asking as my Olympic set was pretty cheap & i was wondering if they use a thicker bar.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 3 Utter !!!!, grip gave out again, kept eye on grip but as I started the third rep my hand just started to open up & loose grip


Are you using chalk? What grip style are you using? I found chalk and using alternate grip allowed me to get 135kg a few months ago (can't do that now :lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Are you using chalk? What grip style are you using? I found chalk and using alternate grip allowed me to get 135kg a few months ago (can't do that now :lol.


Loads of chalk & overhand grip:thumb: I thought using the alternate grip was only to be used for single lifts.

Really annoyed with myself, 140Kg isn't heavy 

I know if my grip was ok i could easily be up to 150/160Kg by now, the actual lifting of the weight is easy, I just need hands of steal! :devil: 

I'm going to get some board to protect the flooring so i can train until i drop the weight for real, the thought of dropping the weight is putting me off to a point, I may have got an extra rep out tonight, possibly.

Although I think i need to be a little patient, after all I've only been doing this powerlifting for 10-12 weeks, plateaus are there to be beaten...to death


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Loads of chalk & overhand grip:thumb: I thought using the alternate grip was only to be used for single lifts.


All the advice I've received/read said move to alternate grip once overhand fails. Just continue with your WU and then WO sets as normal, just using the different grip. If you don't, then you are limiting your DL by your OH grip stength. I understand that you'll find your OH grip strength will increase as the weight on the bar goes up with alternate grip.



ITHAQVA said:


> Really annoyed with myself, 140Kg isn't heavy


Mate, you're a strong chap! I found 135kg an absolute b***ard :lol:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Loads of chalk & overhand grip:thumb: I thought using the alternate grip was only to be used for single lifts.
> 
> Really annoyed with myself, 140Kg isn't heavy
> 
> I know if my grip was ok i could easily be up to 150/160Kg by now, the actual lifting of the weight is easy, I just need hands of steal! :devil:
> 
> I'm going to get some board to protect the flooring so i can train until i drop the weight for real, the thought of dropping the weight is putting me off to a point, I may have got an extra rep out tonight, possibly.
> 
> Although I think i need to be a little patient, after all I've only been doing this powerlifting for 10-12 weeks, plateaus are there to be beaten...to death


In the 5/3/1 Ebook Jim Wendler suggests Kroc Rows for grip strength.

I use an alternate grip on Deadlifts, find it strengthens your grip no end. Overhand grip is harder so do your warm ups with your Overhand grip and then change to Alternate Grip. Some people say the alternate grip puts unequel stress on your body as each side is pulling differently, if you agree with this you can use the hook grip but this hurts like hell. Depends how much you want hat Deadlift


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> All the advice I've received/read said move to alternate grip once overhand fails. Just continue with your WU and then WO sets as normal, just using the different grip. If you don't, then you are limiting your DL by your OH grip stength. I understand that you'll find your OH grip strength will increase as the weight on the bar goes up with alternate grip.
> 
> Mate, you're a strong chap! I found 135kg an absolute b***ard :lol:


Thanks mate, looks like the alternate grip it is, was actually thinking about 
this last night in bed, if I power up my deadlift on the alt… grip then surely as the weight increases my grip strength will follow, amazing how sometimes you miss the obvious,

As for strong, no way, was watching YouTube last night, there are loads of guys lifting 500LB with ease, I will consider myself weak until the 500LB IS MINE!!!! 

You have no idea how frustrating it is knowing a lift is easy to do yet you bloody hands just let go & laugh at you 
Doug.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> In the 5/3/1 Ebook Jim Wendler suggests Kroc Rows for grip strength.
> 
> I use an alternate grip on Deadlifts, find it strengthens your grip no end. Overhand grip is harder so do your warm ups with your Overhand grip and then change to Alternate Grip. Some people say the alternate grip puts unequel stress on your body as each side is pulling differently, if you agree with this you can use the hook grip but this hurts like hell. Depends how much you want hat Deadlift


Just downloaded 5/3/1 last night, it looks really good, like the idea of doing one body part once a week, I used to train like this about 15 years ago, always thought it was wrong, got good results then. I should have just kept up with it.

Will look up Kroc rows :thumb:

My body has to learn, im boss!!!!!


----------



## MarkH

All the Plifters I knew/know just do alternate grip the majority of the time if you are worried about unequal development just swap grip for while during the start of the season.

Just found out a got a job in weightlfiting for the Olympics, woohoo ))


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> As for strong, no way, was watching YouTube last night, there are loads of guys lifting 500LB with ease, I will consider myself weak until the 500LB IS MINE!!!!


A 500lb is a great target to aim for :thumb:. 
I actually like the 1/2/3/4/5 which often gets mentioned as a longer term goal. It won't be happening this year for me though  That is:
+100lbs Weighted Chins/Dips
200lb OHP
300lb Bench
400lb Squat
500lb Deadlift


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> All the Plifters I knew/know just do alternate grip the majority of the time if you are worried about unequal development just swap grip for while during the start of the season.
> 
> Just found out a got a job in weightlfiting for the Olympics, woohoo ))


Thanks Mark, I think it's pretty much the general consensus. Time for me to start the alternate grip :thumb: 

Well done on the job Mark, good on you :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Guest

MarkH said:


> Just found out a got a job in weightlfiting for the Olympics, woohoo ))


Congrats! What's it doing? I reckon it will be really interesting to be involved :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I hope you paid for the 5/3/1 book!!! :lol:

I've always used alternate grip for the deadlift (apart from a couple of months where I used straps :wall: )

I'm itching to get back to proper training. All this resting and cardio is driving me crazy!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I hope you paid for the 5/3/1 book!!! :lol: :lol::lol:
> 
> I've always used alternate grip for the deadlift (apart from a couple of months where I used straps :wall: )
> 
> I'm itching to get back to proper training. All this resting and cardio is driving me crazy!


Alternate grip for me next session guys :thumb::thumb:

STRAPS!!!!!!!!! :doublesho Dan, its time to get into your sparkling pink spandex catsuite & do 100 reps.....dry humping! :doublesho 

Im stuck on cardio until my bodyfat decresses, this could be measured in years


----------



## sidewalkdances

In my defence I didnt know any better and I wasn't training for powerlifting (I was just 'losing weight' - I went from 24st at my heaviest to 12st 12 at my lowest!) - I ditched the straps quite quickly. I still use them from time to time for things like shrugs if my grip is giving me jip! 

I've already done my cardio today, so I'm going to be well bored tonight!


----------



## ITHAQVA

This thread has had nearly 6000 views :doublesho :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

Box Squat 127.5kg 1 x 5
Bench Press 97.5kg 5 x 5
Pendlay Rows 72.5kg 3 x 5

Quite an easy workout as I deloaded 2 of the execises. Weird though as everything felt really nice to lift, I could feel the muscle really working and today I am quite sore. Maybe grinding the weight out every weight isnt the best way, maybe should do it more like Jim Wendler suggests and always stop 1-2 reps shy or failure by being honest wheres the fun in that lol.

Doug: I also brought the new 2nd Edition of 5/3/1 and thats what I'm planning on moving to after I done Madcow/Texas Method. I read countless views of it where people have made gains. I actually have my Mrs on it at present. I really like it due to the amount you can customise the assiatnt works, you can do a cutting, power strength size workout, anything really but keep the 1st movement of the day so you keep your strength. I decided I'm going to smash the 1st exercise and then have short rest periods on the Assistant Exercises so I can can a little body fat and grow a little bigger


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> This thread has had nearly 6000 views :doublesho :doublesho


The starters of this thread will be famous soon. :lol:

Its obviously popular as it pops up on the first page of google now, result.

Miles behind the 56,000 on the Today Workout thread. Thats impressive


----------



## Alex L

It's probably been mentioned but I can't be bothered to go through 30+ pages, but when you get to a weight and can't go high do you drop back down and start again or change up completely?

I've got 8 weeks in Madcows 5x5 Intermediate and managed to add 20 
kg to all lifts (D/lift is up 30kg). and have been stuck at 20 for the last 3 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Box Squat 127.5kg 1 x 5
> Bench Press 97.5kg 5 x 5
> Pendlay Rows 72.5kg 3 x 5
> 
> Quite an easy workout as I deloaded 2 of the execises. Weird though as everything felt really nice to lift, I could feel the muscle really working and today I am quite sore. Maybe grinding the weight out every weight isnt the best way, maybe should do it more like Jim Wendler suggests and always stop 1-2 reps shy or failure by being honest wheres the fun in that lol.
> 
> Doug: I also brought the new 2nd Edition of 5/3/1 and thats what I'm
> planning on moving to after I done Madcow/Texas Method. I read countless views of it where people have made gains. I actually have my Mrs on it at present. I really like it due to the amount you can customise the assiatnt works, you can do a cutting, power strength size workout, anything really but keep the 1st movement of the day so you keep your strength. I decided I'm going to smash the 1st exercise and then have short rest periods on the Assistant Exercises so I can can a little body fat and grow a little bigger


I've briefly gone through the 5/3/1
I think ill stick to the 5X5 for now as it's only my deadlift grip at present that's my weakest point. I like the idea of training each area/compund exercise once a week, but i think that will have to wait until my weights are much heavier/respectable :thumb:

Reducing my squats to 3X5 one week & twice 3X5 the next has made a massive difference overall :thumb:

I Do like wendlers attitude, think I would go for page 49 Assistance Work #3: I'm Not Doing Jack S**T! 

Will read the 5/3/1 in depth over next week.


----------



## sidewalkdances

I used 5/3/1 to cut significant body weight before with a couple of mods that are worth using.

1) Started pretty light - for lifts I didnt have a raw max for, I leant on the cautious side.
2) Didnt go up in weight each cycle - the body weight drop was enough of a change
3) Picked 2 exercises for assistance and stuck too them in a superset.
-Lower was Leg Press and Glute Ham Raises
-Upper was Dips and either Chins (MP day) or Rows (Bench Day)
4) Really pushed the main lift hard and was breaking rep PR's well into Week 10 of my diet (By this time I was doing about an hour of cardio a day, and my food intake had dropped)

Its a good program.

I'm very bored with this deload week now!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> (By this time I was doing about an hour of cardio a day, and my food intake had dropped)


I was afraid of going over 30 mins cardio a day.

Do you find doing an hour cardio a day effects your strenght gains?

How long before your comp?


----------



## sidewalkdances

When I was dieting I didnt care about gaining strength, I just wanted to get leaner. Same as when I did Men's Health - I tolerated a strength loss to get really lean. Second time round was much better, I was hungry all the time and cardio is boring, but I got lean (the guy who did my diet reckoned I was sub 8% bodyfat - I still had a 180kg raw squat @ 82kg - better coefficient than I have now :lol: and about a 120 bench and a 225 deadlift). Bear in mind I was just working two, very low responsibility jobs as it was for the most part my uni summer hols, it was easy to dedicate my life entirely to diet and training. 

16 days till the meet. Not sure how my last 2 weeks are going to go though, see what Brian has planned for me I guess.


----------



## Guest

Alex L said:


> It's probably been mentioned but I can't be bothered to go through 30+ pages, but when you get to a weight and can't go high do you drop back down and start again or change up completely?
> 
> I've got 8 weeks in Madcows 5x5 Intermediate and managed to add 20
> kg to all lifts (D/lift is up 30kg). and have been stuck at 20 for the last 3 weeks.


Unfortunately, I can't give you the benefit of my experience as I have never run Madcow, however on a quick read through the program I found this statement:


> When the majority of the lifts are stalling, reset the whole program and build back up to PRs over 4 weeks


I would guess that means using your current lifts as your new PR values.

The full description of Madcow can be found here: http://madcow.wackyhq.com/geocities/5x5_Program/Linear_5x5.htm

It might be worth signing up at ironstrong.org. It's a very friendly forum and there are plenty of experienced lifters who will be more than happy to assist you.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursday’s powerlifting.

Bench Press: 100KG/220LB 5,4,4,4,4 :thumb:

Squat: 145KG/319LB 5, 5,5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 95KG/209LB 5,5,5,5,5 :thumb:

20 minutes on the air walker.

Went in the room feeling tired, but it all went well, Bench press didn’t feel heavy at all. Squat felt dam heavy. I worked for every rep :devil:. Barbell row, I’m staying on 95KG/209LB for a while.

I’ve been watching Mark Ripptoe’s seminars today, adjusted my squat stance & even though the weight felt heavy it was far more comfortable to lift.
If my shoulder recovers enough I will start my overhead press from scratch, my form was all wrong.


----------



## Bod42

Alex L said:


> It's probably been mentioned but I can't be bothered to go through 30+ pages, but when you get to a weight and can't go high do you drop back down and start again or change up completely?
> 
> I've got 8 weeks in Madcows 5x5 Intermediate and managed to add 20
> kg to all lifts (D/lift is up 30kg). and have been stuck at 20 for the last 3 weeks.


Thats good gains Alex, I remember you were on Stronglift, how do you find Madcow compared with Stronglift as I'm thinking of moving to that program very soon.

Anyway in answer to your question, Madcow suggests that you deload by 10% once you tried to hit your 5 reps and failed for 3 weeks in a row. This way you dominate the weight, get some confidents and gives you a rest, you shouldnt loose anything by doing lighter weights as your still putting 100% force into your exercises.

I actually deload by15-20% for a few reasons. Madcow and stronglift do not have weeks off or deload weeks you just keep going until you stall which can wreck your CNS so by lowering the weight by 20% it gives your body a break. To be fair this is probably more useful on Stronglift as your Squats increase by 7.5kg per week so in a few weeks your be back to your weight but on Madcow its only weekly progression so it will take quite a while to get back up. Also it allows me to work on my bar speed for a few weeks which will in turn help my strength/power.

Its the 3 steps backwards, 5 steps forward thinking.

BareFacedGeek is also correct above it says to deload and to work back to your weight over 4 weeks just like when you start the program. Thing is it doesnt really state how to delaod so you can either do 4 weeks worth of increases as in 10kg (2.5kg PW) on Upper Body and 20kg (5kg PW) on Lower body or do a percentage like 10-20% and work back up over the 4 weeks. I think 10 or 20kg is better for beginner/weaker people and percentage deloads are better for experienced/Stronger people.

Alex I have a Madcow spreadhseet if you want, just bang your weight in the yellow box in week 4 and it 'should' calculate every weight in every workout for you


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I've briefly gone through the 5/3/1
> I think ill stick to the 5X5 for now as it's only my deadlift grip at present that's my weakest point. I like the idea of training each area/compund exercise once a week, but i think that will have to wait until my weights are much heavier/respectable :thumb:
> 
> Reducing my squats to 3X5 one week & twice 3X5 the next has made a massive difference overall :thumb:
> 
> I Do like wendlers attitude, think I would go for page 49 Assistance Work #3: I'm Not Doing Jack S**T!
> 
> Will read the 5/3/1 in depth over next week.


I defiently stick with 5x5 for now as it has each workout increases, then you can go to weekly increases and then 5/3/1 is monthly increases. If your goal is strength, your going to get alot stronger increasing every workout than every month but only at te beginning. Yes beginners can run 5/3/1 and get constant gains but it take alot longer.

Doug: There is no set amount of cardio, some people can handle alot some people cant. If you want lean out, I would start at 20 mins 3 times a week and then start increasing duration and times per week until you stop getting stronger then drop one of the cardio workouts and this should keep you progressing on both strength and cardio. I used to suggest HIT cardio to everyone as I think it is better at getting you fit and loosing bodyweight BUT now days I realise fitness is a balancing act, are you squats going to suffer more if you lightly jog 3 times per week or sprint 3 times a week? HIT is better but it impacts your recovery.

Ya Jim's attitude is really good, I'm glad someone in the lime light has come along and highlighted that you dont have to workout for 2-3 hours to be seriously strong. I used to get slated at one of my first gym's for not putting in the effort as I used to arrive after everyone and leave before everyone, 3 hour workouts 5 days per week, I got a life lol

Sidewalkdance: Mens health, have you been in there or something?
5/3/1 must work pretty well if you increased your raw strength while dieting as thats unheard of really. Why do you not run 5/3/1 now


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug: There is no set amount of cardio, some people can handle alot some people cant. If you want lean out, I would start at 20 mins 3 times a week and then start increasing duration and times per week until you stop getting stronger then drop one of the cardio workouts and this should keep you progressing on both strength and cardio. I used to suggest HIT cardio to everyone as I think it is better at getting you fit and loosing bodyweight BUT now days I realise fitness is a balancing act, are you squats going to suffer more if you lightly jog 3 times per week or sprint 3 times a week? HIT is better but it impacts your recovery.


Will stick to 20 minute sessions 3-4 times a week & see how I go :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> Sidewalkdance: Mens health, have you been in there or something?
> 5/3/1 must work pretty well if you increased your raw strength while dieting as thats unheard of really. Why do you not run 5/3/1 now


Yes, I was in the Feb 2010 issue.

I would say it more maintained my raw strength whilst dieting. My rep maxes went up, but I didn't test my 1RMs really.

5/3/1 is harder to set up for geared powerlifting (I do have the 5/3/1 for Powerlifting book - its geared more at competition lifters) and i've had good results with other training methods. I'll probably go back to it at some point and if I wasn't competing it'd be my program of choice no doubt.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Better!*

Sunday's Powerlifting

*Deadlift: 140KG/308LB 1X5 :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: 

Pull-Ups: 2/3, 2/3, 1 ¾ / 4 :thumb:

Upright Row: 42.5KG/93.5LB 5,5,5,5,5*

Very happy, deadlift was a success with alternate grip, will move up to 150KG/330LB next week due to all the time I've wasted with my shoddy grip. Thanks for the advice guys! :thumb::thumb:

Pull-up's= slowly improving


----------



## Ryan_W

Guys, after just reading a few pages of this thread, I really think you need to mix it up a bit! I've found a DE (dynamic effort) and ME (maximum effort) weekly split is the best way to do this (apart from training up to a comp).

I've just finished my first DE week of 2012 (thought I was gunna have a heart attack!).

Back on friday went like this:

Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 100kg x 10, 140kg x 10, 180kg x 10

Bent-over Rows - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10, 100kg x 10

Upright Rows - 60kg x 10 x 3

Front-chest Pulldowns - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10

Lat Pulldowns - 60kg x 10 x 3

Then did some flush sets with wide-arm pull-ups...

Basically, lots of reps, perfect form, proper cell volumizing exercises.

Next week the same workout about will be halved in reps, but with bigger weights.

IE; Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 140kg x 5, 180kg x 5, 220kg x 5 x 5

Just my 2p... 



 

Ryan


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ryan_W said:


> Guys, after just reading a few pages of this thread, I really think you need to mix it up a bit! I've found a DE (dynamic effort) and ME (maximum effort) weekly split is the best way to do this (apart from training up to a comp).
> 
> I've just finished my first DE week of 2012 (thought I was gunna have a heart attack!).
> 
> Back on friday went like this:
> 
> Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 100kg x 10, 140kg x 10, 180kg x 10
> 
> Bent-over Rows - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10, 100kg x 10
> 
> Upright Rows - 60kg x 10 x 3
> 
> Front-chest Pulldowns - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10
> 
> Lat Pulldowns - 60kg x 10 x 3
> 
> Then did some flush sets with wide-arm pull-ups...
> 
> Basically, lots of reps, perfect form, proper cell volumizing exercises.
> 
> Next week the same workout about will be halved in reps, but with bigger weights.
> 
> IE; Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 140kg x 5, 180kg x 5, 220kg x 5 x 5
> 
> Just my 2p... 260kg Deadlift - Ryan Wheal - YouTube
> 
> Ryan


Nice one mate, I've only been doing powerlifting for a few months, how do you split the above workouts in the week?

Am i right in assuming the lighter weights at the beggining are the warm up sets?

Doug


----------



## sidewalkdances

Ryan_W said:


> Guys, after just reading a few pages of this thread, I really think you need to mix it up a bit! I've found a DE (dynamic effort) and ME (maximum effort) weekly split is the best way to do this (apart from training up to a comp).
> 
> I've just finished my first DE week of 2012 (thought I was gunna have a heart attack!).
> 
> Back on friday went like this:
> 
> Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 100kg x 10, 140kg x 10, 180kg x 10
> 
> Bent-over Rows - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10, 100kg x 10
> 
> Upright Rows - 60kg x 10 x 3
> 
> Front-chest Pulldowns - 70kg x 10, 80kg x 10, 90kg x 10
> 
> Lat Pulldowns - 60kg x 10 x 3
> 
> Then did some flush sets with wide-arm pull-ups...
> 
> Basically, lots of reps, perfect form, proper cell volumizing exercises.
> 
> Next week the same workout about will be halved in reps, but with bigger weights.
> 
> IE; Deadlift - 60kg x 10, 140kg x 5, 180kg x 5, 220kg x 5 x 5
> 
> Just my 2p... 260kg Deadlift - Ryan Wheal - YouTube
> 
> Ryan


Ryan, that doesn't look like a DE training session...

DE is sets around 50% of max for speed. So a DE bench for a 140 bencher might be something like 60kg (+accomodating resistance) x 3 x 9 (9 sets of 3) - you wouldnt wave up in intensity (weight lifted) like that.

Plus, you have a DE and ME session on the same week. Dynamic Upper (Bench) then a ME Upper (Bench variations - Floor press, board press, reverse bands, pin press etc) and then DE Lower (Box Squats and/or Speed Deadlifts) and a ME Lower (Various squats, good mornings etc).

Thats a nice deadlift, what weight class are you? Look like 82.5/90?


----------



## Guest

Ryan_W said:


> Guys, after just reading a few pages of this thread, I really think you need to mix it up a bit! I've found a DE (dynamic effort) and ME (maximum effort) weekly split is the best way to do this (apart from training up to a comp).


Ryan, would this still be useful for beginners i.e. those, like me, who are still adding weight each session? 
I did google for DE and now understand how it can be useful, but I'm just wondering if it's a better technique to employ once an intermediate/advanced strength program is adopted.
I *think* programs such as Madcow and 5/3/1 do essentially include sub-maximal lifts.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Box Squats 130kg 1 x 5 
Shoulder Press 55kg 5, 5, 4 
Deadlift 150kg 1 x 4
Pull Ups 7 x 4 / 3 x 3 

Box Squat 132.5kg 1 x 5 
Bench Press 100kg 5 x 5 
Pendlay Rows 75kg 3 x 5 

Squats are moving at last, I think its the mental aspect more than anything as I know I only have to do 5 reps and then I can increase the weight. Just really waiting for my squats to stall and then changing to Madcow but want to push Stronglift as far as I can as its workout progression instead of weekly.

Deadlifts felt good but the 4th rep took forever to lock out which is strange and my grip pulled apart slightly which again is stange as I'm havent had problems with my grip at all lately.


----------



## Ryan_W

Will reply to the above questions when I get home chaps... Off for a biceps session now. Curls for the girls


----------



## Ryan_W

Phil, experience in weight lifting is irrelevant to what exercises you should perform.

Any bodybuilder/powerlifter/strongman will tell you that there's 3 exercises you should do religiously (squat, bench, deadlift), but everything else should be mixed up to some part.

I've seen people come in the gym on a Monday and do the same old exercises week-in-week-out, and then they complain about not gaining size or increasing their weights. Variety is the spice of life when it comes to weight lifting. 
Your body is a complex module which will learn and combat reoccurring stress upon itself (the same with dieting). You have to shock your body week-in-week-out to enable it to grow and develop (hence having a well varied workout programme).

Form is EVERYTHING, leave you ego at the door! Personally I used to be an idiot and throw weights around like a monkey. An experienced powerlifter took me under his wing, sorted my form out, and increased my deadlift from 160kg to 232.5kg in around 6 months!

One thing you really have to imply is dedication and diet. Diet is around 70% of the hardship when it comes to growth and development. Don't compete against anyone else apart from yourself. You're the only one you have to beat!

Cheers,

Ryan


----------



## Ryan_W

sidewalkdances said:


> Ryan, that doesn't look like a DE training session...
> 
> DE is sets around 50% of max for speed. So a DE bench for a 140 bencher might be something like 60kg (+accomodating resistance) x 3 x 9 (9 sets of 3) - you wouldnt wave up in intensity (weight lifted) like that.
> 
> Plus, you have a DE and ME session on the same week. Dynamic Upper (Bench) then a ME Upper (Bench variations - Floor press, board press, reverse bands, pin press etc) and then DE Lower (Box Squats and/or Speed Deadlifts) and a ME Lower (Various squats, good mornings etc).
> 
> Thats a nice deadlift, what weight class are you? Look like 82.5/90?


My DE workout is based around 65% ME. It's personnel preference since I can not get anything from 50% since I fatigue (lactic acid) with reps before I even get a decent pump, on the compound exercises.

My DE and ME weeks are pretty much BB'er week, PL'er week. I won't train 2 body parts in the same week, doesn't work for me mate. I've been increasing over the past 8 years doing what I do, so somethings working. However, it's another 'each to their own' scenario...... Something that will work for you, may not work for me etc etc.

Best deadlift @ 81kg was 260kg, best deadlift at 86kg was 285kg. Always been my forte, whereas I have fooked shoulders and struggle with 120kg bench now  Squat isn't too bad at around 200kg raw.

Ryan


----------



## ITHAQVA

Seems there are many lifters who suffer from shoulder issues. Mine was really odd, i woke up with it one Christmas morning about three years ago (wasn't doing any weights at the time, weird eh?), thought it was fixed but as soon as i got to around 60Kg/132LB on the overhead press the pain returned 

Thankfully I can do the main 3 without any pain (Squat. Deadlift & bench Press) :thumb:

Haven't really thought about what i want to do once i reach my modest goals (500 LB Squat & Deadlift, 330LB Bench Press).

Currently my 3 main lifts for reps are at;

*Squat: 147.4KG/324LB

Deadlift: 140KG/308LB

Bench Press: 100KG/220LB *

*To reach my goals i need to add the following to the above, Squat = 83KG/183LB, Deadlift = 88KG/194LB, Bench Press: 50KG/110LB *

I'm giving myself until next Christmas to improve by the above, i think that's realistic/sensible.

As each main lift goal is reached I'll probably do a vid of the single lift :thumb: 

One thing that shocked me this sat was my weight, i was 15 stone 7 pounds before i started powerlifting about 15 weeks ago, I'm now 16 stone 8 pounds :doublesho :doublesho, i have never put so much weight on in such a short time whilst doing weights, ever. I do remember posting somewhere in this thread that even I noticed my own growth during the first 8 week phase. My goal however isn't to get any bigger, in fact i now want to cut down my calories & add 30 min…aerobic work to my workouts as i only want strength, not size.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesdays Powerlifting Workout.

*Bench Press: 100KG/220Lb 5X5

Squat: 147.5KG/324.5LB 3X5

Barbell Row: 95KG/209LB 5X5

20 minutes cardio on the air walker.*

Another very good workout, especially happy with the bench, don't know why but it doesn't feel bone crunching heavy like it used to a few weeks ago when I was stuck on a much lighter weight.
I will be adding another 2.5KG/5.5Lb to all the above lifts next session.


----------



## Bod42

Box Squats 135kg 1 x 3
Shoulder Press 55kg 3 x 5 
Deadlift 150kg 1 x 5 
Pull Ups 7 x 4 / 3 x 3 

I read Dave Tates Vault E-Book and really concentrated on my squat form this workout. The weight felt awesome during warm up. I mean normally when I take the bar out of the rack I have to squat the bar out and it feels heavy on my shoulders, tonight it didnt feel like that. First few reps felt great and then on the 3rd I sat to far back and basically used all my energy to get the 3rd rep up. Squats used to be my best exercise, I was Box squating 180kg before I went traveling and now I been stuck around the 130kg mark for months. I can feel my core/abs working real hard during Squats and Deadlifts and I think my Rugby/Scrumming used to give me really good core strengt but I lost that now so this is my weak point.

Deadlifts I was never going to fail on, I didnt even have not getting to 5 reps in my head. The lower portion of the lift was flying up.

Doug: Have you ever made a workout spreadsheet where you work backwards from your goal. If you giving yourself 1 year, pick a date, say 18th January 2013 and work backwards from your goal. Thsi will give you an idea if the weekly/monthly increases are possible. You put on some decent strength since starting this program mate, keep it up


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Box Squats 135kg 1 x 3
> Shoulder Press 55kg 3 x 5
> Deadlift 150kg 1 x 5
> Pull Ups 7 x 4 / 3 x 3
> 
> I read Dave Tates Vault E-Book and really concentrated on my squat form this workout. The weight felt awesome during warm up. I mean normally when I take the bar out of the rack I have to squat the bar out and it feels heavy on my shoulders, tonight it didnt feel like that. First few reps felt great and then on the 3rd I sat to far back and basically used all my energy to get the 3rd rep up. Squats used to be my best exercise, I was Box squating 180kg before I went traveling and now I been stuck around the 130kg mark for months. I can feel my core/abs working real hard during Squats and Deadlifts and I think my Rugby/Scrumming used to give me really good core strengt but I lost that now so this is my weak point.
> 
> Deadlifts I was never going to fail on, I didnt even have not getting to 5 reps in my head. The lower portion of the lift was flying up.
> 
> Doug: Have you ever made a workout spreadsheet where you work backwards from your goal. If you giving yourself 1 year, pick a date, say 18th January 2013 and work backwards from your goal. Thsi will give you an idea if the weekly/monthly increases are possible. You put on some decent strength since starting this program mate, keep it up


Quality workout James:devil:, bet you felt good after that, you're an inspiration to us beginners mate :thumb::thumb:

Never thought to work backwards from my goals mate. I don't generally train that way, I just take each workout as it comes & always try to improve were I can , but yes its a good idea, cheers :thumb:

I would have my work cut out if my goal was to Bench Press 150KG/330LB for reps in 12 months as I would need to add 4.3 KG every month until December, that's without any plateaus/breaks/injuries etc.… so it's a little ambitious really. So it's probably better to try to aim for a 150KG/330LB single lift.

I've never had such a buzz out of any type of weight training before & never made such gains, at my age it's so weird, I LOVE POWERLIFTING!


----------



## Woodking

Great read guys, and there are some seriously strong chaps on this forum :thumb:

Can I please ask if anyone knows of a decent bench online for me to buy, just for chest work - bench press - flyes - incline/decline if possible, no leg attachments? I did have a bench but there the posts were exactly where you put your arms to lift the weight so got rid of it, now a bit worried about ordering another one if the posts are in the same place.

Cheers chaps


----------



## JamesGarner

I not following a program (stroglifts etc) but i have always done dead-lifts & squats in 5x5

im i overdoing the reps on deadlifts
i was happy creeping the lifts up to 145Kg but for 5x5


----------



## ITHAQVA

Woodking said:


> Great read guys, and there are some seriously strong chaps on this forum :thumb:
> 
> Can I please ask if anyone knows of a decent bench online for me to buy, just for chest work - bench press - flyes - incline/decline if possible, no leg attachments? I did have a bench but there the posts were exactly where you put your arms to lift the weight so got rid of it, now a bit worried about ordering another one if the posts are in the same place.
> 
> Cheers chaps


This is what I bought & reviewed on DW 

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211 :thumb:

Good value & exactly what your looking for :thumb:


----------



## Woodking

ITHAQVA said:


> This is what I bought & reviewed on DW
> 
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211 :thumb:
> 
> Good value & exactly what your looking for :thumb:


Thanks bud, really appreciate it. :thumb:

Woody


----------



## ITHAQVA

JamesGarner said:


> I not following a program (stroglifts etc) but i have always done dead-lifts & squats in 5x5
> 
> im i overdoing the reps on deadlifts
> i was happy creeping the lifts up to 145Kg but for 5x5


Stronglifts recommends doing Deadlifts 1X5 & Squat 5X5. Haven't seen stronglifts recommend 5X5 on both squat & deadlift due to recovery etc... Please see below workout, ive taken this of the stronglift site just now :thumb:

If your still gaining with a 3 x week squat/deadlift then carry on, I have always been very lucky & have to train very little to gain.

There are several variants of the 5X5, starting strength was one the first I think (Mark rippetoe), then you got Texas method, Madcow etc..

The latest stronglifts 5X5:

*Workout A:*

Squat 5x5
Bench Press 5x5
Barbell row.

*Workout B:*

Squat 5x5
Overhead Press 5x5
Deadlift 1x5

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Woodking said:


> Great read guys, and there are some seriously strong chaps on this forum :thumb:
> 
> Can I please ask if anyone knows of a decent bench online for me to buy, just for chest work - bench press - flyes - incline/decline if possible, no leg attachments? I did have a bench but there the posts were exactly where you put your arms to lift the weight so got rid of it, now a bit worried about ordering another one if the posts are in the same place.
> 
> Cheers chaps


Where you from Buddy, I got a Bench with squat rack on the back just sitting back in uk doing nothing. Its in Suffolk. For some Beer tokens its yours lol, I rather see it put to good use than collecting dust.












ITHAQVA said:


> Quality workout James:devil:, bet you felt good after that, you're an inspiration to us beginners mate :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Never thought to work backwards from my goals mate. I don't generally train that way, I just take each workout as it comes & always try to improve were I can , but yes its a good idea, cheers :thumb:
> 
> I would have my work cut out if my goal was to Bench Press 150KG/330LB for reps in 12 months as I would need to add 4.3 KG every month until December, that's without any plateaus/breaks/injuries etc.… so it's a little ambitious really. So it's probably better to try to aim for a 150KG/330LB single lift.
> 
> I've never had such a buzz out of any type of weight training before & never made such gains, at my age it's so weird, I LOVE POWERLIFTING!


Us beginners, what you on about? Your smashing me on squats and im 25 so really your well ahead of me buddy. Keep up the good work.

I dont use the work back workouts, I take each workout as its comes as well as everyone has good and bad days but its good to know if your goal is possible. Nothing wrong with aiming high though.



JamesGarner said:


> I not following a program (stroglifts etc) but i have always done dead-lifts & squats in 5x5
> 
> im i overdoing the reps on deadlifts
> i was happy creeping the lifts up to 145Kg but for 5x5


All depends when your doing the 5x5 Deadlifts. I used to do 5x5 Deadlifts and made good gains. The reason Stronglift only suggests 1x5 is due to recovery. Your squating 6 times in 2 weeks and Deadlifting 3 times so this is a massive strain on your CNS. If your squating once a week then your body should be able to handle Deadlifting once per week 5x5. Also the deadlifts are after 5x5 squats so that would be a killer, ya I done it before, actually I super setted Squats and Deadlifts but its a real killer


----------



## Woodking

Thanks Bod42, appreciate the gesture bud :thumb:

Unfortunately I'm in the Channel Islands so cant take you up on that! Sorry. :doublesho

Woody


----------



## Modmedia

Getting back into 5x5 after injury, my left knee is still dodgy from bad form previously. I have done a _lot _of reading and I'm dropping the weights on my squat and focusing on getting it all done with proper form.

My figures are poor atm, but we all start somewhere.  I currently weigh about 69KG @ 5'8" 

Using Stronglift tracker for iPhone which is awesome.

Todays workout...

*Squat: 67.5KG *(Reduced from my 85KG I was doing): *5x5* - Solid form, good reps, this will increase next workout. Left knee still feeling dodgy but I'm doing some foam rolling beforehand to loosen up. Helps.

*Overhead Press: 27.5KG: 5x5*! Proud of myself, I hate this exercise and it's the first time I've done 5x5 with this weight.

*Deadlift: 100KG: 1x5* - Love this exercise, going heavier next time - can't wait. :thumb:

That's all for now. Just an aside to say that I tried a Preworkout called iForce Maximize V2. Holy Jesus it was awesome, but I took it on an empty stomach and puked afterwards - but seriously it beats Jack3d and all the others I have tried in the past. Some people frown upon these pre-workout sups but I need them because I train at 6:30am and it's hard for me to get fully energised. 

Will try eating some oats or something then taking that pre workout and hope I don't vomit again, really want to prevent this from happening because it is a great product.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Nice!*

Fridays Powerlifting:

*Deadlift: 150KG/330LB 1 X 5

Pull-Ups: 2 ½ /3, 2 /3, 1 ¾ /4

Upright Row: 45KG/99LB 5,5,5,5,5*

Just to make new readers of this thread aware I do plenty of warming up before the above workout 

Moved the Deadlift up to 150KG/330LB to try & catch up with the lost time me faffing around with my grip, will keep at this weight & go back to moving up in increments of 2.5KG/5.5LB every time I reach 5 reps :thumb:


----------



## theshrew

How long have you been doing the 5x5 for ? 

Im going to start on Monday. Got myself some weights last weekend and going to get a bench this weekend. 

The only trouble is im going to have to do some sort of variant of a squat as ive no rack / or might just use the machine at the gym. 

Quite looking forward to it never used free weights before.


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> How long have you been doing the 5x5 for ?
> 
> Im going to start on Monday. Got myself some weights last weekend and going to get a bench this weekend.
> 
> The only trouble is im going to have to do some sort of variant of a squat as ive no rack / or might just use the machine at the gym.
> 
> Quite looking forward to it never used free weights before.


I'm on week 3 of my second 8 week phase, I'm pleased with my strength gains so far, slow & steady will do me at my age.

When I used to do weight training before i bought the power rack I replaced the squat with the Deadlift for safety & peace of mind :thumb:

If you can use a rack at the gym I would use it so you can Squat.


----------



## theshrew

Not got a rack just a squat machine. Better than nothing i suppose. 

Am i correct in saying the 5x5 is more for strengh gain over size ?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Modmedia said:


> *That's all for now. Just an aside to say that I tried a Preworkout called iForce Maximize V2. Holy Jesus it was awesome, but I took it on an empty stomach and puked afterwards - but seriously it beats Jack3d and all the others I have tried in the past. Some people frown upon these pre-workout sups but I need them because I train at 6:30am and it's hard for me to get fully energised.
> 
> Will try eating some oats or something then taking that pre workout and hope I don't vomit again, really want to prevent this from happening because it is a great product.*


*

Sorry missed this bit 

I can't give you any advice on supplements as I don't take any mate :thumb:

To help increase my protein intake i have a milkshake or two in the day & snack on different types of nuts or those tins/Jars of sardines/****les/muscles & ensure my main meals have enough protein in them too :thumb:

No puking from my diet of FOOD *


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> Not got a rack just a squat machine. Better than nothing i suppose.
> 
> Am i correct in saying the 5x5 is more for strengh gain over size ?


I've gone from 15 stone 5 pounds to 16 stone 8 pounds in less than 12 weeks powerlifting, you decide :thumb:

Ironically Im not training for size, so im adding 20 min cardio 3 times a week for a while.

The only reason i cant fit into my 34" Jeans is my legs are too big now, so i wear 36" with a belt, but even they are getting tight in the legs :thumb:

And im 43 so good size/strengh gains all round for me


----------



## theshrew

ITHAQVA said:


> I've gone from 15 stone 5 pounds to 16 stone 8 pounds in less than 12 weeks powerlifting, you decide :thumb:
> 
> Ironically Im not training for size, so im adding 20 min cardio 3 times a week for a while.
> 
> The only reason i cant fit into my 34" Jeans is my legs are too big now, so i wear 36" with a belt, but even they are getting tight in the legs :thumb:
> 
> And im 43 so good size/strengh gains all round for me


Is that with scoffing the same food or have you upped the intake ?

Im glad someone else has the same problem as me with the jeans. Ive lost a fair bit of weight since i started going the gym etc. Went shopping for some new jeans. I went for 3 full ish days to 5 different towns / citys. Could i find a pair i liked that fit my legs could i feck WTF AHHHHHHHHH :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> Is that with scoffing the same food or have you upped the intake ?
> 
> Im glad someone else has the same problem as me with the jeans. Ive lost a fair bit of weight since i started going the gym etc. Went shopping for some new jeans. I went for 3 full ish days to 5 different towns / citys. Could i find a pair i liked that fit my legs could i feck WTF AHHHHHHHHH :devil::devil::devil:


About the same food as always with the added 1-2 milkshakes a day plus one of the food protein snacks from my above list :thumb:

Mind you, im one of those people who can walk through fog & gain two pounds 

I always look for jeans with comfort/baggy fit cut. :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

You will never find jeams in the UK for real men, their all made for the non-weight lifting skinny boys. I could never find stylis jeans, the best ones were Skarter boy ones as they are really bangy but they dont look good lol.

I find 5x5 pretty good for size, I put one of the wingers on 5x5 at my rugby club and in 6 weeks he gained 7lb of weight and lowered his body fat percentage. As its only 5 reps you can use 80-85% of your 1 rep max which is good for your strength but the 5 sets gives you enough volume which helps with your size.

Modmedia: It all depends on how you injured your knee and where the damage/pain is but sometimes box squats can help you to carry on squatting with bad knees as it takes the bounce out of the bottle of the squat


----------



## Matt.

Doug, do you have Week 1 & Week 2? 

I have just been readint the link you posted on Ross' weight loss thread. 

I am starting to eat better, I have started running and now it's time to get back in the gym for weights.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Doug, do you have Week 1 & Week 2?
> 
> I have just been readint the link you posted on Ross' weight loss thread.
> 
> I am starting to eat better, I have started running and now it's time to get back in the gym for weights.


Hi Matt,

Here mate :thumb:

WEEK 1

TUESDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

THURSDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

SATURDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

WEEK 2

TUESDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

THURSDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

SATURDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
DEADLIFT KG ____

After 8 weeks of the above ive reduced my squat to 3 sets of 5 reps & alternate squating once on one week then twice on the following week.

You can change the reps to 6-8 if you want to train in a lighter/bodybuilding/weight training style


----------



## Matt.

Well I want definition along with more muscle. So what's best for that?

So it's 5 reps, a breather x 5?

Do you do anything for legs or does the squats cover this?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Well I want definition along with more muscle. So what's best for that?
> 
> So it's 5 reps, a breather x 5?
> 
> Do you do anything for legs or does the squats cover this?


Will try to keep this brief;
5 reps then rest for around 1 minute then the next 5 rep set & so on, when the weight gets heavier you'll rest a bit longer etc... And be thankful of the rest 

Squats are the number one compound leg exercise, but also tax the rest of the body & nervous system. :thumb:

*Some top compound exercises: Squat, deadlift, bench press, overhead press, barbell rows, dips & pull ups, to name a few. :devil:*

As for how to train, it's a very ambiguous question.

The many variations of the 5X5 will pack on muscle/strength & if you keep an eye on your diet you'll also loose fat. You can add a bit of cardio. I am starting with cardio 3 times a week for 20 minutes & will build up to a maximum of 5 times a week for 30 minutes.

It's not really an answer but the subject & its material is mahoosive. Having done weights most of my life, if I could go back in time I would be only doing powerlifting & the many variations of the 5x5, worth reading the book starting strength (Mark Rippetoe). He also has some good videos on how to train on YouTube.
The 5X5 I've posted is an excellent way to get into it & train; I really recommend it, if you really want to lift weights as it's not for everyone.

Link to stronglifts: http://stronglifts.com/
Worth reading up on the 5X5 & to download the free material, no need to subscribe :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Thanks Doug.

So will that help with definition then? 



ITHAQVA said:


> About the same food as always with the added 1-2 milkshakes a day plus one of the food protein snacks from my *above list* :thumb:
> 
> Mind you, im one of those people who can walk through fog & gain two pounds
> 
> I always look for jeans with comfort/baggy fit cut. :thumb:


What's this list you talk about?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Thanks Doug.
> 
> So will that help with definition then?
> 
> What's this list you talk about?


Very briefly,

Definition is about body fat content, which is achieved by your diet & creating a negative calorie deficit, which means in simple terms, you burning more calories in each day than you eat, causing a deficit. However it is very hard to keep on all your muscles mass & lose weight as you tend to lose a bit of size if you go for a very high definition ( around 5% body fat or less for the average person is very low).

I read that 500 negative calories a day is sufficient for weight lose

The list is just a few things I snack on to get extra protein in my diet on top of what i normally eat. See post #348 :thumb:

I think your goals for being slightly muscular with a nice level of definition are very realistic & you don't really need to lift heavy at all, just train with weights 3 times a week, using an 8-10 rep scheme with mainly compound exercises (The higher the intensity the more calories burnt), mix it up with some cardio. Get under a sun bed 3 times a week as a slight tan will increase your overall look of definition (moderation is key to sunbeds, when i say slight tan I mean slight tan) Your hardest part is diet.
This is all from memory, best to check out some decent sites, PM me your address again Matt & I'll send you a DVD of all my E-books on bodybuilding/weight training/diet etc.. :thumb:

I'm making it simple for myself (as im an old fart )

Over the next 12 months I'm aiming for as much strength as possible & ensuring I don't put any more body fat on, once my goals are reached I'll go into a maintenance mode (I'll probably use a variation of the Texas method) keep strength/size, but make efforts to lose some body fat by controlling my diet more as by then I will be doing cardio for 30 mins 5 times a week.


----------



## Matt.

Thanks again Doug. Your a star. :thumb:

So 5x5 is no good for my goal then? 

I'm a complete :newbie: when it comes to which excersise to do. I don't want to go to the gym unsure what excersise is what. At the same time, I'm not going to pose in there either. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Thanks again Doug. Your a star. :thumb:
> 
> So 5x5 is no good for my goal then?
> 
> I'm a complete :newbie: when it comes to which excersise to do. I don't want to go to the gym unsure what excersise is what. At the same time, I'm not going to pose in there either. :thumb:


The 5X5 is an excellent way to start, don't try to rush this; a great body should take time to develop, its more than just training, it takes a lot of discipline to keep training year in year out & eating correctly.

Best to get on YouTube & watch Mark Ripptoes videos on the main lifts, he's very down to earth guy, I love his approach, simple & safe.
To be honest there is enough info on this thread to get anyone started on a good training routine, obviously cost is a big deciding factor, but you can get great results with some relatively cheap kit. :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

So the main benefits for 5x5 is strength and muscle gain?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> So the main benefits for 5x5 is strength and muscle gain?


Amongst all the other health benefits yeah.

From a personal point of view, I love the challenge of increasing my strength; of course there are many, many hidden & not so hidden benefits from doing any sport.

The 5X5 is the most fulfilling weights routine I've ever come across. Great for the beginners & advanced.

Get some kit & get lifting! :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

I would have to go to the gym. Living in an apartment is something I hate with a passion!

I'm not sure if I should go with the 5x5 or train for muscle size with definition?

But the 5x5 will give me muscle size right?


----------



## mark328

PDF of the principles/techniques' etc...http://gainmusclesize.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/stronglifts-5x5.pdf

Is this the latest version, as after reading the internet he seems to of dropped the "prone bridges" and some others?

Ive been training for 3 years, but been following the standard 3 x 8 reps/ split routine, i.e chest/bicep, back/tricep.

Ive not been geting anywhere and am really hopeful that 5 x 5 will change things, i just want to make sure im reading the most up to date info on the program

Ive signed up for the email information from the site, im assuming ill get everything from that?

Thanks for all the posts, finding it very inspirational!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> But the 5x5 will give me muscle size right?


Matt,
I've grown so much even the missus & family members who see me every day have commented on my size increase since doing the 5X5, even I can see it. That to me is a sure sign of pretty dam good gains/growth.

I've gone from 15 1/2 stone to 16 stone 8 pounds within the first 8 week phase.

Just re weighed myself again, 16 stone 8 pounds stark naked :thumb: 

Ironically my goal was never size, only strength.

Anyhow on to the job at hand, Sunday's Workout. :thumb:

*Bench Press: 102.5KG/225.5LB 5,4,4,4,4

Squat: 150KG/330LB 5X5

Barbell Row: 95KG/209LB 5X5*

Pleased with results considering I felt tired before I started.

That's week 3 of my second 8 week phase over, I'm shagged out & sooo hungry now, I've got roast chicken, vegetables & stuffing, you can't beat a bit of stuffing :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> PDF of the principles/techniques' etc...http://gainmusclesize.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/stronglifts-5x5.pdf
> 
> Is this the latest version, as after reading the internet he seems to of dropped the "prone bridges" and some others?
> 
> Ive been training for 3 years, but been following the standard 3 x 8 reps/ split routine, i.e chest/bicep, back/tricep.
> 
> Ive not been geting anywhere and am really hopeful that 5 x 5 will change things, i just want to make sure im reading the most up to date info on the program
> 
> Ive signed up for the email information from the site, im assuming ill get everything from that?
> 
> Thanks for all the posts, finding it very inspirational!!!!


Use the workout ive posted for Matt, Post #354, you want size, use compound barbell exercises, i have never used a dumbell or a suppliment in my life :thumb:

I would say it is very usefull if you read this entire thread from start to finish, everything you need to get started is all here :thumb:


----------



## mark328

ITHAQVA said:


> Use the workout ive posted for Matt, Post #354, you want size, use compound barbell exercises, i have never used a dumbell or a suppliment in my life :thumb:
> 
> I would say it is very usefull if you read this entire thread from start to finish, everything you need to get started is all here :thumb:


Im reading the 57 page PDF aswell!!!

Ive never done Squats for any lengt of time, or deadlifts, so this is gonna be tough i know.

I read in the PDF that the recommendation is inverted rows instead of barbell rows, which should i do


----------



## Matt.

Doug, can you tell in your arms and legs that it is muscle or do you look the same but have more strength? Get some photos up. 

Why was Bench Press 5, 4, 4, 4, 4?


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> Im reading the 57 page PDF aswell!!!
> 
> Ive never done Squats for any lengt of time, or deadlifts, so this is gonna be tough i know.
> 
> I read in the PDF that the recommendation is inverted rows instead of barbell rows, which should i do


Overhand rows or inverted.

Overhand = more triceps involvement
Underhand = more biceps involvement.

Im doing overhand barbell rows :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Doug, can you tell in your arms and legs that it is muscle or do you look the same but have more strength? Get some photos up.
> 
> Why was Bench Press 5, 4, 4, 4, 4?


I can see size increased on: legs including calves, traps, arms & shoulders, basically everywhere.

Bench was 5,4,4,4,4 reps because i knew if i pushed for more than 5 reps each set i would be a little short at the end for reps, no worries next session i will now aim for a full 5X5, im not rushing & I don't want to increase the intensity as this way works better for me, I used to train to failure & it didn't do much for me in any way. Anyhow IT WAS BLOODY HEAVY! 

I would rather build up my reps than lower the weight or de load as it called in the 5X5, i prefer to de load on reps than weight even if it meant I was doing one rep each set, worked for me years ago, but not as good as this time as i was doing way too much volume (Sets) & with too much intensity (Training each set to positive failure) :thumb:

As for pics, well I'm not a bodybuilder so it's not my thing & i find it a little gratuitous, but if i carry on with this, which i hope to, by the end of this year I'll pop some up, i promise not to have my knob hanging out 

Now go train!  :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Matt. said:


> I would have to go to the gym. Living in an apartment is something I hate with a passion!
> 
> I'm not sure if I should go with the 5x5 or train for muscle size with definition?
> 
> But the 5x5 will give me muscle size right?


Definition = Muscle + Low Body Fat

I dont personnally believe there is training for definition. Yes you can do Super Sets, drop sets, Giant sets, short rest period, etc, etc , bla bla bla but this just burns more calories which in turn gets you more definition but there is no point being low body fat if you dont have much muscle as you wont look defined.

If your a noob, you will pretty much grow on anything so 5x5 is a perfect program as its consistain gains both in muscle and strength. You will find it easier to put on more muscle if your handling more weight. Some people dont agree but take Bench press for example. If tomorrow you lift 50kg for 5 reps and in 2 months you lift 80kg for 5 reps, your chest, shoulders and arms are going to be bigger.

I would suggest doing 5x5 as written for maybe 8 weeks and then evaluate how you look feel and make adjustments from there.

As for inverted Rows or Barbell Rows. Stronglift used to advise Inverted Rows in his 1st or 2nd edition of 5x5 but now he suggests Barbell Rows. Barbell Rows are easier to add consistant weight to so I would go with them.


----------



## Matt.

Barbell Rows, are they the same as Bent Over Rows?


----------



## Bod42

Matt. said:


> Barbell Rows, are they the same as Bent Over Rows?


Yes they are just a different name for them. You can do Bent over Dumbell Rows but stick with Barbell Movements most of the time.

Best thing is to find an experience lifter and ask if he doesnt mind showing you the ropes for a few weeks if you dont know perfect technique. I find it hard to suggest using a person trainer as I am a qualified person trainer and the stuff they teach you on the courses is mostly utter  I quit after being bollocked for training people properly so dont waste your money on 95% of PTs. Most powerlifter, proper trainers are usually well prepared to pass on their knowledge.

Not sure how old you are but when I left the UK the council/government was doing some incentive where you only pay 5 quid a week for a gym or something like that. Try and find a gym with a power rack. Basically if the gym doesnt have a power rack, its not a gym. Ask the PTs if the gym has a power rack, if they say whats a power rack (usual answer) then RUN


----------



## Ryan_W

I'm going to disagree with 5x5 for conditioning and muscle growth. 

The reason many professional athletes undertake powerlifting (not really 5x5, but it's pretty close) for their sport, is due to the fact that it doesn't increase huge amounts of muscle growth due to it primarily concentrating of strength and explosive power.

Muscle gain is focussed towards a traditional bodybuilding program, containing high reps, low(ish) weight and strict form. The key to muscle growth in cell-volumisation, essentially getting as much blood (nutrients) to the muscle as possible.

I've seen 300lb monsters bicep curling 15kg dumbbells for these very reasons. However, I still think you should perform the 3 main compound exercises with a challenging weight due to the nature of the lift. Benching 40kg for 20 reps is not really worth it for someone who maxes out at 80kg.

I grew from 75kg to 88kg staying under 10% BF buy using a bodybuilding routine, yet I now maintain size and weight with my PL'ing routine incorporating some BB'ing assistance exercises.

Horses for courses... Give a plethora of workout programs a go, see what works for you and then stick to it!

Cheers

Ryan 

(All the above is just my personnel opinion from 8-ish years experience......)


----------



## sidewalkdances

Now i've changed my dietary strategy, my lifting has improved! How about that.


----------



## Matt.

Trouble is Ryan, I don't know where to start with the routine. Which excersises to do on what day.


----------



## MarkH

sidewalkdances said:


> MWD vs CBL - YouTube


What powerlifting federation do you belong to as the rules seem to have changed or is that some off season training?


----------



## sidewalkdances

MarkH said:


> What powerlifting federation do you belong to as the rules seem to have changed or is that some off season training?


BPC - those are training videos, not competition.

What rules are you referring too? The second one has a legit pause and press command in there as well as a rack command - just cant hear them very well on the video (I think the lad had his finger over the mic!)

The 120 is a **** show anyway!


----------



## MarkH

Had a look for BPC rules and they are not apparent, only that they don't do drug tests, are the foot movements in some powerlifting organisations banned?


----------



## sidewalkdances

My feet stay still when I lift, I just push them hard into the floor - You can move your feet around as much as you like when setting up the lift. 

BPC Rules will be the same as WPC/WPO rules.


----------



## theshrew

Matt. said:


> Trouble is Ryan, I don't know where to start with the routine. Which excersises to do on what day.


Someone put the routine on a few pages back mate.


----------



## theshrew

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Matt,
> 
> Here mate :thumb:
> 
> WEEK 1
> 
> TUESDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____  ____ ____ ____ ____
> 
> THURSDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> SATURDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> 
> WEEK 2
> 
> TUESDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> THURSDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> 
> SATURDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> After 8 weeks of the above ive reduced my squat to 3 sets of 5 reps & alternate squating once on one week then twice on the following week.
> 
> You can change the reps to 6-8 if you want to train in a lighter/bodybuilding/weight training style


LOL Matt you already asked


----------



## sidewalkdances

MarkH said:


> Had a look for BPC rules and they are not apparent, only that they don't do drug tests, are the foot movements in some powerlifting organisations banned?


As a further to my other post: These are the WPC Rules for the feet on the bench press

2. The lifter must lie backward with shoulders and buttocks in contact with the flat
bench surface. The lifter's shoes or toes must be in solid contact with the platform or surface. The position of the head is optional.

They are the only rules in relation to the feet.


----------



## Matt.

theshrew said:


> LOL Matt you already asked


But then you have others saying don't do Stronglift.


----------



## theshrew

Matt. said:


> But then you have others saying don't do Stronglift.


Im a noob to mate joined the gym in November but mine aint got any free weights. Ive gained a little strengh from using machines but looking into it people say free weights are soooo much better.

Last weekend got myself some weights and fingers crossed tonight i will be getting a bench and starting the 5x5. Try it if it doesnt do what you want try something else is my view.

Ive looked on loads of forums and loads of people recomend 5x5:thumb:


----------



## Ryan_W

sidewalkdances said:


> MWD vs CBL - YouTube
> 
> Now i've changed my dietary strategy, my lifting has improved! How about that.


Not being an ****, but both lifts would have failed with WDFPF judges.

The first is blatant, the second has a little decompression just before you start the push from the bottom.

Why have you decided to go with BPC and not BDFPA/GPC?

Still, top lifts, I'm sure you'll be throwing up 3 plates in no time.

Ryan :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Ryan_W said:


> I'm going to disagree with 5x5 for conditioning and muscle growth.
> 
> The reason many professional athletes undertake powerlifting (not really 5x5, but it's pretty close) for their sport, is due to the fact that it doesn't increase huge amounts of muscle growth due to it primarily concentrating of strength and explosive power.
> 
> Muscle gain is focussed towards a traditional bodybuilding program, containing high reps, low(ish) weight and strict form. The key to muscle growth in cell-volumisation, essentially getting as much blood (nutrients) to the muscle as possible.
> 
> I've seen 300lb monsters bicep curling 15kg dumbbells for these very reasons. However, I still think you should perform the 3 main compound exercises with a challenging weight due to the nature of the lift. Benching 40kg for 20 reps is not really worth it for someone who maxes out at 80kg.
> 
> I grew from 75kg to 88kg staying under 10% BF buy using a bodybuilding routine, yet I now maintain size and weight with my PL'ing routine incorporating some BB'ing assistance exercises.
> 
> Horses for courses... Give a plethora of workout programs a go, see what works for you and then stick to it!
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Ryan
> 
> (All the above is just my personnel opinion from 8-ish years experience......)


This is why I love reading about weightlifting and I am constantly learning as I agree with what your saying about you can be huge while using small weights but these guys have amazing mind muscle connection and make their muscle scream with those light weights. A noob doesnt have that connection. I mean take someone who has never weight lifted and ask them to contract their lats, tense their back or tense their hamstring or thigh, they normally cantdo it as they dont have the mind muscle connection. Now stick a heavy barbell on their back and show them how to squat, having that mind muscle connection isnt as important as your body will automatically tense the muscles it needs. I find increasing weight is the easiest way to train a noob.

Anyway noobs grow muscle on any program at the start so why not be strong as well as big.

I met a few 300lb bodybuilders and there aint many who arent on the roids. Another reason I like 5x5 is that its pretty much 100% to make you stronger/bigger whereas there are thousands of people doing Arnolds/Ronnie Colemans workouts and not making even a slight gain.

There is defiantly different things you can do for strength gain and muscle gain just take a look at Dave Tate and Matt Kroczaleski who were Powerlifters but are now Bodybuilders but strength still plays a massive role.

But like you say its just my opinion and experience.



Matt. said:


> But then you have others saying don't do Stronglift.


There are 2 programs for beginners that I suggest, Stronglift or Starting strength. Both have pros and cons. Stronglift has a free E-book, starting strength has a book on amazon. Pick one and hit it hard.


----------



## Ryan_W

Matt. said:


> Trouble is Ryan, I don't know where to start with the routine. Which excersises to do on what day.


Here'a a routine nigh-on identical to mine:

All I use are straps for shrugs (220kg is pretty hard with double overhand grip) and NO belt for squats (makes you train your core more)... I sometimes use a belt for my ME back day, but only if I'm going 240kg+.

Monday - Chest

Barbell bench press
Incline dumbbell press
Incline or flat dumbbell press
Dumbbell pullovers
Decline barbell press

Tuesday - Biceps

Barbell or EZ bar curls
Dumbbell hammer curls
Dumbbell concentration curls
Weighted pull-ups 
Reverse grip EZ bar curls

Wednesday - Legs

Squat or leg press
Squat to bench
Single paused leg extensions
Calve rasies
Good Mornings

Thursday - Shoulders

Standing military press
Barbell shrugs
Seated dumbbell press
Upright barbell rows
Dumbbell superset

Friday - Back

Deadlift or T-bar rows
Bent over rows
Front-chest pulldowns
Lat pulldowns
Wide-arm pull-ups 
Single arm mowers

Saturday - Mountain biking

Sunday - Mountain biking


----------



## Bod42

Anyway back on point

First Madcow Workout:
Box Squat: 70kg x 5, 80kg x 5, 95kg x 5, 112.5kg x 5, 127.5kg x 5
Bench press: 52.5kg, 65kg x 5, 77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 102.5kg x 5
Barbell Rows: 37.5kg x 5, 47.5kg x 5, 57.5kg x 5, 65kg x 5, 75kg x 5
Hyper Extensions and Abs.

Changed to the intemediate Madcow program today and am working back up to a PR over the next 4 weeks. Im hoping this workout keeps me progressing nicely as you still squat 3 times a week but Wednesday is a recovery day so its similar to Texas Method program where you have Volume - Rest - Intensity Days. I didnt feel as pumped after the workout but this will be from the reduced volume. I really wanted to keep 5x5 sets across like Texas Method but didnt fancy the 1.5 to 2 hour Monday workouts but I probably try this after Madcow anyway.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Ryan_W said:


> Not being an ****, but both lifts would have failed with WDFPF judges.
> 
> The first is blatant, the second has a little decompression just before you start the push from the bottom.
> 
> Why have you decided to go with BPC and not BDFPA/GPC?
> 
> Still, top lifts, I'm sure you'll be throwing up 3 plates in no time.
> 
> Ryan :thumb:


As I said, the first lift, the 120, was done touch and go and I felt like crap. The second will be my opener and is fine - the decompression is not an intentional thing and i probably just from the flexing of my lats. I don't care for the super strict IPF/WDFPF type federations - because I enjoy multiply powerlifting and because some of the stuff that goes on in BDFPA is laughable.

I compete BPC for a few reasons, mainly because all the powerlifters in my gym have or do compete BPC, we hold a BPC meet most years down here and as I said, I don't want to compete raw/single ply. If I competed GPC, there is far far more travelling involved to compete too.

My best (raw) bench is a 142.5kg, shamefully at a lighter body weight - touch and go. That 125kg is an easy opener for the weekend on a compromised training cycle through work/diet mistakes.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Anyway back on point
> 
> First Madcow Workout:
> Box Squat: 70kg x 5, 80kg x 5, 95kg x 5, 112.5kg x 5, 127.5kg x 5
> Bench press: 52.5kg, 65kg x 5, 77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 102.5kg x 5
> Barbell Rows: 37.5kg x 5, 47.5kg x 5, 57.5kg x 5, 65kg x 5, 75kg x 5
> Hyper Extensions and Abs.
> 
> Changed to the intemediate Madcow program today and am working back up to a PR over the next 4 weeks. Im hoping this workout keeps me progressing nicely as you still squat 3 times a week but Wednesday is a recovery day so its similar to Texas Method program where you have Volume - Rest - Intensity Days. I didnt feel as pumped after the workout but this will be from the reduced volume. I really wanted to keep 5x5 sets across like Texas Method but didnt fancy the 1.5 to 2 hour Monday workouts but I probably try this after Madcow anyway.


James,
Are the sets at the beginning warm up/ build up sets?

I like the idea of building up to a single full out 5 rep max set at the end, did you feel less pre exhausted for the final sets James? I sometimes feel shagged after the 3 sets of squats lol.

Interesting way to work out, I would definitely consider this once my weights become too heavy to do at least 3 sets building up to 5 reps, cool mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> As I said, the first lift, the 120, was done touch and go and I felt like crap. The second will be my opener and is fine - the decompression is not an intentional thing and i probably just from the flexing of my lats. I don't care for the super strict IPF/WDFPF type federations - because I enjoy multiply powerlifting and because some of the stuff that goes on in BDFPA is laughable.
> 
> I compete BPC for a few reasons, mainly because all the powerlifters in my gym have or do compete BPC, we hold a BPC meet most years down here and as I said, I don't want to compete raw/single ply. If I competed GPC, there is far far more travelling involved to compete too.
> 
> My best (raw) bench is a 142.5kg, shamefully at a lighter body weight - touch and go. That 125kg is an easy opener for the weekend on a compromised training cycle through work/diet mistakes.


This may be a stupid question but in Powerlifting comps dont they normally include the bar in the total weight as well. Your doing 6 plates (which i take are 20s) plus the bar so wouldnt this be 140kg in comp?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James,
> Are the sets at the beginning warm up/ build up sets?
> 
> I like the idea of building up to a single full out 5 rep max set at the end, did you feel less pre exhausted for the final sets James? I sometimes feel shagged after the 3 sets of squats lol.
> 
> Interesting way to work out, I would definitely consider this once my weights become too heavy to do at least 3 sets building up to 5 reps, cool mate :thumb:


The sets are worked backwards from your 5RM in 12.5% increasements so 50%, 62.5%, 75%, 87.5%, 100%. I like this workout as its like having a warm up schedule set in stone so you are always hitting your heavy weight after the same warm up percentages. The last 3 sets are harder than I thought they would be actually so yes I was less buggered than doing 5x5 straight sets but I can actually feel it more than usual in my legs today.

I think I may have sent you the Madcow Spreadsheet previously. Its the intemediate workout after Stronglift


----------



## Ryan_W

When mentioning 'plates', it's in reference to how many 20kg discs are on one end, ie: 5 plates = 220kg (including 20kg bar).


----------



## Bod42

Ryan_W said:


> When mentioning 'plates', it's in reference to how many 20kg discs are on one end, ie: 5 plates = 220kg (including 20kg bar).


Cool, thats exactly how I calculate the weight.


----------



## theshrew

So i got my bench last night and built it. Only had a quick 2 min on it with real light weight. 

I have a question when doing a bench press how wide should your hands be on the bar ? The hooks on the bench are pretty much bang on where i would natrually put my hands. Should i go inside or outside them ?


----------



## MarkH

Ok well I had better dig out the rule book as I am working at the powerlifting at the Paralympics as well!!!


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> James,
> Are the sets at the beginning warm up/ build up sets?
> 
> I like the idea of building up to a single full out 5 rep max set at the end, did you feel less pre exhausted for the final sets James? I sometimes feel shagged after the 3 sets of squats lol.
> 
> Interesting way to work out, I would definitely consider this once my weights become too heavy to do at least 3 sets building up to 5 reps, cool mate :thumb:


Doug, the normal SL program will eventually drop to 1x5 when you eventually can't recover from doing 3x5. That makes it similar to Madcow in the sense that you effectively do ramping sets i.e. a few warm up sets followed by a single work set.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The sets are worked backwards from your 5RM in 12.5% increasements so 50%, 62.5%, 75%, 87.5%, 100%. I like this workout as its like having a warm up schedule set in stone so you are always hitting your heavy weight after the same warm up percentages. The last 3 sets are harder than I thought they would be actually so yes I was less buggered than doing 5x5 straight sets but I can actually feel it more than usual in my legs today.
> 
> I think I may have sent you the Madcow Spreadsheet previously. Its the intemediate workout after Stronglift


Cheers James, yes mate sorry, i did get the Madcow routine :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Doug, the normal SL program will eventually drop to 1x5 when you eventually can't recover from doing 3x5. That makes it similar to Madcow in the sense that you effectively do ramping sets i.e. a few warm up sets followed by a single work set.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Cheers Phil,
Not at that point yet, but see the validity in the ramped sets. I will keep pushing the straight sets for as long as i can, only because im too lazy to keep changing plates :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> So i got my bench last night and built it. Only had a quick 2 min on it with real light weight.
> 
> I have a question when doing a bench press how wide should your hands be on the bar ? The hooks on the bench are pretty much bang on where i would natrually put my hands. Should i go inside or outside them ?


How to Bench Press :thumb:





















Check out the other Mark Rippetoe Vids, very usefull info :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> This may be a stupid question but in Powerlifting comps dont they normally include the bar in the total weight as well. Your doing 6 plates (which i take are 20s) plus the bar so wouldnt this be 140kg in comp?


The outer plates are 10's :thumb: - we have a set of full sized Eleiko bumper plates that I use all the time because they are more accurate than the smaller Jordan plates we have


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesdays Workout

*Deadlift: 152.5KG/335.5LB 1 X 5 :thumb:

Pull-ups: 2¾/3, 2/3, 1¾/3.

Upright Rows: 47.5KG/104.5LB 5X5

20 minutes cardio.*
Im seeing slight improvements in the pull ups, so onward & upward


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Doug, the normal SL program will eventually drop to 1x5 when you eventually can't recover from doing 3x5. That makes it similar to Madcow in the sense that you effectively do ramping sets i.e. a few warm up sets followed by a single work set.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Very similar but not quite the same as when I warm up for Stronglift if its 5x5, 3x5 or 1x5 I will warm up like 50% for 5, 75% for 3 and then 90% for 1 but with Madcow it calls for 5 reps throughout your warm up sets so the 87.5% for 5 reps does nacker you abit.



ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers Phil,
> Not at that point yet, but see the validity in the ramped sets. I will keep pushing the straight sets for as long as i can, only because im too lazy to keep changing plates :lol:


Haha I was just saying to my Mrs the other night that not sure I like this workout as I have to change the weight 15 times per workout I might change back to 5x5 so I dont have to change so much.

Funny how were quite happily put a heavy bar on our back and strain like crazy but to lazy to chnage weights lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Funny how were quite happily put a heavy bar on our back and strain like crazy but to lazy to chnage weights lol.


Dam right , imagine knowing you lost that crucial fith rep on the last set & not being able to add another 2.5KG next session down to too much weight on the warm ups :doublesho You'd hate the weights then :devil:

James, if your squat is not moving up have you tried my de load the reps method instead "ITHAQVA Method" ©


----------



## chunkytfg

Anyone got the olympic plates from powerhouse fitness.co.uk?

The dumbbells we ordered before Xmas finally turned up and although the plates fit fine mostly the 1.25kg plates dont and i've had to take a dremmel to them as it looks like the 2 halves of the cast were not lined up quite right making the hole for the dumbbell not round.


----------



## ITHAQVA

chunkytfg said:


> Anyone got the olympic plates from powerhouse fitness.co.uk?
> 
> The dumbbells we ordered before Xmas finally turned up and although the plates fit fine mostly the 1.25kg plates dont and i've had to take a dremmel to them as it looks like the 2 halves of the cast were not lined up quite right making the hole for the dumbbell not round.


I ordered this from powerhouse, arrived in less than 7 days :thumb:
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211

This from Fitness superstore, again arrived within 7 days :thumb:
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372

I called ahead & made sure everything was in stock & held back for me on all above purchases :thumb:


----------



## mark328

Guys,
How many of you started with an empty bar 1st off AS PER PROGRAM?

Im off to the gym soon to start my SL 5x5 ( Workout A ) and just wanted to see out of curiousty?


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> Guys,
> How many of you started with an empty bar 1st off AS PER PROGRAM?
> 
> Im off to the gym soon to start my SL 5x5 ( Workout A ) and just wanted to see out of curiousty?


I didnt. I did a pre workout test for my starting weigths, made sure the weights were easy enough to get back into it & in very good form, but also giving me a little resistance.

There is nothing wrong in starting with an empty bar though, follow the program & youll fill it up soon enough  :thumb:


----------



## mark328

ITHAQVA said:


> I didnt. I did a pre workout test for my starting weigths, made sure the weights were easy enough to get back into it & in very good form, but also giving me a little resistance.
> 
> There is nothing wrong in starting with an empty bar though, follow the program & youll fill it up soon enough  :thumb:


ATM I can bench 80kg 5x5. Empty bar will take me about 2 months to reach this with the increments.

The program says EMPTY bar all over it, even if your an experienced lifter.

Im tempted to start at 50% ? i.e 40kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> ATM I can bench 80kg 5x5. Empty bar will take me about 2 months to reach this with the increments.
> 
> The program says EMPTY bar all over it, even if your an experienced lifter.
> 
> Im tempted to start at 50% ? i.e 40kg


40KG is a good starting weight :thumb:


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> I ordered this from powerhouse, arrived in less than 7 days :thumb:
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211
> 
> This from Fitness superstore, again arrived within 7 days :thumb:
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372
> 
> I called ahead & made sure everything was in stock & held back for me on all above purchases :thumb:


I'll add to this and mention that the Olympic plates from Powerhouse are a little on the small side. This means that when you are doing Rows and Deadlifts the bar will be about 2" lower than you'd normally expect, when loaded with 20kg plates. Might be worth bearing in mind.
If I had my time over again, I'd have got my weight plates from Fitness Superstore because of this.

Their power rack, however, is fantastic.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, if your squat is not moving up have you tried my de load the reps method instead "ITHAQVA Method" ©


I do kind of try that but I only do it for 3 weeks and if I still cant ge the weight after 3 weeks I deload. I used to do exactly as you do and it worked quite well so might skip this deload malarky and start pushing the reps up. On my arms I used to do 1 rep extra per week so to go from 3 x 3 to 3 x 5 would take 6 weeks but it always worked. Haha like the copyright sign



mark328 said:


> ATM I can bench 80kg 5x5. Empty bar will take me about 2 months to reach this with the increments.
> 
> The program says EMPTY bar all over it, even if your an experienced lifter.
> 
> Im tempted to start at 50% ? i.e 40kg


I started with 50% of my 5RM and it worked ok. First few sessions feel stupidly easy but after a few weeks your soon start hitting hard weights.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Light Box Squat: 65x5, 80x5, 95x5, 95x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5x5, 37.5x5, 45x5, 50x5
Conventional Deadlifts: 90x5, 110x5, 127.5, 145x5
Chins Ups: 25 reps

Worked from 6am to 9:30pm yesterday and then went to the gym, didnt finish until nearly 11pm so was pretty pleased to get all my weights when I was nackered.

You feel so much fresher doing Shoulder Press after light squats instead of 5x5 so my shoulder press felt good, hardly any pain while pressing.

I havent done this much Deadlift volume in quite a long time so even the lower sets were difficult and seriously shredded my hands. Gone from 1 set to 4 sets so feel abit different. Plus Chin Ups and you have one exhausted back.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Light Box Squat: 65x5, 80x5, 95x5, 95x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5x5, 37.5x5, 45x5, 50x5
> Conventional Deadlifts: 90x5, 110x5, 127.5, 145x5
> Chins Ups: 25 reps
> 
> Worked from 6am to 9:30pm yesterday and then went to the gym, didnt finish until nearly 11pm so was pretty pleased to get all my weights when I was nackered.
> 
> You feel so much fresher doing Shoulder Press after light squats instead of 5x5 so my shoulder press felt good, hardly any pain while pressing.
> 
> I havent done this much Deadlift volume in quite a long time so even the lower sets were difficult and seriously shredded my hands. Gone from 1 set to 4 sets so feel abit different. Plus Chin Ups and you have one exhausted back.


Considering what time you started mate :doublesho, fair play to you :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I'll add to this and mention that the Olympic plates from Powerhouse are a little on the small side. This means that when you are doing Rows and Deadlifts the bar will be about 2" lower than you'd normally expect, when loaded with 20kg plates. Might be worth bearing in mind.
> If I had my time over again, I'd have got my weight plates from Fitness Superstore because of this.
> 
> Their power rack, however, is fantastic.


Phil is correct re the plate size, however if you purchase the same Olympic set as myself:
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372
, you get the larger 25KG/55LB plates wich are the correct size :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Last session before the comp tonight.

Some very light deads and floor pressing on the agenda.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Last session before the comp tonight.
> 
> Some very light deads and floor pressing on the agenda.


:thumb::thumb: Best of luck Dan :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Phil is correct re the plate size, however if you purchase the same Olympic set as myself:
> http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372
> , you get the larger 25KG/55LB plates wich are the correct size :thumb:


I've looked at that picture several times and never noticed the 25kg plates! :lol:
Are they 450mm in diameter, which would be standard size? 
I think you said the 20kg plates were 430mm - even those would only put the bar 1cm lower than expected, which wouldn't be noticeable :thumb:.
Out of interest, do your plates look the same on both sides or is one side flat?

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Last session before the comp tonight.
> 
> Some very light deads and floor pressing on the agenda.


Good luck Buddy


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I've looked at that picture several times and never noticed the 25kg plates! :lol:
> Are they 450mm in diameter, which would be standard size?
> I think you said the 20kg plates were 430mm - even those would only put the bar 1cm lower than expected, which wouldn't be noticeable :thumb:.
> Out of interest, do your plates look the same on both sides or is one side flat?
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Hi Phil, 25KG plates are 450 mm :thumb:

All the plates are flat on one side :thumb:

Really pleased with set, its all the weight ill ever need as I dont think i have any plans to go over 520LB on any single lifts.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Itching to go and lift now.

Bags packed, carbs are being loaded, about to go and get my haircut then off the SFW (Smash F'ing Weight!)


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Itching to go and lift now.
> 
> Bags packed, carbs are being loaded, about to go and get my haircut then off the SFW (Smash F'ing Weight!)


Go for it mate :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Madcow Workout: 
Box Squat:70kg x 5,80kg x 5,95kg x 5,112.5kg x 5, 130kg x 3, 95kg x 8
Bench press: 52.5kg,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 105kg x 3, 77.5kg x 8
BarbellRows: 37.5kg x 5,47.5kg x 5,57.5kg x 5,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 3, 57.5 x 8
Dips 3x8
Dumbell Curls 3x8

Pretty good workout, 3reps felt good and i thought the back off set would be hard but the 1good thing about back off sets is they feel amazing light when u had a lot heavier weights on your back.

First time I done dips in yrs and they felt awesome. Was really surprised how easy 8were


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sunday's workout.

*Bench Press: 102.5KG/225.5LB 5X5 :thumb:

Squat: 152.5KG/335.5LB 3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 95KG/209LB 5X5*

I missed one workout this week , forced myself to hate the weights today :devil: & I'm really pleased with the results 

Bench Press, I felt there was a lot more strength in the tank & could of lifted more weight, but not for 5 sets of 5 reps. I'm continuing to take the very slow approach to ensure I stay safe, especially at my old age (43 :doublesho:doublesho), gotta look after the old bones ya know.

*Squat: I start my squats from the low position :doublesho which is really hard to do, im going to make changes soon & start at the top position like everyone else. What are your views on this guys? :thumb:*

Barbell row: I've stayed on the same weight for a while, its now starting to feel much easier to move, will consider upping the weight to 97.5KG in the next week or two


----------



## sidewalkdances

Video of my comp attempts - totalled 620kg raw 240kg squat, 137.5kg bench, 242.5kg deadlift.

ITHAQVA - why do you start at the bottom - you need to squat from the top. The descent on the squat is just as important as the coming up


----------



## Guest

Definately start from the top. You won't get the benefit of the stretch reflex on your first rep.
How did you unrack the bar from the bottom position?

I have to say I'm impressed that you are around BW on the bench and row and still managing 5x5! You are recovering well for an oldie  (I can say that because I'm your age too )

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Sidewalk dance: Real nice lifting in the video. I would say your 3rd squat attemp is your lowest so really nice lift.

Nice deadlift form. How comes you Sumo deadlift, what do you think are the benefits. Only ask as I prefer Sumo but apparently they dont carry over to sport as well

Doug, Def start at the top


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Raw Qualifier for Lee Lumpy Price - YouTube
> 
> Video of my comp attempts - totalled 620kg raw 240kg squat, 137.5kg bench, 242.5kg deadlift.
> 
> ITHAQVA - why do you start at the bottom - you need to squat from the top. The descent on the squat is just as important as the coming up


Well lifted Dan, POWER!!!!!!!!!! :thumb::thumb::thumb:

Just a habit, i leave the bar on the safety rails & squat from there, i think im making it even harder for myself than it already is, will start from top from now on  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Definately start from the top. You won't get the benefit of the stretch reflex on your first rep.
> How did you unrack the bar from the bottom position?
> 
> I have to say I'm impressed that you are around BW on the bench and row and still managing 5x5! You are recovering well for an oldie  (I can say that because I'm your age too )
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Your impresed, lol im suprised i can still walk after a workout :lol:, go for it Phil, us oldies have to stick together :thumb:  :thumb:

Get posting on here Phil, im finding the other guys on this thread keep me inspired :thumb:

To show how i squat if you look at the first pic in this thread: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211
I squat from the safety bar not the hooks, so start at the bottom position, i must admit the first rep is a complete sod!


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Get posting on here Phil, im finding the other guys on this thread keep me inspired :thumb:


Yep, I might start doing that. Currently I run a log over at IronStrong, but I could do one here too. Still working my way back up to my previous stats after a good 3 months off due to a tricep injury. I should be back on form in about 2 weeks.



ITHAQVA said:


> To show how i squat if you look at the first pic in this thread: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211
> I squat from the safety bar not the hooks, so start at the bottom position, i must admit the first rep is a complete sod!


Ah, I hadn't even thought about using the safetys - I imagined you wrestling the bar off the pins in a full squat position :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just to clarify on how I helped with improving my recovery: (for us old guys )

First 8 week phase: I followed the 5X5 as is (Squat 3 times a week, 5 sets of 5 reps). As the weight got heavier this became really hard & I found myself tired throughout the week.

Second 8 week phase: Reduced the squat to twice one week & once the following week & alternating between weeks 1 & 2. I also reduced sets from 5 to 3, but maintained aiming for 5 reps before adding more weight.

Example: 

Week 1 = Tuesday: Squat 3X5, Saturday: 3X5.
Week 2 Thursday: Squat 3X5.

Within a week of reducing my squat volume I noticed a huge difference in my overall energy & my squat is still increasing :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Yep, I might start doing that. Currently I run a log over at IronStrong, but I could do one here too. Still working my way back up to my previous stats after a good 3 months off due to a tricep injury. I should be back on form in about 2 weeks.
> 
> Ah, I hadn't even thought about using the safetys - I imagined you wrestling the bar off the pins in a full squat position :lol:


 :lol::lol::lol::lol:

Go for it Phil! :thumb:

I'll have a look at iron strong :thumb:

The first rep on squats is like trying to move a  Mountain


----------



## R0B

ITHAQVA , your coming along nicely sir, keep it up mate 

Back in gym tonight for me ,time to start getting busy, not trained properly since start December and i can see it now, look flat and motivation has gone to sh1t and ive got man flu 

Ah well no more excuses time to go hard or go home tonight , wish me luck :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

R0B said:


> ITHAQVA , your coming along nicely sir, keep it up mate
> 
> Back in gym tonight for me ,time to start getting busy, not trained properly since start December and i can see it now, look flat and motivation has gone to sh1t and ive got man flu
> 
> Ah well no more excuses time to go hard or go home tonight , wish me luck :lol:


Cheers for the support Rob:thumb:

Good to see your getting back into the gym Rob, you gotta HATE THOSE WEIGHTS MATE :devil: :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

JFYI lot of the russians and chinese try to avoid psyching themselves up for big weights, and train without any hype, reason being it drains the adrenal system and takes you longer to recover between workouts!


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> Sidewalk dance: Real nice lifting in the video. I would say your 3rd squat attemp is your lowest so really nice lift.
> 
> Nice deadlift form. How comes you Sumo deadlift, what do you think are the benefits. Only ask as I prefer Sumo but apparently they dont carry over to sport as well
> 
> Doug, Def start at the top


I just have better leverages for sumo deads, my 'sturdy' midsection makes it easier to sumo, plus my leg strength is better out wide. Always set up a pretty wide deadlift when I pulled conventional, so I just ended up migrating to sumo.

All three squats were good I thought. Even though I sunk that last one very deep, I still don't really subscribe to going any lower than I have to! Especially multiply! I was pretty pleased with the second, especially after losing my knee wrap in the hole.


----------



## Bod42

Week 2 Madcow Workout:
Box Squat: 70kg x 5, 80kg x 5, 95kg x 5, 112.5kg x 5, 130kg x 5
Bench press: 52.5kg, 65kg x 5, 77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 105kg x 5
Barbell Rows: 37.5kg x 5, 47.5kg x 5, 57.5kg x 5, 65kg x 5, 77.5kg x 5
Hyper Extensions and Abs.

Well squats didnt feel right tonight, most probably I didnt do my normal Eric Cressey warm up before the gym as I was in a hurry. 112.5kg felt really heavy tonight and it starts making you think when 87.5% of your working weight feels really heavy. When I got to my work weight, jesus it felt heavy unracking it but I grinded through all 5 reps.

Bench Press, my right shoulder was popping on every rep which hurt but this shows how important my warm up routine is. 

Barbell Rows, doing these the old school way instead of the Pendlay Rows I have been doing. These work your grip alot harder but the constant tension on the back feels good


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesdays Workout.

Felt shagged before i even started so pleased i did as well as i did 

*Deadlift: 155KG/341LB 1X5 :thumb:

Pull-ups 2¾/3, 2/3, 1¾/3

Upright Row: 50KG/110LB 5X5

20 mins cardio on the air walker.*

Im done lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.


----------



## Guest

I'll start copying my IronStrong log here from now on.

A little bit of background. Found StrongLifts and started lifting in Aug'10, using an "empty" bar (20kg), after several years of pretty much no exercise. 
I allowed work commitments (overseas travel) to get in the way and ended up stopping and re-starting a couple of times. 
Finally, in Sep'11 I pulled my right tricep pretty badly and could not lift at all. Took a few months off and started lifting again 4 weeks ago.
If my plan comes together I'll hit my previous 5RM PRs, acheived last Sept, at the end of next week.

Some stats. Age 43, height 185cm (6'1"), weight 95kg (209lbs / 14st 13lbs).
Previous 5RM PRs: Dead 125kg, Squat 100kg, Bench 65kg, Row 60kg, Press 45kg.

My log from tonight is as follows:

Missed yesterdays workout so combined the two into tonights session. Did 3x5 on all lifts because of this.

Squat: 85kg / 187lbs - 3x5
Bench: 57.5kg / 127lbs - 3x5
Row: 57.5kg / 127lbs - 3x5
Press: 37.5kg / 83lbs - 3x5
Dead: 110kg / 243lbs - 1x5
Chins: -30kg / -66lbs - 10/6/6

Squat felt heaver than expected on the first work set, though I still managed to push it up without issue. By the third set, it all felt comfortable again.
Bench and press gave some discomfort to my right tricep. Thinking about doing some soft tissue work to see if this helps.
Dead was fine apart from starting to reach the limit of my grip - I'll need to switch to a mixed grip fairly soon, I expect.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I'll start copying my IronStrong log here from now on.
> 
> A little bit of background. Found StrongLifts and started lifting in Aug'10, using an "empty" bar (20kg), after several years of pretty much no exercise.
> I allowed work commitments (overseas travel) to get in the way and ended up stopping and re-starting a couple of times.
> Finally, in Sep'11 I pulled my right tricep pretty badly and could not lift at all. Took a few months off and started lifting again 4 weeks ago.
> If my plan comes together I'll hit my previous 5RM PRs, acheived last Sept, at the end of next week.
> 
> Some stats. Age 43, height 185cm (6'1"), weight 95kg (209lbs / 14st 13lbs).
> Previous 5RM PRs: Dead 125kg, Squat 100kg, Bench 65kg, Row 60kg, Press 45kg.
> 
> My log from tonight is as follows:
> 
> Missed yesterdays workout so combined the two into tonights session. Did 3x5 on all lifts because of this.
> 
> Squat: 85kg / 187lbs - 3x5
> Bench: 57.5kg / 127lbs - 3x5
> Row: 57.5kg / 127lbs - 3x5
> Press: 37.5kg / 83lbs - 3x5
> Dead: 110kg / 243lbs - 1x5
> Chins: -30kg / -66lbs - 10/6/6
> 
> Squat felt heaver than expected on the first work set, though I still managed to push it up without issue. By the third set, it all felt comfortable again.
> Bench and press gave some discomfort to my right tricep. Thinking about doing some soft tissue work to see if this helps.
> Dead was fine apart from starting to reach the limit of my grip - I'll need to switch to a mixed grip fairly soon, I expect.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Welcome aboard Phil :thumb::thumb:

Good to see im not the only old git doing this .

I had to switch to mixed grip too, as soon as i did grippig became so much easier :thumb:


----------



## theshrew

How the hell are you fellas managing to bench so much ? 

Ive been watching some vids think im doing it correctly. I dont feel it in my chest only in my tri's I presume this should be the other way around ?


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> How the hell are you fellas managing to bench so much ?
> 
> Ive been watching some vids think im doing it correctly. I dont feel it in my chest only in my tri's I presume this should be the other way around ?


There are two main way to bench, bodybuilding style or powerlifting style. If i do powerlifting style the bar comes down on the lower part of my chest/upper stomach & i feel it in my triceps more, if the bar comes down on your upper chest youll feel it in your pecs, powerlifting style will allow you to lift more, unless your a supper strong animal.

Two vids to show you:










 :thumb:

Im like you i am not benching a lot yet, but hopefully within 12 months i will reach 150KG (its not a lot, but im 43, so im taking it very slowly, dont want to bugger up the old body  :thumb.

I personally bench as in Mark ripptoes vids (few pages back in this thread) with a slight arch in my back feet on the floor, as im not competing im not going for the full on powerlifting technique.


----------



## Bod42

I would never suggest doing the Bodybuilding style Bench Press unless you have perfect shoulders and I dont think they will be perfect for long if you do this. The Powerlifting style puts your lower arms at about 45 degrees to your body in the bottom position which is alot safer position for your shoulder.

Theshrew: Are you pulling your shoulder blades back and down before unracking the bar. People normally find that tis makes them more stable and so can put more force through the bar.

I cant upload the picture but Stronglift has a Bench Article with a picture of a guy holding a pen between his shoulder blades. This is what you should be doing whilst setting up. I find foot placement is person choice, some people like them under them, others further out. Just pick a position that feels good and makes you feel tight and stable.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I would never suggest doing the Bodybuilding style Bench Press unless you have perfect shoulders and I dont think they will be perfect for long if you do this. The Powerlifting style puts your lower arms at about 45 degrees to your body in the bottom position which is alot safer position for your shoulder.
> 
> Theshrew: Are you pulling your shoulder blades back and down before unracking the bar. People normally find that tis makes them more stable and so can put more force through the bar.
> 
> I cant upload the picture but Stronglift has a Bench Article with a picture of a guy holding a pen between his shoulder blades. This is what you should be doing whilst setting up. I find foot placement is person choice, some people like them under them, others further out. Just pick a position that feels good and makes you feel tight and stable.


I have to totally agree with James on this, Since starting the 5X5 I only train bench powerlifting style & will stay training that way, so + 1 :thumb:


----------



## Guest

In addition to all the above, a couple of other things to consider are consistency and time. 
If you are not consistent you'll end up like me after 18 months i.e. not very strong at all 
It also takes time to build strength, but keep at it and you will get there :thumb:


----------



## theshrew

Bod42 said:


> Theshrew: Are you pulling your shoulder blades back and down before unracking the bar. People normally find that tis makes them more stable and so can put more force through the bar.
> 
> I cant upload the picture but Stronglift has a Bench Article with a picture of a guy holding a pen between his shoulder blades. This is what you should be doing whilst setting up. I find foot placement is person choice, some people like them under them, others further out. Just pick a position that feels good and makes you feel tight and stable.


I will give that a pop then. One thing i have notied is that the bar seems to move about rather than up and down ( sometimes )with heavier weights. Maybe the shoulder thing will help with that.


----------



## JamesGarner

Chuffed with myself last night
I finally got 5x5 150 Kg dead-lifts 

was starting to struggle with grip on the last set again (use mixed grips)
put my wrist straps for the last set (normally use for doing traps)and managed the last set with reasonable ease 
think i also need to work on grip strength


----------



## ITHAQVA

JamesGarner said:


> Chuffed with myself last night
> I finally got 5x5 150 Kg dead-lifts
> 
> was starting to struggle with grip on the last set again (use mixed grips)
> put my wrist straps for the last set (normally use for doing traps)and managed the last set with reasonable ease
> think i also need to work on grip strength


Nice one James G :thumb:

I started using a mixed grip a few weeks ago & it made a huge difference to my deadlift :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

theshrew said:


> I will give that a pop then. One thing i have notied is that the bar seems to move about rather than up and down ( sometimes )with heavier weights. Maybe the shoulder thing will help with that.


How long have you been training free weights as most people struggle with stabalising the weight while lifting so when they push their hands go backwards/forwards and normally each hand is different. This means its technique. Its hard to say without seeing but one of the rugby guys had this problem even after quite a few months training so we started doing 3 sets of 12 rotary cuff exercises at the end of each Bench Workout and he started smashing the weight.

Basically you want 100% of your Strength/Power going into the bar and forcing it upwards. Any other movement and its wasted energy.

Also you could lower the weight and really work on technique.

JamesGarner: 5x5 on Deadlifts I bet that was a killer, I find it kills me doing 5 sets but working the weight up each set. nice work


----------



## Guest

JamesGarner said:


> Chuffed with myself last night
> I finally got 5x5 150 Kg dead-lifts


Nice lifting, especially at 5x5 :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Squat: 87.5kg / 193lbs - 3x5
Bench: 60kg / 132lbs - 5x5
Row: 60kg / 132lbs - 5x5
Dips: -30kg / -66lbs - 6x2
Chins: -30kg / -66lbs - 10/7/6

A little cool in my garage tonight - had numb toes by the end of the workout 
Right tricep ached again during the bench, which was tougher than expected - last couple of reps on the final set were a little hard.
All other lifts were fine.
Dip attachment for my power rack arrived, so gave it a try out tonight using my band for assistance.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> How long have you been training free weights as most people struggle with stabalising the weight while lifting so when they push their hands go backwards/forwards and normally each hand is different. This means its technique. Its hard to say without seeing but one of the rugby guys had this problem even after quite a few months training so we started doing 3 sets of 12 rotary cuff exercises at the end of each Bench Workout and he started smashing the weight.
> 
> Basically you want 100% of your Strength/Power going into the bar and forcing it upwards. Any other movement and its wasted energy.
> 
> Also you could lower the weight and really work on technique.
> 
> JamesGarner: 5x5 on Deadlifts I bet that was a killer, I find it kills me doing 5 sets but working the weight up each set. nice work


I had the same problem with stability as I had always trained with shorter bars, before these guys goaded me into a 7 footer , keep at it mate I think I was up to speed after about a month of WTF :doublesho:doublesho is going with my Bench, then slowly my technique improved & now I'm more focused on using my power in a more efficient line :thumb:, I recommend you view Mark ripptoes vids on YouTube showing you the mechanics of the main lifts :thumb:

5X5 on a deadlift! :doublesho, James your an animal :devil: I only do 1X5 on my max weight as per stronglifts advice.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Madcow Workout:
Box Squat:70kg x 5,80kg x 5,95kg x 5,112.5kg x 5, 132.5kg x 3, 100kg x 8
Bench press: 52.5kg,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 107.5kg x 3, 80kg x 8
BarbellRows: 40kg x 5,47.5kg x 5,57.5kg x 5,65kg x 5,80kg x 3, 60 x 8
Dips 3x8
Dumbell Curls 3x8

Last week i thought this workout was pretty easy as doing 2.5kg more weight but lowering the reps from 5 to 3 is quite easy. This week on the back off set of 8 I concentrated on completing the negative portion of the lift slower than usual and this really burned my muscle. I was pumped and exhausted after this workout. You know you trained hard when you have trouble scratching your face afterwards.

James, what is your weekly workout as 5x5 at 1150kg is impressive. I made some of my best gains ever squatting and deadlifting 5x5 in the same workout but then I only trained twice a week so got alot of recovery


----------



## Ryan_W

Thursday 2nd Feb - Back - ME

Deadlifts - 60kg x 10, 100kg x 3, 140kg x 5, 180kg x 5 x 4
T-Bar Rows - 60kg x 10, 100kg x 10, 120kg x 10 x 10
Widearm Pullups - 10, 10, 10
BORs - 100kg x 6 x 6 x 8
Lat Pulldown - 80kg x 8, 90kg x 8, 100kg x 8

Was seriously lethargic yesterday, wasn't feeling strong at all, but the deadlifts were pretty easy.

Squatting today, should be fun!

Ryan


----------



## theshrew

Bod42 said:


> How long have you been training free weights as most people struggle with stabalising the weight while lifting so when they push their hands go backwards/forwards and normally each hand is different. This means its technique. Its hard to say without seeing but one of the rugby guys had this problem even after quite a few months training so we started doing 3 sets of 12 rotary cuff exercises at the end of each Bench Workout and he started smashing the weight.
> 
> Basically you want 100% of your Strength/Power going into the bar and forcing it upwards. Any other movement and its wasted energy.
> 
> Also you could lower the weight and really work on technique.
> 
> JamesGarner: 5x5 on Deadlifts I bet that was a killer, I find it kills me doing 5 sets but working the weight up each set. nice work


Ive just started mate only done the bench press twice so far. Just used machines before that. I have a lot to learn it seems.

I always thought weights was a simple thing to do but when you get into it its far from simple


----------



## ITHAQVA

theshrew said:


> I always thought weights was a simple thing to do but when you get into it its far from simple


We are always learning, every time i log on here i learn ive got soooo far to go, onwards & upwards :thumb:


----------



## JamesGarner

Bod42 said:


> James, what is your weekly workout as 5x5 at 1150kg is impressive. I made some of my best gains ever squatting and deadlifting 5x5 in the same workout but then I only trained twice a week so got alot of recovery


I only dead lift once a week on legs night
I normally do 20 min cardio before then warm up with 3-5 reps at 90kg ish
Then try and do 5x5 at full weight

Might give it a try doing 5 sets but start lighter and try and Finnish hevier


----------



## Bod42

theshrew said:


> Ive just started mate only done the bench press twice so far. Just used machines before that. I have a lot to learn it seems.
> 
> I always thought weights was a simple thing to do but when you get into it its far from simple


That's why I love weightlifting as your constantly learning. Just rememer that free weights are superiors 2machine.

If that was only your second time i would say your stabaliser muscles aren't used to it. Give it a few weeks and it feel completely different


----------



## Bod42

JamesGarner said:


> I only dead lift once a week on legs night
> I normally do 20 min cardio before then warm up with 3-5 reps at 90kg ish
> Then try and do 5x5 at full weight
> 
> Might give it a try doing 5 sets but start lighter and try and Finnish hevier


Still nice work which ever workout you do. My next workout will probably b squatting and deadlifting once a week as 5x5 at higher weights really smashed your body but then you got an entire week to recover. With stronglift you only have2days. It's getting the balance between work and recovery correct.

I say if its not broken don't change it so if your making gains I wouldn't worry to much but tthats an option in the future


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturdays Workout.

*Bench Press: 110KG/242LB 1X2 (Just wanted to try the weight ) :thumb:

Bench Press: 105KG/231LB 5X4 :thumb:

Squat: 155KG/341LB 3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 97.5KG/214.5LB 5X5* :thumb:

Squat:
Squatting from the top position felt really unnerving & getting my feet positioned right was harder than normal with the weight on my back rather than as before, under the bar at the bottom position. Considering I have never squatted from the top position I was happy with the results.

Overall, the old man is very pleased with today's workout & totally shagged out!


----------



## Bod42

Your weights are looking impressive Bud. Especially liking the 155kg squat and cant wait until I get back up to that sort of weight. Nice Work


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Your weights are looking impressive Bud. Especially liking the 155kg squat and cant wait until I get back up to that sort of weight. Nice Work


Thanks James :thumb::thumb: Believe me, it is hard work, but very rewarding :devil: :thumb:

I will stick to the 5X5 with lower squat volume for as long as I can, or as long as my old body will cope with .
I've been a bit lame & missed two training session already in this phase , loose one more & I'll have to add another week at the end of the phase to make up for it :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'll be straight back into full gear today - a few light singles at 225kg (believe me, in gear, these will FLY). 

Gradually upping the percentages over the next few weeks. Can't wait to compete again, going to be a HUGE meet. We've got lifters coming from Russia, Czech Republic, Hungary (even though he lives local!) and Ireland.

Looking forward to it. 10 weeks out.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I'll be straight back into full gear today - a few light singles at 225kg (believe me, in gear, these will FLY).
> 
> Gradually upping the percentages over the next few weeks. Can't wait to compete again, going to be a HUGE meet. We've got lifters coming from Russia, Czech Republic, Hungary (even though he lives local!) and Ireland.
> 
> Looking forward to it. 10 weeks out.


I'm really tempted to get to one of these meets this year Dan, would be nice to see the real deal, im sure it would also be very inspirational for me :thumb:

This thread has had 9,454 views WTF!!!! :doublesho

Very best of luck for your next comp mate :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Not sure where you're based, but the next meet i'm doing is April 14th in Folkestone. Can post more details if you want?


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Not sure where you're based, but the next meet i'm doing is April 14th in Folkestone. Can post more details if you want?


Im in Cornwall. 

Folkestone is a bit far


----------



## sidewalkdances

I think all the comps will be a bit far then mate. There is one in Wales in a few weeks though if thats any better.

I have to go down to Truro for work soon.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I have to go down to Truro for work soon.


How long mate, will you be staying in Cornwall?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Its in the near future, some time this month for definite. Will be a splash and dash, 6 hour drive to set up a stand and then drive home again! Will probably stay down there though, not doing 12 hours driving in a day if I can help it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Its in the near future, some time this month for definite. Will be a splash and dash, 6 hour drive to set up a stand and then drive home again! Will probably stay down there though, not doing 12 hours driving in a day if I can help it.


Never mind mate, if youre in area another time give us a shout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Nice.*

Tuesday's Workout

*Deadlift: 157.5KG/346.5LB

Pull-ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3.

Close Grip Bench Press: 80KG/176LB*

All good 

Have removed upright rows & incorporated the Close Grip Bench Press & started at a nice low weight to get the feel of the movement back. Once happy I'll start adding 2.5KG every time I reach a full 5X5.

Felt really strong in the deadlift, I know I can lift a lot more, but I'm keeping disciplined & will stick to 2.5KG every time 5 reps achieved. At my age I feel I should continue to take the slow route & always leave my ego at the door as I walk into my gym room :thumb:

With the pull-ups I'm initially aiming for 5 reps per set so as above if you see 3/2, I've achieved 3 positive reps & finished with 2 negative reps to complete 5 reps.
Once I get a full 3 X 5 positive reps I'll add another set & keep doing this until I get 5 sets of 5 positive reps, then possibly add more reps or attach weight plates to my body for extra resistance :thumb:

Time for the old man to rest


----------



## mark328

ITHAQVA said:


> Tuesday's Workout
> 
> *Deadlift: 157.5KG/346.5LB
> 
> Pull-ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3.
> 
> Close Grip Bench Press: 80KG/176LB*
> 
> All good
> 
> Have removed upright rows & incorporated the Close Grip Bench Press & started at a nice low weight to get the feel of the movement back. Once happy I'll start adding 2.5KG every time I reach a full 5X5.
> 
> Felt really strong in the deadlift, I know I can lift a lot more, but I'm keeping disciplined & will stick to 2.5KG every time 5 reps achieved. At my age I feel I should continue to take the slow route & always leave my ego at the door as I walk into my gym room :thumb:
> 
> With the pull-ups I'm initially aiming for 5 reps per set so as above if you see 3/2, I've achieved 3 positive reps & finished with 2 negative reps to complete 5 reps.
> Once I get a full 3 X 5 positive reps I'll add another set & keep doing this until I get 5 sets of 5 positive reps, then possibly add more reps or attach weight plates to my body for extra resistance :thumb:
> 
> Time for the old man to rest


Well done for your results. The one thing I would say though is that the moment you change ANYTHING in the program it is no longer "Stronglift 5 x 5". The exercises in SL 5 x 5 are there for a reason, ie FULL BODY workout, as the author himself states "if you change anything it is no longer SL 5 x 5.

Im not taking anything away from you, you are doing very well, but just believe that if people want to follow SL 5 x 5 ( as I am at present) then they need to understand that they cant chop and change the exercises in the workouts "A" and "B" or it no longer becomes the "program".

Hope I havent offended you.


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> Well done for your results. The one thing I would say though is that the moment you change ANYTHING in the program it is no longer "Stronglift 5 x 5". The exercises in SL 5 x 5 are there for a reason, ie FULL BODY workout, as the author himself states "if you change anything it is no longer SL 5 x 5.
> 
> Im not taking anything away from you, you are doing very well, but just believe that if people want to follow SL 5 x 5 ( as I am at present) then they need to understand that they cant chop and change the exercises in the workouts "A" and "B" or it no longer becomes the "program".
> 
> Hope I havent offended you.


No worries Mark,
The main reason i am not following the 5X5 to the book is an old injury that stops me lifting anything over 60KG on the Overhead press without some pain in my upper left arm, until it repairs :devil:. That's why I'm experimenting for alternative upper body multi joint exercises.

So far I have concluded my main upper body exercises that will be incorporated are:

Close grip bench press.
Dips.
Pull-ups & chin-ups.

Also due to my age after doing the first 8 weeks i found reducing my squat to once one week & twice the following has vastly improved my recovery & to be honest my legs are getting too big for conventional jeans. My legs & calves have always been strong & I take very little training for results 

So yes, I have moved on from the stronglifts 5X5. Having trained for many years I have learnt to listen to my body, experiment & diversify my training when needed, but stick to the fundamentals where possible.

My pull ups will soon be 5 sets & the close grip bench press is a great multi joint exercise, which I plan to alternate between dips, to help my Bench press :thumb:

As for offended, are you mad, I'm getting stronger & stronger & I'm 43 years old, so whatever I'm doing works, I'm over the Moon. I don't use any supplements, just eat good nutritionally dense whole foods, I feel like I'm 20 & I rock!


----------



## mark328

ITHAQVA said:


> No worries Mark,
> The main reason i am not following the 5X5 to the book is an old injury that stops me lifting anything over 60KG on the Overhead press without some pain in my upper left arm, until it repairs :devil:. That's why I'm experimenting for alternative upper body multi joint exercises.
> 
> So far I have concluded my main upper body exercises that will be incorporated are:
> 
> Close grip bench press.
> Dips.
> Pull-ups & chin-ups.
> 
> Also due to my age after doing the first 8 weeks i found reducing my squat to once one week & twice the following has vastly improved my recovery & to be honest my legs are getting too big for conventional jeans. My legs & calves have always been strong & I take very little training for results
> 
> So yes, I have moved on from the stronglifts 5X5. Having trained for many years I have learnt to listen to my body, experiment & diversify my training when needed, but stick to the fundamentals where possible.
> 
> My pull ups will soon be 5 sets & the close grip bench press is a great multi joint exercise, which I plan to alternate between dips, to help my Bench press :thumb:
> 
> As for offended, are you mad, I'm getting stronger & stronger & I'm 43 years old, so whatever I'm doing works, I'm over the Moon. I don't use any supplements, just eat good nutritionally dense whole foods, I feel like I'm 20 & I rock!


Thanks, its great you are achiveing your goals, genuinely pleased for you. Ive been training on and off for 5 years and got stuck with the 3x8 routine, getting nowhere fast.

Ill admit in those 5 years i have never squatted or deadlifted and with only being in Wk3 of 5 x 5 i can already feel my legs responding, which is great.

Ive only started at very low weight and i know its going to take at least 3 months @2.5kg per workout to put me anywhere near what i know im capable of, but im happy to just get the form right 1st, i thought i knew how to Bench but after dropping the weight and looking at videos/researching internet ive been sooo wrong.

Im really looking forward to the next 3 months and especially the legs.

p.s If it wasnt for this thread i wouldnt of googled "5x5" and would be prob still be doing 3 x 8 so THANK YOU :thumb::thumb::thumb:


----------



## Guest

Wimping out tonight . It's -6 in the garage, the weights can wait


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Wimping out tonight . It's -6 in the garage, the weights can wait


-6 :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

mark328 said:


> Thanks, its great you are achiveing your goals, genuinely pleased for you. Ive been training on and off for 5 years and got stuck with the 3x8 routine, getting nowhere fast.
> 
> Ill admit in those 5 years i have never squatted or deadlifted and with only being in Wk3 of 5 x 5 i can already feel my legs responding, which is great.
> 
> Ive only started at very low weight and i know its going to take at least 3 months @2.5kg per workout to put me anywhere near what i know im capable of, but im happy to just get the form right 1st, i thought i knew how to Bench but after dropping the weight and looking at videos/researching internet ive been sooo wrong.
> 
> Im really looking forward to the next 3 months and especially the legs.
> 
> p.s If it wasnt for this thread i wouldnt of googled "5x5" and would be prob still be doing 3 x 8 so THANK YOU :thumb::thumb::thumb:


You should join us here Mark & post your workouts, the more the merrier  :thumb:


----------



## mark328

ITHAQVA said:


> You should join us here Mark & post your workouts, the more the merrier  :thumb:


I think I will, what the hell.

My weights are low obvioulsy as i started with:

Squat - 20kg ( Empty Bar as never squated in my life !)
Bench - 37.5kg ( 50% of usual as Empty Bar per program TOO low! )
Rows - 30kg ( Starting Point as per program )
Overhead Press - 20kg ( Empty Bar as per program )
Deads - 45kg (Starting Point as per program )

Im only in week 3 so tonight:

Squat - 35kg
Bench - 47.5kg
Rows - 37.5kg

I think i might add 5kg per workout on Squats and Bench for say 4 weeks, thn back to 2.5kg as im currently projecting the following after 12wks ( 36 workouts) @ 2.5kg per session.

Squat - 105kg
Bench - 82.5kg
Rows - 72.5kg
O/H Press - 62.5kg
Deads - 130kg

Im happy with 2.5kg for Rows/Press and the recommended 5kg per Deadlift, but Squats/Bench I feel I could handle 5kg instead of the 2.5kg for 1 month.

Oh well, i let you know what I decided !!


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow Workout:
Box Squat:70kg x 5,80kg x 5,95kg x 5,112.5kg x 5, 132.5kg x 5
Bench press: 52.5kg,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 107.5kg x 5
Barbell Rows: 40kg x 5,47.5kg x 5,57.5kg x 5,65kg x 5,80kg x 5

This workout should have been Monday but had to work long hours so havent had time for te gym. I know I'm the first person to say anyone can make time but hey do as I say not as I do :thumb:

Had to really grind the squats out today but Im just going to keep grinding over the next few weeks as I never thought I would get 5 reps. Form seems to be improving and Im not doing a good morning out of the bottom and my shoulder isnt hurting one bit now during squats so my body has got used to low bar squatting.

Bench Press was pretty easy at this weight. I think dips on fridays may be helping but then Im not pushing them hard so who knows.

Barbell Rows, my back has loads more strength but my grip is starting to give out. Have to add back in extra grip work again.

I really need to start smashing the gym 3 times a week and not missing sessions, I missed Wednesdays workout 2 weeks in a row now and I seem to be going twice a week most weeks now which is not good enough. I'm getting to work early on Monday, Wednesday, Friday from now on so I can leave early and hit the gym befre the Mrs gets home.


----------



## Bod42

mark328 said:


> I think I will, what the hell.
> 
> My weights are low obvioulsy as i started with:
> 
> Squat - 20kg ( Empty Bar as never squated in my life !)
> Bench - 37.5kg ( 50% of usual as Empty Bar per program TOO low! )
> Rows - 30kg ( Starting Point as per program )
> Overhead Press - 20kg ( Empty Bar as per program )
> Deads - 45kg (Starting Point as per program )
> 
> Im only in week 3 so tonight:
> 
> Squat - 35kg
> Bench - 47.5kg
> Rows - 37.5kg
> 
> I think i might add 5kg per workout on Squats and Bench for say 4 weeks, thn back to 2.5kg as im currently projecting the following after 12wks ( 36 workouts) @ 2.5kg per session.
> 
> Squat - 105kg
> Bench - 82.5kg
> Rows - 72.5kg
> O/H Press - 62.5kg
> Deads - 130kg
> 
> Im happy with 2.5kg for Rows/Press and the recommended 5kg per Deadlift, but Squats/Bench I feel I could handle 5kg instead of the 2.5kg for 1 month.
> 
> Oh well, i let you know what I decided !!


Slow and Steady is really the goal with Stronglift. If your moving the weight with 100% force then training with lighter weight will still make you grow and get stronger. If you do 5kg for a month your weight in 12weeks will be:

Squats: 20.0kg + 60kg(5x12)+60kg(2.5x24) = 140 kg
Bench - 37.5kg + 30kg(5x6)+30kg(2.5x12) = 97.5kg

You may be able to pull these numbers off but I dont know many people who could with just 3 months of training. If you can nicely done though :thumb:

5x5 program have been around since weight lifting began and there are thousands of variations. Doug is doing his own custom 5x5 program. Stronglift is just a custom 5x5 program but your right you cant call it Stronglift unless your doing exactly as he outlines.

Congratulations on finding 5x5, your miles ahead of 99% of gym goers in the world just by getting this far.



ITHAQVA said:


> Tuesday's Workout
> 
> *Deadlift: 157.5KG/346.5LB
> 
> Pull-ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3.
> 
> Close Grip Bench Press: 80KG/176LB*
> 
> All good
> 
> Have removed upright rows & incorporated the Close Grip Bench Press & started at a nice low weight to get the feel of the movement back. Once happy I'll start adding 2.5KG every time I reach a full 5X5.
> 
> Felt really strong in the deadlift, I know I can lift a lot more, but I'm keeping disciplined & will stick to 2.5KG every time 5 reps achieved. At my age I feel I should continue to take the slow route & always leave my ego at the door as I walk into my gym room :thumb:
> 
> With the pull-ups I'm initially aiming for 5 reps per set so as above if you see 3/2, I've achieved 3 positive reps & finished with 2 negative reps to complete 5 reps.
> Once I get a full 3 X 5 positive reps I'll add another set & keep doing this until I get 5 sets of 5 positive reps, then possibly add more reps or attach weight plates to my body for extra resistance :thumb:
> 
> Time for the old man to rest


Awesome Deadlft there mate, makes me want to smash mine now as Im falling behind.

Your getting there on Pull Ups Mate, I started with 10 sets of 1 rep when we started this thread and did 6 reps last night so keep it up ate.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> The main reason i am not following the 5X5 to the book is an old injury that stops me lifting anything over 60KG on the Overhead press without some pain in my upper left arm, until it repairs :devil:. That's why I'm experimenting for alternative upper body multi joint exercises.


Doug, have you seen Alwyn Cosgrove 8 weeks to Monsterous Shoulder Program reconmended by Harry Selkow on Elitefts. I do the first 3 exercise Giant Set after each Bench Session and I must say my shoulder is the best its been in a while, not sure if its that program but it does seriously work the shoulders while your doing the exercises.


----------



## Guest

Wimped out yesterday due to it being -6°C (21°F) in my garage last night. It was a little warmer tonight so I'm back at the weights.

Squat: 90kg / 198lbs - 3x5
Press: 40kg / 88lbs - 5x5
Dead: 115kg / 254lbs - 1x5
Chins: -30kg / -66lbs - 12/10/7 (Resistance band assisted)
Dips: -30kg / -66lbs - 5x3 (Resistance band assisted)

Was a little worried that this might have been a tough session due to almost a week off. Fortunately, while the weights felt a little heavy, everything moved ok.
I actually remembered to use the stretch reflex on the squat tonight, rather than come to a dead stop at the bottom.
Pleased with my progress on the chins - I'll start adding weight soon and progress towards BW.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Madcow Workout:
> Box Squat:70kg x 5,80kg x 5,95kg x 5,112.5kg x 5, 132.5kg x 5
> Bench press: 52.5kg,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 107.5kg x 5
> Barbell Rows: 40kg x 5,47.5kg x 5,57.5kg x 5,65kg x 5,80kg x 5
> 
> This workout should have been Monday but had to work long hours so havent had time for te gym. I know I'm the first person to say anyone can make time but hey do as I say not as I do :thumb:
> 
> Had to really grind the squats out today but Im just going to keep grinding over the next few weeks as I never thought I would get 5 reps. Form seems to be improving and Im not doing a good morning out of the bottom and my shoulder isnt hurting one bit now during squats so my body has got used to low bar squatting.
> 
> Bench Press was pretty easy at this weight. I think dips on fridays may be helping but then Im not pushing them hard so who knows.
> 
> Barbell Rows, my back has loads more strength but my grip is starting to give out. Have to add back in extra grip work again.
> 
> I really need to start smashing the gym 3 times a week and not missing sessions, I missed Wednesdays workout 2 weeks in a row now and I seem to be going twice a week most weeks now which is not good enough. I'm getting to work early on Monday, Wednesday, Friday from now on so I can leave early and hit the gym befre the Mrs gets home.


Don't worry too much James, I've missed two session too, I hate training while the weather is cold, however when I do miss sessions I add them to the 8 week phase example: if I miss one more sessions that will make three training days missed so I train for 9 weeks instead of 8 then take my week off :thumb:

Don't let a little lull put you off, a few missed workouts here & there is no big deal.

If I'm feeling really off & I'm really too busy to train for a spell I do loads of warm ups & just do one set of 5 reps max weight, that way you keep the most of your strength & motivation when you start up again.

Still a mighty fine workout mate :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, have you seen Alwyn Cosgrove 8 weeks to Monsterous Shoulder Program reconmended by Harry Selkow on Elitefts. I do the first 3 exercise Giant Set after each Bench Session and I must say my shoulder is the best its been in a while, not sure if its that program but it does seriously work the shoulders while your doing the exercises.


Cheers James I'll check out elitefts (its already in my favorites ) :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Slow and Steady is really the goal with Stronglift. If your moving the weight with 100% force then training with lighter weight will still make you grow and get stronger. If you do 5kg for a month your weight in 12weeks will be:
> 
> Squats: 20.0kg + 60kg(5x12)+60kg(2.5x24) = 140 kg
> Bench - 37.5kg + 30kg(5x6)+30kg(2.5x12) = 97.5kg
> 
> You may be able to pull these numbers off but I dont know many people who could with just 3 months of training. If you can nicely done though :thumb:
> 
> 5x5 program have been around since weight lifting began and there are thousands of variations. Doug is doing his own custom 5x5 program. Stronglift is just a custom 5x5 program but your right you cant call it Stronglift unless your doing exactly as he outlines.
> 
> Congratulations on finding 5x5, your miles ahead of 99% of gym goers in the world just by getting this far.
> 
> Awesome Deadlft there mate, makes me want to smash mine now as Im falling behind.
> 
> Your getting there on Pull Ups Mate, I started with 10 sets of 1 rep when we started this thread and did 6 reps last night so keep it up ate.


Cheers James, Deadlift still doesn't feel bone crunching heavy...yet , really funny though you can see the knurl of the bar on my hands after the lift :doublesho 

Yep as James states, I'm doing my own variation of the 5X5 so for all newcomers to this thread please be aware I'm not using the stronglift 5X5 anymore, I will settle down soon as I'm almost complete with my core exercise list that I will be using.

Thanks for the support on the pull ups :thumb:, im over 16 stone so it really is difficult, but as elitefts put it, once I get to doing several sets of around 8-10 reps I'LL BE JACKED!!! :lol: Or the old man will break something trying lol  :doublesho

I hope this thread & the group on it keep training & keep up what we have started, hurrah for us! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Wimped out yesterday due to it being -6°C (21°F) in my garage last night. It was a little warmer tonight so I'm back at the weights.
> 
> Squat: 90kg / 198lbs - 3x5
> Press: 40kg / 88lbs - 5x5
> Dead: 115kg / 254lbs - 1x5
> Chins: -30kg / -66lbs - 12/10/7 (Resistance band assisted)
> Dips: -30kg / -66lbs - 5x3 (Resistance band assisted)
> 
> Was a little worried that this might have been a tough session due to almost a week off. Fortunately, while the weights felt a little heavy, everything moved ok.
> I actually remembered to use the stretch reflex on the squat tonight, rather than come to a dead stop at the bottom.
> leased with my progress on the chins - I'll start adding weight soon and progress towards BW. *EDIT BY DOUG this doesnt mean Body Wrap *
> Cheers,
> Phil


Keep going Phil!!!!! Your weights are increasing my good man :thumb:

I hate training in the cold too :thumb:


----------



## mark328

Bod42 said:


> Slow and Steady is really the goal with Stronglift. If your moving the weight with 100% force then training with lighter weight will still make you grow and get stronger. If you do 5kg for a month your weight in 12weeks will be:
> 
> Squats: 20.0kg + 60kg(5x12)+60kg(2.5x24) = 140 kg
> Bench - 37.5kg + 30kg(5x6)+30kg(2.5x12) = 97.5kg
> 
> You may be able to pull these numbers off but I dont know many people who could with just 3 months of training. If you can nicely done though :thumb:
> 
> 5x5 program have been around since weight lifting began and there are thousands of variations. Doug is doing his own custom 5x5 program. Stronglift is just a custom 5x5 program but your right you cant call it Stronglift unless your doing exactly as he outlines.
> 
> Congratulations on finding 5x5, your miles ahead of 99% of gym goers in the world just by getting this far.
> 
> Awesome Deadlft there mate, makes me want to smash mine now as Im falling behind.
> 
> Your getting there on Pull Ups Mate, I started with 10 sets of 1 rep when we started this thread and did 6 reps last night so keep it up ate.


Cheers Bod42.

Yeah given those projections of yours, i dont want to stall after say 2.5mths or worse 2mths. I think ill just stick with my 2.5kg.

One thing that is driving me nuts is ( as ive never squatted before ) is the different way to do them, ive been following Ripptoes videos, now i hear that there is a better way to do them, whos the best to give advice video wise guys?


----------



## Bod42

mark328 said:


> Cheers Bod42.
> 
> Yeah given those projections of yours, i dont want to stall after say 2.5mths or worse 2mths. I think ill just stick with my 2.5kg.
> 
> One thing that is driving me nuts is ( as ive never squatted before ) is the different way to do them, ive been following Ripptoes videos, now i hear that there is a better way to do them, whos the best to give advice video wise guys?


I think Rippletoe is pretty good to listen to. You can listen to people like Dave Tate and Jim Wendler but they are Powerlifters so they squat differently. There arent really that many ways to squat, its hard to help without seeing your squat but basics are,

squat back not down, your knees can go forward but not to much, 
push through your heels to activate your posterior chain more,
make sure your knees are tracking straight over your feet, 
arch the upper back hard, this one especially good as alot of people try to stop their lower back rounding but the spine is actually an S shape which means if the upper back is arched the lower back cannot round.
Find 2 or 3 word clues that help you, I have problems with my knees bowing inwards slightly when I hit my sticking point and always read to push your knees out but this didnt work so i imaging spliting the floor apart with my feet and pushing through the outside part of my foot. Its the same with any sport find clues that work for you.

If really worried mate post a vid up, theres some really strong, knowledgeable people on here and everyone is only here to help.

Also you may read the arguements between high bar squatting and low bar squatting. I would personally pick one that feels the most comfy and stick with that. I read and been told that you have to low bar squat as this carries over to sport whereas high bar doesnt. What a load of S**T, these people rally think if someone is squatting 200kg high bar thats not going to make them strong at sports.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I think Rippletoe is pretty good to listen to. You can listen to people like Dave Tate and Jim Wendler but they are Powerlifters so they squat differently. There arent really that many ways to squat, its hard to help without seeing your squat but basics are,
> 
> squat back not down, your knees can go forward but not to much,
> push through your heels to activate your posterior chain more,
> make sure your knees are tracking straight over your feet,
> arch the upper back hard, this one especially good as alot of people try to stop their lower back rounding but the spine is actually an S shape which means if the upper back is arched the lower back cannot round.
> Find 2 or 3 word clues that help you, I have problems with my knees bowing inwards slightly when I hit my sticking point and always read to push your knees out but this didnt work so i imaging spliting the floor apart with my feet
> and pushing through the outside part of my foot. Its the same with any sport find clues that work for you.
> 
> If really worried mate post a vid up, theres some really strong, knowledgeable people on here and everyone is only here to help.
> 
> Also you may read the arguements between high bar squatting and low bar squatting. I would personally pick one that feels the most comfy and stick with that. I read and been told that you have to low bar squat as this carries over to sport whereas high bar doesnt. What a load of S**T, these people rally think if someone is squatting 200kg high bar thats not going to make them strong at sports.


I'm with James on this, Mark Ripptoes Vids are great & they helped improve how my squat felt, safety/ comfort, also helped make my line of power delivery more efficient.
I squat low bar styleeee as it suites my build & just feels right/safe/comfortable, you need to find what works for you. Think about making the lift efficient & safe. Listen to your body :thumb:

Watch Mr Ripptoes vids over a few times & watch more before training, learn to feel how the lift should be executed if possible.

Agree also with James, if you can squat 200KG no matter if it's a low or high bar, in my books, you da man! :devil::devil: 
End of the day I want to lift heavy, I couldn't give a monkeys about carry over to other sports, I cant see my powerlifting helping my sports, 20-30 minutes on the crosstrainer & ..screwing!!! lol. 

Powerlifting IS my sport  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Madcow Workout:
Box Squat:70kg x 5,80kg x 5,95kg x 5,112.5kg x 5, 135kg x 3, 100kg x 8
Bench press: 52.5kg,65kg x 5,77.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 110kg x 3, 80kg x 8
BarbellRows: 40kg x 5,47.5kg x 5,57.5kg x 5,65kg x 5,82.5kg x 3, 60 x 8
Dips 3x10
Dumbell Curls 3x8

I didnt really like this workout when I first started but the friday workout feels really good. I never liked back off sets but they do seem to work really well.

My squat form felt the best it has since I started lifting again, my warm up sets felt perfect.

Bench was another story and you know its not going to be a good day when you have to try unracking your first warm up set twice as you couldnt move it the first time. Every warm up set felt heavy and my shoulder was clicking again so not the best bench day but still got my 3 reps.

Rows are feeling better each week i do them, completely difference feeling from Pendlay rows.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> End of the day I want to lift heavy, I couldn't give a monkeys about carry over to other sports, I cant see my powerlifting helping my sports, 20-30 minutes on the crosstrainer & ..*screwing*!!! lol.
> 
> Powerlifting IS my sport  :thumb:


Not before hitting the gym, may take away squat strength. Made the mistake the other night :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

bod42 said:


> not before hitting the gym, may take away squat strength. Made the mistake the other night :devil:


:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Very Poor week for training, all out of sync.

Managed to do my bench, ran out of energy for the squat & moved on to the barbell row.

*Bench Press: 105KG/231LB 5,5,5,3,3 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 100GK/220LB 5X5 :thumb: (felt easy )*

I think Dan (sidewalk) said I'm training too much in one session for someone who is not in competition & today highlighted this, I will stick with it for a little while and then perhaps do squats/legs on their own day.

*I don't really want to move to training each body part once a week as I feel my weights are no way heavy enough to justify that, opinions please guys?*

However, I won't be too disheartened by this as I have always found that the coldest part of the year, (now), always affects my training & motivation. I will call it a day this week & resume play next week, onward & upward  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

The ITHAQVA Method ©  Dont ya just love the internet, you can make any old bullll**** up  

Had a bit of a read & have come up with this as a very possible alternative to the workout I'm presently doing :thumb:

I've based the below on the book (5/3/1 Jim Wendler©) I have used his formula to work out the estimated 1 rep max & 65%, 75% max weights for 5 reps.

Why is there the possibility of calf raises on squat day? Well, i don't want my legs to grow out of proportion & end up with large thighs & skinny little calves, although at the moment the missus thinks I got COWS not calves :thumb: 

One thing that does appeal to me is there is only one set to max out on, I believe it will help me maintain focus/motivation & I also hope this will give better strength gains as I am finding it increasingly difficult to do 5 sets of 5 reps on bench & even 3 sets of 5 reps on the squat. Give the old man some slack guys 

I don't intend to follow the 5/3/1 methodology, I would do the below over 8 week phases with a week off, as long as the last heaviest set allows me to keep striving for 5 reps then add 2.5KG I'm ok, although I do like the idea of trying to max positive reps (But not failure) as per (5/3/1 Jim Wendler©)

I have just made this up out thin air I tell ya & stole from other wiser men & their powerlifting bibles, looks good on paper, comments opinions please guys.

*Sunday

Squat Estimated 1RM 180KG 
65% 117 KG_____
75% 135 KG_____
157.5 KG_____

Will possibly add Calf Raise, 80% max KG _____ KG_____ KG_____

Monday

Deadlift Estimated 1RM 180KG 
65% 117 KG_____
75% 135 KG_____
157.5 KG_____

Wednesday

Bench Press Estimated 1RM 123KG
65% 80 KG_____
75% 93 KG_____
107.5 KG_____

Dips _____ _____ _____

Thursday

Barbell Row Estimated 1RM 116KG
65% 76 KG_____
75% 87 KG_____
100 KG_____

Pull-ups _____ _____ _____*

Overhead/military press will be added once i feel able to train without any pain & the exercises will be moved around accordingly :thumb:

*Edit, i havent included the warm up sets I normaly do, 5 sets 5 reps etc..*


----------



## Bod42

Hey Bud, Im going to change to 5/3/1 eventually but dont feel im strong enough yet and feel like I need to hit each body part more than once a week. Ya 15 sets of 5 per workout and every set at 100% is a hard workout not only physically but mentally as well.

The madcow workout im doing is pretty similar to your workout you listed above, take the first 2 sets off my workout which are 50% & 62.5% so they are pretty much warm up sets and its very similar to yours. I must set I wasnt feeling the workout when I first started but now its really good. Having my warm ups set in stone, I actually find really good as some days your first warm up set feels really nasty and the extra sets really help warm up before hitting your maximum weight.

I must say 1 all out set is so much easier mentally to just smash as you know if you get just that one weight next week you can move up. Look at it this way, Im doing Squats, Bench and Bent Over Rows in one workout just like I was on Stronglift but I used to smash the weight 15 times, now I only do 3 maximum sets


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Hey Bud, Im going to change to 5/3/1 eventually but dont feel im strong enough yet and feel like I need to hit each body part more than once a week. Ya 15 sets of 5 per workout and every set at 100% is a hard workout not only physically but mentally as well.
> 
> The madcow workout im doing is pretty similar to your workout you listed above, take the first 2 sets off my workout which are 50% & 62.5% so they are pretty much warm up sets and its very similar to yours. I must set I wasnt feeling the workout when I first started but now its really good. Having my warm ups set in stone, I actually find really good as some days your first warm up set feels really nasty and the extra sets really help warm up before hitting your maximum weight.
> 
> I must say 1 all out set is so much easier mentally to just smash as you know if you get just that one weight next week you can move up. Look at it this way, Im doing Squats, Bench and Bent Over Rows in one workout just like I was on Stronglift but I used to smash the weight 15 times, now I only do 3 maximum sets


Agreed mate, I am finding it hard to max on every set the heavier the weights become. This may even be holding me back from making even better strength gains :thumb:

I'm going to reduce my Bench Press on my current workout to 3 sets of 5 reps & see how i go, if after a few weeks I'm still struggling I will change to the above: ITHAQVA method ©™ 

Will also try another workout this morning before washing the car :detailer: :doublesho, to make up for at least one of missed workouts this phase, wish me luck, this will bring my missed total to only two sessions :thumb:  This will still give me the rest of the day/night & all of Monday to recover, hopefully


----------



## Guest

Doug, why not drop to 3x5 on all lifts? I found that to help me massively last time around.
In my experience, it kept the workouts shorter, allowed me to recover more and feel stronger on the next session and most of all, as James says above, was not so mentally taxing.

Also, as I understand it, there is actually little strength benefit from doing 5x5 over 3x5. It's really more to do with muscle memory and programming the correct movement for each lift earlier on.
I do wonder at this though because as the weights go up, and keep going up, I've found myself and read of others having to alter their technique, even long past 5x5. 

There is a reason that Mark Rippetoe uses 3x5 - I'll pick up a copy of Practical Programming one day to find out why .

I've also read an interesting critique of StrongLifts saying that the deload process at 5x5 is more to do with fatigued muscles rather than hitting a stength plateau.
Eventually you drop to 3x5, which then becomes very similar to Rippetoe's SS routine.
Finally, you are supposed to drop to 1x5. However, I'm reading that switching to Madcow is better at this point (and many people actually do this). Apparently, 1x5 with the SL warmup process is not effective enough - Madcow with it's proper ramped sets, all at 5 reps, is. I still don't know enough to be certain but I'm starting to change my view on the wisdom of SL.

Final though - 5/3/1 looks at monthly gains. You will be switching from a program that attempts to provide gains on a workout by workout basis. You might want to look at something like Madcow which is based on weekly gains.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Not before hitting the gym, may take away squat strength. Made the mistake the other night :devil:


Oh no - so when the weather warms up and I go back to my 6am workouts I'm going to be alot weaker :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Doug, why not drop to 3x5 on all lifts? I found that to help me massively last time around.
> In my experience, it kept the workouts shorter, allowed me to recover more and feel stronger on the next session and most of all, as James says above, was not so mentally taxing.
> 
> Also, as I understand it, there is actually little strength benefit from doing 5x5 over 3x5. It's really more to do with muscle memory and programming the correct movement for each lift earlier on.
> I do wonder at this though because as the weights go up, and keep going up, I've found myself and read of others having to alter their technique, even long past 5x5.
> 
> There is a reason that Mark Rippetoe uses 3x5 - I'll pick up a copy of Practical Programming one day to find out why .
> 
> I've also read an interesting critique of StrongLifts saying that the deload process at 5x5 is more to do with fatigued muscles rather than hitting a stength plateau.
> Eventually you drop to 3x5, which then becomes very similar to Rippetoe's SS routine.
> Finally, you are supposed to drop to 1x5. However, I'm reading that switching to Madcow is better at this point (and many people actually do this). Apparently, 1x5 with the SL warmup process is not effective enough - Madcow with it's proper ramped sets, all at 5 reps, is. I still don't know enough to be certain but I'm starting to change my view on the wisdom of SL.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Cheers Phil,

Yep, it's my next step :thumb: As from next week I'm reducing my bench to 3 max weight sets :thumb:

I think SL is very good at the beginning, it really got me into powerlifting, but as I've progressed I have found following a full 5X5 increasingly hard to maintain. It's just getting so hard to do 5 sets of 5 reps on my max training weight.
I've looked over Mark Ripptoes stuff & agree, he does give a program which seems to be more appropriate for long term strength training. I will perceiver for a week or so, then, go for a program that allows me to keep improving.

I'm slightly disappointed how quickly I've found a need to reduce my sets. As I'm nowhere near my main single lift goals yet 

Squat:157.5KG/346.5LB = *70KG/153.5LB to go*

Deadlift: 160KG/352LB = *69KG/148LB to go.*

Bench Press: 105KG/231LB = *45KG/99LB to go*

But im not giving up :thumb: After all im 43 & ive only been training for around 15 weeks


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Oh no - so when the weather warms up and I go back to my 6am workouts I'm going to be alot weaker :lol:


You an early riser Phil :doublesho:doublesho

Edit this thread has now over 10,000 views WTF!!!!!


----------



## Guest

Doug, I think the fact you can do a 1.5-1.6 x BW squat at 5x5 is amazing. You certainly have the right mental attidtude to go a long way imho :thumb:. Most people on SL have switched to Madcow by this point.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> You an early riser Phil :doublesho:doublesho


hehe - not at the moment - too damn cold. But before I stopped last year, I was getting up at 6am to workout. Meant I had the evenings to do as I wished.



ITHAQVA said:


> Edit this thread has now over 10,000 views WTF!!!!!


I saw that too! I hope it has inspired some people to go and lift because it's a great form of exercise and is definately character building - the carry-over to other aspects of your life is much greater than you'd initially expect. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Doug, I think the fact you can do a 1.5-1.6 x BW squat at 5x5 is amazing. You certainly have the right mental attidtude to go a long way imho :thumb:. Most people on SL have switched to Madcow by this point.


lol Phil, every time i train, I do think to myself, yep ive got a mental attitude all right, why do i do this, i must be out of my small mind at my age 

Warming up training room as we speak, my first ever 160KG deadlift :doublesho

What do most people do on a sunday, chill out, me, I walk into a room & get in a ruck with this


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Warming up training room as we speak, my first ever 160KG deadlift :doublesho


GL mate - hope you make it :thumb:

I'm googling for a heater for my garage :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> hehe - not at the moment - too damn cold. But before I stopped last year, I was getting up at 6am to workout. Meant I had the evenings to do as I wished.
> 
> :lol::lol:
> 
> I saw that too! I hope it has inspired some people to go and lift because it's a great form of exercise and is definately character building - the carry-over to other aspects of your life is much greater than you'd initially expect. :thumb:


I was shocked when I saw the views, I think Bod42 (James) said he picks this thread up on the first page on Google :thumb:

Totally agree mate, the amount of effort/struggle needed for a vigorous sport is definitely character building & also as you get older a great way to boost your confidence in yourself as an individual :thumb:

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> GL mate - hope you make it :thumb:
> 
> I'm googling for a heater for my garage :lol:


Cheers Phil :thumb:

I remember training in a garage years ago & i hated it so much, especially this time of year, totally put me off training between Jan-Feb 

That flooring i use is very good for keeping the floor warm & if you need some dense matting as per the blue stuff in my last pic, I'm sure i could arrange something for you mate, we've got loads at work, it will need a clean though, but will protect the softer flooring :thumb:

Are you going for a blower type heater? They seem to be the best at quickly bringing up the temp, even though they are expensive to run.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> That flooring i use is very good for keeping the floor warm & if you need some dense matting as per the blue stuff in my last pic, I'm sure i could arrange something for you mate, we've got loads at work, it will need a clean though, but will protect the softer flooring :thumb:


That's very kind of you mate, but I'm thinking of painting the concrete floor when it warms up a bit :thumb:



ITHAQVA said:


> Are you going for a blower type heater? They seem to be the best at quickly bringing up the temp, even though they are expensive to run.


Currently looking at electric powered oil filled radiators. Probably going for a 2.5kw one.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's very kind of you mate, but I'm thinking of painting the concrete floor when it warms up a bit :thumb:
> 
> :thumb: :thumb:
> 
> Currently looking at electric powered oil filled radiators. Probably going for a 2.5kw one.


Much more economical :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Doug, why not drop to 3x5 on all lifts? I found that to help me massively last time around.
> In my experience, it kept the workouts shorter, allowed me to recover more and feel stronger on the next session and most of all, as James says above, was not so mentally taxing.
> 
> Also, as I understand it, there is actually little strength benefit from doing 5x5 over 3x5. It's really more to do with muscle memory and programming the correct movement for each lift earlier on.
> I do wonder at this though because as the weights go up, and keep going up, I've found myself and read of others having to alter their technique, even long past 5x5.
> 
> There is a reason that Mark Rippetoe uses 3x5 - I'll pick up a copy of Practical Programming one day to find out why .
> 
> I've also read an interesting critique of StrongLifts saying that the deload process at 5x5 is more to do with fatigued muscles rather than hitting a stength plateau.
> Eventually you drop to 3x5, which then becomes very similar to Rippetoe's SS routine.
> Finally, you are supposed to drop to 1x5. However, I'm reading that switching to Madcow is better at this point (and many people actually do this). Apparently, 1x5 with the SL warmup process is not effective enough - Madcow with it's proper ramped sets, all at 5 reps, is. I still don't know enough to be certain but I'm starting to change my view on the wisdom of SL.
> 
> Final though - 5/3/1 looks at monthly gains. You will be switching from a program that attempts to provide gains on a workout by workout basis. You might want to look at something like Madcow which is based on weekly gains.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Totally agree with all of this. Most people say Starting strength is superior to Stronglift and I agree as 5x5 is so hard to continue for a long period. I normally start beginners on stronglift as it gives them more technique practice but overall I think Starting Strength is a better program. I had awesome gains on 5x5 but I could only manage 2 days a week otherwise I over trained.

I think 5/3/1 is an advanced program but it does work for beginners and intermediate but why would you want to progress monthly when you could progress each workout or weekly.


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> GL mate - hope you make it :thumb:
> 
> I'm googling for a heater for my garage :lol:


This brings back memories of training in the freezing rugby club gym with the good old concrete foors.

I got the opposite issue now, my gym is incredibly well insulated so its like 30 degrees and the humidity is unreal. Mrs always complains that im soaked in sweat when I finished, abit different from the days of not being able to get warm in uk


----------



## ITHAQVA

*better!*

Sundays Powerlifting.

*Deadlift: 160KG/352LB 1 X 5 :thumb:

Pull-Ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3 :thumb:

Close grip bench press: 82.5KG/181.5LB 3 X 5 :thumb:*

Deadlift felt heavy, but I just went for it :devil:

Next, wash the car for two hours in the cold & damp, but i do have roast Chicken & vegetables to look forward to later :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Totally agree with all of this. Most people say Starting strength is superior to Stronglift and I agree as 5x5 is so hard to continue for a long period. I normally start beginners on stronglift as it gives them more technique practice but overall I think Starting Strength is a better program. I had awesome gains on 5x5 but I could only manage 2 days a week otherwise I over trained.
> 
> I think 5/3/1 is an advanced program but it does work for beginners and intermediate but why would you want to progress monthly when you could progress each workout or weekly.


Thanks James, it good to know I'm thinking along the right lines.

Agreed, SL is a good program and its author has done a lot to educate people about the benefits of compound lifting. I shall certainly keep using it, at 3x5, until I need to switch to an intermediate program - which will probably be Madcow.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Sundays Powerlifting.
> 
> *Deadlift: 160KG/352LB 1 X 5 :thumb:
> 
> Pull-Ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3 :thumb:
> 
> Close grip bench press: 82.5KG/181.5LB 3 X 5 :thumb:*
> 
> Deadlift felt heavy, but I just went for it :devil:
> 
> Next, wash the car for two hours in the cold & damp, but i do have roast Chicken & vegetables to look forward to later :thumb:


Nice! Good job on the DL :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Sundays Powerlifting.
> 
> *Deadlift: 160KG/352LB 1 X 5 :thumb:
> 
> Pull-Ups: 3/2, 2/3, 2/3 :thumb:
> 
> Close grip bench press: 82.5KG/181.5LB 3 X 5 :thumb:*
> 
> Deadlift felt heavy, but I just went for it :devil:
> 
> Next, wash the car for two hours in the cold & damp, but i do have roast Chicken & vegetables to look forward to later :thumb:


Awesome Deadlift mate, this makes me want to smash my Deadlift Wednesday as the most I done is 150kg so far on this workout



BareFacedGeek said:


> Thanks James, it good to know I'm thinking along the right lines.
> 
> Agreed, SL is a good program and its author has done a lot to educate people about the benefits of compound lifting. I shall certainly keep using it, at 3x5, until I need to switch to an intermediate program - which will probably be Madcow.


Im running Madcow at the moment and it seems to be working well. Im going to run it for a while until I stall and reset twice then probably change to Texas Method which is very similar but the reason I didnt choose Texas Method id due to the 1.5-2 hour Volume day but may do it with lower rest period say 2 mins


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Nice! Good job on the DL :thumb:





Bod42 said:


> Awesome Deadlift mate, this makes me want to smash my Deadlift Wednesday as the most I done is 150kg so far on this workout
> 
> *Many thanks Guys :thumb: It felt as hard as wrestling a  Rhino  *
> 
> Im running Madcow at the moment and it seems to be working well. Im going to run it for a while until I stall and reset twice then probably change to Texas Method which is very similar but the reason I didnt choose Texas Method id due to the 1.5-2 hour Volume day but may do it with lower rest period say 2 mins


 I'm changing all my max lifts to 3 sets now, thanks for the advice & pointers guys.

I'm also considering my ITHAQVA method ©  Once my present system stops giving results, but will keep on trying to increase the weight in the mean time.
I agree with James on his point Re: 5/3/1, why only try increase once a month, surely it is more productive to keep upping the weight were ever possible. 
However, one thing I did notice on my Barbell row recently, when it got a bit heavy & I was constantly struggling to improve, I followed Dan's (Sidewalk) advice & kept at the weight until I dominated it, now a 100KG Barbell row 5X5 feels relatively easy. I am also wondering if this strategy is a good idea to ensure all your joints/tendons are strong enough to lift.

I'm considering including the stops in weight increase at certain intervals (possibly the last two weeks in my 8 week phases) to ensure every part of my body is ready to lift not just the muscles.

After all I'm in no hurry & if I don't get to my goals within 12 months adding another 12 months will be no issue, as being safe/fit & injury free are important to me, especially at my age. Above all I'm going to keep it simple.

Just a few thoughts. Comments opinions very welcome guys?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Sounds like a good plan. 

I on the other hand, feel like i've been hit by a bus!

I drove 1100 miles last week for work and had 3 nights in hotels. My pet hate as the beds are awful and eating well is hard to do. Anyway. I squatted Monday night before I left. Disaster. My squat suit is far too tight, cuts off the circulation to my feet! Lol. I basically did a 205 and a 225kg power curtsy :lol: - so when I post the vid, I know that its no where near a good squat :thumbup:

Deads when I got home on Friday. Worked up to 212.5 for 3 singles in full gear. They felt like ****, but moved well on video.

Bench was a triumph even if I do say so myself. Worked up to a 140kg raw bench, moved faster than it ever ever has. Then shirt on and did the following to a 3 board.

160x3
180x3
200x3
220x2 (First rep was PERFECT - moved so fast - i misgrooved the second and it was a bit poo)
230x1
240x1
245xMiss - locked out right arm, left arm slightly kinked - i'll have it soon.

Then backed down to 200x2 off a 2 board, did 100x8, 110x8 and 100x8 again on the decline, so incline flyes and some push downs to finish off.


----------



## sidewalkdances




----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Sounds like a good plan.
> 
> I on the other hand, feel like i've been hit by a bus!
> 
> I drove 1100 miles last week for work and had 3 nights in hotels. My pet hate as the beds are awful and eating well is hard to do. Anyway. I squatted Monday night before I left. Disaster. My squat suit is far too tight, cuts off the circulation to my feet! Lol. I basically did a 205 and a 225kg power curtsy :lol: - so when I post the vid, I know that its no where near a good squat :thumbup:
> 
> Deads when I got home on Friday. Worked up to 212.5 for 3 singles in full gear. They felt like ****, but moved well on video.
> 
> Bench was a triumph even if I do say so myself. Worked up to a 140kg raw bench, moved faster than it ever ever has. Then shirt on and did the following to a 3 board.
> 
> 160x3
> 180x3
> 200x3
> 220x2 (First rep was PERFECT - moved so fast - i misgrooved the second and it was a bit poo)
> 230x1
> 240x1
> 245xMiss - locked out right arm, left arm slightly kinked - i'll have it soon.
> 
> Then backed down to 200x2 off a 2 board, did 100x8, 110x8 and 100x8 again on the decline, so incline flyes and some push downs to finish off.


Bloody nice weights Dan, :thumb: Respect mate :thumb:

140KG raw Bench :doublesho :thumb:

I dont think people realise how much harder the extra 45KG is over a normal 100KG bench, im starting to  & wondering if i have set my goals a bit high for the first 12 months for a begginer like myself.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> April Meet - Week 1 training - YouTube


Inspiring stuff Dan :thumb:

You made the 200KG deadlift look so easy:doublesho, when i did 160KG for 5 reps on Sunday, i thought i was going to snap in half


----------



## MarkH

Strong old fella!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Strong old fella!!!
> 
> Valentin Dikul Guinness World Record - YouTube


Holy **** :doublesho :thumb:

Is it for real or fake?


----------



## Bod42

Monday Madcow Workout:
Box Squat:70kg x 5,85kg x 5,102.5kg x 5,120kg x 5, 135kg x 5
Bench press: 55kg x 5,70kg x 5,82.5kg x 5, 97.5kg x 5, 110kg x 5
Barbell Rows: 42.5kg x 5, 52.5kg x 5, 62.5kg x 5, 72.5kg x 5,82.5kg x 3

Squats wre hard work but what do you expect when you get a PR. The last rep felt like it took 30 seconds to lock out but it was probably only a few. At least with the box I know it was a true new record, no doubt about it.

I got all my reps on Bench Press but my shoulder really hurt on the last rep so think I will keep my bech short of failure. No point blowing my shoulder out and not being able to bench.

Missed my Barbell Rows not due to Back strength but due to grip strength. I always had a useless gip but its really starting to annoy me now.

Doug: I wouldnt schedule breaks/staying at the same weight as its to set in stone, I would do it depending on how you feel with each exercise. If you do the last 2 weeks of an 8 week cycle then the exercises could feel crap for the first few weeks but then get in the groove and start moving up in weight but then you have a scheduled break from increasing the weight.

When working with Dumbells I used to hit the weight 2 or 3 times before moving up a weight. Just lets you dominate it before moving on.

Real nice lifts there Sidewalkdance, holding 245kg in your hands wow, I would stuggle with that on my back


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Madcow Workout:
> Box Squat:70kg x 5,85kg x 5,102.5kg x 5,120kg x 5, 135kg x 5
> Bench press: 55kg x 5,70kg x 5,82.5kg x 5, 97.5kg x 5, 110kg x 5
> Barbell Rows: 42.5kg x 5, 52.5kg x 5, 62.5kg x 5, 72.5kg x 5,82.5kg x 3
> 
> Squats wre hard work but what do you expect when you get a PR. The last rep felt like it took 30 seconds to lock out but it was probably only a few. At least with the box I know it was a true new record, no doubt about it.
> 
> I got all my reps on Bench Press but my shoulder really hurt on the last rep so think I will keep my bech short of failure. No point blowing my shoulder out and not being able to bench.
> 
> Missed my Barbell Rows not due to Back strength but due to grip strength. I always had a useless gip but its really starting to annoy me now.
> 
> Doug: I wouldnt schedule breaks/staying at the same weight as its to set in stone, I would do it depending on how you feel with each exercise. If you do the last 2 weeks of an 8 week cycle then the exercises could feel crap for the first few weeks but then get in the groove and start moving up in weight but then you have a scheduled break from increasing the weight.
> 
> When working with Dumbells I used to hit the weight 2 or 3 times before moving up a weight. Just lets you dominate it before moving on.
> 
> Real nice lifts there Sidewalkdance, holding 245kg in your hands wow, I would stuggle with that on my back


Cracking workout James, you're bench is coming on really well: 110KG/242LB for 5 reps :devil::devil:

Agree with your point on weights & breaks, I will do as i did with the barbell row, rest when i feel I need to & dominate the weight for a week or so, then carry on with adding more weight :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cracking workout James, you're bench is coming on really well: 110KG/242LB for 5 reps :devil::devil:
> 
> Agree with your point on weights & breaks, I will do as i did with the barbell row, rest when i feel I need to & dominate the weight for a week or so, then carry on with adding more weight :thumb:


Cheers Mate,

Just highlifts how bad my squat is though and its really confusing as my squat used to be my best lift by far. My squat is only 25kg heavier than my Bench :doublesho Oh well hopefully this Madcow workout will push my squat up for a few weeks yet.

My not to distance goals are at my current bodyweight of 105kg

Bench 1.5 x BW = 157.5kg - 47.5kg to go or 30% to go.
Squat 2.1 x BW = 220.0kg - 85.0kg to go or 39% to go.
Dead 2.5 x BW = 262.5kg - 112.5kg to go or 43% to go.

Got quite a way to go


----------



## MarkH

ITHAQVA said:


> Holy **** :doublesho :thumb:
> 
> Is it for real or fake?


I think he is real, he has been around for quite a while now!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> My not to distance goals are at my current bodyweight of 105kg
> 
> Bench 1.5 x BW = 157.5kg - 47.5kg to go or 30% to go.
> Squat 2.1 x BW = 220.0kg - 85.0kg to go or 39% to go.
> Dead 2.5 x BW = 262.5kg - 112.5kg to go or 43% to go.
> 
> Got quite a way to go


Very similar to mine although mine are lower & not set by bodyweight.

James, Is it a power lifting standard to set your goals according to X times your body weight etc...?
Even though I'm not competing at the moment I would like to at least set my main lift goals logically just in case I do in the future.

My main lift goals are:

Squat 228KG/500LB

Deadlift: 228KG/500LB

Bench Press: 150KG/330


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Good one!*

Tuesdays Powerlifting

*Bench Press: 107.5KG/236LB 3 X 4 :thumb:

Squat: 157.5KG/346.5LB 3 X 5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 102.5KG/225.5LB 4, 3, 3. :thumb:*

Moved on to a 3X5 as of today & my energy levels were much higher throughout the workout, thanks for the advice giuys :thumb:

Barbell row felt heavy today, bit I'll keep going as best I can.

Here is a wonderful sight, I'm so pleased that my deadlift is now using all the big plates, thought I'd share with you guys, yes it's not a massive weight at 162.5KG/357.5LB, but for me it's a proud moment, Ive never lifted this much, wish me luck, this is Thursday's challenge :doublesho :devil:










*Yes, the bloody chalk gets every ware!* 

*Also, for anyone considering buying this weights set, I made a **** up in measuring the 25KG disks (sorry Phil), they are exactly the same as the 20Kg disks, see pic above. They are the slightly thicker plates on the inside.*

*Edit: wrong weight loaded on the bar , but i spotted it before lifting, was 10KG shy *


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Very similar to mine although mine are lower & not set by bodyweight.
> 
> James, Is it a power lifting standard to set your goals according to X times your body weight etc...?
> Even though I'm not competing at the moment I would like to at least set my main lift goals logically just in case I do in the future.
> 
> My main lift goals are:
> 
> Squat 228KG/500LB
> 
> Deadlift: 228KG/500LB
> 
> Bench Press: 150KG/330


I wouldnt say its Power Lifting Standards. The reason I do it times BW is that my backround is Rugby so if I set standards of say Bench 300 / Squat 400 / Deadlift 500 the 18-22 stone props would have a good chance of hitting these numbers but the 11-12 stone wingers would have less of a chance. By working on Power/Strength to weight ratio it keeps people on a level playing ground and keeps everyone pushing.

And I dont want to put on 20kg and get a little bit stronger, I would rather keep my Strengt to weight ratio as high as possible.

www.crossfit.com/cf-journal/WLSTANDARDS.pdfSimilar I found this its the starting strength Weight Lifting Standards for each weight class. Using this I need to increase my lifts by the following:

Weight 242lb: My Lifts Advanced To Go

Bench Press 127.5 143.6 16.1 or 11%

Shoulder Press 65 85.9 20.9 or 24%

Squat 157.5 192.3 34.8 or 18%

Deadlift 175 222.7 47.7 or 21%

The my lifts are predicted 1RM using JIm Wendler formula. I like putting the percentages in as it shows clearly which exercises you are best and worst at.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I wouldnt say its Power Lifting Standards. The reason I do it times BW is that my backround is Rugby so if I set standards of say Bench 300 / Squat 400 / Deadlift 500 the 18-22 stone props would have a good chance of hitting these numbers but the 11-12 stone wingers would have less of a chance. By working on Power/Strength to weight ratio it keeps people on a level playing ground and keeps everyone pushing.
> 
> And I dont want to put on 20kg and get a little bit stronger, I would rather keep my Strengt to weight ratio as high as possible.
> 
> www.crossfit.com/cf-journal/WLSTANDARDS.pdfSimilar I found this its the starting strength Weight Lifting Standards for each weight class. Using this I need to increase my lifts by the following:
> 
> Weight 242lb: My Lifts Advanced To Go
> 
> Bench Press 127.5 143.6 16.1 or 11%
> 
> Shoulder Press 65 85.9 20.9 or 24%
> 
> Squat 157.5 192.3 34.8 or 18%
> 
> Deadlift 175 222.7 47.7 or 21%
> 
> The my lifts are predicted 1RM using JIm Wendler formula. I like putting the percentages in as it shows clearly which exercises you are best and worst at.


Thanks James, I'm also using Wendlers formula to work out my 1RM :thumb:
We have very similar goals & weigh almost the same, which is great as we can bounce of each other in regards to our lifts & continue to inspire each other to keep improving :thumb:

One thing that crept in my mind last Saturday was fear of the weight :doublesho, however last nights success with the squat removed that fear & I'm now looking forward to squatting 160KG next session & even considering lowering my safety bar so I get a nice deep squat (Slightly below horizontal) to help with confidence & strength.

I'm also looking at getting some tight fitting stretchy leggings of some sort as my loose jogging bottoms stick & pull on me when I lift, no, not ballet pants before you say 

Im gettign an error on your PDF link, do you have another mate?


----------



## Bod42

http://www.crossfit.com/cf-journal/WLSTANDARDS.pdf

I double checked this 1 and it seems to be working.

Its good having someone with the same goals, your well ahead of me on Deadlift now and Im sure thats why the weight flew up last night as I didnt even think of failing as I got to catch up. I like the competitive side of it, gives you another reason why we all do this.

I know exactly what your talking about with fear of the weights. It takes quite alot of mental strength sometimes to put that weight on your back and push yourself to your limits. This is why I prefer training with a dedicated partner. Its like having a different personality on ech shoulder when Im lifting, one saying your a Pus*y move the god dam weigth no matter what, the other one is saying why are you bothering, really why are you putting yourself through this, just put the weight down. So it takes alot of mental strength not to give in to the easy option. This is why I like talkative loud training partners, when your on rep 9 and you cant breath, feel spaced out, cant think straight, your legs have nothing left and you want to give up, you got someone who just keeps saying 1 more rep and so you just keep going. You cant even think about quiting.

Never squatted in jogging bottoms. Shorts every time and if you get those black sport short type the material is so light it doesnt effect your form at all. Cant say I would ever stand behind and spot someone squatting wearing Spandex, good think you train at home if your considering that look :lol:


----------



## MarkH

You may want to try liquid chalk, I like it a lot of people don't, an alternative to man tights , are long baggy shorts, which have plenty of give when squatting.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow:
Light Box Squats: 67.5 x 5, 85 x 5, 102.5 x 5, 102.5 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5 x 5, 40 x 5, 45 x 5, 52.5 x 5
Deadlifts: 92.5 x 5, 110 x 5, 130 x 5, 147.5 x 5
Chin Ups: 25 reps all 3 grips
Core Work

Concentrated on my Squat speed and form with the lighter weight. This is suppose to be a recovery day so I can see me changing these to light front squats in the near future to give me more rest before friday.

Seated Shoulder Press was pretty easy for some reason, I thought as I havent done it consistantly for a little while that I would be crap at it.

There was no way I was going to fail on deadlift I just dominated the weight. The first few reps flew up really fast and easy lock out. I got in the zone early on and forgot I was doing increasing sets so put everything I had into the 110 and it felt like I nearly threw it throught garage ceiling it came up so fast. My mixed grip strength is fine but couldnt even get passed 92.5 with double overhand grip which shows how crap my grip is.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thanks for the advice Mark/James :thumb:

Man tights :lol::lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> http://www.crossfit.com/cf-journal/WLSTANDARDS.pdf
> 
> I double checked this 1 and it seems to be working.
> 
> Its good having someone with the same goals, your well ahead of me on Deadlift now and Im sure thats why the weight flew up last night as I didnt even think of failing as I got to catch up. I like the competitive side of it, gives you another reason why we all do this.
> 
> I know exactly what your talking about with fear of the weights. It takes quite alot of mental strength sometimes to put that weight on your back and push yourself to your limits. This is why I prefer training with a dedicated partner. Its like having a different personality on ech shoulder when Im lifting, one saying your a Pus*y move the god dam weigth no matter what, the other one is saying why are you bothering, really why are you putting yourself through this, just put the weight down. So it takes alot of mental strength not to give in to the easy option. This is why I like talkative loud training partners, when your on rep 9 and you cant breath, feel spaced out, cant think straight, your legs have nothing left and you want to give up, you got someone who just keeps saying 1 more rep and so you just keep going. You cant even think about quiting.
> 
> Never squatted in jogging bottoms. Shorts every time and if you get those black sport short type the material is so light it doesnt effect your form at all. Cant say I would ever stand behind and spot someone squatting wearing Spandex, good think you train at home if your considering that look :lol:


 ohhhhhhhhhhhh spandex :lol::lol::lol:

Excellent James, this one works, will be good so i can structure my training a bit better in the future when my lifts get to something worht talking about :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Madcow:
> Light Box Squats: 67.5 x 5, 85 x 5, 102.5 x 5, 102.5 x 5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5 x 5, 40 x 5, 45 x 5, 52.5 x 5
> Deadlifts: 92.5 x 5, 110 x 5, 130 x 5, 147.5 x 5
> Chin Ups: 25 reps all 3 grips
> Core Work
> 
> Concentrated on my Squat speed and form with the lighter weight. This is suppose to be a recovery day so I can see me changing these to light front squats in the near future to give me more rest before friday.
> 
> Seated Shoulder Press was pretty easy for some reason, I thought as I havent done it consistantly for a little while that I would be crap at it.
> 
> There was no way I was going to fail on deadlift I just dominated the weight. The first few reps flew up really fast and easy lock out. I got in the zone early on and forgot I was doing increasing sets so put everything I had into the 110 and it felt like I nearly threw it throught garage ceiling it came up so fast. My mixed grip strength is fine but couldnt even get passed 92.5 with double overhand grip which shows how crap my grip is.


 Now your hating the weights mate, grrrrrrrrrrrrr (Insert Manly stuff here):thumb: 

I experienced the same the other night on my squat; I put the 25KG disk on for the first time miscalculated the weight DOH!!! & put 147.KG on the bar by mistake instead of 157.5KG. That 10KG difference made the weight feel "light" after doing 5 reps I was like WTF!!!! :doublesho I was annoyed that I had to do 3 more sets, but I was well pleased to think that 147.5KG felt so easy, a good indicator that my body is actually getting stronger. A positive side to me being a dumb **** & not being able to count properly 

I was lucky in the deadlift, I got to around 130KG/140KG before switching grip, now I love the alternative grip & don't beat myself up about it, stick to the alternative grip James & your deadlift will go up much quicker, I wasted a few weeks worrying about my grip, now I concentrate on the lift & my lift form, alternative grip all the way baby!  :thumb:


----------



## Ryan_W

Monday 13th Feb 12 - Chest

*Barbell Benchpress*

20kg x 20
60kg x 10
80kg x 3
100kg x 5, 5, 5, 5

*Incline Dumbbell Press*

30kg x 8
35kg x 8
40kg x 8, 8

*Decline Barbell Press*

80kg x 10, 10, 10

*Incline Flyes*

30kg x 10, 10, 10

Wednesday 15th Feb 12 - Back

*Deadlift*

20kg x 20
60kg x 10
100kg x 5
140kg x 5
180kg x 5, 5
200kg x 5

*BORs*

80kg x 10
100kg x 8, 8, 8

*18" Rack Pulls*

180kg x 3
220kg x 3
260kg x 3
300kg x 3
340kg x 3

*Pullups*

10, 10, 15

Off to do some shoulders now. Hoping for reps of 80kg on strict military press......


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Happy with tonights progress.*

Thursday's Powerlifting

*Deadlift: 162.5KG/357.5LB 1 X 5  :thumb:

Pull-Up's: 3¼/2, 2/3, 2/3 :thumb:

Close Grip Bench Press: 85KG/187LB 3 X 5 :thumb: *

Nearly had a disaster, on Monday I loaded the bar with only 152.5KG/335.5LB for the deadlift :doublesho, luckily I checked it & loaded the bar up with the correct weight today 

Pull ups, even though the positive reps are not moving up quick the negative reps feel a lot easier & im lowering my weight under much more control.

Close grip felt really light, but I'm going to keep disciplined & start all new exercises light & work my way up 2.5Kg at a time.

One more session & the week is complete :devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks for the advice Mark/James :thumb:
> 
> Man tights :lol::lol::lol:


Just remember there is no such thing as "man tights" they are just re packaged large women tights. Is your name Man-dy in the gym :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Just remember there is no such thing as "man tights" they are just re packaged large women tights. Is your name Man-dy in the gym :lol:


:lol::lol::lol:

And Susan at the weekends :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ryan_W said:


> Monday 13th Feb 12 - Chest
> 
> *Barbell Benchpress*
> 
> 20kg x 20
> 60kg x 10
> 80kg x 3
> 100kg x 5, 5, 5, 5
> 
> *Incline Dumbbell Press*
> 
> 30kg x 8
> 35kg x 8
> 40kg x 8, 8
> 
> *Decline Barbell Press*
> 
> 80kg x 10, 10, 10
> 
> *Incline Flyes*
> 
> 30kg x 10, 10, 10
> 
> Wednesday 15th Feb 12 - Back
> 
> *Deadlift*
> 
> 20kg x 20
> 60kg x 10
> 100kg x 5
> 140kg x 5
> 180kg x 5, 5
> 200kg x 5
> 
> *BORs*
> 
> 80kg x 10
> 100kg x 8, 8, 8
> 
> *18" Rack Pulls*
> 
> 180kg x 3
> 220kg x 3
> 260kg x 3
> 300kg x 3
> 340kg x 3
> 
> *Pullups*
> 
> 10, 10, 15
> 
> Off to do some shoulders now. Hoping for reps of 80kg on strict military press......


Some mighty weights in there Ryan :thumb:

How long have you been training mate?


----------



## Ryan_W

Started 'throwing weights around' when I was around 18 (couldn't even bench 60kg)...

Started seriously training for powerlifting when I was 20.

Now at the ripe old age of 27. Legs and back are strong, but 3 reconstructive shoulder ops from weight lifting and rugby means my bench is a bit ghey...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ryan_W said:


> Started 'throwing weights around' when I was around 18 (couldn't even bench 60kg)...
> 
> Started seriously training for powerlifting when I was 20.
> 
> Now at the ripe old age of 27. Legs and back are strong, but 3 reconstructive shoulder ops from weight lifting and rugby means my bench is a bit ghey...


At least your still training Ryan, thats the most important thing :thumb:

Keep hating those weights mate :devil:  :thumb:

I must admit i consider myself very lucky to have gotten away with very little injury after training most of my life with no warm ups at all :doublesho

Things are now much different & over the last 12 months this powerlifting lark has tought me so much. I warm up all thew time :thumb:

Ripe old age of 27 :lol: You wait until you get past your 40's


----------



## J1ODY A

Over the last couple of weeks I've got back into the gym & noting my training regime... will whack up a couple of days worth to see how it compares.

I find I have the ability to lift some real heavy weights but I like to keep them lighter to do more reps so I can burn off some of my fat!


----------



## ITHAQVA

J1ODY A said:


> Over the last couple of weeks I've got back into the gym & noting my training regime... will whack up a couple of days worth to see how it compares.
> 
> I find I have the ability to lift some real heavy weights but I like to keep them lighter to do more reps so I can burn off some of my fat!


Come on in J1ODY, join da crew :devil: :thumb:


----------



## dubnut71

I'll be honest I am sceptical but I have downloaded the PDF and in reading it its fired my imagination for a new way of training, I love the simple stuff.

Ok I am more or less sold, will give it a go on Monday when back in the gym, are you guys seeing some tangible results over your normal split or abbreviated routines?


----------



## ITHAQVA

dubnut71 said:


> I'll be honest I am sceptical but I have downloaded the PDF and in reading it its fired my imagination for a new way of training, I love the simple stuff.
> 
> Ok I am more or less sold, will give it a go on Monday when back in the gym, are you guys seeing some tangible results over your normal split or abbreviated routines?


Sceptical? If you read this thread from start to finish, you'll see my results :thumb:

*:devillease be aware my primary goal & this thread is strength/power :devil:* i see no need to be muscular & weak. If you incorporate the basic principles & add losing body fat into the mix, you will become muscular, but more importantly very strong as well :devil: :thumb:

If you want the physique of a bodybuilder you need to train like a bodybuilder & how much you lift should be replaced with how you lift, IE more volume, less weight. But still using compound multi joint exercises. 
Most of all, your diet is the most important factor & it is also the hardest part to be successful at, anyone can lift weights.

Body fat content is crucial to muscularity.

I will focus more on body fat reduction/Aerobic fitness once I reach my primary goals for the Deadlift, Squat & Bench Press, but continue to train as a powerlifter & stick to my core objective, getting stronger & stronger :thumb:

Now go lift!


----------



## Bod42

Same goals here doug, I told the Mrs that I have set a deadline of next Summer to be in shape so putting on as much strength as possible right now and then in October/November I will keep the Main movements as heavy exercises but change my assistant lifts to more volume and build some muscle and loose some fat.

Was polishing my wheels yesterday and got bored so thought I do a Max Chin Up Test. 8 Reps neutral grip, well happy. I think I'm struggling with increasing my reps during my workout as I'm doing them after Deadlifts


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Same goals here doug, I told the Mrs that I have set a deadline of next Summer to be in shape so putting on as much strength as possible right now and then in October/November I will keep the Main movements as heavy exercises but change my assistant lifts to more volume and build some muscle and loose some fat.
> 
> Was polishing my wheels yesterday and got bored so thought I do a Max Chin Up Test. 8 Reps neutral grip, well happy. I think I'm struggling with increasing my reps during my workout as I'm doing them after Deadlifts


Nice one mate, good for overall fitness too, when i get to that stage i'll probably do a split routine, max out on first 2 sets 1-5 reps, then do more volume/lighter weight for 6-8 reps & possibly train each body part once a week :thumb:

I do my pull ups after deads too , so far my max is 3 on the first set  

Wont be training this week as ive got way too much on so im calling this my week off instead of two weeks time, i'll be starting a new 8 week phase next Monday.


----------



## J1ODY A

little bit of context - I always been a gym member, but never really a regular gym goer and probably just trained off the food I ate. Changing jobs 12 months ago meant I quit the gym & spent 4 hours a day commuting.

last November time I noticed my stomach growing, general feeling of being bloated & completely unhappy with the way I look, seeing myself turn into a middle aged man.

to help I started jogging around the local park with the dog once a day (prob 1 or 2 km) & being an ex-smoker my breathing suffered but steadily built it up over a few weeks. I bought a weights bench & some free weights so dabbled in using them which got me in the mood for more.

middle of last month I found a gym chain that had a place on the way to work & another in my home town, meaning I could find time to train... as well as changing what I ate so I cut out chocolate, fizzy drinks, white bread & general snacking and instead increased eating eggs, chicken, porridge & fruit for breakfast etc...

so far my tummy has reduced, my arms & shoulders have some definition again, I'm building my chest too.

Anyway, up late so only a short workout today & focussed on chest so:

15 mins on cross-trainer, level 15 on random setting
3 sets x 20 reps @ 120lbs seated chest press
3 sets x 20 reps @ 120lbs seated pec fly
1 set x 10 reps @ 130lbs & 1 set x 10 reps @ 140lbs seated pec fly
1 set x 10 reps @ 20kg, then 22kg, then 24kg incline dumbbell chest press
1 set x 6 reps @ 26kg incline dumbbell chest press

finished off with sets of 20 push up, sit ups & ab crunchs


----------



## impster

ok folks. I'm in.

I started a thread in this section a few days ago. completely new to this, and as a 9.5stone 5'7" 36 year old I've decided it's about time to sort my body and self confidence out.

So, had a go at what I thought was a 5x5 routine on Friday, using about half the weights I've got in my setup. Boy did I ache during and after it.

Over the past couple of days I've read more about 5x5, and I've just spent the last hour or so in the garage doing a proper routine.

Anyway, it turns out that I was either doing something wrong, or maybe Friday night was a wake up call for what muscles I have. Tonight, I've maxed out on the kit I've got, and need to buy some more weights. Ok - the weight isn't a lot really (one of those old vinyl dumbell kits), but basically, I'm at 60lbs/27kgs. Not much really, but compared to where I was 2 nights ago, I'm thrilled.

Tonight was Workout A - so, Squats 5x5, Bench Press 5x5, and Barbell Rows 5x5.

I still feel that I could do with another 'something' in there, but I'm going to stick with the programme and keep it simple.

So there you go. 60lbs. (I prefer lbs to kgs for the moment as it sounds better I reckon).

Roll on Wednesday which will bring Squat, Overhead Press and Deadlift into it.

Impster


----------



## Bod42

Monday Madcow Workout:
Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 120x5, 137.5x3
Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x5, 85x5, 97.5x5, 112.5x5
Barbell Rows: 40x5, 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 80x5

Squats felt really good warming up. The 137.5 felt heavy coming out of the rack but the first rep felt good but I keep really everywhere like from Jim Wendler and Dan John that you should stop 1 or 2 reps short of total failure and to pick your battles, well tonight I choose to get 3 reps and leave it. I still worked hard as there was quite a high chance I wouldnt have got the 4th rep anyway.

Bench, I walked in the gym telling myself that I was going to deload this exercise as my shoulder hurt last week and if I blow it out again then I will be away from Bench for months but I really want 100kg on the bar so thought I would do an easy 3 reps and add 1 rep per week. Any progression is good progression.

Lowered Rows as my grip was going. 60kg was easy and felt good. Really concentrated on squeezing my shoulder blades together through the entire exercise.

Whats everyones thinking on Jim Wendler and Dan John suggesting that you stop 1-2 reps short of failure?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Madcow Workout:
> Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 120x5, 137.5x3
> Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x5, 85x5, 97.5x5, 112.5x5
> Barbell Rows: 40x5, 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 80x5
> 
> Squats felt really good warming up. The 137.5 felt heavy coming out of the rack but the first rep felt good but I keep really everywhere like from Jim Wendler and Dan John that you should stop 1 or 2 reps short of total failure and to pick your battles, well tonight I choose to get 3 reps and leave it. I still worked hard as there was quite a high chance I wouldnt have got the 4th rep anyway.
> 
> Bench, I walked in the gym telling myself that I was going to deload this exercise as my shoulder hurt last week and if I blow it out again then I will be away from Bench for months but I really want 100kg on the bar so thought I would do an easy 3 reps and add 1 rep per week. Any progression is good progression.
> 
> Lowered Rows as my grip was going. 60kg was easy and felt good. Really concentrated on squeezing my shoulder blades together through the entire exercise.
> 
> Whats everyones thinking on Jim Wendler and Dan John suggesting that you stop 1-2 reps short of failure?


Nice progress here James :thumb::thumb:

I actually thought you were already training one - two reps before failure anyway James

I've not trained to failure since using the 5X5 & now the 3X5.

I would recommend you stick to training one- two reps before positive failure.

Reason One: I have never experienced such strength gains/increases in all my years of training until now, I train around one- two reps before failure, most of the time if I make my designated rep & its easy ill not go further until my next session. I spent most of my training life training to positive failure, for me does not work at all.

Reason two: Since following the powerlifting route I have experienced the largest mass gains. 
These two points in themselves are proof that whatever I'm doing WORKS for me. Training to one or two reps before failure ensuring I have enough energy to make my full 3 sets of 4 reps then 3 sets of 5 reps on the second session.

Brief Example: Chest (using my rep de-load instead of weight de-load) - As soon as i reach 5 reps on a given weight (100KG) I add 2.5KG, with the new weight (102.5KG) i then aim for 3 sets of 4 reps the first chest session, the next chest session i am for 3 sets of 5 reps, then add another 2.5KG & go through the 4 rep first session then 5 reps the second & so on. I train to almost failure, can't explain but i feel i know my own body well enough to stop a rep or two before failure.

From what I see of pure strength training I think going to failure isn't right, maybe ok for bodybuilding though. But even then I question whether it is necessary.

For some reason since using powerlifting techniques/basic principles I have never experienced such growth in strength & size. I have faith that the strength will continue to move up, but feel that the size gains may slow down soon as I'm not eating loads, I don't want to get any bigger to be honest.

I think the simple approach of compound exercises & progressive increase in weight with the correct intensity (one or two reps before failure) is the best way to train.

Totally agree with your bench press approach, slowly build up the reps each session then add weight, this is how i do it, I actually think de loading the weight should only be used if really necessary, I always go for a rep De-load & keep the weight on the bar, I'm prepared to go right down to one rep & build up to five if I have to before weight De-loading.

I hope ive made the above easy to understand :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> ok folks. I'm in.
> 
> I started a thread in this section a few days ago. completely new to this, and as a 9.5stone 5'7" 36 year old I've decided it's about time to sort my body and self confidence out.
> 
> So, had a go at what I thought was a 5x5 routine on Friday, using about half the weights I've got in my setup. Boy did I ache during and after it.
> 
> Over the past couple of days I've read more about 5x5, and I've just spent the last hour or so in the garage doing a proper routine.
> 
> Anyway, it turns out that I was either doing something wrong, or maybe Friday night was a wake up call for what muscles I have. Tonight, I've maxed out on the kit I've got, and need to buy some more weights. Ok - the weight isn't a lot really (one of those old vinyl dumbell kits), but basically, I'm at 60lbs/27kgs. Not much really, but compared to where I was 2 nights ago, I'm thrilled.
> 
> Tonight was Workout A - so, Squats 5x5, Bench Press 5x5, and Barbell Rows 5x5.
> 
> I still feel that I could do with another 'something' in there, but I'm going to stick with the programme and keep it simple.
> 
> So there you go. 60lbs. (I prefer lbs to kgs for the moment as it sounds better I reckon).
> 
> Roll on Wednesday which will bring Squat, Overhead Press and Deadlift into it.
> 
> Impster


Muscle ache is normal for beginners, look up DOM's (Delayed Onset of Muscle soreness)

I'll get a little soreness from time to time, it is normal.

Don't worry about the simplicity of the workout, I think the main problem is that it is so simple people seem to find it hard to believe it works, but it does mate I'm 43 & loving it :thumb: 

Beginners get a better perception of the weight lifted if it's easier for them to relate to it, so I post in both pounds & kilos :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice progress here James :thumb::thumb:
> 
> I actually thought you were already training one - two reps before failure anyway James
> 
> I've not trained to failure since using the 5X5 & now the 3X5.
> 
> I would recommend you stick to training one- two reps before positive failure.
> 
> Reason One: I have never experienced such strength gains/increases in all my years of training until now, I train around one- two reps before failure, most of the time if I make my designated rep & its easy ill not go further until my next session. I spent most of my training life training to positive failure, for me does not work at all.
> 
> Reason two: Since following the powerlifting route I have experienced the largest mass gains.
> These two points in themselves are proof that whatever I'm doing WORKS for me. Training to one or two reps before failure ensuring I have enough energy to make my full 3 sets of 4 reps then 3 sets of 5 reps on the second session.
> 
> Brief Example: Chest (using my rep de-load instead of weight de-load) - As soon as i reach 5 reps on a given weight (100KG) I add 2.5KG, with the new weight (102.5KG) i then aim for 3 sets of 4 reps the first chest session, the next chest session i am for 3 sets of 5 reps, then add another 2.5KG & go through the 4 rep first session then 5 reps the second & so on. I train to almost failure, can't explain but i feel i know my own body well enough to stop a rep or two before failure.
> 
> From what I see of pure strength training I think going to failure isn't right, maybe ok for bodybuilding though. But even then I question whether it is necessary.
> 
> For some reason since using powerlifting techniques/basic principles I have never experienced such growth in strength & size. I have faith that the strength will continue to move up, but feel that the size gains may slow down soon as I'm not eating loads, I don't want to get any bigger to be honest.
> 
> I think the simple approach of compound exercises & progressive increase in weight with the correct intensity (one or two reps before failure) is the best way to train.
> 
> Totally agree with your bench press approach, slowly build up the reps each session then add weight, this is how i do it, I actually think de loading the weight should only be used if really necessary, I always go for a rep De-load & keep the weight on the bar, I'm prepared to go right down to one rep & build up to five if I have to before weight De-loading.
> 
> I hope ive made the above easy to understand :thumb:


Cheers for the advice Doug.

As you know I was doing the Stronglift 5x5 workout and started light so I was defiantly stopping 1-2 reps short of failure if not more. My problem is now that I really want to increase my squat weight that im putting 100% effort in to every squat workout to try and hit my 5 reps so I can increase the weight. This is probably why my body only wants to workout twice a week instead of 3 times as I'm smashing my body 100% 3 times a week and it cant recover.

This would also explain why I normally get to around this strength level and struggle to progress my weights. Its hard to know what to do / how to feel during the lift as I dont want to be a pussy but then I dont want to smash my body every single time as I just over train.

I'm just getting annoyed with my squat weights. Everything is feeling good and progressing other than my squat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cheers for the advice Doug.
> 
> As you know I was doing the Stronglift 5x5 workout and started light so I was defiantly stopping 1-2 reps short of failure if not more. My problem is now that I really want to increase my squat weight that im putting 100% effort in to every squat workout to try and hit my 5 reps so I can increase the weight. This is probably why my body only wants to workout twice a week instead of 3 times as I'm smashing my body 100% 3 times a week and it cant recover.
> 
> This would also explain why I normally get to around this strength level and struggle to progress my weights. Its hard to know what to do / how to feel during the lift as I dont want to be a pussy but then I dont want to smash my body every single time as I just over train.
> 
> I'm just getting annoyed with my squat weights. Everything is feeling good and progressing other than my squat.


Your squat issue is weird, bare in mind my progress is going well because I don't think I've found my REAL rep/weight limit yet on my Squat & Deadlift, my training feels almost on rails as I work up to were my limit is, although this also could be me genuinely getting stronger.

Perhaps a different approach would help.

I'm not a great lover of warming up with heavy weights, but do 5 sets of 40KG various reps for my warm up.

Squat example: 40KG x 10 reps, 40KG x 8 reps, 40KG x 7, 40KG x 5, 40KG x5 that is it. Then do the 3 X ???KG for 5 reps.

I could never bring myself to do the madcow as it is, I would modify it to personally suit me, it has way too much medium/heavy work for my liking.

If I were doing a single lift I would however use heavier weights as my warm up, due to only doing one max rep the muscle exhaustion plays a far lesser role :thumb:

Before starting all my powerlifting sessions I ensure my weights room is very warm too, then I do a full body warm up before I even start the light weight warm up reps, all the usual stuff, running on the spot, star jumps, fast stretches, touch toes, loads of different un weighted arm torso movements (10 mins max). Because everything is so light I'm not pre exhausting any muscles so I can put 100% into my max sets :thumb:

Caution: I have been lifting for many, many years & have not suffered any injury due to my unorthadox warm up routine, *this works for me, but may not for others*, I never jerk or execute any of my lifts fast. My shoulder injury was caused when I wasn't lifting & I've never found out what did cause it. I woke up one Christmas morning with a great pain in it, been a little buggered ever since a real WTF injury lol.

I'll post my workout if you want it James, so you can see the whole thing including warm up stuff, you never know it might work for you too mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Cheers for all the help Doug. I haven't been consistant with my deadlift workouts and that feels like its no where near its limit but i box squatted 180kg before I left the UK and now I been around 130-135kg for what seems like months. Think maybe I'm jumping the gun a little bit as I am getting stronger on Madcow so i need 2run it for a few more months and see what happens really.

Have decided on my program progression once madcow stops working, I'm going to change over to 5/3/1 but the beginners version where you squat and bench twice a week. This will be slower gains but then should be more consistant gains.

It's really just working out a plan of attack for squats, do I hit squats with everything I got or back off and work slowly up?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> It's really just working out a plan of attack for squats, do I hit squats with everything I got or back off and work slowly up?


If I were to have issues with my squat I would leave the weight & concentrate on adding good form/quality reps, before even considering lowering the weight.

I have been training with & achieved: Squat:157.5KG/346.5LB 3 X 5 so my next squat session is going to be 160KG, as long as I make 1 rep per set I will keep the weight on, next session go for two reps & so on, until I reach 5 reps per set (3X5) I would then stick with the weight & dominate it as i did with the barbell row, now a 100KG row feels relativly easy. If I find after a few weeks that I'm going nowhere I would then go back to Squat:157.5KG/346.5LB & start again. Remember however that unlike most I only add 2.5KG to a movement after achieving 5 reps, I know in most books/info they say you can add 5KG for the lower body lifts, but I prefer the small increments, this is also good from a psychological point of view, which we all know plays a big part in lifting heavy weights.

The above works for me, however sometimes in the past to get more motivated I would strip off 10KG & start from there, but if your doing this continuously something in your training needs to change.
I have always loved training each body part once a week in the past; this is a great way to get over a plateau & helps greatly with focus on the lift. Above all it's a very personal thing, power lifting is a challenge & our personality/character can play an important part to meeting a challenge.

I think I would consider looking at doing a 3 times a week 3X5 as I am mate, I'm only a bit flakey at the moment because its that miserable wet time of year & I always find this part of the year I miss sessions in the week, as soon as the weather brightens up I will get well back into it & focus :thumb:

Your possibly just losing a little motivation at this time, we all get it from time to time, keep with it James, :devil:*you are going to get that 180KG Squat mate :thumb: * :devil:

I find watching Ripptoes vids a good way to regain the motivation. :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I got the motivation right now, I'm loving working out and hitting new PRs but I'm just confused over my squat. How can my best exercise become my worse exercise with just a few months off.

Maybe I should have done the Starting Strength Advanced Novice before moving onto Madcow as this is 3x5 and squattin twice per week so more simila to what you are doing.

Think I'm going to leave the weight as per your suggestion but work up by 1 rep per workout and see how this goes. This is how I used to do it and it worked.

Your squat is going really well buddy, I started this workout before you but your squat is 25kg ahead of me which means I need to hit every weight for the next 10 weeks to get to your squat figure. 160kg is a big mile stone for me as its everyone of my large plates that I have right now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I got the motivation right now, I'm loving working out and hitting new PRs but I'm just confused over my squat. How can my best exercise become my worse exercise with just a few months off.
> 
> Maybe I should have done the Starting Strength Advanced Novice before moving onto Madcow as this is 3x5 and squattin twice per week so more simila to what you are doing.
> 
> Think I'm going to leave the weight as per your suggestion but work up by 1 rep per workout and see how this goes. This is how I used to do it and it worked.
> 
> Your squat is going really well buddy, I started this workout before you but your squat is 25kg ahead of me which means I need to hit every weight for the next 10 weeks to get to your squat figure. 160kg is a big mile stone for me as its everyone of my large plates that I have right now.


Cheers for the support James :thumb::thumb:

Even though I'm having a week of i thought of doing my Bench tonight to keep the momentum going on it. Glad I did.

*Bench Press: 107.5KG/236.5LB 3X5 :thumb:*

Well pleased, it means my next session is with 110KG/242LB :thumb::thumb:

Good man, glad you're still with us mate, would be a terrible shame if you lost the drive.

I'm on 160KG/352LB for my next squat session & it's the same for me too mate all my big plates :doublesho, i loaded the rack & looked at them & thought WTF! :doublesho, My bar has a slight bend in it already 

Fear not mate, I'm having the same sort of issue with my Bench, it's a slow process, but tonight proved I can do it mate & *so can you :thumb:*, oddly the first set was the hardest :doublesho Seems as though it's a night of WTFKS! 
Defo go with the rep increases.


----------



## Bod42

Nice Bench there mate, so much for a week off hey. 

I never kick the weightlifting, feel weird without training. Some days its a real slog to get my **** in the gym but once I'm warmed up I love it every single time.


----------



## Guest

Back training after far too long off. Only managed 1 session in the last 3 weeks due to cold weather (yep, I wimped out and threw in the towel at -5°C / 23°F and below) and being ill for most of last week.
The good news is the heater for my garage turned up just as the weather warmed up :lol:.

Anyway, easing back into it by keeping the same weights as used on my last sessions. Decided to set a base line today by doing all lifts but for only 1x5 on the work set.
Edit to add that WU=Warm Up, WO=Work Out, BW=Body Weight 

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Row*
WU: None
WO: [email protected]
*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Chins* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
*Dips* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

All exercises were fine bar the OHP. The work set was harder than expected. Lost a bit of endurance on the chins, but I was expecting that.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Tips

Gosh - your warm up stats are the actual weights I use, but at least I'm working to 12 reps.

Great post - I love the format of your workout log, keep up the good work :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice Bench there mate, so much for a week off hey.
> 
> I never kick the weightlifting, feel weird without training. Some days its a real slog to get my **** in the gym but once I'm warmed up I love it every single time.


I couldnt leave the the bloody power rack alone all evening 

Cheers James :thumb:, looking forward to my 110KG bench next week, a real milestone for me :thumb: Havent lifted that sort of weight for over 10 years :doublesho

I'll be doing Squats tonight too   :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Back training after far too long off. Only managed 1 session in the last 3 weeks due to cold weather (yep, I wimped out and threw in the towel at -5°C / 23°F and below) and being ill for most of last week.
> The good news is the heater for my garage turned up just as the weather warmed up :lol:.
> 
> Anyway, easing back into it by keeping the same weights as used on my last sessions. Decided to set a base line today by doing all lifts but for only 1x5 on the work set.
> Edit to add that WU=Warm Up, WO=Work Out, BW=Body Weight
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> *Row*
> WU: None
> WO: [email protected]
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> *Chins* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
> WU: None
> WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> *Dips* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
> WU: None
> WO: 4x[email protected]
> 
> All exercises were fine bar the OHP. The work set was harder than expected. Lost a bit of endurance on the chins, but I was expecting that.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


All in one session ^^^^^^ :doublesho welcome back Phil, you animal :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tips said:


> Gosh - your warm up stats are the actual weights I use, but at least I'm working to 12 reps.
> 
> Great post - I love the format of your workout log, keep up the good work :thumb:


As long as you got the passion lift TIPS :thumb:, who cares if its not heavy,

:thumb: THIS IS AN EGO FREE ZONE :thumb:


----------



## Tips

ITHAQVA said:


> As long as you got the passion lift TIPS :thumb:, who cares if its not heavy,
> 
> :thumb: THIS IS AN EGO FREE ZONE :thumb:


And that's why I joined this forum folks - thanks for the encouragement ITHAQVA :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tips said:


> And that's why I joined this forum folks - thanks for the encouragement ITHAQVA :thumb: :thumb:


Great here aint it  Your welcome mate :thumb:

Perhapse a separate Bodybuilding/Weight training thread should be set up as well :thumb:


----------



## Tips

ITHAQVA said:


> Great here aint it  Your welcome mate :thumb:
> 
> Perhapse a separate Bodybuilding/Weight training thread should be set up as well :thumb:


I'd buy that for a dollar!


----------



## Guest

Tips said:


> Gosh - your warm up stats are the actual weights I use, but at least I'm working to 12 reps.
> 
> Great post - I love the format of your workout log, keep up the good work :thumb:





ITHAQVA said:


> All in one session ^^^^^^ :doublesho welcome back Phil, you animal :devil: :thumb:


Thanks chaps. It feels good to be back :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow Workout:
Light Box Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 102.5x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 35x5, 42.5x5, 47.5x5, 55x5
Deadlifts: 95x5, 112.5x5, 132.5x5, 150x5
Core Squats: 3x10
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 1-5rep Ladder

Squats always feel great during this workout as your only doing 75% of your 5RM so I just concentrate on my form and speed. Feel like my form is really improving lately so hoping to start really driving my squat weight up.

Shoulder Press feels so much better after light squats and ramped sets. I concentrate on working the muscle on the lower sets and then pressing with full power on the higher sets. The 1 heavy set seems to be better for my shagged shoulder as well.

Deadlifts: These were easier than last week by far. I think its due to me really concentrating on using my posterier chain during squats instead of moving forward and using my quad strength. This in turn I think helps my deadlift. The strange thing was in the past I have read alot about my squat position as I have really short arms and legs but a long body, this isnt the best body type for deadlifts and puts your back horizontal at the start of the rep but on 1 rep I squatted down more than usual and the weight just flew up. Think I'm going to record my form and see what Im up to.

Chins are improving, top set of 5 reps neutral grip. Can do more underhand


----------



## impster

Wednesday workout for me (novice):
workout B in the 5x5 stronglift thing. Using all the weights I've got for the second time (only 60lbs total), I know now that I need to buy some more. 2x10kg or 2x20lbs york vinyls will do it.

5x5 Squats 
5x5 Overhead Press
1x5 Deadlift (added an old cast iron vice to the centre of the bar to give it a bit of oomph)
Then I added in a 5x5 of press ups as a warm down.

Got to say, feels really good, and wish I'd started doing this ages ago.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Madcow Workout:
> Light Box Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 102.5x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 35x5, 42.5x5, 47.5x5, 55x5
> Deadlifts: 95x5, 112.5x5, 132.5x5, 150x5
> Core Squats: 3x10
> Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 1-5rep Ladder
> 
> Squats always feel great during this workout as your only doing 75% of your 5RM so I just concentrate on my form and speed. Feel like my form is really improving lately so hoping to start really driving my squat weight up.
> 
> Shoulder Press feels so much better after light squats and ramped sets. I concentrate on working the muscle on the lower sets and then pressing with full power on the higher sets. The 1 heavy set seems to be better for my shagged shoulder as well.
> 
> Deadlifts: These were easier than last week by far. I think its due to me really concentrating on using my posterier chain during squats instead of moving forward and using my quad strength. This in turn I think helps my deadlift. The strange thing was in the past I have read alot about my squat position as I have really short arms and legs but a long body, this isnt the best body type for deadlifts and puts your back horizontal at the start of the rep but on 1 rep I squatted down more than usual and the weight just flew up. Think I'm going to record my form and see what Im up to.
> 
> Chins are improving, top set of 5 reps neutral grip. Can do more underhand


Nice one James, deadlift is coming on really well mate :thumb:, keep hating those weights, i did tonight lol.

Couldn't leave the rack alone, so did some more today .

*Squat: 160KG/352LB 3X5 :thumb::thumb:

Barbell Row: 102.5KG/225.5LB 5, 4, 4* :thumb::thumb:

Actually did 4 sets of Squats but the first one was a major *FAIL*, placed the bar too high on my back stepped out of the J-hooks & only did 2 reps, my balance was everywhere lol. Had to get the missus to move the j-hooks down a few holes as I lifted the bar side by side up on them as she moved them back to the squat point. 
All this pisssing around made me do my Darth Vader impression, I gave into the DaRkSIde & I hammered out the reps :devil::devil: 










*Bloody chalk gets everywhere, by the time I've finished my workout I look like a giant black powdery marshmallow *


----------



## dubnut71

Its a good job this is an ego free zone as I have just started with a clean bar for the press, 40kg on the reads and had the bar plus 2.5kg wither side for my squats today, if only my old training partners could see me now!!!
But...... I can see the logic in it. I have read the PDF from Mehdi and despite hearing it and ignoring it for all these years, heavy compound lifts are where its at, strength being all important, size being nothing without it.

First week but I am having fun doing it if hating and loving the squats can be possible. I know they are light now but the concentration is exerted in getting my form spot on. Good stuff guys, keep it up!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

dubnut71 said:


> Its a good job this is an ego free zone as I have just started with a clean bar for the press, 40kg on the reads and had the bar plus 2.5kg wither side for my squats today, if only my old training partners could see me now!!!
> But...... I can see the logic in it. I have read the PDF from Mehdi and despite hearing it and ignoring it for all these years, heavy compound lifts are where its at, strength being all important, size being nothing without it.
> 
> First week but I am having fun doing it if *hating and loving the squats can be possible. *I know they are light now but the concentration is exerted in getting my form spot on. Good stuff guys, keep it up!!


Possible & true , you gotta hate the weights to lift em & then love em after youve finished lifting :thumb::thumb:

Dont worry about WHAT your lifting, your lifting thats what counts mate :thumb:

Very soon you'll be moving the weights up & see the logic :thumb:

Barbell/Compounds all the way :thumb: If its bodybuilding your more into you could try different rep ranges, 6-8 or even an 8-10, youll need to find out what your body REACTS to :thumb:

I would stick to the 5X5 first for at least 8-10 weeks :thumb:

I still cant get over all the views this thread gets, 12k plus now lol!!!!


----------



## dubnut71

ITHAQVA said:


> Possible & true , you gotta hate the weights to lift em & then love em after youve finished lifting :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Dont worry about WHAT your lifting, your lifting thats what counts mate :thumb:
> 
> Very soon you'll be moving the weights up & see the logic :thumb:
> 
> Barbell/Compounds all the way :thumb: If its bodybuilding your more into you could try different rep ranges, 6-8 or even an 8-10, youll need to find out what your body REACTS to :thumb:
> 
> I would stick to the 5X5 first for at least 8-10 weeks :thumb:
> 
> I still cant get over all the views this thread gets, 12k plus now lol!!!!


Yeah you know I think its the simplicity that makes it popular? I mean read what he says in the PDF about splits etc, I have trained like that for years and now this comes along and blows it out of the water, thats why we are all on it now with a passion!


----------



## antony_Dannatt

Wow getting some inspiration from this thread. 

I have been back training now 3 weeks and am well chuffed its been 6 years away from a gym but the muscle memory is coming back. After 3 sessions of each body part i have got upto 110kg x 6 bench, 160kg x 5 deadlifts and 150kg x 5 squats all with super strict form no cheating at all (always been anal about that I hate to see sloppy form and weights been thrown about).

I am now back fully buzzing for training again I am so glad never sold my weights when I stopped.

Oh and how popular is this thread........ my god


----------



## Bod42

dubnut71 said:


> Its a good job this is an ego free zone as I have just started with a clean bar for the press, 40kg on the reads and had the bar plus 2.5kg wither side for my squats today, if only my old training partners could see me now!!!
> But...... I can see the logic in it. I have read the PDF from Mehdi and despite hearing it and ignoring it for all these years, heavy compound lifts are where its at, strength being all important, size being nothing without it.
> 
> First week but I am having fun doing it if hating and loving the squats can be possible. I know they are light now but the concentration is exerted in getting my form spot on. Good stuff guys, keep it up!!


I totally agree that you can love and hate squats, I hate them but love the feeling they give you. Abit like the Mrs.

Good stuff starting the program mate. I never seen why people worry about just starting with the bar so good on you for doing this. You put 7.5kg on squats per week and do 75 reps, how would your body not respond to that if it hasnt squatted before. All you have to think is in 1 month you will be doing 50kg (8Stone) for 75 reps per week and then the month after that 80kg (about 13stone) for 75 reps. Your body will get stronger and it will get bigger, no doubt about it.


----------



## Bod42

antony_Dannatt said:


> Wow getting some inspiration from this thread.
> 
> I have been back training now 3 weeks and am well chuffed its been 6 years away from a gym but the muscle memory is coming back. After 3 sessions of each body part i have got upto 110kg x 6 bench, 160kg x 5 deadlifts and 150kg x 5 squats all with super strict form no cheating at all (always been anal about that I hate to see sloppy form and weights been thrown about).
> 
> I am now back fully buzzing for training again I am so glad never sold my weights when I stopped.
> 
> Oh and how popular is this thread........ my god


Awesome lifts there for 3 weeks training and such a lay off. You must have been hitting some impressive weights 6 yrs ago.

There are some seriously strong detailers out there.

Yep the thread is really popular, that thread creator must be a genius  This thread has been open for about 108 days and has 12,073 hits, thats an average of 112 hits per day. We should have all been in advertising lol

Nice inspirational poster there Doug :lol:


----------



## comando-s

*my 5x5*

i do this last friday of every month

Bench 130kg 5x5

leg press 320kg 5X5

Standing overhead Press 100kg - 120kg 5X5 (i do these as a clean and jerk and then press)

Dead Lift 140x6 180x4 200x4 240KG x2 (lifting upto 200kg with out straps,chalk or belt over 200kg belt straps and chalk)

but usual routine is:

monday -chest-12 sets x10 reps then 30 mins of abs

tuesday - back 12 set x 10 reps

wednesday - shoulders 12 sets x 10 reps 30 mis of abs

thursday - arms 12 sets x 10 reps on biceps and 12 sets x 10 reps triceps

Friday legs 8 heavy sets till failure

last rep of my least set i rep till failure

being a member of the forces i have 24 hr gym access but im being medical discharged at the end of the month so will be joining a local gym and will prob have to reduced to only 3-4 days a week so if any one has any advice on how i can improve my routine would be greatly appreciated


----------



## comando-s

*help*

also i am about 20% disabled in my legs and cant do any cardio as i cant do impact just swimming any advice to weight loss as ive put about a stone on since beging to leave the army im 6.5ft and 20.6 stone i would like to get to 
18 - 18 1/2 but im struggling to get past 19.3 i just keep yoyo-ing

thanks


----------



## ITHAQVA

comando-s said:


> also i am about 20% disabled in my legs and cant do any cardio as i cant do impact just swimming any advice to weight loss as ive put about a stone on since beging to leave the army im 6.5ft and 20.6 stone i would like to get to
> 18 - 18 1/2 but im struggling to get past 19.3 i just keep yoyo-ing
> 
> thanks


Total low impact & works very well for cardio, perfect for you mate :thumb: Do a search for an "*air walker*", I've got one, awesome & no impact at all :thumb:

I have one of these & they are the best value & very robust, If you can find one that is.

Carl Lewis AWD15X Foldable Air Walker: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Leisure

Alternatively try eBay, always seems to be a few on there mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

comando-s said:


> i do this last friday of every month
> 
> Bench 130kg 5x5
> 
> leg press 320kg 5X5
> 
> Standing overhead Press 100kg - 120kg 5X5 (i do these as a clean and jerk and then press)
> 
> Dead Lift 140x6 180x4 200x4 240KG x2 (lifting upto 200kg with out straps,chalk or belt over 200kg belt straps and chalk)
> 
> being a member of the forces i have 24 hr gym access but im being medical discharged at the end of the month so will be joining a local gym and will prob have to reduced to only 3-4 days a week so if any one has any advice on how i can improve my routine would be greatly appreciated


lol, you want advice from us :doublesho Thats a shiiiit load of wieght youre using mate, reeeeeespect :thumb:

I would look at Madcow or wendlers 5/3/1, you look like your at a level were less is more :thumb:

Check out...... http://www.elitefts.net/Default.asp :thumb:


----------



## comando-s

thank u all for ur advice,basically i suffer from compartment syndrome in both of legs to that end ive tried airwalkers and they are good but cant do more than 15 mins as my legs swell, i can get away with weights as im resting for 60 secs between sets so thats my prob and the fact im out the armt on the 6th and due to my new job will only have 4 days a week to train, my aim is to drop a stone to 19st but i keep getting down to 19 1/2 and no lower i also wanna put 10kg on my presses in 3 months?


----------



## ITHAQVA

comando-s said:


> thank u all for ur advice,basically i suffer from compartment syndrome in both of legs to that end ive tried airwalkers and they are good but cant do more than 15 mins as my legs swell, i can get away with weights as im resting for 60 secs between sets so thats my prob and the fact im out the armt on the 6th and due to my new job will only have 4 days a week to train, my aim is to drop a stone to 19st but i keep getting down to 19 1/2 and no lower i also wanna put 10kg on my presses in 3 months?


Have you tried an interval session on the air walker 3 times a week?

*No more than jogging speed

15 minutes air walker workout

10 minutes rest

10 minutes air walker workout

10 minutes rest

5 minutes air walker workout* *= 30 minutes workout :thumb:*

You can adapt & vary the rest & training intervals to your ability, try to get a full 30 minutes workout, the 30 minutes can also be split into two sessions twice a day, :thumb:

*Alternative*

*10 minutes air walker workout

10 minutes rest

5 minutes air walker workout

5 minutes rest

10 minutes air walker workout

5 minutes rest

5 minutes air walker workout* = 30 minutes workout :thumb:

Basically break it up any way you like but dont rest more than your max single workout time, this will keep things logical :thumb:

If possible try to build up to a full hour interval session 3-5 times a week, even if you split them up to two half hour sessions :thumb:


----------



## comando-s

ITHAQVA said:


> cheers mate will try that monday and let u know.:thumb


----------



## Bod42

comando-s said:


> thank u all for ur advice,basically i suffer from compartment syndrome in both of legs to that end ive tried airwalkers and they are good but cant do more than 15 mins as my legs swell, i can get away with weights as im resting for 60 secs between sets so thats my prob and the fact im out the armt on the 6th and due to my new job will only have 4 days a week to train, my aim is to drop a stone to 19st but i keep getting down to 19 1/2 and no lower i also wanna put 10kg on my presses in 3 months?


I would try the intervals that ITHAQVA has suggested. The great thing about intervals is that you can use any work to rest ratio you like. Also try Upper Body dominant cardio work like Sledge Hammer or battle ropes.

Your heavy weights once a month are impressive and you do alot of volume the rest of the month.

Diet is 90% of the battle with loosing weight. Im going to diet later this yr and will be using the carb cycling approach. Check out T-nations "Reserach-Approved Carb Cycling" article as it tells you most of what you need to know


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Diet is 90% of the battle with loosing weight. Im going to diet later this yr and will be using the carb cycling approach. Check out T-nations "Reserach-Approved Carb Cycling" article as it tells you most of what you need to know


Thanks for posting this James, I'll be interested to read this too.
I'm planning on a fat loss phase too at some point this year - not sure when, as I want to get my strength up first.
I'm looking at carb cycling too and am currently intenting to use an Intermittent Fasting approach (LeanGains i.e. fast for 16hrs and eat only within an 8hr window each day). 
At the moment my plan is to consume maintainance-30% (with minimal carbs) on non-w/o and maintainance+10% (with more carbs) on w/o days. If I get it right (and I have understood it correctly) it should drop me to 8-10% bf, from my current 20ish%, in 3-4 months.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Guest

Back to the normal workouts tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
*Row*
WU: None
WO: [email protected]
*Dips* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]
*Chins* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Nearly played it safe and kept the same weights as last time. Decided not to in the end and I'm glad I didn't. Really enjoyed this workout.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Thanks for posting this James, I'll be interested to read this too.
> I'm planning on a fat loss phase too at some point this year - not sure when, as I want to get my strength up first.
> I'm looking at carb cycling too and am currently intenting to use an Intermittent Fasting approach (LeanGains i.e. fast for 16hrs and eat only within an 8hr window each day).
> At the moment my plan is to consume maintainance-30% (with minimal carbs) on non-w/o and maintainance+10% (with more carbs) on w/o days. If I get it right (and I have understood it correctly) it should drop me to 8-10% bf, from my current 20ish%, in 3-4 months.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Intermittent Fasting seems to be big at the moment. If you check out Elitefts they call it the Warrior Diet but basically the same thing. When I first got into the fitness industry it was standard suggestion to have 5-7 meals a day but there is now research showing that people who have followed this long terms have problems when they have a cheat meal, basically the body is so used to havinf 5-7 small meals a day that it doesnt know how to fast and then have a huge cheat meal. So i would defiently give the Internittent fasting ago. There are studies to show that bouts of fasting improve mnetal function and also slightly increase testosterone.

The way I diet to keep it simple is keep my fat and protein the same each day but just alter my carbs. So on training days I have carbs, non-training days I have very few carbs. One thing I suggest if your a weekday gymer, is to very low carb the weekend and then put your leg day Monday evening and carb loads with double carbs, this should allow you to keep your strength up while dieting.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow Workout: 
Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 120x5, 140x3, 102.5x8
Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x5, 85x5, 97.5x5, 115x3, 85x8
BarbellRows: 40x5, 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 82.5x3, 60x8
Dips: 12,12,8
Dumbell Curls

Squats felt ok warming up and I was nervous about my work set as i didn't get 5reps Monday but still increased the weight. I have never felt so tight at the top of a squat it was great and it made the weight feel so.much lighter. I smashed the 3reps and probably could have got 5. This have boosted my confidence in squats and in this program alot

I went up 2.5kg on bench as well and the 3reps felt easier than Monday.

Rows were crappy, grip is seriously holding me back now.

I must say I'm really pleased with the madcow program. I thought maybe I had changed to early and was worried about the ramping sets instead of straight sets but it seems to be working ok


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Madcow Workout:
> Squats: 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x5, 120x5, 140x3, 102.5x8
> Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x5, 85x5, 97.5x5, 115x3, 85x8
> BarbellRows: 40x5, 50x5, 60x5, 70x5, 82.5x3, 60x8
> Dips: 12,12,8
> Dumbell Curls
> 
> Squats felt ok warming up and I was nervous about my work set as i didn't get 5reps Monday but still increased the weight. I have never felt so tight at the top of a squat it was great and it made the weight feel so.much lighter. I smashed the 3reps and probably could have got 5. This have boosted my confidence in squats and in this program alot
> 
> I went up 2.5kg on bench as well and the 3reps felt easier than Monday.
> 
> Rows were crappy, grip is seriously holding me back now.
> 
> I must say I'm really pleased with the madcow program. I thought maybe I had changed to early and was worried about the ramping sets instead of straight sets but it seems to be working ok


Inspirational workout James! :thumb::thumb:

I like the look of the Madcow & that you only have one max set, im going to look into this mate, might make a few changes to it as i feel with the big lifts (Squat & deadlift, it might be possible to up the weight 5-10KG each time 5 reps are made or vary it between 2.5KG -10KG to ensure the body keeps up :thumb.

James, do you find doing the Madcow twice a week better for gains or three times a week, as im a bit like you & overtrain very easily.


----------



## impster

Can't compete with any of that 'heavy' stuff I'm afraid...

..but I did buy 2x10kg weights today, so that I've got some room to progress (I hope)

Workout 'A' tonight - so Squats, Bench, and Barbell Row.

Squat 5x5: 40.4kg (I'd be able to lift more but without a squat rack I'm not confident enough to lift it over my head and onto my back/shoulders.

Bench 5x5: 33.6kg

Barbell Row 5x5: 38.2kg

Followed by 5x8 push ups as a warm down.

So, from a max of 27kgs that I had for previous 2 workouts this week, i'm up at least 6kg. If I can do that each week (lol) I'll be happy.!


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Can't compete with any of that 'heavy' stuff I'm afraid...
> ..but I did buy 2x10kg weights today, so that I've got some room to progress (I hope)
> 
> Workout 'A' tonight - so Squats, Bench, and Barbell Row.
> 
> Squat 5x5: 40.4kg (I'd be able to lift more but without a squat rack I'm not confident enough to lift it over my head and onto my back/shoulders.
> 
> Bench 5x5: 33.6kg
> 
> Barbell Row 5x5: 38.2kg
> 
> Followed by 5x8 push ups as a warm down.


Dont worry about the weight impster, get a good feel for all the exercises & learn how your body works, there is no rush.

One thing I will say is this. If you really enjoy this & keep it up, please consider a power rack, it will give you the added confidence to lift heavy as you know youll be safe in the event of dropping the bar.

Here is my kit, the total investement including the flooring was £834 :thumb:

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372

If you spent £50 per month on going to the gym you would of bought this kit in less than 17 months & its all yours for life! :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

JFYI, a cheap alternative to gym matting which is very heavy duty for Olympic lifters is stable matting!


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> JFYI, a cheap alternative to gym matting which is very heavy duty for Olympic lifters is stable matting!


Thanks Mark :thumb:


----------



## impster

or indeed cattle mats - softer, and ideal for sit ups etc.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Inspirational workout James! :thumb::thumb:
> 
> I like the look of the Madcow & that you only have one max set, im going to look into this mate, might make a few changes to it as i feel with the big lifts (Squat & deadlift, it might be possible to up the weight 5-10KG each time 5 reps are made or it between 2.5KG -10KG to ensure the body keeps up :thumb.
> 
> James, do you find doing the Madcow twice a week better for gains or three times a week, as im a bit like you & overtrain very easily.


I done madcow for 5weeks now and this was the first week that i felt great on Fridays but that's probably becuase I didn't smash myself on Monday. I didn't think the ramped sets would be any good but the extra volume really seems to help. You have to do the program 3 days per week as the nuts and bolts of the program is hitting 3reps Friday andthen hitting the same weight for 5 on Monday.

It's defiantly easier mentally to do 1 all out set. I just treat the other 4sets like warm up sets but after the gym last night my Mrs said I'm defiantly getting bigger


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I done madcow for 5weeks now and this was the first week that i felt great on Fridays but that's probably becuase I didn't smash myself on Monday. I didn't think the ramped sets would be any good but the extra volume really seems to help. You have to do the program 3 days per week as the nuts and bolts of the program is hitting 3reps Friday andthen hitting the same weight for 5 on Monday.
> 
> It's defiantly easier mentally to do 1 all out set. I just treat the other 4sets like warm up sets but after the gym last night my Mrs said I'm defiantly getting bigger


Cheers James, I can see why you'd get bigger on this workout with the lighter Warm up sets/extra volume.
I'm looking at a variation of the Madcow principle as my next phase.

One thing though, do you really need to get that close to your max 5th rep weight with the warm ups?

My Bench press example would look like;

5X	55KG
5X	70KG
5X	82.5KG
5X	97.5KG
5X	110KG

The reason I ask is that I'm concerned that my strength will be used up by set 4 & may affect the max set performance.
Looking at the above Bench press example, under normal circumstances I would probably just do 4 sets of 5 reps using 55KG then the 1 X 110KG, can you explain the need to go so heavy on the warm ups when I'm only using a relatively light weight for my max set (110KG).

Edit: James, does it matter if i put KG in the Madcow Excel instead of pounds?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers James, I can see why you'd get bigger on this workout with the lighter Warm up sets/extra volume.
> I'm looking at a variation of the Madcow principle as my next phase.
> 
> One thing though, do you really need to get that close to your max 5th rep weight with the warm ups?
> 
> My Bench press example would look like;
> 
> 5X	55KG
> 5X	70KG
> 5X	82.5KG
> 5X	97.5KG
> 5X	110KG
> 
> The reason I ask is that I'm concerned that my strength will be used up by set 4 & may affect the max set performance.
> Looking at the above Bench press example, under normal circumstances I would probably just do 4 sets of 5 reps using 55KG then the 1 X 110KG, can you explain the need to go so heavy on the warm ups when I'm only using a relatively light weight for my max set (110KG).
> 
> Edit: James, does it matter if i put KG in the Madcow Excel instead of pounds?


I'm not sure why you go so near your max but that's the program, every program can be modified as when i get to squatting 200kg I wouldn't like to do 175kg for a warm up. I would say you need to go quite close to your max so you have got a certain amount of volume above a certain percentage of your 5RM. I leave 2mins between the first 3 seats, 3mins between the next set and then 4mins before I hit my max weight. I originally thought the last warm up set would effect my max weight but it doesn't seem to.

Did I send you my Excel sheet or the actual madcow sheet. Either way its worked out by percentage so it shoulder matter if its kg or lb. I know my one is set up for kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I'm not sure why you go so near your max but that's the program, every program can be modified as when i get to squatting 200kg I wouldn't like to do 175kg for a warm up. I would say you need to go quite close to your max so you have got a certain amount of volume above a certain percentage of your 5RM. I leave 2mins between the first 3 seats, 3mins between the next set and then 4mins before I hit my max weight. I originally thought the last warm up set would effect my max weight but it doesn't seem to.
> 
> Did I send you my Excel sheet or the actual madcow sheet. Either way its worked out by percentage so it shoulder matter if its kg or lb. I know my one is set up for kg


Cheers James, :thumb:

I will read Lord Ripptoes power lifting bibles today  & work out a plan of attack :devil:, I think I'll FIX my warm up set weights for the 8 to 10 week cycles & increase them at the beginning of each new cycle, I'm sure that small deviation from the program won't make any difference 

I do however like the idea of some extra volume :thumb:

Still got all your excels mate, many thanks :thumb::thumb:

*Update: 
Been reading Mark Ripptoes starting strength (2nd Edition) & I think I'll adopt his method of warming up:

Bench Press Example (Warm up weights are approximations)
Start with an empty bar (45 lbs.); determine the work set or sets and then divide the difference between them into even increments.

Empty bar x 5 reps

40Kg x 5 reps

60KG X 3 reps

80KG X 2 reps

The Work set 110KG x 5 reps :thumb:*


----------



## MarkH

impster said:


> or indeed cattle mats - softer, and ideal for sit ups etc.


Thanks not heard of this one, probably useful for stretching etc. you may want to avoid spongey matting for squating/heavy work as the give in the mats makes your squats more unstable.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Cool! Or should I say WARM!*

Saturday's powerlifting.

After reading several of THE books on powerlifting/strength training I concede to this structured warm up lark. So I've just tried it with my Deadlift.

I still carried out my body movements as my pre warm up.

*Deadlift Warm up sets::devil: 20kgx5- 60Kgx5- 80Kgx3- 80Kgx2 :devil:

Deadlift Work set: 165Kg/363LB X 5* :thumb:

Conclusion:
The work set although it did felt heavy, it felt less heavy than before and I think apart from all the obvious positive aspects of warming up correctly/logically, there was an element of the final work set being less of a shock to the system when I proceeded to lift. I would say the previous warm upsets did prepare me for the heavier work set. And it did not affect my performance on the work set.

I think the ultimate test will be the bench press & other upper body lifts that use fewer muscle groups. I suspect the fewer muscles groups used in a lift the easier it is to over work/warm up & degrade work set performance/gains.

Any thoughts on this guys?


----------



## MarkH

Proper warm up is essential to any training, not only for preventing injury but getting the best out of your workout, a lot of the top weightlifters spend 30mins warming up before lifting any working load, the smaller muscle groups need just as much time to warm up, remember our discussion on shoulder press?


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> Proper warm up is essential to any training, not only for preventing injury but getting the best out of your workout, a lot of the top weightlifters spend 30mins warming up before lifting any working load, the smaller muscle groups need just as much time to warm up, remember our discussion on shoulder press?


I've been told 

Yes your right though Mark :thumb: And after today, I will heed all the great advice being given here :thumb:

I do remember the shoulder discussion & remember finding the second set easier & so on 

Odd you mention that too as recently as my lifts have been getting heavier i noticed a trend on all of them; they got easier from the second set onwards, especially the bench press.

So instead of doing multiples of 20-40KG I will warm up & build up the weight properly :thumb::thumb:


----------



## chillly

ITHAQVA said:


> I've been told
> 
> Yes your right though Mark :thumb: And after today, I will head all the great advice being given here :thumb:
> 
> I do remember the shoulder discussion & remember finding the second set easier & so on
> 
> Odd you mention that too as recently as my lifts have been getting heavier i noticed a trend on all of them; they got easier from the second set onwards, especially the bench press.
> 
> So instead of doing multiples of 20-40KG I will warm up & build up the weight properly :thumb::thumb:


You have been training for a while now mate and i think its time we seen pics of the before and afters Hi Doug :wave: And thanks again for that favour Mate i really appreciate it!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

chillly said:


> You have been training for a while now mate and i think its time we seen pics of the before and afters Hi Doug :wave: And thanks again for that favour Mate i really appreciate it!!! :thumb:


:lol::lol: Chills,

Im still building strenght so im not too pretty at the moment :lol:

Dont think even I've got the balls to post picks of myself online 

Anytime Gary, as always mate :thumb:


----------



## chillly

Its ok i found some 

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=pi...tart=0&ndsp=21&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0&tx=47&ty=64


----------



## ITHAQVA

chillly said:


> Its ok i found some
> 
> http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=pi...tart=0&ndsp=21&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0&tx=47&ty=64


:lol::lol::lol:

Cant be me, I only wear black


----------



## Guest

Had a great session tonight. Getting tantilisingly close to my previous 5RM PRs so I decided to drop the chins/dips and test both my squat and dead 1RM. Managed to set a couple of new PRs, so I'm over the moon.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
1RM: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]
1RM: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Press was better than expected tonight. Second set was slow, not really a grind but it too a bit of effort. Took a longer rest and the final set went up a bit more quickly.
So pleased with my new squat and dead 1RMs. I've actually beaten my previous 1RMs on these (tested last Aug/Sep time) by 20kg (44lbs) on both lifts.
I stopped at 125kg (275lbs) on the squat because the last two sets had been a bit of a grind - felt quite a bit of pressure in both my head and stomach, so I decided enough was enough.
I actually attempted 155kg on the dead twice but only managed only a 1/4 lift on both occasions. Still really pleased with my new 150kg (330lbs) 1RM. This is the most weight I've ever lifted.
The plan is to turn these new 1RMs into 5RMs by the end of March.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Had a great session tonight. Getting tantilisingly close to my previous 5RM PRs so I decided to drop the chins/dips and test both my squat and dead 1RM. Managed to set a couple of new PRs, so I'm over the moon.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 1RM: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]15kg, [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 1RM: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> Press was better than expected tonight. Second set was slow, not really a grind but it too a bit of effort. Took a longer rest and the final set went up a bit more quickly.
> So pleased with my new squat and dead 1RMs. I've actually beaten my previous 1RMs on these (tested last Aug/Sep time# by 20kg #44lbs# on both lifts.
> I stopped at 125kg #275lbs# on the squat because the last two sets had been a bit of a grind - felt quite a bit of pressure in both my head and stomach, so I decided enough was enough.
> I actually attempted 155kg on the dead twice but only managed only a 1/4 lift on both occasions. Still really pleased with my new 150kg #330lbs) 1RM. This is the most weight I've ever lifted.
> The plan is to turn these new 1RMs into 5RMs by the end of March.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Excellent stuff Phil :thumb::thumb: Your shifting some weight now mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Question Guys 

Now that I’m starting a new training cycle & only doing one work set on each lift, what are your opinions on adding 5Kg instead of 2.5Kg to my Squat & deadlift everytime i achieve 5 reps?


----------



## Bod42

A few posts back I was talking about losing weight and that the suggested 5-7 meals per day may not be the best idea anymore.well there is a good article just been put on tnation that explains what I was reffering to

Doug, I thought the program you have been on the last 8weeks was working well. If its working why you changizng it. Also with regards to the 5kg increases, why becuase your now just doing 1work set would you more your increasements up. If anything the more advanced you get the slower the increasements should be


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> A few posts back I was talking about losing weight and that the suggested 5-7 meals per day may not be the best idea anymore.well there is a good article just been put on tnation that explains what I was reffering to
> 
> Doug, I thought the program you have been on the last 8weeks was working well. If its working why you changizng it. Also with regards to the 5kg increases, why becuase your now just doing 1work set would you more your increasements up. If anything the more advanced you get the slower the increasements should be


Hi James, 
I have been in two minds to keep doing a 3x5 routine/work set with the 
structured warm ups wave: lesson learnt! ) To add more reason about warming up, this morning when I woke up my joints didn't feel as stiff :thumb:

I think it would be best to continue with 3X5 until I can no longer progress, then move on to a 2X5 before finally using the 1X5.

My barbell rows are getting heavy now & I think the best way to progress is to employ stricter form & slower weight progress, although I'm not complaining as I used to think my grip was pants but if I'm able to barbell row 102.5Kg/225.5LB, it can't be all that bad & I'm hoping that heavy rows will improve my grip strength & over all upper body strength.

Also I'm starting to see the benefits of training partners, I'm already feeling pushed/inspired by the input on this thread :thumb:

I see what you mean about slower progress, i was just concerned I wasnt pushing my self hard enough especially in the squat & deadlift, but again have to agree with you as the Wendler 5/3/1 calls for much patience & that powerlifting is a long hard road who's walking it with me :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just found the last weight improvement document from my previous cycle.

So here are my gains for 5 reps in the last 6-7 week cycle.

*Squat: 25Kg/55Lb

Deadlift: 30Kg/66Lb

Bench Press: 15Kg/33Lb

Barbell Row: 10Kg/22Lb*

Considering all the variables: Wasn't consistent in training three times a week in the last 3 weeks of the cycle & this time of year isn't the most motivating, I'm really pleased with my lift increases :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Just found the last weight improvement document from my previous cycle.
> 
> So here are my gains for 5 reps in the last 6-7 week cycle.
> 
> *Squat: 25Kg/55Lb
> 
> Deadlift: 30Kg/66Lb
> 
> Bench Press: 15Kg/33Lb
> 
> Barbell Row: 10Kg/22Lb*
> 
> Considering all the variables: Wasn't consistent in training three times a week in the last 3 weeks of the cycle & this time of year isn't the most motivating, I'm really pleased with my lift increases :thumb:


Thats awesome progress Doug, wish I was progressing like that


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Just found the last weight improvement document from my previous cycle.
> 
> So here are my gains for 5 reps in the last 6-7 week cycle.
> 
> *Squat: 25Kg/55Lb
> 
> Deadlift: 30Kg/66Lb
> 
> Bench Press: 15Kg/33Lb
> 
> Barbell Row: 10Kg/22Lb*
> 
> Considering all the variables: Wasn't consistent in training three times a week in the last 3 weeks of the cycle & this time of year isn't the most motivating, I'm really pleased with my lift increases :thumb:


They are great gains mate, especially as you are over 1.5*BW on squats and deads and around BW on the bench :thumb:
As far as the program goes, don't change what's not broke - in fact, as you've just highlighted, it is anything but broke!
My personal opinion is to milk 3x5 for all you can get then change to an intermediate program like Madcow or Texas Method. This is exactly what I'm going to do.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thats awesome progress Doug, wish I was progressing like that





BareFacedGeek said:


> They are great gains mate, especially as you are over 1.5*BW on squats and deads and around BW on the bench :thumb:
> As far as the program goes, don't change what's not broke - in fact, as you've just highlighted, it is anything but broke!
> My personal opinion is to milk 3x5 for all you can get then change to an intermediate program like Madcow or Texas Method. This is exactly what I'm going to do.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


:thumb: Thanks for the support guys :thumb: 

I will start a new 3X5 cycle tonight, wish me luck :thumb:

Once gains have stopped on this I will move on to a 2X5 then a 1X5 :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Hello chaps :wave:

How are we all? I've had a nightmare month, working away an awful lot. Still been training as much as I can but a lot of the other little variables (recovery, diet, cardio) have taken a hit. I've been as good as possible and now ready to attack the final 7 weeks until the comp.

Also did some excellent work with a sports psychologist at the weekend. It was insane. Going to make a huge difference to my lifting I can tell.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Hello chaps :wave:
> 
> How are we all? I've had a nightmare month, working away an awful lot. Still been training as much as I can but a lot of the other little variables (recovery, diet, cardio) have taken a hit. I've been as good as possible and now ready to attack the final 7 weeks until the comp.
> 
> Also did some excellent work with a sports psychologist at the weekend. It was insane. Going to make a huge difference to my lifting I can tell.


Welcome back Dan :thumb:

Glad your good mate 

Another comp!!!!! Your a bloody animal mate, all the best for 7 weeks time :thumb: :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Yep, this time i'm getting back into the kit and going for a big squat and total. 

Although as I still cant get anywhere near depth in full gear, I might have to just qualify in a suit only, depending what I can do to get my bodyweight down to around 108.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Nice!*

Monday's 3X5

*Bench Press: 110Kg/242Lb 5, 3, 3 :thumb:

Squat: 162.5Kg/357.5Lb 3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 102.5Kg/225.5Lb 3X5* :thumb:

The 4 warm up sets before each lift made a big difference:

*Bench press*, first set felt relatively easy & my form was better due to the warm up sets, slight back arch, rest of my body stayed on the bench. However, I got bit keen & started set 2 within 2-3minutes & ended up with only 3 reps, the third set felt good & a fourth rep would have been possible, I will have to be a little more disciplined with regard to my rest periods between sets  

*Squat & Barbell row *felt much easier after the warm ups, the whole workout took around 70 minutes.

Very happy with today's results, I will monitor the Bench press & reduce the work sets if after a few weeks I'm struggling too much to get a full 3X5


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squat: 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x5, 122.5x5, 140x3
Bench press: 57.5x5, 72.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x5, 115x5
Barbell Rows: 60x3x5

I had a stressful day at work and had hardly any food so this was the crapest workout I had in a long time. You know its going to be bad when you have a grinder on your warm up sets. I got 3 reps of 140kg again but the reps were ugly, felt like I couldnt sit back and was just sitting straight down.

Bench Press my shoulder was clicking on the every rep and it never felt right. Im going to leave bench a few more weeks and see how it goes but probably deload soon to keep my shoulder healthy.

I just did 60kg rows to make sure I got them as I was shagged.

I think the main reason my friday workouts seem to always go well and my Monday workouts go crap is simply, diet. I played golf for 5 hours sunday and had nothing to eat and only drank 1.5L of water. This means Sunday I only had dinner and Monday I only had a small lunch before the gym Monday night. I dont think this is enough food for buuilding strength and muscle. Also the last couple of weeks I been doing low carb on my off days which probably isnt helping. And to make things worse I ran out of protein so been missing breakfast. Going to get my diet in check and see what happens.


----------



## impster

Right - here we go - week 2 of the programme for me.

Workout B - Squats, Overhead Press, and Deadlifts.

Squats at 42.8kg - 2.4kg more than last workout.
Overhead Press a dissapointing 29kgs - would have thought I could have matched my 33.6kg from last workouts' bench press - however, the 3rd set got a lot easier.
Deadlift at 42.kg - could have gone more, but my hollow 5ft york barbell has no room any more...

Finished off with a warm down of some press ups. 4x10 sets, with 1,2 then 4 minutes between them.

Some questions in the meantime:

1: Barbells - need a good cheap 1" barbell that will go up to 100kgs or so? Any recommendations
2: Squats - is there an alternative to squats when you ain't got no squat rack?
3: Deadlift - any harm in adding 5 shrugs of the shoulders at the highest point of each deadlift?
4: Reflex one stop protein shake - do you need to take 2 a day? It'll only last 2 weeks if I take 2 a day...



Impster


----------



## Guest

Harder workout than expected tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

*Dips* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

*Chins* (resistance band assisted - weight is BW-30kg)
WU:None
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Needed an extra set @20kg on the squat as the movement was feeling tight, even after some dymanic stretching. I suspect this was due to last sessions 1RMs. I was hoping the weight would feel light but unfortunately not - still the sets went ok and the bar went up at a reasonable rate.
Bench was tough too. Last rep of each set was a bit of a struggle. Again, suprised a little here since @62.5kg the bench felt fine.
Row was actually the best exercise of the night - all went up ok.
Chins and dips were a bit of a struggle too - hoped I'd get more reps on both.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Right - here we go - week 2 of the programme for me.
> 
> Workout B - Squats, Overhead Press, and Deadlifts.
> 
> Squats at 42.8kg - 2.4kg more than last workout.
> Overhead Press a dissapointing 29kgs - would have thought I could have matched my 33.6kg from last workouts' bench press - however, the 3rd set got a lot easier.
> Deadlift at 42.kg - could have gone more, but my hollow 5ft york barbell has no room any more...
> 
> Finished off with a warm down of some press ups. 4x10 sets, with 1,2 then 4 minutes between them.
> 
> Some questions in the meantime:
> 
> 1: Barbells - need a good cheap 1" barbell that will go up to 100kgs or so? Any recommendations
> 2: Squats - is there an alternative to squats when you ain't got no squat rack?
> 3: Deadlift - any harm in adding 5 shrugs of the shoulders at the highest point of each deadlift?
> 4: Reflex one stop protein shake - do you need to take 2 a day? It'll only last 2 weeks if I take 2 a day...
> 
> Impster


Most important!

3: Deadlift - any harm in adding 5 shrugs of the shoulders at the highest point of each deadlift? :doublesho:doublesho

*Not a good idea as the weight gets heavy you'll have a tendency to bend your arms & could tear a bicep*

If you want to shrug do shrugs :thumb:

4. I dont take any suppliments, why would you want to, are you going to compete? There is no alternative to REAL food, *have a big glass of milk twice a day instead*, dont be fooled by the fitness industry.

2. NO.

1. I bought my last 7' barbell on amazon :thumb: I would recomend you buy an olympic set as soon as you think this sport is for you :thumb:


----------



## impster

Thanks for that - just thought that adding a 'shrug' or two would 'add' something to the deadlift. I'll leave off the shrugging.

Since taking a supplement I've put on about a third of a stone in just over a week, I feel I need to put on some weight just to give me a boost really. Not going to 'compete', just wanting to get rid of this skinny frame I've got and add a little self confidence.

An olympic barbell sounds good, but I reckon what I need is something 'in between', that will hold up to 100kgs. I'll see what I can find.

Thanks again - I'm learning a lot from you ITHAQVA - it's much appreciated mate.


----------



## ntynan528

Alright guys, been folowing this thread for a while now. I started at the gym in november after an absence of about four years. I started stronglifts 5x5with the folowing wieghts

Squat 35k

bench 35k

rows 35k

press 20k

deadlift 40k

my bodywieght was 118k

Since then I have progressed to

squat 110k

bench 80k

row 80k

press 50k

deadlift 140k

Bodywieght now 110k

I think I have progressed well over the last 3 months. I had to deload most of my wieghts at points, mostly because I felt that my form wasnt as good as it should be. I now feel that all my lifts are performed with correct form and feel so much better for it. I also found that upping my rest time to 3 minutes during heavy lifts helped.
Im going to try and keep my updates coming but a busy lifestyle often gets in the way.
Lastly I'd like to thank everyone whos posted in the trhead as its been a great source of information and insperation to me.

Cheers,
Nicky


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Thanks for that - just thought that adding a 'shrug' or two would 'add' something to the deadlift. I'll leave off the shrugging.
> 
> Since taking a supplement I've put on about a third of a stone in just over a week, I feel I need to put on some weight just to give me a boost really. Not going to 'compete', just wanting to get rid of this skinny frame I've got and add a little self confidence.
> 
> An olympic barbell sounds good, but I reckon what I need is something 'in between', that will hold up to 100kgs. I'll see what I can find.
> 
> Thanks again - I'm learning a lot from you ITHAQVA - it's much appreciated mate.


Here is a 6'6" standard bar good enough to start with mate :thumb:

York 6ft 6' (200cm) Spinlock Beefy Bar: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Leisure :thumb:


----------



## impster

thanks for that - I notice that you can get this in either spinlock or plain (for spring clips presumably).

Which would you recommend (and I presume that my existing set of york vinyl weights will fit on this kit)?

Gonna order one based on your recommendation - so, no pressure then...


----------



## Guest

impster said:


> thanks for that - I notice that you can get this in either spinlock or plain (for spring clips presumably).
> 
> Which would you recommend (and I presume that my existing set of york vinyl weights will fit on this kit)?
> 
> Gonna order one based on your recommendation - so, no pressure then...


I found spin locks to be a pain tbh. Ended up using spring clips instead - much quicker to put on and remove.

With respect to squats, you could try getting hold of some builders trestles and doing bottom position squats - i.e. the bar starts on the trestles at the bottom position of the squat. You push the bar up from that position and back down again to perform a single rep. You miss out on the stretch reflex of the conventional squat, so they are harder, but they apparently do help the deadlift. The trestles will double up as catchers too.

Another option is to build your own. I know of a few people who have built squats stands and even full power racks out of wood. I nearly went down this route myself.

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf415-squat-and-dip-rack-with-spotter-catchers.php is another option, which I also considered before deciding to go for a full power rack and oly weight set.


----------



## Guest

ntynan528 said:


> Alright guys, been folowing this thread for a while now. I started at the gym in november after an absence of about four years. I started stronglifts 5x5with the folowing wieghts
> 
> Squat 35k
> 
> bench 35k
> 
> rows 35k
> 
> press 20k
> 
> deadlift 40k
> 
> my bodywieght was 118k
> 
> Since then I have progressed to
> 
> squat 110k
> 
> bench 80k
> 
> row 80k
> 
> press 50k
> 
> deadlift 140k
> 
> Bodywieght now 110k
> 
> I think I have progressed well over the last 3 months. I had to deload most of my wieghts at points, mostly because I felt that my form wasnt as good as it should be. I now feel that all my lifts are performed with correct form and feel so much better for it. I also found that upping my rest time to 3 minutes during heavy lifts helped.
> Im going to try and keep my updates coming but a busy lifestyle often gets in the way.
> Lastly I'd like to thank everyone whos posted in the trhead as its been a great source of information and insperation to me.
> 
> Cheers,
> Nicky


That's great progress Nicky. Keep up the good work :thumb:
You're right about the rest time between sets. Don't allow enough rest time and you be battling against fatigue rather than strength to get you next set completed.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's great progress Nicky. Keep up the good work :thumb:
> You're right about the rest time between sets. Don't allow enough rest time and you be battling against fatigue rather than strength to get you next set completed.


Agree, nice work Nicky :thumb:, rest between work sets can go up to 5 minutes if need be when the weights get heavy :thumb: :devil:


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> 4. I dont take any suppliments, why would you want to, are you going to compete? There is no alternative to REAL food, *have a big glass of milk twice a day instead*, dont be fooled by the fitness industry.


I must admit that I do use supplements.

I use a basic protein shake to ensure I'm getting enough protein. I aim for 1g per lb of lean bodyweight. Currently, I'm using http://www.bulkpowders.co.uk/produc...in_concentrate_82___instantised_#.T0zCQYeSe88
I also take a fish oil which is definately helping my joints.
I also take creatine to aid recovery, but I'm not sure if that is helping or not so I may drop it once my tub runs out.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I found spin locks to be a pain tbh. Ended up using spring clips instead - much quicker to put on and remove.
> 
> With respect to squats, you could try getting hold of some builders trestles and doing bottom position squats - i.e. the bar starts on the trestles at the bottom position of the squat. You push the bar up from that position and back down again to perform a single rep. You miss out on the stretch reflex of the conventional squat, so they are harder, but they apparently do help the deadlift. The trestles will double up as catchers too.
> 
> Another option is to build your own. I know of a few people who have built squats stands and even full power racks out of wood. I nearly went down this route myself.
> 
> http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf415-squat-and-dip-rack-with-spotter-catchers.php is another option, which I also considered before deciding to go for a full power rack and oly weight set.


Yes, sorry impster, go for spring collar version :thumb:

I nearly went for the above squat rack but for a little more you can get a full power rack :devil: :thumb:

Think about how far you intend to go with it then decide on what is the most viable option in regards to equipment :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I must admit that I do use supplements.
> 
> I use a basic protein shake to ensure I'm getting enough protein. I aim for 1g per lb of lean bodyweight. Currently, I'm using http://www.bulkpowders.co.uk/produc...in_concentrate_82___instantised_#.T0zCQYeSe88
> I also take a fish oil which is definately helping my joints.
> I also take creatine to aid recovery, but I'm not sure if that is helping or not so I may drop it once my tub runs out.


Something we talked about on here before Phil, do you think the fish oil has helped with your joints?  As i feel powerlifting puts stress on joints & some mornings i feel a little stiff (Leave it!!!!! )


----------



## impster

ITHAQVA said:


> Think about how far you intend to go with it then decide on what is the most viable option in regards t oequipment :thumb:


Well, it's only been a week and a half really, but I do find myself looking forward to my 5x5 session, and motivation is not an issue (although I thought it would be) at the moment. In addition, I'm convinced that i can see some changes (particularly shoulders) in my 'physique' (though that may be wishful thinking...).

Being a skinny framed lad, one thing I've always lacked is self confidence when it comes to stuff like going swimming etc. I've three kids, the oldest of which love swimming, and are always asking me to go with them. The time has come to man up to this, so I want to get rid of this skinny frame and build myself up to a stage where I'll be comfortable in 'bearing' all so to speak.

As I'm enjoying it, and as it's doing me some real good, I'm gonna carry on until I reach a point that I'm happy with, and we'll see if I decide to carry on.

So, with that in mind, I best be getting on with it. I'll go order a beefy bar, and see if I can find a good used squat rack, or make one.

Thanks guys.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Something we talked about on here before Phil, do you think the fish oil has helped with your joints?  As i feel powerlifting puts stress on joints & some mornings i feel a little stiff (Leave it!!!!! )


I do think it's helped. 
I started getting pains in my ankle joints most mornings - almost like they were slightly out of joint and made walking a little uncomfortable for the first hour or two of each day. Walking down stairs, first thing in the morning, could actually be quite painful on some days.
I did try some mobility exercises to try and help but didn't have much success. Within a day or two of taking fish oil, the pains have stopped and have not reoccurred.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Well, it's only been a week and a half really, but I do find myself looking forward to my 5x5 session, and motivation is not an issue (although I thought it would be) at the moment.


Just something to bare in mind mate.

Your motivation as a begginer is always high.....until

1. The weights get very heavy.
2. You start to get sticking points.

Consider this when investing money in your new hobby :thumb:

For me its no issue, I have lifted weights more years than i can remember & I will continue to do so in one form or another until im unable to do so :devil: :thumb:


----------



## MarkH

How many months have you been doing the same exercises?


----------



## impster

ITHAQVA said:


> Just something to bare in mind mate.
> 
> Your motivation as a begginer is always high.....until
> 
> 1. The weights get very heavy.
> 2. You start to get sticking points.
> 
> Consider this when investing money in your new hobby :thumb:
> 
> For me its no issue, I have lifted weights more years than i can remember & I will continue to do so in one form or another until im unable to do so :devil: :thumb:


Good job I've started posting on this thread then eh? Plenty of motivation on here. I also work with a chap who's ex commando and ex copper - I've told him that I've started and he's on my case making sure I'm hitting my own goals etc. Also, the wife does the EA Sports Active 2 on the wii - 3 times a week, so whilst she's doing that, I pop into my garage to do my thing on the weights at the same time. Works well - but, as you say, it's early days.

BTW I've ordered the York Beefy Bar and spring clips so they should be arriving in a few days.


----------



## ITHAQVA

I thought i would post my latest 3X5 routine for all you guys (The below doesnt include my warm up sets)

One thing i do different is train in two week cycles so i squat only once one week & twice the following. The week i squat once i deadlift twice :thumb:

*Week 1

Monday or Tuesday
BENCH PRESS- 110 KG__/__/__/
SQUAT-162.5 KG__/__/__/
BARBELL ROW-102.5 KG__/__/__/

Wed or Thursday
DEADLIFT-167.5 KG__/
PULL-UP __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS- 87.5 KG__/__/__/

Fri or Sat
BENCH PRESS- ????KG__/__/__/
SQUAT-????KG__/__/__/
BARBELL ROW-????KG__/__/__/

Week 2

Monday or Tuesday
DEADLIFT-????KG__/
PULL-UP __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS-????KG__/__/__/

Wed or Thursday
BENCH PRESS-????KG__/__/__/
SQUAT-????KG__/__/__/
BARBELL ROW-????KG__/__/__/

Fri or Sat
DEADLIFT-????KG__/
PULL-UP __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS-????KG__/__/__/*

After week 2 is complete i go back to week 1 & so on, this cycles all my lifts & they all get a much attention as each other each month, it also varies my workouts, I would find squatting 2-3 times every week a real chore & the above works for me very well, give it a go chaps :thumb:

Any questions, feel free to ask  :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'd die if I deadlifed twice per week!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I'd die if I deadlifed twice per week!


Thats becasue your lifting real weigths Dan :devil: :thumb:, im still working on it, I would love to get 200Kg for 5 reps within the next 6 months :devil:

I got my deadlift session tonight :thumb: :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I've got a rest day today, well some cardio and thats it. Then suited squats tomorrow night. Starting to work out my comp attempts!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I've got a rest day today, well some cardio and thats it. Then suited squats tomorrow night. Starting to work out my comp attempts!


:devil::devil: Armour plated powerlifting :devil::devil: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Lol

My training cycle has been a bit rubbish this time round. Havent been able to fit into my kit properly, need everything a size up really and my work schedule has screwed up my lower back strength. So just trying to do bits of extra work to make it come up a bit faster.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Lol
> 
> My training cycle has been a bit rubbish this time round. Havent been able to fit into my kit properly, need everything a size up really and my work schedule has screwed up my lower back strength. So just trying to do bits of extra work to make it come up a bit faster.


I bet your kit is a real PITA to get on & off if it's too small mate.


----------



## impster

Question re squats:

In the absence of a squat rack to aid getting the barbell 'into position' on my shoulder/back, would front squats be an alternative (woulndt' have to lift the damn thing over my head)?

Thanks

Workout 'A' later tonight. Looking forward to it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Question re squats:
> 
> In the absence of a squat rack to aid getting the barbell 'into position' on my shoulder/back, would front squats be an alternative (woulndt' have to lift the damn thing over my head)?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Workout 'A' later tonight. Looking forward to it.


The front squat is not something I would recommend to any beginner without someone there to help/spot/coach until your used to the exercise :thumb:

Because of the "high bar" position of the front squat, you will find you'll have to start with light weight again to find your natural squat bar position once you start using the traditional squat.

I used the deadlift as an alternative, yes its back exercise but it also hits the legs. I would rather deadlift than front squat any day :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Happy with progress.*

Wednesdays Powerlifting

*Deadlift: 167.5Kg/368.5Lb 1X5 :thumb:

Pull-Up - bodyweight: 105Kg/229LB :doublesho : P 3½ /N 2, P 2½ /N 3, P 2¼ /N 3, P 1½, P 1 :thumb: (I consider a pull-up when it is done with an overhand grip)

Close Grip Bench Press: 87.5Kg/192.5Lb 3X5* :thumb:

Deadlift felt very good, I pulled 5 nice clean reps with shoulders back on the lockout of each rep, it did feel heavy though.

Pull-ups improving slowly but in the right direction I added two more sets to try to hit the area a little harder. *P = Positive Rep, N = Negative Rep (I combine the positive & negative reps for a total of no more than 5 reps on the first 3 sets)*:thumb:

Close Grip Bench Press, if you're wondering why I'm using such a light weight. I'm doing what I've done with all the exercises, start light & build up to my optimum training weight, safety first at my age  :thumb:

Thats lifting done till Saturday :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

So it doesn't need to be on set days then? Like a day gap in between? 

I will start Mon, Wed & Thur. But for any reason, I could leave Wed till Thur, then Sat?

What do you do for warm ups?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> So it doesn't need to be on set days then? Like a day gap in between?
> 
> I will start *Mon, Wed & Thur*. But for any reason, I could leave Wed till Thur, then Sat?
> 
> What do you do for warm ups?


As long as you train 3 times a week with at least a *full day & nights *rest between workouts i dont see a problem at all Matt.

The above in red isnt a good idea as your not recovering properly (Wed-Thur), you'll need to go - Mon - Wed - Friday or Saturday. Or you could do a - Tue - Thur-Sat or Sunday

My warm up consists of 10-15 minute body movements/exercises.

Then before each exercise i do the below(In Kg) :thumb:

Workout 1

*BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2

SQUAT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2

BARBELL ROW 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 *

Workout 2

*DEADLIFT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2

C G BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 *

I'll re asses the warm up weights every 5 weeks & increase accordingly :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Ooops, Thur meant to say Friday. 

So you warm up doing the same excersise but less weight?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Ooops, Thur meant to say Friday.
> 
> So you warm up doing the same excersise but less weight?


Yep less weight otherwise you'll pre exhaust the muscle group & be unable to complete the work sets (in my case I'm now on 3 work sets) or be able to judge if you've failed to reach your reps due to pre exhausted muscles or that you really haven't got strong enough to reach your goal yet :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow Workout:
Light Box Squats: 70 x 5, 87.5 x 5, 105 x 5, 105 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 35 x 5, 42.5 x 5, 50 x 5, 57.5 x 5
Deadlifts: 95 x 5, 115 x 5, 132.5 x 5, 152.5 x 5

Box squats felt good but always do on light day, just use them to work on form and speed.

Shoulder Press felt really good, Im not to sure about Madcow yet but it defiantly works on shoulder press as my shoulder never really hurts whereas with 5x5 it would kill after about the 3rd set.

Deadlifts felt good really concentrating on tensing every muscle in my back so Im pulling with good form.

I increased my food intake yesterday by having my normal meals but adding 5 glasses of milk as well. I worked out that my strength progress has been slow but I lost 5kg at the same time and its extremely hard to increase strength without extra calories so from now on I will be consuming alot more food on training days.


----------



## Matt.

ITHAQVA said:


> Yep less weight otherwise you'll pre exhaust the muscle group & be unable to complete the work sets (in my case I'm now on 3 work sets) or be able to judge if you've failed to reach your reps due to pre exhausted muscles or that you really haven't got strong enough to reach your goal yet :thumb:


So really it's 10x5? But the first 5x5 are low weights?


----------



## impster

A good workout tonight - limited by the capacity/length of my hollow 'york' barbell (not to worry though, a 6'6" beefy bar weighing in at 10kgs is on it's way to me.

Anyway - here's tonight's synopsis:

Squats remain at 42.8kgs. No more room on the barbell with the weights I've got.

Bench -40.4kgs, up from previous 33.6kgs. Last set was a trembler, but made it.

Rows - 40.4kgs, up from previous 38.2 kgs. I need to raise the barbell off the floor a bit to enable me to get a better posture i think. Did this temporarily tonight with some bricks (!). 4th and 5thset were much easier than the first 3.

Finished off with 5x10 press ups (which are getting easier every workout, so something is working ok), and nearly went for a run afterwards (felt full of energy after tonights session), but decided to watch masterchef instead.

Going to see if I can get hold of or make a squat stand. Being without one is going to hold me back i reckon, don't want to risk an injury so early on.


----------



## Bod42

Matt. said:


> So really it's 10x5? But the first 5x5 are low weights?


Decrease the reps as you increase the weight during warm ups so I do:
Bar Only 2 sets of 5 reps
50% of work weight for 5 reps.
75% of work weight for 3 reps.
90% of work weight for 1 rep.


----------



## Guest

Matt. said:


> So really it's 10x5? But the first 5x5 are low weights?


Not quite. You warm up to get you muscles/joints/tendons etc used to pulling/pushing weight. If you jump straight in at your work weight you risk injury.
The idea is to start with an empty bar (an olympic bar weighs 20kg). Then step up in roughly equal increments until you reach your work weight.
When using an empty bar, use as many sets (of 5 reps each) as you feel necessary. The recommendation is for at least 2 sets.
Then your early weighted warmup sets will all be @ 1x5 (1 set of 5 reps). However, as you approach your work weight, reduce the reps.

It probably better explained here: http://stronglifts.com/5-rules-to-find-your-perfect-warm-up-weight/

Hope this helps.

Edit - I type too slowly


----------



## Guest

Had a better session tonight

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Chins* (resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+2.5kg=67.5kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squat was fine today. I can tell I've got 100kg/220lbs on my back but it all moved ok.
Press - my first fail since returning to training. Actually quite happy as it's at my previous PR and only on the last rep. Was quite tough but hey it's the OHP - it's supposed to be tough 
Dead went up fine. However, I skimped on the warmup sets and it felt like I was about to dislocate a knuckle on the WO set. I obviously hadn't allowed my hands to adapt to holding that sort of weight - lesson learnt!
I've moved to adding weight, with a dipping belt, to my chins. I'll do these at 5x5 and increase by 2.5kg as per normal weighted exercises. I'll now do chins on DL day and dips on bench/row day.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Had a better session tonight
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Chins* (resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+2.5kg=67.5kg)
> WU: None
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Squat was fine today. I can tell I've got 100kg/220lbs on my back but it all moved ok.
> Press - my first fail since returning to training. Actually quite happy as it's at my previous PR and only on the last rep. Was quite tough but hey it's the OHP - it's supposed to be tough
> Dead went up fine. However, I skimped on the warmup sets and it felt like I was about to dislocate a knuckle on the WO set. I obviously hadn't allowed my hands to adapt to holding that sort of weight - lesson learnt!
> I've moved to adding weight, with a dipping belt, to my chins. I'll do these at 5x5 and increase by 2.5kg as per normal weighted exercises. I'll now do chins on DL day and dips on bench/row day.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Nice workout Phil,

Why do you use an assistant band and then use a Weight belt as well. I take it you dont have a lighter band or its to big jump between the bands so your using the belt to ake smaller jumps.

Just rememeber if this is the case and your using the weight belt to add weight slowly that your actually making the exercise alot harder for yourself as a band, depending on the length will have 30kg of help at the bottom but possibly zero help at the top. The top is also the hardest part of a chin/pull up so really your making the top part 2.5kg heavier than your body weight.

I explained that badly but hopefully you get when I mean. I used to use bands for help with high rep work and then just do high sets of singles for chin ups. Now im doing 6 rep ladders for chin ups which i find work really well


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Nice workout Phil,
> 
> Why do you use an assistant band and then use a Weight belt as well. I take it you dont have a lighter band or its to big jump between the bands so your using the belt to ake smaller jumps.
> 
> Just rememeber if this is the case and your using the weight belt to add weight slowly that your actually making the exercise alot harder for yourself as a band, depending on the length will have 30kg of help at the bottom but possibly zero help at the top. The top is also the hardest part of a chin/pull up so really your making the top part 2.5kg heavier than your body weight.
> 
> I explained that badly but hopefully you get when I mean. I used to use bands for help with high rep work and then just do high sets of singles for chin ups. Now im doing 6 rep ladders for chin ups which i find work really well


Thanks James.

I only have the one resistance band so, yes, I'm adding weight to counteract its level of assistance. You are quite right, at the top of the movement it is giving me pretty much zero lift, so by adding weight I'll be pulling over my BW. I'm just going to see how it goes. If it get too tricky I'll revert to a more conventional chin-up program :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> I bet your kit is a real PITA to get on & off if it's too small mate.


Not as bad as you'd think. It goes on, just I lose the circulation to my feet! :lol: that and I cant hit depth at all


----------



## Matt.

BareFacedGeek said:


> Not quite. You warm up to get you muscles/joints/tendons etc used to pulling/pushing weight. If you jump straight in at your work weight you risk injury.
> The idea is to start with an empty bar (an olympic bar weighs 20kg). Then step up in roughly equal increments until you reach your work weight.
> When using an empty bar, use as many sets (of 5 reps each) as you feel necessary. The recommendation is for at least 2 sets.
> Then your early weighted warmup sets will all be @ 1x5 (1 set of 5 reps). However, as you approach your work weight, reduce the reps.
> 
> It probably better explained here: http://stronglifts.com/5-rules-to-find-your-perfect-warm-up-weight/
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Edit - I type too slowly


So after reading that I read it as follows;

2 sets of 5 reps with just the bar
1x3 with a little more weight
1x2 with more weight than previous 
5x5 at the weight of your workout

Would I do this before each excersise? Or just before the first excersise?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> So after reading that I read it as follows;
> 
> 2 sets of 5 reps with just the bar
> 1x3 with a little more weight
> 1x2 with more weight than previous
> 5x5 at the weight of your workout
> 
> Would I do this before each excersise? Or just before the first excersise?


Each exercise :thumb: Now go lift! :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Can’t believe it, I’ve got slight DOMS today :doublesho traps, back, upper arms & lower back, probably down to the two extra set on the pull-up, that'll learn me


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Not as bad as you'd think. It goes on, just I lose the circulation to my feet! :lol: that and I cant hit depth at all


Holy ! That cant be good for you mate :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Held back long enough, going to order one of these tonight as soon as the peeps at Zuluglove get back to me 

http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-powerlifting-belt---jet-black-24-p.asp

http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-2-powerlifting-belt--jet-black-28-p.asp

I just have to have one of these in my life   Thanks for the links Dan :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Held back long enough, going to order one of these tonight as soon as the peeps at Zuluglove get back to me
> 
> http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-powerlifting-belt---jet-black-24-p.asp
> 
> http://www.zuluglove.com/powerlifting-belt--defcon-evolution-2-powerlifting-belt--jet-black-28-p.asp
> 
> I just have to have one of these in my life   Thanks for the links Dan :thumb:


There one of the nicest belts I seen, really makes me want to get a belt and see how much carry over it has in my lifts. I only ever used a normal prong belt before, didnt realise you could get leverage belts


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Not as bad as you'd think. It goes on, just I lose the circulation to my feet! :lol: that and I cant hit depth at all


I be worried what else the squat suit is cutting the circulation off to something in the grional area more than my feet :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> There one of the nicest belts I seen, really makes me want to get a belt and see how much carry over it has in my lifts. I only ever used a normal prong belt before, didnt realise you could get leverage belts


Hopefully they will answer my email today James, ill post some pics once my belt arrives mate :thumb:

I don't wear my belts tight. The best way to describe the way i wear a belt is it becomes a little tight on the lowest part of the deadlift & squat, im trying to condition myself to not have too much assistance from the belt on my lifts for as long as i can :thumb:

I'm trying to keep my core strong especially for Deadlifts & Squats. Just wearing a belt gives you more confidence even though i know it's not really doing anything, you'd be surprised how easily it is to trick the old mind


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I be worried what else the squat suit is cutting the circulation off to something in the grional area more than my feet :doublesho


:lol::lol::lol::lol:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys last nights gym session consisted of

Squat 112.5k 5,5,5

Bench 82.5k 5,5,5,5,5

row 82.5k 5,5,5,5,5

Dips @ body weight 5,5,5,5,5

Workout felt good, squats were hard but felt no worse than they have felt since about 95k. Always just seem to grind out the last set


----------



## Guest

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys last nights gym session consisted of
> 
> Squat 112.5k 5,5,5
> 
> Bench 82.5k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> row 82.5k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Dips @ body weight 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Workout felt good, squats were hard but felt no worse than they have felt since about 95k. Always just seem to grind out the last set


Good workout :thumb: I've just hit 100kg again on the squat, so it's good to hear that it doesn't start to feel worse as the weight goes up (at least in the short term ).


----------



## Guest

I need to start working on my core again, so last night I did the following:

*Prone Bridge*
[email protected]

*Ab Wheel Rollouts*
[email protected]

*Glute Bridges*
[email protected]

All quite easy, so I probably need to start weighting them.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Good workout :thumb: I've just hit 100kg again on the squat, so it's good to hear that it doesn't start to feel worse as the weight goes up (at least in the short term ).


Have to agree, although my deadlift, squat & bench press "feel heavy" the feel of the weights doesn't feel any heavier than the lighter weights before (I hope this makes sense), I suppose this is a good indicator that you are progressively getting stronger?


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Have to agree, although my deadlift, squat & bench press "feel heavy" the feel of the weights doesn't feel any heavier than the lighter weights before (I hope this makes sense), I suppose this is a good indicator that you are progressively getting stronger?


That's just reminded me of this:



Henry Rollins said:


> The Iron never lies to you. You can walk outside and listen to all kinds of talk, get told that you're a god or a total *******. The Iron will always kick you the real deal. The Iron is the great reference point, the all-knowing perspective giver. Always there like a beacon in the pitch black. I have found the Iron to be my greatest friend. It never freaks out on me, never runs. Friends may come and go. But two hundred pounds is always two hundred pounds.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Lever belts are so much easier than prong belts IMO. Just snap on and go. 

The only thing being is you need a phillips in your gym bag for any on the fly adjustments. And I forgot mine last night and needed it!

Session went well, decided to go suit only, sans briefs but with good tight straps. Session went something like this:

Bar (Texas Squat Bar - 25kg) x 5x3
75x5x2
125x3x2 (Added Belt)
175x3x2 (Suit bottoms)
225x3 
275x1 (Full Gear, last warm up)
295x1 (Opener)
325x1x2 (Reverse Strong Bands - Planned 2nd)
350x1x2 (Reverse Strong Bands - Planned 3rd)

Weight all moved well, but I had a real problem keeping my core braced and as a result I was letting all my gas out. Led to me shaking in the hole so I had to cut each squat high. Otherwise I kept my form pretty well, the weight moved fast and it was ok. Just need to really hammer on my abs over the next few weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

^^^^^^^ :doublesho 350Kg!!! :doublesho :devil:

I think holy  ing  ! springs to mind Dan, thats some weight mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

It felt good on the back, but my technique needs a lot of work.

Weak abs, weak upper back and my knees had some forward drift.





 - this is an example of perfect multiply squat form. His knees track perfectly and he stays very very upright.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Zuluglove havent got back to me 

So I called the chaps at *www.pullum-sports.co.uk*, absolutely brilliant!. The guy i spoke to spent over half an hour chatting & helping me spend my money , the Zulu glove belt is a tad under £20 cheaper but Pullum's put a lot of effort into helping me with all my questions, so I've spent my money with them instead :thumb::thumb:

Hopefully this will be with me soon http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...ede-duel-prong-powerlifting-belt/prod_24.html :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Really enjoyable session tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips* (Resistance band assisted with weight belt - weight is BW-30kg+2.5kg=67.5kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

All exercises felt good tonight. First WO sets on the squat and bench were a little ragged but the final two sets on each were fine.
Decided to start warming up properly on the rows. WO sets felt better for it.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Lever belts are so much easier than prong belts IMO. Just snap on and go.
> 
> The only thing being is you need a phillips in your gym bag for any on the fly adjustments. And I forgot mine last night and needed it!
> 
> Session went well, decided to go suit only, sans briefs but with good tight straps. Session went something like this:
> 
> Bar (Texas Squat Bar - 25kg) x 5x3
> 75x5x2
> 125x3x2 (Added Belt)
> 175x3x2 (Suit bottoms)
> 225x3
> 275x1 (Full Gear, last warm up)
> 295x1 (Opener)
> 325x1x2 (Reverse Strong Bands - Planned 2nd)
> 350x1x2 (Reverse Strong Bands - Planned 3rd)
> 
> Weight all moved well, but I had a real problem keeping my core braced and as a result I was letting all my gas out. Led to me shaking in the hole so I had to cut each squat high. Otherwise I kept my form pretty well, the weight moved fast and it was ok. Just need to really hammer on my abs over the next few weeks.


Jesus, I don't even think I could lift 350kg out of the rack.

Why the screw driver, the pics of the belt look like they have normal holes and the prongs go in the holes and then u leaver the belt over to tighten it


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: Box Squat:70x5, 87.5x5, 105x5, 122.5x5, 142.5x2, 105kgx8
Bench press: 57.5x5, 72.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x5, 117.5x5, 87.5x8 
Pendlay Rows: 70x3x5

squats are going up but god their a grind. I'm so slow, even my warm up sets feel like grinders so I think some speed work would really help me.

Bench press was an easy 2reps with 117.5 so pleased with that. What people are saying about heavier weight not feeling any worse once they get stronger, I was thinking exactly the same on my last warm up set. The weight felt brilliant and it was only a few weeks back that was my work weight, its that feeling that makes.me work out.

Training back for more volume as i think this works better for me


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout: Box Squat:70x5, 87.5x5, 105x5, 122.5x5, 142.5x2, 105kgx8
> Bench press: 57.5x5, 72.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x5, 117.5x5, 87.5x8
> Pendlay Rows: 70x3x5
> 
> squats are going up but god their a grind. I'm so slow, even my warm up sets feel like grinders so I think some speed work would really help me.
> 
> Bench press was an easy 2reps with 117.5 so pleased with that. What people are saying about heavier weight not feeling any worse once they get stronger, I was thinking exactly the same on my last warm up set. The weight felt brilliant and it was only a few weeks back that was my work weight, its that feeling that makes.me work out.
> 
> Training back for more volume as i think this works better for me


Nice one James, your bench is getting better each week mate :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> There one of the nicest belts I seen, really makes me want to get a belt and see how much carry over it has in my lifts. I only ever used a normal prong belt before, didnt realise you could get leverage belts


Spoke to the guy a Pullum sports, he said you could add around 10Kg to your Bench by wearing a belt :doublesho


----------



## impster

Missed last night's workout due to a prior engagement. So have just done it now instead 

My 'beefy bar' hasn't arrived yet, so still limited by the set up i've got (for squats and deadlift at least).

Anyway, managed to squeeze an extra couple of kgs on the bar for squats and deadlift, so some progress made...

Squats: 45kg (was 42.8kg)
Overhead press: 33.6kg (was 29kg)
Deadlift: 45kg (was 42.8kg)

Finished off with 1x20 press ups, and 4x10 press ups.

Dissapointed with my overhead press - tried going for 35.8kg but failed after 4th rep. strangely, the 3rd, 4th and 5th rep at 33.6kg was much easier than the first two at that weight. I can bench press a lot more than this though.

That's all for now. Progress being made, for sure.

Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Missed last night's workout due to a prior engagement. So have just done it now instead
> 
> My 'beefy bar' hasn't arrived yet, so still limited by the set up i've got (for squats and deadlift at least).
> 
> Anyway, managed to squeeze an extra couple of kgs on the bar for squats and deadlift, so some progress made...
> 
> Squats: 45kg (was 42.8kg)
> Overhead press: 33.6kg (was 29kg)
> Deadlift: 45kg (was 42.8kg)
> 
> Finished off with 1x20 press ups, and 4x10 press ups.
> 
> Dissapointed with my overhead press - tried going for 35.8kg but failed after 4th rep. strangely, the 3rd, 4th and 5th rep at 33.6kg was much easier than the first two at that weight. I can bench press a lot more than this though.
> 
> That's all for now. Progress being made, for sure.
> 
> Impster


Once you get around 50Kg-60Kg try the below;

If you make3-4 reps on 50-60KGkg that's not a failure. I don't deload weight as i prefer to lower the reps & build on them if I get a plateau/sticking point, for example if you can do 3 good reps 50-60kg, next session aim for four, the following session aim for five, then add 2.5Kg & start again (The Progressive Overload Principle), then once progress slows, go for Dan's (sidewalkdances) approach stay at the weight & Dominate it for a while, I did this with my Barbell row & now I'm rowing 102.5 KG for reps after being stuck around the 98- 100Kg mark (thanks to Dan for this Info) :thumb:

It's common for the shoulders to take a while to warm up (Thanks MarkH for this info :thumb, you'll find this is also true with the bench press, I think it's due to the fact you're not actually hitting an area as directly as you do with the deadlift & squat. I used to find the second & third set of the overhead press easier than the first, it also highlights how beneficial warming up can be to help you lift more on certain parts of the body, now that I'm taking a more structured approach to warming up I'm finding it less apparent.

Also as the shoulder is prone area for injury, once I am able to overhead press again I'll do several extra warm up sets before the work sets, 
something like this:
Warm up sets: 20Kg X5, 20Kg X 5, 20Kg X5, 30Kg X5, 40Kg X5, 40Kg X3, 50Kg X3
Work sets: 62Kg X5, 62Kg X5, 62Kg X5

Of the 5 or 6 who post here I think I'm right in saying at least 3 of us have shoulder related issues (although mine is just below the left shoulder & only effects the overhead press), so please listen to the great advice by the guys on here, my injury wasn't done while powerlifting but as I reached the 60Kg mark the pain made the overhead press difficult, ill let it heal then return to it. But im not too worried, im finding the Bench press is developing my shoulders BONUS! :thumb:

I had a poor/stupid warm up routine for most of the years I trained; I consider myself very lucky to not have had any injuries in the past, when I was in my mid-twenties used to get under the machine, bench press & squat 180Kg for reps after one warm up set of 10 reps with less than 10Kg :doublesho & do standing calf raises with 380Kg plus with the same stupid approach.

My attitude now, if I can't warm up I'm not lifting :thumb:


----------



## impster

Thanks again. All good advice which I'll follow. By the way, should I warm up as described for every single part of the programme? Even deadlifts?

Anyway, Even after this short time (2-3weeks) I am noticing (positive) changes - I'm up from 9 and a half stone to almost 10 stone (was 10stone exactly before I went to bed last night, down to 9stone 12 this morning!) - a mixture of getting a more substantial breakfast, mid morning snack (usually a banana or 2), an extra sandwich and yoghurt for lunch, and a slightly meatier dinner. I'm also taking (when I can) 2 servings of reflex one stop per day (one mid afternoon, and one around 8pm or after a workout). I'm mixing it with milk instead of water also.

From now on I'll only take one serving a day, as It's expensive stuff.

I'm also more 'defined' around the shoulders, and my upper arms are plumping out a bit (which is exactly what I'm hoping for). I don't carry any fat on me, so the additional weight has to be muscle (?), and I suppose with a frame like mine it will show pretty early on. Still early days though.

2 big diferences though is the amount of energy I have - particulary in the mornings. I'm far less 'drained' when I get up. Also, the amount of press ups I can do has changed big time - I can do them a lot faster and can do a lot more of them than before. Yesterday I did 60 press ups - 20, then 4 lots of 10, with around a minute between each set. There's no way I would have done that before.

Anyway - many thanks for all the advice on here. I should have started on this years ago.

Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Thanks again. All good advice which I'll follow. By the way, should I warm up as described for every single part of the programme? Even deadlifts?
> 
> Anyway, Even after this short time (2-3weeks) I am noticing (positive) changes - I'm up from 9 and a half stone to almost 10 stone (was 10stone exactly before I went to bed last night, down to 9stone 12 this morning!) - a mixture of getting a more substantial breakfast, mid morning snack (usually a banana or 2), an extra sandwich and yoghurt for lunch, and a slightly meatier dinner. I'm also taking (when I can) 2 servings of reflex one stop per day (one mid afternoon, and one around 8pm or after a workout). I'm mixing it with milk instead of water also.
> 
> From now on I'll only take one serving a day, as It's expensive stuff.
> 
> I'm also more 'defined' around the shoulders, and my upper arms are plumping out a bit (which is exactly what I'm hoping for). I don't carry any fat on me, so the additional weight has to be muscle (?), and I suppose with a frame like mine it will show pretty early on. Still early days though.
> 
> 2 big diferences though is the amount of energy I have - particulary in the mornings. I'm far less 'drained' when I get up. Also, the amount of press ups I can do has changed big time - I can do them a lot faster and can do a lot more of them than before. Yesterday I did 60 press ups - 20, then 4 lots of 10, with around a minute between each set. There's no way I would have done that before.
> 
> Anyway - many thanks for all the advice on here. I should have started on this years ago.
> 
> Impster


Definitely warm up sets for every exercise. Get into the habit :thumb:

At the moment your warm ups are more important from the point of view to getting you to learn to listen to your body, how it moves throughout the lifts & to lift in the correct form.

Once the weights get heavier the warm ups will be very important to ensure you don't injure yourself & to be more inclined to lift heavy. Ever since I've started to warm up properly I no longer go into the gym feeling tired before I start. Warming up makes the heavier weights much easier from a psychological point of view if you get my meaning, you "get into the workout" much easier if you warm up :thumb:

Yes your muscularity will show up much more than a bigger guy carrying more body fat (I.E Myself), muscularity is largely down to body fat content, I carry around 22-25% body fat, if I reduced my body fat by 5%, even though I'm not & don't plan to be, I would look like a body builder, my only drive to reduce body fat is from the health point of view & once my main lift goals are reached I will switch to a 1X5 work set & increase my warm up sets to add more volume to help reduce body fat & improve cardio vascular fitness.

If muscularity is your main goal, you'll find you'll reach it in a short period of time, if you want be :devil: stronger & stronger :devil:; powerlifting is for you & will be for a long time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sunday's Powerlifting

*Bench Press: 110Kg/242Lb--5, 4, 3 :thumb:

Squat: 165Kg/363Lb--3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 105Kg/231Lb--4, 3, 3* :thumb:

Bench Press, only rested a minute or so on last set, still happy, I will aim for 5,4,4 next session.

Squat, good sets, felt very strong on this & the weight moved up at a good pace.

Barbell row, the 105Kg is feeling heavy, but not really heavy, could of got a few extra reps out but wanted to concentrate on form & build the reps slowly.

:thumb:


----------



## MarkH

impster said:


> Question re squats:
> 
> In the absence of a squat rack to aid getting the barbell 'into position' on my shoulder/back, would front squats be an alternative (woulndt' have to lift the damn thing over my head)?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Workout 'A' later tonight. Looking forward to it.


Front squats are fine, you can power clean the weight up and if your wrists/elbows are flexible enough fine if not you can use this method, try to use a slightly better from though!

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...s-snWr29A&sig2=yuGvT31qdiK9lxVRenueyA&cad=rja

and

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Arti...Best_Tips_for_Increasing_the_Front_Squat.aspx

ITH if your joints are getting stiff and you have been doing the same exercise for six months it may be time for 2-3 change of exercise routine, a mini off season, it reaps a lot of benefits and you come through the other side stronger and healthier!


----------



## ITHAQVA

MarkH said:


> ITH if your joints are getting stiff and you have been doing the same exercise for six months it may be time for 2-3 change of exercise routine, a mini off season, it reaps a lot of benefits and you come through the other side stronger and healthier!


Thanks for the advice Mark, i should of taken the week off after the last cycle but couldn't bring myself to  Next cycle end (7 weeks' time) I will take the full week away from my weights & power rack (although ill have to see them at least once a day to let them know I've not forgotten them ).

In your experience, is there a real benefit to stretches/cool downs after the workout?

Would it also be a good idea to do a stretch routine on the off days to help with over all flexibility?


----------



## impster

Beefy bar has arrived. Weighs 9.1kg according to my bathroom scales.Therefore my scales are a bit 'out' - showing 0.9 kgs less than actual weight (per 10kgs). 

Anyway, got workout 'A' for tonight, so once kids in bed, will try the thing out.

I'll report back around 9 with progress.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x5, 125x5, 142.5x2 
Bench Press: 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x5
Pendlay Rows: 72.5kg 3x5
Ab Work: Leg Raises, Reverse Crunches with negative.

I really went at this workout and still couldnt do it, I increased my calories and Im still not increasing weight on my squats. The only thing I can think is that the exercise I'm doing at the weekend is tiring my abs, hamstrings and lower back as Fridays I feel awesome and have got the 3 reps for the last few weeks but havent hit 5 reps on a monday in a few weeks. 

Bench has been progressing well and I know it seems weird but this has always been an exercise that I could build quickly so in view of my shoulder I have lowered the weight as my shoulder is getting worse again. Hoping to be in this for the long run.

Decided I need more volume on back so changed to 3x5 instead of 1x5 and I changed back to Pendlay rows as these allow me to row to the bottom of my pecs which should help my upper back more.

Probably going to deload my squat soon and then work up once more until I miss 5 reps 3 weeks in a row and then Im going to change to the Juggernaut method, i think


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Box Squats: 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x5, 125x5, 142.5x2
> Bench Press: 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x5
> Pendlay Rows: 72.5kg 3x5
> Ab Work: Leg Raises, Reverse Crunches with negative.
> 
> I really went at this workout and still couldnt do it, I increased my calories and Im still not increasing weight on my squats. The only thing I can think is that the exercise I'm doing at the weekend is tiring my abs, hamstrings and lower back as Fridays I feel awesome and have got the 3 reps for the last few weeks but havent hit 5 reps on a monday in a few weeks.
> 
> Bench has been progressing well and I know it seems weird but this has always been an exercise that I could build quickly so in view of my shoulder I have lowered the weight as my shoulder is getting worse again. Hoping to be in this for the long run.
> 
> Decided I need more volume on back so changed to 3x5 instead of 1x5 and I changed back to Pendlay rows as these allow me to row to the bottom of my pecs which should help my upper back more.
> 
> Probably going to deload my squat soon and then work up once more until I miss 5 reps 3 weeks in a row and then Im going to change to the Juggernaut method, i think


I would be very tempted to do conventional squats James, Im sure you said you had the same power rack as me, you should be able to set the safety bars so that you touch them on horizontal/lowest part of the squat.

I have also found that being a low bar squatter makes progress much easier as my balance/stability is so much better & gives me much more confidence for the lift :thumb:

I've got Deadlift, pull-ups & Close grip bench press tomorrow :devil: :thumb:

Will add stretches at the end of my workouts & on my off days, after doing some today i felt much more flexible :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## impster

Ok, job done. Good workout tonight.

Squats at 48.2kg (up from 45kg last workout)
Bench at 45.8kg (up from 40.4kg last bench workout)
Rows at 45.8kg (up from 40.4kg last row workout)

Then, 1x20 press ups, followed by 4x10 press ups.

This beefy bar has made a big diference. it 'feels' better balanced due to it being longer than my previous bar and so the weights are further apart, and also it has a better 'grip' to it.

My next target is to clear the 50kg mark, and if progress, motivation, and inspiration continues I hope to get there quite soon.

I may rig up a chin up bar to swap some of my press ups for chin ups. We'll see.

Question - bent over rows - overhand or underhand grip (i'm using overhand (palms down)) unless someone tells me otherwise.

Impster


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I would be very tempted to do conventional squats James, Im sure you said you had the same power rack as me, you should be able to set the safety bars so that you touch them on horizontal/lowest part of the squat.
> 
> I have also found that being a low bar squatter makes progress much easier as my balance/stability is so much better & gives me much more confidence for the lift :thumb:
> 
> I've got Deadlift, pull-ups & Close grip bench press tomorrow :devil: :thumb:
> 
> Will add stretches at the end of my workouts & on my off days, after doing some today i felt much more flexible :thumb: :thumb:


Yes mate I got the same Power rack as you. I like your idea and have thought about doing normal squats but I find every rep is slightly different even after months of doing them, wit Box Squats they are the same every time. I used to use the Power Rack bars as my depth guide but I found sometimes when I legs got tired I would just lean forward slightly more which meant the bar was touching the Rack but my legs werent actually hitting depth.

I worked out I gone up 2.5kg in like 7 weeks on this program so really dont think it is working for me. Think I need more volume especially on squats. Going to move back to Starting strength but do the advanced novice so I squat twice per week for 3x5. Or may do a Smolov Jr 3 week squats cycle to kick start my squats as Im getting annoyed with them.

I defiantly prefer low bar squatting now I got used to it, it sits in that slot so much tighter.

Good luck mate, Im sure you will smash it.


----------



## Guest

Got home from work tonight a little too late to do a full session. Rather than skip it enitrely I did spend half an hour doing squats.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

I'll get back out to the garage tomorrow and do a full session then.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Yes mate I got the same Power rack as you. I like your idea and have thought about doing normal squats but I find every rep is slightly different even after months of doing them, I used to use the Power Rack bars as my depth guide but I found sometimes when I legs got tired I would just lean forward slightly more which meant the bar was touching the Rack but my legs werent actually hitting depth.
> 
> I defiantly prefer low bar squatting now I got used to it, it sits in that slot so much tighter.
> 
> Good luck mate, Im sure you will smash it.


I find the only time the squat varies on feel is if my bar position on my back varies.

When I get it right I can hammer out the reps quite fast & I feel incredibly stable/strong in the lift, when I pick the bar up wrong it feels very unsafe & my body starts to lean forward, my balance is all wrong & the reps are very hard to complete.

I have been watching Mark Ripptoes vids on squat mechanics & found them to be a great way to learn the correct position for my body type. I will try & get the missus to get a pic of my bar position to show just how low I go as I think this is crucial when it comes to lifting heavy in the squat, I found out the hard way when once or twice I've put the bar in a too high position & the reps are hell to complete & feel unsafe/unstable. IMHO the bar/back position in the squat is very important in regards to lifting heavy successfully & safely :thumb:

Something I like about mark Ripptoes is his honesty, in one vid he says some people are just shiiity deadlifters & there is nothing you can do about it 

Also James, in my favour is my height, I'm only 5' 11".

Cheers mate, I'll do my best & hate the weights tonight :devil:


----------



## Guest

impster said:


> Question - bent over rows - overhand or underhand grip (i'm using overhand (palms down)) unless someone tells me otherwise.


That's correct :thumb:. Overhand grip and about shoulder width apart.


----------



## ITHAQVA

James, something has sprung to my mind in regards your squat.

How much does your body/back position differ from a conventional squat to a box squat? Are you not able to squat because you're using a box squat position with your conventional squat?
If memory serves right the BS does use a more upright position (Ideal for geared lifters) looking at the BS I don't consider it a very dynamic lift, unlike the conventional squat, which gives you all the dynamics/mechanics you need in the whole lift.

If it were me, I would only do conventional squats start at a lower weight, get the bar position right & build up your weight, I would be less concerned about getting every rep horizontal on your squat but more concerned about your squat mechanics. I'm a simple sole, if I'm training to squat heavy, I'll use the squat, only if I were at a much higher level (200Kg plus) & struggling to lift the conventional way would I consider using assistance exercises.

I would do a 3X5 & cycle the deadlift & squat over two weeks, this gives you plenty of rest & ability to FOCUS on each lift individually, bare in mind the direct correlation between the deadlift & squat (in regards to both lifts helping each other)

*Week 1: 2X Squat sessions, 1X deadlift session.
Week 2: 1X squat session, 2X deadlift sessions.*

Hope I've explained that clear mate, im not so good with the paperwork side of this sport


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's correct :thumb:. Overhand grip and about shoulder width apart.


+ :thumb:

Overhand all the way :thumb: 
I find I get a better range of movement & feel on the Overhand Grip, it also allows me to load much more weight on the bar :thumb:


----------



## impster

Just looking at my progress so far and seems to be going in the right direction in terms of weight lifted and number of press ups (push ups?) accomplished. I'm working with an imperial set (lbs) of york vinyl weights, and have added 2x10kg weights, and now a 10kg beefy bar - hence the odd decimal points here and there...

BTW the '22kgs' is when I was limited by the amount of weights I had -still felt it though as hadn't done any lifting of any real value 'ever'.
From then on I lifted what I was able to lift for a full 5x5. Squats are getting to the point where i'm getting a bit breathless, but without a squat stand (yet) I'm not too comfortable with the idea of cleaning weights and lifting them over my head. I'm sure with a rack I could add quite a bit to them.

SQUATS PROGRESS (combining workouts A & B):
22kgs
22kgs
40.4kgs
42.8kgs
45.8kgs
48.2kgs

BENCH BROGRESS:
22kgs
33.6kgs
40.4kgs
45.8kgs

BENT OVER ROWS PROGRESS:
22kgs
38.2kgs
42.8kgs
45.8kgs

OVERHEAD PRESS PROGRESS:
22kgs
29kgs
33.6kgs

DEADLIFT PROGRESS:
22kgs
42.8kgs
45.8kgs

The bench press is where I'm noticing and feeling the diference so far. I've also added 'warm down' press ups (5x5, 10x5, and now 20x1 and 10x4) to the end of each workout which also helps me feel my progress. Chin up bar will be going up tonight so we'll mix and match press ups and chin ups for variety.

Target for bench is now 50kgs next week, and target for overhead press around 38-40kgs. Both (at this point in time) seem achievable. But we'll see...

I can definately feel the diference in myself even at this early stage - more energy, easier to get up in the mornings etc, and I do have a slightly more toned appearance (or is that just placebo effect).

Thanks again for all your help guys, and thanks for answering my novice questions.


----------



## sidewalkdances

I've worked out whats wrong with my deadlift

My lower back is very very weak.

285kg x2 from my knees, using a deadlift bar (very whippy) is shocking. My deadlift has actually gone backwards  - this should be well well above 300 at the moment. 

My best suited pull is 265. My max at the moment is only about 250. 

At least it gives me something to work hard on and start seeing the improvements. Bloody sore in the traps from last night thought!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I've worked out whats wrong with my deadlift
> 
> My lower back is very very weak.
> 
> 285kg x2 from my knees, using a deadlift bar (very whippy) is shocking. My deadlift has actually gone backwards  - this should be well well above 300 at the moment.
> 
> My best suited pull is 265. My max at the moment is only about 250.
> 
> At least it gives me something to work hard on and start seeing the improvements. Bloody sore in the traps from last night thought!


Weak! are you mad mate, your shifting loads of weight :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday's /powerlifting/3X5.

*Deadlift: 170Kg/374Lb 1X5 :thumb:

Pull-ups/bodyweight: 108kG/237.6LB P3½-N2, P2¾-N3, P2½-N3, P1¼, P1¼ :thumb:

Close Grip Bench Press: 90Kg/198LB 3X5* :thumb:

Deadlift: starting to feel heavy-ish now & im feeling im getting to a point were I am working for my reps :devil:

Pull-ups slow progress but still in the right direction, every month ill add another set up to a max of 10 as per EliteFTS pull up thread :thumb:

Close Grip BP: Due to the low weight I'm only resting around 30-40 seconds between sets, now its getting close to an optimum training weight I'll increase rest between sets to around 2 minutes & increase up to a maximum of 5 minutes when the weight gets heavier.

After the Powerlifting workout I did 20 different stretches (15-20 minutes total workout), I can really feel the difference stretching makes, I feel much more mobile tonight, cheers for the email/info James :thumb:
Also had 6 boiled Eggs for tea, scrummy protein :devil:

New belt arrived today :argie::argie: Awesome, really well made & WIDE! :doublesho Thanks for the link Dan :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, something has sprung to my mind in regards your squat.
> 
> How much does your body/back position differ from a conventional squat to a box squat? Are you not able to squat because you're using a box squat position with your conventional squat?
> If memory serves right the BS does use a more upright position (Ideal for geared lifters) looking at the BS I don't consider it a very dynamic lift, unlike the conventional squat, which gives you all the dynamics/mechanics you need in the whole lift.
> 
> If it were me, I would only do conventional squats start at a lower weight, get the bar position right & build up your weight, I would be less concerned about getting every rep horizontal on your squat but more concerned about your squat mechanics. I'm a simple sole, if I'm training to squat heavy, I'll use the squat, only if I were at a much higher level (200Kg plus) & struggling to lift the conventional way would I consider using assistance exercises.
> 
> I would do a 3X5 & cycle the deadlift & squat over two weeks, this gives you plenty of rest & ability to FOCUS on each lift individually, bare in mind the direct correlation between the deadlift & squat (in regards to both lifts helping each other)
> 
> *Week 1: 2X Squat sessions, 1X deadlift session.
> Week 2: 1X squat session, 2X deadlift sessions.*
> 
> Hope I've explained that clear mate, im not so good with the paperwork side of this sport


Box squat is actually a more dynamic exercise than normal squats as your muscle have to contract faster as you are pushing from a dead stop where as with normal squats you can use the bounce and stretch reflex out of the bottom.

My back angle etc is exactly the same with box squat, I videoed myself previously, the box is litrally there to gauge depth and make you work harder out of the bottom. I suppose I could do free squats but leave the box there but do touch and go reps. Basically at the moment I sit on the bo pause for a second and then drive up but if I did touch and go then I would put zero weight on the box but would use it as my depth gauge.

I dont think its the box squat as I had a 180kg Box squat before moving away. I think I have a weak link as my legs find the weight easy, I mean I finish a set that nearly killed me and my legs are fine to walk on whereas I used to have trouble standing up. I think its possibly my ab strength is really crap because I can feel these really bad during squats and after squats Monday I tried to do some situps and couldnt do one, thats how much squats had fatigued my abs. I think scruming used to give me awesome ab strength which I now lost.

I made a decision to either move back to Starting Strength Advanced Novice or Inverted Juggernaut Program from next week. Trouble is everything on Madcow is moving up except my Squat, maybe its the lack of volume. I may do SSAN but keep my shoulder press the madcow way as it feels best when I do this.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Box squat is actually a more dynamic exercise than normal squats as your muscle have to contract faster as you are pushing from a dead stop where as with normal squats you can use the bounce and stretch reflex out of the bottom.
> 
> My back angle etc is exactly the same with box squat, I videoed myself previously, the box is litrally there to gauge depth and make you work harder out of the bottom. I suppose I could do free squats but leave the box there but do touch and go reps. Basically at the moment I sit on the bo pause for a second and then drive up but if I did touch and go then I would put zero weight on the box but would use it as my depth gauge.
> 
> I dont think its the box squat as I had a 180kg Box squat before moving away. I think I have a weak link as my legs find the weight easy, I mean I finish a set that nearly killed me and my legs are fine to walk on whereas I used to have trouble standing up. I think its possibly my ab strength is really crap because I can feel these really bad during squats and after squats Monday I tried to do some situps and couldnt do one, thats how much squats had fatigued my abs. I think scruming used to give me awesome ab strength which I now lost.
> 
> I made a decision to either move back to Starting Strength Advanced Novice or Inverted Juggernaut Program from next week. Trouble is everything on Madcow is moving up except my Squat, maybe its the lack of volume. I may do SSAN but keep my shoulder press the madcow way as it feels best when I do this.


:thumb:

180Kg box squat mate :doublesho, that is heavy, im not even deadlifting that yet  :devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb:
> 
> 180Kg box squat mate :doublesho, that is heavy, im not even deadlifting that yet  :devil:


Cheers for the help though Doug it is much appreciated.

I did a few weeks of 5/3/1 (never gave it a good run) and got some crazy rep records as well. Got 140kg for 18 reps but couldnt even walk to the next exercise let alone do it lol. Had a 130kg for 5rep front squat as well. Not Deadlifting that yet, at your progress your be there in a few months. Awesome work so far mate

Alot of the time I think I over think things, I should just change to Starting Strength Advanced Novice and smash the weights. That program works for thousands of people so I need to stop thinking theres a problem with me or the program and just hit it hard.

I think sometimes Im looking for that Magic Pill / Routine and theres no such thing. Weightlifting is hard, thats why there are millions of people who hit the gym but probably less than 1% of them squat 200kg+.

In the past I would use Rugby as my motivation but need to really push it. Right Im going to deload Madcow on Monday and I will smash it for the next 8 weeks and see what happens. That will be a total of 15 weeks so if I'm still not getting the desired results then I will decide on another program. Im going to use Doug's rep deload scheme once I start struggling on a weight as this is what I used to do and it worked extremely well, so basically if I can only get 3 reps then next week I will get 4, then 5, then increase weight and so on


----------



## impster

ITHAQVA said:


> Pull-ups/bodyweight: 108kG/237.6LB P3½-N2, P2¾-N3, P2½-N3, P1¼, P1¼


Care to decode that please? Lol, I've no idea what it means?!


----------



## Guest

Full session tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Chins* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+5kg=70kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squats are felt surprisingly good tonight - heavy but they moved ok. I was having to take a couple of breaths at the top of most reps, however.
Managed to get [email protected] on the OHP tonight. Last rep was a little bit of a grind but I felt my form was better this time - kept my body far more rigid.
Deads were all fine but perhaps did too much volume on the warm up - I was pretty knackered after the workout set.
Chins seem to be progressing well. However, it's early days yet as I'm still 25kg below BW at the start of each rep.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cheers for the help though Doug it is much appreciated.
> 
> I did a few weeks of 5/3/1 (never gave it a good run) and got some crazy rep records as well. Got 140kg for 18 reps but couldnt even walk to the next exercise let alone do it lol. Had a 130kg for 5rep front squat as well. Not Deadlifting that yet, at your progress your be there in a few months. Awesome work so far mate
> 
> Alot of the time I think I over think things, I should just change to Starting Strength Advanced Novice and smash the weights. That program works for thousands of people so I need to stop thinking theres a problem with me or the program and just hit it hard.
> 
> I think sometimes Im looking for that Magic Pill / Routine and theres no such thing. Weightlifting is hard, thats why there are millions of people who hit the gym but probably less than 1% of them squat 200kg+.
> 
> In the past I would use Rugby as my motivation but need to really push it. Right Im going to deload Madcow on Monday and I will smash it for the next 8 weeks and see what happens. That will be a total of 15 weeks so if I'm still not getting the desired results then I will decide on another program. Im going to use Doug's rep deload scheme once I start struggling on a weight as this is what I used to do and it worked extremely well, so basically if I can only get 3 reps then next week I will get 4, then 5, then increase weight and so on


Your welcome mate :thumb:, thanks for your continued help & support too mate :thumb:, anything we can do to inspire & help us get over those sticking points, I see one on its way via my bench press  

I'm very much like you James, sometimes I over think about a single workout, especially if it doesn't go to plan, having read the eBooks we have I'm much happier now to take the slow approach if I get stuck on a weight I will just keep bashing at it, even if it takes a month or so to get past a certain weight.

I used to use the rep de load principle when I was training with a 1-4 rep range (all those years ago, how old am I? :doublesho )

Sometimes you got to just hate the weight for a little longer :devil:

I'm so glad I've got back into it. Makes you feel human, this powerlifting lark :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Care to decode that please? Lol, I've no idea what it means?!


:lol::lol::lol: Sorry mate, i did explain somewehere on here...I think 

*Pull-ups/bodyweight: 108kG/237.6LB P3½-N2, P2¾-N3, P2½-N3, P1¼, P1¼*

*Pull-ups/bodyweight: 108kG/237.6LB *: I consider an overhand grip a pull-up, the 108Kg is my bodyweight, just put there so that the skinny guys who say pull ups are easy can strap enough weights to their body to make the 108Kg & see how hard it is for us chunky blokes to do them 

*P3½-N2*; The *P* stands for positive reps the *N* stands for negative reps. I basically have a target of 5 reps per set at the moment, so in this example i reached 3 full reps so to complete the set i finish off with 2 negative reps making 5 reps, I only count full reps towards the 5 but still write down 1/2 or 3/4 reps to guage my progress :thumb:

The last 2 sets I will only do posative reps. My ultimate goal is 3 sets of 6-8 reps, IF i reach that then i would add weight to my body & stick with 3 sets of the 6-8 rep range using the progressive overload principle with weights & my body weight combined :devil:

Hope that clears it up mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Your welcome mate :thumb:, thanks for your continued help & support too mate :thumb:, anything we can do to inspire & help us get over those sticking points, I see one on its way via my bench press
> 
> I'm very much like you James, sometimes I over think about a single workout, especially if it doesn't go to plan, having read the eBooks we have I'm much happier now to take the slow approach if I get stuck on a weight I will just keep bashing at it, even if it takes a month or so to get past a certain weight.
> 
> I used to use the rep de load principle when I was training with a 1-4 rep range (all those years ago, how old am I? :doublesho )
> 
> Sometimes you got to just hate the weight for a little longer :devil:
> 
> I'm so glad I've got back into it. Makes you feel human, this powerlifting lark :thumb::thumb:


Im sure with the progress your making, your get alot further with your bench than you think. Im near my 300lb target for Bench Press so I'm pulling back on my bench press for the time being. I know its strenge to be doing that but if I keep going my shoulder is only to get worse and may be starting rugby again soon so that will really screw it up,

Im quite happy to take the slow approach, its just I thought getting my strength back would be easy considering its muscle memory. But I wouldnt consider 2.5kg in 7 weeks even slow progress its crap, I be happy with that when Im squatting over 200kg but not 135kg.

Im just going to hit the weights hard now, the old way I used to. I hit 3 reps on Shoulder Press tonight so now I will just aim for 4 reps next week, 5 the week after and then increase. Nice and simple.

Decided I'm going to do the Juggernaut Method after Madcow as it will be a massive shock doing 10+ reps for high sets. Then probably go to 5/3/1 for the long haul


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Im sure with the progress your making, your get alot further with your bench than you think. Im near my 300lb target for Bench Press so I'm pulling back on my bench press for the time being. I know its strenge to be doing that but if I keep going my shoulder is only to get worse and may be starting rugby again soon so that will really screw it up,
> 
> Im quite happy to take the slow approach, its just I thought getting my strength back would be easy considering its muscle memory. But I wouldnt consider 2.5kg in 7 weeks even slow progress its crap, I be happy with that when Im squatting over 200kg but not 135kg.
> 
> Im just going to hit the weights hard now, the old way I used to. I hit 3 reps on Shoulder Press tonight so now I will just aim for 4 reps next week, 5 the week after and then increase. Nice and simple.
> 
> Decided I'm going to do the Juggernaut Method after Madcow as it will be a massive shock doing 10+ reps for high sets. Then probably go to 5/3/1 for the long haul


I hope so mate, ive always found my bench a pig to improve on once i get around the 110Kg-180Kg mark, im tempted to bench using a 2X5 or 1X5 work set, ive done this in the past & it seems to allow my BP improve quicker :thumb:

I know what you mean mate, once i get to 200Kg squat/deadlift i wont expect quick progress, ive still got 32.5Kg to go on the squat & 27.5Kg on the Deadlift  may not sound like much, but the road to 200Kg is harder than a hard thing...thats really hard especialy for an old bugger like me 

Onward & upward!  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I hope so mate, ive always found my bench a pig to improve on once i get around the 110Kg-180Kg mark, im tempted to bench using a 2X5 or 1X5 work set, ive done this in the past & it seems to allow my BP improve quicker :thumb:
> 
> I know what you mean mate, once i get to 200Kg squat/deadlift i wont expect quick progress, ive still got 32.5Kg to go on the squat & 27.5Kg on the Deadlift  may not sound like much, but the road to 200Kg is harder than a hard thing...thats really hard especialy for an old bugger like me
> 
> Onward & upward!  :thumb:


I never been to bothered about my bench press really, I think its because I hurt my shoulder badly every single season I played except one so I hardly ever benched pressed. I think 300lb for 5 reps is a good target for me and I been there before so should be able to do it again.

You should (will) get to 200kg on both lifts long before me mate. Im still 65kg short on squats and 45kg short on Dedlifts. Are you planning to hit 200kg for 1 rep or 5 reps because if its 1 rep, using Jim Wendler 1 RM formula you cant be that short.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Madcow:
Light Box Squat: 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x5, 107.5x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 37.5x5, 45x5, 52.5x5, 40x3
Deadlifts: 97.5x5, 117.5x5, 135x5, 155x5

I may change wednesday's Box squats to freee squats as a way of getting me used to free squatting or change these to Front Squats as it gives you more of a rest accoding to Mark Rippletoe.

Shoulder Press felt good but didnt want to force it. Defiantly the ramped Madcow sets really help keep my shoulder from hurting. 5x5 I could really feel it by the 4th and 5th set.

Deadlifts: I was just hitting my heavy set and my Mrs arrived home so I got her to record me. Not bad form but need to work on keep my back flat as each rep my back got slightly more rounded. Watched all of Mark Rippletoe Deadlift videos on YouTube last night so will put these into practise next week and see how it goes


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> You should (will) get to 200kg on both lifts long before me mate. Im still 65kg short on squats and 45kg short on Dedlifts. Are you planning to hit 200kg for 1 rep or 5 reps because if its 1 rep, using Jim Wendler 1 RM formula you cant be that short.


My aim is 5 reps for 200Kg so that i feel more confident/safe doing 228Kg/500Lb single rep on each lift.

Two questions 

The deadlift is starting to get heavy ish now should i slow my progress to alow my whole body to catch up or continue to add 2.5Kg every time i reach 5 reps in the work set? Just asking as i want to be safe as ive not got to much more weight to add (27.5Kg) for my initial max goal.

On my squat im currently doing 3 sets with 167.5Kg now that im on the last part of my main goal with 32.5Kg to go, should i lower the work set to one, is
3 sets of 200Kg a bit much?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Madcow:
> Light Box Squat: 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x5, 107.5x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 37.5x5, 45x5, 52.5x5, 40x3
> Deadlifts: 97.5x5, 117.5x5, 135x5, 155x5
> 
> Deadlifts: I was just hitting my heavy set and my Mrs arrived home so I got her to record me. Not bad form but need to work on keep my back flat as each rep my back got slightly more rounded. Watched all of Mark Rippletoe Deadlift videos on YouTube last night so will put these into practise next week and see how it goes


Your deadlifts are coming on great mate; you've only got 45Kg to go!!!! :thumb: :devil: :thumb:

In regard to heavy ish deadlifts, I think even Mr Ripptoe says that a little rounding of the back will occur from time to time, I get it sometimes, I feel extra stretching in my upper back when my back is a little round at the top, I find you remember this & the following session you really keep your form good. Don't be to hard on yourself James, with the weights we are moving keeping perfect form is a constant struggle & of course as long as its within the boundaries of safety there is the school of though that says a little lose form every once in a while actually helps & forces the body to grow.

I have to admit the fear of injury makes me aim for good form every time :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Weak! are you mad mate, your shifting loads of weight :doublesho


Cheers mate, but in competitive terms, a 250kg deadlift is small potatoes. I want at least 700lbs in competition! A total I want within a few years is something like 420/260/320 so 1000kg 3 lift total. Then i'll move on to try and conquer a 1000lbs squat!

Just need to work on what is ailing me, make sure i'm consistent with my ab work and lower back work too.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Cheers mate, but in competitive terms, a 250kg deadlift is small potatoes. I want at least 700lbs in competition! A total I want within a few years is something like 420/260/320 so 1000kg 3 lift total. Then i'll move on to try and conquer a 1000lbs squat!
> 
> Just need to work on what is ailing me, make sure i'm consistent with my ab work and lower back work too.


Dan your a crazy   :devil: :thumb: Hate those weights mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Squat session tonight for me - plenty of technique work to do. Think i'm going to go with 5 sets of 2 with 220+Chains as a deload in suit bottoms only.

Then kill my lower back and abs!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> My aim is 5 reps for 200Kg so that i feel more confident/safe doing 228Kg/500Lb single rep on each lift.
> 
> Two questions
> 
> The deadlift is starting to get heavy ish now should i slow my progress to alow my whole body to catch up or continue to add 2.5Kg every time i reach 5 reps in the work set? Just asking as i want to be safe as ive not got to much more weight to add (27.5Kg) for my initial max goal.
> 
> On my squat im currently doing 3 sets with 167.5Kg now that im on the last part of my main goal with 32.5Kg to go, should i lower the work set to one, is
> 3 sets of 200Kg a bit much?


My feeling is that if its not broke dont change it. With regards to adding weight I would go until you stall on a weight and then change to smaller. Thats how I read Rippletoe does it and then when you can no longer do 2.5kg he will micro load.

Same with this if its not broke dont change it. If you change to one set you may stall (like me) and it may not be enough volume for you (like me) so I would stick with the 3x5, Im changing back to starting strength as I think I jumped ship to soon. The reason Stronglift goes down to 1x5 is that you are squatting 3 times per week. If I remember you are squatting 3 times every 2 weeks. Basically your looking to apply the greatest stress possible at each workout that your body can recover from before your next session. Basically on strong lift your doing 1x5 and having 1 day rest where as your doing 3x5 and having 3-4 days rest.



ITHAQVA said:


> Your deadlifts are coming on great mate; you've only got 45Kg to go!!!! :thumb: :devil: :thumb:
> 
> In regard to heavy ish deadlifts, I think even Mr Ripptoe says that a little rounding of the back will occur from time to time, I get it sometimes, I feel extra stretching in my upper back when my back is a little round at the top, I find you remember this & the following session you really keep your form good. Don't be to hard on yourself James, with the weights we are moving keeping perfect form is a constant struggle & of course as long as its within the boundaries of safety there is the school of though that says a little lose form every once in a while actually helps & forces the body to grow.
> 
> I have to admit the fear of injury makes me aim for good form every time :thumb:


The video shows my back rounding quite abit really, I dont set it straight to begin with but then hold it statically so its not as bad as letting it bend duringt he set. After watching loads of Rippletoe videos I got some clues to think of, I have been pulling myself down to the bar which can be a good tip as it makes everything tighter but this has been making me pull myself down around the bar so I sit backwards slightly, I need to bend straight down. BUt once this is set the only think I need to think of is chest up and Im going to turn round in my power rack and pull from the other direction so I can look at a spot a few metres away instead of straight at a wall



sidewalkdances said:


> Cheers mate, but in competitive terms, a 250kg deadlift is small potatoes. I want at least 700lbs in competition! A total I want within a few years is something like 420/260/320 so 1000kg 3 lift total. Then i'll move on to try and conquer a 1000lbs squat!
> 
> Just need to work on what is ailing me, make sure i'm consistent with my ab work and lower back work too.


Setting your goals high, I like your style. 700lb deadlift and 1000lb squat, jesus


----------



## Guest

I starting to read several reports of people not achieving much on SL1x5. The volume is too low apparently.
I'm hopefully a way off yet, but I'm toying with switching to 5x3 after 3x5 runs out. Another option is doing ladder sets. Just been reading a log today of a young lad (21) using ladder sets to get his bench up to 120kg.


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> I starting to read several reports of people not achieving much on SL1x5. The volume is too low apparently.
> I'm hopefully a way off yet, but I'm toying with switching to 5x3 after 3x5 runs out. Another option is doing ladder sets. Just been reading a log today of a young lad (21) using ladder sets to get his bench up to 120kg.


What do you mean when you say ladder sets.

Ya even Stronglifts admits that by changing to 1x5 you may only get a few more weeks progression but nothing major


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> What do you mean when you say ladder sets.


They are often used in training chins/pull-ups. I think Pavel (of kettlebell fame) first mentioned them.

Essentially, a ladder is where each set involves performing a number of reps, resting for few secs then keep repeating with a greater number of reps each time i,e. you do 1 rep, rest, 2 reps, rest, 3 reps, rest, etc.

With chins/pull-ups each rest period would be just a few secs (about the same time as it took to perform the reps you just did). 
I'm still a little unclear how long you rest for when using significant weights - I think enough time to mostly recover .

Once you reach your rep goal (i.e. you might decide to do a max of 3 reps, say) or you fail to get the reps, you call that one set. You then repeat the ladder a number of times.

The idea is you get a greater volume in but it not as exhausting as doing sets across. e.g doing 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3 would not be exhausting as 5x5 but would give you greater volume 30reps vs 25reps, in this case. At least, this is how I understand it at the moment.

I also understand that you start at 2 or 3 ladder sets on an exercise and then increase the number of ladders you do on successive workouts. Once you reach 5 ladder sets, you'd up the weight and drop back down to 2 or 3 ladder sets again e.g.
WO#1: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
WO#2: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
WO#3: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
WO#4: Bench 102.5kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
etc

The ladders don't have to increase by one rep each time. I've seen people doing 1/3/5 ladders and also someone doing 3/6/10 ladders on deads.


----------



## impster

Workout B tonight - a night late due to work commitments etc.

Also, had to get up at 4:45am this morning so am completelly knackered.

Another excuse, missed the past 2 days protein thingy shakes.

Anyway, not too impressed with myself with tonights' performance. 5x5? lol more like 1x1 at times...

Progress for tonight:

Squats: 50.4kg (up from 48.2kg). This is seriously limited by a lack of a squat rack. I could probably add a lot to this, but I've got to the point where I daren't lift any more over my head and onto my back.

Overhead Press: (Last time I was at 33.6kg) Tonight managed 4 reps of 41.2kg. Could do no more. Then managed 4 reps of 39kg. Again, could do no more. Then managed 5 reps at 36.8kg, followed by 2 sets of 4 at that weight and a further 2 sets of 3. Think I probably added too much too soon here. Will stick with this weight next time workout B comes around.

Deadlift. Maxed out the bar with all I could fit on it. 55kg. Did 2 sets of 5 to make up for a ****ty night (last time round was at 45kg). 

Press ups - 1x15, 3x10, 1x8, 1x10.

Arms were totally shot by the end. I guess lifting the bar over my head to get to the squat position doesn't help at all. Overloading too soon on the o/head press is another lesson learnt. Early morning start today, and 2 nights of work related meetings have had their impact (I'm good at excuses aren't I...).

Impster


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> They are often used in training chins/pull-ups. I think Pavel (of kettlebell fame) first mentioned them.
> 
> Essentially, a ladder is where each set involves performing a number of reps, resting for few secs then keep repeating with a greater number of reps each time i,e. you do 1 rep, rest, 2 reps, rest, 3 reps, rest, etc.
> 
> With chins/pull-ups each rest period would be just a few secs (about the same time as it took to perform the reps you just did).
> I'm still a little unclear how long you rest for when using significant weights - I think enough time to mostly recover .
> 
> Once you reach your rep goal (i.e. you might decide to do a max of 3 reps, say) or you fail to get the reps, you call that one set. You then repeat the ladder a number of times.
> 
> The idea is you get a greater volume in but it not as exhausting as doing sets across. e.g doing 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3 would not be exhausting as 5x5 but would give you greater volume 30reps vs 25reps, in this case. At least, this is how I understand it at the moment.
> 
> I also understand that you start at 2 or 3 ladder sets on an exercise and then increase the number of ladders you do on successive workouts. Once you reach 5 ladder sets, you'd up the weight and drop back down to 2 or 3 ladder sets again e.g.
> WO#1: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
> WO#2: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
> WO#3: Bench 100kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
> WO#4: Bench 102.5kg 1/2/3, 1/2/3, 1/2/3
> etc
> 
> The ladders don't have to increase by one rep each time. I've seen people doing 1/3/5 ladders and also someone doing 3/6/10 ladders on deads.


Just thought I would check what you mean by Ladder sets as everyone uses different terms. I use Ladder sets for my Chin-Ups right now but Im doing my Chin Ups between pushing exercises so I do 1 Chin Up, Shoulder Press, 2 Chin Ups, SP, Etc up to my goal of 6 reps at the moment, I then work back down the ladder. Its a good way of getting extra volume into an exercise.

There all a slight spin of something else as this sounds similar to muscle rounds, rest pause, DC, etc


----------



## Bod42

Just totally ramdom but just out of curiosity where does everyone bring their Shoulder Press down to. I bring them down so they touch my upper chest, just on the boney part below your neck.

Read so many different opions on what everyone does/thinks. What everyones opion in here


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Just totally ramdom but just out of curiosity where does everyone bring their Shoulder Press down to. I bring them down so they touch my upper chest, just on the boney part below your neck.
> 
> Read so many different opions on what everyone does/thinks. What everyones opion in here


Yep, I do it this way too.


----------



## Guest

Good session tonight.

*Squats*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+5kg=70kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squats feeling heavy but lifts went fine. Needed to take a few pauses at the top of some reps to catch my breath, again.
Bench was a little tough. Not quite a grind but getting close to it 
Rows were fine, definitely easier than bench.
Dips going well. Definitely feeling these on my inner pecs.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> Just totally ramdom but just out of curiosity where does everyone bring their Shoulder Press down to. I bring them down so they touch my upper chest, just on the boney part below your neck.
> 
> Read so many different opions on what everyone does/thinks. What everyones opion in here


Right across my shoulders, then drive my head back so I don't chin myself with the bar! :lol::lol:

Squats went well last night, did 205 + chains (No idea what the chains weigh - i'd guess around 40-50kg at the top) for a few doubles. Seem to have sorted out a few technical gremlins and am keeping my air in a lot better under the pressure of the gear. Did 245 + chains straps up and got nowhere near depth, which is reassuring. Tightened my fronts up harder to lock my into a better position.

Still waiting for Minna at Metal to email me back about getting my new kit!


----------



## Matt.

Reading back on this workout Doug, do you only Deadlift once? 5 reps x 1 set?



ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Matt,
> 
> Here mate :thumb:
> 
> WEEK 1
> 
> TUESDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> 
> THURSDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> SATURDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____  ____ ____
> 
> WEEK 2
> 
> TUESDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> THURSDAY
> 
> BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> 
> SATURDAY
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
> DEADLIFT KG ____
> 
> After 8 weeks of the above ive reduced my squat to 3 sets of 5 reps & alternate squating once on one week then twice on the following week.
> 
> You can change the reps to 6-8 if you want to train in a lighter/bodybuilding/weight training style


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Reading back on this workout Doug, do you only Deadlift once? 5 reps x 1 set?


WEEK 1

TUESDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

THURSDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
*DEADLIFT KG 1 set 5 reps____ *

SATURDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

WEEK 2

TUESDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
*DEADLIFT KG 1 set 5 reps____ *

THURSDAY

BENCH PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
BENT OVER ROW KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____

SATURDAY

OVERHEAD PRESS KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
SQUAT KG ____ ____ ____ ____ ____
*DEADLIFT KG 1 set 5 reps____ *

As above mate :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

There are that many videos of Mark Rippetoe on the 5x5 exercises, which would you say are the key ones of each exercise?


----------



## Matt.




----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> There are that many videos of Mark Rippetoe on the 5x5 exercises, which would you say are the key ones of each exercise?





Matt. said:


>


Stop the music!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Do you want to do powerlifting or bodybuilding?


----------



## Matt.

I want to build muscle size. But first, I'm doing the 5x5 to build a bit of a base.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> I want to build muscle size. But first, I'm doing the 5x5 to build a bit of a base.


If your doing the 5X5, I would view Mark ripptoes vids, they are all on youtube, ive posted the links on this thread several times, go hunt!


----------



## impster

opinions please:
This (argos)

or

this (Amazon)

I already have a bench (old york 6605), but lack of squat stand/rack is holding me back.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> opinions please:
> This (argos)
> 
> or
> 
> this (Amazon)
> 
> I already have a bench (old york 6605), but lack of squat stand/rack is holding me back.


For an extra £33 you could have this :thumb:

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk...m_medium=Product+Search&utm_campaign=products

Safer :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> opinions please:
> This (argos)
> 
> or
> 
> this (Amazon)
> 
> I already have a bench (old york 6605), but lack of squat stand/rack is holding me back.


For an extra £110 ish you could have this :thumb::thumb:

http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf375-power-rack.php

Much, much safer, Buy now!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday

*Bench Press: 110Kg/242Lb 4, 3, 3  

Squat: 167.5Kg/368.5Lb 3X5 :thumb:

Barbell Row: 105Kg/231Lb 5, 4, 4* :thumb:

One of those days, not happy with my bench progress, felt drained before I started the workout so not too bad a result. Been a very busy week for me too 

Have been speaking to few mates who lift weights & they are amazed how little I eat for someone who weighs 232Lb (106Kg). I think it's time to take a more structured approach to my diet :thumb:


----------



## impster

Workout A just done whilst watching the rugby.

Squats up to 52.8kg (such a shame i ain't got a squat rack. I will have one of sorts soon).
Bench has broken the 50kg mark. 50.4kgs to be precise.
Barbell Rows also at 50.4kgs.
Then did a mix of press ups and chin ups - 50 each which I found surprisingly satisfying (i've got 'thin' biceps so need to give them something to do, hence my desire for chin ups).

Arms feel nice and tight now. T'was a really enjoyable workout.

Impster.

EDIT: Bench and Rows 50.4kg - not 52.4kg as originally stated.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Workout A just done whilst watching the rugby.
> 
> Squats up to 52.8kg (such a shame i ain't got a squat rack. I will have one of sorts soon).
> Bench has broken the 50kg mark. 52.4kgs to be precise.
> Barbell Rows also at 52.4kgs.
> Then did a mix of press ups and chin ups - 50 each which I found surprisingly satisfying (i've got 'thin' biceps so need to give them something to do, hence my desire for chin ups).
> 
> Arms feel nice and tight now. T'was a really enjoyable workout.
> 
> Impster.


Good workout Impster :thumb:

Is this right? 50 chin ups & 50 Press ups :doublesho


----------



## impster

Yup - 50 each (it does sound mental doesn't it...)

I usually do 50-60 press ups after a workout, but thought I'd mix in a few chin ups. Was going to do 50 in total, but got to that stage and felt I could go on so I did. I only weigh 10stone (lol up half a stone since I started) so there's not that much weight to lift compared to some.

Rested between 3-4 minutes between each 'set' as follows:

1x15 press ups
3x10 chin ups
1x15 press ups
1x10 chin ups
1x10 press ups
1x10 chin ups
1x10 press ups

(i should add as well, that my version of chin ups doesn't go 'all the way down' - probably 75% of a 'full' chin up)


Not saying i'll do this every workout. It just seemed the thing to do today for some reason.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Yup - 50 each (it does sound mental doesn't it...)
> 
> I usually do 50-60 press ups after a workout, but thought I'd mix in a few chin ups. Was going to do 50 in total, but got to that stage and felt I could go on so I did. I only weigh 10stone (lol up half a stone since I started) so there's not that much weight to lift compared to some.
> 
> Rested between 3-4 minutes between each 'set' as follows:
> 
> 1x15 press ups
> 3x10 chin ups
> 1x15 press ups
> 1x10 chin ups
> 1x10 press ups
> 1x10 chin ups
> 1x10 press ups
> 
> (i should add as well, that my version of chin ups doesn't go 'all the way down' - probably 75% of a 'full' chin up)
> 
> Not saying i'll do this every workout. It just seemed the thing to do today for some reason.


Now that i see its done in sets it makes more sense :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys had a busy week last week. Also been down with a viral infection. Made it to the gym twice tho. I had my first fail on the squat. Warmed up nicely to 100k then went for my 115k. got the first 4 reps at a snails pace then failed on the 5th. decided to drop the weight as the sweat was lashing off me and I wasnt feeling too good.

Thursday,

squat 115k 4,
dropped to 100k 5,5

overhead press 52.5k 5,5,5,5,5

deadlift 145k 4

Saturday

squat 105k 5,5,5

bench 85k 5,5,5,5,5

bent over row 85k 5,5,5,5,5


Still not feeling 100% and i'm on anti biotics for the viral infection so ive kept my squat down to conserve what energy/strength I had for the rest of my work out. Gonna increase up 5k ech time until I'm back to 115k.


----------



## Guest

Ntynan, definitely the right decision. Hope you are feeling better soon - you'll regain your strength in no time :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

50 pull ups in a session is good going! 

I remember when I was lighter and could knock out sets like no-ones business - my best was 16 reps i think @ 106kg bodyweight. Then I stopped doing them and i'm down to about 6 in a set! :lol: 

Deads tonight, just some very light form work. Comp getting close so can't go crazy.


----------



## impster

Workout B tonight for me - and this is the start of my 4th week doing SL.

Now then - thinking ahead - in week 5 am I supposed to deload or simply stop adding weights to the bar for a while? Been looking online and there seems to be a mix of advice as follows:

a) Keep adding weight as per normal.
b) deload to about 80% of your last workout - stick with this for weeks 5-8, then start adding weights for weeks 9-12
c) Don't add any more weight on the bar for 1-4 weeks.

Which one should it be?

thanks

Impster


----------



## sidewalkdances

Keep adding weight to the bar. I'm on my phone, but I gave Doug the advice of 'dominating a weight' - i'm sure he'll pass it on in more depth than I can at the moment.


----------



## Guest

impster said:


> Workout B tonight for me - and this is the start of my 4th week doing SL.
> 
> Now then - thinking ahead - in week 5 am I supposed to deload or simply stop adding weights to the bar for a while? Been looking online and there seems to be a mix of advice as follows:
> 
> a) Keep adding weight as per normal.
> b) deload to about 80% of your last workout - stick with this for weeks 5-8, then start adding weights for weeks 9-12
> c) Don't add any more weight on the bar for 1-4 weeks.
> 
> Which one should it be?
> 
> thanks
> 
> Impster


Keep adding weight as normal. The programming behind SL works as follows:
Only deload until you stall at a weight for 3 successive attempts (workouts). Then the idea is that you deload by 10% and carry on as normal from there. The point of the deload is to improve recovery.
Eventually, when you end up deloading for a 3rd time on an exercise you switch to a lower volume i.e. 5x5->3x5 or 3x5->1x5. Once you hit 3 deloads at 1x5, you are then ready for an intermediate programme.

This is not the only way, however, but it is how SL has been put together.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Keep adding weight to the bar. I'm on my phone, but I gave Doug the advice of 'dominating a weight' - i'm sure he'll pass it on in more depth than I can at the moment.


keep adding 2.5Kg every time you reach 5 reps each set, as Dan says, if you get a sticking point & you cant get your 5 reps on the new weight even after trying for a week or so, go back, reduce the weight by 2.5Kg, stay on that & :devilOMINATE :devil:the weight (keep getting 5 reps on it for a week or so) then go back to adding 2.5Kg etc..etc..

Dan (Sidewalkdances) takes credit for this bit of advice  :thumb:


----------



## impster

thanks for the advice guys.

Went swimming with my 6 yr old daughter yesterday. Didn't feel self conscious at all (for the first time in years) and a mate of mine who was there with his kids asked me if I worked out - apparently he'd never noticed me looking 'toned' before...

It's definately working.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> keep adding 2.5Kg every time you reach 5 reps each set, as Dan says, if you get a sticking point & you cant get your 5 reps on the new weight even after trying for a week or so, go back, reduce the weight by 2.5Kg, stay on that & :devilOMINATE :devil:the weight (keep getting 5 reps on it for a week or so) then go back to adding 2.5Kg etc..etc..
> 
> Dan (Sidewalkdances) takes credit for this bit of advice  :thumb:


That's interesting. I might have to try that come deload time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's interesting. I might have to try that come deload time :thumb:


Since getting into this powerlifting lark, ive not done a proper deload, ive only had to use the :devil:dominate :devil: approach once :doublesho :thumb: (Overhead press) but I think that was mainly down to the pain hindering the lift :thumb:

Guys im feeling totally shattered all the time now, after all these months of lifting without a break (started around October/November 2011) im taking a full week off to rest, for the first time ever I actually feel overtrained/drained :doublesho

Have no fear I WILL start again next week. Im planning on moving onto a 1X5 & stick with that for as long as I possibly can/stop progressing (I'm looking forward to it already :thumb I think my final program after that will be a 4 times a week with each bodypart worked once a week :thumb::thumb:

Has to be said, powerlifting really gets in ya blood, I love it :argie: & im soooo looking forward to starting again next Monday, but i must listen to my body, i dont want to get too fatigued & have a load of crappy workouts & possibly injury due to not recovering :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
Squats: 127.5kg - 3x5
Bench Press: 100kg - 3x5
Chin Ups - 3x4

I been watching Defranco Box Squat video's and how he's got high school athletes box squatting 400-500lb. I been watching their form and think I been too slow in my movements. Anyway this squat workout was one of the best workouts I had in a long time. Also moved to 5 mins rest between sets as my main focus is strength at the moment.

Killed Bench Press, this weight was easy. My shoulder didnt hurt at all during my warm ups and could barely feel it during my sets. 

Chin Ups were harder than I thought they would be. Considering doing more sets for less reps as per Elitefts as this worked well before but 3x5 is what rippletoe suggests.


----------



## Guest

Enjoy the break Doug.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Enjoy the break Doug.


Cheers Phil, day one day already done lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
> Squats: 127.5kg - 3x5
> Bench Press: 100kg - 3x5
> Chin Ups - 3x4
> 
> I been watching Defranco Box Squat video's and how he's got high school athletes box squatting 400-500lb. I been watching their form and think I been too slow in my movements. Anyway this squat workout was one of the best workouts I had in a long time. Also moved to 5 mins rest between sets as my main focus is strength at the moment.
> 
> Killed Bench Press, this weight was easy. My shoulder didnt hurt at all during my warm ups and could barely feel it during my sets.
> 
> Chin Ups were harder than I thought they would be. Considering doing more sets for less reps as per Elitefts as this worked well before but 3x5 is what rippletoe suggests.


Nice workout James:thumb:

I found as soon as i got to 110Kg the 3X5 became difficult (squat was ok though ) im looking forward to the 1X5 so i can focus on hitting the work set harder :thumb:

Bench would look something like this: 20X5, 40X5, 60X5, 80X3, 90X2 then work set 110x5.

I will keep 1X5 on the main lifts (Squat, Deadlift & bench Press) but still do 3X5 on the other exercises (Pull-ups, Barbell Row & Close Grip Bench Press) :thumb:


----------



## impster

Missed tonights' workout. Our cul-de-sac has had a sewer pipe blockage, so been out helping to unblock it and only just got back in. Other people's [email protected] by torchlight isn't the nicest of things.

Very annoyed at this (missing the workout, not the blockage).

Anyway, some good news, got hold of 2x10kg cast iron discs that were gathering dust in a neighbour's garage. That frees up more space on the barbell, and saves me £30 or so.

Tomorrow it is then.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice workout James:thumb:
> 
> I found as soon as i got to 110Kg the 3X5 became difficult (squat was ok though ) im looking forward to the 1X5 so i can focus on hitting the work set harder :thumb:
> 
> Bench would look something like this: 20X5, 40X5, 60X5, 80X3, 90X2 then work set 110x5.
> 
> I will keep 1X5 on the main lifts (Squat, Deadlift & bench Press) but still do 3X5 on the other exercises (Pull-ups, Barbell Row & Close Grip Bench Press) :thumb:


I worked up to 117.5x5 on Bench so the 100kg should be real easy and it was, I just backed off slightly as I was feeing it in my shoulder quite bad.

Im hoping this program brings me more results than the Madcow program and I think it will as when I really sit down and look at the Madcow program its really not a good program for me for a number of reasons. I got at least 9 weeks on this program so Im hoping to improve my squat alot in that time.

I would always keep more volume on the back exercises, its good for you and I think with most people the back grows better with higher volume.

Good luck with the deload week buddy as I remember a few weeks/months back you put on here that you were taking a deload week and a few days later posted a workout, so hard to stay away from the iron


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I worked up to 117.5x5 on Bench so the 100kg should be real easy and it was, I just backed off slightly as I was feeing it in my shoulder quite bad.
> 
> Im hoping this program brings me more results than the Madcow program and I think it will as when I really sit down and look at the Madcow program its really not a good program for me for a number of reasons. I got at least 9 weeks on this program so Im hoping to improve my squat alot in that time.
> 
> I would always keep more volume on the back exercises, its good for you and I think with most people the back grows better with higher volume.
> 
> Good luck with the deload week buddy as I remember a few weeks/months back you put on here that you were taking a deload week and a few days later posted a workout, so hard to stay away from the iron


 I know what you mean James warming up with 90kg feels easy these days, fully understand why your backing off mate, until the shoulder improves I would carry on with what you're doing, that way you're at least training the area :thumb:

Defo keeping volume on the back & assistance exercises (Pull-up, Barbell Row & Close grip BP :thumb

I know  couldn't keep off the iron mate, I LOVE THE IRON :argie:  

I will stay away this time as i think it would be far more beneficial, I want my 500Lb squat & deadlift in the next 2-3 months 

Shock horror! I've just started to take supplements to ensure i fully recover etc.. :doublesho

1. Glucosamine & Chondroitin
2. Cod liver Oil
3. Protein Supplement http://www.supplementcentre.com/ProductPage/12097/5KG-Matrix-Anabolic-Protein.asp Seems to be as good as any & its priced pretty well too

I'm also trying to ensure i get between 200-240 grams of protein on training days, i'll aim for 160-180 on off days. I am not a big eater, so it's a major task.

*Typical training day*

Early Morning - supplement - 40gm plus 20gm from the Milk - 60gm

9-9:30 AM - 4 x Boiled eggs - 40gm

12-12:30 AM - chicken & rice or sushi or bowl of porridge etc.. - 20-30gm

3-3:30 -supplement - 40gm plus 20gm from the Milk - 60gm

6-6-:30 - evening meal - 40gm

Weekends ill slack off a little to give the old body a slight break :thumb:

What do you think guys, I'm a little rusty with nutrition as I've never really taken completely structured approach to it for lifting that is.


----------



## Matt.

Shock bleeding horror Dougster!!!

You on supplements :doublesho

How many servings do you take in a non-training day? 

I assume you add 500ml of skimmed milk?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Shock bleeding horror Dougster!!!
> 
> You on supplements :doublesho
> 
> How many servings do you take in a non-training day?
> 
> I assume you add 500ml of skimmed milk?


I know, I just cant eat that much, so protein shakes will have to do  

I mix approx 500-700 ml - Semi skimmed Milk on training days & water on non training days as I don't want to ingest too much fat :thumb:

I will of course monitor my weight :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Did you consider any of the MyProtein range?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Did you consider any of the MyProtein range?


Might look at it at a later date Matt :thumb:, im not really sold on supplements, but understand they may be of good use for me to help with recovery :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys, gym last night. Feel like I'm getting over my viral infection now.

Squat 110k 5,5,5

Overhead press 55k 4,5,5,5,5

Deadlift 145k 5

I dont think i gave myself enough time after my squats before starting my overhead press. My warmup felt real easy so i just bashed streight into my set. As soon as I picked up the bar I realised my mistake. On hindsight I should have put it back down and rested. Oh well leason learned.


----------



## Matt.

Well tonight I went to the Gym 

Bench Press

WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3, 30kg x 2
WO - 40kg 5 x 5

Squat 

WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3, 30kg x 2
WO - 40kg 5 x 5

Bent Over Row

WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3
WO - 40kg 5 x 5

Bench Press - I struggled on this. Although I made the 5 x 5 it was slow on the last few reps. 

Squats - They went well. my legs started to sting ok the last set. I could of probably squeezed 50kg. The bone at the top of my spine really hurts now. Have I been squatting with the bar in the wrong place?

Bent Over Row - All about the technique on this. DEFINITELY room for more weight 

So overall, I enjoyed it. I was only in there 40 minutes. If i'm honest, it doesn't feel like I have done a session at the Gym. Is this normal?

Is there any advice you can give me for next time?


----------



## Guest

Matt,

Yep, it will not feel like you have done much exercise at first. It's not really about that at the moment. It's all about learning the movements for each exercise.

Sounds like you have the bar positioned too high on the squats. Try pulling your shoulders back and squeezing your shoulder blades together. Your rear deltoids for a sort of shelf which the bar sits on - it shouldn't make contact with your spine in this position.

When you state the weights, is that including the bar? I only ask because in your warm-up you show sets with the bar only and then 20kg etc. A normal Olympic bar weights 20kg. All weights should be including the bar (because that is what you are lifting) and not what you placed on the bar.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Matt.

Ahh I thought the weight looked low. 

So 40kg workout for Bench Press is actually 60kg?

Should the bar be above my spine on the shoulders?


----------



## Matt.

I had a long conversation with someone from My Protein today. Very helpfull.

There advice was to use Impact Whey Isolate - http://www.myprotein.com/uk/products/impact_whey_isolate It is very low in Fat & Carbs and has a high protein content.

Creatine Gluconate - http://www.myprotein.com/uk/products/creatine-gluconate Apparently, this is better than Ethyl Ester Creatine. It transports to your muscle faster

Dextrose - http://www.myprotein.com/uk/products/dextrose Basically a carb.


----------



## impster

Workout B tonight - a day late.

Squats: 54.6kg. Will sort out some sort of squat rack this weekend, as I'm damn sure I could easily add a lot more to this. 54.6 is the limit of what I can lift over my head - bbut even that is improving every workout.

Overhead Press: 41.2kg. Glad to have broken the 40kg barrier. When I started I couldn't benchpress 40kg, so this is another achievement for me.

Deadlift: Maxed out the barbell with 72.8kg (up from 55kg last time lol). 1x5 no problem. Must get more cast iron weights to replace these fat vinyl ones.

Finished off with 50 chin ups and 50 press ups. Alternating sets of 10 each.

Topped off with 4 scoops of Reflex One stop in 400ml of water.

Press ups and chin ups are now proper 'warm downs' as opposed to 'work outs' - another indicator of progress.

As I'm trying to stick to Mon, Wed, Fri schedule, I'm gonna miss 2 days, so that my next workout is this Friday, and then 2 days off over the weekend and back to normal schedule on Monday.

Really enjoying this, and am so glad I asked on DW how to start off.

Lol - Wax on, Wax off. Mr Miagi was so right.


----------



## Bod42

My take on Supplements is that I put everyone I ever trained on Whey Protein Shakes. No you dont need them and they should be treated as a Supplement but most of us have a life and cant/dont prepare 6-7 meals a day full of protein. I find it so much easier to get the calories and protein needed while using shakes. Another good thing about Whey Protein is they normally have a healthy does of Glutamine in them as well, this is well known to boost the immune system so helps you stay healthy and recover when your pushing your body hard.

I would personally go with maltodextrin over Dextrose. Dextrose is a simple carb so ok after training but I find most people are carb sensative to a degree so a more complex carb like Maltodextrin is better. 

Im similar to you Doug in that you lower your cals on non training days. But the way I do it is to always add Milk but on training days I add 2 scoops of extra Carbs to each shake and on non training days I forget the carbs.

Creatine is a good product and each persn see's different results but personally I dont put any beginners on this as in simple terms it basically increases the amount of ATP's and water in your muscles. Higher ATP's will normally result in a rep or 2 more but beginners dont have the form to be grinding out a rep or 2 more.

I suggest everyone take an EFA supplement, just look at the research Charles Poliquin constantly provides to back up this supplement. Again you dont need this if your diet is up to scratch but hands up who here eats 2-3 servings of Organic Free Range Fresh fish each week.

Wow Doug you really dont eat alot, you must have a body that grows muscle on low calories or its all muscle memory. Your diet looks pretty healthy which is good but god knows how you eat cold uncooked fish, nasty


----------



## Bod42

impster said:


> Workout B tonight - a day late.
> 
> Squats: 54.6kg. Will sort out some sort of squat rack this weekend, as I'm damn sure I could easily add a lot more to this. 54.6 is the limit of what I can lift over my head - bbut even that is improving every workout.
> 
> Overhead Press: 41.2kg. Glad to have broken the 40kg barrier. When I started I couldn't benchpress 40kg, so this is another achievement for me.
> 
> Deadlift: Maxed out the barbell with 72.8kg (up from 55kg last time lol). 1x5 no problem. Must get more cast iron weights to replace these fat vinyl ones.
> 
> Finished off with 50 chin ups and 50 press ups. Alternating sets of 10 each.
> 
> Topped off with 4 scoops of Reflex One stop in 400ml of water.
> 
> Press ups and chin ups are now proper 'warm downs' as opposed to 'work outs' - another indicator of progress.
> 
> As I'm trying to stick to Mon, Wed, Fri schedule, I'm gonna miss 2 days, so that my next workout is this Friday, and then 2 days off over the weekend and back to normal schedule on Monday.
> 
> Really enjoying this, and am so glad I asked on DW how to start off.
> 
> Lol - Wax on, Wax off. Mr Miagi was so right.


I would always suggest getting a power rack but I been lifting a few years now and only got a Power rack a few months back as funds were tight and also space.

Anyway another way of getting the bar in the right position is whats called the Steinborn Lift. Cant posts links as at work but try Stronglifts "How to Squat When you Don't Have a Power Rack" article for Details


----------



## Bod42

Matt. said:


> Well tonight I went to the Gym
> 
> Bench Press
> 
> WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3, 30kg x 2
> WO - 40kg 5 x 5
> 
> Squat
> 
> WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3, 30kg x 2
> WO - 40kg 5 x 5
> 
> Bent Over Row
> 
> WU - Bar 5 x 2, 20kg x 3
> WO - 40kg 5 x 5
> 
> Bench Press - I struggled on this. Although I made the 5 x 5 it was slow on the last few reps.
> 
> Squats - They went well. my legs started to sting ok the last set. I could of probably squeezed 50kg. The bone at the top of my spine really hurts now. Have I been squatting with the bar in the wrong place?
> 
> Bent Over Row - All about the technique on this. DEFINITELY room for more weight
> 
> So overall, I enjoyed it. I was only in there 40 minutes. If i'm honest, it doesn't feel like I have done a session at the Gym. Is this normal?
> 
> Is there any advice you can give me for next time?


Defiently got the bar in the wrong place mate. You can either choose high bar placement which involves putting the bar on top of your traps or low bar where you fit the bar in the slot created by your rear delts when their tensed up. I watched a video from Mark Rippletoe where he shows a few people where low bar squats are, theres quite a few on youtube as well


----------



## Guest

A good but lengthy workout tonight - a shade under 2hrs. I normally only take 1.5hrs.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/5/3/1/[email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 1/3/[email protected]

*Chins* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+7.5kg=72.5kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squat was ok. Felt heavy and moved a little slowly.
OHP went better than expected tbh. Actually please I got 2 complete sets. Couldn't get the 4 rep on the final set, so ended up doing 2 singles to keep the volume up.
Decided to give a 1/3/5 ladder a go on the dead to get some more volume in - I'll see how this goes. Last set was quite tough.
Chins were fine.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Lots of good stuff here guys, I’m feeling so fresh already & waking up at 6.30 each morning as my energy levels are back weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!, getting twitchy as  need my weights 

Almost certain I’ll start a 1X5 next as i really want to focus on getting my lifts up & especially focus on my bench form, I’ve been watching Dave Tate’s vids on how to bench, very inspiriting stuff :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I've been reading Wendlers 5/3/1.
A really interesting & varied workout/rep & weight percentage routine, something else I will defo try this year, love the idea of adding volume with 5 sets of 10 reps (Personally I would stay below 8) I think he calls it “the big but boring”:devil: assistance routine. I also like “I’m doing Jack SHHit”  routine, thinking of mixing the both up to keep it interesting :thumb:

There are so many possibilities within the basic compound lifts in Powerlifting; I think variation is key to keeping it interesting from a psychological/motivational point of view & physical point of view in regards to growth & recovery :thumb:

Long live Powerlifting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  :thumb:


----------



## Guest

I think 5/3/1 is a very popular program. I'm certainly interested in doing it after I've got as much as I can out of my beginner and intermediate stages - which I'm hoping will not be until late this year/early next year.

I think the BBB (Big But Boring) assistance routines are along the lines of Dynamic Effort exercises that Ryan mentioned a few weeks ago. Mind you, I've yet to get the ebook, so I might be completely wrong


----------



## sidewalkdances

The Boring But Big is nothing like DE work.

BBB assistance is basically take 50% of your working max and do 5 sets of 10 after your main lift of that exercise. Although some do switch around, so they do 5x10 deads after their 5/3/1 squats.

5/3/1 is a cracking program. It takes a mental adjustment to drop the weights down but in the long run its an exceptional program.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
Front Squats: 82.5x5, 82.5x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 50x5, 50x5, 50x5
Deadlifts: 150kgx5

Front squats were a nice change actually but my shoulders are bruised this morning, need them to toughen up and get used to Front Squats again.

Seated Shoulder Press was easy but had slight pain in my shoulder so I'm going to see how this goes but may change back to ramped sets as my shoulder doesnt hurt on these, I presume due to the lower volume.

I really worked on my form tonight, exercise felt weird but was actually easier to lock out with a tighter back. Amazing what a little change like turning round in the rack can do. Im looking forward to smashing this weight over the next few weeks now I got my form down and hitting some PRs. Roll on 220kg.

I revised my goals slightly the other day as I think Im aiming to low. I increased each goal by 100lb. This was brought about by watching Defranco on youtube hitting some stupid weights with his athletes. 
Goals are now:
Shoulder Press: 300lb / 135kg - 115 x 5 
Bench Press: 400lb / 180kg - 155 x 5
Box Squat: 500lb / 225kg - 192.5x 5
Deadlift: 550lb / 250kg - 215 x 5

I think the Lower Body Movement are doable but the Upper body lifts are going to be hard work. I used Jim Wendlers formula to calculate the 5RM weight so I know it wont be totally accurate. If I get my goals it will be a nice 1750lb / 790kg total. 

I read alot of Forums and reviews of the 5/3/1 program and it will definitely be my go to program in the future. Alot of people say they regress on squats but I think this is because they start the program to soon while they are a beginner and also because they go from starting strength, squatting 3 times per week, to 5/3/1 where you squat once a week or every 8 days depending how many days per week you work out.

When I start I will doing the Beginners workout which has you squatting twice a week so its an easier transition. Once I done that I will probably go on the Simpest Strength Template for the long run.

Im going to do a run through of Juggernaut Method as well as this is very similar to 5/3/1 but has auto regulate so should be able to make quicker gains. If I start playing rugby again Im going to do the Inverted Juggernaut Method as well, would be good to see how my body responds to this.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I read alot of Forums and reviews of the 5/3/1 program and it will definitely be my go to program in the future. Alot of people say they regress on squats but I think this is because they start the program to soon while they are a beginner and also because they go from starting strength, squatting 3 times per week, to 5/3/1 where you squat once a week or every 8 days depending how many days per week you work out.
> 
> When I start I will doing the Beginners workout which has you squatting
> twice a week so its an easier transition. Once I done that I will probably go on the Simpest Strength Template for the long run.
> 
> Im going to do a run through of Juggernaut Method as well as this is very similar to 5/3/1 but has auto regulate so should be able to make quicker gains. If I start playing rugby again Im going to do the Inverted Juggernaut Method as well, would be good to see how my body responds to this.


I like the look of the 5/3/1, however I think there is still a little more progress for me left with the much more basic workouts once i sort my diet out & get a regular protein intake every 3 hours:thumb:
Im going to do a 1X5 next & monitor my progress over the next 8 weeks & continue with it until progress stops then go for the 5/3/1 & mix it up between jack shhit & big but boring assistance exercises 

For the first time ever I will be taking supplements on the next cycle :doublesho (Protein shake, cod liver oil, Glucosamine & Chondroitin)
My protein intake will increase to around 200grams per day (80grams via supplementation, the rest with whole natural foods) I'm interested to see what the results are, if there is very little difference then I will know once & for all that supplementation for me is a waste of money & time


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
> Front Squats: 82.5x5, 82.5x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 50x5, 50x5, 50x5
> Deadlifts: 150kgx5
> 
> Front squats were a nice change actually but my shoulders are bruised this morning, need them to toughen up and get used to Front Squats again.
> 
> Seated Shoulder Press was easy but had slight pain in my shoulder so I'm going to see how this goes but may change back to ramped sets as my shoulder doesnt hurt on these, I presume due to the lower volume.
> 
> I really worked on my form tonight, exercise felt weird but was actually easier to lock out with a tighter back. Amazing what a little change like turning round in the rack can do. Im looking forward to smashing this weight over the next few weeks now I got my form down and hitting some PRs. Roll on 220kg.
> 
> I revised my goals slightly the other day as I think Im aiming to low. I increased each goal by 100lb. This was brought about by watching Defranco on youtube hitting some stupid weights with his athletes.
> Goals are now:
> Shoulder Press: 300lb / 135kg - 115 x 5
> Bench Press: 400lb / 180kg - 155 x 5
> Box Squat: 500lb / 225kg - 192.5x 5
> Deadlift: 550lb / 250kg - 215 x 5
> 
> I think the Lower Body Movement are doable but the Upper body lifts are going to be hard work. I used Jim Wendlers formula to calculate the 5RM weight so I know it wont be totally accurate. If I get my goals it will be a nice 1750lb / 790kg total.
> 
> I read alot of Forums and reviews of the 5/3/1 program and it will definitely be my go to program in the future. Alot of people say they regress on squats but I think this is because they start the program to soon while they are a beginner and also because they go from starting strength, squatting 3 times per week, to 5/3/1 where you squat once a week or every 8 days depending how many days per week you work out.
> 
> When I start I will doing the Beginners workout which has you squatting twice a week so its an easier transition. Once I done that I will probably go on the Simpest Strength Template for the long run.
> 
> Im going to do a run through of Juggernaut Method as well as this is very similar to 5/3/1 but has auto regulate so should be able to make quicker gains. If I start playing rugby again Im going to do the Inverted Juggernaut Method as well, would be good to see how my body responds to this.


Nice goals James, a 300LB shoulder press & 400LB bench press :doublesho James you animal  :devil:

Im sticking with my goals until i reach them & spend a few weeks dominating them before i consider moving up a level :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I like the look of the 5/3/1, however I think there is still a little more progress for me left with the much more basic workouts once i sort my diet out & get a regular protein intake every 3 hours:thumb:
> Im going to do a 1X5 next & monitor my progress over the next 8 weeks & continue with it until progress stops then go for the 5/3/1 & mix it up between jack shhit & big but boring assistance exercises
> 
> For the first time ever I will be taking supplements on the next cycle :doublesho (Protein shake, cod liver oil, Glucosamine & Chondroitin)
> My protein intake will increase to around 200grams per day (80grams via supplementation, the rest with whole natural foods) I'm interested to see what the results are, if there is very little difference then I will know once & for all that supplementation for me is a waste of money & time


If your keeping your normal food the same and adding in supplements, I would say it will help quite alot. Your be getting extra calories and extra protein so thats perfect for strength training.



ITHAQVA said:


> Nice goals James, a 300LB shoulder press & 400LB bench press :doublesho James you animal  :devil:
> 
> Im sticking with my goals until i reach them & spend a few weeks dominating them before i consider moving up a level :thumb:


I think setting my goals high is better for me mentally, I remember hitting my 350lb Bench Press for reps goal and kind of relaxed on it after that. Im going to have to push for a long time to get those goals but it should be worth it.

Rippletoe Elite Class Weights are
Shoulder Press: 264
Bench Press: 395
Squats: 551
Deadlift: 596

So really my goals are not that different to hitting Elite Standard. As Im not playing rugby now and not planning to in the near furture I was planning to cut to 95kg next Christmas (our Summer) as I dont need to be 110kg but if I want to hit those goals Im going to have to eat big so I will have to see where I am in 6-9months time and go from there.

Also I found a place that does Ultra Sound body scans that tells you quite accurately what BF% you are and how much muscle and fat you have at each site. Also tells you thickness of the fat and muscle. Its only 25 quid so thought I would get one now, one after the 16 Juggernaut Program and then one after a 12 week cut. Good to know what works for your body


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Rippletoe Elite Class Weights are
> Shoulder Press: 264
> Bench Press: 395
> Squats: 551
> Deadlift: 596


These are really nice goals; I would be very pleased if I were able to reach those weights in 2 1/2 to 3 years.

Problem is I'm like everyone who lifts, I want it NOW!!!!! 

But I also realise that if you want to lift & be successful you need to learn patience & except that sometimes training session just don't work out as planned :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Doug - how heavy are you? 

200g might not be adequate. The usual rule I go by is 1.5g per lb bodyweight. So for me at 250-ish lbs I get well over 400g protein a day. My training day diet is (I follow carb backloading - my strength has rocketed back up and bodyfat/weight has stayed the same) 

Upon Waking- 20g whey in water, 2 tbsp coconut oil - skip if feeling bloated

Late Breakfast - 4-6oz breakfast meat (usually bacon) and 3-4 eggs in coconut oil, 20g whey

Lunch - 8oz steak and salad

Afternoon Snack - 40g whey/casein blend with 1 cup nuts

Post Workout 60g carbs (30/30 Waxy Maize and Maltodextrin), 40g Whey Isolate, 5g L-Leucine, 5g Creapure, 4g Fish Oil

Dinner - 2 burgers on wholemeal buns

Pre-Bed - 30g Casein, 4g fish oil, 5g L-Leucine, 2 cups of Ice Cream.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Doug - how heavy are you?
> 
> 200g might not be adequate. The usual rule I go by is 1.5g per lb bodyweight. So for me at 250-ish lbs I get well over 400g protein a day. My training day diet is (I follow carb backloading - my strength has rocketed back up and bodyfat/weight has stayed the same)
> 
> Upon Waking- 20g whey in water, 2 tbsp coconut oil - skip if feeling bloated
> 
> Late Breakfast - 4-6oz breakfast meat (usually bacon) and 3-4 eggs in coconut oil, 20g whey
> 
> Lunch - 8oz steak and salad
> 
> Afternoon Snack - 40g whey/casein blend with 1 cup nuts
> 
> Post Workout 60g carbs (30/30 Waxy Maize and Maltodextrin), 40g Whey Isolate, 5g L-Leucine, 5g Creapure, 4g Fish Oil
> 
> Dinner - 2 burgers on wholemeal buns
> 
> Pre-Bed - 30g Casein, 4g fish oil, 5g L-Leucine, 2 cups of Ice Cream.


 Hi Dan, 400g protein!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho

I weigh 232LB, I'm around 22-25% body fat, so I was hoping to get enough protein for my lean body mass only etc..

I'm not a big eater & find eating 5 meals a day really difficult, I'm going to replace real food with 3 x 500-700ml protein shakes made with skimmed milk/water per day.

My diet approx..Only just started this week so i doubt ill see anything yet.

* 8am* 700 ml Protein shake made with skimmed milk = 60gram

* 9-9:30 *2 x boiled eggs = 20gram (tempted to change up to 4 x boiled eggs)

*12-12:30* = chicken, rice & vegetables = 20gram

*3-3:30pm* protein shake made with water = 40gram

*Workout between 5-6pm*

*6pm* evening meal with protein shake made with skimmed milk = 80gram

Estimated total protein a day 220grams.

For the record I eat healthy but no way as structured as I should be, as I would love to achieve my goals & more if possible I'm starting to see that I need to be the complete package in regards my approach to training & nutrition. I'm sold on the warming up thing & would never lift without it now.
I'm ready & very keen to learn :thumb::thumb:

I would like your very honest opinion on the above mate as I want to lift as much as i can :devil:

I love milk & eggs so im happy to consume more!!!! :thumb:

Suppliments i have recently purchased: :doublesho

1.Glucosamine & Chondroitin x 2 a day
2. Cod liver Oil x 1 a day
3. Protein Supplement http://www.supplementcentre.com/Prod...ic-Protein.asp Seems to be as good as any & its priced pretty well too


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'd ditch the milk for starters, it's a rubbish carb. Your not really getting extra protein from it. 

More protein in meal 2 with the eggs. Maybe add some chicken or red meat here.

More food in the evening too. You need something after your evening meal thats slow digesting. The usual suspects are either a casein shake or cottage cheese. 

That link isnt working, but i'd recommend something like Total Protein or Total Milk and Whey from MyProtein for you. Will be a good, low carbs, low fat shake and will fit in anywhere.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Cheers Dan,

Updated link to my protein shake;

http://www.supplementcentre.com/ProductPage/12097/5KG-Matrix-Anabolic-Protein.asp

I'll check out your links mate. :thumb:

Lots for me to think about & work out :thumb:

I like peanuts & all nuts, how do you rate them as a protein?

I like cottage cheese, so ill add that to my shopping list for my evening protein snack :thumb:

Many thanks for your help Dan :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Nuts are fats rather than proteins. 

My diet guy has just taken my evening ice cream away


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Nuts are fats rather than proteins.
> 
> My diet guy has just taken my evening ice cream away


Ok mate, No ice cream  I've got it!!! Have a frozen protein shake


----------



## Matt.

Doug, have a look at Impact Whey Isolate - http://www.myprotein.com/uk/product...m_medium=cpc&gclid=CPWBudHP6a4CFUcntAodPTDKHQ

Per 25g:
Energy: 92.5cal
Energy: 393.3kJ
Protein (dry basis): 23.0g
Protein (as-is): 22.25g
Fat: 0.25g
Carbohydrates: 0.17g
Calcium: 100.0mg
Cholesterol: 0.5mg

A good amount of Protein. Hardly any Carbs or Fat. :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Protein 50g Serving

Matrix - 40g Impact Whey Isolate - 46g

Fat

Matrix - 2.9g Impact Whey Isolate - 0.50g

Carbohydrates

Matrix - 5.9g Impact Whey Isolate - 0.17

When I spoke to MyProtein, this is what they recommend for lean muscle growth.

You have the option of adding a Carb on training days into the shake if you wish - http://www.myprotein.com/uk/products/dextrose


----------



## Bod42

SideWalkDance: I read a few of the guys on Elitefts are using the Backloading Carbs Diets and now you are.

Could you breifly explain what it is. As I understand it, its where you eat low carbs throughout the day except you hard carb load in the window following your workout. What do you do on days you dont work out.

At the moment I am doing high carb days on training days and low carb days on non training days which is similar I suppose. I just find it gives me alot of energy for lifting but keeps my body weight in check.

What do you think?


----------



## Guest

Tough workout tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+7.5kg=72.5kg)
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

Squats felt quite heavy tonight. Reps moved slowly but never a grind. Paused for 2-3 breaths at the top of most reps.
Bench was tough. Last rep of each set was most definately a grind.
Row was ok but my back is rising by about 30° towards the top of each rep.
Dips were heavy but fine. However, I started too soon after finishing the BBR and only managed 3 reps. I relegated that to a warm up set 

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> SideWalkDance: I read a few of the guys on Elitefts are using the Backloading Carbs Diets and now you are.
> 
> Could you breifly explain what it is. As I understand it, its where you eat low carbs throughout the day except you hard carb load in the window following your workout. What do you do on days you dont work out.
> 
> At the moment I am doing high carb days on training days and low carb days on non training days which is similar I suppose. I just find it gives me alot of energy for lifting but keeps my body weight in check.
> 
> What do you think?


I used to do something similar - carb cycling. Most of the more advanced diets follow some sort of macronutrient cycling.

Backloading is good because daytime carbs interfere with stuff like mental performance and you end up walking round with jacked up insulin levels all day. Not good to burn bodyfat!

Then at night, after a hard training session when your primed to build muscle, you shuttle in loads of fast acting carbs and proteins getting the insulin level high to force those nutrients into the muscles. The reason you use fast acting carbs is that the insulin spike comes down quicker, enabling you to drop into sleep easier and release GH during sleep properly.

For me it's helped me get stronger and maintain my bodyweight. It hasn't really had a drastic effect on my body composition at all.


----------



## sidewalkdances

BareFacedGeek said:


> Tough workout tonight.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Row*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dips* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+7.5kg=72.5kg)
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Squats felt quite heavy tonight. Reps moved slowly but never a grind. Paused for 2-3 breaths at the top of most reps.
> Bench was tough. Last rep of each set was most definately a grind.
> Row was ok but my back is rising by about 30° towards the top of each rep.
> Dips were heavy but fine. However, I started too soon after finishing the BBR and only managed 3 reps. I relegated that to a warm up set
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Why are you doing weighted, but assisted dips? Work on getting to the point where you can do non assisted dips. You dont want to be adding weight to something you cant yet do with bodyweight.


----------



## Guest

sidewalkdances said:


> Why are you doing weighted, but assisted dips? Work on getting to the point where you can do non assisted dips. You dont want to be adding weight to something you cant yet do with bodyweight.


That is just what I am doing :thumb:. I'm using extra weight to reduce the assistance effect of the resistance band. 
My thought is that I wouldn't start trying to bench/squat/etc 100kg by doing negatives/singles etc so why do that with dips/chins? I'm trying to use PR for these exercises too.
It's not perfect, since the band will offer much less assistance at the top of the movement.


----------



## sidewalkdances

It doesnt make any sense tbh dude. 

Have you tried to do reps without the band yet?


----------



## impster

Tonight's workout 'A' (squats, bench, rows).

(finally got myself a set of squat stands by the way)

Squats: 63.6kg (up from 54.6kg last workout).

Bench: 52.2kg (up from 50.4kg last workout). This was a complete nightmare tonight. I've had a few late nights and early mornings this week, and didn't really get a proper lunch today, so I'm putting it down to that. I did get my 25 reps, but rather than 5x5 it was a case of a few 1x3s mixed with 2 1x4s and even a 1x2. 

Rows: 52.2kg (up from 50.4kg last workout). No problems here whatsoever. Could have added a few more kgs possibly. 

Finished with 3x10 chinups and 3x10 press ups alternating. Usually do 50 of each, but am tired, and it's late, so have thrown in my towel tonight. 

Hopefully, Monday's workout will be better.

Impster


----------



## Guest

sidewalkdances said:


> It doesnt make any sense tbh dude.


The plan is to get strong enough to do them unaided. When I do get strong enough, I'll drop both the resistance band (for good) and weighted belt (temporarily).
I figure that adding weight is just that - effectively making myself heavier but using the same resistance band.



sidewalkdances said:


> Have you tried to do reps without the band yet?


Only a while back and it wasn't good. I was going to try again once I get to 15kg on the weighted belt (equivalent to me weighing 110kg) - this will represent the half way point as the band is giving me +30kg of lift at the bottom of the movement but virtually zero lift at the top.


----------



## Guest

This weekend is rather busy for me, so I'm splitting my workout over the two days.

*(Nearly) Chins** (Unassisted)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*(Nearly) Chins** (Unassisted)
WU: None
WO: 5/2/3/1/1/1/1/2/3/1/2/2/[email protected]

*Called them "nearly chins" because I'm about 2-3 inches too tall to completely extend my arms. Each rep ended with my feet back on the ground and a second or two pause before pulling the next.

After SWD's comments, I thought I'd see how many chins I could actually do. Wandered into my garage, did a few stretches, and just tried a few unassisted - managed 4 nearly reps and almost a 5th.

About an hour later I decided to part of my workout. Really wanted to get some work in on my OHP so decided to these and a bunch of BW chins too.
Since I was only doing these two exercises I went for 5x5 on the OHP. First set was a little slow, middle three went a bit better. Final set was hard and the last rep was a real grind.
Second bunch of chins were a bit random and ended up in almost a ladder. A little suprised I got 5 reps on the first set - I suspect the OHP had warmed me up a bit better than before.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Got my diet worked out (310 grams of protein a day) for the next 11 weeks, ill weight myself before i start & keep an eye on things in general (Thanks Dan) :thumb:

After reading the powerlifting bibles from Mark rippetoe & Wendler, I'm going to have go at *"The ITHAQVA 11 Cycle ©2012"* 

Thought I'd have a little fun with the next 11 weeks training but also keep to the basic principles.

I'll be training 3 times a week as before.

*Exercises used = Bench press, squat, deadlift, barbell row, pull-ups, close grip bench press & dips.*

After this 11 week cycle I will have another go at the overhead press using a 1X5 or Wendlers 5/3/1.

*The Workout*

*Weeks 1-4* are variable set workouts with 80%-85% of my one rep max using, 1X5, 2X5 or 3X5 depending on the exercise. I will keep aiming to add 2.5Kg when 5 reps are achieved as before.

*Week 5* will be a straight *1X3* on all exercises with 90% of my one rep max, aiming for one or more reps each exercise, if i manage 3 reps on any of the exercises i will add another 2.5Kg & recalculate my 80%-85% weights. If I have to take a set to failure in this week to reach 3 reps I will.

*Week 6 *will be a de load week using approx. 60% of my one rep max calculated from week one. On this week I'll aim for 8 reps every set, low intensity.

*Repeat Weeks 1-4. *

*Repeat week 5*

*Week off*

If the above works, I will repeat the 11 weeks again. If it doesn't I will do a 1X5 for 8 weeks to get back on track then a 4 day split (Wendlers 5/3/1).
I sat at work & made this all up within an hour  to give me a little variation on load & reps before I start using the tried & trusted methods, my main aim is to get more weight on the bar so that I can justify a straight four day split & Wendlers 5/3/1.

Comments/criticism welcome guys :thumb:

Edited: 19-03-12 Cheers Dan.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys, some real good info and nice insperation in this thread. I'm currently looking at suplements as I dont have the time to eat six protien rich meals a day(who does?). Thats for after my weeks holiday in april. Think even if it is just a placebo effect it could be just what im needing, if not all the better.
Saturdays session,

Squat 112.5k 3,3,3

Bench 87.5k 5,5,5,5,5

Barbell row 80k 5,5,5,5,5

Squat felt heavy, i'm currently considering dropping to two squats per week. On the other day I would do assistance work for my legs. What do you guys think? I aslo dropped my barbell row, it should have bee the same as my bench. The movement didn't feel great so I just knocked it back. It felt much better and I'll use this approach any time I feel my form is suffering.

Thanks guys,
Nicky


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys, some real good info and nice insperation in this thread. I'm currently looking at suplements as I dont have the time to eat six protien rich meals a day(who does?). Thats for after my weeks holiday in april. Think even if it is just a placebo effect it could be just what im needing, if not all the better.
> Saturdays session,
> 
> Squat 112.5k 3,3,3
> 
> Bench 87.5k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Barbell row 80k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Squat felt heavy, i'm currently considering dropping to two squats per week. On the other day I would do assistance work for my legs. What do you guys think? I aslo dropped my barbell row, it should have bee the same as my bench. The movement didn't feel great so I just knocked it back. It felt much better and I'll use this approach any time I feel my form is suffering.
> 
> Thanks guys,
> Nicky


Hi Nicky,

I do squats & deadlifts in 2 week cycles,

Brief example using a 3X5 work set: My warm up sets are included (adjust according to your needs) the ??? is whatever your 80-85% of 1 rep max is. Aim for 5 reps each set then add 2.5Kg for the next time & so on :thumb:

*WEEK ONE*

*MONDAY OR TUESDAY WARM UP SETS & WORK SETS*

BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 ???KG__/__/__/ 
SQUAT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 ???KG__/__/__/ 
BARBELL ROW 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 ???KG__/__/__/

*WEDNESDAY OR THURSDAY*

DEADLIFT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 ???KG__/ 
PULL-UP (Overhand Grip) __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 ???KG__/__/__/

*SATURDAY*

BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 ???KG__/__/__/ 
SQUAT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 ???KG__/__/__/ 
BARBELL ROW 20X5 40X5 60X3 80X2 ???KG__/__/__/

*WEEK TWO*

*MONDAY OR TUESDAY WARM UP SETS & WORK SETS*

DEADLIFT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 ???KG__/ 
PULL-UP (Overhand Grip) __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 70X2 ???KG__/__/__/

*WEDNESDAY OR THURSDAY*

BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 70X2 ???KG__/ 
SQUAT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 ???KG__/ 
BARBELL ROW 20X5 40X5 60X3 70X2 ???KG__/__/__/

*SATURDAY*

DEADLIFT 20X5 60X5 90X3 100X2 KG__/ 
PULL-UP (Overhand Grip) __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__ __/__
C G BENCH PRESS 20X5 40X5 60X3 70X2 KG__/__/__/

Then reapeat :thumb:

My Squat & deadlift have moved up really well using this approach :thumb:

All in Kg's :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Doug - your program looks good in theory, but 5 reps with 90% of your max is very hard and not always achieveable. It'd be better doing 5 reps at 85% and 3 reps at 90%


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Doug - your program looks good in theory, but 5 reps with 90% of your max is very hard and not always achieveable. It'd be better doing 5 reps at 85% and 3 reps at 90%


Cheers Dan, yep I have to agree, been reading some more PDf's over the weekend & it does seem that training with 90% means bringing the reps down :thumb:

I will see how it goes, I've no idea what will happen , I'm hoping the 90% week will give me a little variation & help with increasing my strength with my main lifts :thumb:

If I set my 90% week to a 3 rep max, could I still follow the basic progressive overload principle?

For example;

Following the Wendler formula my Bench Press 90% of 1 rep max = 128Kg = If 3 reps achieved, add 2.5Kg.

Next 90% Bench Press session = 130.5Kg aim for 1 or more reps, if 3 reached add another 2.5Kg & so on.

With the 90% sessions I would keep form strict :thumb:

What do you think Dan?


----------



## sidewalkdances

It could work, give it a go :thumb: 

No harm in trying.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Heavy deadlift day for me tonight, last one I think before the comp. Taking my opener, 2nd attempt and then my goal for a double off the 6" blocks!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Heavy deadlift day for me tonight, last one I think before the comp. Taking my opener, 2nd attempt and then my goal for a double off the 6" blocks!


Best of luck in the comp Dan :thumb:

Give it some :devil::devil::devil: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Cheers Doug, Attempts today will be 

240kg Opener
250kg 2nd
272.5x2 (On Blocks) - third


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 132.5x5, 132.5x5, 132.5x5
Shoulder Press: 52.5x5, 52.5x5, 52.5x5
Chins Ups: BW 4, 4, 5

Squats still feel heavy every rep of every set but just going to push on and see what happenes. If I fail to get 5 reps then I just make sure that the next workout I will get one more rep and work up. I hoping I continue to get 3x5 for a little while yet as I need to increase my squat big time. My first wave of this program is 9 weeks but after 6 weeks I will evalulate where I am and if my Squat still isnt progressing then I will be doing Smolov. Difficult program but everyone seems to gain on it.

Shoulder Press felt great tonight, it was the fastest it moved since I started doing this exercise again. Hopefully this will translate into move weight on the bar in the weeks to come.

1 min rest between Chin-Ups and was surprised how quickly my strength fell off, first set of 4 was easy, form felt great but the last set of 5 definitely involved some cheating


----------



## ITHAQVA

First day of my revised diet with more protein (approx 250 grams of protein, hope to increase to around 300 grams once i get back into training) must admit i have felt full most of the day. if I were to train tonight i would of not been able to as i was so stuffed after drinking the protein shake at 4pm, by 4.40pm i was still stuffed. Tomorrow I will make 3:3pm the latest i eat before my 5pm workout.

Todays diet;

8AM Protein shake made with skimmed milk.

11AM 4 boiled eggs

2:30PM two chicken breasts a mug of rice & vegetables.

4PM Protein shake made with water (Way to close to training time i came home too stuffed to train)

5:30PM Pigs liver, mash, peas, carrots & cabbage followed by a natural yogurt

I am so full


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> First day of my revised diet with more protein (approx 250 grams of protein, hope to increase to around 300 grams once i get back into training) must admit i have felt full most of the day. if I were to train tonight i would of not been able to as i was so stuffed after drinking the protein shake at 4pm, by 4.40pm i was still stuffed. Tomorrow I will make 3:3pm the latest i eat before my 5pm workout.
> 
> Todays diet;
> 
> 8AM Protein shake made with skimmed milk.
> 
> 11AM 4 boiled eggs
> 
> 2:30PM two chicken breasts a mug of rice & vegetables.
> 
> 4PM Protein shake made with water (Way to close to training time i came home too stuffed to train)
> 
> 5:30PM Pigs liver, mash, peas, carrots & cabbage followed by a natural yogurt
> 
> I am so full


Your get used to the protein shakes pretty quickly mate, I think everybody I ever put Protein shakes on has said the sam thing. Your stomach is probably not used to ingesting half a litre of milk. Its the same whe you increase your water intake, you feel full and are in the loo every 5 mins but after a week or 2 it all settles down.

Im the same as you I cant have a shake to close to gym time but this is what all the powerlifters seem to do so there must be something behind the theory


----------



## impster

workout 'B' tonight (squat, o/head press, d/lift). Following a pretty [email protected] workout last time round, tonight went much better.

Squat: 68.2kg
O/h press: 43.6kg
D/lift: 72.8kg (can't get more on the bar unless I get some more large weights)
Finished with 50 chin ups and 50 press ups (alternating sets of 10 each)

This completes my first 4 weeks on the 5x5 stronglift programme, and I have to admit that I can feel and see the diference in this short time.

One big thing I've noticed is that you have to make sure you take in food regularly and get your dose of sleep and rest. On the days that I've missed lunch (like today unfortunately) or missed a few hours of sleep I really notice a diference in how a workout feels.

I've cut down from 2 protein shakes a day to one - that's purely on the basis of cost as I can't afford to spend £2 a day on shakes. I guess I'll need to re-evaluate what I do with the shakes situation as I'd rather be spending that money on the kids or the wife (or possibly a trip for myself to watch France v Wales in Paris next spring).

So - if anyone has a method of getting a good dose of protein into my system for less than 50p per day that would be great. Reflex one-stop seems good, but as I'm cutting the recommended dose by half, maybe I'm not getting my money's worth? I'll leave that one to you experts, and would like to know which is the best 'Value for Money'.

Anyway - month 2 about 2 start. Keep the advice and motivation coming. It's working well.

Impster


----------



## JJ_

Does anyone here try lactose free or other types of protein shakes, I find them easier to digest and they don't give me that bloated feeling ?


----------



## Guest

Not a bad workout tonight - had a couple of mishaps which I'll detail below.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips* (Resistance band assisted with weighted belt - weight is BW-30kg+10kg=75kg)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squat went suprisingly well tonight. Still feels heavy but I needed to take less pauses for breath between reps. 
I did manage to miss rack the bar on my 80kg warmup set. Got one side on the bar hook but somehow missed the other side. Fortunately, the power rack did what it is designed to do and prevented me from being squished .
Not sure what happened on the middle set on the bench. Thought I'd taken enough rest after the first set, but I guess not - I'll definately get this next time.
Row went ok but I think my form might be suffereing. Tempted to keep at this weight on the next session.
Dips were fine but I need to do a warmup set now. My LH shoulder twinged a bit on the first set - all fine on the remaining sets.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ntynan528

Monday nights workout,

Squat 115k 5,5,5

Overhead press 55k 5,5,5,5,5

Deadlift 150k 5

Last nights workout felt great. I am taking a couple of deep breaths before each squat. This really seems to help me over just trying to push out the reps as quick as possible. Overhead press felt easy after lest weeks fail. This was definatily down to the rest period between sets. Managed to do my first two reps at full wieght on the deadlift with overhand grip, I then changed to one overhand one underhand to get the other three reps. Is this the best way to go while my grip improves?

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Monday nights workout,
> 
> Squat 115k 5,5,5
> 
> Overhead press 55k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Deadlift 150k 5
> 
> Last nights workout felt great. I am taking a couple of deep breaths before each squat. This really seems to help me over just trying to push out the reps as quick as possible. Overhead press felt easy after lest weeks fail. This was definatily down to the rest period between sets. Managed to do my first two reps at full wieght on the deadlift with overhand grip, I then changed to one overhand one underhand to get the other three reps. Is this the best way to go while my grip improves?
> 
> Cheers


My overhand grip started to fail like yours around the same weight, i use a mixed grip for my work sets now :thumb:

I train my deadlifts touch & go rep style, feels more fluid & natural for me 

Looking forward to tonights session :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek;3369932[B said:


> Bench[/B]
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO:* 5/3/5*@75kg


I wouldnt worry too much Phil, this does happen, shoulder lift (Overhead press) can do the same thing, MarkH spoke about this a few weeks back, these areas can be difficult to warm up :thumb:


----------



## impster

Thinking ahead to this Wednesday's workout ('A' - Squats, Bench, Rows), and considering that last time round I struggled on the Benchpress, would it be advantageous to stick to the last weight (or the one before that) and 'dominate' it? A partial deload. I'm thinking I may be pushing too much weight too soon? Not being able to 'dominate' is a pcychological negative - and I have been adding more than I should really from week to week?


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> My overhand grip started to fail like yours around the same weight, i use a mixed grip for my work sets now :thumb:
> 
> I train my deadlifts touch & go rep style, feels more fluid & natural for me
> 
> Looking forward to tonights session :thumb::thumb:


Try and do the deads from a dead stop Doug! The clue is in the name - DEADlift :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

My session was poo. Missed 240kg twice equipped (I ate too much at the weekend and my suit was too bloody small) then pulled it raw.

Probably down to the fact I squatted 320kg and 350kg at the tail end of last week too!


----------



## Guest

impster said:


> Thinking ahead to this Wednesday's workout ('A' - Squats, Bench, Rows), and considering that last time round I struggled on the Benchpress, would it be advantageous to stick to the last weight (or the one before that) and 'dominate' it? A partial deload. I'm thinking I may be pushing too much weight too soon? Not being able to 'dominate' is a pcychological negative - and I have been adding more than I should really from week to week?


Had a quick look back at your log. I'd say stick at the current weight and see how it goes. You'll probably get the proper 5x5 this time around :thumb:.


----------



## Guest

sidewalkdances said:


> My session was poo. Missed 240kg twice equipped (I ate too much at the weekend and my suit was too bloody small) then pulled it raw.


Out of interest, is the technique for doing lifts suited different from raw? I only ask because I think you've mentioned before pulling weights suited that you can also pull raw.



sidewalkdances said:


> Probably down to the fact I squatted 320kg and 350kg at the tail end of last week too!


They are pretty mental weights :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

BareFacedGeek said:


> Out of interest, is the technique for doing lifts suited different from raw? I only ask because I think you've mentioned before pulling weights suited that you can also pull raw.
> 
> They are pretty mental weights :thumb:


Bench and Squat the technique is totally different. Deadlift not so much, the main problem being that on its own, that suit needs 300+ kg to get me to hit depth when I use it as a squat suit. So it can in some respects compromise starting position on the deadlift.

I cant drop my hips as low, so I sometimes end up starting with the bar well out in front of me. This is a disaster and is often where I miss the lift. I really need to work on rocking back into the lift and pulling my hips down into the bar to maximise the pop out of the suit.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Try and do the deads from a dead stop Doug! The clue is in the name - DEADlift :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


Yep understand that :thumb:, but I like to rep out the lift bodybuilding style no rest, bare in mind I'm not competing so I don't think this little discrepancy will be of importance because my initial rep goal on this lift is so light, as soon as I reach 5 reps 200kg I will do a single 230Kg lift, then re asses what my next goal on the lift is or just keep going 

Dan, is there any benefit to deadlifting with the dead stop technique for me?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Injury prevention for a starter - its hard to maintain proper deadlift form if you touch and go, because you've got the bar bouncing to contend with. 

It'll also build greater starting strength for that 230kg when you go for it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Injury prevention for a starter - its hard to maintain proper deadlift form if you touch and go, because you've got the bar bouncing to contend with.
> 
> It'll also build greater starting strength for that 230kg when you go for it.


Cheers Dan, ill give this a go next DL session :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## impster

BareFacedGeek said:


> Had a quick look back at your log. I'd say stick at the current weight and see how it goes. You'll probably get the proper 5x5 this time around :thumb:.


Here's the log from week 1 to end of week 4 in case anyone else is curious (weights in kgs - 22kgs during first week was all the weights I had in week 1, and 72.8 is all the weights I can fit onto my bar at the moment (need more cast weights to replace thick vinyl ones). I've never done weights before in my life BTW.

Squats: 22, 42.8, 45, 50.4, 54.6, 68.2 (for the past week I've had squat stands)
Bench: 22, 33.6, 40.4, 45.8, 50.4, 52.2
Rows: 22, 38.2, 40.4, 45.8, 50.4, 52.2
Press: 22, 29, 33.6, 36.8, 41.2, 43.6
D/Lift: 22, 42.8, 45, 55, 72.8, 72.8


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Here's the log from week 1 to end of week 4 in case anyone else is curious (weights in kgs - 22kgs during first week was all the weights I had in week 1, and 72.8 is all the weights I can fit onto my bar at the moment (need more cast weights to replace thick vinyl ones). I've never done weights before in my life BTW.
> 
> Squats: 22, 42.8, 45, 50.4, 54.6, 68.2 (for the past week I've had squat stands)
> Bench: 22, 33.6, 40.4, 45.8, 50.4, 52.2
> Rows: 22, 38.2, 40.4, 45.8, 50.4, 52.2
> Press: 22, 29, 33.6, 36.8, 41.2, 43.6
> D/Lift: 22, 42.8, 45, 55, 72.8, 72.8


Good gains Impster :devil: :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday Powerlifting

*Bench Press*
Warm Up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3, 80X2. *Work Set 110Kg/242Lb 1X5* :thumb:

*Squat*
Warm Up Sets: 20X5, 60X5, 90X3, 90X2. *Work Sets 170Kg/374Lb 2X5* :thumb:

*Barbell Row*
Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3, 80X2. *Work sets: 105Kg/231Lb 3X5* :thumb:

Workout followed by 10 minutes various stretches.

All lifts felt lighter than I remember them;

Bench press was a real shock :doublesho it wasn't easy but no way was it hard and every rep went straight up no hesitating. Squat & barbell row felt the same to a lesser degree.

I'm not sure if it's the week off or that my new diet is helping. I will monitor over the next 11 week cycle.


----------



## impster

Thanks!

I've a feeling the graph I've plotted will start to level off considerably now. I'll still try to keep adding for the full 12 week programme though, and we'll see what happens at that stage - I'm tempted at the moment to stick to my current weights for a week or two before adding again - but willpower (and you lot) are motivating me enough to keep going. 

I'm still very much enjoying my workouts - in fact I look forward to them.

I wouldn't be doing this if it wasn't for Detailing World. Maybe there's a detailing thread on a Bodybuilding forum eh?


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I've a feeling the graph I've plotted will start to level off considerably now. I'll still try to keep adding for the full 12 week programme though, and we'll see what happens at that stage - I'm tempted at the moment to stick to my current weights for a week or two before adding again - but willpower (and you lot) are motivating me enough to keep going.
> 
> I'm still very much enjoying my workouts - in fact I look forward to them.
> 
> I wouldn't be doing this if it wasn't for Detailing World. Maybe there's a detailing thread on a Bodybuilding forum eh? I doubt it!


Its a good thread/forum Impster, keeps me inspired too mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> Injury prevention for a starter - its hard to maintain proper deadlift form if you touch and go, because you've got the bar bouncing to contend with.
> 
> It'll also build greater starting strength for that 230kg when you go for it.


Must say I totally agree, I watched quite a few people deadlift and normally on their first rep you see them working on form, concentrating on their arch, getting their thigh and upper body angle correct and the first rep looks good but after this I find each rep gets slightly worse.

I used to do Touch and Go but I also found people would try and bounce the weight to help. I do a dead stop between each set and reset my body, this means every rep is nearly the same so come 1RM time I should be able to pull exactly the same. Hopefully

But hey some of the strongest Powerlifters in the world train touch and go so cant be all bad.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Tuesday Powerlifting
> 
> *Bench Press*
> Warm Up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3, 80X2. *Work Set 110Kg/242Lb 1X5* :thumb:
> 
> *Squat*
> Warm Up Sets: 20X5, 60X5, 90X3, 90X2. *Work Sets 170Kg/374Lb 2X5* :thumb:
> 
> *Barbell Row*
> Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3, 80X2. *Work sets: 105Kg/231Lb 3X5* :thumb:
> 
> Workout followed by 10 minutes various stretches.
> 
> All lifts felt lighter than I remember them;
> 
> Bench press was a real shock :doublesho it wasn't easy but no way was it hard and every rep went straight up no hesitating. Squat & barbell row felt the same to a lesser degree.
> 
> I'm not sure if it's the week off or that my new diet is helping. I will monitor over the next 11 week cycle.


:doublesho Nice lifts Doug, 170kg squat, mice work. Must feel good to have 150kg on the bar. You havent missed a weight yet on Squats have you, thats amazing work.

The week off should give you a boost as your body wont be over trained and the extra calories and especially protein wont hurt either.

Keep it up mate, your goals are getting closer by the day.

This gives me the motivation to smash my squats this week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> :doublesho Nice lifts Doug, 170kg squat, mice work. Must feel good to have 150kg on the bar. You havent missed a weight yet on Squats have you, thats amazing work.
> 
> The week off should give you a boost as your body wont be over trained and the extra calories and especially protein wont hurt either.
> 
> Keep it up mate, your goals are getting closer by the day.
> 
> This gives me the motivation to smash my squats this week.


Cheers James :thumb: :thumb: Dont know about feeling good at the time, i just wanted to finish my 5 reps without snapping myself in half :doublesho 

Squat & deadlift have yet to stall, however I think before i get to reping 200Kg It will start to get much harder & stall a few times, I'm considering lowering my Barbell row weight & training it assistance style as per the 5/3/1 for around 10reps :thumb:

Im hoping the *"ITHAQVA 11 CYCLE" ©ITHAQVA 2012 *works as it looks interesting on paper 

I bet the 90% week will be a real bugger :devil:, I will be glad of the deload week after me thinks :thumb: 

Smash your goals mate! :thumb: :devil::devil: Hate those weights  :devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers James :thumb: :thumb: Dont know about feeling good at the time, i just wanted to finish my 5 reps without snapping myself in half :doublesho
> 
> Squat & deadlift have yet to stall, however I think before i get to reping 200Kg It will start to get much harder & stall a few times, I'm considering lowering my Barbell row weight & training it assistance style as per the 5/3/1 for around 10reps :thumb:
> 
> Im hoping the *"ITHAQVA 11 CYCLE" ©ITHAQVA 2012 *works as it looks interesting on paper
> 
> I bet the 90% week will be a real bugger :devil:, I will be glad of the deload week after me thinks :thumb:
> 
> Smash your goals mate! :thumb: :devil::devil: Hate those weights  :devil:


Ah but I bet it felt amazing once the bar was back in the rack. I think thats why we weight lift, the pushing and straining, feeling like my organs are going to come out my Ar*e any second and then you finish the rep and that suddenly changes to hell ya, woohoo. What kind of reps are you going to do on your 90% week as I think you originally said 5 reps but that will be hard. I thought 5 reps was 80-85% and 90% was 3 reps. Keep in mind everybody is different, if you take 80% of your 1RM and rep out some people can get 12-15 reps, some people can get 2. Me personally my 5RM is quite close to my 1RM, using Jim Wendler's formular, using my 5RM of 135kg it gives a 1RM of 157.5. I doubt I could do 22.5kg more for 1 rep but who knows.

You may stall, you may not. Getting to 170kg/374lb in one go without stalling is really good work. You are showing exactly why Stronglift/Starting Strength/5x5 are excellent beginners programs and the kind of gains you can expect from them.

I need to hate those weights, Im still kind of looking for a magic program but it doesnt matter if the program was designed by the best person in the world, I still need to put in the effort. Im kind of getting under the weight and thinking "oh this is harder than I thought it would/should be" and that just isnt like me.

I'm going to smash my Bench and Deadlift tonight.

Oh and Sidewalkdance, that 350kg Squat is sick.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ah but I bet it felt amazing once the bar was back in the rack. I think thats why we weight lift, the pushing and straining, feeling like my organs are going to come out my Ar*e any second and then you finish the rep and that suddenly changes to hell ya, woohoo. What kind of reps are you going to do on your 90% week as I think you originally said 5 reps but that will be hard. I thought 5 reps was 80-85% and 90% was 3 reps. Keep in mind everybody is different, if you take 80% of your 1RM and rep out some people can get 12-15 reps, some people can get 2. Me personally my 5RM is quite close to my 1RM, using Jim Wendler's formular, using my 5RM of 135kg it gives a 1RM of 157.5. I doubt I could do 22.5kg more for 1 rep but who knows.
> 
> You may stall, you may not. Getting to 170kg/374lb in one go without stalling is really good work. You are showing exactly why Stronglift/Starting Strength/5x5 are excellent beginners programs and the kind of gains you can expect from them.
> 
> I need to hate those weights, Im still kind of looking for a magic program but it doesnt matter if the program was designed by the best person in the world, I still need to put in the effort. Im kind of getting under the weight and thinking "oh this is harder than I thought it would/should be" and that just isnt like me.
> 
> I'm going to smash my Bench and Deadlift tonight.
> 
> Oh and Sidewalkdance, that 350kg Squat is sick.


Totally agree James, once the weight is back on the rack its a big  YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr manly stuff etc... 

Dan, put me on the right path re: 90% reps, I'll be using a 3 rep approach & increase weight after 3 have been reached. I'm like you though James my 80-85% feels close to my 1RM, it could also be a psychological though.

I had your issue a month or so ago whilst doing my squats, I got under the bar though "this is heavy" & gave up WTF!! :doublesho Next session I just though to myself hang on this is only 2.5 kg more than my last attempt, Doug get under the  bar & lift it yah wimp.

Hope your lifts get smashed mate, rooting for yah

You could try the ITHAQVA 11 CYCLE :thumb: 

Yep, Dan is one sick mofo, geared up or no, 350Kg :doublesho is ****t load of weight to be sticking on ya back :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Just a shame my deadlift hasn't been given the memo to go up :lol: 

We had a good session at the gym last night. I just did some upper assistance, did a few sets of 5 with 130kg + chains (we estimate about 20kg at the top) off a 3 board to really work the lockout. Then a few paused, full range close grips with the chains around the 100kg mark. Rest of it was just light BB pump stuff like rear delts, abs and biceps.

The good bit though was helping our mate Ben out. He was benching in his shirt (we have a fair few PL'ers now, but we all seem to train at different times!) - from what I remember he went up to 285kg off a 3 board, 265kg of a 2 board and I think 245kg off a 1 board. I'm sure that handing off the big weights will help my deadlift :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Just a shame my deadlift hasn't been given the memo to go up :lol:
> 
> We had a good session at the gym last night. I just did some upper assistance, did a few sets of 5 with 130kg + chains (we estimate about 20kg at the top) off a 3 board to really work the lockout. Then a few paused, full range close grips with the chains around the 100kg mark. Rest of it was just light BB pump stuff like rear delts, abs and biceps.
> 
> The good bit though was helping our mate Ben out. He was benching in his shirt (we have a fair few PL'ers now, but we all seem to train at different times!) - from what I remember he went up to 285kg off a 3 board, 265kg of a 2 board and I think 245kg off a 1 board. I'm sure that handing off the big weights will help my deadlift :lol:


Memo to Dans deadlift MOVE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

If only it were that easy :lol:

You're shifting some serious poundages now mate :thumb: 

Still trying to get my training partners squat up - stuck at 140kg. He raw benches that :lol: - only weighs 77kg though. Poor chap has these weird spindley things with feet stuck on the bottom.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> If only it were that easy :lol:
> 
> You're shifting some serious poundages now mate :thumb:
> 
> Still trying to get my training partners squat up - stuck at 140kg. He raw benches that :lol: - only weighs 77kg though. Poor chap has these weird spindley things with feet stuck on the bottom :lol::lol::lol: .


Tell me about it 

Cheers Dan :thumb:, I'm getting there but wont be happy or consider myself a REAL powerlifter until i squat & dead 200Kg for 5 reps :thumb:

The 150Kg Bench is a long way off  Onward & upward! :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

You should compete Doug. That makes you more a 'real' powerlifter than a set of numbers!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> You should compete Doug. That makes you more a 'real' powerlifter than a set of numbers!


True, I'm making contacts via a young lady here at work who knows an ex competing powerlifter, he owns a gym in Newquay, I'm going to arrange a few hours with the guy sometime to asses my form etc... You never know :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Sounds good Doug! 

Always handy to have someone look over your form. I've been fortunate to have trained with a few world champs (Andy Bolton being one!) and have them help. But its still a work in progress.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Sounds good Doug!
> 
> Always handy to have someone look over your form. I've been fortunate to have trained with a few world champs (Andy Bolton being one!) and have them help. But its still a work in progress.


Defo mate, like you say it would be amazing :thumb:

Andy Bolton :doublesho You lucky   :thumb:

Tesco's delivered today, 5X Plain yogurt & 5 X low fat cottage cheese for my evening protein kick to name but a few :thumb: 

Enjoying this diet now, since training last nigh that stuffed feeling is going, looks like the old body is finding a use for all that bloody protein


----------



## impster

Evening all.

Workout 'A' tonight - so Squats, Bench, and Rows.

Squats now 'maxed out' on the bar - 72.8kgs. Must get a couple of 10kg cast iron discs. (warm up was 5x 30kgs, 5x 50kgs)

Bench - 54.6kgs. First 2 sets at 5 each, then 2 sets of 4, then a couple of sets of 2 and a mammoth final effort to get the last 3 in one set. At least I got my 25 reps in. (Warm up was 10x30kgs, 5x50kgs)

Rows - 54.6kgs. No problems here, but somehow don't feel right in adding more to rows than I lift in my benchpress? (didn't do a warm up for this one).

Followed by my usual 50 chins and 50 press ups, in alternating sets of 10 each.

A nice refreshing 'Reflex one stop' down in one to finish.

Although bench wasn't a perfect 5x5, it was better than my last bench workout where it was all sets of 3 or so. I did add about 2.4kgs this time round, and got 2 sets of the full 5 in.

Squats and also deadlifts are now both maxed out on the weights I've got. I guess I'll have to get hold of a couple more 10kgs cast iron discs soon.

Impster


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Totally agree James, once the weight is back on the rack its a big  YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr manly stuff etc...
> 
> Dan, put me on the right path re: 90% reps, I'll be using a 3 rep approach & increase weight after 3 have been reached. I'm like you though James my 80-85% feels close to my 1RM, it could also be a psychological though.
> 
> I had your issue a month or so ago whilst doing my squats, I got under the bar though "this is heavy" & gave up WTF!! :doublesho Next session I just though to myself hang on this is only 2.5 kg more than my last attempt, Doug get under the  bar & lift it yah wimp.
> 
> Hope your lifts get smashed mate, rooting for yah
> 
> You could try the ITHAQVA 11 CYCLE :thumb:
> 
> Yep, Dan is one sick mofo, geared up or no, 350Kg :doublesho is ****t load of weight to be sticking on ya back :devil:


Thats kind of what Im doing at the moment, thinking this is hard and heavy and not putting 110% into the lift. I used to be the guy in the gym getting the people I was training in the mood and making them push hard. My best mate who I trained would always lift first as he liked to set a rep bench mark and then I would go as I like to have a rep goal in mind and I wouldlt quit unless I got that weight or basically die trying, need to get that back.



sidewalkdances said:


> Just a shame my deadlift hasn't been given the memo to go up :lol:
> 
> We had a good session at the gym last night. I just did some upper assistance, did a few sets of 5 with 130kg + chains (we estimate about 20kg at the top) off a 3 board to really work the lockout. Then a few paused, full range close grips with the chains around the 100kg mark. Rest of it was just light BB pump stuff like rear delts, abs and biceps.
> 
> The good bit though was helping our mate Ben out. He was benching in his shirt (we have a fair few PL'ers now, but we all seem to train at different times!) - from what I remember he went up to 285kg off a 3 board, 265kg of a 2 board and I think 245kg off a 1 board. I'm sure that handing off the big weights will help my deadlift :lol:


I used to train at the same gym (not with sadly) as Pinda Singh and watching some of his Bench Workouts were just crazy. Watching videos on Youtube is one thing but watching someone Bench 250kg+ is just nuts. It will only help your deadlift if your one of those guys who never lets go of the bar while their mate is bench pressing and constantly shouts "Its all you, Its all you" :lol:



sidewalkdances said:


> Sounds good Doug!
> 
> Always handy to have someone look over your form. I've been fortunate to have trained with a few world champs (Andy Bolton being one!) and have them help. But its still a work in progress.


Andy Bolton, that is so cool



sidewalkdances said:


> You should compete Doug. That makes you more a 'real' powerlifter than a set of numbers!


I know this was aimed at Doug but its weird you said this as I was just saying to my Mrs last night that I have nothing to aim for now days. I used to focus on being the strongest/best prop in my league and I was saying I should sign up for a power lifting meet in say 6 months, that would make me work hard as I wouldnt want to look like a t**t at the event.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
Front Squats: 85 x 5, 85 x 5
Bench Press: 105 x 5, 105 x 5, 105 x 5
Deadlift: 152.5 x 5

I tried a new way of front squatting tonight and it really didnt work. I normally do cross arm as the mobility in my shoulder is so bar that I cant do the normal snatch grip so I brough some wrist wraps and put these around the bar to hold. This in itself worked really well but where my front deltoid now tenses up, it creates a decline towards my throat which means alot of the bar weight is pushing into my wind pipe. Not the nicest feeling so changed back to cross arm.

Bench Press felt really good off my chest and I felt like I was controlling the bar really well but for the first time in forever I was having trouble bringing my hands up at the same time. I was getting to the top and having to lock out my right arm. Still quite easy 3x5 though.

Deadlifts, Im really concentrating on form and driving my chest up as hard as possible to keep my arch which seems to be going well. Strangly my grip felt like it was struggling on the last rep or 2 and had to re-grip. Every since I dropped high sets of Chin Ups my grip strength seems to have gone backwards abit. Good thing Im reverting back to high set Chins. Could also be that this program doesnt call for Barbell Rows which Im not sure I agree with as Im a big advocate of the 2:1 ratoi for pulling to pushing


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Starting Strength Advanced Novice:
> Front Squats: 85 x 5, 85 x 5
> Bench Press: 105 x 5, 105 x 5, 105 x 5
> Deadlift: 152.5 x 5
> 
> I tried a new way of front squatting tonight and it really didnt work. I normally do cross arm as the mobility in my shoulder is so bar that I cant do the normal snatch grip so I brough some wrist wraps and put these around the bar to hold. This in itself worked really well but where my front deltoid now tenses up, it creates a decline towards my throat which means alot of the bar weight is pushing into my wind pipe. Not the nicest feeling so changed back to cross arm.
> 
> Bench Press felt really good off my chest and I felt like I was controlling the bar really well but for the first time in forever I was having trouble bringing my hands up at the same time. I was getting to the top and having to lock out my right arm. Still quite easy 3x5 though.
> 
> Deadlifts, Im really concentrating on form and driving my chest up as hard as possible to keep my arch which seems to be going well. Strangly my grip felt like it was struggling on the last rep or 2 and had to re-grip. Every since I dropped high sets of Chin Ups my grip strength seems to have gone backwards abit. Good thing Im reverting back to high set Chins. Could also be that this program doesnt call for Barbell Rows which Im not sure I agree with as Im a big advocate of the 2:1 ratoi for pulling to pushing


Deadlift 152.5Kg X5 :devil: Nice one Mr B! :thumb:

Are you using a mixed or overhand grip?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Competing is the best thing someone can do. It makes your numbers legitimate and is a bloody good laugh! Powerlifters are a friendly bunch. As evidenced by me training with Andy and team. Just sent him a message on FB and he said no problems. 

It's one of my last squat sessions tonight, lets hope I fit into all my kit!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Competing is the best thing someone can do. It makes your numbers legitimate and is a bloody good laugh! Powerlifters are a friendly bunch. As evidenced by me training with Andy and team. Just sent him a message on FB and he said no problems.
> 
> It's one of my last squat sessions tonight, lets hope I fit into all my kit!


Im becoming more inclined to compete on a very low level just for the experience, im not fussed if i dont do to well in a LIVE situation :thumb:

I think weve got a competing powerlifter who lives/trains around St Austell too :thumb:

Give it beans Dan, all the best mate, looking forward to some vids to inspire us all here :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

New kit just arrived!! 

I love new kit. Its bright orange. I'll get a piccy up soon. 

Doug - look into the GBPF - UK IPF affilate. Will be perfect for you. Or come and lift in the BPC where I lift! You can lift however you want in the BPC. Raw, Single Ply, Multi Ply, you name it. Comps tend to be more London/SE based though!

I might be down in Cornwall in a few weeks, so can always come down and give you a hand/pointers if you want? In exchange for a hose off of the motor :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> New kit just arrived!!
> 
> I love new kit. Its bright orange. I'll get a piccy up soon.
> 
> Doug - look into the GBPF - UK IPF affilate. Will be perfect for you. Or come and lift in the BPC where I lift! You can lift however you want in the BPC. Raw, Single Ply, Multi Ply, you name it. Comps tend to be more London/SE based though!
> 
> I might be down in Cornwall in a few weeks, so can always come down and give you a hand/pointers if you want? In exchange for a hose off of the motor :lol:


Boys & their Toys 

I'll check out the GBPF - UK IPF & BPC, if i were to compete, I would go raw :devil:

:thumb::thumb:Cheers Dan :thumb::thumb:, Let me know when your around I'll see what we are up to, your always welcome to hose of the motor :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I cant remember the exact date, but we're meant to be going down for a lads weekend in Newquay at some point.

The GBPF is the UK IPF affiliate. Looking at it I didnt make it 100% clear. The other alternative is the BDFPA I think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I cant remember the exact date, but we're meant to be going down for a lads weekend in Newquay at some point.
> 
> The GBPF is the UK IPF affiliate. Looking at it I didnt make it 100% clear. The other alternative is the BDFPA I think.


I'm going to try & get my squat & deadlift up to 200Kg & my bench up to 120Kg for reps within this 11 week cycle, got a Cornish rep/contact via http://www.gbpf.org.uk/

Then ill feel a little more confident playing with the big boys


----------



## ITHAQVA

Cant wait for my next powerlifting session on Saturday :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Im seriously considering entering one as there are a few round here that are run by the local gyms just as kind of friendly novice comps but have some seriously strong lfters there.

Your the same as me Doug, you want to get to a certain strength level before competing but I think we kind of have it wrong. Imagaing the boost your training would have if you signed up for a comp in 3 months. You go nuts, never miss a session, hit it with 110% effort.

I used to have 4-6weeks to train myself and the other rugby players before the season started again so every session was full on as you new once Pre-Season started you would have to throttle back a little bit.



ITHAQVA said:


> Deadlift 152.5Kg X5 :devil: Nice one Mr B! :thumb:
> 
> Are you using a mixed or overhand grip?


Ya its only 47.4kg short of a decent Deadlift and 27.5kg short of where I was 2 years ago :lol:

Mixed grip mate, I have always had a girly grip so I normally do my first 2 warm up sets overhand and then change to mixed grip.

Watching Elitefts "So you think you can squat" videos last night. I recommend these video to anyone for looking at form. They use the box squat for the same reason I do for beginners, its easier to teach them to sit back as most people are quad dominant so they have trouble sitting back free squatting


----------



## ITHAQVA

This diet of protein every 3-ish hours & less carbs is amazing, i can feel the difference already: steady energy levels throughout the day, no food cravings at all (Carbohydrates/sugar) Awesome :thumb:

*Average diet & approximate Protein intake.*

*7:30Am* Protein Shake made with skimmed Milk = 50grams

*10AM* 4 X boiled Eggs = 28grams

*1pm* = 2 X chicken breasts, rice & vegetables = 45grams

*3-3:30pm* = protein shake made with water = 40grams

*Workout around 5pm*

*Evening meal (6-6:30pm ish)* 2 x chicken breasts, vegetables (Broccoli, asparagus, peas, boiled potatoes or jacket potato etc..)
For my Sweet i now have 250grams natural low fat yogurt = 60grams

*8:30Pm* low fat Cottage Cheese = 20grams protein & on training days I also have a casein shake = total 40 grams

Approx daily protein intake = 268grams.

I'll increase the intake as i get further into this cycle of lifting :thumb:

What do you think so far guys? Comments/opinions please.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Glad the diet is working well. A shade more fat wouldnt hurt. Just add some olive oil to your chicken and veg and 5-10g fish oils spaced through the day. Keeps the joints better lubricated and fat burns fat! 

My session was good last night. Didnt fit into my new kit, so whacked the old suit on. Did 295kg x1 to parallel. Could do with being a shade lower, but for now it'll do, next week i'll sink it in there, my lack of hip flexibilty stopped me getting any lower in a wide stance.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Glad the diet is working well. A shade more fat wouldnt hurt. Just add some olive oil to your chicken and veg and 5-10g fish oils spaced through the day. Keeps the joints better lubricated and fat burns fat!
> 
> My session was good last night. Didnt fit into my new kit, so whacked the old suit on. Did 295kg x1 to parallel. Could do with being a shade lower, but for now it'll do, next week i'll sink it in there, my lack of hip flexibilty stopped me getting any lower in a wide stance.


Cheers Dan,

I take 1 X Cod liver oil (1000mg). A friend of mine has bad arthritiis & said give 2X Glucosamine (400mg) & Chondroitin (100mg) per day a go, its non proven suppliment i know, do you think the Cod liver oil is sufficient as I dont have any joint problems?

Already got Olive oil in the Chicken dish & some more is used in the evening meal :thumb:

I got 1kg of fresh smoked muscles for dinner tomorrow & 250grams fresh Crab for tea mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm saturday is going to see some tasty :devil: protein :devil: being consumed by MEEEEE!!!  :devil: :thumb:

Dan,

What are your thoughts on adding 5kg to my squat/deadlift instead of the usual 2.5Kg every time 5 reps have been acheived?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Your best just adding the 2.5kg. Its better to keep walking forward slowly than to run into a brick wall. 

Always add in small increments :thumb:

Prevention is better than a cure! 

I'm going to try and wiggle into my new briefs again later.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Your best just adding the 2.5kg. Its better to keep walking forward slowly than to run into a brick wall.
> 
> Always add in small increments :thumb:
> 
> Prevention is better than a cure!
> 
> I'm going to try and wiggle into my new briefs again later.


 :thumb:

You could hang your gear on a power rack & jump into it as part of your warm up Dan


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb:
> 
> You could hang your gear on a power rack & jump into it as part of your warm up Dan


You jest, but thats exactly how you get into a tight suit. Wrap the suit straps round a bar and just drop yourself in there. :lol:

Powerlifting gear makes the biggest men look very homoerotic sometimes :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> You jest, but thats exactly how you get into a tight suit. Wrap the suit straps round a bar and just drop yourself in there. :lol:
> 
> :lol::lol::lol::lol:
> 
> Powerlifting gear makes the biggest men look very homoerotic sometimes :lol:


:lol::lol::lol: :doublesho


----------



## sidewalkdances

Last night it took 2 of us to pull Bens briefs on and his suit off. 

His words "I want one at the front and one at the back"  :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Last night it took 2 of us to pull Bens briefs on and his suit off.
> 
> His words "I want one at the front and one at the back"  :lol:


Double bagged :doublesho


----------



## impster

Just done my workout. 'B' tonight (Squats, overhead press and deadlift).

Squats: 72.8kgs (still waiting for 2x10kg discs to arrive which will let me add to this next time)

Overhead press: 45.8kgs. up by 2.2kgs from last time.

Deadlift: 72.8kgs (again, arrival of 2x10kg discs will enable me to add more next time).

Finished with the usual 50 chin ups and 50 press ups, in alternating sets of 10 each.

Had a really good workout tonight. Felt good. Arms feel 'pumped'.

Impster


----------



## Guest

Missed Wednesdays workout due work . Anyway, got back to it last night.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/4/[email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

Skipped the chins tonight as it was getting too late.

Squat was fine. It's definately heavy but the reps are going better than when I was lifting around 110kg - also I don't need to take so many breaths after each rep. Probably just getting used to lifting this sort of weight.
Press is going how I expect it to. I sure I'll get all 3x5 next time.
Dead was knackering. The weight moved ok, but I was exhausted by the end. However, it feels good to have broken the 300lb barrier for the first time on one of my lifts - can't wait for my squat to get there now.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Friday workout: done Sat morning.

box squat. 135kg x 3x5
Seated shoulder press 55kg 3x5
Pull UPS 10x1

Best squat workout since I started lifting again, I am so stoked right now just want to get back in the gym. Was watching those elitefts vids and changed from rippletoe looking down to the so you think you can squat way. I also haven't been arching my lower back hard enough so really concentrated on that tonight and things felt like they used to, all my power going in to the bar instead of all bodyparts feeling separate. At last itself like I can start making progress with my squats.

Press felt quite easy left a few in the tank but 3 sets kills my right shoulder. Got a massarge on it afterwards to release the tension as it was effecting my arm and god it hurt but seems to of.done the job.

Changed back to high volume chins and do them between presses


----------



## ITHAQVA

Good to see everyone getting great results :thumb::thumb::thumb:

Saturdays Powerlifting

*Deadlift:* 
Warm up sets: 20X5, 60X5, 90X3 and 90X2. *Work Set: 172.5Kg/379.5Lb 1X5*

*Pull-ups (Overhand grip)** 3, 2¾, 2, 2, 2.*

*Close Grip Bench Press:*
Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 70X2. *Work Sets: 92.5Kg/203.5Lb 3X5*

Over all very pleased with my first week back into lifting :thumb:

The Deadlift felt heavy, im going to increase the weight of some of the warm up sets to ensure im fully warmed up & ready for the work set.


----------



## Guest

Quick one tonight.

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

Also intended to do some dips and chins. However, my left shoulder was twinging throughout the first warmup set. It didn't feel right, so decided to finish the workout there - no point in injuring myself and then not being able to train for some time.

Bench was a hard fought battle. Pleased I got the full 3x5 but I think it's going to be an up hill struggle from now on.
Row in comparison was much better. Only the last rep of the last set was a little dodgy.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Big *thank you *to the admins for removing the :spam: post so quickly :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Quick one tonight.
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Row*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Also intended to do some dips and chins. However, my left shoulder was twinging throughout the first warmup set. It didn't feel right, so decided to finish the workout there - no point in injuring myself and then not being able to train for some time.
> 
> Bench was a hard fought battle. Pleased I got the full 3x5 but I think it's going to be an up hill struggle from now on.
> Row in comparison was much better. Only the last rep of the last set was a little dodgy.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Phil, why not try this next session.

Bench Press: WU = 5X20kg, 5X30Kg, 3X40Kg, 2X50Kg. Work sets 3x75Kg :thumb:

I think your pre exhausting yourself with your warm up sets


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Also intended to do some dips and chins. However, my left shoulder was twinging throughout the first warmup set. It didn't feel right, so decided to finish the workout there - no point in injuring myself and then not being able to train for some time.


Always better to come back to fight another day than be out for months with an injury. I leant this the hard way many times


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Always better to come back to fight another day than be out for months with an injury. I leant this the hard way many times


Have to agree with James, an injury can take you out for months


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Good to see everyone getting great results :thumb::thumb::thumb:
> 
> Saturdays Powerlifting
> 
> *Deadlift:*
> Warm up sets: 20X5, 60X5, 90X3 and 90X2. *Work Set: 172.5Kg/379.5Lb 1X5*
> 
> *Pull-ups (Overhand grip)** 3, 2¾, 2, 2, 2.*
> 
> *Close Grip Bench Press:*
> Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 70X2. *Work Sets: 92.5Kg/203.5Lb 3X5*
> 
> Over all very pleased with my first week back into lifting :thumb:
> 
> The Deadlift felt heavy, im going to increase the weight of some of the warm up sets to ensure im fully warmed up & ready for the work set.


No stopping you on those Deadlifts mate.

How you finding the close grip Bench Press. Just out of interest where do you have your hands as I Bench normally with a grip a thumb width off the smooth so pretty close anyway as finds this protects my shoulder more so for me to go closer I have to bench on the smooth


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Phil, why not try this next session.
> 
> Bench Press: WU = 5X20kg, 5X30Kg, 3X40Kg, 2X50Kg. Work sets 3x75Kg :thumb:
> 
> I think your pre exhausting yourself with your warm up sets


You might be right. May be why I find the rows easier too due to less of a warm up. Worth a try :thumb:



Bod42 said:


> Always better to come back to fight another day than be out for months with an injury. I leant this the hard way many times





ITHAQVA said:


> Have to agree with James, an injury can take you out for months


Thanks chaps and you are both so right :thumb: Pulled a tricep late Sept time last year, put me out of lifting for 2-3 months and I can still feel it sometimes now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> No stopping you on those Deadlifts mate.
> 
> How you finding the close grip Bench Press. Just out of interest where do you have your hands as I Bench normally with a grip a thumb width off the smooth so pretty close anyway as finds this protects my shoulder more so for me to go closer I have to bench on the smooth


Cheers James, its getting harder though :devil:  :thumb:

I used a neutral grip. Basically on the lowest part of the lift my hands just touch the sides of my rib cage :thumb:

See pic below, *for the close grip bench *the red arrows indicate the inner part of my hand, forefingers on knurled surface while the thumb only just touches the shiny part, hope that makes sense. I keep form very strict :thumb:

*When i bench press I follow the standard powerlifting grip from the Ripptoe & tate vids, works out around an inch futher out from the arrows :thumb:*










I would deffo start very light (30-40Kg) & build up, if youve not done Close grip Benches for a while, this lift can irritate the elbows as well as your shoulders.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Seems like you do it exactly the same as me. Just curious as in my younger days when I actually trained arms I would do CGBP but never with a Straight bar, I would do it with an EZ Bar as the angle takes the strain off the wrists but Im talking with hands maybe 6" apart.

Your gym looks like a sweet setup. Well to clean though lol, my gyms covered in chalk, spiders and all sorts and the bars all rusty from where its in the garage. Oh well none of that effects me smashing the weights.



BareFacedGeek said:


> Thanks chaps and you are both so right :thumb: Pulled a tricep late Sept time last year, put me out of lifting for 2-3 months and I can still feel it sometimes now.


I used to think every single workout had to be structured and set in stone as it was easy to gauge progression etc and didnt understand how some powerlifters/bodybuilders just trained depending on how they feel but nowdays I think there is alot og merit to training this way. I'm not saying its an exercuse to p*ssy out but if your feeling run down there is no point trying to hit a PR and running yourself down even more as the next workout you wont have a chance of hitting a PR. I think most of the top trainers in the world vary intensity throughout their workout schedules these days.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Seems like you do it exactly the same as me. Just curious as in my younger days when I actually trained arms I would do CGBP but never with a Straight bar, I would do it with an EZ Bar as the angle takes the strain off the wrists but Im talking with hands maybe 6" apart.
> 
> Your gym looks like a sweet setup. Well to clean though lol, my gyms covered in chalk, spiders and all sorts and the bars all rusty from where its in the garage. Oh well none of that effects me smashing the weights.


Cheers mate, missus vacuums up the chalk as its gets everywhere :tumbleweed: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I used to think every single workout had to be structured and set in stone as it was easy to gauge progression etc and didnt understand how some powerlifters/bodybuilders just trained depending on how they feel but nowdays I think there is alot og merit to training this way. I'm not saying its an exercuse to p*ssy out but if your feeling run down there is no point trying to hit a PR and running yourself down even more as the next workout you wont have a chance of hitting a PR. I think most of the top trainers in the world vary intensity throughout their workout schedules these days.


Totally agree :thumb:

If some days just dont feel right, do a light session, its better than none at all :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

My raw grip is middle finger on the rings for normal bench. Index finger on the rings (maximum legal grip) for shirted bench. Pinkies on rings for most board work, declines and floor press.

Finally pressed 230kg to lockout on Saturday. It was a bit shakey and took me two attempts, but I got it. The first was absolutely terrible, bar went up and down and I couldn't lock my right arm at all. Second attempt was much much better. Just a little stall at lockout, but I got it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> My raw grip is middle finger on the rings for normal bench. Index finger on the rings (maximum legal grip) for shirted bench. Pinkies on rings for most board work, declines and floor press.
> 
> Finally pressed 230kg to lockout on Saturday. It was a bit shakey and took me two attempts, but I got it. The first was absolutely terrible, bar went up and down and I couldn't lock my right arm at all. Second attempt was much much better. Just a little stall at lockout, but I got it.


I used to use the same grip in my youth, im not so keen on it now as it limits the movement, im finding the standard grip works really well, i will continue to use it, I sooo want that 150Kg bench  :thumb:

Are we talking 230Kg for your bench press :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

Mondays Workout: Only had 1 rest day as did fridays workout Sat.
Box Squat: 137.5 x 5, 5, 5.
Bench Press: 107.5 x 5, 5, 3.
Chin Ups: 10 x 3

Squats definitely feel better now Im arching my back hard but I need to build endurance/stength in my lowewr back so I can keep the arch easier as Im loosing it on the box which means its difficult to drive straight up. I got 137.5 for 5 over all 3 sets but my god the last rep of the 3 set was the best good morning I have ever done, my legs and hips shot up but my shoulders didnt move, took a few seconds to lock out but it was ugly.

Bench Press felt good, the 95kg warm up for 1 rep felt lighter than the bar, I got everything absolutely perfect and it flew up. I had the strength to hit 3x5 but everytime I lowered the bar I got quite abit of pain from my shoulder down through my bicep to my hand so i decided to leave a few reps in the tank.

I feel that high set chins are the best way to build chin up strength.

I used to bench with my pinky on the ring but after I buggered my shoulder I find benching with a closer grip doesnt hurt my shoulder as much. Yes I can bench more with a wider grip but at the chance of majorly screwing up my shoulder more so its not worth it


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Are we talking 230Kg for your bench press :doublesho


Certainly are mate. Want to push on for a 250kg bench, then up to 272.5 (600lbs) then 300!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Certainly are mate. Want to push on for a 250kg bench, then up to 272.5 (600lbs) then 300!


:doublesho:doublesho Makes my 150Kg Bench press goal look like sod all


----------



## sidewalkdances

Don't forget, thats in a shirt! And I full expect to take a good few years to manage that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Don't forget, thats in a shirt! And I full expect to take a good few years to manage that.


Im trying to push for 150Kg by the end of the year, do you think thats realistic?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday's powerlifting

Bit crap today.

*Bench Press:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 80X2 - *Work set: 112.5Kg/247.5Lb 1X3* 

*Squat:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 60X5 90X3 & 90X2 - *Work Sets: 172.5Kg/379.5Lb 2X5* :thumb:

*Barbell Row:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 80X2 - *Work sets: 100Kg/220Lb 3X3* :thumb:

*10 minutes of various stretches.*

Bench went a bit booolox, I think I went under the bar way to soon & when i warmed up I took very little rest between the sets, lesson learnt & only made 3 reps. Way to keen today & I paid the price 

Squats were good :thumb:

Barbell row, took 5 Kg of my max 5 rep weight & just bashed out 3 sets of 3 reps with approx. 30 seconds rest between sets, wasn't happy about my bench :devil::devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Tuesday's powerlifting
> 
> Bit crap today.
> 
> *Bench Press:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 80X2 - *Work set: 112.5Kg/247.5Lb 1X3*
> 
> *Squat:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 60X5 90X3 & 90X2 - *Work Sets: 172.5Kg/379.5Lb 2X5* :thumb:
> 
> *Barbell Row:* Warm up sets: 20X5, 40X5, 60X3 & 80X2 - *Work sets: 100Kg/220Lb 3X3* :thumb:
> 
> *10 minutes of various stretches.*
> 
> Bench went a bit booolox, I think I went under the bar way to soon & when i warmed up I took very little rest between the sets, lesson learnt & only made 3 reps. Way to keen today & I paid the price
> 
> Squats were good :thumb:
> 
> Barbell row, took 5 Kg of my max 5 rep weight & just bashed out 3 sets of 3 reps with approx. 30 seconds rest between sets, wasn't happy about my bench :devil::devil:


Everyone has good and bad days buddy. Im sure you will get 4 or 5 reps next bench session so no harm done. Im starting to take less rest as Im getting bored between sets waiting so long but if you want pure strength you got to keep those rest periods up. Rippletoe suggests 5-7mins for squats.

Awesome Squats, I will be trying to squat 140kg on friday and I know that is going to be rediculously heavy so nice 172.5kg. Do you realise using Wendler formular that 172.5 x 5 is 200kg x 1. Thats an impressive (predicted) 1RM buddy.



sidewalkdances said:


> Don't forget, thats in a shirt! And I full expect to take a good few years to manage that.


Shirt or not thats impressive. I could have someone help me lift the weight and not do a 300kg Bench Press lol


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Everyone has good and bad days buddy. Im sure you will get 4 or 5 reps next bench session so no harm done. Im starting to take less rest as Im getting bored between sets waiting so long but if you want pure strength you got to keep those rest periods up. Rippletoe suggests 5-7mins for squats.
> 
> Awesome Squats, I will be trying to squat 140kg on friday and I know that is going to be rediculously heavy so nice 172.5kg. Do you realise using Wendler formular that 172.5 x 5 is 200kg x 1. Thats an impressive (predicted) 1RM buddy.


Cheers James,. i'll aim for 4 reps next session but also try for the full 5 :thumb:

I've been only resting around 3 mins between sets, oddly enough with my squtas that seems enough.

I must admit im pleased with my squat & deadlift, tonights squat was good the first set wasnt pretty, bar too high & feet too close lol, second set was great, 5 good powerfull reps to the lockout & back to the horizontal :thumb:

200kg 1 rep, i promise i wont have a go, yet 

I understand why my bench was a bit crap tonight. I'm Still a bit strained from saturdays deadlift. I cant understand why but when i tried to bring my chest up, this time i did shoulder shrugs at the lockout :doublesho a WTF moment indeed! 
It's all a learning curve :thumb: One thing I am learning with powerlifting in particular is to check your form & check again. Dont do what i did, shoulder shrug 172.5Kg :doublesho:doublesho 

Best of luck with the 140Kg Squat James, i know YOU CAN DO IT :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers James,. i'll aim for 4 reps next session but also try for the full 5 :thumb:
> 
> I've been only resting around 3 mins between sets, oddly enough with my squtas that seems enough.
> 
> I must admit im pleased with my squat & deadlift, tonights squat was good the first set wasnt pretty, bar too high & feet too close lol, second set was great, 5 good powerfull reps to the lockout & back to the horizontal :thumb:
> 
> 200kg 1 rep, i promise i wont have a go, yet
> 
> I understand why my bench was a bit crap tonight. I'm Still a bit strained from saturdays deadlift. I cant understand why but when i tried to bring my chest up, this time i did shoulder shrugs at the lockout :doublesho a WTF moment indeed!
> It's all a learning curve :thumb: One thing I am learning with powerlifting in particular is to check your form & check again. Dont do what i did, shoulder shrug 172.5Kg :doublesho:doublesho
> 
> Best of luck with the 140Kg Squat James, i know YOU CAN DO IT :thumb::thumb:


Chad Wesley Smith (Juggernaut Program) suggest 3 mins rest between Big Lower body exercises and 2:30min between Big Upper Body exercises so I think your on the right track. Also I think keeping Squats/Deadlifts around 3mins is a happy medium as it helps your fitness by keeping the rest down but is enough rest that you can still smash your strength.

I bet its tempting though lol. I had ago at 220kg before for a half squat just to get used to what Im aiming for. That was an eye opener lol.

I will get the 140kg if I can keep my back straight but it was struggling with 137.5 so we will see. Like they say your only as strong as your weakest link. My legs never hurt after squatting as they have the strength to squat alot more, just need to work on my back strength but we will see Friday as really want it so were see what happens :devil:


----------



## Guest

Tonight's workout.

After Doug's comment, I've decided to change how I do my warm-up sets. Going for 40%, 60% and 80% of the work weight (a la Starting Strength) . I'll also use an empty bar for a few sets on the squats to help limber up.

I had planned 40%x5, 60%x3 and 80%x2 for the warm-up sets. However, after doing this on the squat the first workout set was rather tough - the rest were much better. This made me rethink my strategy and do 5 reps on each warm-up set.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 3/3/[email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Chins*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

First WO set of squat was tough as explained above. The rest were much better - felt heavy but no worse than lifting 120kg.
My change of WU plan meant a new spreadsheet. This also meant I ****ed up my OHP WO weight. Should have been 50kg. Well, it went better than expected! Think I'll keep this weight and just dominate it over the next few sessions.
Dead was heavy. Not sure how long I can keep up 5kg increments on this now. I'll worry about it when I fail though.
Chins are still progressing ok.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Tonight's workout.
> 
> After Doug's comment, I've decided to change how I do my warm-up sets. Going for 40%, 60% and 80% of the work weight (a la Starting Strength) . I'll also use an empty bar for a few sets on the squats to help limber up.
> 
> I had planned 40%x5, 60%x3 and 80%x2 for the warm-up sets. However, after doing this on the squat the first workout set was rather tough - the rest were much better. This made me rethink my strategy and do 5 reps on each warm-up set.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 3/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Chins*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> First WO set of squat was tough as explained above. The rest were much better - felt heavy but no worse than lifting 120kg.
> My change of WU plan meant a new spreadsheet. This also meant I ****ed up my OHP WO weight. Should have been 50kg. Well, it went better than expected! Think I'll keep this weight and just dominate it over the next few sessions.
> Dead was heavy. Not sure how long I can keep up 5kg increments on this now. I'll worry about it when I fail though.
> Chins are still progressing ok.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Hi Phil, if your struggling to add weight, why not reduce your sets to one work set on Deadlift & start adding 2.5Kg every time you get your 5 reps, ive been doing this from day one & it works very well :thumb:

I know how you feel though ive been itching to go for adding 5kg, the guys (Dan & James:thumb here all say the same as do the powerlifting bibles, slow but sure is the way to go for lifting heavy :thumb:

What routine are you following as i think doing Squats & deadlift on the same session is going to put you aboard THE OVERTRAIN woowooo  especially as your weights get heavier :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Im trying to push for 150Kg by the end of the year, do you think thats realistic?


I think it's a reasonable goal. Although progress will start to slow now you're getting to a decent strength level!


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Phil, if your struggling to add weight, why not reduce your sets to one work set on Deadlift & start adding 2.5Kg every time you get your 5 reps, ive been doing this from day one & it works very well :thumb:
> 
> I know how you feel though ive been itching to go for adding 5kg, the guys (Dan & James:thumb here all say the same as do the powerlifting bibles, slow but sure is the way to go for lifting heavy :thumb:
> 
> What routine are you following as i think doing Squats & deadlift on the same session is going to put you aboard THE OVERTRAIN woowooo  especially as your weights get heavier :thumb:


Doug, the routine is standard StrongLifts with the addition of Chins and Dips. The SL programme uses 5kg increments on the dead (2.5kg on all others).
Must admit I've been thinking about dropping the squats on DL days for a little while.
Deads and squats on the same day are probably fine to begin with, but as you say, when the weights go up it become too much.
The 5/3/1 ladder on deads is to try and get some more volume in. This strangely feels fine, I'm just doubting the sanity of 5kg increment - especially when I'm also pushing the limits of my squat on the same day too.

Just bought a proper belt (ZuluGlove Evo2) so I'm interested to see how that will help - I've not used a belt before.

I might wait for a fail, then move to 2.5kg increments on the dead.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sidewalkdances

A small step forward, is still a step forward :thumbup:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> A small step forward, is still a step forward :thumbup:


 :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:

I've been so tempted several times to add 5Kg every time I get 5 reps, but have kept disciplined & stuck with 2.5Kg (You see I do listen) 

The more I do this powerlifting thing, the more I accept it will take years rather than months to get to a level that I'm happy with. This is something that becomes much more apparent as you get to the heavier weights & closer to your true max training weight, I think the first few months can give you a very distorted view of what is good/normal progress & us newbies become disappointed with the slowing progress, after reading a load of powerlifting literature it turns out this is the normal chain of events for all but the most gifted lifters.

I will keep adding when I can, if I get a crappy workout I'll learn from it, I learnt a lot from my shoddy shoulder shrug-deadlift session last Saturday


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout.

Back Squats: 100kg x 5, 5
Seated Shoulder Press: 57.5kg x 5, 4, 4
Deadlifts: 155kg x 3

I was so ill Tuesday that I had to take my first day off Tuesday in yrs and still felt like crap Wednesday but I really wanted to work out.

I did back squat instead of front squat as I really wanted to work on my technique and practise my arch. Amazing how 37.5kg less feels like nothing, the sets went really well and felt light but even at this weight I can feel my arch straighting out so really need to work on my Lower back strength.

Really please with my shoulder press progress, next time I will hopefully smash 57.5kg which means I move up to a PR (since starting training again) of 60kg seated shoulder press. Just going to take the increases nice and slow now and will probably micro load this exercise so 1kg per workout would be 3kg every 2 weeks. Even at this low level of progression I think my Shoulder will have problems keeping up with the strength but we will see.

Deadlifts: These really werent good. I was trying to really arch my lower back as hard as possible but it was rounding as soon as I pulled the bar and had no arch by the time the weight was leaving the floor. Really not good but then I have been ill so I cant complain to much.


----------



## impster

Evenin' all.

Two workout updates for you tonight -from Monday and tonight's workout:

Monday (Squats, Bench, Rows)
Squat: 72.8kg (still not received my extra weights yet grrrr)
Bench: 56.8kg (up from 54.6kg). Managed one set of 5, and many sets of 3 and 2 to get up to my 25 reps.
Rows: 56.8kg (up from 54.6kg). No problems with rows.
Finished with the usual alternating sets of 10 chin ups and 10 press ups to get to 50 each.

Tonight:
Squat: 72.8kg (I'm going to go nuts if my 2x10kgs don't arrive tomorrow)
O'head press: 48.2kg (up from 45.8kg last time). 4 sets of 5 and one set of 3.
D/lift: 72.8kg (Postman Pat, Postman Pat, deliver my weights don't be such a prat)
Finished off with a sit down and a cup of tea as a warm down. 

I really think that I need to de-load a little on the benchpress so that i can get a full 5x5. I'd much rather 5 sets of 5 as opposed to 8 sets of 3 - that's unless of course 8 sets of 3 is ok?

Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Evenin' all.
> 
> Two workout updates for you tonight -from Monday and tonight's workout:
> 
> Monday (Squats, Bench, Rows)
> Squat: 72.8kg (still not received my extra weights yet grrrr)
> Bench: 56.8kg (up from 54.6kg). Managed one set of 5, and many sets of 3 and 2 to get up to my 25 reps.
> Rows: 56.8kg (up from 54.6kg). No problems with rows.
> Finished with the usual alternating sets of 10 chin ups and 10 press ups to get to 50 each.
> 
> Tonight:
> Squat: 72.8kg (I'm going to go nuts if my 2x10kgs don't arrive tomorrow)
> O'head press: 48.2kg (up from 45.8kg last time). 4 sets of 5 and one set of 3.
> D/lift: 72.8kg (Postman Pat, Postman Pat, deliver my weights don't be such a prat)
> Finished off with a sit down and a cup of tea as a warm down.
> 
> I really think that I need to de-load a little on the benchpress so that i can get a full 5x5. I'd much rather 5 sets of 5 as opposed to 8 sets of 3 - that's unless of course 8 sets of 3 is ok?
> 
> Impster


In regards to your Bench Impster: if your doing a 5X5 are you saying that because you didnt get 5X5 that you increased the sets just to make 25 reps? If so i dont think that the way to go mate. Do your 5 sets aim for 5 reps & rest 3-7 minutes between each set if you really need to.

Dont worry If you still cannot get a 5X5, stick with it for a week or so, then If your still unable to reach 5X5 go back by 2.5kg (Im asuming you reached 5X5 on the lower weight) Dominate it for two weeks (© SIDEWALK*DAN*CES 2011 ), keep getting your 5X5 with it, then put the 2.5Kg back on & go for your 5X5 again :thumb:

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

Still feeling a bit strained on the right side, im going to take the rest of the week off & maybe next week 

Dont worry as soon as im able, I'll restart my 11 week cycle, im itching to lift already, its amazing how you miss it :devil: I need to lift muhahahahahaha!!! :devil: Ahem sorry


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> In regards to your Bench Impster: if your doing a 5X5 are you saying that because you didnt get 5X5 that you increased the sets just to make 25 reps? If so i dont think that the way to go mate. Do your 5 sets aim for 5 reps & rest 3-7 minutes between each set if you really need to.


Just to add to this, the way I understand it at the moment is that, if you go to failure on multiple sets to try and get the 25 reps you could risk fatiguing the muscles too much. Which could mean that you are not recovered fully for your next session.

I have an old weight training book, Getting Stronger by Bill Perl, which has a section on how muscles adapt to stress. It has a chart showing the diminishing returns gained from doing multiple sets. 
Three sets appears to be the sweet spot in terms of effort vs adaptation. After 5 sets the curve has pretty much flattened out indicating that you'll not gain much from any further sets - other than fatigue IIRC.

Reps are another thing, but essentially around 5 reps and below are geared more towards building strength. As you head over 5 reps you are moving towards developing size and muscular endurance.

Basically, this adds to the 5x5 (or 3x5) principle. You do up to 5 reps per set to build strength (and some size) and don't gain much by exceeding 5 sets.

If you only get 5x3 (3 reps on each of the 5 sets), that is fine. You have stressed the muscle enough for adaptation to occur. You'll probably find you can do more reps on each set next time around. If not, it will be because you have not recovered in time.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Getting close to my last heavy week of training. This deload/no kit week is driving me bonkers!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Getting close to my last heavy week of training. This deload/no kit week is driving me bonkers!


:lol::lol: Your Obsessed!!!!!


----------



## sidewalkdances

Obsessed is just the word the weak used to describe the dedicated Doug  

Oh, i'll definitely be down in Cornwall-land May Bank Holiday weekend


----------



## Guest

sidewalkdances said:


> Obsessed is just the word the weak used to describe the dedicated Doug


hehe - I like that :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Obsessed is just the word the weak used to describe the dedicated Doug
> 
> Oh, i'll definitely be down in Cornwall-land May Bank Holiday weekend


:thumb:

Let me know if you are popping around mate, i'll get the Karcher ready :detailer: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb:
> 
> Let me know if you are popping around mate, i'll get the Karcher ready :detailer: :thumb:


Top man! I'll pack some Magifoam, Citrus Power and GWash!

Full correction this weekend :detailer: :buffer: :car:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Top man! I'll pack some Magifoam, Citrus Power and GWash!
> 
> Full *Errection* this weekend :detailer: :buffer: :car:


 :doublesho

 :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Correction = Errection Doug, I think you may have got the wrong end of the stick with this detailing malarky :doublesho :lol:

Must say I only got one of those last time I visited Cornwall :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Box Squats: 140kg 5,5,5
Bench Press: 110kg 5,3,3
Pull Ups: 1 x 2, 9 x 1
Hyper Extensions 3 x 12

This was my best squat workout since starting weightlifting again by miles. This was the heaviest weight I lifted since starting back again but it was probably a 8 or 9 out of 10 in effort. Each workout seems to be getting better and I actually feel exhausted after squats now as Im using my entire Body.

I didnt get all my reps last workout but my shoulder felt awesome so I increased the weight and got 5 reps reasonably easy. i deiceded to just hit 3 reps on the next 2 sets and work up over the next 2 workouts. Next time I increase the weight I will go down to 3 x 3 then 3x4, then 3x5 over 3 workouts. This means i will increase my bench Press weight by 2.5kg every 2 weeks which sounds good to me.

These were over hand pull ups which im now where near as good at. I pull my legs up and hold them static during my Pull/Chin Ups to work the static strength of my abs as well.

I always suggest adding Hyper extensions as most average people have a weak lower back but i had no way of doing them by looking around my gym i figured out a way of doing them. I put my Punch Bag on my Bench and then hook my feet under the safety bar, this keeps me extra ROM to do Hyper extensions properly.

This entire workout just felt awesome. Really hoping I can keep pushing my squat up now as I havent increased my squat in months but i now increased it by 5kg this week just from improving my technique


----------



## sidewalkdances

I had a pretty good session myself. Did a lot of form work for my deadlift in the suit. I was throwing 140 around like a toy. Took all the skin off my middle finger on my 'under' hand by catching it on the suit.

Finished off with some lat pulldowns, curls and some reverse hypers.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Box Squats: 140kg 5,5,5
> Bench Press: 110kg 5,3,3
> Pull Ups: 1 x 2, 9 x 1
> Hyper Extensions 3 x 12
> 
> This was my best squat workout since starting weightlifting again by miles. This was the heaviest weight I lifted since starting back again but it was probably a 8 or 9 out of 10 in effort. Each workout seems to be getting better and I actually feel exhausted after squats now as Im using my entire Body.
> 
> I didnt get all my reps last workout but my shoulder felt awesome so I increased the weight and got 5 reps reasonably easy. i deiceded to just hit 3 reps on the next 2 sets and work up over the next 2 workouts. Next time I increase the weight I will go down to 3 x 3 then 3x4, then 3x5 over 3 workouts. This means i will increase my bench Press weight by 2.5kg every 2 weeks which sounds good to me.
> 
> These were over hand pull ups which im now where near as good at. I pull my legs up and hold them static during my Pull/Chin Ups to work the static strength of my abs as well.
> 
> I always suggest adding Hyper extensions as most average people have a weak lower back but i had no way of doing them by looking around my gym i figured out a way of doing them. I put my Punch Bag on my Bench and then hook my feet under the safety bar, this keeps me extra ROM to do Hyper extensions properly.
> 
> This entire workout just felt awesome. Really hoping I can keep pushing my squat up now as I havent increased my squat in months but i now increased it by 5kg this week just from improving my technique


Nice squat weight James :thumb::thumb::thumb:

I do my pull ups with the over hand grip as well :devil: :thumb:

My right side is feeling much better after the shoulder shrug deadlift hybrid lift i did last saturday , going to start the 11 week cycle again This monday! yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice squat weight James :thumb::thumb::thumb:
> 
> I do my pull ups with the over hand grip as well :devil: :thumb:
> 
> My right side is feeling much better after the shoulder shrug deadlift hybrid lift i did last saturday , going to start the 11 week cycle again This monday! yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


Its not a great squat weight YET but at least its starting to move now after stalling for quite some time.

Mondays I do underhand Fridays I do overhand and sometimes I do neutral grip. Best to train all grips.

Glad to hear your feeling better buddy and ready to start smashing those weights again


----------



## impster

Late update!

Friday's workout:
had a few pints after work on friday, so friday night's workout became saturday mid morning workout:

Squat: 72.8 (no change and the bloody weights I've ordered via ebay haven't turned up).
Bench: deloaded from 56.8 to 54.6kg and got my 5x5. Will stick to that weight again next time round and then carry on with 2.5kg increments.
Rows: 59.2kgs. No problems here at all.

Warm down: washed the car.
Warm down +24hours: washed the car again, SRP then EGP by hand, no breaks.

Impster


----------



## Bod42

nice workout and loving the warm down Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mondays Workout

*Bench Press:* 
Warm up sets - 20kgX5, 20kgX5, 40KgX5, 60KgX3 & 80KgX1.
*Work Set: 112.5Kg/247.5Lb X4.* :thumb:

*Squat: *
Warm up sets - 20kgX5, 60kgX5, 90kgX3 & 110KgX2
*Work sets: 175Kg/385LbX5 *got bored with that weight so did *180Kg/396Lb X5* on the second work set :thumb: 

*Barbell Row:*
Warm up sets - 20KgX5, 40KgX5, 60KgX3 & 70KgX2.
*Work sets: 70kg/154Lb 3X6*

Took it easy on the upper body lifts this workout & kept form strict. Used a nice light weight & higher reps with no intensity for the barbell row to ensure my right side doesn't play up.
Bench felt very good, could of done 5 reps but was worried if I pushed too hard on this lift I would do more harm to my right side.
Squat felt heavy ish but as soon as I completed the first rep I was confident of doing 5 so I upped the weight for the second set to 180Kg, again weight didn't feel heavy but my balance was a little poor.
I put some blue tape on the floor to help me keep my feet in the right place when squatting. Worked a treat & i focused on the lift more :thumb::thumb:

Here is a piccy to break the monotony, ooh look blue tape :thumb: 










:thumb:

Hopefully I can deadlift the 175Kg on Wednesday without any pain/injury. I'll stick to the main lifts until I'm fully recovered then start my ITHAQVA 11 cycle in a month or so


----------



## sidewalkdances

I had a wicked session Sat. Loads of Powerlifters in the gym, everyone preparing for battle in a fortnight!

I got a 125x8 floor press. This exceeds my best on two fronts - 115x8 and 120x5! Also PR'd incline barbell with 100x8x3. 

Some big lifts from the guys squatting too. Atmosphere was buzzing!


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 142.5kg x 5,5,1
Shoulder Press: 57.5kg x 5,5,3
Chin Ups: 10x3

I was ill last night and felt like I was going to be sick my entire workout. On the last set I really concentrated on pushing my legs out and missed the 1st rep completely, I tried the rep again and muscled it up from the bottom but that was all my energy gone.

Disappointed I didnt get all my reps on Shoulder Press as looking forward to putting a big plate each side. I done more than this with normal shoulder press but Im quite surprised how much doing them seated takes off your strength.

Only highlight of this workout was that the Chin Ups felt great and were reletively easy.


----------



## impster

My monday workout:

Squats: still stuck at 72.8kg. Delivery of more weights promised for tomorrow.
Overhead Press: Stuck at last week's weight of 48.2kg - to get a proper 5x5. It worked.
Deadlift: 72.8kg. See above. Grrr.

Finished with some press ups and chin ups as usual.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> My monday workout:
> 
> Squats: still stuck at 72.8kg. Delivery of more weights promised for tomorrow.
> Overhead Press: Stuck at last week's weight of 48.2kg - to get a proper 5x5. It worked.
> Deadlift: 72.8kg. See above. Grrr.
> 
> Finished with some press ups and chin ups as usual.


Dont worry too much Impster, keep focused & within 6 months youll be pushing a lot more, use this time to get your form spot on :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Box Squats: 142.5kg x 5,5,1
> Shoulder Press: 57.5kg x 5,5,3
> Chin Ups: 10x3
> 
> I was ill last night and felt like I was going to be sick my entire workout. On the last set I really concentrated on pushing my legs out and missed the 1st rep completely, I tried the rep again and muscled it up from the bottom but that was all my energy gone.
> 
> Disappointed I didnt get all my reps on Shoulder Press as looking forward to putting a big plate each side. I done more than this with normal shoulder press but Im quite surprised how much doing them seated takes off your strength.
> 
> Only highlight of this workout was that the Chin Ups felt great and were reletively easy.


Considering you were ill James, thats one hell of a workout :thumb: :devil: :thumb:

Shoulder press seated is really hard, no momentum from the spring back in the legs, its all i used to do when i was your age mate, dont think i went over 84kg for reps though, ive always found it a very difficult lift in regards to progress.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Considering you were ill James, thats one hell of a workout :thumb: :devil: :thumb:
> 
> Shoulder press seated is really hard, no momentum from the spring back in the legs, its all i used to do when i was your age mate, dont think i went over 84kg for reps though, ive always found it a very difficult lift in regards to progress.


Even the smallest amount of progress on Shoulder Press is a great feeling for me as my shoulder is so screwed up. Only do seated as the weights hit the garage ceiling otherwise I would do standing as they are great for cre strength as well.

Mate you just squated 180kg for 5 reps, thats one hell of a workout :doublesho. There seems to be no stopping you Doug.

Even on my 1st 2 sets of squats my form wasnt as good as Friday, I was still kind of doing a good morning with the weight. Hopefuly friday will be better and I will smash the weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Even the smallest amount of progress on Shoulder Press is a great feeling for me as my shoulder is so screwed up. Only do seated as the weights hit the garage ceiling otherwise I would do standing as they are great for cre strength as well.
> 
> Mate you just squated 180kg for 5 reps, thats one hell of a workout :doublesho. There seems to be no stopping you Doug.
> 
> Even on my 1st 2 sets of squats my form wasnt as good as Friday, I was still kind of doing a good morning with the weight. Hopefuly friday will be better and I will smash the weight.


I'm not so good in the shoulder area either mate, but I've never really hit my body in the way i do now, you are to blame if i break something James 

Thanks mate :thumb: The odd thing is the 180Kg didn't feel really heavy; the only thing is i did have a very ugly 4th rep, but i think that's down to me pushing up too fast & not concentrating on my balance.

The biggest thing in my favour is that i squat with the bar very low on my back, i have noticed when i get it placed wrong (Bar too high) that the whole lift is much more difficult & the lift becomes ugly & out of balance. My feet are approx. shoulder width apart.

All rise!! Mr Rippetoe Enters the building!











:thumb:

*EDIT: Holy SHEEEEEEET! This thread has gone over 20,000 hits! :doublesho*


----------



## sidewalkdances

I squat pretty low bar. Dig it into the shelf below my traps and across my rear delts. Doesn't help me stay anymore upright though!

My session last night was rubbish, did some light rep bench up to 125x5 (felt very easy), some DB laterals and rear delts, some DB pressing which bothered my shoulder after the second set, so just did 2 sets some triceps and some biceps and that was it. Big deadlift day today!


----------



## impster

Guys - been offered a york vertical multigym (not bench type) with leg and pec fittings for £40.

Similar to this : http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007K7JOA8/ref=asc_df_B007K7JOA87270088?smid=A3I7N0CZ5MDZ9S&tag=shoppingmp136-21&linkCode=asn&creative=22218&creativeASIN=B007K7JOA8

Would this be any good? They're around £300 new i believe. But - I don't want to be spending £40 unless it could be useful to me?

Am i better off sticking with the barbell?

Thanks

Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Guys - been offered a york vertical multigym (not bench type) with leg and pec fittings for £40.
> 
> Similar to this : http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007K7JOA8/ref=asc_df_B007K7JOA87270088?smid=A3I7N0CZ5MDZ9S&tag=shoppingmp136-21&linkCode=asn&creative=22218&creativeASIN=B007K7JOA8
> 
> Would this be any good? They're around £300 new i believe. But - I don't want to be spending £40 unless it could be useful to me?
> 
> Am i better off sticking with the barbell?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Impster


It all depends on what you want out of your training impy.

If you want to go for powerlifting & become big & strong, its barbell/compound lifts all the way, add a power rack & your in paradise  :thumb:

Also imagine telling people you bench pressed 150Kg on a machine, lol, it just as well not happen 

*Think about what you really want from this sport. Here is my long term strategy.*

*1.* Firstly, I want to be strong, so powerlifting is my weapon of choice.

*2.* I want to lose some body fat & get fitter, so once i reach a strength level im happy with ill add more high rep assistance lifts (Wendlers 5/3/1).

*3.* Who knows i might even add some conditiong & run up hills :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I squat pretty low bar. Dig it into the shelf below my traps and across my rear delts.


I place the bar in the very same spot :thumb:



sidewalkdances said:


> Doesn't help me stay anymore upright though!


:lol: Aint supprised with the amount of tonnage you haul up & down ya crazee animal!


----------



## Guest

impster said:


> Guys - been offered a york vertical multigym (not bench type) with leg and pec fittings for £40.
> 
> Similar to this : http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007K7JOA8/ref=asc_df_B007K7JOA87270088?smid=A3I7N0CZ5MDZ9S&tag=shoppingmp136-21&linkCode=asn&creative=22218&creativeASIN=B007K7JOA8
> 
> Would this be any good? They're around £300 new i believe. But - I don't want to be spending £40 unless it could be useful to me?
> 
> Am i better off sticking with the barbell?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Impster


I wouldn't bother, personally. Barbell all the way :thumb:

Free weights are better for functional strength i.e. you are the only thing supporting the weight. You have to prevent the weight moving forwards/backwards, left/right, as well as controlling any twisting motion all while pressing/pulling it up/down. With machines, you only need to do the later.
In the real world, handling heavy objects requires the same control as when training with free weights.


----------



## impster

Thanks for the advice guys. I'll stick to the barbell.

Impster.


----------



## sidewalkdances

This is the form im working towards - very upright on the descent and no wasted motion.


----------



## ITHAQVA

:devil::devil: Holy  Shiit!!! ^^^^^^ :thumb: :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wish me luck guys, Deadlifting 175Kg tomorrow :devil:

I'll do a couple extra warm up sets & promise not to do a shoulder shrug at the lockout


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm not so good in the shoulder area either mate, but I've never really hit my body in the way i do now, you are to blame if i break something James
> 
> Thanks mate :thumb: The odd thing is the 180Kg didn't feel really heavy; the only thing is i did have a very ugly 4th rep, but i think that's down to me pushing up too fast & not concentrating on my balance.
> 
> The biggest thing in my favour is that i squat with the bar very low on my back, i have noticed when i get it placed wrong (Bar too high) that the whole lift is much more difficult & the lift becomes ugly & out of balance. My feet are approx. shoulder width apart.
> 
> *EDIT: Holy SHEEEEEEET! This thread has gone over 20,000 hits! :doublesho*


Blame me if you break something, the the kind of thanks I get for starting this thread :lol::thumb: The only thing your breaking is PRs mate.

180kg not feeling heavy :doublesho I cant imaging 180kg ever not feeling heavy but then again I am warming up with weights that used to be my work sets. Heres to all of us warming up with 180kg in thenear future.

I squat with a low bar, right below the bony bits on the back of your shoulders as per Rippletoe but I seen some power lifters with it miles lower than me



impster said:


> Guys - been offered a york vertical multigym (not bench type) with leg and pec fittings for £40.
> 
> Similar to this : http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007K7JOA8/ref=asc_df_B007K7JOA87270088?smid=A3I7N0CZ5MDZ9S&tag=shoppingmp136-21&linkCode=asn&creative=22218&creativeASIN=B007K7JOA8
> 
> Would this be any good? They're around £300 new i believe. But - I don't want to be spending £40 unless it could be useful to me?
> 
> Am i better off sticking with the barbell?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Impster


Some people disagree, but I actually go as far to say machines are dangerous on their own. When your using compound exercises, yes machines are good for isolating the muscle, building muscle, working on weak points etc but I think without the compound movements they are dangerous. Heres why, say your doing machine chest press and machine flyes or something similar, these machines are designed to hit the pecs and only the pecs but what about all the little supporting muscles that the machine doesnt hit. These stay weak which means you now have a massive strength imbalance between your pecs and supporting muscles. Same with any other big exercise.

Watch any beginner who used machines for yrs try and do a dumbell bench press their arms go all over the place. I had people do the entire 100kg stack on a machine but have trouble controlling 20kg dumbells as their supporting muscles arent up to the task.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Blame me if you break something, the the kind of thanks I get for starting this thread :lol::thumb: The only thing your breaking is PRs mate. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
> 
> 180kg not feeling heavy :doublesho I cant imaging 180kg ever not feeling heavy but then again I am warming up with weights that used to be my work sets. Heres to all of us warming up with 180kg in the near future.
> 
> I squat with a low bar, right below the bony bits on the back of your shoulders as per Rippletoe but I seen some power lifters with it miles lower than me
> 
> Some people disagree, but I actually go as far to say machines are dangerous on their own. When your using compound exercises, yes machines are good for isolating the muscle, building muscle, working on weak points etc but I think without the compound movements they are dangerous. Heres why, say your doing machine chest press and machine flyes or something similar, these machines are designed to hit the pecs and only the pecs but what about all the little supporting muscles that the machine doesnt hit. These stay weak which means you now have a massive strength imbalance between your pecs and supporting muscles. Same with any other big exercise.
> 
> Watch any beginner who used machines for yrs try and do a dumbell bench press their arms go all over the place. I had people do the entire 100kg stack on a machine but have trouble controlling 20kg dumbells as their supporting muscles arent up to the task.


 :thumb::thumb:

+1, machines don't allow your stabilizer muscles to develop, the body works better as a whole, compound barbell exercises rock! :thumb:

On the subject of the 180kg. I'm wondering if the heavier warm up sets helped?

Unlike my usual warm up weight of 90Kg i used 110kg. On the first work set of 175Kg i felt so much stronger & steady that I decided to add another 5Kg for the second work set & the 180Kg went up for 5 reps. I'll see how it goes next time, might go 182.5Kg first work set & 185Kg on the second.
I'm going to try the same heavier warm up principle with the deadlift to see if it makes me more prepared for the work set & reduce the possibility of injury like last time with my deadlift shoulder shrug hybrid bolloxx lift


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb::thumb:
> 
> +1, machines don't allow your stabilizer muscles to develop, the body works better as a whole, compound barbell exercises rock! :thumb:
> 
> On the subject of the 180kg. I'm wondering if the heavier warm up sets helped?
> 
> Unlike my usual warm up weight of 90Kg i used 110kg. On the first work set of 175Kg i felt so much stronger & steady that I decided to add another 5Kg for the second work set & the 180Kg went up for 5 reps. I'll see how it goes next time, might go 182.5Kg first work set & 185Kg on the second.
> I'm going to try the same heavier warm up principle with the deadlift to see if it makes me more prepared for the work set & reduce the possibility of injury like last time with my deadlift shoulder shrug hybrid bolloxx lift


I like to use percentages to calculate my warm ups. If your doing 140kg, warming up with 110kg is about right but your now doing 180kg so 120kg isnt heavy enough. It also works the other way, if your work weight is 200kg warming up with 180kg is to heavy so percentage works it out well. It doesnt have to be exact, I set my excel sheet to round to the nearest 10kg on my warm ups.

The guy I used to train with liked warming up how some power lifters do after i showed him. Say your doing a 5RM well thats about 80-85% or your 1RM. To keep things simple say your work set is 85kg well you do 1 reps up to around 95% so 95kg so your body gets used to heavier weights and the work sets feel light.

Its just finding what works for you. Trial and error is the only way to find out


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I like to use percentages to calculate my warm ups. If your doing 140kg, warming up with 110kg is about right but your now doing 180kg so 120kg isnt heavy enough. It also works the other way, if your work weight is 200kg warming up with 180kg is to heavy so percentage works it out well. It doesnt have to be exact, I set my excel sheet to round to the nearest 10kg on my warm ups.
> 
> The guy I used to train with liked warming up how some power lifters do after i showed him. Say your doing a 5RM well thats about 80-85% or your 1RM. To keep things simple say your work set is 85kg well you do 1 reps up to around 95% so 95kg so your body gets used to heavier weights and the work sets feel light.
> 
> Its just finding what works for you. Trial and error is the only way to find out


I think i have to agree with you mate, the 175kg followed by the 180kg squat clearly demonstrates that. I'm going to take a good look at my warm ups for the squat & deadlift & you never know I might be able to make even better gains :thumb:

Also, something which is obvious but worth pointing out:

Lifts like the squat & deadlift that involve the whole body as one unit seem to be far more forgiving & less likely to suffer from pre exhaustion due to heavy warm up sets, however when you warm up the small muscles groups/lifts (bench press & overhead press) I think using your percentages & being more exact is important to consider as pre exhaustion in these areas can easily happen & its bye bye work set reps? What do you think about this guys?

As you say James, it's about finding what works for you as an individual, I'm finding the heavier my weights get the more I'm learning about my body, its weak & strong points, I'm hoping this first year in powerlifting will teach me how to lift safely/properly for many more years & give me the ability to get lifting some really decent weights by next Christmas. I don't want to repeat the mistake i made the other week with the deadlift 

I'm even more determined to focus on my form on every warm up & work set from now :thumb:

It's amazing how just one thread & the excellent small group of guys on it have taught me more about powerlifting/weight training in the last 7 months than I've learnt the last 20 years :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Light Box Squats: 102.5kg x 5,5
Bench Press: 110kg x 5,5,4
Deadlift: 155kg x 5

I have been doing Front Squats on Wednesday as they are better for recovery as they hit different muscles. I also like doing these as they hit the upper back and core really hard. The reason I dont Back Squats the last 2 workouts is to really work on my form as I'm alot stronger than my squats are showing at the moment, its just my form letting me down.

Bench Press: I decided to go up just a rep per workout so 2.5kg every 2 weeks which sounds good to me. The bench felt the worst it has in ages though, no matter what I did the bar was coming towards my face when I was pushing up, this meant my elbows came backwards as well. Ya I got the reps but they were far from perfect.

Deadlift: The last few reps were hard but fast so Im pleased with that. Really concentrating on arching my lower back as hard as possible during each rep to try and keep it flat. Grip felt better tonight as well.

All around not a bad workout. Just forward to fridays workout now so I can smash my Squats.



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm even more determined to focus on my form on every warm up & work set from now :thumb:
> 
> It's amazing how just one thread & the excellent small group of guys on it have taught me more about powerlifting/weight training in the last 7 months than I've learnt the last 20 years :thumb:


I been working really hard on my form over the last month or so and I think its starting to pay off as my weights are starting to move again.

The amazing things is the fact that we all learned so much and its a detailing forum :lol:


----------



## sidewalkdances

9 days!

My Tuesday deadlift session felt pretty good. To a point - In the suit I was AWFUL off the floor. The 235 opener I chose moved barely more than ok. Certainly not what an opener should look like. Then I did 255 off a 6" block. Dare I say it, it felt easy. I've narrowed it down to two culprits - my upper back strength (Brian's had me doing very little heavy lat work - I want to add in Kroc Rows and/or barbell rows in my off season cycle) and that my belly is getting in the way so my ultra stiff belt is causing my some problems - new Spud Inc 3 Ply Deadlift belt ordered!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> 9 days!
> 
> My Tuesday deadlift session felt pretty good. To a point - In the suit I was AWFUL off the floor. The 235 opener I chose moved barely more than ok. Certainly not what an opener should look like. Then I did 255 off a 6" block. Dare I say it, it felt easy. I've narrowed it down to two culprits - my upper back strength (Brian's had me doing very little heavy lat work - I want to add in Kroc Rows and/or barbell rows in my off season cycle) and that my belly is getting in the way so my ultra stiff belt is causing my some problems - new Spud Inc 3 Ply Deadlift belt ordered!


:doublesho

Im only lifting 175Kg, how long have you been doing this Dan?

Just tried my 175Kg deadlift, warmed up with heavier weight, odd thing is the first rep felt really hard, i took a couple minutes rest after the last 110Kg warm up set. I'm still feeling a bit of pain on my upper right side, so put the weight back down. My back also felt pre exhausted.

I think the last sessions **** up on the deadlift coupled with the psychological effects made this lift hard today. Next session I'll reduce the weight to 160Kg & build back up from there.

When warming up with heavier weights Should I Rest around 3-7 minutes between sets?

Would my Squat session of effected todays perfomance?

Tempted to go in again tomorrow grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr I'll be ****ed off with myself all day now  Dan I think im obsessed


----------



## sidewalkdances

My warm up NEVER changes, no matter what my goal weight is for the day.

60x5x3 
100x3x2
140x3
180x1 (maybe 3 if i'm working up to near max) 

Then work sets or I might make another small half plate jump to 200 for a single.

How exactly are you warming up Doug? Sets and reps please!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> My warm up NEVER changes, no matter what my goal weight is for the day.
> 
> 60x5x3
> 100x3x2
> 140x3
> 180x1 (maybe 3 if i'm working up to near max)
> 
> Then work sets or I might make another small half plate jump to 200 for a single.
> 
> How exactly are you warming up Doug? Sets and reps please!


Hi Dan,

My Warm up, like you i have been keeping the same weights until today.

My usual Deadlift warm up:

20Kg X 5
60Kg X 5
90Kg X 3
90Kg X2

Work set: 172.5Kg

Todays warm up:

20Kg X 5
70Kg X 5
90Kg X 3
110Kg X 2

Work set 175Kg. Decided t oput down after one rep  

Doug


----------



## sidewalkdances

You aren't warming up enough!

I would do

60x3x3 
100x3
120x2 
140x1
Work Set

You just aren't getting enough work in to prime the body to lift the big weights.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> You aren't warming up enough!
> 
> I would do
> 
> 60x3x3
> 100x3
> 120x2
> 140x1
> Work Set
> 
> You just aren't getting enough work in to prime the body to lift the big weights.


Thank mate :thumb::thumb:

What rest period between warm up sets should i use Dan?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Just go when your ready - I don't have a set time. I dont dawdle, but I dont rush if that makes sense. 

Also I tend to train with people, so sometimes I can go 10 mins between sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Just go when your ready - I don't have a set time. I dont dawdle, but I dont rush if that makes sense.
> 
> Also I tend to train with people, so sometimes I can go 10 mins between sets.


Thanks Dan :thumb:

Ive been taking very little rest between warm up sets 

Would it be a good idea to have another go tomorrow or should i stay away from the weights for a few days?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Just repeat the session when you are next ready to deadlift. Carry on as normal.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Question.

Is there a standard diameter of the Olympic disks used in any UK competition or is there a measurement that the bar has to be off the floor?


The reason I’m asking is i remember Phil (Barefacedgeek) ask me what the diameter of the largest disk in my Olympic set was. I'm assuming so that his bar was off the floor at the correct height ensuring a better chance to lift safely & properly, i can see that being too low can make the lift far more difficult that it already is. After today’s FAIL, I would like to make sure I’ve got everything covered


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Box Squats: 142.5 x 5,5,3
Seated Shoulder Press: 57.5 x 5,5,5
Pull Ups: 2x2, 8x1

Box squats were crap again, 1st rep flyes up and the 2nd is pretty easy but I fall off really fast as my back just runs out of strength. Working hard on my lower back. Got the Mrs to video my form and think I got it figured. I know I say that everytime but everything you feel under the bar seems to be multiplied as I felt like my back was nearly horizontal and I was taking weeks to finish my reps but I dont look as back as I thought.

YEEEEEPPPPPEEEEEE I got my Shoulder Press weight which means a big plate each side. I know big wow but for me a 60kg Shoulder Press is impressive.

Pull ups felt real good but high volume below failure always feels good.



ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Dan,
> 
> My Warm up, like you i have been keeping the same weights until today.
> 
> My usual Deadlift warm up:
> 
> 20Kg X 5
> 60Kg X 5
> 90Kg X 3
> 90Kg X2
> 
> Work set: 172.5Kg
> 
> Todays warm up:
> 
> 20Kg X 5
> 70Kg X 5
> 90Kg X 3
> 110Kg X 2
> 
> Work set 175Kg. Decided t oput down after one rep
> 
> Doug


Doug not that you should listen to me as my workouts are going SH*T but I warm up very similar to SideWalkDance.

To warm up to 175kg I would do.
87.5 x 2 x 5
122.5 x 3
157.5 x 1
175kg work sets

Its finding what works, I do the Eric Cressey warm up routines before every workout so I only need a few warm ups but if I skip the EC warm ups then I use more sets the warm up.

I use a watch to time time between sets but not between warm ups, just go by feel.

That was quick Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Box Squats: 142.5 x 5,5,3
> Seated Shoulder Press: 57.5 x 5,5,5
> Pull Ups: 2x2, 8x1
> 
> Box squats were crap again, 1st rep flyes up and the 2nd is pretty easy but I fall off really fast as my back just runs out of strength. Working hard on my lower back. Got the Mrs to video my form and think I got it figured. I know I say that everytime but everything you feel under the bar seems to be multiplied as I felt like my back was nearly horizontal and I was taking weeks to finish my reps but I dont look as back as I thought.
> 
> YEEEEEPPPPPEEEEEE I got my Shoulder Press weight which means a big plate each side. I know big wow but for me a 60kg Shoulder Press is impressive.
> 
> Pull ups felt real good but high volume below failure always feels good.


Excellent stuff James! :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Box Squats: 142.5 x 5,5,3
> Seated Shoulder Press: 57.5 x 5,5,5
> Pull Ups: 2x2, 8x1
> 
> Box squats were crap again, 1st rep flyes up and the 2nd is pretty easy but I fall off really fast as my back just runs out of strength. Working hard on my lower back. Got the Mrs to video my form and think I got it figured. I know I say that everytime but everything you feel under the bar seems to be multiplied as I felt like my back was nearly horizontal and I was taking weeks to finish my reps but I dont look as back as I thought.
> 
> YEEEEEPPPPPEEEEEE I got my Shoulder Press weight which means a big plate each side. I know big wow but for me a 60kg Shoulder Press is impressive.
> 
> Pull ups felt real good but high volume below failure always feels good.
> 
> Doug not that you should listen to me as my workouts are going SH*T but I warm up very similar to SideWalkDance.
> 
> To warm up to 175kg I would do.
> 87.5 x 2 x 5
> 122.5 x 3
> 157.5 x 1
> 175kg work sets
> 
> Its finding what works, I do the Eric Cressey warm up routines before every workout so I only need a few warm ups but if I skip the EC warm ups then I use more sets the warm up.
> 
> I use a watch to time time between sets but not between warm ups, just go by feel.
> 
> That was quick Doug


I have learnt a lot in a small space of time, most of all I've learnt how little i know or think i know & I've also learnt how much I really want my lift goals, I'm still mad at myself from yesterday's farce, I know I can lift more FFS!!! 
And don't knock yourself mate you're going to get there :thumb:

Warming up has never been my strong point  but at least i am open to learn & that i think is important if i want to carry on this sport. I've just got to realise there is no quick way, just the right way. I need to learn a bit of patience.

I'm going to regroup this week & start again Monday :thumb:

Very tempted to start a simple split routine training each lift once a week. Will think about this over the weekend.

I WILL be warming up with the heavier weights as recomended by you two guys :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have learnt a lot in a small space of time, most of all I've learnt how little i know or think i know & I've also learnt how much I really want my lift goals, I'm still mad at myself from yesterday's farce, I know I can lift more FFS!!!
> And don't knock yourself mate you're going to get there :thumb:
> 
> Warming up has never been my strong point  but at least i am open to learn & that i think is important if i want to carry on this sport. I've just got to realise there is no quick way, just the right way. I need to learn a bit of patience.
> 
> I'm going to regroup this week & start again Monday :thumb:
> 
> Very tempted to start a simple split routine training each lift once a week. Will think about this over the weekend.
> 
> I WILL be warming up with the heavier weights as recomended by you two guys :thumb:


Alot of lifting is mental strength as well mate as you can psych yourself out before you even attempt the lift, I do this alot.

Im pissed at myself every bloody squat work at the moment, I need to just smash the weights.

I know some top powerlifters spend a serious amount of time warming up. I used to do alot less sets and also reps than my training partner. He used to spend quite awhile warming up.

Mate Im pretty sure thats the first time you have failed on one of the big 2 so i wouldnt jump program just yet. You got that slight injury worry in the back of your mind so maybe a slight deload to get your confidence back and make sure the inury is ok. Check out Wendler log at the moment he is recovering from shoulder surgery, not saying your injury is anywhere near this bad but he's just taking things one step at a time.

You have to prime your nervous system when warming up. Alot of people training athletes seem to warm them up using jumps, sprints, etc to prime the Nervous system, look at the Juggernaut Program he does this alot and so does Wendler.

I'm going to start 5/3/1 eventually but why change when your still making progress. Especially you Doug, thats the first time you have failed.

The main reason I want to change to 5/3/1 is I find it quite mentally taxing squating every workout, waking up in the morning knowing I got to squat and smash the weight whereas 5/3/1 I get that mental break on Bench and Shoulder press


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Alot of lifting is mental strength as well mate as you can psych yourself out before you even attempt the lift, I do this alot.
> 
> Im pissed at myself every bloody squat work at the moment, I need to just smash the weights.
> 
> I know some top powerlifters spend a serious amount of time warming up. I used to do alot less sets and also reps than my training partner. He used to spend quite awhile warming up.
> 
> Mate Im pretty sure thats the first time you have failed on one of the big 2 so i wouldnt jump program just yet. You got that slight injury worry in the back of your mind so maybe a slight deload to get your confidence back and make sure the inury is ok. Check out Wendler log at the moment he is recovering from shoulder surgery, not saying your injury is anywhere near this bad but he's just taking things one step at a time.
> 
> You have to prime your nervous system when warming up. Alot of people training athletes seem to warm them up using jumps, sprints, etc to prime the Nervous system, look at the Juggernaut Program he does this alot and so does Wendler.
> 
> I'm going to start 5/3/1 eventually but why change when your still making progress. Especially you Doug, thats the first time you have failed.
> 
> The main reason I want to change to 5/3/1 is I find it quite mentally taxing squating every workout, waking up in the morning knowing I got to squat and smash the weight whereas 5/3/1 I get that mental break on Bench and Shoulder press


Good advice mate.

I think you are correct, the slight injury is more than likely the thing that really stopped me do my lift, i also took longer than normal, walked up to the bar around 5 times :doublesho

It is the first time I've failed, in fact even the slower progress on the bench could hardly be considered a fail, I'm probably like you mate, i like to be hard on myself  I hate physical weakness in myself 

I can really see how warming up with heavier weight can set the mind up for the lift, if i warm up with 140Kg then my work set is only 35Kg more.

I really wanted to keep to the current program until i reached at least 200Kg for reps on the squat & deadlift, achieving the 150Kg bench press is going to be the real trick me thinks.

I'm going to do the warm up sets today but no work set just to get a feel for it :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Good advice mate.
> 
> I think you are correct, the slight injury is more than likely the thing that really stopped me do my lift, i also took longer than normal, walked up to the bar around 5 times :doublesho
> 
> It is the first time I've failed, in fact even the slower progress on the bench could hardly be considered a fail, I'm probably like you mate, i like to be hard on myself  I hate physical weakness in myself
> 
> I can really see how warming up with heavier weight can set the mind up for the lift, if i warm up with 140Kg then my work set is only 35Kg more.
> 
> I really wanted to keep to the current program until i reached at least 200Kg for reps on the squat & deadlift, achieving the 150Kg bench press is going to be the real trick me thinks.
> 
> I'm going to do the warm up sets today but no work set just to get a feel for it :thumb:


If you walked up to the bar so many times then that is def mental, i do that some times where I take my big breath before the lift loads of times.

Ya but this is the first time you have failed mate and you got an injury so you cant be to hard on yourself. Just pick your battles mate, if your still injured keep working but dont smash your body 110%.

If the program is still feeling good and your still making progress there is no need to change things. Leave the more advanced programs for later


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> If you walked up to the bar so many times then that is def mental, i do that some times where I take my big breath before the lift loads of times.
> 
> Ya but this is the first time you have failed mate and you got an injury so you cant be to hard on yourself. Just pick your battles mate, if your still injured keep working but dont smash your body 110%.
> 
> If the program is still feeling good and your still making progress there is no need to change things. Leave the more advanced programs for later


Mental alright 

Im going to take the next week off to fully recover & start again with the same program, I feel even more determined now :devil: :thumb:

I agree the 5/3/1 or a simple 4 day split is something i wanted to save until i got at least 200kg for reps on the squat & deadlift :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Question.
> 
> Is there a standard diameter of the Olympic disks used in any UK competition or is there a measurement that the bar has to be off the floor


SS:bbt3 "All plates bigger than 25 pounds and all bumper plates (since they wouldn't bump if they didn't touch the floor) should be 17.5 inches (45cm) in diameter."


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> SS:bbt3 "All plates bigger than 25 pounds and all bumper plates (since they wouldn't bump if they didn't touch the floor) should be 17.5 inches (45cm) in diameter."


Thanks Oats :thumb::thumb:

Have checked my bar height & its around 8 1/2 inches off the floor so about right :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/a_letter_to_my_younger_self

Read that Doug

5 days to go! Started my weight cut yesterday, down by a kg already. Hopefully should see the same on Tuesday and Wednesday, leaving me only 2kg to shift on Thursday on the dreaded no water and no food day!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/a_letter_to_my_younger_self
> 
> Read that Doug
> 
> 5 days to go! Started my weight cut yesterday, down by a kg already. Hopefully should see the same on Tuesday and Wednesday, leaving me only 2kg to shift on Thursday on the dreaded no water and no food day!


Cheers for the link 

Best of luck Dan :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Wtf!!!!!!!!!!*

As per the title :thumb:

Thought I'd do the new improved warm up to get a feel for it, wasn't planning on going any further. However 

Deadlift: Warm up - 70kgX3X3, 100kgX3, 120KgX2, 140KgX1 ( I did with less than one minute rest between sets, tea was almost ready!)

So after feeling so good on the warm up set i loaded the bar with 170Kg & just did one rep to monitor my recovery. WTF!!! It was easy  Could of repped out 5 but thought better of it. I'm still going to leave this week to fully recover, I'm so happy i can lift the 170Kg with no pain at all  :thumb: :thumb:

I really felt how the above warm up prepared my body for the work set.

So my next question for you Dan (How much beer do I owe you now?)

If my Bench Press is 112.5Kg for reps, what would you recommend as my optimum warm up routine?


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Squats: 142.5 x 3,0,0 - 120kg x 5,5,5
Bench Press: 110kg x 5,1,0
Chin Ups: 1x4, 9x3

Im trying not to rock on the box as much as I used to as it means the weight is travelling forwards when I push up and this is the reason the weight is going over my toes and causing me to good morning out of the hole. I really concentrated on my form tonight but its hitting different muscles so couldnt get the weight. Deloaded and it felt alot better, weirdly the third set felt the best and easiest.

It was just one of those nights, my shoulder felt great walking in the gym but squats always make it hurt. If I drive my elbows down it kills my shoulder but keeps my upper back tight. So when I got to Bench Press my shoulder was killing but first 5 reps flew up, 2nd set I had trouble even unracking the bar but pushed hard and got it out, first rep was ugly and then the 2nd rep went towards my face and that was it. Got my Chin Ups done and got out of there to ice my shoulder for the rest of the evening.

All in all a really SH*T workout. I thought I was making progress on my squat but obviously not. Getting really down with my weight lifting, tonight I will be hitting the same Deadlift weight that I hit 5 months ago and my squats have only gone up 12.5kg in 5 months. I would be ok with the progress if I was nearer 200kg but this is pathetic progress to go from 130kg to 142.5kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Squats: 142.5 x 3,0,0 - 120kg x 5,5,5
> Bench Press: 110kg x 5,1,0
> Chin Ups: 1x4, 9x3
> 
> Im trying not to rock on the box as much as I used to as it means the weight is travelling forwards when I push up and this is the reason the weight is going over my toes and causing me to good morning out of the hole. I really concentrated on my form tonight but its hitting different muscles so couldnt get the weight. Deloaded and it felt alot better, weirdly the third set felt the best and easiest.
> 
> It was just one of those nights, my shoulder felt great walking in the gym but squats always make it hurt. If I drive my elbows down it kills my shoulder but keeps my upper back tight. So when I got to Bench Press my shoulder was killing but first 5 reps flew up, 2nd set I had trouble even unracking the bar but pushed hard and got it out, first rep was ugly and then the 2nd rep went towards my face and that was it. Got my Chin Ups done and got out of there to ice my shoulder for the rest of the evening.
> 
> All in all a really SH*T workout. I thought I was making progress on my squat but obviously not. Getting really down with my weight lifting, tonight I will be hitting the same Deadlift weight that I hit 5 months ago and my squats have only gone up 12.5kg in 5 months. I would be ok with the progress if I was nearer 200kg but this is pathetic progress to go from 130kg to 142.5kg


I always do my bench before the squats :thumb:

Keep at it mate :thumb:

James, have you considered just taking a week off to get reset & refreshed.


----------



## impster

Been feeling like sh1t for the past few days, and am ashamed to say I've not done my Monday workout and unlikely to do tonights. I think this bug/virus thing I've got is starting to shift though, so will get back onto track on Friday.

Damn nuisance.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Been feeling like sh1t for the past few days, and am ashamed to say I've not done my Monday workout and unlikely to do tonights. I think this bug/virus thing I've got is starting to shift though, so will get back onto track on Friday.
> 
> Damn nuisance.


It happens mate, my injury has kept me out for around 3 weeks, back to it Monday, Onward & upward!!! :thumb: :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout.
Free Squats 82.5 x 5,5. 
Box Squats 82.5 x 5,5
Shoulder Press 60 x 3,3,3
Deadlift 160 x 4

Walked in the gym to do front squats but then wondered how Free Squats would free and one thing I noticed is its alot easier to hit depth with my feet closer together than wider like i usually havw them. The Eric Cressey warm ups have obviously helped as the free squats felt great where as I used to feel crap because I wasnt flexible enough. I smashed the safety bars on my first rep so I was obviously going lower than parallel but this is the reason I love Box squats, I know that every rep is exactly the same height and I didnt miss the rep because I was to low or get the rep as I was to high. Anyway I measured my shoulders and put tape on the floor at shoulder width and my stance has been 4-5" wider on each foot than shoulder width. No wonder I been feeling it in the inside of the legs and having trouble keeping my knees out. I will stick with a mor conventional stance and see how things go.

Tried box squat after just to see the difference in the muscles the squat hits. Really wide hits Glutes and inside of legs and a big stretch whereas normal stance you feel more in your thighs. Rippletoe suggests shoulder width whereas Dave Tate suggest really wide but I think thats to get the most out of the squat suit and lessen the distance.

Shoulder Press I only went for 3 x 3 but I worked really hard for them. As I hadnt hit squats hard before this my shoulder felt fine so I fet confident in grinding out the last rep.

Kicked my deadlifts up by 5kg for a PB, ok it was only 4 reps but I will get it next week


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout.
> Free Squats 82.5 x 5,5.
> Box Squats 82.5 x 5,5
> Shoulder Press 60 x 3,3,3
> Deadlift 160 x 4
> 
> Walked in the gym to do front squats but then wondered how Free Squats would free and one thing I noticed is its alot easier to hit depth with my feet closer together than wider like i usually havw them. The Eric Cressey warm ups have obviously helped as the free squats felt great where as I used to feel crap because I wasnt flexible enough. I smashed the safety bars on my first rep so I was obviously going lower than parallel but this is the reason I love Box squats, I know that every rep is exactly the same height and I didnt miss the rep because I was to low or get the rep as I was to high. Anyway I measured my shoulders and put tape on the floor at shoulder width and my stance has been 4-5" wider on each foot than shoulder width. No wonder I been feeling it in the inside of the legs and having trouble keeping my knees out. I will stick with a mor conventional stance and see how things go.
> 
> Tried box squat after just to see the difference in the muscles the squat hits. Really wide hits Glutes and inside of legs and a big stretch whereas normal stance you feel more in your thighs. Rippletoe suggests shoulder width whereas Dave Tate suggest really wide but I think thats to get the most out of the squat suit and lessen the distance.
> 
> Shoulder Press I only went for 3 x 3 but I worked really hard for them. As I hadnt hit squats hard before this my shoulder felt fine so I fet confident in grinding out the last rep.
> 
> Kicked my deadlifts up by 5kg for a PB, ok it was only 4 reps but I will get it next week


Shoulder press & deadlift looking goooooooooooood! :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Have checked my bar height & its around 8 1/2 inches off the floor so about right :thumb:


I forgot to say about the bench height as well.

I started SS about 9 months ago after a disc bulge, and bench presses always aggravated my lower back. The SS book says bench height should be 17 inches (or poss. 17.5 from memory). Mine, and most you can buy, are 20+ (I think it's to fit on leg attachments on multi function benches). Anyway, using plates to make the height difference 17 inches has helped my lower back.


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> If my Bench Press is 112.5Kg for reps, what would you recommend as my optimum warm up routine?


Bar x5 x3
40x3x2
60x3
80x3
100x1
Work Set.

Thats if your coming in totally cold. If you've already done another lift before and are generally warm from that, go in at 40 or 60.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Bar x5 x3
> 40x3x2
> 60x3
> 80x3
> 100x1
> Work Set.
> 
> Thats if your coming in totally cold. If you've already done another lift before and are generally warm from that, go in at 40 or 60.


 :thumb: Thanks Dan, i'll do this on Mondays workout :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Im well into my weight cut now - have to give my next update to my coach at 6pm.

Gone from 116.1 to 113.1 in 3 and a half days.Need another 3kg off today!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Im well into my weight cut now - have to give my next update to my coach at 6pm.
> 
> Gone from 116.1 to 113.1 in 3 and a half days.Need another 3kg off today!


:doublesho :doublesho


----------



## sidewalkdances

I can see me spending some decent time in the sauna this evening. Today is no food or drink and I cant seem to have a wee! I loaded on water the last two days, no carbs and i'm still holding water. I can tell as much as my feet are all 'puffy' :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I can tell as much as my feet are all 'puffy' :lol:


:lol::lol:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I was 112.8 at my last check. Starting to get VERY hungry now.

When your used to pounding down 3500 cals a day and over 400g protein, and still being hungry, not eating for 24 hours is horrid.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I was 112.8 at my last check. Starting to get VERY hungry now.
> 
> When your used to pounding down 3500 cals a day and over 400g protein, and still being hungry, not eating for 24 hours is horrid.


What weight catagory are you aiming for Dan?


----------



## ITHAQVA

I find these vids great for a little MOTIVAAAATION? :thumb: :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Jesus, where was the spotter in that first vid when the guy drops the bench press on his face. Excatly why I always use a rack.

Good motivation though, makes me want to lift now


----------



## JamesGarner

Last vid made me smile. That song is on my iPod and I can totally blank the world out and focus listening to that in in the gym either running or lifting

Thought I'd take it easier In the gym last to save my legs for today a bit and ended up squatting more than ever (160kg) then lightened up and went right to the floor for 3 more sets of 10 

Feeling it today though as been out on the bike round cannock chase (think it was 21 miles

Doubt this time last year I'd have been able to squat or cycle half of either let alone both


----------



## ITHAQVA

JamesGarner said:


> Last vid made me smile. That song is on my iPod and I can totally blank the world out and focus listening to that in in the gym either running or lifting
> 
> Thought I'd take it easier In the gym last to save my legs for today a bit and ended up squatting more than ever (160kg) then lightened up and went right to the floor for 3 more sets of 10
> 
> Feeling it today though as been out on the bike round cannock chase (think it was 21 miles
> 
> Doubt this time last year I'd have been able to squat or cycle half of either let alone both


Nice one James :thumb:

For those that may not know the epic track on the last vid is called "time" from the film Inception. Artist = Hans Zimmer :thumb:


----------



## SAL73R

I read this in an issue of muscle and fitness a couple of months ago but never really stuck to it, kinda wish I did. 


Day 1
Squat 5x5
Power clean 5x5
Split squat (dumbells) x3 sets 6 reps
Leg raises x3 sets AMAP

Day 2
Bench press 5x5
Dip x3 *AMAP
Bent over row x3 8-12 reps
Pull ups x3 AMAP
Side bends x3 8-12 reps*

Day 3
Dead lift 5x5
Front squat x3 8-12 reps*
Back raise x3 8-12 reps
Plank x5 10second hold

Day 4
Overhead press 5x5
Incline chest press x3 8-12 reps
Tate press x3 8-12 reps
1 arm row x3 8-12 reps
Hammer curl x3 8-12 reps


----------



## Bod42

^^^^^^^

That looks similar to the program Jim Wendler just wrote an article on Tnation, its called a A letter to My Younger Self which looks pretty good.

Monday
Squat 5/3/1
Bench Press 5/3/1
Dips 
Chin Ups
4-Way Neck
Sit Ups

Wednesday
Power Clean 5/3/1
Deadlift 5/3/1
Incline Press
Barbell Curls
Back Extensions

Friday
Front Squat 5/3/1
Press 5/3/1
Rows
DB Press
4-Way Neck
Sit Ups

Short of it is this is the routine Wendler would tell himself to do if he met his younger self.


----------



## Bod42

Fridays Workout:
Box Squats: 127.5kg x 5,5,5
Bench press: 100kg x 5,5,5
Pull Ups: 3x2, 7x1

I taped up the floor so I can get my stance right everytime (idea stolen from Doug :thumb as I find when the weight gets heavier, my stance tends to get wider. I feel like Im using my normal squatting muscles now with a closer stance so heres hoping we can start increasing the weight. I did abit of a deload to get my form down and now I decided on a form Im going to stick to it and smash the weights.

Bench was easy, 100kg seems to be such a good weight for me so going to increase the weight slower. At this weight compared with 110kg the reps are perfect and just feel smooth, no grinding or anything. I think I'm going to do this exercise without any grinding from now on and see how things go.

Pull Ups seem to hurt my shoulder alot more than Chin Ups or Neutral grip but then they hit your back better so I keep with Mondays Chin Ups and Fridays Pull Ups.

Did some RC and rear delt work in high rep giant super set fashion to finish


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Fridays Workout:
> Box Squats: 127.5kg x 5,5,5
> Bench press: 100kg x 5,5,5
> Pull Ups: 3x2, 7x1
> 
> I taped up the floor so I can get my stance right everytime (idea stolen from Doug :thumb as I find when the weight gets heavier, my stance tends to get wider. I feel like Im using my normal squatting muscles now with a closer stance so heres hoping we can start increasing the weight. I did abit of a deload to get my form down and now I decided on a form Im going to stick to it and smash the weights.
> 
> Bench was easy, 100kg seems to be such a good weight for me so going to increase the weight slower. At this weight compared with 110kg the reps are perfect and just feel smooth, no grinding or anything. I think I'm going to do this exercise without any grinding from now on and see how things go.
> 
> Pull Ups seem to hurt my shoulder alot more than Chin Ups or Neutral grip but then they hit your back better so I keep with Mondays Chin Ups and Fridays Pull Ups.
> 
> Did some RC and rear delt work in high rep giant super set fashion to finish


Glad the tape idea worked James, all these little things help us focus on the job at hand...lifting the bloody weight 

I know exactly how you feel about the bench 100Kg is so easy, i find progress after 110Kg is slow.

Keep an eye on that shoulder mate you dont want to put yourself out of action, have you tried any of the flexibility vids etc?

Vid below From the people at EliteFTS :thumb:

:lol: the static screen shot below looks like hes decided to take a **** on the office floor :doublesho 





 :thumb:

I'll also email a shoulder related PDf to you to mate.


----------



## Bod42

The tape idea is good as one heavy set the other week I felt my toes touching the side of the rack during a set. Didnt even realise my stance was that wide but feels alot better 1" wider than shoulder width.

I'm not to worried about my Bench progress, for some reason its always been the exercise I worry the least about of the big 4. I would rather push my squat up especially as its only like 30kg heavier.

Ya im not pushing it to hard, Squats seem to be the exercise that makes it hurt the most so working on mobility.

Cheers for the PDF Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

I will be starting a 4 day split tonight to get me up to the 200Kg Squat & deadlift for 5 reps. I’m considering Wendlers 5/3/1. Very soon too.

However now that I’ve learnt to warm up I noticed that in the 5/3/1 pdf it states this as enough of a warm up :doublesho

• 1x5 @ 40%
• 1x5 @ 50%
• 1x3 @ 60%
• 3 X Work sets

The only thing I see that makes this sort of ok is the fact that you do 3 work sets of each lift & they start light so by the time you get to your last work set you should be warmed up enough.

I would greatly appreciate your thoughts/opinions guys :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Doug - I made the 110kg class.

Final results

Squat
Opener 295kg - Miss (Depth)
2nd - 295kg - Good Lift - 3 whites
3rd - 330kg - Good Lift - 3 whites

Bench
Opener - 200kg - Good lift
2nd - 215kg - Good Lift
3rd - 230kg - No lift - Pressed the weight back up but my bum came off the bench

Deadlift
Opener - 235kg - Good Lift
2nd - 255kg - No lift - barely off the floor
3rd - 255kg - No lift - Locked out but hitched.

780kg total, 4th place (out of 14) in the 110kg class.

I'll have video for you all soon


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Doug - I made the 110kg class.
> 
> Final results
> 
> Squat
> Opener 295kg - Miss (Depth)
> 2nd - 295kg - Good Lift - 3 whites
> 3rd - 330kg - Good Lift - 3 whites
> 
> Bench
> Opener - 200kg - Good lift
> 2nd - 215kg - Good Lift
> 3rd - 230kg - No lift - Pressed the weight back up but my bum came off the bench
> 
> Deadlift
> Opener - 235kg - Good Lift
> 2nd - 255kg - No lift - barely off the floor
> 3rd - 255kg - No lift - Locked out but hitched.
> 
> *780kg total *:thumb::thumb::thumb::devil::devil:, 4th place (out of 14) in the 110kg class.
> 
> I'll have video for you all soon


Dan, thats great stuff, 4th out of 14 :devil:, I would be really really bloody happy with those kind of results mate :devil::devil:

Well done mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Cheers Doug, just a light recovery week this week. Foam rolling, stretching and a bit of walking


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Cheers Doug, just a light recovery week this week. Foam rolling, stretching and a bit of walking


Well earned after lifting all that Iron :thumb: :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Nightmare, apparently the next comp might be July 7th and 8th! Not the end of September!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Nightmare, apparently the next comp might be July 7th and 8th! Not the end of September!


:doublesho You love it mate  And i dont blame you :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

All up in the air at the moment. I'll probably just do the UK Open as I know when that will be!


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Excellent!*

I will be doing a 3 or 4 day split if my shoulder allows a lifting session & using Wendler's boring but big assistance routine at the end of each days workout.

*Bench Press*

*Warm up sets: 40kg3X2 - 60KgX3 - 80KgX3 - 100KgX1

Work Set: 112.5KgX4* :thumb:

*Assitance Work - Wendler's "Boring but big" *

*Bench Press: 60Kg5X10

Barbell Row: 60Kg5X10*

Im going to be so sore tomorrow


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> All up in the air at the moment. I'll probably just do the UK Open as I know when that will be!


Balls! I bet you do it anyway


----------



## sidewalkdances

Nope, UK Open it is. The British is confirmed at week of the 7th/8th of July. Just too close to make good improvements. I'm thinking about my lifting longer term


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squat: 135kg x 5,5,5
Shoulder Press: 60kg x 3,3,4
Chin Ups: 2x4, 8,3
RC and Rear Delt work high rep.

Box squat are feeling good, everything feels alot better with a closer stance but then its harder to sit back so much.

Shoulder Press felt eally good, if your wondering why the last set was for more reps, this is on purpose so next week I will go 3,4,4 then 4,4,4 then 4,4,5 and so on. I find this one of the best ways to keep increasing weights.

Chin Ups felt the best they have ever have, 4 reps was really easy.



ITHAQVA said:


> I will be starting a 4 day split tonight to get me up to the 200Kg Squat & deadlift for 5 reps. I'm considering Wendlers 5/3/1. Very soon too.
> 
> However now that I've learnt to warm up I noticed that in the 5/3/1 pdf it states this as enough of a warm up :doublesho
> 
> • 1x5 @ 40%
> • 1x5 @ 50%
> • 1x3 @ 60%
> • 3 X Work sets
> 
> The only thing I see that makes this sort of ok is the fact that you do 3 work sets of each lift & they start light so by the time you get to your last work set you should be warmed up enough.
> 
> I would greatly appreciate your thoughts/opinions guys :thumb:


The reason 5/3/1 program suggests warming up like that is becuase really thats not the entire warmup, the first 2 sets are warm ups as well really. And remember these are % of your 1RM where as all the discussions on here lately have been % of your working max.

So your 170kg squat would be:
40 % 67.5 x 5 
50% 85 x 5 
60% 102.5 x 3 
65% 110 x 5 (76% of work set) 
75% 127.5 x 5 (88% of work set) 
85% 145 x 5+ Work Set



ITHAQVA said:


> I will be doing a 3 or 4 day split if my shoulder allows a lifting session & using Wendler's boring but big assistance routine at the end of each days workout.
> 
> *Bench Press*
> 
> *Warm up sets: 40kg3X2 - 60KgX3 - 80KgX3 - 100KgX1
> 
> Work Set: 112.5KgX4* :thumb:
> 
> *Assitance Work - Wendler's "Boring but big" *
> 
> *Bench Press: 60Kg5X10
> 
> Barbell Row: 60Kg5X10*
> 
> Im going to be so sore tomorrow


After reading alot of Wendler's replies in the Q&A section of Elitefts he seems to suggest switching the assistant exercises on boring but big plan so when you bench press you do 5x10 shoulder press and when you shoulder press you do 5x10 bench press. The same goes for squats and deadlifts as well. I read alot of people seem to gain better on this templates and going from a program where you have been hitting each exercise more than once a week this is probably good progrssion. I read a few people who go from Starting Strength/Stronglift/5x5 etc loose some squat strength when starting this program as their going from squatting 2-3 times per week to once every 7-10 days depending on 3 or 4 days per week.

When I start 5/3/1 which will be in the new year I will start with the full body version.

Monday:
Squats: 5/3/1 
Bench press: 45% x 5, 55% x 5, 65% x 5 (increase 5 % each week)
Dumbell Rows: 3 x 10

Wednesday:
Deadlift: 5/3/1
Shoulder Press: 5/3/1
Dips: 3 x 10

Friday:
Bench Press: 5/3/1
Squats: 45% x 5, 55% x 5, 65% x 5 (increase 5 % each week)
Chin / Pull Ups: 3 x 10

Hits Bench and squats twice per week that way



sidewalkdances said:


> Doug - I made the 110kg class.
> 
> Final results
> 
> Squat
> Opener 295kg - Miss (Depth)
> 2nd - 295kg - Good Lift - 3 whites
> 3rd - 330kg - Good Lift - 3 whites
> 
> Bench
> Opener - 200kg - Good lift
> 2nd - 215kg - Good Lift
> 3rd - 230kg - No lift - Pressed the weight back up but my bum came off the bench
> 
> Deadlift
> Opener - 235kg - Good Lift
> 2nd - 255kg - No lift - barely off the floor
> 3rd - 255kg - No lift - Locked out but hitched.
> 
> 780kg total, 4th place (out of 14) in the 110kg class.
> 
> I'll have video for you all soon


Amazing lifts there. What are your goals for your next event


----------



## ITHAQVA

^^^ :thumb::thumb:

Bloody sore today lol!!!:devil::devil:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys not posted in a while, been busy with work then on holiday. I dropped my wieghts down a bit mainly due to pain in my shoulder. this seems to be getting better. just need to wait and see when the wieght goes uo again. Anyhow last nights workout was

Squat 100k 5,5,5

Overhead Press 52.5k 5,5,5,5,5

Deadlift 135k 5

Warmed up with lighter wieghts and some dynamic streching then finished up with 20 minutes in the cross trainer

cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys not posted in a while, been busy with work then on holiday. I dropped my wieghts down a bit mainly due to pain in my shoulder. this seems to be getting better. just need to wait and see when the wieght goes uo again. Anyhow last nights workout was
> 
> Squat 100k 5,5,5
> 
> Overhead Press 52.5k 5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Deadlift 135k 5
> 
> Warmed up with lighter wieghts and some dynamic streching then finished up with 20 minutes in the cross trainer
> 
> cheers


Hi Nicky,
I would definitely lower your work sets on the overhead press, especially if you have a shoulder issue.

Warm up Sets: 20X3X2 30X3 40X2 50X1
Work Set: 52.5Kg

:thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Bod42 said:


> Amazing lifts there. What are your goals for your next event


Something like 
Sq 365, BP 245, Deadlift 275


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> ^^^ :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Bloody sore today lol!!!:devil::devil:


How did the 5x10 go considering we been doing 5 reps for so long. Bet it was quite a shock to the system doing high sets and reps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> How did the 5x10 go considering we been doing 5 reps for so long. Bet it was quite a shock to the system doing high sets and reps.


All jokes aside , hardly sore at all today, just a slight ache mainly in the pec's/traps/triceps/shoulders :thumb:, was very surprised as I thought it would be a full 5 days of the dreaded DOMS!!!!  

The 5X10 in training felt really good, I took around 1-2 minutes rest between sets, each set was easy enough to complete due to the light weight used (around 50% of my 1 rep max), I will keep using "boring but big" & possibly add 2.5Kg once every 1-2 months.

On the 10 reps stuff I'm concentrating on powering the weight up quick to help increase explosive power/strength, I'm also hoping the high rep stuff will increase my fitness & help with a little body fat loss :thumb:

Just to keep everyone informed this is not the 5/3/1, but a basic 5 rep routine at approx... 85% max followed by the boring but big routine from the 5/3/1 book :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

With BBB assistance add 2.5kg each cycle. The volume will soon mount up. 

I'm heading back to the gym I think today, should have my new training program very soon too. 

20 weeks!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> With BBB assistance add 2.5kg each cycle. The volume will soon mount up.
> 
> I'm heading back to the gym I think today, should have my new training program very soon too.
> 
> 20 weeks!


Will do :thumb:

Is that 20 weeks until your next meet?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Yes mate, just waiting for the venue to confirm we can have it again. We left a bit of mess on Saturday because they didnt leave the mops out as promised. A powerlifting comp is a messy affair, lots of chalk and talc everywhere. 

The comp, if it gets the go ahead, is likely to be one of the biggest in Europe this year. We're looking to get a WPC sanction (World Powerlifting Congress) so that World Records can be attempted and broken! The World Champs are in Las Vegas this year, so many people cant afford to travel over there. This way it'll be a mini world championships! 

Will be over 2 days (1st and 2nd Sept) in Folkestone, Kent and will be a cracking couple of days of lifting. Top quality venue with top quality kit! We're looking into getting a grant to make the event even better by getting a nice lighting rig and having a WPO style stage!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Yes mate, just waiting for the venue to confirm we can have it again. We left a bit of mess on Saturday because they didnt leave the mops out as promised. A powerlifting comp is a messy affair, lots of chalk and talc everywhere.
> 
> The comp, if it gets the go ahead, is likely to be one of the biggest in Europe this year. We're looking to get a WPC sanction (World Powerlifting Congress) so that World Records can be attempted and broken! The World Champs are in Las Vegas this year, so many people cant afford to travel over there. This way it'll be a mini world championships!
> 
> Will be over 2 days (1st and 2nd Sept) in Folkestone, Kent and will be a cracking couple of days of lifting. Top quality venue with top quality kit! We're looking into getting a grant to make the event even better by getting a nice lighting rig and having a WPO style stage!


Hope you guys get the grant, powerlifting is undervalued.


----------



## sidewalkdances

We can easily do it without needing a grant to be honest. Just getting the venue is a huge step forward. The international sanction would be a great forward move too. That will attract lifters from all over. Especially those who didnt get an invite to Bullfarm the weekend after!


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Light Free Squats: 82.5 x 5,5
Bench Press: 100kg 5,5,5
Deadlift: 160kg x 5

Just felt like doing free squats the last couple of weeks to see what kind of depth I can hit and how they feel. The Eric Cressey Warm up most of helped as hitting depth is easy now. I know not heavy weights but this is my light day.

Bench Pressed the same weight as last week so this was easy.

Deadlifts were ugly but I got all the reps, the last rep was def a grinder but I locked it out


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday workout

Squat: Warm up sets – 60X3X3 – 100X3-120X2-140X1
Squat: Work set – 170KgX5

Boring but big routine
Squat: 100Kg 3X10
Standing Calf Raise: 100Kg 5X10

Lowered my safety bar so that I’m well below the parallel & I’ve set myself the goal that if I don’t touch the bar 5 times on the work set I don’t up the weight, tonight I managed to touch 3 times so no weight increase for me, this will force me to get it 100% right & ensure there is plenty of power on the lowest/weakest part of the lift :thumb:

Went through the workout way too quick so only did 3X10 reps with 100Kg on the squat, I was fookin mashed after 3 sets lol, I will do 5X10 next session
Standing calf raise was a little awkward on a power rack, I will get a block to stand on to ensure full plane of movement in the future.

Loving the boring but big routines afterwards, really gets the heart pumping :devil::devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Wednesday workout
> 
> Squat: Warm up sets - 60X3X3 - 100X3-120X2-140X1
> Squat: Work set - 170KgX5
> 
> Boring but big routine
> Squat: 100Kg 3X10
> Standing Calf Raise: 100Kg 5X10
> 
> Lowered my safety bar so that I'm well below the parallel & I've set myself the goal that if I don't touch the bar 5 times on the work set I don't up the weight, tonight I managed to touch 3 times so no weight increase for me, this will force me to get it 100% right & ensure there is plenty of power on the lowest/weakest part of the lift :thumb:
> 
> Went through the workout way too quick so only did 3X10 reps with 100Kg on the squat, I was fookin mashed after 3 sets lol, I will do 5X10 next session
> Standing calf raise was a little awkward on a power rack, I will get a block to stand on to ensure full plane of movement in the future.
> 
> Loving the boring but big routines afterwards, really gets the heart pumping :devil::devil:


Assuming i've read this right;

DO NOT TOUCH THE SPOTTER PINS!!!!!

Its very dangerous. All you need to do is graze the pins unevenly, or hit them too hard because your tired and you will start rotating in the trunk. That is going to throw your back out something chronic. Just trust that your going deep enough. You dont want to get injured!

I'm almost feeling ready to go back to the gym. Back is still all jacked up


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Assuming i've read this right;
> 
> DO NOT TOUCH THE SPOTTER PINS!!!!!
> 
> Its very dangerous. All you need to do is graze the pins unevenly, or hit them too hard because your tired and you will start rotating in the trunk. That is going to throw your back out something chronic. Just trust that your going deep enough. You dont want to get injured!
> 
> I'm almost feeling ready to go back to the gym. Back is still all jacked up


You are reading right mate, have to agree when I touch the safety bars it does make the lift feel all wrong & sometimes i almost bottom out if you know what i mean as the weight shifts onto the safeties, I'm constructing a small cardboard box so when I reach just below parallel ill feel it touch my bum  (Not a true box squat but a box used to gauge how deep I'm going), :thumb::thumb: thanks for the heads up Dan :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Wouldnt even bother doing that. You know when a squat is high! 

We've got confirmation on the comp! Doug - I expect to see your debut on the platform! 5 months is plenty of time! September 1st and 2nd - Folkestone, Kent!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Wouldnt even bother doing that. You know when a squat is high!
> 
> We've got confirmation on the comp! Doug - I expect to see your debut on the platform! 5 months is plenty of time! September 1st and 2nd - Folkestone, Kent!


I'm still on the fence about competing Dan , perhaps if we meet when you're down here sometime you can judge if I'm truly ready to justify a drive up to Kent for a powerlifting meet (320 Miles) :thumb:

When I get to 200kg on my squat & deadlift for 5 reps I will however video my 230kg single lifts & upload for all to see, that in itself would be a start in the right direction :thumb:

Why 200kg for 5 reps you may ask! Well at that weight/rep ratio I would feel confindent that i have reached a respectable strength level, simples! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Happy Bunny!!!!*

Fridays Workout.

Was going to do my deadlift but my legs are still sore, ill do the deads tomorrow:thumb: Bloody DOMS!!!AAAAAgh :devil::devil:

So i decided to do Shoulders!!! :doublesho:doublesho

*Overhead Press (Warm up sets): 20X3X2 - 30X3 - 40X2 - 50X1

Overhead Press (Work Set): 60X5 *:thumb::thumb: No pain!!!!! wohhoooo!!! 

Weight felt really good, i defo had more left in the tank but i was cautious about the old left shoulder/arm injury i had around last October time.

Boring but big 

*Overhead Press 30X5X10*

Felt too light/easy, but i don't want to bugger up my left shoulder/arm, so i may stay within 30-40kg for the light high rep stuff & only increase the work set everytime i reach 5 reps :thumb:

I left out pull ups on tonights boring but big.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi Admins,

Please can we make this thread a sticky? I think it deserves it due to its high view total/interest (22569) & that it is constantly viewed updated by us DW powerlifting chaps on a daily basis :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Beeet the Demons!!!*

Sundays workout.

*Deadlift Warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift Work Set: 170KgX5*

Boring but big workout;

*Deadlift: 100X3X10

Hanging knee raise: 3X10*

Good workout, beat my deadlift demon today:devil: I will treat myself to a chicken kebab as I've been a good boy


----------



## Bod42

Nice Workouts there Doug and great idea about the sticky.

I'm taking a week off this week as my body is run down, havent been sleeping properly, skins crap, feel weak, etc and I havent taken a week off since I started last year.

When I come back I will be doing the Juggernaut Method for 20 weeks. This includes all the Medicine ball throws, sprints, sled drags, hill sprints, jumps etc as well which I'm hoping will make me feel alot more athletic and that way if I decide to play rugby again I wont need ages to get my fitness up.

Just nipped out at lunch and brought a Sled, got a bargain as well. 95quid with crap strap, I got it for 30 quid with the upgraded strap and it has a lifetime guarantee. RESULT


----------



## sidewalkdances

Dont think we need a sticky - we keep this bumped near the top anyway :lol: 

Back in the gym today, lets hope my lower back holds out!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Dont think we need a sticky - we keep this bumped near the top anyway :lol:


:lol::lol::lol:


----------



## sidewalkdances

For those interested - here's is tonights session on paper

Free squat: 3 working sets of 8 
Leg press: 2 sets of 30 
Lunge: 3 sets of 8 per leg 
Planks: 3 sets of 60 sec
Vomit - As required


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> For those interested - here's is tonights session on paper
> 
> Free squat: 3 working sets of 8
> Leg press: 2 sets of 30
> Lunge: 3 sets of 8 per leg
> Planks: 3 sets of 60 sec
> *Vomit - As required*


:doublesho :lol:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I hate lunges with a passion. I always feel like i'm going to fall over


----------



## Oats

Can't find my old log in so I'll go with this one.

Here's my evening of starting strength suffering. Nine months in, couple of resets and disc bulge flare ups later.....
Squat 115kg 3x5 (linear)
bench 62.5kg 1x5 (intensity)
chins 10x3 reps at 1 min intervals


----------



## impster

Evenin' all.

Been a while and ashamed to say tonight was my first workout for a fortnight. A combination of a really really bad case of what my wife calls 'man-flu' put me out for a week, then I had a wisdom tooth out last week and dentist told me it was important not to 'strain' at all for a few days.

All good excuses, but all annoyingly true as well.

Anyway, tonight's workout 'B' (squats, overhead press, deadlifts):
Squats 84.6kg (up from 81.2kg last time)
O/head press: 48.2kg (currently 'dominating' this for the 3rd time)
Deadlift: 90.4kg (up from 72.8kg !).

I can feel the diference a couple of weeks has made. Glad to be back on it as well.

Impster


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Evenin' all.
> 
> Been a while and ashamed to say tonight was my first workout for a fortnight. A combination of a really really bad case of what my wife calls 'man-flu' put me out for a week, then I had a wisdom tooth out last week and dentist told me it was important not to 'strain' at all for a few days.
> 
> All good excuses, but all annoyingly true as well.
> 
> Anyway, tonight's workout 'B' (squats, overhead press, deadlifts):
> Squats 84.6kg (up from 81.2kg last time)
> O/head press: 48.2kg (currently 'dominating' this for the 3rd time)
> Deadlift: 90.4kg (up from 72.8kg !).
> 
> I can feel the diference a couple of weeks has made. Glad to be back on it as well.
> 
> Impster


Good to see you back mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Felt good to get back in the gym yesterday

Worked up to a top set of 185x8 on the squat - most reps i've ever done with 185. I nearly p*ssied out of doing it. I worked up slowly, I felt awful when I first got under the bar, like i'd never lifted weights in my life. Must have easily done 8 sets with just the bar to loosen myself up and a couple with 65kg (I use a 25kg squat bar).

Then worked up to my first work set of 165x8, then went to 175x8. This was semi tough, definitely a proper work set. So I almost decided to do the same weight again. Then thought, I'll move up just 5kg and do 180. But the allure of having 4 wheels on the bar was too much, so I fired myself up and went to work! 

Assistance was leg press 250kgx30x2 - a bit light I think. Leg extention - I was shifting all over the place on lunges and my back was playing up, so did something safer. Then 3 one minute sets of planks. 

I would suggest that you Stronglifts boys do add in some ab work. Nothing super heavy, just some planks and some leg raises. It'll make a big difference when the weights get heavier.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> *But the allure of having 4 wheels on the bar was too much, so I fired myself up and went to work! * :lol::lol::lol:
> 
> I would suggest that you Stronglifts boys do add in some ab work. Nothing super heavy, just some planks and some leg raises. It'll make a big difference when the weights get heavier.


Dan
I've just started to do 5X10 knee raises & will work up to leg raises on my deadlift day :thumb:

Also, how long do you recomend I hold the upper position for the plank?

185Kg for 8 reps, is that RAW :doublesho :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Good shout Doug - I usually do 3x a minute on my planks. For leg raises. I usually do 2-3 sets straight legged and then finish off with knee raises, depending on how my abs are feeling. Very good to build the hip flexors too.

Yes, the 185x8 was raw. Belt only, no knee wraps. I did use wrist wraps to stop me getting wrist pain, but it doesnt add anything to the lift.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Good shout Doug - I usually do 3x a minute on my planks. For leg raises. I usually do 2-3 sets straight legged and then finish off with knee raises, depending on how my abs are feeling. Very good to build the hip flexors too.
> 
> *Yes, the 185x8 was raw *:thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:. Belt only, no knee wraps. I did use wrist wraps to stop me getting wrist pain, but it doesnt add anything to the lift.


Cheers Dan :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Just realised - I get to use my new ab toy today!






Strong Abs = Strong Squat!


----------



## ITHAQVA

*"""~^*((%~$~!!!!!!*

Tuesdays utter  workout

*Bench Press Warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X3 - 100X1

Bench Press work set: 112.5X2  rested two minutes, tried again 112.5X2  lowered weight & 110X2 *

Assistance work, all sets done with two minutes or less rest just get my own back on my rubbish bench press :devil::

*Bench Press: 60X5X10

Barbell Row: 60X5X10*

*Dips Body weight (108Kg) 3X3X5 *felt pretty easy so a big WTF moment there as I didn't think I could do them unassisted :doublesho, i could of done 5X5 for sure if i rested for a few minutes more between sets, tempted to add this to help strengthen my triceps for my crappy bench :thumb:

If my body thinks by giving me a big *FAIL* on my bench today will stop me training, it's got another  thing bloody coming, must admit was still feeling a bit sore from sat & sun workout, there is a possibility that I'm not fully recovered as I did feel weak in the bench today.

Do you get the impression im peed off with my bench  Onward & upward :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Better Day!*

Wednesday workout

*Squat Warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
Squat Work set: 170X5 *much more tiring when you squat parallel :devil:

Boring but big
*Squat: 100X5X10* 
I'll be so sore tomorrow :devil:

Had to break off from the Calf workout as a delivery is due to arrive an hour early  , but at least I got my main/core work in  :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I had a decent first upper session back. We decided to do high boards to work on tricep strength at the top, reps in the 5's. I worked up to 160x5 raw. I could have probably had 170x5 and taken a run at 180kg of the boards, but I decided that wasn't a smart idea. So backed off. 

Was a good idea as my shoulder started playing up. I have zero need to risk things going forward.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Yes, the 185x8 was raw. Belt only, no knee wraps. I did use wrist wraps to stop me getting wrist pain, but it doesnt add anything to the lift.


I've noticed with 170Kg squats that my wrists are getting slightly bent back, it's only slightly uncomfortable nothing more, no pain or issues really, should i play safe & start using wraps for my work sets Dan or carry on until i feel its becoming more than just uncomfortable?


----------



## sidewalkdances

Completely up to you. No prizes for the bravest powerlifter though.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Completely up to you. No prizes for the bravest powerlifter though.


  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nice workouts there Doug and Sidewalkdances.

Loving the 170 and 185kg squats, thats very impressive raw. Cant wait to get up to that sort of weight.

This week off is killing me as I just want to hit the gym. Hopefully it will do me good and I can come back and hit some PRs


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice workouts there Doug and Sidewalkdances.
> 
> Loving the 170 and 185kg squats, thats very impressive raw. Cant wait to get up to that sort of weight.
> 
> This week off is killing me as I just want to hit the gym. Hopefully it will do me good and I can come back and hit some PRs


:thumb:

Keep to your week off mate, it will do you a lot of good :thumb:


----------



## impster

Hello again. Last night's workout:

Squats: 85.8kg (up another couple of kilos from last time)
Benchpress: 59kg (up from 54.6kg which I'd been sticking to for last couple of workouts after failing to improve on 56.8kg about 3 workouts ago)
Bent over Rows: 65.8kg (up from 63.6kg).

Squats are okay, bench is a bit wobbly/trembly, rows just seem to fly by.

Not sure what to do with my 'warm down' - is a warm down beneficial? Was doing 50 press ups and 50 chin ups (in alternating sets of 10 each) but not sure what benefit that actually is? If there is no benefit, it's hardly worth wasting energy on them - what do you all think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Hello again. Last night's workout:
> 
> Squats: 85.8kg (up another couple of kilos from last time)
> Benchpress: 59kg (up from 54.6kg which I'd been sticking to for last couple of workouts after failing to improve on 56.8kg about 3 workouts ago)
> Bent over Rows: 65.8kg (up from 63.6kg).
> 
> Squats are okay, bench is a bit wobbly/trembly, rows just seem to fly by.
> 
> Not sure what to do with my 'warm down' - is a warm down beneficial? Was doing 50 press ups and 50 chin ups (in alternating sets of 10 each) but not sure what benefit that actually is? If there is no benefit, it's hardly worth wasting energy on them - what do you all think.


i'm the last person you'd ask about warming up or down :lol:

Great results there impster onward & upward mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Impster - the sets of 10 pull ups are always a good idea - i'm considering adding them back in as a warm up. Never a bad thing to have extra upper back work. It's something we're all lacking!

I dont usually do a 'warm down' but my training is different to all of you doing SL or variants as my work tapers down so that I do lower intensity stuff towards the end of my sessions. 

Deadlifts tonight - sets of 8.

Had a massage last night, lots of tightness gone from the comp. Getting one a week I reckon as my sisters mate is a massage therapist (trainee) and likes massaging me as i'm so 'muscley'


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Had a massage last night, lots of tightness gone from the comp. Getting one a week I reckon as my sisters mate is a massage therapist (trainee) and likes massaging me as i'm so 'muscley'


So what your saying is youve got this chick massaging your stiff muscle :doublesho  :doublesho Play safe mate when your with her, make sure its a geared lift


----------



## sidewalkdances

Haha Doug, very good.


----------



## Oats

Not looking forward to tonight. Felt beat down and stiff for last two days. Kids waking up during the night didn't help.

Squat warmup a grind so went to the proverbial gun cupboard and wheeled out the double barreled shotgun: Guns and Roses Appetite for Destruction. BOOM!!

Squat 3x5 115kg (linear) - same as last workout to sort out my shoulder that was becoming a real issue. Realised it's not my wrists but I'm moving my arm or shoulder on the way up and consequently the bar seems to be compressing something. Really happy now I've realised what's going on as a seriously mashed arm that stopped me like 3 months ago seemed imminent.

Sh. Press 5x5 22.5 (vol) - technique made a solid step forward tonight.

Deadlift - 2x5 130kg (linear) - just as I was setting up my first pull Enter Shikari screamed '*these are such exciting times to be alive*' and that was like a bolt of raw energy. First set destroyed!

One of those nights that would have been easy to bail on but ended up being really productive.


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Not looking forward to tonight. Felt beat down and stiff for last two days. Kids waking up during the night didn't help.
> 
> Squat warmup a grind so went to the proverbial gun cupboard and wheeled out the double barreled shotgun: Guns and Roses Appetite for Destruction. BOOM!!
> 
> Squat 3x5 115kg (linear) - same as last workout to sort out my shoulder that was becoming a real issue. Realised it's not my wrists but I'm moving my arm or shoulder on the way up and consequently the bar seems to be compressing something. Really happy now I've realised what's going on as a seriously mashed arm that stopped me like 3 months ago seemed imminent.
> 
> Sh. Press 5x5 22.5 (vol) - technique made a solid step forward tonight.
> 
> Deadlift - 2x5 130kg (linear) - just as I was setting up my first pull Enter Shikari screamed '*these are such exciting times to be alive*' and that was like a bolt of raw energy. First set destroyed!
> 
> One of those nights that would have been easy to bail on but ended up being really productive.


N ice work Buddy these are the workouts that make all the difference. The gym/weightlifting is easy when everything is going right and you feel great, its the rest of the time that you have to dig deep and get out what you put in


----------



## sidewalkdances

When ever you want to stop - just push for one more. Whilst one more rep or one more set wont make an immediate difference, the ripple effect it creates going forward is very powerful.

My deadlift SUCKS!!!!

Worked up to 185x8, which is below my best rep effort and I was gassed. Then did 3x3 sumo with 190/195/200. Now sumo used to be my strong suit and it was my comp stance. Yesterday it felt slow as balls and lockout was brutally tough. Conventional felt a lot more natural and locked out easier.

I think this is going to be a worthwhile change for me. Much easier to get my hips through at the top and could use plenty of leg drive.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> When ever you want to stop - just push for one more. Whilst one more rep or one more set wont make an immediate difference, the ripple effect it creates going forward is very powerful.
> 
> My deadlift SUCKS!!!!
> 
> Worked up to 185x8, which is below my best rep effort and I was gassed. Then did 3x3 sumo with 190/195/200. Now sumo used to be my strong suit and it was my comp stance. Yesterday it felt slow as balls and lockout was brutally tough. Conventional felt a lot more natural and locked out easier.
> 
> I think this is going to be a worthwhile change for me. Much easier to get my hips through at the top and could use plenty of leg drive.


lol, now who's being hard on themselves 

185Kg for 8 reps thats mad as fook :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> ... its the rest of the time that you have to dig deep and get out what you put in


It has been a real life lesson on how disinclined you can be to lift for one reason or another, but then once you start the body takes over from the mind and the session pans out well.

A bad surprise has been how frickin hard it is to sort out bad technique without a coach or anyone else to comment. Recording sets is a poor substitute.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> It has been a real life lesson on how disinclined you can be to lift for one reason or another, but then once you start the body takes over from the mind and the session pans out well.
> 
> A bad surprise has been how frickin hard it is to sort out bad technique without a coach or anyone else to comment. Recording sets is a poor substitute.


One of the major downsides to training at home on your own, i use this thread for my motivation & information. Cant fault it at all :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> lol, now who's being hard on themselves
> 
> 185Kg for 8 reps thats mad as fook :devil: :thumb:


Nah man, its shocking. Even though reps aren't a focus of mine. It was more the 200x3 that felt terrible thats of the biggest concern. I just cant seem to get it licked. I've done 235x3 conventional, raw. So I think i'm going to stay back with conventional, even though I rarely ever train it.

My coach reckons that its to do with my size. Now i'm heavier I just cant get into the right position to perform sumo correctly.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Friday's workout

*Overhead press warm up sets: 20X3X3 - 30X3 - 40X2 - 50X1
Overhead Press work set: 62.5X3*

Boring but big
All below done with 60 or less seconds of rest between sets :thumb:

*Overhead Press 32.5X5X10
Pull-ups (overhand grip) 2-2-1-1-1*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday's Workout

*Deadlift Warm Up Sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
Deadlift Work Set: 172.5X5*

Boring But Big assistance work

*Deadlift: 100X5X10
Hanging Knee Raises: 5X10 *

Today's challenge, threads can be a bit boring with just loads of lists of numbers 










Anyone new to this thread, if i can do this at 43, anyone can, so go lift, weight training/powerlifting/bodybuilding are all great sports, helps you learn a lot about your true self, creates self-discipline & self-respect :thumb:

If your counting the disks & think ive go the weight wrong, the inner wheels are 25Kg disks :thumb:


----------



## impster

Good morning all.

Forgot to post my Friday night workout. Here it is:

Squat: 88.2kg (up from 85.8kgs)
Overhead Press: 48.2kg (not up at all, and can't seem to hit 50kgs???)
Deadlift: 90.4kgs (not up at all, because I need more weights!)

Didn't do a warmdown and I need to get back in the habit of doing some chin ups.

Impster.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Good morning all.
> 
> Forgot to post my Friday night workout. Here it is:
> 
> Squat: 88.2kg (up from 85.8kgs)
> Overhead Press: 48.2kg (not up at all, and can't seem to hit 50kgs???)
> Deadlift: 90.4kgs (not up at all, because I need more weights!)
> 
> Didn't do a warmdown and I need to get back in the habit of doing some chin ups.
> 
> Impster.


Nice weights Impy :thumb:

Dont worry about your overhead press, it will go up, keep lifting mate :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Today's challenge, threads can be a bit boring with just loads of lists of numbers


Judging by the gap from the line to the rack's feet, either the one I had built is a foot wider than normal or you're a foot wider than me...










*Saturday*
Squat 82.5 3x5 (linear 80%) - I'm pretty sure my shoulder is going to take a while to get it right because I couldn't sort it out even at 80%.

Bench 62.5 3x5 (light)

Power clean\ hang clean - technique still  Every single pull is with bent arms, and has been from the first pull I ever did. One day.....

Stuart McGill's 'Big 3'.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Saturday's Workout
> 
> *Deadlift Warm Up Sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> Deadlift Work Set: 172.5X5*
> 
> Boring But Big assistance work
> 
> *Deadlift: 100X5X10
> Hanging Knee Raises: 5X10 *
> 
> Today's challenge, threads can be a bit boring with just loads of lists of numbers
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone new to this thread, if i can do this at 43, anyone can, so go lift, weight training/powerlifting/bodybuilding are all great sports, helps you learn a lot about your true self, creates self-discipline & self-respect :thumb:
> 
> If your counting the disks & think ive go the weight wrong, the inner wheels are 25Kg disks :thumb:


Im pretty sure you have said in the past that you squat with a shoulder width stance.

Either you line the outside of your feet up with the tape or you have some seriously wide shoulders. I have taped up my rack so the inside of my heels are on the outside of the tape.

Oats not sure how wide your rack is but if you do the same as me your tape looks about right.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Judging by the gap from the line to the rack's feet, either the one I had built is a foot wider than normal or you're a foot wider than me...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Saturday*
> Squat 82.5 3x5 (linear 80%) - I'm pretty sure my shoulder is going to take a while to get it right because I couldn't sort it out even at 80%.
> 
> Bench 62.5 3x5 (light)
> 
> Power clean hang clean - technique still  Every single pull is with bent arms, and has been from the first pull I ever did. One day.....
> 
> Stuart McGill's 'Big 3'.





Bod42 said:


> Im pretty sure you have said in the past that you squat with a shoulder width stance.
> 
> Either you line the outside of your feet up with the tape or you have some seriously wide shoulders. I have taped up my rack so the inside of my heels are on the outside of the tape.
> 
> Oats not sure how wide your rack is but if you do the same as me your tape looks about right.


I'll measure the gap tonight :thumb: Whatever the gap, it feels just right :thumb:
I'll do a pic of my feet tonight too as my toes go out to the tape not my whole foot :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Hi chaps :wave:

I finally hit a long standing bench press goal on Saturday

140x5 - this is the first time I have managed to rep 140kg! I was very very happy when I came out of the gym. Didnt even need to psyche myself up. Just laid down and did it. Huge confidence builder for my bench press.

Squats tonight


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Hi chaps :wave:
> 
> I finally hit a long standing bench press goal on Saturday
> 
> 140x5 - this is the first time I have managed to rep 140kg! I was very very happy when I came out of the gym. Didnt even need to psyche myself up. Just laid down and did it. Huge confidence builder for my bench press.
> 
> Squats tonight


Very well done mate :devil:140KgX5!:devil: 
I would love to bench that, i bet you felt fooking epic mate :thumb: but think its further away from me than i expected  
Im still stuck on 110kg-112.5kg, im going to go back down to 110 if i fail to make 4 reps next bench session, then just hammer the 110 for a few weeks until it feels lighter :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ITHAQVA said:


>


Just noticed in this pic, you can see were my feet were in the chalk for the deadlift , thats just inside my shoulders to allow for proper form/technique, you can also see were my hands are to hold the bar (Shoulder width apart) so yes that picture/tape is correct as i squat with my toes pointing slightly outward :thumb:

I'll still check it out tonight & post pics of foot position ect.. :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Very well done mate :devil:140KgX5!:devil:
> I would love to bench that, i bet you felt fooking epic mate :thumb: but think its further away from me than i expected
> Im still stuck on 110kg-112.5kg, im going to go back down to 110 if i fail to make 4 reps next bench session, then just hammer the 110 for a few weeks until it feels lighter :thumb:


It has taken me around 15 months to move from 140x1 to being able to do reps with it. The closer you get to your natural limit, the slower the progress comes.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> It has taken me around 15 months to move from 140x1 to being able to do reps with it. The closer you get to your natural limit, the slower the progress comes.


I must admit the more I've got into this sport the more I accept that it will take more time than initially anticipated, I don't think I will get my 150Kg bench by Christmas, but I'm not worried. Dan, you said this would take some time to achieve  :thumb:

I'm now taking your advice & advice from the Wendler 5/3/1 PDF, if my bench is 110Kg for reps my next goal is 112.5Kg for reps, small steps for me from now on, I also think that half the fun is the journey, so why rush it, I love this sport & I'm very happy with my results so far :thumb:

Onward & upward :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

That's the way to look at it, why rush. 

I'm happy with small improvements from comp to comp - it's the only way you can really go after a while. Fortunately training consistently for a long time gives you the perspective to realise your squat will not go up 50kg a year, unless something is drastically wrong with your form/technique that can be fixed.

To add that much muscular strength takes a long time.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Squat Width: When i squat my toes just go over the blue tape, squat stance a little wider than my shoulders.

Distance inside tape: 64.5CM.

Screenshot from starting stenght showing how to get the correct squat position.










I used Mark Ripptoes vids to get my squat stance correct :thumb:

This one shows the technique I use: Hip drive! 






Hope this is of some help :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Squat Width: When i squat my toes just go over the blue tape, squat stance a little wider than my shoulders.


There's the foot difference then; mine is on my heels. I've got the DVD and find single frame advancing it pretty useful for figuring out this kind of thing (you're welcome to borrow it if you've not).

Squat (linear) - 96.25 3,4,4,3 Just couldn't move it tonight. Don't know why. Racked it when shoulder getting into trouble and added a 4th set to get to 15reps.

Sh. Press (intensity) - 51.75 2x3 
Sqeeeeeezed abs and glutes as suggested and noticed pelvis lifting up . No lower back ache for a change. Technique much imporved

Pull ups - 3x8 failed 9th @ 1 min rest. I tend to read the SS 3rd book between sets and have found a peach of a line: " Any lifter who bails out of the missed rep and leaves the spotters holding the bar needs to be beaten with a hammer"!


----------



## Bod42

Cheers for the info Doug, it looks like we all squat with a similar stance but just line it up with a different part of our feet.

I got the Mrs to measure my shoulder width and then marked it on the floor, it felt a tiny bit close so I moved my stance out 1" per side. 

Doug you have the same rack as me so try Squating with your toes touching the Rack, thats what I was doing the other week. Big mistake, serious groin stretch, moved my stance in and feel much better.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Juggernaut Program: 
First Day Bench Day:
4kg Chest Press Medicine Ball Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 70x10, 70x10, 7x10, 7x10, 7x13
Pendlay Rows: 55x5, 65x5, 72.5x8
Dips: Bodyweight 10,9,5,5,5

I really like starting with a Power move, Medicine Ball throws on Bench Press and Shoulder Press, Jumping on Squat day and Sled Dragging & sprinting on deadlift day. This should improve my fitness as well. The program also calls for hill sprints just like 5/3/1, a short hill day consisting of 30m hill and a long hill consisting of 80m hills, they will be a killer. I have moved to this program to get more athletic incase I start playing Rugby again.

The higher volume is definitely a shock to the system as even on a low weight of 70kg my triceps were out of energy by about the 8th rep. This week you stop 2-3 reps short of failure so 13 reps isnt to bad. I think my body will adapt quickly and I will get better at higher reps.

The 2nd exercise is done as per the 5/3/1 scheme but its still an assistant exercise so no point smashing yourself into the floor.

Dips felt good but my triceps were already exhausted from Bench so the short rest periods really took its toll on my numbers.

All in all feels like a nice workout and doing one main exercise per workout just feels so much better.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Nice one guys, looks like we do squat roughly the same, my stance is just a tad wider than my shoulders, the missus measured then from my back with a metal tape measure  , my shoulders are approx. 54CM -55CM wide, so no I’m not a foot wider than you guys lol, just an average guy :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Juggernaut Program:
> First Day Bench Day:
> 4kg Chest Press Medicine Ball Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 70x10, 70x10, 7x10, 7x10, 7x13
> Pendlay Rows: 55x5, 65x5, 72.5x8
> Dips: Bodyweight 10,9,5,5,5
> 
> I really like starting with a Power move, Medicine Ball throws on Bench Press and Shoulder Press, Jumping on Squat day and Sled Dragging & sprinting on deadlift day. This should improve my fitness as well. The program also calls for hill sprints just like 5/3/1, a short hill day consisting of 30m hill and a long hill consisting of 80m hills, they will be a killer. I have moved to this program to get more athletic incase I start playing Rugby again.
> 
> The higher volume is definitely a shock to the system as even on a low weight of 70kg my triceps were out of energy by about the 8th rep. This week you stop 2-3 reps short of failure so 13 reps isnt to bad. I think my body will adapt quickly and I will get better at higher reps.
> 
> The 2nd exercise is done as per the 5/3/1 scheme but its still an assistant exercise so no point smashing yourself into the floor.
> 
> Dips felt good but my triceps were already exhausted from Bench so the short rest periods really took its toll on my numbers.
> 
> All in all feels like a nice workout and doing one main exercise per workout just feels so much better.


That routine reminds me of a bodybuilding routine, i imagine you'll pack on some muscle in using those rep ranges mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> There's the foot difference then; mine is on my heels. I've got the DVD and find single frame advancing it pretty useful for figuring out this kind of thing (you're welcome to borrow it if you've not).
> 
> Squat (linear) - 96.25 3,4,4,3 Just couldn't move it tonight. Don't know why. Racked it when shoulder getting into trouble and added a 4th set to get to 15reps.
> 
> Sh. Press (intensity) - 51.75 2x3
> Sqeeeeeezed abs and glutes as suggested and noticed pelvis lifting up . No lower back ache for a change. Technique much imporved
> 
> Pull ups - 3x8 failed 9th @ 1 min rest. I tend to read the SS 3rd book between sets and have found a peach of a line: " Any lifter who bails out of the missed rep and leaves the spotters holding the bar needs to be beaten with a hammer"!


Dont knock yourself mate those weights are good.

Im assuming your a low bar squater like me if you get shoulders issues, have you tried the shoulder flexibility routines, they may help you mate :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I squatted too last night

Lots of warm ups up to 145x5 (beltless) then popped a belt on for
165x6
175x6
185x6
200x6

I decided to push on and hit the 200kg for reps. Could have p*ssied out and done 190 or 195 (185 felt hard) but a few hits of nose tork and some shouting and I got it done

Assistance was leg press 300x35x2 (yes, thirty five reps :lol: ), leg extention (was mean to be lunges but I couldnt stand up) and 3x45s planks.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Pendlay Rows: 55x5, 65x5, 72.5x8
> 
> ... even on a low weight of 70kg my triceps were out of energy by about the 8th rep.


I though you were saying you weighed 70kg and had done 5 sets of 55 reps. Thought I still hadn't got the hang of reading reps and sets, but then along comes the routine that time forgot..... :doublesho



sidewalkdances said:


> Assistance was leg press 300x35x2 (yes, thirty five reps :lol: )


----------



## sidewalkdances

Nothing will put mass on your legs quicker than high rep squats and leg press.


----------



## Guest

Lots of activity in my absence. Better get back to it


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Excellent!*

Tuesday morning workout.

*Bench Press Warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1
Bench press work set: 110X5 :doublesho WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *Last week I tried 112.5 & only got 2 sets of 2 reps, this week I go down to 110 to dominate & it bloody felt too easy, just bashed out 5 reps as though it was a warm up set. God my body is really weird lol! 

*Bench Press: 65X5X10 (1-2 minutes max rest between sets)*
*Dips: 1X6 *reps, had to finish up early to go out, can't believe the dips were that easy after all the bench work :thumb: really wanted to do more sets though   My triceps felt like they wanted to explode :devil:

Just one of those workout were it all went my way, felt bloody awesome all day, so after doing my chores I went for a two hour coastal walk, now I'm shagged out lol!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> That routine reminds me of a bodybuilding routine, i imagine you'll pack on some muscle in using those rep ranges mate :thumb:


Its the routine Chad Wesley Smith used to get his 800lb squat and uses with all his athletes so I'm hoping for mainly strength gains but a little big extra size never hurts. Wendler & CWS have results showing you can get stronger using the rep method so hopefully thats the case.

I know I'm only 1 workout in but I like training 1 main exercise per session so much more. You go to the gym knowing you havent got to smash yourself with squats before doing anything else, its a nice break.

The program is 4 months long and the reps decrease each month, 10, 8, 5, 3 so the final month you should be lifting some good weight, hopefully


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I know I'm only 1 workout in but I like training 1 main exercise per session so much more. You go to the gym knowing you havent got to smash yourself with squats before doing anything else, its a nice break.


Agreed mate, I find going in & training one bodypart per session so much better for focus :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I squatted too last night
> 
> Lots of warm ups up to 145x5 (beltless) then popped a belt on for
> 165x6
> 175x6
> 185x6
> 200x6
> 
> I decided to push on and hit the 200kg for reps. Could have p*ssied out and done 190 or 195 (185 felt hard) but a few hits of nose tork and some shouting and I got it done
> 
> Assistance was leg press 300x35x2 (yes, thirty five reps :lol: ), leg extention (was mean to be lunges but I couldnt stand up) and 3x45s planks.


Holy  Dan, thats one hell of a workout :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Cheers Doug

I benched last night as i'm down in Newquay for the weekend. Had to do floor presses, worked up to 130x6 then added the slingshot (www.howmuchyabench.net) for a set of 140x6. Very happy with that. Moved on to close grips. Did 100x10x2 and 100x5 - i shut down the third set on 5 reps as my shoulder was hurting. I'm starting to get a bit of grief from my rotator cuff and my ROM is very limited. About half that of my right arm.

Other assistance was lying band flys, wide grip push downs (used the lat pull down bar) and DB skullcrushers. These didnt bother my elbows for once which is a good sign.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Cheers Doug
> 
> I benched last night as i'm down in Newquay for the weekend. Had to do floor presses, worked up to 130x6 then added the slingshot (www.howmuchyabench.net) for a set of 140x6. Very happy with that. Moved on to close grips. Did 100x10x2 and 100x5 - i shut down the third set on 5 reps as my shoulder was hurting. I'm starting to get a bit of grief from my rotator cuff and my ROM is very limited. About half that of my right arm.
> 
> Other assistance was lying band flys, wide grip push downs (used the lat pull down bar) and DB skullcrushers. These didnt bother my elbows for once which is a good sign.


:thumb: Dont get too drunk


----------



## sidewalkdances

Trying not to drink for 2 reasons - 1) I'm a bit skint. 2) It'll wreck my training when I come back!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Trying not to drink for 2 reasons - 1) I'm a bit skint. 2) It'll wreck my training when I come back!


Glad to hear it mate, dehydration is so bad for the muscles  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
75% x 6 sets of 3 jumps - 18 Total
Box Squats: 85kg x 10 reps x 4 sets, 87.5kg x 13 reps
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 65kg x 5, 75kg x 5, 85kg x 5
Bulgarian Goblet Split Squats: 5kg x 6 reps x 3 sets.
Ab Work: 5 sets

What an absolute killer squats were, I could have got more reps but this phase you stop 2-3 reps short. Its such a strange feeling, you unrack the weigth thinking WTF as its so light but then once you get to 7-8 reps unusual muscles start to really burn. With 5 reps you are grinding the reps up when you get near your limit but I find alot of high rep work is mental, you can grind the weight up but its if you can take the burning.

First time I have ever done snatch grip deadlifts. Puts you lower so it makes the exercise harder.

Its been along time since I done any single leg work so these really kicked my **** but I know the value of single leg work especially in sport.

Still feeling good about this workout but I been doing 5 reps for quite a few months now so 10+ reps is a real killer and the weight goes up fast. Next week I will be doing 100kg x 10+ and then the following week I need to do 110kg x 15+ so its going to be hard.

P.S. You cannot go to Newquay and not drink, its just not right.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Glad to hear it mate, dehydration is so bad for the muscles  :thumb:


But its so good for the mind and opposite sex :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I imagine I will find time for a few sherberts. Dont want to spend the entire weekend in a stupor though!

Deads tonight before I go!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursday workout

*Squat Warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat Work set: 172.5KgX5 :thumb: *

leaving out assitance work this week as im right out of sync due to family visiting, so im working out 3 days in a row - tonight, friday & saturday:thumb: :devil:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Holy  Dan, thats one hell of a workout :thumb:


It was. 25,350kg of a workout. Or the equivalent of my next 14.69 squat sessions. Or 7 weeks worth in one go. :lol:

*Thursday*
Squat (linear) 116kg 3x4  Knew I wouldn't make the fifth rep so switched to 4s. Looks like I'm stalling at exactly the same point where I was at Christmas when my back went. Really thought I'd get 100kg on the bar comfortably, when it was at 95kg and now it's gone pear shaped. Thinking hat on before next heavy set on Monday.

Bench (vol) 65kg 5x5 Good. Not sure about this originally but I think I can see how volume day is linking in to intensity day now.

Deadlift (linear) 132.5kg 2x5 Asked on SS programming section about rest between reps. Official answer is a reset is required. Shame as strength and grip seemed to be moving along with the weight.

Side note - Weighed myself at weekend and I've lost 4kg since Christmas (down to 85kg. Was 75kg at the start of SS). It's a standing joke how much I eat at work, but it looks like it's still not enough. Time to revisit the milk...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> It was. 25,350kg of a workout. Or the equivalent of my next 14.69 squat sessions. Or 7 weeks worth in one go. :lol:
> 
> *Thursday*
> Squat (linear) 116kg 3x4  Knew I wouldn't make the fifth rep so switched to 4s. Looks like I'm stalling at exactly the same point where I was at Christmas when my back went. Really thought I'd get 100kg on the bar comfortably, when it was at 95kg and now it's gone pear shaped. Thinking hat on before next heavy set on Monday.
> 
> Bench (vol) 65kg 5x5 Good. Not sure about this originally but I think I can see how volume day is linking in to intensity day now.
> 
> Deadlift (linear) 132.5kg 2x5 Asked on SS programming section about rest between reps. Official answer is a reset is required. Shame as strength and grip seemed to be moving along with the weight.
> 
> Side note - Weighed myself at weekend and I've lost 4kg since Christmas (down to 85kg. Was 75kg at the start of SS). It's a standing joke how much I eat at work, but it looks like it's still not enough. Time to revisit the milk...


Oats,
Have you considered doing a 4 day routine Squat,bench & deadlift on one day is a lot.

Rest between reps, i think the guys on here go up to 7-9 minutes on heavy work sets.

I take about 3-4 minutes rest after all my warm up sets before doing my work set.

We are all learning mate, ive only been doing this powerlifting thing since October


----------



## ITHAQVA

fridays workout.

Felt very tired today so lowered the work set weigth  

*Overhead press warm up sets: 20X3X3 - 30X3 - 40X2 - 50X1

Work set: 60X1 - 50X5*

Boring but big assistance work

*Overhead press: 30X5X10
Overhand pull-ups: 2-2-2-1-1*

Crap workout, but a workout is a lot better than no workout at all :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday workout:
Got home and a few moments later the electric went out on the entire grip. Did this stop me working out, hell no, I just lifted by candle light. That's 1 thing i never done b4.

Seated should press: 35kg x 4sets x 10reps. 35kg x 1set x 13hours reps.
Dips: Bodyweight, 5,5,10
Neutral grip chins 5sets

Pretty good workout all in all and i like having shoulders on a Friday as I'm hardly sore 2day and that way it doesn't effect my golf.

Oats with regards 2rest it depends what your goal is, I read on starting strength that they rest up to 7mins for strength training but right now I'm resting 3mins on squats and deadlifts, 2:30 for bench and shoulder press and then 1:30 for all assistant work. This isn't for pure strength I'm trying to get stronger as well as bring my fitness up


----------



## ITHAQVA

Might not workout today, Dan (Sidewalkdances) is coming all the way from London to beat the hose pipe ban & wash his car at my place (Cornwall)   :detailer:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi Dan (Sidwalkdances) the vids on here don't do you justice, i couldn't believe it when you got out of ya car, you're built like a fookin house! :doublesho Was great to meet you, anytime you are in Cornwall you're always very welcome to pop in :thumb:

Sunday's workout

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift work set: 175KgX5 that's a PR for me* :thumb:

Boring but big assistance work

*Deadlift: 100X5X10 :devil:
Hanging knee raises: 5X10*

Excellent result on my deadlift today, this means next week's work set/5 rep goal is 177.5Kg :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Dan (Sidwalkdances) the vids on here don't do you justice, i couldn't believe it when you got out of ya car, you're built like a fookin house! :doublesho Was great to meet you, anytime you are in Cornwall you're always very welcome to pop in :thumb:
> 
> Sunday's workout
> 
> *Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> Deadlift work set: 175KgX5 that's a PR for me* :thumb:
> 
> Boring but big assistance work
> 
> *Deadlift: 100X5X10 :devil:
> Hanging knee raises: 5X10*
> 
> Excellent result on my deadlift today, this means next week's work set/5 rep goal is 177.5Kg :thumb:


Videos never do people justice. I always look at the pics of Chad Wesley Smith and think he looks pretty normal as he's in proportion but he's like 310lb, thats stupidly big.

175kg nice workout Doug, your be hitting that 200kg before you know it. Cant wait to get back to lifting the heavy weights and smash some PRs, this rep workout is weird as every workout is a PR as I never repped weights for as many reps as possible before.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Videos never do people justice. I always look at the pics of Chad Wesley Smith and think he looks pretty normal as he's in proportion but he's like 310lb, thats stupidly big.
> 
> 175kg nice workout Doug:thumb::thumb::thumb: *thanks mate*, your be hitting that 200kg before you know it. Cant wait to get back to lifting the heavy weights and smash some PRs, this rep workout is weird as every workout is a PR as I never repped weights for as many reps as possible before.


I hope so James, i really want 200kg for my Squat & deadlift asap , i can then concentrate on getting my bench up to something a litte more respectable :thumb:

The whole workout felt good, was really pleased 

Must be weird doing high rep stuff, although I'm doing 2X5 sets of 10 reps as per "boring but big", it feels right as it's done after the heavy work set.

Just think of the extra fitness you'll get from the juggernaut method & that at least you're lifting & packing on muscle mass ready for your next heavy phase :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Sled Dragging Sprints: 32.5kg x 6 reps x 15 yards. 45 seconds rest.
Deadlifts: 100kg x 4sets x 10reps, 100kg x 1sets x 11reps
Front Squats: 65kg x 5, 75kg x 5, 85kg x 5
Weighted Ab Work

The first few sets of Deadlifts felt great but 3 mins rest combined with 10 reps sets is a killer when you been doing 5 rep sets with 5 mins rest. They def hit muscles that I'm not used to feeling during Deadlifting.

Front squats were so much harder than I thought they would be. I have full respect for anyone who deadlifts and then front squats as my abs, lower back, core, etc were screming at me even at a light weight.



ITHAQVA said:


> I hope so James, i really want 200kg for my Squat & deadlift asap , i can then concentrate on getting my bench up to something a litte more respectable :thumb:
> 
> The whole workout felt good, was really pleased
> 
> Must be weird doing high rep stuff, although I'm doing 2X5 sets of 10 reps as per "boring but big", it feels right as it's done after the heavy work set.
> 
> Just think of the extra fitness you'll get from the juggernaut method & that at least you're lifting & packing on muscle mass ready for your next heavy phase :thumb:


Ya I really want a 200kg Squat and Deadlift that is like the holy grail for me.

The boring but big looks really good and I will do it soon but its slightly different as your just using it for volume really as you have doen your hard sets where as I'm doing rep PRs for my main sets. Very similar to 5/3/1 but higher reps.

The lower rest times and sprint work will def improve my fitness and the higher rep stuff will probably put on some size. The last 2 months of Juggernaut are 5 and 3 reps so that will be some heavy work.


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Oats,
> Have you considered doing a 4 day routine Squat,bench & deadlift on one day is a lot.
> 
> Rest between reps, i think the guys on here go up to 7-9 minutes on heavy work sets.


I allow 5-10 mins between sets but can't see how I could fit in four days a week. But you're right - felt stiff next day after squat,bench,deadlift.

Been at the inlaws for a couple of days so reckon I must have put on a kilo in bodyweight through cake alone

Took the time to look back at my log and it's worse than I thought. Powerack delivered last May. Squatting 95kg in August. So that makes it 20kg added in 9 months :doublesho Entries like "Lower back a mess, leg cramping up constantly" and "Back's gone, stiff, shooting pains down leg" seem to then lead to a couple of months resetting and building up. Going to try to find time during work day to get a few coaching sessions in. There isn't anyone obvious to go to though. Judging by some lads at work who are trying to train prior to their weddings there's some crap trainers out there. They look exactly the same as six months ago. Wife wasn't too encouraging about me going to Texas for a week (might start to pester - seems to work for the kids ). A few ex-rugby league players seem best bet. Unless I get giddy and book some sessions with Andy Bolton as the gym he uses is 15 minutes down the road. Kinda feel that that it would be like going to PebbleBeach with a chamois leather, bucket of fairy liquid, and DemonShine and saying 'Lets be having you then....'.

Saturday 
Squat 85kg (80% linear) 2x5
Shoulder press 42.5kg (light) 3x5
Chins max 7,5

Monday - jacked off after last couple of days sessions. Wasn't going to squat at all but then whilst warming up decide to go for it before the inevitable reset and get over the 100kg on the bar barrier....
Squat 110x1, 115x1, 120x1, 125x1 
Bench 73.5kg 1x5 - just.

Downloaded new version of Kinovea freeware that I use to check my powercleans by single frame advances and it now does dual screen. Might be useful for anyone else who records their's to review. e.g 120kg squat:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I allow 5-10 mins between sets but can't see how I could fit in four days a week. But you're right - felt stiff next day after squat,bench,deadlift.
> 
> Been at the inlaws for a couple of days so reckon I must have put on a kilo in bodyweight through cake alone
> 
> Took the time to look back at my log and it's worse than I thought. Powerack delivered last May. Squatting 95kg in August. So that makes it 20kg added in 9 months :doublesho Entries like "Lower back a mess, leg cramping up constantly" and "Back's gone, stiff, shooting pains down leg" seem to then lead to a couple of months resetting and building up. Going to try to find time during work day to get a few coaching sessions in. There isn't anyone obvious to go to though. Judging by some lads at work who are trying to train prior to their weddings there's some crap trainers out there. They look exactly the same as six months ago. Wife wasn't too encouraging about me going to Texas for a week (might start to pester - seems to work for the kids ). A few ex-rugby league players seem best bet. Unless I get giddy and book some sessions with Andy Bolton as the gym he uses is 15 minutes down the road. Kinda feel that that it would be like going to PebbleBeach with a chamois leather, bucket of fairy liquid, and DemonShine and saying 'Lets be having you then....'.
> 
> Saturday
> Squat 85kg (80% linear) 2x5
> Shoulder press 42.5kg (light) 3x5
> Chins max 7,5
> 
> Monday - jacked off after last couple of days sessions. Wasn't going to squat at all but then whilst warming up decide to go for it before the inevitable reset and get over the 100kg on the bar barrier....
> Squat 110x1, 115x1, 120x1, 125x1
> Bench 73.5kg 1x5 - just.
> 
> Downloaded new version of Kinovea freeware that I use to check my powercleans by single frame advances and it now does dual screen. Might be useful for anyone else who records their's to review. e.g 120kg squat:


I have had no coaching except watching videos on YouTube (Mark Ripptoe & loads of stuff from EliteFTS,Wendler/dave tate etc..) Also had some great support & advice from a few of the guys on this thread. If an old guy like me can do it, you can :thumb:

Squat 110x1, 115x1, 120x1, 125x1 am I reading this right 4 sets of 1 rep :doublesho If so I would take a step way back mate, find a weight that allows a good 5 clear reps.

I find resting around 5-7 minutes is enough; otherwise the workout can get boring just sitting there :tumbleweed:

Questions
Do you have any medical conditions that re causing the issues explained in you above post?
What workout routine are you following, is it starting strength?
What are your immediate & future goals?
What do you want to get out of powerlifting?

If you can't do a 4 day routine, how about a 3 day routine as prescribed in Wendlers 5/3/1? Basically it's a 4 day routine but spread into the second week. I think this would give you a much better focus on each lift & would be very beneficial to you :thumb:

It's an uphill struggle mate; I've only been doing this since last October, but I now love the powerlifting journey :devil: :thumb:

Good form vid mate :thumb::thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Woohooo!*

Tuesday workout

*Bench Press warm up sets: 40 X3 X3 - 60 X3 - 80 X3 - 100 X1

Bench Press work set: 112.5Kg X 4 yes!!!!!!*:thumb::thumb:

Boring but big assistance work

*Bench Press: 67.5 X 5 X 10

Dips 5,3 triceps totally mashed lol.*

Excellent result on the bench, a PR for me, nearly got 5 reps but let the air out of my chest a bit too soon , never mind, a fine result for the old man  :thumb:

Getting more realistic about my bench goal for this year & I'm going to aim for small mini goals rather than get to preoccupied about the 150Kg goal, small steps :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The boring but big looks really good and I will do it soon but its slightly different as *your just using it for volume really *as you have doen your hard sets where as I'm doing rep PRs for my main sets. Very similar to 5/3/1 but higher reps.


Hi James, I've just started to add weight to the boring but big exercises (Progressive overload) so that these movments will become much more difficult, ill keep adding 2.5kg as long as i can still keep reaching 5 sets of 10reps :devil: :thumb:

One thing that is great about boring but big is that you get a chance to practice your technique with the assistance work, i think this is one of its secrets as doing the bench press once per week isnt enough, im already finding my lifts have improved mainly due to the extra practice im getting doing 5 sets of 10 after the work set :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Hi Guys :wave:

Doug: Great to meet you at the weekend, I had yesterday off as well from work - very tired indeed. Doug's got a great little set up, his power rack is better than the one at my gym! And he's proof that all you need to get strong is a bar and a ton of plates.

Thanks again for letting me wash the car - it definitely needed it! 

I trained last night

Speed Squats (to parallel box) 125x3x3 and 130x3x2 - I was hanging anyway, just very tired. So I should really have used about 50% of my geared squat (330/2 = 165) but tbh I just didnt have the energy. Also moved my hands right out to the collars - felt much more upright, but its only a light weight.

Ultra Wide Sumo Deads - 145x10x3 - Weight wasn't hard, I jut have zero endurance in my hips! I used a double over hand for all the sets too, just to try something new.

Leg Press - this is where it got stupid 400kg x30 x2 - i nearly threw up.

Leg Extension - some weight x20 x2 - i dont care what the weight is on leg extensions. Just used a decent weight that made 20 reps hard.

Plank 2x 1 min.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Hi Guys :wave:
> 
> Doug: Great to meet you at the weekend, I had yesterday off as well from work - very tired indeed. Doug's got a great little set up, his power rack is better than the one at my gym! And he's proof that all you need to get strong is a bar and a ton of plates.
> 
> Thanks again for letting me wash the car - it definitely needed it!
> 
> I trained last night
> 
> Speed Squats (to parallel box) 125x3x3 and 130x3x2 - I was hanging anyway, just very tired. So I should really have used about 50% of my geared squat (330/2 = 165) but tbh I just didnt have the energy. Also moved my hands right out to the collars - felt much more upright, but its only a light weight.
> 
> Ultra Wide Sumo Deads - 145x10x3 - Weight wasn't hard, I jut have zero endurance in my hips! I used a double over hand for all the sets too, just to try something new.
> 
> Leg Press - this is where it got stupid 400kg x30 x2 - i nearly threw up.
> 
> Leg Extension - some weight x20 x2 - i dont care what the weight is on leg extensions. Just used a decent weight that made 20 reps hard.
> 
> Plank 2x 1 min.


Thanks Dan :thumb:

The Karcher is always here if Thames water think they are going to stop you washing your car :thumb:


----------



## impster

Evenin all. Sorry, but missed another week due to work commitments and the small matter of helping a family member becoming a county councillor - including going to the 'count' and staying up all night waiting for the result and partaking in a few single malts afterwards. 

Anyway, it's all settled down now, and I've recovered from losing a whole nights sleep (not easy with 3 kids).

So, tonight's workout:

Squats: Still friendly with 5x5 of 88.2kgs as I've no more weights that will fit securely onto the bar.

O/h press: Managed to hit 50kgs tonight. Been stuck on 48.2kg for a while. Managed 5x3 on 50kgs so I'm chuffed to bits at that.

Deadlift: Managed to do 1x5 of 93.4kgs, which meant putting on a couple of weights at the end of the bar with no clips holding them on.

Finished with 20x push ups and 20xchin ups which felt enough to me.

Question - where does this all stop? Do I just go on and on, or would I be ok to stick with the existing weights for a while? I need to ease off a bit I think as I'm getting to the stage where any more weights will be a big struggle. If I spent say, a month sticking to these weights, and then start adding again, would that be better? 

Certainly, I've felt the weights a lot easier after missing a few sessions.

What about doing some lower weight with higher reps? Or is that something completelly diferent?

Your advice, as usual, greatly appreciated and (usually) followed.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Evenin all. Sorry, but missed another week due to work commitments and the small matter of helping a family member becoming a county councillor - including going to the 'count' and staying up all night waiting for the result and partaking in a few single malts afterwards.
> 
> Anyway, it's all settled down now, and I've recovered from losing a whole nights sleep (not easy with 3 kids).
> 
> So, tonight's workout:
> 
> Squats: Still friendly with 5x5 of 88.2kgs as I've no more weights that will fit securely onto the bar.
> 
> O/h press: Managed to hit 50kgs tonight. Been stuck on 48.2kg for a while. Managed 5x3 on 50kgs so I'm chuffed to bits at that.
> 
> Deadlift: Managed to do 1x5 of 93.4kgs, which meant putting on a couple of weights at the end of the bar with no clips holding them on.
> 
> Finished with 20x push ups and 20xchin ups which felt enough to me.
> 
> *Question - where does this all stop*? Do I just go on and on, or would I be ok to stick with the existing weights for a while? I need to ease off a bit I think as I'm getting to the stage where any more weights will be a big struggle. If I spent say, a month sticking to these weights, and then start adding again, would that be better?
> 
> Certainly, I've felt the weights a lot easier after missing a few sessions.
> 
> What about doing some lower weight with higher reps? Or is that something completelly diferent?
> 
> Your advice, as usual, greatly appreciated and (usually) followed.


This is your journey impster, it's up to you to decide what YOU want out of it, this will dictate HOW you train if you wish to make this a permanent part of your new healthy lifestyle, perhaps not the answer you wanted but it's the simplest I can give.
Continuously lifting heavier & heavier is not for everyone. But if you do you will be a member of a very small elite community of people :thumb::thumb:

I will give you me as an example of what I want to do to help you decide mate, i want to reach my 3 main lift goals (230kg single lifts squat & deadlift, 150kg single lift bench press) ill then stay at those weights for a month or so while i reduce my body fat, then I will keep lifting heavier & heavier, for me i love the challenge of lifting more & more weight, powerlifting is a constant challenge, makes me feel so alive & vital :thumb:

You may want to go down the bodybuilding/weight training route with lighter weights & more volume; you may want to incorporate aerobic activity with the weights. The humble barbell can give you everything you want mate.

Tell us what you want out of the sport & we will be able to give you an answer in regards to how you train.

:devil::devil:My chosen journey is POWERLIFTING, it's going to be bloody hard & there's no reward at the end except for the self-respect you gain by meeting each challenge head on & beating them. Anyone fancy tagging along?:devil::devil:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> I have had no coaching except watching videos on YouTube (Mark Ripptoe & loads of stuff from EliteFTS,Wendler/dave tate etc..) Also had some great support & advice from a few of the guys on this thread. If an old guy like me can do it, you can


Less of the 'old' - you needn't think that I'm that far behind you!  I've just got the Starting Strength book, DVD, practical programming and Stuart Mcgill book. I don't look at much else because i think it'll just confuse what should, at this stage, be a pretty simple setup.



> am I reading this right 4 sets of 1 rep :doublesho If so I would take a step way back mate, find a weight that allows a good 5 clear reps.


That's why I ended up doing the singles. I know I'm going to have to reset and just wanted to exercise the demon of 100kg on the bar. Now it is, I can get on with more senseible programming. What that is I don't know. My riddle to solve over the coming week.



> Questions
> Do you have any medical conditions that re causing the issues explained in you above post?


Yep, L5\S1 disc bulge couple of years ago. Lost all feeling in my leg mid thigh down and calf cramped up solid. Three months off work, another three part time. Couldn't do a glute bridge for a long time and only recently been able to lift myself onto my tiptoes. Subsequently read Stuart McGills book on lower back where he talks about squatting and that led me on to Starting Strength. Kind of a kill or cure decision. Mostly it's a cure but sometimes it's a killer!



> What workout routine are you following, is it starting strength?


Yes. Post christmas start up I decide to add in the 80% because I think I need the light days to recover and diddle with technique. On uppper body I'm trying a Texas method style split after a couple of stalls.



> What are your immediate & future goals?
> What do you want to get out of powerlifting?


My immediate goal is to figure out why I'm stalling when all the info suggest I shouldn't for another 50kg. I'm coming to the conclusion this week that I won't know why but just am. Maybe it's been too long on linear progression regardless of the weight lifted.

No powerlifting goals. Initial thoughts around lifts in bodyweight multiples and then start Oly lifting in the summer (national team and local club is down the road at the university so thought summer would be a good quiet time to start). Now I think I'll roll it on a year. At our age they all blend in to one anyway:lol:



> If you can't do a 4 day routine, how about a 3 day routine as prescribed in Wendlers 5/3/1?


I need to have a read of Practical Programming again and decide. No idea what 5/3/1 is but will look it up. I've got seven hours on trains next week going to Bristol so need some reading material to break up watching the Soprano's box set. 



> It's an uphill struggle mate; I've only been doing this since last October, but I now love the powerlifting journey :devil: :thumb:


It is; would it be rewarding if it wasn't? I'm posting here to reassure others that no matter how badly they're doing there's always someone worse, and since I'm not quitting they certainly can't either! As with other things, the harder it is the more stubborn I get about overcoming it.



> Good form vid mate


I just thought the software might be of use to others. It certianly helps me. For example from that video I think it's clear I need to sort out my knees moving back as it's killing my drive up.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Bench Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x5, 77.5x10x2, 77.5x13
Pendlay Rows: 60x3, 67.5x3, 77.5x6
Dips: 5 sets of 7 reps (easy)

I was pleased with my overall progress this week as I was up at 4:30am to catch a flight to a meeting and on Bench Press I did 7.5kg more than last week for the same amount of reps so I'm either getting stronger or my body is getting better at higher reps.

Pendlay rows felt really good.

Dips always feel good and I kept these pretty low rep. Next bench session is everything I got so I will smash my dips then.



ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James, I've just started to add weight to the boring but big exercises (Progressive overload) so that these movments will become much more difficult, ill keep adding 2.5kg as long as i can still keep reaching 5 sets of 10reps :devil: :thumb:
> 
> One thing that is great about boring but big is that you get a chance to practice your technique with the assistance work, i think this is one of its secrets as doing the bench press once per week isnt enough, im already finding my lifts have improved mainly due to the extra practice im getting doing 5 sets of 10 after the work set :thumb:


Doug, it wasn't a criticism buddy, was just saying from Wendler point of view they are to get more volume in but with the Juggernaut System you take the last set to absolute failure in the last set so you give it everthing you got. Its a weird feeling going for all out reps for high reps as I'm used to grinding the weight out slowly but its the lactic acid that kills you on higher reps but the pump is quite cool.

A good side note is that the Mrs already thinks I look bigger. Strength going up and getting bigger, RESULT


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Bench Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x5, 77.5x5x2, 77.5x13
> Pendlay Rows: 60x3, 67.5x3, 77.5x6
> Dips: 5 sets of 7 reps (easy)
> 
> I was pleased with my overall progress this week as I was up at 4:30am to catch a flight to a meeting and on Bench Press I did 7.5kg more than last week for the same amount of reps so I'm either getting stronger or my body is getting better at higher reps.
> 
> Pendlay rows felt really good.
> 
> Dips always feel good and I kept these pretty low rep. Next bench session is everything I got so I will smash my dips then.
> 
> Doug, it wasn't a criticism buddy, was just saying from Wendler point of view they are to get more volume in but with the Juggernaut System you take the last set to absolute failure in the last set so you give it everthing you got. Its a weird feeling going for all out reps for high reps as I'm used to grinding the weight out slowly but its the lactic acid that kills you on higher reps but the pump is quite cool.
> 
> A good side note is that the Mrs already thinks I look bigger. Strength going up and getting bigger, RESULT


All those reps :doublesho 

No worries James, didn't take it as criticism mate, was just updating you on a different approach of the BBB (You know i like to break the rules ), i think Wendler says you can do whatever you like with the assistance stuff. I'm trying my utmost to stay away from "I'm doing Jack shiit" as my assistance routine 

Glad you're getting some good results buddy, you never know you may have found the workout that really suites you & you get some fine weights in :thumb:

Here's to beating those sticking points :thumb:


----------



## impster

ITHAQVA said:


> This is your journey impster, it's up to you to decide what YOU want out of it, this will dictate HOW you train if you wish to make this a permanent part of your new healthy lifestyle, perhaps not the answer you wanted but it's the simplest I can give.
> Continuously lifting heavier & heavier is not for everyone. But if you do you will be a member of a very small elite community of people :thumb::thumb:
> 
> I will give you me as an example of what I want to do to help you decide mate, i want to reach my 3 main lift goals (230kg single lifts squat & deadlift, 150kg single lift bench press) ill then stay at those weights for a month or so while i reduce my body fat, then I will keep lifting heavier & heavier, for me i love the challenge of lifting more & more weight, powerlifting is a constant challenge, makes me feel so alive & vital :thumb:
> 
> You may want to go down the bodybuilding/weight training route with lighter weights & more volume; you may want to incorporate aerobic activity with the weights. The humble barbell can give you everything you want mate.
> 
> Tell us what you want out of the sport & we will be able to give you an answer in regards to how you train.


I think my goal now is pretty much what it was when I first asked for advice on here back in February (LINK TO THREAD!!!) - to look and feel healthier and stronger and have a bit more self confidence. I wish I'd taken photos of myself before i started as there's a real diference in muscle tone, especially upper body (which is what I wanted).

I do like the idea of hitting PBs and increasing the weights I can lift, but I'm starting to feel that I'm reaching some sort of a limit and that my body needs to get used to these weights that I'm currently at.

When I strarted on 20th February I had an old bench with 27kgs of vinyl weights. That first workout was a bit of a revelation - after finishing I was trembling - must have shocked my body a bit! Anyway, I added between 2.5 and 5kgs a time and found that as I went on, it became easier both physically and mentally. However, I'm now at a point where mentally I'm keen, but physically it's getting tougher. Here's a 'then and now' comparison:

Squat: 27kgs - 88.2kgs
Bench: 27kgs - 61.2kgs
O/head Press: 27kgs - 50kgs
Rows: 27kgs - 68.2kgs
D/lift: 27kgs - 93.4kgs

What I feel I need to do is allow my body to get used to these weights for a while, before adding more again? A little bit more muscle mass wouldn't go amiss either.

I enjoy the weights (even though it's getting tougher), and my motivation is in the pieces of A4 paper that record my progress since 20/02/12.

So, I guess what I'm after is to find out if sticking to these weights for a month or so is a good idea? Or - should I change something in the programme to help me along.

Priorities: Strength first, size second. And 3 workouts a week is do-able, though at times it may only be 2 due to workload/kids etc.

I'll await your replies!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi Impy,

You can gain strength just buy doing weights & adding as you have already done, you can slow your own progress by giving yourself lower goals, say 2.5 per month to pace yourself a bit.

I don’t think you’ve got anywhere near your potential, it’s just starting to get harder, you wait till you get past 100Kg on your bench then you’ll see lol. 

I think your starting to see how hard powerlifting can be, it tests your character to the max mate. If you stick with it you will like me find it gives the most muscle/size gains as well as pure strength, in all my years of weight training I have never packed on so much mass, I’ve done all the high intensity, negative & forced rep crap & it is nowhere near as productive as the compound lifts & 5 rep range from powerlifting.

I’m 43 mate, since October I have put loads of extra kilos on my lifts:

Bench press: Then 80Kg - Now 112.5Kg – Increase 32.5Kg

Squat: Then 100kg – Now 175Kg – Increase 75Kg

Deadlift: Then 90kg – Now 177.5Kg – 87.5Kg 

I havent finished yet either, more kilos to follow 

And added just under 2 stone to my body weight :thumb:

You want strength first then stick to powerlifting, you want a good physique as well, just add a good diet to your powerlifting, lower your body fat & you will be awesome!  :thumb:

I would recommend a basic four day split routine, power lifts first followed by higher rep assistance work for the volume :thumb:

If you want a routine done for you just ask mate, im passing on what ive learned from some of the excelent guys on this thread :thumb:

Keep lifting :thumb:


----------



## impster

Thanks mate. It's very much appreciated.

You're right - so much advice on here it's unreal.

If you could help out with a routine that would be great. Things to bear in mind that currently I'm doing my workouts after kids in bed. usually from 7:30pm till about 9-9:30pm. I take plenty of rest between sets when needed, and I don't rush it - hence the occasional 2hour workout lol.

I've got a 10kg bar, and approx 80kgs in weights at the moment. I've a basic bench with i can raise up to form an inclince, and also a set of squat stands.

I wouldn't mind doing the occasional run as well, but I'm so unfit on my feet it's not easy. On the bike, I'm ok, but I live in an area where fell running and triathlons are very popular, so, maybe there's another goal to be achieved there too?

What would you suggest mate? Should I buy one of those battery powered electronic muscle builder things???






(only kidding about the electronic stufff...)


----------



## sidewalkdances

Trained last night - upper assistance

3 board press - added boards at 60kg - all sets 5 reps
60/80/100/120/140/160x5 then I did 180x2 - most weight i've ever handled raw.

Then did 'Tricep Hell' - I used 100kg with a close grip and did 5 reps to each board in this order 3/2/1/2/3 for 15 total reps

DB Laterals - about 10kg x20x2
DB Shoulder Press - 30x20x2
Rear Delt using Spud Ab Strap - some weight x some reps lol
DB Curls - 20x10x3

20 mins HIIT cardio


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Trained last night - upper assistance
> 
> 3 board press - added boards at 60kg - all sets 5 reps
> 60/80/100/120/140/160x5 then I did 180x2 - most weight i've ever handled raw.
> 
> Then did 'Tricep Hell' - I used 100kg with a close grip and did 5 reps to each board in this order 3/2/1/2/3 for 15 total reps
> 
> DB Laterals - about 10kg x20x2
> DB Shoulder Press - 30x20x2
> Rear Delt using Spud Ab Strap - some weight x some reps lol
> DB Curls - 20x10x3
> 
> 20 mins HIIT cardio


 Christ Dan, your an animal.........REEEEESpect mate :thumb:

Is that 180Kg on the Bench press? :doublesho

Got a question or two Dan 

My four day split is going really well, is there any reason for me to do a light week if my progress continues & is there any benefit for me to do a 90% week some times.

I was thinking something like 4 weeks at 80%-85% with a 5 rep max
one week doing light 90% with a 3 rep max then a week of 50% using a 10 rep range.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

My basic four day split for next week :thumb:










My work sets are around 80%-85% of my one rep max.

Use this formula to work out your one rep max and then use your one rep max to work out your 80% or 85% work set weight.

One rep max formula: *Weight x Reps x .0333 + Weight = Estimated 1RM * Then multiply your estimated one rep max by either .80 or .85 etc... :thumb:
I've left my weights in so that you can work out what your warm up sets should be :thumb: And now i pass it on

You can move the lifts around to different days to suite you :thumb:

*Most of the info above has been passed on to me by Dan & James :thumb::thumb:*


----------



## ITHAQVA

Had a wisdom tooth out today, not allowed to lift until Sat


----------



## sidewalkdances

Doug - as we discussed on Sat, if your progressing nicely, then don't need to back off. Life has its way of throwing in 'light weeks' where other stuff is more important.

Where did you get your rack from again mate? Someone I know is interested in purchasing basically your set up, so I said i'd ask as I know it was reasonable cost wise and is pukka kit!

And yes, it was 180 on the bench - only a partial range of motion though - working on my tricep power for when I get back in my shirt! A bird's just crapped all over my car! Best get down to Cornwall!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Doug - as we discussed on Sat, if your progressing nicely, then don't need to back off. Life has its way of throwing in 'light weeks' where other stuff is more important.
> 
> Where did you get your rack from again mate? Someone I know is interested in purchasing basically your set up, so I said i'd ask as I know it was reasonable cost wise and is pukka kit!
> 
> And yes, it was 180 on the bench - only a partial range of motion though - working on my tricep power for when I get back in my shirt! A bird's just crapped all over my car! Best get down to Cornwall!


Exactly what i wanted to hear mate  :thumb:

Power rack Linkeeeee: http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf475-heavy-power-rack.php

Link to my write up on here: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211

I spoke to them & instead of free gloves i had the dip bars for £15 cool green  :thumb:

I bought my Oly weight set from fitness superstore because i wanted a black set 

Linkeee: http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...odypower_235kg_olympic_weight_set/9028_p.html

Write up on here: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372

:lol: The Karcher is always on mate & your always welcome  :thumb:

How is the wolfs trim coat looking?

Just spotted this on the site WOW :argie::argie: dear santa  Looks like i know what i want for christmas already http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk..._cast_iron_olympic_disc__50kg_x1/10912_p.html :argie::argie: :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

50kg plates are a PITA mate! I wouldn't bother. Just get some more 20's or 25s!

Trim coat looks absolutely spot on. Going to run it through the jet wash a little bit later, just to get the crap off. If I wasn't living at home, i'd flaunt the ban and get mine out for a snow foam session! Bought 5L of Magifoam 3 days before the ban was announced.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> 50kg plates are a PITA mate! I wouldn't bother. Just get some more 20's or 25s!
> 
> Trim coat looks absolutely spot on. Going to run it through the jet wash a little bit later, just to get the crap off. If I wasn't living at home, i'd flaunt the ban and get mine out for a snow foam session! Bought 5L of Magifoam 3 days before the ban was announced.


http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk..._cast_iron_olympic_disc__25kg_x1/10911_p.html

25's it is mate :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> .. how about a 3 day routine as prescribed in Wendlers 5/3/1?


I've just had a look for 5\3\1 between sets. There aren't hardcopies on Amazon, but there are ebooks on his website. Do you mean the white 2nd edition or the red 1st edition that says '5\3\1 for powerlifting'? Is there much difference?

Also noticed on Amazon that Starting Strength 3rd edition Kindle version is £7. That's a bargain!!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm 43 mate, since October I have put loads of extra kilos on my lifts:
> 
> Bench press: Then 80Kg - Now 112.5Kg - Increase 32.5Kg
> 
> Squat: Then 100kg - Now 175Kg - Increase 75Kg
> 
> Deadlift: Then 90kg - Now 177.5Kg - 87.5Kg
> 
> I havent finished yet either, more kilos to follow
> 
> And added just under 2 stone to my body weight :thumb:


I know we spoke about progress via PM'd but writting it out again it just looks awesome. 87.5kg in 7 months :doublesho average 12.5kg per month:doublesho that is some seriously nice work Doug and I think anyone on here would love to have that sort of progress. I think the massive point is that you have followed Starting Strength guidelines and put on weight, this puts you in a calorie surplus and allows you to build musce and strength. My weight has stayed exactly the same over the last 7 months and thats probably one of my biggest issues.

Keep it up Doug :thumb:



Oats said:


> I've just had a look for 531 between sets. There aren't hardcopies on Amazon, but there are ebooks on his website. Do you mean the white 2nd edition or the red 1st edition that says '531 for powerlifting'? Is there much difference?
> 
> Also noticed on Amazon that Starting Strength 3rd edition Kindle version is £7. That's a bargain!!


Oats get the 2nd Edition 5/3/1 if your going to get one, its the updated version. The powerlifting version is a completely different book that adresses pure powerlifters and incorporates some 1 rep max sets etc which is more advanced stuff. 5/3/1 is great simple program for putting on strength continually over a long period. If you go with the boring but Big accessory template, like Doug, you should see some good growth as well as strength. You can choose 2, 3 or 4 days a week so its flexible. I'm on a higher rep modified 5/3/1 program at the moment. I can always send you my spreadsheets if you want? I got them for Juggernaut (higher rep) and 5/3/1.



impster said:


> Thanks mate. It's very much appreciated.
> 
> You're right - so much advice on here it's unreal.
> 
> If you could help out with a routine that would be great. Things to bear in mind that currently I'm doing my workouts after kids in bed. usually from 7:30pm till about 9-9:30pm. I take plenty of rest between sets when needed, and I don't rush it - hence the occasional 2hour workout lol.
> 
> I've got a 10kg bar, and approx 80kgs in weights at the moment. I've a basic bench with i can raise up to form an inclince, and also a set of squat stands.
> 
> I wouldn't mind doing the occasional run as well, but I'm so unfit on my feet it's not easy. On the bike, I'm ok, but I live in an area where fell running and triathlons are very popular, so, maybe there's another goal to be achieved there too?
> 
> What would you suggest mate? Should I buy one of those battery powered electronic muscle builder things???
> 
> (only kidding about the electronic stufff...)


Most of the people on here would probably be happy to write you a program. You just decide on the number of days you would like to workout, if its only 2 that fine I have had good success on a 2 day a week program when I was playing rugby. I think doing a little bit of fitness is good but you can't be the strongest guy while also being the best marathon runner so final goal is important. Then decide if you would like to keep your fitness on the same day as your lifting or if you will have time to do fitness on separate days.

I rest about 5mins between sets when doing 5 reps workouts and I'm never in there more than 1 hour 15mins tops. I know powerlifters and Olympic lifters do workouts that can take hours but for general fitness I would try to keep them under an hour. At the moment I'm leaving 1:30mins between my acessory works sets so im in and out of the gym in half an hour.

You have to push the body past what its used to to force change/adaption so I wouldnt keep at the same weight for a prolonged period, you have to change something to keep you moving be it that you lower the rest times, increase the reps or increase the weight, just something to keep the lift progressing. There is merit to taking a light week or staying at the same weight for a little while but not prolonged period. Will you be getting more weight in the future? This makes a difference on program as if you want to keep to low rep, strength building work you will soon run out of weight.


----------



## impster

Well, i'm not 'built' for strength, that's for sure, but doing what I have done over the past few weeks has got me to where I should have been since I was a teenager really. 

I'll see what I can do over the next 2 weeks - even if it means sticking to the same weights, but reducing time between sets so that I can get it all in 1 hour.

I really want to continue, but I'm reaching a point where getting 5 reps is really tough especially on o/head press.

Squats will probably go up as will deadlift - I'm limited to what weights I've got on this though. I need to get another couple of 5 or 10kg discs.

bench and o/h press though, is getting tougher.

I was just wondering whether there's an alternative programme I can change to for a short while, which will help me through what I reckon is a plateau, therbeby allowing me to sidestep a potential demotivator...

I'll keep sticking at it though, whatever it is. I'm enjoying it.

By the way I'm only taking a supplement now after each workout. The cost is simply too much to take one twice a day, or even once a day.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I know we spoke about progress via PM'd but writting it out again it just looks awesome. 87.5kg in 7 months :doublesho average 12.5kg per month:doublesho that is some seriously nice work Doug and I think anyone on here would love to have that sort of progress. I think the massive point is that you have followed Starting Strength guidelines and put on weight, this puts you in a calorie surplus and allows you to build musce and strength. My weight has stayed exactly the same over the last 7 months and thats probably one of my biggest issues.
> 
> Keep it up Doug :thumb:


 :thumb::thumb:

Thanks James; I cannot deny after doing this for 7 months I am well pleased with my progress. Even my bench press 

I had a very poor approach to powerlifting at the beginning but thanks to some of you excellent guys on here I'm still here & I'm still improving.

Things that I've learnt ...so far.

Be patient. By all means have BIG goals but get there with small mini goals, helps with motivation.

Stick with it.

Diet with a little supplementation does make it easier to train & recover if you're an old git like me.

Warm up properly.

Learn correct technique/form.

Listen to the guys on here.

If you're really lucky you'll end up like me, totally in love with powerlifting & all the things its gives you, even some of the aches & pains


----------



## Bod42

Friday workout:
Box Squats: 80x5, 92.5x5, 100x5x2, 100x13
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 70x3, 80x3, 90x3
Bulgarian Split Squats: 5kgx 7reps x 5sets

I have been looking at that 100kg weight all day in my workout book and wondering how on earth I'm going to get 10 reps let alone for 3 sets and then an all out set. The reason is I only just got 13 reps last squat workout and this time the weight is 17.5kg heavier. This shows how quick your body adapts to a new stress. The 100kg felt stupidly light when lifting out of the rack, I nearly put it down and checked it was correct.

These feel very different but at this weight they are pretty easy especially at low reps.

Single leg training feels very weird as its been so long since I done any.

The workout felt alot better than last week. Last week I couldnt even walk up the stairs back up to the house afterwards but this time I atleast felt alive afterwards. I still worked hard, I think anyone who can feel their heartbeat in their eye is working hard lol



ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Thanks James; I cannot deny after doing this for 7 months I am well pleased with my progress. Even my bench press


Well the program I'm on at the moment is 4 months long, I would love to put 50kg on both Squats and Deadlifts, that would be awesome but I'm more aiming for half that. Its quite cool way of working out though as the more reps you do the more you increase the weight so for each rep I add 2kg to my max, this gives you a big mental push to hit as many reps as possible. I got to hit 110kg for 15 reps next week but want 18, I'm actually going to die.



impster said:


> Well, i'm not 'built' for strength, that's for sure, but doing what I have done over the past few weeks has got me to where I should have been since I was a teenager really.
> 
> I'll see what I can do over the next 2 weeks - even if it means sticking to the same weights, but reducing time between sets so that I can get it all in 1 hour.
> 
> I really want to continue, but I'm reaching a point where getting 5 reps is really tough especially on o/head press.
> 
> Squats will probably go up as will deadlift - I'm limited to what weights I've got on this though. I need to get another couple of 5 or 10kg discs.
> 
> bench and o/h press though, is getting tougher.
> 
> I was just wondering whether there's an alternative programme I can change to for a short while, which will help me through what I reckon is a plateau, therbeby allowing me to sidestep a potential demotivator...
> 
> I'll keep sticking at it though, whatever it is. I'm enjoying it.
> 
> By the way I'm only taking a supplement now after each workout. The cost is simply too much to take one twice a day, or even once a day.


I trained people who arent "built" for strength when they first start but if you train right you can become built for strength. I trained my best mate and he was 11 stone 6'2" when we started but he finished at 13 stone with a lower body fat level. He went from a 3rd team rugby player to top scorer of the first team after training him like an athlete. The first few months are the easiest for putting on strength, the time after that is what makes us who we are as things get harder.

Overhead press will stall first and be the hardest to increase weight then Bench Press, then Squat then Deadlift. Look at some of the stronger guys on here their Overhead press still isnt that high compared with their Squat/Deadlift.

There is no magic program, trust me I have looked. I'm pretty sure you posted your program but put it up again and lets the guys on here have a look if you want.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I trained people who arent "built" for strength when they first start but if you train right you can become built for strength. I trained my best mate and he was 11 stone 6'2" when we started but he finished at 13 stone with a lower body fat level. He went from a 3rd team rugby player to top scorer of the first team after training him like an athlete. The first few months are the easiest for putting on strength, the time after that is what makes us who we are as things get harder.
> 
> *Overhead press will stall first and be the hardest to increase weight then Bench Press, then Squat then Deadlift. Look at some of the stronger guys on here their Overhead press still isnt that high compared with their Squat/Deadlift.* :thumb::thumb:
> 
> There is no magic program, trust me I have looked. I'm pretty sure you posted your program but put it up again and lets the guys on here have a look if you want.


Agree with James here.

Impster,

Sometimes we just make excuses for ourselves especialy when things get tough. Dig in & show your true characture.

Think about the size & amount of muscles involved between the deadlift & overhead press. Then you see that an overhead press of 80-100Kg is good :thumb:

Got a sticking point, As Dan would say "Dominate" the weight you managed 5 reps on for a few weeks :thumb:


----------



## impster

ok - will do. Thanks for the advice - it's all good, and it all adds to my motivation and determination.

I'll stick with existing weights for a week or two and 'dominate' them. Once i have the true 5 sets of 5 done, I'll continue to add more weight.

Next workout tonight. Squat, Bench and Row. Then I'll add the 2 sets of press ups and chin ups to failure.

Thanks guys.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I got to hit 110kg for 15 reps next week but want 18, *I'm actually going to die.*




:lol::lol:

When i do the 5 sets 10 reps 100Kg on squats - Boring but big, i know how you feel mate, why do we do this James!!!!!  :devil::devil::devil:

Dig in & hate those weights mate! Will be good for fitness & body fat loss :thumb: :devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

I've got to do 

Speed Deads, Close Stance Squats, DB Rows (Strict), Shrugs, Leg Raises

Should get it done nice and quick


----------



## impster

Ok - tonight's workout.

Squats: steady on 88.2kgs
Bench: tough - 6 sets of 3 at 61.2kgs.
Rows: ok at 68.2kgs.
15 chin ups, 15 press ups, 15 more chins and 15 more press ups to finish.

Am going to stick at these weights for a couple of weeks, but am changing my timings by only allowing myself 90secs between each set.

My bench is ok at the top, but not good at the bottom of the lift. Any tips. Once I'm over half way up I can manage ok, but an 'explosive' start simply ain't happening. I've checked my form, and it seems ok. 

How can I strengthen the bottom of my bench press guys?

Cheers

Impster.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Oats get the 2nd Edition 5/3/1 if your going to get one, its the updated version. The powerlifting version is a completely different book that adresses pure powerlifters and incorporates some 1 rep max sets etc which is more advanced stuff.


Thanks for this. I've just bought the second edition. Should be a fairly quick read (comparing it to the tomes that are Starting Strength and Practical Programming). Best of all (seeing as I hate kindle format) it's a .pdf so I print it out:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Thanks for this. I've just bought the second edition. Should be a fairly quick read (comparing it to the tomes that are Starting Strength and Practical Programming). Best of all (seeing as I hate kindle format) it's a .pdf so I print it out:thumb:


No worries, its a good program. I will be doing the simple strength template after I finished this 4month templates. This should allow me 2keep adding weight for a long time, hopefully.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bloody wisdom tooth stopped me training for most of last week 

Benching tonight.......regardless :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Ok - tonight's workout.
> 
> Squats: steady on 88.2kgs
> Bench: tough - 6 sets of 3 at 61.2kgs.
> Rows: ok at 68.2kgs.
> 15 chin ups, 15 press ups, 15 more chins and 15 more press ups to finish.
> 
> Am going to stick at these weights for a couple of weeks, but am changing my timings by only allowing myself 90secs between each set.
> 
> My bench is ok at the top, but not good at the bottom of the lift. Any tips. Once I'm over half way up I can manage ok, but an 'explosive' start simply ain't happening. I've checked my form, and it seems ok.
> 
> How can I strengthen the bottom of my bench press guys?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Impster.


Why are you benching 6 sets of 3 reps 

I thought you were doing the 5X5 impy?

If you reduce rest to 90 seconds you will be too pre exhausted to complete your full sets. Perhaps you should consider a higher rep range/lighter weight strategy & train bodybuilding style?

I swapped my exercises around & found that it worked a treat 

Bench press 5X5, keep at it for a while. Perhaps you should do a 3X5 on bench instead.
Squat 5X5
Barbell Row 5X5

If you go back through this thread you'll see were I dropped the sets on my posted logs.

P.S, the lowest part of the bench press is always the weakest. Learn the powerlifting techniques, arch back, solid core (Shoulders back, lats flared etc..). Check out Ripptoe & other vids in this thread, technique plays a bigger part than people realise, get your body set right & it makes a huge difference when you get to the heavier weights :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

sidewalkdances said:


> I've got to do
> 
> Speed Deads, Close Stance Squats, DB Rows (Strict), Shrugs, Leg Raises
> 
> Should get it done nice and quick


This one went well - still relearning the conventional deadlift technique with a whippy deadlift bar. I decided to use a normal power bar for my squats after as they were going to be light (I did 165 for sets of 8) - what a crazy crazy difference. I have been squatting exclusively with a 8ft 25kg Texas Squat Bar for the last few months. Going back to squatting on the bar I use to bench, makes it feel like a toy!

Benched on Saturday Morning
Floor Press Up to 130x5x5
Wide Grip Bench (Index on Rings) -120x8x3 - my back was cramping the whole time
Band Flyes - Ave Band x 15 x3 (laying)
Incline BB Skullcrushers 40x10x2, 45x10
Pushdowns 3x30 (I used a rope, lat pull down bar and a narrow v handle)

Done.

Squats tonight 5x5 is my main movement, want to go over 200 for 5 sets


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> This one went well - still relearning the conventional deadlift technique with a whippy deadlift bar. I decided to use a normal power bar for my squats after as they were going to be light (I did 165 for sets of 8) - what a crazy crazy difference. I have been squatting exclusively with a 8ft 25kg Texas Squat Bar for the last few months. Going back to squatting on the bar I use to bench, makes it feel like a toy!
> 
> Benched on Saturday Morning
> Floor Press Up to 130x5x5
> Wide Grip Bench (Index on Rings) -120x8x3 - my back was cramping the whole time
> Band Flyes - Ave Band x 15 x3 (laying)
> Incline BB Skullcrushers 40x10x2, 45x10
> Pushdowns 3x30 (I used a rope, lat pull down bar and a narrow v handle)
> 
> Done.
> 
> Squats tonight 5x5 is my main movement, want to go over 200 for 5 sets


:thumb::devil:

Are you aiming for 200 RAW 5X5 Dan?


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb::devil:
> 
> Are you aiming for 200 RAW 5X5 Dan?


Certainly am Doug, no wraps either.

You can all come to my funeral :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Certainly am Doug, no wraps either.
> 
> You can all come to my funeral :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


Hardcore mate :devil: :thumb::lol:

Do you want to be buried RAW or GEARED


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'll be buried equipped :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> I'll be buried equipped :thumb:


Full metal it is:thumb::lol:


----------



## impster

ITHAQVA said:


> Why are you benching 6 sets of 3 reps
> 
> I thought you were doing the 5X5 impy?


Couldn't make 5 sets of 5, but could manage sets of 3, so I did 6 sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Couldn't make 5 sets of 5, but could manage sets of 3, so I did 6 sets.


I would go for 3 sets of 5.

Dig in mate, watch the vids, it will help :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Happeeeee!!!*

Mondays Workout

*Bench press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench Press work set: 112.5X4* :thumb:

Boring but big assistance work

*Bench press: 70X5X10

Barbell row: 60X5X10*

I may not have achieved 5 reps on the Bench press today but the 4 reps I did do were very positive, felt strong throughout the work set/reps. Well pleased as this is now the second week were 122.5 was easy enough to lift ,I'm hoping this is my new strength level & won't have to go back to 110.

Boring but big: was relatively easy to achieve 10 reps for all of the 20 sets. I will follow Dan's advice & start adding 2.5kg every time I get 5 sets of 10 reps on each of the lifts :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5x10, 37.5x5, 30x10, 30x10, 30x12
Dips: BW x 3, 3, 14
Neutral Grip Chin Up: 4,3,3,3,2

Was pretty pleased with this workout as my body isnt used to high rep work and even more so my shoulders but then my shoulder has been pain free for a few weeks now so maybe the higher rep stuff helps. Im actually still sore from Friday Squat workout and I done a lot of walking at the weekend so this would have helped. 

Dips felt really good on the last set. Need to get a dip belt so I can start adding weight.

The Mrs worked out with me and did 20kg Seated Shoulder Press for 5x5 with 2:30 rest. Not bad for a first time ever doing Shoulder Press


----------



## Christianmp

Been lurking this thread for some time and now I might as well join in.
Newbie regarding training with barbells, but I'm really enjoying it.

Monday workout:

Barbell Squat: 10x 20kg, 5x 40kg, 5x 60kg, 5x5x 80kg

Overhead Press: 10x 20kg, 5x 30kg, 5x5x 45kg (the last couple of reps became push press instead to get to lock out).

Barbell Deadlift: 5x 70kg, 5x 90kg, 3x 90kg

And some fcukarounditis assistance to end of. Chin-ups: 3 Dips: 5.

I am really impressed with the high numbers you guys are moving. I have reached a plateu with my benchpress at around 64 kg. 
Any recommendations to burst through this?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Been lurking this thread for some time and now I might as well join in.
> Newbie regarding training with barbells, but I'm really enjoying it.
> 
> Monday workout:
> 
> Barbell Squat: 10x 20kg, 5x 40kg, 5x 60kg, 5x5x 80kg
> 
> Overhead Press: 10x 20kg, 5x 30kg, 5x5x 45kg (the last couple of reps became push press instead to get to lock out).
> 
> Barbell Deadlift: 5x 70kg, 5x 90kg, 3x 90kg
> 
> And some fcukarounditis assistance to end of. Chin-ups: 3 Dips: 5.
> 
> I am really impressed with the high numbers you guys are moving. I have reached a plateu with my benchpress at around 64 kg.
> Any recommendations to burst through this?


Welcome to our little crew Christian :thumb:

Questions for you 

What program are you following mate? 
Do you keep training logs?
How long have you been doing this?
How old are you?
How do you train your bench ie warm ups reps/sets? 
When you reach 5 reps do you increase the weight by 2.5kg for the next session?

As for heavy weights, it takes time mate, enjoy the journey to your goals and aim for small steps. I've been doing this for 7 months & one thing you really need is patience & the determination to succeed, remember as the weights get really heavy this can be an extreme sport :devil:

Have you tried Dan's approach to dominating the weight until it feels much lighter, before adding more weight?


----------



## Christianmp

I am 28 y o following the standard SL 5x5 programme. I have always had problems gaining weight, as if the universe has decided I should stay at 75kg, but it is getting better and better. The kg's are slowly but steadily rising.

I use fitocracy as my training log. It gives a little extra having the game element with quests, achievements and xp points.

Started out from scratch, only barbell, in december 2011, but didn't stick to the regime because of bad/improper form on squats and deads, this is improving now and I am felling more confident on the lifts. 
Had a PT at the gym correct the wrongs and now it is steady progress on all lifts. Only the pendlay/BOB-rows are getting a bit behind. 

With bench I follow the same warm-up as the other lifts, 10x bar, and then ramping up with 2-3 sets before my actual worksets. If I can nail the 5x5 worksets i add 2.5kg next workout.

Might be I should follow Dan's approach before adding the extra weight.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Well chaps, I managed it - in fact I superceeded my target

205kg for five sets of five reps

185x3 and 190x3x2 Pause Squats (Sit in the hole for a 2 count) - these are horrific for a geared squatter like me - takes away all of my strengths - no wraps, no suit to spring me up, and no dip out of the bottom. 

Leg Press 400x25x3 (The last set nearly made me vomit everywhere)

Leg Extention - some weight for some reps :lol: - I hit a huge wall on the last set. Couldn't move my legs at all... Even with no weight.

Skipped abs and will do them tonight.


----------



## Christianmp

sidewalkdances said:


> Well chaps, I managed it - in fact I superceeded my target
> 
> 205kg for five sets of five reps


This is madness....
-
-
-
THIS IS SPARTA!

That is incredible lifts raw.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Cheers mate, no wraps either. Well, wrist wraps, but they dont count!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Well chaps, I managed it - in fact I superceeded my target
> 
> 205kg for five sets of five reps
> 
> 185x3 and 190x3x2 Pause Squats (Sit in the hole for a 2 count) - these are horrific for a geared squatter like me - takes away all of my strengths - no wraps, no suit to spring me up, and no dip out of the bottom.
> 
> Leg Press 400x25x3 (The last set nearly made me vomit everywhere)
> 
> Leg Extention - some weight for some reps :lol: - I hit a huge wall on the last set. Couldn't move my legs at all... Even with no weight.
> 
> Skipped abs and will do them tonight.


lol, makes my RAW 172.5 X 5 look like utter craap  

Great RAW lifting Dan, hate those weights mate :devil::devil: :thumb:

Does using pause squats really help with strength at the lower part of the lift Dan?


----------



## sidewalkdances

I think so, they are certainly harder than doing them with a normal turnaround. I dont get to come up till my training partner gives me an up call.

I also use them to get used to holding the extreme pressure of the suit when I get back into gear, which hopefully should only be a few weeks away to get used to the new stuff before I start my potential last UK competition prep for a while - thinking of moving to the US in September as i've been invited to train with Brian Carroll and his crew!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> thinking of moving to the US in September as i've been invited to train with Brian Carroll and his crew!


Bloody hell mate, nice one :thumb:

Is this the same Brian Carroll who is on team Elitefts? :doublesho You lcuky buggerr


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> Bloody hell mate, nice one :thumb:
> 
> Is this the same Brian Carroll who is on team Elitefts? :doublesho You lcuky buggerr


The very same, he writes my training programs and takes care of my diet/supplements - I just have to do as i'm told. Makes it a lot easier sometimes.

Just need to square away the financial situation to do it. If I could get a 6 month working visa, a decent place to live and a reasonable job, it could be the best 6 months of my life.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> The very same, he writes my training programs and takes care of my diet/supplements - I just have to do as i'm told. Makes it a lot easier sometimes.
> 
> Just need to square away the financial situation to do it. If I could get a 6 month working visa, a decent place to live and a reasonable job, it could be the best 6 months of my life.


I hope you manage it mate, so much experience to be gained & to actually visit eliteFTS :argie: HQ :thumb:

Go for it mate :thumb: Or you can move to Cornwall & train me instead


----------



## sidewalkdances

ITHAQVA said:


> I hope you manage it mate, so much experience to be gained & to actually visit eliteFTS :argie: HQ :thumb:
> 
> Go for it mate :thumb: Or you can move to Cornwall & train me instead


Elite are based in Ohio, if I can manage to wangle a trip up there, then I would be on it like a tramp on chips. I've spoken to Dave Tate a few times via email, and a few of the other guys.


----------



## Bod42

Amazing work there Sidewalkdance, thats incredible. My goal is to squat over 200kg for 5 reps, pretty sure its Doug's goal as well.

Maybe I should get some wrist wraps if they make you squat 205kg 

Training with someone who is a member of Elitefts would be amazing. Training there would be even better. Hope it all works out and your updating us from the US of A real soon


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I am 28 y o following the standard SL 5x5 programme. I have always had problems gaining weight, as if the universe has decided I should stay at 75kg, but it is getting better and better. The kg's are slowly but steadily rising.
> 
> I use fitocracy as my training log. It gives a little extra having the game element with quests, achievements and xp points.
> 
> Started out from scratch, only barbell, in december 2011, but didn't stick to the regime because of bad/improper form on squats and deads, this is improving now and I am felling more confident on the lifts.
> Had a PT at the gym correct the wrongs and now it is steady progress on all lifts. Only the pendlay/BOB-rows are getting a bit behind.
> 
> With bench I follow the same warm-up as the other lifts, 10x bar, and then ramping up with 2-3 sets before my actual worksets. If I can nail the 5x5 worksets i add 2.5kg next workout.
> 
> Might be I should follow Dan's approach before adding the extra weight.


Have tried warming up with less reps? Are you resting enough between work sets?

Keep at it mate :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

I haven't timed my rest periods before. Only started doing that last workout and I think that might be (one of) the problem(s). 
Tried resting 90sec between OHP and actually got restless.

I know some of you recommend 3-5 min between sets. I am also going to try with less warmup sets.

Looking forward to hitting the gym tonight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I haven't timed my rest periods before. Only started doing that last workout and I think that might be (one of) the problem(s).
> Tried resting 90sec between OHP and actually got restless.
> 
> I know some of you recommend 3-5 min between sets. I am also going to try with less warmup sets.
> 
> Looking forward to hitting the gym tonight.


I rest around 5-6 minutes before attempting my main lift work set.

Also on the SL 5X5 it doesn't require you to do assistance work, I would concentrate on getting into the routine & making the lifts count, I've only started assistance work since moving over to a 4 day split routine.

We all get restless & bored between sets, but you must think of it this way, a few minutes of boredom & you might make your goals quicker, I use my iPod for training now :thumb:
I've followed Dan's advice on warming up & it works really well, check out my logs & just adjust the weights accordingly mate 

Hope your workout goes well :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday's workout.

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat work set: 172.5X5* :thumb:

Boring but big assistance work

*Squat: 102.5X5X10 :devil:
Standing calf raise: 102.5X5X10* :devil:

Good workout, squats were nice & deep so I'm adding another 2.5kg to the work set & all assistance sets :thumb:


----------



## Oats

A week of doing what little I can due to travel, launch of reorg.\redund. at work, and catching the man-flu that's going around. Had time to get some of my homework done so think I've got my head round 5\3\1 (got a bit lost at the Doggcrapp bit). Goal for this week is to get a plan together for next week.

Read a good chunk of this thread. Just need folk to stop posting so I can catch up :lol: Couple of things I've come across this week have reminded me of comments from this thread.



sidewalkdances said:


> I decided to push on and hit the 200kg for reps. Could have p*ssied out and done 190 or 195 (185 felt hard) but a few hits of nose tork and some shouting and I got it done


Was it something like the next fella in this video ? 







Bod42 said:


> I think the massive point is that you have followed Starting Strength guidelines and put on weight, this puts you in a calorie surplus and allows you to build musce and strength.


There was a write up of a recent seminar and these are of the say fella 20 months apart. 
Month 1 - http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/newreply.php?do=postreply&t=238868

Month 20 - http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2065&d=1332787961

Maybe me putting on 2 stone has only got me to where I should have started from in the first place.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Deadlifts: 92.5x5, 105x5, 112.5x10, 112.5x10, 112.5x11
Front Squats: 70x3, 80x3, 90x3
Rotational Ab Work

Not a bad workout, had to swear a few times at rep 8 of the last set to get the last 3 reps but got them. My biggest worry is that next week I need to increase the weight by 12.5kg and increase my reps to 15, OH  Ok 125kg isnt a big weight for Deadlifts but tis gives a predicted 1RM of 190kg which isnt bad.

Assistant exercise is for precribed reps only so not pushing it to hard as only 5kg increase per month.

Kind of liking the medicine ball throws work at the moment.

Oats: I think 5/3/1 is quite an advanced program as you only increase your weights by 5kg on lower and 2.5kg on upper Body exercises every month. This means a yearly increase of 30kg and 60kg respectively. That is a fantastic gain if your squatting 1.5 times body weight squats and over but not such a great gain if you go from 20kg squats to 80kg in a year.

It depends what you like though as I personally prefer hitting 1 main exercise per workout but I always put beginners/people needed to increase strength fast on stronglift or Starting Strength. Also SS GOMAD is a good system when you start.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats,
I Agree with James about the 5/3/1, you have so much more potential than adding weight once a month :thumb:

I’m not even doing it yet but following a simple 4 day split & using the 5/3/1 boring but big assistance routines as a finisher, with my 4 day routine i do have the potential to add weight every time i reach 5 reps on a lift, you could potentially be adding weight once a week at best, I’m aiming for every two/three weeks on my bench & every week on my squat & deadlift. Overhead press I’ll take whatever comes at the moment but will focus more on it when i get my end of year goals for my other lifts. 

You could also try a 3X5 or a 2X5 before going onto a 4 day split. When i first started (7 months ago) i found doing the bench press before squats helped greatly.

Onward & upward guys! :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Well, the USA move might be happening sooner than expected - I got made redundant yesterday. Getting an ok pay off and if I sell the car, most of my detailing gear then I should have enough cash to last me 4-6 weeks or so out there.

Trying to get everything arranged now - Brian has a copy of my CV now so is going to pass it to anyone who he feels could help work wise.

Its a big gamble, but one that could be epic.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Well, the USA move might be happening sooner than expected - I got made redundant yesterday. Getting an ok pay off and if I sell the car, most of my detailing gear then I should have enough cash to last me 4-6 weeks or so out there.
> 
> Trying to get everything arranged now - Brian has a copy of my CV now so is going to pass it to anyone who he feels could help work wise.
> 
> Its a big gamble, but one that could be epic.


Sorry to hear you lost your job mate, but you never know this may be your lucky break, I hope this turns out to be an awesome experience for you Dan, I wish you all the luck in getting to the US & your dream :thumb: I mean ElitFTS you lucky swine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Question for you mate 

I don't see much about the stiff legged deadlift anymore; i used to do this exercise a lot in my early years to strengthen my lower back/core for the deadlift. Has it gone out of favour/what are your opinions of the movement as an assistance exercise?


----------



## Bod42

Bad news on the job front buddy. But every cloud has a silver lining, this could just push you over the edge to move to america and train with some of the best in the world.

I always wanted to move to NZ but if I hadnt of been made redundant I probably would have never made the move and its the best think I ever did. It will work out if you got people willing to help in America, we booked our flights on a Tuesday and left on the Friday with 1 Bag each. Started a hole new life.


----------



## sidewalkdances

Cheers guys - I'm just looking into what I need to do for a visa and to be able to work out there. There are very few reasons for me to stay here except family. If I could get there quickly, it'd work out a lot better for me. 

Doug: Stiff Legs are a fine assistance movement, they work just as well as they ever have. I'm just rubbish at them. Well i'm rubbish at deadlifting full stop - 210x5 yesterday was the hardest set i've ever done. Dropped to 205 to try and do the remaining sets, could barely break the thing off the floor. Awful


----------



## Matt.

In the gym last night and this guy Bench Pressed 180kg. He only managed 1 rep.

Doug, how are you getting on with your supplements?


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Cheers guys - I'm just looking into what I need to do for a visa and to be able to work out there. There are very few reasons for me to stay here except family. If I could get there quickly, it'd work out a lot better for me.
> 
> Doug: Stiff Legs are a fine assistance movement, they work just as well as they ever have. I'm just rubbish at them. Well i'm rubbish at deadlifting full stop - 210x5 yesterday was the hardest set i've ever done. Dropped to 205 to try and do the remaining sets, could barely break the thing off the floor. Awful


I wish you the very best Dan :thumb:

Glad to hear they are still respected, i always did really well with them, i remember using 140kg many many years ago 
I might add them into my deadlift boring but big routine & take out the knee raises :thumb:

205X5 is good mate, you cant always have a great day, consider yourself lucky, im only deadlifting 177.5 tomorrow


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> In the gym last night and this guy Bench Pressed 180kg. He only managed 1 rep.
> 
> Doug, how are you getting on with your supplements?


Hi Matt,

180kg one rep is good going, I've done it for reps many years ago on a mass goliath machine (I wouldn't bother looking for one, I've spent ages trying to find a pic online ) my personal best so far is 112.5X4 reps Free weights, don't know what my 1 reps max is at the moment. Wedlers formula indicates I can do 127.5kg for one rep.

Doing ok on supplements mate.

Still using the following;

*Recovery:*
Protein shake twice a day (Mixed with skimmed milk) I cannot eat enough to get the protein in me so this is a great way to increase my protein intake. 57 grams protein per shake.

*Joint care:*
Glucosamine HCL 1500mg once a day
Cod liver oil 1146mg once per day

I'm currently trialling pure Creatine monohydrate, so far I'm not convinced it adds anything. I'm now on one teaspoon a day, after the 5 X 4 teaspoons a day loading phase. Contrary to the info given on the net I have not had any increase in weight with it & I I've not noticed any advantages to taking it. I will use up the container view my training logs, if I see no difference then ill not purchase any more :thumb:

There are no other supplements I see the need for & to be honest I get the feeling that the Creatine will stop once the container is finished.

One of the biggest problems with me is that I'm advancing my training weights so well that I think other than a protein shake for recovery & the joint care supplements anything else is just a waste of time. I'm really glad to be honest:thumb:

Fridays Workout:

*Overhead press warm up sets: 20X3X3 - 30X3 - 40X2 - 50X1
Overhead press work set: 60X3*

Boring but big work sets:

*Overhead press 30X5X10*

I've got 4X 0.5kg stainless steel disks on the way soon; I'm hoping this will help me in my overhead press progress as ill add only 1kg every time I get 5 reps


----------



## Matt.

How about trying Creatine Gluconate http://www.myprotein.com/uk/product...4eb569b756518beffb&utm_source=awin&affil=awin


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> How about trying Creatine Gluconate http://www.myprotein.com/uk/product...4eb569b756518beffb&utm_source=awin&affil=awin


Creatine is creatine matt, as long as its pure & clean, dont listen to all the hype mate :thumb:

There are some creatines out there for sale that are 80% sugar. Mine is 100% pure creatine monohydrate.

I think Dan said it will help some & not others, i've noticed nothing yet lol, suprise, suprise! I think your determination to lift will give you more gains than any suppliment :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Some trax from my Ipod Powerlifting playlist  :thumb: :devil:














































:devil:


----------



## impster

Hi guys. Well, (yet) another bad week. Been away with work unexpectedly and and have missed Monday and Wednesday workouts. Got home late last night and knackered so missed that one as well.

I suppose it's a case of not fretting about it and carrying on as normal yes?


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Hi guys. Well, (yet) another bad week. Been away with work unexpectedly and and have missed Monday and Wednesday workouts. Got home late last night and knackered so missed that one as well.
> 
> I suppose it's a case of not fretting about it and carrying on as normal yes?


Impy, You must do what you want, you'll get out as much as you put in :thumb:


----------



## impster

Ok. Will probably do an additional workout today and then back to Mon, Wed & Fri.

Motiviation still there, but past few weeks one thing or another seems to have cropped up which has interfered quite a bit with progress.

Damn nuisance really.


----------



## ITHAQVA

impster said:


> Ok. Will probably do an additional workout today and then back to Mon, Wed & Fri.
> 
> Motiviation still there, but past few weeks one thing or another seems to have cropped up which has interfered quite a bit with progress.
> 
> Damn nuisance really.


This is what happens to so many who start weight training of one type or another. Only you know if you've got the character & desire for the sport mate, I've been playing around with weights since a teenager.

Powerlifting is an extreme sport & I have to admit it takes a certain type of person to stick with it, inner strength is most definitely required (insert mad as fuuk smiley here )

You need to have a real reason to lift weights, most just want a good body. I want strength. Once that goal is reached my plan is to maintain the strength & reduce my body fat percentage a little. I have my goals & my strategy to reach them, but the real fun part is the journey :thumb:

Impy, my progress is on this thread for all to see, I've said this so many times, if me a 43 year old can do it, so can any of you , I'm so proud of my achievements so far, I've worked hard for them. I committed myself over 7 months ago & invested in the right kit that will last me a lifetime, I've also met some really top guys due to this thread who have helped to motivate me & answer my millions of questions :thumb::thumb:

There is only one thing stopping you………yourself

I wouldn't do extra workouts to make up, get yourself organised & make a plan for your journey :thumb:


----------



## impster

Well my own motivation is all in black and white in the records I've kept since starting this program. It's just this past 2-3 weeks it's all gone to **** for one reason or another. Until then it was all good. 

I'm gonna do a workout later today as I feel I deserve to do one really.

Then it's back to Mon, Wed, Fri. I'm sticking with my current weights for 6 workouts (i.e. for this next fortnight) before adding more.

My strength goals are open ended at the moment. My goal is simply to persevere with the programme to a point where I feel I'm happy at and just to keep my levels at that point.

Next week as far as I know at the moment there's no evening work so will be back on for my regular workouts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Wooooooooooot!!!*

Saturday's Workout

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift Work Set: 177.5X5*:thumb::thumb:

Boring but big assistance work

*Deadlift: 100X5X10

Stiff legged deadlift: 20X2X10*

Cracking result on the deadlift, 180kg next week :thumb:

Stiff legged deadlifts felt perfect as a finisher to the workout. Only did 2 sets of 10 reps with the bar (20Kg) this time, I will gradually build up to 5 full sets of 10 reps, then start adding weight :thumb:
A positive aspect of this great lower back exercise is it stretches your hamstrings at the bottom of the movement :thumb:, will help bring some flexibility back into them, bonus! :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Doug, when do you take your protein and Creatine?

Should you not have Creatine before and after a workout?

According to MyProtein, you should have it twice daily with the protein. So that would be one in the am, and one post workout. Even on non training days. But, I have also read that you should have a serving of Creatine pre workout with water?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Doug, when do you take your protein and Creatine?
> 
> Should you not have Creatine before and after a workout?
> 
> According to MyProtein, you should have it twice daily with the protein. So that would be one in the am, and one post workout. Even on non training days. But, I have also read that you should have a serving of Creatine pre workout with water?


Protein shake & a glass of water with fully dissolved Creatine in the morning around 7am & another protein shake at around 3pm.

I don't understand why some tell you to take Creatine at a certain time as you spend 5 days loading so i don't think taking it before a workout makes any difference as it needs to be digested then transformed into chemicals which are then held in the muscle tissue for use when needed.

I wouldn't listen too much of the info about supplements. Supplements basically help to maintain a nutritional ideal throughout the day so that you are optimized for training/recovery & results.

There are some good videos on YouTube that explain the chemical process involved with Creatine synthesis etc...

Psychology is the best supplement :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Do you not have protein after a workout then?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Do you not have protein after a workout then?


Nope 

In the week i usually workout between 5:15pm - 6:15pm so i have my evening meal after & it always containes loads of protein & i have a big glass of Milk with it  around 8-8:30 i'll have cottage cheese or another glass of Milk :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

One other thing Matt thats very, very important, plenty of Sleep for recovery & growth :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

8-9 hours isn't it?

Do you get a lot of DOMS?


----------



## Bod42

Late update for Fridays Workout
Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x3, 80x1, 87.5x16 (134kg predicted Max)
Pendlay Rows: 65x5, 72.5x3, 80x8
Dips: Body Weight 5sets of 8

I was aiming for 13 reps but got 16. Really really pleased with 16 reps as I have never trained with reps that high so my body isnt used to it. Also I strugled with 70kg for 13 reps 2 weeks ago so thats a real nice increase.

Pendlay rows felt really good but I was pumped from doing well in Bench Press.

The last set of Dips was an all out set but I still only got 8 reps but Im only leaving 90 seconds rest between sets so fatigue sets in quickly.

Doug, creatine seems to react differently for different people. Some people gain a lot of weight through extra water retension, some people get extra strength and some people get nothing. I dont get much from creatine but I find if I have been stuck on say 4 reps on bench press for a month of so I can take creatine and I may get that extra 5th rep. 

There are a number of studies that show taking creatine before and after a workout does work better but I can see your point of view that your loading so why does timing help.

Awesome Deadlifts Doug, good luck with the 180kg Deadlift, thats a nice mile stone to hit. 180kg x 5 reps is a 210kg 1RM


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> 8-9 hours isn't it?
> 
> Do you get a lot of DOMS?


Very little even after doing the boring but big routines 2X5 sets of 10 :devil: :thumb:

I sometimes go bed around 8-8:30 so nearing 10 hours, but i average 8-9 hours a night.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Late update for Fridays Workout
> Bench Press: 57.5x5, 70x3, 80x1, 87.5x16 (134kg predicted Max)
> Pendlay Rows: 65x5, 72.5x3, 80x8
> Dips: Body Weight 5sets of 8
> 
> I was aiming for 13 reps but got 16. Really really pleased with 16 reps as I have never trained with reps that high so my body isnt used to it. Also I strugled with 70kg for 13 reps 2 weeks ago so thats a real nice increase.
> 
> Pendlay rows felt really good but I was pumped from doing well in Bench Press.
> 
> The last set of Dips was an all out set but I still only got 8 reps but Im only leaving 90 seconds rest between sets so fatigue sets in quickly.
> 
> Doug, creatine seems to react differently for different people. Some people gain a lot of weight through extra water retension, some people get extra strength and some people get nothing. I dont get much from creatine but I find if I have been stuck on say 4 reps on bench press for a month of so I can take creatine and I may get that extra 5th rep.
> 
> There are a number of studies that show taking creatine before and after a workout does work better but I can see your point of view that your loading so why does timing help.
> 
> Awesome Deadlifts Doug, good luck with the 180kg Deadlift, thats a nice mile stone to hit. 180kg x 5 reps is a 210kg 1RM


Nice predicted max for the Bench James :thumb::thumb:

Was well pleased with the deadlift mate, 20kg to go & hopefully by christmas i'll be repping 200kg :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 75x5, 87.5x3, 102.5x1, 110kgx17 (172kg predicted max)
Oh crap just relised I missed out Snatch grip Deadlifts, was light headed after Squats.
Bulgarian Split Squats: 5kg x 3sets x 8reps.
Ab Work

I couldnt even see my spot on the wall after about 8 reps so this was a real mental test. I was breathing so hard that sometimes I was loosing my tightness on the box so did about 3 or 4 reps where I had to rebreath at the bottom, not good.

Cant believe I missed Snatch Grip Deadlifts, its because I was training with the Mrs and she doesnt do them.

nice increase of 22.5kg and 4 reps in 2 weeks, not bad. I know this isnt pure strength gain and a lot of it is just getting used to the higher reps.

I tend not to get DOMS so bad if I keep my protein intake high and I only seem to get DOMS on high volume programs.


----------



## Christianmp

So, I didn't get to work out on wednesday and it really bothers me.
Was playing floorball wednesday and was using vibrams fivefingers. Don't ever do that. I ended up with blisters on both feet. Skipped the training, didn't train thursday or friday either, due to those damn feet.

*Saturday* workout:

Squat: 10x 20kg, 6x 40kg, 10x 65kg, 5x 65kg, 5x 80kg.
Half-arsed squats, but wasn't really feeling on top.

Bench: 10x 20kg, 6x 40kg, 5x5x 65kg (new PR!)
Did rest more between sets as recommended.

Pendlay row: 10x 40kg, 5x5x 50kg.

Deadlift: 3x10x 60kg (just for fun)

Pull-ups (wide grip): 3x 3 reps (BW)

*Sunday*: 70km ride on my bike.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> So, I didn't get to work out on wednesday and it really bothers me.
> Was playing floorball wednesday and was using vibrams fivefingers. Don't ever do that. I ended up with blisters on both feet. Skipped the training, didn't train thursday or friday either, due to those damn feet.
> 
> *Saturday* workout:
> 
> Squat: 10x 20kg, 6x 40kg, 10x 65kg, 5x 65kg, 5x 80kg.
> Half-arsed squats, but wasn't really feeling on top.
> 
> Bench: 10x 20kg, 6x 40kg, 5x5x 65kg (new PR!)
> *Did rest more between sets as recommended*. :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Pendlay row: 10x 40kg, 5x5x 50kg.
> WDeadlift: 3x10x 60kg (just for fun)
> 
> Pull-ups (wide grip): 3x 3 reps (BW)
> 
> *Sunday*: 70km ride on my bike.


I would be concerned about all that extra physical activity interfering with my powerlifting at my age :doublesho.

What are your overall goals Christian?

What routine are you following?


----------



## Christianmp

Overall goal is getting in shape and getting stronger. 
This years goals:
Squat: 100kg this year (5x5)
Deadlift: 120kg (1x5)
Bench: 80kg (5x5)

I'm following Mehdi's Stronglifts 5x5. And adding a little bit extra here and there (chins, pull-ups, plank, dips).

I've only ever done isolation excercises in machines as the gyms here in Denmark have a tendency to focus primarily on that. However with the increasing popularity regarding crossfit, more and more gyms actually invest in power-racks and lots of free weights. 

Cycling is just to get out, clear my mind and get lots of fresh air.
Floorball is with the colleagues at work.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Overall goal is getting in shape and getting stronger.
> This years goals:
> Squat: 100kg this year (5x5)
> Deadlift: 120kg (1x5)
> Bench: 80kg (5x5)
> 
> I'm following Mehdi's Stronglifts 5x5. And adding a little bit extra here and there (chins, pull-ups, plank, dips).
> 
> I've only ever done isolation excercises in machines as the gyms here in Denmark have a tendency to focus primarily on that. However with the increasing popularity regarding crossfit, more and more gyms actually invest in power-racks and lots of free weights.
> 
> Cycling is just to get out, clear my mind and get lots of fresh air.
> Floorball is with the colleagues at work.


I would say follow the 5X5 mate & youll reach those goals in no time :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

Monday workout:

Squat: 10x 20kg, 6x 40kg, 4x 60kg, 5x5x 82.5kg 
I really hated doing squats this workout. Got a strange kind of pain in my left shoulder. Maybe should have done some shoulder dislocators for warm-up.

OHP: 10x 20kg, 6x 30kg, 5x5x 45kg
Last week I was struggling with these where I had to push-press the last set.
This time the barbell just rocketed skywards  -> more weight next time.

Deadlift: 5x 70kg, 5x 95kg


----------



## sidewalkdances

My new kit arrived 

Worked up to 225x3 in just briefs. They fit very very nicely. I nearly fell over unracking 225kg though, was a touch back in the monolift, so I started 'pushing' the weight forward into the rack. Not a big deal in a power rack, but when the mono arms swing away - you start falling forward, I shouted 'No, no, no, no' in blind panic, and my training partner slammed the monolift back in, hitting the bar and making me fly backwards. I took about 3-4 stumble steps before I got my balance back!

I did very little other work, just leg press and leg extention and a raw 180x3 squat. After the briefs work I just wasn't feeling it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> My new kit arrived
> 
> Worked up to 225x3 in just briefs. They fit very very nicely. I nearly fell over unracking 225kg though, was a touch back in the monolift, so I started 'pushing' the weight forward into the rack. Not a big deal in a power rack, but when the mono arms swing away - you start falling forward, I shouted 'No, no, no, no' in blind panic, and my training partner slammed the monolift back in, hitting the bar and making me fly backwards. I took about 3-4 stumble steps before I got my balance back!
> 
> I did very little other work, just leg press and leg extention and a raw 180x3 squat. After the briefs work I just wasn't feeling it.


Excelent result Dan:thumb::thumb:, your really upping the weigths mate :thumb:, so you nearly fell over with 225Kg on your back, why is that heavy  :doublesho:doublesho, mate thats nearly 500 pounds on your back you crazy fookin animal :devil::devil::doublesho:doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Aaaaaauuuoooooo!!!!*

Tuesday's workout

*Bench Press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench Press work set: 112.5X5!!!!!! So pleased with this, 115kg next week :thumb:
YES, YES, YES!!!!! :devil::devil: *

Boring but big (Bit late from work so only did the bench routine)

*Bench Press: 72.5X5X10 :devil: Felt dam good :thumb:*

Bench press was one hell of a result for me, another free weight PR, do you get the impression I'm totally fooking over the moon with today's workout


----------



## Bod42

Nice Work Doug, onwards and upwards for your Bench Press. Cant wait to get back to the heavy iron.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice Work Doug, onwards and upwards for your Bench Press. Cant wait to get back to the heavy iron.


Thanks James:thumb:, so pleased, looking forward to the 115kg Bench next week just to see how many reps i can do, i'm hoping for at least 3 to work up on 

I think the boring but big is actually helping, last night benching 72.5kg for 5 sets of 10 reps seemed so easy after the main work set & im going to keep adding 2.5kg to the assistance work as Dan advised, i can also see how the juggernaut method would work with high rep stuff :devil:

Im going to stick to this basic 4 day split until it produces no more results :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

The Juggernaut Program is weird as a few years back if I read that program I would have thought it was for "toning" as 17 reps to me is very high reps but I seem to be gaining strength.

It might be a coincidence but my shoulder has stopped hurting for the first time in years but Dave Tate said the same thing when he moved to higher weights. I love the Med ball extra speed work and keep this in any program in the future.

I'm glad we started this thread Doug, its good to look back and see what we were lifting when we started. Your winning at the minute with awesome gains but Im hoping to put up some good numbers at the end of the Juggernaut Program.

Im truely starting to see that every single set doesnt have to totally kill you and be 100% to make gains so I can see how the BBB program works and I will prob do it after Juggernaut


----------



## sidewalkdances

'Toning' is a fallacy - you either make a muscle bigger or smaller - the level of 'tone' is largely down to body fat levels as opposed to the effect of weight training on the muscle. 

Anyway, congrats Doug! Nice pressing. We had a humdinger of a session yesterday, decided to use the short monster mini bands on a close grip bench - we thought they were adding around 20kg at the top. Wrong! When I checked the tension chart at home, they were giving roughly 40-45kg of added resistance at the top of the movement! I managed to get up to 100x4 (missed a 5th rep) 

Training in this heat isn't fun!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> 'Toning' is a fallacy - you either make a muscle bigger or smaller - the level of 'tone' is largely down to body fat levels as opposed to the effect of weight training on the muscle.
> 
> Anyway, congrats Doug! Nice pressing. We had a humdinger of a session yesterday, decided to use the short monster mini bands on a close grip bench - we thought they were adding around 20kg at the top. Wrong! When I checked the tension chart at home, they were giving roughly 40-45kg of added resistance at the top of the movement! I managed to get up to 100x4 (missed a 5th rep)
> 
> Training in this heat isn't fun!!!


Agree about the toning thing, its all down to body fat content :thumb:

Thanks Dan, nothing like the weights you guys throw around but i'm only 7 months in & still LOVING IT 

Onwards & upwards guys!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The Juggernaut Program is weird as a few years back if I read that program I would have thought it was for "toning" as 17 reps to me is very high reps but I seem to be gaining strength.
> 
> It might be a coincidence but my shoulder has stopped hurting for the first time in years but Dave Tate said the same thing when he moved to higher weights. I love the Med ball extra speed work and keep this in any program in the future.
> 
> I'm glad we started this thread Doug, its good to look back and see what we were lifting when we started. Your winning at the minute with awesome gains but Im hoping to put up some good numbers at the end of the Juggernaut Program.
> 
> Im truely starting to see that every single set doesnt have to totally kill you and be 100% to make gains so I can see how the BBB program works and I will prob do it after Juggernaut


I think you'll find its all down to how much weight you lift with your shoulder James, I've always found lighter weights/higher reps much easier on the joints & any old injuries.

Its not about winning for me mate, never has TBH, as long as we lift & enjoy what we do, that's the main thing :thumb: I know you'll get there, you have youth on your side :thumb:

I set my own standards. I compete against the iron & myself :thumb:

Squats tonight :doublesho Followed by cauliflower cheese, creamy mashed potatoes & Pork chops yuuumeeeee


----------



## Bod42

sidewalkdances said:


> 'Toning' is a fallacy - you either make a muscle bigger or smaller - the level of 'tone' is largely down to body fat levels as opposed to the effect of weight training on the muscle.
> 
> Anyway, congrats Doug! Nice pressing. We had a humdinger of a session yesterday, decided to use the short monster mini bands on a close grip bench - we thought they were adding around 20kg at the top. Wrong! When I checked the tension chart at home, they were giving roughly 40-45kg of added resistance at the top of the movement! I managed to get up to 100x4 (missed a 5th rep)
> 
> Training in this heat isn't fun!!!


I totall agree now but I meant when I first got into fitness all the mags said to tone a muscle you do high reps but now I know its all crap. Like you say a muscle can do three things, get bigger, get smaller or stay the same. The amount of "tone" you have is a combination of muscle size and low body fat.

100kg + 40-45kg at the top, thats some nice lock out strength.



ITHAQVA said:


> I think you'll find its all down to how much weight you lift with your shoulder James, I've always found lighter weights/higher reps much easier on the joints & any old injuries.
> 
> Its not about winning for me mate, never has TBH, as long as we lift & enjoy what we do, that's the main thing :thumb: I know you'll get there, you have youth on your side :thumb:
> 
> I set my own standards. I compete against the iron & myself :thumb:
> 
> Squats tonight :doublesho Followed by cauliflower cheese, creamy mashed potatoes & Pork chops yuuumeeeee


Ya I think the higher reps and lower weights also help with the pump and I find that fixes injuries quicker as it get nutrients to the muscles.

Its not about winning for me either I like seeing people doing well in what ever they do but if we were training together their would be a slight male ego and I find it makes you lift harder. Thats how I use it anyway.

The great thing about the Juggernaut Program is every rep you get on your third week equels a certain amount of weight increase so this makes you smash the set with 110% intensity. Like the other day on squats I wanted 15 reps which is a 10kg increase but I got 17 reps so i increase my weight by 14kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I totall agree now but I meant when I first got into fitness all the mags said to tone a muscle you do high reps but now I know its all crap. Like you say a muscle can do three things, get bigger, get smaller or stay the same. The amount of "tone" you have is a combination of muscle size and low body fat.
> 
> 100kg + 40-45kg at the top, thats some nice lock out strength.
> 
> Ya I think the higher reps and lower weights also help with the pump and I find that fixes injuries quicker as it get nutrients to the muscles.
> 
> *Its not about winning for me either I like seeing people doing well in what ever they do but if we were training together their would be a slight male ego and I find it makes you lift harder. Thats how I use it anyway.*
> The great thing about the Juggernaut Program is every rep you get on your third week equels a certain amount of weight increase so this makes you smash the set with 110% intensity. Like the other day on squats I wanted 15 reps which is a 10kg increase but I got 17 reps so i increase my weight by 14kg


Im with you on that James :thumb: When in the company of others especially fellow lifters you'll defo try harder, none of us guys want to look like weak losers!


----------



## Christianmp

Wednesday Workout:

Squat: 10x 20kg, 5x 40kg, 5x 60kg, 5x5x 85kg (PR!)
Don't know what happened, but felt like I owned the barbell. Down and up again, no worries. 
Last workout with 82.5kg I was scared of the weights and really struggled. Funny how things can change.

Benchpress: 10x 20kg, 5x40, 5x 67.5kg, 4x5x 65kg.
The benchpress however wasn't as easy as the squats and had to "de-load" to 65kg

Pendlay Row: 5x 40kg, 5x 57.5kg, 4x5x 55kg.
Same as bench. 

And just for the fun of it I added a little extra because no one occupied the rack. 
3x10x 25kg OHP 
supersets with
3x10x 55kg deadlifts.

Feeding time: 1 large chicken breast, 500g minced meat (beef) with rice and vegetables, 1 homemade "tortilla-wrap" pizza with ham, chorizo and lettuce, 1 bowl of frozen strawberries with banana and milk plus whey = stuffed.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursday's workout.

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
Squat work set: 175X4 *

Idiot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I got under the bar & knew it was too high on my back but thought ah well it will be ok, WRONG 4 reps below parallel then it was too much to lift. Lesson learnt, next time I'll re rack the barbell & start the set again.

Boring but big

*Squat: 105X3X10
Standing calf raise: 105X3X10*

Crap workout but I know why so it's not too bad


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout: (Done Thursday)
Medicine Ball Throws Push Press: 3sets x 5reps
Seated Shoulder Press: 30x5, 35x3, 42.5x1, 45kgx16 (Predicted 1RM 70kg)
Dips: 5, 3, 16
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 4, 3, 3, 3, 3

Was aiming for 13 reps on SP so was pleased to get 16. I havent felt a burn like that directly in my deltoids for a long time and zero pain. I actually think one of the things really helping my shoulders is the medicine ball throws, when I started I could throw it maybe twice my height but just 3 weeks later I'm throwing it like 20 foot in the air that shows my power is improving.

Pleased with 16 dips thats pretty good. Need to buy a belt so I can start adding weight.

1 more rep overall on chins but the gains arent coming on there as well as they once were.



Christianmp said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> 
> Squat: 10x 20kg, 5x 40kg, 5x 60kg, 5x5x 85kg (PR!)
> Don't know what happened, but felt like I owned the barbell. Down and up again, no worries.
> Last workout with 82.5kg I was scared of the weights and really struggled. Funny how things can change.
> 
> Benchpress: 10x 20kg, 5x40, 5x 67.5kg, 4x5x 65kg.
> The benchpress however wasn't as easy as the squats and had to "de-load" to 65kg
> 
> Pendlay Row: 5x 40kg, 5x 57.5kg, 4x5x 55kg.
> Same as bench.
> 
> And just for the fun of it I added a little extra because no one occupied the rack.
> 3x10x 25kg OHP
> supersets with
> 3x10x 55kg deadlifts.
> 
> Feeding time: 1 large chicken breast, 500g minced meat (beef) with rice and vegetables, 1 homemade "tortilla-wrap" pizza with ham, chorizo and lettuce, 1 bowl of frozen strawberries with banana and milk plus whey = stuffed.


Nice workout good to see people hitting PRs.

Did you eat all of that food in 1 sitting or was that spaced out throughout the day. Nice work either way.



ITHAQVA said:


> Thursday's workout.
> 
> *Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> Squat work set: 175X4 *
> 
> Idiot!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I got under the bar & knew it was too high on my back but thought ah well it will be ok, WRONG 4 reps below parallel then it was too much to lift. Lesson learnt, next time I'll re rack the barbell & start the set again.
> 
> Boring but big
> 
> *Squat: 105X3X10
> Standing calf raise: 105X3X10*
> 
> Crap workout but I know why so it's not too bad


Im sure everyone on here has done this Doug, I know I have. Something doesnt feel quite right but you try to push through it, I find it hard but now I step completely back from the back and reset everything.

And you are lifting some serious weight now so technique is more important as at lower weights you can get in the wrong position but manhandle the weight back again but at your weights you cant do this. I'm sure you will smash the weight next time buddy. And this is where the BBB is worth its weight in gold as even though you missed a rep your still adding volume/strength with the extra squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Im sure everyone on here has done this Doug, I know I have. Something doesnt feel quite right but you try to push through it, I find it hard but now I step completely back from the back and reset everything.
> 
> And you are lifting some serious weight now so technique is more important as at lower weights you can get in the wrong position but manhandle the weight back again but at your weights you cant do this. I'm sure you will smash the weight next time buddy. And this is where the BBB is worth its weight in gold as even though you missed a rep your still adding volume/strength with the extra squats.


Thanks for your support James :thumb:
Was really kicking myself yesterday because I did 180Kg a while back (but it was above parallel). However, another lesson learnt & i think all the little hurdles i cross will make me a much better Powerlifter, next week it *will *be a low bar squat  

When squatting high bar, my body wanted to do 4 huge good mornings:doublesho but I kept my core rigid & managed 3 below parallel & one parallel, so that in itself was appositive result.

Agree, even though the work set took it out of me & didn't go according to plan  I still forced myself to do at least 3 sets of the two assistance exercises :thumb:

From my failure, I will learn to win! (©ITHAQVA 2012)


----------



## Guest

Finally getting back into training again :wall:
I think I only managed 3 sessions in the last two months .

Did an hour of light lifting to re-acclimatise myself back into exercise. Started a little later than hoped (10pm) as the kids were restless last night due to the humidity.

*Squat*
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Bench*
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Row*
[email protected]

*Press*
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Dead*
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Dips*
[email protected]

*Chins*
[email protected]

*Kneeling Ab Wheel Rollouts*
[email protected]

Only took an hour and was actually quite easy. I intend to do similar again tonight but add a 4th set to each exercise with more weight. I'll then switch back to my normal routine on Monday.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Fridays Workout:
Sled Drags:
Deadlifts: 85x5, 100x3, 120x1, 125x12
Front Squats: 75x5, 85x3, 95x1
Ab Work: 5x5 Med Ball Twist Throws.
Grip Work

Worst workout so far in Juggernaut. I felt like **** in the gym but that may be due to the Mrs wanting some quick couple time right before the gym. She wasnt to impressed when I said I cant I got the gym :thumb:

Was quite impressed with how Frot Squats felt and havent done 1 rep in years so this was a nice change.

Loving the Med Ball Power ab work, it really works your abs diff from anything else.

I'm doing a lot of grip work for Deadlifts and golf and found a few exercises that pumped my forearms up so they felt like rock. Grip training is quite fun actually.



ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks for your support James :thumb:
> Was really kicking myself yesterday because I did 180Kg a while back (but it was above parallel). However, another lesson learnt & i think all the little hurdles i cross will make me a much better Powerlifter, next week it *will *be a low bar squat
> 
> When squatting high bar, my body wanted to do 4 huge good mornings:doublesho but I kept my core rigid & managed 3 below parallel & one parallel, so that in itself was appositive result.
> 
> Agree, even though the work set took it out of me & didn't go according to plan  I still forced myself to do at least 3 sets of the two assistance exercises :thumb:
> 
> From my failure, I will learn to win! (©ITHAQVA 2012)


Watch some of the 1000lb squats on youtube doug and watch how long they take to set up, everything has to be exactly the same each time. They come up with a routine and stick to it.

Thats why i love using a box, there is no did I get that rep or not and when training all the rugby players with the massive egos and the comp charts I used to put on the gym walls this made sure their was zero cheating or dissagreement if the squat was low enough


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Finally getting back into training again :wall:
> I think I only managed 3 sessions in the last two months .
> 
> Did an hour of light lifting to re-acclimatise myself back into exercise. Started a little later than hoped (10pm) as the kids were restless last night due to the humidity.
> 
> *Squat*
> [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Bench*
> [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Row*
> [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Dips*
> [email protected]
> 
> *Chins*
> [email protected]
> 
> *Kneeling Ab Wheel Rollouts*
> [email protected]
> 
> Only took an hour and was actually quite easy. I intend to do similar again tonight but add a 4th set to each exercise with more weight. I'll then switch back to my normal routine on Monday.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


About bloody time Phil 

Welcome back mate, we have missed ya :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Cheers Doug. I'll have a proper read through this thread at lunchtime to catch up on all that I have missed.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Cheers Doug. I'll have a proper read through this thread at lunchtime to catch up on all that I have missed.


Please ignore my last log it's full of technique FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Fridays Workout:
> Sled Drags:
> Deadlifts: 85x5, 100x3, 120x1, 125x12
> Front Squats: 75x5, 85x3, 95x1
> Ab Work: 5x5 Med Ball Twist Throws.
> Grip Work
> 
> *Worst workout so far in Juggernaut. I felt like **** in the gym but that may be due to the Mrs wanting some quick couple time right before the gym. She wasnt to impressed when I said I cant I got the gym :thumb:* :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho Dirty boy
> 
> Was quite impressed with how Frot Squats felt and havent done 1 rep in years so this was a nice change.
> 
> Loving the Med Ball Power ab work, it really works your abs diff from anything else.
> 
> I'm doing a lot of grip work for Deadlifts and golf and found a few exercises that pumped my forearms up so they felt like rock. Grip training is quite fun actually.
> 
> Watch some of the 1000lb squats on youtube doug and watch how long they take to set up, everything has to be exactly the same each time. They come up with a routine and stick to it.
> 
> Thats why i love using a box, there is no did I get that rep or not and when training all the rugby players with the massive egos and the comp charts I used to put on the gym walls this made sure their was zero cheating or dissagreement if the squat was low enough


I will check out the vids, cheers James.

Im finding the boring but big routine for my deadlifts - 5 sets of 10 reps is giving me great grip :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi guys, well time i joined this thread after much reading of it, tho the only thing i've lifted recently is my fat bod off the sofa ...:doubleshot
haven't lifted weights for some years now and although am planning on starting the SL5x5 soon (many thanks to doug for info and encouragement:thumb i think i need to start simple and practice a little form 1st plus teach my body to move and lift again...
thinking of doing a couple o weeks of something similar to barefacedgeeks routine a few posts earlier...?
it'll be minus the dips or chins as at 17stone+ i know i couldn't do them yet..:doublesho
what do you think..?
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Bod42 said:


> Worst workout so far in Juggernaut. I felt like **** in the gym but that may be due to the Mrs wanting some quick couple time right before the gym. She wasnt to impressed when I said I cant I got the gym :thumb:


2-3 reps per secomd. High Reps low rest period :thumb:



ITHAQVA said:


> I will check out the vids, cheers James.
> 
> Im finding the boring but big routine for my deadlifts - 5 sets of 10 reps is giving me great grip :thumb:


Just read about Kroc Rows on tnation and it seems that high rep endurance deadlifts, rows, etc seems to build your 1RM grip strength as well.



sfstu said:


> hi guys, well time i joined this thread after much reading of it, tho the only thing i've lifted recently is my fat bod off the sofa ...:doubleshot
> haven't lifted weights for some years now and although am planning on starting the SL5x5 soon (many thanks to doug for info and encouragement:thumb i think i need to start simple and practice a little form 1st plus teach my body to move and lift again...
> thinking of doing a couple o weeks of something similar to barefacedgeeks routine a few posts earlier...?
> it'll be minus the dips or chins as at 17stone+ i know i couldn't do them yet..:doublesho
> what do you think..?
> rgds stu


I would personally start the stronglift program as soon as possible. You can start with just the bar to get used to the exercise. I'm pretty sure a lot of the guys in here are 16-17 stones and were still making progress. If you cant do Dips / Chins you can assist with your legs or buy a band and use that to help you. If you need to practise squats I suggest finding a Box of some sort and getting used to the depth, I normally suggest a 14" Box for most people but if you struggle with your flexibility you can start higher and slowly work your way down.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi guys, well time i joined this thread after much reading of it, tho the only thing i've lifted recently is my fat bod off the sofa ...:doubleshot
> haven't lifted weights for some years now and although am planning on starting the SL5x5 soon (many thanks to doug for info and encouragement:thumb i think i need to start simple and practice a little form 1st plus teach my body to move and lift again...
> thinking of doing a couple o weeks of something similar to barefacedgeeks routine a few posts earlier...?
> it'll be minus the dips or chins as at 17stone+ i know i couldn't do them yet..:doublesho
> what do you think..?
> rgds stu


Hi Stu,

Welcome to our little piece of powerlifting heaven 

Don't worry about dips/chins, I'm 16 stone 12 pounds & its just much harder for us heavy guys to do them no matter how strong, there is a little article on elitefts.com about it, but I would stick to the basic 5X5, its simple but very effective :devil::thumb:

Big basic multijoint exercises are all you need, my arms are much bigger since starting & I don't even train them directly :thumb:

As for starting out, I would go straight into the SL 5X5, follow the advice & start with an empty bar only, you will very soon add weight, be patient mate, it wont be long & you'll be lifting more than you think :thumb:

Its well worth reading through this thread, as we have all posted many vids on the lifts/form/technique/ etc...

In fact I would say within this thread is almost everything you need, many of us only started powerlifting around the time of this threads beginning, I've played with the weights for..........too many years 

Get your training logs all written out ready for the journey mate :thumb:

Might be a good idea to get some chalk , i use one of those chalk balls, less mess :thumb:

Chalk Ball - Wild Country: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Outdoors

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> 2-3 reps per secomd. High Reps low rest period :thumb:
> 
> And no nookies, James you missed out
> 
> Just read about Kroc Rows on tnation and it seems that high rep endurance deadlifts, rows, etc seems to build your 1RM grip strength as well.


As I go through the Boring but big routines, I must agree James, I'm finding things are getting easier in my full on work sets. I no longer walk up to the deadlift bar several times; I just walk up to it & lift :devil:

I have lost that fear of lifting heavy weights because I have done so many more sets with the BBB routine that the lifts feel second nature. That's the reall beauty about BBB, it gives you more lifting time/experience so you're much more in tune with the lift & this helps you get over the fear which hinders your confidence. :thumb:

There are people for's & against touch & go deadlift, personally I can see why its safer, your at most risk as you pull the bar from the floor & your grip has to hold out as you make your reps which in my mind must make the grip much stronger. But that's just my opinion & its only based on what I presume to think I know


----------



## The Cueball

Seems to be a lot of dedicated chaps on here.... well done guys...keep up the good work.... 

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> I would personally start the stronglift program as soon as possible. You can start with just the bar to get used to the exercise. I'm pretty sure a lot of the guys in here are 16-17 stones and were still making progress. If you cant do Dips / Chins you can assist with your legs or buy a band and use that to help you. If you need to practise squats I suggest finding a Box of some sort and getting used to the depth, I normally suggest a 14" Box for most people but if you struggle with your flexibility you can start higher and slowly work your way down.





ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Stu,
> 
> Welcome to our little piece of powerlifting heaven
> 
> Don't worry about dips/chins, I'm 16 stone 12 pounds & its just much harder for us heavy guys to do them no matter how strong, there is a little article on elitefts.com about it, but I would stick to the basic 5X5, its simple but very effective :devil::thumb:
> 
> Big basic multijoint exercises are all you need, my arms are much bigger since starting & I don't even train them directly :thumb:
> 
> As for starting out, I would go straight into the SL 5X5, follow the advice & start with an empty bar only, you will very soon add weight, be patient mate, it wont be long & you'll be lifting more than you think :thumb:
> 
> Its well worth reading through this thread, as we have all posted many vids on the lifts/form/technique/ etc...
> 
> In fact I would say within this thread is almost everything you need, many of us only started powerlifting around the time of this threads beginning, I've played with the weights for..........too many years
> 
> Get your training logs all written out ready for the journey mate :thumb:
> 
> Might be a good idea to get some chalk , i use one of those chalk balls, less mess :thumb:
> 
> Chalk Ball - Wild Country: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Outdoors
> 
> Doug


cheers for replies guys...:thumb: start with the SL 5x5 it is then..was planning on using just the bar anyway to try and get form right and ease my tired old bod into it.. good idea with a box i think for getting depth of squat right...watched one of mehdis vids on the squat the other day and realised i'd only ever done a partial squat before!!
still reading through this thread but at 120 something pages it'll take a while :doublesho
little concerned how much i'll be able to do with my marcy smith machine as the bar is fixed on the vertical posts so think that'll restrict range of movement too much for squats/deadlifts/OHP etc but i have a seperate bar anyway and am currently in the process of clearing the garage to make room...
cheers, rgds stu:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

The Cueball said:


> Seems to be a lot of dedicated chaps on here.... well done guys...keep up the good work....
> 
> :thumb:


Cheers Cuey, whats also great is the lack of Ego but loads of support & help :thumb:


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> hi guys, well time i joined this thread after much reading of it, tho the only thing i've lifted recently is my fat bod off the sofa ...:doubleshot
> haven't lifted weights for some years now and although am planning on starting the SL5x5 soon (many thanks to doug for info and encouragement:thumb i think i need to start simple and practice a little form 1st plus teach my body to move and lift again...
> thinking of doing a couple o weeks of something similar to barefacedgeeks routine a few posts earlier...?
> it'll be minus the dips or chins as at 17stone+ i know i couldn't do them yet..:doublesho
> what do you think..?
> rgds stu


I'm actually still following SL, though I have switched from 5x5 to 3x5 mainly to save time . 
The routine I did last night was both workouts in one session using only my warmup sets. Normally, I'd finish each exercise with proper work sets.
I've added dip and chins, usually on alternate days as assistance exercises. I use a resistance band to help with my dips and chins, which gives me 30kg of lift.
The ab-wheel rollouts are usually done on off days.

I'd also recommend just starting with the standard SL5x5 routine. Since you start with an empty bar, it will be light enough to learn form with little risk of injury. 
You'll also find your form will need revising as the weight goes up anyway e.g. the form you had for a 50kg squat will probably be different to the form you have at 100kg, only because you have to sharpen up your form as the weight goes up - and you won't know to sharpen it up until something doesn't go quite right.


----------



## The Cueball

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers Cuey, whats also great is the lack of Ego but loads of support & help :thumb:


Always a good thing mate...

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

The Cueball said:


> Always a good thing mate...
> 
> :thumb:


An ego is just so much extra weight we dont want to lift  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cheers for replies guys...:thumb: start with the SL 5x5 it is then..was planning on using just the bar anyway to try and get form right and ease my tired old bod into it.. good idea with a box i think for getting depth of squat right...watched one of mehdis vids on the squat the other day and realised i'd only ever done a partial squat before!!
> still reading through this thread but at 120 something pages it'll take a while :doublesho
> little concerned how much i'll be able to do with my marcy smith machine as the bar is fixed on the vertical posts so think that'll restrict range of movement too much for squats/deadlifts/OHP etc but i have a seperate bar anyway and am currently in the process of clearing the garage to make room...
> cheers, rgds stu:thumb:


If you really get into this Stu & you clear the garage, get your self a power rack, bench & Olympic weights set, I've done reviews on the setup I've got to help peeps decide (James has the same set up :thumb 
Should pay for itself within 12 -24 months gym fees :thumb:

The smith machine will limit your movement & reduce the use of your stabiliser muscles; in fact I would say a power rack is the only way to go now.
You've got into it at a bad time the sale price has gone on the Olympic weights set 

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...odypower_235kg_olympic_weight_set/9028_p.html
http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf475-heavy-power-rack.php
http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf430-heavy-duty-flatinclinedecline-bench.php
Approx cost £874 inc vat & delivery.

See how easy it is to spend someone elses money 

If youve got enough free weights use them with the rack & your bench, will save you loads in the meantime & also it will give you time to decide if this is for you :thumb:

Also if your in a garage, get some nice flooring & a heater if its cold in the winter :devil:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> If you really get into this Stu & you clear the garage, get your self a power rack, bench & Olympic weights set, I've done reviews on the setup I've got to help peeps decide (James has the same set up :thumb
> Should pay for itself within 12 -24 months gym fees :thumb:
> 
> The smith machine will limit your movement & reduce the use of your stabiliser muscles; in fact I would say a power rack is the only way to go now.
> You've got into it at a bad time the sale price has gone on the Olympic weights set
> 
> http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk...odypower_235kg_olympic_weight_set/9028_p.html
> http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf475-heavy-power-rack.php
> http://www.powerhouse-fitness.co.uk/bodymax-cf430-heavy-duty-flatinclinedecline-bench.php
> Approx cost £874 inc vat & delivery.
> 
> See how easy it is to spend someone elses money
> 
> If youve got enough free weights use them with the rack & your bench, will save you loads in the meantime & also it will give you time to decide if this is for you :thumb:
> 
> Also if your in a garage, get some nice flooring & a heater if its cold in the winter :devil:


read your post doug on your rack/bench/olympic weights, (very nice mate:thumb will have to wait awhile til i can get those but as have a seperate barbell and approx 150kgs standard plates (way more than enough for now) and planning on using these off of the bench or even removing the vertical guide bars from smith machine, then that should do me for now..

as for the garage, have carpet on the floor and a gasfire for winter (plus a tv,dvd,stereo  )-mrs sfstu has suggested several times that i should move in..:devil:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> read your post doug on your rack/bench/olympic weights, (very nice mate:thumb will have to wait awhile til i can get those but as have a seperate barbell and approx 150kgs standard plates (way more than enough for now) and planning on using these off of the bench or even removing the vertical guide bars from smith machine, then that should do me for now..
> 
> as for the garage, have carpet on the floor and a gasfire for winter (plus a tv,dvd,stereo  )-mrs sfstu has suggested several times that i should move in..:devil:
> rgds stu


:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Someone owed a friend of a friend a favour, so I cashed it in  These arrived today :thumb:

Meticulously crafted in stainless steel - by Honeywell's aerospace division :thumb:

All weighing a precise .50KG :thumb:










Imagine a full Olympic set in the above material :argie::argie:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Someone owed a friend of a friend a favour, so I cashed it in  These arrived today :thumb:
> 
> Meticulously crafted in stainless steel - by Honeywell's aerospace division :thumb:
> 
> All weighing a precise .50KG :thumb:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Imagine a full Olympic set in the above material :argie::argie:


Wow Doug they look the nuts, any chance he wld make another set for the right price but they look expensive


----------



## Bod42

Wow Doug they look the nuts, any chance he wld make another set for the right price but they look expensive


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wow Doug they look the nuts, any chance he wld make another set for the right price but they look expensive


I'll ask :thumb:

All this stainless steel is supposed to help the aerospace industry


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday's workout

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift work set: 180X5* :thumb:

Boring but big

*Deadlift: 102.5X5X10

Stiff legged deadlift: 2X10 empty bar*

Deadlift felt heavy, not sure if I'm starting to get to my natural strength limit or the 30 degree heat is sapping my strength a bit. I will stay at 180Kg for next week to dominate the weight :devil:

:devil:My lower back is fried :devil:

James, I've sent an email asking about the stainless steel weights mate.
If not possible we can purchase from here: http://www.gymratz.co.uk/microloader-plates-250g :thumb:

Sizes: 0.125Kg, 0.25Kg and 0.5Kg :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> I would personally start the stronglift program as soon as possible. You can start with just the bar to get used to the exercise. I'm pretty sure a lot of the guys in here are 16-17 stones and were still making progress. If you cant do Dips / Chins you can assist with your legs or buy a band and use that to help you. If you need to practise squats I suggest finding a Box of some sort and getting used to the depth, I normally suggest a 14" Box for most people but if you struggle with your flexibility you can start higher and slowly work your way down.


as above, what sort of strength and size band do i need..? had a quick look on fleabay but there's over 1700 resistance bands..:doublesho i'm approx 17stone at the mo and haven't done a chin or pull up for probably 15 years..

did have several other questions but have just read through the stronglifts pdf doug sent me thumb and i think that has answered most of my questions...for now..

have realised my smith machine is no use to me for this program so will be selling sometime soon and getting a powerack...for the meantime tho, gonna try and adapt it by removing the vertical posts/runners so bar will be free and will have some sort of stop to rest bar on...:speechles
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> as above, what sort of strength and size band do i need..? had a quick look on fleabay but there's over 1700 resistance bands..:doublesho i'm approx 17stone at the mo and haven't done a chin or pull up for probably 15 years..
> 
> did have several other questions but have just read through the stronglifts pdf doug sent me thumb and i think that has answered most of my questions...for now..
> 
> have realised my smith machine is no use to me for this program so will be selling sometime soon and getting a powerack...for the meantime tho, gonna try and adapt it by removing the vertical posts/runners so bar will be free and will have some sort of stop to rest bar on...:speechles
> rgds stu


I wouldn't even worry about the bands yet Stu, follow one of the routines in the pdf's, Strong Lifts or Starting Strength, concentrate on getting stronger & back into it first :thumb:

Don't get to concerned about not being able to do many chins if any, when you see light guys doing 10 reps per set, consider this, imagine if you put weight on their bodies so they weighed the same as us (108kg) & watch them not being able to chin either :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi doug, gonna be starting i think on the stronglifts programme (v3) i think...will be a few days yet as still sorting garage/smith routine etc...not excuses! but wanna make sure i've got what i need so i can't make excuses..
workout b has pullups and chin ups done alternating workouts? and i have long wanted to be able to do pull ups...:devil: think i read that you need 41in/1m lengths but not sure plus they come in different strengths/resistances..?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi doug, gonna be starting i think on the stronglifts programme (v3) i think...will be a few days yet as still sorting garage/smith routine etc...not excuses! but wanna make sure i've got what i need so i can't make excuses..
> workout b has pullups and chin ups done alternating workouts? and i have long wanted to be able to do pull ups...:devil: think i read that you need 41in/1m lengths but not sure plus they come in different strengths/resistances..?
> rgds stu


Haven't seen that version.

If you go back to the first page of this thread you will see how James & I started :thumb:

If you are heavy & cannot do chins very well i see no point in doing them at the start, you want to get your barbell work in first Stu, learn technique & get a real feel for the main lifts.

Strong lifts does change its routine around a lot, try this mate.

*Workout A
Squat 
Bench Press
Barbell Row

Workout B
Squat
Press
Deadlift*

I very quickly moved the bench press as my first exercise on workout A as I found squatting first sapped my energy & it affected my bench press performance.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Monday's Workout

*Bench press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench press work set: 115X3 well pleased!!!!!* :thumb::thumb:

Boring but big

*Bench press: 75X5X10

Barbell row: 62.5X5X10*

Dam good workout all around, stopped at 3 reps on the bench press as I didn't think I could of completed the 4th rep. Still 3 reps of 115kg is a new PR  :thumb:

Assistance work is starting to feel really good too :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Haven't seen that version.
> 
> If you go back to the first page of this thread you will see how James & I started :thumb:
> 
> If you are heavy & cannot do chins very well i see no point in doing them at the start, you want to get your barbell work in first Stu, learn technique & get a real feel for the main lifts.
> 
> Strong lifts does change its routine around a lot, try this mate.
> 
> *Workout A
> Squat
> Bench Press
> Barbell Row
> 
> Workout B
> Squat
> Press
> Deadlift*
> 
> I very quickly moved the bench press as my first exercise on workout A as I found squatting first sapped my energy & it affected my bench press performance.
> 
> :thumb:


hi doug, ok, seems i already had in my docs file a copy of stronglifts 5x5 (ver 3) which i thought was one of the ones you'd sent me.. i'm not too clever with computers and converting/extracting files, as you can plainly see! but have read this pdf 1st... it lists for starting out:

workout A
squat 5x5
bench press 5x5
inverted press 3xf (this is to replace barbell rows, as recommended as safer/easier for beginner)
push ups 3xf
reverse crunch 3x12

workout B
squat 5x5
overhead press 5x5
deadlift 1x5
pullups/chins 3xf (these to alternate per workout)
prone bridges 3x30sec

still needing to read through the other pdf's you sent, the above one was what i focused on making notes from..! doh..!

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi doug, ok, seems i already had in my docs file a copy of stronglifts 5x5 (ver 3) which i thought was one of the ones you'd sent me.. i'm not too clever with computers and converting/extracting files, as you can plainly see! but have read this pdf 1st... it lists for starting out:
> 
> workout A
> squat 5x5
> bench press 5x5
> inverted press 3xf (this is to replace barbell rows, as recommended as safer/easier for beginner)
> push ups 3xf
> reverse crunch 3x12
> 
> workout B
> squat 5x5
> overhead press 5x5
> deadlift 1x5
> pullups/chins 3xf (these to alternate per workout)
> prone bridges 3x30sec
> 
> still needing to read through the other pdf's you sent, the above one was what i focused on making notes from..! doh..!
> 
> rgds stu


Not sure why its changed so much, i would stick to the basic older 5X5 or starting strength :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stu, ive just gone on the SL site, dont know were you got your 5X5, but on the page of the site the workout is plain for all to see :thumb:

StrongLifts 5x5 Workout A
*Squat 5x5
Bench Press 5x5
Barbell Rows 5x5*

StrongLifts 5x5 Workout B
*Squat 5x5
Overhead Press 5x5
Deadlift 1x5*

*Stronglifts web page:* 
http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/

Even the links from the main page takes you to the above workout :thumb:
http://stronglifts.com/ :thumb:

Hope that's made it clear for you mate, enjoy :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi doug, embarrassingly, have just discovered that the pdf 5x5 i have is dated 2010..:doublesho:doublesho don't even remember downloading it (usually dont bother downloading anything as dont really know what i'm doing!)..
will go with the current one you've shown i think, especially for starting off...
not sure about what weights to start off with tho..? 1st couple of weeks i'll be just using the bar +10kg=20kg (don't have olympic bar) but after that not sure...just started reading up on the starting strength book..:thumb:
cheers for checking for me tho..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

I believe it is SLv2 that has those assistance exercises. He dropped them in v3 for a number of reasons.

Start all exercises at 20kg (inc weight of the bar) and increase by 2.5kg on each successive session (dead is +5kg).


----------



## Bod42

sfstu: I agree with what Doug said, just do the standard program as he laid out in Post #1245. 

And then add weight as per BareFacedGeek post above. Everytime you complete 5 sets of 5 reps increase the weight by 2.5kg on Bench Press, Shoulder Press, Squats and 5kg on Deadlifts. This will seem really light at first but your adding 7.5kg to your squat per week so in just a month your be doing 50kg squats, 2 months 80kg squats. Better to start to light than to heavy and burn yourself out.

I know there is a stronglift app out now that calculates everything for you.

Apologises regarding my previous post and the suggestion of a band to help with Dips/Chins. Yes this is a good way to train Dips/Chins and get extra volume in but I would do the Stronglift program as written and dont add or subtract anything from it. Its a very program but works really well.


----------



## sfstu

cheers all for replies (and patience!)...:thumb:
got it now and will be starting the one doug mentioned in #1245...hopefully this weekend...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Deload Week
Monday Workout: Done Tuesday
Chest Medicine Ball Throws: 3 x 5
Bench Press: 45 x 5, 60 x 5, 70 x 5
Pendlay Rows: 60 x 3 x 5
Dips: BW 3 x 10

I completed this workout in like 15-20mins, its my deload week so these are really light workouts just to keep you active. Its good to have a rest before the higher volume next week.

Its surprising how light weights feel with just a few kgs off. Like Pendlay Rows my best is 80kg for 8 reps and 60 actually felt like nothing.

Dips always feel good and as my shoulder is feeling the best its felt in years they feel even better and its nice to have a tricep pump once in a while.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deload Week
> Monday Workout: Done Tuesday
> Chest Medicine Ball Throws: 3 x 5
> Bench Press: 45 x 5, 60 x 5, 70 x 5
> Pendlay Rows: 60 x 3 x 5
> Dips: BW 3 x 10
> 
> I completed this workout in like 15-20mins, its my deload week so these are really light workouts just to keep you active. Its good to have a rest before the higher volume next week.
> 
> *Its surprising how light weights feel with just a few kgs off. Like Pendlay Rows my best is 80kg for 8 reps and 60 actually felt like nothing.*
> Dips always feel good and as my shoulder is feeling the best its felt in years they feel even better and its nice to have a tricep pump once in a while.


Same here mate, on the BBB all the weights feel a lot lighter than you expect after the full work set. I'm using BBB to create more explosive power & push out controlled/quick reps hoping this will carry over to the work sets :thumb:


----------



## Guest

My first full session in far too long.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Deloaded by 15-20% on all exercises. Going to spend the next 2-3 weeks returning to my previous levels.
All exercises went well tonight. Felt very positive on all the lifts. No DOMS this morning so hopefully I've got used to lifting again.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> My first full session in far too long.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Row*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dips*
> WU: None
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Deloaded by 15-20% on all exercises. Going to spend the next 2-3 weeks returning to my previous levels.
> All exercises went well tonight. Felt very positive on all the lifts. No DOMS this morning so hopefully I've got used to lifting again.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


And about bloody time 

Welcome back Phil :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday's workout

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat work set: 170X5*

Boring but big

*Squat: 105X5X10

Standing calf raise: 105X5X10*

This time I got the bar too low aaaaaa!!! I was determined to lift so I took off all the plates, re racked & re loaded the bar with 170Kg, got the position correct & made 5 reps as though it was a warm up weight 

Note to self: Not only is it important to get the bar position correct, *IT IS CRITICAL *to get the bar in the correct position for a successful set.

I will go back to 175kg next squat session & concentrate on getting the bloody bar in the right position :thumb:

Still a very good workout :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesdays Deload Workout:
Jumps: 3x5
Squats: 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x5
Bulgarian Split Squats: BW x 3 x 10
Ab Work

Easy workout only took 15-20mins again. Concentrated on getting the reps done as soon as possible and didnt worry about rest periods just lifted when I was ready.

Nice squats there Doug. I can get under the bar and put the bar straight into the right position but I still go through my little routine each time to make sure the bar is in exactly the right place. 

I sit the bar lightly on the bones at the top of my shoulder blades and push so it hurts slightly as its directly on the bone, I then tense my upper back hard and pull my elbows together, then i slide the bar down until it hits the slot my rear delts have made. If you put slight forward pressure on the bar with your arms I find that when you slide the bar down it will find that slot everytime and it cant go to low as the shelve your rear delt makes stops it. Bad explaination but hopefully you get what I mean. It doesnt work at lighter weights so try it with some weight on the bar.

Dont no if that will help but its a routine I use everytime to get the bar in the right place.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesdays Deload Workout:
> Jumps: 3x5
> Squats: 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x5
> Bulgarian Split Squats: BW x 3 x 10
> Ab Work
> 
> Easy workout only took 15-20mins again. Concentrated on getting the reps done as soon as possible and didnt worry about rest periods just lifted when I was ready.
> 
> Nice squats there Doug. I can get under the bar and put the bar straight into the right position but I still go through my little routine each time to make sure the bar is in exactly the right place.
> 
> I sit the bar lightly on the bones at the top of my shoulder blades and push so it hurts slightly as its directly on the bone, I then tense my upper back hard and pull my elbows together, then i slide the bar down until it hits the slot my rear delts have made. If you put slight forward pressure on the bar with your arms I find that when you slide the bar down it will find that slot everytime and it cant go to low as the shelve your rear delt makes stops it. Bad explaination but hopefully you get what I mean. It doesnt work at lighter weights so try it with some weight on the bar.
> 
> Dont no if that will help but its a routine I use everytime to get the bar in the right place.


Thanks James, i should know better really 

I take an overall view of my powerlifting & to be honest the few setbacks I've had aren't a big deal. The squat is just another learning curve, in some way I'm glad of these little hurdles, it should make me a much better lifter in the long run :thumb:

I'm going to put 175kg back on the bar next time :thumb: :devil: I'm also focusing more on the depth of my squat which has stalled me a little, last nights was 5 good parallel or below reps :thumb::thumb:

Still working on the stainless weights for you mate DI'm quietly confident )


----------



## Christianmp

A little update:
*Saturday workout *:was hung over from fridays binge-drinking, only 5 hours of sleep, but the weights wanted attention.

Squats: 20x10, 40x6, 60x5, 60x5, 70x5, 70x5, 75x5
Half arsed approach to the squats, work sets should have been 87.5kg.

OHP: 20x10, 30x5, 40x5, 47.5x5x5
My favourite lift. Just feels awesome. 50kg milestone next OHP-workout.

Deadlift: 60x5, 80x5, 100x5
Good form and awesome feeling afterwards. My first 3-digit lift since starting this whole lifting adventure.

-----------------
*Tuesday*: Bike-ride for ~40km
-----------------
*Wednesday workout*:
Squats: 20x10, 40x5, 60x5, 87.5x5x5
Excellent squat workout yesterday. Bar placement spot on everytime, good form, "easy" lifts.

Benchpress: 20x10, 40x5, 67.5x5x5

Pendlay rows: 50x5, 57.5x5x2, had to deload 55x5x3. 

And then some fcukarounditis work
Dead: 50x10
Clean: 50x1
Frontsquats 50x5.
Push-ups: 20 - 10 - 20
Chin-ups: 5 - 3 - 2 (strict, from dead hang).


----------



## sfstu

been reading your workout guys over last week or so and getting a little confused with your warmups vs actual worksets..? are you all doing different workouts (5x5, other, etc)?
doug for example,
Wednesday’s workout

Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 – 100X3 – 120X2 – 140X1

Squat work set: 170X5

Boring but big

Squat: 105X5X10

i get the warmup (though how exactly do you pick the weight for a warmup in relation to the actual weight for the exercise?) but there is listed
squat warm up
squat work set
then squat...?

rgds stu
p.s. i know there is gonna be an obvious answer and i'm gonna regret asking..!


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> i get the warmup (though how exactly do you pick the weight for a warmup in relation to the actual weight for the exercise?) but there is listed
> squat warm up
> squat work set
> then squat...?
> 
> rgds stu
> p.s. i know there is gonna be an obvious answer and i'm gonna regret asking..!


It's different routines.

The classic starting strength worksets are something like:
Monday Workout 1 Squat 3x5, bench 3x5, powerclean 5x3
Wednesday Workout 2 Squat 3x5, press 3x5, chins 3 x max reps possible. 
etc

Stronglifts I think is the same but 5x5

The routine you're looking at above is Jim Wendler's 5\3\1. It's 
Main lift 3x5 e.g. squat
Ancillary 1 5x10 e.g. lighter squats
Ancillary 2 5x10 e.g. leg raises

Warmups tend to be a percentage of the main lift with decreasing reps.

I'm reading up on it myself at the moment, so am sure others here are able to fill in specifics or omissions.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> been reading your workout guys over last week or so and getting a little confused with your warmups vs actual worksets..? are you all doing different workouts (5x5, other, etc)?
> doug for example,
> Wednesday's workout
> 
> Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> Squat work set: 170X5
> 
> Boring but big
> 
> Squat: 105X5X10
> 
> i get the warmup (though how exactly do you pick the weight for a warmup in relation to the actual weight for the exercise?) but there is listed
> squat warm up
> squat work set
> then squat...?
> 
> rgds stu
> p.s. i know there is gonna be an obvious answer and i'm gonna regret asking..!


Hi stu,

 Confused, No, you will be 

First of all I'm doing a workout that's just made up by myself & others.
It's a basic 4 day routine, the warm up weights were given to me by Dan (sidewalkdances) & they don't change. They seem to work very well, Dan know his shiit :thumb:

My work sets is a 1X5.

The assistance work is the boring but big routine from Wendlers 5/3/1, but as advised by Dan :thumb: I'm adding 2.5kg to the weights each week as long as I can get 5 sets of 10 reps, so in a way the BBB is very much like a bodybuilding routine with the progressive overload principle added to keep the body from getting used to the weight. Again I'm already getting results, I feel a lot stronger, fitter & much more flexible :thumb:

I would do the 5X5 as I did first Stu :thumb:

Hope I've explained clearly, if not ask away mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stu,

Edit from above^^^^^^^^^

Progressive overload principle, brief/basic overview: :thumb:

*1.* 10 is my max rep goal & I've given myself a training range from 8-10 reps. I aim for a max of 10 reps each set, if reached I will add 2.5kg, with the new weight I will now aim for a minimum of 8 reps per set, but push for 10 per set & stop as soon as 10 reps acheived, *medium volume/medium intensity*.

Some will do it this way. 

*2.* If 10 is your max rep goal, then your training range can be 7-9. This way you add weight every time you exceed your range by one or more reps, you can increase the intensity further by aiming to exceed the rep range & training to positive failure, however this will exhaust your muscles much quicker & more than likely stop you from completing all the sets, *low volume/high intensity*.

Or you can mix it up by alternating between the two principles. As long it doesn't interfere with the work set *(Revovery is hit harder with high intensity training). *

*I would still stick to the basic 5X5 for now, don't be fooled by its simplicity :thumb:*


----------



## sfstu

cheers for clearing that up, i think... was getting a little confused reading some of you guys posts from last week or 2..
still happy to stick to the orig 5x5 and although it looks basic, have read up a fair bit on it and understand the reasons given by mehdi for that and i think thats what i need anyway for now so will be doing that for next 12 weeks at least..:thumb: 
not had a chance this week to disassemble and reassemble my smith machine but thats gonna be happening this weekend and will be making a start on 5x5 then..have a freind interested in buying my smith machine so tho that may take a few weeks think i will then be looking at the rack that you have and reviewed doug, as from what i've read so far the smith machine has not helped me in the past with the dodgy shoulder i have..
confident that back to basics or old school training is what i need...:thumb:
cheers, rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Stu I have the same rack and bench as Doug and I will always recommend to people. Its a great product for the price and it will improve your lifting especially if you train on yoru own as it will allow you to push your training without any risk of danger.

You got the right idea changing out your Smith machine as I would actually go as far to say they are slightly dangerous as they can put your body in unnatural positions.

I would start with Stronglift 5x5 as this turns into 3x5 and then 1x5 eventually so its def the best program for beginners


----------



## sfstu

cheers for reply/info bod...:thumb: i read similar comments on the smith machine and when i did used to use it i used to get pain in my shoulder when doing bench press (tho not doing seated dumbell OHP?) and i know i couldn't squat with it...nice machine but not for me i think...
theres a bodymax rack/bench/weights going on ebay today (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/180893630401?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649), i know its the model down from the ones you guys have but for the price was wondering if it would be ok for me..? i'm approx 110kg at the mo (hopeing to reduce that!) and think it'll be a little while til i'm squatting or pressing that weight but what do you think...?
i have weight plates at the mo but not olys and will prob be awhile til i can afford a set of oly weights..?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cheers for reply/info bod...:thumb: i read similar comments on the smith machine and when i did used to use it i used to get pain in my shoulder when doing bench press (tho not doing seated dumbell OHP?) and i know i couldn't squat with it...nice machine but not for me i think...
> theres a bodymax rack/bench/weights going on ebay today (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/180893630401?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649), i know its the model down from the ones you guys have but for the price was wondering if it would be ok for me..? i'm approx 110kg at the mo (hopeing to reduce that!) and think it'll be a little while til i'm squatting or pressing that weight but what do you think...?
> i have weight plates at the mo but not olys and will prob be awhile til i can afford a set of oly weights..?
> rgds stu


Max weight is only 180kg , I'm squatting 170-175kg within less than 7 months of starting, it looks a good price, but what if you outgrew this in less than 12 months of training?

If you think you'll not go over the recommended max weight then it's a very good buy (depending on condition) :thumb:

I bought my rack because it gave me the max weight capability to do a 230kg/500lb squat in safety :thumb:

If you think the max weight on this rack is as far as you want to go its worth looking at.

Doesn't really matter about the weights, you could use the standard set for as long as you like or as long as the standard bar holds out.

What are your fitness goals with weight training Stu?


----------



## sfstu

Hi doug, not _too_ concerned about the max weight of 180kg but does this apply to the bench as well as that could become a prob with BP? As far as goals, for the moment i want to lose fat, build muscle as well as increase strength (doesnt everybody) but not gonna be entering any competitions or have a certain weight i wanna lift..?
That said, have always wanted to BP 100kgs...
Rgds stu


----------



## The Cueball

ITHAQVA said:


> Someone owed a friend of a friend a favour, so I cashed it in  These arrived today :thumb:
> 
> Meticulously crafted in stainless steel - by Honeywell's aerospace division :thumb:
> 
> All weighing a precise .50KG :thumb:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Imagine a full Olympic set in the above material :argie::argie:


What a complete waste of time and material, over the top, not needed...

Love 'em! :argie::argie::argie::argie::argie::argie:

Always good so something machined eh.... :lol:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

The Cueball said:


> What a complete waste of time and material, over the top, not needed...
> 
> Love 'em! :argie::argie::argie::argie::argie::argie:
> 
> Always good so something machined eh.... :lol:
> 
> :thumb:




They are things of beauty Cuey :thumb: 

And we have wasted some more material  (The Aerospace industry will have to wait its turn), I've got 8 more on the way, 4X.50 (For James, he doesn't know about this yet shhhhhh ) & 4 X.25 for me . All Stainless steel too


----------



## ITHAQVA

Friday's workout

*Overhead Press warm up sets: 20X3X3 - 30X3 - 40X2 - 50X1

Overhead Press work set: 50X5*

Part boring but big

*Overhead Press 30X5X10*

Not sure why but low reps just feel all wrong on the overhead press & I don't feel warmed up at all after doing the warm up sets. I'm going to change the work set to an 8-10 rep regime & increase my warm up volume. And the extra reps will help towards fitness & reducing my body fat % :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

sfstu said:


> Hi doug, not _too_ concerned about the max weight of 180kg but does this apply to the bench as well as that could become a prob with BP? As far as goals, for the moment i want to lose fat, build muscle as well as increase strength (doesnt everybody) but not gonna be entering any competitions or have a certain weight i wanna lift..?
> That said, have always wanted to BP 100kgs...
> Rgds stu


further to my above reply (was at work using my mobile for internet which is hard work with walls sized fingers!)..

goals...as i said earlier, main reasons right now for picking up the weights are:

A/ wanting to lose weight/fat...i know muscle weighs heavier than fat but wanna get out of 40" trousers.. i'm over 17stone at the mo and ideally would like to reduce this by a couple of stone as at 40 am pretty sure its not good for me ..bought some of those cheap plastic fat calipers the other day and according to those i'm approx. 30% body fat..:doublesho so ideally i'd like to half that...

B/ wanting to gain muscle...like most, i'd like to build muscle in the upper area-chest,shoulders,arms,back...being brutally honest, i'm kinda pear shaped at the moment, carrying most of the excess weight/fat on my lower half...thats why i had earlier questions/doubts concerning the amount of squats in the 5x5 routine...my legs and backside have always been big and would ideally like to *not* increase their size, although i am aware that its not possible to spot reduce fat...if i can reduce fat overall than i don't mind having big legs etc if its muscle and kinda defined and especially if i can build a better/bigger upper half...?

C/ wanting to increase strength...i am so weak these days compared to my younger days... have always been a "blue collar" worker and done fairly physical work but i used to be fairly strong which matched my build (which has never been slim..!)...that said, i can't see me entering weight lifting competitions or bragging with guys at work about how much i can lift just for the one-upmanship...?

i think/hope my goals are fairly realistic as i am well aware that all of the above won't be a fast process but i feel its kinda now or never age wise and don't wanna have to keep avoiding things like my kids sports days as too embarrassed about my size/shape to attend and have to compete...!:doublesho
ideally, i would like to feel fitter and stronger and i would like to be in good enough muscular shape to not be ashamed to take my top off in the summer and also to have people say "he's in pretty good shape for his age"...
rgds stu
p.s. didn't win the ebay auction earlier for the rack...it jumped from £205 to £270 in the last few seconds...


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> further to my above reply (was at work using my mobile for internet which is hard work with walls sized fingers!)..
> 
> goals...as i said earlier, main reasons right now for picking up the weights are:
> 
> A/ wanting to lose weight/fat...i know muscle weighs heavier than fat but wanna get out of 40" trousers.. i'm over 17stone at the mo and ideally would like to reduce this by a couple of stone as at 40 am pretty sure its not good for me ..bought some of those cheap plastic fat calipers the other day and according to those i'm approx. 30% body fat..:doublesho so ideally i'd like to half that...
> 
> B/ wanting to gain muscle...like most, i'd like to build muscle in the upper area-chest,shoulders,arms,back...being brutally honest, i'm kinda pear shaped at the moment, carrying most of the excess weight/fat on my lower half...thats why i had earlier questions/doubts concerning the amount of squats in the 5x5 routine...my legs and backside have always been big and would ideally like to *not* increase their size, although i am aware that its not possible to spot reduce fat...if i can reduce fat overall than i don't mind having big legs etc if its muscle and kinda defined and especially if i can build a better/bigger upper half...?
> 
> C/ wanting to increase strength...i am so weak these days compared to my younger days... have always been a "blue collar" worker and done fairly physical work but i used to be fairly strong which matched my build (which has never been slim..!)...that said, i can't see me entering weight lifting competitions or bragging with guys at work about how much i can lift just for the one-upmanship...?
> 
> i think/hope my goals are fairly realistic as i am well aware that all of the above won't be a fast process but i feel its kinda now or never age wise and don't wanna have to keep avoiding things like my kids sports days as too embarrassed about my size/shape to attend and have to compete...!:doublesho
> ideally, i would like to feel fitter and stronger and i would like to be in good enough muscular shape to not be ashamed to take my top off in the summer and also to have people say "he's in pretty good shape for his age"...
> rgds stu
> p.s. didn't win the ebay auction earlier for the rack...it jumped from £205 to £270 in the last few seconds...


Good goals mate.

I think powerlifting IS for you, but also once you've done your 5X5 & maybe a 3X5, I would be inclined to do as I am, add some 10 rep stuff to help with fitness add more muscle mass & symmetry :thumb:

Don't worry about age Stu , I'm 44 in July :thumb:

You would be fine with the lower safety weight rack too. You could give yourself the goal of Squatting/deadlifting 180Kg & whatever you want on the bench press as I doubt you'll be benching more than 180Kg.

You could also do a modified powerlifting routine with more reps (10) once you get to the point of training with a 4 day split. As long as you keep the basic/multi joint exercises as your core routine :thumb:

*1. Bod42 is doing a high rep routine (Juggernaut method) im sure he is getting really fit & strong with it.

2. Sidewalkdances i think does a 4 day split (Throws heavy weights around like an animal)

3. Barefacedgeek is doing a 3X5 with extra work added at the end.

4. Me im just doing a 4 day split 1X5 work set & 2X5 sets of 10 reps boring but big from wendlers 5/3/1, except my overhead press which im going to train with an 8-10 rep range to get back into the lift & work from there, might stay on the higher range or move to a 5 rep range *

4 different approaches but we have many goals in common :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

cheers for reply doug..:thumb: thats the other reason i feel confident about reaching goals, encouragement and support from you guys on here..
not really worried about my age mate, but am aware that if i don't do something soon then it won't get any easier..!:devil: starting to get aches and pains (usual suspects like back and knees etc) that are all down to poor fitness/lack of exercise and as i have 3 young kids i wanna keep up with them..:thumb:
think a lower rated rack like that 180kg probably would be ok for me if one came along on ebay or something, as you say, doubt i'll be benching more than 180kg:doublesho. would love to be able to bench a 100kg tho...when i used to bumble through weight training when i was younger i think i only ever got to about 60kgs but then i didn't have the wordly knowledge i have now or the internet with info available such as you guys and this forum...
not gonna worry about the more advanced routines for now either...gonna do the 5x5 for the 12 weeks then see from there...like the look of the version 3 5x5 that i got confused with earlier, the one with the chins and dips added..?
we'll see...
rgds stu


----------



## SAL73R

I did a bench press 1RM today, I was quite disappointed as I have training on and off for the best part of 18 months and could on manage 95kg where as the lad I have been training with since day 1 is lifting 120kg. I am by no means a big kid (20 years old and I weigh 77kg) but I feel like I'm being left behind.


----------



## ITHAQVA

SAL73R said:


> I did a bench press 1RM today, I was quite disappointed as I have training on and off for the best part of 18 months and could on manage 95kg where as the lad I have been training with since day 1 is lifting 120kg. I am by no means a big kid (20 years old and I weigh 77kg) but I feel like I'm being left behind.


We are all built different mate. When you say you have been training on & off that might give you a clue to why your bench 1rm is 95Kg :thumb:

Keep training mate :devil:

What routine are you following?


----------



## SAL73R

I say I and off it's more miss a session every couple of months then a week off here and there due to working 12 hour shifts and other commitments. 
We train each muscle group say chest and triceps, back and bi's usually doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

SAL73R said:


> I say I and off it's more miss a session every couple of months then a week off here and there due to working 12 hour shifts and other commitments.
> We train each muscle group say chest and triceps, back and bi's usually doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps.


Thats not bad :thumb:

If you want to lift heavy though, you really need to move over to a 5 rep powerlifting routine. But this also Depends on what your goals are. An 8-10 rep range is more suited for size/bodybuilding, i'm assuming thats what you do?

What about legs/lower back?

Do you split your muscle groups, ie do you do a 4 day split?

*Just to add though, if you want to be muscular it's HOW you lift not HOW MUCH you lift* :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Last nights session

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Chins* (supersetted with deads)
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squats felt heavier than expected, unlike my last session. 
I'm putting this down to too much work (working past midnight on Friday, as I have been doing a lot recently), poor sleep and not eating enough (trying to cut my carb intake but not balancing it by suitably increasing fats and protein).
OHP went really well - no problems here.
Dead was ok, again heavier than expected. Didn't brace my core well enough on the 1st set. Concentrated on doing that one the other sets and the lifts went much better.

Contemplating wearing my belt for WO sets on Squat and Dead to help brace my core. Was trying to put off wearing a belt until around 1.5xBW on lifts, but maybe wearing a belt will help train me to brace my core better with/without a belt.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Last nights session
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Chins* (supersetted with deads)
> WU: None
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Squats felt heavier than expected, unlike my last session.
> I'm putting this down to too much work (working past midnight on Friday, as I have been doing a lot recently), poor sleep and not eating enough (trying to cut my carb intake but not balancing it by suitably increasing fats and protein).
> OHP went really well - no problems here.
> Dead was ok, again heavier than expected. Didn't brace my core well enough on the 1st set. Concentrated on doing that one the other sets and the lifts went much better.
> 
> Contemplating wearing my belt for WO sets on Squat and Dead to help brace my core. Was trying to put off wearing a belt until around 1.5xBW on lifts, but maybe wearing a belt will help train me to brace my core better with/without a belt.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Nice one Phil :thumb:

I use the belt for the last warm up set (Dead & Squat) so i get a better feel for it when on the work set, only have it so it goes a little tight when at the bottom of the squat & deadlift, so as to keep my core strong :thumb:

Just started doing HIT yesterday to help with fitness & fat reduction. Will try 3X 10 min sessions this week, then move up to until I do 20 mins 3X week :thumb:

I also use the belt for Barbell rows :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> They are things of beauty Cuey :thumb:
> 
> And we have wasted some more material  (The Aerospace industry will have to wait its turn), I've got 8 more on the way, 4X.50 (For James, he doesn't know about this yet shhhhhh ) & 4 X.25 for me . All Stainless steel too


Doug u realise I can read your posts, the shhhh so I don't find out doesn't really work :thumb:.

Cheers Doug your the man. Let me know how much coin I owe you.



SAL73R said:


> I say I and off it's more miss a session every couple of months then a week off here and there due to working 12 hour shifts and other commitments.
> We train each muscle group say chest and triceps, back and bi's usually doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps.


As Doug said really, if you want more strength move to a lower rep range like 5reps. I would say 3 sets of 5i s best. Also don't worry about small body parts and hitting the muscle from every angle I would do a simple barbell routine and 90% of people see better strength and muscle gain that the fashionable 3sets of 10 for 3exercises per body part. Read starting strength or stronglift for some ideas.

Phil I'm in a similar boat to you at the.moment, I haven't worn a belt for years as i always lifted for.rugby and I wanted my core to be as strong as possible but after Doug linked those mean looking belts a few pages back I'm really considering getting one. At least then if I compete I have a mean belt as i will only ever compete raw, belt.only


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug u realise I can read your posts, the shhhh so I don't find out doesn't really work :thumb:.
> 
> Cheers Doug your the man. Let me know how much coin I owe you.
> 
> As Doug said really, if you want more strength move to a lower rep range like 5reps. I would say 3 sets of 5i s best. Also don't worry about small body parts and hitting the muscle from every angle I would do a simple barbell routine and 90% of people see better strength and muscle gain that the fashionable 3sets of 10 for 3exercises per body part. Read starting strength or stronglift for some ideas.
> 
> Phil I'm in a similar boat to you at the.moment, I haven't worn a belt for years as i always lifted for.rugby and I wanted my core to be as strong as possible but after Doug linked those mean looking belts a few pages back I'm really considering getting one. At least then if I compete I have a mean belt as i will only ever compete raw, belt.only


Yeah I know James, that was the plan   :thumb:

I will hopefully be picking them up from work sometime next week mate, the only thing you might need to pay for is the postage :thumb:

Sundays Workout!

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

:devil: Deadlift work set: 180X5* :devil: :thumb:

Boring but big

*Deadlift: 105X5X10

Stiff legged deadlift: Empty bar (20kg) 3X10*

Excellent workout, deadlift felt much lighter this week, 5 full touch n go reps so im adding 2.5kg for next week :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

well, 1st workout just done...
managed to remove the vertical runner rails on my smith machine this morning leaving a free bar with just the hooks to hook them onto the vertical part of framework, and have stops to catch the bar when it gets heavier...this is only a temporary set up until i sell my smith machine and get a proper rack, its not ideal but will do for now...

did workout A, squats,bench press,barbell rows...

thoughts..? well, used the bar +10kg=20kg and knew it'd feel light but felt strange only doing 5 reps (got up to 8 reps before remembering it should only be 5 on 1st set of squats!!:doublesho) and lost count a couple o times of sets.. 
concentrated on technique/form and think i did ok...think i got low enough on squats but think i may make a box to take the guesswork and head movement out of it..? or may get the missus to film me (that'll be a laugh,she'll rip me for ages over that!..) from the side on my mobile to see what i'm really doing..
BP press felt way too light but tried to concentrate on grip and squeezing back/shoulder blades tight..
barbell rows felt a little awkward putting the bar on floor as i was using 2 x 5kg plates and as they're small obviously the bar is lower to the floor..
gonna do the 2 workouts with 20kg this week and possibly next week and treat as a learning curve...

i know after that that i'll be adding 2.5kg per workout but is that added to the 20kgs starting weight for all exercises or should i increase the weight to something a little heavier (30kgs for example)then start adding 2.5kg each time..?
i take it that over time, some exercises will be easier than others and may not be able to increase all exercises evenly..? (shoulder press for eg will become harder than bench press i would imagine..?)
so glad that i've finally made a start, really looking forward to doing this, just can't wait to get above the starting weight of 20kg..! i know that i need to start light and not go rushing ahead but...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> well, 1st workout just done...
> managed to remove the vertical runner rails on my smith machine this morning leaving a free bar with just the hooks to hook them onto the vertical part of framework, and have stops to catch the bar when it gets heavier...this is only a temporary set up until i sell my smith machine and get a proper rack, its not ideal but will do for now...
> 
> did workout A, squats,bench press,barbell rows...
> 
> thoughts..? well, used the bar +10kg=20kg and knew it'd feel light but felt strange only doing 5 reps (got up to 8 reps before remembering it should only be 5 on 1st set of squats!!:doublesho) and lost count a couple o times of sets..
> concentrated on technique/form and think i did ok...think i got low enough on squats but think i may make a box to take the guesswork and head movement out of it..? or may get the missus to film me (that'll be a laugh,she'll rip me for ages over that!..) from the side on my mobile to see what i'm really doing..
> BP press felt way too light but tried to concentrate on grip and squeezing back/shoulder blades tight..
> barbell rows felt a little awkward putting the bar on floor as i was using 2 x 5kg plates and as they're small obviously the bar is lower to the floor..
> gonna do the 2 workouts with 20kg this week and possibly next week and treat as a learning curve...
> 
> i know after that that i'll be adding 2.5kg per workout but is that added to the 20kgs starting weight for all exercises or should i increase the weight to something a little heavier (30kgs for example)then start adding 2.5kg each time..?
> i take it that over time, some exercises will be easier than others and may not be able to increase all exercises evenly..? (shoulder press for eg will become harder than bench press i would imagine..?)
> so glad that i've finally made a start, really looking forward to doing this, just can't wait to get above the starting weight of 20kg..! i know that i need to start light and not go rushing ahead but...
> rgds stu


Nice one Stu, welcome to the thread as a lifter :thumb:

Stick to the rule mate, add 2.5kg to all lifts as proscribed by SL 5X5.

You don't want to be forgetting how many reps you are doing, later when it gets heavier you could pre exhaust yourself & not make 5 reps on the last set/sets & that means not adding weight, there's an incentive for you 

Keep learning the techniques as you progress, especially as the weights get heavier it is critical to be lifting correctly & safely. 
I would say anything you need is contained within this thread, videos, info Q&A etc..

Don't forget to post your workouts; it will make it much easier for us to help you with any questions if we can see your progress etc…

Doug :thumb:


----------



## SAL73R

ITHAQVA said:


> Thats not bad :thumb:
> 
> If you want to lift heavy though, you really need to move over to a 5 rep powerlifting routine. But this also Depends on what your goals are. An 8-10 rep range is more suited for size/bodybuilding, i'm assuming thats what you do?
> 
> What about legs/lower back?
> 
> Do you split your muscle groups, ie do you do a 4 day split?
> 
> *Just to add though, if you want to be muscular it's HOW you lift not HOW MUCH you lift* :thumb:


I am training for rugby really not bodybuilding or powerlifting. I do do squats and dead lifts but not as often as I should. As for training I lift weights Monday Wednesday and Friday, then I go rugby training Tuesday and Thursday.


----------



## ITHAQVA

SAL73R said:


> I am training for rugby really not bodybuilding or powerlifting. I do do squats and dead lifts but not as often as I should. As for training I lift weights Monday Wednesday and Friday, then I go rugby training Tuesday and Thursday.


Bod42 is a rugby player & would be much better than me to give you advise :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Yeah I know James, that was the plan   :thumb:
> 
> I will hopefully be picking them up from work sometime next week mate, the only thing you might need to pay for is the postage :thumb:
> 
> Sundays Workout!
> 
> *Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> :devil: Deadlift work set: 180X5* :devil: :thumb:
> 
> Boring but big
> 
> *Deadlift: 105X5X10
> 
> Stiff legged deadlift: Empty bar (20kg) 3X10*
> 
> Excellent workout, deadlift felt much lighter this week, 5 full touch n go reps so im adding 2.5kg for next week :thumb:


Doug thats an awesome Deadlift, thats a big milestone having 4 plates on each side. You just lifting my record 1RM for 5 reps. Once I finished my Juggernaut program I will be changing to BBB. Did you see Wendler Q&A in Elitefts the other day he said you should split the year into 4 parts and concentrate on a different aspect of fitness each segment so I'm going to do BBB then that Simplest Strength Template.



SAL73R said:


> I am training for rugby really not bodybuilding or powerlifting. I do do squats and dead lifts but not as often as I should. As for training I lift weights Monday Wednesday and Friday, then I go rugby training Tuesday and Thursday.


I am by no means an expert but I have trained quite a few rugby players over the years and always have them as training partners as they are easy to motivate.

What position do you play as this makes a slight difference but not much. What kind of level do you play at as during seasion its better to lower your weight lifting days to 2 days per week and do some other work on the 3rd gym day, this way you get an extra rest day after the game. Whats your weight, age and lifts for Squat, Deadlift, Bench Press and Shoulder Press.

Squats and Deadlifts are everything in a rugby players program. Bench press is the most overrated exercise for rugby but I know everyone wants to bench big.

SFSTU: Nice first workout and welcome to the group buddy. Not sure how tall you are but my box is 14" tall, I always teach beginners on a box as you have got enough to think about so this simplfies it and then once it feels good you can take the box out.

The weights will feel really light but this gives your body a chance to get used to the exercise and improve your muscle mind connection. I know it feels light right now but you will only need maybe 10kg on some exercises for it to feel heavy and you will be there next week so no need to rush. The progress on SL is very fast. You are correct that some exercises will get hard/fail before others. Usually they will get hard in this order but everyone is different SP, BP, SQ, DL.


----------



## ITHAQVA

bod42 said:


> doug thats an awesome deadlift, thats a big milestone having 4 plates on each side. You just lifting my record 1rm for 5 reps. Once i finished my juggernaut program i will be changing to bbb. Did you see wendler q&a in elitefts the other day he said you should split the year into 4 parts and concentrate on a different aspect of fitness each segment so i'm going to do bbb then that simplest strength template.


Thanks James :thumb::thumb: , it was a great workout, weight felt easier to lift than i thought it would, last week it felt like i was REALLY bloody heavy. It's so weird how the same Weight can feel so different from one session to the next 

Wasn't 4 big plates , I used 2X25, 4X20 & 2X15 + the bar 20 = 180Kg'ssss Dear Santa IM OUT OF BIG PLATES!!!! :doublesho:doublesho

I got a few other smaller plates which will give me a total of 235Kg, so I'll be ok for some time yet :thumb:

I would have a go at my routine sometime James; it gives a nice mix of heavy/medium weights with a rep range variation too.

Wendler is a bit of an ultimate warrior :devil:, I've just added HIT to 3 of my off days :thumb:

Onward & upward people! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 77.5kg x 8, 8, 8, 8, 14
Pendlay Rows: 60x5, 67.5x5, 75x8
Dips: BW x 9, 9, 9, 8, 6 Total 41

Was pleased with Bench Press as got 13 reps a month ago with the same weight but with less sets before so this means Im improving. Shoulder hurt for the first time since starting this program tonight but I have slept on it a few times lately which is bad.

Pendlay rows felt surprisingly heavy on the last set and my back/lats are telling me they really felt it while writing this. I been concentrating on getting a hard arch during set up so I can use my upper back better.

Slowly improving on dips 41 total is a 1 rep improvement but after more bench press sets.


----------



## Christianmp

Another workout:
*Friday SL 5X5*
Squats: 20x10, 40x5, 60x5, 90x5x4, 80x5
Form was crumbling during the 4th 90kg set, so chose to deload to 80kg. 
Been having some odd shoulder impingement pain when squatting. And it bothers me. Pain radiating from left shoulder to the elbow. But it shouldn't stop me from doing the overhead press.

OHP: 20x10, 30x5, 50x5x5 
Last rep was push-press, other than that it was an awesome feeling pressing 50kg. This has to be my favourite lift.

Deadlift: 60x10, 80x5, 105x5.
Also love the deadlift. Was talking to with a guy at the gym doing 120x6x8 and he really encouraged me and said that I was doing fine gains on my lifts and that it was good to see people doing compound lifts instead of your typical machine-curl-bro.

All in all a good workout, *PR's all over*. Just hope that I can get rid of the shoulder pain. Have tried doing several "shoulder dislocators" before squatting. Maybe I just need to work on flexibility on a daily basis.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 77.5kg x 8, 8, 8, 8, 14
> Pendlay Rows: 60x5, 67.5x5, 75x8
> Dips: BW x 9, 9, 9, 8, 6 Total 41
> 
> Was pleased with Bench Press as got 13 reps a month ago with the same weight but with less sets before so this means Im improving. Shoulder hurt for the first time since starting this program tonight but I have slept on it a few times lately which is bad.
> 
> Pendlay rows felt surprisingly heavy on the last set and my back/lats are telling me they really felt it while writing this. I been concentrating on getting a hard arch during set up so I can use my upper back better.
> 
> Slowly improving on dips 41 total is a 1 rep improvement but after more bench press sets.


Nice one James, careful with the rows, do you wear a belt when you do them, i do & i must admit it feels much better especially on the heavy stuff or on the last reps of the higher rep stuff :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Another workout:
> *Friday SL 5X5*
> Squats: 20x10, 40x5, 60x5, 90x5x4, 80x5
> Form was crumbling during the 4th 90kg set, so chose to deload to 80kg.
> Been having some odd shoulder impingement pain when squatting. And it bothers me. Pain radiating from left shoulder to the elbow. But it shouldn't stop me from doing the overhead press.
> 
> OHP: 20x10, 30x5, 50x5x5
> Last rep was push-press, other than that it was an awesome feeling pressing 50kg. This has to be my favourite lift.
> 
> Deadlift: 60x10, 80x5, 105x5.
> Also love the deadlift. Was talking to with a guy at the gym doing 120x6x8 and he really encouraged me and said that I was doing fine gains on my lifts and that it was good to see people doing compound lifts instead of your typical machine-curl-bro.
> 
> All in all a good workout, *PR's all over*. Just hope that I can get rid of the shoulder pain. Have tried doing several "shoulder dislocators" before squatting. Maybe I just need to work on flexibility on a daily basis.


Good workout Christian :thumb:

Your OHP = 50KgX5X5, you set monster you! :devil: 

Shoulder issues are very common I'm afraid, are you a low bar squatter? If so you may be going just a bit low. As the weight gets heavier there is a tendency to put the bar really low as it helps with balance, you should know if it's too low as your wrists will hurt as the weight pushes on them as you carry out the lift & this in turn forces the shoulder back.

Keep lifting! :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

ITHAQVA said:


> Good workout Christian :thumb:
> 
> Your OHP = 50KgX5X5, you set monster you! :devil:
> 
> Shoulder issues are very common I'm afraid, are you a low bar squatter? If so you may be going just a bit low. As the weight gets heavier there is a tendency to put the bar really low as it helps with balance, you should know if it's too low as your wrists will hurt as the weight pushes on them as you carry out the lift & this in turn forces the shoulder back.
> 
> Keep lifting! :thumb:


Yup, I'm a (too?) low bar squatter. Have thought of changing to frontsquats if the shoulder pain persists. But first I'll work on bar-placement and not fear the weight, maybe deload 'till I find my low-bar sweet spot. 
The overhead press is just an awesome lift and I hope to increase it to 65-70kg by the end of the year.

On another note. When deadlifting, I'm still using overhand grip. I've seen a lot using mixed grip. When should one change?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Yup, I'm a (too?) low bar squatter. Have thought of changing to frontsquats if the shoulder pain persists. But first I'll work on bar-placement and not fear the weight, maybe deload 'till I find my low-bar sweet spot.
> The overhead press is just an awesome lift and I hope to increase it to 65-70kg by the end of the year.
> 
> On another note. When deadlifting, I'm still using overhand grip. I've seen a lot using mixed grip. When should one change?


You'll find it mate :thumb:

I started using a mixed grip at around 140Kg as my grip would start to give out during the 3rd or 4th rep (I deadlift touch & go style).
Try to stick with the overhand grip for as long as you can but don't let it stop you deadlifting more weight, if you get to a point where you know it's only the grip stopping you from deadlifting more Weight switch to the mixed grip as you can haul loads more weight with it :thumb:

*Remember: keep the arms straight, please dont bend them, this can end up in you tearing a bicep & that is not good, just think of your arms being hooks attached to your body & let your body do the work* :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice one James, careful with the rows, do you wear a belt when you do them, i do & i must admit it feels much better especially on the heavy stuff or on the last reps of the higher rep stuff :thumb:


The reps still went up nice and fast so I'm not to worried. Nope don't own a belt but you.posted those mean ones a few weeks back and that made me think about getting one


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The reps still went up nice and fast so I'm not to worried. Nope don't own a belt but you.posted those mean ones a few weeks back and that made me think about getting one


Defo go for a belt James:

When you get to your heavy work sets it is better if only for the placebo effect, I find I lift with better form knowing it's there, sometimes when lifting heavy you can be a little hesitant/scared of the weight, the belt is my training partner (as well as you guys on here) 

When i was Rowing heavy 80kg-105kg the belt was on for all the sets, now i use it for all my barbell rows, even the light BBB 60kg plus work :thumb:

Also i wear mine on the last warm up set of my deadlift & squat 140kgX1 this sets me up for the work set as there is a different "feel" to wearing & not wearing a belt (you lose a little torso flexibility due to the belt tightening on the low part of the lifts) I would also hate to think that I had failed a lift just down to an unfamiliar feeling of the belt being there. We all go through a little routine when on the heavy sets; I make the belt part of it.

I bought mine from *Pullum sports *& spent more money as Zulu glove didn't answer my emails at all 

Pullum sports Belt Link 
http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...ede-duel-prong-powerlifting-belt/prod_24.html :thumb:

The guys at Pullum were the best, when I called them, the chap I spoke to stayed on the phone for over 30 minutes going through products & answering my questions, I'm happy to pay more & support a business like that :thumb:


----------



## Matt.

Doug, what HIT training are you doing?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Matt. said:


> Doug, what HIT training are you doing?


Hi Mat,
I just started a basic 2 mins steady pace 30 second MAD all out will work up to 20 mins on the cross trainer. However as I've found the HIT is a little boring already  I though how about some form of martial art training? I'm going to make up a routine this week consisting of:

10 minutes easy dynamic stretches (Paul & Tips :thumb followed by a 30 minute session of Tai Kwon do & Muay Thai drills (Thanks for the info Paul :thumb I will gradually build up the intensity once I get more fluid in the movements; have missed Tae Kwon Do so much. I'm also considering building the session time up to 1 hour.

Will be nice to get back into it :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I'd like to try some powerlifting but with the state of my lower back its out of the question.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I'd like to try some powerlifting but with the state of my lower back its out of the question.


I'm not sure, i find powerlifting safer than sitting in my office chair at work Ross, remember powerlifting incorporates natural movements & you start with an empty bar & can go as far/fast/slow/heavy or light as you want :thumb: Add some cardio at the end & you've got a nice little balance of physical activity :thumb:

What is the physical problem with your back Ross?


----------



## Ross

I do plenty of physical activity at work:thumb: I am not sure always had back pain since I was 16,sometimes its my whole back which goes stiff and painful but mostly its from my waist line up to kidney height. 
Some weeks its ok and like now its quite painful no matter what I do,resting makes it worse so its a catch 22


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I do plenty of physical activity at work:thumb: I am not sure always had back pain since I was 16,sometimes its my whole back which goes stiff and painful but mostly its from my waist line up to kidney height.
> Some weeks its ok and like now its quite painful no matter what I do,resting makes it worse so its a catch 22


Is there a medical term for your conditon Ross?


----------



## Ross

Not sure mate if the local health center was not such a shambles I might go and see a doc about it. Its not just back pain both knees,my left quad muscle/tendon tear which is still not 100% and all over general stiffness and pain.
I don't mean to go on about it but its really getting to me now,safe to say I am not enjoying day to day life anymore battling everyday pain. I honestly think there is something up with me because at 23 I feel ruined physical,I thought losing over 6 stone would help but it seems to have had little affect.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Not sure mate if the local health center was not such a shambles I might go and see a doc about it. Its not just back pain both knees,my left quad muscle/tendon tear which is still not 100% and all over general stiffness and pain.
> I don't mean to go on about it but its really getting to me now,safe to say I am not enjoying day to day life anymore battling everyday pain. I honestly think there is something up with me because at 23 I feel ruined physical,I thought losing over 6 stone would help but it seems to have had little affect.


Ross, its worth paying for a private opinion/diagnosis :thumb:


----------



## Ross

Its coming to it just working is becoming a challenge.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Its coming to it just working is becoming a challenge.


Then as above, do it mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Ross we spoke about this in your other thread. Bypass the doctor and go straight to the Osteopath as you need to find out whats wrong. If you been in pain for that long that really isnt good.

I damaged my back badly when I was 13 and have dislocated my shoulder I think 7 times now so I know what doctors are like. 7 dislocations and they still wouldnt give me an MRI, I had to pay for one myself. 

Its your health so its well worth doing.

As for power/weight lifting, me damaging my back and being in constant pain and spending a few months in hospital is what made me start the whole fitness/weight lifting malarky. It is amazing for lower back and core strength. Weightlifting also teaches you mind muscle connection so you can engage the correct muscle while doing your day to day job. When I used to personal train you spend a lot of time teaching people to use their core and back muscles and the correct muscles for the correct lift as they dont have that mind muscle connection. 

Anyone on here will be happy to help you with a program but I wouldnt be happy in doing that until you find out whats up with your back.

As for knees hips etc hurting, when I hurt my back I found that you move and walk differently to get away from the pain. This in turn throws the alignment of other joints out and I had a bad hip, knee and ankle on one side.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Defo go for a belt James:
> 
> When you get to your heavy work sets it is better if only for the placebo effect, I find I lift with better form knowing it's there, sometimes when lifting heavy you can be a little hesitant/scared of the weight, the belt is my training partner (as well as you guys on here)
> 
> When i was Rowing heavy 80kg-105kg the belt was on for all the sets, now i use it for all my barbell rows, even the light BBB 60kg plus work :thumb:
> 
> Also i wear mine on the last warm up set of my deadlift & squat 140kgX1 this sets me up for the work set as there is a different "feel" to wearing & not wearing a belt (you lose a little torso flexibility due to the belt tightening on the low part of the lifts) I would also hate to think that I had failed a lift just down to an unfamiliar feeling of the belt being there. We all go through a little routine when on the heavy sets; I make the belt part of it.
> 
> I bought mine from *Pullum sports *& spent more money as Zulu glove didn't answer my emails at all
> 
> Pullum sports Belt Link
> http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...ede-duel-prong-powerlifting-belt/prod_24.html :thumb:
> 
> The guys at Pullum were the best, when I called them, the chap I spoke to stayed on the phone for over 30 minutes going through products & answering my questions, I'm happy to pay more & support a business like that :thumb:


Cheers for that Doug. Im the same would rather support a company who are glad to help and know what their on about rather than a company who cant even be bothered to reply.

I never worn a belt as I always trained for Rugby and why train with a belt when I cant wear a belt on the field but now Im really considering it.


----------



## Ross

Thing is I don't like anybody doing anything for me at all.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Thing is I don't like anybody doing anything for me at all.


Please don't take this the wrong way Ross, from reading your posts on DW i get the impression; firstly, you are your biggest hurdle. Secondly, when you have truly dome as much for yourself as you can, you need to turn to others for support mate :thumb:

You've done well & lost loads of weight now plan your next stages of improvement so that you can enjoy a much better quality of life, you are far too young to be just giving up, you have many years ahead of you. Learn about yourself my friend & i mean TRULY learn about yourself 

You have all the tools you need Ross, youve always had them :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I do honestly feel like giving up I don't see what the point is anymore.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I do honestly feel like giving up I don't see what the point is anymore.


A forum is no place to be thinking that, if you have close friends or family, go to them first mate, by all means start a new thread, you never know it may inspire you to help yourself :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I might do,I tend to keep everything to myself.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I might do,I tend to keep everything to myself.


Your first problem right there Ross, humans are social creatures no matter how independent we think we are, that's why so many are miserable these days


----------



## Bod42

Just brought myself a commercial garde dippping belt. $110 reduced to $50 (approx 25quid) so thought it had to be done.

Also got a proper #1 strength band while I was in there to help with RC work and warming up.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Squat Workout:
Box Squats: 105 x 8, 8, 8, 8, 11
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 70x5, 80x5,90x5
Bulgarian Split Squat: 7.5x 9, 9, 9
Ab Work

Felt like crap tonight really having been sleeping well this week so was please to get 105 for 11 and this was quite a few reps below what I could of done.

Snatch grip deadlifts felt good but my grip really needs work as loosing my grip on the top set. Deadlifting this weigth normally is easy but I'm putting my hands outsides the rings so pulling at a harsh angle which makes it a lot harder.

BSS burned like crazy but could really feel them around the knee which is good.

Played with my new band to finish, had to.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Press Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 40kg x 8, 8, 8, 8, 12
Dips: BW x 5,5, 2.5kg(107.5) x 12
Neutral Grip Chins: 5x3
RC work
Improved on shoulder press so pleased with that. I dont really care if I take a month or 2 to move up 2.5kg as I know my shoulder is screwed so any gain is a bonus.

Tried my new dipping belt, def needs a longer chain which is disappointing. I put a 25kg on there to try and it basically sits in my nuts. Will get my Maximuscle one sent over I think. Nice to add some weight to dips though and pleased to get an easy 12 reps with added weight.

Going to change up my grip on chins for a change.

Did defrancos shoulder savers with the band after and cant believe how well doing rehad work with a proper band works. Its really good and think I will buy the best of the bands so I can increase the amount of exercises I can do


----------



## ITHAQVA

Good workouts James :thumb:

Will update you on the small disks, they are going to be deliverd at work, im back Monday :thumb:

Enjoying my week off, looking forward to powerlifting again from next week.

Still formulating my day off & on cardio work. Looking like this so far, have decided to not do Tae Kwon Do, going to try Muay Thai instead :thumb:

*1. Powerlifting days: dynamic stretches before i start each session to keep things safe (11 different body movements) :thumb:

2. Off days: Dynamic stretches (around 10-15 mins, 11 different movements), Muay Thai (Unsure about time frame possibly 30 mins) & then HIT (build up to 20 min max)*

Looking forward to taking my fitness to a more balance level but not forgetting my primary powerlifting goals; Deadlift & squat 200kg x 5 reps, Bench press 150kg X 1 rep :thumb:

I'll stay at these weigths & just dominate them while i focus on increasing the Boring but big weights. Not sure about going heavier as i would have already proved to myself what i can acheive & thats is my whole reason for doing it :thumb:

Thank you every body who has kept me going with support & kind words :thumb: (You know who you are ) :thumb:

Been doing this since last October & it has been amazing, looking forward to this october as its my first 12 months in powerlifting  Love it & will keep doing it, for as long as my body allows! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Monday is here 

115kg Bench Press tonight, wish me luck guys :thumb:

James, something has just been delivered here, guess what?!!!!!! 


:thumb::thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Hi guys!

Sorry i've been a bit off the map the last few weeks, lots going on. I've been a bit injured too, but finally seem to be on the mend. Did go and do some real training on Saturday as I was mega stressed with a few things and ended up working up to a 260kg three board press in my shirt, very pleased with that


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Hi guys!
> 
> Sorry i've been a bit off the map the last few weeks, lots going on. I've been a bit injured too, but finally seem to be on the mend. Did go and do some real training on Saturday as I was mega stressed with a few things and ended up working up to a 260kg three board press in my shirt, very pleased with that


lol, was about to PM you today Dan, ill Pm you anyway


----------



## sidewalkdances

Getting myself sorted to go train tonight


----------



## ITHAQVA

^^^^^^^ Im with you mate, Ipod? check! Powerlifting playlist? Check!

Hmmm, Naplam Death, volume = MAX! :thumb: :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Pantera at the moment for me, and Down. 

For my next comp i'm either having I'm Broken (Pantera) or Bury Me In Smoke (Down) as the music on when I lift.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mondays Workout

Felt tired due to the heat :devil: but went for it anyway 

*Bench Press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench Press work set: 115X3 :thumb:*

Boring but big

*Bench Press: 77.5X5X10

Barbell Row: 56X5X10*

Good workout all round


----------



## sfstu

hi guys...:wave:
havent posted for a few days so thought i'd better check in..:thumb: been lurking and reading all your posts but as i've just been doing the basic 20kg 5x5 last week didn't think it was worth posting.. used last week as a practice/dry run and tonight have actually started on the SL 5x5 albeit still with the 20 kgs for squats,BP and 30kg for the barbell rows...still working on form/technique but will now be adding the 2.5kg each workout...:thumb:
won't post every workout just yet but will be checking in every few days and i'm sure i'll be pestering you all with some more questions as i go...:thumb:
really looking forward to doing this and can't wait to see what i'll be able to lift in a years time...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
10x10m Sprints 30 secs rest
Deadlift: 112.5x8, 112.5x8, 112.5x8, 112.5x8, 112.5x12
Front Squats: 70x5, 80x5, 90x5
Med Ball Twist Throws: 5x3
Grip Work

Have a very slight incline outside my house so was sprinting up and then back down for the first few sprints but sprinting downhill doesnt feel hard so changed to sprinting up hill and really driving hard with small steps.

I felt like crap tonight, I feel like I havent slept properly in weeks, so was really pleased to get 12 reps on the last sets. This is 1 more than last month with 2 more sets before so thats quite an increase. Considering how crap I felt I'm not sure what made the workout good in the end, if it was the sprints or what Im not sure.

Front squats actually feel like they are tearing my abs apart after Deadlifts. Can feel these so much more in yoru quads compared with back squats.

Lowered my Med Ball Twist throws to 3 reps from 5 so I could work on power more.

Grip work is a killer.

Nice 115kg Doug, bet that felt good. :thumb: 

Stu: Throw up any questions buddy, I'm sure everyone here is happy to help anyway they can. You made the biggest step by starting a proper compound exercise program. Looking forward to your progress buddy.


----------



## Guest

Back to lifting after a short camping trip.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WU: None
WO: [email protected]

Squat went well. Last WO set was the easiest.
Bench felt a little heavy, but everything moved well.
Row was fine.
Dips were harder than expected - felt some straining in left shoulder but not enough to worry me.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Nice to see all the activity going on guys :thumb:

Tonight I've got dynamic stretches, Muay Thai then Tabata on the air walker :devil::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday's workout

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat work set: 175X5*

No assistance work tonight, too much on 

Squat felt lighter than I was expecting, but I wanted to go deeper, I'll keep the 175Kg for next week & dominate to ensure 5 good deep reps before adding another 2.5Kg, after all I've only got 25Kg to go :thumb:

Have made my mind up on my ultimate goals, my plan is to stay at 200Kg for 5 reps & 227.5kg for 1 rep on both the squat & deadlift, hoping to reach this by December 2012. Bench press I'll work to get 130Kg for 5 reps & 150kg for 1 rep (Hoping to reach this by December 2013, this will take some doing me thinks). I will then stay at these goal weights basically forever, while I have fun with various assistance exercises to keep things interesting & also to help improve over all fitness.

The Muay Thai session yesterday was so much fun, will be doing this 2-3 times a week also as im now going to start trying to lose some body fat, would like to be down to 15% by December 2013, but i know its going to be bloody hard   :thumb:

Onward& upward!


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice to see all the activity going on guys :thumb:


I guess I should check in after being quiet for a few weeks. Been experimenting with lifts and routines in order to decide what's next.

Starting Strength (3x5 linear) - done it for a while and feel that if I restarted it I'd just stall at old levels given all other circumstances remain the same. 'If you always do what you've always done, you always get what you've always got' kind of situation.

Texas Method - (5x5 volume, light, 1x5 intensity) Looks and feels OK but getting volume\intensity right is a fine line. The literature says it's a young persons routine due to recovery. Easy to get mashed pretty quickly.

Starr (5x5) - Similar to SS but quickly requires two-a-days. That ain't going to happen!

Dynamic Effort\Westside - I expect DE requires much better technique than I've got and seems WAY advanced for me.

5\3\1 - Pros - simple template, volume will probably help technique and injuries, should be easier to recover due to manipulating variables and shorter workouts, still has inbuilt goals\PR. Requires running; yay !
Cons - I should be able to progress faster than prescribed. However, I really think relentless improvement without stalling is what I need.

So 5\3\1 it is. Thanks for the suggestion :wave: Suspect triumvate would be best for me but can't decide what assistance would be best so Boring But Big it is! Need to find replacement for leg curls - probably be lunges or front squats. Not sure.

Lower back - had a week holiday so no sitting down or weights. Couldn't feel anything at all wrong with my back. Atleast I know the baseline is OK. See how next few weeks sitting down and work and lifting affect it. Tried flat field sprints and they REALLY screw it up. Hill sprints are fine and have some cracking DOMS in my bad leg so I take that to be a good thing.

Food - recorded a couple of days and they came out as - 
Day A - Calories 2200, Fat 85g (33%), Carbs 231g (41%), Prot 147g (26%). 
Day B - Calories 2355, Fat 62g (23%), Carbs 339g (56%), Prot 126g (21%)

I've no idea what any of this means :lol: It's something to read up on though. I'd probably eat a bit more if I had been lifting heavy but I having a suspicion the calroies should be almost double that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I guess I should check in after being quiet for a few weeks. Been experimenting with lifts and routines in order to decide what's next.
> 
> Starting Strength (3x5 linear) - done it for a while and feel that if I restarted it I'd just stall at old levels given all other circumstances remain the same. 'If you always do what you've always done, you always get what you've always got' kind of situation.
> 
> Texas Method - (5x5 volume, light, 1x5 intensity) Looks and feels OK but getting volumeintensity right is a fine line. The literature says it's a young persons routine due to recovery. Easy to get mashed pretty quickly.
> 
> Starr (5x5) - Similar to SS but quickly requires two-a-days. That ain't going to happen!
> 
> Dynamic EffortWestside - I expect DE requires much better technique than I've got and seems WAY advanced for me.
> 
> 531 - Pros - simple template, volume will probably help technique and injuries, should be easier to recover due to manipulating variables and shorter workouts, still has inbuilt goalsPR. Requires running; yay !
> Cons - I should be able to progress faster than prescribed. However, I really think relentless improvement without stalling is what I need.
> 
> So 531 it is. Thanks for the suggestion :wave: Suspect triumvate would be best for me but can't decide what assistance would be best so Boring But Big it is! Need to find replacement for leg curls - probably be lunges or front squats. Not sure.
> 
> Lower back - had a week holiday so no sitting down or weights. Couldn't feel anything at all wrong with my back. Atleast I know the baseline is OK. See how next few weeks sitting down and work and lifting affect it. Tried flat field sprints and they REALLY screw it up. Hill sprints are fine and have some cracking DOMS in my bad leg so I take that to be a good thing.
> 
> Food - recorded a couple of days and they came out as -
> Day A - Calories 2200, Fat 85g (33%), Carbs 231g (41%), Prot 147g (26%).
> Day B - Calories 2355, Fat 62g (23%), Carbs 339g (56%), Prot 126g (21%)
> 
> I've no idea what any of this means :lol: It's something to read up on though. I'd probably eat a bit more if I had been lifting heavy but I having a suspicion the calroies should be almost double that.


Lots to think about Oats.

Why dont you try my workout, you never know :thumb:

Dont worry i eat bugger all, havent even taken a protein shake for the last 3 weeks :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 72.5x3, 82.5x3, 90x8, 90x8, 90x11
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x3, 70x3, 80x6
Dips: BWx 9, 9, 9, 6, 5

I am defiantly getting more powerful as the ball is bouncing further off the wall. Not the most technical calculation.

Bench Press felt the worse it has since starting working out again, the bar was all over the place, it was moving back, forwards & side to side. Just couldnt get it any where near the grove. Think this maybe due to my rear delts and traps still being sore from Deadlift. I'm not sure if Benching once every 9 days is enough really but I keep with the program until the end and see what my gains are. Pleased with 11 when nothing felt right.

Pendlay Rows were easy, I keep these well below failure until my 5/3/1 week.

Less Dips than last Bench Workout but then I did more weight on Bench and Im not going to Major in the minor. 3 sets of 9 with 90 secs rest after Benching isnt to bad. I added weighted Dips after Shoulder Press day and am looking to push the weight up on these as I remember doing 6 reps with a 20kg plate added when I was 115kg.



ITHAQVA said:


> Squat work set: 175X5[/B]
> 
> Squat felt lighter than I was expecting,


175x5 :thumb:

And it felt lighter than you expected :doublesho Nice work Doug, you seem to have found your program sweet spot


----------



## Bod42

Oats: 5/3/1 is a very good program and has excellant reviews if you read around. You mentioned slower progress which is 1 of the down points of the program but also one of the up points and why its works so well.

Wendler does have a full body and beginner (not saying your a beginner) program that have slightly faster progress and they hit each body part more often which is better for some people.

I would probably suggest the Boring But Big routine but one of the big changes that Wendler now suggests himself is doing the Boring But Big portion of the workout as the opposite exercise so 5x10 of Shoulder Press after 5/3/1 Bench Press and 5x10 Deadlifts after 5/3/1 squats and vice versa. This hits your body parts more often and Wendler suggests it a lot on Elitefts now days. Its what I'm going to do when i start 5/3/1 in a few months.

Just advice and you cant go wrong with the standard version


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I am defiantly getting more powerful as the ball is bouncing further off the wall. Not the most technical calculation. *Only the one James :doublesho *
> 
> And it felt lighter than you expected :doublesho Nice work Doug, you seem to have found your program sweet spot


Definitely mate, I like its simplicity. 1X5 then two exercises 5 sets of 10 reps, job done! Wendler is right; it's hard work, especially if you keep adding 2.5 kg to the assistance sets. I love the progressive overload principle!!!! :devil: I will stick to this routine indefinitely :thumb:

Also, I can feel I'm at a very different level now, all the weights I use don't feel heavy or intimidating at all, this I believe is the sweet spot which allows powerlifters to progress.

Did your parents get the parcel mate? :thumb: Haven't heard from you.


----------



## Ross

I am going to get into this I think,I have noticed at work since I am much leaner my strength is actually pretty good due to me not carrying extra weight.

I like doing pull ups/chin ups which I never could do before:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I am going to get into this I think,I have noticed at work since I am much leaner my strength is actually pretty good due to me not carrying extra weight.
> 
> I like doing pull ups/chin ups which I never could do before:thumb:


Try a simple 5X5 Ross, start with an empty bar :thumb:


----------



## Ross

Thing is I have no idea where to start.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Thing is I have no idea where to start.


http://stronglifts.com/ :thumb:

Read the site Ross, has everything you need to know about starting up & more :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I still don't think it would do my knackerd back and knees any good at all.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I still don't think it would do my knackerd back and knees any good at all.


If you dont try, you'll never know :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I might give it a bash finding the time is going to be tricky.


----------



## Christianmp

Might just be that it improves your knackered back and knees by strengthening them.

Motivational quote:
"If it is important to you, you'll find a way (and thus time). If not, you'll find an excuse"


----------



## Ross

Yeah I'd love to try it but the pain stops me actually doing a lot of things not just weightlifting.


----------



## Bod42

As Doug says your never know until you try. You need to get out of your negitive mind set and try things. One of the helpful aspects of this thread and one of the reason's people are doing so well is that everyone in here has a positive attitude.

Have you been to the Osteopath yet? Your entire body pain could be down to a simple misalignment of your spine and a quick pop (literally) could be all it takes to rid you of your pain. Bad back's are one of the most comman complaints and you will read loads of reviews/comments on Stronglift that the program has helped their back pain.

I seriously damaged my back and shoulder playing rugby but I still managed to work my way up to some decent weights and my back is now pain free and has been for a long time and my shoulder is getting there.

Christianmp: Brilliant quote right there, sums up the entire human race.


----------



## Ross

I am trying to have a positive mind set but its hard with constant pain not just my back as you know most of my other joints too.


----------



## Guest

It's funny how exercise boosts your mood. Hard day at work today and I nearly didn't bother tonight. Now I'm sitting here typing up my session and feeling on top of the world.

*Squats*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Chins*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

Had a really good session tonight after dragging myself out to the garage.
Squats starting to feel heavy again but they moved well.
Press felt heavy but again managed very positive reps throughout.
100kg warm-up on the deads was strangely tougher than the workout sets.
Chins went really well.

So pleased I kicked myself up the **** and got out there.

Phil


----------



## Bod42

Ross said:


> I am trying to have a positive mind set but its hard with constant pain not just my back as you know most of my other joints too.


Only you have the power to do something about it. People will/can help as much as possible but at the end of the day the buck stops with you.



BareFacedGeek said:


> It's funny how exercise boosts your mood. Hard day at work today and I nearly didn't bother tonight. Now I'm sitting here typing up my session and feeling on top of the world.
> 
> *Squats*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Chins*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Had a really good session tonight after dragging myself out to the garage.
> Squats starting to feel heavy again but they moved well.
> Press felt heavy but again managed very positive reps throughout.
> 100kg warm-up on the deads was strangely tougher than the workout sets.
> Chins went really well.
> 
> So pleased I kicked myself up the **** and got out there.
> 
> Phil


Nice workout, Its easy working out when the weights are moving well and your progressing but I think its these workouts that really make the lifter. The nights where you just want to sit on the sofa after a hard day but you go to the gym anyway. Nice work again.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Motivational quote:
> *"If it is important to you, you'll find a way (and thus time). If not, you'll find an excuse"*




Nice one Christian :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> It's funny how exercise boosts your mood. Hard day at work today and I nearly didn't bother tonight. Now I'm sitting here typing up my session and feeling on top of the world.
> 
> *Squats*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Chins*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> Had a really good session tonight after dragging myself out to the garage.
> Squats starting to feel heavy again but they moved well.
> Press felt heavy but again managed very positive reps throughout.
> 100kg warm-up on the deads was strangely tougher than the workout sets.
> Chins went really well.
> 
> So pleased I kicked myself up the **** and got out there.
> 
> Phil


Good workout Phil :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

I've been digging into Starting Strength 3rd edition and oh my, how my squat-form has improved. Those little simple pointers that Marc mentions makes a huge difference. 

Previously I've been a little scared of the squat ~90ish kg, but wednesday all went well. I've been keeping my back too vertical and not getting the most out of the hip drive. This time around it was a walk in the park. Having DOMS in the legs, especially hamstrings right now, but its worth it.

OHP has gone down though, WO set was 47.5kg x5x5


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I've been digging into Starting Strength 3rd edition and oh my, how my squat-form has improved. Those little simple pointers that Marc mentions makes a huge difference.
> 
> Previously I've been a little scared of the squat ~90ish kg, but wednesday all went well. I've been keeping my back too vertical and not getting the most out of the hip drive. This time around it was a walk in the park. Having DOMS in the legs, especially hamstrings right now, but its worth it.
> 
> OHP has gone down though, WO set was 47.5kg x5x5


Had the same Christian, as soon as I squatted deeper, the old hamstrings were sore the next day, I'm going to keep lifting until I get to 200Kg, then focus on squatting below parallel for every rep :devil:

I've noticed as the hamstrings get stronger your confidence in going deeper grows; there is that odd feeling of fear as you go deep as the hamstrings take over & feel weak, keep at it, it does slowly reduce as you increase in strength :thumb:

I Don't know what it is about the OHP, I have the same weird effects sometimes 5 reps with 60Kg is easy, a week later I can get more than 3 reps WTF!!!! 
I'm going to train the OHP with 10 reps starting tonight for a while and then I'm going to do the Heavy OHP work sets push press or clean & jerk style, as it does feel more natural to jerk/push press than just press from the start position. 
I'll go over Marks Videos & read Starting strength again.
Anyone got any thoughts ideas why the OHP is so problematic, is it purely down to the fact that you are using such small muscles?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just found this guys :thumb:

Mr Wendler = Maximum win! 

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/wait-a-couple-weeks-oh-press/

I've tried point number 5, made no difference at all for me, but oddly enough worked incredibly well on my bench press.

My new shoulder/arms workout for Friday nights:

*OHP Warm up: 20kgx5 reps - 22.5Kgx5 reps - 30Kgx3 reps

OHP Work set 45kg (Starting very light & I'll micro load with 0.5kg or 0.25 kg plates & progress very slowly & see if this works)

Alternative version of Boring but big using the Progressive overload principle, I'll keep adding weight on the below exercises every time I reach 5 sets of 10 reps. I'll experiment with adding 2.5kg first until I stall then go back one step & start micro loading with smaller plates, 0.5 first then down to the 0.25 plates :thumb:

Overhead press 32.5Kg 5 sets 10 reps

Barbell curl 30kg 5 sets 10 reps

Close grip bench press 40kg 5 sets 10 reps* :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Lots to think about Oats.


Yep - it requires surprisingly more thought than you imagine when you think of starting! I'm conscious of sticking to it once I've set a schedule in motion. Possibly to my detriment sometimes but chopping and changing frequently appears to be counselled against by the few people who I've read articles by. Change is no substitute for hard work and suffering 

I've got a large sliding door in the garage that I write relevant things on with a marker pen. Kind of like a scrap book. Across the top is a Dan John mantra - 'Turn Up. Don't Quit. Ask Questions'.



ITHAQVA said:


> Why dont you try my workout, you never know :thumb:





ITHAQVA said:


> Alternative version of Boring but big using the Progressive overload principle…
> Overhead press 32.5Kg 5 sets 10 reps
> Barbell curl 30kg 5 sets 10 reps
> Close grip bench press 40kg 5 sets 10 reps[/B] :thumb:


Is this just assistance work or is the OHP the main workout at 5 sets?



Bod42 said:


> I would probably suggest the Boring But Big routine but one of the big changes that Wendler now suggests himself is doing the Boring But Big portion of the workout as the opposite exercise so 5x10 of Shoulder Press after 5/3/1 Bench Press and 5x10 Deadlifts after 5/3/1 squats and vice versa


Really? Things have moved on since the 2nd edition already! I read his replies for the Programming Q&A section this week and wasn't something I'd noticed. I'll have to try to look for archived stuff.

Have noticed he says supersetting assistance is OK so I'm doing that whilst things are relatively light and it works well. Doing opposites makes sense although I imagine it requires a warmup building in. I'll stick to same exercise for this 4 weeks and put it down for something to try in future cycles. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Is this just assistance work or is the OHP the main workout at 5 sets?


Hi Oats,

Anything I do with 5 sets is an assistance/volume exercises; my work set is always 1 set of 5 reps :thumb:

Tonight's workout.

Just to make sure you are aware of the entire routine, I'm including my pre warm up (I do this before every powerlifting & Muay Thai workout but just don't post it).

*Pre Warm up: Dynamic stretches:

1.	Cat/Camel X10
2.	Yoga twist X 10 each side
3.	Birddog X 10 each side
4.	Supine Bridge
5.	Sorry have no idea what this is called
6.	Hip Flexors X 10 each side
7.	Shoulder dislocations X 10
8.	Side twists X 10 each side
9.	Shoulder shrugs X 10
10.	Windmills X 10 each side
11.	Bodyweight good mornings*

*OHP Warm up sets: 20X5 - 22.5X5 - 30X3

OHP work set (Starting very light) 45X5 *- this will increase as I progress, this is the only true work set in tonight's workout, everything below is assistance/volume work.

*Barbell curl: 30X3X10

Close Grip bench press: 40X3X10*

Hope that makes more sense mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Jumps: 3x5
Box Squats: 90x3, 110x3, 117.5x8, 117.5x8, 117.5x12
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 72.5x3, 85x3, 95x3
Balgarian Split Squats: 5kg 3x10 each leg
Ab Work

On the last set of 12 I started the rep without taking a breath twice, once early on in the set so got away with it and the 2nd time on the 11th rep and trying to take a breath and get tight at the bottom is nearly impossible so had to muscle the weight up. Good thing I did as only noticed afterwards that I forgot to put my safety bars back in the rack so could have been a bad niht.

Working hard on grip as cant even lift the 95kg for 3 reps with an overhand grip.

I do this last exercise with 45 second rest so get a serious burn and pump in my legs.



ITHAQVA said:


> Had the same Christian, as soon as I squatted deeper, the old hamstrings were sore the next day, I'm going to keep lifting until I get to 200Kg, then focus on squatting below parallel for every rep :devil:
> 
> I've noticed as the hamstrings get stronger your confidence in going deeper grows; there is that odd feeling of fear as you go deep as the hamstrings take over & feel weak, keep at it, it does slowly reduce as you increase in strength :thumb:
> 
> I Don't know what it is about the OHP, I have the same weird effects sometimes 5 reps with 60Kg is easy, a week later I can get more than 3 reps WTF!!!!
> I'm going to train the OHP with 10 reps starting tonight for a while and then I'm going to do the Heavy OHP work sets push press or clean & jerk style, as it does feel more natural to jerk/push press than just press from the start position.
> I'll go over Marks Videos & read Starting strength again.
> Anyone got any thoughts ideas why the OHP is so problematic, is it purely down to the fact that you are using such small muscles?


The shoulder is the most complex joint in the body by far and has a lot of different muscle attached to it which means it only takes one muscle to be sore or tired and the shoulder joint wont be at 100% strength. This also makes it very hard to warm up.

Also your head is in the way of a perfect shoulder press so its the only exercise where you cant move the bar straight between the start and finish of the lift. There still doesnt seem a universal way of shoulder pressing either, some people say its bad to go down to your chest. I read lower to your mouth, eyes, forehead and also to the top of your head so its safer and keeps the shoulder joint inline.

I find my shoulders grow the fastest when I do push press and great for core strength and I would be doing then now if my garage ceiling wasnt only 6 foot tall


----------



## Ross

I am interested in getting a weights bench or something to tone up my chest a bit.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I am interested in getting a weights bench or something to tone up my chest a bit.


Tone doesn't exist Ross; it's all down to size, body fat & vascularity. Muscles feel & look harder the lower your body fat.

If you're serious about doing weights, you should first decide what you really want from it. Either way you should always train your whole body.

Ross I would advise you start with a lighter 10 rep routine. Perhaps go to the gym first then decide if it's for you, then if so, buy your own kit. You don't need to train as heavy as some of us & believe me its takes a lot of character to do so mate. Very few stick with the heavy stuff.

If you want Ross I'll put together a good routine for you :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I am not really looking to do my whole body because I am quite well buith as it is,just looking at my shoulders/chest. 
Same goes for the heavy weights not that intrested it them either but if I wanted I could. Losing 6+ Stone my myself shows I do have character and determination.


----------



## J1ODY A

ITHAQVA said:


> My new shoulder/arms workout for Friday nights:
> 
> *OHP Warm up: 20kgx5 reps - 22.5Kgx5 reps - 30Kgx3 reps
> 
> OHP Work set 45kg (Starting very light & I'll micro load with 0.5kg or 0.25 kg plates & progress very slowly & see if this works)*


*

Real naive question here.. when you say overhead press 30kg, do you mean total weight i.e. using a barbell OR are you using dumbbells which are 30kg each?

Method in my madness as when I record my own workouts in my little book I would put Bi Curl 20kg meaning dumbbells of 20 kg each so trying to compare what I lift to you.

Want to workout how much of a big girl you are :lol:*


----------



## Bod42

Ross said:


> I am not really looking to do my whole body because I am quite well buith as it is,just looking at my shoulders/chest.
> Same goes for the heavy weights not that intrested it them either but if I wanted I could. Losing 6+ Stone my myself shows I do have character and determination.


People who just want chest and abs and just do bench press and sit ups cause muscle imbalances which in turn can cause pain. The majority of the population who do weights would do well to work their bench press less and work their back more. A lot of top trainers suggest a 1:2 even 1:3 ratio of chest to back work.

If your happy with your build thats cool but you have to strengthen muscles in balance.



J1ODY A said:


> Real naive question here.. when you say overhead press 30kg, do you mean total weight i.e. using a barbell OR are you using dumbbells which are 30kg each?
> 
> Method in my madness as when I record my own workouts in my little book I would put Bi Curl 20kg meaning dumbbells of 20 kg each so trying to compare what I lift to you.
> 
> Want to workout how much of a big girl you are :lol:


I think Doug is the same but personally I put the total weight on Barbell exercises and each Dumbell weight when Im doing Dumbell Work.

I let Doug defend the big girl comment :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

J1ODY A said:


> Real naive question here.. when you say overhead press 30kg, do you mean total weight i.e. using a barbell OR are you using dumbbells which are 30kg each?
> 
> Method in my madness as when I record my own workouts in my little book I would put Bi Curl 20kg meaning dumbbells of 20 kg each so trying to compare what I lift to you.
> 
> Want to workout how much of a big girl you are :lol:


Hi J1ODY :wave: 

1. All my lifts are with an Olympic barbell (I'm considering purchasing an Olympic curling bar very soon so I'll adjust the weights accordingly).
2. All weights include the bar (20kg)
3. This is a new workout for Fridays so i have purposely started very light on all the exercises, I will of course slowly increase the weights, for example next week's shoulder/arm workout will look like this :thumb:

*Work set*
*OHP Warm up: 20kgx5 reps - 22.5Kgx5 reps - 30Kgx3 reps

OHP Work set 47.5kg (Increase of 2.5Kg from last session) I lifted 60kg a few weeks ago but i want to get this lift right so i can go heavier :thumb:

Light assistance work

Overhead press 35Kg 5 sets 10 reps (Increase of 2.5Kg from last session)

Barbell curl 32.5kg 5 sets 10 reps (Increase of 2.5Kg from last session)

Close grip bench press 42.5kg 5 sets 10 reps (Increase of 2.5Kg from last session)*

*Weights i have used in the past for 4 reps (I used a 1-4 rep range in my youth)
Close grip bench press on machine = 180kg
Strict barbell curl using an arm blaster & curling bar = 54kg
Seated behind the neck press = 82kg *

I know I can lift a lot more but it is far more productive to start light & get back into it with a steady pace, I've not directly trained my Biceps for nearly two years :doublesho

Lifting/training heavy successfully takes character, not ego :thumb:

A young man like yourself should be able to do a strict barbell curls with 55kg within about 10-15 weeks of training with a 1-4 rep range, if your using 20kg dumbbells, i would switch to a curling bar for more mass/power & use light dumbbell work at the end to really blast the Bicep, if your training for size that is J1ODY, i have rarely used dumbbells as you tend to throw them around & lose form as they get heavier, but then I'm biased, I love barbell training :argie: :devil: 

I'm off to put on my gingham dress & tidy my pigtails


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> I am not really looking to do my whole body because I am quite well buith as it is,just looking at my shoulders/chest.
> Same goes for the heavy weights not that intrested it them either but if I wanted I could. Losing 6+ Stone my myself shows I do have character and determination.


Use a 10-12 rep range, as soon as you can do 12 reps for every set of any given exercise below add 2-2.5kg & aim for at least 10 reps the next session & so on until you find a weight you feel is right, start with an empty bar :thumb:

Start easy: week one do one set of each exercise, add a set each week until you are doing the full sets below :thumb:

*MONDAY:*

CLOSE GRIP BENCH PRESS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
TRICEP EXENSIONS: 3 sets 10-12 reps
BARBELL CURL: 5 sets 10-12 reps
ALTERNATE DUMBELL CURLS: 3 sets 10-12 reps

*TUESDAY:*

BENCH PRESS (Powerlifting style): 5 sets 10-12 reps
BENCH PRESS(Bodybuilding style): 5 sets 10-12 reps
BABELL ROWS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
PULL-UPS: 3 sets max reps

*THURSDAY:*

OVERHEAD PRESS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
ALTERNATIVE DUMBELL PRESS: 3 sets 10-12 reps
BARBELL SHRUGS 5 sets 10-12 reps

*FRIDAY:*

DEADLIFT: 5 sets 10-12 reps
POWER CLEANS: 5 sets 10-12 reps

:thumb:


----------



## Ross

ITHAQVA said:


> Use a 10-12 rep range, as soon as you can do 12 reps for every set of any given exercise below add 2-2.5kg & aim for at least 10 reps the next session & so on until you find a weight you feel is right, start with an empty bar :thumb:
> 
> Start easy: week one do one set of each exercise, add a set each week until you are doing the full sets below :thumb:
> 
> *MONDAY:*
> 
> CLOSE GRIP BENCH PRESS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> TRICEP EXENSIONS: 3 sets 10-12 reps
> BARBELL CURL: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> ALTERNATE DUMBELL CURLS: 3 sets 10-12 reps
> 
> *TUESDAY:*
> 
> BENCH PRESS (Powerlifting style): 5 sets 10-12 reps
> BENCH PRESS(Bodybuilding style): 5 sets 10-12 reps
> BABELL ROWS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> PULL-UPS: 3 sets max reps
> 
> *THURSDAY:*
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> ALTERNATIVE DUMBELL PRESS: 3 sets 10-12 reps
> BARBELL SHRUGS 5 sets 10-12 reps
> 
> *FRIDAY:*
> 
> DEADLIFT: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> POWER CLEANS: 5 sets 10-12 reps
> 
> :thumb:


Thanks Doug but I still don't really have much idea what your going on about :lol:


----------



## J1ODY A

Cheers for the response sweetcheeks, I assumed it was total weight but wanted to check.

I am limited by the equipment in my gyms... I use Spirit Health club for convenience of location so you're just lucky for what they do have. For instance Ipswich gym only has dumbbells up to 20kg whereas Brentwood is 30kg... I do have a York bench with barbell & dumbbells plus lots of various plates at home but rarely get chance to use it properly.

Understand what you say about losing form but I am very focussed on ensuring I am doing the exercise right rather than pushing the most I can in weight... when I started training in Jan I ensured I started light to get the right form.

I find I am physical strong.but don't have the muscle definition of the bigger guys mainly cos I love pies 

The plan put up for Ross is generally the programme I follow but with more individual exercises plus cardiovascular.

Pic of you in gingham or it didn't happen x


----------



## sfstu

hi guys..:wave: needing some advice...? as you know, have just started mehdi's SL 5x5 programme which i've just completed 1st week of...liking it and intending to stick to it for next 12 weeks and see where that takes me..
however...
for me personally, i really don't wanna squat 3 times a week..? 
have done some reading on the SL site and the emails from mehdi and repeatedly read that most guys train there upper bod and neglect their lower bod (which i've done in the past) resulting in skinny legs and out of proportion upper...
have also read about the guys who've followed SL strictly and gained inches on their legs...and this is my problem/concern...? have always had big legs (calves, thighs and butt) and tend to gain/store fat more on my lower half rather than just round the belly area so really don't wanna be increasing the size of my legs...wear 40" jeans/trousers not so much for the waist size but to squeeze my fat legs/butt in...:doublesho
i know you can't spot reduce fat and i know that with work on my diet and following weights/fitness regime will result in decreasing bodyfat all over including my lower half/legs but concerned that following the SL 5x5 means that i'm doing squats 3 times a week plus the deadlifts (and barbell rows) resulting in a helluva lot of leg/lower half work..? am also planning on doing more cycling and walking as part of general exercise so this too will result in even more leg work...

heres where i need the advice...:thumb:
what i would like to do is drop the squat from workout B maybe and replace with some thing else, preferably for my upper half, shoulders maybe? (as this has always been lacking i feel)...will be happy with the squats on workout A and although i won't get the strength increase in my legs as quickly i can live with that...like the idea of compound exercises but not sure what i could replace the squat for something upper body related on workout B with...?
any ideas/thoughts guys...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Thanks Doug but I still don't really have much idea what your going on about :lol:


If you are starting out as a complete novice Ross, go here for exercise examples & how to execute them: :thumb: 
http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercises/

As for types of programs: :thumb: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/bbmaintrain.htm?sel=Getting-Started#getting-started

*Sets & reps *(repetitions): Simplest terms, one set = one attempt at the exercise for (whatever your repetition range is, yours is 10-12, so you want to aim for a minimum of 10 repetitions per set).

*Example: Bench Press *- 5 sets of 10-12 reps, you attempt to execute this exercise for your minimum of 10 reps 5 times (You rest between each set, see below for details), if you really can't make at least 10 reps per set, you may be starting at too heavy a weight.
Learn to understand what training to positive failure is, so you know when to stop just before positive failure, this will allow you to carry on & achieve your reps for all 5 sets - (training volume), i.e. 1 sets is low volume & the more sets you do means you're doing more volume (more overall work) if you were to train with high intensity you would need to lower the volume due to the hit on your recovery/central nervous system.

*Rest* (Depends on your goals Ross, but generally bodybuilding style workouts have less rest than strength/powerlifting style. (This is where the intensity part kicks in) I would suggest 3 minutes rest at the beginning (I have no idea of your fitness level so I'm being kind here) but ideally you want to aim for one minute rest between each exercise set of 5, you may take longer when you change to a difference exercise.
If you're thinking of attempting High intensity training, then don't!

This is a good place for you, http://www.bodybuilding.com/

Don't listen to all the supplement hype though.

At most you will find these supplements the only ones you'll ever need:
A good quality whey protein.
Cod liver oil capsules.
Glucosamine & possibly creatin. Now I've reached a good strength /recovery level I've stopped taking protein powder for the last 3-4 weeks, haven't noticed any difference 

Hope that is clear mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

J1ODY A said:


> Cheers for the response sweetcheeks, I assumed it was total weight but wanted to check.
> 
> I am limited by the equipment in my gyms... I use Spirit Health club for convenience of location so you're just lucky for what they do have. For instance Ipswich gym only has dumbbells up to 20kg whereas Brentwood is 30kg... I do have a York bench with barbell & dumbbells plus lots of various plates at home but rarely get chance to use it properly.
> 
> *Understand what you say about losing form but I am very focussed on ensuring I am doing the exercise right rather than pushing the most I can in weight... when I started training in Jan I ensured I started light to get the right form.*
> I find I am physical strong.but don't have the muscle definition of the bigger guys mainly cos I love pies
> 
> The plan put up for Ross is generally the programme I follow but with more individual exercises plus cardiovascular.
> 
> Pic of you in gingham or it didn't happen x


I Always train Biceps with good form as you can hurt your back throwing the bar around, as I'm doing a 10 rep range this time i might do them strip style once they get heavy,

Barbell Curl - 5 sets:

Set 1 - 50kg X 10 (Less than 2 years ago i did 46kg when using a 6-8 rep range so I'm hoping i can manage 50kg for 10 within 6 months) 
Set 2 - 40Kg X 10
Set 3 - 30kg X 10
Set 4 - 20kg X 10
Set 5 - 10kg X 10

This is just a very loose example as i have no idea what the weights will be for each set until i start getting into the barbell curl again.

I have the same issue, you can see i do some sort of weights, but my body fat percentage is around 25% so not much definition, I've just stated to do Muay Thai for my cardio twice a week, its great fun :thumb:

It didn't happen I went out & washed the car instead :detailer:


----------



## Ross

Thanks Doug its a bit clearer now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi guys..:wave: needing some advice...? as you know, have just started mehdi's SL 5x5 programme which i've just completed 1st week of...liking it and intending to stick to it for next 12 weeks and see where that takes me..
> however...
> for me personally, i really don't wanna squat 3 times a week..?
> have done some reading on the SL site and the emails from mehdi and repeatedly read that most guys train there upper bod and neglect their lower bod (which i've done in the past) resulting in skinny legs and out of proportion upper...
> have also read about the guys who've followed SL strictly and gained inches on their legs...and this is my problem/concern...? have always had big legs (calves, thighs and butt) and tend to gain/store fat more on my lower half rather than just round the belly area so really don't wanna be increasing the size of my legs...wear 40" jeans/trousers not so much for the waist size but to squeeze my fat legs/butt in...:doublesho
> i know you can't spot reduce fat and i know that with work on my diet and following weights/fitness regime will result in decreasing bodyfat all over including my lower half/legs but concerned that following the SL 5x5 means that i'm doing squats 3 times a week plus the deadlifts (and barbell rows) resulting in a helluva lot of leg/lower half work..? am also planning on doing more cycling and walking as part of general exercise so this too will result in even more leg work...
> 
> heres where i need the advice...:thumb:
> what i would like to do is drop the squat from workout B maybe and replace with some thing else, preferably for my upper half, shoulders maybe? (as this has always been lacking i feel)...will be happy with the squats on workout A and although i won't get the strength increase in my legs as quickly i can live with that...like the idea of compound exercises but not sure what i could replace the squat for something upper body related on workout B with...?
> any ideas/thoughts guys...?
> rgds stu


Stu, please post your workout i'll adjust it for you :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stu,

The barbell row is an amazing upper body exercise :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Stu, please post your workout i'll adjust it for you :thumb:


cheers doug...:thumb:

workout A

SQUATS 5X5 
BENCH PRESS 5X5 
BARBELL ROWS 5X5

workout B

SQUATS 5X5
OVERHEAD PRESS 5X5
DEADLIFT *1*X5

done 3 times per week (mon,weds,thurs)

just spent the last couple o hours reading through mehdis stronglift report and wondering if i should just leave as is..? can't help wondering if its a case that mehdi himself (and majority of guys) had skinny legs and feels that legs should be worked more and this routine is based on that..?
think after the 1st 12 weeks when i've made some strength gains i could maybe add chins/pullups to one workout and dips to the other to increase upper body exercise (as used in one of the earlier versions of stronglifts)
cheers, rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cheers doug...:thumb:
> 
> workout A
> 
> SQUATS 5X5
> BENCH PRESS 5X5
> BARBELL ROWS 5X5
> 
> workout B
> 
> SQUATS 5X5
> OVERHEAD PRESS 5X5
> DEADLIFT *1*X5
> 
> done 3 times per week (mon,weds,thurs)
> 
> just spent the last couple o hours reading through mehdis stronglift report and wondering if i should just leave as is..? can't help wondering if its a case that mehdi himself (and majority of guys) had skinny legs and feels that legs should be worked more and this routine is based on that..?
> think after the 1st 12 weeks when i've made some strength gains i could maybe add chins/pullups to one workout and dips to the other to increase upper body exercise (as used in one of the earlier versions of stronglifts)
> cheers, rgds stu


First of all the squat even though it is a leg exercise also trains loads of other muscles in your upper body & gives great core strength :thumb:

I would stick to the conventional routine you've posted for 12 weeks, the idea is for you to build muscle & lose some body fat, so your legs shouldn't go too big, however if you're like me, they will go bigger. I am a 36" waist & have to wear 38" waist stretch jeans with a belt so I can fit comfortably in them 

If you look back you'll se I very soon changed the workout 
On bench press day I swapped the lifts around so the bench press was done first :thumb:

An alternative workout

*Week 1*

*Workout A (Monday) 
BENCH PRESS 5X5 
SQUATS 5X5 
BARBELL ROWS 5X5*

*Workout B (Wednesday)
DEADLIFT 1X5 
OVERHEAD PRESS 5X5
PULL -UPS (Overhand grip)*

*Workout A (Friday) 
BENCH PRESS 5X5 
SQUATS 5X5 
BARBELL ROWS 5X5*

*Week 2*

*Workout B (Monday)
DEADLIFT 1X5 
OVERHEAD PRESS 5X5
PULL -UPS (Overhand grip)*

*Workout A (Wednesday) 
BENCH PRESS 5X5 
SQUATS 5X5 
BARBELL ROWS 5X5*

*Workout B (Friday)
DEADLIFT 1X5 
OVERHEAD PRESS 5X5
PULL -UPS (Overhand grip)*

Then go back to week 1 & so one :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

so you swapped the squat in one of the 2 workouts for pullups..?
thats kinda what i wanted to hear...! 
would still be squatting twice every other week i guess and as i really don't wanna increase size of my legs but would like to work more on upper bod...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> so you swapped the squat in one of the 2 workouts for pullups..?
> thats kinda what i wanted to hear...!
> would still be squatting twice every other week i guess and as i really don't wanna increase size of my legs but would like to work more on upper bod...?
> rgds stu


Thats what i did i think after 12 weeks of the 5X5, look back on this thread it will be in there somewhere :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sundays Workout

*Deadlift Warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift Work set: 182.5X5 :thumb:* Felt heavy on the last rep.

Boring but big assistnce

*Deadlift: 107.5 3X10*

Had to go out so made the workout short, made 5 good reps on the work set which means next weeks deadlift is 185Kg :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Thats what i did i think after 12 weeks of the 5X5, look back on this thread it will be in there somewhere :thumb:


cheers doug, think i'll leave the routine be for now but may change as you did along the line...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cheers doug, think i'll leave the routine be for now but may change as you did along the line...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Good man, I think i went on to a 2X5 for a few weeks then decided the 4 day split 1X5 with some extra 10 rep volume work was to be my routine of choice :thumb:


----------



## J1ODY A

I had a health check last October before I started this programme and was 31% BMI so hoping when it comes around again there will be significant improvement. They suggested that I would have average stats should I lose half stone...

If I had known I was going to transform my body so much I would have put a thread up :lol:


----------



## Bod42

I wouldnt take to much notice of the BMI, its a useless piece of information that the doctors use to sometimes give bad advice. 

If you know you made a good transformation then thats all that matters really.

sfstu: I would have to agree with leaving the routine as it is written for the first 12 weeks. The reason SL squats 3 times per week is due to beginners progressing better when exercises are done more frequently. The 5x5 3 times per week will be quite a shock to the system so I would say you will lose fat and put on muscle so your legs may stay the same size. It will all depends on how much your eating as well.


----------



## Guest

Short session tonight as I started late. Decided during my warmup to try for a PR on the squat and do the rest of the session tomorrow.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

And that's it . Did take me an hour however to do all that.
My previous 1RM was 125kg. Belted up for both 130kg and 140kg.
Just decided to do 3 reps @ 130kg. I might have got another rep but 3 is what I was aiming for.
The single rep @ 140kg was quite enough tbh. But I'm pleased to have cracked the 300lb barrier on the squat at last. I feel confident on reaching [email protected] by then end July now.

Bench, Row and Dips tomorrow.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## J1ODY A

Bod42 said:


> I wouldnt take to much notice of the BMI, its a useless piece of information that the doctors use to sometimes give bad advice.
> 
> If you know you made a good transformation then thats all that matters really.


oh I agree, I have friends who chase the magic number when it comes to their weight which I know is crap... i.e. one guy is an inch taller than me & is now 1.5 stone lighter (after intense dieting) BUT I know at 15 stone I am in better shape than him... I have more strength & cardio fitness by far.

But still be interesting to take the same health check to see how I've improved :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

J1ODY A said:


> oh I agree, I have friends who chase the magic number when it comes to their weight which I know is crap... i.e. one guy is an inch taller than me & is now 1.5 stone lighter (after intense dieting) BUT I know at 15 stone I am in better shape than him... I have more strength & cardio fitness by far.
> 
> But still be interesting to take the same health check to see how I've improved :thumb:


There seems to be a massive emphasis on weight these days and I think its irrelevant. I remember watching a scientific show that had 3 guys, a skinny guy, fat guy and rugby player. When the audience were asked who was heathiest without question the lightest was the healthiest and the rugby player was the worse whereas in fact it was the total opposite as the skinny guy carried all his fat around his organs.

At 5'9" the doctor tells me I should be 11.5-12 stone WTF springs to mind.


----------



## ITHAQVA

I agree with James^^^^^, we are all built different, a lot of it is just luck, we all know stories of healthy people dropping dead & fat people living longer.

At the end of the day i don’t train to live longer, i train to have a better quality of life, especially at my age :thumb:

I have a goal to lose some body fat which I’m just starting now & hopefully I’ll get down to 15% :thumb:

Enjoy the ride! :thumb:


----------



## Ross

I am going to give this a miss currently,My left quad muscle which was healing nicely since tearing it 8/9 months ago has gone again.
Awful pain,its bruised from the bleeding so I am back to square one


----------



## tomah

Ross said:


> I am interested in getting a weights bench or something to tone up my chest a bit.


The easiest exercise to build your upper body, Ross, is the pull up.

Get one of the 'door gyms' or whatever they're called. Fantastic pieces of home equipment that will build your back, core, chest and arms all in one movement.

:thumb:


----------



## The Cueball

ITHAQVA said:


> At the end of the day i don't train to live longer, I train to f**k chics and show the guns off....
> 
> Enjoy the ride! :thumb:


EFA there buddy!



:thumb:


----------



## Ross

There can't be much demand for buff OAP's?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> There can't be much demand for buff OAP's?


I'd put this buff old OAP up against guys half my age in regards to getting pussy & lifting


----------



## ITHAQVA

The Cueball said:


> EFA there buddy!
> 
> 
> 
> :thumb:


:lol::lol::lol:

Powerlifting = pump em deeper n harder :devil: 

All this a pumpin, makes me fitter for the humpin!


----------



## Ross

ITHAQVA said:


> I'd put this buff old OAP up against guys half my age in regards to getting pussy & lifting


Just joking mate I am the one who is an OAP....


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ross said:


> Just joking mate I am the one who is an OAP....


Dont think like that Ross, you are still very young, you have all the tools you need to get fixed mate :thumb:


----------



## Ross

Doctors tomorrow to see what the hell is going on with my left quad,never did anything to set it off.Pain is from my hip to half way down my shin,whole thigh/knee is blue and swollen which means its been bleeding again somehow.
Hugely frustrating because it was getting much better and I was doing well.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Press Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 37.5x3, 42.5x3, 45x8, 45x8, 45x12
Weighted Dips: BWx3, BWx3, 10(115kg)x10
Chin Ups Neutral Grip: 6x3

Pleased to get 12 reps on shoulder press, I think higher reps are the way to go for me with SP as I can feel the targe muscles working.

I was aiming for 6 reps with 10kg extra added but it was a lot easier than I expected. Have to watch this exercise as it can put a lot of stress on the shoulders.

Added an extra set of Chins as having trouble adding reps. Been doing this grip for awhile so may change to underhand


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Med Ball Shoulder Press Throws: 3x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: 37.5x3, 42.5x3, 45x8, 45x8, 45x12
> Weighted Dips: BWx3, BWx3, 10(115kg)x10
> Chin Ups Neutral Grip: 6x3
> 
> Pleased to get 12 reps on shoulder press, I think higher reps are the way to go for me with SP as I can feel the targe muscles working.
> 
> I was aiming for 6 reps with 10kg extra added but it was a lot easier than I expected. Have to watch this exercise as it can put a lot of stress on the shoulders.
> 
> Added an extra set of Chins as having trouble adding reps. Been doing this grip for awhile so may change to underhand


OHP 45kg for 12, that's good going James, bet it was sooo uncomfortable! :devil::devil:

I can see how the higher rep routine carries over to the heavier stuff what's the max reps recommended?

When are you returning to the heavy stuff?


----------



## Oats

Review of first week of 5\3\1 (9 day cycle, boring but big assistance)

Pros – Weights felt good, supersetting assistance exercises works, enjoying chins between main lift sets, 10 light reps gives a very different feeling to feeling mashed by 5 heavy, hill sprints given harsh DOMS in bad leg, ab wheel is ridiculously hard (I felt like an utter girl :lol. Done in an hour (compared to double that on Starting Strength), lower back feels good.

Cons – Not squatting first and every workout – feel like a dog without its collar Reps on assistance work much lower than expected (around 7 or 8). I was expecting double figures :doublesho Must have lost a lot of strength on squats whilst dialling back on them for a month. The weight was definitely too heavy (in contrast to other lifts) even though it was half on the bar to previously; will knock off 10kg from max and recalculate. 

Next week – more of the same I’ve done it by the book with low numbers to start with. I expect hill sprint DOMS to reduce a touch. Will see how a lower weight on squat day helps. If it feels like a question of frequnecy I might look at Bod42s suggestion earlier than anticipated (putting the squat assistance on a different day).


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> OHP 45kg for 12, that's good going James, bet it was sooo uncomfortable! :devil::devil:
> 
> I can see how the higher rep routine carries over to the heavier stuff what's the max reps recommended?
> 
> When are you returning to the heavy stuff?


Got one more week of 8s and then I do a month of 5s and then a month of 3s. If everything goes to plan I should be hitting some pretty good numbers on the last week of the 3s month. Cant wait. Friday and next week are my all out, everything I got workouts so Im preparing to die. Last squat workout I hit 17 reps, now thats a shock to the system after doing 5s for months.

So used to doing 5 reps its surprising how much 12 reps burns but I been using low rest periods so good for size and fitness.

Oats: If you been doing 5 reps for awhile 10 reps will feel like loads. I been doing this higher rep strength cycle and week 1 I was having trouble hitting higher reps but your body will adapt really quickly. As Wendler says better to start to light than to heavy.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Review of first week of 531 (9 day cycle, boring but big assistance)
> 
> Pros - Weights felt good, supersetting assistance exercises works, enjoying chins between main lift sets, 10 light reps gives a very different feeling to feeling mashed by 5 heavy, hill sprints given harsh DOMS in bad leg, ab wheel is ridiculously hard (I felt like an utter girl :lol. Done in an hour (compared to double that on Starting Strength), lower back feels good.
> 
> Cons - Not squatting first and every workout - feel like a dog without its collar Reps on assistance work much lower than expected (around 7 or 8). I was expecting double figures :doublesho Must have lost a lot of strength on squats whilst dialling back on them for a month. The weight was definitely too heavy (in contrast to other lifts) even though it was half on the bar to previously; will knock off 10kg from max and recalculate.
> 
> Next week - more of the same I've done it by the book with low numbers to start with. I expect hill sprint DOMS to reduce a touch. Will see how a lower weight on squat day helps. If it feels like a question of frequnecy I might look at Bod42s suggestion earlier than anticipated (putting the squat assistance on a different day).





Bod42 said:


> Got one more week of 8s and then I do a month of 5s and then a month of 3s. If everything goes to plan I should be hitting some pretty good numbers on the last week of the 3s month. Cant wait. Friday and next week are my all out, everything I got workouts so Im preparing to die. Last squat workout I hit 17 reps, now thats a shock to the system after doing 5s for months.
> 
> So used to doing 5 reps its surprising how much 12 reps burns but I been using low rest periods so good for size and fitness.
> 
> Oats: If you been doing 5 reps for awhile 10 reps will feel like loads. I been doing this higher rep strength cycle and week 1 I was having trouble hitting higher reps but your body will adapt really quickly. As Wendler says better to start to light than to heavy.


Not sure your having problems with the high rep stuff Oats, what weight % are you starting at mate?

Here is how I interpreted the 5/3/1 boring but big.

*Squat:*
Bare in mind my heavy work sets are not part of the 5/3/1 routine just a plain 1X5.

Example squat work set weight a few weeks ago: 170Kg

When I started BBB I went for 50% of my work set: So I should start with 85kg for 5 sets of 10 reps. Once I get a full 10 reps on each set I add 2.5kg & will continue to do this for as long as possible etc…, this week for instance my BBB squat is 107.5kg 5X10.

I've done the same for all 3 lifts, bench BBB is around 80kg now, start light & you'll soon pack on the plates :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Oats: If you been doing 5 reps for awhile 10 reps will feel like loads.


You're right; it feels very different even whilst doing the lifts. Then afterwards it could be the mythical 'pump' that others refer to :lol: It also seems like it would be a diffrent kind of mental attitude than heavy low rep sets.



ITHAQVA said:


> Not sure your having problems with the high rep stuff Oats, what weight % are you starting at mate?
> ...
> I've done the same for all 3 lifts, bench BBB is around 80kg now, start light & you'll soon pack on the plates :thumb:


I've done the weights to the letter. Previous week did a rep max test at 80% of max and then weightxrepx0.0333+weight to get max. 90% of that for new working max. Week one sets at 65%, 75%, 85% and assistance at 50%. Will be interesting to see what week 2 yields.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I've done the weights to the letter. Previous week did a rep max test at 80% of max and then weightxrepx0.0333+weight to get max. 90% of that for new working max. Week one sets at 65%, 75%, 85% and assistance at 50%. Will be interesting to see what week 2 yields.


Fair play to you Oats :thumb: I couldn't be arsed with all that, I just do a 1X5 with 85% of my 1rm for my work sets, no light weeks either.

I.E
Work set 85% of my one rep max - 1X5

Assistance work started at 50% of my work set weight, every week I get 5X10 I add 2.5kg to the assistance weight :thumb:

Very simple, but also very effective, I'm really looking forward/hoping to getting my rep goals for the Deadlift & Squat by December, as I'm going to really hit the assistance work hard as though its a secondary work set & just keep going as heavy as I can with good from :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Deadlifts: 102.5x3, 115x3, 125x8, 125x8, 125x8
Front Squats: 72.5x3, 85x3, 95x3

Thats it, thats all I dont tonight as I was ill today so just got in the gym and did the main exercises and got out. I only hit the minimum reps as didnt want to destroy my body as I would have probably made myself more ill. Also friday and next week is progression week, the most important week of the month so dont want to be ill for that.



Oats said:


> I've done the weights to the letter. Previous week did a rep max test at 80% of max and then weightxrepx0.0333+weight to get max. 90% of that for new working max. Week one sets at 65%, 75%, 85% and assistance at 50%. Will be interesting to see what week 2 yields.


Sounds like you done it spot on but if your haing trouble dount worry, your body will adapt really fast to the extra reps. For instance the program I'm on at the moment calls for higher reps and week 1 I managed to Deadlift 100kg x 11 reps, week 2 112.5x11, 125x12 and the first week I really had nothing left.

Also 5 sets of the same exercise plus the heavy sets is a lot of volume for one exercise so your body needs to get used to this. I found unusual muscles were burning like crazy during high rep squats, muscles I wouldnt even normally feel when squatting low rep.


----------



## Guest

That's an interesting program you are on James. 125kgx12 is some tonnage (1.5tons to be exact! ), especially after "only" 100kgx11 the week before - a 400kg increase!

I'm going to watch how you progress with much interest :thumb:

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's an interesting program you are on James. 125kgx12 is some tonnage (1.5tons to be exact! ), especially after "only" 100kgx11 the week before - a 400kg increase!
> 
> I'm going to watch how you progress with much interest :thumb:
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Obviously it is that weight increase as the weights dont lie but its kind of a false increase as its just my body getting used to the higher reps. I had been doing 5 rep workouts for 7-8 months so doing more than 10 reps was a real shock to the body.

Its the same as when you change from resting 5-7mins between sets to 60 secs rest, the first few weeks you crawl out of the gym but you get used to it pretty fast.

Its the Juggernaut Program, its basically a slightly higher rep and auto regulated 5/3/1 workout. By auto regulate I mean instead of increasing by a predefined amount, like say 2.5kg, you increase your max weight by how many reps you get over your goal. For instant last month I hit 17 reps on Squats when the Goal was 10 so I increase my 1RM by 14kg.


----------



## Guest

Had to delay continuing my last workout until last night due to work getting in the way again.

*Back Squat*
WU: [email protected]

*Front Squat*
WU: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Front Squat*
WO: [email protected]

Didn't quite follow my normal routine last night. Since I was not doing back squats, I decided to do a bit of technique practice on the front squat instead.

Warmed up with back and front squats @20kg for a few sets of 5. Found the bar was falling forward on the front squats so decided to spend some time at the end of the workout trying to identify what was lacking in my (non-existent) technique.

As I didn't do any proper squat work, I did some extra warmup sets on the bench @20kg as well.
Bench is getting heavy again. Last few reps were slow, but not grinders. Getting quite close to my previous max.

Row was fine apart from not allowing enough time between the warmup and first workout set - form dropped a bit.

Dips went ok once I remembered to keep my elbows in. I keep letting them flare out which causes pain in my left shoulder.

Front squats - hmm, ok, I'm pretty bad at them.
My torso bend forward I think because I lack ankle flexibility. I ended up using a 20kg plate to lift my heels up for the WO sets.
I think I also lack wrist flexibility as I can't get my upper arms high enough.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Out of sync this week after Tuesdays *EPIC FAIL*, took two attempts at the bench press, nearly dropped it on the second :doublesho Decided to take a day off & had another go today. Done as before, view Dave Tate's bench press videos & Re-evaluated my form/technique. I remember doing this before & it really helps. *Dave states, as the weight gets heavy your technique can deteriorate. Totally agree.*

Todays excellent result! :thumb:

Thursdays Workout

*Bench press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench press work set: 115X4*, really kicking myself though, I was so over the moon about getting 4 reps I racked the bar as soon as they were complete, at a push I think I could have done 5, but I would rather progress slow than not at all :thumb:

BBB assistance work

*Bench Press 80X5X10 *(The last two reps on the last two sets were hard, so it looks like I'm starting to find my 5 sets of 10 reps strength base line to work from).

*Barbell Row: 67.5X5X10 *less than 60 seconds rest between sets :devil:

Done the whole workout in less than 40 minutes :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Out of sync this week after Tuesdays *EPIC FAIL*, ... Todays excellent result! :thumb:
> [...] Done the whole workout in less than 40 minutes :thumb:


It's the damndest thing isn't it, how one session can fail and then you come back and do the exact same thing and it works. It's not like you didn't put the effort in on the first session. Good lesson in perserverance:thumb:

40 mins? :doublesho I haven't warmed up and chosen which CD to have on in that time :lol:



ITHAQVA said:


> Fair play to you Oats :thumb: I couldn't be arsed with all that


I think it's from reading Rip railing at people YNDTP and believing that I'm not entitled to an opinion on these matters. Do as I'm told :thumb: although I've just found a calculator at http://blackironbeast.com/5/3/1/calculator that does the whole months routine for you if you type in your maxes. Useful.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> It's the damndest thing isn't it, how one session can fail and then you come back and do the exact same thing and it works. It's not like you didn't put the effort in on the first session. Good lesson in perserverance:thumb:
> 
> 40 mins? :doublesho I haven't warmed up and chosen which CD to have on in that time :lol:
> 
> I think it's from reading Rip railing at people YNDTP and believing that I'm not entitled to an opinion on these matters. Do as I'm told :thumb: although I've just found a calculator at http://blackironbeast.com/5/3/1/calculator that does the whole months routine for you if you type in your maxes. Useful.


Tell me about it, but i shouldnt moan, im getting some dam good results in only 8 months powerlifting so im  about it in general :thumb:

Yep 40 mins, usualy do it in an hour, i dont see the point in going to slow, better to get it over with 

You do what suites you mate, if it works bonus! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug I know your not into the hole Deloading but was reading about Andy Bolton and found this. He doesnt do a full deload just takes 60% of the reps every 4 weeks so your still lifting heavy weights but just lower the reps slightly. Sounds good to me as when I deloaded a few weeks back to say 40-50% when I came back to squatting and benching I felt like I hadnt done either in months and my technique didnt feel good so I may take this approach. Copy and paste below.

Let me give you an example of de-loading using this 60% rule:
Imagine that for the past 3 weeks you had performed Incline Bench Presses as your second movement on Monday. Here's what you did:
Week 1: 80kg x 6, 95kg x 6, 110kg x 6
Week 2: 85kg x 6, 100kg x 6, 115kg x 6
Week 3: 90kg x6, 105kg x 6, 120kg x 4
Here's how you would de-load on Week 4:
Week 4: 80kg x 4, 95kg x 4, 110kg x 4



BareFacedGeek said:


> Front squats - hmm, ok, I'm pretty bad at them.
> My torso bend forward I think because I lack ankle flexibility. I ended up using a 20kg plate to lift my heels up for the WO sets.
> I think I also lack wrist flexibility as I can't get my upper arms high enough.


I have put Front Squats back in my routine lately and I think they are a great exercise. I struggled with loosing the bar forward big time out of the hole and I found a couple of things.

Front squats are different to back squats in technique, with back squats your suppose to feel like your sitting back and I dont like the knees going to far forwards (mixed opinion if this is bad or not) but I do this so people use their posterior chain more but with front squat you squat straight down letting your knees go forwards abit more which in turn keeps the torso very upright.

I find core and upper back strength is very important for front squats. As you say ankle flexibility is also key and I would do Wall Ankle Mobilizations between sets to help you with this.

Technique wise try and drive your elbows up to the ceiling as you come out of the bottom of the squat, this should help with your back rounding forwards.

I have very poor flexibility in my wrists so I do this sometimes. I just use cheap wrist straps.












Oats said:


> 40 mins? :doublesho I haven't warmed up and chosen which CD to have on in that time :lol:


 :lol:

The nice thing about Stronglift is you get 5-7 mins rest, the bad thing about Stronglift is you get 5-7mins rest which makes the workout long.

I'm on 3 mins between main exercise sets and 90 second between assistant exercises and sometimes I super set those so 45 secs rest so Im out of the gym in like 30 mins. Lovely


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug I know your not into the hole Deloading but was reading about Andy Bolton and found this. He doesnt do a full deload just takes 60% of the reps every 4 weeks so your still lifting heavy weights but just lower the reps slightly. Sounds good to me as when I deloaded a few weeks back to say 40-50% when I came back to squatting and benching I felt like I hadnt done either in months and my technique didnt feel good so I may take this approach. Copy and paste below.
> 
> Let me give you an example of de-loading using this 60% rule:
> Imagine that for the past 3 weeks you had performed Incline Bench Presses as your second movement on Monday. Here's what you did:
> Week 1: 80kg x 6, 95kg x 6, 110kg x 6
> Week 2: 85kg x 6, 100kg x 6, 115kg x 6
> Week 3: 90kg x6, 105kg x 6, 120kg x 4
> Here's how you would de-load on Week 4:
> Week 4: 80kg x 4, 95kg x 4, 110kg x 4
> 
> I have put Front Squats back in my routine lately and I think they are a great exercise. I struggled with loosing the bar forward big time out of the hole and I found a couple of things.
> 
> Front squats are different to back squats in technique, with back squats your suppose to feel like your sitting back and I dont like the knees going to far forwards (mixed opinion if this is bad or not) but I do this so people use their posterior chain more but with front squat you squat straight down letting your knees go forwards abit more which in turn keeps the torso very upright.
> 
> I find core and upper back strength is very important for front squats. As you say ankle flexibility is also key and I would do Wall Ankle Mobilizations between sets to help you with this.
> 
> Technique wise try and drive your elbows up to the ceiling as you come out of the bottom of the squat, this should help with your back rounding forwards.
> 
> I have very poor flexibility in my wrists so I do this sometimes. I just use cheap wrist straps.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :lol:
> 
> The nice thing about Stronglift is you get 5-7 mins rest, the bad thing about Stronglift is you get 5-7mins rest which makes the workout long.
> 
> I'm on 3 mins between main exercise sets and 90 second between assistant exercises and sometimes I super set those so 45 secs rest so Im out of the gym in like 30 mins. Lovely


Thanks James, i see the principle, there are similarities between that & 5/3/1, lower reps heavier weight etc..Defo something for me to consider when i start to really struggle on the last 20kg for the DL & S & when progress on the BP becomes very slow.
Last night's improvement to 4 reps has proved to me that I need to just keep at it & dig in, I can't believe how easy they felt, it's so weird how the same weight can feel so different. If I can get to 120kg-125kg for reps by December I will be very pleased 

Excellent info on the front squat :thumb:

My rest periods are around 2-3 minutes between warm ups, 5-6 minutes between the last warm up & full work set, assistance set rest periods vary due to how heavy they feel. The bench press feels the most difficult so must be getting close to my max which I then need to work from & rest periods are around 1-2 minutes, the barbell row is still feeling really light so I go back to the bar in around 30 seconds :thumb:

I'm inclined to keep the assistance sets lighter & keep the intensity higher with around 2 minute rest periods, is this the best method for fat burning? :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Medicine Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x3, 85x2, 92.5x1, *97.5x13 (Predicted 1RM 140kg)*
Pendlay Rows: 65x5, 75x3, 82.5x9
Dips: BW x 9, 9, 9, 9, 6

Ya its a Chavy saying but all I can think about Bench Press is Ya Boi. I'm really happy with 13 reps of just under 100kg for Bench Press. 140kg predicted max is pretty good as well.

Incresed Pendlay rows by 2.5kg and 1 rep so pretty happy with this and this isnt an all out set as I only leave 90 seconds between sets.

Cant believe how easy the first set of dips feel but fatigue soon sets in with 5 sets and low rest.

Doug, it wasnt so much the program that I was showing I was more showing the deload as I think there is a positive aspect to deloading but I know you dont do it but Andy Bolton's way isnt a fall deload, still heavy weights but slightly less reps.

Your progressing mate so no need to change.

Depends on your goals really. I like longer rest periods for main strength exercises and then 1-2 mins for assistant stuff as I find it builds abit more muscle and muscle burns fat so cant be bad. Also helps with fitness. But if you want all out strength then longer rest periods are better. Just my thinking.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, it wasnt so much the program that I was showing I was more showing the deload as I think there is a positive aspect to deloading but I know you dont do it but Andy Bolton's way isnt a fall deload, still heavy weights but slightly less reps.
> 
> Your progressing mate so no need to change.
> 
> Depends on your goals really. I like longer rest periods for main strength exercises and then 1-2 mins for assistant stuff as I find it builds abit more muscle and muscle burns fat so cant be bad. Also helps with fitness. But if you want all out strength then longer rest periods are better. Just my thinking.


I get ya mate, i do like the idea of going to lower reps & heavier, bit like doing a 90% day :thumb:

So far I am, it does concern me that my progres is that good that im an injury waiting to happen because some part of my body isnt up to speed :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

just checking in guys...
just finished 3rd workout of 2nd week of SL 5x5...:thumb:

observations,
need to find some decent videos for the exercises i'm doing...ok on some but just finished an *UGLY* set of deadlifts, which at 50kgs is heavy enough to maybe hurt my lower back... loads of vids on youtube but don't know which ones are good enough to follow and there're only a couple on the stronglifts site... mainly OHP,deadlifts and barbell rows...

although i'm only lifting light weights at the mo, can see what you guys mean by one workout you struggle but the next is easy although the weights heavier...squats were much easier today than wednesday tho slightly heavier..

knees and shoulder both feel better already after only 2 weeks of training with virtually all niggles/pains having cleared up... putting it down to exercising for 1st time in years,strengthing muscles around those areas and using free weights rather than a machine or smith machine...bench press on my smith machine used to really hurt my shoulder in the past...

DO NOT start a workout when you think you may need a dump, and DEFINATELY DO NOT attempt barbell rows thinking you can finish set before taking aforementioned dump..!!!:doublesho 
nearly messed meself for the 1st time in 30 something years...:devil:

don't think i've lost much weight wise so far but definately feeling better and know my bodyshape has changed slightly and generally feeling better and stronger already...its all good...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> just checking in guys...
> just finished 3rd workout of 2nd week of SL 5x5...:thumb:
> 
> observations,
> need to find some decent videos for the exercises i'm doing...ok on some but just finished an *UGLY* set of deadlifts, which at 50kgs is heavy enough to maybe hurt my lower back... loads of vids on youtube but don't know which ones are good enough to follow and there're only a couple on the stronglifts site... mainly OHP,deadlifts and barbell rows...
> 
> although i'm only lifting light weights at the mo, can see what you guys mean by one workout you struggle but the next is easy although the weights heavier...squats were much easier today than wednesday tho slightly heavier..
> 
> knees and shoulder both feel better already after only 2 weeks of training with virtually all niggles/pains having cleared up... putting it down to exercising for 1st time in years,strengthing muscles around those areas and using free weights rather than a machine or smith machine...bench press on my smith machine used to really hurt my shoulder in the past...
> 
> DO NOT start a workout when you think you may need a dump, and DEFINATELY DO NOT attempt barbell rows thinking you can finish set before taking aforementioned dump..!!!:doublesho
> nearly messed meself for the 1st time in 30 something years...:devil:
> 
> don't think i've lost much weight wise so far but definately feeling better and know my bodyshape has changed slightly and generally feeling better and stronger already...its all good...:thumb:


Hi Stu,

First of all I always ensure I'm cleared out before lifting 

As for videos mate, I posted a load of links from YouTube on this thread regarding form/technique etc...Well worth looking for :thumb:

Or you can go to YouTube, look for Mark Ripptoe (Deadlift, squat, bench press & overhead press) & Dave Tate's bench press videos, I watched theses to get yesterdays 4 reps :devil:
Also look for the Elitefts videos (Dave Tate is part of them) :devil:

Always remember keep checking your form as it will deteriorate as you progress. I put yesterdays 115kg Bench press X 4 reps down to lifting right & Tuesdays utter failure down to lifting wrong & nothing to do with strength :thumb:

Keep lifting mate & if it helps to inspire post your workout on here, you'll get all our support, this is an ego free zone :thumb:


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> just checking in guys...
> observations,
> need to find some decent videos for the exercises i'm doing...
> 
> DO NOT start a workout when you think you may need a dump, and DEFINATELY DO NOT attempt barbell rows thinking you can finish set before taking aforementioned dump..!!!:doublesho
> nearly messed meself for the 1st time in 30 something years...:devil:


I agree - there are few things more disruptive to a workout than an imminent sh*^

I got the Starting Strength DVD form Wichita Falls and you're welcome to borrow it for a couple of weeks if you wish.


----------



## sfstu

cheers doug...:thumb:
will be posting mate, its just that as i'm right at the start and only lifting 25kgs for BP and 32.5kgs for squat for example it seems a little strange to post weights that most of you are at least doubling for warmups..!!! 
not embarrassed about it as know that i need to start small and work up it just seems a bit daft right now... just glad i've finally made a start and can't wait for next workout and increase..!!!
will have a look for the links you posted its just that this threads _soooo_ long it'd take me hours to find...:doublesho will check those others on youtube out tho for now...
cheers, rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I agree - there are few things more disruptive to a workout than an imminent sh*^
> 
> I got the Starting Strength DVD form Wichita Falls and you're welcome to borrow it for a couple of weeks if you wish.


that'd be great oats..?! very kind of you mate...:thumb: i'll obviously sort you out for postage and dvd will be well looked after...
cheers again,
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I get ya mate, i do like the idea of going to lower reps & heavier, bit like doing a 90% day :thumb:
> 
> So far I am, it does concern me that my progres is that good that im an injury waiting to happen because some part of my body isnt up to speed :devil:
> 
> :thumb:


Deloads seem to be the standard in workouts now but that never means its right. The thinking seems to be, yes you can progress faster within a shorter time frame without deloads but in the long run it seems that you make better progress using deloads as you get less injured and less run down. This is all theory anyway.

Anyway Doug thinking about it you do deload as you increase the weight by 2.5kg but lower the reps to 3 amd even if you can do more you still only do 3 which is a deload really.



sfstu said:


> cheers doug...:thumb:
> will be posting mate, its just that as i'm right at the start and only lifting 25kgs for BP and 32.5kgs for squat for example it seems a little strange to post weights that most of you are at least doubling for warmups..!!!
> not embarrassed about it as know that i need to start small and work up it just seems a bit daft right now... just glad i've finally made a start and can't wait for next workout and increase..!!!
> will have a look for the links you posted its just that this threads _soooo_ long it'd take me hours to find...:doublesho will check those others on youtube out tho for now...
> cheers, rgds stu


Mate there is no ego in here so the weights are not important, just trying to help people out as much as we all can. No matter the wieght your at currently your still working at 100% to improve so everyone is level in my opinion.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deloads seem to be the standard in workouts now but that never means its right. The thinking seems to be, yes you can progress faster within a shorter time frame without deloads but in the long run it seems that you make better progress using deloads as you get less injured and less run down. This is all theory anyway.
> 
> Anyway Doug thinking about it you do deload as you increase the weight by 2.5kg but lower the reps to 3 amd even if you can do more you still only do 3 which is a deload really.
> 
> Mate there is no ego in here so the weights are not important, just trying to help people out as much as we all can. No matter the wieght your at currently your still working at 100% to improve so everyone is level in my opinion.


James, yep i forgot all about that  So yes i do de load , sometimes i know i can make more than 3 reps after adding 2.5kg, but i like to get into the new weight slowly & I suppose because I move up on my deadlift & squat by only 2.5kg not 5kg that in itself is a safer way to progress :thumb:

As James says, the ego isn't trained here Stu, it's the challenge to one's character, setting goals & achieving them. We don't care how much anyone lifts as long as you lift  :thumb:

We are all doing different routines, but we can still learn from each other to achieve our goals :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Tonights session. Started at 10pm, finished just before midnight :/.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Chins*
WU: [email protected]
WO: 1/2/3/4/5/[email protected], 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected] (61 reps total)

Squat went well tonight, managed to push each rep up moderately quickly - maybe my 1RM session a couple of nights ago helped?

Press was good as well tonight. Again, pushed the reps up very positively. The weight didn't feel as heavy as 42.5kg did on my last OHP session.

Dead was weird. Moved all the reps perfectly fine but for some reason I felt it didn't go well - can't put my finger on why though? It might have been because I started to superset these with the chins. I did find the deads quite exhausting, maybe because I started too late?

Decided to change the way I do chins and try using ladders again to get in more volume (and hopefully strength adaption). Started off by supersetting with the deads but stopped after the 2nd set as the deads were not feeling right.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Tonights session. Started at 10pm, finished just before midnight :/.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Chins*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: 1/2/3/4/5/[email protected], 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected] (61 reps total)
> 
> Squat went well tonight, managed to push each rep up moderately quickly - maybe my 1RM session a couple of nights ago helped?
> 
> Press was good as well tonight. Again, pushed the reps up very positively. The weight didn't feel as heavy as 42.5kg did on my last OHP session.
> 
> Dead was weird. Moved all the reps perfectly fine but for some reason I felt it didn't go well - can't put my finger on why though? It might have been because I started to superset these with the chins. I did find the deads quite exhausting, maybe because I started too late?
> 
> Decided to change the way I do chins and try using ladders again to get in more volume (and hopefully strength adaption). Started off by supersetting with the deads but stopped after the 2nd set as the deads were not feeling right.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Holy **** Phil 10pm start :doublesho

Way to go mate :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Off to see Europes strongest man later - looking forward to it, although I might need my snorkel!

sfstu-pm your address and I'll post it over.


----------



## sfstu

would like to add some ab exercises, maybe to do at the weekend as abs get some workout during the 3 training days during week but would like to do some extra...
any recomendations...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> would like to add some ab exercises, maybe to do at the weekend as abs get some workout during the 3 training days during week but would like to do some extra...
> any recomendations...?
> rgds stu


You'll find the Core powerlifting lifts will make your abs strong.

Go here for loads of extra info on everyhing powerlifting: http://www.elitefts.net/

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday's workout

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat Work set: 177.5X5*

BBB Assistance work

*Squat: 110X5X10

Standing Calf raise: 110X5X10*

Starting to find the limit of my shoes, Squat work set was untidy; they aren't as solid as I thought :doublesho! Time to invest in some proper weightlifting shoes for squatting, another call to the guys at Pullum sports me thinks :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Tonights workout.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WU: [email protected]
WO: 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected], 1/2/[email protected], [email protected]2.5kg (50 reps total)

Squat continues to feel good, so I hope this lasts a while 

Bench was pretty tough. Managed all the reps but last couple were hard fought. Getting close to my previous max work weight so this is expected.

Row went fine. Lifting my body slightly at the end of most reps, but only by a few inches so I'm not too worried about form atm.

Last few sets of the Dips were a battle. I was determined to get a total of 50 reps, which I just managed.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Box Squats: 80x5, 97.5x3, 112.5x2, 120x1, 130x11 (Predicted Max 177.5) (13 reps would have been predicted Max of 187.5)
Snatch Grip Deadlift: 80x5, 90x3, 110x1
Bulgarian Split Squat: 5kg x 3x11
Ab Works

My god I cant explain how fcuking angry i am with myself. My goal was a minimum of 11 reps but I wanted more than that and I had maybe 2 or 3 more reps if not more and this is my give it 110% week. I was counting down from 12 and the first 6 were easy and after 9 my lower back and abs started to burn but the weight was going up easy and I wasnt grinding the weight at all but for some reason I got to 11 reps and on the way down I felt weak and didnt even bother trying to push up. This had nothing to do with strength, this was all mental and thats why Im so fcuked off with myself, its these reps that really make a lifter and I pussied out. 

Everything else was irrelevant really as i was such a pussy on squats. So annoyed.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Box Squats: 80x5, 97.5x3, 112.5x2, 120x1, 130x11 (Predicted Max 177.5) (13 reps would have been predicted Max of 187.5)
> Snatch Grip Deadlift: 80x5, 90x3, 110x1
> Bulgarian Split Squat: 5kg x 3x11
> Ab Works
> 
> My god I cant explain how fcuking angry i am with myself. My goal was a minimum of 11 reps but I wanted more than that and I had maybe 2 or 3 more reps if not more and this is my give it 110% week. I was counting down from 12 and the first 6 were easy and after 9 my lower back and abs started to burn but the weight was going up easy and I wasnt grinding the weight at all but for some reason I got to 11 reps and on the way down I felt weak and didnt even bother trying to push up. This had nothing to do with strength, this was all mental and thats why Im so fcuked off with myself, its these reps that really make a lifter and I pussied out.
> 
> Everything else was irrelevant really as i was such a pussy on squats. So annoyed.


Dont be too hard on your self James, sometimes workouts dont go according to plan. 
*Mate: 130Kg for 11 reps, think about it, I think its awesome :devil: :thumb:*
Onward & upward mate!!!! :thumb:

From Wendlars 5/3/1 :thumb:

Having a Less than Stellar Day You're not always going to have great training days. Life is filled with distractions, and you're going to get stressed out. Combine that with a bad night's sleep or a lack of food, and you're looking at a lot of things that can potentially go wrong. The bottom line here is that you're not going to have great days all the time.

James, youve stuck with it for all this time, you will succeed mate! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday's workout

*Bench Press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1
Bench Press work set: 115X4* :thumb::thumb:

Couldn't resist, I know I said I was not going to do assistance work but I had to do some to try a wider grip  

*Bench Press: 82.5X3X10* :thumb:

Wider grip (hands in middle of first inner knurled parts of the bar, middle of hand 28" apart) didn't feel any different & the new weight went up nice :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Thoroughly enjoyed Europe's Strongest Man. Really appreciate the weight they're lifting when a couple of times some of them couldn't even break it off the floor. On the frame carry (320kg) you could see deep impressions in the soil from each foot step :doublesho

Couple of pics to liven up the thread 

420kg deadlift. Did seem rather pointless when I went home and did my lifts at a quater of that the next day 









Ed Hall at twice my bodyweight and probably half body fat









PRESS MEDLEY of 100kg Dumbell one rep, 155kg Axel two reps, 120kg Block one rep. Quickest was 24.25 seconds :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Dont be too hard on your self James, sometimes workouts dont go according to plan.
> *Mate: 130Kg for 11 reps, think about it, I think its awesome :devil: :thumb:*
> Onward & upward mate!!!! :thumb:
> 
> From Wendlars 5/3/1 :thumb:
> 
> Having a Less than Stellar Day You're not always going to have great training days. Life is filled with distractions, and you're going to get stressed out. Combine that with a bad night's sleep or a lack of food, and you're looking at a lot of things that can potentially go wrong. The bottom line here is that you're not going to have great days all the time.
> 
> James, youve stuck with it for all this time, you will succeed mate! :thumb:


Everyone has good and bad days, some days you get in the gym and you just havent got the strength to lift but I'm annoyed as this wasnt the case. I think I had the strength to get at least 2 more if not 3 maybe even 4 but I gave up mentally and thats why Im so angry with myself. This is why i progressed so well with a training partner, they just wouldnt let me quit and shouted at me to just keep going and I would have got those 3-4 extra reps.

I talked myself out of the lift from the start and need to get out of that.

Its pretty good but I got a predicted max of 177.5kg but if I got 3 more reps I would have got a predicted max of 190 which is more like it. Also it impacts on next months totall, instead of 147.5 for 9+ I will be doing 142.5 for 9+.

Oh well got Shoulder Press and Deadlift left to try and make up for the crap last night. Planning to do 50kg for 10+ and 137.5 for 11+.

Cheers for the support though Doug


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Everyone has good and bad days, some days you get in the gym and you just havent got the strength to lift but I'm annoyed as this wasnt the case. ... but I gave up mentally and thats why Im so angry with myself.


I'd like to find a good lay mans book on sports psychology because I think it's really interesting how we can convince ourselves of something and then moments later be so jacked off at the decision!

Purely out of interest, what was it that you were thinking when you stopped? Did you feel it wasn't 'right' and needed reracking, something pulled, leave something in the tank for later, 11 reps was actually pretty good, it didn't matter about the last few reps, etc?

I've found with the squat (which I despise and hate) my mental weakness is thinking it'll aggravate my back or other injury present at the time. No other lift gets to me mentally as much. :wall:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: 32.5x5, 37.5x3, 45x2, 47.5x1, 50x11 (Predicted 1RM 67.5kg)
Dips: BWx5, 107.5x3, 122.5x8
Underhand Chin Ups: 6x3

Shoulder Press went as well as I could have hoped really. Really tensing my lats on the way down.

Very pleased with Dips, an extra 17.5kg for 8 reps is pretty good and Im going really deep with these. Need to make sure I dont push them to hard though as they put a lot of stress on my bad shoulder.

Changed my grip on Chin ups from neutral to underhand grip as these are easier. Problme is they pulled my right bicep which is turn seemed to pull and cause pain in my shoulder. Will change back to nautral next week or maybe even Pull Ups.


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> I'd like to find a good lay mans book on sports psychology because I think it's really interesting how we can convince ourselves of something and then moments later be so jacked off at the decision!
> 
> Purely out of interest, what was it that you were thinking when you stopped? Did you feel it wasn't 'right' and needed reracking, something pulled, leave something in the tank for later, 11 reps was actually pretty good, it didn't matter about the last few reps, etc?
> 
> I've found with the squat (which I despise and hate) my mental weakness is thinking it'll aggravate my back or other injury present at the time. No other lift gets to me mentally as much. :wall:


I dont want to sound like a mental person but its like a have a different voice on each shoulder, one telling me to smash the weight, the other telling asking me why am I bothering and I should just give up. During the 11 reps it felt like I had an entire conversation with myself. I remember tellng myself I am not leaving the rack until i get 12 reps but the minimum I needed was 11. That minimum 11 was always in my head and things started getting really hard with 1 or 2 reps to go and when I figured out I had done 11 reps I lowered the weight and didnt even boter trying to lift the weight just lowered it on to the safeties.

I have always been a slow lifter so I have always grinded my reps out and I havent grinded any reps yet thats why I think I had at least 2-4 reps left.

11 reps is ok but the point Im so annoyed with is that I gave up. This is were a training partner is worth their weight in Gold.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I dont want to sound like a mental person but its like a have a different voice on each shoulder, one telling me to smash the weight, the other telling asking me why am I bothering and I should just give up. During the 11 reps it felt like I had an entire conversation with myself. I remember tellng myself I am not leaving the rack until i get 12 reps but the minimum I needed was 11. That minimum 11 was always in my head and things started getting really hard with 1 or 2 reps to go and when I figured out I had done 11 reps I lowered the weight and didnt even boter trying to lift the weight just lowered it on to the safeties.
> 
> I have always been a slow lifter so I have always grinded my reps out and I havent grinded any reps yet thats why I think I had at least 2-4 reps left.
> 
> 11 reps is ok but the point Im so annoyed with is that I gave up. This is were a training partner is worth their weight in Gold.


James, I wouldn't be so hard on yourself, its is common, I do it all the time on the squat & deadlift, I know I can push more than the allotted 5 reps most of the time, but I've achieved what I needed & I'm done :thumb:

You could add an extra week to your routine so next week you retry this weeks workout then carry on as normal I don't see this having any negative impact on your whole routine either.I don't think a little deviation will hurt, in fact it would probably help, you now know you can have another crack at it & this week's not so good workout will fire you up for next weeks :thumb:

One thing I have learnt over the last 8 months is not to be so hard on myself if a workout doesn't go to plan. I only managed 4 reps again this week on my 115kg bench, not overly disappointed as I still managed 4 reps, I'll keep at it until I get my 5 reps then when I do up my bench to 117.5kg it will be even more satisfying, don't forget mate the failures make the victories really sweet :thumb:

We are your training partners, this is for you mate, Love this line from Batman, why do we fall? :thumb:






Im not giving up & im damed if I'm letting you give up on yourself, hate those weights James!!! :thumb::devil:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> I dont want to sound like a mental person but its like a have a different voice on each shoulder, one telling me to smash the weight, the other telling asking me why am I bothering and I should just give up. During the 11 reps it felt like I had an entire conversation with myself.


I know exactly what you mean by a conversation. The other night I set hill sprints to be 15. By the 13th I was thinking as I walked back down '_That's enough. I've got something out of it. Two more won't really make any difference_', and then the other side would chip on '_You graet big raging pus**_'! and basically bullied and shamed myself into two more sprints. With squats it seems to be multiplied by several orders of magnitude due to the weight and time between reps.

On long runs you can't just stop 'cus you've got to get back home. Or if your losing a match you've got to play until time's up. Weightlifting presents such easy cop outs. I'm sure there's some scientific explanation for it.

On the plus side, if you can't be mental on Detailing World where can you be? There's some serious cases of OCD on here :lol:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Im not giving up & im damed if I'm letting you give up on yourself, hate those weights James!!! :thumb::devil:


There is no chance I'm giving up. Havent got my Rugby now so this is my manly thing :devil:

Getting the 11 reps keeps me on track to hit 160kg for 7 reps at the end of the program but it will hopefully be higher than this.

I received a nice little parcel from the UK today with so very nice looking shiney rings in. Very nice and I will be using these real soon for Shoulders. Cheers Buddy :thumb:



Oats said:


> I know exactly what you mean by a conversation. The other night I set hill sprints to be 15. By the 13th I was thinking as I walked back down '_That's enough. I've got something out of it. Two more won't really make any difference_', and then the other side would chip on '_You graet big raging pus**_'! and basically bullied and shamed myself into two more sprints. With squats it seems to be multiplied by several orders of magnitude due to the weight and time between reps.
> 
> On long runs you can't just stop 'cus you've got to get back home. Or if your losing a match you've got to play until time's up. Weightlifting presents such easy cop outs. I'm sure there's some scientific explanation for it.
> 
> On the plus side, if you can't be mental on Detailing World where can you be? There's some serious cases of OCD on here :lol:


This is why so many sportmen have a normal coach and also a mental coach now days as it is such a massive aspect of sport. I used to be fine as I wanted to be the strongest rugby player in my league and I had to say ahead of the guys I was training but now I just do it for fun, theres not that pressure to hit the weights so hard. My training took a massive leap when I got a serious training partner as we pushed each other hard.

Good to hear theres more than one other mental person on DW but then we do spend a great deal of time touching up our cars so all the neighbors think were mental anyway.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I know exactly what you mean by a conversation. The other night I set hill sprints to be 15. By the 13th I was thinking as I walked back down '_That's enough. I've got something out of it. Two more won't really make any difference_', and then the other side would chip on '_You graet big raging pus**_'! and basically bullied and shamed myself into two more sprints. With squats it seems to be multiplied by several orders of magnitude due to the weight and time between reps.
> 
> On long runs you can't just stop 'cus you've got to get back home. Or if your losing a match you've got to play until time's up. Weightlifting presents such easy cop outs. I'm sure there's some scientific explanation for it.
> 
> On the plus side, if you can't be mental on Detailing World where can you be? There's some serious cases of OCD on here :lol:


Mental............& proud mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I received a nice little parcel from the UK today with so very nice looking shiney rings in. Very nice and I will be using these real soon for Shoulders. Cheers Buddy :thumb:


Youre welcome mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday's workout

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat work set: 177.5X5*

Tried squatting without shoes, felt really good & weird , will continue to do so, but I'm also considering some squat shoes :thumb:

Missus said not all the reps were 100% parallel, so I'm sticking with 177.5 for a while & won't add any more weight until I get 5 full parallel reps :devil::thumb:

I think I'm getting to my squat sticking point, so now i need to really dig in :thumb:

Onward & upward!!!!:devil::devil:


----------



## Guest

Tonights workout

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Chins*
WU: [email protected]
WO: 1/2/3/4/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected], 1/2/3/[email protected], 1/2/[email protected], [email protected] (50 reps total)

Squat felt a little heavy tonight but all reps moved well. Had a pretty broken nights sleep lastnight, so that may be to blame.

Press was fairly tough. I'm expecting a stall next workout, but you never know 

It must be BareFootDay  I decided to do BareFootDeads also (without my trainers on) to effectively raise the bar height by about 25mm/1". 
My 20kg plates are 340mm/13.4", which puts the bar about 55mm/2.1" lower than with standard sized plates. I reckon my trainers have a 1" sole, so I've probably been doing deadlifts with a 3" deficit.
Anyway, deads went well today. Nearly went for all 8 reps in one go but decided to follow the ladder as planned.

Chins were tough towards the end. Determined to get a total of 50 reps. I'll keep at this weight until my endurance improves.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

177.5x5 awesome lift there mate. Its going to get harder, thats the entire reason why only a handful of people squat 200kg+ and the exact reason your aiming to become one of those ahdnful. If it was easy then everybody would be there. Its still impressive how much you have progressed in less than a year.

I think barefoot is always suggested for Deadlifts but proper Weightlifting shoes are suggested for Squats but I always squatted barefoot as well, miles cheaper this way. I think doing certain exercise barefoot is good for you as well.

50 reps is a good goal on Chins, I would love to do 10 sets of 5. I watched my mate do 10 sets of 10 reps on the widest possible grip with extra weight added. Impressive stuff.


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 1 Week 2*

Main lifts feeling really light and super setted assistance work does too. Higher reps on max reps sets not really coming along just yet; but they will eventually.

OHP - 6 this week vs 7 last week.
Deadlift -8 vs 8 - I'm stopping when the pause between reps gets too long. Hoping hill sprints will help. 
Bench - 9 vs 8
Squat - 7 vs 5

DOMS is the main theme. Pratically crippled by lunges at end of week one! Was staggering sideways down stairs, clutching at the handrail like grim death for a few days after week 1 lunges.  Really glad first lift of this week was OHP.

Hill sprints still cause pretty severe DOMs in right leg as well. Makes skipping for my warmup a 

Something unilateral like lunges for assistance is a good choice as my co-ordination and balance is really tested on the right leg.

It does seem a long time before a each lift comes round on a 9 day cycle. However, it helps fitting in the hill sprints and they're all part of it.

Next week is 1 rep's and I just know it's going to be a good week :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> *531 Cycle 1 Week 2*
> 
> Main lifts feeling really light and super setted assistance work does too. Higher reps on max reps sets not really coming along just yet; but they will eventually.
> 
> OHP - 6 this week vs 7 last week.
> Deadlift -8 vs 8 - I'm stopping when the pause between reps gets too long. Hoping hill sprints will help.
> Bench - 9 vs 8
> Squat - 7 vs 5
> 
> DOMS is the main theme. Pratically crippled by lunges at end of week one! Was staggering sideways down stairs, clutching at the handrail like grim death for a few days after week 1 lunges.  Really glad first lift of this week was OHP.
> 
> Hill sprints still cause pretty severe DOMs in right leg as well. Makes skipping for my warmup a
> 
> Something unilateral like lunges for assistance is a good choice as my co-ordination and balance is really tested on the right leg.
> 
> It does seem a long time before a each lift comes round on a 9 day cycle. However, it helps fitting in the hill sprints and they're all part of it.
> 
> Next week is 1 rep's and I just know it's going to be a good week :thumb:


Oats if this is the first time you added in HIT fitness work it will take a little away from your weights for a few weeks while your body gets used to this. I'm adding in Hill Sprints again soon so I expect to be in the same situation as you very soon, DOMs galore.

If you kept some of your reps the same or just 1 below then that means your progressing as the weight should be heavier each week. Thats the great thing about 5/3/1 and programs where you push the last set, if you miss judge the weight on the low side you just do more reps so your always pushing yourself no matter what the weight is.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Sprints: 6x10m 30 secs rest, 6x20m 60 secs rest
Deadlift: 85x5, 102.5x3, 120x2, 127.5x1, 137.5x12 (Predicted 1RM 192.5kg)
Front Squats: 80x5, 90x3, 100x1
Rotational Ab Work
Grip Work

Really enjoyed sprints, they gassed me more than I thought but I felt faster than usual so the strength must be helping.

Not a bad workout, needed 11 reps and got 12 so quite happy considering last week I only hit the minimal amount as I was ill and a month ago I was like 4 reps short og my Goal so pleased with the progress. Hamstrings felt abit tired from Sprints though. I know the predicted max is exactly that, a prediction but its a pretty good figure to look at.

Front Squats felt good, the weight is getting to a reasonable weight as well and its not hurting or bruising my shoulders at all so the skin must have toughened up now.

I quite enjoy doing Grip work, I only been doing it a few weeks but I dont even think about my grip on Deadlifts now and my Golf Clubs feel lighter.


----------



## Guest

What sort of grip work are you doing James? This is something I definitely need to work on too.

Nice work on the deads and squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> What sort of grip work are you doing James? This is something I definitely need to work on too.
> 
> Nice work on the deads and squats.


Are you using the alternate grip on your Deadlift Phil?

If not mate, believe me you will be absolutely amazed, I haven't had any grip issues since switching :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Guest

I am Doug :thumb:. 

I find somewhere around the 130kg is the change over point for me atm. 
The most I've ever pulled is 150kg, which as far as mixed grip was concerned, felt ok. Good to know that it continues to work well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I am Doug :thumb:.
> 
> I find somewhere around the 130kg is the change over point for me atm.
> The most I've ever pulled is 150kg, which as far as mixed grip was concerned, felt ok. Good to know that it continues to work well.


:thumb:

Another thing which I think helps Phil,
I train touch & go style which I think improves the grip, as you have to hold onto the weight for all 5 reps as opposed to the traditional way which allows for too rest between reps :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

3rd week of SL just finished...
SQUAT 5x5 40kg
BENCH 5x5 32.5
BARBELL ROW 5x5 40
must admit, i did bench press 1st as weight was same for squat and bb row...
after watching a mark rippetoe vid(i think ithaqua posted on another thread), when doing squats tried lifting my butt/hips first but didn't feel as much work on thighs...?
got dvd from oats this morn :thumb::thumb::thumb: so will be having a look over weekend to brush up on my form especially on deadlifts and OHP...
rgds stu
p.s. feeling so much better in myself already and mrs sftu commented yesterday that shes noticed i've a lot more get up and go over last couple o weeks and seem happier...all good...


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> 3rd week of SL just finished...
> SQUAT 5x5 40kg
> BENCH 5x5 32.5
> BARBELL ROW 5x5 40
> must admit, i did bench press 1st as weight was same for squat and bb row...
> after watching a mark rippetoe vid(i think ithaqua posted on another thread), when doing squats tried lifting my butt/hips first but didn't feel as much work on thighs...?
> got dvd from oats this morn :thumb::thumb::thumb: so will be having a look over weekend to brush up on my form especially on deadlifts and OHP...
> rgds stu
> p.s. feeling so much better in myself already and mrs sftu commented yesterday that shes noticed i've a lot more get up and go over last couple o weeks and seem happier...all good...


All good stuff mate, keep at it :thumb:

Nothing wrong with benching first, i think i changed it to my first lift within only a few weeks of doing 5X5 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays Workout

Starting everything nice & light :thumb:

*Overhead Press warm up sets: 20X5 - 22.5X5 - 30X3

Overhead Press work set: 47.5X5 *

Assistance work

*Overhead Press: 32.5X5X10

Babel Curl: 30X5X10

Close Grip Bench Press: 40X5X10*

After this workout is completed next week I'll micro load all the above exercises, I'm hoping the arm work will help with the Overhead press :thumb:


----------



## RedUntilDead

Pulled my back squatting a few weeks ago now. Any back exercises that will be good for strengthening the lower back area or should I just lay off.
Back exercise doesn't give me pain but loading up leg press or squatting does.
Booked in to see a sports injury guy who is resident at our gym but thought some of you guys might have some good ideas:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> What sort of grip work are you doing James? This is something I definitely need to work on too.
> 
> Nice work on the deads and squats.


i do a number of exercises between my ab work. The one I found that kills my forearms is this 



 go to 2:05. I thought this wouldnt do anything as your just using a balance point but if you push the bar down as fast as possible and then change direction as fast as possible for about 10 reps it kills your forearms.

I then do a number of other exercises from this article.
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online...=219670581EE9CC4C2B505D9195345294-mcd01.hydra

Touch and go deadlifts def put more stress on your grip as you never get a rest but I think normal Deadlifts are a little safer but its one of those personal preference things again, like everything really.


----------



## Bod42

RedUntilDead said:


> Pulled my back squatting a few weeks ago now. Any back exercises that will be good for strengthening the lower back area or should I just lay off.
> Back exercise doesn't give me pain but loading up leg press or squatting does.
> Booked in to see a sports injury guy who is resident at our gym but thought some of you guys might have some good ideas:thumb:


See the sports guy first to see if anything is badly wrong. There are a number of studies that show back endurance is more important for back health then overall strength. I think static back extensions are very good when you have an injury as there is zero movement throughout the spine while your doing the exercise. And you can hold them for a few mins and really work that endurance strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

RedUntilDead said:


> Pulled my back squatting a few weeks ago now. Any back exercises that will be good for strengthening the lower back area or should I just lay off.
> Back exercise doesn't give me pain but loading up leg press or squatting does.
> Booked in to see a sports injury guy who is resident at our gym but thought some of you guys might have some good ideas:thumb:


If you're passed by the specialist to train try:

Stiff leg deadlift.
Deadlift.
Good mornings.
Hanging leg or knee raise.

I start every workout with dynamic stretches to warm my whole body & especially my core before I even start my warm up with the weights, pm your email & I'll send you a great pdf (Magnificent mobility)

I would go easy on barbell rows (I always wear a belt when doing Rows) :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> If you're passed by the specialist to train try:
> 
> Stiff leg deadlift.
> Deadlift.
> Good mornings.
> Hanging leg or knee raise.
> 
> I start every workout with dynamic stretches to warm my whole body & especially my core before I even start my warm up with the weights, pm your email & I'll send you a great pdf (Magnificent mobility)
> 
> I would go easy on barbell rows (I always wear a belt when doing Rows) :thumb:


Doug, Is Magnificent mobility the one the Eric Cressey sells? Is it any good?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, Is Magnificent mobility the one the Eric Cressey sells? Is it any good?


That's the one James :thumb:

It's very good, there are loads of dynamic stretches in it, the book is set out for different experience levels too :thumb:

I have taken most of the stretches from the beginner chapter & added a few more to give me a very complete pre warm up :thumb:

Ive also got: From the usual sources 

*1. Sports Injury Management Vol. 1 (Back2Sports Team)

2. Functional Movement Screen and Exercise Progression Manual (Gray Cook, Lee Burton & Keith Fields)

3. Self-Myofascial Release Techniques (Mike Robertson)

4. Inside-Out:The Ultimate Upper Body Warm-up (Bill Hartman and Mike Robertson)

5. The Trigger Point Therapy Workbook - Your Self-Treatment Guide for Pain Relief (Clair Davies) its a scan of the book so its 106MB :doublesho:doublesho*

:thumb:


----------



## avit88

Hi guys Ive recently just started stronglift 5x5 as in ive just done my first session.

I was just wondering how often you do your 3 workouts a week? Do you do them one after the other or space them out with a rest day in between each session??


----------



## -Simon-

avit88 said:


> Hi guys Ive recently just started stronglift 5x5 as in ive just done my first session.
> 
> I was just wondering how often you do your 3 workouts a week? Do you do them one after the other or space them out with a rest day in between each session??


I would recommend Mon, Weds, Friday then take the weekend to rest and detail :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

^^^what he said...:thumb:
just started SL 5x5 myself and just finished 3rd week...tis fun...
rgds stu


----------



## avit88

-Simon- said:


> I would recommend Mon, Weds, Friday then take the weekend to rest and detail :thumb:


ok mate thanks,

Its just and im not affraid to post this up I did

squat: 20kg
bench:20kg
row: 30kg

and i found it a bit easy so I feel im wasting time taking a rest day as I dont really feel I need it!? What u lot think?

Also obv I, just starting this but i go on holiday in 3 weeks for a week. What to you reckon to that? Should I do 2 sets the week before my hol and take the holiday to rest up?


----------



## -Simon-

avit88 said:


> ok mate thanks,
> 
> Its just and im not affraid to post this up I did
> 
> squat: 20kg
> bench:20kg
> row: 30kg
> 
> and i found it a bit easy so I feel im wasting time taking a rest day as I dont really feel I need it!? What u lot think?
> 
> Also obv I, just starting this but i go on holiday in 3 weeks for a week. What to you reckon to that? Should I do 2 sets the week before my hol and take the holiday to rest up?


Don't worry too much about the weight at first, just take your time and get the form spot on...re the holiday I always tried to find a gym where I went made life more interesting and you won't have to do the catch up when you get home....


----------



## avit88

The hotel has a gym I just doubt it has a bar and changeable weights! Im a cardio king at the min so il still do my cardio..

Is ok to skip a week then?


----------



## -Simon-

I would use what is there, or google gyms in the area...

Of course a week off is ok but if you've just started your programme not really ideal...

Use what you can and keep your hand in.


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> Hi guys Ive recently just started stronglift 5x5 as in ive just done my first session.
> 
> I was just wondering how often you do your 3 workouts a week? Do you do them one after the other or space them out with a rest day in between each session??


Welcome to the thread mate :thumb:

As Simon says Mon - Wed - Fri :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> ok mate thanks,
> 
> Its just and im not affraid to post this up I did
> 
> squat: 20kg
> bench:20kg
> row: 30kg
> 
> and i found it a bit easy so I feel im wasting time taking a rest day as I dont really feel I need it!? What u lot think?
> 
> Also obv I, just starting this but i go on holiday in 3 weeks for a week. What to you reckon to that? Should I do 2 sets the week before my hol and take the holiday to rest up?


At this stage mate, what you lift isn't important it's HOW you lift, learn proper technique & keep on re-evaluating it as the weights get heavier :thumb:
You will find you will have a tendency to loosen your form as the lifts gets harder, I did a few weeks ago & made a right pigs ass of my Bench press


----------



## avit88

cheers mate, yeh im keeping things steady to keep good form. 

even after todays workout i have to say my back muscles def felt tired

its also fun! i really think this will make me much stronger!


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> cheers mate, yeh im keeping things steady to keep good form.
> 
> even after todays workout i have to say my back muscles def felt tired
> 
> its also fun! i really think this will make me much stronger!


Stick with it mate, It will defo make you stronger :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Took a day off & didn't do my deadlift session today & decided to evaluate my progress & structure of my lifting plans :thumb:

1. I estimate *if* my progress on the Deadlift doesn't stall that I will have reached my goal of 200kg for 5 reps in 7 weeks :doublesho Wish me luck :thumb:

2. I'll then focus on the squat & aim for 5X200kg by this December if possible 

3. My Bench is going well, but i will stay with aiming for 150kg by December 2013 & continue to train as I am now.

4. If everything above goes to plan: As each lift moves into it predetermined goal weight I'll then put the lift into a maintenance mode I.E Train the lift heavy as I am now but every other week (twice a month instead of four). On the non-heavy weeks I'll just do the assistance routine as I'm now, but keep aiming to increase the weight with 5 sets of 10 reps :thumb:

As of tomorrow I'm on the lower carb diet to reduce my body fat & hopefully my punch bag will be here soon so i can do my Muay Thai drills 2 X week for my conditioning/cardio. I would like to aim for 15% body fat & maintain it at that level.

I really have no idea what my lifting potential is so the above may actually be beyond the time frames I hope for. But I think it is good to structure your approach to keep one focused on the challenges we set ourselves :thumb:


----------



## avit88

Hello again just a quick question.

As i have to increase my weight every session/week by 2.5 what should i do if my gym doesnt have 1.25kg weights?


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> Hello again just a quick question.
> 
> As i have to increase my weight every session/week by 2.5 what should i do if my gym doesnt have 1.25kg weights?


You will have to find some way of adding 2.5kg to the bar, some good gyms have chains.

Worst case, you will have to buy your own disks & take to the gym, make sure the owners know, you don't want to be accused of stealing your own weights


----------



## avit88

ok thanks,

as im going on holiday soon does anyone know of a good fitness book to read thats actually decent?


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> ok thanks,
> 
> as im going on holiday soon does anyone know of a good fitness book to read thats actually decent?


Sorry, ive only got the usual powerlifting pdf's.


----------



## Bod42

avit88 said:


> ok thanks,
> 
> as im going on holiday soon does anyone know of a good fitness book to read thats actually decent?


Welcome to the thread. :thumb:

If your after a hard copy, Starting Strength by Mark Rippletoe is always a winner.

As said dont worry about your weights at the moment, your putting on 30kg a month on Squats so they will soon go up. As said concentrate on technique especially Squat depth as this has to be the biggest mistake you see from people who just start squatting, they feel like they are hitting depth but its really a half squat. Use the lighter weights to practise this.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> As of tomorrow I'm on the lower carb diet to reduce my body fat & hopefully my punch bag will be here soon so i can do my Muay Thai drills 2 X week for my conditioning/cardio. I would like to aim for 15% body fat & maintain it at that level.


This is exactly what I will be doing in 2 months Doug but instead of Low Carb all the time I will be doing as per Shelby Starnes and doing Low Carb on my off/cardio days, Medium Carbs on training days and High Carb on my hardest workout of the week, more than likely my Squat Day. This way I should loose weight but keep enough carbs in me to keep the muscle and strength aspect of my training improving. Also on Med/High carb days try and have the majority of your carbs after you workout even if its in the evening.


----------



## Phil_b88

Wow this is a long thread! 

I'm hoping to join in, i've been out of the gym a good 2 years, moving in with the girlfriend and enjoying eating what i want and not liking my local gym (mosside leisure centre ) has not helped me over this time!

I'm now back home got a 9-5 job and ready to get back into the 5x5 routine. I only weigh 10.5st but last time I did 5x5 i put on half a stone in no time! I'm going to stick at it this time and this thread will hopefully keep me motivated! 

Not going to jump straight into 5x5 as I feel its a real killer, going to do a normal split routine then go back to the pull, push legs when my muscles are used to actually working.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Phil_b88 said:


> Wow this is a long thread!
> 
> I'm hoping to join in, i've been out of the gym a good 2 years, moving in with the girlfriend and enjoying eating what i want and not liking my local gym (mosside leisure centre ) has not helped me over this time!
> 
> I'm now back home got a 9-5 job and ready to get back into the 5x5 routine. I only weigh 10.5st but last time I did 5x5 i put on half a stone in no time! I'm going to stick at it this time and this thread will hopefully keep me motivated!
> 
> Not going to jump straight into 5x5 as I feel its a real killer, going to do a normal split routine then go back to the pull, push legs when my muscles are used to actually working.


Welcome Phil.

Its long thread all right :lol:

But you'll find there is so much info & links, that this thread is probably one of the only resources you'll need :thumb:


----------



## Phil_b88

ITHAQVA said:


> Welcome Phil.
> 
> Its long thread all right :lol:
> 
> But you'll find there is so much info & links, that this thread is probably one of the only resources you'll need :thumb:


Cheers ITHAQVA :thumb:

I had best get reading!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> This is exactly what I will be doing in 2 months Doug but instead of Low Carb all the time I will be doing as per Shelby Starnes and doing Low Carb on my off/cardio days, Medium Carbs on training days and High Carb on my hardest workout of the week, more than likely my Squat Day. This way I should loose weight but keep enough carbs in me to keep the muscle and strength aspect of my training improving. Also on Med/High carb days try and have the majority of your carbs after you workout even if its in the evening.


Sorry James,

I didnt post right 

On my Powerlifting days I will have starchy carbs after my workout (Brown pasta/Rice or potatoes with my meal) :thumb:

On off days I will use green veg/salad for my carb intake :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Phil_b88 said:


> Cheers ITHAQVA :thumb:
> 
> I had best get reading!


Glad to be of help mate, this thread is really good :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> This is exactly what I will be doing in 2 months Doug but instead of Low Carb all the time I will be doing as per Shelby Starnes and doing Low Carb on my off/cardio days, Medium Carbs on training days and High Carb on my hardest workout of the week, more than likely my Squat Day. This way I should loose weight but keep enough carbs in me to keep the muscle and strength aspect of my training improving. Also on Med/High carb days try and have the majority of your carbs after you workout even if its in the evening.


I'll be doing very similar once my newbie gains have run out. 
Looking at cycling my carb/fat ratios (as well as calories) depending upon workout days. I'm also intending to switch to a reverse pyramid based program, which is apparently easier on the cns when on a cut, than say madcow/texas method.

I'm already getting close to the point where I might drop the squats on DL day. Getting a little hard to recover completely for the following session after doing both in one workout.


----------



## Guest

Phil_b88 said:


> Not going to jump straight into 5x5 as I feel its a real killer, going to do a normal split routine then go back to the pull, push legs when my muscles are used to actually working.


Welcome to the thread. Personally, I jump straight into 5x5, but just start out light. You'll acclimatise after a couple of weeks and be ramping up the weights in no time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Looks like we are all evolving the same here guys :thumb:

I'm in two minds to lower my Squat goal to 190Kg. I’m not going to compete. I’m sure you guys agree my progress has been really good for my age (even I can see that now)  And what the heck, if I maintain dead lifting 200kg, squatting 190kg & benching 115 -150kg & still incorporate a bodybuilding style routine with some conditioning, do I really need to push for more weight? I don’t think so. 

As far as I can see I’m almost were I want to be strength wise, I’m going to push for my deadlift 5X200kg in 7 weeks, put it in maintenance mode & do the same for the squat then bench press. Once maintaining the strength on my heavy 1X5’s I will keep pushing to increase the weight for my 10 rep assistance work :thumb:

It is funny how we are all doing different routines but have the same goals, strength, fitness, some muscle mass & a nice lower degree of body fat :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Welcome to the thread. Personally, I jump straight into 5x5, but just start out light. You'll acclimatise after a couple of weeks and be ramping up the weights in no time :thumb:


+1 :thumb:

The 5X5 starts with an empty bar go for it mate, i did, then moved onto the workout im on now, "The ITHAQVA method" ©


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Looks like we are all evolving the same here guys :thumb:


There's a great post on Starting Strength by the guy who runs the programming board. I think it makes the reasoning behind Starting Strength \ SL very clear and why as linear progression ceased I've returned to sprints. Think it'd also clear up alot of the misconceptions on other threads about strength vs losing fat vs 'fitness':

_Look....here is what people fail to understand about this balance between strength and conditioning......building peak strength takes about 20 years of dedicated work and planning. Building peak conditioning takes about 8-12 weeks of dedicated work......usually less if you are at least somewhat in shape when you start to try and peak.

In our hypothetical 20 year quest to build peak strength, we have this window at the beginning of our training where we are capable of experiencing "The Novice Effect." In other words, at no other time in our training careers are we capable of building strength and mass at this ridiculously rapid rate.

So for us as strength coaches who have witnessed this effect, we don't want to do anything to derail these gains or impede the potential for growth and strength. So, at this time in a person's training career we will SACRIFICE cardiovascular conditioning for strength. We do this, not because cardio is unimportant, but because we know WE CAN GET OUR CARDIO BACK IN A MATTER OF WEEKS!!!!

Once someone has ran the course on a basic linear progression there is no reason they cannot begin a program that strikes more balance between the two attributes. As long as the conditioning is phased in intelligently, you will be able to hang on to those hard earned strength gains while getting yourself in better condition._

[...]

_Keep in mind that you CAN keep your body fat in check and keep your energy levels steady with a clean diet....it just needs to be high calorie. There is no law saying that on SS you have to stuff your face with donuts and pizza in order to recover.

I would start with something like:

1) Whole Eggs, Large Bowl Oatmeal, Fruit
2) Large Grilled Salmon Filet, 1 Large Sweet Potato or Rice
3) Steak, Sweet Potato

In between meals I would have my 1/2 gallon to 1 gallon of Milk spread out throughout the day, or if you are an older guy who puts fat on easier, you might opt for a protein shake with a piece of fruit between meals. Either way....the eating can be healthy and still put you into caloric excess. _


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Looks like we are all evolving the same here guys :thumb:
> 
> I'm in two minds to lower my Squat goal to 190Kg. I'm not going to compete. I'm sure you guys agree my progress has been really good for my age (even I can see that now)  And what the heck, if I maintain dead lifting 200kg, squatting 190kg & benching 115 -150kg & still incorporate a bodybuilding style routine with some conditioning, do I really need to push for more weight? I don't think so.
> 
> As far as I can see I'm almost were I want to be strength wise, I'm going to push for my deadlift 5X200kg in 7 weeks, put it in maintenance mode & do the same for the squat then bench press. Once maintaining the strength on my heavy 1X5's I will keep pushing to increase the weight for my 10 rep assistance work :thumb:
> 
> It is funny how we are all doing different routines but have the same goals, strength, fitness, some muscle mass & a nice lower degree of body fat :thumb:


Why would you lower your goals when your making great progress . I would always say make your goals slightly on the high side as it gives you something to aim for. I remember wanting to bench 120kg, as soon as I got there I gave it zero attention whereas now my goal is stupidly high I will keep pushing the exercise hard. Your progressing has been amazing but why suddenly lower a goal you had since the start if you get me, 190kg is a great lift but I bet that extra 10kg will always be in the back of your mind and everyone wants to be part of the 200kg squat club :devil::thumb: This thinking didnt get you where you are today, smash those weights.

If your changing to 5/3/1 or something similar during your low carb (a lot of people say they retain strength with 5/3/1 while dieting) then you can pick and choose your battles, this is the great thing about 5/3/1.

Welcome to the thread Phill. I would have to agree with everyone else on here that you start the 5x5 program straight away. The 5x5 program is superior to a split program for beginners so why start with a lesser program. I would start light, lighter than you think and progress from there. Even if you start with just the bar, after just 12 weeks you should be doing 110kg for 5x5 which is an inpressive lift.

If your 10.5 stone I would do the GOMAD diet as well when the weights start to get hard.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Why would you lower your goals when your making great progress . I would always say make your goals slightly on the high side as it gives you something to aim for. I remember wanting to bench 120kg, as soon as I got there I gave it zero attention whereas now my goal is stupidly high I will keep pushing the exercise hard. Your progressing has been amazing but why suddenly lower a goal you had since the start if you get me, 190kg is a great lift but I bet that extra 10kg will always be in the back of your mind and everyone wants to be part of the 200kg squat club :devil::thumb: This thinking didnt get you where you are today, smash those weights.
> 
> If your changing to 5/3/1 or something similar during your low carb (a lot of people say they retain strength with 5/3/1 while dieting) then you can pick and choose your battles, this is the great thing about 5/3/1.
> 
> Welcome to the thread Phill. I would have to agree with everyone else on here that you start the 5x5 program straight away. The 5x5 program is superior to a split program for beginners so why start with a lesser program. I would start light, lighter than you think and progress from there. Even if you start with just the bar, after just 12 weeks you should be doing 110kg for 5x5 which is an inpressive lift.
> 
> If your 10.5 stone I would do the GOMAD diet as well when the weights start to get hard.


200Kg it is mate 

I suppose im so close to my goals now that i dont want to rush to get them & keep enjoying the journey :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Excelent!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

Tuesday's workout

*Bench Press warm up sets: 40X3X3 - 60X3 - 80X2 - 100X1

Bench Press Work set: 115X5 wooohoooo!!!!!* :devil::devil: :thumb:

BBB Assistance work

*Bench press (wider 28" grip) 82.5X5X10 :devil:

Barbell Row: 70X5X10* :devil:

What can I say, YESSSSSSS, totally awesome workout, felt that strong on the bench press I think I could have done 6 reps & probably tried the 7th!!!! Really strange thing the body.

The assistance sets also felt that good as I executed them that I felt very confident in completing all the 10 sets with 10 reps, I did.

My main concern is recovery, should I be continuing to add 2.5Kg to all my assistance work all the time? I'm tempted to stay on the weights above for a week or so.

I've stopped taking most of my supplements (Protein & Creatine) for a month now & seen absolutely no difference in my progress :thumb:

The only supplements I'm now taking now are for joint care: Cod liver oil -1146mg X 1 a day & Glucosamine HCL/chondroitin - 500mg/400mg X 3 a day :thumb:

Next week's bench 117.5kg :doublesho :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Why would you lower your goals when your making great progress .


Agree with Bod42. :thumb: Is it an issue of 200kg being a massive mental hurdle? Where's Sidewalkdances nower days? We need to wheel him out to get into perspective what heavy really is!! 200kg is a warmup :lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Agree with Bod42. :thumb: Is it an issue of 200kg being a massive mental hurdle? Where's Sidewalkdances nower days? We need to wheel him out to get into perspective what heavy really is!! 200kg is a warmup :lol::lol:


No worries, im over it already  

The only thing I might do is reduce my heavy session to twice a week as soon as I feel my recovery is suffering from weekly heavy lifting, but I'm still going to keep to my original plan :thumb:

Deadlift & Squat - 200KgX5
Bench Press - 150KgX1

And now im back on the Overhead Press, i'll have to work out a goal for that too, so ive actually added to my list of goals 

:thumb:

Punch bag should be here soon, looking forward to some good conditioning  *FIGHT..................FINISH HIM!!!!!!!!! EXCELLENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *:devil::devil:


----------



## Guest

Tonights workout

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WU: [email protected]
WO: None

Squat went well tonight. Felt a little heavy after almost a week away from the weights. The workout sets got easier as I progressed through them.

Bench was a little tough, my LH shoulder started to twing a bit but by the time I reached the workout sets it was ok. Last rep of each set was tricky.

Form on the row is starting to drop. Got all the reps ok, but I'm now starting to lift my body noticably on the last 3 reps of each set. I might repeat this weight next time.

Dips were a wipe out. My LH shoulder did not want to know. I'll try and do these again tomorrow after a rest.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> 200Kg it is mate
> 
> I suppose im so close to my goals now that i dont want to rush to get them & keep enjoying the journey :thumb:


Wasnt busting your balls buddy, just not letting you quit.

Anyone in this forum could have said my goal is a 200kg squat and when they get to 100kg or 150kg or what ever kg they could redo their goals and set an easier goal. If you had done this you would have never made the progress you have to date.

Here's some motivation:









Monday Deload Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x5
Pendlay Rows: 60x3x5
Dips: BW x 12, 12, 8

This is a low weight for me but things just didnt feel right. I am considering upping my workouts to 4 days per week so I'm benching once every 7 days instead of every 9. Not a lot of difference but when I bench it just feels like I havent benched in ages. Maybe its more that I havent benched heavy in ages as I been doing higher reps. Trouble with 4 days is it can effect your recovery.

Rows were heavier than I'm supposed to do on a deload week but still easy.

Dips felt good. Its so nice having dip bars at home as it means I can keep them in all my programs. I think these are one of the best exercises for Chest and Triceps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wasnt busting your balls buddy, just not letting you quit.
> 
> Anyone in this forum could have said my goal is a 200kg squat and when they get to 100kg or 150kg or what ever kg they could redo their goals and set an easier goal. If you had done this you would have never made the progress you have to date.
> 
> Here's some motivation:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Monday Deload Workout:
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x5
> Pendlay Rows: 60x3x5
> Dips: BW x 12, 12, 8
> 
> This is a low weight for me but things just didnt feel right. I am considering upping my workouts to 4 days per week so I'm benching once every 7 days instead of every 9. Not a lot of difference but when I bench it just feels like I havent benched in ages. Maybe its more that I havent benched heavy in ages as I been doing higher reps. Trouble with 4 days is it can effect your recovery.
> 
> Rows were heavier than I'm supposed to do on a deload week but still easy.
> 
> Dips felt good. Its so nice having dip bars at home as it means I can keep them in all my programs. I think these are one of the best exercises for Chest and Triceps.


You were busting my balls James :thumb:. And rightly so :thumb: You are one of my virtual training partners, thanks mate, I owe you one :thumb:

I've got 235Kg in weights, it would be a shame not to have them all on the bar one day :devil::devil: :thumb:
Besides which last night bench session proved I can lift heavy weights & improve if I stick at it. it's taken me 5 weeks to get those 5 reps & I'm very happy with that, I mean every 5 weeks & an extra 2.5kg that's an approximate gain of 26kg in 12 months on the bench!

As for the chick, id give her some deep squat thrusts :devil: :argie::argie:

Feel the burn baby!!! 

*On your bench James, I make sure that every warm up set is lifted as per the heavy technique, that way when you get to your work set it feels familiar, I'm finding its helping greatly for my bench press. I followed dave tates videos & it really works mate *

:thumb::thumb: Thanx James :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Tonights workout
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Row*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Dips*
> WU: [email protected]
> WO: None
> 
> Squat went well tonight. Felt a little heavy after almost a week away from the weights. The workout sets got easier as I progressed through them.
> 
> Bench was a little tough, my LH shoulder started to twing a bit but by the time I reached the workout sets it was ok. Last rep of each set was tricky.
> 
> Form on the row is starting to drop. Got all the reps ok, but I'm now starting to lift my body noticably on the last 3 reps of each set. I might repeat this weight next time.
> 
> Dips were a wipe out. My LH shoulder did not want to know. I'll try and do these again tomorrow after a rest.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


You pushing some nice iron now Phil :devil: :thumb:

Careful with the shouldes mate, the buggers take ages to heal :thumb:

Have you tried a closer grip on your main heavy bench work set? (I use a 20" grip) :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wednesday's workout

*Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Squat work set: 177.5X3*  :thumb:

Squat looks like a fail, but WAIT!  That was 3X below parallel reps, after the 3rd I just wanted to stop due to the high humidity, I was soaking in sweat during my warm up sets & had to cover my back with chalk :doublesho

Can't believe how strong I felt & how surprisingly easy the reps were, I'm a little annoyed I gave in after 3 reps, but it was just so humid. * I'm also using my new squat platform & squatting bare foot.*With all the changes I'm very happy with 3 full motion reps :thumb::thumb: next week all going well I will aim for 5 full reps below parallel & then move onto 180Kg's!

The platform & bare foot is much better, much more stable! i'll post a pic later on (Just two pieces of plywood :thumb

:devil: Its so hot today :devil: But no bloody sunshine lol


----------



## sfstu

tonights SL workout...

*bench press 35kg 5x5
squat 45kg 5x5
barbell rows 42.5kg 5x5*

exercises starting to feel better now the weights starting to get get heavier...i'm doing a couple of warmup sets for each but love how the 3rd,4th,5th sets of workout feel better than the 1st or 2nd..? been doing the hip raise on squats since watching some of the SS vid that oats lent me,didn't make sense before but as the weight increases it does now..!
need to study up on barbell rows next...i'm bracing my belly against tops of my legs i think as i lift..? not sure thats right...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> tonights SL workout...
> 
> *bench press 35kg 5x5
> squat 45kg 5x5
> barbell rows 42.5kg 5x5*
> 
> exercises starting to feel better now the weights starting to get get heavier...i'm doing a couple of warmup sets for each but love how the 3rd,4th,5th sets of workout feel better than the 1st or 2nd..? been doing the hip raise on squats since watching some of the SS vid that oats lent me,didn't make sense before but as the weight increases it does now..!
> need to study up on barbell rows next...i'm bracing my belly against tops of my legs i think as i lift..? not sure thats right...
> rgds stu


There are loads of different ways to do a barbel row, but always make sure you keep form good Stu :thumb:

I wear a belt when barbell rowing :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

think i'm doing that more to protect my lower back maybe...?


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> You pushing some nice iron now Phil :devil: :thumb:
> 
> Careful with the shouldes mate, the buggers take ages to heal :thumb:
> 
> Have you tried a closer grip on your main heavy bench work set? (I use a 20" grip) :thumb:


Thanks Doug, steadily getting there 
I think my grip on the bench is probably pretty close already, not sure of the exact distance but my hands are just over shoulder width apart - I grip the bar so my hands just meet the smooth part of the bar (I hope that makes sense). I've tried it slightly wider, mid way between the ring and the smooth section but it didn't feel too different so I returned to my narrower grip.



ITHAQVA said:


> Wednesday's workout
> 
> *Squat warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> Squat work set: 177.5X3*  :thumb:
> 
> The platform & bare foot is much better, much more stable! i'll post a pic later on (Just two pieces of plywood :thumb
> 
> :devil: Its so hot today :devil: But no bloody sunshine lol


Top lifting mate :thumb:

Good idea on the plywood - got to be much more stable than carpet.



sfstu said:


> tonights SL workout...
> 
> *bench press 35kg 5x5
> squat 45kg 5x5
> barbell rows 42.5kg 5x5*
> 
> rgds stu


Good progress Stu. I think the work sets getting easier is just your body getting used to pushing that weight. Happened to me the other night too. Makes the workout even more satisfying!


----------



## Christianmp

Having had some time off from the gym I was really excited to see that I haven't lost significant strength:

Bench press 70x5x5
Dead: 60x10 60x5 90x5 90x5 110x3 120x3 120x2
was aiming for 120x5 but just couldn't do it. Going to stick with 120kg until I can do 5 reps with good form.

Pendlay row 60x5x5.

Squats however needs some work. My max so far has been 95kg, but right now I'm down at 80-85kg. I need to stop fearing the squat and just hate the iron. Goal is 100x5x5 by the end of summer.

Oh, and dips, I could acutally do dips. 3x8reps with good form and it wasn't that hard. I guess the push-up challenge I did last week has something to do with it. 2000 push-ups in 7 days. Fun stuff.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Having had some time off from the gym I was really excited to see that I haven't lost significant strength:
> 
> Bench press 70x5x5
> Dead: 60x10 60x5 90x5 90x5 110x3 120x3 120x2
> was aiming for 120x5 but just couldn't do it. Going to stick with 120kg until I can do 5 reps with good form.
> 
> Pendlay row 60x5x5.
> 
> Squats however needs some work. My max so far has been 95kg, but right now I'm down at 80-85kg. I need to stop fearing the squat and just hate the iron. Goal is 100x5x5 by the end of summer.
> 
> Oh, and dips, I could acutally do dips. 3x8reps with good form and it wasn't that hard. I guess the push-up challenge I did last week has something to do with it. 2000 push-ups in 7 days. Fun stuff.


 Nice one Christian :thumb:

I think the 100kg 5X5 will be yours in no time mate :devil:

Your deadlift: I think your using too many reps & sets on the warm up. Not sure I understand how you have structure your lifting, 60x10 60x5 90x5 90x5 110x3 *120x3 120x2 *am I right In assuming the last two in bold are you actual work sets & the rest are warm up sets, if so I would try the Christian:

Dynamic stretches before the workout to warm up your core, then the workout.

Warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 90X3 - 100X2 - 110X1

Work sets: 120X? - 120X? (I would reduce to one work set)

Take at least 6 minutes rest between the last warm up set & the first work set, personally I would only do one work set as recommended by SL :thumb:


----------



## sidewalkdances

Hi all!

I'm still alive, still training. Just been ill and had an absolute ton of personal problems getting in the way, so I havent had much time to sit at the laptop!

Hope everyone is progressing nicely. Made my way through the toughest (on paper) bench session of my training cycle yesterday with no hiccups. So very pleased with that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sidewalkdances said:


> Hi all!
> 
> I'm still alive, still training. Just been ill and had an absolute ton of personal problems getting in the way, so I havent had much time to sit at the laptop!
> 
> Hope everyone is progressing nicely. Made my way through the toughest (on paper) bench session of my training cycle yesterday with no hiccups. So very pleased with that.


Bout time you posted Dan 

Glad everything is ok mate :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Christianmp said:


> Having had some time off from the gym I was really excited to see that I haven't lost significant strength:
> 
> Bench press 70x5x5
> Dead: 60x10 60x5 90x5 90x5 110x3 120x3 120x2
> was aiming for 120x5 but just couldn't do it. Going to stick with 120kg until I can do 5 reps with good form.
> 
> Pendlay row 60x5x5.
> 
> Squats however needs some work. My max so far has been 95kg, but right now I'm down at 80-85kg. I need to stop fearing the squat and just hate the iron. Goal is 100x5x5 by the end of summer.
> 
> Oh, and dips, I could acutally do dips. 3x8reps with good form and it wasn't that hard. I guess the push-up challenge I did last week has something to do with it. 2000 push-ups in 7 days. Fun stuff.


Good workout Christian.

I wonder if 100kg is a bit of a psychological barrier? I had issues around 100kg too. Not sure if it was breaking into 3 numbers or because it was just over my bodyweight that was causing the problem. It took me about three attempts to get past 100kg. I'd work my way up to around 95kg or so and then take a few weeks off. On returning, I'd deload and start the process all over again.

One thing I find that helps me is to do a 1RM session every so often. When you know you can lift a weight for 1 rep, you can put a goal in your mind to do it for 5 reps. Because you know you can already lift that weight, you don't fear it any more.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Christianmp

I too think it is a mental barrier I need to break through. And my 95kg workout wasn't planned I just decided to put on some extra and see if I could lift it.
Its going to happen I know. I should just stop overthinking it and lift.


Regarding the deadlifts I will try ITHAQVA's method with only few warmups and extra rest. Was aiming for the single 1x5, but could do it, so broke it into 1x3 and 1x2 reps.

As my mate simply pointed out: "It's only iron".


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I too think it is a mental barrier I need to break through. And my 95kg workout wasn't planned I just decided to put on some extra and see if I could lift it.
> Its going to happen I know. I should just stop overthinking it and lift.
> 
> Regarding the deadlifts I will try ITHAQVA's method with only few warmups and extra rest. Was aiming for the single 1x5, but could do it, so broke it into 1x3 and 1x2 reps.
> 
> As my mate simply pointed out: "It's only iron".


Please make sure you do around 8-10 minutes dynamic stretches before the warm ups Christian.

The deadlift hits the core very hard so a pre warm up will set you up for it, but as your doing less volume you will maintain your peak strength/power for the work set :devil:


----------



## sfstu

well, sitting here slurping my chocmint protein shake and noticed am 1st to post today... so heres fridays workout...

*squat 47.5kg 5x5
OHP 32.5kg 5x5
deadlift 60kg 2x5 (i know it should be only 1 set but couldn't resist an extra set)*

thoughts...
end of 4th week and pleased with 5x5 so far...:thumb:like its simplicity and ease and definatly getting stronger and although i was dubious about lightness of starting weights can see now its definately the way to go for a newbie or someone coming back to weights after a long lay off...

getting a little disillusioned/fed up with lack of weight/fat loss tho... weigh exactly the same as a month ago and don't think the fatloss has really happened yet either going by the feel of my work trousers...? 
i know that muscle is heavier then fat but would have thought i'd have felt some reduction in fit of clothes by now...on top of 5x5 3 times a week have been making a concious effort to get out once if not twice a day walking the dog and my diet,although not perfect, is 100% better than it was a month ago but no change in the waist area for example..?

i know rome wasn't built in a day but was hoping i'd have lost some weight after a month in...
with a little more focus/understanding now, my goals are still basically the same as before...lose weight (a couple o stone ideally!), build muscle (mainly upper body) and improve strength/fitness and health...
don't know yet how long it'll take but would like by end of year to be benching 100kgs,squat and deadlift 150kgs...? think its possible and definately have the urge/want to carry on, just want to reduce my waistline a little quicker...!
rgds stu


----------



## jamest

Ignore your weight. Just keep doing what you are doing and continue working on your diet.

People have an obsession with numbers especially weight but the changes that some people go through and small and take a long time. If you stay focused on numbers which aren't changing much you are going to get upset and get out of your rhythm which will be destruction to your goals.

I have been doing weights for just over 3 months now and haven't taken any notice towards any aesthetic differences from my workouts nor my weight. I know I am stronger and if I carry on there are going to be changes however slow they are. If you are wanting to lose weight and make large gains in strength you are going to have a hard task getting your diet right.

Not doing 5x5, SL or SS doing my own thing with the owner of the gym who has his own experience to impart.

But I have gone from 40kg squat to 100kg (hit it yesterday, took a while for me to actually get that second plate on, always got stuck on 90). Bench press I have just from struggling to do the bar to 60kg. Deadlifts/OHP etc aren't part of my workout.


----------



## sfstu

hi james, know what you mean about obsessing with no.s, _ideally_ i'd like to lose a stone or 2 but its more the fit of my clothes, and the content of said clothes..! strength,fitness and health is priority but also wanting to look better and consequently feel better too...:thumb:
know it's gonna be a long process and will be a gradual thing to gain muscle and lose fat but i just really had expected to see some sort of change on the scales or more specifically the tightness of my work trousers  especially as i'm about 200% more active than i was a month ago and my diet is much better than it was...!
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> well, sitting here slurping my chocmint protein shake and noticed am 1st to post today... so heres fridays workout...
> 
> *squat 47.5kg 5x5
> OHP 32.5kg 5x5
> deadlift 60kg 2x5 (i know it should be only 1 set but couldn't resist an extra set)*
> 
> thoughts...
> end of 4th week and pleased with 5x5 so far...:thumb:like its simplicity and ease and definatly getting stronger and although i was dubious about lightness of starting weights can see now its definately the way to go for a newbie or someone coming back to weights after a long lay off...
> 
> getting a little disillusioned/fed up with lack of weight/fat loss tho... weigh exactly the same as a month ago and don't think the fatloss has really happened yet either going by the feel of my work trousers...?
> i know that muscle is heavier then fat but would have thought i'd have felt some reduction in fit of clothes by now...on top of 5x5 3 times a week have been making a concious effort to get out once if not twice a day walking the dog and my diet,although not perfect, is 100% better than it was a month ago but no change in the waist area for example..?
> 
> i know rome wasn't built in a day but was hoping i'd have lost some weight after a month in...
> with a little more focus/understanding now, my goals are still basically the same as before...lose weight (a couple o stone ideally!), build muscle (mainly upper body) and improve strength/fitness and health...
> don't know yet how long it'll take but would like by end of year to be benching 100kgs,squat and deadlift 150kgs...? think its possible and definately have the urge/want to carry on, just want to reduce my waistline a little quicker...!
> rgds stu


You're doing well Stu,

Weight loss may not show up as you could be losing fat & gaining muscle at the same pace.

I haven't changed my body fat % in 8 months, but that's because I have concentrated on adding bulk to keep my energy up for the heavy stuff, I'm only now on reduced carbs to help with fat loss. One thing at a time mate, keep it simple.

Getting strong takes time.
Getting to a good level of fitness can be done in around 3 months.
Fat loss (give your self 12 months to lose around 10-15% body fat)
To maintain the above, takes a change in your lifestyle forever. There is no quick fix.

Your weight goals are achievable :thumb:; believe in yourself & in 8-12 months you'll be bashing out some serous iron! :devil: :thumb:

Enjoy the journey Stu, there is no rush mate.


----------



## ITHAQVA

jamest said:


> Ignore your weight. Just keep doing what you are doing and continue working on your diet.
> 
> People have an obsession with numbers especially weight but the changes that some people go through and small and take a long time. If you stay focused on numbers which aren't changing much you are going to get upset and get out of your rhythm which will be destruction to your goals.
> 
> I have been doing weights for just over 3 months now and haven't taken any notice towards any aesthetic differences from my workouts nor my weight. I know I am stronger and if I carry on there are going to be changes however slow they are. If you are wanting to lose weight and make large gains in strength you are going to have a hard task getting your diet right.
> 
> Not doing 5x5, SL or SS doing my own thing with the owner of the gym who has his own experience to impart.
> 
> But I have gone from 40kg squat to 100kg (hit it yesterday, took a while for me to actually get that second plate on, always got stuck on 90). Bench press I have just from struggling to do the bar to 60kg. Deadlifts/OHP etc aren't part of my workout.


May i ask why Deadlifts & the overhead press are not a part of your workout James?

Good gains by the way, keep at it mate & enjoy! :thumb:


----------



## jamest

sfstu said:


> hi james, know what you mean about obsessing with no.s, _ideally_ i'd like to lose a stone or 2 but its more the fit of my clothes, and the content of said clothes..! strength,fitness and health is priority but also wanting to look better and consequently feel better too...:thumb:
> know it's gonna be a long process and will be a gradual thing to gain muscle and lose fat but i just really had expected to see some sort of change on the scales or more specifically the tightness of my work trousers  especially as i'm about 200% more active than i was a month ago and my diet is much better than it was...!
> rgds stu


Forget the 2 stone number, it means nothing, especially as you said yourself that you know muscle weighs more than fat. Are you saying that you want to lose 3 stone of fat and gain a stone of muscle? It's just silly thinking about those numbers. The numbers to concentrate on are your calories in and out and your macros.

Also take in to account that everyone's body is different. There was a panorama show a while ago on fitness which showed that some people are great at getting benefits out of exercise where as others get pretty much no benefit.

I'm skinny and have been doing weights for 3 months but I don't think I look any different and my clothes are pretty much the same fit. I have seen others getting huge gains in 3 weeks let alone 3 months. I realise I am probably one of the people on the low end of the benefits from the panorama program.

Just remember not to get down just because your trousers aren't looser. Keep it up and it will happen, it just might take longer for people like us to see any significant changes.


----------



## jamest

ITHAQVA said:


> May i ask why Deadlifts & the overhead press are not a part of your workout James?
> 
> Good gains by the way, keep at it mate & enjoy! :thumb:


Purely because we haven't done them.

I joined the gym and happen to workout the same time as the gym owner (who is in his 70's, ex-bodybuilder) so I followed through his circuit of Tue/Sat = Chest/Back/Triceps, Thurs/Sun = Shoulders/Biceps/Legs

I have read Rippletoe's Starting Strength book and have been going over the squat and bench press chapters to make sure I am not missing anything.

I do plan on doing deadlifts soon. I do a similar one to OHP, but we do it on the smith machine with the bar behind the head (purely because that is what I have been told).


----------



## sfstu

You're doing well Stu,

Weight loss may not show up as you could be losing fat & gaining muscle at the same pace.

I haven't changed my body fat % in 8 months, but that's because I have concentrated on adding bulk to keep my energy up for the heavy stuff, I'm only now on reduced carbs to help with fat loss. One thing at a time mate, keep it simple.

*dietwise, ive been taking in more protein than carbs...cut out a lot (but not all) of the bread,crisps,potatoes etc i used to scoff...:thumb:*

Getting strong takes time.
Getting to a good level of fitness can be done in around 3 months.
Fat loss (give your self 12 months to lose around 10-15% body fat)
To maintain the above, takes a change in your lifestyle forever. There is no quick fix.

*that change is what i'm working on now with all the help from you guys on here... trying to build the habits routines for the rest of my life...*

Your weight goals are achievable ; believe in yourself & in 8-12 months you'll be bashing out some serous iron!

Enjoy the journey Stu, there is no rush mate

*i am mate, i'm just impatient, but trying to be realistic too...
rgds stu*


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> especially as i'm about 200% more active than i was a month ago and my diet is much better than it was...!
> rgds stu


lol, I read that as '200% more *attractive* than...'.

Not to put a damper on it but I thought it took significantly longer to add muscular weight than lose fat (6 weeks?).

There's an article on Starting Strenght called 'A clarification...' Have a read.

Admittedly, I've not looked to lose weight (gone up from 75kg to 88, or 2 stone, so far) but the more I read about it the more I understand that restricting calories in the early days of SS is really shagging up the one opportunity you'll ever have of making fast gains. I think if someone was really desperate to lose weight first it might be better to delay beginning the programme of novice linear progression until they can go at it with absolute venom and commitement (at least if they're lifting without a coach to give advice).

I made a pact with myself I'd not give weight a moments thought until I hit 100kg. Maybe if you're going in the opposite direction you could make a pact with yourself to do everything required to make progress and only review weight after 6 months (since linear progress apparently lasts an average of 6 to 9 months)? I'm not denying that weight will be a nagging thought, but if you know it'll meet it's judgement day later it'll help you make the most of the strength gains at this stage?:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> lol, I read that as '200% more *attractive* than...'.
> 
> Not to put a damper on it but I thought it took significantly longer to add muscular weight than lose fat (6 weeks?).
> 
> There's an article on Starting Strenght called 'A clarification...' Have a read.
> 
> Admittedly, I've not looked to lose weight (gone up from 75kg to 88, or 2 stone, so far) but the more I read about it the more I understand that restricting calories in the early days of SS is really shagging up the one opportunity you'll ever have of making fast gains. I think if someone was really desperate to lose weight first it might be better to delay beginning the programme of novice linear progression until they can go at it with absolute venom and commitement (at least if they're lifting without a coach to give advice).
> 
> I made a pact with myself I'd not give weight a moments thought until I hit 100kg. Maybe if you're going in the opposite direction you could make a pact with yourself to do everything required to make progress and only review weight after 6 months (since linear progress apparently lasts an average of 6 to 9 months)? I'm not denying that weight will be a nagging thought, but if you know it'll meet it's judgement day later it'll help you make the most of the strength gains at this stage?:thumb:


interesting read oats...:thumb: wanna get a copy of the SS book but pricey over here..! (don't have a kindle)..
hope i've not given the wrong impression-that i'm obsessed with losing weight... i'm not, but i had expected to see some difference even in this short time? maybe not so much on the scales but more in myself and the fit of my clothes is usually a good indicator. after all, have definitely noticed my clothes getting tighter and fitting worse over last year...!:devil:

guess i'm basing what i'm doing now with what i did a few years back (about 8 to be precise!). started eating sensibly,lifting weight 3/4 times a week (nothing heavy) and walking 40mins every other day...lost 2 stone in 2 months, looked better and got into a pair of jeans i hadn't fit into for 10 years..! i was only 32 then tho...

as i've said previously, i definatly feel better already and i know i'm stronger by what i'm lifting now compared to 1 month ago...i also know my problem- I WANT IT ALL AND I WANT IT NOW!!!!...

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

jamest said:


> Purely because we haven't done them.
> 
> I joined the gym and happen to workout the same time as the gym owner (who is in his 70's, ex-bodybuilder) so I followed through his circuit of Tue/Sat = Chest/Back/Triceps, Thurs/Sun = Shoulders/Biceps/Legs
> 
> I have read Rippletoe's Starting Strength book and have been going over the squat and bench press chapters to make sure I am not missing anything.
> 
> I do plan on doing deadlifts soon. I do a similar one to OHP, but we do it on the smith machine with the bar behind the head (purely because that is what I have been told).


Hi James,

IMHO= the best way to gain weight/mass is by using compound exercises, they should always be the foundation of any routine. The deadlift is an outstanding all body lift, for someone like yourself (they used to call them hard gainers in the old days) I would not be worried so much about isolation exercises until after at least 12 months barbell work. Compound barbell exercises also hit the central nervous system harder which make the body react quicker, I.E grow muscle.

Using the smith machine for your shoulders is not a good idea; free weights allow you to use your muscles the way nature intended -naturally. Free weights also hit you harder due to more muscles being used (Stabiliser muscles). There is also the question of shoulder health, if you are skinny, you will have a slight frame that is not naturally intended to carry large muscles, the barbell compounds will help strengthen bones, joints & tendons, the benefit of this is your body will more readily accept carrying more muscle mass ergo your body will gain weight quicker & more importantly safer. Also there is one school of thought that believe the behind neck press can for some be detrimental to shoulder health in later years (It's the only way I used to lift so I'm not being biased just trying to help, bear in mind I have a solid heavy frame which gives me a genetic advantage to lift heavy gain muscle Etc...Etc...) Read about almost any sport & one of the biggest weaknesses in the human body is the shoulder area. The overhead press & bench press will help develop big shoulders; in fact this year I laid off shoulder training, they are the biggest they've ever been, why, heavy bench presses!

Machines can give you a distorted view of your abilities, my example: I could bench press 180kg's on a machine for reps within 12 months of training when I was in my mid 20's, there is no way I could do this with free weights so easily.

To leave out the deadlift is fundamentally incorrect IMHO.

Basically to build a body you need to have good foundation to build upon. I.e. strong healthy bones, tendons & joints.

And rest! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> You're doing well Stu,
> 
> Weight loss may not show up as you could be losing fat & gaining muscle at the same pace.
> 
> I haven't changed my body fat % in 8 months, but that's because I have concentrated on adding bulk to keep my energy up for the heavy stuff, I'm only now on reduced carbs to help with fat loss. One thing at a time mate, keep it simple.
> 
> *dietwise, ive been taking in more protein than carbs...cut out a lot (but not all) of the bread,crisps,potatoes etc i used to scoff...:thumb:*
> 
> Getting strong takes time.
> Getting to a good level of fitness can be done in around 3 months.
> Fat loss (give your self 12 months to lose around 10-15% body fat)
> To maintain the above, takes a change in your lifestyle forever. There is no quick fix.
> 
> *that change is what i'm working on now with all the help from you guys on here... trying to build the habits routines for the rest of my life...*
> 
> Your weight goals are achievable ; believe in yourself & in 8-12 months you'll be bashing out some serous iron!
> 
> Enjoy the journey Stu, there is no rush mate
> 
> *i am mate, i'm just impatient, but trying to be realistic too...
> rgds stu*


Stick with the program Stu, soon you'll be on a 2X5 then a 1X5 like me, take one step at a time and keep it simple in the beginning & you're more likely to keep at it mate :thumb:

My first 8 months i trained for pure strength only (I would recommend you do the same Stu TBH, in this time learn how to read your body & use your character to push you forward, it takes fighting spirit my man, give the iron hell! :thumb: :thumb: ), it's only now at my strength level that I feel I'm ready to complicate things by adding a more structured diet & next week start conditioning routines with some Muay Thai training 2X a week to help reduce body fat.

Keep focused Stu. Just think in 6 months you could be benching 100kg's for reps mate :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays Workout

*Overhead press warm up sets: 20X5 - 22.5X5 - 30X3

Overhead press work set: 50X6 (don't ask me why I did 6 reps, have no idea lol)* 

BBB assistance work

*Overhead Press: 35X5X10

Barbell Curl: 32.5X5X10 (Cant wait for my Olympic curl bar to arrive) using a barbell for curls is uncomfortable on the wrists.

Close grip bench press 42.5X5X10*

Good workout. Still sticking to the plan, start with light weights & move up slowly :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> lol, I read that as '200% more *attractive* than...'.
> 
> Not to put a damper on it but I thought it took significantly longer to add muscular weight than lose fat (6 weeks?).
> 
> There's an article on Starting Strenght called 'A clarification...' Have a read.
> 
> Admittedly, I've not looked to lose weight (gone up from 75kg to 88, or 2 stone, so far) but the more I read about it the more I understand that restricting calories in the early days of SS is really shagging up the one opportunity you'll ever have of making fast gains. I think if someone was really desperate to lose weight first it might be better to delay beginning the programme of novice linear progression until they can go at it with absolute venom and commitement (at least if they're lifting without a coach to give advice).
> 
> *I made a pact with myself I'd not give weight a moments thought until I hit 100kg*. Maybe if you're going in the opposite direction you could make a pact with yourself to do everything required to make progress and only review weight after 6 months (since linear progress apparently lasts an average of 6 to 9 months)? I'm not denying that weight will be a nagging thought, but if you know it'll meet it's judgement day later it'll help you make the most of the strength gains at this stage?:thumb:


Like your style Oats :thumb:

Get some bulk/power in first :thumb:

Simple is the key guys, focus on one stage at a time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> interesting read oats...:thumb: wanna get a copy of the SS book but pricey over here..! (don't have a kindle)..
> hope i've not given the wrong impression-that i'm obsessed with losing weight... i'm not, but i had expected to see some difference even in this short time? maybe not so much on the scales but more in myself and the fit of my clothes is usually a good indicator. after all, have definitely noticed my clothes getting tighter and fitting worse over last year...!:devil:
> 
> guess i'm basing what i'm doing now with what i did a few years back (about 8 to be precise!). started eating sensibly,lifting weight 3/4 times a week (nothing heavy) and walking 40mins every other day...lost 2 stone in 2 months, looked better and got into a pair of jeans i hadn't fit into for 10 years..! i was only 32 then tho...
> 
> as i've said previously, i definatly feel better already and i know i'm stronger by what i'm lifting now compared to 1 month ago...i also know my problem- I WANT IT ALL AND I WANT IT NOW!!!!...
> 
> rgds stu


What books do you need Stu? I thought i sent you SS, if not PM me mate & ill email it to you :thumb:

I take it your in my age group? Im 43, lol until 2 weeks time!!! :doublesho


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> What books do you need Stu? I thought i sent you SS, if not PM me mate & ill email it to you :thumb:
> 
> I take it your in my age group? Im 43, lol until 2 weeks time!!! :doublesho


you did doug! i'd buried it in a file on my laptop somewhere.. (wheres the smilie for slapping your head with your palm and saying doh!!!?)

41 today mate...:thumb:

am def sticking to the programme for the next 8 weeks then see what to do next...my diet needs looking at but i know its better than it was, just needs working on a bit..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> you did doug! i'd buried it in a file on my laptop somewhere.. (wheres the smilie for slapping your head with your palm and saying doh!!!?)
> 
> 41 today mate...:thumb:
> 
> am def sticking to the programme for the next 8 weeks then see what to do next...my diet needs looking at but i know its better than it was, just needs working on a bit..:thumb:
> rgds stu


:lol: You & your Laptop just don't get on :lol:

41, old git! 

Keep getting stronger for the next 8 weeks :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

you're right on all 3 counts there mate..!:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

5\3\1 Week 3 Cycle 1

A week of last set being 95% of working max for one rep or more. Scores on the doors were: (movement, reps, how it works out as a 1RM, difference to max at week 1)
OHP x6 = 55 +7kg
Dead x6 =143 +17kg
Bench x4 =79 +6kg (Really jacked off. Left scapula came out of contraction and just couldn't shift the bar. Common issue on my bench press.)
Squat x8 =120 +20kg (More left in my legs but shagged up bar position on shoulder. Could have chewed a brick I was that stoked setting up. Awful bench couple days before does help you go to war)

Numbers pretty much where I'd expect them to be at the moment after a few months going backwards. I think the improvement in the 1RM is actually gaining efficiency in higher reps than true 1RM strength. 

Annoyed with the bench. 10 rep assistance sets are a real boon when you've get an area of technique that you're trying to adjust. 

No chinups between sets as I didn't want to interfer with max reps. I'm sure they've regressed as a consequence.

Hill sprints ticking along. Now bad leg is nicely tight the next day rather than crippled with DOMS.

Deload week next week. Going to mix it up a bit to address weak spots confused:expect questions shortly!). 

Oh nearly forgot - the absolute grade A* best fuing thing is my back. I used to have a constantly irritated sciatic nerve and lower back that felt tired and ached. Squatting every session as heavy as I could no doubt didn't help. But now, I've probably only felt the sciatic nerve and leg cramping twice in the last three weeks. Looks like L5\S1 might not be the limiting factor if I progress a bit slower overall. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> 531 Week 3 Cycle 1
> 
> A week of last set being 95% of working max for one rep or more. Scores on the doors were: (movement, reps, how it works out as a 1RM, difference to max at week 1)
> OHP x6 = 55 +7kg
> Dead x6 =143 +17kg
> Bench x4 =79 +6kg (Really jacked off. Left scapula came out of contraction and just couldn't shift the bar. Common issue on my bench press.)
> Squat x8 =120 +20kg (More left in my legs but shagged up bar position on shoulder. Could have chewed a brick I was that stoked setting up. Awful bench couple days before does help you go to war)
> 
> Numbers pretty much where I'd expect them to be at the moment after a few months going backwards. I think the improvement in the 1RM is actually gaining efficiency in higher reps than true 1RM strength.
> 
> Annoyed with the bench. 10 rep assistance sets are a real boon when you've get an area of technique that you're trying to adjust.
> 
> No chinups between sets as I didn't want to interfer with max reps. I'm sure they've regressed as a consequence.
> 
> Hill sprints ticking along. Now bad leg is nicely tight the next day rather than crippled with DOMS.
> 
> Deload week next week. Going to mix it up a bit to address weak spots confused:expect questions shortly!).
> 
> Oh nearly forgot - the absolute grade A* best fuing thing is my back. I used to have a constantly irritated sciatic nerve and lower back that felt tired and ached. Squatting every session as heavy as I could no doubt didn't help. But now, I've probably only felt the sciatic nerve and leg cramping twice in the last three weeks. Looks like L5S1 might not be the limiting factor if I progress a bit slower overall. :thumb:


Bloody 5/3/1 is too complicated for me, I'll stick to my basic 1X5 plus assistance work 

I still think the 5/3/1 is basically a workout to use once you've completely exhausted gains in the 5X5 - 4X5 - 3X5 -2X5 -1X5, I went from 5X5 to 2X5 (briefly) then quickly to the 1X5. Personally I think the 1x5 is amongst the most productive of the basic workouts (Longterm). If I continue to progress as I am now I may never need to use the 5/3/1 thankfully 

Not a big fan of getting anyone to worry about 1rep maxes in the first 12 months of lifting either.

When Benching oats, how wide is your grip?

Since going back into training the OHP I have made efforts to keeping my torso upright & rigid, I can feel the difference, also when lowering the weight don't let it touch or bounce of your upper chest, start pushing the weight up as soon as you know you're about to touch your chest, you'll find it will be safer/more comfortable for you shoulders, allowing it to touch/bounce off your upper chest will result in the tendency to lower the weight faster as it get harder & create more stress on the shoulders.

I have also adjusted my grip width (Wider) centre of hands approx. 27" apart :thumb:


----------



## avit88

guys im struggling

i started 5x5 a week ago but decided to do 4 sessions instead of 3 in the frist week(stupid now i realise) because the weights were low.

im doing great with the squat
but i felt a twinge in my right shoulder doing the ohp due to poor technique

few things u should know:

im doing shoulder dislocations and roller work to sort my posture and increase shoulder flexibility.
i have pretty weak shoulder muscles.

So I carried on with my deadlift but I think this has pull the muscle further from the weight in my arms. I need to make sure my shoulders are back and down n deadlift.


My point is im finding it frustrating because Im trying to improve technique but as soon as I get it slightly wrong I get a twinge which has resulted in an injury.

Ok so is it bad that my squat and deadlift progress but my bp, ohp and br deload and fall behind? Will this effect my squat and deadlift too much? 

I am literally struggling to lift 22.5kg on the ohp.

fed up, help


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> guys im struggling
> 
> i started 5x5 a week ago but decided to do 4 sessions instead of 3 in the frist week(stupid now i realise) because the weights were low.
> 
> Im doing great with the squat
> but i felt a twinge in my right shoulder doing the ohp due to poor technique
> 
> few things u should know:
> 
> Im doing shoulder dislocations and roller work to sort my posture and increase shoulder flexibility.
> I have pretty weak shoulder muscles.
> 
> So i carried on with my deadlift but i think this has pull the muscle further from the weight in my arms. I need to make sure my shoulders are back and down n deadlift.
> 
> My point is im finding it frustrating because im trying to improve technique but as soon as i get it slightly wrong i get a twinge which has resulted in an injury.
> 
> Ok so is it bad that my squat and deadlift progress but my bp, ohp and br deload and fall behind? Will this effect my squat and deadlift too much?
> 
> I am literally struggling to lift 22.5kg on the ohp.
> 
> Fed up, help


*STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* 

First of all you look like your heading for some serious injuries! You sound as though your knowledge of weight training is minimal. You need to spend a week reading & viewing Videos on technique etc…

1.	Stop training.

2.	2. Go to http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/ & read & read some more :thumb:

3. Go to YouTube & search for Videos by Mark Ripptoe. Learn how to: squat, deadlift, bench press & overhead press properly. Try out with an empty bar while watching the videos if possible, learn how your body functions & how to move correctly & safely in all the lifts.

4. Start all over again with an empty bar & slowly progress, use good form/technique, ensure you warm up properly :thumb:

Failing to do the above mate & you'll soon stop training all together.

:thumb:

I'm going offline in a mo to do my deadlift session, ill log back later mate. we can go through this one step at a time, keep it simple mate :thumb:


----------



## avit88

thanks 

I have been reading like mad

I will just go back to the bar and practice technique

 dissappointed



ok so just watched the vids by mark on utube and feel alot better, he has cleared up the points that have been bugging me.


----------



## sfstu

avit88...
started SL myself 4 weeks ago now mate and i too was dubious about the light weights and only training 3 times a week and the workouts are pretty basic and quick due to the light weights...? 
was tempted to do more/add exercises etc etc but thanks to advice from guys on here (like ithaqva) i didn't and have basically stuck to doing exactly what the programme says...
i.m 4 weeks in now and the weights soon start to feel heavier believe me! but because its a gradual increase your body can cope...:thumb:
i too have weak shoulders and also have had pain in one shoulder for years now and have only ever done shoulder press seated with dumbbells in the past with pretty light weights but having stuck with the SL programme am already up to 32.5kg for the shoulder press which although thats less than a warmup weight for a lotta guys on here, i wouldn't have been able to lift that 4 weeks ago... 

although i too was impatient with the light starting weight i treated the 1st couple of weeks (where i stuck to the 20kg) as a practice run and to learn how to do the lifts properly...as the weight gets heavier you really need to be spot on with your form, at the start with light weights, its easy to get away with not doing the lift properly but you'll soon notice it when the weight increases and you'll end up with injuries that'll take you out of the game before you've gotten started...

vids of the lifts, reading up on them and advice from guys on here with the experience will see you through...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> thanks
> 
> I have been reading like mad
> 
> I will just go back to the bar and practice technique
> 
> dissappointed
> 
> ok so just watched the vids by mark on utube and feel alot better, he has cleared up the points that have been bugging me.


Stick with it mate, ive been doing this for 8 months :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Heavy!!!!*

Sunday's workout

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift work set: 185X5* :thumb:

BBB Assistance work

*Deadlift: 107.5X5X10* :devil::devil:

The 185Kg felt heavy today & I miss timed my breathing so basically did the last two reps holding my breath :doublesho:doublesho !!!!!!

Still a very good workout 187.5Kg's next week :thumb:


----------



## avit88

sfstu said:


> avit88...
> started SL myself 4 weeks ago now mate and i too was dubious about the light weights and only training 3 times a week and the workouts are pretty basic and quick due to the light weights...?
> was tempted to do more/add exercises etc etc but thanks to advice from guys on here (like ithaqva) i didn't and have basically stuck to doing exactly what the programme says...
> i.m 4 weeks in now and the weights soon start to feel heavier believe me! but because its a gradual increase your body can cope...:thumb:
> i too have weak shoulders and also have had pain in one shoulder for years now and have only ever done shoulder press seated with dumbbells in the past with pretty light weights but having stuck with the SL programme am already up to 32.5kg for the shoulder press which although thats less than a warmup weight for a lotta guys on here, i wouldn't have been able to lift that 4 weeks ago...
> 
> although i too was impatient with the light starting weight i treated the 1st couple of weeks (where i stuck to the 20kg) as a practice run and to learn how to do the lifts properly...as the weight gets heavier you really need to be spot on with your form, at the start with light weights, its easy to get away with not doing the lift properly but you'll soon notice it when the weight increases and you'll end up with injuries that'll take you out of the game before you've gotten started...
> 
> vids of the lifts, reading up on them and advice from guys on here with the experience will see you through...:thumb:
> rgds stu


thanks for that mate i just needed some reassurance :thumb:

am i ok to carry on with my squats as i have been squatting for years but without weight so i have a pretty good technique?


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> thanks for that mate i just needed some reassurance :thumb:
> 
> am i ok to carry on with my squats as i have been squatting for years but without weight so i have a pretty good technique?


We all had bad workouts mate, no need to rush 

As for your technique. Unless you are being coached by someone who knows I'm afraid all you can hope for is acceptable technique (Thats what I aim for) :thumb:

Something I've learned (The hard way) is your technique constantly changes as you progress/increase the weight lifted. This means you should keep checking/monitoring your technique nearly every time you lift. I make sure I lift every warm up the same as if it was a work set this way you will learn how "acceptable technique" feels. Get it right & you'll have more good workouts than bad & give yourself a better chance of staying away from injury :thumb:

As soon as I know i have had a not so good workout due to technique failure I go back to the videos, spend about 10 minutes on one of my non training days resetting my technique with an empty bar :thumb:

I know this thread is long, but if you went through it from the start you would see most of your questions answered, due to me being just as much a novice as your self mate i went through all the same issues, we all have to start somewhere. I'm still learning :thumb:


----------



## avit88

whats the best way to warm up?


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> whats the best way to warm up?


I would use Dynamic stretches before you even start warming up with weigths :thumb:

My Dynamic Stretch routine.

Pre Warm up: Dynamic stretches (Post #1353, page 136 of this thread)

1. Cat/Camel X10
2. Yoga twist X 10 each side
3. Birddog X 10 each side
4. Supine BridgeX10
5. Hip Flexors X 10 each side
6. Shoulder dislocations X 10
7. Side twists X 10 each side
8. Shoulder shrugs X 10
9. Windmills X 10 each side
10. Bodyweight good mornings
11. Bear hugs, basically put your arms out as though you were going to bring someone close to you to do a big bear hug, each rep you should alternate your arms so when you "hug" one arm is higher than the other, do 20 reps & youve done 10 for each side :thumb:

You'll be ready to start warming up with the barbell, give yourself at least 6 minutes rest between the last barbell warm up set & starting the work sets :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Todays workout, split over a few sessions.

*Session 1*

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/3/[email protected]

*Session 2*

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 4/3/[email protected], 4/[email protected] 3/[email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]

*Negative Chins*
WU: None
WO: 3/3/[email protected] (BW)

*Session 3*

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: None

*Row*
WU: None
WO: None

I've been a bit slack this week so decided to make up for it by doing multiple sessions throught the day.

Squat went very well. I was pretty exhausted by the end of the 5th set, but pleased with what I managed to acheive.
Moved staright onto the deads as I was nicely warmed up. Workout sets went very well indeed. Didn't bother to sit down between sets, just stood in place by the bar to let my heart rate drop and then pulled the next set.
Annoyingly, I managed to pop a rivet on my belt.

OHP was tough. I had just planned on a straight 3x5, but it quickly became apparent that I was not going to manage it. Decided on a whim to give DRPT (Double Reverse Pyramid Training) a go, as I think I'll move onto this style of lifting for my intermediate program.
It nearly went to plan and the drop set at the end added some volume in too - 8 reps, remove some plates then straight onto the final 4 reps.

I think I'd managed to exhaust my muscles by the time the 3rd session came around - only 2 hours after finishing the previous session.
My triceps were fried, and I could not complete the final set of my warmup on the bench. Decided to call it a day at that point.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

mondays 5x5 workout...

*bench 37.5kg 5x5
squat 50kg 5x5
BBrows 45kg 5x5*

was hard work...
had a good nights sleep but maybe energy levels were down due to eating crap yesterday...still, managed it all but struggled with some of it...:devil:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout 5s Month.
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 5 x 5 x 90kg, 10 x 90kg
Pendlay Rows: 60 x 5, 70 x 5, 80 x 5
Dips: BW x 9, 9, 9, 6, 5

Bench Press felt hard at first, 5 rep was going a little bit slow but on the last set I was aiming for 7 reps, the 6th rep was hard but the 7th rep flew up like weight had fallen off the bar, it was really weird. I got 3 more reps after this which all felt great. I worked out a slight tweak to my benching that made my shoulder not hurt at all which is brilliant.

Pendlay rows felt crap today as hurt my hand hitting a punch shot at golf yesterday but worth it as the shot was amazing if I dont say so myself lol.

Less dips than I have done previously but Bench is starting to get heavier so Im more tired by the time I get to Dips.



ITHAQVA said:


> Sunday's workout
> 
> *Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> Deadlift work set: 185X5* :thumb:
> 
> BBB Assistance work
> 
> *Deadlift: 107.5X5X10* :devil::devil:
> 
> The 185Kg felt heavy today & I miss timed my breathing so basically did the last two reps holding my breath :doublesho:doublesho !!!!!!
> 
> Still a very good workout 187.5Kg's next week :thumb:


Thats an impressive Deadlift Doug, even more impressive that your doing 50 reps of 107.5 after doing it. Those higher reps at that weight have really got to be building some muscle on your back.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Todays workout, split over a few sessions.
> 
> *Session 1*
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> 
> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/3/[email protected]
> 
> *Session 2*
> 
> *Press*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 4/3/[email protected], 4/[email protected] 3/[email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
> 
> *Negative Chins*
> WU: None
> WO: 3/3/[email protected] (BW)
> 
> *Session 3*
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: None
> 
> *Row*
> WU: None
> WO: None
> 
> I've been a bit slack this week so decided to make up for it by doing multiple sessions throught the day.
> 
> Squat went very well. I was pretty exhausted by the end of the 5th set, but pleased with what I managed to acheive.
> Moved staright onto the deads as I was nicely warmed up. Workout sets went very well indeed. Didn't bother to sit down between sets, just stood in place by the bar to let my heart rate drop and then pulled the next set.
> Annoyingly, I managed to pop a rivet on my belt.
> 
> OHP was tough. I had just planned on a straight 3x5, but it quickly became apparent that I was not going to manage it. Decided on a whim to give DRPT (Double Reverse Pyramid Training) a go, as I think I'll move onto this style of lifting for my intermediate program.
> It nearly went to plan and the drop set at the end added some volume in too - 8 reps, remove some plates then straight onto the final 4 reps.
> 
> I think I'd managed to exhaust my muscles by the time the 3rd session came around - only 2 hours after finishing the previous session.
> My triceps were fried, and I could not complete the final set of my warmup on the bench. Decided to call it a day at that point.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Bloody hell Phill, how much do you hate yourself  All that in one day :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho Mad as a brush, but much respect to you mate, top workout and probably the longest on this thread, you animal:devil::devil::devil :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout 5s Month.
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 5 x 5 x 90kg, 10 x 90kg
> Pendlay Rows: 60 x 5, 70 x 5, 80 x 5
> Dips: BW x 9, 9, 9, 6, 5
> 
> Bench Press felt hard at first, 5 rep was going a little bit slow but on the last set I was aiming for 7 reps, the 6th rep was hard but the 7th rep flew up like weight had fallen off the bar, it was really weird. I got 3 more reps after this which all felt great. I worked out a slight tweak to my benching that made my shoulder not hurt at all which is brilliant.
> 
> Pendlay rows felt crap today as hurt my hand hitting a punch shot at golf yesterday but worth it as the shot was amazing if I dont say so myself lol.
> 
> Less dips than I have done previously but Bench is starting to get heavier so Im more tired by the time I get to Dips.
> 
> Thats an impressive Deadlift Doug, even more impressive that your doing 50 reps of 107.5 after doing it. Those higher reps at that weight have really got to be building some muscle on your back.


Powering up now James, 80X5 on a Pendlay is good going :thumb:

I wouldn't be too hard on yourself all your other work has mashed your Triceps by the time you get to the dips :thumb:

Thanks mate, the old man is feeling it today  :devil: I'm still totally shagged out  I just couldn't get any more air in my lungs by the time I got to rep 4 & thought "*** it I am getting 5 reps"! :lol, reminds me of that scene in Red Dwarf "Oxygen is for loooosserrrs"! 

I might have to switch to deadlifting the standard way so i can fill my lungs with air before each rep, but we will see how next weeks go first.

Must admit I think my progress will start to slow if all my deadlift's feel as hard as yesterday's session, but I'm not giving up, onward & upward guys!!!!!!
Not sure about muscle as I'm still carrying too much body fat, I've had my first week on my new eating regime so I'll start to measure it as of today :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> mondays 5x5 workout...
> 
> *bench 37.5kg 5x5
> squat 50kg 5x5
> BBrows 45kg 5x5*
> 
> was hard work...
> had a good nights sleep but maybe energy levels were down due to eating crap yesterday...still, managed it all but struggled with some of it...:devil:
> rgds stu


Good going Stu :thumb:

Mind those Barbell rows mate, do them nice & slow. If you think this is what youll be doing for many months, I would consider a powerlifting belt. If you need a link to some just ask mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Powering up now James, 80X5 on a Pendlay is good going :thumb:
> 
> I wouldn't be too hard on yourself all your other work has mashed your Triceps by the time you get to the dips :thumb:
> 
> Thanks mate, the old man is feeling it today  :devil: I'm still totally shagged out  I just couldn't get any more air in my lungs by the time I got to rep 4 & thought "*** it I am getting 5 reps"! :lol, reminds me of that scene in Red Dwarf "Oxygen is for loooosserrrs"!
> 
> I might have to switch to deadlifting the standard way so i can fill my lungs with air before each rep, but we will see how next weeks go first.
> 
> Must admit I think my progress will start to slow if all my deadlift's feel as hard as yesterday's session, but I'm not giving up, onward & upward guys!!!!!!
> Not sure about muscle as I'm still carrying too much body fat, I've had my first week on my new eating regime so I'll start to measure it as of today :thumb:


Doing the Pendlay Rows 5/3/1 style so only add 2.5kg per month but this is an exercise I dont mind progressing slowly on and with 5/3/1 when you feel good you can smash the weight so never have a bad workout really. Thats still 30kg per year.

Ya did 6 work sets on Bench Press, probably the most I ever done on a main exercise, oh no wait I tried German Volume Training for a little while but thats only one exercise then your done. When my arms are fresh like on deload week I been banging out 12-15 reps quite easily so I'm not to worried.

Mate I'm certain if you check back you said your going to stall soon a few times now and you still havent had a proper stall so think positive and keep hitting those weights.

Im still impressed with the boring but big sets, what kind of rest are you leaving between sets.


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Bloody hell Phill, how much do you hate yourself


That's an absolute classic response !!:lol:



sfstu said:


> … its easy to get away with not doing the lift properly but you'll soon notice it when the weight increases and you'll end up with injuries that'll take you out of the game before you've gotten started...


I think that's one of the most difficult aspects of doing SS by yourself. When something's wrong you can drive on using the Hate Yourself tm c (available in all good bookshops) method. Most of the time it works. I have pulled various muscles (thighs, arms, neck) and lifting through them, whilst painful, has worked. However occasionally it makes it worse and you end up digging a hole for yourself. I mashed something in my shoulder on squats (a nerve?) and had a numb arm, pins and needles etc for months because I kept returning to back squats too soon. Very hard to learn these things when your sample size is one.



ITHAQVA said:


> I still think the 5/3/1 is basically a workout to use once you've completely exhausted gains in the 5X5 - 4X5 - 3X5 -2X5 -1X5, I went from 5X5 to 2X5 (briefly) then quickly to the 1X5. Personally I think the 1x5 is amongst the most productive of the basic workouts (Longterm).


That is very close to the Texas Method premise (using three big compound moves each session). Monday is volume day of 5x5. Wednesday is 80% 3x5. Friday is intensity varying between 1x5 to 5x1. It was what I intended to do after SS but getting the volume day right is crucial and takes 2+ hours. Given the variables (recovery, age, work, sleep, kids etc etc) I think 5\3\1 seems a better fit for me.



ITHAQVA said:


> Not a big fan of getting anyone to worry about 1rep maxes in the first 12 months of lifting either.
> 
> When Benching oats, how wide is your grip?


I'm not actually gauging how heavy I can lift. I know it's not much. It's because one of the things I don't get about 5\3\1 is Wendler talks about personal bests. If you're changing the weight and reps each time how do you know it's a PB? I've decided I'll work out the 1RM at the end of each cycle to check progress (on the downside apparently 1RM calculations on +5reps are meant to be fairly inaccurate, but I'm thinking that as I'm measuring them realitve to one another rather than a true 1RM it should work out).

My bench needs tidying up. Hands are within Rips numbers and I've tried wider and narrower. My shoulder blade is a constant bug bear. I've a suspicion that my wrist, forearm, elbows aren't in right alignment and I'm not touching in the right place. Something on the list to sort out during 10 rep assistance sets (and another benefit of 5\3\1 as on SS you never get the opportunity to strip your technique down and build it back up again). Lying on your back staring at the ceiling isn't the best place to view these things from is it?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doing the Pendlay Rows 5/3/1 style so only add 2.5kg per month but this is an exercise I dont mind progressing slowly on and with 5/3/1 when you feel good you can smash the weight so never have a bad workout really. Thats still 30kg per year.
> 
> Ya did 6 work sets on Bench Press, probably the most I ever done on a main exercise, oh no wait I tried German Volume Training for a little while but thats only one exercise then your done. When my arms are fresh like on deload week I been banging out 12-15 reps quite easily so I'm not to worried.
> 
> *Mate I'm certain if you check back you said your going to stall soon a few times now and you still havent had a proper stall so think positive and keep hitting those weights.
> 
> Im still impressed with the boring but big sets, what kind of rest are you leaving between sets*.


I know mate, sometimes I'm just far to cautious for my own good  The deadlift did feel hooooolgy heavy on Sunday, got DOMs in my lower back yesterday & just as little today, still aiming to train my bench tonight :thumb:

BBB rest times -

Bench press session - Barbell row, get my breath back & do next set (approx 1 minute or less) at present as the weight is only 70kg.

Squat & Deadlift BBB - Approx 3 minutes or less rest.

I've not decided how to progress with the BBB routine.
I can either go as heavy as I can, keep adding 2.5kg per lift every time I reach 5 sets of 10 reps, which will mean longer rest periods & an even bigger hit on my recovery or find a cut off point were I rest no longer than X amount of time to keep the weights lighter.

I'm leaning toward a max of 3 minutes rest & only upping the weight when I can do the full 5X10 with 3 minute rest period Max. Hoping this will be good for strength/fitness & muscle mass, which in turn will help me with the heavier 1X5's & not hit my recovery so hard.

I am also considering doing a BBB only week once a month as soon as I feel my recovery is being bashed to ensure I don't burn out :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> My bench needs tidying up. Hands are within Rips numbers and I've tried wider and narrower. My shoulder blade is a constant bug bear. I've a suspicion that my wrist, forearm, elbows aren't in right alignment and I'm not touching in the right place. Something on the list to sort out during 10 rep assistance sets (and another benefit of 531 as on SS you never get the opportunity to strip your technique down and build it back up again). Lying on your back staring at the ceiling isn't the best place to view these things from is it?


The last time i botched my bench I viewed these vids, Dave is an awesome guy who says it as it is :thumb: & i bashed the weight & beat it! :devil::devil:

Im on 117.5Kg tonight thanks to these two videos, lift right, lift safe guys! :thumb:

A VERY BIG THANKS TO DAVE TATE! :thumb:











Oats, Enjoy!!! :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Good going Stu :thumb:
> 
> Mind those Barbell rows mate, do them nice & slow. If you think this is what youll be doing for many months, I would consider a powerlifting belt. If you need a link to some just ask mate :thumb:


yeah, been thinking bout getting a belt..? lower back been ok so far but as the weights going up think i'd rather be safe than sorry...:thumb:
what do you recommend doug..?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> yeah, been thinking bout getting a belt..? lower back been ok so far but as the weights going up think i'd rather be safe than sorry...:thumb:
> what do you recommend doug..?
> rgds stu


I have this one, bloody awesome :thumb:

http://www.pullum-sports.co.uk/acce...ede-duel-prong-powerlifting-belt/prod_24.html

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ballsed up my bench press today. I put a belt on for the first time today, just to see how it felt, very different!  Did one rep, as the bar came down for rep 2 it hit the safeties & well the rest is history  i got up laughed :lol:at my self for being a complete muppet, the weight didnt even feel that heavy lol!!!:wall::wall:

On a plus side, look what came today! :thumb::thumb::thumb:










Life is balance & im going in there again tomorrow :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> That is very close to the Texas Method premise (using three big compound moves each session). Monday is volume day of 5x5. Wednesday is 80% 3x5. Friday is intensity varying between 1x5 to 5x1. It was what I intended to do after SS but getting the volume day right is crucial and takes 2+ hours. Given the variables (recovery, age, work, sleep, kids etc etc) I think 531 seems a better fit for me.
> 
> *I looked at the Texas Method but I didnt fancy the colume day as I would loose focus if my workouts took that long so I did the Starting Strength Advanced Novice Program which is a great step after SL or SS*
> 
> I'm not actually gauging how heavy I can lift. I know it's not much. It's because one of the things I don't get about 531 is Wendler talks about personal bests. If you're changing the weight and reps each time how do you know it's a PB? I've decided I'll work out the 1RM at the end of each cycle to check progress (on the downside apparently 1RM calculations on +5reps are meant to be fairly inaccurate, but I'm thinking that as I'm measuring them realitve to one another rather than a true 1RM it should work out).
> 
> My bench needs tidying up. Hands are within Rips numbers and I've tried wider and narrower. My shoulder blade is a constant bug bear. I've a suspicion that my wrist, forearm, elbows aren't in right alignment and I'm not touching in the right place. Something on the list to sort out during 10 rep assistance sets (and another benefit of 531 as on SS you never get the opportunity to strip your technique down and build it back up again). Lying on your back staring at the ceiling isn't the best place to view these things from is it?


Find a clue that works with your shoulder baldes, ones I heard/taught are try and put your shoulder blades in your back pockets, try and imaging your holding a pen between your shoulder blades, stuff like that. The biggest mistake I see, that I do sometime, is you set your shoulder blades in a good position at the start but you press the bar to high which pulls your shoulder blades apart, practice laying on your bench with your shoulder blades pulled together and move your arms up in a bench press movement and feel for when its pulling your shoulder blades. You can even practice without the bench pull your shoulder blades back and check how far forward your arms go and then relax your shoulder blades and repeat. Mine hands move over 6" once I released my shoulder blades. Havent written that very well but hopefully you get what I mean.

Nice boxing bag Doug, our gyms are getting closer and closer by the day as I got one with my original order. I also got the olympic Curl Bar and I also got the Olympic Tricep Bar. Will be ordering more weight next month as well. What ever shop you ordered from must have cornered the market, boxing equipment and detailing gear as Im sure thats BH Clay in that pic.

I been leaving 90seconds between all my accessory exercises as it helps with abit more muscle growth. I'm still leaving a good rest between my heavy sets but thought I use the rest of the gym time to build some muscle and get abit fitter. Thats the great thing you can change something like your rest periods and get a totally new feeling workout.


----------



## Guest

Tough workout tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/4/[email protected]

*Negative Chins*
WU: None
WO: 3/3/[email protected] (BW)

Think I'm still recovering from my weekend session. 
The squat was really tough going tonight. The bar felt no heavier than normal, I just had trouble pushing the weight on the first 2 sets - it was a battle make the 5 reps each time.
Strangely, the 3rd set was notably easier. Still hard but closer to how I expected to push this weight.

Bench was hard work too. Didn't make all 5 reps on each set. Not too disappointed though as this is the heaviest I've ever benched.

Negative Chins are getting easier. I can hold the top position for around 5 secs now before lowering myself down slowly - I was only managing around 1 sec when I first started doing these :lol:.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Tough workout tonight.
> 
> *Squat*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected]
> 
> *Bench*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: 5/4/[email protected]
> 
> *Negative Chins*
> WU: None
> WO: 3/3/[email protected] (BW)
> 
> Think I'm still recovering from my weekend session.
> The squat was really tough going tonight. The bar felt no heavier than normal, I just had trouble pushing the weight on the first 2 sets - it was a battle make the 5 reps each time.
> Strangely, the 3rd set was notably easier. Still hard but closer to how I expected to push this weight.
> 
> Bench was hard work too. Didn't make all 5 reps on each set. Not too disappointed though as this is the heaviest I've ever benched.
> 
> Negative Chins are getting easier. I can hold the top position for around 5 secs now before lowering myself down slowly - I was only managing around 1 sec when I first started doing these :lol:.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


nice work Phil,

I find especially with squats that you cant really structure your warm ups, you have to kind of go by feel on how good you feel. I say this as sometimes if i havent concentrated on warming up then my squats get easier the more sets I do. Doug and Sidewalkdance have posted warm ups a few times and I normally suggest as you increase the weight you lower the reps so you dont burn yourself out.

Negative Chins are awesome, I find they really tear into your lats. I even think they are good for people who can do multiple reps, at the end of your workout hold yourself at the top for as long as possible and keep fighting all the way down, then do a flexed arm hang then down to a dead hang, this will kill your lats and grip.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> nice work Phil,
> 
> I find especially with squats that you cant really structure your warm ups, you have to kind of go by feel on how good you feel. I say this as sometimes if i havent concentrated on warming up then my squats get easier the more sets I do. Doug and Sidewalkdance have posted warm ups a few times and I normally suggest as you increase the weight you lower the reps so you dont burn yourself out.
> 
> Negative Chins are awesome, I find they really tear into your lats. I even think they are good for people who can do multiple reps, at the end of your workout hold yourself at the top for as long as possible and keep fighting all the way down, then do a flexed arm hang then down to a dead hang, this will kill your lats and grip.


Thanks James, that is some great advice :thumb:

You make a very good point about my squat warmups. I'll definitely look at this.

I like the your idea for the negative chins. I must admit I need to work on using my lats more - concentrate on pushing my elbows down rather than pulling my body up, as you have mentioned before.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Jumps: 3x5
Box Squats: 120kg x 5 x 5, 120 x 8
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 72.5 x 5, 82.5 x 5, 92.5 Skipped

I have just felt like crap lately and I cant really tell if this workout was good or not. i did 117.5kg for 8,8,12 3 weeks ago so not sure of 5x5 and then 8 is better, I would say its not as good personally but this is only week 1 so you leave 2-3 reps in the tank.

I felt so run down I skipped the last set which is the work set and the Balgarian split squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Thanks James, that is some great advice :thumb:
> 
> You make a very good point about my squat warmups. I'll definitely look at this.
> 
> I like the your idea for the negative chins. I must admit I need to work on using my lats more - concentrate on pushing my elbows down rather than pulling my body up, as you have mentioned before.


I would also recommend you do dynamic stretches as posted a page or two back Phil, the ones I do are to ensure the core & shoulders are pre warmed before you warm up with weights. I'm fining the heavier the weights get the more apparent that warming = better lifting :thumb:

And thats comming from a guy who never used to warm up hardly at all, ME!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Jumps: 3x5
> Box Squats: 120kg x 5 x 5, 120 x 8
> Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 72.5 x 5, 82.5 x 5, 92.5 Skipped
> 
> I have just felt like crap lately and I cant really tell if this workout was good or not. i did 117.5kg for 8,8,12 3 weeks ago so not sure of 5x5 and then 8 is better, I would say its not as good personally but this is only week 1 so you leave 2-3 reps in the tank.
> 
> I felt so run down I skipped the last set which is the work set and the Balgarian split squats.


I'm still tired from sundays deadlift session :doublesho WTF!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice boxing bag Doug, our gyms are getting closer and closer by the day as I got one with my original order. I also got the olympic Curl Bar and I also got the Olympic Tricep Bar. Will be ordering more weight next month as well. What ever shop you ordered from must have cornered the market, boxing equipment and detailing gear as Im sure thats BH Clay in that pic.
> 
> I been leaving 90seconds between all my accessory exercises as it helps with abit more muscle growth. I'm still leaving a good rest between my heavy sets but thought I use the rest of the gym time to build some muscle and get abit fitter. Thats the great thing you can change something like your rest periods and get a totally new feeling workout.


 Yep BH clay :thumb: forgot to put the new George foreman grill & 1ltr of Iron-X that arrive yesterday too 

I'm not sure if I could manage 90 seconds between the deadlift & squat assistance work, I may have gone too heavy.
Very tempted to reduce the assistance weights back to 50% of my main work set & strictly time my rest periods, James is 90 seconds the optimal time for growth mate?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Yep BH clay :thumb: forgot to put the new George foreman grill & 1ltr of Iron-X that arrive yesterday too
> 
> I'm not sure if I could manage 90 seconds between the deadlift & squat assistance work, I may have gone too heavy.
> Very tempted to reduce the assistance weights back to 50% of my main work set & strictly time my rest periods, James is 90 seconds the optimal time for growth mate?


If that's all from one shop that's definitely a shop that caters foreveryone.

I wouldn't say optimal Doug, as as you know there isn't really an optimal for everyone. Some people grow with less volume others grow with more, some with more rest other with less. I just read a number of articles and seen a number of well known coaches recommend 30-120 for muscle grow so I decided on 90 seconds.

I wouldn't suggest this to anyone normally as I always been the guy that rests 3-5 mins but your smashing your heavy exercise for your strength so i think doing assistant exercises with lower rest is fine. Also bigger muscle have more potential for strength increase so win win


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> If that's all from one shop that's definitely a shop that caters foreveryone.
> 
> :lol::lol::lol::lol:
> 
> I wouldn't say optimal Doug, as as you know there isn't really an optimal for everyone. Some people grow with less volume others grow with more, some with more rest other with less. I just read a number of articles and seen a number of well known coaches recommend 30-120 for muscle grow so I decided on 90 seconds.
> 
> I wouldn't suggest this to anyone normally as I always been the guy that rests 3-5 mins but your smashing your heavy exercise for your strength so i think doing assistant exercises with lower rest is fine. Also bigger muscle have more potential for strength increase so win win


I see what you mean mate. However I think I do need to set a maximum rest time between sets just to ensure I keep structure to my assistance workouts so I can properly gauge my progress & also ensure I don't keep going heavy, which I seem to be doing all the time. In a way I need to restrict my progress with reduced rest?

Or do you think I can approach my assistance work in the same way as my work sets? Max 6 minutes rest between sets & keep adding 2.5Kg every time I get 5 sets 10 reps?

I'm in a bit of a dilemma at the moment, my deadlift session is starting to feel like its taking it out of me.

James, do you consider last Sundays deadlift session as a big workout?

*Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1

Deadlift work set: 185X5

BBB Assistance work

Deadlift: 107.5X5X10*

Question is: Should I be lowering my assistance weights, go for the proscribed rest period (30-120) build muscle mass to keep progressing on my heavy work sets & ensure better recovery. Or should I carry on maxing out the weights on my assistance work restricting only by sticking to a maximum of 6 minutes rest between sets & turning my assistance work into a secondary "heavy" assistance session?

HELP!!!!!!!


----------



## sfstu

weds workout SL 5x5

*squats 52.5kg 5x5
OHP 32.5kg 5x5
deadlift 65kg 1x5*

squat was ok, feeling better 3rd,4th,5th sets (as usual?)...not my favourite exercise but its going ok and my knees feel much better in general these days...not so-old!!!

pleased with OHP as always had problems with my shoulder and never lifted even the weight i'm at now, concentrated on giving it the extra squeeze at the top of the movement...expect to stall soon on it but for now will keep going til i do.. not too sure how wide my grip should be though...gonna do some more reading/vid watching...

deadlift went ok...watched the vid by rippetoe that oats lent me before doing it...just doesn't feel as if i'm doing as much as i should/could what with only 1 set of 5....

anyway, off now for a, as someone on another thread called, "gay spunky" choc/mint protien shake...:doublesho:devil::lol:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> weds workout SL 5x5
> 
> *squats 52.5kg 5x5
> OHP 32.5kg 5x5
> deadlift 65kg 1x5*
> 
> squat was ok, feeling better 3rd,4th,5th sets (as usual?)...not my favourite exercise but its going ok and my knees feel much better in general these days...not so-old!!!
> 
> pleased with OHP as always had problems with my shoulder and never lifted even the weight i'm at now, concentrated on giving it the extra squeeze at the top of the movement...expect to stall soon on it but for now will keep going til i do.. not too sure how wide my grip should be though...gonna do some more reading/vid watching...
> 
> deadlift went ok...watched the vid by rippetoe that oats lent me before doing it...just doesn't feel as if i'm doing as much as i should/could what with only 1 set of 5....
> 
> anyway, off now for a, as someone on another thread called, "gay spunky" choc/mint protien shake...:doublesho:devil::lol:
> rgds stu


Excellent mate work! :thumb:

Go easy on the gay spunky stuff :doublesho 

1x5 deadlift is enough, have no fear when it gets heavy you'll be glad of it :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> On a plus side, look what came today! :thumb::thumb::thumb:


You're a very lucky boy ithaqva. My local fitters would never have put the carpet in with all that junk lying around.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I see what you mean mate. However I think I do need to set a maximum rest time between sets just to ensure I keep structure to my assistance workouts so I can properly gauge my progress & also ensure I don't keep going heavy, which I seem to be doing all the time. In a way I need to restrict my progress with reduced rest?
> 
> Or do you think I can approach my assistance work in the same way as my work sets? Max 6 minutes rest between sets & keep adding 2.5Kg every time I get 5 sets 10 reps?
> 
> I'm in a bit of a dilemma at the moment, my deadlift session is starting to feel like its taking it out of me.
> 
> James, do you consider last Sundays deadlift session as a big workout?
> 
> *Deadlift warm up sets: 60X3X3 - 100X3 - 120X2 - 140X1
> 
> Deadlift work set: 185X5
> 
> BBB Assistance work
> 
> Deadlift: 107.5X5X10*
> 
> Question is: Should I be lowering my assistance weights, go for the proscribed rest period (30-120) build muscle mass to keep progressing on my heavy work sets & ensure better recovery. Or should I carry on maxing out the weights on my assistance work restricting only by sticking to a maximum of 6 minutes rest between sets & turning my assistance work into a secondary "heavy" assistance session?
> 
> HELP!!!!!!!


Here's my take on things Buddy. Your not competing right now and your doing this for overall fitness but you like being strong so what ever routine you do keep your first exercise at 3-7 mins rest and smash it for strength. Then for the fitness aspect your probably better to lower your rest periods slightly to stop the stress on your body. Im sure Wendler does this and also Dave Tate said when he changed his training to more bodybuilding lower rest and concentrating on the contraction that he felt a million times better after a few weeks but then he was pretty beat up.

Anyway as a comparison our total tonnage for our last Deadlift Workouts were:
James: 1,650kg + 75kg = 1,725kg
Doug: 925kg + 5,375 = 6,300kg

Your about 15% stronger than me on deadlifts right now but even taking this into account your doing a hell of a lot of total weight. But then your stronger than me so what your doing is obviously working.

As you know, in simple terms, higher rest is better for strength, lower rest is better for muscle and fitness.

From Defranco's Q&A
What rest periods do you recommend for the max-effort lifts
and accessory lifts?
A: The recommended rest periods for max-effort exercises are 3-5 minutes
between sets. The recommended rest periods (if not specified) are one to
two minutes between sets for all accessory exercises.

From Wendler's 5/3/1 Book
Question: Do you ever take your assistance work to failure?
Answer: Very rarely. The key to assistance work is doing enough to stimulate the muscle. Your assistance work should not affect your recovery and overall performance.



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm still tired from sundays deadlift session :doublesho WTF!!!


If your taking this long to recover, your either having a bad week, your getting very near your limit or your over trained. The workout your on has given you great gains so is obviously working but you may be overtrained so maybe a light week would help and then stay on the same program. Being near your limit takes a lot out of you, this is why some powerlifters take time off after a Big Comp.

I was just re-reading 5/3/1 2nd Edition and in the long run I will probably switch to 5/3/1 & Crossfit, its 2 strength exercises and then circuit training which will be great for conditioning. The full body/strongman circuit training is what I used to do with the Rugby players and I dont think their anything better for overall fitness.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> You're a very lucky boy ithaqva. My local fitters would never have put the carpet in with all that junk lying around.


:lol::lol::lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Here's my take on things Buddy. Your not competing right now and your doing this for overall fitness but you like being strong so what ever routine you do keep your first exercise at 3-7 mins rest and smash it for strength. Then for the fitness aspect your probably better to lower your rest periods slightly to stop the stress on your body. Im sure Wendler does this and also Dave Tate said when he changed his training to more bodybuilding lower rest and concentrating on the contraction that he felt a million times better after a few weeks but then he was pretty beat up.
> 
> Anyway as a comparison our total tonnage for our last Deadlift Workouts were:
> James: 1,650kg + 75kg = 1,725kg
> Doug: 925kg + 5,375 = 6,300kg
> 
> Your about 15% stronger than me on deadlifts right now but even taking this into account your doing a hell of a lot of total weight. But then your stronger than me so what your doing is obviously working.
> 
> As you know, in simple terms, higher rest is better for strength, lower rest is better for muscle and fitness.
> 
> From Defranco's Q&A
> What rest periods do you recommend for the max-effort lifts
> and accessory lifts?
> A: The recommended rest periods for max-effort exercises are 3-5 minutes
> between sets. The recommended rest periods (if not specified) are one to
> two minutes between sets for all accessory exercises.
> 
> From Wendler's 5/3/1 Book
> Question: Do you ever take your assistance work to failure?
> Answer: Very rarely. The key to assistance work is doing enough to stimulate the muscle. Your assistance work should not affect your recovery and overall performance.
> 
> If your taking this long to recover, your either having a bad week, your getting very near your limit or your over trained. The workout your on has given you great gains so is obviously working but you may be overtrained so maybe a light week would help and then stay on the same program. Being near your limit takes a lot out of you, this is why some powerlifters take time off after a Big Comp.
> 
> I was just re-reading 5/3/1 2nd Edition and in the long run I will probably switch to 5/3/1 & Crossfit, its 2 strength exercises and then circuit training which will be great for conditioning. The full body/strongman circuit training is what I used to do with the Rugby players and I dont think their anything better for overall fitness.


Thanks for the info James :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:

When I saw the total weight I was lifting in one session :doublesho I can see why I'm a bit burnt out :thumb:

Today is the first time since Sunday that I've woken up & not felt tired :doublesho I'm taking the rest of the week off to recover & re structure my training routine.

Having read your info James, I think I'm allowing my assistance work to become too heavy & it's hitting my recovery too hard combine that with the lower intake of food as I'm trying to reduce body fat.

I'm strongly leaning toward;

*1X5 on week 1*, followed by *BBB assistance work only on week 2 with fixed rest periods between BBB sets *to artificially slow my progress. This will also enable me to do two sessions per week of Muay Thai (limited to 45 minutes per workout).
The two heavy & two assistance per month will give me loads more recovery time & I'll be able to focus on power/fitness one week, muscle mass/fitness the following etc...Etc... Which will also make things a bit more interesting 

Thanks mate :thumb:


----------



## jamest

Bod42 said:


> Here's my take on things Buddy. *Your *not competing right now and *your *doing this for overall fitness but you like being strong so what ever routine you do keep your first exercise at 3-7 mins rest and smash it for strength. Then for the fitness aspect *your *probably better to lower your rest periods slightly to stop the stress on your body. Im sure Wendler does this and also Dave Tate said when he changed his training to more bodybuilding lower rest and concentrating on the contraction that he felt a million times better after a few weeks but then he was pretty beat up.
> 
> *Your *about 15% stronger than me on deadlifts right now but even taking this into account *your *doing a hell of a lot of total weight. But then *your *stronger than me so what *your *doing is obviously working.
> 
> As you know, in simple terms, higher rest is better for strength, lower rest is better for muscle and fitness.
> 
> If *your *taking this long to recover, *your *either having a bad week, *your *getting very near your limit or *your *over trained. The workout your on has given you great gains so is obviously working but you may be overtrained so maybe a light week would help and then stay on the same program. Being near your limit takes a lot out of you, this is why some powerlifters take time off after a Big Comp.
> 
> I was just re-reading 5/3/1 2nd Edition and in the long run I will probably switch to 5/3/1 & Crossfit, its 2 strength exercises and then circuit training which will be great for conditioning. The full body/strongman circuit training is what I used to do with the Rugby players and I dont think their anything better for overall fitness.


Sorry to be a grammar nazi but most of the "your" should be "you're". Makes it hard to read.

Tried doing deadlifts on Tuesday (only 60kg followed by 80kg) and had a sore back in the evening and Wednesday and a bit today but was alright doing squats (which has made the soreness more or less completely disappear.) Don't know if it is down to poor technique or that I worked muscles which I haven't really worked before. All of the back work I had done before was pretty much all upper back.


----------



## ITHAQVA

jamest said:


> Sorry to be a grammar nazi but most of the "your" should be "you're". Makes it hard to read.


I didnt have a problem, perhapse this thread isnt for you :thumb:

Bod42 has been an incredible source of info, support & friendship, to pick up on his grammar on a thread created to help with the physical just makes me :lol:


----------



## jamest

ITHAQVA said:


> I didnt have a problem, perhapse this thread isnt for you :thumb:
> 
> Bod42 has been an incredible source of info, support & friendship, to pick up on his grammar on a thread created to help with the physical just makes me :lol:


I'm alright if apostrophes are missing but the wrong their/there/they're or your/you're or brought/bought always throw me off and make me have to read it through again. Means I pretty much read everything twice.

Grammar aside the information is very helpful.


----------



## Bod42

Well I must sincerely apologise for my poor grammer. I will E-mail the Moderator's and request everyone pass an english proficiency test before posting within the thread.

Most of my posts are made from my phone which has predicted txt and a very small keyboard but I will make more of an effort in the future.

Doug, if your increasing your BBB weight at the same time as Dieting and adding Muay Thai a few times a weeks your/you're (put both to make sure) body will take a little while to adapt. Even Wendler said if your just adding Hill sprints, keep your weights the same for a few weeks.

You only have a certain amount of energy/recovery each week and your now adding extra work so something has got to come out. Also putting on strength while dieting is really hard, some people say its impossible.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Well I must sincerely apologise for my poor grammer. I will E-mail the Moderator's and request everyone pass an english proficiency test before posting within the thread.
> 
> Most of my posts are made from my phone which has predicted txt and a very small keyboard but I will make more of an effort in the future.
> 
> Doug, if your increasing your BBB weight at the same time as Dieting and adding Muay Thai a few times a weeks your/you're (put both to make sure) body will take a little while to adapt. Even Wendler said if your just adding Hill sprints, keep your weights the same for a few weeks.
> 
> You only have a certain amount of energy/recovery each week and your now adding extra work so something has got to come out. Also putting on strength while dieting is really hard, some people say its impossible.


:thumb::thumb: *Thanks for the info James *:thumb::thumb:

I'm going to have a look at my training routine & restructure accordingly :thumb:

Onward 'N' Upward!  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb::thumb: *Thanks for the info James *:thumb::thumb:
> 
> I'm going to have a look at my training routine & restructure accordingly :thumb:
> 
> Onward 'N' Upward!  :thumb:


See below Wendler says his lofts took a few months to get back to normal when he added conditioning.
http://asp.elitefts.net/qa/default.asp?qid=171644&tid=

I cant find the Elitefts Q&A post but I read he advises that you split your year into 2-4 parts and concentrate on a different aspect of fitness within each part.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> See below Wendler says his lofts took a few months to get back to normal when he added conditioning.
> http://asp.elitefts.net/qa/default.asp?qid=171644&tid=
> 
> I cant find the Elitefts Q&A post but I read he advises that you split your year into 2-4 parts and concentrate on a different aspect of fitness within each part.


Excellent mate, some reading for me when i get home


----------



## ITHAQVA

jamest said:


> I'm alright if apostrophes are missing but the wrong their/there/they're or your/you're or brought/bought always throw me off and make me have to read it through again. Means I pretty much read everything twice.


But imagine the fun! You can read our posts twice & get two completely different meanings :thumb: twice the value from reading this thread & you didn't even need to use your 50% coupon :thumb:


----------



## jamest

ITHAQVA said:


> But imagine the fun! You can read our posts twice & get two completely different meanings :thumb: twice the value from reading this thread & you didn't even need to use your 50% coupon :thumb:


:thumb:


----------



## Guest

jamest said:


> Sorry to be a grammar nazi but most of the "your" should be "you're". Makes it hard to read.






jamest said:


> Tried doing deadlifts on Tuesday (only 60kg followed by 80kg) and had a sore back in the evening and Wednesday and a bit today but was alright doing squats (which has made the soreness more or less completely disappear.) Don't know if it is down to poor technique or that I worked muscles which I haven't really worked before. All of the back work I had done before was pretty much all upper back.


:wall:

Pot, kettle?


----------



## sfstu

ordered a chalk bag today (from link that ithaqva provided a few pages back)..:thumb: starting to get calluses and don't like gloves...
have also ordered a couple of resistance bands for assistance with pullups/chins/dips which i'm thinking of adding to my programme at some point although will probably wait till i've finished present SL5x5 programme or when i get power rack...not sure yet...:devil:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> ordered a chalk bag today (from link that ithaqva provided a few pages back)..:thumb: starting to get calluses and don't like gloves...
> have also ordered a couple of resistance bands for assistance with pullups/chins/dips which i'm thinking of adding to my programme at some point although will probably wait till i've finished present SL5x5 programme or when i get power rack...not sure yet...:devil:
> rgds stu


Dont worry Stu, the calluses settle down, I dont know why but mine are getting smaller :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Tonight's workout, which went a lot better than my last one.

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/5/[email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Chins*
WU: None
WO: -3/-3/+4/+2/+2/[email protected] (BW)

Dead went really well. Decided to rep out on the last set to get an estimate of my 1RM. 8x145kg=~1x180kg. I'll have to try it for real soon to see how close I actually am.

Press was good. Last rep of each set was a little tough but I'm pleased I got all 3x5.

Chins started off with a couple of sets of negatives. Then moved onto proper unassisted chins. 
I feel Negatives are definitely the way to go. They have built my strength up far faster than doing assisted chins.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## jamest

BareFacedGeek said:


> :wall:
> 
> Pot, kettle?


What?


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Chins started off with a couple of sets of negatives. Then moved onto proper unassisted chins.
> I feel Negatives are definitely the way to go. They have built my strength up far faster than doing assisted chins.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


interesting stuff...:speechles
although i'm only half way through my first SL5x5 am already thinking bout what to do next (another 7 weeks yet)...really wanting to add chins,pullups and dips to what i'm doing now (although i will wait til end of the 12 weeks). 
just bought a couple of resistance bands to help as no way will i be hauling this 17odd stone up in the air without _some_ help...:doublesho 
will remember this about using negatives though....:thumb:

what programme are you doing phil..?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

jamest said:


> What?


Jamest,

1. I think it's safe to say that the core posters on here did not appreciate your post regarding Bod42's grammar.

2. This is a power lifting /weight training thread, if grammar is that important to you, why not start a grammar thread were you can use your vast knowledge to help educate those less fortunate than yourself?

3. What if a member is not well educated, do you really think your post would have a negative or positive effect on them?

I suggest if you wish to join this very friendly group & enjoy our help, that you put your concerns regarding grammar aside. We are here to build bodies not minds :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Hi Stu,

I was doing StrongLifts but at 3x5, rather than 5x5, to help recovery and save a bit of time (I switched at around 100kg squat). I also added chins and dips, as accessory exercises, to the SL programme.

I'm now starting to move over to a slightly different programme. This has been picked up from the weight lifting forum, IronStrong.org, which I also maintain a log at. 
The advantage of this programme is that you squat twice a week and perform deads on a, separate, third session. I'm starting to find that squats and deads on the same day mean I'm taking 3-4 days to recover.
The Average F'n Program, as it is called :lolI actually think the name is great), could be considered an advanced beginner programme. I'm not quite at the stage where I need an intermediate programme, but SL is starting to get a little too much for me now.

I started off using a resistance band (30kg rating) for both my chins and dips. I started adding weight as well as using the band but progression was slow - got up to adding 10kg and started stalling. 
I thought I'd try negative chins instead, as these are often recommended. Within 3 sessions, I had managed to do an unassisted chin. Negatives are great, but can make you very sore and are tough on tendons/ligaments. You probably need to get your body used to the movement before trying these out. 
I think I'll probably start alternating between negatives and standard chins, and may even weight the negatives.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Jamest,
> 
> 1. I think it's safe to say that the core posters on here did not appreciate your post regarding Bod42's grammar.
> 
> 2. This is a power lifting /weight training thread, if grammar is that important to you, why not start a grammar thread were you can use your vast knowledge to help educate those less fortunate than yourself?
> 
> 3. What if a member is not well educated, do you really think your post would have a negative or positive effect on them?
> 
> I suggest if you wish to join this very friendly group & enjoy our help, that you put your concerns regarding grammar aside. We are here to build bodies not minds :thumb:


In addition, if you are going to criticise someone's use of English, you'd better make sure the rest of your own post is up to scratch too :thumb:.


----------



## jamest

ITHAQVA said:


> Jamest,
> 
> 1. I think it's safe to say that the core posters on here did not appreciate your post regarding Bod42's grammar.
> 
> 2. This is a power lifting /weight training thread, if grammar is that important to you, why not start a grammar thread were you can use your vast knowledge to help educate those less fortunate than yourself?
> 
> 3. What if a member is not well educated, do you really think your post would have a negative or positive effect on them?
> 
> I suggest if you wish to join this very friendly group & enjoy our help, that you put your concerns regarding grammar aside. We are here to build bodies not minds :thumb:


1. It wasn't meant malicious in any way.
2. I don't have a vast knowledge of grammar but incorrect usage can completely change the context of a sentence.
3. It should have a positive affect. If anyone gets offend by their grammar being corrected then they won't do too well getting a job.

The way you have all reacted is akin to me calling him something defamatory, not pointing out a minor grammar problem.

I will take my leave.


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Hi Stu,
> 
> I was doing StrongLifts but at 3x5, rather than 5x5, to help recovery and save a bit of time (I switched at around 100kg squat). I also added chins and dips, as accessory exercises, to the SL programme.
> 
> I'm now starting to move over to a slightly different programme. This has been picked up from the weight lifting forum, IronStrong.org, which I also maintain a log at.
> The advantage of this programme is that you squat twice a week and perform deads on a, separate, third session. I'm starting to find that squats and deads on the same day mean I'm taking 3-4 days to recover.
> The Average F'n Program, as it is called :lolI actually think the name is great), could be considered an advanced beginner programme. I'm not quite at the stage where I need an intermediate programme, but SL is starting to get a little too much for me now.
> 
> I started off using a resistance band (30kg rating) for both my chins and dips. I started adding weight as well as using the band but progression was slow - got up to adding 10kg and started stalling.
> I thought I'd try negative chins instead, as these are often recommended. Within 3 sessions, I had managed to do an unassisted chin. Negatives are great, but can make you very sore and are tough on tendons/ligaments. You probably need to get your body used to the movement before trying these out.
> I think I'll probably start alternating between negatives and standard chins, and may even weight the negatives.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


_Very_ interesting stuff phil...:thumb: looks to be exactly what i'm wanting to be doing next...will be having a proper read through that thread/link later but after a quick speed read of it definitely like the sound of only doing squats twice a week rather than 3 times and doing more deadlifts appeals too, as does chins,press ups,dips...
think i'd do similar to you with regards chins...? start with the resistance bands (got 2 lightest ones which i can use together then separately) then move onto negative chins then, somewhere in the distant murky future, i'd love to move onto pullups...we'll see...
did you carry over the weights you were lifting from SL to the average f'n programme (good name)...?
probably have some more questions later when i've had time to have a proper read...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

friday's workout...

*bench 40kg 5x5
squat 55kg 5x5
bb rows 47.5kg 5x5*

struggled slightly on bench, i think because the marcy bench i have at the moment is a little tall and as weight gets heavier its getting harder to set myself up on the bench and get my feet just so...will be remedied at some point soon when i get new bench and rack, (the bodymax ones that ithaqva reviewed...:thumb

what do you guys think of me adding some ab stuff but on the off days maybe..? thinking some crunches,planks, side planks...don't really want to make my present workouts much longer if possible so thats why i thought of using the off days...?

thoughts...
end of my 5th week and well pleased i'm still lifting and still enjoying it...its been so easy for me to put things off and not stick to things in this day and age, especially with the daft shifts/hours i often do and juggling that with family life (3 kids)...not just feeling physically better,fitter, stronger but also mentally i'm much happier and more positive than i was a couple of months ago...
big thanks to all you guys on here for patience, help and advice...:thumb::thumb::thumb:

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> friday's workout...
> 
> *bench 40kg 5x5
> squat 55kg 5x5
> bb rows 47.5kg 5x5*
> 
> struggled slightly on bench, i think because the marcy bench i have at the moment is a little tall and as weight gets heavier its getting harder to set myself up on the bench and get my feet just so...will be remedied at some point soon when i get new bench and rack, (the bodymax ones that ithaqva reviewed...:thumb
> 
> what do you guys think of me adding some ab stuff but on the off days maybe..? thinking some crunches,planks, side planks...don't really want to make my present workouts much longer if possible so thats why i thought of using the off days...?
> 
> thoughts...
> end of my 5th week and well pleased i'm still lifting and still enjoying it...its been so easy for me to put things off and not stick to things in this day and age, especially with the daft shifts/hours i often do and juggling that with family life (3 kids)...not just feeling physically better,fitter, stronger but also mentally i'm much happier and more positive than i was a couple of months ago...
> big thanks to all you guys on here for patience, help and advice...:thumb::thumb::thumb:
> 
> rgds stu


Noting wrong with a little extra ab work Stu, but on this first phase i would keep to the plan. Small steps mate :thumb:


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> did you carry over the weights you were lifting from SL to the average f'n programme (good name)...?


Yep, just kept the weights the same :thumb:.

The only real difference between SL and AFP is the reduced workout volume, which aids recovery. It's at 3x5, which you will have moved to anyway on SL by the time you need to consider AFP. Increments are still the same too - +2.5kg on all exercises bar the dead, which is +5kg.

Because you squat only twice a week and perform the dead, press, bench and row only once a week progress is, in theory, slightly slower. However, you'll be at a point where your body needs longer to recover so you might not manage to increase weights any faster than that anyway.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Question.*

I've been trying to work out the best way to keep achieving my powerlifting goals & also make a start on reducing some body fat & getting in some conditioning/fitness. 
I could be asking a bit much of myself. I would like you opinions please guys.

*Week 1: 
Workout days = Dynamic stretches - 6x various weight warm up sets up to a max of 60% of my max weight - 1X5 reps, concentrating on strength only.
On two of the non-training days do up to 45 minutes Muay Thai, with the possibility of increasing to 60 minutes max.*

*Week 2:
Workout days= Dynamic stretches - 6x various weight warm up sets up to a max of 60% of my max weight - 2 x 5 sets of 10 reps boring but big assistance/mass/volume work. 
On two of the non-training days do up to 45 minutes Muay Thai, with the possibility of increasing to 60 minutes max.*

Alternating from week 1 to week 2 each month will give me two weeks powerlifting & two weeks mass/volume/assistance work. Obviously the 2 X 5 sets 10 rep (Mass/volume/assistance week) is well within my capability. As I get into it I plan to mix it up with other Compound exercises (chins, pull ups, dips, barbell shrugs). The 1X5 is also well within my capability, if I feel that my recovery with this routine is good I may also add another 1X5X10, but no more.

Problem is, I think I'm doing far too well, I'm feeling very strong, but I'm also feeling a bit sluggish/unfit & some of my joints have recently been a little sore in the mornings. I'm beginning to see why many power lifters cycle their training, even though i'm so close to my Squat & deadlift goals, I think I need to give the rest of body a little bit of time to catch up.

I would like you opinions please guys :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> interesting stuff...:speechles
> although i'm only half way through my first SL5x5 am already thinking bout what to do next (another 7 weeks yet)...really wanting to add chins,pullups and dips to what i'm doing now (although i will wait til end of the 12 weeks).
> just bought a couple of resistance bands to help as no way will i be hauling this 17odd stone up in the air without _some_ help...:doublesho
> will remember this about using negatives though....:thumb:
> 
> what programme are you doing phil..?
> rgds stu


Stu, the SL workout isn't just a 12 week program, some people stay on it for years. If it is working then no need to change. SL changes from 5x5, 3x5 then 1x5 depending on how many times you have deloaded.

Negative chins are very good and they are one of the best ways to improve your chin up numbers. There are a few different types to try, jump chins, negative chins and timed chins. You also have flexed hang and dead hangs. I think with chins you can mix and match and throw then in between other exercises for some extra volume.

I used a band before for higher rep work and it worked very well for me but like everything they have their place and work different for different people.


----------



## sfstu

cheers bod42...i know the SL carries on after the 1st 12 weeks but for myself, still not 100% about doing squats 3 times a week for one thing and although it is working for me and i like the simplicity of it i wouldn't mind trying some other similar style programmes, like the AFP that phil mentioned earlier...? as said, i would also like to add some other exercises maybe..?
read a few posts back about splitting your training year into 3 or 4 parts and once i've done the 1st 12 weeks of SL i'm gonna regard that as my 1st quarter of the year then maybe try something different but similar to SL for the next quarter...
i remember a few years back when i used to do weight training (pretty poor attempt at it it's gotta be said!) that it was the thing to do to change your routine every few weeks...have also read recently that that view has now changed back and i can see how programmes like SL can work if stuck to _but_ at the same time i wouldn't want to get bored with doing the exact same routine for evermore...and i don't like doing squats 3 times a week...:devil::lol:

i have never really able to do more than a handful of chins,dips and never been able to do a pullup at all unassisted in the past so really fancy trying to change all that... i think the bands would be a good start for me to try and reach those goals...:thumb:
won't be doing any of that for a little while though...have got next weeks training then off on holiday for a week so as its 6 weeks into SL think a break won't really hurt at the halfway point...? will probably repeat next weeks weights after my week off and carry on for the next 6 weeks and see where i'm at weight/lifting wise...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Ihavent personally tried the APF workout but its looks to be the same template as Starting advanced novice that I did before my current program. It consists of 3x5 and squatting twice per week. It also has dips and chins and I quite enjoyed it.

In theory you will.make the fastest progress by staying on SL but then you have to take the mental aspect into account as well. Are people going to go to the gym and work at 100% if they hate or are bored of the program, in most cases no so its best to change your program. I'm not one to advise changing programs just becuase its hard or boring but then we want to enjoy the gym to.

Either AFP or SS advanced novice will serve you well


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I've been trying to work out the best way to keep achieving my powerlifting goals & also make a start on reducing some body fat & getting in some conditioning/fitness.
> I could be asking a bit much of myself. I would like you opinions please guys.
> 
> *Week 1:
> Workout days = Dynamic stretches - 6x various weight warm up sets up to a max of 60% of my max weight - 1X5 reps, concentrating on strength only.
> On two of the non-training days do up to 45 minutes Muay Thai, with the possibility of increasing to 60 minutes max.*
> 
> *Week 2:
> Workout days= Dynamic stretches - 6x various weight warm up sets up to a max of 60% of my max weight - 2 x 5 sets of 10 reps boring but big assistance/mass/volume work.
> On two of the non-training days do up to 45 minutes Muay Thai, with the possibility of increasing to 60 minutes max.*
> 
> Alternating from week 1 to week 2 each month will give me two weeks powerlifting & two weeks mass/volume/assistance work. Obviously the 2 X 5 sets 10 rep (Mass/volume/assistance week) is well within my capability. As I get into it I plan to mix it up with other Compound exercises (chins, pull ups, dips, barbell shrugs). The 1X5 is also well within my capability, if I feel that my recovery with this routine is good I may also add another 1X5X10, but no more.
> 
> Problem is, I think I'm doing far too well, I'm feeling very strong, but I'm also feeling a bit sluggish/unfit & some of my joints have recently been a little sore in the mornings. I'm beginning to see why many power lifters cycle their training, even though i'm so close to my Squat & deadlift goals, I think I need to give the rest of body a little bit of time to catch up.
> 
> I would like you opinions please guys :thumb:


Doug u are doing extremely well but we do this to feel stronger and fitter. At your weights I would seriously suggest a deload every 4th week or 6 at most. I felt dead after 3weeks and half way through my deload week I felt **** and remember saying to the Mrs that i feel **** but a few days later I felt great and the gym feels better again. Your breaking your body down especially on your deads and squats, you just can't do that week after week. Some powerlifters only deadlift once per month due to the massive strain on the XMas. And they are taking in massive amounts of calories while your lowering yours.

I'm dieting in 7weeks time but want to keep my strength up and gain a little muscle so I changed my workout to suit that.

Also mate you say the 5/3/1 seems complicated but you do realise your program is 95% the same. You just do the 5s week all the time and do lower reps on the 2sets before your work set. If your program is that close I would listen to the man himself for what to do next.

Stu ab work is fine but squats and deadlifts will.smash your abs when you first start. If your keen on doing some I stay away from crunches and concentrate on core work like planks, roll outs etc. If you can do.advanced planks and full standing roll outs then your have some sick abs and stupid core strength


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Med Ball shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 45kg 5x5, 45c11
Dips: BW 5, 5, 5kg x 12
Chins: BW x 6 x 3 with added killer negative

I have driver over 400km today so like 6hours plus in the seat so shoulders and back didn't feel great so the first set felt like bum. But after that i started flaring my lats and its like you get a boost out of the bottom, pretty pleased with 11 reps as had maybe 2more in me.

I love dips and I love the feeling of loading them up but I can feel them pulling on my bad shoulder so i need to be careful especially as in 2 weeks I will be doing them with 20kg added weight.

Chins were ok but after all this talk of negatives, I thought I throw one in at the end. Probably held myself at the top for a min and my lats were burning then resisting all the way down. Threw a couple in while training the Mrs who did 20kg x 4 x 5 then 20kg x 12 with less than 2mins rest on the bench so she coming along


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug u are doing extremely well but we do this to feel stronger and fitter. At your weights I would seriously suggest a deload every 4th week or 6 at most. I felt dead after 3weeks and half way through my deload week I felt **** and remember saying to the Mrs that i feel **** but a few days later I felt great and the gym feels better again. Your breaking your body down especially on your deads and squats, you just can't do that week after week. Some powerlifters only deadlift once per month due to the massive strain on the XMas. And they are taking in massive amounts of calories while your lowering yours.
> 
> I'm dieting in 7weeks time but want to keep my strength up and gain a little muscle so I changed my workout to suit that.
> 
> Also mate you say the 5/3/1 seems complicated but you do realise your program is 95% the same. You just do the 5s week all the time and do lower reps on the 2sets before your work set. If your program is that close I would listen to the man himself for what to do next.


I have to agree James, I've come to the same conclusion mate. I'm lifting weights that are now really hitting me very hard :devil::devil:

I cannot complain, I think managing to get this far before encountering a slight burn out is really good :thumb:

Lol!!!! I've been reading the 5/3/1 over the last two days (Stop reading my mind James!!!) :lol::lol:

I think to advance now to my final phase i need to go back a step or two. I think my biggest problem is i was finding it hard to reduce my weights to do the 5/3/1, i've worked so hard to get them, to lower them seems a little of a defeat, but i think it will pay off in the long run & enable me to keep progressing to my goals :thumb:

I'll lock up my ego & throw away the key  

In a way the starting light will probalby give me some well needed rest & recovery while I build up again, Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa hate being weak!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::devil: 

Right thats out of my system  :thumb:

Thanks for your help & support mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have to agree James, I've come to the same conclusion mate. I'm lifting weights that are now really hitting me very hard :devil::devil:
> 
> I cannot complain, I think managing to get this far before encountering a slight burn out is really good :thumb:
> 
> Lol!!!! I've been reading the 5/3/1 over the last two days (Stop reading my mind James!!!) :lol::lol:
> 
> I think to advance now to my final phase i need to go back a step or two. I think my biggest problem is i was finding it hard to reduce my weights to do the 5/3/1, i've worked so hard to get them, to lower them seems a little of a defeat, but i think it will pay off in the long run & enable me to keep progressing to my goals :thumb:
> 
> I'll lock up my ego & throw away the key
> 
> In a way the starting light will probalby give me some well needed rest & recovery while I build up again, Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa hate being weak!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::devil:
> 
> Right thats out of my system  :thumb:
> 
> Thanks for your help & support mate :thumb:


When you talk about lowering your weights are you meaning the deload week or the starting at 90% for 5/3/1.

The deload week will help you progress I think faster in the long run and as for the 90% that's not really a step backstreet as your still go to near failure so the workouts your building the weight back up aren't at all wasted.

Your 1x5 program seems to be working so I keep everything the same but throw a reload in there somewhere, this will hopefully allow you to keep hitting your full on workouts without over stressing the body. I also find deloads give you a new stimulus, I haven't been sore for ages but when I deload I'm always really sore the week back which means its getting your body out of what its used to within just a week


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> When you talk about lowering your weights are you meaning the deload week or the starting at 90% for 5/3/1.
> 
> The deload week will help you progress I think faster in the long run and as for the 90% that's not really a step backstreet as your still go to near failure so the workouts your building the weight back up aren't at all wasted.
> 
> Your 1x5 program seems to be working so I keep everything the same but throw a reload in there somewhere, this will hopefully allow you to keep hitting your full on workouts without over stressing the body. I also find *cellars* give you a new stimulus, I haven't been sore for ages but when I deload I'm always really sore the week back which means its getting your body out of what its used to within just a week


Lowering to 90% as per the book :thumb:

^^^^^^Cellars?? James

I'm actually now ok with doing the 5/3/1, I will see how it goes and I had to give it a try some time, so now is as good as any mate. It will help me get some recovery in for the first month :thumb:

I can always chuck in a week of my straight 1X5 with my normal heavy weights from time to time, after all my only sticking point has just been recovery.

I'm 44 in a few days, to do what I'm doing & to have gotten away with going heavy for over 8 months is good going any way I look at it. I'm feeling very positive about my future progress, in fact I think this brief de load will actually do more good :thumb:

5/3/1 here I come!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Lowering to 90% as per the book :thumb:
> 
> ^^^^^^Cellars?? James
> 
> I'm actually now ok with doing the 5/3/1, I will see how it goes and I had to give it a try some time, so now is as good as any mate. It will help me get some recovery in for the first month :thumb:
> 
> I can always chuck in a week of my straight 1X5 with my normal heavy weights from time to time, after all my only sticking point has just been recovery.
> 
> I'm 44 in a few days, to do what I'm doing & to have gotten away with going heavy for over 8 months is good going any way I look at it. I'm feeling very positive about my future progress, in fact I think this brief de load will actually do more good :thumb:
> 
> 5/3/1 here I come!!!!!


Cellars is my stupid HTC changing words automatically and I can't check what I written. Sorry about that, i noticed one of my earlier posts was supposed to be CNS and it came out something random.

If your feeling Abit warn down mate you should maybe start with the deload week to start just to give the body a break.

The biggest problem with 5/3/1 is I have read quite a few people who make great gains on everything except squats but I think this program will be good for you as you progressed well on 1x5 and its similar.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cellars is my stupid HTC changing words automatically and I can't check what I written. Sorry about that, i noticed one of my earlier posts was supposed to be CNS and it came out something random.
> 
> If your feeling Abit warn down mate you should maybe start with the deload week to start just to give the body a break.
> 
> The biggest problem with 5/3/1 is I have read quite a few people who make great gains on everything except squats but I think this program will be good for you as you progressed well on 1x5 and its similar.


 Cheers James,

Im just working out my first months training, it doesnt seem to be TBH. Yes I agree a nice deload week to get back into training will be great for my poor old bones!!! :thumb: :lol::lol: :thumb:

CNS?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just doing my week 3 of 5/3/1.

Last set of bench press is 95%, TBH its only one step back from were I am now :thumb:

Im sure the squat, deadlift & OHP will be similar  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

CNS = central nervous system

Your muscles can be fine after a hard deadlift or squat session but it puts a massive stress on your CNS which can sometimes take longer to recover.

Doug I would suggest doing the 90% but the entire reason wendler suggests that is that everyone over estimates their 1RM but you know your 5RM spot on but the 90% will give you a break

Off to take my motor bike test training thingy now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> CNS = central nervous system
> 
> Your muscles can be fine after a hard deadlift or squat session but it puts a massive stress on your CNS which can sometimes take longer to recover.
> 
> Doug I would suggest doing the 90% but the entire reason wendler suggests that is that everyone over estimates their 1RM but you know your 5RM spot on but the 90% will give you a break
> 
> Off to take my motor bike test training thingy now.


Cheers James,

I'm going to stick with the 90% option as per the book, as by week 3 of the first month i will be already very close to my usual training weights. The variation in training method & slightly lighter weights will give me a bit of a break too.

To be honest it's no big deal, in fact I'm grateful that I have the genetics to progress so quickly.

Best of luck with your test mate, be safe :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

been doing some reading on ironstrong site that barefacedgeek/phil posted the link to AFP to...think i'm definately going to give that routine a go after i've finished the 1st 12 weeks of SL...

but while reading up on there i've realised that though i've made a start on the training side of things:thumb:, where i'm totally stuck is diet...
tbh, i have no idea what/how much i should be eating..? been doing some reading on IS on diets but it really seems so complicated and am now getting a little despondant with it all due to info overload!!! just don't know where to start...

so, where do i start with diet...? how much should i be eating and what of...?
goals would be the usual, lose fat-build muscle...
i know thats not that easy to do but i also know with the right diet and time and continuing training i could get where i need to be, not overnight, but i would like to start seeing _some_ fat loss goals some time soon...

am hoping that someone can point me towards a relatively simple diet (lotta meals away from home=packed lunch basically) that i can follow..? don't really know how to properly work out how many calories i should be eating and what exactly they should consist of..?

not much to ask, i know...:doublesho

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stu,

I've been reading on info regarding diet/fat lose/building muscle.

To do all this in one go can be very difficult because when you aim to lose body fat you will invariably lose some muscle mass too. Why? Because you will be attempting to create a calorie deficiency with your eating regime so that your body burns fat, this also makes it very hard to keep all your hard earned muscle mass. It is a natural part of how your body works.

You need to decide on your ultimate/future goals.

I will give you mine as an example to help you decide.

My Main goal is to be strong, to gauge this I have set myself weight goals for 5 reps on three lifts: Bench press 130KgX5- Deadlift 200KgX5 - Squat 200kgX5. The overhead press is now part of this group but I have only just started doing it so I have no clear goal, yet.

My second goal is to be fit: I'm starting my Muay Thai next week; punch bag is going up today. I'll be doing a max of 45 mins twice a week while I'm in my strength phase.

My remaining goals are tied in with each other: Weight/ body fat percentage/fitness: I would like to weight at least 95Kg with a body fat of 15%, if by the time I reach the 15% body fat mark & I'm lighter, I will then change my diet slightly to add some more weight. 
I think with 15% body fat, abs will not show a great deal, this doesn't bother me as looking good is the lowest of my priorities. I want to be Strong, fit & healthy :thumb:

As for diet Stu, as you are in my age group, again you now need to make goals. As you all know I had to take this week off after being burnt out a bit, several factors have possibly caused this, just started to reduce my calories/carbs/ been training max weight for 8 months with very few breaks/recovery has taken a bit of a bashing.
So there is the magic word: Recovery, I think you said you have a family, I don't so I'm able to get plenty of rest & sleep. My average hours of sleep per night = 8-9 hours, that's probably a big factor in my ability to keep going & progress very well at my age.

I hope by showing you my goals that you understand this is not easy, even for those of us who are doing well.

You mentioned that you may purchase the same power rack & bench as myself, I would say only go this far if you plan to lift heavy, there is plenty of much cheaper kit out there (I can help you decide) which will give you all that you need.

Back to the diet; I found this to be excellent, Keep it plain & simple: http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-diet-muscle-gains-strength-building-fat-loss/

Here is my typical day's food intake doestn change much at all, easy to follow :thumb:

7AM 500ml Skimmed milk, 500ml water

*10AM 3X boiled eggs
1pm 2X chicken breast sandwiches (Brown bread)
3pm 100grams nuts*

6-5:30pm Main meal can be one of either (Salmon, 3X pork chops, 2X chicken breasts) with either a Fresh salad sprinkled with various seeds or veg - asparagus, boiled or jacket potatoes, broccoli, peas, courgettes green beans etc..etc..
8pm 100grams nuts or seeds with a 500ml glass of skimmed milk

The above in bold is my pack lunch for work :thumb:

Edit, the above is a lot of food for me 

On week days my daily fluid intake is 4-4.5 litres (2-2.5 litres Water, 1 litre skimmed milk, one 500ml mug of decaf coffee & one 500ml can of monster as my daily junk treat) Weekends i lower it to around 3-3.5 litres.

And yes ive done a full 360 & dont bother with suppliments except for joint care -Cod liver oil & "ChondroMax" (500mg Glucosamine & 400mg Chondroitin)


----------



## sfstu

firstly, many thanks for such an in depth and long reply doug..! appreciate the time invested in it...:thumb:
goals wise, i _do_ want to be strong,fit and healthy but in addition to this i want to look good too! i know that sounds a little shallow maybe but i've been out of shape for so long, it really bothers me how i look and how my clothes fit? that's why i keep going on about weight loss which i know is a little contradictory to what i'm doing weightswise maybe...i'm thinking of my current programme of SL as a foundation for muscle building/body transformation (maybe that words a little optimistic!).

as i said in a previous post, i'd love to BP 100kgs and deadlift and squat 150 kgs but in all honesty they're just numbers and i think the quality of what i'm doing and how i look/feel is just as important to me..?
i'm 17.5stone which if was solid muscle wouldn't really bother me but ideally would like to be a stone or 2 lighter but still muscular...(i know i keep confusing weightloss with fatloss!)...

maybe i should've started myself off with a couple of months of weightloss training before starting on the SL but was/am hoping that longterm i _can_ still lose fat and build muscle doing what i'm doing...don't really want to stop lifting weights now having finally gotten started after thinking about it but not doing anything about it for years...

restwise, it _is_ more difficult with a family (i have 3 young sons!) but i do tend to get 7-8hrs most of the time which is an improvement on a few months ago when i was averaging 5 or 6 hrs a night during the week..:doublesho

with regards the power rack/bench, i maybe don't need one quite as heavy rated as yours, as being realistic i don't think i will get to the kind of heavy weights you're doing? can't see myself really getting into the powerlifting thing big style as i just don't think i could devote that much time/energy etc to it..have looked at the rack/bench model below the one you have a couple of times and i think weight wise this would be sufficient...will need to get a rack soon though as i'm doing it all free at the mo which i can see becoming an issue confidence wise soon..

have read that link to the SL diet advice a couple of times now and i think i'm on the right lines with _what_ i'm eating its just the _amounts_ i'm not too sure of..? drink a lot more water these days and have cut down on tea/coffee and soft drinks. cut down but not stopped completely..

supplements wise, i take a general multivit everynight plus a codliver oil tablet too and at the mo i am having protein shakes mainly cos i've had a 2.2kg tub of whey protein sat around for the last year or so waiting on me starting the weights! i have one (250mg skimmed milk plus 2 scoops powder) after training but not sure how many times a day to take and whether to take every day or just training day...

rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

to add to the above post...have been eating 3 meals a day rather than eating every few hours partly due to taking maximuscle thermobol capsules (caffiene free)...not really noticed the fatloss but they definately work as an appetite suppressant...have really cut out the snacking on rubbish i used to do all the time so they've been worth it for that alone even its only a placebo effect...
maybe i need to do more than just the weights 3 times a week..? like doing a bit more walking on my off days for example? don't really mind if it slows down my lifting progress max weight, as i said above, not really focused on being able to lift a certain amount of weight, but more important to me is to carry on lifting/training/exercising rather than sitting around doing nothing like i have been doing the last few years...


----------



## Guest

Hi Stu,

I'll post my comments on your squat video here, as I'd like James and Doug to see them too.

I thought your squat technique was pretty good tbh.
The bar position on your shoulders looked fine to me and you are reaching good depth on each rep. It was a little difficult to tell, but I felt your foot positioning was probably fine too.

I'd only consider looking at the following 3 things:
1. The bar looks a little high in the rack to me. Might be worth dropping it a little bit or you may have difficulty racking it if you ever have a particularly exhausting set. I read somewhere that the bar should be about armpit level when racked, which seems about right to me.

2. When you squat you want to keep your neck straight, thus effectively looking at a point on the floor a few feet in front of you. It does look like your head is tilted up a bit.

3. It looks like you squat straight down rather than sit back, which might be putting the bar too far forwards at the bottom of each rep. The bar needs to stay over the middle of your foot. If you start squatting by bending at the knees before, or at the same time as, the hips then this can push the bar forwards. You actually start by bending at the hips and effectively sitting back. It a subtle but important difference.

Hopefully, Doug/James can comment too and provide a better explanation than I have managed.

Hope this helps,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

cheers for reply phil...:thumb:
think my feet positioning is ok...little wider than shoulder width and toes pointing outwards-roughly 10 to 2 position...

will try racking the bar a little lower...am using a smith machine at the moment but with the vertical bars/runners removed so the barbell i'm using has hooks which hook into vertical holes about 2 in apart..? not ideal but will have to do for now til i get a proper rack which i think will be soonish...:thumb:

will remember neck positioning...

just tried a squat with no weight and yes i am starting knees 1st rather than hips 1st and sitting back...probably cos i was concentrating on the hipdrive _upwards_ rather than thinking bout the downwards movement and also i think having a power cage would help me there too confidence wise...

cheers for your comments phil, not as bad as i was expecting from that vid...
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

Tonight's session.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Chins*
WU: None
WO: 7/3/3/2/2/2/[email protected] (BW), [email protected] (BW+10kg)

Squat was quite tough tonight, but not as bad as my last squat session. Think I've got a bit left in me before I stall. Not expecting to get to 5x140kg in straight increments atm.

Bench was pretty tough going too. Last rep of final set was a bit of a grinder, but I managed it so I finally get to break into the 80kgs.

Still pleased with how the chins are going. Started off with just BW and left around 45-60secs between sets. My endurance is dropping quickly on these but that should hopefully improve over the next few weeks. Tried some weighted negatives too. Did try for a 3rd rep but I just dropped to the floor :lol:.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Hi Stu,
> 
> I'll post my comments on your squat video here, as I'd like James and Doug to see them too.
> 
> I thought your squat technique was pretty good tbh.
> The bar position on your shoulders looked fine to me and you are reaching good depth on each rep. It was a little difficult to tell, but I felt your foot positioning was probably fine too.
> 
> I'd only consider looking at the following 3 things:
> 1. The bar looks a little high in the rack to me. Might be worth dropping it a little bit or you may have difficulty racking it if you ever have a particularly exhausting set. I read somewhere that the bar should be about armpit level when racked, which seems about right to me.
> 
> 2. When you squat you want to keep your neck straight, thus effectively looking at a point on the floor a few feet in front of you. It does look like your head is tilted up a bit.
> 
> 3. It looks like you squat straight down rather than sit back, which might be putting the bar too far forwards at the bottom of each rep. The bar needs to stay over the middle of your foot. If you start squatting by bending at the knees before, or at the same time as, the hips then this can push the bar forwards. You actually start by bending at the hips and effectively sitting back. It a subtle but important difference.
> 
> Hopefully, Doug/James can comment too and provide a better explanation than I have managed.
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Phil


Glad to read this post, I replied to Stu and then read this thread and you basically put exactly the same as me. The bar is travelling forward slightly on the decent but other than that it all looks pretty good. Its nice to see someone who is self taught squatting to proper depth. I seen one person in a commercial gym in all my years of training hit depth.

Stu, when starting the easiest way to progress is to write down your goals and when you want to achieve them and then divide them into stages. You will see Doug is very good at this and probably a major factor in his success. Some people say make your goals public so everyone knows about them and helps you achieve them but I find this is a personal choice.

It is very hard for the body to do everything at once so by dividing your goals into stages should make them more easily achievable. Using myself as an example, I want to be strong as my main priority but I have no plans to compete, I want to be fitter and healthier, I want to loose some weight as I decided not to play rugby again so I dont need to be as heavy and as a by product of both of these I wouldnt mind looking good in the old birthday suit. Ok so what are the stages to achieve these goals, I need to put on muscle and strength, I need to work on my fitness and I need to lose fat while maintaining as much muscle as possible. All 3 of these goals wont be achievable at the same time if you want the best results so I broke it down like this. 1 year of Strength Work with eating quite a lot but keeping my weight between 105-110kg then 3 months of cleaner eating, muscle building and fat loss and slowly increasing my fitness, then once I hit 95kg I will start on the strength work again but add in a componant of fitness each workout to keep my fitness up.

Doug is doing similar with similar goals and if you read his posts, he has put on some impressive strength in a short time frame and now he is starting to add in fitness aspects and lower his carbs slightly to loose some weight.

If your strength goals are not such a high priortity you could say do 3-6 months of strength training and then diet. Unless your massively over weight, which your not, then I would always suggest increasing your strength and muscle mass before dieting, it makes the dieting so much easier. I would always choose a weight figure to aim for than a set time as the former will make your work harder. This is a great little trick on cardio as well, never ever run/bike for time, always do it for distance.


----------



## sfstu

gotta get ready for work now and laptop almost dead so will reply this evening and post last nights workout then..:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

My first ever 5/3/1 tonight :doublesho


Yes you guessed it i changed my mind several times after posting I was going to do it  

I feel ive got to a good level of strength now & dont actually mind taking it slower for a while, I'm thinking the variation of the 5/3/1 will allow me to make better gains in the long run, if I see it paying off then I might stick with it as my core routine. Even with 10% off my main lifts, by the end of the first month (week 3) im using almost the same weigths, the only difference is the the reps, so not a big a deal :thumb:

Managed to download 5/3/1 for powerlifters James, thanks mate :thumb:

I set my punch bag up yesterday, perfect! Looking forward to starting this tuesday :thumb:

I've also got a skiping rope with the boxing set, looks like a good way to get some cardio in, thats if i can stop tripping over it!  :lol:


----------



## Bod42

I haven't actually read the powerlifting version so let me know if its any good mate.

You may actually progress faster Doug, who knows. Just because you only put 5kg per month on the bar doesn't mean you only got that much stronger as you could do more reps. The problem with just doing a defined number of reps is what if your body could have done more, 5/3/1 addresses this issue by repping out.

Looking forward to your progress mate. Did you go with 3 or 4days per week


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I haven't actually read the powerlifting version so let me know if its any good mate.
> 
> You may actually progress faster Doug, who knows. Just because you only put 5kg per month on the bar doesn't mean you only got that much stronger as you could do more reps. The problem with just doing a defined number of reps is what if your body could have done more, 5/3/1 addresses this issue by repping out.
> 
> Looking forward to your progress mate. Did you go with 3 or 4days per week


Hi James,

If you need a copy just ask mate  :thumb:

It goes into training cycles for events, off season etc... Not really what I/we need, but still this can be incorporated into a routine when cycling between strength/fitness & fat loss etc... :thumb:

I'm going to follow the 4 day week split mate :thumb:; I would imagine trying to do two workouts in one day way too much, considering I would be adding 4X5 sets of 10 reps assistance exercises :doublesho :devil:

I'm actually starting to look forward to it now; the first two weeks will give me some rest. And as you add 10 pounds (around 5kg to your 90% weight) that's twice my normal rate so for the lower body lifts I may actually move up at around the same pace, not so worried about the upper body lifts as they should progress much slower anyhow.

I think my 1X5 served me very well & I'm sure I'll go back to it from time to time as I think mixing up is another way to encourage growth, I could in fact add it to the end of the 5/3/1 month after the light week. As long as it's constructed around the fundamentals I don't think you need to worry about following these routines to the book. I think if you stick to the basics - Compound exercises - 4 day split- keep an eye on recovery - eat according to your goals, most routines should give results.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Workout & Observations*

Monday's 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (Warm up sets-50 X 5 60 X 5 72 X 3) 78KG X _5_/90KG X _5_/102KG X 5 or more_8_/

BENCH PRESS 5 X 82.5KG 10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

BARBELL ROW 5 X 70KG 10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*

*Observations: I'm being as critical as I can *

*1.* The workout felt more like a bodybuilding workout. Loads of pump :devil:

*2.* I felt pre exhausted due to the first two work sets using 5 reps, I have a big concern that this workout will be hard to progress when the weights get heavier 

*3.* I feel the extra volume will generate more muscle mass, as I don't want to get any bigger I will monitor my weight over the next few months; I'm already 111kg's! :doublesho

*4. *I'm hoping the lower reps on the second & third week make this workout easier to progress :thumb:

*5.* I felt more tired during the whole workout, but after less than an hour after I feel far less fatigued & beat up as I do on my constant 1X5 heavy workout, this could allow for better recovery & cancel out my concerns on point *2* :thumb:

*6.* Because of the "do 5 reps or more" option, I pushed 8, might of done 9 but I wanted to keep fresh for the assistance work sets.
*If I use the 1rep max formula on todays last set, it indicates I can bench 130kg for one rep :doublesho Im very sceptical *

*7.* As the workout gets heavier I may have to do only the prescribed sets, no sure how this will go a the moment.

I'm sure the guys who understand the biology/physiology behind all this will be able to explain how just a few changes can make this workout feel so very different to my original 1X5 :thumb:

Although I have purposely been as critical as I can, I'm actually positive about the 5/3/1, at the end of the day it's different so It will feel very different. I'm not saying it will be better for me or worse. I think the biggest change will be 3 X work sets :devil:

I will continue to use the 5/3/1 for a few months & asses my progress, the critical points above are to generate some feedback on the points made.

A very positive aspect of this workout is on the heavy (week 3) you lower the reps on the work sets to 5/3/1, which will help with focus & motivation to push hard on the heavy week :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Monday's 5/3/1
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (Warm up sets-50 X 5 60 X 5 72 X 3) 78KG X _5_/90KG X _5_/102KG X 5 or more_8_/
> 
> BENCH PRESS 5 X 82.5KG 10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/
> 
> BARBELL ROW 5 X 70KG 10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*
> 
> *Observations: I'm being as critical as I can *
> 
> *1.* The workout felt more like a bodybuilding workout. Loads of pump :devil:
> 
> *2.* I felt pre exhausted due to the first two work sets using 5 reps, I have a big concern that this workout will be hard to progress when the weights get heavier
> 
> *3.* I feel the extra volume will generate more muscle mass, as I don't want to get any bigger I will monitor my weight over the next few months; I'm already 111kg's! :doublesho
> 
> *4. *I'm hoping the lower reps on the second & third week make this workout easier to progress :thumb:
> 
> *5.* I felt more tired during the whole workout, but after less than an hour after I feel far less fatigued & beat up as I do on my constant 1X5 heavy workout, this could allow for better recovery & cancel out my concerns on point *2* :thumb:
> 
> *6.* Because of the "do 5 reps or more" option, I pushed 8, might of done 9 but I wanted to keep fresh for the assistance work sets.
> *If I use the 1rep max formula on todays last set, it indicates I can bench 130kg for one rep :doublesho Im very sceptical *
> 
> *7.* As the workout gets heavier I may have to do only the prescribed sets, no sure how this will go a the moment.
> 
> I'm sure the guys who understand the biology/physiology behind all this will be able to explain how just a few changes can make this workout feel so very different to my original 1X5 :thumb:
> 
> Although I have purposely been as critical as I can, I'm actually positive about the 5/3/1, at the end of the day it's different so It will feel very different. I'm not saying it will be better for me or worse. I think the biggest change will be 3 X work sets :devil:
> 
> I will continue to use the 5/3/1 for a few months & asses my progress, the critical points above are to generate some feedback on the points made.
> 
> A very positive aspect of this workout is on the heavy (week 3) you lower the reps on the work sets to 5/3/1, which will help with focus & motivation to push hard on the heavy week :thumb:


The first 2 sets will exhaust you to start with but its surprising how quickly you adapt. I was doing 5 mins rest between my Lower Body exercises and Im now doing 3 mins. The first couple of weeks on 5 x 10 I was totally shagged during the workout but now I feel fine as my body has adapted to the 3 mins. Your body is used to 1-3 reps on your warm up and your now doing 5 reps so it will take a little getting used to. Dont drop those sets though as Wendler says he looked into this but you get better results with the first 2 sets.

Your lowering your carbs so doubt you will get bigger, a little extra muscle never hurts anyway especially if your starting to add more fitness and clean up the diet.

The lower reps will help with strength but for the first few weeks/months you may be doing higher than 5 reps even on your week 3 workouts. I bet if you did the exact workout weight next week you get a lot more than 8 reps as your body will get used to the higher reps. I been doing higher reps than 5/3/1 and my strength is still going up faster than it was.

I wouldnt ever keep fresh for your assistance exercises, the first exercise is the bread and butter of the workout. Wendler suggests leaving 1 rep in the Tank on 5s week but smashing it on the 3s and 5/3/1 week.

I wouldnt be sceptical, the calculations isnt an exact science but most people can do 8 reps for approx 70% of their 1RM so this seems about rght. Obviously different people have different ratio of fast and slow twitch fibres and different muscles give out at heavier weights but I bet you could get pretty close to this. The Wendler formula works better at lower reps so it will be more accurate on your later weeks.

Wendler says a lot of people would progress better just doing the prescribed reps so nothing wrong with doing that in the future but have faith buddy I bet it be along time before you have to just do the prescribed reps. I was very surprised how quickly I was able to do more reps with more weight on the Juggernaut Program.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi James,

Have to say I agree with your comments, the extra reps will feel much easier as my body gets fitter & adapts to a slightly higher rep routine. Generally I have found after the first week you adapt & find the longer sets much easier :thumb:
First thing I noticed this morning is I don’t feel any way near as tired (Up before 6AM :thumb: ) my joints feel really good too, so straight away I can see benefits from varying the training load over a month. 

BBB work, I agree, I will focus on the work sets & take what comes with the BBB sets, I will also be sticking to the same weight for the BBB & only add 2.5kg once per month as long as I achieve 5X10. I will lower any BBB work if I can’t get the full 5X10 on the heaviest week.

My overall impression of the 5/3/1 is very good. Due to the slow progress it may take much longer to reach my goals, however I think it will be far healthier & that’s the point, if getting strong means being unhealthy I see no point in it. At my old pace the deadlift would have been finished in 6-7 weeks, I’m enjoying the training so this way I prolong the journey that I’m enjoying so much & also I think it will give better fitness results. 

Squats tonight :thumb: :devil:


----------



## sfstu

hi guys...:wave: reading some of your above posts and gotta admit, haven't a clue how some of your routines work (seem so complicated:doublesho) but theres some serious weight being lifted..:doublesho:thumb:
normally do my 3 workouts mon,weds,fri but as this week i had a v.long day at work mon and am going on holiday on fri, this week am doing my workouts sun,tues,thurs...

so, sundays workout...
*squat 57.5kg 5x5
OHP 37.5kg 5x5
deadlift 70kg 2x5*
as i think was obvious from previous posts/pms, struggled a bit with the squat, feeling a bit wobbly on the form _but_ not as bad as i feared..:thumb:
OHP was hard, but doable and very pleased with that as shoulders always been my weakest point and thought i may have stalled on that by now...
deadlift was ok,still feels like a cheat to do only 1 set of 5,so i did an extra set 

my god, did my legs and backside feel sore yesterday...:doublesho must have reached the certain weight on squats where my body really had to work for the sets and i really felt it yesterday and a little today...good feeling tho...:devil:

todays workout...

*squat 57.5kg 5x5
bench press 42.5kg 5x5
BBrows 50kg 5x5
planks 3x10secs*

after sundays struggle with the squats, had decided to keep the weight the same today (plus being unsure whether to train harder through DOMS or not?)...
and it felt ok today... hard, but doable so will carry on putting the weight up by 2.5kg each time...think i hit a phsycological barrier on sunday but thanks to you guys for the confidence boost i went for it today...:thumb:
bench press was again hard but doable, felt a twinge in my right shoulder at the start of one of the sets so stopped and readjusted myself on the bench and it was ok then...
BBBrows went fine too tho i think i will check some vids for form check...

all in all, workouts starting to get, if not hard, then certainly not easy any more but thats what i've been waiting for and as my body is obviously growing stronger am really enjoying it...got one more workout this week on thurs then off on hol fri for a week (sunny:lol: weymouth) so taking a week off which is right at the halfway point through this programme then continuing when i get back, maybe repeating this weeks weights for 1st couple of workouts...

with regards goals, mine are somewhat similar to what bod42 said on his post on previous page..? think i'm going to carry on with SL for the full 12 weeks then try the AF'nP for 12 weeks then see where i'm at...gonna stop worrying about my weight and take a leaf from you guys book and concentrate on strength first then see whats what after 6 months strength training....:thumb:

rgds stu

p.s.put my worktrousers on monday morning and they don't feel quite as tight...!:thumb:


----------



## Oats

*Wendler 5\3\1 Cycle 1 Week 4*

*Deload week*. 80% of previous maxes and less assistance work. Had a really hectic week at work and home. Bit peeved that I didn't do any of the extra things I wanted to try out like ab work, hill sprints or cycling. On the plus side the kiddies have a newly painted and built playhouse so they're happy :argie: Deload week fell at the perfect time really.



sfstu said:


> my god, did my legs and backside feel sore yesterday...
> after sundays struggle with the squats, had decided to keep the weight the same today (plus being unsure whether to train harder through DOMS or not?)...


I've found, and expect others will agree, that the hardest part about DOMS is getting warmed up. Once you start to work out it eases off, and unless crippling, isn't a reason back off or delay a session. I've had days when i couldn't get down the stairs without holding onto the handrail, but that nights session was fine.



sfstu said:


> ...gonna stop worrying about my weight and take a leaf from you guys book and concentrate on strength first then see whats what after 6 months strength training....:thumb:
> p.s.put my worktrousers on monday morning and they don't feel quite as tight...!:thumb:


Hallalujah!!:lol:



ITHAQVA said:


> Have to say I agree with your comments, the extra reps will feel much easier as my body gets fitter & adapts to a slightly higher rep routine. Generally I have found after the first week you adapt & find the longer sets much easier :thumb:
> First thing I noticed this morning is I don't feel any way near as tired (Up before 6AM :thumb: ) my joints feel really good too, so straight away I can see benefits from varying the training load over a month.
> :


I'd be interested to see what happens when you introduce new exercises after doing the same ones for eight months. I was crippled by lunges on the first week :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesdays 5/3/1

*SQUAT 74X5 92X5 110X3 120KGX _5_/ 140KGX_5_/ 157KGX5 or more_6_/

BBB

SQUAT 100KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

CALF RAISE 110KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*

All felt good, the last work set was the hardest, but didn't feel too heavy a start weight.

I've got slight DOMS from yesterday's workout (Pec's, Triceps, shoulders & upper back) :thumb:

Start conditioning tomorrow: 15 minutes Muay Thai :devil: Hopefully when i get good at it I'll be able to shoot fireballs from my hands :devil:


----------



## Guest

Tuesday's session. A night of almost nearly's...

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], 0/[email protected]  

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/5/[email protected]

*Chins*
WO: 1/2/3/[email protected], 1/2/[email protected], 1/2/[email protected], [email protected] (all @BW)

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: -3/[email protected]

Was planning on only reaching 5x160kg, as last sessions 8x145kg meant that I should be able to get that. My e1RM of 180kg seemed so close that I thought I'd try for it. Got 2x170kg so it was looking hopeful.
First pull of 180kg I only managed 1/4 rep before going very light headed. Dumped the bar and grabbed onto an upright of my rack to steady myself until it passed.
Second pull, a few mins later, did not move off the floor. Oh well, tonight was not the night . I did learn one thing though - 180kg is F'n heavy!

Press went better than expected. I was, in all honesty, not expecting to get 5 reps on any of the sets this time around. I wonder if my chins have been helping here?
Decided just to do BW ladders on the chins. Quite pleased that I managed a total of 24 reps.

Bench was all negative reps tonight. Just going to try these out once a week and see how they go. They might help to improve my lagging bench or they might not.
Worked up to 95kg because it is just over my e1RM and also my body weight. I really need to lose some weight :lol:

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Sled Drags: 22.5 kg - 6 x 15m with 45 secs rest
Deadlifts: 125 x 5 x 5, 125 x 9
Front Squats: 72.5 x 5, 82.5 x 5, 92.5x5
Passed on Ab and Grip Work

Sleds felt good and actually gassed me more than I thought they would.

Setting your rep goals is a weird process, the 5th rep of the 5th set was really slow and didnt feel great and I was like oh siht no way will I get 9. The 1st rep flew off the floor and I got to 6 reps in what felt like record time and the next 3 reps were good as well. Left 1-2 in the Tank.

Front Squats were a killer. They hit my abs and core so hard. My legs are strong enough but after Deads my abs are fried and I struggle to keep my body upright but I still got 5 reps on the last set. I only leave 90 seconds between each set so this obviously makes things harder.

Overall very pleased with my workout because I had one hell of a week and I dont think I ever been so stressed. On the way home I was thinking Im way to stressed to go to the gym but then thought Im well to stressed not to go. Pleased with all the stuff happening to keep my progress going.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> *Dead*
> WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
> WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], 0/[email protected]
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


I'm not surprised you failed at 180 Phil you bloody Lunatic!!!!! :doublesho, the older they get the sillier they get  :lol:

Try just doing the warm up sets then the 180, you'll probably be able to rep out with it then mate :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

One word to say about this morning...........DOMS!!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho 

Not bad to effect my range of movment, but still not had DOMS for a while.

The odd thing is I'm not really do much more than before, it must be down to the extra work sets as ive been doing the BBB for weeks.

To add to my comments regarding the 5/3/1.

It’s very similar to my 1X5, as the weight goes up you de load your reps :thumb: I see the logic in this. But that’s were the similarity ends 

The workouts feel harder in their own way, but after the workout i don’t feel utterly destroyed all evening, within less than an hour I’ve got energy again & in the morning I’m waking up feeling awake, unlike before on my 1X5 I woke up with some stiffness in my joints & very often took ages to wake up 

I like the way it progresses with weight but lowers the reps as you progress, this will allow for that all out set (week 3 last work set) :devil:

I like the idea you get a whole week of light work, again setting you up for the next cycle :thumb:

The more I look at the 5/3/1, the more I see how & why it is structured the way it is & why it should work for almost everyone :thumb:

Its only major downfall that I can see so far is, if you fail utterly on week 3, you lose a month’s progress. However I think if you’re motivated enough & listen to the advice of starting with lighter weights, you’ll adapt to the program & failures shouldn’t happen very often if at all :thumb:

Also a thing to remember is Wendler as with any good power lifter will be in this game for 10 years, follow this program for a few years & I get the feeling you’ll progress in a steady way that is better for health & motivation :thumb:

Look at me & my 1X5, less than 12 months & I would be using 200kg on my deadlift & squat :doublesho Yes good progress but at what cost, I was starting to feel tired & sore. I cannot deny even I thought to myself that my progress was too fast & my body wasn’t keeping up with my strength. I understood this & in my defence I commented about this on this thread  

The 5/3/1 will allow me to enjoy progress at a rate that will allow me to continue in safety & enjoy the sport much more :thumb: 

Once you get your head around the program it’s actually quite simple & the variation makes it more interesting than just bashing out the same routine every week. I’m sure for the long haul this routine will keep motivation/progress high :thumb:

So far I like 5/3/1, however, weeks 2 & 3 are the real tests :devil:  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wenesday workout:
Med ball chest throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 82.5x2, 92.5x2, 100 x 5, 5, 5, 8
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x3, 72.5x3, 80x6
Dips: BW x 10, 9, 9, 7, 6

Bench was be far the worst It's been since I started this program, even my med ball throws were pathetic, I had like zero power. My shoulder was clicking on the negative of every rep which isn't good. I had trouble even getting my 70kg warm up out of the rack. I'm going to put this bad workout down to deadlifting last night and you need your lats to bench heavy.

Rows were slow, very slow but again I put this down to deadlifts.

Dips felt really good on the first few sets but I find I loose reps really fast with 9 0 seconds rest and 5 sets. May try a slightly different way of approaching these as I have stalled slightly but its hard to gauge as I'm always doing them after heavy bench press


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wenesday workout:
> Med ball chest throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 82.5x2, 92.5x2, 100 x 5, 5, 5, 8
> Pendlay Rows: 62.5x3, 72.5x3, 80x6
> Dips: BW x 10, 9, 9, 7, 6
> 
> Bench was be far the worst It's been since I started this program, even my med ball throws were pathetic, I had like zero power. My shoulder was clicking on the negative of every rep which isn't good. I had trouble even getting my 70kg warm up out of the rack. I'm going to put this bad workout down to deadlifting last night and you need your lats to bench heavy.
> 
> Rows were slow, very slow but again I put this down to deadlifts.
> 
> Dips felt really good on the first few sets but I find I loose reps really fast ith 9 0 seconds rest and 5 sets. May try a slightly different way of approaching these as I have stalled slightly but its hard to gauge as I'm always doing them after heavy bench press


I have to be honest the Juggernaut isn't for me, but what are your thoughts on it James. Are you any stronger for doing it? I imagine your fitness is much better though.

In regards to the dips, mate, after doing your bench & rows, you should just accept what you get, don't beat yourself up (You sound just like me, we want it all ) After all if you did your dips before the bench you know you would possibly not make your designated Bench press reps. Regardless of rest, pre exhaustion happens.

Once you've done your bench the rest is just assistance work. If you do heavier work sets your assistance work sets will start to suffer once you reach your optimum weights. When I was going heavy (115kg work set) I had to build up my assistance bench from a pretty low weight & then only now do I do 82.5Kg 5 sets of 10. My approach was keep adding weight, but once I stalled & didn't reach 5 sets of 10 reps I would stay on the same weight until I did.

Beside which mate youve lifted 100Kg 5,5,5,8. Thats good going IMHO :thumb: :thumb:

Above all mate, youre still shifting some good weights & reps mate, regardless :thumb:, onward & upward James :devil: :thumb:


----------



## avit88

hey guys im really enjoying 5x5 now getting well into it  

anyway today at the gym I could not believe it!

i was on the mats warming up and doing dynamic stretches- i move away for one second and these two guys come up and stand it the spot they've seen me working out in (the rest of the mat area is empty) 

I thought oh great what a troll we have here , so i politely ask hiim to move as i was working there. Immediately he starts giving me a load of babble talk I call it this as its normally a load of f words mixed with a few other verbs lol

i was like look mate ive ask u politely what is ur problem? Then he threatened to smack me around the head with this bar i was doing shoulder dislocations with

at this point i was like god what is the point he just wasnt worth it.

Notice there is always 2 of them.... 

I stood up properly and said "go on then" taken aback he comes out with more babble talk so i just turned away and carried on- he jsut walked away 

I was like what a total moron. Anyone else had an experience like this?

I was determined not to rise to him and for it not to spoil my workout.


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> hey guys im really enjoying 5x5 now getting well into it
> 
> anyway today at the gym I could not believe it!
> 
> i was on the mats warming up and doing dynamic stretches- i move away for one second and these two guys come up and stand it the spot they've seen me working out in (the rest of the mat area is empty)
> 
> I thought oh great what a troll we have here , so i politely ask hiim to move as i was working there. Immediately he starts giving me a load of babble talk I call it this as its normally a load of f words mixed with a few other verbs lol
> 
> i was like look mate ive ask u politely what is ur problem? Then he threatened
> to smack me around the head with this bar i was doing shoulder dislocations with
> 
> at this point i was like god what is the point he just wasnt worth it.
> 
> Notice there is always 2 of them....
> 
> I stood up properly and said "go on then" taken aback he comes out with more babble talk so i just turned away and carried on- he jsut walked away
> 
> I was like what a total moron. Anyone else had an experience like this?
> 
> I was determined not to rise to him and for it not to spoil my workout.


I've never had this problem in life let alone in a gym :devil: 

I train at home Avit, have used gyms less than five times in my whole life :thumb: 

Unfortunately mate the sport of playing with weights will always attract over competitive males with ego's the size of elephants 

You did what you had to & didnt rise to them :thumb:

Glad you're enjoying your 5X5 :thumb:

I would say join in here with us guys, post your workouts & use us as your virtual training partners. There is a lot of info & help to be gained here :thumb:

I'm glad you stood up to the C**K twins; they play the safety in numbers game. Makes me wish I was there to correct them :devil: I hate it when people intimidate others in a gym, it's so out of order, bullying is bullying no matter how you dress it up & its an ugly human trait, you were the better man :thumb:

If you know of any gyms that cater for mainly power lifting & strongman, I would go there :thumb:

How many weeks have you been doing 5X5 Avit?


----------



## avit88

yeah it still bugs me.

i like my gym and cant work out at home unfortunately. 

ive got friday to do then im in week 4


----------



## ITHAQVA

avit88 said:


> yeah it still bugs me.
> 
> i like my gym and cant work out at home unfortunately.
> 
> ive got friday to do then im in week 4


Never mind the idiots mate, you stick to your routine, keep focused.

4 weeks is good going mate, many pack it in after weeks 1 & 2 :thumb:

Onward & upward!!!!! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have to be honest the Juggernaut isn't for me, but what are your thoughts on it James. Are you any stronger for doing it? I imagine your fitness is much better though.
> 
> In regards to the dips, mate, after doing your bench & rows, you should just accept what you get, don't beat yourself up (You sound just like me, we want it all ) After all if you did your dips before the bench you know you would possibly not make your designated Bench press reps. Regardless of rest, pre exhaustion happens.
> 
> Once you've done your bench the rest is just assistance work. If you do heavier work sets your assistance work sets will start to suffer once you reach your optimum weights. When I was going heavy (115kg work set) I had to build up my assistance bench from a pretty low weight & then only now do I do 82.5Kg 5 sets of 10. My approach was keep adding weight, but once I stalled & didn't reach 5 sets of 10 reps I would stay on the same weight until I did.
> 
> Beside which mate youve lifted 100Kg 5,5,5,8. Thats good going IMHO :thumb: :thumb:
> 
> Above all mate, youre still shifting some good weights & reps mate, regardless :thumb:, onward & upward James :devil: :thumb:


Im actually quite surprised at how good the Juggernaut Program is. Its basically a higher rep version of 5/3/1, well thats how I look at it anyway. I put on strength while still getting the volume from higher reps which has resulted in some size. Im thinking of doing the 10s and 8s month for bench press all the time as I had zero pain in my shoulder on these blocks and they must have fixed my shoulder or given a rest at least as last night I could feel the stress on my shoulder but it wasnt the usual pain. Personally I think my lower body responds best to low rep work and upper body to slightly higher reps. Have you ever tried a Max reps test at 85% of your 1RM?

Its more of an athletes workout as well as your doing the sprints, sled drags, med balls throws, etc and with the 3 mins rest you def feel fitter but the 10s block is a killer.

I would like to get at least 1 more rep per workout on Dips but your right it doesnt really matter. On deload week I can easily bang out 15 reps so its obviously the bench taking a lot out of me.

I actually put the wrong figure, the last set was 6 reps. Its ok but its not much up on what I was doing months ago. This has always been my problem, I do well on a program then i stall so I change workouts and can never carry on from where I left off. I done 107.5kg for 3 x 5 on SS Advanced Novice. Bench has never been a priority as my shoulder is screwed thats why I'm thinking about sticking to the higher reps.

The true tests are friday next week and then next month. Next friday Im aiming for 110kg x 8+ and a month after that 120kg x 6+ so wish me luck.


----------



## Bod42

I've had stuff like this in the gym before, as Doug said full of Male ego's everywhere.

You get even more Ego's in forums, thats why I only post in here as everyone is encouraging. I recently read a NZ Bodybuilding forum and this guy had put on a massive amount of weight on his squats in a short period and he was already strong, Im sure it was like 200kg to 260kg and he used the Smolov program which is where you sqaut high volume and like 4 times a week and someone slatted him for taking so long and doing so much work to get there. Its such a :doublesho:doublesho moment reading it. I dont care if someone takes 10 years to get a 260kg squat, thats an impressive lift no matter what.

They made our Rugby gym public and we got the new Fake Tanned, Tattooed, perfect gelled hair, only train arms and chest gym gay. He used to give the rugby players **** about being fat and weak, etc. Never saw him squat but obviously he could squat 150kg easy peasy as he told us enough. So I challenged him to a squat contest but agreed we would use a box to keep the depth fair and obviously I let him go first. We agreed to warm up with 100kg, but as he had never squatted more than 2" down before so it stapled him to the box, we all then left :devil: leaving him there :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Im actually quite surprised at how good the Juggernaut Program is. Its basically a higher rep version of 5/3/1, well thats how I look at it anyway. I put on strength while still getting the volume from higher reps which has resulted in some size. Im thinking of doing the 10s and 8s month for bench press all the time as I had zero pain in my shoulder on these blocks and they must have fixed my shoulder or given a rest at least as last night I could feel the stress on my shoulder but it wasnt the usual pain. Personally I think my lower body responds best to low rep work and upper body to slightly higher reps. Have you ever tried a Max reps test at 85% of your 1RM?
> 
> Its more of an athletes workout as well as your doing the sprints, sled drags, med balls throws, etc and with the 3 mins rest you def feel fitter but the 10s block is a killer.
> 
> I would like to get at least 1 more rep per workout on Dips but your right it doesnt really matter. On deload week I can easily bang out 15 reps so its obviously the bench taking a lot out of me.
> 
> I actually put the wrong figure, the last set was 6 reps. Its ok but its not much up on what I was doing months ago. This has always been my problem, I do well on a program then i stall so I change workouts and can never carry on from where I left off. I done 107.5kg for 3 x 5 on SS Advanced Novice. Bench has never been a priority as my shoulder is screwed thats why I'm thinking about sticking to the higher reps.
> 
> The true tests are friday next week and then next month. Next friday Im aiming for 110kg x 8+ and a month after that 120kg x 6+ so wish me luck.


:thumb:

110kg x 8+ and a month after that 120kg x 6+ :doublesho Mate if you Bench those numbers that would be awesome & would prove that the Juggernaut is a program well worth looking into :thumb:

I would try to stick to a program for a while, be determined & dig in, sticking points are there to be :devil: DOMINATED!!!!!:devil:  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> They made our Rugby gym public and we got the new Fake Tanned, Tattooed, perfect gelled hair, only train arms and chest gym gay. He used to give the rugby players **** about being fat and weak, etc. Never saw him squat but obviously he could squat 150kg easy peasy as he told us enough. So I challenged him to a squat contest but agreed we would use a box to keep the depth fair and obviously I let him go first. We agreed to warm up with 100kg, but as he had never squatted more than 2" down before so it stapled him to the box, we all then left :devil: leaving him there :devil:


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb:
> 
> 110kg x 8+ and a month after that 120kg x 6+ :doublesho Mate if you Bench those numbers that would be awesome & would prove that the Juggernaut is a program well worth looking into :thumb:
> 
> I would try to stick to a program for a while, be determined & dig in, sticking points are there to be :devil: DOMINATED!!!!!:devil:  :thumb:


Ya i been looking at the prediction all the way through and thinking oh crap thats going to be hard but so far I have exceeded expectations.

So far Bench looks like this, 
Month 1 - Goal 87.5 x 13, Actual 87.5 x 16
Month 2 - Goal 97.5 x 12, Actual 87.5 x 13

Thats why Im surprised the 100kg for 6 felt so heavy as I done 97.5kg x 13. Like I say it most be due to my back being so sore from deadlifts and working out 2 days in a row.

As for my predictions. Its not really a 10kg increase as the reps are less. Using Wendler formula the 110kg x 8 = 140kg 1RM and the 120kg x 6 = 145kg 1RM so only 5kg in a month which is achievable.

We will all know on Friday 27th July if I achieve my predicted weights.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ya i been looking at the prediction all the way through and thinking oh crap thats going to be hard but so far I have exceeded expectations.
> 
> So far Bench looks like this,
> Month 1 - Goal 87.5 x 13, Actual 87.5 x 16
> Month 2 - Goal 97.5 x 12, Actual 87.5 x 13
> 
> Thats why Im surprised the 100kg for 6 felt so heavy as I done 97.5kg x 13. Like I say it most be due to my back being so sore from deadlifts and working out 2 days in a row.
> 
> As for my predictions. Its not really a 10kg increase as the reps are less. Using Wendler formula the 110kg x 8 = 140kg 1RM and the 120kg x 6 = 145kg 1RM so only 5kg in a month which is achievable.
> 
> We will all know on Friday 27th July if I achieve my predicted weights.


Go for it mate! :thumb::thumb::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Forgot to mention. I started the Muay Thai training last night for my conditioning work, great fun, recommended!  :thumb:

I will work up to around 45-60 minutes twice a week & see how I go, if there is no negative effect on my powerlifting I'll add another day, giving me 3X60 minutes Muay Thai per week for conditioning :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

just a quick post guys...gotta go pack...

thurs workout
*squat 60kg 5x5
OHP 40kg 5x5
deadlift 70kg 2x5*

squat felt good today so think i'm passed sticking point (for now...:devil
OHP felt heavy...didn't hurt but only just had the strength to do it and didn't lower bar to upper chest, more chin level...
deadlift doable but feeling it in upper bod now too...tried the grip with hands facing in/out...confused

pleased with all these weights as never lifted these weights properly before...
am thinking that a week off now at the halfway point will do me good but not sure if to repeat this weeks weights when i return or just carry on from todays...?
we'll see...
lift well,
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

Tonight's session.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 5/4/[email protected], -3/[email protected]

*Chins*
WO: -3/-3/[email protected] (BW + 10kg)

Squats feeling suitably heavy but seemed a little less exhausting than my last couple of sessions.

Bench was quite tough. Didn't actually go to failure on the last two sets - I knew I would not make the last rep so just racked the bar instead.
Did a couple of negative sets too. I had more control of the weight this time which is encouraging.

Just did negatives on the chins too, with added weight. Again, I'm starting to slow down the descent nicely.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> just a quick post guys...gotta go pack...
> 
> thurs workout
> *squat 60kg 5x5
> OHP 40kg 5x5
> deadlift 70kg 2x5*
> 
> squat felt good today so think i'm passed sticking point (for now...:devil
> OHP felt heavy...didn't hurt but only just had the strength to do it and didn't lower bar to upper chest, more chin level...
> deadlift doable but feeling it in upper bod now too...tried the grip with hands facing in/out...confused
> 
> pleased with all these weights as never lifted these weights properly before...
> am thinking that a week off now at the halfway point will do me good but not sure if to repeat this weeks weights when i return or just carry on from todays...?
> we'll see...
> lift well,
> rgds stu


Try to carry on from where you left of Stu :thumb:

Why are you doing 2X5 deadlifts 

I would do only 1X5 on the deadlift, try to keep to the standard overhand grip for as long as you can to help build grip power, many of us here managed to go to around 130-140 before switching to the alternative grip, dig in mate :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

I'm so bad at keeping up with posting my workouts, but anyway here's the numbers for the past couple of WO.

Got my deadlift up to 120kg for 5 reps. Really helped to switch to mixed grip and skipping a lot of the warm-up sets.
Squats is now at 92.5kg for 3x5. Couldn't manage the 5x5. But it will soon be nailed. 

Tried for the heck of it to put 100kg on the bar and managed to squat it for 5reps, so the psycological barrier is broken.

Bench has been going up nice and slow. I'm at 75kg 5x5 and it is heavy.

OHP is at 50kg 5x5. Again I tried loading the bar with a little extra and got a 1RM at 60kg. 

Been straying a bit on the 5x5 SL routine and skipping squats on deadlift days, but think I'll go back to the standard template and just eat my heart out and gain some weight. I'm currently at 78kg.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I'm so bad at keeping up with posting my workouts, but anyway here's the numbers for the past couple of WO.
> 
> Got my deadlift up to 120kg for 5 reps. Really helped to switch to mixed grip and skipping a lot of the warm-up sets.
> Squats is now at 92.5kg for 3x5. Couldn't manage the 5x5. But it will soon be nailed.
> 
> Tried for the heck of it to put 100kg on the bar and managed to squat it for 5reps, so the psycological barrier is broken.
> 
> Bench has been going up nice and slow. I'm at 75kg 5x5 and it is heavy.
> 
> OHP is at 50kg 5x5. Again I tried loading the bar with a little extra and got a 1RM at 60kg.
> 
> Been straying a bit on the 5x5 SL routine and skipping squats on deadlift days, but think I'll go back to the standard template and just eat my heart out and gain some weight. I'm currently at 78kg.


Nice one Christian :devil: :thumb:

I think a lot of people stall around 70-80 Kg on the Bench, I know I did, once your over that you may find you'll progress but at a slightly slower pace :thumb:
Its awesome for self motivation once you start benching three figures :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I've just been working out next months 5/3/1
Week 3 Cycle 2 last work set

*Bench press - 116Kg X 1 or more reps

Squat - 179Kg X 1 or more reps

Deadlift - 189Kg X 1 or more reps*

As I've only just got back into the OHP, I'm not sure what my real training weight is yet , I'm only using around 51Kg......for now :devil: 

The above progress is not shoddy at all considering I took 10% off my 1X5 routine 1RM weights :thumb:

I'm getting a very good feeling about the 5/3/1 even after only using it for two sessions I'm already FEELING the benefits of a progressive build up to your max weights, I'm most definitely have more energy, my joints feel great & my motivation is higher than ever. I think the end of month 2 will either show how good or bad this routine is. But I feel a million times healthier , so if I have to take the slow road to my final goals, so be it :thumb:


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Try to carry on from where you left of Stu :thumb:
> 
> Why are you doing 2X5 deadlifts
> 
> I would do only 1X5 on the deadlift, try to keep to the standard overhand grip for as long as you can to help build grip power, many of us here managed to go to around 130-140 before switching to the alternative grip, dig in mate :thumb:


I'll 2nd this advice. If you are going to squat on the same day as deads, 1x5 should be plenty enough.
The squats will also help carry your dead forward, so don't feel you are losing out by only doing them at 1x5.


----------



## Guest

Christianmp said:


> I'm so bad at keeping up with posting my workouts, but anyway here's the numbers for the past couple of WO.
> 
> Got my deadlift up to 120kg for 5 reps. Really helped to switch to mixed grip and skipping a lot of the warm-up sets.
> Squats is now at 92.5kg for 3x5. Couldn't manage the 5x5. But it will soon be nailed.
> 
> Tried for the heck of it to put 100kg on the bar and managed to squat it for 5reps, so the psycological barrier is broken.
> 
> Bench has been going up nice and slow. I'm at 75kg 5x5 and it is heavy.
> 
> OHP is at 50kg 5x5. Again I tried loading the bar with a little extra and got a 1RM at 60kg.
> 
> Been straying a bit on the 5x5 SL routine and skipping squats on deadlift days, but think I'll go back to the standard template and just eat my heart out and gain some weight. I'm currently at 78kg.


Great progress Christian.

Another option is to drop to 3x5. You don't have to wait for the 3rd (or even 1st) deload for that to happen. If you feel your body will recover better at 3x5 then switch - this is exactly what I did for this reason (and the workouts taking over 2 hrs )


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> (*and the workouts taking over 2 hrs *)


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho Bugger me! :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho

1 Hour is enough for me  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Great progress Christian.
> 
> Another option is to drop to 3x5. You don't have to wait for the 3rd (or even 1st) deload for that to happen. If you feel your body will recover better at 3x5 then switch - this is exactly what I did for this reason (and the workouts taking over 2 hrs )


+ 1 :thumb:

As soon as it becomes the amount of sets/volume stopping your progress, its time to reduce your work sets :thumb:


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho Bugger me! :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho
> 
> 1 Hour is enough for me  :thumb:


I don't know how you do it Doug. I can't get my workouts to be under 1.5hrs. Last nights was just over 1h 45m .


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I don't know how you do it Doug. I can't get my workouts to be under 1.5hrs. Last nights was just over 1h 45m .


 I'll time myself when I do my bench workout, just to make sure I've got it right, I'm almost certain my workouts take no longer the 60-70 minutes. I'll time the whole workout & include the rest periods as I've not timed my workouts for ages  
You never know I could be completely wrong, but my missus tells me I'm in there just over an hour, she can't be wrong, because she has to wait for me to finish my workout before cooking a nutritious evening meal  :thumb:


----------



## Oats

BareFacedGeek said:


> I'll 2nd this advice. If you are going to squat on the same day as deads, 1x5 should be plenty enough.
> The squats will also help carry your dead forward, so don't feel you are losing out by only doing them at 1x5.


There is a point in starting strength where you move to 2x5 deadlifts. I think it's when you've added powercleans and 80% squat day. If it's because you want to work on technique, I used do do more in the warmup sets.


----------



## Guest

Oats said:


> There is a point in starting strength where you move to 2x5 deadlifts. I think it's when you've added powercleans and 80% squat day. If it's because you want to work on technique, I used do do more in the warmup sets.


That's interesting. Must admit I didn't know that. Good idea though, but I'd imagine it would be done along with the lower intensity squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS 22X5 28X5 33X3 36KGX_5_/40KGX_5_/46KGX5 or more_10_/ Stopped at 10 

OVERHEAD PRESS 35KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

BARBELL CURL 35KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

CLOSE GRIP BENCH PRESS 45KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*

As you can see, I'm purposely starting this workout really light, I'll build up each month :thumb:

What can I say; I love the 5/3/1 already! The amount of extra energy I have is silly. I'm still hoping to reach my deadlift & squat goals by December :thumb:

I can see the progressive logic behind this routine & see why on paper it should work; obviously we are all built slightly different so progress will vary.

If this workout gives me the proscribed increase of 2.5Kg & 5Kg per month I will probably stay on it for a very long time if not indefinitely.

Also because of its variation in load/reps & the fact I have more energy I think I'll be more inclined to do the BBB assistance work more often, giving me more training volume & a better chance at increasing muscle mass while decreasing body fat. I already feel less bloated yet I'm eating the same & to top it all I'm starting to feel hungry as well!!

The real test will be the next two months heavy weeks :thumb:


----------



## Oats

BareFacedGeek said:


> That's interesting. Must admit I didn't know that. Good idea though, but I'd imagine it would be done along with the lower intensity squats.


I'll have a look during my next session over the weekend. I think it's in practical programming.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Saturday's 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (Warm up sets - 78X5 98X5 116X3) 126KGX_5_/145KGX_5_/165KGX5 or more_6_/

DEADLIFT 100KGX_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

STIFF LEG DEADLIFT 20Kg (EMPTY BAR) X_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*

Timed the workout: 62 minutes :thumb:

As this is the lightest of the training weeks I would imagine the workouts will get longer as they progressively get heavier. I wouldn't be surprised if my heavy 3rd week workouts are around 90 minutes. I'll time them too as I'm interested to see how I'm progressing :thumb:

Didn't max out on the final deadlift. I read somewhere it's better to max out on weeks 2&3, any excuse for me to make it easy for myself!


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Saturday's 5/3/1
> Timed the workout: 62 minutes :thumb:
> 
> As this is the lightest of the training weeks I would imagine the workouts will get longer as they progressively get heavier. I wouldn't be surprised if my heavy 3rd week workouts are around 90 minutes. I'll time them too as I'm interested to see how I'm progressing :thumb:


Including warmup? I'm under an hour from getting my shoes on to finishing. I guess supersetting the assistance work helps. I doubt I'll be able to keep doing it like that indefinatly.


----------



## Oats

Oats said:


> I'll have a look during my next session over the weekend. I think it's in practical programming.


Oooohhhh just found out I can copy and paste from Kindle. Very exicted lol

The section is talking about introducing an 80% squat day on the middle day after, the first reset has taken place (I got this all wrong and reset twice before having a light day. No wonder I felt mashed:wall

_Deadlifts are still done for one set of five, although more sets could be added due to their reduced frequency in the program. Deadlifts are very easy to overuse; they are important for basic strength, but too many sets make recovery difficult because of the weights that can be used and the amount of stress they can produce cumulatively.

Rippetoe, Mark; Kilgore, Lon (2010-11-04). Practical Programming for Strength Training (Kindle Locations 2112-2114). The Aasgaard Company. Kindle Edition._

It actually says sets in the plural. Not sure I'd have wanted to do 3+ sets on novice linear. Maybe one for for young 'uns.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Including warmup? I'm under an hour from getting my shoes on to finishing. I guess supersetting the assistance work helps. I doubt I'll be able to keep doing it like that indefinatly.


Yep including warm up posted above. I didn't include the dynamic stretches as they are done every day & aren't a real part of the 5/3/1 routine :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout Done Sunday.
Squats: 132.5 x 5,5,5,5
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 80x3, 90x3, 100x3
Bulgarian Split Squats: 5kg x 12,12,12

Squats were really really siht again. Ever since I started this 5s month I fee like I havent had one good workout and it cant just be a bad form workout as all my lifts are suffing and all i can think is that its due to me being massively stressed. Had to decide on a new job offer then went to buy a motorbike this weekend and the shop tried to **** me over big time. My last warm up set felt like the heaviest weight I had ever lifted on my shoulders and when it feels like that its very hard to go for high reps. I was suppose to go for 10 reps on the last set but decided on 8 reps as I was having a bad workout but I got to 5 reps and thought what the hell and racked the weight. Its just poor mental strength at the moment but i cant get my head in the game. On the 3rd set I actually let my breath out twice within 5 reps as I cant concentrate.

Deadlifts actually felt pretty good especially after the poor squats.

Split squats are good for knee health so just bang out 3 sets with 45 secs rest.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout Done Sunday.
> Squats: 132.5 x 5,5,5,5
> Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 80x3, 90x3, 100x3
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 5kg x 12,12,12
> 
> Squats were really really siht again. Ever since I started this 5s month I fee like I havent had one good workout and it cant just be a bad form workout as all my lifts are suffing and all i can think is that its due to me being massively stressed. Had to decide on a new job offer then went to buy a motorbike this weekend and the shop tried to **** me over big time. My last warm up set felt like the heaviest weight I had ever lifted on my shoulders and when it feels like that its very hard to go for high reps. I was suppose to go for 10 reps on the last set but decided on 8 reps as I was having a bad workout but I got to 5 reps and thought what the hell and racked the weight. Its just poor mental strength at the moment but i cant get my head in the game. On the 3rd set I actually let my breath out twice within 5 reps as I cant concentrate.
> 
> Deadlifts actually felt pretty good especially after the poor squats.
> 
> Split squats are good for knee health so just bang out 3 sets with 45 secs rest.


Once you finish the Juggernaut James, have a go at 5/3/1, i noticed in the first week that my joints felt a million times better, i think the gradual progression with the warm up sets & the two work sets before the main work set makes huge difference, might help you too mate :thumb:

Hope everything goes well with your new job to :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Once you finish the Juggernaut James, have a go at 5/3/1, i noticed in the first week that my joints felt a million times better, i think the gradual progression with the warm up sets & the two work sets before the main work set makes huge difference, might help you too mate :thumb:
> 
> Hope everything goes well with your new job to :thumb:


I dont think its anything to do with the program, its my head at the moment, Im being a full on pussy and quiting and I'm the trainer who hates quitters. I dont really like my job so found another job which seemed great but my current company made me an offer I couldnt refuse and its the best thing for my family.
Then I passed my Motorbike Test so went to buy a bike which I thought would cheer me up but the shop tried to rip me off so had to go and get my deposit back which was fun as it was non-refundable.

The juggernaut program does seem to work and I am going to hit my goals, just having a few off weeks. Was talking to the Mrs about it last night and theres no way you can go from 97.5 x 11 to 100 x 6 due to strength loss in one week, its just because my heads not in the game.

5/3/1 is the program I will be on on the long run as I love the customisation factor to it. Keep the 5/3/1 aspect but do BBB for more size, Simple strength template for strength, crossfit for overall fitness but your still keep increasing your strength as you always have that 5/3/1 in there.

Anyway enough *****in, I got 6 weeks of this program left then I'm going to start my diet with 5/3/1 as the main exercise but then add a lot more volume and lower rest periods. See how that works out but reading an article on T nation at the weekend, it was saying for maximum muscle size keep your rest periods up and to loose weight keep them lower so dont want to drop the rest to low, 90-120secs sounds good.

I think your workouts should be kept under an hour. Take starting strength for example, 3x5 of Squats, Bench Press, Rows. Thats 9 sets so 8 rest periods = 40 mins. This gives you 20 mins for warming up and changing exercises and I wouldnt normally wait 5 mins on Rows.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> 5/3/1 is the program I will be on on the long run as I love the customisation factor to it. Keep the 5/3/1 aspect but do BBB for more size, Simple strength template for strength, crossfit for overall fitness but your still keep increasing your strength as you always have that 5/3/1 in there.
> 
> See how that works out but reading an article on T nation at the weekend, it was saying for maximum muscle size keep your rest periods up and to loose weight keep them lower so dont want to drop the rest to low, 90-120secs sounds good.
> 
> I think your workouts should be kept under an hour. Take starting strength for example, 3x5 of Squats, Bench Press, Rows. Thats 9 sets so 8 rest periods = 40 mins. This gives you 20 mins for warming up and changing exercises and I wouldnt normally wait 5 mins on Rows.


I read the article on T-Nation :thumb: seems I'm already training in a Powerlifting/bodybuilding style, but I have gone much heavier than the 50-60-70%. I'll keep adding 2.5Kg to my BBB assistance work once a month.

I have made excellent strength gains using low intensity work, so I think I'm going to go easy on the "or more" reps as added muscle mass will help with burning fat at a later stage :thumb:

Hate hose weights!!!!!!

I'll time my heavier workout tonight (Update: I meant Tuesday) :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I read the article on T-Nation :thumb: seems I'm already training in a Powerlifting/bodybuilding style, but I have gone much heavier than the 50-60-70%. I'll keep adding 2.5Kg to my BBB assistance work once a month.
> 
> I have made excellent strength gains using low intensity work, so I think I'm going to go easy on the "or more" reps as added muscle mass will help with burning fat at a later stage :thumb:
> 
> Hate hose weights!!!!!!
> 
> I'll time my heavier workout tonight (Update: I meant Tuesday) :thumb:


I agree go easy on the more reps, i read a fair few articles on Elitefts that most people would do a lot better if they never went to failure. Im sure Wendler says most people would do well just to do the prescibed reps. Seems to be why 5/3/1 and the Juggernaut program work well, they both have added reps at well below your ability. Juggernaut tells you to leave 2-3 reps in the tank on week 1 and 1-2 on week 2, obviously training below failure works. BUT I think this works for strength but not the best for size


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tuesday's 5/3/1

Second week

*BENCH PRESS (Warm up sets 50X5 60X5 72X3) 84KGX3 96KGX3 108KGX3

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX10_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/

BARBELL ROW 70KGX10_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/_10_/*

Felt a slight twinge in Hamstring (left leg only) on the last set of Barbell rows…. WTF!!!! I'm hoping I can continue to train, as I've read if it's an injury it can take me out for at least a week.

Workout time: 54 Minutes, down to using weight well within my training maxes.


----------



## Guest

Not sure what happened last night - one of the worst workouts I've had in a long time 
It might have been the heatwave and high humidity we are experiencing in the UK atm. Stuck in an office all day without aircon. Garage was like a sauna even with the doors open.

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 3/0/[email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 2/[email protected]

I should have been able to manage 3x3x165kg - it is effectively a deload compared to 2x170kg last session. It felt massively heavy and was a real strain to make the first 3 reps. I started the second set and got half a rep - it felt like I was going for a 1RM.

Press was similar. Warmup sets were fine, but I just had no strength to lift the WO weight, even though I'd managed 5/5/4 at this weight last week.

I'm putting it down to the weather and the fact that I have not acclimatised to lifting in this sort of heat/humidity.

The upside is that this session only lasted 40mins. I'm sure my next session will be better - only because it surely can't be any worse :lol:.

Cheers,
Phil

Edit to add. Just loaded up my spreadsheet. 160kg x 3 = 170kg x 2 = 180kg x 1. No wonder it was tough . I probably should have chosen 160kg as the WO weight .


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: Done Tuesday
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3 x 5
Shoulder Press: 42.5 x 2, 47.5x 2, 50 x 5, 5, 5, 10
Dips: BW x 5, 5, 117.5 x 10
Chins x 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 4

The first rep of each Shoulder Press set felt hard and slow but after that things started to move better. I had to stay away on Monday night and the bed was really hard which meant I woke up and my shoulder was killing and only got worse throughout the day so was very happy to get 10 reps. I iced my shoulder after the workout just incase as I think this is extremely important for shoulder injuries. My biggest worry is that my shoulder has started hurting 3 days before I'm due to hit my heaviest bench session of the month so this may really effect my performance which is disappointing.

Did Chins between shoulder press' today but this seemed to make my shoulder hurt more so stopped between work sets and dips.

Dips always feel good in my chest and tris but they do pull my shoulder slightly. At the moment I do Dips twice per week but I may lower this to once per week and decide if I want these to be weighted or bodyweight.

Phil, when i trained in england I found that when it was hot my training suffered really bad as my body cant deal with the heat. I was always surprised how much it zapped my energy so I wouldnt be to hard on yourself. Not surprised you could do 165 x 3 x 3 as I was thinking thats got to be similar to 170x2 but your doing it for more sets.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout: Done Thursday
Sled Drags: Missed sled drags
Deadlifts: 117.5 x 2, 130 x 2, 140 x 5, 5, 5, 4 WTF
Front Squats: 80 x 3, 90 x 3, 100 x 3
RC Work

I really have no clue whats going on at the moment, I seem to have the strength but I have lost all my speed, when I benched last I couldnt even throw the med ball as hard as usual and then last night I had zero speed breaking the bar off the floor which meant I was grinding every rep. I was aiming for 8 reps on the last set and managed 4 WTF. I did 137.5x12 less than a month ago. This program was going so well and I seem to have derailed big time. Everyone has bad workouts now and then but I seem to have started this month and every workout has been bad, strange very strange.

Front squats went ok and 100kg isnt bad after Deads and only resting for 90 secs between sets.

Instead of my usual Ab and grip work I decided to do some RC work as my shoulder was killing me. Luckily this actually got rid of 90% of the pain in my shoulder. I going to eat more and real clean the next week and hopefully I can get something from the most important week of the month.

GOALS: Predicted 1RM
Bench: 110kg x 8 - 140kg
Squats: 145kg x 10 - 192.5kg
Press: 55kg x 8 - 70kg
Deads: 152.5kg x 9 - 197.5kg

We will see how things go on Sat


----------



## Guest

Thankfully, things have picked up since Tuesday's session 

*Wednesday Evening*

*Chins*
WO: [email protected] (BW)

*Dips*
WO: -3/-3/-3/-3/[email protected] (BW)

Supersetted both exercises. 
Chins went well but was tough going towards the end.
Dips were negatives all the way throughout, but started pushing back up on each rep on the last 3 sets. I do reset after each rep on the dips i.e. drop to the ground and then lift myself back up again.

*Thursday Evening*

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

Squat was hard work. Last rep of each set was a bit of a battle.
Bench was tough. Really had to fight to get all the reps. A BW bench still looks a long way off.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout: Done Sat
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 65x5, 77.5x3, 90x2, 97.5x1, 102.5x1, 110kg x 8 (Predicted Max 140Kg)
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x5, 77.5x3, 85x9
Dips: BW x 8, 8, 8, 8, 15
RC Work

After the totally SIHT workouts I had this month I am extremely pleased to hit my target of 110kg x 8 reps. My warm ups felt the best they ever have, I mean like unreal how good it felt, I felt in perfect position and the 97.5 came out of the rack like it was nothing. The 8th rep was a real grinder and I mean a real grinder, I was struggling to lock out my right arm but I got it in the end.

Used abit of Body English on Rows on the last few reps but I like really pushing it this week.

I decided to go easy on the first 4 sets so I could smash the last set. I was aiming for 11 reps on the last set for a 1 rep, rep record but got 15 reps which is a record and even better after the bench press.

Overall I am over the moon with this workout, I had 2 weeks of awful workouts so really happy to hit another record. Thats 1 of 4 targets done, squats on Monday will be seriously hard. My record before this program was 140 x 3 x 5 but on monday I aiming for 145 x 10. I think this is doable but my biggest worry if the Deadlift day as I been struggling with my deadlift on this program.


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 2 Week 1*

Sh Press Last set 6 reps (vs 7 cycle 1)

Deadlift 9 reps (vs 8 cycle 1)

Bench 8 reps (vs 9 cycle 1)

Squat 7 reps (vs 5 cycle 1)

Uneventful numbers. Was hoping to get to double figures in at least a few of the lifts at these relatively light weights.

Deadlift - I was catching bottom of my knee. Realised shoulders were level with the bar. Moved bit further from my shin on set up and shoulders further forward. Resulted in a rather pleasing (from technical point of view) bloody scrape on my shin showing bar path was better .

No sprints all week. No excuse other than fannied out and found other things to do that were more pressing (but in all honesty shouldn't be). i enjoy them but hate going out on my bike for the ten minute ride to get there. Need to give myself a stern boll*cking this week:devil:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Squats: 85x5, 102.5x3, 120x2, 127.5x1, 137.5x1, 145x4 For F**K SAKE

Didnt bother with the rest as the Squats were so Pathetic.

Predicted Max of 165kg, thats a 22.5kg loss in one month. I needed to get 9 reps to get the same predicted max. Nothing felt right tonight, my wrists were killing and I couldnt keep my upper back tight. If I could swear in this forum then there would be a fair bit after this poor excuse for a workout.

This workout seems to work well for Upper Body exercises but I seem to be struggling like crazy with Lower body movement.


----------



## Oats

Update on my 'rather pleasing bloody scrape'. Did week 2 deadlifts last night and it's now become a 'rather annoying scab that gets peeled off by the bar and covers my trouser leg in blood':lol:

On the plus side I watched the Oly lifting yesterday and quite a few of them had cuts in the exact same place as me (2 or 3 inches below the bottom of the knee cap) so I've obviously found the sweet spot:thumb:



Bod42 said:


> This workout seems to work well for Upper Body exercises but I seem to be struggling like crazy with Lower body movement.


I have little experience behind me but I was wondering about this last night. I'm now doing deads with squat assiatance work etc. Upper body seems to benefit from time between sessions and a more considered approach whereas lower body seems to go better when I'm a bit more mashed and tired from the previous workout. Maybe a hangover from SS and squatting every session but it seems that session frequency affects upper and lower body differently.


----------



## sfstu

hi guys...:wave: back from holiday now (how lucky could i get with the weather!)...did 1st workout for just over a week yesterday and felt like i'd never lifted a thing....:doublesho

mondays workout...weights carried on from last w/o week and a half ago...:thumb:
*bench 45kg 5x5
squat 62.5kg 5x5
BBrows 52.5kg 5x5*

i'll be honest, i struggled....with all of it! 
been eating rubbish for last week and just felt weak before i started and not really in the mood for it but did it all anyway which i was pleased about (after!) and god i'm sore today...

got your advice guys about only doing 1 set of deadlifts and will follow it...:thumb:

rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Then I passed my Motorbike Test so went to buy a bike which I thought would cheer me up but the shop tried to rip me off so had to go and get my deposit back which was fun as it was non-refundable.


well done for passing your test by the way, james....:thumb: 
what sort of bike are you after or have you got one yet..?
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

:thumb:


sfstu said:


> well done for passing your test by the way, james....:thumb:
> what sort of bike are you after or have you got one yet..?
> rgds stu


Cheers Mate,

Your allowed a 250 on a learners license over here compared with the 125 allowed in the UK which is a bonus. Problem is its a staged system so it takes a year and a half minimum to get your full license.

Going for a sports bike as I'm going to track it. Its my adrenaline fix as I havent got a 4x4 now and have decided not to play rugby.

Also completely blew my shoulder out last night pissing around with squat technique so I be working out pretty light with my upper body exercises for awhile now.

Good work hitting the gym after a holiday. I find once you done it for awhile, it becomes a way of life, my family think I'm crazy as I go to the gym while I'm on holiday sometimes. Cant remember going in Ibiza


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> :thumb:
> 
> Cheers Mate,
> 
> Your allowed a 250 on a learners license over here compared with the 125 allowed in the UK which is a bonus. Problem is its a staged system so it takes a year and a half minimum to get your full license.
> 
> Going for a sports bike as I'm going to track it. Its my adrenaline fix as I havent got a 4x4 now and have decided not to play rugby.
> 
> Also completely blew my shoulder out last night pissing around with squat technique so I be working out pretty light with my upper body exercises for awhile now.
> 
> Good work hitting the gym after a holiday. I find once you done it for awhile, it becomes a way of life, my family think I'm crazy as I go to the gym while I'm on holiday sometimes. Cant remember going in Ibiza


whereabouts are you then james...? theyre making some really nice 250 sports now if its new you're going for...

think with hindsight, i would've been better doing a sesion on the weights saturday, maybe 2x5 for all 5 exercises to ease me back into it as really did struggle monday...!

weds workout...
*squat 65kg 5x5
OHP 42.5kg 5x5
deadlift 80kg 1x5*:thumb:

felt much stronger going out to the weights in my garage today tho still sore from monday...
squats were heavy but good,
OHP, still impressed with myself that i'm still lifting without stalling (so far:devil....really did struggle on last 2 sets tho, only managed 4 on last set and tbh that was probably more like 3 and a half...
deadlift felt ok...back to using regular grip...
getting back into the swing o things now...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

I'm originally from the UK but in New Zealand at the moment.

Sorry everyone this is very off topic but this is what I just brought, pick it up Sunday :thumb::devil::thumb:








Its the same size as its 650 bigger brother so a proper size bike instead of the usual G string learner bikes and its got proper size tyres, never felt confident riding on biscuits. Mines very slightly different as I got an exhaust and a Tail Tidy. No I'm not a CHAV, the exhaust is actually for safety.

Anyway back on topic. Stu you will normally find after a week off that things will feel really weird and abit more difficult but then suddenly you have a big leap in strength back to where you were or higher. Thats what I'm finding with only Squating once every 9 days, everytime I squat it feels weird as I think theres to long between workouts now. This means I will need to change to a 4 workouts per week template when I move across to 5/3/1.

Update on the shoulder, it is totally  right now. Hurts like hell, when I hurt it the other night I actually think it hurt more than when I dislocated it last time during rugby. Most be due to adrenaline while you rplaying rugby.

It was my fault though, I have been looking into my squatting technique with a fine tooth comb as I feel stronger than ever but my squat sucks **** and basically I hurt my shoulder carrying some lengths of pipe on site but I still went to the gym as my squat were so siht Monday that I had to sort things out. I was trying to straighten my wrists out but was struggling so I gripped the bar really tight so my wrist stayed in the position I wanted it and then forced myself into position. DO NOT DO THIS.

I then worked up to what I thought would be a very easy 160kg for 1 rep and completely bombed, I couldnt even move off the box.

So the outcome is that I been watching loads of videos of squat technique and I have been using Elitefts squat style with elbows under the bar, looking up, hard arch in the lower back but I decided to do a run through with Rippletoe's technique and see how it goes. First signs are that its really good technique for me, for the first time Squats actually feel like a legs exercise instead of lower back.

I also had the bar to low and I will try and post Rippletoe's bar position video when Im at home as it explains why people have the bar to low for low bar squat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I'm originally from the UK but in New Zealand at the moment.
> 
> Sorry everyone this is very off topic but this is what I just brought, pick it up Sunday :thumb::devil::thumb:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its the same size as its 650 bigger brother so a proper size bike instead of the usual G string learner bikes and its got proper size tyres, never felt confident riding on biscuits. Mines very slightly different as I got an exhaust and a Tail Tidy. No I'm not a CHAV, the exhaust is actually for safety.
> 
> Anyway back on topic. Stu you will normally find after a week off that things will feel really weird and abit more difficult but then suddenly you have a big leap in strength back to where you were or higher. Thats what I'm finding with only Squating once every 9 days, everytime I squat it feels weird as I think theres to long between workouts now. This means I will need to change to a 4 workouts per week template when I move across to 5/3/1.
> 
> Update on the shoulder, it is totally  right now. Hurts like hell, when I hurt it the other night I actually think it hurt more than when I dislocated it last time during rugby. Most be due to adrenaline while you rplaying rugby.
> 
> It was my fault though, I have been looking into my squatting technique with a fine tooth comb as I feel stronger than ever but my squat sucks **** and basically I hurt my shoulder carrying some lengths of pipe on site but I still went to the gym as my squat were so siht Monday that I had to sort things out. I was trying to straighten my wrists out but was struggling so I gripped the bar really tight so my wrist stayed in the position I wanted it and then forced myself into position. DO NOT DO THIS.
> 
> I then worked up to what I thought would be a very easy 160kg for 1 rep and completely bombed, I couldnt even move off the box.
> 
> So the outcome is that I been watching loads of videos of squat technique and I have been using Elitefts squat style with elbows under the bar, looking up, hard arch in the lower back but I decided to do a run through with Rippletoe's technique and see how it goes. First signs are that its really good technique for me, for the first time Squats actually feel like a legs exercise instead of lower back.
> 
> I also had the bar to low and I will try and post Rippletoe's bar position video when Im at home as it explains why people have the bar to low for low bar squat.


Nice ride James :argie: (cant remember how long ago i passed my motorbike test, but it was a long time ago lol!)

Go easy mate, be safe :thumb:

Back on topic 

In regards to your training have you considered doing just the BBB routines? :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice ride James :argie: (cant remember how long ago i passed my motorbike test, but it was a long time ago lol!)
> 
> Go easy mate, be safe :thumb:
> 
> Back on topic
> 
> In regards to your training have you considered doing just the BBB routines? :thumb:


Cheers mate. Been riding 10yrs now but had to get a NZ license.

The long term plan is to go on 5/3/1 and just change between the different types like BBB, simple strength template etc but I'm going to complete the juggernaut program and then I got 12 weeks of dieting so after that I will be on 5/3/1.

This is the video I was talking about. It seems the bar doesn't go below your shoulder blade, it goes below the spur of the shoulder blade so an inch or so higher. Does anyone on here squat using the thumbless grip.
http://vimeo.com/m/30763907


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> This is the video I was talking about. It seems the bar doesn't go below your shoulder blade, it goes below the spur of the shoulder blade so an inch or so higher. Does anyone on here squat using the thumbless grip.
> http://vimeo.com/m/30763907


I've pretty much always used a thumbless grip on the squat (and press too). However, I do actually grab hold of the bar tightly. 
Rip's squat videos always show the lifter just placing their hands over the bar and not really gripping it - more like the are using their palms to push the bar against their body. My shoulders are not flexible enough to let me get into that position anyway.


----------



## Guest

Did a brief accessory workout last night. Hoping to get a couple of proper sessions in before going on holiday next week.

*Chins*
WO: 5/5/5/4/4/[email protected] (BW)

*Dips*
WO: [email protected], 3/3/3/3/[email protected] (BW)

Supersetted both exercises.
I've lost a little endurance on the chins - the final 3 sets I only got to around forehead level on the 5th rep, so I discounted them. Did 6 sets in total just to keep my volume up.
I started the dips with a set of 3 negatives. These felt good and I was managing to hold the bottom position for several seconds. Decided to try proper sets of positives but kept each set to just 3 reps. My chest and triceps knew they had been worked . I've got big hopes that these will help my bench.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

LOL Rip in the house!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol::lol::lol::lol:






:thumb: & I thought it pissed me off when people asked this question! :lol:


----------



## Guest

^^^^ :lol::lol::lol:

I still want a set of bumpers though


----------



## Guest

Tonights session

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 4/3/[email protected]

Couldn't find my bottle of liquid chalk tonight, so had to make do without.

Dead went well. Nicely heavy but I had no problems pulling any of the reps. Tried standard grip to start with one the first WO set. Managed to get the first rep then needed to switch to mixed grip. Pleased that my grip has improved.

Not sure what is going on with the OHP. At least I managed to get 5 reps on one of the sets, even if it was the last one!??? 

Done in just under an hour, so that was good too.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 2 Week 2* (Sets of 3)

I really need to concentrate and write down my sessions in advance rather than tagging numbers onto previous workouts:

*Shoulder Press* - max 6 (vs 6 cycle 1)
Did sets of 5 for the first 2 work sets then realised I should have been doing 3s. :wall: - concentrate!

*Deadlift* - max 6 (vs 8 cycle 1)
Warmup weight I used was more than second work set :wall: - concentrate!

*Bench* - max 6 (vs 8 cycle 1)
Never felt warmed up and went into last set feeling like it was a warm up.

*Squat* - max 8 (vs 7 cycle 1)
Warmed up with lots of sets. Shoulder mashing main limiting factor rather than strength. Then, did 4x10 deadlift assistance thinking it was a bit tougher than before. On last set I realised I'd put the full weight in paltes on to the bar rather than taking off 20kg from the number for the weight of the bar. :wall: - concentrate!

Overall not a bad week. Running out of puff is main limiting factor rather than strength per say. Assistance exercises went really well. First full week of doing opposites - bench assistance with shoulder workout, deadlift assistance with squat workout etc. I think it lets you lift more weight on the assistance (although unclear on the overall effect this has compared to light weights after a matching heavy session), and I didn't feel so rusty as I did when completing each lift once every 9 days.

I could only get my feet level with hips on hanging leg raise when I started. Now I'm all the way up and touching the roof of the cage for 7 reps before my grip gives out. Think my lack of back pain is starting to translate into better mobiliity.

One set of hill sprints. Went out for two but got lost on my bike trying to go to another hill I thought I could find. Ended up as an hours ride instead :wall: - take a map 

On holiday now for 3 weeks so thankful I'm on 5\3\1 as I'll need to jig things around and it's quite felxible in that regard.

Off to watch mens 105+kg Olympic weightlifting on Tuesday. Can't wait! The 85kg class started off the clean and jerk session with 200kg on the bar yesterday :doublesho


----------



## sfstu

hi guys,
haven't had time to get on here for last few days (and missed fridays workout-1st one..) due to work and some other stuff but just wanted to let you guys know i've had to make the decision to get rid of my marcy home gym today...



































and got a bodymax cf475 rack, cf430 bench and 160kg oly set...
at last, found a good deal on the bay and drove up to nottingham this morn to collect...spent this afternoon dismantling my marcy gym and helping load it into mates car and then assembling my rack...
god its huge..!!! and well solid...love it..
need a day or two more to get things tweaked around in garage til i can use it properly but will hopefully be back in the groove midweek and posting again...
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

^^^ awesome mate, you will love it. I think we all have that rack. I have the same bench too. You will love it - so versatile. I highly recommend getting the dip bars too.

I covered the safety bars and hooks with duck tape to stop the bar scratching the paint.


----------



## sfstu

yeah, was considering getting the lighter model rack as prob won't need the max weight of this one but it was too good a deal... 
its in almost as new condition too so was also thinking of covering the top of catch bars with something to protect them...got some thin foam/rubber stuff somewhere which is sticky on one side so may use that...
got plenty of weight plates now too as was starting to run out with the standard plates i had and wasn't wanting to spend any more money on them knowing i wanted an oly set...
just need to get hold of some 1.25kg plates now as smallest i got with set was 2.5kg..?
got, 4x20kg,2x15,2x10,4x5,4x2.5...
would've preferred a 7ft oly bar rather than the 6ft one i got with it but love it anyway...
rgds stu
p.s. got the dip bars with it too...!


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Overall not a bad week. Running out of puff is main limiting factor rather than strength per say. Assistance exercises went really well. First full week of doing opposites - bench assistance with shoulder workout, deadlift assistance with squat workout etc. I think it lets you lift more weight on the assistance (although unclear on the overall effect this has compared to light weights after a matching heavy session), and I didn't feel so rusty as I did when completing each lift once every 9 days.


The reasoning for doing opposites is so you can hit the exercise more than once a week which is better for beginners/Intermediate. The overall effect should be more strength and growth.

Starting Strength / Sronglift / 5/3/1 etc, all the programs that seem to work for people hit the exercises more than once a week. On 5/3/1 you dont have to but check out the Beginners version its:

Monday:
Squat
Bench Press
Dumbell Rows

Wednesday:
Deadlift
Shoulder Press
Dips

Friday
Bench Press
Squat
Chin Up

I feel its a general agreement between trainers that beginner and intermediates to an extent should be hitting each big exercise more than once a week. Once you get to an advanced level your body needs to longer to recover.

Stu, nice work on the Rack you will find that your lifts will improve a lot when you feel safe. Looks like you have the same rack as Doug and I, its been awesome for me so far. I havent put anything on the rack but wish I had as the paint is quite thin. Doug put some rubber or something on his, looks really good. He did a review of the rack and bench somewhere and you can see the bits he added there. I may try spraying mine with Plastidip and see how that holds up?

Edit: Decided against the Plastidip so popped out at Lunch and grabbed some 4.5mm thick 50mm wide hard rubber to cut up and stick to the bars. We will see how it goes tonight.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 100kg 6sets x 3reps, 1set x 5reps
Pendlay Rows: 60x5, 70x5, 80x7
Dips: 9,9,9,8,5

Must say I'm quite impressed to hit all reps and my goal as my shoulder was totally shagged last week but i done loads of rehab work over the past week and i suppose I have just been extremely lucky with how good it feels now.

Really forced the arch in my upper back and this exercise felt awesome tonight, hit all the right muscles.

Dips are getting to that point in body weight exercises where they feel really fast and easy for the 1st few reps. My triceps tire quickly with higher reps so now I'm only doing sets of 3 reps I have more strength left in my triceps.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Stu, nice work on the Rack you will find that your lifts will improve a lot when you feel safe. Looks like you have the same rack as Doug and I, its been awesome for me so far. I havent put anything on the rack but wish I had as the paint is quite thin. Doug put some rubber or something on his, looks really good. He did a review of the rack and bench somewhere and you can see the bits he added there. I may try spraying mine with Plastidip and see how that holds up?
> 
> Edit: Decided against the Plastidip so popped out at Lunch and grabbed some 4.5mm thick 50mm wide hard rubber to cut up and stick to the bars. We will see how it goes tonight.


:thumb: had some 5mm thick foam draught excluder stuff which is just the right width for the catcher bars and hooks...

spent this morning moving some stuff around and making some room in the end of garage where the rack now lives...didn't realise just how big it is..!!!
need to paint white the end wall of garage at some point and may get hold of a mirror (for form check only), oh, and get the arnie poster i used to have on the back of my bedroom door back in the day..! 

love the bench too...feels so stable and solid and best of all, it is a little lower than the marcy one i had so think it''ll be much better for the bench press as was struggling before with positioning due to height of previous bench...?

have ordered some 1.25kg plates which should be here in next day or two..
re-read dougs review of rack and bench and just need now to mark the positions of where to put the bars for the different exercises...:thumb:

won't be able to do OHP inside of rack as arms at full stretch are an inch or two too high but will lift off front of rack...considered lifting whole rack with some plywood under the bottem but don't really want to do that...

off to work now but hoping to be back on training track tomorrow or weds latest...:thumb:

rgds stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> ...got a bodymax cf475 rack, cf430 bench and 160kg oly set.........


Great news:thumb: I remember getting my Oly barbell and thinking 'Christ, that's heavy I don't need any weights'!!



Bod42 said:


> The reasoning for doing opposites is so you can hit the exercise more than once a week which is better for beginners/Intermediate. The overall effect should be more strength and growth.
> [...]
> I feel its a general agreement between trainers that beginner and intermediates to an extent should be hitting each big exercise more than once a week. Once you get to an advanced level your body needs to longer to recover.


Ahhh it starts to make sense now. Thanks. :thumb: I think I'm going to up the weight a bit on the assistance since it's easier when you're not pre-fatigued.



BareFacedGeek said:


> ^^^ awesome mate, you will love it. I think we all have that rack. [...]
> I covered the safety bars and hooks with duck tape to stop the bar scratching the paint.


Oh no, there's a black sheep in the family; I don't have that one :doublesho

I got mine made at a fabricators that was next to a powder coaters. I wanted to be able to do dead hangs and shoulder presses inside the cage without touching the top or bottom. For some reason that ruled out all the standard size commercial ones I'm only 6ft.

Here she is, as I walk into for todays session. Recently bolted to the floor and like an old Volvo - boxy but safe


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> oh, and get the arnie poster i used to have on the back of my bedroom door back in the day..!
> 
> love the bench too...feels so stable and solid and best of all, it is a little lower than the marcy one i had so think it''ll be much better for the bench press as was struggling before with positioning due to height of previous bench...?


Post cross over!

Gotta have a picture of that when it's finished. Might have to get myself some old school Arnie action posters 

Rip (praise be on his name) says the bench should be 17 inches off ground with foam compressed (or 17.5 can't remember!). I use plates (as in the pic) to make up the difference. Helps my back but probably not the ideal.


----------



## Bod42

Looks like some people are getting some awesome home gyms in this thread now.

Must say I would have to disagree with Rip (I know stupid) on the bench height. Theres is an optimal leg position when benching so you can get the best leg drive, how can this always be 17" whel some people are 5' and other are 7' tall. I know personally I have really short legs so the shorter the bench the better for me but the Bodymax Bench isn't too bad for height, its def one of the better ones.

Rip doesnt suggest Mirrors either. I'm on the fence, I think they have their place and they are good for checking back alignment on Rows, Etc but you should never squat using a mirror as then you dont have a fixed point to look at. Also you want to improve your body spatial awareness so you know what its doing and where it is. 2c worth.

I'm only 5'10" and I have to do seated shoulder press as I hit the top of the rack. If you go this route then use the bench flat without a back support, this way its as close to the standing version as possible.


----------



## sfstu

was just about to reply to oats re; bench height...? my legs are fairly short and i know on my last bench (a marcy) it felt fairly high and could never really get my feet/legs positioned just right...haven't actually used this bodymax bench but did have a quick lay down on it when i got it home and it definately feels a better height for me...will find out soon as hoping to use it in anger tomorrow...

interesting point about the mirror...would probably be too focused on balancing the bar using the mirror rather than building a natural feel for it...also, been watching some of the olympic weightlifting and noticed that some of them often don't hold the bar totally horizontal when raised above head...
my mrs was already taking the mick about me looking at myself anyway...:lol:

but i'm going with the arnie poster... 

will bear in mind the seated OHP...thinking of lifting off the front of the rack and doing it free for now...only really need another inch or so but then agin its getting heavy for me so maybe won't be reaching full height anyway...

@oats...good looking rack mate and like those weight plates...:thumb:
have thought of fixing mine to concrete garage floor too but not sure i'll need too...had my previous rack/gym tip on me once doing a bench press (smith machine) and nearly went over on me..! i'll usually leave whatever heavy plates i'm not using on the back floor support just in case, maybe when i start doing some chins/pullups...?

will try and get a pic of my set up soon....

not sure which is my favourite arnie poster of the 4 below...?


----------



## Bod42

I face out of my rack now, when I first started I faced the wall the rack was against but found it hard to look at one spot as the wall was so close. So if I put a mirror on the wall I wouldnt use it anyway but it is good for some exercises. And everybody likes a good old school gun tense when you think no one is looking.

If you got the means to lift outside the rack this is definitely the best option. I do seated as the ceiling in my garage is very low so cant do them even outside my rack.

Out of those posters definitely the first one. I like comparing the golden era body builders with the body builders today, the ones today just look like freaks. Arnold looked like an extremely muscular human and more like an athelete, thin waist, big back, V taper but the guys today just look wrong. Arnold all the way.

Arnold was 107kg in competitions and 118kg off season at 6'2" (even though there are people who argue he's shorter). Coleman was 135kg in competitions, 150kg off season at 5'11". Arnold Chest 57" and 34" waist, Coleman Chest 58" and waist is 38" (has been reported to be over 40")

















Look at the difference in the waist size and the V taper difference.

And for the people who seem to believe Bodybuilders dont need strength check this out.

Arnold's Weights
Clean & press - 264 lb (120 kg)
Snatch - 243 lb (110 kg)
Clean & jerk - 298 lb (135 kg)
Squat - 215 kg (470 lb)
Bench press - 200 kg (440 lb)
Deadlift - 310 kg (680 lb)


----------



## sfstu

^^^totally agree with above comments re;oldschool builders like arnie vs current bodybuilders....:thumb:

well, just had 1st workout on new rack/bench/weights... oohhhh yeeeaaaahhhh....! i likey...:devil:

tues workout...

*bench 45kg 5x5
squat 65kg 5x5
bbrows 55kg 5x5*

dropped 2.5kg on both bench and squat as my 1.25kg plates hadn't arrived ,they actually arrived during last barbellrows set..!

BP felt really good, wished i'd gone up 2.5kg rather than down but nevermind..

squat felt good tho had to fiddle around a bit to get hooks at right height...

BBrows felt good too...felt too light really though this is the weight i should be on at the moment...

obviously being my 1st workout on new setup, there was/will be some tweaking of things, need to move a couple more things in garage to make enough room and need to get some proper labels for the rack to mark various heights of hooks and catch bars (after reading james's review thread of this rack..:thumb....for now its got bits of detailing blue masking tape in various places...
LOVE the bench :argie:, feels so solid and supportive and the height is just right...not sure what to make of the foam leg pads tho..? didn't use them as i put my legs to the sides....?
LOVE the rack too..:argie: felt so different lifting/squatting inside it with no worries of dropping anything...:thumb: need to slacken off all the bolts and get a setsquare on it though to make sure its all straight and parallel as catch bars were a little tight on one side...need to do the same with bench as legs are a little out of square to the actual bench...
LOVE the olympic plates too...:argie: they're the bodypower rubber radial ones with the 3 grips for easy lifting and just look so big! feel like i'm lifting more than i am if you know what i mean...need to get a 7ft bar though at some point soon (when funds have recovered) as the 6ft one only just clears the rack and can be a little awkward to line up widthwise with the hooks when tired...

so just to reiterate...
LOVE THIS SETUP..:argie::argie::argie:
will definately help/improve my lifting if only in a mental way and thats gotta be half the battle...:thumb: thanks to all you guys for recommending the rack..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Nice workout especially as your new to the gear. I find a lot of lifting is in the mind so if the gear feels right or wrong then it can have a massive impact. Same in any sport really. Bet your looking forward to putting up some good weights with your new gear

The foam leg thingy is really only used when doing decline bench Press to stop you sliding down the bench, other than that i never use mine. Actually you can do Glute ham raises using them so that saves another piece of equipment.

I don't mind being thanked but must say it was actually Doug who did the rack and bench review but I don't think that rack can be beaten for value for money and as you see Doug has had some serious weights in there and had no troubles.


----------



## sfstu

Yep, dougs review was what made my mind up almost before i started this 5x5...!:thumb:
strange to read on that thread from end of last year that he'd not long started on 5x5 and that he weighed 15.5stone and is now up by 2 stone and the weights he lifts now are MUCH heavier...


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> Yep, dougs review was what made my mind up almost before i started this 5x5...!:thumb:
> strange to read on that thread from end of last year that he'd not long started on 5x5 and that he weighed 15.5stone and is now up by 2 stone and the weights he lifts now are MUCH heavier...


Yep Doug has made amazing progress since starting. He is definitely an inspiration to what can be done on 5x5.

If you check out Starting Strength Forum, Rippletoe goes on about how important putting on weight is for strength/muscle gains. I have done it without gaining any weight but your see from my posts my gains arent in the same league as Doug's and I have really struggled at times.

The Dips bars for the new Rack are definitely worth the investment.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Box Squats: 127.5x 6sets x 3reps, 1set 5 reps.
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 75x5. 87.5x5, 97.5x5

Squats felt good tonight, for the first time in months I feel like I have things locked in so i can push this exercise. Was messing around with different grips between the sets and they all produced a very similar result really. I definitely had the bar to low and moving it up just a tiny bit feels so much better.

Snatch Grip deadlifts are the best for posterior chain strengthening. My problem is my grip but if I do an under/over grip then this exercise is easy. It's not the weight so much its the weird angle you pull at as your hands are so wide.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Yep Doug has made amazing progress since starting. He is definitely an inspiration to what can be done on 5x5.
> 
> If you check out Starting Strength Forum, Rippletoe goes on about how important putting on weight is for strength/muscle gains. I have done it without gaining any weight but your see from my posts my gains arent in the same league as Doug's and I have really struggled at times.
> 
> The Dips bars for the new Rack are definitely worth the investment.


he certainly is an inspiration for anyone who's thinking of lifting and he's certainly been a great help with advice and sending ebooks with various programmes etc...and the way/what he lifts..?-he's a MACHINE..!!

i think with hindsight, i should've lost some of my excess weight/fat _before _starting the 5x5 then concentrated on gaining muscle weight instead of trying to do both at the same time... 
i'm 17.5 stone and most of that is fat rather than muscle although that is slowly changing...(i hope...) i think if i'd tried to lose the excess weight/fat and dropped a couple of stone 1st then started lifting weights and put on muscle weight i'd feel better...still weighing about the same but obviously i must of gained some muscle (and lost some fat) as i am definately stronger now than i was 7 or 8 weeks ago when i started...?
i keep thinking about doing what i did before for fatloss (which was doing weights on alternate days then on the other days walking, with a heart monitor, off road for about 45mins every other day) as i managed to lose about 2 stone in 2 months this way...
thing is now, with the 5x5 i'm doing squats 3 times a week and as i've said before, i really don't want my legs any bigger than they are! hold most of my fat on my legs/lower half and wear 40" trousers not only for the waist size but also to fit my legs and backside in...!
squatwise, i really am not that bothered with the amount i can lift...? tbh, am happy with right now at 70kgs as never done squats before ever..! i know most people training concentrate on the upper half and ignore their lower half resulting in skinny legs but that would be my ideal..!

got about another 4 weeks on the 1st 5x5 and rather than doing a second run on it, fancy doing something similar like the "average f'ing programme" mentioned a few pages back where you only squat twice a week i think and you also add dips, chins and pullups...i got the dip bars with my rack thumb and have some resistance bands ready for when i start chins, then pullups as never been able to do them properly down to my weight vs muscle strength...feel that this would suit me personally better as would rather focus more on upper half...

gotta admit, yesterdays workout, i did a cheeky 3 negative chins at the end... couldn't resist what with those lovely new bars on the top of my new rack.... could only do the 3 but its a start...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout
> Box Squats: 127.5x 6sets x 3reps, 1set 5 reps.
> Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 75x5. 87.5x5, 97.5x5
> 
> Squats felt good tonight, for the first time in months I feel like I have things locked in so i can push this exercise. Was messing around with different grips between the sets and they all produced a very similar result really. I definitely had the bar to low and moving it up just a tiny bit feels so much better.
> 
> Snatch Grip deadlifts are the best for posterior chain strengthening. My problem is my grip but if I do an under/over grip then this exercise is easy. It's not the weight so much its the weird angle you pull at as your hands are so wide.


how come you do box squats...? for accuracy/consistancy..?


----------



## sfstu

question guys...
got a 6ft olympic bar with my rack/bench/weights etc but find its a little narrow between the collars with only about an inch spare when its on hooks (if that makes sense!) and can see me struggling a little putting it back on hooks after say bench press...
thinking of getting a bodypower 7ft oly bar from powerhouse fitness (20% discount at the mo which is £12 off=£47.99)...
question is, is the 7ft bar wider between the collars or is it the ends that are longer..? pretty sure its the actual bar between the collars thats wider on the 7ft bar but wanted to check..
cheers, rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> how come you do box squats...? for accuracy/consistancy..?


I like to have no doubts in my mind that I have got a weight. If you check out one of the latest T-Nation article where it suggests Low Box Squats 1 Week and then High Box Squats the next week, the difference in the guys weight is like 40kg and its only a few inches different. This means you may get what you believe is a PR but infact you have just squatted higher. I dont like that doubt in my mind.

Also there are a number of advantages, they let you sit back further which hits you posterior chain more which is better for sport, your depth is perfect everytime, easier to treach beginners, they make you faster as your starting from a dead stop and they make you less sore as they take away the stretch reflex. The last one is especially important as my backround was training Rugby players and if your squatting thursday you dont really want to be sore Saturday for the game.



sfstu said:


> question guys...
> got a 6ft olympic bar with my rack/bench/weights etc but find its a little narrow between the collars with only about an inch spare when its on hooks (if that makes sense!) and can see me struggling a little putting it back on hooks after say bench press...
> thinking of getting a bodypower 7ft oly bar from powerhouse fitness (20% discount at the mo which is £12 off=£47.99)...
> question is, is the 7ft bar wider between the collars or is it the ends that are longer..? pretty sure its the actual bar between the collars thats wider on the 7ft bar but wanted to check..
> cheers, rgds stu


Definitely wider between the collars. Mine has 4-5" at each side which sounds about right if its a foot longer.

Regarding your post 1699#, I would always suggest people doing strength training first. It is so much easier to loose weight when your carrying more muscle as muscle burns calories. Just becuase your bodyweight isnt changing doesn mean your body composition isnt which is the important factor. I have stayed exactly the same weight but I have got bigger, not exact science but bigger normally means more muscle which means I must have less fat.

The average f'ing programme looks like good progression, its very similar to the Stronglift and Starting Strength next progression program so your do well with that. Must admit I like Bodyweight exercises added to a program. Any exercise where your moving instead of staying still and moving a weight is better for you.


----------



## sfstu

cheers for that james...:thumb: thinking of making a box out of ply, more for consistancy than anything..? find myself looking down sometimes to check i'm getting to parallel... would take the guesswork out of it...
just need to get the missus now to hold a tape measure under my butt...

just seen a new 7ft oly bar localish to me on fleabay for £45...

another question...do you know if its possible to get extra hooks for the cf475..?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> The average f'ing programme looks like good progression, its very similar to the Stronglift and Starting Strength next progression program so your do well with that. Must admit I like Bodyweight exercises added to a program. Any exercise where your moving instead of staying still and moving a weight is better for you.


i do like the look of it and i really would like to be doing some bodyweight exercises albeit with assistance (negs/bands/etc)..! also, with the chins/dips it seems a little more focused on upper body which i also like the sound of...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I made my box out of an old pallet, cut all the lengths the same and glues them together into tiles and then nailed the tiles on top of each other until I got to my desired height. Weights an absolute tonne but there is no way its going to break under my weight as its totally solid. 

Box Squats arent for everyone, they have their disadvantages as well, you cant use as much weight and you cant use the stretch reflex which some say is major part of building muscle. Best thing is to keep both free squats and Box Squats in your program. Some people also argue that Box squats have no carry over to Raw free squats and are better for geared lifters but I disagree. Box Squats are perfect for geared lifters as they are closer to the movement but they still have carry over to Raw squats. There is no way if you have a 100kg free squat and you get your box squat up to 200kg that your free squat will stay at 100kg. 

I will probably never compete and I prefer Box squats so this is what i do the majority of the time. I may change to free squats on my next cycle but probably not. Some of the best trainers in the world choose Box Squats over Free squats but then there are top trainers who choose Free squats over Box squats so go with personnal preferences.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> I made my box out of an old pallet, cut all the lengths the same and glues them together into tiles and then nailed the tiles on top of each other until I got to my desired height. Weights an absolute tonne but there is no way its going to break under my weight as its totally solid.
> 
> Box Squats arent for everyone, they have their disadvantages as well, you cant use as much weight and you cant use the stretch reflex which some say is major part of building muscle. Best thing is to keep both free squats and Box Squats in your program. Some people also argue that Box squats have no carry over to Raw free squats and are better for geared lifters but I disagree. Box Squats are perfect for geared lifters as they are closer to the movement but they still have carry over to Raw squats. There is no way if you have a 100kg free squat and you get your box squat up to 200kg that your free squat will stay at 100kg.
> 
> I will probably never compete and I prefer Box squats so this is what i do the majority of the time. I may change to free squats on my next cycle but probably not. Some of the best trainers in the world choose Box Squats over Free squats but then there are top trainers who choose Free squats over Box squats so go with personnal preferences.


i was thinking of making just a top and 2 sides with a support so it won't be solid enough to sit on but more to let my butt know when its at right height..?
i'm probably missing the point totally as not sure i really get what and why for box squats so will do some reading and maybe watch a couple o vids and go from there...:thumb:

thurs workout...

*OHP 45kg 5x5
squat 67.5kg 5x5
deadlift 85kg 1x5*

OHP felt heavy but good...managed all the sets/reps but was definately slowing down towards the end...really struggled last time at 42.5kg so think the combo of a weeks holiday then the mental magic of using new rack and oly weights helped at 45kg... can't quite do them in the rack (height) so lifting off of the front but facing the rack....

squat was as well heavy but good...felt good loading a couple of big 20kg oly plates on the bar, they're huge... tbh, was only going to do 3 sets of 5 but it felt good and doable so did the proper 5x5...

deadlift was ok...feeling heavy but only 1 set so doable...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Theres 2 main types of box squats, what I call normal box squats where u squat down actually sit on the box and release the tension in your legs and then stand up and then there are touch and go squats which are where you barely touch the box and basically just use it as a depth guide.

Defranco uses box squats a lot with his athletes and he has some good vids of his high school kids box squatting stupid weights.

Nice workout.

Edit: You should be able to get extra hooks as they do them in my part of the world. Their 25 quid over here.


----------



## Bod42

Friday workout.
Med Ball shoulder throws: 3x5
Seated shoulder press: 50kg x 6sets x 3reps, 1set x 10reps.
Weight Dips: BW x 5,5, 112.5kg x 12
Neutral grip chin ups: 6x3, 1x4

I was pretty happy with my shoulder press tonight, shoulder hurt quite back but it must trap a nerve or something as it kills my biceps and effects my grip. To get 10reps after 6previous sets was quite good.

As always I like weighted dips but they do seem to pull my shoulder quite Abit. Making steady progress on these weight wise which is good.

I did 5sets of chin ups between my shoulder press which made the workout a lot quicker and made me work Abit harder.

All in all a very successful week in the gym and my legs hurt 2day from squats but in al the right places so my form must have been better


----------



## sfstu

Nice workout james..:thumb:
i too have a nagging shoulder problem and would struggle with dips or chins let alone between shoulder press sets...
can imagine that seated shoulder press would be harder than standing shoulder press..?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

saturdays workout...:thumb:

*bench press 47.5kg 5x5
squat 70kg 5x5
BBrows 57.5kg 5x5*

all felt good today.... squats seem to be getting easier..?:doublesho
not heavy weights yet by any stretch but heavy enough for me and more than i've ever lifted in the past....
new bench,rack and oly weights definately giving me a mental boost...:thumb:
off now to powerhouse fitness chessington to hopefully pick up my 7ft oly barbell to replace the 6ft one...20% off all olympic stuff at the moment due to olympics...
rgds stu
edit; powerhouse still don't have one in stock but will order and hold the olympic discount for me...


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 2 Week 3 - 5,3,1+ sets*

*Sh Press* 5 reps @ 48.5kg = 1RM 56.5 (vs 55 cycle 1)

*Deadlift * 8 reps @ 125kg = 1RM 158 (vs 144 cycle 1)

*Bench * 3 reps @ 73kg = 1RM 80.5 (vs 80 cycle 1)

*Squat* 6 reps @ 100kg = 1RM 120 (vs 120 cycle 1)

So there we go. A pretty cr** set of numbers all round  I was doing those weights (and more) for 3x5 at the end of Starting Strength and I thought they were cr** then! Shoulder press was too far from my face and by the time I realised this on the 4th rep I'd expended too much energy. Deadlift was fine if a bit long between reps. Bench just stopped moving! I was so pissed, I sat up, had a drink, chalked my hands, changed the CD then went again; pushed 3 reps and failed again. Grrrrrrrrr. Hopeless  Squats were OK but a bit slow and felt heavier than they should.

Not sure if timings had something to do with it: Press on Sunday PM, Deads Monday AM; Bench Thurs PM, Squats Fri AM. I don't think so. Next cycle I'm going to go up in a smaller incrememnt (1.25kg upper body, 2.5kg lower body) and chase the reps. Also, going to make main priority of the cycle the cardio sprints. Lastly going to increase the assistance work weights from 50%-60% to 60% to 70%. Part of me feels pretty disconsolate with the numbers. Luckily I also have the no quit part that says attack, attack, attack :thumb:. I also like the routine which is helpful.

*Olympics* - a great spectacle. Good to see bits of the lifts on the stage e.g. back and shin angle on the deadlift, elbows high on the clean, elbows forward on the should press. 230kg opener on the clean & jerk is ridiculous!



Bod42 said:


> Theres 2 main types of box squats, what I call normal box squats where u squat down actually sit on the box and release the tension in your legs and then stand up and then there are touch and go squats which are where you barely touch the box and basically just use it as a depth guide.


I had a look in SS:3 after reading this thread. He says that you sit back alot more than normal, with a tighter back angle because of this, in order to compensate for the lack of the stretch reflex at the bottom. I've been squatting to the box and pausing for a second for the assistance sets recently. Sure makes it harder. Also, using a box is a nice form check. I was surprised how high up the box felt.


----------



## Bod42

The box will normally feel higher as the angle of your knee is less than a free squat. Dave Tate says it has about a 10% carry over to free squats. Im on the fench if I should free squat or not for my next cycle as I have always box squatted so should be a nice shock to the system.

I always teach people box squats before free squats. Nearly everyone can box squat but not everyone can free squat.

When I start 5/3/1 I'm thinking of doing the opposite box squat heavy and then free squat assistant.

Don't get to disheartened mate everyone has there up and down workouts, weeks, months, etc. Look at my log I did shockingly last month but feel really good this month but we will see over the next few weeks


----------



## Alex L

A few quick questions for the 5/3/1 guys:

I don't have Excel, is there another type of (free) program I can use to work out all the numbers?

For Squat days is stiff legged D/lifts and seated/standing calf raises ok for assistance exercises?

And just for a bit of fun, today was the first day I've had to roll out from a failed rep, went to do a squat (lighter than I normally do too lol) and my knee gave out like when someone taps the back of it and you fall over. No pain or damage, luckily no-one was at the gym.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Don't get to disheartened mate everyone has there up and down workouts, weeks, months, etc. Look at my log I did shockingly last month but feel really good this month but we will see over the next few weeks


You're right, you had a torrid month and now it seems to have suddenly released. I dislike gardening because you do something and then a year later find out it was a complete waste of time  A months cycle with no progress has a similar feeling. Where 5\3\1 is good is that I can pick out progress if I look for it e.g. number of chins, no doms after lunges, etc. My reckoning is that I should make the most of the summer weather and daylight and it will, without fail, carry over to the cardio.



Alex L said:


> A few quick questions for the 5/3/1 guys:
> 
> I don't have Excel, is there another type of (free) program I can use to work out all the numbers?
> 
> For Squat days is stiff legged D/lifts and seated/standing calf raises ok for assistance exercises?


He says you can do pretty much whatever you want on the assistance days as long as you do it for a few cycles. There was a dicussion on here recently about deadlift frequency, but I think the general view would be to deadlift one session for mainlifts and once for assistance otherwise recovery becomes an issue.

I think the website I used was Blackironbeast. You punch in your reps and weights, say what plates you've got, and which assistance scheme you're one and it does the rest.


----------



## Bod42

Alex L said:


> A few quick questions for the 5/3/1 guys:
> 
> I don't have Excel, is there another type of (free) program I can use to work out all the numbers?
> 
> For Squat days is stiff legged D/lifts and seated/standing calf raises ok for assistance exercises?
> 
> And just for a bit of fun, today was the first day I've had to roll out from a failed rep, went to do a squat (lighter than I normally do too lol) and my knee gave out like when someone taps the back of it and you fall over. No pain or damage, luckily no-one was at the gym.


I did reply to this last night but stupid phone doesnt post sometimes.

I have 5/3/1 in Open Office which is free if you want it.

Wendler says to pick best bang for buck exercises and I wouldnt really consider calf exercises in that category but theres nothing stopping you if you really want them in there. The 5/3/1 lifts are the majority of the program.



Oats said:


> You're right, you had a torrid month and now it seems to have suddenly released.


We shall see in 3 weeks how I'm doing this month as these are the lighter weight weeks.


----------



## Bod42

http://articles.elitefts.com/traini...-i-in-the-gym-because-i-have-a-d-d-rach-edit/

Great article. Explains the thinking behind 5/3/1 very well. Dont major in the minor.


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> another question...do you know if its possible to get extra hooks for the cf475..?
> rgds stu


I was just looking on Strength Shop and recalled this thread :speechles. They've got some J-hooks (new products) for 60mm box section racks for £40. Dunno if that's suitable or not.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout.
Sprints: 8x10m, 2x20m
Deadlifts: 135x6setsx 3reps, 135x7
Front squats: 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 97.5x5
Grip work

Not a bad workout, didn't really feel tired after the 3rep sets but 7sets is quite Abit of volume so pleased to get through it.

Front squat seriously smash my core after deadlifts. This is an easy weight for my legs but my core and upper back struggle to hold the weight. Pleased to get all the reps with only 90 seconds rest.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout.
Sprints: 8x10m, 2x20m
Deadlifts: 135x6setsx 3reps, 135x7
Front squats: 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 97.5x5
Grip work

Not a bad workout, didn't really feel tired after the 3rep sets but 7sets is quite Abit of volume so pleased to get through it.

Front squat seriously smash my core after deadlifts. This is an easy weight for my legs but my core and upper back struggle to hold the weight. Pleased to get all the reps with only 90 seconds rest.


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I was just looking on Strength Shop and recalled this thread :speechles. They've got some J-hooks (new products) for 60mm box section racks for £40. Dunno if that's suitable or not.


cheers for the tip oats...will check it out...:thumb:

tues workout...

*squats 72.5kg 5x5
OHP 47.5 5x5
deadlift 90kg 1x5*

squats felt heavier today than sat but putting it down to heat and not feeling so good today....
OHP was really heavy...really had to strain to lift the bar and only just managed it, last set was pretty ugly...1st stall coming methinks.... dunno whether to do the same weight next time rather than try and do 50kg but with really bad form as the reps i did today involved most of my body rather than shoulders. don't think it was the heat, think i'm nearing my limit..? 
deadlift feeling pretty heavy too now...but only the 1 set...

dunno whether its the heat and drinking loads cos of it but just feel bloated,weak and not in the zone at the mo...eating hasn't been spot on last few days either...
but pleased with myself for doing the workout today as in the past i wouldn't have bothered...
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> OHP was really heavy...really had to strain to lift the bar and only just managed it, last set was pretty ugly...1st stall coming methinks.... dunno whether to do the same weight next time rather than try and do 50kg but with really bad form as the reps i did today involved most of my body rather than shoulders. don't think it was the heat, think i'm nearing my limit..?


Stu, I would advise not upping the weight if your form is off. Repeat with the same weight and you'll probably find your form has improved. 
Attempting to lift a weight with bad form is a fast track to injury and potentially a bad one that could put you out of lifting for a while.


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Stu, I would advise not upping the weight if your form is off. Repeat with the same weight and you'll probably find your form has improved.
> Attempting to lift a weight with bad form is a fast track to injury and potentially a bad one that could put you out of lifting for a while.


exactly what i was thinking phil....:thumb:
will try it next time with same weight and see how it goes...that workout didn't feel great anyway but also think i'm nearing a sticking point anyway on OHP...surprised to have got this far really as shoulders have always been weakest part and have had a dodgy shoulder for a few years now, though has been better since working out so still happy with the weight i'm lifting..
would like to get to the round number of 50kgs tho...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Throws: 3 x 5
Bench Press: 92.5x1, 102.5x1, 110 x 5 sets x 3 reps.
Pendlay Rows: 65x5, 75x5, 82.5x6
Dips: BW x 10, 10, 8, 8, 5 = 41

Bench Press didnt feel the best during warm up but my strength was still there. My best aspect of benching is that I can get the bar in the groove nearly every time which allows me to put maximum force through the bar. 100kg I can do this perfectly but when I start getting over 100kg a few reps I miss the groove like on 1 rep I must have been 3-4" towards my face during the decent. Anyway last set I was going for 5-6 reps but I lost my shoulder tightness on the first rep and I knew from then that I wouldnt get my target, I was surprised to get 3 reps as my form wasnt the best. 5 sets of 3 reps at 110kg i can live with though. That was my last volume bench session before my all out bench next friday, 120kg for 6 reps.

Rows felt really good today, i concentrated on getting my body perfectly horizontal so I could use my back completely for the movement. Must say I like the 5/3/1 for assistant exercises as I dont really set a target, I just rep out based on how I feel that day.

Always like dips but dont like higher rep stuff so these are beginning to be love hate relatioship but I'm going to keep doing them as my aim is to hit 5 sets of 20 reps to go with my 5 sets of 10 reps Pull Ups. I recon when I can do that my body would have changed quite abit.

Stu, I second whats been said. Theres only one competing Power lifter in this thread so theres no point risking an injury when the rest of us do this to get stronger but also get healthier. I dont think the little extra weight is worth the risk of an injury.


----------



## sfstu

^^^nice workout james...:thumb: i _dream_ of 10 dips or chins, let alone sets of 10 of them...

thurs workout....

*bench 50kg 5x5
squat 72.5kg 5x5
BBRows 60kg 5x5*

bench felt good once i'd got myself into position properly....never heard before starting this 5x5, about getting your shoulders back and chest high before lifting....it works though...
squat was ok...doable though feeling heavy and as you probably all know, not my favourite exercise...
BBRows were heavy but doable...as bod42 above, tried to keep my back horizontal but think maybe i should be wearing a belt now...?
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> ^^^nice workout james...:thumb: i _dream_ of 10 dips or chins, let alone sets of 10 of them...
> 
> thurs workout....
> 
> *bench 50kg 5x5
> squat 72.5kg 5x5
> BBRows 60kg 5x5*
> 
> bench felt good once i'd got myself into position properly....never heard before starting this 5x5, about getting your shoulders back and chest high before lifting....it works though...
> squat was ok...doable though feeling heavy and as you probably all know, not my favourite exercise...
> BBRows were heavy but doable...as bod42 above, tried to keep my back horizontal but think maybe i should be wearing a belt now...?
> rgds stu


Nice workout Stu.

Pinching your shoulder blades together is actually safer and also allows you to lift more and we all like more weight so win win :thumb:

I'm doing pendlay rows which is where you stop and deload the weight between each rep which normally allows the body to be more horizontal. The more horizontal the body is the higher you can pull up the body which is better for raw lifters. I row to the exact spot that I bench to so my sternum or bottom of my pecs.









Some people teach the Rows like this but this way you row to your stomach, this allows more weight as its a shorter ROM but doesnt hit your upper back as well.









Great article http://stronglifts.com/how-to-master-barbell-row-technique/


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> exactly what i was thinking phil....:thumb:
> will try it next time with same weight and see how it goes...that workout didn't feel great anyway but also think i'm nearing a sticking point anyway on OHP...


I think ohp is usually the first one that stalls. To my mind, 2.5kg a session every time is a heck of lot unless you're 16 and drinking a gallon of milk. I don't think the age demographic on DW is quite that. Micro weights do help. 
I always think that my ohp shold progess better. Maybe it should, but a Bill Starr article on SS said it took him 3 years to a bodyweight ohp so it's obviously a very slow process. A shame really because it's my joint favourite lift (together with deadlift). Picking stuff up and shoving it above your head has a primitive satisfaction about it. My kids clamour to be lifted out of the bath at the same time, one on each arm. I just need to stop feeding them as they're getting  heavy


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> I'm doing pendlay rows which is where you stop and deload the weight between each rep which normally allows the body to be more horizontal. The more horizontal the body is the higher you can pull up the body which is better for raw lifters. I row to the exact spot that I bench to so my sternum or bottom of my pecs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some people teach the Rows like this but this way you row to your stomach, this allows more weight as its a shorter ROM but doesnt hit your upper back as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great article http://stronglifts.com/how-to-master-barbell-row-technique/


seems like i'm doing pendlay rows too...! been keeping my back as close to horizontal as possible and have been touching the floor with the weights between reps,also touching lower pecs/sternum...
didn't plan to do it this way, just ended up doing it this way...that link didn't work for me but remember reading that the 2nd picture of BBRows was how dorian yates used to row and was not the recommended way..?
certainly feeling some doms in my upper back today (more than my lats).
does pendlay rows hit your lats less...?
thinking that when i move to the A F'n Programme i'll be doing (or trying!) chins/pullups so this will hit lats more anyway..?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I think ohp is usually the first one that stalls. To my mind, 2.5kg a session every time is a heck of lot unless you're 16 and drinking a gallon of milk. I don't think the age demographic on DW is quite that. Micro weights do help.
> I always think that my ohp shold progess better. Maybe it should, but a Bill Starr article on SS said it took him 3 years to a bodyweight ohp so it's obviously a very slow process. A shame really because it's my joint favourite lift (together with deadlift). Picking stuff up and shoving it above your head has a primitive satisfaction about it. My kids clamour to be lifted out of the bath at the same time, one on each arm. I just need to stop feeding them as they're getting  heavy


read too on SL that OHP will usually be 1st to stall...? 
got it to do on tomorrows workout so gonna stick with same weight as last time (47.5kg) and see how it goes...?
think you could be right with microplates...could do now with maybe only creeping up by a kilo at a time on OHP...smallest plates i got tho are 1.25kg...
could use my old standard bar and weights but i love my oly set....
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

just went and picked up my new 7ft olympic bar, got a deal from an ebay seller off of ebay... like new condition, it looks to have the brass bushings wereas the 1st bar i had that came with the oly weights i bought was a 6ft one and the ends were kinda loose and rattley..?
very solid and heavy...and therein lies the problem...


never weighed the previous bar til tonight and now i find that the weights i've been posting (and thinking i've been doing) are actually about 5kg lighter than i thought...
just had to take a deep breath and alter my SL spreadsheet...
puts me back a week or so weights wise though i know it doesn't really matter, they're just numbers right...?
oh well...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Friday workout:
Jumps: 3x5
Squats: 140x6sets x 3reps
Snatch Grip Deadlift: 82.5x3, 92.5x3, 102.5x3
Bulgarian split squats: 5kg x 3x 12

Squats felt the best they have in ages with me changing my arm position. I feel like all my power is going through the bar instead of just trying to straighten my back the entire rep. I was aiming for 5-7 reps but I'm pleased with 3 reps as the high number of sets does catch up with you.

I push really hard through my heels so this exercise hits your hams and touted brilliantly.

Single leg work is always good to keep limb strength balanced but this really don't matter.


----------



## sfstu

sat workout...with _revised_ weights....

*OHP 40kg 5x5
squat 70kg 5x5
deadlift 90kg 1 x5*

OHP, was dropping the weight down to previous workouts anyway then a little more for change in oly bar discrepency...heavy but doable...was a little wobbly on it but could be cos i struggled a little with new bar due to width-about 8" clearance from garage walls so may use 6ft bar for this in future...really think i need to get some micro plates so i can increase this by 1kg each time rather than trying to do 2.5kg...
squat was ok, feels heavy but doable...trying to not lean forwards too much..
deadlift feeling heavy but can do as only 1 set...


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Shoulder Med ball throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 55x4x3, 55x5
Dips: BWx3,3, 120 x 10
Neutral Chin Ups: 6x3, 1x4

Pretty good workout, felt the best I have in ages but didn't quite hit my goal reps on shoulder Press.

Dips felt great and I could have got 2-3 more reps so the 5/3/1 seems to be working well on the assistance exercises.

Chin Ups felt good to. Did them between shoulder Press sets so workout only took like 20mins


----------



## sfstu

mondays workout...

*bench 47.5kg 5x5
squat 72.5kg 5x5
BBR 55kg 5x5*

all felt good tonight...:thumb:
quite often tired when getting in from work around 7 and especially in this heat but felt positive all day and looking forward to workout,also had a fan running in the garage which helped !

yesterday i read through jim wendlers 5/3/1 pdf that doug sent me thumb and gotta say, i love the guy's style, humour and attitude... gave me an understanding of what some of you guys are doing and can now make more sense of your workouts ...also gave me some good tips and a little more focus/commitment...will definately be giving it a go at some point though not for a while as have other things planned before moving to 5/3/1/...

rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Wendler is the man, if your ever confused about anything just listen to him and you wont go far wrong. I love his simple approach, lift heavy things, eat and sprint, theres nothing better.

The original 5/3/1 is definitely for intermediate/advanced trainers but you can make minor alterations to the program that make it good for beginners/intermediates which means you can literally stay on it for years with just little changes.


----------



## sfstu

will definately get on to 5/3/1 at some point...:thumb:
got another 2 or 3 weeks of SL 5x5 to do then really wanting to try the Average F'n Programme (http://ironstrong.org/index.php?/topic/1157-the-average-fn-program-a-simple-and-efficient-training-template/) which seems like a good progression from SL 5x5...? 
like idea of squatting twice rather than 3 times a week and also really want to incorporate chins/pullups/dips for upper body...

however, really thinking that i should spend a month or 2 concentrating on losing some weight first as seems to be common consensus that best way to be able to do these moves is to loose weight first...?
so far on SL 5x5 have put on a few pounds which i'm pretty sure most of which is muscle as i'm definately stronger but am nearer 18 stone than 17 stone doublesho) so pretty sure i could drop a stone if not more in a couple of months which would do me good with regards chins/dips etc, not to mention mentally...
not sure how to go about this lifting wise though...? don't wanna ease off the lifting as i'm pleased with the progress i'm making lifting wise...
thinking of doing an extra month or so of 5x5 but concentrate on doing a fair bit of cardio on in between days, probably walking or cycling...? tbh, not been doing anything really cardio wise, just the sl 5x5 lifting...
at start of wendlers 5/3/1 he talks about losing some weight by eating less and walking...:thumb:

"_My first order of business was losing weight. I was about 280 pounds, and I wanted to be able to tie my shoes without turning red. I wanted to be able to walk down the street without losing my breath. Like many people, I played football in high school and college. I was in shape then, and could do just about anything. Fast forward five years, and I was at the bottom of the food chain. That feeling of being a fat-ass was awful. I was exactly what I despised._"

"_A few months later, I'd managed to lose about 25 pounds. Simply walking and not eating as much helped me out immensely. I was able to move again. I could run, sprint, jog, jump rope or do just about anything_"

so what do you guys think...?
rgds stu

p.s. off to work shortly so prob won't be on til this eve...


----------



## Oats

*Wendler 5\3\1 Cycle 2 Week 4 *

On second and third week of hols now. First week at seaside so did three one hour bike rides. My ar"* was too sore by fourth night  so did hill sprints.

Back home for three days so decide on old school sessions to hit all body parts quickly :speechles
*SS 3x5 @ 80%ish*
Friday - Squat (85kg), Press (37.5kg), chins
Sunday - Squat (85kg), Bench (60kg), Deads (85kg, don't tell sfstu but went 3x5)

Really enjoyed them. Life doesn't feel the same now I don't squat every session. These were like putting on an old comfy jumper.

Making the recovery week a two week slot due to unavailability of gym. Couple more hill sprints this week for sure though.



sfstu said:


> will definately get on to 5/3/1 at some point
> ... like idea of squatting twice rather than 3 times a week and also really want to incorporate chins/pullups/dips for upper body...
> however, really thinking that i should spend a month or 2 concentrating on losing some weight first as seems to be common consensus that best way to be able to do these moves is to loose weight first...?


Let me say outright: I've no idea about losing weight on SS! Rip regularly talks about a paleo diet (and lots of it) during SS whilst cutting back on GOMAD for those wanting to loose weight. From what I've read of others, and my experience, is that you grow much more rapidly in the first month or two then less quickly. I wouldn't see weight gains as being linear. SS is also typically 6-9 months before folks level off and switching to intermediate. Two months has only just started. I guess if fat loss is a real concern you could try something like Matt Lovell's 4 week fat loss, or Brendan Chaplin's Lean Body Challenge then come back to SS novice. I think if you look at your weight as a concern during SS you'll dig yourself into a hole with recovery. A a recovery pit on SS is a dark place to be.

Have you introduced 80% squat mid week if you want to reduce the squat volume? Body weight certainly is an issue with chins etc. I don't think the programme you link to is that different except it takes out powercleans and a squat day. Could perhaps aid in revocering but would be less work volume and isn't that something you're after to reduce bodyweight? 1 or 2 chins doesn't seem to equate to a set of powercleans. Thinking about it, aren't you on SL that's 5x5? Is it the 3x5 that's the attraction?

I think a long run on SS is a great introduction if only because it cuts down all options for ducking out and really makes you dig deep and learn e.g. how to lift when sore, lift when injured, how a weight can become a mental barrier, having to lift three itmes a week regardless of whether you want to or not, what being mashed and still performing really feels like (and it's alot further down the road then you think) etc etc



Bod42 said:


> The original 5/3/1 is definitely for intermediate/advanced trainers but you can make minor alterations to the program that make it good for beginners/intermediates which means you can literally stay on it for years with just little changes.


The second edition has a 'permitted' beginners variant that (unsurprisingly given they're friends) refers to Rip and full body workouts:thumb:

Monday
Squat - 5/3/1 sets/reps Bench - 55%x5, 65×5%, 75%x5 Assistance work
Wednesday
Deadlift - 5/3/1 sets/reps Press - 5/3/1 sets/reps Assistance work
Friday
Bench - 5/3/1 sets/reps Squat - 55%x5, 65%x5, 75%x5 Assistance work

Wendler does say the normal workout is fine but to my mind, that's very slow progress for a beginner compared to SS\SL


----------



## sfstu

deads- 3x5 ? he should be bollocked, immediately, by everyone on this thread!!:devil::lol:

thanks for your reply colin...:thumb:
hear what you are saying bout changing programmes after a couple a months... and true, not a fan of doing squats and doing a 80% midweek sounds good to reduce the volume but then again i'm still making progress on them, just don't like doing them and got a thing in my head about not wanting to increase the size of my legs as they've always been big anyway (though not particularly strong)... doing it twice a week on the AF'nP would be a personal bonus in that respect but like more the idea of the upper body stuff like the chins/dips etc (and thats where the weight loss thought comes in..)?

originally started all this to lose some weight (fat!) as well as build muscle etc etc and focus isn't so much for me on what numbers i can lift but more on how i feel/look etc...yes, i'd like to be able to say i can bench x amount or deadlift x amount but more than that just wanna feel strong and also feel good about myself physically and part of that is losing some excess weight...
with hindsight, i should've maybe done the fatloss thing _before_ starting the lifting but it'd been so long since i'd done any weights i couldn't wait to get started..!
maybe i should stay on SL for a while yet before changing and still start doing some cardio (walking/cycling etc) and see how it goes....another 3 weeks to go on SL then thats 12 weeks done...i think SS is pretty similar to SL so maybe not worth switching to that after getting used to SL...
5/3/1 i think is a little way off for me yet although i do like the look/sound of it but think thats it requires a little more knowledge/experience than i have right now...
all in all, pleased with my progress so far...although the weights i'm lifting are pretty light compared to most of you guys, they're more than i've ever 
been able to do in the past and i definately feel stronger and have definately changed shape a little so it is working...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Obviously Dips and Chins will be easier if your lighter as your lifting less weight but you can still do them if your heavy. I'm 110kg and I'm doing Dips with 22.5kg extra for 8 reps so it can be done.

SL isnt just a 12 week program, the site goes on about that and as Oats says the beginner phase is normally about 6-9 months so you got a lot of progress to make yet. SL kind of turns into SS in the end as the main difference is SL is 5x5 and SS is 3x5. The other difference is Cleans but some people dont like to learn these and change them to Rows much to the disgust of Rip. But once you have to deload 3 times on SL then you change to 3x5.

The best way to progress is probably to follow what Rip suggest (and Oats) and stick to the beginner program as long as possible BUT like I always say most of us in here are doing this for a hobby so why do soemthing if you dont enjoy it. Dont get me wrong I'm not giving you an excuse to program hop just because your bored but I know from personal experience that squatting 3 times a week is mentally draining so you may actually get more from a program that squats trice a week.

I have never used the Average F'n Programme but looking at it, it looks like a logical step when you reach intermediate level as its similar to rips intermediate suggested program.

The fat loss decision is always a hard one, I basically sat down a year ago and wrote down my goals and what programs I would do over the next year and what I would be concentrating on. I have lifted for a year concentrating on strength but havent gained any weight and in a few weeks I will be dieting. It's a lot easier to diet once you have more muscle but its a hard choice to make, we can give advice but at the end of the day you need to make the decision but once you make one you need to give it 100%. When I trained when I was younger I would start a bulk and 2-3 weeks later I would stop as I lost my abs and would begin a diet. This jumping all over the place and trying to complete multiple goals gets you no where. Wendler address' this in his 5/3/1 book.

As for dieting I can only tell you what I'm doing and why. I'm doing 3 workouts per week and using the 5/3/1 for the first exercise to keep my strength up. This is very important and a major step people miss. You will read the mags that tell you to do higher reps to burn fat but I believe its imperative you leave a strength exercise in the program.

I will then do higher volume assistance exercises will rest between 45-90 seconds and also superset exercises if they are antagonist muscles. This should help in a number of ways, increasing your heart rate, burning calories, building muscle, etc. I will then be finishing my workouts with Complex's and/or challenges.

Diet, I do not want to become super skinny or any crap, I just want to be in slightly better shape so I have deiceded based on my Body fat % that I need to loose between 5-10kg. I will be following a very low carb day on my off days and then a medium carb day on my training days. This way I should keep my muscle and strength better than a full out diet and will keep my energy higher so I can continue to train hard.


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> deads- 3x5 ? he should be bollocked, immediately, by everyone on this thread!!:devil::lol:


Hehe - I won't post my latest workout then


----------



## sfstu

cheers for reply james...:thumb:
i knew SL is an ongoing programme and not just the 1st 12 weeks i'm coming towards the end of but maybe i lost track of that, when i used to train years back, it was the done thing to change your training programme every few weeks...
but, it _is_ working for me...:thumb:
i suppose having read a few different programmes now and seeing exercises i wanna be doing like chins and dips for example was making me think of "jumping ship", that combined with my impatience and wanting everything at once! is what lead to me thinking of trying something else...
as i've said, the SL is working for me and i am enjoying it so no reason to change whats working i guess...
ok, lets call all this a focus poke in the ribs...
dietwise, i think i'm on the right lines but could do with some improvement i know...to put things in perspective, i've put on maybe 4 or 5 lbs in roughly 2 months but started lifting at 20kgs for everything and this has gone steadily up as it should and i know i've built muscle so must have lost some fat in that time because that 4 or 5lbs gain, if just muscle, can't be enough to lift what i can now...i mean, i couldn't do 5 press ups at the start but will be benching 50kgs on friday, if i was squatting down on the floor i couldn't get up without pushing myself up with my hands on my knees but will be squatting 75kgs parallel on friday...
right, it'll be another 3 months on the SL then, then i'll see where i am then and we can go from there...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Hehe - I won't post my latest workout then


after the telling off i got...? can't believe you lot....


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> after the telling off i got...? can't believe you lot....


To be fair, it was the only exercise I did that session. I've now moved to an intermediate style of program now that I am actively trying to lose BF.

If you are squatting at maximum effort on the same day as dead lifting, then definitely keep the deads to just one set. AFP has you doing 3x3 but only because there are no squats on that day.

Keep with SL until you get well past a 100kg squat (and probably over 125kg) - in fact, only consider the change to AFP when you find you actually need more than 1 full days rest between deadlift+squat day and the next session.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Springs: 5x10m 30rest, 4x20m 60rest, 1x30m
Deadlifts: 147.5x5x3
Front Squats: 80x3, 92.5x3, 102.5x3
Ab Work

Not my best deadlift workout but I'm trying to keep my back flatter as I think its rounding slightly. This just changes my position slightly and hits different muscles. Still got minimum reps so not all bad.

I.seem to be making the best and easiest progress on the assistant exercises that I'm using the 5/3/1 protocol on so this just makes me want to do the program any more. I'm pleased with over 100kg front squat especially after deadlifts.


----------



## sfstu

wednesday workout...

*OHP 42.5kg 3x5
squat 75kg 5x5
deadlift 95kg 5x5*

struggled with the OHP... only managed 3 sets, just couldn't do it?...think i'm gonna drop down to 40kgs for a couple of sessions as i'm wobbling all over the place so need to lighten it slightly and work on form...can't see me going too much heavier on this...
squat was ok, heavy but doable...(haven't dropped it to 80%, yet)
deadlift-gave up after 3 lifts.... only 5kgs heavier than last time but just gave up on it...lower back didn't feel too good plus was fed up after OHP...

pretty cr ap workout really, mondays workout done at same time with same food during day, same sleep etc felt like one of the best so really fed up after today's...
i know some workouts are better than others and some will be downright s but can't help but wonder at how unable to lift some of these weights i was today...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi All :wave::wave:


Been off a while, Hamstring is fixing well :thumb:

I have changed my lower body workouts for a while, to help recover & increase my strength/ confidence in the squat & deadlift.

This Monday I started with 40Kg!!! :doublesho:doublesho


I’ll add 5kg per session – 10kg per week. All going well around October I’ll be back to using around 160Kg-170Kg for both lifts. I won’t post these workouts; you’ll see my upper body routines as I will pick up where I left off.

While in recovery my squat & deadlift will be done twice a week with a 1X5 routine & all my upper body will stay on the 5/3/1, were I left off. 

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Hi doug, good to hear from you, but sorry to hear about injury... thought you were away on holiday...!
How'd it happen...?


----------



## Bod42

Good to see you back Doug. Good to hear the Hamstring is fixed and sounds like you made a very clever plan to get back into things.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> Hi doug, good to hear from you, but sorry to hear about injury... thought you were away on holiday...!
> How'd it happen...?


Go back a few pages, done it while doing barbell rows........I know WTF!!!!!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Good to see you back Doug. Good to hear the Hamstring is fixed and sounds like you made a very clever plan to get back into things.


So Am i James :thumb: Hate not lifting :devil:

If the injury recovers I will be back on track in a few months. To be honest as long as im using at least 150Kg for my squat & deadlift by December I will be happy :thumb: Then do all my workouts 5/3/1 style :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

As I say mate I think your being extremely clever setting relistic goals. I know everyone in here wants their goals yesterday but no point starting training again and then hurting yourself soon again.

Im going to do a 3 month diet so I will be starting 5/3/1 for the long run in January. Probably start with the Simple Strength Template.


----------



## Guest

Welcome back Doug. Sorry to hear about your injury. I hope you manage to recover quickly from it and get back to lifting serious weights soon. 
I think when I pulled my tricep (when messing about with an empty bar!) it took 6 months before it was fully healed and I didn't experience any pain from it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> As I say mate I think your being extremely clever setting relistic goals. I know everyone in here wants their goals yesterday but no point starting training again and then hurting yourself soon again.
> 
> Im going to do a 3 month diet so I will be starting 5/3/1 for the long run in January. Probably start with the Simple Strength Template.


It's the only way mate.

Slow & sure. At the end of the day I WANT MY GOALS, if I have to wait a few extra months it's no big deal, I'm still happy with my progress. The biggest annoyance is that I was getting so close, but that's life. More importantly it's how I deal with it. I know my character well & I know if my body allows me I WILL REACH MY GOALS sooner rather than later.

As the mighty Dave Tate said "I've seen people come back from everything"!

And that great line from the batman film always springs to mind & spurns me on (Sorry for repeating this) "Why do we fall"? "So we can learn to pick ourselves up" :thumb::thumb:

Sometimes the fall makes us stronger, my injury has made me even more determined and if my body is willing I will succeed because I am my own inspiration! :thumb:

Lift on people!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Welcome back Doug. Sorry to hear about your injury. I hope you manage to recover quickly from it and get back to lifting serious weights soon.
> I think when I pulled my tricep (when messing about with an empty bar!) it took 6 months before it was fully healed and I didn't experience any pain from it.


Thanks Phil, No worries mate, if the body allows, I will carry on training heavy, heavy is what i love the most :devil::devil:

If not then I will adopt a bodybuilding routine but not consume too much protein as I dont want to get any bigger, if anything I would like to reduce in size :thumb:


----------



## Guest

Time to post a few workouts.

I've had a change of plan and am now on a "cut" with a goal of reaching around 10% BF by the end of the year. I decided to start at little earlier than planned because for the first week of this month and the last week I am (have been) on holiday. I'm also getting fed up being chubby and it's bothering me more than not being strong. The strength can come later.

I'm using a Double Reverse Pyramid Training program, which basically means your 1st work set is the heaviest then you ramp down the weight and bump up the reps over the next few sets. It's called "Double" RPT because you do each weight for two sets.
Progress on DRPT is measured by trying to increase your e1RM. Essentially, all WO weights are derived from your current e1RM. The goal is to increase your e1RM by 2.5kg each session or two. I'll be doing each major copound only once a week, so the best progress I can hope for is to increase my e1RM for a lift by 10kg/month.

To set a baseline, the best (and last working) weights achieved on SL/AFP are:
Dead: 170kg x 2 => 180kg e1RM
Squat: 135kg x 5 => 155kg e1RM
Bench: 80kg x 5 => 92.5kg e1RM
Press: 52.5kg x 5 => 60kg e1RM
Chin: 95kg x 7 => 117.5kg e1RM
Dip: 95kg x 3 => 102.5kg e1RM

Due to the big increase in volume on the DRPT program, I'll be deloading my e1RMs by quite a bit. There is also going to be some experimentation until I find what I can cope with.

*Friday 17th August*

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 85kg

*Chins*
WU: None
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 100kg

*Monday 20th August*

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 170kg

*Wednesday 22nd August*

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 135kg

I'll not put a lot of waffle about each workout other than to say they are pretty tough. It is going to take me a while to adapt to the increased volume.
Also, I've definitely lost strength by being on a diet. I think I need to try much harder to ensure I get the correct (enough) cals and carbs on WO days.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Go back a few pages, done it while doing barbell rows........I know WTF!!!!!!!!


Missed it, i was on hol at the time....
you seem to have a sound plan though...:thumb: will you still be doing the muay thai or will that be too much strain on hamstring..?


----------



## sfstu

just been reading through last few pages...lots going on...

EVERYBODYS GOING ON DIETS!!!!! AND I'M NOT ALLOWED,ITS NOT FAIR!!!!

well after reading recently the AF'nP and wendlers 5/3/1, i've reread the SL bible today to refocus myself a little...
i _would_ like to try and drop some excess weight, kinda how barefacedgeek put it 
"_ I'm also getting fed up being chubby and it's bothering me more than not being strong. The strength can come later."_ 
but at same time have taken on board what you guys have been trying to tell me (i guess repeatedly) about staying on what i'm doing at the mo...i'm just over 2 months in and doing well, apart from yesterdays workout!, so gonna finish the next 2 or 3 weeks then do another 12 week run of it until my squat is at _least_ bodyweight (112kg) and see where my other ones are at then...
that'll be 6 months of SL and would hope to consider myself intermediate by then and maybe i'll still fancy doing the AF'nP-wanna do those dips/chins...:lol:
then, I'M GOING ON A DIET...!!!!!:devil:
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> EVERYBODYS GOING ON DIETS!!!!! AND I'M NOT ALLOWED,ITS NOT FAIR!!!!


I'm not, and I'm saying that after being on hols for 3 weeks and stuffing my face 



sfstu said:


> after the telling off i got...? can't believe you lot....


Here's the thing Stu. None of us on here do any lifting. Never have. It actually started off as a pilates club but we just like to take the **** out of muscle freaks. This is Doug:












sfstu said:


> Hi doug, good to hear from you, but sorry to hear about injury... thought you were away on holiday...!
> How'd it happen...?


I though you were as well lol. Reminds me of an email from Andy Bolton a while back when his hamstring snapped:

_And I've got a story for you...

A couple of weeks ago I was squatting on a Wednesday night - just like I've pretty much done every Wednesday for the past 20 years.

I worked up to 370kg in just my belt and knee wraps and I was feeling extremely STRONG and very explosive.

In fact - I was feeling the best I'd felt since my knee surgery a couple of years back.

I think a lot of that has to do with Pavel and listening to him when he said to train BELT-LESS a lot more often.

You might want to try it yourself because it develops serious CORE STRENGTH.

Then - when you put the belt back on...

BOOM.

You feel even stronger 

Anyway, back to my 370kg squat...

I descended and exploded the bar back up like a toy. Seriously - it was easy.

But something weird happened at the top...

As I locked out I fell forwards and my hamstring tore!

And that's when I went DAMMIT! That really HURT!

----------------------------------------------

What The Hell Happened?

----------------------------------------------

I left the gym feeling pretty annoyed.

I've never ever fallen forwards at the top of a squat like that before. I needed to figure out what had happened.

So I got the video camera out and started comparing my squats that night to my squats when I put up 1214lbs.

And guess what?

My BAR POSITION had totally CHANGED.

It had got lower.

Much lower.

Now what happens when your bar position gets
lower?

Yeah, you got it...

You have to lean over more at the start of your squat, otherwise the bar would roll off your back.

And that's what happened at the top of my squats...

I was leaning over slightly to compensate and this time I lent too far, put a tonne of pressure on my hamstring and it tore.

Full on - black, bruised... the real deal.

A proper tear.

So my advice to you is to avoid having the bar in such a low position that it comprises the start of your squat because it will also compromise your lockout.

I'm going to back a higher bar position as soon as I'm back squatting - which should be next week.

-------------------------------------------------

How I Healed My Hamstring

------------------------------------------------

For the first couple of days I used a lot of ICE, but never for more than 15 minutes at a time.

Then I began gentle stretching.

Then I began very light weights - like leg curls with 5 pounds... just to get some blood flow to the muscles and help them to heal.

Pretty soon - the hamstring felt okay again._


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> It's the only way mate.
> 
> Slow & sure. At the end of the day I WANT MY GOALS, if I have to wait a few extra months it's no big deal, I'm still happy with my progress. The biggest annoyance is that I was getting so close, but that's life. More importantly it's how I deal with it. I know my character well & I know if my body allows me I WILL REACH MY GOALS sooner rather than later.
> 
> As the mighty Dave Tate said "I've seen people come back from everything"!
> 
> And that great line from the batman film always springs to mind & spurns me on (Sorry for repeating this) "Why do we fall"? "So we can learn to pick ourselves up" :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Sometimes the fall makes us stronger, my injury has made me even more determined and if my body is willing I will succeed because I am my own inspiration! :thumb:
> 
> Lift on people!!!!


So nice motivational quotes in there.

People fight back from the brink of death and do amazing things. This is why I stopped working in a gym as I'm not very sympathetic to people who dont help themselves when they have a small problem when across the world there are people doing amazing things. I loved training the rugby players as you can push them really hard.

Injuries and the come back makes it so much more worth it in the end. Its easy to lift when its going well and its even easier to give up at the first hurdle but shows character and determination when you fight back.

Saying all this lets see how my character is tonight and the next week as the next 4 workouts are what I been training four months for. 120kg x 6 Bench Press tonight.


----------



## Bod42

Phil: What diet are you doing?

Stu: I dont really want to diet as I know it will affect my strength but my BF% is to high really. Its 25 quid here to get a scan done that tells you your overall BF% and also how much you carry on your legs, torso and arms so I will get that done before I diet, that way I can see how much lean mass I loose.



Oats said:


> Here's the thing Stu. None of us on here do any lifting. Never have. It actually started off as a pilates club but we just like to take the **** out of muscle freaks. This is Doug:


Wo Doug your looking serious ripped mate. MUST be the lack of weights and all the long distance running you do to look so awesome. :lol::thumb:

And to think if you hadnt of given up the weights and started solely doing long distant cardio you could have ended up like the monstrosity below at 65. Lucky escape I think :thumb:










Yep he's 65


----------



## sfstu

^^^that bodyfat scan sounds good james..? i bought some of those plastic bodyfat calipers but not sure how accurate they can be, afterall, the harder or softer you squeeze em varies the result...

fridays workout...

*bench 50kg 5x5
squat 77.5kg 5x5
BBRows 57.5kg 5x5*

bench felt good...concentrating on keeping shoulders squeezed but find it hard to maintain when lifting bar from rack, tried what wendler does-holding breath for 1st couple of reps and this helps but may lower the hooks for next time.. 
squat felt heavy, had to really try for good form...1st set, as ever, a killer..!
BBRows felt heavy but good...using chalk definately helps...
still using the 6ft barbell for some exercises like BBRows as the 7ft one is too awkward and long for the space i have...weight descrepency taken into account tho...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

I have those calipers as well but if you pinch slightly wider or slightly thinner then it effects the results so dont find them accurate. The scan I'm looking at uses Ultrasound technology. Seems pretty accurate from the reviews but who knows.

The best way I found to see if your going in the right direction is with your cloths. I know sounds weird but I brought a shirt about a year ago and it was my going out shirt as it fitted great, now i cant wear it as it doesnt fit round my back or my arms. Ok this tells you that you got bigger but I also started wearing a belt I grew out of so my waist has got smaller. Im the same weight but more muscly with a smaller waist, far from technical but to me that means I gained muscle and lost fat.

Friday Workout:
Med ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press Warm Up: 67.5x5, 80x3, 92.5x2, 100x1, 105x1, 112.5x1
Work set: 120x4 (Predicted Max 136kg)
Pendlay Rows: 70x5, 77.5x3, 87.5x6
Dips: BWx10,10,10,8,8

I was aiming for 6 reps on Bench Press but to be honest, Im more than happy with 4 reps, they all felt great, no real grinders and it lets me know that my shoulder can handle and stabilize the heavier weight. This isnt a record weight for me but its a record since I last dislocated my shoulder so really happy.

Jumped on to the pendlay rows without any rest really as was so fired up. It nice to be lifting some decent weight on these now.

Love dips the more I do them the more I love them. Also doing body weight dips one day and doing weighted later in the week seems to work really well as after doing weighted dips BW dips feel like nothing. Something has improved my bench quite fast and not sure but it could be all the dips or the dedicated shoulder work or the RC work I do at the end of the workouts. Who's knows but it seems to be working.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Phil: What diet are you doing?


I'm giving LeanGains a try - I actually quite enjoy the fasting each day and pretty much have no problems with hunger. 
I actually found the website rippedbody.jp useful for giving me the info needed to workout my calories and macros for each day.

Currently I'm aiming for 1500kcal, low carb, on rest days and 2500kcal, high carb, on workout days. Protein is kept high on both days. These were workedout out from a guesstimate of a lean body mass of 72kg. It provides a starting point at least.

I started this when I went on holiday at the beginning iof August, so used the rest day cals/macros all week. I'll do that again next week when I'm on holiday again.

I lost 5kg in the first 10-11 days. This was a surprise and I think (hope) was probably mostly water weight due to the low carb diet. I have lost some strength on my squat, however, so I may well have lost some muscle mass too.

I've pretty much plateaued on the weight loss since, but I hope it will start moving again soon - I'm trying to resist the temptation of weighing myself every day.
I've also bought some bodyfat scales (Omron BF508). I know biometric impedance is not an ideal way of measuring absolute BF levels, but I hope it will be useful in showing a (downward) trend.

I suspect I'll have to play around with the cals and macros to find the ideals for me.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Guest

Did the OHP last night, as I skipped it on my last session due to time.

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 50kg

*Bicep Curl*
WU: [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 50kg

*Dips*
WU: None
WO: [email protected] (BW - 30kg, using a resistance band)

Decided to superset the press with some barbell curls  :lol:. No problems with any of the weights.

Thought I'd add some assisted dips in to get more blood flowing to my strained tricep.

This session was not anywhere near as exhausting as the dead and squat sessions earlier this week. I'm seriously considering sticking to a 4day/week workout format until I get a bit fitter.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Sounds like your pretty much doing the same diet as me. I will be doing low carb on off days and medium to high carb on workout days. I will probably keep my calories slightly higher but then I'm heavier so probably about right.

When do you fast? Just checked out Leangains looks really good and makes sense.

How comes you do so many sets on the reverse pyramid, just reading the website and it says one work set with 2 back off sets.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> When do you fast? Just checked out Leangains looks really good and makes sense.


I'd planned my fast from 8pm through to midday the next day, to give me 16hrs. More often than not it works out from around 7pm to 12:30, but I still have very little issues with hunger.

I only eat 2 meals a day, with a protein shake in between. I do eat all my meals before I workout, but I don't think that makes a big difference.



Bod42 said:


> How comes you do so many sets on the reverse pyramid, just reading the website and it says one work set with 2 back off sets.


I'm actually using a different program. It's the Double Reverse Pyramid Training program from ironstrong.org - listed in the intermediate program section. The chap that designed it has been doing IF for several years and used it himself on a cut. A few other members have tried it out and had good success, I'll see how I go with it. If it gets too much, I'll revert to the RPT program from LG.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Hello chaps!

Thought i'd give this a go today! Seems like everyone is raving about it.

Felt quite good, been use to doing one body part each day so a little different.

Does anyone use the strong lift app?


----------



## sfstu

jonnyMercUK said:


> Hello chaps!
> 
> Thought i'd give this a go today! Seems like everyone is raving about it.
> 
> Felt quite good, been use to doing one body part each day so a little different.
> 
> Does anyone use the strong lift app?


hi, don't use the app if its a mobile one you mean but i'm doing stronglifts and using the pdf that you can get to keep track of your weights...?
rgds stu


----------



## jonnyMercUK

It's the one for the iPhone. Seems ok, good way to keep a record and automatically increases the weight for the next session.


----------



## sfstu

sounds the same as the pdf i have on laptop...


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> It's the one for the iPhone. Seems ok, good way to keep a record and automatically increases the weight for the next session.


They haven't released it for Android yet but I nabbed the Mrs iPhone to have a look and it seems pretty good to me. I think these days noone goes anywhere without their phone so you never forget your workout


----------



## avit88

jonnyMercUK said:


> It's the one for the iPhone. Seems ok, good way to keep a record and automatically increases the weight for the next session.


yeh i use it its pretty handy


----------



## rob warrington

hiya guys, ive been keeping an eye out on this thread every now and again. i started the gym about 2 years ago in an attempt to gain abit of size, must admit im getting a bit fed up of late with the gym, only thing that has kept me interested the last few weeks was me starting to do more back workouts, ive avoided these mostly due to my glass back, but been doing deadlifts etc and ive had no back pain etc so im going to continue doing these. i would usualy try and go the gym 3 times a week ( due to work and kids etc ) chest/bis shoulders/tris back/legs this is how ive been doing it for some time. problem im having is although i have gained size and muscle, my progress is slow. A bloke i spoke to last week told me to ditch all my isolation moves and just focus on compound moves. so im thinking of giving it a go. My flat bench lets me down big time, ive been stuck lifting the same weight now for so long ( 70kg ) which after going the gym for 2 years is poor i know. i maybe get about 7-8 reps out at this weight. anyways this bloke was talking about 5x5 hence me coming and posting on this thread. I do like to train bis and tris and i know alot of lads just dont bother training these seperate. im just hoping if i switch to doing more compound movments i may gain more size and strength. ill keep looking back through the old posts on her for tips and advice. cheers


----------



## Bod42

Every guy I ever met who in to the gym loves bis and tries. Who doesn't like the good old guns but when you first start your get more arm size from just the compound exercises. There's guys in here rowing and benching 100kg+, imaging the stress that is putting through your bis and tris. All the rugby players I trained weren't allowed to train arms until they hits their goals which were normal 1.5-2x bodyweight on squats depending on position, 1x bench and 2x deadlift. By then you were at a level where you could decide to do arms or not :thumb:

Give it a try you have nothing to loose and everything to gain.

What are your stats right now. Weight, height, age, deads, squats obviously only if you want to


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> Every guy I ever met who in to the gym loves bis and tries. Who doesn't like the good old guns but when you first start your get more arm size from just the compound exercises. There's guys in here rowing and benching 100kg+, imaging the stress that is putting through your bis and tris. All the rugby players I trained weren't allowed to train arms until they hits their goals which were normal 1.5-2x bodyweight on squats depending on position, 1x bench and 2x deadlift. By then you were at a level where you could decide to do arms or not :thumb:
> 
> Give it a try you have nothing to loose and everything to gain.
> 
> What are your stats right now. Weight, height, age, deads, squats obviously only if you want to


I'm 31 just under 12 stone 5'11. like I say I've only just started doing dead lifts and I'm doing 85kg usualy get about 8 reps at that and do maybe 3 sets, bench as I say I'm stuck at 70kg (flat bench) and to be honest I can't remember the last time I did any squats. Like I say I'm looking at myself thinking 'hang on a min after 2 years in the gym I should be lifting more than this' I think I'm maybe focusing more time on small muscles like the bis tris etc. this is why I'm thinking of focusing on the big compound movements for a while. as you say there's plenty of rugby players that never do a single bicep curl. I also guess I've never asked on here before because I see what all you guys are lifting and think ' jeez, my stats are shamefull haha' if I'm do take this up, and say I go three times a week (mon wed fri) do you guys do the same lifts on all them days?? Or you still keep for ex chest on Monday's back Wednesday's etc ?? Sorry for long post haha


----------



## sfstu

^^^^ check out http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/, all you need to know about which exercises and when...
the programme does work too...:thumb:
rgds stu

p.s. don't worry bout how much you're lifting and asking questions on here,these guys on here know their stuff and are more than willing to help,also no egos here when it comes to numbers-i should know, i started the 5x5 a couple o months ago..! (and you got me by 20kgs on bench...)


----------



## Bod42

Stu has linked to the stronglift website, best program you can go on to start hitting compound movement. Most of the guys in here started on this program and have all made awesome progress.

I only post in here as there is no judgement and no ego's everyone starts somehwhere in every sport. :thumb:

You are also a perfect candidate at your weight and strength levels to start this program and increase your calorie intake at the same time to gain weight. Gaining weight allows you to increase your strength at a faster rate. 

The actual weights lifted are not the whole story, I would always look at your weights as a ratio of your body weight, it makes it a more accurate comparison between different people. Your around 76kg and you are benching 70kg for reps so your actually benching more than your BW which isnt bad.

Squats should be the backbone of any program and they will put muscle on all over your body. You will soon get the love/hate relationship with them if you start te SL program.

What are your goals? Short Term, Long Term.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> squats... You will soon get the love/hate relationship with them if you start te SL program.


:lol:


----------



## Oats

avit88 said:


> yeh i use it its pretty handy


I don't get it. Isn't SL add 2.5kg upper body and 5kg lower body each workout? Why does that need an ap 



Bod42 said:


> I only post in here as there is no judgement and no ego's ....
> 
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> 
> 
> rob warrington said:
> 
> 
> 
> ... doing dead lifts and I'm doing 85kg usualy get about 8 reps at that and do maybe 3 sets,
> 
> 
> 
> Oh god don't let sfstu know, he'll have a seizure
> 
> 
> 
> Bod42 said:
> 
> 
> 
> All the rugby players I trained weren't allowed to train arms until they hits their goals which were normal 1.5-2x bodyweight on squats depending on position, 1x bench and 2x deadlift. By then you were at a level where you could decide to do arms or not :thumb:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> ^^^ on the button. In an interview Kirk Karwoski said he didn't let himself have a belt until he squatted something like 250kg. Even then it was only one that was narrow at the front. He made himself wait until something like 375kg before he got a full belt.
> 
> "I wanna hold it" Well if you do 1000lb x2 you should be left alone to :thumb:
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> I don't get it. Isn't SL add 2.5kg upper body and 5kg lower body each workout? Why does that need an ap


I think its 2.5kg on all exercises and 5kg on deadlifts isnt it?
I dont think its so much a calculation thing, I think its a convenients thing. I know I personally take my phone everywhere with me but I have got to the gym before and forgotten my workout sheet and subsequently lifted the wrong weight. 

Also my best mate has a theory about why I sometimes struggle with my training and his training just goes from strength to strength. I write and program all his workouts, he never has to think about anything, never has any doubts, he arrives at the gym picks up his sheet and does the sets and weights as they are written without questioning anything. As he says he has nothing to think about other than getting the weight and reps written on the page and then going home for dinner, easy. The app does this for you in a way, it automatically increases the weights and deloads so you should never have any doubt in your mind.



Oats said:


> Oh god don't let sfstu know, he'll have a seizure


:lol:



Oats said:


> ^^^ on the button. In an interview Kirk Karwoski said he didn't let himself have a belt until he squatted something like 250kg. Even then it was only one that was narrow at the front. He made himself wait until something like 375kg before he got a full belt.


I used to be slightly sneaky as for some reason Monday is the Universal Bench Press day but nobody no matter their schedule was allowed to bench press Mondays. Bench press' are good but Squats and Deadlifts are far superior especially for sportman so Bench Press was programmed for Friday, that way if they missed a squat or deadlift session they werent allowed to Bench and everyone seems to love benching.


----------



## Christianmp

BareFacedGeek said:


> I only eat 2 meals a day, with a protein shake in between. I do eat all my meals before I workout, but I don't think that makes a big difference.


Doesn't Martin (author of leangains.com) recommend that you eat your meals post-workout and do your training fasted.

I've been doing leangains for a couple of months, I've definetely lost some fat and maintained my bodyweight. So muscle must be going up and bodyfat-% going down. The only thing regarding this regime is how hard it is to eat the food required to reach my macro's. 
Carbs is a nightmare on training days, it's hard to eat ALL the rice/sweet potatoes/pasta.

And once again I'll recommend trying out fitocracy. Easy way to log your training, get you motivated and it is a great fitness-community.


----------



## sfstu

some good info above...must admit, was getting tempted to start some cheeky bi's and tri's (on the quiet) but gonna wait awhile...was surprised at how solid my arms feel considering not a curl or kickback done...:thumb:

mondays workout...

*squat 80kg 5x5
OHP 42.5kg 5x5
deadlift 95kg 1x5 *

squat felt good today, couple of warmup sets then into 1st set and had to check the weight after to make sure i'd put enough on! struggled a little last workout but this felt good and easy...:thumb:

OHP, kept weight same as last workout (which was cr ap) and beforehand did some reading (wendler/rippetoe/mehdi) to brush up on form. concentrated on positioning and keeping chest high and torso forwards after bar passed head.
did better then last workout, managed all 5 sets of 5 but was hard after 3rd set, really struggled on last 2 so gonna keep the weight the same on next workout which i hope will go ok but worried about putting the weight up...

deadlift went ok, felt really heavy but managed it for full set this time unlike last workout when i just gave up after 3 reps...next workout a nice round number-100kgs... felt a slight twinge in lower back after-should i be wearing a belt yet or take advice from previous posts and not allow myself one yet..? always had a dodgy lower back and never done deadlifts before so pleased to get 95kgs and back feels good these days...

rgds stu


----------



## rob warrington

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oats 
Oh god don't let sfstu know, he'll have a seizure
Why will he have a seizure??? Haha

can I just say thanks to you guys for all the helpful info. I was a member on another forum until a few month back. (will remain nameless ) I asked on there for advice on gym related stuff and got nothing but insulting replies on how crap my stats etc was (what I was benching etc) I replied and said 'guys im asking for help and advice' I was told to basicly sod off and do my own research on google. I will check out that link. Thanks again guys.


----------



## sfstu

rob warrington said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Oats
> Oh god don't let sfstu know, he'll have a seizure
> Why will he have a seizure??? Haha
> 
> *cos you're only supposed to do 1 set of 5 reps on deadlift on stronglifts 5x5 and i was doing 2 or 3 sets....
> and they all told me off....*
> 
> can I just say thanks to you guys for all the helpful info. I was a member on another forum until a few month back. (will remain nameless ) I asked on there for advice on gym related stuff and got nothing but insulting replies on how crap my stats etc was (what I was benching etc) I replied and said 'guys im asking for help and advice' I was told to basicly sod off and do my own research on google. I will check out that link. Thanks again guys.
> 
> *thats why i started posting on this thread/forum...:thumb:no-one scoffs at yer weights and there's always plenty of constructive and knowledgeable advice/help...*


rgds stu (the single set deadlifter )


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> Stu has linked to the stronglift website, best program you can go on to start hitting compound movement. Most of the guys in here started on this program and have all made awesome progress.
> 
> I only post in here as there is no judgement and no ego's everyone starts somehwhere in every sport. :thumb:
> 
> You are also a perfect candidate at your weight and strength levels to start this program and increase your calorie intake at the same time to gain weight. Gaining weight allows you to increase your strength at a faster rate.
> 
> The actual weights lifted are not the whole story, I would always look at your weights as a ratio of your body weight, it makes it a more accurate comparison between different people. Your around 76kg and you are benching 70kg for reps so your actually benching more than your BW which isnt bad.
> 
> Squats should be the backbone of any program and they will put muscle on all over your body. You will soon get the love/hate relationship with them if you start te SL program.
> 
> What are your goals? Short Term, Long Term.


my goals. I guess when I first started I just wanted to gain some muscle and size, and being naive I thought after a year in the gym I'd be ripped hahah. 
My goals haven't changed all that much I still want to gain some size and add muscle. only thing that's changed is I'm not bothered about getting getting ripped hahaha. Only thing that concerns me is not doing bi's haha looking forward to giving this a go though, not looking forward to squats it must be said lol we all got to start somewhere I guess


----------



## rob warrington

sfstu said:


> ^^^^ check out http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/, all you need to know about which exercises and when...
> the programme does work too...:thumb:
> rgds stu
> 
> p.s. don't worry bout how much you're lifting and asking questions on here,these guys on here know their stuff and are more than willing to help,also no egos here when it comes to numbers-i should know, i started the 5x5 a couple o months ago..! (and you got me by 20kgs on bench...)


wow, just had a look at that link, was nearly high fiving myself after reading it haha cant believe how simple it is, after all this time of me and my gym buddy doing countless number of exercises and workouts trying to hit every head of every muscle.


----------



## sfstu

spend some time reading and absorbing the philosphy of the programme would be my advice...:thumb:

with regards the gym you use, do you have access to free weights-barbells to be specific..? cos the whole programme revolves around that. no machines, no dumbells...

its very easy to follow and use and thats part of the appeal of this programme to the beginner such as myself...you can download the SL 5x5 worksheet where you have all the weights you need to lift programmed for you making it easier still as you just lift what you need to each workout. theres also a mobile app though only for apple at the mo (whats up with android mehdi?!)

i've been on this SL 5x5 programme for just over 2 months and as i'm coming back to lifting after a lay off of about 15 years:doublesho i can say it really does work...:thumb: you start off light (feels too light but stick with it, it soon gets harder!) and you add a little each workout...it works...
rgds stu


----------



## rob warrington

sfstu said:


> spend some time reading and absorbing the philosphy of the programme would be my advice...:thumb:
> 
> with regards the gym you use, do you have access to free weights-barbells to be specific..? cos the whole programme revolves around that. no machines, no dumbells...
> 
> its very easy to follow and use and thats part of the appeal of this programme to the beginner such as myself...you can download the SL 5x5 worksheet where you have all the weights you need to lift programmed for you making it easier still as you just lift what you need to each workout. theres also a mobile app though only for apple at the mo (whats up with android mehdi?!)
> 
> i've been on this SL 5x5 programme for just over 2 months and as i'm coming back to lifting after a lay off of about 15 years:doublesho i can say it really does work...:thumb: you start off light (feels too light but stick with it, it soon gets harder!) and you add a little each workout...it works...
> rgds stu


thanks stu, yeah im going to do lots of reading, its a pitty tbh cos i used to go the gym with 3 lads one of the lads was a total guru as he's been going the gym for years and last year he was very keen to starrt the 5x5 but i wasnt keen. the other guy would be happy training bis every day of the week so i guess im gonna be leaving him to it, time for a change me thinks, cant wait to get my weights lifted posted up then see how i progress from there. still cant believe that the only lifts are barbell rows deadlifts bench press and squats, and yes the gym i use has both machines and barbells etc, as i try and avoid the machines anyways.


----------



## sfstu

rob warrington said:


> thanks stu, yeah im going to do lots of reading, its a pitty tbh cos i used to go the gym with 3 lads one of the lads was a total guru as he's been going the gym for years and last year he was very keen to starrt the 5x5 but i wasnt keen. the other guy would be happy training bis every day of the week so i guess im gonna be leaving him to it, time for a change me thinks, cant wait to get my weights lifted posted up then see how i progress from there. still cant believe that the only lifts are barbell rows deadlifts bench press and squats, and yes the gym i use has both machines and barbells etc, as i try and avoid the machines anyways.


it sounds too good to be true what with only 5 different exercises but i think thats part of why it works...:thumb: they're all basic compound exercises, foundation exercises as i think of em...!

if you're gonna download the SL 5x5 just make sure you download the latest one as there's been a couple of versions and they do differ slightly...:thumb:


----------



## rob warrington

sfstu said:


> it sounds too good to be true what with only 5 different exercises but i think thats part of why it works...:thumb: they're all basic compound exercises, foundation exercises as i think of em...!
> 
> if you're gonna download the SL 5x5 just make sure you download the latest one as there's been a couple of versions and they do differ slightly...:thumb:


Cheers buddy I will do


----------



## ITHAQVA

First bench session since injury, well pleased as this is the second 5/3/1 month i planned to do so no time lost on upper body :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS 50X5 60X5 72X3 79.5KGX5 92KGX5 104KGX5

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX-10-10-10-10-10*

Left Barbell rows out this time, next time around i will lower the weight (50Kg) until i feel confident I wont re-injure myself :thumb:

I wont post my squat & deadlift workouts until i get back to my normal training weights, this weeks squat/Deadlift sessions will be day one 50Kg, day two 55Kg

As you can see I have followed the plan & reduced my 100% max weights by 10%, hopefully by week 3 of this month/Cycle I will have 116Kg on the bar for the bench :thumb:

Cant wait to recover 100% but im not rushing either


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> First bench session since injury, well pleased as this is the second 5/3/1 month i planned to do so no time lost on upper body :thumb:
> 
> *BENCH PRESS 50X5 60X5 72X3 79.5KGX5 92KGX5 104KGX5
> 
> BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX-10-10-10-10-10*
> 
> Left Barbell rows out this time, next time around i will lower the weight (50Kg) until i feel confident I wont re-injure myself :thumb:
> 
> I wont post my squat & deadlift workouts until i get back to my normal training weights, this weeks squat/Deadlift sessions will be day one 50Kg, day two 55Kg
> 
> As you can see I have followed the plan & reduced my 100% max weights by 10%, hopefully by week 3 of this month/Cycle I will have 116Kg on the bar for the bench :thumb:
> 
> Cant wait to recover 100% but im not rushing either


thats a serious amount of benching doug...:devil:
i can imagine your frustration at not being able to do the rows as well as the squats/deadlifts but i'm sure it won't be long till you're back on track...know you've the patience though to take it steady till you're back up to full strength/fitness...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

rob warrington said:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Oats
> Oh god don't let sfstu know, he'll have a seizure
> Why will he have a seizure??? Haha
> 
> can I just say thanks to you guys for all the helpful info. I was a member on another forum until a few month back. (will remain nameless ) I asked on there for advice on gym related stuff and got nothing but insulting replies on how crap my stats etc was (what I was benching etc) I replied and said 'guys im asking for help and advice' I was told to basicly sod off and do my own research on google. I will check out that link. Thanks again guys.


I went to post my workouts on another forum and then read them all slating this guy for putting 40kg on his squat in 6months. He used a very heavy volume workout program and everyone was saying why did you work so hard when you could have done it easy. The think is he went from 220kg to 260kg which in 6months is awesome, I think anyway


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> I went to post my workouts on another forum and then read them all slating this guy for putting 40kg on his squat in 6months. He used a very heavy volume workout program and everyone was saying why did you work so hard when you could have done it easy. The think is he went from 220kg to 260kg which in 6months is awesome, I think anyway


yeah very good, god i havent added 10kg to my flat bench in 4 month so hats off to that guy. my mrs has fell out with me haha hardly said two words to her all day as been on tinterwebb reading up on 5x5 etc etc, she aint happy :lol:


----------



## Bod42

rob warrington said:


> yeah very good, god i havent added 10kg to my flat bench in 4 month so hats off to that guy. my mrs has fell out with me haha hardly said two words to her all day as been on tinterwebb reading up on 5x5 etc etc, she aint happy :lol:


She be very happy in a few months if you start this program. One guy that I trained wife was the most greatful for his new body :lol: Everytime I saw her she thanked me.

You got to eat on this program and your in a very good position that you can afford to put on weight. A few of us on here including me dont want to get any bigger so have to watch our diet. This is just a rule of thumb but if you start at 5'0" and 100lb you add 10lb for every 1" for minimum weight and add 30-40lb to get your maximum. Cant remember the guy that advisors this off the top of my head but its very similar to Rippletoe's suggestions.

E.g. I think you said your 6' this would mean a minimum 220lb and maximum 250-260lb. 220lb is approx 15 and half stone so you can afford to put on some weight. Im not saying you have to get to this weight but just using it as an example.

Is there someone at the gym that can teach you squats, its not essential but obviously helpful. The most important aspect is to hit parallell. Right I'm off to squat.


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> She be very happy in a few months if you start this program. One guy that I trained wife was the most greatful for his new body :lol: Everytime I saw her she thanked me.
> 
> You got to eat on this program and your in a very good position that you can afford to put on weight. A few of us on here including me dont want to get any bigger so have to watch our diet. This is just a rule of thumb but if you start at 5'0" and 100lb you add 10lb for every 1" for minimum weight and add 30-40lb to get your maximum. Cant remember the guy that advisors this off the top of my head but its very similar to Rippletoe's suggestions.
> 
> E.g. I think you said your 6' this would mean a minimum 220lb and maximum 250-260lb. 220lb is approx 15 and half stone so you can afford to put on some weight. Im not saying you have to get to this weight but just using it as an example.
> 
> Is there someone at the gym that can teach you squats, its not essential but obviously helpful. The most important aspect is to hit parallell. Right I'm off to squat.


I know a guy that could do some squats with me, there's a lot of very big polish guys in my gym who I only ever see doing these big ass compound lifts. I'd ask one of them but they scare me hahaha (the bigger boys ) lol. As for putting weight on, I just hope I don't put anymore belly fat on that I seem to have started to get of late. I'm also looking on the Internet for one of these workout logs cos I easy forget. Happy squatting btw


----------



## Bod42

WARNING PLEASE DO NOT READ IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY COARSE LANUAGE

Monday Workout:
Squats: 152.5kg x 1 Yep thats right F 1  rep.
Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 82.5x5, 92.5x3, 110x1

1  rep. As you can tell Im extremely  off over this workout. My goal was 7 reps and I got 1  rep. Everything felt great during warm up, I was firing my posterior chain perfectly and getting straight up off the box and that happens. Ok the bar did roll up slightly towards my neck which made me good morning the 1st rep big style but even if the first rep was perfect I would have been lucky to get 2 or 3 reps.

As you can imaging Snatch grip deadlift were a piece of  after being so annoyed over squats.

Did some Kroc Rows just because I was annoyed. 25kg for 35 reps each arm.

So far on the Juggernaut program my upper body lifts have gone from strength to strength but I have lost strength on lower body. I think that this is due to the lack of 90%+ lifting in this program and when you do finally get there your not used to the heavy weight. I feel like my legs and lower back are strong enough but my upper back cant support the weight especially when you jump up 20kg between months.

I dont really care about bench as my shoulder is so screwed but my Bench 1RM is 136kg and my 1RM squat is 152.5kg. 16.5kg different WTF!!!!!

4 months of work to go backwards, really not happy. Oh well we live and learn but to be fair I havent been eating enough for this program to really work.

I think its time to get off the box and free squat for a while and see what happens as Im getting no where fast with my lower body exercises.

Update: went back to the gym after this post and videoed my form and depth on free squats. I then worked up to an easy 140kg free squat which isn't bad considering I haven't free squatted in a year and that I had already squatted and deadlifted. Definitely going to free squat on my next workouts for a while


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> WARNING PLEASE DO NOT READ IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY COARSE LANUAGE
> 
> Monday Workout:
> Squats: 152.5kg x 1 Yep thats right F 1  rep.
> Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 82.5x5, 92.5x3, 110x1
> 
> 1  rep. As you can tell Im extremely  off over this workout. My goal was 7 reps and I got 1  rep. Everything felt great during warm up, I was firing my posterior chain perfectly and getting straight up off the box and that happens. Ok the bar did roll up slightly towards my neck which made me good morning the 1st rep big style but even if the first rep was perfect I would have been lucky to get 2 or 3 reps.
> 
> As you can imaging Snatch grip deadlift were a piece of  after being so annoyed over squats.
> 
> Did some Kroc Rows just because I was annoyed. 25kg for 35 reps each arm.
> 
> So far on the Juggernaut program my upper body lifts have gone from strength to strength but I have lost strength on lower body. I think that this is due to the lack of 90%+ lifting in this program and when you do finally get there your not used to the heavy weight. I feel like my legs and lower back are strong enough but my upper back cant support the weight especially when you jump up 20kg between months.
> 
> I dont really care about bench as my shoulder is so screwed but my Bench 1RM is 136kg and my 1RM squat is 152.5kg. 16.5kg different WTF!!!!!
> 
> 4 months of work to go backwards, really not happy. Oh well we live and learn but to be fair I havent been eating enough for this program to really work.
> 
> I think its time to get off the box and free squat for a while and see what happens as Im getting no where fast with my lower body exercises.


Don't knock yourself James, you are doing really well, consider yourself lucky you aren't having to squat/deadlift 50kg today due to a freak injuree  (Spelt wrong on purpose) had adverts! 
Agree, get off the box & free squat! :thumb: I know you can do it mate, channel your anger & give in to the DaRKside!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 2 week 5*

Week *5*?! Well I'm on leave and couldn't get to a gym so it's a second rest week. Two sprint sessions and a 30 min jog with the wife. After ten minutes I couldn't help sprinting from one lamp post to the next . God only knows how I used to run 10k at least once a week. My attention span for running has clearly diminished.

Going to keep weights same in next cycle as I've only lifted twice in the last fortnight, last max effect week was poor, and I want to see if more reps weeks 1 and 2 help in the 3rd week. Also noticed last night that 5\3\1 has percentage splits for the assistance exercises that vary every week. Need to have a detailed look as I've been doing 5x10 at the same weight for the whole cycle.



ITHAQVA said:


> First bench session since injury, well pleased as this is the second 5/3/1 month I planned to do so no time lost on upper body :thumb:
> 
> *BENCH PRESS 50X5 60X5 72X3 79.5KGX5 92KGX5 104KGX5
> 
> *


*
Nice :thumb: Was a bit worried I'd stumbled onto a weight loss thread with all this talk of fasting :lol:



Bod42 said:



Monday Workout:
Squats: 152.5kg x 1 Yep that's right F 1  rep.
...
Update: went back to the gym after this post and videoed my form and depth on free squats. I then worked up to an easy 140kg free squat which isn't bad considering I haven't free squatted in a year and that I had already squatted and deadlifted. Definitely going to free squat on my next workouts for a while

Click to expand...

Did you get pinned on the second rep or was it mental?



Bod42 said:



I think you said your 6' this would mean a minimum 220lb and maximum 250-260lb. 220lb is approx 15 and half stone so you can afford to put on some weight.

Click to expand...

I weighed myself this morning and have lost weight again. Now 83kg (183lb) at 6' :wall:. That's on the back of being off three weeks and eating at will. I thought I was around 88kg. I'm sure there's a link between food\weight and lifting numbers. As Rip (glory on his name) would say: You're Not Doing The Programme*


----------



## nabz1

Anyone recommend any pre workout shakes etc?


----------



## ITHAQVA

nabz1 said:


> Anyone recommend any pre workout shakes etc?


I train around 5:15pm weekdays so I don't eat anything after 3pm :thumb:

As for shakes, I found no benefit, other than the usual placebo effect 

Sorry cant recommend anything other than eating & sleeping right


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Nice :thumb: Was a bit worried I'd stumbled onto a weight loss thread with all this talk of fasting :lol:


Don't worry mate if my crappy body allows, I WILL be lifting heavy again :devil::devil::devil:

I keep looking at the 3 disks leaning against either side of my power rack  don't worry my little ones, Dougy will soon have you on the bar were you belong


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> I keep looking at the 3 disks leaning against either side of my power rack  don't worry my little ones, Dougy will soon have you on the bar were you belong


:lol:


----------



## sfstu

nabz1 said:


> Anyone recommend any pre workout shakes etc?


i have some protien powder to use up so been mixing 2 scoops with 250ml skimmed milk, chuck in a banana and couple scoops of porridge oats...i've having this an hour before workout and it seems to give me a boost, although maybe just placebo as ithaqva said...:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I weighed myself this morning and have lost weight again. Now 83kg (183lb) at 6' :wall:. That's on the back of being off three weeks and eating at will. I thought I was around 88kg. I'm sure there's a link between foodweight and lifting numbers. As Rip (glory on his name) would say: You're Not Doing The Programme


whats yer secret oats...?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> WARNING PLEASE DO NOT READ IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY COARSE LANUAGE
> 
> Monday Workout:
> Squats: 152.5kg x 1 Yep thats right F 1  rep.
> Snatch Grip Deadlifts: 82.5x5, 92.5x3, 110x1
> 
> 1  rep. As you can tell Im extremely  off over this workout. My goal was 7 reps and I got 1  rep. Everything felt great during warm up, I was firing my posterior chain perfectly and getting straight up off the box and that happens. Ok the bar did roll up slightly towards my neck which made me good morning the 1st rep big style but even if the first rep was perfect I would have been lucky to get 2 or 3 reps.
> 
> As you can imaging Snatch grip deadlift were a piece of  after being so annoyed over squats.
> 
> Did some Kroc Rows just because I was annoyed. 25kg for 35 reps each arm.
> 
> So far on the Juggernaut program my upper body lifts have gone from strength to strength but I have lost strength on lower body. I think that this is due to the lack of 90%+ lifting in this program and when you do finally get there your not used to the heavy weight. I feel like my legs and lower back are strong enough but my upper back cant support the weight especially when you jump up 20kg between months.
> 
> I dont really care about bench as my shoulder is so screwed but my Bench 1RM is 136kg and my 1RM squat is 152.5kg. 16.5kg different WTF!!!!!
> 
> 4 months of work to go backwards, really not happy. Oh well we live and learn but to be fair I havent been eating enough for this program to really work.
> 
> I think its time to get off the box and free squat for a while and see what happens as Im getting no where fast with my lower body exercises.
> 
> Update: went back to the gym after this post and videoed my form and depth on free squats. I then worked up to an easy 140kg free squat which isn't bad considering I haven't free squatted in a year and that I had already squatted and deadlifted. Definitely going to free squat on my next workouts for a while


i know when i had that really cack workout last week and just couldn't lift what i wanted/needed it gave me the proper hump, for the rest of the day...! so can imagine how you must feel after 4 months of training...
still, the bench 1RM is not too shabby...!
you'll come through james...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> whats yer secret oats...?


It's no secret; I do 3x5 deadlifts 



rob warrington said:


> wow, just had a look at that link, was nearly high fiving myself after reading it haha cant believe how simple it is, after all this time of me and my gym buddy doing countless number of exercises and workouts trying to hit every head of every muscle.


This reminds me of an article a while ago about a journalists transition. Quite an entertaining read.


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> It's no secret; I do 3x5 deadlifts


:wall::lol:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Don't knock yourself James, you are doing really well, consider yourself lucky you aren't having to squat/deadlift 50kg today due to a freak injuree  (Spelt wrong on purpose) had adverts!
> Agree, get off the box & free squat! :thumb: I know you can do it mate, channel your anger & give in to the DaRKside!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::devil:


a 152.5kg Box squat after a year isnt great. That is shown by yourself being nearer 200kg for 5 reps. I kind of sabotage myself to a degree as I want to be strong but I dont want to put on weight and these things go hand in hand. Im going to do Smolov Jr for 3 weeks free squat and then do 5/3/1.



Oats said:


> Did you get pinned on the second rep or was it mental?
> 
> I weighed myself this morning and have lost weight again. Now 83kg (183lb) at 6' :wall:. That's on the back of being off three weeks and eating at will. I thought I was around 88kg. I'm sure there's a link between foodweight and lifting numbers. As Rip (glory on his name) would say: You're Not Doing The Programme


Nope just got pinned, it wasnt mental as I was psyched up. I put it down to lack of lifting over 90% as my warm ups were awesome but I felt like my upper back couldnt handle the weight 100% and keep the arch. The weight did roll up nearly on to my neck which meant I did an awesome good morning but with good form I still would have only got 2 at a massive push 3 reps which isnt good.

There is a big correlation between weight and food. If your putting on weight, your in a calorie surplus which means your body can put on muscle and strength. If your loosing weight the opposite happens.



sfstu said:


> i know when i had that really cack workout last week and just couldn't lift what i wanted/needed it gave me the proper hump, for the rest of the day...! so can imagine how you must feel after 4 months of training...
> still, the bench 1RM is not too shabby...!
> you'll come through james...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Thats why I had to go back to the gym and squat again just to get rid of some energy. Free squats felt really good and I was hitting depth really easily so some good came out of it. Really really pleased with my bench but then it just highlights how poor my squat and deadlifts are. Going to change to 5/3/1 and see how I get on.


----------



## rob warrington

Evening guys. Well as per my previous posts on here I've decided to start on this 5x5 stronglifts workout as I'm so bored with my usual routine. So I've taken your advice and done a lot of reading on the net etc, downloaded the app ha. so after nearly a month away from the gym I dragged my old gym buddy there tonight and tried to sell him on the idea of the 5x5. I think he's kinda on board with me lol. Anyways tonight I just wanted to go through what ive learnt and read abiut the workout with this other lad, and after not been for a month etc (excuses) we just tried all the workouts at low weights ( some of you will say this is rediculous , just get cracking) but just wanted to get my head round it all and get my mate sold on the idea. So I did squats 45kg 5 reps 5 sets with no problem at all, felt way too light which surprised me as I've never done a single squat before. bench 75kg just a couple of sets easy, dead lift 80 kg felt easy, shoulder press 50kg 5x5 and finally rows, went light on these at 30kg. Again, I only did all this work tonight just to have a go at doing the exercises on this 5x5 programme, on Thursday I will start the programme how it's intended to be done following the correct structure etc. sorry for long post but just wanted to say I'm keen to get into this and am actually very excited about the change. Thanks.


----------



## Bod42

Congrats on deciding to do SL and starting the workout. You just made the best choice to becoming stronger.

Nothing wrong with starting light, its actually better as your putting 7.5kg per week so over 30kg a month on your squat so your soon be lifting some decent weights.


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> Congrats on deciding to do SL and starting the workout. You just made the best choice to becoming stronger.
> 
> Nothing wrong with starting light, its actually better as your putting 7.5kg per week so over 30kg a month on your squat so your soon be lifting some decent weights.


Thanks, was a tad embarrassing when the last guy had finished with the rack I asked if he'd finished then I proceeded to remove ALOT of plates off the bar, he even offered to help haha. but I know I've got to go through this 'look at me lifting girlie weights ' in order to get bigger. Although I was only doing 45 kg on squats they felt really good, would defo feel better with a spotter when I start to go heavier though. dead lifts also felt good but think I need to practice my technique a little. Thanks again guys for the encouragement, as I previously mentioned if I'd have got encouragement from the last forum I asked for advice on I'd have started this ages ago.


----------



## Bod42

Everyone starts some where, I dont get people who get on their high and mighty box. Anyway most people giving the grief on Forums have never even touched a weight. Classic example was a User on Starting Strength was giving Rippletoe, the main man himself, S**T about various things and how he doesnt know what he's doing. Turned out he was 14 :wall:

If your doing the compound exercises you will be stronger than 90% of gym goers in no time at all. Just check out peoples logs for proof of that.

If you think you need help with technique then grab yourself a copy of starting strength, brilliant book.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Just want some advice re diet really.

I have used the info on stronglifts.com, this is what I am having.

Breakfast - Omelette, chopped tomatoes
Snack - Apple, shake
Lunch - Tuna salad
Snack - Mixed nuts, pear
Post Workout - Chicken, Veg, brown rice
Pre-bed snack - Shake

I'm use to having a banana and a shake pre workout to provide me with energy but the info doesn't say anything about pre workout.


----------



## Bod42

You haven't said what your goals are. This makes a big different on the diet.

Wednesday Workout:
Med ball shoulder throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: 60x4
Dips: BWx5, BW+7.5x3, BW+22.5x7
Neutral Grip Chins: 3x3

My aim was 6reps and i got 4 so not the best but still pleased with 2 big plates on either side. Haven't drunk or eaten anything all day as been on the road so this couldn't of helped.

Very pleased with dips, my shoulder was really hurting which also effects my bicep. I'm sure if my bicep didn't hurt at the bottom of every rep I could have got my goal of 8reps.

Cut chins short as these seemed to be hurting my shoulder.

Got a decision to make now go all out on the diet and change to a more diet suited program with super sets etc or just move to 5/3/1. I'm leaning towards the latter as that way i don't have to spend money on more weight for Dumbell.work. i.written out a 5/3/1 program that hits squats, deadlifts and dips twice a week so this should be good. Going to do a quick 3week smolov cycle to get used to free suats first.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

To be honest I'm a newbie to this 5x5 stronglifts so don't know too much.

I obviously want to be stronger, but also more defined. I've lost 1 1/2 stone already and got more defined but thought I'd give this a try.


----------



## Bod42

Your diet seems very low calories but this could be good or bad depending on your goals right now.

Most people want to be bigger/stronger but also lower body fat so they can see their abs. This is extrememly hard to achieve at the same time, it is doable but your diet and training has to be perfect. Also which one do you want first, stregth or definition as this will effect which route you go first.

Probably best if you provide your stats. Weight, height, deadlift, squat, bench, goals.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Bod42 said:


> Your diet seems very low calories but this could be good or bad depending on your goals right now.
> 
> Most people want to be bigger/stronger but also lower body fat so they can see their abs. This is extrememly hard to achieve at the same time, it is doable but your diet and training has to be perfect. Also which one do you want first, stregth or definition as this will effect which route you go first.
> 
> Probably best if you provide your stats. Weight, height, deadlift, squat, bench, goals.


From reading up on the stronglifts website, carbs were only for post workout. I'm trying to see some abs but I don't think my body was made for it! I would like to be a lot stronger but also defined :wall: I would say stronger first. I know I have got a lot stronger since I first started going to the gym.

Do you do cardio on your in between days?

Here are some stats

Weight: 81.9KG
Height: 5"11
Deadlift: Not done this yet, I'll be doing it today as my mate couldn't get to the gym last night (did cardio instead)
Squat: 82.5KG
Bench: 70KG
Barbell Row: 62.5KG

I've never really done weights 'properly' until 10 weeks ago so don't laugh if i'm pretty weak! :thumb: Also, I definitely felt I could go up in weight for the next workout.

Cheers


----------



## Bod42

I always suggest people put on strength, muscle and weight first as it makes loosing weight easier when you get round to it. You can definitely afford to put on some weight and strength but good lifts if you only been lifting a few weeks.

Carbs are useful in your diet most of the time especially if your trying to gain weight and strength. You can cut them out when you want to loose abit of weight. Rippletoe suggests people your height weight approx 105kg. This means you can afford to eat more which is a hugh component of increasing strength.

I dont suggest cardio to people trying to put on weight and strength. If you really have/want to do it then do some sprints as these will help with strength to a degree.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Yeh I do quite a few sprints to be honest, mixed with a good hour on the crossy.

In terms of weight, yes I am rather light however I have had quite a bit of body fat to lose and still feel I need to lose some.

In terms of eating more, in what respect? I'm having around 6 meals a day.

Appreciate your help so far.


----------



## rob warrington

jonnyMercUK said:


> From reading up on the stronglifts website, carbs were only for post workout. I'm trying to see some abs but I don't think my body was made for it! I would like to be a lot stronger but also defined :wall: I would say stronger first. I know I have got a lot stronger since I first started going to the gym.
> 
> Do you do cardio on your in between days?
> 
> Here are some stats
> 
> Weight: 81.9KG
> Height: 5"11
> Deadlift: Not done this yet, I'll be doing it today as my mate couldn't get to the gym last night (did cardio instead)
> Squat: 82.5KG
> Bench: 70KG
> Barbell Row: 62.5KG
> 
> I've never really done weights 'properly' until 10 weeks ago so don't laugh if i'm pretty weak! :thumb: Also, I definitely felt I could go up in weight for the next workout.
> 
> Cheers


nobody laughed at me buddy and I've been going the gym for a while doing weights, did my first ever set on squats the other day and only put 45kg on it and my legs are killing today haha (in my defence I do have the legs of a 13 yr old girl haha) so your doing double what I did on squats and your benching about the same as me and like you said you've only just started. I was a tad embarrassed about posting up how weak I actually am haha. But on the other hand I'm very pleased I've ditched my old gym ways of doing a thousand bicep curls and am now just going to focus on 5x5 and building strentgh and hopefully some size. so we can look back in 10/12 weeks and see a big improvement on what weights we started on.


----------



## Oats

rob warrington said:


> Thanks, was a tad embarrassing when the last guy had finished with the rack I asked if he'd finished then I proceeded to remove ALOT of plates off the bar, he even offered to help haha.


Incase you tired yourself out before you started?:lol: Good to see you took it so well. At least he didn't call you 'poppet' or 'flower' I imagine that self-consciousness and embarassment is something that keeps many people away from exercise or gyms in the first place.



jonnyMercUK said:


> I'm trying to see some abs but I don't think my body was made for it! I would like to be a lot stronger but also defined :wall: I would say stronger first.


Rip (may he be showered in radiant sunshine) spends most of his time railing against people who want to get stronger and 'have abs'. It's like me saying I want the same salary but only to work 2 days a week. Or make the fantastic progress like Doug when I eat half what he does and sleep 3 hours less (which I imagine is probably about right). They don't go together. Have a read of A Clarification.

As the saying goes on Starting Strength 'Abs on a skinny guy are like t*ts on a fat chick'.


----------



## JamesGarner

Learnt a hard lesson on dieting and lifting heavy last night 
defiantly don't go together

Since starting a stricter diet again some of my weights have gone down (fair enough i suppose) 
Deadlift last week’s heavy set after warming up and it felt quite light upped it to 200kg (my old 3 rep max) and tried for 1 rep 
Got the bar up OK for 1 rep was happy

Don’t remember putting all the way down though just being on the floor and people standing around me asking if I was ok

Whoops felt like a right ****


----------



## rob warrington

Oats said:


> Incase you tired yourself out before you started?:lol: Good to see you took it so well. At least he didn't call you 'poppet' or 'flower' I imagine that self-consciousness and embarassment is something that keeps many people away from exercise or gyms in the first place.
> 
> Rip (may he be showered in radiant sunshine) spends most of his time railing against people who want to get stronger and 'have abs'. It's like me saying I want the same salary but only to work 2 days a week. Or make the fantastic progress like Doug when I eat half what he does and sleep 3 hours less (which I imagine is probably about right). They don't go together. Have a read of A Clarification.
> 
> As the saying goes on Starting Strength 'Abs on a skinny guy are like t*ts on a fat chick'.


Hahaha yes this guy did have a bit of a grin as he removed mos the weight he'd left on the bar haha and as for abs on a skinny guy thing? Was that mark rippetoe Who said that? I read somthing last night he said that made me laugh, he said if your going to wear gloves when lifting weight, make sure they match your purse haha


----------



## rob warrington

well started my first session tonight as per the the SL website. i had my first go at squats two days ago and my legs still felt like jelly today haha (as said before i have legs like a girl ha) so anyways heres how i did.

squats 45 kg 55555

shoulder press 40kg 55555

deadlift 100kg 5

as said never done squats before so really need to improve on this (big style) i usualy do more on shoulder press but ive dropped the weight as to be as strict as poss. deadlifts ive been doing a little bit of late so when i warmed up i felt confidents i could make the 100kg, so right or wrong i went for it and got the 5 reps out, last rep was slow haha. so as per the rules ill add 5kg to deadlift next time. thanks ya'll


----------



## sfstu

rob warrington said:


> well started my first session tonight as per the the SL website. i had my first go at squats two days ago and my legs still felt like jelly today haha (as said before i have legs like a girl ha) so anyways heres how i did.
> 
> squats 45 kg 55555
> 
> shoulder press 40kg 55555
> 
> deadlift 100kg 5
> 
> as said never done squats before so really need to improve on this (big style) i usualy do more on shoulder press but ive dropped the weight as to be as strict as poss. deadlifts ive been doing a little bit of late so when i warmed up i felt confidents i could make the 100kg, so right or wrong i went for it and got the 5 reps out, last rep was slow haha. so as per the rules ill add 5kg to deadlift next time. thanks ya'll


hi rob, congrats for starting the SL...:thumb: 
i'm not sure about people who already train/lift moving onto the SL but i know for the beginner you're supposed to start at 20kgs for everything, 30 for barbell row and 40 for deadlift? this way you can make progress adding the 2.5kg for much longer than starting with a higher weight where you may stall sooner which is aim of SL i think..? 
i know you're not a beginner with lifting but for example, 40 kgs for shoulder press means that in roughly 6 weeks you'll be at 60kgs where a lot of people stall rather than lasting for several weeks longer before stalling
i'm certainly no expert here but thats my understanding of SL, i'm sure one of the others here will be able to explain much better...:thumb:

wednesday workout (didn't have time to post yesterday)

*squat 82.5kg 5x5
bench 52.5kg 5x5
BBRow 60kg 5x5*

all felt good, didn't feel that full of beans after sitting on my backside all day at work (i'm a hgv driver) but due to stress/having the bang hump before starting workout this gave me some extra fuel...!
squats felt good,bench felt good and bbrow felt heavy but doable...wasn't really doing much in the way of warmup sets before but i am now and this definately helps...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## rob warrington

sfstu said:


> hi rob, congrats for starting the SL...:thumb:
> i'm not sure about people who already train/lift moving onto the SL but i know for the beginner you're supposed to start at 20kgs for everything, 30 for barbell row and 40 for deadlift? this way you can make progress adding the 2.5kg for much longer than starting with a higher weight where you may stall sooner which is aim of SL i think..?
> i know you're not a beginner with lifting but for example, 40 kgs for shoulder press means that in roughly 6 weeks you'll be at 60kgs where a lot of people stall rather than lasting for several weeks longer before stalling
> i'm certainly no expert here but thats my understanding of SL, i'm sure one of the others here will be able to explain much better...:thumb:
> 
> wednesday workout (didn't have time to post yesterday)
> 
> *squat 82.5kg 5x5
> bench 52.5kg 5x5
> BBRow 60kg 5x5*
> 
> all felt good, didn't feel that full of beans after sitting on my backside all day at work (i'm a hgv driver) but due to stress/having the bang hump before starting workout this gave me some extra fuel...!
> squats felt good,bench felt good and bbrow felt heavy but doable...wasn't really doing much in the way of warmup sets before but i am now and this definately helps...:thumb:
> rgds stu


cheers buddy, yeah your maybe right i may be jumping in too deep with the deadlifts, i just went for it as i thought i could lift it, i may drop the weight some what next time round. :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

rob warrington said:


> cheers buddy, yeah your maybe right i may be jumping in too deep with the deadlifts, i just went for it as i thought i could lift it, i may drop the weight some what next time round. :thumb:


Stu is right your better to start light than to heavy but then you dont want to be spinning your wheels for weeks and months if you can be doing more weight. Your are putting 30kg per month on your deadlift so if the 100kg was real easy I would say this is fine but do you think your be doing 130kg next month if the last rep was slow. You may be who knows but you probaby need to make a judgement call.

Good starting weights. While the weights are light really try and concentrate on form, squatting to depth is probably the hardest aspect for people just starting squatting. Extract from one of Rippletoe's latest squatting articles:

Squats below parallel are your homework. The result of doing them is that you get stronger on all the other exercises, even the pressing movements, because squats make your whole body stronger - if you do them correctly. I know it's harder that way, and one of the ways you know it's wrong to do them high is that everybody else does them high. When was the last time that thing everybody else was doing turned out to be the right thing to do?

Deep squats done with a weight that's a little heavier each time you train affect your body in a way that no other exercise can. And believe me when I say that "other methods" have been tried. They just don't work. And it's not that they don't work as well, they don't work at all.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Extract from one of Rippletoe's latest squatting articles:
> 
> Squats below parallel are your homework. The result of doing them is that you get stronger on all the other exercises, even the pressing movements, because squats make your whole body stronger - if you do them correctly. I know it's harder that way, and one of the ways you know it's wrong to do them high is that everybody else does them high. When was the last time that thing everybody else was doing turned out to be the right thing to do?
> 
> Deep squats done with a weight that's a little heavier each time you train affect your body in a way that no other exercise can. And believe me when I say that "other methods" have been tried. They just don't work. And it's not that they don't work as well, they don't work at all.


gotta admit, was for a while quite dubious about all the squatting lark being a whole body exercise rather than just legs but having done then now (grudgingly) for last couple of months, tbh i can now understand how it does work whole body and can feel the benefits...:thumb:
don't really mind/almost enjoy doing them now...:lol:
got 85kgs to do on them today, only another 4 weeks and i'm at bodyweight..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

fridays workout...

*squat 85kg 5x5
OHP 42.5kg 5x5
deadlift 100kg 1x5*

squats were fine, as said above, _almost_ enjoying em...

deadlift was feeling real heavy but nice round number on the bar and nice to have a few big plates on the bar...

ohp was a problem... 42.5kg for the 3rd time now and although i made the 5x5 it was real hard,only just doable and really don't feel i could increase to 45kg... not being defeatist, just don't think i could move the bar with that extra 2.5kgs on...so what now, try the 45kgs next time or deload by 10%...?  also now got a pain down r/h/s of middle of back...could just be the way i slept but as i have a dodgy shoulder on r/h/s thinking i need some warmup/stretching/flexibility exercies for shoulders...any ideas guys...?

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> fridays workout...
> 
> *squat 85kg 5x5
> OHP 42.5kg 5x5
> deadlift 100kg 1x5*
> 
> squats were fine, as said above, _almost_ enjoying em...
> 
> deadlift was feeling real heavy but nice round number on the bar and nice to have a few big plates on the bar...
> 
> ohp was a problem... 42.5kg for the 3rd time now and although i made the 5x5 it was real hard,only just doable and really don't feel i could increase to 45kg... not being defeatist, just don't think i could move the bar with that extra 2.5kgs on...so what now, try the 45kgs next time or deload by 10%...?  also now got a pain down r/h/s of middle of back...could just be the way i slept but as i have a dodgy shoulder on r/h/s thinking i need some warmup/stretching/flexibility exercies for shoulders...any ideas guys...?
> 
> rgds stu


Don't worry too much about the OHP Stu, it takes time to increase the weight due to the small muscles used etc...

*A good shoulder flexibility/movement - Shoulder dislocations :thumb:*:

I've got my shoulder & arms session tonight :devil:

Roll on December!!!! Hopefully my hamstring will let me get back to my normal weights, then i'll push really hard for the 200kg deadlift & squat :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Don't worry too much about the OHP Stu, it takes time to increase the weight due to the small muscles used etc...
> 
> *A good shoulder flexibility/movement - Shoulder dislocations :thumb:*:
> 
> I've got my shoulder & arms session tonight :devil:
> 
> Roll on December!!!! Hopefully my hamstring will let me get back to my normal weights, then i'll push really hard for the 200kg deadlift & squat :thumb:


cheers doug...thinking of getting some fractional plates for OHP so i can increase maybe by 1kg at a time...
will check out shoulder dislocations...:thumb:
200kg deadlift...:doublesho, just done 100kgs and thought i was gonna poop myself...:lol:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> gotta admit, was for a while quite dubious about all the squatting lark being a whole body exercise rather than just legs but having done then now (grudgingly) for last couple of months, tbh i can now understand how it does work whole body and can feel the benefits...:thumb:
> don't really mind/almost enjoy doing them now...:lol:
> got 85kgs to do on them today, only another 4 weeks and i'm at bodyweight..:thumb:
> rgds stu


Might be worth purchasing some micro loaders or get hold of some magnets that weight 1kg-0.5kg & micro load your OHP rather than going up by 2.5Kg increments :thumb:

As soon as my OHP progress stops this time I will micro load by 1kg at a time then by 0.5kg & lastly by 0.25kg until the 100kg is reached or to whatever is my max as I have no idea what it is as I've only ever got to 84Kg for reps on the behind neck press in my younger years :thumb:

I would expect it to take around 3 years of uninterrupted Injury free progress to get the OHP to 100kg :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cheers doug...thinking of getting some fractional plates for OHP so i can increase maybe by 1kg at a time...
> will check out shoulder dislocations...:thumb:
> 200kg deadlift...:doublesho, just done 100kgs and thought i was gonna poop myself...:lol:
> rgds stu


Believe me mate if it wasn't for this bloody hamstring  you guys WOULD have a video on here by now of me doing the single rep 230kg deadlift :thumb:

As long as my hamstring recovers you have my word, there will be a video of me doing the above. I'm on 55kg sat  utter crap but I have to move up slowly if I am to have any chance of lifting heavy again, especially at my age :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> I would expect it to take around 3 years of uninterrupted Injury free progress to get the OHP to 100kg :thumb:


:doublesho:doublesho:doublesho

was looking at micro plates/fractional plates but magnets sound like a good idea..!:thumb:

tbh, fairly happy with 42.5kgs at the mo as thats more than i could lift when i was younger but obviously still wanna increase this weight and i think 1kg per time is more realistic than 2.5kgs...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Believe me mate if it wasn't for this bloody hamstring  you guys WOULD have a video on here by now of me doing the single rep 230kg deadlift :thumb:
> 
> As long as my hamstring recovers you have my word, there will be a video of me doing the above. I'm on 55kg sat  utter crap but I have to move up slowly if I am to have any chance of lifting heavy again, especially at my age :thumb:


look forward to that vid...:thumb: maybe stuff the back of yer shorts with kitchen roll paper before you start?...:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> look forward to that vid...:thumb: maybe stuff the back of yer shorts with kitchen roll paper before you start?...:devil:


Never squat heavy if your feeling a little loose!!!!! :doublesho:doublesho


----------



## jonnyMercUK

My mate who I train with has had a cartilage transplant so squats are out of the question, just wondered if anyone recommended an alternative, it's not the weight that is the problem it's the movement.


----------



## rob warrington

Bod42 said:


> Stu is right your better to start light than to heavy but then you dont want to be spinning your wheels for weeks and months if you can be doing more weight. Your are putting 30kg per month on your deadlift so if the 100kg was real easy I would say this is fine but do you think your be doing 130kg next month if the last rep was slow. You may be who knows but you probaby need to make a judgement call.
> 
> Good starting weights. While the weights are light really try and concentrate on form, squatting to depth is probably the hardest aspect for people just starting squatting. Extract from one of Rippletoe's latest squatting articles:
> 
> Squats below parallel are your homework. The result of doing them is that you get stronger on all the other exercises, even the pressing movements, because squats make your whole body stronger - if you do them correctly. I know it's harder that way, and one of the ways you know it's wrong to do them high is that everybody else does them high. When was the last time that thing everybody else was doing turned out to be the right thing to do?
> 
> Deep squats done with a weight that's a little heavier each time you train affect your body in a way that no other exercise can. And believe me when I say that "other methods" have been tried. They just don't work. And it's not that they don't work as well, they don't work at all.


Thanks. Like I say I've dropped the weight I usualy do on ovp as to be more strict and not pushing up from my legs, I'll defo drop down on dead lifts and I've no need to drop the weight on my squats are its low enough haha but I do go down as low as I should. that EZ curl bar was giving me funny looks lastnight as I havent picked it up for over 4 weeks haha (mustn't do bi's mustn't do bi's) lol


----------



## ITHAQVA

rob warrington said:


> Thanks. Like I say I've dropped the weight I usualy do on ovp as to be more strict and not pushing up from my legs, I'll defo drop down on dead lifts and I've no need to drop the weight on my squats are its low enough haha but I do go down as low as I should. that EZ curl bar was giving me funny looks lastnight as I havent picked it up for over 4 weeks haha (mustn't do bi's mustn't do bi's) lol


Nothing wrong with training your arms if you have a well balanced workout mate :thumb:

Tonights Shoulder/arm session.

Weights felt way too light but I'm going to stick with it & follow the 5/3/1 advice on starting lighter :thumb:

*Main lift:

OVERHEAD PRESS (Warm up sets -22X5 28X5 33X3) Work sets - 37KGX5 42KGX5 48KGX5

Assistance work:

OVERHEAD PRESS 35KG-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL CURL 35KGX-10-10-10-10-10

CLOSE GRIP BENCH PRESS 45KGX-10-10-10-10-10*

:thumb:

Im itching to get my deadlift & squat back to normal


----------



## sfstu

rob warrington said:


> that EZ curl bar was giving me funny looks lastnight as I havent picked it up for over 4 weeks haha (mustn't do bi's mustn't do bi's) lol


*"STEP AWAYFROM THE EZ CURL BAR"*:devil::lol:

gotta admit, looking forward to the time when i can do some bi's/tri's as miss doing them, although your arms really do grow in size and strength doing the basic compound stuff...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> *"STEP AWAYFROM THE EZ CURL BAR"*:devil::lol:


:lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> My mate who I train with has had a cartilage transplant so squats are out of the question, just wondered if anyone recommended an alternative, it's not the weight that is the problem it's the movement.


Im not sure the extent of the injury, so here is a little list of lifts,try the following for legs/calves pick out the ones your friend can do, discard the ones he cant :thumb:

1. Glute ham raises, start with bodyweight then add weights (only if possible) if not do 5 sets of 10 at bodyweight only :thumb:

2. Leg press

3. Deadlift, if not possible to do a standard deadlift you can try Rack 
pulls :thumb:

4. Sumo deadlift

5. Leg curl

6. Leg raise

7. Half squats

8. Half front squats.

9. The mighty under estimated Standing calf raise!!! Do these with a 1-4 rep range for the pure power sets, aim for a max of 300kg, then do your 10 rep sets, I wouldn't go much heavier than 300kg, *be warned *-once I got to around 380kg- 400kg I suffered a calf muscle tear & it took a very long time to heal. *Never sacrifice your form if you plan to go heavy.*

10. Seated calf raise.

Above all, adapt the lifts according to ability, with the injury described I would speak to a good sports physio before starting & keep form very strict *always* & add weight at reduced increments to allow the injury adapt/recover.

*I would start very light & do sets of 10 reps & get a feel for it then think about the heavy low rep stuff a little later :thumb:*

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Never squat heavy if your feeling a little loose!!!!! :doublesho:doublesho


I recall a discussion a little while back about the disruptive effect of needing to take a dump mid session. Something to factor into your warmup for sure



jonnyMercUK said:


> My mate who I train with has had a cartilage transplant so squats are out of the question, just wondered if anyone recommended an alternative, it's not the weight that is the problem it's the movement.


One alternative could be to ask on Rip's Q&A. Couple of things though. Be precise e.g. ankle or knee, seach first and if that doesn't help say you searched, there's a sticky at the top about what info to post when asking such questions. Like any of us who post on there be prepared to have your ass handed to you - he's a knowledgeable but crotchety old goat and it's all part of the fun of his forum.


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> My mate who I train with has had a cartilage transplant so squats are out of the question, just wondered if anyone recommended an alternative, it's not the weight that is the problem it's the movement.


Where was the cartilage transplanted? If its the knee then box squats have been shown to be better for the knees as you can keep your lower leg dead vertical and you don't stretch everything as your stopping on the box. Another advantage is you can set the box higher and then he can test and see what feels ok


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Where was the cartilage transplanted? If its the knee then box squats have been shown to be better for the knees as you can keep your lower leg dead vertical and you don't stretch everything as your stopping on the box. Another advantage is you can set the box higher and then he can test and see what feels ok


You & your bloody box squats James!!!  :lol:

All jokes aside, i think it's a very good idea :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> You & your bloody box squats James!!!  :lol:
> 
> All jokes aside, i think it's a very good idea :thumb:


I'm off the box starting tomorrow, smolov for 3 weeks, should be interesting. Then instead of the planned weight loss workout I'm moving onto 5/3/1. No other reason than I don't want to spend money buying extra plates for dumbe:lol:lls


----------



## ITHAQVA

Another recovery session complete :thumb:

*SQUAT 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% 55KGX5

DEADLIFT 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% 55KGX5

DEADLIFT 55KG-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL ROW 55KG-10-10-10 (Will add two more sets next week giving a total of 5 sets for the recovery phase)*

:thumb:

Only another 130KG to go before im back to were I was before the  injury!!!! :doublesho:doublesho 

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

making good progress there doug...:thumb: slow and steady wins the race..

ordered today some 8x 0.25kg fractional plates for help with my OHP which i'll find out tomorrow if i've stalled on or not at 42.5kg...
was reading rippetoes forum and he says its fine to microload on OHP whenever you stall...gonna have a go at 45kg for a couple of workouts but not confident after last couple of ohp workouts...

gonna start shoulder dislocations too using a resistance band...how often should i do, just before shoulder exercise or several times a week..?

would like to add some sort of assistance for shoulder too as don't wanna be stuck at weight i'm at especially if that could affect things like bench press. what do you think guys...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> making good progress there doug...:thumb: slow and steady wins the race..
> 
> ordered today some 8x 0.25kg fractional plates for help with my OHP which i'll find out tomorrow if i've stalled on or not at 42.5kg...
> was reading rippetoes forum and he says its fine to microload on OHP whenever you stall...gonna have a go at 45kg for a couple of workouts but not confident after last couple of ohp workouts...
> 
> gonna start shoulder dislocations too using a resistance band...how often should i do, just before shoulder exercise or several times a week..?
> 
> would like to add some sort of assistance for shoulder too as don't wanna be stuck at weight i'm at especially if that could affect things like bench press. what do you think guys...?
> rgds stu


Exactly, i know even now I could go heavier but i would rather go slow & have no more issues :thumb:

Glad you got your micro loaders on the way Stu, I tend to have my first stall around 60kg-62kg on the OHP, as soon as I do this time I will micro load with 1kg increments for as long as I can then move on to 0.5kg & finally 0.25kg discs :thumb:

I do shoulder dislocations 4 times a week as part of my dynamic stretch warm up :thumb:

I have found the bench press hits my shoulders really well no matter the grip. I would stick to your 5X5 as is, then move on to the 5/3/1, you can add more volume on the assistance work & your shoulders will be hit by the extra bench & shoulder work, if you do the boring but big routine after the main workout.

BBB Examples:

*Bench day - 5 sets 10 reps bench press, starting at 50% of your training max.

Shoulder day - 5 sets 10 reps OHP, starting at 50% of you training max*

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 3 Week 1*

Sets of 5 reps.

Max rep sets: (n.b. same weight as Cycle 2)

Shoulder Press 7 reps vs 6 Cycle 2

Deadlift 10 reps(@112.5kg) vs 9 last cycle

Bench 7 reps vs 8 last cycle

Squat 8 reps vs 7 last cycle

Really happy to eventually get 10 reps on a set :devil:. Bench was less than last time but I think I was going too slow and fatigued. Squats were a mess. Posterior chain was strong but bar moved down back, good morning it towards the end and on the 8th rep my air popped up into my throat and I bascially good morninged it up without air in my belly and a rounded back. Bit scary given my back history and on reflection I should have dumped it but felt so good I thought I could reset at the top (which I couldn't!) :wall:. Decided to try out concentrating on the movement and videoing the set. I'll count back the reps from that and it should stop me rushing to get past a certain number.

Got 10 reps on hanging leg raises for a few sets :devil:

Two hill sprints. The one today had loads of couples walking past in the lane. Quite a few cheered me on or said 'Well done lad' as I got to my end line  Only in Yorkshire!
*
Community thread \ Challenge*
I was thinking during my warmup :speechles if bench press correlated to press-ups. So, since we've no shame on here, who's up for a test? It's not about how who's best but how the max number of press-ups relates to bench press numbers. I'll probably be around a dozen and reckon barefacedgeek will come out best. Anyone want to try?:wave:


----------



## sfstu

i'll have a go...:thumb: 
probably about a dozen for me too (sometimes manage a cheeky 10 on bench day at the end of workout) but i remember trying to do some a few months back for the 1st time in ages (before starting the 5x5) and managed 3 :doublesho:lol:, had to do some more on my knees...:wall:
thing is, i was trying to show my oldest lad how to do em for his tae kwon do..


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> i'll have a go...:thumb:
> probably about a dozen for me too (sometimes manage a cheeky 10 on bench day at the end of workout) but i remember trying to do some a few months back for the 1st time in ages (before starting the 5x5) and managed 3 :doublesho:lol:, had to do some more on my knees...:wall:
> thing is, i was trying to show my oldest lad how to do em for his tae kwon do..


Cool:thumb::thumb: Shall we test next weekend (to give rest of 'em time to sign up) and then post results on Monday (bench 1rm and pressup reps)? Oh and we need to set the competition rules: no practicing allowed! None of this sneaky 10 pressups morning and night for the next week in advance 

Bl**dy kids eh? They always show you up. Seeing one's enough for him to learn, the ungrateful bugger!! On the hill sprints I got shouts of encouragement only to get home and my eldest to say "Daddy, why is your face all red?"! I didn't reply since all I could think of saying was 'Because I'm ****ed!" :lol:


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Community thread Challenge[/B]
> I was thinking during my warmup :speechles if bench press correlated to press-ups. So, since we've no shame on here, who's up for a test? It's not about how who's best but how the max number of press-ups relates to bench press numbers. I'll probably be around a dozen and reckon barefacedgeek will come out best. Anyone want to try?:wave:


Maximum number of press ups doesnt really correlate to maximum bench press as anything over 20 reps is more endurance strenth. Not saying they would hurt your bench press but I seen people do a shed load of press up but suck at Bench Press.

I dont mind having ago though. Should be fun :thumb:

These are not push ups 



 lol


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout
Free Squats (Yes Free Squats :thumb 102.5kg x 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6
Bench Press: 72.5x5, 82.5x5, 92.5x10 
Pendlay Rows: 45 x 10, 10, 10

This is my first Free squat workout since I started lifting again which is nearly a year. They felt easier and also harder, they felt easier as you get the bounce from the bottom but harder as your legs never get a break and they definitely cause you to breath harder. They hit different muscles and I forgot about that dead leg feeling you get from squats.

Left 1-2 reps in the tank so I dont exhaust myself, this is just basically to keep my strength up as my priority is to increase my squats.

50% of max so very light but just doing these to keep my strength up. I'm not in a hurry to push the weight up on these extra exercises as I'm squatting 4 times per week which will use up all my energy.


----------



## sfstu

must admit, don't like working out 1st thing in the morn...:doublesho
mondays workout

*bench 55kg 5x5
squat 87.5 5x5
BBRows 62.5 5x5*

as said above, despite a full nights sleep and a banana this morning, working out an hour after waking is not my best workout...
bench went ok, though having to watch overextending when pushing bar at top cos of losing shoulder tightness...
squat felt HEAVY but putting that down to my legs not being as warmed up as usual froma days walking on them...?
rows felt heavy too...found myself holding my breath through most...!

as a sidenote, found my bodyfat calipers while working out and although i didn't think i'd lost too much in the way of fat, i was pleased to find (according to dodgy calipers) that i've dropped from 30 to 22...

with the press ups, got no idea how to work out 1RM for bench... did have a cheeky try out last night and managed 16 which is a few more than my 3 on attempt couple o months ago..! chuffed, although i know that'll be a lot less than everyone elses here...:lol:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

I can't help but feel like i'm losing size... it could be because i'm use to being at the gym 6 days a week. I am getting stronger each session so something must be working!

Any advice?


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> I can't help but feel like i'm losing size... it could be because i'm use to being at the gym 6 days a week. I am getting stronger each session so something must be working!
> 
> Any advice?


If you are getting stronger & you really thing yo uare getting smaller I would be inclined to think your losing some bodyfat :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout
> Free Squats (Yes Free Squats :doublesho:doublesho:doublesho:thumb 102.5kg x 6, 6, 6, 6, 6, 6
> Bench Press: 72.5x5, 82.5x5, 92.5x10
> Pendlay Rows: 45 x 10, 10, 10


:thumb: Are you still doing the juggernaut James?


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> must admit, don't like working out 1st thing in the morn...:doublesho
> mondays workout
> 
> *bench 55kg 5x5
> squat 87.5 5x5
> BBRows 62.5 5x5*
> 
> as said above, despite a full nights sleep and a banana this morning, working out an hour after waking is not my best workout...
> bench went ok, though having to watch overextending when pushing bar at top cos of losing shoulder tightness...
> squat felt HEAVY but putting that down to my legs not being as warmed up as usual froma days walking on them...?
> rows felt heavy too...found myself holding my breath through most...!
> 
> as a sidenote, found my bodyfat calipers while working out and although i didn't think i'd lost too much in the way of fat, i was pleased to find (according to dodgy calipers) that i've dropped from 30 to 22...
> 
> with the press ups, got no idea how to work out 1RM for bench... did have a cheeky try out last night and managed 16 which is a few more than my 3 on attempt couple o months ago..! chuffed, although i know that'll be a lot less than everyone elses here...:lol:


Go easy on the rows Stu, I went up to 105Kg & too be honest it was too heavy; I would recommend you train with good form on barbell rows. 
Keep an eye on your back position, as the weight goes up you can have a tendency to stand more upright the heavier the weight gets, therefore negating the targeted muscles :thumb:
I'm back on rows tonight, tried 55kg over the weekend & it felt very SAFE, so tonight I'm going to try 60kg, hopefully get back to where I was on them within a few weeks (around 70kg), then carry on adding weight but keeping form strict.

Lift on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> I can't help but feel like i'm losing size... it could be because i'm use to being at the gym 6 days a week. I am getting stronger each session so something must be working!
> 
> Any advice?


To be honest you could loose a little size changing from a 6 day per week bodybuilding routine to a strength routine. Step back take a deep breath after reading that but your be better in the long run. The traditional pump sets that bodybuilders use make the muscle retain more water and other nutrients bit this effect is short term and you have to tense the muscle to get the full effect. Strength builds a different type of muscle (sorry can't remember the name right now its late) which is denser and lasts longer. I seen this first hand where my bodybuilder make would miss a week or two and be noticeable smaller where as I could take similar time off and loose hardly any muscle or size. This is why I always advocate the big exercises be trained for strength what ever your goals



ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb: Are you still doing the juggernaut James?


Nope finished that now. Overall a good program but for me it 
was very good for upper body exercises but not enough heavy work on the lower body. I'm on smolov for 3 weeks now. What better way to get used to a new exercises other than doing it 4 times per week but its going to hurt.

With rows I still like to see people doing Pendlay Rows, in my view its the same theory as doing deadlifts with a stop between each rep and these are good as you reset your form every rep. With normal rows, as Doug said, you can have a tendency to get more upright and by the end of the set you can be almost vertical bit with pendlay rows you have less room for error as your resetting every rep.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> To be honest you could loose a little size changing from a 6 day per week bodybuilding routine to a strength routine. Step back take a deep breath after reading that but your be better in the long run. The traditional pump sets that bodybuilders use make the muscle retain more water and other nutrients bit this effect is short term and you have to tense the muscle to get the full effect. Strength builds a different type of muscle (sorry can't remember the name right now its late) which is denser and lasts longer. I seen this first hand where my bodybuilder make would miss a week or two and be noticeable smaller where as I could take similar time off and loose hardly any muscle or size. This is why I always advocate the big exercises be trained for strength what ever your goals


Have to agree 100% with James on this; my strength has reduced very little even after years away from the weights. Before starting this powerlifting lark I used to train with a 1-4 rep range. Many years before that when using 6-8 rep range I found power losses happend even after a few weeks off.

James pointed this out many months ago about "muscle memory", I have no idea what the theory is but it holds true especially to large compound lifts.
:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nope finished that now. Overall a good program but for me it
> was very good for upper body exercises but not enough heavy work on the lower body. I'm on smolov for 3 weeks now. What better way to get used to a new exercises other than doing it 4 times per week but its going to hurt.
> 
> With rows I still like to see people doing Pendlay Rows, in my view its the same theory as doing deadlifts with a stop between each rep and these are good as you reset your form every rep. With normal rows, as Doug said, you can have a tendency to get more upright and by the end of the set you can be almost vertical bit with pendlay rows you have less room for error as your resetting every rep.


Like the sound of Pendlay rows, am I right in assuming it's just a strict form row with a dead stop after each rep? If so it actually sounds like a good way to Row more weight but in a safer manner :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Bod42 said:


> To be honest you could loose a little size changing from a 6 day per week bodybuilding routine to a strength routine. Step back take a deep breath after reading that but your be better in the long run. The traditional pump sets that bodybuilders use make the muscle retain more water and other nutrients bit this effect is short term and you have to tense the muscle to get the full effect. Strength builds a different type of muscle (sorry can't remember the name right now its late) which is denser and lasts longer. I seen this first hand where my bodybuilder make would miss a week or two and be noticeable smaller where as I could take similar time off and loose hardly any muscle or size. This is why I always advocate the big exercises be trained for strength what ever your goals


Great advice! Thanks!


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Go easy on the rows Stu, I went up to 105Kg & too be honest it was too heavy; I would recommend you train with good form on barbell rows.
> Keep an eye on your back position, as the weight goes up you can have a tendency to stand more upright the heavier the weight gets, therefore negating the targeted muscles :thumb:
> I'm back on rows tonight, tried 55kg over the weekend & it felt very SAFE, so tonight I'm going to try 60kg, hopefully get back to where I was on them within a few weeks (around 70kg), then carry on adding weight but keeping form strict.
> 
> Lift on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Dont think my forms too bad but i know its not as good as it was when weight was lighter
think im doing pendlay rows anyway as am touching floor after each rep and my back is more parallel to the floor than upright but i did notice this morning that the bar doesn't
always touch my lower chest/sternum...?
Should i stick at present weight for a couple of sessions til form is strict or deload by 10%...?


----------



## Guest

Christianmp said:


> Doesn't Martin (author of leangains.com) recommend that you eat your meals post-workout and do your training fasted.
> 
> I've been doing leangains for a couple of months, I've definetely lost some fat and maintained my bodyweight. So muscle must be going up and bodyfat-% going down. The only thing regarding this regime is how hard it is to eat the food required to reach my macro's.
> Carbs is a nightmare on training days, it's hard to eat ALL the rice/sweet potatoes/pasta.
> 
> And once again I'll recommend trying out fitocracy. Easy way to log your training, get you motivated and it is a great fitness-community.


Hi Christian,

Yep, I think the ideal is to do as you mention but I believe this is just extracting the last few percent out of your possible gains (losses!).

The way I understand the system is that the fasting has several hormonal benefits as well as aiding being on a calorie deficit (I've found my appetite has notably diminished by being on a fast). Being on a calorie deficit is the primary state required for fat loss, along with resistance training to maintain muscle mass.
The calorie/macro nutrient cycling is to aid fat loss/exercise dependant on your daily requirement. 
I think (hope) that the timing of meals comes a distant third with respect to fat loss. I guess time will tell, but consuming all my calories prior to lifting I hope won't affect me too much.

I'm having the same issues as you on WO days. It is TOUGH to get all those carbs in. I've been falling short lately and I think that may be partly why I've lost some strength - squatting has just felt plain weird, like I could lift the weight but don't have the energy to do so.

I'll take a look at fitocracy. I've been using myfitnesspal but it's not really geared towards I.F. or weight lifting.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> Dont think my forms too bad but i know its not as good as it was when weight was lighter
> think im doing pendlay rows anyway as am touching floor after each rep and my back is more parallel to the floor than upright but i did notice this morning that the bar doesn't
> always touch my lower chest/sternum...?
> Should i stick at present weight for a couple of sessions til form is strict or deload by 10%...?


 I wouldn't de load if I could help it, but I wouldn't use a light weights either, it's just one of those things mate, you need to use enough weight to produce results, it's not much of an answer but it is how it goes, use enough & add enough.

Keep following the 5X5 as is :thumb: 
Here is an example of my approach to help you a little later:
I get a good feel for rows at around 70Kg-80kg on 10 rep sets & 90Kg-100Kg on 5 rep sets. As I'm doing the 5/3/1 the row is an assistance exercise & I will try to keep adding 2.5kg every time I feel I have reached 5 sets of 10 quality reps. once I get to a point where I lose my form (I'll guess it to be somewhere around 80Kg- 90Kg) I will micro load my barbell row. 
Stu as you are doing barbell rows in sets of 5 reps you will find it much easier to progress in weight, once you start doing sets of 10 reps progress is far more difficult & slow. However the extra muscle mass produced from the 10 rep sets will help you with the 5 rep work, more muscle fibres to use!!!! :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mondays 5/3/1 :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (Warm up sets 50X5 60X5 72X3) 86KGX3 98KGX3 110KGX3

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL (Reduced weight from 70kg to 60Kg just to be safe, all reps felt gooooooooood!!) :thumb: 60KGX-10-10-10-10-10*

Very pleased with the workout :thumb:

Looking forward to next weeks Bench session as I will be on 116Kg :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Strength builds a different type of muscle (sorry can't remember the name right now its late) which is denser and lasts longer


Having a weird memory for this sort of thing is it myofibrillar (hard\strength) versus sacoplasmic (bodybuilding\ soft) where sarcoplasm fluid is 25% of the muscle volume?



Bod42 said:


> Maximum number of press ups doesnt really correlate to maximum bench press as anything over 20 reps is more endurance strenth. Not saying they would hurt your bench press but I seen people do a shed load of press up but suck at Bench Press.
> 
> I dont mind having ago though. Should be fun :thumb:
> 
> These are not push ups lol


Excellent. That's three guinea pigs. :thumb: Ok rule number 2 (seeing as Stu has already broken rule 1 - see below): nose needs to touch the floor?



sfstu said:


> must admit, don't like working out 1st thing in the morn...:doublesho
> 
> with the press ups, got no idea how to work out 1RM for bench... did have a cheeky try out last night and managed 16 which is a few more than my 3 on attempt couple o months ago..! chuffed, although i know that'll be a lot less than everyone elses here...:lol:


Oy no practicing!!  :lol:

1RM from 5\3\1 is calculated as reps (multiplied by) weight (multiplied by) 0.0333 (plus) weight (equals 1RM).

One of the things I recall from reading about lower backs is that you should avoid full spinal flexion in the first hour after waking up. Discs are full of fluid from the night time and so are much more liable to be injured (90% of it goes after 60 minutes). Might be worth moving around a while before you start. The worse replase I had (two days lying flat out) was unloading the dishwasher just after getting up. And that was when it felt so good I was off out for a days mountain biking with friends!


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> Excellent. That's three guinea pigs. :thumb: Ok rule number 2 (seeing as Stu has already broken rule 1 - see below): nose needs to touch the floor?
> 
> Oy no practicing!!  :lol:


i wasn't practicing, just a trial run and it was before you said no practicing anyway...

don't think anyones got any competition from me...


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Like the sound of Pendlay rows, am I right in assuming it's just a strict form row with a dead stop after each rep? If so it actually sounds like a good way to Row more weight but in a safer manner :thumb:


Yep your right. The main differences are that your upper body should be horizontal, no Yates Rows here :thumb:. I know some poeple touch the floor between reps but I like to actually deload the weight and basically let all the weight go on to the floor. This way every rep is from a deadstop. The positives are that its better for form and better for power as your starting from a dead stop and I think the most important aspect for raw lifters is that you row to the bottom of your pecs/sternum which is the exact opposite of bench press, this puts more muscle on your upper back which results in a bigger bench.

Doug they may be very good for your hamstring as thinking about it, imaging the force going through your lower back and hamstrings when you stop and reverse 100kg whereas Pendlay rows theres no stretch at the bottom.

You probably already read it but SL has an article on pendlay rows.


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Hi Christian,
> 
> Yep, I think the ideal is to do as you mention but I believe this is just extracting the last few percent out of your possible gains (losses!).
> 
> The way I understand the system is that the fasting has several hormonal benefits as well as aiding being on a calorie deficit (I've found my appetite has notably diminished by being on a fast). Being on a calorie deficit is the primary state required for fat loss, along with resistance training to maintain muscle mass.
> The calorie/macro nutrient cycling is to aid fat loss/exercise dependant on your daily requirement.
> I think (hope) that the timing of meals comes a distant third with respect to fat loss. I guess time will tell, but consuming all my calories prior to lifting I hope won't affect me too much.
> 
> I'm having the same issues as you on WO days. It is TOUGH to get all those carbs in. I've been falling short lately and I think that may be partly why I've lost some strength - squatting has just felt plain weird, like I could lift the weight but don't have the energy to do so.
> 
> I'll take a look at fitocracy. I've been using myfitnesspal but it's not really geared towards I.F. or weight lifting.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Hey Phil,

I been looking at Leangains lately and pretty much what I was going to do before you suggested the site which is cool. You mention hard to get in all the carbs, does leangain suggest certain % between fat/protein/ carbs on training and non-training, if so where can I find them please?


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Having a weird memory for this sort of thing is it myofibrillar (hardstrength) versus sacoplasmic (bodybuilding soft) where sarcoplasm fluid is 25% of the muscle volume?
> 
> Excellent. That's three guinea pigs. :thumb: Ok rule number 2 (seeing as Stu has already broken rule 1 - see below): nose needs to touch the floor?
> 
> Oy no practicing!!  :lol:
> 
> 1RM from 531 is calculated as reps (multiplied by) weight (multiplied by) 0.0333 (plus) weight (equals 1RM).
> 
> One of the things I recall from reading about lower backs is that you should avoid full spinal flexion in the first hour after waking up. Discs are full of fluid from the night time and so are much more liable to be injured (90% of it goes after 60 minutes). Might be worth moving around a while before you start. The worse replase I had (two days lying flat out) was unloading the dishwasher just after getting up. And that was when it felt so good I was off out for a days mountain biking with friends!


Cheers Oats their the different muscle types.

Cant really use Wendler 1RM formula for push ups unless you know the weight of your upper body and lower body separate and use a complicated calculation to ascertain the exact weight on your hands as some of your weight is being taken by your feet.

That is exactly right, its not just spinal flexion its spinal loading as well so squats are a no no. I think the article I read compared your spine to a hot water bottle, ifs it full to the brim and you lean on it, theres a high chance it will burst, if its half full you have more room for error.

Saying all this is just science, people have worked out for years in the mornings and I know some people think its an advantage due to higher hormone levels.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Hey Phil,
> 
> I been looking at Leangains lately and pretty much what I was going to do before you suggested the site which is cool. You mention hard to get in all the carbs, does leangain suggest certain % between fat/protein/ carbs on training and non-training, if so where can I find them please?


Hi James,

Yes, it a good site but finding info can be a little difficult. I actually went to the rippedbody.jp site to work out my calories and macros. 
Link to the actual page is http://rippedbody.jp/2011/10/23/how-to-calculate-leangains-macros/.
I actually guesstimated by LBM and took it from there. I'll see how I go and adjust the figures if necessary. 
The whole site is worth a read because it is effectively a condensed version of the LeanGains site - all the practical information with not so much of the background science, though he does link extensively to LG if you want to find out more.

Another useful site is http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/. It's a good calculator to show how you'll hopefully do on a LG style of diet.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Felt good last night!

Squats 85KG 5x5
Overhead Press 42.5KG 5x5
Deadlift 110KG 1x5

Weighted Chins 15KG 3x5
Plank 3x1min
Long Arm Crunch 3x12

I must say I struggled mid way through the overhead press so I decided to have a longer rest (90 secs or so). Managed to finish off pretty easily!


----------



## Guest

Back off holiday and back to lifting . After suffering a rather good bout of DOMS last time I squatted using DRPT, I decided to just do a single workset at each rep range (SRPT ). I'l probably do this for a bit until I'm fit enough to get a full DRPT session done in around an hour.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 135kg

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 50kg

Top squat set was a little hard but, after looking back at my log, I have only squatted once in the last month so I think the drop off in strength is to be expected. I'm ok with that. I think the occasional deload is no bad thing and I should be back to my previous e1RM by the end of October. No hint of DOMS this morning, so my plan might have worked .

Press went really well. My left tricep was aching after the squats. I'd hoped that a weeks rest would have helped it out a bit more. However, the more pressing I did the better it felt. Final AMRAP sets were good to get some blood flowing, even if the first set @32.5kg was a little light.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Guest

jonnyMercUK said:


> I must say I struggled mid way through the overhead press so I decided to have a longer rest (90 secs or so). Managed to finish off pretty easily!


Good session :thumb:

Don't worry about resting. Up to around 5 mins is fine, which you'll probably need for the squat as the weight goes up. OHP won't need so much, as the muscles being worked dynamically are much smaller, but it's better to rest and do all the sets rather than not rest enough and stall.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Another recovery workout done :thumb:

*DEADLIFT (Warm Up sets -5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work Set 60KGX5

SQUAT (Warm Up sets-5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work Set 60KGX5

SQUAT 60KG-10-10-10-10-10

CALF RAISE 60KG-10-10-10-10-10*

:thumb:

Roll on end of November!


----------



## rob warrington

tonight's workout, 

squats 50kg 55555 still a tiny amount of weight I know but it's gone up from 40 kg from last week 

overhead press 42.5kg 55532 

Deadlifts 80kg 5x1 I did 100 kg last week but as advised by you guys I've dropped the weight as I was probably jumping in a little early with the 100kg. to be honest I'm glad as by back is a little sore today (gardening digging out sodding bushes) haha. 

Also did some bi's sorry I couldn't resist lol. I did feel my back a little during my squats, don't know if this is normal or my form is off but I don't think it is. 
Anyways all in all very good, be doing some proper weight anytime soon I hope ha


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Hi James,
> 
> Yes, it a good site but finding info can be a little difficult. I actually went to the rippedbody.jp site to work out my calories and macros.
> Link to the actual page is http://rippedbody.jp/2011/10/23/how-to-calculate-leangains-macros/.
> I actually guesstimated by LBM and took it from there. I'll see how I go and adjust the figures if necessary.
> The whole site is worth a read because it is effectively a condensed version of the LeanGains site - all the practical information with not so much of the background science, though he does link extensively to LG if you want to find out more.
> 
> Another useful site is http://www.1percentedge.com/ifcalc/. It's a good calculator to show how you'll hopefully do on a LG style of diet.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Cheers Phil, I started having a read last night, loads of info but theres no summary anywhere. I found when to eat and that you should eat as many meals as possible after your training and that non-training days are low carb higher fat and training days are high carb lower fat. I also found the formula's to calculate your BMR but didnt see the macros as he said they are different for eveyone.

What kind of macros do you base your diet on. Just curious as I always got good results with the 40/30/30 split for training days but I do it slightly different as I use the 40% for protein instead of the suggested carbs and wondered what Leangains suggested. I know that I am a protein person and carbs make me feel sluggish. Curious as you said its hard to get all your carbs but hitting macros is extremely hard when you eat clean.


----------



## Guest

Hi James,

I've tweaked my calories and macro split slightly since my first post about this.

For Non-WO days:
1400kcal
60/10/30, so P=210g, C=35g, F=47g

For WO days:
2100kcal
40/45/15, so P=210g, C=236g, F=35g

I don't fuss over every gram, just try to get reasonably close. I'm currently not counting carbs in non-starchy veggies and fruit, just bread/rice/pasta/potato etc.

I worked out these macros by choosing protein to be roughly 3xLBM. Currently, I'm using a 25%/75% split for carbs/fat on non-WO days and then 75%/25% on WO days (inspired by the I/F calculator, but chosen to keep fat low on WO days).

I'll keep monitoring my progress and adjust if BF is not shifting how I'd like it to. The calculator gives a 0.57kg/1.3lb loss per week and indicates I should reach my target by end Feb next year.

Edit to add that I'm currently pretty rubbish at hitting my macros on both days and I really need to try and sort it out. I don't manage to get enough protein on either day - closer to 140g. Carbs are over on non-WO days at around 60-90g, but way under on WO days. Fat I tend to get about right. I'm currently ending up being a little below my cals on non-WO days and way under on my WO days :wall:. I'm definately a newb at this diet stuff .

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

gotta admit, all this diet talk of macros and how much proteinvscarbvsfat just bewilders me...:doublesho it all just seems so complicated but i really need to be looking into all this a bit more i know...i'm sure i could be doing so much better lifting wise and weight wise if i did...

wednesday workout

*OHP 45kg 5x5
squat 90 5x5
deadlift 105 5x5*

well wasn't sure whether to attempt 45kg on ohp after struggling for last 3 workouts at 42.5kg but glad i did... was hard, really hard and all a bit wobbley but did manage it, last set was a bit ropey but chuffed to get it anyway.... gonna see how it goes but have 8x0.25kg micro plates now so will prob increase by 1.5kg or even 1kg in future...

squat was pleasantly heavy but doable...took the dog for a walk this morning between breakfast and working out which was late morning which helped and was definately better than doing workout an hour after waking like lasttime...:thumb:

deadlift feels heavy but still doable,just...:thumb: wouldn't have thought 2 months ago with a bad back i could do deads let alone get up to 105kg so chuffed with that too... glad its only 1 set too, felt sick at the end...:lol:

rgds stu

p.s. Oats, i haven't done a pushup since sunday...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> gotta admit, all this diet talk of macros and how much proteinvscarbvsfat just bewilders me...:doublesho it all just seems so complicated but i really need to be looking into all this a bit more i know...i'm sure i could be doing so much better lifting wise and weight wise if i did...


Don't worry too much about diet Stu, the human body can build muscle/strength on very little :thumb:

Get your strength goals sorted first then adapt your training/diet to maintain the strength and then add other aspects of your goals - fitness/lower body fat levels. Trying to do it all at once can be a little overwhelming :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout 2 of 12
Free Squats: 110kg x 7sets x 5reps
RC Work

Squats r feeling better every time I squat. A few of the reps I got felt perfect, I dropped into the hole and just stood up in what felt like less than a second, it felt so good. Definitely loving the free squats right now and feel like I can put some weight on the bar fast and that's the idea behind this 3 week blitz. The Mrs did point out that the bar is on my back on the **** and when I looked at a video she was right and looks like i was off centre on the bar to give my screwed shoulder some space.

Just did some band work to keep the shoulder sweet


----------



## Guest

Tonight's session.

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]

*Chins*
WU: None
WO: -3/-3/[email protected]

Bench went ok. Struggled a bit on the top work sets (@67.5kg) due to my left tricep giving me some pain. Disappointingly, I probably would have still struggled even if my tricep was not playing up.

Chins were a bit of a disaster. Was planning on doing a few ladders but could not manage 3 full reps. Switched back to negatives in the hope this will rapidly improve my strength at doing these again.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> ... wasn't sure whether to attempt 45kg on ohp after struggling for last 3 workouts at 42.5kg but glad i did... was hard, really hard and all a bit wobbley but did manage it, last set was a bit ropey but chuffed to get it anyway....
> 
> ... squat was pleasantly heavy but doable...
> 
> deadlift feels heavy but still doable,just...:thumb: wouldn't have thought 2 months ago with a bad back i could do deads let alone get up to 105kg so chuffed with that too... glad its only 1 set too, felt sick at the end...:lol:


I think that's a great post and epitomises what this is all about. Hard work, daunting\mental and rewarding all together. Roll on a hundred more sessions like that eh sfstu?:thumb::thumb:



sfstu said:


> p.s. Oats, i haven't done a pushup since sunday...:thumb:


Ahhh well I did my usual dozen in my warm up and thought 'not sure how many more I'd be able to do!'. On the plus side my bench is sh^t so no pressure. Might load up on creatine for next few days since that's not been outlawed by the assessing panel :lol:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout 2 of 12
> The Mrs did point out that the bar is on my back on the **** ...


My wife turns the other way if she comes in to have a conversation mid squat - she says it looks horrific :doublesho



Bod42 said:


> Saying all this is just science, people have worked out for years in the mornings and I know some people think its an advantage due to higher hormone levels.


I re-read the passage between sets yesterday and Stuart McGill used rowers as an example. They go out very early to have calm water but it does increase the chance of injury.

The three things I remember from a talk by the Leeds Rhinos coach were:
1) third of a bag of crisps weight is fat. 
2) they have porridge every morning. 
3) they start training at 7:30 since testosterone is at its highest (waking up under a tepee and all that).


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> I think that's a great post and epitomises what this is all about. Hard work, dauntingmental and rewarding all together. Roll on a hundred more sessions like that eh sfstu?:thumb::thumb:


Have to agree with this. This right here is exactly why we weightlift, to surpass our expectations. Glad to see you got 105kg deadlift stu, thats impressive for the amount of time training. I know what you mean about increasing thr weight on OHP, I had the same on squats, I would complete 5x5 on say a Monday and think that took every ounce of energy and strength I had, there is no way in hell I can do 2.5kg more on wednesday. Wednesday comes and you smash the weight.



Oats said:


> My wife turns the other way if she comes in to have a conversation mid squat - she says it looks horrific :doublesho


The Mrs trains with me sometimes, she is actually the most natural strength person I have ever seen god dam it. She has perfect form in nearly every exercise straight off the bat. She is very inconsistent with her training and sometimes goes months without training but I have seen her do a low box squat for reps with 70kg at a BW of 60 something kg. Not bad.

She only mentioned it while I was warming up so I asked her to take a vid and its 2-3" down/up at one end.

She does look worried when I was doing the all out sets when on Juggernaut.



Oats said:


> I re-read the passage between sets yesterday and Stuart McGill used rowers as an example. They go out very early to have calm water but it does increase the chance of injury.
> 
> The three things I remember from a talk by the Leeds Rhinos coach were:
> 1) third of a bag of crisps weight is fat.
> 2) they have porridge every morning.
> 3) they start training at 7:30 since testosterone is at its highest (waking up under a tepee and all that).


Good to see another person who reads stuff from top coaches. I like this info as its proven in life, scientific tests are good but real life is where it really matters.


----------



## Christianmp

I've been a lazy ******* regarding posting my workouts here.

Posting links to my fitocracy "wall".

Deadlifts! 
https://www.fitocracy.com/entry/11438974/
Next time I tried to deadlift I could barely lift 90kg!?

Easing back into the SL5x5-ish WO:
https://www.fitocracy.com/entry/11739512/

Another 5x5.
https://www.fitocracy.com/entry/11922308/

At around 78kg BW.


----------



## Guest

Christianmp said:


> Deadlifts!
> https://www.fitocracy.com/entry/11438974/
> Next time I tried to deadlift I could barely lift 90kg!?


Good workouts :thumb:. It might have been a recovery issue that stopped you lifting more than 90kg - that was quite a big session with deads, rows, rdls and chins all hitting your back!


----------



## Christianmp

@barefacedgeek
It most definately was a recovery issue. The next couple of deadlift WO was nice and "easy". Looking forward to friday, where I'll be trying out 130kg again and just stick to the SL template.

Not feeling the love for the pendlays though. Might consider switching to DB rows instead.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Did my wed session last night, seem to be getting strong each session (yes I know thats the point!)

Bench - 72.5kg (stayed on the same as last workout as I struggled, however this time it was no problem!
Squat - 87.5KG, again banged all 5 sets out
Barbell - 67.5KG, was hard but will go up next time 2.5kg
Dips - 35KG, killed me!


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout: 3 of 12
Squats: 115kg x 8 sets x 4 reps
Seated Shoulder Press: 40 x 5, 42.5 x 5, 50 x 8
Dips: BW x 5, 5, 10

Squats are just feeling better and better every workout, really enjoying free squats and they feel completely different and hit completely different muscles. Not looking forward to squatting tomorrow though.

Doing the 5/3/1 workout but stopping 2-3 reps short so I dont exhaust myself. My goal right now is to increase my free squat up to a decent amount. Really hoping to add a decent amount in the 3 weeks, should be a minimum 7.5kg but hoping for more.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Bod42 said:


> really enjoying free squats


Are free squats, free standing ie not on say a smith machine?


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> Are free squats, free standing ie not on say a smith machine?


Free squats are normal squats. I normally box squat so just putting free squat. Squatting in a smith machine is dangerous, never do that.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Bod42 said:


> Free squats are normal squats. I normally box squat so just putting free squat. Squatting in a smith machine is dangerous, never do that.


Ah I get you now, I have always done 'normal' squats.


----------



## Guest

Short session tonight.

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 160kg

The 160kg e1RM was a little too high. Already a deload of 20kg from my e1RM on AFP, but I think the diet and relative lack of lifting last month has taken its toll.
The top work sets of 142.5kg were a little tough. Deloaded to an e1RM of 155kg for the remaining sets and they went much better.

I was going to attempt some dips but my LH tricep, and now wrist, are playing up. Decided to rest them instead.
(for those of you snigering in the corner, I am right handed )

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

fridays workout...

*bench 57.5kg 5x5
BBRows 65 5x5*

bench was good and heavy, and definitely have to concentrate on body position but pleased with the weight and even more pleased that theres more to come yet...
BBRows/pendlay rows (as thats what i've found i've been doing anyway) were real heavy...struggled on last couple o sets barely managing to get bar up to sternum so gonna repeat this weight again next workout...don't mind if i slow down on this with adding weights tbh as want to keep form good...:thumb:
the observant amongst you will notice the lack of squats.... basically, i had a 12 hour rubbish day at work, was tired and haven't really seen my kids much last couple of days so basically cut the workout short and will do squats in the morning...:thumb:

thats not a copout...tbh, am starting to struggle a bit now with the length of workouts (up to hour and a half on bench/squat/bbrow day) and with the effort/intensity etc required... 
have so far manged to nearly always get my 3 workouts a week in but now the weights are going up i'm needing more and more rest between sets and now with the warmups (that i didn't used to do!) its getting physically and mentally draining...! would love to add ab work or chins/dips etc but just can't do it timewise, let alone physically...? even with a good nights sleep i'm absolutely exhausted after the workouts and working sometimes long and irregular hours doesn't help either... after a long day at work like today, and with thoughts of needing to spend quality family time am beginning to wonder how long i can sustain current workouts...?

thinking of reducing squats to 3x5 very soon...(no surprise there for some of you!:lol.basically because i don't know how long i can keep increasing the weights on a day like today when planned workout is squats,bench and rows, all big heavy moves and adding in warmups i'm starting to think that its too much in addition to work and family life etc...
if i do squats 1st then bench is that much harder and i think the rows will really suffer at the end..? and whichever order i do it in the last exercise will suffer...
don't wanna stop the 5x5 as i'm enjoying it and the lifting but don't wanna burnout either and tbh, don't mind slowing down on the squats, i'm pleased with progress so far (never squatted before 2 months ago and will be up to bodyweight in 2 weeks or so) but definately would rather focus on building the upper body strength if i had to choose, which i'm starting to think i do...
what do you guys reckon...?
rgds stu (the knackered:doublesho)


----------



## Guest

Stu,

I reduced all my exercises to 3x5 for the very reasons you mention above - workout time and exhaustion. I suffered no let off in strength gains, which is not completely surprising since SS is all at 3x5.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

Thats good to hear phil...:thumb:
was half expecting a stern talking too rippetoe style about digging deep and sucking it up or wendler style bout moving north o vag...!:doublesho
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> Thats good to hear phil...:thumb:
> was half expecting a stern talking too rippetoe style about digging deep and sucking it up or wendler style bout moving north o vag...!:doublesho
> rgds stu


Stu, you can go all the way down to a 1X5 if it works for you mate, it did for me :thumb:
But even then you can burn out once you start using more weight, thats why i have now moved over to the 5/3/1 & will stay with it :thumb:

Fridays shoulder workout.

*OVERHEAD PRESS (Warm up sets -22X5 28X5 33X3) Work sets 40KGX3 45KGX3 51KGX3 *

Stuffed for time so did "I'm doing Jack SHiit" assistance routine 

:thumb::thumb:


----------



## Oats

BareFacedGeek said:


> Stu,
> 
> I reduced all my exercises to 3x5 for the very reasons you mention above - workout time and exhaustion. I suffered no let off in strength gains, which is not completely surprising since SS is all at 3x5.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


I did Starting Strength and that gets long as well. Resting 5 mins between sets means 45 mins of rest without anything else. 90 minutes session was pretty normal (although I think I was a bit slow!). There's no way round it really and is a cost of lifting heavier weights and doing linear progression. I have wondered how the 5x5 folks do it because it must take ages.

The SS intermediate routine most people do is Texas Method. That's 5x5 on volume day. Rip says those squatting 300+ in his gym regularly take 10 mins rest so they're looking at 2 hours plus on the volume day. A large part of why I did 5\3\1 as it's an hour.

To my mind milking novice linear progression for all its worth is worth giving up alot for. It's only a short time. But then none of us are in this to Qualify for the Olympics so why let it get on top of you? Luckily 3x5 is just the ticket:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Then 3 x 5 it will be...:thumb:
as i said, i've enjoyed it so far but last couple o weeks its been less enjoyable and more of a chore....
And i never did like doing chores....
cheers all for replies, rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I did Starting Strength and that gets long as well. Resting 5 mins between sets means 45 mins of rest without anything else. 90 minutes session was pretty normal (although I think I was a bit slow!). There's no way round it really and is a cost of lifting heavier weights and doing linear progression. I have wondered how the 5x5 folks do it because it must take ages.
> 
> The SS intermediate routine most people do is Texas Method. That's 5x5 on volume day. Rip says those squatting 300+ in his gym regularly take 10 mins rest so they're looking at 2 hours plus on the volume day. A large part of why I did 531 as it's an hour.
> 
> To my mind milking novice linear progression for all its worth is worth giving up alot for. It's only a short time. But then none of us are in this to Qualify for the Olympics so why let it get on top of you? Luckily 3x5 is just the ticket:thumb:


think i see what you are saying oats with the linear progression for the novice...i have made the effort to stick with my workouts, rearranging all sorts of things lifewise to accomodate but its getting really hard to do that all the time and as you say, i'm not in it for olympic qualification...
i do like the sound of 5/3/1 but am happy to leave it for a couple of months yet and stick with the SL5x5 for a little while longer albeit becomming 3x5...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Another recovery workout done :thumb:

*SQUAT (Warm up 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work set 65KGX5

DEADLIFT (Warm up 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work set 65KGX5

DEADLIFT 65KG -10 - 10 - 10 - 10 - 10*

So far still on track to be back to my normal training weights by Mid/end November :thumb:

116Kg Bench on Monday, wish me luck :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Another recovery workout done :thumb:
> 
> *SQUAT (Warm up 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work set 65KGX5
> 
> DEADLIFT (Warm up 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work set 65KGX5
> 
> DEADLIFT 65KG -10 - 10 - 10 - 10 - 10*
> 
> So far still on track to be back to my normal training weights by Mid/end November :thumb:
> 
> 116Kg Bench on Monday, wish me luck :thumb:


getting there doug...:thumb: good luck for the BP, would love to break 100kgs on bench...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> getting there doug...:thumb: good luck for the BP, would love to break 100kgs on bench...
> rgds stu


Cheers Stu :thumb:

You'll get there mate, don't be too disappointed if you have one maybe two plateaus before you get 100kg.

I'm stopping at a 150Kg bench; i expect it to take about 12 months to get from my present 116kg to 150kg :thumb:

Onward & upward!!!!


----------



## sfstu

it'll take me awhiles yet but thats fine...:thumb: aproaching 60kgs on it which is more than i used to lift in my younger days and as i have iffy shoulders i gotta be happy with that... still focussing on quality rather than quantity which i think i need to, especially agewise...!
think i've slackened off recently dietwise and feeling it a little so gonna refocus on that starting next week...just time for a cheeky kebab tonight tho....:devil:
you onboard for the pressups doug...? posting mine monday, think my 1rm is worked out to be 67kg using wendlers formula...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> it'll take me awhiles yet but thats fine...:thumb: aproaching 60kgs on it which is more than i used to lift in my younger days and as i have iffy shoulders i gotta be happy with that... still focussing on quality rather than quantity which i think i need to, especially agewise...!
> think i've slackened off recently dietwise and feeling it a little so gonna refocus on that starting next week...just time for a cheeky kebab tonight tho....:devil:
> you onboard for the pressups doug...? posting mine monday, think my 1rm is worked out to be 67kg using wendlers formula...
> rgds stu


Press ups challenge, not this time Stu.

The formula is all well & good but i cant see it being accurate after 10 reps or so, i think it even states that in the 5/3/1 book.

Dont let your age put you off Stu, Or should I say dont let *you* put yourself off. Mate im 44 & If my hamstring allows Im still aiming for my ultimate goals :thumb:


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> ...stick with the SL5x5 for a little while longer albeit becomming 3x5...:thumb:


My understanding is that Bill Starr used to teach 5x5. Rip was coached by Bill Starr and over time moved to 3x5. The fella on Strong Lifts didn't have a background in competing or coaching but set up a *******isation of the two and over time have managed to make himself a living out of it. Fair do's to him but 3x5 is the orthodoxy of the coach who is regarded as the expert in getting novices strong so don't worry about it being a poor relation. Thought of adding power cleans now you've got the kit? I enjoyed them but never got the hang of pulling with straight arms even after doing them weekly for 6 months. :wall: One of my future goals.



ITHAQVA said:


> Press ups challenge, not this time Stu.
> 
> The formula is all well & good but i cant see it being accurate after 10 reps or so, i think it even states that in the 5/3/1 book.


The 1rm max was for the bench and then I was wondering about how it corrolated to reps on press-ups. Utterly unscientifc and just a bit of fun.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> The 1rm max was for the bench and then I was wondering about how it corrolated to reps on press-ups. Utterly unscientifc and just a bit of fun.


 Fun, im all for it  So its naked press ups then, with a lady unerneath you :thumb: :doublesho


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> think i see what you are saying oats with the linear progression for the novice...i have made the effort to stick with my workouts, rearranging all sorts of things lifewise to accomodate but its getting really hard to do that all the time and as you say, i'm not in it for olympic qualification...
> i do like the sound of 5/3/1 but am happy to leave it for a couple of months yet and stick with the SL5x5 for a little while longer albeit becomming 3x5...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Stu,

When 3x5 gets too much, which it will eventually, then would be the time to look at something like AFP, which is really an advanced beginner program. Only two compound exercises per session, so the workout time drops back down again.


----------



## Bod42

I think SS is superior to SL BUT I would always suggest beginners start on SL as the 5 sets give you more time under the bar and therefore more practice and SL eventually drops to 3x5 and then 1x5. You will see that Doug had amazing sucess on 1x5.

Must say I have lowered my rest periods as i want an aspect of fitness as well. I rest 3 mins for main Lower Body, 2.5mins for main Upper body. 1.5 mins for assistant exercise and 0-30 seconds rest for everything else.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Squeezed another leg recovery session in today 

*DEADLIFT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 70KGX5

SQUAT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 70KGX5

SQUAT 70KG - 10 - 10 - 10 -10 - 10*

All felt good & it was really nice to see my two X 25kg plates on the bar again :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: 5 of 12
Free Squats: 107.5 x 6 sets x 6 reps
Bench Press: 77.5x3, 87.5x3, 100x8 
Chin Ups.

Squats seem to feel better everytime I do them. My knees and ankles arent used to them yet but getting there. I am getting a hugh pump in the lower back and getting DOMS in my upper back so its definitely hitting different muscles than Im used to.

Easy 8 reps on Bench Press. Pretty pleased with 100kg for 8 reps especially after squats as this definitely effects your next exercises.

Tried wider grip Neutral grip chin ups and man these feel good and hit your lats a lot more. Didnt used to be able to do even one rep but found a few quite easy tonight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Nice!*

Mondays 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 92KGX5 104KGX3 116KGX1

BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-7

BARBELL ROW 65KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Nice workout, Barbell row felt safe so next week im back on 70Kg woohoooo!!! :thumb:

All I need to do now is get my deadlift & Squat sorted :thumb: hopefully it will be an early christmas present to myself


----------



## sfstu

only a quick post chaps...
pressups last night...

17 with good form and 67kg 1rm...

(it was my abs that made me stop rather than my chest or arms..? obviously needs addressing...)

rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

james and doug...nice numbers, both getting there...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> james and doug...nice numbers, both getting there...:thumb:


Cheers Stu :thumb:

28Kg to go on my bench woohooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> only a quick post chaps...
> pressups last night...
> 
> 17 with good form and 67kg 1rm...
> 
> (it was my abs that made me stop rather than my chest or arms..? obviously needs addressing...)
> 
> rgds stu


What % of your weight did you use to calculate the 1RM.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Mondays 5/3/1
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 92KGX5 104KGX3 116KGX1
> 
> BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-7
> 
> BARBELL ROW 65KG-10-10-10-10-10*
> 
> Nice workout, Barbell row felt safe so next week im back on 70Kg woohoooo!!! :thumb:
> 
> All I need to do now is get my deadlift & Squat sorted :thumb: hopefully it will be an early christmas present to myself


Doug are you just doing the prescribed reps or are you pushing the last set for as many as you can.


----------



## Guest

Tonight's session.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 137.5kg

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 52.5kg

Top squat sets were pretty tough again. Felt close to failing at a couple of point. Subsequent sets got easier.

Left tricep is still giving me some issues. Made top sets of OHP harder than it should have been. Didn't manage to get last rep on 2nd top set.
Found out how I tweaked my left wrist, because I did it again tonight. I'm supporting the bar in my hands (that are bent backwards), rather than properly against the front of my shoulders, when racking it after an OHP set. This caused a slight pull of a muscle in my left wrist. Didn't even realise I was doing this - must be a bad habit I picked up and managed to get away with for some time.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> What % of your weight did you use to calculate the 1RM.


Did max weight so far on bench 57.5 x 5 (reps) x 0.0323 + 57.5...?


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> Did max weight so far on bench 57.5 x 5 (reps) x 0.0323 x 57.5...?


My fault I misunderstood, I thought you were saying that 17 Press Ups equals 67kg 1RM but your comparing the 2.

I dont think there will be a strong correlation between total press ups and 1RM Bench as after say 20 reps its more endurance than strength. But you would think the stronger the individuals 1RM the more he would be able to rep a certain weight as its a lower %.

Its also what you train for as I have read about crossfit people challenging Powerlifters at a certain weight for reps and won. One springs to mind where they did Bicep curls with 75kg to start and the power lifter won hands down but then they halved the weight and only rested 30 seconds between sets and the crossfitter won by set 3. Its conditioning your body to the target you want. It just gets more differcult when you want multiple fitness goals.


----------



## Christianmp

Had a great workout yesterday. 
Wasn't really feeling like going to the gym, but kicked myself in the butt and got it done.

https://www.fitocracy.com/entry/12180134/

The squats are slowly but steadily increasing again. For the fun of it I did pauses on the last rep of each set, staying in the hole for a couple of seconds.

OHP was feeling light-weight this time around.

On another note, I signed up (or took my (injured)mate's place) for a mini-triathlon this weekend. 400m swim, 32km bike ride, 7.2km run.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug are you just doing the prescribed reps or are you pushing the last set for as many as you can.


James, I'm following the prescribed reps mate. I'm keeping the intensity for the assistance work. I think i could of done about 3 reps on 116kg, the last heavy bench session I did before going over to the 5/3/1 was 115kg for 5 so that sounds about right.

I've been playing with weights for many years & have never improved any better with high intensity work; I've done negative reps, forced reps, plate stripping/pyramid etc... A lot of this "High Intensity" stuff was big in the 80's. My honest opinion is its fad training & only useful for the roid puffy boys who compete in bodybuilding.

If i want size an 8 or 10 rep routine, if i want power anything between 1-5 reps :thumb:

I think far too much emphasis is put on making training complex, when in truth a simple routine based on mainly compound exercises coupled with a simple progressive overload with the weight is all anyone needs. The reason I say mainly is because i 100% agree with wendler. Symmetry IS important, that's why i train my triceps, biceps & calves :thumb: Far too many powerlifters have small calves, it looks bloody daft, not me, I've trained them all my life, I GOT COWS, NOT CALVES! :thumb:


----------



## Guest

I think I've finally settled on some good LG macros for myself. The diet is going well but the big compounds (squat and dead) are tough on a deficit.

My Lean Body Mass is about 72kg, which gives me a BMR of about 1925kcals (using Katch-McArdle formula).
I decided that since I'm a desk worker, my actiity level is pretty much "sedentary", so I used an activity multiplier of 1.2 to give me a TDEE estimate of 2310kcal.

Currently, on LeanGains, I'm using a -40%/-10% split for calories on rest/workout days. The reason I'm below TDEE on workout days is because I have enough excess fat to use as fuel. I'll consider revising this split as my BF drops.

I've now settled on a daily protein intake of 2.5xLBM = 180g. The remaining calories get partitioned into carbs/fat at 25%/75% on rest days and 75%/25% on workout days.

So, to summarise with rounded values:

Rest Days
1400kcal, P180g, C42g, F56g

Workout days
2100kcal, P180g, C256g, F38g

Since the beginning of August I've lost 7kg/15.4lbs. I've dropped from 99kg/218lbs/15st8lbs to 92kg/202lbs/14st6lbs (all based on my new scales, as my old scales put me at being 4kg lighter).
I reckon I've got another 12kg to go before I hit my target of 10% BF. Then I'll move onto a "slow bulk" which should let me put on muscle (strength) but maintain leanness.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> I think I've finally settled on some good LG macros for myself. The diet is going well but the big compounds (squat and dead) are tough on a deficit.
> 
> My Lean Body Mass is about 72kg, which gives me a BMR of about 1925kcals (using Katch-McArdle formula).
> I decided that since I'm a desk worker, my actiity level is pretty much "sedentary", so I used an activity multiplier of 1.2 to give me a TDEE estimate of 2310kcal.
> 
> Currently, on LeanGains, I'm using a -40%/-10% split for calories on rest/workout days. The reason I'm below TDEE on workout days is because I have enough excess fat to use as fuel. I'll consider revising this split as my BF drops.
> 
> I've now settled on a daily protein intake of 2.5xLBM = 180g. The remaining calories get partitioned into carbs/fat at 25%/75% on rest days and 75%/25% on workout days.
> 
> So, to summarise with rounded values:
> 
> Rest Days
> 1400kcal, P180g, C42g, F56g
> 
> Workout days
> 2100kcal, P180g, C256g, F38g
> 
> Since the beginning of August I've lost 7kg/15.4lbs. I've dropped from 99kg/218lbs/15st8lbs to 92kg/202lbs/14st6lbs (all based on my new scales, as my old scales put me at being 4kg lighter).
> I reckon I've got another 12kg to go before I hit my target of 10% BF. Then I'll move onto a "slow bulk" which should let me put on muscle (strength) but maintain leanness.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


10% BF!!! :doublesho:doublesho

Phil you animal :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Today's recovery session, aiming to do 3 sessions this week :thumb: 

*SQUAT 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% 75KG X 5

DEADLIFT 75KG X 5

DEADLIFT 75KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Only 25Kg to go & my 10 rep assistance work for the Squat & Deadlift will be back to 100kg, yippeee!!! I'll then concentrate on my recovery work sets :thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 3 Week 2* - same weight as cycle 2
*
Shoulder Press x 4* (vs 6 cycle 2)

Really tired after a long day travelling, was going to delay by a day but decided to do it anyway. Started at 9pm and had no energy. I think on days like this I should skip the pull-ups between every set including warm ups. Doing 20-30 pull-ups before my main lift left little in the tank.

*Deadlift x 10* (vs 9 cycle 2)

Made up for shoulder press. Bit slow but 10 x 118.5kg seems useful and it's still my favourite lift by far (strange given my back history!).

My knee's been feeling bit weird for last couple of weeks. I thought it'd wear off but during second assistance set of squats something snapped  Couldn't do unweighted squats or any unweighted lunges. Iced it over next few days and went out on bike for an hour to see if it'd help.

*Bench x5* (vs 6)

Dunno! Was videoing it to look at wrists over elbows and whilst my upper body was pressed into the bench my hips and legs were wriggling all over the place. Probably due to my knee.

*Squat 2 sets of 5 reps* (vs 8)
Decided to see how things went but had a plan B schedule for next couple of weeks incase it wasn't good as my knee was really stiff. Put knee sleeve on, warmed up for ages and did 5 reps. Decided to try for another 5 and that was OK. Called it quits there as I think I was tempting fate. Felt worringly heavy though at only 95kg. The one lift that under 5\3\1 I'm sure is going backwards.

Cardio - one set of hill sprints then reverted to the bike for other days.


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> pressups last night...
> 
> 17 with good form and 67kg 1rm...
> 
> rgds stu


Doing mine tonight :thumb:



BareFacedGeek said:


> I've dropped from 99kg/218lbs/15st8lbs to 92kg/202lbs/14st6lbs (all based on my new scales, as my old scales put me at being 4kg lighter).


My memory of your posts around Xmas or Easter was that we used to lift roughly the same numbers, you did 10 pull ups during the warmup, and weighed 76kg

I remember that because I was thinking it was strange how you did so many more chinups than me but lifted the same weights. I thought it was linked to body weight. Is my memory completley wrong or have you put 25kg on in the last six months :doublesho



Christianmp said:


> On another note, I signed up (or took my (injured)mate's place) for a mini-triathlon this weekend. 400m swim, 32km bike ride, 7.2km run.


Reminds me of my mate some years ago. He's an infrantry officer in the army. His mate dropped out last minute from the London Marathon. He took his place but only got round to one run of 10 miles as practice. He then stayed at a friends house the night before and went to a party until 3am. Woke up at 5am and ran the marathon. When I asked how it went his main issue was that he was queing for the cute physio's table in the tents at the end and just as he got there they swapped over and he got a fat biffer. It takes a certain type of person to be a career infantryman


----------



## Guest

Oats said:


> My memory of your posts around Xmas or Easter was that we used to lift roughly the same numbers, you did 10 pull ups during the warmup, and weighed 76kg
> 
> I remember that because I was thinking it was strange how you did so many more chinups than me but lifted the same weights. I thought it was linked to body weight. Is my memory completley wrong or have you put 25kg on in the last six months :doublesho


Oooh - not me  I can't remember when I last weighed 76kg - my late teens I think (or about 25+ years ago :lol. 
I'd have been a lardy-ass 95kg around xmas/easter time (actually nigh on 100kg, but my scales liked to flatter me).
10 pullups! I dream of 10 pullups


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> Doing mine tonight :thumb:


good, thought i was the only one...!:doublesho


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, I'm following the prescribed reps mate. I'm keeping the intensity for the assistance work. I think i could of done about 3 reps on 116kg, the last heavy bench session I did before going over to the 5/3/1 was 115kg for 5 so that sounds about right.
> 
> I've been playing with weights for many years & have never improved any better with high intensity work; I've done negative reps, forced reps, plate stripping/pyramid etc... A lot of this "High Intensity" stuff was big in the 80's. My honest opinion is its fad training & only useful for the roid puffy boys who compete in bodybuilding.
> 
> If i want size an 8 or 10 rep routine, if i want power anything between 1-5 reps :thumb:
> 
> I think far too much emphasis is put on making training complex, when in truth a simple routine based on mainly compound exercises coupled with a simple progressive overload with the weight is all anyone needs. The reason I say mainly is because i 100% agree with wendler. Symmetry IS important, that's why i train my triceps, biceps & calves :thumb: Far too many powerlifters have small calves, it looks bloody daft, not me, I've trained them all my life, I GOT COWS, NOT CALVES! :thumb:


I believe in keeping it simple as well Doug, I have been considering just doing the prescribed reps as the goal is written in stone. Sometimes I feel that Do as Many Reps as Possible is to open ended and gives you the opportunity to pussy out but then I suppose at the other end of the spectrum if you feel great one day you can push the reps higher than you usually would.

The prescribed reps does appeal to me as a few times on the Juggernaut program I found it hard to push past the minimum reps.

Anyway if you look at the 5/3/1 program, the reps you do Month 1 should be the reps you try and stay at to improve consistantly. Think I may increase my weights but do the prescribed reps.



ITHAQVA said:


> Today's recovery session, aiming to do 3 sessions this week :thumb:
> 
> *SQUAT 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% 75KG X 5
> 
> DEADLIFT 75KG X 5
> 
> DEADLIFT 75KG-10-10-10-10-10*
> 
> Only 25Kg to go & my 10 rep assistance work for the Squat & Deadlift will be back to 100kg, yippeee!!! I'll then concentrate on my recovery work sets :thumb:


Doug your doing 100kg for 5 x 10 Holy  :doublesho. Nice work


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> good, thought i was the only one...!:doublesho


No way bro. One in:all in.

I really surprised myself. Thought I'd get a dozen, but actually got....

... thirty-one :doublesho :devil:

Bench e1rm of 80.5kg

I did cheat though. I ain't got an Arnie poster yet so I put the laptop on the floor and then played this COME ON!! Gotta give anyone an extra 20 reps over what they could do normally


----------



## Oats

BareFacedGeek said:


> Oooh - not me  I can't remember when I last weighed 76kg - my late teens I think (or about 25+ years ago :lol.
> I'd have been a lardy-ass 95kg around xmas/easter time (actually nigh on 100kg, but my scales liked to flatter me).
> 10 pullups! I dream of 10 pullups


What?!!!  Let's hunt down whoever it was that could do 10 and run 'em over :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I believe in keeping it simple as well Doug, I have been considering just doing the prescribed reps as the goal is written in stone. Sometimes I feel that Do as Many Reps as Possible is to open ended and gives you the opportunity to pussy out but then I suppose at the other end of the spectrum if you feel great one day you can push the reps higher than you usually would.
> 
> The prescribed reps does appeal to me as a few times on the Juggernaut program I found it hard to push past the minimum reps.
> 
> Anyway if you look at the 5/3/1 program, the reps you do Month 1 should be the reps you try and stay at to improve consistantly. Think I may increase my weights but do the prescribed reps.
> 
> Doug your doing 100kg for 5 x 10 Holy  :doublesho. Nice work


The prescribed reps in the 5/3/1 have enough variation to keep it interesting yet simple to follow. As things get heavy it is nice to only have to do one rep on the 3rd week 95% set. Gives you loads of confidence as the rep expectation is low, that 116kg bench was a prime example. Yet there is still a natural progression/increase in load. Its very like what i was already doing - rep de loading :thumb:

5 X 10 reps with 100kg on the squat & deadlift is what i was doing before the injury, when I got my squat over the 150 mark the 10 rep 100kg sets felt light 

As long as my Hamstring holds up I plan to be back on 100kg for 5 sets of 10 by Tuesday 25th September at the latest :thumb:

Another reason I'm sticking to the prescribed reps is I want to save some energy for the assistance work; I'm not competing so for me the assistance work is part of my workout.
I consider my workouts as a session of two parts, first part strength, second part: fitness, fat loss, symmetry.

The third part, cardio, will be added once im 100% fit:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> What?!!!  Let's hunt down whoever it was that could do 10 and run 'em over :lol:


I'll second that :wave: :driver:


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I did cheat though. I ain't got an Arnie poster yet so I put the laptop on the floor and then played this COME ON!! Gotta give anyone an extra 20 reps over what they could do normally


If using Rocky aint cheating, then i dont know what is...! i was listening to Boney M's brown girl in the ring...
:doublesho :lol:
seriously tho, thats a goodly amount...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> What?!!!  Let's hunt down whoever it was that could do 10 and run 'em over :lol:


I have a faint memory of someone doing sets of 10 chin ups as well. 












impster said:


> Ok - tonight's workout.
> 
> Squats: steady on 88.2kgs
> Bench: tough - 6 sets of 3 at 61.2kgs.
> Rows: ok at 68.2kgs.
> 15 chin ups, 15 press ups, 15 more chins and 15 more press ups to finish.
> 
> Am going to stick at these weights for a couple of weeks, but am changing my timings by only allowing myself 90secs between each set.
> 
> My bench is ok at the top, but not good at the bottom of the lift. Any tips. Once I'm over half way up I can manage ok, but an 'explosive' start simply ain't happening. I've checked my form, and it seems ok.
> 
> How can I strengthen the bottom of my bench press guys?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Impster.


I found this old post and believe this is the one I was thinking of. 15 chin ups is impressive.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout.
Squats: 115kg x 7 sets x 5 reps
Back Machine and RC Work to finish.

Im not lifting heavy yet as Im doing higher density of training but must say I am loving Free Squats. I have massive respect for box squats and think they are a awesome exercise but have a feeling I should have got off the box earlier. Free squats hit an entirely different aray of muscles. For me mostly they seem to be hitting my vastus medialis the my upper back the most

Squats went ok. Im away on business at the moment so choose some big commercial gym and it reminded me never ever ever to go back to a commercial gym. And this was probably the best commercial gym I had ever been in regarding Squatting and proper exercises. They had 1 power rack, 2 squat racks and one of those weird smiths machines that can move backwards and forward. Erm just free squat. The bar was thinner and shorter so I just threw 5 extra kg on the bar. The biggest problem was that you have to wear shoes and I normally train barefoot so I had to borrow trainers, i know nasty. They were the usual spongy crap trainers which really effected my form but at least I got a workout in.

Some of the things do make me laugh though. The guy rowing 100kg with straps but standing about 85 degrees upright and moving the bar 4", thats not a row thats a shrug. The early twenties guy who struggled to do 1 fly rep with 10kg, flies are are shaping exercise, if you have zero muscle to shape why the hell are you doing them, get in the god dam squat rack. The guy who was there when I got there and was still there when I left who only trained arms the entire time. Every squat rack was free which is great for me but does make me laugh.

I will admit there is one awesome aspect to a commercial gym, THE HUNNIES, MY GOD THE HUNNIES.


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> If using Rocky aint cheating, then i dont know what is...!


I agree, but I think it was an inspried decision!! I looked at Rocky 4 montage first bit found Dolph Ludgrens power clean form too offensive   Can't get the fanfare out of my head now. Luckily I've shared the tune with the whole office so I'm not alone 



Bod42 said:


> I have a faint memory of someone doing sets of 10 chin ups as well.


Ahhh may well have been; impster probably got confused with geek in my head.



Bod42 said:


> The guy who was there when I got there and was still there when I left who only trained arms the entire time.


Two possible answers:
i) JohnnyMerc has fled the country in order to get some bi's and tri's time in 

ii) He wasn't there just for the weights:


Bod42 said:


> THE HUNNIES, MY GOD THE HUNNIES.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

HAHAHAHA!

No I am here! And no bi's and tri's. Training is going very well, getting stronger each session.

I do 3x5 15KG chins. Will be going up to 20KG tonight


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session number, i can't remember  

*DEADLIFT - 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% - 80KG X 5

SQUAT - 80KG X 5

SQUAT 80KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Woohooo!!! 20kg to goooooooooo for the Squat & Deadlift assistance work & then it can stay at 100kg so i can concentrate on my ultimate strength goals :thumb:

I Will try to get two more recovery sessions in this week & back to twice a week next week, bringing me up to my 100Kg assistance work set limit, cant bloody wait :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I will admit there is one awesome aspect to a commercial gym, THE HUNNIES, MY GOD THE HUNNIES.


Gym Pussy!!!!!!!!!!!! :argie::argie::argie:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Just don't get caught perving! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I definitely got caught today, looked at a girl squatting (sadly only half squatting) but couldn't quite see in enough detail so put my glasses on and looked again.

I think the hunnies make you lift more as no one wants to fail in front of a hotty. Brings back good memories of what I used to get up to in my old gym with the ladies.

Just reading some news today and this made me laugh. Not only does he look like a royal Tw*t he's also a lier. Those arms are made from injecting Synthol directly into the muscle, not from genetics or hard work. His forearms have zero muscle mass or definition so I doubt he trains and/or eats like that.


----------



## Bod42

I have decided to start 5/3/1 Monday on a 3 day per week split. This way it gives me 3 cycles and the 3rd deload week will be the 24th December 2012. 

I know you shouldn't mess with Wendler's suggestions but I have kind of combined a few of his program suggestion to basically get everything I want from one program.

Program is:
Bench Press: 5/3/1
Pendlay Rows: 5x10 Triumvirate
Dips: 5x10-20

Squats: 5/3/1
Deadlifts: 5x10 BBB opposite
Abs

Shoulder Press: 5/3/1
Dips: 5/3/1 Great success with this during Juggernaut
Chin Ups: 10 sets Various Grips.

Deadlifts: 5/3/1
Squats: 5x10 BBB Opposite
Abs

This way I have volume for all my exercises and I hit each Body Part twice per week which is a lot better for someone at my strength level.

I'm not going to fully diet now but I am adding more volume and adding hill sprints twice per week. This way I should work slowly towards my overall goals and with the 5/3/1 program I can stay on it for the long run and just make minor changes if and when needed.

My only decision I now have to make is what kind of rep range to aim for. I thought of going slightly higher reps with upper body e.g 12/10/8 as this seems to keep my shoulder healthier and then I make decent strength gains. Or stick to the standard 90% and aim for slightly less reps. I want to go low reps for strength as my assistant exercises will cover the volume but as I said my shoulder doesnt cope well with heavy weights for prolonged periods. Decisions decisions.


----------



## Guest

Last night's session.

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected] + [email protected]
e1RM: 77.5kg

*Assisted Chins*
WU: None
WO: 12/9/8/8/[email protected] (BW-30kg)

Bench went well. I won't pretend it was easy, but I think I have finally sussed out how to bench a little better. It's always hit my triceps hard (hmmm - could this be the reason for my tricep injury atm?).
I've started to try and concentrate on contracting my pecs to pull my arms up rather than pushing with my hands. Ironically, having an aching tricep helped to let me know when I was getting it right, to the point that I could not feel any pain in my tricep at all.

Back to using assisted chins and higher volume to help get me back to BW chins. I'll probably do some negatives later on in the week.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Oats

jonnyMercUK said:


> Just don't get caught perving! :thumb:


I know this ain't PC but I really don't see what the problem is. Folks go to a gym to feel and look good so take it as a compliment.



Bod42 said:


> I have decided to start 5/3/1 Monday on a 3 day per week split. This way it gives me 3 cycles and the 3rd deload week will be the 24th December 2012.
> 
> This way I have volume for all my exercises and I hit each Body Part twice per week which is a lot better for someone at my strength level.
> 
> My only decision I now have to make is what kind of rep range to aim for. I thought of going slightly higher reps with upper body e.g 12/10/8 as this seems to keep my shoulder healthier and then I make decent strength gains. Or stick to the standard 90% and aim for slightly less reps. I want to go low reps for strength as my assistant exercises will cover the volume but as I said my shoulder doesnt cope well with heavy weights for prolonged periods. Decisions decisions.


Couple of random thoughts that I've been mulling over in relation to my routine that may give food for thought when setting yours up:

The template puts press and deadlift deload on the same day so the deload week is acutally 7 days instead of 9 (I've been doing 9 days because I missed that. NOt sure I'll change as I like to really push the sprints on recovery week).

On JWs Q&A someone asked if doing heavy singles after the main lift was OK and he said it was fine. Not sure where I'd do this but it's there for the using.

I think assistance work as the opposite on the 9 day cycle helps stop the lift feeling stale. I also think it means you can lift more on the assistance sets as you're not pre-fatigued. Again not sure if this is a good or bad thing in terms of the objective of strength. I would ahve though that 5x10 would be enough in itself to build muscle without the 3x5 of the same exercise previously.

I've just started putting leg raises before deadlift assistance as my grip was a limiting factor. Works much better for me and I can now do both without grip being the weak link.

Hill Sprints - when I ran hill sprints for running they were a timed exercise and you jogged to the bottom. I've had a read about them and there does seem to be a difference in doing them in this sort or routine, where the advice is to be more recovered between sprints and utterly shagged at the top! Soemthing to do with it being a muscluar rather than vascular version. I also used hill gradient to build them up. I'm fine on a couple of hills but a steeper one in the park gives me calf DOMS, and probably would have killed me when I started them. I've got my eye on an absolute fu*"er of a hill for Christmas :devil: I guess it's like increasing the incline on a treadmil over time.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session - 10 

*SQUAT- 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% 86KG X 5

DEADLIFT- 85KG X 5 
DEADLIFT- 85KG-10-10-10-10-10 :devil:*

Still up for one more session this week bringing it up to 90Kg, leaving two sessions needed for next week to reach the 100Kg assistance sets, as long as the old hamstring keeps recovering :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I have decided to start 5/3/1 Monday on a 3 day per week split. This way it gives me 3 cycles and the 3rd deload week will be the 24th December 2012.
> 
> I know you shouldn't mess with Wendler's suggestions but I have kind of combined a few of his program suggestion to basically get everything I want from one program.
> 
> Program is:
> Bench Press: 5/3/1
> Pendlay Rows: 5x10 Triumvirate
> Dips: 5x10-20
> 
> Squats: 5/3/1
> Deadlifts: 5x10 BBB opposite
> Abs
> 
> Shoulder Press: 5/3/1
> Dips: 5/3/1 Great success with this during Juggernaut
> Chin Ups: 10 sets Various Grips.
> 
> Deadlifts: 5/3/1
> Squats: 5x10 BBB Opposite
> Abs
> 
> This way I have volume for all my exercises and I hit each Body Part twice per week which is a lot better for someone at my strength level.
> 
> I'm not going to fully diet now but I am adding more volume and adding hill sprints twice per week. This way I should work slowly towards my overall goals and with the 5/3/1 program I can stay on it for the long run and just make minor changes if and when needed.
> 
> My only decision I now have to make is what kind of rep range to aim for. I thought of going slightly higher reps with upper body e.g 12/10/8 as this seems to keep my shoulder healthier and then I make decent strength gains. Or stick to the standard 90% and aim for slightly less reps. I want to go low reps for strength as my assistant exercises will cover the volume but as I said my shoulder doesnt cope well with heavy weights for prolonged periods. Decisions decisions.


There is a bodybuilding version of the 5/3/1 online James :thumb:

I've been training heavy for around 11 months now & my joints do feel it, even top powerlifters vary their workouts to give their bodies a chance to recover :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> I know this ain't PC but I really don't see what the problem is. Folks go to a gym to feel and look good so take it as a compliment.


I like Qats thought process, why shouldnt we perv :lol:



Oats said:


> The template puts press and deadlift deload on the same day so the deload week is acutally 7 days instead of 9.
> 
> *I have been working on the 7 day deload but Im sure either is fine especially if your using your deload week to push your hill sprints.*
> 
> On JWs Q&A someone asked if doing heavy singles after the main lift was OK and he said it was fine. Not sure where I'd do this but it's there for the using.
> 
> *This is basically the 5/3/1 Power Lifting Edition plus he suggests doing 3/5/1 if your going to do singles.*
> 
> I think assistance work as the opposite on the 9 day cycle helps stop the lift feeling stale. I also think it means you can lift more on the assistance sets as you're not pre-fatigued. Again not sure if this is a good or bad thing in terms of the objective of strength. I would ahve though that 5x10 would be enough in itself to build muscle without the 3x5 of the same exercise previously.
> 
> *On Juggernaut the exercises definitely felt weird after 9 days so I'm hoping, as you say, it will keep the exercise from feeling stale. Also Wendler suggests this in a number of Q&As and also his 3 month challenge is set out this way.*
> 
> Hill Sprints - when I ran hill sprints for running they were a timed exercise and you jogged to the bottom. I've had a read about them and there does seem to be a difference in doing them in this sort or routine, where the advice is to be more recovered between sprints and utterly shagged at the top! Soemthing to do with it being a muscluar rather than vascular version. I also used hill gradient to build them up. I'm fine on a couple of hills but a steeper one in the park gives me calf DOMS, and probably would have killed me when I started them. I've got my eye on an absolute fu*"er of a hill for Christmas :devil: I guess it's like increasing the incline on a treadmil over time.


You should rest enough in hill sprints so you can put maximum effort into the sprint. From memory Wendler suggests a walk back to the start and 1 min rest at the bottom on short hills and forever on long hills.

Cheers for your thoughts Qats, most appreciated.



ITHAQVA said:


> There is a bodybuilding version of the 5/3/1 online James :thumb:
> 
> I've been training heavy for around 11 months now & my joints do feel it, even top powerlifters vary their workouts to give their bodies a chance to recover :thumb:


:doublesho Mentioning a bodybuilding routine in here, you got a death wish :thumb:

Everyone is closet bodybuilder really but I'm not moving to bodybuilding routine but as I will be kind of dieting I am adding more volume just to try and preserve as much muscle as possible. I have seen the bodybuilding Template in 5/3/1 PL and he adds a drop set to the 5/3/1 sets and adds more volume. Strange thing about the templates in his PL book is that he suggests a lot more exercises per workout than the normal 5/3/1, wonder why this is?

If your joints are feeling it you could change to something with a slightly higher rep range, I found this really helped my shoulder. The juggernaut Program is pretty much a higher rep 5/3/1 program as your doing 10/8/5/3


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> :doublesho Mentioning a bodybuilding routine in here, you got a death wish :thumb:
> :lol::lol::lol::lol:
> *Everyone is closet bodybuilder *really but I'm not moving to bodybuilding routine but as I will be kind of dieting I am adding more volume just to try and preserve as much muscle as possible. I have seen the bodybuilding Template in 5/3/1 PL and he adds a drop set to the 5/3/1 sets and adds more volume. Strange thing about the templates in his PL book is that he suggests a lot more exercises per workout than the normal 5/3/1, wonder why this is?
> 
> If your joints are feeling it you could change to something with a slightly higher rep range, I found this really helped my shoulder. The juggernaut Program is pretty much a higher rep 5/3/1 program as your doing 10/8/5/3


:lol::lol:

Straight out of wendlers 5/3/1 :thumb:

Joints are ok, i put up with them being a little stiff in the mornings, its not that bad TBH & considering my age i still think i get off very lightly  

Not really interested in a higher rep routine as my primary workout, i've always loved heavy low rep routines, i do like to finish off with higher rep sessions though, the 5/3/1 is just perfect for me :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :lol::lol:
> 
> Straight out of wendlers 5/3/1 :thumb:
> 
> Joints are ok, i put up with them being a little stiff in the mornings, its not that bad TBH & considering my age i still think i get off very lightly
> 
> *Not really interested in a higher rep routine as my primary workout, i've always loved heavy low rep routines*, i do like to finish off with higher rep sessions though, the 5/3/1 is just perfect for me :thumb:


Thats what I like to hear :devil:

But the juggernaut creator does RAW squat like 900lb so the higher reps cant be all bad and 5/3/1 is higher reps when you begin.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thats what I like to hear :devil:
> 
> But the juggernaut creator does RAW squat like 900lb so the higher reps cant be all bad and 5/3/1 is higher reps when you begin.


Anything over 5 reps for power & I feel I kinda cheeeeted myself!!!! :thumb::devil:

Shoulders/OHP today &................. Bi's & Tri's!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho:doublesho  grrrr check out ma gunzzzz!!! :lol::lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Cool!*

Fridays 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 42KGX5 48KGX3 54KGX1

OVERHEAD PRESS 35KG-10-10-10-10-10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT-5-5-5-5-5

BARBELL CURL 35KGX-10-10-10-10-10
*

Everything felt too light today.WTF????? 

Started dips today, felt gooooooooooooood!! :devil:
Will aim to add one rep per set per week until i manage 5 sets of 10 reps, then microload with 1kg, aim for 5 sets of 10 again & so on :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

ITHAQVA said:


> Everything felt too light today.WTF?????


Guess that's not including the bodyweight dips!! :lol:


----------



## sfstu

well, have ended up having an unplanned break this week due to working 13 hour days and averaging 5.5-6 hour sleep most nights... couldn't be helped but not happy about it as tried to do my workout today (finished work early) but felt like i'd had a month off rather than a week...!:doublesho

tried squats at weight i should be on but just couldn't get down parallel...knees didn't feel good and just couldn't keep body in position either...
OHP went ok which surprised me as have struggled recently with this but did only 3x5 (as recently discussed) so that helped...
deadlift, didn't even attempt 110kg which is what i should've been doing as back didn't feel right and neither did legs so ended up going lighter at 90kgs and settled for that...

with hindsight, i should've gone lighter on all of it maybe to get back into things, a week off sitting on your backside (hgv1 driver) you would think would make you feel rested and raring to go but it was the opposite, felt drained and out of sorts with it all...feel like i've gone backwards by several weeks but gonna do sundays workout and try again and hopefully that'll have me back on track...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> Guess that's not including the bodyweight dips!! :lol:


Yeah them too & I was surprised, but I only weight 108Kg :thumb: Only went for 5 sets of 5 reps to start with, just to get a feel for them again, next week I'll aim for 5 sets of 6 reps  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> well, have ended up having an unplanned break this week due to working 13 hour days and averaging 5.5-6 hour sleep most nights... couldn't be helped but not happy about it as tried to do my workout today (finished work early) but felt like i'd had a month off rather than a week...!:doublesho
> 
> tried squats at weight i should be on but just couldn't get down parallel...knees didn't feel good and just couldn't keep body in position either...
> OHP went ok which surprised me as have struggled recently with this but did only 3x5 (as recently discussed) so that helped...
> deadlift, didn't even attempt 110kg which is what i should've been doing as back didn't feel right and neither did legs so ended up going lighter at 90kgs and settled for that...
> 
> with hindsight, i should've gone lighter on all of it maybe to get back into things, a week off sitting on your backside (hgv1 driver) you would think would make you feel rested and raring to go but it was the opposite, felt drained and out of sorts with it all...feel like i've gone backwards by several weeks but gonna do sundays workout and try again and hopefully that'll have me back on track...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Below par workouts happen Stu, dont worry, you can hate the weights next time mate :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

yeah i know doug, just p***ed off with work interfering with my workouts, was making good progress last week but right this second i feel like i've gone backwards a month.... 

i know i haven't but it feels that way...


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> ... but I only weight 108Kg


"only"?!! That's "only" 25kg more than me. I feel such a scrawny b**ch :lol: Am I the lightest on here? I wear XL tshirts FFS!



sfstu said:


> yeah i know doug, just p***ed off with work interfering with my workouts, was making good progress last week but right this second i feel like i've gone backwards a month....
> 
> i know i haven't but it feels that way...


There's no doubting it's a ***** when that happens. The more you put into something the more you've got to lose. God knows what elite athletes feel when they're injured constantly (e.g. Johnny Wilkinson). On the plus side Stu, look how far you've come. Would you have been jacked off three months ago about lost opportunities in pushing yourself physically?


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> There's no doubting it's a ***** when that happens. The more you put into something the more you've got to lose. God knows what elite athletes feel when they're injured constantly (e.g. Johnny Wilkinson). On the plus side Stu, look how far you've come. Would you have been jacked off three months ago about lost opportunities in pushing yourself physically?


no i wouldn't of...:thumb: and yep, can imagine how athletes feel when injured, not gay footballers tho with all their money,cars,wags etc... or how doug felt recently with hamstring injury knocking him back for a while...

just surprised at how down/p***ed off i feel tho after a rubbish workout...i mean i know they happen,good days/bad days,not always gonna be able to make gains etc but really puts me in a bad mood especially when its down to work interfering with personal life...
still, i also know it'll only take me a session or 2 to get up to speed and i'll be back on the path again...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> "only"?!! That's "only" 25kg more than me. I feel such a scrawny b**ch :lol: Am I the lightest on here? I wear XL tshirts FFS!
> 
> There's no doubting it's a ***** when that happens. The more you put into something the more you've got to lose. God knows what elite athletes feel when they're injured constantly (e.g. Johnny Wilkinson). On the plus side Stu, look how far you've come. Would you have been jacked off three months ago about lost opportunities in pushing yourself physically?


 Blame the powerlifting, im on XXL loose cut tops now 

Exactly Oats :thumb: I've had two injuries, one when i did a massive barbell shrug while doing a deadlift (took me out for 2-3 weeks) then this stuuupid hamstring (took me out for a whole month) And even now im going to take a few months before im back to were I was.

Stu, Keep at it mate :thumb:

*Why do we fall Stu??*


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> no i wouldn't of...:thumb: and yep, can imagine how athletes feel when injured, not gay footballers tho with all their money,cars,wags etc... or how doug felt recently with hamstring injury knocking him back for a while...
> 
> *just surprised at how down/p***ed off i feel tho after a rubbish workout...i mean i know they happen,good days/bad days,not always gonna be able to make gains etc but really puts me in a bad mood especially when its down to work interfering with personal life...*still, i also know it'll only take me a session or 2 to get up to speed and i'll be back on the path again...:thumb:
> rgds stu


You sound just like me Stu, :devil:keep that fire in your heart burning mate :devil:, that is what will make you overcome & succeed :thumb:

Powerlifting is a very important part of my life, it makes me feal alive in a world full of the dead! :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA;3703278
[B said:


> Why do we fall Stu??[/B]


"so we can learn to pick ourselves up"....


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> "so we can learn to pick ourselves up"....


Exactly mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session 11 :thumb:

*DEADLIFT - 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60% - 90KG X 5

SQUAT - 90KG X 5

SQUAT - 90KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Good session, hopefully my recovery will continue to progress & allow me to lift heavy soon 

Deload 5/3/1 cycle next week


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Ybut I only weight 108Kg :thumb:


Thats a good weight, I should know being similar to my weight :thumb:

Must say I am loving dips and they feel better the more weight I add. I got them in my program twice a week, 1 workout 5 sets of maximum sets just trying to improve on my total reps and thena strength workout where Im just trying to add weight.


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> "only"?!! That's "only" 25kg more than me. I feel such a scrawny b**ch :lol: Am I the lightest on here? I wear XL tshirts FFS!


I wouldnt worry to much about weight, people hold their weight differently. I was at a party last night and we got on to the subject of the gym as I havent seen some people in 9-10 weeks and they said I got bigger which is always nice for the ego and the ladies :thumb: Got asked to Personal Train a hotty at her house but she has a bloke so thought probably not the best idea but she was keen, after that she tried to get me round to detail her car :lol:. Did I mention her drift car :argie: Anyway one of my mates same height as me goes to the gym has a personal trainer every week, does actually squat but he's over 4 and a half stone lighter than me :doublesho. Yes he's smaller but theres no way I have 4 and a half stone of muscle more than him, its weird I must have heavy bones or something. :tumbleweed:



sfstu said:


> yeah i know doug, just p***ed off with work interfering with my workouts, was making good progress last week but right this second i feel like i've gone backwards a month....
> 
> i know i haven't but it feels that way...


Reacting like this to a bad workout is a good thing. When you dont get the results you want from life, you have 2 options, 1. give up, curl in to a ball and cry yourself to sleep at night (most of the population) Or 2. you can get mad, grab the bull by the horns and get what you want from life. If your mad now imagine how intense your next workout will be, channel and use that aggresion.



sfstu said:


> not gay footballers tho


Haha I love this so much. So glad to see there are other sane people in the world who think the same as me. :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Got asked to Personal Train a hotty at her house but she has a bloke so thought probably not the best idea but she was keen,
> 
> *WTF!!!!!! James, get in there, she wants a real man :thumb::thumb:*
> 
> Haha I love this so much. So glad to see there are other sane people in the world who think the same as me. :lol:


*Footballers = lawn fairies!*


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thats a good weight, I should know being similar to my weight :thumb:
> 
> Must say I am loving dips and they feel better the more weight I add. I got them in my program twice a week, 1 workout 5 sets of maximum sets just trying to improve on my total reps and thena strength workout where Im just trying to add weight.


Must admit they felt excellent mate & easier than I thought they would, I'm going to use them a lot from now on, like your idea of splitting between all out reps - bodyweight & then a strength workout - bodyweight plus added weight :devil: :thumb:

I'm thinking about doing chins & pull-ups twice a week on my off days :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Reacting like this to a bad workout is a good thing. When you dont get the results you want from life, you have 2 options, 1. give up, curl in to a ball and cry yourself to sleep at night (most of the population) Or 2. you can get mad, grab the bull by the horns and get what you want from life. If your mad now imagine how intense your next workout will be, channel and use that aggresion.


yep, got next workout today and can't wait...:devil: bench, squat and rows..:thumb:
my legs and backside are DOMS city yesterday but a little less so today, so after last workout gonna go 10-20% lighter then back on track for rest of week...:thumb:
got a couple more long days at work this week but not gonna let it interfere with workouts again, so doing workout today and then again on tuesday...don't wanna end up taking a week off like last week, leaving me feeling weak as a baby...
post workout later...


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> *Footballers = lawn fairies!*


 WTF!!!!!!James, getinthere, she wantsa realman. That's the problem we were talking about how we dont understand women dating footballers and then she kept telling me she wants a proper man. She has a boyfriend so to messy and I found in my younger years once a women has a real man they get massively over the top attac:lol:hed.

The boyfriend was at this party as well. He did tell her off and remind me a couple of times that was his girlfriends. Not my fault I'm such a charming drunk:lol:



ITHAQVA said:


> Must admit they felt excellent mate & easier than I thought they would, I'm going to use them a lot from now on, like your idea of splitting between all out reps - bodyweight & then a strength workout - bodyweight plus added weight :devil: :thumb:
> 
> I'm thinking about doing chins & pull-ups twice a week on my off days :thumb:


I found it worked really well in the juggernaut program. Something fixed my shoulder and 1 if the only changes was adding dips so who knows.

Off days are recovery days but nothing wrong with throwing them in between shoulder and bench press as wendler does himself. Don't have to be to failure but I try and hit high.volume so 10 sets


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> yep, got next workout today and can't wait...:devil: bench, squat and rows..:thumb:
> my legs and backside are DOMS city yesterday but a little less so today, so after last workout gonna go 10-20% lighter then back on track for rest of week...:thumb:
> got a couple more long days at work this week but not gonna let it interfere with workouts again, so doing workout today and then again on tuesday...don't wanna end up taking a week off like last week, leaving me feeling weak as a baby...
> post workout later...


Try to stick with the 5X5 Stu, I looked back & I was still on: deadlift/squat 140, bench 102 doing the 5X5, not sure at what exact weight I stopped (So many pages to look through back there lol!).

However if you're feeling that you are unable to keep up with the 5X5 at present weights due to factors out of your control, there would be nothing wrong with going straight over to the 5/3/1 now if it meant the difference to consistently training & not training.

I was so sceptical about the 5/3/1 & held back for a while, but now I'm on it, I can tell you it is an excellent program. The variation makes it far more interesting than the 3X5, 2X5 & 1X5. It targets both strength & some fitness with the volume/assistance sets :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Off days are recovery days but nothing wrong with throwing them in between shoulder and bench press as wendler does himself. Don't have to be to failure but I try and hit high.volume so 10 sets


I'm aiming to do my pull up/chin work on two of the off days instead of conditioning, follow the advice from EliteFTS & slowly build up the positive reps by one every four workouts, very low intensity :thumb:

All of this could end up being rather academic, I have slight medial epicondylitis (Golfers Elbow) in my right elbow due to squatting low bar, have tried different positions, but it's just how I squat , the elbow only hurts when I do pull ups/chins.

I'll concentrate on getting my recovery sorted on the hamstring first. Then have a go at the pull up/chin workout hopefully in a months time :thumb:


----------



## J1ODY A

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm thinking about doing chins & pull-ups twice a week on my off days :thumb:


Interesting you say that, that's the one piece of equipment my gym does not have so been looking at getting a bar I can mount on my outside garage wall, so can do them as & when. Seem to be about £20 new off the bay ut not sure how they will hold up being permanently outside.


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Try to stick with the 5X5 Stu, I looked back & I was still on: deadlift/squat 140, bench 102 doing the 5X5, not sure at what exact weight I stopped (So many pages to look through back there lol!).
> 
> However if you're feeling that you are unable to keep up with the 5X5 at present weights due to factors out of your control, there would be nothing wrong with going straight over to the 5/3/1 now if it meant the difference to consistently training & not training.
> 
> I was so sceptical about the 5/3/1 & held back for a while, but now I'm on it, I can tell you it is an excellent program. The variation makes it far more interesting than the 3X5, 2X5 & 1X5. It targets both strength & some fitness with the volume/assistance sets :thumb:


cheers doug....i am planning on staying on present SL 5x5 for a couple of months yet...as discussed the other week, has got to the point where doing 5x5 was just getting too intense/timemunching (1.5hrs:doublesho) and what with my irregular rubbish work hours and busy family life, although i was being pretty consistant with sticking to the 3 times a week 5x5, it was just getting a bit too much...plus was really starting to feel tired, all the time... 
so gonna drop to 3x5 for squats (as these take all my energy not leaving as much for other exercises that i'd rather work on), keep the 5x5 for rows,bench,ohp (for now) and 1x5 dead... need to start adding some ab stuff too so this should give me a little more time and energy...?

definately like what i've read with 5/3/1, although need to do a little more reading as pretty confusing at 1st glance after SL...! like his style and attitude towards training and definately like the sound of all the variation and assistance and(the odd set o bicep curls)...
so think this may well be the next programme for me but think i should still do at least a couple of months more on SL (put in my time as it were...) and get my weights up there and if i need to drop to 3x5 for everything then ok, i'm still working on the foundation...:thumb:

sunday workout...

*bench 60kg 5x5
rows 57.5 5x5
squat 80 3x5*

was feeling pretty sore from fridays workout so started with bench, couple of light warmup sets then rather than dropping weights through mised workouts went for the 60kg, and got it for the 5x5... gonna be sore tomorrow..:devil:
went 10% off for rows due to sore back and not wanted to sacrifice form but still felt good and heavy and i think hit the right spots...
squats went lighter too... doms from friday still present today, but did squats last today as didn't wanna knacker myself for this week...will need to get workouts in after 13 hr day...
have noticed yesterday and today with the doms, squats on friday definately hit inner thighs and back of legs and backside but not so much the front as expected...read that front squats are more 50/50 front and back leg muscles and back squats more concentrated on back of legs so is it worth replacing 1 workouts back squats with front squats...?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

sfstu said:


> so is it worth replacing 1 workouts back squats with front squats...?
> rgds stu


yeah yeah, i know....
*STU, LEAVE THE SL 5X5 ALONE....!!!!*


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> yeah yeah, i know....
> *STU, LEAVE THE SL 5X5 ALONE....!!!!*


Simplicity mate, the 5X5 AS IS, is an excellent routine  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

J1ODY A said:


> Interesting you say that, that's the one piece of equipment my gym does not have so been looking at getting a bar I can mount on my outside garage wall, so can do them as & when. Seem to be about £20 new off the bay ut not sure how they will hold up being permanently outside.


Im not sure about the bar J1ODY, i will be using my power rack as it already has pull up/chin up bars attached :thumb:

This Might be usefull if your as heavy as me  http://articles.elitefts.com/traini...ogression-part-ii-super-heavy-weight-edition/

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> *bench 60kg 5x5
> rows 57.5 5x5
> squat 80 3x5*
> 
> Read that front squats are more 50/50 front and back leg muscles and back squats more concentrated on back of legs so is it worth replacing 1 workouts back squats with front squats...?
> rgds stu


Stick to the 5X5 as written from SL :thumb:

Stu, no disrespect but if you are feeling tired from those weights, I would strongly advise you look at your lifestyle not your training, how is your diet? How much sleep are you getting etc...Is your job that ****t that it bores you & makes you feel very fatigued by the time you get home?

A lot of the issues I've ever had with training tend to be external rather than training related fatigue etc :thumb:

Are eating ok, bear in mind you don't need to go diet mad at the moment, just eat sensibly according to your body's needs, however I wouldn't worry too much as the weights you are using are not taxing your body that much…..yet! Perhaps you should add two glasses of skimmed milk a day (1 litre) to whatever you're eating now (one in the morning & another one mid-day).Try to ensure you get at least 20grams of protein in each meal. If you are carrying a bit too much body fat (like me 25%-27%... I think ), try to keep carbs down & focus on protein to ensure you keep your muscle mass/strength while losing some fat.

As brief as I could make it mate :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Stick to the 5X5 as written from SL :thumb:
> 
> Stu, no disrespect but if you are feeling tired from those weights, I would strongly advise you look at your lifestyle not your training, how is your diet? How much sleep are you getting etc...Is your job that ****t that it bores you & makes you feel very fatigued by the time you get home?
> 
> A lot of the issues I've ever had with training tend to be external rather than training related fatigue etc :thumb:
> 
> Are eating ok, bear in mind you don't need to go diet mad at the moment, just eat sensibly according to your body's needs, however I wouldn't worry too much as the weights you are using are not taxing your body that much…..yet! Perhaps you should add two glasses of skimmed milk a day (1 litre) to whatever you're eating now (one in the morning & another one mid-day).Try to ensure you get at least 20grams of protein in each meal. If you are carrying a bit too much body fat (like me 25%-27%... I think ), try to keep carbs down & focus on protein to ensure you keep your muscle mass/strength while losing some fat.
> 
> As brief as I could make it mate :thumb:


all good advice as ever doug...:thumb:

as for the lifestyle vs. training and sleep etc, theres only so much i can do... i work shifts of earlies and lates (week of each) and hours are very variable and often long, so hard to stick to a definate training/eating time and sleep is often a factor due to early starts (4am sometimes:doublesho).
also with having 3 young kids (and a dog!) all means that i basically do as much as i can to be dedicated to training, but cannot always rely on being able to find the time/energy to give it my all which the 5x5 was requiring more and more with the length of workouts and also the effort was suffering as a result of this...
its a case of balance i know, and i have been pretty consistent with training 3times a week so far but life is busy these days and i'm spreading myself real thin at times...!

and yes, my job is pretty boring a lot of the time and that definately does give you a sense of fatigue and empties the tank on a long day but its also not a bad job with relatively good money,especially with o/t so needs must for now...

would love to devote to training 100% and make it a priority but reality says i have to fit it around other stuff which takes a fair bit of planning...:wall:

dietwise theres always room for improvement but overall i think its not too bad and is actually fairly similar to what you've outlined doug...:thumb:
still having a protien shake after workouts and one in morning of offdays which i figure cant hurt and do try for protien with most meals and have definately greatly reduced my carbs like bread, potatos etc...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> This Might be usefull if your as heavy as me  http://articles.elitefts.com/traini...ogression-part-ii-super-heavy-weight-edition/
> 
> :thumb:


interesting read...:thumb:
maybe i'll ditch the resistance bands-wouldn't want jim thinking i squat to pee...:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> all good advice as ever doug...:thumb:
> 
> as for the lifestyle vs. training and sleep etc, theres only so much i can do... i work shifts of earlies and lates (week of each) and hours are very variable and often long, so hard to stick to a definate training/eating time and sleep is often a factor due to early starts (4am sometimes:doublesho).
> also with having 3 young kids (and a dog!) all means that i basically do as much as i can to be dedicated to training, but cannot always rely on being able to find the time/energy to give it my all which the 5x5 was requiring more and more with the length of workouts and also the effort was suffering as a result of this...
> its a case of balance i know, and i have been pretty consistent with training 3times a week so far but life is busy these days and i'm spreading myself real thin at times...!
> 
> and yes, my job is pretty boring a lot of the time and that definately does give you a sense of fatigue and empties the tank on a long day but its also not a bad job with relatively good money,especially with o/t so needs must for now...
> 
> would love to devote to training 100% and make it a priority but reality says i have to fit it around other stuff which takes a fair bit of planning...:wall:
> 
> dietwise theres always room for improvement but overall i think its not too bad and is actually fairly similar to what you've outlined doug...:thumb:
> still having a protien shake after workouts and one in morning of offdays which i figure cant hurt and do try for protien with most meals and have definately greatly reduced my carbs like bread, potatos etc...
> rgds stu


Stu, considering the above. I used to work shifts (for 20 years) just like you (I did a 6am -2pm one week & a 2pm-10pm the following then starting again back on early shift etc...) Only when I moved into I.T & worked days (9am-4.30pm/5pm) did I realise how bad/old/tired I felt, going on days made me feel like I was 20 again  :thumb: so totally understand how you feel & can only tell you *get out of it mate, if you can, it is very bad for your health in every way*. On average shift workers, in particular night shift workers, live 10 years less than someone who works a 9-5 job :doublesho Think about it :thumb:

I would strongly advise you go onto the 5/3/1, you only train each lift once a week & it will help you with motivation/energy. You don't have to do the assistance work, so your workouts can be very short/long as you like :thumb:

If I had to choose just one routine for a beginner, intermediate or advanced lifter, it would be the 5/3/1 :thumb:

I've got nice basic word docs all laid out for the 5/3/1 Stu, if you want them i'll email them to you & anything you need to know just ask :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Stu, considering the above. I used to work shifts (for 20 years) just like you (I did a 6am -2pm one week & a 2pm-10pm the following then starting again back on early shift etc...) Only when I moved into I.T & worked days (9am-4.30pm/5pm) did I realise how bad/old/tired I felt, going on days made me feel like I was 20 again  :thumb: so totally understand how you feel & can only tell you *get out of it mate, if you can, it is very bad for your health in every way*. On average shift workers, in particular night shift workers, live 10 years less than someone who works a 9-5 job :doublesho Think about it :thumb:
> 
> I would strongly advise you go onto the 5/3/1, you only train each lift once a week & it will help you with motivation/energy. You don't have to do the assistance work, so your workouts can be very short/long as you like :thumb:
> 
> If I had to choose just one routine for a beginner, intermediate or advanced lifter, it would be the 5/3/1 :thumb:
> 
> I've got nice basic word docs all laid out for the 5/3/1 Stu, if you want them i'll email them to you & anything you need to know just ask :thumb:


would love to get out of it and to do regular hours but now is not a good time to be out looking for work ?...i was made redundant from my present firm 3 years ago and despite hgv1 license (spotless too) and lots of experience in what i do, i got 3 days work in that 2 months from an agency...:wall: nightmare,what with a mortgage and family and things aren't that much better workwise now as have a couple of mates who've left but wanting to come back...! 
you are definately right about getting out doug, but it needs to be something for the next couple of years at the moment...:thumb:
training around work can be done though, as thats what i've managed last few months but it does mean i need to be flexible around times/eating...

in the process of getting someone to print out wendler's 5/3/1 that you already sent me doug but would like a look at those word docs if you don't mind...? going to do some reading up and get familiar with the programme over next week or so...:thumb:

was thinking about staying on the sl 5x5 for a couple of months mainly to up my lifts a little, maybe 25% heavier than now? just to be able to hold my head up when walking into jim's gym...:lol:
i've written lifts i'm on at moment rather than working out 1rms for them...
squat 97.5kg
bench 60kg
rows 65kg
dead 110kg
ohp 46kg

just thought that 25% heavier on all of the above wouldn't hurt and as i'm familiar with sl...


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> would love to get out of it and to do regular hours but now is not a good time to be out looking for work ?...i was made redundant from my present firm 3 years ago and despite hgv1 license (spotless too) and lots of experience in what i do, i got 3 days work in that 2 months from an agency...:wall: nightmare,what with a mortgage and family and things aren't that much better workwise now as have a couple of mates who've left but wanting to come back...!
> you are definately right about getting out doug, but it needs to be something for the next couple of years at the moment...:thumb:
> training around work can be done though, as thats what i've managed last few months but it does mean i need to be flexible around times/eating...
> 
> in the process of getting someone to print out wendler's 5/3/1 that you already sent me doug but would like a look at those word docs if you don't mind...? going to do some reading up and get familiar with the programme over next week or so...:thumb:
> 
> was thinking about staying on the sl 5x5 for a couple of months mainly to up my lifts a little, maybe 25% heavier than now? just to be able to hold my head up when walking into jim's gym...:lol:
> i've written lifts i'm on at moment rather than working out 1rms for them...
> squat 97.5kg
> bench 60kg
> rows 65kg
> dead 110kg
> ohp 46kg
> 
> just thought that 25% heavier on all of the above wouldn't hurt and as i'm familiar with sl...


Totally understand mate :thumb:

If you are happy & can stay with the 5X5 carry on with it, it is a good program to get you into powerlifting ect..

PM your email or send another email to me & i'll reply with the docs, i cant remember which one yours is mate


----------



## sfstu

roger roger...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> read that front squats are more 50/50 front and back leg muscles and back squats more concentrated on back of legs so is it worth replacing 1 workouts back squats with front squats...?
> rgds stu


Have to disagree with what you read. Front squats hit mostly the quads with a little bit of the posterior chain, Low bar squats hit everything and you need to hit your posterior chain as your glutes are one of the biggest muscles in the body and can contribute massively to your overall strength.

Mr Rippletoe covers this in the book and an article called "The Squat, or
How I Learned to Stop Leg-Pressing and Use My Ass"

Stu it sounds like time is a big issue in your works outs and to be perfectly honest I hate my workouts going over an hour. 5/3/1 is a very good program but I would agree that you will make better progress on 5x5. If time is a problem you could always keep the rest high on the main exercises Squats/Deadlifts and lower it slightly on the other exercises. Also you could drop to 3x5 or even 1x5. 1x5 isnt a great deal of volume but you can get away with this when you been lifting a little while as your squatting 3 times per week so your not getting volume per workout but you are getting density of exercise per week which is a great way to build strength. Its how most Olympic Lifters train, lower intensity but more often.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x7 (PM 129.5)
Pendlay Rows: 45x5x10
Dips: BW x 10,10,8,6,5 Total 39

Bench Press felt like crap tonight, the warm up felt heavy but the biggest problem was my right shoulder was clicking badly every single rep. 

Im starting very light on these and adding 2.5kg per workout so thats a pretty agressive way to add weight on 5/3/1 but I will stay at the weight until I get 5 sets of 10. To be honest at this weight they felt really easy as I would expect but sitting here now I can feel my lats hurting so the higher reps and voume has definitely hit them hard.

Love dips as always, 39 isnt a great total for me especially after low volume Bench Press but its not to bad. I really like adding high volume dips to my chest workout as I didnt have the best bench session but these make sure your hitting the required muscles as well.

I tried a complex but really couldnt be arsed so decided that after heavy weights I cant put decent effort into fitness so I will stick to doing this on off days.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x7 (PM 129.5)
> Pendlay Rows: 45x5x10
> Dips: BW x 10,10,8,6,5 Total 39
> 
> Bench Press felt like crap tonight, the warm up felt heavy but the biggest problem was my right shoulder was clicking badly every single rep.
> 
> Im starting very light on these and adding 2.5kg per workout so thats a pretty agressive way to add weight on 5/3/1 but I will stay at the weight until I get 5 sets of 10. To be honest at this weight they felt really easy as I would expect but sitting here now I can feel my lats hurting so the higher reps and voume has definitely hit them hard.
> 
> Love dips as always, 39 isnt a great total for me especially after low volume Bench Press but its not to bad. I really like adding high volume dips to my chest workout as I didnt have the best bench session but these make sure your hitting the required muscles as well.
> 
> I tried a complex but really couldnt be arsed so decided that after heavy weights I cant put decent effort into fitness so I will stick to doing this on off days.


James, why not do your bench work with 10 rep sets instead of the heavy low rep 5/3/1 stuff to save your shoulder :thumb:

Are you using the narrow grip that Wendler & myself use on your bench?


----------



## jonnyMercUK

I have a question...

I have been doing the 5x5 stronglifts for nearly a month now, I posted a while back about me losing size, just wondered how long it took people to physically see a difference. I know I am stronger but still feel a loss of definition


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> I have a question...
> 
> I have been doing the 5x5 stronglifts for nearly a month now, I posted a while back about me losing size, just wondered how long it took people to physically see a difference. I know I am stronger but still feel a loss of definition


It takes time mate & we are all different, if you see adverts with "massive arms in 6 weeks" etc... & all the like, I can tell you it is all a load of 
It takes dedication & training consistency; I have been powerlifting for 11 months now & have put on approx. 2 stone & moved from an XL to a XXL.

If definition is your priority I would focus on your diet/body fat percentage :thumb:

If you are following the SL 5X5 I would recommend you follow the proscribed advice from the SL site in regards to the weights you should reach before moving to the 3x5, 2x5, 1x5 or 5/3/1.

:thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

@jonnymercUK: 
Its hard to see the difference as you improve, without progress pictures. 
I'm glad I took a few when starting out. (Jan '12). The first couple of months (on SL5x5) I didn't see much of an improvement, but it was there. you just do not notice it. 

Now I can see a significant difference and I still feel I could have gone further with aesthetics if my diet had been in check from the get go. 
On the other hand I do enjoy having a beer, wine and some good food. It'll just take a little longer to reach the wanted physique.

Keep at it and soon you will notice the difference. Its a marathon, not a sprint.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Yeh the diet is good, apart from this weekend, I went mad!

Where can I find the info on SL site in regards to weights etc (I find that website horrible to navigate around!)

I do quite a lot of HITT cardio to burn fat and that has worked very well so far, just unfortunately it shrinks muscle.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Deload Cycle this week :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS- (WU 50X3 60X2 70X1) 48KGX5 60KGX5 72KGX5

BENCH PRESS- 82.5KGX-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL ROW- 70KGX-10-10-10-10-10*

:thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Right here we go..

Squat 97.5kg x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5
Overhead press 47.5kg x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 4
Dead lift 115kg x 5

Chins 15kg x 5 x 5 x 5
Ab crunches x 15 x 15 x 15
Side planks x 1mins

Cross trainer 20 mins, 1 min level 20/2 mins level 10 etc etc

Felt great tonight!!


----------



## sfstu

jonnyMercUK said:


> Right here we go..
> 
> Squat 97.5kg x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5
> Overhead press 47.5kg x 5 x 5 x 5 x 5 x 4
> Dead lift 115kg x 5
> 
> Chins 15kg x 5 x 5 x 5
> Ab crunches x 15 x 15 x 15
> Side planks x 1mins
> 
> Cross trainer 20 mins, 1 min level 20/2 mins level 10 etc etc
> 
> Felt great tonight!!


pretty much same weights i'm on at the moment...:thumb: although i couldn't do the chins...just yet...


----------



## jonnyMercUK

sfstu said:


> pretty much same weights i'm on at the moment...:thumb: although i couldn't do the chins...just yet...


I did 20KG chins last time but felt the first set felt weak so I dropped it to 15KG as form was going.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

How do people do their overhead press? I had been doing it seated however, think I might try it standing next time, the more weight I add the more difficult it is to rack it back up whilst sitting down.


----------



## sfstu

always done mine standing up, cage is slightly too low to do inside it unless seated...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> How do people do their overhead press? I had been doing it seated however, think I might try it standing next time, the more weight I add the more difficult it is to rack it back up whilst sitting down.


To get the full benefit of the OHP = standing :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Yes, been watching some videos, think I might try it standing, maybe inside the cage.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, why not do your bench work with 10 rep sets instead of the heavy low rep 5/3/1 stuff to save your shoulder :thumb:
> 
> Are you using the narrow grip that Wendler & myself use on your bench?


My shoulder has been getting better lately, this is the first time it has clicked during Benching in ages. Didnt expect the workout to go well as have a massive amount on my mind right now, hugh decisions to make that I cant get off my mind.

Anything over 5 reps is high rep training :thumb:

Yep close grip, a thumbs width from the smooth. Its feels more natural for me to bench like this anyway as I have strong triceps.



jonnyMercUK said:


> I have a question...
> 
> I have been doing the 5x5 stronglifts for nearly a month now, I posted a while back about me losing size, just wondered how long it took people to physically see a difference. I know I am stronger but still feel a loss of definition


It takes time as everyone has said but I find it very hard to spot change in yourself. You see yourself every single day and the 0.1% wont be noticeable day in day out. But i heard and had personal experience when you dont see people for a few months and you dont think you have changed but they comment on the change. Happened at the weekend actually. I didnt think I put on any size on the past year as Im the same weight and I swear my arms are the same size but I went to put on a shirt I used to wear out and it wouldnt actually fit round my arms or back, I also run out of clean jeans at the weekend so tried some that havent fitted for years and I needed a belt :doublesho And I thought I had made zero progress.



jonnyMercUK said:


> Yes, been watching some videos, think I might try it standing, maybe inside the cage.


If you have space 100% standing, it hits more muscle and hits your core hard.


----------



## sfstu

tuesdays workout...

*squat 97.5kg
OHP 46kg
deadlift 110kg*

squat went fine,heavy but good, a mid morning workout with breakfast, then dog walk as warmup, then train seems to work best for me though i can't always do it at this time...
OHP was hard, did 3x5, just...used some fractional plates to take it up a kilo a time but really struggling on this lift....
deadlift felt really heavy too, have to keep an eye on this...

rgds stu

p.s. doug, just wondered if you get my PM sunday..?


----------



## sidewalkdances

I'm back!!!!

Comp did not go well - I bombed! 

I cut something like 7.5kg in the end to make weight and with working all day the day before the comp (bar work so on my feet all the time) and a lack of money to eat right, I couldnt put the weight on. 

Took 315kg as my opener. Came up fairly easily even though warm ups felt like crap. I got called on depth though (3 reds would you believe - front judges shouldnt be calling depth!!!) - Judging was very tight, so I went up to 335 for a small PR and sunk it. Just couldnt stand it up. Same again on the third. Tried to go down quicker to get more rebound out of the gear and just fell back with it.

Did bench only and got 210/220 and 230. The 220 and 230 were 5 and 15kg PR's respectively. 

As i bombed I didnt think I was deadlifting, imagine my surprise when I heard my name called as being 4 lifters out. I asked the table what the deal was and they said I could lift if I wanted. So just threw my suit on and pulled 235kg opener (no warm ups!), 255kg and then I attempted 260kg which I locked out but got called for hitching. 

All in all an ok day. Couple of comp PR's in the bench and deadlift, but never nice to bomb out.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> p.s. doug, just wondered if you get my PM sunday..?


Answered mate :thumb:


----------



## Oats

sidewalkdances said:


> I'm back!!!!


 Excellent :thumb:

What are the rules at PL meets? Is it like Oly lifting where you can go up in 1kg increments and follow yourself?


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday: Hill Sprints 6 reps 1 min Rest

Wednesday:
Squats: 92.5x5, 107.5x5, 120x7 3 mins rest
Deadlifts: 70 x 5 x 10 2 mins rest
Abs

I have to start by saying. What ever you do listen to Wendler, he's the man. Reason I say this is that I did hill sprints last night when he advises not to them the day before a lower body workout. I thought they cant make you that sore its only fitness but while doing them I could really feel them in my upper thighs. Then today while squatting I could feel I was sore.

Squats went ok I wanted 9 and could have probably got there if I really put my mind to it but Im doing as Wendler says and leaving a few in the Tank.

Lower rest, higher rep Deadlifts are a killer but you can feel that it will be awesome at building some serious muscle. No wonder Wendler says BBB is good for size. 70kg is light but Im adding 2,5kg per week so I will soon be doing a decent weight.

Quick update, got bored so jumped up off the sofa and did the max push up test. 34reps with nose touching carpet each rep, pretty pleased with that.


----------



## sfstu

^^^yep, he is the man...! been doing some reading last few days of his 5/3/1 and some of his articles on his webpage...like his attitude to things...:thumb:
think i'm gonna be doing the 5/3/1/ next but gonna leave it for a month or so yet and get my weights up some more on SL...


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Quick update, got bored so jumped up off the sofa and did the max push up test. 34reps with nose touching carpet each rep, pretty pleased with that.


With or without Rocky 



sfstu said:


> think i'm gonna be doing the 5/3/1/ next but gonna leave it for a month or so yet and get my weights up some more on SL...


There have been a few threads on SS about the point at which people stall on linear progression every session and move off novice (using squat weight as a gauge). The poll was around 125kg. Rips reply was 125kg was the lowest he sees, and 150kg being more the norm. Might give you an idea of where to aim for before looking at 5\3\1 that is much slower. That being said, work, family, and age are an unholy trinity in making it difficult to keep up the novice progression.


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> There have been a few threads on SS about the point at which people stall on linear progression every session and move off novice (using squat weight as a gauge). The poll was around 125kg. Rips reply was 125kg was the lowest he sees, and 150kg being more the norm. Might give you an idea of where to aim for before looking at 531 that is much slower. That being said, work, family, and age are an unholy trinity in making it difficult to keep up the novice progression.


will reach 100kg today on squat and bodyweight is 112kg (couple o weeks ago anyway) so 125-150kg sounds ok to me...:thumb: still making progress on SL so should stay with it for a little while yet...
as you said though, the unholy trinity definately plays a part in things...!


----------



## leisure

What is 5x5?
I hear people talking about it all the time. I assume its 5 sets of 5 reps?
But do you stick to one bodypart with it or mix it up?
I have a pretty good routine but trying something new never does any harm.
Des Moines boot camp


----------



## Bod42

Fridays Workout (Completed Thurs as working late tomorrow AGAIN)
Shoulder Press: 37.5x5, 42.5x5, 50x7
Dips: BWx5, BWx5, BW+7.5x10
Neutral Grip Chins Ups: BW x 5 x 2

I had about 4 hours sleep last night and did a 15 hour day so really not feeling the gym but still went. I have done 11 reps on 50kg so not impressed with 7 reps but I am exhausted and nothing wrong with starting light as per Wendler advice.

Dips felt awesome as usual. I think for me havin both high volume, higher rep and then lower volume lower rep strength work in the same week just seems to work so well for me.

My chins werent great as my back is sore all over from Deadlifts yesterday. A really good sore, I like that feeling I get in the back of my shoulders from deads.



Oats said:


> With or without Rocky


Rocky wasnt playing but he was there in spirit lol



Oats said:


> With or without Rocky
> 
> There have been a few threads on SS about the point at which people stall on linear progression every session and move off novice (using squat weight as a gauge). The poll was around 125kg. Rips reply was 125kg was the lowest he sees, and 150kg being more the norm. Might give you an idea of where to aim for before looking at 531 that is much slower. That being said, work, family, and age are an unholy trinity in making it difficult to keep up the novice progression.


Rip does suggest a few steps before finally going onto a program like 5/3/1. So does Stronglift.

Basically SS adds weight every workout, then you have programs like advanced novice where you add weight twice per week with a light squat day in the middle, then Madcow where you add weight once per week and then move onto 5/3/1 which adds weight once per month. Good thing about 5/3/1 is due to the maximum reps, yes your only adding 2.5/5kg per month but you may increase your strength at a faster rate than this.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Wednesday workout

Body weight:80KG

Squats 100KG 5x5x5x5x5
Bench 80KG 5x5x5x5x5
Barbell Row 75KG 5x5x5x5x5
Dips 30KG 5x5x5

Felt great last night, very hard workout but great. I'm breaking PB's every time I train now


----------



## sfstu

leisure said:


> What is 5x5?
> I hear people talking about it all the time. I assume its 5 sets of 5 reps?
> But do you stick to one bodypart with it or mix it up?
> I have a pretty good routine but trying something new never does any harm


Google either Stronglifts 5x5 or starting strength by mark rippetoe and all will be revealed...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stuffed for time so went straight to 100 & 105 today :thumb: 

*SQUAT - (Warm up sets 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) Work set 105KG X 5

SQUAT 100KG-10-10-10-10-10* :devil:

All good, assistance exercises now complete, next stage is to increase the work set up to 150 for both squat & deadlift then split up both the lifts for the final stage to 200, as long as my hamstring continues to hold out that is :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

well was short of time myself this morning before work so had to pick 2 of 3 exercises to do this morn and just done the 3rd tonight...may surprise some of you that i actually did squats as one of the two this morn instead of binning it...

thurs workout...

*squat 100kg
bench 62.5kg
rows 67.5kg*

got a nice round number for squats at a 100kgs and it felt surprisingly good too today...only another 12kg (6 x sessions or 2 weeks) and then i'm at bodyweight...
bench was good and heavy at 62.5, helped that i'm concentrating on arching my back some and keeping shoulders back and tight but this weight is 20kgs more than i ever lifted before due to dodgy shoulder and not knowing how to press...:thumb:
did the rows this evening after work...67.5kg just felt too heavy... first 2 or 3 reps were ok but didn't get 1 set of 5 good reps and form wasn't the best but gonna try this weight again next time and see if its improved...


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> I had about 4 hours sleep last night and did a 15 hour day so really not feeling the gym but still went.





jonnyMercUK said:


> Felt great last night, very hard workout but great. I'm breaking PB's every time I train now





ITHAQVA said:


> ... next stage is to increase the work set up to 150 for both squat & deadlift then split up both the lifts for the final stage to 200





sfstu said:


> got a nice round number for squats at a 100kgs and it felt surprisingly good too today...only another 12kg (6 x sessions or 2 weeks) and then i'm at bodyweight...


Look at all that! Now we're truckin'! :driver: 
:thumb::thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 3 Week 3 - Max rep test week*

_Same weight as cycle 2_

Sh Press 4 reps = 1RM 55 (-1.5kg vs cycle 2)

Deadlift 10 reps = 1RM 166 (+8kg)

Bench 3 reps = 1RM 80.3 (same)

Squat 6 reps = 1RM 120 (same)

I did the same weights as cycle 2 in order to sort out upper body reps and they've either stayed the same or got worse! Looked back at log and 6th Decmeber has same bench weight for 3x5 and note saying "very very close but got it". That was almost a year ago.:wall: My technique on bench is completly to pot. Going to look at rebuilding it during next cycle.

I repeated both Press and Bench max lifts after a 5 min rest and got the same number of reps again which is a bit weird. I'm going to take a leaf from the Texas Method intensity day. If I don't get at least 5 reps I'll rest then lift again until I get 5 reps total. So could be 2x3, 3x2, 5x1. If nothing else at least I'll feel happier than only getting two reps and then ending it there.

Lower body good. Deadlift left hand grip an issue for first time at 10x125kg. I have an irrational attachment to double overhand grip though! Squat was good. Limiting factor again was left shoulder getting mashed. Even when really concentrating on it I can't stop it happening.

Aggravated lower back most of week from a hill sprint on a new steeper hill (right underneath Jimmie Saville's old flat). Possibly could have been that the ground was more uneven\pitted. I'll go back to the other end of the park to my old hill next week and see what happens.

Seems a bit of a crap week on paper but I actually feel the cycle was an OK one overall. Maybe I'm just deluded but that's not such a bad thing now and again is it


----------



## jonnyMercUK

102.5KG squat tonight, that's 20KG more than my body weight...BRING IT ON!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> *531 Cycle 3 Week 3 - Max rep test week*
> 
> _Same weight as cycle 2_
> 
> Sh Press 4 reps = 1RM 55 (-1.5kg vs cycle 2)
> 
> Deadlift 10 reps = 1RM 166 (+8kg)
> 
> Bench 3 reps = 1RM 80.3 (same)
> 
> Squat 6 reps = 1RM 120 (same)
> 
> I did the same weights as cycle 2 in order to sort out upper body reps and they've either stayed the same or got worse! Looked back at log and 6th Decmeber has same bench weight for 3x5 and note saying "very very close but got it". That was almost a year ago.:wall: My technique on bench is completly to pot. Going to look at rebuilding it during next cycle.
> 
> I repeated both Press and Bench max lifts after a 5 min rest and got the same number of reps again which is a bit weird. I'm going to take a leaf from the Texas Method intensity day. If I don't get at least 5 reps I'll rest then lift again until I get 5 reps total. So could be 2x3, 3x2, 5x1. If nothing else at least I'll feel happier than only getting two reps and then ending it there.
> 
> Lower body good. Deadlift left hand grip an issue for first time at 10x125kg. I have an irrational attachment to double overhand grip though! Squat was good. Limiting factor again was left shoulder getting mashed. Even when really concentrating on it I can't stop it happening.
> 
> Aggravated lower back most of week from a hill sprint on a new steeper hill (right underneath Jimmie Saville's old flat). Possibly could have been that the ground was more unevenpitted. I'll go back to the other end of the park to my old hill next week and see what happens.
> 
> Seems a bit of a crap week on paper but I actually feel the cycle was an OK one overall. Maybe I'm just deluded but that's not such a bad thing now and again is it


It takes time & sometimes workouts just don't go according to plan :thumb:

Don't be too concerned with keeping the double overhand grip on the deadlift Col, once you get to around 140kg ish you may find as I did that my grip failing was interfering with the actual lift. I would go for the alternative grip as soon as you think you are not focusing on the lift & spending too much time trying to get your grip to hold, once you go over to alt grip you'll find that your deadlift goes up even quicker in weight.

Once you have around 185kg on the bar you'll be working your grip strength :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> 102.5KG squat tonight, that's 20KG more than my body weight...BRING IT ON!


Hate those weights grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr :devil: , Best of luck for tonight mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Last session of this weeks deload cycle :thumb:

OHP percentage is way too light, but im going to slowly build it up on the 3 x monthly work set cyles. And still aim for 100kg for 1 rep....If possible  :thumb:

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X3 28X2 33X1) - 21KGX5 27KGX5 33KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 35KG-10-10-10-10-10

DIPS Bodyweigth (108Kg)-6-6-6-6-6

BARBELL CURL 35KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Upping the assitance weigths for barbell Curl & OHP to 37.5kg for next months cycle :thumb:

Third 5/3/1 cycle starts Monday


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Overhead press standing killed me tonight. Had to reduce the weight from the start  however think it will be better for me standing rather than seated


----------



## sfstu

quick question guys...what ,if any, multivits do you take...?
for years now i've taken the tescos 1 a day multivits but was reading on the My Potein site the other day about AlphaMen multivits and got me wondering whats good multivit wise...?


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> quick question guys...what ,if any, multivits do you take...?
> for years now i've taken the tescos 1 a day multivits but was reading on the My Potein site the other day about AlphaMen multivits and got me wondering whats good multivit wise...?


During my powerlifting over the last 11 months I have tried only a few supplements, result - nothing conclusive. I don't bother with anything at all now :thumb:

*Eat right mate - Nutrition from whole foods is the only way.*

Read what Wendler & Ripptoe have to say on the subject Stu :thumb:

And Stu, if anyone tells you that supplements make a REAL difference, they are full of **** :thumb: 

*All the best from Cornwall's:wave: insane Hippy DaRK lord:devil:  :thumb:*


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> *All the best from Cornwall's:wave: insane Hippy DaRK lord:devil:  :thumb:*


you sure you're not taking any "supplements" doug...?:lol:

agree with you there about getting what you need from a balanced diet mate, have always thought of vitamins and protein shakes as an extra or assistance stuff rather than relying on them...have taken multivits for a few years now though and must admit i do feel better for them (even if thats placebo effect)..
also, although my diets not too bad and fairly varied and natural i reckon it can be hard to get everything you need just from food especially if you're talking "packed lunches" which i have to have several days a week which is where i suppose a vitamin as an extra boost comes in, covering all bases as it were...

other than a multivit every evening i take a cod liver oil tablet and a protein shake after training and thats a bout it...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> you sure you're not taking any "supplements" doug...?:lol:
> 
> agree with you there about getting what you need from a balanced diet mate, have always thought of vitamins and protein shakes as an extra or assistance stuff rather than relying on them...have taken multivits for a few years now though and must admit i do feel better for them (even if thats placebo effect)..
> also, although my diets not too bad and fairly varied and natural i reckon it can be hard to get everything you need just from food especially if you're talking "packed lunches" which i have to have several days a week which is where i suppose a vitamin as an extra boost comes in, covering all bases as it were...
> 
> other than a multivit every evening i take a cod liver oil tablet and a protein shake after training and thats a bout it...
> rgds stu


100% Natural & proud :thumb: 

After training I have my biggest meal of the day, I'll have either chicken breasts, Lean pork chops, salmon or red meat with a fresh salad with mixed seeds or 3 veg from this list (Asparagus, broccoli, green beans, courgettes, potatoes).

Just bought a new BBQ for winter :thumb: Tonight's evening meal is BBQ'd :devil: sirloin steak with boiled potatoes salad & mixed seeds & BBQ'd :devil: vegetables on skewers (peppers, onions & tomatoes)  :thumb: all dressed in lemon juice mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Just bought a new BBQ for winter :thumb: Tonight's evening meal is BBQ'd :devil: sirloin steak with boiled potatoes salad & mixed seeds & BBQ'd :devil: vegetables on skewers (peppers, onions & tomatoes)  :thumb: all dressed in lemon juice mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! :thumb:


can't find the smilie for a rumbling tum...


----------



## sfstu

sundays workout...

*squat 102.5kg
OHP 47kg
deadlift 105kg*

surprisingly good workout today considering i wasn't feeling too energetic...:thumb:

back to doing squats 1st albeit 3x5 (+2 or 3 warmup sets)...felt good and well chuffed to be past the 100kg mark... think i need to face out of cage though ,as at the moment i'm looking at the wall from 3ft which isn't the best for keeping focussed/head still...
OHP went good today as well which surprised me tbh...been having trouble with this recently, sticking on the weights, but have been using fractional plates to increase by 1kg a session which seems to be working as got the 47kg today with not too much trouble...watched a couple of youtube vids before hand as a form check and that helped too...will be happy if i can get to 50kg for 5x5 at the mo...:thumb:
was a little worried about deadlift too but with 3xwarmup sets it went ok for the 1x5 although by the time i finished and put the bar down i thought i was going to be sick....:doublesho:devil:
deadlift feels such a _nice_ lift at 75kg warmup but altogether different at work weight...

well it showed me today that it _is_ worth bothering to do my workout even if i'm not in the mood for it or not feeling too positive about it as today was a good workout, making my weights, but before hand expecting to crash out some of the weights or end up cutting session short and skipping one of the exercises...
i am actually now starting to notice/feel the increase in strength i have now, compared to 3 months ago....cool...


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> quick question guys...what ,if any, multivits do you take...?
> for years now i've taken the tescos 1 a day multivits but was reading on the My Potein site the other day about AlphaMen multivits and got me wondering whats good multivit wise...?


I've come accross bits and bats on multi-vits. The things that always come up when writers mention supplements are magnesium, D, zinc, and omega oils. Different quantities are suggested and I'm also conscious that they tend to be talking about elite athletes.

For example from Poliquin (who I think is a bit batty!) "_Generally, taking a multivitamin is not a substitute for taking the other four nutrients already mentioned (zinc, magnesium, vitamin D, and omega-3s) because individuals typically need more of these four than are included in most multis, and omega-3s are almost never included in multis. But, if you're only able to take one supplement, a multi may be a beneficial choice_".

The other things that are often mentioned on multi vits is that modern farming means food nowersdays is less nutrient dense than historically, and multivits are rammed together to make them one-a-day. This isn't necessarily a good thing (think weening baby and sweetcorn).

I think it's one of those things as a general punter you'll never really know. I use Alpha when I'm feeling run down, a cold coming on etc as an insurance policy. It's profile looks better than most, it's two tablets rather than one, and Myprotein seems well regarded. But as Doug says, I don't believe it's a substitute for eating well and sleep; rather a safety net.



sfstu said:


> well it showed me today that it _is_ worth bothering to do my workout even if i'm not in the mood for it or not feeling too positive about it as today was a good workout, making my weights, but before hand expecting to crash out some of the weights or end up cutting session short and skipping one of the exercises...


It still strikes me as so weird when I read that. You learn it's the case but if you try to exlpain it to someone who doesn't do weights I reckon they think you're a bit mental


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> once you get to around 140kg ish you may find as I did that my grip failing was interfering with the actual lift.


Yep, I was 135kg on Starting Strength and grip began to raise its head. Certainly seems different going for a set of 10 than 5 as well.



ITHAQVA said:


> All the best from Cornwall's insane:confused Hippy...


Eh? Hippy  Have you seen how many of your posts have the word 'hate' in them?


----------



## jonnyMercUK

sfstu said:


> m looking at the wall from 3ft which isn't the best for keeping focussed


Take a pencil and draw a marker on the wall.


----------



## sfstu

already tried staring at one spot on the wall but because its so close head moves too much focusing on the one spot...? if i face the other way, will be looking down garage which is further away so think i'll try that...:thumb:


----------



## Mark Chandler

Hello chaps, I have been reading some of this thread for a while now so here's a bit of history.

50 next year, body in decline so looked in the mirror 4 months ago and decided that things need to change so joined a gym (I used to do free weights with my mates in my early 20's mostly bench and curl was able to press 250lb, only once or twice but could do 220lb x 10 okay)

Over the last 4 months have lost 1stone, now just under 13 and my bench presses started at a very weak 50kg have now improved to 80kg max for maybe 4.

I got this far with pyramid weights, 12x, then 10x then 8x increasing 10kg at a time until I stop gaining so three weeks switched to 5x5 with 30 second rest with 60kg working up to 70kg on the last couple of sets.

Next I move on to dumb bells to get a bit more depth to the movement and have increased from 24kg to 26kg on 5 x 5, I do do all other muscles as well, every other visit switching from arms and shoulders to stomach and legs.

It all looks quite promising, my problem then.... I do not feel the burn, also I can do more than 5x5, tonight I did 8x5 with 26kg to collaspe then switched to 24kg weights and did a few more.

I physically cannot however increase the weight, it is as if I am at my lifting limit is very close to my 5x5 weight limit.

So any suggestions, I feel like I have hit a block 

Should I increase to 5 x 8 maybe ?

Cheers Mark


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Eh? Hippy  Have you seen how many of your posts have the word 'hate' in them?


Thats the dark lord bit :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mark Chandler said:


> Hello chaps, I have been reading some of this thread for a while now so here's a bit of history.
> 
> 50 next year, body in decline so looked in the mirror 4 months ago and decided that things need to change so joined a gym (I used to do free weights with my mates in my early 20's mostly bench and curl was able to press 250lb, only once or twice but could do 220lb x 10 okay)
> 
> Over the last 4 months have lost 1stone, now just under 13 and my bench presses started at a very weak 50kg have now improved to 80kg max for maybe 4.
> 
> I got this far with pyramid weights, 12x, then 10x then 8x increasing 10kg at a time until I stop gaining so three weeks switched to 5x5 with 30 second rest with 60kg working up to 70kg on the last couple of sets.
> 
> Next I move on to dumb bells to get a bit more depth to the movement and have increased from 24kg to 26kg on 5 x 5, I do do all other muscles as well, every other visit switching from arms and shoulders to stomach and legs.
> 
> It all looks quite promising, my problem then.... I do not feel the burn, also I can do more than 5x5, tonight I did 8x5 with 26kg to collaspe then switched to 24kg weights and did a few more.
> 
> I physically cannot however increase the weight, it is as if I am at my lifting limit is very close to my 5x5 weight limit.
> 
> So any suggestions, I feel like I have hit a block
> 
> Should I increase to 5 x 8 maybe ?
> 
> Cheers Mark


Hi Mark, moving from one rep range to another is your problem, over complicating things for yourself mate :thumb:

I would suggest you do the 5X5 as is or do it with a 10 rep range, no dumbbells just the barbell.

Once you reach a full 5X5 or 5X10 (Choose one rep range not both ) on a lift add 2.5kg start again & so on. Changing you rep range is not a good idea as you really don't know if you have reached your strength limit.

May I suggest you try the 5/3/1, it will give you plenty of variation & progression, PM your email & I'll send you a copy 

Keep it simple, eat right & get plenty of sleep, I'm 44 so you are not alone here, but we all train the same, barbells, barbells & barbells  

The above is for strength (5X5) mass (5X10), what are your goals Mark? You can adapt the above for just fitness by increasing the rep range to 15, at this range I would progress with 1kg increments & do 3X30 min sessions of light cardio on your off days :thumb:

As brief as i can make it, off to work now 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> by the time i finished and put the bar down i thought i was going to be sick....:doublesho:devil:
> 
> well it showed me today that it _is_ worth bothering to do my workout even if i'm not in the mood for it or not feeling too positive about it as today was a good workout, making my weights, but before hand expecting to crash out some of the weights or end up cutting session short and skipping one of the exercises...
> i am actually now starting to notice/feel the increase in strength i have now, compared to 3 months ago....cool...


It gets worse Stu, try 1X5 touch n go reps with 185 & you feel like you've been sexually assaulted by a fully grown male Rhino :doublesho:doublesho

This is common Stu, i tend to find the dynamic stretches followed by my warm up & good toons :devil: on the old iPod get one ready for the full sesh


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> already tried staring at one spot on the wall but because its so close head moves too much focusing on the one spot...? if i face the other way, will be looking down garage which is further away so think i'll try that...:thumb:


I used to train facing the wall, I now face out of the rack..& burn holes in the opposite wall :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Third 5/3/1 Cycle Week 1 

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 81KGX5 94KGX5 106KGX5

BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL ROW 72.5KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Good workout, bench weights getting close to my old max (115), pre hamstring injury :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Third 5/3/1 Cycle Week 1
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 81KGX5 94KGX5 106KGX5
> 
> BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-10
> 
> BARBELL ROW 72.5KG-10-10-10-10-10*
> 
> Good workout, bench weights getting close to my old max (115), pre hamstring injury :thumb:


i get the 5x10 of bench as assistance but how come you do bbrow as assistance also doug..? 
i know its an opposite muscle group to work to chest but thought the assistance was just based on the actual bodypart exercise for that session...?


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> i get the 5x10 of bench as assistance but how come you do bbrow as assistance also doug..?
> i know its an opposite muscle group to work to chest but thought the assistance was just based on the actual bodypart exercise for that session...?


Just to annoy you :lol:

But really because in the 5/3/1 it states that dumbbell rows are a good assistance exercise on the bench day, I hate dumbbells so I'm using a barbell, simples!  :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Just to annoy you :lol:
> 
> But really because in the 5/3/1 it states that dumbbell rows are a good assistance exercise on the bench day, I hate dumbbells so I'm using a barbell, simples!  :thumb:


gotcha...:thumb: the kroc rows that wendler loves...


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Great session tonight  I'm well chuffed!!

Bench 82.5kg 5x5x5x5x5
Squat 105kg 5x5x5x5x5
Barbell row 77.5kg 5x5x5x5x5
Chins 20kg 5x5x5

Really impressed with bench I started stronglifts on 60kg!


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> already tried staring at one spot on the wall but because its so close head moves too much focusing on the one spot...? if i face the other way, will be looking down garage which is further away so think i'll try that...:thumb:


Stu, I had this exact same issue a few months back and I turned to face out of my rack. If you mark the wall 2-3 foot in front of your face your head moves loads whereas if you look at a mark 15 foot away it keeps your head at a more constant angle.



ITHAQVA said:


> It gets worse Stu, try 1X5 touch n go reps with 185 & you feel like you've been sexually assaulted by a fully grown male Rhino :doublesho:doublesho


:lol::doublesho:lol:



sfstu said:


> i get the 5x10 of bench as assistance but how come you do bbrow as assistance also doug..?
> i know its an opposite muscle group to work to chest but thought the assistance was just based on the actual bodypart exercise for that session...?


Number 1, because Wendler SAYS SO and he is never wrong :thumb: Really when designing a workout you should really try and keep a 2:1 ratio between pulling and pushing. If you sit at a desk all day or have shoulder problems you can change this ratio to 3:1. As I have problems with my shoulders you will see on bench day that I dont do a second pushing exercise I go straight to a rowing exercise. The same thing on my shoulder day. I also throw in Band Pull Aparts and face pulls to add extra volume for my upper back.


----------



## Bod42

Mondays Workout:
Deadlifts: (WU 67.5x5, 85x5, 100x3) 110x5, 125x5, 142.5x5
Squats: 60x5x10
Ab Work

Very disappointed with Deadlifts as I was expecting to get 7-9 reps as I took 90% of my 1RM but I only got 5. I have pulled 5 reps at 20kg heavier in the past so very disappointing. My head isnt really in the gym at the moment so cant be to hard on myself and also I havent Deadlifted in over a month so hopefully next week the movement wont feel so alien and will therefore increase strength. UPDATE: Just checked my Juggernaut records and I did 137.5, so 5kg less, for 12 reps. Thats a Predicted 1RM of 192.5kg compared with 166kg :doublesho This why I was aiming for 7-9 reps as this should have been achievable.

I have to take my hat off to Doug here, doing 5x10 of 100kg squats is impressive. 60kg was hard enough but Im adding 2.5kg per week so 10kg a month so hoping to increase this weight a lot. I'm taking 2 mins rest so you get a massive pump in your legs and back which is always cool. I lowered my safety bars another notch so I can drop slightly faster and get a nice rebound as per rippletoe teachings, hoping this will make a big difference as I have always lowered slowly to sit on the box gently.

Did bridges for abs but sqeeze your glutes and legs together as hard as you can and it shifts all the stress to your abs. If you do this properly theres no way you should be able to last more than a minute.


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> Great session tonight  I'm well chuffed!!
> 
> Bench 82.5kg 5x5x5x5x5
> Squat 105kg 5x5x5x5x5
> Barbell row 77.5kg 5x5x5x5x5
> Chins 20kg 5x5x5
> 
> Really impressed with bench I started stronglifts on 60kg!


Good solid workout there Jonny :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Mondays Workout:
> Deadlifts: (WU 67.5x5, 85x5, 100x3) 110x5, 125x5, 142.5x5
> Squats: 60x5x10
> Ab Work
> 
> Very disappointed with Deadlifts as I was expecting to get 7-9 reps as I took 90% of my 1RM but I only got 5. I have pulled 5 reps at 20kg heavier in the past so very disappointing. My head isnt really in the gym at the moment so cant be to hard on myself and also I havent Deadlifted in over a month so hopefully next week the movement wont feel so alien and will therefore increase strength. UPDATE: Just checked my Juggernaut records and I did 137.5, so 5kg less, for 12 reps. Thats a Predicted 1RM of 192.5kg compared with 166kg :doublesho This why I was aiming for 7-9 reps as this should have been achievable.
> 
> I have to take my hat off to Doug here, doing 5x10 of 100kg squats is impressive. 60kg was hard enough but Im adding 2.5kg per week so 10kg a month so hoping to increase this weight a lot. I'm taking 2 mins rest so you get a massive pump in your legs and back which is always cool. I lowered my safety bars another notch so I can drop slightly faster and get a nice rebound as per rippletoe teachings, hoping this will make a big difference as I have always lowered slowly to sit on the box gently.
> 
> Did bridges for abs but sqeeze your glutes and legs together as hard as you can and it shifts all the stress to your abs. If you do this properly theres no way you should be able to last more than a minute.


Dont be to hard on yourself James, you are young & have a whole lifetime to reach your goals :thumb:

Cheers mate, its hard going at my age  , must admit though 5X10 at 100Kg does feel good :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> gotcha...:thumb: the kroc rows that wendler loves...


Dumbells...............NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## jonnyMercUK

ITHAQVA said:


> Good solid workout there Jonny :devil: :thumb:


Thanks! :thumb:

Do you have a link for the weights I should be achieving before moving onto wendler?


----------



## sfstu

tues workout

*squat 105kg
bench 65kg
rows 67.5kg*

squat wasn't so good today...made it but really struggled, just didn't have the fire alight today...
bench and rows went ok, heavy but did em...:thumb:
also did a few chins after with assistance band...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

@jonnymercuk



Oats said:


> There have been a few threads on SS about the point at which people stall on linear progression every session and move off novice (using squat weight as a gauge). The poll was around 125kg. Rips reply was 125kg was the lowest he sees, and 150kg being more the norm. Might give you an idea of where to aim for before looking at 531 that is much slower.


asked similar a week or so ago...:thumb:


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> @jonnymercuk
> 
> asked similar a week or so ago...:thumb:


To add to that, the proper answer is that progress isn't at a specific weight. Intermediate is when basic linear progression ceases to cause disruption and so progession. On SS you lift until you stall. You then reset, and go 80% squat on the middle day. You will then stall again. At this point you may move to another routine or try another cycle. If you think there's progress to be made, a reset and linear progression will progress faster than any intermediate programme. 531 will progress slower so why rush to change to it? The answer to that I think is where life gets in the way of what the business end of noice linear progression requires in time and recovery. I put my weights onto an excel chart (weight,time) and the waves of each cycle are clear. Seeing two of succesive waves peak at the same point was a deciding factor in me moving off SS even though my weights were poor. Plotting it like that may make it easier to keep track.


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> Thanks! :thumb:
> 
> Do you have a link for the weights I should be achieving before moving onto wendler?


Hi Jonny,

Its not an exact link but its on the SL site http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/

There is a section about moving on to madcow 1x5 etc...:thumb:

I moved to the 5/3/1 at these weigths/reps.

Deadlift 185kg X5
Squat 177.5kg X5
Bench 115kg X5

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Todays recovery session.

Went really well, i re injured myself with this weight doing only one rep about a month ago :thumb:

*DEADLIFT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 110KG X 5

SQUAT 110KG X 5

SQUAT 100KG-10-10-10-10-10*

:thumb:

Squat 60 kg & Deadlift 75kg to go until im back to were i was before the injury, so progress in the right direction :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> Thanks! :thumb:
> 
> Do you have a link for the weights I should be achieving before moving onto wendler?


Just to add to what everyone has added. I 2nd that there is no defined weight, its when things stop working for you. SL has reported people still squatting 3 times per week for 5x5 when their over 200kg. Most mere mortals wouldnt be able to handle this.

Rippletoe did release a weight lifting standards PDF. Do a search for it but dont take it as gospel, it is just a guide.

Quick Extract.
Intermediate at 100kg
Squat - 137kg
Deadlift - 159.5
Bench - 102kg

Advanced at 100kg
Squat - 186kg
Deadlift - 218kg
Bench - 139kg

Honestly Im on 5/3/1 at the moment and all my lifts are over the Intermediate level but I dont think 5/3/1 provides enough stimulus in its normal format so I'm doing the opposite format so I hit each exercise more than once a week.


----------



## Guest

I always thought that 5/3/1 was an advanced program. I sure even Wendler says that you should have been lifting for several years before you are ready for it.

Having said that, the type of program you need for optimal strength gains is dependant on your ability to recover. 
Moving to a more advanced program too early won't do you any harm, it will just mean that your strength gains will not be as quick as perhaps they could have been.
This is not necessarily a bad thing. Training with heavy weights is hard - very hard. Hard on the body and hard on the mind. A program offering a gentler rate of progression can, I believe, help make it less taxing.


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> I always thought that 5/3/1 was an advanced program. I sure even Wendler says that you should have been lifting for several years before you are ready for it.
> 
> Having said that, the type of program you need for optimal strength gains is dependant on your ability to recover.
> Moving to a more advanced program too early won't do you any harm, it will just mean that your strength gains will not be as quick as perhaps they could have been.
> This is not necessarily a bad thing. Training with heavy weights is hard - very hard. Hard on the body and hard on the mind. A program offering a gentler rate of progression can, I believe, help make it less taxing.


Some times it can be bad to move to an advanced program to soon as people lifting 2x Body weight need longer to recover and their programs take account for this. When your a beginner you dont need as long to recover hence the squattin3 times per week in SS and SL. In advanced programs sometimes there can be to long between exercises to provoke any gains. See it every day in the gym, the beginner doing a 5 day per week split and hitting each body part once per week and not making the gains they should.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) 85x3, 97.5x3, 110x5
Pendlay Rows: 47.5x5x10
Dips: BW x 8,8,8,8,8 Total 40

I got the 5 reps on Bench press and didnt feel exhausted after the set but it wasnt pretty. I said this about the Juggernaut Program as well, I think Benching once every 8 days isnt really enough for someone of my level. We will see in a few weeks though.

Pendlay Rows feel weird being so light but with 90 seconds rest they are actually harder than you think as the short rest periods catch up with you pretty fast. Also as Im not using 20s yet the bar is lower than normal and therefore Im in an unusual position.

I got 1 more rep this week so happy with this. 40 reps in 5 sets with only 90 seconds rest isnt to bad especially after already doing bench press. I think 100 reps is a nice goal to aim for but its in no way a priority.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Jesus I feel sore!

Started back at rugby last night, went for a 3 mile run before rugby and we also did fitness at the end!

It's funny how your body gets use to impact, my body isn't use to it after 9 months out! On the plus side, I felt massively stronger, especially in the quads!

Wednesday workout tonight, although i'm feeling tired, i'm ready to smash it! Oh wait...it's OHP tonight


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> Jesus I feel sore!
> 
> Started back at rugby last night, went for a 3 mile run before rugby and we also did fitness at the end!
> 
> It's funny how your body gets use to impact, my body isn't use to it after 9 months out! On the plus side, I felt massively stronger, especially in the quads!
> 
> Wednesday workout tonight, although i'm feeling tired, i'm ready to smash it! Oh wait...it's OHP tonight


Good to hear theres another Rugby Player in this Thread.

Strength is huge in Rugby, I talked about it in here before how important I think it is. I started training a winger and he went from 3rd team to 1st team in a matter of months. I didnt work on skills with him, just sprinting, interval training, weight lifting and putting nearly 2 stone on him didnt hurt either.


----------



## Oats

jonnyMercUK said:


> Jesus I feel sore!
> 
> Started back at rugby last night, went for a 3 mile run before rugby and we also did fitness at the end!
> 
> It's funny how your body gets use to impact, my body isn't use to it after 9 months out! On the plus side, I felt massively stronger, especially in the quads!


Following on from your previous concerns, did anyone comment on how you looked less 'toned\ripped'?


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Following on from your previous concerns, did anyone comment on how you looked less 'tonedripped'?


No Rugby player I ever met would comment on how ripped another player is :doublesho Your getting us confused with Puffballers where they compliment each others on how nice their new highlighted hair looks :lol:.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> No Rugby player I ever met would comment on how ripped another player is :doublesho Your getting us confused with Puffballers where they compliment each others on how nice their new highlighted hair looks :lol:.


Lawn Fairies!  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Following on from your previous concerns, did anyone comment on how you looked less 'tonedripped'?


Yep, we all said, be patient ffs!!!


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> No Rugby player I ever met would comment on how ripped another player is :doublesho Your getting us confused with Puffballers where they compliment each others on how nice their new highlighted hair looks :lol:.


:lol:


----------



## sfstu

friday workout...

*squat 107.5kg
OHP 48kg
deadlift 110kg*

all went ok but.... 
dunno, just feel i'm struggling on too many exercises and not making the progress i should of by now...:wall: i suppose i'm just feeling a little negative about it all today, (although at least i did actually do my workout and made the weights, albeit only just...)


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> friday workout...
> 
> *squat 107.5kg
> OHP 48kg
> deadlift 110kg*
> 
> all went ok but....
> dunno, just feel i'm struggling on too many exercises and not making the progress i should of by now...:wall: i suppose i'm just feeling a little negative about it all today, (although at least i did actually do my workout and made the weights, albeit only just...)


That's a good workout Stu, stop being so hard on yourself 

We are all different & you may just need some extra time, this is very normal mate. In fact if you get into a mind-set of not rushing you'll just enjoy the ride & get to your goals soon enough :thumb:

Look at what you've achieved so far :thumb:

*Try not to compare with others & do as I do, set your own pace & progression :thumb:*


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays 5/3/1

Weights felt too light but im going to follow progress as outlined by the book :thumb:

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 38KGX5 44KGX5 50KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 37.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT-7-7-7-7-7

BARBELL CURL 37.5KGX-10-10-10-10-10*

All good, cant wait to be using some real weight :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Evening all! 

Sorry been rather in active this week, i've been enjoying some AL.

Not done my session today as i'm playing rugby tomorrow, did a good circuit session last night at training so want to be fresh for tomorrow.

Will be doing a workout on Sunday.

I must say it does feel good being fitter and stronger, it makes such a difference whilst playing ruggers. I've not weighed myself recently but 2 stone of muscle (not water!) I wouldn't mind!


----------



## Mark Chandler

I just wanted to thank Doug, http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/member.php?u=39160 for sending me over a load of info off line and his very useful advise.

Started on the 5/3/1 at the start of the week, already starting to feel a little progress :thumb:

Also joint ache is down so double bonus.

regards Mark


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mark Chandler said:


> I just wanted to thank Doug, http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/member.php?u=39160 for sending me over a load of info off line and his very useful advise.
> 
> Started on the 5/3/1 at the start of the week, already starting to feel a little progress :thumb:
> 
> Also joint ache is down so double bonus.
> 
> regards Mark


My pleasure Mark :thumb:

I used the 1X5 to get my weights up to a very good level, but as Mark says your joints can ache a little more than they should when going heavy for many months.

The 5/3/1 is an ideal way to progress in a way that allows you to lift heavy for longer.
IMHO health & fitness is as important as being able to lift heavy :thumb:

The 5/3/1 works on a 5 & 10 lb (2.5 & 4.5kg) increase on the main lifts which you then calculate your training weigths from. I round up the figures so im adding 3-4kg per month on my main lifts. That's equals to an approx... 30kg increase for me in 12 months on my bench press. A 150kg bench press in 12 months, YES PLEASE! :thumb: That IMHO is fast enough progress for anyone regardless of age. And in the meantime the 10 rep assistance work will add muscle mass to help you burn more calories & body fat :thumb:

Just to clarify - although im rounding up the figures at the moment, I may find I will have to revert to being more exact once i get to my max training weights :thumb:

Life is balance!

Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

20 minutes on the old airwalker - medium cardio - keeping in time with 120BPM-130 BPM toons!


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout (Done Saturday)
Im not doing Jack S**t Workout
Squats: WU 57.5x5, 72.5x5, 85x3, (WO 100x3, 115x3, 127.5x5) PM 148.5

Thats it, had to go out and had my mate waiting so just smashed my squats quickly and got out of there. Kept the safeties 1 notch lower like I did on my 5x10 and its better as I never touch them that sometime puts you off.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout (Done Saturday)
> Im not doing Jack S**t Workout
> Squats: WU 57.5x5, 72.5x5, 85x3, (WO 100x3, 115x3, 127.5x5) PM 148.5


James, the above implies you are doing two sets of 3 reps followed by one set of 5 reps on your work sets , which 5/3/1 pdf is this from mate?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Quick recovery session.

*SQUAT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 115KG X 5

DEADLIFT 115KG X 5*

All felt easy & good :thumb:

Time for a BBQ :devil:.....again


----------



## Christianmp

Saturday workout: 
Spent most of the day in bed, drinking coffee watching TV and eating cookies. Kept on postphoning my workout. 
Finally decided to get up and get moving. Had an awesome workout.
Squats: 90kg 5x5
OHP: 55kg 5x5
Deadlift: 135kg 1x5.

Today: DOMS all over.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Feel like I've hit a brick wall today!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, the above implies you are doing two sets of 3 reps followed by one set of 5 reps on your work sets , which 5/3/1 pdf is this from mate?


Doug this is standard 5/3/1. I'm on week 2 which is 3,3,3+. As the last set is as many reps as possible I got 5. At the moment its working out to 7,5,3 on my amap sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug this is standard 5/3/1. I'm on week 2 which is 3,3,3+. As the last set is as many reps as possible I got 5. At the moment its working out to 7,5,3 on my amap sets.


lol, im too lazy, i just stick to the predefined reps


----------



## jonnyMercUK

I honestly gave it all I had to give today! Do I try again on the same weight or do we think that is it for strong lifts?


----------



## Guest

jonnyMercUK said:


> I honestly gave it all I had to give today! Do I try again on the same weight or do we think that is it for strong lifts?


Repeat at the same weight :thumb:

Ok, that is assuming you've not stalled at that weight before. Could you post a log of the session?

In terms of switch to a different program due to exhausting the gains you can acheive on SL, you are looking at in excess of 1.5xBW on the squat. It varies from person to person and is more to do with your body's ability to recover.

In general the process is:
Stall 3 times in a row and you deload by 10%. 
Carry on as normal from deloaded weight until you fail again (i.e. 3 stalls in a row).
After the 2nd deload, drop from 5x5 to 3x5.
Eventually, you'll fail on 3x5 as above. At this point drop to 1x5 or switch to a different routine.

There are other options, but that is what the SL program prescribes.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Nice one phil! 

Was the first time I have stalled. Ill go again on Friday and post an update. 

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> I honestly gave it all I had to give today! Do I try again on the same weight or do we think that is it for strong lifts?


We all have bad days mate, keep at it, you will grow stronger if you want it bad enough :thumb:

:devil:HATE THE WEIGHTS:devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Third month, week 3 of the 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 87.5KGX3 100KGX3 112.5KGX3

BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL ROW 70KG-10-10-10-10-10.*

Tried the Barbell row without my belt for first time & the weight felt way too light, i think wearing a belt at this light weight is restricting me in some way 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 30x5, 35x3) 40x3, 45x3, 52.5x6
Dips: BWx3, BWx3, BW+15x8
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 8x2

Was only aiming for 5reps on Shoulder Press but warm ups felt the best they ever have so I pushed it a little harder and did 1 more. That is the great aspect to 5/3/1, when you have a good day you push it and when your having a bad day you can back off without feeling bad that you missed your reps.

Dips hurt my shoulder when I first started them and I have read a number of articles that show that dips can be bad depending on your shoulder joint structure but they are feeling great. I think adding weight makes them slightly easier in a strange way as it stops you swaying so much which means you can put full power into the dips.

Im working up to 10 sets of chin ups and do these between all my exercises. I feel my Chin Ups improve more with high sets, low intensity than all out sets.



ITHAQVA said:


> lol, im too lazy, i just stick to the predefined reps


Done a great deal of reading on 5/3/1 and it seems that the lower % of your 1RM you start on the longer you will progress for so some of my weights I actually set at 85% so I can get slightly higher reps and not smash myself into the floor in the first few weeks. Must say I was slightly underwhelmed by the program in week 1 as it didnt seem enogh work but the weights were easy week 2 so its obviously working. Loving free squats as well, can really see the weight increasing now I changed to these.

Doug, your doing only the prescribed reps so you can concentrate in the 10 rep sets arent you?


----------



## Christianmp

Bod42 said:


> Im working up to 10 sets of chin ups and do these between all my exercises. I feel my Chin Ups improve more with high sets, low intensity than all out sets.


I'm having a great time doing high sets as well. Been doing chin and pull-ups at work throughout the day. reps ranges around 4-8. I do whatever feels good and the other day I smashed out 10 chin-ups with ease ([email protected]). Have done it several times now, so it might be time to start adding weight.

Kicked myself of the sofa yesterday and went for a quick session in the gym:
Squats: 93kg 5x5
Pendlay row: 60kg 5x5 (still not comfortable with this)
One-arm DB row: 26kg 5x6
Dips: 10/10/10.
SO MANY people in the gym so did not have time (couldn't be arsed to wait) to benchpress. Think I'm doing a BP session tonight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Done a great deal of reading on 5/3/1 and it seems that the lower % of your 1RM you start on the longer you will progress for so some of my weights I actually set at 85% so I can get slightly higher reps and not smash myself into the floor in the first few weeks. Must say I was slightly underwhelmed by the program in week 1 as it didnt seem enogh work but the weights were easy week 2 so its obviously working. Loving free squats as well, can really see the weight increasing now I changed to these.
> 
> Doug, your doing only the prescribed reps so you can concentrate in the 10 rep sets arent you?


I think I started at 90% so I could reach my goals quicker 

I have found with powerlifting & strength training in the past that training to failure or with a little too much intensity slows my progress, hence the rep deload method I used when on my 1x5 phase after increasing the weight. And it is also partly because I want to concentrate on my BBB 10 rep sets on building some extra muscle mass to help with fat burning & the 3 x a week cardio will hopefully give my fitness balance, rather than just being strong but out of shape (which I found doing the 1X5).

If you feel underwhelmed by the 5/3/1 it's probably because your weights are so light they aren't challenging you…yet. I felt the same at the beginning but as the weights build up the workout will feel worthwhile, stick with it mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> I'm having a great time doing high sets as well. Been doing chin and pull-ups at work throughout the day. reps ranges around 4-8. I do whatever feels good and the other day I smashed out 10 chin-ups with ease ([email protected]). Have done it several times now, so it might be time to start adding weight.


Its strange I still read that we should only hit each body part once per week and only for a set number of sets but then you watch what athletes do to become the best at their sport. They sometimes train upto 8 hours a day, 6 days per week and Olympic weight lifters also do this, training well below failure but for hours on end.

This definitely seems a very good way of building chin ups and I know Elitefts say it works really well for Dips as well but personally I have never tried it.



ITHAQVA said:


> I think I started at 90% so I could reach my goals quicker
> 
> I have found with powerlifting & strength training in the past that training to failure or with a little too much intensity slows my progress, hence the rep deload method I used when on my 1x5 phase after increasing the weight. And it is also partly because I want to concentrate on my BBB 10 rep sets on building some extra muscle mass to help with fat burning & the 3 x a week cardio will hopefully give my fitness balance, rather than just being strong but out of shape (which I found doing the 1X5).
> 
> If you feel underwhelmed by the 5/3/1 it's probably because your weights are so light they aren't challenging you…yet. I felt the same at the beginning but as the weights build up the workout will feel worthwhile, stick with it mate :thumb:


Im doing more than 5/3/1 but Im no where near failure, Im normally 2 reps short I would say, maybe more if I really wanted it. I agree that I seem to progress better if I'm below failure and not destroying my body everytime I enter the gym. Ya I think the 5 sets of 10 at my goal of 100kg with only 90secs rest will be an absolute killer.


----------



## Christianmp

When did you guys switch from 5x5 to 5/3/1? I like the idea of Wendlers programme wiith 4 days one for each major lift. 
But still feel that the weights I'm pushing on 5x5 could/should increase a bit.

Current max: 
DL: 135kg 5reps
Squat: 100kg 5reps
OHP: 55kg 5 reps
BB row: 75-ishkg 5 reps
BP: 77,5kg 5 reps.
@ BW 78-80kg fairly lean 9-11% BF. (guestimated)

BP is the one I'm having most trouble with. Loving the OHP.


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> When did you guys switch from 5x5 to 5/3/1? I like the idea of Wendlers programme wiith 4 days one for each major lift.
> But still feel that the weights I'm pushing on 5x5 could/should increase a bit.
> 
> Current max:
> DL: 135kg 5reps
> Squat: 100kg 5reps
> OHP: 55kg 5 reps
> BB row: 75-ishkg 5 reps
> BP: 77,5kg 5 reps.
> @ BW 78-80kg fairly lean 9-11% BF. (guestimated)
> 
> BP is the one I'm having most trouble with. Loving the OHP.


There is no set weight its when ever you stop making progress. As stated on the SL website, do not change workouts just because you are bored or tempted by the new wonder program, if your program is still working then stay on it.

Personally I worked though the SL suggestions. 5x5, 3 deloads, 3x5, 3 deloads, 1x5, 3 deloads, Intermediate program (I did madcow) and then advanced program.

Your going to make the best gains on a beginner program so dont be to keen to jump programs to early. I probably switched to 5/3/1 slightly early but I'm doing the opposite program where you squat 5x10 on deadlift day and deadlift 5x10 on squat day.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session. Couldnt resist so i put it up to a 130 work set weight 

*DEADLIFT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 130KG X 5

SQUAT 130KG X 5

SQUAT 100KG-10-10-10-10-10

STANDING CALF RAISE 130KG-10-10-10-10-10*

All felt safe, no pain or the feeling of a presence of the injury :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

@ Doug: I must say I'm impressed with your "assistance" squats. 5x10 100kg Squats! I'm still having trouble with my measly 5x5 @ ~90kg.


Went to the gym yesterday and did some very light weights.
Deadlifts @ 17kg
Rows @ 17kg
Bench @ 7kg 
OHP @ 7kg. 
Only thing missing was squats (racks occupied)

So, why would I do that? 
Introducing barbell training for my sister. And she loved it. She quickly adapted to the technique and did the lifts with proper form, with the deadlifts looking very good. Of course its only VERY light weight to start with, but it looks promising. Can't wait to guide her next time, following the SL 5x5 template.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> @ Doug: I must say I'm impressed with your "assistance" squats. 5x10 100kg Squats! I'm still having trouble with my measly 5x5 @ ~90kg.
> 
> Went to the gym yesterday and did some very light weights.
> Deadlifts @ 17kg
> Rows @ 17kg
> Bench @ 7kg
> OHP @ 7kg.
> Only thing missing was squats (racks occupied)
> 
> So, why would I do that?
> Introducing barbell training for my sister. And she loved it. She quickly adapted to the technique and did the lifts with proper form, with the deadlifts looking very good. Of course its only VERY light weight to start with, but it looks promising. Can't wait to guide her next time, following the SL 5x5 template.


Thanks Christian :thumb: One thing I've noticed, the heavier the work set becomes the lighter the assistance set feels, at present it feels like I've got around 40kg on my back. I think as you grow stronger your perception of "heavy" grows with it.

90kg isn't measly either it's the same as your body weight if I recall, I have a higher percentage of body fat & I weight 108kg, James is better at explaining this but it's something along the lines of my extra body weight & muscle mass giving me an advantage over a leaner guy. I've put on 11kg during the first 11 months of powerlifting.

Nice one getting ya sis involved, good idea starting with sensible light weights too :thumb:

SL 5X5 is an excellent way to start :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Good session today!

Squat 110KG 5x5x5x5x5 (I did the same as Monday and it felt good, I can go up on Friday  )
Overhead Press 40KG 5x5x5x5 (Since I have gone from seated to standing I had to reduce the weight, but getting there.)
Deadlift 130KG (Smashed it!)
Chins BW until failure 5x5x5 (Feel so much stronger on these!)
Dips BW until failure 5x5x5
Abs 3x1 min plank, 12x12x12 crunches

DONE


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> @ Doug: I must say I'm impressed with your "assistance" squats. 5x10 100kg Squats! I'm still having trouble with my measly 5x5 @ ~90kg.
> 
> Went to the gym yesterday and did some very light weights.
> Deadlifts @ 17kg
> Rows @ 17kg
> Bench @ 7kg
> OHP @ 7kg.
> Only thing missing was squats (racks occupied)
> 
> So, why would I do that?
> Introducing barbell training for my sister. And she loved it. She quickly adapted to the technique and did the lifts with proper form, with the deadlifts looking very good. Of course its only VERY light weight to start with, but it looks promising. Can't wait to guide her next time, following the SL 5x5 template.


Nice work getting your sister involved. I was having this discussion at a party at the weekend about how women and men should train as they thought they should train differently and the age old sasying of "But I dont want to get big and muscly". My view is were all humans, we have the same organs, muscles, etc so why would we train differently.

The only difference that I have found is that women can do more reps at a set % e.g. most guys will get around 3 reps at 90% but women will get 5-6. Obviously this is a generalization and shouldnt be taken as gospel.










I actually commented on Doug's 100kg for 50 reps for assistance a few days ago as well as I think this is 1 mean accomplishment.



ITHAQVA said:


> 90kg isn't measly either it's the same as your body weight if I recall, I have a higher percentage of body fat & I weight 108kg, James is better at explaining this but it's something along the lines of my extra body weight & muscle mass giving me an advantage over a leaner guy. I've put on 11kg during the first 11 months of powerlifting.


I wouldnt say I can explain it better but I will give it ago. When comparing weights lifted you should always convert them into a ratio of your BW as this is the fairest way to get a decent comparison. When I trained Rugby players the record board did have overall weight but it also had a BW ratio as well. Why would it be fair for some 19-20 stone prop to be competeing against a 12-13 stone winger for absolute strength. By leveling the playing field it enabled every one to compete against each other. Much like the handicap system in Golf.

Anyway on to the weight = strength issue. Being heavier does have its physical advantages like you have more mass round your joints, your muscles are bigger so have more potential for strength, you have a shorter ROM in exercises like the Bench Press, etc. But I dont think its so much the overall BW that makes the real difference, its your diet and calorie surplus that is the key factor. You must have a calorie surplus to build muscle and strength and the guys who are heavier have obviously eaten more and been in a calorie surplus to get to that weight. Take Doug and I for a real life example, he has put on 11kg in 11 months and I have lost a few kg's but just look how Doug's progress smashes mine, he is at some incredible weights and I have been treading water and in some cases going backwards. I have not given my body the energy it requires to build muscle and strength. And you got to remember Doug is an old bugger too :thumb:

You actually have more chance of getting a higher BW ratio the lighter you are but a higher chance of lifting heavier weights the heavier you are. (Badly written but hope that makes sense). E.g. Lamar Gant Deadlifted 688lb in the 132lb class :doublesho BW ratio of 1:5.21 :doublesho:doublesho Ed Coan Deadlifted 900lb at 219lb BW ratio of 1:4.11. As you can see Ed has lifted 212lb more than Gant but Gant is the stronger guy. Ed would actually have to lift 1,141lb to equel Gant's strength.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Crap Workout:
Deadlifts: (WU 67.5x5, 85x5, 100x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 150x1 :doublesho bloody 1.
Squats: 62.5x5x10 90 seconds rest.
Abs.

Last week I did 142.5 for 5 hard reps and thought this was utter crap and tonight I was aiming for what should have been an easy 3 and got 1. Still cant believe it. I know I had the most stress ever in my life and havent been eating very much but this is still useless. My upper body is still progressing but my lower body progress sucks. For comparison I lifted 150kg for 5 reps in January, a few months after starting. That means in 10 months I have gone backwards, crap. I also got 160kg for 5 reps in April. I have only been on 5/3/1 for 2 weeks so not long enough to tell but I may have to deload my deadlift.

As a bonus squats went well. The 90 seconds rest is a real killer, your legs are so pumped by the 4th set it makes them more a mental exercise than strength as you have to push through the burn. Only 37.5kg to hit my goal. I think eventually I could hit 5x10 with 100kg squats but the 90 seconds rest is going to be the killer part. If my plan goes well I should be hitting 80kg for 5 sets of 10 before christmas which I will be happy with considering I changed to free squats and had to work my way back up.

Edit: Oops just checked my workout and I'm suppose to be rested 2 mins between lower body assiatance exercises and 90 seconds between upper body. I had a better workout than I thought then.


----------



## Christianmp

Bod42 said:


> Nice work getting your sister involved.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You actually have more chance of getting a higher BW ratio the lighter you are but a higher chance of lifting heavier weights the heavier you are. (Badly written but hope that makes sense). E.g. Lamar Gant Deadlifted 688lb in the 132lb class :doublesho BW ratio of 1:5.21 :doublesho:doublesho Ed Coan Deadlifted 900lb at 219lb BW ratio of 1:4.11. As you can see Ed has lifted 212lb more than Gant but Gant is the stronger guy. Ed would actually have to lift 1,141lb to equel Gant's strength.


I actually showed my sister (and brother in law) the exact same picture. And he thought that the squat-behind wasn't flattering :doublesho WTF?!

Different guy, different taste. I'm just hoping that she will get hooked, stick to the program and enjoy the progress she undoubtedly will have, as she haven't lifted anything before.

The BW to lifting weight ratio's make perfect sense and I clearly understand what you say.

Had a great workout yesterday. Felt tired and exhausted but went anyways. 
Squats (2min rest): 95x5x5
OHP: 57,5x5x3 (had to push press last 2 reps, 56kg x2, 50x5x2.
Deadlift: 60x10, 90x5, 120x3 142,7x3 (last increment was 2x25lbs, no 10kg plates).

I am still messing around with leangains approach IF, doing a cut, so the body might not be getting the optimal amount of fuel, but damn it I want those abs to show.

Once I'm satisfied and lean (and the WO weight stalls) I'm converting to a light bulk to build some (extra)muscle.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> BP is the one I'm having most trouble with. Loving the OHP.


Christian,
Have you looked at the technique that powerlifters use as opposed to bodybuilders?

Sorry to the rest of the guys for this repost :thumb:











Ignore the guy in the red & his tiny calves, i mean WTF!!!!! (Jack em up with heavy 10 rep standing calf raises as a nice finisher to your leg routine) :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Edit: Oops just checked my workout and I'm suppose to be rested 2 mins between lower body assiatance exercises and 90 seconds between upper body. I had a better workout than I thought then.


I take around 2 minutes rest for all my 5X10 rep assistance sets as I'll get my fitness from the 3X week medium cardio sessions :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I actually commented on Doug's 100kg for 50 reps for assistance a few days ago as well as I think this is 1 mean accomplishment.
> 
> And you got to remember Doug is an old bugger too :thumb:
> 
> *GIT!! :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:*


*^^^^^^ No contest the squat ass is the only way to go :argie::argie: :devil::devil:*
And as I've said before if I can do it, I expect you young guys to do it no excuses, now go hate those weights!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::thumb:

I'm not sure if this makes any difference or is of any use as it may be considered a little unorthodox. But when training as a young man I used to train arms powerlifting style (1-4 rep range, all barbell work) with plenty of focus on getting the triceps as strong as possible.

*My version of a true close grip bench press * :devil:

Put both hands in the middle of the bar touching. To execute make sure your elbows are out as though you were going to perform a bodybuilding style bench press, focus on squeezing the triceps together until you reached full extension, as you execute the movement let your elbows go where it feels right for you, but try your best to stop the elbows going down & too close to your sides (opposite to the standard close grip bench). The pecs & shoulders will also come into play but you must concentrate on triceps forcing your arms together as you execute the lift (something you can't do very well with a free weight barbell, due to the hands being so close together, you lose most of the control/balance & the barbell will rock & cause possible injury etc.. This method of triceps work allowed me to do dips with bodyweight (95Kg) plus 40kg, also helped me do the Bench press & my version of the close grip bench press 180kg X 4. It was on a machine so I feel it doesn't count as a free weight total does, machine work is so much easier, but it did feel heavy at the time :devil:

If you have access to a machine that allows this assistance exercise (I'm sure a conventional smith machine would allow this exercise to be carried out, try it. Don't worry about the lack of stabilizer involvement this is all about max weight in one line of movement & making the triceps grow strong.

James, have you thought of just training for strength only for a few months to get past your sticking point with a 1X5 routine? :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> I actually showed my sister (and brother in law) the exact same picture. And he thought that the squat-behind wasn't flattering :doublesho WTF?!
> 
> Different guy, different taste. I'm just hoping that she will get hooked, stick to the program and enjoy the progress she undoubtedly will have, as she haven't lifted anything before.


Wasn't Flattering:doublesho If I showed that to one of my mates and he said that I would be careful turning my back on him :doublesho:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> *^^^^^^ No contest the squat ass is the only way to go :argie::argie: :devil::devil:*
> And as I've said before if I can do it, I expect you young guys to do it no excuses, now go hate those weights!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil::thumb:
> 
> I'm not sure if this makes any difference or is of any use as it may be considered a little unorthodox. But when training as a young man I used to train arms powerlifting style (1-4 rep range, all barbell work) with plenty of focus on getting the triceps as strong as possible.
> 
> *My version of a true close grip bench press * :devil:
> 
> Put both hands in the middle of the bar touching. To execute make sure your elbows are out as though you were going to perform a bodybuilding style bench press, focus on squeezing the triceps together until you reached full extension, as you execute the movement let your elbows go where it feels right for you, but try your best to stop the elbows going down & too close to your sides (opposite to the standard close grip bench). The pecs & shoulders will also come into play but you must concentrate on triceps forcing your arms together as you execute the lift (something you can't do very well with a free weight barbell, due to the hands being so close together, you lose most of the control/balance & the barbell will rock & cause possible injury etc.. This method of triceps work allowed me to do dips with bodyweight (95Kg) plus 40kg, also helped me do the Bench press & my version of the close grip bench press 180kg X 4. It was on a machine so I feel it doesn't count as a free weight total does, machine work is so much easier, but it did feel heavy at the time :devil:
> 
> If you have access to a machine that allows this assistance exercise (I'm sure a conventional smith machine would allow this exercise to be carried out, try it. Don't worry about the lack of stabilizer involvement this is all about max weight in one line of movement & making the triceps grow strong.
> 
> James, have you thought of just training for strength only for a few months to get past your sticking point with a 1X5 routine? :thumb:


My chest and shoulder strength sucks, I put my Bench Press which used to be around the 140kg mark down to tricep strength. I did what you said Doug but I use an EZ Bar, this way your wrists are aligned pointing ooutwards and it took all the stress off my wrists and allowed me to lift more. Skull crushers are my exercise of choice for putting slabs of muscle on your arms, with really training them my record is 45kg for 30 reps.

You do love your 1x5 dont you :thumb:. 5/3/1 is very similar to 1x5 as the first 2 sets dont really tired you out. Im making good progress on everything but Deadlifts. I think its due to me keep ****ing around with form to much. Im going to stick with 5/3/1 for at least 3 months if not 6 and give it a proper trial. Im under a hugh amount of stress right now so Im appy Im making any progress, we shall see how bench goes tonight, got 117.5x3 and I got 120x4 not long ago so it should be quite easy, Im hoping


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wasn't Flattering:doublesho If I showed that to one of my mates and he said that I would be careful turning my back on him :doublesho:thumb:


I wouldn't turn my back on any guy who preferred the "No squats" pic, defo ****! :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> My chest and shoulder strength sucks, I put my Bench Press which used to be around the 140kg mark down to tricep strength. I did what you said Doug but I use an EZ Bar, this way your wrists are aligned pointing ooutwards and it took all the stress off my wrists and allowed me to lift more. Skull crushers are my exercise of choice for putting slabs of muscle on your arms, with really training them my record is 45kg for 30 reps.
> 
> You do love your 1x5 dont you :thumb:. 5/3/1 is very similar to 1x5 as the first 2 sets dont really tired you out. Im making good progress on everything but Deadlifts. I think its due to me keep ****ing around with form to much. Im going to stick with 5/3/1 for at least 3 months if not 6 and give it a proper trial. Im under a hugh amount of stress right now so Im appy Im making any progress, we shall see how bench goes tonight, got 117.5x3 and I got 120x4 not long ago so it should be quite easy, Im hoping


You could also try the 4th powerlift:

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/platform_the_lying_triceps_extension

:thumb:

1X5, me love......never 

Good idea with the EZ bar :thumb: much kinder to the wrists, mine is too short to be of any safe use in the power rack though.

Best of luck on the bench tonight James, hate the weights!!!!!!! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Good idea with the EZ bar :thumb: much kinder to the wrists, mine is too short to be of any safe use in the power rack though.


SAFE, pppffft call yourself a power lifter :thumb:



ITHAQVA said:


> I wouldn't turn my back on any guy who preferred the "No squats" pic, defo ****! :doublesho


Thats what I was hinting at while trying not to be to blunt and outright calling him a **** :lol:

Ask him about this one, if he's still not keen, Doug was definitely right.


__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content










Friday Night Workout:
Med Ball Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 92.5x5, 105x3, 117.5x3 PM 129KG
Pendlay Rows: 50x5x10
Dips: BW x 8,8,8,8,7 Total 39

Got the 3 reps I was aiming for but they were pretty ugly, slow and moved backwards towards the rack quite abit. My brain tells me to deload but I think my problem is I deload to bloody much, I'm will just keep going until I cant get 1 rep on the 1 week then I will deload. I quite please with 3 reps but theres no way I could have got 4 so its actually less than the 120kg for 4 I did a few weeks back but that was on a 16 week program.

These high rep low rest Pendlay Rows are hitting different muscles than heavy rows. There not hitting my lats so much but my rear delts which isnt a bad thing.

Dissappointed not to increase my dips. One workout during Juggernaut I somehow got 8,8,8,8,15. Not quite sure where the 15 reps came from but thats a good aim.


----------



## Christianmp

I don't know what's wrong with him. Thought it was too bulky :doublesho
Just smile and wave, then ignore.

Anyways, I'm having his girlfriend (my sister) doing squats and DL's hopefully building her a firm behind. He won't be disappointed I'm sure. 

I'm close to convince some of the girls at work to implement heavy weights and squats, instead of the barbie-weight-workouts they currently do.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> SAFE, pppffft call yourself a power lifter :thumb:
> 
> Thats what I was hinting at while trying not to be to blunt and outright calling him a **** :lol:
> 
> Ask him about this one, if he's still not keen, Doug was definitely right.
> 
> 
> __
> Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
> Show Content
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Friday Night Workout:
> Med Ball Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 92.5x5, 105x3, 117.5x3 PM 129KG
> Pendlay Rows: 50x5x10
> Dips: BW x 8,8,8,8,7 Total 39
> 
> Got the 3 reps I was aiming for but they were pretty ugly, slow and moved backwards towards the rack quite abit. My brain tells me to deload but I think my problem is I deload to bloody much, I'm will just keep going until I cant get 1 rep on the 1 week then I will deload. I quite please with 3 reps but theres no way I could have got 4 so its actually less than the 120kg for 4 I did a few weeks back but that was on a 16 week program.
> 
> These high rep low rest Pendlay Rows are hitting different muscles than heavy rows. There not hitting my lats so much but my rear delts which isnt a bad thing.
> 
> Dissappointed not to increase my dips. One workout during Juggernaut I somehow got 8,8,8,8,15. Not quite sure where the 15 reps came from but thats a good aim.


Deadliftz & Squatz for me :argie::argie::argie:

Why are you doing med ball throws before your bench James? 

I do my dips on my OHP/arm day so there is plenty left in the tank :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 week 2 Cycle 3

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 41KGX3 47KGX3 53KGX3

OVERHEAD PRESS 37.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT-8-8-8-8-8

BARBELL CURL  37.5KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Still Sticking to the program even though the weights feel a bit too light at the mo :thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 3 Week 4 - deload
*
Lower back still irritated from previous week. Got in to that vicious cycle of irritable back is tiring, and when I'm tired my back's more irritable. So no hill sprints. Two full body sessions at 80% and McGills 'Big 3' static holds for lower back on the non lifting days. 
*
Cycle 4 Week 1 - 5 reps min*
Sh Press - 5
Deadlift - 7
Bench - 6
Squat - 6

Bit run down all week and sore all week . For example on the deadlift I switched to a mixed grip at 4 reps because I couldn't hold on to it. That was at 117.5kg and the previous week I pulled 125kg for 10. Got stomach bug off kids at end of this week. Tonight it would have been easy to postpone but I knew that once I got going it'd be easier than I thoguht it would. Nice doing 5\3\1 as well - told myself all I had to do was warm up then stick my **** in the air 5 times and the session was a good one. And, low and behold, I even carried on through to doing the assistance work (albeit a few kg lighter).

Overhauled shoulder press form. Moved my grip in about 4 inches and I think it's much better. Bench is still clueless even with referring to the book and DVD.

Noticed tonight that on 5\3\1 the weights you do for 3 reps become the weights for 5 reps in the next cycle, and max rep session becomes the 3 rep session. Kind of makes sense now!



Bod42 said:


> I wouldnt say I can explain it better but I will give it ago.


One of the few blogs I read had a piece on this a while back. Have a look a couple of entries down at "You Have The Power..."


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> *
> *
> Lower back still irritated from previous week. Got in to that vicious cycle of irritable back is tiring, and when I'm tired my back's more irritable. So no hill sprints.
> Bit run down all week and sore all week . For example on the deadlift I switched to a mixed grip at 4 reps because I couldn't hold on to it. That was at 117.5kg and the previous week I pulled 125kg for 10. Got stomach bug off kids at end of this week. Tonight it would have been easy to postpone but I knew that once I got going it'd be easier than I thoguht it would. Nice doing 531 as well - told myself all I had to do was warm up then stick my **** in the air 5 times and the session was a good one. And, low and behold, I even carried on through to doing the assistance work (albeit a few kg lighter).
> 
> Overhauled shoulder press form. Moved my grip in about 4 inches and I think it's much better. Bench is still clueless even with referring to the book and DVD.


Might be worth considering a week off from training Col :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Deadliftz & Squatz for me :argie::argie::argie:
> 
> Why are you doing med ball throws before your bench James?
> 
> I do my dips on my OHP/arm day so there is plenty left in the tank :thumb:


Med balls throws are just a power exercise for speed, wakes ur muscles up without tiring them out.

I do my heavy dips after OHP but do volume less rest dips after bench. I find by throwing both heavy and volume dips in my workout I can still push my bench up even when my shoulder is screwed


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Wtf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

Spent 4 hours on the racing tank today :detailer: You should see it shine!!! , i was a little too shagged out to do a full recovery session, but did the work sets :thumb:

*SQUAT (WU 5X40% - 5X50% - 3X60%) 150KG X 5 No belt

DEADLIFT 150KG X 5 with a belt*

:devil: Got myself all wound up with some aggressive cyber Goth/punk toons before each lift :devil:

*Squat:* un racked the weight & squatted, because the 4 rep wasn't deep enough I went back down again & added another rep, 5 good, 1 crap lol!

*Deadlift:* really got myself syced up grrrrrrr lol! I though this will be uncomfortable, but no, I was shocked how light it felt 

I'm still going to take it easy until I get to around 170 for both squat & deadlift, then move these lifts back into the 5/3/1 :thumb:

Perhapse the time off from lifting heavy has helped, it dont know


----------



## Christianmp

Saturdays WO:
Not feeling all that energized I went to the gym to (at least) help my sister on her lifts. First time squatting and it was terrible. But as we proceded she got the hang of it. She was not too fond of having the bar on the back and felt like tipping backwards all the time, which made her lift her heels from the ground. 
So I made her try out goblet squats and that was much better for her. So she is going to do them until she is comfortable and a bit more "loose" in her hip and ankles.

Didn't feel like doing squats, but sometimes you just have to suck it up. Loaded the bar with the desired weight and BLAM! nailed them. As Doug says, hate the weights.

Squats:97,5kg 5x5
Bench: 77kg 5x5
Pendlay: 65kg 5x5
Did some dips and pull-ups to "cool down".

Training was done in a fasted state. And it wasn't that bad compared to non-fasted.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Squats: (WU 60x5, 72.5x5, 85x3) WO 107.5x5, 120x3, 135x4 PM 153KG
Deadlifts: 75x5x10
Abs: Planks

Warm Ups felt heavy but the work set felt ok when walking it out. I love workouts like this, I was aiming for 3 reps and the 2nd rep was god aweful and a grinder so stopped at the top and really concentrated on form and smashed the 3rd rep so much that I went for the 4th rep and got that reasonably easy. I easily had 1 more in me if not 2.

Deadlifts: These are feeling a lot better than I thought they would and they really get your heart rate up while working your muscles hard. Im doing these touch and go style with double over hand grip and I got a real nice pump in my forearms.

Just did planks, 30 secs on, 15 seconds rest. Squeezing feet and elbows towards each other and sqeezing glutes as hard as you can to make the exercise a lot harder and more focused on the abs.



Christianmp said:


> She was not too fond of having the bar on the back and felt like tipping backwards all the time, which made her lift her heels from the ground.
> So I made her try out goblet squats and that was much better for her.


Lifting heels normally isnt so much a balance issue as it is a flexibility issue. Most people cant walk in the gym and have the flexibility to Squat and Deadlift. Deadlifts are simple, just raise the bar up and move it down every few months as your flexibility improves. Squats are abit more difficult unless you have an adjustable box or low solid box with hard rubber mats or something similar. Just my 2c worth but sounds like your doing well moving her to goblet squats as these hits the abs slightly harder anyway.


----------



## ITHAQVA

I have to disagree with you guys doing alternatives to Squats WTF?????  :devil: :wall::lol::lol:

You need to learn how the lift basically "feels" which takes time and then as you increase the weight it will feel different as your body naturally tries to find an easy way to get the weight up (bad form).

If you are constantly increasing your weight, "In any lift" you should be using that same lift as your primary exercise. If you are struggling then you are using too much weight. By making it easy for yourself you are actually making it harder to progress. 

If someone struggles doing squats with an empty Olympic bar, try body weight squats first, get the person used to squatting. Then try a light standard bar, then the Olympic bar. Ensure a good firm flat surface & if possible bare foot :thumb:

 Old man lecture over


----------



## Christianmp

Its always nice to get an old man lecture. 
I'm also having her doing BW-squats/air-squats. As she gets more flexible I'll get her doing barbell squats, right now I have to take baby-steps with her as she is easily scared regarding lifting weights. 

Got her to join fitocracy and I am happy to see she has joined a few groups, e.g. The "Starting strength"-group and the "No Barbieweights here"-group.

It is all promising. She called me yesterday and started complaining about DOMS all over. Ahh, the joy of starting out, and lifting heavy.

I am so psyched on tonights workout. First time I'm trying out 100kg squat for 5x5. Have only once tried it at 1x5. And I'm hoping to nail the deadlift at 140kg 1x5. Did 142.7kg 1x3 last time I deadlifted. Only one thing to do *cue Doug*.:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Its always nice to get an old man lecture.
> I'm also having her doing BW-squats/air-squats. As she gets more flexible I'll get her doing barbell squats, right now I have to take baby-steps with her as she is easily scared regarding lifting weights.
> 
> Got her to join fitocracy and I am happy to see she has joined a few groups, e.g. The "Starting strength"-group and the "No Barbieweights here"-group.
> 
> It is all promising. She called me yesterday and started complaining about DOMS all over. Ahh, the joy of starting out, and lifting heavy.
> 
> I am so psyched on tonights workout. First time I'm trying out 100kg squat for 5x5. Have only once tried it at 1x5. And I'm hoping to nail the deadlift at 140kg 1x5. Did 142.7kg 1x3 last time I deadlifted. Only one thing to do *cue Doug*.:devil:


Looks good Christian :thumb:

Oh & Hate the weights!!!!  :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Month 3 week 3 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 94KG X 5 106KG X 3 119KG X 1

BENCH PRESS 82.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

BARBELL ROW 72.5KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Good workout :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi guys, just thought i'd better say hello as not been on for a week or so due to laptop packing up... have been lurking though (via mobile)and everyone seems to be doing good...:thumb:
haven't been able to train either for last week due to life/work interfering again but planning to be back in the rack by midweek...:thumb: 
have been looking back over last few weeks of training log and can see my form wasn't too good and lifts were suffering and have been doing some thinking about focus (or lack of) so i'm planning to drop all weights by 10-15% and concentrate on form and trying to clear my mind a little training wise, and also to refocus as have so much going on outside of training at the mo...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi guys, just thought i'd better say hello as not been on for a week or so due to laptop packing up... have been lurking though (via mobile)and everyone seems to be doing good...:thumb:
> haven't been able to train either for last week due to life/work interfering again but planning to be back in the rack by midweek...:thumb:
> have been looking back over last few weeks of training log and can see my form wasn't too good and lifts were suffering and have been doing some thinking about focus (or lack of) so i'm planning to drop all weights by 10-15% and concentrate on form and trying to clear my mind a little training wise, and also to refocus as have so much going on outside of training at the mo...
> rgds stu


Good idea about a re focus Stu, keep lifting mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have to disagree with you guys doing alternatives to Squats WTF?????  :devil: :wall::lol::lol:
> 
> You need to learn how the lift basically "feels" which takes time and then as you increase the weight it will feel different as your body naturally tries to find an easy way to get the weight up (bad form).
> 
> If you are constantly increasing your weight, "In any lift" you should be using that same lift as your primary exercise. If you are struggling then you are using too much weight. By making it easy for yourself you are actually making it harder to progress.
> 
> If someone struggles doing squats with an empty Olympic bar, try body weight squats first, get the person used to squatting. Then try a light standard bar, then the Olympic bar. Ensure a good firm flat surface & if possible bare foot :thumb:
> 
> Old man lecture over


But some people from a flexibility aspect cant actually do squats safely. I agree that squats should be the backbone of any program and you should get people squatting as soon as possible but I would rather see someone do a second rate exercise properly than do one of the top exercises badly and risk injuring themselves. Even top coaches like Defranco, Eric Cressey and Elitefts start clients on a high box and elevated Deadlifts until they are able to complete the exercise properly.



Christianmp said:


> Its always nice to get an old man lecture.


:lol:

I can see Doug getting ready to open a can of Woop Ass on us for the old man comments :lol: I have an image of Doug getting fired up for big Deadlift set while mumbling to himself "Old, OLD!, I show those baby faced *******s how to lift" :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I can see Doug getting ready to open a can of Woop Ass on us for the old man comments :lol: I have an image of Doug getting fired up for big Deadlift set while mumbling to himself "Old, OLD!, I show those baby faced *******s how to lift" :thumb:


:lol::lol::lol:


----------



## Christianmp

Monday became Tuesday and there was a workout. And Christian made sure that it was good.

Squats: *100kg* 5x5 
OHP: 57,5kg x5, 56,5kg 2x5, 55kg x5, 55kg x3. Was totally spent on the last few sets. Next time is last try with 5x5 at 57.5kg, deload to follow.
Deadlifts: 60kg x10, 100kg x5, 120kg x3, *140kg *x5 Totally nailed it
Incline DB bench: 18kg x6, 18kg 2x8.
@ 79kg BW

I'm so satisfied with the squats. Bar placement was perfect, reps went well, the last set was a grind, but nailed it anyways.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> Monday became Tuesday and there was a workout. And Christian made sure that it was good.
> 
> Squats: *100kg* 5x5
> OHP: 57,5kg x5, 56,5kg 2x5, 55kg x5, 55kg x3. Was totally spent on the last few sets. Next time is last try with 5x5 at 57.5kg, deload to follow.
> Deadlifts: 60kg x10, 100kg x5, 120kg x3, *140kg *x5 Totally nailed it
> Incline DB bench: 18kg x6, 18kg 2x8.
> @ 79kg BW
> 
> I'm so satisfied with the squats. Bar placement was perfect, reps went well, the last set was a grind, but nailed it anyways.


Nice solid workout at good weigths Chris :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Quick Recovery session.

*SQUAT (WU 5X60 - 5X77 - 3X100) 160KG X 5 No belt*

Weight is feeling more like it now, once i get to 170 i'll go back to the 5/3/1 for the Squat :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 30x5, 35x3) WO 42.5x5, 50x3, 55x5
Weighted Dips: BWx5, BW+7.5x3, BW+22.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x2

Not a bad workout beat my Goal of 4 reps so pretty happy with that.

Dips felt abit slower than usual and I'm using the 5/3/1 system on these but only resting 90secs so I think the 2nd set has an impact on my last set but I want to keep rest periods low on assistance execises.

I completely forgot about Chin Ups and therefore did 10 straight sets at the end of the workout, began with 1 min rest but got bored and moved this down to 30 seconds.

Nemesis exercise Deadlifts next, I hate Deadlifts


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> Monday became Tuesday and there was a workout. And Christian made sure that it was good.
> 
> Squats: *100kg* 5x5
> OHP: 57,5kg x5, 56,5kg 2x5, 55kg x5, 55kg x3. Was totally spent on the last few sets. Next time is last try with 5x5 at 57.5kg, deload to follow.
> Deadlifts: 60kg x10, 100kg x5, 120kg x3, *140kg *x5 Totally nailed it
> Incline DB bench: 18kg x6, 18kg 2x8.
> @ 79kg BW
> 
> I'm so satisfied with the squats. Bar placement was perfect, reps went well, the last set was a grind, but nailed it anyways.


Nice Workout Only 20kg to go and you will be doing a 2 x BW Deadlift which is a great mile stone to hit.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 30x5, 35x3) WO 42.5x5, 50x3, 55x5
> Weighted Dips: BWx5, BW+7.5x3, BW+22.5x6
> Neutral Grip Chins: 10x2
> 
> Not a bad workout beat my Goal of 4 reps so pretty happy with that.
> 
> Dips felt abit slower than usual and I'm using the 5/3/1 system on these but only resting 90secs so I think the 2nd set has an impact on my last set but I want to keep rest periods low on assistance execises.
> 
> I completely forgot about Chin Ups and therefore did 10 straight sets at the end of the workout, began with 1 min rest but got bored and moved this down to 30 seconds.
> 
> Nemesis exercise Deadlifts next, I hate Deadlifts


Good workout James, glad to see things are on the up mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout (Done Thursday as have BBQ Fri)
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 100x3) WO 125x5, 142.5x3, 160x1
Free Squats: 65x5x10
Ab Work

Deadlifts went well for once. I have actually learnt better form by doing the 5 sets of 10 as its such a light weight I can practice form and get the right feeling. I bent my knees more tonight which meant my back stayed lightly more upright which felts a lot better. I been warming up touch and go and they feel so good but think I will stick to stopping between each rep as they are a lot harder. I never liked Deadlifts and find lower reps are better for me so just sticking to the 5/3/1 reps. I figured out most if not all my problem with lifting is mental. I been thinking of the deadlifts all day and when I completed 142.5x3 it felt quite hard and its just a warm up so this started me doubting, I kept looking at my log sheet and saw that I only got 1 rep last week at 150kg so I'm jumping 10kg and expect to get the same reps, more doubt creeps in my head. All this doubt is holding me back so I got a little fired up and smoked the weight. I actually been looking at my workout spreadsheet earlier in the day and looking at taking weight off both the Bench Press and Deadlift, WTF I hadnt even tried the lift yet and Im already thinking deload. Need to get my head in the game if I want to hit my goals.

Squats are feeling good. The lighter weight gives you a chance to practise form and also practice my depth as I thing Im actually going to low so was practicing getting the rebond from the bottom but without going **** to grass. 

Did bridges 30 seconds on, 15 seconds off for 3 sets. I always said the stronger your abs get and the better your muscle mind connection the harder bridges should be and the pain was intense last night, so much so that I actually have Doms in my abs just from 2 mins of Ab work. For anyone thinking they can do this easy, try doing bridges like this, tense your glutes and squeeze your legs together as hard as you can and then pull your belly button back and feel like your trying to touch your spine. This is stage one and should put more stress on your abs but if this is still to easy, while still doing the 1st things, pull your elbows and toes together as hard as you can, this tensing of the abs plus the stabilizing effect of the abs should set your abs on fire, if it doesnt tense harder.

I have also decided to change from 3 days per week to 4 on 5/3/1 as the progress is 25% faster this way and I feel like I can take it on this program as the volume is lower. This way it keeps all my training days the same each week instead of every training day changing. 

Edit: Just signed up to play touch rugby every thursday night over the summer so the 4 days per week program wont work now, back to 3 days per week I go.


----------



## Christianmp

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout (Done Thursday as have BBQ Fri)
> Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 100x3) WO 125x5, 142.5x3, 160x1
> Free Squats: 65x5x10
> Ab Work
> 
> I figured out most if not all my problem with lifting is mental.
> 
> Need to get my head in the game if I want to hit my goals.


I'm like you here. During my last workout I thought the warm-up weight at 120kg was really heavy and didn't think I could do the 140kg for 5 reps. But the weights left the ground every single time I tried to lift. That just goes to show that you shouldn't give up without at least trying. we are capable of much more than we THINK.

I'm going to really focus on this and just push it as far as possible (with good form) not letting my thoughts get in the way.

And congratz on the 160kg. I'm looking forward to try out that weight come November/December.

Didn't lift yesterday as work and planning of an upcoming party took all my spare time. Tonight, weights will be weights, and I'm gonna get hammered. I can hate the weights Sunday.


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Third month week 3 :thumb:

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 44KG X 5 50KG X 3 56KG X 1

OVERHEAD PRESS 37.5KG-10-10-10-10-10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT-9-9-9-9-9

BARBELL CURL 37.5KG-10-10-10-10-10*

Good workout, still a little frustrated with using light weights on the OHP work set, but the progression over the next three months will bring this workout to decent weight (approx.…65KG) which I can work from & improve upon for the new year :thumb:

Dips, very pleased with 5X9 today, hoping to get a full 5X10 next session then add 5kg. I will then aim for 5 sets of 5 reps first week with bodyweight plus 5kg, second week aim for 5 sets of 6 & so on until I hopefully reach 5X10. 
I'm very surprised how much more powerful the triceps feel after only 2 months of doing dips. Wish I started doing them much earlier, hoping this will help improve my bench press progression :thumb:

Last deadlift recovery session tomorrow then all my training will be 5/3/1 :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm very surprised how much more powerful the triceps feel after only 2 months of doing dips. Wish I started doing them much earlier, hoping this will help improve my bench press progression :thumb:


I find for me personally that Dips help my Bench Press no end. For me I can hit all the muscles that the Bench Press uses without smashing up my bad shoulder by Benching heavy.

Im sure your hit that 65kh real soon mate.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I find for me personally that Dips help my Bench Press no end. For me I can hit all the muscles that the Bench Press uses without smashing up my bad shoulder by Benching heavy.
> 
> Im sure your hit that 65kh real soon mate.


Funny you mention that James, when i used to bench 180 it was the same time i used to do dips bodyweight plus 40kg (6-8 rep range). Looks like im going to be doing dips for a while :thumb:

I hope so mate, my mini goal for the end of 2012 is 60/65 for the OHP, i know i could do 60 now but im going to go nice & slwo & follow the 5/3/1, the ego can go wait in the corner :lol:

I'm going for 170 today on my deadlift (final recovery session) wish me luck 

*In regards to Hamstring injuries;*

Since my Hamstring injury I have learnt so much in regards to muscle injury/ repair & Since putting together my own recovery program I came across the Starting strength site & Ripptoes recovery program is very similar to mine except mine is slower in regards progression, but it has worked, from no squat to 160kg in less than 3 months & I'll be deadlifting 170kg today :thumb:

Check out these vids in regards to injuries & resolving them: 
Below is your muscle injury Bible, it is all you need :thumb: 

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_healing_avoiding_injuries

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_training_through_around_injuries

Ice is your best friend when it comes to an injury, there are no alternatives, I've tried all the freeze creams, sprays (load of craap).

*Proper usage of ice can reduce the destruction over-response which can result from inflammation. A good method is ice 20 minutes of each hour for the first week.* (This wasn't possible for me so I did a 20 minute session before & after work & 20 minutes in the evening) :thumb:
I continued to use Ice for the remaining month or so 3 times a day (up to around 120/130kg for my Squat & Deadlift) - Recovery session followed by 4 X 10 second hamstring stretches then 20 minutes Ice :thumb:

*Exceeding the recommended time for ice application may be detrimental, as blood flow will be too reduced to allow nutrient delivery and waste removal.*


----------



## ITHAQVA

MAJOR FAIL!!!!!  :devil:

Deadlift up 150 all fine. As soon as i went to about mid point on first rep of 170 I felt a small twinge (160 squat was fine this week when i tried it ) its not as bad as before, but it looks like i need to stay light for a little longer. I will call it a day for the heavy stuff until the new year & stay in recovery mode & go no heavier than 150 on Squat & deadlift for the remaing part of 2012 

The battle continues!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## Bod42

Have to agree Ice is your friend especially on more complex joints like the shoulder. I ice my shoulder after every single rugby game, no matter if I hurt it or not. If I push my shoulder press or bench press hard in the gym I also ice my shoulders. I know you want blood flow to provide nutrition and build muscle but I rather keep my shoulder healthy and put on slightly less strength and muscle. 

I agree with you as well Doug, the sprays, patches, etc arent nearly as good. I found that this just cooled the skin instead of cooler deep into the muscle. How do you apply the ice as most people use a tea towel or one of those ice bags which is fine but they make the mistake of not wetting it. If its wet its transfers the cold across to your skin/muscle a lot better. And the biggest mistake I ever see at rugby is bloody deep heat lovers, every time they pull something or hurt themselves they use deep heat, makes everything worse.

Free squats dont have the same stress on the hamstrings as Deadlifts. I think your going about your injury in a very clever manor Douh so keep at it. I have never had a really bad Hamstring injury myself but I trained people who have and what I found is its the stretch at the bottom of the movement that seems to put the most pressure on the injury. Have you considered elevated Deadlifts, just a plate or 2 under the weight to bring it up a few inches, this way the Hamstrings arent in such a stretched state when you first begin the pull, may help may not.


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> MAJOR FAIL!!!!!  :devil:
> 
> Deadlift up 150 all fine. As soon as i went to about mid point on first rep of 170 I felt a small twinge (160 squat was fine this week when i tried it ) its not as bad as before, but it looks like i need to stay light for a little longer.


The thought process when my back twangs is really weird. There's the instant of panic when you feel it, the urgency as you try to bail, then trying to gauge if it was terminal or not, the realisation that it wasn't, and then the mixture of relief and angry frustration. Hate the injuries Doug:devil:



Bod42 said:


> And the biggest mistake I ever see at rugby is bloody deep heat lovers, every time they pull something or hurt themselves they use deep heat, makes everything worse.


Lol, blast from the past, you've just reminded me of rugby at school. Before a match, the team used to assemble in the small captains room and whilst the coach was talking nearly the whole team used to coat themselves in Deepheat. The fumes were unbelievable! Probably a reason why we were one of the best team in the England was that the oppostion were semi-unconscious after the first contact. Gas-gas-gas


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Have to agree Ice is your friend especially on more complex joints like the shoulder. I ice my shoulder after every single rugby game, no matter if I hurt it or not. If I push my shoulder press or bench press hard in the gym I also ice my shoulders. I know you want blood flow to provide nutrition and build muscle but I rather keep my shoulder healthy and put on slightly less strength and muscle.
> 
> I agree with you as well Doug, the sprays, patches, etc arent nearly as good. I found that this just cooled the skin instead of cooler deep into the muscle. How do you apply the ice as most people use a tea towel or one of those ice bags which is fine but they make the mistake of not wetting it. If its wet its transfers the cold across to your skin/muscle a lot better. And the biggest mistake I ever see at rugby is bloody deep heat lovers, every time they pull something or hurt themselves they use deep heat, makes everything worse.
> 
> Free squats dont have the same stress on the hamstrings as Deadlifts. I think your going about your injury in a very clever manor Douh so keep at it. I have never had a really bad Hamstring injury myself but I trained people who have and what I found is its the stretch at the bottom of the movement that seems to put the most pressure on the injury. Have you considered elevated Deadlifts, just a plate or 2 under the weight to bring it up a few inches, this way the Hamstrings arent in such a stretched state when you first begin the pull, may help may not.


I think this time it was a combination of things:

1. I use a wood platform for squats & deadlifts, bringing my feet up another inch.

2. Due to using really light weights while recovering I've not used a belt, once I put it on, my body was in a different position, putting my hamstring at more risk.

3. A miscalculation - I should have been using 165kg, I'm not sure if the 10kg jump played its part or not.

Either way it's another setback, but has not put me off. This is my light de load week so ill use it to fully rest & start the recovery work Friday. I will use 20 minutes ice every hour when possible throughout this week :thumb:

For the next 6 months I'm going to call it a day with squats & deadlifts. I'll work back up to 150/160 then completely dominate that weight for 3 months before moving on. 
The frustrating thing is 150 now feels so light, my upper body strength has definitely improved, possibly due to the dips. So I'm going to do a various grip pull up/chin routine instead of barbell rows for a while.

 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Hate the injuries Doug:devil:


Oh believe me I DO! :devil::devil:

I will now be going through the rest of the week despising my own body for its pathetic weakness :devil::devil:

 Looking forward to having 150 on my back again already


----------



## ITHAQVA

I'm going to give Ripptoes recovery program a go, I’m wondering that I may have been too cautious with my rest/recovery & allowed scar tissue to form, creating a weakness in the muscle belly as it is odd how I was able to go all the way up to 160 with no issues at all. 

His program is extreme & takes two weeks & apparently & I quote "You should be fixed in about 2 weeks, squatting more than you hurt yourself with" :doublesho:doublesho:devil:

I’ll put my neck on the line & say I’m very doubtful of the above! Having gone thought recovery once, I’m sceptical this can be resolved so quickly & allow me to lift as heavy as before. But we will see, I will do nothing else but the proscribed program & follow to the letter :thumb: Two weeks & back to where I was, would IMHO be a ****ing miracle! 


Ohhh, this is going to hurt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## sfstu

sorry to hear about continuing hamstring probs doug... 
quick question mate, you mentioned a couple of posts back about sticking with 150 for squats for a couple of months, what would happen there to your legs what with no increase in weight...? 

just in middle of 1st comeback workout for over 2 weeks-my legs hurt...:doublesho  doing 1 x workout A and 1x workout B at roughly 60% to get back into it then going back to old weights but 10% down as a form check...doesn't help that when my laptop packed up the other week i lost my 5x5 tracker log...
no excuses but have loads going on at the mo which has thrown me out of workout cycle (not least my missus filling the garage with boxes of stuff, as house on the market, stopping me from seeing my cage let alone getting to it..!!:doublesho) but going back to it and gonna stick as regular as possible to 5x5...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm going to give Ripptoes recovery program a go, .... Two weeks & back to where I was, would IMHO be a ****ing miracle!


I was just reading Rips Q&A and they're going to post up a roundtable video on injuries from the Starting Strength coaches conference they held recently. Might be worth keeping an eye out for. Although I suspect it'll be a week or two by which time you'll have finished your two weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> sorry to hear about continuing hamstring probs doug...
> quick question mate, you mentioned a couple of posts back about sticking with 150 for squats for a couple of months, what would happen there to your legs what with no increase in weight...?
> 
> just in middle of 1st comeback workout for over 2 weeks-my legs hurt...:doublesho  doing 1 x workout A and 1x workout B at roughly 60% to get back into it then going back to old weights but 10% down as a form check...doesn't help that when my laptop packed up the other week i lost my 5x5 tracker log...
> no excuses but have loads going on at the mo which has thrown me out of workout cycle (not least my missus filling the garage with boxes of stuff, as house on the market, stopping me from seeing my cage let alone getting to it..!!:doublesho) but going back to it and gonna stick as regular as possible to 5x5...:thumb:
> rgds stu


No worries Stu, I will be back on it again. I got to 160 before any injury so something was right, perhaps at 150 I should have slowed progress to ensure I was fully recovered.

In regards to your question: 
At 150 nothing lol, you don't have to keep progressing, but to increase strength you would.
For me personally my legs are big enough, 150 is good enough for anyone not competing. 
I will monitor my progress again this time around & if I suffer any more Hamstring injuries I will work back up to Squatting & deadlifting 150kg for 5 reps & leave it at that. Workout would look thus.
Squat work set:
Warm up 40%-50%-60% Work set 150kgX5
Assistance sets:
Squat 100kg 5 sets 10 reps
Glut ham raise 5 sets 10 reps bodyweight.

Deadlift session would look the same. I would keep training the bench & ohp days as normal. I would still train 4 x week but my squat & deadlift sessions would be fixed at 150kg max for the work set for a few months before I carry on with progression.
Roll on Friday! Starting with an empty bar…………….again lol!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I was just reading Rips Q&A and they're going to post up a roundtable video on injuries from the Starting Strength coaches conference they held recently. Might be worth keeping an eye out for. Although I suspect it'll be a week or two by which time you'll have finished your two weeks.


I've just watched the older vids :thumb:

Here is what my 2 week recovery program will look like :doublesho

Date------------Reps X weight
19-10-12-----25x20, 25x20, 25x20
20-10-12-----25x20, 25x20, 25x25
21-10-12-----25x20, 25x25, 25x30
22-10-12-----25x25, 25x30, 25x35
23-10-12-----25x30, 25x35, 25x40
24-10-12-----25x35, 25x40, 25x45
25-10-12-----25x40, 25x45, 25x50
26-10-12-----25x45, 25x50, 25x55
27-10-12-----25x50, 25x55, 25x60
28-10-12-----25x55, 25x60, 25x65
29-10-12-----25x60, 25x65, 15x80
30-10-12-----25x65, 15x80, 10x95
31-10-12-----15x80, 10x95, 5x110
1-1-12-----10x95, 5x110, 5x115
2-11-12-----5x110, 5x115, 5x120

If all goes well, I will then train the Squat & deadlift twice a week adding 5kg per session giving me 150kg by the week ending 25-11-12, giving me one month to dominate the weight from a safety point of view 

Do i have doubts? yes i do, but im giving it a go :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> I've just watched the older vids :thumb:
> 
> Here is what my 2 week recovery program will look like :doublesho
> 
> Date------------WeightXreps
> 19-10-12-----25x20, 25x20, 25x20
> 20-10-12-----25x20, 25x20, 25x25
> 21-10-12-----25x20, 25x25, 25x30
> 22-10-12-----25x25, 25x30, 25x35
> 23-10-12-----25x30, 25x35, 25x40
> 24-10-12-----25x35, 25x40, 25x45
> 25-10-12-----25x40, 25x45, 25x50
> 26-10-12-----25x45, 25x50, 25x55
> 27-10-12-----25x50, 25x55, 25x60
> 28-10-12-----25x55, 25x60, 25x65
> 29-10-12-----25x60, 25x65, 15x80
> 30-10-12-----25x65, 15x80, 10x95
> 31-10-12-----15x80, 10x95, 5x110
> 1-1-12-----10x95, 5x110, 5x115
> 2-11-12-----5x110, 5x115, 5x120


:doublesho indeed...:thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 4 Week 2* - 3 rep week

Now I've realised that the 5 rep weights of this cycle are same as 3 rep last cycle (and 3 reps this are 1 rep last cycle) I'm going to look at comparing like-for-like weights rather than week 3 vs week 3. Hopefully see some progress! Here goes:

*Shoulder Press 48.5kg x 3* this cycle vs 4 last time (not a good start!!)

*Deadlift 123.5 x 10* vs 10
*
Bench 71.5kg x 6* vs 3 @ 73kg

*Squat 100kg x 7* vs 6

Felt like a good week but the numbers are uninspiring! Lower back has calmed down. On Shoulder Press did 3 reps, rested, another 3, rested and then 2. I don't know if doing a couple more sets helps but it can't do any harm and it makes me feel alot better about such a low intial number! Squats good for another 2 or 3 reps but racking because of mashed nerve in rear shoulder; frustrating.

Cardio a real issue on deadlifts. Maybe it drops off quicker than I thought after only doing a few sessions over past couple of weeks. I hadn't anticipated it but dark nights mean I can't do hills on an evenings because there's no street lights anywhere near a hill I've used. Going to have a think and come up with alternative.

Eating well at momnet. Put on a kilo recently. _(Doug and James - not forgotten to send you copy of recipe book. Trouble is the women at work have got hold of it and it's doing the rounds because of the low carb recipes )_

Been thinking about routine recently. I've only lifted weights for a year or so but in that time have only done the same half a dozen movements. I think I need to change up my assistance work and try to address some weak points. Especially true in shoulder and bench press. I might get some dip bars fabricated and switch to a closer grip bench press as I think that is meant to aid in the bottom of the movemment. Would seem 5\3\1 _'Triumvate'_ would be a better match than _'Boring but Big'_. The thing is I've just noticed this week that I *look* different. Now my shoulders are slightly more than a bone going into a socket. I suspect it's one of those muscle things that I hear about. Same with my legs, so in that respect I think Boring but Big is doing its job. Couple of weeks to think about it.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout 5s week, skipped deload week
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5, 75x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x7 PM 132.5KG
Pendlay Rows: 52.5x5x10
Dips: BWx 8,8,8,6,5 Total 35
Band RC Work

Pretty good workout, increased Bench Press by 2.5kg and got the same reps but they werent pretty. The warm up and everything felt brilliant and the first few reps were great but Im starting to push up to high during the reps and its unlocking my shoulders so need to watch that. My shoulder is still clicking on the negative but it doesnt hurt so I will carry on at the moment but I have thrown RC work in at the end again to try and help.

Im quite surprised how much Rows are kicking my **** at this light weight but 50 reps in 7.5 mins in quite a lot of reps in a short time. Its great though as they are really hitting my upper back and surprisingly my forearms and biceps quite hard. Looking forward to getting to 60kg as the weight plates are bigger and I will be in a better position. Depending how things go I may move up to 60kg and just work my way up to 5x10 but for the time being we will see how things go.

Dips didnt go as well as planned but then my chest and especially triceps were fried from Bench Press so didnt expect to get a record. I find I do better at Dips the lower the reps I do on Bench Press. This was the same on the Juggernaut Program.

All in all really liking the 5/3/1 right now.

On the diet front I have been doing intermittent fasting, not by choice its just Im so broke at the moment I have been missing breakfast but it seems to suit my body. Yes my stomach rumbles like crazy until lunch time but I feel a lot more energetic during my workouts the last few weeks. Just need to get some money so I can buy loads of meat and do the program properly.

Doug that program looks sick. Have you tried foam rolling the area to help breakdown any scar tissue? It can also help loosen and lengthen the muscle as well.


----------



## Christianmp

Didn't get anything done other than 1 session last week, and today I was running late, so it was a quick training. 2min rest between sets.

Monday workout. 
Bench: 77,5kg 5x5 (first time I think i've nailed all 5x5 reps, actually did 6 reps on last set, and was almost failing it)
Dips: 8/8/8/8/8 (Squat rack occupied, so did these straight after bench, damn my triceps were pumped.)
Squats: 102,5kg 5x5
Chin ups: 5/5/5
Didn't have time for BB ROWS/Pendlays.

Its funny how the squats actually are going fine at the moment. It is mostly in my head I'm having the fight.
Also this session I talked a lot to my self (out loud) during the last couple of reps, complimenting myself/psyching myself. Strange, but it actually worked/helped. Curl-bro in the rack beside my looked puzzled, but so did I, when he started doing curls in the power rack.

@James: Nice to see that (unintentional) intermittent fasting is working for you. I've really been enjoying this kind of eating regime with no breakfast. The first couple of days stomach is rumbling like crazy, but water and coffee keeps the hunger pangs at bay. Sunday was the first time in 2-3 months I ate an actual breakfast. Only for the sake of the sweet little thing who spent the night. It was fine, but back on track with an IF style cut, abs are showing now


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug that program looks sick. Have you tried foam rolling the area to help breakdown any scar tissue? It can also help loosen and lengthen the muscle as well.


I'm putting my faith in Ripttoe's knowledge/experience this time :devil:

Once I start the recovery program my post workout routine will be: hamstring stretches followed by rolling with a plastic pipe to roll the scar tissue out of the repairing muscle tissue as before.

I think the deciding factor this time around is I should have stayed at 160 for a month & upped the reps, possibly 160X10 before adding weight. On the day I was going to call it done after the 150, but carried on. I should have listened to my instincts 

Hamstring has that dull feeling already, but I will wait until Friday before I start the recovery workout. This time I'm using Ice every hour & there is most definitely a difference, last time I didn't ice till a few days after the injury :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm putting my faith in Ripttoe's knowledge/experience this time :devil:
> 
> Hamstring has that dull feeling already, but I will wait until Friday before I start the recovery workout. This time I'm using Ice every hour & there is most definitely a difference, last time I didn't ice till a few days after the injury :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:


I'm crossing my fingers that your recovery will be swift and that Rippetoe's knowledge is enough to get you back on track. You are the DW strength oracle!

Regarding the program, in the description haven't you switched the reps & weights?:lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Christianmp said:


> I'm crossing my fingers that your recovery will be swift and that Rippetoe's knowledge is enough to get you back on track. You are the DW strength oracle!
> 
> Regarding the program, in the description haven't you switched the reps & weights?:lol:


lol yep, but also ive re read the article & its sicker than James thought :doublesho

Ripptoe says that in just about two weeks you can be using more than the weight you injured yourself with!

Revised recovery program:
--------------- Reps X Weight lol!
19-10-12-----25x50, 25x50, 25x50
20-10-12-----25x50, 25x50, 25x55
21-10-12-----25x50, 25x55, 25x60
22-10-12-----25x55, 25x60, 25x65
23-10-12-----25x60, 25x65, 25x70
24-10-12-----25x65, 25x70, 25x75
25-10-12-----25x70, 25x75, 25x80
26-10-12-----25x75, 25x80, 25x85
27-10-12-----25x80, 25x85, 25x90
28-10-12-----25x85, 25x90, 25x95
29-10-12-----15x90, 15x95, 15x100
30-10-12-----15x95, 15x100, 10x125
31-10-12-----10x100, 10x125, 5x140
1-1-12-------5x125, 5x140, 5x145
2-11-12------5x140, 5x145, 5x150

:doublesho

No matter how many times I tell myself Ripptoe knows what he's on about, I can't help but doubt that I can be back on 150 in around *two weeks!!!*

Im not brave enough to set the program for 170 as the final weight 

DW strength oracle, lol WTF!!! I've only been doing it for 12 months & have accumulated more injuries than everyone on this thread combined! :wall::lol:


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> @James: Nice to see that (unintentional) intermittent fasting is working for you. I've really been enjoying this kind of eating regime with no breakfast.


I was thinking I hadnt lost any weight but just tucked my shirt in at work without undoing my belt so have definitely lost size round my waist and I can nearly get to the next notch. The great thing is that my strength doesnt seem to of suffered. Maybe this is the program for me, less overall calories but loads of food around training time. Need to find a way of keeping my protein high as I used to have a protein shake for breakfast.



Christianmp said:


> The first couple of days stomach is rumbling like crazy, but water and coffee keeps the hunger pangs at bay. Sunday was the first time in 2-3 months I ate an actual breakfast. *Only for the sake of the sweet little thing who spent the night*. It was fine, but back on track with an IF style cut, abs are showing now


Breaking your routine for a bit of tail, tut tut


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Jumps: 3x5
Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) 95x5, 110x5, 125x8 PM 158.5
Deadlifts: 77.5x5x10

Squats went pretty well, I think the Bar may have been a few mm high as I felt like I was falling forwards when coming out of the bottom. Need to really concentrate on driving my knees out as they are coming up when I hit the half way point, this fixes itself if I use a closer stance but a closer stance just doest feel right. I need to start getting my head in the game for these big lifts and basically stop being a *** and doubting myself before they have even started. Anyway using Wendler formula I have put 10.5kg on my squat in a month which I'm very happy with.

Deadlifts are going surprisingly well, I actually love the feeling of doing heavy squats and then doing high rep low rest deadlifts and it seems to be working well for me which is the main thing.

Overall very happy with 5/3/1 so far.


----------



## Christianmp

Wednesday workout:
Squats: 105kg 5x5
OHP: 57,5kg 5x5 (was bouncing the weight on the last rep, but got it done, think I'm gonna stay here until I can do the weight with better form)
Deadlifts: 60kg x10, 100kg x5, 125kg x3 and 145kg x5, finished with another 60kg x10

The deads where the best in this workout. Didn't feel _that_ heavy. So I'm fine with adding more weight next workout.

Also got the best training partner yesterday. My ex-GF started in the gym (nice breakup and all and no hard feeling) and she did the same excercises I did, including bench.
Squat: 30kg 5x5
OHP: 22,5kg 5x5
Bench: 25kg 5x5
Dead: 45kg 3x5 (PERFECT form/technique, I almost fell in love with her again:lol:, but it wouldn't work out)


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Bill Starr Rehab/Recovery program*

*1.* Having searched the internet I am surprised there is so little info regarding the Bill star recovery program, so I thought I'd post my recovery using it :thumb:

*2.* My own recovery program actually worked very well, but for a simple mistake right at the end.

*3.* *Mistake:* The platform I squat on raised my feet a good inch or so higher, making me straighten my legs more than necessary & thus putting my hamstrings in a much weaker/vulnerable position.

*4.* I've opted for a limit of 150kg for my recovery weight, not 170kg (that can wait).

*5.* I think it would be far more beneficial to all to put all my recovery sessions in one post & keep updating it :thumb:

*6.* I know that my own program works (*©ITHAQVA Rehab Version1 ©ITHAQVA 2012* ), but it took 2.5 months to get from an empty bar to 170kg, i would recommend it to anyone who feels less confident with the 2 week Bill Starr version below.

*7.* I'll put in notes as I go on & highlight each completed session. All weigths are in KG :thumb:

*8.* I have altered the program slightly at the beggining so that i can get the 150 goal withing 15 days.

*9.* This may not be pretty, but I hope it is informative 

*Date*-----*Reps X Weigth *

19-10-12 25x40, 25x50, 25x50----------Pain free, so far. Workout followed by 4X10 second Hamstring stretches & 20 minutes Ice.

20-10-12 25x50, 25x50, 20x55----------Pain free. Workout followed by 4X10 second Hamstring stretches & 20 minutes Ice. Will reduce reps to 20 for next session.

21-10-12 10x55 30 second rest 10x55, 10x60---------- Pain free, 4X10 second hamstring stretches & 20 min Ice. Took the workout a little easy today & completed sets using lower reps, but kept weigth. Monday 23rd, i'll aim for 3 sets of 20 reps.

22-10-12 20x60, 20x65, 15x70---------- Pain Free, The bill star routine does state use as much weight as you can tolerate. Workout was followed by 4X10 second hamstring stretches & 20 min Ice. Lower back is sore from DOMS!  
I'll alter the sets/weight & reps below as I do them. I think im going to be down to 15-10 reps very soon, if the repair carries on at this rate I will be at my goal very quickly, although I think as it gets closer to 110kg progress may slow down due to pain etc..

23-10-12 No workout, took the day off to rest :thumb:

24-10-12 15x70, 10x75, 10x80. Pain free.

25-10-12 No workout too busy.

26-10-12 10x80, 10x90, 10x100 Pain free!!!!!

27-10-12 25x80, 25x85, 25x90 No Workout.

*28-10-12 Deadlift: 10x100, 5x105, Squat 10x100, 5X105 :thumb: :thumb:*

29-10-12 15x90, 15x95, 15x100

30-10-12 15x95, 15x100, 10x125

31-10-12 10x100, 10x125, 5x140

1-1-12 5x125, 5x140, 5x145

2-11-12 5x140, 5x145, 5x150

:thumb:


----------



## Ross

Ive not been doing any weights but I have noticed my strength increasing over the past few months with increased muscle definition which is a bonus :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

thursday workout, workout B of SL 5x5 done at approx 75% (to allow for not having done it for over 2 weeks)...
did squats on monday at 75% and the doms crippled me yesterday and tues, not helped by flu-jab which made me ache all over...

not happy also to discover today, that although i started off fine with parallel squats, somewhere along the line these became nearer to partial squats... used a paint can and a couple o 5kg plates today under my backside as a form check and found i was squatting about 6 in above this and when i made the effort to touch my backside on the paintcan i nearly couldn't get up... 
not f***ing happy...
back to the drawing board there and looks like i'll be dropping from 110kg squats to about 60kgs to nail this...
other than that, all good and back to regular weights (apart from squats) for next workout on sat...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Evening everybody!

Not been able to come on here over the past month  We have been on holiday, started a new job and lots of things going on in the house.

Had a week off stronglifts whilst I was on holiday, ate whatever I wanted and no gym what so ever (couldn't resist a few laps in the pool on a morning though!). 

Did my first session back on Wednesday, squats and row felt real good, I just knew bench would kill me so I dropped 5kg, struggled all the way through but got 5 sets out!


----------



## Bod42

Christianmp said:


> Also got the best training partner yesterday. My ex-GF started in the gym (nice breakup and all and no hard feeling) and she did the same excercises I did, including bench.
> Squat: 30kg 5x5
> OHP: 22,5kg 5x5
> Bench: 25kg 5x5
> Dead: 45kg 3x5 (PERFECT form/technique, I almost fell in love with her again:lol:, but it wouldn't work out)


Women doing proper weight lifting is so god dam hot, cant help but :doublesho

I find women learn form a lot better than men, most women I trained can Deadlift nearly perfect straight away. Must be as their good at being told what to do :thumb:



jonnyMercUK said:


> Evening everybody!
> 
> Not been able to come on here over the past month  We have been on holiday, started a new job and lots of things going on in the house.
> 
> Had a week off stronglifts whilst I was on holiday, ate whatever I wanted and no gym what so ever (couldn't resist a few laps in the pool on a morning though!).
> 
> Did my first session back on Wednesday, squats and row felt real good, I just knew bench would kill me so I dropped 5kg, struggled all the way through but got 5 sets out!


I used to find I would get bigger and stronger when I had a week off abroad despite the copious amounts of alcohol and I put it down to no/lower stress and just eating loads of food.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> thursday workout, workout B of SL 5x5 done at approx 75% (to allow for not having done it for over 2 weeks)...
> did squats on monday at 75% and the doms crippled me yesterday and tues, not helped by flu-jab which made me ache all over...
> 
> not happy also to discover today, that although i started off fine with parallel squats, somewhere along the line these became nearer to partial squats... used a paint can and a couple o 5kg plates today under my backside as a form check and found i was squatting about 6 in above this and when i made the effort to touch my backside on the paintcan i nearly couldn't get up...
> not f***ing happy...
> back to the drawing board there and looks like i'll be dropping from 110kg squats to about 60kgs to nail this...
> other than that, all good and back to regular weights (apart from squats) for next workout on sat...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Dont worry Stu, I would think this happens to almost everyone as the weight gets heavier :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Dont worry Stu, I would think this happens to almost everyone as the weight gets heavier :thumb:


do you mean with not squatting low enough...?
its not a problem really, just gonna drop the weight right down till i nail the proper form then should be able to increase weight pretty quickly rather than 2.5kg each time...:thumb: just hadn't realised i wasn't getting low enough recently, think i'll stick with the paintcan for a while as a form check, not squat down on to it but just touch it so i know i'm at right depth..

was pretty annoyed about it last night after workout but got to thinking after about doug having to restart his squat from 20kg after injury, so put it into perspective really...:thumb:

now got an oly EZcurl bar too so gonna add some bicep and tricep stuff in there somewhere...

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> do you mean with not squatting low enough...?
> 
> now got an oly EZcurl bar too so gonna add some bicep and tricep stuff in there somewhere...
> 
> rgds stu


Yes, but this also includes any lift that gets heavier, keep checking form etc..And dont make changes as I have done with using the squat platform for my deadlifts  

Of all the exercises i've used I would say the mighty Dip is one of the best for the Triceps :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Yes, but this also includes any lift that gets heavier, keep checking form etc..And dont make changes as I have done with using the squat platform for my deadlifts
> 
> Of all the exercises i've used I would say the mighty Dip is one of the best for the Triceps :thumb:


tried dips couple o times doug but i'm too damn heavy and not strong enough yet... thought i'd do a little extra tri work for a while to help...?:thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Dont worry Stu, I would think this happens to almost everyone as the weight gets heavier :thumb:


Yep it's a real fu. Where a coach would be useful as they'd spot each rep. I made a box out of an old pallet as a depth check. Touch it on warm-ups or 80% days or made sure I'd go below parallel on days when not using it. I found that doing that meant my work sets stayed true, without the danger of having a box inserted up my ar if I failed a rep! Hopefully it isn't quite as much of a killer as realising your bar was underweight!


----------



## Oats

New free platform video on the shoulder press has just gone up on Rip's website :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> New free platform video on the shoulder press has just gone up on Rip's website :thumb:


Seen it, lol, it's how I used to do my OHP when pushing 77kg-84kg for reps :thumb: Like it, will involve more muscles allowing more weight :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> Yep it's a real fu. Where a coach would be useful as they'd spot each rep. I made a box out of an old pallet as a depth check. Touch it on warm-ups or 80% days or made sure I'd go below parallel on days when not using it. I found that doing that meant my work sets stayed true, without the danger of having a box inserted up my ar if I failed a rep! Hopefully it isn't quite as much of a killer as realising your bar was underweight!


finding out my bar was 13kg instead of 20kg really bummed me out at the time..! only 7kgs but really messed with my head and took the wind out of my sails...:devil:
this i can live with, as i know i can get this back with some depth checks, ie, trusty paint can and couple o weight plates, big enough not to worry about ending up with it inserted up the ol rusty sherriff's badge in the event of a mishap..:lol: also, i have a large tool chest that looks about right height..:thumb:
guess i was concentrating too much on the weight i was lifting (getting near 110kg) and staring at the wall and trying to keep my balance and posture but not realising i was gradually going less deep...
anyway, back to a proper workout A tomorrow or sunday...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

sunday workout A

squats 70kg 
bench 60kg
bbrows 60kg

as previously mentioned, have dropped the bench and bbrows by a little as a form check...not worried about this, trying to concentrate on quality rather than quantity...:thumb:
squats, after realising i'd gradually started doing partials have dropped this right down from 110kg to 70kg but will prob increase by 5kg per workout so won't take too long to get back to previous weights, hopefully with much better form...
struggled today with squats though... having not been doing the lowest 6 inches of squat really found it hard to do this properly below parallel...used trusty 5l paint can with a couple of weight plates on as a depth guide but although i'm not sitting back on to it, it feels like i'm gonna fall back on to it... if i do the squat without the depth guide then i just don't get low enough, as i'm staring at point on wall i need to look down to see when my legs are at parallel so end up wobbling all over which is why i've dropped down to the 70 kg...may try raising the safety bars next time to see if thats a better way for me to do it...
it'll come i know, just need some practice for the correct form so thinking of staying with the 70 kgs for next couple o workouts to see if i can nail this better...
weights were much easier before i did squats...
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> may try raising the safety bars next time to see if thats a better way for me to do it...


On the odd ocassion I've hit the sabres on squats it's been a  It just throws you off balance and kills the rebound that you're feeling for. Give it a try by all means but my suggestion would be not at your 1RM !



sfstu said:


> weights were much easier before i did squats...


I didn't do weights before I did squats and I still hate and despise them! I just wish eveyone didn't talk about them so highly then I'd be able to VAG out :lol:


----------



## sfstu

tuesday workout

squat 70kg
ohp 40kg
deadlift 85kg

stuck with 70 again on squat as want to sort out this depth problem...i'm fine down to hips just above knee but that last few inches to below parallel is hard... used the paintcan/weight plate set up again and it was better...:thumb:
ohp and dead have both been dropped by approx 10% for form check/focus...had a little go at rips new method of ohp but although it was fine on warmup, felt a bit dodgy with the 40kgs so need some practice on this...:thumb: deads went fine but i was up to 110ish so it should do... will be putting it back up to 100 next time as have only done deads once in 3 weeks...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> On the odd ocassion I've hit the sabres on squats it's been a  It just throws you off balance and kills the rebound that you're feeling for. Give it a try by all means but my suggestion would be not at your 1RM !
> 
> I didn't do weights before I did squats and I still hate and despise them! I just wish eveyone didn't talk about them so highly then I'd be able to VAG out :lol:


noted, cheers colin, will stick with paintcan for now..:thumb:
you and me both mate...:devil: my reason for not liking them is purely asthetic, i have always had big legs/backside anyway so don't wanna make em any bigger with the squats but i do em cos i don't wanna get told off again...!:lol: and cos i wanna live north of vag..!!
life was easier in the late 80's when it was fine to be pecdec bro and a preacher curl bro...
with the squats, secretly wanting to stop increasing weights at 100kgs and maintain it there :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> tuesday workout
> 
> squat 70kg
> ohp 40kg
> deadlift 85kg
> 
> stuck with 70 again on squat as want to sort out this depth problem...i'm fine down to hips just above knee but that last few inches to below parallel is hard... used the paintcan/weight plate set up again and it was better...:thumb:
> ohp and dead have both been dropped by approx 10% for form check/focus...had a little go at rips new method of ohp but although it was fine on warmup, felt a bit dodgy with the 40kgs so need some practice on this...:thumb: deads went fine but i was up to 110ish so it should do... will be putting it back up to 100 next time as have only done deads once in 3 weeks...
> rgds stu


Stu,

You may already do this but have you tried this. When you get to that point where the last few inches feel difficult, instead of trying to force yourself lower push your knees and legs out. This should open your hip joint slightly and allow you to get lower without anymore effort.

Try it with just a bar, go to the bottom and stop and then push your legs out slightly and you should feel pressure release slightly in the hip joint.


----------



## sfstu

will give that a try james...:thumb: feels like somethings stopping me doing those last few inches and maybe its what you suggest...?
i know i started off ok on the squats and was definately getting low enough but somewhere along the way i ended up squatting a few inches above parallel but not sure how long this has been going on for and its bloody annoying...!


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> will give that a try james...:thumb: feels like somethings stopping me doing those last few inches and maybe its what you suggest...?
> i know i started off ok on the squats and was definately getting low enough but somewhere along the way i ended up squatting a few inches above parallel but not sure how long this has been going on for and its bloody annoying...!


Whats your warm up like, I find certain stretches like squats to stands are very good.

I use the Eric Cressey Maximum strength warm ups before every workout and find them extremely good.


----------



## Bod42

Quick update as havent posted a workout in a while.
Friday Workout:
Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 30x5, 35x3) WO 40x5, 45x5, 50x7 PM 61.5kg
Weighted Dips: BWx5, BWx5, BW+10x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 9x2, 1x3

I really wanted to get 8 or 9 reps on Shoulder Press but I played rugby on thrusday for the 1st time in a few years and this was after Squatting & Deadlifting on Wednesday. My DOMS on Friday was unreal in my thighs and I do seated SP without a back support but force my feet against the side of the cage. My DOMS was actually that bad that I couldnt put enough force against the cage to keep my body upright and therefore couldnt put full power into the bar.

Dips were slow but still got my reps.

Chins felt good with high volume low reps. I did these between all my warm up and work sets.

Anyway my goals are changing slightly. I'm still going to be strength training but it wont be the only goal I'm chasing. I started playing rugby again but its only gay tag rugby due to my shoulder. But my main goal is based around Golf, I have just joined a championship level golf course and my Goal now is to make the single figure handicap team which is being choosen over the next few weeks. Strength training is useful for golf as its a power sport but things like a big chest dont really help as it stops you getting into the right position.

I'm more accurate than I was when I was younger even though I had 8 yrs away from the sport and I put this solely down to being stronger and having better control over my muscles.

One of my goals is to increase my swing speed so i will be swinging a heavy club and extra light club during the week which will effect my weight lifting slightly.

Missed Deadlifts on Monday as it was a Bank Holiday and will be missing Bench Press tonight as have rugby practise.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Whats your warm up like, I find certain stretches like squats to stands are very good.
> 
> I use the Eric Cressey Maximum strength warm ups before every workout and find them extremely good.


tbh its pretty basic... depending when i work out, sometimes i'll walk the dog immediately before workout then just before each exercise do a couple of sets of light weights and thats pretty much it...? so i should be stretching beforehand..?


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Evening all!

Great sesh tonight, it felt great!

Squats 117.5KG 5x5x5x5x5
OHP 45KG 5x5x5x5x5
Deadlift 140KG 5
Weighted chins 20KG 5x5x5


----------



## Christianmp

jonnyMercUK said:


> Evening all!
> 
> Great sesh tonight, it felt great!
> 
> Squats 117.5KG 5x5x5x5x5
> OHP 45KG 5x5x5x5x5
> Deadlift 140KG 5
> Weighted chins 20KG 5x5x5


Great workout. Good squats and impressive (IMO) with the weighed chins.

I have done something (badminton i guess) to irritate my left hip flexor. Ignored it at first and squatted away, but its only getting worse, so I'm laying off squatting right now and focusing on other lifts that doesn't irritate the hip flexor. Massage and ice.

Still, I had a great workout yesterday, even tough it feels odd not squatting everytime.
Bench: 84kgx4, 75 6x6x6x6x6
Deadlift: 150kg 5, 100kg 6x6x6x6x6 Damn it felt great!
Lat pulldown, some curls, chins and pull ups.

Hoping to get back into squatting soon again.


----------



## Christianmp

two days later.... Back not feeling so great. DOMS all over. Might have gone a bit overboard on the DL's.


----------



## sfstu

Christianmp said:


> two days later.... Back not feeling so great. DOMS all over. Might have gone a bit overboard on the DL's.


that looked like a lot of DL's...!:doublesho like doms cos you know you've worked the muscle out of its comfort zone but don't cos it can be sore as hell...:devil:

friday workout

squat 70kg
bench 60kg
BBRows 65kg

squat went better today though didn't like the paintcan as when i touched it it was a struggle to get back up keeping body straight...got lower on the warmup without the paintcan depth guage...
struggled a bit with bench today as have a sore trap on RHS and this stopped me doing the planned 65kgs...something to do with the fact that i moved by hand pallet truck yesterday, 60 tons of silver bars, and the day before and the day before that...:doublesho
BBRows was ok...
off for a long weekend in the morn so back training mid next week, hopefully no more training breaks as i seem to be going backwards weights wise but still thinking quality over quantity...:wave:
rgds stu


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Christianmp said:


> Great workout. Good squats and impressive (IMO) with the weighed chins.


Cheers! Really loving squats at the minute.

Even though weighted chins work the biceps, I know they have shrunk in size, feel like doing some curls :/


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: (After Week Off)
Sprints: 10mx10 1 rep every 30 seconds.
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 102.5x3) WO 112.5x5, 130x5, 147.5x3
Free Squats: 67.5x5x10

Deadlifts have always been my worst exercise, I have a really bad build for them but tonight I moved my feet in a few inches and this allowed me to get my hands closer which shortens the distance the bar has to move a tiny bit. Deadlifts felt good tonight but still not sure that only heavy lifting on each exercise every 9 days is enough. I want to change to 4 days per week but cant due to Rugby.

Free Squats went well, felt really good and I hit a milestone next workout which is always a good feeling.

One good thing about BBB is that you get to practice your technique on the lower weight higher rep sets which has definitely helped with both my squat and especially my Deadlift technique.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 of my recovery :thumb:

*SQUAT: (WU 5X40 - 5X50 - 3X60) 105KGX5 - 110KGX5 - 115KGX5

DEADLIFT: 105KGX5 - 110KGX5 - 115KGX5*

I feel I can safely lift more, but I'm not re-injuring myself. This week's goal is to reach 150kg for both Deadlift & squat by this Saturday :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 of my recovery :thumb:
> 
> *SQUAT: (WU 5X40 - 5X50 - 3X60) 105KGX5 - 110KGX5 - 115KGX5
> 
> DEADLIFT: 105KGX5 - 110KGX5 - 115KGX5*
> 
> I feel I can safely lift more, but I'm not re-injuring myself. This week's goal is to reach 150kg for both Deadlift & squat by this Saturday :thumb:


Doug I thought you were doing the 5 billion rep recovery workout from Rippletoe.


----------



## Guest

Last nights workout. The first in 6.5 weeks!

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dead*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Press*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Dips*
WO: [email protected] (87kg)

*Chins*
WO: [email protected] (87kg)

Meh. It's a start.
No DOMS so far this morning, just a little tightness in the hams.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug I thought you were doing the 5 billion rep recovery workout from Rippletoe.


As the weight increases you lower the reps :thumb:

If you go back to page 216 you'll see ive already done week 1 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 day 2 recovery session

*DEADLIFT: (WU 5X40 - 5X50 - 3X60) 115KGX5 - 120KGX5 - 125KGX5

SQUAT: 115KGX5 - 120KGX5 - 125KGX5*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 day 3 recovery

*SQUAT: (WU 5X40 - 5X50 - 3X60) 125KGX5 - 130KGX5 - 135KGX5*

Felt a "pulling presence" of the old injury on the 135kg set (No pain however) & decided to leave the deadlift session out.

I've got today off to rest, then Friday I will do this work out again with the same weights & include the deadlift session, if I feel safe I will then add some weight & move on.

:thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

Not doing my usual squat sets, Still feeling a little pain/tightness in the left hip flexor. Its funny how I feel that I'm doing jack sh!t in the gym, when not squatting. 

Anyways, I'll make up for it with deads.
Deadlift Wednesday:
DL: 50kg x10, 90kg x5, 130kg x3, 155kg x5
+5 sets with 90kg x6. (Not going as heavy as last DL workout, which left me in DOMS hell).

Squat:
20kg x10, 30kg x10, 60kg x5, 70kg x5, 110kg x3, 70kg x5.
Just wanted to try a heavy triple. Felt good, but couldn't have done 5reps.

OHP:
20kg x10, 30kg x10, 40kg x5, 50kg x5, 55kg x5x2, 60kg x3, 40kg x5.

Dips: 8

I am really loving the deadlift right now and I'm sure I am going to nail it next week, puting the weight at 2x BW. But I definately need more rest and more food. Been slacking a bit the last week.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) WO 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x3 PM 123.5kg
Pendlay Rows: 55x5x10
Dips: BW x 8,8,6,5,4 Total 31

My shoulder is still clicking on Bench Press which is strange as I havent had this for months if not a year. It used to hurt but never click. I dont think the click is effecting my strength but its really putting me off. As I dont want my arm to fall out in a few years and would like my shoulder to work in the future I am going to lower the weight quite abit and aim for 12, 10, 8 across the weeks. When I did the higher reps on Juggernaut it really cleared up a lot of my aches and pains.

I may move my Pendlay Rows up to 60kg as my 20kg and 10kg plates are a few inches different in size and the 10s plates put me in a weird position.

Dips went the worst they have in ages.

Overall Im not to disappointed as I'm kind of doing the intermittant fasting and I added running and rugby to my program so cant expect to set new PRs while adding them.


----------



## Guest

Decided not to push it and have a few days rest. Back to it tonight.

*Squat*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: [email protected]

*Bench*
WU: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 10/6/[email protected]

*Row*
WU: [email protected], [email protected]
WO: 8/6/[email protected]

*Chins*
WU: None
WO: [email protected] (87kg)

Session went well. Was a little slow coming out of the hole on the squats. Just going to play with alternating sessions of standard 3x5 and then slightly higher volume work on bench, row and press. I'll see how it goes. May help me to progress these lift, may not.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Last Recovery session of the two week cycle.

*DEADLIFT: Warm up sets: 3X50 - 3X65 - 3X80 -3X100 - 3X110 - 3X120 - 3X130

DEADLIFT: Work set: 135X5

SQUAT: Warm up sets 3X80 - 3X100 - 3X110 - 3X120 - 3X130

SQUAT: work set: 135X5 *

No pulling sensation with the Deadlifts at all :thumb:

Much diminished pulling sensation in left hamstring compared to the last workout with Squat work set :thumb:

I will now move back to my twice week recovery routine as before. If my injury allows, I will try to increase the squat & deadlift by 10Kg per week up to 150Kg.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*The Bill Starr/Mark Ripptoe Recovery routine*

A few points:

At no time have I ever experienced "PAIN" before during or after the injury, the injury has always felt like a dull pulling sensation, when I tore the muscle due to going too heavy too quick I can only describe the feeling as "tearing soggy/wet paper".

It is easy to misread/ignore the pulling sensation & carry on & re injure yourself as I did the first time many months ago. I would be cautious in regard to the part where it states *"If it's ready to rehab you will know by the pain: if the pain increases during the set, it's not ready, if it stays the same or feels a little better toward the end of the set, it is ready to work".* I would suggest a little more info regarding the pulling sensation of muscle fibres under load etc... There is a hint of this on the SS forum videos.
I re- injured myself during the deadlift the second time; however the Squat seems to highlight the injury far more than the deadlift, hence why my recovery sessions are both lifts, ensuring the hamstring is trained fully for a more complete recovery. The multiple joint exercises we do involve many muscle groups, so it is not so easy to pin point what went wrong. I did look into all the aspects of the days lifting & found it was the squat platform the put me way too low/incorrect body position & putting my recovering hamstring at greater risk (My fault entirely) 

I would suggest you train your recovery this way.

1.	4 days of ice every hour, 20 minutes Max per hour. I noticed a huge difference in recovery compared to last time when only using ice a few times a day, take a week off sick if you have to, but get that ice time in people !!!

2.	Follow the Bill Star routine with strict form; keep monitoring how the muscle feels under the ever increasing load.

3.	A "pulling sensation" in the injured muscle belly is IMHO indicator for you to start being very careful with the weight you are using. This is where it gets fun/ambiguous 

4.	To recover from a muscle tear you need to stress the muscle fibres with a progressive increase in weigh, reducing scar tissue. The body is really crap at repairing muscle tissue if you allow it to recover with just "rest". If you imagine you're muscle fibres like this in a healthy muscle |||||||| all nice & uniform/Strong :thumb:

5.	When a muscle is torn & allowed to recover on its own with no stress/load you'll get a mess of crossed up fibres XX//XX\\XXX creating a weakness within the muscle & the sort of weights we use will hunt that weakness down & increase our chances of re injury etc..

6. If you injured yourself during a multi joint exercise, think about the exercises for the recovery period. Example: The first time I injured my hamstring was during a heavy barbell row set, just bad luck, so should I have recovered doing barbell rows??? Try to involve the injured muscle as directly as possible with the most appropriate multi joint exercises, not just one.
It's a bit long but there is so little info regarding this recovery method & yet it's supposed to be the best of the best. During my research I have found loads of people with muscle belly injuries & questions regarding them, but very few prepared to give some added info regarding it. Ironically once you acquire the info it makes complete sense why progressive resistance is the only true way to repair damaged muscle tissue.

Hope this helps someone :thumb:


----------



## Mark Chandler

Been following 5 x 5 for a couple of months now, and it works really well 

For my aged body I suffered joint pain on straight sets, decent warm up and this has really improved my strength overall.

Normal chap resumed doing weights after a 25 year rest ! After 4 months on straight sets I just felt exhausted, just 2 months into 5x5 my max bench has increased by 10kg from 80kg shoulder press by 8kg, I can now do 40kg vertically.

Squats have improved, I do these with light weights on my back standing max 60kg as I have to be careful of my back but seated leg press started at 150kg now can do 170kg as not afraid to load myself up.

So all good then, this is after my second low rep in the 5 week cycle.

Down side, I just top 13 stone now  although most of this gain is muscle


----------



## Bod42

Friday Work Out:
Jumps: 3x5
Free Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 102.5x3, 117.5x3, 132.5x4 PM 150kg
Deadlifts: 80x5x10
Shoulder Rehab Work

I dont want to make excuses and Im not sure if its even this but I ran Wednesday after my Bench session and then had Rugby on thursday so I think this effected my squats to a degree. Wendler does say when you add conditioning into your program do not expect to hit PRs and your weights will take a slight set back.

Deadlifts felt good but my grip is going already, I want to do these double over hand to keep the stress on my body the same each side. Quite pleased with 80kg, target is 100kg.

I always kept shoulder / RC work at the end of my workout but its just been a few exercises here and there. I decided to add more work back in to try and stop my shoulder clicking. Im still going to lighten my Bench Press though and keep it short of failure so my form is perfect.


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Cycle 4 week 1. Squat & deadlift sessions will be added to the 5/3/1 at some point this year :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 83KGX5 - 96KGX5 -108KGX5

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

I've lowered the assitance work set weigths to help with focus while my hamstring recovers...for the second time 

Tempted to do a pull up routine on the off days :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deadlifts felt good but my grip is going already, I want to do these double over hand to keep the stress on my body the same each side. Quite pleased with 80kg, target is 100kg.


Go for it James, it can be done, I found the best way is too ensure 3-5 mins rest between sets & you'll get the full 5 sets of 10 reps with no bother, also keep it touch n go so you are constantly loading your grip for added power! :thumb:

Why do we do it to ourselves?  Because we can! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mark Chandler said:


> Been following 5 x 5 for a couple of months now, and it works really well
> 
> For my aged body I suffered joint pain on straight sets, decent warm up and this has really improved my strength overall.
> 
> Normal chap resumed doing weights after a 25 year rest ! After 4 months on straight sets I just felt exhausted, just 2 months into 5x5 my max bench has increased by 10kg from 80kg shoulder press by 8kg, I can now do 40kg vertically.
> 
> Squats have improved, I do these with light weights on my back standing max 60kg as I have to be careful of my back but seated leg press started at 150kg now can do 170kg as not afraid to load myself up.
> 
> So all good then, this is after my second low rep in the 5 week cycle.
> 
> Down side, I just top 13 stone now  although most of this gain is muscle


Good to see your workouts going well Mark. If you are concerned about your back & joints, there is no shame in setting your ultimate goals lighter with a higher 10 rep routine :thumb:

Still an Ego free Zone here, yes we want to be strong, but not at the expense of our health :thumb:


----------



## Oats

*5\3\1 Cycle 4 Week 3*

Had a cold first week so decided to do the whole lot again the following week.

Standing Press (51kg) 2 reps, next week 2

Deadlift (130kg) 3 reps, next week 5

Bench Press (75.5kg) 4 reps, next week 4

Squat (105kg) 4reps, next week 6

First session was  and then I barely improved on it without a cold.

Estimated or actual 1RM maxes compared to May when I finished Starting Strength (and was doing three lifts per session rather than one)

Press was 56.5 kg - 54kg now
Dead was 151kg - 151kg now 
Bench was 85kg - 85kg now 
Squat was 120kg - 126kg now

I had this week down as a week to look at my routine and perhaps introduce some changes. Seeing these numbers makes me wonder if I'm not just wasting my time. There's a ton of of other things that I'd like to do and the 5 hours a week lifting takes e.g. to do or compete again in racket sports, climbing, Krav Magna, swimming, British Military Fitness sesisons etc etc. One of the benefits of living in a big city. I don't think time allows it to be both weights and something else. Earlier in the week I was inclined to do something else but now I'm more inclined to alter the routine to address weakpoints for two cycles (5\3\1 triumvate) to see where it goes. Mainly because I'm so bl**dy minded.


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> *The Bill Starr/Mark Ripptoe Recovery routine*
> 
> Hope this helps someone :thumb:


Why not post it on Starting Strength? Then when people search on there they'll find it :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 30x5, 35x3) 42.5x3, 47.5x3, 55x5 PM 64kg
Dips: BWx3, BW+2.5x3, BW+17.5x8
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: BWx 8x2, 2x3

Only got the same reps at the same weight as last month but I'm not to unhappy. My strength has stayed the same and Im loosing weight and doing more fitness so overall I'm ok with this. I'm still on the fence on what to do, eat properly and put on weight and go all out for my strength gains or diet, I need to decide though as at the moment I'm just treading water with no real direction and I been around the same strength for at least 6 months.

Plus point is dips felt really good and I videoed my form to make sure I'm hitting depth and I am.

Im increasing Chin Ups total volume by 1 rep every workout. Slow and steady on these.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Why not post it on Starting Strength? Then when people search on there they'll find it :thumb::thumb:


Having joined SS & viewed a few of the threads i dont feel inclined to post yet. I also think the SS forum lacks moderation :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 30x5, 35x3) 42.5x3, 47.5x3, 55x5 PM 64kg
> Dips: BWx3, BW+2.5x3, BW+17.5x8
> Neutral Grip Chin Ups: BWx 8x2, 2x3
> 
> Only got the same reps at the same weight as last month but I'm not to unhappy. My strength has stayed the same and Im loosing weight and doing more fitness so overall I'm ok with this. I'm still on the fence on what to do, eat properly and put on weight and go all out for my strength gains or diet, I need to decide though as at the moment I'm just treading water with no real direction and I been around the same strength for at least 6 months.
> 
> Plus point is dips felt really good and I videoed my form to make sure I'm hitting depth and I am.
> 
> Im increasing Chin Ups total volume by 1 rep every workout. Slow and steady on these.


Having done Powerlifting for 12 months now I would advise anyone who is not going to compete, to go easy on body weight increases & aim for a middle ground of power & fitness.

I'm also eating less now, I think my own weight (108g/237lb) or 17 stone in English money  is a bit much for my height although my strength goals remain the same. I'm also interested in increasing my fitness, so I'm doing cardio 3X week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery workout

*DEADLIFT Warm up sets: 5X50 - 5X70 - 3X80 - 3X120 - 3X130 - 3X135

DEADLIFT Work Set: 140KGX5*

Slight pulling sensation in left Hamstring, but not much, I'll stay on 140 until it reduces & I feel more confident to move up with the weight :thumb:

I will also split the recovery workouts from now on, which will allow for some added higher rep assitance work to aid recovery :thumb:

My goal for this year is to Deadlift & Squat 150Kg for 5 in complete confidence/no pulling sensation at all.


----------



## leemarksmith

I've dropped deadlift altogether now... Used to do it regularly, dropped it from my routine in the last 5 months or so, went to start it again on my usual weight (idiot) and felt a twinge. 4 weeks later and my back still doesn't feel the same 

Its not effecting any other exercise, even squats etc. But there's something not right, even touching my toes gets a twinge, lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

leemarksmith said:


> I've dropped deadlift altogether now... Used to do it regularly, dropped it from my routine in the last 5 months or so, went to start it again on my usual weight (idiot) and felt a twinge. 4 weeks later and my back still doesn't feel the same
> 
> Its not effecting any other exercise, even squats etc. But there's something not right, even touching my toes gets a twinge, lol.


Have you tried using Ice on the effected area?


----------



## leemarksmith

Ice, heat, all sorts... It will be 4 week Sunday so will go to docs, apart from putting socks on its not effecting anything else really lol.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Sprints: 8x10m, 4x20m
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 137.5x3, 155x3 PM 170.5kg
Squats: 70x5x10

Pleased to get 155kg for 3 reps but they werent pretty. Im making progress but its still disappointing that months ago I did 160 for 5 reps so I'm still weaker at deadlifts than I was. It will take until Feb to hit 160x5 which sucks to look at.

Squats went well. This was probably the easiest week and doing 5x10 definitely helps my form which is a bonus. I like doing the 5x10 even though I thought I would hate it as when Im missing reps on my main exercises at least I'm making reps and increasing the weight on the 5x10 exercises. Make you feel a little better.


----------



## leemarksmith

Do you do any glute work in isolation, like stiff legs lift or weighted hip thrusts etc?
I usually do to brake a plateau, and I drop the weight back on deads and increase reps again for a few week and do the additional work...


----------



## ITHAQVA

leemarksmith said:


> Do you do any glute work in isolation, like stiff legs lift or weighted hip thrusts etc?
> I usually do to brake a plateau, and I drop the weight back on deads and increase reps again for a few week and do the additional work...


We do very little isolation work as our primary goal is pure strength :thumb:

I only do two isolation exercises:

Barbell curls: to add more power/mass to my arms to help in the bench press & overhead press. Also helps with symmetry :thumb:
Standing calf raise to complete the strength chain of my legs to help with my primary lifts (Squat & Deadlift) although at the moment my leg lifts are pathetic, I don't foresee my hamstring injury allowing me to deadlift 185KgX5 again for a good while yet. Calf work helps with symmetry, so many power lifters look really odd with huge legs & tiny Calves


----------



## ITHAQVA

leemarksmith said:


> Ice, heat, all sorts... It will be 4 week Sunday so will go to docs, apart from putting socks on its not effecting anything else really lol.


If your back problem is a muscle injury may I suggest you try the below for four days.

If you can;

Take a week off work, get some Meloxicam 15mg from your doctor (Take one per day) & Ice the effected area for 20 minutes every hour (No longer as it will have adverse effects).

The above does not work for joint issues due to the lack of blood flow (the principle works on blood flow & flushing blood from the damaged area etc...Apparently the flushing of lactose also helps in the rebuilding process)

Use the above with the Bill starr recovery routine (Go back to page 216, i did a brief write up) :thumb:

I've gone from an empty bar to 5X140kg deadlift & 5X135Kg squat in just over two weeks after tearing my hamstring whilst deadlifting 170Kg, last time it took 2.5 months without following the above :thumb:

Hope this helps


----------



## Christianmp

Wednesday workout:
OHP: Some WU-sets, followed by 55kg 5x5 BBB-add-on 27,5kg 10x5.
Deadlift: 60x10, 100x8, 140x3, 160x3, 160x1, 140x4, 100kg x5x6
Barbell curls: 20kgx12, 27,5kg x8, 27,5kg x6
Close grip chin-ups: 3/6/5/4.

Grip was failing on the 3rd 160kg DL rep, and it wasn't the prettiest session. 
Accessory lifts felt really good and I'm feeling pretty good today. No DOMS....for now.


----------



## leemarksmith

I'll give the constant ice a go this weekend, can't have time off work tho 

As for isolation I didn't mean loads of leg extrnsions etc lol, just specific glute targeting as this has always jumped my deadlifts. Even with my back like this its not effecting lifts (although I won't deadlift for a while), Wed I was doing 4 plates a side on the hack squat machine no issues.


----------



## ITHAQVA

leemarksmith said:


> I'll give the constant ice a go this weekend, can't have time off work tho
> 
> As for isolation I didn't mean loads of leg extrnsions etc lol, just specific glute targeting as this has always jumped my deadlifts. Even with my back like this its not effecting lifts (although I won't deadlift for a while), Wed I was doing 4 plates a side on the hack squat machine no issues.


I would get a copy of Jim Wendlers 5/3/1 :thumb:

And have a look at this site: http://www.elitefts.net/


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Week 1 Cycle 4

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 40KGX5 46KGX5 52KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 37.5KG X10X10X10X10X10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT (108Kg) X10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL CURL 37.5KG X10X10X10X10X10*

I'll increase assistance weights for the OHP & Barbell Curl to a nice round 40Kg next session 

Very pleased with Dip progress :thumb::thumb:, I'll add 2.5Kg for next session :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session Week 3 

*SQUAT Warm up sets: 3X70 - 3X90 - 3X120 - 3X130 - 3X135

SQUAT Work set: 5X140KG :thumb::thumb: *

Very pleased with this particular session  No pulling sensation whatsoever in my left Hamstring  :thumb: Yes I could have gone heavier, but I would rather take it steady & not re injure myself ….again.


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Week 2 Cycle 4

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 89KGX3 - 102KGX3 - 115KGX3

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10X10X10X10X10

PULL UP BODYWEIGHT (108Kg) 1X1X1X1X1*

Bench press:
Was a big surprise, the 115Kg didn't feel as heavy as I was expecting, possibly the added dips over the last few months has helped 

Pull-Ups: 
I will apply the same lower intensity method as I did with the dips & not move up until full 5 sets of the same reps achieved. I think this will take a lot longer & be much harder to progress with than the dips, but one must try  I'm going to be a bit more structured in my approach & time 3 minutes rest between each pull up set & increase to 5 minutes when I move up in reps :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x3, 97.5x6
Pendlay Rows: 60x5x5
Dips: BW x 8, 8, 8, 6, 4

Bench Press felt ok but not as fast as I would like so Im going to lower the weight even more. I'm probably going to start Rugby League soon so need my shoulder as healthy as possible and Bench Press is the most useless out of the 4 main exercises for sport. Its also the most dangerous so I dont mind lowering the weight to stay healthly. Also my shoulder has been clicking lately during Bench which cant be good so need to sort that before going heavy.

Pendlay rows felt so much better with the 20 plates. I could have done more than 5 but would rather work up slowly.

Dips felt good as usual but strength on these is dropping off slightly.

Overall I feel like i need a change but I havent been on 5/3/1 that long so need to stick to it but I do feel like Im going backwards.

Monday Workout: 
Jumps: 3x5
Free Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 110x5, 125x3, 140x1
Deadlifts: 82.5x5x10
Abs

This workout looks really bad but I was quite pleased with it. I have taken a massive chunk out of the side of my upper leg. This has swollen the top of my thigh and made it painful to squat. I just wanted to get in do what I could and get out. I need to record my reps again as think now I got my form feeling really good and driving my knees out I am going to deep.

Deadlifts felt brilliant and its a great time to practice form.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Overall I feel like i need a change but I havent been on 5/3/1 that long so need to stick to it but I do feel like Im going backwards.


One thing I have learnt is that training consistency is key to progress :thumb: The idea of changing routines to shock the body into growth IMHO for strength is WRONG. I have the same view with training to positive failure on all sets.

Stick with it mate, it has taken 4 training months to get my bench press back to the weight I was using before going on the 5/3/1.

I've been powerlifting for just over 12 months now & love it; I've had a few setbacks with the hamstring injury (twice!!!), but roll on 2013!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery workout

*DEADLIFT Warm up Sets: 3X70 - 3X90 - 3X120 - 3X130 - 3X135 - 3X140

DEADLIFT Work Set: 5X145KG *

All felt good, no pain :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> One thing I have learnt is that training consistency is key to progress :thumb: The idea of changing routines to shock the body into growth IMHO for strength is WRONG. I have the same view with training to positive failure on all sets.
> 
> Stick with it mate, it has taken 4 training months to get my bench press back to the weight I was using before going on the 5/3/1.
> 
> I've been powerlifting for just over 12 months now & love it; I've had a few setbacks with the hamstring injury (twice!!!), but roll on 2013!!!


I feel like I make better gains when I dont reach positive failure, I think thats why my Bench went up so much during Juggernaut as your only hitting failure once per month but then I find that line hard to find on lower body exercises as I dont want to be a pu33y but want to stay short of failure. This is why I have dropped my Bench Press so much, should make better progress in the long run and help my shoulder so win/win. I just really want to concentrate on my lower body lifts at the moment.

I still like 5/3/1 in that Im hitting each exercise twice a week and even if I'm not progressing very fast with maximum strength, my 5x10 weight is still increasing. This is good mentally to be moving forwards on something every week.


----------



## impster

Hi guys, I'm back.

Been a while - my 5x5 sessions lapsed about July when school holidays started and kids were all over the place being allowed to stay up late etc(!) and then my wife broke her ankle which meant I became a house husband. Summer hols and this then took over, and since then work commitments got in the way (been really hectic). Then of course, here in Machynlleth where I live we've had the harrowing case of little April being taken away from our town which meant that I and many others spent as much time as possible helping with the search efforts, and to be honest, 5x5 was been firmly shelved for a while.

Things are settling back to a normality now, and I need to get back on this.

The gains I made whilst I was doing it were incredible - self confidence, strength, general wellbeing etc. So, I'm going to start again within the next couple of days. Not saying I'll post records on here, but It's something which I enjoyed doing earlier this year, and I want to regain some of the benefits again.

I may well pop in on this thread for some motivation, but even if I don't post regularly, be assured I'll be back on it with you guys.

Impster


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 30x5, 35x3) WO 45x5, 50x3, 57.5x4
Dips: BWx5, BW+10kgx3, BW+25kgx6
Neutral Grip Chins: 3x3, 7x2

Was pleased with 4 reps, it was above my aim of 3 so cant complain.

Really impressed with 25kg and 6 reps. Thats a Predicted Max Dip of 156kg which I think is pretty good.

I changed my Chins round so I do my higher rep sets first instead of last. Just makes things a little easier. All in all a good workout I think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Wed: 20 minutes medium intensity cardio :devil: 

Over the next few weeks I'll work up to 45 minutes medium intensity cardio for 3 times a week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thursday - 20 minutes medium cardio


----------



## Bod42

Cardio in the weights page, WHAT are you playing at Doug :thumb:

I actually went for a run after an upper body workout the other day, shock horror. Faster time than I expected actually. Those 5x10 sets have obviously helped a lot.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cardio in the weights page, WHAT are you playing at Doug :thumb:


:lol::lol::lol:

Have no fear James, 5/3/1 Shoulders/arm session tonight :devil::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Friday 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22x5 28x5 33x3) 43KGx3 - 49KGx3 - 55KGx3

OVERHEAD PRESS 40KGx10x10x10x10x10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+2.5Kg (109.5Kg) 5x5x5x5x5

BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout :thumb:

Dips:
Have added weight, but will use the same method as before but start at 5 sets of 5 reps & try to work up to a full 5 sets of 10 reps, then add another 2.5 etc...


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :lol::lol::lol:
> 
> Have no fear James, 5/3/1 Shoulders/arm session tonight :devil::thumb:


Cardio and Arms, who are you and what have you done with Doug :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cardio and Arms, who are you and what have you done with Doug :doublesho


I noticed a while ago as my bench is getting heavier that i feel my Biceps working on the lift (a Stabiliser muscle?) so I want to make sure my arms get more assitance work, i bench the same as you, with a narrow grip :thumb: 

Also, even though a narrow grip bench is supposed to hit the triceps more, the only place i get slight DOMS is my pecs, weird eh 

Also tempted to add these at some point, i wont use dumbells but just hold onto a weight plate:






Like the idea of training the smaller muscles to help increase my main lift power :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery workout

*SQUAT Warm up Sets: 3x70 - 3x90 - 3x120 - 3x130 - 3x135 -3x140

SQUAT Work Set: 5x145KG*

All good :thumb:

This thread has over 70k views, yet less than a dozen people have posted on here from its start. Not the best time of year to get oneself motivated i know, but if you want your goals you need to be consistent :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> this thread has over 70k views, yet less than a dozen people have posted on here from its start. Not the best time of year to get oneself motivated i know, but if you want your goals you need to be consistent :thumb:


got nothing but admiration for the staying power and determination of guys like you and james doug...you're like machines....:devil:

well, have been lurking on here but not posting as have been off training for over a month now... couple of unavoidable things kept me off for a week or so which became a forknight which became a month...:wall:
not given up to middle age yet tho... getting back to it in next week tho need to move piles of boxes in garage to get to my cage for starters...! going to be starting back at approx half the weights i was doing but not worried about that as over the last month have had a chance to think about my training with a little perspective and really not worried about amount i'm lifting-more concerned with quality and form...i had problems with a gradual loss of form on squat, which i gotta be honest, really knocked me back due to dropping right down on the weight but still struggled with, but not worrying about it now, the consistency is whats important...:thumb:

to echo what you said above doug, this time of year its easy to wait til after xmas for the new year resolutions time to start back training but really can't wait that long so i'll be posting soon...!

rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I noticed a while ago as my bench is getting heavier that i feel my Biceps working on the lift (a Stabiliser muscle?) so I want to make sure my arms get more assitance work, i bench the same as you, with a narrow grip :thumb:
> 
> Also, even though a narrow grip bench is supposed to hit the triceps more, the only place i get slight DOMS is my pecs, weird eh
> 
> Also tempted to add these at some point, i wont use dumbells but just hold onto a weight plate:
> 
> Like the idea of training the smaller muscles to help increase my main lift power :thumb:


Just messing mate. Even wendler advises to throw some bicep curls in to your routine to help your bench press. I was actually looking at my workout the other night and thinking I may throw Barbell Curls and Skull Crushers in at the end of my upper body workouts.

I find the same with my pecs getting DOMS but my triceps dont. I think it must be due to the ROM the triceps go through and the chest is still the main muscle taking the majority of the weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Just messing mate. Even wendler advises to throw some bicep curls in to your routine to help your bench press. I was actually looking at my workout the other night and thinking I may throw Barbell Curls and Skull Crushers in at the end of my upper body workouts.
> 
> I find the same with my pecs getting DOMS but my triceps dont. I think it must be due to the ROM the triceps go through and the chest is still the main muscle taking the majority of the weight.


:thumb:

As for the triceps, i dont think i'll ever do any isolation work for them as they get worked very hard on all my upper body lifts :thumb:

Bench session tonight, its going to be a tough one :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Month 4 Week 3

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 96KGX5 - 108KGX3 - 121KGX1 :thumb:

PULL-UPS (Bodyweigth 108.7Kg) 2x2x2x2x2* :thumb:

Bench Press:
The heaviest ive lifted in 10 years :doublesho, didnt feel as heavy as I was expecting TBH, good for future progress & confidence :thumb:

Pull-ups:
Went very well, but i think from now on they will be very hard to progress with, but I will keep at it :thumb:

Now of to do some christmas shopping - Hence the shorter workout


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press (WU 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) WO 65x5, 75x5, 85x10 PM 113.5kg
Barbell Rows: 60x5x6
Dips: BWx5x8
RC Work

Ok so I lowered my Bench Press considerably as my shoulder has been clicking on every rep and I dont want to do any damage to it but it clicked worse than ever and actually hurt after my set for the 1st time in months. My shoulder and Bench has felt great lately so not sure where this ramdom clicking has come from. The only changes to my workout are the 5/3/1 format, I have been doing dips and weighted dips for months now, maybe its the less frequent Benching as Im only benching once every 9 days which is the lowest frequency I ever done in my life. Starting to think its to little for me as I really dont feel like Im making any progress on 5/3/1.

This exercise felt awesome tonight, just shows how much you use your back during Bench Press as I normally feel abit slow on this exericse but tonight it was fast and easy.

Nice to get 40 reps of dips.

Did some RC work afterwards to try and help with the clicking. Still confused where the clicking has come from. If it continues I may drop the dips but then my shoulder doesnt hurt during Dips so who knows.



ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb:
> 
> As for the triceps, i dont think i'll ever do any isolation work for them as they get worked very hard on all my upper body lifts :thumb:
> 
> Bench session tonight, its going to be a tough one :tumbleweed:


My triceps do get worked hard by BP and SP but Skull Crushers just seem to add size to my arm in just a few workouts and Im sure the extra strength and size wouldnt hurt.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press (WU 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) WO 65x5, 75x5, 85x10 PM 113.5kg
> Barbell Rows: 60x5x6
> Dips: BWx5x8
> RC Work
> 
> Ok so I lowered my Bench Press considerably as my shoulder has been clicking on every rep and I dont want to do any damage to it but it clicked worse than ever and actually hurt after my set for the 1st time in months. My shoulder and Bench has felt great lately so not sure where this ramdom clicking has come from. The only changes to my workout are the 5/3/1 format, I have been doing dips and weighted dips for months now, maybe its the less frequent Benching as Im only benching once every 9 days which is the lowest frequency I ever done in my life. Starting to think its to little for me as I really dont feel like Im making any progress on 5/3/1.
> 
> This exercise felt awesome tonight, just shows how much you use your back during Bench Press as I normally feel abit slow on this exericse but tonight it was fast and easy.
> 
> Nice to get 40 reps of dips.
> 
> Did some RC work afterwards to try and help with the clicking. Still confused where the clicking has come from. If it continues I may drop the dips but then my shoulder doesnt hurt during Dips so who knows.
> 
> My triceps do get worked hard by BP and SP but Skull Crushers just seem to add size to my arm in just a few workouts and Im sure the extra strength and size wouldnt hurt.


Hi James,
Not sure if it will help much but have you tried Cissus for your joints?

As for Dips, I agree they can add to shoulder problems, but I would still stick with them for a while but stay away from weighted dips until you can do a full 5 sets of 10 reps bodyweight, then add 2.5kg, lower you start reps & build up to 10 again & so on.

I would defo try to find out what the clicking is James. Use plenty of ice post workout, 20 minutes every hour & take an anti-inflammatory for a week or so :thumb:

Also, any area that has issues should be warmed up for longer pre workout: static stretches followed by progressive resistance etc.. 
Then post workout: stretches & massage work.

Check out Mike Robertson's Vids on YouTube :thumb:

It's all basic stuff James, which you probably know already but It never hurts to go back to basics, sometimes we miss the obvious (my example was adding the squat platform & re injuring my Hamstring DOH!!!)

And adding size won't hurt mate, I'm finding the 5x10 assistance work has increased my upper body size & strength.

The fourth powerlift!
http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/platform_the_lying_triceps_extension

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Free Squats: (WU 60x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) WO 100x5, 115x5, 130x6 PM 156kg
Deadlifts: 85x5x10

Squats felt really good tonight, I need to video my squats again as I feel like Im going super low but who knows unless I see it on video. I was aiming for 8 but only managed 6 but Im still happy as I feel like a steadied the ship as I had some bad results lately. I also hit 180 golf balls today so my back was fried before I even started. 

Its starting to get warm here and I was sweating ridiculously during these. Anyone whos says that weights dont work your heart and lungs have obviously never lifted properly. My lower back was fried from golf and squats so deadlifts were a killer tonight. 15kg away from my goal. If everything goes to plan I should hit my 100kg x 5 x 10 on 30th January 2013. 

Skipped abs as was going out to watch Cameron loose.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery session :thumb:

*DEADLIFT Warm up Sets: 3X70 - 3X90 - 3X120 - 3X130 - 3X140-3X145

DEADLIFT Work Set: 5x150KG *

Good session, no feeling of injury :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Month 4 Week 3

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 46KGx5 - 52KGx3 - 58.5KGx1

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 2.5Kgx6x6x6x6x6

OVERHEAD PRESS 40x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout :thumb:


----------



## Daffyplum

What would be a good beginners routine? I am 37 and weigh 78kg. I have been bench pressing most Saturdays for about 6 months and training a further 2/3 times.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Daffyplum said:


> What would be a good beginners routine? I am 37 and weigh 78kg. I have been bench pressing most Saturdays for about 6 months and training a further 2/3 times.


http://stronglifts.com/

Stay on the Stronglifts 5x5 for as long as the system states, then move up to Wendlers 5/3/1 with the boring but big assistance exercises.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Recovery Workout.

*SQUAT Warm up Sets: 3X70 - 3X90 - 3X120 - 3X135 - 3X145

SQUAT Work Set: 5x150KG*

Well pleased, all felt gooooood, i'll consider training the squat with the 5/3/1 or possibly wait till I get to 160 before going back to the 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: 
Sprints: 10x10m 1 run every 30 seconds
Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 40x5, 47.5x5, 52.5x7 PM 64.5
Dips: BWx5, BWx5, BW+12.5x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 3x4, 6x2

Was supposed to complete this workout friday but was playing in a big golf comp. I was actually putting on the same green as Lydia Ko which was quite cool. Anyway shoulder press went extremely well and felt good all the way through, I could have done 1 or 2 more but stops at the prescribed reps.

Dips went well. I pleased with the weight Im adding to this exercise and my shoulders feel good during it so cant complain.

Again could have done more chins but kept to my plan. All in all a great workout. I started having a protein shake for breakfast again and I feel so much better than when I was doing intermittant fasting.


----------



## ITHAQVA

5/3/1 Cycle 4 Week 4 (Light week) :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU20X5 30X5 44X3) 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

PULL UPS 2x2x2x2x2

BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Pull ups felt difficult tonight, i managed some half reps after the full reps on sets 1-4 but they dont count! 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday Workout: (Suppose to be done Monday but catching up)
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) WO 100x5, 115x5, 132.5x5 PM 154.5
Free Squats: 75x5x10

I have lightened Deadlifts as I'm running more for Rugby training and I think I can get away with this due to the 5x10 during my squat workout. I realise its crap moving the weight down but I may be starting Leauge soon so need to increase my fitness.

Squats were the hardest they have even been but that makes sense as I increased them by 15kg in 6 weeks which isnt bad progress. I find these sets are more mental as I'm pushing through the burn especially in my lower back.


----------



## sfstu

moving north of vag workout...

well, as i said in a recent post, for one reason or another i haven't been working out for nearly 6 weeks now...:wall: tbh, the last few weeks i could've and should've been working out but just found it really hard to get going again but the guilt of _lurking_ on this thread and reading james' and doug's posts all the time has made me realise its time now to pull my finger out and get back to it...:thumb: 
had a look at my SL spreadsheet last night and realised that i'd actually made pretty good progress with lifts coming from a dead start although i'm going to be dropping those weights down now because of lay off but i can live with that...:thumb:

went for a light, getting-back-to-it workout A today with squats, bench and BBrows all at 40kgs and will do a similar light workout B in a couple of days then get back properly to the SL programme over the weekend..
planning on starting squats light at 50kgs as had a problem before with losing form/depth so want to make sure i'm doing it right before upping the weights to where i was before (105kgish).if it goes ok for several workouts i may increase by 5kgs each time but we'll see...
also gonna start bench,rows,ohp and dead approx 25% lighter than the weights i was previously on due to 6 weeks off and form was starting to slip a little before...

could do with a little help though dietwise guys...? a lot of the time i have a "packed lunch" for work (which can often be long hours) and not always access to a microwave so don't really want to live on sandwiches which is the obvious/easy choice...
what do you guys eat during the day...? not after recipes or anything, just some ideas for healthy, more protien than carb, things to eat...

rgds stu
p.s. feel like a complete noob but nice to be back...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> moving north of vag workout...
> 
> well, as i said in a recent post, for one reason or another i haven't been working out for nearly 6 weeks now...:wall: tbh, the last few weeks i could've and should've been working out but just found it really hard to get going again but the guilt of _lurking_ on this thread and reading james' and doug's posts all the time has made me realise its time now to pull my finger out and get back to it...:thumb:
> had a look at my SL spreadsheet last night and realised that i'd actually made pretty good progress with lifts coming from a dead start although i'm going to be dropping those weights down now because of lay off but i can live with that...:thumb:
> 
> went for a light, getting-back-to-it workout A today with squats, bench and BBrows all at 40kgs and will do a similar light workout B in a couple of days then get back properly to the SL programme over the weekend..
> planning on starting squats light at 50kgs as had a problem before with losing form/depth so want to make sure i'm doing it right before upping the weights to where i was before (105kgish).if it goes ok for several workouts i may increase by 5kgs each time but we'll see...
> also gonna start bench,rows,ohp and dead approx 25% lighter than the weights i was previously on due to 6 weeks off and form was starting to slip a little before...
> 
> could do with a little help though dietwise guys...? a lot of the time i have a "packed lunch" for work (which can often be long hours) and not always access to a microwave so don't really want to live on sandwiches which is the obvious/easy choice...
> what do you guys eat during the day...? not after recipes or anything, just some ideas for healthy, more protien than carb, things to eat...
> 
> rgds stu
> p.s. feel like a complete noob but nice to be back...:thumb:


Nice to see you back Stu :thumb::thumb:

Don't worry about the weights you are using mate, as long as you are lifting that's the main thing & there really is no rush. If you don't want to lift heavy set your goals accordingly :thumb:

As for what to eat at work, no problem eating sandwiches:
I have sandwiches often (Hovis Nimble wholemeal, 51 calories a slice) although it's not all wholemeal.

Fillings: Prawn & Lettuce, Tuna & cucumber or chicken, lettuce & a little curry sauce (Curry powder & light mayo, easy!)

Other food I take to work: 3 boiled eggs (Approx… 18 grams protein). 500ml pots of Tesco Plain yogurt (20gram protein).

I also take some fruit & drink about 1.5 litre of green tea!

As you can see I go for plain food. 
At your level I don't think you have to go mad on Protein intake, 3-4 well balanced meal per day will be fine.
Hope this is off some help Stu :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Good to see you back Stu, as Doug said dont worry about the weights, the main thing is that your lifting. Your see that my weights havent increased much in the last few months but I still enjoy lifting.

As Doug said sandwiches are fine and the good thing is you can easily change the fillings when you get bored.

I'm not really a sandwich eater myself so I batch cook stuff on a Sunday and double portion food during the week so I can take it for lunch the next day. My usual meals are diced chicken with spices, lasagna, spag bowel, curry, etc. I make all these from scratch, none of that out the jar stuff, cheaper, nicer and got to be more healthy


----------



## sfstu

cheers for replies guys...its good to be back although its gonna take a week or so to settle back into my SL routine. not worried about dropping my weights down either, i don't have definate weight targets to lift so that takes the pressure off, still thinking quality over quantity...:thumb:
seems i'm on the right lines foodwise as i already eat fairly well (plenty of room for improvement tho!) its just that sarnies get a little boring sometimes and as i quite often do irregular or long hours its hard to think of something different to eat...i think i'm going to get one of those thermos hot food containers so i can mix it up sometimes with soups and stews etc which i'm going to start having a go at cooking myself with the slow cooker...
looking forward to some DOMS that are sure to follow todays get-back-into-it workout...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

One of my mates has started training and he's going to start training with me, I told him he's going to walk like he's lost his donkey for at least the first week.

Stu not sure what sort of phone you have but a few of my mates keep going on about an App called MyFitnessPal. You can scan the product and it tells you the nutrional values and keeps track of everything that day.


----------



## sfstu

cheers james, downloading it right this second...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> cheers james, downloading it right this second...:thumb:


I downloaded it but havent had a play yet so let me know if its any good. People at the party at the weekend were going crazy about it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I downloaded it but havent had a play yet so let me know if its any good. People at the party at the weekend were going crazy about it.


 :doublesho:doublesho

lol young people today!  I remember when i used to go to parties the only thing I used to go crazy about, was pussy :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Christianmp

So, my hip flexor has been acting strange and been hurting, so I haven't done my regular workouts. Squats are out, or at least heavy squats are. 

I'm giving Bill Starr rehab protocol a go. I'm on day 4 now and it actually feels good squatting the high reps (25) low weight sets.
Monday: 
Squat 25x20, 25x20, 25x25
Bench 85x5x5
Close grip bench 55x10x5

Tuesday:
Squat 25x20, 25x25, 25x30
Dips 8reps BW, 3x8reps BW+10kg
Side lateral plate raise 3x8 5kg 
OHP 3reps 60kg
(this dumbass :wall: just had to try squatting 5reps 60kg and blam! hip flexor pain. STICK TO THE PROGRAM)


----------



## Stevoraith

Hi guys, haven't had the time to read through the thread properly but I've just started on the stronglifts 5x5 program- session 8 tonight so still on light weights (will be 37.5kg squat, 27.5kg OHP and 55kg Deadlift tonight).

Was just wondering if anyone had signed up to the stronglifts inner circle thing? Do you know how much it is? I'm new to lifting and super skinny (69kg at 5'10") so I feel that form checks and form video guides could be really beneficial.

Any thoughts? Are there good free form guides available?


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> :doublesho:doublesho
> 
> lol young people today!  I remember when i used to go to parties the only thing I used to go crazy about, was pussy :devil: :thumb:


:lol::lol:


----------



## sfstu

Stevoraith said:


> Hi guys, haven't had the time to read through the thread properly but I've just started on the stronglifts 5x5 program- session 8 tonight so still on light weights (will be 37.5kg squat, 27.5kg OHP and 55kg Deadlift tonight).
> 
> Was just wondering if anyone had signed up to the stronglifts inner circle thing? Do you know how much it is? I'm new to lifting and super skinny (69kg at 5'10") so I feel that form checks and form video guides could be really beneficial.
> 
> Any thoughts? Are there good free form guides available?


welcome....:wave:
not joined the SL inner circle so can't answer that one for you but well worth your while to regularly post on this thread as some very helpful and experienced people here who'll advise you when needed...:thumb:

if you're wanting to bulk up a little, i'll tell you now what others will tell you...

*EAT EAT EAT!*

on SL programme myself although i have the opposite deal of being too big(fat)...:doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Stevoraith said:


> Hi guys, haven't had the time to read through the thread properly but I've just started on the stronglifts 5x5 program- session 8 tonight so still on light weights (will be 37.5kg squat, 27.5kg OHP and 55kg Deadlift tonight).
> 
> Was just wondering if anyone had signed up to the stronglifts inner circle thing? Do you know how much it is? I'm new to lifting and super skinny (69kg at 5'10") so I feel that form checks and form video guides could be really beneficial.
> 
> Any thoughts? Are there good free form guides available?


Hi mate,

You'll find loads of info & links in this thread, yes its long, but within it there is everything you need. Anything specific just ask.

I've not joined the SL inner circle, but suggest you stick to the 5x5 for a while yet :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :doublesho:doublesho
> 
> lol young people today!  I remember when i *used* to go to parties the only thing I *used* to go crazy about, was pussy :devil: :thumb:


*Used* to hey Doug, I bet you still go crazy every time a hotty walks in. That would explain why you train at home, if you were in a commercial gym it would just be hours of going crazy. :lol::thumb:



Stevoraith said:


> Hi guys, haven't had the time to read through the thread properly but I've just started on the stronglifts 5x5 program- session 8 tonight so still on light weights (will be 37.5kg squat, 27.5kg OHP and 55kg Deadlift tonight).
> 
> Was just wondering if anyone had signed up to the stronglifts inner circle thing? Do you know how much it is? I'm new to lifting and super skinny (69kg at 5'10") so I feel that form checks and form video guides could be really beneficial.
> 
> Any thoughts? Are there good free form guides available?


I thought long and hard about joining the inner circle but I have seen a few forum posts saying at the start it was very useful but then most of the knowledgeable people left so its not worth it now.

As said there is a great deal of info in this thread but if you want expert advice (other than the experts on this thread of course :thumb check out Starting Strength Forum run by Mark Rippletoe and Jim Wendlers articles on T nation and his Q & A section on Elitefts. I think between these sites you can get all the information you need and you find both MR and JW are both straight to the point easy to understand guys. BUT you can get paralysis by over analysis so I would probably stick to the SS forum if/when you hit a problem.

Here's a past post I wrote about weight etc. If your skinny your in an extremely favorable position as you can afford to eat loads and put on weight which in turn means you have the calories to increase muscle and strength quickly. I tained my best mate and he put on 3.5kg in 6 weeks and lost body fat, he started at 70kg and was 6'2" so skinnier than you.



Bod42 said:


> She be very happy in a few months if you start this program. One guy that I trained wife was the most greatful for his new body :lol: Everytime I saw her she thanked me.
> 
> You got to eat on this program and your in a very good position that you can afford to put on weight. A few of us on here including me dont want to get any bigger so have to watch our diet. This is just a rule of thumb but if you start at 5'0" and 100lb you add 10lb for every 1" for minimum weight and add 30-40lb to get your maximum. Cant remember the guy that advisors this off the top of my head but its very similar to Rippletoe's suggestions.
> 
> E.g. I think you said your 6' this would mean a minimum 220lb and maximum 250-260lb. 220lb is approx 15 and half stone so you can afford to put on some weight. Im not saying you have to get to this weight but just using it as an example.
> 
> Is there someone at the gym that can teach you squats, its not essential but obviously helpful. The most important aspect is to hit parallell. Right I'm off to squat.


At 5'10" that works out to a goal weight between 200lb and 240lb or 90kg and 109kg. Once your weights get hard, check out the GOMAD diet.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (Wu 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) 70x5, 80x5, 90x8 PM 114
Pendlay Rows: 60x5x7
Dips: BWx5x9 Total 45 reps

As Im sure you know I have reduced my Bench Press substantially as my shoulder had started clicking. The clicking was still there last night but not as evident as usual which hopefully means Im going in the right direction. I did these reps without a single pause between reps and probably could have done 12.

Rows always start easy like I choosen the wrong weight but the 90 seconds rest soon catches up with you. Really concentrating on good form with this exercise as I believe I need to strengthen my upper back and it will improve most of my exercises.

Dips went well, 45 reps is a record amount on 5/3/1. I did more on Juggernaut but this was with 1 single work set on Bench Press. I seem to have got into a nice groove with 5/3/1 now.


----------



## Stevoraith

Thanks guys, plenty of useful info there, I'll check out the forums Bod mentioned.

I know it sounds odd, but if I'm honest, eating enough is a problem. I guess that's why I'm skinny in the first place! I've been taking hard-gainer protein shakes but I still need to increase my intake.

I could easily up my calories but doing it 'clean' is more challenging! It's something I have to do though so I'll just have to work at it!

I'll have a read through this thread too and I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. Cheers!


----------



## Guest

Don't bother with the StrongLifts Inner Circle thing. Pointless to pay for something you can get for free. 
Most of the original members of the SL forum, when it was free, have since moved to ironstrong.org and it's a friendly place to be with plenty of very knowledgeable members. 

In his naivety, Mehdi ended up chucking all his long standing, experienced members, who had built the forum into what it was, because he got greedy for money.
His SL system is good, but it is just another 5x5 system. They are all pretty much the same. What Mehdi did was promote it and promote compound lifting as the way to overall functional strength. 
This was all part of his business plan, but the side effect in pushing SL high up in the web search engine rankings was to highlight the benefits of compound lifting. He cast a beacon of light over compound lifting that lead may people to taking it up in preference to body building style isolation exercises that are so widely popularised. While I think his business practices are misguided, a small part of me will always be grateful for this.

I find the Starting Strength forums rather venomous and avoid them like the plague, which is a shame because Rippetoes books are excellent and his knowledge vast.

For nutrition, especially lean massing, take a look at rippedbody.jp and leangains.com. Rippedbody is the easier site to navigate, but both are about the same system (LeanGains). Clean bulking takes time. Unfortunately, you just have to accept this. 
I've nearly finished my "cut" and will soon be moving to a lean massing phase. The cut has only taken me a few months, the lean massing I expect to take a couple of years.
I'll add that the LeanGains system is not the only way. It is just one way, but makes a lot of sense to me and fits in with my lifestyle.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

thursdays getting-back-into-it workout... 

did a light workout B today with squats,ohp and deadlifts...all good and now looking forward to re-starting SL proper this weekend, albeit with 25% lighter weights for most exercises and squats starting at 50kg with a possible 5kg per workout increase...:thumb: god, i'd forgotton how nice and short the workouts are at the start of SL, but also still remember how they build up too...:devil:
rgds stu 
p.s. will be having a look myself at the above mentioned leangains (cheers phil), i know its been recommended on here before but really need to get my backside into gear nutritionwise...:thumb:


----------



## Guest

Me too Stu.

Apart from a couple of workouts earlier this month, I've had about 4 months off from lifting. Sort of enforced, since my gym garage has been filled full of building equipment, kitchen units etc while we had an extension built. Spent the time losing weight instead.

Started lifting gain on Monday. Starting low and will hopefully ramp up with 5kg increases as well. The only thing I find is that it takes a few sessions before your muscles get used to lifting weights again, so go steady at first and expect some doms.

Nutrition is a minefield. So many differing views and so many writers with an agenda to push their own stuff, the true science often gets lost.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Me too Stu.
> 
> Apart from a couple of workouts earlier this month, I've had about 4 months off from lifting. Sort of enforced, since my gym garage has been filled full of building equipment, kitchen units etc while we had an extension built. Spent the time losing weight instead.
> 
> Started lifting gain on Monday. Starting low and will hopefully ramp up with 5kg increases as well. The only thing I find is that it takes a few sessions before your muscles get used to lifting weights again, so go steady at first and expect some doms.
> 
> Nutrition is a minefield. So many differing views and so many writers with an agenda to push their own stuff, the true science often gets lost.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


wish i'd spent the last 6 weeks off losing weight...
yep, gonna take it easy for a couple of weeks, was feeling sore yesterday from tues light workout but not too bad and its always a good soreness anyway...:devil:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Stevoraith said:


> Thanks guys, plenty of useful info there, I'll check out the forums Bod mentioned.
> 
> I know it sounds odd, but if I'm honest, eating enough is a problem. I guess that's why I'm skinny in the first place! I've been taking hard-gainer protein shakes but I still need to increase my intake.
> 
> I could easily up my calories but doing it 'clean' is more challenging! It's something I have to do though so I'll just have to work at it!
> 
> I'll have a read through this thread too and I'm sure I'll be back with more questions. Cheers!


If your struggling to put on weight which is a key to increasing strength and muscle. Seriously look at the adding GOMAD (Gallon of milk a Day) to your diet, it adds a heaps of calories, protein and more importantly its the cheapest way as if you tried to do this with meat you would spend a fortune.



BareFacedGeek said:


> Nutrition is a minefield. So many differing views and so many writers with an agenda to push their own stuff, the true science often gets lost.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Just like anything to do with anything fitness related. Look at the program side of things everybody promotes their program. With diet I think you have to try things for a month or 2 and see how they go. Obviously Leangains is working for you but the intermittent fasting just didnt work for my body. Putting the same macros and overall calories in a shorter window of time just didnt work. For me its all about manipulating carbs, high, medium and low days seem to work the best for me.

Stu I looked over that App some more last night and was quite surprised how good it was, I scanned the barcode on my Supplements and they were already in there. Found out the Meatball sub I usually have is 1500 calories plus 3 cookies equals 2200 calories for lunch :doublesho Oops. Anyway the only thing I would change is the suggested % of daily calries from protein, it seems very low and probably more inline with givernment suggestions that are too low for people who exercise. I changed mine to 40% protein, 30% carbs and fat. Good starting point and then change from there.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> *Used* to hey Doug, I bet you still go crazy every time a hotty walks in. That would explain why you train at home, if you were in a commercial gym it would just be hours of going crazy. :lol::thumb:


I dont know what your talking about 

Pussy!!!!!!!!!!!:doublesho:argie::argie: :argie: :argie:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Stu I looked over that App some more last night and was quite surprised how good it was, I scanned the barcode on my Supplements and they were already in there. Found out the Meatball sub I usually have is 1500 calories plus 3 cookies equals 2200 calories for lunch :doublesho Oops. Anyway the only thing I would change is the suggested % of daily calries from protein, it seems very low and probably more inline with givernment suggestions that are too low for people who exercise. I changed mine to 40% protein, 30% carbs and fat. Good starting point and then change from there.


not had a chance to have a look at it properly yet but going to over the weekend...good tip for the protein calories...:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

monday workout...
did workout A of SL, light weights of squat 50kg,bench 45kg and BBRows 45kg..no probs anywhere, as well there shouldn't at these weights! but gotta admit its nice at this level as its such a quick and non-draining workout...! wanted to put the bench and BBRows up a bit more but held back as 1st real workout for 6 weeks...:doublesho

however....
bit of a quandry for me workoutwise at the moment though... we've had our house on the market for last couple of months and just accepted an offer, which although is a long way off from actually moving, we are planning in a few weeks time to start packing up a lot of stuff thats not needed daily and guess where its gotts be stored...? yep, my garage/gym...
no choice really and as my cage and bench takes up a good third of the end of garage theres no option for being able to use it once stuff starts getting stored in here...my bike lives in the garage and my tools and other stuff in garage alone once boxed will fill the area my gym is in and have nowhere else to put gym...:wall:

this is all unavoidable and obviously i need to put the house move (fingers crossed!) first for a couple of months so my quandry is, having been off the weights now for 6 weeks or so, is it worth starting back up (at 60% of where i was) for what will probably be only 3 weeks or so before having to stop again...?
am thinking not, (although i was all fired up last week to get right back into lifting!:wall, and am thinking of taking a leaf from phil's book where he said a couple of posts back that he'd been off lifting for a few months and spent the time instead losing some weight, which is something i really want to do but was finding difficult doing the SL programme...

i'm thinking of maybe trying the intermittant fasting a couple of days a week along with just generally eating a bit less and better and exercise wise doing plenty of walking (which is something wendler recommended i think?) with some regular pressups and ab work...hopefully this would all result in some weight (hopefully fat!) loss over next couple of months when i will return to the SL programme pretty much where i am at this moment lifting wise...

any suggestion for other exercises i could do on the living room floor like pressups...?

lifting or not, i will still be keeping up with this thread and hopefully you all won't mind if i post from time to time until such time as i can start back and be dedicated and focussed on lifting, hopefully in a nice new bigger home gym...:thumb:

rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Stu, The foot print of the Rack isnt that big and the Bench can be stored upright in the rack so shouldnt take up to much room but your call.

Anyway there are plenty of BW exercises you can do. I know some people dont believe you can get strong, big etc using just BW but they go up to some nearly impossibly hard exercises for us mere mortals.

Check out http://www.beastskills.com for some ideas.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout: 
Jumps: 3x5
Free Squats: (WU 60x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) 107.5x3, 122.5x3, 137.5x5 PM 160.5kg
Deadlifts: 87.5x5x10

Really good workout, I was zoned in and hit all my reps well. Im going extrememly deep in my squats so I could probably squat an inche or 2 higher but I rather be low than high.

Deadlifts, I always find the first set really hard and the 3rd set the easiest. I only have 12.5 kg to hit my goal of 100kg for 5 sets of 10 reps. Hopefully I will hit this in 5 weeks. 

Saturday Update: I have been considering a return to proper full contact rugby and the more I play Tag rugby and therefore the more proper rugby players I meet who keep asking me to play the more I am consdering playing. But I think I have now decided this is totally off the cards sadly. I knocked my shoulder last thursday and it was so painful, it was the smallest knock but still felt like crap for a few days. And then I went to a BBQ/Party saturday and got roped in to an Arm Wrestling comp which they apparently do every year. I won which was cool and especially against a couple of guys who were boosting that they just come off the juice. Anyway the reason Im writing all this crap is that it completely blew out my shoulder, I couldnt feel my hand for the rest of the weekend and therefore missed last nights shoulder press workout. My shoulder was feeling good and its a hugh blow to realise that no matter how good it feels it was always be screwed.

Think I stick to golf instead of rugby but even that kills my shoulder.


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Stu, The foot print of the Rack isnt that big and the Bench can be stored upright in the rack so shouldnt take up to much room but your call.
> 
> Anyway there are plenty of BW exercises you can do. I know some people dont believe you can get strong, big etc using just BW but they go up to some nearly impossibly hard exercises for us mere mortals.
> 
> Check out http://www.beastskills.com for some ideas.





Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Jumps: 3x5
> Free Squats: (WU 60x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) 107.5x3, 122.5x3, 137.5x5 PM 160.5kg
> Deadlifts: 87.5x5x10
> 
> Really good workout, I was zoned in and hit all my reps well. Im going extrememly deep in my squats so I could probably squat an inche or 2 higher but I rather be low than high.
> 
> Deadlifts, I always find the first set really hard and the 3rd set the easiest. I only have 12.5 kg to hit my goal of 100kg for 5 sets of 10 reps. Hopefully I will hit this in 5 weeks.
> 
> Saturday Update: I have been considering a return to proper full contact rugby and the more I play Tag rugby and therefore the more proper rugby players I meet who keep asking me to play the more I am consdering playing. But I think I have now decided this is totally off the cards sadly. I knocked my shoulder last thursday and it was so painful, it was the smallest knock but still felt like crap for a few days. And then I went to a BBQ/Party saturday and got roped in to an Arm Wrestling comp which they apparently do every year. I won which was cool and especially against a couple of guys who were boosting that they just come off the juice. Anyway the reason Im writing all this crap is that it completely blew out my shoulder, I couldnt feel my hand for the rest of the weekend and therefore missed last nights shoulder press workout. My shoulder was feeling good and its a hugh blow to realise that no matter how good it feels it was always be screwed.
> 
> Think I stick to golf instead of rugby but even that kills my shoulder.


hi james...i already have to store my bench upright when not in use due to lack of room in my garage and the 7ft barbell only has about 9in clearance either side which keeps me accurate if nothing else...! my garage serves as gym, workshop, storage for my bike and kit plus all my tools and other crap thats kept in here all as well as being my mancave...:devil:
when time comes for having to start packing stuff up there will no way be room to be able to use my gym...
however, talking to my missus last night and there is a _possibility_ of moving our no.3 son into room with no.s 1 and 2 sons therefore freeing up the boxroom for storage although this is only a possibilty right now, have decided to carry on training for now and see what happens...
as i'm starting back with light weights i won't get time to get up to real heavy weights before the upheaval of moving so not gonna go mad eating for size as SL recommends...
had a real quick look at that link you posted and looks good site, will have more of a look when i get time later...:thumb:

sorry to hear about your shoulder affecting your decision to play rugby again...? i've suffered with a dodgy shoulder for years now-its why i stopped lifting years ago on advice from physio, (tho feels better these days after lifting for last few months!)...its worse in mornings as i tend to sleep on my side, squashing my shoulder up and can't seem to stop this...affects me most when driving for many hours or doing ramdom stuff over my head like decorating so can imagine what a blow for you for it to stop you doing the sports you want...


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: (Done Tuesday)
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) 45x3, 50x0
Weighted Dips: Skipped
Chins: 5x3, Skipped 5x2
RC Circuit

Ok so I was going to miss this workout due to my shoulder but the Mrs pissed me off so thought I would do it anyway. Stupid mistake, the warm ups felt ok but as soon as I got to anywhere near my work weight I could feel it right through my shoulder, down my bicep and into my thumb. Couldnt even do 1 rep of my last warm up. Im glad I won arm wrestling otherwise I would have been extremely annoyed screwing my shoulder and loosing at the same time.

Didnt even attempt dips.

Did chins between my SP sets and it was hurting my shoulder and bicep a lot so cut the sets short. Conclusion, my shoulder is ****ed again, ********.

RC circuit to pump some blood into my RC as this normally relieves the pain slightly.

Stu, a lot of shoulder pain is caused at night from sleeping on it. I know Elitefts sell a shoulder rehab system that comes with a support you wear at night and it keeps your shoulder in alignment but cant imagine its to comfy. I will just step up my rehab work again and hopefully it will take the pain away abit.


----------



## sfstu

i was surprised at the ohp not actually hurting my shoulder when i started lifting again...? it got better too as long as i kept my form good and although i only got to around 45kgs for ohp and was increasing by 1kg a time rather than 2.5kg that was way better than i expected....

bench has always bothered me more shoulderwise and its also what put me off dips (plus my weight vs strength:lol but bench is ok as long as i keep the form good with my shoulder blades pinched together as much as poss...
my shoulder has been like it for years tbh and i'm not even sure when i first injured it and have kinda got used to it over the years...try not to sleep on it but always seem to wake up with it squashed up under me...someone once suggested taping a marble to my arm/shoulder so when i rolled over on to it in my sleep it'd be uncomfortable and i'd move...never tried it tho..!
yours sounds a lot worse than mine tho james, did you injury it playing rugby...?


----------



## Christianmp

I know I'm not being very consistent with updating my training on the site, but here goes last workout. 

Squats are out, was getting annoyed with the hip flexor pain, so I'm going to discard squats entirely for a 2 week period. 

Wednesday workout: 
OHP: 2x10x20kg, 10x30kg, 5x40kg, 5x60kg, 6x55kg, 8x50kg, 8x40kg. 
Deadlift: 10x60kg, 6x80kg, 5x100kg, 3x130kg, 3x150kg, 5x130kg.
Clean&Press: 2x5x40kg (working on technique).
Side lateral DB raise: 3x8x5kg

Tore a callus in my left hand during the 150kg deadlift, leaving the bar grip smeared in blood. Enjoying my newly acquired battle-scar I proceeded with some extra reps at 130kg. It was a good workout. Hand a bit sore today but already healing up nicely.


----------



## sfstu

weds workout done today...
did workout b of sl, squats 55kg,ohp 35kg,dead 50kg...
not much to say at these sorta weights but squats i'm making sure to go nice and deep (can you go too deep...?) and still planning on increasing this by 5kgs each time til i reach a 100kgs then slow it down to 2.5kg increases...
ohp i will increase by 2.5kgs for next 3 workouts or so then prob drop back to 1kg increases as i was doing before...
deadlift at 50 kg felt ridiculously light so i did 3 sets... thinking of increasing this by 10 kg each workout until 100kgs then resume regular 5kg increases...
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

Nice return workout Stu. I'm doing pretty much the same atm.



sfstu said:


> squats i'm making sure to go nice and deep (can you go too deep...?)


Not really, just makes the exercise harder the deeper you go and will work the posterior chain even more. The only thing to look out for is lower back rounding due to lack of flexibility. I say keep with the deep squats. You'll probably find you naturally raise the depth as the weight goes up.


----------



## sfstu

saturdays workout...
workout A of SL which was squats @ 55kg, bench @ 45kg and BBRows also @ 45kg...all good...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> iyours sounds a lot worse than mine tho james, did you injury it playing rugby...?


Dislocated it 7 times now. Been told by numerous Doctors/Surgeons/Physio's etc that it needs surgery.

Most people will find Bench Press hurts their shoulders more than Shoulder Press. I was the same when I came back from my last dislocation, I could SP pain free but even unracking the BP was agony.

What annoys me the most though is that it hurts while I squat.


----------



## Bod42

Doesnt look like I put my last workouts on here.

Wednesday Workout:
Sprints: Skipped due to rain, I know what kind of weight lifter misses an exercise due to rain.
Deadlifts: (WU 62.5x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) 107.5x3, 125x3, 140x3 PM 154kg
Squats: 77.5x5x10 

A decent workout but nothing to be pleased about as I deloaded my Deadlifts. I know I could lift more if I let my form abit looser but theres no point when I just lift for fun and fitness.

Squats felt good but they didnt half hurt my shoulder. If I get my weight next workout I will only be 20kg away from my target which Im pleased about. I know I started light but I also havent missed a weight yet and Im dipping with sweat when I finish these with shorter rest so they are working my fitness hard.

I missed Fridays workout as it was Bench Press and theres no point even trying wth the way my shoulder feels. I went to the beach sunday and jumped on my Body Board and felt my shoulder pop backwards slightly so was in a lot of pain for the rest of the day and night. Might even drop Bench Press and replace it with an entire workout of rehab work.


----------



## sfstu

can imagine you're proper effed off with your shoulder at the mo james...
looking on the plus side tho, your sentance about going to the BEACH with your BODYBOARD made me smile...its about 0degrees in my garage and although i have a small gas fire in there, my bar is so ice cold i actually put on some old lifting gloves the other day-bar was like ice...:devil:
currently working out with a scarf and woolly hat on...

mondays workout B of SL...
squats @ 60kg, ohp @ 37.5kg and dead @60 kg...all good although finding ohp hard but its always been my weakest exercise...
also added 3 sets of 8 of bicep curls...
as i'm covering old ground and weights are pretty light i won't be commenting much but will still post workouts...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

lol, dont tell me about injuries!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Anyhow back to training :thumb:

Week 1 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) - 84KGx5 - 97KGx5 - 110KGx5

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Glad i took the last two weeks off, felt very fresh after workout & the weights felt goooooooooooood!  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Jumps: 3x5
Squats: (WU 70x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) WO 115x5, 130x3, 145x4 PM 164.5kg
Deadlifts: 90x5x10
Inverted Rows Supersetted with Scapular Push Ups

I was surprised to get 4 reps but very pleased as lately I have been struggling with the heavier weeks but getting high reps on the lighter weeks. For instance last month I got 125x8, 132.5x4, 140x1. So 15kg higher and I lost 7 reps. This month I went 130x6, 137.5x5, 145x4. That means 15kg increase but only a lost of 2 reps so pleased with that. Next month will be the heaviest I lifted in a while so the workout is working.

Deadlifts felt really good, tough and go high rep feels like a nice exercise whereas I do hate heavy deadlifts, they just never feel right. I feel like I can keep my lower back tensed throughout with touch and go. Only 10kg until my Target but think I will just keep going for as long as I can with these as I think its these BBB sets that are really increasing my strength.

Did some upper back and RC work. For anyone who has been doing Barbell Rows for a while, try inverted rows. I found these harder than I expected and they pumped the hell out of my forearms.



sfstu said:


> can imagine you're proper effed off with your shoulder at the mo james...
> looking on the plus side tho, your sentance about going to the BEACH with your BODYBOARD made me smile...its about 0degrees in my garage and although i have a small gas fire in there, my bar is so ice cold i actually put on some old lifting gloves the other day-bar was like ice...:devil:
> currently working out with a scarf and woolly hat on...
> 
> mondays workout B of SL...
> squats @ 60kg, ohp @ 37.5kg and dead @60 kg...all good although finding ohp hard but its always been my weakest exercise...
> also added 3 sets of 8 of bicep curls...
> as i'm covering old ground and weights are pretty light i won't be commenting much but will still post workouts...
> rgds stu


Ya pretty mad but thats life really. I will see how my Shoulder Press workout goes tomorrow but I have decided to replace my Bench Press with a Shoulder Health plan for the next month. Im also going to take a band to work and do pull aparts at work as I sit at a desk so this should hopefully help as well.

Ya christmas over here is normally 30 degrees but never feels like christmas. You need a good slush to feel like christmas.

Hey Stu whats with the curls :lol: Funny you added them, I just added 2 sets of Barbell curls to my BP workout and Skull Crushers to the end of my OHP workout.


----------



## Alex L

Just started 5/3/1 Borin but Big this week, interesting to see how it's going to go.

Just a couple of questions, how long should I be looking at for rest periods between sets? (warm up/5-3-1/BBB)

And is the BBB 5 sets of 10 or 10 sets of 5?



Bod42 said:


> Ya christmas over here is normally 30 degrees but never feels like christmas. You need a good slush to feel like christmas.


Try spending most of you life having a cold Christmas then swapping over, seems really weird watching Christmas films in the summer lol


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60x5 75x5 90x3) 114KGx5 - 131KGx5 - 149KGx5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10

CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10*

Took it easy on the assitance work as its the first time ive done it in ages, im expecting some DOMS!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Alex L said:


> And is the BBB 5 sets of 10 or 10 sets of 5?


Alex, BBB is 5 sets of 10 reps :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Alex L said:


> Just started 5/3/1 Borin but Big this week, interesting to see how it's going to go.
> 
> Just a couple of questions, how long should I be looking at for rest periods between sets? (warm up/5-3-1/BBB)
> 
> And is the BBB 5 sets of 10 or 10 sets of 5?
> 
> Try spending most of you life having a cold Christmas then swapping over, seems really weird watching Christmas films in the summer lol


Thats what I done Alex, Im originally a POM, been over here 2 years in January. Made a point of going in my friends out door pool last christmas day just to highlight how weird it is.

Anyway I kind of made my own rest periods up after trial and error. I warm up quite fast but then rest 3,4 & 5 mins on work sets of lower body and 2:30, 2:30, 3 mins on upper body.

Depending on what you want from the BBB sets depends on your rest periods. 30-60 seconds, fitness and size, 60-120 size and fitness, longer strength. I like to hit multiple fitness/strength aspects at one time so long rest periods on the heavy first exercise and then the second exercise I use 2 mins rest on lower and 1:30 on upper body.

Depending on your strength levels I find BBB opposite works better and Wendler has started advising this as well as you hit each exercise twice per run through instead of once.

For instance my workout Monday went as follows:
Warm Up: 
40% - 60x5 Rest as Needed
50% - 77.5x5 Rest as Needed
60% - 92.5x3 Rest 3 mins

Worksets:
75% - 115x5 Rest 4 mins
85% - 130x3 Rest 5 mins
95% - 145x4 Die

Deadlifts: 90kg x 5 sets of 10 - 2:00 Rest between each.


----------



## Alex L

ITHAQVA said:


> Alex, BBB is 5 sets of 10 reps :devil: :thumb:


Phew, glad I got that right then lol



Bod42 said:


> Thats what I done Alex, Im originally a POM, been over here 2 years in January. Made a point of going in my friends out door pool last christmas day just to highlight how weird it is.


Ah, yes it's just not right lol. One of my bosses has been here over 30 years and still hasn't got used to it.



Bod42 said:


> Anyway I kind of made my own rest periods up after trial and error. I warm up quite fast but then rest 3,4 & 5 mins on work sets of lower body and 2:30, 2:30, 3 mins on upper body.
> 
> Depending on what you want from the BBB sets depends on your rest periods. 30-60 seconds, fitness and size, 60-120 size and fitness, longer strength. I like to hit multiple fitness/strength aspects at one time so long rest periods on the heavy first exercise and then the second exercise I use 2 mins rest on lower and 1:30 on upper body.
> 
> Depending on your strength levels I find BBB opposite works better and Wendler has started advising this as well as you hit each exercise twice per run through instead of once.
> 
> For instance my workout Monday went as follows:
> Warm Up:
> 40% - 60x5 Rest as Needed
> 50% - 77.5x5 Rest as Needed
> 60% - 92.5x3 Rest 3 mins
> 
> Worksets:
> 75% - 115x5 Rest 4 mins
> 85% - 130x3 Rest 5 mins
> 95% - 145x4 Die
> 
> Deadlifts: 90kg x 5 sets of 10 - 2:00 Rest between each.


I've always done 1-2 minute rest periods, never realised the rest period went towards the what specific goals are. I'm going more for strength and hoping for a bit of size as a side effect, so a longer rest period would be more beneficial.

I used this calculator for my weights, does it look about right? http://www.strstd.com/


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> ...its about 0degrees in my garage and although i have a small gas fire in there, my bar is so ice cold i actually put on some old lifting gloves the other day-bar was like ice...:devil:
> currently working out with a scarf and woolly hat on...


I'll see your hat and scarf and raise you x2 tshirts, a jumper, hat and cup of coffee  Roll on deep winter - NOT!


----------



## Bod42

Alex L said:


> I've always done 1-2 minute rest periods, never realised the rest period went towards the what specific goals are. I'm going more for strength and hoping for a bit of size as a side effect, so a longer rest period would be more beneficial.
> 
> I used this calculator for my weights, does it look about right? http://www.strstd.com/


Rippletoe suggests 5-7 mins rest if your after strength. I like to use the main exercise of the day for strength and then use the assistance exercises for size.

That site looks pretty good and it automatically starts you at 90% which is what your supposed to do. Only small issue is that it seems to round to the nearest 5kg instead of 2.5kg, may be an issue on upper body exercises.

I always make my own spreadsheets so I can print them and take them to the gym with me.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 47.5x5, 52.5x3, 60x3 PM 66kg
Weighted Dips: BWx5, BW+12.5x3, BW+27.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 6x3

Very pleased to get my goal reps in this workout considering the way my shoulder feels. I was aiming to just get the minimum 1 rep but it felt good once I started and there was no real pain so carried on. My right shoulder definitely felt weaker but not as much as I expected. Its more the joint, tendons, ligaments, etc that are damage and not so much the muscle so if I can pump enough blood round and stop the pain then I can train.

I thought dips would hurt my shoulder but they were fine and Im glad to add another 2.5kg.

Heres the exercise that killed my shoulder. Chin ups were the only exercise of the night that hurt my shoulder and the last set I stupidly pushed and the pain was shooting down my bicep into my hand. Need to learn when to pull back.


----------



## Alex L

Bod42 said:


> Rippletoe suggests 5-7 mins rest if your after strength. I like to use the main exercise of the day for strength and then use the assistance exercises for size.
> 
> That site looks pretty good and it automatically starts you at 90% which is what your supposed to do. Only small issue is that it seems to round to the nearest 5kg instead of 2.5kg, may be an issue on upper body exercises.
> 
> I always make my own spreadsheets so I can print them and take them to the gym with me.


Sh!t I'd never get home lol

I write it all down and take it to the gym, feels quite weird dropping the weights again but feels really good at the moment.


----------



## Bod42

Alex L said:


> Sh!t I'd never get home lol
> 
> I write it all down and take it to the gym, feels quite weird dropping the weights again but feels really good at the moment.


Well you bypassed the stronglift 5x5 so imagine that with 5 mins rest and the 3 exercises. Thats an hour & 10mins of resting alone, let alone the warming up, setting up and actually doing the exercise. Makes for an extrememly long workout.

Your dropping the weights but remember the last set is for As Many Reps as Possible. So you should still be hitting a similar Predicted Max, e.g. 150kg x 5 reps = PM 175kg compared with 10% less so 135kg x 9 reps = PM 175kg


----------



## Alex L

Bod42 said:


> Well you bypassed the stronglift 5x5 so imagine that with 5 mins rest and the 3 exercises. Thats an hour & 10mins of resting alone, let alone the warming up, setting up and actually doing the exercise. Makes for an extrememly long workout.
> 
> Your dropping the weights but remember the last set is for As Many Reps as Possible. So you should still be hitting a similar Predicted Max, e.g. 150kg x 5 reps = PM 175kg compared with 10% less so 135kg x 9 reps = PM 175kg


Been hitting max and struggling on the 5+ which is good (managing 8-12).

Realised I mucked up my OHP by not including the 20kg bar 

So recalculating that for next week.

This week I did:

*OHP*
wu - 15x5, 15x5, 20x3
5/3/1 - 20x5, 25x5, 25x5+ (10)
BBB - 5x10 x15

(need to adjust this to include the bar lol).

*DL*
wu - 70x5,85x5,100x3
5/3/1 - 110x5,125x5,145x5+ (8)
BBB - 5x10x85

*Bench*
wu - 40x5,55x5,65x3
5/3/1 - 70x5,80x5,90x5+ (8)
BBB - 5x10x55

*Squat*
wu - 45x5,55x5,70x3
5/3/1 - 75x5,85x5,95x5+ (8)
BBB - 5x10x55

According to the calculator my 1RM are:

OHP - 36 (needs adjusting)
D/L - 189
Squat - 127
Bench - 119


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22x5 28x5 33x3) 41.5KGx5 48KGx5 54.5KGx5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 2.5KGx7x7x7x7x7

OVERHEAD PRESS 40KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All nice & easy, cant wait to get heavy on the OHP :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

thurs workout done today...
workout A of SL, squat 65kg, bench 50kg, BBRows 50kg...
all went ok but tbh felt really weak and lethargic but then been eating crap last couple o days so thats probably got a lot to do with it...!
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60x5 75x5 90x3) 114KGx5 - 131KGx5 - 149KGx5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All felt really good, I will continue with slow & steady, this means it will take approx...7 months to get to my already achieved 5x185 , but I would rather be able to lift than not at all  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 60x5 75x5 90x3) 114KGx5 - 131KGx5 - 149KGx5
> 
> DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> All felt really good, I will continue with slow & steady, this means it will take approx...7 months to get to my already achieved 5x185 , but I would rather be able to lift than not at all  :thumb:


Slow and steady has got to be the way to do it mate. I know its a pain in the **** but I know how you feel. I have just completely dropped Bench Press from my routine to try and improve my shoulder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Slow and steady has got to be the way to do it mate. I know its a pain in the **** but I know how you feel. I have just completely dropped Bench Press from my routine to try and improve my shoulder.


Injuries suck, however I'm using this to my advantage & I'm adopting a relaxed leangains approach to my nutrition. I've lost 2.5Kg already which is a good start, I will continue to monitor my progress & goals :thumb:

I think managing one's own expectations is a major deciding factor in weight/fat loss
Initial goal is to reduce my calorific intake (Currently down to 1800Kcal per day) & aim for 15% Body fat in a sensible time frame - 6 months (this will allow me to adapt & keep increasing my strength gains).

Lift on!!!! 

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

another injury doug? sorry to hear that mate... at least you've started the fatloss thing with almost half stone already...:thumb:

monday workout, workout B of SL...
squat 70kg, ohp 37.5kg, dead 70 kg
squat went ok although was wary as lower back a little sore (i think from BBRows the other day), still getting nice and deep-parallel or slightly lower sometimes, 5kg increase each time is fine so far but will be slowing it back down to 2.5kg around the 85kgish mark...
ohp i'm a little disapointed in as really weak on this... got up to about 45kg before but struggling a little at present weight... made todays weights so gonna increase by 2.5kg to 40kgs then drop back to 1kg increases...slow and steady wins the race i guess...:thumb:
dead was ok and have been increasing this by 10kg eack workout but this too will shortly slow back to correct increases of 5kg each time...

bit gutted that recently my SL spreadsheet went FUBAR and i now can't enter any weights but now using an exercise book and pencil so alls good...old school..
all quiet on the house move front at the mo...:wall: house back on the market in january so gonna continue training as long as possible, which in all honesty could be for months yet...
good to be back and posting regularly (sort of!)
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> another injury doug?


No mate, the same one lol! I think you may have missed a few of my posts!


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> No mate, the same one lol! I think you may have missed a few of my posts!


not been on so much recently...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Injuries suck, however I'm using this to my advantage & I'm adopting a relaxed leangains approach to my nutrition. I've lost 2.5Kg already which is a good start, I will continue to monitor my progress & goals :thumb:
> 
> I think managing one's own expectations is a major deciding factor in weight/fat loss
> Initial goal is to reduce my calorific intake (Currently down to 1800Kcal per day) & aim for 15% Body fat in a sensible time frame - 6 months (this will allow me to adapt & keep increasing my strength gains).
> 
> Lift on!!!!
> 
> :thumb:


Nice weight lost their Doug. I decided Im going to make an effort to loose 5kg so Im 100kg. A few months back I wanted to be 95kg but I think this is to light for my frame. Im not counting calrories but I will just change my carbs depending on the day, Protein and fat will stay the same but will be doing low carb on non-training days, medium carb on upper body and high carb on lower body. I used this during a bulk before and it allowed me to add weight without to much fat and from experience it works the other way to.

Monday Workout: Deload Week
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: Have completely dropped Bench Press for 4 weeks while I complete the 8 weeks to monsterous shoulders program. Only doing the 1st 4 weeks prehab workout.

Reach, Roll & Lift, Dumbell External Rotation, L-Lateral Raises Giant Set
YTWL, Seated Cable Row with Rope to Neck
Push-up Plus on Swiss Ball
Static Stretching of the Lats and Pecs

Barbell Rows: 60 x 5, 5, 5
Dips: BW x 5, 5, 5

As its deload week its obviously very easy week weight wise. The shoulder workout felt really good but I did make a few changes. The rows to neck I used a band instead of a cable as I workout at home and therefore dont have a cable stack. And I did push ups on my medicine ball instead of swiss ball which is actually harder.

Rows and dips were easy. Dips felt especially good as my shoulders were pumped which seemed to protect my shoulders.

Im considering dropping all pressing, other than the main exercises, for 1-3 months after I finished this Shoulder Program and replace them with back exercises. Or I may drop them while doing this program for 4 weeks, its only 4 weeks out of a life of training and really if my shoulder is better I will be able to progress better in the long run so I think this is what I will do. A lot of athletes with shoulder problems are put on a 2:1 or even 3:1 pulling to pushing ratio which helps with shoulder issues. In the long run I think this will be a clever idea.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice weight lost their Doug. I decided Im going to make an effort to loose 5kg so Im 100kg. A few months back I wanted to be 95kg but I think this is to light for my frame. Im not counting calrories but I will just change my carbs depending on the day, Protein and fat will stay the same but will be doing low carb on non-training days, medium carb on upper body and high carb on lower body. I used this during a bulk before and it allowed me to add weight without to much fat and from experience it works the other way to.
> 
> Monday Workout: Deload Week
> Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
> Bench Press: Have completely dropped Bench Press for 4 weeks while I complete the 8 weeks to monsterous shoulders program. Only doing the 1st 4 weeks prehab workout.
> 
> Reach, Roll & Lift, Dumbell External Rotation, L-Lateral Raises Giant Set
> YTWL, Seated Cable Row with Rope to Neck
> Push-up Plus on Swiss Ball
> Static Stretching of the Lats and Pecs
> 
> Barbell Rows: 60 x 5, 5, 5
> Dips: BW x 5, 5, 5
> 
> As its deload week its obviously very easy week weight wise. The shoulder workout felt really good but I did make a few changes. The rows to neck I used a band instead of a cable as I workout at home and therefore dont have a cable stack. And I did push ups on my medicine ball instead of swiss ball which is actually harder.
> 
> Rows and dips were easy. Dips felt especially good as my shoulders were pumped which seemed to protect my shoulders.
> 
> Im considering dropping all pressing, other than the main exercises, for 1-3 months after I finished this Shoulder Program and replace them with back exercises. Or I may drop them while doing this program for 4 weeks, its only 4 weeks out of a life of training and really if my shoulder is better I will be able to progress better in the long run so I think this is what I will do. A lot of athletes with shoulder problems are put on a 2:1 or even 3:1 pulling to pushing ratio which helps with shoulder issues. In the long run I think this will be a clever idea.


Cheers James, at 15% body fat I estimate I will be around 90Kg, then I will try to maintain the 15% & increase my strength to my ultimate goals.

James, why don't you just do powerlifting but with a 10 rep range, that way you will use much less weight & stay healthy :thumb:

Having done powerlifting for just over 12 months now, I can honestly say it is not for everyone, in fact I think only a very small percentage will stick with it.

For me personally, heavy training is how I have always trained, its how I roll baby!!!!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers James, at 15% body fat I estimate I will be around 90Kg, then I will try to maintain the 15% & increase my strength to my ultimate goals.
> 
> James, why don't you just do powerlifting but with a 10 rep range, that way you will use much less weight & stay healthy :thumb:
> 
> Having done powerlifting for just over 12 months now, I can honestly say it is not for everyone, in fact I think only a very small percentage will stick with it.
> 
> For me personally, heavy training is how I have always trained, its how I roll baby!!!!


Doug are you over estimating your Body Fat % at the moment. I thought you were like 110kg and if you need to loose 20kg to get down to 15% that would put you at about 30% which seems high.

I like lifting heavy, I prefer the grind over the burn any day. Im going to drop my Bench when I return tho and concentrate on the higher rep range like 15 reps and just slowly work up stopping a few reps short of failure.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug are you over estimating your Body Fat % at the moment. I thought you were like 110kg and if you need to loose 20kg to get down to 15% that would put you at about 30% which seems high.
> 
> I like lifting heavy, I prefer the grind over the burn any day. Im going to drop my Bench when I return tho and concentrate on the higher rep range like 15 reps and just slowly work up stopping a few reps short of failure.


Yep, sorry mate, I estimate I'm around 20% body fat.....ish. Although I can see my body composition changing already since going on the lean gain approach to nutrition, which I might add feels a million times better than anything else I've tried, it's also much easier to follow :thumb:

I'm down from 108.7Kg to 106.2Kg in only two weeks :thumb:

I will of course keep monitoring my strength as it is my primary goal for powerlifting :devil:

Must admit I don't envy you having to drop the bench & I hate high rep work (anything over 10 reps )


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> not been on so much recently...:thumb:


It has been noticed , stick with it Stu  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Yep, sorry mate, I estimate I'm around 20% body fat.....ish. Although I can see my body composition changing already since going on the lean gain approach to nutrition, which I might add feels a million times better than anything else I've tried, it's also much easier to follow :thumb:
> 
> I'm down from 108.7Kg to 106.2Kg in only two weeks :thumb:
> 
> I will of course keep monitoring my strength as it is my primary goal for powerlifting :devil:
> 
> Must admit I don't envy you having to drop the bench & I hate high rep work (anything over 10 reps )


What are the main things you have changed to follow the Lean gains approach? Intermittant fasting? Just curious as it didnt work well for me so be good to hear what your doing to succeed.

108.7kg at 20% BF = 21.74kg Fat 86.96kg Lean Weight

Lower the Lean weight slightly as you normally loose a little while dieting gives the following.

100kg at 15% BF = 15kg Fat 85kg Lean weight.

90kg sounds very light mate. Your obviously experienced Doug but if Powerlifting is your main goal I would increase your calories slightly as you have dropped 2.5kg in 2 weeks which will make your total weight lose over 6 months quite big. The less calorie deficit your in, the less likely you will be to loose muscle and strength.

Ya dropping bench sucks big time but have to think about my shoulder in the future. Im only dropping it for a month and I'm hoping in the long run it will get me to that 150kg bench press maybe more.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> What are the main things you have changed to follow the Lean gains approach? Intermittant fasting? Just curious as it didnt work well for me so be good to hear what your doing to succeed.
> 
> 108.7kg at 20% BF = 21.74kg Fat 86.96kg Lean Weight
> 
> Lower the Lean weight slightly as you normally loose a little while dieting gives the following.
> 
> 100kg at 15% BF = 15kg Fat 85kg Lean weight.
> 
> 90kg sounds very light mate. Your obviously experienced Doug but if Powerlifting is your main goal I would increase your calories slightly as you have dropped 2.5kg in 2 weeks which will make your total weight lose over 6 months quite big. The less calorie deficit your in, the less likely you will be to loose muscle and strength.
> 
> Ya dropping bench sucks big time but have to think about my shoulder in the future. Im only dropping it for a month and I'm hoping in the long run it will get me to that 150kg bench press maybe more.


The main changes are:

1. The fasting window of 14-16 hours (I usually fast between 7pm to 10 Am)

2.	I only eat two/three meals a day. (Following the 5/6 meals a day made me feel so stuffed & bloated, I hated it, now I feel empty but fed well) lean gains is very similar to how I used to naturally eat so bonus! :thumb:

Have no fear mate I don't lose muscle easy. It took more than 8 years away from the weights for my muscles to only start to hypertrophy very slightly, I'm really lucky my body for some reason holds onto muscle mass (my only theory on that is that I have always trained heavy with a 1-4 rep range, that approach produces a more permanent state of muscle mass, unlike body building training which I've seen in my mates which produces muscle mass that seems to waste away even after only a few months away from the weights)

I'm also taking a relaxed approach to lean gains & only want to lose around 5% of my current body fat percentage, I will not sacrifice my strength for this & as soon as I'm happy in how I look I will increase protein intake. I'm not out to look muscular/vascular just a bit healthier.

I would like to weigh 110Kg @15% body fat. The reason for setting a 6 month goal is to ensure I keep my strength; from my experience if you can be disciplined enough, slow & steady is the only way in regards to muscle gain & fat loss :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

@doug and james...you guys are so disciplined !!!, if i could be a quarter as disciplined as you two i'd be happy!...:doublesho:devil:
i do my best but as i've said before, life gets in the way for me, especially shift work...(i know we've spoken about it before doug but unfortunately i've just gotta go with it for now...)
still, managing to get my workouts in again pretty regularly, its the nutrition side that lets me down but gonna concentrate on improving that in the new year, for now just glad to be lifting again...!

anyways, weds workout A of SL...squat 75kg,bench 55kg,BBRows 55kg...all went well again but is starting to get heavy now so i think the 5kg increases i've been doing for last couple of weeks will revert back now to regular increases of 2.5kg in line with SL or form will be starting to suffer soon and only going to get to a sticking point or 2 sooner...
still getting parallel (slightly lower as sometimes hit the spotter bars) on squats so pleased with that as thats where i had probs before...i know i won't be able to keep the depth that low as it increases but will for as long as poss...bench and BBRow felt good and i know i could get away with another 5kg increase but not gonna rush it...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> @doug and james...you guys are so disciplined !!!, if i could be a quarter as disciplined as you two i'd be happy!...:doublesho:devil:
> i do my best but as i've said before, life gets in the way for me, especially shift work...(i know we've spoken about it before doug but unfortunately i've just gotta go with it for now...)
> still, managing to get my workouts in again pretty regularly, its the nutrition side that lets me down but gonna concentrate on improving that in the new year, for now just glad to be lifting again...!
> 
> anyways, weds workout A of SL...squat 75kg,bench 55kg,BBRows 55kg...all went well again but is starting to get heavy now so i think the 5kg increases i've been doing for last couple of weeks will revert back now to regular increases of 2.5kg in line with SL or form will be starting to suffer soon and only going to get to a sticking point or 2 sooner...
> still getting parallel (slightly lower as sometimes hit the spotter bars) on squats so pleased with that as thats where i had probs before...i know i won't be able to keep the depth that low as it increases but will for as long as poss...bench and BBRow felt good and i know i could get away with another 5kg increase but not gonna rush it...:thumb:
> rgds stu


The best advice I can give you Stu.

1.	If you want to succeed you need to make time to train, if you don't you will fail & give up eventually IMHO (I'm in your age group Stu so we both know time is short to reach our goals).

2.	Don't worry too much about your diet in the first 12 months of training. Just ensure you are getting enough protein (Three good meals a day with at least 40-50Gm of protein in each meal is enough, the body doesn't just use protein to build muscle) 

3.	Concentrate on ensuring you train consistently (this is key to success) :devil:

4.	Train according to your real goals, if it's too loose weight & gain more muscle use a 10 rep range with the powerlifting lifts (With more focus on how you lift no how much). If it is pure strength stick with the 5 rep range & strive for an increase on all your main lifts by 2.5kg per month until you find your natural plateaus & then adapt & expect progress to slow down. Or you can do it as I do on the 5/3/1 - a combination of rep ranges with the assistance work using the 10 rep range :thumb:

5.	The lean gains approach to nutrition is well worth trying, it doesn't feel like a diet at all :thumb:

That's a short as I can make it, if I can do it so can you :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 90.5KGx3 - 103.5KGx3 - 116.5KGx3

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good, bit out of sync with my training this week as I've got loads of I.T callouts this week, never the less the next sessions WILL be done Friday & Sat :devil: I will only miss the deadlift session this week, but I will be training all through the christmas period so no worries  :thumb:

:devil::devil::devil:Hate those weigths!!!!! :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> The best advice I can give you Stu.
> 
> 1.	If you want to succeed you need to make time to train, if you don't you will fail & give up eventually IMHO (I'm in your age group Stu so we both know time is short to reach our goals).
> 
> 2.	Don't worry too much about your diet in the first 12 months of training. Just ensure you are getting enough protein (Three good meals a day with at least 40-50Gm of protein in each meal is enough, the body doesn't just use protein to build muscle)
> 
> 3.	Concentrate on ensuring you train consistently (this is key to success) :devil:
> 
> 4.	Train according to your real goals, if it's too loose weight & gain more muscle use a 10 rep range with the powerlifting lifts (With more focus on how you lift no how much). If it is pure strength stick with the 5 rep range & strive for an increase on all your main lifts by 2.5kg per month until you find your natural plateaus & then adapt & expect progress to slow down. Or you can do it as I do on the 5/3/1 - a combination of rep ranges with the assistance work using the 10 rep range :thumb:
> 
> 5.	The lean gains approach to nutrition is well worth trying, it doesn't feel like a diet at all :thumb:
> 
> That's a short as I can make it, if I can do it so can you :thumb:


hi doug, cheers for advice mate...:thumb: i'll reply in point form..
1/i hear you :thumb: _most_ of the time its fine but usually once a week i need to move a training day due to work etc which is why i don't do the ideal of mon,weds,fri training but it normally works out ok none the less...jobwise, not a lot i can do about it at the mo, but on earlies i'm usually up about 4.30am and often the hours are long as they're not set hours and i have to be somewhat flexible plus do some overtime...for now, its not the ideal but it is what it is and i have to work around it...

2/i keep forgetting this and getting a little hungup on weightloss vs musclegain which i know is very very hard to achieve...trying to adopt the long term view...

3/working on this and this is also where this thread and you guys help a lot..:thumb:

4/ i need to give this one some thought i think.. the 10 rep range for fatloss with some muscle gain is perhaps where i'd rather be for a while at least rather then pure strength training as i'm doing now...hmmm, as i said, some thought needed on this one...

5/leangains is where i'm planning on looking as i need a structured diet to follow....as we all know, the advice on SL (which i think is based at skinny guys looking to gain size/weight/muscle) is to eat,eat,eat (the right stuff obviously) but right stuff or not, its not the ideal way to go for me as a/ i'm not a skinny guy who struggles to put on weight and b/ i really don't wanna be any heavier than i am now, and for now i'm not actually following any sort of plan with regards calories and percentages...:doublesho

lots to consider and you're right about the focus/determination which i need to work on...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> bit out of sync with my training this week as I've got loads of I.T callouts this week,
> 
> I will only miss the deadlift session this week,


doug, please see points 1 and 3 in your post above....



i too am planning on training over christmas period though probably not on christmas day...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> The main changes are:
> 
> 1. The fasting window of 14-16 hours (I usually fast between 7pm to 10 Am)
> 
> 2.	I only eat two/three meals a day. (Following the 5/6 meals a day made me feel so stuffed & bloated, I hated it, now I feel empty but fed well) lean gains is very similar to how I used to naturally eat so bonus! :thumb:
> 
> Have no fear mate I don't lose muscle easy. It took more than 8 years away from the weights for my muscles to only start to hypertrophy very slightly, I'm really lucky my body for some reason holds onto muscle mass (my only theory on that is that I have always trained heavy with a 1-4 rep range, that approach produces a more permanent state of muscle mass, unlike body building training which I've seen in my mates which produces muscle mass that seems to waste away even after only a few months away from the weights)
> 
> I'm also taking a relaxed approach to lean gains & only want to lose around 5% of my current body fat percentage, I will not sacrifice my strength for this & as soon as I'm happy in how I look I will increase protein intake. I'm not out to look muscular/vascular just a bit healthier.
> 
> I would like to weigh 110Kg @15% body fat. The reason for setting a 6 month goal is to ensure I keep my strength; from my experience if you can be disciplined enough, slow & steady is the only way in regards to muscle gain & fat loss :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:


I think its the fasting window that trips me up and I loose out on 50g of protein straight away as I normally have a shake for breakfast. My body just doesnt seem to like the fast, its 9:30am here and I have 2:30hours left before I eat but I'm starving and my body actually makes me feel sick until I eat. I think because of this I just eat more at my 1st meal as Im so hungry. I was only eating twice when doing the Leangains so I didnt follow it to the tee. Need to do more research into it but the feeling sick thing makes me think its not for me. I find my body reacts a lot to carbs so just by cutting them out I can loose weight pretty easily.

I agree your lack of muscle lose would be due to your muscle being built from power lifting as I have a few mates who body build and they do complain that they loose their gains really fast.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> doug, please see points 1 and 3 in your post above....
> 
> 
> 
> i too am planning on training over christmas period though probably not on christmas day...:thumb:


 I knew you'd pick up on that....Git  :lol: :thumb:

However over the last 12 months my consistency & progress has been as good as required, also I've had two injuries which have put me back approx. 6 months, but I'm still here & still training.
I've been lifting on & off for years & have a reasonable good grip on listening to my body, contradictory I know but a little inconsistency within a consistent training routine helps with recovery & motivation, you just need to know how to balance this as to have a positive effect rather than a detrimental effect on your progress. 
The human body is a living evolving machine; one needs to learn how to work with it to get it to do what you want while using a flexible ever evolving approach.

There Zen moment over lol!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I think its the fasting window that trips me up and I loose out on 50g of protein straight away as I normally have a shake for breakfast. My body just doesnt seem to like the fast, its 9:30am here and I have 2:30hours left before I eat but I'm starving and my body actually makes me feel sick until I eat. I think because of this I just eat more at my 1st meal as Im so hungry. I was only eating twice when doing the Leangains so I didnt follow it to the tee. Need to do more research into it but the feeling sick thing makes me think its not for me. I find my body reacts a lot to carbs so just by cutting them out I can loose weight pretty easily.
> 
> I agree your lack of muscle lose would be due to your muscle being built from power lifting as I have a few mates who body build and they do complain that they loose their gains really fast.


James, you are missing one of the fundamental points/ethos of the diet. It indicates that the body is an adaptive mechanism & will take as much protein from your diet as required 

I totally agree with lean gains & disagree that you need 6 meals a day, eating every 3 hours for perfect growth, unless you are at the highest level of body building, we are not body builders.

Tonight my main meal after training consisted of over 90Gm of protein; my body will slowly absorb & use what it needs. Having looked back over my years of training, when at my most successful I was naturally eating the lean gains way, using a 1-4 rep range on my own made up 1x4 routine.

James, I would start with a relaxed approach to lean gain mate. Start with a 10 hour fast window (or whatever you want), I'm currently on a 12-14 hour fast window as I'm not looking to go very low with body fat nor am I in a hurry :thumb:

I think even the mighty Jim Wendler says 3 good meals a day is enough.
I consume approx. 200grams of protein a day. One main meal at 10Am, one small meal between 12-2pm & the third main meal around 6:30pm (after training). As I adapt to the lean gains diet I will slowly get back into consuming whey protein as source of low calorie protein on my second small meal between 12-2pm (40gm protein @170Kcal).

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I think its the fasting window that trips me up and I loose out on 50g of protein straight away as I normally have a shake for breakfast. My body just doesnt seem to like the fast, its 9:30am here and I have 2:30hours left before I eat but I'm starving and my body actually makes me feel sick until I eat. I think because of this I just eat more at my 1st meal as Im so hungry. I was only eating twice when doing the Leangains so I didnt follow it to the tee. Need to do more research into it but the feeling sick thing makes me think its not for me. I find my body reacts a lot to carbs so just by cutting them out I can loose weight pretty easily.
> 
> I agree your lack of muscle lose would be due to your muscle being built from power lifting as I have a few mates who body build and they do complain that they loose their gains really fast.


I think the sick feeling is something to do with blood sugar levels (I think) :thumb:

Try 3 meals a day :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I think the sick feeling is something to do with blood sugar levels (I think) :thumb:
> 
> Try 3 meals a day :thumb:


I dont believe in the 6 meals a day unless like you say your a top bodubuilder. At the moment Im on 3 meals a day. Protein shake for breakfast, Lunch and Dinner.

So I pretty much do a 10-12 hour fast anyway. I feel stuff trying to fit 3 meals into a shorter window of time. I will do some more research but for now Im doing the low carb approach.


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> 4.	Train according to your real goals, if it's too loose weight & gain more muscle use a 10 rep range with the powerlifting lifts (With more focus on how you lift no how much).


doug, meant to ask yesterday about the above but ran out of time (due to having to get to bed for getting up at 3am this morn:doublesho)...
as i've said before, i originally started the lifting this year with the intention of losing weight _and_ building muscle and i know you guys have all told me not to worry abou the losing weight for 1st 12 months of something like SL and i understand where you are all coming from on this but right now, i would really like to lose some weight _1st_ and then concentrate on the strength training and i'd then feel happier about controlling the nutrition side of things when starting the strength training from a lower weight then present...
with hindsight, i should've spent a couple o months slimming down a bit before starting the SL but was so keen to get going and also was very naive about losing fat and building muscle at the same time...i could give loads of reasons why i wanna lose weight 1st but ultimately i'm just not happy with the size/weight of me at the mo and although i've made good personal gains strengthwise i'd be happy to wait for the strength side of things for a few months...

anyway, i've said all this before so with regards to the quote above, assuming i'd keep the SL exercises and workouts (and am really enjoying these compound lifts, most of which i'd never bothered with before!) and you mention the 10 rep range, how exactly would it work...? i'm assuming 3 sets of 10 concentrating on the lift rather than the amount ? but what should be my target for amounts to lift? what i'm lifting now or would i need to decrease weight a bit...?

for me to adopt this sort of rep range for a couple of months would mean i could concentrate on a little less food without worrying about needing loads of fuel for heavy lifts and hopefully incorporate more stuff like walking/cycling/running on off days without worry of burnout...also have an impending house move which will interfere with current SL programme anyway at some point in next couple of months...
what d'ya reckon...?
rgds stu


----------



## Guest

You'll need to decrease the weights Stu. 

Very roughly, your 5RM is 90% of your 1RM. Your 10RM is 75% of your 1RM.
As an example, if your 1RM squat was 100kg, this would mean you could expect to perform 5 reps @ 90kg or 10 reps @ 75kg.

For a quick calculation, multiply your 5RM weights by 0.83 to get your 10RM weight (actually from 0.75/0.9 = 0.83).

According to a chart my Mr Rippetoe, 8-12 reps is the range for hypertrophy (size). I've gone for 8 reps as it has a slight strength bias. 10 reps is obviously bang in the middle of the range. Expect a slight slow down on increments after a while i.e. you'll start failing earlier than when doing 5reps/set. This is to be expected - don't worry about it.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> My body just doesnt seem to like the fast, its 9:30am here and I have 2:30hours left before I eat but I'm starving and my body actually makes me feel sick until I eat.


Have you tried drinking black coffee in the morning, while still on the fast? I find this helps with controlling the hunger pangs. IIRC, Martin Berkhan recommends this also.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> doug, meant to ask yesterday about the above but ran out of time (due to having to get to bed for getting up at 3am this morn:doublesho)...
> as i've said before, i originally started the lifting this year with the intention of losing weight _and_ building muscle and i know you guys have all told me not to worry abou the losing weight for 1st 12 months of something like SL and i understand where you are all coming from on this but right now, i would really like to lose some weight _1st_ and then concentrate on the strength training and i'd then feel happier about controlling the nutrition side of things when starting the strength training from a lower weight then present...
> with hindsight, i should've spent a couple o months slimming down a bit before starting the SL but was so keen to get going and also was very naive about losing fat and building muscle at the same time...i could give loads of reasons why i wanna lose weight 1st but ultimately i'm just not happy with the size/weight of me at the mo and although i've made good personal gains strengthwise i'd be happy to wait for the strength side of things for a few months...
> 
> anyway, i've said all this before so with regards to the quote above, assuming i'd keep the SL exercises and workouts (and am really enjoying these compound lifts, most of which i'd never bothered with before!) and you mention the 10 rep range, how exactly would it work...? i'm assuming 3 sets of 10 concentrating on the lift rather than the amount ? but what should be my target for amounts to lift? what i'm lifting now or would i need to decrease weight a bit...?
> 
> for me to adopt this sort of rep range for a couple of months would mean i could concentrate on a little less food without worrying about needing loads of fuel for heavy lifts and hopefully incorporate more stuff like walking/cycling/running on off days without worry of burnout...also have an impending house move which will interfere with current SL programme anyway at some point in next couple of months...
> what d'ya reckon...?
> rgds stu


You can follow Phil's advice or take a relaxed view, all up to you mate.

I would do the Big but boring routine on its own & possibly add a few more warm up sets just to help with volume.
You can start all your lifts with 40Kg & work from there. A very good way to progress is this.

Bench press example:

First week Bench Press - 40kg.

1.	Aim for 5 sets of 10 reps; if you succeed add 2.5kg (42.5Kg). 
2.	Next session aim for at least 5 sets of 8.
3.	Next session aim for 5 sets of 9.
4.	Next session 5 sets of 10.
5.	Next session 5 sets of 11 & then add another 2.5kg (45Kg). 
6.	Carry on with the above approach & keep increasing the weight as directed.

If you find after adding weight at a certain point that you cannot manage at least 5 sets of 8 reps after 3 attempts, reduce by 2.5Kg & start again.
In simple terms your rep range is (8-11) 8 being minimum reps & 11 being the indicator that you are ready to move up in weight. Remember though you will not progress as quick, the body does not like to lift heavy for high reps. Lower your expectations in regards to how much you lift & concentrate on form & full range of motion.

This is a very simple progressive overload principle that works very well, I used it when I was younger on a 4 rep range & benched 180x4 at my peak. You can use this principle with any rep range you like.
If you look back when I did the 1x5 I used to aim for a minimum of 3 reps after adding weight & progressed up to 5 reps then added weight (Another variation with a smaller range i.e. 3-4 & 5 being my indicator to move up in weight.

Hope this is helpful I'm writing it at work & in a hurry!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Have you tried drinking black coffee in the morning, while still on the fast? I find this helps with controlling the hunger pangs. IIRC, Martin Berkhan recommends this also.


I drink gallons of Gree Tea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> You'll need to decrease the weights Stu.
> 
> Very roughly, your 5RM is 90% of your 1RM. Your 10RM is 75% of your 1RM.
> As an example, if your 1RM squat was 100kg, this would mean you could expect to perform 5 reps @ 90kg or 10 reps @ 75kg.
> 
> For a quick calculation, multiply your 5RM weights by 0.83 to get your 10RM weight (actually from 0.75/0.9 = 0.83).
> 
> According to a chart my Mr Rippetoe, 8-12 reps is the range for hypertrophy (size). I've gone for 8 reps as it has a slight strength bias. 10 reps is obviously bang in the middle of the range. Expect a slight slow down on increments after a while i.e. you'll start failing earlier than when doing 5reps/set. This is to be expected - don't worry about it.





ITHAQVA said:


> You can follow Phil's advice or take a relaxed view, all up to you mate.
> 
> I would do the Big but boring routine on its own & possibly add a few more warm up sets just to help with volume.
> You can start all your lifts with 40Kg & work from there. A very good way to progress is this.
> 
> Bench press example:
> 
> First week Bench Press - 40kg.
> 
> 1.	Aim for 5 sets of 10 reps; if you succeed add 2.5kg (42.5Kg).
> 2.	Next session aim for at least 5 sets of 8.
> 3.	Next session aim for 5 sets of 9.
> 4.	Next session 5 sets of 10.
> 5.	Next session 5 sets of 11 & then add another 2.5kg (45Kg).
> 6.	Carry on with the above approach & keep increasing the weight as directed.
> 
> If you find after adding weight at a certain point that you cannot manage at least 5 sets of 8 reps after 3 attempts, reduce by 2.5Kg & start again.
> In simple terms your rep range is (8-11) 8 being minimum reps & 11 being the indicator that you are ready to move up in weight. Remember though you will not progress as quick, the body does not like to lift heavy for high reps. Lower your expectations in regards to how much you lift & concentrate on form & full range of motion.
> 
> This is a very simple progressive overload principle that works very well, I used it when I was younger on a 4 rep range & benched 180x4 at my peak. You can use this principle with any rep range you like.
> If you look back when I did the 1x5 I used to aim for a minimum of 3 reps after adding weight & progressed up to 5 reps then added weight (Another variation with a smaller range i.e. 3-4 & 5 being my indicator to move up in weight.
> 
> Hope this is helpful I'm writing it at work & in a hurry!!!


thanks for the answers guys...:thumb: i'm fine with decreasing the weights lifted for now (until a return to strength training in a couple o months) and also with lowering my expectations with weight lifted and increasing it the way i've been on SL...
so i know now the rep range and weights i need to be using, but would i be better to continue the SL programme exercise wise ie workout A, squats, bench,BBRows then next workout B, squats,ohp,dead or adopt the BBB routine proper...? (will need to look that up but think its one basic exercise each workout?)
cheers again, rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> thanks for the answers guys...:thumb: i'm fine with decreasing the weights lifted for now (until a return to strength training in a couple o months) and also with lowering my expectations with weight lifted and increasing it the way i've been on SL...
> so i know now the rep range and weights i need to be using, but would i be better to continue the SL programme exercise wise ie workout A, squats, bench,BBRows then next workout B, squats,ohp,dead or adopt the BBB routine proper...? (will need to look that up but think its one basic exercise each workout?)
> cheers again, rgds stu


It would not hurt if you went straight to a 4 day routine based on Wendlers big but boring :thumb:

Keep using the large multi joint barbell exercises, there is no alternative regardless of your goals :thumb:

If you want a routine typed up for you Stu, just PM me mate :thumb: 

Have a good look at http://rippedbody.jp/english/introduction-english/
(Thanks to Phil/barefacedgeek for introducing me to an awesome site) :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> It would not hurt if you went straight to a 4 day routine based on Wendlers big but boring :thumb:
> 
> Keep using the large multi joint barbell exercises, there is no alternative regardless of your goals :thumb:
> 
> If you want a routine typed up for you Stu, just PM me mate :thumb:
> 
> Have a good look at http://rippedbody.jp/english/introduction-english/
> (Thanks to Phil/barefacedgeek for introducing me to an awesome site) :thumb: :thumb:


had a brief look at the rippedbody site before but just haven't really paid much attention to nutrition side of things so far...schoolboy error i know..
some reading and planning there for over christmas...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

BareFacedGeek said:


> Have you tried drinking black coffee in the morning, while still on the fast? I find this helps with controlling the hunger pangs. IIRC, Martin Berkhan recommends this also.


I dont drink coffee nasty stuff. I'm going to do some more research on Leangains and see what I come up with. I think I was eating more in those 2 meals than spread out through the entire day and I thought yesterday I could still have my protein shake but as an afternoon snack which would probably be good as its closer to the gym.

Stu if your natural I think its very important to keep heavy work in your routine so out of the suggestions above I would definitely go for the Boring but Big routine. This may help you with wanting to train more as I found it mentally draining squatting every workout and you could possibly do 2 days a week if your struggling for time. This would allow you to look at your shift work through the week and pick the best days.

My one suggestion for BBB would be to do the opposite exercises on the BBB. e.g. deadlifts / squats, bench press / shoulder press etc. This means you hit the exercise more often which will be better for your training level.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> My one suggestion for BBB would be to do the opposite exercises on the BBB. e.g. deadlifts / squats, bench press / shoulder press etc. This means you hit the exercise more often which will be better for your training level.


Like you Stu, on reflection before commencing Starting Strength I wish I'd brought my main weakness into line. For me it was lower back, you it's weight. I've never quite fully understood where novice linear progression start, finishes, and can be done again. However, Rip frequently tells people to start again if it's been broken (by illness, life etc) so it sounds like a good idea to address your concerns so as to be able to get the most from linear progression. Are you sure Christmas is the best time to loose weight though :doublesho

I've settled upon Triumvate with a big compound assistance at the moment and it's going well. I do my main lift, then an opposite big compund movement for 5x10, then my weaknesses. My weakness I've decided is lowerback\abs and press so it's lots of lowerback\ab work and press\dips. Kind of adressing the weakest link head on. If there's one thing that you think is your achilles heal perhaps you could use this intermission to address it and so come back to linear progression all the better e.g. I think you've mentioned in the past power cleans, or pull ups. Wonder what others think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 45KGx3 - 51KGx3 - 57.5KGx3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+2.5KGx8x8x8x8x8

OVERHEAD PRESS 40KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Another good workout :devil: :thumb:

Although my bodyweight is going down I'm not going to compensate with the added weight on the dips, but continue to add 2.5kg after every 5x10 reached via the slow progression method I'm currently using, which seems to work very well. Eventually my bodyweight will level out & I will be able to more accurately gauge my progress.

While in the weight loss phase I will stop doing chins & concentrate on the barbell row 5x10 styleee!!!  :thumb:

:thumb::thumb:Happy Christmas Guys!!! :thumb::thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> I dont drink coffee nasty stuff. I'm going to do some more research on Leangains and see what I come up with. I think I was eating more in those 2 meals than spread out through the entire day and I thought yesterday I could still have my protein shake but as an afternoon snack which would probably be good as its closer to the gym.
> 
> Stu if your natural I think its very important to keep heavy work in your routine so out of the suggestions above I would definitely go for the Boring but Big routine. This may help you with wanting to train more as I found it mentally draining squatting every workout and you could possibly do 2 days a week if your struggling for time. This would allow you to look at your shift work through the week and pick the best days.
> 
> My one suggestion for BBB would be to do the opposite exercises on the BBB. e.g. deadlifts / squats, bench press / shoulder press etc. This means you hit the exercise more often which will be better for your training level.


hi james, definately liking the idea of high reps and the BBB, and i think it will help with me wanting to train more, although am thoroughly enjoying being back into it now anyway :thumb:, its just the time thing with work sometimes throws a spanner in the works but can usually pull it back at the weekend so 3 times a week is well doable poss 4 sometimes..? and yep it is mentally draining with the squats 3 times a week although last few weeks i've secretly been looking forward to doing proper DEEP squats...:doublesho:thumb: slight doms in my legs and forearms from last training today but strangely enjoying it...

with the oposite exercises above james, do you mean 2 exercises each workout...? and would BBRows go with bench?-i know on workout A sl it feels right to be doing bench then BBRows... i like the idea below from colin about the opurtunity to address a weakness which for me would definately be my shoulders...do you reckon its worth doing more shoulder stuff...?
cheers for the help and advice...:thumb:



Oats said:


> Like you Stu, on reflection before commencing Starting Strength I wish I'd brought my main weakness into line. For me it was lower back, you it's weight. I've never quite fully understood where novice linear progression start, finishes, and can be done again. However, Rip frequently tells people to start again if it's been broken (by illness, life etc) so it sounds like a good idea to address your concerns so as to be able to get the most from linear progression. Are you sure Christmas is the best time to loose weight though :doublesho
> 
> I've settled upon Triumvate with a big compound assistance at the moment and it's going well. I do my main lift, then an opposite big compund movement for 5x10, then my weaknesses. My weakness I've decided is lowerbackabs and press so it's lots of lowerbackab work and pressdips. Kind of adressing the weakest link head on. If there's one thing that you think is your achilles heal perhaps you could use this intermission to address it and so come back to linear progression all the better e.g. I think you've mentioned in the past power cleans, or pull ups. Wonder what others think.


hi colin, well i've had a break of a couple of months recently and just a couple of weeks back into SL now so to change now i think would be fine, especially as will look forward to coming back to SL in a couple of months...a change is as good as a rest and all that...:thumb:
as regards christmas and losing weight, probably not the ideal time but then its only a week or so to the new year and new start and all that..will have a couple of days over next week or so to eat drink and be merry but will be fairly good with food over christmas time otherwise...

i definately think my shoulders are weakest point and have struggled with ohp and made the least gains weights wise there so could be a good idea to target those...? do you mean do extra exercises for them..? pullups i'm just definately too heavy vs not enough strength and dips the same but added bonus of shoulders not strong enough either...

reckon you should post a few of your workouts colin? i'd be interested to see them..?:thumb:
thanks for help and advice...:thumb:



ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) 45KGx3 - 51KGx3 - 57.5KGx3
> 
> DIPS BODYWEIGHT+2.5KGx8x8x8x8x8
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS 40KGx10x10x10x10x10
> 
> BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Another good workout :devil: :thumb:
> 
> Although my bodyweight is going down I'm not going to compensate with the added weight on the dips, but continue to add 2.5kg after every 5x10 reached via the slow progression method I'm currently using, which seems to work very well. Eventually my bodyweight will level out & I will be able to more accurately gauge my progress.
> 
> While in the weight loss phase I will stop doing chins & concentrate on the barbell row 5x10 styleee!!!  :thumb:
> 
> :thumb::thumb:Happy Christmas Guys!!! :thumb::thumb:


nice workout doug...:thumb: was looking wistfully at your ohp and dips... if i do the lose the weight over next few months then dips is something i'll be looking forward to...:devil:
what do you think to above idea of concentrating on weakest part-shoulders..? 
thanks for help and advice...:thumb:
rgds stu

*MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU ALL...*


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> nice workout doug...:thumb: was looking wistfully at your ohp and dips... if i do the lose the weight over next few months then dips is something i'll be looking forward to...:devil:
> what do you think to above idea of concentrating on weakest part-shoulders..?
> thanks for help and advice...:thumb:
> rgds stu
> 
> *MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU ALL...*


OHP will always be your weakest lift (smaller muscles & less muscles used in the lift etc...) :thumb:

No way out of it mate, I know what you're thinking; isolate your shoulders etc... It doesn't work like that. The only guys who should even consider isolation exercises are body builders who are looking for that little extra intensity to totally fry the muscles they are training, this takes a lot out of your central nervous system & your recovery will be affected.

If you are considering a 5x10 routine don't expect to be pushing 60kg on the OHP for a good while yet :thumb:

Remember if you are going for a 5x10, the amount of weight you lift is much less important, you will need to concentrate on perfect form & full range of motion. Reps should be done slowly with a minimum of 1 second positive & 2 seconds on the negative part of the lift. Unlike powerlifting where there is a more explosive style :devil:

I think you are finding powerlifting hard & may possibly think that a lighter body building style routine will be easy, well once you try body building & do it properly it will be also very hard. Try a 10 rep barbell bicep curl with 40kg & do each rep 2 seconds up & 2 seconds down.

Either way mate, it is hard work if it's going to work, sorry but that is why very few succeed & so many drop out or make their routines easy & end up training for years with very little to show for it.

Your 5x10 routine is almost done :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 122.5KGX3 - 140KGX3 - 157.5KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

christmas eve workout...BBB...:thumb:

as per recent negotiations, have decided to leave SL 5x5 for a few months at least and concentrate on losing a little excess weight, hence the bbb based routine...many thanks to you all for recent advice and doug especially for sending me some written routines...:thumb:

today was first day of new routine and oh my god did i notice the extra reps and also the slower pace of each rep (1sec+,2sec-)....:doublesho:devil::doublesho
squat 40kg 5x8
bench 40kg 5x8
BBRow 40kg 5x8

stuck with the 8reps rather than push for more as this is 1st workout so treating this next week as a familiarisation...really noticed the extra few reps and the slower pace of each exercise, haven gotten used to 5x5 and a faster movement... 
also noticed the weakness in my abs  this i know will improve as i carry on this programme :thumb:

what sort of rest is ideal between sets at this level ?...(ideally slightly longer than it takes for my heart to climb back down into my chest...:doublesho my fitness sucks...!!)

rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Stu when i mentioned doing the opposite exercise what I meant was this.

Normal BBB routine is 5/3/1 exercise followed by the same exercise for 5x10. E.g. squats 5/3/1 squats 5x10, check out dougs routine as he does this. What i suggest when you first start 5/3/1 is to do the opposite lower or upper body movement so squats 5/3/1 then deadlifts 5x10, this way if you train 3 times per week you hit each exercise twice in 8 days instead of once.

Merry Xmas everyone. It's Xmas morning in my part of the world. I'm starting my month program of no pushing exercises other than shoulder press. I changed all pushing exercises for more back work to try and help my shoulder.


----------



## sfstu

merry christmas to you james...:thumb: you got your presents before we did...! good luck with the new recovery programme, can imagine its not too much fun to alter your entire routine for an injury  but at least you have the knowledge and a plan to deal with it...:thumb:

got you with the oposites on bbb... have gone for a similar looking routine to SL but have dropped the squat from what was workout b and replaced with either tri or bi exercise (alternates each workout)..so squat twice one week then once the following week but as still have deadlifts on what was workout b then legs still getting some action when not squatting, just a slight more focus on the upper body...and obviously 5x10...

in process of trying to sort out nutrition side of things over next week... been doing some calculations and working with bodyfat of 30% i think i need to be on around 1800 calories a day, more protein than carb, and although i have been reading up a bit on leangains, not convinced i can make the IF work... an eating window of say 10am to 6pm would be real awkward when i'm on earlies starting at 5am...
reading some of the last couple of pages from you james, and doug, i gather though you can have a larger eating window to start off with...? 
i think you said james that you didn't find it ideal for you...? what problems did you have with it..?

by the way, anyone know the easy way to convert calories to grams..? this is where i really mess up, i eat the right kinda stuff most of the time but have no idea of the amounts...!:lol: well i do have an idea of the amounts-TOO MUCH..!!!   not sure how to convert that 1800 cal per day into grams of carbs, protien and fat and though i'm not intending to count every last calorie, i do need a better idea of how much of each i should be aiming for...

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> christmas eve workout...BBB...:thumb:
> 
> as per recent negotiations, have decided to leave SL 5x5 for a few months at least and concentrate on losing a little excess weight, hence the bbb based routine...many thanks to you all for recent advice and doug especially for sending me some written routines...:thumb:
> 
> today was first day of new routine and oh my god did i notice the extra reps and also the slower pace of each rep (1sec+,2sec-)....:doublesho:devil::doublesho
> squat 40kg 5x8
> bench 40kg 5x8
> BBRow 40kg 5x8
> 
> stuck with the 8reps rather than push for more as this is 1st workout so treating this next week as a familiarisation...really noticed the extra few reps and the slower pace of each exercise, haven gotten used to 5x5 and a faster movement...
> also noticed the weakness in my abs  this i know will improve as i carry on this programme :thumb:
> 
> what sort of rest is ideal between sets at this level ?...(ideally slightly longer than it takes for my heart to climb back down into my chest...:doublesho my fitness sucks...!!)
> 
> rgds stu


In regards to rest Stu, see my emails, i think i gave a window of 3 mins between different exercises & 1 minute betweeen all sets because you are now moving over to an 8-11 routine. If you are a bit out of shape work up to this :thumb:

On your next session you want to aim for 5x9 on all sets, keep going up in reps each session until you get you 5x11, then add 2.5Kg :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> merry christmas to you james...:thumb: you got your presents before we did...! good luck with the new recovery programme, can imagine its not too much fun to alter your entire routine for an injury  but at least you have the knowledge and a plan to deal with it...:thumb:
> 
> got you with the oposites on bbb... have gone for a similar looking routine to SL but have dropped the squat from what was workout b and replaced with either tri or bi exercise (alternates each workout)..so squat twice one week then once the following week but as still have deadlifts on what was workout b then legs still getting some action when not squatting, just a slight more focus on the upper body...and obviously 5x10...
> 
> in process of trying to sort out nutrition side of things over next week... been doing some calculations and working with bodyfat of 30% i think i need to be on around 1800 calories a day, more protein than carb, and although i have been reading up a bit on leangains, not convinced i can make the IF work... an eating window of say 10am to 6pm would be real awkward when i'm on earlies starting at 5am...
> 
> *You can move the window to anytime Stu (Start with a 10 hour window first if you struggle with it) :thumb:*
> 
> reading some of the last couple of pages from you james, and doug, i gather though you can have a larger eating window to start off with...?
> 
> *I started with around 12-14 fasting window, now im on a 16 hour fast (Usually from 6pm-10am) Last night i didnt finish eating till 7.30 so my first food of the day will be 11.30Am :thumb:*
> 
> i think you said james that you didn't find it ideal for you...? what problems did you have with it..?
> 
> by the way, anyone know the easy way to convert calories to grams..? this is where i really mess up, i eat the right kinda stuff most of the time but have no idea of the amounts...!:lol: well i do have an idea of the amounts-TOO MUCH..!!!   not sure how to convert that 1800 cal per day into grams of carbs, protien and fat and though i'm not intending to count every last calorie, i do need a better idea of how much of each i should be aiming for...
> 
> rgds stu


Stu,
I estimate by using the packaging nutritional info at the moment, I also have some of those really small kitchen scales. Which I will use once I really get into it & want to be more accurate.

This may help too: http://www.livestrong.com/myplate/ you'll need to register (free) but it picks up many foods from Tesco's etc…

At the moment though mate I would just rely on the packaging, very often if it's a protein source I.e. Tin of Tuna, I just eat the whole tin, when I eat prawns, again the whole bag so most of my nutrition is easy.
Today at 11.30 I will have 2x protein shakes 80grams protein & 356 Kcals.
Under normal circumstances I have set weekly menu that doesn't change from Monday to Friday (Saves you having to keep working out your intake) Sat & sun I tend to relax only slightly.

At the moment as long as I consume enough protein in each day (at least 200gms) & meet my 1800-2000 calories per day I'm not interested in macros. There are many different ways to eat, but at the end of the day you only need to meet several requirements to lose weight;

1.	Create a calorie deficit (500cal per day is generally recognised as the standard to lose body fat, going lower than this will put the body in its starvation mode & it will fight to keep its reserves of fat etc… )
2.	Eat enough protein for your lean body mass.
3.	Resistance training (Preferably with free weights) to encourage the body to keep its muscle mass while losing body fat.

The reason I have gone for leangains is that I can follow the above easily & the best part is it suites my natural eating habits. Oddly I have more energy eating this way & feel much better in that eating every 3 hours just made me feel full & stuffed all the time.

Above all mate, just get into it slowly at the beggining, if you find it difficult to follow, start with a smaller IF windows & work up :thumb: Simples!!! 

Tis Christmas day.............And i've got a bench session to complete!!!!!  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 72X3) 97KGX5 - 111KGX3 - 123KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good Christmas day workout!


----------



## sfstu

merry christmas doug...:thumb: good christmas day workout, then a nice big dinner then a snooze on the couch this afternoon...:devil:

wasn't sure exactly the rest (i know its in one of your emails!) but i was taking between 60-90secs between sets so will work up to 60secs as fitness improves...certainly got my heart rate up more than 5x5 did...
echoing your comment doug, i am planning on taking it slowly with regards nutrition and leangains...i need to improve my eating habits a bit but more so i need to keep a check on how much i actually eat, but without getting too bogged down by it...:thumb:
as i mentioned earlier, i am aiming at about 1800cals a day with a bias towards protien and as i have atub of whey protien i can continue with the shakes which i often have for breakfast with a scoop of porridge...good to hear regards the fasting window-a 12-14hr fast would certainly be doable and with practice i think could be made a 14hr fast without too much trouble... i have tried in the past the eating every 3 hrs or so and it made me feel bloated too, plus i think thats where i've packed the weight on the last couple of months... three meals a day suits me and to eliminate evening snacking the fasting will be a good tool...
already a little soreness in legs,chest and back from yesterday...looking forward to boxing day workout...:devil:

have a good day all...:thumb:

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> merry christmas doug...:thumb: good christmas day workout, then a nice big dinner then a snooze on the couch this afternoon...:devil:
> 
> wasn't sure exactly the rest (i know its in one of your emails!) but i was taking between 60-90secs between sets so will work up to 60secs as fitness improves...certainly got my heart rate up more than 5x5 did...
> echoing your comment doug, i am planning on taking it slowly with regards nutrition and leangains...i need to improve my eating habits a bit but more so i need to keep a check on how much i actually eat, but without getting too bogged down by it...:thumb:
> as i mentioned earlier, i am aiming at about 1800cals a day with a bias towards protien and as i have atub of whey protien i can continue with the shakes which i often have for breakfast with a scoop of porridge...good to hear regards the fasting window-a 12-14hr fast would certainly be doable and with practice i think could be made a 14hr fast without too much trouble... i have tried in the past the eating every 3 hrs or so and it made me feel bloated too, plus i think thats where i've packed the weight on the last couple of months... three meals a day suits me and to eliminate evening snacking the fasting will be a good tool...
> already a little soreness in legs,chest and back from yesterday...looking forward to boxing day workout...:devil:
> 
> have a good day all...:thumb:
> 
> rgds stu


Workout - Check :thumb:
Big Dinner - Check :doublesho

About to flake out in front of the TV in about an hour  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Stu

Protein and carbs are 4 calories per gram and fat is 9 calories per gram so work backwards from your 1800 goal. I normally start people on 40% protein and 30% carbs and fat. This calculates to 180 grams protein, 135 grams carbs and 60 grams of fat.

This is just a starting point and you can play around with your percentages depending on how your loosing the weight.

Xmas day workout:
8 Weeks to Monterous Shoulders
Pendlay Rows: 60x5x8
Dumbell Rows: 25x3x10

Strange feeling doing just a shoulder and back workout as havent done a body part split since the body building days. Hoping in the end it will help my shoulder though.


----------



## sfstu

hi james...:wave: thanks for the protien/carb/fat info..exactly what i needed, and a starting point is all i need at the mo..:thumb: not gonna be too strict about counting every cal but just need some guidelines...
another christmas day workout..!! are the DB rows the same as croc rows that wendler shows in his 5/3/1 doc...? 
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

boxing day workout...:thumb:

workout b of dbbb D)...
OHP 30kg 5x8
dead 50kg 5x10
bicep curl (oh yeah!) 17.5kg 5x10
all good...:thumb: found the ohp difficult in last few reps of each set...obviously used to 5reps and also my shoulders are weakest point and any length of time with arms above head hurts and goes weak fast...concentrating on form and i know this exercise will pick up with the bbb. sticking with this weight untill i can get 5x11...:thumb:
dead was i think a little light so gonna increase to maybe 60kg for starting point...went for 5x10 today as still familiarising myself to this workout...
barbell curl was great fun to do... only doing this once a week as alternating with triceps every other workout... bicep curl was also pretty easy at 5x10 so will increase to 20kg for starting point...
rgds stu


----------



## dave-g

I've been starting out on weights recently, well about 3 months, and my days i am feebly weak haha.

Todays shoulder workout was..

shoulder press; 30kg 4x10
lateral side raise; 8kg 4x10
plate front raise; 15kg 4x10
pulley rear lat raise; 3.75kg 4x10, 5kg 4x10

reasonably small workout, but enough for a newbie 

looking at ways of adding to it as the months go by, and have a new plan to start on the 2nd january for 12 weeks, as a task for myself, because i like to change it up!

enjoy the gym which is the main thing!


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> hi james...:wave: thanks for the protien/carb/fat info..exactly what i needed, and a starting point is all i need at the mo..:thumb: not gonna be too strict about counting every cal but just need some guidelines...
> another christmas day workout..!! are the DB rows the same as croc rows that wendler shows in his 5/3/1 doc...?
> rgds stu


DB Rows are exactly the same movement as Kroc Rows but Kroc Rows are just a high rep version.

Thursday Workout:
Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 102.5x5, 117.5x5, 135x6 PM 162kg
Deadlifts: 92.5x5x10

A pretty good workout and I should have got at least 7 if not 8 reps which was my goal but the 5th rep was probably the lowest I ever squated and took a lot of energy to complete the rep. And anyone who argues that weights arent good for fitness are crazy, short rest deadlifts get my heart rate through the roof and breathing really heavy.

I then decided to play 18 holes of golf so I know Im going to be sore as hell tomorrow as its not the easiest walking approx 10 miles after squats and deadlifts.

Deadlifts are getting hard at this weight and I know all of you are complaining about the cold but I rather train in the cold than 100% humidity. I was sweating buckets and threw up. Its been a fair few yrs since I threw up due to training.


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> I've been starting out on weights recently, well about 3 months, and my days i am feebly weak haha.
> 
> Todays shoulder workout was..
> 
> shoulder press; 30kg 4x10
> lateral side raise; 8kg 4x10
> plate front raise; 15kg 4x10
> pulley rear lat raise; 3.75kg 4x10, 5kg 4x10
> 
> reasonably small workout, but enough for a newbie
> 
> looking at ways of adding to it as the months go by, and have a new plan to start on the 2nd january for 12 weeks, as a task for myself, because i like to change it up!
> 
> enjoy the gym which is the main thing!


What are your goals Dave? 
Do you have structured approach to training or are you just a casual lifter trying to make your fitness regime interesting?

8-11 rep routines give good muscle gains when combined with the correct barbell exercises :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> DB Rows are exactly the same movement as Kroc Rows but Kroc Rows are just a high rep version.
> 
> Thursday Workout:
> Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 102.5x5, 117.5x5, 135x6 PM 162kg
> Deadlifts: 92.5x5x10
> 
> A pretty good workout and I should have got at least 7 if not 8 reps which was my goal but the 5th rep was probably the lowest I ever squated and took a lot of energy to complete the rep. And anyone who argues that weights arent good for fitness are crazy, short rest deadlifts get my heart rate through the roof and breathing really heavy.
> 
> I then decided to play 18 holes of golf so I know Im going to be sore as hell tomorrow as its not the easiest walking approx 10 miles after squats and deadlifts.
> 
> Deadlifts are getting hard at this weight and I know all of you are complaining about the cold but I rather train in the cold than 100% humidity. I was sweating buckets and threw up. Its been a fair few yrs since I threw up due to training.


Nice & warm in Cornwall, if a little wet :doublesho 

*But then I have always have been fond of moist things :devil::devil::doublesho*

I would increase the rest between your Deadlift & Squat 5x10 James (I use 2-3 minutes) :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> DB Rows are exactly the same movement as Kroc Rows but Kroc Rows are just a high rep version.


So they are basically......dumbbell rows  

lol, what a Croc!!!!!! :lol::lol::lol:


----------



## dave-g

ITHAQVA said:


> What are your goals Dave?
> Do you have structured approach to training or are you just a casual lifter trying to make your fitness regime interesting?
> 
> 8-11 rep routines give good muscle gains when combined with the correct barbell exercises :thumb:


Thanks for the reply 

I had a meeting in with the trainer in the gym, who helped me out with a plan, which I've been sticking to and gradually adding weight over the past 3 months, but to be honest I haven't necessarily noticed any gains 

I have a plan for

Shoulders
Back and biceps
Chest and tri's
Legs

So 4 days a week, but have picked up another generic plan I'm thinking of trying out for 3 months to see if I can gain.

My aim is (fingers crossed) bigger arms/shoulders/chest and just generally feel better and happier with myself! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> Thanks for the reply
> 
> I had a meeting in with the trainer in the gym, who helped me out with a plan, which I've been sticking to and gradually adding weight over the past 3 months, but to be honest I haven't necessarily noticed any gains
> 
> I have a plan for
> 
> Shoulders
> Back and biceps
> Chest and tri's
> Legs
> 
> So 4 days a week, but have picked up another generic plan I'm thinking of trying out for 3 months to see if I can gain.
> 
> My aim is (fingers crossed) bigger arms/shoulders/chest and just generally feel better and happier with myself! :thumb:


If size/muscularity is your goal Dave & buy looking at the workout you have posted, your trainer has obviously no idea & I would suggest you do not take his/her advice ever again!:lol::lol: :thumb:

You will also need to train your legs, I know most guys want larger upper bodies but leg training effects the overall body due to the effort put in & causes the body to respond better (Growth) :thumb:

As for size mate you need to be realistic & think a bit longer term & train consistently for 12 months with a multi joint routine & consume enough calories/protein from whole food (Not loads of useless supplements).
Whey protein is probably the only supplement that is useful as it allows you to conveniently reach you daily protein intake without loads of extra calories :thumb:

I've been powerlifting for just over 12 months I'm 44 years old & put on approx. 28 pounds :thumb:

PM ya email address & I'll send you a body building routine to use for the next 12 months, please don't allow any so called expert talk you into deviating from this program :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi guys, dunno whether anyone's running low on protein powder but if so, Myprotein is doing 25%off their true whey protein powder until 6th jan...
£30 instead of £40 with code TRUE25...:thumb: 
myprotien linky
just ordered some more while its a tenner off... it certainly does mix easily with water or milk and tastes goooooddd...

out of interest chaps, what protein supps do you use..?
and doug, you said a couple of pages back-"_Today at 11.30 I will have 2x protein shakes 80grams protein & 356 Kcals._", do you double up on amount of powder you use as most i've seen give approx 100cals and 20g protein per serving..? which leads to my next question, can you take too much protein at one time...? 
(i'm aiming for approx 200g protein a day which i do plan to get as much as possible from food but protein shakes are also very handy if pressed for time and as a top-up, so curious what everyone else uses/thinks...?

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi guys, dunno whether anyone's running low on protein powder but if so, Myprotein is doing 25%off their true whey protein powder until 6th jan...
> £30 instead of £40 with code TRUE25...:thumb:
> myprotien linky
> just ordered some more while its a tenner off... it certainly does mix easily with water or milk and tastes goooooddd...
> 
> out of interest chaps, what protein supps do you use..?
> and doug, you said a couple of pages back-"_Today at 11.30 I will have 2x protein shakes 80grams protein & 356 Kcals._", do you double up on amount of powder you use as most i've seen give approx 100cals and 20g protein per serving..? which leads to my next question, can you take too much protein at one time...?
> (i'm aiming for approx 200g protein a day which i do plan to get as much as possible from food but protein shakes are also very handy if pressed for time and as a top-up, so curious what everyone else uses/thinks...?
> 
> rgds stu


Hi Stu,

I don't double up as it goes so thick its like drinking mousse :doublesho

I will tend to mix one scoop with 400ml water (careful with using Milk, Calories!!!!) 

I currently use: http://www.supplementcentre.com/ProductPage/12097/5kg-Matrix-Anabolic-Protein.asp Because its priced well & gives all I need in a supplement.

Approx. nutrition info:

K cals/K: 178k cals
Protein: 40g
Fat: 2.9g
Of which are saturates: 2.1g
Trans Fat: 0g
Carbohydrates: 5.9g

I wouldn't recommend taking more than two servings per day, you should get the rest of your protein from whole foods :thumb:

As for taking too much protein, I'm following the leangains approach to nutrition so I can take around 100gm protein in a single meal, if my body needs it, it will use it. I don't think for one moment the eating every 3 hours is correct, it made me feel ill. I'm already noticing changes in my own body & we all know you see yourself every day & to see changes means something is working, I've not changed my training only my eating habits & I feel AWESOME!!!! 

Week 3 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 28X5 33X3) - 48KGx5 - 54KGx3 - 61KGx1

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+2.5KGx9x9x9x9x9

OVERHEAD PRESS 40KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 40KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good Workout 

I will be progressively increasing my assistance weights in the new year :thumb:

Lift On!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

that looks pretty good value doug...:thumb: 
looking at the amounts (cal,protein,water to mix) it's similar to what i'm using now but i'd need to double up my fluid and use 2 scoops of my powder each time...done twice a day would give me 80g protein, and as i was in tescos earlier with mrs sfstu i had a look at a couple of the nutrition info on packets of stuff i eat and realised i'd need to eat a fair bit to reach 200gish of protein...:doublesho never really checked it out properly before... starting to pay attention though...:thumb:

good workout doug...:thumb: dips are certainly impressive at bodyweight + 2.5kg... how do you find the width of the dip attachments that come with the cage...? not they've had much use (so far) from me but they seemed kinda wide to me (had a go with a resistance band but it wasn't pretty...!:doublesho)...?

rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> that looks pretty good value doug...:thumb:
> looking at the amounts (cal,protein,water to mix) it's similar to what i'm using now but i'd need to double up my fluid and use 2 scoops of my powder each time...done twice a day would give me 80g protein, and as i was in tescos earlier with mrs sfstu i had a look at a couple of the nutrition info on packets of stuff i eat and realised i'd need to eat a fair bit to reach 200gish of protein...:doublesho never really checked it out properly before... starting to pay attention though...:thumb:
> 
> good workout doug...:thumb: dips are certainly impressive at bodyweight + 2.5kg... how do you find the width of the dip attachments that come with the cage...? not they've had much use (so far) from me but they seemed kinda wide to me (had a go with a resistance band but it wasn't pretty...!:doublesho)...?
> 
> rgds stu


I wouldn't worry too much about getting your Protein intake exactly 200gm Stu, as long as its around that amount everything will be fine. Don't forget that the body doesn't make muscle solely from Protein, good balanced nutrition plays an important part in the creation of muscle fibres.

Its the fitness industry that tells you that huge amounts of protein is the only way to grow muscle knowing that the amounts stated are very difficult to maintain, hence the fitness industry offers an alternative, wow they are so good to us! Hmmm 

Good value sources of protein: Tins of Tuna (In brine), Tesco value prawns, chicken breast & good old eggs to name but a few.

I also use a lot of seeds in my salads: Pumpkin, sunflower & De-Hulled Hemp Seeds etc.. as they contain protein, good old fibre & omega-3 

Dip bars are just right for my frame :thumb:

I'm finding the dips are making a huge difference to upper body power, if you can do 5 sets of 4-5 reps I would start using them Stu :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> I wouldn't worry too much about getting your Protein intake exactly 200gm Stu, as long as its around that amount everything will be fine. Don't forget that the body doesn't make muscle solely from Protein, good balanced nutrition plays an important part in the creation of muscle fibres.
> 
> Its the fitness industry that tells you that huge amounts of protein is the only way to grow muscle knowing that the amounts stated are very difficult to maintain, hence the fitness industry offers an alternative, wow they are so good to us! Hmmm
> 
> Good value sources of protein: Tins of Tuna (In brine), Tesco value prawns, chicken breast & good old eggs to name but a few.
> 
> I also use a lot of seeds in my salads: Pumpkin, sunflower & De-Hulled Hemp Seeds etc.. as they contain protein, good old fibre & omega-3
> 
> Dip bars are just right for my frame :thumb:
> 
> I'm finding the dips are making a huge difference to upper body power, if you can do 5 sets of 4-5 reps I would start using them Stu :thumb:


i'm only aiming at 200g protein per day as a target to work towards and will be eating a good balanced diet as well so as i get better at watching the no's as i'm eating i'm hoping it'll get easier, ie i'll have a diet of sorts worked out in my head which i can follow pretty easily during the week at work etc but without overly worrying about counting everything i've eaten..!
already do the tuna and eggs most days now :thumb: and also get the packs of turkey and chicken from tescos, just surprised me how many packs i need to make up the right calories/protein...:doublesho

dips is something i've gotta train up for unfortunately... i need to both get stronger, (especially in the shoulders) and get a bit lighter before starting them... i am however looking forward to being able to start including them in routine soon...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> i'm only aiming at 200g protein per day as a target to work towards and will be eating a good balanced diet as well so as i get better at watching the no's as i'm eating i'm hoping it'll get easier, ie i'll have a diet of sorts worked out in my head which i can follow pretty easily during the week at work etc but without overly worrying about counting everything i've eaten..!
> already do the tuna and eggs most days now :thumb: and also get the packs of turkey and chicken from tescos, just surprised me how many packs i need to make up the right calories/protein...:doublesho
> 
> dips is something i've gotta train up for unfortunately... i need to both get stronger, (especially in the shoulders) and get a bit lighter before starting them... i am however looking forward to being able to start including them in routine soon...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Keep an eye on your weight Stu, too much protein can as with any extra unused calories add body fat :thumb:

I think I trained for around 8-9 months on just the barbells before going back to dips, last sunday I weighted myself & I was 107.4Kg (16.8 Stone!! :doublesho)


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Keep an eye on your weight Stu, too much protein can as with any extra unused calories add body fat :thumb:
> 
> I think I trained for around 8-9 months on just the barbells before going back to dips, last sunday I weighted myself & I was 107.4Kg (16.8 Stone!! :doublesho)


nice weight loss...:thumb: hoping to be hot on your heels in next few weeks.. i'm aiming for 3 months to have lost enough weight and gained enough strength to go for the dips...


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> nice weight loss...:thumb: hoping to be hot on your heels in next few weeks.. i'm aiming for 3 months to have lost enough weight and gained enough strength to go for the dips...


Cheers Stu, as long as my body fat reduces I'm not overly worried about actual weight 

3 months Is a good sensible time frame. Even if you are not following the leangain approach to eating, the site has loads of info regarding body fat loss, especially on expectations. I'm giving myself 6 months to get down to 15% so that there is lower chance of muscle & strength loss


----------



## sfstu

saturday workout A of dbbb... was planning this yesterday but decided against it because i had a sore lower back all day confused and after a couple of warmup sets then one workout set of squats i decided it felt too dodgy to plough through rest of workout so thought it better to live and fight another day...:thumb:
back feels much better this morning so workout A it was...
squats 50kg 5x9 (increased from 40kg)
bench 45kg 1x8, 4x10 (inc by 5kg)
BBRow 45kg 5x9 (inc by 5kg)
gonna take some getting used to these increased reps...:doublesho reps 6-9 are a killer...:doublesho enjoying it though and concentrating on form and quality of lift rather than focus on weight...
squat felt good at 50kg and got 5x9 so will go for 5x10 next time...:thumb:
bench also felt good and after 1st set of 8, got 4x10 so will go for 5x11 next time...
BBRows i was expecting my lower back to complain but it didn't so did 5x9..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> saturday workout A of dbbb... was planning this yesterday but decided against it because i had a sore lower back all day confused and after a couple of warmup sets then one workout set of squats i decided it felt too dodgy to plough through rest of workout so thought it better to live and fight another day...:thumb:
> back feels much better this morning so workout A it was...
> squats 50kg 5x9 (increased from 40kg)
> bench 45kg 1x8, 4x10 (inc by 5kg)
> BBRow 45kg 5x9 (inc by 5kg)
> gonna take some getting used to these increased reps...:doublesho reps 6-9 are a killer...:doublesho enjoying it though and concentrating on form and quality of lift rather than focus on weight...
> squat felt good at 50kg and got 5x9 so will go for 5x10 next time...:thumb:
> bench also felt good and after 1st set of 8, got 4x10 so will go for 5x11 next time...
> BBRows i was expecting my lower back to complain but it didn't so did 5x9..:thumb:
> rgds stu


Good workout Stu, glad your Keeping your range full & form strict mate, this is the REAL trick with any body building routine for it to give results :thumb:

Week 3 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

I combined both the Squat & Deadlift sessions to get myself back in sync 

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 131KGX5 - 149KGX3 - 166KGX1

DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 131KGX5 - 149KGX3 - 166KGX1*

The rest of the day will be spent doing bugger all & watching the winter sports on Eurosport


----------



## dave-g

Well, after speaking to Doug on here over the last couple of days ive decided to give the 5x5 a go 

now, i personally know i'm not the strongest, and i want to work on my form to get the most out of my work out, so went to the gym this morning, and tried out some exercises i've not done/not used to!

I went for the squats at 60kg, 1st time ever doing them so didn't know what to expect haha, and deadlifts at 70kg, happy with that as a start tbh, will give me a base point.

My chest press is feeble tbh, i'm only managing 40kg! 50kg for bent over rows max.


so there is my startin point...!

here we go


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> reckon you should post a few of your workouts colin? i'd be interested to see them..?:thumb:


Happy Christmas and forthcoming new year  Apologies for this being bit of a long one but you did ask  What I was thinking previously was if, for example, you struggle with pullups why not do negatives or band assisted ones every day? You've got the time and recovery available while you pause SL. Like Doug said, I don't think that isolation exercise will be a silver bullet but you could do press variations every session and mix it up a bit.

For me I had a think about what I wanted to achieve and decided that it was (a) sorting out my back (b) BW OHP. Everything else was secondary to these. Couple of pieces stuck in my mind when deciding what to do: Wendler 'make it a priority' if you want to improve it (bit like Doug and his recovery or James and his shoulder), Brendan Chaplin 'to add something, you've got to take something out; what are you willing to drop?', and Bill Starr 'the press needs leaning on like the squat' (i.e. frequency). My squat and deadlift haven't stalled yet and I'm on Cycle 6 so leaving them alone.

I've gone for 5\3\1 format, followed up with a 5x10 opposite compound and then one of my priorities. Some bits of the press routines are from Bill Starr's article on Rip's website. I'm sticking to 5\3\1 for the press for now but might switch to his main format if I feel it would be useful.

Session 1 - Press 5\3\1; Dips 5x max, chins 5 x max

Session 2 - Deadlift 5\3\1; Squat 5x10, abs

Session 3 - Bench 5\3\1; Press 5x10, abs

Session 4 - Squat 5\3\1; Deadlift 5x10, Press 3 reps and adding 5kg upto failure then press starts 3x3 (from Starr)

'Abs' means two from a list of band crunch, leg raise, farmer walk, plank, or just 'Stuart Mcgill Big 3'.

It is missing rows for balance so I try to add them in on session 1 or 3, but not if it's to the detriment of other elements.

Cardio - Very hard to do sprints in the dark (don't realise how uneven grass is until I sprinted in the pitch black!). I had sort of talked myself out of doing anything thinking 'Can't do sprints, no prowler etc, so it's not worth it'. Then I decided that was stupid and have moved to 20-30 min run with sprints every 3 lamposts. Better than nothing.

Equipment - Dips very hard with no bars so got these made (as I try to get things locally rather than funding China!).










Starr says you need to do dips with 50kg. I asked Rip what that translated into for a Bench Press and he reckoned 275-300lb. I need to double my bench press. This is going to take a while 

Coaching - decided to get someone to clean up my technique. I contacted someone who looked good, comepetes, and wasn't all about fat loos. They came back along the lines of 'Good news, a member of the national weightlifitng team is doing some PT with me so you can go with them'. You know when you volunteer to do something and then think 'what the f u c k was I thinking'? This is a prime example!


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> Well, after speaking to Doug on here over the last couple of days ive decided to give the 5x5 a go
> 
> now, i personally know i'm not the strongest, and i want to work on my form to get the most out of my work out, so went to the gym this morning, and tried out some exercises i've not done/not used to!
> 
> I went for the squats at 60kg, 1st time ever doing them so didn't know what to expect haha, and deadlifts at 70kg, happy with that as a start tbh, will give me a base point.
> 
> My chest press is feeble tbh, i'm only managing 40kg! 50kg for bent over rows max.
> 
> so there is my startin point...!
> 
> here we go


Dave,

Don't concern yourself with how much you lift at this stage, its a learning curve at the beginning & then more learning curves as you progress 

I think the 5x5 & workouts of the same ilk have you start with an empty bar so that you can learn technique. Once the weights get heavy this is even more important.

Even being careful, injuries happen (my hamstring was done while doing light 10 rep barbell rows with only 70Kg :doublesho) Imagine if I had done it will deadlifting 185Kg 6 months ago! Probably torn the whole muscle off :doublesho Thankfully it was one of those injuries that Dave Tate calls a total fluke & there was nothing to prepare for it, if it was done by bad technique I would have been kicking myself big time.

And that is the point of starting light, if you learn good technique you lessen the chance of an injury. When you **** up a heavy lift the chances of injury are greater & so is the extent of the injury.

I would start with an empty bar Dave, you will soon add weight with the 5x5 :thumb:

It doesn't matter if your into body building or powerlifting, leave the ego at the door before entering your gym to train :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

dave-g said:


> Well, after speaking to Doug on here over the last couple of days ive decided to give the 5x5 a go
> 
> now, i personally know i'm not the strongest, and i want to work on my form to get the most out of my work out, so went to the gym this morning, and tried out some exercises i've not done/not used to!
> 
> I went for the squats at 60kg, 1st time ever doing them so didn't know what to expect haha, and deadlifts at 70kg, happy with that as a start tbh, will give me a base point.
> 
> My chest press is feeble tbh, i'm only managing 40kg! 50kg for bent over rows max.
> 
> so there is my startin point...!
> 
> here we go


good for you mate...:thumb: you'll love it (and hate it..:devil
i've done it for about 3 or 4 months but not as consistently as i should've... and thats one of the keys to it...be consistent..
don't worry about what your press is or any of the weights either, it doesn't matter...! i started as the SL recommended with 20 kgs (just the olympic bar)for everything and added the 2.5kg everytime and don't worry, it soons goes up in weight and it soon gets harder...:doublesho:devil:
just keep your form good with the lighter starting weights and treat that as a learning time as you get to the heavier weights...you'll thank yourself in the long run...:thumb:
keep us updated with your workouts... its a very friendly supportive thread this, with lots of very knowledgeable and helpful people...(as you've found with doug:thumb
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> now, i personally know i'm not the strongest


Forgot to add to this 

Dave,

Your goals don't require strength mate, but decent nutrition, good form & full range of motion.

Strength is only for those of us who's primary goal is strength, please don't work yourself up into a mind set of heavy is the only way to a better physique.

I think in your position I would prioritise thus 

1. Nutrition

2. Train slow with Good form & Full range of movement

3. Consider moving over to a 10 rep routine after 3 months on the 5x5

4. Strength: Keep striving to add weight to your exercises but never at the cost of items 1-3 above

:thumb:

Take it from me, full on strength/power training can & will beat you up, it is my goal yes but heavy has always been my thing, its the way I motivate myself to lift. It has nothing to do with ego, its how I roll baby!


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> its a very friendly supportive thread this, with lots of very knowledgeable and helpful people...(as you've found with doug:thumb
> rgds stu


Stu, If you think for one moment your getting any commission for that comment!:lol::lol:


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> Happy Christmas and forthcoming new year  Apologies for this being bit of a long one but you did ask  What I was thinking previously was if, for example, you struggle with pullups why not do negatives or band assisted ones every day? You've got the time and recovery available while you pause SL. Like Doug said, I don't think that isolation exercise will be a silver bullet but you could do press variations every session and mix it up a bit.
> 
> For me I had a think about what I wanted to achieve and decided that it was (a) sorting out my back (b) BW OHP. Everything else was secondary to these. Couple of pieces stuck in my mind when deciding what to do: Wendler 'make it a priority' if you want to improve it (bit like Doug and his recovery or James and his shoulder), Brendan Chaplin 'to add something, you've got to take something out; what are you willing to drop?', and Bill Starr 'the press needs leaning on like the squat' (i.e. frequency). My squat and deadlift haven't stalled yet and I'm on Cycle 6 so leaving them alone.
> 
> I've gone for 531 format, followed up with a 5x10 opposite compound and then one of my priorities. Some bits of the press routines are from Bill Starr's article on Rip's website. I'm sticking to 531 for the press for now but might switch to his main format if I feel it would be useful.
> 
> Session 1 - Press 531; Dips 5x max, chins 5 x max
> 
> Session 2 - Deadlift 531; Squat 5x10, abs
> 
> Session 3 - Bench 531; Press 5x10, abs
> 
> Session 4 - Squat 531; Deadlift 5x10, Press 3 reps and adding 5kg upto failure then press starts 3x3 (from Starr)
> 
> 'Abs' means two from a list of band crunch, leg raise, farmer walk, plank, or just 'Stuart Mcgill Big 3'.
> 
> It is missing rows for balance so I try to add them in on session 1 or 3, but not if it's to the detriment of other elements.
> 
> Cardio - Very hard to do sprints in the dark (don't realise how uneven grass is until I sprinted in the pitch black!). I had sort of talked myself out of doing anything thinking 'Can't do sprints, no prowler etc, so it's not worth it'. Then I decided that was stupid and have moved to 20-30 min run with sprints every 3 lamposts. Better than nothing.
> 
> Equipment - Dips very hard with no bars so got these made (as I try to get things locally rather than funding China!).
> 
> Starr says you need to do dips with 50kg. I asked Rip what that translated into for a Bench Press and he reckoned 275-300lb. I need to double my bench press. This is going to take a while
> 
> Coaching - decided to get someone to clean up my technique. I contacted someone who looked good, comepetes, and wasn't all about fat loos. They came back along the lines of 'Good news, a member of the national weightlifitng team is doing some PT with me so you can go with them'. You know when you volunteer to do something and then think 'what the f u c k was I thinking'? This is a prime example!


wow col, superpost...!:doublesho:thumb: we're gonna be expecting more of em...
very interesting reading mate and do love how all you guys here come up with such detailed well thought out routines and plans...!:thumb: it looks like you've covered all your bases...? like the sound of the running, something i may try and ease into in the new year...already starting to do powerdogwalks everyday...
with regards the pullups, its just something i'd love to be able to do, along with dips  but right now my weight far exceeds my strength levels..!:doublesho i do have some bands and have indeed done the odd few cheeky assisted pullups in the last few months...maybe i should dig out my bands again...

wicked idea with the coaching too...:thumb: and training with a member of the national weightlifting team is too good to pass up!, result...:thumb: reckon you should get some pics/videos of the event...?

dip bars look good too col... nice idea with getting made up locally, the powdercoating looks good...? i used to have a mate from work who could machine up anything i needed, mainly custom bike parts:devil:, and also had a really good and cheap powdercoater but they've moved away now or not as reliable...

anyway, good luck with your new plan col...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X5) 52KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 75KGX5

BENCH PRESS 40KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 40KGX10X10X10X10X10*

I'm going to train the deload week as a bodybuilder.

All exercises will be trained 1 second positive & negative, take no more than 30 seconds rest between sets & no more than one minute rest between exercises.

*Bench Press *- Wider grip & lower the bar to the pec's.

I'm hoping this alternative way to train every 4 weeks will help make the workout more intense, burn a few more calories, improve my cardiovascular fitness & aid in my body fat loss :thumb:

Marvellous!


----------



## sfstu

good plan doug...:thumb:
looking at those weights on bench and rows i was thinking "welcome to my world":lol: i certainly feel those extra reps tho...:devil:
how much do you deload by on deload week...? seems like a good idea to give your muscles and body a rest from heavy lifting all the time...

got my workout in next hour... about an hour in from work and lunch now so just chillin for a bit then going to get some mettallica playing loud and get fired up...:devil: (planning to concentrate on ohp and going to go for 5x10, no effing about... :devil
stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> good plan doug...:thumb:
> looking at those weights on bench and rows i was thinking "welcome to my world":lol: i certainly feel those extra reps tho...:devil:
> how much do you deload by on deload week...? seems like a good idea to give your muscles and body a rest from heavy lifting all the time...
> 
> got my workout in next hour... about an hour in from work and lunch now so just chillin for a bit then going to get some mettallica playing loud and get fired up...:devil: (planning to concentrate on ohp and going to go for 5x10, no effing about... :devil
> stu


De load as per the 5/3/1 with a little tweaks. 

Bodybuilder training style.

1. Short rest (Will stay around 30 seconds as my default).

2. Form & full range of movement.
3. Working on my TUT (Time Under Tension), possibly up to the max of six seconds! :doublesho (that's gonna hurt!) :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

workout B, dbbb routine...:thumb:
OHP 30kg 2x10, 3x8...
deadlift 50kg 5x11
lying tricep extension 15kg 5x11

thought i'd smash the ohp at 30kg today but not to be...:wall: first couple of sets were fine for 10 reps but last 3 sets i just couldn't do more than 8...i had made some progress on sl and got up to 45kgish but extra reps are gonna take so getting used to... oh well, next time...
deadlift was ok..got 5x11 so will increase by 2.5kg..:thumb: 
tried lying triceps extension today (as per rip's vid)...went light as first time doing tris...not sure about them though?, did a couple of skullcrushers at the time to compare and they felt like they put more onto the triceps...probably not doing them right... 
also bloody awkward to get into position on my own half out of the cage trying not to knock over everything in garage... may try doug's suggestion of close grip BP next time and compare...? (wasn't sure about adding close grip BP as thought it would double up with normal bench meaning doing chest every workout causing imbalance...?)
rgds stu

by the way,
*HAPPY NEW YEAR GUYS*, all the best for 2013 and safe lifting...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> workout B, dbbb routine...:thumb:
> OHP 30kg 2x10, 3x8...
> deadlift 50kg 5x11
> lying tricep extension 15kg 5x11
> 
> thought i'd smash the ohp at 30kg today but not to be...:wall: first couple of sets were fine for 10 reps but last 3 sets i just couldn't do more than 8...i had made some progress on sl and got up to 45kgish but extra reps are gonna take so getting used to... oh well, next time...
> deadlift was ok..got 5x11 so will increase by 2.5kg..:thumb:
> tried lying triceps extension today (as per rip's vid)...went light as first time doing tris...not sure about them though?, did a couple of skullcrushers at the time to compare and they felt like they put more onto the triceps...probably not doing them right...
> also bloody awkward to get into position on my own half out of the cage trying not to knock over everything in garage... may try doug's suggestion of close grip BP next time and compare...? (wasn't sure about adding close grip BP as thought it would double up with normal bench meaning doing chest every workout causing imbalance...?)
> rgds stu
> 
> by the way,
> *HAPPY NEW YEAR GUYS*, all the best for 2013 and safe lifting...:thumb:


lol, I did say mate, the reason I don't do LTE is it just feels like I'm not working the Triceps. They are very hard to hit due to the 3 heads of the muscle etc..

I would go for either: Dips, Close grip bench or my alternative narrow close grip bench press. If you execute either close grip bench press exercises correctly you'll feel the Tri's getting hit hard.

Don't forget, the bench press & overhead press also hit the Triceps.

Alternatively, you could try Triceps press ups. Imagine a press up off the floor but keep your elbows tight at your sides & press, this is a good way to get the Triceps ready for dips  Don't be fooled by its simplicity & you can strap weights to your back as you progress, all of a sudden you have an upper body squat! :thumb:

HAPPY NEW YEAR FROM CORNWALL!!!!!


----------



## sfstu

think i'll try the close grip press next time or before then try a few triceps pushups, see which feels best...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Happy New Year everyone.

Been some good info on here over the last few days. Always good to see.

Oats I would definitely add Barbell Rows to your session 3 to even out your pulling to pushing ratio, just slightly better for your shoulders, posture, etc.

All this talk about dips, my opinion is that are amazing. I have both Body Weight and Weighted Dips in my program at the moment and I think they contribute a great deal to Bench Press strength and in some ways are better for overall development than Bench Press.

Good to read that a 50kg Dip translates to 300lb Bench Press as I'm dipping 30kg for 6 so Im around that strength.

I find the Dips bars for our Racks the perfect width for me.

For triceps I love skull crushers, I find they are the best exercise for adding inches to your arms quickly. Do them with your upper arm 10 degrees or so backwards so even when your at the top of the rep all the tension is still on the triceps. This way you get zero rest throughout your sets.

For everyone whos on Leangains annd has done their reading, do you mind helping me with a few things. The more research I do, the more it makes sense but all I keep thinking is this. You do a 16 hour fast and a 8 hour eating window, so say 12-8. People you say they feel better and less full but the Leangains program you still eat the same overall amount of food and calories per day but your just eating the food in a shorter time period so you must eat more at each meal and wouldnt you therefore feel fuller????

This is what Im thinking. Normal diet 3000 calories spread over 16 hours, eating every 3 hours so 5 meals, 600 calories per meal. Leans gains would be 3 meals, 1 every 2.5 hours but 1,000 calories per meal. Is this correct or have I got the wrong end of the stick?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Happy New Year everyone.
> 
> Been some good info on here over the last few days. Always good to see.
> 
> Oats I would definitely add Barbell Rows to your session 3 to even out your pulling to pushing ratio, just slightly better for your shoulders, posture, etc.
> 
> *Definitely agree with James here, the barbell row is an awesome lift :thumb:*
> 
> All this talk about dips, my opinion is that are amazing. I have both Body Weight and Weighted Dips in my program at the moment and I think they contribute a great deal to Bench Press strength and in some ways are better for overall development than Bench Press.
> 
> Good to read that a 50kg Dip translates to 300lb Bench Press as I'm dipping 30kg for 6 so Im around that strength.
> 
> I find the Dips bars for our Racks the perfect width for me.
> 
> For triceps I love skull crushers, I find they are the best exercise for adding inches to your arms quickly. Do them with your upper arm 10 degrees or so backwards so even when your at the top of the rep all the tension is still on the triceps. This way you get zero rest throughout your sets.
> 
> For everyone whos on Leangains annd has done their reading, do you mind helping me with a few things. The more research I do, the more it makes sense but all I keep thinking is this. You do a 16 hour fast and a 8 hour eating window, so say 12-8. People you say they feel better and less full but the Leangains program you still eat the same overall amount of food and calories per day but your just eating the food in a shorter time period so you must eat more at each meal and wouldnt you therefore feel fuller????
> 
> This is what Im thinking. Normal diet 3000 calories spread over 16 hours, eating every 3 hours so 5 meals, 600 calories per meal. Leans gains would be 3 meals, 1 every 2.5 hours but 1,000 calories per meal. Is this correct or have I got the wrong end of the stick?


As for leangains;

I've read all the site over & over. My conclusion is im going with how I feel with a moderate structured approach to the calorific deficit & nutrition.

Sometimes I think we lose the plot with being over scientific in our desire to label & rigidly structure everything we do to make sure we get 100% out of our training, ironically I think it has a negative effect & reduces optimum efficiency. We are natural creatures not machines.

I'm feeling way less full (I don't know why as I'm eating fair sized evening meals) I have more energy, I seem to be feeling stronger, my lower body lifts are so easy at the weights I'm using, its just my hamstring I'm afraid of re injuring which is holding me back . Upper body feels gooood!!!

I have now over the last two weeks crept up to 108.7KG!!!!:doublesho But I'm more muscular (Even I can see it!!) I visited a few people over Christmas who hadn't seem me for 3 months & they all think I've lost weight WTF!!!

All this is just my very unscientific opinion, whatever leangains does WORKS  for me 

You haven't got the wrong end of the stick James, your just looking at it too hard 

Get an average of 200gm protein a day, consume around 300-500 calories less a per day than your required amount & I cannot see anyone failing! :thumb:

Breakfast is bull****, I've always disliked eating early, leangains is like going back to my roots. Looks like I came to the correct conclusion all those years ago on my own & now years later after 12months of lifting I've gone full circle & come to the same conclusion. Again 

I wish I stuck to my own instincts instead of reading up all the bull on the internet & allowing it to confuse my own natural intuition. Its funny as years ago I also came to the same conclusion about supplements, whey protein is the only one worth taking, simply because it makes it easy to achieve your 200gm protein per day intake.

I'm sure I'll think of more (my joints feel better & I feel more flexible since eating this way, I have no idea how this works, but I think its partly due to my midsection being slimmer!!).

Go for it mate, 100gm protein twice a day job done!!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

New years day & I'm working out, I must be out of my small mind!! :devil::devil:

Week 4 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X5) 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 100KGX5

SQUAT 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

As with all my deload weeks I'm training in a bodybuilding style, Squat, going so low I'm almost sitting on the floor! 

Like the fitness aspect of this light week also :thumb:

Disappointed no one else does the standing calf raise though, it is an awesome lift, I know it is thought of as dangerous, but if your contemplating doing this heavy (200Kg-300Kg or more) I would get some truck strapping for added safety & balance (Make sure you get the correct weight rating), put the straps over your shoulders & load the barbell as close to the floor as possible :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

i am certainly noticing the fitness aspect of 10rep sets...:doublesho gets the heart fair beating away and am usually pretty out of breath at end of set...

i used to do the standing calf raise years ago at the gym and always loved it :thumb: but i thought with the routines most of us are doing here they would be considered an "accessory" exercise, not one of the 5 main exercises...? from what i've read, most programmes like SL etc preach that your calfs are covered by doing squats, same as bi's and tri's are covered with bench and ohp etc...
mind you, i'm thoroughly enjoying doing biceps and triceps now and as they are your assistance set i can see why you like doing them doug...
how do you do them out of interest...? freestanding inside of cage or do you need to lean the barbell against the racking..? (just thinking of all that paint getting scraped up...:doublesho:devil
it is worth checking, but most of the truck straps (that we use anyway) are rated 1000kg plus... ones from the airport are best straps to get hold of, most are rated 5000kg...:doublesho (had backend of my bike hanging from one in my garage a couple of years ago while i worked on it for 6 months :thumb..
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> i am certainly noticing the fitness aspect of 10rep sets...:doublesho gets the heart fair beating away and am usually pretty out of breath at end of set...
> 
> i used to do the standing calf raise years ago at the gym and always loved it :thumb: but i thought with the routines most of us are doing here they would be considered an "accessory" exercise, not one of the 5 main exercises...? from what i've read, most programmes like SL etc preach that your calfs are covered by doing squats, same as bi's and tri's are covered with bench and ohp etc...
> mind you, i'm thoroughly enjoying doing biceps and triceps now and as they are your assistance set i can see why you like doing them doug...
> how do you do them out of interest...? freestanding inside of cage or do you need to lean the barbell against the racking..? (just thinking of all that paint getting scraped up...:doublesho:devil
> it is worth checking, but most of the truck straps (that we use anyway) are rated 1000kg plus... ones from the airport are best straps to get hold of, most are rated 5000kg...:doublesho (had backend of my bike hanging from one in my garage a couple of years ago while i worked on it for 6 months :thumb..
> rgds stu


Hiya Stu,

I currently do my SCR in the rack lean against it & scrap up & down as I rep :doublesho Not worried about the paint, power racks are a tool & worrying about the paint is just another small thing that may hold you back. I used to re paint my old Mass Goliath builder once every 5 years or so.

Yep, I was looking at the 1000Kg straps, well priced for the job :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Hiya Stu,
> 
> I currently do my SCR in the rack lean against it & scrap up & down as I rep :doublesho Not worried about the paint, power racks are a tool & worrying about the paint is just another small thing that may hold you back. I used to re paint my old Mass Goliath builder once every 5 years or so.
> 
> Yep, I was looking at the 1000Kg straps, well priced for the job :thumb:


i can remember reading your review of rack doug and didn't you coat it with fk or something...?:lol:
totally agree with you on the cage though...mines picked up a few scrapes and scratches so far and it doesn't worry me in the least... 
do you use a piece of wood under foot as a platform or anything when doing scr...? when i sometimes did them on my old marcy smith machine, i used as a platform a angled lump of wood that was actually a chock used for the airplanes at heathrow...:doublesho it was handy being a driver on the airport...


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Yep, I was looking at the 1000Kg straps, well priced for the job :thumb:


don't buy any doug...?! i can get hold of them easily from work..:thumb:
let me know what you need mate...


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Happy New Year everyone.
> 
> Been some good info on here over the last few days. Always good to see.
> 
> Oats I would definitely add Barbell Rows to your session 3 to even out your pulling to pushing ratio, just slightly better for your shoulders, posture, etc.
> 
> All this talk about dips, my opinion is that are amazing. I have both Body Weight and Weighted Dips in my program at the moment and I think they contribute a great deal to Bench Press strength and in some ways are better for overall development than Bench Press.
> 
> Good to read that a 50kg Dip translates to 300lb Bench Press as I'm dipping 30kg for 6 so Im around that strength.
> 
> I find the Dips bars for our Racks the perfect width for me.
> 
> For triceps I love skull crushers, I find they are the best exercise for adding inches to your arms quickly. Do them with your upper arm 10 degrees or so backwards so even when your at the top of the rep all the tension is still on the triceps. This way you get zero rest throughout your sets.
> 
> For everyone whos on Leangains annd has done their reading, do you mind helping me with a few things. The more research I do, the more it makes sense but all I keep thinking is this. You do a 16 hour fast and a 8 hour eating window, so say 12-8. People you say they feel better and less full but the Leangains program you still eat the same overall amount of food and calories per day but your just eating the food in a shorter time period so you must eat more at each meal and wouldnt you therefore feel fuller????
> 
> This is what Im thinking. Normal diet 3000 calories spread over 16 hours, eating every 3 hours so 5 meals, 600 calories per meal. Leans gains would be 3 meals, 1 every 2.5 hours but 1,000 calories per meal. Is this correct or have I got the wrong end of the stick?


hi james...:thumb:
totally agree there's been some real interesting reading here recently... i'm following you all on the leangains thing too with interest...am doing some reading myself and got an idea of what i need daily and how to do it but still gotta work out some actual meals...
with you on the dips too...its been a long time now since i've done them (or been able to do them!) but when i did, i remember them as feeling that they'd worked my entire upper body...its something i really want to bring into my training but i'm just too heavy vs. too weak to be able to do them right now, but i'm hoping that'll change over next 2 or 3 months, really looking forward to doing them...:thumb:

with the skullcrushers, do you do them with dumbells or can they be done with ez bar and would that be standing or lying...? i didn't really get on with the lying tricep extension yesterday and thinking about either skullcrushers (which i tried a couple of yesterday during workout), or dougs suggestion of triceps pushup or close grip press...maybe i should vary it each time...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> i can remember reading your review of rack doug and didn't you coat it with fk or something...?:lol:
> totally agree with you on the cage though...mines picked up a few scrapes and scratches so far and it doesn't worry me in the least...
> do you use a piece of wood under foot as a platform or anything when doing scr...? when i sometimes did them on my old marcy smith machine, i used as a platform a angled lump of wood that was actually a chock used for the airplanes at heathrow...:doublesho it was handy being a driver on the airport...


Werkstat if memory serves 

At the moment I'm just raising from my squat platform, but will get something made up for the new year :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> don't buy any doug...?! i can get hold of them easily from work..:thumb:
> let me know what you need mate...


That's bloody decent of you Stu, ill get back to you soon mate :thumb:

I'm sure we can come to some arrangement


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> i didn't really get on with the lying tricep extension yesterday and thinking about either skullcrushers (which i tried a couple of yesterday during workout), or dougs suggestion of triceps pushup or close grip press...maybe i should vary it each time...?
> rgds stu


Even though you are trying to hit the triceps more directly, the best lifts are the ones which allow you to use the most weight :thumb: That's why I'm not so keen on skullcrushers or lying triceps extensions.

But bare in mind I have always trained for strength not size :thumb:

If you can get your balance try the close grip bench with your hands touching in the middle. To get my bench up to 180Kg all those years ago I used this combination of these lifts on different days in the week:

Close Gip bench press day (Hands touching in centre of bar) Max ever lifted = 184Kg with a 1-4 rep range, max 10 sets with weight reduced on each set (the old Plate stripping method) :thumb:

Dips Day: body weight plus 40kg x 5 sets using a 1-4 Rep range, then 5 sets body weight 5-7 rep range. lol you should of seen me dipping with weights tied to me with a bit of rope!!! 

:thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Evening all! 

Well I'm back, on the forum that is, not the gym. I've still been hitting it hard. Moved on slightly from 5x5, I still incorporate the main exercises from strong lifts ie squat, bench press, dead lift but introducing some super sets of the relevant muscle group. 

Diet has been useless over Xmas, I've had a rest on weights over the last 2 weeks but hit cardio pretty hard. 

Anyway, that's my little update. I'm just in the process of creating a new plan for the forthcoming 6 weeks.


----------



## sfstu

hi jonny...:thumb: good to hear you're still training...
i shudder to think of some the rubbish (and sheer amount) i got down my neck the last week...:doublesho nevermind, thats what new years for...
post up yer new routine when you've got it worked out..? be interested to see it...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## jonnyMercUK

This is the plan I had, I'm just reworking the exercises as I've doing it for around 6 weeks. 

Workout A
Squats - 5 x 5
Leg press - 4 x 8-10
Leg extension (Superset with) Leg curl - 4 x 12-15
Body weight lunges - 3 x max
Calf extension (Superset with) body weight calf raise - 4 x 20+

Workout B
Bench press - 5 x 5
Seated overhead dumbell press - 4 x 8-10
Dumbell flys (Superset with) dumbell side raise - 4 x 12-15
Body weight dips - 3 x max
Rope cable push downs (Superset with) dumbell kickbacks - 4 x 15-20

Workout C
Deadlift - 5 x 5
Barbell bent row - 4 x 8-10
Wide grip pull down (Superset with) Low lat pulley - 4 x 12-15
Wide grip pull ups - 3 x max
Standing barbell curl (Superset with) e-z bar preacher curl - 4 x 15-20


----------



## sfstu

jonnyMercUK said:


> This is the plan I had, I'm just reworking the exercises as I've doing it for around 6 weeks.
> 
> Workout A
> Squats - 5 x 5
> Leg press - 4 x 8-10
> Leg extension (Superset with) Leg curl - 4 x 12-15
> Body weight lunges - 3 x max
> Calf extension (Superset with) body weight calf raise - 4 x 20+
> 
> Workout B
> Bench press - 5 x 5
> Seated overhead dumbell press - 4 x 8-10
> Dumbell flys (Superset with) dumbell side raise - 4 x 12-15
> Body weight dips - 3 x max
> Rope cable push downs (Superset with) dumbell kickbacks - 4 x 15-20
> 
> Workout C
> Deadlift - 5 x 5
> Barbell bent row - 4 x 8-10
> Wide grip pull down (Superset with) Low lat pulley - 4 x 12-15
> Wide grip pull ups - 3 x max
> Standing barbell curl (Superset with) e-z bar preacher curl - 4 x 15-20


looks like a plan mate...:thumb:
reminds me of when i used to use a gym (as opposed to now training at home) and sort of stuff i used to do...kinda miss it, or at least that time when i used to go the to gym. although i do like training at home now, with just more or less the basic 5 or so exercises...
good luck with new programme...keep us updated as you go on..:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Cheers mate. The gym is literally over the road so it's so handy for me. I go before work now, 6.30am 😳😳😳 tend to find its less busy and I can come home and chill after work


----------



## sfstu

weds dbbb workout A
bench 40kg 5x10
squat 45kg 5x10
BBRow 40kg 5x10
all good...:thumb:
dropped weights slightly...partly to get used to the fitness side and partly to me being slightly impatient to start upping the weight, have decided to take a step back and take it easy and concentrate on my form a bit more and also to get used to longer rep range in first few weeks of this routine...
my fitness sucks right now....:doublesho
it'll pick up i know and will be easier as i start to lose some excess weight/bulk/fat...:devil:
off for a powerdogwalk now...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> weds dbbb workout A
> bench 40kg 5x10
> squat 45kg 5x10
> BBRow 40kg 5x10
> all good...:thumb:
> dropped weights slightly...partly to get used to the fitness side and partly to me being slightly impatient to start upping the weight, have decided to take a step back and take it easy and concentrate on my form a bit more and also to get used to longer rep range in first few weeks of this routine...
> my fitness sucks right now....:doublesho
> it'll pick up i know and will be easier as i start to lose some excess weight/bulk/fat...:devil:
> off for a powerdogwalk now...:thumb:
> rgds stu


Stick with it Stu, once the weights get heavier this will give great results & you do have the option to move over to a 4 day routine in time & I can help you formulate the routine for extra intensity :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 5 De load - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 25KGx5 - 30KGx5 - 40KGx5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 2.5Kg x10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS  30KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

If only workouts were as easy as this one!!!!


----------



## sfstu

friday workout B dbbb
ohp 27.5kg 5x11
dead 45kg 5x11
bicep curl 18.5kg 5x11
slight weight drop on ohp and dead as i settle on the right weights i need to start from but all good...:thumb: slowly getting to used to the higher reps and felt slightly less out of breath today...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> slowly getting to used to the higher reps and felt slightly less out of breath today...
> rgds stu


Give it 2 weeks mate & you'll see a great improvement with your 11 rep fitness :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1 (De Load week)

*DEADLIFT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 100KGX5

DEADLIFT 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice light de load session :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Stu I looked over that App some more last night and was quite surprised how good it was, I scanned the barcode on my Supplements and they were already in there. Found out the Meatball sub I usually have is 1500 calories plus 3 cookies equals 2200 calories for lunch :doublesho Oops. Anyway the only thing I would change is the suggested % of daily calries from protein, it seems very low and probably more inline with givernment suggestions that are too low for people who exercise. I changed mine to 40% protein, 30% carbs and fat. Good starting point and then change from there.


hi james, an older post above but just started using myfitnessapp properly and agree its pretty useful, once i've gotten used to it... 
i can't see though how you adjust the percentages as you've mentioned above...?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 4 Cycle 5 - 5/3/1 (De Load week)
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 100KGX5
> 
> DEADLIFT 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Nice light de load session :thumb:


looks like a nice rest for the body and mind doug...:thumb: presume you go back to heavy lifting on next weeks cycle...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> looks like a nice rest for the body and mind doug...:thumb: presume you go back to heavy lifting on next weeks cycle...?
> rgds stu


Indeed I am Stu, following the 5/3/1 as is, 3 weeks powerlifting & assistance work then on the 4th week light de load using slightly slower exercise execution :thumb:

Week 3 this next cycle my bench is up to 125.5Kg :thumb:

Squat & deadlift are staying at 166.5kg as I'm still not confident enough to go heavier...yet


----------



## Bod42

Im with Doug on the Close Grip Bench Press where you do them with your hands nearly touching but I like to do them with an EZ Bar. It puts your hands and wrists pointing out slightly which puts a lot less stress on them. I found I could lift more this way as the joint stres was less.



sfstu said:


> hi james, an older post above but just started using myfitnessapp properly and agree its pretty useful, once i've gotten used to it...
> i can't see though how you adjust the percentages as you've mentioned above...?
> rgds stu


I remember it was pretty inbedded in the App but its there somewhere. I will have a look later and remind myself then let you know.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> hi james, an older post above but just started using myfitnessapp properly and agree its pretty useful, once i've gotten used to it...
> ,i can't see though how you adjust the percentages as you've mentioned above...?
> rgds stu


Stu,

My approach - keep the diet simple & very similar throughout the cutting phase, this helps with keeping track, due to the lack of variation you also find you are more than likely to stick to the diet, diversify too much & you can run into issues, mistakes & going off track :thumb:

Over the next 3 months (I'll re-evaluate after the end of March):

1. Primary protein sources will be - Chicken breast, Prawns, Tuna & lastly whey protein (2 x a day with meals) :thumb:

2. Secondary protein sources will be pumpkin & de hulled hemp seeds that cover my salads :doublesho (Omega 3/joint health & added fibre amongst other benefits, why use a supplement when there is a perfectly natural alternative) :thumb:

3. There will also be a little extra protein from the vegetables consumed. Not counting those...so there!.

In regards to protein, 2 x 135gm chicken breast grilled, will give a whopping 58.86gm of protein at 324Kcal :devil: :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

i'm working out my diet to be very similar from day to day for ease and convenience...:thumb: obviously eating the same each day will save a lot of calorie counting which will be handy as its a bit of a minefield, i'm aiming for just a couple of choices just to make things interesting and i'll be less likey to want to snack...
no more "breakfast in a roll" from the cafe then....:lol:

secretely pleased that i completed my last christmas scoff up last night...:thumb: 
always get together every year round a mates house with a couple of mates to watch films and stuff and we order an indian takeaway plus loads of chocolate,biscuits,cheescake and loads of other rubbish...:doublesho:devil:
its a tradition, and its not the done thing either to order healthy from the indian or to wimp out on the chocolat etc so felt seriously ill last night...:lol:
glad its done with now... 
last week was first time i'd paid attention to what and how much i ate so have a lot more idea now of what i need to eat so this next week will be finetuning it...:thumb:

james, i looked and looked on myfitnesspal, both on mobile app and on the proper site on laptop but just couldn't find where you could change those settings...?
took me a few days to get used to the app but it is very good and well handy sometimes to barcode scan stuff...:thumb:

guys, will try the close grip bench press on this weeks tri workout, as i really didn't get on with the LTE (though i watched the ripvid a couple of times)...:thumb:
do like the ripvids...but does anyone else think he's chuck norris's brother..?:doublesho:lol:
Rippetoe-Texas Ranger....:devil:

p.s. my new years deal with myself...:thumb: if i lose a stone in excess weight in next 2 months, i'm treating myself to a set of oly dumbbells...


----------



## Bod42

Stu looks like Im in the similar frame of mind to you. Just came back from holiday last night and pretty much ate what I wanted, when I wanted but now I'm going to loose 5kg so will tidy up my diet. Im hoping even though I'm dieting that my weights dont suffer much as my body responds extremely well to extra protein and low carbs.

Best progress I ever had while putting on very little fat was to keep everything the same but change the amount of carbs I ate on non-training and training days. So I would have low to medium carbs on non-training days and high carb on training days. This was simple as I just added carbs to my protein shakes on high days. Now I will be doing low carbs on non training days and medium carb on training days. Pretty much as per Leangains suggestions.

Anyway Stu I looked at the App again and it seems that you have to change them through the website. Go to My Home - Goals - Change Goals - Custom - The change Carbs, Fat & Protein. I dont use this App exclusively and I keep things simple like Doug suggests but its just helpful sometimes to scan stuff and it shows you there and then the nutrional values. Like I was shocked at the amount a meatball subway has.


----------



## sfstu

just changed it...nice one james...:thumb: its been driving me crackers...
interesting point about the carbs on training and non-training days...i could easily add a banana or a scoop of instant oats to shake for easy carb addition...
sounds like you, me and doug are all on similar path at the moment...anyone would think its new year...!
rgds stu


----------



## dave-g

So for extra carbs are you just adding oats to a shake for a training day?

Any other diet tips? I'm just eating salad, chicken, rice, pasta, sweet potatoes and protein Shakes ATM. 

The diet is the most confusing :/


----------



## sfstu

dave-g said:


> So for extra carbs are you just adding oats to a shake for a training day?
> 
> Any other diet tips? I'm just eating salad, chicken, rice, pasta, sweet potatoes and protein Shakes ATM.
> 
> The diet is the most confusing :/


adding oats to protein shake is just one easy way of getting extra carbs if you need them...:thumb: i have myprotein instant oats and mixes well with protein powder....

the diet does seem confusing at first but stick with it and it can be worked out... i've started using myfitness app which you enter your food on and it counts the cals,protein,carbs and fat each day...it also has a barcode scanner for instant additions...little overwelming maybe at first but it soon becomes easier to use and most of us, once we've found our ideal amounts for the day, will stick with this each day (weekdays anyway) for ease...

the leangains system of nutrition is highly recommended, do a little digging and reading for a few days and it will become easier...:thumb: there's been a fair bit discussed over last couple of weeks on this here thread in case you haven't seen the posts...?
what are your aims diet,nutritionwise dave...?
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

dave-g said:


> So for extra carbs are you just adding oats to a shake for a training day?
> 
> Any other diet tips? I'm just eating salad, chicken, rice, pasta, sweet potatoes and protein Shakes ATM.
> 
> The diet is the most confusing :/


When I was on a Bulk in my rugby days you need to take in more calories to build muscle but you dont want to get fat so I would only take in carbs when I really needed them.

The easiest way I found was just to add maltodextrin supplement to my protein shakes on training days but keep everything else the same. 2 shakes per day with 2 scoops in each would add 130 grams of carbs. This also had the effect of increasing my calorie intake by 520 calories on training days.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
8 Weeks to Monsterous Shoulders Routine
Pendlay Rows: 60kg x 5 x 8
Dumbell Rows: 22.5kg x 3 x 12

For those who dont know the 8 weeks to Monsterous Shoulders program isnt reallly what ther name implies. The 1st 4 weeks are completely rehad exercises. And as Bench Press is the exercise that hurts my shoulder the most, I have dropped Bench Press for a month and replaced with this rehab program.

I forgot to print out my workout sheet and there did 8 reps on Pendlay Rows and sadly this is what I did last workout so I didnt progress but hey look on the bright side I stayed the same after a few weeks off over christmas.

I can go a massive amount heavier on Dumbell Rows but Im using this month to improve my shoulder so doing these more Body Builder style with a big stretch at the bottom and a count at the top with basically zero body movement. Really burns up the back that way.


----------



## sfstu

hi james...good workout, especially if you've been on holiday...! hope you get your shoulder sorted soon to where you can go back to stuff like bench...:thumb:

monday workout A dbbb
bench 40kg 5x11
BBRow 42.5kg 5x8
squat 42.5kg 5x8
all good again...will increase by 2.5kg the bench for next time and i'm keeping an eye on form on all exercises...getting nice and low on squat, hitting the stops most of the time so think i may lower them one notch... fitness is slowly improving and i'm not as out of breath as i was a week or so ago and doesn't feel as if i'm about to have a heart attack...:doublesho:lol:
eating is going well and have felt full of energy all day plus not felt bloated either and pretty much close to targets on macros/cals...i'm keen to see if it makes a difference on the scales in a couple of weeks...if not, i'll reevaluate...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

weds (midmorn) workout B dbbb
OHP 30kg 5x8
dead 45kg 5x10
close grip bench 20kg 5x8
all good, ohp went well after a shakey start last week...taking this one slow and steady as my shoulders are really weak..
dead went well, going steady on this too as have had a slightly sore lower back last couple of workouts confused so concentrated on form...
tried the closegrip bench today following recent advice from james and doug..:thumb: used the ez bar at 20kg and fists were about 4-5in apart on bar...felt good and definately felt it in the tris as they were still sore from mondays bench...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Jumps: 3 x 5
Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 102.5x5, 117.5x5, 135x5 PM 157.5
Deadlifts: 95 x 5 x 10

I actually squatted for 1 less rep than over christmas which is disappointing as it knocks 4.5kg off my predicted max. But something good did come out of it. I feel like my upper back is getting stronger and where Im'm putting the bar is getting more natural. I say this because lifting the weight from the rack and walking it out was probably the easiest its ever been. I kept lifting the weight and then looking side ways to check that the weights were correct. The only reason I missed the lift was form, on the 5th rep I rocked forward on to my toes and therefore the bar started trying to roll up my back, this meant I used a lot of back strength to get the rep back on track. 1 less rep but for some reason I still feel good about things.

Deadlifts are getting to be an absolute killer, I know 2 mins rest doesnt sound hard in theory but when your near your limit its a killer. Last few sets felt like I sat down took a few breaths and the time had gone. I know I'm getting near my limit as the last 1-2 reps on the last 2 sets were kind of grinders. But Im going to keep pushing as Im so close to my goal of 100kg Deadlift for 5 sets of 10 reps with 2 mins rest.

Oh and to add to it all it was about 30 degrees and god knows the humidity in my garage but I was soaked after deadlifts. Nice BBQ for dinner is always good though.

My goals are still to get strong and hit my targets but I offically joined a golf club the other day so I'm set on becoming a scratch golfer and making the club team. The extra strength must be helping as I hit the 600 yard par 5 in 2 tuesday night, driver, 5 wood which isnt bad, and its flat not down hill.

Update on the diet, Im trying Leangains again as every review I read only has positive things to say and Im doing low carb on off days, medium carbs on training days, abit higher on lower body days. Its hard to prepare all your food etc but yesterday was the first time I had carbs for lunch since sunday and forgot how cool it is when you reintroduce carbs, I got a massive pump during deadlifts last night, even my triceps were pumped. Apologies the long post.


----------



## bruudy

My absolute favorite for Rugby players or anyone in a contact sport is the circuit of death as its now named. 10 Squats, 30 secs Rest, 10 Chin Ups, 30 secs Rest, 10 Deadlifts, 30 secs Rest, 10 Dips with added weight, 2 mins Rest then repeat 3 more times. Try and complete as close to 20mins as possible.Des Moines Jiu Jitsu


----------



## Bod42

bruudy said:


> My absolute favorite for Rugby players or anyone in a contact sport is the circuit of death as its now named. 10 Squats, 30 secs Rest, 10 Chin Ups, 30 secs Rest, 10 Deadlifts, 30 secs Rest, 10 Dips with added weight, 2 mins Rest then repeat 3 more times. Try and complete as close to 20mins as possible.


Thats my workout :lol: Posted it a fair few pages back now. Which club do you play for? The workout has obviously been around for years but my mate and I named it the circuit of death. Coincidence if we both named it the same thing.

Edit: Page 1 of this thread and Post 5 talks about the circuit of death. Actually you must have copy and pasted from my post as its word for word. Have you tried this workout.

Great article for all the people on Leangains. This is exactly what Im doing so its good to read an article outlining the same thing.
http://articles.elitefts.com/nutrition/fasting-for-muscle-gain/


----------



## Oats

Quiet on here at the moment. Usually takes me the whole workout to catchup on two days of posts!

Feel like I'm getting to the business end of 5\3\1 now. Sixth cycle and no resets but getting near. e1RM hasn't gone up much on the lifts but just had a good session. Just added 3kg on Press 1rm (doing the 3reps +5kg upto failure AFTER squats and deadlifts  Would have thought I'd have less energy!). First sign of e1rm budging in months so really pleased with that :thumb: In May, before starting 5\3\1, I squatted 1x120kg as I was mashed. Just did a good but reasonably hard 115kgx5 and feel fine.



Bod42 said:


> I would definitely add Barbell Rows to your session 3 to even out your pulling to pushing ratio, just slightly better for your shoulders, posture, etc.


It's an interesting experiment at the moment. I thought the chins between sets would be 'pulling' and so even things out, especially with my regular pressing. However, I've got a long standing problem where the muscle between my scapula and spine knots up and spasms from my shoulder being hunched forward (apparently common for desk workers or people leaning forward like butchers). When I did dumbell rows it wasn't a problem at all. Now with barbell rows it is. I've been trying barbell rows (at 55\60kg) and they seem to hit the lower back and hamstrings more than upper back, and don't seem to have anywhere near the helpful effect on my muscle knot that dumbell rows did. Not feeling anything on my shoulder but may try to find a balance between barbell and dumbell as they certainly have different effects.

Tuition starts next week. #assumefeotalpositionandprayformercy


----------



## dave-g

Bod42 said:


> Great article for all the people on Leangains. This is exactly what Im doing so its good to read an article outlining the same thing.
> http://articles.elitefts.com/nutrition/fasting-for-muscle-gain/


Thanks for the link mate.

Funny how so many different people have different approaches to things, it always seems different!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sorry no posts this week, I've had the  bloody man flu :wall::wall::wall::wall:


Back training Monday :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Oats if your a desk worker.check this out. Very good for shoulders bit the pull apart also hits the rear delts and upper back.

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/band-pull-apart-super-series-for-healthy-shoulders/


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Oats if your a desk worker.check this out. Very good for shoulders bit the pull apart also hits the rear delts and upper back.
> 
> http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/band-pull-apart-super-series-for-healthy-shoulders/


looks interesting james...
i drive for a living and sometimes for long hours and the seating position is never quite right so i often have problems shoulderwise which i think maybe similar to shoulder problems office workers have....
think i may try this once or twice a week as a mobility exercise...would it be best done on or off exercise days, or wouldn't it matter...?
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Sorry no posts this week, I've had the  bloody man flu :wall::wall::wall::wall:
> 
> Back training Monday :thumb:


manflu is the *WORST* kinda flu doug, everybody knows that, but you've probably had *BIGMANFLU* which is obviously worse still...!!:devil:

still, you'll be well fired up by tomorrow to get back to it...! :thumb:

had last couple of days off myself due to various things, not least a bit of a pain in upper middle back which got worse after last workout so thought i'd take it easy for a couple of days rather than injure myself and put myself out for weeks....
housemove looks to be getting closer so need to be fit for that...!:doublesho

cheeky weigh in this morning...lost about 5 or 6lb.... early days i know and i know that it'll slow up as first part of weight loss is always easier and my diet still needs tweaking some but i'm on the right lines...:thumb: eating more or less between 9am and 6pm at the mo which is actually pretty easy...
all week have felt good, plenty of energy, workouts felt good so gonna carry on in general direction for now...
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

sun workout A dbbb
squat 42.5kg 5x11
bench 42.5kg 1x10,4x11
BBR 42.5kg 5x10

all good today...:thumb: on all exercises especially bbr, i was being vary wary of my upper middle back which i seem to have aggravated at some point in last week or so, not sure how but didn't want to make it any worse...
squats and bench going up 2.5kg for next time...:thumb: bbr going for 5x11 to make sure on form...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> looks interesting james...
> i drive for a living and sometimes for long hours and the seating position is never quite right so i often have problems shoulderwise which i think maybe similar to shoulder problems office workers have....
> think i may try this once or twice a week as a mobility exercise...would it be best done on or off exercise days, or wouldn't it matter...?
> rgds stu


It says at the bottom of the article that you can work up to 3 sets per day, 7 days per week. Exercises like this are fine to do daily as they wont really tax your CNS at all. And driving every day is a very similar position to us office workers. And you can never have to strong shoulders and upper back so it cant do any harm really.

Fridays Workout:
Med Ball Throws: 5x3
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 42.5x5, 47.5x5, 54x5 PM 66.5kg
Inverted Rows: BW x 8, 7, 4
Neutral Grip Chin Up: 6x3, 4x2

The PM is actually down on last time but im not unhappy as I got back late friday night so couldnt workout. This meant I had to shift it to Sat but I was playing golf in the morning so had to workout after. 5 hours in 30+ degree heat on low carb diet and then going to the gym really isnt fun. And to top it off I spent 5 hours in the boiling sun to play  so  off

Inverted Rows are majorly harder than I imagined they would be but they really work your back well.

Im trying thumbless chins after advice from the Q&A section of Elitefts and they do seem to keep abit more pressure off my shoulders.


----------



## Buzz819

I've been working out on and off for years, I cycle on and off, I think it is because I go too hard, over train then stop for a little while and repeat.

Lately I have been doing things a bit different, I started off by doing some German Volume training to get back into the game, I found the workout on bodybuilding.com. I did that for 12 weeks and went to pyramid training, I completed an 6 week routine of that and am now onto the 5x5 training.

My max's -
Bench - 150kg - 4 reps
Deadlift - 200kg - 2 reps
Squat - 180kg - 1 rep
I've got say I'm feeling damn good at the moment.

I'll see how I go after 8 weeks of 5x5 training.

Happy training!

Buzz


----------



## Buzz819

Duplicate!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 86KGX5 - 99KGX5 - 112KGX5

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 72.5KGX10x10x10x10x10*

All goooooooooooood!!


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Sprints: Skipped
Deadlifts: (WU 65x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 105x5, 120x5, 135x5 PM 157.5kg
Squats: 82.5 x 10, 10, 10, 5, 0

I trained one of my mates who has just joined the gym last night but I took him threw an extire workout before starting my workout so it was a long time in the gym. Thats why I skipped Sprints. Its good to help someone get on 5x5 and teach them the moves.

Deadlifts were easy, I dropped the weight quite a while ago and have decided to only do the minimum reps on these. My form feel a lot better and I solely put this down to the 5 sets of 10 reps after squats. I also changed my breathing and this really helped a lot.

Squats I probably could have completed if my lide depended on it but I was exhausted from low carb and was sweating bucket loads and pretty much jus ran out of energy.


----------



## Oats

Buzz819 said:


> My max's -
> Bench - 150kg - 4 reps
> Deadlift - 200kg - 2 reps
> Squat - 180kg - 1 rep


It must be pretty unusual to have a 1RM bench that works out a few Kg short of your squat?



Bod42 said:


> if your a desk worker.check this out.
> http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/band-pull-apart-super-series-for-healthy-shoulders/


Thanks. I'm working my way through Kelly Staretts MODs at the moment and can see this adding this in as a daily thing for a month to see how it goes. What I can't understand though is what the elbow on a table position adds to the routine. Need to try it to find out I guess.


----------



## Oats

Bit achy today after getting some instructions yesterday. Used weights that were probably around 50% of max. Difference was it was 5 reps; few words about technique; 5 reps, few words; 5 reps etc. I'm used to 10 minutes between sets!

Main thing to take home was about pushing hips further forward e.g. plank needs to go lower, side bridge is like a V and a bit low. Interestingly it seem to be about engaging a very similar area of the hip\psoas area that Kelly Starett did in his first ever MOD videos.

*Squat* - I'm not setting my toes level to one another. Could be why my left knee is always sore\irritated as I'm twisting as I push up. Also pushing\flicking hips backwards at start of descent and need to work on tightening abs\core instead. Descent needs to slow down as well.

*Press* - Perhaps where the bigegst changes are to occur, which is good because it's my prioirty! First thing was pushing hips forward and up (again the Kelly Starett area) to stop posterior tilt\bending lower back. Second was holding the bar on my collarbone\shoulders. I always though it just wouldn't get there. I was pushing chest up and scapulas together (and therefore shoulders back). What I need to do is push chest up and shoulders forward. Kind of pushing shoulders forward and in. Gives the bar somewhere to rest but also (strangly) makes the bar path seem much more efficient and closer to face. Don't need to push elbows so far infornt of the bar in this position either. Down side is that the bar is back in my fingers but should get it back near the meat of my thumb with practice and stretching. Suggested sigle arm neutral grip dumbell press whilst holding a post to learn keeping core tight and highlight any imbalances.

*Powerclean* - Not the disaster I thought it was:thumb: Main issue is jumping backwards. I thought it would be bending arms. I do like them and wonder whether to add them in and take out bench pressing. Is benching adding much when I'm doing dips? Not sure given Perhaps make them an assiatance exercise? Got some homework to do.

Had quick look at programming and apparently 5,3,1 is a common rep programme for a cycle. Building up strength over the 5s and 3s for the max effort of singles. Suggestion of doing two weeks of 5s, two weeks of 3s, and then 1s. Could then work on form a bit and the last sets are still AMRAP.

I don't think my reply on my cooldown being 'Cake and a session on Xbox with my mates" was the right answer :doublesho

Deload week to think about it. Oh and do some rows :wave:


----------



## Guest

Buzz819 said:


> I've been working out on and off for years, I cycle on and off, I think it is because I go too hard, over train then stop for a little while and repeat.
> 
> Lately I have been doing things a bit different, I started off by doing some German Volume training to get back into the game, I found the workout on bodybuilding.com. I did that for 12 weeks and went to pyramid training, I completed an 6 week routine of that and am now onto the 5x5 training.
> 
> My max's -
> Bench - 150kg - 4 reps
> Deadlift - 200kg - 2 reps
> Squat - 180kg - 1 rep
> I've got say I'm feeling damn good at the moment.
> 
> I'll see how I go after 8 weeks of 5x5 training.
> 
> Happy training!
> 
> Buzz


If they are your current training maxes, I'd say you are well past linear progression. You might want to look at something like 5/3/1. Mind you everyone is different and it's all to do with recovery and not the weights lifted!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 6 - 5/3/1 (Tuesday)

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 114KGX5 - 131KGX5 - 149KGX5

SQUAT 100KGX10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGX10x10x10x10x10*

Happy with workout. Will be a dam sight happier when i get back to my normal weights :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

nice to see you back doug...:thumb: not bad weights either..!

yesterdays workout B dbbb
OHP 30kg 5x9
dead 45kg 5x11
barbell curl 20kg 5x8

all good, will be increasing dead for next time, ohp am working my way up slowly and thoroughly on this....:thumb:
my back is still playing up a bit (comes and goes) so gonna rest up til weekend, maybe next week as working out hasn't helped it i don't think, not sure whats caused it-working out or something else...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
8 Weeks to Monsterous Shoulders
Pendlay Rows: 60x5x9
Dumbell Rows: 22.5x3x15

Not a bad workout, think I missed a few things out of my shoulder routine but I was training the new guy again and taking him through workout B this time so spent most of my time teaching his he exercises.
Looking forward to getting back to Bench Press but still got a while yet.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> nice to see you back doug...:thumb: not bad weights either..!
> 
> yesterdays workout B dbbb
> OHP 30kg 5x9
> dead 45kg 5x11
> barbell curl 20kg 5x8
> 
> all good, will be increasing dead for next time, ohp am working my way up slowly and thoroughly on this....:thumb:
> my back is still playing up a bit (comes and goes) so gonna rest up til weekend, maybe next week as working out hasn't helped it i don't think, not sure whats caused it-working out or something else...
> rgds stu


Thanks mate, all going well I will be squatting 170 again within 3 months, then as long as the hamstring allows I will be using the 5/3/1 to squat 230x1 by the end of this year at the latest...I hope! :thumb::thumb:

If you have a back problem Stu, you must find out what it is - (muscle/bone/cartilage) This will aid you in using the most effective way to treat it :thumb: You need to find out what's causing it. I doubt its an exercise your doing that's caused it unless you have a medical condition or unwittingly used a bit of bad form while training (which is very common on higher rep routines at the last few reps).

You can use your exercises to help pinpoint the pain/effected area :thumb:

Hate the weights gentlemen!!!! 

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks mate, all going well I will be squatting 170 again within 3 months, then as long as the hamstring allows I will be using the 5/3/1 to squat 230x1 by the end of this year at the latest...I hope! :thumb::thumb:
> 
> If you have a back problem Stu, you must find out what it is - (muscle/bone/cartilage) This will aid you in using the most effective way to treat it :thumb: You need to find out what's causing it. I doubt its an exercise your doing that's caused it unless you have a medical condition or unwittingly used a bit of bad form while training (which is very common on higher rep routines at the last few reps).
> 
> You can use your exercises to help pinpoint the pain/effected area :thumb:
> 
> Hate the weights gentlemen!!!!
> 
> :thumb:


230kg...:doublesho read somewhere that arnie only squatted about 200kg back in the day...

not sure whats caused the back pain...? its around the area of my right shoulder blade though can't pinpoint exactly what/where, also not sure how it came about, could well be bad form on last couple of reps of something... its seemed to have come and gone a bit this last week which is why i'm not sure if workouts have helped or hindered...? as long as i hold myself tight during workouts its been ok even on dead and bbrows, tbh its been worse in the mornings when i get up making me wonder if the way i'm sleeping has aggravated it but good news is it seems to have eased/almost gone today so going to do workout shortly and be careful while doing it...!:thumb:
rgds stu

p.s. on the housemove front, its early days but we've found somewhere and agreed on a price, but best of all, its got a double garage... meaning i'll have more than 8in either side of barbell...:doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> 230kg...:doublesho read somewhere that arnie only squatted about 200kg back in the day...
> 
> not sure whats caused the back pain...? its around the area of my right shoulder blade though can't pinpoint exactly what/where, also not sure how it came about, could well be bad form on last couple of reps of something... its seemed to have come and gone a bit this last week which is why i'm not sure if workouts have helped or hindered...? as long as i hold myself tight during workouts its been ok even on dead and bbrows, tbh its been worse in the mornings when i get up making me wonder if the way i'm sleeping has aggravated it but good news is it seems to have eased/almost gone today so going to do workout shortly and be careful while doing it...!:thumb:
> rgds stu
> 
> p.s. on the housemove front, its early days but we've found somewhere and agreed on a price, but best of all, its got a double garage... meaning i'll have more than 8in either side of barbell...:doublesho


Don't be so easily impressed mate its only for the squat & deadlift & only for one rep :thumb: the biggest fuuuuu g!!! annoyance is its my hamstring I'm afraid of re injuring that's stopping me, remember I've already done deadlift 185kg for 5 touch n go reps before my injury & I think it was 177.7kg for 3 on the squat so 230x1 wasn't far off at all 

If I can progress with both lifts on the 5/3/1 without any discomfort/pain at my current rate, I estimate 230x1 in approx. 6 months on the deadlift, the squat I think may take 8-9 months for a 230x1, but it all can turn to shhit if the injury hinders me.

In regards to you're back.

The pain you are suffering from, if you sit in a seat slightly hunched forward (being on the laptop for instance, or did you say you drive lorries long distance?) do you feel a painful pulling/stretching sensation from the shoulder to the middle of your back & is it in a diagonal line from the shoulder down?

That's an extra 16 inches!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho:doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> 8 Weeks to Monsterous Shoulders
> Pendlay Rows: 60x5x9
> Dumbell Rows: 22.5x3x15
> 
> Not a bad workout, think I missed a few things out of my shoulder routine but I was training the new guy again and taking him through workout B this time so spent most of my time teaching his he exercises.
> Looking forward to getting back to Bench Press but still got a while yet.


James if that's an 8 week rehab routine, I would do the following before the workout -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiOKjDSvsa0

Shoulder dislocations x 20

Arm windmills x 20

Then your routine with the below rep ranges :thumb:

8 week rehab rep scheme :thumb:

1. 25
2. 25
3. 20
4. 20
5. 15
6. 15
7. 10
8. 10

Static stretches to be done after all workouts followed by two 20 minute ice sessions with 1 hour break between the sessions, then go to bed early young man!!!  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James if that's an 8 week rehab routine, I would do the following before the workout -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiOKjDSvsa0
> 
> Shoulder dislocations x 20
> 
> Arm windmills x 20
> 
> Then your routine with the below rep ranges :thumb:
> 
> 8 week rehab rep scheme :thumb:
> 
> 1. 25
> 2. 25
> 3. 20
> 4. 20
> 5. 15
> 6. 15
> 7. 10
> 8. 10
> 
> Static stretches to be done after all workouts followed by two 20 minute ice sessions with 1 hour break between the sessions, then go to bed early young man!!!  :thumb:


Its a rehab routine. Cant link on work computer but its Al Cosgrove's "8 Weeks to monster Shoulders" Program. Harry Selkow always suggests it to everyone before commencing a chin up program. I spoke to Harry about my dislocations and he suggested running through the program a couple of times. Once I have finished the 4 weeks I will keep some exercises and do them after every workout or at least every upper body workout.

Need to work on mobility and flexibility of the shoulder joint because not only is it effecting my weight lifting its effecting my golf swing :doublesho


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> p.s. on the housemove front, its early days but we've found somewhere and agreed on a price, but best of all, its got a double garage... meaning i'll have more than 8in either side of barbell...:doublesho


I hate you with a passion that you can only dream of


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I hate you with a passion that you can only dream of


colin, there's gonna be wall space enough for a veritable gallery of arnie posters...:lol:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Don't be so easily impressed mate its only for the squat & deadlift & only for one rep :thumb: the biggest fuuuuu g!!! annoyance is its my hamstring I'm afraid of re injuring that's stopping me, remember I've already done deadlift 185kg for 5 touch n go reps before my injury & I think it was 177.7kg for 3 on the squat so 230x1 wasn't far off at all
> 
> If I can progress with both lifts on the 5/3/1 without any discomfort/pain at my current rate, I estimate 230x1 in approx. 6 months on the deadlift, the squat I think may take 8-9 months for a 230x1, but it all can turn to shhit if the injury hinders me.
> 
> In regards to you're back.
> 
> The pain you are suffering from, if you sit in a seat slightly hunched forward (being on the laptop for instance, or did you say you drive lorries long distance?) do you feel a painful pulling/stretching sensation from the shoulder to the middle of your back & is it in a diagonal line from the shoulder down?
> 
> That's an extra 16 inches!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho:doublesho


i don't think your hamstring would _dare_ to let you down again doug...

re; shoulder/back pain...firstly, its pretty much gone now today...:thumb: it was kinda hard to pinpoint exactly where/what but it was in the area between my shoulder blade and spine on r/h/s and hurt at strange times, like turning head, coughing, hiccups :doublesho but not really during training as long as i held myself tight...? friend at work who's pretty into sport injury/therapy reckons i could've done something to rib where they connect together...?:doublesho i think maybe i just slept funny or possibly it came from overextending on bench press, when bar went a little too high...not sure, but as i said, it seems to have sorted itself out now...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS - (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 43KGX5 - 50KGX5 - 56.5KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 5KGx5x5x5x5x5. Might move up to 10kg plus body weight to hit the triceps a bit harder for the bench :thumb:

OVERHEAD PRESS 42.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, left out barbell curls tonight.

Playing with Macros now, ensuring my diet is protein dominant, will monitor progress & possibly increase daily protein intake in a few weeks, I am currently reducing starchy carbs & replacing with green veg :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS - (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 43KGX5 - 50KGX5 - 56.5KGX5
> 
> DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 5KGx5x5x5x5x5. Might move up to 10kg plus body weight to hit the triceps a bit harder for the bench :thumb:
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS 42.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Good workout, let barbell curls tonight.
> 
> Playing with Macros now, ensuring my diet is protein dominant, will monitor progress & possibly increase daily protein intake in a few weeks, I am currently reducing starchy carbs & replacing with green veg :thumb:


doug, have you loooked at myfitnesspal...? very good for keeping check on macros...

forgot to post yesterdays workout...
workout A dbbb
squat 45kg 5x8
bench 45kg 5x8
BBRows-----
just increased weights on squat and bench so stuck to 5x8 rather than rushing ahead to increase weights too quickly...both went well...:thumb:
skipped bbrow  partly due to fear of agravating my back and partly due to having to go pick up my kids from school....tbh, i very seldom skip an exercise but i didn't like doing it yesterday...!
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> colin, there's gonna be wall space enough for a veritable gallery of arnie posters...:lol:


WHAT?!! You're killing me here in my 9x18 -2degree cave :wave:

I can picture the conversation:
"Stu, what's that?"
"Oh it's my bench, you didn't notice it in the last house with all the boxes". :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> doug, have you loooked at myfitnesspal...? very good for keeping check on macros...


Only going for high protein content at the moment, I eat very much the same food week in week out so its not that difficult to work out. I don't think I would bother with varied macros on different days until I get to 15% body fat, then re evaluate. I'm not planning to go lower on body fat as its for health rather than look :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


>


:argie::argie::argie::argie::argie::argie::argie: :argie:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 6 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 114KGX5 - 131KGX5 - 149KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout & hamstring behaved :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Jumps: 6x3
Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 110x3, 125x3, 142.5x3 PM 156.5kg
Deadlifts: 97.5x5x10
Abs: Med Ball Throws, Leg Raises
Band Pull Apart Series 

Im disappointed with 3 reps on squats but I added in jumps betweeb each set of squats to add abit of athletics to my workout. Need to be powerful as well as strong but I think this effected my performance. 

Hell ya, pleased to get this week as last week was a struggle and this sets me up to hit 100kg for 5 sets of 10 with 2 mins rest which has been my goal for a little while now. 2mins rest seriously gets your heart rate up and makes you sweat like crazy. 

Im moving away from BBB at the end of this run through and I will be using the simple strength template just to shake things up as I been on BBB for 4 months.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Friday Workout:
> Jumps: 6x3
> Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 110x3, 125x3, 142.5x3 PM 156.5kg
> Deadlifts: 97.5x5x10
> Abs: Med Ball Throws, Leg Raises
> Band Pull Apart Series
> 
> Im disappointed with 3 reps on squats but I added in jumps betweeb each set of squats to add abit of athletics to my workout. Need to be powerful as well as strong but I think this effected my performance.


Seems more logical to do the jumps after completing the squat & deadlift sets (Something I'm considering myself very soon) :thumb:

Squats
Deadlifts
Jumps


----------



## sfstu

sunday workout B of dbbb

OHP 30kg 5x10
dead 47.5kg 5x10
close grip bench 30kg 5x8

all good...bit frustrated with slowness of progress of ohp but getting there slowly...
dead was fine...:thumb:
2nd time of close grip bench...used ezcurl bar with false grip and went ok but unsure what weight i should be aiming for...? tried it last time at 20kg (which is what i'd have done for lying tri ext) but that was too light so went for 30kg this time and it was pretty doable...should i be aiming for a similar weight to what i use on normal bench press...? say 40kg for starting..?

good cardio afterwards...sledge pulling in the snow, 2 sledges (one behind the other) with my 3 kids up to the local park and back...:thumb: what with trying to keep my grip in the snow/ice and the weight pulled, really felt it in thighs...
shame i couldn't do this all the time...:lol:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Seems more logical to do the jumps after completing the squat & deadlift sets (Something I'm considering myself very soon) :thumb:
> 
> Squats
> Deadlifts
> Jumps


Wendler suggests doing them before and Defranco suggests doing them straight after heavy lifting and what he calls contrast training.

In my head, Im the same as you Doug, where I think it makes more sense afterwards but Im not going to argue with Defranco :lol: It was just a trial anyway.



sfstu said:


> sunday workout B of dbbb
> 
> OHP 30kg 5x10
> dead 47.5kg 5x10
> close grip bench 30kg 5x8
> 
> all good...bit frustrated with slowness of progress of ohp but getting there slowly...
> dead was fine...:thumb:
> 2nd time of close grip bench...used ezcurl bar with false grip and went ok but unsure what weight i should be aiming for...? tried it last time at 20kg (which is what i'd have done for lying tri ext) but that was too light so went for 30kg this time and it was pretty doable...should i be aiming for a similar weight to what i use on normal bench press...? say 40kg for starting..?
> 
> good cardio afterwards...sledge pulling in the snow, 2 sledges (one behind the other) with my 3 kids up to the local park and back...:thumb: what with trying to keep my grip in the snow/ice and the weight pulled, really felt it in thighs...
> shame i couldn't do this all the time...:lol:


Stu dont be too hard on yourself with OHP, I am now adding 1kg a month to my training max. I would be over the moon if I could add 12kg per year to my OHP.

You can do that all year round mate. I got one of these and they make quite abit of difference to sprints.


















Or you can make your own.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Im disappointed with 3 reps on squats but I added in jumps betweeb each set of squats to add abit of athletics to my workout. Need to be powerful as well as strong but I think this effected my performance.


Reminds me of winter Olympics and the commentator was saying the big ski jumpers do huge jump squats with 100kg on them and they're rake thin. Makes sense when you see them go off the end of the ramp. BOOM!

I think it's also how I feel about things; like I've lost my 'bounce'! Could be age but, after years for playing racquet sports that require multi direction explosive movement, doing the big compounds does seem very slow and one directional. I can see why Crossift seems to have box jumps in it. Also makes sense why Rip (praise be upon him) is so insistent on powercleans being in the routine rather than rows. When I eventually get on to Olympic lifting I think it'll be equally satisfying as it will be technically frustrating.


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> sunday workout B of dbbb
> 
> OHP 30kg 5x10
> dead 47.5kg 5x10
> close grip bench 30kg 5x8
> 
> all good...bit frustrated with slowness of progress of ohp but getting there slowly...
> dead was fine...:thumb:
> 2nd time of close grip bench...used ezcurl bar with false grip and went ok but unsure what weight i should be aiming for...? tried it last time at 20kg (which is what i'd have done for lying tri ext) but that was too light so went for 30kg this time and it was pretty doable...should i be aiming for a similar weight to what i use on normal bench press...? say 40kg for starting..?
> 
> good cardio afterwards...sledge pulling in the snow, 2 sledges (one behind the other) with my 3 kids up to the local park and back...:thumb: what with trying to keep my grip in the snow/ice and the weight pulled, really felt it in thighs...
> shame i couldn't do this all the time...:lol:


Keep at it mate, these things take time, what you are lifting is not as important as full range of movement, slower reps & good form. :thumb:

10 rep routines will always be slow in regards to weight increases, the higher the rep range the slower the progress in the weight you are lifting :thumb:

load the EZ bar with anything you feel comfortable with then work your way up, treat the lift as a separate lift from the bench press :thumb:

Be patient!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wendler suggests doing them before and Defranco suggests doing them straight after heavy lifting and what he calls contrast training.
> 
> In my head, Im the same as you Doug, where I think it makes more sense afterwards but Im not going to argue with Defranco :lol:


I with you James, it seems very contradictory to do a light set of exercises in between your heavy work as it might pre exhaust the muscles trained, how 
can you gauge your progress? You would never know if its your strength that's faltering or the fact you used up a bit of strength on the light work in between 

Week 2 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 92.5KGX3 - 105.5KGX3 - 119KGX3

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 72.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Last set on the Bench is starting to feel heavier now :thumb:

Not sure how I should progress on the assistance work.

1. Add 2.5kg every time I reach 5x10.

2. Add 2.5kg every time I reach 5x10 for weeks 1,2 & 3.

3. Vary the weights according to the work set weight used for the week trained. Giving varied assistance weight & progress for weeks 1,2 & 3.

Hmmmm time to play!  I'm thinking option 3 will be more logical & give a much more accurate representation of progress etc... :thumb: decisions, decisions!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 122.5KGX3 - 140KGX3 - 157.5KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Pleased with this workout no presence of the old injury in my left hamstring, if week 3 feels as good ill move up the weight, if not ill stay on the same weights for another month.

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

tues workout A dbbb
squat 45kg 5x9
bench 45kg 5x9
BBRow 45kg 5x9

all good, though felt really tired for some reason today...don't like working out after a 10-7 shift.. had to concentrate on keeping back tight on bench and form on bbrow...squat went ok tho...:thumb:

was bloody cold too...! the bar felt like a bar of ice, had to resort to my old york gloves to fend off the cold....felt like stallone in rocky IV training in russia...:devil::lol:
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 45x3, 51x3, 57x5 PM 66.5kg
Inverted Rows: BWx 10, 4, 8
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: BW 7x3, 3x2
Elitefts Band Pull Apart routine: Red Band

So pleased with this workout. I felt completely shattered even doing the warm up but the further I got into the workout the better I felt and Im pleased to get 5reps with 57kg when last week I only got 5 reps wit 54kg. Im not setting any records and I never expect to with my shoulder but this is still progress no matter how small.

Loving Inverted Rows. Changed these slightly on set to and put my feel on a bench so my body is horizontal at the top. These seem to be so good for shoulder health as instead of pulling the bar to your chest and rounding the back, you push your chest out as much as possible to try and touch the bar, this in turn pulls your shoulders back and hits them really well.

Pleased to make progress on Chins and I do these between every set of shoulder press which makes it very easy to fit in the 10 sets. They were quite easy until the last 2 sets as I did these after Inverted Rows which exhausted my back.

And a massive thank you goes out to Doug for allowing me to progress my shoulder press at 1kg per month :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Im not doing Jack S**T Workout
Sprints: Skipped
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 112.5x3, 127.5x3, 145x3 PM 159.5kg
Squats: Skipped
Abs: Skipped

Ok so my landlord txt me saying that he is coming round on friday and I have rugby thurs so that left wednesday to tidy the house and mow the lawns. This meant I did all this before hitting the gym. I was like a man possessed with that flymo. Anyway this is why I did the Im not doing jack s**t workout and the fact that the Mrs came home with a gorgeous smelling curry before I even started the gym so I had to be quick.

Deadlift form is feeling great and this just doing the minimum reps is kind of a trial to see how much I gain while being miles below wha I can actually lift. So its really seeing if this stop 1-2 reps before failure really works.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> And a massive thank you goes out to Doug for allowing me to progress my shoulder press at 1kg per month :thumb:


Anytime mate, glad they are helping you mate :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

As we aren't able to rugby train, it's bleep test tonight...gulp!!


----------



## Bod42

jonnyMercUK said:


> As we aren't able to rugby train, it's bleep test tonight...gulp!!


Hate the bleep test and its not really applicable to rugby fitness but let us know how you go.


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Only going for high protein content at the moment, I eat very much the same food week in week out so its not that difficult to work out. I don't think I would bother with varied macros on different days until I get to 15% body fat, then re evaluate. I'm not planning to go lower on body fat as its for health rather than look :thumb:


Based on my own experience, I'd agree with this. Just go on a deficit but with plenty of protein. 
I don't even think it matters what you eat either, as long as you maintain the deficit. I really think there is sense in the IIFYM (If It Fits Your Macros) attitude.
I think it is only as you start to reach single digit BF that you need to be more particular about what and how you eat.

I finally dropped below 13 stone and reached 82.5kg (from 99kg) a couple of days ago, after a half stone hiccup at Christmas :lol:. 
According to my calipers I'm around 16% BF (down from an estimate of nigh on 30%). It's slow going but I feel much happier for losing the excess.

I've started lifting properly again too, so I should really start logging here again . After playing around with higher rep stuff I decided I'd return to a strength biased approach. I began Starting Strength last week.
I attempted to translate my higher 12RMs into 5RMs and carry on straight from there. BIG mistake. I'd not lifted weights that heavy in something like 5 months and my body was not ready for it. Lesson learnt! Deload and carry on.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Bod42

Nice work Phil.

You could treat it like some workouts and stay on the same weights and reps but just keep adding 2.5kg for Upper and 5kg for Lower Body per workout but just decrease the reps when you need to until you get down to 5 reps. This should allow you to keep adding weight for a long time and get you accustomed to heavier weights.

Does that makes sense?


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> Nice work Phil.
> 
> You could treat it like some workouts and stay on the same weights and reps but just keep adding 2.5kg for Upper and 5kg for Lower Body per workout but just decrease the reps when you need to until you get down to 5 reps. This should allow you to keep adding weight for a long time and get you accustomed to heavier weights.
> 
> Does that makes sense?


Thanks James.

Yes, that makes perfect sense. Though I've started doing something slightly different . 
I deloaded back to my 12RMs, then did 5 reps sets. However, Starting Strength actually suggests increasing weights on a set by set basis if you can manage that with good form. I also do an AMRAP set as my last set - which kinda helps indicate how much room I have left.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Bod42 said:


> Hate the bleep test and its not really applicable to rugby fitness but let us know how you go.


Due to technological issues bleep test got cancelled and we ended up doing pyramids, probably even worse!!


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> Based on my own experience, I'd agree with this. Just go on a deficit but with plenty of protein.
> I don't even think it matters what you eat either, as long as you maintain the deficit. I really think there is sense in the IIFYM (If It Fits Your Macros) attitude.
> I think it is only as you start to reach single digit BF that you need to be more particular about what and how you eat.
> 
> I finally dropped below 13 stone and reached 82.5kg (from 99kg) a couple of days ago, after a half stone hiccup at Christmas :lol:.
> According to my calipers I'm around 16% BF (down from an estimate of nigh on 30%). It's slow going but I feel much happier for losing the excess.
> 
> I've started lifting properly again too, so I should really start logging here again . After playing around with higher rep stuff I decided I'd return to a strength biased approach. I began Starting Strength last week.
> I attempted to translate my higher 12RMs into 5RMs and carry on straight from there. BIG mistake. I'd not lifted weights that heavy in something like 5 months and my body was not ready for it. Lesson learnt! Deload and carry on.
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil


Phil, for the weightloss, did you aim for a certain amount of calories per day or did you just literally eat "right" and keep protein high?


----------



## Guest

sfstu said:


> Phil, for the weightloss, did you aim for a certain amount of calories per day or did you just literally eat "right" and keep protein high?


The short answer is pretty much a target amount of calories and kept the protein intake high. I've probably been on around 1200-1500 calories a day. I don't actually measure the calories but I try to keep things simple and measure my weight each morning to track progress over time.

I didn't set out to do it that way. I had planned on following Leangains to the letter. I've ended up keeping to the intermittent fasting but being on a deficit every day. 
I eventually went low carb all the time, but with some experimentation, I don't think it makes any difference. As long as there is a deficit, you'l lose weight at the same rate - or at least, I seem to.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 46.5KGX3 - 53KGX3 - 60KGX3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+5KGx6x6x6x6x6

OVERHEAD PRESS 42.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 42.5KGx8x8x8x8x8*

Happy with workout


----------



## sfstu

BareFacedGeek said:


> The short answer is pretty much a target amount of calories and kept the protein intake high. I've probably been on around 1200-1500 calories a day. I don't actually measure the calories but I try to keep things simple and measure my weight each morning to track progress over time.
> 
> I didn't set out to do it that way. I had planned on following Leangains to the letter. I've ended up keeping to the intermittent fasting but being on a deficit every day.
> I eventually went low carb all the time, but with some experimentation, I don't think it makes any difference. As long as there is a deficit, you'l lose weight at the same rate - or at least, I seem to.


cheers for that phil...i've been aiming at 1800 cals a day (was on between 2500 and 3000 before i reckon) with emphasis on protein but last couple of weeks i haven't lost anything at all weightwise...think i've also being try to pay too much attention to % of pro vs carb vs fat...as i'm doing high reps/low weight i think i can afford to eat less but still make sure to base most of what i eat towards protein...:thumb:
never paid attention before to nutrition at all so its interesting seeing what all you other guys are doing/eating....
rgds stu


----------



## sfstu

Bod42 said:


> Nice work Phil.
> 
> You could treat it like some workouts and stay on the same weights and reps but just keep adding 2.5kg for Upper and 5kg for Lower Body per workout but just decrease the reps when you need to until you get down to 5 reps. This should allow you to keep adding weight for a long time and get you accustomed to heavier weights.
> 
> Does that makes sense?


cool plan james....something i'll bear in mind for the future maybe...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 122.5KGX3 - 140KGX3 - 157.5KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

JUMPS 3x3x3x3x3*

Added jumps for a little finisher, rested around a mx of 5 seconds between sets 

Another good workout, hamstring felt good, I'm hoping the last week of this cycle will be free of any sensation of the old injury so that I can add more weight.


----------



## sfstu

mondays workout B dbbb

OHP 32.5kg 5x8
deadlift 47.5kg 5x11
bicep curl 20kg 5x10

all good...:thumb: increased the ohp by 2.5kg and went ok, apart from cracking myself on the chin...:lol:
dead also good and will be increasing this for next workout...
curls felt gooood...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

Abit behind but friday nights workout.
Med Ball Throws: 3x5
8 weeks to monsterous shoulders workout.
Pendlay Rows: 60x5x10
Dumbell Rows: 25x3x15

Not a bad workout, my shoulder definitely seems to be getting stronger as Im slowly increasing the weights and reps on the exercises and it actually feels good. Will definitely be dividing the exercises up from the workout and adding them to the end of my workouts from now on. And I have been doing the band pull apart routine after my lower body workouts which seems to work well.

Glad to get 5 sets of 10 reps on Pendlay Rows. Will carry these over to my next program and keep them progressing as think their brilliant to have in your program as they are the exact opposite of Bench Press.

Can go higher on these but using them to hit the correct muscles and add some volume.

I was suppose to workout Monday but it was a bank holiday weekend here and I was far to hung over to train.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 99KGX5 - 112KGX3 - 125.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 72.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good, bench is starting to feel "heavy" now :thumb:

Will be adding another 2.5kg to the assistance lifts Bench press & Barbell row for the next cycle :thumb::thumb:

Time for something to eat - one whole chicken all to myself! :doublesho


----------



## sfstu

ITHAQVA said:


> Time for something to eat - one whole chicken all to myself! :doublesho


can see you now doug, out in the yard, chasing some poor chicken round like rocky I...

nice weights mate...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Mondays Workout Completed Tuesday
Free Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 117.5x5, 135x3, 150x0 
Deadlifts: 100x5x10

So I completly bombed my Squats, couldnt even get one rep of 150kg. Starting to really **** me off. To put in perspective how crap this is. On 02/03/12 I did 142.5x3, on 02/04/12 I did 142.5x5. So in 10 months I have lost strength. All those hours, all the hard work for 10 months and it has got me exactly no where.

On a positive note I hit my goal of 100kg for 5 sets of 10 reps with 2 mins rest. These really work your heart, lungs and make you sweat like crazy. Abit confused how you can add 30kg to your BBB sets in 4.5 months but add zero to your heavy sets. I must be missing something here.


----------



## sfstu

nice lifts regardless james...? :thumb:

fraid i got no knowledge to advise you on squats mate but do you think it could be a mental block..?
only ask cos when i found i had a problem with depth a few months back it really knocked me back and literally had to halve mine to be able to squat to depth...at the time i'm sure i was strong enough to rescue the depth thing without dropping too much weight but mentally it just fcuked me...:doublesho

maybe try again next time but get yer missus to load the plates while you look away and she can load 150kg but tell you its 145kg...
rgds stu


----------



## Bod42

sfstu said:


> nice lifts regardless james...? :thumb:
> 
> fraid i got no knowledge to advise you on squats mate but do you think it could be a mental block..?
> only ask cos when i found i had a problem with depth a few months back it really knocked me back and literally had to halve mine to be able to squat to depth...at the time i'm sure i was strong enough to rescue the depth thing without dropping too much weight but mentally it just fcuked me...:doublesho
> 
> maybe try again next time but get yer missus to load the plates while you look away and she can load 150kg but tell you its 145kg...
> rgds stu


I am having abit of trouble with depth. Not in the sense of not going low enough but not sure if I'm going to low. I dont want to go to low and make the lift harder but then I dont want to squat high which makes the lift a lot easier. This is why I have used Box Squats most of the time. When you complete a rep there is no doubt in your mind that it was the right height and you have gotten stronger. In 2 minds weather to change back to box squats of progress with free squats for a while longer.

I could blame it on the large amount of booze at the weekend :tumbleweed: Or due to me dieting but if I wasnt taking in enough calories then I wouldnt be progressing on my other lifts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I am having abit of trouble with depth. Not in the sense of not going low enough but not sure if I'm going to low. I dont want to go to low and make the lift harder but then I dont want to squat high which makes the lift a lot easier. This is why I have used Box Squats most of the time. When you complete a rep there is no doubt in your mind that it was the right height and you have gotten stronger. In 2 minds weather to change back to box squats of progress with free squats for a while longer.
> 
> I could blame it on the large amount of booze at the weekend :tumbleweed: Or due to me dieting but if I wasnt taking in enough calories then I wouldnt be progressing on my other lifts.


I would do some heavier squats with 170-180 just above parallel to get used to the weight for a few weeks and then go back to your normal weight for parallel squats :thumb:

As for progressing so well on your assistance weight, it's actually quite normal due to the weight being so light. I used to get this all the time with weights that were 10-20 kg lighter than my heaviest training weight years ago, always stumped me too mate :wall: 

I would also be more inclined to think your heavy set progress is being hindered by psychological limitations rather than physical limitations :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

weds workout dbbb

squat 45kg 5x10
bench 45kg 5x10
BBR 45kg 5x10 (ish)

all good tho bbrows were a little ropey towards the end...feel tired on all exercises today, probably to do with the fact i had to get at 3am for work today and ended up with 5 hours sleep...:doublesho
early night tonight, 9 hrs sleep to recharge...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## Oats

Couple of interesting replies from coaches on Rips Q&A about 5\3\1 versus Texas Method and LP for novices.

*Older novice Starting Strength* - linear progress but lift every third day. Good feedback from someone who did that and I can see how it would help with recovery whilst still providing enough stimulus and helping adherence to the programme.

*Intermediate 5\3\1* - Miss out the 3s and deload: 
Week 1 - 5s, 
Week 2 - 1s
Week 3 - 5s
Week 4 - 1s 
etc

Not necessarily relevant now but something for the toolbag :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 131KGX5 - 149KGX3 - 166KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE  100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Very pleased with this workout as there was no feeling of the old injury, which means I can increase by another 5kg on the next cycle :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Oats said:


> Couple of interesting replies from coaches on Rips Q&A about 531 versus Texas Method and LP for novices.
> 
> *Older novice Starting Strength* - linear progress but lift every third day. Good feedback from someone who did that and I can see how it would help with recovery whilst still providing enough stimulus and helping adherence to the programme.
> 
> *Intermediate 531* - Miss out the 3s and deload:
> Week 1 - 5s,
> Week 2 - 1s
> Week 3 - 5s
> Week 4 - 1s
> etc
> 
> Not necessarily relevant now but something for the toolbag :thumb:


Another variant that looks good, although I think I do some 5x10 in the 50%-75% range:

"I recently switched from SS to 5/3/1 and thought I could benefit from more volume ... doing the Boring But Big template with 5x5 @ 70% instead of 5x10 @ 50%. It is a good way of adding volume without feeling like a body building routine. I do the following with power cleans replacing the extra deadlifts:

Day 1: Press 5/3/1, Bench 5x5 @ 70%, Assistance (I do chins and DB rows)
Day 2: DL 5/3/1, Squat 5x5 @ 70%, Assistance (I do abs)
Day 3: Bench 5/3/1, Press 5x5 @ 70%, Assistance (I do chins and DB rows)
Day 4: Squat 5/3/1, Power Cleans, Assistance (I do RDLs)

I think it is good for intermediates like me because of the extra volume; an advanced lifter would probably have a hard time with the extra volume at 70%. Somedays the 5x5 squats @ 70% feel really hard after DLs so adjust the weight accordingly keeping in mind the squats are for extra volume, so don't kill yourself!"


----------



## sfstu

our thread was half way down the page...:doublesho

fridays workout B dbbb

OHP 32.5kg 5x10 
dead 50kg 5x9
close grip bench/tri 30kg 5x10

well pleased with todays workout...after struggling at 30kg for last few weeks and grinding out 5x8 last time on ohp, did today 5x10 at 32.5kg..:thumb: felt strong and maybe could've done 5x11 but didn't wanna burn out on 1st couple of sets and fizzle out on last couple...

dead felt light too although i'd increased to 50kg today but took it easy and slow and concentrated on form as didn't want to aggravate my back which was playing up last week, though all good this week...

close grip bench went good too though not too sure on form for this...?
using the ezbar with hands on start of knurling (bout 9-10in apart) but where should my elbows end up at bottom of lift..? at the moment they're pointing outwards almost hitting the bottom of the plates at either side..? should elbows be closer into body..? have tried it with my knuckles almost touching on bar but could feel my shoulders clicking...

felt strong today and slight changes in diet this week seem to be bearing fruit though early days i know, but also body feels like its getting a definate redistribution of muscle vs fat and have had a few slight doms this week so all good...:thumb:

was overdue a good workout...
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> close grip bench went good too though not too sure on form for this...?
> using the ezbar with hands on start of knurling (bout 9-10in apart) but where should my elbows end up at bottom of lift..? at the moment they're pointing outwards almost hitting the bottom of the plates at either side..? should elbows be closer into body..? have tried it with my knuckles almost touching on bar but could feel my shoulders clicking...
> 
> rgds stu


Elbows should be as close to your sides as possible at the lowest part of the exercise so that you involve the Triceps as much as possible Stu :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

cool, cheers for that doug...:thumb: 
was thinking about it after and makes sense as pressups with elbows done tight to body hit tris...
tried the grip with different widths but start of knurling, bout 10 in feels right...?
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

sfstu said:


> cool, cheers for that doug...:thumb:
> was thinking about it after and makes sense as pressups with elbows done tight to body hit tris...
> tried the grip with different widths but start of knurling, bout 10 in feels right...?
> rgds stu


The closer the grip the more force goes direct to the Triceps, go as close as is comfortable for you :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 56.5KGX3 - 63KGX1

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+5KGx9x9x9x9x9

OVERHEAD PRESS 42.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 42.5KGx9x9x9x9x9*

Will add 2.5kg to the assistance overhead press weight & move up to 10Kg plus bodyweight on my dips for the next cycle. Barbell curls will remain the same as I want to keep them light so that my form is strict enough to ensure my stabiliser muscles are hit properly.

Not sure, but is it possible for the consistent daily intake of at least 200gms protein & reduced starchy carbs per day causing my strength to increase as I'm feeling much stronger in all of my lifts


----------



## Bod42

Doug your body could have converted to using protein as a source of energy and some people feel a lot better and stronger once thier body does this. Some people thrive on high protein other people on high carbs. I feel slugish on high carbs.

I have close grip bench press in my next routine but not sure to swap it for dips as I already Bench Press quite close any way. And I do like dips.


----------



## sfstu

Will def be switching to dips myself asap...when enough weight lost and strength increases that is...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug your body could have converted to using protein as a source of energy and some people feel a lot better and stronger once thier body does this. Some people thrive on high protein other people on high carbs. I feel slugish on high carbs.
> 
> I have close grip bench press in my next routine but not sure to swap it for dips as I already Bench Press quite close any way. And I do like dips.


I am most certainly doing better on more protein & less carbs James, I to feel sluggish when eating carbs.

If you are training Triceps I would definitely use:

Dips 
Close grip bench press

You can do them in any order but I would always do the lift than allows for the most weight first :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 131KGX5 - 149KGX3 - 166KGX1*

No assistance work for todays workout


----------



## Bod42

Fridays Workout:
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 120x5, 135x3, 152.5x2 PM 162.5
Squats: 82.5x3x10

Yep i pussied out and only did 3 sets of squats. I had trained another person before myself so it was starting to get late. I know crap excuse.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 6 5/3/1 - LIGHT/DELOAD WEEK!!!! 

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 60KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 60KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## sfstu

this mornings workout A dbbb

bench 45kg5x11
squat 45kg 5x11
BBRows 45kg 5x11

all good and all increasing by 2.5kg for next time...:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1 Deload week 

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 100KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug Im on a deload week too. I feel weird not lifting heavy though but I always come off my supplements for the week. Its a good mental break as well and couldnt have come at a better time as I have two big golf comps this weekend.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug Im on a deload week too. I feel weird not lifting heavy though but I always come off my supplements for the week. Its a good mental break as well and couldnt have come at a better time as I have two big golf comps this weekend.


It does feel weird at first James, doesnt take long to getting used to a light week being a part of your routine. I find it sets me up for the next 3 weeks 

I only take Whey protein so keep taking it to ensure my daily protein intake is high enough :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1 Deload Week

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 28KGX5 - 33KGX5 - 40KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 20KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All done in 34 minutes, loads of winter sports on Eurosport to watch!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

5/3/1 Simple Strength Template
Monday Workout 1st Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) WO 65x5, 75x5, 85x10 PM 113.5kg
Incline Press: 42.5x10, 50x10, 60x10
Underhand Thumbless Chin Ups: BW 5x4, 5x3 Completed between all pressing sets.
Kroc Rows: 22.5 x 20, 20, 20
Skull Crushers: 25x 6, 6, 6

This is one of the best workouts I have done in a long time. Heavy chest work followed by high rep back work and then some cheeky arm work makes you feel massive.

Bench Press went well, zero pain in my shoulder which is good but it still clicked on every rep which is very offputting. It never used to do that and then suddenly started. Need to mess around with different positions on the bench and see if I can stop it as it cant be good. Overall pleased with a very easy 10 reps.

This is the first time I have done anything Incline since I started working out again and I was looking at my workout thinking 60kg will be to light but it was actually quite hard. Incline is such a different feeling but I feel it more in my triceps than my chest.

Chins between each set is a great way to keep you moving during rest periods and add in some extra back work.

Kroc rows were hard but a good feeling. I bang through the first 10 and then mentally start my set from there. nice back pump from these.

I love skull crushers always have, they seem to pack muscle on to my arms so quickly and the feeling is awesome. 25kg is a stupidly easy weight as I worked up to 60kg before but no rush.

All in all very pleased with Simple Strength Template, so far anyway.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 87.5KGX5 - 101KGX5 - 114KGX5*

I'm going to be only doing the heavy sets this week & no assistance work to give myself a little rest (I'm doing jack S**T!) 

Surprised how well the 5x114 went up, very pleased :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 117KGX5 - 135KGX5 - 153KGX5*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Squats: (WU 60x5, 72.5x5, 85x3) 92.5x5, 107.5x5, 120x6 PM 144kg
Stiff Leg Deadlifts: 60x10, 67.5x10, 80x10
Glute Ham Raises: 3x6
Bar Rollouts: 10 x 3,,3,2
Band Pull Apart series.

So did crap on squats as usual but I know that I just gave up. I dont think my brain suits 5/3/1 as the reps are just to open ended. I may just do 5/3/1 for my sets so then I have a concrete goal. I feel this is ok on the BBB routine as you hit squats again either in the same workout or after Deadlifts but Im not sure if 3 sets of squats every 8 days is enough. I did have a small break through though, I have been training a friend and kept telling him to get his chest up and out so checked out my form and looks like I lose the arch in my upper back when I take the bar out so I got on Youtube and Chad Wesley Smith is doing a fix your squat series and he said about pushing the chest up and out. I tried this and must say my upper back feels tighter than it ever has. Im hoping this is why I'm good with lower weights but as soon as I put on a weight I should be able to do it kills me. We shall see in the near furture.

Thought SLDLs would be easy but they were actually pretty hard even at 80kg. Hams and glutes were fried afterwards.

And then I did GHR which really hit my posterior chain, I think I should have added these to my program a long time ago.

Im normally pretty good at bar rollouts but my back was arc hing hard out after all the Hamstring, glute and lower back work


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 45KGX5 - 52KGX5 - 58.5KGX5 *

 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1/

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 117KGX5 - 135KGX5 - 153KGX5*

Next week I will be back to the BBB assistance work :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 42.5x5, 48x5, 54.5x5
Dips: BW x 10,10,10
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 9x3, 1x4 Done between every pressing set
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x 8, 8,8
EZ Bar Curls: 20x 6, 6,6

Strange workout as with the chin ups between every set you never really get a rest more than 1 min. Great way of getting extra back volume in but its hard work.

Dips went well, I should do less than BW on the 2 first sets but cant really take weight off so just did 3 sets of BW.

Pendlay Rows felt good, every time I add 2.5 I drop the reps from 10 to 8 and work back up, should help with progress.

Ya I know doing biceps but their really light and quick to add in. Later that night I did 55kg for 6 reps at a party as their was abit of a comp going.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 7

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 94KGX3 - 107.5KGX3 - 121KGX3

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Bench starting to feel heavy now :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 107.5x5, 125x5, 140x5 PM 163.5kg
Front Squat: 60 x 6, 6, 6
Good Mornings: 20 x 10, 10, 10
Reverse Crunches

Deadlifts felt good, something has changed as I used to have a problem locking deadlifts out but now the top part is really fast, pretty much it seems if I get a good break off the floor then I will get the rep.

My abs are really sore at the moment, every since Bar roll outs and playing golf they dont seem to have healed. And front squats require good ab strength. I pussied out and lowered te weight and reps.

I have never put Good Mornings in a program before but I can see the benifit after just one workout. It uses every muscle on the back of your body but Im not looking at max weight Im just looking at doing these right.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 126KGX3 - 144KGX3 - 162KGX3

SQUAT 102.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 102.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Well pleased with tonight's workout, absolutely no feeling of the old Hamstring injury. Hopefully this will allow me to progress with the weight without discomfort, but only time will tell :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) WO 70x3, 80x3, 90x8 PM 114kg
Incline Bench Press: 50x8, 60x8, 67.5x6
Chin Ups: 5x3
Kroc Rows: 25x3x20
Skull Crushers: 22.5x6

Bench is feeling good, this has got to be my favorite workout at the moment. Weight still feels really easy but being away for a month is more about getting my position sorted on the bench. Shoulder still clicked slightly but no where near as bad as last week which is great news. Shoulder has zero pain which is a strange feeling.

I feel like a body builders doing 2 chest exercises. I find Incline Bench Press is just a tricep exercise for me, I fire out of the bottom, stall and half way and then just lock out with all triceps. Chest still feels it but triceps are really burning at the end.

Chin Ups: Was supposed to do these between every set but forgot and tried to throw them in at the end but by the time I had done Kroc Rows I couldnt barely do 1 rep.

Kroc Rows are awesome, I just bang through the reps not worrying about the contraction at the top or anything. The ultimate goal is heavy weight high reps.

Its only week two and broke my plan of adding 1kg and added 2,5kg as the weight was so light. Still felt stupidly light.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 48KGX3 - 55KGX3 - 62KGX3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+5KGx8x8x8x8x8

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, overhead press progress will start to get difficult from now on in :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 126KGX3 - 144KGX3 - 162KGX3

DEADLIFT 102.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

JUMPS - BODY WEIGHTx3x3x3x3x3*

A major milestone for me, so pleased this workout went so well, absolutely no feeling of pulling or discomfort in my left hamstring as I lifted the 162x3, I'm hoping this will continue.

I've been doing deep muscle massage on my left hamstring for the last 3/4 weeks to break up any scar tissue & I must admit I have noticed a big difference in how it feels since doing it. I'm still not 100% confident but I will take small steps forward over no progress at all :thumb:


----------



## Alex L

When you guys hit a peak on your weights what are you doing? My bench was great on cycle 1 @ 100kg, but for cycle 2 i just couldn't do the final one for the 5/3/1 week?

Should I go back to cycle 1 and build from there again?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Alex L said:


> When you guys hit a peak on your weights what are you doing? My bench was great on cycle 1 @ 100kg, but for cycle 2 i just couldn't do the final one for the 5/3/1 week?
> 
> Should I go back to cycle 1 and build from there again?


I would try doing the same cycle for another month before following the 5/3/1 books advice of de loading, especially at the lighter weights :thumb:


----------



## sfstu

hi guys, its been a couple of weeks so thought i'd better say hello...:thumb:
didn't get round to posting last few workouts and tbh, they've become a little sporadic the last couple of weeks, due in part to being ill for a few days and part to being busy packing/sorting in preperation for upcoming house move...

although i'm still doing the workouts, as said its getting pretty sporadic now, but it can't be helped at the moment as i need to make the house move my priority. will need to pack up gym and fill the garage up with boxes somepoint soon too, so will be having a couple of months off until i get the new gym set up...

taking a leaf from phil's book, i'm hoping to use this time to lose some weight without worrying about getting enough to eat for training purposes...:thumb:


still been keeping up on the thread even if i've not been posting recently and doug and james, you guys are really lifting some weights...:doublesho lift safely...:thumb:
rgds stu


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) -101KGX5 - 114KGX3 - 128KGX1

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Dam pleased with this workout & very surprised how easy the 128x1 went up :thumb:

Onward & Upward!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 135KGX5 - 153KGX3 - 171KGX1

SQUAT 102.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 102.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice!!! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I have been working out but havent had access to internet so will do a quick update.
Friday Workout: (Done Sat after 18 holes of golf)
Squats: (WU 60x5, 72.5x5, 85x3) WO 100x3, 115x3, 127.5x4 PM 144.5
Stiff Leg Deadlifts: 67.5x8, 80x8, 90x6
Glute Ham Raises: BW x 6 Assisted
Ab Roll Outs: Red Band x 3 x 8

Very pleased to get these squats when I had walked round 18 holes of golf in a big comp so it was quite mentally exhausting. I also hurt my left knee last week, all you weight lifters will laugh but I hurt it playing golf of all sports. After each set I could hardly put any weight on it but the pain subsided and didnt hurt that much during the set so I got it done. Felt better the next day.

Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 45x3, 51x3, 57.5x5 PM 67kg
Dips: BW x 8, 8 BW +15 x 6
Neutral Grip Chins Between every Set: 8x3, 2x4
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x 9,9,9
EZ Bar Curls: 21x 6,6,6

5th rep was a grinder but still got it. Loving my 0.5kg weights. Im adding 1kg per month. I would be over the moon with 12kg a year on SP.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) 115x3, 132.5x3, 147.5x3 PM 162kg
Front Box Squats: 67.5x8, 80x8, 90x6
Good Mornings: 22.5x 10,10,10
Reverse Crunches

Deadlifts followed by Front Squats are still one of the best ab workouts you can do and these 2 exercises paired together pretty much hit every muscle in your body. Deadlifts mostly hit glutes, hamstrings, lower back, front squats hit quads and upper back. You will notice I changed to Box front squats this is just until my knee heals up.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

Family down so only the work sets tonight.

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 52KGX5 - 58.5KGX3 - 65.5KGX1*

All good :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 135KGX5 - 153KGX3 - 171KGX1*

Had to keep it short again today as we have family down


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

De- Load week.

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 54KGX5 - 67KGX5 - 81KGX5

BENCH PRESS 60KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*


----------



## Bod42

Im still here and still working out but just havent had time to update as got a lot going on, moving house, sold the car, its all happening, anyway to the workouts.

Friday Workout:
Med Ball Chest Throws: 3x5
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 50x5, 60x3) WO 75x5, 85x3, 95x10 PM 126.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 55x5, 65x5, 72.5x5
Over Hand Close Grip Chins: 10x2 Between every pushing set.
Kroc Rows: 2x25x20 (Cut 1 set short as guy turned up to pick up car)

So my plan was to stick to the low reps and slowly work my way up but I wanted to see how my shoulder felt when I pushed it. My aim for the workout was 6 so I pushed to 8, felt good so I got 10, probably still could have got more.

Inclines are starting to feel more natural as I get used to them.

Changed to Overhand Chins as underhand were killing my wrists as find my bars slightly to close.

Kroc rows are definitely a love/hate relationship.

Monday Workout:
Squats: (WU 60x5, 72.5x5, 85x3) WO 107.5x5, 120x3, 135x3 PM 148.5kg
Straight Leg Deadlifts: 72.5x5, 85x5, 95x5
GHR: 3x6
Ab Roll Outs

Nothing felt right on squats, I felt like I had never picked up a bar in my life. Warm ups felt **** form felt **** but I managed to grind out 3 reps which was more than my aim of 2 so cant really complain. Need to use this upcoming deload week to work on my form. I feel like I'm on the verge of making good progress as when I slow during a rep I know feel like Im pushing with my legs whereas for years I always felt it in my back. We shall see, all the direct Ham/Glute work cant be hurting either.

As I get used to these again they hurt more and more, not using massive weight but really making sure I get a massive stretch and isolate my Hams.

On a nice note I have been training one of my mates and he justs pops round to train every so often so I can check his form etc and he is squatting 70kg for 5x5 after 7 weeks. Not bad considering he weighs 80kg. Puts my training to shame really so need to up my game. We will be training together all the time soon as my gym is going in his garage so hopefully that will push me more.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesay Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 47.5x5, 54.5x3, 61x3 PM 67kg
Weights Dips: BWx5, BW+7.5x5, BW+22.5x5
Neutral Grip Chins: 7x3, 3x4 between every pushing set
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x5x10
EZ Bar Curls: 27x3x6

Hit my goal of 3 reps on shoulder press. 60kg has always been my stalling point and I dont think this is a bad weight for a seated press. I have calculated all my weights for this year and hoping to hit 70 for 3 reps by Oct.

Weighted Dips were pretty easy.

Chin Ups between every set is a great way to improve your pulling volume and its good for fitness as Im only resting 1 min between pulling and pushing sets.

Pendlay Rows feel so different after Chin Ups. Its like your lats are exhausted so you use all upper back.

Biceps are pretty pointless after a hard back workout like this but I just throw a few light sets in at the end while Im tidying up and things.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fridays workout

Week 4 Cycle 7 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 28KGX5 - 35KGX5 - 42KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice & easy :thumb:


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> hi guys, its been a couple of weeks so thought i'd better say hello...:thumb:
> didn't get round to posting last few workouts


Think I should check in as well after couple of weeks of reading and not contributing. :wave:

Had a stomach bug for a week so couple of weeks of next to nothing, then couple of weeks getting back up to lifting with any sort of strength and endurance.

Just before the bug I noticed I'd dropped 4kg (to [email protected]). I've added up todays macros and it's 2000cal, 174protein, 179 carbs, 65 fat. I need to eat more.

Press - started to add press or dips back in every workout and feels good again. I really think frequent volume is the way forward for me. Added 3kg to e1rm this cycle. Up to 5x13 dips. Bill Starr's pressing article said 4x20 before adding weight. Don't think I'll be able to add a rep or two to every set each week going forward as they're getting tougher and tougher. We'll see. Maybe weighted dips in a month :thumb:

Squat - Knees moving back is an absolute 'er. Screws my knee up (acl inflamed) Read this in response to question about heel height on Erice Cressy site and it really cleared up in my mind a few things:

_If you don't have great ankle mobility, you'll need a little lift.

If it's a hip dominant squat (sitting back), you'll be fine in these.

If it's a quad dominant squat (sitting down), you'll want some lift._

I think I'm doing some hybrid of sitting back but shoving my knees forward. Need to sort it out as I keep getting to 120kg'ish then having to reset to recover because my knee is shagged.

Mobility - I've being doing Kelly Staretts mobility WOD each night for a couple of months. Has anyone else? 10 minutes for each one. I feel good for it and have some key moves to use when things feel clunky. If anyone wants I could pull together 7 that I think were really good so folks could try it for a week. Especially for you Stu if you're not lifting. Have something to show for the last few weesk whilst you're moving and not able to lift anything.



ITHAQVA said:


> Week 4 Cycle 6 - 5/3/1 Deload Week
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 28KGX5 - 33KGX5 - 40KGX5 *


*

I remember reading that and thinking that it was a full workout for some of us rather than a deload (back me up here Stu!)

Mind you I did 5x10 deadlifts last night. Should have been 90kg but I misloaded and noticed on the last set I'd put 100kg on. That's progress as I vividly remember being made up the first time I pulled 100kg for 5 reps on Starting Strength. I don't think I've ever reset my deadlift but worksets at 150kg feels proper heavy now. Got a belt to see if it's useful. Not broken in yet but getting there.








*


----------



## sfstu

i'd be interested to see the mobility stuff colin...?

been a month for me now almost and probably another month at least yet til i get set up and lifting...:wall: 
can't be helped though as so much to do with 5 of us to pack for and move, and am trying to make use of the time and lose some weight and doing plenty of walking and also plenty of lifting and up and down to the loft...!:doublesho
will also need to sort a new roof, windows and side door on new garage soon after moving in but looking forward to setting up cage and weights and having the room to use it again...:thumb:
rgds all,
stu :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I really like that belt and Im on the fence if I buy one or not. Half me says go for it, im certain with the way I lift that it would help a lot but I lift for rugby and you dont wear a belt on the pitch and I think you should train like what ever sport you play.

Anyway I am still lifting but its my deload week so I decided to miss it completely as my parents are over from the UK so think its abit cheeky disappearing to the gym when they have come round the world to see me.

Seeing that belt has definitely got me thinking about it again though


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> i'd be interested to see the mobility stuff colin...?


I'll have a look back a pick seven out  There are three things that he uses so it may be useful if you say whether or not your've got them and I'll avoid ones where you no got the equipment. They are:
(1) Resistance band for looping over power rack and putting your hand in, 
(2) Lacrosse balls x3 (or x1 !). Can use a hockey ball but it's bigger and hurts more!! I can say where to get three for £10 inc postage if needed (took me a while hunting around for them)
(3) Foam roller or pvc pipe.

Prepare to enter the 'pain cave' :devil:



Bod42 said:


> I really like that belt and I'm on the fence if I buy one or not. Half me says go for it, im certain with the way I lift that it would help a lot but I lift for rugby and you don't wear a belt on the pitch and I think you should train like what ever sport you play.


I'm the same as you. Stuart Mcgill writes they don't prevent injury but allow you to lift more. Like any powerlifting gear I guess. It's a bugger to break in and I'm using it on light sets then taking it off for the last sets as it's a distraction!! Once it's broken in then I've got a choice of whether to use it or not.

I decided last month to go to a physio and get my twitchy leg and wonky scapula sorted out. Noticed a guy nearby and found out he's currently a physio for elite England rugby (and formerly team physio with Leeds, Harlequins etc). The benefits of living in a big city! My first conversation with him went:
Me - 'My back went and my right leg seized up and went numb. I read about it and decide to do squats'
Him - 'Ok'
Me - 'I mean squats and deadlifts. Heavy as I can. Trying to get double body weight. With free weights.'
Him - 'Great. Absolutely the right thing to do!!'

I couldn't believe it. I was expecting a lecture on being stupid! I'll try to remember to ask him his view on belts next week.


----------



## sfstu

Oats said:


> I'll have a look back a pick seven out  There are three things that he uses so it may be useful if you say whether or not your've got them and I'll avoid ones where you no got the equipment. They are:
> (1) Resistance band for looping over power rack and putting your hand in,
> (2) Lacrosse balls x3 (or x1 !). Can use a hockey ball but it's bigger and hurts more!! I can say where to get three for £10 inc postage if needed (took me a while hunting around for them)
> (3) Foam roller or pvc pipe.
> 
> Prepare to enter the 'pain cave' :devil:


have sgot bands, no hockey balls though and have pvc pipe but what sort of size/dia col...?
stu


----------



## Oats

sfstu said:


> have sgot bands, no hockey balls though and have pvc pipe but what sort of size/dia col...?
> stu


My foam roller is six inches diameter. I guess if it was a pipe it'd be something like those brown drainage ones. It will hurt more though since it's solid! Bit like the difference between the hockey and lacrosse ball. Think Wendler also says to wrap grip tape around it to stop it slipping. Again slipping is a problem with a plastic hockey ball compared to a lacrosse ball.

I first heard of Kelly Starett on Rips website. Have heard him mentioned quite alot elsewhere including by Tommy Yule who's the GB weightlifting strength coach. So ignore the fact he's very Crossfit :tumbleweed:

This one doesn't count but there's something wrong about not doing the first ever one...

http://www.mobilitywod.com/page/92

Others to follow later. There's a couple of key principals about posture he really drills home so I'll try to find one that exlpains them well. They make interesting viewing.

*Update*
Looking back, key lower back and shoulder concepts are in the first few and they don't require anything you've not got :thumb: So ten minutes a day is all it takes.....
http://www.mobilitywod.com/page/91

Monday - Episode 2 Intro to the 'pain cave' 

Tuesday - Episode 4 Loved this one. Goes together nicely with Episode 2 for those that do alot of sitting....

Wednesay - Episode 5 Shoulder positioning. Something I work on during dips. Watch episode 6 for a bit more explanation of it.

Thursday - http://www.mobilitywod.com/page/90 Episode 8 Loading, duration and hunting in this video were all new to me and make a big differnce in how I stretch\mobilise now.

Friday - Episode 9. I had a ****ty shoulder for six months from the squat bar mashing a nerve. This pretty much solved it in one session! Turn thumb outwards more to get lats (where it gets tight from chin ups).

That only leaves 2 Episodes before your week is up my mobility padawan! Need to think about this one carefully. Now, which ones induced the greatest discomfort :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

After another week of man flu aaaaaaaaaaaaa hate being ill!!! :wall::wall:

Week 1 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 89KGX5 - 103KGX5 - 116.5KGX5*

Still not feeling 100% so I'm going to stick with the heavies only for this week


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> I really like that belt and Im on the fence if I buy one or not. Half me says go for it, im certain with the way I lift that it would help a lot but I lift for rugby and you dont wear a belt on the pitch and I think you should train like what ever sport you play.


I asked my phsio today about belts. He said none of his permier/super league or country players use them. Except to hang weights from to chin and dip  You can take from that what you will!



ITHAQVA said:


> After another week of man flu aaaaaaaaaaaaa hate being ill!!! :wall::wall:/QUOTE]
> Been a bad year for it. Easter next week and it's snowing! Roll on the summer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I asked my phsio today about belts. He said none of his permier/super league or country players use them. Except to hang weights from to chin and dip  You can take from that what you will!
> 
> 
> 
> ITHAQVA said:
> 
> 
> 
> After another week of man flu aaaaaaaaaaaaa hate being ill!!! :wall::wall:/QUOTE]
> Been a bad year for it. Easter next week and it's snowing! Roll on the summer.
> 
> 
> 
> Since getting back into powerlifting after tearing my hamstring I have not used my belt, I want to train my core to be strong & not become a weak link :thumb:
> 
> Tell me about it, I've never had the flu/virus twice within 6 month before  However no matter how fit you think you are it will not stop you getting a virus, it will just help you're body fight it better.
> 
> The biathlon people (I'm talking ski/shooting biathlon) are amongst the fittest humans on the planet & they catch flu viruses on a regular basis. So I'm not going to knock myself for being old & weak
> 
> Lift on!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No belt!!!!!!!!!! took me a few session to get used to the different feel, apart from that all good :thumb:
Click to expand...


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) 67.5x5, 77.5x5, 87.5x10 PM 116.5
Incline Bench Press: 45x10, 52.5x10, 62.5x10
Over Hand Chins: 9x2, 1x3
Kroc Rows: 30x20, 30x15

Not a bad workout but after a week off even the warm up felt hard, need to actually do the deload weeks and not just take a week off but the parents were here from the UK so good time to take a week off. This is where the 5/3/1 program shines though as you dont have to destroy yourself every session and you can pick your battles.

I am loving incline BP at the moment, been years since I done them but completely different feeling from standard bench.

I didnt used to be able to do 1 over hand Chins up and I know Im not exactly doing a lot now but Im pleased.

Kroc Rows are a *****, simple as that really.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 120KGX5 - 139KGX5 - 157KGX5*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Squat: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 95x5, 110x5, 125x8 PM 158.5
Straight Leg Deadlifts: 60x10, 70x10, 82.5x10
Glute Ham Raise: 0x6, 6, 6
Bar Roll Outs: Red Band 6, 6, 6

Pleased with squats, best they have felt in a long time. I keep saying it but I'm feeling like I'm at the point where I can start adding some serious weight to the bar.

Everything else was pretty standard, getting better at GHR and seem to be isolating my Hamstings well on these as well as SLD. I know this as I'm sore as hell today.

The guy I'm training squated 87.5x5x5 after 9 weeks on wednesday so I need to get a bloody move on considering I have been sqautting a few years now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 46.5KGX5 - 53.5KGX5 - 61KGX5*

Good workout, surprised how light the 61x5 felt, hopefully in the next few months I can break past my old OHP sticking point :tumbleweed:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout:
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) 42.5x5, 49x5, 35.5x8 PM 70.5kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+2.5x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 6x3, 4x4
Pendlay Rows: 65x8,8,8

I was only supposed to do 7 reps on shoulder press but got 8 so Im pleased. I have been eating like I'm on holiday since my parents got here and have put on weight, great thing about putting on weight is your strength goes up so easy.

Pleased with dips as the percentages are exactly less than BW for the first 2 sets which means I use a lot of energy on these. Its a lot more accurate on the heavier weeks.


----------



## Bates

Bod42 said:


> Wednesay Workout:
> Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 47.5x5, 54.5x3, 61x3 PM 67kg
> Weights Dips: BWx5, BW+7.5x5, BW+22.5x5
> Neutral Grip Chins: 7x3, 3x4 between every pushing set
> Pendlay Rows: 62.5x5x10
> EZ Bar Curls: 27x3x6
> 
> Hit my goal of 3 reps on shoulder press. 60kg has always been my stalling point and I dont think this is a bad weight for a seated press. I have calculated all my weights for this year and hoping to hit 70 for 3 reps by Oct.
> 
> Weighted Dips were pretty easy.
> 
> Chin Ups between every set is a great way to improve your pulling volume and its good for fitness as Im only resting 1 min between pulling and pushing sets.
> 
> Pendlay Rows feel so different after Chin Ups. Its like your lats are exhausted so you use all upper back.
> 
> Biceps are pretty pointless after a hard back workout like this but I just throw a few light sets in at the end while Im tidying up and things.


All of these presses, are you using bar, machine or dumbbells?


----------



## sfstu

That'll be a bar...:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bates said:


> All of these presses, are you using bar, machine or dumbbells?





sfstu said:


> That'll be a bar...:thumb:


Stu knows us all to well as that would be with a bar :thumb:. Its safe to say on this page that unless it states a dumbell exercise e.g. dumbell rows then 99% of the time it will be a Barbell.

Theres 6 sets, 3 are warm up, 2 are easy sets and then 1 top sets so its not that much really. Far easier than 5x5


----------



## Bod42

Whats going on people, our thread is nearly off the first page. I havent been on here for a while as I have been pretty addicted to quading but I have still been training. Had an RVR to detail which would have been a great turn around car but my friend wants it back and doesnt care about it being detailed, bloody Kiwi's.

Anyway my few workouts.
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 110x5, 127.5x5, 145x5 PM 169KG
Front Box Squats: 60x10, 70x10, 80x10
Good Mornings: 27.5x3x10

Not a bad workout, definitely enjoying deadlifts more than I ever had but thats probably because I'm using such a light weight and not having to grind them out. I seem a lot faster now days with these and my sticking point has changed.

High rep Front squats are now my new worst exercise especially after deadlifts. Your back and core are burning by the end, its more mental than a leg exercise.

Using Good Morning more to practise keeping my upper back arched to improve my squat. Obviously could use a lot more weight.

Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) WO 72.5x3, 82.5x3, 92.5x8 PM 117KG
Incline Press: 52.5x8, 62.5x8, 70x6
Over Hand Chins: 8x2, 2x3 Done between pressing sets.
Kroc Rows: 30x20,20
Skull Crushers: 35x6,6,6

Bench Press felt the best it has in a long time during warmup but then once I got to my heavy sets my right shoulder was clicking real bad in every rep. It doesnt hurt at all but your shoulder moving and popping on every rep is unsettling.

Loving Incline Press, its a great change from the norm and my shoulder doesnt click.

Chin Ups just felt plain weird tonight.

Im leaving 45 seconds between Kroc Rows and this is seriously hard, absolutely sweating like mad by the end of just the 2 sets.


----------



## Oats

It was Christmas when I rewrote my routine so I was going to do a write up of how it's going. Noticed some interesting things. However I've been thinking about something and following a little bonus at work have thought screw it and signed up. Twice a day strength camp with a good coach. http://www.brendanchaplin.co.uk/services/strength-camp/ I think it's going to be pretty punishing but once the doms etc have gone I'll have learnt a lot. I'll post about each session. Wish me luck! :wave:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I will be posting again as of Monday, bloody man flu came back....again, then I decided to take a week off :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Stu knows us all to well as that would be with a bar :thumb:. Its safe to say on this page that unless it states a dumbell exercise e.g. dumbell rows then 99% of the time it will be a Barbell.


Incorrect!!!! Should read 100% of the time it will be a barbell unless otherwise stated 

I wont even say the D word! :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 96KGX3 - 109.5KGX3 - 123KGX2* <<<<<<<<<<<<<:wall::wall: Thought to myself this is heavy & put the bar back after two reps!!!!!!!!! Idiot!!!!!!!!!!!! Thinking about it, I feel I could have done 3 but after a few weeks of the man flu & not keeping my protein intake to 200grams a day put doubt in my mind 

Anyhow I will forget this little set back & carry on with this cycle as though I made the 3 reps, If I fail again then I will consider re starting this cycle from week 1 

I'll only do the heavies this week & start the 5x10 assistance work next week :thumb:

Lift on!


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout (Done Late Saturday)
Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 102.5x3, 117.5x3, 132.5x5 PM 154.5KG
Straight Leg Deadlifts: 70x8, 80x8, 92.5x6

Went for a 6th rep on squats as should easily be able to get 6 reps but failed so seriously  off. My strength was good but my form was ****, the bar actually rolled up my back on the 5th rep which should be impossible and happened even worse on the 6th rep, need to pull the back down into my back. I know driving my elbows forwards helps with this but I cant do this with my elbow, instantly screws it up.

Monday Wokrout
Med Ball Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 45x3, 42x3, 58.5x5 PM 68KG
Weighted Dips: BWx8, BW+2.5x8, BW+17.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 5x3, 3x4, 2x3 Between each pushing set
Pendlay Rows: 65x 9, 9, 9

Good workout. The really eagle eyed will notice that my Predicted Max on SP was actually less but I'm still happy as I hit my goal of 5 reps and they felt good. Probably could have got 6 if I really wanted.

Pleased with my dips, I just love adding weight to these.

Not impressed with Chin Ups but I have now built my Rack properly and put the Chin Up bar at full height so it is slightly different.

I hate low rest Pendlay Rows after Chin ups as your lats are weak so its basically all upper back which makes it bloody hard. But always good to have a thicker and stronger upper back.


----------



## Oats

I've finished my intensive course and it was a blast :thumb: Mashed by the end of it. Reminded me of the end of linear progression where you are mullered but still manage to warm up and lift.

Learnt clean and snatch progression that is totally different to the one Rip does. Makes a lot more sense to me now and I've got a clear idea of what I need to do going forward. Was nice to see someone from the national weightlifting team do the same movements when they did their routine.

I asked for a bit of time on squats so we covered them quickly. He was saying that he does a very clear progression with his atheletes. They do overhead squats first to learn good posture, depth etc. Then they move on to front squats for quite some time. It teaches the chest up cue, good back angle etc. Only when they are really competent and moving some good weight do they go on to back squats. When they do it's high bar. The back angle more closely approximates that in athletic movements. It seems to be that low bar enables you to shift more weight (hence powerlifting style) whereas high bar carries over more. I can see how high bar with deadlifts and powercleans still gets the whole posterior chain. I tried high bar (sitting down rather than pushing hips back) and when chatting he said that the tendency with low bar is for your lower back to roll under slightly because of the increased tension on the pelvis caused by the flatter back angle. The strange thing is, that's exactly what happens on my low bar squat and he hadn't seen it. If only for this reason alone, and my lower back history, I'll try high bar :tumbleweed:

We had a session on programming and I've tweaked me previous routine. Main goal is still bodyweight press. Now I can do cleans and snatches I've added them in. Reduce or even remove 5x10 deadlifts as that'll come via the cleans. Overall there is more squatting movement due to cleans\snatches. Single leg squats as prescribed by physio to sort out glute activation. Moved bench to more of an accessory lift to make way for cleans. Need to add in more pulling work but I'm going to see how this goes for a few weeks first.

I've learnt loads over the last four days (e.g. warm ups, technique, conditioning circuits etc) but don't want to write war and peace; so any questions just ask :wave:

*Workout 1*
(a) Press 5\3\1
(b) Pull ups
(a) Dips 5x5
(b) Unilateral row 5x10

*Workout 2*
Power Clean 4x4
Deadlift 5\3\1
Single Leg Squat 5x5

*Workout 3*
Clean\Snatch Variants 4x4
Bench Press 5x5
Press 5x10

*Workout 4*
Squat 5\3\1
Front squat\walking lunge\deadlift 5x5-8
Unilateral press

Core work at end of workout time permitting.
5 mins 30 sec on 30 off conditioning twice a week.
Deload week bit more conditioning and retraction\pulling work.


----------



## Bod42

Sounds awesome mate, I looked at the link and it did look really good and wouldnt mind doing something similar myself. Been watching the California Strength BFS stronger videos on youtube and they do mostly olympic movements and it is getting my interest up for them abit more.

The high and low bar squat arguement has gone on for years and think it will for many years to come. The only comment I really disagree with from Pro High Bar squatters is that it has a better carry over to sport as its more sport specific. There isnt a sport other than Power and Olympic lifting that you do a full squat movement in so neither movement is sport specific. As defranco says you just get overall stronger and that carries over to your sport but hardly any gym movements are sports specific. My overall take is there is no right or wrong answer, do which ever feels right for you when you start.

I low bar squat as it feels more locked in and I come from a box squat backround so I therefore sit back more than sit down. The guy I'm training high bar squats as it felt more natural so I'm happy with that. My back is definitely my weak point in my squat so I could possible squat more with high bar as you keep your torso more upright.

And your new workout looks really good, exactly how I have aletred 5/3/1 for rugby guys who want to incorparate power movements. Some rugby teams (All Blacks) use the clean as a strength measure.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 8 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 129.5KGX3 - 148KGX3 - 166.5KGX3*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x4 PM 173KG
Front Squats: 70x8, 80x8, 92.5x6
Good Mornings: 30 x 10, 10, 10
Reverse Crunches

Deadlifts felt good so went for an extra rep and really I should be doing this anyway to improve from last week otherwise Im just lifting the same predicted max.

Front Squats are a seriously hard exercise but its not my legs, its my upper back that struggles especially after Deadlifts. Please with my progress though as next month will be 100kg for 5 which I suppose is a reasonable milestone.

Concentrated on pulling the bar downwards during my good mornings to practice what I should be doing during my squats. Just using this movement to strengthen my upper back arch for squats.


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> The high and low bar squat arguement has gone on for years and think it will for many years to come. The only comment I really disagree with from Pro High Bar squatters is that it has a better carry over to sport as its more sport specific


There are plenty of people stronger than me that squat high and low bar so either is better than neither. I think it's the back rounding under that surprised me the most and so is probably a good idea for me to try it out.

Chest up is why they do so much over head squats, front squats and plate carries.



Bod42 said:


> And your new workout looks really good, exactly how I have aletred 5/3/1 for rugby guys who want to incorparate power movements. Some rugby teams (All Blacks) use the clean as a strength measure.


I'm happy that I've got a good idea of the powerclean now. I've always liked it but just sucked at it. Now I can get on with my primary goal of BW shoulder press, and secondary aims of x2 BW deadlift and BW powerclean 

They mentioned rugby quite alot. Apparently contact in sport is normally under 0.2 secs and that's why cleans are emphasised so much (0.2 sec contact from an All-Black would be plenty enough for me!). They also do alot of sumo deadlifts since its a foot position found frequently in sport.

Keep an eye on his website as there's freuqently mention of rugby. I think he's got a video coming up of the carry over of grappling into rugby.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX3 - 57KGX3 - 64KGX3*

Good workout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 129.5KGX3 - 148KGX3 - 166.5KGX3*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX3 - 57KGX3 - 64KGX3*
> 
> Good workout :thumb:


Thats a real good OHP Doug. Keep it up. You doing these seated or standing these days?

Friday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x3, 100x10 PM 133.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 57.5x5, 65x5, 75x5
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 7x2, 3x3
Skull Crushers: 37.5x 6, 6, 6

Pleased with the 133.5kg predicted 1RM but shoulder did hurt abit while pushing it abit. Obviously keeping the reps well below failure is working well on BP.

Loving Incline Press, Im actually considering making this my main exercise for the next few cycles as my shoulder doesnt click or hurt while doing these.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thats a real good OHP Doug. Keep it up. You doing these seated or standing these days?


Hiya James 

OHP standing as always mate :thumb:

Been watching the Olympic weightlifting on Eurosport last week, bloody awesome! Has inspired me to do Power Cleans instead of jumps on my Deadlift day as an assistance exercise, I'll start with a light weight and low reps to keep form good :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) -103KGX5 -116.5KGX3 - 130KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Dam good workout, the 130 bench was difficult in the middle part of the lift and none to pretty :devil:

There is a very satisfying feeling seeing the bar bend slightly in the middle with your benching weight when on the rack! :devil:

I think its going to get very hard to progress to my final goal of 150Kg x 1 rep, if I progress with the 5/3/1 without any plateaus I'm on for September 2013 for my goal, I would be happy if I got it by the end of this year though 

Squats tomorrow :doublesho :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Hiya James
> 
> OHP standing as always mate :thumb:
> 
> Been watching the Olympic weightlifting on Eurosport last week, bloody awesome! Has inspired me to do Power Cleans instead of jumps on my Deadlift day as an assistance exercise, I'll start with a light weight and low reps to keep form good :thumb:


When I read it I realised how freakin' far I had to go to get to a BW OHP!! I'm determined not to fanny out and lose weight to get it!

There's an instructional Oly lifting DVD that's got good reviews. Probably available from your usual sources...


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> There are plenty of people stronger than me that squat high and low bar so either is better than neither. I think it's the back rounding under that surprised me the most and so is probably a good idea for me to try it out.
> 
> Chest up is why they do so much over head squats, front squats and plate carries.
> 
> I'm happy that I've got a good idea of the powerclean now. I've always liked it but just sucked at it. Now I can get on with my primary goal of BW shoulder press, and secondary aims of x2 BW deadlift and BW powerclean
> 
> They mentioned rugby quite alot. Apparently contact in sport is normally under 0.2 secs and that's why cleans are emphasised so much (0.2 sec contact from an All-Black would be plenty enough for me!). They also do alot of sumo deadlifts since its a foot position found frequently in sport.
> 
> Keep an eye on his website as there's freuqently mention of rugby. I think he's got a video coming up of the carry over of grappling into rugby.


Its always a good idea to try things mate and it strange as I have actually been looking very closely at my squat back angle which lead me to high bar and low bar topic. Was messing around with squats the other night, trying different bar positions and squatting down instead of back which keeps my torso more up right. I found that high bar feels the most natural, the bar sits there without any stress on my shoulders or streching anything so Im inclined to move to this but when the weight got high I felt I couldnt drive into the bar so much but it was only messing around so I would most probably improve. The problem for me with my screwed shoulder is I have very little flexibility which means even getting into the low bar position is stressful and just standing at the top of a squat everything is stretched whereas highbar squat just sits there and its closer to your spine and therfore centre of gravity. Decisions decisions.

I have heard of the contact time theory with rugby but I know the All Blacks use it as its an indicator of power (strength x speed) which is very important for rugby. Strange that they do Sumo as a number of people say Sumo doest carry over to sport but conventional does. This is why I love reading about sport / fitness / etc as there are a million and one different opinions even between top trainers but their top trainers as they get results.

Anyway on to another crap Squat Workout
Monday Workout:
Squat: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 110x5, 125x3, 140x3 PM 154kg
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 75x5, 90x5, 100x5
Glute Ham Raises: BW x 6,6,6
Ab Roll Outs: 5s with Red Band: 8, 6, 5

Another workout where I didnt make any progress, I made my minimum reps but I wanted more. I would think that maybe my diet sucks and Im not getting my body in a good state to produce strength but all my other lifts are increasing except bloody squats. I even deloaded my Bench and have been training 3-4 reps shy of failure and my strength has gone up even though I dont really care about Bench but the one exercise that I'm trying to increase, Squats, just isnt moving.

SLDs are one of those exercises that you make as hard as you want, you really keep the arch in your back and push through your heels their a killer but you get lazy and dont stretch and just go through the movement then they are easy.

After I had finished all my workout I decided to do some heavy walkouts with weights I used to squat. I worked up to 200kg and thought my back was going to snap, I used to full box squat 180kg and half squat 220kg for reps. Now I struggle to even walk the bloody thing out, its pathetic. To put things in perspective my last two workouts, I have Bench a PM of 133.5kg and Squatted a PM of 154kg, 20 bloody kg between them.

Edit: Maybe I'm slightly over reacting as looking at the starting strengh weight goals there are only 40kg between the advanced Squat and Bench Press but still annoys me that my squat isnt going up.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> When I read it I realised how freakin' far I had to go to get to a BW OHP!! I'm determined not to fanny out and lose weight to get it!
> 
> There's an instructional Oly lifting DVD that's got good reviews. Probably available from your usual sources...


Slow, steady and consistent on the OHP press :thumb:

Nice link Col, thanks. Like the look of the "Clean high pull" assistance lift :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Its always a good idea to try things mate and it strange as I have actually been looking very closely at my squat back angle which lead me to high bar and low bar topic. Was messing around with squats the other night, trying different bar positions and squatting down instead of back which keeps my torso more up right. I found that high bar feels the most natural, the bar sits there without any stress on my shoulders or streching anything so Im inclined to move to this but when the weight got high I felt I couldnt drive into the bar so much but it was only messing around so I would most probably improve. The problem for me with my screwed shoulder is I have very little flexibility which means even getting into the low bar position is stressful and just standing at the top of a squat everything is stretched whereas highbar squat just sits there and its closer to your spine and therfore centre of gravity. Decisions decisions.
> 
> I have heard of the contact time theory with rugby but I know the All Blacks use it as its an indicator of power (strength x speed) which is very important for rugby. Strange that they do Sumo as a number of people say Sumo doest carry over to sport but conventional does. This is why I love reading about sport / fitness / etc as there are a million and one different opinions even between top trainers but their top trainers as they get results.
> 
> Anyway on to another crap Squat Workout
> Monday Workout:
> Squat: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 87.5x3) WO 110x5, 125x3, 140x3 PM 154kg
> Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 75x5, 90x5, 100x5
> Glute Ham Raises: BW x 6,6,6
> Ab Roll Outs: 5s with Red Band: 8, 6, 5
> 
> Another workout where I didnt make any progress, I made my minimum reps but I wanted more. I would think that maybe my diet sucks and Im not getting my body in a good state to produce strength but all my other lifts are increasing except bloody squats. I even deloaded my Bench and have been training 3-4 reps shy of failure and my strength has gone up even though I dont really care about Bench but the one exercise that I'm trying to increase, Squats, just isnt moving.
> 
> SLDs are one of those exercises that you make as hard as you want, you really keep the arch in your back and push through your heels their a killer but you get lazy and dont stretch and just go through the movement then they are easy.
> 
> After I had finished all my workout I decided to do some heavy walkouts with weights I used to squat. I worked up to 200kg and thought my back was going to snap, I used to full box squat 180kg and half squat 220kg for reps. Now I struggle to even walk the bloody thing out, its pathetic. To put things in perspective my last two workouts, I have Bench a PM of 133.5kg and Squatted a PM of 154kg, 20 bloody kg between them.
> 
> Edit: Maybe I'm slightly over reacting as looking at the starting strengh weight goals there are only 40kg between the advanced Squat and Bench Press but still annoys me that my squat isnt going up.


I have tried adding intensity many years ago to my strength training & after 10-12 weeks reasonable progress my strength would then start to drop. I disagree with mixing Intensity and strength training :doublesho

Forget the "or more" extra reps for the main lifts :thumb: follow the 5/3/1 only aiming to make the reps required, do the BBB assistance routine (Barbells lifts only), stick with the routine as is for at least 12 months :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 139KGX5 - 157KGX3 - 176KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x01x10*

Good workout, hopefully the hamstring will allow me to get to 200Kgx1 without any more trouble & then allow me to progress to my final goal of 230x1, only time will tell.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have tried adding intensity many years ago to my strength training & after 10-12 weeks reasonable progress my strength would then start to drop. I disagree with mixing Intensity and strength training :doublesho
> 
> Forget the "or more" extra reps for the main lifts :thumb: follow the 5/3/1 only aiming to make the reps required, do the BBB assistance routine (Barbells lifts only), stick with the routine as is for at least 12 months :thumb:


Problem is Doug I have been on 5/3/1 for just under 7 months and have made zero progress. I have actually gone backwards slightly. Im not sure if the 1 top set is enough volume for me. Obviously when your stronger that one set has more impact on your body but at my strength level it doesnt seem to work.

Reading a lot of peoples review of the program, they say it works great for upper body movements but they normally lose strength on their lower body especially squats and this is exactly what I have experienced.

To put in context why I'm getting so annoyed with my squat. 
20th April 2012 - 142.5kg for 2 sets of 5 reps
15th April 2013 - 140kg for 1 set of 3 reps.

Means I have lost 7.5kg off my predicted max in 1 yr.

And on the 10th Dec I did 145 for 1 set of 4 reps so lost strength in the last 4 months.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 50x5, 55x3, 62x3 PM 68kg
Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 4x3, 3x4, 3x3 Between every pushing set
Dips: BWx5, BW+10x5, BW+25x5
Pendlay Rows: 65x 10, 10, 10

So adding 1kg a month to my shoulder press seems to be working. I know its slow going but I would be happy going from PM max of 68kg to 80kg within a year.

As I have moved house I put the Chin Up bar on the right way up and it changes the movement every so slightly so Im missing a few reps but still getting that extra back volume in so not to worried.

Dips are feeling solid but I used to keep my depth constant by using my shadow but cant do this anymore. I always hit parallel but need to make sure I dont go to low as it puts a lot of stress on my screwed shoulder.

Pleased to get all my reps on pendlay rows but god they were hard. High rep rows after Chins suck big time but my upper back is alway sore the next day.

Decidied to just stick with my set reps from now on as my shoulder has acted up slightly after pushing my bench press. Going to keep my bench 3-4 reps shy of failure from now on.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout
> Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
> Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 50x5, 55x3, 62x3 PM 68kg
> Neutral Grip Chin Ups: 4x3, 3x4, 3x3 Between every pushing set
> Dips: BWx5, BW+10x5, BW+25x5
> Pendlay Rows: 65x 10, 10, 10
> 
> So adding 1kg a month to my shoulder press seems to be working. I know its slow going but I would be happy going from PM max of 68kg to 80kg within a year.
> 
> As I have moved house I put the Chin Up bar on the right way up and it changes the movement every so slightly so Im missing a few reps but still getting that extra back volume in so not to worried.
> 
> Dips are feeling solid but I used to keep my depth constant by using my shadow but cant do this anymore. I always hit parallel but need to make sure I dont go to low as it puts a lot of stress on my screwed shoulder.
> 
> Pleased to get all my reps on pendlay rows but god they were hard. High rep rows after Chins suck big time but my upper back is alway sore the next day.
> 
> Decidied to just stick with my set reps from now on as my shoulder has acted up slightly after pushing my bench press. Going to keep my bench 3-4 reps shy of failure from now on.


Hi James,

Which 5/3/1 workout pdf does your workout come from mate?

Have you tried the original workout yet. I'm sure you've got a copy, if not, I'll send one if you want it mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James,
> 
> Which 5/3/1 workout pdf does your workout come from mate?
> 
> Have you tried the original workout yet. I'm sure you've got a copy, if not, I'll send one if you want it mate :thumb:


I'm doing the Simplest Strength Template so it has % laid out for your first accessory exercise. The program seems to be working for everything else except my squat.

Wasnt my gym night last night but messed around with squats again. When I low bar squat I have my 2nd finger on the ring and just standing up with the weight stretches all my chest and shoulders. I tried high bar with my hands a lot closer and just outside my shoulders, how nice does this feel, zero stress on shoulders or chest. Everyone seems to agree that you can lift more low bar but Im starting to question if moving the bar 1" really makes that much difference. Im not looking to set world records and there are plenty of people out there who squat 200kg high bar, watched a guy last night high bar squat 300kg. I'm not beng a pussy (maybe I am actually) but is the gain from low bar worth all the pain and uncomfort.

At the moment I am going to stick with low bar for another 4 months but with my hands slightly wider and see how things go.

Thinking about it though, I got to my 180kg Box squat with a high bar squat.

And I think I lost a little faith in 5/3/1 as I have made no progress on the program. And I have been looking at it in more detail and you spend a month lifting the same Predicted Max and then suddenly jump 5kg. To me this means if you get your 5 reps in week 1 then you are just treading water for the next 2 weeks as your not making any progress. So you make no progress for 3 out of 4 weeks and then suddenly add 5kg to the bar. So the different weight and different rep range will stress your body slightly different but overall its still the same PM. Even his Simplest Strength Template percentages on accessory exercises progresses slowly week to week and this makes more sense to me.
Example on Incline Press 
59x10=78.5
68x6=81.5
72x5=84
This is small progress week to week instead of staying the same and then jumping a large amount like 5kg.

Thinking about going back to the traditional if you complete your reps you add weight, if you dont get your reps, you stick to the weight, pretty simple really.

At the end of the day Im doing my usual over thinking everything and always ****ing with things. Squats are hard, there is no magic cue to suddenly make me lift more weight. I just need to stop being a pussy and get under a heavy bar more often. I'm going to stick to low bar, Im going to stick with 5/3/1 for the mean time and see where things go.


----------



## TW15T3D

All those looking for good workout programs,info on supplements, CV etc you should head over to bodybuilding.com amazing site that I have used for years this site has taught me how to lift correctly and kept my interest in weights by always having different workouts to try and above all else it taught me about nutrition as what you eat is just as important if not more that hitting the weights


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I'm doing the Simplest Strength Template so it has % laid out for your first accessory exercise. The program seems to be working for everything else except my squat.
> 
> Wasnt my gym night last night but messed around with squats again. When I low bar squat I have my 2nd finger on the ring and just standing up with the weight stretches all my chest and shoulders. I tried high bar with my hands a lot closer and just outside my shoulders, how nice does this feel, zero stress on shoulders or chest. Everyone seems to agree that you can lift more low bar but Im starting to question if moving the bar 1" really makes that much difference. Im not looking to set world records and there are plenty of people out there who squat 200kg high bar, watched a guy last night high bar squat 300kg. I'm not beng a pussy (maybe I am actually) but is the gain from low bar worth all the pain and uncomfort.
> 
> At the moment I am going to stick with low bar for another 4 months but with my hands slightly wider and see how things go.
> 
> Thinking about it though, I got to my 180kg Box squat with a high bar squat.
> 
> And I think I lost a little faith in 5/3/1 as I have made no progress on the program. And I have been looking at it in more detail and you spend a month lifting the same Predicted Max and then suddenly jump 5kg. To me this means if you get your 5 reps in week 1 then you are just treading water for the next 2 weeks as your not making any progress. So you make no progress for 3 out of 4 weeks and then suddenly add 5kg to the bar. So the different weight and different rep range will stress your body slightly different but overall its still the same PM. Even his Simplest Strength Template percentages on accessory exercises progresses slowly week to week and this makes more sense to me.
> Example on Incline Press
> 59x10=78.5
> 68x6=81.5
> 72x5=84
> This is small progress week to week instead of staying the same and then jumping a large amount like 5kg.
> 
> Thinking about going back to the traditional if you complete your reps you add weight, if you dont get your reps, you stick to the weight, pretty simple really.
> 
> At the end of the day Im doing my usual over thinking everything and always ****ing with things. Squats are hard, there is no magic cue to suddenly make me lift more weight. I just need to stop being a pussy and get under a heavy bar more often. I'm going to stick to low bar, Im going to stick with 5/3/1 for the mean time and see where things go.


I do low bar on the work sets and high bar on the assistance sets (100Kg 5x10)

As for progress I'm using the original 5/3/1 and you only add 5Kg to the Squat/Deadlift and 2.5Kg to the upper body lifts every month/cycle.

If you run out of options James, I still recommend the original 5/3/1 with BBB as your assistance work and yes you do mess around with your programs and think too much I take an even simpler approach these days, go in and do it, I don't even visualise the lifts anymore.

I have found the 5/3/1 has made me more confident in my lifts due to using the same weights calculated from your 100% PM for an entire cycle/month, I'm expecting a plateau very soon with my bench press, I'll carry the same calculated weights to the next cycle and try again and again until I complete the required only reps for the 3 work weeks.

Keep at it mate! :devil::devil::thumb::thumb:

Lift on!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 8 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 53.5KGX5 - 61KGX3 - 68KGX1

OVERHEAD PRESS  45KG10x10x10x10x10*

Had to keep it short this workout. I will be adding weighted dips back to this workout as of next cycle.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 139KGX5 - 157KGX3 - 176KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEANS 20x3 - 30x3 - 40x3 - 50x3 - 60x3*

Starting to add light power cleans to my workouts now and build up the weight used slowly, not sure how heavy to go but ill not go heavier than 100Kg.

I'm still not using my belt and lifting feels very comfortable, is it possible to go to 230Kgx1 for the Squat and Deadlift and still be safe?

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Squats are hard, there is no magic cue to suddenly make me lift more weight. ... I'm going to stick to low bar, Im going to stick with 5/3/1 for the mean time and see where things go.


I tried out high bar last night and it certainly feels different. I can see why the cue on HB is 'straight down' rather than reach back. It feels much more vertical (and yes I know LB should be vertical over mid-foot!). On the down side the bar seems to just perch ontop of you, whereas with LB it's rammed in there and pinned in place. LB feels much better and stable to me. I did 10x90kg to get a starting figure and I'll take my 5\3\1 numbers from there.

I think that 5\3\1 does seem to lack frequency. It appears that certain moves really require frequency to get the numbers moving (squat, press, chins). I've wondered about taking out the assistance squat on the deadlift day and repeating the main squat lift. I very much doubt it'd hamper recovery. I'm sticking with my programme for now but it's an option for the future. When you think the intermediate Texas method is 5x5 volume day and 5x1 intensity day in the same week, remaping up to one set of five reps in a week on 5\3\1 is really low for an intermediate, but probably OK for elite.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I do low bar on the work sets and high bar on the assistance sets (100Kg 5x10)
> 
> As for progress I'm using the original 5/3/1 and you only add 5Kg to the Squat/Deadlift and 2.5Kg to the upper body lifts every month/cycle.
> 
> and yes you do mess around with your programs and think too much


Ya I add the same weights as you Doug, its just the sudden jump but it seems to work on every other lift so the program obviously works.

I said to a mate the other day if my 21year old self ever met me he kick my **** for being a pussy. Just get under the bar and lift the bloody weight. Its going to be hard otherwise every man and his dog would be squatting 200kg.

Im making progress on deadlifts at the moment as I have decided on a technique and I do the same every single workout. Just lift the bloody weight, simples.



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm still not using my belt and lifting feels very comfortable, is it possible to go to 230Kgx1 for the Squat and Deadlift and still be safe?
> 
> :thumb:


I been reading some of Lift Run Bang's Article's written by an English guy called Paul. He never uses a belt unless he's competing in a meet and he says its the best thing he ever did. And his latest posting had him repping 550lb (250kg) so pretty strong guy.


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> I tried out high bar last night and it certainly feels different. I can see why the cue on HB is 'straight down' rather than reach back. It feels much more vertical (and yes I know LB should be vertical over mid-foot!). On the down side the bar seems to just perch ontop of you, whereas with LB it's rammed in there and pinned in place. LB feels much better and stable to me. I did 10x90kg to get a starting figure and I'll take my 531 numbers from there.
> 
> I think that 531 does seem to lack frequency. It appears that certain moves really require frequency to get the numbers moving (squat, press, chins). I've wondered about taking out the assistance squat on the deadlift day and repeating the main squat lift. I very much doubt it'd hamper recovery. I'm sticking with my programme for now but it's an option for the future. When you think the intermediate Texas method is 5x5 volume day and 5x1 intensity day in the same week, remaping up to one set of five reps in a week on 531 is really low for an intermediate, but probably OK for elite.


I totally agree LB feels much more stable and HB feels like its not locked in but LB is very uncomfortable for me due to my buggered shoulder so thought I would ave a play. Also read a few articles that say people with short legs and long torso should high bar but that doesnt make sense to me as body style should be more upright than a long leg short torso person. Anyway Im going to stick with LB but widen my hands slightly so it takes pressure off my shoulder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I totally agree LB feels much more stable and HB feels like its not locked in but LB is very uncomfortable for me due to my buggered shoulder so thought I would ave a play. Also read a few articles that say people with short legs and long torso should high bar but that doesnt make sense to me as body style should be more upright than a long leg short torso person. Anyway Im going to stick with LB but widen my hands slightly so it takes pressure off my shoulder.


LB on the heavies seems more stable to me too :thumb: As for width, I grip the bar so that my little finger just touches those little smooth rings on the bar :thumb:

Light de loads only this week


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1 - De load week 

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 55KGX5 - 68.5KGX5 - 82KGX5

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 60KGx3x3x3x3x3*

I have decided to make the first day of the de load week a bit more interesting from now on by taking the second bench press group away and adding power cleans after the barbell row, I really felt the workload, especially in my arms and hamstrings, loving the power clean! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> LB on the heavies seems more stable to me too :thumb: As for width, I grip the bar so that my little finger just touches those little smooth rings on the bar :thumb:
> 
> Light de loads only this week


I had my 2nd finger in from my little finger on that smooth ring but I have such little flexibility on my right shoulder that standing with just the bar is one hell of a stretch. A hugh number of power lifters grip with a wide grip so I'm going to try this and see if I can take some stress off my shoulders and chest.

Monday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 42.5x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x5) 67.5x5, 80x5, 90x10 PM 120kg
Incline Bench Press: 45x10, 55x10, 62.5x10
Over Hand Chin Ups: 6x2, 3x3, 1x2 Inbetween all pressing sets
Kroc Rows: 32.5x 20, 20
Skull Crushers: 45x 6, 6, 6

Bench Felt quite easy but it should considering I done 100kg x 10 reps last week but I have decided to stick to my rep ranges as this hurt my shoulder. My shoulder is still clicking about 2" off my chest on every single rep.

Incline went great but can tell Im a tricep bencher and even on Incline its my triceps that are killing by the end, not my tris.

Chin Ups felt great. Would love to get to a decent chin up number over the next few months but Im still happy as didnt used to be able to do any overhand.

I hate Kroc rows but I know that they are so good for you so will keep them in my program.

Love skull crushers, that awsome pump that they give your tris and make them feel twice as thick. Can only help my bench and OHP strengthening my Tris


----------



## Oats

Couple of videos for variety:

James - This is a good demonstration of the high-bar 'balance' mentioned above. Try this low bar!!





Doug - MobilityWod on hamstring tears.





And a new oly lift progression for me to try!


----------



## Bod42

Oats said:


> Couple of videos for variety:
> James - This is a good demonstration of the high-bar 'balance' mentioned above. Try this low bar!!


That is totally insane.

But this is kind of what I was talking about, low bar does feel more locked in but you still need your arms and hands to hold it there, high bar, as proven by the video, may not feel so tight but sits there all on its own.

Thats California Strength, been watching a lot of their videos lately and makes me want to do Oly training.

And as their videos prove you can squat some serious weights high bar. The locgical side of my brain tells me there is about 1" difference so do what ever you like and feels better. Its still a squat at the end of the day.

Tuesday Workout:
Squats: (WU 60x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) 100x5, 115x5, 130x5 PM 151.5kg
Straight Leg Deadlifts: 60x10, 70x10, 82.5x10
Glute-Ham Raises: BWx 6, 6, 6
Ab Roll Outs: 8, 8, 4

So I widened my grip and should have probably done this along time ago, I just felt a lot more comfortable under the bar and didnt lose any upper back tightness. I squatted more downwards which definitely feels weird but keeps my torso at a better angle. I complain I'm not getting any stronger but I'm litrally squatting as deep as I can so well below parallel. The 5 was below what I can do but I dont want to be grinding out reps so followed Doug's advice and will be doing just the prescibed reps and I have already done this months ago on my deadlifts and it seems to be working. Having open ended rep goals just doesnt work for me.

SLDs combined with GHR is a hamstring killer.

All in all a good workout.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Couple of videos for variety:
> 
> James - This is a good demonstration of the high-bar 'balance' mentioned above. Try this low bar!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Doug - MobilityWod on hamstring tears.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And a new oly lift progression for me to try!


Nice links Col :thumb: I'll look over tonight mate


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1 - De load week

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 74KGX5 - 92.5KGX5 - 111KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1 - De load week

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 30KGX5 - 36KGX5 - 43KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL CURL 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 8 - 5/3/1 - De load week.

*DEADLIFT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 75KGX5 - 95KGX5 - 110KGX5

DEADLIFT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEANS 70Kgx3x3*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Thursday Wokrout (Done Friday)
Med Ball Shoulder Throws: 3x5
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) 42.5x5, 50x5, 56x7 PM 69kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+2.5x10
Neutral Grips Chins: 6x3, 3x4, 1x3
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x 8, 8, 8

All in all a good workout. At this weight Seated Shoulder Press is proving to be a problem not from a strength perspective but I need to ancor my feet and there is nothing in the rack to do this with so I just have to push my feet into the side of the rack really hard but this only goes so far.

Dips felt really easy and 3 sets of 10 gives you an awesome pump in your arms, shoulders and chest.

I stalled the last few weeks on Chin Ups which is dissappointing but Im not going to major in the minor, its great additional back work.

I used to like Pendlay Rows on 5x5 but they are a different animal when your lats are exhausted from Chin Ups.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90.5KGX5 - 104.5KGX5 - 118.5KGX2!!!!!!!!!!! 

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Fail on the last work set, only managed two  reps. Cant complain though, I think this is the first sticking point for more months than I can remember  possibly caused by the two week break last cycle due to the flu, who knows 

I'll try this weeks bench routine next week and if I fail again go back to cycle 8 weights for my bench and keep pushing until I get my 5 reps.

Lift on! :thumb:

Power cleans felt good


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday Workout
Bench Press: (WU 42.5x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) WO 72.5x3, 85x3, 95x8 PM 120.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 55x8, 62.5x8, 72.5x6
Over Hand Chin Ups: 6x2, 4x3
Kroc Rows: Skipped
Skull Crushers: 50 x 6, 6, 6

All in all a good workout, hit all my reps. Seems a pretty easy workout as I'm probably about 3-4 reps below my max reps but there is no point screwing up my shoulder so I'm just going to slowly progress and not grind at all.

Had some bad news today so was pissed off so did 50kg skull crushers and during them I managed to rip my upper back which made me more annoyed so finished my set. How on earth do you rip your upper back during Skull crushers


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> How on earth do you rip your upper back during Skull crushers


Just how I felt when I tore a hamstring doing barbell rows...WTF.... then  as hell!

Go mad on the ice for a few days mate, it does make a HUGE difference :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Just how I felt when I tore a hamstring doing barbell rows...WTF.... then  as hell!
> 
> Go mad on the ice for a few days mate, it does make a HUGE difference :thumb:


Ya but at least during a bend over row the Hamstrings are at least in some sort of tension, I was laying on a bench. Felt it go got very  off and stupidly finished my set and another 2 :wall:

Yep icing it all the time as I have squats tomorrow and really dont want to miss them but doubt its going to happen


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 123.5KGX5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 48KGX5 - 55.5KGX5 - 63KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 5KGx10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Decided to do Fridays workout today


----------



## Oats

Got a long standing goal tonight  Deadlift of 150kgx3. I remember 100kg being a landmark. I've never reset it and is good to see slow but relentlees improvement. 

Next goal is 150kg of wieght plus the 20kg bar for 170kg. That would give me double body weight :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Got a long standing goal tonight  Deadlift of 150kgx3. I remember 100kg being a landmark. I've never reset it and is good to see slow but relentlees improvement.
> 
> Next goal is 150kg of wieght plus the 20kg bar for 170kg. That would give me double body weight :thumb:


Go for it Col!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 123.5KGX5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 (Week 1 bench session repeated due to a fail on reps last week)

Week 1 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90.5KGX5 - 104.5KGX5 - 118.5KGX5 YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Made the 5 reps this time  Had to HATE the weights!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 9

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) -133KGX3 - 152KGX3 - 171KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Pleased with workout, squat starting to feel difficult, progress may slow from here on in.

So many views on this thread, yet so few posters.


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Go for it Col!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:


Oh it will happen  Have you watched the CT Fletcher videos on Youtube? 'I command you to grow'. Watch his 'I challenge you CT Fletcher' one. It's great for getting a bit of fire in your belly :devil:

Sets across on high bar last night at 100kg. I'm faintly appalled that it's now a third less than my squat. Between my back and my knee, my squat has gone nowhere for ages. High bar does seem better for stopping my knees moving back though. So in deference to my meniscus and lower back, I'm going high bar for now. Have to see if 5\3\1 frequency is enough to progress my squat.


----------



## Bod42

I'm still working out but lost my job the other day so that means I also lost my laptop and its a PITA to post by Mobil.

Will update when I can tho as I haven't missed a weight in ages so training is going well


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I'm still working out but lost my job the other day so that means I also lost my laptop and its a PITA to post by Mobil.
> 
> Will update when I can tho as I haven't missed a weight in ages so training is going well


Sorry to hear you've lost your job mate, I hope all turns out well for you very soon.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 52KGX3 - 59KGX3 - 66.5KGX3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+10KGx5x5x5x5x5

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good so far.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 133KGX3 - 152KGX3 - 171KGX3*

Very happy about this workout, I have been worried about it since yesterday. This is the weight I tore my hamstring the second time around 

But it went well so I'm happy  :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Very happy about this workout, I have been worried about it since yesterday. This is the weight I tore my hamstring the second time around


I imagine it felt like you were walking on glass for each rep.

Deload week this week for me.

Doing 80% main lift (and no assistance work). 
Ten minutes working on cleans to eradicate bending arms. 
Finish off with meabolic conditioning circuit that we learnt on the strength camp. :devil:

For example:
30 seconds on\off (or when I'm feeling energetic 45secs on\15 off) with 1 min rest between each ciruit.
1. Barbell thrusters or overhead lunges
2. Chins or 45 degree bench rows
3. Plyo box jumps (made with scrap wood from neighbours attic conversion :speechles)
4. Gym ring pull ups (feet against wall, lay back to 45 degrees. Move feet away from wall to make easier)
5. Man-makers (burpess with bumbells held between legs and do a press up at bottom)

The main thing is to plan are moves that are non-technical and whole body. I've gone for retracticon to offset my normal pressing volume, and change of height moves for mobility. I try to do a circuit (5mins) twice a week, upping it to three circuits (15 minutes) every session on deload week. Takes a lot less time than hill sprints, not dependent on daylight and doesn't aggravate my back :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> I imagine it felt like you were walking on glass for each rep.


Yep! 

Week 2 (Out of sync on bench by a week) Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 97.5KGX3 - 111.5KGX3 - 125.5KGX2 FAIL! (Only managed 2 reps last cycle, thought it was just a glitch, I will re do this cycle 9 bench routine next cycle and get back into sync :thumb

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Wasn't surprised I failed to get 3 reps on the last bench set today, as soon as I looked back at the last cycles numbers I realised that I have jumped 5kg in two cycles and not made the 3 reps, although making 2 reps is still good :thumb

Lift on! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Dam pleased with the 180.5x1, no hamstring issue....yet  20kg to go!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1 (Done last night)

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 55.5KGX5 - 63KGX3 - 70KGX1

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

The 70x1 felt that good that I nearly followed it with a 80x1, but thought best to stick to the program 

:tumbleweed: Posting on this thread feels a little like talking to one's self! :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 9 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Good end to a good cycle :thumb:

Next week is de load week


----------



## Oats

Finished deload session at the weekend. Enjoyed the metabolic circuits and hope doing them twice a week until next deload means I'll move my conditioning forward each cycle.

Been doing some reading on the train about nutrition. Not entirely clear on the protein refractory period\ refractory protein synthesis but it's starting to make sense. Might move to meals around every 5 hours with BCAA+waxy maize inbetween. Need to understand it more first.


----------



## Bod42

Still here and still working out but limited access to a computer right now but I will summarize my best lifts from the last month so the message isnt massive.

Bench Press: 92.5x10 PM 123.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 77.5x5 PM 90.5kg
Skull Crushers: 52x3x6

Squats: 135x5 PM 157.5kg

Seated Shoulder Press: 57x7 PM 70.5kg
Dips: BW+27.5x5 PM 154.5kg

Deadlifts: 150x5 PM 175kg
Front Squats: 100x5 PM 116.5kg

Havent missed a rep this entire cycle so very happy with progress.

At the moment my rep goals are
5/3/1 on Squats and Deadlifts
10/8/6 on Bench Press
7/5/3 on Shoulder Press

I like higher reps on Bench Press as my shoulder is buggered and the higher reps keep the weight down slightly. Shoulder Press are slightly higher as I dont believe doing just 1 set of 1 rep does much for building strength or muscle. I have kept the reps low on Deads annd Squats as a lot of it is mental and I want to get my body used to moving heavy weights. No point being able to do 140kg for 10 reps and then struggle to do 1 rep with 150kg


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Seated Shoulder Press: 57x7 PM 70.5kg


Not sure why you've gone with seated press but it reminds me of a variation that they had us doing on the course. Kneeling dumbell press. I asked why and they said they prefer them to seated press as it activates your core but also prevents the excessive layback that you can do when standing.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 10 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90.5KGX5 - 104.5KGX5 - 118.5KGX5

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 75KGx3x3x3x3x3*

I put 150kg on the bar after the whole bench session which was a bit daft as I was already pre exhausted :tumbleweed: wanted to get a feel for the weight  It felt heavy :devil:

According to my workout schedule im already on target for 139.5kg x 1 for my bench, which leaves me 10.5kg to go! :thumb: Only time will tell though 

Power cleans are the daddy!!! Looking forward to getting 100kg on the bar :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Still here and still working out but limited access to a computer right now but I will summarize my best lifts from the last month so the message isnt massive.
> 
> Bench Press: 92.5x10 PM 123.5kg
> Incline Bench Press: 77.5x5 PM 90.5kg
> Skull Crushers: 52x3x6
> 
> Squats: 135x5 PM 157.5kg
> 
> Seated Shoulder Press: 57x7 PM 70.5kg
> Dips: BW+27.5x5 PM 154.5kg
> 
> Deadlifts: 150x5 PM 175kg
> Front Squats: 100x5 PM 116.5kg
> 
> Havent missed a rep this entire cycle so very happy with progress.
> 
> At the moment my rep goals are
> 5/3/1 on Squats and Deadlifts
> 10/8/6 on Bench Press
> 7/5/3 on Shoulder Press
> 
> I like higher reps on Bench Press as my shoulder is buggered and the higher reps keep the weight down slightly. Shoulder Press are slightly higher as I dont believe doing just 1 set of 1 rep does much for building strength or muscle. I have kept the reps low on Deads annd Squats as a lot of it is mental and I want to get my body used to moving heavy weights. No point being able to do 140kg for 10 reps and then struggle to do 1 rep with 150kg


If your upper body is susceptible to issues James I would move over to doing a 10 rep version for all body parts/lifts of the workout for 6 months.

Sometimes mate you just have to accept that HEAVY doesn't suite you. Mix it up to give the body time to heal :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 10 - 5/3/1 (Done yesterday)

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 127KGX5 - 146KGX5 - 166KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 110KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Squat starting to get difficult now :thumb:

Upped the calf raise from 100 to 110kg and took 30-60 seconds rest between sets, I will keep adding 10kg per month to get to 200kg, if my balance allows and stay at that weight.

Might get hold of some lorry straps so I can perform the exercises safer :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 10 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 57KGX5 - 65KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+10KGx6x6x6x6x6

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good progress, work set weights dont feel difficult enough to be doing much to increase strength yet, I rekon over the next two cycles they will :thumb:

Considering a different approach to the dips with a possibilty of doing some heavy 5 rep work each cycle.

:devil:


----------



## Oats

Unscheduled week off from lifting. Too busy at start of week. Then spent end of the week in the Lake District making most of the weather and getting in some good hills. Thank god first session tomorrow is pressing as my legs ain't gonna be able to squat for a while!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 10 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) -127KGX5 -146KGX5 - 166KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 75KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Have increased all warm up weights for all my workouts as of this cycle :thumb:

Time to get back outside and catch some rays!


----------



## Bod42

So I completed another cycle of 5/3/1 and brought a laptop so can start updating again.

Bench Press: 92.5x11 PM 126.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 77.5x5 PM 90.5kg
Skull Crushers: 54x3x6

Squats: 150x2 PM 160kg

Seated Shoulder Press: 60.5x5 PM 70.5kg
Dips: BW+30x5 PM 157.5kg

Deadlifts: 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
Front Squats: 102.5x5 PM 119.5kg

I hit every rep and goal in this cycle so cant complain. Every thing is feeling good, I just need to man up and lift the bloody weight. My form is good so I just keep everything the same from now and smash the weights.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 65x5, 82.5x5, 97.5x3) 105x5, 122.5x5, 137.5x5 PM 160.5kg
Stiff Leg Deadlifts: 62.5x10, 72.5x10, 87.5x10
GHR: BW x 6, 6, 6 plus pulses at the top of last rep.
Ab Roll Outs: Red Band x 9, 9, 9

Good workout, hit all my reps so cant complain. Hamstring were really sore the day after so the SLDs and GHRs must be hitting the right spot.

Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 40x3) 45x5, 51x5, 58x7 PM 71.5kg
Dips: BW x 10, BW x 10, BW+7.5 x 10
Neutral Grip Chins: 2x3, 8x4 between all pushing sets
Pendlay Rows: 70 x 8, 8, 8
EZ Bar Curls: 35 x 6, 6, 6

One of the best workouts I've had lately, all my warm ups felt light and fast, checked my last warm up and work weight about 3 times to make sure they were right. All I changed is trying to explode my warm ups so its like speed work before my sets. Chin Ups super setted with dips and then pendlay rows gives you an insane pump, feels great.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 120x5, 140x5, 157.5x5 PM 183.5kg
Front Box Squat: 62.5x10, 72.5x10, 85x10
Good Mornings: 50x3x10
Reverse Crunches

Another week completely and every rep completed. I'm finally starting to get back to where I was quite awhile back with my weights. I'm really pleased with the way deadlifts are feelings. I'm also loving the Simple Strength Template, just having those secondary big exercises feels great, especially incline bench and front squats.

I have a new drive for the gym at the moment due to one of the guys I'm training progressing so well and me wanting to stay ahead of him so I'm really hitting it hard, attacking all warm ups with maximum speed and really attacking the work weights. I can do these workouts easy, I have just had no drive and been a pussy really.

Anyway the guy I'm training has hit a 1.5 BW squat within 4 months of training. Thats good for the rugby players I used to train but this guy has never played a sport or been to the gym in his life and he sits behind a desk 9-5 so its even more impressive.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Re doing the third week of cycle 8 as I'm off training again next week (family down all week) and I've hit a bit of a plateau on my bench Press.

Todays 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) -103KGX5 - 116.5KGX3 - 130KGX1*

All weights felt easy TBH, I think my form has been lax in regards to breathing and keeping the body rigid while doing my bench over the last two cycles. Today I keep it nice and strict and the weights and 130x1 went up not problem.

I will continue to add more weight to my dips to help with Triceps power.

Lift on!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb::devil:


----------



## Bod42

Couple of Catch Up Workouts
Bench Press: (45x5, 55x5, 65x3) 77.5x3, 87.5x3, 100x8 PM 126.5kg
Incline Press: 57.5x8, 67.5x8, 75x7
Over Hand Chins: 1x2, 9x3
Dumbell Rows: 45x10
Skull Crushers: 55x 6, 6, 5

Squats: (65x5, 82.5x5, 87.5x3) 112,5x3, 130x3, 147.5x3 PM 162
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 72.5x8, 85x8, 97.5x6

Seated Shoulder Press: (27.5x5, 35x5, 40x3) 47.5x3, 55x3, 61x5 PM 71kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+7.5x8, BW+22.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 1x3, 9x4

Deadlifts: (75x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) 130x3, 147.5x3, 167.5x3
Front Squats: 72.5x8, 85x8, 97.5x6
Good Mornings: 52.5x3x10

Bench Press: (40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) 77.5x5, 87.5x3, 105x6 PM 126kg
Incline Bench Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x5, 80x5
Over Hand Chins: 10x3
Dumbell Rows: 45x12

Squats: (65x5, 82.5x5, 97.5x3) 122.5x5, 137.5x3, 155x2 PM 165.5kg
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x5


----------



## ITHAQVA

Repeat of Cycle 9 Week 3 until i get back into it after next weeks break.

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX1*

Weights felt good :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Repeat of cycle 9 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 55.5KGX5 - 63KGX3 - 70KGX1 *

The 70kg felt easy TBH but I will stick to the slow/steady progress, I bet the next 30kg wont be so easy.

Marvellous!


----------



## Bod42

Looks like just you and I Doug lol.

Seated Shoulder Press: (27.5x5, 35x5, 40x3) 50x5, 58x3, 64.5x3 PM 71kg
Dips: BWx5, BW+15x5, BW+30x5
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x4 Between each pressing set
Pendlay Rows: 70x3x9

Very pleased with my progress on SP. I was knackered tonight but 3 reps was still quite easy. Ya its slow progress but its constant progress.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Looks like just you and I Doug lol.
> 
> Seated Shoulder Press: (27.5x5, 35x5, 40x3) 50x5, 58x3, 64.5x3 PM 71kg
> Dips: BWx5, BW+15x5, BW+30x5
> Neutral Grip Chins: 10x4 Between each pressing set
> Pendlay Rows: 70x3x9
> 
> Very pleased with my progress on SP. I was knackered tonight but 3 reps was still quite easy. Ya its slow progress but its constant progress.


Yep! Were still here and lifting James :thumb: 

Only the strong survive!!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Repeat of last cycles heavy week 3

*DEADLIFT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX1 *

All felt goooooooooooooooood! :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> Looks like just you and I Doug lol.


Plus me as a half :wave: Just not got much to say. If no one else has bought Beyond 531 I can post a quick overview of the chages (got a long train jouney on Tuesday!)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Plus me as a half :wave: Just not got much to say. If no one else has bought Beyond 531 I can post a quick overview of the chages (got a long train jouney on Tuesday!)


I'm interested in an overview of the new book Col :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I didn't even realise there was a new E-Book but Im very interested.

Hows the Hammy Doug now your lifting some good weight. I'm only 5kg behind on deadlifts now, its strange I have hated deadlifts the entire time I have lifted as I am the most awful build for them but now I like deadlift and don't like squats even tho Im built perfect for squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I didn't even realise there was a new E-Book but Im very interested.
> 
> Hows the Hammy Doug now your lifting some good weight. I'm only 5kg behind on deadlifts now, its strange I have hated deadlifts the entire time I have lifted as I am the most awful build for them but now I like deadlift and don't like squats even tho Im built perfect for squats.


Hammy is fine now mate, I'm confident I could lift the 230 now but don't want to go too fast, I'm happy to just add 5kg per month as per 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Afternoon chaps, after finishing the rugby season i've been to the gym 5 days a week, all weights no cardio, pretty rubbish diet but you only live once!

Preseason starts tomorrow, twice a week and so stronglifts is going to fit nicely in between!

Been feeling quite strong in the gym, wonder if I will last 5x5 though!!!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hammy is fine now mate, I'm confident I could lift the 230 now but don't want to go too fast, I'm happy to just add 5kg per month as per 5/3/1 :thumb:


Good to hear mate. I have to go back to the UK in Oct for my Bro's wedding so I arranged a little power lifting comp between a few friends, nothing serious just see what we can do after training for a while. Hoping to hit 220kg deadlift so 5 plates on either side, 185kg squat, 140kg Bench Press. Bench shows how weak my squat is though especially as I don't even train Bench properly now due to my shoulder, I'm just built to bench press though.



jonnyMercUK said:


> Afternoon chaps, after finishing the rugby season i've been to the gym 5 days a week, all weights no cardio, pretty rubbish diet but you only live once!
> 
> Preseason starts tomorrow, twice a week and so stronglifts is going to fit nicely in between!
> 
> Been feeling quite strong in the gym, wonder if I will last 5x5 though!!!


Stronglifts and Pre-Season will be hell, your be a legend if you get through it. Your body takes a lot of stress from the hits in rugby coupled with squats 3 times a week is a massive amount of stress. I done it before but your diet and sleep have to be spot on and I didn't do it for long unitl I changed to the 5/3/1 or defranco 2 day per week in season program that they prescribe.

Good to hear all weights no cardio, exactly what I used to do with my rugby players. You lose weight and strength during the season so that needs to be put back and hopefully more.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

I'm hoping there won't be any contact for a while, I have a feeling it will be flipping tyres and circuits etc


----------



## Oats

Quick overview of Beyond 531

Beyond takes it as given that you've got 531 and gets straight to the action. There are dozens and dozens of variations and templates including a full year programme showing how to mix and match them. I found 521 formatting a bit confusing seeing where one variant finished and another starts. Beyond is the same. The bases of 531 is big lifts, start light, progress slow, set PRs. Notice that reps, percentages and assistance work arent in that list.

Standout things for me were:

*Cycles* - complete two cycles then deload. Not deload every fourth week. This applies accross the board 
*Pyramid* - could work up then down the sets (5 in total). Go for PR on top and last set. 
*First Set Last* - do first set again after heaviest set for amrap. Or do first set last for 3-5 sets for 5-8 reps.
*Joker sets* - after last set add ten percent and do that sessions reps (5,3,or1), then add another ten percent and do reps again. Keep doing reps and sets until just shy of faliure. I think this may be OK when you're hitting high reps but not so good if you're only just getting the required reps. 
*Superset* - everywhere and anywhere if you wish (my words!) 
*Combine these things* .eg. normal session with supersets of face pulls, then joker sets with chins, then First Set Last with curls superset. 
Calls First Set Last with Joker Sets a *' magic bullet*' for those short on volume. 
*Five different de-load* week options with diffeernt sets and reps according to how you feel.

*Issues*
My main conjecrn with the book is that there is so many variations it feels that you can do pretty much anything and call it 531. As noted above, the principles dont touch on reps and sets and feels to me like an overload on variations. Probably a reflection of how many people he now coaches and can trial things with. For example, boring but big has about eight variations such as twice a week, opposite to manlift, 50 reps, eight week challenge, 5/10, 5/3, 5/3.

I misunderstood 531. I added 5lb\10lb to each set each cycle. In 531 he emphatically says NOT to do this but add it to the Training Max. Looking at forums it seems that this can lead to some cycles being at the same weight as last time with PRs delivering progress. With Beyond and Joker and First Set in particular this seems to make more sense especially with two back to back cycles. I think it also gives more options for your squats with volume which seemed to be a common issue with 531.

I'll be going back over my numbers and refreshing them as I'm just making the reps and it seems my TM is my actual max and not 90%.

It's $25 when 531 was $20  However, I'd still say it was well worth the cost and will probably be something to dip in and out of for ideas for quite a while.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Quick overview of Beyond 531
> 
> Beyond takes it as given that you've got 531 and gets straight to the action. There are dozens and dozens of variations and templates including a full year programme showing how to mix and match them. I found 521 formatting a bit confusing seeing where one variant finished and another starts. Beyond is the same. The bases of 531 is big lifts, start light, progress slow, set PRs. Notice that reps, percentages and assistance work arent in that list.
> 
> Standout things for me were:
> 
> *Cycles* - complete two cycles then deload. Not deload every fourth week. This applies accross the board
> *Pyramid* - could work up then down the sets (5 in total). Go for PR on top and last set.
> *First Set Last* - do first set again after heaviest set for amrap. Or do first set last for 3-5 sets for 5-8 reps.
> *Joker sets* - after last set add ten percent and do that sessions reps (5,3,or1), then add another ten percent and do reps again. Keep doing reps and sets until just shy of faliure. I think this may be OK when you're hitting high reps but not so good if you're only just getting the required reps.
> *Superset* - everywhere and anywhere if you wish (my words!)
> *Combine these things* .eg. normal session with supersets of face pulls, then joker sets with chins, then First Set Last with curls superset.
> Calls First Set Last with Joker Sets a *' magic bullet*' for those short on volume.
> *Five different de-load* week options with diffeernt sets and reps according to how you feel.
> 
> *Issues*
> My main conjecrn with the book is that there is so many variations it feels that you can do pretty much anything and call it 531. As noted above, the principles dont touch on reps and sets and feels to me like an overload on variations. Probably a reflection of how many people he now coaches and can trial things with. For example, boring but big has about eight variations such as twice a week, opposite to manlift, 50 reps, eight week challenge, 5/10, 5/3, 5/3.
> 
> I misunderstood 531. I added 5lb10lb to each set each cycle. In 531 he emphatically says NOT to do this but add it to the Training Max. Looking at forums it seems that this can lead to some cycles being at the same weight as last time with PRs delivering progress. With Beyond and Joker and First Set in particular this seems to make more sense especially with two back to back cycles. I think it also gives more options for your squats with volume which seemed to be a common issue with 531.
> 
> I'll be going back over my numbers and refreshing them as I'm just making the reps and it seems my TM is my actual max and not 90%.
> 
> It's $25 when 531 was $20  However, I'd still say it was well worth the cost and will probably be something to dip in and out of for ideas for quite a while.


Thanks for the overview Col :thumb:

Looks to me that this book does what most of us would do anyway in regards to adding variation to our workouts.

IMHO I think the original 5/3/1 with BBB assistance is basically all you will ever need. You could consider training to failure on the last couple of sets on the BBB work. Its also a good idea to increase the weight used on the BBB sets by 2.5Kg per month periodically as long as it doesn't effect your recovery and progress on the work sets, or if your feeling particularly mad try the plate strip method to failure on every set :doublesho :devil: :thumb:

The big lifts combined with the progressive overload principle is all you need, honest! 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

LOL!!

I have already managed to Acquire Beyond 5/3/1 and Elite FTS bench press manual (pdf format)  :thumb:

Isn't the internet a wonderful thing :lol:


----------



## Guest

Worth a read: Increasing Work Capacity


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Looks to me that this book does what most of us would do anyway in regards to adding variation to our workouts.
> ...
> IMHO I think the original 5/3/1 with BBB assistance is basically all you will ever need.


For a general programme I probably agree. It doesn't help with addressing specific weaknesses (and why I'm doing triumvate instead) and is noticable how it works in limited planes of movement when you do other activities\sports. Also, the thought of 5x10 snatches makes me feel due South of VAG 



BareFacedGeek said:


> Worth a read: Increasing Work Capacity


Good link. I find it one of the harder bits to get to grips with in relation to programming. I find it easiest to understand in relation to the Texas Method:

"_The trainee in transition from novice to intermediate is unable to make progress with either a (not sufficiently stressful) workload that he can recover from enough to do 2 to 3 times per week, or conversely, a workload that is stressful enough to induce the stress/recovery/supercompensation cycle but that he cannot recover from quickly enough to be able to do 2 to 3 times per week
...
In the Texas method, the first workout of the week is the "stress" workout, the lighter midweek workout comes during the recovery period, and the last, higher-intensity/lower-volume workout is done when the trainee has recovered enough from the first day to show an increase in performance. Both the Monday and Friday workouts increase in weight each week by 5 pounds. The total weekly training volume and training stress is low enough that as each week begins the trainee has no accumulated fatigue from the previous week, yet the one "stress" workout on Monday is high enough in volume to trigger an adaptation, the heavy single set on Friday provides enough intensity that neuromuscular function is reinforced without fatally upping the volume, and each week produces a small net increase in strength_". [Rip's Practical Programming]

Unfortunatly Texas Method is a ***** to get right and has long workouts and is why I'm looking at 531. I think Beyond recognises the deficiencies in 531 but it's getting pretty complicated to programme 531, first last, and joker sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> the thought of 5x10 snatches makes me feel due South of VAG


I wouldn't do any of the weightlifting moves with so many reps due to loss of technique and possible increase of injury. Hence I do power cleans in sets of 3 reps.

So north of the VAG it is


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 89KGX5 - 103KGX5 - 116.5KGX5

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10
BARBELL ROW 70KGx5x5x5x5x5 Less than 30 seconds rest between sets :devil: :thumb:

*

All good :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 120KGx10x10x10x10x10*

The 170Kg Squat felt better than expected, but I think progress on the 5 rep week will be increasingly difficult. I think a 200kgx1 squat would probably feel much easier.

:devil::devil: Its pretty hot down here to train today :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 11

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 51KGX5 - 59KGX5 - 67KGX5 *

Main work sets only today

The 67x5 was difficult on the last rep :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 11

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGX10x10x10x10x10

BODY WEIGHT JUMPS x3x3x3x3x3*

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

Been trying First Set Last and Joker sets. Bit hit and miss, and I think Beyond still feels a bit of a buggers muddle.

Deadlift - I was just getting reps so lowered TM from 155kg and did 130x10 last week, 140x8 this week. Not sure if this will work out but I'm trying to get the balance of volume and intensity and think it was too little previously.

Squats - Last week did FSL after squattign session. Felt OK. This week did FSL weights after deadlifts I'll be doing later in the week for the 3 rep squats. Trying to break the long 9 day break between squatting and use a bit more weight than a 5x10. I'm not sure about the percentages though. I thought less than 80% didn't do much and these are 70-75%. On the plus side, I've re-set because of my knee constatntly for the last 12 motnhs and these sub-max weights are helping. My technique is good and my knee is just sore enough that I can mash it with the lacrosse ball and feel good to go in 48 hours. Feels like it just about the right rate of stress and adaptation :thumb:

Also, have you seen the suggested rest periods he puts in the sample session?! Jeezus. This is presumably supersetting as well

*Warm--‐up …*
235 x 5 reps
285 x 3 reps
335 x 1rep
350 x 3 reps
400 x 3 reps
450 x 5 (PR set)
*Take 5--‐10 minute break*
500 x 3 reps
525 for 1 rep
*Take 5 minute break*
3--‐5 sets of 8 reps at 350


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Been trying First Set Last and Joker sets. Bit hit and miss, and I think Beyond still feels a bit of a buggers muddle.
> 
> Deadlift - I was just getting reps so lowered TM from 155kg and did 130x10 last week, 140x8 this week. Not sure if this will work out but I'm trying to get the balance of volume and intensity and think it was too little previously.
> 
> Squats - Last week did FSL after squattign session. Felt OK. This week did FSL weights after deadlifts I'll be doing later in the week for the 3 rep squats. Trying to break the long 9 day break between squatting and use a bit more weight than a 5x10. I'm not sure about the percentages though. I thought less than 80% didn't do much and these are 70-75%. On the plus side, I've re-set because of my knee constatntly for the last 12 motnhs and these sub-max weights are helping. My technique is good and my knee is just sore enough that I can mash it with the lacrosse ball and feel good to go in 48 hours. Feels like it just about the right rate of stress and adaptation :thumb:
> 
> Also, have you seen the suggested rest periods he puts in the sample session?! Jeezus. This is presumably supersetting as well
> 
> *Warm--‐up …*
> 235 x 5 reps
> 285 x 3 reps
> 335 x 1rep
> 350 x 3 reps
> 400 x 3 reps
> 450 x 5 (PR set)
> *Take 5--‐10 minute break*
> 500 x 3 reps
> 525 for 1 rep
> *Take 5 minute break*
> 3--‐5 sets of 8 reps at 350


I wouldn't worry too much if your only hitting the minimum reps on 5/3/1 Col, that's all I've ever done to keep energy/strength for the rest of the workout :thumb:

I've read beyond 5/3/1 and must say its not something I'll be trying until reaching my goals (190kg squat and Deadlift next week, wish me luck! )

There is so much you can do to the original 5/3/1 and still make it one of the most effective routines out there, once you read many of the ElitFTS manuals you can see that the 5/3/1 takes a lot of its methods from older training programs. The 3 weeks on one off seems tied in with central nervous system restrictions noted on the "Max Effort" principle whilst using 90% of max weights, although the variation in reps and weight percentages allows you to train for much longer before reaching a sticking point and I can see why it is incorporated in the original 5/3/1.

Original 5/3/1 For the Win


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 11

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 96KGX3 - 109.5KGX3 - 123KGX1 <<<<<!!!! 

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 80KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Good workout except for the main work set, its been very hot and I felt drained and a little doubt crept into the old nut. Never the less I have been struggling for the last 3 cycles on my bench on week 1 5x85% and week 2 3x90%. Its really weird as week 3 1x95% feels almost easy 

I'm going to read my Elitfts manuals tonight and see if there is something I can do different just to get past this silly sticking point ( I'm being drawn to the max effort principle :devil

Still hungry for my 150x1 on my bench :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 130KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Cracking workout, I hope to keep progressing and be squatting 200kgx1 in two cycles time, as long as everything holds together  :doublesho

I'm really undecided about how heavy to go on my squat  200kgx1 is my initial goal, but I would love to do 230kgx1. I also want to start going heavy on my standing calf raise (SCR) at some point once I've reached my squat goal max, however the days of 400kilo plus SCR are long gone. I wouldn't mind going 230kg max by using the 5/3/1 routine as though the SCR was a main lift :thumb:

If only my bloody bench press was progressing as well, I feel that the work sets before the main set are pre exhausting my upper body. I'm working on a bench max effort routine for next cycle just to make things interesting


----------



## Oats

What would be x2 BW?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> What would be x2 BW?


For me: between 210 - 214Kg :thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> For me: between 210 - 214Kg :thumb:


Seem a shame not to get that then. Or loose 7kg of body weight to make it 200kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Seem a shame not to get that then. Or loose 7kg of body weight to make it 200kg


:doublesho  I'm big boned!:lol:

I'll aim for x2 BW squat :thumb: if I can do 200 I'm sure 210 wont be that much harder (famous last words!!!!!) :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 55KGX3 - 63KGX3 - 71KGX3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+10KGx8x8x8x8x8

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Workout was done in 28 degree heat :devil: was hard going but completed a full session, Dips were especially hard today.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

BODYWEIGHT JUMPS (less than 30 seconds rest between sets) 5x5x5x5x5*

Very pleased with workout :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nice Goals Doug, I really want a 2xBW squat, it just sounds really cool. I've always wanted 220kg squat and 250kg Deadlift. I didn't give a crap about Bench but 150kg sounds so cool so may see what happens.

Anyway quick summary.
Bench: 107.5x7 PM 132.5kg
Incline Bench: 82.55 PM 96kg
Kroc Rows: 45x18

Squats: 142.5x5 PM 166kg

Seated Shoulder Press: 62x5 PM 72.5kg
Dips: BW+30x6 PM 168kg
Shull Crushers: 60x6

Deadlifts: 170x3 PM 187kg
Front Box Squats: 107.5x5 PM 125.5kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice Goals Doug, I really want a 2xBW squat, it just sounds really cool. I've always wanted 220kg squat and 250kg Deadlift. I didn't give a crap about Bench but 150kg sounds so cool so may see what happens.


It all depends on weather the old body holds together :doublesho:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103KGX5 - 116.5KGX3 - 130KGX1

BENCH PRESS (Pause at bottom on each rep :devil 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10*

Good workout. the 130kg bench as usual went up relatively easy :thumb:

I'm doing the assistance bench in a very slow style and allowing a slight pause at the bottom of each rep, makes it harder and I'm hoping this style of lift will help with my work set bench press and get me past this sticking point. Many years ago all my bench work started from the bottom of the lift, allowing me to bench 180kg. I don't think for one moment I'll ever do that weight again but hope it will help in my attempt at a 150kgx1 :thumb:

Barbell row done slow and allowing the barbell to rest on the floor before each rep, I'm hoping this will also help my bench. This is not a pendlay row :doublesho this style was used well before his name was added to it, I used to use this style row when training in my mid twenties, pains me to admit it but yes even flex magazine got this one right many years ago :doublesho

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

Nearly at end of first three week cycle trying a bit of Beyond out. I've tweaked couple of my TMs as form and numbers were falling off. The heat is really noticeable. Thankfully I don't live in Texas!

Deadlifts - 131x10, 139x8, 147x4
Increased reps over the three weeks by tweaking working max down a little bit. All good with grip being a limiting factor. Followed up each session with First Set Last (FSL) of squats using that week's numbers. Felt good and helped drilling in technique for knees and getting used to high bar.

Squats - TM down to 110kg to get knee improved. All good. Then do FSL and it feels OK. However, I've noticed that this takes a good chunk of energy out of me for when I do my assistance exercises afterwards. Not noticed so much when I follow deadlifts with squat.

I'm going to carry on next three weeks with FSL but will put it right at the end after my assistance work. I can't imagine that 20 minute gap between main lift and LSF will make any difference and it should improve the quality of the assistance work. I'm laying off joker sets for now in order to try and see how FSL changes how things feel.

Interesting observation this week. I started my 5in5 warm-up the other day and felt really creaky. Stopped after first minute as I realised I hadn't done my usual couple of mins of foam roller and lacrosse ball. Started 5in5 again and the difference was huge. They say myofascial\mashing help muscles sheaths glide, and it really did feel exactly like that. Almost like a drop of oil had been put in to a machine. Really surprised me how different it felt as I don't think I've done such a direct back-to-back comparison before.



ITHAQVA said:


> *BENCH PRESS 103KGX5 - 116.5KGX3 - 130KGX1*


*

It always cheers me up to see you benching more than I squat :lol:*


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> It always cheers me up to see you benching more than I squat :lol:


 :lol:

We all have to start somewhere Col :thumb:

Lift on! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX1 :thumb::thumb:

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 120KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Really pleased with this workout, the hamstring held out and I felt no sensation of the old injury. This is a bit of a milestone for me, I haven't lifted this much since I was in my mid twenties/early thirties :thumb:

Its really odd, but the heavy singles feel a dam sight easier than the rep work. I think for me personally they are easier to prepare for mentally than the 5 and 3 rep work sets 

Hate those weights guys!! :devil:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> :lol:
> 
> We all have to start somewhere Col :thumb:
> 
> Lift on! :thumb:


Oy, I started two years ago. Are you saying I've got nowhere?! :tumbleweed::tumbleweed: I like to think my slow squat progress is because I'm nearing my inbuilt genetic potential   Maybe I just need to get T-Nation's latest super-duper-pre-pump-beast-shake-boost. I'm off to get some now :car:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Oy, I started two years ago. Are you saying I've got nowhere?! :tumbleweed::tumbleweed: I like to think my slow squat progress is because I'm nearing my inbuilt genetic potential   Maybe I just need to get T-Nation's latest super-duper-pre-pump-beast-shake-boost. I'm off to get some now :car:


:lol:

Megafuel 2000!!! 50% whey 50% sawdust


----------



## PTR101

Well after seeing this thread a few days ago, I headed over to the StrongLifts.com site, and downloaded the 5x5 program, which i'll start tomorrow morning. I've never done any structured weight lifting before so starting right at the start! Should be fun!

There's alot of abbreviations in this thread which i'll slowly start deciphering as I go along!


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Well after seeing this thread a few days ago, I headed over to the StrongLifts.com site, and downloaded the 5x5 program, which i'll start tomorrow morning. I've never done any structured weight lifting before so starting right at the start! Should be fun!
> 
> There's alot of abbreviations in this thread which i'll slowly start deciphering as I go along!


Welcome to the thread PTR101 :thumb:

Even if I do say this myself, you'll not find a much better powerlifting/strength and even bodybuilding :doublesho thread than right here, other than the big sites of course: stronglifts, starting strength, iron strong and the mighty EliteFTS being theeee daddy 

Hate those weights! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 57KGX5 - 65KGX3 - 72.5KGX1

DIPS: BODYWEIGHT+10KG x9x9x9x9x9

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Starting to get close to my OHP max of years ago, although in the past I never did the OHP but used to press 84Kg behind the neck style for reps, never had shoulder probs with it even though these days it is considered an unhealthy to press from behind the neck  

Dips are becoming hard, My bodyweight is probably not helping (107Kg)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Worth viewing :thumb:

Dave Tate's strength seminar: 33 parts - over 5 hours! :thumb:

http://articles.elitefts.com/tag/max-effort-method/

EliteFTS for the Win


----------



## PTR101

Well first session completed this morning. 
Following the 5x5 program to the letter, I started with an empty barbell, which was really easy, but that means I can only improve! 

Week 1, Day 1

Squat: 20kg 5/5/5/5/5
Bench Press: 20Kg 5/5/5/5/5
Barbell Row: 30kg 5/5/5/5/5


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Well first session completed this morning.
> Following the 5x5 program to the letter, I started with an empty barbell, which was really easy, but that means I can only improve!
> 
> Week 1, Day 1
> 
> Squat: 20kg 5/5/5/5/5
> Bench Press: 20Kg 5/5/5/5/5
> Barbell Row: 30kg 5/5/5/5/5


Slow and steady is the only way :thumb:

What are your goals? strength, size, fitness or all of them?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX1 *

No assistance work today and the 190x1 felt good, still taking it slow as I don't want to tear the Hamstring now I'm so close to my goal :thumb:

De load week next week


----------



## PTR101

ITHAQVA said:


> Slow and steady is the only way :thumb:
> 
> What are your goals? strength, size, fitness or all of them?


Yeah, my main aim is strength. I can run and cycle all day long, but my upper body strength is somewhat lacking.

Looking at the 5x5 spreadsheet, come the 12 week point I should be on for bench and overhead pressing 85% of my body weight. That's a figure WAY over what I can do right now!

Should be on for barbell rowing 100% body weight and squatting 150%

:devil:


----------



## PTR101

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX1 *
> 
> No assistance work today and the 190x1 felt good, still taking it slow as I don't want to tear the Hamstring now I'm so close to my goal :thumb:
> 
> De load week next week


That's incredible! What do you weigh now? What % body weight does it work out as?

(Just for comparison, 190kgs is just over 250% of me)


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Yeah, my main aim is strength. I can run and cycle all day long, but my upper body strength is somewhat lacking.
> 
> Looking at the 5x5 spreadsheet, come the 12 week point I should be on for bench and overhead pressing 85% of my body weight. That's a figure WAY over what I can do right now!
> 
> Should be on for barbell rowing 100% body weight and squatting 150%
> 
> :devil:


Hi PTR101 :wave:

Being able to run and cycle all day has very little to do with strength, this is just endurance and I would be very inclined to say both your upper and lower body lack strength :thumb:

Ultimate strength success comes from the whole body working as one :devil:

Keep your 5x5 goals realistic, there are guys on here that have been on the same weight for nearly 12 months, although your initial strength increases will go up quick until you find your first real plateau :tumbleweed:

Lift on!


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> That's incredible! What do you weigh now? What % body weight does it work out as?
> 
> (Just for comparison, 190kgs is just over 250% of me)


I weight 107Kg @15% - 20% body fat :thumb:

Basic main goals are:

Deadlift 230kgx1
Squat 215x1
Bench 150kgx1
Overhead press 105kgx1

I've been lifting 1 year 9 months and torn my Hamstring twice which put me back around 12 months, but its all part of the learning :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Dawned on me I'm on holiday at end of this week for a fortnight. A shame from a lifting point of view as I feel things are chugging along reasonable well.

Had a good session last night. Had pretty much talked myself out of being able to overhead press 5 x 50kg. But then I just got my head in to it during the sets and by the last set I was ready for war :devil: Cycle before last I did 50kgx3 so it shows my programming for the OHP is right for me. Also, I didn't superset with chins between sets and I wonder if that has something to do with it. Experimentaion required.



ITHAQVA said:


> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 57KGX5 - 65KGX3 - 72.5KGX1 *
> ...
> Starting to get close to my OHP max of years ago,
> 
> Dips are becoming hard, My bodyweight is probably not helping (107Kg)


Looks like we're both about 20kg short of BW press. I feel a competition coming on 

My dips *were* going well with about 20 unweighted then reps of 5-7 with 10kg. Didn't do any last cycle for reasons unknown ( I think I've been spending too long on snatches to fit dips in). I went back to dips the other day and they've fallen off a cliff! Couldn't get 10 unweighted :doublesho Went at them again last night and found I'd stopped getting my shoulders into external rotation with crook of elbow directly forward. Ammended that and did a controlled 5x10 supersetted with rows was good.



PTR101 said:


> Following the 5x5 program to the letter, I started with an empty barbell, which was really easy, but that means I can only improve!


Good look with it :thumb:

Might be worth mentioning a couple of things that seem to often be reasons for stalling:

Do GOMAD or similar calories - you can always loose a bit of weight later if you want to but don't limit progress by going light on food. Have a look at Jordan Feigenbaum's 'To Be a Beat Article' if you don't read his forum on Starting Strength, as it explains it quite well.

No conditioning for first couple of months as it'll interupt recovery.

Tweak sessions to account for ago if you're over 30 and it starts to become a 'mare recovering.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Looks like we're both about 20kg short of BW press. I feel a competition coming on
> 
> Tweak sessions to account for ago if you're over 30 and it starts to become a 'mare recovering.


Unfair, that means I've got to press 107Kg :doublesho 

I'm not so sure about the recovery thing. It's very hard to quantify, I can only think of one week were I actually felt fatigued by an all out Deadlift session.

Sometimes I think a lot of it is psychological. I found the 1x5 the most difficult due to progress being perceived as slow as you build up to 5 reps with the same weight for several weeks.

I find the 5/3/1 very easy to recover from, possibly due to its variation in reps and training percentage and a de load week every 4 weeks, which I find great for motivation for the following cycle :thumb:

As with anything in sport its not an exact science


----------



## PTR101

Did session number 2 the other morning:

Squat: 25kg 5/5/5/5/5
OHP: 20kg 5/5/5/5/5 (This was harder than I thought it was going to be)
Deadlift: 40kg 5


Then i've done my third session this morning.
Squat: 27.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
Bench: 22.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
Barbell Row: 32.5kg 5/5/5/5/5

I got into the gym this morning at 0515 and it was great! Only 1 other person in there meant I could get to the squat rack and the bench as and when I wanted it! So refreshing!


----------



## PTR101

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi PTR101 :wave:
> 
> Being able to run and cycle all day has very little to do with strength, this is just endurance and I would be very inclined to say both your upper and lower body lack strength :thumb:
> 
> Ultimate strength success comes from the whole body working as one :devil:
> 
> Keep your 5x5 goals realistic, there are guys on here that have been on the same weight for nearly 12 months, although your initial strength increases will go up quick until you find your first real plateau :tumbleweed:
> 
> Lift on!


Yeah, I don't have any specific goals, just to increase my strength. Maybe squatting 150% (111kgs) and benching 100% (74kgs) would be some nice figures. I'd be happy with those.

I'll follow the plan for the first 12 weeks and i'll see where I get to!


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Yeah, I don't have any specific goals, just to increase my strength. Maybe squatting 150% (111kgs) and benching 100% (74kgs) would be some nice figures. I'd be happy with those.
> 
> I'll follow the plan for the first 12 weeks and i'll see where I get to!


Very realistic goals, you'll be there in no time :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Dont let anyone put you off starting with the bar buddy, ya it feels light to start with but at 7.5kg per week you will soon be lifting a good amount of weight. To put it into perspective, Doug and I are on 5/3/1 so we increase out squat by 5kg every 4 weeks, this means your increasing your weight at 6 times the rate of us. You made the biggest step by downloading the program and deciding to start it, now all you got to do is stay commited.



ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 Cycle 11 - 5/3/1
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX1 *
> 
> No assistance work today and the 190x1 felt good, still taking it slow as I don't want to tear the Hamstring now I'm so close to my goal :thumb:
> 
> De load week next week


Nice work Doug, that 200kg is in sight. Im catching up abit on Deadlifts as I did 180kg for 1rep the other day, must be the 4 times per week and skipping a few of the deload weeks.

Been making great progress, Bench Pressed 97.5kg for 14 reps Monday night which is a PM of 143kg and a personal record for me and I probably had 1 more in me if I really grinded it. I have been training 10,8,6 on my Bench Press weeks so shows that I am keeping 4-5 reps in the Tank and still making progress.

Its weird every exercise of mine is moving except squats and squats used to be my best exercise, strange. But it was my best when I boxed squatted, not free squatted.

I been the sickest I have in years this week so hopefully it wont effect my training to much next week. But I started work again so need to lower the days down to 3 days per week again.


----------



## PTR101

Bod42 said:


> Dont let anyone put you off starting with the bar buddy, ya it feels light to start with but at 7.5kg per week you will soon be lifting a good amount of weight. To put it into perspective, Doug and I are on 5/3/1 so we increase out squat by 5kg every 4 weeks, this means your increasing your weight at 6 times the rate of us. You made the biggest step by downloading the program and deciding to start it, now all you got to do is stay commited.


Cheers man!

Another session done this morning:

Squat: 30kg 5/5/5/5/5
OHP: 22.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
Dead: 45kg 5

I love how simple this program is, it means every time I leave the gym, I can't wait for the next session. 
I can already look back to this time last week where I had no weight on the bar so it feels like i'm doing well already!


----------



## PTR101

Sundays session:

Squat: 32.5kg 5/5/5/5/5 
Bench: 25kg 5/5/5/5/5 
Row: 35kg 5/5/5/5/5

And then this mornings session:

Squat: 35kg 5/5/5/5/5 this is still feeling quite easy, but the weight is still rising!
OHP: 25kg 5/5/5/5/5 being my weakest area, this is starting to feel heavy already.
Deadlift: 50kg 5 

Can't wait for Thursday when all the weight goes up again!


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Sundays session:
> 
> Squat: 32.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
> Bench: 25kg 5/5/5/5/5
> Row: 35kg 5/5/5/5/5
> 
> And then this mornings session:
> 
> Squat: 35kg 5/5/5/5/5 this is still feeling quite easy, but the weight is still rising!
> OHP: 25kg 5/5/5/5/5 being my weakest area, this is starting to feel heavy already.
> Deadlift: 50kg 5
> 
> Can't wait for Thursday when all the weight goes up again!


OHP is always the weakest due to the smaller muscles involved with the lift, keep at it mate. Your doing fine :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Max Effort - Bench Press Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 78KGX3 - 90KGX2 - 104KGX1 - 117KGX1 - 123.5KGX1 - 130KGX1

Assistance work

DEAD BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

First session felt good, took around 4 minutes rest between the last three bench press sets :thumb:

My goal is to get to 135Kgx1 on week 3. Wish me luck, I'm going to bloody need it


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Max Effort - Bench Press Week 1
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 78KGX3 - 90KGX2 - 104KGX1 - 117KGX1 - 123.5KGX1 - 130KGX1
> 
> Assistance work
> 
> DEAD BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> First session felt good, took around 4 minutes rest between the last three bench press sets :thumb:
> 
> My goal is to get to 135Kgx1 on week 3. Wish me luck, I'm going to bloody need it


New warm up or workout Doug? Looks similar to a LRB format.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> New warm up or workout Doug? Looks similar to a LRB format.


Trying out the max effort principle for the bench this month, then over the next couple of months I'm going to try max effort for the Squat and deadlift to get my ultimate goals.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 133KGX5 - 154KGX5 - 174KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 130KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Cracking workout, the last rep on 174Kg x 5 set was mad  I took over 2 seconds to get the weight up, I kept my breath held throughout the rep, didn't get dizzy or pass out, which is always good. Most certainly hated the weights tonight  :devil:

I'm getting to old for this............NOT! 

Standing calf raise is still possible within the rack. I find the high bar position better for these.

If your wondering why its 5/3/1 today its because I'm only using the max effort principle for my bench press on this cycle, everything else is 5/3/1 and BBB assistance as normal.

After this 12th cycle (as long as things go according to plan) I will do 2 and half months max effort on the squat and deadlift. As long as I progress without any stalls this will bring me to my ultimate goal for squat in 6 weeks (that's including one de load week) And my ultimate goal for the deadlift in 10 weeks (this includes two de load weeks).

A little selection of tonight's powerlifting playlist, enjoy! :thumb: :devil:









 (love the chorus. ARISE AGAIN, ARISE AGAIN!!! :devil













Hate the weights!!!! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I will actually start to post up my workouts again soon.

Just wanted to say that I tried the first set last on squats the other night and it makes a big difference. So I worked up to my 3 rep set then dropped the weight and did a higher rep set, just that little change has increased my soreness a lot. All my exercises are moving other than my squat so I'm going to leave the extra set in for a while and see if it helps. I'm also going to try the volume approach some point in the near future, at the end of the day if you want to improve at something then you do it more often, 1 heavy set of squats a week just doesn't seem to work for me. May try the BBB or 10x3 after my main sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I will actually start to post up my workouts again soon.


About bloody time James! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 53KGX5 - 61KGX5 - 69KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT(107Kg)+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHT(107Kg)x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Another very good workout :thumb: Feeling much stronger in the OHP now.

Slight change to my dip regime:
3 sets 5 reps weighted (15kg) followed by 3 sets 10 reps just bodyweight. Nearly threw myself off the dip bar on the first rep of the first un weighted dip set, its amazing how light you feel after doing a few sets of weighted dips  lol!

Would like to do some max effort cycles on my OHP at some time in the future :thumb:


----------



## PTR101

Week three, session 2 done this morning:

Squat: 40kg 5/5/5/5/5
OHP: 27.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
Dead: 55kg 5

Squat is still feeling good, OHP is a challenge, but i'm still hitting all 5 so the weight will continue up. It's a great feeling when you hit that last 5!!


----------



## Paintmaster1982

been reading up on 5x5. Basically I'am not very flexible and so I can't squat properly in terms of getting lower then my knee level. My back curves.

Anyone got any advice to overcome this problem?

I already do core training which involves cat stretches etc and pretty much anything to gain the correct arch in my back.

Really want to start 5x5 but find this will hold me back.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Paintmaster1982 said:


> been reading up on 5x5. Basically I'am not very flexible and so I can't squat properly in terms of getting lower then my knee level. My back curves.
> 
> Anyone got any advice to overcome this problem?
> 
> I already do core training which involves cat stretches etc and pretty much anything to gain the correct arch in my back.
> 
> Really want to start 5x5 but find this will hold me back.


Some good squat vids:

http://stronglifts.com/how-to-squat-with-proper-technique-fix-common-problems/
















Search YouTube for Mark ripptoe's seminars on the main lifts, there are loads that will help you :thumb:

1. Start light (Empty bar) and progress very slow, be strict with your form.

2. Find a leg stance that suites your frame/ability.

3. Test both low and high bar squat position to see which is best for you.

4. You will find as the weight gets heavy that your form becomes more and more important. There is a tendency for form to get bad the heavier you progress, keep checking form.

5. Read this thread and you will find answers to probably every question you have as there are loads of video links within it.

Enjoy! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 133KGX5 - 154KGX5 - 174KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

BODYWEIGHT JUMPS x5x5x5x5x5*

Nice workout, 174Kgx5 on the deadlift is starting to get hard again as I do touch n go reps. It's starting to get difficult getting enough air into my lungs on the last two reps  :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Paintmaster1982 said:


> been reading up on 5x5. Basically I'am not very flexible and so I can't squat properly in terms of getting lower then my knee level. My back curves.
> 
> Anyone got any advice to overcome this problem?
> 
> I already do core training which involves cat stretches etc and pretty much anything to gain the correct arch in my back.
> 
> Really want to start 5x5 but find this will hold me back.


Just a thought, but you are probably very weak in your core. When people say core work they generally mean very light core work witch adds very little to overall core strength.

Two good core exercises ........................ The Squat and deadlift :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Paintmaster1982 said:


> been reading up on 5x5. Basically I'am not very flexible and so I can't squat properly in terms of getting lower then my knee level. My back curves.
> 
> Anyone got any advice to overcome this problem?
> 
> I already do core training which involves cat stretches etc and pretty much anything to gain the correct arch in my back.
> 
> Really want to start 5x5 but find this will hold me back.


Everyone I train I always put on the Eric Cressey Maximum Strength Warm Ups, its great for showing any flexibility weakness' you have at the start, improves your flexibility and warms you up. Win win. Concentrate on squat to stands and seated 90/90 stretch.

Good video for Butt Wink (Rounding of the lower back in the hole)





As Doug said it could also be a weak core depending on what exercises your doing.

http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/2013/05/16/mobility-for-the-big-3/ This page backs up what Doug and I are saying, weak core and Glutes.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> About bloody time James! :thumb:


Just for Doug:thumb:

Bench Press: (WU 45x5, 57.5x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x5, 97.5x3, 110x6 PM 132kg
Incline Bench Press: 65x5, 75x5, 85x5
Bench Press: Rest Pause
Over Hand Chins: 10x3
Kroc Rows: 47.5x15

Bench went alright but felt heavy for some strange reason. Probably because I rode home in the rain and cold for nearly an hour so my shoulder still felt like crap even after warming up. Clicked on every single rep as well which I never like.

Please with incline, I didn't use to like Incline but now I think they have good carry over to other exercises.

Not a rep record on chins but massive forearm pump.

The rest pause set makes such a hugh difference, having trouble writing this as my torso is so pumped from the rest pause and Kroc rows.

Only a few more weeks and then I'm changing over to hard out Body Building for 6 weeks. No drinking, clean eating, 3-400 grams of protein per day just like my younger years.

Don't worry everyone (Doug) I'm still keeping the 5/3/1 as my first exercise to keep my strength up. Right time for a protein shake


----------



## fitz

Just started the 5x5 today after joining the gym ages ago and not really committing myself to it. 

Wanting to put on mass and increase strength so will stick to this for the next 10 weeks and see how we go. 

So day 1 

Squat 50kg x 5
Bench press 50kg x 5
Bent over row 40kg x 5

Currently weighing in at 61kg 5ft 10 but my aim is to get to 70! 

Bring on Wednesday! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

fitz said:


> Just started the 5x5 today after joining the gym ages ago and not really committing myself to it.
> 
> Wanting to put on mass and increase strength so will stick to this for the next 10 weeks and see how we go.
> 
> So day 1
> 
> Squat 50kg x 5
> Bench press 50kg x 5
> Bent over row 40kg x 5
> 
> Currently weighing in at 61kg 5ft 10 but my aim is to get to 70!
> 
> Bring on Wednesday! :thumb:


Congrats on starting the program, its the best program there is for packing on size and strength.

Take it your doing 5 sets of 5 reps and not just 5 reps? Whats your maximum lifts as your suppose to start real light on 5x5 as the loading is so aggressive? Most people start with just the bar on all lifts.

At your weight I would be doing the GOMAD diet as you have a lot of room to increase your weight at your height and it will help massively with size and strength.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 102.5x3) WO 130x5, 147.5x3, 165x0 PM FA! 120x6, 70x10,10,10

That's it just a bucket load of squats. My form was so off tonight, I was shifting my weight right over my toes and on the 1 rep set I went over my toes then back to my toes and that just killed my drive out of the hole.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Just for Doug:thumb:
> 
> Bench Press: (WU 45x5, 57.5x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x5, 97.5x3, 110x6 PM 132kg
> Incline Bench Press: 65x5, 75x5, 85x5
> Bench Press: Rest Pause
> Over Hand Chins: 10x3
> Kroc Rows: 47.5x15
> 
> Bench went alright but felt heavy for some strange reason. Probably because I rode home in the rain and cold for nearly an hour so my shoulder still felt like crap even after warming up. Clicked on every single rep as well which I never like.
> 
> Please with incline, I didn't use to like Incline but now I think they have good carry over to other exercises.
> 
> Not a rep record on chins but massive forearm pump.
> 
> The rest pause set makes such a hugh difference, having trouble writing this as my torso is so pumped from the rest pause and Kroc rows.
> 
> Only a few more weeks and then I'm changing over to hard out Body Building for 6 weeks. No drinking, clean eating, 3-400 grams of protein per day just like my younger years.
> 
> Don't worry everyone (Doug) I'm still keeping the 5/3/1 as my first exercise to keep my strength up. Right time for a protein shake


YAY a workout post from James!!!! 

Don't you think 3-400 grams of protein is a bit excessive mate :doublesho

I will also be focusing on Hypertrophy once I reach my goals, but will always prioritise strength in my training :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> YAY a workout post from James!!!!
> 
> Don't you think 3-400 grams of protein is a bit excessive mate :doublesho
> 
> I will also be focusing on Hypertrophy once I reach my goals, but will always prioritise strength in my training :thumb:


1.5 grams of protein per lb of body weight which is approx 363grams per day. It probably is a bit excessive but its only for 6 weeks and I want to see what difference it makes. You look at the old school strong men and bodybuilders and this is what they did. Also its what they do with all the actors to get them in top shape really quickly, they just flood their bodies with protein.

Strength is still my main goal but in a comp with a few mates back home so thought i would add a bit of size for when I go back in Oct.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 78KGX3 - 90KGX2 - 104KGX1 - 117KGX1 - 123.5KGX1 - 132.5KGX0 

BENCH PRESS 80Kgx 10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout except for the last 132.5x1, friends came around just before I was about to do last heavy and we talked I got out of the zone and FAILED the  lift!!!!!  Although I'm not to sure if I'm doing too many sets with a bit too much weight before the main work set. Will try with less next week.

Carried on with the rest of the workout a pushed all the other lifts hard :thumb: I will keep at, a bad workout is not the end of the world and they do happen.

Hate the weights :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Thursday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 52.5x5, 60x3, 66.5x3 PM 73kg
Dips: BW+2.5x5, BW+20x5, BW+35x5
Neutral Grip Chins: 7x4, 3x3
Pendlay Rows: 70x8, 8, 8

The 60x3 was a real slow grind on each rep and I just laughed at the thought of the 66.5x3 but it was easy, well not easy but confident.

Chin Ups are starting to hurt my bad shoulder so will have to do the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders again as that took a lot of my pain away.

I been on 70kg pendlay rows for awhile but 3x8 was pretty easy. Its definitely the chins before that kill my progress as all I feel is my upper back and it burns afterwards as my lats are fried. 

All in all a good workout and haven't failed SP in months. I also messed around the other day and did a 90kg push press without a warm up so shoulders are definitely getting stronger.


----------



## PTR101

Couple to add here:

From the other day
Squat: 42.5kg 5/5/5/5/5
Bench: 30kg 5/5/5/5/5
Row: 40kg 5/5/5/5/5


And for this morning:
Squat: 45kg 5/5/5/5/5
OHP: 30kg 5/5/5/5/5
Dead: 60kg 5

This OHP this morning was hard, so I made sure I had a full minute between each set. It helped having someone I know whose been doing some split routine next to be looking astounded that i've gone heavier than him so quickly :devil:


----------



## Bod42

PTR101 said:


> This OHP this morning was hard, so I made sure I had a *full minute between each set*. It helped having someone I know whose been doing some split routine next to be looking astounded that i've gone heavier than him so quickly :devil:


As you get heavier try increasing your rest periods, it makes a massive difference. The guy I'm training I started on 2 mins rest between his squats and then when he started to fail I increased it to 3 mins rest, this alone allowed him to put another 15kg on his squat. Its funny as he said 3 mins feels like he's standing around for ages but a few weeks later he said 3 mins doesn't feel enough again. If your really pushing your sets your body will need a bit of time to recover. Rippletoe suggest 5-7mins between squats.

For overall fitness 3mins between squats and deadlifts and 2 mins between Shoulder Press and Bench Press seems to work well.

Nice work, as your finding 5x5 rules. Weird how some people are so against it.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 100x5, 120x3) 147.5x5, 165x3, 185x1 
Front Box Squats: 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x5
Good Mornings: 62.5x10, 5, 5

Pleased to get my 1 rep considering I failed my 3 week but it wasn't pretty but hey the weight has continually been going up for months now so cant complain. I think its all the hamstring work I been doing both after squats and deadlifts.

The weight on Front squats is slowly coming up as well which I think helps massively with upper back static strength.

Cut good mornings short as form was breaking down and its not an exercise that you want to do without perfect form.


----------



## PTR101

Cheers Bod, i'll see how I get on in the next OHP session, but I fear this will be the first lift I stall on! I'll make sure to increase my rest to make it as easy as possible for me and we'll see how I get on!

The other lifts are now starting to feel like an effort. Up to now it's been easy, but that's been great to work on my form. I know my squat from was horrid before I started. Having watched all the 5x5 videos and other squat vids on Youtube, I feel it's much improved now!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> As you get heavier try increasing your rest periods, it makes a massive difference. The guy I'm training I started on 2 mins rest between his squats and then when he started to fail I increased it to 3 mins rest, this alone allowed him to put another 15kg on his squat. Its funny as he said 3 mins feels like he's standing around for ages but a few weeks later he said 3 mins doesn't feel enough again. If your really pushing your sets your body will need a bit of time to recover. Rippletoe suggest 5-7mins between squats.
> 
> For overall fitness 3mins between squats and deadlifts and 2 mins between Shoulder Press and Bench Press seems to work well.
> 
> Nice work, as your finding 5x5 rules. Weird how some people are so against it.


I agree with James here :thumb:

As the weight gets heavier, you need to be intelligent about your lifting, it can make the difference between a good lift and a bad one.

On my heavy work sets I can rest as much as 5-7 minutes. I know it seems as though you are sitting around for ages but you must discipline yourself to accept that a large part of your workout is sitting around resting.

There is so much more to Powerlifting than just lifting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 143.5KGX3 - 164KGX3 - 184.5KGX3

STANDING CALF RAISE 130KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Been a mad/busy week so I'm totally out of sync  However I'm doing my OHP workout later this afternoon, leaving my deadlift session for tomorrow 

I could not believe how easy the 184.5kgx3 felt on the squat  A real WTF moment!  Will try deadlift session same time tomorrow morning as a test.

Still not using my belt and it feels a million times better training without one. I feel safer and more flexible in my lifts :thumb:

Haven't done a morning workout for ages, was very surprised how it went. Although, I did drink 1 litre of green Tea and a can of Monster this morning  I can fly!!!!! 

OHP later wish the old man luck 

I read a very interesting article this morning and apparently a man peaks in strength between his 30's and mid 40's, at 45 I better crack on with this Powerlifting lark lol


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> Cheers Bod, i'll see how I get on in the next OHP session, but I fear this will be the first lift I stall on! I'll make sure to increase my rest to make it as easy as possible for me and we'll see how I get on!
> 
> The other lifts are now starting to feel like an effort. Up to now it's been easy, but that's been great to work on my form. I know my squat from was horrid before I started. Having watched all the 5x5 videos and other squat vids on Youtube, I feel it's much improved now!


The OHP is the first lift everyone stalls on PTR, don't let it deter you mate, failures are a normal part of progression. Its the failures that test your character, James and I are still here after nearly two years and we have had our fair share of stalls and injuries. You gotta HATE THE WEIGHTS!!!!! :devil::devil:

Remember this: *When you lift well you love the sport, when you lift bad, you hate yourself * :thumb:

The first 1:15 of this track is good for firing you up for your heavy stuff :devil: Gets a bit lame after that though


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 57KGX3 - 65KGX3 - 73KGX3*

Second workout today 

Today I've already eaten - 1 x tin tuna, 2 x chicken breasts and in about 15 minutes I'm going to eat a whole chicken (cooked of course  ) :thumb:

Deadlifts to do tomorrow and I'm back on track for this weeks sessions, most excellent! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 143.5KGX3 - 164KGX3 - 184.5KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Last rep on the 184.5Kgx3 a little untidy but ok.

Its really odd how 180kg feels relatively easy to rep out with. As soon as I move up to around 184/185 the last 1 - 2 reps feel pretty hard. Its probably because I train touch n go an without a belt. I tend to not get enough air in my lungs to tighten my core enough and get loser with each rep. Might try the standard deadlift style soon to see how it feels 

Anyhow, I'm back on track now :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 Cycle 12 - 5/3/1
> 
> *SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 143.5KGX3 - 164KGX3 - 184.5KGX3
> 
> STANDING CALF RAISE  130KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Been a mad/busy week so I'm totally out of sync  However I'm doing my OHP workout later this afternoon, leaving my deadlift session for tomorrow
> 
> I could not believe how easy the 184.5kgx3 felt on the squat  A real WTF moment!  Will try deadlift session same time tomorrow morning as a test.
> 
> Still not using my belt and it feels a million times better training without one. I feel safer and more flexible in my lifts :thumb:
> 
> Haven't done a morning workout for ages, was very surprised how it went. Although, I did drink 1 litre of green Tea and a can of Monster this morning  I can fly!!!!!
> 
> OHP later wish the old man luck
> 
> I read a very interesting article this morning and apparently a man peaks in strength between his 30's and mid 40's, at 45 I better crack on with this Powerlifting lark lol


Nice squat Bud, everyone of my lifts is moving other than squat which is strange. I confident it will go up soon though as I changed form a little while back sitting more down instead of back, this uses different muscles and I think its just a small muscle or something holding me back.

I was saying exactly this to my mate the other day, peak fitness at late twenties but peak strength comes later. He didnt believe me so had to go through it all. Look at most forwards in rugby where strength is a premium, their average age is always higher than that of the backs.

Good to see some new people chiming in on this thread, I love it when people actually make the move to 5x5 but you still get the people who amaze me. Had to basically argue with a group of guys at a party at the weekend that I'm not on gear, (never have been, never will be) so they ask for your help, you send them the 5x5 program and they say it wont work because its not a hundred exercises from a thousand different angles and has no drop sets, super sets, no this set is going to turn me green like the hulk set. Why are people so against lifting heavy these days, I struggle to understand why a man wouldnt want to get stronger.

Weight lifting is very simple but people seem to complicate it beyond believe. People ask how have I got a wide back, my reply is how many sets of bench press do you do per workout, hundreds, how many sets do you do for your back, zero, theres your answer.

And another guy at the party asks how long it would take to look like me (btw I'm not in shape, Im overweight but just bigger than average), I said if you worked hard you could probably do it in 6 months, his face fell and he's like "oh that long". I would not say 6 months, to get something you want, is a long time, its just modern people want everything yesterday for zero effort.

And one of my mates, every time I see him brings up the gym and wants to get in shape, bla bla bla. He has been gyming for 2 yrs, even taken roids and has put on zero muscle and zero strength. I say come train with me as the guy Im training has put on 3-4" of muscle on each leg and 110kg on his squat in 4 months, "No because you will change what I'm doing" wtf to me this is actually bordering on insanity.

I use this saying in the gym so much Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Sorry for the rant, just find some people really strange and confusing


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice squat Bud, everyone of my lifts is moving other than squat which is strange. I confident it will go up soon though as I changed form a little while back sitting more down instead of back, this uses different muscles and I think its just a small muscle or something holding me back.
> 
> I was saying exactly this to my mate the other day, peak fitness at late twenties but peak strength comes later. He didnt believe me so had to go through it all. Look at most forwards in rugby where strength is a premium, their average age is always higher than that of the backs.
> 
> Good to see some new people chiming in on this thread, I love it when people actually make the move to 5x5 but you still get the people who amaze me. Had to basically argue with a group of guys at a party at the weekend that I'm not on gear, (never have been, never will be) so they ask for your help, you send them the 5x5 program and they say it wont work because its not a hundred exercises from a thousand different angles and has no drop sets, super sets, no this set is going to turn me green like the hulk set. Why are people so against lifting heavy these days, I struggle to understand why a man wouldnt want to get stronger.
> 
> Weight lifting is very simple but people seem to complicate it beyond believe. People ask how have I got a wide back, my reply is how many sets of bench press do you do per workout, hundreds, how many sets do you do for your back, zero, theres your answer.
> 
> And another guy at the party asks how long it would take to look like me (btw I'm not in shape, Im overweight but just bigger than average), I said if you worked hard you could probably do it in 6 months, his face fell and he's like "oh that long". I would not say 6 months, to get something you want, is a long time, its just modern people want everything yesterday for zero effort.
> 
> And one of my mates, every time I see him brings up the gym and wants to get in shape, bla bla bla. He has been gyming for 2 yrs, even taken roids and has put on zero muscle and zero strength. I say come train with me as the guy Im training has put on 3-4" of muscle on each leg and 110kg on his squat in 4 months, "No because you will change what I'm doing" wtf to me this is actually bordering on insanity.
> 
> I use this saying in the gym so much Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
> 
> Sorry for the rant, just find some people really strange and confusing


Cheers mate, I'm most certainly getting there, I do worry about my old Hamstring injury, but the slow progression of the 5/3/1 helps greatly with my lifting confidence :thumb:

I know were your coming from James :thumb:

How many new threads have been started in the H&F section with the title about getting bigger this and bigger that, what protein shakes etc..etc.. I'm losing energy please tell me which concocted energy drink I need :lol:

Very few people will work for it because they are too  lazy and that is why so many fail and yet after years of poor training/nutrition they still wont take advice from bigger/stronger guys. let them do it their way James. We are stronger than 90% of the population on this planet, because we have what it takes :thumb:

lol it makes me laugh! 

I wonder how many will believe that if you want bigger arms: YOU DONT NEED TO TRAIN ARMS! :doublesho:thumb:

As for people mate, as you get older you'll understand they aren't strange, they aren't confusing, they are just plain stupid  :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice squat Bud, everyone of my lifts is moving other than squat which is strange. I confident it will go up soon though as I changed form a little while back sitting more down instead of back, this uses different muscles and I think its just a small muscle or something holding me back.


Try the standing calf raise James, helps stabilise you in your squat. I've been doing them for years.

Build Cows not calves! :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Back after a couple of weeks hols  No lifting but did three 20 mile rides which is 19 miles further than I've ridden in one go ever before 

Repeating last workout this week to get going again. Did presses last night and they were awful. Didn't even get my 5 reps at 50kg. The good thing is I know it takes a few sessions to get back into the groove and it's not 'lost' strength.

Couple of videos have been posted up from the strength camp I went on. They're the Oly lifting progressions we did every session. I found them really useful. http://www.brendanchaplin.co.uk/sf-tv-episode-11-olympic-weightlifting-complex/

and another one:


----------



## Oats

Bod42 said:


> 1.5 grams of protein per lb of body weight which is approx 363grams per day. It probably is a bit excessive but its only for 6 weeks and I want to see what difference it makes. You look at the old school strong men and bodybuilders and this is what they did. Also its what they do with all the actors to get them in top shape really quickly, they just flood their bodies with protein.
> 
> Strength is still my main goal but in a comp with a few mates back home so thought i would add a bit of size for when I go back in Oct.


I'm slowly getting my head round the nutrition side of things. It's hellishly complex but every so often a little piece clicks in to place.

One of the things that's strange is the protein refractory period. Apparently when you take protein your enczyms rise to break it down and then take four hours or so to go back down. Additional protein during this time isn't processed into muscles. So taking shakes etc really regularly isn't optimal. That's where BCAA come in because they're already broken down into branch chains and bypass this process.

GOMAD etc provides some protein but it's big contribution is enough calories to promote growth.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers mate, I'm most certainly getting there, I do worry about my old Hamstring injury, but the slow progression of the 5/3/1 helps greatly with my lifting confidence :thumb:
> 
> I know were your coming from James :thumb:
> 
> How many new threads have been started in the H&F section with the title about getting bigger this and bigger that, what protein shakes etc..etc.. I'm losing energy please tell me which concocted energy drink I need :lol:
> 
> Very few people will work for it because they are too  lazy and that is why so many fail and yet after years of poor training/nutrition they still wont take advice from bigger/stronger guys. let them do it their way James. We are stronger than 90% of the population on this planet, because we have what it takes :thumb:
> 
> lol it makes me laugh!
> 
> I wonder how many will believe that if you want bigger arms: YOU DONT NEED TO TRAIN ARMS! :doublesho:thumb:
> 
> As for people mate, as you get older you'll understand they aren't strange, they aren't confusing, they are just plain stupid  :tumbleweed:


Slow and steady with the injury mate. Always seem to be saying I'm training a guy who x, y, z but I swear I'm not bull****ting :lol: one of the guys who trains with me every so often for a check up hasnt been training full out due to wrist injury, I said never put the gym off due to an injury, worst thing you can do. If it really bad and painful train round it and replace some of your exercises as you can never do to much prehad work. So his wrist is screwed so changed his squats to arms crossed front squats then RC work then lower back work.

*I wonder how many will believe that if you want bigger arms: YOU DONT NEED TO TRAIN ARMS! :doublesho:thumb:* This rings so true with me, I keep bumping into a guy every time I go to this house party and every single time without fail its how much do you curl, I dont curl, I dont train arms, na bro seriously how much do you curl, I dont curl, I dont train arms. Its actually like his brain can not process this information.

Ya starting to realize people are just stupid especially when it comes to common sense.



Oats said:


> I'm slowly getting my head round the nutrition side of things. It's hellishly complex but every so often a little piece clicks in to place.
> 
> One of the things that's strange is the protein refractory period. Apparently when you take protein your enczyms rise to break it down and then take four hours or so to go back down. Additional protein during this time isn't processed into muscles. So taking shakes etc really regularly isn't optimal. That's where BCAA come in because they're already broken down into branch chains and bypass this process.
> 
> GOMAD etc provides some protein but it's big contribution is enough calories to promote growth.


With nutrition I think I have basically come to the conclusion that its the same as training, research in a lab is nothing like real life research in the trenches. I used to believe that you couldnt ingest more than 30grams of protein at any meal so had like 7 meals per day, I got stronger. I lowered my meals to 3 times a day, I got stronger, I lowered my meals to 2 a day with a massive meal at night which everyone says is the worse thing to do and I have increased strength and size while staying the same weight. If you spoken to me 5 yrs ago I would have called you mental for eating 2 meals per day and your biggest one before bed.

And I agree the 300-400 is over kill but Im dieting fast and want to hold on to as much muscle and strength as possible so I would rather be over than under. And I diet on about 3000 calories and I know from previous diets that I get results really fast and easy if I cut carbs, this means I have to eat a lot of protein and fat to hit my 3000 calories.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 104.5KGX5 - 118.5KGX3 - 132.5KGX0 Dam!

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Fail on last work set 132.5Kgx1 again, so I'm going to de load and re evaluate. The warm up sets felt too light and the 118.5x3 before the main work set felt too heavy. Bit of a balls up all in all really, never mind onward and upward! :thumb:

Can not eating enough protein effect your strength that much?

Although tonight's tea is a whole 1.3kg Chicken, and its all mine!!!!


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press (WU) WO 100x10
will update the rest when I look at my spreadsheet

Squats (WU 75x5, 105x3, 135x1) 120kg x 10 sets x 3 reps 90 secs rest
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 70kg x 2 sets of 10 reps 1 min rest.

I been struggling with my squat and I just don't think the 1 all out set is right for me. Its the 1st time I have done the 1 all out set and its the 1st time I haven't made progress on my squat and I gave 5/3/1 a solid try as been on it quite a few months now. I love it for all the other exercises but I read a lot of people struggle with their squats on 5/3/1. So basically I'm going the volume route and adding 2.5kg every time I complete a workout. And to be honest the workout felt awesome, its great for practicing form and speed on the 1st few sets and at the end due to the short rest periods you are having to push it pretty hard. 120kg was a pretty easy start but adding 2.5kg a workout should add up quickly.

Its a strange game hey Doug, I haven't been training my Bench hard, been training 3-4 reps shy of failure to protect my shoulder and its going up. I been smashing my squat and its not moving. And I think with the 1.3kg chicken that your getting enough protein :lol: I would say put some more reps in your workout as I dont like the 5/3/1 especially on upper body movements BUT you have the reps well and truly covered with your BBB sets. How many failures on that weight is that now because failed reps arent good for the mental side of lifting. If its a few times maybe a tiny deload so your confident in smashing your heavy reps and just keep pushing your assistant exercise weight up for a few weeks and see what happens.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Its a strange game hey Doug, I haven't been training my Bench hard, been training 3-4 reps shy of failure to protect my shoulder and its going up. I been smashing my squat and its not moving. And I think with the 1.3kg chicken that your getting enough protein :lol: I would say put some more reps in your workout as I dont like the 5/3/1 especially on upper body movements BUT you have the reps well and truly covered with your BBB sets. How many failures on that weight is that now because failed reps arent good for the mental side of lifting. If its a few times maybe a tiny deload so your confident in smashing your heavy reps and just keep pushing your assistant exercise weight up for a few weeks and see what happens.


Tis strange but I should not complain, I'm 45, I've not even been training two years yet and I've torn my hamstring twice. So all in all I'm still making amazing progress :thumb:

I think I've failed around 4 times now and you are right, it can end up being a psychological rather than physiological block :tumbleweed:

Defo enough protein yesterday, I estimated around 180grams in the chicken alone :doublesho 

I'm going to do a small de load for the bench next cycle and see how that goes, then add some weight to the BBB assistance work sets.

Its really weird as 130kgx1 on the bench goes up no problems :wall:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 154KGX5 - 174KGX3 - 195KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 130KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, its starting to feel like hard work now 

The 195x1 squat felt dam good, its funny how when you walk it out of the rack it feels like it wants to crush you, yet when you start the squat it feels lighter 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> The 195x1 squat felt dam good, its funny how when you walk it out of the rack it feels like it wants to crush you, yet when you start the squat it feels lighter
> :thumb:


5kg from 200kg :doublesho nice work.

Had to comment again as you said something else we were discussing the other day. Some days I lift the bar out of the rack and think my good god, getting it out of the rack was hard enough and now I have to squat it but the weight flies up, weird hey.

Did you notice I did the over warm up for my 10x3 the other day, that made the bar feel really light on my working sets, going to use these more in my training I think.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> 5kg from 200kg :doublesho nice work.
> 
> Had to comment again as you said something else we were discussing the other day. Some days I lift the bar out of the rack and think my good god, getting it out of the rack was hard enough and now I have to squat it but the weight flies up, weird hey.
> 
> Did you notice I did the over warm up for my 10x3 the other day, that made the bar feel really light on my working sets, going to use these more in my training I think.


I took some doing James and its been a bumpy journey after tearing my hamstring twice. I've decided to stay at 200kg on the squat for a while (Next cycle will bring it to 200kg! :thumb. I want concentrate on squat form and depth as I'm still lifting without a belt :doublesho

My next mini goal is to focus on getting the deadlift up to 230Kg x1 :thumb:

I agree that the warm up can play an important part in preparing you psychologically and physiologically for a lift especially when you are at a sticking point. I don't think benching with such a narrow grip helps, but I like the challenge 
I'll add the extra warm up's to my "Things to try" list :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## fitz

Bod42 said:


> Congrats on starting the program, its the best program there is for packing on size and strength.
> 
> Take it your doing 5 sets of 5 reps and not just 5 reps? Whats your maximum lifts as your suppose to start real light on 5x5 as the loading is so aggressive? Most people start with just the bar on all lifts.
> 
> At your weight I would be doing the GOMAD diet as you have a lot of room to increase your weight at your height and it will help massively with size and strength.


Yeh 5 sets of 5. After today's session (week 2 workout 2) I can see your point about starting light. I got 60kg squat 57.5kg bench (this was particularly hard) and 45kg bent over row.

With the weights I'm currently lifting I can see me hitting a wall very shortly and with it only being week 2 this is not going to be beneficial.

Would you recommend me starting the programme from scratch ie the bar and just strengthening up gradually every week although I can lift much more!?

I checked out the gomad diet and I'm not sure about the idea of drinking a gallon of milk a day. :doublesho

Thanks for your guidance
Tom


----------



## ITHAQVA

fitz said:


> Yeh 5 sets of 5. After today's session (week 2 workout 2) I can see your point about starting light. I got 60kg squat 57.5kg bench (this was particularly hard) and 45kg bent over row.
> 
> With the weights I'm currently lifting I can see me hitting a wall very shortly and with it only being week 2 this is not going to be beneficial.
> 
> Would you recommend me starting the programme from scratch ie the bar and just strengthening up gradually every week although I can lift much more!?
> 
> I checked out the gomad diet and I'm not sure about the idea of drinking a gallon of milk a day. :doublesho
> 
> Thanks for your guidance
> Tom


Tom,
I would definitely recommend you start with an empty bar. Learn about lifting technique and form, this will become very important in the future as the weights get heavier. Good form/technique can make the difference to making a lift and completely failing a lift. You also need to think about joint health/injuries etc...You will need to keep re evaluating your form as there is a tendency for form to worsen the heavier the weight.

As for the GOMAD: its specifically designed for you to bulk up quickly and ensure you get plenty of protein per day, its a good way to start, however I wouldn't recommend it for prolonged periods as you will more than likely increase your body fat as well. I never used the GOMAD approach, but just ate plenty of protein rich meals. I have gone from 15 stone to 17 stone in a year and half  my weight is very stable now and has been for around 9 months :thumb:

Think about what your goals are. If you don't have any, it will be beneficial to have some, you need something to strive for which will help for motivation and guide you in how you train or help us in helping you decide the best lifts rep ranges etc....

Do you want to just get strong or do you also want to pack on muscle mass.

If you want to be strong and muscular, follow the 5x5 until you reach the proscribed guidelines on the Stronglifts site (Cant remember what they are, but they're on the site somewhere, they basically let you know at what approximate weights you should be before considering moving onto another training program) :thumb:

I strongly recommend the original 5/3/1 with the big but boring assistance sets (These will help you pack on muscle mass) once you move from the 5x5, even though I'm on a bit of a sticking point at the moment it still rocks and I have been doing it for 12 months. I see myself using the original 5/3/1 for many a year :thumb:

Enjoy your new sport, in less than 24 months you could also be stronger than90% of humans on the planet :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

fitz said:


> Just started the 5x5 today after joining the gym ages ago and not really committing myself to it.
> 
> Wanting to put on mass and increase strength so will stick to this for the next 10 weeks and see how we go.
> 
> So day 1
> 
> Squat 50kg x 5
> Bench press 50kg x 5
> Bent over row 40kg x 5
> 
> *Currently weighing in at 61kg 5ft 10 but my aim is to get to 70! *
> Bring on Wednesday! :thumb:


Just seen this, I'm between 5'10 - 5'11" (107Kg :doublesho), to get to 70kg will be easy and you most certainly don't need to drink a gallon of Milk a day. 
For a small increase of 9kg in body weight I would recommend you lean bulk :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Think I put this on here before but I still like to follow this theory.

Start with 5 Feet, 100 lbs.

Every inch, add ten pounds for your minimum muscular bodyweight. Add thirty to forty for your maximum muscular bodyweight.

I'm 5'10" so I should be between 200-240lb (90-110kg)



fitz said:


> Yeh 5 sets of 5. After today's session (week 2 workout 2) I can see your point about starting light. I got 60kg squat 57.5kg bench (this was particularly hard) and 45kg bent over row.
> 
> With the weights I'm currently lifting I can see me hitting a wall very shortly and with it only being week 2 this is not going to be beneficial.
> 
> Would you recommend me starting the programme from scratch ie the bar and just strengthening up gradually every week although I can lift much more!?
> 
> I checked out the gomad diet and I'm not sure about the idea of drinking a gallon of milk a day. :doublesho
> 
> Thanks for your guidance
> Tom


As Doug said starting with the bar is the best way, ya it will seem light but 7.5kg per week will see you lifting some good weight really quickly. Failing in week 3-4 is not really what the program is designed for. The guy I train took about 3 months before he hit his first failure on squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 61KGX5 - 69KGX3 - 77KGX1

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Pleased with the workout, the 77kgx1 went up relatively easy although it felt heavy enough to make me think I'm getting close to first plateau on this lift.

I never used to press much in my youth, 84kg was in fact the heaviest I went up to on my behind neck press. I will soon be moving into new territory on this lift :tumbleweed: Wish me luck :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 12 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 154KGX5 - 174KGX3 - 195KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Another cycle coming to a close, the 195Kgx1 felt surprisingly easy , if it we not for the fact that I'm conscious about my hamstring I would have tried something heavier. But I'm not rushing into another injury.

Missus did a form check on the 195Kgx1 Deadlift today and she said my back was almost straight :thumb: Just a slight bend at the top were the weight pulls you shoulders together. Well pleased all in all really :thumb:

A big milestone for me next cycle = 200Kgx1 on the squat and deadlift :doublesho 

:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

As this thread has so many hits 144,203 to date :doublesho I thought I'd post this helpful info for all the people who keep starting new threads "how to get big this" and "I want bigger than" 

Problem is most people are all talk and want it all with no effort, I've got news for you, I doesn't work like that. It takes great effort, discipline and the desire to overcome the physiological and psychological challenges set before you. You don't need loads of suppliments, I LOL when I see all the threads on here about protein shakes and energy drinks, yet very few ask about info on foods for sport :lol::lol::lol:

There does seem to be some contradiction in regards being big and being strong. There are many small guys who can deadlift 500lb as there are many big guys who can deadlift 500lb etc...

The difference between muscle strength and muscle size, link below 

*
The important part in the below link:

" Hypertrophy Vs. Hyperplasia. Hypertrophy refers to an increase in muscle size, due to the enlargement of the size of the cells, as opposed to an increase in the number of cells by cell division, a.k.a. Hyperplasia. *

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/issa7.htm

I've been playing with the Iron for many years and of all the methods I've used the one that has given me the most size and strength is the original 5/3/1 with the Big but boring assistance routine. The original 5/3/1 helps produce both hypertrophy and hyperplasia :thumb:

You want to get big and strong:

1. Train using the original 5/3/1 with BBB assistance exercises.

2. Eat 1 - 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight You'll find out which suites you best, I find 1gram per pound ample. Get 90% of your protein from food :doublesho

3. Supplements - A good quality Whey protein shake to supplement your diet is all you need, one after your workout should be enough.

4. Go to bed no later than 10:00pm -10:30pm on training days, sleep/rest is very important, its when you grow :thumb:

Now go lift! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I have a feeling Doug is going to shake his head at me for this workout :lol: My first strength maintenance / size emphasis workout. (People do not read this and think this is a good size workout, strength is still the way, I am just trying something for a few weeks while I'm dieting as a test really for the bodybuilding guys I train)

Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 47.5x5, 54x5, 61x6 PM 73kg Rest Pause (RP) 47.5x 7, 2, 1
Incline one arm laterals: 5x9,9 X-reps
Dumbell upright Rows: 5x7,7 RP
Dips: BWx 5,5 BW+15, 9,9
Decline Skull Crushers: 17.5x5, 25x5, 30x9, 9 RP, RP
Kickbacks: 5x7,7, RP
Barbell Curls: 35x9,9, X-reps
Incline Curls: 7.5x9,7, X
Concentration Curls: 7.5x7, 7, RP, X

Right so my thoughts on this standard Body Building workout. What an absolute load of S**T. 2/3 of the workout was bloody arms, arms for god sake and they were no more pumped than my heavy higher rest sets. Like skull crushers, when I do these heavy they actually pump my arms so hard that it feels like my skin is stretching whereas short rest lighter weight just gave me a small pump. Kick backs are a contraction exercise and basically just got cramp and my god I hate doing kickbacks, what a crap exercise.

So I;m going to keep doing this workout for 6 weeks but so far I'm not impressed. Hoping the bigger workouts that I have planned like Chest/Legs on Wed and Back/Lats on Fri will feel abit better as they have zero arms in them.

Oh and my shoulder is absolutely killing me after this workout but to be fair this could be from the arm wrestling comp again when I was drunk at weekend, it seems to suck my shoulder slightly out of joint and takes quite a while to repair. I hate this crap at parties but only so much banter you can take before you give in and show them strength rules over the roidy bodybuilders :lol:

Nice post Doug, like your straight to point style. I was reading back through old posts trying to find some info I posted in one of the get bigger legs or something thread and saw the bit of advice "nothing hits every muscle in your body as well as running" absolutely amazing that people believe this and the guy has obviously never squated lol.

And its amazing what people are still being taught. Mates Mrs is a physio and she couldn't believe how hard his heart beats and how hard he breaths after squats because its not cardio and she been through Uni.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I have a feeling Doug is going to shake his head at me for this workout :lol: My first strength maintenance / size emphasis workout. (People do not read this and think this is a good size workout, strength is still the way, I am just trying something for a few weeks while I'm dieting as a test really for the bodybuilding guys I train)
> 
> Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 47.5x5, 54x5, 61x6 PM 73kg Rest Pause (RP) 47.5x 7, 2, 1
> Incline one arm laterals: 5x9,9 X-reps
> Dumbell upright Rows: 5x7,7 RP
> Dips: BWx 5,5 BW+15, 9,9
> Decline Skull Crushers: 17.5x5, 25x5, 30x9, 9 RP, RP
> Kickbacks: 5x7,7, RP
> Barbell Curls: 35x9,9, X-reps
> Incline Curls: 7.5x9,7, X
> Concentration Curls: 7.5x7, 7, RP, X
> 
> Right so my thoughts on this standard Body Building workout. What an absolute load of S**T. 2/3 of the workout was bloody arms, arms for god sake and they were no more pumped than my heavy higher rest sets. Like skull crushers, when I do these heavy they actually pump my arms so hard that it feels like my skin is stretching whereas short rest lighter weight just gave me a small pump. Kick backs are a contraction exercise and basically just got cramp and my god I hate doing kickbacks, what a crap exercise.
> 
> So I;m going to keep doing this workout for 6 weeks but so far I'm not impressed. Hoping the bigger workouts that I have planned like Chest/Legs on Wed and Back/Lats on Fri will feel abit better as they have zero arms in them.
> 
> Oh and my shoulder is absolutely killing me after this workout but to be fair this could be from the arm wrestling comp again when I was drunk at weekend, it seems to suck my shoulder slightly out of joint and takes quite a while to repair. I hate this crap at parties but only so much banter you can take before you give in and show them strength rules over the roidy bodybuilders :lol:
> 
> Nice post Doug, like your straight to point style. I was reading back through old posts trying to find some info I posted in one of the get bigger legs or something thread and saw the bit of advice "nothing hits every muscle in your body as well as running" absolutely amazing that people believe this and the guy has obviously never squated lol.
> 
> And its amazing what people are still being taught. Mates Mrs is a physio and she couldn't believe how hard his heart beats and how hard he breaths after squats because its not cardio and she been through Uni.


WFT? Head shaking ensues! :lol:

Far too complicated! And no barbell shoulder shrugs! :doublesho

This is better and works :thumb:

Example - Triceps workouts: Max rest 1-2 minutes between sets for size and up to 4 minutes if strength is your key goal:

Depending on level

1.
Warm up
5 sets 10 reps - Dips (weighted if sets of 10 are too easy).*
5 sets 10 reps - Lying Triceps Extension to failure.

2.
Warm up
5 sets 10 reps Close grip bench press.*
5 sets 10 reps Lying Triceps Extension to failure.

Or if your at a higher level (James this is for you) Once a week!

3.
Warm up
5 sets 5-10 reps - Dips (weighted if sets of 10 are too easy).*
5 sets 10 reps - Close grip bench press.*
5 sets 10 reps - Lying Triceps Extension to failure.

If you want to add biceps to this try this after workout 3

5 sets 5 -10 reps - Heavy Barbell Curls.*
5 sets 10 reps - EZ Bar Curls to failure.

Add 2.5kg to sets marked * every time you reach the designated reps for each set in good form.

:devil:

- Upright rows, there is a lot of talk about them and behind the neck presses.

- I spent 10 years only using the behind neck press as my core shoulder exercise with no issues and using up to 84kg for 6-8 reps. I have also used upright rows for many years no problems.

- I think with both of these lifts as with many is to know your physical limits/flexibility. If any lift is causing pain you should stop and re asses.

- With both the above lifts as you execute them you may feel a crushing sensation as you reach the topmost part of the upright row and the starting position on the Behind neck press. So there is justification for not using full range of motion on the upright row and swapping the behind nech press for the overhead or front press.

On the upright rows James take the bar no higher than just below your chest, this will cause less compression of the shoulder area and put less stress on your shoulder joints/tendons and you'll get full benefit of this excellent lift :thumb:

I have to be honest and think that workout looks bloody awful mate, far too many gaybells, sorry dumbells  You'd be better off doing what I used to do when I was younger, barbell plate strip method combined with the overload principle. Its a simple but killer routine. I'll post it soon when I find my old notes (Be warned you can only do it for around 8 weeks max before taking a full week off) :devil:

As for physio's and general practitioners. It has been my experience, that they lack the fundamental knowledge to be of any great help. I'm not knocking them, its just as far as powerlifters/bodybuilders go they generally give out very out of date/incorrect generic advice.

Re-post, but very good physio advice :thumb:

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_healing_avoiding_injuries

http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/roundtable_training_through_around_injuries

Time for my de load workout :thumb:


----------



## PTR101

I've not posted for a while as I joined the Stronglifts Inner Circle a little while back.

There's so much info on there, it's great!

As for my current stats:

Squat: 55kg
Bench: 35kg
Press: 35kg
Row: 45kg
Dead: 70kg (2.5kg away from my body weight)

and i'm still progressing nicely. 

For anyone else thinking of doing this, you really, really should start with an empty bar. Getting the form right, especially on the squat, OHP and dead will make the difference between you stalling at week 5 or week 12!


----------



## ITHAQVA

PTR101 said:


> I've not posted for a while as I joined the Stronglifts Inner Circle a little while back.
> 
> There's so much info on there, it's great!
> 
> As for my current stats:
> 
> Squat: 55kg
> Bench: 35kg
> Press: 35kg
> Row: 45kg
> Dead: 70kg (2.5kg away from my body weight)
> 
> and i'm still progressing nicely.
> 
> For anyone else thinking of doing this, you really, really should start with an empty bar. Getting the form right, especially on the squat, OHP and dead will make the difference between you stalling at week 5 or week 12!


If you don't post, it didn't happen!


----------



## Bod42

Doug I'm with you on the Tricep routine. All I ever done is Close Grip Bench, Skull Crushers and tricep extension but this workout is slightly different as it hits all the positions of flexion, midrange, strength and contraction.

The best routine I ever did for my arms was my 5x5 arms, Bench press super setted with Rows followed by Barbell Curls super setted with Skull Crushers. Had unreal stretch marks on my arms from where they grew so fast so heavy is the way but as I say this is a position of flexion workout just as a trial.

Traps are trained on back day in this workout. I find upright rows are fine with dumbells as your more free to move and you can keep away from your pain zone if you have one but my shoulder pain came from training shoulders first and exhausting them and then doing dips, I could feel the dips really badly in my shoulder, may change these to close grip bench press to be honest.

But dont worry I should get some man points back now. Just got another 100kg of weight and another olympic bar so we have a dedicated deadlift and row bar. Got nearly 300kg now. This may seem a bit over the top but got a few new people starting to train with me so need to be able to do more than one exercise at a time so more people can train.


----------



## fitz

Thank you again for the very useful advice! 

Since your recommendation I have started the programme again yesterday with the empty bar :thumb: 

Also downloaded the strong lift app to keep track! 

I'm looking forward to (already feel like I am) seeing the gains. And feel like when I reach my 70kg goal I'll more than likely want to hit 80 :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 De load week - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 55KGX5 - 68.5KGX5 - 82KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice easy De load session :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

fitz said:


> Thank you again for the very useful advice!
> 
> Since your recommendation I have started the programme again yesterday with the empty bar :thumb:
> 
> Also downloaded the strong lift app to keep track!
> 
> I'm looking forward to (already feel like I am) seeing the gains. And feel like when I reach my 70kg goal I'll more than likely want to hit 80 :lol:


SL app is pretty good actually and its great because hardly anyone goes anywhere without their phones these days so you never forget your workout.

You made a great choice, I know it feels weird at the start but trust me you will be stronger in the long run and I seen it with my own eyes. 2 guys wanted to train with me, 1 did and 1 didnt because I said he had to start from zero and he thought he had worked to hard to start again as he had a 40kg squat and bench. Moral of the story, the guy who started from zero is now squatting 130kg for 5 reps at 85kg after 4-5 months, the other guy is still doing his Bodybuilding mag routine and after more than a year has gone backwards. And he still argues that his routine is better :doublesho

Actually got another 2 people starting with me tonight and another one coming in tomorrow to teach him the exercises so he can train at his own gym and just come back for a form check every so often so we shall see how they get on in a few months.


----------



## chadlcfc

5x5 is a great method for mass gaining, aslong as youre eating the correct foods/macros of course.

I was mad for it while at uni last semester and carried on while at home. Unfortunately because of family issues in the last 6 weeks, ive stopped going gym and have lost a stone and a half due to not eating properly.

Im going to go back to university in 3 weeks and hopefully can try and 'rebuild again' to get back up to my weight.


----------



## Bod42

I think if Doug lived close to me he would come round and man slap me for keep posting these type workouts in this section but here goes :lol:

Squats: (WU 75x5, 122.5x3, 135x1) WO 122.5x 10sets x 3 reps. 90 seconds rest
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 70x10, 10, X-reps
Bulgarian Split Squats: 12.5x7,7, X-reps

Bench Press42.5x5, ) ???x5, ???x5, 102.5x10
Flyes: 12.5x 7, 7, Rest Pause
Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 5, X-reps
Incline Flyes: 12.5x7, Rest Pause
Knees Up

So 10 sets of squats is a killer, muscles that never hurt on heavy sets burn like crazy but I feel like 10x3 is an awesome scheme for building muscle and strength.

I was shagged after squats as Im doing low carb and 10 sets would be hard enough when your 100% let alone low carb. I actually put the weight down after 5 reps but told myself to man up and finish the sets. 

I pretty much had enough after Squats but had an entire Bench routine to go through. I had to try 2-3 times to unrack the bar on my first warm up, not a good start. Every rep felt awful and I was shaking just holding the weight at the top. Remember thinking on my first work set that I may as well just quit but carried on. Anyway the top set was so hard to unrack the first rep was lowered ridiculously slowly as I thought it was going to staple me but somehow I did a real slow grind up, a slow grind on rep 1 when you have another 9 to go never fills you with confidence but anyway I managed to grind out the next 9 reps. Its like I had the strength easily but I lost all my speed, it was strange.

I havent done flyes in years but I think these will help my chest a lot as then when I did incline, I could feel the entire rep in my chest instead of shoulders and triceps.

Not a bad workout but this volume stuff is crap and its getting old after just 2 workouts. And fri I will be hitting my back with a ridiculous amount of volume so were see how that goes. The strange thing is I can see myself lean out very slightly after 4 days of no carbs but I havent lost any weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I think if Doug lived close to me he would come round and man slap me for keep posting these type workouts in this section but here goes :lol:
> 
> Squats: (WU 75x5, 122.5x3, 135x1) WO 122.5x 10sets x 3 reps. 90 seconds rest
> Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 70x10, 10, X-reps
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 12.5x7,7, X-reps
> 
> Bench Press42.5x5, ) ???x5, ???x5, 102.5x10
> Flyes: 12.5x 7, 7, Rest Pause
> Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 5, X-reps
> Incline Flyes: 12.5x7, Rest Pause
> Knees Up
> 
> So 10 sets of squats is a killer, muscles that never hurt on heavy sets burn like crazy but I feel like 10x3 is an awesome scheme for building muscle and strength.
> 
> I was shagged after squats as Im doing low carb and 10 sets would be hard enough when your 100% let alone low carb. I actually put the weight down after 5 reps but told myself to man up and finish the sets.
> 
> I pretty much had enough after Squats but had an entire Bench routine to go through. I had to try 2-3 times to unrack the bar on my first warm up, not a good start. Every rep felt awful and I was shaking just holding the weight at the top. Remember thinking on my first work set that I may as well just quit but carried on. Anyway the top set was so hard to unrack the first rep was lowered ridiculously slowly as I thought it was going to staple me but somehow I did a real slow grind up, a slow grind on rep 1 when you have another 9 to go never fills you with confidence but anyway I managed to grind out the next 9 reps. Its like I had the strength easily but I lost all my speed, it was strange.
> 
> I havent done flyes in years but I think these will help my chest a lot as then when I did incline, I could feel the entire rep in my chest instead of shoulders and triceps.
> 
> Not a bad workout but this volume stuff is crap and its getting old after just 2 workouts. And fri I will be hitting my back with a ridiculous amount of volume so were see how that goes. The strange thing is I can see myself lean out very slightly after 4 days of no carbs but I havent lost any weight.


James, I think you should take yourself outside and man slap yourself, New Zealand is a brisk old walk away from sunny Cornwall :lol:

Doing a squat session and a bench session together James!!! Are you f mad 

Anyhow back to proper lifting 

Week 4 Cycle 12 de load - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 80KGX5 - 100KGX5 - 120KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Done :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Its an indirect direct split workout so you hit each muscle group trice a week but its a strange old workout as you have a big squat and bench workout on the wed and a deadlift and high volume back on the fri. Squats and deadlifts are just to close especially when your 3rd workout is mostly training arms so may swap these around and it would mean that I'm hitting my chest before triceps which is always better and it will give me 4 days between squats and deadlifts.

Back to proper lifting, I like that. Dont worry doug you only have to put up with it for another 5 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Its an indirect direct split workout so you hit each muscle group trice a week but its a strange old workout as you have a big squat and bench workout on the wed and a deadlift and high volume back on the fri. Squats and deadlifts are just to close especially when your 3rd workout is mostly training arms so may swap these around and it would mean that I'm hitting my chest before triceps which is always better and it will give me 4 days between squats and deadlifts.
> 
> Back to proper lifting, I like that. Dont worry doug you only have to put up with it for another 5 weeks.


Maybe mate, but I think you'd be better off doing a bodybuilding rep version of the 5/3/1 with BBB, this would give you loads more effective volume, you'd be hitting each area with more intensity/focus and you would still be able to incorporate the overload principle to enhance your results by increasing the weight used :thumb:

A Split routine with squats and bench together :doublesho will drain you to the extent that.

1. You have to use much less weight on the second split of the routine - less weight - less effective.
2. You have pre exhausted/fatigued yourself so that you cannot focus on increasing the weight used on the second split - less effective.
3. You may end up using bad form due to your pre exhausted state.
4. I cannot for the life of me see how anyone can remain motivated with such a routine  And that is key to a routine that you stick with for a few years while you build up your size.

Bodybuilding Example; (Use the standard 5/3/1 template in regards to how the bodyparts are split)

Week 1 = 10 -10 - 10 Work sets + 2x5x10 BBB assistance.
Week 2 = 8 - 8 - 8 Work sets + 2x5x10 BBB assistance.
Week 3 = 6 - 6 - 6 Work sets + 2x5x10 BBB assistance.
Week 4 all De load sets 10 reps.

To further add to this you could set yourself to add weight every time you achieved the rep goals instead of once per month, you could also do some of the last sets to failure.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 cycle 12 - 5/3/1 - Quick De load

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 31KGX5 - 40KGX5 - 47KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Done very quick! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> And that is key to a routine that you stick with for a few years while you build up your size.


I'm with you Doug, i put on good size just on the standard 5/3/1 workout so I don't need this and theres no way I could keep it going for years as its week 2 and I'm already not liking it but its only for 6 weeks so I'm going to stick with it just for abit of a trial. I lost zero weight last week even on a low calorie, carb restricted diet but lost size around my waist, I put this down to the more volume workout forcing abit more water into your muscles which kept me the same weight even tho I lost fat.

And I agree that it will be hard to increase my bench after I done such an intense exercise such as squats but I'm sure my body will adapt. People do full body workouts all the time and 5x5 SL has bench after squats.

Anyway I must be in better shape than I think after the weekend I just had, very entertaining to say the least :doublesho:lol: Being single definitely has its perks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Anyway I must be in better shape than I think after the weekend I just had, very entertaining to say the least :doublesho:lol: Being single definitely has its perks.


Screwing all weekend = dam good for fat burning :devil: :thumb: And to add to that you are ensuring that some nice lady is getting their daily protein requirements! :doublesho  :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> And I agree that it will be hard to increase my bench after I done such an intense exercise such as squats but I'm sure my body will adapt. People do full body workouts all the time and 5x5 SL has bench after squats.


Beginners certainly, But at our level mate, the heavy weights take their toll and the more advanced you become the less you can train, splitting the body parts IMHO is the best way to get optimum strength/size results. Hence you have had to lower the weights to use the double split routine. I could not imagine combining a squat session ending 200kg followed by a bench routine ending in 130kg :doublesho

Also, I have always loved the amount of focus training the body parts singularly gives me, when I was young I got my best results from a 5 day a week split (Got the stretch marks to prove it )

I would break the days up depending on how I felt, generally after 10-14 weeks I was totally broken and then would take one full week off and start again.

Old PR's
Bench: 180kg
Close grip bench 180kg 
Behind neck press: 84kg for reps.
Squat: 210kg
Deadlift: 210kg
Stiff legged deadlift 140kg for reps
Barbell row: ??? Cant remember lol!  was somewhere around 140kg me thinks.
Standing calf raise: 400kg (Grade 1 muscle tear suffered in left calf just as I hit this weight)
Barbell curl (ultra Strict form, using an arm blaster): 54kg for reps.

Set totals would vary depending on body part. This is a rough idea of what I used to do.

Monday = Bench 12 sets (5 sets 1-4 reps, 7 sets 6-8 reps)
Tuesday = Triceps/biceps 20 sets (10 sets 1-4 reps, 10 sets 6-8 reps)
Wednesday = Back 12 sets (5 sets 1-4 reps, 7 sets 6-8 reps)
Thursday = Shoulders 12 sets (5 sets 1-4 reps, 7 sets 6-8 reps)
Friday = Legs 20 sets (10 1-4 reps, 10 sets 6-8 reps)

As you can see I was doing something similar to the 5/3/1 just by learning on my own (No internet in those days) And as now the only supplement was a protein powder, even in those days it was obvious that supplements were just that, supplements to your already good diet.

Day off today then cycle 13 starts tomorrow, I've de loaded the bench session so I can focus on my squat this cycle (want that 200kg!!! :devil

Keep posting your workouts though James as it still all about the Iron mate :thumb:


----------



## mikex

Decent numbers there ^^ bench seems to dominate though. Need to get those squat and DL numbers up 

For anyone that cares, Im an amateur strongman. (no6 in England this year) so if you want strength / conditioning advice then drop me a line.


----------



## ITHAQVA

mikex said:


> Decent numbers there ^^ bench seems to dominate though. Need to get those squat and DL numbers up
> 
> For anyone that cares, Im an amateur strongman. (no6 in England this year) so if you want strength / conditioning advice then drop me a line.


Welcome to the thread MikeX! :thumb:

The above figures were when I was around 25 years old, I'm 45 now :doublesho

I was a little obsessed with my bench in those days, these days I would love to just get to 150x1 on my bench although I get a feeling it could take another 12 months (I'm on 130kg at the moment).

Any advice on getting my bench up would be great, I'm confident I can get my Deadlift to 230kgx1 and my squat 200kg this time around. That's as heavy as I want to go these days. Then I want to reduce my body fat.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Screwing all weekend = dam good for fat burning :devil: :thumb: And to add to that you are ensuring that some nice lady is getting their daily protein requirements! :doublesho  :lol:


Well its rude to gossip so I just say stunning 24yr old, a spa, a shower and we went straight from the club to her place so nothing to wear :thumb: 4 separate people in the clubs stopped me and called me a legend or wanted to shake my hand :lol: That was Fri night, same again Sunday.

I'm not at the same level as you Doug, my squat is still crap so I can get away with it a bit easier. But I haven't lowered my weights, I have transferred the 5/3/1 first exercise straight over into this program to keep a strength focus on the first exercise except squats where I'm trying something new as I just feel like my squat is the only exercise that's not moving.. I have just added the other exercises in around the 5/3/1.


----------



## mikex

ITHAQVA said:


> Welcome to the thread MikeX! :thumb:
> 
> The above figures were when I was around 25 years old, I'm 45 now :doublesho
> 
> I was a little obsessed with my bench in those days, these days I would love to just get to 150x1 on my bench although I get a feeling it could take another 12 months (I'm on 130kg at the moment).
> 
> Any advice on getting my bench up would be great, I'm confident I can get my Deadlift to 230kgx1 and my squat 200kg this time around. That's as heavy as I want to go these days. Then I want to reduce my body fat.
> 
> :thumb:


Nice to see you still going into your mid 40's! not sure theres many out there capable of those lifts at your age! well done bud!

Best things I can advise for bench are the following:

Lean to arch and keep your back tight. There a series of videos on Youtube called 'so you think you can bench' which goes deep into the powerlifting style. While not to everyone's taste, there are some valuable tips for the gym lifter.

Pause every rep on the chest. even the warm ups.

Weighted dips are your friend.

good luck with it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

mikex said:


> Nice to see you still going into your mid 40's! not sure theres many out there capable of those lifts at your age! well done bud!
> 
> Best things I can advise for bench are the following:
> 
> Lean to arch and keep your back tight. There a series of videos on Youtube called 'so you think you can bench' which goes deep into the powerlifting style. While not to everyone's taste, there are some valuable tips for the gym lifter.
> 
> Pause every rep on the chest. even the warm ups.
> 
> Weighted dips are your friend.
> 
> good luck with it.


Cheers Mike always good to get support, age is just a number :thumb:

Funny you mention the vids, I have them all and they are my place to go every time I stall on bench, its an excellent series, its not everyone's taste because it teaches you how to lift properly. I like Dave's attitude, straight to the point. I often find when I stall its because my bench form is lose due to getting close to my next limit.

Looks like I'm going to have to cut my power rack j hooks, the lip is a bit high and I cant just pull the bar forward of them so my upper body tightness probably loosens as I get the bar into position :thumb:

Like the idea of the rest pause, was considering it for my assistance work to get a feel for it :thumb:

As for dips, I do them bodyweight (107kg) plus 15kg at the moment. Im going to get a band so I can warm up properly so that I can dip with some proper weight.

Bench session is this afternoon :devil:

I've got loads of pdf's and vids on powerlifting if there is anything you need just PM me mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Well its rude to gossip so I just say stunning 24yr old, a spa, a shower and we went straight from the club to her place so nothing to wear :thumb: 4 separate people in the clubs stopped me and called me a legend or wanted to shake my hand :lol: That was Fri night, same again Sunday.
> 
> I'm not at the same level as you Doug, my squat is still crap so I can get away with it a bit easier. But I haven't lowered my weights, I have transferred the 5/3/1 first exercise straight over into this program to keep a strength focus on the first exercise except squats where I'm trying something new as I just feel like my squat is the only exercise that's not moving.. I have just added the other exercises in around the 5/3/1.


Jizzmaster James, new Zealand's powerlifting porn star working on his "Weekend Conditioning manual!" 

I think you should strap her to your prowler and give her a few yards! :doublesho :thumb::devil: :lol:


----------



## mikex

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers Mike always good to get support, age is just a number :thumb:
> 
> Funny you mention the vids, I have them all and they are my place to go every time I stall on bench, its an excellent series, its not everyone's taste because it teaches you how to lift properly. I like Dave's attitude, straight to the point. I often find when I stall its because my bench form is lose due to getting close to my next limit.
> 
> Looks like I'm going to have to cut my power rack j hooks, the lip is a bit high and I cant just pull the bar forward of them so my upper body tightness probably loosens as I get the bar into position :thumb:
> 
> Like the idea of the rest pause, was considering it for my assistance work to get a feel for it :thumb:
> 
> As for dips, I do them bodyweight (107kg) plus 15kg at the moment. Im going to get a band so I can warm up properly so that I can dip with some proper weight.
> 
> Bench session is this afternoon :devil:
> 
> I've got loads of pdf's and vids on powerlifting if there is anything you need just PM me mate :thumb:


Good to hear pal! Looks like your pretty clued up.

Id use dips as an assistance following Bench, so you should be pretty warmed up.

As for rest pause, I didn't mean rest pause in the traditional sense. I meant when your benching, As you lower the bar, pause it on your chest for a second. It will reduce the stretch reflex and change the lift so you have to overcome a static force, rather than relying on the stretch reflex in the muscles to get the bar moving. In layman's terms, it makes it harder, but a more effective way to build strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

mikex said:


> Good to hear pal! Looks like your pretty clued up.
> 
> Id use dips as an assistance following Bench, so you should be pretty warmed up.
> 
> As for rest pause, I didn't mean rest pause in the traditional sense. I meant when your benching, As you lower the bar, pause it on your chest for a second. It will reduce the stretch reflex and change the lift so you have to overcome a static force, rather than relying on the stretch reflex in the muscles to get the bar moving. In layman's terms, it makes it harder, but a more effective way to build strength.


At the moment my dip session is done after my OHP, on bench day I do...more benches (5x10 @85kg, although I'm thinking of adding weight to this assistance group to also help my bench power go up)

I'm with you in regards to the rest at the lower part of the bench :thumb: Was thinking of doing dead benches as this is how I used to bench when I was young. For those of you who don't know what a dead bench is. Its a bench press that is started at the lower position (Bar on Chest) 

My weak point seems to be the start, once I get going, locking out seems ok... for now.

Dead bench linkeee! - http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/bring-your-bench-press-alive-with-the-dead-bench/

Going through my Dave Tate bench vids today :devil:

Thanks for the advice MikeX, always good to get info from advanced lifters, it also helps inspire those of us who are struggling :thumb:

Although I want my 150kg x1 I will break my bench into mini goals from now on to help with motivation.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 87.5KGX5 - 101KGX5 - 114KGX5

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x7 <<<< last set done with a second pause at the bottom of the lift.

DEAD BARBELL ROW 75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice workout, all targets reached :thumb:

Been watching the mighty Dave Tate's " So you think you can bench" videos today, guess what? I monitored my form and tonight felt different, I have most certainly lost some form over the last few months and got a little sloppy with my back arching and therefore losing the stability needed to successfully lift. Tonight's 114kg x 5 felt relatively easy. It may not make my bench go up all of a sudden but at least I now understand partly why my bench is a little behind. I'm going to focus on the feeling I get when I arch nice and tight and keep working on maintaining it. 
Don't know why but it always seems to be my bench form that I struggle with the most.

Thanks for reminding me Mike, that you never stop learning when ya lifting! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 13 - 5/3/1
*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX5 :devil: 
SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10*

Very pleased with this workout, still not using a belt or knee wraps :thumb:

After the 3rd rep on the 178.5kg doubt crept in, the weight wanted to crush me, I said NO! I Dug in, hated the weights :devil: and got my 5 parallel reps :thumb::thumb:
The standing calf raise is getting difficult to complete in the power rack, its hard to maintain balance and rep out while I scrape the bar up and down the inner upright of the rack :lol: Not sure how I will be able to train this lift in safety  I will have to think of something  Not to keen on using heavy duty straps as the weight will be low to the floor, I like the overall strength gained from keeping the bar on your back. I will have to investigate this further.....The games afoot!


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (75x5, 105x3, 135x1) 125x10x3
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 72.5x10, 72.5x10, X-reps
Bulgarian Split Squats: 15x7, 15x7, X-reps
Bench Press: (47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x8, RP 85x9, 85x4, 85x2
Dumbell Flyes 12.5x7, 12.5x7, RP 
Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 70x6, X-reps
Incline Dumbell Flyes: 12.5x7, RP

Wednesday Workout:
Seated Shoulder Press: (30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 50x3, 57.5x3, 65x3, RP 50x8, 50x2, 30x2
Incline One Arm Laterals: 12.5x5, 12.5x5, X-reps
Dumbell Upright Rows: 12.5x7, 12.5x7, 12.5x5
Dips: BWx5, BWx5, BW+17.5x9, BW+17.5x9
Decline Skull Crushers: 20x5, 30x5, 35x9, 35x9, RP 6, 8
Kickbacks: 7.5x7, 7.5x7, RP 3
Barbell Curls: 40x6, 40x4, X-reps
Incline Curls: 7.5x7, 6, X-reps
Concentration curls: 7.5x7, 7, RP, X-reps


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (75x5, 105x3, 135x1) 125x10x3
> Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 72.5x10, 72.5x10, X-reps
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 15x7, 15x7, X-reps
> Bench Press: (47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x8, RP 85x9, 85x4, 85x2
> Dumbell Flyes 12.5x7, 12.5x7, RP
> Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 70x6, X-reps
> Incline Dumbell Flyes: 12.5x7, RP
> 
> Wednesday Workout:
> Seated Shoulder Press: (30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 50x3, 57.5x3, 65x3, RP 50x8, 50x2, 30x2
> Incline One Arm Laterals: 12.5x5, 12.5x5, X-reps
> Dumbell Upright Rows: 12.5x7, 12.5x7, 12.5x5
> Dips: BWx5, BWx5, BW+17.5x9, BW+17.5x9
> Decline Skull Crushers: 20x5, 30x5, 35x9, 35x9, RP 6, 8
> Kickbacks: 7.5x7, 7.5x7, RP 3
> Barbell Curls: 40x6, 40x4, X-reps
> Incline Curls: 7.5x7, 6, X-reps
> Concentration curls: 7.5x7, 7, RP, X-reps


A lot of volume James, keep pumping and posting mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 54.5KGX5 - 63KGX5 - 71KGX4 Form check!!!! 

Dip warm up 3 sets Bodyweight: 3xquarter 3xhalf 3xfull see ** for explanation 

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 45KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Failed 5 reps on the OHP 71kgx5, not surprised, I don't feel recovered from this weeks bench and squat sessions (Doms) and my OHP form/technique is getting sloppy. First 3 reps were ok 4 rep was hard and I made a complete balls up of my breathing on rep 5, so I was stuck there with half a rep for 2 seconds then gave up. I should have held my breath, instead I let it out and inhaled again DOH! My foot stance is also to narrow. Need to re evaluate my OHP form now the weights are getting heavy.

** Found a great way to warm up for weighted dips. Try 3 sets of these:
Bodyweight 3 quarter reps 3 half reps then 3 parallel reps. Worked very well, after doing these the weighted dips were far more comfortable and I felt stronger, I feel more confident to add weight to these now :thumb:

Even with the main work set fail this is still a good workout, once this cycle is complete I will repeat these weights next cycle (14) and see if I can progress past this sticking point.

:devil::devil: Hate those weights people!!!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

A Over head press link in my favourites which I think will be useful, I cant stay away from EliteFTS.com  :thumb:

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/wait-a-couple-weeks-oh-press/

I find Jim's approach to powerlifting, honest, simple and to the point :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (W U70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX5*

Nice! Kept it short today so I can recover a bit better this week, 5x178kg went up better than I expected :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> A lot of volume James, keep pumping and posting mate :thumb:


Its strange as it doesnt actually feel like a lot of volume as your only doing 2 sets per exercise and then adding in an intensity method like X-reps and/or Drop Sets. Used to doing a lot more volume on each exercise but less exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 94KGX3 - 107.5KGX3 - 121KGX3

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Excellent workout :thumb:

Cant understand how I'm struggling with 3x123kg on my bench, this evenings 3x121kg felt easy enough, although I am keeping my core much tighter and focusing on bench form throughout all the bench press exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 147KGX3 - 168KGX3 - 189KGX3

SQUAT  100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10x10*

Sorted the standing calf raise, I found doing the exercise in solid bottomed trainers gives a lot more balance and will allow me to use more weight safely ( I was doing the lift bare foot :doublesho) :thumb:

Excellent workout, I'm feeling very strong in my squat for some reason. The only thing I have changed recently is I now ensure I get at least 200grams of protein per day. My starchy carb intake has been reduced slightly as well. My starchy carb intake comes primarily from different types of beans (Butter beans, Kidney beans and soy beans etc...).

Does protein play that much of a role? I have been reading up on the subject and its interesting to learn how important protein is for the rejuvenation of the body and all of its components (Including internal organs etc..) even though we as a species are omnivorous not carnivorous. Under normal circumstances I don't think protein is as important. But when its comes to sports and more so the strength/muscle building sports you can see the importance of it.

Powerlifters/bodybuilders and weightlifters are forcing their bodies to transform/adapt far beyond what I consider an natural state (the body growing extra muscle mass is very inefficient in so many ways). That's why I think its so hard to gain muscle, if you think of it that way you can see how most of this works or not. Also under natural conditions you would not experience consistent stress to the body it would be inconsistent. Hence why I think it takes a year or so of consistent training before the body learns that this new heavy lifestyle is "the norm" and adapts more freely, I have noticed far more muscle mass in the last 6 months (My weight isn't changing much, but my body composition most certainly is and I'm 45)

I've learnt so much over the last 23 months, its amazing and its also funny how the obvious isn't so obvious until you experience it yourself, you seem to be continuously learning, re checking form, re adapting your diet etc..

200kgx1 Squat next week :doublesho Wish me luck


----------



## Bod42

Good luck with the 200kg squat Doug but Im sure you will smash it. Gives me a big push as I should be up with you not pussying around with the crap squat weights I'm on.

I read 10s of thousands of weightlifting articles in my years but i still like looking at real life examples, powerlifters, strongman, bodybuilders, athletes, they all eat high protein, is there a link, of course there is. And talk to any top trainer about trying to get the same results with a vegetarian or vegan person, its just a lot harder and the only difference with them is lack of protein. Also look at trainers to the stars who get massive turn arounds in short periods of time by flooding their systems with large amounts of protein and I have done this with a guy I trained as well and his results were amazing. So in the end, yes I think protein plays a massive part.

Oh and I've increased my protein substantially lately and completely cut out carbs, yes I have lost a rep of strength but I lost size round my waist and 2kgs but I'm still the same size if not slightly bigger which is the complete opposite of what normally happens when I deplete carbs.


----------



## Oats

Long time, no post....

Went on hols for three weeks, then had no kitchen for another three. **** tonne of stuff at work as well so just doing anything\jack **** has been the goal.

Done same 5s cycle about three times getting back to my pre holiday rep count and very little assistance. Done work capacity\metcon cicuits twice a week as they're nice when you've been sat down all day. Now I've caught back up i've started my 3s cycle. Dealift 147x4 felt awfully heavy last night.

Doing first set last twice a week on squats has helped tidy up my technique. I'm hoping that better technique and more volume will help me get a good run on them before stalling\inflamming my knee.

Strap broke on my old shoes so got some Addidas weightlifting shoes for £70. Picture to follow 



ITHAQVA said:


> Excellent workout, I'm feeling very strong in my squat for some reason. The only thing I have changed recently is I now ensure I get at least 200grams of protein per day. My starchy carb intake has been reduced slightly as well. My starchy carb intake comes primarily from different types of beans (Butter beans, Kidney beans and soy beans etc...).


I'm doing 200ch, 200p and 80f each day and have noticed the difference. 200p is soemthing I have to be really conscious in achieving. I would have thought you'd need to be up in the 240s at your weight? Have you read Lyle Mc's Protein Book? Maybe we need a Dropbox.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 59KGX3 - 67KGX3 - 75.5KGX2

DIP Warm up routine (3 sets of 3x.25, 3x .50 and 3x full reps) :thumb:

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, fail on 3 reps for the last work set on the OHP, I will de load back to cycle 12 weights for the OHP on the next cycle.

Decided to go up to 50kg on my assistance OHP after reading Wendler's advice that going as heavy as you can for 5 sets of 10 will help with progressing on the main OHP work set. Really odd thing is the 5 sets of 10 at 50kg felt relatively easy WTF???? 

Somewhere at the begging of this thread we discussed that the OHP was difficult to warm up for the work sets, I may experiment with higher rep lighter weight warm up sets to see if there is any truth in this.

My OHP form is still rubbish but I'm working on it 

The dip warm up routine I'm now doing is making a MASSIVE difference in my dip power :thumb:

Excellent!!!! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Long time, no post....
> 
> Strap broke on my old shoes so got some Addidas weightlifting shoes for £70. Picture to follow
> 
> I'm doing 200ch, 200p and 80f each day and have noticed the difference. 200p is soemthing I have to be really conscious in achieving. I would have thought you'd need to be up in the 240s at your weight? Have you read Lyle Mc's Protein Book? Maybe we need a Dropbox.


I wouldn't use shoes Col, I do all my workouts in socks or bare feet, no belt, no knee wraps. It feels safer which is strange, but true :thumb:

Sod carbohydrates, they are evil things :devil:  and we humans need very little of them, I've reduced my starchy carbs hugely, but keeping loads of green veg in my diet and of course pulses/seeds and nuts for extra varied protein and dietary fibre :thumb:

I think 200grams of protein per day is sufficient for me as I don't want to consume more than needed for my "Lean body mass" I've monitored my weight since 16-12-12 and it has remained very constant (around 106-107Kg).

Since taking my diet more seriously and being very strict on ensuring I get at least 200grams of protein per day I have noticed I'm becoming more muscular and my muscles have started to become harder. I'm hoping to get more clued up on my diet as the next few months go by. As soon as I have my squat and deadlift goals sorted I want to start losing body fat, 5kg of it to be exact :thumb:

Protein for the Win!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 147KGX3 - 168KGX3 - 189KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

JUMPS (Body weight) 5x5x5x5x5*

Good workout, the last rep on the 189kg x3 was a bit ugly  was hard to keep my back straight. Undecided weather I should move over to traditional deadlift style for safety instead of the touch and go that I currently do.


----------



## Bod42

Monday
Squats: (WU 75x5, 110x3, 145x1) WO 130kg x 10 sets x 3 reps
Bulgarian Split Squats: 20kg x 2 sets x 7reps, X-reps

Ya I know 130kg is nothing impressive but this is during a diet and only 90 secs rest and that short rest for 10 sets really catches up with you.

This is supposed to be my Squats and Bench workout but I went out Fri and then out to the rugby Sat, got absolutely **** faced on both occasions and only got an hours sleep both nights so I still felt hungover on Monday night so I got in and did my squats as punishment but decided to change my workout to 4 days per week so I can Squat and bench on separate days.

I don't do much cardio, I rely on changing the rest periods and volume of my weight lifting and I do throw in some complex's at the end of workouts sometimes but there's proof thats weights increase your fittness as I'm 27 but was told I have the stamia of an 18 yr old and the most powerful hips ever. See weightlifting benefits all aspects of your life :doublesho

But on a serious note, I'm going to cut down on my drinking a lot, its been a mental/fun few weeks/months but its Tues and I still feel like **** so its got to stop.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 13

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101KGX5 - 114KGX3 - 128KGX1

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Excellent workout, felt strong all through :thumb:

What I don't get is how easy the 128kgx1 felt. The only real difference is this time I kept focused on my bench form. I ensured every bench rep in today's workout was done with good form, arch in back and core rigid, seems to have made a big difference :thumb:

I concur with James, weight training/powerlifting does have it's advantages in other areas of life :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 200KGX1 *

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:

So here I am, hamstring torn twice and just under two years of powerlifting. I've just made my first ultimate goal! 

I can tell you for a fact 200kg feels really  heavy, it felt like an eternity at the bottom of the squat, once I started to move up from parallel the weight felt more manageable, but still very heavy.

So were do I go from here? I think I'll make up a cardboard box at just the right height (just below parallel) and use that as a guide for my 1 rep max, to ensure it stays parallel all the time :thumb:

I'll also make an attempt to build on the 10 rep assistance weights to hopefully build some more muscle mass. 
Example cycle - week 1, 5 sets10 reps @ 110kg, week 2, 5 sets 10 reps @120kg and week 3, 5 sets 10 reps @ 130kg. I see no point in going any heavier.

I'll most certainly start adding weight to my standing calf raise, unsure how heavy I'll go at the moment, but it wont be heavier than 200kg for 5 sets of 10 reps.

I'm also hoping to get my deadlift to 230kg for 1 rep by cycle 20 (March 2014, as long as I stay injury free).

As for the bench and Overhead press, I'm resigned to the fact it may take another 12 months. But I've learned that patience is just another key factor in being successful at this game.

I'll get a 200kgx1 video put up some time as well, once I get my camera set up in my powerlifting room, or get the missus to do it (lol a full video of her thumb no doubt!)  :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Oats

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 cycle 13 - 5/3/1
> 
> *SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 200KGX1 *


Great to hear. Well done Doug :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> Great to hear. Well done Doug :thumb:


Thanks Col :thumb:

Its hard to put into words how hard the rep felt, but if anyone is starting out, be prepared.
As you take the weight out of the rack you'll find it hard to just stand let alone drop down to parallel and then lift it back up and rack it. I almost gave up at the bottom of the lift.

I wont be going any heavier on my squat.


----------



## Bod42

Awesome work Doug. You ask where next, I would say 202.5kg :thumb:

Tuesday
*Bench Press (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x10 PM 140kg RP 80x12,3,2
Flat Flyes: 10x7,7 RP 3
Incline Press: 70x10, 7 X-reps
Incline Flyes: 10x7, RP 3*

Pretty pleased with the 10 reps, I think I have found a sweet spot of 10, 8, 6 on my Bench Press as it just keeps going up and I had a few in the Tank. Probably going to drop the RP work from Bench and Shoulder Press as my shoulders feel like crap at the moment, the worse they felt in a long time, its actually painful to ride my motorbike so I will be skipping Shoulder Press tonight and doing a complete RC rehab program.

I also felt like my shoulder tore slightly during flyes so iced it for hours after the workout so this may have an impact on my upper body exercises for abit.

I had to spot my mate in the gym yesterday so couldnt resist having a mess around, 62.5kg for 40 reps, zero rest at the top. Was quite happy with that and I think it proves how important strength training is even for endurance athletes.

Abit of an update on this program as well, yes it may add a tiny bit more size BUT I still think this is only made possible due to the strength work and if you started with this program then you wouldnt get very far. Also these building workouts of working body parts instead of exercises just seems so unbalanced. An entire workout of just chest is an injury waiting to happen, I know I work back later in the week but its not the same as working them in the same workout. Only another 2.5 weeks of this and then I will be moving to 5/3/1 BBB.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys not posted on here for ages but been keeping an eye on the thread. not long started doing 5/3/1 with bbb as you guys seem to be getting some good results. I'll post tonights workout tomorrw and you guys can tell me what you think. Cheers


----------



## ntynan528

last nights work out

overhead press 3x45kg 3x52.5kg 10x57.5kg

dead 3x105kg 3x120kg 9x135kg

overhead press 5x10x35kg

dead 5x10x70kg

dips 5x10xbodyweight - 33kg

curls 5x10x20kg

Good workout, loving the mix of heavy weights with low reps and and the light weights with high reps. Gets a bit of a sweat on and lets you feel like youve worked hard without the zombie state 5x5 left me in. Week 3 next week ill try and keep updated.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> last nights work out
> 
> overhead press 3x45kg 3x52.5kg 10x57.5kg
> 
> dead 3x105kg 3x120kg 9x135kg
> 
> overhead press 5x10x35kg
> 
> dead 5x10x70kg
> 
> dips 5x10xbodyweight - 33kg
> 
> curls 5x10x20kg
> 
> Good workout, loving the mix of heavy weights with low reps and and the light weights with high reps. Gets a bit of a sweat on and lets you feel like youve worked hard without the zombie state 5x5 left me in. Week 3 next week ill try and keep updated.


Hi ntynan528,
Is there any reason why you've mixed deadlifts with the OHP 
I would also lose the curls, they are a complete waste of time at this point in your development. Stick to the barbell basics for the next two years and focus on your overall size :thumb:

The best advice I can give you young guys is forget the isolation stuff, your wasting your time. Even if your into bodybuilding I would recommend the 5/3/1 with BBB to get your body size up :thumb:


----------



## fitz

Well after your recommendation to start the 5x5 from scratch, time has gone very quickly indeed. My last workout saw me hit with success getting 5x5

Squat 42.5kg
OHP 30kg
Deadlift 60kg

And before that
Squat 40kg
Bench 30kg
Barbell row 40kg

One question i do have though is im currently tracking my progress on the stronglift app and for Deadlift it says just to do 1 set of 5 reps?? bumping up the weight by 5kg each workout. Is this correct or should i be doing 5 sets? 

I have to say though, I am feeling stronger now than i ever have as a whole. Im an ectomorph and find it hard to put on weigh previously doing a mix of compound and isolation moves but this programme feels much more rounded and beneficial to the whole body.

My OHP is getting to a point where i feel like im going to start failing but everything else feels like i can keep building up the weighs :thumb:

Thanks for the help
Tom


----------



## ITHAQVA

fitz said:


> Well after your recommendation to start the 5x5 from scratch, time has gone very quickly indeed. My last workout saw me hit with success getting 5x5
> 
> Squat 42.5kg
> OHP 30kg
> Deadlift 60kg
> 
> And before that
> Squat 40kg
> Bench 30kg
> Barbell row 40kg
> 
> One question i do have though is im currently tracking my progress on the stronglift app and for Deadlift it says just to do 1 set of 5 reps?? bumping up the weight by 5kg each workout. Is this correct or should i be doing 5 sets?
> 
> I have to say though, I am feeling stronger now than i ever have as a whole. Im an ectomorph and find it hard to put on weigh previously doing a mix of compound and isolation moves but this programme feels much more rounded and beneficial to the whole body.
> 
> My OHP is getting to a point where i feel like im going to start failing but everything else feels like i can keep building up the weighs :thumb:
> 
> Thanks for the help
> Tom


Good to see your sticking with it Tom :thumb:

Deadlift is 1x5 reps, because the lift taxes the body so much :thumb:

If you are struggling to add mass drink 2 x 500-600ml whey protein drinks mixed with skimmed milk. This will give you approx 780cals and 110 grams of protein per day :thumb:

Stick with it, be consistent and you'll succeed, if I can do it at my age, anyone can


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 63KGX5 - 71KGX3 - 80KGX1

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Happy with this workout, the 80kgx1 on the OHP was pretty hard, I got a little stuck about half way up but made the rep, no matter how ugly it was 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

fitz said:


> I have to say though, I am feeling stronger now than i ever have as a whole. Im an ectomorph and find it hard to put on weigh previously doing a mix of compound and isolation moves but this programme feels much more rounded and beneficial to the whole body.
> 
> My OHP is getting to a point where i feel like im going to start failing but everything else feels like i can keep building up the weighs :thumb:
> 
> Thanks for the help
> Tom


Sorry did answer these in previous post 

There is nothing better for strength and muscle mass than compound/multi joint exercises. The lifts don't necessarily have to be very heavy either, although the more weight you load the more the central nervous system gets taxed and therefore the bodies response (Strength and muscle growth) is quicker.

The reason a barbell is so effective is the ability to increase the resistance (Progressive overload).

Body weight exercises are also very effective (Chins, pull ups, dips, push ups and Glute ham raises) but the ability of adding weight is not so easy. hence the good old fashioned barbell is such an effective tool :thumb:

Never think that by doing an isolation exercise that you are hitting the muscle group harder/will grow quicker at your level. Most of these types of workouts came from the high intensity days by pro bodybuilders that were at such a level that steroids had to be used to be able to compete at their level.

The OHP is generally were everyone experiences their first plateau, the lifts that involve the smaller and weaker muscle groups tend to plateau first, the larger/stronger muscle groups keep going due to the sheer amount of muscle involved in the larger compound lifts (Squat and Deadlift).

Supplements, I wouldn't bother with any other than a good quality whey protein powder to help you reach your desired daily protein level. I find it very difficult to eat 200grams of food protein per day, I would feel totally bloated, so Whey is a good choice for me. If you are able to eat you daily requirement via natural unprocessed whole foods then you should.

I've tried many of the other main supplements for sore joints and Creatine, made absolutely no difference. Creatine naturally occurs in protein based foods especially Salmon and tuna.

If you can get to the desired weights proscribed by the stronglifts site, consider moving over to the original 5/3/1 with BBB, I found the variation of this workout helped greatly with sore joints which I experienced a lot once I moved over to the 1x5 (I tried "glucosamine and chondroitin" and "Cissus" they did absolutely bugger all to help ) Moving over to the 5/3/1 made a massive difference :thumb: (I would put this down to the joints being given time to recover from heavy powerlifting sessions due to the 5/3/1 varied load rep scheme, joints take far longer to recover etc...)

Its well worth reading through this thread, I bet all your questions will be answered here. Don't set your goals to high, you will need to stick with it for two/three years (Consistent training).

Enjoy your new journey! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 200KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

JUMPS 5x5x5x5x5 (These are done approx. 10 seconds after the last 5x10 deadlift set, rest between jump sets= 5 deep breaths )*

The 200kgx1 Deadlift felt heavy, I'm 99% sure I made a competition "good lift", but I plan on repeating this cycles weights next cycle. I'll get the missus to form check me on my next 200kgx1 deadlift before I move on :thumb:

Might also be a good idea to use this reload to move over to the traditional style of deadlift for at least the work sets to ensure my deadlift technique is in the "good lift" category :thumb:

No I'm not going to compete, but IMHO for my lifts to count on this thread the 1 rep sets should be good enough to pass as a "good lift" in competition 

I've also constructed a slim cardboard box to go between my legs for my squats. Its 350mm high. As soon as my ass touches the box, I know I've gone parallel :thumb: (Brings a whole new meaning to a box squat!)

De load next week to give the old body a well earned rest 

Treat tonight = mahoosive Chinese takeaway! :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

HI guys, the reason that i press and deadlift on the same day is that I only train two days per week. I have taken this workout from a template in the 5/3/1 book that I have.

As for the curls, I understand that this might not be the best use of my gym time but feel that after my compound exercises in 5/3/1 and my bbb assistance the curls along with the dips this can help strenghten my arms and help in my other lifts.

Cheers for the feedback its the reason why i've started posting here again


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> HI guys, the reason that i press and deadlift on the same day is that I only train two days per week. I have taken this workout from a template in the 5/3/1 book that I have.
> 
> As for the curls, I understand that this might not be the best use of my gym time but feel that after my compound exercises in 5/3/1 and my bbb assistance the curls along with the dips this can help strenghten my arms and help in my other lifts.
> 
> Cheers for the feedback its the reason why i've started posting here again


I would strongly advise you move over to a four day week split mate. I'm 45 and can train four days a week without recovery issues (So far ).

A two day a week split will hinder your progress in strength and muscle size greatly. I would say if you want it enough you will FIND time to train four days a week :thumb:

The Bicep helps with stabilising on the OHP and bench, however if you want to help increase arm size and power try the close grip bench press or dip. Pull ups and chins are also good if your light enough to do them :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

I understand that the four day split would be better but time only allows for two gym days that i can consistently achieve. That said once the weather gets worse some of my other commitments will subside. If my two day split isn't working in the future I will have to choose what I want to do but for now I'll stick with it.

Well done on both your 200kg lifts. This is the kind of strength levels that I'd like to achieve myself over the next year to 18 months if I can train consistently and stay injury free.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> I understand that the four day split would be better but time only allows for two gym days that i can consistently achieve. That said once the weather gets worse some of my other commitments will subside. If my two day split isn't working in the future I will have to choose what I want to do but for now I'll stick with it.
> 
> Well done on both your 200kg lifts. This is the kind of strength levels that I'd like to achieve myself over the next year to 18 months if I can train consistently and stay injury free.


No worries mate, just want to make you aware of the facts, to reach a 200kg squat and deadlift will take a lot if you only plan to train twice a week.

Thanks, it felt very heavy, I'm not confident the 230kg deadlift will happen as quick as I would like but I will continue to work at it  :devil:

If you get into this and can afford the investment I would strongly advise you buy a power rack and Olympic weight set :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> No worries mate, just want to make you aware of the facts, to reach a 200kg squat and deadlift will take a lot if you only plan to train twice a week.
> 
> Thanks, it felt very heavy, I'm not confident the 230kg deadlift will happen as quick as I would like but I will continue to work at it  :devil:
> 
> If you get into this and can afford the investment I would strongly advise you buy a power rack and Olympic weight set :thumb:


Buying my own rack and weights isn't an option for me at the moment as I don't have a garage where I stay. Would be fantastic not to have to travel to the gym tho.

Gym tonight for squat and bench press. I'll post up my workout tomorrow.

Thanks:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I feel the days per week is personal preference, if you can commit to 2 days per week every single week vs 4 days per week and missing sessions then your going to make better progress on 2 days per week. I had rugby's players on 2 days per week for years and they do very well on it.

If your talking absolutely optimum performance then would 4 days per week be better, maybe, would 2 days per week be better, maybe.

But I'm with Doug on the arms, rather you spent your time on Rotary Cuff or Prehab exercises than arms. Most old school body builders believed that you had to put a stone of weight on for every inch gain in your arms, unless your a genetic freak then you just dont get 19" arms at say 70kg no matter how much you train arms. Your better smashing your food and big heavy compound exercises.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys, cheers for the advice. I'm taking it all on board.

Last nights workout week 3 cycle 1

squat 5 90kg 3 102.5 kg 5 115kg

bench press 5 77.5kg 3 90kg 10 100kg

squat 50kg 5*10

bench 50kg 5*10

bent over row 50kg 5*10

calf raise 50kg 5*10

Workout went well, one more workout to go and I'll be on cycle 2 as i'm not having a rest week. This follows what I have read in 5/3/1 for two day splits. I'll look thru what you guys have posted here and whats in my 5/3/1 and change up my assistance workt. I now also have a better idea of weights for my bbb so I'll also change that up.

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 13 - 5/3/1

De load week 

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 55KGX5 - 68KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Really glad of this de load week after last weeks heavy stuff :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday session (done tuesday)

Squats: (WU 75x5, 112.5x3, 145x1) 132.5x10x3
Bench Press: (Wu 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x5) 85x3, 97.5x3, 110x8 PM 139.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 10

So I took out the flyes on this workout as for one they are really playing havock with my shoulders and their bad enough as it is at the moment. Also I got bloody spiked at the weekend and still felt like crap so I thought about taking the week off but didnt want to take a week off because someone else is a worthless piece of  Quite scary only having 3 drinks and then next thing I new I woke up in my mates bed wondering where da hell I was and how I got there like 5 hours later.

Anyway a nice workout, those 90 secs rest are starting to catch up with me on squats. And the bench felt real easy, still miles below my max reps.

Trained another couple Monday and another guy last night so starting to help a fair few people with their training which I always enjoy. Started them all included the girl on 5x5 and zero weight. Had to modify the girls program slightly as shes not strong enough for an olympic bar yet but she will get there. Spent some time with my training partner on his Bench form friday as well, he has been murdering his first 2 reps and then struggling with the next 3 which is strange and I worked out its because he's over extending at the top and losing his back tightness so worked on doing an inverted row to set up on the bench, then locking the elbows instead of pushing up. Comes back to the gym Monday and smashes a PR, awesome.


----------



## ntynan528

Not great that you got spiked, glad your alright. Good to hear that you have guys and girls on 5x5 with no weight. I tired to get a few guys I know to do it when i started. Not one of them took me up on it. I'm stronger now and dont think I've worked out as consistantly as them. Now i have my two dedicated days with 5/3/1 and better eating I'm hoping to really show them.


----------



## Oats

There was a good discussion on SS a while ago between the coaches. Programme they all suggested is pretty much 5\3\1 but sets accross. Seems that a choice of full body OR main lift + 2 assistance is a very common one.

*5\3\1 Cycle*

It's been about eight weeks of disruption so it was nice to get to the end of this cycle. Need to pick up on work capacity ciruits again but at least my lifts have come back without having to reset yet again.

Press 55 x 2 Main goal so always happy when this goes up.

Bench 79 x 2 technique is gash. My left foot was off the floor on last rep!

Dealift 152 x3

Squat 100 x 5

Squats are still my nemisis. I hate them and hate myself for being so  at them. Feels like I'm slow and tight on the descent. On video it look like I bomb down. Then my knees move back on the ascent and I can see all the power leaking out through excess movement. That said, getting used to high bar and had DOMs in my numb butt. Shows having a physio sticking their elbow in there for 30 minutes is having an effect and they starting to join in the work!

*First Set Last* - going well. Press and bench on their days and squats on both deadlift and squat day. Adds bit of time but I can feel the difference in slight DOMS. I'm mainly using them to tidy up on technique and hoping that in squats particularly it will help. Also, 108 more reps over a cycle must help squat volume even if it is around 70-80% of max.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Oats said:


> There was a good discussion on SS a while ago between the coaches. Programme they all suggested is pretty much 531 but sets accross. Seems that a choice of full body OR main lift + 2 assistance is a very common one.
> 
> *531 Cycle*
> 
> It's been about eight weeks of disruption so it was nice to get to the end of this cycle. Need to pick up on work capacity ciruits again but at least my lifts have come back without having to reset yet again.
> 
> Press 55 x 2 Main goal so always happy when this goes up.
> 
> Bench 79 x 2 technique is gash. My left foot was off the floor on last rep!
> 
> Dealift 152 x3
> 
> Squat 100 x 5
> 
> Squats are still my nemisis. I hate them and hate myself for being so  at them. Feels like I'm slow and tight on the descent. On video it look like I bomb down. Then my knees move back on the ascent and I can see all the power leaking out through excess movement. That said, getting used to high bar and had DOMs in my numb butt. Shows having a physio sticking their elbow in there for 30 minutes is having an effect and they starting to join in the work!
> 
> *First Set Last* - going well. Press and bench on their days and squats on both deadlift and squat day. Adds bit of time but I can feel the difference in slight DOMS. I'm mainly using them to tidy up on technique and hoping that in squats particularly it will help. Also, 108 more reps over a cycle must help squat volume even if it is around 70-80% of max.


Re: Bench, your foot come of the ground :doublesho
All jokes aside Col, I assumed you used the powerlifting style of benching, feet dug into the floor back slightly arched.

Re: Squat.
Col, I have no idea why you use a high bar position  To me that's just like keying your own car, dumb! 

Think about the mechanics of the squat, balance, centre of gravity etc.. In all the powerelifting videos I have watched the lifters seem to use the low bar position (Personally I think its a normal powerlifting squat) I think there is far too much influence by the non powerlifting community, hence the stupid low bar term. You would be far better off using the powerlifting position to get to your goals.

For me personally the best way to squat is the powerlifting bar position, leg position wider than your shoulders and NO BELT! As soon as I stopped using a belt both my squat and deadlift felt easier, I gained more flexibility and control in my core, also try bare foot, keep your feet nice and flat, Toes pointing outward. Stabilise with your core, lift with your legs.

Not sure if you seen them as you post so infrequently , but we have links to great bench and squat vids in this thread, well worth viewing, I can re post them if you want me to mate :thumb:

Enter your powerlifting room/arena as a warrior, be more than just an average human. If you don't listen to music, you should, get on something fast and aggressive, not pathetic metal but real fukin hardcore stuff, get mad, hate the weights! Whatever it takes.

The more you do this sport the more you learn it takes a very particular type of person to succeed, you've got to really want to succeed, you make time to lift consistently. The lifting becomes a very important part of your life and more importantly a part of who YOU are :thumb:


----------



## profoundoblu

Please could you link those vids, I start as 5x5 a few weeks ago and could def work on my squat form!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 cycle 13 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 84KGX5 - 105KGX5 - 125KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

De load session complete. The box I've made up is spot on, every time I touch it I get a perfect parallel squat, also it forces me to concentrate on my squat posture/technique. It highlights my weakest link which seems to be my lower core.


----------



## ITHAQVA

profoundoblu said:


> Please could you link those vids, I start as 5x5 a few weeks ago and could def work on my squat form!


EliteFTS Squat vids :thumb:





















Enjoy! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

If your foots coming off the ground on bench press then your set up is way off. I was explaining to the new trainees this week thats its a full body exercise and you should be solid. I demonstrated this by getting my training partner to set up like a normal gym goer and pushed him from the side, easy to move and shove off the bench if I wanted to compared with setting up like a power lifter I couldnt move him. You need to be solid on that bench as your lifting more than your body weight so the set up on Bench is probably the most important of any exercise. I like to use the inverted row technique, then bring feel back until heels are just off the floor then drive the heels down hard so they touch the floor, this is not a comfortable position but its a necessary one.

Seated Shoulder Press: 61x7
Incline Laterals: 10x6,6,X-reps
Skipped Upright Rows
Dips: 110+25x9,9
Decline Skull Crushers: 45x7,7, RP
Kick backs: 10x5,5
Barbell Curls: 40x9,6, X
Incline Curls: 10x5,5
Concentration Curls: 10x6,6

I failed on my Shoulder Press last time so stayed at the same weight for this run through and smashed my 7 reps this time easily. 1kg a month is the way to go for me on Shoulder Press.

Incline Laterals do hit the outside head of your delts extremely well but why would any normal guy really waste time putting a mm or 2 of a specific head of your delt when you can increase size all over, still doesnt make sense to me.

Okay so it is fun to train arms, that feeling where your triceps touch your lats is a good feeling and make you feel big but again I still stick to my words that your time is best spent else where. And as I was explaining to a new guy last night, why on earth when people want big arms do they train biceps, triceps are 2/3 the size of your upper arm and their what looks big when its hanging at your sides. So you should be doing more tricep work, what works your triceps, thats right heavy Bench Pressing.

I have another week of this "size" workout but I cannot see anything changing. It has been a good experiment but I still believe strength training with barbell compound movements is still the way to get stronger and bigger for the average Joe. And this was confirmed that I am the same weight if not slightly lighter than I was in Feb but tried a shirt on I wore to a wedding in Feb and it wouldnt fit round my back and arms.

Love those videos, have watched them many times.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 cycle 13 - 5/3/1 Deeeeeload!! 

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU20X5 20X5 20X3) - 33KGX5 - 42KGX5 - 50KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx5x5x5x5x5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Another deload session done :thumb:


----------



## Guru

An OHP deload session on 5-3-1 is a breeze. How long did it take? About 20 minutes?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> An OHP deload session on 5-3-1 is a breeze. How long did it take? About 20 minutes?


Good guess, give the guy a Cigar!


----------



## ntynan528

Thursdays 5/3/1 done on Friday 

overhead press 5*55.25kg 3*57.5kg 8*62.5kg

dead lift 5*127.5kg 3*135kg 7*142.5kg

overhead press 5*10*35kg

dead lift 5*10*70kg

dips 5*10*-33kg

curls 5*10*20kg

That's my first cycle complete. Really enjoying 5/3/1. I'm planning my next cycle now. Watched so you think you can squat videos and I'm going to try the seated good mornings on squat/bench day with bbb squat/bench. Think I'll also add in pull ups.

For dead lift/overhead press day I'll keep my dips and think I'll add a rotator cuff exercise in place of my curls to going along with my bbb.

Guys seen as I'm doing assisted dips and chins do you think I should stick with 5*10 at the end. My other thought was to go 5*5 before my main lifts. I could manage 5*5 dips unassisted but would still need a little assistance with the chins. Which do you guys think will give the best results?

Feel free to suggest other assistance work that you think will benefit me more in my early days at 5/3/1


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Thursdays 5/3/1 done on Friday
> 
> overhead press 5*55.25kg 3*57.5kg 8*62.5kg
> 
> dead lift 5*127.5kg 3*135kg 7*142.5kg
> 
> overhead press 5*10*35kg
> 
> dead lift 5*10*70kg
> 
> dips 5*10*-33kg
> 
> curls 5*10*20kg
> 
> That's my first cycle complete. Really enjoying 5/3/1. I'm planning my next cycle now. Watched so you think you can squat videos and I'm going to try the seated good mornings on squat/bench day with bbb squat/bench. Think I'll also add in pull ups.
> 
> For dead lift/overhead press day I'll keep my dips and think I'll add a rotator cuff exercise in place of my curls to going along with my bbb.
> 
> Guys seen as I'm doing assisted dips and chins do you think I should stick with 5*10 at the end. My other thought was to go 5*5 before my main lifts. I could manage 5*5 dips unassisted but would still need a little assistance with the chins. Which do you guys think will give the best results?
> 
> Feel free to suggest other assistance work that you think will benefit me more in my early days at 5/3/1


As you are already doing two main lifts per session I would advise you do your 5x10 assistance work afterwards (hence the name assistance work ) You will find as the weights become heavier that anything before your main work sets can interfere with progression.

Chins/pull ups, dips and barbell rows are great exercises :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

My advice is never use an assisted Dip or Chin machine.

Ntynan528 your weights are getting up there now so there is no reason why you shouldn't progress fast on Dips and Chins. Do 5x5 on dips and then keep adding a rep when you complete instead of weight so next week do 5x6, 5x7 and so on until your at 5x10. I would probably bring the sets down to 3 as well just because your already doing two main exercises plus two 5x10 assistance exercises per workout so the volume is already high. I had good progress with people on chins adding a rep to the last set first. So progress is like this 
2,2,2
2,2,3
2,3,3
3,3,3
3,3,4 and so on. Doesnt seem like much but its still progression.

And definitely replace barbell curls with RC work. This is a good exercise http://www.fitstep.com/Misc/Newsletter-archives/issue53/bench-press.htm and I still think overall that this will make you stronger and bigger than the benefits of barbell curls.

Just read this article http://npcnewsonline.com/powerbuilding-you-dont-grow-in-the-gym/63930/ Must say one of the best I have ever read, clear and straight to the point. And he is saying that higher rep warm up sets are a waste of time which means 5/3/1 warm ups are wrong but I have always thought this as they do effect your max set, no question.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Just read this article http://npcnewsonline.com/powerbuilding-you-dont-grow-in-the-gym/63930/ Must say one of the best I have ever read, clear and straight to the point. And he is saying that higher rep warm up sets are a waste of time which means 5/3/1 warm ups are wrong but I have always thought this as they do effect your max set, no question.


Agree, there is a fine line between warming up enough and warming up to the point of pre exhausting yourself and no making the lift :thumb:

As you become more and more advanced you may need to tailor your workout accordingly.

For me personally I think the 5/3/1 will give me my goals with very little alteration. I like the 5/3/1......A lot and it likes me 

I've decided to stay on 200kg for my Squat and Deadlift until the new year and work on improving my technique. I viewed the Squat vids I posted and there is most certainly room for improvement on that lift, my deadlift needs a little refinement on the lockout, 195kg was ok but 200kg felt a lot different :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I had good progress with people on chins adding a rep to the last set first. So progress is like this
> 2,2,2
> 2,2,3
> 2,3,3
> 3,3,3
> 3,3,4 and so on. Doesnt seem like much but its still progression.


I used a very similar progression method for my dips and it worked very well :thumb:

5,5,5,5,5
6,6,6,6,6
7,7,7,7,7
8,8,8,8,8
9,9,9,9,9
10,10,10,10,10 and then started to split into 3x5 rep sets (weighted starting at 5kg) and 3x10 reps sets just bodyweight to give some volume/build muscle. And the variation makes it a lot more interesting :thumb:

If I remember correctly when I first did dips I could hardly manage 3 sets of 5 reps at bodyweight.

You gotta hate those weights! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 89KGX5 - 102.5KGX5 - 116KGX5

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.75KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Happy with this workout, all weights felt good.
I've added 2.5kg to my assistance work and did a few sets of the Dead row with my back parallel, made the weight feel much heavier than the usual stance, Back just above parallel 

Keeping my back and core nice and tight made a huge difference to how the weight felt on the bench :thumb:

Good track for working out to :thumb:






:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) 77.5x5, 87.5x3, 120x6 144kg PM RP 92.5x10,2,2
Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 6, X-reps

That's it, got in, did my work, got out and ate. I was supposed to do 117.5 bench but I really wanted that 120kg Bench as its 4 big 25s and just looks cool. Dropped flyes again as they just wreck my shoulders. Again I dont like this size program where you dont do back work on the same day as bench, it just feels wrong. This is my last week of this program then I will probably change to BBB opposite or back to my Simple Strength Template which has given me good gains and just feels good at it hits all the exercises I really like.

Forgot about my Rest Pause sets. My work capacity is definitely increasing as to get 10 reps of 92.5kg after 120kg is pretty good I think and when I first added rest pause I was only getting like 4 reps.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 80x5, 115x3, 147.5x1) 135x 10sets x 3 reps
Bulgarian Split Squats: 22.5x 7, 7, X-reps

10 sets of 3 are definitely hitting completely different muscles than usual and this can only be a good thing. Its mentally hard but seems to be working.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday Workout:
> Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) 77.5x5, 87.5x3, *120x6* 144kg PM RP 92.5x10,2,2
> Incline Bench Press: 70x10, 6, X-reps
> 
> That's it, got in, did my work, got out and ate. I was supposed to do 117.5 bench but I really wanted that 120kg Bench as its 4 big 25s and just looks cool. Dropped flyes again as they just wreck my shoulders. Again I dont like this size program where you dont do back work on the same day as bench, it just feels wrong. This is my last week of this program then I will probably change to BBB opposite or back to my Simple Strength Template which has given me good gains and just feels good at it hits all the exercises I really like.
> 
> Forgot about my Rest Pause sets. My work capacity is definitely increasing as to get 10 reps of 92.5kg after 120kg is pretty good I think and when I first added rest pause I was only getting like 4 reps.


120kg on the bench for 6 reps, most impressive James :thumb: :devil:


----------



## ntynan528

Mondays workout

Squat 5*92.5kg 5*97.5kg 5*105kg

Bench 5*80kg 5*85kg 12*92.5kg

Squat 5*10*60kg

Bench 5*10*60kg

bent over row 3*10*60kg

pull up 2,2,2

rotator cuff 5*10*10kg

Good workout last night. After watching the squat videos there was a lot of room for improvement on my squat. I held my shape much better last night and it felt much better.

Do you guys do much conditioning work?

Cheers for the help guys.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX1 :lol: :lol:

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, spent so much time concentrating on my squat technique I went totally out of the groove, nearly dropped the weight lol!!! So I racked it and moved on, I should had just done what I normally do


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 cycle 14 - 5/3/1
> 
> *SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX1 :lol: :lol:
> 
> SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10
> 
> STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Good workout, spent so much time concentrating on my squat technique I went totally out of the groove, nearly dropped the weight lol!!! So I racked it and moved on, I should had just done what I normally do


I'd have to agree with you on over thinking the form. I struggled with my heavy sets due to this. I must admit my legs are sore from mondays workout. Not sure if this was super strict form on bbb or the 10kg increase in weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> I'd have to agree with you on over thinking the form. I struggled with my heavy sets due to this. I must admit my legs are sore from mondays workout. Not sure if this was super strict form on bbb or the 10kg increase in weight.


I'm now finding that the cardboard box I made up forces me to do every rep full parallel and today I've got doms!
Its not too big a deal as I'm on 200kg for my squat (the pressure is now off ) I have no plans to go heavier, but the cardboard box adds to the mix so its making the squat session feel a lot harder which has sort of given me a new goal - Full parallel reps on all my squat workout :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Seated Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 50x3, 57.5x3, 65x5 PM 76kg
Incline Dumbell Raises: 12.5x8,8, X-reps
Arm Work

I'm really starting to get near failure on my SP and BP so it may seem crazy but I may actually deload as I have made such great progress on these exercises training 2-4 reps short of failure. I wouldnt normally advise this as I'm making good progress but my shoulders are starting to feel like crap so I dont want to push things to hard when I know my shoulders are screwed. I would rather be in this game for the long run. I may just deload 5% instead of the normal 10% as it will take me so long to get back to where I am now.


----------



## ntynan528

last nights workout

dead lift 117.5*5 125*5 132.5*7

overhead press 50*5 55*5 57.5*10

dead lift 5*10*80

overhead press 5*10*40

dips 3*5*bodyweight

rotator cuff 5*10*10

Workout went well. decided to take rotator cuff out of mondays and added it in thursday. Had a bit of shoulder pain while doing dips, not enough to stop but a bit of a niggle.
cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> last nights workout
> 
> dead lift 117.5*5 125*5 132.5*7
> 
> overhead press 50*5 55*5 57.5*10
> 
> dead lift 5*10*80
> 
> overhead press 5*10*40
> 
> dips 3*5*bodyweight
> 
> rotator cuff 5*10*10
> 
> Workout went well. decided to take rotator cuff out of mondays and added it in thursday. Had a bit of shoulder pain while doing dips, not enough to stop but a bit of a niggle.
> cheers


Careful with your dips if your shoulders are playing up, you don't need to go deeper than parallel, there are many that say it is better to stop just above parallel to ensure your shoulders stay healthy.

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/dips-done-right/ :thumb:

James/Bod42 has a few shoulder issues and he will be able to give you the best advice in this area :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 54.5KGX5 - 63KGX5 - 71KGX5 :thumb:

DIP WARM UP ROUTINE - 9 sets 3 reps variable depth bodyweight

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Excellent workout, one of those session were everything went well, felt very strong in all lifts, cant believe I couldn't make 5 reps last cycle on the 71kg OHP, this time around it felt medium difficulty.

Possibly the 50kg 5 sets 10 reps on the OHP assistance work (As advised by Wenlder) is helping.

Dip warm up is definitely making a huge difference, moving up to bodyweight plus 20kg next week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, nice to be on the same weights for a while to give the old body a rest


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Careful with your dips if your shoulders are playing up, you don't need to go deeper than parallel, there are many that say it is better to stop just above parallel to ensure your shoulders stay healthy.
> 
> http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/dips-done-right/ :thumb:
> 
> James/Bod42 has a few shoulder issues and he will be able to give you the best advice in this area :thumb:


I find dips are a very personal exercise, some people can do them pain free, others just cant get on with them at all. My shoulder is absolutely screwed and dips do hurt but they dont make it any worse whereas if I get out of my groove on Bench Press I can feel it doing damage. There are a thousand ways to improve shoulder health and my training partner had shoulder pain during his Bench Press so dropped these from his routine and replaced with the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders routine from T nation, without doubt the best program I have found for shoulder Pre-hab. Training partner has been pain free since running the program and ya not benching for 4 weeks did suck but in the long run he has surpassed all his previous weights and doubt he could have done that in so much pain.

I also like to do a lot of volume band pull a parts and shoulder dislocations at every workout.



ITHAQVA said:


> Possibly the 50kg 5 sets 10 reps on the OHP assistance work (As advised by Wenlder) is helping.


I really want to do this when I come back from the UK, pretty much run the BBB program as I think it will do wonders considering where I am now but worried the volume is going to destroy my shoulder so sadly going to stick to the simple strength template but this is still an awesome template.


----------



## mikex

Trained for the first time in a while this weekend

Log,
55x5
75x3
85x3
95x3
105x3
115x3
125x1
130x1
120x5/4

Farmers walk
100x20x2
120x20x2 
140kg/hand x20m x 2 (fastest time of 10seconds flat)

Atlas stones.
worked upto 160 stone over a 4' bar for 2 sets of 3 reps. just working on technique and exploding out the bottom position.

messed about on the bench for a bit afterwards, worked upto 140 for a couple and repped out on 120 for a couple of sets

Loads of pullups while messing on the bench.

Im a bit off where I left off but 10 weeks out will do that, body is ruined now and its the best ive felt in months"!


----------



## Bod42

Monday
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x10 PM 143.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 70x10,10

Thats it. Didnt do flyes again as my shoulder felt like absolute crap. Definitely going to deload these. Im in no hurry to hit my goals, well I am but I would rather get there pain/injury free than an absolute wreck. I'm not doing this on any other exercises but its just due to my shoulder and I want to get as many years out of it as possible before I give in and have surgery.

Going to concentrate on pushing my incline up as this hits my chest more and less painful than normal bench but that could be due to the lower weight and higher reps.

Training partner was messing around with various exercises while waiting for me to finish with the rack. He was doing speed deadlifts with 110kg so thought I would try and row it, used abit of body movement but still rowed it so was quite pleased with that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Monday
> Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x10 PM 143.5kg
> Incline Bench Press: 70x10,10
> 
> Thats it. Didnt do flyes again as my shoulder felt like absolute crap. Definitely going to deload these. Im in no hurry to hit my goals, well I am but I would rather get there pain/injury free than an absolute wreck. I'm not doing this on any other exercises but its just due to my shoulder and I want to get as many years out of it as possible before I give in and have surgery.
> 
> Going to concentrate on pushing my incline up as this hits my chest more and less painful than normal bench but that could be due to the lower weight and higher reps.
> 
> Training partner was messing around with various exercises while waiting for me to finish with the rack. He was doing speed deadlifts with 110kg so thought I would try and row it, used abit of body movement but still rowed it so was quite pleased with that.


Glad to see you back James


----------



## ITHAQVA

mikex said:


> Trained for the first time in a while this weekend
> 
> Log,
> 55x5
> 75x3
> 85x3
> 95x3
> 105x3
> 115x3
> 125x1
> 130x1
> 120x5/4
> 
> Farmers walk
> 100x20x2
> 120x20x2
> 140kg/hand x20m x 2 (fastest time of 10seconds flat)
> 
> Atlas stones.
> worked upto 160 stone over a 4' bar for 2 sets of 3 reps. just working on technique and exploding out the bottom position.
> 
> messed about on the bench for a bit afterwards, worked upto 140 for a couple and repped out on 120 for a couple of sets
> 
> Loads of pullups while messing on the bench.
> 
> Im a bit off where I left off but 10 weeks out will do that, body is ruined now and its the best ive felt in months"!


Hi Mike,

Am I right in assuming that the "Log" is used for the overhead press Mike?

Also with the strongman training do you find because of the huge variation of grips/body positions, that it has great carryover to the Barbell Bench Press/Overhead Press/Squat and Deadlift?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 96KGX3 - 109KGX3 - 123KGX3 About bloody time!!!! 

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Well pleased with this workout as I've been stuck on this Bench press cycle for 6 months :doublesho :doublesho

I think it was all due to my technique, tonight's 123kgx3 was easy  WTF??, hopefully next weeks 130kgx1 will go well and I can at last add some more weight for the next cycle 

The only other change in this workouts is I'm doing 87.5kg for 5 sets of 10 on the assistance sets, does this extra weight carryover the same as the OHP, only time will tell 

Workout completed, weights hated loads! :devil:


----------



## mikex

first midweek workout in 10 weeks, Had fun.

deadlifts, Basically turned into a pissing contest.
120x5
170x5
220x3
270x1
320x1
340xfail. gutted.
220x2/2/2/2 speed reps.
I pulled 320 easily. first time deadlift in a while so happy enough.

BO rows
120x9/7/5

pulldows - some.
upright rows. - some
CG bench 120x10/9/7

home. bloody loved that. would have liked to get a bit of overhead in instead of so much back, but the lad I was training with had 'back day' I tend to avoid bodypart days in favour of full bodies or days based around a particular lift or two.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 147KGX3 - 168KGX3 - 189KGX3 (Didn't nearly drop it this time lol ) :thumb:

SQUAT  100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Well pleased with this workout :thumb:

Its very surprising how much more difficult and technical the squat is when you work on consistently achieving the desired depth :doublesho But its also very pleasing to find even on the second week that I'm becoming more proficient on this lift :thumb:

Even though I'm still performing "reps" on the work sets I'm finding its better to briefly pause at the top position, take a deep breath and set myself up for the next rep and so on until the desired reps are reached. Doing the Squat this way makes it far easier to focus on technique and depth :thumb:

One thing, my squat sessions are a dam sight harder now 

The longer I'm in this game, the more respect I have for the heavy RAW lifters :thumb:


----------



## mikex

Always good to reset yourself at the top of a squat. As long as you aren't taking 10 mins between reps


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Alright chaps, long time no post for me! 

Training has been a little on and off for me, still playing rugby but got married so had a little time off.

I'll be starting 5x5 again on Monday. Any advice? Stretching is key for me, them legs going to be stiff for a while!

Also I've totally forgotten what's after the main routine.

Monday i'll be on:

Squats
Bench
Barbell row

Do you add one of the following dips or chins after these?

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

mikex said:


> Always good to reset yourself at the top of a squat. As long as you aren't taking 10 mins between reps


lol no mike, just one big deep breath and down again :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Anyone help?


----------



## ITHAQVA

jonnyMercUK said:


> Anyone help?


Very few regular posts on here now mate, which is disapointing considering there are now 162,335 views :doublesho

*StrongLifts 5×5 Workout A**

Squat 5×5
Bench Press 5×5 
Barbell Rows 5×5 
______________________________

StrongLifts 5×5 Workout B

Squat 5×5 
Overhead Press 5×5 
Deadlift 1×5*

:thumb:

No other exercises are required at this level :thumb: follow the program until you reach the designated weights then move on to the original 5/3/1 with BBB assistance routine. That's all you need to know training wise for the next two years :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 59KGX3 - 67KGX3 - 75.5KGX3 *

Short workout tonight.

Very pleased again, I failed on this session last cycle, this time the 75.5kgx3 went up ok :thumb: By the time I completed the second rep I was confident the third would go up (that's how good it felt ). Once again, its really odd how very different the same weight can feel from one workout to another, but I'm not complaining, if I succeed next weeks OHP work sets, I can add more weight :thumb:

Weights hated, session complete  Whole chicken for tea tonight! :thumb:


----------



## jonnyMercUK

ITHAQVA said:


> Very few regular posts on here now mate, which is disapointing considering there are now 162,335 views :doublesho
> 
> *StrongLifts 5×5 Workout A**
> 
> Squat 5×5
> Bench Press 5×5
> Barbell Rows 5×5
> ______________________________
> 
> StrongLifts 5×5 Workout B
> 
> Squat 5×5
> Overhead Press 5×5
> Deadlift 1×5*
> 
> :thumb:
> 
> No other exercises are required at this level :thumb: follow the program until you reach the designated weights then move on to the original 5/3/1 with BBB assistance routine. That's all you need to know training wise for the next two years :thumb:


Cheers mate. I'll try and post up after each session - keep the thread going!

Just been back through the thread at my last posts, let's see how strong I am now!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) -147KGX3 - 168KGX3 - 189KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

BODYWEIGHT JUMPS x5x5x5x5x5*

Awesome 

Last cycle the 3x189kg got ugly by the 3rd rep, this cycle all 3 reps went up with good form and were relatively easy, I most certainly could have made 5 reps  Again I'm totally amazed how different a weight can feel from one cycle to another. Not complaining though :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

last weeks workouts

monday

squat 98kg*3 105kg*3 110kg*3

bench 87.5kg*3 92.5kg*3 97.5kg*3

squat 60kg*10*5

bench 60kg*10*5

bent over row 60kg*10*5

chins 2,2,3

thursday

overhead press 55kg*3 57.5kg*3 60kg*3

deadlift 125kg*3 132.5kg*3 140kg*3

overhead press 40kg*10*5

deadlift 80kg*10*5

dips 5,5,5

rotator cuff 7.5kg*10*5

last weeks workouts done while on holiday. Never went away but the kids and two weddings kept me busy. Had a real turn around since switching to 5/3/1 in that I'm finding the deadlift really easy but I'm struggling with my squat. This is the opposite of what I'm used to.
I have been really thinking about squat form since watching the videos. 'Ill see how it goes tonight but I'm really thinking of backing off the squat weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> last weeks workouts
> 
> monday
> 
> squat 98kg*3 105kg*3 110kg*3
> 
> bench 87.5kg*3 92.5kg*3 97.5kg*3
> 
> squat 60kg*10*5
> 
> bench 60kg*10*5
> 
> bent over row 60kg*10*5
> 
> chins 2,2,3
> 
> thursday
> 
> overhead press 55kg*3 57.5kg*3 60kg*3
> 
> deadlift 125kg*3 132.5kg*3 140kg*3
> 
> overhead press 40kg*10*5
> 
> deadlift 80kg*10*5
> 
> dips 5,5,5
> 
> rotator cuff 7.5kg*10*5
> 
> last weeks workouts done while on holiday. Never went away but the kids and two weddings kept me busy. Had a real turn around since switching to 5/3/1 in that I'm finding the deadlift really easy but I'm struggling with my squat. This is the opposite of what I'm used to.
> I have been really thinking about squat form since watching the videos. 'Ill see how it goes tonight but I'm really thinking of backing off the squat weight.


If you are using a power rack to squat set the safety bars so that you just touch them as you go parallel or better, just below :thumb:

Alternatively do what I've done recently, build a cardboard box that you just touch with your ass as you go parallel :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Cheers I'll give that a go tonight. Funny thing is that I am still lighter than when I was doing 5*5 and was managing that.
Saying that Mondays workout last week was after a very big weekend of celebrating a friends wedding.
cheers


----------



## ntynan528

Last nights workout

Squat 92.5kg*5 105kg*3 117.5kg*5

Bench 80kg*5 92.5kg*3 102.5kg*10

Squat 60kg*10*5

Bench 60*10*5

bent over row 60kg*10*5

chins 2,3,3

Last nights workout was difficult but I felt strong in all lifts. Very pleased with it. BBB felt difficult after going all out on my last set in both squat and bench. Pleased with the number tho.


----------



## Bod42

mikex said:


> home. bloody loved that. would have liked to get a bit of overhead in instead of so much back, but the lad I was training with had 'back day' I tend to avoid bodypart days in favour of full bodies or days based around a particular lift or two.


Like hearing this, was training a new guy the other day and said one of the easiest ways to tell a real trainer is if they say its an exercise day instead of a body part day, you know squat day instead of leg day :thumb:

And that is one hell of a deadlift, I need to start pushing my lower body movements, they are pefectic.



ntynan528 said:


> Had a real turn around since switching to 5/3/1 in that I'm finding the deadlift really easy but I'm struggling with my squat. This is the opposite of what I'm used to.
> I have been really thinking about squat form since watching the videos. 'Ill see how it goes tonight but I'm really thinking of backing off the squat weight.


Done a lot of research on 5/3/1 before starting it and it seems to be a comman theme that it works on everything except squats (unless your Doug :thumb and I have found exactly the same thing. I could always improve my squats easily and my deadlift sucked, now its the other way round.

Ok so Im back in the UK for weeks for my Bros wedding (must be weddings eason) but that doesnt mean I am missing the gym. Went to my old rugby club gym last night and trained.

Bench Press: (WU ???) 97.5x5, 110x3, 122.5x7 
Incline Dumbell Press: 35x10,10
Chin Ups between every set of pushing.
Pendlay Rows: 60x10,10,10
TRX Straps

Very pleased with 7 reps of 122.5 considering it was a different bar, rack and bench. And the rack was to high so i lost my tightness unracking it but still pleased with the set.

TRX straps are actually great fun, brilliant for core strength but it still showed that strength rules as I passed the fitness test that they do with people. Being honest though it does make absolutely everything harder, even chin ups are harder but they do feel more natural and better for yoru shoulders.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 14

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103.5KGX5 - 116KGX3 - 130KGX1

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good session, all weeks on bench completed..........AT LAST!!!!  The 130kgx1 felt pretty easy TBH, strength is a really odd thing. I'm hoping the rest of this cycle will all go well :tumbleweed:

Its good to see other members posting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Like hearing this, was training a new guy the other day and said one of the easiest ways to tell a real trainer is if they say its an exercise day instead of a body part day, you know squat day instead of leg day :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:
> 
> And that is one hell of a deadlift, I need to start pushing my lower body movements, they are pefectic.
> 
> *Yes you do James, Hate those weights!!! *:devil::devil:
> 
> Done a lot of research on 5/3/1 before starting it and it seems to be a comman theme that it works on everything except squats (unless your Doug :thumb and I have found exactly the same thing. I could always improve my squats easily and my deadlift sucked, now its the other way round.
> 
> *It has been said, I'm a bit different!*
> 
> Ok so Im back in the UK for weeks for my Bros wedding (must be weddings eason) but that doesnt mean I am missing the gym. Went to my old rugby club gym last night and trained.
> 
> Bench Press: (WU ???) 97.5x5, 110x3, 122.5x7
> Incline Dumbell Press: 35x10,10
> Chin Ups between every set of pushing.
> Pendlay Rows: 60x10,10,10
> TRX Straps
> 
> Very pleased with 7 reps of 122.5 considering it was a different bar, rack and bench. And the rack was to high so i lost my tightness unracking it but still pleased with the set.
> 
> TRX straps are actually great fun, brilliant for core strength but it still showed that strength rules as I passed the fitness test that they do with people. Being honest though it does make absolutely everything harder, even chin ups are harder but they do feel more natural and better for yoru shoulders.
> 
> *I've been reading up on shoulder health as I'm starting to lift heavier, I'm keeping bench and OHP grips narrow (Wendler's advice on this is spot on IMHO) and the general consensus is protect your shoulders at all costs as once they are damaged its very difficult to get them 100% fit again (Dave Tate is a prime example)
> 
> James you continue to use whatever keeps your shoulders fit so you can lift as long as you like :thumb: *


:thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Last nights workout
> 
> Squat 92.5kg*5 105kg*3 117.5kg*5
> 
> Bench 80kg*5 92.5kg*3 102.5kg*10
> 
> Squat 60kg*10*5
> 
> Bench 60*10*5
> 
> bent over row 60kg*10*5
> 
> chins 2,3,3
> 
> Last nights workout was difficult but I felt strong in all lifts. Very pleased with it. BBB felt difficult after going all out on my last set in both squat and bench. Pleased with the number tho.


Weights are coming on now mate, keep going!! :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Cheers Doug. Thats exactly why even though my Bench Press is going so well that I will be deloading it as I can just feel the strain on my shoulder and I have had quite a few months of easy progress and have been training 3-4 reps below my max, good to know you can train like this and still make progress. If anyone reads Lift RUn Bang this is pretty much what he suggests for strength. 

My deaadlift is at 185kgs which isnt bad when read on its own but looks utter w**k when read next to a predicted 150kg Bench press. Going to deload my Bench & shoulder press and use the extra energy to smash my squats and deadlifts. Give me a few months and I will be smashing that 200kg on deadlifts and beyond.

I want to do BBB as everyone on here who does it seems to do really well on it but dont think my shoulder will handle it but will definitely be doing it on my lower body movements.


----------



## jonnyMercUK

Not been able to get on last couple of days but here it goes.

I decided to swop the workouts as everyone seems to do chest on a Monday! Also taking it very steady as it's my first week back into it.

Workout B

Squat 5 x 5 x 70KG
Shoulder Press 5 x 5 x 40KG
Deadlift 1 x 5 x 55KG

Workout A

Squat 5 x 5 x 72.5KG
Barbell Row 5 x 5 x 60KG
Bench Press 5 x 5 x 65KG


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 14

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 200KGX 0 and 0 second attempt  

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 140KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Totally  up the 200kgx1 squat set, had a second go but the first attempt exhausted me. I went too deep on the first try and could not get the bar up, second attempt was no better 

I'm not too disappointed as I've managed the 200kg for 1 rep once. However I want to get to a point were I can consistently lift the 200kg. Now that I'm being ultra strict on my depth I'm finding that technically my squat needs cleaning up before I know I can confidently squat 200kg for 1 rep all the time (my next challenge to myself  :thumb

Every time I fail, its more down to poor technical execution of the lift rather than strength. You lift and learn!


----------



## ITHAQVA

After last nights fail and the fact that I've already done 200kg for 1 rep once! I think I'm going to lower the weight back to 180kg and work on my form/technique and build back up to 200kg.Of all my lifts the Squat is my biggest form failure, I think as the weight got heavier I was getting the bar up any which way and didn't notice my technique getting worse as the weight went heavier. 

I always find a fail on a lift (For me) is a big reminder to go back to the videos and re learn lift technique. Looks like I'll be viewing the "So you think you can squat" videos again 

I've also got a week off work soon, I was going to take the whole week off training but I think its well worth spending a little time gong through my squat technique :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

last nights workout

overhead press 50kg*5 57.5kg*3 65kg*8

deadlift 115*5 130kg*3 147.5kg*8

overhead press 40kg*10*5

deadlift 80kg*10*5

dips 6,6,6

rotator cuff 7.5*10*5

Really good workout last night. Pleased with all my numbers here. It always surprises me when the weights feel heavy at the begining and you start to doubt yourself but by the time you get to the last set you just push right thru what you doubted earlier.

looking forward to planing out my next cycle, always like to look at the numbers and think about where I'd like to be.

Just wondering how much you guys eat and what you eat. Been eating more feeling myself getting bigger after just six weeks on 5/3/1 but putting on a bit around the belly too. Is this enevitble or should I have a good look at my diet?

cheers


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> After last nights fail and the fact that I've already done 200kg for 1 rep once! I think I'm going to lower the weight back to 180kg and work on my form/technique and build back up to 200kg.Of all my lifts the Squat is my biggest form failure, I think as the weight got heavier I was getting the bar up any which way and didn't notice my technique getting worse as the weight went heavier.
> 
> I always find a fail on a lift (For me) is a big reminder to go back to the videos and re learn lift technique. Looks like I'll be viewing the "So you think you can squat" videos again
> 
> I've also got a week off work soon, I was going to take the whole week off training but I think its well worth spending a little time gong through my squat technique :thumb:


Hi Doug

I think my form is getting better now as I can really think about it during BBB this seems to be carrying over into my heavier lifts where I've now tried not to over think form but just to concentrate on the job in hand.

I'd say it cant be a bad idea to drop back and think more about form for yourself if 200kg is where you want to be. Especially as squat is so unforgiving when you get it wrong :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi Doug
> 
> I think my form is getting better now as I can really think about it during BBB this seems to be carrying over into my heavier lifts where I've now tried not to over think form but just to concentrate on the job in hand.
> 
> I'd say it cant be a bad idea to drop back and think more about form for yourself if 200kg is where you want to be. Especially as squat is so unforgiving when you get it wrong :thumb:


I concur Ntynan , the Squat for me is also the most unforgiving and fear invoking lift of them all, once you get it wrong the weight just wants to CRUSH YOU!!! :devil:

I'm going back to around cycle 10 in regards to my squat and work on my technique until I can squat the 200kg as easy as I can deadlift it :thumb:

On the other hand I've also decided to carry on upping the weight on my deadlift and go for it! 230kg for 1 is my next and final deadlift goal  I'm also hoping there will be a bit of carry over to help my squatting :thumb:

I just as well use all the weights I've got, seems a waste not to lift em all!


----------



## happychap

I'm sure this has been asked before, but the weights that are posted, is this inclusive of the weight of the Olympic bar, or just the weight added to it. Thanks


----------



## ITHAQVA

happychap said:


> I'm sure this has been asked before, but the weights that are posted, is this inclusive of the weight of the Olympic bar, or just the weight added to it. Thanks


All weights posted should IMHO include the weight of your Olympic barbell (20kg) :thumb:

This is also how the weights are calculated for competing Powerlifters and Olympic weightlifters :thumb:


----------



## happychap

ITHAQVA said:


> All weights posted should IMHO include the weight of your Olympic barbell (20kg) :thumb:
> 
> This is also how the weights are calculated for competing Powerlifters and Olympic weightlifters :thumb:


Thank's for clarifying.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 63KGX5 - 71KGX3 - 80KGX1

DIPS (WU 9x3)

DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10*

Workout went very well, now that the OHP cycle has been 100% cleared I can add some more weight next cycle :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

happychap said:


> Thank's for clarifying.


:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 14 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 205KGX1* Couldn't resist, so I added another 5kg to todays single lift 

The 205kg felt easy enough, missus says my back was slightly rounded, so I'm going to stay at this weight until she says I lift with a full straight back. I think I was so expecting the weight to feel crushingly heavy that I let my form slip a little :tumbleweed:

I wont be de loading next week but doing week 1 work sets of my next cycle (15) The following week I'm taking the whole week of from training, except for a few sets getting my squat from sorted :thumb:


----------



## Oats

Starting Strength coaches training camp in London in December on squat and deadlift\power clean have gone on sale if anyone else is interested. If so, see you there


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 cycle 14 - 5/3/1
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 63KGX5 - 71KGX3 - 80KGX1
> 
> DIPS (WU 9x3)
> 
> DIPS BODYWEIGHT+15KGx5x5x5
> 
> DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10*
> 
> Workout went very well, now that the OHP cycle has been 100% cleared I can add some more weight next cycle :thumb:


Good stuff Doug, I was at the gym last night but don't have my workout with me today so I'll post it up tomorrow.:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Good stuff Doug, I was at the gym last night but don't have my workout with me today so I'll post it up tomorrow.:thumb:


Cheers mate :thumb: Only 20kg to go on OHP   

keep posting your sessions :thumb:


----------



## Rowe

are you gents using straps when deadlifting?

I've only just started doing them at the gym and start struggling over 120kg. I can just about manage 140kg on the end of my fingers but thats it. 
I've tried doing one arm under, and one over which makes things alot easier.


----------



## Guru

Rowe said:


> are you gents using straps when deadlifting?
> 
> I've only just started doing them at the gym and start struggling over 120kg. I can just about manage 140kg on the end of my fingers but thats it.
> I've tried doing one arm under, and one over which makes things alot easier.


Mixed grip (one arm under & one over) and chalk is the way to go.

If you can manage 120 kg with double overhand grip, you'll easily reach 200 with mixed grip and chalk.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Rowe said:


> are you gents using straps when deadlifting?
> 
> I've only just started doing them at the gym and start struggling over 120kg. I can just about manage 140kg on the end of my fingers but thats it.
> I've tried doing one arm under, and one over which makes things alot easier.





Guru said:


> Mixed grip (one arm under & one over) and chalk is the way to go.
> 
> If you can manage 120 kg with double overhand grip, you'll easily reach 200 with mixed grip and chalk.


Mixed grip and some chalk, I have not had any grip problems to date (although I'm only using 205kg at the moment) :thumb:


----------



## Rowe

cheers gents. TBH i never even considered chalk.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90KGX5 - 104KGX5 - 118KGX5 *

As this is supposed to be cycle 14's de load week, I'll only be doing the work sets for cycle 15 this week, Then next week a full week off! :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Rowe said:


> are you gents using straps when deadlifting?
> 
> I've only just started doing them at the gym and start struggling over 120kg. I can just about manage 140kg on the end of my fingers but thats it.
> I've tried doing one arm under, and one over which makes things alot easier.


I found that my grip used to be the limiting factor in my dead lift. I used to do timed hangs at the end of my gym sessions. Really works your grip. Give it a try.


----------



## ntynan528

Monday nights session

squat 92.5*5 100*5 107.5*5

bench 82.5*5 87.5*5 92.5*5

squat 65*10*5

bench 65*10*5

chins 3,3,4

bent over row 65*5*10

I went to the gym on Monday night but really wasn't in the mood. I planned only to do my 5/3/1 then get out. When I got there the gym was really busy. I got the 5/3/1 done but it took ages as bench seem to the the weapon of choice with everyone tonight. Once I did that I decided seen as I'd been in the gym longer than I wanted to I'd be better getting my assistance work in. Felt good leaving as I hadn't wimped out on my assistance.


----------



## Guru

I have not had the time to go through the entire length of this thread, but a question to the people here who started out with Stronglifts 5x5 -

Were any of you a member of the Stronglifts forum back in the golden days when it was an open community?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> I have not had the time to go through the entire length of this thread, but a question to the people here who started out with Stronglifts 5x5 -
> 
> Were any of you a member of the Stronglifts forum back in the golden days when it was an open community?


I wasn't a member of the golden circle, I just went on the 5x5 and made mistakes along the way :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Guru said:


> I have not had the time to go through the entire length of this thread, but a question to the people here who started out with Stronglifts 5x5 -
> 
> Were any of you a member of the Stronglifts forum back in the golden days when it was an open community?


No just read the 5x5 after hearing about it here. Often wondered about the inner circle. I'd like to see that.


----------



## Guru

No, I'm not talking about the inner circle. I am talking about the open forum before that. I was a member (hell, even a moderator for an year) there, and all of us who didn't pay to get entry to the inner circle got booted out of the forum.

I was just wondering if I could find some old pals from there.


----------



## ntynan528

Guru said:


> No, I'm not talking about the inner circle. I am talking about the open forum before that. I was a member (hell, even a moderator for an year) there, and all of us who didn't pay to get entry to the inner circle got booted out of the forum.
> 
> I was just wondering if I could find some old pals from there.


Yeah sorry never made myself very clear. No I wasn't on there before but have wondered what its like now its paid for.

Do you still lift?


----------



## ntynan528

Last nights workout

Overhead press 5*55 5*57.5 5*62.5

deadlift 5*120 5*127.5 5*135

overhead press 5*10*45

rotator cuff 7.5*10*5

Didn't do my dips or 5*10 deadlift didnt feel great in the gym so decided to get out. Dont know if its how I've been feeling this week or what but last nights weights felt heavy. Roll on next week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 56KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 73KGX5 *

All reps achieved = me happy 

I've been reading up on squat form/technique and decided to go back to cycle 9 weights to sort all my bad technique issues out (Meaning I'll be on 180kg for my single rep week, so not too far away from 200kg but light enough to allow improvement) :thumb:

I have made the mistake of using the safety bars as a guide to squat depth..... WRONG!!!! As the weight got heavier I have ended up squatting around 30cm above parallel and allowing my core to go down instead of using my legs :wall:

The little squat box I made up has highlighted this greatly, I doubt if my 200kgx1 was full parallel now  Never mind, back to the drawing board!  I'm glad I found this out now,as it would be awful to have no noticed this after several years training :doublesho

This will make me fight even harder to succeed :devil:


----------



## ntynan528

monday nights workout

squat 3*100 3*107.5 3*112.5

bench 3*87.5 3*92.5 10*100

squat 5*10*65

bench 5*10*65

bent over row 5*10*65

chins 3,3,4

Good workout last night, really looking at my diet just now. Thats me up to 119kg. Was at 107kg in July when I went on holiday. I know that i have packed on a fair bit of muscle since then but also feeling it around the belly. Lets see how I get on. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> monday nights workout
> 
> squat 3*100 3*107.5 3*112.5
> 
> bench 3*87.5 3*92.5 10*100
> 
> squat 5*10*65
> 
> bench 5*10*65
> 
> bent over row 5*10*65
> 
> chins 3,3,4
> 
> Good workout last night, really looking at my diet just now. Thats me up to H19kg. Was at 107kg in July when I went on holiday. I know that i have packed on a fair bit of muscle since then but also feeling it around the belly. Lets see how I get on. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Cheers


13kg is a huge jump in weight in such a short time :doublesho

Has your waist size gone up at all?


----------



## ntynan528

Hi Doug, Yeah I have gone up to a 40. I was a 40 about March last year but came down to an easy 38 and kept my weight down below 110kg all summer. I feel bigger everywhere tho my jeans are tight round the leg and my dust coat at work is tight around my shoulders. Also got more stretch marks on my shoulders. 
Done a bit of reading on nutrition and have changed my diet to suit. I was finding before that sometimes I would eat crap just to try and keep my calories up. Got some healthy snacks and a better meal plan now though just need to see that it doesn't have a negative effect on training.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi Doug, Yeah I have gone up to a 40. I was a 40 about March last year but came down to an easy 38 and kept my weight down below 110kg all summer. I feel bigger everywhere tho my jeans are tight round the leg and my dust coat at work is tight around my shoulders. Also got more stretch marks on my shoulders.
> Done a bit of reading on nutrition and have changed my diet to suit. I was finding before that sometimes I would eat crap just to try and keep my calories up. Got some healthy snacks and a better meal plan now though just need to see that it doesn't have a negative effect on training.


Lol you sound a bit like me, I have to wear 38 waist to fit my legs and ass in, I'm actually a 36, but I just cannot find jeans that fit me, I find 38 waist stretch jeans are always a good way to go and with a longer leg, you'll find larger legs make jeans rid up your leg so the longer leg jeans allow for a better tidy/fit

You may also find wearing XXL tops will fit your shoulders/arms better too :thumb:

The woes of a powerlifter! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ntynan528 said:


> Yeah sorry never made myself very clear. No I wasn't on there before but have wondered what its like now its paid for.
> 
> Do you still lift?


I heard when it first went to a paid site that it was very good and had some very knowledgeable people helping out but through the grape vine I have since heard that these people have left due to a number of reasons and it now isnt worth the money. Especially when you have this thread and Mark Rippletoes forum for free.



ntynan528 said:


> Good workout last night, really looking at my diet just now. Thats me up to 119kg. Was at 107kg in July when I went on holiday. I know that i have packed on a fair bit of muscle since then but also feeling it around the belly. Lets see how I get on. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Cheers


How tall are you mate?



ITHAQVA said:


> Lol you sound a bit like me, I have to wear 38 waist to fit my legs and ass in, I'm actually a 36, but I just cannot find jeans that fit me, I find 38 waist stretch jeans are always a good way to go and with a longer leg, you'll find larger legs make jeans rid up your leg so the longer leg jeans allow for a better tidy/fit
> 
> You may also find wearing XXL tops will fit your shoulders/arms better too :thumb:
> 
> The woes of a powerlifter! :thumb:


Get in, Im still in 36" jeans but I do wear the real baggy skater boy jeans and they look normal. Mate tried to borrow a pair the other day so we could go clubbing and was like WTF the legs are massive lol. Girl last night said I'm not supposed to have muscle coming out sideways above my knee. I think it looks cool so put up with tight jeans for that :thumb:

Doug as you figured out never use the weight to gauge your depth. I used to squat in a mirror and use the safety's but as my legs fatigued I wouldnt hit depth I would just bend over more. Use the cardboard box on warm ups and assistance exercises but I do try and stay away from something like that on your heavy sets as yoru feeling for something instead of going down and exploding up. But what do I know, your squatting 200+ kgs so your obviously doing the right thing :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug as you figured out never use the weight to gauge your depth. I used to squat in a mirror and use the safety's but as my legs fatigued I wouldnt hit depth I would just bend over more. Use the cardboard box on warm ups and assistance exercises but I do try and stay away from something like that on your heavy sets as yoru feeling for something instead of going down and exploding up. But what do I know, your squatting 200+ kgs so your obviously doing the right thing :thumb:


Exactly same thing here James, I've noticed once I've got around 180kg that I'm bending forward to meet the safety bars :doublesho

The squat for me personally seems to be the most difficult and technical to get right :wall:

What I've found out over the last two years of powerlifting is you should be constantly form checking, even if you make a weight doesn't necessarily mean you've lifted I correctly, this becomes highlighted only until you reach a weight that really challenges you. Then you realise you just got the weight up any old how and your poor form fails you at heavier weights.

I agree with your point on not relying on touching anything, but until I get a feel ill use the little box to touch.

The other thing is I'm not an explosive lifter (never have been), every lift I do is done in deliberate slow form, this I feel actually makes me stronger as I know I can move the weight in a slow controlled manner rather than relying on a little momentum by being explosive.

Apart from the fluke hamstring tear while doing Barbell rows  (I'm still amazed how it happened on such a light weight, although I understand the Hamstrings are in extension while carrying out the Barbell row) I've only had two injuries to speak of;

Left calf tear many years ago while doing standing calf raises with 400kg plus :doublesho
Hamstring tear (Must have been a minor grade 1 tear) I had no pain and the physio couldn't even find it  The only time I really felt it was when I was in rehab mode and adding weight to repair the muscle fibres.

Considering my age, after all the set backs im incredibly happy with my progress and have no intention of stopping now I'm so close :devil:

Back training next week. Game on! :devil::thumb:

OH, AND I WANT THAT 200Kg SQUAT!!!!! :devil::devil:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi James, I'm 6foot 1. 

Doug you'll smash that 200kg with good form. Shouldn't take too long.

Thursday nights workout

overhead press 57.5*3 62.5*3 65*8

deadlift 127.5*3 135*3 145*5

overhead press 45*10*5

deadlift 85*10*5

rotator cuffs 12.5*10*5

Never done any dips as I had a limited time and had to get home. Diet has been good all week. Got some good high protien recipes. Trying to limit my carb intake on non training days as this has worked well for me in the past.

cheers,

Nicky


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi James, I'm 6foot 1.
> 
> Doug you'll smash that 200kg with good form. Shouldn't take too long.
> 
> Thursday nights workout
> 
> overhead press 57.5*3 62.5*3 65*8
> 
> deadlift 127.5*3 135*3 145*5
> 
> overhead press 45*10*5
> 
> deadlift 85*10*5
> 
> rotator cuffs 12.5*10*5
> 
> Never done any dips as I had a limited time and had to get home. Diet has been good all week. Got some good high protien recipes. Trying to limit my carb intake on non training days as this has worked well for me in the past.
> 
> cheers,
> 
> Nicky


I would swap the light OHP press work for dips if your short on time :thumb:

Thanks for the support Nicky 

I'm starting a food diary from tomorrow :doublesho


----------



## ntynan528

Hi Doug, I never even considered I was short on time until I looked at the clock and had to get going. Are you gonna post up your food diary? I've been using my fitness pal for tracking my food. You can enter your own recipes and it stores your recent foods. Find it helps me. Feeling much better after last weeks "diet". dont know if it's had any effect on my weight but only time will tell. Don't want to go down the reduced calorie route as this will defo effect my lifting.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi Doug, I never even considered I was short on time until I looked at the clock and had to get going. Are you gonna post up your food diary? I've been using my fitness pal for tracking my food. You can enter your own recipes and it stores your recent foods. Find it helps me. Feeling much better after last weeks "diet". dont know if it's had any effect on my weight but only time will tell. Don't want to go down the reduced calorie route as this will defo effect my lifting.


You read my mind Nicky! :doublesho 

The last 6 months or so I've been concentrating on ensuring I get 200grams of protein and eating relatively healthy, now I'm used to that its time to move my nutrition up another notch (I've noticed I've become larger due to being more strict with protein intake and I do not feel tired or suffer from energy spikes anymore) :thumb:

I wasn't sure if it would help to post up my food diary. Thinking about it now though, as my diet is very simple, it would be of help as anyone could follow it and guarantee at least 200grams protein per day. So yes I'll post my daily food diary for a week and see what you guys think :thumb: If you like it I'll post every day for the next 6 weeks. Initial plan is six weeks controlled food intake up until my Christmas break.

The goal is to reduce weight/body fat by one pound per week maximum as this will ensure maximum muscle retention. I've done some loose calculations  And I estimate I need to lose 11 pounds of body fat to get to a body fat % of around 14% (This is considered optimum in regards to my health at my age) :thumb:

I use this site to gauge body fat via pictures.

http://www.leighpeele.com/body-fat-pictures-and-percentages

I'm at the 20% picture at the moment and my goal is the 14% picture. IMHO anything lower than that is not in my mind aesthetically pleasing, especially someone of my age and also I like my food too much to take it further than 14%  

This is the first time I've ever done a food diary :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mondays food log 

10am: Salmon with green salad and (Pumpkin seeds, de hulled Hemp seeds, Sesame seeds and a sprinkling of Feta Cheese)
1x Kiwi Fruit

6:30: 4.5 Grilled Pork chops with Broccoli, green beans and Asparagus.

4 spoons of sugar:72 calories

*Total Calories today: 1276
Total Protein: 178.5 grams*

Total water consumed 3 litres (will probably drink another 500ml later)

As its my first day back from my week off I'm not consuming loads of protein, as of tomorrow I will be adding a bit more as I'm back in training.

First thing I've just realised by doing this food diary, I must have been consuming around 300-350grams of protein per day! :doublesho Now I can see why I've not been losing or gaining weight.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nicky at 6'1' I think you should be between 230lb - 270lb (105kg-123kg) so I think your pretty much bang on with your weight.

Monday Workout
Bench Press (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x10 PM 133.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 47.5x10, 55x10, 65x10 PM 86.5kg
Pull Ups: 9x2, 1x3 between all pushing sets
Kroc Rows: 32.5x20

So i deloaded my Bench Press day quite a lot as I was grinding my reps, I had the strength but was starting to grind and I just dont want to put that pressure on my shoulder. And my Bench has been improving by training 3-4 reps below my max so why put my shoulder at risk really. Shoulder felt like crap when unracking and lowering the weight but it still went up really easy.

Going to try and push my incline up as I believe this has great carry over to other exercises.

Kroc rows made my bad shoulder feel great so will try and get these to a decent weight. I shouldnt really call them Kroc rows as they are high reps with a high weight getting the reps any way you can but mine are really controlled concentrating on strengthening my shoulder.

Squats followed by BBB Deadlifts tomorrow which is going to make me seriously sore after nearly a month off.


----------



## ntynan528

Last nights workout

squat 5*92.5 3*107.5 5*117.5

bench 5*82.5 3*92.5 7*105

squat 5*10*65

bench 5*10*65

chins 4,4,4

row 5*10*65

Good workout, getting some shoulder pain on the lighter weights but it seems to disappear with the heavy weights. I did hurt it sunday when i filted a goal at my young lads football.

cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90KGX5 - 104KGX5 - 118KGX5

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Dam good workout, I will post food diary a little later, time to eat!!!!! 

Food diary;

10Am = 2x250 gram chicken breast and green salad with (Pumpkin seeds, sesame seeds, de hulled hemp seeds and sprinkling of Feta cheese )

2Pm = 500ml Protein shake (half skimmed milk half water)

5-5:30 = 500ml Protein shake with workout (Made with water)

6pm = Evening meal 295gram of rump steaks with (Asparagus, Chick peas and Green beans)

4.5 litres water (So far and the night isn't over yet!) :doublesho
1659 calories
262 gram protein And that's not including the protein in the seeds and chick peas etc... :doublesho:doublesho

Major shock how much protein and water I'm consuming :doublesho The calories are about right, I'm hoping to keep a steady 1700-1800 per day :thumb: I'll weight myself Sunday morning and then monitor as I'm aiming for body fat loss of 1 pound maximum per week ensuring I keep as much muscle mass as possible. I think it will take a few weeks of this food diary for me to find my optimum daily calorific amount.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 123.5KGX5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX2*

Not bad but I'm going to have to re learn how to squat. I stopped after two reps on the main sets as my form was awful, nearly bent over too far, balance was terrible too. And I forgot to look slightly up, I was looking down!!! :wall:

Now you may think I'm really disappointed, well I'm not as I know its just a matter of finding the correct weight to start squatting from The strength is there but my form is taking all my power away if you know what I mean. The odd thing is the weight didn't feel heavy just I felt off balance. I think using the safety's as a guide over the last 6 months has not done me any favours at all. This new way of squatting makes the squat feel like a totally new lift.

I will try cycle 8 squat weight and see if that is a good starting point. I'm trying to find and easy start weight but not too easy 

On a positive note I think relearning the squat and performing the lift will encourage more muscle growth :thumb:

Food diary;

*10Am:2xtin tuna and green salad (73gm protein and 350cals)

2pm: 500ml protein shake made with skimmed milk (57gm protein and 355cals)

4:30: Workout shake made with water (40gm protein and 180cals)

6pm: 220grams Salmon (43gm protein and 440cals) Veg: Butter beans, garden peas and chick peas.

Total cals: 1774
Total protein, Not including what's in the veg (212g) *

So far the food diary is a very good idea, I find it stops me picking at little snacks.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 90x3) WO 97.5x5, 112.5x5, 127.5x7 PM 157kg
Deadlifts: 5x10x82.5
GHRs: Skipped due to Hamstrings being fried
Ab Roll Outs: Red Band 8,8,8

Good workout but when Im lifting light weights like this it really should be. I been messing around with these sort of weights on squats for bloody years now. Need to sort my crap out.

Deadlifts went better than expected and must be due to me increasing my maximum strength that I was better in the higher rep stuff. 

Just got back from the UK and back into a routine and now I have to move house and got some bad news to top it off but thats life so I will try and keep my training up as much as possible


----------



## Guru

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 cycle 15 - 5/3/1
> 
> *SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 123.5KGX5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX2*
> 
> Not bad but I'm going to have to re learn how to squat. I stopped after two reps on the main sets as my form was awful, nearly bent over too far, balance was terrible too. And I forgot to look slightly up, I was looking down!!! :wall:
> 
> Now you may think I'm really disappointed, well I'm not as I know its just a matter of finding the correct weight to start squatting from The strength is there but my form is taking all my power away if you know what I mean. The odd thing is the weight didn't feel heavy just I felt off balance. I think using the safety's as a guide over the last 6 months has not done me any favours at all. This new way of squatting makes the squat feel like a totally new lift.
> 
> I will try cycle 8 squat weight and see if that is a good starting point. I'm trying to find and easy start weight but not too easy
> 
> On a positive note I think relearning the squat and performing the lift will encourage more muscle growth :thumb:
> 
> Food diary;
> 
> *10Am:2xtin tuna and green salad (73gm protein and 350cals)
> 
> 2pm: 500ml protein shake made with skimmed milk (57gm protein and 355cals)
> 
> 4:30: Workout shake made with water (40gm protein and 180cals)
> 
> 6pm: 220grams Salmon (43gm protein and 440cals) Veg: Butter beans, garden peas and chick peas.
> 
> Total cals: 1774
> Total protein, Not including what's in the veg (212g) *
> 
> So far the food diary is a very good idea, I find it stops me picking at little snacks.


Just a suggestion - since you have already deloaded the squat quite a bit, why not switch to box squats? IMO they are one of the best ways to learn / ingrain proper squat technique.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Just a suggestion - since you have already deloaded the squat quite a bit, why not switch to box squats? IMO they are one of the best ways to learn / ingrain proper squat technique.


Funny you should say that Guru, all the videos that I've viewed from Elitfts say exactly the same thing.

I think I will de load to a useful base weight to build up my confidence and strength again and try the box :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Food diary;
> 
> *10Am:2xtin tuna and green salad (73gm protein and 350cals)
> 
> 2pm: 500ml protein shake made with skimmed milk (57gm protein and 355cals)
> 
> 4:30: Workout shake made with water (40gm protein and 180cals)
> 
> 6pm: 220grams Salmon (43gm protein and 440cals) Veg: Butter beans, garden peas and chick peas.
> 
> Total cals: 1774
> Total protein, Not including what's in the veg (212g) *
> 
> So far the food diary is a very good idea, I find it stops me picking at little snacks.


Out of interest mate, what time do you get up? Just wondering how much time you leave from waking to actually having your first meal.
What shakes are you using too? (Apologies if you've already covered this in a previous post but it's a very large topic so I admit I haven't read it all )


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Out of interest mate, what time do you get up? Just wondering how much time you leave from waking to actually having your first meal.
> What shakes are you using too? (Apologies if you've already covered this in a previous post but it's a very large topic so I admit I haven't read it all )


Hi Leebo,

I got to bed 10pm at the latest Mon - Friday and get up 6am.
Sat-Sun get to bed 11pm ish and get up 6-7am

First thing in the morning I drink 1 litre of water :thumb:

I drink around 3.5 litres of liquids a day (Green tea, protein shake, skimmed Milk and of course water!)

My last food intake of the day 8pm.

Breakfast in the traditional sense is a load of bull and has been pushed to sell breakfast products IMHO.

Ever since I've started fasting from 8pm to 10am and consuming around 200grams plus of protein per day and reducing starchy carbs to almost none per day I feel awesome! My main carbs are pulses and green veg, I do not have energy spikes any more, I have more energy, I sleep better and wake up very awake. At my age I should not feel so good 

If your not lifting or in any sport I would advise a lower amount of protein (0.5gram per pound of lean bodyweight)

Hope this gives you a good idea mate, best advice, follow the above and tell me how you feel ( I think if memory is correct I noticed a difference within 1 to 2 weeks)

Starchy carbs and breakfast = Evil! 

The shake I use at the moment is Matrix, it gives 40gm protein (Scoop is 90ml), as soon as it finished I will be looking for a non flavoured whey protein.


----------



## ntynan528

Thursdays workout

overhead press 5*55 3*62.5 5*67.5

deadlift 5*120 3*135 3*152.5

overhead press 5*10*45

deadlift 5*10*85

Next week should be my first week of my next cycle. I'm not going to start it because I've hurt my shoulder. It's nothing to serious but think for the next four weeks I'm going to follow the second part of the monstrous shoulder link James posted. I've read the link and I passed the tests for the first part and hope that a four week stint at the second part can sort me out. The only thing I will continue is squat as I feel this is the only exercise I can do without risking further injury.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Nicky


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Thursdays workout
> 
> overhead press 5*55 3*62.5 5*67.5
> 
> deadlift 5*120 3*135 3*152.5
> 
> overhead press 5*10*45
> 
> deadlift 5*10*85
> 
> Next week should be my first week of my next cycle. I'm not going to start it because I've hurt my shoulder. It's nothing to serious but think for the next four weeks I'm going to follow the second part of the monstrous shoulder link James posted. I've read the link and I passed the tests for the first part and hope that a four week stint at the second part can sort me out. The only thing I will continue is squat as I feel this is the only exercise I can do without risking further injury.
> 
> Any advice would be much appreciated.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Nicky


Nicky,

*Any injury: Ice 15 minutes every hour for the first 48 hours then follow the RICE method combined with the bill star rehab protocol :thumb:*

Mike Robertson gives some good advice on rehab and flexibility exercises, Check him out on YouTube :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Really bad DOMS this week, the worst in two years :doublesho 

Quick food diary update

10am: 50gram Pro Beef, Beef Jerky, 1x kiwi and 100gram grapes.

1pm: Salmon and green salad with sesame seeds, Pumpkin seeds, Hemp seeds and a sprinkling of Feta Cheese.

5pm: Home made Chicken curry made with 3x 250gm chick breasts. 3 poppadum's and 250ml Monster energy drink


Protein: 253gram
Calories: 1648

Starting to get into this food diary and I think over the next week or so I will become more and more disciplined and structured with it, I'm almost there though.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) -56KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 73KGX4*

Failed to make 5 reps on last set (was so close though) still happy with results, DOMS much reduced today :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Food diary 

10am: 100gm Chick breast and 1x tin Sardines, 250ml Monster.

1pm: 3x85gm Kipper fillets, 250ml Monster, 1x Granny Smith Apple.

4pm: 50gm Beef Jerky

6pm: 200gm Rump Steak with Asparagus, Butter beans, Mixed salad leaves, Pumpkin, Sesame, Hemp seeds and a sprinkling of Feta  1x Granny Smith Apple.

Cals: 1726
Protein: 167
Liquids today: 3 litres will drink another 500ml at least

First weigh in day tomorrow, not sure I've lost anything yet, but I'm eating healthy :thumb:


----------



## stealthwolf

I've just embarked on this (or at least the ice-cream fitness version). I need help with squats. I can't get anywhere near parallel (let alone below) and I can't keep my heels on the ground. Have started stretching my achilles' tendons but any other way I can master the exercise?


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> I've just embarked on this (or at least the ice-cream fitness version). I need help with squats. I can't get anywhere near parallel (let alone below) and I can't keep my heels on the ground. Have started stretching my achilles' tendons but any other way I can master the exercise?


I would start by using an empty bar and learn correct squat technique :thumb:

Search for Videos "So you think you can squat" on YouTube they are by EliteFTS or go back a few pages, I've posted several links on this subject :thumb:

What on earth is the Ice Cream fitness version


----------



## ITHAQVA

Last time I weighted myself was 13th October. I was 107.3Kg. This morning I'm 104.3Kg. Over the last 4 weeks I've lost an average of 600grams. If I can keep to this rate or a bit lower it would be perfect. 

Next weeks weight in will give me a better indicator.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> I've just embarked on this (or at least the ice-cream fitness version). I need help with squats. I can't get anywhere near parallel (let alone below) and I can't keep my heels on the ground. Have started stretching my achilles' tendons but any other way I can master the exercise?


Must point out 

Before exercising use "Dynamic stretching"

After exercising use "Static stretching"

Are you overweight?

For flexibility vids search YouTube for Mike Robertson :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Funny you should say that Guru, all the videos that I've viewed from Elitfts say exactly the same thing.
> 
> I think I will de load to a useful base weight to build up my confidence and strength again and try the box :thumb:


As a Box squatter for years, my experience is that if you want to get good at something then you have to actually do it. Box squats have great carry over to geared lifters as you sit back into your suit just like a box squat but they dont have much carry over to the Raw squat as the mechanics are completely different. All the top Raw lifters seem to agree on this point.

But I do agree that they are great for technique and I always start people on Box squats for at least their first few sessions as they have a lower learning curve.



stealthwolf said:


> I've just embarked on this (or at least the ice-cream fitness version). I need help with squats. I can't get anywhere near parallel (let alone below) and I can't keep my heels on the ground. Have started stretching my achilles' tendons but any other way I can master the exercise?


Not many people can squat to proper depth straight away especially without Butt wink but all of the below will help. I always use the 2 warm ups from Maximum Strength program and find them brilliant.






http://www.t-nation.com/training/defranco-agile-8

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online...quat_like_you_mean_it_tips_for_a_deeper_squat

Friday Workout:
Standing Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52x5, 58.5x7 PM 72kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+7.5x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3 Between all pushing Sets
Pendlay Rows: 60x10, 10, 10

Good workout, first time I have done standing shoulder press in years and it does feel completely different, definitely more of a whole body exercise as your core is working to stabilize the weight.

Dips were very easy but I have deloaded these as well so they should be very easy.

Now I can actually get some reps on chin ups I do really enjoy them, just seem to work so many muscles and makes you feel better doing 3 really fast powerful reps.

Need to start pushing my Row weight up as this will literally help every big exercise that you do.


----------



## stealthwolf

Ice cream fitness: http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/jason-blaha-ice-cream-fitness-5x5-novice-workout

I've been doing stretching since yesterday's embarassment at the gym. I can now squat to parallel (bodyweight only). If I go lower, I'm very unsteady unless I go wide with my feet and toes pointed out at 45 degrees. Then I can go all the way down but cant get back up!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> Ice cream fitness: http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/jason-blaha-ice-cream-fitness-5x5-novice-workout
> 
> I've been doing stretching since yesterday's embarassment at the gym. I can now squat to parallel (bodyweight only). If I go lower, I'm very unsteady unless I go wide with my feet and toes pointed out at 45 degrees. Then I can go all the way down but cant get back up!!!


I think the above program is far too complicated for you, start the 5x5 from stronglifts or starting strenght. You dont need all that isolation stuff :wall: Concentrate on the basics :thumb:

Toes should be pointed out (see "So you think you can squat" vids on YouTube) :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> As a Box squatter for years, my experience is that if you want to get good at something then you have to actually do it. Box squats have great carry over to geared lifters as you sit back into your suit just like a box squat but they dont have much carry over to the Raw squat as the mechanics are completely different. All the top Raw lifters seem to agree on this point.
> 
> But I do agree that they are great for technique and I always start people on Box squats for at least their first few sessions as they have a lower learning curve.


As I've got a good level of strength already, *I wont be box squatting *but just touching the box before pushing up, once i get into good technique i want to be able to do it without touching the box :thumb:


----------



## stealthwolf

ITHAQVA said:


> I think the above program is far too complicated for you, start the 5x5 from stronglifts or starting strenght. You dont need all that isolation stuff :wall: Concentrate on the basics :thumb:
> 
> Toes should be pointed out (see "So you think you can squat" vids on YouTube) :thumb:


It doesn't come across as complicated. I used to lift when I was at uni. I used to have a four day split of delt/traps, back/bis, chest/tris, legs/lower back. Never really bothered with an abs workout.

I've been stretching out some more and can squat to near enough parallel but if I go slightly wider than shoulder width and keep toes pointed out at 45 degrees, I can squat all the way down. Just cant get back up withou falling over.


----------



## Guest

stealthwolf said:


> Ice cream fitness: http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/jason-blaha-ice-cream-fitness-5x5-novice-workout


Looks like a standard 5x5 routine with a ton of accessory exercises thrown in. My first question would be how is your recovery going to be on that template? I'd be tempted to suggest it's one for the younger crowd.


----------



## Bod42

Ice Cream is one for the arms & abs crowd which is exactly what 5x5 is NOT about. Its about the best bang for your buck exercises that create the best gains for your effort. You only have so much energy/recovery so everyone of those isolation exercises that you do is taking away from the big exercises. And considering the big exercises hit your arms anyway, what are you really achieving except killing your recovery. Most people struggle with squats 3 times per week as it is let allow with that pointless isolation exercises.

It's your choice at the end of the day but the Stronglift version is far better than Ice cream.

Stance should be slightly wider than shoulder width and toes pointed out slightly. Everyones hip joint is formed differently and therefore different people will need different stances and different amount of toe turn out. Do what ever feels the best.


----------



## stealthwolf

Today was my second day of ICF and you know what? It's too long. I just don't feel it's hitting my muscles adequately.

I'm now going back to a 3-day push/pull/legs split.

Thanks for the links for the squat. I managed to achieve it today. Used a bar with light weights and seemed to be going well. Will need to continue the stretches though.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 97.5KGX3 - 111KGX3 - 125KGX3

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, the last rep on the 3 x 125 was a little difficult so I need to keep my form strict if I'm to continue to progress on this lift.

Didn't post yesterday's food diary as I ate only one bag of beef jerky then had a Chinese for tea as a treat 

Food diary for today

10Am: 2x250gm chick breast, green salad with Pumpkin, sesame and Hemp seeds.

1-2pm: Beef Jerky.

5pm: Protein shake.

6:30: 2 x Rib Eye Steak (585gm!!! :doublesho:doublesho) Mixed salad leaves, Pumpkin, sesame, Hemp seeds, Garden peas, asparagus and chick peas.
250ml Monster :devil:

Cals: 2348 :doublesho (The two steaks were nearly 1500 cals :doublesho)
Protein: 291gm Protein!

Bit of a balls up with the steaks but not to big a deal, should have only eaten one


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Deadlift: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x3) WO 115x5, 132.5x5, 150x7 PM 185kg
Squats: 70x10,10,10,10,10 90 secs rest
Good Morning: missed

First time I have deadlifted in over a month but they actually felt really good. Getting more in front of the bar and it felt like how I pulling a few months back which was better form.

Ok so I can see why BBB work. Even at this low weight I was dripping with sweat and breathing hard. Anyone who ever said weights don't work your heart and/or lungs has never done a proper set of squats. These were killer but I expect my body to adapt quickly to these again and start pushing the weight up fast.

I was so knackered and I'm still ill so missed Good mornings



stealthwolf said:


> Today was my second day of ICF and you know what? It's too long. I just don't feel it's hitting my muscles adequately.
> 
> I'm now going back to a 3-day push/pull/legs split.
> 
> Thanks for the links for the squat. I managed to achieve it today. Used a bar with light weights and seemed to be going well. Will need to continue the stretches though.


Day 2 you quit :wall: . 5x5 is an absoloute bare minimum 12 week program. No one I have ever trained has said it didn't hit the muscles adequately, I had to pick a lot of people up off the floor as its time for their next set. 5x5 done properly is a killer.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi, James. The BBB work is a killer, like you say dripping in swaet and out of breath. It's a different feeling from just being tired.

The shoulder is feeling better and I'm going to start strengthening my shoulders from tomorrow. Easy workouts will be strange but need to get this shoulder sorted.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 122.5KGX3 - 140KGX3 - 157.5KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, finally found the correct weights to re learn my squat from :thumb:
Squats on this cycle will be a little out of sync, I'll start this squat cycle again next cycle and try to build from there :thumb:
Squatting full parallel on every rep adds a whole lot more to the session (Much harder by a huge degree)

Food diary:

*10Am: 2xtin Tuna with mixed green salad, Pumpkin, sesame, Hemp seeds and some feta cheese.

1Pm: Beef Jerky

5Pm: Protein Shake

6:30Pm: 1x whole roast chicken (Had two left and needed to get rid of them, one to go!) and two chocolate éclairs.

Liquids today: 3.2 litres, will consume at least another 500ml.

Total cals (Approx):2922
Total protein (Approx)403 grams!!!!!!!!!!!:doublesho:doublesho*

I will keep the calories down over the next 4 days  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug I am absolutely loving your diet, massive credit to you. I may do something very similar in a few weeks when I move into my new place and finally have a proper kitchen again.



ntynan528 said:


> Hi, James. The BBB work is a killer, like you say dripping in swaet and out of breath. It's a different feeling from just being tired.
> 
> The shoulder is feeling better and I'm going to start strengthening my shoulders from tomorrow. Easy workouts will be strange but need to get this shoulder sorted.


From personal experience take it really easy with that shoulder. Shoulder rehab isn't about weight, its about feeling the muscle working and getting blood pumping through the area. After months of rehab, I was still only using 5kg max for my RC exercises. But look at the long term, I put someone on the 8 weeks to monsterous shoulders workout, he wasn't happy about being away from benching for 8 weeks but came back and hit a PR within a few weeks and he hasn't had a problem since.


----------



## stealthwolf

Bod42 said:


> Day 2 you quit :wall: . 5x5 is an absoloute bare minimum 12 week program. No one I have ever trained has said it didn't hit the muscles adequately, I had to pick a lot of people up off the floor as its time for their next set. 5x5 done properly is a killer.


Main reason is duration. Remember, it's not just 5x5 but has accessories in. By the time I'd done a 20 min run, squats, deadlifts and shoulder press, I'd been in the gym for almost two hours. I still had to do barbell row, dips and BB curls.

My prev split of delts&traps/chest&back/arms completely neglected legs, but I still managed to get in and out in under 90mins and that's with a 20 min run.

I think the issue I have is the 5 sets of an exercise means I need to take longer between exercises (something like 2-3 mins between sets and 3-5 mins between exercises). When I'm doing 3 sets of 8-12 reps, I give myself 60secs between sets and 2 mins between exercises.


----------



## Bod42

stealthwolf said:


> Main reason is duration. Remember, it's not just 5x5 but has accessories in. By the time I'd done a 20 min run, squats, deadlifts and shoulder press, I'd been in the gym for almost two hours. I still had to do barbell row, dips and BB curls.
> 
> My prev split of delts&traps/chest&back/arms completely neglected legs, but I still managed to get in and out in under 90mins and that's with a 20 min run.
> 
> I think the issue I have is the 5 sets of an exercise means I need to take longer between exercises (something like 2-3 mins between sets and 3-5 mins between exercises). When I'm doing 3 sets of 8-12 reps, I give myself 60secs between sets and 2 mins between exercises.


So drop the pointless accessory exercises :wall: 5x5 shouldn't take longer than an hour. Im in the gym less than an hour including my warm up etc.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> *My prev split of delts&traps/chest&back/arms completely neglected legs,* but I still managed to get in and out in under 90mins and that's with a 20 min run.


:doublesho

As with anything in life, If you want it, you'll make time for it :thumb:


----------



## stealthwolf

Completely agree. I was scared of injuring myself with deadlifts and squats so I was avoiding them. When I used to train about ten years ago, I couldn't do squats so I did machine leg press instead. I used to deadlifts and good mornings though.

This time around, I just did shoulders on tues, chest/back on thurs, arms on sat. I've now changed that to: chest/shoulders/tris on tues, back, traps, biceps on thurs, legs and abs on sat.

Thanks to the posts on here, I can now squat to parallel (or just below). Will slowly increase the weight though and will keep up the daily stretching.


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> Completely agree. I was scared of injuring myself with deadlifts and squats so I was avoiding them. When I used to train about ten years ago, I couldn't do squats so I did machine leg press instead. I used to deadlifts and good mornings though.
> 
> This time around, I just did shoulders on tues, chest/back on thurs, arms on sat. I've now changed that to: chest/shoulders/tris on tues, back, traps, biceps on thurs, legs and abs on sat.
> 
> Thanks to the posts on here, I can now squat to parallel (or just below). Will slowly increase the weight though and will keep up the daily stretching.


Glad to hear your training legs :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug I am absolutely loving your diet, massive credit to you. I may do something very similar in a few weeks when I move into my new place and finally have a proper kitchen again.


It tastes great :thumb:
Its actually not hard to stick to, a few times i deviate (Last night eclairs spring to mind! ) but im becoming more and more disciplined.Becuase of last nights little treat I will only have one junk meal on my junk day, so the weeks calories wont be too over my required amount :thumb:

Eating this way is a little more exspensive, I'll guess we spend around £20 more per week on food. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Food diary*

10Am: Beef Jerky

1Pm: Chicken salad with Sesame seeds, de hulled Hemp seeds, Pumpkin seeds and Feta Cheese. 1x kiwi fruit and Half a Banana 

6:30Pm: 220gm of Salmon with Asparagus, Garden peas and 200gm, Butter Beans.
250ml Monster :devil:

Cals: 1364
Protein: 210.68gm

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Bench Press: (Wu 47.5x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 82.5x3, 95x3, 105x8 PM 133kg
Incline Bench Press: 55x8, 65x8, 75x6 PM 90kg
Pull Ups: 8x2, 2x3 between every pushing set
Kroc Rows: 32.5x20

Another very easy workout, hit all my weights so have to be pleased. Need to look at my setup on bench though as the weight was easy but definitely don't feel as stable and cant get as good leg drive lately and the bar wasn't as straight path as usual.

Still loving incline BP, it doesn't hurt my shoulder and just feels like a better exercise. I'm going to concentrate on pushing these and my barbell row up.

Kroc rows again, Im using to strengthen the back of my shoulder and leave it at the bottom of the rep for a second or 2 really stretching out the muscle. Shoulder always feel great after these. Its quite surprising the weight you can do on these compared with your barbell row.


----------



## ntynan528

thursday workout

Started my shoulder rehab last night. Shoulders felt good with only a little twinge on front dumbell raise. No pain today I'm glad to say. I'll follow this for the next four weeks and see how the shoulder feels. Did some light squats and leg press too.

Next week will be the next cycle of 5-3-1 for my squat with my shoulder work. Thinking of doing leg press for assistance this cycle. Thoughts?

Been watchinng my diet and have lost 1kg each week for the last two weeks. Trying to keep this up as all I have really done is cut out snacking and replaced some carbs with protein.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> thursday workout
> 
> Started my shoulder rehab last night. Shoulders felt good with only a little twinge on front dumbell raise. No pain today I'm glad to say. I'll follow this for the next four weeks and see how the shoulder feels. Did some light squats and leg press too.
> 
> Next week will be the next cycle of 5-3-1 for my squat with my shoulder work. Thinking of doing leg press for assistance this cycle. Thoughts?
> 
> Been watchinng my diet and have lost 1kg each week for the last two weeks. Trying to keep this up as all I have really done is cut out snacking and replaced some carbs with protein.


Leg assistance: BBB (5x10) Deadlifts and squats (Not on the same workout though!) :thumb:

I would not lose more than 1 pound per week otherwise youll be losing muscle tissue as well.

When losing body fat ensure you are getting the correct amount of protein for your lean body mass and drinking plenty of water to help the body flush the excess/unused protein :thumb:


----------



## stealthwolf

Stupid question: when I was into lifting in the early Noughties, leg curl/extension machines were a no-no because of potential damage to the ligaments in the knee. Is this still the case?


----------



## ITHAQVA

stealthwolf said:


> Stupid question: when I was into lifting in the early Noughties, leg curl/extension machines were a no-no because of potential damage to the ligaments in the knee. Is this still the case?


I've not heard that one before. Are you actually contemplating doing these exercises? 

I see not point in performing Isolation exercises unless you are a competing bodybuilder who wants to add "Intensity" to a particular body part workout. The average person does not need to do them at all :thumb:


----------



## Guru

stealthwolf said:


> Stupid question: when I was into lifting in the early Noughties, leg curl/extension machines were a no-no because of potential damage to the ligaments in the knee. Is this still the case?


Why would a thing like that change with time?

I'm with Doug on this. You'll need isolation work IF you're either a competing bodybuilder or you're trying to address a particularly weak muscle.

The knee ligament damage is a partial truth. It can happen if you do these exercises in high intensity. Keep them relatively light IF you really must do them.


----------



## stealthwolf

No not going to do them but did wonder about them.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 60KGX3 - 69KGX3 - 77KGX2

DIPS (WU 9x3) BODYWEIGHT+20KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGX10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, fail on the last work set, I got about half way up on the third rep and it wouldn't go up anymore  Not a worry as this OHP cycle is going to be repeated next cycle.

Food diary

8Am: Beef Jerky

9Am:230gm of kippers 

1:30: Protein shake with workout

4:15: 200gm rump steak, Asparagus, butter beans, garden peas, green salad with various seeds, chargrilled yellow pepper and tomatoes.

Protein: 173.2 grams
Cals: 1445

Will have another protein shake later adding 180cals and 40gm protein :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 147KGX3 - 168KGX3 - 189KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice!


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> Leg assistance: BBB (5x10) Deadlifts and squats (Not on the same workout though!) :thumb:
> 
> I would not lose more than 1 pound per week otherwise you'll be losing muscle tissue as well.
> 
> When losing body fat ensure you are getting the correct amount of protein for your lean body mass and drinking plenty of water to help the body flush the excess/unused protein :thumb:


Cheers Doug, was thinking of the leg press for my second workout as I'm not deadlifting till my shoulder is better. I'll give it a go, better than doing nothing.

I've been checking I'm getting enough protein and I am. Eating more protein with less carbs and keeping roughly to the same calories. Wouldn't think I'll keep losing at this rate of 1kg per week but it seems that with restricted carbs the weight seems to shift pretty quick.

Gym tonight with squat and shoulder rehab

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Cheers Doug, was thinking of the leg press for my second workout as I'm not deadlifting till my shoulder is better. I'll give it a go, better than doing nothing.
> 
> I've been checking I'm getting enough protein and I am. Eating more protein with less carbs and keeping roughly to the same calories. Wouldn't think I'll keep losing at this rate of 1kg per week but it seems that with restricted carbs the weight seems to shift pretty quick.
> 
> Gym tonight with squat and shoulder rehab
> 
> :thumb:


My weight has gone back to 106Kg :doublesho and im eating soooo healthy :wall:  I will reduce my daily intake by another 200cals and see what happens :thumb:

You could try Glute Ham raises, these come highly recomended by the guys at ElitFTS :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout: (Should have been fri)
Squats: (60x5, 75x5, 90x3) 105x3, 120x3, 135x5 PM 157.5kg
Deadlifts: 85x5x10
Ab Roll Outs: Red Band 3x9

I hit all my weights so cant complain but its not enjoyable lifting this light on squats. 

BBB are just a killer, proper love hate relationship going on with these. I lowered my rest time to 90 secs on these as well. I am determined to do all reps and sets with a double over hand grip as well. Absolutely killed my forearms and that's definitely my weak point on these but I know it will help with my heavy weight days.


----------



## Bod42

Tuesday Workout
Standing Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 47.5x3, 55x3, 62x5 PM 72.5
Dips: BWx8, BW+7.5x8, BW+22.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 9x3, 1x4
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x3x8

Another workout where I hit all my reps. Standing shoulder press feels weird, feels like I cant get all my power into the bar like I can when I'm seated but I'm going to stick with standing for at least a few cycles.

I do love dips and have figured out a way to do them where they put zero stress on my bad shoulder.

I really want to push up my barbell row, imagine how much better every exercise would be if you were doing 100kg rows instead of 60kg but its hard to push the weight up when your lats are fried from 10 sets of chin ups. But I love doing Chin ups between all my pushing exercises and think everyone should so not dropping them.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 104.5KGX5 - 118KGX3 - 132KGX1

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 87.5KGx5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 77.5KGx10x10x10*

Workout felt awesome, I felt strong in every lift, the 132kg x 1 bench was easy  Strength is a weird thing. It amazes me how a weight can feel like it wants to totally crush you then another workout it just goes up easy (I'm convinced my recent bench plateaus were caused by poor technique)

Slight alteration to the workout I'm splitting Dead Barbell Rows into 2 heavy and 3 light, I plan to increase the weight on the 2 heavy until I get around 105kg for 5 reps with good form to help with pull ups when I add them in the future :thumb:

Timing my rest between sets every time now, 6 minutes between heavy work sets and up to 4 minutes for all assistance sets (This includes the heavier Dead Barbell Rows)

Hopefully my squat session will go well this week and my technique will improve over the next few months. I would love to have a full parallel 200kg squat in 6 months (Wish me luck , I'm going to need it )

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Standing shoulder press feels weird, feels like I cant get all my power into the bar like I can when I'm seated but I'm going to stick with standing for at least a few cycles.


It feels exactly the same for me James, I think its due to the body not being as rigid as it is in the seated position, standing OHP is far more technical and to get all the aspects of its technique takes time mate, I'm still struggling. You focus on keeping the lats rigid and the rest of your core and your legs get all lose!  I find the same with the squat you've got to focus on keeping the arch in the back, stick your belly out, keep looking up etc.. the whole lift is so dam technical!!!

IMHO the squat and OHP are the hardest to master  But master them we will! :devil:


----------



## ntynan528

ITHAQVA said:


> My weight has gone back to 106Kg :doublesho and im eating soooo healthy :wall:  I will reduce my daily intake by another 200cals and see what happens :thumb:
> 
> You could try Glute Ham raises, these come highly recomended by the guys at ElitFTS :thumb:


I wouldnt be so quick to reduce your calories Doug. Give it till next week and see what happens:thumb:

I like the glute ham raise but the gym I've been going to doesn't have anywhere I can do them.


----------



## ntynan528

Monday nights workout

Squat 97.5*5 105*5 110*5

squat bbb 70*10*5

Shoulder rehab is going pretty well I think. It can be strange that working with light weights can still be difficult. Never had any pain in my shoulder during the workout but a strange burning feeling which disappeared with rest. Not sure what this is but only had it in the side I have injured


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> I wouldnt be so quick to reduce your calories Doug. Give it till next week and see what happens:thumb:
> 
> I like the glute ham raise but the gym I've been going to doesn't have anywhere I can do them.


I think your right Nicky :thumb:

The slower the better and im using these few weeks before christmas to find out my optimum daily calorific intake for slow body fat loss (say that after a few glasses of Absinthe!)


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Monday nights workout
> 
> Squat 97.5*5 105*5 110*5
> 
> squat bbb 70*10*5
> 
> Shoulder rehab is going pretty well I think. It can be strange that working with light weights can still be difficult. Never had any pain in my shoulder during the workout but a strange burning feeling which disappeared with rest. Not sure what this is but only had it in the side I have injured


Its always worth going to see a sports physio just to get another opinion.

The one I've used only cost £35 so its well worth it IMHO :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) -131KGX5 - 149KGX3 - 166KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Incredibly pleased with this workout :thumb: Look>>>> 

The work sets felt medium difficulty, I'm especially surprised how the 166x1 went up :thumb: Even though I know I can lift more, I'm going to stick to a steady increase and allow my technique to keep improving. Every rep was 100% parallel :thumb:

One huge difference I noticed was changing the bar position on my back, I was squatting with the bar soooo dam low before and it was making me feel totally out of control and off balance once I moved over to full parallel squats and touching the little box. Moving the bar to the correct position (the part were the traps meet the shoulders) has made the squat feel much more stable and I don't feel out of control and about to topple over. It has also made the lift feel less technical because I'm not worrying about falling over  Another lesson learned! But im glad. I want to squat my 200kg correctly.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Thursday Workout
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x3) WO 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x5 PM 183.5kg
Squats: 72.5x5x10 90 seconds rest
Good Mornings: 35x3x10

Yet another workout hitting all my reps but considering I deloaded deadlifts, they were a lot harder than they should have been but then I have added 2 reps so it probably evens itself out.

I find the BBB sets are more mental than actually hard and coupled with the 90 seconds short rest period, these really get your heartrate up. Got to love the feeling about 3 sets in when your legs are so pumped that the first few reps feel like you forgotten to put the bar on your back. I can tell these are just great for form as its just time under the bar.


----------



## ntynan528

Thursdays workout

Leg press 225*5 240*5 255*5

leg press 150*10*5

Shoulder rehab

Weights felt good. Going to stick with the leg press for the next two weeks and hope my shoulder feels better next cycle. If not then I'll go for another cycle and see someone about my shoulder.

Going to weigh myself tonight and see how the weight loss is going hopefully well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Thursdays workout
> 
> Leg press 225*5 240*5 255*5
> 
> leg press 150*10*5
> 
> Shoulder rehab
> 
> Weights felt good. Going to stick with the leg press for the next two weeks and hope my shoulder feels better next cycle. If not then I'll go for another cycle and see someone about my shoulder.
> 
> Going to weigh myself tonight and see how the weight loss is going hopefully well.


I wouldnt pospone seeing someone about your shoulder Nicky, you should really start rehab about two days after the injury occured if its a muscle tear, otherwise scar tissue will form and leave you more prone to injuries.

:thumb:


----------



## t1mmy

I've been dipping in and out of the thread as a casual reader for quite a while now and was planning on getting back into it. To be honest I've done very little weights work in the last 2 years, mainly focusing on running and other cardio.

I've been looking at 5 by 5 programs and there seem to be a few variations. Is there a specific one that people would recommend?


----------



## ITHAQVA

t1mmy said:


> I've been dipping in and out of the thread as a casual reader for quite a while now and was planning on getting back into it. To be honest I've done very little weights work in the last 2 years, mainly focusing on running and other cardio.
> 
> I've been looking at 5 by 5 programs and there seem to be a few variations. Is there a specific one that people would recommend?


*StrongLifts 5×5 Workout A*

Squat 5×5
Bench Press 5×5
Barbell Rows 5×5

*StrongLifts 5×5 Workout B*

Squat 5×5
Overhead Press 5×5
Deadlift 1×5

http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/

:thumb:


----------



## t1mmy

Cheers for the link, I've been having a read and it looks good. Got a bit more to read later as there is loads of info!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 15 - 5/3/1

Yesterday:

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 73KGX3 - 82KGX0 *

Left it to late in the night and the workout was awful  My OHP technique needs fixing.

Today:

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX3 - 200KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Felt awesome throughout the whole workout! Missus said my 200x1 form was spot on. I'm not surprised, it went up so easy, steady and controlled :thumb:

I'll stay at the above deadlift weights until my squat gets to a better weight to allow for a little extra recovery and to help me put extra focus on my OHP.


----------



## Bod42

In the process of moving house so my gym isnt set up at the moment but I'm hopefully going to get it all set up tonight and back to updating regularly.

Also got a proper kitchen again so can actually start eating better which can only help my training.


----------



## ntynan528

Monday night

Squat 105*3 110*3 117.5*3

SHoulder rehab

BBB 70*10*5

Good workout all the weights went well. My squat form is much better now and the lifts feel easy.

Going to see someone next week about my shoulder. Although my doctor didn't think it was anything to worry about and it is feeling much better. I'm just going to get a professional opinion from a guy who's been recomended to my through a friend who visited him during the time he played football and has nothing but good things to say about him.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 (Deload) cycle 15 -5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS 20X5 30X5 40X3 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

What can I say, deeeload!!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Monday night
> 
> Squat 105*3 110*3 117.5*3
> 
> SHoulder rehab
> 
> BBB 70*10*5
> 
> Good workout all the weights went well. My squat form is much better now and the lifts feel easy.
> 
> Going to see someone next week about my shoulder. Although my doctor didn't think it was anything to worry about and it is feeling much better. I'm just going to get a professional opinion from a guy who's been recomended to my through a friend who visited him during the time he played football and has nothing but good things to say about him.


I would be very careful in taking advice from a GP, my local said all I needed was rest after tearing my hamstring and they could give me no other advice, if your into any sport allowing scar tissue to form is a recipe for more injury time.


----------



## Bod42

Im a few workouts behind at the moment due to move but fitting them in where I can.
Wednesday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 70x3) 87.5x5, 100x3, 112.5x6 PM 135kg
Incline Bench Press: 60x5, 70x5, 80x5
Over hand Chin Ups: 7x2, 3x3
Kroc Rows: Couldnt find my DB clips so just did inverted rows in the top of my rack.

Easy workout, weights went up really well but my technique is still off, having trouble getting my feet in a position where I can leg drive which is strange.

Really pleased with Chin Ups, they were really fast and easy. I know its nothing fantastic but I never used to be able to do over hand chins.

Incline was very easy and felt great tonight, so great in fact that I actually considered changing my main exercise to inclines.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys, I was just wondering what type of protein you guys use? I've been using whey protein for a while now and although I've had no problems with it i've been looking at Go nutrition's "essential protein". This is a mix of 3 different protein types and creatine. Been thinking of giving this a try. Any advice?

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys, I was just wondering what type of protein you guys use? I've been using whey protein for a while now and although I've had no problems with it i've been looking at Go nutrition's "essential protein". This is a mix of 3 different protein types and creatine. Been thinking of giving this a try. Any advice?
> 
> Cheers


Go for as a natural and additive free as you can Nicky, Creatine is a complete waste of money IMHO and has more of a placebo effect than anything else. One can of Tuna = 5mg of Creatine, so you can see once you start eating right, supplementation is a complete waste of time :thumb:

I've been training for many, many years mate, please don't listen to anyone who says they swear by a certain supplement, its a load of bull.

I only use whey protein to "supplement" my diet as I find eating 200gm plus of protein a day difficult to achieve as I'm naturally a light eater.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I always like to keep all my supplements separate so theres not any unwanted products in there. i always use Whey protein, the other types of protein have benefits but I dont like them as they are a cheaper protein and I feel that they will just change the ratio in favor of the cheapest protein.

Also I dont like to buy protein with creatine in it, choice separate products so you can be in charge of your dosage. 

I slightly disagree with Doug regarding Creatine, I think it has its place, theres just to much research showing good results but i think you only gain an advantage at an advanced level.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I always like to keep all my supplements separate so theres not any unwanted products in there. i always use Whey protein, the other types of protein have benefits but I dont like them as they are a cheaper protein and I feel that they will just change the ratio in favor of the cheapest protein.
> 
> Also I dont like to buy protein with creatine in it, choice separate products so you can be in charge of your dosage.
> 
> I slightly disagree with Doug regarding Creatine, I think it has its place, theres just to much research showing good results *but i think you only gain an advantage at an advanced level*.


I agree with James on the above, but I don't think any of us are "Advanced" or have taken our training anywhere near our maximum potential.

I notice a huge difference in my training and how I felt as soon as I started to structure my diet (reduced starchy carbs and increased protein intake), I noticed nothing using Creatine or any of the so called joint supplements.

In regards to joint health, the biggest difference I noticed was when I moved away from the 5x5,2x5 and 1x5 training routines over to the 5/3/1. I think the varied loads, 3 week cycles and adding weight only once per month, allow your joints to recover a build tolerance to the steady weight increases. IMHO this is were you can be smart and maintain progressive overload for a much longer period.

Since being on the 5/3/1 I have yet to plateau due to physical constraints, all my plateaus have been IMO poor technique.

After being on it for 15 months I still think the 5/3/1 is the ultimate training routine :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys, I was just wondering what type of protein you guys use? I've been using whey protein for a while now and although I've had no problems with it i've been looking at Go nutrition's "essential protein". This is a mix of 3 different protein types and creatine. Been thinking of giving this a try. Any advice?
> 
> Cheers


Just to add, we can over analyse nutrition. To ensure I get all the proteins I need I eat all the below In a normal week.

Average week consumption:

Tin Tuna x 2-3
Tin salmon x1-2
Fresh Salmon x 2-3
Kippers x 2-3 packs
Sardines x1
Chicken x 2-3
Beef (Rump steaks) x 2
Beef jerky (50gm packs) x5
Pork chops x 2
Eggs x 2-3
Loads of different non meat proteins (Butter beans, chick peas, kidney beans, soy beans, garden peas and seeds)
Whey protein x 6 500 ml servings a week max (approx. 3 made with skimmed milk).

I stick to that list every week, all the proteins I need me thinks 

Well worth you Google about how much Creatine is in all the above protein sources


----------



## ntynan528

thursdays workout

leg press 280*3 297.5*3 315*3

leg press bbb 200*10*5

shoulder rehab

Looks as though my leg press has jumped up loads but this is only because I noticed that the leg press has a starting weight of 50kg.

Cheers foe the advice on the protein, I'm going to stick with just my whey protein as I feel that its working well and im not struggling on any lifts. Looking forward to getting past this shoulder issue so I can continue with the rest of my lifts, I'm not going to lift until I have the all clear and feel good in myself. 

I'm also going to start sprints for conditioning. I'll keep you guys upto date in when that starts and how it goes.

Cheers


----------



## ITHAQVA

Deeeeeload week!

*OVERHEAD PRESS 20X5 20X5 20X3 30KGX5 - 40KGX5 - 50KGX5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx5x5x5x5x5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## t1mmy

So having read through all the stuff I'm going to start this tomorrow. I have jotted down some basic stats before I start.

Height: 6'3" / 189cm
Age: 31
Weight: 11st 5lb / 72.1kg
BF: 12.8%

Looking forward to it.


----------



## Bod42

Friday Workout
Squats: (WU 60x5, 75x5, 90x3) WO 112.5x5, 127.5x3, 142.5x3 PM 156.5kg
Deadlifts: 87.5x5x10

Squats were easy but they should be at this weight. Seeing that predicted max of 156.5kg isnt nice but looking at this long term. I feel after all those years of box squatting that my body is growing different muscles for free squats and your only as strong as your weakest muscle.

Had to do the last set of deadlifts with a mixed grip which is a disappointing but still going to push my double over hand as far as possible.

I really need to sort out my diet, I feel really run down again and its obvious that my immune system is down as just had my second out break of coldsores in 3 weeks. If my immune system is down then my training isnt going to go well so need to sort this out ASAP.

I'm going to add in some hill sprints on my off days. No excuse now I live on a hill



t1mmy said:


> So having read through all the stuff I'm going to start this tomorrow. I have jotted down some basic stats before I start.
> 
> Height: 6'3" / 189cm
> Age: 31
> Weight: 11st 5lb / 72.1kg
> BF: 12.8%
> 
> Looking forward to it.


Absolutely perfect starting position for you. You can afford to put on a fair bit of weight and with that added food comes added strength and muscle. Good luck and keep us posted.


----------



## Guru

t1mmy said:


> So having read through all the stuff I'm going to start this tomorrow. I have jotted down some basic stats before I start.
> 
> Height: 6'3" / 189cm
> Age: 31
> Weight: 11st 5lb / 72.1kg
> BF: 12.8%
> 
> Looking forward to it.


Good luck. You'll be starting light, so concentrate on the technique right from beginning. You can even film your lifts and post them so as to get help from others regarding form.

As rightly said above, it's a good starting position for you since you need to gain weight, not lose it - so yeah, focus on right nutrition at the right time.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Standing Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 52.5x5, 57.5x3, 65x3 PM 71.5kg
Dips: BWx5, BW+15x5, BW+30x5
Neutral Grip Chins: 8x3, 2x4
Pendlay Rows: 65x3x9

Another workout hitting all my reps. I have left my micro weights at my old flat (dont worry Doug I am getting them back) so meant I couldnt load to my exact weights. I also did my second work set twice which Im sure took a little out of me so pleased to get the 3 reps.

Dips felt great as usual and Im 110+kgs at the moment so Im pleased with a 140kg dip for 5 reps.

Chin Ups are improving fast and even better than the 1 rep a workout as Im heavier than I was. Going to up my activity level over the next few weeks and see if I can trim down abit though. Tennis tonight and golf thurs, I know this will probably effect my deadlifts on wednesday but i am prepared for that.

I actually did 2.5kg more on Pendlay rows than I should have but still got all my reps so Im pleased.


----------



## t1mmy

Monday Workout:

Squats: 20 5x5
Bench Press: 20 5x5
Pendlay Rows: 30 5x5

No issues on the first day. Even at only 20kg, I've got a feeling my legs will be a little achey tomorrow.


----------



## Guru

t1mmy said:


> Monday Workout:
> 
> Squats: 20x5
> Bench Press: 20x5
> Pendlay Rows: 30x5
> 
> No issues on the first day. Even at only 20kg, I've got a feeling my legs will be a little achey tomorrow.


Are you doing the 5x5 routine? From what you've logged, I see only one set of 5 reps for each of them. As per 5x5, you need 5 sets each of 5 reps. If you're doing the Starting Strength of Rippetoe, 3 sets of 5 reps each.


----------



## t1mmy

Well spotted! I am following the stronglift 5x5 routine and wrote it down wrong, I've edited it for clarity. Apologies for the confusion.


----------



## Guru

Spotted just now, but any reason for starting 10 kg heavier just for the rows?


----------



## t1mmy

The guy who has written the routine suggests starting rows at 30kg, deadlifts at 40kg and everything else at 20kg.


----------



## Guru

Funny. Remember deadlifts starting at 40 but everything else was at 20 as I remember it, and I was a member of that forum for quite some time.

Anyway, not that it matters much. The worst that can happen is that you'll hit the ceiling first on them.


----------



## t1mmy

Wednesday Workout:

Squats: 22.5kg 5x5
Shoulder Press: 20kg 5x5
Deadlifts: 40kg 1x5

Shoulder press and deadlifts were new exercises today. With relatively light weights I had no issues and felt my form was fine. Fine tuning of form will come with time.

Having now done all the exercises at least once I would say that I think that shoulder press is going to be the most difficult.


----------



## Bod42

So i just looked back through all my logs and this thread etc and Im disgusted with my progress to date, i really need to knuckle down, sort out my diet and start training harder.

This is approx 18 months progress:
Bench Press: 117.5x5 PM 137kg
Squats: 142.5x5 PM 166kg 
Shoulder Press: 57.5x5 PM 67kg 
Deadlift:160x5 PM 186.5

Bench Press: 120x6 PM 144kg
Squats: 142.5 PM 166kg
Shoulder Press: 65x5 PM 76kg 
Deadlift: 165x5 PM 192.5

Gain/Loss 
Bench Press: 7kg gain
Squats: 0kg gain
Shoulder Press: 9kg gain
Deadlift: 6kg gain

Hardly worth the time and effort. If you were at a very advanced level then you may be happy with this progress but Im not advanced yet so it sucks. To put in context Doug and I started at the same time and he is absolutely kicking my butt now and hes had an injury to contend with. Nice work by the way Doug.

Not making excuses but there is a few reasons surrounding these numbers:

Bench Press: This is my best exercise by far, i could be lifting some serious weight on this by now but everytime I feel even the slightest stress on my screwed shoulder I deload the weight, i never ever push this exercise. And my goal is 150kg bench so Im within striking distance of that so Im happy.

Squat: I changed from Box squat to free squat and the box was probably parallel to 1" above parallel. Now Im squatting **** to grass and this would have taken some weight off the bar.

Shoulder Press: I would take a 0.5kg gain every month any day. And since I have changed to increasing the weight on 5/3/1 by 1kg per month I havent missed a weight yet.

Deadlifts: I changed to dead stop deadlifts which does make a big difference. But you should be gaining my total gain every month or so not 18 months so very disappointed with this. Im not built for deadlifts at all but thats no excuse. 

As I said this has given me the drive to get back in the gym and smash it.


----------



## t1mmy

Friday Workout:

Squats: 25kg 5x5
Bench Press: 22.5kg 5x5
Pendlay Row: 32.5kg 5x5

Week 1 complete and it went well, roll on next week.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys been really busy but still managed to get bot of last weeks workouts in, dont have my logs wit me at work but both workouts went well. Shoulder seems to be steadily getting better. I've had no pain since I stopped bench and ohp but I know its still not ready for the return yet.


----------



## t1mmy

Week 2 - Workout 1:

Squats: WU 20kg 1x5 / WO 27.5kg 5x5
Shoulder Press: WU 20kg 1x5 / WO 22.5kg 5x5
Deadlifts: WU 40kg 1x5 / WO 45kg 1x5

Chin-ups: 0kg 1x7 1x4 1x3


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout
Bench Press: (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x10 PM 136.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 47.5x10, 57.5x10, 67.5x10
Over hand Chins: 6x2, 4x3
Kroc Rows: 35kg x 20

Pleased with the workout, Bench was easy and I felt like I was getting my legs in a lot better position which I seem to have been struggling with lately. This is after a deload so should be easy. About 8kg less than my best predicted max.

Incline press was actually quite hard as my triceps were giving out. They always do on the higher rep week as Im definitely a tricep bencher.

I know its nothing sensational but so glad to get 4 sets of 3 over hand chin up considering I didnt used to be able to do one over hand chin up. Now I can really feel my back firing.

Could do a lot more weight on Kroc rows but Im still using these as more of a shoulder health exercise, letting it hang at the bottom and pull my shoulder forwards and then really contracting it back. Shoulders always feel great after this exercise.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 92KGX5 - 106KGX5 - 120KGX5

BENCH PRESS  87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

All good! The 120x5 was a bit of a milestone for me :thumb:

Tried 5 rep heavier rows instead for a change


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: This is my best exercise by far, i could be lifting some serious weight on this by now but everytime I feel even the slightest stress on my screwed shoulder I deload the weight, i never ever push this exercise. And my goal is 150kg bench so Im within striking distance of that so Im happy.
> 
> Squat: I changed from Box squat to free squat and the box was probably parallel to 1" above parallel. Now Im squatting **** to grass and this would have taken some weight off the bar.


1. James, Why do you keep de loading when you feel a little discomfort on your bench? Have you tried the bill star rehab? Worked for my hamstring, you've got to push past your fear or you'll never progress (And believe me I do know how you feel, I was terrified of lifting after tearing my hamstring TWICE! :doublesho) Both injuries stalled my progress by 12 months in total 

2. Why squat ass to the grass when parallel is all you need? That's like keying your own car 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> 1. James, Why do you keep de loading when you feel a little discomfort on your bench? Have you tried the bill star rehab? Worked for my hamstring, you've got to push past your fear or you'll never progress (And believe me I do know how you feel, I was terrified of lifting after tearing my hamstring TWICE! :doublesho) Both injuries stalled my progress by 12 months in total
> 
> 2. Why squat ass to the grass when parallel is all you need? That's like keying your own car
> 
> :thumb:


Remember my shoulder isnt an injury Doug, its completely buggered and needs replacing. 7 dislocations will do that lol. Im constantly rehabing it, tried all sorts of programs and managed to get it to a good place but thats taken me 3-4 yrs so dont want to rip it again. If I rip it again I will be out for years so better to take the slow and steady approach. And if you listen to LRB, you can work on bar speed and still set PRs even if the weight doesnt increase, he talks a lot about training with 93% of what you can use and concentrate on dominating the weight and being fast with it. Im making progress on this exercise as Im training 3-4 reps shy of failure.

I hate squatting above parallel so to make sure that all my reps are legit, i squat **** to grass. That way if I cut a couple high then Ive still managed below parallel squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Remember my shoulder isnt an injury Doug, its completely buggered and needs replacing. 7 dislocations will do that lol. Im constantly rehabing it, tried all sorts of programs and managed to get it to a good place but thats taken me 3-4 yrs so dont want to rip it again. If I rip it again I will be out for years so better to take the slow and steady approach. And if you listen to LRB, you can work on bar speed and still set PRs even if the weight doesnt increase, he talks a lot about training with 93% of what you can use and concentrate on dominating the weight and being fast with it. Im making progress on this exercise as Im training 3-4 reps shy of failure.
> 
> I hate squatting above parallel so to make sure that all my reps are legit, i squat **** to grass. That way if I cut a couple high then Ive still managed below parallel squats.


I do remember now mate  thought it was a muscle injury for some reason DOH! :wall: 

That's why I use the little box :thumb: Every time I go just below parallel I just touch the box and then up I go. Makes it so much easier to gauge all my reps 100% parallel :thumb: Although it has made my squat session much harder and tiring :devil:

Hopefully this cycle I'll make 171kg x 1 on my squat, leaving 29kg to go for my 200kg squat.......again lol :wall:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi Doug, I like the look of that bill star rehab. Could be a good way for me to reintroduce my bench after xmas.

I've often wondered do you never try more than one rep on your last set of your last cycle as I understand that one is the minimum. Also hows it going with the diet?

James it can be difficult when you look at your progress and it hasnt moved much. I have moved on a bit recently with with my squat but this muscle tear in my shoulder back has set me back a bit with everything else. On the plus side though I met a guy that I used to train with and I was squatting more for BBB than he was squatting for sets of 5. looks a bit like he skipped leg day. lol

Anyway mondays workout

Squat 90*5 100*5 115*5

sqaut bbb 75*10*5

shoulder rehab

Good workout went really well. It is really amazing how much bigger my back and shoulders feel with the light weight and high reps.


----------



## Chino

Hi everyone, just thought I'd say hi, I've been a member on here a while but only just stumbled onto this thread. I've been training in some capacity or other for approximately 10years, trying to run 10/20km a week be it treadmill or road, along with lifting.

As usual at this time of year I've switched more to a powerlift routine, current stats are:

5ft 10in tall(or short lol)
99kg

Deadlift 1RM: 205kg
Squat 1RM: 140kg
Benchpress 1RM: 125kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi Doug, I like the look of that bill star rehab. Could be a good way for me to reintroduce my bench after xmas.
> 
> I've often wondered do you never try more than one rep on your last set of your last cycle as I understand that one is the minimum. Also hows it going with the diet?


I worked for my hamstring, well worth a try for muscle injuries :thumb:

I used to train to failure in my youth and it didn't work for me at all, in fact I would often lose strength. I also like conserve energy for my assistance/volume work, but mainly because it doesn't work for me.

I think the rep schemes in the 5/3/1 are perfect and I see absolutely no need to go over them, if you can, *you need to be using more weight IMHO* :thumb: People say there is carryover, but if you can do 10 reps for 100kg on a given exercise then perhaps you need to load the bar with more humbling weight to find you true strength limit and build upon that :thumb:

I'm training predominantly for strength, the 10 rep assistance work is just to add volume and muscle mass, otherwise my assistance work would be in the 5
rep range :thumb:


----------



## t1mmy

Week 2 - Workout 2:

Squats: WU 22.5kg 5x5 / WO 27.5kg 5x5
Bench Press: WU 20kg 5x5 / WO 25kg 5x5
Pendlay Row: WU 30kg 5x5 / WO 35kg 5x5

I'm having a bit of a mare at the gym following this program. I go in at lunch times, which to be fair is the quietest I ever see it. In the free weights area there are a couple of power cages as well as two smiths machines. Getting on them is at times impossible, whereas other days possibly two will be free!!! With only limited time before I have to get back to work it's just getting frustrating.


----------



## ITHAQVA

t1mmy said:


> Week 2 - Workout 2:
> 
> Squats: WU 22.5kg 5x5 / WO 27.5kg 5x5
> Bench Press: WU 20kg 5x5 / WO 25kg 5x5
> Pendlay Row: WU 30kg 5x5 / WO 35kg 5x5
> 
> I'm having a bit of a mare at the gym following this program. I go in at lunch times, which to be fair is the quietest I ever see it. In the free weights area there are a couple of power cages as well as two smiths machines. Getting on them is at times impossible, whereas other days possibly two will be free!!! With only limited time before I have to get back to work it's just getting frustrating.


If you think you'll stick to this for the long haul, it would consider buy your own kit. approx. = £800 for heavy duty power rack, bench and 237kg Olympic barbell set :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Also hows it going with the diet?


Sorry Nicky, missed this question 

Its going very well, I've not lost an ounce! 

Now you might think I'm disappointed. But over the last few weeks I've been catching up on friends and family I've not seen for a few months. They all think I've lost weight and look more muscular, even the missus has commented that I'm much bigger all round, yet I'm still 107kg. My XXL tops are much loser than they were 2-3 months ago :thumb:
Obviously my body composition is changing in a very balanced/slow way which pleases me as I know I'm not losing muscle mass but changing shape and still getting much stronger :thumb:

I'm still playing around with calories, I think I would need to go down to a steady daily limit of 1500 cals per day before I saw any major weight changes, that is very low for someone of my size. I'm happy to carry on with the 1800 cals per day I'm on now and just change shape very slowly and carry on progressing in strength :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 117KGX5 - 135KGX5 - 153KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Very happy with this workout, the 153x5 squat felt well within my limits (Medium difficulty) but I'm still sticking with the program. I'm glad I went back to cycle 6 weights after finding out I was squatting wrong, the weights I'm using now feel perfect for good solid progression :thumb:

Once again I am finding out that bar position is crucial in successfully squatting heavy, the feeling of balance and control at the higher position is very apparent, although when I say high I mean normal position. I was squatting with the bar so low I cannot believe how I managed it :doublesho

I also breath differently. For each rep I stomach breath in at the top, hold, carry out the rep and breath out again once I reach the top, maintaining a lot more core stability. In the past I let the air out as I went up, loosening my core when I needed it to be stable, causing me to struggle :wall:

Excellent!


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout
Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) WO 100x5, 117.5x5, 132.5x7 PM 163.5kg
Deadlifts: 90x5x10

Squats felt good, feel like after a few weeks off that my flexibility was a slight issue and felt like I was rounding right at the bottom but this will fix itself. I think my squats are very much mental and I just need to stop being a women and destroy the weights. I think this as the new girlfriend poked her head in the gym during the last warm up set and I destroyed it like there was nothing on my back. Shows its all in my head.

The good old BBB deadlifts, what a killer. Couldnt do all my sets double over hand so switch to opposite grip and it was easy. I have been using this grip for a long time and I cant believe the difference it makes. I try and switch my grip between sets so theres no imbalance.



ITHAQVA said:


> I do remember now mate  thought it was a muscle injury for some reason DOH! :wall:
> 
> That's why I use the little box :thumb: Every time I go just below parallel I just touch the box and then up I go. Makes it so much easier to gauge all my reps 100% parallel :thumb: Although it has made my squat session much harder and tiring :devil:
> 
> Hopefully this cycle I'll make 171kg x 1 on my squat, leaving 29kg to go for my 200kg squat.......again lol :wall:


Well it was an injury but that was 4 yrs ago. Biggest problem when i first did it was I couldnt even hold my pint :doublesho But I have got it to 95% pain free which the doctors told me I would never be able to do. I would maybe risk pushing it abit harder if I entered a comp or something but right now I am concentrating on my lower body movements as they really need work.

I have read up and tried the little box but it can take a great deal of weight off the bar as your looking for the box instead of bouncing out of the hole. I did proper Box squat for yrs though and my squat was a lot higher, 186kg Box squat which I was happy with. I find free squats are more legs and Box squats are more back though due to your knees traveling more forward in free squats which allows a more upright back position. Joe Defranco is one of the best trainers I know and he uses Box squats with all his athletes so I may change back one day. And box squats do seem to be better for your knees.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I have read up and tried the little box but it can take a great deal of weight off the bar as your looking for the box instead of bouncing out of the hole. I did proper Box squat for yrs though and my squat was a lot higher, 186kg Box squat which I was happy with. I find free squats are more legs and Box squats are more back though due to your knees traveling more forward in free squats which allows a more upright back position. Joe Defranco is one of the best trainers I know and he uses Box squats with all his athletes so I may change back one day. And box squats do seem to be better for your knees.


I think you miss understood the "little box" 

Basically I've made a small wooden box that I touch very lightly as I go down on my squat to indicate to me I'm just below parallel :thumb:

Within two workouts and due to getting the bar position correct, I squat down, lightly touch the box and push up. I don't look for the box and most certainly do not sit on it. So in effect my squat is just like a normal squat. The box is my spotter telling me I'm just below parallel and time to push up. I agree with you on the box squat not being a squat though. I believe my idea is better! 

I understand what you mean by searching for the box, the first session before getting my bar position right I was going down stopping and then lowering more until I touched the box. However, a few sessions later I'm already naturally squatting down and pushing up in one movement, no pausing a finding the box :thumb: The secret is balance, by finding the correct bar position. As soon as that was sorted the whole lift just fell into place :thumb: Granted the squat felt very different to what I was used to at first, but in no time the new way is my normal way.

Out of my entire squat session I missed one rep last time around (Third assistance set).

My little box is a very useful tool, but *bar position is key *to successful squatting, get that right and the weight will feel controlled and balanced throughout the entire squat and you'll squat much more weight end off!

My goal is still to squat 200kg for 1 rep :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Thursdays workout

Decided to do some lunges today as every time I've done them its resulted in some serious doms for the next couple of days.

I started with the bar and added weight until I felt that I was ready for 3*5. Found it easier to keep form with my left leg forward. I thought it would be the opposite.

lunge 40*5*3

Shoulder rehab

My shoulder is feeling much better now. I've had some deep tissue massage on my shoulder and deltoid. This is painful at the time but helps so much. I've also bought a foam roller and will start foam rolling.

I've decided that in the new year I'm going to go with the bill star rehab on bench press as this is the movement that is most stress on my delt. All going well hopefully I'll be back soon with a full workout.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 56KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 73KGX5

DIPS (WU 9x3) BODYWEIGHT+20KGx5x5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 52.5KGx10x10*

Made 5 reps on the OHP 73kg work set this time :thumb: But it was hard going. I might stay on this weight another cycle. Due to the nature of the OHP it is very easy to go too fast and then end up on a weight you stall on for a long time.
Also I used a belt so I had something to push my stomach against to help with stability. I don't know about you guys but I find the OHP the hardest to get right from a technical/form perspective. I used to do the seated version in the past as it is much easier to master.

Initially my goal is 100kg for 1 rep on the OHP by this time next year, but that would mean progressing by 1.5kg per month with no stalls :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Thursdays workout
> 
> Decided to do some lunges today as every time I've done them its resulted in some serious doms for the next couple of days.
> 
> I started with the bar and added weight until I felt that I was ready for 3*5. Found it easier to keep form with my left leg forward. I thought it would be the opposite.
> 
> lunge 40*5*3
> 
> Shoulder rehab
> 
> My shoulder is feeling much better now. I've had some deep tissue massage on my shoulder and deltoid. This is painful at the time but helps so much. I've also bought a foam roller and will start foam rolling.
> 
> I've decided that in the new year I'm going to go with the bill star rehab on bench press as this is the movement that is most stress on my delt. All going well hopefully I'll be back soon with a full workout.


Don't let DOMS fool you into thinking it means more growth Nicky, when I used to train high intensity years ago I had DOMS a lot, the last two years I have put on more muscle size and strength than any time during my HIT days, I very rarely get DOMS doing the 5/3/1. The only time I get real DOMS now is if I take a full week off then go straight back into training :thumb:

Lunges = less weight used = less results = an unhappy Nicky


----------



## Guru

ITHAQVA said:


> I don't know about you guys but I find the OHP the hardest to get right from a technical/form perspective. I used to do the seated version in the past as it is much easier to master.


I am sure you know this, but squeezing your glutes hard is very helpful in the OHP technique.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> I am sure you know this, but squeezing your glutes hard is very helpful in the OHP technique.


:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 178.5KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I think you miss understood the "little box"
> 
> Basically I've made a small wooden box that I touch very lightly as I go down on my squat to indicate to me I'm just below parallel :thumb:
> 
> Within two workouts and due to getting the bar position correct, I squat down, lightly touch the box and push up. I don't look for the box and most certainly do not sit on it. So in effect my squat is just like a normal squat. The box is my spotter telling me I'm just below parallel and time to push up. I agree with you on the box squat not being a squat though. I believe my idea is better!
> 
> I understand what you mean by searching for the box, the first session before getting my bar position right I was going down stopping and then lowering more until I touched the box. However, a few sessions later I'm already naturally squatting down and pushing up in one movement, no pausing a finding the box :thumb: The secret is balance, by finding the correct bar position. As soon as that was sorted the whole lift just fell into place :thumb: Granted the squat felt very different to what I was used to at first, but in no time the new way is my normal way.
> 
> Out of my entire squat session I missed one rep last time around (Third assistance set).
> 
> My little box is a very useful tool, but *bar position is key *to successful squatting, get that right and the weight will feel controlled and balanced throughout the entire squat and you'll squat much more weight end off!
> 
> My goal is still to squat 200kg for 1 rep :thumb:


Ya I know what you mean Doug, just got a little side tracked and started talking about EliteFTS style box squats. You know squat down deload the legs completely and then drive up. Some of the rugby guys used to do touch and go style box squats which are similar to your idea Doug, just from experience I found they would squat down slower than usual trying to find the box or they would get a rep slightly to low and crash into the box. If your a geared lifter I dont think a slow decent is bad but RAW lifters definitely descend faster to get full use of the stretch reflex. Im not saying its wrong, everyone has their ways that why i love weightlifting. I have also seen well known trainers use your method Doug.

Friday Workout
Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x5) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 59.5x7 73.5kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+7.5x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 7x3, 3x4

Pleased with shoulder press as it really makes all the difference pressing standing up but overall it makes you stronger as I can feel the torque through my abs and lower back. The only thing I like about sitting is if you get the weight then you 100% got it whereas standing you maybe could have kicked your legs slightly but who knows.


----------



## Bod42

Monday Workout:
Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x3) WO 120x5, 135x5, 152.5x7 PM 188kg
Squats: 77.5x5x10

I was disappointed with Deadlifts as 7 was a real grind and I just dont think it should have been this hard as I have just deloaded but I added 2 reps to all my sets as my target abd surprising how much difference this makes. I am actually only 4kg away from my best predicted max so feeling better about it.

BBB is totally kicking my ****. 1:30 rest really gets you sweating and the heart rate going. I find these arent so much about strength but about your mental strength to fight the pain and exhaustion and just get through the sets. I can see why people make progress on BBB as its just good old hard work. 

I still dont get people who think that weights arent hard work, dont work your lungs or heart and dont make you sweat. I was talking to the Mrs last night and she has been written a new weights program by a personal trainer at her gym and she says she doesnt really break a sweat until she gets on the bike and therefore just feels cardio is better :wall::wall::wall:


----------



## Guru

Bod42 said:


> I still dont get people who think that weights arent hard work, dont work your lungs or heart and dont make you sweat. I was talking to the Mrs last night and she has been written a new weights program by a personal trainer at her gym and she says she doesnt really break a sweat until she gets on the bike and therefore just feels cardio is better :wall::wall::wall:


She doesn't break a sweat because the weights aren't any kind of work really. Personal trainers generally prescribe much lower weights to female members because of the perceived (wrong) notion that weight lifting will make them look all muscular and buff. Obviously, that kind of weight training is practically useless.


----------



## Bod42

Guru said:


> She doesn't break a sweat because the weights aren't any kind of work really. Personal trainers generally prescribe much lower weights to female members because of the perceived (wrong) notion that weight lifting will make them look all muscular and buff. Obviously, that kind of weight training is practically useless.


I did actually write in my last post but deleted it, there is a very simple fix, increase the weight, its makes everything harder. If I did my 5 sets of 10 with 20kg instead of 80kg, obviously it would be easy. Ya the PT also prescribed 17 rep sets which I dont agree with, no matter what your training for I still think there should be a main strength exercise in all programs. She's going to E-mail me her program today so i can have a look and she may train with me tonight as she doesnt feel like her workout is doing anything.


----------



## Bod42

Wednesday Workout:
Bench Press: (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x8 PM 136kg
Incline Bench Press: 60x8, 67.5x8, 75x7 PM 92.5kg
Pull Ups: 5x2, 5x3
Kroc Rows: 37.5x20

Bench Press went very well. I have always tried to push the weight up fast but Im doing a lot of reading of Raw power lifters and a massive amount of them train with lighter weights than you would think and concentrate on speed and reps so now Im putting 100% into every single rep. This hits muscles a lot differently and I have more DOMS today. I know DOMS has absolutely no impact on progress but good to know changing your rep speed slightly can have such a change. Going to really concentrate on doing this for squats and deadlifts.

Same thing for Incline Press, even though this is a deloaded weight by accelerating every rep as hard as possible you still get a good productive workout. Its physics really that to get the same power with a lighter weight then you have to move it faster.

As my chin up strength comes up, my shoulder just seems to feel better and better. But then I think everyone should strive to be Chin Upping and rowing more weight than they Bench press


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Wednesday Workout:
> Bench Press: (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x8 PM 136kg
> Incline Bench Press: 60x8, 67.5x8, 75x7 PM 92.5kg
> Pull Ups: 5x2, 5x3
> Kroc Rows: 37.5x20
> 
> Bench Press went very well. I have always tried to push the weight up fast but Im doing a lot of reading of Raw power lifters and a massive amount of them train with lighter weights than you would think and concentrate on speed and reps so now Im putting 100% into every single rep. This hits muscles a lot differently and I have more DOMS today.


Sorry mate but three stupid questions.... 
What does the PM value mean?
What is a kroc row? 
What are DOMS?


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Sorry mate but three stupid questions....
> What does the PM value mean?
> What is a kroc row?
> What are DOMS?


No worries buddy, ask away.

PM = Predicted Max. Its a Jim Wendler formula of calculating your predicted 1 rep max from rep sets. Its not a science but kind of lets you know if your getting stronger without continually testing your 1 rep max which I think is counter productive anyway.

Kroc Row is basically a Dumbell row for high reps and high weight, suppose mine arent really Kroc rows as I keep the form really tight. Named after Matt Kroczaleski 



 136kg for 13 reps, far from good form but still impressive.

DOMS = Delayed onset muscle soreness. In simple terms, its the muscle soreness you get from the gym.


----------



## Leebo310

Thanks mate, I've just learnt a lot! 
Yep, I've never really gone for the whole one rep max either. My thinking is always that if you can only manage one rep, chances are your form is going to be pretty awful for it! I think it's always better to get a few reps out with decent form instead. 
Cool, will search out the 136's at my gym tomorrow and see if I can beat 13


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Yep, I've never really gone for the whole one rep max either. My thinking is always that if you can only manage one rep, chances are your form is going to be pretty awful for it! I think it's always better to get a few reps out with decent form instead.


On the contrary, form tends to degrade when performing more than one rep.

As you perform your reps fatigue sets in which then effects your concentration followed by lose form :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Its not a science but kind of lets you know if your getting stronger without continually testing your 1 rep max which I think is counter productive anyway.


Have to totally disagree with you on that James 

I have found for me personally that the 1 rep set used in the 5/3/1 is an incredibly useful way to keep motivated. It may not build physical strength but the psychological carryover is great for lifting more weight the following month and for progress per se .

As you train other athletes I'm very surprised you don't see the benefits and amazing motivational power this principle provides 

After all a large percentage of progressing in our sport is down to the power of the mind :thumb:

Why would you post the PM on your workouts if there was no benefit to you psychologically, IMHO there is no substitute for actually lifting very close to your actual max to gauge how well your progressing, especially for lifters who have had very few years under the bar :thumb:

:devil: Don't fear the weight, make it fear you :devil:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> On the contrary, form tends to degrade when performing more than one rep.
> 
> As you perform your reps fatigue sets in which then effects your concentration followed by lose form :thumb:


Interesting thought. I'd agree that for high reps, (always seeing people in the gym swinging like crazy on their 30th bicep curl!  ) but if you're doing 4 or 5, I've always believed your form should be perfect for at least the first few otherwise you're realistically using too much weight aren't you? 
Thinking about it I suppose it just depends on the persons form for that "one" If it's good then fair enough, if it's shakey and you need help from a spotter then that shouldn't count as a one rep max!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Interesting thought. I'd agree that for high reps, (always seeing people in the gym swinging like crazy on their 30th bicep curl!  ) but if you're doing 4 or 5, I've always believed your form should be perfect for at least the first few otherwise you're realistically using too much weight aren't you?
> 
> *No and Incorrect!
> Form degrades as the reps become harder, this can happen on rep two of a 5 rep set. If the weight is difficult enough for you (From my personal experience I find reps 4 and 5 the hardest). On the second part about using too much weight. A good/successful lifter will use a structured training routine and keep notes of their progress and use this information to progress correctly/steadily. From what I can see if you follow a good routine, there is no way you'll end up in a situation that you are suing too much weight as you will always build up to the weight slowly and in a structured manner.*
> *Remember this is predominantly a strength/powerlifting thread, we live in the 1-5 rep range for our main work sets and we use heavy weights :thumb:
> *
> 
> Thinking about it I suppose it just depends on the persons form for that "one" If it's good then fair enough, if it's shakey and you need help from a spotter then that shouldn't count as a one rep max!
> 
> *Agreed :thumb:*


Leebo310, what are your goals?


----------



## Leebo310

Goal is size and strength at the moment. I'm lifting reasonably heavy (or at least I think so for my size!) and am doing 4 sets of 6 to 8 reps of each exercise. 4 to 5 exercises per day with low rest periods and splitting out a singular body part per day. (Chest, biceps, shoulders, triceps, back and legs) 
Only get chance to work out in the week so do mon to fri so rest on weekends.
To be fair I've been doing this for three months now and am really impressed with the results and changes I'm seeing. 
Yeah sorry mate, maybe i wasn't quite explaining it right! Totally agree form decreases as the reps become harder. My point was more about seeing someone struggling to bench 150kg for one rep, wobbling all over the place, barely moving the bar and then looking impressed because they've just "beaten their one rep max"


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Goal is size and strength at the moment. I'm lifting reasonably heavy (or at least I think so for my size!) and am doing 4 sets of 6 to 8 reps of each exercise. 4 to 5 exercises per day with low rest periods and splitting out a singular body part per day. (Chest, biceps, shoulders, triceps, back and legs)
> Only get chance to work out in the week so do mon to fri so rest on weekends.
> To be fair I've been doing this for three months now and am really impressed with the results and changes I'm seeing.
> Yeah sorry mate, maybe i wasn't quite explaining it right! Totally agree form decreases as the reps become harder. My point was more about seeing someone struggling to bench 150kg for one rep, wobbling all over the place, barely moving the bar and then looking impressed because they've just "beaten their one rep max"


Am I right you train 6 days a week? And you have separate Biceps and Triceps days :wall:

As for the wobbling all over the place, yep that's poor, but again if you have a structured approach to training this is very rare and usually only happens when you start lifting far into unknown territory. I'm sure if you put 150kg on a bar and tried to bench it you would be in a scary place 

If you truly want size and strength use the original 5/3/1 with the big but boring assistance exercises for 2-3 years, eat right and you will have the physique you want (yes it is as simple as that) and there are no isolation or arm exercises in the routine :doublesho because you would only do this after 2-3 years training with the compounds and only then if you were a competing bodybuilder :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

I'm training 5 times a week on a 6 day workout cycle. 
I've been doing this for about 3 months but have been working out fairly seriously (albeit with limited equipment! ) for over 4 years now and have done various different programmes, including the "boring" exercises  
Yep plenty of people are shocked when I do a separate bicep and tricep day but to be fair it works and I'm seeing really good results from it! Most other people seem to have a rest day every other one and then maybe combine back and biceps and chest and tris but this way definitely seems to work better for me. I'm putting on muscle at a really consistent rate and am shifting more weight in virtually every exercise every time I go! Plus I should say that on a bicep day I'm not just doing 3 different varieties of curls! I do closed grip lat pull downs, seated underhand rows on the pulley machine, closed grip pull ups so it's not purely bicep isolation. Same for tris, I'll do weighted dips, short grip bench press etc rather than just kick backs and tricep pull downs.
As I said, I've done programmes with the focus on compound exercises but admit I've never done 5/3/1 reps. Do you do a warmup before that I presume? How many exercises are you doing in a session and then how often are you doing the workout?
Appreciate all the advice mate, I'm always up for learning and trying new stuff!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> I'm training 5 times a week on a 6 day workout cycle.
> I've been doing this for about 3 months but have been working out fairly seriously (albeit with limited equipment! ) for over 4 years now and have done various different programmes, including the "boring" exercises
> Yep plenty of people are shocked when I do a separate bicep and tricep day but to be fair it works and I'm seeing really good results from it! Most other people seem to have a rest day every other one and then maybe combine back and biceps and chest and tris but this way definitely seems to work better for me. I'm putting on muscle at a really consistent rate and am shifting more weight in virtually every exercise every time I go! Plus I should say that on a bicep day I'm not just doing 3 different varieties of curls! I do closed grip lat pull downs, seated underhand rows on the pulley machine, closed grip pull ups so it's not purely bicep isolation. Same for tris, I'll do weighted dips, short grip bench press etc rather than just kick backs and tricep pull downs.
> As I said, I've done programmes with the focus on compound exercises but admit I've never done 5/3/1 reps. Do you do a warmup before that I presume? How many exercises are you doing in a session and then how often are you doing the workout?
> Appreciate all the advice mate, I'm always up for learning and trying new stuff!


To be honest I think you are already convinced that your style of working out is better for you, I wasted many years doing the same!

You must warm up before doing any form of exercises IMHO :thumb:

I train 4 days a week - Bench day, squat day, overhead press day and deadlift day

Exercises per workout

Bench press day = Bench press and the barbell row
Squat day = Squat and standing calf raise
Overhead press day = Overhead press and Dips (weighted and non weighted)
Deadlift day = Deadlifts

Rep ranges - Work sets vary from 5 all the way to 1
Rep ranges - Assistance sets 10 reps.

Rest 5-6 minutes between work sets and 3-4 minutes between assistance sets

If you go back a few pages you'll see how the 5/3/1 works over each monthly cycle :thumb:

Simple but very, very effective :thumb:

I used to train a bit like you many years ago, what a waste of my time. But the last two years powerlifting has made up for it big time  :thumb:

This is not new stuff, its been around for more years than the isolation farce that most seem to fall for these days :tumbleweed:

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> To be honest I think you are already convinced that your style of working out is better for you, I wasted many years doing the same!
> 
> You must warm up before doing any form of exercises IMHO :thumb:
> 
> I train 4 days a week - Bench day, squat day, overhead press day and deadlift day
> 
> Exercises per workout
> 
> Bench press day = Bench press and the barbell row
> Squat day = Squat and standing calf raise
> Overhead press day = Overhead press and Dips (weighted and non weighted)
> Deadlift day = Deadlifts
> 
> Rep ranges - Work sets vary from 5 all the way to 1
> Rep ranges - Assistance sets 10 reps.
> 
> Rest 5-6 minutes between work sets and 3-4 minutes between assistance sets
> 
> If you go back a few pages you'll see how the 5/3/1 works over each monthly cycle :thumb:
> 
> Simple but very, very effective :thumb:
> 
> I used to train a bit like you many years ago, what a waste of my time. But the last two years powerlifting has made up for it big time  :thumb:
> 
> This is not new stuff, its been around for more years than the isolation farce that most seem to fall for these days :tumbleweed:
> 
> :thumb:


Sorry mate, I may be being stupid but I can't find the post that explains the whole routine over each month! Any chance you can point me in the right direction?!

Appreciate all the advice and like I said I'm keen to try new stuff. To be fair, I definitely don't feel I've wasted my time on my current workout, even if you felt you did working out like that. Like I said I'm going off results both size and strength and they are the most impressive I've seen so far, based on what I've tried before. It may not suit everybody and may not be the most efficient way in the world but not sure you can really call it a "farce" as it definitely works! ;-)

I'm definitely keen to give your workout a try and see how I get on! Looking back through your posts your strength gains are hell impressive so it clearly works really well!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Sorry mate, I may be being stupid but I can't find the post that explains the whole routine over each month! Any chance you can point me in the right direction?!
> 
> *If you go back through the pages on this thread you'll see how the 5/3/1 works
> 
> Basically its a 4 week cycle, look back for a week 1 post and just follow, all will become clear :thumb:*
> 
> Appreciate all the advice and like I said I'm keen to try new stuff. To be fair, I definitely don't feel I've wasted my time on my current workout, even if you felt you did working out like that. Like I said I'm going off results both size and strength and they are the most impressive I've seen so far, based on what I've tried before. It may not suit everybody and may not be the most efficient way in the world but not sure you can really call it a "farce" as it definitely works! ;-)
> 
> *I used to think the same, unfortunately that type of workout did not allow for continuous progress for very long. I got big quick but soon burned out*
> 
> I'm definitely keen to give your workout a try and see how I get on! Looking back through your posts your strength gains are hell impressive so it clearly works really well!


Not my workout its Jims!  Jim Wendler :thumb:

Google the original 5/3/1, I can see myself using this routine for many years :thumb:

Im 45 and getting bigger and stronger, that's how good the routine is, oh and the only supplement you'll ever need is whey protein if your like me a find it very difficult to eat 250gm protein per day :thumb:

:devil: Hate the weights!!! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 99KGX3 - 113KGX3 - 127KGX3

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10*

Last two reps on the 3x127Kg Bench press were more difficult than normal. But went up ok :thumb:

What am I doing powerlifting over Christmas lol, I must be out of my small mind! :wall:  :wall:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> What am I doing powerlifting over Christmas lol, I must be out of my small mind! :wall:  :wall:


Not quite Christmas yet mate, don't worry about it  
Good going on the weights too!

Been reading up about the 5/3/1 all day and definitely keen to give it a go!
In the not quite so stupid way that this sounds but what is the best way to get my current one rep max?? Is there a way of calculating it based on the weight I currently shift 6-8 reps of or have I literally gotta go in there and see what I can do??


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Not quite Christmas yet mate, don't worry about it
> Good going on the weights too!
> 
> Been reading up about the 5/3/1 all day and definitely keen to give it a go!
> In the not quite so stupid way that this sounds but what is the best way to get my current one rep max?? Is there a way of calculating it based on the weight I currently shift 6-8 reps of or have I literally gotta go in there and see what I can do??


I plan to lift all through Christmas :doublesho 

Thanks mate, I'm pleased with my progress so far, two years training and two stone heavier thanks to the 5/3/1 :devil:

Hi Leebo310, If your serious about getting big and strong.

I'll try to keep it brief 

Don't expect to be doing any isolation exercises :doublesho Investigate the science behind strength and building muscle mass, you'll soon find out that isolation exercises are a total waste of time, unless your a competing bodybuilder who and this is the important part - needs to add more volume/intensity to your workouts to force the body to build more muscle mass (This will take over 2 1/2 - 3 years of consistence compound exercise training before you reach this point) I don't see myself ever changing my present workout, the only difference will be that when possible I will lift more weight on all my exercises to stimulate growth :devil:

1. I would do the stronglifts 5x5 for approx. 4-6 months to help you get used to lifting heavy and work out an approximate 1 rep max. You start with an empty bar and very quickly add weight on the 5x5 :thumb: You don't have to do this, its just how I started and I found it a great way to get into the Iron groove again.

2. Once you have an approximate one rep max, use it to calculate all your lifts for the 5/3/1(It doesn't have to be totally accurate as you will build up to your present one rep max and then build upon that) :thumb:

3. I would recommend you do the original 5/3/1 with the boring but big compound exercises I use (See my workout posts) Not a dumbbell in sight! :thumb: Don't worry the very nature of free weight compound exercises involves all the stabiliser muscles you need.

4. I would not do as some do on here and do deadlift as an accessory exercises after the squat work set and the squat as an accessory exercises after the deadlift as I think this is a poor way to learn correct form. Keeping it simple will enable you to naturally learn the lift far easier than swapping it around :thumb:

Simplicity is the key :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just to update you on my bench :thumb:

I'm still using the narrow grip and intend to keep it that way. I believe it is the best way to keep your upper body especially the shoulder area healthy. IMHO the arch in your back gives you enough of an edge when benching, using an ultra wide grip to reduce the range of movement is just a way to make it easier. 

If you plan to lift heavy on your bench for many years, keep the grip narrow, injuries can take longer to heal than plateaus take to break! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Have to totally disagree with you on that James
> 
> I have found for me personally that the 1 rep set used in the 5/3/1 is an incredibly useful way to keep motivated. It may not build physical strength but the psychological carryover is great for lifting more weight the following month and for progress per se .
> 
> As you train other athletes I'm very surprised you don't see the benefits and amazing motivational power this principle provides
> 
> After all a large percentage of progressing in our sport is down to the power of the mind :thumb:
> 
> Why would you post the PM on your workouts if there was no benefit to you psychologically, IMHO there is no substitute for actually lifting very close to your actual max to gauge how well your progressing, especially for lifters who have had very few years under the bar :thumb:
> 
> :devil: Don't fear the weight, make it fear you :devil:


The problem with 1 rep sets is they dont really build much strength or muscle if any at all. You look at any of the top RAW lifters and nearly all of them build their strength using the rep method not by continually maxing their 1RM.

Dont get me wrong Doug, I fully understand the mental benefits to hitting new max`s but I would rather see people hit a new 5RM or 3RM, same mental benefit but also more of a benefit to training. I keep track of my predicted 1RM as like you say it provides a mental boost but this doesnt mean I will take a true 1RM as I dont see the point unless you compete.

Leebo, fire me your email via PM and i will fire you my 5/3/1 excel spreadsheet if you want. Just fill in the yellow cells and it will calculate everything for you.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The problem with 1 rep sets is they dont really build much strength or muscle if any at all. You look at any of the top RAW lifters and nearly all of them build their strength using the rep method not by continually maxing their 1RM.
> 
> Dont get me wrong Doug, I fully understand the mental benefits to hitting new max`s but I would rather see people hit a new 5RM or 3RM, same mental benefit but also more of a benefit to training. I keep track of my predicted 1RM as like you say it provides a mental boost but this doesnt mean I will take a true 1RM as I dont see the point unless you compete.
> 
> Leebo, fire me your email via PM and i will fire you my 5/3/1 excel spreadsheet if you want. Just fill in the yellow cells and it will calculate everything for you.


I agree mate no size or strength gains, however there is no substitute for actually lifting, the predicted max thing IMHO is a waste of time, the motivation I gain by lifting heavier each cycle is awesome! :thumb:

I think that contributes greatly to my success and the fact that I'm not afraid to fail, if I do fail, I pick myself up a get on with it (The recent 200kg Squat ****up is a prime example) But I've de loaded so that I can do the lift parallel and I will build from there :thumb:

My experience from the last two years is that failure is a good thing, in my case it makes me stronger :devil:

In 2014 I will be hating weights


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 126KGX3 - 144KGX3 - 162KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10x10*

Very happy with today's workout, wasn't feeling confident for the last work set due to miscounting the weight on the second work set, 2.5kg short! :wall::wall: But the 3 reps went up better than expected :thumb:

Still not using a belt, knee or wrist wraps and I plan to keep it that way up to 200kg if possible :thumb:

Happy powerlifting day!!!!!!!!!!!! Why should Boxers have it all to themselves


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 60KGX3 - 69KGX3 - 77KGX3 *

Felt strong in the OHP today, hopefully next weeks 1 rep will go up easier so I can add more weight :thumb:

Finished just in time for the Ski Jumping :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

200,004 Views :doublesho


----------



## Leebo310

Good stuff yet again mate! 
Are you doing seated or standing by the way?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Good stuff yet again mate!
> Are you doing seated or standing by the way?


There is only one overhead press - *Standing* :thumb: :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Thought it would be but wanted to check! So is that with a leg drive as well then?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Thought it would be but wanted to check! So is that with a leg drive as well then?


No way! :doublesho Strict form as it should be done mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats (WU 62.5x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) 107.5x3, 125x3, 140x5 PM 163.5kg
Deadlifts: 92.5x5x10

Shoulder Press: (27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 50x3, 55x3, 63x5 PM 74kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+7.5x8, BWx25x6 PM 157kg
Neutral Grip Chins: 6x3, 4x4
Pendlay Rows: 65x3x8

Had a little while off the gym as I have been ill and just cant shaske this chest infection ever since I came back from the UK so I'm really pleased to hit my reps on Shoulder Press. 

Still trying to move every single rep as fast as possible. Made sure the bar left my back on every single rep and this really helped me fire through any sticking point I may have had. Strangly by concentrating on just the top of the squat it completely cleared up my form.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Happy New Year to all you peeps! :thumb:

2013 conclusion 

A good year for training, despite a few set backs I'm still very happy with my progress.

Bench press = 132kgx1
Squat = Unknown due to parallel position mistake :wall: and now have to re load some old weights and get back a real 1 rep max, to date I have done 166kgx1 which felt well within my current limits :thumb: The mistake basically cost me getting my 200kg squat this year, so my determination is even greater :devil:
Deadlift = 205kgx1
Overhead press = 80kgx1 

Some major lessons were learnt:
keep monitoring form/technique and then keep monitoring more! 
A structured approach to Protein intake does make a noticeable difference to muscle growth/strength and recovery.

2014 goals:

I would like to get a 200kgx1 full parallel Squat. By August would be amazing, but that would mean progress without any stalls.

Bench: 150kgx1 not sure if this is realistic, at current progress it would take 8 months, but that may be a little optimistic for this lift. If I can get around 145kg by Christmas next year I would still be happy.

Deadlift: I plan to just add 5kg per month on the single rep week and build up to 230kg. So May/June would be my goal for this lift.

Overhead press: Hmm difficult one as it uses the weakest and smallest muscles. I would love to be able to do 100kgx1, however I think 90kg is far more realistic :thumb:

Training routine:

5/3/1 
Having done the 5/3/1 for some time now I have to admit that I think it is the most impressive workout ever (For me that is) everything about it seems to suite me  So I will endeavour to stay on this routine to get my goals and use it to maintain my strength. The assistance work (BBB) Is also perfect for me, the only change I may make once my goals are mine are to see if I can more regularly increase the weight to the BBB work, but keep the rest between sets 3-4 minutes. 
The only other exercise I would like to add is pull up/chins, but only after my main goals are achieved (Squat, Deadlift and Bench) as I know the OHP is a more long term goal.

I will be adding 15 minutes of HIIT 3 x a week to help with fat loss as of next week :thumb:

Two years of Powerlifting gone by and I still love it despite injuries and set backs :thumb:

Hate the weights! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 106KGX5 - 120KGX3 - 134KGX1 *

The 134 was a bit difficult, but considering I rushed the workout and the last two weeks my training and eating have been crap I'm not surprised 

Been very inconsistent over the Christmas break, but will be back on track after next weeks de load :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 16 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 135KGX5 - 153KGX3 - 171KGX1*

29kg to go!


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Leebo, fire me your email via PM and i will fire you my 5/3/1 excel spreadsheet if you want. Just fill in the yellow cells and it will calculate everything for you.


PM sent mate!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 16

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 73KGX3 - 82KGX1*

Excellent! last cycle I didn't make the rep :thumb:

De load and 3xHIIT next week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeload week 

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:

HIIT tomorrow :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x4 PM 184kg

I pushed this workout hard but missed my 5th rep. Just really crap workout. I will stick to this weight next cycle and dominate it then move on. Still struggling with illness so skipped the BBB squats as these seem to just kill me.

Bench Press: (WU 47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 90x5, 102.5x3, 115x6 PM 138kg
Incline Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x5, 80x6 PM 93.5kg
Pull Ups: BWx 4x2, 6x3
Kroc Row: 37.5x20

As always I hit my Bench Press really easily. I just wish my lower body movements would progress as easily as my upper body movements. Its weird. I have always moved the bar as fast as possible, I think you should get to the bottom of the rep and explode with everything you have, the bar wont move fast when your at a heavy weight but your still putting 100% force into the bar. But I used to get past my sticking point and relax abit, now Im trying to keep accelerating the bar right to lock out and imagining throwing the bar through the ceiling. Im also doing this on my warm up sets but the bar does move a lot faster on these.

Incline press was easy but Im about 2 cycles behind my max on these. Instead of deloading next time I stall, Im just going to stick with the weight until I get all my reps and dominate it. Dont think Im spending enough time using heavy weights but we shall see.

Pleased to keep making progress on my chin ups. 6 sets of 3 is nothing to some people but I couldnt do 1 over hand chin up for a long time so this is good progress for me.

Kroc rows were easy, well as easy as a 20 rep set can be. Was thinking of swapping these out for Pendlay rows so I can concentrate on getting my row weight up but I still credit these for improving my shoulder health so much.



Leebo310 said:


> PM sent mate!


Sorry about the delay mate, just fired it over. If you have any questions either PM me on here or just put them in the thread so others can help as well.


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys Happy New Year.

Did some light bench press thru the holidays and my shoulder seems better. I decided to go back to strong lifts as a nice way to break myself back in to heavy lifting and to allow the weight to progress quickly.

Squat 100*5*5

bench 40*5*5

bent over row 40*5*5

Everything went well. I added in dips at the end with negative weight and did -47*10*3. It was doing dips where I felt my shoulder at its worst so hoping that by starting light and building up I wont get any more problems here.


----------



## ITHAQVA

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys Happy New Year.
> 
> Did some light bench press thru the holidays and my shoulder seems better. I decided to go back to strong lifts as a nice way to break myself back in to heavy lifting and to allow the weight to progress quickly.
> 
> Squat 100*5*5
> 
> bench 40*5*5
> 
> bent over row 40*5*5
> 
> Everything went well. I added in dips at the end with negative weight and did -47*10*3. It was doing dips where I felt my shoulder at its worst so hoping that by starting light and building up I wont get any more problems here.


Don't forget Nicky, you don't need to go any lower than parallel with dips (This advice comes from the guys at EliteFTS :devil As an added bonus this will also protect your shoulders :thumb:

Todays HIIT 10 minutes session with intervals 20 second on 20 second rest = total time 10:25 :thumb:

I will stay at 10 minutes for the first month and see how I feel. Then progress slowly to sessions of 20-30 minutes max with intervals of 20 -30 seconds on and 20 seconds rest :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ntynan528 said:


> Hi guys Happy New Year.
> 
> Did some light bench press thru the holidays and my shoulder seems better. I decided to go back to strong lifts as a nice way to break myself back in to heavy lifting and to allow the weight to progress quickly.
> 
> Squat 100*5*5
> 
> bench 40*5*5
> 
> bent over row 40*5*5
> 
> Everything went well. I added in dips at the end with negative weight and did -47*10*3. It was doing dips where I felt my shoulder at its worst so hoping that by starting light and building up I wont get any more problems here.


And some people just dont have the shoulder structure for dips. If dips cause you any pain at all then just simply dont do them. They are an amazing exercise but not worth the risk in my mind.

Squats: (WU 62.5x5, 77.5x5, 92.5x3) WO 120x5, 132.5x3, 147.5x3 PM 162kg 
Back Off Sets: 120x3x3
Deadlift: 95x5x5

I have long believed that there is not enough squat volume in 5/3/1 and to some degree deadlifts as well. This has been confirmed by a number of other people on 5/3/1 where they progress on their upper body movements but regress on lower body. Since starting 5/3/1 I have made zero progress on squats so something has to change. I read beyond 5/3/1 and most of his new options involve more volume so I have decided to add the suggested 3-5 sets of the first set last. These 3 easy sets after the main set made a hugh difference to how worked my legs felt. Will be running this for a while now but have a feeling this will work a lot better for me than the 1 top set.

Deadlifts are still BBB but as per Jim Wendler I am letting my double over hand grip define the weight I use. This will help with grip strength and keep my BBB weight abit lower as I find I struggle to recover with BBB.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 deeeeload

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) -70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 110KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Job done


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 52.5x5, 60x3, 67.5x3 PM 74kg
Dips: BWx5, BW+17.5x5, BW+32.5x5 PM 160.5kg
Neutral Grip Chins: 3x3, 5x4, 2x3
Pendlay Rows: 65x3x9

Really didnt think I would get the shoulder press, the 5th set felt incredibly heavy but just concentrating on form and blasted out the reps. Still trying to throw everything through the ceiling. This most be more intense as I havent been this sore in a very long time.

First time I have failed Chins so slightly disappointed. 

Very pleased with BW+32.5 dips. But I now need to reset my rack as 142.5kg on one side for multiple reps has put it on the **** slightly so dug out my spirit level last night.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 107.5x3) 135x5, 152.5x3, 170x3 PM 187KG

Got in did my deadlifts and got out. I was so sore from Squats on Tues and felt like crap so just got the main work in.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 108KGX5 - 122KGX4

BENCH PRESS 87.5KGx10x10x10x10x6

DEAD BARBELL ROW 82KGx10*

Poor workout, I put it all down to not paying attention to my nutrition or sleep over the Christmas period. Lesson learnt  Felt tired throughout the workout. Although I was really close to making 5 reps on the 122kg set, try again next month :thumb:

Back on track as of today with regards to protein intake and go back to early nights 9:30pm :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Hey guys, seems I'm a little late on the bandwagon here. I stopped reading at page 7 as I'm busy tonight. I started the program last week. I've already lifted in the past and have pretty good form so I haven't started on an empty bar. Although always do warm up on the empty bar to ensure correct form for the rest of the weights. 

I have enjoyed reading all the stuff from Mendi but I do feel a little aprehensive about it all. Ultimatley I'm doing this to get strong and to lower body fat. I know this is about strength. I am not eating more calories than I need so not aiming to get bigger. I am worried I will come to a halt doing this. I'm pretty large up top any way and have always had muscle albeit underneath all the fat. 

I'm not totally convinced on it being the best for fat loss yet but I am combining it with a good diet and I am doing a bit of running in between to keep it mixed up. Very impressive looking at some of your stats and I have no doubt I'll eventually get stronger. 

I think I'm not convinced by it because I'm only doing it 3 times a week and still on relativly light weights therefore not needing a deal of rest time in between. I guess that will all change when they weights get heavy and I need more rest time. 

I am slightly worried about injury when I get heavy but I'll cross that bridge when/if it happens. Like I said, I have lifted before with personal trainers and have got pretty good form. I don't feel like anything is straining that shouldn't be except the back is a little sore where the barbell has rested on my traps. Is this normal or should I be trying to take less weight on my shoulders?


----------



## Bod42

Guitar Jon: What kind of weights were you doing previously and what kind of weights have you started on now.

Everybody thinks the same when they first start the program, that its far to easy but trust me adding 7.5kg per week to your squats will make the workout very hard very fast.

The biggest problem with trainers these days (Im guilty of this even now) is that they jump programs to much. You need to find a program that has proven results and commit to it for 6 months and dont become a program jumper. Doug on here has done 2 programs over the last 2 years and had amazing results. There was a guy on here not long ago who started the Strong Lifts program and less than 2 weeks later posted that it doesnt work and he's changing programs. You cant find out jack S**t in less than 2 weeks.

Also dont be fooled by the 3 days per week. I find 3 days per week lifting is the best for 80% of the population. If your adding in running then your working out 4-5 days a week anyway.

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x10 PM 140
Incline Bench Press: 50x10, 57.5x10, 67.5x11 PM 92kg
Pull Ups: 3x2, 7x3
Kroc Rows:42.5x10

Another run of the mill workout. This is all Im after at the moment, what Paul Carter calls an 80% workout, you get in do all your reps and get out, nothing special but hit all your pre workout goals. My bench just seems to go up so easily, havent missed a Bench workout in what feels like years. Ive decided not to deload when my shoulder starts to act up but just go for rep records so instead of going for 107.5x10 I will just stick at 105 but add reps. Should allow me to increase my strength while using lighter weights and not buggering my shoulder.

Still moving all my reps as fast as possible, trying to throw my bench press through the roof even on every warm up set. This just feels so much better, like Im working speed and strenth and not just going through the motions.


----------



## ntynan528

Have to agree with you James, I usually find that the problem is with people who currently lift but lift the same weight every week and have done for months. These same people see a de-load as madness yet continue for months with little or no progress. To try and get them to start so light that they can learn the lift before the weight gets too much and they hit the same problems as before takes a lot of thought.

I currently understand how they feel as coming back from injury is difficult because every ounce of me wants to lift heavy. I just keep telling myself that I don't want another 8 weeks of shoulder rehab and over the next 8 weeks my lifts will build up hopeful passing where I was before I tore my deltoid.

Don't know that I've mad any sense there but that's my take on it.

Anyway never had time to post Thursdays workout and didn't get in the gym at the weekend but everything is progressing nicely with no pain in any lifts.

Thursday

Squat 102.5*5*5
overhead press 40*5*5
deadlift 100*5

assisted pullups 5*5

Monday

squat 105*5*5
bench 45*5*5
bent over row 45*5*5

dip assist 10*5

My shoulders feel better than ever and I hope that stronglifts with the dips and wide grip pull ups can keep me strong and keep my shoulders healthy.

Hi Doug, Hows the eating going? Its always difficult not to get caught up in the excesses of Christmas. I've not weighed myself since being away over Christmas. Think I'll give it another week. lol


----------



## Bod42

Made perfect sense to me. I actually had it last night, got the new Mrs to bring home her gym programs as she was complaining she hasnt improved at all so I was interested what they looked like and then she told me she hasn't increased the weights in about 3 years :wall: Its amazing how many times I use this saying when talking to people about the gym *Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results*

When i trained my IT mate, as soon as he started getting shoulder pain I dropped bench press from his program and did the 4 weeks of shoulder rehab and then started him slow, he came back and smashed his previous best so Im sure the extra shoulder strength will help you no end.

Just a suggestion regarding chin ups. I realise wide grip chins hit the back the hardest but they also put the biggest stress on the shoulders. I think this personally and proven by science. If they dont cause you any pain then your all good but I only do neutral grip and close grip pull ups now. For me the benefits dont outweigh the risks.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 105x5, 120x5, 135x7 PM 166.5kg
Back Offs: 105x3x5

This is the most Predicted max I have squatted since August so very pleased to be making some progress at last. I need to just be confident as I was worried about putting 5kg on the bar and then I went in and smashed all the reps, no grinders at all. I made sure I was accelerating right to the top and making the bar leave my shoulders on every rep. I used to get past my sticking point and then kind of relax but now I give it everything until the end of the rep. Its a lot more work but seems to be working. The back off sets arent hard at all, their just there to get some extra volume in.

I was even more pleased to complete this workout as Im majorly allergic to nuts and my lunch time meal had nuts in it so threw up 4 times in the afternoon and felt like crap walking into the gym. This is also why i skipped deadlifts as didnt think I would make it threw without being sick again.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 120KGX5 - 138KGX5 - 157KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10*

Good workout, felt a little tired as I started the Standing calf raise, so left it at two sets.

In answer to Nicky's question: Just started the food diary again yesterday, first go at it I found no weight loss but my body did change shape. I will now concentrate on eating better again and stick to it longer as I think to lose 11 pounds of fat is a 12 month investment.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Tried doing my OHP workout last night with the man flu, only managed two reps on 75kg, last cycle I managed 5 on 73Kg :doublesho 

Man Flu - What a bunch of pants!


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 47.5x5, 54x5, 61x6 PM 73kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+10x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 2x3, 4x4, 3x3
Pendlay Rows: 65x10,8,10

Nothing really felt that great tonight. First time I have missed SP in months and months so cant complain to much.

I think this is what I dont like about 5/3/1, I have missed a weight but now I have to wait 3 weeks to have another crack at it whereas on most programs I could have another go next week. Im going to change to another program like that as I think it suits me more mentally and its surprising how much the mental aspect of lifting effects you.

Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 120x5, 140x5, 157.5x5 PM 183.5kg
Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5
Squats: 80x5x5

I felt like crap this workout, didnt hit my reps. And because I felt so bad I didnt think doing 50 reps would exactly help with my recovery so I just got some quality reps in. Surprising how much easier 5x5 is compared with 5x10.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 85x3, 97.5x3, 110x8 PM 139.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 60x8, 67.5x8, 77.5x6
Pull Ups: 2x2, 8x3
Kroc Rows: 42.5x12

Another standard workout. I feel that the faster rep warm up sets are helping a lot as even during a 5 rep set the weight starts to move faster as you get further into the set instead of just going through the motions.

Havent missed a rep of pull ups in ages. i know 1 rep per week isnt fast progress but it is progress none the less.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 112.5x3, 127.5x3, 145x5 PM 169kg
Back Offs: 112.5x4,4,4
Deadlifts: 100x6,5,4,4,4

Squats felt good again. Its weird, its actually like Im wasting less energy during the warm ups now by giving every rep 100% and by moving the bar so fast on your last 2nd work set, it really gives you confidence for your last weight. I have always fired hard at the bottom of every exercise but once I was through the sticking point I would slow down, now Im trying to throw that bar through the ceiling which requires acceleration through the entire rep.

Deadlifts my grip is the limiting factor so this highlights how much i need to work on my double over hand grip. I get so much out of the mixed grip.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 50x3, 57.5x3, 65x5 PM 76kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+10x8, BW+27.5x6
Neutral Grips Chins: 3x3, 7x4
Pendlay Rows: 65X10,10,10

Another workout where I hit all my reps and pleased to get back on target with my SP and chin ups. I pushed the Pendlay Rows as hard as I could as I have been messing around on the weight for far to long. Its hard to push up while your pushing your chin ups though.


----------



## Guitarjon

I've decided not to continue with the 5x5. My main goals are to loose body fat which I know strength training will help but I'm now doing a combination of that and high intensity cardio. I've now split my sessions into legs and lower back; chest, upper back and triceps; shoulders, biceps and abs. Combined with some interval training on each session. Compound movements and heavy lifting are the main focus on all the sessions. With squats on every session. 

I've been doing this now for 2 weeks and feel like I now have a good focus and know I've had a good work out at the end of every session. I know it was early days on the 5x5 but I just didn't feel like I'd accomplished enough. As I said I am doing all the exercises throughout the week anyway and lifting heavy for 5x5 just doing additional stuff too, although I haven't upped the weigh every session. Seems to be every 2-3 sessions. I've lost a bit of weight (body fat) but my body has started changing shape already, as has the wife's.

Once my body fat has come down to around 20% (currently a large 36%) I'll get back on the powerlifting. Being physically fit is important to me and being able to run over distances with ease is also something that's important. I know lifting heavy gets the heart rate up but I want to be a good alrounder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 108KGX5 - 122KGX4

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, a bit disappointed with only making 4 reps on the 122kg, but after a week of having a cold its not too bad. 

I've lowered the assistance weights so I can concentrate solely on my work sets, really weird the 80kg bench work felt way too light. I will resist the urge to up the weight :tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I know it was early days on the 5x5 but I just didn't feel like I'd accomplished enough.


You've answered your own question. You were not using enough weight, the idea behind the 5x5 is to gradually work up to an optimum weight (This is were you are really getting stronger) :thumb:
One you start using heavier weights you would soon find the workout much more difficult.

Do you really think training arms and abs will exhaust you more than using compound exercises :doublesho


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> after a week of having a cold its not too bad.


It was man flu, not a cold mate


----------



## Bod42

Ya personally i would have stayed with the 5x5. Ive never had anyone say it didnt feel like it did anything, most people struggle to finish the workout as 15 work sets is a lot of work. If your looking to lose weight then by all means throw some hit fitness work in there but I think 5x5 is by far the best program out there for laying a foundation of strength, muscle and fitness. 

As Doug said abs and arms wont help you loose weight as well as compound exercises, all they will do is cut into your recovery. I think training arms when you first start training isactually bad for progress.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> It was man flu, not a cold mate


I stand corrected!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) -120KGX5 - 138KGX5 - 157KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good, I'm knackered now


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) 130x3, 147.5x3, 167.5x4 PM 190kg
Back Off: 130x4,4,4
Squats: 80x6,6,6,6,6

Didnt quite hit the 5 reps I was aiming for so i will stick with this weight next month until I get the reps I'm aiming for. Im really liking the back off sets on my squats and deadlifts at the moment, they really do fill you with confidence.

Squats were incredibly easy and should have probably pushed them a lot harder but Im just working up slowly to the new volume. I really feel like the BBB sets are helping my heavy squat day.


----------



## rob warrington

Guys can I just ask something regarding squatting technique, I guess this is the best place to ask . I've starting the 5x5 some time ago and due to yet another injury at work had to give the gym a miss for a while . Anyways I'm back on it again and been reading up on mark ripps technique , I've also found a lot of comments and negative reviews regarding how he teaches the squat. I think the guys a legend but wanted some views ?? Thanks


----------



## ITHAQVA

rob warrington said:


> Guys can I just ask something regarding squatting technique, I guess this is the best place to ask . I've starting the 5x5 some time ago and due to yet another injury at work had to give the gym a miss for a while . Anyways I'm back on it again and been reading up on mark ripps technique , I've also found a lot of comments and negative reviews regarding how he teaches the squat. I think the guys a legend but wanted some views ?? Thanks


I found this video series to be very helpful :thumb:
















Also, instead of doing the traditional box squat I have made a box that I touch, this is my cue that I'm just below parallel and time to push back up

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Rob, the basics of Rips teaching are correct but most of the negative reviews come from the power lifting community because of a few small things that he teaches differently.

For instance he teaches to look at a spot on the floor to improve hip drive from the bottom. Westside teaches to look up as they believe if you look down you will fall forwards. At the end of the day, everybody is built differently and I think its a bit trial and error with things like that. 

If you are going to read up on technique watch videos etc make sure its for RAW lifters. Geared squatting is completely different.


----------



## rob warrington

Excellent videos thanks for that


----------



## rob warrington

Thanks for your advice bod


----------



## Guitarjon

Another update, I've continued to lift with compound movements just not following the 5x5 to the letter. 

Feeling great so far.

One question- when you guys state the weight you've accomplished does this include the Olympic bar weight of 20kg or not? 

I'm listing the below with the addition of the bar weight eg bench press is 50kg in weight +20kg bar =70kg

Currently- 

Squat- 50kg Its light enough but I'm worried about technique as I go heavier. A fellow gym goer mentioned my back was doing a bit too much work so I kinda stalled abit here. He observed other stuff and said they were fine. So sticking there for a while as worried about injury. 8,8,8
Deadlift- 90kg. Reps wise I managed 8,8,6
Bench press- 70kg 8,8,7
Bent over row- 55kg 8,8,8
Milletry press - 30kg 8,8,8

As I said I'm not doing it in the same way as the 5x5 program but I am incorporating those exercises into each one of my splits. When I mentioned doing biceps/ triceps before it literally is as simple as finish with a set 21 before I move into the treadmill. Most of my muscles are worked out through the co pounds. I was shattered after both the dead lifts and bench press over the last couple of visits. I've found where I'm at with those. I still need to work on squatting technique. My friend seems to think I look right, he told me to put my feet in a little more. Maybe I just lost form when I upped the weights previously? 

The milltery press and rows I think I need to go heavier with as they haven't - knocked me for six yet. In a good way of course.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Another update, I've continued to lift with compound movements just not following the 5x5 to the letter.
> 
> Feeling great so far.
> 
> One question- when you guys state the weight you've accomplished does this include the Olympic bar weight of 20kg or not?
> 
> I'm listing the below with the addition of the bar weight eg bench press is 50kg in weight +20kg bar =70kg
> 
> Currently-
> 
> Squat- 50kg Its light enough but I'm worried about technique as I go heavier. A fellow gym goer mentioned my back was doing a bit too much work so I kinda stalled abit here. He observed other stuff and said they were fine. So sticking there for a while as worried about injury. 8,8,8
> Deadlift- 90kg. Reps wise I managed 8,8,6
> Bench press- 70kg 8,8,7
> Bent over row- 55kg 8,8,8
> Milletry press - 30kg 8,8,8
> 
> As I said I'm not doing it in the same way as the 5x5 program but I am incorporating those exercises into each one of my splits. When I mentioned doing biceps/ triceps before it literally is as simple as finish with a set 21 before I move into the treadmill. Most of my muscles are worked out through the co pounds. I was shattered after both the dead lifts and bench press over the last couple of visits. I've found where I'm at with those. I still need to work on squatting technique. My friend seems to think I look right, he told me to put my feet in a little more. Maybe I just lost form when I upped the weights previously?
> 
> The milltery press and rows I think I need to go heavier with as they haven't - knocked me for six yet. In a good way of course.


As brief as I can get it 

Squat = see the vids I've just posted on here for Rob :thumb:

Technique = There are a few variations in regards to technique between powerlifting and body building.
Personally I use the powerlifting approach to all my lifts, even the 5x10 reps sets (these are know as the Big but boring sets and primarily included to build muscle mass). Ensure you have a very strong and stable core for all your lifts. This helps prevent injury and allows you to lift a lot more weight safely and with confidence. IMHO core strength is key to all good lifting and there are no better exercises to building a strong core than compound exercises which are also the best exercises to build muscle mass.

Go on YouTube and search for "elitfts so you think you can bench" series, that will give you great insight into effective bench pressing. Or you could read his thread as I've posted the complete series several times. There is also a deadlift and of course the squat vid posted just a few posts back.

All weights posted should include the Olympic bar weight which is 20kg :thumb:

Again, training arms directly in your first 2 years is a waste of your time :wall:

Enjoy :thumb:


----------



## ntynan528

Hi guys been another long time since I've posted but been busy with work and family. I've recently started training with a guy from my local gym who is just a bit stringer than me. It's good having someone for a bit of competition.
Still working with 5x5 twice a week for deads, bench, row and press but I've been back to 5-3-1 for my squat as the 3 day squatting with 100+kg was killing me. hoping to be back to a full 5-3-1 workout in the next 2-4 weeks as my strength is returning without a hiccup. As for The people who can't see that this is a good progression to get your strength up I sould be back posting my workout figures soon and it will show that 5*5 really does work you just have to give it a chance


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Again, training arms directly in your first 2 years is a waste of your time :wall:


Exactly what I teach and nice to see someone else who thinks the same.

From my experience its not only a waste of time, it is actually is worse for progress.

Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) 92.5x5, 105x3, 117.5x6 PM 141kg
Incline Bench Press: 62.5x5, 72.5x5, 82.5x5
Pull ups: 1x2, 7x3, 2x2
Kroc Rows: 42.5x14

Another good workout but for some reason I was really feeling my chin ups in my shoulder from rep 1 so these werent the best reps. Glad to hit this bench press as it puts me on target to hit my heaviest weight in a long time next month. I may stick with a weight for awhile after I hit my goal of 150kg and concentrate on getting cleaner faster reps so Im not using heavy weights so much as this seems to aggravate my shoulder.

Still pushing my incline up as well and Im on target with this to hit a heaviest weight next month as well. All seems to be coming together at the moment. And I havent put any weight on but unless the Mrs is shrinking my cloths Im shuggling to fit in some of my shirts and tshirts


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 57.5KGX5 - 66.5KGX5 - 75KGX3

DIPS (WU 9x3) BODYWEIGHT+20KGx5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x9

10 minutes medium cardio*

Not bad actually considering I only made two reps on the OHP 75kg on man flu week.

Onward and upward! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 135KGX5 - 155KGX5 - 180KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Christmas break really helped my deadlift workout, felt very strong throughout the entire session, barely tired.

Depending on how I feel on the day I will be going for 1x215kg (Deadlift) on week 3 and all going well 230kgx1 the following cycle :thumb:

Cardio - I'll do 3 times a week and work up to 30 mins max.

So far I've lost 1 pound :tumbleweed:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) -100KGX3 - 115KGX3 - 129KGX2.... Balls! 

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Failed to make 3 reps on the 129kg, but not to concerned, I know this bench cycle is going to be done again due to week one not making 5 reps.

The assistance weights felt that light it was almost a de load session, really weird. but I'm sticking to the weights while I concentrate on my bench work set technique.

Really hoping I get 230kgx1 on my deadlift next cycle and then I can concentrate on the 3 remaining lifts.

Hate the weights! :devil: :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) 120x5, 135x3, 152.5x5 PM 167.5kg
Back off Sets: 120x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100kgx6,6,5,4,4

Another great squat workout, I find trying to throw the bar through the ceiling is helping so much. i feel so slow on the first rep of the warm up sets but doing it this way the 5th rep is actually the fastest. I have always been one of these people who thought if your not increasing the weight or your not doing maximum weight then what is the point of going to the gym but i feel like these back off sets are doing a great job even though their miles below what I can do. They work on speed, technique and confidence all in one. You know when your doing 120kg and walking it out feewling like you have nothing on your back that 150 is going to be easy.

Deadlifts Im only failing because of my grip. My forarms are killing the next day so double over hand is obviously a weakness of mine so going to use these to build my deadlift for a while as I dont believe in using straps.

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 55x5, 61x3, 68.5x3 PM 75.5kg
Dips: BW+2.5x5, BW+20x5, BW+35x5 PM 163.5kg
Neutral Chin Ups: 2x3, 5x4, 3x3
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x7,7,7

Was really surprised to hit 3 reps on shoulder press but they were actually quite clean. Puts me back on track after missing my 5s week to increase the weight. Only 24.5kg until my goal so 2 years if everything goes to plan which it never does.

Very pleased with dips but Im actually have to unbolt my rack now and spirit level it back up as 145kg dipping on one side has made it lean lol.

Pendlay rows felt incredibly easy when normally they feel like crap. Weird as my chin ups werent the best.

Good luck with the 230kg Dead Doug. How comes your jumping from 215 to 230 in one cycle. Dont you normally put it up by 5kg. If your peaking have you checked out Paul Carters mini peaking cycle, every one who uses it for their power lifting meets seems to do very well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) 120x5, 135x3, 152.5x5 PM 167.5kg
> Back off Sets: 120x3,3,3
> Deadlifts: 100kgx6,6,5,4,4
> 
> Another great squat workout, I find trying to throw the bar through the ceiling is helping so much. i feel so slow on the first rep of the warm up sets but doing it this way the 5th rep is actually the fastest. I have always been one of these people who thought if your not increasing the weight or your not doing maximum weight then what is the point of going to the gym but i feel like these back off sets are doing a great job even though their miles below what I can do. They work on speed, technique and confidence all in one. You know when your doing 120kg and walking it out feewling like you have nothing on your back that 150 is going to be easy.
> 
> Deadlifts Im only failing because of my grip. My forarms are killing the next day so double over hand is obviously a weakness of mine so going to use these to build my deadlift for a while as I dont believe in using straps.
> 
> Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 55x5, 61x3, 68.5x3 PM 75.5kg
> Dips: BW+2.5x5, BW+20x5, BW+35x5 PM 163.5kg
> Neutral Chin Ups: 2x3, 5x4, 3x3
> Pendlay Rows: 67.5x7,7,7
> 
> Was really surprised to hit 3 reps on shoulder press but they were actually quite clean. Puts me back on track after missing my 5s week to increase the weight. Only 24.5kg until my goal so 2 years if everything goes to plan which it never does.
> 
> Very pleased with dips but Im actually have to unbolt my rack now and spirit level it back up as 145kg dipping on one side has made it lean lol.
> 
> Pendlay rows felt incredibly easy when normally they feel like crap. Weird as my chin ups werent the best.
> 
> Good luck with the 230kg Dead Doug. How comes your jumping from 215 to 230 in one cycle. Dont you normally put it up by 5kg. If your peaking have you checked out Paul Carters mini peaking cycle, every one who uses it for their power lifting meets seems to do very well.


James, I think its not a good idea to restrict your overall deadlift just to use a double overhand grip, I would recommend you deadlift for max weight mixed grip and your grip will go up with it :thumb:

Power cleans are also very good for grip training as the movement is very similar to a deadlift and you use a double overhand grip. Mixing squats around with the deadlifts I think could take away your focus, keeping the deadlift work sets with the deadlift assistance sets will keep the lift feeling familiar through the session giving you better "Feel" for the technique and a better chance of progression :thumb:

I'm going for the deadlift 215 this cycle and 230 next cycle because I feel its time to have a go a my one rep max, if I fail I will keep trying. I want to finish my deadlift progression so that I can focus on my other weaker lifts. The deadlift work sets will remain static and I will then just concentrate on adding some weight to the assistance sets and build more muscle 

Good to see your progressing mate, I hope you can see how effective the 5/3/1 is. Stick with it :devil:


----------



## Leebo310

My current workout has been awesome but improvements are just starting to slow down a bit after 5 months so I've decided to start a 5/3/1 workout, thanks to great advice on here (plus an awesome spreadsheet from Mr Bod42 :thumb 

I weigh about 70kg, am 5ft 9 and my current "bests" are 
Standing shoulder press - 65kg 4 reps
Deadlift - 130kg 2 reps
Bench press - 99kg 5 reps
Squat - 120kg 3 reps

Did my first workout today and results were below
Had to round up a few weights due to being limited with plates in the gym (so lifted 45kg, rather than the calculated 44kg for example)
All figures include the 20kg bar (as do my bests above)

Cycle 1, session 1
Shoulder press - (WU - 20x5, 40x5, 40x5) WO 45x5, 50x5, 57.5x5
Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 
Wide grip pull ups - (5 sets to fail each time) 14, 11, 7, 6, 5

Looking forward to deadlifts tomorrow!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 129KGX3 - 148KGX3 - 166KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, felt as though I could have squatted a lot more, which is weird because I felt tired before I started the workout 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> My current workout has been awesome but improvements are just starting to slow down a bit after 5 months so I've decided to start a 5/3/1 workout, thanks to great advice on here (plus an awesome spreadsheet from Mr Bod42 :thumb
> 
> I weigh about 70kg, am 5ft 9 and my current "bests" are
> Standing shoulder press - 65kg 4 reps
> Deadlift - 130kg 2 reps
> Bench press - 99kg 5 reps
> Squat - 120kg 3 reps
> 
> Did my first workout today and results were below
> Had to round up a few weights due to being limited with plates in the gym (so lifted 45kg, rather than the calculated 44kg for example)
> All figures include the 20kg bar (as do my bests above)
> 
> Cycle 1, session 1
> Shoulder press - (WU - 20x5, 40x5, 40x5) WO 45x5, 50x5, 57.5x5
> Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10,
> Wide grip pull ups - (5 sets to fail each time) 14, 11, 7, 6, 5
> 
> Looking forward to deadlifts tomorrow!


Good to see your on the 5/3/1, remember the 5/3/1 is a workout for long term goals :thumb:

If you plateau you'll probably find like I did that its a technique weakness rather than strength.

Good luck with your deadlifts :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, I think its not a good idea to restrict your overall deadlift just to use a double overhand grip, I would recommend you deadlift for max weight mixed grip and your grip will go up with it :thumb:
> 
> Power cleans are also very good for grip training as the movement is very similar to a deadlift and you use a double overhand grip. Mixing squats around with the deadlifts I think could take away your focus, keeping the deadlift work sets with the deadlift assistance sets will keep the lift feeling familiar through the session giving you better "Feel" for the technique and a better chance of progression :thumb:
> 
> I'm going for the deadlift 215 this cycle and 230 next cycle because I feel its time to have a go a my one rep max, if I fail I will keep trying. I want to finish my deadlift progression so that I can focus on my other weaker lifts. The deadlift work sets will remain static and I will then just concentrate on adding some weight to the assistance sets and build more muscle
> 
> Good to see your progressing mate, I hope you can see how effective the 5/3/1 is. Stick with it :devil:


Wendler suggests doing Deadlifts after squats and vice versa in a few of his books and Q&As. Allows you to hit the movement twice per week and when you do the 5x10 sets your a bit fresher as your using different muscles. Im still using a mixed grip on my heavy sets but the 5x10 sets are just in there for added volume so I may as well hit 2 birds with 1 stone and use them to increase my grip strength as well. Also my grip is slipping slightly on my mixed grip and there is nothing more annoying than missing a deadlift due to grip.

I have planned to stick with this program for another few months at least but my gains havent been very good on 5/3/1 (this is me more than the program) and I am starting to miss reps lately but instead of deloading I am just going to stay at the weight until I get the reps I want and see how that goes for me. I may give Base Building a try in a about 6 months as I think Paul Carter really knows what hes taling about


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> My current workout has been awesome but improvements are just starting to slow down a bit after 5 months so I've decided to start a 5/3/1 workout, thanks to great advice on here (plus an awesome spreadsheet from Mr Bod42 :thumb
> 
> I weigh about 70kg, am 5ft 9 and my current "bests" are
> Standing shoulder press - 65kg 4 reps
> Deadlift - 130kg 2 reps
> Bench press - 99kg 5 reps
> Squat - 120kg 3 reps
> 
> Did my first workout today and results were below
> Had to round up a few weights due to being limited with plates in the gym (so lifted 45kg, rather than the calculated 44kg for example)
> All figures include the 20kg bar (as do my bests above)
> 
> Cycle 1, session 1
> Shoulder press - (WU - 20x5, 40x5, 40x5) WO 45x5, 50x5, 57.5x5
> Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10,
> Wide grip pull ups - (5 sets to fail each time) 14, 11, 7, 6, 5
> 
> Looking forward to deadlifts tomorrow!


Hey Lee great start. I can change the spreadsheet for shoulder press to round to the nearest 2.5kg, I just have it round to the nearest 1kg as I only increase the weight by 1kg per month.

And very nice lifts especially for your bodyweight. Look forward to seeing your progress over the coming months.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Hey Lee great start. I can change the spreadsheet for shoulder press to round to the nearest 2.5kg, I just have it round to the nearest 1kg as I only increase the weight by 1kg per month.
> 
> And very nice lifts especially for your bodyweight. Look forward to seeing your progress over the coming months.


Great minds mate, I've updated the rounding on the spreadsheet this morning before I read this!:thumb:

Yeah I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes too. 
One thing I don't think I've asked you (despite the many that I have!) is what sort of rest periods should I be looking at between the sets? 
Also on your ss it says "5+" and "3+" etc, I presume this means minimum of the number plus any more if I can?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Great minds mate, I've updated the rounding on the spreadsheet this morning before I read this!:thumb:
> 
> Yeah I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes too.
> One thing I don't think I've asked you (despite the many that I have!) is what sort of rest periods should I be looking at between the sets?
> Also on your ss it says "5+" and "3+" etc, I presume this means minimum of the number plus any more if I can?


My rest periods

6 minutes between work sets.

And 3-4 minutes between assistance sets.

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Great workout!! Granted I'm only two sessions in on this programme but I'm loving it so far!

Cycle 1, session 2

Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x7 (still felt strong here)
Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x10
Barbell shrug - 80x10, 80x10, 80x10, 80x10, 100x6

This was with rest periods of about a minute or two. Will try the longer rest periods when I feel I need them (I'm guessing on the heavier sessions) but at the moment these seem to be fine.

Looking forward to bench press tomorrow!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Great workout!! Granted I'm only two sessions in on this programme but I'm loving it so far!
> 
> Cycle 1, session 2
> 
> Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x7 (still felt strong here)
> Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x10
> Barbell shrug - 80x10, 80x10, 80x10, 80x10, 100x6
> 
> This was with rest periods of about a minute or two. Will try the longer rest periods when I feel I need them (I'm guessing on the heavier sessions) but at the moment these seem to be fine.
> 
> Looking forward to bench press tomorrow!


Nice looking layout mate, I have to disagree with Wendler in regards to mixing squats and deadlifts.The squat and deadlift are very different lifts regardless of the same muscle groups hit, just like the Bench press and the overhead press, both are presses but they feel very different and learning how a lift feels will help you get stronger quicker, it will also help with technique. But to contradict things technique has to be constantly checked as the heavier the weights get the more chances your technique will fail you before actual strength :tumbleweed:

As for rest, yes you are right at the moment the lighter weights will be easier to recover from. As you lift heavier you'll find what suites you best. I like the longer rest periods because I want maximum strength capability, even on the assistance sets.

Good choice on the barbell shrug to mate :thumb: I used to do them a lot millions of years ago If you want something that lets you handle more weight, you could try http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/video/platform_the_barbell_shrug :devil: Try it without the aid of straps to help build grip strength :devil:


----------



## Guitarjon

Squat- 50kg 8,8,8
Deadlift- 90kg. Reps wise I managed 8,8,7 (Improvement from last weeks 6)
Bench press- 70kg 8,8,7
Bent over row- 55kg 8,8,8
Milletry press - 40kg 8,8,8 (again improvement)

Overall, feeling stronger, I've not upped weights on certain exercises due to trying to keep good form.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Squat- 50kg 8,8,8
> Deadlift- 90kg. Reps wise I managed 8,8,7 (Improvement from last weeks 6)
> Bench press- 70kg 8,8,7
> Bent over row- 55kg 8,8,8
> Milletry press - 40kg 8,8,8 (again improvement)
> 
> Overall, feeling stronger, I've not upped weights on certain exercises due to trying to keep good form.


If you plan to lift heavy I would recommend you split this workout, use the 5/3/1 template but use your rep scheme and you will build some good muscle :thumb:

To make your progress logical and easier to gauge I would use the progressive overload technique

Using this principle on a 8-10 rep workout you would only add weight every time you reach 10 or more reps on any given lift (on all the sets of the lift that is)

Example Bench press 70kg, Reps achieved 10,10,10 = add 2.5kg next session 72.5kg, aim to achieve at least 8 reps per set, the following time you bench aim for 9 and so on until your doing 10 or more reps again. Add 2.5kg and so on....:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Guitarjon said:


> Squat- 50kg 8,8,8
> Deadlift- 90kg. Reps wise I managed 8,8,7 (Improvement from last weeks 6)
> Bench press- 70kg 8,8,7
> Bent over row- 55kg 8,8,8
> Milletry press - 40kg 8,8,8 (again improvement)
> 
> Overall, feeling stronger, I've not upped weights on certain exercises due to trying to keep good form.


As Doug has said, would definitely split this out mate. Lumping all those massive compound exercises together is one intense workout!


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, Session 3

Benchpress - (WU - 39x5, 49x5, 59x3) WO 69x5, 79x5, 89x6 
Benchpress - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x18
Seated chest press - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x14

Very happy with this considering I was suffering from the very manly injury of sleeping funny on my arm last night


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 62KGX3 - 71KGX3 - 80KGX1

DIPS (WU 6x3) BODYWEIGHT+20KGX5x5

DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10*

Not too bad, I will de load this OHP cycle back one month. Also I don't think its a good idea only having one days rest mid week, will probably go back to two days.


----------



## Guitarjon

Do t worry guys, that's the stats for the week. I'm doing them as the 5x5 plan says. What I posted is a summery of where I'm at.

I do it A, B, A, B etc.

If I did all that in one go I'd not walk for days... The dead lifts really knock me for 6 after I've done them. I usually need a fairly long break inbetween sets.


----------



## Leebo310

Guitarjon said:


> Do t worry guys, that's the stats for the week. I'm doing them as the 5x5 plan says. What I posted is a summery of where I'm at.
> 
> I do it A, B, A, B etc.
> 
> If I did all that in one go I'd not walk for days... The dead lifts really knock me for 6 after I've done them. I usually need a fairly long break inbetween sets.


That makes more sense 

I'm feeling yesterday's deadlift now too!


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1 session 4 ( yesterday)
Squat - (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3 ) 
WO - 77.5x5, 90x5, 100x12 felt really strong here so just carried on going! 
Squat - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x21 again felt good here so really went for it! 
Seated leg press - 130x10, 130x10, 130x10, 130x10, 130x13

Happy with all of that, although I did then walk out of the gym as if I'd [email protected] myself :-D
Rest now then shoulders on Monday!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Ballsed up yesterday deadlift session :wall: 

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X30 - 145KGX3 - 165KGX3 - 190KGX2 :wall:*

Got my breathing all wrong so after two reps decided to lower the bar, message to self...... FOCUS! 

Also checked my maths and I may have added too much weight on the Overhead press this cycle, I added 2kg to my bench weights but for some reason upped the weights on my overhead press by 3kg. might be a good idea to sort my S**T out for next cycle


----------



## Leebo310

James sent me a great spreadsheet that works out all the weights per cycle and stuff. 
Happy to forward that on if that would help mate??


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> James sent me a great spreadsheet that works out all the weights per cycle and stuff.
> Happy to forward that on if that would help mate??


Marvellous Lee, ill have a copy please mate. Do you need any Powerlifting books (Pdf format), I've got loads :thumb:

Been thinking about this cycles plateaus/ issues etc.

My conclusions 

1. Bench press - Technique has got sloppy/loose... again :wall:

2. Squat - doing alright :thumb: 

3. Overhead press - Screwed up by adding too much weight and moving over to using a belt. IMHO the belt has actually weakened me in this lift. Belt off next time and back to my normal way of moving in this lift :devil:

4. Deadlift - last few cycles my reps have been sloppy as I'm getting far to relaxed/complacent due to the fact that moving 200kgx1 is now easy for me.

Technique, technique and TECHNIQUE!


----------



## Guitarjon

Had a gym instructor check over my technique yesterday to ensure I was safe. 

He said technique was spot on and any pains maybe that my outside muscles in the lower back are working ok. But I need to work on the deeper core muscles before I go much heavier. 

Any reccomendations for building more core strength or do I just build up slowly. He said to keep the same weigh for a couple of weeks and only put the increments up by 1.25kg and to do more planks etc.


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Great minds mate, I've updated the rounding on the spreadsheet this morning before I read this!:thumb:
> 
> Yeah I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes too.
> One thing I don't think I've asked you (despite the many that I have!) is what sort of rest periods should I be looking at between the sets?
> Also on your ss it says "5+" and "3+" etc, I presume this means minimum of the number plus any more if I can?


Sorry Mate, been away at the Wellington 7s so havent checked DW all week.

Ya the 5+, 3+ etc means as many reps as you can. I think most people are starting to agree that 1-2 reps shy of failure is a good place to finish. You dont want to be smashing yourself into the ground every single session but then this isnt an excuse not to work hard either. Try and set your goals before you start the workout but you can tailor them based on how you feel during the actual workout.

Rest periods are personal but also goal orientated. This isnt set in stone but usually longer rest is good for strength building, shorter rest is better for building muscle. I do 2-5 mins rest on main sets and 1:30 on all assistant exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Had a gym instructor check over my technique yesterday to ensure I was safe.
> 
> He said technique was spot on and any pains maybe that my outside muscles in the lower back are working ok. But I need to work on the deeper core muscles before I go much heavier.
> 
> Any reccomendations for building more core strength or do I just build up slowly. He said to keep the same weigh for a couple of weeks and only put the increments up by 1.25kg and to do more planks etc.


I disagree with your gym instructor in regards to his recommendations on how much you should increase your weights. I would also be careful on taking just one view on form/technique. There are different approaches for different forms of weight training. If building strength and muscle mass is your main goal I would strongly recommend you learn from sites like ElitFTS or starting strength, basically lift like a raw powerlifter.

Why would you want to work on core muscles before going heavier  If you use a simple well structured barbell routine based on large compound lifts your whole body is trained. Arm and ab training is a waste of time for the first two or even three years (I'm sure you've been told this already when you decided to add arm and ab work to the 5x5, see how you now have questions which have the same answers, forget the direct arm and ab training!) 

You should be able to add 2.5kg to upper body lifts and 5kg to lower body lifts quite easily at your level.

As for core strength. If you lift like a powerlifter all of the big four will require you to have good core strength and if you want to build core power the Squat and the deadlift are the ultimate ways to go. But if you follow 5x5 or the 5/3/1, you'll find your core should build up with your lifts (This is what I have found personally)

Above all remember that its not an exact science when it comes to sport advice. We all react differently to our chosen sports and it takes time to learn what best suites us 

My advice would be to decide exactly what you want to achieve from this sport. What are your goals? When I first started powerlifting just over two years ago I had clear goals and they have not changed that much, I've just added to my goals list. You will also find as the weights get heavier you'll have to keep reviewing your technique. You may even change your goals, lifting heavy weights consistently is hard on both body and mind :devil:

My own experience I have found when performing 5 reps that around 122kg form gets sloppy on the bench press, 75kg overhead press form fails, 185kg deadlift starts to loosen up and around 180kg the squat gets sloppy, you'll then think its a plateau but its more likely to be a technique failure not strength failure :thumb:

By changing the rep ranges you can use the 5x5 or 5/3/1 templates for strength, muscle mass a fitness but I would not change the basic exercises :thumb:

Above all enjoy the journey :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I have to disagree with Wendler in regards to mixing squats and deadlifts.The squat and deadlift are very different lifts regardless of the same muscle groups hit, just like the Bench press and the overhead press, both are presses but they feel very different and learning how a lift feels will help you get stronger quicker, it will also help with technique. But to contradict things technique has to be constantly checked as the heavier the weights get the more chances your technique will fail you before actual strength :tumbleweed:


In a way training the lifts on opposite days actually helps more with Technique as you are training the lift twice per week and your training in a less fatigued state as you havent just exhausted the muscles doing top heavy sets. As Wendler says though, it doesnt actually matter as its the same amount of work, just structured differently so more down to personal preference. I find it very hard to Squat high volume low rest after I have just hevay squatted, a lot easier after deadlifts.



Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 1 session 4 ( yesterday)
> Squat - (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3 )
> WO - 77.5x5, 90x5, 100x12 felt really strong here so just carried on going!
> Squat - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x21 again felt good here so really went for it!
> Seated leg press - 130x10, 130x10, 130x10, 130x10, 130x13
> 
> Happy with all of that, although I did then walk out of the gym as if I'd [email protected]pped myself :-D
> Rest now then shoulders on Monday!


Im very impressed with 21 reps. Not only is that great strength, that takes balls to do that especially on your own. Bet your get some serious DOMS from that. Going to be walking like you lost your Donkey.

Jon, I have to agree with Doug, in simple terms keep adding weight to the major compound exercises and these will sort your core strength out. I think "core" strength is one of those fads that came around and everyone and his cat was doing squats on top of a swiss ball while balancing on top of a balance board. Core exercises have there place but like everything it seems today, people take it to far. Yes planks are good if you are a beginner but how far can you really take a planks? How much will a 5min plank really carry over to your squat? Will it really make your deadlift go up? Nope Deadlifts and squats will make your deadlift and squat go up. And an exercise is only as strong as its weakest link so if you go from deadlifting 20kg to 200kg, your abs are capable of handling 200kg.


----------



## Leebo310

Cheers mate, and hell yep I'm still feeling the ache today! Feels lovely though! :-D 
Figured I'd just keep pushing myself!

Looking forward to the second session of shoulders later today.

Jon - have to agree with the others. You'll feel you've worked your abs way more after one heavy squat session than doing however many planks. I also find really slow and controlled pull ups really work your abs well as they're under constant tension to keep you from swinging wildly.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 5
Shoulder press - (WU - 30x5, 40x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x3, 55x3, 60x9
Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x20 
Front bbell raise - 20x10, 20x10, 20x10, 20x10, 20x18

Really going for it on the final set of each exercise.

And after all of that my legs are still aching from the mammoth squat session last Friday... 

Again, it's only my fifth workout on this programme but I am absolutely loving it! Feeling immense after every session, and then get a lovely ache the days after! What more could you want from a workout! 
Cheers again Doug and James for getting me into this! :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108KGX5 - 122KGX3 - 136KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

That's more like it  The 122kgx3 which I failed on my 5 rep week went up easy and I most certainly could have done 5 reps with it tonight. I felt that strong that I'm confident I could have put 140kg on the bar and would have made 1 rep with it.

I'm going to print a sign with !!!!TECHNIQUE!!!! on it and put it up on my powerlifting room wall :wall:


----------



## Leebo310

Good lift, impressive mate!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Good lift, impressive mate!


Not bad for an old man eh   Still hungry for that elusive 150kg bench though :devil:


----------



## Leebo310

Ha, yep not bad!  
What was your best before you started this programme by the way?


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5,75x3) 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x10 PM 143.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 50x10, 60x10, 70x10
Pull Ups: 1x2, 1x3, 8x2
Inverted Rows: AMAP

Really pleased to get this weight as it puts me on target to hit my biggest weight ever in a few weeks time and Im getting closer to that 150kg Bench all the time. I have to admit that I was even more impressed to get this when I only got back from a rugby holiday where I was literally on the **** 14+hours per day for 4 days straight. Im still feeling horrendous a few days on so did well to hit my weights. Buggered my ankle jumping off the stage chasing a Jaberbomber so not sure how squats will go tomorrow but we will see.

Nice pump on incline and still havent missed a rep on these. Sometimes I feel like the Simple Strength Template is actually better than 5/3/1 as it waves up in intensity through the weeks and I havent missed a rep on any any exercises since I started using it.

Nice call on the Chin ups being a great ab exercise Lee, most people never consider that but your abs always hurt after a good chin up session. Glad to hear your loving the program Lee, its nice when you suggest something to someone and it actually works out. And thanks for listening to Doug and I, its actually a compliment. Wrote out the SL 5x5 workout for someone the other day, spent 2.5hours teaching them all the exercises and instead they decided to do a magazine body building routine.

Haha posted this before refreshing and seeing Doug's comments. Were both chasing that 150kg Bench but Doug is absolutely smashing me on the lower body exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Ha, yep not bad!
> What was your best before you started this programme by the way?


180Kg (Wide grip) when I was in my mid twenties :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Wow, that's one monster lift! 
I was more asking to see your progress on this actual programme though  
Oh and those mails have now come through cheers, they had indeed classed them as "Junk" :-D


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Wow, that's one monster lift!
> I was more asking to see your progress on this actual programme though
> Oh and those mails have now come through cheers, they had indeed classed them as "Junk" :-D


Off the top of my head I think I started around 90kg approx. two years ago. I would say going from the 5x5 to the 5/3/1 has in fact slowed overall progress but kept me from experiencing any real plateaus (Which is the point of the 5/3/1, slow but sure and to keep you progressing for many years).

Glad you got ya pdf's mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 138KGX5 - 157KGX3 - 175KGX1

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Excellent, all went well, the 175kgx1 squat felt well within my capability :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Tonight's workout: Squats
20, 60, 80, 90, 100kg x 5
110kg x 3
120kg x 2
130kg x 1
140kg x too high, wimped out a couple of times.

Bench Press
20, 60, 70, 80, 90kg x 5 Wasn't feeling it through the pecs so...

Flat DB Press
PH 20, 30, 40kg x 5

OHP
20, 50, 55kg x 5

Seated Dips
BW x 5 x 2

Energy tailed off throughout but a good session none the less.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Tonight's workout: Squats
> 20, 60, 80, 90, 100kg x 5
> 110kg x 3
> 120kg x 2
> 130kg x 1
> 140kg x too high, wimped out a couple of times.
> 
> Bench Press
> 20, 60, 70, 80, 90kg x 5 Wasn't feeling it through the pecs so...
> 
> Flat DB Press
> PH 20, 30, 40kg x 5
> 
> OHP
> 20, 50, 55kg x 5
> 
> Seated Dips
> BW x 5 x 2
> 
> Energy tailed off throughout but a good session none the less.


Welcome to the thread :thumb:

First of all, if the above is one workout session it is structured incorrectly for you to make decent gains in muscle and strength. I would most certainly recommend a four day week split. like you said "energy tailed off"... Really!  

To build muscle and strength you need to be able to load each area with enough volume and weight, the four day split is an excellent way to achieve maximum results, high intensity is not required 

Good 4 day template.

Monday = Bench press, plus assistance exercises

Tuesday = Squat, plus assistance exercises

Friday = Standing Overhead press, plus assistance exercises

Saturday = Deadlift, plus assistance exercises

The bench press is primarily a Tricep exercise if you execute the lift like a powerlifter. If you do a flat back bench with a wider grip the pecs will come into play more, but the risk of shoulder injury/damage makes it not worth while, especially when you can build a big chest safely with a shoulder width grip powerlifting style bench press :thumb:

However if you bench press like a powerlifter not only will you hit the Triceps but most of the upper body including the pecs, shoulders, oh and the Biceps! :thumb: The bench press will build more mass than any other chest exercise (possibly dips are a close second but they are difficult to load and don't suite everyone's physique) If feel was your only goal a good pec deck session would make you feel as though you'd hit the chest harder. Even though the pec deck makes the chest feel worked harder, the bench press will build more mass and strength.

I would check out the original 5/3/1 and use the big but boring assistance lifts template :thumb:

Don't be fooled into thinking that pump/feel means growth, neither does having DOMS indicate growth either.

Is there any reason why you are doing seated dips?

Not sure what your level is so if I've told you stuff you already know, sorry 

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Hello, thanks for the input. None of that is news in any way but I appreciate your help. My recovery has always been shocking so I stick to two sessions a week.
A: Squats and push
B: Pull

Then I play rugby at the weekends 

Since I've been picking up more and more nutritional information and increasing my GPP I've been able to recover better.

I've been doing this on and off for a while. I just need some consistency.

I can normally get through that workout just fine but I hadn't slept much or eaten much. Plus I don't usually work up to singles, just today they felt good so I wanted to get some decent weight on my back to see how it feels as I'm no where near my previous standards.

Wendler's programme is indeed very good. The BBB assistance I have also done before but I was looking for something a little different for now until the season comes to an end then push the training cycles when I don't have to save all my energy for the weekend.

That's my reasoning anyway. If there's a better way to do it then I'm all ears 

I usually warm up with some cleans, power cleans, front squats and/or overhead squats but left them as I wasn't full of energy.

I'm not after a pump, there's no show here pal hehe. I'm not small, I'm a front row player! But I can tell/feel when I am using the right muscles and how they should be reacting to the training stimulus. So I just added some extra in to increase the volume.


----------



## Bod42

Bokers, Im a rugby player, well should say was a rugby player and Ive trained loads of players and worked at a few clubs. I think a 2 day split is perfect for in season as your body takes a pounding on game day and most teams train 2 days a week so you need time to rest. 

And I wouldnt say you split is that bad as its not far off a 5x5 split really. I used to stick to more full body workouts with rugby players as its closer to the needs of the game. All positions pretty much do the same thing in the weights room but would tailor their fitness and power differently so it hits the energy systems that the positions uses most.

If your serious about rugby then your not lifting to feel the muscles your lifting for maximum power and strength so stick with the big compound exercises especially in season. Out of season concentrate on putting back the muscle you lost during the season. Oh and stay away from seated dips, puts your shoulders in an awful position so get on the real dips station.

How much do you weigh, position and age?


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 6 (yesterday)

Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x8
Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x18
Bent over bbell row - 30x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x22 (the fact I managed 22 on my final set probably means I should've used more weight on this one from the start!)

Another good session although I think I need to refine my dl technique a touch as I noticed I was bending my back a little. Still managed the weights and reps but just want to get it perfect! 

Doug/James - any top tips for getting perfect form on dl?! Will check those books you emailed later Doug but just thought I'd see if you guys had any pearls of wisdom first! :thumb:

Bench press later today...


----------



## Bokers

I usually stick to compound movements, I just added a few extra to this session.

Dips are 'seated' (I use a bench behind me) with me pushing from the ground. I'm just too heavy for BW dips at the moment. I might go banded for a while.

I agree with the maximal approach but I can't recover quickly enough to make the next session or the game worth while so I'm building it up as my recovery is improving.

130kg, tighthead and 25. I also like long walks on the beach and sunsets :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 1, session 6 (yesterday)
> 
> Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x8
> Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x18
> Bent over bbell row - 30x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x22 (the fact I managed 22 on my final set probably means I should've used more weight on this one from the start!)
> 
> Another good session although I think I need to refine my dl technique a touch as I noticed I was bending my back a little. Still managed the weights and reps but just want to get it perfect!
> 
> Doug/James - any top tips for getting perfect form on dl?! Will check those books you emailed later Doug but just thought I'd see if you guys had any pearls of wisdom first! :thumb:
> 
> Bench press later today...


As with all the lifts the Deadlift and how easy or how you execute can be influenced largely due to your body type.

However I've always found the EliteFTS videos an excellent way to your quest for good lift technique/form :thumb:

A very comprehensive so you can deadlift video set 














































Enjoy :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> I usually stick to compound movements, I just added a few extra to this session.
> 
> Dips are 'seated' (I use a bench behind me) with me pushing from the ground. I'm just too heavy for BW dips at the moment. I might go banded for a while.
> 
> I agree with the maximal approach but I can't recover quickly enough to make the next session or the game worth while so I'm building it up as my recovery is improving.
> 
> 130kg, tighthead and 25. I also like long walks on the beach and sunsets :lol:


I'm very surprised someone so young cannot recover from a basic 4 day week split.
I'll ask the obvious 

Are you eating enough protein for your bodyweight per day?
Are you sleeping properly?
Do ensure you are hydrated adequately?

A deload week every 4th week is a great way to fully recover body and mind 

Walking on the beach at sunset is not a good idea as sea spray is more easily absorbed through the skin at that time of day, it decreases the metabolism and increases body fay percentage


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Bent over bbell row - 30x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x10, 40x22 (the fact I managed 22 on my final set probably means I should've used more weight on this one from the start!)


I see a cunning plan formulating


----------



## Bokers

So we've gone from me showing you what I got up to in the gym to now almost having to lay it all out...?!  I'm not particularly bothered, it's rather funny!



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm very surprised someone so young cannot recover from a basic 4 day week split.
> I'll ask the obvious
> 
> Are you eating enough protein for your bodyweight per day?
> Are you sleeping properly?
> Do ensure you are hydrated adequately?
> 
> A deload week every 4th week is a great way to fully recover body and mind
> 
> Walking on the beach at sunset is not a good idea as sea spray is more easily absorbed through the skin at that time of day, it decreases the metabolism and increases body fay percentage


So I've been in much better shape before, more energy, better diet, living style etc.

I'm just returning to my previous better habits with some more information than before and I'm aware of my protein, macro and micro-nutrient requirements. I'm well hydrated now and sleeping is better. Stuff is on the up so I'm not concerned. I just haven't been recovering well so far, it's getting better by the day currently.

Do you play any sports as well as lifting three/four times a week? I've done every over day for a good few months before without any other sports or loading it's very do-able when I had my recovery in place. But bring something as exhausting as rugby or martial arts (I did K1 for a while too) and you'll see the difference in your recovery.

Bod42 also chimed in and I'm glad it's not just me that really feels it after the games.

I'm not crying about any of this, nor am I ungrateful for help (not that I asked) but it might be worth asking what's gone on beforehand sometimes to get a better understanding.

Back to the matter at hand then...

How can I recover better when I've got my sleep, diet, nutrient timing, n3 to n6 ratio, less inflammatory foods, salt baths, ice baths etc all in line?

I was thinking that I need more active recovery? Walking and light exercise to increase blood flow (detailing more often might help haha) as I sadly have a desk job.


----------



## Bod42

2 days per week is fine for Rugby, it is even better for a prop. Props take unreal pressures down their neck, back and spine. I should know I was one and got to a decent level. There is a number of studies that show loading the spine effects recovery more than other exercises.

So if Bokers is training twice and playing 1 game per week then he is actually training high intensity 5 times per week. I dont know anyone that can sustain 4 heavy weights sessions per week and 3 intense rugby sessions, even professional dont do that. When do you recover if your smashing yourself 7 days per week.

4 days body part split is a very good program for a weight lifter but it isnt any good for a sports man. This is backed up by both Joe Defranco and Jim Wendler 2 day inseason programs. It is even argued by a lot of lifters that 4 days per week is to much and they prefer 3 days per week. Jim Wendler doesnt play a sport anymore but only does a 2 day per week program. Jim even says that adding running to your program will effect your strength training and running is nothing compared to rugby.

People dont realise the impact Rugby has on the body. The England Rugnby team physio says that after every single game players show the same signs of trauma to the body as being in a 30mph car crash. Could you imagine being in a 30mph car crash every weekend and then going to the gym?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> So we've gone from me showing you what I got up to in the gym to now almost having to lay it all out...?!  I'm not particularly bothered, it's rather funny!
> 
> So I've been in much better shape before, more energy, better diet, living style etc.
> 
> I'm just returning to my previous better habits with some more information than before and I'm aware of my protein, macro and micro-nutrient requirements. I'm well hydrated now and sleeping is better. Stuff is on the up so I'm not concerned. I just haven't been recovering well so far, it's getting better by the day currently.
> 
> Do you play any sports as well as lifting three/four times a week? I've done every over day for a good few months before without any other sports or loading it's very do-able when I had my recovery in place. But bring something as exhausting as rugby or martial arts (I did K1 for a while too) and you'll see the difference in your recovery.
> 
> Bod42 also chimed in and I'm glad it's not just me that really feels it after the games.
> 
> I'm not crying about any of this, nor am I ungrateful for help (not that I asked) but it might be worth asking what's gone on beforehand sometimes to get a better understanding.
> 
> Back to the matter at hand then...
> 
> How can I recover better when I've got my sleep, diet, nutrient timing, n3 to n6 ratio, less inflammatory foods, salt baths, ice baths etc all in line?
> 
> I was thinking that I need more active recovery? Walking and light exercise to increase blood flow (detailing more often might help haha) as I sadly have a desk job.


I was only trying to be helpful. At least your sarcasm seems to be well developed :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, Session 7

Benchpress - (WU - 49x5, 59x5, 69x3) WO 74x3, 84x3, 94x5
Benchpress - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x17
Incline benchpress - 50x10, 50x10, 50x10, 50x10, 50x15

Can't wait for squats tomorrow!!!


----------



## Bokers

ITHAQVA said:


> I was only trying to be helpful. At least your sarcasm seems to be well developed :thumb:


Maybe the start, towards the end it wasn't. I was genuinely asking about improving recovery. It's all got a little out of hand...

Bod thanks for the reply  I'm only in a local team, nothing special. When you get up to that level it doesn't sound as fun! Hehe.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Maybe the start, towards the end it wasn't. I was genuinely asking about improving recovery. It's all got a little out of hand...
> 
> Bod thanks for the reply  I'm only in a local team, nothing special. When you get up to that level it doesn't sound as fun! Hehe.


No harm done mate :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1 session 8
Squat - (WU 60x5, 60x5, 70x3 ) 
WO - 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x11 
Squat - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x23 
Calf raise - 139x10, 139x10, 149x10, 159x10, 109x24

Very happy with that workout, the 11 reps on 107.5 felt good so I'm looking forward to seeing how many I can smash out on the 1+ rep at 113kg next squat day!


----------



## Bod42

Bokers said:


> Maybe the start, towards the end it wasn't. I was genuinely asking about improving recovery. It's all got a little out of hand...
> 
> Bod thanks for the reply  I'm only in a local team, nothing special. When you get up to that level it doesn't sound as fun! Hehe.


Friendliest weights forum your find, no ego's at all in here. Everybody starts somewhere.

And Doug is very experienced and knows what he is doing so he is only giving his best advice and has helped a fair amount of people on here. Thats again why I love weightlifting as there is no right answer, more than one way to skin a cat.

Ya I dropped like 3 leagues one day as I just couldnt be bothered and it was taking over my life. I enjoyed playing at a lower level and drinking with the boys more than playing lol.

As for recovery, it sounds like you have read about the best methods, contrast baths, showers etc. The only other one is Epsom salt baths, I found these worked really well for me. If you do these dont buy epsom salt from the High street, but it in bulk, I ended up buying a 10kg box.

Thursday Workout
Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) 47.5x5, 55x5, 62x7 PM 76.5kg PR!!!
Dips: BWx10,10, BW+12.5x10 
Neutral Chin Ups: 8x3, 2x2
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x8,8,8

Very good workout, very pleased to get 7 reps of 62 as I missed my 7th rep of 61 last month. Still just plodding away at 1kg per month on shoulder press but Im more than happy with that.

Only disappointment today was chin ups but this was probably due to running out of chalk and my hands being ripped up from Deadlifts without chalk on Wed.

Pleased with Pendlay Rows, these were very strict and fast.

Its great making progress but it just seems every week I easily hit my upper body weights and move on no big deal whereas I struggle like crazy with my lower body and thats what I really need to work on. Im going to give it a few more months and see where I am and then Im going to try something completely different.


----------



## Guitarjon

Really happy last night. I smashed my deadlift. I was struggling to get the final rep the last couple of times and last night I did all 5 and could have done more! Granted still only 90kg. Also I've done 5x5 on that one not 1x5.

It seems that the 'so you think you can deadlift' series was worth watching. Don't think I was being explosive enough.


----------



## Leebo310

Guitarjon said:


> Really happy last night. I smashed my deadlift. I was struggling to get the final rep the last couple of times and last night I did all 5 and could have done more! Granted still only 90kg. Also I've done 5x5 on that one not 1x5.
> 
> It seems that the 'so you think you can deadlift' series was worth watching. Don't think I was being explosive enough.


Nice work mate! 
Yep those videos are good, I'm looking forward to trying out the tips and refining my technique next deadlift day.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Its great making progress but it just seems every week I easily hit my upper body weights and move on no big deal whereas I struggle like crazy with my lower body and thats what I really need to work on. Im going to give it a few more months and see where I am and then Im going to try something completely different.


Mate do you reckon that it may be that it's just your lower body was much stronger than your upper to start with? Hence why you're seeing good improvement above but not so much on your lower? 
I'd have thought the high level of rugby that you played for however many years would probably mean that you'd developed massive strength in your legs and lower body so your starting point was already fairly high.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 9
Shoulder press - (WU - 30x5, 40x5, 45x3) WO 50x5, 57.5x3, 62.5x6
Shoulder press - 30x10, 30x10, 40x10, 35x10, 35x24 (varying weights were due to me being stupid and unable to read my own writing... ) 
Upright row - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x15

Happy with my 6 reps at 62.5kg - means I'm a whopping 2% stronger already after only 3 shoulder workouts :thumb:
Only downside now is that I'm away with work so won't be doing my next workout until Wednesday...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) -65KGX5 - 75KGX3 - 84KGX0 I failed, I failed, faileee failson, captain FAIL! :wall:

DIPS (WU 9x3) -BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout except for the fail on the 84kgx1, however I felt stronger on the 75kgx3. Week 1 my target was 5 and I failed on the 75kg, if it were week 1 workout tonight I'm confident I would have reached 5 reps :thumb:

Also I have noticed that switching over to using the belt recently has changed my technique (belt I lean back) without the belt I lift properly and get my head under the bar, I would say I felt stronger tonight because I didn't use the belt. Relying on a belt IMHO buggered up my technique. But I make no excuses, the 84kgx1 fail was a strength fail 

Changed back to bodyweight dips to increase volume and help with bodyfat reduction.

Need to hate the  weights more :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Really happy last night. I smashed my deadlift. I was struggling to get the final rep the last couple of times and last night I did all 5 and could have done more! Granted still only 90kg. Also I've done 5x5 on that one not 1x5.
> 
> It seems that the 'so you think you can deadlift' series was worth watching. Don't think I was being explosive enough.


Word of caution, when being explosive, try not to jerk the bar. Aim for a controlled power execution.

Personally I am not explosive in any of my lifts and rely on 100% raw controlled strength to move the weight. This one of the only good weight training principles I learned from the 80's = good form (Don't train with poor form for the sake of more weight, be safe) Remember its not just your muscles that need to grow but tendons and bones etc.. :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

ITHAQVA said:


> No harm done mate :thumb:


:thumb:



Bod42 said:


> As for recovery, it sounds like you have read about the best methods, contrast baths, showers etc. The only other one is Epsom salt baths, I found these worked really well for me. If you do these dont buy epsom salt from the High street, but it in bulk, I ended up buying a 10kg box.


Funny you should say... 10kgs of epsom just arrived  Thanks for the tip.



Guitarjon said:


> It seems that the 'so you think you can deadlift' series was worth watching. Don't think I was being explosive enough.





ITHAQVA said:


> Word of caution, when being explosive, try not to jerk the bar. Aim for a controlled power execution.
> 
> Personally I am not explosive in any of my lifts and rely on 100% raw controlled strength to move the weight.


You can be as explosive as you want to be but as ITHAQVA says, you don't want to jerk the bar. That will just get you into all sorts of trouble.

You want to take the tension of the bar. Get your grip set, right position, take the tension and then let rip. No jerking but you will find the increased acceleration from the floor will help you get more weight locked out.

Have a look at the olympic lifts for example. The weights are moved as explosively as possible but at no point is it out of control or just thrown without the correct tension and form.

You can apply the same queues to all your lifts. Sometimes you can be too gentle with the weights.


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Mate do you reckon that it may be that it's just your lower body was much stronger than your upper to start with? Hence why you're seeing good improvement above but not so much on your lower?
> I'd have thought the high level of rugby that you played for however many years would probably mean that you'd developed massive strength in your legs and lower body so your starting point was already fairly high.


I did start high, I could squat a lot the day I walked in the gym but I'm still making no progress. Me and Doug started about the same time and he is lapping me. My bench is nearly the same as my squat which is just perfectic. I feel like accelerating my squats and using back off sets is working really well for squats but not for deadlifts.

I work hard, don't miss workouts but just not making the progress I should be so that only leaves one thing, DIET. Been doing a lot of reading of sorting out and balancing the florna in my gut. May get worse before it gets better but will be worth it.

I'm going to give the 5\3\1 with back off sets a proper try but then I will go back to the simple turning your 8rm into your 15rm then adding weight. Gives you 1 simple goal to focus on.


----------



## Guitarjon

Starting to struggle a bit with the milletry press. I understand it uses some of the smaller muscles. I'm on 35kg. Again I'm struggling with form. I am finding my back is swigging slightly in order to get the bar in the air. I'll keep it where it is until I'm confident my mid section is tighter. I'm managing the 5x5 lifts just, but feel the last couple are of poor quality.

On another note my wife came for a hug on the sofa yesterday and moaned that my previously wobbly chest area was now hard and not as comfortable to put her head lol. Personally thought this was fantastic. I've got quite a heigh body fat percentage (in the 30s) it's coming down slowly. I can't imagine what I'll be like when I knock 15% off while carrying on with all the lifting. I've always been fairly well built and broad, in other words not a hard gainer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Starting to struggle a bit with the milletry press. I understand it uses some of the smaller muscles. I'm on 35kg. Again I'm struggling with form. I am finding my back is swigging slightly in order to get the bar in the air. I'll keep it where it is until I'm confident my mid section is tighter. I'm managing the 5x5 lifts just, but feel the last couple are of poor quality.
> 
> On another note my wife came for a hug on the sofa yesterday and moaned that my previously wobbly chest area was now hard and not as comfortable to put her head lol. Personally thought this was fantastic. I've got quite a heigh body fat percentage (in the 30s) it's coming down slowly. I can't imagine what I'll be like when I knock 15% off while carrying on with all the lifting. I've always been fairly well built and broad, in other words not a hard gainer.


Keep at it mate, the overhead press is a bugger to progress on due to the smaller muscles used whilst executing the lift.

Patience is key to any body transformation, try not to have unrealistic expectations as this lead to a loss in motivation. I've been doing this for just over two years and I'm only on 82kg for 1 on my overhead press :thumb:

15% is a good goal, its the same as myself ( I'm at 20% at the moment) 

A good little article about the press from the WENDLER! 

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/wait-a-couple-weeks-oh-press/


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 17 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 155KGX5 - 175KGX3 - 200KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 70KGx3x3x3x3x3*

A good workout, considering feeling weaker in this lift recently. The 200kgx1 felt heavy.
I checked my workout record to see why I've lost a little strength, answer - I have over the Christmas break missed 3 deadlift workouts. Consistency!!!! :wall:


----------



## Bokers

Nicely done. What grip do you use to deadlift?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Nicely done. What grip do you use to deadlift?


Moved over to mixed grip after double overhand grip started to fail when repping with 140kg


----------



## Bokers

Cool, I moved to DOH hook when normal DOH fails.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Cool, I moved to DOH hook when normal DOH fails.


Is that the same as the Olympic lifters hook grip (Fingers over thumb). I've had a go at it but it feels weird lol. Might have a go at powercleans with it to see how it goes :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

ITHAQVA said:


> Is that the same as the Olympic lifters hook grip (Fingers over thumb). I've had a go at it but it feels weird lol. Might have a go at powercleans with it to see how it goes :thumb:


That's the one. It's painful when you get up into the weight, I won't lie! 

You'll want the rotation of a normal DOH grip for cleans. Try it for SLDL or rows or similar


----------



## Leebo310

Doug - Quick question about the 5/3/1 but on my deload sessions, am I just doing 3 sets of 5 for my main exercise or 2 sets of 5 and then the third as many as I can?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Doug - Quick question about the 5/3/1 but on my deload sessions, am I just doing 3 sets of 5 for my main exercise or 2 sets of 5 and then the third as many as I can?


I'm on deload this week too 

I never go over the prescribed reps on any of my training. However on a deload week I would most definitely stick to the reps and not go over :thumb:

There are arguments for both going over the reps (Intensity etc..) and sticking to the exact reps (Lower intensity etc..) From my own experience I have found keeping intensity down works better for strength, muscle growth and progress.


----------



## Leebo310

Cheers Doug, can't argue with your results so I'll go with that then!
I'm on the third cycle, won't be on deload till next week anyway but like to plan ahead


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cheers Doug, can't argue with your results so I'll go with that then!
> I'm on the third cycle, won't be on deload till next week anyway but like to plan ahead


I would have a play around with intensity if you've not done so before.

From my own experience as a younger lifter (20-35) I found that after around 8-10 weeks high intensity (positive failure) style training I started to plateau and lose strength. I made up my own routines and one I used a lot was very similar to the 5/3/1 in structure. My home made routine was based on strength 5 sets of 1-4 reps then 10 sets volume work done with a 5-7 rep range combined with the progressive overload principle.

I think if you plan to train to positive failure you should cycle your workouts. The best approach would be 3-4 weeks high intensity then 3-4 weeks medium intensity/volume (The last rep on the last work set should be hard to complete, the other sets should feel a rep or two short of complete positive failure).

Take a look at the Max effort principle (If you want the pdf, pm me :thumb: ) I works on 3 week cycles and focuses on ...max effort 

just bear in mind, high intensity can make you loose muscle mass and strength (I would be more inclined to think that is why some people struggle with the 5/3/1, by taking Wendlers advice on repping over the proscribed number when they should just follow the routine as is rep wise or cycle the intensity) training to failure IMHO is not the way and you all know me, I think Wendler overall gives excellent lifting advice.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Cheers Doug, can't argue with your results so I'll go with that then!
> I'm on the third cycle, won't be on deload till next week anyway but like to plan ahead


I started running 6 weeks of 5/3/1 and then deloading and found it better as I feel Im just getting momentum after 3 weeks. Then I was pleased to see that Wendler suggests this in his latest book. So instead of 3 weeks deload the 4th, do 6 weeks deload the 7th. And I do think deloads are beneficial but not sure if I like such a rigid approach as some times you feel amazing and your training is going amazing and you have to deload. Its a new program and you seem to be liking it so i would space the deloads slightly further apart.



ITHAQVA said:


> just bear in mind, high intensity can make you loose muscle mass and strength (I would be more inclined to think that is why some people struggle with the 5/3/1, by taking Wendlers advice on repping over the proscribed number when they should just follow the routine as is rep wise or cycle the intensity) training to failure IMHO is not the way and you all know me, I think Wendler overall gives excellent lifting advice.


The more I read about RAW lifters, the more this is becoming very apparent. Check out this article, very eye opening. Extract below. http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/2013/06/20/squatting-big/

"Fact is, I very rarely squat heavy. The majority of my squat training, I would guess 90% of it, is done with around 420 pounds. That's right, I built an 800+ belt only raw squat and an 1,100+ geared squat training with only about 420 pounds. Unbelievable? Believe it."

Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 107.5x5, 125x5, 140x7 PM 172.5kg
Back Off: 107.5x5,5,5

Thats it, I was absolutely fried. The last set was hard but if I really wanted to I probably could have got another 1-2 reps but for some reason i got an absolutely incredible pump in my quads. I feel like I have finally converted to a decent free squat technique instead of the Box Squat technique that I used for so many years. I can see how box squats carry over to geared lifters but I think they are 90% useless for Raw lifters as the technique is so different and therefore hit different muscles.

This is the hardest squat workout of the phase for me so pleased to get it.


----------



## Leebo310

Ah ok, so miss out the deload next week, and go straight into the next cycle with the increased weight and then have a deload after that? 
I'm definitely enjoying it and feeling good. 
It's just getting that balance of working hard and not overdoing it as Doug pointed out! 
I'm away with work at the moment so means that I worked out on Friday and won't get chance to do my next one till Wednesday so I'll see how I feel after the deadlift, bench and squat of the 3rd sessions which I'll do this week and see if I feel like I need the deload or whether the 4 day gap now is enough. 
Man there are so many different things to think about and weigh up!


----------



## Bod42

Yep, do 2 cycles in a row then deload. Increase the weight between each cycle still.


----------



## Leebo310

Cool, cheers James.
Nice lifts by the way, 7 @ 140 is impressive!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 cycle 17 de load week

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Marvellous! :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Got the 5/3/1 V2, powerlifting and beyond 5/3/1 as bed time reading as I've run the program but never read the books.


----------



## Bokers

Played at the weekend and won! Woohoo. That's a few on the trot now. Still my neck has me moving like a car crack victim haha.

So a nice easy session tonight. All about speed!

Deadlifts
50, 90, 120 150kg x 5
160kg x 3 x 3 still snappy.
170kg x 2. Nice.

Bench Press
Changed my grip width to a little narrower. Liking it 
40, 60, 80, 85, 90kg x 5
95kg x 3 x 3
100kg x 1 Still quick.

Cable pullups
40, 60, 70, 75, 80, 85kg x 5

That was it. Short and sweet.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Played at the weekend and won! Woohoo. That's a few on the trot now. Still my neck has me moving like a car crack victim haha.
> 
> So a nice easy session tonight. All about speed!
> 
> Deadlifts
> 50, 90, 120 150kg x 5
> 160kg x 3 x 3 still snappy.
> 170kg x 2. Nice.
> 
> Bench Press
> Changed my grip width to a little narrower. Liking it
> 40, 60, 80, 85, 90kg x 5
> 95kg x 3 x 3
> 100kg x 1 Still quick.
> 
> Cable pullups
> 40, 60, 70, 75, 80, 85kg x 5
> 
> That was it. Short and sweet.


Well done on the win Bokers! :thumb:

I use a narrow grip as well mate, much healthier for the old shoulders :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Cool, cheers James.
> Nice lifts by the way, 7 @ 140 is impressive!


Cheers for the support mate but its not that great when you consider Im benching 120 for 6 :lol::wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 cycle 17 - 5/3/1 de load week

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 110KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

If only normal weeks were this easy  :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 10 (yesterday)

Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 95x5, 107.5x3, 119x5
Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x18
Lat pull down - 90x10, 110x10, 110x10, 110x10, 90x12 


Cycle 1, Session 11 (today)

Benchpress - (WU - 49x5, 59x5, 59x3) WO 79x5, 89x3, 99x4 (bit disappointed with 4 to be honest, wanted a few more)
Benchpress - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x17

Final exercise was a new one suggested by one of the PT's at the gym - Press ups "medley" on the powerplate! (Intensity level 30)
45 seconds of plyo pressups where I managed 38
60 seconds rest
45 seconds to do as many standard pressups as possible - managed a pityful 26 as was absolutely shot at this point!
60 seconds rest
45 seconds of standard pressups only holding the position for 5 seconds at the top and bottom of the movement - managed the full 45 seconds

And before anyone calls the powerplate "girly", try doing that combo and then see how girly it feels! Trust me, it's a good one! :thumb:

Heavy squats tomorrow, can't wait!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 1, session 10 (yesterday)
> 
> Deadlift - (WU - 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 95x5, 107.5x3, 119x5
> Deadlift - 62.5x10, 62.5x12, 62.5x13, 62.5x10, 62.5x18
> Lat pull down - 90x10, 110x10, 110x10, 110x10, 90x12
> 
> Cycle 1, Session 11 (today)
> 
> Benchpress - (WU - 49x5, 59x5, 59x3) WO 79x5, 89x3, 99x4 (bit disappointed with 4 to be honest, wanted a few more)
> Benchpress - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x17
> 
> Final exercise was a new one suggested by one of the PT's at the gym - Press ups "medley" on the powerplate! (Intensity level 30)
> 45 seconds of plyo pressups where I managed 38
> 60 seconds rest
> 45 seconds to do as many standard pressups as possible - managed a pityful 26 as was absolutely shot at this point!
> 60 seconds rest
> 45 seconds of standard pressups only holding the position for 5 seconds at the top and bottom of the movement - managed the full 45 seconds
> 
> And before anyone calls the powerplate "girly", try doing that combo and then see how girly it feels! Trust me, it's a good one! :thumb:
> 
> Heavy squats tomorrow, can't wait!


Hi Lee,

It may sound like a daft question, but why are you doing powerplate work? 

P.s Powerplate work is girly!


----------



## Leebo310

It was my second assistance exercise mate
I vary the 2nd assistance one each session and this cycle I thought I'd give it a go.
Ha, girly it may be but trust me I've never seen a girl doing plyo pressups on one


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> It was my second assistance exercise mate
> I vary the 2nd assistance one each session and this cycle I thought I'd give it a go.
> Ha, girly it may be but trust me I've never seen a girl doing plyo pressups on one


All joking aside Lee, if you enjoy it and it keeps you motivated and challenged it matters not what you do :thumb:

Have you tried plate strip sets? :devil:


----------



## Leebo310

Yeah it was just to keep it varied as obviously the first chunk of the workout was standard bench press. I won't lie though, I felt a bit stupid going towards the powerplate in the first place and then a bit show offy doing plyo pressups on it! I was "that guy"!  Still felt good and I do love the explosiveness of a plyo press up! 
You know you're just jealous you don't have a powerplate in your home gym ;-)

Is a plate strip set the same as a drop set mate?


----------



## Bod42

Never put up my Bench Workout
Bench: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x8 PM 142.5kg
Incline Bench: 60x8, 70x8, 80x6
Pull Ups: 2x2, 8x3
Kroc Rows: 42.5x16

Not a bad workout but this is the first workout in a long time where I had a rep stop and I had to grind it up a little. I was always 100% confident in getting the rep but it just slowed down slightly whereas all other weeks have been pretty easy. Still on target to hit 150kg predicted max next month. Ya I know a PM isnt a real max but one day I will do a mock meet and see where I really am.

I really want to get my Incline weight up though, I just think its one of those exercises that benefits all of your pushing exercises.

Glad to get back on track with my pull ups. They were hurting my shoudler the first few sets but a little tweak to form and I was fine.

Not to take the **** mate but never thought I would see the words "powerplate" mentioned in this forum. Some guy must be laughing all the way to the bank, I created a plates that vibrates and it magically makes you more muscular. Do your workout on the ground and it would still probably be just as hard and you would probably get better carry over from the Plyo pushups as your pushing from a solid surface. Saying that I have seen Chad Wesley Smith from juggernaut doing Plyo jumps from sponge to make them harder. But as Doug says what ever keeps you happy really. im under the believe now that everyone should really do something like 5/3/1 for the first exercise and then they can pretty much do what they want and follow what ever goals they want.

I even hit the boxing bag Tabata style on Tues for a quick fitness boost.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Yeah it was just to keep it varied as obviously the first chunk of the workout was standard bench press. I won't lie though, I felt a bit stupid going towards the powerplate in the first place and then a bit show offy doing plyo pressups on it! I was "that guy"!  Still felt good and I do love the explosiveness of a plyo press up!
> You know you're just jealous you don't have a powerplate in your home gym ;-)
> 
> Is a plate strip set the same as a drop set mate?


Lol, my missus has one  And no I don't use it 

Basically you strip of plates as you fatigue, I used to do sets of 15 :doublesho Varied rest periods, first five sets heavy 3 min rest, then the remaining sets vary from 1 minute down to just enough time to change the plates.

Its a great way to add intensity to a workout from time to time, but will bash your recovery a little bit  Be warned it makes your grow so quick you can get stretch marks on your biceps up through the shoulder area. Quads, calves (You get the message ).

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Try it, you might like it :-D 

Do you mean to do the strip weight set as my second assistance exercise then?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Try it, you might like it :-D
> 
> Do you mean to do the strip weight set as my second assistance exercise then?


Usually a strip is the whole set, but yes you could do a 5 or 10 set strip as all your assistance work :thumb:

Not using the powerplate


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Not to take the **** mate but never thought I would see the words "powerplate" mentioned in this forum.


Haha, well I like to be different! And to be fair I didn't actually buy one 
Jeez, I knew I should've just put the pressup medley, and missed out the fact it was on the pp then I wouldn't be getting this abuse :wall:

Anyway, back to Cycle 1, session 12

Was supposed to be squat day but due to the only rack in the gym being in use when I got there  I had to vary it up a bit and do the 2nd assistance exercise first. Not ideal but still hit all my goals when I eventually got to the squats and actually did better than I thought considering the amount of leg press I did first.

Leg press - (WU 100x6, 130x6, 140x5)
WO - 160x5, 180x3, 210x7
Leg press - 120x10, 120x10, 120x10, 120x10

Squat - 90x5, 100x3, 112.5x6
Squat - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 13 (saturday) 
Deload
Shoulder press - (WU - 30x5, 30x5, 30x5) WO 27.5x5, 35x5, 40x5
Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10 
Seated dumbbell press - 26x8, 26x8, 26x8, 26x8, 26x8

First ever deload session and felt weird leaving the gym knowing that I had plenty left to give! 
Deload session for deadlifts later today so will see how that goes.


----------



## Bokers

Yesterday: Deadlifts again, yay! I need more structure heh.
Three hours sleep the night before, I was pleasantly surprised.

Power cleans
40, 50, 60kg x 3 x 3

Deadlifts
50, 90, 120, 150kg x 5
160, 170kg x 3
180kg x 2

SLDL
90kg x 8 x 4
Going to build this up. Weak hams 

Bench Press
50, 70, 80, 90kg x 5
95kg x 3
100kg x 2

Incline DB press
20kg x 12
25kg x 8 x 4
Again, going to build up the accessory work.

DB rows
25kg x 10 x 4
I don't think I've got this right at all. Time for youtube :lol:

Planks and raises, done.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU50X5 60X5 80X3) - 92KGX5 - 106KGX5 - 120KGX5

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW  80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

The assistance work is feeling way too light, but I really want to focus on my works sets for a while, need to resist urge to increase assistance weights! :wall::wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Yesterday: Deadlifts again, yay! I need more structure heh.
> Three hours sleep the night before, I was pleasantly surprised.
> 
> Power cleans
> 40, 50, 60kg x 3 x 3
> 
> Deadlifts
> 50, 90, 120, 150kg x 5
> 160, 170kg x 3
> 180kg x 2
> 
> SLDL
> 90kg x 8 x 4
> Going to build this up. Weak hams
> 
> Bench Press
> 50, 70, 80, 90kg x 5
> 95kg x 3
> 100kg x 2
> 
> Incline DB press
> 20kg x 12
> 25kg x 8 x 4
> Again, going to build up the accessory work.
> 
> DB rows
> 25kg x 10 x 4
> I don't think I've got this right at all. Time for youtube :lol:
> 
> Planks and raises, done.


I wouldn't be so hard on yourself Bokers, the above is a vey good workout if your no splitting the lifts.

Looking at the weights you use, I'm not sure if it is the same for rugby players and their training, but for powerlifting and any other muscle sport I would always work heaviest lift to lightest to get maximum benefit from the exercises.

Deadlift
SLDL
Powerclean

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) -123.5KGX5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Well pleased with this workout, the 161.5kgx5 squat felt well within my capabilities (I think this is down to getting used to full parallel squatting) also noticed using the higher the bar position the more controlled and balanced I felt, NICE  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I agree with heaviest to lightest except when it is a Power exercise. Power exercise always goes first especially for sports people. I will try and dig out my old Rugby program that I designed.

Nice Deadlift there.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 115x3, 132.5x3, 147.5x5 PM 172kg
Back Off Sets: 115x4,4,4
Deadlifts: 100x6,6,6,6,5

I felt like crap walking in the gym and really could not be bothered today but dispite that I kept looking at the weights after I had unracked the weight as I felt like I had nothing on my back and this workout ended up being pretty easy. The change in technique/thinking is definitely working and this is how I used to approach the gym when I was younger which served me well.

Disappointed to miss my last rep on deadlifts. Just to clarify this has nothing to do with deadlift strength, Im using a double overhand grip and want to get to 5x10 on 100kg double over hand and its my grip that is failing. This may seem abit weird but my grip needs work and its also a way of stopping me going over board on the assistance exercise which I have a habit of doing.



ITHAQVA said:


> The assistance work is feeling way too light, but I really want to focus on my works sets for a while, need to resist urge to increase assistance weights! :wall::wall:


Doug have you read Paul Carters Base Building? He talks about picking a weight and staying at that weight until it becomes stupidly easy and feels really light for 3-5 workouts in a row. There is no set percentages or timeframe, its more of personal choice and knowing your body. Actually makes sense if you think about it so if your 80kg is feeling ridiculously easy then increase it a little bit.


----------



## Bokers

Appreciate the advice but those power cleans are light for me. They serve me as a good & fun little warm up for deadlifts and I definitely take longer to build up when I haven't done them. Get's you in the right positions and mindset to rip the bar off the floor when I add weight for the deadlift.


----------



## Bod42

What timing for a great article http://www.t-nation.com/diet-fat-loss/a-calorie-is-sometimes-not-a-calorie.

I designed the Mrs programming and she is the strongest she has ever been and is making great gains. She asked for as new blank sheet at the gym and the PT is insisting that she review her and change her programming as "you get used to your programming and stop progressing". Honestly I was taught this on my PT course but its just total crap, your muscle doesn't know which exercise its doing, you can't confuse a muscle. Look at it simply you don't spend 4 weeks swinging a golf club and then change to 4 weeks swinging a cricket bat to get better at golf, you practice what you want to improve at.

She met with the PT today but refused to change the programming so has arranged another meeting tomorrow. And my god she said her programming doesn't have enough balance as it hasn't got bicep work. Sorry half info half rant post lol


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 1, session 14 (Tuesday) 
Deload
DL - (WU - 40x5, 50x5, 50x5) WO 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x5
DL - 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x10 
Seated row - 45x10, 45x10, 45x10, 45x10, 45x10

Cycle 1 session 15 (today)
Deload
Bench Press - (WU - 39x5, 39x5, 39x5) WO 41.5x5, 51.5x5, 64x5
Bench Press - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10 
Incline press fly grip - 40x8, 35x10, 30x10, 30x10, 30x10

As always, looking forward to squats tomorrow!


----------



## Bokers

Snatches
20, 30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats, yay!
50, 70, 90, 100, 120kg x 5
130kg x 2

Front Squat
90kg x 1
50kg x 5 x 5

OHP
20, 40, 50 kg x 5
60kg x 3 x 3

Too much chatting means that's where it ended. Need more pressing, may go in again today.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 25X5 30X5 40X3) - 56KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 73KGX5

DIPS (WU 9x3) - BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Glad I de loaded back to this cycle for the OHP, the last rep on the OHP 73kgx5 was quite difficult :thumb:

9 pounds to go for my body fat goal :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> She met with the PT today but refused to change the programming so has arranged another meeting tomorrow. And my god she said her programming doesn't have enough balance as it hasn't got bicep work. Sorry half info half rant post lol


I would ask the so called expert about the involvement of the biceps during the bench press and Overhead press :tumbleweed:

Has the PT mentioned varied training that confuses muscles yet :wall::wall:

I'll feel your pain James :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 135KGX5 - 155KGX5 - 180KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 75KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Better workout, the 180kgx5 felt much easier this week. I concentrated on powering up through each rep :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I would ask the so called expert about the involvement of the biceps during the bench press and Overhead press :tumbleweed:
> 
> Has the PT mentioned varied training that confuses muscles yet :wall::wall:
> 
> I'll feel your pain James :thumb:


She changed her Lat Pull down (compound exercise) to stiff arm lat pull down, an isolation exercise but states my program doesnt have enough balance. She has changed 5 of the 6 exercises from compound to isolation exercises which is mental.

Ya that was the rant really as she said you stop progressing unless you change every 4 weeks to confuse the muscle. As the T-nation article states, you cant confuse a muscle and it takes 4 weeks to learn a new movement so why on earth would you change every 4 weeks.

I suppose if PTs put people on year long programs they would have nothing to do in the gym.

Anyway SP workout.

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 50x3, 57.5x3, 65.5x5 PM 76.5kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+12.5x8, BW+30x6
Neutral Chin Ups: 2x3, 1x4, 7x3
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x5x9

Just keep plodding along on my upper body workouts, nothing fantastic but nothing bad, just keep adding weight.

Dips were easy which Im pleased about.

Only slightly disappointing thing is that my chin up performance has gone down but then I have put on a few kgs of weight so this is probably just due to this.

Pendlay rows are moving again and all I did was sort my setup out so Im in a really solid position to pull the weight from.


----------



## Guitarjon

Squat and dead lift are improving. I've nailed my technique for now on the squat which was holding me back previously but after lots of you tube and asking people in the gym to watch my technique I'm happy to start upping the weight. No suprise I'm not getting any lower back pain any more. 

Current stats (not all done at the same time)

Squat 55kg (currently upping every work out now) 5x5
Dead 90kg 5x5
Bench 60kg 5,5,5,5,4 This is starting to get hard so I'm going to watch loads of you tube.
Barbell row 45kg- 5x5 still feels very easy.
Overhead press 35kg 5,5,5,4,4 finding this one hard to get good form on the last few (arching back).


----------



## Guitarjon

I've just watched the series of so you think you can bench. Hopefully picked up a few tips. I think I've a few issues.

Too narrow grip (elbows come below the bench)
Not holding the bar tight enough
Not keeping my whole body tight

I've got the arch etc but will have to experiment when I'm at the gym on Tuesday.


----------



## Bokers

Plant your feet too and push through your heels, that will help keep everything stable and tight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I've just watched the series of so you think you can bench. Hopefully picked up a few tips. I think I've a few issues.
> 
> Too narrow grip (elbows come below the bench)
> Not holding the bar tight enough
> Not keeping my whole body tight
> 
> I've got the arch etc but will have to experiment when I'm at the gym on Tuesday.


I don't think there is any better resource than ElitFTS so you think you can bench series, keep viewing mate :thumb:

My grip is narrow, it makes the lift harder and also helps keep the shoulders healthy.

:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

I can't wait to get in the gym tomorrow and try it out.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I can't wait to get in the gym tomorrow and try it out.


Stick with it mate. The lifts can become very technical as you increase the weight, so don't expect perfection straight away and when its gets heavier you'll find that your technique drops more often. I make a point of focusing on technique in every workout now. Try to think about using all of your body for the lifts. This is the trick with strength, train your body to use all the muscle fibres, execute the reps with loads of power, you don't need to be ridiculously explosive, but you do need to be explosive when you lift.

You'll be amazed how much of the obvious you forget when your lifting 

Hate the weights!!! :devil:


----------



## Bod42

One of the best ways to check if your set up correct on the bench is to get someone to push and pull you when your on the Bench and you should be totally solid. Most people arent solid on the bench so how can you expect to lift something heavier than you without a solid foundation.

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) 95x5, 107.5x3, 120x6 PM 144kg
Incline Press: 70x5, 75x5, 85x5
Pull Ups: 2x2, 1x3, 7x2
Inverted Rows: AMAP

Pleased to get 6 reps as this matches my best in quite awhile but this time it was a lot easier. i actually got to rep 3 and thought "oh cr*p" but as soon as i exploded out of the bottom on the 6th rep I knew I had it and the lock out was easy. Getting closer to that 150kg bench now.

Incline was really easy as well but I still concentrated on throwing the weight through the ceiling.

Again my chin performance is dropping off but I dont really track these, they are just in there to get extra pulling volume in.

Did Inverted rows on the top of the rack instead of setting up Kroc rows as I was hard pressed for time.


----------



## Leebo310

Last three updates...

Cycle 1, session 15 (27th Feb)
Bench press - (WU - 29x5, 39x5, 39x3) WO 41.5x5, 51.5x5, 64x5
Bench press - 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10, 51.5x10
Machine fly - 40x8, 35x10, 30x10, 30x10, 30x10


Cycle 1, session 16 (28th Feb)
Squat - (WU - 40x5, 40x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x5, 60x5, 72.5x5
Squat - 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 60x10, 
Calf raise - 109x10, 139x10, 139x10, 139x10, 139x18


Cycle 2, session 1 (yesterday)
Shoulder press - (WU - 30x5, 40x5, 45x3) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 60x11 (very happy with this!)
Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x24 
Wide grip plyo pull up to fail - 13, 10, 10, 9, 6

Deadlift later today


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 99KGX3 - 113KGX3 - 127KGX3

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good.
Read through Wendler's original 5/3/1 book and found something I forgot or missed, you can do pyramids or plate strip on your BBB exercises :devil:

Something to consider in the future me thinks :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Ok, squats, chest and rows done tonight. 

Squat 60kg. 
Chest 60kg
Row 45kg

Thoughts - Squats I'm really happy with how these are going. Feel really strong and definitely feel like I will continue to progress with a bit of ease for a little while yet. 

Bench press - WOW what a difference. Wider grip helped but one of the biggest differences for me to really get the last couple on the reps was to squeeze the bar tighter/harder. Really felt more power coming through. I also pulled the bar off the rack higher today and used my lats to move the bar away. I did get my wife to give me a kick/poke on the bench after seeing it happen on so you think you can bench. 

Strange one. Although I managed 5x5 on the chest it felt really hard. However, I didn't feel as out of breath as I would I'f I'd just finished a squat or dead lift. I kinda feel like I only did 5,5,5,5,4.5 on the last one. Would you stick at this weight next time round or increase? I'm not confident my last rep was a good one. After all it's gotta slow down soon as I should be squatting and dead lifting way more than the chest press. I'm sure it will do as it's taken me a while to get the squat form right. 

Barbell row - still feels easy.


----------



## Guitarjon

Also made me chuckle tonight as I saw some lads squatting some real weight. Like 200kg. Then I watched them actually perform them and they were like quarter squats... half at best. 

I know we all do things in our own way etc but is there any point in squatting 200kg if your not doing them properly?


----------



## Leebo310

Guitarjon said:


> Also made me chuckle tonight as I saw some lads squatting some real weight. Like 200kg. Then I watched them actually perform them and they were like quarter squats... half at best.
> 
> I know we all do things in our own way etc but is there any point in squatting 200kg if your not doing them properly?


Yeah it really works out your ego muscle :-D


----------



## Guitarjon

I'm a fairly stocky chap but don't think I could lift 200kg for 1 yet never mind squat it.


----------



## Bod42

Pretty poinless doing half squats and they are basically 100% quads so it leads to imbalance. i know some rugby coaches prescribe half squats as its nearly the same position your in during a scrum and ruck but as i say they swap them out with proper squats to help with muscle balance. People are absolutely shocked what reduced ROM training adds to there total. If he is quarter squatting 200kg I would be surprised if he can full squat 100kg. I have benched 240kg using ROM training, did it not long ago with one of my trainees to show how much difference it makes. He was doing 60x5 on the bench and hit 140 bench.

The only time I ever load up the bar is to do walk outs every so often as they get you used to having heavier weights on your back.

Anyway talking about squats:
Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 125x5, 140x3, 157.5x3 PM 173kg
Back off Sets: 125x3x3
Deadlifts: 100x5x6

Please to get my heavy week of squats. Didnt feel very fast tonight but still managed to get all the reps that Im pleased about.

Back off sets werent as fast as usual but I still feel like these are a real confidence builder, walking out a weight that you know there is 0% chance of failing makes you feel great.

Pleased to get all my reps double over hand grip on deadlift. The deadlift part is actually very easy now but Im struggling with my grip. May add some grip work back into my workout like I used to.


----------



## Guru

Guitarjon said:


> I know we all do things in our own way etc but is there any point in squatting 200kg if your not doing them properly?


Well, partial squats do have their place, but I would say as assistance stuff for really advanced lifters. I will look at them just like rack pulls for deadlifts or high pin lockouts for bench etc. They do make you get accustomed to a huge amount of weight on your back. I know of a few guys who do walkouts at 1.2 - 1.5 times their max as a part of warm-up. Psychologically your top set then feels lighter than it otherwise would.

P.S. - Not in any way advocating what those guys were doing BTW.


----------



## Bokers

Very quick session last night. Short on time! Happy none the less 

Snatches
20kg x 5 x 3
30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats (ATG)
60, 80, 100, 110, 120kg x 5
130kg x 2
135kg x 1 Happy with that!

Bench Press
60, 70, 80, 90kg x 5
Filmed the last set, seems my arms are a little shakey and my line is off. Back to EFS videos :lol:


----------



## profoundoblu

Started my ICF 5x5 program a couple of weeks ago, 

Today's workout (workout A) was 

Squats 72.5kg (5x5)
BB rows 60kg
Flat bench 65kg
Shrugs 60kg
Skullcrushers 27.5kg
Inc DB curls 16kgs 
Cable crunches

Rows are about as high as I can go ATM, and my elbows are uneven, so in thinking of adding some DB rows in to try and strengthen my left arm, (I'm assuming it's muscle imbalances causing it!) squats are still pretty comfortable, 

Workout B will be on Friday, which consists of squats, deadlifts, rows, CGBP, inc curls/pull ups, OHP, and some ab work! 

Any advice on how I can improve my rowing would help greatly, I posted ok this thread a while ago about squats and someone linked the so you think you can squat videos, they definately helped me form wise so thank you who ever link that! (Cannot remember who!)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 133KGX3 - 152KGX3 - 171KGX3

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDINGF CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Feeling much stronger all over, calf raise needs to be upped, will go 155 next cycle :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Back to EFS videos :lol:


EliteFTS is our second home mate


----------



## ITHAQVA

profoundoblu said:


> Started my ICF 5x5 program a couple of weeks ago,
> 
> Today's workout (workout A) was
> 
> Squats 72.5kg (5x5)
> BB rows 60kg
> Flat bench 65kg
> Shrugs 60kg
> Skullcrushers 27.5kg
> Inc DB curls 16kgs
> Cable crunches
> 
> Rows are about as high as I can go ATM, and my elbows are uneven, so in thinking of adding some DB rows in to try and strengthen my left arm, (I'm assuming it's muscle imbalances causing it!) squats are still pretty comfortable,
> 
> Workout B will be on Friday, which consists of squats, deadlifts, rows, CGBP, inc curls/pull ups, OHP, and some ab work!
> 
> Any advice on how I can improve my rowing would help greatly, I posted ok this thread a while ago about squats and someone linked the so you think you can squat videos, they definately helped me form wise so thank you who ever link that! (Cannot remember who!)


If it were me I would follow a more simple template, have you tried the normal stronglifts 5x5 or original 5/3/1 with the BBB template?

Simple is effective in this game :thumb:


----------



## profoundoblu

I haven't tried it no, I'll have a look into the strong lifts workout, thanks for the advice!


----------



## ITHAQVA

profoundoblu said:


> I haven't tried it no, I'll have a look into the strong lifts workout, thanks for the advice!


Be warned, there is no direct arm or abb training. These are propely structured training routines. :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Ok, squats, chest and rows done tonight.
> 
> Squat 60kg.
> Chest 60kg
> Row 45kg
> 
> Thoughts - Squats I'm really happy with how these are going. Feel really strong and definitely feel like I will continue to progress with a bit of ease for a little while yet.
> 
> Bench press - WOW what a difference. Wider grip helped but one of the biggest differences for me to really get the last couple on the reps was to squeeze the bar tighter/harder. Really felt more power coming through. I also pulled the bar off the rack higher today and used my lats to move the bar away. I did get my wife to give me a kick/poke on the bench after seeing it happen on so you think you can bench.
> 
> Strange one. Although I managed 5x5 on the chest it felt really hard. However, I didn't feel as out of breath as I would I'f I'd just finished a squat or dead lift. I kinda feel like I only did 5,5,5,5,4.5 on the last one. Would you stick at this weight next time round or increase? I'm not confident my last rep was a good one. After all it's gotta slow down soon as I should be squatting and dead lifting way more than the chest press. I'm sure it will do as it's taken me a while to get the squat form right.
> 
> Barbell row - still feels easy.


You will feel much less taxed doing benches due to the smaller muscles involved.

If you make your reps move the weight up. Might be a good idea to ensure you take the same amount of rest between sets. I can imagine you need no more than 4-5 minutes between sets at your level :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

profoundoblu said:


> Started my ICF 5x5 program a couple of weeks ago,
> 
> Today's workout (workout A) was
> 
> Squats 72.5kg (5x5)
> BB rows 60kg
> Flat bench 65kg
> Shrugs 60kg
> Skullcrushers 27.5kg
> Inc DB curls 16kgs
> Cable crunches
> 
> Rows are about as high as I can go ATM, and my elbows are uneven, so in thinking of adding some DB rows in to try and strengthen my left arm, (I'm assuming it's muscle imbalances causing it!) squats are still pretty comfortable,
> 
> Workout B will be on Friday, which consists of squats, deadlifts, rows, CGBP, inc curls/pull ups, OHP, and some ab work!
> 
> Any advice on how I can improve my rowing would help greatly, I posted ok this thread a while ago about squats and someone linked the so you think you can squat videos, they definately helped me form wise so thank you who ever link that! (Cannot remember who!)


May sound weird but one of the best way to get your back strength up is to drop your arm work. I find that when people do back work especially chin ups that they pull with their arms whereas they should be using their back. i normally have people set up in a row position but pull the shoulders back before every rep, its a lot harder but teaches you to engage your back. Also get them to do chin up without bending their arms, its a very small movement but you tense your lats and move up abit, this helps with your mind muscle connection.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 55x5, 62x3, 69.6x3 PM 76.5kg
Dips: BW+5x5, BW+20x5, BW+37.5x5
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x10,7,8

Shoulder Press was the hardest it has been in a long time, I felt like I had no pop off my chest so normally i will fire from the bottom and my sticking point is my forehead but today on the 3rd rep i got the bar to around mouth level and then just muscled the thing up, took a seriously long time to complete the rep. And my left arm went up faster than my right and afterwards I felt like i tore my abs from the uneven load. Now who says barbell work doesnt work your abs.

Please with dips, made these really deep and they were still relatively easy. 150kg for 5 dips next month, nice milestone.

I lowered my chins as really these are just for extra back volume so better to do them properly.

Ive been really strong on Pendlay rows lately but just ran out of steam.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

Yesterdays workout = Crap!

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 60KGX3 - 69KGX3 - 78KGX2 *

Overhead press not progressing, I'm struggling with the technicalities of the lift, I'm finding the OHP the hardest to master. I will work out my 1 rep max and re calculate my work set percentages and build up from there :thumb:

Today = Awesome!

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 145KGX3 - 165KGX3 - 190KGX3

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 75KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Total contrast, the 190kg x 3 reps was easy, the missus spotted my form and she said my back was straight throughout the 3 reps :thumb: Whole workout was easy.

Overall very pleased, I was expecting to stall on the OHP sometime.

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Power cleans
30, 40, 50, 60kg x 3 x 3

Deadlifts
60, 100, 130, 160kg x 4
180kg x 3, 2, 1

SLDL
70kg x 10 x 4

OHP
20, 30, 40, 50kg x 5
60kg x 3, 2, 1

DB OHP
10, 15, 20, 25kg x 8

That was me done.
Recovery is on the up. I'm only sore in my forearms from Saturday's game which is progress.
I'll be going more often but focusing on one lift and accessories each time. It should mean better progress.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) 110x5, 127.5x5, 145x7 PM 179kg
Back off Sets: 110x5x5

I ate just before going to the gym and this made me feel like absolutely crap, note to self never to do that again. Got all my squats but they werent pretty, my weight was shifting to my toes at the bottom which meant I was good morninging the weight on most of my reps. Strange as I have never had this problem before.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 106KGX5 - 120KGX3 - 134KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All went well :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) -142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX1

SQUAT 110KGx10

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 150KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Really good workout, the 180.5kgx1 went up without too much effort :thumb:

Over the next few months I will gradually up my Squat assistance weight up to 110kg for extra mass and strength, I intend to do the same for the deadlift :thumb:

Time for some protein!!!!!!


----------



## Bokers

Good progression there pal!


----------



## Bokers

Snatches
20, 30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats
60, 100kg x 5
120kg x 3 x 8 Deeeeeep. Happy with that.

Front squats
60kg x 6 x 4

Calf raises SS curls for the girls
BW / 15kg x 12 x 4

Squats coming on nicely


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Good progression there pal!


Thanks mate :thumb: Hopefully i can get to 200kg without too many stalls :devil:


----------



## Bokers

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks mate :thumb: Hopefully i can get to 200kg without too many stalls :devil:


Let's hope so!


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 2 session 8
Squat - (WU 60x5, 70x3, 80x3 ) 
WO - 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x11 
Squat - 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 62.5x22 
Calf raise - 139x10, 139x10, 139x10, 149x10, 149x21

And as normal, I struggled to walk out of the gym after this


----------



## Ryan_W

Not been on here in aaaaaaages so thought I'd pop in and say hello again...

Have had a serious back injury after a car accident (fractured T-10, torn tendons), but am back in training now and have been since Dec even though I had a month off for a holiday over in Australia.

Tested myself the other week and worked my back squat back up to 180kg x2, bench up to 100kg x10 (haven't tried a max due to old shoulder injury), 250kg deadlift, 107.5kg OHP and 120kg C&J. All of those have been without of belt since I'm training more like an Olympic lifter now and working on my flexibility.

Few pics back in the gym:

260kg rackpulls










100kg front squats










140kg squats










240kg deadlift










Decided to play around with my diet too and trim up at bit. 
This was after 12 weeks strict (read boring as ****) diet:










And a comparison pic from 10 years of drug free training. This s**t takes time!










Hope everyone is well and keeping injury free!

Ryan :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Great pictures Ryan. Really amazing how long it takes for real muscle to build. 

I'm currently not quite sure what my body is doing. I've always been quite broad and large framed, as well as fat.

I'm lifting heavy progressively (some exercises I'm starting to fail on more frequently now). I'm not loosing scale weight but my body fat is dropping. That said, I'm still looking more defined. The annoying thing is I've still a load of fat to shift. I really have no idea what sort of actual muscle I actually have yet. Just wish the scales would go down quicker as I should be loosing fat quicker than I build muscle...


----------



## Guitarjon

Oh and I seem to be breaking through my 60kg bench plateau. Going for 62.5 next session. 

The so you think you can bench really have helped with technique. Yesterday I didn't fail any reps and think I might have been able to do possibly 6 reps on each set.

Rows up to 50 now, I'm going to stick with that one a little longer as it was hard... Technique wasn't perfect. 

I know the guidance says to progress each session but I am sort of judging by how effective that session was. If I feel I did 5x5 but I either struggled or did bad technique I'm continuing until I've mastered it. What's your take on this guys? I'm in no major rush as I personally feel I've progressed so much already.


----------



## Ryan_W

You'll get there mate, don't worry about it! Just make sure your form is dialled in and it'll come...
The biggest error so many people make with benching is having a poor platform. By platform, I'm referring to feet, **** and shoulder placement and stability. Correct leg drive can aid in a bench press more than any other 'technique'.

And PLEASE don't be looking at your scales on a weekly basis. Weight is nothing (unless you're competing and need to hit a certain BW). It's all about shape and BF%.

When I went onto my diet I went from 190lb to 201lb then cut my water to lean up and hit 193lb in the after pic you see above. You'll put on weight since you'll be building muscle. A lot of the excess weight will be fluids too. You should be aiming to drink at least 1L per 20kg of BW.

Feel free to fire any questions my way, I'm here to help!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Good to see you Ryan, glad you've got over the accident mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Oh and I seem to be breaking through my 60kg bench plateau. Going for 62.5 next session.
> 
> The so you think you can bench really have helped with technique. Yesterday I didn't fail any reps and think I might have been able to do possibly 6 reps on each set.
> 
> Rows up to 50 now, I'm going to stick with that one a little longer as it was hard... Technique wasn't perfect.
> 
> I know the guidance says to progress each session but I am sort of judging by how effective that session was. If I feel I did 5x5 but I either struggled or did bad technique I'm continuing until I've mastered it. What's your take on this guys? I'm in no major rush as I personally feel I've progressed so much already.


As long as you make good reps, progress. If you feel the last few reps were just plain ugly, feel free to stick at the same weight until your happy, but don't let this slow your progress and become habit. You can become stuck at a weight and lose strength. Always strive to reach your rep goals each workout.

There is no hurry mate, enjoy the journey :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Cheers guys. I also find water really helps with weight loss. A couple of years ago I lost 6 stones through diet alone! I've since put some of that back on but not all. I did find that although I was going to the toilet every two minutes it really helped. A lot of people seem to believe its bro science or not actually proven but hey it helped me.

This time I'm using diet and weights it's just happening much slower. I guess I was becoming skinny fat before where as this time I'm going skinnier fit. 

I'm currently at 119kg. People don't think I look that heavy but I am. I do think a lot of it is a fairly muscular body composition. I know I'm lifting weights recently but I used to lift in the past too - just had a break. I know they are just numbers on no scale but I do have a high body fat. (Somewhere between 30-35% measured using electric machine - hense 5% in accuracy- could be anywhere in between)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Cheers guys. I also find water really helps with weight loss. A couple of years ago I lost 6 stones through diet alone! I've since put some of that back on but not all. I did find that although I was going to the toilet every two minutes it really helped. A lot of people seem to believe its bro science or not actually proven but hey it helped me.
> 
> This time I'm using diet and weights it's just happening much slower. I guess I was becoming skinny fat before where as this time I'm going skinnier fit.
> 
> I'm currently at 119kg. People don't think I look that heavy but I am. I do think a lot of it is a fairly muscular body composition. I know I'm lifting weights recently but I used to lift in the past too - just had a break. I know they are just numbers on no scale but I do have a high body fat. (Somewhere between 30-35% measured using electric machine - hense 5% in accuracy- could be anywhere in between)


In regards to weight loss.

Consider how long it took for you to acquire your bodyfat, so many people forget this, it took me over 20 years to go from an average 15% to 20% body fat.

So you should have realistic goals. I would suggest you aim for 15% bodyfat in 24 months :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 22X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 73.5KGX3 - 82KGX1*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 18 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 155KGX5 - 175KGX3 - 200KGX1 - 205kgx0

DEADLIFT 110KG10x10x10x10x10

POWER CLEAN 75KGx3x3x3x3x3*

Tried another single rep of 205kg after the 200kgx1 and just didn't have enough energy to complete it. 

Upped the 5x10 rep deadlift assistance work to 110kg, felt easy enough to get some nice volume in. I'm hoping this will help build some extra strength on the work sets.

:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Really really bad session today. Major struggle lifting 100kg this week in the deadlift. I hammered it last time. Without any worry of not getting it. I managed 5,4,3 and gave up as my lower back started hurting. 

I warned up with 40kg for 5 then 60 for 5. Really whacked me out and even an empty bar felt heavy (before I did my warm ups) 

Back still hurts a little now. I've gone weeks without any issues and had PTs check my form etc. the only difference being today I did my workout in the morning and I normally do it in the evening.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Really really bad session today. Major struggle lifting 100kg this week in the deadlift. I hammered it last time. Without any worry of not getting it. I managed 5,4,3 and gave up as my lower back started hurting.
> 
> I warned up with 40kg for 5 then 60 for 5. Really whacked me out and even an empty bar felt heavy (before I did my warm ups)
> 
> Back still hurts a little now. I've gone weeks without any issues and had PTs check my form etc. the only difference being today I did my workout in the morning and I normally do it in the evening.


Bad workouts happen mate. However at your level, the above back issues are either a genuine medical problem or incorrect lifting technique.
Go over the daedlift videos from ElitFTS on YouTube. They are linked in this thread.:thumb:
P.s 
PTs are not always right. If the pts definition of good technique differs from ElitFts vids I would go with Elitfts everytime. Look for " so you think you can deadlift" on YouTube. I think its in 9 parts.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x5, 55x5, 63x6 PM 75.5kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+15x10
Neutral Chins: 10x3
Pendlay Rows: 67.5x10,7,7

First time i have missed a SP weight in like 6 months, the 1kg a month has been working so well for me but I knew a stall was coming soon as I have been really grinding my last rep most weeks so I will stick with this weight next month and dominate it then start the 1kg per month again.

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) 90x3, 102.5x3, 115x8 PM 145.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 62.5x8, 72.5x8, 82.5x6
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

This was the hardest bench press have been in ages. Normally my form is pretty dam good on bench but for some reason tonight the bar just wanted to head straight for my head as soon as i unracked it and my wrists were bending backwards towards my face as well which is the first time I have encountered this problem. All i can think is that i played golf for the first time in over 6 months yesterday and my upper back and forarms are sore and tight which changed my form slightly. Still grinded through all my reps through but i really dont like grinding reps as this is when I seem to get shoulder pain.

Glad to get Incline, nothing spectacular but at least it is improving every single month.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 2 session 9 (yesterday)
Shoulder press (WU 40x5, 50x3, 50x3 ) 
WO - 52.5x5, 60x3, 65x7
Really happy with 7 at 65!
Shoulder press - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x21
Upright row - 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10, 35x10 
Definitely could've done more on the final set but thought I wouldn't smash myself into oblivion on the first workout of the week!


----------



## Bokers

Power cleans
20, 40, 60kg x 3 x 3

HG Dealifts
60, 100, 130, 160kg x 4
170kg x 3, 3, 3, 2, 2, 1. Had to use straps here, my thumb was going numb/hot so I couldn't grip properly. Straps aren't something I advocate but I didn't want to flake out!

SLDL
100kg x 5 x 3

Bench Press
50, 70, 80kg x 5
90kg x 5 x 3
Back to EFS videos... Not overly happy.

Incline DB
20kg x 12 x 3

I've setup my training now and will start following it from this week along with improved nutrition. Hopefully better things to come.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x5 PM 178kg
Back Off Sets: 120x4,4,4
Deadlifts: 100x7,6,6,5,5

Glad to get another squat workout under my belt. Im actually just getting my heavy sets out of the way now but then really concentrating on 110% effort and acceleration on my back off sets. And they are great for form and confidence. Keeps me on target to hit a PR in April.

Disappointed with Deadlifts, did 5x6 last week but only managed 1 set of 7 reps this week. I could complete 10 reps easily with a mixed grip but my forearms gets such a hugh pump doing double overhand so I need to keep up the work and strengthen my grip.

Also may have to change some of my exercises as I have to do everything in the rack now as my Quad Bike is now in the garage :devil:


----------



## Bokers

Snatch
20, 30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats
60, 100, 110kg x 5 Too big a jump here. Lesson learned.
120kg x 4, 3
130kg x 2, 1
Filmed the heavier sets and form is not too bad but I'm falling forward at the bottom so I'm making some changes.

Front squats
60kg x 8 x 3

Bench Press: Just adjusting form here after some EFS viewing.
20, 50, 70, 80, 90kg x 5.
Much better. Think I have it now, well better than before.

Curls for the girls.
30kg x 8 x 4

Form needs work on the big four for sure I think. Going to back off and work on it for a bit.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 55x3, 62.5x3, 70.5x1!!!!
Dips: BWx8, BW+15x8, BW+30x6
Neutral Chins: 

Ok so worst workout Ive had in 6 months, even my warm ups felt really heavy and everything just felt off. I presume this was because I deadlifted the day before without a day between like usual and your upper back has a lot to do with SP stability. BUT! just opened my workout sheet again to update this thread and I was trying to do next weeks weights, I nearly did this with Dips as well. So I should have been doing 66.5 not 70.5, oops. Need to learn to read my sheet correctly.


----------



## Guitarjon

Had to postpone work out. A problem with my foot has come back leaving me unable to walk. I've been to the doctors 3 times about it in the past each time sending me a blood test as they suspect gout. The last time they came up with my body not processing enough vitamin d so put me on vitamin d tablets. Hasn't stopped this though. Every so often my foot, tendons and ankles just swell leaving me in a lot of pain leaving me unable to even use the clutch I the car.

Gutted. I've had almost a full week off at the moment and it doesn't feel much better.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 95x5, 107.5x3, 120x6 PM 144kg
Incline Bench Press: 70x5, 77.5x5, 87.5x5
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Ok so I was actually aiming for 7 reps on bench press and this should have been easily achievable considering I have hit 120x6 twice before. But i dont think this was a strength problem, it was a technique problem. Lately i feel like the bar is rolling my wrists back towards my face, never had this before so on the last set (stupid time to try new things) I move the bar further down my hand, this obviously completely threw me out of my groove and I missed the 7th rep. Still think the strength is there though.

Going to stick at this bench weight for a couple of months and just concentrate on absolutely dominating the weight with no pauses between reps or anything. Seems that I make better progress when I dont grind anything. Actually scrap that, Im only 2 months away from hitting a 150kg predicted max and wanted this for ages so Im going to hit this and then concentrate on making it easy and fast.

Hit a PR on incline press so cant be doing to badly.


----------



## Bokers

Power cleans
20, 30, 40, 50kg x 3

Deadlifts
60, 80, 100, 110, 120kg x 5
140kg x 7
90kg x 10
100kg x 8
110kg x 6

Reverse crunches, dragon flags, chops and rotations.

Just seeing what's what and setting up my 5/3/1 cycle.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 108KGX5 - 122KGX5

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 85KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Very happy, the 122kg went up 5 times this cycle :thumb:

I'm also going to be experimenting with varied weights on my assistance sets so I can build more muscle mass and hopefully this will carryover to my work sets.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 127.5x5, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
Back Off Sets: 127.5x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,6,5,5

Just a nice feeling to get all my big plates on the bar at last. I used to be a big believer that if your not working at 100% of your ability its a total waste of time but I feel like these back off sets work really well.

Got another rep on Deadlifts overall so at least its progress. Its still weird that deadlifts feel better after squats than they do normally. I must take my legs out of them and use my glutes more or something. Even the setup feels better.


----------



## Guitarjon

Well, been to the doctors a couple of times in the last week. 

Seems I have achilles tendenitus or how ever you spell it. The doctor said this is usually from overuse. 

The first doctor mentioned steroid injections ( I have other pains in my feet too but this new one is the tendon at the back of my foot/ankle. The second doctor said to hold off on the injections as it can weaken the tendon and if I'm active can make it tear over time. He's given me naproxen to reduce the swelling which is really helping - the ibruprophen wasn't touching it. 

He said to try and stick to upper body exercises and stay clear of running until its sorted. 

I've missed working out for the last week but feel like I'm on my way to recovery. Would you guys say squatting will strain the achillies? I'm guessing it would as you sort of push up through your heel. 

I don't know whether to just stick to the bike and a few upper body machines for a little while as I don't want to cause any more damage. 

Not sure if the tendon has been damaged through lifting or from running. My guess is running but I did start getting the pain the day after a really bad deadlift day.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Well, been to the doctors a couple of times in the last week.
> 
> Seems I have achilles tendenitus or how ever you spell it. The doctor said this is usually from overuse.
> 
> The first doctor mentioned steroid injections ( I have other pains in my feet too but this new one is the tendon at the back of my foot/ankle. The second doctor said to hold off on the injections as it can weaken the tendon and if I'm active can make it tear over time. He's given me naproxen to reduce the swelling which is really helping - the ibruprophen wasn't touching it.
> 
> He said to try and stick to upper body exercises and stay clear of running until its sorted.
> 
> I've missed working out for the last week but feel like I'm on my way to recovery. Would you guys say squatting will strain the achillies? I'm guessing it would as you sort of push up through your heel.
> 
> I don't know whether to just stick to the bike and a few upper body machines for a little while as I don't want to cause any more damage.
> 
> Not sure if the tendon has been damaged through lifting or from running. My guess is running but I did start getting the pain the day after a really bad deadlift day.


My experience of GPs in regarding injuries: They are years out of date.

When I tore my hamstring they told me to just rest for weeks :doublesho This as we know is totally wrong and will inevitably end in re injury and scar tissue.

However I do not know your history, so I would search for your issues on the Elitfts site, they have extensive info regarding injuries/recovery and in the words of the mighty Dave Tate "I've seen people come back from everything!"

I would most certainly say stop the running (Running is evil!) 

Also research RICE (Rest Ice Compression Elevation) method, see if its appropriate for you injury. Unfortunately tendons have far less blood flow in them and that is why they are more difficult to rehabilitate.

Possibly a visit to a sports physio may help you in your search for rehab info/advice :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 127KGX5 - 146KGX5 - 166KGX5

SQUAT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Note to self, powerlifting with a blazing headache is bloody stupid!!!!! :devil: :wall:

Headache sort of got in the way and two of the 166x5 reps were not positive enough, the touch on the box was so slight. I'll re do this cycle next month to ensure im 100% happy with it :thumb:

Apart from that upping my assistance squats to 5 sets of 10 reps at 110kg was bloody awesome, really felt worked, almost broken lol! :devil:

Hate the weights and lift on BIATCHES!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

I'm with Doug that Doctors are years out of date on sports injuries, they havent diagnosed 1 of my injuries correctly yet and definitely havent given me a decent recovery protocol.

After dislocating my ankle I was back deadlifting after a week and a half. This sounds mental but any sideways movement or walking hurt like hell but straight down pressure didnt so deadlifts were fine. I think you just have to listen to your body in situations like this and what ever you do, dont let them inject something into a joint, this cures the symptoms (what all doctors seem to do) not the problem and will therefore just get worse in the future.

I dont know your background but first thoughts are to drop the running as its a repetition injury. 

As Doug said try the RICE principle, amazing what a little ice can do after exercise. i got those pop the bag inside a bag ice bags which are instant, used to ice my shoulder after every rugby game and workout.

Nice workout Doug, this makes me think that I really need to concentrate on increasing my BBB squat weight as Im nowhere near you on those. How long do you leave between your BBB sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice workout Doug, this makes me think that I really need to concentrate on increasing my BBB squat weight as Im nowhere near you on those. How long do you leave between your BBB sets.


Cheers James :thumb:

It felt good, not heavy but more gruelling. I use my iPod to time all my rest periods and take 3-3.5 minutes rest between assistance work sets. :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Cycle 1, Week 1.

Bench Press
20, 40, 60, 70kg x 5
75kg x 12
50kgx10
55kgx8
60kgx6

Incline DB
10, 15, 20, 25kg x 12

Cable pushdowns
Stack-5 5x5

DB Rows
25kg x 12 x 3

Pushed for time. Good though.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers James :thumb:
> 
> It felt good, not heavy but more gruelling. I use my iPod to time all my rest periods and take 3-3.5 minutes rest between assistance work sets. :thumb:


Ah see slightly different approach, i use 90 second rest to promote muscle growth after my heavy sets.

Bokers, pet peeve of mine seeing Rugby players train arms, no one was allowed to train arms in the team i coached unless you had hit certain xBW lifts then your experienced enough to make your own decision, until then they were banned :thumb:. I dont think arms should be trained at all unless your a bodybuilder but if your "pushed for time" at least get your big exercises in and then if you really really have to then train arms when you have the time. Your back in rugby is far more important in rugby and a million times more important in the scrum. If you hit slightly wrong and cave, you can fight your way back up using back strength, nothing you can do with your arms in that situation to help.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ah see slightly different approach, i use 90 second rest to promote muscle growth after my heavy sets.
> .


Ive tried many different rest periods between sets over the years from high intensity, the only rest is the time it takes to get to the next exercise ( a matter of seconds) to 10 minutes. I found that around 3-3.5 minutes allows you to recover, lift heavier and therefore promote more growth. I could squat 100kg for 5 sets of 10 with 30 seconds rest between sets, but its so light it wont bring results. I think by limiting the rest period to 90 seconds restricts you to lift too light and it becomes just fitness. And boring


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ah see slightly different approach, i use 90 second rest to promote muscle growth after my heavy sets.
> 
> Bokers, pet peeve of mine seeing Rugby players train arms, no one was allowed to train arms in the team i coached unless you had hit certain xBW lifts then your experienced enough to make your own decision, until then they were banned :thumb:. I dont think arms should be trained at all unless your a bodybuilder but if your "pushed for time" at least get your big exercises in and then if you really really have to then train arms when you have the time. Your back in rugby is far more important in rugby and a million times more important in the scrum. If you hit slightly wrong and cave, you can fight your way back up using back strength, nothing you can do with your arms in that situation to help.


Talking of things banned. You won't find dumbbells in my house


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 56KGX5 - 65KGX5 - 73KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 55KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, the last set 73kgx5 felt well within my capabilities, hopefully ill be able to get past next cycles weights (previously failed).

went up to 55kg for 5 sets of 10 reps also felt good, only the last rep on the last set was medium difficulty :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 137.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5 - 182.5KGX5

DEADLIFT 120KGx10x10x10x10x10*

As planned, I'm just adding 2.5kg per cycle to all my Deadlift work sets and 5kg to my 1 rep work set on week 3 until it reaches 230kgx1 :thumb:

Moved the deadlift assistance weight up to 120kg for 5 sets of 10, didn't feel too heavy at this rep range which I thought it would 
I also left the other assistance work out this session as I'm not too sure how much of an impact going heavier on the assistance sets will hit my overall recovery.

Not too sure if anyone knows but in anyone's opinion would doing 5 of 10 reps with 150kg make that much difference to recovery as opposed to 5 sets 10 reps of 120kg?

Now for some cardio - Vacuum and wash the car, cut the grass and wash the windows of my bungalow :lol: 

Weights hated, day off tomorrow :wave:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Not too sure if anyone knows but in anyone's opinion would doing 5 of 10 reps with 150kg make that much difference to recovery as opposed to 5 sets 10 reps of 120kg?


I would think so Doug. 
120x50 reps = 6,000kg
150x50 reps = 7,500kg

25% increase in total tonnage in that workout. I would think 25% more of anything will affect your recovery. But weights are about trial and error so maybe give it ago. But if your program is working at the moment, I dont see the point in changing it.


----------



## Guitarjon

2 weeks rest and the foot is perhaps 90% fit now. Going to go and have a light session in the gym on Tuesday. I might be a whimp and stick to machines and upper body until its 100% back. 

Truth be told my back isn't feeling great either.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> 2 weeks rest and the foot is perhaps 90% fit now. Going to go and have a light session in the gym on Tuesday. I might be a whimp and stick to machines and upper body until its 100% back.
> 
> Truth be told my back isn't feeling great either.


I would definitely go and see a sports physio. Research your issues while your not training and get yourself preped :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I would think so Doug.
> 120x50 reps = 6,000kg
> 150x50 reps = 7,500kg
> 
> 25% increase in total tonnage in that workout. I would think 25% more of anything will affect your recovery. But weights are about trial and error so maybe give it ago. But if your program is working at the moment, I dont see the point in changing it.


Lol thanks James, didn't really look at it in those terms. I think ill stick to 120kg for a few months. 25% is too big a jump.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101KGX3 - 115KGX3 - 129KGX3

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 85KGx10x10x10x10x10*

About time, glad the 129kg went up for 3 this time, ironically the first rep went up that quick I nearly pushed the bar too far forward and almost had to lower it back on the safety bars :doublesho

I'm not sure if I've mentioned this; Dead barbell row technique.

I treat the DBR as a powerlift, so when pulling the weight off the floor and to my stomach area I breath in, hold my breath/tighten my core, lift. I then lower to the floor and exhale as the weight is placed back on the floor. This technique will help keep your back safe and I have noticed this technique makes the weight feel lighter. As with all powerlifting a tight core does help in the overall lifting and how it feels. Use this breathing technique combined with the dead weight technique and I think you'll be surprised how good it feels :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 136.5KGX3 - 156KGX3 - 175.5KGX3

SQUAT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Squat heaviest work sets getting difficult now :thumb:

Staying with the 110kg for the 5 sets of 10 until it becomes too easy :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*OVERHEAD PRESS ( WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 60KGX3 - :wall:64KGX3 loaded the bar incorrectly  - 69KGX3 - 78KGX3

OVERHEAD PRESS 57.5KGx10x10x9x8x7*

Considering i loaded the bar with the wrong weight all things went well :thumb:

Have increased my assistnace OHP to 57.5kg, felt good not to make my reps at the end, this will give me something to aim for and hopefully add extra strenght to my OHP :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 147.5KGX3 - 167.5KGX3 - 192.5KGX3

DEADLIFT 120KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL SHRUG 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout the last work set 192.5 went up easy enough for 3 :thumb:
The 120 5x10 assistance work felt good to not too hard but felt a good weight to get some volume in.


----------



## Bod42

Still here just had a week off for the deload.

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 65x577.5x3) WO 85x5, 97.5x5, 110x10 PM 146.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 52.5x10, 62.5x10, 72.5x11
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Good workout, my hand angle felt a lot better this week than the 120x7 I missed. I wasnt sure to increase the weight or not after missing 120x7 but made the right choice increasing it as it was a technique miss not a strength miss.

Pleased to get my incline as well. Really starting to like this exercise and its tempting to do a run with this as my main exercise.


----------



## Bokers

Changed jobs so not much access until now.

Run all four Wendler sessions now, know which weights I need to change and start ploughing through it.

Rugby finishes this weekend so time for four days a week at the (office) gym.

Now walking to work 45 mins each way 3-4 times a week which is helping.

Some logging for the last couple of weeks...

Deadlifts
105, 120kg x 5
140kg x 8
90kg x 10
100kg x 8
110kg x 6

Press	
35kg, 40kg x 5
45kg x 8
30kg x 10
35kg x 8
37.5kg x 6

Bench
60, 70kg x 5
75kg x 10
50kg x 10
55kg x 8
60kg x 6

Squat
80, 90kg x 5
105kg x 8
70kg x 10
77.5kg x 8
85kg x 6
60, 80, 100, 120kg x 5

Front Squats
50, 60, 70kg x 8 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x3) WO 115x5, 132.5x5, 150x5 PM 175kg
Back Off Sets: 115x5,5,5

This may look like an OK workout but I was actually aiming for 7 reps on squats. I had the strength but didnt have my head on right tonight. I got forward on my toes on the 5th rep which meant I goodmorning the bar out of the hole, got the rep but used a lot of strength and kind of talked myself out of it right there. Useless. Still did my back off sets so at least got some work in.

I feel like Im failing everything at the moment, have failed squats last night, shoulder press the 2 weeks previous and Bench last week. Thats a lot of failure. Im not going to deload though, Im going to just try and increase my reps 1 rep per week unitl I hot my goals. This is probably my only criticism of 5/3/1 that I have missed my weight but I have to wait another month until I can have another crack at it. On a normal program it would only be 1 week max. I cant complain to much as I am approaching my heaviest ever free squat.


----------



## Guitarjon

I'm back on it after having a 3 week rest period. 

Just curious to what people warm up with as the weights get higher?

Tonight I dropped back a little after having had a break due to an Achilles issue. 

Squats
Warm up 5 on empty bar (20kg) x5 40kg x5 50x 5. 
Then I did 70kg 5x5

Chest press
Warm up empty bar x5 30kg x 5. 
Then my set were 60 5x5. But I failed on the last set as I did 4. I actually did the final rep on the last set but I got the messed up and had to reset. 

Barbell row
warm up was 15kg. X5
Then straight into 45kg


Hamstring is very tight and I known I'm gonna struggle with the stairs tomorrow... 

By the way I think the achillies problem came from the uphill running, this is what the doc thought as apposed to the weight lifting. Needless to say I didn't have any pain tonight just doing the weights.


----------



## Bod42

The (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x3) in mine and Dougs posts are the warm ups we do. It is 40%x5, 50%x5, 60%x3

But then the 5/3/1 workout is easier for the first 2 sets but for 5x5 I usually do 50%x5, 70%x3, 90%x1 of work weight. But lately I have been using over warm ups with certain people and they seem pretty good. So for 5x5 I would do 5/3/1 again but 50%,80%, 110%. This gives you an easy 1 rep set but when you go back to your work weight it will feel surprisingly light in your hands/on your shoulders.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108KGX5 - 122KGX3 - 136.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 85KGx10x10x10x10x10*

The 136.5Kg went up really well , I lowered bar slowly, took a brief pause at the bottom and lift! :thumb: It didn't feel as heavy as I was expecting, which is also good 

The live Olympic weightlifting on Eurosport was good tonight, don't forget its the women's 75kg class tomorrow....Lidia valentin! :argie::argie: http://sweatforit.com/wp-content/up...-spanish-olympic-weightlifter-sweatforit2.jpg


----------



## Guitarjon

Ouch, aching today. 

Legs from those squats. Heaviest I've squatted. They still felt suprisingly easy so I must be a bit off my max yet but I knew I'd worked them yesterday. 

Do larger framed guys (17/18 stone) tend to have a higher maximum as they carry more weight or does it soley depend on genetics?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Ouch, aching today.
> 
> Legs from those squats. Heaviest I've squatted. They still felt suprisingly easy so I must be a bit off my max yet but I knew I'd worked them yesterday.
> 
> Do larger framed guys (17/18 stone) tend to have a higher maximum as they carry more weight or does it soley depend on genetics?


IMHO a lot of strength has to do with your mind set.

I also think there are many ways to achieve strength goals, it depends on your approach, your height, your bone structure and its ability to hold muscle (Bigger bones have the ability to hold more muscle naturally than slim build slighter boned humans etc..).

I use a mix of strength reps 1-5 and assistance reps 10, I will get strong because of the 1-5 rep range a bigger because of the 10 rep work. Most powerlifters want it all  to be Big and strong.

I'm 17 stone 3 pounds 5'11", I have a large bone structure which will help me build more muscle naturally, but don't think its the only thing that helps me lift heavier. I love the sport, I have determination, discipline and passion for the challenge it brings to my life. All these aspects and many more about powerlifting help motivate me to succeed. I am 45 years old and getting stronger.

Go back to the beginning of this thread, we all started training with light weights about two years ago. It takes time mate, dedicate yourself for 2-3 years then don't stop! :thumb:

If you think squatting 70kg for 5x5 is close to your limit, YOU are limiting your own potential and in my own experience that's the only factor that limits potential (apart from a genuine medical condition, but muscle, tendon, joint and bone injuries can be repaired, I've torn my hamstring twice and it put me back over 12 months on my training, but I still trained :thumb

If you choose to be weak you will be weak, if you choose to be strong you will be strong, simple rhetoric, but very true in this game :thumb:

Worth you looking up "powerlifting motivation" The best vids are here http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl-EuMx24lzHV5e9ksdmQrg

Enjoy :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Guitarjon said:


> Do larger framed guys (17/18 stone) tend to have a higher maximum as they carry more weight or does it soley depend on genetics?


Check out page 210, http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=3732529&highlight=Lamar+Gant#post3732529


----------



## Guitarjon

I'm quite happy I'm not near my limit just yet. Don't worry. I know with hard work I'll continue to lift heavier. 

I get those daily emails from Mehdi. He often talks about him being a smaller framed guy and he is currently working at around 180kg max squat. Then you get bigger built guys who can lift 3 times as much.


----------



## Guitarjon

Bod42 said:


> Check out page 210, http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=3732529&highlight=Lamar+Gant#post3732529


Thanks for that, and the heads up on the pictures on and near that page lol


----------



## Bokers

Deadlifts
50, 90, 110, 130kg x 5
145kg x 6
100kg x 8
105kg x 7
115kg x 6

Short on time. Job done. More tweaks needed.


----------



## Starbuck88

Hey Guys,

New guy to the SL5x5 here  You are going to see some serious weak stats here but here it goes...I have a progress thread started on myprotein forum.

Tuesday I did...

Squat 5 x 5 at 10KG - Started struggling on the last set in the muscles at the back top of my leg.
Benchpress 5 x 5 at 10KG - Could have gone heavier but finding it difficult with no proper bench, I just have a barbell and the disc weights to put on it.
Barbell Row 5 x 5 at 20KG - This felt like a proper workout, could feel it in my back, my abs, my arms etc.

Pathetic numbers compared to all you guys but that was the first first session, so after this week I get to start adding weight.

So My Stats:

Age 25
Weight 63KG - 139lbs
Height 5' 11"

BMR - 1656.87

Daily Calorie 1656.87 x 1.375 = 2278.20


----------



## Leebo310

Mate don't worry about thinking you're weak, it's not about where you start it's where you finish! 
You'll see some real good improvements soon enough, just stick with it!
What equipment do you have by the way? Am I reading it right that you don't have anything to balance the barbell on like a rack or stands?


----------



## Starbuck88

Leebo310 said:


> Mate don't worry about thinking you're weak, it's not about where you start it's where you finish!
> You'll see some real good improvements soon enough, just stick with it!
> What equipment do you have by the way? Am I reading it right that you don't have anything to balance the barbell on like a rack or stands?


All I have is a barbell with 50kg worth of weights, it's just a cheap pro power set from Argos , when I hit the limit on these i'll join a Gym as I don't have the room for a rack or bench in my apartment.

Not sure how long it's gonna take to get to the 50kg though on squats and overhead presses etc, I reckon id be able to do dead lifts with that now...

Am doing the 2nd now so have added 2.5kg to the bar....


----------



## PolishMyPipe

In the build up to my most recent MMA bout I decided to do more strength and conditioning training so employed the assurance of Jack Lovett at Spartan Performance in Consett. 

When I started I thought I could lift big but it's amazing what you can do when you start from scratch learn the proper techniques then slowly build up the weight. 

By the end I was 
squatting 210kg (back squat) 
Squatting 120kg (front squat)
Bench press 125kg
Trap dead lift 185kg
Dead lift 200kg 

All these are 1 rep max lifts. At fight weight I was 84kg


----------



## Leebo310

PolishMyPipe said:


> In the build up to my most recent MMA bout I decided to do more strength and conditioning training so employed the assurance of Jack Lovett at Spartan Performance in Consett.
> 
> When I started I thought I could lift big but it's amazing what you can do when you start from scratch learn the proper techniques then slowly build up the weight.
> 
> By the end I was
> squatting 210kg (back squat)
> Squatting 120kg (front squat)
> Bench press 125kg
> Trap dead lift 185kg
> Dead lift 200kg
> 
> All these are 1 rep max lifts. At fight weight I was 84kg


Decent weights mate!
How did you do in your bout?!


----------



## Leebo310

asonda said:


> All I have is a barbell with 50kg worth of weights, it's just a cheap pro power set from Argos , when I hit the limit on these i'll join a Gym as I don't have the room for a rack or bench in my apartment.
> 
> Not sure how long it's gonna take to get to the 50kg though on squats and overhead presses etc, I reckon id be able to do dead lifts with that now...
> 
> Am doing the 2nd now so have added 2.5kg to the bar....


You're probably going to need to join a gym before then mate as unless you can get someone to hand you the bar when you're lying on the bench, it's going to be incredibly hard (actually almost impossible! ) to get 50kg barbell into position on your own! 
Same with the squats. You'll find that you can squat 50kg pretty quickly but the problem will be getting the bar up and back down!


----------



## Guitarjon

Oh my god. Legs feel like lead weights! Second day back at it after my little recovery time. 

Hitting the reps with the squats but that extra 2.5kg felt much heavier today that on Tuesday. 

I did warm up empty bar x5, 40kgx5, 60kg x5 and then did 5x5 at 72.5kg.

OHP warm up with empty bar x5, 25kg x 5 and worked at 30kg for 5x5. Really need to work on form on this one as I am hyper extending. Will check out YouTube before the next session.m

Deadlifts I went easy on today as I wanted to have a quick check on form and concentrate on correct movement as I think I may have hurt myself a little last time ( a really bad session a few weeks back where I could barely lift anywhere near what I normally could but I think this was partly to blame another injury) I ended up doing a measly 50kg for 5.

I have to say though, even though I only lifted 50kg on the deads I was mega tired after those squats.


----------



## PolishMyPipe

Leebo310 said:


> Decent weights mate!
> How did you do in your bout?!


I lost due to my own stupidity mate.

I was smashing my opponent who was 7 inches taller than me until I made Aussie mistake which he jumped upon.


----------



## Bod42

Welcome along Asonda, no ego's in here, everyone starts somewhere. Congrats on starting 5x5 :thumb:

I did a training session of MMA, real hardcore stuff. Loved it but didnt have that killer instinct to strike when we opponent was down. Awesome lifts at 84kg by the way. I really want to get my squat up to 220kg, 5 plates each side just looks and sounds cool. Ive lost my drive after finishing rugby, maybe I should take up something like MMA to give me that drive again, hhmmm.


----------



## Starbuck88

Thanks Guys, I appreciate the encouraging words. If I have to join the gym sooner...then I will  a couple of years ago I joined a gym and then due to work I just couldn't find the time as my day was already taken up so much.

I've always been a week skinny person so hopefully this will change all that  I just want to be fit, healthy and if better aesthetics come along as a bi-product, I'll be all for that, living 2 seconds from the beach 

So last night, was the second round of SL5x5.

Squat 5x5 12.5KG
Overhead Press 5x5 12.5KG
Deadlift 1x5 22.5 KG

How is it when I do this, it starts hurting not the following day but the day after. I thought you were supposed to get the aches and pains the day after?

So last night doing the Squats burned my quads like hell....


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Welcome along Asonda, no ego's in here, everyone starts somewhere. Congrats on starting 5x5 :thumb:


+1 welcome Asonda, and yes no ego's.

Well done on starting the 5x5, don't worry about how much your lifting, stick with it and you will get there mate :thumb:

Week 3 cycle 19 -5/3/1 (Done yesterday)

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 146KGX5 - 166KGX3 - 185KGX1

SQUAT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 155KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, the 185kgx1 was easy enough. I seem to do better at heavy singles than the rep work sets. Probably due to my form loosening as I rep out :wall:
Need to concentrate on next cycles 5 and 3 rep weeks to ensure I can move up in weight the following cycle as I'm only 15kg from that elusive 200kg squat. At that point I will then check my weight and aim for a 2 x body weight squat :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Oh my god. Legs feel like lead weights! Second day back at it after my little recovery time.
> 
> Hitting the reps with the squats but that extra 2.5kg felt much heavier today that on Tuesday.
> 
> I did warm up empty bar x5, 40kgx5, 60kg x5 and then did 5x5 at 72.5kg.
> 
> OHP warm up with empty bar x5, 25kg x 5 and worked at 30kg for 5x5. Really need to work on form on this one as I am hyper extending. Will check out YouTube before the next session.m
> 
> Deadlifts I went easy on today as I wanted to have a quick check on form and concentrate on correct movement as I think I may have hurt myself a little last time ( a really bad session a few weeks back where I could barely lift anywhere near what I normally could but I think this was partly to blame another injury) I ended up doing a measly 50kg for 5.
> 
> I have to say though, even though I only lifted 50kg on the deads I was mega tired after those squats.


Keep at it mate and you'll soon find your form :thumb:

If your feeling it a bit much there is nothing wrong with lowering the weights and start lighter and then build up :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

asonda said:


> How is it when I do this, it starts hurting not the following day but the day after. I thought you were supposed to get the aches and pains the day after?


Its called DOMS - delayed onset of muscle soreness. :thumb:


----------



## Starbuck88

ITHAQVA said:


> Its called DOMS - delayed onset of muscle soreness. :thumb:


Cheers, does this mean my body's slow to react? What does it show?


----------



## ITHAQVA

asonda said:


> Cheers, does this mean my body's slow to react? What does it show?


No mate completely normal :thumb: Just shows you've worked the muscles harder than normal. There are loads of theories about it.

I would just accept it as a normal part of working muscles hard


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 19 - 5/3/1

Yesterdays workout
*
OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 73.5KGX3 - 82KGX1

OVERHEAD PRESS 57.5KGx10x10x10x6x6*

Had to go out so rushed the workout hence only 6 reps on last two sets. The 57.5 is feeling much easier just after a few weeks on it bonus! :thumb:

Good workout overall, Pressing technique seems to have cleared up. Next cycle will be testing.

Weightlifting coverage on Eurosport has been great this last week :thumb:

Deadlifts later on :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 19 - 5/3/1


DEADLIFT (wu 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 177.5KGX3 - 205KGX1 

DEADLIFT 120KGX10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL SHRUG 80KGX10x10x10x10x10


Nice workout. 205 felt good, ill do the same weight next cycle then hope to move up to 210:thumb:

Tried some dynamic stretching after the workout and must admit I feel more recovered from the lifting than usual, more flexible and not so stiff. I'll do some more dynamic stretching every day next week if I notice a tangible improvement I'll make it a permanent part of my routine.


----------



## Guitarjon

I tend to be sore after 2 days too. Which sucks as it tends to be the next day in the gym. Wasn't as sore on the last session though.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I tend to be sore after 2 days too. Which sucks as it tends to be the next day in the gym. Wasn't as sore on the last session though.


On the days your sore, do 15 minutes dynamic stretching :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Haven't posted for a while but that doesn't mean I haven't been doing the workouts!
Currently up to cycle 3, session 2 and today's workout was my favourite -squats

WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3
WO 90x3, 105x3, 117.5x6
65x10, 65x10, 65x10, 65x10, 65x10, 

Calf raises
160x10, 180x10, 190x10, 200x10, 210x10 
After the last set I immediately then performed a drop set taking a 25kg plate off each side so then did 160x10, straight into 110x10, straight into 60x10


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x5, 55x5, 63x5 PM 73.5kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+15x11
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3

Just missing weights all over the place at the moment so a bit disappointing. I got 6 reps a month ago so very disappointing to get 5 reps this time. Ive stated before this is the only thing I dont like about 5/3/1 that I have to wait a month before I can try this weight again. Im missing weights all over the place lately and feeling like crap so may be time for a deload. Jim Wendler's words, 3 steps back, 5 steps forwards.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x5, 55x5, 63x5 PM 73.5kg
> Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+15x11
> Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3
> 
> Just missing weights all over the place at the moment so a bit disappointing. I got 6 reps a month ago so very disappointing to get 5 reps this time. Ive stated before this is the only thing I dont like about 5/3/1 that I have to wait a month before I can try this weight again. Im missing weights all over the place lately and feeling like crap so may be time for a deload. Jim Wendler's words, 3 steps back, 5 steps forwards.


James, Perhaps you should try just to make the prescribed reps and reducing the intensity on your work sets. I've tried various approaches to intensity over the years and found low intensity training produces the best strength and size gains :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Haven't posted for a while but that doesn't mean I haven't been doing the workouts!
> Currently up to cycle 3, session 2 and today's workout was my favourite -squats
> 
> WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3
> WO 90x3, 105x3, 117.5x6
> 65x10, 65x10, 65x10, 65x10, 65x10,
> 
> Calf raises
> 160x10, 180x10, 190x10, 200x10, 210x10
> After the last set I immediately then performed a drop set taking a 25kg plate off each side so then did 160x10, straight into 110x10, straight into 60x10


Nice to see someone training their calves, do you do them standing up Lee?


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice to see someone training their calves, do you do them standing up Lee?


It's one of my favourite exercises and something that I've overlooked in the past so am seeing good results now! 
Yep I do them standing on a smith machine. I stand on a couple of the little block things on the balls of my feet so my heels are off the floor and then do them that way.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> It's one of my favourite exercises and something that I've overlooked in the past so am seeing good results now!
> Yep I do them standing on a smith machine. I stand on a couple of the little block things on the balls of my feet so my heels are off the floor and then do them that way.


Its exactly how i used to do them when i had a machine, if your sticking to 10 rep sets i wouldn't bother going over 400 - 450kg

Build cows not Calves! :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Its exactly how i used to do them when i had a machine, if your sticking to 10 rep sets i wouldn't bother going over 400 - 450kg
> 
> Build cows not Calves! :thumb:


Haha, I like that saying! :thumb:

I'm generally sticking to 10 rep sets for the first 4, and then either going to fail on the last one or drop setting it. Either way I'm quite a way off 400kg yet though!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Haha, I like that saying! :thumb:
> 
> I'm generally sticking to 10 rep sets for the first 4, and then either going to fail on the last one or drop setting it. Either way I'm quite a way off 400kg yet though!


:thumb:

You say that now, but the Calf muscle is incredibly strong, work up to 400kg and the Cows will be yours :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 :doublesho 

As I've got a week off work next week I thought it would be a good idea to de load then, so this week I will do a re run of last weeks weights but with a slight difference. Increase the single rep sets and only do one set of assistance work :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108KGX5 - 122KGX3 - 140KGX1 :thumb:

DEAD BARBELL ROW 85KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Was surprised how well the 140 went up  Not that I'm complaining  I'm sort of kicking myself now and wish I went for 145kg :wall:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, Perhaps you should try just to make the prescribed reps and reducing the intensity on your work sets. I've tried various approaches to intensity over the years and found low intensity training produces the best strength and size gains :thumb:


Ive thought about doing just the prescribed reps and did give it a shot for a short while but I dont think the 1rep week does much. I think the upper body especially needs more reps. I think you can get away with it on BBB as you still get the volume on your BBB sets but I move straight to Dips.

It will just be because Im dieting and you always lose some strength while dieting.

What do you mean low intensity anyway as strictly speaking intensity is a % of your 1RM so lowering the reps would increase intensity.

Doug what do you do when you miss reps on 5/3/1. Say you get 4 reps instead of 5, would you just stick with that weight until you got the 5 reps and felt comfortable with it, then increase as you dont seem to deload a lot. Im fed up of deloading, every time I seem to get near a PR then I start to fail and deload.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ive thought about doing just the prescribed reps and did give it a shot for a short while but I dont think the 1rep week does much. I think the upper body especially needs more reps. I think you can get away with it on BBB as you still get the volume on your BBB sets but I move straight to Dips.
> 
> It will just be because Im dieting and you always lose some strength while dieting.
> 
> What do you mean low intensity anyway as strictly speaking intensity is a % of your 1RM so lowering the reps would increase intensity.
> 
> Doug what do you do when you miss reps on 5/3/1. Say you get 4 reps instead of 5, would you just stick with that weight until you got the 5 reps and felt comfortable with it, then increase as you dont seem to deload a lot. Im fed up of deloading, every time I seem to get near a PR then I start to fail and deload.


Hi James,
Intensity is determined by the difficuly or level of effort required to complete prescribed reps in your training sets. The % of you max lift is only used as a guide to get you started on the right percentage of your one rep max (basically you should be able to complete 5 sets of 6 reps quite comfortably at 80% of your one rep max). 
If you trained to positive failure on each set this would be considered "high intensity" and this means the last rep on each set was complete grinder to complete, the "effort" dictates whether a set is high intensity or not. The % of a weight has nothing to do with intensity.
You can go even higher with intensity - complete a set to total posative failure, do some assisted reps (someone helps you complete a few more positive reps) then go even further. Your spotter completes most of the positive part of the reps then you complete the negative part of the reps unassisted!

After a set like that youll truly understand "high intensity".

Imho high intensity hits the central nervous system/recovery so hard that you can loose strength and end up de loading often.
Low intensity - training 1-2 reps short of positive failure produces the most consistent strength and size results.

I train only to the prescribed reps. The more efficient your training the better the results. Put in the least effort required for your desired results (in the first 5/3/1 book Wendler mentions about training efficiency)

A for me not de loading much. I have no idea. I make sure im in bed lights out by 10pm (I average 8-9 hours sleep) I eat around 200 gm Protein a day and never train to positive failure. I train "low intensity".
Besides which I think a huge degree of strength is controlled by the mind. Its safer to work up to a weight, but I would imagine anyone can deadlift 200kg for one if their life depended on it.

If I have a stall I got back to the cycle were I completed all 3 weeks successfully and start again from there. Hope that helps mate.

The one rep week is a powerful tool. I know I can bench 140 with ease because of it. Im now looking to try 145 and 150. Dont underestimate it mate. You can use it to set new PR's.
:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Weight lifting makes me sleep like a baby. I often have sleep problems not been able to sleep at a reasonable time. I noticed when I started the exercise in general I started sleeping regulary and and usually around 10. When I had a couple of weeks rest my body started to adjust back to its old ways and sleeping became harder again. 

Its strange realising how much effort lifting weights has an effect on your mental, and physical, well being. 

Also, is it normal to want to yawn in the gym. I understand that yawning is essentially taking a deep breath to supply oxygen to the muscles. I know I breath when I should during the exercises.


----------



## Bokers

Bench Press
20, 50, 60kg x 8
70, 80kg x 5
85kg x 6
55kg x 10
65kg x 8
75kg x 6

Incline Press
15kg x 12 x 4

Dips
Banded x 3 x 4
Seated x 5 x 2
Cable stack x 5 x 2

BOR
50kg x 12 x 3

Need to improve the accessory work. Bench form is much better.


----------



## dan.j.sinclair

To improve bench press there are certain MUSTS'S. 
Feet flat so you can press down with the lift, as if trying to stand. 
Knees bent to that feet are high up your body whilst still flat on the floor. 
Shoulder blades pulled together throughout the lift. 
Breathe in when pushing up and out when lowering. 
3 seconds to lower bar, immediately push bar up with no rest as fast as possible, 1 second pause at the top then 3 seconds to lower the bar. 
Try these. There are other rules but these seem to be the ones that many miss out. 
Dan


----------



## Bokers

Thanks pal. Been using he EFS videos to help mostly.


----------



## dan.j.sinclair

Have a look at bodybuilding.com. Very good. That's where I get all my routines from. 
Dan


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 re run extra weight 

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 146KGX5 - 166KGX3 - 190KGX1 :thumb:

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Another re run of week 3 and another excellent result, the 190kg went up with relative ease  Marvellous! :thumb: And again I'm kicking myself for not going heavier, but safety is important :thumb:

Weights hated :devil: 1.5kg chicken eaten :doublesho I'm done for tonight


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Weight lifting makes me sleep like a baby. I often have sleep problems not been able to sleep at a reasonable time. I noticed when I started the exercise in general I started sleeping regulary and and usually around 10. When I had a couple of weeks rest my body started to adjust back to its old ways and sleeping became harder again.
> 
> Its strange realising how much effort lifting weights has an effect on your mental, and physical, well being.
> 
> Also, is it normal to want to yawn in the gym. I understand that yawning is essentially taking a deep breath to supply oxygen to the muscles. I know I breath when I should during the exercises.


It used to happen to me in the early stages of my training, ignore I mate, it should reduce as your lungs become more anaerobically efficient :thumb: :thumb:

Lift BIG, Breath DEEP! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

dan.j.sinclair said:


> To improve bench press there are certain MUSTS'S.
> Feet flat so you can press down with the lift, as if trying to stand.
> Knees bent to that feet are high up your body whilst still flat on the floor.
> Shoulder blades pulled together throughout the lift.
> Breathe in when pushing up and out when lowering.
> 3 seconds to lower bar, immediately push bar up with no rest as fast as possible, 1 second pause at the top then 3 seconds to lower the bar.
> Try these. There are other rules but these seem to be the ones that many miss out.
> Dan


Dan, I would check out "So you think you can bench" on YouTube, its produced by ElitFTS. 
I would also suggest to both bodybuilders and powerlifters to bench powerlifting style with the only adjustment that bodybuilders use a wider grip less weight/higher reps.
Personally I use a Powerlifting style with a narrow grip with just a slight arch in the back (just enough to keep the core tight).
As for breathing.
Not while in the lift
,you'll soften your core. Breath in hold tight lower the bar, exhale right at the top of the positive part of the lift, approx the last 3 inches. On a single rep lift, hold your breath all the way, keep the core tight, not only will you lift more but youll lift safer :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Snatch
20, 30kg x 3 x 3
40kg x 3

Squats
Been adjusting my form and grip width. Think I'm sorted for now.
20, 50, 70, 80, 90kg x 5
105kg x 5
120kg x 5. This was HARD. Then I checked my sheet... 3+ should have been 105 hahah. Good news.
70kg x 10
75kg x 8
82.5kg x 6

Calf Raises SS Fat Bar Curls
(12 x BW SS Bar) x 4

More adjustments needed.


----------



## Guitarjon

Just back from the gym. Squats felt easy. I actually took a video for you guys to critique but struggling with uploading it from the phone. Can't seem to upload it properly to Photobucket.

Squats warm up 20kgx5 40kgx5 60kgx5 
Then I did 75kg for 5x5
Felt pretty easy today and my legs still feel like they are alive. 

Chest press warm up 20kgx5 40kgx5
Work weight 62.5kg. 5,5,5,5,3 felt hard putting it up 2.5kg today. 

Barbell row warm up 20kgx5 45kgx5
Work weight 50kg 5x5


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Just back from the gym. Squats felt easy. I actually took a video for you guys to critique but struggling with uploading it from the phone. Can't seem to upload it properly to Photobucket.
> 
> Squats warm up 20kgx5 40kgx5 60kgx5
> Then I did 75kg for 5x5
> Felt pretty easy today and my legs still feel like they are alive.
> 
> *"Chest press" *warm up 20kgx5 40kgx5
> Work weight 62.5kg. 5,5,5,5,3 felt hard putting it up 2.5kg today.
> 
> Barbell row warm up 20kgx5 45kgx5
> Work weight 50kg 5x5


Jon,

I would keep going over the "So you think you can Squat" and "So you think you can bench press videos". Download Freestudio, you can then use it to download the videos from YouTube for easy viewing on your pc/phone/tablet.
I go back to them as soon as things get difficult, invariably its technique that fails you not strength :thumb:

I'm assuming that "Chest Press" is a barbell bench press?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Snatch
> 20, 30kg x 3 x 3
> 40kg x 3


That's one thing I would love to have the space and floor for, the Olympic lifts :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Re run.

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 65KGX5 - 73.5KGX3 - 85KGX1 :thumb:

OVERHEAD PRESS 55KGx10x10x10x10x10*

The 85x1 was about the ugliest rep i've ever done. As I pushed up my right arm went up further than my left by approx. 6" :tumbleweed: But I did make it 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 re run

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 157.5KGX5 - 177.5KGX3 - 205KGX1 Much Better! :thumb:

BARBELL SHRUG 90KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Kept the 1 rep weight the same due to not being happy with last attempts lockout, the 205 felt lighter this time and went up really well and I finished the lift correctly, stand erect chest up :thumb:

That's me done, next week de load


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James,
> Intensity is determined by the difficuly or level of effort required to complete prescribed reps in your training sets. The % of you max lift is only used as a guide to get you started on the right percentage of your one rep max (basically you should be able to complete 5 sets of 6 reps quite comfortably at 80% of your one rep max).
> If you trained to positive failure on each set this would be considered "high intensity" and this means the last rep on each set was complete grinder to complete, the "effort" dictates whether a set is high intensity or not. The % of a weight has nothing to do with intensity.
> You can go even higher with intensity - complete a set to total posative failure, do some assisted reps (someone helps you complete a few more positive reps) then go even further. Your spotter completes most of the positive part of the reps then you complete the negative part of the reps unassisted!
> 
> After a set like that youll truly understand "high intensity".
> 
> Imho high intensity hits the central nervous system/recovery so hard that you can loose strength and end up de loading often.
> Low intensity - training 1-2 reps short of positive failure produces the most consistent strength and size results.
> 
> I train only to the prescribed reps. The more efficient your training the better the results. Put in the least effort required for your desired results (in the first 5/3/1 book Wendler mentions about training efficiency)
> 
> A for me not de loading much. I have no idea. I make sure im in bed lights out by 10pm (I average 8-9 hours sleep) I eat around 200 gm Protein a day and never train to positive failure. I train "low intensity".
> Besides which I think a huge degree of strength is controlled by the mind. Its safer to work up to a weight, but I would imagine anyone can deadlift 200kg for one if their life depended on it.
> 
> If I have a stall I got back to the cycle were I completed all 3 weeks successfully and start again from there. Hope that helps mate.
> 
> The one rep week is a powerful tool. I know I can bench 140 with ease because of it. Im now looking to try 145 and 150. Dont underestimate it mate. You can use it to set new PR's.
> :thumb:


cheers Doug, every good lifter I seem to read talks about leaving 1 or 2 reps in the tank but then i find that I would never progress if I did that lol. But I do feel the best, in the best shape just after a deload, all my reps are fast and easy and I add weight really easy, its when Im grinding weights that the problems kick in. have you read Base Building by Paul Carter, I may give his methods a try and they seem to make sense and people are making great gains with them, its all about staying away from failure like you say and you only increase the weight when you feel comfortable with it. I just dont feel like I have made any progress on 5/3/1 but i think a lot of that is mental these days.

But I have seriously fallen off the wagon the last few weeks. I know Im dieting but my god, Ive gone totally flat, seem fatter and lost all my strength. Jesus Ive only lowered my carbs and calories slightly but always seems to kill me.

I missed Bench by 1 rep 2 weeks ago, 4 reps last night.
Squats I missed by 2 reps
SP I missed by 1 rep 3 weeks ago, 4 reps 2 weeks ago, 2 reps last week

Just missing weights left right and centre at the moment. But I have added fitness as well so maybe Im trying to hit to many goals at the same time. May just do the prescribed reps and concentrate on weight loss for 6 weeks, drop 6 kg and then go from there.


----------



## Guitarjon

ITHAQVA said:


> Jon,
> 
> I would keep going over the "So you think you can Squat" and "So you think you can bench press videos". Download Freestudio, you can then use it to download the videos from YouTube for easy viewing on your pc/phone/tablet.
> I go back to them as soon as things get difficult, invariably its technique that fails you not strength :thumb:
> 
> I'm assuming that "Chest Press" is a barbell bench press?


Yeah, it's the barbell version. I mean bench press.

Got a complement in the gym yesterday when a guy said good going on the squats. I was upto 77.5kg. He asked if I needed him a squat partner if I wanted to go heavier. He was Impressed I was getting parallel with good form which made me happy. I got my wife to take a video of me the other day so I could check myself.

I actually said I was progressing slowly to learn to do the weights myself as I wouldn't always have a partner. I told him how a friend spotted me on a bench press one day and how I felt it was easier than expected and the next bench press day I could barely lift it.

Always good to hear I'm doing something right as you see so much bad form in gyms. Mainly from teenagers giving it the big I am.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> cheers Doug, every good lifter I seem to read talks about leaving 1 or 2 reps in the tank but then i find that I would never progress if I did that lol. But I do feel the best, in the best shape just after a deload, all my reps are fast and easy and I add weight really easy, its when Im grinding weights that the problems kick in. have you read Base Building by Paul Carter, I may give his methods a try and they seem to make sense and people are making great gains with them, its all about staying away from failure like you say and you only increase the weight when you feel comfortable with it. I just dont feel like I have made any progress on 5/3/1 but i think a lot of that is mental these days.
> 
> But I have seriously fallen off the wagon the last few weeks. I know Im dieting but my god, Ive gone totally flat, seem fatter and lost all my strength. Jesus Ive only lowered my carbs and calories slightly but always seems to kill me.
> 
> I missed Bench by 1 rep 2 weeks ago, 4 reps last night.
> Squats I missed by 2 reps
> SP I missed by 1 rep 3 weeks ago, 4 reps 2 weeks ago, 2 reps last week
> 
> Just missing weights left right and centre at the moment. But I have added fitness as well so maybe Im trying to hit to many goals at the same time. May just do the prescribed reps and concentrate on weight loss for 6 weeks, drop 6 kg and then go from there.


Having looked at some of your workouts mate, am I right in assuming that you claim you missed reps when you don't make your own target not the prescribed weights?

Going back to the 24th your on the 5/3/1 week, why aim for 7 reps on 120kg when you only needed 1 rep? 
*Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 95x5, 107.5x3, 120x6 PM 144kg*
On the 18 you posted you missed a rep 
*Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 47.5x5, 55x5, 63x6 PM 75.5kg*
You only needed 5 reps.

In regards to the Overhead Press, expect many plateaus to come. It is the most technical lift due to its very execution (In the standing position there are many components you have to focus on, the whole body!). If you did it sitting 50% of the technical issues are removed (The lower body etc..) and your focus would be on the upper body technical aspects of the lift, when you do it standing the lift becomes a whole lot more technical (More chance of fail ). This is very obvious but like me every now and again you need to relearn, go back to basics :thumb:

I have found on the OHP that I'm better off lowering the bar to my chest, lifting my chest up tighten my core and pushing my chin into my chest (As thought your trying to make a double chin) this allows the bar to travel in a very straight line up rather than having to navigate past your face and back. 
*Please bare in mind this is ok for a straight OHP but not for Olympic lift training. I'm only concerned about lifting the weight an Olympic lifter has to use the traditional method due to the mechanics of the lift (Clean and Jerk)*

Also James, having tried lowering calories myself I would suggest you don't do this while your aiming for lift goals. If you remember recently I went through a few small plateaus, yes they were technical issues but I would also suspect the calorie deficit didn't help. I'm now basically eating what I need no more no less, its slow but I'm getting more muscular and heavier. 17 Stone 3 now, I'm expecting to be around 18 stone by the end of this year :doublesho

Powerlifting is an extreme sport mate, I think the simpler you can make it the better you'll progress, focus is crucial.

*One thing to point out, I've noticed my size/muscularity and strength has improved since upping the assistance weights and because my assistance weights are heavier I am having to concentrate on technique on them as well, IMHO the extra technical experience/carry over to work sets is very important. As long as I can recover and everything feels ok to do so I plan to go heavier soon :thumb:*

My suggestion to you:

1. Go back to a cycle you know you will make all the prescribed reps.
2. Do not do more than the prescribed reps.
3. Time your rest periods between work sets, I use 6.5-7 minutes.
4. Increase your assistance weights to a point were you can do 5 sets of 10 reps with 3-3.5 minutes rest between sets.
5. Simplify your workouts, if its a squat session do squat assistance, if its a deadlift session do deadlift assistance, bench press, bench press assistance. OHP, OHP assistance.
6. Eat the calories you need, if you wish to create a deficit do this 3 x a week

http://www.fitnessblender.com/v/wor...amp-Workout-Quick-Sweat-Bodyweight-Cardio/i4/ The only thing I miss out is the burpees, (What a stupid  name!! lol) I just do body squats.

7. You may have noticed I did week 3 twice. I wont do it often as I'm happy with my progress, but you could do this from time to time to motivate yourself, it doesn't matter if you miss the prescribed rep on the re run as you have already done it the week previously so no month wasted! :thumb: Use this week to inspire yourself!
8. Protein, I have found that it is my protein intake that dictates my energy levels (I do not eat many starchy carbs)

9. Drink a protein shake during your workout and plenty of water (I average 1.5 litres a workout, plus my shake = 2 litres of fluids!) :thumb:
10. After my workouts I have my main large meal of the day and a protein shake. 8:30 - cottage cheese every night I train.
11. Squat nights I eat a 1.5Kg chicken :thumb:
12. If you are having a busy day drink a big 500ml mug of green tea about an hour before your workout and another during your workout. Green tea has a more graceful caffeine spike plus its many health benefits.
13. Sleep! Even at your young age sleep is important mate, its not how many hours you sleep but the time you go to sleep that is really important.

There are many things that can effect our lifting mate, keep the complicated stuff (Above) for your non training but simplify the actual training. Save your focus for the lifting :thumb:

I hope there is something here that helps you regroup and get back on track mate. My progress at my age speaks for itself and I really do think my approach will suite you :thumb:

Hate those weights James!!! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Yeah, it's the barbell version. I mean bench press.
> 
> Got a complement in the gym yesterday when a guy said good going on the squats. I was upto 77.5kg. He asked if I needed him a squat partner if I wanted to go heavier. He was Impressed I was getting parallel with good form which made me happy. I got my wife to take a video of me the other day so I could check myself.
> 
> I actually said I was progressing slowly to learn to do the weights myself as I wouldn't always have a partner. I told him how a friend spotted me on a bench press one day and how I felt it was easier than expected and the next bench press day I could barely lift it.
> 
> Always good to hear I'm doing something right as you see so much bad form in gyms. Mainly from teenagers giving it the big I am.


Well done mate.

Regardless of what people say us guys do like being complimented, it helps us feel good about ourselves and inspires us to lift more!!!! :devil::thumb:

I find the biggest issue with the Squat is the fear it evokes when you go down parallel (will it crush me?????)  :doublesho:doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

De load Week 4

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

TRADITIONAL BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

UPRIGHT ROW 50KGx5x5*

Although the upright row is considered to many to be a bad exercise that increases the risk of injury to the shoulder area, I have never had issues after many years including it in my routines. But as a precaution in my older years  I will now only take the barbell to my lower chest area :thumb:

Now its time to eat a Chicken, then tonight home made Chilly with butter beans and Kidney beans...........PROTEIN!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

Doug thanks for the really in depth answer mate. The reason I go higher reps on Bench and SP is due to my shoulder, as soon as I start doing heavier weights then its starts to hurt so I just keep the reps higher which keeps the weight lighter. Im really happy with my Bench and SP progress, its just those god dam lower body movements.

I have kind of made up my own reps to aim for so instead of 5/3/1, I do 7,5,3 on all exercise except bench where I do 10,8,6.

Last nights workout
Squats: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 105x3) WO 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x1kg
Deadlifts: 100kgx7,7,7,5,5

So I would normally aim for 5 reps on this week but thought I would take Dougs advice and aim for just the minimum reps which should have been easy but I missed my goal and instead of 3 reps 1 got rep, thats 4 reps lower than the 5 I would normally aim for. Thats just mental.

Think Im just going to do the straight BBB workout. Opposite makes more sense to me as you are hitting each exercise twice a week and hitting slightly different muscles each week but I am just going to do the standard BBB.

Im making this way to complicated as usual. I just need to stay away from grinding reps, as soon as I start grinding reps to force to get a PR then I start to regress. I have thought this before so i just need to be more patient, if I grind and barely make weights on an exercise then i will stick with it until I am killing the weight.
. Kirk Karwoski and Ed Conan agree so who am I to argue. Like Doug said alway leave 1-2 reps in the Tank so if I havent got 1-2 left in the Tank then I will stick with the weight until I do. Going to train more by feel than set in stone now.


Extract from base Building
Grinding weights week after week
eventually is the main culprit for a lot of people to stall in progress. The fatigue curve gets too
steep and the super-compensation curve is negated. This is backed over and over and over
again by what we’ve seen from the Russian training philosophies and other training models
that take recovery and super-compensation into the equation. Kirk Karwoski, one of the greatest
power lifters of all time, told me “if you start grinding reps, something went wrong in how
you programmed your training.”
If you want to go argue with Kirk, be my guest. He only squatted a grand for a double in training,
benched just under 600 pounds, and pulled 777 in competition. The guy he finally listened
to about not grinding out every rep was Ed Coan, the greatest power lifter of all time. Ed reiterated
this theme at the seminar I did with him in Chicago. Which was, “set your training cycle
up so that you smash weights all the way through it. You should be building confidence every
week of the training cycle.”


----------



## Guitarjon

ITHAQVA said:


> Well done mate.
> 
> Regardless of what people say us guys do like being complimented, it helps us feel good about ourselves and inspires us to lift more!!!! :devil::thumb:
> 
> I find the biggest issue with the Squat is the fear it evokes when you go down parallel (will it crush me?????)  :doublesho:doublesho


I'm not too worried about failing miserably on the squats. I set those bars every time so I've always got a fall back. Always that bit of security when lifting alone. I'd hate to think I was doing the bench press alone in a basement gym somewhere though.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 30x5, 37.5x5, 45x3) WO 52.5x3, 60x3, 66.5x3 PM 73kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+15x8, BW+32.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3
Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5

Just went in the gym tonight and just played it as i went. I wanted 5 reps on this weight but Im already obviously struggling to recover so i have to pick my fights and ya I probably could have got the 4th rep but would have been a grinder so concentrated on getting the 3 reps real nice and fast, I'm going to stick with this weight and reps until the weight is flying up and easy and i feel like without a doubt I can increase weight without missing reps. 

This workout has completely changed my mindset on training lately. It is almost impossible to diet and hit PRs so just need to try and maintain my strength right now.


----------



## Bokers

Deadlifts
60, 100, 130, 160kg x 5
100kg x 10
110kg x 8
120kg x 6

OHP
20, 40, 50kg x 5
20, 30, 40kg x 8

That was me done.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Deadlifts
> 60, 100, 130, 160kg x 5
> 100kg x 10
> 110kg x 8
> 120kg x 6
> 
> OHP
> 20, 40, 50kg x 5
> 20, 30, 40kg x 8
> 
> That was me done.


Progressing really well Bokers, keep hating those weights mate :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 deeeeeeeeeeee load!

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Done


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 4, session 1 
OHP 
WU 30kgx5, 37.5kgx5, 45kgx3
WO 47.5kgx5, 55kgx5, 62.5kgx8

OHP 40kgx10x5

Pull ups 10x wide grip, 8x closed grip, 8x hammer grip


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x5 PM 178

Thats it, went in, ripped my reps nice and fast and got out as it was a saturday. Going to stick with this weight until I make it look stupidly easy.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 cycle 20 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 95KGX5 - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX4

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 82.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Made a bit of a mess of the 124.5kgx5:wall::wall:, I should have held the bar at the top of the 4th rep, inhaled, reset my core and went for it, but instead I lost concentration and exhaled far to early loosening my core and ballsing it up :wall: :lol: Technique, technique, TECHNIQUE!!!! 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 97.5x3, 110x3, 122.5x5 PM 143kg
Incline Bench Press: 70x5, 80x5, 90x5
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Pretty easy 5 reps. I am leaving some in the Tank and making sure I grind nothing. Im benching a decent weight now so will stick to this weight until I make it a no brainer that i will get my reps nice and fast.

Was going to say the same with Inclines but Im going to keep increasing the weight as I havent failed on these yet so will keep going until i fail. I still think Simplest Strength template is awesome assistance exercise protocol as it waves through the month getting heavier and increasing your Predicted max so your not always grinding weights out, just once per month are you going for a record.


----------



## Bokers

Saturday
Snatch
20, 30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats
50, 70, 90kg x 5
100kg x 3. Not cool.

Monday
Snatch
20, 30, 40, 45kg x 3 x 3

Squats
50, 70, 90, 100kg x 5
110, 120kg x 3
130kg x 2

I thought I was 10kg higher from 100kg... Silly me! Good none the less though


----------



## Bod42

Squats (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 125x5, 140x3, 160x2 PM 170.5kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,6,5

Good workout, didnt go for a rep record or anything, just did my reps nice and fast. Used the 5/3/1 portion as a warm up for my fast BOSs. Just going to stick with the BOSs until they are flying.


----------



## Bokers

Power clean + power jerk
20, 40, 50kg x 4 x 3

Bench Press
20, 60, 70kg x 5
80kg x 8
50kg x 10
55kg x 8
50kg x 6

Incline Press
17.5kg x 12 x 4

Cable Pushdowns
8 plates x 12 x 4

BOR
60kg x 8 x 4

Getting there.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week.....................3 :doublesho cycle 20 - 1 

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 146KGX5 - 166KGX3 - 195KGX1  :thumb:*

Its a busy month for me so I thought I'd mix it up a bit and do the 1 rep week 3 times, adding weight on every successful lift, bit of a mini max effort month :thumb:

The 195Kg went up ok, but it didn't go up fast  Was Full parallel though! :thumb:

200kg next week :doublesho And I am most definitely better squatting high bar, tried low bar for the 3 rep set and I felt off balance, you would have thought it would be the opposite, but hey ho


----------



## Guitarjon

I've been rubbish. Been very busy decorating the house in between working etc. I've not managed to make it to the gym for a week. I've worked out lifting shptuff but nothing like heavy weights. I've been very active etc. hope I haven't regressed too far. I was getting back Into the swing since my foot injury.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I've been rubbish. Been very busy decorating the house in between working etc. I've not managed to make it to the gym for a week. I've worked out lifting shptuff but nothing like heavy weights. I've been very active etc. hope I haven't regressed too far. I was getting back Into the swing since my foot injury.


It all depends on how much you want to succeed and the type of character you have.
Some people make time to train, some people make excuses not to train.

Ive now been powerlifting over two and a half years, a few cycles have been inconsistent but generally I lean to making time to train.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Mini max effort

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 67KGX5 - 75.5KGX3 - 84.5KGX1

OVERHEAD PRESS 57.5KGx10x10x10x10x7*

Huge improvement all round, the 84.5Kg went up nice and balanced :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 Mini max effort
> 
> *OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 67KGX5 - 75.5KGX3 - 84.5KGX1
> 
> OVERHEAD PRESS 57.5KGx10x10x10x10x7*
> 
> Huge improvement all round, the 84.5Kg wet up nice and balanced :thumb:


Awesome work on the OHP!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Awesome work on the OHP!


Thanks Jon, Its a very difficult lift to progress on due to the perceived light weights (Psychological), the smaller/weaker muscles involved and the technical difficulty due to carrying out the lift standing. Its a right pig basically 

Still have 15.5Kg to go :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Cycle 20 Mini max effort

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 210KGX1

DEADLIFT 125KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Awesome workout :thumb:

The first attempt I messed up and wasn't set right so lowered the bar at approximately 6" off the floor. I waited a few seconds, give myself stick  for being such a weak ass and went for a second attempt the 210Kg went up well and I locked out at the top :thumb:

Excellent track for the 125Kg assistance/speed work :thumb:






Really banging from 1:22 :devil: :thumb:

Time for the old man to rest now :tumbleweed:


----------



## Bod42

Did Shoulder Press and Deadlift last week but never posted. No PRs or anything just solid workouts.

This week
Bench Press (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 85x5, 97.5x5, 110x10 PM 146.5kg
Incline Press: 55x10, 65x10, 75x10
Pull Ups: 10x2

Easy workout as stayed with the same weight on Bench, will stick with it until I kill it.

Moved up again on Incline which Im pleased about but will make a call over the next 2 weeks if I will stick with this weights or not as starting to grind reps.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) 107.5x5, 125x5, 140x6 PM 168kg
Back Off Sets: 107.5x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,6,5

This workout was an eye opener for me, following Paul Carter's teachings. The 140kg for 6 reps was easy, there was never any doubt that I would miss it so it takes all the stress out of training. But dont think this was easy as Im putting 100% effort into every rep and trying to throw that weight through the ceiling so when I say easy, it was actually the most knackering workout Ive done in a long time. The back off sets felt like I was free squatting on the first few reps of each set and I actually think I got a few reps in there that were 100% perfect form, just felt awesome.

Grip is slowly strengthening for the BBB deadlifts. I brought some Fat Gripz the other day, down to 10 quid now and always wanted some. After trying them, I have a new found respect for anyone who does fat bar training, these things are insane. Im rowing 70kg for 9 reps at the moment, couldnt get the bar off the floor with the fat gripz, thats how much harder they make it.


----------



## Bokers

Some good workouts there pal 

I take it you mean Paul Carter's 'Lift Run Bang' not the Strongman competitor?
It's very good info, something I'm going to start doing too.

As far the fat gripz... Switch to DOH on your warmup and back off sets and then DOH hook grip to get your grip up as well as the Gripz. This helped me massively


----------



## Bod42

Bokers said:


> Some good workouts there pal
> 
> I take it you mean Paul Carter's 'Lift Run Bang' not the Strongman competitor?
> It's very good info, something I'm going to start doing too.
> 
> As far the fat gripz... Switch to DOH on your warmup and back off sets and then DOH hook grip to get your grip up as well as the Gripz. This helped me massively


Their Ok but my Bench should not be 20kg behind my squat. Considering Im a squatter and built for squatting, not sure why its so hard to put weight on my squats. Obviously my methods at the moment arent working so no harm in giving Paul Carter's method a try. It does seem to make sense and reading up on other RAW lifters they all seem to do the same.

Ya Lift Run Bang and all his books. Its just the mental aspect of training, I have spoken to a lot of the people I have trained and most of them are doing it as a hobby so their not that serious and they say after a long hard day where you cant be bothered to go to the gym, everyone knows those days, they would probably go if it was just bench or something but grinding squats every single workout like on 5x5 just isnt fun and puts you off. Ok Im all for grinding and hard work but I even find myself that i would never work out on a sat but lately I have been like lets go in rip these weights that you will 100% get as fast as possible and get out of the gym. Just makes the gym a lot easier. But anyone reading this, just because your using lighter weights does not make it easier as your putting 100% effort into moving that bar as fast as possible. i would never prescribe something like this to a beginner.

I do DOH on all warm ups, DOH on BBB sets but do mixed grip my work sets. Trying to think how to incorparate Fat Gripz into my training but I would lose so much weight it would be a joke. Maybe use them on my BBB sets or after those or something. Im just shocked at how much harder they make everything.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Last nights session.

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX3 - 140KGX1 *

Nice workout, technique a little sloppy. Will stay on 140 for next 3 week max cycle. If I can get up to 145 by the end of next cycle I will be very happy :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

James,

Does your grip actually fail on your work sets?


----------



## Bokers

I asked Andy Bolton on FB and he said: speed pulls as heavy as possible and fat grip holds.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Yes!!!!!!!!!!!*

Squat - Goal achieved :thumb:

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 146KGX5 - 166KGX3 - 200KGX1 *

My first 200Kg full Parallel squat!

The strange thing is the rep felt harder just below the mid point rather than at the lowest point as expected.

I plan to stay at 200kg and do 5/3/1 for that lift indefinitely only working on increasing weight on the squat assistant sets and standing calf raise. But vary the weights within the cycle, as James pointed out, the total tonnage is what really hits your recovery. that's why my sessions have started so late this week, I didn't feel recovered from last weeks deadlift session until Wednesday :doublesho

weights hated :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Nice work pal! Did you video it?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Nice work pal! Did you video it?


Cheers Bokers, I'll get a video done next cycle :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Awesome stuff Doug! Great achievement!! 
300kg the next goal then?!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Awesome stuff Doug! Great achievement!!
> 300kg the next goal then?!


Thanks Lee :thumb: 

Believe me mate, I'm so pleased I finally made the lift. I've been training for over 2 and half years, tore my hamstring twice and the first time I did make 200kg I found out I wasn't squatting parallel  I relied on the safety bars as my parallel point but unknown to me as the weight got heavier I actually started lowering my body/core not my legs to touch the bars :wall:

Now I use my little spotter box, every time I touch the box with my ass, I'm squatting parallel :thumb:

300kg!! :doublesho No going heavier, I will be working on lowering my squat depth though by gradually reducing my spotter box height :thumb:

Deadlift later :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Mini Max effort

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 210KGX1*

PR! :thumb:
Decided to stick to 210kg for today as last weeks deadlift wasn't as clean a lift as I wanted. Next cycle I'm aiming to add 5kg every time I'm 100% happy I've made a good lift - back as straight as possible and lockout at the top.

The 210kg felt much easier this time around as well. I put 230kg on the bar just to see what it looked like, such a beautiful sight! 

De load next week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Deload week :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice and light, took about 25 minutes.

:thumb:


----------



## chillly

ITHAQVA said:


> Deload week :thumb:
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5
> 
> BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10
> 
> BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*
> 
> Nice and light, took about 25 minutes.
> 
> :thumb:


Jesus Doug. Glad your still going strong mate:thumb: Are you sure you can still fit in the beamer bucket seat with all them mucles mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

chillly said:


> Jesus Doug. Glad your still going strong mate:thumb: Are you sure you can still fit in the beamer bucket seat with all them mucles mate :thumb:


They are a tad more snug than they were two and a half years ago Gary 

Did the software arrive mate?


----------



## Guitarjon

Good going Doug, I'm still going strong just haven't been on the forum that much lately.

Slightly annoyed myself the other day. I was reading an email sent from Mehendi about the barbell row. I'll be honest I didn't watch all of how how to video on the barbell row as it's something give done before. Then I read about someone complaining he wasn't touching his chest with the bar and I got thinking, well I never touch my chest with the bar either. 

So looks like on my next barbell row day (Thursday) I'm going to have re evaluate my barbell row. Maybe lower the weigh too.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James,
> 
> Does your grip actually fail on your work sets?


No they dont mate but you would be surprise how much having a stronger grip will help your lifts. I can do 6-8 chin ups easily be can only do tops 2 with fat gripz. Im still hanging on the bar so havent lost complete grip but cant do another chin up, this is obviously 100% due to grip strength. Weird aye.

Congrats on your 200kg squat Doug, your the man. For anyone who hasnt been here the start, Doug and I started about the same time and he has destroyed me with the progress he has made, keep it up Doug.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Good going Doug, I'm still going strong just haven't been on the forum that much lately.
> 
> Slightly annoyed myself the other day. I was reading an email sent from Mehendi about the barbell row. I'll be honest I didn't watch all of how how to video on the barbell row as it's something give done before. Then I read about someone complaining he wasn't touching his chest with the bar and I got thinking, well I never touch my chest with the bar either.
> 
> So looks like on my next barbell row day (Thursday) I'm going to have re evaluate my barbell row. Maybe lower the weigh too.





Bod42 said:


> No they dont mate but you would be surprise how much having a stronger grip will help your lifts. I can do 6-8 chin ups easily be can only do tops 2 with fat gripz. Im still hanging on the bar so havent lost complete grip but cant do another chin up, this is obviously 100% due to grip strength. Weird aye.
> 
> Congrats on your 200kg squat Doug, your the man. For anyone who hasnt been here the start, Doug and I started about the same time and he has destroyed me with the progress he has made, keep it up Doug.


Thanks for the support guys :thumb:

Jon - You should touch at the top of the Barbell row regardless of what type you use and as you lower the bar your arms should be fully extended before you start the next rep. This reduces lift momentum, increases the difficulty and reduces the risk to lower back injury. I use a dead weight barbell row style to take it even further. Remember Jon *SAFETY* is a big part of lifting successfully. This is another reason why I never use a belt in any lifts any more. As for touching the chest, I would say it depends on how you position your torso when you execute the lift. I have always done rows with my torso in the horizontal position, so when I pull the bar its natural line of progression will be towards my stomach area. I would suggest you execute your lift in the same way and again, *this is far safer for your lower back*, the further up your torso you bring the bar the more out of balance and control you can become and therefore you increase your risk of injury. 
Breathing - Breath into your stomach, push your stomach out and hold tight before you lift, keep holding your breath as you lift and breath out as you extend your arms at the bottom of the lift. Learning to stomach breath is an important factor in lifting. keeps the core more stable and increases safety :thumb:

James - I have to say grip hasn't been a weak point in my training, but I do know that my deadlift progression has given me really good grip strength especially this last 12 months.

I'm going to get a vid done soon so you can see me squat the 200kg again, but my primary focus will be to check that I'm consistently going parallel or below at 200kg. I have no plans to progress further on my squat but I do plan to ensure I squat 200kg once a month to maintain the strength.

The squat is so much easier without a belt mate, you should try it :thumb: In fact I would suggest not using a belt at all in any of your lifts, my personal experience with lifting has taught me that they cause injury.

Keep hating those weights James :devil:


----------



## chillly

ITHAQVA said:


> They are a tad more snug than they were two and a half years ago Gary
> 
> Did the software arrive mate?


As always Doug you never let anyone down:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

87.5kg squat for me tomorrow. Sorta looking forward to doing it as it still feels very achievable.


----------



## ITHAQVA

De load

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 110KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

CALF RAISE 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 90x3, 105x3, 117.5x8 PM 149kg
Incline Bench Press: 65x8, 75x8, 85x6
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Just sticking with the same weight until I make this look easy but 149kg predicted max is actually a record so thats always nice. Still a nice heavy weight as well which is good.

I was actually going for 7 reps in Incline as I did 6 last time but didnt quite make it so will stick to this weight for next cycle.

There is nothing better than inverted rows for sorting out shoulder problems, your shoulder is 100% to move naturally. I also do them with a neutral grip which is more friendly and its zero setup as I just do them in the top of the rack. Any slight pain in my shoulder I have from Benching is gone after doing Inverted Rows.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 115x3, 132.5x3, 150x4 PM 170kg
Back Off Sets: 115x4,4,4

Felt like absolute death so just went in did my squats and got out of there. Just doing these until they are easy, speed is coming up already and the back off sets are getting nice and fast.

I have never squatted with a belt or any wraps or anything mate. i started training for rugby and you dont get to wear that stuff on a rugby field so why would I train with it, thats the way I look at it. I dont really think I need to work on my grip all that much but the fat gripz were only a tenner and always wanted some. May use them for my complexs and see how that goes, that would be killer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Yesterdays de load

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 20X5 20X3) - 30KGX5 - 40KGX5 - 50KGX5

OVERHEAD PRESS 30KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 97.5x5, 110x3, 122.5x6 PM 147kg
Incline Bench Press: 70x5, 80x5, 92.5x5
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Another good Bench workout, got all my reps on all exercises. Abit of a grind on the last few reps but felt really good.

Pleased to get my Goal on Incline as i missed it last week. Deload week next week and then I will be going for a predicted max of 150kg which is my goal. Then I will stick with this weight for a long time and concentrate on speed and increasing my reps.

Did my inverted rows with the Fat Gripz, holy crap, i have never seen veins in my forearms like that. Hanging in the top of the rack really makes you grip for your life as if you slip, it would hurt like hell :wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 97.5x5, 110x3, 122.5x6 PM 147kg
> Incline Bench Press: 70x5, 80x5, 92.5x5
> Pull Ups: 10x2
> Inverted Rows
> 
> Another good Bench workout, got all my reps on all exercises. Abit of a grind on the last few reps but felt really good.
> 
> Pleased to get my Goal on Incline as i missed it last week. Deload week next week and then I will be going for a predicted max of 150kg which is my goal. Then I will stick with this weight for a long time and concentrate on speed and increasing my reps.
> 
> Did my inverted rows with the Fat Gripz, holy crap, i have never seen veins in my forearms like that. Hanging in the top of the rack really makes you grip for your life as if you slip, it would hurt like hell :wall:


Nice numbers James :thumb:

Best of luck with the 150kg Bench mate :devil::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 mini max effort

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX3 - 140KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10

NEUTRAL GRIP PULL UPS 2x2x2*

Good workout, all reps done. I added a few pullups as I'm considering replacing the DBRow with this exercise for a while to gain extra upper body strength. I've never done neutral pull ups and wow! How good do they feel, nearly managed 3 reps per set, considering I had just done 3 sets on the Row and I weigh 110Kg:doublesho I was pleased how they felt. In the past I have found its hard to warm up for traditional pull ups and they caused discomfort which held back my progression, no more!! Neutral grip for me!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 mini max effort
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX3 - 140KGX1
> 
> BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10
> 
> DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10
> 
> NEUTRAL GRIP PULL UPS 2x2x2*
> 
> Good workout, all reps done. I added a few pullups as I'm considering replacing the DBRow with this exercise for a while to gain extra upper body strength. I've never done neutral pull ups and wow! How good do they feel, nearly managed 3 reps per set, considering I had just done 3 sets on the Row and I weigh 110Kg:doublesho I was pleased how they felt. In the past I have found its hard to warm up for traditional pull ups and they caused discomfort which held back my progression, no more!! Neutral grip for me!


Neutral grip is so much better for the shoulders, puts them in a far better position. Doug have you noticed that I add Chin up in between all my pushing exercises. Only do half of my reps max but gets a lot of volume for my back. So I can do 6-8 neutral grip chins so I do 10 sets of 3 reps. Keeps you moving as well as i only rest 90 seconds between dips so you have to be quick to get the dip belt off and on.

Squats (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 100x3) WO 125x5, 140x3, 160x2 PM 170.5kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,6,6

Some will note that this is the same weight as a few weeks ago. Im sticking with a weight now until its absolute childs play before I make a bigger leap. The back off sets are flying now, getting great turn around at the bottom of the rep.

Disappointed not to increase my reps on Deadlifts, bar was never gripped right from the start on the 4th set, should have got 7 reps. Tried the fat grips DOH afterwards on 100kg, couldnt even move the bar a mm, these things are crazy. Anyone who can use these and lift a decent weight has my utmost respect. I like how you can change the difficulty with them as well depending which way round they are.


----------



## Leebo310

Again, haven't posted on here for a while but have still been working out...

Today's was OHP - Cycle 4, session 3

WU - 30kg*5, 40kg*5, 45kg*3

WO - 55kg*5, 62.5kg*3, 70kg*4 :thumb:

OHP - 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*13

DB Side raise/front raise superset 7kg*10*5

Very VERY happy with the 4*70kg OHP as that's my bodyweight! Didn't think I'd get 4 out either, thought I would just get 1 maybe 2 tops but felt strong so carried on. That was my first goal (to OHP my bodyweight) so happy to get that complete after 3 and a half months. 
Am getting close to my second goal of twice my BW squat too, which I'll be attempting in a couple of weeks.


----------



## Bod42

Nice work buddy. A BW OHP is awesome, thats what Im aiming for. Actually scrap that, 70x4 is awesome and even better at 70kg.

Keep it up mate.


----------



## Guitarjon

Just finished tonight's workout. Things are starting to get tougher now. 

A summery of where I am currently with weights.

Squat- 90kg
Deadlift 120kg
Bench press 65kg
Overhead press 37.5kg
Barbell row 60kg

All 5x5.


----------



## Guitarjon

Bloody DOMs. First time I've put bench up for a while. Chest feels sore...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 5/3/1 for Squat

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

SQUAT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Very pleased, this is the heaviest I'm going on the 5 rep week and the 170kg felt lighter than expected, I put this down to getting used to having 200kg on my back. So yes I do think there is carry over from heavy singles. Not so sure for upper body lifts though.

Once my Deadlift and Bench press goals are complete I intend to go heavier on the 5 sets of 10 and build some more muscle mass.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Just finished tonight's workout. Things are starting to get tougher now.
> 
> A summery of where I am currently with weights.
> 
> Squat- 90kg
> Deadlift 120kg
> Bench press 65kg
> Overhead press 37.5kg
> Barbell row 60kg
> 
> All 5x5.


Well done Jon, really good progress mate. Keep hating those weights :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Again, haven't posted on here for a while but have still been working out...
> 
> Today's was OHP - Cycle 4, session 3
> 
> WU - 30kg*5, 40kg*5, 45kg*3
> 
> WO - 55kg*5, 62.5kg*3, 70kg*4 :thumb:
> 
> OHP - 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*10, 37.5kg*13
> 
> DB Side raise/front raise superset 7kg*10*5
> 
> Very VERY happy with the 4*70kg OHP as that's my bodyweight! Didn't think I'd get 4 out either, thought I would just get 1 maybe 2 tops but felt strong so carried on. That was my first goal (to OHP my bodyweight) so happy to get that complete after 3 and a half months.
> Am getting close to my second goal of twice my BW squat too, which I'll be attempting in a couple of weeks.


Nice numbers Lee :thumb: :devil:

Excellent result on the OHP :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

I was trying to think earlier if there are any muscles the 5x5 Stronglifts doesn't hit? Any ideas!

Legs pretty much covered directly, abs/ core indirect but still being worked out, forearms from grip, tris from bench, shoulders from over head, back from row and deadlifts. Which exercises hit the biceps? I'm pretty sure they being hit indirectly as the are growing. 

So, are there any muscles not being worked by the big 5?

BTW- I'm not trying to complicate things just interested to know. Just querying it myself.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I was trying to think earlier if there are any muscles the 5x5 Stronglifts doesn't hit? Any ideas!
> 
> Legs pretty much covered directly, abs/ core indirect but still being worked out, forearms from grip, tris from bench, shoulders from over head, back from row and deadlifts. Which exercises hit the biceps? I'm pretty sure they being hit indirectly as the are growing.
> 
> So, are there any muscles not being worked by the big 5?
> 
> BTW- I'm not trying to complicate things just interested to know. Just querying it myself.


I know what your thinking jon and the answer is you dont need isolation exercises mate.
Your biceps are utilized in the bench press, they are one of the stabaliser muscles.

Keep to barbell compounds mate. Its all ive done for over 2.5 years, best strength and size growth ive ever experienced.

Wait until you hit the 5x5 goals set out on the site, then move onto the original 5/3/1 you can then add some alternative barbell exercises and of course dips, pull ups and chins. Its all youll ever need.:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Truth be told, I don't need to build biceps. I need to shrink overall body fat. Having a hard time giving up crap food at the moment. I've done it plenty of times before. I wouldn't say I'm over indulging I'm pretty much eating maintenance calories at the moment but could do with eating under. 

I know you can't spot reduce body fat but it's all in my upper body. I'm really top heavy. 

I get a bit mixed up when it comes to diet and weights at the same time. I seem to be able to loose weight through regular diet but throw in weights too then it puzzles me a bit as I don't feel I can lift the weights if I'm not fuelled enough.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Truth be told, I don't need to build biceps. I need to shrink overall body fat. Having a hard time giving up crap food at the moment. I've done it plenty of times before. I wouldn't say I'm over indulging I'm pretty much eating maintenance calories at the moment but could do with eating under.
> 
> I know you can't spot reduce body fat but it's all in my upper body. I'm really top heavy.
> 
> I get a bit mixed up when it comes to diet and weights at the same time. I seem to be able to loose weight through regular diet but throw in weights too then it puzzles me a bit as I don't feel I can lift the weights if I'm not fuelled enough.


I would keep it simple Jon.

Have a long term goal and Break it down.

Reach your strength/muscle goals first, then if you want to loose body fat do this after the first two goals. That way youll keep it simpler and easier to achieve.

Im just like you mate. I have tried several times to cut my body fat (I want to loose 5%) but I worry it will effect my strength goals so soon go back to eating without a deficit.

Keep it simple and your focus will be better.

Are you top heavy? Or are your legs skinny?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 mini max effort

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 215KGX1

DEADLIFT  120KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good. The 215kg Deadlift felt easier than the 210kg two sessions ago  If only upper body lifts were this straight forward :wall: 

I did do yesterdays OHP session but failed the 85kgx1 and I have had doms since Thursdays Squat session :doublesho. I also added 5 sets of pull ups doing two reps per set to get some volume in. I will be using the medium intensity/volume approach, stop about one rep before positive failure. I'm also considering going back to dips. I'm not entirely sure how I will structure the OHP session yet, but it will be something on the lines of:

1. OHP warm up sets - Work sets (5/3/1)

Not sure what order to do the dips and pull ups, I might even mix them up  

?. Bodyweight dips 5 sets 10 reps

?. Pull ups 5 sets of two reps and try to build from there without too much intensity.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug my OHP workout is as follows.
OHP
Dips
Pendlay Rows
Chin ups between every pushing set. This means with 5/3/1 you do 10 sets of Chins. very nice workout, keeps things short but get all the exercises I want in there.

Congrats on the deadlift, 200kg on the bar next time, nice.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug my OHP workout is as follows.
> OHP
> Dips
> Pendlay Rows
> Chin ups between every pushing set. This means with 5/3/1 you do 10 sets of Chins. very nice workout, keeps things short but get all the exercises I want in there.
> 
> Congrats on the deadlift, 200kg on the bar next time, nice.


Hi James,

Thanks for the info mate :thumb: Talking of rows I was considering replacing the dead barbell row with inverted rows, as I weigh 110kg I thought it would add some more strength to my upper body and also carry over to the pull ups. I know you do them mate, how do you rate them?

Some good variations here:

http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/five-fun-inverted-row-variations/
http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/five-awesome-inverted-row-variations-part-2/
http://articles.elitefts.com/training-articles/awesome-inverted-row-progressions-part-3/

I always seem to end up at ElitFTS 

:thumb: No mate 220kg on the bar next week :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

ITHAQVA said:


> I would keep it simple Jon.
> 
> Have a long term goal and Break it down.
> 
> Reach your strength/muscle goals first, then if you want to loose body fat do this after the first two goals. That way youll keep it simpler and easier to achieve.
> 
> Im just like you mate. I have tried several times to cut my body fat (I want to loose 5%) but I worry it will effect my strength goals so soon go back to eating without a deficit.
> 
> Keep it simple and your focus will be better.
> 
> Are you top heavy? Or are your legs skinny?


I've got an odd body shape. For years it's been a bit of an embarrassment but as I've got older I'm not as body conscious. A good thing as I wouldn't even take my top off to get in the pool on holiday. I'm not bothered now.

I don't have skinny legs they are pretty proportionate I'd say. I struggle with trousers as I have a rather small bum but fairly thick thighs. Again, I wouldn't call them fat and since if started squating they really look quite muscular. I have very broad shoulders and chest. I ran for a few years and my legs just look like muscle. I know you can't spot reduce fat but all my fat appears to be on my chest and a bit of a belly (although it appears to be going down and my chest is getting flatter).

I've always had quite perky boobs, not the typical fat guys who's droop down which is what's always embarrassed me. I'd be interested to know how much muscle I do already have as I'm sure a lot of my weight is muscle and water.

I feel like I already have quite a lot of muscle (I worked out in the past but not on the same program). But I also feel like I carry weight all around the muscle. I'm around 118kg but people don't realise this when they see me thinking I'd be less.


----------



## Bod42

Doug I wouldnt replace your barbell rows with Inverted but you could slot them in somewhere. Its like replacing Bench Press with push ups, yes push ups are a very good exercise but you would never replace your bench with them.

I rate them extremely well. They just seem to fix shoulder problems so well.

And Jesus Doug, Im back struggling on 195kg Deadlift and 180kg squat and your at 240kg deadlift and 200kg squat, awesome work mate. Need to up my game.

Guitar Jon, you sound exactly the same as me. Sadly different people just carry their weight in different places. Ive had Body Fat calipers done a few times and I carry basically no fat on my legs, a little on my back, a bit more on my chest but basically all of it on my belly. No one thinks I'm 110kg, most people guess like 90kgs. When I used to diet down with my mate when he was doing Bodybuilding comps, he used to say my back comes out way before my abs, its just different ways we all hold fat. Keep working hard.

How tall are you anyway mate.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Mini max effort :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX3 - 142.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

PULL UPS 3 minute rest between sets 2x2x2x2x2

PULL UPS 1 minute rest between sets 2x2x2x2x2*

Going to try pull ups twice a week (Bench session and OHP session). I'm tall enough to stand flat footed and hold onto the bars easily, so on each rep I lower to the floor and assist myself with a little upward push with my feet to get more volume in.

Not sure which way to progress in regards to rest periods/reps, at the moment the first group is done with 3 minute rest intervals and the second group done with 1 minute rest intervals.

I'm going to break my goals up into mini goals as I'm not sure what is possible at my bodyweight (110Kg)

First part - Volume/Assisted
5 sets 10 reps with assistance from pushing with my feet at bottom of rep.
5 sets 5 reps with assistance from pushing with my feet at bottom of rep.

*Question 1*, is the first part done twice a week too much volume for recovery at my body weight?
*Question 2*, Is it possible for a 110kg guy to do 5 sets of 10 unassisted reps on the pull up?

Secondly, YES! The 142.5Kg bench went up really well, not fast and it did feel reasonably heavy, but it was a nice clean rep  :thumb::thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT  (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

SQUAT 115KGx10x10x10

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All Squat work sets 100% complete. Ill keep to the work set weights and wait to complete the Deadlift and Bench press. After that I'll maintain strength levels on work set weights and slowly increase the assistance weight s, build more muscle, also make a start in reducing calories and have a proper go a loosing body fat :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Guitarjon said:


> I've got an odd body shape. For years it's been a bit of an embarrassment but as I've got older I'm not as body conscious. A good thing as I wouldn't even take my top off to get in the pool on holiday. I'm not bothered now.
> 
> I don't have skinny legs they are pretty proportionate I'd say. I struggle with trousers as I have a rather small bum but fairly thick thighs. Again, I wouldn't call them fat and since if started squating they really look quite muscular. I have very broad shoulders and chest. I ran for a few years and my legs just look like muscle. I know you can't spot reduce fat but all my fat appears to be on my chest and a bit of a belly (although it appears to be going down and my chest is getting flatter).
> 
> I've always had quite perky boobs, not the typical fat guys who's droop down which is what's always embarrassed me. I'd be interested to know how much muscle I do already have as I'm sure a lot of my weight is muscle and water.
> 
> I feel like I already have quite a lot of muscle (I worked out in the past but not on the same program). But I also feel like I carry weight all around the muscle. I'm around 118kg but people don't realise this when they see me thinking I'd be less.


Are you doing any cardio at the moment mate or is it all just the strength workouts?


----------



## Bod42

Doug, I would seriously do a rep max and then do half the reps for high sets. This has been proven to build chin up strength for a long time. And this isnt me saying this, it is Harry Selkow from Elitefts who renowned as the chin up guru.

I think adding back volume to nearly everyones program is a good thing. I do chin ups twice per week Doug. But remember if something goes in your program then something else needs to come out.

Selkow progressing is just an extra rep each time you do them. So workout 1 - 10x1, WO2 - 9x1, 1x2, WO 3 - 8x1, 2x2, and so on.

Question 2 - I have worked up to 10 sets of 4 pretty easily and Im not strong by any means so Im sure people can do 5 sets of 10, will just take time like everything else.

Also stick to your neutral grip chins mate as they are better for the shoulders.


----------



## Bod42

So i have been looking at my programming/progress quite extensively today and I have decided to change programs. I have been on 5/3/1 for 17 months now and my progress has been minimal. I dont think its the program, I think its my mentality. I just dont like the different weights each week, I like to hit my reps and increase the weight, having a bad week or 2 and not being able to try that weight again for another month really throws me. With this in mind, i have gone back to the old school multiple sets of the same weight and when you hit your reps, you increase the weight. Simple as it gets but also very effective. I have also gone back to 3 days per week.

i have 13 weeks from Monday until i start dieting so hopefully I can hit my goals. Hopefully a new program will kick start my love for training again as well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, I would seriously do a rep max and then do half the reps for high sets. This has been proven to build chin up strength for a long time. And this isnt me saying this, it is Harry Selkow from Elitefts who renowned as the chin up guru.
> 
> I think adding back volume to nearly everyones program is a good thing. I do chin ups twice per week Doug. But remember if something goes in your program then something else needs to come out.
> 
> Selkow progressing is just an extra rep each time you do them. So workout 1 - 10x1, WO2 - 9x1, 1x2, WO 3 - 8x1, 2x2, and so on.
> 
> Question 2 - I have worked up to 10 sets of 4 pretty easily and Im not strong by any means so Im sure people can do 5 sets of 10, will just take time like everything else.
> 
> Also stick to your neutral grip chins mate as they are better for the shoulders.


Thanks James, great advice, I'll formulate a plan 

I'm happy to drop assistance OHP for the pull up and I'm going to loose the Barbell row for a while as I've been doing rows all through the last 2.5 years.

Like the Selkow approach and I can see validity in it totally.

How's this?

*Workout 1 - 10x1

Workout 2 - 9x1 then 1 set of 2

Workout 3 - 8x1 then 2 sets of 2

Workout 4 - 7x1 then 3 sets of 2

Workout 5 - 6x1 then 4 sets of 2

Workout 6 - 5x1 then 5 sets of 2

Workout 7 - 4x1 then 6 sets of 2

Workout 8 - 3x1 then 7 sets of 2

Workout 9 - 2x1 then 8 sets of 2

Workout 10 - 1x1 then 9 sets of 2

Workout 11 - 10x2

Workout 12 - 9x2 then 1x3* and so on.......

I agree James and have found that the neutral grip is incredibly comfortable, feels right if you know what I mean :thumb:

Cheers James :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> So i have been looking at my programming/progress quite extensively today and I have decided to change programs. I have been on 5/3/1 for 17 months now and my progress has been minimal. I dont think its the program, I think its my mentality. I just dont like the different weights each week, I like to hit my reps and increase the weight, having a bad week or 2 and not being able to try that weight again for another month really throws me. With this in mind, i have gone back to the old school multiple sets of the same weight and when you hit your reps, you increase the weight. Simple as it gets but also very effective. I have also gone back to 3 days per week.
> 
> i have 13 weeks from Monday until i start dieting so hopefully I can hit my goals. Hopefully a new program will kick start my love for training again as well.


If your issues are not physical then a program change might give you that boost you need.

I understand why the 5/3/1 can be frustrating, fail to make one rep in any of the work sets and you have to do it all again next month. That is why I've done the 2 mini max effort months to bring my 1 rep up quicker.

Have you thought of doing a few months of week 3's? I have found it a great motivator, especially for the deadlift and squat.

I've been doing week 3 for three weeks followed by a de load week, then 3 weeks of week 3 and so on

As soon as the 1 rep has been successfully completed I add 5kg for the squat and deadlift and 2.5kg for the bench and OHP. Although I would say the OHP for me does not progress well with low reps (I will be going back to the original 5/3/1 for OHP after this month)

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Bench Press
20, 40, 60, 80kg x 6
90kg x 8
50kg x 8 x 3

Incline DB
20kg x 12 x 3

DB Row
22.5kg x 8 x 4

BB Curls
20kg x 12, 10, 8, 5, 3.

Need some consistency otherwise I'm regressing!!
Row is pitiful.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Bench Press
> 20, 40, 60, 80kg x 6
> 90kg x 8
> 50kg x 8 x 3
> 
> Incline DB
> 20kg x 12 x 3
> 
> DB Row
> 22.5kg x 8 x 4
> 
> BB Curls
> 20kg x 12, 10, 8, 5, 3.
> 
> Need some consistency otherwise I'm regressing!!
> Row is pitiful.


Hi Bokers,

I'd be inclined to switch over to a Barbell row, start really light and build up mate. I found using a dead barbell to be good style for power :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Hi buddy,
Thanks for the tip. I find I can't get the same level of feel/contraction when using the barbell which is just undoubtedly technique. Is there any vids you'd recommend to get it sorted? No EFS so you think you can row as far as I can see haha.
Cheers!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Hi buddy,
> Thanks for the tip. I find I can't get the same level of feel/contraction when using the barbell which is just undoubtedly technique. Is there any vids you'd recommend to get it sorted? No EFS so you think you can row as far as I can see haha.
> 
> Cheers!


I understand your thoughts on feel, but that is very much the same for any barbell versus dumbbell/isolation lift, i wouldn't worry about feel because the more muscles involved the less feel you get, I know it sounds contradictory.

Example: The squat hits legs like no other lift (and many other areas :thumb, however the leg raise or leg curl will give you much more "feel" due to the isolation effect. This is why so many fail in the weights room, they think "feel" and "pump" means they are hitting the muscles better, it is however the other way around. Due to the huge amount of muscles targeted by large heavy compound lifts the "feel" is reduced, however the hit on the CNS and factors that produce growth are far greater.

If you were bodybuilding possibly you would train compound followed by isolation to really finish off the muscle, this is the ultimate catch all way to increase intensity and hit the CNS/muscles to produce max goals, however training like this requires you to have a really good grasp of your recovery needs and can have the reverse effect - overtraining, muscle/strength loss! constantly fatigued and low in motivation.

Progress is all about your mental strength and desire to succeed. That's why you'll hear me say "hate the weights", on your heaviest set make your self mad and hateful, that barbell is your worst enemy BEAT IT INTO SUBMISSION! :devil:

IMHO - Use heavy compounds only for the first 3 years of training, if you then go to around 15% body fat, you'll look dam good and wander what all the fuss about isolation stuff is really about :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Hi buddy,
> Thanks for the tip. I find I can't get the same level of feel/contraction when using the barbell which is just undoubtedly technique. Is there any vids you'd recommend to get it sorted? No EFS so you think you can row as far as I can see haha.
> Cheers!


Search for Pendlay row it is basically a dead weight row :thumb:

Don't expect feel with dead weight barbell rows though mate, this way of rowing makes the exercise feel more like a lift, if you know what i mean :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Excellent summary and makes great sense when you lay it down like that.

Now then as for technique I see three approaches:
Elbows 90deg from body, pull to upper chest
Elbows 45deg from body, pull to lower chest (much like bench press form)
Elbows parallel and tucked to body, pull to belly button

Now for better or (more than likely) worse, I've done all three over different training phases. I would think the middle option (ala bench) with good form would be the best approach?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Excellent summary and makes great sense when you lay it down like that.
> 
> Now then as for technique I see three approaches:
> Elbows 90deg from body, pull to upper chest
> Elbows 45deg from body, pull to lower chest (much like bench press form)
> Elbows parallel and tucked to body, pull to belly button
> 
> Now for better or (more than likely) worse, I've done all three over different training phases. I would think the middle option (ala bench) with good form would be the best approach?


I would consider the version that feels the most comfortable.

Personally I walk up to the bar as if I'm doing a deadlift (This gives my most natural foot stance and stability) I slide my hands down my legs until I can grip the bar (This will give me my natural grip width) Pull the bar up and to my stomach, you may find your elbows flare slightly as they pass the torso. If you do a bent over row with no bar you'll see naturally the elbows will flare as it reaches the torso, try to emulate this slight gradual flare.

How I row - http://www.mega-pro.com/images/workout/wt/exercises/bentoverbarbellrows.gif Not a brilliant picture but it will give you a good idea how you should row for years of healthy lifting :thumb:

Be careful with any lift that makes you flare your elbows too much or if your instructed to use a wide grip. The wider the grip combined with elbow flaring and I'm generalising here, the more chance of joint injury. The best example is the bench press, many lifters have totally shot shoulders because of years of wide grip benching - the reduced motion of a wide grip allows them to use more weight but puts a lot of strain on the shoulder area.

I bench with a narrow grip and I'm still able to lift a decent weight, keep it healthy at all times, lifting heavy weights in the manner we do is not natural, listen to your body and allow it to guide how you lift :thumb:

Approximate illustration of my grip for all my Bench press work: http://www.bodytrainer.tv/data/exercisefiles/85/2785.jpg When I grip the bar on the innermost knurled parts there is about 10mm of the knurled area visible between my forefinger and the two shiny inner bands of my Olympic bar :thumb:

I hope that makes sense mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> If your issues are not physical then a program change might give you that boost you need.
> 
> I understand why the 5/3/1 can be frustrating, fail to make one rep in any of the work sets and you have to do it all again next month. That is why I've done the 2 mini max effort months to bring my 1 rep up quicker.
> 
> Have you thought of doing a few months of week 3's? I have found it a great motivator, especially for the deadlift and squat.
> 
> I've been doing week 3 for three weeks followed by a de load week, then 3 weeks of week 3 and so on
> 
> As soon as the 1 rep has been successfully completed I add 5kg for the squat and deadlift and 2.5kg for the bench and OHP. Although I would say the OHP for me does not progress well with low reps (I will be going back to the original 5/3/1 for OHP after this month)
> 
> :thumb:


I just dont like missing a rep and then waiting a month to have another try at it. I want to get it next week. And it takes months to see if your struggling not weeks. I have thought about just doing 1 week of 5/3/1 as you say, like the 3s week but I have been doing work up to 1 all out work set for 17 months and really doesnt seem to be working so have designed a program based on Paul Carters base building and will see how I go. Its straight across sets instead of ramped sets which is abit different from 5/3/1 ramped sets. i really like my workout, I love the layout as it covers all areas of my body and has all the core exercises in it but like I say I dont like that waiting a month to try a weight again. A part of me doesnt want to change but i think it is time to change.

Go on Elitefts Q&A and you will see loads of posts from Harry regarding chin ups but that looks good mate. If your only 50% of your top reps then it shouldnt effect recovery to much. I just throw my rows in at the end so its like a pre exhaust.

I do the hardest version of rows. Body 90 degrees to the floor (horizontal) and pull the bar to my lower chest, exactly the same place I bring my bench down to. I find this destroys your upper/mid back and as your not using so much weight then your lower back isnt a limiting factor. I have never felt rows like I do know I do true pendlay rows.

http://stronglifts.com/how-to-perform-the-pendlay-row-with-correct-technique/

Doug, Im in 2 minds what to do so I am just going to listen to you. I have changed my lower body days to the 3s only week and will increase or stick depending on how I feel during the workout.


----------



## Bokers

Thanks for info, images and info chaps. That's cleared it right up!


----------



## Bokers

Snatch warmup
20, 30, 40kg x 3 x 3

Squats
20, 50, 70, 90, 100kg x 5

Front Squat
70, 50, 20kg x 6

Calf raises
BW x 12 x 3

KB Swings
20kg x 20 x 4

Easing back into it nicely.


----------



## Guitarjon

Bod42 said:


> Doug I wouldnt replace your barbell rows with Inverted but you could slot them in somewhere. Its like replacing Bench Press with push ups, yes push ups are a very good exercise but you would never replace your bench with them.
> 
> I rate them extremely well. They just seem to fix shoulder problems so well.
> 
> And Jesus Doug, Im back struggling on 195kg Deadlift and 180kg squat and your at 240kg deadlift and 200kg squat, awesome work mate. Need to up my game.
> 
> Guitar Jon, you sound exactly the same as me. Sadly different people just carry their weight in different places. Ive had Body Fat calipers done a few times and I carry basically no fat on my legs, a little on my back, a bit more on my chest but basically all of it on my belly. No one thinks I'm 110kg, most people guess like 90kgs. When I used to diet down with my mate when he was doing Bodybuilding comps, he used to say my back comes out way before my abs, its just different ways we all hold fat. Keep working hard.
> 
> How tall are you anyway mate.


I'm 5 foot 10.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I just dont like missing a rep and then waiting a month to have another try at it. I want to get it next week. And it takes months to see if your struggling not weeks. I have thought about just doing 1 week of 5/3/1 as you say, like the 3s week but I have been doing work up to 1 all out work set for 17 months and really doesnt seem to be working so have designed a program based on Paul Carters base building and will see how I go. Its straight across sets instead of ramped sets which is abit different from 5/3/1 ramped sets. i really like my workout, I love the layout as it covers all areas of my body and has all the core exercises in it but like I say I dont like that waiting a month to try a weight again. A part of me doesnt want to change but i think it is time to change.
> 
> Go on Elitefts Q&A and you will see loads of posts from Harry regarding chin ups but that looks good mate. If your only 50% of your top reps then it shouldnt effect recovery to much. I just throw my rows in at the end so its like a pre exhaust.
> 
> I do the hardest version of rows. Body 90 degrees to the floor (horizontal) and pull the bar to my lower chest, exactly the same place I bring my bench down to. I find this destroys your upper/mid back and as your not using so much weight then your lower back isnt a limiting factor. I have never felt rows like I do know I do true pendlay rows.
> 
> http://stronglifts.com/how-to-perform-the-pendlay-row-with-correct-technique/
> 
> Doug, Im in 2 minds what to do so I am just going to listen to you. I have changed my lower body days to the 3s only week and will increase or stick depending on how I feel during the workout.


James I think you need to do a re evaluation on your goals and set it out like a project :thumb:
But unlike a normal project I would set out a flexible ending so that you can take into account all the usual things that make your training stall/increase the duration of your project.

I think you and I want roughly the same end results so I'll use my project plan as an example.

What is this project for? What is it I want to achieve?

*1. Strength goals:*
1.1 Bench press - 150kgx1
1.2 Squat - 200kgx1
1.3 Deadlift - 230kgx1
1.4 Overhead press - 100kgx1
1.5 5x10 Pull ups
You can add as many here as you want but be realistic, the simpler the template the easier to focus and achieve.

*2. Physical changes/goals:*
2.1 15% body fat
2.2 100kg - 110kg at 15% body fat
2.3 Build more muscle while at 15% body fat (Lean gain so not to add any more body fat)

So I have my goals written down, now how do I get to them?

First of all I have learned the hard way over the last 12 months and struggle when I try to do too many things at once (Loose weight and lift more!) 

So how do we get the goals in point 1.

1. Be patient! If you could reach the above strength goals for lifts 1,2 and 3 in 3 years I would say that is realistic and achievable.

2. Find a program that suites you and stick to it, the original 5/3/1 is an awesome program, but remember it is tailored for the long term and I would suggest the gains made on it will last longer. The longer I stick to the 5/3/1 the more respect I have for it, simple and very effective. But you have got to want it to work for you.

3. Mind set! Your state of mind when lifting is key to success, I find on my heavy singles that most of the time after the lift I cannot remember the lift :doublesho My focus becomes so intense that it becomes a subconscious automatic response, my conscious mind switches off and therefore I have no memory of the lift, its weird but perhaps if you do some investigation you'll find many people go through this intense focus phase.

Think about the lift but don't think about the lift :thumb: (I hope that makes sense mate)

4. Plateaus have very little to do with strength and have more to do with a failure in lifting and breathing technique and the wrong metal approach.

5. Read the original 5/3/1 and follow the advice about breaking your ultimate goals down into mini goals. Example - this week my mini goal is to add 5kg to my Deadlift. If I make my lift im 5kg closer to my ultimate goal. Use all these little tactics to make the goals seem more achievable, less overwhelming, it will help with motivation :thumb:

With the above in mind you should be able to re evaluate your programs and set yourself up for your new training phase :thumb:

2. Physical changes/goals.

I will leave this one as I have yet to get to it, but I do have a loose plan.

1. Eat the same as I am now but add 15-20 HIIT body weight cardio up to a maximum of 3 times a week. Keep at around 200grams protein per day. monitor physical changes (Body weight, how clothes fit, how you look in the mirror) 
2. Start adding weight to the BBB 5x10 sets for more muscle, maintain strength by lifting ultimate goal weights at least once per cycle/month :thumb:

I hope this gives you a very brief overview of how a little structure can help with motivation, you know all the above but when you loose focus and get a bit lost in your lifting a brief going over the basics can highlight an obvious issue you totally missed, Yep, that's me  The last 12 months I have had times when I've missed a lift because I forgot to use proper technique because I became lazy and unfocused. Now I make sure every rep is done as per the correct technique, even the warm ups. In the past if I was light id just muscle the weight rather than executing proper form  :wall: 

The weights we lift change all the time you'll find your technique will naturally get sloppy the heavier you go. It gets worse the stronger you get. I almost got to a point were I was going to print out an A3 sheet with the words "TECHNIQUE, TECHNIQUE and TECHNIQUE"! and stick it on the wall in my powerlifting room 

Stick with it mate, you know you can do it, you just need to believe and find that inner primitive you who can lift like a muthafuker :thumb:

:devil:Get on YouTube and watch some motivational vids :devil:

Why do we fall James?


----------



## Focusaddict

Pendlay Row


----------



## Bokers

Round a mates, low ceiling and no DBs meant a slight change.

Seated BB OHP
20, 25, 30kg x 8
35, 40, 45, 50kg x 5
45, 40, 35, 30, 25kg x 8
20kg x 12
Form is much better pressing now 

Chinups
BW x 3, 2, 2
Assisted with a little push x 2, 3, 2, 2

There were from 2/3 depth and very promising. Need to work down to full hang.
Arms started at around 30/35 degrees. Not bad for being heavy haha.

Cable Pushdowns
40kg x 5 x 5
Squeaky / stiff pulley means weight was low.

Cable Curls
30kg x 8 x 3

Cable Delt Raise
20kg x 8 x 3

Cable GHR?
Like a cable RDL with more pull back as well as up? Either way it got the lower back and spinal erectors warm! 
40kg x 5 x 5


----------



## Bod42

Thanks for the in depth reply Doug. My strength goals are identical to yours.

1. Strength goals:
1.1 Bench press - 150kgx1
1.2 Squat - 200kgx1
1.3 Deadlift - 230kgx1
1.4 Overhead press - 100kgx1

I think i just like to evaluate my workouts weekly on how i feel instead of monthly. Take bench for instance, i completed my 5s week but this doesnt mean i will complete my 3s or 1 week so at the end of a month its hard to say if it went well or not whereas if I do the same weight each week and I got a weght 3 times in a row then i would definitely be looking at increasing the weight. I think 5/3/1 is a good program but doesnt suit my mentality.

BUT then I did just hit one of my goals.
Bench (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) 85x5, 100x5, 112.5x10 *PM 150kg*
Incline Press: 55x10, 65x10
Pull Ups: 7x2

Very pleased to hit my goal. This has been a long time goal of mine and it now means I can put this lift into maintenance mode and really concentrate on my other lifts which are lagging. The last rep of the 150kg was a real grinder, I mean one of the longest grinds I have ever done, took me an eternity to lock my right elbow but i got there in the end. Tweaked my shoulder slightly but it doesnt feel inside like my old injury, more the front delt and doesnt go down my arm so hopefully it will be sweet in a day or 2.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thanks for the in depth reply Doug. My strength goals are identical to yours.
> 
> 1. Strength goals:
> 1.1 Bench press - 150kgx1
> 1.2 Squat - 200kgx1
> 1.3 Deadlift - 230kgx1
> 1.4 Overhead press - 100kgx1
> 
> I think i just like to evaluate my workouts weekly on how i feel instead of monthly. Take bench for instance, i completed my 5s week but this doesnt mean i will complete my 3s or 1 week so at the end of a month its hard to say if it went well or not whereas if I do the same weight each week and I got a weght 3 times in a row then i would definitely be looking at increasing the weight. I think 5/3/1 is a good program but doesnt suit my mentality.
> 
> BUT then I did just hit one of my goals.
> Bench (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) 85x5, 100x5, 112.5x10 *PM 150kg*
> Incline Press: 55x10, 65x10
> Pull Ups: 7x2
> 
> Very pleased to hit my goal. This has been a long time goal of mine and it now means I can put this lift into maintenance mode and really concentrate on my other lifts which are lagging. *The last rep of the 150kg was a real grinder*, I mean one of the longest grinds I have ever done, took me an eternity to lock my right elbow but i got there in the end. Tweaked my shoulder slightly but it doesnt feel inside like my old injury, more the front delt and doesnt go down my arm so hopefully it will be sweet in a day or 2.


No worries mate, just being supportive :thumb: I understand your frustration with monthly progress, it does take getting used to, and like you previously I have always trained with progress being weekly. But I have found this time around the monthly slow approach has paid off with very few plateaus. This Wendler guy does have a good grasp of training methodology and application 

After you completed the 112.5kgx10 did you lift 150kgx1?

Well done on the Bench session, glad your shoulder held out this time James :thumb: I know an injury can be a constant concern and very frustrating :wall: Us cavemen hate physical weakness 

I'm on my 145kg Bench tonight :doublesho wish me luck


----------



## Bokers

Ran out of time as I'm getting my mate upto speed so only time for:

Power Cleans
20, 40kg x 5 x 5

Deadlfts
20, 60, 100, 130, 150kg x 5 Hands hurting, got annoyed.

GMs
Bar x 12 x 3


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> No worries mate, just being supportive :thumb: I understand your frustration with monthly progress, it does take getting used to, and like you previously I have always trained with progress being weekly. But I have found this time around the monthly slow approach has paid off with very few plateaus. This Wendler guy does have a good grasp of training methodology and application
> 
> After you completed the 112.5kgx10 did you lift 150kgx1?
> 
> Well done on the Bench session, glad your shoulder held out this time James :thumb: I know an injury can be a constant concern and very frustrating :wall: Us cavemen hate physical weakness
> 
> I'm on my 145kg Bench tonight :doublesho wish me luck


Na mate, its just a predicted max of 150kg so Im in no way claiming that I could Bench 150kg but this is the highest my predicted has ever been.

Monthly progress is better, Im not trying to add 10kg per month to my lower body but its more at the end of the month I find it hard to decide to increase the weight or not as hard to rate your workouts when your doing different reps and weight.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 105x3) WO 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x3 PM 173kg
Back Off Sets: 122.5x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,7,5

Great workout, squats felt brilliant and fast. I think the back off sets are helping so much. On my 140kg set, I had to look left and right at the weights as I thought I had loaded it wrong as walking the weights out just felt ridiculously light tonight which obviously fills you with confidence.

Thats a rep record on deadlifts as well. Forearms get an incredible pump. Did think about going back to mix grip as bet I could do 100x10 easy but I like the sound of 100x10 double over hand.

I have decided to just the 3s week on lower body movements (as suggested by Doug :thumb I love it already, last night workout was really good so I am confident at hitting my next weight, if I struggle with a weight then i will stick with it until its fast and confident with it.


----------



## Guitarjon

95kg on the squats and it's getting hard! My 65kg bench press felt relativly easy today? I normally struggle with that one but my barbel row and overhead press have improved quite a bit too so maybe that's why my bench feels easier?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 mini max effort

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KGX5 - 124.5KGX3 - 145KGX0

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

PULL UP (4 minute rest) 2x2x2x2x3

PULL UP (1 Minute rest) 1x1x1x1x2*

Had a phone call just before doing the 145kg and I think I cooled down too much and lost focus on technique :wall: total fail! I do remember this happened a good while ago when a mate came around just before I went for my 1 rep. Lesson learnt, from now on everyone can bugger off until I've finished my work sets  On my next mini max effort I'll go back to the 142.5kg and build up from there :thumb:

Pull ups were ok, I'm trying to split them up into two sessions with different rest periods between sets. Hopefully the extra volume will produce some good results.


----------



## Guitarjon

Feeling great at the moment. Gym day again tomorrow. Not sure how long I'll be able to keep the squats up for. Has anybody looked into the mad cow version of 5x5. I'm gonna do a bit of research of it. I'm not going to stop with the normal strong lifts until I've deoaded 2 times at the same weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Feeling great at the moment. Gym day again tomorrow. Not sure how long I'll be able to keep the squats up for. Has anybody looked into the mad cow version of 5x5. I'm gonna do a bit of research of it. I'm not going to stop with the normal strong lifts until I've deoaded 2 times at the same weight.


Hi Jon,
I went from the 5x5 to I think a 3x5 then quickly to a 1x5, but soon moved over to the 5/3/1 which I have been doing for around 21 months now.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> 95kg on the squats and it's getting hard! My 65kg bench press felt relativly easy today? I normally struggle with that one but my barbel row and overhead press have improved quite a bit too so maybe that's why my bench feels easier?


You'll find as you get stronger your lifts will all move up, the larger lifts like the deadlift and squat seem for me to be the easiest to progress on followed by the bench press and last but not least the OHP. Keep an eye on technique and breathing, these two things are key to successful lifting mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hamstring went again today while I was squatting 200kg.

I slipped a few days ago and tweeked it. I was in two minds to rehab then but it seemed ok.

Ill do the bill starr rehab by the book this time and see you guys in approx 2-3 weeks. Maybe doing the rehab slow and sensible last time allowed scar tissue to build and maybe It was inevitable I was going to suffer another injury.

Keep hating the weights. See you all very soon. Were is my ice!!!!!!


----------



## Guitarjon

That sucks buddy  

Getting injured does seem to be a big part of lifting weights at a higher weight. I haven't looked into any sort of rehab before but is that all it takes 2-3 weeks? My running injury took a month to completely clear (Achilles tendonitis). 

Keep resting! 

I managed to get 100kg squat 5x5 today. I have to say it felt very easy compared to some. I have been a bit more consistant with training this last few weeks so I think it's helping. 

Still completely gutted that I failed my OHP the other day. It was a new weight but I thought I'd cracked it the time before as it felt fairly easy. So many variables though such as sleep, water intake, food eaten etc. 

On a side note though I have been counting calories and eating properly this week and have lost 2.9kg which is loads! Still a lot to go yet. I guess most of that was probably water.


----------



## Bod42

Abit late but thurs and fri workouts.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 53.5x5, 60.5x7 PM 74.5kg
Dips: BWx10, BWx10, BW+15x10
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8

Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg

Deadlift was easy and moved really fast. The DOH BBB sets are definitely helping my grip strength which is helping my deadlifts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> That sucks buddy
> 
> Getting injured does seem to be a big part of lifting weights at a higher weight. I haven't looked into any sort of rehab before but is that all it takes 2-3 weeks? My running injury took a month to completely clear (Achilles tendonitis).


I will be honest, i took 12 months to build up last time even though i was aware of the Bill Starr rehab protocol. Basically it states you can be back lifting as heavy as the weight you injured yourself with in around two weeks :doublesho I really struggle to believe its is possible to come back so quick but if you think about it, it is soft tissue and therefore should repair quick. I've read loads of forums and they all say the same thing, it works! However, the lifters are maxing out at around 120-150kg, from my experience there is a massive difference between 150kg and the mighty 200kg.

So my plan is to use the protocol as is but get up to around 180kg then build up again, i know im strong enough to lift it but its my body that's letting me down now.

The irony is i filmed the rep so i could post it here, all came out nice and clear but as i was injured I just went down!

I'm sort of unsure what went wrong i built up as normal 150kgx 5, 170x3, then went to 200kg for 1 and as i went down i felt the muscle tear and just give away. The bruising is already gong yellow so healing is on its way and the problem is when you injure at heavier weights you do more damage.

If its physically possible I plan to squat and deadlift 200kg again :thumb:

Why do we fall? :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 92.5x3, 105x3, 120x6 PM 144kg
Incline Press: 70x8, 77.5x8, 87.5x6
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

I definitely could have got 7 reps, probably 8 reps which was my goal but i cut the set short as I was really grinding the reps. Still pleased with a fast 6 x 120kg.

Inclines is where the problem started, i have never had problems with my shoulder on inclines but today i did and i think its because Im starting to grind weight on it. 6 reps on the last set was my goal and I got it but had a massive pain through my shoulder and thought i had ripped it but sat up in massive pain but the pain seemed to go away over the next 30 seconds or so. Must have just popped my joint slightly instead of ripping something thank god. Definitely going to deload my bench now as pointless stirring up an old injury.

Doug read up on Paul Carter and Brandon Lilly and their injuries during competition and how they came back from them. At some point you have to give heavy weight low reps a rest and concentrate on setting some rep records, your body will thank you for it. You could stick to the 5/3/1 format as we know you think so highly of it but instead of 5/3/1, maybe do 10/8/6 or something. So I think your spending to much time testing your lifts instead of time building them.


----------



## Bokers

Power Jerk
20, 40, 60kg x 5 x 2

OHP
20, 30, 40kg x 5
50kg x 5 x 5

Chinups
BW x 2, 2/3 hang.
Small band x 5 x 3
Bigger band x 5 x 2

Dips
Small band x 5 x 5

DB Curls
10kg x 12 x 4 PH


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug read up on Paul Carter and Brandon Lilly and their injuries during competition and how they came back from them. At some point you have to give heavy weight low reps a rest and concentrate on setting some rep records, your body will thank you for it. You could stick to the 5/3/1 format as we know you think so highly of it but instead of 5/3/1, maybe do 10/8/6 or something. So I think your spending to much time testing your lifts instead of time building them.


Will do James, I agree, I think ive been doing too much heavy work and think I need to vary my training to allow for more recovery. My success has been my downfall. I was actually planning to vary reps once I reached my goals.
I can also see why powerlifters do a lot of assistance work. I intend to put balanced focus on hamstring training and strength. Will defo be adding GHR and if possible reverse hypers.
Thanks for the heads up on P Carter and the mighty B lilly :thumb:

I think also more dynamic stretching pre workout and massage post workout. Someone said yesterday. Doug you dont realise just how much you lift! Its true when you do well you take it for granted. Another leason to learn -I need to train in a more thoughtful manner and consider the forgotten aspects of lifting heavy weights


----------



## Bokers

Snatch
20, 30kg x 5 x 3

Squats
20, 50, 70, 90, 100kg x 5

Front Squats
40kg x 8 x 4

That was me done, so I left it at that. The cycle was interesting haha.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Will do James, I agree, I think ive been doing too much heavy work and think I need to vary my training to allow for more recovery. My success has been my downfall. I was actually planning to vary reps once I reached my goals.
> I can also see why powerlifters do a lot of assistance work. I intend to put balanced focus on hamstring training and strength. Will defo be adding GHR and if possible reverse hypers.
> Thanks for the heads up on P Carter and the mighty B lilly :thumb:
> 
> I think also more dynamic stretching pre workout and massage post workout. Someone said yesterday. Doug you dont realise just how much you lift! Its true when you do well you take it for granted. Another leason to learn -I need to train in a more thoughtful manner and consider the forgotten aspects of lifting heavy weights


You can increase strength by setting rep records, doing more volume, doing the same work in shorter time, making a weight easier, I know its the funnest way but putting weight on the bar isnt everything at your level.

I think a higher rep phase will do you wonders. And ya definitely add in GHR. You know our bench has a built in GHR raise?!? Move the leg pad to its maximum height, put the bench into the decline position and then slip your ankles under the leg pad, the bottom pad then stops you killing your knees.

The more i read up on RAW lifters the more they train differently from Geared lifters but as Geared are the ones setting all the records that you hear about, i think we hear about their training more. Reread this The more I read about RAW lifters, the more this is becoming very apparent. Check out this article, very eye opening. Extract below. http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/...squatting-big/

"Fact is, I very rarely squat heavy. The majority of my squat training, I would guess 90% of it, is done with around 420 pounds. That's right, I built an 800+ belt only raw squat and an 1,100+ geared squat training with only about 420 pounds. Unbelievable? Believe it."

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x5x7

Squats felt good tonight, never felt like missing. They didnt fly up but never ever felt like I was going to miss and wasnt even that knackered after the set. The back off sets seems to be working wonders but they do fill you with confidence when your moving 125kg so fast its leaving your shoulders at the top of each rep.

Get in got all 5 sets of 7 reps DOH on deadlifts, forearms are really pumped after these sets and can feel my grip getting stronger and that I feel like I can grip the bar tighter. Also my lower back is taking a pounding with my workouts so its a really good way of not going nuts with my assistant deadlifts.

Just concentrating on one goal at the moment. I have until 1st September to get my lower body lifts as high as possible and then I will be dieting down to 100kg.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> You can increase strength by setting rep records, doing more volume, doing the same work in shorter time, making a weight easier, I know its the funnest way but putting weight on the bar isnt everything at your level.
> 
> I think a higher rep phase will do you wonders. And ya definitely add in GHR. You know our bench has a built in GHR raise?!? Move the leg pad to its maximum height, put the bench into the decline position and then slip your ankles under the leg pad, the bottom pad then stops you killing your knees.
> 
> The more i read up on RAW lifters the more they train differently from Geared lifters but as Geared are the ones setting all the records that you hear about, i think we hear about their training more. Reread this The more I read about RAW lifters, the more this is becoming very apparent. Check out this article, very eye opening. Extract below. http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/...squatting-big/
> 
> "Fact is, I very rarely squat heavy. The majority of my squat training, I would guess 90% of it, is done with around 420 pounds. That's right, I built an 800+ belt only raw squat and an 1,100+ geared squat training with only about 420 pounds. Unbelievable? Believe it."


thanks James,

I think i can see why I'm having a few issues injury wise, first of all I'm squatting way too much weight to often. It makes sense to lower and train at lower percentages and cycle the loads.

I was thinking once i get back to my 200kg squat to cycle the load, say do 200kg 3 times a year (Once a quarter) and train with 5x170kg, 3x180kg and 1x-190kg? Do the same for the deadlift?

To only use 190kg and get a an 800 + squat is mad.

And No, i didn't know my bench had a GHR! :doublesho lol! Thanks for the heads up mate :thumb:

First rehab sets tonight, going to hurt like a MuthK BastD!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> thanks James,
> 
> I think i can see why I'm having a few issues injury wise, first of all I'm squatting way too much weight to often. It makes sense to lower and train at lower percentages and cycle the loads.
> 
> I was thinking once i get back to my 200kg squat to cycle the load, say do 200kg 3 times a year (Once a quarter) and *train with 5x170kg, 3x180kg and 1x-190kg*? Do the same for the deadlift?
> 
> To only use 190kg and get a an 800 + squat is mad.
> 
> And No, i didn't know my bench had a GHR! :doublesho lol! Thanks for the heads up mate :thumb:
> 
> First rehab sets tonight, going to hurt like a MuthK BastD!


I know its fun training with heavier weights but i would up the reps even if its just for a little while. 10/8/6 would prob do you well.

Juggernaut strength just sent out an email. What great timing. They believe 5/3/1 is good but lacks volume so they suggest:

10/8/5
Week 1-45/55/65%x10+
Week 2-50/60/70%x8+
Week 3-55%x10, 65%x8, 75%x5+

And ya you should only peak for a 1RM like 2-3 times per year. Its called testing not training. Testing doesnt build your strength, training does.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 50x3, 57.5x3, 64x5 PM 74.5kg
Dips: BWx8, BW+15x8, BW+32.5x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x3
Pendlay Rows: 70x8x8x9

All in all a good workout, hit all my reps so cant complain. Maybe time for a change though as Dips arent feeling that great on the shoulders now but then the weight is getting up a little bit now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I know its fun training with heavier weights but i would up the reps even if its just for a little while. 10/8/6 would prob do you well.
> 
> Juggernaut strength just sent out an email. What great timing. They believe 5/3/1 is good but lacks volume so they suggest:
> 
> 10/8/5
> Week 1-45/55/65%x10+
> Week 2-50/60/70%x8+
> Week 3-55%x10, 65%x8, 75%x5+
> 
> And ya you should only peak for a 1RM like 2-3 times per year. Its called testing not training. Testing doesnt build your strength, training does.


That's a hell of a light routine :doublesho I Like the idea of cycled training, one big problem, with my genetics and that type of routine I would build a load of muscle 

Might be a good an interesting idea to do one month 5/3/1 and one month 10/8/5 hmmmm, the games afoot!  :thumb:

Rehab is going very well :thumb: I am making notes for each day and will post on here once complete, there is surprisingly very little info on the Bill starr rehab, most tend to link back to the original site and give very little info on there results. Mark Ripptoes grumpy old man approach doesn't help either, the Bill star rehab itself is vague and doesn't seem to make itself 100% clear, its also seems on the face of it cater for lifters using lighter weights. I have structured my rehab up to 200kg squat over a 20 day rehab period.

I'll post it in an easy to understand format with some basic notes to help anyone in need of something to help them repair. It indicates there will be pain, but so far I would say its more of a scary pulling sensation on the area of injury and the worst part is psychological, as you squat and feel the pulling, you get the sensation you'll pull the muscle apart :doublesho This I can see is the real rehab action, pull the fibres in the direction of natural movement to encourage a uniform repair :thumb:

I'm 99% certain this injury was caused by me slipping a few days previous to the workout and tweaking my hamstring as it did feel like I tore the muscle then. If only I had listened to my initial instinct and rehabbed just in case :wall:

Right off to work out a 5/3/1 - 10/8/5 routine, thanks for the info James. oh and James if I turn into a 19 stone behemoth your to blame mate!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Brief overview of new training protocol :thumb:

This variant reduces my max lifts to once every 3 months/4 times a year, allowing for a bit more recovery and slower progression :thumb: Loads more volume :doublesho

What do you think James?

First draft 

Month 1	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	95%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 2	Light 
10/8/5 
Week 1 45%	55%	65%
Week 2	50%	60%	70%
Week 3	55%	65%	75%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 3	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	100%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 4	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	95%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 5	Light 
10/8/5 
Week 1 45%	55%	65%
Week 2	50%	60%	70%
Week 3	55%	65%	75%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 6	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	100%
Week 4	40%	50%	60% 
Month 7	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	95%
Week 4	40%	50%	60% 
Month 8	Light 
10/8/5 
Week 1 45%	55%	65%
Week 2	50%	60%	70%
Week 3	55%	65%	75%
Week 4	40%	50%	60% 
Month 9	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	100%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 10	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	95%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 11	Light 
10/8/5 
Week 1 45%	55%	65%
Week 2	50%	60%	70%
Week 3	55%	65%	75%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

Month 12	Heavy 
5/3/1 
Week 1 65%	75%	85%
Week 2	70%	80%	90%
Week 3	75%	85%	100%
Week 4	40%	50%	60%

KEY
Week 4	40%	50%	60% = De load Week
100% = 1 Rep max week

Progression - 5/3/1
Progress until goal weights reached, then stop 5/3/1 weights progression. Thereafter slow Progress only on assistance lifts with strict form.

Progression - 10/8/5
Slow progress with strict form.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Wow thats complicated.

Doug if you love doing your 1RM then why not stick to the 10/8/5 protocol but after your last work set, if you feel really good that day, work up to your working max? Dont listen to me, read 5/3/1 for power lifting.

And ya higher reps are known to cause more muscle growth but 1. this isnt a bad thing and 2. it shouldnt be that bad as thats more to do with time under tension and powerlifters dont do the 4 seconds down, 2 seconds up BB reps so should be fine.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wow thats complicated.
> 
> Doug if you love doing your 1RM then why not stick to the 10/8/5 protocol but after your last work set, if you feel really good that day, work up to your working max? Dont listen to me, read 5/3/1 for power lifting.
> 
> And ya higher reps are known to cause more muscle growth but 1. this isnt a bad thing and 2. it shouldnt be that bad as thats more to do with time under tension and powerlifters dont do the 4 seconds down, 2 seconds up BB reps so should be fine.


I like to keep you on your Toes 

Actually I'm really looking forward to the split 10/8/5 and 5/3/1 :thumb: It will add some variation, i can also use a few different exercises. I'm there with my squat and my deadlift so no pressure and my bench is 10kg away and I'm not in any particular hurry now I'm moving over to a maintenance style routine.

Don't mind packing on more muscle now, missus says she likes a real man!


----------



## Bokers

Power Jerk
20, 30, 40, 50, 60kg x 5

Bench
Bit of an experiment on form and contraction...
20, 40, 60kg x 8
80kg x 5 x 5 various widths and form. Happy with what I settled on.

Incline DB
20kg x 12 x 4

Pendlay Row
20, 40, 60kg x 8
80kg x 3. Too much for sure, woeful!

BB Curls
Bar x 12 x 4


----------



## Bokers

3k of 4min jog, 1 min off and a couple of runs up the hill this morning.
Will be building it up over the coming weeks.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Juggernaut strength just sent out an email. What great timing. They believe 5/3/1 is good but lacks volume so they suggest:
> 
> 10/8/5
> Week 1-45/55/65%x10+
> Week 2-50/60/70%x8+
> Week 3-55%x10, 65%x8, 75%x5+


Don't the assistance sets provide the volume in the normal BBB 5/3/1 workout then? I thought that was what they were there for? 
Would the above include additional assistance sets as well then? Is there no deload week in the above either?
(I'm not being lazy, I just can't access the Juggernaut website from work!)


----------



## Guitarjon

So from what you guys are saying more reps means larger muscles but less reps mean stronger muscles? 

At he current weight I can't imagine doing 10 squats without a break. I guess it doesn't apply to me yet as I'm still on the 5x5. I've had to deload my OHP as I could shift past 40kg. However, I've since discovered I think I was benching wrong. I know grip is a personal thing but I think I was far too narrow to build my chest muscles. I've knocked it down from 70kg to 50 and going to progress from there. 70kg wide grip felt way too heavy. 50 is easy but I think I need to get the technique right. Hopefully the wider grip bench and the deload will break me through my plateau.

I've also found working out in the morning is bad for me. I couldn't lift 130kg deadlift at all. I think I could have with bad form but I've performed a bad for deadlift before and it left me with back pain for weeks! I read up at the time that the spine needs to dehydrate throughout the day to help prevent injury. I managed 125kg last week and that was bloody hard. I thought I'd have got a couple of reps out of the 130kg though but nothing! I normally work out in the evening though after tea.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> So from what you guys are saying more reps means larger muscles but less reps mean stronger muscles?
> 
> At he current weight I can't imagine doing 10 squats without a break. I guess it doesn't apply to me yet as I'm still on the 5x5. I've had to deload my OHP as I could shift past 40kg. However, I've since discovered I think I was benching wrong. I know grip is a personal thing but I think I was far too narrow to build my chest muscles. I've knocked it down from 70kg to 50 and going to progress from there. 70kg wide grip felt way too heavy. 50 is easy but I think I need to get the technique right. Hopefully the wider grip bench and the deload will break me through my plateau.
> 
> I've also found working out in the morning is bad for me. I couldn't lift 130kg deadlift at all. I think I could have with bad form but I've performed a bad for deadlift before and it left me with back pain for weeks! I read up at the time that the spine needs to dehydrate throughout the day to help prevent injury. I managed 125kg last week and that was bloody hard. I thought I'd have got a couple of reps out of the 130kg though but nothing! I normally work out in the evening though after tea.


That's the general consensus Jon, however its not an exact science, I build muscle and strength at lower reps as well as at 10 rep sessions.

The wide grip on the bench press puts more stress on your shoulder and pectoral area, I personally use a narrow grip and wont ever go to a wide grip. Wide grip is used because it limits the range of motion and allows pros to lift more weight etc..

Workout times are a personal thing, what ever suits your lifestyle, I prefer workouts after work between 5:00-5:30 even thought I go to bed early every night.

Above all Jon, its all learning curve and that's part of the fun/challenge :thumb:

"The bench press is a Tricep exercise" (Dave Tate :thumb But as a secondary it will build your chest and shoulders :devil:

The 10 rep session are built up over time and you'll find what is best for you:

Less weight - shorter breaks between sets (Approx 1 minute)
More weight - Longer breaks between sets (I use 3 minute breaks on the heavier stuff) I suppose you could go right up to 7 minutes and therefore use even more weight

Rehab session felt really good tonight, no pain at all, just the sensation of the injury area being slightly pulled at, but I think this is how its supposed to feel like. Could have lifted much more weight but will stick to the program as close as I can so that I can post results about the Bill Starr rehab, not something I've just made up, so far I would say its working very well. I think when I get to the heavier stuff (190Kg+ :doublesho) I'll truly find out how good the rehab protocol really is :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Don't the assistance sets provide the volume in the normal BBB 5/3/1 workout then? I thought that was what they were there for?
> Would the above include additional assistance sets as well then? Is there no deload week in the above either?
> (I'm not being lazy, I just can't access the Juggernaut website from work!)


I havent suggested the routine for Doug due to the volume, i have suggested due to his injury history and I think a higher rep, therefore slightly lighter weight will do him a world of good.

Jon, Doug got it spot on "That's the general consensus Jon, however its not an exact science, I build muscle and strength at lower reps as well as at 10 rep sessions." Its not an exact science BUT there is no better program for a beginner than 5x5 for putting on size and strength.

Im with Doug, my shoulder health is worth far more to me than a little bit more size on my chest.

You are right about the spine needing time to drain. If your going to work out in the morning they say you should be up 90 mins before your workout. The spine fills with fluid while you sleep and drains during the day. This is like squeezing a really full water bottle vs one thats half full. Which one will be easier to burst?


----------



## Bokers

Usually people that need to go wider to get chest activation need to work on there form rather than actually doing wider. You want your forearms to sit perpendicular to the floor when the bar touches your chest. This means pulling the elbows down in a different position or setting the lift up differently to achieve it.

This article helped me clean mine up lot: http://www.lift-run-bang.com/2011/11/developing-your-raw-bench-part-1.html


----------



## Bokers

Powercleans
20, 40, 60kg x 5
80kg x 3 x 3. Woeful. I need to brush up.

Deadlifts
80, 100, 120, 140kg x 6

SLDL
112.5kg x 8
105kg x 8
80kg x 8
65kg x 8

Grip
Fat Grip 80kg Holds 30 sec x 4
Plate pinch 20kg x 30 sec x 4

Abs
Situps, sweepers x 12 x 3


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> I havent suggested the routine for Doug due to the volume, i have suggested due to his injury history and I think a higher rep, therefore slightly lighter weight will do him a world of good.


Sorry James, I was meaning as to why Juggernaut were suggesting the 5/3/1 lacked volume when I thought the 5x10 assistance sets are there for volume.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Sorry James, I was meaning as to why Juggernaut were suggesting the 5/3/1 lacked volume when I thought the 5x10 assistance sets are there for volume.


What James means is that some find the lower rep approach of the 5/3/1 work sets isn't enough to stimulate results so an alternative is using a higher overall rep/volume approach :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Sorry James, I was meaning as to why Juggernaut were suggesting the 5/3/1 lacked volume when I thought the 5x10 assistance sets are there for volume.


Juggernaut systems also train a lot of athletes so they will be doing different exercises after the big three. BBB would cover the volume aspect but I dont see many athletes on BBB as they have areas of weakness to address/work on rather than just bringing up the big 4.

Also I dont think they are referring to overall volume as in sets, more volume by reps. I have read a fair few people have struggled with squats on 5/3/1 due to lack of volume and a lot of old school trainers believe you should be training the squat with higher reps as well so Juggernaut are prob on to something here.

Or in simpler terms, what Doug said

Deadlift: (WU 72.5x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 127.5x3, 145x3, 165x3 PM 181.5kg

Good fast easy workout, got in pulled my reps hard and fast and got out. Aggressively loading Deadlifts at the moment at 2.5kg per week so we will see how this goes.

Bench Press (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3, 100x5, 112.5x3, 125x4 PM 141.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 72.5x5, 82.5x5, 92.5x6 PM 111kg
Pull Ups: 10x2
Inverted Rows

Stopped well short of what i could do. Just put this exercise in maintenance mode while I concentrate on my other lifts. I know I used to be one of those guys who thinks you should always be improving but just because Im stopping a few reps shorts doesnt mean Im not getting stronger.

Incline Bench is getting up there now but after last weeks tweaking my shoulder, Im going to stick with the same weight for another month but please with a predicted max of 111kg. Be good to get 100kg for 5 reps soon.

Im going to keep Inverted rows in every program I do now as they seem to have a ridiculous ability to stop any shoulder pain.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,7,8

I stayed with the same weight this week as last as the reps werent very fast but this was just one of these workouts that didnt feel right from the get go. Couldnt get the bar on my back in the right place and couldnt even get my feet in the right place. Form was awful and the reps were slow but still got them all. Dropped stupidly low on the first rep. Even the first back off set was useless so practiced my form inbetween the sets and bam my form was perfect on the second set, felt fast and easy. Will stick with this weight next time though. Man I do love this deciding each workout how it went and what I will do, so much less stressful.

I have decided to train hard for 3 months, make it my priority and not worry so much about weight gain and put some muscle and strength on. I want to hit Rippletoes suggested "advanced" strength level for a 110kg guy which are.

Bench Press: 144kg - Complete
Squat: 192kg
Shoulder Press: 86kg
Deadlifts: 223kg

These are now my short terms goals but my long term goals are still the same. No chance of hitting SP or Deadlift advanced weights but will try and get pretty close.

Also after the advice on here, Im going to change shoulder press to BBB, I think my shoulders need a break from dips as dips used to feel amazing but now they are a slow struggle whereas I get zero pain from OHP.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Or in simpler terms, what Doug said


Haha!


----------



## Guitarjon

Cheers for the I out yet again guys, especially doug! 

I had another go at the chest press today using my new adopted technique at a lower weight. Both my wife and mate say I think too much about it and it often stalls me. I did 55kg today. My friend seems to think I needed to rest those muscles a little more as it sempt like I should be able to lift it but struggled. 

Now I agree. 

My weekly routine is Sunday, Tuesday, Thursday. Thursday being the end of my week with he longest rest period. I'm usually busy cleaning cars and DIY on the Saturday so perhaps don't rest up as much as I should. I'm also aiming for 130g of protein a day. I still think I need more for my size (117kg) but it's about 20g more than usual. 

Great session tonight, albeit at a lower weight. My wife struggled on Thursday to get her 30kg bench and failed a couple of sets. However, she nailed it in every possible way today  proud of her. She seems to have really good form but it's me who does all the research and tells her what to do. I can't see myself at the time I'm doing it. 

Squat now upto 110kg
Deadlift 125kg
Bench well- if you include full 5x5 then it's at 67.5kg. I'm confident I'm going to break through this platau when I get back upto that weight.
Barbell row 65kg
OHP 37.5kg again not yet completed 40 so deoaded.

As you all say, it's not a race. The quicker I progress the longer I've got to keep it up anyway haha. 

Worried that my squat is going to overtake my deadlift at this rate.


----------



## Bokers

Aim as high as you want with the protein, whether it's useful pas 1.5g per lb... There's enough science either way. But if you don't get enough you'll soon know bout it with reduced recovery and the aches and pains.


----------



## rob warrington

quick one guys. I'm getting on well with my 5x5, but recently changed my diet , it wasn't bad before but I'm trying to get rid of a bit of belly fat now I know you can't directly target belly fat so Ive started doing a bit if cardio after workouts , only say 15 20 mins rowing . Will this help burn fat, as said I've changed up my diet to cut out bread and trying to eat more clean etc. thanks


----------



## Leebo310

rob warrington said:


> quick one guys. I'm getting on well with my 5x5, but recently changed my diet , it wasn't bad before but I'm trying to get rid of a bit of belly fat now I know you can't directly target belly fat so Ive started doing a bit if cardio after workouts , only say 15 20 mins rowing . Will this help burn fat, as said I've changed up my diet to cut out bread and trying to eat more clean etc. thanks


Any cardio will help to burn fat mate and eating cleaner will help too.
I'd suggest interval training if you're doing 15-20 mins. So do 2 mins of normal pace then 30 seconds of sprint pace, then back to 2 mins of regular, 30 seconds sprint etc etc.


----------



## Bokers

Fat loss it about calorie deficit pal and as you've just learnt, you can't spot reduce it. Whether you want to create a deficit by adding cardio or eating a bit less is upto you. Just listen to your body as the cardio may impact your recovery.

Look into HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training) which is short burst of flat out then a little longer recovery then repeat for 6-10 rounds. That'll get the work done in less time and burn more calories than steady state.

You could also try barbell complexes (google: bear complex fat loss) you'll see that there's many ways to burn calories and still gain something from it.


----------



## Guitarjon

Bokers said:


> Fat loss it about calorie deficit pal and as you've just learnt, you can't spot reduce it. Whether you want to create a deficit by adding cardio or eating a bit less is upto you. Just listen to your body as the cardio may impact your recovery.
> 
> Look into HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training) which is short burst of flat out then a little longer recovery then repeat for 6-10 rounds. That'll get the work done in less time and burn more calories than steady state.
> 
> You could also try barbell complexes (google: bear complex fat loss) you'll see that there's many ways to burn calories and still gain something from it.


This. I find the rower fantastic to help stretch out legs when you've had a heavy weight on them too. I used to hate the rower but it's currently my fav cardio machine just for that nice stretch feel. I've improved quite a bit on there.

20 mins HITT training after your weights will be enough for cardio to help the after burn. As it's been said you just need to be in a calorie deficit to loose body fat and body fat will drop from where ever it feels like it. Unfortunately the fat on your belly is often one of the last places to go. Just keep trying to reduce overall body fat and it will get there.


----------



## rob warrington

It's the age old 'I want to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time' I'm not a big guy , my main goal is to build more muscle , not so much mass. But also need rid of the fat I seem to have got round my middle . My routine is 5x5 ( sometimes mix it up with other stuff ) but you get the idea what I do for weight training , as for diet lets forget what I used to eat, my new diet looks like this, porridge in the morning with protein shake ( can't stomach anything else early morning ) then around 10 am apple and banana. 12pm I've started having a salad with a chicken breast and an boiled egg ( I do have sweet chili sauce on it though ha ) then around 3 ish I've been having mixed nuts and an orange or more fruit. Tea time is usually chicken veg or sometimes lean mince type dishes ( whatever the mrs cooks) brown rice and steak etc etc then after gym usually protein shake and before bed cottage cheese and small handful if mixed nuts , don't know how this looks to you guys. Oh I've also started having green tea instead of regular tea for what it's worth haha.


----------



## rob warrington

Thanks for replies btw guys


----------



## Guitarjon

rob warrington said:


> It's the age old 'I want to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time' I'm not a big guy , my main goal is to build more muscle , not so much mass. But also need rid of the fat I seem to have got round my middle . My routine is 5x5 ( sometimes mix it up with other stuff ) but you get the idea what I do for weight training , as for diet lets forget what I used to eat, my new diet looks like this, porridge in the morning with protein shake ( can't stomach anything else early morning ) then around 10 am apple and banana. 12pm I've started having a salad with a chicken breast and an boiled egg ( I do have sweet chili sauce on it though ha ) then around 3 ish I've been having mixed nuts and an orange or more fruit. Tea time is usually chicken veg or sometimes lean mince type dishes ( whatever the mrs cooks) brown rice and steak etc etc then after gym usually protein shake and before bed cottage cheese and small handful if mixed nuts , don't know how this looks to you guys. Oh I've also started having green tea instead of regular tea for what it's worth haha.


That's funny my diet consists of pretty much the same! Except I have a protein shake an apple after work before I've made my tea.

I usually have an additional shake after the gym. I mix my protein powder in with my morning porridge to save a bit of time and add flavour to the porridge.

I'm actually pretty good at loosing weight when I actually bother counting calories. I've almost lost a stone in 3 weeks.

To an extent you can burn fat and add muscle but these are only short lived gains usually at the beginning of a routine. People say you can do both through careful food intake at specific times and stuff but I'm not so sure. If you ask me you can make noob gains for a while when the weight isn't too high but when you start to get to your natural limit for your genetics/ weight / height etc the more weight needs more energy from food. Doing deadlifts at my lowest weight of 130kg knocks me for 6, makes me yawn and feel sleepy. In all honesty I'm struggling to improve this now due to it been so physically taxing. I'm sure if I ate more it would help but like you, I'm trying to loose body fat too so eating a deficit.


----------



## Bod42

Guitarjon said:


> Both my wife and mate say I think too much about it and it often stalls me.
> 
> She seems to have really good form but it's me who does all the research and tells her what to do. I can't see myself at the time I'm doing it.


One of the guys I used to train said exactly the same about me, I think to much. And also he trusted me 100% so all he had to do was turn up, work hard and leave, i was 100% in charge of his program. A lot easier when its like that.


----------



## Bod42

rob warrington said:


> quick one guys. I'm getting on well with my 5x5, but recently changed my diet , it wasn't bad before but I'm trying to get rid of a bit of belly fat now I know you can't directly target belly fat so Ive started doing a bit if cardio after workouts , only say 15 20 mins rowing . Will this help burn fat, as said I've changed up my diet to cut out bread and trying to eat more clean etc. thanks


Change that rowing to interval rowing and the fat will drop off. I have never had people lower their resting heart rate faster than using interval rowing. My 2 favorites are 
12 x 250m with 90 secs rest between reps.
5 sets of 4 x 250m with 30 secs rest between reps and 2 mins between sets.

This will be hard work after your weights so if your intent on doing this then try and put it on a different day. If you cant get to the gym then do sprints. BUT! You can't serve two masters. You can't get "big and ripped" at the same time. Pick one goal and have a laser like focus on that goal.

This is exactly why I have been treading water as I have been chasing to many goals. I am now attacking my strength & muscle full on for 3 months and then will be putting my strength into maintenance mode and attacking fitness and weight lose for 3 months.


----------



## rob warrington

How can I post videos on here from my iphone or ipad ? Haven't done deadlifts for some time as I hurt my back ( not related to deadlifts ) today was the first time I've videoed myself and although I thought my form was ok I do seem to arch my back , as if I'm not sitting low down at the start of the lift , but when I try to do this I struggle to lift anything ?? The video today was 30kg off what I used to lift. It felt good and wasn't too much of a struggle, just wanted some constructive criticism on my form ???? Thanks all


----------



## Guitarjon

Smashed 130kg deadlift tonight. Mega happy with myself


----------



## rob warrington

Good man. In hoping I'm gonna back there soon. Stupid glass back ha


----------



## Guitarjon

Cheers buddy, it can be major off putting when you hurt your back. I know... As a kid you don't realise how important it is.


----------



## Bod42

rob warrington said:


> Good man. In hoping I'm gonna back there soon. Stupid glass back ha


Rob I seriously hurt my back playing rugby as a teenager so i have done quite abit of reading into back rehab/prehab etc. There have been a number of studies that have shown back endurance strength plays more of a role in a healthy back than overall strength. This seems to ring true as try to stand or sit dead upright, the best position for your back and see how long you can last before your muscles give way. Most people slouch on their spine instead of using their muscles to hold them up.

A great back exercise is Hyper Extensions and you can also do a test using these. Make sure your doing the parallel ones, not the 45 degree. Go to the top position so you are horizontal to the floor and hold this position for as long as possible. 2 mins is goal before you pass. Give it a try and see how long you can do it for, should give you a good indication of where your back endurance is at. Could always substitute hyper extensions for deadlifts until you have improved this exercise. Ya its a B!tch giving up a compound exercise but trust me you will be better and stronger for it in the long run.


----------



## Guitarjon

Lover hyper extensions. For some reason I just enjoy the movement... Maybe in strange.


----------



## Bod42

Must be injury month or something. I woke up Sunday morning and I must have spent the night laying on my buggered shoulders as I have ripped it. I mean cant even hold my arm out at arms length right now. So complete change to my workout. Take a few days off anything that effects my shoulder and then start the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders workout which is actually a rehab/prehab workout for the first 4 weeks. Shame as my upper body lifts have been doing so well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Must be injury month or something. I woke up Sunday morning and I must have spent the night laying on my buggered shoulders as I have ripped it. I mean cant even hold my arm out at arms length right now. So complete change to my workout. Take a few days off anything that effects my shoulder and then start the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders workout which is actually a rehab/prehab workout for the first 4 weeks. Shame as my upper body lifts have been doing so well.


Welcome to the world of powerlifting James


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Welcome to the world of powerlifting James


Oh ya the Mrs is like are you annoyed, Im like not really, Im disappointed but if you powerlift then you will get injured, its part of the journey.

My shoulders have been feeling a bit beat up lately anyway so good excuse to take 4 weeks off Bench and do some rehab work.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 130x3, 147.5x3, 167.5x3 PM 184kg

Thats it, went in ripped my weights really fast and got out of there. Dropped all upper body stuff this week and will do Deadlifts Monday, Squats Wed, Deadlifts Fri so should be a hard week.

This is why I hate to hear people say they dont have time for the gym, I was in and out of the gym in less than 15 mins and worked up to 167.5x3. 15mins isnt a lot out of your day.


----------



## Guitarjon

My wife is complaining of a twitchy knee pain.mshes been squatting and I've told her to ease off on them. 

I read something about de loading on the bodybuilding forum the other day. It was a sticky and talked about de loading to break through plateaus and to give your body a needed rest. It mentioned that muscles recover much quicker than joints and to give them a break ever so often by de loading as much as 60% or total rest for a week (even without injury).


----------



## Bokers

Power Jerk
20, 40, 60kg x 8
80kg x 3

OHP
20, 40, 50kg x 5
55kg x 5,4,3
20kg x 12

Dips
BW x 3
Band 1 x 3
Band 2 x 5
Band 3 x 5
Band 4 x 5

Chinups
BW x 1 High
Band 1 x 3
Band 2 x 3
Band 3 x 4
Band 4 x 3
Band 5 x 5

Hammer Curls
8, 9, 10, 12kg x 12 x 2


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> My wife is complaining of a twitchy knee pain.mshes been squatting and I've told her to ease off on them.
> 
> I read something about de loading on the bodybuilding forum the other day. It was a sticky and talked about de loading to break through plateaus and to give your body a needed rest. It mentioned that muscles recover much quicker than joints and to give them a break ever so often by de loading as much as 60% or total rest for a week (even without injury).


De loading and recovery are important parts of any sport, the original 5/3/1 is structured with one de load week every month. But as your level advances so does the need to structure your training around more recovery. I've found this out the hard way recently, but there is not so much obvious info available once you get to a certain level.

Joints do take a bit of a beating in any sport because of the fact they don't recover as quickly as soft tissue (muscles), but at the weights your lifting Jon I wouldn't concern yourself just now mate. How your body tolerates lifting does vary from person to person though :thumb:

I can lift all my ultimate goals with 0 joint issues however I do suffer from a weakness in my Hamstrings. Ironically being successful at lifting is my weakness  This I think is key to progressing at any level and after doing some research, there is a large percentage of high level powerlifters who do a lot of weakness training. Mike Robertson has written a load of info on correcting physical imbalances (worth checking him out :thumb. My recent Hamstring injury is in my view largely due to an imbalance, I lead with my left foot and unless I look down to check my stance when I lift heavy, I will tend to have my left foot slightly further forward than my right :doublesho My answer to this is to put a platform on the floor with a raised lip to which I will bring my heals back to touch, this will correct my stance and keep both feet in line with each other. I train alone so all these little tools are useful in keeping me in the game :thumb:

This I think is important to point out, if you train alone think of ways to keep yourself spotted without looking into a mirror. I have found the little squat box invaluable, every time I touch the box when I squat, its full parallel, now I've added the little platform to keep my feet in line.

The Bill star rehab is going better than expected, last night I did 150kg for 5 reps no problems. However I think the real test of the protocol and my courage is this last phase between 150kg and 200kg :doublesho

:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Progress is good there doug. Still sounds strange apthat even during rehad your lifting lol. I guess its just my image of rehab meaning don't do it. But then I guess my dad went I to rehab to learn to walk again after having being diagnosed with cervical mylopathy (spelling) which of course included him walking. 

I guess I associate the word rehad with American megastars who have a couple of whiskeys too many on a night out and check themselves into 'rehab'

One more squat session until I'm at body weight.  wife is going to buy me a slap up meal when I make it. 117.5! Really excited as I still feel I'm making good progress here. Of course its getting hard but it doesn't feel like I'm anywhere near collapsing under the bar stage yet.

I have been wondering if this would have been so easy if I'd weighed much less than I currently do (117kg)? 

Bench is improving. I deloaded and altered my grip and I'm flying through the weight again. 

Still low but I can feel a huge improvement in technique etc. I'm currently back to 60kg which I know sounds low but I got in a bit of a rut here. The deload did me good, and having a friend give me some tips (while I'm doing them) has helped. 

I did 5,5,5,5, 10 @60kg tonight reps wise as it did feel a little easy. 

Barbell row was 65kg.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Progress is good there doug. Still sounds strange apthat even during rehad your lifting lol. I guess its just my image of rehab meaning don't do it. But then I guess my dad went I to rehab to learn to walk again after having being diagnosed with cervical mylopathy (spelling) which of course included him walking.
> 
> I guess I associate the word rehad with American megastars who have a couple of whiskeys too many on a night out and check themselves into 'rehab'
> 
> One more squat session until I'm at body weight.  wife is going to buy me a slap up meal when I make it. 117.5! Really excited as I still feel I'm making good progress here. Of course its getting hard but it doesn't feel like I'm anywhere near collapsing under the bar stage yet.
> 
> I have been wondering if this would have been so easy if I'd weighed much less than I currently do (117kg)?
> 
> Bench is improving. I deloaded and altered my grip and I'm flying through the weight again.
> 
> Still low but I can feel a huge improvement in technique etc. I'm currently back to 60kg which I know sounds low but I got in a bit of a rut here. The deload did me good, and having a friend give me some tips (while I'm doing them) has helped.
> 
> I did 5,5,5,5, 10 @60kg tonight reps wise as it did feel a little easy.
> 
> Barbell row was 65kg.


It does sound strange I suppose, but considering last time I tore my hamstring I took 12 months to rehab it I'm not complaining at less than two weeks :doublesho :thumb:

It does however make sense, the muscle is soft tissue and therefore should repair relatively quickly, the progress in weight forces the repair of the muscle fibres to be uniform and with less scar tissue. It also works wonders for your confidence, as you know one of the deciding factors in injury is getting back into it and regaining the confidence to lift.

Well done on your progress Jon, I wouldn't worry about collapsing under the bar as you progress your core will follow as long as your squatting parallel :thumb:

Your weight can be a hindrance but if your 20% body fat or below I wouldn't worry too much at this stage, For me personally I only wish to go down to 15% body fat as I'm currently 20%. The only issue guys with big bellies have is flexibility, especially in the deadlift.

Technique is everything when it comes to successful lifting progress Jon :thumb:

Didn't do rehab last night I had DOMS!!!!!! :doublesho


----------



## Bokers

While I completely agree about the fatman flexibility... You can certainly improve it, because I am that fatman haha. It will hinder you at first at any size/shape if you're not flexible though. Most people coming into lifting will have to learn many things to get the technique right. Flexibility is key and one you have to pick up to progress.


----------



## Bokers

Power Cleans
20, 40, 60kg x 5
80kg x 3

DL
100, 130, 150kg x 5
170kg x 3
Painful on the hook grip! Thumb still doesn't feel right this morning.

RDL
60, 80kg x 8 x 2
100kg x 6

Full range sit-ups
BW x 12 x 3

Pinch Grip
20kg x 30 sec x 2

Fat Bar Holds
80kg x 45sec, 28sec, 17sec. Done.


----------



## Guitarjon

I'm about 30% body fat but have a strange build. 

I've had to call tonight's session off. Feel bad about it but I'm going in huge day tomorrow instead. Basically I got a call asking for me to go to an interview on Friday and teach a 45 minute lesson. On top of that my dad has had a lot of ill health and has been in and out of hospital. I keep getting calls from my mum crying saying dad has fallen again. He has something called cervical mylopathy which basically means he can't use his hands and legs properly amoung other things. Anyway he came out of hospital yesterday and its set him back. He can't literally walk a few meters. So at 1:30 am yesterday night I went round as he would let my mum call the ambulance as he wouldn't go back in hospital. 

One thing lifting weights has helped. He's 19 stone and pretty much a dead weight at the moment. I was obviously careful as he has many other ailments including heart failure etc. 

So to summarise, I've had a few late nights and early mornings, I have an interview to prepare for on top of the usual lessons. So I just wanted to get everything in focus tonight but I'm coming out of the interview and straight for the gym tomorrow (I'd normally be at work but they have given me the day off).


----------



## Bokers

Power cleans
20, 40, 60kg x 3 x 3

Bench
20, 40, 70, 80, 90kg x 5
60, 40, 20kg x 12

BOR
60kg x 5 x 5

Chinups
BW x 2, 2, 2, 3, 1, 2, 1
Not too low yet.


----------



## Bokers

Snatch
20, 25, 30, 35kg x 3

Squats
20, 50, 70, 90, 100kg x 5

Front Squat
70kg x 3 x 3
50kg x 5 x 5

Calf Raises
BW x 12 x 4

KB Swings
24kg x 12 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3

Completely destroyed this workout. I was ready for my next set ages before my allotted rest time which is a good sign. And all the sets were fast and relatively easy so its time to increase the weight. The longer I do back off sets the more i like them, you leave the gym feeling good and confident about what youve just lifted which is always an advantage for your next session.


----------



## Guitarjon

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
> Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
> 
> Completely destroyed this workout. I was ready for my next set ages before my allotted rest time which is a good sign. And all the sets were fast and relatively easy so its time to increase the weight. The longer I do back off sets the more i like them, you leave the gym feeling good and confident about what youve just lifted which is always an advantage for your next session.


Great feeling. I got this after a deload on my bench press. Ok, it was lighter but the last time I lifted 60kg I struggled. This time it was a piece of cake. the same for my overhead press.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Rehab update

This is only day 13 of actual training :doublesho

Friday Squat rehab session:

*Warm up 1 - 8 different dynamic stretches of 10 reps per side

Warm up 2 - 20kg x10 - 70kg x 5- 100kg x5 - 130kg x2

Work set 160kgx5 - 165kgx3 - 170kg x2*

The biggest problem I have now is I'm getting pre exhausted by the first set and the 2nd and 3rd sets are difficult. This raises my concern as its exhaustion that plays a huge role in my technique failure and it is unstable technique that can put immense stress on one of the hamstring muscles and tear it quite easily.

I also don't feel recovered from yesterdays session, so I think I'm at a point were I need to break up rehab sessions with a days rest for recovery (I slept 10 hours Last night :doublesho)

This is how I should progress from here on in if I follow the protocol to the book - Holy  SH*T! :doublesho

*170kg x5 - 175kg x3 - 180kg x2
180kg x3 - 185kg x2 - 190kg x1
190kg x1 - 195kg x1 - 200kg x1*

By the time I warm up to the first set I'll be bloody knackered, let alone do two more heavy sets


----------



## Guitarjon

117.5kg squat 5x5 felt hard yesterday! I'm past body weight now. Seems I have shed 2kg this week so not only have I lifted body weight I exceeded it. Another 130kg deadlift too which felt easier today. I managed a good 140 1rm. I didn't try past this as I went for another but only got part way off e floor before putting it down.


----------



## ITHAQVA

I've been doing a good deal of research since my injury and have learnt a lot :thumb:

Unfortunately until you get injured the obvious doesn't seem that obvious 


Something I have noticed is the more experienced lifters do not train as heavy as you may believe. James thanks for the info on this, it has lead to a much greater understanding of lifting heavy long-term :thumb:

If you read my workout posts and your at the same level or getting there I would strongly advise you SLOW DOWN and cycle your training. I've said it before but it needs saying again. Being strong can be your weakness because when you do make a mistake it can be very big, my latest injury was a torn hamstring while squatting 200kg. This could have been much worse at this weight (Muscle detach from bone). 

I will be using a two month cycle - (Medium weight - 10/8/5 month 1) (Heavy weight 5/3/1 month 2) then back to month 1 and so on. I will still add weight on the 10/8/5 but due to the higher reps the weight will always be lower and allow for more volume, I'm hoping this will result in better form on my heavy month so I can maintain my strength/single lift maximums :thumb:

Another rehab later and it will be scary. I find anything around the 170-190kg feels heavy and 200kg feels dam right frightening as you find it difficult to move with it once its un racked, the fear brought on by the weight as it tries to crush you doesn't help :devil:


----------



## Guitarjon

Well after my 117.5kg squats combined with my OHP on Friday I gave my mates car a machine polish / tidy up yesterday and today my whole core/abs feels like I can't shift. Nice gentle stroll round the shops for me today and nothing much more.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Well after my 117.5kg squats combined with my OHP on Friday I gave my mates car a machine polish / tidy up yesterday and today my whole core/abs feels like I can't shift. Nice gentle stroll round the shops for me today and nothing much more.


Your doing really well Jon, stick with it mate. If all out strength isn't your goal, 3 x15 minutes HIIT per week will help reduce your bodyfat :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

I keep thinking about incorporating some HITT. But I'm getting some great results so far with the program. I am now starting to get a good shape. 

I defo want to keep it up for now as I really need to get my bench up too. But I feel as it starts to get more demanding (going all out on every session) I may need to rethink things. I don't mean take the easy option but I do think there is a lot to be said for having a break. Although when I have a break I won't be stopping just need to decide how to proceed.


----------



## Bod42

Guitarjon said:


> I keep thinking about incorporating some HITT. But I'm getting some great results so far with the program. I am now starting to get a good shape.
> 
> I defo want to keep it up for now as I really need to get my bench up too. But I feel as it starts to get more demanding (going all out on every session) I may need to rethink things. I don't mean take the easy option but I do think there is a lot to be said for having a break. Although when I have a break I won't be stopping just need to decide how to proceed.


Jon, that is one of the awesome things about 5x5, it is basically auto regulating and has breaks built in but to each individuals needs unlike other programs. Look at 5/3/1, you deload every 4th or 7th week but what happens if your recovery needs are different which they are person to person. Whereas with 5x5, when you dont hit 5x5 3 workouts in a row then you deload by 10%, this is your break. So just keep pushing it up and there is no harm with sticking with a weight until you completely dominate it either.

That sounds like a good plan Doug, think I would rather see you doing 10/8/5 for months 1&2 then 5/3/1 for 3rd month as that means you hitting a 1RM 4 times per year instead of 6 times. Remeber you want to be building not testing. Just from personal experience I moved my reps up on Bench and it has progressed better than ever and hasnt hurt my shoulder once. Bloody hurt it sleeping of all things.

I must have torn the muscle or something as when I move my arm on its own it hurts but if I put pressure on my front delt then I can move my arm round pain free. I know I will need to get it replaced at some point but the longer I can keep it, the better really. Same as Doug I am just going through a rehab program at the moment so changed my program layout.

Mon - Squats / BBB Deadlifts
Wed - Rehab / then back work
Fri - Deadlift / BBB Squats

Deadlift workout Fri
Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x3 PM 187kg
Held the last rep for as long as I could and my grip feels really good. The DOH BBB sets are paying off.

Thats it, in and out in under 15mins. Im loving this new setup. I cant really call it 5/3/1 anymore as i have completely *******ised it but I just like that I can decide my progress week to week instead of worrying about it month to month. Im also making far better progress far easier than i was on 5/3/1. Anyone reading this, this isnt a bad word against 5/3/1, i think its a great program but you have to find the program that matches your mentality and I naturally sit there and worry about my workouts/progress etc so a month is a long time to wait. This way its very simple, i ripped 170x3 on fri so I increase the weight, if it was a grinder i would stick with it until it was easy.


----------



## Bokers

Power Jerk
20, 40, 60kg x 5
70kg x 3 x 3

Press
20, 30, 40kg x 5
50kg x 5 x 3
40kg x 8

Dips
Green band 5 x 5

Pullips
Green band 5 x 5

Hammer Curls
10, 12kg x 12
15kg x 8
8kg x 12


----------



## Guitarjon

Grrrrr. 

Bench is back upto 70kg and I've stalled again even after a deload and steady back up. 

I did 5,5,5 really poor ones and thought I'd continue to try and get 5x5 poor as aposed to failing. I managed to get another 4 out then 3 and someone in the gym walking past helped me on the last as I got a bit stuck.

Hate doing bench without a spotter.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,6,6

Great workout, the 162.5 was heavy but I never ever felt like missing even if a few of the reps were slow. The back off sets were the fastest they have ever been and are really starting to fly now. This training seems really good for me as Im a grinder so this speed work seems to make me progress really fast.

Deadlifts are less than last week but this was due to wearing different shorts and them catching so it tired my grip out faster. Still all in all a great workout.


----------



## Bokers

Reset my lifts as such, rather build something decent for once and leave my ego at the door.

Snatch
20, 25, 30kg x 3 x 3

Squats
20, 40, 60kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 5 Paused.

Front Squats
40kg x 5 x 5 Paused.

Calf Raises
BW x 12 x 4

KB Swings
24kg x 12 x 3


----------



## Bod42

So did my rehab Wed night. That program always amazes me how good it makes my shoulder feel. I used to do prehab at the end of every session and havent been doing it for a few months now so its my own fault I blew my shoulder.

Im about 1/3 as strong as I was last time I run this rehab program so that would prob have something to do with why my shoulder blew out again. I will come back bigger and stronger in the future thought.

Deadlifts tonight, got my excitement back for training, loving hitting 3s and the speed sets on squats. Give you that nice mental buzz where you know no matter what you will get the rep, all you have to do is do it properly and as fast as possible. Its just like running sprints, zero stress of completing the run, you just have to do it as fast as possible.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*Bill Starr Rehab Protocol*

*Bill Starr Rehab Protocol*

Hopefully this will be of use to anyone who has suffered a muscle belly tear, I've noticed that there is little information regarding this widely used protocol the info that is available is vague at best 

It is far easier to recover for you lighter lifters, I found that the heavier you lift the harder it is to progress just by the sheer weights you are expected to lift. By day 13 I was lifting 3 sets with 160x5 165x3 170x2, I don't tend to lift weights that are that close together and I found that that particular session made my knees sore, I then decided to re evaluate the protocol and spaced out the rehab weights to 130x5 - 155x4 - 175x3, enough weight to progress from and felt far more comfortable :thumb:

*Injury*: Grade 2 Tear of Hamstring (Semitendinosus) whilst on the lower part of the negative phase of a 200kg parallel squat :doublesho

I have previously torn the hamstring (Grade 1 - Biceps Femoris) whilst doing Barbell rows. I decided to take a very slow and easy approach to rehab and trained the areas 2 twice a week, it took 12 months to get back to my normal lifting weights 

This time around I decided to follow the Bill Starr rehab protocol as close as I could :thumb:

*Pre rehab*:2 Days complete bed rest (Includes the day of injury), Ice 15 minutes every hour.

*Rehab*: Days 1-19 (Includes 4 recovery/rest days) All weights in Kilos.

1	20x20	20x20	20x20 -- Reps felt just uncomfortable no real pain, last set was easiest - moved to 20 reps per set

2	25x20	30x20	30x20 -- Reps felt just uncomfortable no real pain, Second and third sets easiest

3	30x20	35x20	40x20 -- Reps felt slightly uncomfortable no real pain, Second and third sets easiest

4	40x20	45x20	50x20 -- Reps felt slightly uncomfortable no real pain, Second and third sets easiest

*15th June 2014	Day missed - recovery day*

5	50x20	60x20	65x20 -- Least amount of pain felt as though I could have used much more weight

6	65x20	70x20	75x20 -- Pain/sensation of injury felt as though I could have used much more weight

7	75x20	85x20	95x15 -- Pain/sensation of injury felt as though I could have used much more weight

*19th June 2014	Day missed - recovery day*

8	95x15	100x15	105x10 -- Set 1 slight pulling sensation, set 2 minimal pulling sensation and set 3 no pulling at all

9	105x10	110x10	120x10 -- Set 1 minimal pulling, set 2 almost 0 pulling and set 3 no pulling at all

10	120x10	130x8	140x5 -- Set 1 0 pulling, set 2 0 pulling, set 3 140kg slight pulling injured area next day increase by 5kg increments

11	140x5	145x5	150x5 -- Set 1 0 pulling, set 2 very slight pulling, set 3 150kg 0 pulling

*24/06/2014	Day missed - DOMS* :doublesho

12	150x5	155x3	160x3 -- No pulling, very slight feeling when form became lose on set 2

*26/06/2014	Day missed	*

13	160x5	165x3	170x2 -- No pulling sensation but Knees sore due to lifting too much weight for 3 sets

14	130x5 - 155x4 - 175x3 -- felt really good

15 140x5 - 160x3 - 170x3 (Ballsed up, wrong weight on bar :lol: but I was determined to lift 180 :devil 180x2 -- My work is done! :thumb: :thumb:

*Warm up routine*:

*Dynamic stretches *:
10 reps each side, Anterior-posterior leg swings, side to side leg swings, high knee walks, butt kicks, deep wide out drops, cat camels and lying leg raises (With hands under back to increase difficulty)
*Barbell warm up*:
From day 8 warm up sets 20x10, 70x5.
From day 10 warm up sets: 20x10, 70x5, 100x5.
From day 14 until the finish of rehab warm up sets: 60x5, 75x5, 90x3

As you can see by day 5 I was feeling very little sensation of the injury the only feeling was a pulling of the injured area (Not pain, just the newly repaired tissue contracting).

The Bill Starr rehab protocol is amazing. In 15 days of lifting I have made it to 180kg for 2 reps and could have done a third. I will be back to normal training in one weeks time, I'm slightly out of sync so I need to do a de load week next week then start the 10/8/5 for month one followed by the 5/3/1 (I will be going for a 190kg squat as long as all goes well, then a 200kg squat on month 4) I will video it again and hopefully this time I go down and come up, unlike last time in the video I just go down 

From my own experience of the protocol I would say you owe it to yourself to give it a go. Also I have noticed that this time there is no sensation of the injury at all. The last time I took the slow approach I could feel the area that was injured (Possibly this sensation is caused by scar tissue?)

Due to the injuries I have had I will now be taking a different approach, in fact ill be taking the approach of professional lifters and train as though I'm going into competition and cycle my lifting by using both the 10/8/5 and 5/3/1.

Example:
Month 1 10/8/5
Month 2 5/3/1 (Single reps reduced by 10kg, Example - Squat 190kg)
Month 3 10/8/5
Month 4 5/3/1 (Single reps use the full 100% weight, Example - Squat 200kg)

This way I'll only be using max weight 3 times a year, my only concern is the high rep work may make me even heavier as I do tend to pack on muscle reasonably easy, my over all weight will be controlled by keeping calories around 2800 - 3000 per day. If I start to lose weight I will increase calories accordingly :thumb:
I am now counting calories as no matter what I intend to drop 8-9 pounds of body fat.

Any you peeps have question feel free to ask, I've learnt a lot more this time around and I know it will make me a better lifter :thumb: Hopefully I've not left anything out


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> So did my rehab Wed night. That program always amazes me how good it makes my shoulder feel. I used to do prehab at the end of every session and havent been doing it for a few months now so its my own fault I blew my shoulder.
> 
> Im about 1/3 as strong as I was last time I run this rehab program so that would prob have something to do with why my shoulder blew out again. I will come back bigger and stronger in the future thought.
> 
> Deadlifts tonight, got my excitement back for training, loving hitting 3s and the speed sets on squats. Give you that nice mental buzz where you know no matter what you will get the rep, all you have to do is do it properly and as fast as possible. Its just like running sprints, zero stress of completing the run, you just have to do it as fast as possible.


Reading what info there is on rehab (Bill Starr and starting strength site) you should really be rehabbing that area and leaving out all other training :tumbleweed:


----------



## Guitarjon

Guys, what do we think to benching without a spotter? 

I'm struggling to get past 70kg for 5 proper form reps for 5 sets.

It's annoying as I always think I'll make the next rep but then get stuck. Felt like a right donut the other day when a random guy had to come and help. My wife hasn't been coming to the gym at the same time. I just feel like if I lift lighter I won't progress.

I'm considering swapping the barbell for some dumbbells. At least I can put them down.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Reading what info there is on rehab (Bill Starr and starting strength site) you should really be rehabbing that area and leaving out all other training :tumbleweed:


The Bill Starr program looks good for most injuries as your working the muscle and getting awesome blood flow with the higher reps. Also higher reps have been shown to produce GH so that helps as well. The problem with a Rotary Cuff injury is which exercise would you do the Bill Starr program on, shoulder press, bench press, laterals, bent over laterals, there isnt really a decent exercise that you can use. Also the rotary cuff is more of a stabilizer muscle and its an area that normally needs the balance corrected. Like if I work on getting the muscles to pull my shoulder back then all the pain stops.

Basically i like the Bill starr protocol for all injuries except for the shoulder. Being the most complicated joint in the body, it needs special attention. Also I used the 8 weeks to monsterous shoulders a few times myself and with a lot of people and in 95% of cases, it works extremely well.

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 97.5x5, 115x3) WO 135x3, 155x3, 172.5x3 PM 189.5kg

Thats it again. Just got in ripped my reps nice and fast and got out. Im in and out in less than 15 mins on a fri so I literally have zero excuses not to go. I had people round on fri to meet my new house mate etc (21yr old blonde girl :thumb and could still slip away, rip my weights and come back to socializing. Other than the bagging they barely notice.


----------



## Bod42

Guitarjon said:


> Guys, what do we think to benching without a spotter?
> 
> I'm struggling to get past 70kg for 5 proper form reps for 5 sets.
> 
> It's annoying as I always think I'll make the next rep but then get stuck. Felt like a right donut the other day when a random guy had to come and help. My wife hasn't been coming to the gym at the same time. I just feel like if I lift lighter I won't progress.
> 
> I'm considering swapping the barbell for some dumbbells. At least I can put them down.


I think you should Bench with a spotter or like Doug and I, bench in a power rack. If you get a spotter, make sure you walk him through what spotting is so you dont get the "It's all you Bro, its all you" while he deadlifts the bar. I never advocate forced reps, just fries the Nervous System so we would only step in or touch the bar when we said so, other wise keep your hands off the bar.

I wouldnt change to Dumbell's. Let SLs tell you when to deload, otherwise keep smashing those weights and yes grab a spotter, most people in the gym are more than happy to help.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Guys, what do we think to benching without a spotter?
> 
> I'm struggling to get past 70kg for 5 proper form reps for 5 sets.
> 
> It's annoying as I always think I'll make the next rep but then get stuck. Felt like a right donut the other day when a random guy had to come and help. My wife hasn't been coming to the gym at the same time. I just feel like if I lift lighter I won't progress.
> 
> I'm considering swapping the barbell for some dumbbells. At least I can put them down.


Not a good idea to bench on your own Jon, at least have your missus just keep an eye on you, if memory servers at least 10 people a year die in America benching on their own.

If your goals include heavy benching and squatting I would recommend you look into purchasing a power rack with bench (James and I have the same rack & bench set up) If your lifting goals are lighter than ours, there are lower weight spec racks available and yes they will cost less too :thumb:

Do you have any goals for your main lifts Jon? 

Oh, AND NO DUMBELLS!!!!!!!!!!!!! :doublesho :wall: :lol:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,7,8,8 PR

Not the best workout, my form seemed to be really off and could feel my **** tucking under at the bottom which was weird. This is where the back off sets come into play as you get good speed and form with these. 

The strange thing is I have always been an advocate of training as heavy as you can but since implementing these back off sets, my legs are more muscly and Im sore after each workout. Yes I know that DOMS isnt a sign of progress but still means something has changed normally.

Deadlifts was a PR DOH. Can feel my grip getting stronger by the week and without training Fat gripz, i can now use them just from the DOH work on Deadlifts. Grip has never really been a problem for me on Deadlifts but I still think this extra grip training is helping because as soon as I get to mixed grip on deadlifts, the weight actually feels lighter.


----------



## Guitarjon

Really aching again today. Done a few stretches and seem better. I'm aching more in the evening the day after workout. I'm not complaining though. I've mixed in a few lighter weights for more reps just so I'm not going all out heavy on every session. Although DOMs seems to be kicking in a little more. 

Shoulders seem to be getting very defined and I can feel muscle in the tops of my boobs now making them appear flatter if that makes sense. Apparently the back is looking good minus the hair too, not that I can see it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 10/8/5

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) 63KGX10 - 77KGX10 - 91KGX10

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10x10x10x10x10

PULL UPS 2x2x2x2x2*

Felt really weird training with such light weight and higher reps, although I can see it will get more difficult very soon on the last work set. Ill be adding 2.5kg on upper body and 5kg on lower body lifts.
All percentages were worked out from my actual 1 rep lifts (Bench 140kg, Squat 200kg, OHP 84kg and Deadlift 210kg) :thumb:

I will have a bit of a play with the assistance work and find the exercises that really do help. Example - I might replace the 80kgx10 Bench press sets with 5 sets of dips.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7

Good workout, form felt better than last week but still not perfect. Back off sets did move really well though without basically any slowing at my sticking point. Squats are definitely feeling better and better. I am going to start increasing the weight though because i have a goal of hitting 170kg for 3 reps before I start my diet.

Something didnt feel quite right with my back during deadlifts today so i cut them short. Dont want a buggered back and shoulder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 10/8/5

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 90KGX10 - 110KGX10 - 130KGX10

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, the higher reps made the workout more tiring than difficult, which is Probably due to me eating at a 500 Calorie per day deficit and poor cardiovascular fitness. I'm currently consuming an average of 2700 calories, 3-4 litres of water and 190 -220 grams of protein per day. I'll stick to this for a month then re evaluate. My goal is 14%-15% body fat :thumb:

I currently weigh 111Kg at a 20% body fat

Slight alteration to rest periods - Same 7 minute rest between the work sets, but increased to 5 minutes rest for the light assistance sets.

All in all I like the juggernaut/hypertrophy approach. It will add variation to my workouts and most importantly allow me to lift heavy every other month  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug how comes you have increased your rest between the assistant stuff?


----------



## Guitarjon

Ok, probably not what you guys want to hear but I've strayed off the beaten track.ive not been doing so much heavy compound stuff as of late. 

I've started doing a full body workout routine. It still incorporates heavy compounds but only once a week. It has a heavy day, medium day and light day. Heavy sets with 3 reps, medium weights with 6-10 reps and light days with 10-15 reps. Light is Said to be around 60% of your max 1 rm. I come away feeling more like I've had a workout although the intensity isn't what it was. I've decided my main aim is to loose body fat for he time being. I will continue with the strong lifts at a later date as I feel its more focused and really helps shift the weight. I genuinely believe that some of the exercises I'm doing on the medium day are helping build muscles in my back and last/ delta where I wasn't before which is aiding other compound lifts. I maybe wrong. 

I'll still keep coming on here with updates on my heavy days which is still pretty much like the strong lifts.


----------



## Bod42

SLs is a full body routine. 

Thats a very old school type of routine with light days. If you notice Doug & i just do our assistant work at higher reps lighter weight. 

Hope it goes well for you. This thread has kind of adapted to more than just a SLs workout so feel free t throw up all your workouts. Im going to when Im on a cut.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug how comes you have increased your rest between the assistant stuff?


Basically I'm doing it to get into this different way of training, I'll probably go back to 3 minutes within a few weeks as I felt the 5 minute rest periods were already feeling too long on this weeks squat session. But I'm going to rest according to how I feel on the day for the high rep sessions but not go over 5 minute rest periods. IMO I don't think it really matters.

However, I've been reading a lot about how the body uses energy (Carbs, Fat and proteins) If you want to maximise fat burning it seems best advised to train low intensity. A longer rest period between sets and the body turns to fat for energy, the shorter rest period and it uses Glycogen (This is stored in the muscles and liver). The muscle Glycogen can be depleted during a long workout but the liver Glycogen can take days on a low carb diet. Contrary to what most people think its not just the workout that burns the calories but the after effect on the metabolism combined with eating in a slight deficit over a long period that puts the body in a state of burning fat (my mind set is this a 12 month eating challenge with goals) :thumb:

I'm basically eating low carb, low fat, high protein. My glycogen stores may become depleted so longer rest periods will help me adapt. I may have to eat a small carb meal an hour or so pre workout. I'm taking the eating as seriously as the training now and can see how the successful ones do it. I have a training log and now an eating log 

This time I am very determined to get to 15% body fat and then re evaluate with the possibility of going 12-14% body fat. The last time I noticed changes within a few weeks, this time I intend to stick to it all the way and still lift 90% heavy every second month and lift 100% 3 times a year :thumb:

Hope you enjoy the e books mate, I found leigh's approach easy to read and helped me gain an interest in understanding the nutritional aspects of sport, even though I may not agree 100% with her, the basics were written out very well and for the first time I actually read the whole book :doublesho

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Ok, probably not what you guys want to hear but I've strayed off the beaten track.ive not been doing so much heavy compound stuff as of late.
> 
> I've started doing a full body workout routine. It still incorporates heavy compounds but only once a week. It has a heavy day, medium day and light day. Heavy sets with 3 reps, medium weights with 6-10 reps and light days with 10-15 reps. Light is Said to be around 60% of your max 1 rm. I come away feeling more like I've had a workout although the intensity isn't what it was. I've decided my main aim is to loose body fat for he time being. I will continue with the strong lifts at a later date as I feel its more focused and really helps shift the weight. I genuinely believe that some of the exercises I'm doing on the medium day are helping build muscles in my back and last/ delta where I wasn't before which is aiding other compound lifts. I maybe wrong.
> 
> I'll still keep coming on here with updates on my heavy days which is still pretty much like the strong lifts.


Jon,

As James says, this is very old skool, I used this workout many years ago. Although it was done with - high intensity (Positive failure all sets) @80% of 1 rep max, doing sets of 6-8 reps, progressive overload, 3 times a week. I had more feel in the high intensity training days, but never packed on muscle to the extent I am now with very little feel due to using all compounds. IMO the beginners body does not react well to higher intensity workouts.

Jon, I'm 45 and been playing with weights for many years, I strongly advise you stick to the 5x5 until you reach the prescribed weights for the lifts as put down on the site and then move over to the 5/3/1 or the juggernaut variation 10/8/5 (Thanks James :thumb I have never packed on as much strength and muscle as I have over the last 2.5 years.

Losing fat is 100% nutrition/calories. Exercise just helps to reach the calorie deficit easier and to help increase the bodies overall metabolism so at rest it burns more calories (However if you train and build more muscle, the more lean muscle mass a body has, the more calories are burnt at rest), you could do any activity as long as your in a calorie deficit and you'll loose fat (and muscle if you don't train or eat right) by thinking a certain workout will help you lose more fat is incorrect, it is all about the calorie expenditure. So if you want to burn more calories you move more. If your 3 day a week workout burns more calories you'll experience a higher percentage of body fat reduction, does this make it a better workout? It all depends on what you truly want from your workout and what you want your body to look like.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 10/8/5

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 52KGX10 - 60KGX8 - 68KGX3 WRONG WEIGHTS! :wall: 

DIPS 10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50x10x10x10x7x7*

I wondered why I felt pre exhausted during the work sets! lol, I used the wrong weights, I should had done - 36KGx10 - 44KGx10 - 52KGx10 :wall: 

Never mind, good workout, will keep to these exercises as it will allow for more volume :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 10/8/5

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 70KGX8 - 84KGX8 - 98KGX8

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Workout went well, finding it hard to get motivated using light weights though. However, as I progress it will start to become more of a challenge :thumb:

Still sticking to the 500 calorie deficit per day for the next month, if no fat loss ill move up to a 700 calorie per day deficit. No noticeable loss in energy at present :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 100x5, 115x3) WO 135x3, 155x3, 172.5x3 PM 189.5kg

Thats it. Ok i was ill from thurs to mon this week so kept the weight the same as thought it would be a real struggle but this was the best the weight has moved yet so Im going to increase the weight next week.

Just slowly increasing my deadlift, not forcing anything and concentrating on my squats. With squats I want to hit 170kg for 3 reps before i start my diet. That means i have to put on 7.5kg in 1 month which should be achievable.

Doug you should still be trying to throw that weight through the ceiling even with lighter weights. And setting a new 10rep PR is no different than setting a new 1rep PR, you should still be focused and be chasing rep PRs no matter the number.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 10//8/5

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 100KGX8 - 120KGX8 - 140KGX8

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, went back to normal rest periods (7 minute work sets and 3 minutes assistance) to help increase difficulty. Humidity was crazy today adding to the difficulty :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug you should still be trying to throw that weight through the ceiling even with lighter weights. And setting a new 10rep PR is no different than setting a new 1rep PR, you should still be focused and be chasing rep PRs no matter the number.


I agree James, will help to do some speed training. I was also thinking of using just 8 reps for all the weeks and adding weight to any set that 8 reps were reached to increase the load and help with hypertrophy training. Not sure yet though, best thing is to enjoy and experiment with the medium training months and maintain my optimum strength with a strict 5/3/1 on the heavy months :thumb:

I think now I'm in maintenance mode for the squat and deadlift I still need to have goals, for me its keeping those 1 rep maxes and progressing my bench press 
I also want to increase muscle mass and reduce body fat, I want It all!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I agree James, will help to do some speed training. I was also thinking of using just 8 reps for all the weeks and adding weight to any set that 8 reps were reached to increase the load and help with hypertrophy training. Not sure yet though, best thing is to enjoy and experiment with the medium training months and *maintain my optimum strength with a strict 5/3/1 on the heavy months :thumb:
> *
> I think now I'm in maintenance mode for the squat and deadlift I still need to have goals, for me its keeping those 1 rep maxes and progressing my bench press
> I also want to increase muscle mass and reduce body fat, I want It all!


Doug, its been proven that the rep work is what builds your strength when your RAW so dont worry, your not going to lose strength by doing the higher reps. Reading about all the strongest RAW guys, they all use rep work as a way to increase strength. If your doing 8reps of 100kgs and then you work up to 120kg for 8 reps, you have obviously got stronger, doesnt matter if its higher reps or not.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, its been proven that the rep work is what builds your strength when your RAW so dont worry, your not going to lose strength by doing the higher reps. Reading about all the strongest RAW guys, they all use rep work as a way to increase strength. If your doing 8reps of 100kgs and then you work up to 120kg for 8 reps, you have obviously got stronger, doesnt matter if its higher reps or not.


Thanks for the info James. I'll stay with the planned 10/8/5 :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats (WU 70x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 127.5x3, 145x3, 165x3
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x8,8,8,6,6,

All in all a good workout. I have programmed in 170kg for 3 reps the week before i start my diet so kind of have to hit every weight with confidence but thats 1 down, only 2 more increases to go. Training with more speed now seems to really help as i still hit a sticking point on my heavy 3 reps but I never worry during the rep that i wont make it. I seem to be able to drive through the sticking point easier. Form still isnt 100% on but getting there. Im still praising back off sets. Would have never dreamed of doing these a few years back but now they are a staple of my program.

This weeks abit messed up as couldnt work out Mon or Fri so I did heavy Deads Tues, Shoulder rehab wed, squats and deadlifts thur. Not ideal but at least i got all my work in. This is why i wasnt to worried about not hitting all my reps on deadlifts as I only heay deadlifted 2 days prior.

Starting to make some really good progress at the moment. Funny thing it, i havent done an upper body exercise in a month but my arms have grown.

Probably the best way i have seen it written.

Hypertrophy is not a localized process; at least it isn't those of us who don't suckle at the teat of the goddess Steroidia. Instead, it's systemic. What I mean by that is that for the most part, given sufficient stimulus, muscle growth happens all over your body instead of in one teeny location. *As such, doing work that puts a big load on the whole body - putting a big load on the spine - will cause more growth in your biceps than working the biceps directly. To put it another way, doing trap-bar deadlifts will generally do more to make your arms bigger than doing curls.*

That wild wag Charles Poliquin has often written that in order to gain an inch of circumference on your arms, you need to gain about 15 pounds of muscle, and he's pretty much right. If it were otherwise, you'd surely see guys walking around who trained nothing but biceps and as a result were inverse T-Rex types that had huge arms and tiny little bodies and ate cans of spinach instead of Iguanodons. But you don't.

Now a biceps specific program will surely add some size to your arms as long as you're doing everything else right, but the results would generally pale in comparison to what you'd get if you did a program that was biased towards the deadlift or some other big total body movement. Likewise, a biceps-specific program would help if you've been doing the big movements all along but need a bit of an area-specific catalyst.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 10/8/5

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 40KGX8 - 48KGX8 - 56KGX8

DIPS x10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KG x10x10x10x10x10*

The 8 rep work sets felt really good. Rested only as long as I needed between work sets and only took 3 minutes rest between all other assistance sets.

A good tip for the OHP. Squeeze your glute's really hard when executing this movement to help protect your lower back from injury caused by excessive arching of the back :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Probably the best way i have seen it written.
> 
> Hypertrophy is not a localized process; at least it isn't those of us who don't suckle at the teat of the goddess Steroidia. Instead, it's systemic. What I mean by that is that for the most part, given sufficient stimulus, muscle growth happens all over your body instead of in one teeny location. *As such, doing work that puts a big load on the whole body - putting a big load on the spine - will cause more growth in your biceps than working the biceps directly. To put it another way, doing trap-bar deadlifts will generally do more to make your arms bigger than doing curls.*
> 
> That wild wag Charles Poliquin has often written that in order to gain an inch of circumference on your arms, you need to gain about 15 pounds of muscle, and he's pretty much right. If it were otherwise, you'd surely see guys walking around who trained nothing but biceps and as a result were inverse T-Rex types that had huge arms and tiny little bodies and ate cans of spinach instead of Iguanodons. But you don't.
> 
> Now a biceps specific program will surely add some size to your arms as long as you're doing everything else right, but the results would generally pale in comparison to what you'd get if you did a program that was biased towards the deadlift or some other big total body movement. Likewise, a biceps-specific program would help if you've been doing the big movements all along but need a bit of an area-specific catalyst.


Totally agree James, I have dam good sized arms but never directly train them. Isolation work IS for losers


----------



## dave-g

ITHAQVA said:


> A good tip for the OHP. Squeeze your glute's really hard when executing this movement to help protect your lower back from injury caused by excessive arching of the back :thumb:


Will give this a shot, only just getting into ohp's but find myself getting a bit arched after set 3 so have to back off. 
Second week in, so only light at 35kg presses but seeing progression already.


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> Will give this a shot, only just getting into ohp's but find myself getting a bit arched after set 3 so have to back off.
> Second week in, so only light at 35kg presses but seeing progression already.


Dave, You'll find it works very well, concentrate on squeezing those glute's hard, it will inhibit arching and help stabilise your body - end result lifting more :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

*310,453 views on this thread, yet only two members consistently post here* :doublesho
LOL WTF!!!!


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> *310,453 views on this thread, yet only two members consistently post here* :doublesho
> LOL WTF!!!!


I'm still here too mate, just haven't posted up any workouts for a while! 
Heavy squat session later today so aiming to do my goal of twice bodyweight....


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 10/8/5

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 105KGX8 - 126KGX8 - 147KGX8

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 70KGx5x5x5x5x5 *

All good. Tried some light Romanian deadlifts today. Will add weight to this lift and build slowly. You can feel the tension in the Hamstrings on this lift. I will set my bench up for GHR as well very soon :thumb:

Progression: Hypertrophy month, increase weight by 2.5kg per month. Strength month, increase weight on the bench press and OHP by 2.5kg per month as long as all reps are achieved. Squat and deadlift weight will now remain static :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 - 10/8/5
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 105KGX8 - 126KGX8 - 147KGX8
> 
> DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10
> 
> RDL 70KGx5x5x5x5x5 *
> 
> All good. Tried some light Romanian deadlifts today. Will add weight to this lift and build slowly. You can feel the tension in the Hamstrings on this lift. I will set my bench up for GHR as well very soon :thumb:
> 
> Progression: Hypertrophy month, increase weight by 2.5kg per month. Strength month, increase weight on the bench press and OHP by 2.5kg per month as long as all reps are achieved. Squat and deadlift weight will now remain static :thumb:


Haha ya wonder who reads this thread or is it just 150k views each for me and Doug lol.

Nice lifts Doug. I bet that now you have put your lower body lifts into maintenance mode that they will still increase. Wish I could get my lower body lifts to your standard but they are finally starting to move.

If things go to plan then I should be doing 185x3 deads and 170x3 squats by the end of August, hooah.

Shoulder still feels like crap but havent done an upper body exercise in a month so its time to start adding them back in. Bench hurts but over head press doesnt so just going to do OHP with BBB workout.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 5, Session 3 - Squat

WU - 60kgx5, 70kgx5, 87.5kgx3

WO - 107.5kgx5, 122.5kgx3, 140kgx4
Was only supposed to be doing 137.5kg as my final work set but the 122.5kg felt pretty easy so I figured I may as well go for 140kg :thumb:
That's twice my bodyweight so the second goal checked off my list. Won't settle on that though and will continue to progress with 5kg every cycle.

Squat 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 

Calf raise - 149kgx20, 149kgx20, 159kgx20, 169kgx20, 179kgx20

Leg Extension - 70kgx10, 75kgx10, 80kgx10, 85kgx10, 90kgx10

Finished with 5 mins of interval training on the bike, 45 seconds normal pace followed by 15 seconds of sprint

Legs feel lovely today


----------



## Guitarjon

Still here guys.on holiday at the moment so a complete break.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice lifts Doug. I bet that now you have put your lower body lifts into maintenance mode that they will still increase. Wish I could get my lower body lifts to your standard but they are finally starting to move.


Dam I've been rumbled James  Not sure about lifting heavier mate, but I have been thinking about gaining more size as I reduce my body fat. I'm totally happy with my strength levels, but would like to be at a minimum 238Lb/110Kg @15% body fat. Ultimately I would like to make 250Lb/114kg @ 15% body fat, but I have no idea of what my potential is as a 100% natural lifter.



Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 5, Session 3 - Squat
> 
> WU - 60kgx5, 70kgx5, 87.5kgx3
> 
> WO - 107.5kgx5, 122.5kgx3, 140kgx4
> Was only supposed to be doing 137.5kg as my final work set but the 122.5kg felt pretty easy so I figured I may as well go for 140kg :thumb:
> That's twice my bodyweight so the second goal checked off my list. Won't settle on that though and will continue to progress with 5kg every cycle.
> 
> Squat 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5, 70kgx5,
> 
> Calf raise - 149kgx20, 149kgx20, 159kgx20, 169kgx20, 179kgx20
> 
> Leg Extension - 70kgx10, 75kgx10, 80kgx10, 85kgx10, 90kgx10
> 
> Finished with 5 mins of interval training on the bike, 45 seconds normal pace followed by 15 seconds of sprint
> 
> Legs feel lovely today


Lee, 2 x bodyweight is awesome mate, well done! :thumb::thumb:

Am I right you weigh 70Kg?


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Lee, 2 x bodyweight is awesome mate, well done! :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Am I right you weigh 70Kg?


Cheers Doug, I was well happy with it too especially managing to get out 4! 
I haven't weighed myself for ages but yep I was between 69 and 70kg when I started this 5/3/1 back in Feb/March. 
I probably weigh a slight bit more so it could mean that I didn't actually do twice my current bw as have definitely put on muscle... Will get on the scales tomorrow and then may have a new goal! 
Either way I'm happy with the improvement though!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Dam I've been rumbled James  Not sure about lifting heavier mate, but I have been thinking about gaining more size as I reduce my body fat. I'm totally happy with my strength levels, but would like to be at a minimum 238Lb/110Kg @15% body fat. Ultimately I would like to make 250Lb/114kg @ 15% body fat, but I have no idea of what my potential is as a 100% natural lifter.
> 
> Lee, 2 x bodyweight is awesome mate, well done! :thumb::thumb:
> 
> Am I right you weigh 70Kg?


Not heavier Doug, sticking to same weights your doing but I bet you anything if you keep trying to throw those lower body movements through the ceiling and get faster at them in maintenance mode then retest in a few months then you will be stronger just from your maintenance mode.

Ya Im aiming for around 12% BF as my overall goal but around 100-105kg but at my height, that is a big ask but i seem to build muscle pretty easily.

Awesome work Lee, 2 times bodyweight is my goal as well. Got about 30kg to go now. But going to cheat and lose some weight now :lol: Im doing as Wendler and Paul Carter advocate, divide your year in to 3 month programs and go after a goal hard out. So the last 3 months have been pure strength, havent missed a rep in months now, great feeling, next 3 months will be fitness and fat lose, strength maintenance. I actually have 6 weeks where i just go in, do the compound lift to try and maintain my strength then do circuits.


----------



## Bokers

I'm still here too. Reset my lifts and started rugby pre-season so it's all backed off a bit! Much fitter already though.


----------



## Leebo310

Ok, weighed myself this morning and was surprised to see 76.1kg! Happy that obviously I have put on a good amount of muscle but annoyingly it does mean that I haven't actually hit any of my goals yet then! 
Need to get a bw ohp (another 3.5kg) and then as good as my squat was, I need to add another 12kg to it!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Ok, weighed myself this morning and was surprised to see 76.1kg! Happy that obviously I have put on a good amount of muscle but annoyingly it does mean that I haven't actually hit any of my goals yet then!
> Need to get a bw ohp (another 3.5kg) and then as good as my squat was, I need to add another 12kg to it!!


You wait until you weight 100kg +, it only get harder from hear on in Lee


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> You wait until you weight 100kg +, it only get harder from hear on in Lee


Based on the current pace though, I'll weigh 100kg in 24 months, but hit a 200kg squat in 12... :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 10/8/5

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 77KGX5 - 91KGX5 - 105KGX9 Kicking myself, I have no idea why I stopped at 9 reps :wall:

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEAD BARBELL ROW 80KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Still feels really weird training so light, but I'm getting used to it, I think once I do next months heavy cycle it will all fall into place


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Based on the current pace though, I'll weigh 100kg in 24 months, but hit a 200kg squat in 12... :doublesho


Please don't have to high expectations Lee, muscle sports are long term, enjoy the ride and you'll get there soon enough :thumb:

I can tell you now, having 200kg on your back is very humbling :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 97.5x5, 120x3) WO 137.5x3, 155x3, 175x3 PM 192.5
Shoulder Rehab Work
Inverted Rows

One of the best deadlifts workout Ive had in a long time. My technique feels really good, having a stronger grip seems to really help and Im getting seriously fast on my warm up weights. 

This was my last full shoulder rehab workout but i will be keeping RC work in my workouts from now on as I slacked off and then i tore my shoulder. RC has got so much stronger just after a month of these workouts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 10/8/5

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 110KGX5 - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10 superset with 70x10x10x10*

Took only 3 minutes rest for all sets except the superset were I just rested enough to get 50% of my breath back :devil:

Have thought about it and I want to get bigger (250lb @ sub 15% body fat) :thumb: but I'm staying on my eating regime at present as I'm losing an average of 1lb - .8lb per week and already looking more muscular in less than 4 weeks :thumb: once I'm happy with my body fat level I'll increase my protein intake to 230-250 grams per day :thumb:

I will use the hypertrophy month to train for size and use supersets, plate strip and train some sets to positive failure. I'll then use the heavy fixed month for pure strength so that I keep my power up and force my body to hang onto as much muscle mass as possible :thumb:

There will be no isolation exercises in my posts! 

This is awesome


----------



## ITHAQVA

You want to know what it takes in this game, Dedication and an understanding wife 

This months musclefood order :thumb:

10 x 6-7oz Great British Rump Steaks
5KG - Premium Chicken Breast Fillets (Approx 22-25)
11 x British Beef Sticks 100g, I usually by Biltong or jerky in 50 gram bags but these are awesome value - £2 per 100gram bag! I can split into two servings (I only have one serving of this per day) :thumb:

And no that's not all my protein, once a week we get Tuna, Pork loins, eggs, lean minced beef, ****les, cottage cheese and smoked mackerel :doublesho

I take one 500ml protein shake per day at 7Am, made with skimmed milk (57grams protein) purely for convenience to build up my daily protein intake.

I started eating in a more structured manner (5 meals a day) approx. 3 weeks ago and I'm going to keep at this for 12 months, I'm really interested to see how much muscle can be built on a slight calorie deficit, but still ingest loads of protein and lift heavy :devil: 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nice work Doug. Ive never really been an advocate of all those strip sets, forced reps etc as i just think they kill your recovery.

Easiest way to get bigger is higher reps with shorter rest. Im happy with my size and I normally do 3mins between lower body workouts and 2.5mins between upper body and thats only my top sets, warm up are more like 1 min.

Talking of higher reps, lower rest.
Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 30x5, 37.5x3) WO 40x5, 47.5x5, 52.5x7
BBB: 30x10,10,8,6,7
Neutral Chin Ups:10x2
Inverted Rows: 3x10

2.5mins rest between heavy sets, 1.5mins between BBB sets. I can see how anyone who does BBB increases their shoulder press well as this workout felt great. Shoulder didnt feel perfect but Im used to that.

Doug what does your daily diet look like at the moment as you seem to diet and gain strength so must be bang on. Im in the process of writing mine.


----------



## Bokers

Yesterday
Power Clean and Jerk
20, 30, 40 50kg x 3 x 3

Speed Squats
40, 60, 70kg x 3 x 3

OHP
40kg x 5 x 5

Dips
BW + Green Band x 12 x 3

Pullups
BW + + Green Band 3 x 10

Deadlifts
70, 110, 150, 160kg x 5

Tonight
Rugby training. Dead!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice work Doug. Ive never really been an advocate of all those strip sets, forced reps etc as i just think they kill your recovery.
> 
> Doug what does your daily diet look like at the moment as you seem to diet and gain strength so must be bang on. Im in the process of writing mine.


I agree about intensity James but as I'll only be doing this either on the last work set (Do more reps than prescribed) or on the assistance sets (Strip or superset the last set) and its only on the light month, I'm not overly concerned about overtraining.

Daily diet: BMR - 3248 (using Harris Benedict BMR formula and activity level of 1.50) 
Daily max calories after 500 cals removed - 2748
Liquids - 3.5 litres per day (Not including liquid from my food)

Daily eating regime:

6.30am - 7am 500ml Protein shake with skimmed milk (57 gram protein)

10am Salad, with either (2xchick breast, 5xboiled eggs, 1xtin tuna 112g drained weight)

1-2pm Beef jerky/biltong (50gram bag 25g protein)

6.30 Main meal of the day always eaten after workout will consist of either 2-3 portions of various greens (green beans, peas, asparagus) or 2 portions of pulses (Kidney beans, cannellini beans, butter beans) and one of the following protein sources - 4 x pork loins, 2 x 195 gram steaks, 1x 220gram salmon, once a week ill have a home made chilie with 500grams of lean mince meat.

8.30 300gram Cottage cheese with pineapple (28 gram casein protein)

That's is it, as I eat very much the same week in week out tracking this is much easier for me. I love all the food I eat and with the added benefit of knowing its "Good fuel" for my body my motivation is high.

Counting calories is important especially when you eat something out of the norm, today for instance I will be having a treat - a kebab! yesterday I had plenty of calls left so had a peperoni. That's the interesting part, now im concentrating on making protein my primary concern my calorie deficit can go up to 1000 cals on some days, as long as I've got a minimum of 200 grams of protein (Increasing to 250 soon) in I'm ok to go higher with my deficit as I believe you need to fluctuate so the body doesn't get itself into a starvation mode, that's why once a week I have a mad meal. The kebab tonight in itself will be around 2500 cals, by doing this once a week my body will not lower my metabolism and because some days my deficit has been higher than it needs to be my weekly deficit is still intact :thumb:

I actually believe I could go to a higher calorie deficit but im losing around a pound a week, as long as this continues ill stay as I am for optimum performance and fat loss:thumb:

I plan ahead with my meals, todays example;

*NOW! Protein shake skim milk 57	-	388

10am 5x boiled eggs salad 30	-	375

2pm biltong 25	-	234*

By 2pm today ill have ingested 112gram protein and 997 calories :thumb:

I've been doing this for around 4 weeks and my desires fort junk or sugar are almost zero, my body is now reset to eating the way it should, the first week was the hardest (hunger) I'm also finding that I'm going off the mad meal as well. It seems eating healthy induces you to eat even more healthy.

I think the more meals in the day also plays a big part, but when I say meals only two of them are meals in the traditional sense, I consider a 50gram bag of beef jerky/biltong a meal. a protein shake a meal and my pot of cottage cheese in the evening is a meal.

Going on what I've learned over the last 4 weeks I would say the body builders are the closest to getting I right: more frequent small meals and loads of protein throughout the day and evening :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug what does your daily diet look like at the moment as you seem to diet and gain strength so must be bang on. Im in the process of writing mine.


I would also say that my physical and psychological make up, make me genetically optimised for strength. I'm very much an Alpha male


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, Session 1
Bench press
WU 40kgx5, 50kgx5, 60kgx3
WO 70kgx5, 80kgx5, 90kgx10

Bench 
52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 

V bar tricep push down
30kgx10, 32.5kgx10, 35kgx10, 35kgx10, 35kgx10, 

Cable cross
12.5kgx10, 15kgx10, 15kgx10, 17.5kgx10, 20kgx10

Main work sets had 2 minutes rest, all assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets


----------



## dave-g

Just out of interest doing, how much did your muscle food order work out at?
Was comparing between them and the local butchers


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> Just out of interest doing, how much did your muscle food order work out at?
> Was comparing between them and the local butchers


Hi Dave,

This musclefood total order was £76 free shipping.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 6, Session 1
> Bench press
> WU 40kgx5, 50kgx5, 60kgx3
> WO 70kgx5, 80kgx5, 90kgx10
> 
> Bench
> 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10,
> 
> V bar tricep push down
> 30kgx10, 32.5kgx10, 35kgx10, 35kgx10, 35kgx10,
> 
> Cable cross
> 12.5kgx10, 15kgx10, 15kgx10, 17.5kgx10, 20kgx10
> 
> Main work sets had 2 minutes rest, all assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets


Lee, for maximum power and muscle gains in your arms you would be far better of doing 5 sets of 10 reps barbell row (80kg or whatever weight you can manage) than all that isolation work :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 10/8/5

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 44KGX5 - 52KGX5 - 60KGX8

DIPS x10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KG x10x10x10x10x10*

All pretty straight forward, I did add 3 extras reps to the last work set :thumb:

Something we've talked out in the past is that warming up the shoulder area for heavy overhead pressing has always seemed a bit difficult and for me personally I have found my progress to be sometimes hit and miss. One thing that does make a huge difference is to continuously squeeze the glutes really hard as you do this exercises.

I'm also wondering if the higher rep approach suites the overhead press better due to the difficulties warming and prepping for heavy lifting.

Time for some more protein!!!! 450grams of grilled Kippers


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 10/8/5

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 115.5GX5 - 136.5KGX5 - 157.5KGX5

DEADLIFT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 100KGx5x5x5x5x5*

All good, I could feel the RDL reps working my grip and Hamstrings nicely :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Friday Night
Squats: (WU 72.5x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 127.5x3, 145x3, 165x3 PM 181.5kg
Back off sets: 125x3,3,3

Got all my reps but was pretty slow tonight, back off sets were ok but my top set felt slow. 

Then i spent all day running up dunes offroading in the dunes so that really worked the legs as well.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, session 1 

Squat
WU - 60kgx5, 75kgx5, 90kgx5
WO - 97.5kgx5, 112.5kgx5, 127.5kgx7

Squat
75kgx10, 75kgx10, 75kgx10, 75kgx10, 75kgx10, 

Calf raise
159kgx20, 169kgx20, 179kgx20, 189kgx20, 199kgx20


----------



## ITHAQVA

Some changes to my training 

I've been trialling Romanian deadlifts recently and every time I get doms the feeling is just the Hamstrings. Perfect for strengthening them! I'll also start some GHR on the next hypertrophy month :thumb:

I'll be adding some heavy RDL work on my heavy and hypertrophy month :thumb: I'll use the current 100kg, work up to 5 sets of 10 then add weight :thumb:

I will also be following Bill stars Dip progression method and his OHP training method so I can get really heavy with my Bench press and OHP. Apparently I need to get dipping with 50kg around my waist :doublesho then my bench and OHP will improve, No shiit! 

Need to buy a good dipping belt


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> I will also be following Bill stars Dip progression method and his OHP training method so I can get really heavy with my Bench press and OHP. Apparently I need to get dipping with 50kg around my waist :doublesho then my bench and OHP will improve, No shiit!
> 
> Need to buy a good dipping belt


Dips are such a good exercise, but I get such pain in my right arm when I do them I've had to drop them completely from my workouts 
I broke my upper arm pretty badly several years ago and now have a big metal plate in there and weirdly dips are the only exercise where I actually feel it. Literally feels like an electric shock!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Dips are such a good exercise, but I get such pain in my right arm when I do them I've had to drop them completely from my workouts
> I broke my upper arm pretty badly several years ago and now have a big metal plate in there and weirdly dips are the only exercise where I actually feel it. Literally feels like an electric shock!


Dips rock as do pull ups, when you can do both exercises and have a good deal of body weight, they are awesome for upper body power and size.

If you can do them Lee, there are alternatives, I would suggest a close grip bench press and press really hard, rely on the triceps to lock out the arms, when I was younger that approach got me to a 180kg bench press and close grip bench press:thumb:

Go as narrow as you can mange to engage the triceps, a smith machine is ideal for this and will allow you to press with both hands touching, max out the weight and train with a 3-5 rep range :thumb:

Although Bill starr says dips with 50kg will help, I found many years ago that bodyweight plus 40kg made a big difference.

I agree with Dave Tate, the bench press is a Triceps exercise :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Dips rock as do pull ups, when you can do both exercises and have a good deal of body weight, they are awesome for upper body power and size.
> 
> If you can do them Lee, there are alternatives, I would suggest a close grip bench press and press really hard, rely on the triceps to lock out the arms, when I was younger that approach got me to a 180kg bench press and close grip bench press:thumb:
> 
> Go as narrow as you can mange to engage the triceps, a smith machine is ideal for this and will allow you to press with both hands touching, max out the weight and train with a 3-5 rep range :thumb:
> 
> Although Bill starr says dips with 50kg will help, I found many years ago that bodyweight plus 40kg made a big difference.
> 
> I agree with Dave Tate, the bench press is a Triceps exercise :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:


Yep Doug, closed grip press is already a staple of my workouts, it's one if my favourite exercises! 
I grip pretty narrow, with probably about a two inch gap, if that, between my hands. I found any closer and the bar was a little unstable but that seems to be the perfect width for me on a free bar. May try on the smith then and actually touch hands and see how that goes.
I will try doing some low rep/heavy weight ones then as at the moment I tend to do 5x10 with a medium weight as per my other assistance exercises. 
What main lift do you normally do them with? I tend to put them with bench mostly or on occasions ohp.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Yep Doug, closed grip press is already a staple of my workouts, it's one if my favourite exercises!
> I grip pretty narrow, with probably about a two inch gap, if that, between my hands. I found any closer and the bar was a little unstable but that seems to be the perfect width for me on a free bar. May try on the smith then and actually touch hands and see how that goes.
> I will try doing some low rep/heavy weight ones then as at the moment I tend to do 5x10 with a medium weight as per my other assistance exercises.
> What main lift do you normally do them with? I tend to put them with bench mostly or on occasions ohp.


I haven't done much this time around, but I would do them on your bench press day. I'm going for heavy dips this time 

You can do them as an assistance after your Bench work sets :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Never met a guy who can dip a lot and had small arms and a crap bench press. Maybe thats why my bench press went up as i was doing BW+45 for 5 reps last cycle.

I have always thought that doing your lower body movements are absolutely essential in a workout but the last month has really cemented that fact for me. Have done 1 upper body workout in 6 weeks and all I have been concentrating on is my lower body lifts but my upper body feels the most solid it has in ages and the Mrs says that my arms are looking massive. Strange that increasing your lower body movements can make your upper body bigger. Was ill over the weekend but need to get back to training as only have 3 weeks left before my diet and I will miss my goal if i dnt move my ****. 2 weeks of 167.5 then my goal of 170 x3


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 de load :wave:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 55KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 85KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

To help with cardio fitness I'm taking very little rest during the whole de load workouts :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Never met a guy who can dip a lot and had small arms and a crap bench press. Maybe thats why my bench press went up as i was doing BW+45 for 5 reps last cycle.
> 
> I have always thought that doing your lower body movements are absolutely essential in a workout but the last month has really cemented that fact for me. Have done 1 upper body workout in 6 weeks and all I have been concentrating on is my lower body lifts but my upper body feels the most solid it has in ages and the Mrs says that my arms are looking massive. Strange that increasing your lower body movements can make your upper body bigger. Was ill over the weekend but need to get back to training as only have 3 weeks left before my diet and I will miss my goal if i dnt move my ****. 2 weeks of 167.5 then my goal of 170 x3


Exactly mate, I'm sick of just benching 140kg and would like to get up to 150kg before the end of the year :thumb:

Starting first stage next week: Work up to 4 sets of 20 reps body weight (I have no idea how long that will take, but if I can manage 4x16 by week 3 I'll be very pleased


----------



## Bod42

I have a very good dipping body tho, short arms, big triceps so i can bang out 25+ in a row but i find that your performance drops off fast with exercises like dips and chins but then i dont wait long between sets. If I do add dips back in my program then they will be high rep BW reps instead of weighted.

Squats: (70x5, 92.5x5, 110x3)130x3, 147.5x5, 167.5x3 PM 184kg
Back Off Sets: 125x3,3,3
Deadlifts: 100x7,7,8,8,6

Ok this workout was pretty hard, the top set really wasnt pretty but i still got it. If everything depended on it then i recon I could have got another rep but no way could I have got 2 so getting close to me limit. But it puts me on target for 170x3 which is an ok lift. Actually 180 for 3reps is approx a 200kg squat so Im finally getting there.

Annoyed to miss my deadlifts but this is a grip issue but it is slowly strengthening. My grip feels so much stronger from practicing DOH grip. Some times Im so tempted to mix grip it and just rip my reps easily but need to stick to my plan.

Haha Doug, if your getting fed up with only benching 140 and these high rep workouts, dont think you would do well on the base building that Im doing next for 3 months. Its in simple terms taking a weight which is hard and only increasing it once you absolutely dominate it and make it look like your lifting nothing that its fast. I will start with 110kg squats and 100kg bench. We shall see how it goes. Should be good when your dieting as you wont miss reps, you may just slow down slightly or something. Really looking forward to it tho. Think it will do me a world of good and its the workout that got my squat moving again so cant be all bad. Paul carter divides his days into Push/Pull/Legs but i still like to throw some pulling movements in on push day and vice versa like Jim Wendler does.


----------



## Bod42

Bench PressWU 50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x10 PM 136.5kg
Incline Press: 60x10, 70x10
Inverted Rows
Plate Rows

Considering I havent benched in 6 weeks, I was pretty impressed with this workout. I thought I would just pick a light weight but predicted max of 136.5kg isnt to bad at all. Really felt it in my bad shoulder but it was more a pain than a rip of bad shooting pain so will keep with it. Will be staying with this weight for a few weeks anyway so will be nice easy work for my shoulder.

Usually I felt inclines in my shoulder but these well more just pumping out an easy weight. 

i love back work, always makes my shoulder feel so much better. Just a couple sets of Inverted rows concentrated on pulling my shoulder back and it instantly feels better, strange but good.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench PressWU 50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x10 PM 136.5kg
> Incline Press: 60x10, 70x10
> Inverted Rows
> Plate Rows
> 
> Considering I havent benched in 6 weeks, I was pretty impressed with this workout. I thought I would just pick a light weight but predicted max of 136.5kg isnt to bad at all. Really felt it in my bad shoulder but it was more a pain than a rip of bad shooting pain so will keep with it. Will be staying with this weight for a few weeks anyway so will be nice easy work for my shoulder.
> 
> Usually I felt inclines in my shoulder but these well more just pumping out an easy weight.
> 
> i love back work, always makes my shoulder feel so much better. Just a couple sets of Inverted rows concentrated on pulling my shoulder back and it instantly feels better, strange but good.


I think you should really focus on rehabbing the effected area James, your young and have many years to accomplish your goals, it would be a real shame to do more damage now.

I've used both approaches (first time slow - 12 months, second time Bill Starr 15 days:doublesho) Get the ice out mate :thumb: go for the Bill Starr approach, it is amazing. It does sound to good to be true but i can tell you, going from a torn bloody hamstring with 200kg on my back to 180kg x3 in 15 days proves that this is the correct approach.

It may not stop me from getting Hamstring injuries in the future but at least I will allow me to get back on course much quicker.

 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 108KGX5 - 122KGX4

BENCH PRESS 100KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5*

Excellent workout! :thumb:

Missed one rep on the last Bench work set, but I did lose count so not sure, either way as I've not lifted heavy in around 2 months im very pleased  I felt my energy reserves were far less depleted using the 5 rep variant, which I hope will allow me to use more weight on my assistance work and hopefully improving my base strength.

I'll try the 5x5 assistance work for a while on my heavier months only and see if it helps.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I think you should really focus on rehabbing the effected area James, your young and have many years to accomplish your goals, it would be a real shame to do more damage now.
> 
> I've used both approaches (first time slow - 12 months, second time Bill Starr 15 days:doublesho) Get the ice out mate :thumb: go for the Bill Starr approach, it is amazing. It does sound to good to be true but i can tell you, going from a torn bloody hamstring with 200kg on my back to 180kg x3 in 15 days proves that this is the correct approach.
> 
> It may not stop me from getting Hamstring injuries in the future but at least I will allow me to get back on course much quicker.
> 
> :thumb:


Remember my shoulder needs replacing so its a more a case of working round the issue as best I can than rehabing it properly. And it wasnt a bad pain, more just feeling it in my shoulder.

I will take a further look at Bill Starr's rehab program.

Doug have you noticed how we have both adapted 5/3 1 to exactly the same workout without even realising. Im doing work up to a top set then back off sets. You just did work up to 5RM then 5x5 as backoff sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Remember my shoulder needs replacing so its a more a case of working round the issue as best I can than rehabing it properly. And it wasnt a bad pain, more just feeling it in my shoulder.
> 
> I will take a further look at Bill Starr's rehab program.
> 
> Doug have you noticed how we have both adapted 5/3 1 to exactly the same workout without even realising. Im doing work up to a top set then back off sets. You just did work up to 5RM then 5x5 as backoff sets.


Sorry James, total forgot mate  And yes your right with your condition Bill starr rehab may not be any good at all.

I know lol, I'm at a point were I want more heavy volume so that I can improve my upper body strength but maintain my lower body strength.

Im sort of content with all my main 3 lifts as they are TBH and im focusing maintaining my base strength, losing body fat but still try to build muscle mass.

I'm still unsure if reaching 250 pounds at sub 14% body fat is actually realistic for a natural lifter like myself, I think the next 12 months on my present training and eating regimes will give me a good indicator of what can be achieved. And don't forget no matter how great and young I feel, I am still 46 years old.

Im still on around 500-700 cal deficit and I have been losing around .8 of a pound a week, I have another weigh in today. What I'm finding is I'm starting to adapt and eating less is becoming easier. I will however always keep my daily protein intake to a minimum of 200grams per day.


----------



## Bod42

I will take a further look at it as the higher reps etc may really help it but we will see. I have looked at it before and thought it was a great program but not for shoulder injuries as most shoulder injuries are a weak RC. Compound lifts dont really hit the RC.

Paul Carter got to 250lb+ naturally so it can be done, depends on your height though as i cant find how tall he is. You may have to change to a move size based program to reach that goal. Im similar to you but 240lb in good shape, may take me a fair few years. in a few weeks i will be slimming to 220lb and seeing what sort of shape I am in.

Anyway, I hit my goal last night :thumb::argie::doublesho
Squats: (WU 70x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x3 PM 187kg
Back off sets: 125x3,3,3

Thats it, was toast after this. Even my back off sets were really slow. Im please with a 170x3 ATG squat. I found a little technique the last few weeks that really helps. Ive tried all sorts during my squats, I used to tense my upper back, try and drive my elbows forward but that hurt my shoulder, then I started tensing my shoulders up to create a better platform but now I just pull the bar down and forward at like a 45 degree angle, this secures the bar, tenses my lats and my rear delts naturally tense up and create a better shelve. Just makes everything feel that much tighter.

You may noticed I actually hit my PR 1 week early but i was getting bored of waiting and just wanted to hit my goal. Its done now so Im happy to start my diet.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, Session 2
Bench press
WU 40kgx5, 50kgx5, 65kgx3
WO 75kgx3, 85kgx3, 95kgx6

Bench press
52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 52.5kgx10, 

Barbell row
55kgx10, 55kgx10, 55kgx10, 55kgx10, 75kgx8 (shouldn't have jumped up so much weight but thought I'd just try!) 

Incline DB press
26kgx10, 26kgx10, 26kgx10, 26kgx10, 26kgx10

Pull ups
10 x closed grip, 10 x wide grip, 10 x wide grip

Main work sets had 2-3 minutes rest, all assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX4

SQUAT 130KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Not bad.

Squat technique was not good so I decided to only go for 4 reps on the 170kg, everything else was fine. Its getting difficult to progress with my Standing calf raise weight due to me trying to do this inside the rack and sliding the bar against the inner vertical supports. May have to look at some type of lorry strapping so I can go much heavier safer.

Im in two minds about the 10/8/5 now, I have found due to the light weights and high reps my form on the heavy stuff isn't good.

The 5x5 assistance work feels really good, so not sure what to do. My intutition tells me I would be better to do more heavier volume than the light hypertrophy training. Unsure. Will do one more month of 10/8/5 and then decide after all missing one rep is not really that bad


----------



## Bod42

Haha 10/8/5 isnt high rep. High rep is 15+ if not 20+.

Remember Doug, 10, 8 & 5 reps will still build strength but it reduces your risk of injury and when you get near your target, you seem to get injured so I think this is a lot better way of doing things. And 5 reps are definitely not high reps, so if your loseing form on 5 reps then thats not the high reps programs fault. That is just an off day.

The more I read about natural lifters, Dan Green, Paul Carter, etc the more I realise that most of their training is down at lower % and higher reps. Pretty sure this guy is quite strong 



 As they say their is a big difference between displaying your strength and training your strength. Low reps seem to display strength and higher reps seem to train your strength. Dont get so caught up in displaying your strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Haha 10/8/5 isnt high rep. High rep is 15+ if not 20+.
> 
> Remember Doug, 10, 8 & 5 reps will still build strength but it reduces your risk of injury and when you get near your target, you seem to get injured so I think this is a lot better way of doing things. And 5 reps are definitely not high reps, so if your loseing form on 5 reps then thats not the high reps programs fault. That is just an off day.
> 
> The more I read about natural lifters, Dan Green, Paul Carter, etc the more I realise that most of their training is down at lower % and higher reps. Pretty sure this guy is quite strong Dan Green -- Beltless Squats 635x10 - YouTube As they say their is a big difference between displaying your strength and training your strength. Low reps seem to display strength and higher reps seem to train your strength. Dont get so caught up in displaying your strength.


Its high reps for me  I trained exclusively with 1-4 when I was younger and now 1-5 

I do know what you mean though, but I still think the slip prior to the day were I felt my hamstring pull really hard was the reason for the second injury.
But I do also agree about your idea with a higher rep approach for variation and more importantly health.

Most certainly poor training days, I felt like I haven't lifted for ages so that had a lot to do with my form, my breathing form was right off to  

FOCUS Doug FOCUS!!!!

I just have to keep disciplined  I've always been the same, I love low rep heavy training. It gives me focus and a real challenge, I generally find if its not around my maximum that I lose the will and cant be arsed to lift light weights 

I will stick with the heavy/light phases for a while and get myself into the groove :thumb:

James, you are now my sports psychologist  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bill Starr Stronger Press

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X5) - 70Kgx3 - 70Kgx3 - 70Kgx3 - 70x3 - 70Kgx3 - 70Kgx3

PRESS STARTS 80Kgx3 - 80Kgx3 - 80Kgx3

DIPS (Goal 4x20) 15x15x15x15 Bloody arms felt pumped up like balloons after that lot! :devil: *

Wanted to improve my bench press and OHP. After some research, I found this little gem by bill Starr. First impressions are very good, I like the whole feel of more heavy volume. Bill states that you need to dip 4 sets of 20 reps to successfully get into weighted dips. The end result is supposed to be that if you dip with 100lb/45Kg for 3 reps this will carry over to your OHP and of course all the OHP work will also carry over to your Bench Press.

And I think after using the 5/3/1 for nearly two years a slight change to my training will help for motivation.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 130GX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

DEADLIFT 130KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 100KGx6x6x6x6x6*

Nice workout, RDL's really work the grip as well, bonus :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Its high reps for me  I trained exclusively with 1-4 when I was younger and now 1-5
> 
> I do know what you mean though, but I still think the slip prior to the day were I felt my hamstring pull really hard was the reason for the second injury.
> But I do also agree about your idea with a higher rep approach for variation and more importantly health.
> 
> Most certainly poor training days, I felt like I haven't lifted for ages so that had a lot to do with my form, my breathing form was right off to
> 
> FOCUS Doug FOCUS!!!!
> 
> I just have to keep disciplined  I've always been the same, I love low rep heavy training. It gives me focus and a real challenge, I generally find if its not around my maximum that I lose the will and cant be arsed to lift light weights
> 
> I will stick with the heavy/light phases for a while and get myself into the groove :thumb:
> 
> *James, you are now my sports psychologist  :thumb:*


haha I could say the same about you mate, you always tell me to stop looking into things to much and just lift. Was reading the other day that Wendler emailed Paul Carter and said training is going great, I'm going to change this, this & this to make it even better. PC said dont change whats working. JW still changed it, training tanked, PC told you so lol. See even the top guys need to be told to stick with whats working.

My workouts have been working but still time for me to change gears in 2 weeks. Im actually looking forward to getting slimmer and fitter.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, Session 3
OHP
WU 20kgx10, 50kgx7
WO 60kgx5, 67.5kgx3, *75kgx3* very happy with this! :thumb:

OHP
50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10,

Standing db side raise
8kgx10, 8kgx10, 9kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10

Pull ups
8 x wide grip, 10 x hammer grip, 10 x closed grip, 7 x wide grip, 5 x hammer grip

Main work sets had 2-3 minutes rest, assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets apart from the pullups which had about 2 mins


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cycle 6, Session 3
> OHP
> WU 20kgx10, 50kgx7
> WO 60kgx5, 67.5kgx3, *75kgx3* very happy with this! :thumb:
> 
> OHP
> 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10,
> 
> Standing db side raise
> 8kgx10, 8kgx10, 9kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10
> 
> Pull ups
> 8 x wide grip, 10 x hammer grip, 10 x closed grip, 7 x wide grip, 5 x hammer grip
> 
> Main work sets had 2-3 minutes rest, assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets apart from the pullups which had about 2 mins


Nice one Lee, you do seem to be making very good progress :thumb:

Excellent! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I've been doing RDL's for a few weeks now and can confirm by the new DOMs im experiencing :doublesho They do hit the Hamstrings perfectly 

I plan to build up the weight and go heavy on the RDL's to keep strengthening my Hamstrings :thumb:

I would also go so far to say it would be very beneficial to do them straight after the main deadlift work sets with the added bonus of improving grip strength.

*Tip: If you find heavy deadlifts hurt your hands as you rep, try to focus on keeping your hands closed as tight as possible and grip the bar tight, you'll find this reduces the pain greatly :thumb:*


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice one Lee, you do seem to be making very good progress :thumb:
> 
> Excellent! :thumb:


Cheers Doug, I'm happy with it too! 6 cycles in and haven't missed a lift yet on any! Not even close to be honest, lowest I think I've done is 3 reps on the final lift of all of my max sessions!


----------



## Bokers

Back onto 5x5 while in season. Nothing majorly heavy for me yet.

Squats
5x5 82.5kg

Press
5x5 45kg

Deadlift
140kg x 5


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x10 PM 136.5kg
Incline Press: 60x10, 70x10
Inverted Rows x 2
Band Pull Apart Series x 2

Just staying with this weight until i absolutely kill it. It was easy tonight, had at least another few in the tank but speed started to slow on the last 2.

Same on Inclines, easy but started to slow. Will wait until I kill it then move up. Basically this is maintenance mode with my shoulder and while I concentrate on my lower body.

Inverted Rows super setted with band Pull apart series seriously pumps up the shoulders and makes them feel awesome. Making a conscious effort to do shoulder prehab at the end of every workout now.

Lee that is an impressive OHP, wish i was up to that level but I will get there one day. Out of interest, where does everyone bring the bar down to on OHP as seen a lot of different techniques from chest to on top of the head.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Lee that is an impressive OHP, wish i was up to that level but I will get there one day. Out of interest, where does everyone bring the bar down to on OHP as seen a lot of different techniques from chest to on top of the head.


Standard OHP for me, I have the bar rest on my upper chest :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Standard OHP for me, I have the bar rest on my upper chest :thumb:


Same here pretty much - down to my collar bone and NO leg drive :thumb:
Probably my favourite exercise, along with closed grip press
Least favourite would be deadlift... :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Same here pretty much - down to my collar bone and NO leg drive :thumb:
> Probably my favourite exercise, along with closed grip press
> Least favourite would be deadlift... :devil:


Opposite for me Lee, dislike the OHP and love the deadlift  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) -101KGX3 - 115KGX3 - 129KGX2

BENCH PRESS 101KGx5x5x5x5x10 :devil:

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x10 :devil:*

Missed last rep on the 129kg Bench, but im consoled to the fact that this month wont go as planned. I also punished myself by doing 10 reps on the last assistance sets of both the bench and Row :devil:  Odd thing is they didn't actually feel that difficult....WTF! 

*Note to self...........TECHNIQUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* :wall::wall:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 137.5x3, 157.5x3, 177.5x3 PM 195kg
Ab Roll Outs

Good workout, felt a bit slow at the start but still hit all my reps so im happy. That was my last heavy workout for a while now so glad to hit a decent number. Will start the heavy lifting again in 3 months. next week deload then start my diet. Dont get me wrong i will still be lifting heavy but with slightly higher volume and just putting my lifts into maintenance mode.


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, Session 3
Bench press
WU 50kgx10, 65kgx5
WO 80kgx5, 90kgx3, *100kgx6* another pb so very happy with this!

Bench press
60kgx10, 60kgx10, 60kgx10, 60kgx10, 60kgx10

Closed grip press
50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10, 50kgx10

Incline DB fly
16kgx10, 16kgx10, 12kgx12, 12kgx12, 12kgx12

Press up set to finish
45 seconds of clap press ups (41)
60 seconds rest
45 seconds of regular pressups (28)
60 seconds rest
45 seconds of hold press ups (5 second hold at both top and bottom of movement)

Main work sets had 3 minutes rest, assistance exercises had 1 minute rest between sets

On another note, I've now got my friend doing this workout too. He's only done three sessions so far but he's loving it!


----------



## Leebo310

Cycle 6, session 3

Due to the squat rack being in use when I got to the gym today, I actually did the whole workout in reverse. Wasn't sure I'd hit all my reps due to doing the heaviest weights at the end but made it pretty easily! :thumb:

Leg Extensions
50kgx10, 75kgx10, 80kgx10, 80kgx10, 85kgx10

Calf Raise
159kgx20, 169kgx20, 179kgx20, 189kgx20, 159kgx25

Squats (on smith machine as rack was STILL in use at this point! )
69kgx10, 79kgx10, 79kgx10, 79kgx10, 79kgx10

Squat (finally on the rack!)
112.5kgx5, 127.5kgx3, 142.5kgx4

Am a bit unsure what to do tomorrow as it's supposed to be my deload OHP but I'm on holiday all of next week so it'll be my last workout till the following Monday...
Three choices really, deload OHP, session 1 cycle 7 of OHP, or just a big cardio session 
Suggestions welcome!


----------



## Bod42

Do your next heavy session missing the deload week then take your holiday week as your deload week.

I always do 6 weeks before a deload now instead of the usual 3 weeks.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Do your next heavy session missing the deload week then take your holiday week as your deload week.
> 
> I always do 6 weeks before a deload now instead of the usual 3 weeks.


Cheers James, I'll go with that then!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Cheers James, I'll go with that then!


I'm with James, enjoy the hols and de load then :thumb:

My lifting has been awful this last month, I think I've changed too many things at once, combine that with just coming back from an injury = recipe for disaster 

I'm coming off the calorie deficit for one week and I'm staying on the 5/3/1 until I'm back on track. I think if anything I need more heavy volume. Once I'm back on track weight wise I'll then go back to the 10/8/5 - 5/3/1 cycles :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bill Starr Overhead Press Routine

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X5) - 72.5Kgx3 - 72.5Kgx3 - 72.5Kgx3 - 72.5Kgx3 - 72.5Kgx3 - 72.5Kgx3

PRESS STARTS 82.5Kgx3 - 82.5Kgx3 - 82.5x3

DIPS BODYWEIGHT (110Kg) 4x16x16x16x16*

Good workout, dips getting harder now :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 140GX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

DEADLIFT 130KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 100KGx7x7x7x7x7*

Total contrast to my squat workout, all lifts felt easy, so I went through the assistance work without timing my rest periods.

I love the deadlift!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108KGX5 - 122.5KGX3 - 140KGX1

BENCH PRESS 100KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

That's more bloody like it :thumb:

I even put 150Kg on the bar after the 140kg to get a feel lol!!!  Was pre exhausted and couldn't lift it  :lol: Although it didn't feel as heavy as I expected, which is a bonus :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Im still working out, just havent bothered putting up my deload workouts this week. Real excited to start this diet and start a new workout. Also looking forward to getting abit fitter as well from the sprints.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1 (Done yesterday)

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX1 :thumb:

SQUAT 130KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE  160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Excellent workout, cant believe how straight forward the 190kg was.

I have learned for me the most important part of the squat is getting the bar in the right place on my back and everything else falls into place. I was obviously squatting with the bar far too high on weeks 1 and 2, hence the feeling of being off balance and trying to overcompensate for that sapped my strength and concentration during the lifts :wall:

Will have to get some lorry straps so I can add more weight on my calf raises, its total pain sliding the bar up against the inside of the rack


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bill Starr stronger Overhead Press

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 40X5 50X3) - 75Kgx3x3x3x3x3x3

PRESS STARTS 85Kgx3x3x3

BODYWEIGHT DIPS (111.63Kg) - X17x17x17x17*

Going well so far, I'm having to work for the dip reps now :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Oh dear, I went on holiday, tried to keep up with routines etc but I'll be honest! The intensity and frequency hasn't continued. 

I went back to the gym the other day. I dropped my squats by 20kg from my previously 125kg and to cut it short ended up feeling light headed/wobbly and I've been in pain for 4 days. Not like I've torn something just servere DOMs. I'm thinking maybe dropping 20 should have been more like dropping 40kg. Overall I had a bad work out and went home half way through my OHPs which I had done ok but felt shocking. 

I'm just about ok now, still sore but I am going to brave the gym again tomorrow. 

What would you guys start off at if you were me? It wasn't like I couldn't lift the weight but it was really really hard even after the warm up and first set at 105kg. 

So I got up to 125kg squat
135kg dead
70kg bench
40kg OHP 
65kg Row

Where would you guys start from if you were me?

The weights I did on holiday were baby weights - the machines were rubbish and the barbells could only hold 60kg (30 each side) they were not olypmic bars. I had a few work outs but to be honest didn't do that much. I've been away for 3 weeks all together but my workouts since the holiday have been non exsistant. I'd say I've been out for around 2 months from proper routine and frequency. 

Feel crap about it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> Oh dear, I went on holiday, tried to keep up with routines etc but I'll be honest! The intensity and frequency hasn't continued.
> 
> I went back to the gym the other day. I dropped my squats by 20kg from my previously 125kg and to cut it short ended up feeling light headed/wobbly and I've been in pain for 4 days. Not like I've torn something just servere DOMs. I'm thinking maybe dropping 20 should have been more like dropping 40kg. Overall I had a bad work out and went home half way through my OHPs which I had done ok but felt shocking.
> 
> I'm just about ok now, still sore but I am going to brave the gym again tomorrow.
> 
> What would you guys start off at if you were me? It wasn't like I couldn't lift the weight but it was really really hard even after the warm up and first set at 105kg.
> 
> So I got up to 125kg squat
> 135kg dead
> 70kg bench
> 40kg OHP
> 65kg Row
> 
> Where would you guys start from if you were me?
> 
> The weights I did on holiday were baby weights - the machines were rubbish and the barbells could only hold 60kg (30 each side) they were not olypmic bars. I had a few work outs but to be honest didn't do that much. I've been away for 3 weeks all together but my workouts since the holiday have been non exsistant. I'd say I've been out for around 2 months from proper routine and frequency.
> 
> Feel crap about it.


Easy way would be to de load the 2 months and start from there Jon, the lower weight will make it easier to get back into it. Check your form/technique on all lifts as well mate as you've been off training for so long. Machines will not teach you about form that's why they can be so detrimental to your training :thumb:

You need to set yourself goals both long term and short term.To succeed you do need to have a good level of consistency in your training. recovery and nutrition :thumb:

Also, when I have my holidays/week off work I take them on my de load week :thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

So I should be deloading roughly 7.5kg per week of missed training would you say? 7.5kgx8 is 60kg So tomorrow I'm going to aim for 65kg and work up! Sounds sensible. It's put me back but at the end of the day I;ll be moving more, concentrating on technique and should blast all the way back up. It will also mean I'll be able to complete my work out and hopefully be less sore... 

Do you guys recon there is much room for training 4 days a week as aposed to 3? I'm now self employed so have more time. I know rest is important but I will always have a clear day after training. Monday, Wed, Friday, Sunday, Tues, Thurs, Sat. At least until it starts getting hard and I need the rest again?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> So I should be deloading roughly 7.5kg per week of missed training would you say? 7.5kgx8 is 60kg So tomorrow I'm going to aim for 65kg and work up! Sounds sensible. It's put me back but at the end of the day I;ll be moving more, concentrating on technique and should blast all the way back up. It will also mean I'll be able to complete my work out and hopefully be less sore...
> 
> Do you guys recon there is much room for training 4 days a week as aposed to 3? I'm now self employed so have more time. I know rest is important but I will always have a clear day after training. Monday, Wed, Friday, Sunday, Tues, Thurs, Sat. At least until it starts getting hard and I need the rest again?


Yes mate, de load back, but I dont understand were the 7.5kg comes from. Most programs progress 5kg for lower body and 2.5kg for upper. So I would de load and progress with these amounts.

Im 46 and train heavy 4 times a week, there are times I feel tired the next day after a squat or deadlift session but after an extra days rest im good to train again, I make sure I get in bed and asleep before 10pm. I find however that my optimum time is between 8:30 and 9pm, ill be awake 6am as bright as a button!

Jon, you are no way lifting heavy yet and would most definitely recommend you move up to a 4 day week program, however you must monitor how you progress and feel on a 4 day program. Ensure you are getting enough protein per day for recovery.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 200KGX1 :thumb:

DEADLIFT 130KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 100KGx8x8x8x8x8*

Good workout, very pleased how easy the 200kg went up as I was worried I'd lost some strength since the hamstring tear :thumb:

Guzzling down a protein shake now and going to have a Chinese takeaway later as a wee treat


----------



## Bod42

Hold up on the 4 days per week. Are you doing 5x5 or 5/3/1?

4 days per week of 5x5 will be to much but 4 days per week of 5/3/1 will be fine.

Also i agree with Doug, deload all your weights by 10-15% and start again. If your on 5x5 then it wont take long to get back to where you were due to the aggressive progression. If your on 5/3/1 then you can use the last set to gauge your progress. 

If 10-15% isnt enough then take a weight you feel comfortable with and work up from there.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Hold up on the 4 days per week. Are you doing 5x5 or 5/3/1?
> 
> 4 days per week of 5x5 will be to much but 4 days per week of 5/3/1 will be fine.
> 
> Also i agree with Doug, deload all your weights by 10-15% and start again. If your on 5x5 then it wont take long to get back to where you were due to the aggressive progression. If your on 5/3/1 then you can use the last set to gauge your progress.
> 
> If 10-15% isnt enough then take a weight you feel comfortable with and work up from there.


Yep, sorry Jon forgot  , If you're on the 5x5 you will have to stick to the original template - 3 days per week :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

And so it begins. Slightly different workout based on Paul Carter's Base Building principles. Basically its more volume and training lighter sub-max sets. Dont mistake this with easy, you are still accelerating the weight as hard as possible so is still really hard work. Coupled with shorter rest periods and you have a nice intense workout.

Its the traditional 3 day split of Push/Pull/Legs but I have swapped some things around as i like some pulling on push day and vice versa. So basically my workout looks like this.

Push 1
Push 2
Pull 1

Pull 1
Pull 2
Push 1

Pretty simple and seems to be the way most top trainers train their athletes. 

Anyway day 1.

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 95x3, 105x2, 120x1) WO 105x8,8,5,4,3
Incline Bench Press: 70x8,6,5
Chins Ups between all pushing sets.
Inverted Rows: 3x10
Band Push Downs: 3x20
RC Work

As you can see the volume had a massive effect on me here. Im used to 1 top set with 5/3/1 but now Im doing straight sets for 5 sets, my body isnt used to that sort of volume but it will adapt quickly.

You may have also noticed the over warm up. I have messed around with these before but never fully incorporated them like I have this workout. I would recommend everyone try over warm ups as they are a great tool. My 105kg x 2 felt really heavy during warm ups and had me thinking "crap I have to do this for 8" but once I did the 120kg for 1 and went back to 105kg, it felt like nothing unracking it and the first 4 reps flew up like my first warm up set.

I also kept 1-2 reps in the tank and didnt force anything. This is definitely going to be my goal while i diet so I dont burn myself out but I recon with this type of programming that I may actually increase my strength if I keep my diet bang on.


----------



## dave-g

@bod42 I've always been interested in the whole push/pull split routines, what's the 3 day plan if you don't mind me asking? :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

dave-g said:


> @bod42 I've always been interested in the whole push/pull split routines, what's the 3 day plan if you don't mind me asking? :thumb:


Not sure if you mean "my" plan or the traditional plan.

Well the traditional push/pull/legs is really exactly what it says on the tin. So set out like: 
Monday - Chest/Shoulder/Tri
Wednesday - Legs
Friday - Back/Biceps

I find all the trainers who train athletes and one of the guys I respect the most, Joe Defranco, train both Push and Pull in the same day and I find this really helps with my buggered shoulder and the health of it. After all those pushing sets, quite a bit of pain in my shoulder but after some horizontal pulling exercises, pain is 90% gone.

Joe Defranco follows more of an Upper/Lower split.

If you meant my plan, then its as follows:
Monday
Bench Press
Incline Press
Chin ups between all pushing exercises
Inverted Rows

Wednesday
Squats
Bulgarian Split Squats
Lunges

Friday
Deadlifts
Pendlay Rows
Barbell Shoulder Press

Im throwing in a lot of single leg work on leg day to even up any imbalances and been having a few problems with my left knee due to practicing golf quite a lot at the moment and one of my swing faults is causing pain in my knee. (Same injury and swing flaw as tiger actually, hip out of aliment at impact, thats why he fired Foley)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Yesterdays de load

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## Guitarjon

Hit the gym again yesterday as I only recovered Monday. Kept the weight a little lower and I think I'm good to continue now. The stuff still felt hard but I don't think I knocked myself up this time.


----------



## Bod42

Wedesday
Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) WO 120x5x5
Bulgarian Split Squats: BWx3x10 each leg
Lunges: BWx3x12

High volume leg workout compared with what Im used to so serious DOMS today. My chest & shoulders have some of the worst DOMS I have had in a long time from mondays workout. DOMS doesnt actually mean anything but it still feels kind of good.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) WO 160x5x3
Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5
Shoulder Press: 50x8,8,8
Barbell Curls: 20x30

higher volume on deadlifts does feel good but it was actually quite hard work. Will stick with this weight for 6 weeks and just concentrate on making it look easy as I diet. Cant be a master of everything at the same time so right now my goal is weight loss. On wed I will see how my weight loss is going after 1 week on 2,500 calories and adjust accordingly.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 95x3, 105x2, 120x1) WO 105x8,8,6,4,3
Incline Bench Press: 70x8,6,5
Chins Ups between all pushing sets.
Inverted Rows: 3x10
Band Push Downs: 3x20
RC Work

1 more rep on bench press this week but I would still say that I got weaker as the last reps were all grinds. There is no way that I should be grinding reps on week 2, this was probably screw up my progress but we will see what happens. its only a 6 week long phase so dont think it will do to much wrong.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Barbell Curls: 20x30


20 sets of 30 reps?? Impressive!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> 1 more rep on bench press this week but I would still say that I got weaker as the last reps were all grinds. There is no way that I should be grinding reps on week 2, this was probably screw up my progress but we will see what happens. its only a 6 week long phase so dont think it will do to much wrong.


I found the low weight high rep 10/8/5 made me weaker very quickly too James, although I would say it may have been more to my technique getting loose due to not having to try to hard to lift the lighter weights.

Tonight session was a complete contrast, the 122kgx5 felt relatively easy. I'm not sure if the Bill star routine or the 5x5 rep heavy assistance work is starting to carry over, but something has changed drastically, last cycle the 122kg was a complete grind every rep, this time it felt like one of the lighter work sets  :thumb:

Week 2 Heavy 5 rep variant 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 108KGX5 - 122KGX5 :thumb:

BENCH PRESS 102.5KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

I'll stick to the heavier variant for a few months and see how it goes. I will however go easy on the squat and use 190kg for most of the singles and use 200kg every few months as planned and only change this if my strength indicates I can go even heavier safely. Any time I'm in doubt I'll only use the 190kg :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> 20 sets of 30 reps?? Impressive!


Haha 20kg x 30 reps.

i cant believe 10/8/6 made you weaker Doug. It would have been that your not used to the higher reps. there is no way if you do 100kg for 10 reps and finish doing 105kg for 10 reps that you havent got stronger. I think in the long term, the higher reps would have benefited your injuries. Higher reps are so much better for my bad shoulder. And if all the top raw guys train higher reps then Im going to train higher reps. Seems to be higher reps for training, lower reps for testing. This also gives you a slanted opinion of low reps as I have been doing higher reps for approx a year now but the other week I changed everything to 3s and hit a record, I dont believe for a second that the 3s built my person record, I believe all the high rep work built my strength and the 3 reps just showed my strength.

Even changing from 3 reps to 5 reps on squats was an adaption so you have to get used to the higher reps.

And I expect to get weaker as I am dieting at 1kg per week. I have also increased the volume so its adapting to that as well.

Doug did you ever think that the month of higher rep training made you stronger and now that you are back to lifting heavy that the reps were easier?

And i dont see the point of ever doing singles unless you are competing, again this is showing/testing your strength, not training it. I think your better to put your squat in maintenance mode than continually test it. I know so many people who put a lift into maintenance mode and they actually get stronger. Its basically what I did with my Bench


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> i cant believe 10/8/6 made you weaker Doug. It would have been that your not used to the higher reps. there is no way if you do 100kg for 10 reps and finish doing 105kg for 10 reps that you havent got stronger. I think in the long term, the higher reps would have benefited your injuries. Higher reps are so much better for my bad shoulder. And if all the top raw guys train higher reps then Im going to train higher reps. Seems to be higher reps for training, lower reps for testing. This also gives you a slanted opinion of low reps as I have been doing higher reps for approx a year now but the other week I changed everything to 3s and hit a record, I dont believe for a second that the 3s built my person record, I believe all the high rep work built my strength and the 3 reps just showed my strength.
> 
> Even changing from 3 reps to 5 reps on squats was an adaption so you have to get used to the higher reps.
> 
> And I expect to get weaker as I am dieting at 1kg per week. I have also increased the volume so its adapting to that as well.
> 
> Doug did you ever think that the month of higher rep training made you stronger and now that you are back to lifting heavy that the reps were easier?
> 
> And i dont see the point of ever doing singles unless you are competing, again this is showing/testing your strength, not training it. I think your better to put your squat in maintenance mode than continually test it. I know so many people who put a lift into maintenance mode and they actually get stronger. Its basically what I did with my Bench


Were as I do agree to a point on the above James. I personally have always struggled to train higher reps and I'm not saying from a physical point of view but psychological.

I find high rep work totally uninspiring and lacking in the challenge I'm looking for which low rep heavy training gives me. Putting it simply I LOVE HEAVY LOW REP TRAINING  The single reps may seem to be a waste of time and I agree wont really add to my strength, but I find them incredibly inspiring, it has little to do with ego but more to do with seeing on a regular basis my true power which then inspires me further. I also find my form/technique gets really terrible from light lifting because its just too easy and I tend to just muscle the weights up 

I lift on my own, I have no one to impress but myself, I love having the discipline to constantly challenge myself. This I think actually makes me a better lifter because if anyone will ruin your lifting it will be yourself. my biggest issue is the fear of failing which can make me tentative during lifting and actually cause a fail. But thankfully not too many times over the last nearly 3 years :thumb:

But You are very right in the reasoning for mixing up the reps/weights James, tonight's workout was fukin EPIC, but quite tiring during the heavier assistance work and I get the feeling hauling so much heavy weight will hit my recovery very hard. Once I'm happy with my level I will go back to mixing higher rep cycles (10/8/5 - 5/3/1) :thumb: And to be honest I don't think I gave the 10/8/5 a good enough chance to show results, I'll give it a go again in a month or so time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1 Heavy 5 rep variant

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

SQUAT 135KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Much better than last months total hash up and I Paid attention to bar and head position this time :thumb:

I found the 135Kg 5 rep assistance more difficult this time, but I'm not surprised considering the weights lifted during the work sets


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Were as I do agree to a point on the above James. I personally have always struggled to train higher reps and I'm not saying from a physical point of view but psychological.
> 
> I find high rep work totally uninspiring and lacking in the challenge I'm looking for which low rep heavy training gives me. Putting it simply I LOVE HEAVY LOW REP TRAINING  The single reps may seem to be a waste of time and I agree wont really add to my strength, but I find them incredibly inspiring, it has little to do with ego but more to do with seeing on a regular basis my true power which then inspires me further. I also find my form/technique gets really terrible from light lifting because its just too easy and I tend to just muscle the weights up
> 
> I lift on my own, I have no one to impress but myself, I love having the discipline to constantly challenge myself. This I think actually makes me a better lifter because if anyone will ruin your lifting it will be yourself. my biggest issue is the fear of failing which can make me tentative during lifting and actually cause a fail. But thankfully not too many times over the last nearly 3 years :thumb:
> 
> But You are very right in the reasoning for mixing up the reps/weights James, tonight's workout was fukin EPIC, but quite tiring during the heavier assistance work and I get the feeling hauling so much heavy weight will hit my recovery very hard. Once I'm happy with my level I will go back to mixing higher rep cycles (10/8/5 - 5/3/1) :thumb: And to be honest I don't think I gave the 10/8/5 a good enough chance to show results, I'll give it a go again in a month or so time :thumb:


I get where your coming from with the psychological difference between low and high reps. Im trying to explode and throw the weight through the ceiling at the moment on squats and even changing from 3 reps to 5 reps makes it a lot more difficult to concentrate on every rep.

Also I do like training heavy and that last 3s cycle I did was amazing, just keep increasing the weight every week, was great fun but I didnt seem to be getting anywhere and now with slightly higher reps I do seem to be getting somewhere.

Weighted in this morning and only lost 1kg in a week and a half so time to drop my calories slightly and concentrate on my fitness more. Easy to lower my calories, just take carbs out of one meal on a non training day.

Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
Bulgarian Split Squats: 2.5x10,10,10
Lunges: 2.5x12,12,12

All in all a good workout, speed started to slow on the 4th and 5th set a bit. This is the whole point of this type of workout, you are trying to complete 5x5 without slowing down.

Started to add a little bit of weight to the single leg exercises, wont be going heavy on these as these are to correct imbalances.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 135GX5 - 155KGX5 - 175KGX5

DEADLIFT 135KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Good workout, all weights felt easy enough. I'll be adding 5kg per month to all work sets from now till December. Aiming for 230kgx1 by end of this year, all going well :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 5, 4
Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 5
Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10
Band Push Down: 3x20
RC Work

I have been struggling with my workouts more than I should be even though Im dieting so I went back to look at my workout in more depth and I screwed up my percentages. I put my max reps for 1 set in the calculator and then used 100%. There is no way I can do 5 sets using the same weight I used for 1 set so that was a big mistake and i should be training lighter while I diet as well so I have moved these back to 90%.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Weighted in this morning and only lost 1kg in a week and a half so time to drop my calories slightly and concentrate on my fitness more. Easy to lower my calories, just take carbs out of one meal on a non training day.


That's 2.2 pounds in a week and a half, I wouldn't change anything James, otherwise you will start to lose hard earned muscle and strength.

I would get yourself checked out too as fitness comes in different guises mate. I recently had a health check. Haven't had one since I started powerlifting, my cholesterol was 4.3 (un fasted normal state), blood pressure normal, blood sugar nice and low and I have the heart of a younger man. Its even more impressive when you consider health checks lean towards cardiovascular fitness (Weak skinny runner types  ) not anaerobic fitness :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 5, 4
> Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 5
> Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
> Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10
> Band Push Down: 3x20
> RC Work
> 
> I have been struggling with my workouts more than I should be even though Im dieting so I went back to look at my workout in more depth and I screwed up my percentages. I put my max reps for 1 set in the calculator and then used 100%. There is no way I can do 5 sets using the same weight I used for 1 set so that was a big mistake and i should be training lighter while I diet as well so I have moved these back to 90%.


What rest periods do you use between your main work sets James?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101KGX3 - 115KGX3 - 129KGX3

BENCH PRESS 102.5KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Again, another workout with a WTF  contrast in how the weights felt.
I have no idea what has changed, but the last work set was easy  Every rep slow and controlled, I estimate I could have completed 5 reps possibly six.

Possible contributors:

1. Moving over to 5 rep assistance, possibly more heavy load making me much more powerful or the heavy load is forcing much better form.

2. The Bill starr OHP routine, it is thought that the OHP carries over to the bench press more rather than the other way around. Also the 4 sets of dips at my bodyweight with high reps?

3. Motivational music, I'm using some very epic music from the YouTube along with motivational speeches to bring forth the warrior in me 

Diet is very much the same.

Long may this continue :devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> That's 2.2 pounds in a week and a half, I wouldn't change anything James, otherwise you will start to lose hard earned muscle and strength.
> 
> I would get yourself checked out too as fitness comes in different guises mate. I recently had a health check. Haven't had one since I started powerlifting, my cholesterol was 4.3 (un fasted normal state), blood pressure normal, blood sugar nice and low and I have the heart of a younger man. Its even more impressive when you consider health checks lean towards cardiovascular fitness (Weak skinny runner types  ) not anaerobic fitness :thumb:


Sorry Doug that was actually 2 and a half weeks so abit slow but weights myself this morning and I am back on track.

I have had a check up for my NZ immigration and everything is in the healthy range even though according to the government, i eat unhealthy and dont do enough cardio. Sure it would be a lot healthier world if people ate like fitness people and instead of jogging for hours on end, lifted some weights.



ITHAQVA said:


> What rest periods do you use between your main work sets James?


2.5mins at the moment for Bench, 3 mins for Squats and deadlifts. 1-2mins on everything else.

Doug you keep progressing the way you are and I will get you to write my programs lol. When I added dips into my program, my Bench just kept getting better and better so it could be the dips but hard to pinpoint, just if its working then keep riding that wave as long as possible. Its funny as we are both basically doing the same program just got there different ways.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Sorry Doug that was actually 2 and a half weeks so abit slow but weights myself this morning and I am back on track.
> 
> I have had a check up for my NZ immigration and everything is in the healthy range even though according to the government, i eat unhealthy and dont do enough cardio. Sure it would be a lot healthier world if people ate like fitness people and instead of jogging for hours on end, lifted some weights.
> 
> 2.5mins at the moment for Bench, 3 mins for Squats and deadlifts. 1-2mins on everything else.
> 
> Doug you keep progressing the way you are and I will get you to write my programs lol. When I added dips into my program, my Bench just kept getting better and better so it could be the dips but hard to pinpoint, just if its working then keep riding that wave as long as possible. Its funny as we are both basically doing the same program just got there different ways.


Agree mate, what is this obsession with the cardiovascular :wall: I have a mate at work who runs long distance (did the London marathon this year) he is injured nearly all the time, feels tired more often than not and moans about aching joints and legs. But at long last I've talked him into eating more protein for his recovery :thumb: He was a carbohydrate junkie. Eats processed packed food every day. Just because he's skinny he thinks it's all ok. But and here is the thing he looks older than me he's 35 I'm 46 :doublesho He is a prime example of the damage a lot of cardio can do to you (Google the damage to hormones/muscle mass done by too much cardio)

I'm not surprised your lifting light mate, those are very short rest periods. I'm not so sure you need to alter so much of what your doing just to lose some body fat James. Personally I would have just gone with optimising your calorie deficit and continued to lift heavy (Its a very slow process, I've lost only 1.5Kg in 6 weeks of deficit) But all my loss is fat and...This is the really important bit - I am also building muscle, lifting heavy and progressing. Slow is the way to go. I don't care if it takes 12 months to get down to 15% body fat, but I do know if I go slow, I will be able to continue to do what I love.

Also reducing your calories further after only a few weeks is too quick mate, allow a month at one level, your big like me so we will have large weight fluctuations during the day due to our muscle mass. I can vary 3 pounds easy within a few days. I would judge your weight loss on a monthly trend rather than weekly loss. If your trend is spiking but going down only slightly its working. Unless of course your approach is fast cut. We progress slowly in powerlifting for permanent results, I feel this approach should also be used when reducing fat otherwise we will lose the power we have worked so very, very hard for James :thumb:

lol, you'd not like my program because I've found as I did when I was younger. lift heavy and then lift more heavy (I used to thrive in the 1-4 rep range, muscle growth and strength) I would even go so far to say doing the 10 rep assistance work did very little for me on the 5/3/1. The heavier 5 rep work forces me to lift with better form. I have also lost the "fear of failing" my biggest psychological hurdle. Last night was a prime example, I looked at the 129Kg and it didn't look so big anymore, I gave it less respect.

This is the trick James, the head is were it all happens. Get the mind set right and your going to have a better chance at that lift. The heavy 5 rep work after the primary work sets keeps me lifting the same way, the 10 rep work was just a workout and IMHO did nothing for my mind set for successful lifting. There will come a time as I progress when I need to rest off to recover, but I will listen to my body to tell me when its time for that.

We may fall down many times (failing lifts, injuries and bad training days), but we will get up and not give up.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 Heavy Variant

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

SQUAT 135KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Average workout, weights felt well as they normally do. I made a bit of a mess of the second work set and got the bar position wrong making the set more difficult. This then distracted me on the final work set and I forgot to breath in and hold my stomach out, instead I just held my stomach in lol WTF :wall:

I don't know about you guys. But the squat is my worst lift. Two things seem to cause me issues. Fear of the lift itself. Fear of failing the lift. I know I'm strong enough to lift the weights I use, but my focus on this lift falters and I lift with hesitation which makes the lift far harder than it should be :wall:

I will stay on the same weights until I crack it :thumb:

I need to get into a consistent lifting pattern for the squat, so I'm going to print out a technique sheet for the powerlifting room :wall::wall:

Breath in!
Bar position!
Un rack!
Breath out! 
Look up, breath in, expand stomach!
Lower to parallel
LIFT!

Do any of you guys struggle with consistency on the squat?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Agree mate, what is this obsession with the cardiovascular :wall: I have a mate at work who runs long distance (did the London marathon this year) he is injured nearly all the time, feels tired more often than not and moans about aching joints and legs. But at long last I've talked him into eating more protein for his recovery :thumb: He was a carbohydrate junkie. Eats processed packed food every day.* Just because he's skinny he thinks it's all ok. But and here is the thing he looks older than me he's 35 I'm 46 :doublesho He is a prime example of the damage a lot of cardio can do to you (Google the damage to hormones/muscle mass done by too much cardio)*
> 
> I'm not surprised your lifting light mate, those are very short rest periods. I'm not so sure you need to alter so much of what your doing just to lose some body fat James. Personally I would have just gone with optimising your calorie deficit and continued to lift heavy (Its a very slow process, I've lost only 1.5Kg in 6 weeks of deficit) But all my loss is fat and...This is the really important bit - I am also building muscle, lifting heavy and progressing. Slow is the way to go. I don't care if it takes 12 months to get down to 15% body fat, but I do know if I go slow, I will be able to continue to do what I love.
> 
> Also reducing your calories further after only a few weeks is too quick mate, allow a month at one level, your big like me so we will have large weight fluctuations during the day due to our muscle mass. I can vary 3 pounds easy within a few days. I would judge your weight loss on a monthly trend rather than weekly loss. If your trend is spiking but going down only slightly its working. Unless of course your approach is fast cut. We progress slowly in powerlifting for permanent results, I feel this approach should also be used when reducing fat otherwise we will lose the power we have worked so very, very hard for James :thumb:
> 
> lol, you'd not like my program because I've found as I did when I was younger. lift heavy and then lift more heavy (I used to thrive in the 1-4 rep range, muscle growth and strength) I would even go so far to say doing the 10 rep assistance work did very little for me on the 5/3/1. The heavier 5 rep work forces me to lift with better form. I have also lost the "fear of failing" my biggest psychological hurdle. Last night was a prime example, I looked at the 129Kg and it didn't look so big anymore, I gave it less respect.
> 
> This is the trick James, the head is were it all happens. Get the mind set right and your going to have a better chance at that lift. The heavy 5 rep work after the primary work sets keeps me lifting the same way, the 10 rep work was just a workout and IMHO did nothing for my mind set for successful lifting. There will come a time as I progress when I need to rest off to recover, but I will listen to my body to tell me when its time for that.
> 
> We may fall down many times (failing lifts, injuries and bad training days), but we will get up and not give up.
> 
> :thumb:


I never ever put "cardio" in anyones program that I write. I think bang for buck, it is the worst exercise out there, it ages you as you say. I have read about how it ages your genetic markers whereas weights actually decreases them. Its a very strange world that we live in where fat is instantly unhealthy and skinny is healthy. Skinny with zero muscle is far worse than slightly over weight with muscle. There was a program on TV a few years ago, compared 3 people, thin person, average person and a rugby player. Obviously everyone in the audience chose rugby player is the most unhealthy as hes heavy and the thin person was the most healthy. Then they took scans of their organs and the thin person had a shed load of fat sitting on their organs whereas the rugby player had none.

It confuses the hell out of me how brained washed a lot of people are. I have mentioned the guy I used to gym with, never did cardio, only weights, was big and ripped. Went to the Doc's, they would be stunned every time how healthy he was in his mid 40s, perfect bloods, not over weight, etc, etc. But then when they asked what he did and he said high protein and weights they would lecture him on how bad this is for him.

Another guy at rugby got spoken to as his little girl goes to the gym with him and does Body weight exercises and they lectured him how bad it was. What is everyones problems with weights these days. In the school holidays when i was 10, i helped my Dad cut up 2 massive trees which literally took weeks, I got more muscly and lost weight from chopping and loading wood. no one had a problem with this but sounds like weight (wood) lifting to me. I have my Mrs doing weights now and everyone she talks to is confused why she is doing weights and tries to convince her to do cardio, so strange.

Take a look at our programs closely Doug. I ramp up to a top set then do what I call back off sets of a lighter weight for multiple sets. You ramp up to a top weight and then do a lighter weight for multiple sets but call it assistant work. We are basically using the same principle of work up to a 5,3 or 1 rep near max set then back off the weight for more sets.

Thats not that low rest for me. I normally do 4 mins on bench and 5 mins on squats but I suppose 1.5 & 2 mins is a big difference. But the top raw guys dont seem to have massive rest periods anymore these days. That article I linked to not long ago starts with 5 sets in 20 mins and when he can do it easily closer to 10 mins then he increases the weight as he has made that weight stupidly easy.

Im still lifting heavy with my diet, Ive just increased the volume and lowered the rest periods abit as I am also using this phase to work on my fitness. Even Wendler says to divide your year into 3 month blocks and concentrate on certain things like size, strength, fitness, etc.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
Bulgarian Split Squats: 2.5x10,10,10

Had to cut my workout short and the guy I sold my bike to rocked up to collect it.

I am starting to see the theory behind this workout now as I havent changed the weight or messed with the time between sets but the first 3 sets of 5 were the fastest they have even been, then the last 2 sets started to get hard. Just keep working at that weight until all 5 sets are fast and easy and then increase the weight and work from there.

The single leg work seems to be adding to my leg size as well and sorting out the pain in my left knee but maybe that is also because I have changed my golf swing and therefore dont put so much pressure on it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Take a look at our programs closely Doug. I ramp up to a top set then do what I call back off sets of a lighter weight for multiple sets. You ramp up to a top weight and then do a lighter weight for multiple sets but call it assistant work. We are basically using the same principle of work up to a 5,3 or 1 rep near max set then back off the weight for more sets.


I agree James, we are basically working out the same :thumb: But, now that I've moved over to 5 rep work, I don't actually consider the 10 rep work I used to do as "Assistance" sets. IMHO an assistance set should be doing just that. Assist you in your main lifts. For me personally the higher rep stuff did very little to assist, but just add muscle building volume (which is exactly as Wendler describes them). The low 5 rep work forces me to use the correct form when lifting (this is a personal thing and a failing of mine to a point as I seem to need to do more heavy work, light weights make me very lazy )

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> It confuses the hell out of me how brained washed a lot of people are.


Its not difficult to sus out mate. In regards fitness, diet etc.. Most people are too lazy to think for themselves and want the answers given to them, the fitness industry is a money making machine and provides the answers, they keep re inventing the wheel, make it look shiny and NEW and the masses will go for it and spend plenty for the privilege 

We know that a well formulated barbell program with some medium cardio (Walking and swimming are excellent) provides almost all the fitness you need but the rusty old barbell cant really be changed much/ sorry made fashionable and new  Well done bowflex for re packing a load of dumbbells at a ridiculous price and selling them to dumbbells :thumb: I'm sure some bright spark will put a price on walking (Enter the trainers that help you lose weight :lol::lol

The fitness industry = adventures in capitalism


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 77.5Kgx3x3x3x3x3x3

PRESS STARTS 87.5Kgx3x3x3

DIPS X20x20x16x12*

Good workout :thumb:

Will have to change warm up weights for main OHP workout. James, We've discussed this before :thumb: The OHP can be difficult to warm up for. I found this out today the first main OHP set was the hardest, the rest were difficult but not incredibly so until the very last rep on the last set which was UGLEEEEE! :devil:  Will remain on 77.5Kg for 6 sets of 3 reps next session to ensure all the reps are good before moving up another 2.5Kg :thumb:

Decided to go to 20 reps on the dips instead of the prescribed 18, went ok for the first two sets then fatigue took over, will keep at it until I get my 4 sets of 20 reps :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Aching like mad in the upper body/arms due to my dip session yesterday :thumb:

What I do like about DOMS is that it gives a good indicator of what areas the exercise hits  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 145KGX3 - 165KGX3 - 185KGX3

DEADLIFT 135KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Good session, left out RDL's today :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 145x3,3,3,3,3
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6
Shoulder Press: 50x8

Deadlifts felt nice and fast at this weight. I can imagine staying on this weight until Im throwing it through the ceiling for all my sets. 

Pendlay Rows are well below what I can do but this phase isnt about putting weight on the bar, its about improving my fitness and droping some body fat.

Buggered my wrist at the weekend so tried OHP but cut the set short as no point prolonging an injury.

Need to knuckle down and do my fitness as Im slacking on it and thats what this phase is about. Its hard as i have been ill but going to do as per my plan from now on.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 5, 5
Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 6
Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10
Band Push Down: 3x20
RC Work

Good Workout, Bench felt like it did in the old days. Used less arch and kept my elbows closer to my sides so it used more triceps and kept the pressure off my shoulder. First set of 8 was so easy. I got 1 more rep on bench and the sets where I got the same were far easier so this is progress so I'm pleased.

Same on incline, one more rep so pleased with that.

Still amazed at the ability of Inverted Rows to stop my shoulder pain dead. It always hurts after Bench, first set of inverted rows and the pain instantly stops.


----------



## Benn

Bod42 said:


> Still amazed at the ability of Inverted Rows to stop my shoulder pain dead. It always hurts after Bench, first set of inverted rows and the pain instantly stops.


Sorry to be stupid, but what are inverted rows?


----------



## Guru

Benn said:


> Sorry to be stupid, but what are inverted rows?


----------



## Benn

Ah, thank you very much.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108KGX5 - 122.5KGX3 - 145KGX1 :thumb:

BENCH PRESS 102.5KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Tried 145Kg for my 1 rep Bench Press and made it :thumb: Definitely feeling stronger in the Bench Press, unsure, by I'm inclined to think the Bill Starr program is contributing greatly to my Bench Press progress  
Don't think I'm ready for 150kg just yet so ill keep lifting 145kg for a few cycles :thumb:
I also noticed a lot more strength on the 90Kg dead barbell row sets :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
Bulgarian Split Squats: 10x10,10,10
Lunges: 10x12,12,12

Good workout, reps werent as fast as I would have liked but still completing them fairly easily for the 1st 3 sets then they are still easy, I mean I have zero chance of failing but the speed starts to slow on the 5th set.

Have a love/hate relationship with single leg work. Hate doing it but love the results. They pump your legs up well and fix any imbalances and as I said before, my knee pain is getting better and better. 

Basically another good workout.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 10x10,10,10
> Lunges: 10x12,12,12
> 
> Good workout, reps werent as fast as I would have liked but still completing them fairly easily for the 1st 3 sets then they are still easy, I mean I have zero chance of failing but the speed starts to slow on the 5th set.
> 
> Have a love/hate relationship with single leg work. Hate doing it but love the results. They pump your legs up well and fix any imbalances and as I said before, my knee pain is getting better and better.
> 
> Basically another good workout.


What calorie deficit are you on now James?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1 heavy variant (Done yesterday)

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 180KGX1 - 190KGX1

SQUAT  135KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Best squat session for some time. I managed to get the bar position right on every set and the whole session felt awesome. Made a mistake and loaded the incorrect weight for what was to be my last work set  I decided to carry on and loaded 190Kg for an extra set :thumb: The mistake made the 190Kg feel a lot easier to lift and I mean a lot easier to the point of checking the weight after the rep 
I also worked on my fear of this lift :thumb:

This session highlighted to me that it is fear and consistency of bar position holding me back and my strength limit is yet to be found.

The 5 sets of 5 reps are most definitely helping in regards to technique as the weight is heavy enough to ensure I lift the sets as I would any work set. I will be continuing with 5 rep assistance sets on all three main lift sessions.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 30X5 40X5 50X3) - 77.5Kgx3x3x3x3x2x3

PRESS STARTS 87.5Kgx3x3x3

DIPS (Bodyweight - 110.72Kg :doublesho) x20x20x20x18 :thumb:*

Excellent workout. Form failed on set 5 of the OHP (Forgot to tighten glutes :wall and paid the price, however the last set was a hell of a lot better than last weeks, all the reps were strong.

Press starts are just starting to improve, I am basically moving the weight higher than before.

Dips, bloody awesome improvement from last week, I was so close to making 20 reps on the last set too :wall: 

My arms have never felt so dam pumped :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1 heavy variant

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 165KGX5 - 185KGX3 - 205KGX1

DEADLIFT 135KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 105KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Very happy with this workout, all weights felt GOOD! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> What calorie deficit are you on now James?


I basically do maintenance level on training days so i have the carbs and cals to train and then reduce carbs on non training days which obviously drops my calories.

Normally I hate dieting as I lose so much strength but this way seems to be working really well.

Quite a boring update as nothing has changed.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 145x3,3,3,3,3
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6
Shoulder Press: 45x8,8,8

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 5, 5
Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 6
Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 - 5/3/1 - De load

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice and easy de load session enabling me to rest before the next cycle.


----------



## Estoril-5

Ive been meaning to get into this again for so long, but I haven't, mainly my fault but not going to bore you with my excuses.

Anyway 1/10/14

Weight: 122kg

Squat: 20kg
Bench: 20kg
Barbell row: 30kg

5x5 all done


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Ive been meaning to get into this again for so long, but I haven't, mainly my fault but not going to bore you with my excuses.
> 
> Anyway 1/10/14
> 
> Weight: 122kg
> 
> Squat: 20kg
> Bench: 20kg
> Barbell row: 30kg
> 
> 5x5 all done


Welcome Estoril-5, glad you've decided to get active mate, stick with it and you will see results :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
Bulgarian Split Squats: 10x10,10,10
Lunges: 10x12,12,12

Was so tired and exhausted yesterday but this is where this type of training comes into its own, I completely all the reps relatively easily but they just weren't as fast as usual. My body is definitely adapting to the higher volume and shorter rest periods as I'm not as gassed at the end of 5 sets.

Awesome workout Doug, but that 205kg feels good.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 10x10,10,10
> Lunges: 10x12,12,12
> 
> Was so tired and exhausted yesterday but this is where this type of training comes into its own, I completely all the reps relatively easily but they just weren't as fast as usual. My body is definitely adapting to the higher volume and shorter rest periods as I'm not as gassed at the end of 5 sets.
> 
> Awesome workout Doug, but that 205kg feels good.


Thanks James, I'm hoping for 210Kg next cycle :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

ITHAQVA said:


> Welcome Estoril-5, glad you've decided to get active mate, stick with it and you will see results :thumb:


This might sound daft but, even though I started with an empty bar or near enough, the top of my legs (front) are aching a little. Not painful but they feel a bit heavier than normal when walking around.

Can this happen at such low weight?


----------



## Guru

It can happen without weight too. Remember, even if you do BW squats, about half your bodyweight (maybe more) has to be moved by your legs, so it's natural they are sore.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> This might sound daft but, even though I started with an empty bar or near enough, the top of my legs (front) are aching a little. Not painful but they feel a bit heavier than normal when walking around.
> 
> Can this happen at such low weight?


It can happen with no weight (body weight) or with added resistance - weight on a barbell. In layman's terms this pain is a result of your muscles doing something they haven't done before, it can be the intensity of the exercise, the amount/volume of the exercise, a new exercise. I would look at it as a good sign. The term for it is DOMS, "delayed onset of muscle soreness". We all get it from time to time and its a good sign of your workout pushing your body.

DOMS can indicate any of the following or a combination of:
Growth/size (Sarcoplasmic Hypertrophy).
Strength growth (myofibrillated hypertrophy) 
The natural repair process.

And so on.

Personally I would not try to understand too much as most sport science is contradictory as there as many factors determining a persons success. Me personally I love lifting heavy - so lifting heavy will work for me. The irony is it all works to a certain degree.

I would concentrate on the mental aspect of lifting and all the others will fall in place :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Cheers guys!

I'm actually looking forward to tomorrows workout


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> It can happen with no weight (body weight) or with added resistance - weight on a barbell. In layman's terms this pain is a result of your muscles doing something they haven't done before, it can be the intensity of the exercise, the amount/volume of the exercise, a new exercise. I would look at it as a good sign. The term for it is DOMS, "delayed onset of muscle soreness". We all get it from time to time and its a good sign of your workout pushing your body.
> 
> DOMS can indicate any of the following or a combination of:
> Growth/size (Sarcoplasmic Hypertrophy).
> Strength growth (myofibrillated hypertrophy)
> The natural repair process.
> 
> And so on.
> 
> Personally I would not try to understand too much as most sport science is contradictory as there as many factors determining a persons success. Me personally I love lifting heavy - so lifting heavy will work for me. The irony is it all works to a certain degree.
> 
> I would concentrate on the mental aspect of lifting and all the others will fall in place :thumb:


Excellent and in depth reply as usual Doug! 
Would echo everything said there.

Estoril-5 - Main thing is just to be comitted and consistent and you will get results, pretty much no matter what the details of the actual workout are. Don't worry too much about numbers of reps or numbers of actual weights, just find what works best for you and enjoy it. 
Good luck mate, and look forward to seeing your improvements!


----------



## Estoril-5

03/10/14

Squat: 22.5kg
Ohp: 20kg
DL: 40kg

5x5 all done


----------



## V3nom

Wow, I've just been reading into this whole 5x5 thing...sounds good, gonna give it a bash!

Are people noticing good results?!


----------



## Leebo310

Estoril-5 said:


> 03/10/14
> 
> Squat: 22.5kg
> Ohp: 20kg
> DL: 40kg
> 
> 5x5 all done


How are you currently splitting your workouts mate and how many times a week are you training? 
That's three big compound exercises to lump together in a single workout!


----------



## Estoril-5

Leebo310 said:


> How are you currently splitting your workouts mate and how many times a week are you training?
> That's three big compound exercises to lump together in a single workout!


I'm just following the stronglifts 5x5 guide.

It's split into 2 excercise sets A and B.

Train 3 times a week and alternate excercise sets.

Google it there's tonnes of info out there.


----------



## Leebo310

Estoril-5 said:


> I'm just following the stronglifts 5x5 guide.
> 
> It's split into 2 excercise sets A and B.
> 
> Train 3 times a week and alternate excercise sets.
> 
> Google it there's tonnes of info out there.


Sorry mate, yep know the 5x5! Think I just misread the dates on your workouts and assumed you were working out more than 3 times a week!


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> Wow, I've just been reading into this whole 5x5 thing...sounds good, gonna give it a bash!
> 
> Are people noticing good results?!


I've been training for 3 years done 5x5 for around 12 months, moved over to the original 5/3/1

I'm at just under 20% body fat and weight in at a slim  17 stone 8.6 pounds :doublesho 

Bench to date - 145Kg 
Squat to date - 200kg 
deadlift to date - 205kg

Incredibly happy with results :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 - 5/3/1 de load

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 110KGX5

SQUAT  70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Nice quick de load session :thumb:


----------



## dave-g

what sort of meal plans are people working with?
i find that I'm making good progress but my meals etc are ruining me :lol:

searched high and low for a decent meal, but at 82kg and not really wanting the whole bulking thing, they're scarce.


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> what sort of meal plans are people working with?
> i find that I'm making good progress but my meals etc are ruining me :lol:
> 
> searched high and low for a decent meal, but at 82kg and not really wanting the whole bulking thing, they're scarce.


Hi Dave,
We cant really answer the question without you telling us what your goals are.

What is it your looking to get from your nutrition? If not to bulk/grow muscle, are you looking to just maintain your weight/muscle mass?


----------



## dave-g

Yeah was a bit rushed that last comment 

I've been trying to lose body fat as due to last couple of months been a bit over-carbing to be honest, so holding a bit of excess fat on my lower back/belly.

But, I do feel that with recent months training I'm growing muscle too, which overall is the main aim. So I'd say muscle gaining... So realistically bulking :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

dave-g said:


> Yeah was a bit rushed that last comment
> 
> I've been trying to lose body fat as due to last couple of months been a bit over-carbing to be honest, so holding a bit of excess fat on my lower back/belly.
> 
> But, I do feel that with recent months training I'm growing muscle too, which overall is the main aim. So I'd say muscle gaining... So realistically bulking :lol:


Briefly:

If muscle mass is your goal, then you need to eat in excess to gain the muscle (You will gain some fat), just like you need to eat in deficit to lose fat (You will lose some muscle).

I've tried many different approaches to getting stronger and bigger, nothing has come a million miles close to the results I've gained from a heavy powerlifting approach (5x5 and 5/3/1) and a higher protein diet. At present I consume around 200-250 grams per day, I'm 5'10" and weigh in at 17 stone 8.6 pounds at 20% body fat (I don't have a belly but at that percentage I'm not lean either) :thumb:

I would suggest you consume around 180-200 grams of protein per day, relying on whole food sources for the largest part and one whey protein a day to supplement the intake. You'll need to work out your BMR to enable you to work out daily calories required. I would suggest doing 500 calories over your BMR and monitor your weight as it is very easy to start building more fat than muscle.
Depending on how your body copes with protein you will need to ensure you drink plenty of water (Keep urine almost clear) and eat a good amount of greens/veg and pulses for extra protein and fibre if required. I'm lucky high protein does not effect my bowel movements (I average 3 times a day = Good speedy digestion :thumb

If your serious about your goals you'll realise that for the most of us mere mortals getting big and strong is not just about lifting. How you eat and sleep are also very important for recovery/growth.

The only other thing is the mental approach - Beast mode activated! :devil:

Hope this helps Dave :thumb:


----------



## dave-g

Very very helpful mate appreciate you taking the time to reply :thumb:

Going to look into the 5x5 as it has been recommended by a few others up until now, so worth a look 😊

Thanks again!


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 145x3,3,3,3,3
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8

This was a committed workout. Was going round a mates for a boys darts night but was late home from work so i took my weights with me and pulled a set between my darts throws. I thought rows would be awful after Deadlifts but I actually prefer them and Im making good progress.

I havent missed a workout since i have been dieting but I have been absolutely useless on doing my fitness. This phase is all about increasing my fitness and losing some body fat, so far I havent done either. I should have done 13 walks and 5 sprints sessions, all I have done is 2 walks, that is absolutely pathetic so for the next 8 weeks, I will not be missing my fitness workouts. I need to increase my fitness as the next phase is circuit training so need to be fit enough to maintain my strength.


----------



## Estoril-5

6/10/14

Squats: WU 20kg 5x1, 25kg 5x5.
Bench: 22.5kg 5x5
Barbell row: 32.5kg 5x5.

Done


----------



## V3nom

Gave this an attempt on Saturday...

Weight: 90kgs

Squat: 60kg
Bench: 40kg
Barbell row: 40kg

5x5 all done

My quads are still quite sore today but that's about it...need to go heavier next time I guess.


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> Gave this an attempt on Saturday...
> 
> Weight: 90kgs
> 
> Squat: 60kg
> Bench: 40kg
> Barbell row: 40kg
> 
> 5x5 all done
> 
> My quads are still quite sore today but that's about it...need to go heavier next time I guess.


Hi Venom,

Follow the program as per stronglifts advice, you'll soon find sticking points, no need to get to them too quick


----------



## Estoril-5

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Venom,
> 
> Follow the program as per stronglifts advice, you'll soon find sticking points, no need to get to them too quick


I agree with the above, I've started on an empty bar as per 5x5 advice even though I've been training on and off for a while.

Gives the body time to adjust and hopefully not max out prematurely.


----------



## V3nom

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Venom,
> 
> Follow the program as per stronglifts advice, you'll soon find sticking points, no need to get to them too quick





Estoril-5 said:


> I agree with the above, I've started on an empty bar as per 5x5 advice even though I've been training on and off for a while.
> 
> Gives the body time to adjust and hopefully not max out prematurely.


Cheers guys...I have been doing weight training solid for about 3 months now so I'm guessing that's why I'm not too sore.

I started off with what I felt comfortable with so I'll maybe up each one by 2.5kgs next time.

Felt good though, good sweat-up, especially on the squats!


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 5, 6
Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 6
Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10 
Band Push Downs: 3x20
RC Work

Good workout, got 1 more rep than i have been getting so that is progress which is good. Im definitely starting to adapt the higher volume as Im not as gassed during the workout and Im not so sore.

I really like this workout setup of Push 1, Push 2, Pull 1 but if you look at 5/3/1 then this is exactly how he sets out his BBB workouts which funnily enough is what I will be changing to in a few months but I will be doing my Just 3s on the lower body movements as that worked so well for me last time.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 96KGX5 - 110.5KGX5 - 124.5KGX5

BENCH PRESS 105KGx5x5x5x5x5

DEAD BARBELL ROW 92.5KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Bloody awesome workout :thumb:

Cant believe how positive the 5x124.5kg felt and I don't mean easy but all the reps were no were near grinders if you know what I mean :thumb:

All I need to do now is sort my squat out :wall:


----------



## Bod42

Im contemplating doing your workout Doug as the more I read about Raw lifters, the more they seem to work up to a max 5/3 or 1 and then do back off sets. That is basically what you are doing. Its just like BBB but I feel the 10 reps wont have as much carry over as the 5 reps that your doing.


----------



## Estoril-5

8.10.14

Squats 27.kg 5x5
Ohp 22.5kg 5x5
DL 45kg 1x5
Done.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Im contemplating doing your workout Doug as the more I read about Raw lifters, the more they seem to work up to a max 5/3 or 1 and then do back off sets. That is basically what you are doing. Its just like BBB but I feel the 10 reps wont have as much carry over as the 5 reps that your doing.


James, I highly recommend 5 rep assistance sets and the Bill Starr OHP/Dip program, I'm getting heavier but my body fat is less (My clothes feel looser). I currently weigh 17 stone 8 :doublesho This jump in growth can only be attested to the above changes to my routine as im eating around 3000 cals per day. Does this also mean that the low rep work burns more fat as it has been suggested?

Although Im not sure how heavy I can take the assistance work. I'm sure its bashing my recovery really hard :devil:
Wendler suggests 3 months then a lay off to recover from it. Although I'm not following his 3 month challenge I'm just lifting heavy for 5 reps and adding 2.5kg per month on them all. I'm going to just monitor my progress and if I find the extra load does effect my over all training I'll add in de load assistance months were the assistance work is all the original 10 rep stuff, after a month go back to the heavy 5 rep assistance work and carry on with the weight I left off from so there is progress in these sets hopefully keeping up the carry over to my work sets.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> 8.10.14
> 
> Squats 27.kg 5x5
> Ohp 22.5kg 5x5
> DL 45kg 1x5
> Done.


Just remember Estoril, you'll stall on the OHP first, its very normal, don't get disheartened by it :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

ITHAQVA said:


> Just remember Estoril, you'll stall on the OHP first, its very normal, don't get disheartened by it :thumb:


Funny you should say that as this morning I was thinking to myself the hardest part was OHP.

Squats and DL ok for now


----------



## Starbuck88

I've been doing 5x5 for a little while now and the improvements so far have been nothing short of amazing.

Now that I have form down to a T I backed off the weight a little and am now starting to slowly add again.

Can already see a difference in the mirror, been about 3 months now.


----------



## Estoril-5

asonda said:


> I've been doing 5x5 for a little while now and the improvements so far have been nothing short of amazing.
> 
> Now that I have form down to a T I backed off the weight a little and am now starting to slowly add again.
> 
> Can already see a difference in the mirror, been about 3 months now.


What were your stats before and now?

I'm weighing in at 122kg and massively overweight.

I don't know if the weights will help with weight loss but I enjoy it and that means I'll stick at it for longer.


----------



## Starbuck88

Estoril-5 said:


> What were your stats before and now?
> 
> I'm weighing in at 122kg and massively overweight.
> 
> I don't know if the weights will help with weight loss but I enjoy it and that means I'll stick at it for longer.


I am 26 and a stick thin 60-62kg keeps fluctuating as I can't seem to keep cramming in the calories and diet is inconsistent. I'm trying to add weight, have been skinny all my life.

Currently Gluten free too so am just trying to get in as much healthy fats, almond butter, coconut oil etc and eat very healthy.

When I started I honestly had no muscle what so ever, I couldn't bench 20kg or do a deep squat with 20kg.

My form was a little off so kept adding weight and didn't realise although I could manage it, I was probably doing myself more harm than good.

So this past 2 weeks I reigned it right back to the beginning and I'm currently at 30kg Squat, 30kg Bench Press, 60kg Deadlift, 35kg Barbell Row, OHP at 22.5kg but with perfect form.

Yes OHP is the hardest one to move forward with as quickly as the others.

As I want to increase strength and overall mass the compound movements have thickened my ab area so I now don't have as much of a girly waist cinch and the bench presses have helped a bit with chest size, as I had no muscle there at all.

In order to speed things up, seems to be working, I've added in some machine excersises and do 5x5 on them, so I currently do 20kg Pec Deck and I do bicep and tricep excersises (curls and pull downs) to grow my arms.

I also include every other work out crunches, planks and knee ups for abs.

The one thing everybody has to do is commit, and stay committed, people get disheartened by slow progress, not seeing results in just a couple of sessions at the Gym but if you stay committed you'll see results.

Even if you go in the Gym with no plan and you just try and lift everything in sight for an hour, you're still going to be 100% better off than the guy sitting at home playing PS4 and eating crisps 

Oh and the weights for weight loss, is brilliant, as if you keep on the low side for Carbs, your body will use fat to replenish energy reserves, weight lifting helps you lose weight long after you've left the gym where most Cardio is lots of hard work for little return and has shown your body gets used to it and losing weight becomes and issue again.

Weights all the way with a bit of Cardio to warm up or cool down after a work out


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*SQUAT (WU 80X5 90X5 110X3) - 130KGX5 - 150KGX5 - 170KGX5

SQUAT 137.5KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Best squat workout for some time, managed to achieve good technique consistency throughout the workout :thumb:

Wednesday weigh in - 17.9 stone :doublesho  :thumb: The heavy approach is really packing on the muscle :devil:


----------



## Estoril-5

10.10.14

Squat 35kg 5x5 (was supposed to be 30kg but I misread - all good though as I've jumped up a little faster than usual but in fine)
Bench 25kg 5x5
Barbell row 35kg 5x5

Done!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> 10.10.14
> 
> Squat 35kg 5x5 (was supposed to be 30kg but I misread - all good though as I've jumped up a little faster than usual but in fine)
> Bench 25kg 5x5
> Barbell row 35kg 5x5
> 
> Done!


Keep at it mate, the weights will go up soon enough.

Few tips to stop you wasting your time:

1. Never forsake your form/technique to make the reps- It will bite you in the ass when they get heavier 

2. Do not use machines. They are a complete waste of time.

3. Do not train arms or abs. If you stick with the program, you'll have arms to be proud of due to the heavy lifting your doing on the compound lifts. Also the Abs/core are hit very hard whilst using compound barbell lifts.

4. Once you've made the prescribed weights on the 5x5 move away and try the original 5/3/1 with the Big But Boring assistance routines.

5. Sleep is very important to muscle growth/recovery.

6. Don't bother doing "MORE" than the prescribed routines, this will slow down your progress/growth/strength.

7. Ensure you consume your daily requirement of protein.

8. keep re evaluating your form/technique, as you progress and the weights get heavier your form will tend to falter.

9. Search YouTube for "So you think you can bench" "So you think you can squat" and "So you think you can deadlift". They are produced by EliteFTS and are an excellent way to learn form :thumb:

Hope this helps mate :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

This is my gym, no machines


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> This is my gym, no machines


Looks dam good mate. However if your training alone as I do and this new venture becomes more long term, for your safety I would recommend a power rack.

Feeling safe while lifting will also put you in the right mind set to progress. Having doubt will hold you back.

This is my setup (Bod42 has the same)

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211

You can get the rack and bench for around £500, if you need to upgrade to the weights it will cost another £399 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 140GX5 - 160KGX5 - 180KGX5

DEADLIFT 140KGx5x5x5x5x5

RDL 110KGx5x5x5x5x5*

All good.

Missed this weeks Bill Starr OHP due to being a lazy sod and going to bed too late during the week. Woke up Saturday feeling tired, my fault and I should listen to my own advice :wall:  Punished myself by adding more weight to todays Deadlift session and it still ended up feeling easy enough to complete :tumbleweed:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Yep Doug and I are on opposite sides of the world but we have managed to buy exactly the same power rack and bench. Simple set up but its the best.

Doug do you mind sending me some info on the Bill Starr Dips routine as I googled it but cant find anything.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Yep Doug and I are on opposite sides of the world but we have managed to buy exactly the same power rack and bench. Simple set up but its the best.
> 
> Doug do you mind sending me some info on the Bill Starr Dips routine as I googled it but cant find anything.


Yep, long distance training partners 

James, Ill email it to you tonight after work mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Yep Doug and I are on opposite sides of the world but we have managed to buy exactly the same power rack and bench. Simple set up but its the best.
> 
> Doug do you mind sending me some info on the Bill Starr Dips routine as I googled it but cant find anything.


Just sent it James :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Thanks Doug, most appreciated. Ya and Ive decided that Im going to steal your 5/3/1 5x5 routine from the 1st of December. On lower body it will be working up to 3RM instead of the usual 5/3/1 so basically its nothing like 5/3/1 anymore lol.

Friday
Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 145x3,3,3,3,3
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8

Monday
Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 6, 6
Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 6
Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10
Band Push Downs: 3x20
RC Work

The eagle eyed of you will notice that I increased my reps on bench by 1 rep. This is nothing major but its a big deal when you are dieting. Yes I havent lost anywhere near the weight I wanted to. I mean I should have lost approx 6kg by now and I have only lost 2kg but to keep my strength while dieting, for me is amazing. As soon as I drop my calories, my strength normally takes a massive dive. This week is the last of this type of workout and for the next 6 weeks I will be using complexes to really push my fitness and weight loss and just maintaining strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thanks Doug, most appreciated. Ya and Ive decided that Im going to steal your 5/3/1 5x5 routine from the 1st of December. On lower body it will be working up to 3RM instead of the usual 5/3/1 so basically its nothing like 5/3/1 anymore lol.
> 
> Friday
> Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 145x3,3,3,3,3
> Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8
> 
> Monday
> Bench Press: (WU 70x5, 77.5x4, 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1) WO 100x8, 8, 6, 6, 6
> Incline Press: 70x8, 6, 6
> Neutral Grip Chins between pressing warm ups x 2
> Inverted Rows: BWx7, 7, 10
> Band Push Downs: 3x20
> RC Work
> 
> The eagle eyed of you will notice that I increased my reps on bench by 1 rep. This is nothing major but its a big deal when you are dieting. Yes I havent lost anywhere near the weight I wanted to. I mean I should have lost approx 6kg by now and I have only lost 2kg but to keep my strength while dieting, for me is amazing. As soon as I drop my calories, my strength normally takes a massive dive. This week is the last of this type of workout and for the next 6 weeks I will be using complexes to really push my fitness and weight loss and just maintaining strength.


I would go for it James, but listen to your body, if after a few months of heavy cycles you may feel fatigued on rest days. I would then as I might next month go back to 10 rep assistance work just to rest up and recover for a month, then back to heavies. Imagine this as a large monthly max effort approach but in monthly cycles.

Don't worry about the weight James, the same happened to me. I now eat healthy but don't worry about extra calories and for some odd reason I'm getting more muscular but heavier, which is a good sign of body fat reducing (Body re composition). My advice to you mate is, if you able to lift normal (heavy) and keep calories just right I think you should forget the high rep stuff and keep building.

Im sitting here at 6.59 eating two pieces of chicken thighs 

:thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

14.10.14

Squat 37.5kg 5x5
Ohp 25kg 5x5
Deadlift 50kg 1x5

Done


----------



## V3nom

13/10/14

Squat - 70KGS - 5 x 5
Bench Press - 47.5KGS - 5 x 5
Barbell Row - 47.5KGS - 5 x 5

Done


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103.5KGX3 - 117.5KGX3 - 131.5KGX3

BENCH PRESS 105KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Had to leave the rows out tonight, stuffed for time:wall:

All good. Last rep of the 131.5Kg was a little untidy,so I will repeat this months Bench weights next month.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I would go for it James, but listen to your body, if after a few months of heavy cycles you may feel fatigued on rest days. I would then as I might next month go back to 10 rep assistance work just to rest up and recover for a month, then back to heavies. Imagine this as a large monthly max effort approach but in monthly cycles.
> 
> Don't worry about the weight James, the same happened to me. I now eat healthy but don't worry about extra calories and for some odd reason I'm getting more muscular but heavier, which is a good sign of body fat reducing (Body re composition). My advice to you mate is, if you able to lift normal (heavy) and keep calories just right I think you *should forget the high rep stuff and keep building.*
> 
> Im sitting here at 6.59 eating two pieces of chicken thighs
> 
> :thumb:


The most reps I have been doing is 10s on the assistant exercises so not that high really.

The 5/3/1 5x5 is basically what I'm doing now but I want to simplify everything next phase and get my strength back to hitting PRs quickly so this is definitely the best way to do it.

Im actually looking forward to the complexs. You still work up to a 5RM on the big 3 but then the complexs are really going to improve my fitness. Im also looking at playing rugby again so need to see how fit I am so this will be a great test.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX3

SQUAT 137.5KGx5x5x5x5x5

STANDING CALF RAISE 160KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Best squat workout for some time, all reps parallel and felt dam good :thumb:

At no time did fear show its face :devil: I'm hoping my confidence will now come back so I can start progressing 

EPIC!


----------



## Estoril-5

16.10.14

Squat 40kg 5x5 
Bench 27.5kg 5x5
Barbell row 37.5 kg 5x5

Done

Don't know why but I really like barbell rows


----------



## V3nom

15.10.14

Squat - 72.5kgs - 5x5
OHP - 30kgs - 5x5
Deadlift - 50kgs - 5x5

What has happened to me!? I'm actually looking forward to and enjoying Squats! Crazy!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> 16.10.14
> 
> Squat 40kg 5x5
> Bench 27.5kg 5x5
> Barbell row 37.5 kg 5x5
> 
> Done
> 
> Don't know why but I really like barbell rows





V3nom said:


> 15.10.14
> 
> Squat - 72.5kgs - 5x5
> OHP - 30kgs - 5x5
> Deadlift - 50kgs - 5x5
> 
> What has happened to me!? I'm actually looking forward to and enjoying Squats! Crazy!


Nice one guys, keep that love and passion, the sport of powerlifting teaches you a lot about yourself and your character. Those that go the course show true strength of character :thumb:

If you have any questions feel free to ask James or myself, I think between the both of us we've made all the mistakes you possibly can in this sport


----------



## Bod42

Nice work guys. I can promise you that this is one of the best programs out there so believe in the program, be consistent and you will see the benefits. 

I see it time and time again people doing the long body part isolation exercise routines from the body building mags and just making zero progress whereas I have never seen anyone not make progress on this program.

Squats: (WU 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1) 120x5,5,5,5,5

Looking forward to getting back to squatting some decent numbers soon, well 6 weeks anyway. The weight feels stupidly light on my back now and my speed is getting better.

I missed my split squats and lunges as their what make me really sore and I had a golf comp the next day so didnt want to be to sore and tight for that. Been doing some swing speed training as well on my off days and my swing speed is slowly creeping up and Ive got my game back at the moment from the awful form Ive had so going to push my golf this summer as well, see where I can get with that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

My first powerlifting YouTube video. Big thanks to Mitch Eller for inspiring me into this :thumb:

As stated in the vid: 180Kg x 3 reps. Take note of how I keep my belly pushed out throughout the set, this is especially important for me as I lift 100% RAAAAAWWWWWW!

Sparkly lights courtesy of Mrs ITHAQVA


----------



## Leebo310

Nice lift Doug 👍


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lift Doug &#55357;&#56397;


Thanks for your support Lee :thumb:

I've been struggling with fear of the squat. After some research, its apparently a common issue for lifters 

But I WILL FACE FEAR Again and again until I win! :devil:

Going to try some squat walkouts soon to help with my confidence


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks for your support Lee :thumb:
> 
> I've been struggling with fear of the squat. After some research, its apparently a common issue for lifters
> 
> But I WILL FACE FEAR Again and again until I win! :devil:
> 
> Going to try some squat walkouts soon to help with my confidence


I love squats but I have a similar problem with deadlift. Hate the exercise! Really struggle with perfect form on it, no matter how many videos I watch! 
Will stick with it though and hopefully get it sorted soon as it's lagging behind on progress massively compared to the other three lifts 😠


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 30X5 40X5 50X3) - 77.5Kgx3x3x3x3x3x3

DIPS (Body weight - 112Kg) 20x20x20x18

PRESS STARTS 87.5Kgx3x3x3*

Moved Dips between the OHP sessions as my bench is more of a priority. Odd thing was it made the press starts hard, first set was very difficult and then the following two sets were easier. Goes to show just how difficult the OHP is to warm up. This was also evident on the first OHP group as the third and fourth sets were the easiest.

Didn't manage 20 reps on the last set of dips, so I'll just have to keep at it until I do :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1 - Heavy Variant

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 150GX3 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX3

DEADLIFT 140KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 110KGX5X5X5X5X5*

All good :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Main work set Vid :thumb:

Please ignore the barbell load caption TYPO!






I am most certainly a lot stronger since moving over to a 5 rep heavier assistance approach :devil: I feel like I've moved up to another base strength level if that makes any sense.

However, next month I will use the standard 10 rep slightly lighter approach and also use the month to do some different assistance exercises, namely - Chins, squat walk outs and dead benches as I'm just starting to feel a little extra fatigued on some rest days (Not a great deal but enough to tell me to rest so my progress is not hindered by beating up my CNS). Resting before the old CNS is battered will allow me to go heavy again the following month. I will take each month as it comes, but would like to be able to do 3 months 5 rep approach 1 month 10 rep and so on.

Had so much doms in my upper body this morning from yesterdays Bill Starr routine, todays deadlift session took my mind off that lol

:devil: Lift on! :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> I love squats but I have a similar problem with deadlift. Hate the exercise! Really struggle with perfect form on it, no matter how many videos I watch!
> Will stick with it though and hopefully get it sorted soon as it's lagging behind on progress massively compared to the other three lifts 😠


Deadlifts are a complicated exercise for some people to feel the muscles they should be doing. Best advice I can give is dont treat it as a pulling exercise. i know that sounds weird but dont think of pulling the weight up your legs, think about driving your feet through the floor for the initial break of the weight and then just think of pushing your hips through and contracting your glutes.

Nice work Doug, vids are awesome and really inspiring. I cant wait to get back to lifting heavy. I had 170x3 for squat so Im not far behind :devil: Just got 6 weeks and then i will be doing Dougs 5/3/1 5x5 hybrid program. I wont be altering my weight monthly at first, I will be doing it each workout so I can get back to optimum strength following my diet. My strength will prob plumet hard out over the next 6 weeks as Im going to lower my carbs quite abit. i want 1 kg per week for the next 6 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice work Doug, vids are awesome and really inspiring. I cant wait to get back to lifting heavy. I had 170x3 for squat so Im not far behind :devil: Just got 6 weeks and then i will be doing Dougs 5/3/1 5x5 hybrid program. I wont be altering my weight monthly at first, I will be doing it each workout so I can get back to optimum strength following my diet. My strength will prob plumet hard out over the next 6 weeks as Im going to lower my carbs quite abit. i want 1 kg per week for the next 6 weeks.


Thanks mate :thumb: I'm finding them a good way to form check and keep myself inspired. All these little tools we use will help us progress 

Give it a go James, its worked very well for me. But I'm not sure if you'll benefit as much if you loosing weight too quick. remember the 5 rep assistance should be heavy enough to feel like your working for your reps. Add 2.5Kg upper and 5kg lower per month until you find a sticking point or you start feeling fatigued on some rest days. Then go back to the standard 10 rep BBB template for a month.

I've managed 3 months 5 rep and could probably do a few more, but I want to progress so its always good to structure in "recovery". It is far better to recover before you really need it, otherwise you could end up a little burnt out and need more recovery making you take longer to progress if you know what I mean. Keep it open ended if you do two months and feel fatigued a bit more than normal or lacking energy on rest days. Do a recovery month.

Your tolerance to more heavy load will go up, but will also drop if you hit your CNS too hard.

Its a juggling act between the heavy 5 rep assistance lifts and recovery. I've managed 3 months and the assistance weights are nowhere near heavy yet but I have got results from them. As they get heavier I may have to go down to a month on month off approach until my tolerance level goes up. There will also be another factor to consider. - Joint health, they take longer to adapt, hence why im going back to 10 rep BBB next month, if I feel a little more fatigued than normal on rest days then my joints are also in need of some recover (You'll notice a little extra stiffness in your joints in the mornings, LEAVE IT! ) I've not researched the joint version of DOMS but I'm sure there is some form of recovery mechanism in them or at least the surrounding tissue/tendons.

:thumb:


----------



## guy999

Hi
Have been doing stronglifts 5x5 since August, apart from a 2 week break in September for holiday.
Break was well worth it, since hadn't trained for years and to be honest probably started off too heavy (also didn't fancy paying fees to go to the gym and just use an empty bar...)
Experienced all forms of aches and pains, especially in knees and calf muscles. Probably due to form and lack of exercise over the previous years.

Anyway during my break purchased power rack, olympic weights etc... lowered weights and restarted the 5x5. Now train in my garage before work, so trying to get up around 6am, train and then 1hr+ commute to work.

Most aches and pains have now gone, trouble is when getting 1/2 way down when squatting get a pain shooting up from my calf which basically stops me from going further. 
Have now started to do 5 mins on exercise bike and basic stretching which helps, concentrating on my form.

Saturday, legs were sore and having rubbed my calves found knot in my calf which hopefully is the culprit of the pain. Looked on net and used a tennis ball to roll around on it. Sunday my left calf felt really sore and bruised, today is no better.
This morning when i got out of bed to train, pain was that bad, that i went back to bed.
So tonight planning on training, trouble is 5x5 is basically a squating program and dont think i can squat. Thinking of doing leg extensions instead for a while, whilst carrying on with the other exercises as normal.
Any advice? I'm in my 40's so dont think recovery will be that quick anymore 
Thanks


----------



## ITHAQVA

guy999 said:


> Hi
> Have been doing stronglifts 5x5 since August, apart from a 2 week break in September for holiday.
> Break was well worth it, since hadn't trained for years and to be honest probably started off too heavy (also didn't fancy paying fees to go to the gym and just use an empty bar...)
> Experienced all forms of aches and pains, especially in knees and calf muscles. Probably due to form and lack of exercise over the previous years.
> 
> Anyway during my break purchased power rack, olympic weights etc... lowered weights and restarted the 5x5. Now train in my garage before work, so trying to get up around 6am, train and then 1hr+ commute to work.
> 
> Most aches and pains have now gone, trouble is when getting 1/2 way down when squatting get a pain shooting up from my calf which basically stops me from going further.
> Have now started to do 5 mins on exercise bike and basic stretching which helps, concentrating on my form.
> 
> Saturday, legs were sore and having rubbed my calves found knot in my calf which hopefully is the culprit of the pain. Looked on net and used a tennis ball to roll around on it. Sunday my left calf felt really sore and bruised, today is no better.
> This morning when i got out of bed to train, pain was that bad, that i went back to bed.
> So tonight planning on training, trouble is 5x5 is basically a squating program and dont think i can squat. Thinking of doing leg extensions instead for a while, whilst carrying on with the other exercises as normal.
> Any advice? I'm in my 40's so dont think recovery will be that quick anymore
> Thanks


I would first of all forget training for a few days and do further investigation on your problem. I have never had knots so cannot comment from my experience. However, I'm not so sure the pain should be as acute as you describe and would recommend getting an opinion from a good sports physio.

As for training in the morning, your joints are not fully hydrated and I do not recommend it.

Sorry not much of an answer but my knowledge/experience with this is limited mate.

:thumb:


----------



## V3nom

Got a good email from Mehdi this morning (the stronglifts guy) on the best way to exercise the guns...chinups...he said you can spend years and years bashing out curls and not get anywhere but with chinups it's a much more effective workout. 

If only I could do a chinup lol


----------



## guy999

Thanks, made an appointment to see someone Sunday hopefully is just a knot,think i went too mad rolling around on the ball though...
You are probably right about training first thing, trouble is with work and family life only free time i seem to have nowadays, hence why i hadn’t trained for years. But determined to do something.
When i get back tonight will try some leg extensions and then back to routine so its just ohd press and dlifts, followed by some pull-ups.


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> Got a good email from Mehdi this morning (the stronglifts guy) on the best way to exercise the guns...chinups...he said you can spend years and years bashing out curls and not get anywhere but with chinups it's a much more effective workout.
> 
> If only I could do a chinup lol


If you do the 5x5 for 12 months then the 5/3/1 for another two years you'll have guns mate and they will be fully functional not just for show 

Don't forget dips will build those shooters too


----------



## guy999

Workout tonight, quick 40 minutes. 
5 mins bike
Body weight squats. Concentrating on form. Calf feels a lot better
Leg extensions 3x12 40 kgs
Ohd press 50 kgs
Deadlift 90 kgs
3 sets of pull ups x5 (over under over grip)
Whey protein 
Shower

Bit hard to concentrate with 2 yr old in room though.


----------



## Bod42

V3nom said:


> Got a good email from Mehdi this morning (the stronglifts guy) on the best way to exercise the guns...chinups...he said you can spend years and years bashing out curls and not get anywhere but with chinups it's a much more effective workout.
> 
> If only I could do a chinup lol


Totally agree. I never train arms and mine are just shy of 17".

Check out this article. "Half an inch in upper arm growth (very rapid for an experienced lifter.) Noticeable increase in upper body size and strength. Stronger abs and grip, decreased body fat."

http://www.t-nation.com/workouts/chin-up-project

Guy999. This could just be the typical lack of mobility when you first start squatting. I have only ever trained one person who had the mobility to squat straight off the bat. Also check how far forward your knees are going out over your foot. If your sitting back like you should then the knees shouldnt be going forward very far but they do in most beginners as their quads are stronger than their hamstrings and glutes. I would concentrate on doing Calf Wall stretch a few times per day if it doesnt cause pain.

While you are waiting for the pain to go away, do body weight squats for high reps, surprisingly these will add size to your legs for a short period of time and doing an exercise if the best way to improve your mobility for it.

Anyway on to my new workout. Note i am just doing this for 6 weeks to improve my fitness using weights, i do not expect this to add size or strength but will improve my overall fitness.

Bench Press: 70x5, 75x4, 87.5x3, 95x2, 100x1, 105x1, 112.5x1, 100x8
Dips: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3
Chins: 2, 4, 6 , 8, 10, 8, 6, 4, 2
Push ups: 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 20, 15, 10, 5
leg Raises: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3

This is done as a ladder circuit so Dips, Chin, pushups, leg raises and then 1 min rest, start again. Ok I thought I wouldnt have any prob with this workout except chin ups, boy was I wrong, this thing completely gased me. Felt awesome on my chest and worked me really hard. i honestly thought the easiest exercise would be push ups but after dips, they are an absolute killer and I was down to single reps and then a rest on the upper sets. My entire upper body is sore today so this workout really hits everything. Need to smash this workout hard as I'm only lifting 2 days per week over the 4 exercises so only do this workout 3 times in 6 weeks. Coupled with walking and sprinting a few times a week, this should enable me to keep my calories higher and burn them off instead of eat less. Hopefully this will keep my strength up and so far it has.


----------



## guy999

Thanks for the advice. Tried the calf wall stretch on right calf didn't think was doing it correct. On the left, it hurt!
Going to take it a bit easier. Concentrate on upper body at least for workouts of tomorrow and Friday.


----------



## Guitarjon

I appear to be having issues. Think it could be a visit to the doctor. But could also be down to diet/ hydration. 

Major dizzy spells and tiredness... I couldn't believe how crap I felt today. Seems to come on more after barbell rows and deadlifts for some reason? Literally had to sit down for a while. 

For a few months my diet hasn't been as clean as it was but nothing off the wall. I haven't been watching calories as I was. I've been drinking plenty but not just water and green tea. Been having quite a lot of diet Pepsi and was never bothered by it before. Been doing this for a week or so. It started a while back but I've not done so much strength stuff for a while. For what its worth I wasn't lifting very heavy today either. I literally pulled my car over on the way home and stopped as I didn't feel safe.


----------



## guy999

At work today, loads of people with coughs and colds. Must be change in weather. Guess won't be long before it reaches my section

Best to go to doctor, hopefully just that you coming down with flu, maybe u need to just rest up for a bit or take things easy.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I appear to be having issues. Think it could be a visit to the doctor. But could also be down to diet/ hydration.
> 
> Major dizzy spells and tiredness... I couldn't believe how crap I felt today. Seems to come on more after barbell rows and deadlifts for some reason? Literally had to sit down for a while.
> 
> For a few months my diet hasn't been as clean as it was but nothing off the wall. I haven't been watching calories as I was. I've been drinking plenty but not just water and green tea. Been having quite a lot of diet Pepsi and was never bothered by it before. Been doing this for a week or so. It started a while back but I've not done so much strength stuff for a while. For what its worth I wasn't lifting very heavy today either. I literally pulled my car over on the way home and stopped as I didn't feel safe.


You definitely need to go and see you doctor mate, get a full check up. Leave the lifting until your clear. Perhaps take a few days eating nice and clean with plenty of water. Diet Pepsi has sweeteners in personally I think they are worse than sugar.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 130x5
BW Squats: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5
Sit Ups: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5
Chin Ups: 2,4,6,8,6,4,2
Push Ups: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5

Good workout, was dripping with sweat by the end. Not as hard workout as Mondays due to hitting all different muscles.


----------



## Guitarjon

ITHAQVA said:


> You definitely need to go and see you doctor mate, get a full check up. Leave the lifting until your clear. Perhaps take a few days eating nice and clean with plenty of water. Diet Pepsi has sweeteners in personally I think they are worse than sugar.
> 
> :thumb:


I know I should but I genuinely don't have much faith in the doctors. Had far to many personal bad experiences. Myself and my family have been victims of budget cut Nhs. I don't want to slate it but its a pretty well know fact that the NHS are very good at diagnosing the problems but budgets often lead to the least effective way to treating the symptoms. In my case they have not always diagnosed me correctly leading to hospitalisation.

Maybe now is the time I should look at private health care lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guitarjon said:


> I know I should but I genuinely don't have much faith in the doctors. Had far to many personal bad experiences. Myself and my family have been victims of budget cut Nhs. I don't want to slate it but its a pretty well know fact that the NHS are very good at diagnosing the problems but budgets often lead to the least effective way to treating the symptoms. In my case they have not always diagnosed me correctly leading to hospitalisation.
> 
> Maybe now is the time I should look at private health care lol.


We are a bit lucky down here in Cornwall, NHS is very good and local doctors are caring. I do understand a lack of faith though as you will find a GP not really that knowledgeable enough to help with sports injuries and rehab, but then again that is why we have general practitioners and specialists


----------



## Starbuck88

ITHAQVA said:


> We are a bit lucky down here in Cornwall, NHS is very good and local doctors are caring. I do understand a lack of faith though as you will find a GP not really that knowledgeable enough to help with sports injuries and rehab, but then again that is why we have general practitioners and specialists


Where abouts are you in cornwall?


----------



## ITHAQVA

asonda said:


> Where abouts are you in cornwall?


PM'd ya :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I didn't train last week, so I will be doing the work sets only this week. I'm a bit out of sync, hence Squats done today 

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 150KGX5 - 170KGX3 - 195KGX1*

Vid:






Rep was a little untidy, I didn't keep my core as tight as I should have even though I forced my belly out as much as I could and looked like a fat git for the privilege! But hey I made the rep :thumb: I'll use same weight next month :thumb:


----------



## guy999

195kg...wow... have been reading the old posts and guess I'm where you were 3 years ago. Doubt if i will ever get to 195 though! Struggling just with your warm up weight at the moment

Todays workout.
Bike 5 mins, basic stretches.
Squat 5x5 40kg (trying to concentrate on form)
BP 5x5 90kg (increased by 10kg from last time)struggled though.
ROW 5x5 70kg
Pull ups 3x5 

Calf rested but still not right, need further deep tissue massage to remove knot.


----------



## ITHAQVA

guy999 said:


> 195kg...wow... have been reading the old posts and guess I'm where you were 3 years ago. Doubt if i will ever get to 195 though! Struggling just with your warm up weight at the moment
> 
> Todays workout.
> Bike 5 mins, basic stretches.
> Squat 5x5 40kg (trying to concentrate on form)
> BP 5x5 90kg (increased by 10kg from last time)struggled though. *Increasing an upper body exercise by 10KG is far too much*
> ROW 5x5 70kg
> Pull ups 3x5
> 
> Calf rested but still not right, need further deep tissue massage to remove knot.


Why would you not be able to squat 195Kg?

I started 3 years ago, lost 12 months training due to injury and I'm still going for it and so should you mate :thumb:

I'm not stronger than anyone just more determined than most!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Re load week Bench Press 

As last week was all to F Im carrying on with just the work sets to keep myself focused :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110.5KGX5 - 125KGX3 - 140KGX1 Good clean slow rep :thumb:

Dead Bench Press 80Kg X 8 - 1 second pauses. *

Tried the Dead Bench Press to get a feel for it: 80Kg x 8 1 second paused reps. I used to use this style all the time, but I didn't think of it as anything but a bench press in those days  The 80Kg felt just right as a starting weight. I allowed the bar to rest on my chest relaxed my grip to ensure a lot of the energy was dissipated from the muscle between each sub rep :thumb:

Glad I made the effort to lift and make the 140Kg today


----------



## V3nom

Quick update on how I'm finding this workout...

So I started on the 4th October at the following weights;

SQUAT - 5X5 - 60KGS
BENCH - 5X5 - 40KGS
BARBELL ROW - 5X5 - 40KGS

Ten sessions later and I'm now at the following as of last night;

SQUAT - 5X5 - 85KGS
BENCH - 5X5 - 55KGS
BARBELL ROW - 5X5 - 50KGS

Overall, I'm loving the workout and happy with my progress...although I am starting to "feel" the weights now. Last nights squats really took it out of me. The first set is always a bugger! But I'm now squatting near enough my body weight and I'm happy.

Onwards and upwards!


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> Quick update on how I'm finding this workout...
> 
> So I started on the 4th October at the following weights;
> 
> SQUAT - 5X5 - 60KGS
> BENCH - 5X5 - 40KGS
> BARBELL ROW - 5X5 - 40KGS
> 
> Ten sessions later and I'm now at the following as of last night;
> 
> SQUAT - 5X5 - 85KGS
> BENCH - 5X5 - 55KGS
> BARBELL ROW - 5X5 - 50KGS
> 
> Overall, I'm loving the workout and happy with my progress...although I am starting to "feel" the weights now. Last nights squats really took it out of me. The first set is always a bugger! But I'm now squatting near enough my body weight and I'm happy.
> 
> Onwards and upwards!


Good progress V3nom :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Forgot to say, I did video the 140Kg lift...................But the bloody camera went flat before I finished!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :wall::wall::wall:

Will re do next month :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

I've been looking for something to take my bench press to the 150Kg mark.

After some online research there seems to be a lot of respect for version of DB progression described on the Juggernaut site and Juggernaut Bench manual.

Has anyone tried it, what were the results?

Here it is set up for my percentages. I must admit im sceptical about being able to dead bench 140kg even once, but im thinking about giving it a try as of next weeks new 5/3/1 month.

*

Month 4 November 2014

Original 5/3/1 (10 rep lighter assistance month)

Week 1-60%(80Kg)x8x1-30 sec rest

Week 2-60%(80Kg)x10x1-30 sec rest

Week 3-60%(80Kg)x12x1-30 sec r*est

Week 4-Deload
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*

Month 5 December 2014

Original 5/3/1 (5 rep heavy month)

Week 5-65%(91Kg)x9x1-45 sec rest

Week 6-70%(98Kg)x7x1-1 min rest

Week 7-75%(105Kg)x5x1-75 sec rest*

Week 8-Deload
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*

Month 6 January 2015! 

Original 5/3/1 (5 rep heavy month)

Week 9-80(112Kg)/82.5(115.5Kg)/85%(119Kg)x1-90 sec rest

Week 10-82.5(115.5Kg)/85(119Kg)/87.5%x(122.5Kg).1-2 min rest

Week 11-3×1 up to a 1rm(140Kg)-150 sec rest*

Week 12-Deload
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Talking about the heavier 5 rep approach for anyone wishing to try it:

I think 3 months in a row is enough. I could feel my joints were a little sore on the last week of the third month, which for those new to this sport is very normal if you lift heavy low rep for too long. Joints and hard tissue takes longer to strengthen, were as the softer tissue recovers much quicker. It seems there is a direct correlation here, the soft tissue repairs quicker and builds quicker, the harder the tissue, the slower the repair and build up. So to enable me to do what I love the most (Lift heavier low rep) I have no choice but to cycle my training to accommodate the imbalances of the different tissue structures involved in my maximal effort approach (The human physiology!). I also need to find what the optimum approach is for progress. I will go back to three months heavy after this next one month (ten rep lighter assistance lifts) and see how I progress/feel. I will train the main work sets as always (Original 5/3/1).

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Incline Bench Press: 55x5, 62.5x4, 72.5x3, 80x2, 92.5x1, 80x5
Dips: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3
Chins: 2, 4, 6 , 8, 10, 8, 6, 4, 2
Push ups: 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 20, 15, 10, 5
leg Raises: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3

Incline press was a piece of cake, I know Im dieting but may still put the weight up next time. 

I was absolutely drenched in sweat at the end of this workout and it seems to be working as I lost 2.5kgs last week, thats abit fast but I dont feel like I have lost any strength or size, probably just the shock of circuit training, sprinting and walking.

This workout was easier in a way as Im getting used to the circuit training but then it was harder as Im getting fitter which means I can push it harder.

Nice work there V3nom.

Doug that looks similar to the Juggernaut Inverted method. Im not sure how you would respond to the lower rest periods Doug but people have had good gains with the Inverted method but I feel this is more for athletes so they dont grind themselves into the ground lifting heavy all the time. 

Normal Juggernaut is 5 sets of 10 with 2:30 rest.
Inverted Juggernaut is 10 sets of 5 with 1:00 rest.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug that looks similar to the Juggernaut Inverted method. Im not sure how you would respond to the lower rest periods Doug but people have had good gains with the Inverted method but I feel this is more for athletes so they dont grind themselves into the ground lifting heavy all the time.
> 
> Normal Juggernaut is 5 sets of 10 with 2:30 rest.
> Inverted Juggernaut is 10 sets of 5 with 1:00 rest.


The program is straight from the Juggernaut bench manual for powerlifting specifically - RAAAAAW! lifters 

As for rest periods, I tried the 60% x 8 and it was easy enough, because it hits the CNS so hard you only do the one set of rest pause reps. As the weight gets heavier the rest increases which logically allows you to progress.

Also bear in mind this is how I used to train bench in my youth due to the limitations of the equipment I had, in fact all my lifts were done dead style as the equipment only allowed me to start in the lowest position, not the new un rack approach. I benched and close benched 180kg in those days, squatted 210Kg and deadlifted around 230Kg, yes it was a machine but very,very basic so it was unlike other machines and had no bearings it all relied on mechanics of an agricultural bent lol. Yes the lifts don't count but the machine did help build a high level of strength due to it being an unhelpful machine if you get my meaning. lol, it was simple but effective 

It was so bespoke , I've tried for years to Google a pic of it but cant find it. I will put something together in paint or something to show you sometime 

But anyhow, dead benches for me it is as my assistance work and ill throw in neutral pull ups after to give the old barbell row a rest for a few months :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Well the Juggernaut guys are very good, definitely some of the people I listen to. Was that the free bench manual you get on sign up?

I just downloaded all 3 manuals so should be a good read. Im happy with a 150kg bench so I will be concentrating on the squat and deadlift.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Well the Juggernaut guys are very good, definitely some of the people I listen to. Was that the free bench manual you get on sign up?
> 
> I just downloaded all 3 manuals so should be a good read. Im happy with a 150kg bench so I will be concentrating on the squat and deadlift.


There's a free manual available to anyone without signing: http://fa68f6a5f58061b9090e-969cb37...5.cf1.rackcdn.com/JUGGERNAUT_BENCH_MANUAL.pdf :thumb:

 Sorry James missed your post on the 150Kg bench, when did you lift that?


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> There's a free manual available to anyone without signing: http://fa68f6a5f58061b9090e-969cb37...5.cf1.rackcdn.com/JUGGERNAUT_BENCH_MANUAL.pdf :thumb:
> 
> Sorry James missed your post on the 150Kg bench, when did you lift that?


I just banged them in google and found them, thanks mate.

I never 1RM my bench due to my shoulder so it was just a predicted 152kg. Im not claiming that this is accurate, i may be able to less, I may be able to do more but as long as that predicted max keeps going up, i am happy. Talking about my shoulder, ever since I have changed my bench to more volume and shorter rests, i have had zero shoulder pain. This could be because of this or because Ive added inverted rows. Its just something to think about instead of working up to a top set of say 5 reps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I just banged them in google and found them, thanks mate.
> 
> I never 1RM my bench due to my shoulder so it was just a predicted 152kg. Im not claiming that this is accurate, i may be able to less, I may be able to do more but as long as that predicted max keeps going up, i am happy. Talking about my shoulder, ever since I have changed my bench to more volume and shorter rests, i have had zero shoulder pain. This could be because of this or because Ive added inverted rows. Its just something to think about instead of working up to a top set of say 5 reps.


No worries James  :thumb:

I don't take much notice of the predicted maxes as I have found they are generally higher than I can lift, hence why I always try my one rep max on every third week. I also prefer my goals weights to be my base level maxes. IE my goals are 200kg squat,230kg deadlift and 150kg bench, doing them once isn't enough for me I want to be able to do those lifts every time I try them. There is a possibility I may have to train a bit heavier to maintain them, I'm happy to go: 210kg squat, 160kg bench, the deadlift is my best lift so once I get to 230kg I will not struggle so much to maintain that.

Shoulders are an area than require a different approach for many due to the difficulty of warming up properly and not to over tax so that the work sets go well. If your shoulder will always be an issue why not train your OHP day with 15-20 rep range. That's how I train my dips on my OHP day :thumb: You could also treat the OHP day as a shoulder day and train bodybuilder style throughout the workout, it wont hurt your main three lifts at all and you'll get some good volume in, extra muscle will help stabilise and cushion the shoulder area when benching :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Well I havebt been well for a while and although I was itching to get back into I knew I wouldnt be doing myself any favours.

So I've fully recovered now and will be back on it from tomorrow.

I weighed myself the other day and after a week of no excercise, not eating clean as much as normal and disrupted sleep I had lost weight, a whole 1kg in fact.

Guess that was the muscle which had developed being lost


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Well I havebt been well for a while and although I was itching to get back into I knew I wouldnt be doing myself any favours.
> 
> So I've fully recovered now and will be back on it from tomorrow.
> 
> I weighed myself the other day and after a week of no excercise, not eating clean as much as normal and disrupted sleep I had lost weight, a whole 1kg in fact.
> 
> Guess that was the muscle which had developed being lost


If memory serves, did you say you weighed 120Kg? You may find being unwell has caused water loss, 1kg of muscle should not just vanish in a few weeks.


----------



## Estoril-5

Actually saying that I had food poisoning so was probably dehydrated.

Oh well there goes the muscle loss theory.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Actually saying that I had food poisoning so was probably dehydrated.
> 
> Oh well there goes the muscle loss theory.


If you get diarrhoea you will lose a lot of water, when you are ill you should always make a point of drinking loads of water to help the body work more efficiently.

Yep, so pick yaself up and get lifting! :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Back in the garage this morning.

Weighed in at 119.4kg

Squats 42.5kg 
Ohp 27.5kg
DL 55kg

All done. Feel good


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Back in the garage this morning.
> 
> Weighed in at 119.4kg
> 
> Squats 42.5kg
> Ohp 27.5kg
> DL 55kg
> 
> All done. Feel good


How do you approach your nutrition and do you have a physical goal?


----------



## Estoril-5

Good question, well presented lol

My nutrition is 50-50, when I'm at work I'm pretty good as I'm busy. In the evenings it's not so great, it's unwind time and the biscuits call my name.

But I'm working on that.

My short to medium term goal is to reach 99kg, not 100kg but 99kg.

I think it's psychological to have body weight from 3 figures down to 2 figures for me, like reaching a milestone.

I'm hoping I can get to 99kg by March next year.

I don't know if this is realistic or not but that's the vision at the moment.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Good question, well presented lol
> 
> My nutrition is 50-50, when I'm at work I'm pretty good as I'm busy. In the evenings it's not so great, it's unwind time and the biscuits call my name.
> 
> But I'm working on that.
> 
> My short to medium term goal is to reach 99kg, not 100kg but 99kg.
> 
> I think it's psychological to have body weight from 3 figures down to 2 figures for me, like reaching a milestone.
> 
> I'm hoping I can get to 99kg by March next year.
> 
> I don't know if this is realistic or not but that's the vision at the moment.


If your main goal is weight loss, its easy.

1. Work out your BMR and reduce by 500 calories (per day). Your goal is to lose around 1.5 - 2 pounds per week, this will fluctuate. Weigh yourself the same time once a week, after a month or two you should see a trend, as long as your trend/weight slowly goes down that's good. If your weight loss trend stalls after three weeks consider reducing calories by another 100. Monitor your trend. This is important to remember. Weight loss fluctuates, hence you only take notice of your weight loss trend. over time your weight loss trend will show you that your are loosing weight. There will be some weeks were your weight goes up, that's normal!

2. One thing people seem to forget is we don't actually put on a huge amount of weight in a few months, so why expect the body to lose it easy. 
Weight loss is easy if you understand what a sensible expectation of weight loss should be. Its taken me around 20 years to put on my body fat that I wish to remove. I'm happy to take 12 months to lose a stone of body fat, that's a loss of 1.17 pounds per month! at this rate I will be able to build muscle and strength :thumb:

3. Eat 100grams protein per day for muscle maintenance or around 150grams protein per day for muscle growth

4. Do up to 30 minutes steady easy cardio. Too much cardio is bad and ages you. Do ya research and you'll find out. I've done my own study, 5000 fast reps on cross trainer one hour a day, sweating like a maniac and eating very healthy, result in 8 weeks two stone weight loss and I looked skinny fat! I was staggered how quickly I got used to one hours intense cardio and how abysmal my results were (This was done approximately a year before I started powerlifting)

5. Stick to the 5x5, but don't be too concerned if you don't progress in strength fast but do try to progress. Remember I lift heavy as strength is my primary goal at the moment. Your lifting will help you maintain your muscle mass so you'll look good when you lose the body fat :thumb:

6. I recommend you keep a food diary, it is very easy to go over your 500 cal a day deficit if you don't keep to your deficit your weight loss will stall.

7. Reduce starchy carbohydrate and simple sugar intake. These effect insulin/blood sugar and appetite etc..etc.., will also make "Dieting" easier. get your carbohydrates from good green vegetables and pulses :thumb:

Now the above seems hard, but if you want to be successful it takes a little effort on your part, hence why so many dieters put the weight back on.

You need to realise why your over weight and adjust your lifestyle accordingly, you could add more exercise, but if you want to grow muscle and or strength, it takes a bit of strategy, because the body will try to lose muscle and fat together and you'll become a skinny fat person. You know who I'm talking about. About almost everyone who goes on a "Diet", I've seen so many slim females with bellies its not even funny. A good body takes effort, a slim body is easy.

Importantly, remember this, many of the so called amazing bodies you see in the media are not healthy, I'm not making excuses for people being fat, but the average human body does not in its natural state look ripped! Body fat is normal and very important. Remember EXPECTATIONS must be realistic.

Now I've just saved you a load of time, research the above and get motivated, don't expect an awesome six pack, that takes an extra level of dedication, which I personally think is more geared towards vanity than health. But aim for a body fat level of around 14% with a little extra muscle built from your lifting routine and you will look dam good :thumb:

I've made it as short as I could :thumb:

best of luck :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 re load

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 1000X5 120X3) - 170GX5 - 190KGX3 - 210KGX1*

Made the lift. Form went sloppy before the lockout as I was so happy the weight felt as easy as it did. I have no idea why I relaxed and almost stopped :wall: I very quickly remembered LOCKOUT first then celebrate! 

As a punishment to myself I will re lift this weight and get the video in focus, haven't a clue why the autofocus was turned off either :wall:

Edit: I'll post the vid on here later, YouTube is having a bit of a moment 

Vid, its crap but a lift is a lift


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 75x4, 87.5x3, 95x2, 100x1, 105x1, 112.5x1, 100x8
Dips: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3
Chins: 2, 4, 6 , 8, 10, 8, 6, 4, 2
Push ups: 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 20, 15, 10, 5
leg Raises: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3

I'm really not sure what is happening on this diet but the 1 rep and 8 rep top sets went up like there was nothing on the bar, so fast and so easy. I'm not even being strict with my diet, I'm basically doing if it fits my macros diet and it seems to be working so well. 5kg loss to date and feel like I have lost zero strength or size. Also I love how quickly the body adapts to stresses, this workout is becoming so much easier, still stupidly hard but my fitness is improving.

Cant wait to get back to the heavy lifting though.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 98.5KGX5 - 113KGX5 - 127KGX3

DEAD BENCH (1 SECOND REST) 80KGX1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1

DEAD CHEAT PULLUPS 3x3x3x3x3*

Good workout. You may think I'm disappointed with only 3 reps on the last work set, but I'm not following the 5/3/1 to the book. I'm adding 2.5Kg to all upper body work sets every time I complete the designated reps in the previous month. Example next month ill aim for 4/5 reps, if I only get 4, the following month I'll aim for 5. Now I'm getting close to my goal I'm relaxing and simplifying the training calculations and de loading reps instead, just to mix things a little.

Dead Bench: I'm going to check the juggernaut site as the one set of 8 dead reps felt too easy/not enough total volume.

Dead Cheat Pull ups: I'm assisting the reps very slightly by keeping my legs straight but just pushing off with my feet only. If I hang from the bars as if I am about to do my pull ups I can stand with my feet flat on the flour. So after each rep I stop very briefly breath in then rep again and so on. This combination felt right for me and enabled me to get some volume in. Stopping after each rep made the reps more comfortable at my weight. I was also very close to making 5 sets of 4 reps, so for me I think this approach is the way to go and only time will tell if it truly works 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Hill Sprints last night. 12x60m.

Anyone who says these arent hard as they only last apporx 15mins should try them. Just got a new flat mate whos a bodybuilder and he threw up after 8 sprints :lol:

Once I have finished my cut stage and hit my goal of 100kg then we will start training together as he wants to do some heavy training as hes annoyed at loosing his gains so soon when he stops lifting.


----------



## rob warrington

Evening all. So I've posted up a new thread asking this question, didn't want to post on this thread as it wasn't strictly 5x5 related. Ill keep it short. My partner and I have been doing 5x5 for some time and have made good strength gains, we have of late been adding some barbel complex style circuits to the end of our sessions as we both don't really like cardio we felt this type of circuit training at the end of our workouts was really helping us get our heart rates up and we always left the gym sweating and feeling we'd worked hard. Of late I've started looking into crossfit and what I love about it is the intensity and high reps high volume cardio style workouts yet using Olympic lifts, what I hate is the total lack of focus on form in some lifts etc ( kipping pull ups wtf ) so in an attempt to keep my other half happy as she feels she's missing the cardio sessions but enjoys doing weight training with me, I'm wanting to change our workouts to compound only, but maybe doing some lifts in a crossfit style high rep circuit type workout so we want to keep on with the squats and deadlifts , only I'm trying to perform higher reps and lighter weights as my knees were starting to take a pounding. So if I was to plan a 3 or 4 ( max ) day all over body compound split what would be the best exercises to do on what days, we want to keep squats and deadlifts and bench press, but want to now include squat cleans, clean and press, squat thruster with kettle bells is a fav of my gf. Also pull ups dips push ups etc, I've been trying to workout out and put something down on paper but the days look way too busy and not sure if I've got everything in. Ok so I know this may seem I'm way over complicating things but I'm just trying to find something new for us to keep us interested, and as we don't particularly like cardio as such other than the rowing machines , so crossfiit without the crazy horrible form. Sorry for the waffling on, any advice ?? Many thanks


----------



## Bod42

I personally don't like crossfit as its to random. Workout of the day is great but the way you get good at anything in life is to practice it so it doesn't work.

I personally like weight lifting and then finishing with various complex's for your fitness. Another style of training is exactly like Im doing at the moment to improve my fitness. I keep the main 4 exercises heavy but then I create a circuit training with the remaining exercises in a non stop fashion. 

So at the moment my workout is as follows.
Big exercise (Squats, Deadlifts, Benc or Shoulder Press)
Then I have 2 circuits that I alternate 
Dips
Chins
Push Ups
Leg Raises

BW Squats 
Sit Ups
Chins
Push Ups

The problem with what you are asking is that Olympic lifts are a technique exercise, yes you need strength but you also need to seriously hone your technique. But when you get tired your technique breaks down and here lies the problem with using Olympic lifts to work on fitness. You want to chose the simplest exercises to use in a circuit. When your extremely tired, what can go wrong with say a push up compared with say clean and jerk. 

But if you really like the exercises you have listed then just slip them into the workout I have laid out above. This way you get your heavy work in but follow up with fitness weights.

Or if you really want a challenge then you could try the circuit of death. Something we used to do for a few weeks with all the rugby guys in the offseason.

Squats x 10 reps
Rest 1 min
Chin Ups x 10 reps
Rest 1 min
Deadlift x 10 reps
Rest 1 min
Dips x 10 reps
Rest 2 mins
Repeat 2-4 times


----------



## Estoril-5

Had a good workout on Friday evening, all workouts done

Squat 45kg 
Bench 30kg
Row 40kg

Last night and this morning my thighs are in pain, it's not heavy weights I'm pushing but a good sign I guess.

Also adding plates to my barbell was difficult due to the friction so I applied some megs #16. They just glide on and off now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


>


:lol::lol:

Mine is wearing Werkstat Acrylic


----------



## Bod42

Incline Bench Press: 55x5, 62.5x4, 72.5x3, 80x2, 92.5x1, 80x5
Dips: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3
Chins: 2, 4, 6 , 8, 10, 8, 6, 4, 2
Push ups: 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 20, 15, 10, 5
Leg Raises: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3

Incline Bench is still stupidly easy. I want to increase the weight but seems weird increasing weights while your dieting.

Absolutely dripping with sweat at the end of this workout. Hard work but I think by being fitter this will def help my normal training. I will def try and fit at least a 6 week fitness period in a few times per year and its a nice break for the joints.


----------



## Estoril-5

Squats 47.5kg
Ohp 30kg
Deadlift 70kg (was supposed to be 60kg but couldn't resist putting my 25kg plates on)

5x5 all done

Felt the Ohp a little bit, legs were shaking after deadlift, I think that's a good sign.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 80x4, 100x3, 120x2, 135x1, 150x5
BW Squats: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5
Sit Ups: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5
Chin Ups: 2,4,6,8,6,4,2
Push Ups: 5,10,15,20,15,10,5

A good workout, deadlifts were nice and fast. I am getting so much fitter so fast, Im literally repping the first 3 sets out on 1 set other than the chin ups.


----------



## Leebo310

First session for ages yesterday, been away with work a lot recently so over 3 weeks since my last one...
Feeling it nicely today!

OHP
WU - Bar x 10, 30kg x 6
WO - 47.5kg x 5, 55kg x 5, 62.5kg x 5

OHP
40kg x 10 x 5

Side/front DB raise
10kg x 10 x 5


----------



## Estoril-5

Leebo310 said:


> First session for ages yesterday, been away with work a lot recently so over 3 weeks since my last one...
> Feeling it nicely today!
> 
> OHP
> WU - Bar x 10, 30kg x 6
> WO - 47.5kg x 5, 55kg x 5, 62.5kg x 5
> 
> OHP
> 40kg x 10 x 5
> 
> Side/front DB raise
> 10kg x 10 x 5


No squats or deadlift?

Are you doing a variation of 5x5?


----------



## Leebo310

Estoril-5 said:


> No squats or deadlift?
> 
> Are you doing a variation of 5x5?


It's the 5/3/1 workout which is a progression of the 5x5 mate. It splits the 4 compound exercises (alongside an assistance exercise of choice) into dedicated days so I do OHP one session, DL the next, Bench the following then Squat the final one. I then decrease the reps but increase the weight each session so first session do 5x65% x 1rm, 5x75%, 5x85% then 5x10 at 50%. 
Next session does 3x70%, 3×80%, 3×90% then 5x10 at 50%.
Next is 5x75%, 3x85%, 1×95% then 5x10 at 50%.
Final session is a deload so 5x40%, 55×50%, 5×60% plus 5x10 at 50%.
You then start your next cycle by adding a set amount to your starting predicted 1rm (I do 2.5kg for upper and 5kg for lower) then repeat the 4 sessions. Then increase again etc.
A good spreadsheet helps


----------



## Estoril-5

Good session today.

Squat 50kg
Bench 32.5kg
Barbel row 42.5kg

All done


----------



## ITHAQVA

A bit out of sync as I've been decorating the last two weeks 

So I'm going to repeat week 3 of cycle 3 and get back into sync once the new cycle starts in two weeks :thumb:

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110.5KGX5 - 125KGX3 - 140KGX1

DEAD BENCH (1 SECOND REST) 80KGX1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1

CHEAT PULLUPS 4x4x4x3x3*

All good :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 75x4, 87.5x3, 95x2, 100x1, 105x1, 112.5x1, 100x8
Dips: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3
Chins: 2, 4, 6 , 8, 10, 8, 6, 4, 2
Push ups: 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 20, 15, 10, 5
leg Raises: 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 12, 9, 6, 3

That was my last Bench Press workout, just 3 workouts left of this program. Havent lost as much weight as i would have liked but I dont seem to have lost any muscle or strength so cant really complain.

I will be starting a hybrid 5/3/1 program. I cant really call it 5/3/1 though as I have completely *******ized it to keep the bits the work the best for me and steal Dougs 5x5 assistant exercise idea.

I have written my program based on 4 days per week but this may change to 2 days per week as I have decided to really push my golf this summer and see where I can go with it so I have just joined the coaching staff that train Lydia Ko and Mike Hendry. This means I need to practice a few times per week so the lifting may have to slow down a bit but we will see.

Awesome 140kg there Doug


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I will be starting a hybrid 5/3/1 program. I cant really call it 5/3/1 though as I have completely *******ized it to keep the bits the work the best for me and steal Dougs 5x5 assistant exercise idea.
> 
> I have written my program based on 4 days per week but this may change to 2 days per week as I have decided to really push my golf this summer and see where I can go with it so I have just joined the coaching staff that train Lydia Ko and Mike Hendry. This means I need to practice a few times per week so the lifting may have to slow down a bit but we will see.
> 
> Awesome 140kg there Doug


I found 3 months in a row of the 5 rep assistance work was just right, not sure how well you recover but do be mindful of going heavy over a prolonged period of time mate, also think of your shoulder :thumb: The 5 rep assistance version will hit your joints hard. But it does improve your base strength and confidence. I will may split it next time around and go heavy one month and 10 rep the next and cycle back and forth the two principles. But do give it a go mate, I felt improvements in all lifts.

I've done some research on assistance work and there is an overwhelming percentage that say the 10 rep scheme is the way to go as it builds more muscle and improves stability and amount of muscle fibres to utilise, so my approach seems to go against the grain, but I do think there is a carry over when you lift heavy with volume.

Thanks James, I've managed to bench 140Kg on three occasions and I have done 145Kg once, so my goal is slowly becoming reality :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

140kg is some serious benchage!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> 140kg is some serious benchage!


Cheers mate :thumb: You'll find as your strength increases your max weight feels the same if that makes any sense


----------



## V3nom

I had my squats up at 95kgs recently but wasn't happy with my form so fortunately, I had the gym all to myself on Saturday morning so decided to video myself doing 5 reps (No chance I would have video'd myself if there were other people there lol cringe)

Glad I did because I was right, I wasn't going down low enough, was about 2-3 inches away from where I should be.

So, decided to drop the weight to 80kgs last night and my mate was there to advise. I was getting right down and I was happy with my sets.

I'll maybe just keep this weight for a few workouts until I'm 100% happy I can go up.


----------



## Leebo310

V3nom said:


> I had my squats up at 95kgs recently but wasn't happy with my form so fortunately, I had the gym all to myself on Saturday morning so decided to video myself doing 5 reps (No chance I would have video'd myself if there were other people there lol cringe)
> 
> Glad I did because I was right, I wasn't going down low enough, was about 2-3 inches away from where I should be.
> 
> So, decided to drop the weight to 80kgs last night and my mate was there to advise. I was getting right down and I was happy with my sets.
> 
> I'll maybe just keep this weight for a few workouts until I'm 100% happy I can go up.


Totally the right attitude mate 👍To be honest the actual weight lifted is purely a number, if the form isn't right doing it then people are only fooling themselves! 
I did the same with my deadlift recently as knew my form was off and it's an exercise I've always struggled with. Backed off the weight by around 40kg so I could really make sure my form was perfect and it's definitely helped.


----------



## V3nom

Leebo310 said:


> Totally the right attitude mate 👍To be honest the actual weight lifted is purely a number, if the form isn't right doing it then people are only fooling themselves!
> I did the same with my deadlift recently as knew my form was off and it's an exercise I've always struggled with. Backed off the weight by around 40kg so I could really make sure my form was perfect and it's definitely helped.


Yeah, two things I always stick by when it comes to weights...full range of motion and form.

I think your workout is pointless without these being correct.

I'll stick to it man and hopefully I'll build it up.

Another thing, how long do people do the 5x5 for? I've been doing it for 7 weeks now and I'm sure I read that you should do any workout programme for 8 weeks then rest a week...


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> I had my squats up at 95kgs recently but wasn't happy with my form so fortunately, I had the gym all to myself on Saturday morning so decided to video myself doing 5 reps (No chance I would have video'd myself if there were other people there lol cringe)
> 
> Glad I did because I was right, I wasn't going down low enough, was about 2-3 inches away from where I should be.
> 
> So, decided to drop the weight to 80kgs last night and my mate was there to advise. I was getting right down and I was happy with my sets.
> 
> I'll maybe just keep this weight for a few workouts until I'm 100% happy I can go up.


Venom,

I built a little squat box to ensure just below parallel squatting. Basically I touch it with my ass as I squat and that is my cue to lift up. I don't compete so its a great way to take away the uncertainty. Please don't confuse this with a Box Squat which I don't do, I just touch and go!


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> Another thing, how long do people do the 5x5 for? I've been doing it for 7 weeks now and I'm sure I read that you should do any workout programme for 8 weeks then rest a week...


I did the 5x5 for around 6 months and took a week off from time to time. Go back to around page 100 and look back a few pages more and you'll see the weights I was using when I transitioned over to the 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

V3nom said:


> Yeah, two things I always stick by when it comes to weights...full range of motion and form.
> 
> I think your workout is pointless without these being correct.
> 
> I'll stick to it man and hopefully I'll build it up.
> 
> Another thing, how long do people do the 5x5 for? I've been doing it for 7 weeks now and I'm sure I read that you should do any workout programme for 8 weeks then rest a week...


Yes programs like 5/3/1 have built in deload weeks every 4th or 7th week depending which volume of the book you have but the beauty of 5x5 is that it has personalised deloads. When you dont make 5x5 3 times in a row then you deload 10% then when you have deloaded 3 times you lower to 3x5 and then 3 more deloads 1x5. The brilliant thing about this is that it also personalises your exercises so you could still be doing 5x5 on bench but 1x5 on say shoulder press. People have stayed on 5x5 for years, if it aint broke then dont fix it.



ITHAQVA said:


> I found 3 months in a row of the 5 rep assistance work was just right, not sure how well you recover but do be mindful of going heavy over a prolonged period of time mate, also think of your shoulder :thumb: The 5 rep assistance version will hit your joints hard. But it does improve your base strength and confidence. I will may split it next time around and go heavy one month and 10 rep the next and cycle back and forth the two principles. But do give it a go mate, I felt improvements in all lifts.
> 
> I've done some research on assistance work and there is an overwhelming percentage that say the 10 rep scheme is the way to go as it builds more muscle and improves stability and amount of muscle fibres to utilise, so my approach seems to go against the grain, but I do think there is a carry over when you lift heavy with volume.
> 
> Thanks James, I've managed to bench 140Kg on three occasions and I have done 145Kg once, so my goal is slowly becoming reality :thumb:


Doug I'm doing 5x5 assistant on lower body and 5x10 on upper body. I think the upper body can handle the extra volume better and it will help with my shoulder. Thats my only problem with 5/3/1 is the lack of volume for the squats so i have been doing back off sets anyway so 5x5 will be very similar and i hit records with the back off set setup last time. Also means I have 2 weights to push, my 3rep top set and the 5x5 sets which will be an awesome goal.

Really looking forward to this program, its nice and simple as the template started as BBB. Im using the over warm up principle on Bench as well as I think this is brilliant for Bench. I actually think its great for squats as well as it makes your work weight feel like childs play but couldnt figure out a way to use this with 5/3/1.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 3 re load

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 1000X5 120X3) - 170GX5 - 190KGX3 - 210KGX1

DEADLIFT  110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 110KGx6x6*

As you can see I've moved my deadlift to the mid week. This is because I think moving the Squat to Sunday will allow for much better focus on what is my most difficult lift. I also find the squat session the most tiring, even though the deadlift is supposed to hit the CNS harder.

Dam good workout, the 210kgx1 felt easier than it did the last time, time to move up to 215kg next month :thumb:

RDL: I'm going to do these with a 6-8 rep range from now on and try to build some more muscle in my hamstrings for extra stability :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 52.5kg
Ohp 32.5kg
Deadlift 80kg (meant to be 75kg, but felt 70kg was not too bad last time).

5x5 all done


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Squat 52.5kg
> Ohp 32.5kg
> Deadlift 80kg (meant to be 75kg, but felt 70kg was not too bad last time).
> 
> 5x5 all done


Nice progress Estoril :thumb:


----------



## V3nom

What do people find is happening to their weight doing this programme?

Reason I ask is because I feel that I look better than I ever have before but I stepped on the scales this morning and I'm actually heavier (by about 5 pounds) than I was at the start of this...

:/

I'm not over concerned because as I say, looks-wise, I couldn't be happier but I'm assuming this will be muscle / hope this will be muscle...


----------



## Estoril-5

Don't worry about the weight mate, the best indicator would have been a body fat estimate before and one now BUT saying your body has changed is the visual indicator!

A pound of fat is bigger in physical size than a pound of muscle.

It's all good mate, keep on trucking.


----------



## Estoril-5




----------



## Estoril-5

Just done another session, I pushed the schedule today. I get happy when I have a day off work 

Squat 60kg (suppossed to be 55kg)
Bench 40kg (suppossed to be 35kg)
Barbellrow 50kg (suppossed to be 45kg)

Felt like a work out today


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> What do people find is happening to their weight doing this programme?
> 
> Reason I ask is because I feel that I look better than I ever have before but I stepped on the scales this morning and I'm actually heavier (by about 5 pounds) than I was at the start of this...
> 
> :/
> 
> I'm not over concerned because as I say, looks-wise, I couldn't be happier but I'm assuming this will be muscle / hope this will be muscle...


In 3 years I have put on 33 pounds. It is very normal for the body to put on some body fat while building muscle if your on a calorie excess. If your training closer to your BMR the lower the percentage of the weight will be body fat but also your lean muscle growth will be slower.

I'm sure there is an optimum amount of calories needed for optimum/maximum muscle growth. From my own experience with calorie deficits and excesses I would start at a round 500 calorie excess over your BMR, monitor your weight trend over 6 months/how you look in the mirror (do this at the same time in the day as lighting effects greatly how you look) monitor how your clothes feel. Over time your results will give you a great indicator of how your body grows at certain calorie percentages :thumb:

My own experience is a calorie excess (Bulking stage) produces the best strength and muscle growth results. I use a clean bulk (Healthy natural foods - *IMHO the best way*) as opposed to a dirty bulk (Eat anything that pushes you over your daily calorific BMR - *not advised*)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 4 re load

*OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 80KGx1x2x0

OVERHEAD PRESS 50KGx10x10x10

DIPS Body Weight (112KG)x10x10x10x10x10x10x10x10*

Made a balls up of the warm up sets on the OHP, hence the poor reps. Decided to reduce weight to 50KG and add 3 sets of 10 reps. Then decided to punish myself with 8 sets of 10 reps on the dips, that'll learn me!


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 62.5kg
Ohp 35kg
Deadlift 85kg

All done.

Starting to sweat a bit these days, so sounds like I'm doing something right


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 cycle 4 re load

*SQUAT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 155KGX5 - 175KGX3 - 195KGX0 *

Fail on work set, I found the 5kg increase on the previous work sets did tire me some what and I seemed to have no strength to finish the set :wall: I'm going to de load back to 190Kg and then possibly work up to the PR with gradual singles rather than use up my energy for the reps. Mind you doing 3 reps on the 175kg after 5 reps on the 155kg felt EPIC! :devil:

Either way I need to de load and smash the 190Kg, possibly try 2 reps with it before moving up. Not sure and not too disappointed, im so close now it is only a matter of time im back squatting 200kg on a regular basis :thumb:

The battle continues with me v me, I'd better win or else!


----------



## Bod42

V3nom said:


> What do people find is happening to their weight doing this programme?
> 
> Reason I ask is because I feel that I look better than I ever have before but I stepped on the scales this morning and I'm actually heavier (by about 5 pounds) than I was at the start of this...
> 
> :/
> 
> I'm not over concerned because as I say, looks-wise, I couldn't be happier but I'm assuming this will be muscle / hope this will be muscle...


Weight it actually a very useless number when your weight lifting or trying to improve body composition. I'm 110kg but went to a health supplement seminar the other day and some guy got up to give a review of the product and said he started at 104kg, the audience gasped. It is ridiculous that we live in a world where a weightlifter, low body fat, high muscle, very healthy individual is looked down on because he's heavy. We would be a lot more healthy world if we stopped worrying about weight and looked at BF%.

My mate who never gyms is 85kg so in society he is instantly healthier than me but in the real world, he is higher BF% than me, just has a big belly and no muscle.

Using the mirror and cloths are one of the best ways to see the difference. If you look and feel better then the scales actually dont matter.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 77.5x4, 92.5x3, 102.5x2, 115x1, 102.5x8 PM 130kg
Back Off Sets: 70x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6,6

Loved this workout, so nice and simple. Just 2 exercises to concentrate on and conquer. Really easy workout at these weights but I am adding 2.5kg per week instead of per month so I will soon be back up to a decent weight. Also gives me 2 diff goals for the same exercise, improve my 8RM and my 5x5 max.

My only issue is how long will I actually be able to do this workout for as i felt a lot of stress on my shoulder but hopefully it will adjust to the higher volume. 

My 3 months of fitness and circuit training has def helped with heavier lifting as I feel far better during my workout now. Will try and keep/improve my fitness from now on.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 110x3, 125x3, 142.5x3 PM 156.5kg
Back off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

GHRs are my last exercise but skipped these I had to go out. Ya I know I shouldnt miss exercises but i got my main work done.

This workout was miles harder than it should have been so will definitely be sticking with the same back off weights next week. Will push the mian sets up by 2.5kg thought. Im not expecting anything great over the next few months as Im still looking to lose some more fat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 De load

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX5 - 70KGX5 - 80KGX5

BENCH PRESS 50KGx10x10x10x10x10

BARBELL ROW 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Done and out :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 65kg
Bench 42.5kg
Barbellrow 52.5kg

All done.

Wasn't feeling great today nut wanted to workout, struggled a fair bit with squats to be honest.

Bench & row ok.

Lower back hurts a little.


----------



## Estoril-5

When squatting, where should the barbell rest along your back?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> When squatting, where should the barbell rest along your back?


This can vary from body type to body type.

Very good squat information: 




This video series comes in 5 parts, well worth going through them all, they also do a deadlift and bench series :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 42.5x5, 50x5, 55x8 PM 69.5kg
Back Off Sets: 35x10,8,8,8,8
Chin Ups: BWx2,2,2,2,2

Strange workout, the 8 reps of 55 was easier than I thought but the back off sets were harder than i thought they would be. This was also hurting my bad shoulder quite badly which was effecting my grip but hoping my shoulder will adapt quickly the the extra volume.

Still loving the BBB, its just great to concentrate on 2 exercises per workout and smash them. All the volume lately on chins must have really helped as these were so easy and fast.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 100x3) 120x3, 135x3, 150x3 PM 165kg
Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
Hanging Leg Raises: BWx5,5,5,5,5

Loving the BBB. So simple but so effective, just heavy Deadlifts followed by more deadlifts. The start of the 5x5 sets, the weight feels so light in your hands but the volume soon catches up with you. But you know you just have to push through the deadlifts and your basically done except for some quick ab work. Makes you really focused.

And changing the weight weekly just works so much better for me as I can tweak things weekly instead of monthly. So after the first week I will increase all my weights except for squats as that was harder than it should have been.


----------



## ITHAQVA

December Week 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 98.5KGX5 - 113KGX5 - 127KGX3

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10x10x10x10x10

CHEAT PULLUPS 4x4x4x3x3*

Slight miscalculation on the Bench work sets, but still very pleased with workout. I've been playing around with sets/style of lifting and reps on my assistance sets and adding a 2.5kg instead of following the 5/3/1 recommendations for upper body.

As of January I'm going back to the original 5/3/1 and follow by the book as I'm that close to my goals I think simple is best and I want to build some more muscle.

Deadlifts tomorrow :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

I agree Doug, this phase I have gone back to simple. Lifting isnt rocket science, Im just going back to the age old principle of progressive overload. 

And using Jim Wendler BBB setout so:

Bench with Rows
Squats with GHRs
Shoulder Press with Chins
Deadlifts with Abs

So simple. Start at 50% on 5x10 sets but increase weight when I feel like it. Give me 2 goals to focus on for 1 exercise, a top set goal and a volume sets goal.

Even tho this does add a fair few weeks to the program, I have also decided to do 3 days per week instead of 4. I recover better from 3 days, this allows me to do some fitness and sprints and it allows me to spend 1 night during the week at the golf range practicing.


----------



## ITHAQVA

December week 1 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 145GX5 - 165KGX5 - 185KGX5

DEADLIFT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 90KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Very good workout, the 185kgx5 felt easier than I was expecting, so base strength is still good and I think warming up with heavier weights definitely helps with the build up to the last set.

Only took 3 minutes rest between work sets and deadlift assistance, left me feeling a bit more fatigued than I liked, but I soon go back into the groove.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 80x4, 95x3, 105x2, 120x1, 105x8 PM 133kg
Back Off Sets: 72.5x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x7,7,7,7,7

Good workout. Im a tricep bencher but its good in the back off sets as my tri's get tired early in the set so my chest takes over which means this is getting worked more than usual.

Still liking this workout and doing Bench followed by rows makes you feel massive with both sides of your body pumped up. Also lost nearly another kg this week so down to just over 105kg.

The great thing about this overwarm up to an easy 1 rep is its nice to watch that number grow and it gives me an idea of my 1 rep max without actually ever working up to my 1 rep max. By the end of this 7 week phase I should be warming up with 130kg which sounds cool.


----------



## Leebo310

Haven't posted for a while but doesn't mean I haven't been working out :thumb:

*Yesterdays workout *
Deadlift
WU - Bar x 20, 60kg x 10
WO - 75kg x 5, 85kg x 3, 100kg x 2 (should've only been 95kg but got carried away)

Deadlift 
10 x 60kg, 10 x 60kg, 10 x 60kg, 10 x 60kg, 10 x 60kg, 
Reset my deadlift 1rm a while back as wanted to get form absolutely spot on, hence why the eagle eyed among you will notice that these weights are quite a bit lower than what I'd done previously. Definitely more happy with my form on these ones now though so will just continue on the standard increments.

Assistance exercise - 
Weighted pullups/standard pullups superset with a rest/pause on the second and third sets. All reps are simply to fail with strict 60 seconds rest inbetween sets (hence why the reps drop so much!)

First set (15kg plate)
13 weighted straight into 10 no weight

Second set (15kg plate)
6 weighted, 15 second rest/pause then 4 weighted, straight into 5 no weight

Third set (15kg plate)
4 weighted, straight into 5 no weight, 15 second rest/pause then 3 no weight

Loving this pullup combination and it really does tire you out. Normally I'd go for two assistance exercises but the intensity of the pullup combo really does literally leave you nothing in the tank.

*Today's workout*
Bench
WU - Bar x 25, 40kg x10

WO - 80kg x 5, 90kg x 3, 100kg x 7

Bench 
70kg x 10, 70kg x 10, 70kg x 10, 70kg x 10, 70kg x 10, 
Have been playing around with the weight on the assistance stuff recently and have upped it by quite a bit hence the 70kg rather than the 50% of my 1rm being apparently 53kg. Definitely finding it better using more weight but still having the volume of 5 x 10 reps. Tried 5 x 5 assistance with even heavier weight for a bit but didn't find it quite as effective as the 5 x 10 as missed the voume!

Final assistance exercise was short arm press on the free bar. Did try the smith machine as Doug suggested a while back but found it put even more stress on my wrists and the free bar just felt more comfortable so have gone back to that.
50kg x 10, 50kg x 10, 50kg x 10, 50kg x 10


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - December - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 80X5 90X5 110X3) - 135KGX5 - 155KGX5 - 175KGX2

SQUAT 110KGx10x10x10x10*

Good workout considering all the work sets are 5kg over the weight they should be :wall:  Must admit the first two work sets tired me out so much making 2 reps on the 175Kg was a result!

Work sets should have been 130x5 - 150x5 - 170x5, they will be next time :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 112.5x3, 127.5x3, 145x3 PM 159.5kg
Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Some will notice that the top set was heavier but the back off sets were the same. Finding that I never thing Im going to fail on the back off sets but I slow way down by the 5th set so just going to stick with this weight until I can do it fast and really dominate the weight.

Still easy top set as its 25kg below my best 3RM. And Im still losing weight so dont want to push it to hard.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 42.5x5, 50x5, 56x8 PM 71kg
Back Off Sets: 35x10,10,10,8,8
Chin Ups: BWx2,2,2,2,3

Another good workout but this workout seems to put a hell of a lot of stress on my bad shoulder, will have to keep at it for awhile and see if that is good or bad stress. Chin ups were very easy but just slowly increasing the volume.

Slightly disappointed not to get all my back off sets but early days yet. But I can definitely see why BBB works, it just hits every muscle that you use for the main lift, like my shoulders and tris burn afterwards.


----------



## Estoril-5

Havent worked out for a while due to lots on, but it's exactly 2 months to my brother in laws wedding and 3 months to my birthday today

So I thought I better snap back into it.

Started the 5x5 app and it said you haven't worked out for a while, you should deload.

I should have bit I was all revved up.

Squat 70kg (was supposed to be 67.5kg)
Ohp 37.5kg
Deadlift 100kg (was supposed to be 90kg).

5x5 All done.


----------



## Estoril-5

ITHAQVA said:


> Cheers mate :thumb: You'll find as your strength increases your max weight feels the same if that makes any sense


i think i know what you mean, when i was squatting 45kg i was struggling. now im on 70kg it feels heavy but not struggling.

the 100kg deadlift i did was tough, it was hurting my hands if that makes sense?


----------



## V3nom

OK, so I had been doing 5x5 3 times a week solid for 8 weeks, never missed a session. After this 8 week spell I took a week off because I'm sure I read that somewhere and I missed it...a lot...anyhoo, back on it last Saturday and picking up again.

I can honestly say I have noticed a massive difference in my strength since doing 5x5...strength that is, that's the key with this programme, it's making you stronger and I love it.

I would recommend it to anyone. I'm going to start incorporating some HIIT on my days off too.

Anyhoo, session last night consisted of...

Squats - 80kgs
Bench Press - 57.15kgs
Barbell Row - 50kgs

All 5x5 then 90 minutes of 7-a-side football lol Burst!


----------



## Estoril-5

I started on 1st October but have only done 16 sessions so far, been on & off, but even I'm impressed at the strength gains.

A couple of years ago I saw a teenager do a Deadlift of 70kg and I couldn't and wondered how on earth he did it and I couldn't? I was bigger than him but that doesn't mean anything but I assumed if he could I could.

Anyway on my 16th session yesterday I did 100kg Deadlift.

Ive noticed a difference too, and I'm loving it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - December - 5/3/1

Hit a brick wall training wise on Sunday, all the heavy lifting recently has given my CNS a dam good bashing. I think the miscalculated squat session tipped me over the edge. woke up Sunday feeling like I had cold symptoms. I've had this once before and luckily I know what it is this time lol. I have been shifting some heavy weights recently.

tonight's session;

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103.5KGX3 - 117.5KGX3 - 131.5KGX2

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10*

Felt too fatigued to carry on, so ill be sleeping loads this week and eating everything in sight  I'll just do this month with last months weights and repeat them again in January to give my CNS time to recover and then adapt to the new workload :thumb:

Only the second time I've done this in 3 years so I've done well TBH :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> i think i know what you mean, when i was squatting 45kg i was struggling. now im on 70kg it feels heavy but not struggling.
> 
> the 100kg deadlift i did was tough, it was hurting my hands if that makes sense?


Makes sense, if you hold the bar really tight you'll find the pain subsides :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Woke up feeling a lot more refreshed today, hopefully I'm recovering now :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Woke up feeling a lot more refreshed today, hopefully I'm recovering now :thumb:


Good stuff Doug


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 72.5kg
Bench 50kg
Barbell rows 55kg

5x5 all done.

Struggled on reps 4&5 of sets 4 and 5 on the barbell row.

Can't believe I'm powering through on the squats.

I'll be happy if I reach 100kg before the years out.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Been checking my training logs to work out why I'm having issues making reps recently. I've made some major errors and have been upping the work set weights in far too large increments without even thinking! :wall:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Been checking my training logs to work out why I'm having issues making reps recently. I've made some major errors and have been upping the work set weights in far too large increments without even thinking! :wall:
> 
> :thumb:


Spreadsheets are the answer Doug, calculates it all for you :thumb:

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
Back Off Sets: 122.5x5,5,5,5,5
Hanging Leg Raises: BWx6,6,6,6,6

Again Im just loving the simplicity of this program, smash the deadlifts, smash some lighter deadlifts as fast as possible and your basically done. And it just feels like it hits all the muscles that you need to hit to improve the main exercise. No wonder everyone seems to gain on this program. Wish I had started it sooner. Im sure eventually I will want to incorporate other exercises but i will just switch between BBB and SST


----------



## Estoril-5

Bod42 said:


> Spreadsheets are the answer Doug, calculates it all for you :thumb:
> 
> Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
> Back Off Sets: 122.5x5,5,5,5,5
> Hanging Leg Raises: BWx6,6,6,6,6
> 
> Again Im just loving the simplicity of this program, smash the deadlifts, smash some lighter deadlifts as fast as possible and your basically done. And it just feels like it hits all the muscles that you need to hit to improve the main exercise. No wonder everyone seems to gain on this program. Wish I had started it sooner. Im sure eventually I will want to incorporate other exercises but i will just switch between BBB and SST


Which program are you on?


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Spreadsheets are the answer Doug, calculates it all for you :thumb:
> 
> Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
> Back Off Sets: 122.5x5,5,5,5,5
> Hanging Leg Raises: BWx6,6,6,6,6
> 
> Again Im just loving the simplicity of this program, smash the deadlifts, smash some lighter deadlifts as fast as possible and your basically done. And it just feels like it hits all the muscles that you need to hit to improve the main exercise. No wonder everyone seems to gain on this program. Wish I had started it sooner. Im sure eventually I will want to incorporate other exercises but i will just switch between BBB and SST


How do you calculate the weight for the back off sets mate? Is it percentage of the 1rm again like when you do 5x10 as assistance?

And yep spreadsheets are the way forward, I still use that one you originally sent to me!


----------



## Bod42

Estoril-5 said:


> Which program are you on?


5/3/1 Boring but Big but I have changed the BBB lower body exercises to 5x5 instead of 5x10.



Leebo310 said:


> How do you calculate the weight for the back off sets mate? Is it percentage of the 1rm again like when you do 5x10 as assistance?
> 
> And yep spreadsheets are the way forward, I still use that one you originally sent to me!


Yep, just a percentage of the 1RM for the first week then I increase by 2.5kg when I complete. 50% of 1RM is good for a starting point but I dont like it all the time as what happens if you easily complete your BBB sets but havent increased your 1RM, your missing out on progressing the BBB sets.


----------



## CrouchingWayne

I'm doing Ice Cream Fitness 5x5 which is essentially SL with a few bolt on accessories.

Squats 97.5kg
Bench 65kg
Row 77.5kg

I reloaded my bench today after failing 3 times at 72.5kg. Squats I reset a while back at 102.5kg. Row I just hit today after 2 failed sessions at that weight.


----------



## Estoril-5

CrouchingWayne said:


> I'm doing Ice Cream Fitness 5x5 which is essentially SL with a few bolt on accessories.
> 
> Squats 97.5kg
> Bench 65kg
> Row 77.5kg
> 
> I reloaded my bench today after failing 3 times at 72.5kg. Squats I reset a while back at 102.5kg. Row I just hit today after 2 failed sessions at that weight.


What are the bolt on's?


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 75kg
Ohp 40kg
Deadlift 105kg

Squats were tough but I've missed two scheduled sessions.

Ohp ok.

Deadlift was hard, think I gotta check my form too.

Think I'm gonna fail soon on deadlift.

Huffing and puffing though so that's a good sign.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 82.5x4, 97.5x3, 107.5x2, 120x1, 107.5x8 PM 133kg
Back Off Sets: 75x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,8

Was incredibly tired today. Was never in doubt of getting the reps but they were just slow.

I was supposed to do this workout fri but had a half day golf lesson which put me in some ridiculously hard positions that my body isnt used to so was knackered after 4 hours so left it until Monday. Strange how Ive been weight lifting all this time but something like a golf swing has made my sore.


----------



## ITHAQVA

December - Bench Press 1rm routine

*BENCH PRESS 54X8 80X5 94X3 108KGX1 - 120KGX1 - 135KGX1 - 140KGx0

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

PULLUPS 3x3x3x2x1*

Have been trying to find out what my base 1 rep max is for the new year :thumb:

Decided to try normal pull ups, very pleased with results, especially at my weight (112Kg) :thumb:

Will try deadlift 1rm session tomorrow :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Strange how Ive been weight lifting all this time but something like a golf swing has made my sore.


I'm not surprised James, a Golf swing is fast and will put undue stresses on the shoulder area. We have a few golf course here were I live and many of the golfers I know suffer from shoulder and back problems.

Stick to powerlifting its much safer


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 77.5kg
Bench 52.5kg
Rows 57.5kg

Squats were tough, managed them all though.

Bench getting harder but in comfort zone.

Rows ok but I think my form might be off.

Will be watching some YouTube vids this Christmas.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 82.5x5, 97.5x3) WO 112.5x3, 130x3, 147.5x3 PM 162kg
Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Thats it. The 147.5kg was pretty easy but then it is 20kg below my max so it should be easy.

I really slow down on the 5x5 though. I am never worried that Im not going to complete but it is a grind.



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm not surprised James, a Golf swing is fast and will put undue stresses on the shoulder area. We have a few golf course here were I live and many of the golfers I know suffer from shoulder and back problems.
> 
> Stick to powerlifting its much safer


Its not so much the stress, its the different muscles you use in a different manner. Im trying to fire my hips more so my left glute gets worked really hard. But ya Im swing at over 110mph so thats alot of stress on your body. And ya a lot of golfers have back problems but a lot of the population have back problems as well, its just because they dont do any pre/rehab.


----------



## ITHAQVA

December 1rm session

*DEADLIFT 85X8 - 125X5 - 145X3 - 165GX3 - 190KGX1 - 210KGX1 - 220KGX0

DEADLIFT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 110KGx5x5x5*

Nice solid workout, failed at the 220Kg, but im not surprised, by the time I get to the 7th set my energy is gone for heavy lifting. The 110kg assistance work flew up.

I've got a good base figure for the new year on the deadlift now :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

What program are you following Doug?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> What program are you following Doug?


Presently I'm just doing some testing for my 1 rep maxes for the new year.

I've been on the original 5/3/1 for the last two years. I did changed the big but boring template recently for a 3 month trial and used 5 sets of 5 reps as opposed to the original 5 sets of 10 reps as a test to keep things interesting.

In the new year I will be going back to the original 5/3/1 combined with the 5 sets of 10 BBB assistance work for Bench press, deadlift and squat days. The only real change is on the OHP day. Instead of using the 5/3/1 template, I will be trying this:

*OHP: warm up sets x 3 followed by 5x10 adding weight were possible.

Dips: 5x10 adding weight were possible.

Neutral pull ups: 5 sets of whatever I can do.*

This will give me two pull up sessions per week. The reason I'm doing this instead of the 5/3/1 OHP day is I never really settled into it, I have no idea why, the above will be beneficial in building more muscle (Leverages) and the bodyweight exercises will hopefully help with increasing my strength.

Above all mate, I thoroughly recommend the original 5/3/1 when your ready to progress :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 80kg
Ohp 42.5kg
Deadlift 107.5kg

Squat was tough but did them.
Ohp on last reps 4 and 5 I felt like I might not make it and when at the top I felt the bar may fall backwards out of my hands.

Deadlift felt heavy and I had to pause between last three reps.

All done though.

P.s. I have no idea on earth how you guys squat and deadlift 200kg plus.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> P.s. I have no idea on earth how you guys squat and deadlift 200kg plus.


From my own experience if you can stay injury free you could get to a 200kg Squat in two years. Its taken me around three years due to several hamstring tears.

There is also fear. Fear of the squat is more common than many may think, I suffer from fear of the squat due to my last injury - I squatted 200kg for 1 and as I went down my semimembranosus tore and I just went straight down. Hence why I'm floating around 190kg -195kg on my Squat at the moment.

Also in regards strength I would say most failures are not due to a lack of strength but:

Poor Technique (This includes setting up the body correctly for the lift, which also includes correct breathing technique)
Fear. fear of failing and fear of injury, both of these fears will make you execute a lift with poor form and in themselves cause a failure.

Powerlifing as with any extreme sports has very little to do with physical strength, it is predominately psychological. Even at my low level you know the weights you use can break your body very badly.

Why do we do it you may ask? For me personally Its something primitive within my male psyche. Being strong is important to me, I love the physical challenge. I work in IT and find it lacks REAL challenge. I have great respect for (natural) physical and sporting prowess.

All hail the warriors of the world I say! :thumb:

What do you do?  
I lift heavy things! :thumb:
Why? 
Because I can!  :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Trial workout for new year.

*OVERHEAD PRESS 20X5 30X5 40X3 55KGx10x10x10x7x7

CHEAT PULLUPS 4x4x3x3x3*

Not bad, will be gradually adding (Dips) 5 sets of 10 to this for the new year. I will also need to find the optimum rest periods, especially between the pull up and dips. Due to my weight (112Kg) I will be aiming for pure strength first, so the rest periods will be something like a 7-10 minute rest period between the pullups and dips and around 3-5 minutes between each set.

I've got my 1 rep max Squat session mid next week then Ill be only using de load weights over the holiday period.


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 82.5kg
Bench 55kg
Barbell rows 60kg

Really feeling it on squats, will be surprised if I don't fail before reaching 90kg.

Bench, breezed through it.

Rows feeling them struggling on last few reps, should they be working yout biceps? Biceps feel strained today.


----------



## V3nom

I really need something new for my biceps and triceps! Feel like they've done nothing for months!


----------



## ITHAQVA

V3nom said:


> I really need something new for my biceps and triceps! Feel like they've done nothing for months!


Bench press
close grip bench press
Overhead press
Pull ups
Chin ups
Dips
Barbell row

Easy!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Rows feeling them struggling on last few reps, should they be working yout biceps? Biceps feel strained today.


Rows will work the entire arm, as does the bench press :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Best way Ive ever seen to add size to your arms is a high frequency chin up program. 

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 32.5x5, 40x3) WO 42.5x5, 50x5, 57x8 PM 72kg
Back Off Sets: 35x10,10,10,9,9
Chin Ups: BWx2,2,2,3,3

Good workout, made progress so I am happy. Need to start concentrating on my diet as put a KG back on and feel smaller so think ive lost a bit of muscle now. Maybe just cos I got drunk at the weekend so feel flat.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 87.5x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 137.5x3, 155x3 PM 170.5KG
Back Off Sets: 125x5,5,5,5,5
Hanging Leg Raises: BWx7,7,7,7,7

Good workout, heavy sets were nice and fast. back off sets started to slow at the end but I will keep pushing these up as it is 8 heavy sets of deadlifts so its just my body adapting to the volume.

Well thats another run through and havent missed a rep so pleased with that.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Merry Christmas everyone! :wave::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Test workout for new years percentages.

*Squat 80Kgx5 - 100Kgx5 - 130Kgx3 - 150Kgx1 - 170Kgx1 - 180Kgx1 - 190Kgx1* :thumb:

Very pleased with the results and have changed how I squat on all sets to ensure that every rep is the same which in turn will help improve my technique. Instead of repping without much of a stop at the top part of the rep I'm treating each rep as a single, once the rep is complete I reset, belly breath and proceed to the next rep and so on until the designated reps of the set are complete. Yes it will extend the length of each set, however I'm hoping there will be a massive advantage of improving technique consistency. Something I've been struggling with especially on the squat. Todays workout was one of the best squat sessions I've ever had and all reps felt the same.
In fact the 190Kgx1 felt that good I almost tried 200Kg x1 but decided to leave it for today. Also I moved over to 8-9 minute rest on the work sets - 150Kg - 190Kg. Again I noticed I had a lot more energy for the next single. I've been reading up on recovery between sets and it is acceptable to go right up to 15 minute breaks between the heavy stuff to allow the CNS to recover. something I've not considered until now 

Just a deload next week then a new year of powerlifting


----------



## Yoghurtman

I've just started the 5x5 program from stronglifts.com.

New years resolution etc. Downloaded the app to keep track of it.
2nd workout tonight and looking forward to it! Increasing by 2.5kg...

Although I've regularly used my own multi-gym at home, I realised I was going through the motions, lifting the same weights and not pushing myself enough. 

I've taken Mehdi's advice and gone back to the beginners start with just 20kg initial weight, to ensure my technique is up to scratch. One of the issues with using a multi-gym I guess is potentially a poor free weight technique, so I'm making sure I spend time getting it right.

Some good info on this thread, thanks to you all for giving me even more stuff to digest


----------



## ITHAQVA

Yoghurtman said:


> I've just started the 5x5 program from stronglifts.com.
> 
> New years resolution etc. Downloaded the app to keep track of it.
> 2nd workout tonight and looking forward to it! Increasing by 2.5kg...
> 
> Although I've regularly used my own multi-gym at home, I realised I was going through the motions, lifting the same weights and not pushing myself enough.
> 
> I've taken Mehdi's advice and gone back to the beginners start with just 20kg initial weight, to ensure my technique is up to scratch. One of the issues with using a multi-gym I guess is potentially a poor free weight technique, so I'm making sure I spend time getting it right.
> 
> Some good info on this thread, thanks to you all for giving me even more stuff to digest


If you stick with it, the rewards are beyond measure :thumb:

Just about to start my fourth year of Wendler's original 5/3/1 and I'm still making mistakes and still learning  But I'm still here and still doing it :devil:


----------



## Yoghurtman

Cheers for the support.

The regular increments in weight seem to have me motivated already, but I'm resisting the temptation to up the kg's too quickly and following the plan.

Free weights purchased (olympic weights are bloomin expensive! - nothing used around on ebay, I kept checking), but the multi-gyms up for sale on the bay to pay for it.... 

Here's to a more muscular 2015!!!!


----------



## Estoril-5

Yoghurtman said:


> I've just started the 5x5 program from stronglifts.com.
> 
> New years resolution etc. Downloaded the app to keep track of it.
> 2nd workout tonight and looking forward to it! Increasing by 2.5kg...
> 
> Although I've regularly used my own multi-gym at home, I realised I was going through the motions, lifting the same weights and not pushing myself enough.
> 
> I've taken Mehdi's advice and gone back to the beginners start with just 20kg initial weight, to ensure my technique is up to scratch. One of the issues with using a multi-gym I guess is potentially a poor free weight technique, so I'm making sure I spend time getting it right.
> 
> Some good info on this thread, thanks to you all for giving me even more stuff to digest


I did the same as you October this year, started on the 5x5 after a long long break.

Started back on the empty bar but missed a few sessions for various reasons, more looking after the kids and stuff rather than lack of motivation.

Currently on

Squat 82.5kg
Bench 55kg
Row 60kg
Ohp 42.5kg
Deadlift 107.5kg

Really hoping to go back full time in 2015 and also add some cardio in aswell.

My tip for you, if you go for a work out and you're not feeling it, leave it, rest and go in the next day.

Looking forward to seeing your 12 weeks results


----------



## ITHAQVA

Yoghurtman said:


> Cheers for the support.
> 
> The regular increments in weight seem to have me motivated already, but I'm resisting the temptation to up the kg's too quickly and following the plan.
> 
> Free weights purchased (olympic weights are bloomin expensive! - nothing used around on ebay, I kept checking), but the multi-gyms up for sale on the bay to pay for it....
> 
> Here's to a more muscular 2015!!!!


Best advice I can give you;

Add the weight as per 5x5 advice.

Train consistently, missing two-three weeks of training per year is not a problem but if you start to miss a day every week your gains will diminish rapidly. The ones that keep having breaks due to one reason or another have to keep de loading and therefore they will FAIL.

Eat enough otherwise you'll not grow (If more muscle is your goal)

If its just strength/health then you don't need to eat as much.

Pretty basic stuff if you need more in depth info, feel free to ask :thumb:

You have to MAKE time to train consistently or you will fail, its you versus you :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

HAPPY
NEW 

YEAR!

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - January - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 94KGX5 - 109KGX5 - 123KGX3

BENCH PRESS 80KGx10x10x10x10x10

CHEAT PULLUPS 4x4x3x4x3*

Nice to get back into it after having a few weeks from consistent lifting, missed two reps on last work set but I can build on that over the next few months, although I don't really intend on going much heavier than 125Kg for 5 reps.

Goals for this year:

Bench Press 150Kgx1 (Current 140Kgx1)
Deadlift 230Kgx1 (Current 210Kgx1)
Squat 200Kgx1 (Current 190Kgx1)

Build as much muscle mass as possible and reduce bodyfat down to 15%

It may seem a lot in one go but my strength goals are all but complete so my approach to finishing them will be slow as I concentrate on building more muscle. I would like to reach between 17-18 stone @15% Body fat


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - January - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 140GX5 - 155KGX5 - 180KGX5*

Decent workout, will be much happier when I'm back into consistent full workouts :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Hope everyone had a good xmas and new yrs. Mine was amazing as its like 30 degrees over here and didnt rain all xmas and new yrs.

Ok so I only did 1 workout over xmas but did 3 days last week as I was back at work.

Bench Press: 70x5, 85x4, 97.5x3, 110x2, 122.5x1, 110x8 PM 139.5kg
77.5x10,10,10,10,10
Inverted Rows

Pleased to be getting back up there in weight, 110x8 isnt to bad at all. And please with the back off sets, will be glad to get 80kg tonight for 5 sets of 10.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 100x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 150x5 PM 165kg
Squats: 120x5,5,5,5,5

My squats are so pathetic, easy 140kg predicted bench and a hard 165kg squat. Such crap. But I suppose Starting Strength does say that advanced at 110kg is 144kg bench and 192kg Squat so my squat should be 48kgs ahead and at the movement it is 25kg. So ya I need to put 23kg more on my squat. Bench will prob stall soon though and hoping that squat wont as I should have loads left in me.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27x5, 35x5, 40x3) WO 45x5, 51x5, 58x8 PM 73.5kg
Shoulder Press: 35x10,10,10,8,8
Chin Ups: BWx2,2,3,3,3

Top set felt awesome. I had physio the other day to try and release my upper back to give me more freedom in my golf swing and it seems to have really helped my shoulder press and definitely chin ups. Chin ups were stupidly easy. I actually got less reps than last time on Shoulder Press but this was more me pulling back as they seemed to be really pulling on my bad shoulder.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 105x3) WO 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x3 PM 173kg
Deadlifts: 127.5x5,5,5,5,5

Heavy sets went well, got all my back off sets but they were hard. Never really a chance of failure but I want to be doing these BBB sets nice and fast instead of grinding out high volume sets.

Pleased with my progress, at least the weights are getting back up there now and so much better mentally altering my weights weekly instead of monthly. Just works so much better with the way I think.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 70x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 112.5x2, 127.5x1, 112.5x8 PM 142.5kg
Bench Press: 77.5x10,10,6,5,5
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6,6

Good workout. I'm loving this over warm up. I might actually use it for my deadlifts and squats. It serves 2 purposes, it makes your work weights feel nice and light and it gives you an excuse to use some nice heavy weights. Like I havent benched 127.5kg in quite a long time, I have been stronger than I am now but i have never showed that strength with a 1RM. The top set is an easy 1rep but you can gauge a lot from this based on speed and how hard it is.

As you will see, my back off sets are dropping off now. Thats to be expected when you are expending more energy on your main heavy sets. I will probably break a PR record on my heavy sets and then leave that and concentrate on bringing up the BBB sets.


----------



## Bokers

RDL
20kg x 12
25kg x 10
30kg x 8
35kg x 6
40kg x 4

Cable Pullthrough
20kg x 12 x 3

Box Squat
20kg x 5 x 5

Bench Press
20kg x 5 x 5

Incline DB Press
5kg x 12
7.5kg x 12
5kg x 12

Flys
5kg x 12 x 3

Weight 282lbs.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - January - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101.5KGX3 - 116KGX3 - 130KGX3

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGx10x10x10x10x10

CHEAT PULLUPS 4x4x4x3x3*

Good workout all reps achieved and increase of 2.5kg on hypertrophy/assistance work :thumb:

Agree with James re: over warm up sets, but it does depend on your goals and there is a fine line between warming up and exhausting the muscle and more importantly your CNS.

Will be researching resistance bands to help with pull ups as I cant gauge if I'm over cheating or not assisting myself enough, would make progress much easier if I had something a bit more consistent


----------



## Bod42

Doug the 1 rep over warm up that I do is maximum 90% of my everyday max so it shouldnt ever burn me out. Normally it is 85%.

I have heard mixed reviews on resistance bands. Some advocate them, some dont as the strength curve is the wrong way round. They help the least at the top and that is the hardest bit. But my personal experience with them is that they work, I remember using a band to get more rep work in around the 10rep area and when I went back to standard chin ups I had gotten a hell of a lot stronger.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug the 1 rep over warm up that I do is maximum 90% of my everyday max so it shouldnt ever burn me out. Normally it is 85%.
> 
> I have heard mixed reviews on resistance bands. Some advocate them, some dont as the strength curve is the wrong way round. They help the least at the top and that is the hardest bit. But my personal experience with them is that they work, I remember using a band to get more rep work in around the 10rep area and when I went back to standard chin ups I had gotten a hell of a lot stronger.


I've just ordered a resistance band. Had to go for a heavy band due to my weight 

I'm not worried if they help in the wrong way. As long as they help/assist they will allow me to reserve power for the upper part of the exercise, so either way will allow for more controlled assistance and volume :thumb:

Got one for £25 on Amazon, I would like to do pull ups twice a week over the next 12 months. I'm interested in how they improve strength over the barbell rows which I've been doing now for 3 years.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - January - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 150GX3 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX3

DEADLIFT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 110KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Felt strong on all reps = Good workout  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I've just ordered a resistance band. Had to go for a heavy band due to my weight
> 
> I'm not worried if they help in the wrong way. As long as they help/assist they will allow me to reserve power for the upper part of the exercise, so either way will allow for more controlled assistance and volume :thumb:
> 
> Got one for £25 on Amazon, I would like to do pull ups twice a week over the next 12 months. I'm interested in how they improve strength over the barbell rows which I've been doing now for 3 years.


Definitely higher frequentcy seems to work with Chins ups. Some of the programs to improve your Chin ups fast are every day with 1 day a week break. Completely different exercises and will hit different muscles. Everyone should include a horizontal and vertical pulling and pushing movement in their program, so both chin ups and rows.

What type did you get Doug, Iron Woody are suppose to be some of the best out there. I have a powerlifting gym not far from me who sells them so Ive got 3 different strength ones now, I find they are brilliant for the home gym setup as they allow you to do push downs etc.


----------



## Bokers

SL SLDL One hand
10kg x 12 x 3

GM
20kg x 12 x 3

Squats
20kg x 5 x 5 - Happy here, knee was a little sore but much better today.

Chinups
BW x 2, 1

Cable Chinups
20kg x 12, 10
25kg x 8, 6, 4

BOR
20kg x 5 x 5

Plank
10 x 10 sec full contraction

BW 276lbs.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> What type did you get Doug, Iron Woody are suppose to be some of the best out there. I have a powerlifting gym not far from me who sells them so Ive got 3 different strength ones now, I find they are brilliant for the home gym setup as they allow you to do push downs etc.


I got one of these: CROSSFIT PULL UP RESISTANCE BANDS - POWER LIFTING WEIGHT LIFTING - HEAVY - BLUE: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Outdoors

For only £24 I thought I'd give it a go :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Not very impressed as my form was awful, the bar felt like it was rolling up towards my neck when i was coming out of the hole. i should not be struggling this badly at this weight. 

My BBB sets were a lot better though, instead of concentrating on my sticking point, i just purely concentrated on throwing the bar through the ceiling at the top and you just drive through your sticking point so much better.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
> BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Not very impressed as my form was awful, the bar felt like it was rolling up towards my neck when i was coming out of the hole. i should not be struggling this badly at this weight.
> 
> My BBB sets were a lot better though, instead of concentrating on my sticking point, i just purely concentrated on throwing the bar through the ceiling at the top and you just drive through your sticking point so much better.


James, I have found treating every rep as a single forces better form for each rep, yeah it may slow the set down, but when I tried this over Christmas I was amazed how every rep felt the same, this in my mind is a great way to improve squat form :thumb:

That's something that although obvious I know I miss often. As with any changing sport I sometimes think we all forget to keep checking form. After three years of Powerlifting due to training alone I find I'm constantly having to keep an eye on myself and even then, 99.9% of the time if I don't make my reps it has nothing to do with strength but Form/technique.
IMHO lifting technique is everything when it comes to powerlifting as it does with Olympic weightlifting, you could almost say that when you progress in the weights you use that you are actually progressing, getting more in tune with your technique rather than strength, given that strength is more heavily based on CNS.

Isn't it ironic that we sometime let our technique become lose to cheat the weight up


----------



## Bokers

Fasted training at a new gym today.

Squats
20kg x 5 x 3
30kg x 5 x 3 -- Squat shoes on, much better. Knee just feels stiff now.

Leg press
50kg x 8 x 2
100kg x 8 x 3

Viking press
50kg x 5 x 3

Small log press
50kg x 3 x 5

Deadlifts
60kg x 5 x 3
80kg x 5 x 2
100kg x 5 x 2


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - January - Replacement to 5/3/1 OHP session.

Had a quick go at my new session. Didn't have time to complete (Missed out 5 sets 10 OHP) but at least i got the main sets done.

*DIPS BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10x10x10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS 10x10x10x7x7*

Assistance band arrived mid workout so thought I'd try on the pull ups, very pleased, gives just right amount of assistance. Also as I progress I can add weight to my body a reduce the assistance. I also see that I can use the band to do assisted dips which will be great for warming up, I've always found it hard to warm up correctly for dips, now it will be much better :thumb:

Must admit doing pull ups with a giant rubber band felt really weird and I was worried it would break and flick my balls!:devil: :doublesho:doublesho:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - January - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX2

SQUAT 100KGx10x10x10x10x10*

Negative points -
Managed two reps on the 180Kg, just because the second rep was moderately difficult I decided to rack it rather than fail the rep :wall: WTF! I should have just carried on, I would have made it FFS. The human psyche is an odd thing 
Definitely lost a bit of fitness due to my inconsistent training Nov/Dec

Positive points -
Consistent rep technique - Squat depth, very positive touches of my depth box every time :thumb: 
Treating each set as a group of single reps most certainly puts you into the groove :thumb:
Body position improved greatly, I'm now leading with my upper body rather that allowing my hips to overtake (The Main technique reason for my previous failures) :thumb:

Yes I missed a rep, but overall there is a huge improvement in my squatting :thumb:

Right back to the winter sports on Eurosport - Ski jumping, biathlon, cross country and men's downhill :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Ya Doug I have always treated my squats like single reps really. Squat, reset, breath into my belly, squat again. never just fast reps unless I'm doing 10 plus reps.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52x5, 60x6 PM 72kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,9,9
Chin Ups: BWx2,3,3,3,3

Not the best workout but means I can stay on this weight for a while now and just absolutely dominate it. Nice to have the 20s on either side of the bar at least. Would rather have the 25s but I know that Shoulder Press is a long road but it will be even longer because my shoulder is buggered.

Chin ups felt really easy.

Deadlifts tonight, first time I havent looked forward to them for a while because I went rock climbing yesterday so my grip and forearms are absolutely fried. We were pushing the inclines and overhangs yesterday so this uses are incredible amount of grip strength. Weird how leg strength is useful in pretty much everything even rock climbing.


----------



## Bokers

Reverse hyperextensions SS the opposite (legs moving)
BW x 12,12 x 3

The plan was cleans, but my mobility is lacking still. So I just did a lot of BW front squats and hitting the right position for cleans.

OHP
20kg x 10 x 5

Seated DB OHP
7kg x 12 x 3

Cable tricep pushdowns SS cable curlzzz
20kg x 12, 10, 8, 6, 4 each.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
BBB sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Didnt do abs as I did rockclimbing on Sunday so my hands were already beat to hell so were completely buggered after Deadlifts. Probably should have done something else. Deadlifts are starting to feel better. Im going to stop where I am on the BBB sets and concentrate on speed for a few weeks and push up my max abit more.

I have decided to enter a bench press comp in July but with a slight difference. Its just soemthing at a Fitness expo but you win like a yrs supply of supplements and I recon I have a good chance of getting a win if I train for it. Basically it is Max reps for BW so im hoping to come in at or close to 100kg and get approx 30 reps. I will be training strength and then about 8 weeks before hand, I will train max rep on my bench workout to get used to the higher reps. 100kg x 30 is a good goal I recon.


----------



## Bokers

Not that it matters, and I might have said before, but I dislocated my knee playing rugby, so it's time to build it back up. Hence the weights.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Not that it matters, and I might have said before, but I dislocated my knee playing rugby, so it's time to build it back up. Hence the weights.


Hope you mend soon mate, keep up the rehab :thumb:

Unfortunately the longer you stay in sport the quicker you realise that injuries are just a part of it.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42;4788944 said:


> I have decided to enter a bench press comp in July but with a slight difference. Its just soemthing at a Fitness expo but you win like a yrs supply of supplements and I recon I have a good chance of getting a win if I train for it. Basically it is Max reps for BW so im hoping to come in at or close to 100kg and get approx 30 reps. I will be training strength and then about 8 weeks before hand, I will train max rep on my bench workout to get used to the higher reps. 100kg x 30 is a good goal I recon.


Fair play, much respect your way if you do 30 reps at BW! That's an insane amount.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 -January 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 108.5KGX5 - 123KGX3 - 138KGX1

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS x10x10x10x10x10*

Best workout this month, fitness and strength felt much better.

I will try to progress on the blue band pull ups by adding 2.5kg to my bodyweight every time I make 5 sets of 10 reps, cancelling out its assistance slowly and hopefully improving my unassisted pull up strength.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Fair play, much respect your way if you do 30 reps at BW! That's an insane amount.


I doubt I will but nice to aim high


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - January 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 215KGX1

DEADLIFT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 110KGx5x5x5*

Really nice workout, the 215Kg x1 went up at a good pace and my missus said my back was pretty close to flat. But safety first and I will be using the same weight next month to ensure good safe form before moving up to 220Kg.

Fitness was much better as well, didn't really feel that out of breath during the whole workout.

Want to keep focused on good safe technique over the next months to try and keep injury free while I build muscle and strength.

Weight in Wednesday = 17 stone 10.8 pounds :doublesho, having to wear a belt for my jeans now, so at least I'm not putting on too much body fat, hope to keep this level of muscle building up to around 18 stone, if its possible. I have no idea what a naturals limit is for my height, but I would say being around 20% body fat makes it far more possible/realistic.

Measured my arms the other day and they are 17.1" (Tape was tight), considering I don't train arms and I'm a powerlifter not body builder I'm pleased as I've managed to kept physical size and symmetry :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nice Work Doug, an easy 215kg, I like it. I need to pull my figer out and crack 200kg, been way to long. I feel like Im finally getting somewhere with my lifting.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 137.5x3, 155x3 PM 170.5kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Very good workout, bar moved slightly again on the last rep so made it slightly harder than it shold have been but I still got it. I have been trying to drive through my heels as I am bending forwards but this seems to fire my hamstrings which pushes my hips back which increases my lean angle so this actually seems to be the problem. I sorted this and my reps were way better.

I had abit of a light bulb moment with squats last night. I just need to stop being such a god dam pu$$y. Last week I was like oh that was hard so i will stick at this weight, came in the gym this week and destroyed the higher weight. This happened when i set my record before Xmas, every week i said there is no way I can go 2.5kg next week but every single week i did. I am just going to keep increasing the weight until I properly fail as I havent failed a squat in god knows how long. Basically I just need to work harder on my lower body lifts, stop making excuses to make things easier.

Short term goal is to get advanced in everything.
Strength Standards - 105kg	Intermediate	Advanced	Elite
Bench Press	104	141	176
Squat	139	189	246
Shoulder Press	71	85	118
Deadlift	162	220	269

If you look at this, i am actually the worst on deadlifts of all my exercises.

And then I want to start doing some more shoulder work and sort out my shoulder strength ratio as per Charles Poliquin writtings.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice Work Doug,
> Short term goal is to get advanced in everything.
> Strength Standards - 105kg	Intermediate	Advanced	Elite
> Bench Press	104	141	176
> Squat	139	189	246
> Shoulder Press	71	85	118
> Deadlift	162	220	269


Thanks James :thumb:

Well structured approach to goals mate, very similar to mine, although I've just rounded mine off - Bench 140-150, Squat 200 and deadlift 230.
after all if we are not competing I see no need to go further. There is enough room for injuries as it is  :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - January Hypertrophy workout

*DIPS (WU BLUE BAND ASSISTED 10x10x5x5x5) - BODYWEIGHTx10x10x10x10x10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS 10x10x10x10x10

OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGx10x10x10x10x10*

New workout and it felt good. The resistance band is ideal for warming up for dips :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Last night
Deadlifts
60, 80, 100, 120kg x 2
130kg x 1

Bench Press
20, 40, 60, 80kg x 3

Today
Squats
20, 40, 50, 60kg x 5
70kg x 3 Knee was starting to ache here. Didn't push it, good form none the less. Happy!

Power cleans
40kg x 3 x 8

Viking press
50, 60kg x 5 x 3

Small log press
50kg x 3 x 3
55kg x 3
50kg x 3

Bench Press
20, 40, 60, 80kg x 5
80kg x 3
40kg x 8


----------



## Bokers

Four of us in a tiny garage gym today made for a slow session but teaching some new guys decent form was fun. Just meant we didn't get much done.

Bench Press
20, 40, 60, 80kg x 5
60kg x 5
40kg x 20

BOR
20, 40, 50kg x 5 x 3

Cable curls SS cable pushdowns
20kg x 12+12 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x7 PM 142kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x10,10,6,5,5
Pendlay Rows: 70x7,7,7,7,7

First time I have failed bench in ages but it was never on from the start of the session. At least now when i miss bench I have done a nice 1rep and I have all the back off sets to still improve the exercise.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52x5, 60x5 PM 70kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,9,9
Chin Ups: BWx3,3,3,3,3

Pretty poor session but again it was never on and I wasnt felling great so I was just in there to get some work in, something is better than nothing. But one good thing about the workout is that my bad shoulder doesnt burn and hurt like crazy during the BBB sets which is good as a few weeks back I said i wonder if Im doing damage or good to it, turns out it seems to be good for it. Less pain must be good. It was a long weekend over here and Sunday I was sitting in 30 degree heat for like 8 hours and then Monday I was riding my quad for like 8+ hours in the dunes so the heat was incredible and you just cant take on enough water to stay hydrated no matter how hard you try. Was an amazing day tho.





Worth having a slightly substandard workout for.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x3 PM 178.5kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, not amazing, not bad, just got in and done the work that needed to be done. Thats the key to progress personally, just consistency. I worked out I can do approx 80% for my 5x5 sets and then I read Beyond 5/3/1 again and JW states the same % so that always gives you some confidence.


----------



## ITHAQVA

A couple de load session done this week.

*SQUAT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 110KGX5

SQUAT 70KGx10x10x10x10x10

DEADLIFT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 80KGX5 - 100KGX5 -120KGX5

DEADLIFT  70KGx10x10x10x10x1

RDL 70KGx10x10x10x10x10*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

So i had a planned deload week this week but felt good so I had actually planned on skipping it and working out like usual. That hasnt quite gone to plan as I went snowboarding on fri night and had a massive off landing on my shoulder and ribs, luckily it was my good shoulder so hopefully its just muscular and therefore wont take long to heal.

So i thought I may as well just do my deload week.
Bench: 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 102.5x5
Inverted Rows: BWx6,6,6 between bench sets

Nice to do an easy 102.5x5 when your injured. I think its more the stabilizing muscles during the bench so is just really uncomfortable during the movement but Ive learnt that pumping blood through your injuries definitely helps healing them. I will probably have to deload my bench tho which is disappointing but thats life. Gives me more energy to concentrate on my lower body lifts which are definitely lacking.

Will just carry on with the deload for the rest of the week as my shoulder will effect my squats and shoulder press.


----------



## Bokers

Deadlifts
60, 90, 100, 110, 120kg x 5

Lat Pulldown 1/1/4/1
30kg x 10 x 3

Low cable row 1/1/4/1
30kg x 10 x 3

KB Swings
8kg x 12 x 4 PH


----------



## Leebo310

Again, haven't posted numbers for a while but have still been working out...

Today's was Bench - Session 3

WU - Bar*20, 40kg*10, 70kg*10

WO - 87.5kg*5, 100kg*3, 110kg*3 

Bench 70kg*10, 70kg*10, 70kg*10, 70kg*10, 70kg*10, 

4*fail pull ups (various grips)

That's a new PB for my bench so was very happy to get 3 reps out considering I only technically needed the 1!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - February 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 94KGX5 - 109KGX5 - 123KGX4

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 2.5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good, added another rep to the final work set, will aim for 5 reps next month. Not overly concerned about adding more weight to the work sets as im more focusing on building some extra muscle over the next few months. Once im happy ill continue to progress on the bench and try to get 150Kgx1 by November/December this year.

Very pleased with assistance band pull ups, I will move up to adding 5kg to bodyweight next week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - February 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) 140GX5 - 155KGX5 - 180KGX5

DEADLIFT 110KGx10x10x10x10x10

RDL 110KGx5x5x5x5x5*

Much better this month, fitness is now back and the whole workout felt a lot less draining.
Will maintain the weight on most of the work sets but still aim to keep progressing on the 1 rep max. If this months 215x1 feels ok ill move up to 220 the following month.

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 40, 60, 80, 60, 40, 20 x 5 Great form, killed my quads.

Bench Press
20, 50kg x 5
70kg x 5 x 5

Bench Row (raised bench with a bar that has extra handles, decent)
40kg x 5 x 5


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x5 PM 134kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x9,9,9,8,6
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,8

Cals: 2453, P:221, C:226, F: 68 W:104.6kg

This may not seem like the best workout but I injured my left shoulder snowboarding so Im pretty please to get 2 reps off my best lately. Cant really complain as its quite painful. Feels miles better this morning though after the workout. I still think working the area pumps blood through it which repairs it faster.

Anyway a little update. I train hard and consistently but I have basically been treading water for god knows how long now so I have decided to concentrate on my diet properly and have spent a lot of time reading about it lately and have come up with the following plan.

Training Days
Calories 2500
Protein 220
Carbs 330
Fat 33

Non-Training Days
Calories 2000
Protein 220
Carbs 110
Fat 76

Weigh ins will be twice per week on Tues and Fri. Thw weight seems light for me but this is taken 1st thing in the morning as soon as I get up before a drink or anything. For comparison, Im 104.6kg this morning but last night before bed I was 108.4kg so gives you some idea how much your weight fluctuates throughout the day and how much food you take on board. Its more complicated having non-training and training day diet but the great thing about all those extra carbs on training days is that I can have Gatorade during my workout which keeps my energy levels up.

Also thinking about switching my workout slightly and putting BBB deadlifts after squats and vice versa. Yes Jim Wendler states that it doesnt matter but at the moment I have 8 days between squat sessions which I think is to long.


----------



## Yoghurtman

I'm just over a month into my Stronglift 5x5 routine and had my first fail on Sunday 

My own fault, did not warm up long enough and in a cold unheated garage, I pulled my inner thigh muscle whilst at the bottom of my 1st set of 72.5kg squats. Gutted.

So having to improvise for a few days and concentrate on upper body, but I'll tentatively start from scratch and see how I get on tonight......


----------



## Estoril-5

After a long rest and starting cardio training I'm back on 5x5 

I'm going to try and alternate the training, 5x5 3 times a week and on the rest days do some cardio.

Weekends will be left free for family time.

Anyway as the app suggests I deloaded to 50% of my max.

Squat 42.5kg
Ohp 22.5kg
Deadlift 70kg (was supposed to be 55kg but went a bit higher)

First session after 6 weeks, didn't even break a sweat which makes me think I'll get back to my max very soon.

Really want to break that 100kg squat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 February 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101.5KGX3 - 116KGX3 - 130KGX3

BENCH PRESS 85KGx10x10x10x10x10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 5KGx10x10x10x10x10*

All good, pull ups required a little effort on the last set, so hopefully soon ill find a good weight to add to my bodyweight to test me enough to fail 5x10, then start to build my strength :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Yoghurtman said:


> I'm just over a month into my Stronglift 5x5 routine and had my first fail on Sunday
> 
> My own fault, did not warm up long enough and in a cold unheated garage, I pulled my inner thigh muscle whilst at the bottom of my 1st set of 72.5kg squats. Gutted.
> 
> So having to improvise for a few days and concentrate on upper body, but I'll tentatively start from scratch and see how I get on tonight......


If you've pulled a muscle I strongly advise you try the RICE method to help repair any torn muscle tissue :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Estoril-5 nice work starting 5x5 again. If your main aim is to lose weight/ change body composition then obviously cardio wont hurt but its mostly in the diet.

Check out http://iifym.com/ If It Fits Your Macros diet, far superior for the average joe. I had a bday party at pizza hut Monday, I had 4 pieces of Peperoni pizza Monday & the other 4 bits on tues for dinner. Ive had pizza for dinner 2 nights in a row on a diet, good aye.

Also check out "The Renaissance Diet", it has some great info on the weighting of each part of the diet. You can read it free here, http://www.scribd.com/doc/248536704/The-Renaissance-Diet#scribd



Calories in versus calories out - 40% of nutritional success
Macronutrients - 30% of nutritional success

Weird how the composition of food makes up so little of diet success. And 70% of our diet is just how much we eat and the protein/carb/fat split.

Ive read the entire book but if you cant be bothered, heres a good summary.

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/weightroom/comments/2h9vrm


----------



## Estoril-5

2nd session of 5x5

Did 50kg on everything 

Squat 50kg rested for about 20 seconds between each set, breezed through it no worries
Bench 50kg 
Rows 50kg

5x5 all done, going to go up in bigger increments because I've been there before so want to get back up to my max as soon as reasonably possible.


----------



## Bod42

Tues Cals: 1683, P:204, C:86, F: 54
Wed Cals: 2476, P:233, C:277, F: 43

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 105x3) 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x1 PM 157.5kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Bad workout but Im still injured from snowboarding so I cant complain really. I need to sort my head out, as soon as I fail Im thinking about deloading and all sorts of crap. Need to realise that you have bad workouts, just get over them and move on. I will try 157.5x3 again next week. I also went for the 1st rep before I was completely happy with my setup which is just stupid.

This is the great thing about the BBB sets, your still getting work in so despite you missing your heavy work, you still have another 5 sets to get some work in.


----------



## ibisa3

Decent squats there bod42

Whats your bodyweight ?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Tues Cals: 1683, P:204, C:86, F: 54
> Wed Cals: 2476, P:233, C:277, F: 43
> 
> Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 105x3) 122.5x3, 140x3, 157.5x1 PM 157.5kg
> BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Bad workout but Im still injured from snowboarding so I cant complain really. I need to sort my head out, as soon as I fail Im thinking about deloading and all sorts of crap. Need to realise that you have bad workouts, just get over them and move on. I will try 157.5x3 again next week. I also went for the 1st rep before I was completely happy with my setup which is just stupid.
> 
> This is the great thing about the BBB sets, your still getting work in so despite you missing your heavy work, you still have another 5 sets to get some work in.


I wouldn't beat yourself up so much James, your young and have a long journey left for lifting the iron.

You and I don't compete so why worry so much about how much you lift, I can tell you that even though I've squatted 200kg for one there is a sort of anti-climax... Is that it?:tumbleweed: You ask yourself, I had the same when I made my first 145Kg on the bench and 200Kg on the deadlift. I'm finding its the journey towards your goal that's the best part, you learn a lot about yourself :thumb: So de loading and building up again may be a very good way to maintain motivation :thumb:

Sometimes reaching your goals can be a bit of a let down :tumbleweed:

Your also finding out that any sport that is taken to a certain level moves away from being physiological to psychological.

I've been a little inconsistent as of late due to being really busy, initially I beat myself up but now I realise I will get back to my usual consistent self sooner rather than later, enjoy the ride mate :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Due to the squat rack being in use when I got to the gym today, (someone squatting the bar + 2 5kg plates...) I had to start on leg press and then go to squat. Still a good workout though.

*Leg Press*
180kgx11, 200kgx11, 230kgx11+6 The +6 is an additional set to failure after only a 15 second rest from your final set. I'm finding it a good way to finish off a set and switch between that and a drop set depending on weeks.

*Squats *
WU 70kgx5, 90kgx5
WO 107.5kgx5, 122.5kgx3, 140kgx3 - The 3 were actually pretty easy and I think I could've done a couple more if I had started on squat, rather than leg press. May up the weight by 10kg, rather than 5kg next cycle as would really like to hit a 150kg squat at my current BW of 77kg :devil:

*Squats* 
90kgx10, 90kgx10, 90kgx10, 90kgx10+4

*Seated Smith Machine Calf Raise*
169kgx25, 199kgx25, 219kgx25, 239kgx21+5

Then I crawled out of the gym :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - February 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 150GX3 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX3*

Short for time so made sure I made the work sets . All good, the 190Kg felt the easiest of all today :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Due to the squat rack being in use when I got to the gym today, (someone squatting the bar + 2 5kg plates...) I had to start on leg press and then go to squat. Still a good workout though.
> 
> *Leg Press*
> 180kgx11, 200kgx11, 230kgx11+6 The +6 is an additional set to failure after only a 15 second rest from your final set. I'm finding it a good way to finish off a set and switch between that and a drop set depending on weeks.
> 
> *Squats *
> WU 70kgx5, 90kgx5
> WO 107.5kgx5, 122.5kgx3, 140kgx3 - The 3 were actually pretty easy and I think I could've done a couple more if I had started on squat, rather than leg press. May up the weight by 10kg, rather than 5kg next cycle as would really like to hit a 150kg squat at my current BW of 77kg :devil:
> 
> *Squats*
> 90kgx10, 90kgx10, 90kgx10, 90kgx10+4
> 
> *Seated Smith Machine Calf Raise*
> 169kgx25, 199kgx25, 219kgx25, 239kgx21+5
> 
> Then I crawled out of the gym :thumb:


That's good going for your light bodyweight Lee :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> That's good going for your light bodyweight Lee :thumb:


Cheers Doug


----------



## Estoril-5

Squats 70kg
Ohp 30kg
Deadlift 90kg

All done, was good. Gonna hit 80kg on the squats next, feel like I'm getting back to where I left off fairly quickly.

Want to hit that 100kg squat before February's out


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - February 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 75X5 90X3) - 140KGX3 - 160KGX3 - 180KGX0 - 180KGX2 :thumb: *

Managed to get the work sets in before going out. Made a mess of my technique on my first attempt on the 180Kgx3 :wall: I was determined to get at least some reps in at the weight so I unloaded the bar re racked and reloaded it  I thought F**K me if I think I'm walking out the  room without making a proper attempt :devil:

Managed two reps might have done three. Considering the energy expended on the first attempt I'm still reasonably happy with making two reps. However I think it would be much wiser to de load my squat work set weight by 10Kg and build up again, I seem ok on the single rep sets but struggling with the five and three rep work sets. There is a possibility that its just an energy issue but I don't want to increase my rest periods beyond the seven minutes I'm currently using on the work sets.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ibisa3 said:


> Decent squats there bod42
> 
> Whats your bodyweight ?


Thanks but Im 105kg so its not that great.



ITHAQVA said:


> I wouldn't beat yourself up so much James, your young and have a long journey left for lifting the iron.
> 
> You and I don't compete so why worry so much about how much you lift, I can tell you that even though I've squatted 200kg for one there is a sort of anti-climax... Is that it?:tumbleweed: You ask yourself, I had the same when I made my first 145Kg on the bench and 200Kg on the deadlift. I'm finding its the journey towards your goal that's the best part, you learn a lot about yourself :thumb: So de loading and building up again may be a very good way to maintain motivation :thumb:
> 
> Sometimes reaching your goals can be a bit of a let down :tumbleweed:
> 
> Your also finding out that any sport that is taken to a certain level moves away from being physiological to psychological.
> 
> I've been a little inconsistent as of late due to being really busy, initially I beat myself up but now I realise I will get back to my usual consistent self sooner rather than later, enjoy the ride mate :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:


Anti-climax, really? I absolutely love hitting PRs, thats why Im getting so annoyed as I feel like I'm getting no where for all my efforts at the moment.

Look over 3 years ago.
Mondays Workout:
Squat 120kg 3 x 5
Seated Shoulder Press 52.5kg 5,5,5,4,3
Deadlift 152.5kg 1 x 5

Wednesdays Workout:
Squat 122.5kg 3 x 5
Bench Press 102.5kg 5,5,5,4,3
Bent Over Rows 80kg 5,5,4,4,4 3 weeks and still didnt hit weight so deload by 20% so next time 64kg and build back up.

Fridays Workout:
Box Squats: 125kg 3 x 5 (14" Box)
Seated Shoulder Press: 52.5kg 5,5,5,5,5
Conventional Deadlift: 157.5kg 1 x 3

So looking at my last few weeks workouts to compare.
Squats - 155x3 compared with 125 x 3 x 5 
Bench - 112.5x8 compared with 102.5x5,5,5,4,3
Deadlift 162.5x3 compared with 157.5x3
Shoulder Press 60x5 compared with 52.5x5,5,5,5,5

So for about 550 hours of busting my ****, I have made basically zero progress. This is why I get so unmotivated.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 45x5, 53x5, 60x4 PM 68kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,10,8
Neutral Grip Chins: BWx3,3,3,3,4

Another workout where I lost strength. Got 5 reps last week, 4 reps this week. But on a positive note, I did match my top BBB reps and nearly beat it.


----------



## Leebo310

James don't be so hard on yourself mate. Yep your lifts may have dropped a bit recently but you're doing yourself a disservice by using them to judge your progress over three years. 
I've just found the below post you made back in August which clearly shows improvement from the start on squat and I'm sure the others are the same. 

Squats: (WU 70x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x3 PM 187kg

Couldn't be bothered to search any more but I'm sure you've got much better records of your max lifts in the three years?? Compare those rather than just these recent ones as I believe you're injured and dieting at the moment so it's not an accurate or fair comparison to use the current and will only demotivate you further buddy. 
Head up mate and stick with it 👍


----------



## ibisa3

few stats from me :
Day 1, 99.8kg. Never squatted, no lifting history.
self calculated diet, bulk cooking, very tight macros.


Currently day 157, Bw = 75.8kg
Nearly ready for a clean bulk, abs JUST about starting show !!!!!!
Back squat 1RM 122.5, 5x5 @ 100
front squat 1rm 85, 5x5 @ 75
Power clean to front squat @ 60kg 5x5
snatch @ 32.5kg reps

Previous injuries : 2x torn disks in lower back, degenerative cervical spondylosis.....

Bench press is terrible though,lucky if i can rep 70kg !!!!!


----------



## Bod42

Thanks Lee & Doug. Its why this forum is such a good place.

Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 127.5x3, 145x3, 165x3 PM 181.5kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Better workout. Hit my reps so cant complain. Nice to be getting somewhere with at least 1 exercise. Shows how much my body responds to calorie intake as i put weight on over the weekend and felt really strong Monday. Soon as I'm in a calorie deficit, body just loses strength.


----------



## Estoril-5

Forgot to add my session I did on Saturday.

Squat 70kg
Ohp 30kg
DL 90kg

5x5 all done. Got another session this evening, aiming for the 80kg squat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thanks Lee & Doug. Its why this forum is such a good place.
> 
> Deadlifts: (WU 72.5x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 127.5x3, 145x3, 165x3 PM 181.5kg
> BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Better workout. Hit my reps so cant complain. Nice to be getting somewhere with at least 1 exercise. Shows how much my body responds to calorie intake as i put weight on over the weekend and felt really strong Monday. Soon as I'm in a calorie deficit, body just loses strength.


Sometimes it just goes that way, I do IT out of work and the last few months have been mad, hence fewer posts :wall: But I have made a mental note for March to ensure im back 4 days a week with consistency :thumb:

Perhaps you should focus on one thing at a time. Make goal weights first, then decide on a way forward :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Sometimes it just goes that way, I do IT out of work and the last few months have been mad, hence fewer posts :wall: But I have made a mental note for March to ensure im back 4 days a week with consistency :thumb:
> 
> Perhaps you should focus on one thing at a time. Make goal weights first, then decide on a way forward :thumb:


Thats what Ive been trying to do Doug, I was trying to hit my strength goals which werent far off and then once I hit them I could just maintain my strength and concentrate on my diet and increasing my BBB sets as the % I can do 10 reps for is awful. Problem is I havent made any progress towards my goals. When I have a bad workout, I just need to stick with that weight and concentrate on adding reps until I'm confident with it, then increase the weight.

Just need to stick at it.


----------



## Estoril-5

Squat 80kg
Bench 60kg
Rows 60kg

Deadlift was good. Bench I struggled but managed. Failed on the rows on the last few sets.


----------



## Estoril-5

Back is hurting a little today. Think I need a good stretch


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x6 PM 138kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x9,9,9,9,8
Pendlay Rows: 70x9,9,9,9,7

Good workout. Starting to work the reps back up. Think my body is getting used to the lower calories. Got a stag do this weekend which will probably kill progress lol.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) 45x5, 53x5, 60x5 PM 70kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,10,10
Neutral Grip Chins: BWx3,3,3,4,4

Well I would have been pleased with this workout normally, matching my heavy set and PRing on BBB sets but im even more impressed after a stag weekend. Not quite sure how i did it to be fair.

Chins were abit harder today.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x2 PM 170.5kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

So pleased with squats this week after the crap last week. I increased the weight and got extra reps. I was going to just do 1 rep but the 1 rep flew up so easily that I just had to go for another one. Going to stick at this weight until Ive finished my diet. With squats you can definitely get stronger by increasing your speed and your exertion rate so no need to keep increasing the weight just yet.

All these better workouts are following a stag weekend so this shows the effect that stress has on your body as I killed my body with a stupid amount of booze but the weekend was pure relaxation and fun so this must be why my workouts are going better.


----------



## Bokers

Deadlifts
60, 100, 120kg x 5
150, 160kg x 2
100kg x 5 x 3

Squats
40kg x 5 x 5

Viking Press
70, 60, 50kg x 5
40kg x 5 x 3

GHR 45Deg
BW x 5 x 5

Romeo Dunn.


----------



## V3nom

Just been getting properly back into the 5x5 over the last few weeks and feeling stronger now...

Squats // 90kgs // 5x5

OHP // 35kgs // 5x5

Deadlift // 90kgs // 5x5

Been at 90kgs on the squats for 2 sessions now and will probably stick for another session...OHP is the killer for me though


----------



## Leebo310

Bokers said:


> Deadlifts
> 60, 100, 120kg x 5
> 150, 160kg x 2
> 100kg x 5 x 3
> 
> Squats
> 40kg x 5 x 5
> 
> Viking Press
> 70, 60, 50kg x 5
> 40kg x 5 x 3
> 
> GHR 45Deg
> BW x 5 x 5
> 
> Romeo Dunn.


Nice deadlift there mate 👍


----------



## Jeli

I have converted half my tandem garage into a gym for when I can't get to the actual gym (or their power rack is in use!). Garage not wide enough for the car tbh. Thanks to ITHAQVA for the reviews on the CF475 and Olympic plates - it is what I have purchased.

On a calorie deficit so it's been tough and concentrating on getting my macros right.

Current bodyweight: 80.7Kg - goal 77Kg
Weight loss so far: 8Kg

Squats: 70, 80, 90, 100, 110Kg [5x5]
Bench: 60, 70, 80, 90, 92Kg [5x5]
OHP: 40, 50, 50, 50, 50Kg [5x5]
Deadlift: 120Kg [5x1]
BBB: 80, 90, 100, 100, 100Kg [5x5]

Struggling with bench at the moment... Also tend to throw chins in with the routine [3x5] and have a habit of working biceps and triceps at the end.


----------



## Jeli

Tonight's workout

Squats - 70, 80, 90, 100, 110kg 5x5
No improvement and still sore!

OHP - 40, 50, 52.5, 55, 60kg 5x5
Small increase with weight

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

Dead lift - 120kg 5x1, 140kg x1

(Reps x Sets)


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 92.5x5, 110x3) WO 130x3, 147.5x3, 167.5x3 PM 184kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, havent been eating very well lately so was pleased to increase the weight again.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - February - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 94KGX5 - 109KGX5 - 120KGX4*

Not bad, missed one rep on last set.

I've been inconsistent with my training due to being very busy recently but I'm determined to complete at least the main work sets for this month, then next month back to normal.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x7 PM 142kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x10,10,8,8,7
Inverted Rows: 3x6

I wanted 8 reps but I added 1 rep which isnt bad but this entire set was a grind, I was struggling from rep 3 so did pretty well to get 7. Strength was there but I was really slow.

This workout was strange as I got a ridiculous pump, like the biggest pump Ive got in months, must have been the slower reps which increased the Time Under Tension. I also did slow negatives on the inverted rows and this really makes a difference, felt awesome.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - March 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 140GX5 - 155KGX5 - 180KGX5*

My favourite lift  All pretty easy TBH so concentrated on technique :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

Tonight's workout

Squats - 70, 80, 90, 100, 110kg 5x5
Starting to feel more comfortable at 110kg and pausing at parallel for a little longer.

Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 95kg 5x5
Bench press feeling better tonight. Should have tried 100kg.

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

BBB- 80, 90, 100, 100, 100 5x5

(Reps x Sets)

Missed training yesterday as worked late. Pleased with tonight and looking somewhat more lean.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hypertrophy training

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT X10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS X10X10X10X10X10

OVERHEAD PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - (Plate strip) - 50x5 - 45x6 - 40x8 - 35x11 - 30x10 - Trained to within one or two reps short of failure :thumb:*

Rest -Dips and pull ups - no more than 3 minutes between sets.

OHP - Rest, just enough time to change disks and get a few breaths in 

I have changed this workout by increasing the intensity a little to help with muscle growth, I'm around 4 pounds short of 18 stone so I just as well reach that weight while I'm eating less and see if I can body recomp.

I will still aim to add weight to the dips and pull ups and use the OHP work to finally fry the upper body. There is also the added benefit of reduced rest improving cardiovascular fitness.

Whole workout felt good :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

This mornings workout

Squats - 70, 80, 90, 100, 112.5kg 5x5
Tiny increase

OHP - 40, 50, 60, 60, 60kg 5x5
Tried 65kg but that was not happening

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

Dead lift - 120kg 5x1

(Reps x Sets)

Don't usually work out at weekend but work in week kept me busy. Felt really tired and was running out of steam today.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> This mornings workout
> 
> Squats - 70, 80, 90, 100, 112.5kg 5x5
> Tiny increase
> 
> OHP - 40, 50, 60, 60, 60kg 5x5
> Tried 65kg but that was not happening
> 
> Chins - bodyweight 5x3
> 
> Dead lift - 120kg 5x1
> 
> (Reps x Sets)
> 
> Don't usually work out at weekend but work in week kept me busy. Felt really tired and was running out of steam today.


What are your goals Jeli ?


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> What are your goals Jeli ?


I've been weight training naturally over 12 years with 2 years off somewhere in there whilst I renovated the house. Hate to say it but I had been neglecting legs day for last several years.

When I first started at gym I was 8 stone body weight and eventually built up to 15 stone.

I'm also trying to balance work outs with my training buddy but he can only do once or twice a week. The home gym is getting more use as spending more time training alone.

Goal get down to 10% body fat but this is my first real cutting diet. I'm wanting to see what I've got in a more lean state.


----------



## Jeli

Training buddy was with me tonight but gym was rammed. So ended up using my home gym. Looks like this is going to be the case from now on.

Squats - 70, 80, 90, 100, 112.5kg 5x5
Legs were tired before starting but soon forgot and felt okay with the squats. After neglecting legs for a long time they are starting to build up.

Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 95kg 5x5
My weak area and annoyed this evening as 95kg felt tough unlike last bench session.

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

BBB- 80, 90, 100, 100, 100 5x5

(Reps x Sets)

No cardio yet and I'm losing weight which is nice. Currently at 176Ib. Thats something like 19Ib off me now since I started cutting. This evenings meal is two fillets of sea bass and broccoli!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - March 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 100KGX3 - 115KGX3 - 130KGX3*

Managed to finish work sets, training with a headache is just no fun at all :devil:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x2 PM 176kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

One of the best squat workouts Ive had in awhile. Except for a few reps Im starting to make the 120kg look stupidly easy. The reason for the best workout in awhile is my rens are visiting from the UK so means been eating a lot and have put weight back on, its amazing how my body reacts to workouts when I'm eating more calories than i need. Also my form felt awesome tonight, best its ever been.


----------



## Jeli

This evenings workout... had a cheeky CNP cherry almond bar 20 mins before as hadn't eaten enough. Love them!

Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
Legs getting stronger, muscle memory perhaps. Completely battered me tho and gave me the sick feeling.

OHP - 40, 50, 60, 60, 60kg 5x5
Decided to stay at this after the squats.

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

Dead lift - 125kg 5x1
Completely shattered but felt easy enough.

(Reps x Sets)

Finished with some bicep and tricep work on cable.

Well deserved 10oz rump steak and broccoli for evening meal.


----------



## ITHAQVA

After over 3 years of using the 5/3/1 and constantly lifting heavy I feel I need to cycle my training and not go heavy all the time (I know you told me so James ).

TBH I'm getting a bit bored of doing the same workout and after over three years solid 5/3/1 I think I can be forgiven in my boredom 

And one of the reasons for changing is not to confuse the muscles, which I think is a load of bullsheet, confuse the muscles my ass!!! REALLY?

Its all about keeping your motivation fresh that's key and my motivation has recently been poor, I'm just bored of lifting the same week in week out, I need fresh motivation :thumb: To take over three years before getting bored of a routine shows just how awesome the 5/3/1 is and it is.

The original 5/3/1 has given me a outstanding base strength and muscle mass level, if you haven't tried it do so for a few years. I will be going back to it after a few phases of Juggernaut that I am certain :thumb: 

As of April I will be trying out the Juggernaut method. I've been researching the program and as I agree with some that it may not be specifically targeted at high end powerlifting it does appeal to someone like myself with modest goals (Bench-150Kg, Squat-200Kg and Deadlift-230Kg) However it does give one the chance to train in cycles as would any competing powerlifter who wishes to stay in the game. The heavy lifting for over three years has tired out my motivation. I've also read loads of advice from the worlds best powerlifters and coaches and they all seem to be unanimous in the fact that training in cycles is a far better way to reach goals and maintain motivation in both mind and body. 

What I do like about the Juggernaut is by the end of each 4 month cycle you do get the opportunity to lift heavy and as each group of waves increases in weight your fourth month will within 8 months be heavy again.

I also like the hypertrophy aspect of the program, extra muscle = more leverage = lift more weight = Happy Me 

I'm also hoping the extra reps and intensity will aid me in my body re composition. I've reached nearly 18 stone and want to now reduce my body fat to around 12%-15%

Goals are the same - Strong - Big and healthy :thumb:

Time for me to get motivated and HATE THE WEIGHTS! again :devil:


----------



## Jeli

I can relate to the boredom and lack of motivation ITHAQVA.

For several years I trained with a guy at a gym who was into competing. I'd wait around after work for an hour and then go to the gym to meet up. Start a split routine at 7:30pm and finish at 9pm. I was getting home at 10pm where I'd eat and then have a shower. Then bed. It got to a point where I hated the gym and then had the 2 years off. My passion for lifting had gone.

Started back on split routine but moved to the 5x5 which I'm enjoying more. I can finish a workout far quicker and strength was up. Heck I'm even training legs again and enjoying that!

Please keep us posted on the Juggernaut method.

-----

Was busy with work again late on Friday so had to drop another Saturday training session in. Hadn't eaten great and I think the calorie deficit has caught up on me.

Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
Last set was tough and definitely not as easy as the mid week workout

Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 90kg* 5x5, 100Kg* 2x1
I attempted the 100Kg after first set of 90Kg. Dismal only achieving 2 reps before failure. So I returned to 90Kg and did another 5 reps. 

Chins - bodyweight 5x3

BBB- 60, 60, 60, 60 ,60Kg 5x5
This is where I completely run out of energy. So I stayed at 60Kg throughout.

(Reps x Sets) 

Not a great workout but body weight is dropping and getting more lean.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> I can relate to the boredom and lack of motivation ITHAQVA.
> 
> For several years I trained with a guy at a gym who was into competing. I'd wait around after work for an hour and then go to the gym to meet up. Start a split routine at 7:30pm and finish at 9pm. I was getting home at 10pm where I'd eat and then have a shower. Then bed. It got to a point where I hated the gym and then had the 2 years off. My passion for lifting had gone.
> 
> Started back on split routine but moved to the 5x5 which I'm enjoying more. I can finish a workout far quicker and strength was up. Heck I'm even training legs again and enjoying that!
> 
> Please keep us posted on the Juggernaut method.
> 
> -----
> 
> Was busy with work again late on Friday so had to drop another Saturday training session in. Hadn't eaten great and I think the calorie deficit has caught up on me.
> 
> Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
> Last set was tough and definitely not as easy as the mid week workout
> 
> Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 90kg* 5x5, 100Kg* 2x1
> I attempted the 100Kg after first set of 90Kg. Dismal only achieving 2 reps before failure. So I returned to 90Kg and did another 5 reps.
> 
> Chins - bodyweight 5x3
> 
> BBB- 60, 60, 60, 60 ,60Kg 5x5
> This is where I completely run out of energy. So I stayed at 60Kg throughout.
> 
> (Reps x Sets)
> 
> Not a great workout but body weight is dropping and getting more lean.


Hi Jeli,

I think the Juggernaut will work, its very similar too many routines and lets be honest, as long as you lift using the compound exercises and use progressive overload anything will work.

The Juggernaut has many possibilities. You can reduce the amount of months ie instead of 10,8,5,3 you can go 8,5,3 or 10,8,3 and so on. I like the idea of a slow build up to heavy weights and that you cycle up to them allowing joints and tendons keep up.

Its going to be hard going on the light stuff but I'll up the intensity to keep things interesting. You add weight with every rep over the prescribed last set so ill aim high and cap it at 10 over as recomended.

Given you can increase your working max by how many reps over the required, if I mange 20 reps on the 10's month my next 10's month will have a minimum increase of 5Kg on upper body!

You have the bare minimum option to use 0.5Kg (Upper body) and 1.13kg (Lower body) or can go full on with 1.13Kg (upper body) and 2.27Kg (Lower body) They seem small increments but if you take into account you times them by reps over prescribed you can make some pretty good increases in working weight. I'm going for max reps on the last work set to see just what can be achieved. I will be honest and say I'm sceptical that the high reps will carry over to a lot of extra strength.
I see the months as this:

Month 10: Mainly Conditioning followed by hypertrophy.
Month 8: Mainly Hypertrophy followed by a little strength.
Month 5: Mainly Strength followed by a little hypertrophy.
Month 3 Strength.

I see months 5 and 3 as the ones were maxing the reps on the last set will make for the greatest strength carry over. The program logically calls for less reps left in the tank as the phases reach the last (Realisation phase) As you can see if you can put more effort on the low rep weeks and increase the reps/intensity over prescribed this is were the program may come into its own :thumb:

Looking at the program I can see indirect benefits. The extra conditioning and muscle mass will in their own way help with strength building :thumb:

As your goal is body fat loss and on a deficit I'm not surprised your strength is failing you. Keep at it though mate :thumb: I'm lucky my body fat is high (20-25%) So I've been able to lift heavy for over 3 years with very few plateaus if any. I'll be using the juggernauts extra reps to burn extra calories :devil:

Well done on your bench, you may find that around 115Kg you'll have another sticking point as I did. My next one seems to be 140Kg I've been hovering around that weight for a few months now :wall: I managed 145Kg once last year then seemed to go back to the old faithful 140Kg which as you can imagine is really frustrating, but this game is a long term thing :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug I think the Juggernaut will serve you really well. As you know I completed it a number of years ago and put up some good numbers. The 1 Balls to the wall set once per month is awesome as thats what lifting is all about, setting PRs and it does really keep you motivated. 

I think with your long rest periods, this workout is going to kick your Ar$e (in a good way) as Chad Wesley Smith (CWS) suggests you rest on your main heavy exercise for 2:30 on upper body and 3 mins on lower body exercises.

Remember Doug, there is also more to 5/3/1 than BBB. I love the SSS workout as well and this little change of exercises can reignite your love for lifting as you have all these other exercises to progress on.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug I think the Juggernaut will serve you really well. As you know I completed it a number of years ago and put up some good numbers. The 1 Balls to the wall set once per month is awesome as thats what lifting is all about, setting PRs and it does really keep you motivated.
> 
> I think with your long rest periods, this workout is going to kick your Ar (in a good way) as Chad Wesley Smith (CWS) suggests you rest on your main heavy exercise for 2:30 on upper body and 3 mins on lower body exercises.
> 
> Remember Doug, there is also more to 5/3/1 than BBB. I love the SSS workout as well and this little change of exercises can reignite your love for lifting as you have all these other exercises to progress on.


I agree and think the 4 month cycles will be great for many aspects of my lifting.

That's a concern as my priority is pure strength. In regards rest I will look at it from a month to month basis and if need be use 5-7 minute rest intervals. Yes its not sticking to the routine 100% but all these routines including the 5/3/1 are generic and we should be looking at tailoring them to our individual needs.

Im thinking lowest rest on month one, 3 mins, working up to 5-7 mins on month four.

I will keep record of the months and hopefully there will be a trend were progress on certain rep ranges gives for better results, worth thinking about! :thumb:

Cheers for the spreadsheet James :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 10's phase Juggernaut Method V.2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 84KG4X10X10X10X10

BENCH PRESS 84KGX10+ =14
* 
BENCH PRESS 70KGx10x10x10x10x10
*
BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 5KGx10x10x10x10x9*

First day of the Juggernaut.

Rest periods used:
3 minutes between all exercises and 5 minutes used between the exercise sets marked *

Initial thoughts:
The 10 session tonight most definitely felt like hypertrophy training not too heavy but enough for the designated rep range and a good deal of pump felt particularly in upper body (arms/shoulders/chest/back)
Workout felt shorter and I estimate it was by about 20 minutes.
More of a sweat in this rep range, but on a positive note I didn't feel as broken as I do when lifting heavy/ I felt that I had recovered better during the workout. In fact I feel considerably recovered already while I type this :thumb:
I will stick to these rest periods for the 10's phase, I see no logic in hindering growth/progress for the sake of a bit of extra cardiovascular fitness when the 10's phase will already increase my conditioning.

I have a question for you James 

Its not overly clear about the working max, its just states thus

"MOVING UP YOUR WORKING MAX
This is the most important part of this program. Your working max will be
adjusted at the end of each wave depending on your performance during the
Realization Phase. For every rep you perform over the standard (The standard is
10 in the 10s Wave, 8 in the 8s Wave, etc) you will move your working max up a
set amount.

Does this mean and this is what I'm hoping, that you have the opportunity to treat each wave/month as a separate training routine and increase only the waves you over repped with? I would see a logic to this as it would allow for progress on all waves/months and not allow a month/wave that didn't go particularly well to hold back the whole 4 month cycle.

Either way it is my intention to do this 

Overall, day 1 was good and I'm keen to keep to it. I liked it James! :doublesho  :thumb:
I would like to go through the Juggernaut for 8 months/2 full wave cycles. If all goes well then stick with it until the end of this year. If it produces good results then continue with it as I can see many health and muscle building benefits from this type of cycle training :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Yes Doug this program is based on performance which is good as who says that someone will only get 2.5kg per month stronger on an exercise. If you have a good month on Juggernaut then you could increase your Working Max by say 10kg.

The spreadsheet I sent you calculates all this for you. Put in your preferred increasements in the top left, then put the reps in the Yellow box above Goal reps and it will calculate your next months Working weight. If you dont hit the required reps then it wont increase, if you smash them then it will increase a lot. Goal reps, just go along and make sure the % figure below is above 5% and lower the reps if its to high. Trying to write a formula to do this automatically.

I put the goal box there as your minimum reps you need to keep 5% between your working weight and projected max. You should be looking to smash this figure by as much as possible.

What you say about feeling recovered, well this is the beauty of Juggernaut as its block periodization so 
Week One: High Volume, Medium-Low Intensity (Accumulation)
Week Two: Medium Volume, Medium-High Intensity (Intensification)
Week Three: Low Volume, High Intensity (Realization)
Week Four: Low Volume, Low Intensity (Deload)

The first 2 weeks get you ready for that week 3 assault.

Deadlifts: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x3 PM 187kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, 170 was pretty easy except nearly lost my grip which is strange. BBB sets were abit slow on the last few reps so will keep the weight here for a little while until I bring my speed up.


----------



## Jeli

Thanks ITHAQVA for the info on Juggernaut. I may introduce this later on in the year and look forwards to seeing how it works for you.

I have benched up to 120Kg and squat 160Kg for reps a number of years ago. Back then I had a job where I could eat all day and train often! Happy days. Whilst I was much bigger with my physique my body fat was high. I don't think I will get near to those kind of weights for a long time. I'll be happy with 100Kg bench press being comfortable and 140Kg squats when I perhaps try a lean bulk later in the year.

----

Yesterdays evening workout

Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
120Kg wasn't easy but it is getting easier

OHP - 40, 50, 60, 62.5, 62.5kg 5x5
Small increase on the last two sets and it felt okay

Chins - bodyweight 5x3
These are getting really easy so either more reps or added weight

Dead lift - 125kg 5x1
Was comfortable and perhaps should have gone heavier

(Reps x Sets)

Again finished off with some cable bicep and tricep work. Pleased with the toning up and definition making it look like my arms are actually bigger than what the are. Stomach is also shaping up well with lower abs appearing.

Evening meal was two fillets of sea bass (50g protein) and mixed veg.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 10's phase Juggernaut Method V.2

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 110X3) - 130KG4X10X10X10X10

DEADLIFT 130KGX10+ = 11*

Felt tired all day from yesterdays workout, but cannot take a days rest as I have two IT callouts Wed/Thur

Done the Deadlift session none the less 

Not sure why but the workout was difficult, not in a heavy way but by the last 10+ set I was finding it difficult to get enough air in my lungs  The 3 minute rest periods didn't feel enough but I will stick with it :thumb: lower back felt very fatigued/pumped, I'm not sure its a good idea to do more deadlifts on the assistance work. Might just do RDL's after.

Juggernaut will most certainly build muscle and improve cardiovascular fitness :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x7 PM 142kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x10,10,8,7,5
Inverted Rows: 5x5

Shame not to increase my Bench Press reps but the 7 reps felt better than last week and there was maybe a chance that I could have got 8 was I wasnt 100% sure so I left it.

Im starting to wonder if its the Powerade Ive started drinking during workouts now but I got another incredible pump this week. Like i could even reach across and touch my left arm sort of pump. Maybe its also because of the slow negative inverted rows I have been doing between the BBB sets so my back and biceps are pumped as well. Just seems weird as havent been this pumped in years.

Didnt make any progress this week but still felt like a good workout. If I dont hit the 8 reps soon then i will deload and work back up from there.


----------



## Jeli

I very nearly skipped tonight's session. Had an early night last night and felt worse for it today. From somewhere I found motivation and got myself in the right frame of mind. To achieve my goals I cannot skip sessions unless It's a good enough reason. This wasn't.

Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
During mid lift at 100 I decided my form was out. Not a great idea as I adjusted and my back let me know it was a stupid idea. Just a twinge on one rep.

Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 100kg* 5x5
Ok I only got *4 reps at 100kg. I then had a minute rest and did another 2 reps at this weight.

Chins - bodyweight* 3x8
* On the final set I stopped at 7 reps.

BBB- 70, 70, 70, 70, 70Kg 5x5
Bench and chins had sapped my energy and strength. Not much left by the time I got here.

(Reps x Sets)

Back on the steak tonight.


----------



## JMorty

Wow, some heavy lifters here!!!

I've just started this but probably not gunna post for a while lol.

So much great info here, can't wait to get where you guys are!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 (Session 3)

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT (113.5Kg) + 2.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS BODYWEIGHT (113.5Kg) + 5KGX10X10X10X10X10*

As you can see I'm not following the Juggernaut for session 3. Just going to stick to some good old body weight exercises and I think next week I'll start to add Barbell rows.

Must admit trying to force myself to train light last time was really difficult, I'm not sure if it was ego, pride or me just being stubborn. This time is very different I'm ready for a change and I'm beginning to enjoy the Juggernaut. I still feel it will have benefits in this years strength training.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Wow, some heavy lifters here!!!
> 
> I've just started this but probably not gunna post for a while lol.
> 
> So much great info here, can't wait to get where you guys are!


Doesn't matter if your a beginner or have been training for a while, your very welcome to post here mate. We all started with an empty bar :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Doesn't matter if your a beginner or have been training for a while, your very welcome to post here mate. We all started with an empty bar :thumb:


Aw , thanks buddy! 

I'm currently doing 5x5's at least once a week and Giants at least twice for a bit of targeted bulk (...I love the pump and fatigue too lol)

My last was Wednesday:

Weight 69.2kg

SQUAT
45kg x5x5x5x5x5

BENCH PRESS 
34kg x5x5x5x5x5

BARBELL ROW
43kg x5x5x5x5x5

Today was Giant

Chest 4x4

Press 12kg x10x4
Fly 10kg x10x4
Inc. press 12kg x10x4
Press ups...as many as I can do. About 20 was the max after that. lol

Back 3x3

Bent over barbell row 32.5kg x10x3
Tbar row 24.5kg x10x3
Cable row 32kg x10x3

Really trying to put some size on!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Aw , thanks buddy!
> 
> I'm currently doing 5x5's at least once a week and Giants at least twice for a bit of targeted bulk (...I love the pump and fatigue too lol)
> 
> My last was Wednesday:
> 
> Weight 69.2kg
> 
> SQUAT
> 45kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> BENCH PRESS
> 34kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> BARBELL ROW
> 43kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Today was Giant
> 
> Chest 4x4
> 
> Press 12kg x10x4
> Fly 10kg x10x4
> Inc. press 12kg x10x4
> Press ups...as many as I can do. About 20 was the max after that. lol
> 
> Back 3x3
> 
> Bent over barbell row 32.5kg x10x3
> Tbar row 24.5kg x10x3
> Cable row 32kg x10x3
> 
> Really trying to put some size on!!!


If you truly want to put size on I would forget complication follow the 5x5 for the specified three times a week until your at the level the program tells you to move on (Cant remember what the totals are when you do this, check the stronglifts site out for info)

You will also need to eat, this will also mean body fat will increase. Lean bulking is a very long term slow approach and I mean years!

Don't allow ego take over and force you to think doing all those extra sets on upper body will speed up the process, the body is a whole, train it so for maximum size increases and more importantly symmetry.

:thumb:


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> Must admit trying to force myself to train light last time was really difficult, I'm not sure if it was ego, pride or me just being stubborn. This time is very different I'm ready for a change and I'm beginning to enjoy the Juggernaut. I still feel it will have benefits in this years strength training.
> 
> :thumb:


I completely get what you are saying about training light. I remember coming back from a rhomboid injury and hated that I had to start over.



JMorty said:


> Aw , thanks buddy!
> 
> I'm currently doing 5x5's at least once a week and Giants at least twice for a bit of targeted bulk (...I love the pump and fatigue too lol)
> 
> Really trying to put some size on!!!


Don't worry about posting on here JMorty. The guys are willing to chime in with good advice.

As ITHAQVA said we all started on an empty bar! Also remember do the weights that work for you. Don't pay attention to what others are lifting around you. You may build more off a lesser weight than what someone else might. Always keep good form for the exercise being performed rather than throwing weights around that are too heavy.

When I started I struggled to gain weight and found I needed 5000cals a day. Yes my body fat jumped up but not excessively. It also enabled me to build good muscle mass.


----------



## Jeli

Decided yesterday I was too tired to train and the extra days rest would be useful. So that meant training this evening. Had visitors which then meant I trained on only 600cals. Was tough, was tiring and I was out of breath. No increase on weights but the same as Monday's routine.

I did use a belt for the first time in ages on squats. Felt uncomfortable but I'll try it on the next session.

So rather than type the same thing as Monday, here's some pics of my garage gym :thumb:

eBay purchase - 40Kg, 47.5Kg and 50Kg



eBay purchase again for the fixed dumbbells. Sadly only one 20Kg. From 7.5Kg upto 30Kg.



CF475



Dips



All my cable accessories



The FID bench which I find a bit narrow



Rubber matting from Endurance mats in Coventry - 18mm thick 6' x 4'. I have 6 of these.



The pulley system with selector weights on the CF475





The Oly plate clock so I can keep an eye on the workout time


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> Decided yesterday I was too tired to train and the extra days rest would be useful. So that meant training this evening. Had visitors which then meant I trained on only 600cals. Was tough, was tiring and I was out of breath. No increase on weights but the same as Monday's routine.
> 
> I did use a belt for the first time in ages on squats. Felt uncomfortable but I'll try it on the next session.
> 
> So rather than type the same thing as Monday, here's some pics of my garage gym :thumb:
> 
> eBay purchase - 40Kg, 47.5Kg and 50Kg
> 
> 
> 
> eBay purchase again for the fixed dumbbells. Sadly only one 20Kg. From 7.5Kg upto 30Kg.
> 
> 
> 
> CF475
> 
> 
> 
> Dips
> 
> 
> 
> All my cable accessories
> 
> 
> 
> The FID bench which I find a bit narrow
> 
> 
> 
> Rubber matting from Endurance mats in Coventry - 18mm thick 6' x 4'. I have 6 of these.
> 
> 
> 
> The pulley system with selector weights on the CF475
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Oly plate clock so I can keep an eye on the workout time


Snap! :wave: 

Power rack: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211

Olympic weights: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 10's phase Juggernaut Method V.2

*SQUAT (WU 80X5 90X5 100X3) - 114KG4X10X10X10X10*

Used three minute rest periods, very difficult! By the time I finished set 4 it took me ages to steady my breathing, in fact straight after the fourth it was incredibly difficult to get enough air in my lungs :doublesho

I do have a question though. If strength followed by muscle growth are my primary goals. Why not increase the rest periods between sets? This would allow for better recovery and the ability to handle heavier weights for higher reps.

I obviously see the benefit of improving fitness - but does this truly carry over to heavy lifting?

The pre exhaustion caused by the main sets will also reduce greatly the weight that can be used in the assistance work, again can someone explain the benefit of this?

Have no fear I intend to stick with the Juggernaut for at least the 4 month cycle, as im hoping by the end of it I will be feeling the benefits of being able to tolerate the higher intensity approach, which in turn will spurn me on to stay with the program. My legs are like jelly! Completing todays four sets was harder than a whole 5/3/1 session :doublesho


----------



## Bod42

Juggernaut is set up more for athletes Doug so the shorter rest periods will benefit them more than the longer rest periods. But saying this, CWS got to a 900lb+ squat using these rest periods so it cant be all bad. 

Also I still recon for you that in the long run this will be far better as one of the easiest ways to build muscle is to play with the rest periods and a lot of top trainers suggest that you increase your GPP to allow you to handle more work. Remember that this is block periodization and how long since you've really done a volume phase so this will prob kick your ar$e for the first few weeks.

And as for the assistance sets, they are exactly that, assistance. Your not going to get to the end of the program and boast about how you improved your assistance exercises but nothing else. The program is about increasing the big 4.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Juggernaut is set up more for athletes Doug so the shorter rest periods will benefit them more than the longer rest periods. But saying this, CWS got to a 900lb+ squat using these rest periods so it cant be all bad.
> 
> Also I still recon for you that in the long run this will be far better as one of the easiest ways to build muscle is to play with the rest periods and a lot of top trainers suggest that you increase your GPP to allow you to handle more work. Remember that this is block periodization and how long since you've really done a volume phase so this will prob kick your ar for the first few weeks.
> 
> And as for the assistance sets, they are exactly that, assistance. Your not going to get to the end of the program and boast about how you improved your assistance exercises but nothing else. The program is about increasing the big 4.


Thanks for the reply James :thumb:

It is most certainly kicking my ar$e on the squat and deadlift workouts! :devil:

And I'm up for improving my GPP, I can see validity in improving overall fitness which in turn will alow me to handle more weight.

I've also noticed straight away that my body is digesting my meals a lot quicker, so this program, due to higher reps lower rest period (Intensity) will help me reduce some body fat.

No matter what I'm committed to finishing the first 4 month cycle before judging the program :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> Snap! :wave:
> 
> Power rack: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=235211
> 
> Olympic weights: http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=243372


That's what made me order them, good write up :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
Used the belt again and think it helps me on the 120s.

Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 100kg* 5x5
Ok I only got *4 reps at 100kg. I then had a minute rest and did another 2 reps. Gutted really thought I'd get the 5 today.

Chins - bodyweight* 3x8

BBB- 70, 70, 70, 70, 70Kg 5x5

(Reps x Sets)

I'm still losing weight so shall keep going. Definitely hit a point where it's having an impact on my training. Tougher every week at same weight.

I feel like chicken tonight


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> Squats - 80, 90, 100, 110, 120kg 5x5
> Used the belt again and think it helps me on the 120s.
> 
> Bench - 60, 70, 80, 90, 100kg* 5x5
> Ok I only got *4 reps at 100kg. I then had a minute rest and did another 2 reps. Gutted really thought I'd get the 5 today.
> 
> Chins - bodyweight* 3x8
> 
> BBB- 70, 70, 70, 70, 70Kg 5x5
> 
> (Reps x Sets)
> 
> I'm still losing weight so shall keep going. Definitely hit a point where it's having an impact on my training. Tougher every week at same weight.
> 
> I feel like chicken tonight


It is personal preference but IMHO wearing a belt is detrimental to core strength and lets be honest a belt wont stop an injury.

I've got CHICKEN for lunch! :argie: Beef sticks for breakfast, ****les around 3-4pm then home for Tea.............Pork chops and finally some quark for late night protein hit


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> It is personal preference but IMHO wearing a belt is detrimental to core strength and lets be honest a belt wont stop an injury.
> 
> I've got CHICKEN for lunch! :argie: Beef sticks for breakfast, ****les around 3-4pm then home for Tea.............Pork chops and finally some quark for late night protein hit


The belt made me feel more solid but it is all in the head as I've been doing the squats without it too. I also find I have to train in front of a mirror. Not through vanity (much) but watching form.

Chicken is in my lunchtime diet every day - 6oz and with Basmati rice on training days.

Started this morning with a CNP bar and a few almonds. Evening meal likely to be fish, maybe steak or an omelette.

What beef sticks are these? I don't get up early enough to have a proper breakie so instant is usually the way, like the CNP bar.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> The belt made me feel more solid but it is all in the head as I've been doing the squats without it too. I also find I have to train in front of a mirror. Not through vanity (much) but watching form.
> 
> Chicken is in my lunchtime diet every day - 6oz and with Basmati rice on training days.
> 
> Started this morning with a CNP bar and a few almonds. Evening meal likely to be fish, maybe steak or an omelette.
> 
> What beef sticks are these? I don't get up early enough to have a proper breakie so instant is usually the way, like the CNP bar.


Beef sticks (just like bigger beef Jerky/Biltong) if you buy 30 bags (£50 inc P&P) cost £1.66 per bag, each bag contains 50gm protein :devil: Grass fed beef etc...
I split one bag into two meals 25gm per portion consumed at 9am every morning Mon to Fri


----------



## ITHAQVA

De load

*BENCH PRESS (WU 20X5 30X5 40X3) - 50KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 50KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Back to de load this week so I can get back in sync. Last weeks week 1 of the juggernaut will be repeated next week.


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> Beef sticks (just like bigger beef Jerky/Biltong) if you buy 30 bags (£50 inc P&P) cost £1.66 per bag, each bag contains 50gm protein :devil: Grass fed beef etc...
> I split one bag into two meals 25gm per portion consumed at 9am every morning Mon to Fri


That's a good protein hit! Think the prices may have gone up with delivery on top. May buy some if there is an offer on at some point.


----------



## Jeli

This evenings work out was so tough. It left me feeling a bit ill. This cutting diet is definitely now making me work to keep pushing the same weights. I've even considered going back to maintenance calories and taking a break!

I'm around 4Ib off my target weight but not as defined as I thought I would be. Definitely I can see changes but was expecting more at this stage.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> This evenings work out was so tough. It left me feeling a bit ill. This cutting diet is definitely now making me work to keep pushing the same weights. I've even considered going back to maintenance calories and taking a break!
> 
> I'm around 4Ib off my target weight but not as defined as I thought I would be. Definitely I can see changes but was expecting more at this stage.


I would just halt your progress while you cut. You wont lose much strength. What you do lose you'll very quickly regain :thumb:


----------



## Kimo

I'm not that strong yet but hit the gym 3 times a week

I do like 16 reps on everything though :lol:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Kimo73 said:


> I'm not that strong yet but hit the gym 3 times a week
> 
> *I do like 16 reps on everything though *:lol:


And that is why your not very strong :lol:


----------



## Kimo

ITHAQVA said:


> And that is why your not very strong :lol:


Weight loss needed before building too much muscle 

My back and legs are strong, just need to work more on chest/shoulders haha

Do boxing the other nights of the week so tone up through that too


----------



## ITHAQVA

De load

*DEFICIT DEADLIFT (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 70KGX10X10X10X10X10

RDL 40KGX10X10X10X10X10*

In and out weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!


----------



## Bod42

Kimo73 said:


> Weight loss needed before building too much muscle
> 
> My back and legs are strong, just need to work more on chest/shoulders haha
> 
> Do boxing the other nights of the week so tone up through that too


Its a strange misconception that higher reps burn more calories. Its been proven that you should stay on your muscle building/strength workouts while dieting so you dont lose any muscle.


----------



## Kimo

Bod42 said:


> Its a strange misconception that higher reps burn more calories. Its been proven that you should stay on your muscle building/strength workouts while dieting so you dont lose any muscle.


That is my workout plan that I was given from a trainer so I just stick to it tbh

Can't be doing too bad as I've lost over 3 stone and been toning up too so does the trick


----------



## Leebo310

Kimo73 said:


> That is my workout plan that I was given from a trainer so I just stick to it tbh
> 
> Can't be doing too bad as I've lost over 3 stone and been toning up too so does the trick


Exactly mate, if you're enjoying it and seeing results then just stick with your current programme! 
Good work by the way, 3 stone loss is impressive 👍


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x2 PM 176kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Back to proper lifting. Parents were over for 3 weeks so lifting has been abit slack but back at it fully now. Decided to not diet for the next few weeks. Try and hit a few PRs as Im only a few weeks away from new records and then will go back to the diet.


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> I would just halt your progress while you cut. You wont lose much strength. What you do lose you'll very quickly regain :thumb:


It makes sense why I was feeling so rough during the work out. I've been struck by deadly man flu and somehow had hiccups for 2 days :lol:

Will be taking time off training so that I can get rid asap.


----------



## V3nom

I'm pretty gutted tbh...was loving the 5x5 and felt like my strength was really improving but I'm going in for an operation on Wednesday and I've been told I can't do anything (gym, football, the other...) for about 4-6 weeks 

Bit of a set-back but gives me time to plan out my new routine


----------



## Bod42

V3nom said:


> I'm pretty gutted tbh...was loving the 5x5 and felt like my strength was really improving but I'm going in for an operation on Wednesday and I've been told I can't do anything (gym, football, the other...) for about 4-6 weeks
> 
> Bit of a set-back but gives me time to plan out my new routine


Unless its personal, what kind of Op mate. Have you looked up prehab and rehab to get you back fully fit ASAP. The doctors will not tell you this stuff.



Jeli said:


> It makes sense why I was feeling so rough during the work out. I've been struck by deadly man flu and somehow had hiccups for 2 days :lol:
> 
> Will be taking time off training so that I can get rid asap.


Ya you will do extremely well to diet and hit PRs, body needs surplus of calories to build muscle/strength but a diet needs a Deficit so your trying to do to many things at once. Better to decide on a goal and hammer it until you reach the goal and then decide on another one. In the words of Jim Wendler "My advice to everyone is to pick one goal you want to focus on and go for it. Don't be that guy who wants to get into shape like a fighter, compete in a powerlifting meet, lose 40 pounds of fat, and get stronger - all at once, and usually in 8 weeks. Pick one thing you want and go for it. All in. No compromises." I actually like to take about 90% of my weight for my diet phase and just maintain my strength as this stops you getting disheartened when your weights drop and places a lot of stress on your body. Last diet phase, I used this approach and basically lost no strength.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 60x7 PM 74kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,8,7,6
Chin Ups: BWx3,3,4,3,3

I need 61kgx8 for a PM record so getting real close. The heavy set obviously had an impact on my strength as my BBB sets were the worst yet. I'm coming up to a deload week so may look at jumping across to the SSS workout but will wait and see. Progress seems to have stalled on all exercises on BBB. This isnt program jumping either as i would have done 21 weeks on BBB if I do change.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Juggernaut 10's

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 84KG4X10X10X10X10

BENCH PRESS 84KGX12

BENCH PRESS 70KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS BODYWEIGHT +5KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good enough workout, feels totally bizarre lifting such light weights. However, I think that if I improve my fitness, flexibility, reduce body fat and build some muscle it will help when I'm back on the heavier workouts.

I've been reading Beyond 5/3/1 and it has some very interesting variations of the 5/3/1 which I'm itching to try


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Juggernaut 10's

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 110X3) - 130KG4X10X10X10X10

DEADLIFT 130KGX11

SNATCH GRIP DEADLIFT 70KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Not bad, definitely feeling easier to complete :thumb:
Added some speed work. Nice light and easy snatch grip deadlifts :thumb: I will add a reps until I get to 5 sets of 10 then add 5 sets of vertical jumps or RDL's.

Sort of getting used to this way of lifting and no matter how much I moan, I'm going to stick to this 4 month cycle as I feel it will give me a great opportunity to improve fitness and flexibility. I also think once I complete this 4 month cycle it would be a good idea to switch between the Juggernaut and 5/3/1.

Something like:

Month 1 - 5/3/1 
Month 2 - Juggernaut 10's
Month 3 - 5/3/1
Month 4 - Juggernaut 8's

Then go back to month 1 and so on. IMHO this would give me multiple benefits, strength, hypertrophy, fat los, flexibility, speed work and fitness.


----------



## Jeli

V3nom said:


> I'm pretty gutted tbh...was loving the 5x5 and felt like my strength was really improving but I'm going in for an operation on Wednesday and I've been told I can't do anything (gym, football, the other...) for about 4-6 weeks
> 
> Bit of a set-back but gives me time to plan out my new routine


That's bad news but rest up and come back with extra motivation.



Bod42 said:


> Ya you will do extremely well to diet and hit PRs, body needs surplus of calories to build muscle/strength but a diet needs a Deficit so your trying to do to many things at once. Better to decide on a goal and hammer it until you reach the goal and then decide on another one. In the words of Jim Wendler "My advice to everyone is to pick one goal you want to focus on and go for it. Don't be that guy who wants to get into shape like a fighter, compete in a powerlifting meet, lose 40 pounds of fat, and get stronger - all at once, and usually in 8 weeks. Pick one thing you want and go for it. All in. No compromises." I actually like to take about 90% of my weight for my diet phase and just maintain my strength as this stops you getting disheartened when your weights drop and places a lot of stress on your body. Last diet phase, I used this approach and basically lost no strength.


Very true that quote from Jim Wendler. Definitely keeping strength motivates me but it's nice to see the body with more definition. Seems I underestimated how much body weight I had to lose before reaching the physique in my mind. I'm no longer looking big on a small frame, more small on a tiny frame. A decent amount of muscle retained but concerning how much more dieting I may need to do. At one point I was tipping the scales at 15 stone (5' 8) and I'm nearly at 12 stone right now.

Sadly still out of training with a cold and still have hiccups!!! The hiccups started on Sunday (how crazy is that) and I've now been prescribed chlorpromazine. Not wanting to take these as doc said they are harsh so will see the week out and hope it cures itself.


----------



## Kimo

Just been doing gvt, I'm pooped


----------



## V3nom

Bod42 said:


> Unless its personal, what kind of Op mate. Have you looked up prehab and rehab to get you back fully fit ASAP. The doctors will not tell you this stuff.


Hydrocele repair  had it done today...perfecting my John Wayne stance lol I will need to look into that as the doc just said no heavy lifting for 2-3 weeks lol


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 97.5x5, 115x3) WO 135x3, 155x3, 172.5x3 PM 189.5kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5
Ab Roll Outs: BWx3,3,3

Good workout. Another workout where I completed my reps. Getting abit harder now but this is weight lifting, not suppose to be easy so Im just going to keep pushing forward on this exercise. The extra volume with the back off sets definitely seems to help me.

Doug I might join you later this year on Juggernaut but already have a plan at the moment. The 10s phase might actually be really good for the bench press test Im going to do so maybe I will switch to Juggernaut in a few weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug I might join you later this year on Juggernaut but already have a plan at the moment. The 10s phase might actually be really good for the bench press test Im going to do so maybe I will switch to Juggernaut in a few weeks.


You don't need to join me James.....I've not fallen apart yet :tumbleweed: 

All jokes aside though mate. I think the Juggernaut is a great way to improve conditioning, I'm already feeling positive effects, I feel more mobile and less tight and muscled bound (if that makes any sense)

I will be following a 5/3/1 - Juggernaut cycle after this four month Juggernaut cycle as I can see major benefits via a more balanced approach to strength training - Power/size/fitness/flexibility etc...

Don't get me wrong my goals are the same.

So close to 18 stone now :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Session 3

*DIPS (WARM UP WITH BODYWEIGHT AND BLUE BANDx10x10x10x10)

DIPS BODYWEIGHT 113.45Kg + 2.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS BODYWEIGHT 113.45Kg+7.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 70KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Dips: Felt very good :thumb:

The added weight is cancelling out more of the assistance the blue band is providing on the pull ups :devil: I would not be surprised if I have to really start working for my reps next week :thumb:

Barbell Row: I have missed this lift and its good to have it back in my routine 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 -Juggernaut 10's

*SQUAT (WU 80X5 90X5 100X3) - 114KGX10X10X10X10

SQUAT 114KGX11

LOW SQUAT 70KGX5*

Pleased I made the work sets this time, I used 4 minutes rest between sets. Last time I barely finished the fourth set, I also felt more recovered after the workout this time around :thumb:

Have added low squats (Well below parallel were my legs touch my stomach and chest at the bottom of the lift :thumb to help with flexibility and strength at the bottom of the squat. I hope as my fitness improves that I can build up to 5 sets of 5 reps then add weight.

Not feeling so disgruntled about using such light weights now :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: WO 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x8 PM 145.5kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x9,9,7,6,5
Inverted Rows: BWx5,5,5,5,5

Good workout. Got the reps I was aiming for which is good. getting close to a PR now. The BBB sets suffered as i used a lot of energy on heavy bench but technique felt a lot better today.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - Juggernaut 10's

*BENCH (WU 40X5 50X5 60X3) - 77KGX5 - 87.5KGX5 - 94.5KGX10X10 - 94.5KG1X10

BENCH PRESS 70KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS BODYWEIGHT 113.45Kg+10KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good enough workout, didn't manage to make any reps over the designated amount on last work set which sucked especially at a measly 94.5Kg :wall:!

Pull ups are starting to feel like I'm going to have to work for my reps soon.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: WO 77.5x5, 87.5x4, 102.5x3, 115x2, 130x1, 115x8 PM 145.5kg
> BBB Sets: 77.5x9,9,7,6,5
> Inverted Rows: BWx5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Good workout. Got the reps I was aiming for which is good. getting close to a PR now. The BBB sets suffered as i used a lot of energy on heavy bench but technique felt a lot better today.


:thumb: Nice bench total James :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> :thumb: Nice bench total James :thumb:


Thanks mate, its getting back up there. Going to jump to 120kg now and just start with say 4 reps and just concentrate on adding reps each week until i hit my goal.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Form felt miles better tonight, just concentrated on really taking a big breath and holding my air tight, seemed to make a big difference. Going to jump to 170kg and just work from 1 rep up to 5 reps and see where that leaves me. Seems to be doing well just trying to add reps each week, very simple wokrout plan and Im sure i will have to deload eventually as cant keep up this type of lifting up forever but at the moment it is working well. Will probably take a leaf out of SL5x5 book and if I dont improve my reps for 3 workouts in a row then I will deload and work back up.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - Juggernaut 10's

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 120KGX5 - 134KGX5 - 145KGX10X10

DEADLIFT 145KGX12

SNATCH GRIP DEADLIFT 110KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Good workout, had a good deal of DOMS from Sundays squat session so wasn't expecting much tonight, but all went well :thumb:

Moved the snatch grip deadlift up to 110Kg, increased the difficulty.

I'll be using the snatch grip deadlift on the 5/3/1 cycles as well :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 60x4 PM 68kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,10,6
Chin Ups: BWx3,3,3,3,3

Well completely fell off the wagon tonight, got 7 last week so wanted 8 this week and only got 4. This was more to do with messing arnd with my form tho, tried to widen my stance to feel more stable on the top set which was just stupid.

I will have one more try at hitting my rep goals and then this exercise is definitely due a deload. Been grinding for way to long now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 60x4 PM 68kg
> BBB Sets: 35x10,10,10,10,6
> Chin Ups: BWx3,3,3,3,3
> 
> Well completely fell off the wagon tonight, got 7 last week so wanted 8 this week and only got 4. This was more to do with messing arnd with my form tho, tried to widen my stance to feel more stable on the top set which was just stupid.
> 
> I will have one more try at hitting my rep goals and then this exercise is definitely due a deload. Been grinding for way to long now.


I wouldn't worry too much about OHP strength variation James. Its such a technical lift that the muscles involved can vary from session to session and effect your overall progress. I also think that it is such a difficult lift to master that progress should be done in smaller increments - 1kg per month. In all my years lifting, the OHP has always been one of those lifts that varies greatly from session to session. Hence why I primarily used the seated behind neck press as my lift of choice in my youth, I had a 180kg bench then and felt the behind neck press did have greater carryover due to targeting a more specific group of muscles for overall strength in the bench press. I am considering trialling the seated behind neck press again once I finish the juggernaut cycle.

For me personally I would rather do my session 3 exercises (Pull ups, dips and barbell row) than an OHP session. Reason being that I soon found I wasn't able to use enough weight for any carryover. I believe that the lifts on session 3 will be great for more power :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Session 3

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT (WU BWx10x10x10x10) + 5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS BODY WEIGHT (114.54Kg) +12.5KGX10X10X10X10X6

BARBELL ROW 80KGX5X5X5X5X5*

All good. Adding 12.5kg to my bodyweight is cancelling out a good amount of assistance from the band now and the reps are gradually getting harder. It will be interesting to see just how good an assistance band is for building up to unassisted pull ups :thumb:

I am now officially over 18 Stone :doublesho :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - Juggernaut 10's

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 70KGX5 - 84KGX3 - 98KGX1 - 105KGX8

BENCH PRESS 70KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS +12.5KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Disappointed I only made 8 reps on the 105Kg, although according to the projected 1 rep max calculator my 1 rep max is 133Kg. Not too far away from my actual lifted 1 rep maxes which range between 135-145Kg. Happy I made 5 sets of 10 reps on the pull ups.

Still happy to complete the 4 month juggernaut :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 - Juggernaut 10's
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 70KGX5 - 84KGX3 - 98KGX1 - 105KGX8
> 
> BENCH PRESS 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
> 
> BLUE BAND PULLUPS +12.5KGX10X10X10X10X10*
> 
> Disappointed I only made 8 reps on the 105Kg, although according to the projected 1 rep max calculator my 1 rep max is 133Kg. Not too far away from my actual lifted 1 rep maxes which range between 135-145Kg. Happy I made 5 sets of 10 reps on the pull ups.
> 
> Still happy to complete the 4 month juggernaut :thumb:


Doug wasnt this your 10s week though? I presume you will just keep the weight the same for your 8s week as you didnt get anything over 10 reps. And did you start at 90% of predicted max as the 10s should be quite easy to get if its based off 90%.

Deadlifts: (WU 77.5x5, 97.5x5, 120x3) WO 137.5x3, 155x3, 175x3 PM 192.5kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Hardest workout yet, not grinding the weight but this was really close to my maximum. Just need 5kg more to hit a PR and then I will change my workout as my body is feeling really beat up on this program at the moment, its to much heavy lifting to be on long term and I need to move to something with higher reps to give my body a break. So hoping to hit PRs on all exercises and then I can increase my reps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug wasnt this your 10s week though? I presume you will just keep the weight the same for your 8s week as you didnt get anything over 10 reps. And did you start at 90% of predicted max as the 10s should be quite easy to get if its based off 90%.
> 
> Hardest workout yet, not grinding the weight but this was really close to my maximum. Just need 5kg more to hit a PR and then I will change my workout as my body is feeling really beat up on this program at the moment, its to much heavy lifting to be on long term and I need to move to something with higher reps to give my body a break. So hoping to hit PRs on all exercises and then I can increase my reps.


Hi James,
Yep its my 10's wave, this is the last week, de load next week then the 8's wave. I calculated my bench from 140Kg, so no I used my 100%, 90% would have given me 94Kg and yes I would have made more reps. However I'm still getting used to a very different style of lifting. I'm going to be mixing juggernaut with 5/3/1 after this four month cycle, perhaps you should do something similar so your not over taxing the body all the time :thumb:

The juggernaut is building muscle which will add more leverage :thumb:

I know how you feel mate, after over 3.5 years of heavy lifting on the 5/3/1 I really needed a break, I can deny though I miss heavy training


----------



## L4Isoside

ITHAQVA said:


> I know how you feel mate, after over 3.5 years of heavy lifting on the 5/3/1 I really needed a break, I can deny though I miss heavy training


I did a 5x5 with weight increments every other workout which became brutal.

Then I lost some strength due to other reasons and my mains lifts dropped a few kg's then carried on with 5/3/1, on my 6th cycle and its brilliant. :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James,
> Yep its my 10's wave, this is the last week, de load next week then the 8's wave. I calculated my bench from 140Kg, so no I used my 100%, 90% would have given me 94Kg and yes I would have made more reps. However I'm still getting used to a very different style of lifting. I'm going to be mixing juggernaut with 5/3/1 after this four month cycle, perhaps you should do something similar so your not over taxing the body all the time :thumb:
> 
> The juggernaut is building muscle which will add more leverage :thumb:
> 
> I know how you feel mate, after over 3.5 years of heavy lifting on the 5/3/1 I really needed a break, I can deny though I miss heavy training


Its based on 90% so you can keep at least 5% between your predicted max and training max. Also its the thinking like Wendler that your better starting to light than to heavy.

Oh and it you miss heavy lifting think about doing 10/5/8/3 instead of the 10/8/5/3, this is one of the suggestions by CWS that may actually be better.

Juggernaut done 10/8/5/3 should be perfect for peaking and high/low reps mix for the long term but I dont like how your not after the same weight each week. So Im just going to move my reps from 3 to 8 on 5/3/1 which should give me a nice little break. And move from BBB to SST to mix things up a little bit.

Bench Press: 80x5, 92.5x4, 110x3, 120x2, 135x1, 120x4 PM 136kg
BBB Sets: 77.5x9,9,9,9,5
Inverted Rows: BWx5,5,5,5,5

Quite please to do 135x1 even if it is just an over warm up. This wasnt a true 1RM but still nice to get it under my belt. I could have got more than 4 reps of 120kg but I was grinding so decided to go with 4 clean reps and build from there.

Been very stagnant on my BBB sets on all exercises so definitely time to change things up abit. Either Juggernaut or SST. Think I will stick will SST for now as Im basically at PRs so I dont want to change type of workout for the time being.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Its based on 90% so you can keep at least 5% between your predicted max and training max. Also its the thinking like Wendler that your better starting to light than to heavy.


Thanks James, I think I used 100% instead of 90% of my one rep max, when I start cycling between Juggernaut and 5/3/1 I'll revise :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - Juggernaut 10's

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 90X5 100X3) - 108.5KGX5 - 130KGX3 - 150KGX1 - 160KGX11

SNATCH GRIP DEADLIFT 110KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good workout, I'm liking this combination of deadlift exercises. I'll be using the same lifts when cycling between Juggernaut and 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x1 
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Pleased to get the 170, again not a true 1RM but always nice to get a decent weight under your belt. I did this for 3 not not ago so the plan is just to do this weight for 4 reps and work my way up. 

My problem at the moment is Im feeling really beat up as all my lower body lifts have been 3 reps for 6 months now. Choices now are to increase my reps but stay on BBB even though I feel like my BBB sets have stalled or move to Juggernaut. Liking the look of Juggernaut at the min and will give me a nice break. Would also let me add in Dips and other exercises again which I like. I am a true believer in that your body will stall if you keep exercises the same so I have just purely been benching for 6 months so maybe a run of dips will get things moving again, but then on the other hand, I am so close to PRs that I dont want to change program. hard choice.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x1
> BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Pleased to get the 170, again not a true 1RM but always nice to get a decent weight under your belt. I did this for 3 not not ago so the plan is just to do this weight for 4 reps and work my way up.
> 
> My problem at the moment is Im feeling really beat up as all my lower body lifts have been 3 reps for 6 months now. Choices now are to increase my reps but stay on BBB even though I feel like my BBB sets have stalled or move to Juggernaut. Liking the look of Juggernaut at the min and will give me a nice break. Would also let me add in Dips and other exercises again which I like. I am a true believer in that your body will stall if you keep exercises the same so I have just purely been benching for 6 months so maybe a run of dips will get things moving again, but then on the other hand, I am so close to PRs that I dont want to change program. hard choice.


I can already feel the benefits of switching to the Juggernaut program to rest my body, but that is after 3.5 years of heavy lifting.

You may be having the same issues as myself James, I found the heavy assistance work at 5 reps was the cause and it hit my ability to recover fully between sessions. If you switch to lighter hypertrophy 10 rep assistance you may find recovery isn't an issue and you wont feel so broken.

Also I'm finding the juggernaut is building muscle quicker than i expected im over 18 stone already! (18.2 to be exact) :doublesho


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> I can already feel the benefits of switching to the Juggernaut program to rest my body, but that is after 3.5 years of heavy lifting.
> 
> You may be having the same issues as myself James, I found the heavy assistance work at 5 reps was the cause and it hit my ability to recover fully between sessions. If you switch to lighter hypertrophy 10 rep assistance you may find recovery isn't an issue and you wont feel so broken.
> 
> Also I'm finding the juggernaut is building muscle quicker than i expected im over 18 stone already! (18.2 to be exact) :doublesho


Are you tracking bf% too Doug?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Are you tracking bf% too Doug?


Just about to reduce calorific intake for the remaining 3 months of Juggernaut.

I'm only after 15% body fat so it will be done all by eye :doublesho


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - Session 3

*DIPS (Warm Up - BLUE BAND ASSISTEDx10x10x10x10X10)

DIPS (UNASSISTED) +7.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS +12.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 90KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Good workout :thumb:

Barbell row getting more difficult :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - Juggernaut 10's

*SQUAT (WU 60X5 70X5 80X3) - 95KGX5 - 115KGX3 - 133KGX1 - 140KGX6

DEEP SQUAT 100KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Poor result on the squat work set, at 6 reps I gave up.I'm might have done 8 at a push. Decided to focus on some nice deep squats, the 100Kg is well within my abilities but I wanted to see were I was in regards squatting this deep, ass approx. 8" from ground, the point were my hamstrings lay alone my calves. I will keep adding weight as I feel this will greatly help in parallel squat confidence. Another new one for the 5/3/1 assistance sets! 

One thing that is very apparent is for me personally the juggernaut does not feel right for squats at all, I feel I've lost strength.

What I am loving about the juggernaut is its giving me good ideas on how to incorporate different lifts and rep ranges for my heavy cycle :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I can already feel the benefits of switching to the Juggernaut program to rest my body, but that is after 3.5 years of heavy lifting.
> 
> You may be having the same issues as myself James, I found the heavy assistance work at 5 reps was the cause and it hit my ability to recover fully between sessions. If you switch to lighter hypertrophy 10 rep assistance you may find recovery isn't an issue and you wont feel so broken.
> 
> Also I'm finding the juggernaut is building muscle quicker than i expected im over 18 stone already! (18.2 to be exact) :doublesho


Ya if I stay on 5/3/1 then I have already programmed in deloading the weights so Im working with higher reps and move the BBB sets to 10s to give my body a break. But saying this I have decided to go with Juggernaut as I also working hard on bringing my golf swing speed up and all the jumping medicine ball throws will really help with this. So I start Juggernaut on the 4th May.

Doug I wouldnt say you have lost strength, its just the ability to express that strength at different rep ranges. If the highest reps you have done on heavy squats in the last year is 5 reps then you body will be accustomed to that, suddenly doing 10 heavy reps will be a completely different fittest.

Shoulder Press: (WU 27.5x5, 35x5, 42.5x3) WO 45x5, 52.5x5, 60x5 PM 70kg
BBB Sets: 35x10,10
Chin Ups: BWx3,3

Really not making any progress on this workout anymore, time to change things up. The beauty of 5/3/1 is that you can just change from BBB to SST to keep things moving. But Juggernaut is more based around athletes and I want to get fitter again as well and increase my power for golf so this will be a very good program for me.

Very depressing putting in my Juggernaut numbers in the spreadsheet. So I did this workout in April 2012 so thats 3 yrs ago and heres a comparison. Numbers are based on 90% of max.

April 2012 vs April 2015
Bench 115 - 130 = 15kg
Squat 147.5 - 157.5 = 10kg
Shoulder Press 60 - 62.5 = 2.5kg
Deadlifts 167.5 - 175 = 7.5kg

Pathetic gains for 3 yrs of work.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 137.5x3, 157.5x3, 177.5x3 PM 195kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, work sets werent fast, abit of a grind but got the reps cleanly.

Ok so after looking at my workouts in depth last night, Ive figured out, as usual, that I'm just being a pussy. I'm so close to PRs on all exercises so why on earth would I choose this as a good time to change program completely. Im going to stick with BBB for at least another 9 weeks and push those PRs. If I miss a rep then I will deload the exercise, simple as that, 1 step back, 3 steps forward, Im making this way more complicated than it needs to be.

And I figured out a nice way to deload. Instead of doing the standard deload of 10% and then building back up which can take 6 months on 5/3/1, I deload to 92.5% then add 2.5% per week so it only takes 4 weeks to get back to a PR. As Wendler says, doesnt matter if its 1 rep or 1kg, progress is progress and at the moment I am slowly adding reps to all my movements so why am I complaining. And when I do stop adding reps, just deload, simple. Making this weight lifting malarky way more complicated than it needs to be.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 137.5x3, 157.5x3, 177.5x3 PM 195kg
> BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Good workout, work sets werent fast, abit of a grind but got the reps cleanly.
> 
> Ok so after looking at my workouts in depth last night, Ive figured out, as usual, that I'm just being a pussy. I'm so close to PRs on all exercises so why on earth would I choose this as a good time to change program completely. Im going to stick with BBB for at least another 9 weeks and push those PRs. If I miss a rep then I will deload the exercise, simple as that, 1 step back, 3 steps forward, Im making this way more complicated than it needs to be.
> 
> And I figured out a nice way to deload. Instead of doing the standard deload of 10% and then building back up which can take 6 months on 5/3/1, I deload to 92.5% then add 2.5% per week so it only takes 4 weeks to get back to a PR. As Wendler says, doesnt matter if its 1 rep or 1kg, progress is progress and at the moment I am slowly adding reps to all my movements so why am I complaining. And when I do stop adding reps, just deload, simple. Making this weight lifting malarky way more complicated than it needs to be.


I wouldn't go too hard on yourself James, the process above is very much the same as myself. There are ups and downs in all aspects of life.

The important part is how do you come out of it, do you give in or do you fight on!

I choose to fight :thumb: :devil:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I wouldn't go too hard on yourself James, the process above is very much the same as myself. There are ups and downs in all aspects of life.
> 
> The important part is how do you come out of it, do you give in or do you fight on!
> 
> I choose to fight :thumb: :devil:


Cheers Doug, I chose to fight on but just hard when you have put 3 days per week for three yrs so 150+ workouts for bugger all gains. But I figured out last night that I have built a good base so now Im going to move to a 100% powerlifting program after the next 9 weeks of 5/3/1 and see how i go on that.

Bench Press: 80x5, 92.5x4, 110x3, 120x2, 135x1, 120x5 PM 140kg
BBB sets: 77.5x9,9,9,9,6

1 extra rep so its still progress. I actually think Im stronger than ever on Bench at the moment but the warm up sets are taking it out of me abit instead of hitting that top set fresh. Deload week next week anyway.

Been reading a lot about RPE scale workouts and this makes a lot of sense to me. And they never seem to go over an RPE of 9 which is leaving 1 rep in the Tank.

Been reading about Power Lifting programs and I cant believe in all my years of lifting that I have never come across Powerlifting to Win program. I have always been an advocator of people starting on SL5x5 but now I would recommend starting on PTW program as the free ebook basically outlines your first 2-3 yrs of lifting so you should have every question answered for you. This has actually made me reevaluate my training and I would probably say that I would be better off doing an advanced novice program instead of intermediate.

Also found an awesome looking program by Candito which looks like a really solid intermediate program. Like 1 of the best I have ever seen, not because it looks cool and all that but because it is set out so cleverly taking into account and using all the best training protocols.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Cheers Doug, I chose to fight on but just hard when you have put 3 days per week for three yrs so 150+ workouts for bugger all gains. But I figured out last night that I have built a good base so now Im going to move to a 100% powerlifting program after the next 9 weeks of 5/3/1 and see how i go on that.
> 
> Been reading a lot about RPE scale workouts and this makes a lot of sense to me. And they never seem to go over an RPE of 9 which is leaving 1 rep in the Tank.
> 
> Been reading about Power Lifting programs and I cant believe in all my years of lifting that I have never come across Powerlifting to Win program. I have always been an advocator of people starting on SL5x5 but now I would recommend starting on PTW program as the free ebook basically outlines your first 2-3 yrs of lifting so you should have every question answered for you. This has actually made me reevaluate my training and I would probably say that I would be better off doing an advanced novice program instead of intermediate.


The guy on PTW seems critical of every program out there but his own, I've never got hold of a copy, could you email me one please James. The chap on the site hints that you should be training with heavier weights does his program follow that advice?

:thumb:


----------



## Jeli

What have I missed in here!

Having managed to stop hiccups after a week without using the meds I got hit by flu. We had 17 people off work with it. I'm left with a cough but I kept the diet going even if I wasn't training. Current body weight down to 167Ib (11.9 stone) so smashed my goal. Feel like I should perhaps try for another 6Ib as it's been quite easy to lose and see if I get closer to chiselled abs.

I trained Monday with a split chest and shoulder routine. I may continue with split training whilst dieting. I liked the simplicity of 5x5 and the strength so will do this when back on food maintenance or bulk.

The split training will be good for targeted aesthetics work going into holiday mode.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Jeli said:


> What have I missed in here!
> 
> Having managed to stop hiccups after a week without using the meds I got hit by flu. We had 17 people off work with it. I'm left with a cough but I kept the diet going even if I wasn't training. Current body weight down to 167Ib (11.9 stone) so smashed my goal. Feel like I should perhaps try for another 6Ib as it's been quite easy to lose and see if I get closer to chiselled abs.
> 
> I trained Monday with a split chest and shoulder routine. I may continue with split training whilst dieting. I liked the simplicity of 5x5 and the strength so will do this when back on food maintenance or bulk.
> 
> The split training will be good for targeted aesthetics work going into holiday mode.


Personally Jeli I would go for medium/heavy compounds when losing fat to help force the body maintain as much muscle mass as possible :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

On de load this week, so thought I'd get some feel for the dead bench.

When I was a young lifter the dead bench was all I did due to the restriction of the kit I had. Looking back I can see how I managed a 180Kg bench press, I also used to do dead squats (210Kg) all at 210 pound body weight. Its funny how you forget the basics :wall: Its only due to reading powerlifting info online and coming across several articles about dead work lifting that I remembered how I used to train. So back to dead work assistance work for me as a trial 

Done a quick test today, practically no rest and all weights felt easy enough and no pain on pecs or joints.

*DEAD BENCH PRESS (WU 20x5 - 30x5 - 40x3) 50x1 - 60x1 - 70x1 - 80x1 - 90x1 - 100x1* I'm tempted to find my dead bench 1 RM next week so my calculations are accurate.

A quick note on dead weight lifting

Please do not train as many of the articles tell you "Explode the weight from the dead position" this is utter horse **** and can cause serious injury to muscles, tendons and joints. In regards to the dead bench - The pec area is very susceptible to tearing while performing the lift.

The best way to train and also ensure you build real strength, not cheating strength, is to get under the bar and push away with control. The more control you use to handle the weight the pure power you will build.

IMHO explosive/speed training should be done with lower weights, leave the explosive stuff to guys who have many years training under their belts (Pun intended ). Remember use controlled force. Dead weight lifts put a lot of stress on the body and CNS as they are without throwing the weight around :thumb:

Anyhow boring lecture over :wave:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> The guy on PTW seems critical of every program out there but his own, I've never got hold of a copy, could you email me one please James. The chap on the site hints that you should be training with heavier weights does his program follow that advice?
> 
> :thumb:


Sent you the Ebook Doug and accompanying excel sheet which calculates everything for you.

Ya he definitely follows that advice that you have to lift heavy, reps start at 6 and go down to 3. Been doing a lot of reading the last few days and I love the fact that its a template for your first 2-3 yrs of lifting, all questions asked but what I dont like is the Squat, Bench & Dead all in the same workout. Yes this works as a beginner but who here can honestly say that your Deadlift wouldnt be effected after Squats let alone Squats and Bench. I know the reason he's doing it, to train like a powerlifting comp but training and competition arent the same thing in my eyes and I dont like all 3 being put together.

I want to train more towards strength for awhile now and basically if you want strength you have to be training 85% and above. I think thats the only issue with 5/3/1, if you do the minimum reps (5/3/1) then the maximum amount of reps at and above 85% per month is 14reps, 3.5 reps per week. I just dont think this is going to cut it if your main goal is strength.

Been reading more powerlifter based programs written by powerlifters and the 2 that keep popping up are Candito and GZCL. If you get a chance to read GZCL he talks about training being a pyramid so like this:

The 1st Tier consists of only your main movements in percentages greater than 85% of your goal weight for 10-15 total reps. All of those programmed reps are mandatory.

-The 2nd Tier are percentages between 65-85% of your goal weight, for 20-30 reps. The movements in this tier should primarily be your main movements or variants of as well as supporting pull movements for back development. Those programmed reps are also mandatory unless you're dying.

-The 3rd Tier is the most important and the foundation for your entire pyramid. Percentages for your main movements are less than 65% of your goal weight for 30 or more reps; including warm ups or back off sets. Other movements in this tier are isolation exercises or supportive exercises like face pulls or GHRs. I urge you to do additional work here but if you're stretched for time, leave the gym and do some band pull-aparts when you get home.

Basically 5/3/1 BBB covers Tiers 2 & 3 but has hardly any work in Tier 1 which is the main strength Tier. If you look at Prilepin's chart, it agrees totally with GZCL pyramid example. It shows that you want to hit between 10-20 reps in the 80-90% range, optimal being 15, 5/3/1 is hitting 3.5 per week. Ok Im including the deload week so I should really say 4.67 reps per week but thats still way below the recommended 15 reps.

I also dont think Im anywhere near advanced enough to be handling a once per month increase like 5/3/1, I should still be at weekly or bi-weekly. So the plan is to change to Candito in the near future which is a weekly and then bi-weekely plan and then change to GZCL which is a powerlifting based monthly program. Candito also does a 6 week plan which I havent read 1 single bad thing about yet so will be giving that a try in the near future.

The great thing about the Candito and GZCL programs is the flexibility, they prescribe the first main exercises but after that its just guidelines so if you want to throw in some curls or flyes then go right ahead.



ITHAQVA said:


> When I was a young lifter the dead bench was all I did due to the restriction of the kit I had. Looking back I can see how I managed a 180Kg bench press, I also used to do dead squats (210Kg) all at 210 pound body weight. Its funny how you forget the basics :wall: Its only due to reading powerlifting info online and coming across several articles about dead work lifting that I remembered how I used to train. So back to dead work assistance work for me as a trial


Doug funny you should say that. Candito's workout is

Mon: Squats, Deadlifts
Tues: Bench, Rows
Thurs: Pause Squats, Pause Deadlifts
Fri: Spoto Press (I had to google this), Pause Row

So basically the second half of the week is all paused work.


----------



## Jeli

ITHAQVA said:


> Personally Jeli I would go for medium/heavy compounds when losing fat to help force the body maintain as much muscle mass as possible :thumb:


Thanks ITHAQVA. I'll continue to do mostly compound exercises for the bulk of the routines. I've been missing my dumbbell lateral raises, shrugs, etc.

Need to get some fitness back as it felt like I've had years off, not weeks. Do you think moving back to the following routine would be a bad idea?

Monday - 
Incline bench dumbbell chest press (alternate weeks with barbell)
Flat bench dumbbell chest press (alternate weeks with barbell)
Incline dumbbell fly

Seated Dumbbell shoulder press (alternate weeks with standing barbell military press)
Dumbbell lateral raises
Dumbbell front delt raise

Wednesday -
Dead lift
Barbell bent over rows (alternate weeks with dumbbell rows)
Pull ups

Incline bench reverse dumbbell fly 
Shrugs

Friday -
Squats
Leg extensions
Ham curls
Seated calf raises

Sunday - 
Fitness work
Dumbbell biceps curls
Ez bar curls
Cable tricep push down
Skull crushers


----------



## Estoril-5

You guys haven't heard from me for a while, been ill twice and once been hospitalised 

Was painful and took some time off work for a while.

Had a small quad injury too which meant I had to stop squating.

Good thing is that I've maintenance my weight so not put on the stone that I lost previously 

Tomorrow going for a muscle & weight analysis which measures body fat percentage, muscle mass etc.

It's the one way I can actually monitor progress.

Quite excited.

Plus this is the 4000 post on this thread 

Will post my analysis results tomorrow, be prewarned I'm a fat ******* lol


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x1
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Still the same amount of reps as last week but this was an easier 1 rep so that is progress. Could I have got a 2nd rep, maybe but as I wasnt 100% sure then I didnt attempt it. In reality its a deload week next week so should have probably given it everything I have. But still pleased with the workout.


----------



## Estoril-5

As promised went to the fitness centre to get body weight analysis done.

It came out as 32% body fat, I don't believe that, I thought I was 40% or there abouts.

But at least it's a bench mark for next time.

It said legs each 6kg of fat
Arms each 2kg of fat
Trunk 20kg of fat

All approx values.

Also said I was very dehydrated long term not just at that moment in time.

Always thought I was 40% or more fat but machine says 32%.

Would love to get to 20% bf


----------



## warren

My claim to fame in the 80's is that I doubled body weight in bench press.benched 140kg weighing 68kg...:thumb:


----------



## Jeli

Estoril-5, sure you can get down to 20%. My old training buddy was nearly at 40% and now 24%. Change of diet and exercise. His bad back virtually gone away through weight training.

Warren, that's impressive. Wish I was able to press twice my weight. I struggle with bench press. I did 140kg but I was 15 stone then.

Yesterday had my body fat measured. I'm at 10% but don't think I look like it. Hardly ripped looking. Abs are visible with some obliques.


----------



## warren

Thanks jeli:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Juggernaut 8's

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 91KGX8X8X8X8

BENCH PRESS 91KGX9

DEAD BENCH PRESS (30 Seconds Rest) 81KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KGX10X10X10X10X7*

Good workout although felt a little lack lustre as the 8 rep scheme at these light weights felt too easy. The Dead bench felt ok although I cant wait to get some heavier weight on the bar as I'm interested to see how heavy I can go on the Dead weight approach because I'm very hopeful this will carry over to my normal bench press. Still not loving the juggernaut but I'm sticking with it to lose some body fat, gain some conditioning and give my body a rest :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Juggernaut 8's

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 110X3) - 140KGX8X8X8X8

DEADLIFT 140KGX9

SNATCH GRIP DEADLIFT 115KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 75KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good workout :thumb:

Still managing to keep to double overhand grip for all assistance work, but the snatch grip deadlift really beats up your grip strength, tears your calluses and it plays merry hell with my little pinkies!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Session 3

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT (WU BWx10x10x10x10) + 7.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 90KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Really good workout, plenty of progress and the BR 90kg felt much easier this week :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Juggernaut 8's

*SQUAT ( WU 80X5 90X5 100X3) - 123KGX8X8X8X8

SQUAT 123KGX9

DEAD SQUAT (30 Seconds Rest) 110KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1*

All good. Trialled the dead squat to help get good depth and taped up the rack for future use :thumb:

Now for all the purists, my dead squat is not a dead squat per se. After trying the DS from the lowest position it felt really alien, the bar was not in the same position etc.. My core just didn't feel correctly positioned. IMO, for the DS to work it must feel as close to the squat as possible but with more depth.
So after a bit of messing around I found the perfect feeling DS. Start at the standard top position, un rack, lower to the safety bars and allow them to take all the weight, keeping the core tight throughout. Then push up and re rack. I know some may say I'm relying on the elasticity in the muscles doing it this way, but for me the biggest squat issue isn't strength but confidence in the lowest position. Using my own take on the DS and going a good 2"-3" lower than parallel will hopefully give me carryover to the squat.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - Juggernaut 8's

*BENCH PRESS (WU 40x5 50x5 60x3) - 84KGX3 - 94.5KGX3 - 101.5KGX8X8

BENCH PRESS 101.5KGX9

DEAD BENCH (30 Second Rest) 81KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1*

Again for the purists my dead bench is slightly different. Its a combination of the dead bench and the competition bench were you pause with the bar on you re chest. I start at the top position un rack and allow the bar to rest on my chest, them allow my chest to sink so that the bar ends up resting on the safety's. I then loosen my grip to reduce the elasticity in the muscles, take a firm grip again and push the bar up and re rack. This makes the lift feel very similar to the traditional bench press. I've noticed too that this lift forces me to belly breath, keeping my core much tighter - Bonus! :thumb:

If your new to any type of dead weight lifting, please be careful, it puts tremendous stress on the joints and surrounding areas. Start light and build up slowly. Lift with control and none of this explosive stuff or you will pay dearly as joint injuries take months to repair.

Basics of Dead weight lifting (You may not have seen me lift dead weight style but I used it many years ago, I trained almost exclusively in dead weight style so have plenty of experience with it)

If your able to dead weight lift, you will become incredibly powerful due to the steady controlled form used - The best analogy I can think of is were you move a heavy object just like a hydraulic ram, no speed, no explosiveness, just total controlled power.

Dead weight lifting takes a little getting used to, you may find your joints become a little sore/tight or tired feeling. I would recommend if your new to lifting in general to not do it for a few years. If you've lifted for a few years but not dead weight style I would do a week on week off for the first month, then two weeks on two weeks off and so on until your dead weight lifting three weeks in a row followed by your de load.

Dead weight lifting suites the more solid framed of us, big bones and joints as long as there are no injuries or underlying health issues will tolerate it far easier - think about it from an evolutionary point of view, the Neanderthal man was incredibly strong, stocky and would have held onto a lot more muscle mass, home sapiens was more slender therefore physically weaker and unable to hold the muscle mass of the Neanderthal. Basic genetics - lift how your built to lift, unless your planning on competing then your going to have to work dam hard either way. if your a slender frame as I said previously get some lifting in for few years get those joints toughened up and ad some muscle to help hold/cushion the weight. Simple bio mechanics! 

Dead squats, put a lot of stress on the lower back, dead benches put stress around the shoulder and pec areas. I know it sounds obvious but sometimes in our haste we all forget the basics. Just like form, you will have to keep re adjusting and checking.

Dead weight lifting will bash your CNS :devil:

Another lecture over, time to eat a chicken!


----------



## Bod42

Back lifting after my deload week. I did workout but very light weights just to keep the movement pattern there.

Bench: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x12 PM 140kg
Bench 350 Method: 60x20x10x11 Total 41
Inverted Rows: BWx6,6,6

OK so WOW, this is how a deload is suppose to work. I have mentioned on here that I have been feeling beat up and was grinding reps and everything was slow. Just made every workout a grind but who wants to back off right. Well I came back this week and everything feels stupidly light and really fast. Every set before my work set was a joke, I was moving the bar so fast it was pulling my torso up off the Bench. Was only suppose to get 10 reps but felt good so pushed for 12 and this was still leaving 2 in the tank if not 3.

Forgot to mention the 350 sets, I thought I would hate these but was actually really nice to hit some high reps. And they really hit my chest instead of my triceps like when I lift heavy.

The true test will be squats tonight and deadlifts friday. Deadlifts will be an all time PR.

Nice write up Doug. And funny that your doing these now as I am changing to a workout with pause and dead reps.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Back lifting after my deload week. I did workout but very light weights just to keep the movement pattern there.
> 
> Bench: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 100x12 PM 140kg
> Bench 350 Method: 60x20x10x11 Total 41
> Inverted Rows: BWx6,6,6
> 
> OK so WOW, this is how a deload is suppose to work. I have mentioned on here that I have been feeling beat up and was grinding reps and everything was slow. Just made every workout a grind but who wants to back off right. Well I came back this week and everything feels stupidly light and really fast. Every set before my work set was a joke, I was moving the bar so fast it was pulling my torso up off the Bench. Was only suppose to get 10 reps but felt good so pushed for 12 and this was still leaving 2 in the tank if not 3.
> 
> Forgot to mention the 350 sets, I thought I would hate these but was actually really nice to hit some high reps. And they really hit my chest instead of my triceps like when I lift heavy.
> 
> The true test will be squats tonight and deadlifts friday. Deadlifts will be an all time PR.
> 
> Nice write up Doug. And funny that your doing these now as I am changing to a workout with pause and dead reps.


Go for it mate, the dead work will produce good results, but please be careful. I know you have a history of issues with your shoulder. I would recommend keeping your grip narrow and using controlled force when in the positive phase of the lift. Also watch out for elbow issues when using dead bench lifting :thumb:

When I was your age James I found after 8-10 weeks solid dead weight lifting that I had to revert back to standard style for a few weeks to recover. Not sure how you plan to program it James, but you'll know you've bashed your CNS as your strength will rapidly decrease. Don't be disheartened, its a sign from the old body to take a few steps back.
I think I'll put heavy dead work in every other heavy month, so:

- Three weeks on 5/3/1 heavy
- One week de load
- Three weeks Juggernaut
- One week de load and so on.

I'm hoping this will allow for good recovery and allow me to use dead style for enough months and really build a solid dead weight PR carrying over to the standard lifting version :thumb:

I have a few ideas of how to program my next heavy phase but not sure on my approach yet.

The 350 set would drive me nuts!


----------



## Bod42

Mate you should give the 350 method a try at least once. Its a different feeling aiming for total reps over 3 sets than the usual concentrating on each individual set. And it will be good way of progressing mentally as I will make a big jump each time I hit 50 reps and then work back up. 

I will doing this split:
Mon: Squats, Deadlifts
Tues: Bench, Rows
Thurs: Pause Squats, Pause Deadlifts
Fri: Spoto Press, Pause Row

So technically its not deadstop work as I will be pausing and not completely deloading the weight off me. But I put in my years on the Box squat so that was enough deadwork for me.

Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x2 PM 181.5kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout here, the 1 rep of 170 flew up so pleased to make progress on that. Im not going to prewrite my reps from now on, I will decide during the set how many I can do. Last week I wanted 2 reps but stopped on 1 as I wasnt 100% sure I would get rep 2. This week rep 1 flew up so I went for rep 2. Simple system really. Yes I have a goal in mind when I step in the gym but how you feel that day dictates how far you go. You cant expect to be 100% every single day of your life.

Going to leave my back off sets at 100kg for quite a while now but start bringing the time between sets down when they become stupidly easy.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 27.5x5, 32.5x3)WO 35x5, 42.5x5, 47.5x10 PM 62.5kg
Dips: BWx10,10,10
Chin Ups: BWx10x2
Barbell Rows: 47.5x5x5

I just did 10 reps and called it quits as I have hurt my shoulder. Literally just pushing a toolbox in the boot of my truck and my shoulder went bang, pain down my shoulder and bicep so that remind me how fragile my shoulder is even when its feeling good. This was wed night but still shoulder pressed thurs.

Was pleased with dips as they didnt hurt at all and this reminded me how much I love dips and how awesome they feel. Hopefully some shoulder work will bring the shoulder back up to health so i can start loading my dips.

I just did some pause Barbell Rows with my shoulder press weight to get in some back work. Have bought another bar and set of weights so will always have a barbell row and deadlift bar outside the rack so no excuses from now on.

Moving house at the min but havent missed a workout yet which Im pleased with.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 27.5x5, 32.5x3)WO 35x5, 42.5x5, 47.5x10 PM 62.5kg
> Dips: BWx10,10,10
> Chin Ups: BWx10x2
> Barbell Rows: 47.5x5x5
> 
> I just did 10 reps and called it quits as I have hurt my shoulder. Literally just pushing a toolbox in the boot of my truck and my shoulder went bang, pain down my shoulder and bicep so that remind me how fragile my shoulder is even when its feeling good. This was wed night but still shoulder pressed thurs.
> 
> Was pleased with dips as they didnt hurt at all and this reminded me how much I love dips and how awesome they feel. Hopefully some shoulder work will bring the shoulder back up to health so i can start loading my dips.
> 
> I just did some pause Barbell Rows with my shoulder press weight to get in some back work. Have bought another bar and set of weights so will always have a barbell row and deadlift bar outside the rack so no excuses from now on.
> 
> Moving house at the min but havent missed a workout yet which Im pleased with.


If your shoulder is still causing issues James ,why not forget direct shoulder work and just do the same as I have done with the session 3 workout? Exactly the same as yours above but minus the OHP :thumb:

*Dips 5 x 10 body weight plus weight

Pull ups 5 x 10 (Blue band assisted plus weight)

Barbell rows 5x5 (Heavy)*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> If your shoulder is still causing issues James ,why not forget direct shoulder work and just do the same as I have done with the session 3 workout? Exactly the same as yours above but minus the OHP :thumb:
> 
> *Dips 5 x 10 body weight plus weight
> 
> Pull ups 5 x 10 (Blue band assisted plus weight)
> 
> Barbell rows 5x5 (Heavy)*
> 
> :thumb:


With mine, direct overhead work makes it better. Its the Benching and horizontal pressing that buggers it up. Im doing high reps and light weights after a deload with OHP anyway so it will be fine. Its fine now anyway, must have just pulled something during the move.

So annoyed, going through a really stressful time and need my gym to destress. I have got the bottom cut so it fits in the new garage but I just need the guys to drill 8 new holes and then i can set it up, theyve had it since thurs and still havent done it and its Tues. So annoying when its a 2min job.

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 140x3, 160x3, 180x2 PM 192kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

DAM IT! Missed a record by about 2 inches, just couldnt lock the weight out. This wasnt so much strength as the new gym. The new gym slops down hill so the weights roll away if I put them across it but then if you put them sideways one foot is lower than the other whcih feels weird. Only a slight amount but still enough to alter technique and the bar was moving away from me as it broke the ground. Annoying.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x5, 90x17, 100x11 PM 140
350 Method: 60x20,11,11
Inverted Rows: BWx6,6,6

So went round my mates gym as just needed a workout but can anyone spot the mistake? Yep the 90x17 reps. He has 20s as his biggest weight whereas I have 25s so as you can see, I messed up my top set but oh well not exactly bad to get some extra volume in and after the 17 reps I was pleased to get an easy 11 reps of 100kgs.

Beat my 350 sets as well by 1 rep which was good after all the extra volume.

And after the gym we set about drilling new holes in my rack and now its an inch shorter and fits perfectly in my new garage so have a proper gym setup now.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x5, 150x3, 170x1 
BBB Sets: 120x5,5

Ive been ill so i wasnt going to workout but finished organizing my new detailing cupboard and the gym was there so thought I would mess around and then it turned into a proper workout. You will see that I messed up the first work set and did 5 reps instead of 3 but good to get more volume in. Only did 2 back off sets as didnt want to kill myself when Im ill.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (WU 22.5x5, 27.5x5, 32.5x3)WO 35x5, 42.5x5, 47.5x15 PM 70.5kg
Dips: BWx10,10,15
Chin Ups: BWx3x2

So as I'm in my new low roof garage I had to change my shoulder press to seated shoulder press due to the ceiling height. So put my bench dead upright and quickly found that this doesnt work after smashing the bar into my chin as you cant move your head back. But what I did find is that seated are way way easier than standing. The bench is supporting you so this feels more like a Bench Press in the way you push the bar away from you. Its nice doing a deload as its a good excuse to set some rep PRs. 10,10,15 on dips easy as.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 140x3, 160x3, 180x3 PM 198kg PR!!!!!
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

This really was everything I had but still pleased to get the weight at long last. Will stick on this weight until its not such a grind or at least hit each weight twice before moving on. I solved the issue of my sloped gym as well. I put 4 foam mats down but left the centre out so Im pushing straight on the concrete but the weights sit on the foam so the dont roll away. Now I can deadlift with my feet level.


----------



## Bod42

I seem to be the only 1 left in here but here goes.

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) 82.5x3, 95x3, 105x12 PM 147kg
350 Method: 60x20,14,12 Total 46
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6,6

This deload weights and deload week has worked better than ever before, I suppose this is exactly how its supposed to work, push yourself to your limit, then back off and let yourself adapt. The workouts seem easy but Im setting rep records every time and even the rows felt stupidly easy which I usually hate. On target to hit a PR. 

I actually thing I stayed more true to 5/3/1 this time. I like to have rigid rep goals in place so I changed 5/3/1 to 10/8/6 but this time I treated these like a minimal and just went off how I felt that day, if I felt great them I did more reps, if I felt crap then i just got the reps and got out. This has allowed me to set some rep records along the way. I will take the same approach with Squats and deadlifts next time I deload.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> I seem to be the only 1 left in here but here goes.
> 
> Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) 82.5x3, 95x3, 105x12 PM 147kg
> 350 Method: 60x20,14,12 Total 46
> Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6,6
> 
> This deload weights and deload week has worked better than ever before, I suppose this is exactly how its supposed to work, push yourself to your limit, then back off and let yourself adapt. The workouts seem easy but Im setting rep records every time and even the rows felt stupidly easy which I usually hate. On target to hit a PR.
> 
> I actually thing I stayed more true to 5/3/1 this time. I like to have rigid rep goals in place so I changed 5/3/1 to 10/8/6 but this time I treated these like a minimal and just went off how I felt that day, if I felt great them I did more reps, if I felt crap then i just got the reps and got out. This has allowed me to set some rep records along the way. I will take the same approach with Squats and deadlifts next time I deload.


I'm still here bud, just haven't posted for a while! 
My wife has just had our second daughter so haven't been to the gym for several weeks now as have been at home enjoying the family time. Will be back in there next week though. 
Impressive work on the PR yesterday by the way mate, told you you'd made a lot of progress!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I seem to be the only 1 left in here but here goes.


I'm here :wave: Been very busy IT wise and I'm on de load this week.

Back to 5/3/1 next week, sorry guys couldn't take any more of the Juggernaut, but I will be alternating between 5/3/1 and the 10's phase for fitness :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

I'm still following the thread but nothing much to report from me.

Dieting ongoing, now weighing at 164Ib @ 9% body fat. Trying to get a little lower percentage if I can.

Training wise moved into split routines.

Bench press is down by a whopping 20Kg (was at 100Kg on the 5x5 but now struggle with 80Kg). Squats was at 120Kg and now 100Kg. To be expected after shifting a couple of stone in weight.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm here :wave: Been very busy IT wise and I'm on de load this week.
> 
> Back to 5/3/1 next week, sorry guys couldn't take any more of the Juggernaut, but I will be alternating between 5/3/1 and the 10's phase for fitness :thumb:


I didnt think you were enjoying Juggernaut Doug. For me I didnt like the open ended rep ranges but then thats probably why I havent done that well on 5/3/1 until I modified it and basically made it noting like 5/3/1. I like to start a set with an exact rep goal in mind and if I hit that then I increase the weight, going in with just hit as many as possible is to vague for me.



Jeli said:


> I'm still following the thread but nothing much to report from me.
> 
> Dieting ongoing, now weighing at 164Ib @ 9% body fat. Trying to get a little lower percentage if I can.
> 
> Training wise moved into split routines.
> 
> Bench press is down by a whopping 20Kg (was at 100Kg on the 5x5 but now struggle with 80Kg). Squats was at 120Kg and now 100Kg. To be expected after shifting a couple of stone in weight.


9% is mighty impressive. Using my FFMI, I worked out I must be way fatter than I thought, i just hold it well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I didnt think you were enjoying Juggernaut Doug. For me I didnt like the open ended rep ranges but then thats probably why I havent done that well on 5/3/1 until I modified it and basically made it noting like 5/3/1. I like to start a set with an exact rep goal in mind and if I hit that then I increase the weight, going in with just hit as many as possible is to vague for me.


It drove me nuts and i started to lose motivation, I will be reducing rest periods in places to help up my fitness level, so it was not all a loss :thumb:


----------



## Jeli

Bod42 said:


> 9% is mighty impressive. Using my FFMI, I worked out I must be way fatter than I thought, i just hold it well.


I carried good size on a small frame but after my first real attempt at dieting I know a reasonable proportion was fat around the abdomen. Result of a long and not always healthy bulk 

Just over 3 months back I was in the 20% body fat range and I haven't done any cardio. Lifting weights, nailed diet, calorie deficit of 500 from maintenance (~1800, 35/35/30).


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (WU 75x5, 95x5, 112.5x3) WO 132.5x3, 150x3, 170x3 PM 187kg
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

This equals my best ever 3RM on squats so all PRs from here on out. I'm on the verge on setting PRs on every exercise so should be fun but hard work from here. Deadlifts and squats have been an absolute grind so maybe due a deload soon but I will just hit some rep PRs like I have done on Bench & Shoulder Press.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: (22.5x5, 27.5x5, 32.5x3) 37.5x3, 45x3, 50x15 PM 74kg
Dips: BWx8, BWx8, BW+15x6
Neutral Grip Chins: 3x2
Inverted Rows: 3x5

So I have been struggling with my shoulder lately, hasnt just been hurting a little bit, the pain has been the worst its been in ages, running down my bicep and forearm and effecting my grip. I have a feeling that it is these seated bench supported shoulder press is causing the problem, my shoulder just really doesnt seem to like the angle. I will give the exercise 1 last try and if it is still causing the same pain then i will drop it. It doesnt hurt during the exercise but after and I did this workout fri but woke up Sat in a lot of discomfort so had to go to the gym and do a load of pumping rehab work to get rid of the pain. 

But other than the pain, seated shoulder press are so so so much easier than standing. I mean I'm getting like double the reps.

Actually thinking about it, it must be this exercise as dips actually made my shoulder feel better and their normally an exercise that put a great deal of stress on your shoulders. Everytime I have a break from Dips and go back, I absolutely love them. And I havent dipped in ages as been doing BBB but i have got stronger on Dips.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Shoulder Press: (22.5x5, 27.5x5, 32.5x3) 37.5x3, 45x3, 50x15 PM 74kg
> Dips: BWx8, BWx8, BW+15x6
> Neutral Grip Chins: 3x2
> Inverted Rows: 3x5
> 
> So I have been struggling with my shoulder lately, hasnt just been hurting a little bit, the pain has been the worst its been in ages, running down my bicep and forearm and effecting my grip. I have a feeling that it is these seated bench supported shoulder press is causing the problem, my shoulder just really doesnt seem to like the angle. I will give the exercise 1 last try and if it is still causing the same pain then i will drop it. It doesnt hurt during the exercise but after and I did this workout fri but woke up Sat in a lot of discomfort so had to go to the gym and do a load of pumping rehab work to get rid of the pain.
> 
> But other than the pain, seated shoulder press are so so so much easier than standing. I mean I'm getting like double the reps.
> 
> Actually thinking about it, it must be this exercise as dips actually made my shoulder feel better and their normally an exercise that put a great deal of stress on your shoulders. Everytime I have a break from Dips and go back, I absolutely love them. And I havent dipped in ages as been doing BBB but i have got stronger on Dips.


James, I have never liked the OHP, it has never felt natural for some reason. I think because it is so technical and takes a lot to master. Dips feel more natural for me as do pull ups (now). I agree regarding the seated press, due to the reduced technical aspects it feels right. Having said that I prefer the behind neck press even more (It was the only shoulder press variant I ever used years ago) Yep I know it goes against recommendation, but it never gave me any problems and I went up to 84-87Kg for 6-8 reps all those millions of years ago


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 80x5, 100x5, 120x3) WO 140x3, 160x3, 180x3 PM 198kg PR!!!!!
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

This equals my PR from last week but it was easier so thats progress. The back off sets are getting to a point where they are all really fast and easy except the last few reps so will bump these by like 20kgs and stick to them for a few months again.



ITHAQVA said:


> James, I have never liked the OHP, it has never felt natural for some reason. I think because it is so technical and takes a lot to master. Dips feel more natural for me as do pull ups (now). I agree regarding the seated press, due to the reduced technical aspects it feels right. Having said that I prefer the behind neck press even more (It was the only shoulder press variant I ever used years ago) Yep I know it goes against recommendation, but it never gave me any problems and I went up to 84-87Kg for 6-8 reps all those millions of years ago


Ya me neither Doug but it seems if I keep my OHP strength up then it keeps my shoulder pain away but I did seated OHP with no back support and then moved to standing but not sure if the new exercise is causing the pain or its just coincidence. It definitely feels completely different. No big deal as i will just go back to seated without the back support but the issues comes in locking your feet into the side of the rack so your stable, that can get quite difficult.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x5, 100x3, 112.5x10 PM 150kg
350 Method: 60x22,10,11
Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5

This ties my best PM ever but so annoyed. I went for the 11th rep and failed but I was so close. Had great speed off my chest but hit that sticking point and normally I can gring through it but shoulder moved on the bench so bar moved backwards towards my face and that was game over. Not nice to miss a rep but so good to be so close a record. Means I'm basically at my strongest ever on all lifts so man did that deload and rest week work well. I think thats how it works when you do 5/3/1 for 7 weeks instead of 3 weeks before a deload as I was grinding every single rep and barely holding on to my strength, did 1 rest week and came back and hit PRs in everything. proves that you grow out of the gym, not in it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 60x5, 70x3) WO 87.5x5, 100x3, 112.5x10 PM 150kg
> 350 Method: 60x22,10,11
> Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> This ties my best PM ever but so annoyed. I went for the 11th rep and failed but I was so close. Had great speed off my chest but hit that sticking point and normally I can gring through it but shoulder moved on the bench so bar moved backwards towards my face and that was game over. Not nice to miss a rep but so good to be so close a record. Means I'm basically at my strongest ever on all lifts so man did that deload and rest week work well. I think thats how it works when you do 5/3/1 for 7 weeks instead of 3 weeks before a deload as I was grinding every single rep and barely holding on to my strength, did 1 rest week and came back and hit PRs in everything. proves that you grow out of the gym, not in it.


I would say you are making the best progress you've ever made since the start of the thread. I would stick to this formula mate its working for you :thumb:

112.5x10 IMPRESSIVE! :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 87.5KGX5 - 101KGX5 - 114.5KGX5

DEAD BENCH PRESS (30 Seconds Rest between each rep) 100KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KGX10X10X10X10X7*

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I would say you are making the best progress you've ever made since the start of the thread. I would stick to this formula mate its working for you :thumb:
> 
> 112.5x10 IMPRESSIVE! :devil: :thumb:


Thanks mate. I dont think it was this workout though, it would have been the workout I was doing before which was BBB that added the strength. I was just grinding out reps week after week and then had a rest week and deloaded and it let me adapt and strengthen. Said a few times the rest & deload just seem to work better than ever. This must be what people go on about with contest prep, slowly work up and push yourself and then back off and adapt. Its exactly what Im going to do with my squats & deadlifts next, keep grinding reps out week after week and then deload, rest and carry on.

My weeks went 
115x5,6,7,7,8
120x4,5
So that was over 7 weeks of grinding out reps.

And its not a fluke either with 1 exercise. Pushed my OHP, rest & deload, came back and hit records.

Just PR'd my deadlift and equaled my squat PR so BBB definitely seems to be working. It isnt really 5/3/1 BBB anymore, its a combination of everything I have learned. Especially on squats and deadlifts that you dont have to kill yourself on every set but lighter/faster back on sets do wonders for these exercises and give you extra volume.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 120X3) - 140GX5 - 161KGX5 - 182KGX5

SNATCH GRIP DEADLIFT 115KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 75KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good solid workout, using 5 mins rest between work sets instead of 7, 3 mins rest between 5 rep assistance and 1 min rest between last 10 rep assistance work. Will stick to these rest periods :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (75x5, 95x5, 115x3) 132.5x3, 152.5x3, 172.5x1
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Form was well off and wasnt feeling the workout so just worked up to the most weight Ive had on the bar in a long time, hit it for 1 rep and concentrated on speed on my back off sets.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - Alternative to 5/3/1 OHP session

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KGX10X10X10X10X8

BARBELL ROW 90KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Pleased with workout as I felt a bit tired today and I've got loads of DOMS all over as this is my first heavy week for a month or so :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 100X3) - 117KGX5 - 135KGX5 - 153KGX5

DEAD SQUAT (30 Seconds Rest between each set) 120KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUT (3 min rest between each set) 200KGX1X1X1X1X1*

As you can see I've taken a considerable de load on my Squat work sets. I want to concentrate on strict reps so that when the time comes to squatting heavy I'll have a better chance at being successful.

*Squat Walkout*
I've been considering this assistance exercise for some time. Now I've tried it, I can say I will keep it in the routine. The 200Kg felt heavy for the first walkout, then after that the walkouts were much easier.

If you do plan to do the squat walkout- Remember you will be using a heavy weight and it may seem simple to just un rack and walk out, hold and re rack, but you can do plenty of damage to your back legs etc.. Keep the core tight throughout the exercise as you would if performing a heavy one rep max.

That's me done :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I did my shoulder workout as planned on fri and it is definitely 100% that back supported OHP killing my shoulder so I tried to press the weight up and then sit forwards. This worked the 1st time but the 2nd time I did it, I dropped the weight and unfortunately tore my shoulder. So back to the drawing board with OHP and probably bench. 

Its a shame but I will just rehab my shoulder and start again, Im used to it now. I messed around with how i can do this exercise. I found 2 solutions, I can either unrack the weight standing and then sit down on the bench and then once Im finished squat back up and rack it or use my Squat Box and do a seated press but the hard bit is unracking the bar and when you get heavy it depends on jamming your feet under the sides of the rack. 

Anyway I will be dropping OHP for awhile, doing dips and the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders which is a rehab program to get my shoulder strong again and then I will move back to OHP. I just hope it doesnt effect my Bench as Im so close to a PR but I recon it will sadly.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I did my shoulder workout as planned on fri and it is definitely 100% that back supported OHP killing my shoulder so I tried to press the weight up and then sit forwards. This worked the 1st time but the 2nd time I did it, I dropped the weight and unfortunately tore my shoulder. So back to the drawing board with OHP and probably bench.
> 
> Its a shame but I will just rehab my shoulder and start again, Im used to it now. I messed around with how i can do this exercise. I found 2 solutions, I can either unrack the weight standing and then sit down on the bench and then once Im finished squat back up and rack it or use my Squat Box and do a seated press but the hard bit is unracking the bar and when you get heavy it depends on jamming your feet under the sides of the rack.
> 
> Anyway I will be dropping OHP for awhile, doing dips and the 8 weeks to monstrous shoulders which is a rehab program to get my shoulder strong again and then I will move back to OHP. I just hope it doesnt effect my Bench as Im so close to a PR but I recon it will sadly.


James, Really sorry your injured again mate, I know your pain, its so frustrating when the body lets us down.

I wouldn't bother with any shoulder pressing for a year. Many lifts/exercises hit the shoulders hard enough mate:BBR, pull ups/chin ups, snatch grip deadlifts, deadlift, rack pulls.

The shoulders act as a stabiliser for many lifts and the heavy weight used gives them enough training :thumb:

I've got really good upper arm/shoulder development and I don't train arms and I haven't trained shoulders much over the last 3.5 years.

I do the session below instead

*Dips weight added 5x10
Pull ups (Blue band assistance) plus weight added 5x10
Heavy barbell rows 5x5*

IMHO the above workout is far more beneficial for upper body development and strength than a shoulder routine, try it mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, Really sorry your injured again mate, I know your pain, its so frustrating when the body lets us down.
> 
> I wouldn't bother with any shoulder pressing for a year. Many lifts/exercises hit the shoulders hard enough mate:BBR, pull ups/chin ups, snatch grip deadlifts, deadlift, rack pulls.
> 
> The shoulders act as a stabiliser for many lifts and the heavy weight used gives them enough training :thumb:
> 
> I've got really good upper arm/shoulder development and I don't train arms and I haven't trained shoulders much over the last 3.5 years.
> 
> I do the session below instead
> 
> *Dips weight added 5x10
> Pull ups (Blue band assistance) plus weight added 5x10
> Heavy barbell rows 5x5*
> 
> IMHO the above workout is far more beneficial for upper body development and strength than a shoulder routine, try it mate :thumb:


Thanks Doug. I dont get to down about it as I know my shoulder is buggered anyway. I do like to keep some Shoulder work in there as when I was doing BBB OHP it actually really helped with the pain. i think if i keep my OHP strength up then it does seem to help my shoulder.

Doug saw a workout last night that I thought you would love that im going to give a try at some point. Its very similar to 5/3/1 but geared more towards powerlifting and has multiple top sets instead of 1 like 5/3/1 which I do feel is better. Its called GZCL. Its the same in that you do a 4 week waved rep scheme and then add weight. Seems really well set out and gets a lot of work in above that 85% range which is what you need for strength.

Your shoulder workout is exactly what I will be doing Doug. Dips, Rows and Rehab work.

Deadlifts: (80x5, 102.5x5, 122.5x3) WO 142.5x3, 162.5x3, 182.5x2 PM 194.5kg
BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Ok so I missed my 3rd rep of 182.5 which is slightly disappointing but the BBB sets were the fastest they have ever been, every rep was clean and fast so definitely progressing on these. Few more weeks and I recon I will go up to 150 and just concentrate on making these fast and stupidly easy for a long time. Once I can do that for 5x5 then i will definitely be pretty strong.

Im going to run GZCL for my lower body exercises for a little while and see how things go. 5/3/1 just doesnt seem to be working on my lower body movements. Yes i have set PRs but its like 2.5kg and then I'm stuck again and need to deload. Work back up over a few months and then 2.5kg progress. Its not good enough so time to try something just a little bit different but still quite close.

But the half my brain is saying why change what is working slowly. I could hit my 3 reps on deadlift next week and I could hit 3 reps on squats which would be a 5kg PR. I just think the multiple heavy sets is better for lower body.

Ok so been really looking into my records and it just seems that 5/3/1 doesnt work for me. I started 5/3/1 on 17th September 2012 and i have made bugger all progress so time to change things up and see what happens from now on. I will finish this cycle and then go in a different direction.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thanks Doug. I dont get to down about it as I know my shoulder is buggered anyway. I do like to keep some Shoulder work in there as when I was doing BBB OHP it actually really helped with the pain. i think if i keep my OHP strength up then it does seem to help my shoulder.
> 
> Doug saw a workout last night that I thought you would love that im going to give a try at some point. Its very similar to 5/3/1 but geared more towards powerlifting and has multiple top sets instead of 1 like 5/3/1 which I do feel is better. Its called GZCL. Its the same in that you do a 4 week waved rep scheme and then add weight. Seems really well set out and gets a lot of work in above that 85% range which is what you need for strength.
> 
> Your shoulder workout is exactly what I will be doing Doug. Dips, Rows and Rehab work.
> 
> Deadlifts: (80x5, 102.5x5, 122.5x3) WO 142.5x3, 162.5x3, 182.5x2 PM 194.5kg
> BBB Sets: 130x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Ok so I missed my 3rd rep of 182.5 which is slightly disappointing but the BBB sets were the fastest they have ever been, every rep was clean and fast so definitely progressing on these. Few more weeks and I recon I will go up to 150 and just concentrate on making these fast and stupidly easy for a long time. Once I can do that for 5x5 then i will definitely be pretty strong.
> 
> Im going to run GZCL for my lower body exercises for a little while and see how things go. 5/3/1 just doesnt seem to be working on my lower body movements. Yes i have set PRs but its like 2.5kg and then I'm stuck again and need to deload. Work back up over a few months and then 2.5kg progress. Its not good enough so time to try something just a little bit different but still quite close.
> 
> But the half my brain is saying why change what is working slowly. I could hit my 3 reps on deadlift next week and I could hit 3 reps on squats which would be a 5kg PR. I just think the multiple heavy sets is better for lower body.
> 
> Ok so been really looking into my records and it just seems that 5/3/1 doesnt work for me. I started 5/3/1 on 17th September 2012 and i have made bugger all progress so time to change things up and see what happens from now on. I will finish this cycle and then go in a different direction.


Nice find James, love the idea of more heavy work, Im going to formulate a workout around the GZCL principles. I agree the 5/3/1 can lack in areas but I rate it as a routine either way.

I would say for the Squat that the 5/3/1 can lack enough time under the bar to help with confidence (IMHO the number one reason for failing the lift)


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 94.5KGX3 - 108KGX3 - 121.5KGX3

DEAD BENCH PRESS (30 Seconds Rest) 100KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KGX10X10X10X10X10*

All good, getting used to the dead bench and its feeling much easier this week :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice find James, love the idea of more heavy work, Im going to formulate a workout around the GZCL principles. I agree the 5/3/1 can lack in areas but I rate it as a routine either way.
> 
> I would say for the Squat that the 5/3/1 can lack enough time under the bar to help with confidence (IMHO the number one reason for failing the lift)


Ya 5/3/1 seems to work incredibly well for my upper body but Ive made 21kg progress on my squat and 11.5kg progress on my deadlift in 3 yrs. That is pathetic. Wouldnt mind if I was at a decent level but I'm not.

I think you either need higher frequency or higher volume. 5/3/1 doesnt have either and I have heard a lot of people far more experienced and clever than me complain about losing strength on their squats. One last 5/3/1 squat workout tomorrow and then I will be starting GCZL. It will only be for one 4 week cycle as Im starting Candito 6 week plan next month but it will at least give me a taster for whats to come when I run it eventually. I will be working out 4 times per week, 1 bench, 1 deadlift and 2 squat days. Want to bring my squat up.

Candito should be good as its a high frequency program and I havent heard 1 bad thing about it yet so will be doing 2 cycles of this. Be completely different than the low volume/frequency of 5/3/1.

1 of the things that has always bugged me about 5/3/1 is its lack of compliance with Prilepin's chart whereas GCZL is dead inline with Prilepin suggestions. 


Week 1 - 85% -3x5 - 15reps
Week 2 - 90% - 4x3 - 12 reps
Week 3 - 97.5% - 3x1 - 3 reps

Bench (50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x15 PM 153.5kg :doublesho
350 Method: 60x15,10,11
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,8

So that a big 3.5kg PR on bench. My bench just seems to gain so easily. Thats 25kg gain in 3 yrs so the most gain out of any exercise which shouldnt be the case. I'm very happy with 8.3kg gain per year, ya it doesnt sound like much but if I could keep this progress up then I would have a 180kg bench in 3 years. Such a simple workout as well, hit a top set on bench, do some back off sets and then some volume back work, simples.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ya 5/3/1 seems to work incredibly well for my upper body but Ive made 21kg progress on my squat and 11.5kg progress on my deadlift in 3 yrs. That is pathetic. Wouldnt mind if I was at a decent level but I'm not.
> 
> I think you either need higher frequency or higher volume. 5/3/1 doesnt have either and I have heard a lot of people far more experienced and clever than me complain about losing strength on their squats. One last 5/3/1 squat workout tomorrow and then I will be starting GCZL. It will only be for one 4 week cycle as Im starting Candito 6 week plan next month but it will at least give me a taster for whats to come when I run it eventually. I will be working out 4 times per week, 1 bench, 1 deadlift and 2 squat days. Want to bring my squat up.
> 
> Candito should be good as its a high frequency program and I havent heard 1 bad thing about it yet so will be doing 2 cycles of this. Be completely different than the low volume/frequency of 5/3/1.
> 
> 1 of the things that has always bugged me about 5/3/1 is its lack of compliance with Prilepin's chart whereas GCZL is dead inline with Prilepin suggestions.
> 
> 
> Week 1 - 85% -3x5 - 15reps
> Week 2 - 90% - 4x3 - 12 reps
> Week 3 - 97.5% - 3x1 - 3 reps
> 
> Bench (50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) 77.5x5, 90x5, 102.5x15 PM 153.5kg :doublesho
> 350 Method: 60x15,10,11
> Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,8
> 
> So that a big 3.5kg PR on bench. My bench just seems to gain so easily. Thats 25kg gain in 3 yrs so the most gain out of any exercise which shouldnt be the case. I'm very happy with 8.3kg gain per year, ya it doesnt sound like much but if I could keep this progress up then I would have a 180kg bench in 3 years. Such a simple workout as well, hit a top set on bench, do some back off sets and then some volume back work, simples.


Nice bench James! :thumb:

Have taken a another look at GZCL and worked out my first cycle. On the face of it, it does look very, very good. I like the idea of training at much higher percentages, even if you fail from time to time, the constant time under the bar with heavy weight will work if your determined to succeed.

I'm going to stick with 5/3/1 for a while and get my 100% maxes up to where they were December/Jan. Even though the GZCL is different it is very similar in that you use 3 phases in your training session. I imagine recovery will be very important while on GZCL. Over all the GZCL is the first program to really entice me, since finding the original 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Fooling around with the deadlift 

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 150.5GX3 - 172KGX3 - 193.5KGX3

DEADLIFT 200KGX2 - 200KGX1

DEADLIFT 170KGX3X3X3X3X3*

Tried a session with higher percentage of 1RM weights, just to get a feel of GZCL.

1. Not for beginners :devil:
2. Recovery, recovery and Recovery! :thumb:
3. You really should reduce your 1RM calculations as recommended, or you'll probably fail really quickly 
4. Feels good to use heavy weights :thumb:
5. If I were to use a GZCL approach to training I would change the first assistance rep range to 5 and but still use a 10 rep scheme on the superset work.

Thanks for the heads up on GZCL James, I'm am seriously considering this at some point.


----------



## Bod42

Thought it would be right up your ally mate.

I'm thinking of running it for a cycle. My only issue is that its so similar to 5/3/1 and i didnt like the mental aspect of 5/3/1 for lower body as just because you got the 5s week doesnt mean you will get the 3s week and so on so I seem to worry every week of the month. Whereas with the same rep range each week, if I got 2 reps last week then this week I will either get 2 reps or 3 reps. Simple. But suppose I can run GZCL the same, i will just go by feel on the day and if its not on then stay on it for another month.

I just like how it has more volume and is inline with Prilepins Chart.

I am also working on an extremely simple but automatically waving volume program for slow steady gains. Its actually what I recommend people for training arms and I used it to have the best arm gains ever so I'm basically implementing it into the larger exercises. Anyone who has followed this thread closely will notice I also use the same progression for Chin ups.

There are a number of famous GZCL sets & rep progression suggestions so which one are you going for Doug? I'm going with his latest Simplified program and the example shown at the bottom so you wave the first & second exercises week to week http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2014/07/the-gzcl-method-simplified_13.html These are the 3 workouts I have captured so far, 1 is his original plan, 2 is his simplified version and 3 is just 1 i found on BB.com Excel if your interested https://www.dropbox.com/s/xxgp5nr60o48d5l/GZCL.xlsx?dl=0


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thought it would be right up your ally mate.
> 
> I'm thinking of running it for a cycle. My only issue is that its so similar to 5/3/1 and i didnt like the mental aspect of 5/3/1 for lower body as just because you got the 5s week doesnt mean you will get the 3s week and so on so I seem to worry every week of the month. Whereas with the same rep range each week, if I got 2 reps last week then this week I will either get 2 reps or 3 reps. Simple. But suppose I can run GZCL the same, i will just go by feel on the day and if its not on then stay on it for another month.
> 
> I just like how it has more volume and is inline with Prilepins Chart.
> 
> I am also working on an extremely simple but automatically waving volume program for slow steady gains. Its actually what I recommend people for training arms and I used it to have the best arm gains ever so I'm basically implementing it into the larger exercises. Anyone who has followed this thread closely will notice I also use the same progression for Chin ups.
> 
> There are a number of famous GZCL sets & rep progression suggestions so which one are you going for Doug? I'm going with his latest Simplified program and the example shown at the bottom so you wave the first & second exercises week to week http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2014/07/the-gzcl-method-simplified_13.html These are the 3 workouts I have captured so far, 1 is his original plan, 2 is his simplified version and 3 is just 1 i found on BB.com Excel if your interested https://www.dropbox.com/s/xxgp5nr60o48d5l/GZCL.xlsx?dl=0


You know me too well 

I wouldn't worry to much about the similarity to 5/3/1, you'll notice they are all similar in many respects.

I've only just started looking at GZCL so have no idea which approach to take, I might even make something up for myself using the GZCL percentages for the work sets, followed by a 5 rep primary assistance session and lastly a secondary light 10 rep scheme.

So a day would look like this:

*Warm up to GZCL work sets
5 rep primary assistance sets with progressive overload
10 rep secondary assistance sets with intuitive increase in weights*

Definitely interested in the excel mate :thumb:

If I do a variation of GZCL I would still do it in 3 week phases followed by a de load week. I'm going to work a full month plan probably this weekend 

I am just the same in regard these monthly progressing workouts mate, one failure and that month has no progress in weight for the next.

There is nothing stopping us doing a 3 rep scheme same weight each week until you go past the designated reps, then add weight, all these programs are just giving us a structure, they are not cut in stone mate and we have enough experience to build our own routines. Which in a way I will be doing if I try a pseudo GZCL routine :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just noticed the recommendations for rest while going through GZCL - "3-8 minutes"

Due to the higher percentage of weights used and my own experience with rest on heavy work. I would totally agree. You will feel rested within 2-3 minutes but you need to allow your CNS to recover ready for the next heavy set. The biggest downside of this is your workout can be significantly increased in its duration just by sitting around 

A Bench work set of 122.5KG 5x3 can take over 30 minutes! That's around 2.5 minutes lifting and 27.5 minutes sitting around! :doublesho :doublesho 

Example of my first week Bench session (Based on using 90% of a reduced TM = 135KG)

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 70X5 100X3) - 121.5KGX5X3

DEAD BENCH PRESS (30 Seconds Rest) 100KGX10x1

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 15KG5X10 *

I've really basterdised the GZCL so its not GZCL now. It is now the ITHAQVA© Cycle!  I'm going to play with the weights during this 5/3/1 cycle to get a feel of using more heavy weight during the work sets to get a much better idea of what weight can be used without failing make the reps too soon, the formulate a new training strategy for the next cycle :thumb:

I'm going to post the full months cycle and appreciate any feedback as this is 100% bro science!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - Session 3

*DIPS BODYWEIGHT+7.5KGX10X10X10X10X7 Arms were so pumped/weak, I found it difficult to lockout on last set lol!

BLUE BAND PULLUPS+17.5KGX10X10X8X8X7

BARBELL ROW 92.5KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Good workout, starting to find the dips and pull ups challenging which is good :thumb:

Rested 2 minutes between Barbell rows and held breath during each of the 5 rep sets to keep core tight, feels right.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 126KGX3 - 144KGX3 - 162KGX3

SQUAT 180KGX1 - 190KGX0

DEAD SQUAT (40 Seconds Rest) 125KGX1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUTS 200KGX1X1X1X1X1*

Had a play with the squat after the work sets, not disappointed in failing the 190KG as I failed due to giving up far to quickly and ran out of puff because I allowed it to stay in the bottom position far too long :wall:  The weight itself did not feel as heavy as I expected.

Squat Walkouts and dead Squats felt a lot more natural this time around.

Tip for squat walkout - When un racking keep your feet around shoulder width apart, this felt far more stable and safe than my normal (Slightly wider than shoulder width stance that I generally use) Obviously once I'm in position I bring my feet apart to my usual squat stance.

I'm really liking the squat walkout as its making me feel far more confident with 200Kg on my back :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: (70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 145x3, 162.5x5 PM 189.5kg PR :thumb: 10kg away from 200kg, what a mile stone. I have 4 months to add 10kg to my total. Can i do it, I think I can. 
BBB Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5

Deloaded but then hit a rep PR so really happy with that. Then i did my back off sets and these were nice and fast, probably the fastest theyve ever been so to hit a PR and then hit basically a speed PR on my back off sets, it was a good workout all round. Still not the progress I want though and I know theres more out there.

Will be starting GZCL on the lower body movements tonight. I will also be increasing my squatting frequency so my week will be 
Mon - Squats
Tues - Bench
Thurs - Squats
Fri - Deadlifts

Increased frequency and increased volume will probably result in a very hard program but this will hopefully result in some nice gains. I will be front squatting as my assistance exercise on thurs to avoid any over use injuries.

To give people a little more idea on the GZCL program i will be doing the following.
Week 1 - 85% - 3x5, 65% - 4x8
Week 2 - 90% - 4x3, 70% - 5x6
Week 3 - 87.5% - 1x3, 92.5% - 2x2, 97.5% - 3x1, 75% - 5x5
Week 4 - 90% - 1x3, 95% - 1x2, 100% - 1x1+, 80% - 5x4

So as you can see its a nice intense workout with some medium rep range back off sets so should be good. I'm hoping most work in the 85%+ range will be more specific and therefore lead to better strength gains.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Hi James, NICE LIFTS mate! Good to see you progressing :thumb:

I've PM'd you some creations of my own :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Ok so my first write up on my new GZCL program. I am progressing nicely on bench on 5/3/1 and my shoulder is shot so I cant really do the low rep work thats outlined in the GZCL program but boy would I like to. So due to that I'm sticking to 5/3/1 on my bench and GZCL for lower body.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 110x3, 125x2, 142.5x1) WO 157.5x5,5,5
Back Off Sets: 120x8,8,8,8

All I can say is what an awesome workout. Havent worked this hard in ages so i am extremely confident that this workout will improve my strength. Its quite simple when you think about it, tonight I did 15 reps in the 85%+ range, on 5/3/1 I was doing 3 reps so I have done 5 times the amount of work. And the back off sets were perfect for me. First set was nice and fast but last set took some mental strength to complete.

All in all, a great first workout.

Been reading a lot of research on frequency of training and Weight lifting is pretty simple really. If you destroy yourself in the gym during a workout then you need longer to recover but if you do a lighter workout with less volume/intensity then you can workout more often. This is why full body training works as your normally hitting say chest for 3 sets which doesnt take long to recover from but if you train chest once per week you could be hitting 15 sets which will take longer to recover from. Make perfect and simple sense really. This is why on 5/3/1 you either need more volume or more frequency to be optimal I believe.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Glad GZCL is going well for you James. I'll be on something like it after next weeks de load :thumb:

Week 3 - 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101KGX5 - 114.5KGX3 - 128KGX1

DEAD BENCH PRESS (30 Seconds Rest) 105KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 17.5KGX10X10X10X10X7*

Please with the workout, Bench felt easy enough at 128Kg. Pull ups are slowly progressing now, just need one more complete set of 10 reps and I can strap 20Kg to my body :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press : (WU 50x5, 60x5, 72.5x3) WO 85x3, 95x3, 107.5x11 PM 147kg
350 Method: 60x22,15,13 Total 50
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,9

All in all a good workout. Shoulder was hurting all day so I probably left 2-3 reps in the tank, I just went until I could feel my shoulder and then shut it down. Means I would have set another PR. Bench is flying at the minute but the more I read the more I can see why. I have unintentionally done a strength phase, deloaded and followed it up with a hypertrophy phase. Will be doing the same thing on my lower body in the future.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - 5/3/1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 161GX5 - 183KGX3 - 205KGX1 - 220KGX1 PR! :thumb:

DEADLIFT 150KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 110KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Probably one of the best deadlift sessions for a while. The 220KG went up easier than expected but my missus did say the upper back/shoulder area was a bit rounded. I'll stay on this weight and tidy the rep up before moving on.

According to GZCL the first assistance set should have been at 80% :doublesho That's 5 sets of 5 at 176KG. I didn't feel confident that I could have done many sets at that weight so decided to go for 150KG to get a good feel. Typical! The 150 felt ok with no real grinders.

Hopefully I can improve my squat on Sunday and get some good heavier time under the bar :thumb:

This flexible approach to training is definitely a better approach.


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 - 5/3/1
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 161GX5 - 183KGX3 - 205KGX1 - 220KGX1 PR! :thumb:
> 
> DEADLIFT 150KGX5X5X5X5X5
> 
> RDL 110KGX5X5X5X5X5*
> 
> Probably one of the best deadlift sessions for a while. The 220KG went up easier than expected but my missus did say the upper back/shoulder area was a bit rounded. I'll stay on this weight and tidy the rep up before moving on.
> 
> According to GZCL the first assistance set should have been at 80% :doublesho That's 5 sets of 5 at 176KG. I didn't feel confident that I could have done many sets at that weight so decided to go for 150KG to get a good feel. Typical! The 150 felt ok with no real grinders.
> 
> Hopefully I can improve my squat on Sunday and get some good heavier time under the bar :thumb:
> 
> This flexible approach to training is definitely a better approach.


Awesome lift Doug, hell impressive


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Awesome lift Doug, hell impressive


Thanks Lee 
I need to keep my form clean so I can get to my final goal of 230KGX1. Then focus hard on my Squat and bench as they have fallen back a bit since the beginning of this year.


----------



## Bod42

Congrats on the PR mate. Awesome lift right there. I was hoping to hit 220kg before I diet down but not going to happen. Theres just something really cool about having 5 plates each side.

The GZCL template I'm on calls for 75% for 5x5. And remember that 220kg was a PR but GZCL suggests using a weight that you can get 1 rep any day of the week and 3 reps when you feel great and a grind. So 220x90% give you 3 rep max of 198. Then 75% of that is 149kg so I would say you were bang on with your 150kg sets.


----------



## Guru

Great deadlift there Doug. Congrats!

Upper back rounding is okay, as long as it does not get transferred to the lower portion. In fact, I remember Dave Tate mentioning in an article (can't find it now) that he uses that as a tactic when competing - it reduces the ROM ever so slightly.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Congrats on the PR mate. Awesome lift right there. I was hoping to hit 220kg before I diet down but not going to happen. Theres just something really cool about having 5 plates each side.
> 
> The GZCL template I'm on calls for 75% for 5x5. And remember that 220kg was a PR but GZCL suggests using a weight that you can get 1 rep any day of the week and 3 reps when you feel great and a grind. So 220x90% give you 3 rep max of 198. Then 75% of that is 149kg so I would say you were bang on with your 150kg sets.


Thanks James :thumb:

I'm going to have to read up the GZCL again. James can you send the link to me please. I've got next weeks de load to decide which template to use.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Great deadlift there Doug. Congrats!
> 
> Upper back rounding is okay, as long as it does not get transferred to the lower portion. In fact, I remember Dave Tate mentioning in an article (can't find it now) that he uses that as a tactic when competing - it reduces the ROM ever so slightly.


Thanks Guru :thumb:

I didn't feel unsafe, unlike middle to lower back rounding. But I'm going to sort the form out. If I can do the 220 rep with a straight back it will indicate good overall strength ready for my final push to 230 and possibly beyond (Looks like I'm going to need to buy some more plates )


----------



## Guru

Guru said:


> Great deadlift there Doug. Congrats!
> 
> Upper back rounding is okay, as long as it does not get transferred to the lower portion. In fact, I remember Dave Tate mentioning in an article (can't find it now) that he uses that as a tactic when competing - it reduces the ROM ever so slightly.


Hah, found the article -

https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-dead-zone

Go to Mistake #2 -



> Mistake #2: Pulling the shoulder blades together
> This is a mistake I made for years. Stand in a deadlift stance and pull your shoulder blades together. Take a look at where your fingertips are. Now if you let your shoulders relax and even round forward a little you'll see your fingertips are much lower. This is why we teach a rounding of the upper back. First, the bar has to travel a shorter distance. Second, there's less stress on the shoulder region. It'll also help to keep your shoulder blades behind the bar. You'll read more on this later.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Hah, found the article -
> 
> https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-dead-zone
> 
> Go to Mistake #2 -


Thanks Guru :thumb:

Allowing the rounding to protect the shoulders makes total sense. I have noticed as the weight gets heavier that the shoulders are pulled into this rounding position naturally. Nice observation Guru. Worth everyone making a mental note of this as the shoulder area is a very vulnerable part of the physique.

Do you lift Guru?.............If so why arent you posting on here


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks James :thumb:
> 
> I'm going to have to read up the GZCL again. James can you send the link to me please. I've got next weeks de load to decide which template to use.


Doug theres the link and the 3 updates. 
http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2012/11/the-gzcl-method-for-powerlifting.html

You can buy all his writting in an ebook for like $1 if you cant be bothered searching around for info.

And I totally agree about the upper back rounding. Some World class deadlifters pull with their upper back rounded as long as its not the lower.

Squats: (WU 45x5, 75x5, 105x3, 120x2, 135x1) WO 150x5,5,5
Back off Sets: 115x8,8,8

So this workout completely gassed me, I mean heart beating hard and heavy breathing. I laid down between a few of the last sets and with 2:30 rest I was sitting up after what I thought was a small rest with like 15 secs remaining before I had to get under the bar. Back and legs was rediculously pumped and then comes the real nemesis after a big squat workout, the stairs up to your front door :lol:

But all in all, I am working so much harder on these multiple sets than I ever could on 5/3/1. This just has to produce more progress than 5/3/1. After 1 week, even the Mrs is saying I'm harder and bigger so its obviously doing something right. Dont worry I know its only been a week so way to early to tell but the signs so far are good. Looking forward to hitting a PR at the end of this month.

I have basically come to the conclusion that sets across are better than just 1 top set. Top sets have their place but more for rep records, you still need your volume work to build that strength I feel. I feel this is why I have made progress on my bench with 5/3/1 and not squats and deadlifts as i moved the rep range up so got in more volume. And it seems that CWS agrees with me which is nice lol http://www.jtstrong.com/articles/logs/extended-531-schemes-and-juggfood-network/ 5/3/1 maybe better as 10/8/5, well my bench has been 10/8/6 so close enough. This gives you more volume and therefore progress but then with the higher reps you lose specificity for strength gains.


----------



## Guru

Thanks Doug. As you said, shoulders are naturally pulled into the rounding position when you really go heavy. However, there's a small catch - try to still keep your chest high. Otherwise the rounding can quickly spread to the lower parts and other thing - your shoulders literally try to get pulled out of their sockets. Needless to say, looking up helps.

I do lift Doug - well, I can say that now. I did slip into a hiatus a few months back and getting back onto the bandwagon was a big mental battle. However, about a month and a half back I threw my hat to the other side of the fence (paid up gym subscription for an year in advance), and that has helped me get back on track.

I started with baby weights of course, but now after two cycles on 5-3-1, the AMRAP sets indicate that I have climbed back up to a reasonable position. As for posting here, I've been maintaining a log at Ironstrong dot com, where I have a few fellow loggers from SL days and was wary logging at two places, but I can always just copy-paste my logging from there to here, can't I?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Thanks Doug. As you said, shoulders are naturally pulled into the rounding position when you really go heavy. However, there's a small catch - try to still keep your chest high. Otherwise the rounding can quickly spread to the lower parts and other thing - your shoulders literally try to get pulled out of their sockets. Needless to say, looking up helps.
> 
> I do lift Doug - well, I can say that now. I did slip into a hiatus a few months back and getting back onto the bandwagon was a big mental battle. However, about a month and a half back I threw my hat to the other side of the fence (paid up gym subscription for an year in advance), and that has helped me get back on track.
> 
> I started with baby weights of course, but now after two cycles on 5-3-1, the AMRAP sets indicate that I have climbed back up to a reasonable position. As for posting here, I've been maintaining a log at Ironstrong dot com, where I have a few fellow loggers from SL days and was wary logging at two places, but I can always just copy-paste my logging from there to here, can't I?


Good on you for getting back into your lifting. I know just how difficult it can be after time off :thumb:

Yes you can, post away mate! Will be good to see more posting on here :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sorry no posts this weekend. Blame the LE MANS! :thumb::thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 40x5, 52.5x5, 62.5x3) WO 77.5x5, 87.5x3, 115x10 PM 153.5kg
350 Method: 70x20,15,8 Total 43
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,9,9

Ok this was an easy workout, such an easy workout that I was questioning the weights on every single set. The 115 for 10 was quite easy, easily had 11 in me which would have been another PR record.

Then increased my 350 method weight by 10kg and still hit 20 reps on the first set so was frantically checking my old sheets as it felt to easy.

And Pendlay rows were so fast that they were smashing into my chest.

So summary another awesome workout.

BUT I am completely flip reversing my goals on Monday 22nd June. I am making brilliant gains at the minute so its bad timing but Paul Carter of Lift Run Bang, a lifter I really respect and agree with, is running his next installment of his personal training program "Maximum Muscle Mass" which I have signed up for. I am fed up of losing so much strength while I diet so I thought that I would put it in the hands of a pro and let him tailor my diet and training. So from Monday I will be on a fat lose plan for 10 weeks.

But I feel like I have learned the most about myself during this training cycle that I ever have and feel really confident that once I finish my diet I can start back on the strength route and make some really good gains. Reading all the top trainers program they all have similarities that I will be implementing into my training.


----------



## Guru

Nice benching James. Have you tested your real max recently?

Referring to some discussion on the previous page, I decided to cross post my workouts here. I actually am between programs. Having completed two cycles of loose 5-3-1, I now am planning to start a routine focusing on deadlift and overhead press. But till I decide about the new routine, yesterday was a workout to sort of test the strength.

Tuesday, 16/06/2015 -

Deadlift - 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 5, 185lb x 3, 205lb x 3, 225lb x 3, 235lb x 2.
Seated cable rows - 50kg x 15, 60kg x 15, 70kg x 7.
Decline sit-ups - 3x15 with a 10lb plate on my chest.
Side bends - 3x10 each side with a 45lb plate.

BW - about 59kg (130lb)


----------



## Bod42

Na I dont really test maxes and especially on bench as my shoulder is buggered and i find heavy low rep work really aggravates it so I stick to higher rep work.

Also I am a firm believer that there is a big difference between testing and training. I dont compete so testing is actually useless and cuts into training time so I hit rep maxes when and where I can if I feel like it.

Thanks for posting and awesome lifts for your BW. Chase that double BW deadlift.


----------



## Jeli

I see there's been some big lifts. Congrats guys.

Body weight is stuck at 162Ib (73Kg) but I'm 7.5% body fat and now ready for hols in 2 weeks time.

Training was bumped up from 3 days a week to 4. Strength shot down but is slowly coming back tho not anywhere near to pre diet.

The home gym has another dumbbell rack for the 30Kg - 47.5Kg. 6ft punch / kick bag is up and a 6' x 4' mirror for checking form 

I'd like a compact calf machine as it's a faff doing these seated on the end of a bench with dumbbells.


----------



## Guru

7.5% BF? Are you competing in Bodybuilding?


----------



## Jeli

Guru said:


> 7.5% BF? Are you competing in Bodybuilding?


No I'm not competing this was just for me. Over the years (14 of them!) I've trained regularly but not focussed on a clean diet. I wanted to see what I could achieve and started my diet around Feb time. I'm sure the holiday will put an end to maintaining low body fat!


----------



## Guru

Tried heavy pressing yesterday.

Thursday, 18/06/2015 -

OHP - 45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, 75lb x 5, 85lb x 3, 95lb x 3, 100lb x 3, 105lb x 3. Yesssss! :devil:
One arm D/B rows - 35lbs x 10, 40lbs x 10.
One arm D/B press - 25lb x 10, 30lb x 10
Face pulls - 25kg - 3x15.

Mighty pleased with the press. This is around 48kg which was my 1 RM yet. Felt reasonably strong too, although on one of the rep I felt the bar was moving forward.


----------



## Guru

Friday, 19/06/2015 -

Squats - 155lb - 3x5.
45 Deg. Leg Press - 230lb - 3x10
Side bends - 3x10 with a 45lb plate.
Ab machine crunches - 35kg - 1x30.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Nice to see the extra posts guys, nice lifting Guru welcome to the team  :thumb:


I'm on my last day of my de load week, then back on lifting Tuesday :devil:


Will be starting a new workout next week, which I've emailed to James for scrutiny :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

So first day of my weight loss program and he calls this a break in week so as you imagine its quite easy but good as it lets you decide what weights to do on the new exercises.
Squats: 50x5, 85x3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 27.5x5, 42.5x5, 70x12
Lying Band Leg curls (Rest Pause): Red Bandx10,10,10
Split Squats: As many as possible in 3 mins. 35 each leg

So a very easy workout, 85 doesnt even feel like you have anything on your back and moves stupidly fast. It was good though as my flatmate is now training with me so was good to start light and check his form as he comes from a Body building backround and has a few injuries that we will try and correct during this program. After just 5 sets he made a massive improvement and said he felt way more powerful so I can see making good strength gains even on a diet mostly due to technique. 

Havent front squatted in a long long time but these actually felt really good.

The density training was also new to me but I can see why this works so well. You dont have set reps or rest periods, your just trying to get more total reps than last week which is a nice mental test and a great pump finisher.


----------



## Guru

Nice light workout James. Break-in week sounds like a damn good idea. Will be interesting to see how this pans out for you.

Monday, 22/06/2015 -

OHP - (WU)45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, 85lb x 3, (Work) 90lb x 3, 95lb x 2, 100lb - 1,1,1.
Lat pull down - 45kg - 3x8.
D/B reverse flyes - 2x10lb - 3x10.

So, I've started with a new program from yesterday. It's based on Surovetsky's 9 week template for deadlifts, but I'm going to use it for both deads and press. Made a mistake on the very first day - should have estimated OHP max slightly conservatively to begin with. Anyway, no problems finishing the workout, but I can see that this will become very hard very soon, so I'm going to correct the max next workout onwards.


----------



## ITHAQVA

June-Week 1 - GZCL

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110.5KGX3 - 113.5KG2X2X2 - 117KG3X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 104KG7X5X5X5X5X5X5X5*

NICE! :thumb:

First go at the GZCL and it feels dam good. However this approach to lifting is going to become very taxing on the CNS. I can see why it is recommended that the 3rd tier is light work. After the heavy lifting, particularly the secondary work set, you don't want anymore heavy work, you know you've done enough  Might be easier for you young guys but im coming up to 47 soon, so go easy on the old chap! 

I do intend on having a 3rd tier, but I was a bit lazy today :tumbleweed:

I noticed a huge amount of pump from the secondary work set and I mean all the upper body. The secondary work set weight was just right not too difficult to complete but just right to make me work for the sets :thumb:

The primary work sets were of medium difficulty and the lower rep range did make for quicker recovery.

During the work sets I took 5 minute rest between sets and during the secondary work sets I took between 4-5 minute rest. Problem with heavy lifting is you don't feel taxed until you attempt another heavy set and if not correctly rested you'll just not have the strength to lift the weight. I have found this to be particularly problematic in the bench press.

I have read that when doing the GZCL you can go up to 7 minutes rest I used 7 minutes on all my work sets up until Dec/Jan this year.

Overall I love the extra heavier work sets, I'm going to keep at the GZCL and see what results I can achieve :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Guru - Ya I'm keen to see where I get to with this program. Have to send diet, pics and workout logs to Paul Carter every sunday and he will adjust my diet and training so I dont even have to think about anything. I can see from the onset how this program will work well with dieting as you only have 1 really hard week in 5 so you know mentally that you just have to get through that and your sweet.

Doug - Looks like you got your lifts spot on, main exercise should be nice and fast, never a hard grind and never the risk of missing a lift but then your 2nd tier stuff is just volume so i found the 1st few sets to be really fast but then I had to work on the last few sets. 

Workout 2
Bench Press: 42.5x5, 70x5, 102.5x4,4,4,14
Incline Dumbell Press: 10x5, 17.5x5, 27.5x12
Incline Flyes (RP): 12.5x10,10,10
Bent Over laterals: 10 mins AMAP 5kgx110 reps

Another easy workout to start but I was in quite a lot of pain tonight so the strength was there but was mental to get over the pain. Shoulder was hurting and sending pain down my bicep and hurt the closer I got to my chest. Also hurt my left hand some how so was extremely hard to concentrate when you have pain on both side :wall: But on the positive side, you have to hit 12 reps to increase your weight by 5% and i did this. Also the 3x4rep sets are actually really good as the weight felt heavy for all these sets but by the time I got to the last set I unracked the bar and asked my mate if it had his 80kg instead of my 102.5 on it as it felt stupidly light.

Havent done dumbell work in years so Incline and flyes felt very different. Hardest thing is getting the dumbells in place especially when you cant use your bicep muscle on your right arm. Again hit 12 so increase the weight. Will probably stick to 12.5 kgs for the entire 10 weeks on flyes as i feel these are a stretch exercise not a weight exercise.

Oh and working rear delts for 10 mins is brutal at the same time as being cool. But who here couldnt do with some more rear delt work. Will be good for my shoulder as well.


----------



## Guru

Nice start there Doug, and don't worry about the age - I'm an year ahead of you, closing in on 48.

James - would look forward to how Week 5 treats you. Bummer on the shoulder - it sounds nasty. Take care - if it gets beyond a certain point it could take ages to recover. On the other hand, lots of light rear delt work is probably one of the best things for it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Nice start there Doug, and don't worry about the age - I'm an year ahead of you, closing in on 48.


Strength thread has to old gits! 

Yeah, it all felt as though I'd chosen some good starting weights. I most certainly felt different from 5/3/1. There are many sets in 5/3/1 that felt too easy, I'm hoping this higher percentage training will get me to my goals and the might possibly motivate me to go heavier, but we will see.

You feel the changes in the training percentages though :devil:

:thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Anyone use straps? My fingers are starting to hurt when deadlifting!


----------



## Guru

Are you using mixed grip?


----------



## Estoril-5

Guru said:


> Are you using mixed grip?


If you mean alternate, then no. I prefer both hands in the same position


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> If you mean alternate, then no. I prefer both hands in the same position


We all felt like this at the beginning :thumb:

I would move over to a mixed grip once you find deadlifting 130Kg-140Kg that your hands are opening up (5 rep range)

Why? Because you'll be restricting your deadlift hugely if worrying about concentrating on a double overhand grip, simples! :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Thanks Chief, will take some getting used to but I'll give it a shot


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Thanks Chief, will take some getting used to but I'll give it a shot


It'll feel odd for a very little while then you'll be deadlifting PR's all over the place :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Talking of Deadlifts 

Week 1 - GZCL - June

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 187GX3 - 192.5KG2X2 - 198KG3X1X1X1

DEADLIFT 155KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 75KGX10X10X10X10X10*

I love the deadlift! 

Really good session, odd thing was the last set on the primary work sets (198Kg) felt the easiest 

Took 5 mins rest throughout the primary and secondary work sets and 1 minute rest on the RDL assistance sets.

I think I may have started a bit heavy but I'll adjust if need be next month :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Guru - Yep shoulder has been dislocated 7 times and ended my rugby career so its pretty messed up but no way was I going to let a surgeon cut it open and mess it up even more at such a young age so I'm just holding on to it as long as possible. If I stay on top of my rehab work then its manageable, just the last injury was slightly different so just finding the approach that works this time. Ive learned the different between bad pain and trapped nerve pain so I can still train, its just off putting.

Estoril-5 - as Doug said definitely change to Mixed grip. I would still do all your warm up sets with DOH and then change to MG on your work sets. Some people worry about getting an imbalance on different sides of the body due to the very slightly different pull mechanism but just switch the MG up during the workout to balance some of the work.

Doug - Maybe the last set felt easiest as you were warmed up. Remember the stronger you are the more warm up sets you need to get to your work weight and 57kg is quite a jump to your first work set. Just think if you stay with the same warmups then you will be jumping 68kg between warmup and work sets in your 3rd week, thats a lot.
My GZCL warm up is: (inputted your weights)
30% x 5 = 65
50% x 5 = 110
70% x 3 = 155
80% x 2 = 175

Remember the 5/3/1 recommended warmup is fine on that workout as your first work set is 65% but on GZCL your first workset will be at 90% so you need to warm up further.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Guru - Yep shoulder has been dislocated 7 times and ended my rugby career so its pretty messed up but no way was I going to let a surgeon cut it open and mess it up even more at such a young age so I'm just holding on to it as long as possible. If I stay on top of my rehab work then its manageable, just the last injury was slightly different so just finding the approach that works this time. Ive learned the different between bad pain and trapped nerve pain so I can still train, its just off putting.
> 
> Estoril-5 - as Doug said definitely change to Mixed grip. I would still do all your warm up sets with DOH and then change to MG on your work sets. Some people worry about getting an imbalance on different sides of the body due to the very slightly different pull mechanism but just switch the MG up during the workout to balance some of the work.
> 
> Doug - Maybe the last set felt easiest as you were warmed up. Remember the stronger you are the more warm up sets you need to get to your work weight and 57kg is quite a jump to your first work set. Just think if you stay with the same warmups then you will be jumping 68kg between warmup and work sets in your 3rd week, thats a lot.
> My GZCL warm up is: (inputted your weights)
> 30% x 5 = 65
> 50% x 5 = 110
> 70% x 3 = 155
> 80% x 2 = 175
> 
> Remember the 5/3/1 recommended warmup is fine on that workout as your first work set is 65% but on GZCL your first workset will be at 90% so you need to warm up further.


I Totally agree in regards extra warm ups mate, especially after last nights deadlift session. I'll drop in another warm up on all lifts.

Lol warm up at 80%, you gotta love the GZCL :devil:


----------



## Guru

Logging late since I was away from internet the past two days.

Wednesday, 24/06/2015 -

Snatch grip deadlifts - 155lb - 5x5
45 deg. leg press - 230lb - 3x12
Hip thrusts - 135lb - 3x5

Thoughts -

Snatch grip deadlift - This is one of my favourite exercise that I am revisiting after a long time. However, I have a neurological condition in my right hand which severely restricts my grip. I even tried straps, but it doesn't help. First set was with straps, but they dig into my veins on the right hand and the palm goes numb after a while. Rest all sets were with a mixed grip, and it is not really suitable for this exercise. So, if it continues not to work for me, I will probably switch to normal grip and up the weight. But the soreness in my traps for two days afterwards was fantastic.

Hip thrusts - Another of my favourite exercise, revisited after a long time too. These were great, but I need to find some cushion for placing under the bar if I want to save my hip bones. Man, these really work your glutes (and hamstrings too) like nothing else.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Logging late since I was away from internet the past two days.
> 
> Wednesday, 24/06/2015 -
> 
> Snatch grip deadlifts - 155lb - 5x5
> 45 deg. leg press - 230lb - 3x12
> Hip thrusts - 135lb - 3x5
> 
> Thoughts -
> 
> Snatch grip deadlift - This is one of my favourite exercise that I am revisiting after a long time. However, I have a neurological condition in my right hand which severely restricts my grip. I even tried straps, but it doesn't help. First set was with straps, but they dig into my veins on the right hand and the palm goes numb after a while. Rest all sets were with a mixed grip, and it is not really suitable for this exercise. So, if it continues not to work for me, I will probably switch to normal grip and up the weight. But the soreness in my traps for two days afterwards was fantastic.
> 
> Hip thrusts - Another of my favourite exercise, revisited after a long time too. These were great, but I need to find some cushion for placing under the bar if I want to save my hip bones. Man, these really work your glutes (and hamstrings too) like nothing else.


Guru, I would revert back to the traditional deadlift if you have issues with the snatch grip deadlift (I love it to) as Wendler said "Don't major in the minors" 

As an older lifter myself I would also use the powerlifting compounds. I've been training over many years and have never seen the results I am now - Size and strength.

Personally I would move away from the "gym" lifts and get into a well structured powerlifting program.

5X5
Starting Strength
5/3/1 (Original)
5/3/1 (Beyond)

Tried the Juggernaut and if I had my time again, I would most certainly use it a lot, but my true love is low rep heavy work.

I found the original 5/3/1 was a great way to build size and strength, only at the end of using it for I think nearly three years did I find it was lacking in heavy volume.


----------



## Guru

Doug, I started training in 2008, and in the last months I got onto the 5x5 program. I was about 53kg back then, and 5x5 combined with more milk (Not GOMAD, but mostly LOMAD) helped me put on another 5-6 kg. I did it till mid of 2009 when it was very clear that I had plateaued. I reached about 90kg squat, 100 kg deadlift, 42.5 kg press and 65 kg bench when I tested my maxes after it.

Then I started with 5-3-1, and over the years have run quite a few cycles of it. I love it's split design, but now it has started to be a bit boring. 5-3-1 took my squat to 100 kg, deadlift to 125, and bench to 69 kg.

I did a Madcow cycle in between which helped take my squat to 105, but did squat (pun intended) for the other lifts.

I also did a round or two of Hepburn routine, but sadly at that point I was not very consistent and couldn't reap the benefits. I think I'll get on it again sometime later this year, but right now I want to give my own homemade version of Surovetsky's program a whirl.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Guru said:


> Doug, I started training in 2008, and in the last months I got onto the 5x5 program. I was about 53kg back then, and 5x5 combined with more milk (Not GOMAD, but mostly LOMAD) helped me put on another 5-6 kg. I did it till mid of 2009 when it was very clear that I had plateaued. I reached about 90kg squat, 100 kg deadlift, 42.5 kg press and 65 kg bench when I tested my maxes after it.
> 
> Then I started with 5-3-1, and over the years have run quite a few cycles of it. I love it's split design, but now it has started to be a bit boring. 5-3-1 took my squat to 100 kg, deadlift to 125, and bench to 69 kg.
> 
> I did a Madcow cycle in between which helped take my squat to 105, but did squat (pun intended) for the other lifts.
> 
> I also did a round or two of Hepburn routine, but sadly at that point I was not very consistent and couldn't reap the benefits. I think I'll get on it again sometime later this year, but right now I want to give my own homemade version of Surovetsky's program a whirl.


Guru,
You have definitely tried quite a few workouts :thumb:

I'm dammed if I can remember when I started, it was a long time ago 

I would say though my real training started about 4 years ago, I've managed to get up to 18 stone. Powerlifting for me has produced the best results by a million miles :thumb:

Todays session 3

*BLUE BAND DIPS Warm up 10X10X10X10X10

DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 7.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 17.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BARBELL ROW 30KG10X10X10X10X10*

I've maintained 3 minutes rest between the DIP and PULLUP work sets and I've reduced the weight greatly on the Barbell Row so I can improve my V02, using 30-40 second rest between sets.

Might not be able to Squat tomorrow as I hurt the joint in my right knee in the garden this week :wall:

Sun is out! So am I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>:thumb: :tumbleweed::tumbleweed:


----------



## Bod42

Thursday Workout
Deadlifts: 52.5x5, 90x5, 125x3
Barbell Shrugs (3 sec Hold) 70x12,12,12,12
Chins: BWx20 total
Dumbell Rows (100 in as few sets as possible) 32.5x30,20,20,15,15

For me this is the worst workout out of the 5 provided. Yes it has deadlifts to hit your back and I think shrugs will really help with my shoulder but i just didnt like the layout of the workout. Saying that I bet it gets a great deal harder once the deadlift weight and volume comes up.

Thats the break in week completed so now the real work begins.


----------



## Estoril-5

alternate grips worked a treat!

the grip felt so much more solid if that makes sense


----------



## Guru

Estoril-5 said:


> if that makes sense


It certainly does.

When I notice that the bar is starting to slip from my palms with the DOH grip, I switch to mixed, and then it feels as if the bar is glued to my hands - not just for that weight, but for the next few higher weights too. :thumb:


----------



## Estoril-5

Yup exactly that!


----------



## Bod42

Ya its strange how much better the mixed grip is than DOH.

Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 102.5x3,3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 30x5, 42.5x5, 72.5x12
Lying Leg Curls (Drop Set): Red Bandx10,10,10
Split Squats: AMAP in 3 mins 40 reps each leg

Again this was a really easy workout but I really pushed the squats as fast as I could out of the hole, literally making the bar leave my back on every single rep. This workout does seem light but it ramps up to 145x3x7 in week 5 with a EDM of 170 so its not to bad. Then on the 2nd 6 weeks you bump the weight by 5% so I will be doing 150x3x7. 

I haven't done front squats in years but forgot how good they are. I used to front box squat as it didnt feel right in the bottom but now they feel awesome and this must be due to increased flexibility and probably all the free squatting.

Never thought of using a band for Leg curls so this is good to know for rehab work etc.

The density training really gives you a chance to push the volume up and get an insane pump.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - GZCL - June

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 114KGX3 - 117KG2X2 - 120KGX1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 107KG7X3X3X3X3X3X3X3*

Spot on :thumb: Primary and Secondary work weights felt just right.


----------



## Bod42

Seated Shoulder Press: 20x5, 32.5x5, 47.5x4,4,4,14
Seated DB Press: 7.5x5, 10x5, 17.5x20
Side Laterals Ladder: 2.5x25, 5x15, 10x10, 5x15, 2.5x25 No Rest
Dips: BWx20,10
S/S
Push ups: BWx8,5

Think Ive mentioned before that my gym ceiling is to low to do standing OHP so I have to do seated now but I cant do seated against a back rest as it kills my shoulder so that means unracking the bar is really hard. So now I unrack in the bottom position, walk back and sit on my bench, do my reps and then basically front squat and put the weight back. Obviously this uses energy but at the minute, thats the only way I can lift.

The side laterals 90 rep set was a killer, shoulders were killing me but in a good way. 

Never thought about doing dips supersetted with Push ups but amazing how hard it makes simple push ups and hits your chest really hard.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - GZCL - June

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3 150X2) - 192.5GX3 - 198KG2X2 - 203.5KGX1X1X1

DEADLIFT 181.5KG7X3X3X3X3X3X3X3

RDL 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Very good workout, I may have started too heavy though. This workout felt like it was close to my limit of strength endurance. Odd thing though the same happened with how they felt, the last work sets felt easier and after the first set on the secondary work set all the other sets were easier, really odd 

Done the RDL as one giant superset but used 30 seconds rest between each set. Hopefully improving my V02. I will aim to reduce the rest period rather than increase the weight :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

This is what I have talked about a little bit in the past, balancing intensity, volume and frequently but Paul Carter obviously writes it better than me.

People get localized recovery, at the muscular level, mixed up with systematic recovery all the time. Systematic recovery has more to do with a reloading of BCAA, ATP, glycogen, and the balance between serotonin and dopamine. Localized recovery is about recovering at the muscular level. They are two very different processes.

This is why you have to balance training across a scale of volume, intensity, and frequency. You can have two of them high at one time, but the third needs to be lower. So if you want to train heavy, with a lot of volume, you will need to train less often.

If you want to train with a lot of volume, and want to train very often, then intensity (percentage of 1 rep max) has to be lowered (i.e. you can't train heavy).

Of course you can break these rules in regards to the sliding scale of volume, intensity, and frequency however you're going to end up overtraining from it.

Everything you do in training should be done for a very specific reason. Lots of guys leave untapped growth because they never address different types of muscle fibers through different training modalities. Not only that, but different muscle groups are made up of different fibers, yet lots of people apply the same training methodologies to all muscle groups, then wonder why some lag behind significantly.

This is why I think 5/3/1 is a good program but not a great program. It has the basics there but it doesnt have volume, intensity or frequency high. Changing to GZCL and I have designed my program that Volume & intensity are high but frequency is low. DUP workouts seem to be making a big splash in the industry at the moment where you train body parts up to 4 times per week but it is perfectly inline with the above principles. High frequency, moderate-high intensity, low volume. I would say these are the key elements to look at when designing a program and basically balance it to your liking.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 52.5x5, 90x5, 125x3, 112.5x3, 115x3,3,3,3,3
Shrugs: 75x12,12,12,12
Neutral Grip Chins: 10x2
DB Rows: 32.5x20,15,10,10,10,10,10,10,5 Total 100 reps per side

Out of the 5 this is definitely the workout I like the least. The deadlifts felt great as they should at such a light weight but I hate each exercise more and more as you go through the workout. But I will stick to the plan. Trap work and high volume dumbell rows cant ever be bad and to be honest, sitting here the next morning, I am definitely sore in different parts of my back.


----------



## Guru

Running around on tours for a week, and not able to make it to the gym. However, I'm back today and hopefully can make it in the evening.


----------



## Guru

Anyway, back into the gym yesterday.

Friday, 03/07/2015 -

Behind the Neck Press - 65lb - 5x5
One arm D/B rows - 40lb - 3x10
Incline D/B press - 2x30lb - 3x10
Seated cable rows - 65kg - 2x10

BTNP was easy. The program says 70% of your max. I don't know my max on this lift (neither do I want to know), so reduced a bit from regular OHP and arrived at 65lb. However, I feel I can up the weight slightly.

Made the assistance work a little harder (heavier) to compensate.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - Session 3 - June/July

*BLUE BAND DIPS BODYWEIGHT (WU 10x10x10x10x10)

UNASSISTED DIPS BODYWEIGHT + 10KGX10X10X10X10X10

BLUE BAND PULLUPS + 20KGX10X10X10X10X10

10 Second rest BARBELL ROW 30KGX10X10X10X10X5 - ran out of air*

Dips went very well today and was pleased with pull up progress.

Continuing with trying to improve my V02, although I'm aware that resistance training isn't the best option. But there will always be a benefit of doing and not doing  I'm also starting a stretching/mobility routine 3 times a week in the mornings for extra V02 and flexibility improvements :thumb:


----------



## Guru

Saturday, 04/07/2015 -

Deadlift - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 5, 185lb x 3, (Work) 200lb x 3, 210lb x 2, 215lb x 1,1,1.
Squats - 135lb - 5x5
Good Mornings - 135lb - 3x5
Decline sit-ups - 3x10 with a `10lb plate behind my neck.

Solid workout. Squats were easy, but doing 5x5 after a long time, and my legs are letting me know that today. Also, point to note that all my deads were chalkless, which definitely is a good thing.


----------



## Leebo310

Haven't posted on this thread for a while due to the arrival of our second daughter but now finally getting back into it! 
Still worked out during that time (almost 9 weeks now) but with the lack of any sort of decent sleep plus a broken routine, I found my strength was dropping like a stone so I focused on higher rep/lighter weight stuff.

Today was my first proper day back on a "strength" style workout. I've deviated slightly from the true 5/3/1, but the workout is still quite similar in that it's based on the four main lifts and works off similar percentages of the 1rm only with more sets of less reps on the main lift.
(Percentages are using 95% of my calculated 1rm, rather than the 90% that Wendler suggests by the way)

*Bench *
*WU* - 5x40kg, 5x60kg, 4x70kg

*WO* - 4 sets of 4 reps at 70%, 75%, 77.5%, 80% then 1 set of 3 reps at 82.5%, then 3 sets of 2 reps at 85%, 90% and 92.5%
So numbers were
4x84kg, 4x90kg, 4x93kg, 4x96kg, 3x99kg, 2x102kg, 2x108kg, 2x110kg
2-3 mins rest between sets

*Assistance exercises* (again similar to BBB but not exactly)

*DB Incline Press* 
10x24kg, 10x26kg, 10x28kg, 10x30kg, 10x30kg
1-2 mins rest between sets
First three sets were effectively me finding the right weight rather than being an intentional increase. Next time I'd go straight for 5x10 reps all at 30kg

*Incline DB Fly*

8x20kg, 8x20kg, 8x20kg
90 seconds - 2 mins rest between sets

Then some ab work to end

*Weighted Cable Kneeling Crunch*

20x27.5kg, 20x27.5kg, 20x27.5kg,
1 min rest between sets

No PB's there but definitely happy with the numbers considering the break I've had from this style of workouts, coupled with the poor sleep, poor eating etc etc…

Looking forward to squats tomorrow… :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

nice workout Lee, as youve probably read, Doug and I have come to the conclusion that we like to see more volume added to 5/3/1 so liking your workout.

Monday Workout. Did an Arm workout Fri which is a very weird feeling.
Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3,3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 30x5, 45x5, 75x12
Lying Leg Curls RP: Red bandx10,10,10
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: BWx41

It is so nice mentally to walk into a workout knowing there is a 0% chance of missing your weights. It is just your job to push as hard as you possibly can on every single rep, make that bar fly.

Actually loving front squats and my upper back is sore today so you can tell that these will help in other areas.

Stretched the red band abit more today to add more resistance and god these crap your hamstrings you can get some a hard contraction.

And that killer last set where you can barely walk due to the massive pump in your legs. Its a great finisher and I might keep this in for a long time to come.


----------



## Leebo310

Leg day today :devil:

*Squat *
*WU* - 4x40kg, 4x60kg, 4x70kg

*WO* - 4x97kg, 4x104kg, 4x108kg, 4x111kg, 3x115kg, 2x118kg, 2x125kg, 2x130kg

Definitely could have done more as the 2 at 130 were relatively easy but didn't want to push it too much given it was my first really heavy leg day for ages.

*Assistance exercises *

*Leg Press* 
10x200kg, 10x200kg, 10x200kg, 10x200kg, 10x200kg

*Leg Extension with 2 second hold at top*

8x65kg, 8x65kg, 8x65kg

*Weighted Cable Side Crunch*

20x27.5kg, 20x27.5kg,

Literally limped out of the gym afterwards :thumb:

Shoulders tomorrow...


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 - GZCL - June/July

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 117KGX3 - 120KGX2X2 - 123.5KG3X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 110.5KG5X3X3X3X3X3

BLUE BAND PULLUPS (30 second rest) X10X10X10X10X5*

Felt good throughout the workout. I've switched to doing the pull ups with no weight added and decreased the rest period between sets to 30 seconds to help increase the intensity.I'll keep using the weighted version on session 3 each week though. After the heavy benching I just don't feel inclined to do more heavy work and the GZCL indicates the third tier of sets should be isolation or at least superset style (Higher intensity) :thumb:

Loving the heavy approach but not sure how long it can be maintained before a lighter month (I would imagine using the original 5/3/1 work set percentages would be idea for a full recovery month) is required for full recovery :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Dont worry Doug, I missed the 3rd tier work sometimes as well but I think it definitely has merit. But I think you need to work upto that volume as the amount of volume weight your doing per workout has increased so much since 5/3/1 anyway.

Bench: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 110x4,4,4,12 PM 154kg PR!!!! WHILE ON A DIET!!!!!!!:doublesho:thumb:
Incline DB Press: 12.5x5, 20x5, 32.5x12
Incline Flyes: 12.5x10,10,8
Bent Laterals AMAP in 10mins: 5 plates x 115.

Didnt even realise this was a PR until I typed in in the sheet. I'm down over 3kgs in just over 2 weeks with a pi$$ up weekend in the middle and still increasing my strength so ridiculously pleased about that.

Working up slowly on DB press. Really dont like DB work, feels crap compared with a nice heavy bar. 

Havent used Isolation exercises in ages so flyes feel weird. The funny thing is, even with isolation exercises, I always finish this workout less pumped than my typical bench workout. I find high rep Barbell work pumps you up more than isolation work. But hey it must be working as hit a PR and only the 2nd time I have benched.

10mins of rear delts is a killer but I think this will be so good in the long run, especially for shoulder health. Who here has ever done 115 reps on their rear delts.


----------



## Guru

Tuesday, 07/07/2015 -

OHP - (WU) 45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, (Work) 85lb x 3, 90lb x 2, 90lb - 2,2,2.
Lat pulldown - 45kg - 8,8,10.
One arm D/B push press - 30lb - 3x10 each side.
Face pulls - 25kg - 3x15.

Nice workout - hard but quite doable.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 - GZCL - June/July

Hmmmmm!!!

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3 150X2) - 198GX3 - 203.5KG2X2 - 209KG FAIL!*

Not sure but a less than stellar day me thinks 

I am also having second thoughts about using GZCL for my deadlift as I was 
progressing very well (220Kgx1) using the 5/3/1 and only needed another 10Kg for my final goal :wall:

I think GZCL is good if you need to break a plateau (My bench and squat for instance) or if your training for a high level of lifting/competing. But even after the third week I can see issues. I have also noticed my deadlift weights may be a bit high for starting this new program but if my deadlift was already progressing via 5/3/1 why change? Well my plateau on the bench and squat were the reason.

On paper the GZCL looks better than the 5/3/1 and the advice online point to the GZCL being better (Training more at higher percentages) But I am having doubts that I need it for my humble goals.

I will go back to 5/3/1 for my deadlift and stick with GZCL for my bench and squat and monitor progress as I've de loaded more on those two lifts.

The bloody irony is that I was considering leaving the deadlift on 5/3/1 due to my good progress, lesson learned, follow your intuition!

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug to me, it just sounds like you programmed to high to start with. If 220kg is your record then you should be setting your max at 200kg for GZCL and then 97.5kg of that so you top set should be 195kg. So your about 15kgs over weight I would say. 

Look at your work sets there. If your 1RM is 220 then your 3RM is approx 200 and you hit that for your first set so you going to be pretty tired after that.

But saying all this, your at that stage in your lifting where intuition should play a major role in your training.


----------



## Guru

Bod42 said:


> But saying all this, your at that stage in your lifting where intuition should play a major role in your training.


+1 to James on this. First week on any new program is an eye opener of sorts. You can make adjustments based on how you feel you're doing.

Long term injury free strength is much more important than short lived PBs. Anyway, here's my training yesterday.

Wednesday, 08/07/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, (Work) 175lb - 5x5
45° Leg Press - 230lb - 3x10
Hip thrusts - 135lb - 3x5

Great workout. 5x5 deadlifts is a completely different beast. To make things more difficult, I moved out my grip couple of inches on each side, so these were more of semi-snatch grip deads. :devil: I was almost thinking of winding up after these, but rested for a few minutes and finished the assistance stuff too.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug to me, it just sounds like you programmed to high to start with. If 220kg is your record then you should be setting your max at 200kg for GZCL and then 97.5kg of that so you top set should be 195kg. So your about 15kgs over weight I would say.
> 
> Look at your work sets there. If your 1RM is 220 then your 3RM is approx 200 and you hit that for your first set so you going to be pretty tired after that.





Guru said:


> +1 to James on this. First week on any new program is an eye opener of sorts. You can make adjustments based on how you feel you're doing.
> 
> Long term injury free strength is much more important than short lived PBs. Anyway, here's my training yesterday.


Thanks James and Guru! :thumb:

I've decided to de load my deadlift and continue with the GZCL, I like the program and I'm sure that with a little de load (200Kg instead of 220Kg) I will be able to make some steady progress.

And TBH I remember when I squatted 200Kg for 1 that I was sort of disappointed that it was over. Let the journey continue! :thumb:


----------



## Guru

Monday, 13/07/2015 -

BTNP - 70lb - 5x5
Seated Cable rows - 60kg - 3x10
Incline D/B press - 2x35lb - 3x10
Revesre flyes - 2x10lb - 3x10

Upped the weight by 5 lb on the BTNP and it was only slightly difficult. 35lb on the inclines felt very heavy though - surprisingly 30lb feels much lighter in comparison. You'd think 5lb won't be much, but sometimes it makes a lot of difference.

No real difficulties yet, and I'm looking forward to deadlifts today.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 30x5, 47.5x5, 77.5x12
Leg Curls RP: Red band: 10,10,10
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: BWx42

All in all a good workout. Squats felt nice and fast considering I havent had anything heavy on my back for ages. Keen to see what this lighter faster lifting does to my strength. Feels good at the moment, especially for a diet.

The only problem is there is 3 of us training now and in my rush between sets I moved my bench which had the power cord wrapped around the bottom and basically threw it across the room smashing it. back to pen and paper for me.


----------



## Bod42

Seated Shoulder Press: 20x5, 32.5x5, 45x3, 50x4,4,4,12
Seated Dumbell Shoulder Press: 10x5, 12.5x5, 22.5x12
Side Lateral ladder: 2.5x25, 5x15, 10x10, 5x15, 2.5x25
Dips: BWx21,10
S/S with Push Ups: BWx6,3

Good workout, pleased to get 12 on Shoulder Press. Dumbells are a completely different animal and I find that you tire quicker than you would think.


----------



## Jeli

I'm back from Ibiza after a crazy time partying until 7am every day (so much for a chilled holiday!). The dieting since February paid off and I was pleased with the aesthetics of a beach bod! Full 6 pack and obliques but my pecs really changed shape for the better. Maybe the alcohol helped by dehydrating me! 

3" lost overall from chest and 4" off my waist. Goes to show I was carrying a fair bit of bad timber without realising. This did mean I had to buy all new clothes! 

Once I've caught up on sleep I'll be back in training and posting more regular.

Keep up the good work and hit them goals!


----------



## Guru

Wednesday, 15/07/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, 185lb x 3, (Work) 200lb x 3, 210lb x 2, 215lb - 2,2,2
Squats - 145lb - 5x5.

That's it.

I somehow managed to sprain something in the right scapula / infraspinatus region, and had a continuous dull pain throughout the day. Gladly it didn't affect the deads much. However, for some reason, I felt pressure building up in my head during the heavy work sets.

Squats were nice and smooth, with 10lb more weight than last time. In fact, I noticed that I could get a really nice form on these after a long time. However, between the deads and the 5x5 squats, I was practically wiped out and called it a day.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x2, 150x3, 132.5x3,3,3
Barbell Shrugs 3sec contraction: 80x12,12,12,12
Neutral Grip Chins: 1x3, 8x2, 1x1.
DB Rows: 32.5x25,15,15,10,10,10,10,5

Deadlifts were easy, especially the back off set, nice and fast which is the goal.

Dont like any of the other exercises in this workout. But when people dont like exercises its normally because they suck at them so will keep hammering these exercises.

100 reps on each arm is an absolute killer of a finisher. Really taxes the grip especially after shrugs and chins. Still very please with how this workout is going. Diet isnt going as fast as I would like but I'm actually gaining strength while losing fat so really cant complain.


----------



## Guru

Saturday, 18/07/2015 -

OHP - (WU) 45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, (Work) 85lb x 3, 90lb x 2, 100lb - 1,1,1
Lat pulldowns - 45kg - 3x9
One arm D/B push press - 30lb x 10, 35lb x 10

Nice going so far on this.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sorry not posted for a while guys, i was on de load last week but ended up with Laryngitis and this week a bloody bad cold WTF!!!!!! Haven't been ill in more years than I can remember 

Hoping to be back lifting by next Monday. :thumb:


----------



## Guru

Take ample rest my friend. The iron is not going anywhere for a while at least.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Sorry not posted for a while guys, i was on de load last week but ended up with Laryngitis and this week a bloody bad cold WTF!!!!!! Haven't been ill in more years than I can remember
> 
> Hoping to be back lifting by next Monday. :thumb:


I'm the same Doug, Diet has been going amazingly and actually been adding strength but after my workout fri, I felt like crap and now its Wednesday and I still dont feel 100%. Need to decide to just take the rest of the week as a deload so i can attack my heavy week at 100% or just get through my heavy week as best i can and then deload.

My trainier has said to deload this week then take my heavy week next week then take an easy week again so it adds a week to the program.


----------



## Guru

Tuesday, 21/07/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, (Work) 185lb - 5x5.
45° Leg Press - 230lb - 3x12
Hip thrusts - 135lb - 3x5.

Deadlifts were again semi-snatch grip, and man, were these hard. My grip started giving way on the third set, so used a bit of chalk for the last two. It was a bit surprising, but I think that's due to the high humidity - it's raining cats and dogs here for past two days.


----------



## Guru

Wednesday, 22/07/2015 -

BTNP - 75lb - 5x5
Seated Cable rows - 65kg - 3x8
Incline D/B press - 2x30lb - 3x12

75lb BTNP was so much harder than 70lb. However, Methinks that these involve traps to a much larger extent than regular press, and my traps were fried from Tuesday's workout.

Forgot face pulls


----------



## Estoril-5

Seem to have injured my ankle and the top part of my fibia in my right leg, I think I did this whilst squatting.

Normally it's ok but when I kneel down, it's when I get up I get a pain in the top of my tibia and in the mornings ankle is stiff.

Got an appointment at the Drs next week but wanted to know if anyone else has suffered similar?


----------



## Bod42

Week 1 of 6
Squats: 52.5x5, 90x3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 32.5x5, 47.5x5, 80x12
Lying Leg Curls Drop Set: Blue bandx10,10,6
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: 45 each leg

This is just the break in week again so a light week but I am still very pleased to add weight to my front squats again. Nearly at a PR for these and I'm actually really enjoying them. Except for the 200 reps of Dumbell Rows, I'm actually quite enjoying this workout and the way its set out. Very easy to push it mentally but still has plenty of volume.


----------



## Jeli

My diet has really impacted on strength but I am around 42Ib lighter in body weight. Think I need to up my calories again now. 

Yesterday I trained legs which I've probably not done in around 5 weeks. On squats I have found the bar behind neck really stresses my knees. Slightly lower down with the bar is better for me. When I skip training legs for this amount of time my hams are always really weak to begin with.

Single leg extensions - 10Kg x 25, 15Kg x25, 20Kg x20, 25Kg x 15
Squats - 60Kg x10, 60Kg x10, 80Kg x10, 80Kg x10
Double leg hamstring curls - 10Kg x25, 15Kg x25, 20Kg x 20, 25Kg x 15
Dumbbell seated calf raises - 30Kg ea knee x 25, x25, x25

Finished up on some bicep curls with the Ez bar.

I look in great shape but I'm struggling. Everything feels so damn heavy!


----------



## Bod42

Week 1 of 6
Bench Press: 45x5, 77.5x5, 107.5x3, 115x4,4,4,9 PM 150kg
Incline Dumbell Press: 15x5, 22.5x5, 37.5x9
Incline Flyes: 12.5x10,10,8
Rear Laterals 10mins AMAP: 5x120

Very pleased to hit a predicted max of 150kg Bench while on a diet. I'm down 4.8kg in 5 weeks which is nearly perfect weight loss rate and from what i can tell, I havent lost any strength and some people have mentioned that Ive actually got bigger.

The next 6 weeks are going to be brutal as there will basically be no easy workouts as all the assistance exercises are heavy and pushing me to the max now. 

And I havent done any dumbell work and definitely fliyes for a long long time but man is my chest sore today.

Jeli, whats your diet looking like? And doing Leg extensions before squats is unusual. If your knees are hurting then I would change these to leg curls before squats, pumping the antagonistic muscle before an exercise cushions the antaganist.


----------



## Jeli

Bod42 said:


> Jeli, whats your diet looking like? And doing Leg extensions before squats is unusual. If your knees are hurting then I would change these to leg curls before squats, pumping the antagonistic muscle before an exercise cushions the antaganist.


Thanks Bod42.

The reason for leg extensions before squats is down to what I used to do in a routine with an old training buddy with more experience than me. I guess it doesn't make great sense so will change it.

Typical diet for the day;

2,056 calories, 43% protein, 37% carbs, 20% fats
(previously 1,800 cals on a 35%/35%/30% split whilst cutting)

7am, Breakfast - 497 cal [60g protein, 41.2g carbs, 10.7g fat]
1pm, Lunch - 785 cal [66g protein, 91g carbs, 14g fat]

7:30pm Training

9:30pm Dinner - 449 cal [87.9g protein, 6g carbs, 7g fat]

Snacks - 325 cal [4g protein, 46g carbs, 13g fat]

Total protein = 218g
Total carbs = 184g
Total fat = 45g

72Kg
5'7
36 y/o

body fat - below 10%


----------



## Bod42

That looks pretty good to me. Your strength does plummet whilst on a diet, well actually i should be more precise and say everyone is different and with some people, their strength plummets like crazy whilst others can hold all their strength. You wont have lost your strength, it will still be there but you just have to peak again and get your body ready to show its true strength. That should happen as you slowly increase your calories.


----------



## Guru

There was a lot of slacking for an entire week (almost). After last Wednesday, I could manage to get back to the Iron only yesterday.

Wednesday, 29/07/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, 185lb x 3, (Work) 210lb x 3, 215lb x 2, 230lb - 1,1,1.
Squats - 155lb - 5x5.

Work sets were supposed to be 200, 215 & 230. However, I had a brainfart on the first set and put 210 on the bar. It felt heavy but I thought it was due to a week long hiatus. Realized it on 2nd set. All chalkless so far.

Upped the weight by 10lb on squats and they were still good. Onward and upward.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3
Shrugs 3 sec hold: 80x12,12,12,12
Chin Ups: BWx10x2
DB Rows: 32.5x25,15,15,15,10,10,10

Not the best workout to be honest. Really struggled with the DB rows and shrugs, not due to strength in the target muscle but due to my grip. Forearms are sore as hell today. I should probably concentrate on 1 thing at a time as I have also been doing speed training for golf and apparently that hits your recovery quite hard as feel exhausted today. But i did add 5mph to my golf swing after 1 session.


----------



## Jeli

Saturday 01/08/2015 workout - back, rear delts, traps, triceps


Pull ups - x10 bodyweight, x10 bodyweight, x10 bodyweight
Bentover barbell rows - 10x 40Kg, 10x 50Kg, 10x 60Kg, 10x 60Kg
Deadlift - 60Kg x10, 80Kg x 10, 90Kg x8, 90Kg x8
Dumbbell Row - 30Kg x10, 32Kg x10, 35Kg x10
Underhand grip cable lat pull down - 30Kg x10, 40kg x10, 50Kg x10
Reverse dumbbell fly incline bench - 7.5kg x15, 7.5kg x 15, 7.5kg x15
Dumbbell shrugs - 30Kg x10, 30Kg x10, 30Kg x10
Dips - x10 bodyweight, x10 bodyweight
Cable tricep push down - x25 20Kg, x15 25Kg, x10 30Kg

Sunday 02/08/2015 workout - legs

Squats - 60Kg x10, 60Kg x10, 80Kg x10, 80Kg x10
Leg extensions - x25 10Kg, x25 15Kg, x25 20Kg, x25 25Kg
Ham curls - x25 10Kg, x25 15Kg, x15 20Kg
Dumbbell seated calf raise - 30Kg x30, 30Kg x30, 30Kg x30


Nothing impressive... Anyone think it's worth throwing lunges into the leg day?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 112.5KGX3 - 116KG2X2X2 -119KG3X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 106KGX5X5X4X4X4X4X3

BLUE BAND PULLUPS 30 Second Rest 10X10X10X8X4*

Glad to be back in training, considering I ballsed up the rest period on the second phase work sets I'm very pleased with the results overall.

I'm out of sync so will train this week, de load next week then back to training normal 3 weeks on 1 week de load.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 110x3,3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 32.5x5, 50x5, 82.5x12
Lying Leg Curls RP: Blue Bandx10,10,6
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: BWx46

This was easy enough as its the first of 4 progressively harder weeks. Pleased to increased my Front Squats again. Your Squats are set in stone so nice to have front squats to be hitting PRs on.


----------



## Bod42

Shoulder Press: 20x5, 35x5, 50x3, 52.5x4,4,4,11
DB Shoulder Press: 10x5, 15x5, 25x9
Laterals Ladder: 2.5x25, 5x15, 10x10, 5x15, 2.5x25
Dips: BWx25,11
Supersetted with Push Ups: BWx6,6

So I'm ill yet again which is annoying but I still did my workout and actually did pretty well considering. Most impressed with my 25 dips. I'm even more ill today which means I may have to miss Deadlifts.


----------



## Guru

Good workout James, and quite impressive considering you not being well. But don't push it too much - it will get into the way of recovery - both from workout and illness.

Wednesday, 05/08/2015 -

OHP - (WU) 45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, (Work) 85lb x 3, 90lb x 2, 100lb - 2,2,2.
Lat pull downs - 40kg - 3x10.
Standing D/B press - 2x20lb - 3x15.
Reverse flyes - 20kg - 3x10.

Everything felt heavy, but then what can I expect working out once a week?


----------



## Bod42

Ya I know your right with recovery but feeling a lot better today so I'm raring to train but i know in the long run that if i deadlift tonight then i will just delay my recovery. Need to concentrate on getting better and then smash the gym. Need to finish this diet hard. If i wasnt ill I recon i would be smashing PRs all over the show. Oh well being ill cant be helped. Just even harder to swallow when its the 2nd time ive been ill in 3 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 110X5 130X3) - 145X5 - 165KGX5 - 187KGX5

DEADLIFT 150KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 30 Second Rest 75KGX10X10X10

*
Considering I've had 3 weeks of with a  virus, I was very pleased with the results. I've definitely lost some peak strength, the last work sets felt heavier than I remember them 

The deadlift weeks will now be fixed except for the last work set of week 3 which I will continue to aim for 230x1 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ya I know your right with recovery but feeling a lot better today so I'm raring to train but i know in the long run that if i deadlift tonight then i will just delay my recovery. Need to concentrate on getting better and then smash the gym. Need to finish this diet hard. If i wasnt ill I recon i would be smashing PRs all over the show. Oh well being ill cant be helped. Just even harder to swallow when its the 2nd time ive been ill in 3 weeks.


I feel your pain James, I've spent 3 weeks with a bloody virus. I don't think I've been ill for over 10 years or more.

Problem is, as you progress and lift heavier your actually putting yourself in more risk due to the extreme hit on the CNS while in recovery and as we all know your in recovery mode almost all the time


----------



## Guru

Saturday, 08/08/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, (Work) 190lb - 5x5.
Seated Leg curls - 30kg x 10, 40kg - 2x10
45° Leg Press - 230lb - 3x12.

Nice soreness in my traps and hamstrings today.


----------



## Bod42

Seems like everyone is ill at the moment and were at different ends of the earth lol.

Anyway I started to feel a little better so I deadlifted on sunday but I'm no where near my max and still training for speed so it wont hit my CNS as hard as a proper deadlift session. And I believe that overall volume is also a killer on the CNS, not just the weight so i did my deadlifts and missed all other exercises.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 140x3, 122.5x3,3,3,3,3,3,3

Good workout. Just got in did my reps and then got out. I was also working on my truck as it failed its MOT the other day so just did the sets when I wasnt busy. Squats tonight and heavy bench tomorrow so interested to see how they go.


----------



## Bod42

Squats:70x5, 90x5, 125x3,3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 35x5, 50x5, 85x12
Band Lef Curls RP: Blue Bandx10,10,10
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: BWx40

So squats felt way heavier than they should but then 2 warm up sets on an absolutely freezing night wasnt exactly my cleverest idea. I'm definitely going to add in more warm up sets. I have added 5 warmup sets before my bench press as lately I have felt like my biceps are going to tear off the bones on the first few heavy sets.

Anyway not a bad workout when I'm still ill and the Front Squats were an absolute mental grind.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 45x5, 77.5x5, 107.5x3, 115x4,4,4,7 
Incline Dumbell Press: 15x5, 22.5x5, 37.5x10
Incline Flyes: 12.5x10,8,8
Rear Laterals 10mins AMAP: 5x125

Did 2 reps less on Bench Press this week so not that impressed but I probably could have forced out an 8th rep if really needed to but form was off and shoulder was hurting so I shut the set down. I added a rep to my incline dumbells so an average workout over all. This is where the diet starts to suck as you start missing reps.


----------



## Leebo310

*Squat *

WU - 60kgx4, 80kgx4

WO - 100kgx4, 107.5kgx4, 112.5kgx4, 115kgx4, 120kgx3, 125kgx2, 130kgx2, 132.5kgx2, 135kgx2

*Leg Press*

170kgx10, 200kgx10, 250kgx10, 300kgx10, 350kgx8

*Leg Extension*

55kgx10, 65kgx10, 75kgx10

45kgx12 - 10 second pause then another 45kgx12


----------



## Bod42

Few to catch up.
Deadlifts: 70x5, 75x5, 105x3, 120x2, 135x1, 150x3, 132.5x3,3,3,3,3
Barbell Shrugs: 80x12,12,8,6
Neutral Chins: BWx1x3, 8x2, 1x1
Dumbell Rows: 32.5x20,15,10,10,10,10,10,10,5

This workout is definitely the hardest workout of the week. Absolute killer on my grip. Forarms are always ridiculously sore the next day.

EZ Bar Curls: 15x5, 25x5, 37.5x3, 42.5x5,5,5,4,3 
Incline DB Curls S/S with Hammer Curls: 7.5x10,10,10
Concentration Curls: 2.5x20,20,20,20
Dips: BW +25x4,4,4,12
Tricep Extensions: 12.5x5, 20x5, 32.5x10
DB Kickbacks 100 in as few sets as possible: 2.5x25, 25, 20, 20, 10

Dont like training arms, think its kind of pointless and their less pumped at the end of a workout than my pressing or pulling days. But they are changing shape so it must do something. But its still weird alternating Bench/Shoulder Press weekly so you only hit each once every 2 weeks but hit arms every week.

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x3,3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 35x5, 52.5x5, 87.5x8
Lying Leg Curls Drop Set: Blue bandx10,10,6
Split Squats AMAP in 3 mins: BWx35

Worst squat workout Ive had in ages. Technique was way off, i never felt like i was going to fail a rep and they werent that hard after the set but i just couldnt get any speed into the reps. Front squats are hell on your abs.


----------



## Bod42

Seated Shoulder Press: 20x10, 35x5, 50x3, 52.5x4,4,4,12
DB Shoulder Press: 10x5, 15x5, 25x8
Lateral Ladder: 2.5x25, 5x15, 10x10, 5x15, 2.5x25
Dips: BWx26,8
Supersetted Push Ups: BWx8,6

Pleased to get the 12 reps on the shoulder press. On a diet and I'm only a few KGs short of a record which is unreal considering how much strength I usually lose. 

Dips is a BW record as well and at the end of a workout so doubly pleased with this.


----------



## Guru

Tuesday, 18/08/2015 -

BTNP - 75lb - 5x5
Inclined D/B press - 2x30lb - 3x10
Face pulls - 25kg - 3x15

Pain in the left rear delt on 4th and 5th set. I could manage to get the sets finished, but that was just it. Weird though that it didn't bother me on the inclines or even the face pulls. No pain afterwards too.


----------



## Guru

Thursday, 20/08/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, 185lb x 3, (Work) 200lb x 3, 215lb x 2, 230lb - 2,2,2.
Decline sit-ups - 3x12 with a 10lb plate on my chest.
Side bends - 3x10 with a 45lb plate in one hand.
Free squats - 1x60.

Deads went well, but did not feel like squatting after them, so just did some random core work. However, in the end I did feel guilty for not squatting, so did an AMRAP set of free squats. Happy to get to 60 on these.


----------



## Guru

Saturday, 22/08/2015 -

OHP - (WU) 45lb x 10, 65lb x 5, 80lb x 3, (Work) 90lb x 3, 100lb x 2, 105lb - 1,1,1.
Lat pull downs - 45kg - 10,10,8 alternating with
Wide grip OHP - 65lb - 3x10.
Reverse flyes - 20kg - 2x12.

Another good workout. Presses felt heavy, but the bar didn't get stuck on it's way up. Also, no complaints from the shoulder.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x2, 160x3, 140x3,3,3,3,3
Shrugs: 80x12,12,12,8
Neutral Chins: BWx10x2
Dumbell Rows: 32.5x20,15,15,15,15,10,10

Deadlifts felt better than I thought they would. I really like the top 3 rep set and then the back off sets. The top set makes the back off set feel like nothing. Kind of cements the theory for the over warm ups.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 70x5, 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x2, 150x3,3,3,3,3
Front Squats: 35x5, 55x5, 90x12 PR!!!
Hamstring Band Curls RP: Blue Bandx10,10,8
Split Squats AMAP in 3mins: BWx36

Really pleased to get through all my squats and these were quite easy. Well not easy but there was never a chance of failing so i have maintained my strength pretty well over these 10 weeks. 

PR on front squats while dieting and after 5 sets of squats is awesome. Couldnt ask for more.


----------



## Kimo

****in hate squats :lol:

Need to get into deadlifts etc soon

I'm matching your weights on shrugs and dumbbell row atm but want to start training properly


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 August

*BENCH PRESS ( WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) 112KGX3 - 126KGX1 - 116X2 - 120KG3X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 106KGX5X5X5X5X4

BLUE BAND PULL UPS 30 Second Rest 10X10X10X9X5
*

Been really busy on some IT projects so I've missed training for several weeks, I'm glad to be back now, I've missed it.

Good first workout, loaded the bar incorrectly on second work set, it should have been 2 sets of 2 reps @116Kg, but ended up with 126Kg on first set DOH!


----------



## Bod42

Kimo said:


> ****in hate squats :lol:
> 
> Need to get into deadlifts etc soon
> 
> I'm matching your weights on shrugs and dumbbell row atm but want to start training properly


If you really want to grow your traps, hold at the top for 3 secs, this makes the sets 10 times harder.

Deep down everyone hates squats lol.

Bench Press: 35x5, 60x5, 80x3, 92.5x2, 102.5x1, 115x4,4,4,8
Incline Dumbell Press: 15x5, 22.5x5, 37.5x12
Incline Flyes: 12.5x10,10,8
10 mins of bent Over Laterals: 5kgx135

Best during this training is 9 reps, best ever is 10 reps so pretty pleased to get 8 reps after 10 weeks of dieting. A quick maintenance phase will probably have me hitting a PR on this. 2 reps isnt exactly a lot of strength lose over 10 weeks and 7kgs in bodyweight.

PR on dumbell press. Best diet I have ever done so far.


----------



## Guru

Wednesday, 26/08/2015 -

Deadlifts - (WU) 45lb x 10, 95lb x 5, 135lb x 5, 165lb x 3, (Work) 195lb - 4x4
45° Leg Press - 180lb x 15, 230lb x 15, 270lb x 12.
Good Morning off the pins - 135lb - 2x5.

Used the semi-snatch grip for deads again, and they were good, though my right palm did hurt a bit. Good Mornings were extremely hard - then I realised that I had set the pins one hole too low - that put them actually sightly below parallel.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 152.5x1, 170x3, 150x3,3
Barbell Shrugs: 80x12,12,8,8
Neutral Grip Chins: Bwx10x2
Dumbell Rows: 32.5x25,15,15,15,10,15

Good workout, nice to hit some heavy weights. Weight came up easy but strangly I was losing my grip which is surprising as these back workouts have really been taxing my grip. Time to throw some grip work into my Deadlift workouts in the next phase. Grip and forearm work will help with my golf speed training as well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 August

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 110X5 130X3) - 145GX5 - 165KGX5 - 180KGX5

DEADLIFT 150KGX5X5X5X5X5

RDL 30 Second Rest 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

All good! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 August

Woke up with major DOMs from yesterdays Deadlift session, but knew i had to do some squats since i hurt my knee a couple of months ago (Non powerlifting injury). Had no pain whatsoever in today's session so I'm incredibly pleased 

*SQUAT ( WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 157KGX3 - 162KGX1 *

Initially disappointed but then realized i shouldn't be, I was aching all over, especially in my lower body. My energy was totally sapped before I even started, so I am actually happy :thumb: Strength can be regained once i recover and become more consistent with my training. I will stick to the same weights next month on the squat, if i fail without DOMs then i will de load and rebuild.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

lol! Major DOMs this morning, walking around like i  myself and cant even bend down porperly 

Bench session tomorrow, already looking forward to it and getting back into my lifting.

I'm going to take a slow approach for the remainder of this year (add 2 kg to all successfully completed work sets) as I've reduced my calories and lost 7 Lb already :thumb: I would like to loose another 7 Lb and then re evaluate :thumb:


----------



## Guru

Hamstring and Trap DOMS are the worst (or maybe the best). Enjoy them for a couple of days.

On a serious note, I've found that a round of static stretching after such a workout dials the DOMS down to a large extent.


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> lol! Major DOMs this morning, walking around like i  myself and cant even bend down porperly
> 
> Bench session tomorrow, already looking forward to it and getting back into my lifting.
> 
> I'm going to take a slow approach for the remainder of this year (add 2 kg to all successfully completed work sets) as I've reduced my calories and lost 7 Lb already :thumb: I would like to loose another 7 Lb and then re evaluate :thumb:


I lost 7kg over 10 weeks and it does take a toll on your strength but I find if you actually work at a lower % of your 1RM then you hold on to your strength better.

I'm now going to do a proper run of GZCL on my lower body and it looks awesome, really looking forward to it.


----------



## Guru

Monday, 31/08/2015 -

BTNP - 80lb - 4x4
Seated cable rows - 60kg - 3x12
Incline D/B press - 2x30lb - 3x12
Face Pulls - 25kg - 3x15

BTNP was very very hard, and on the 3rd and 4th set, I had to cheat the last rep by push pressing. Everything else, good.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 August/September

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 116KGX3 - 119KG2X2 - 122KG3X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 109KG5X3X3X3X3X3

BLUE BAND PULLUPS 30 Second Rest 10X10X10X8X5*

Good solid workout, First and second work sets felt just right for training weight, but i cant imagine progress will be quick at these % of 1RM

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2 August/September
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 116KGX3 - 119KG2X2 - 122KG3X1X1X1
> 
> BENCH PRESS 109KG5X3X3X3X3X3
> 
> BLUE BAND PULLUPS 30 Second Rest 10X10X10X8X5*
> 
> Good solid workout, First and second work sets felt just right for training weight, but i cant imagine progress will be quick at these % of 1RM
> 
> :thumb:


Doug you still running GZCL looking at those sets & reps. How do you like it on the upper body stuff?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug you still running GZCL looking at those sets & reps. How do you like it on the upper body stuff?


Hi James,

Love it on upper body, not sure how it will work for lower though.

I'm running GZCL for Bench and squat and standard 5/3/1 for the deadlift.

One thing is very obvious is the huge jump in training weight percentages, unlike me i think you should listen to the advice and reduce your 1RM as you will soon plateau, last night session was hard in a heavy sort of way but not tiring at all, if that makes sense.

Positive: You get a lot more time under the bar with heavy weights which will improve your one rep technique and confidence with the heavier weights, which IMHO is very important.

Negative: Using the heavier weights during your sessions will effect your recovery so if your using weights very close to your max the chances of a few fails is far greater. Hence the advice on using weights you could easily rep out for 3.

Personally I like the low rep heavy approach, i like being forced into using heavy technique as I have a bad habit of relaxing my technique on lighter weights and just use pure strength to muscle up the weight. I will plateau soon but I'm not worried. It is far too soon to say if the GZCL is any better than the standard 5/3/1, but I'm not rushing my progress for the remainder of the year. And i think also there is far too much emphasis on worrying about plateaus', plateaus are there to be broken :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

The more I learn about powerlifting, weight lifting, strength training, etc it seems that all the strongest people in the world train around the same sort of theory. Few heavy sets but then back off and do some easier sets to get the volume in without killing yourself. This is exactly how GZCL is set out and actually how I finally set up 5/3/1 which saw my best progress. I worked up to a rep PR but then dropped the weight and did another 3 sets of the same weight.

What is interesting me lately is 2 big names, Joe Defranco and Paul Carter have just released programs with the same heavy exercise rep/set protocol. They work up to your work weight, hit 3x4 then do a PR set. So for Paul Carters that I just did, i was doing 115x4,4,4,12. Its getting the volume in before your top set.

I like GZCL and how it has a PR week every 4 week very similar to Juggernaut, it means mentally you know the only really hard week is going to be the 4th week which I think gives you a mental breal. I suppose you could set 5/3/1 up exactly like that and only go for a PR every 4th week. To be fair I do make better progress on 5/3/1 when I do similar to this. Set your weights lower so if you feel crap or average get in and do the set/reps and if you feel brilliant then go for a rep PR, you dont have to set PRs every single week. 

I would love to do heavy weight on my upper body but I find as soon as the bar speed slows down on bench press as it does on heavier weights then thats when I hurt my shoulder so have to keep to higher reps for me.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The more I learn about powerlifting, weight lifting, strength training, etc it seems that all the strongest people in the world train around the same sort of theory. Few heavy sets but then back off and do some easier sets to get the volume in without killing yourself. This is exactly how GZCL is set out and actually how I finally set up 5/3/1 which saw my best progress. I worked up to a rep PR but then dropped the weight and did another 3 sets of the same weight.
> 
> What is interesting me lately is 2 big names, Joe Defranco and Paul Carter have just released programs with the same heavy exercise rep/set protocol. They work up to your work weight, hit 3x4 then do a PR set. So for Paul Carters that I just did, i was doing 115x4,4,4,12. Its getting the volume in before your top set.
> 
> I like GZCL and how it has a PR week every 4 week very similar to Juggernaut, it means mentally you know the only really hard week is going to be the 4th week which I think gives you a mental breal. I suppose you could set 5/3/1 up exactly like that and only go for a PR every 4th week. To be fair I do make better progress on 5/3/1 when I do similar to this. Set your weights lower so if you feel crap or average get in and do the set/reps and if you feel brilliant then go for a rep PR, you dont have to set PRs every single week.
> 
> I would love to do heavy weight on my upper body but I find as soon as the bar speed slows down on bench press as it does on heavier weights then thats when I hurt my shoulder so have to keep to higher reps for me.


I agree mate, all the top programs have major similarities.

In regards to your Bench one thing that works for me is to keep elbows pretty tight against the torso as i bench, this will immediately take the stress away from the pectoral and shoulder area. Make the bench a Triceps lift and all will be good mate. I think Dave Tate had to do the same after his left pec tore off in a meet :thumb:

I always train slow as speed in my view can lead to lack of control, injuries and poor form, i estimate i take around a second on my positive phase of my lifts, the benefit is less momentum giving a more permanent strength increase :thumb:

Slow and steady


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 August/September

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 155GX3 - 175KGX3 - 195KGX3

DEADLIFT 165KGX4X4X4X4X4

RDL 30 Second Rest 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

My favorite lift, good workout, all reps felt strong and solid - light/medium difficulty :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 August/September

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 100X5 120X3 140X2) - 162KGX3 - 166KG Core knackered, decided to re rack it!*

Felt all wrong, I'm finding the GZCL is not feeling good for me on lower body lifts. To follow the program I would have to de load considerably (use a lift that you can rep out easy for 3 as your 100%)

As the reason for my squat progress issue is fear caused by the torn hamstring. I will go back to the 5/3/1.

I'll maintain GZCL for my bench as that feels perfect :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

First Week back and pleased to be back.
Squats: WU(50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2) WO 135x5,5,5
Back Off Sets: 105x8,8,8,8
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3
Prone Bridge: BWx30,30,30

So a good first workout back. Form felt slightly off but not terrible. Was getting over my toes slightly but when I concentrated on driving through the outside of my heels, the reps really cleared up.

Dragon Flags are an absolute killer ab exercise. It just combines everything in 1 for your abs, upper, lower, anti rotation, stabilization. Sore as hell today. 

Prone bridges arent done like the usual hold for 5 mins crowd. Pull your belly button towards your spine, then push your elbows down and pull your feet up (they wont move) and try and get your ribs closer to your pelvis. If done correctly, you wont even last 15 secs your first go. This turns the prone bridge into a good exercise instead of just an endurance exercise.

Doug, I know its hard to move down in weight to the 3 rep max or approx 90% but remember the strongest people in the world barely max out in training. Cant remember his name but we have discussed in this thread how a 1000lb squatter uses 425lb for 80% of his training and just waits until the weight is stupidly easy and the bar speed is really fast before he increases the weight. Lets say you take 180kg squat now and do an absolutely eye bleeding grinding set of 3 reps. Well in 3 months time, you take that same 180kg and blow 3 reps up with great speed, ya you havent added any weight to the bar but do you recon you have got stronger? Of course you have. But lifting is all about personal preference so if you feel good on 5/3/1 then go for it. Personally it doesnt have enough volume for me and I'm definitely finiding that my progress is better on the higher volume programs which does suck :lol:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x14 PM 154kg
BBB Sets: 70x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,8,8,8,8
Prone Trap Raises: 1.25 platesx12,12,12
Side Laying External Rotation: Empty Dumbellx12,12,12
Side Prone Bridge: BWx30s,30s,30s

So some of you may have noticed that I am doing GZCL on lower body and 5/3/1 on upper body. And I felt slightly beat up after my 10 week cut so I have kept the workouts to 2 exercises in the lower body workouts and 3 exercises in the upper body workouts and then added 2-3 rehab exercises at the end. Must say I am sitting here now on Wed the sorest I have ever been in my life, legs and abs are absolutely killing me.

But bench felt awesome last night, all warm up felt great, all sets felt great and i definitely left 1 rep in the tank if not 2 reps. I have been getting an awful feeling in my biceps and shoulder when benching lately but last night just felt awesome. All the reps were nice and fast.

Nice to get back to pendlay rows. The dead stop makes this exercise so much harder and lets you work really hard with less weight which is always good for building the back as form is really strict.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 August/September

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 165GX5 - 185KGX3 - 200KGX1 - 225KGX0 - 225KGX0

DEADLIFT 170KG5X3X3X3X3X3

RDL 30 Second Rest 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Good workout. Failed on the 225Kg twice. The 200Kg went up like the bar was empty and has never felt so light, the 225Kg didn't go up far at all. I would put the failure right at my own doorstep! I allowed the weight to intimidate me and I made two half arsed attempts and never really engaged my full strength. This was proven by how easy the 220Kg was last month Will try again next month :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: WU(70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2) WO 150x5,5,5
Back off Sets: 115x8,8,8,8
Pallof Press: Blue band x12,12,12

Deadlifts went well, harder than I thought they would be but still a couple in the tank. What I'm really surprised about is that I was struggling with my grip but after all the shrugs, chins and high rep DB rows, I thought my grip would be stronger. Strange.

That few extra reps on the back off sets make all the difference. Still like Deadlifts followed by more deadlifts, so simple but works so well.

I have basically worked backwards from a 205kg deadlift so in 10 weeks I should hit the 205kg.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: WU(50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2) WO 145x3,3,3,3
Back Off Sets: 112.5x6,6,6,6,6
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3
Prone Bridge: BWx30

Not the best workout but got all my reps in. I never felt like I was going to fail but form was still off. Not as sore today than last week thank god. I dont know if my abs are still recovering or it was the heavier squats but I could only manage 2 sets of Dragon Flags and these were crap as my abs felt like they were going to rip, very strange.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 85x3, 97.5x3, 112x12 PM 154kg
BBB Sets: 72.5x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x9,9,9,9,9
Prone Trap Raises: Empty Dumbellx8,8,12
Side Laying External Rotation: Empty Dumbellx12,12,12
Side Prone Bridge: BWx30s,30s,30s

Good workout but going to pull back on my bench slightly as that top set hurt my shoulder quite abit, no harm in leaving 1 in the tank to avoid injury. I'm constantly hitting heavier weight lately, matches my rep record last night and I'm only 2 weeks out of my diet so shows how I held on to all my strength while dropping 7kg. Extremely pleased with that.


----------



## Bod42

Just me again these days lol. Oh well good log for me.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3,3,3,3
Back Off Sets: 122.5x6,6,6,6,6
Pallof Press: Blue Bandx12,12,12

Good workout, weights were easy but again struggling with my grip which Im very confused about. I dont see how during a high volume back phase that my grip has got weaker. Hopefully the strength will return soon. Maybe its just my endurance stength as the 1st set is fine but fails as I go on.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Just me again these days lol. Oh well good log for me.


Yeah, sorry i'm not posting, i picked up another WTF!!!! injury walking up some stairs :wall: Pulled a small muscle in the calf and unlike before i'm going to be cautious.

I will be going through the Bill Star rehab protocol. Squats seem to pick up the calf injury the most when i get to parallel or below, so that's the lift ill use to repair.

On a positive note, my squat has been the main reason i'm inconsistent this year and there is no doubting this is the worst year for me lifting wise.

My plan is to squat for the next three weeks, every day if possible, started yesterday with 3 x 25 reps empty bar, no pain and is already feeling dull :thumb: Instead of sharp pain :thumb:

I had a new workout all planned before this to bring me back to my former consistency  But if all goes well I would like to be squatting around 190Kg for 1, if things goes really well 200Kg for 1. This will more than make up for my poor year so far.


----------



## Bod42

Injured again Doug, that sucks. I know you hate it but maybe look at backing right off, putting your big lifts in maintenance mode and doing some higher rep Bodybuilding work to give your body a break. I did that workout during my cut where the maximum you lift is 85% of your 1RM which is calculated off 90% so in reality the heaviest squat your doing is 76.5% of your 1RM for 3 reps but I still kept my strength while losing 8kg. The good thing is it had different exercises and pump reps and volume.

Even the like of CWS and his Juggernaut clients do phases of 10+ reps. They continuously run a muscle build, strength build, peak rotation. Seems to work pretty well for those guys. Theres some info about thw workouts in the back of The Renaissance Diet Ebook. Worth a read. 

Talking of CWS, wouldnt mind his latest book "Scientific Principles of Strength Training" looks really good.

Anyway enough chatting, my workout.
Squats: 70x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 140x3, 147.5x2,2, 155x1,1,1
Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3

Good workout, this amount of volume must be doing something as my legs were dead by the end. Form felt pretty good on the back off sets but forms definitely still off on the heavy sets. Pleased with the workout though. Time to start adding some weight so hopefully I do well on my test week next week.

Dragon flags are the best ab exercise I have ever found, hard as hell but awesome at the same time. They are the squat and deadlift or the ab world.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Injured again Doug, that sucks. I know you hate it but maybe look at backing right off, putting your big lifts in maintenance mode and doing some higher rep Bodybuilding work to give your body a break. I did that workout during my cut where the maximum you lift is 85% of your 1RM which is calculated off 90% so in reality the heaviest squat your doing is 76.5% of your 1RM for 3 reps but I still kept my strength while losing 8kg. The good thing is it had different exercises and pump reps and volume.
> 
> Even the like of CWS and his Juggernaut clients do phases of 10+ reps. They continuously run a muscle build, strength build, peak rotation. Seems to work pretty well for those guys. Theres some info about thw workouts in the back of The Renaissance Diet Ebook. Worth a read.
> 
> Talking of CWS, wouldnt mind his latest book "Scientific Principles of Strength Training" looks really good.
> 
> Anyway enough chatting, my workout.
> Squats: 70x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 140x3, 147.5x2,2, 155x1,1,1
> Back Off Sets: 120x5,5,5,5,5
> Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3
> 
> Good workout, this amount of volume must be doing something as my legs were dead by the end. Form felt pretty good on the back off sets but forms definitely still off on the heavy sets. Pleased with the workout though. Time to start adding some weight so hopefully I do well on my test week next week.
> 
> Dragon flags are the best ab exercise I have ever found, hard as hell but awesome at the same time. They are the squat and deadlift or the ab world.


It sucks more when injuries happen when not training I mean WTF!!!!

But yes a good idea to do some 10 rep months to end this year and start again next year :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 92.5x5, 105x3, 117.5x7 PM 145kg
Bench Press: 75x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x10,10,10,10,10
Prone Trap Raises: Dumbellx12,12,12

Good workout but I did Shoulder Press on Sunday so squats really stretched my shoulders which meant my bad shoulder was really playing up the entire workout sending a pain down my bicep and through my hard, very off putting lowering the weight with a massive pain shooting through your bicep. So I just got a decent amount of reps without pushing it to hard and moved on to some volume. 

Push the rows and especially the Prone Trap raises hard to help with my shoulder. As you can see I am doing RC work after every pushing workout now which to be honest is what I should always be doing.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 152.5x3, 162.5x2,2, 170x1,1,1
Back Off Sets: 132.5x5,5,5,5,5
Pallof Press: Blue Band x12,12,12

I was literally falling asleep during the day so had my first redbull in like 5 yrs and had the best workout in ages. Was it because of the pre-workout drink or because I put the work in on the previous weeks. What ever it was, it was an awesome workout, felt brilliant afterwards moving 170 easily.

Squats: 70x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 145x3, 152.5x2, 160x3
Back Off Sets: 127.5x4,4,4,4,4
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3

Another awesome workout. I have no idea how this workout went so well, I'd had no sleep, eaten like crap all weekend and had a really stressful weekend but my form today was perfect. Every rep felt easy and powerful. The last warm up set of 152.5x2 was so easy, I had to keep checking the weights after each set. I destroyed the top set of 3 and definitely could have got another rep if not 2 so I programmed perfectly. Everything goes up 5kg now.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Really excellent lifts James, this has got to be your best year progress wise AWESOME :thumb: 


Sort of a rhetorical question for you James. I'm doing my rehab work today so far all is good.

Something sprung to mind, if i go for full depth squatting as opposed parallel, using lighter weight of course, but in your opinion would this give me a chance to build up to a far more confident 200kg squat eventually if a bit slower?

Its my understanding that going full squat will build tremendous strength in the squat and improve flexibility and more importantly massive confidence. 

Your thoughts are always appreciated mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Today's rehab workout :thumb:

Wanted to test the Soleus for pain and find a good weight to start full squatting with.

All sets including warm ups:

Front Squat narrow stance: 20x4x4x4x4x4

Full Squat: 20x4X4 - 30X4 - 40X4 - 50X4 - 60X4 - 70X4 - 80X4 - 90X4 - 100X3 - 110X3 - 120X1 - 130X1 - 140X1 - 150X1 


Overall i'm very happy with this session. I could have gone heavier (I would estimate 170Kg, possibly 180Kg without so many warm ups pre exhausting the body) but not overly concerned with maxing out at this stage, just want something to work with.

Its really strange but the most difficult parts of the full squat were walking out after un racking and that little spot after full depth to parallel.


----------



## Estoril-5

Today marks approximately 3 months since my tendon injury below my knee and foot pain on my right leg.

Last appointment with the podiatrist on Wednesday to get my orthotics fitted.

Hopefully I can break back into the lifting slowly then.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Estoril-5 said:


> Today marks approximately 3 months since my tendon injury below my knee and foot pain on my right leg.
> 
> Last appointment with the podiatrist on Wednesday to get my orthotics fitted.
> 
> Hopefully I can break back into the lifting slowly then.


Best of luck mate, tendons and joints are an absolute  to recover from


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Really excellent lifts James, this has got to be your best year progress wise AWESOME :thumb:
> 
> Sort of a rhetorical question for you James. I'm doing my rehab work today so far all is good.
> 
> Something sprung to mind, if i go for full depth squatting as opposed parallel, using lighter weight of course, but in your opinion would this give me a chance to build up to a far more confident 200kg squat eventually if a bit slower?
> 
> Its my understanding that going full squat will build tremendous strength in the squat and improve flexibility and more importantly massive confidence.
> 
> Your thoughts are always appreciated mate :thumb:


I havent actually made that much progress to be honest. 
September 2015 I was lifting
Bench: 112.5x10 PM 150kg
Squats: 170x3 PM 187kg
Deadlifts: 177.5x3 PM 195kg

Now my predicted maxes are (this was in June)
Bench: 154kg
Squats: 189.5kg
Deadlifts: 198kg

So pretty pathetic progress in a year but feel like the extra volume workouts are really working these days so hopefully onwards and upwards from here.

Anyway to your question. The answer is basically a question, where do you want to hit your 200kg squat? Parallel or full depth? What ever the answer then that is where you train to. Squatting at the sort of weights your handling is a skill, the more you practice the skill, the better you get. Yes you can work on your flexibility if this is needed but separately.


----------



## Bod42

Pretty certain that I updated my Squats workout but definitely not here so will write it up again.

Test Week
Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x5, 127.5x2, 145x3, 152.5x2, 160x3 
Back Off Sets: 127.5x4,4,4,4,4
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3

So again I felt like absolute crap as Id had no sleep but as soon as I started working out, everything felt awesome, the best its felt in months, form was spot on and weights were flying up. Hit my goal of 3 reps and could have easily got 4 maybe 5, maybe even 6.

Form went a bit on the back off sets as back was tired from getting tight under the bar for so many sets.

Bench Press: 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3, 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x10
Bench Press: 77.5x10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 70x10,10,10

Ok so the morning of this workout, i told the Mrs that my shoulder really hurt but i had a golf fitting booked for the new Taylormade M1 woods but I was in so much pain with my shoulder that I had to leave. I then went home and trained so this workout was all about just getting the work in and then getting out of the gym. My shoulder sends a quite severe pain down my bicep, through my forearm into my hand so lowering the weight is very painful but Ive got used to living with the injury.

I only did 3 sets of the back off sets and Rows as I was supersetting them with short rest which completely killed me.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Anyway to your question. The answer is basically a question, where do you want to hit your 200kg squat? Parallel or full depth? What ever the answer then that is where you train to. Squatting at the sort of weights your handling is a skill, the more you practice the skill, the better you get. Yes you can work on your flexibility if this is needed but separately.


Going on how they felt yesterday, the really odd thing is even though its harder to squat to full depth, it felt "Right" difficult to translate into words TBH, i didn't feel at all beat up, i'm wondering if trying too hard to hit parallel then stopping at that height is causing issues. At full depth there is no doubt of making the lift.

I don't know it just felt the way to squat. I've been reading up about it and everything seems to point to positives with all the other parts of the body hit by going below parallel, also it is considered it will greatly improve flexibility. From a psychological point of view i can see great confidence to be gained from full depth squatting.

So to answer your question: With all the other benefits I would love to full squat 200Kg :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug you may be getting better rebound out of the bottom instead of trying to reverse at parallel. And I'm with you on the mental bit of it, I have been full squatting for ages now and when that weight gets to the top, I know 100% that I hit depth, none of this half squat crap that cant be counted as a proper squat.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3, 167.5x2, 175x4
Back Off sets: 140x4,4,4,4,4
Pallof Press: Blue Bandx12,12,12

So this was one of these workouts where everything felt crap, form was off, felt weak the lot but battled through as this was my goal week so had to hit something decent as the next 4 weeks are based off this week. Please to get 4 reps anyway as my goal was 3 reps.

So normally i squat on mondays but completelt buggered my left knee at the driving range on sunday trying to get my weight more forward so swapped squats out for bench.

Bench: 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3, 87.5x3, 100x3, 112.5x11 PM 153.5kg
Back Off Sets: 80x10,10,10,7,7
Pendlay Rows: 80x5,5,5,5,5
Prone Trap Raise: 0x12,12,12
Side Laying external Rotations: 0x12,12,12

So shoulder wasnt hurting at all when I started this workout, once I got up to the heavier weights only a slight pain in my bicep so thought I would push it a little bit and pleased with 11 reps of 112.5, I need to hit 115 for 11 reps in 3 weeks to hit a record so I'm confident I will hit this.

Also even more pleased at my back off sets, last time I did Bench BBB I was stuck at 75 for weeks but making really good progress on these as well.

Changed up Pendlay rows as I have been on 70kg for ever so added 10kg and I will keep adding reps until I hit 10 then add 10kg.

I have also been doing a massive amount of reading on rehab etc and getting the body to move correctly. I only do shoulder mobility work quickly as part of my workout, if I want to improve something why on earth am i not doing it every day like the pros do so now I am trying to do a few exercises every morning. I am also working on thoracic spine mobility as they will help with lifting, golf and general health. You dont realise your tight until you try to do a simple mobility drill. Sitting here the next day, my upper back is so sore from just these exercises.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) 85KG5X8X8X8X8X8

BENCH PRESS 70KGX8X8X8X8X8

BLUE BAND PULLUPS 30 Second Rest 10X10X10X6X5
*

Nice to be back into lifting, ill stick to this medium weight training with progression of 2.5kg for upper body every time i make the designated reps until the end of the year, then back to heavy progression January :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug are you doing multiple top sets these days, not 5/3/1. I've considered doing this but my performance drops off so quickly between sets, for me I think its counter productive but do want to give it another try.

*Squats: 50x5, 82.5x5, 115x3, 132.5x2, 140x5,5,5
Squats: 107.5x8,8,8,8*

Did some rehab on my knee before the workout but was still shifting my weight over to my right leg when pushing up obviously protecting my knee so pleased to get in and get the workout done. The 8 rep sets were quite hard.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug are you doing multiple top sets these days, not 5/3/1. I've considered doing this but my performance drops off so quickly between sets, for me I think its counter productive but do want to give it another try.


5/3/1 with some variation  starts January, all I'm doing at the moment is a simple 8 rep template with medium weights until the end of December. Build some muscle lose some fat and gain some fitness :thumb:

I agree if your in a progression mode then the multiple top sets are not the best option. I wouldn't bother with multiple top sets if pure strength is your goal mate. I'm just in maintenance mode for 3 months


----------



## Bod42

See if you asked me not so long ago then I would have agreed, 1 all out top set for strength but in my own training I have found multiple sets to be superior, research shows this and after studying a lot of seriously strong people, they all use multiple sets. The big thing now is back off sets which I found out myself and then backed up by research.

The soreness the next day is definitely different from normal as well, deeper in the muscle.

But I think a slightly higher rep phase will be good for you, does make you feel fresh as I can definitely feel my joints starters to play up with the heavier lifting.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 110X3) - 130KGX8X8X8X8X8

DEADLIFT 100KGX8X8X8X8X8

RDL 70KGX8X8X8X8X8*

Felt very much like a bodybuilding program, nice medium weights, but im ok with that until January :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug I recon you will progress really well on this program. Usually when you take a step back you actually make more progress.

Shoulder Press: (WU 25x5, 32.5x5, 37.5x3) WO 45x3, 50x3, 56.5x9 PM 73.5kg
Dips: BW+35x4,4,3,0
Inverted Rows: BWx10,10,10
Kneeling External Rotations: Red Band x12,12,12
Behind Neck Band Pull Aparts: Red Band x12,12,12

I dont know whats going on with my shoulder at the moment but it is constantly hurting. I'm hoping its like when I adopted BBB for shoulder press and it hurt badly for the first few weeks but then came out stronger in the end. Im hoping thats the case with all the RC work I'm doing. 

Dips were a disaster, Ive done BW+27.5 for 12 reps so figured I could at least get some reps on 35 but as soon as i got near the bottom, got to a certain range in my shoulder and I just dropped, zero strength.

Did inverted rows with all sorts of different grips trying to get some extra volume into my upper back. Then did my RC work. 

Shoulder felt good this morning then I tried to open a jar and blew it. Its getting so annoying having a glass shoulder. Oh well deadlifts tonight which are one of the best shoulder reapirers there is.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 155x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x8,8,8,8
Pallot Press: Blue bandx12,12,12

Good workout, hit all my reps so cant complain. I find this the hardest week on deadlifts.

Squats: 50x5, 82.5x5, 115x3, 132.5x2, 147.5x3,3,3,3
Squats: 115x6,6,6,6
Dragon Flags: BWx3,3,3
Prone Bridge: BWx30s,30s,30s.

Smoked this workout, all sets felt nice and fast with plenty left in the tank. The back off sets felt especially good. Gives me loads of confidence heading towards a rep record as this was 5kgs heavier but still quite easy.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Got my new program sorted and guess what caught another virus FFS, in fact everyone at work has got it again :wall::wall: 

Is this year going to get any more inconsistent?????

Anyway as of Monday ill be doing an 8 rep regime for the remaining year.

See you all next week :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Mate its so weird that I'm on the other side of the world and the same thing is happening, worst year ever for virus' etc. Mine have all been to do with my chest so as gross as it is I actually find that working out removes the flem, good thing I work out in my garage lol.

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 75x3) WO 95x5, 107.5x3, 120x6 PM 144kg
Bench Press: 80x10,10,10,10,10
Pendlay Rows: 80x6,6,6,6,6

Ok so I can do more and could have done more but my shoulder was the worst it has been in a long long time so had to just get in do some reps and get out really. The heavy weights really feel like their going to tear my bicep off the bone. Been reading loads of medical papers regarding shoulder injuries and how to diagnose and treat them. It seems to lead from my scapular so need to work on scapular depression and getting my right scapular to sit in its proper position. Started doing daily mobility exercises to help with this so I'm doing a shoulder mobility series and an upper thoracic mobility routine. I have also been reading a lot on nerve flossing which is a term I only heard yesterday but its amazing how everything is connected in your body and putting pressure on my thumb stops the pain in my shoulder.

Ive also been pressing my RC work really hard to try and get over my shoulder pain but what Ive actually found from research is that you should never press your RC to failure, just concentrate on the movement. Also found some interesting research about speed training your RC as its the fastest joint in the body. I'm thinking this will really help me as Ive always done my rehab slow and controlled and then as soon as i say throw a ball over arm, my shoulder goes, hopefully training the joint with speed will get it used to speed, makes sense really.

My number one goal is fixing my shoulder now and if I have to work on it daily then so be it but its effecting my workouts and its really effecting my golf which I'm trying to push this year. I cant even get through half a bucket of balls before my hand goes numb and the pain stops me.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 127.5x6,6,6,6,6
Backwards/Forwards Farmers Walk: 40kgx4,4,4

Good workout, wasnt as fast as I would have liked but never felt like I was going to fail. This much volume does take a toll on your hands though. Grip was the limiting factor again tonight. Going to start doing dedicated grip work again.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 70x5, 82.5x5, 115x3, 132.5x2, 145x3, 152.5x2,2, 160x1,1,1
Squats: 125x5,5,5,5,5
Backwards/Forwards Farmers Walk: 50kgx4,4,4
Handcuffs: 10,10,10

Good workout, probably a bit harder than it should be considering I have to hit 165x5 next Monday but I did do a round of golf late sunday night so legs were slightly sore. Hoping 165x5 is still on the cards as this will be a rep record for me.

As discuss before, Ive figured out that my shoulder problem isnt RC strength, its actually my scapular so doing a lot of mobility and upper back work. I think Defranco is awesome so adding a few of his favorite upper back exercises/Shoulder health exercises per workout. Even the thoracic spine mobility work seems to be working and my right shoulder is so much tighter than my left.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 82.5x5, 95x5, 110x11 PM 150.5kg
Bench Press: 82.5x10,8,6,6,6
Pendlay Rows: 80x7,7,7,7,7
Handcuffs: BWx10,10,10
Band Pull Aparts: Red bandx25,25,25,25

So didnt hit a record which is slightly disappointing as i was after 13 reps of 110kg and I have hit 12 reps twice before but form was slightly off today, I seemed to be using loads of triceps which felt strong but died off once I got to higher reps.

Some will notice that I added 10kg to my Pendlay rows but still hitting the same sort of reps, I think with Pendlay rows its just higher reps that are hard so no matter the weight it always hard hitting 5 sets of 10.

But the most exciting news is I think I may have found the solution to my shoulder problem after all these years. I have always hammered my RC hard but I've never been weak or had an imbalance, if anything my right shoulder has a stronger RC so thats not the problem. The problem is scapular retraction so I am moving away from RC work and bombing my upper back after every workout. I will actually be starting Defrancos 3 Weeks to a JACKED Upper Back routine which is basically working your upper back every single day. Hoping for good results from this. Its actually what Defranco did with triple H after his shoulder surgery.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 160x3, 170x2,2, 177.5x1,1,1
Deadlifts: 137.5x5,5,5,5,5

Really good workout, hit all my reps nice and fast and the best thing about it is that I had zero problems with my grip. This gives me loads of confidence to hit my goal next week and that will finally put me over that 200kg deadlift. 

Was doubly pleased with this wrokout as well because my upper back was so sore from my bench day. Cant believe how sore it actually was just from some easy exercises like handcuffs and BPAs, its good and shoulder feels good.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Excellent lifting there James :thumb:

Finally the virus is leaving me 

Will be back Tuesday YAY!!! :thumb:


All the healthy runners at work have still got their virus (6th week this week) I was lucky enough to be rid of it in 3 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 70X3) - 87.5KGX8X8X8X8X8
*
Short, but nice to get some lifting in, still got virus, but its not getting in the way now :thumb:

Cant wait to fully recover and do some proper lifting


----------



## Bod42

So Workout one of my records week was a good one.
Bench Press: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 90x3, 102.5x3, 115x11 PM 157kg
Bench Press: 82.5x10,10,7,6,6
Pendlay Rows: 80x7,7,7,7,7
Handcuffs: 4x12
Band Pull Aparts: 4x25

11 reps was my goal so got that so pleased but the even better part of this is that I had basically no pain in my shoulder, bicep and/or hand. First time in months I have been able to bench basically pain free. Had 1 shooting pain down my bicep during my 5th set but shoulder felt really good during the heavy set. So good in fact that i was actually going to go for 12 reps but just lost the 11th rep towards my face a bit so used up a lot of strength finishing that rep. 

Stayed at 80kg for Pendlay Rows but did the reps faster and cleaner so thats still progression. I will probably add another 5-10kgs next phase and go back down to 5x5 and work my way back up as this worked really well. Need to start pushing this exercise.

The simple upper back exercises at the end are actually really hard work especially those handcuffs.


----------



## Bod42

Workout 2 of goals week was also a good one.
Squats: 50x5, 82.5x5, 115x3, 132.5x2, 145x3, 152.5x2, 152.5x5 PM 192.5kg
Squats: 125x4,4,4,4,4

5 reps was the goal I was aiming for and I smashed this. I had loads of strength but the bar was just rolling up my back a bit coming out of the hole so was using more energy than I should have, probably still could have got 6 reps, very confident I could of. I really like this 10 week set up with a small PR at the end, I realise its slow going but its still 12.5kg per year which I'm actually happy with at my level and I feel so much better body and mentality wise.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 110X3) - 135KGX8X8X8X8X8*

Another one down, virus is most definitely sapping my strength, had no energy throughout the entire workout, but made it :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Trial week

*FULL SQUAT (WU 80X5 90X5 100X3) - 114KgX5X5X5X5X5

FULL SQUAT (BBB test) - 70KgX10X10*

Wanted to get some reps in Virus or not!  Pleased with results, all pretty easy. I'm hoping to use the 70Kg5X10 at the end of the workout after Squat walkouts. For my new training cycle i will use 160Kg as my Full squat 100% max.

The plan is

Full squat - 5/3/1 week 3 work set for all 3 weeks. Normal progress
200Kg5X1 Squat walkouts - Progress, possibly adding weight as and when. 
Full squat - 70Kg5X10 - progress to be caped at 100Kg5x10

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Last of my record weeks workouts and saved the best til last.

Deadlifts: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x3, 172.5x2, 182.5x5 PM 213kg
Deadlifts: 145x4,4,4,4,4

So my aim was 182.5x3 but the guy Im training got 5 reps of 162.5 and I wanted to stay 20kgs ahead of him so I went for 5 reps. The 5th reps took an absolute age to lock out but I got there in the end and that exactly gives me a 15kg rep PR for the Deadlifts, extremely pleased with that. I would like to give GZCL another run through but completely changing workout typres now and going for conditioning/body comp for the next 6 weeks.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 97.5KGX5 - 110.5KGX3 - 123.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10X10X10X10X7

BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good comeback workout, work sets felt well within my capabilities and im liking this new format. I hope to keep to this for the end of the year and progress as much as possible on the main worksets back to my original weights for the new year. No need to rush even if the weights are a bit easy, i just want to get some nice consitent lifting in :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Ok so I am taking a completely different approach to training from now on up until Xmas. Ive hit some all time PRs so now I want to improve body comp, fitness, mobility, etc, basically just make myself feel better so I will be running Joe Defrancos Built 2 Last program which includes a load of foam rolling, mobility work, upper back, unilateral work, etc and basically doesnt lift that heavy on the lower body until weeks 8-10.

Anyway this week is my deload week so just basically messing around and learning the exercises I have to do.

Close Grip Bench Press: 50x8, 72.5x6, 85x4, 100x4,4,4,6
S/S Iso-Hold Y-W-T: 4x10secs
Circuit 2 Rounds
Off-set Med ball Push-Ups w/Shoulder Touch - Each Side: BW x 10 reps
Seated Cable Rows - Blue band x 15 reps
L-Laterals w/Long Lever Eccentric - Empty Dumbells x 12 reps
McGill Sit-Ups - Each Leg - BW x 10 reps

Quite surprised how sore this workout made me but nice to get the heart rate up and push myself in a different way. This workout also has a specific warm up for upper and lower body days. Also includes a Pre-bench shoulder warmup.

Going to be very weird for me not hitting heavy squats or deadlifts. Basically the 1st 6 weeks of the program centre around the barbell split squat and bringing up single leg strength is good for health and correcting any imbalances.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Last of my record weeks workouts and saved the best til last.
> 
> *Deadlifts: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x3, 172.5x2, 182.5x5 PM 213kg*
> Deadlifts: 145x4,4,4,4,4
> 
> So my aim was 182.5x3 but the guy Im training got 5 reps of 162.5 and I wanted to stay 20kgs ahead of him so I went for 5 reps. The 5th reps took an absolute age to lock out but I got there in the end and that exactly gives me a 15kg rep PR for the Deadlifts, extremely pleased with that. I would like to give GZCL another run through but completely changing workout typres now and going for conditioning/body comp for the next 6 weeks.


Well done James, awesome lifting mate :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 November

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 165GX5 - 185KGX3 - 205KGX1 - 210KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGX10X10X10X10X10

RDL (30 Second Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Nice workout :thumb:

Form wasn't as good as I would like on the 210KgX1 so ill keep to the same weight next week and work on that :thumb:
BBB sets were far too light, ill have to check my records, but i was sure this was the weight I used while on the 5/3/1 
RDL nice finisher 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Well done James, awesome lifting mate :thumb::thumb:


Ya really pleased with this considering Ive been stuck at similar weights for so long. The entire workout just makes sense to me, whats is going to work better 1 top set (5/3/1) or 6 heavy sets followed by 5 back off sets (GZCL), yes it hards work but hard work gives good results as i PR'd on every exercise in just 10 weeks following a diet where I lost 8kgs so a portion of that was just regaining strength.

This new workout just hits completely different muscles though and will be hard work. Take for instance, the lower body workout, Bulgarian split squats with 52.5kg for 5 reps, should be easy but throw in a 6 sec negative and suddenly this is one brutal workout.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 November

*BAND DIP (WU 10XBB+BW - 10XBB+10KG - 5XBB+20KG)

DIP 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG - 10XBW+10KG5X5X5

BAND PULLUP (WU 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG - 10XBW+10KG) 10XBW+15KGX10X10 - BW+20KGX5X5X5

BLUE BAND DIP (30 Second Rest between Sets) 10X10X10X10X6*

Once i get 30KG-35KG attached to my body weight on pull ups i'm hoping it will cancel out the band and give for some true body weight pull up progress.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 November

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 120KGX5 - 136KGX3 - 152KGX1

SQUAT WALKOUT 200KGX1X1X1X1X1

FULL SQUAT 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*

Good to get some lifting in on the squat.

Main work sets felt within my limits, which is good :thumb:

Squat walkouts felt so much easier than i thought they would, the last time i did them the weight felt incredibly heavy, you could almost hear the bar saying - 



But this time i felt very much more in charge of the weight :thumb:

The last group of sets at 70Kg were too light, ill just keep adding 5kg per week until i find a weight that feels right for training.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Ok so workout 1 of my new routine

Close Grip Bench Press: 50x8, 72.5x6, 85x4, 100x4,4,4,12 PM 140kg
S/S W/ Iso-Hold Y-W-T: 4x10secs

Strength Capacity Circuit: 3 rounds
Off-set Med ball Push-Ups w/Shoulder Touch - Each Side: BWx10
Seated Cable Rows: Blue Bandx15
L-Laterals w/Long Lever Eccentric: 0x12
McGill Sit-Ups - Each Leg: BWx12
60 seconds rest, repeat

So this workout had me dripped with sweat. You will notice that all the exercises are opposites so you can still hit the muscle 100% but also good for your fitness. Its also nice to still have the heavy component in the workouts. 

CGBP felt weird but 100kg for 12 was quite easy considering I havent done this exercise in years. 

If anyone has trouble isolating or getting a pump in their outer Delt then give the L-Laterals w/Long Lever Eccentric a try, these burn and give an incredible pump. I normally feel laterals in my traps but these were awesome.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 November

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 100KGX5 - 113KGX3 - 126KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10X10X10X10X10

BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

All good, cant wait to be back to 130kg on my bench, definite improvements all round in this workout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 November

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 175KGX5 - 190KGX3 - 210KGX1

DEADLIFT 105KGX10X10X10X10X10

RDL (30 Second Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Nice! :thumb:

210Kg went up much easier than last week so ill add 5kg for next week, still need to work on my lockout though, ive got a little lazy


----------



## Bod42

Workout 2 of the new program
Barbell Eccentric Rear Foot Elevated Split Squats: 52.5x8,8,5 (6 sec negative)
Deadlifts: 70x8, 105x8,8
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 2
Singel Leg Hip Thrusts back on bench: BWx10
BW Calf Raises on Floor: BWx15
Stability Ball Crunches: BWx15

Ok so the 6 sec negative for 5 reps is hard enough but I was in a rush and for some strange reason i thought it was 8 reps on each left so I did 60% more work and was absolutely dead after just the first set so as you can imagine, the next 2 sets were brutal.

Awesome workout though, dripping with sweat and breathing really hard but still working on strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 November

*DIP (WU 10XBB+BW - 10XBB+10KG - 5XBB+20KG) 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG - 5XBW+10KGX5X5X5

BAND PULLUP (WU 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG - 10XBW+10KG) 10XBW+15KGX10X10 - 5XBW+20KGX5X5X5

BLUE BAND DIP (30 Second Rest between Sets) 10X10X10X10X10*

My deepest sympathies to the fallen in Paris, their friends and families.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 November

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 120KGX5 - 140KGX3 - 160KGX1

SQUAT WALKOUT 200KGX1X1X1X1X1

FULL SQUAT 70KGX10X10X10X10X10*


----------



## Bod42

Workout 3. 3 workouts per week for 3 phases.
Eccentric Incline DB Bench Press 6sec lowering: 30x8,8,8
S/S Bilateral Lat Pulldown w/ Unilateral Eccentric 6sec lowering: Blue Bandx10,10,10
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 3
Strict DB Flyes w/internal rotation: 10x10
Mini-band Pull parts (underhand): Red Bandx15
Concentration Curls: 10x10
Dead-stop DB Tricep Extensions: 10x10
Pike Planks: BWx15

Never thought I would but Im actually loving these workouts. Get some heavy work in to maintain strength and build muscle then get into the circuits. I actually did 4 circuits insted of 3 as i was enjoying it so much. It ramps each week so concludes with 5 circuits. These are non-competing exercises so you only need 30-60 rest between circuits. Yes I know circuit training is inferior for strength and muscle building, this is obvious and still cant believe people argue about this when its common sense but its good to work on energy systems and prolonged work.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 November

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 102.5KGX5 - 115.5KGX3 - 128.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 80KGX10X10X10X10X10

BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Good workout, felt strong on all lifts :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Close Grip Bench Press: 50x8, 72.5x6, 85x4, 107.5x3,3,3,10 PM 143.5kg
S/S W/ Iso-Hold Y-W-T: 4x12secs

Strength Capacity Circuit: 4 rounds
Off-set Med ball Push-Ups w/Shoulder Touch - Each Side: BWx12
Seated Cable Rows: Blue Bandx12
L-Laterals w/Long Lever Eccentric: 2.5x12
McGill Sit-Ups - Each Leg: BWx10
60 seconds rest, repeat

The Medicine Ball pushups and L-Laterals are absolute killers but its a really good circuit.

Quite pleased to get such a high number on CGBP as havent done this in years and improved on last week.

The only negative point is that I didn't lose any weight last week was is surprising, just have to tidy things up this week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 175KGX5 - 195KGX3 - 215KGX0

DEADLIFT 105KGX10X10X10X10X10

RDL (30 Second Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Good workout, not particularly surprised i failed the 1x215kg, i think doing 3x195kg prior to the main lift fatigued me beyond recovery for a heavy single.


----------



## Bod42

Barbell Eccentric Rear Foot Elevated Split Squats: 55x4,4,4 (6 sec negative)
Deadlifts: 70x8, 105x10,10
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 3
Singel Leg Hip Thrusts back on bench: BWx10
BW Calf Raises on Floor: BWx15
Stability Ball Crunches: BWx15

Such a different workout to what I'm used to. 4 reps on each leg sounds like nothing but the 6 sec negative turns this into a killer exercise and complete burn. 

I recon all this single leg work will pay off when i go back to squatting as it will correct any imbalances.


----------



## Bod42

Eccentric Incline DB Bench Press 6sec lowering: 35x7,7,7
S/S Bilateral Lat Pulldown w/ Unilateral Eccentric 6sec lowering: Blue Bandx8,8,8
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 4
Strict DB Flyes w/internal rotation: 12.5x8
Mini-band Pull parts (underhand): Red Bandx20
Concentration Curls: 15x8
Dead-stop DB Tricep Extensions: 12.5x8
Pike Planks: BWx20

The 6 sec lowering makes the incline press burn like crazy but its actually quite nice as it completely flips the focus as now you dont care about the positive part of the movement, 100% of concentration is on the 6 sec negative. Increased all my weights this week so the circuits were a lot harder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 November

*DIP (WU 10XBB+BW - 10XBB+10KG - 5XBB+20KG) 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG 5XBW+10KGX5X5X5

BAND PULLUP (WU 10XBW - 10XBW+5KG - 10XBW+10KG) 10XBW+15KGX10X10 - 5XBW+20KGX5X5X5

BLUE BAND DIP (30 Second Rest between Sets) 10X10X10X10X10*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 November

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 125KGX5 - 145KGX3 - 165KGX1

DEAD SQUAT (FULL SQUAT DEPTH) - 100KGX1X1X1X1X1

DEAD SQUAT (1" ABOVE PARALLEL DEPTH) - 110KGX1X1X1XX1*

Loving the full squat, all those years going parallel :wall: Full squatting feels harder yes, but you know every lift counts, I've always had doubts and this makes you concentrate on the lift in the wrong areas and is very distracting. Going full depth takes all the doubt away.
Dead squats are a nice alternative lift, ill keep using them. I've started light to get my joints used to the lift and build from there :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I'm exactly the same with full squats Doug. If i lock that weight out then I know it was a good lift, none of this was it parallel and therefore a better lift or not. I used to concentrate on the decent so much but now its down, explode and try and throw that weight through the ceiling, simple really.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I'm exactly the same with full squats Doug. If i lock that weight out then I know it was a good lift, none of this was it parallel and therefore a better lift or not. *I used to concentrate on the decent so much *but now its down, explode and try and throw that weight through the ceiling, simple really.


Exactly James, it used to take all my focus off the lift, just imagine if i had gone full depth from the start, leasson learnt!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 November 1rep max week

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110X1 - 120KGX1 - 130KGX1*

Didn't feel particularly strong tonight in the bench but got some reasonable numbers in. Considering ive benched 145Kg this time last year, the 130Kg felt very close to my max. Work needed in the new year me thinks :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Close Grip Bench Press: 50x8, 85x4, 100x2, 115x2,2,2,8 PM 145.5kg
S/S W/ Iso-Hold Y-W-T: 4x15secs

Strength Capacity Circuit: 5 rounds
Off-set Med ball Push-Ups w/Shoulder Touch - Each Side: BWx10
Seated Cable Rows: Blue Band doubledx10
L-Laterals w/Long Lever Eccentric: 2.5x8
McGill Sit-Ups - Each Leg: BWx10
60 seconds rest, repeat

Pleased to get 8 reps, I think 145.5kg Close grip bench press is pretty decent. Its only about 10kg behind my usual press and I've only trained CGBP for 3 weeks. 

Shoulder is feeling so good at the moment, just doing loads of upper back work, foam rolling and thoracic spine mobility work and its the best it has been in years. Glad I figured out that weak RC wasnt the issue. Need to buy some new bands though as want to do upper back work daily.


----------



## Bod42

Barbell Eccentric Rear Foot Elevated Split Squats: 60x3,3,3 (6 sec negative)
Deadlifts: 70x8, 105x12,12
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 3
Singel Leg Hip Thrusts back on bench: BWx10
BW Calf Raises on Floor: BWx20
Stability Ball Crunches: BWx15

Quite please to do 60kg on 1 leg coupled with a 6 sec negative, that just has to built some strength for full squats and the knee pain I had from golf has all but gone. 

This workout has been awesome so far but it steps up a gear over the next 3 weeks as have to do Bulgarian Split Squats with 3 sec pause in the bottom and then follow up with squats which will be interesting.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 testing week

Bench press has been awful this year, so decided to work on my technique and body position today.

First of all, the lifts felt WORLDS APART from Monday :thumb:

*Bench Press (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110KgX1 - 120KgX1 - 135KgX1*

I was becoming sore in the middle of my back while benching - today no pain at all - reason - I was arching far too much. Today i just kept the arch natural, so i'm glad I've solved that one :thumb:
The knock on effect of the natural arch was more strength throughout each lift :thumb:
Also I reduced my warm up by one set, looking back when i benched 145Kg (Last December FFS! :wall::wall::wall I basically did 3 work sets including the 145. However all the messing around with light weights this year has taken its toll, today's 135Kg was my limit, so a 10Kg loss in 12 months, could be worse 

As you can see I've gone back to what is basically a 5/3/1 but running week 3 every week. I'm sure I'll platueue very soon on many lifts but it will give me a good foundation to work with for the new year :thumb:

Very tempted - http://www.roguefitness.com/nike-romaleos-2-weightlifting-shoe-volt-v2 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 1 rep max testing

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 130X1 - 150KGX1 - 170KGX1*

All felt really good. I now prefer the full squat because it feels so positive on every lift :thumb:

I could have gone to 180Kg, possibly 185Kg, but I'm just building slowly for now.

I have also found that full squatting is helping greatly in my confidence in the lift :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Workout 3.
Eccentric Incline DB Bench Press 6sec lowering: 37.5x6,6,6
S/S Bilateral Lat Pulldown w/ Unilateral Eccentric 6sec lowering: Blue Bandx8,8,8
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 5
Strict DB Flyes w/internal rotation: 15x8
Mini-band Pull parts (underhand): Red Bandx20
Concentration Curls: 15x8
Dead-stop DB Tricep Extensions: 15x8
Pike Planks: BWx20

Good workout, sweating like crazy afterwards. 5 circuits is bloody hard though but also feel really good. Really pleased to get the 37.5 incline press in. 

Complete change of exercises now so change from Close grip Bench to Floor press, Deadlifts to squats and change all the circuits.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 December 2015

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX5 - 118KGX3 - 131KGX1

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX10X10X10X10X10

BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Back pain issue solved, absoluteley no pain today. All lifts were good, good workout in general :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Workout 1 - Phase 2
Barbell Floor Press: 50x8, 82.5x6, 95x4, 110x4,4,4,6 PM 132kg
S/S Iso-Hold Rear Delt Bench Flyes (Hold at top for 5 secs): 1.25x5,5,5,5
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 4
Med Ball "Squeeze" Push Ups: BWx12
Bent-Over Dumbell Row: 32.5x12
Dead Stop Lateral Raises - 2.5x12
Straight Leg Hip-ups on bench: BWx12

Its been years and years since I have done Floor Press and I knew I hated them but jesus they are difficult. Very similar to anderson press and squat where you take the weight off the target muscle.

Super Setting bench with upper back exercises is awesome and I will be keeping these in my program for the future. These arent difficult exercises so dont tax you, they are more isomatric work for rehab and I must say my shoulder is better than ever.

Med Ball Squeeze push ups are harder than they look as well. Your basically doing a close grip push up which is hard enough but push an unstable surface and griiping on the sides so you have to squeeze inwards tensing the chest.

Cant imagine a workout like this will improve my strength at the end but must say, I am fitter and body feels awesome.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Rear Foot Elevated Barbell Split Squats (3 sec Pause): 55x5,5,5
Squats: 70x8, 90x6, 102.5x4, 112.5x5,5,5
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 3
Dumbell RDL's: 10x10
Weighted Calf raises: 10x10
Hollow Body Rocks: BWx30secs

Forward/Backwards Farmers Walks (1 rep= walk forward 5-10yds): 25 in each hand, 4 reps 2 sets

Start by saying that I love farmers walks, not because i actually enjoy doing them, they suck but because they are so good for you. Good enough that they should be in everyones program.

Training legs before squats is something I havent done in years but definitely makes you feel nice and loose. The 3 sec pause split squats are miles easier than 6 sec negitive version but still make a nice change.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 December

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 160KGX5 - 180KGX3 - 200KGX1*

Better, I would put my recent my deadlift failures down to:

1. Using too much weight on the build up to the heaviest set

2. Inconsistency and using light weights this year has made for VERY poor/sloppy technique. Need to get lower and not rely on back brute strength.

3. Not resting enough between work sets. Will revert back to 7 minute rest between main work sets :thumb:

I'll stick to the same weights until i'm happy the above has been corrected.

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Training legs before squats is something I havent done in years but definitely makes you feel nice and loose.


I've been doing this for a while now too James, I agree and find it definitely helps.
I normally do several sets of incrementally heavier leg press before then going into my squat sets.


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 1 December 2015
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX5 - 118KGX3 - 131KGX1
> 
> BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX10X10X10X10X10
> 
> BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
> *
> 
> Back pain issue solved, absoluteley no pain today. All lifts were good, good workout in general :thumb:


122 total reps of the same exercise is impressive Doug... :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> 122 total reps of the same exercise is impressive Doug... :thumb:


I think Doug and i have figured out that volume builds strength and its funny as Doug and I have reached the same conclusion and structured our new workouts the same but from different sides of the world. Its very similar to the GZCL pyramid structure thats basically 
Tier 1 is heavy, low rep, low volume, long rest
Tier 2 is medium weight, reps, volume and rest
Tier 3 is light weight, high reps, volume and short rest

If you structural your workouts around this principle then you will never go wrong.

So one way is Dougs Method above keeping the workouts very specific or if you want you can switch things up abit.
Bench: 5x3 4mins rest
Incline Bench: 5x6 2 mins rest
Dips: 3*12 30-60 secs rest.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Incline DB Bench Press (3 sec Pause at bottom): 35x7,7,7
S/S Iso-Hold Incline DB Rows (3 sec pause at top): 20x7,7,7
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 4
Standing J-Pulldowns w/rope: Blue band x 12
Cable Face Pulls w/Rope: Red Band x 12
Cable tricep Pushdowns w/rope: Blue Band x 12
Zottman Curls: 10 x 8
RKC Planks: 5 sets of 5secs with 5 sec rest (killer)

Another good workout, quite surprised that I'm enjoying all this slower rep, more time under tension work, like the pause in the bottom actually felt really good.

The circuit was pretty easy until the RKC Planks which are a killer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> 122 total reps of the same exercise is impressive Doug... :thumb:


Makes everything easier to set up 



Bod42 said:


> I think Doug and i have figured out that volume builds strength and its funny as Doug and I have reached the same conclusion and structured our new workouts the same but from different sides of the world. Its very similar to the GZCL pyramid structure thats basically
> Tier 1 is heavy, low rep, low volume, long rest
> Tier 2 is medium weight, reps, volume and rest
> Tier 3 is light weight, high reps, volume and short rest
> 
> If you structural your workouts around this principle then you will never go wrong.
> 
> So one way is Dougs Method above keeping the workouts very specific or if you want you can switch things up abit.
> Bench: 5x3 4mins rest
> Incline Bench: 5x6 2 mins rest
> Dips: 3*12 30-60 secs rest.


Actually it is the very close to the workout i used over 25 years ago (15 sets same lift, the percentages are different now) GZCL is nothing new and to do well in this game, very little has changed regarding training. The only difference was i was younger and did a 5 day a week split and after 10 weeks i was burnt out and needed two weeks off!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Makes everything easier to set up
> 
> Actually it is the very close to the workout i used over 25 years ago (15 sets same lift, the percentages are different now) GZCL is nothing new and to do well in this game, very little has changed regarding training. The only difference was i was younger and did a 5 day a week split and after 10 weeks i was burnt out and needed two weeks off!


You are dead right Doug, people are always trying to reinvent the wheel with weight lifting and its actually pretty simple. That layout is what weightlifters did in the 60s, its what Arnold did so why would we change it now. The extra volume is definitely an eye opener for me.

I actually cant wait to run my strength program again once I get back from the UK. It will be really interesting to see where I am after all this rehab and single leg work but I must say my shoulder and entire body feel so much better so I would imagine that this will let me push my heavy lifting harder.


----------



## ITHAQVA

December

*BENCH PRESS ( WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 107.5KGX5 - 120.5KGX3 - 131.5KGX1 *

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Barbell Floor Press: 50x8, 90x5, 102.5x3, 117.5x3,3,3,4 PM 133kg
S/S Iso-Hold Rear Delt Bench Flyes (Hold at top for 5 secs): 2.5x5,5,5,5
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 5
Med Ball "Squeeze" Push Ups: BWx10
Bent-Over Dumbell Row: 37.5x10
Dead Stop Lateral Raises - 5x10
Straight Leg Hip-ups on bench: BWx12

Enjoyed this workout a lot more this time but still really dont like Floor press but I can see the benefit of dead stop training but its dam hard. The Iso hold rear delt flyes are awesome and I will be incorparating these into my heavy bench sessions inbetween each set. Shoulder is still pain free even at heavier weights.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Rear Foot Elevated Barbell Split Squats (3 sec Pause): 60x4,4,4
Squats: 70x8, 90x6, 102.5x4, 120x4,4,4
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 3
Dumbell RDL's: 12.5x10
Weighted Calf raises: 10x10
Hollow Body Rocks: BWx30secs
Forward/Backwards Farmers Walks (1 rep= walk forward 5-10yds): 25 in each hand, 4 reps 3 sets

Good workout, nice to get to some decent weight on single leg


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Incline DB Bench Press (3 sec Pause at bottom): 37.5x6,6,6
S/S Iso-Hold Incline DB Rows (3 sec pause at top): 25x6,6,6
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 5
Standing J-Pulldowns w/rope: Blue band x 10
Cable Face Pulls w/Rope: Red Band x 10
Cable tricep Pushdowns w/rope: Blue Band x 10
Zottman Curls: 10 x 10
RKC Planks: 5 sets of 5secs with 5 sec rest (killer)

The RKC planks are stupidly hard, you get to rest 5 secs between contractions but even the rest is a killer. 5 circuits is really pushing me now, quite an increase from the 3 circuits you start on


----------



## Bod42

Barbell Floor Press: 50x8, 95x4, 110x2, 125x2,2,2,2 PM 133.5kg
S/S Iso-Hold Rear Delt Bench Flyes (Hold at top for 5 secs): 2.5x5,5,5,5
Strength Capacity Circuit
Rounds 6
Med Ball "Squeeze" Push Ups: BWx10
Bent-Over Dumbell Row: 40x8
Dead Stop Lateral Raises - 5x8
Straight Leg Hip-ups on bench: BWx12

125kg is the most Ive bench in a long time let alone floor press with a dead stop. Quite pleased to get 133.5kg with a deadstop. 

6 circuits is a killer but definitely getting fitter as the sets dont fall off as much. Must say Ive had enough of this circuit training though, ready to get back to strength training and hitting some PRs


----------



## ITHAQVA

December

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX5 - 118KGX3 - 130KGX1 - 140KGX0

BENCH PRESS 82.5KGX10X10X10X10X5

BENCH PRESS (30 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Mad Pre Christmas week over, time to lift again :thumb:

Very good workout, the 130KGX1 felt like a medium weight so i went for a 140KGX1, failed but it was soooooooooo close, i didn't execute the power and follow through, by the time i got to mid way i finished powering up the weight DOH! But still a sterling attempt 

Looking forward to some consistent training over Christmas holiday, then the new year carrying on with the 5/3/1 :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

December 2015

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 160KGX1 - 180KGX1 - 200KGX1

DEADLIFT 100KGX10X10X10X10X10

RDL (30 Second Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

Today's workout was focused on form.

Very happy with myself after this session, every rep was completed in excellent form - Core tight back kept its arch, no rounding in upper body at all! Was especially please with how easy the 200kg went up and that my shoulders and back didnt budge. This workout was also to give me a good foundation for the new year.

:thumb:


----------



## eibbor

Can anyone point me in the direction of a good chest workout? Started back the gym again this year now I have the time to do so. Went with a mate who has been going for a long time and is pretty big/strong but I felt that trying to follow his exercises was far too much for me. I'm 6ft3 around 14 stone. Read into the 5x5 and looks like the best thing but how do I take the first step towards it? And do you follow the 5x5 for everything? Thanks in advance


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> Can anyone point me in the direction of a good chest workout? Started back the gym again this year now I have the time to do so. Went with a mate who has been going for a long time and is pretty big/strong but I felt that trying to follow his exercises was far too much for me. I'm 6ft3 around 14 stone. Read into the 5x5 and looks like the best thing but how do I take the first step towards it? And do you follow the 5x5 for everything? Thanks in advance


Hi Eibbor,

I would follow the 5x5 - http://stronglifts.com/

There are guidlines as to when to move to another program, personally I would go to the original Wendlar 5/3/1 once youve met them , but i am biased because i love it! 

:thumb:


----------



## eibbor

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Eibbor,
> 
> I would follow the 5x5 - http://stronglifts.com/
> 
> There are guidlines as to when to move to another program, personally I would go to the original Wendlar 5/3/1 once youve met them , but i am biased because i love it!
> 
> :thumb:


Wow thanks never knew about that site. Got plenty if reading to do! It definitely appeals to me with squats being done 3 times a week plus deadlifts too as I have trouble with my back sometimes but it's down to a weak core/poor posture and it gets worse in the times when I'm not active. Physio has told me numerous times to get into squatting and deadlifts!


----------



## eibbor

Well no time like the present! Just back from my first 5x5 session ha! Started off at the lowest on the app and will work up. Added 20mins of light cardio at the end as it was pretty easy.

To the people who are lifting quite heavy do you implement any cardio at all? In the summer I usually play 7aside football once or twice a week!


----------



## ITHAQVA

January 2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX5 - 118KGX3 - 130KGX1 - 140KGX0 *

Nice to get back after a little break over Christmas. Ill be doing the main work sets this week only so that the DOMS isn't too bad. Added another set t oget a feel for the 140Kg, couldn't resist! 

Ill be ordering these! - https://www.strengthshop.co.uk/shop-by-brand/nike-romaleos-2-weightlifting-shoes.html

Not sure which colour, it will be either black/grey or the Volt! :thumb: I will of course de load my squat a little to get used to the shoes :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> Wow thanks never knew about that site. Got plenty if reading to do! It definitely appeals to me with squats being done 3 times a week plus deadlifts too as I have trouble with my back sometimes but it's down to a weak core/poor posture and it gets worse in the times when I'm not active. Physio has told me numerous times to get into squatting and deadlifts!


Its a good site full of enough info to get you going, no need to pay to join the inner circle.
:thumb:


----------



## eibbor

ITHAQVA said:


> Its a good site full of enough info to get you going, no need to pay to join the inner circle.
> 
> :thumb:


I did look at the £7.99 for the power pack on the app. But all I can see it doing is having a section for warm up and 2 arm exercises. Anyone know which arm workouts they list? Chins and dips? As I noticed there are no curls.


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> I did look at the £7.99 for the power pack on the app. But all I can see it doing is having a section for warm up and 2 arm exercises. Anyone know which arm workouts they list? Chins and dips? As I noticed there are no curls.


You don't need to train arms, believe me mate, follow the powerlifting route and your arms will grow :thumb:
Last time i measured my arms they were both 17.1"

A natural bodybuilder and a natural powerlifter will have the same sized muscles, the only difference is bodyfat content and a fake tan, making the bodybuilder look bigger. I've done both sports and powerlifting has been the most impressive - ive put on 3 stone since powerlitfing :thumb:

I couldn't begin to list the lies in the muscle industry, id run out of time.

Best advise i can give you.

Keep it simple only use the compound lifts.
Eat good food.
Protein is important for muscle growth and recovery, but not in the ridiculous amounts sometimes advertised on the net, im 18 stone and find 200 grams per day ample.
Get plenty of sleep.
Don't bother with supplements.
Train with good form, dont sacrafice form to add weight.
For results expect a good three years consistent training.
Use the progressive overload technique.
Heavy lifting is for us natural lifters and IMHO the best way to progress and maintain muscle mass, your body is efficient and extra muscle goes against evolution (Hence why its so hard to put muscle on)
The amount of muscle you can put on is dictated by bone structure but with consistent heavy lifting you can still expect excellent results.

As brief as i can get it


----------



## ITHAQVA

January 2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 160GX5 - 180KGX3 - 200KGX1*

All good, nice slow controlled rep on last set and managed to keep a nice arch in my back throughout rep :thumb:


----------



## eibbor

Thanks for all the advice. Found a good gym that has an excellent squat rack! Onwards and upwards...


----------



## JMorty

Anyone know any good podcasts to follow regarding strength training?
I've started listening to The Strength Coach and Ben Coomber during training but not sure they are going to give out much.

Anyone do anything like this?


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Anyone know any good podcasts to follow regarding strength training?
> I've started listening to The Strength Coach and Ben Coomber during training but not sure they are going to give out much.
> 
> Anyone do anything like this?


Not sure about podcasts but good places to go would be:

http://stronglifts.com/5x5/ All the free stuff is good enough to get you started.

http://startingstrength.com/

http://www.elitefts.com/

On youtube eliteFTS have a channel with a great series about the main lifts "So you think you can bench", "So you think you can squat" and "So you think you can deadlift"

Strength training is actually very simple, its the commercial aspects/entities that complicate it to keep you buying into their re labeled crap.

My favorite programs are 5x5 and the original 5/3/1, but basically everything works as long as you are consistent and progress, sleep well and eat real food. Simples! 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Squat session

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 125KGX5 - 145KGX3 - 165KGX1

DEAD SQUAT 125KGX1X1X1X1X1
*

Keeping it simple/medium weight as i hope to have my new Olympic shoes within two weeks :thumb:

Anyone considering DEAD Work, do your research, it does hit your joints hard.

:thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Not sure about podcasts but good places to go would be:
> 
> http://stronglifts.com/5x5/ All the free stuff is good enough to get you started.
> 
> http://startingstrength.com/
> 
> http://www.elitefts.com/
> 
> On youtube eliteFTS have a channel with a great series about the main lifts "So you think you can bench", "So you think you can squat" and "So you think you can deadlift"
> 
> Strength training is actually very simple, its the commercial aspects/entities that complicate it to keep you buying into their re labeled crap.
> 
> My favorite programs are 5x5 and the original 5/3/1, but basically everything works as long as you are consistent and progress, sleep well and eat real food. Simples!
> 
> :thumb:


Some great info there, all about great technique for compounds for sure!

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Some great info there, all about great technique for compounds for sure!
> 
> :thumb:


compounds is all you need, trust me :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Always used them but never really focused on like I am now.
Starting with a session a week of compound moves in a pyramid workout.

Fingers crossed I start making some progress looks wise.

Been Giant Setting for 6 months and I don't see the improvement like I did. Gone from 64.5 to 73.4kg in 11 months.

Switched to pyramid isolation exercised but not getting DOMs. I may just switch out all my old exercise and stay on Giants, really works for me.

Always been lean so a nightmare to put muscle mass...or any mass on for that matter. Eating like crazy train like a madman with Giants seems to work.

Got my BF% t'other day so working on cutting macros with high calories.

Sorry for the ramble, let me know what you guys think?

P.S. This is a RAD thread! :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Haven't posted for a while but have still been in the gym

Last week/this week I've already set two personal bests so the year is off to a flyer :thumb:

*Squat* 150kg for 3
*Decline Bench* 120kg for 5

Currently sitting at 76kg bodyweight

Not doing the strict 5/3/1 any more but just making sure I increase the weight no matter what the rep range. Main lifts I'm going for something like 10/10/5/5/3/3/3/3 reps and just adding every single session.


----------



## Bod42

Awesome lifts Leebo, at that BW they are very impressive lifts.

So been in the UK for a month over Xmas and New years and didnt get to the gym once. Now back on my side of the world and written all my 2016 goals etc. 

Back into things with an easy workout
Bench Press: (50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x10 PM 140kg
Incline Press: 70x8,8,6,6,6
Supersetted with
Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5

Nice easy 10 reps on bench and enjoyed doing Incline press again so will be doing this as my second exercise in my new program. 

Will squat fri and bet that is going to hurt lol.

I will be running GZCL until around August as I think this program is nearly perfect for me. The first 2 weeks I will be running an easy 5/3/1 program with low volume while I do a very quick, very strict drastic diet then continuine with a more usual diet but going to keep carbs nice and high on my next diet and see what happens. I will be running GZCL throughout my diet but keeping things nice and light but working on speed on the back off sets, this keeps the mental aspect of failure out of the workouts but if the weight is moving faster by the end of the cycle then I have obviously got stronger. Will keep my goals pretty modest in regards to strength this year but want to get to 99kg from 112kg whilst maintaining/improving my strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

These arrived last night :thumb:

https://www.gymratz.co.uk/nike-romaleos-2-weightlifting-shoes

Went for the Black/Grey in the end 

Full testing weekend, initial feel is very good, solid and planted when bodyweight squatting :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Awesome lifts Leebo, at that BW they are very impressive lifts.
> 
> So been in the UK for a month over Xmas and New years and didnt get to the gym once. Now back on my side of the world and written all my 2016 goals etc.
> 
> Back into things with an easy workout
> Bench Press: (50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x10 PM 140kg
> Incline Press: 70x8,8,6,6,6
> Supersetted with
> Pendlay Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Nice easy 10 reps on bench and enjoyed doing Incline press again so will be doing this as my second exercise in my new program.
> 
> Will squat fri and bet that is going to hurt lol.
> 
> I will be running GZCL until around August as I think this program is nearly perfect for me. The first 2 weeks I will be running an easy 5/3/1 program with low volume while I do a very quick, very strict drastic diet then continuine with a more usual diet but going to keep carbs nice and high on my next diet and see what happens. I will be running GZCL throughout my diet but keeping things nice and light but working on speed on the back off sets, this keeps the mental aspect of failure out of the workouts but if the weight is moving faster by the end of the cycle then I have obviously got stronger. Will keep my goals pretty modest in regards to strength this year but want to get to 99kg from 112kg whilst maintaining/improving my strength.


Cheers mate, I was happy with them :thumb:

What are your strength goals for the year then? My main two are 180 squat and 130 flat bench and then just general improvements on the others.


----------



## Bod42

Ya you should be, people should comapre BW to lifts ratios to make a fair comparison. So you would be Approx
Squats: Max 165kg = 2.17xBW
Me: Max 192.5kg = 1.78xBW
I need to lifting 234kg to match you so very impressive.

My goals are still the same as always. Actually Ive put bench up as hit my old goal.
Bench: 175kg
Deadlift: 250kg
Squat: 220kg
Weight: 99kg

But I really want to be 99kg and get fitter so will divide my year up in segments concentrating on different aspects.

A bit of a random goal as well but I want to get my strength balanced out as per Charles Poliquin recommendations which are.

Close Grip Bench Press: 100% 162.5kg
Incline Bench Press: 91% 148.0kg
Supinated Chin-Up: 87% 141.4kg
Press Behind Neck: 66% 107.3kg
Scott Barbell Curl: 46% 74.8kg
Lying Tricep Extension: 40% 65.0kg
Standing Reverse Curl: 35% 56.9kg

The hardest ones for me will be the Chin-ups and the Bicep curls, can easily skull crush 65kg but 55kgs on a Olympic bar seems pretty hard for barbell curls. Actually just checked and Ive done 60kg without any arm training so thinking I could add 15kg over the year.

He also has standards for arm work which would be cool to hit but I barely ever do arm work.

Close-grip bench presses 360 pounds, 100 percent
Parallel-bar dips 423 pounds, 117 percent
Scott barbell curls 166 pounds, 46 percent
Incline dumbbell curls 160 pounds, 44 percent
Lying triceps extensions 144 pounds, 40 percent
Standing EZ reverse curls 126 pounds, 35 percent

* The norm for the dips includes the athlete’s bodyweight.	
** The weight for the incline curls is the total weight of the two dumbbells.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Good to see so many still active here :thumb:


Had a trial squat session yesterday with the new shoes.

Everything felt very different :doublesho However my feet felt very planted to the squat platform and the shoes were incredibly comfortable and secure :thumb: The whole nature of the squat changed, i seemed to have far more power with a wider stance, the narrower stance caused issues at the heavier weights. Ironically when lifting bare foot the wider stance seems to be my preferred when dead squatting, far more power is available with the wider stance.

I think the stance changes are because i noticed a tendency to squat deeper in the shoes. I also started to notice that with the narrower stance I do have an inbalace, i favor my right leg, with the wide stance both legs are engaged.

Overall very pleased with the shoes and i can see the multiple benefits from them. Another is my lower body joints feel less beat up this morning, especially my lower back, there is much info regarding how the elevated heel can be safer for those who don't have great form and flexibility at the lower part of the lift, so this will enable me to lift heavy for longer, so bonus! :thumb:

As this is my new lifting year as of Feb I have decided to take a considerable de load to be starting off with, last year I messed around with light higher rep workouts and it did no good whatsoever! 

Lesson learned, stay heavy!


----------



## JMorty

That's some great info!!!

Looking for some proper shoes and this may have convinced me! Good mini review there!

I was thinking about leg bias t'other day when squatting. Weirdly, my body favours left leg although I'm right handed/footed. And as with you, wide is fine.

My imbalance was probably me rushing and not taking my shoes off.

Glad you're seeing the benefit of the new gear!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> That's some great info!!!
> 
> Looking for some proper shoes and this may have convinced me! Good mini review there!
> 
> I was thinking about leg bias t'other day when squatting. Weirdly, my body favours left leg although I'm right handed/footed. And as with you, wide is fine.
> 
> My imbalance was probably me rushing and not taking my shoes off.
> 
> Glad you're seeing the benefit of the new gear!!


Hi J :thumb:

I favor my right leg due to three hamstring tears.

The shoes are good, but if money is tight a pair of wooden heeled Olympic shoes will do the job fine, or to put it another way:

Nike Romaleos 2 £175

VX3 - White Wei-Rui Weightlifting Shoes £64 and as good :thumb:

Just to update you all, what i considered a wide stance is in fact a medium stance in the world of powerifting 

So I squat medium stance :thumb:

Pic from PTW website 

http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/stancewidth-front.jpg

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 97.5KGX5 - 110.5KGX3 - 123.5KGX2

DEAD BENCH 1 MINUTE REST BETWEEN SETS 78KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS (sub 10 Second Rest between Sets) 40KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

As you can see I've taken a considerable de load to start the new years lifting, after F*****G around with workouts that don't suite me last year i thought it wise to start light as I will be adding weight each week.

I'll also aim to complete 2 reps on the last work set as per Wendlers recommendations 1+ reps. And as I'm increasing the weight each week only very positive reps will be counted, if it takes an ugly rep to complete a set ill discount it.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

First Squat Workout Back, It was hell lol.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 92.5x3) WO 110x3, 125x3, 140x3 PM 154kg
Squats: 120x5,5,5,5,5

This is a light workout for me but then its the first time Ive squatted in about 6 weeks so muscles started to fail after about the 2nd set of 5 so had to just grind them out. Strangly they still moved nice and fast, it was just really hard work. But what do Iexpect first squats in 6 weeks + 1700 calories per day + 29 degree heat is always going to be hard.


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi J :thumb:
> 
> I favor my right leg due to three hamstring tears.
> 
> The shoes are good, but if money is tight a pair of wooden heeled Olympic shoes will do the job fine, or to put it another way:
> 
> Nike Romaleos 2 £175
> 
> VX3 - White Wei-Rui Weightlifting Shoes £64 and as good :thumb:
> 
> Just to update you all, what i considered a wide stance is in fact a medium stance in the world of powerifting
> 
> So I squat medium stance :thumb:
> 
> Pic from PTW website
> 
> http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/stancewidth-front.jpg
> 
> :thumb:


Thanks for that buddy!

As for stance, I'm a mid stance comfortably.

I'll pop my training up here too, not quite as impressive as you guys. Only been taking this seriously for about 6 months.

I've been giant setting for that time and it's worked so well but I'm swapping out to a pyramid scheme just to shock the body a bit.

Short workout today.

Legs and Arms

Squat

30kg x 15
40 x 10
50 x 6
60 x 3
50 x 6
40 x 10
40 x 12

Preacher Curl

7.5kg x 15
10 x 10
12.5 x 6
15 x 3
12.5 x 6
10 x 10
7.5 x 12

Skull Crusher

Bar only x 15
2.5kg x 10
5 x 6
7.5 x 3
5 x 6
2.5 x 10
Bar only x 15

Not that heavy yet but making sure the technique is as perfect as I can do.

Currently at 73.4kg and 14.6% BF.

Hopefully will start winding up the wick soon!

All your posts guys are spurring me on so thanks!!!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Thanks for that buddy!
> 
> As for stance, I'm a mid stance comfortably.
> 
> I'll pop my training up here too, not quite as impressive as you guys. Only been taking this seriously for about 6 months.
> 
> I've been giant setting for that time and it's worked so well but I'm swapping out to a pyramid scheme just to shock the body a bit.
> 
> Short workout today.
> 
> Legs and Arms
> 
> Squat
> 
> 30kg x 15
> 40 x 10
> 50 x 6
> 60 x 3
> 50 x 6
> 40 x 10
> 40 x 12
> 
> Preacher Curl
> 
> 7.5kg x 15
> 10 x 10
> 12.5 x 6
> 15 x 3
> 12.5 x 6
> 10 x 10
> 7.5 x 12
> 
> Skull Crusher
> 
> Bar only x 15
> 2.5kg x 10
> 5 x 6
> 7.5 x 3
> 5 x 6
> 2.5 x 10
> Bar only x 15
> 
> Not that heavy yet but making sure the technique is as perfect as I can do.
> 
> Currently at 73.4kg and 14.6% BF.
> 
> Hopefully will start winding up the wick soon!
> 
> All your posts guys are spurring me on so thanks!!!


Hi J,

I would seriously consider moving away from this type of workout. Look how much you are training your legs to your arms! :doublesho

Do deadlifts and squats youll grow far quicker and the Bench press will pack muscle on your arms :thumb:

At your level I would strongly advise the 5x5, its a great way to build strenght and muscle mass. Keep your expectations realistic, you could probably get to around 18 stone (Give or take) at your bodyfat naturally within 3-4 years consistent training :thumb:

Lift on!!!!  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Not that heavy yet but making sure the technique is as perfect as I can do.


We all started with an empty bar :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

JMorty no ego's in here, everyone started with an empty bar once upon a time.

But I mirror Doug's thoughts that you should consider the 5x5 program, it will grow your arms far more than an arm program. When I train people, direct arm work doesnt get put in their programs unless they really really want it and they have hit certain lift goals, e.g. 1.5xBW squat, 1.25xBW Bench and 2xBW Deadlift. Up until then you dont need arm work as the compound exercises will build them plenty.

Dont think Doug or I have done a direct arm exercise in years and we both have over 17" arms.

Bench: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 80x5, 92.5x5, 105x12 PM 147kg
Incline Bench 350 method: 60x18, 8, 10 Total 36
Supersetted
Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6

Good workout, was only aiming for 11 reps and hit 12 fairly easily, definitely had 1 more in the tank if not 2. I'm actually very pleased with this as means my strength has barely fallen in the month I had off. Also means I'm constantly training close to a predicted max of 150kg.


----------



## JMorty

You lot have made me reconsider 5x5's now...may have to ditch my current and start again! :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

I'm going to both agree and disagree a bit with Doug and James 

As they've mentioned, that last workout is massively disproportionate in the amount of work your legs are doing compared to your arms. It's supposed to be primarily a leg/lower body workout, yet you have twice as much on your arms! If you're sticking with a "Leg Day" style workout then personally I would add in at least another leg exercise if not two. No problem with the pyramid structure of the workout either (I use that myself for some exercises) but you definitely need to not do a three way proportionate split between legs/tricep/bicep.
The bit I'll slightly disagree on is that if you want to add in some arm work too then by all means do it, providing it doesn't hamper your progress on the main lifts. A massive part of getting results is motivation and commitment. Finding a workout that you like, and actually want to do each time is a huge factor in seeing results. I also think that visible results are a massive incentive in keeping a lot of people going (not all, but a lot..), even if they're just temporary. So many people look forward to chest day because of the pump it gives them after and are therefore less likely to miss it, but there are a lot fewer people who feel the same about legs! This is why I think if you want to stick in a crazy bicep/tricep superset at the end of a heavy leg session just to give you an albeit temporary pump in your t-shirt muscles, then by all means go for it. Yes it might not be the most effective way to do it but if you leave the gym feeling bigger (regardless as to whether you actually are) in addition to stronger and looking forward to the next session then that is never a bad thing in my opinion. 
For a lot of people, it's very hard to get motivation for a leg day in particular. Personally I absolutely love it (I'm doing it today) but just looking round my gym I literally see maybe two other people doing squats/legs on a regular basis whereas there are plenty who do entire 1 hour bicep sessions… 
Like I said, nothing wrong with working out arms (I personally do and like to think I have pretty big arms too :thumb: ) but you just need to make sure at this stage that your main focus are the "main" lifts and anything else is done to aid these (even if it's just in a motivational way as I've mentioned)

With regards to workouts, biggest point is just to stick with it and know that results are going to take time. Again, in my experience progressive overload is the main thing, no matter what the rep range. I test and chart myself on both low and high rep records, so for example I'll do as many squats as I can at 100kg, and then try and improve on that next month in addition to also improving what I can do in the 1-3 rep range. Also if I'm doing 4 sets of 8, then I'll make sure that at least one of those sets of 8 was a heavier weight than the last time I did it etc etc.
5x5 and 5/3/1 are excellent workouts but to me have things that I like to change. Personally, I find the original 5x5 doesn't have anywhere near enough volume (at least for me) Even the 5/3/1 I changed up quite a bit and like to throw in more sets of the lower reps (so I do something like 10/10/5/5/3/3/3/ etc), simply because I've found that I can and still recover suitably. I also take way less rest between sets than is recommended, as like to keep the intensity high. A lot of this is pure trial and error - what works for some doesn't work for others and it's a learning curve knowing what your body can cope with and what you actually like to do.

Doug and James are totally correct in saying stick with the compounds as the basis of whatever programme you go for as these are proven to give better overall gains but personally I don't see anything wrong with adding in some isolation work in moderation at the end (or even in between sets) 
Agreeing with them again, I'd suggest going for the 5x5 as a base template and then see if you want to add anything in with regards to dedicated isolation work. Providing it doesn't have any impact to your ability to hit the required 5x5 targets then I'd say it's fine. 
Again, this is purely based on what I've found works for me and what I can comfortably recover from.

Back to business, yesterday's workout featured another PB (sort of..) - 
*Decline Press 140kg for 1* 
Very, very happy with that, and also nice to know the formula for 1rm is pretty accurate given that my 120kg for 5 the other week gave a predicted 140kg!


----------



## JMorty

Ha! Started a real discussion here! 

That was a really random workout tbf.

I normally bookend the week with a compound pyramid day of:
Squats
Deadlifts
Military Press
Chest Press
Wide Pull Ups

In between those I'll do isolation type days.
Mainly because I find it very interesting ie proper form and the torture I feel afterwards.

I've also been making massive progress with this being a total Ectomorph with a crazy thyroid. Seems to really work.

I am going try 5x5 again.

I just wondered...I know it's great for size and strength but has anyone noticed and issue with muscle tone doing 5x5?

@Leebo - ACE PB there! Good job! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo none of what youve said is wrong but its just personal opinion on some things.

I get exactly where your coming from, 90% of people in the gym are not professionals or up and coming sports stars so its about keeping it fun. I say to people all the time dont do something if its not fun in the gym as its not your job or anything. But with arms, from experience Arm training early on is actually counter productive. You find people pull with their biceps where doing chin ups, rows and any back work for that matter. How many people do you see doing chin ups who cant retract their scapular or pull their shoulders down into the correct position as they are pulling with their biceps. Its not so bad on the triceps because people dont work them as hard as biceps but their still a problem on pressing exercises. I also find beginners who exclude arm work end up with bigger arms in the long run as well as they put more focus into the big lifts. There are obviously exceptions but on average you have to add 1 stone of body weight for every inch you add to your arms so lets use all the energy and recovery you have to add muscle to the entire frame of your body and what is the best way to add muscle, compound exercises.

Also you only have so much recovery which I look at like a bucket with a very slow running tap feeding into it. Everytime you train the water is used and during times of non training, it slowly fills back up. Well 5x5 is a very demanding program so if you add arms a few times put week then your just using up more and more of your recovery until a level where you have to take a deload and recovery fully.

Its also mentally positive to have a goal in mind with a reward. Once you start squatting 1.5BW then you have put time in under the bar and can make some decisions for yourself so once you hit that goal then you get the reward of arm training if you really have to.

Very surprised to read that you feel 5x5 doesnt have enough volume. The only complaint Ive ever had is that it has to much volume. Thats why Rippletoe's program only has 3x5 of everything instead of 5x5. When designing a program the main 3 components are intensity, frequency and volume. Basically a good program will have 2 of the 3 high but the 3rd has to be on the low side otherwise you burn out. Think High volume, high frequency, low intensity or low volume, high intensity, high frequency, so on and so on. 5x5 is medium volume, high frequency, high intensity so I think its a great program. At the end most people Ive trained and myself havent even recovered before the next full body session and thats actually why the volume changes down to 3x5 to accomadate this.

I do agree that 5/3/1 doesnt have enough volume unless your doing BBB which makes it slightly better.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
Deadlifts: 130x5,5,5

Did this thurs night and legs were still killing from squats monday. I dont mean the usual DOMs, I mean like I had torn them or something so just wanted to get in hit some deadlifts and get out. First squats and deadlifts in 2 months so extremely sore, probably not helped by the fact that Im only on 1,800 calories per day so recovery will be compromised.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 150GX5 - 170KGX3 - 190KGX2

DEADLIFT 150KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

RDL (30 Second Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10X10X10X10
*

As you can see another considerable de load, but IMHO a more sensible approach for me to get back into heavier lifting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 85x5, 102.5x3) WO 120x3, 135x3, 152.5x3 PM 167.5kg
> Deadlifts: 130x5,5,5
> 
> Did this thurs night and legs were still killing from squats monday. I dont mean the usual DOMs, I mean like I had torn them or something so just wanted to get in hit some deadlifts and get out. First squats and deadlifts in 2 months so extremely sore, probably not helped by the fact that Im only on 1,800 calories per day so recovery will be compromised.


Go easy James if you think there is any possibility of an injury or slight tear, I can tell you from my own experience an injury is very, very difficult to psychologically recover from.


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Go easy James if you think there is any possibility of an injury or slight tear, I can tell you from my own experience an injury is very, very difficult to psychologically recover from.


^This.

Advice from experience from what you mentioned earlier :-s

Here was my sesh from last night:


















Pyramid sets. Pretty good but not massive DOMS today.


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> ^This.
> 
> Advice from experience from what you mentioned earlier :-s
> 
> Here was my sesh from last night:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pyramid sets. Pretty good but not massive DOMS today.


What are your physical goals J ?


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> What are your physical goals J ?


In terms of numbers, I'm not massively sure.

For my DL, BP & Squat I wanted to get my body weight.

My overall aim is a 70:30 split between aesthetics and strength.

Aesthetics because I've always been the skinny one and strength for my job.

Is that what you meant?


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> In terms of numbers, I'm not massively sure.
> 
> For my DL, BP & Squat I wanted to get my body weight.
> 
> My overall aim is a 70:30 split between aesthetics and strength.
> 
> Aesthetics because I've always been the skinny one and strength for my job.
> 
> Is that what you meant?


Well if your skinny your training incorrectly James.

I strongly recommend you drop the pyramid and dumbell work.

Most of what you are told regarding the iron sport is lies and tailored for cheats, sorry enhanced lifters. Light pump work is for the roid boys.

You are fighting thousands of years of evolution, your body will fight you against every pound of muscle. Lift with heavy compound exercises consistently to change your bodies natural state, put on some fat to speed up the process.
Its nothing to do with training your muscles but training your body as a whole so it reacts/adapts by building muscle, strong bones, tendons and joints. Your hormone levels will also change. Dont believe all this confusing muscle bull****, the muscles are just tissue to be utilized by the brain and central nervous system.

Also have realistic goals, most natural lifters dont look like they lift, unless they go sub 15% body fat.

Remember the sports industry has one motivation, to make money and they have done a great job of reinventing the wheel 

For me personally the 5x5 would be my recommendation for your first year :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Wow, what a great reply!

I'll have to get on it then!

The thought is quite exciting to be fair, those numbers going up and up.

I'll start tomorrow!

Thanks for your support and advice!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Wow, what a great reply!
> 
> I'll have to get on it then!
> 
> The thought is quite exciting to be fair, those numbers going up and up.
> 
> I'll start tomorrow!
> 
> Thanks for your support and advice!


You'll be glad you did, there is no way you could build on the workout you've been using, its more like a cardio session. Less is more in terms of changing your physique.

The numbers will go up at the begging, but as you become more and more accustomed to using heavy weights and become stronger the slower the progress - Diminishing returns.

As you don't want to purely powerlift I would suggest the following 1 rep goals as your guide:

Bench Press 120Kg
Squat 150Kg
Deadlift 150Kg or 190Kg

As for protein intake, i believe a lot of the info online is incorrect and again obviously coming from the roid boys (CHEATS!) perspective (Steroid users can utilize protein more effectively) an 18 stone natural lifter CAN do well on 200grams of protein a day, more protein doesn't mean more muscle for us natural guys, you see this is the real problem, natural size and strength requires very little extra nutrition. Because natural lifters cant actually get that big, the glossy magazines and online sites wire your head up incorrectly blowing your expectation out of all perspective. The amount of muscle you can sustain over a long period of time is directly effected by your body fat % and lifting medium/heavy with consistency. Going below 15% for long periods will (Unless your a naturally lean person) effect hormone levels (Especially females). There are exceptions but i'm talking generally here.

Bottom line if you want to get as big and strong as possible naturally, stay around 15% bodyfat and as you get older you'll be able to keep hold of all your hard earned muscle mass. So yes you as a leaner guy will struggle to get big because that's your genetic make up. Yes you can change your body, but again when you see huge guys who were skinny spout about fighting genetics they are very probably CHEATING!

Start the 5X5 with an empty bar as per recommendations, as the weights increase you'll have a tendency to drop your form :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) -112.5KGX5 - 127.5KGX3 - 142.5KGX3

DEAD SQUAT 1 MINUTE REST BETWEEN SETS 120KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUT 200KGX1X1X1X1X1*

As you can see another huge deload to get back into my squatting :thumb:

Getting used to the new shoes, squats still feel mechanically different, but much better than last week 

The final work set of 142.5Kg was easy enough, however i will stick to my plan of starting light and build up slowly, i want to lift weights not my ego 

Dead Squats were a bit light but good enough to provide some resistance.

One thing i did notice, well actually it was a WTF :doublesho moment, was how much lighter the squat walkouts felt, this must be down to the elevated heel in the shoe, involving more quad/calf strength and improving stability. This will be a big plus when in the 180Kg/190Kg range and above :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Very surprised to read that you feel 5x5 doesnt have enough volume. The only complaint Ive ever had is that it has to much volume. Thats why Rippletoe's program only has 3x5 of everything instead of 5x5. When designing a program the main 3 components are intensity, frequency and volume. Basically a good program will have 2 of the 3 high but the 3rd has to be on the low side otherwise you burn out. Think High volume, high frequency, low intensity or low volume, high intensity, high frequency, so on and so on. 5x5 is medium volume, high frequency, high intensity so I think its a great program. At the end most people Ive trained and myself havent even recovered before the next full body session and thats actually why the volume changes down to 3x5 to accomadate this.
> 
> I do agree that 5/3/1 doesnt have enough volume unless your doing BBB which makes it slightly better.


Yep mate, I just found it wasn't really the way that I liked to workout and the way that I seemed to get the best results. I'm talking more about volume on the heavier sets by the way, rather than the assistance. 
I find I can lift more when I build up to the weight with more sets and on smaller increments. 
I really noticed it on the 5/3/1 - the jumps of 10% each time (65/75/85, 70/80/90 and 75/85/95) just weren't the most efficient way for me. 
I changed this to still being in the similar percentage overall but something like 70%, 75, 77.5, 80, 82.5, 85, 90 and finally 92.5 (obviously that excludes a couple of warm up sets). Reps are between 5 and 2.
It depends how I feel though as changed the final set to 95% today on bench for example. The 90% went up easy so figured I'd try 95 rather than 92.5 and still made 2 reps at 115Kg giving me a new PB. I also update my working 1rm figure as I hit new ones (similar to GZL I believe??), rather than going with the standard 5kg lower/2.5kg upper which I found to be a bit too rigid.
As we've all said before, volume is good and I just find this way works best for me both in terms of hitting my lifts and recovery too :thumb:

Assistance work I do a variety but (much to yours and Dougs dismay ) I will happily throw in supersets/drop sets/pyramids using not only dumbbells sometimes but (ssshhh!) machines too 
I'm hitting my strength goals, recovering well, not getting injured, keeping my BF low (and more importantly consistent) while steadily putting on muscle and looking (in my opinion) better so don't see any reason to change anything up at the moment!

Don't get me wrong, I'm still in total agreement with you and Doug that JMorty should go with a 5x5 rather than the current workout and stick with it for a while though :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Leebo310 said:


> Don't get me wrong, I'm still in total agreement with you and Doug that JMorty should go with a 5x5 rather than the current workout and stick with it for a while though :thumb:


:thumb:

I was thinking of starting at 30KG ie 5 on each side.

I assume people may advise me against that....

Or do I go off 50% my 5RM?


----------



## Leebo310

JMorty said:


> :thumb:
> 
> I was thinking of starting at 30KG ie 5 on each side.
> 
> I assume people may advise me against that....
> 
> Or do I go off 50% my 5RM?


If you know what your maxes are then I'd just go with 50% or whatever the recommendation is of those are mate.
I'd seriously doubt your genuine maxes are the same for all exercises anyway! Deadlift and squat would/should be higher than bench and definitely higher than shoulder press.
You're not completely new to working out so I'm guessing you know roughly what you can lift comfortably with proper form on the required lifts. 
Don't worry about starting too light anyway buddy you'll soon start moving up in weight pretty quickly so it's actually better that way than starting too heavy and struggling a few weeks in.


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Assistance work I do a variety but (much to yours and Dougs dismay ) I will happily throw in supersets/drop sets/pyramids using not only dumbbells sometimes but (ssshhh!) machines too
> I'm hitting my strength goals, recovering well, not getting injured, keeping my BF low (and more importantly consistent) while steadily putting on muscle and looking (in my opinion) better so don't see any reason to change anything up at the moment!


When people have experience under their belt then they can do what ever they want basically. Beginners do well to stick to a very rigid program but the more experienced you get, the more you can throw what ever you fancy into the mix as I find you actually progress better by doing exactly what youve done in your workout, you felt good so you went high than was planned and like the other day I felt crap so i knocked some sets off. Once youve done your heavy lifting then you can do what you want but is what I hate seeing is say 1 set of legs, 30 sets of arms, 40 sets of chest 2 sets of back sort of thing. If you get a balanced heavy workout in at the start then by all means throw some super sets in at the end but have to get that balanced heavy work in first. I still program this for Body Builders as well.

JMorty: As Leebo said dont worry about starting light as the loading is so aggressive on this program, 7.5kg per week or over 30kg per month. Some of us are adding 2.5 per month if were lucky. Always better to start to light than to heavy on a program like this as you basically want a run up into your heavy weights.

Would usually Squat on Mondays but starting with a new Golf Coach tonight so dont want to be really sore so benched instead.

Bench: (WU 50x5, 62.5x5, 72.5x3) WO 85x5, 97.5x5, 110x11 PM 150.5kg
Incline Bench 350 method: 60x20, 10, 7 Total 37
Supersetted
Pendlay Rows: 70x8,10,10

Good workout. Nice and fast at the moment with the super setted 2nd exercise. Improved on last week and still had a rep in the tank so I'm happy.


----------



## JMorty

Cheers guys!

Managed the full sets at 50/40/50 for Squat/Bench/Row.

Looking forward to next time now, see how I get on with the Squats!


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> When people have experience under their belt then they can do what ever they want basically. Beginners do well to stick to a very rigid program but the more experienced you get, the more you can throw what ever you fancy into the mix as I find you actually progress better by doing exactly what youve done in your workout, you felt good so you went high than was planned and like the other day I felt crap so i knocked some sets off. Once youve done your heavy lifting then you can do what you want but is what I hate seeing is say 1 set of legs, 30 sets of arms, 40 sets of chest 2 sets of back sort of thing. If you get a balanced heavy workout in at the start then by all means throw some super sets in at the end but have to get that balanced heavy work in first. I still program this for Body Builders as well.


Exactly mate, everything I do is heavy compound lifting first progressing up over multiple sets and then all the assistance after.

Like you said, I see so many people doing such a disproportionate split favouring arms/chest/shoulders and ignoring legs and also worryingly I rarely see people doing back either.

Going back to your post a few days ago, on the Charles Poliquin recommendations. 
Am I understanding it that you take your closed grip press 1 rep max and then calculate all the others from a percentage of that?

Close Grip Bench Press: 100% 
Incline Bench Press: 91% 
Supinated Chin-Up: 87% 
Press Behind Neck: 66% 
Scott Barbell Curl: 46%
Lying Tricep Extension: 40% 
Standing Reverse Curl: 35%

Nice number on the closed grip by the way, 162.5Kg is impressive :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

JMorty said:


> Cheers guys!
> 
> Managed the full sets at 50/40/50 for Squat/Bench/Row.
> 
> Looking forward to next time now, see how I get on with the Squats!


Nice work mate, especially the row - that's a decent weight already. I'm assuming you're using a barbell for Bench now rather than DB?


----------



## JMorty

Thanks man!

Yeah, brand new olympic bar luck would have it. Was lovely!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Was going to bench tonight, but came home to a hard drive failure (Blasted partition failed) so i'm spending the night recovering files :wall: 

Bench night = Thursday :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Was going to bench tonight, but came home to a hard drive failure (Blasted partition failed) so i'm spending the night recovering files :wall:
> 
> Bench night = Thursday :thumb:


D'Oh!

Was totally gunna go but two 12 hours days and I'm wiped out


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Exactly mate, everything I do is heavy compound lifting first progressing up over multiple sets and then all the assistance after.
> 
> Like you said, I see so many people doing such a disproportionate split favouring arms/chest/shoulders and ignoring legs and also worryingly I rarely see people doing back either.
> 
> Going back to your post a few days ago, on the Charles Poliquin recommendations.
> Am I understanding it that you take your closed grip press 1 rep max and then calculate all the others from a percentage of that?
> 
> Close Grip Bench Press: 100%
> Incline Bench Press: 91%
> Supinated Chin-Up: 87%
> Press Behind Neck: 66%
> Scott Barbell Curl: 46%
> Lying Tricep Extension: 40%
> Standing Reverse Curl: 35%
> 
> Nice number on the closed grip by the way, 162.5Kg is impressive :thumb:


Yep normal people should have a 1:1 ratio of back to chest but with sports guys I always push it to 3:1 so 3 sets of back to every 1 set of chest but this always works in with the train chest for strength, back like a bodybuilder for sports poeple.

162.5kg will hopefully be impressive, its a goal so need to get there first and its probably about 20kg away at the moment. And yep your dead right, take your CGBP 1RM and times by the % for each exercise.


----------



## JMorty

If you're at 140 then that's pretty awesome already!! :thumb:

Session 2

Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 40kg x5)

52.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

Military Press (WU 20kg x5 22.5kg x 5)

25kg x5x5x5x5x5

Deadlift (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5)

42.5kg x5

May have picked up a groin strain at work which is naff.

Boo.


----------



## Bod42

JMorty said:


> If you're at 140 then that's pretty awesome already!! :thumb:
> 
> Session 2
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 40kg x5)
> 
> 52.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Military Press (WU 20kg x5 22.5kg x 5)
> 
> 25kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5)
> 
> 42.5kg x5
> 
> May have picked up a groin strain at work which is naff.
> 
> Boo.


Nice Session Morty. This is where 5x5 shines as next week your be squatting 60kg then 75 2 weeks after which is a decent weight.

Just checked and I'm actually at 145kg for Close Grip. I'm a tricep bencher anyway so doesnt take much away benching close grip for me.

Squats: (WU 70x5, 80x5, 95x3) WO 112.5x3, 127.5x3, 145x3 PM 160kg
Squats: 120x5,5,5,5,5

This workout was miles easier than last week and it should be really as I'm lifting way below my max of 192.5kg. The 120kg for 5x5 still works you hard enough to put some strength on though. Back to GZCL and a proper diet next week anyway so should start putting some better numbers up.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 99.5KGX5 - 112.5KGX3 - 126KGX1

DEAD BENCH 80KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS 100KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Nice medium feel workout :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Starting to feel a bit tasty now...

Session 3

Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 42.5kg x5)

55kg x5x5x5x5x5

Bench Press (WU 20kg x5 30kg x 5 35kg x 5)

42.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

Row (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x 5)

52.5 x5x5x5x5x5

Bring on the DOMS!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Starting to feel a bit tasty now...
> 
> Session 3
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 42.5kg x5)
> 
> 55kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Bench Press (WU 20kg x5 30kg x 5 35kg x 5)
> 
> 42.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Row (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x 5)
> 
> 52.5 x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Bring on the DOMS!


Dont obsess about DOMS James, low rep training in my experience doesn't bring it on so much and its doesn't mean your not growing. Remember you are a natural lifter and medium/heavy progressive weight training is all you need to build yourself to your maximum physical potential. 
As master Yoda said "you must unlearn what you have learnt"  "Your supplements, you will not need them"  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 153.5KGX5 - 174KGX3 - 194.5KGX2

DEADLIFT 160KGX1X1X1X1X1X1

RDL (60 Second Rest between Sets) 110KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Very happy with this workout, strength felt very good throughout.

Secondary sets: I've been trying to find a good weight to build from that's taxing enough but allowing heavy singles with strict form (I'm trying to build up strenght so that my form is good on the heavy stuff) :thumb:

Third group of sets (RDL) wanted to move over to five rep sets that were heavy enough so i could feel the hamstrings being worked, again maintaining strict form (Back arched and core tight) :thumb:

One thing I have been trialing is a foam roller. It's made a massive difference! My Hamstrings have always felt inflexible (Even before my injuries). Since foam rolling instead of feeling my hamstrings being tight they just feel part of my leg and not at all pronounced as before.They feel supple  :thumb:


----------



## eibbor

Started to really enjoy the stronglifts! But have picked up a radial nerve injury on my right arm, taking a week off to see how it goes


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> Started to really enjoy the stronglifts! But have picked up a radial nerve injury on my right arm, taking a week off to see how it goes


Get googling and research rehab for this, i've seen a fair bit of info regarding this problem :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 115.5KGX5 - 131.5KGX3 - 147KGX3

DEAD SQUAT 120KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUT 205KGX1X1X1X1X1*

Really glad I decided to de load :thumb:

The new Oly shoes are now feeling natural and i'm not conscience of them at all. The stability they provide is excellent. They also make getting into position easier.

I could have done more reps on the 147KG but felt three was more than adequate for progression :thumb:

All lifts feeling good today, even the 205KG walkouts, I'm going to build up to 220Kg as recommended (10% more than my max) :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2
> 
> *FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 115.5KGX5 - 131.5KGX3 - 147KGX3
> 
> DEAD SQUAT 120KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1
> 
> SQUAT WALKOUT 205KGX1X1X1X1X1*
> 
> Really glad I decided to de load :thumb:
> 
> The new Oly shoes are now feeling natural and i'm not conscience of them at all. The stability they provide is excellent. They also make getting into position easier.
> 
> I could have done more reps on the 147KG but felt three was more than adequate for progression :thumb:
> 
> All lifts feeling good today, even the 205KG walkouts, I'm going to build up to 220Kg as recommended (10% more than my max) :thumb:


That's rad, great session there!

Well done that man, those shoes sound like a good investment!


----------



## JMorty

Session 4

Squat (WU 20kg x10 30kg x10 45kg x5)

57.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

OH Press (WU 20kg x5 22.5kg x 5 22.5kg x 5)

27.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)

45kg x5

Squats are feeling great now, really planted and controlled.

Deadlifts and OH could be heavier but I'll get there for sure, especially for the OH. That feels like it's going to get heavy quick!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> That's rad, great session there!
> 
> Well done that man, those shoes sound like a good investment!


Thanks James, its nice to be lifting properly again.

They are good, but I think they'll come into their own when I get back to squatting 180-190 and 200kg :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Session 4
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x10 30kg x10 45kg x5)
> 
> 57.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> OH Press (WU 20kg x5 22.5kg x 5 22.5kg x 5)
> 
> 27.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)
> 
> 45kg x5
> 
> Squats are feeling great now, really planted and controlled.
> 
> Deadlifts and OH could be heavier but I'll get there for sure, especially for the OH. That feels like it's going to get heavy quick!


Nice one James, dont worry about progress too much, youll find your true strength levels soon enough.

The ohp is always slow due to the smaller muscles used in the lift.:thumb:

Be patient and enjoy the journey :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice one James, dont worry about progress too much, youll find your true strength levels soon enough.
> 
> The ohp is always slow due to the smaller muscles used in the lift.:thumb:
> 
> Be patient and enjoy the journey :thumb:


Cheers mate!

Starting to enjoy it now, lovin the squat progression. Never really made any headway until now, no one really likes leg day eh?

Not anymore! :thumb:


----------



## eibbor

JMorty said:


> Session 4
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x10 30kg x10 45kg x5)
> 
> 57.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> OH Press (WU 20kg x5 22.5kg x 5 22.5kg x 5)
> 
> 27.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)
> 
> 45kg x5
> 
> Squats are feeling great now, really planted and controlled.
> 
> Deadlifts and OH could be heavier but I'll get there for sure, especially for the OH. That feels like it's going to get heavy quick!


I jumped up 5kg on OHP at around the same level as you because to be honest I felt a bit weird with hardly anything on the bar. MISTAKE! managed 5x5 but it was a struggle. 
Sticking to the rules from now on lol


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 2
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 153.5KGX5 - 174KGX3 - 194.5KGX2
> 
> DEADLIFT 160KGX1X1X1X1X1X1
> 
> RDL (60 Second Rest between Sets) 110KGX5X5X5X5X5
> *
> 
> Very happy with this workout, strength felt very good throughout.
> 
> Secondary sets: I've been trying to find a good weight to build from that's taxing enough but allowing heavy singles with strict form (I'm trying to build up strenght so that my form is good on the heavy stuff) :thumb:
> 
> Third group of sets (RDL) wanted to move over to five rep sets that were heavy enough so i could feel the hamstrings being worked, again maintaining strict form (Back arched and core tight) :thumb:
> 
> *One thing I have been trialing is a foam roller. It's made a massive difference! My Hamstrings have always felt inflexible (Even before my injuries). Since foam rolling instead of feeling my hamstrings being tight they just feel part of my leg and not at all pronounced as before.They feel supple  :thumb:*


Ive been using a foam roller lately and I put that down to my shoulder feeling the best its felt in a long time. Its weird how everything is connected, found a knot in my Lat which when pressed with the foam roller would resonate pain right through my back and all through my shoulder. Been concentrating on this point before every workout and shoulder feels good.



JMorty said:


> Cheers mate!
> 
> Starting to enjoy it now, lovin the squat progression. Never really made any headway until now, no one really likes leg day eh?
> 
> Not anymore! :thumb:


Learn to love the squat days, they will make your entire body stronger all over. Theres a reason their the King of exercises. I echo everyone else in saying that OHP definitely progresses the slowest so dont worry to much about how quickly it gets hard.

Deadlifts: (WU 70x5, 90x5, 110x3) WO 125x3, 142.5x3, 160x3 PM 176kg
Deadlifts: 130x5,5,5,5,5

Top set was good and the back off sets were crazy fast, was banging out 5 reps in seconds. I like this putting full force into the bar with a weight you know you can handle easily, seems to really work.

Thats enough of a reintroduction back into weights, now to start some proper lifting again. Got an extrememly packed week these days, might have to start sprinting in the mornings as have gym, sprinting, running and all my golf days as well so getting short of time.


----------



## JMorty

Session 5

Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x5)

60kg x5x5x5x5x5

Bench Press (WU 20kg x5 30kg x 5 35kg x 5)

45kg x5x5x5x5x5

Row (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x 5)

55 x5x5x5x5x5

Good sesh, still had loads in the bank so my starting point and progression is holding true.

Feel so planted with no shoes, I may not go for any now. I've heard great things about vibrams but I don't think I'm cool enough fir those lol


----------



## JMorty

eibbor said:


> I jumped up 5kg on OHP at around the same level as you because to be honest I felt a bit weird with hardly anything on the bar. MISTAKE! managed 5x5 but it was a struggle.
> Sticking to the rules from now on lol


Good choice mate, I can only imagine how much you get punished later down the line lol


----------



## Bod42

JMorty said:


> Session 5
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x5)
> 
> 60kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Bench Press (WU 20kg x5 30kg x 5 35kg x 5)
> 
> 45kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Row (WU 20kg x5 30kg x5 45kg x 5)
> 
> 55 x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Good sesh, still had loads in the bank so my starting point and progression is holding true.
> 
> Feel so planted with no shoes, I may not go for any now. I've heard great things about vibrams but I don't think I'm cool enough fir those lol


I encourage everyone to lift with no shoes on. It helps nearly every exercise and improves ankle stabilization. Vibrams are good if your gym gets annoyed with you lifting bare foot like mine used to.

Back to a more volume approach to my workouts now.
Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 135x5,5,5
Squats: 105x8,8,8,8
Forwards/Backwards Farmers Walk:50kg x 4 reps x 3 sets

Workout was quite light and everything moved nice and fast. I have based this workout off hitting a PR in 2 months which should basically give me a guarantee of hitting a record instead of trying to push one from day 1. Also nice long term goal of hitting 200kg squat on 16th May if everything goes to plan.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 101.5KGX5 - 114.5KGX3 - 128.5KGX1

DEAD BENCH 1 MINUTE REST BETWEEN SETS 82.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS (2 minute Rest between Sets) 102.5KGX5X5X5X5X3
*

An excellent workout all weights felt dam good :thumb: Have no idea why i only did one rep of 128.5Kg especially when i had decided to try for two every time :wall::wall: 

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I encourage everyone to lift with no shoes on. It helps nearly every exercise and improves ankle stabilization.


Although I've been an advocate of bare foot training for the last four years, I do feel the difference in squatting in Olympic shoes and its all positive. I will however have to reserve judgement to how much better they are, if at all until I start squatting 190Kg plus.

The biggest positive for me is the elevated heel makes the squat feel safer and has greatly reduced the feeling of fear as I go parallel and below. For me personally fear has been the biggest issue with the squat and according to my research is the biggest issue for many lifters :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Great job man!

There's a pretty mean squatter in my gym who wears crossfit shoes so may invest when I'm going over 100kg.

Jumped in today as I was off and it's my bday tomorrow. Probably head in for some cardio and other bits.

Session 6

Squat (WU 20kg x10 30kg x10 40kg x5 50kg x5)

62.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

OH Press (WU 20kg x10 22.5kg x 5 25kg x 5)

30kg x5x5x5x5x5

Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)

50kg x5


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Although I've been an advocate of bare foot training for the last four years, I do feel the difference in squatting in Olympic shoes and its all positive. I will however have to reserve judgement to how much better they are, if at all until I start squatting 190Kg plus.
> 
> The biggest positive for me is the elevated heel makes the squat feel safer and has greatly reduced the feeling of fear as I go parallel and below. For me personally fear has been the biggest issue with the squat and according to my research is the biggest issue for many lifters :thumb:


Squat shoes for squats, definitely. But most people arent that committed to squats to spend the money on proper squat shoes so if you have the choice between trainers and barefoot then go barefoot. I havent worn shoes in the gym for years for any exercise.

Bench Press: 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3, 82.5x5, 95x5, 107.5x10 PM 143.5kg
Incline Press: 60x10,10,10,10,10
S/S Pendlay Rows: 70x6,6,6,6,6
Dips: BWx12,10,10
S/S Inverted Rows: BWx15,15,15

Some will notice that I have really cracked the volume on my upper body day and added another 2 exercises. It doesnt really add anymore time as I have been supersetting chest and back exercises. I can easily get more than 10 of 107.5kg but was hitting the holders on the last 3 reps on the way up which really ruins your groove and I want to leave a few in the tank on Bench at the moment anyway. Good workout and hugh pump.

Pendlay Rows are light but they will go up nice and fast so not worried about starting light.


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Great job man!
> 
> There's a pretty mean squatter in my gym who wears crossfit shoes so may invest when I'm going over 100kg.


James, I wouldnt bother unless your aiming to squat 180-190 or above consistently. I'm only using shoes because I have struggled with confidence since my injury and they are TBH a great placebo for regaining confidence :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

*Tuesday's workout*

*Decline Bench* 
8x60kg, 8x80kg, 4x100kg, 4x105kg, 3x110kg, 3x115kg, 3x120kg, 2x125kg, 4x130kg

Followed by a giant superset of

8x70kg, 8x60kg, 8x50kg, 8x40kg, 8x30kg, 8x40kg, 8x50kg, 8x60kg, 8x70kg

*Wednesday's workout *

*Squat*
8x80kg, 8x92.5kg, 5x110kg, 4x120kg, 3x130kg, 2x135kg, 5x140kg

Followed by

15x80kg, 15x80kg, 15x80kg


----------



## mrbubba

JMorty said:


> Great job man!
> 
> There's a pretty mean squatter in my gym who wears crossfit shoes so may invest when I'm going over 100kg.
> 
> Jumped in today as I was off and it's my bday tomorrow. Probably head in for some cardio and other bits.
> 
> Session 6
> 
> Squat (WU 20kg x10 30kg x10 40kg x5 50kg x5)
> 
> 62.5kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> OH Press (WU 20kg x10 22.5kg x 5 25kg x 5)
> 
> 30kg x5x5x5x5x5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)
> 
> 50kg x5


I got my cross fit trainers for £29 on H&M website, much better than my running trainers for squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

mrbubba said:


> I got my cross fit trainers for £29 on H&M website, much better than my running trainers for squats.


Going to have to chip in here 

If you want to use squat shoes buy Olympic shoes with the elevated heel (Cheaper wooden heeled shoes are just as good as the more modern plastic Adidas or Nike) or go bare foot, once you start squatting heavy a normal trainer will not give you the support you need as the rubber sole will move around under load.

I have personally squatted 200kg bare foot no problems :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 157GX5 - 177.5KGX3 - 198.5KGX1

DEADLIFT 164.5KGX1X1X1X1X1

RDL (1 minute Rest between Sets) 114.5KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Bit disappointing i couldn't mange two reps on the 198.5Kg, but non the less still a good workout :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

:thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Session 7

Squat (WU 30kg x5 40kg x5 50kg x5)

65kg x5x5x5x5x5

Bench Press (WU 20kg x5 30kg x 5 35kg x 5)

45kg x5x5x5x5x5

Row (WU 30kg x5 40kg x5 50kg x 5)

57.5 x5x5x5x5x5

Starting it enjoy it now. Really feel muscles worked now.

Lovin it!


----------



## JMorty

Session 8

Squat (WU 30kg x10 40kg x5 50kg x5 60kg x5)

67.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

OH Press (WU 15kg x 10 20kg x10 25kg x 5)

32.5kg x5x5x5x5x5

Deadlift (WU 20kg x10 30kg x5 40kg x 5)

55kg x5x5x5x5x5

Decided to do the full 5x5 on the deadlift as I was feeling strong and I'm on like 3000+ calories a day at the mo. Bulking at the mo

Going on a 2-3 week calorie deficit before holiday. With my metabolism and cardio I should lean up quite well.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 119.5KGX5 - 135.5KGX3 - 151KGX2

DEAD SQUAT 1 Min Rest between Sets 124.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUT 205KGX1X1X1X1X1
*

All good, the 151Kgx2 felt very good, both reps were full depth, yes i could have done three maybe four but I'm focusing on clean reps to progress from :thumb:

Dead squat is getting a little harder and the squat walkout felt easier. I'm not sure if I should increase the weight or start half or quarter squatting the weight to prepare myself for my goal (200Kg full squat) 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 150x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 115x8,8,8,8
Roll Outs: BWx5,5,5
Pallof Press: Blue Bandx12,12,12

Good workout. Back off sets were moving nice and fast which is exactly where I want to be. Monday morning here now and abs are still sore as hell and we didnt do one single crunch, all stabilisation work.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103KGX5 - 117KGX3 - 130.5KGX1.5 

DEAD BENCH 1 Min Rest between Sets 85KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS (3 min Rest between Sets) 102.5KGX5X5*

Very good workout, nearly made two reps on the 130.5KG NEARLY! :wall: ooooh the bugger was soooo close 

I'll make next week a de load week to give my joints a chance to rest as I want to keep the dead weight work in my workouts 

I've got a 16oz sirloin for tea, PROTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN! :devil::devil:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 145x3,3,3,3
Squats: 112.5x6,6,6,6,6
Forward/Backwards Farmers Walks: 25 each hand x 4 reps x 3 sets

This workout was actually quite easy, everything moved nice and fast and wasnt even that tired after the workout. This doesnt mean I didnt push myself as I still put 100% into the bar every single rep but it means it has just boosted my confidence that I will easily hit my target this month and onwards to 200kg squat. All my maxes are predicted maxes so one week I will actually do a 1RM week and see how I do. I dont reconmend this for training but it will be good to find out how close I am to these predictions


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 160GX5 - 181KGX3 - 203KGX1

DEADLIFT 169KGX1X1X1X1X1

RDL (1 min Rest between Sets) 119KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Didn't manage two reps on the 203Kg, but still I had a go  Still a very pleasing workout and im slowly progressing :thumb:

I'm really enjoying this new format, more than anything before so I plan to stick to it for as long as I can :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 4
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 160GX5 - 181KGX3 - 203KGX1
> 
> DEADLIFT 169KGX1X1X1X1X1
> 
> RDL (1 min Rest between Sets) 119KGX5X5X5X5X5*
> 
> Didn't manage two reps on the 203Kg, but still I had a go  Still a very pleasing workout and im slowly progressing :thumb:
> 
> I'm really enjoying this new format, more than anything before so I plan to stick to it for as long as I can :thumb:


Nice lift buddy  
What is the new format you're following then?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lift buddy
> What is the new format you're following then?


Thanks Lee, its nice to be back into it after last year's awful consistency.

The format is basically week 3 of the 5/3/1 then two secondary work sets based on what I have learned over the last few years and what keeps me motivated. I love heavy low rep training and absolutely despise high rep training 

The deadlift secondary work set is to get some heavy singles to help with form and the third work set is to use a nedium weight for five sets of five to strengthen my hamstrings.

There is weight progression in all the sets but im also being mkre relaxed about weight progression, I up the weight if im happy to, simples :thumb:

Once im settled I intend to add another day, but im just seeing how three days a week works out.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks Lee, its nice to be back into it after last year's awful consistency.
> 
> The format is basically week 3 of the 5/3/1 then two secondary work sets based on what I have learned over the last few years and what keeps me motivated. I love heavy low rep training and absolutely despise high rep training
> 
> The deadlift secondary work set is to get some heavy singles to help with form and the third work set is to use a nedium weight for five sets of five to strengthen my hamstrings.
> 
> There is weight progression in all the sets but im also being mkre relaxed about weight progression, I up the weight if im happy to, simples :thumb:
> 
> Once im settled I intend to add another day, but im just seeing how three days a week works out.
> 
> :thumb:


Nice work Doug, as weve discussed before there is acually a lot to be said for training by feel as you get more advanced.

I know you dont like the Juggernaut Program but if you look at CWS trainly he does more inline with your training, heavy sets followed by low rep but short rest sets. Hes done 500lb with 1 min rest sets, thats got to be a killer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice work Doug, as weve discussed before there is acually a lot to be said for training by feel as you get more advanced.
> 
> I know you dont like the Juggernaut Program but if you look at CWS trainly he does more inline with your training, heavy sets followed by low rep but short rest sets. Hes done 500lb with 1 min rest sets, thats got to be a killer.


Thanks James :thumb:

TBH ive not enjoyed my training so much since last nov/dec 2014, im now looking forward to my workouts, last year whilst playing with lighter weights i just lost the love, i will not do that again, i love lifting heavy and I will continiue to do so with some breaks/deloads to give the old body time to recover :thumb:

But your right, i feel even though im not an advanced a lifter i have enough experince to modify tried workouts to my taste 

No i dont like the juggernaut, what ever gave you that idea  I get very lazy if the weights are too light and my form had become so terrible by the end of last year i hurt my back doing the deadlift over christmas, in fact all my lifts were form = B****X.

Looking forward to my squat workout already :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I know what you mean about liking your workouts. I used to hate multiple sets and just wanted to do 1 top set but now Ive figured out that higher volume is definitely the way to go. I'm really enjoying lifting at the moment and think the program I'm on at the moment is the best one Ive ever written. Making progress on every exercise but I basically dont give myself to much crap over it, if I feel good I hit more reps, if its feeling off then I do less reps but looking at the big picture all my indication lifts are going up. Below is a good example of pushing it when you feel good.

Bench: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 90x3, 102.5x3, 115x10 PM 153.5kg
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,6,6
S/S
Pendlay Rows: 75x5,5,5,5,5
Dips: BWx16,13,9
S/S
Inverted Rows: BWx10,10,10

Another good workout. Was only suppose to hit 8 reps but got there easily so thought I would hit one more rep and that went up easily so hit a 10th rep and still had 1 left in the Tank. Please with this as it means Im back to the same strength as before I went away as my record is 11 reps. I sort of want to stick to the programmed reps though as want to hit them nice and fast and then concentrate on my repeated efforts on the next exercise but hard not to go for extra reps when your feeling good.

Have a good progression setup for Pendlay Rows, its a sort of old school 2 steps forward, 1 step back setup but should hopefully push my weights up.


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Thanks Lee, its nice to be back into it after last year's awful consistency.
> 
> The format is basically week 3 of the 5/3/1 then two secondary work sets based on what I have learned over the last few years and what keeps me motivated. I love heavy low rep training and absolutely despise high rep training
> 
> The deadlift secondary work set is to get some heavy singles to help with form and the third work set is to use a nedium weight for five sets of five to strengthen my hamstrings.
> 
> There is weight progression in all the sets but im also being mkre relaxed about weight progression, I up the weight if im happy to, simples :thumb:
> 
> Once im settled I intend to add another day, but im just seeing how three days a week works out.
> 
> :thumb:


Ah ok, makes sense! I assume you've dropped the OHP day currently then if you're just doing 3 days a week? 
Are you adding weight every single week if you're effectively just doing week 3 of the 5/3/1?

Definitely agree with working out with what you like and know works best for you. I like to get the low rep heavy in first then follow up with some higher rep stuff :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> I know what you mean about liking your workouts. I used to hate multiple sets and just wanted to do 1 top set but now Ive figured out that higher volume is definitely the way to go. I'm really enjoying lifting at the moment and think the program I'm on at the moment is the best one Ive ever written. Making progress on every exercise but I basically dont give myself to much crap over it, if I feel good I hit more reps, if its feeling off then I do less reps but looking at the big picture all my indication lifts are going up. Below is a good example of pushing it when you feel good.
> 
> Bench: (WU 50x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 90x3, 102.5x3, 115x10 PM 153.5kg
> Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,6,6
> S/S
> Pendlay Rows: 75x5,5,5,5,5
> Dips: BWx16,13,9
> S/S
> Inverted Rows: BWx10,10,10


Nice bench James, impressive for 10 reps :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Ah ok, makes sense! I assume you've dropped the OHP day currently then if you're just doing 3 days a week?
> Are you adding weight every single week if you're effectively just doing week 3 of the 5/3/1?
> 
> Definitely agree with working out with what you like and know works best for you. I like to get the low rep heavy in first then follow up with some higher rep stuff :thumb:


I haven't really done a great deal of OHP work TBH and I believe there is enough work in the bench session to grow. I do plan to add another day for back work in the very near future :thumb:

Yep, adding weight every week, it helps greatly for motivation and if there is a fail i can do it again next week rather than waiting a whole month, which i struggled with from time to time.

For the first 3 years I would always recommend going with the tried and true workouts (5x5, 5/3/1 etc..) before moving on to something more tailored to your taste as it gives you great incite to what does and what doesn't work for you and TBH the important part is the psychology, if you really think it will work and want it to work and keep within the realms of tried methods (Progressive overload is the king IMHO) you will succeed.

As for high rep, if i want high rep i'll go for a walk   :wave:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice bench James, impressive for 10 reps :thumb:


+1 :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 122.5KGX5 - 139KGX3 - 155KGX2

DEAD SQUAT (1 MINUTE REST BETWEEN SETS) - 129KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

SQUAT WALKOUT 210KGX1X1X1X1X1*

Really happy with this workout, all reps were good and controlled. I've not enjoyed squatting so much for over a year. I'm hoping I will continue to progress well, although I'm expecting to stall as I get close to 180Kg - 190Kg.

Dead squats felt much easier today. I'm not sure how I will progress on these as I get close to my true Dead Squat max. 
I have a few options. 
1. Reduce the sets to 5 as the weight gets heavier and gradually increase the rest period between sets to maintain progress.
2. Increase the rest period between the 10 sets as the weight gets heavier.
3. Plate strip from set 1 to 10 so that I can maintain progression on main/first set.
4.Do two sets with different percentages of weight.

Either way I will maintain a flexible approach and choose one or a multiple of the above to keep things interesting and to keep the progress going in the right direction :thumb:

Squat walkouts felt awesome, the 210Kg felt easy on the first set and the remaining four sets felt good. I tried slight variation on bar position and was suprised how much of a difference the weight felt whilst walking out, the best and most stable is just in the muscle shelf between traps and back muscles, pull your elbows back and youll feel this shelf. I only intend to progress up to 220Kg on squat walkouts 

The Romaleo's are providing great stability and most definitely help with confidence and added placebo effect :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Ah ok, makes sense! I assume you've dropped the OHP day currently then if you're just doing 3 days a week?
> Are you adding weight every single week if you're effectively just doing week 3 of the 5/3/1?
> 
> Definitely agree with working out with what you like and know works best for you. I like to get the low rep heavy in first then follow up with some higher rep stuff :thumb:


I think if your natural then you have to get the low rep stuff in as putting more weight on the bar is the best way to add muscle. But once youve got your heavy work in then you can tailor the rest if the workout to your goals, if its strength do more low rep stuff, if its muscle throw in higher reps etc. Thats what were doing at the moment, muscle for upper body, strength for lower body.



ITHAQVA said:


> Week 4
> 
> *FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 122.5KGX5 - 139KGX3 - 155KGX2
> 
> DEAD SQUAT (1 MINUTE REST BETWEEN SETS) - 129KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1
> 
> SQUAT WALKOUT 210KGX1X1X1X1X1*
> 
> Really happy with this workout, all reps were good and controlled. I've not enjoyed squatting so much for over a year. I'm hoping I will continue to progress well, although I'm expecting to stall as I get close to 180Kg - 190Kg.
> 
> Dead squats felt much easier today. I'm not sure how I will progress on these as I get close to my true Dead Squat max.
> I have a few options.
> 1. Reduce the sets to 5 as the weight gets heavier and gradually increase the rest period between sets to maintain progress.
> 2. Increase the rest period between the 10 sets as the weight gets heavier.
> 3. Plate strip from set 1 to 10 so that I can maintain progression on main/first set.
> 4.Do two sets with different percentages of weight.
> 
> Either way I will maintain a flexible approach and choose one or a multiple of the above to keep things interesting and to keep the progress going in the right direction :thumb:
> 
> Squat walkouts felt awesome, the 210Kg felt easy on the first set and the remaining four sets felt good. I tried slight variation on bar position and was suprised how much of a difference the weight felt whilst walking out, the best and most stable is just in the muscle shelf between traps and back muscles, pull your elbows back and youll feel this shelf. I only intend to progress up to 220Kg on squat walkouts
> 
> The Romaleo's are providing great stability and most definitely help with confidence and added placebo effect :thumb:


Doug at your level it may be best to do a more day by day basis on your dead squats. Keep doing sets until your speed falls below a certain level, so on good days do your standard 10 sets but if you have a day where your not feeling so good then 5 fast sets may do it. This was also work when you add weight, 5 sets to start, completely dominate it so add a few sets and work up. All sorts of ways you can progress now.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 122.5x6,6,6,6,6
Ab Roll Outs: BWx3,3,3
Pallof Press: Blue Bandx12,12,ABC

Good workout, got all my reps but was hard work. I had to move my Bench/Row day to thurs which seemed to affect my deadlifts on Fri. Also felt really beat up all weekend. I think the extra volume on lower plus the doubled volume on upper plus golf range work plus golf speed work is taking its toll slightly but sure my body will addapt as this is only week to.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> I think if your natural then you have to get the low rep stuff in as putting more weight on the bar is the best way to add muscle. But once youve got your heavy work in then you can tailor the rest if the workout to your goals, if its strength do more low rep stuff, if its muscle throw in higher reps etc. Thats what were doing at the moment, muscle for upper body, strength for lower body.


Ha, yep I'm 100% natural! Wouldn't go near anything like that!

I'm finding that by doing the heavy stuff first, it makes the higher rep stuff a lot easier as the weight then feels incredibly light.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug at your level it may be best to do a more day by day basis on your dead squats. Keep doing sets until your speed falls below a certain level, so on good days do your standard 10 sets but if you have a day where your not feeling so good then 5 fast sets may do it. This was also work when you add weight, 5 sets to start, completely dominate it so add a few sets and work up. All sorts of ways you can progress now.


I think youy have it spot on in regards how to progress James :thumb: As the weights get heavier I will start to stall/have bad days and the added flexability in my lifting will aid progess and motivation :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Ha, yep I'm 100% natural! Wouldn't go near anything like that!


I'm glad to hear that Lee, I have no time for cheats no matter how accepted it seems to be these days.

And to add to what James has pointed out, if your natural, heavy low rep should be the foundation of your workout


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> I'm glad to hear that Lee, I have no time for cheats no matter how accepted it seems to be these days.
> 
> And to add to what James has pointed out, if your natural, heavy low rep should be the foundation of your workout


Absolutely agree buddy :thumb:

*Today's Workout*

*DB Bench* (wasn't planning to do this but had to whilst waiting for the Decline Bench to become free...)
30kgx8, 35kgx8, 37.5kgx5, 40kgx5

*Decline Bench*
90kgx8, 100kgx5, 110kgx3, 120kgx3, 125kgx2, 130kgx3

*Decline Drop Set*
100kgx8 -> 80kgx10 -> 60kgx12 -> 50kgx11 -> 40kgx12

Then finished with some front/side/rear shoulder raises.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 140x3, 147.5x2,2, 155x1,1,1
Squats: 120x5,5,5,5,5
Farmers Walk: 50x4x3

Good workout, technique wasnt the best but was never going to fail a rep in this workout. Sets me up for record week next week anyway but really need to start pushing these lower body weights up.


----------



## JMorty

Some solid work going on in here!!!

Been off this thread for a while but I'll share where I've got to.

All 5x5 and full rom with proper form. I'm absolutely set on keeping that form perfectas I can.

Squat - 77.5 (PB)
OHP - 37.5 (PB)
Deadlift - 65
Bench - 52.5
Barbell Row - 62.5 (PB)

Smashing my previous bests and feeling stronger than ever now.

Starting to out squat some people which feels awesome lol


----------



## Bod42

JMorty said:


> Some solid work going on in here!!!
> 
> Been off this thread for a while but I'll share where I've got to.
> 
> All 5x5 and full rom with proper form. I'm absolutely set on keeping that form perfectas I can.
> 
> Squat - 77.5 (PB)
> OHP - 37.5 (PB)
> Deadlift - 65
> Bench - 52.5
> Barbell Row - 62.5 (PB)
> 
> Smashing my previous bests and feeling stronger than ever now.
> 
> Starting to out squat some people which feels awesome lol


Nice work JMorty. Keep smashing your own PBs, thats all you can ask for.


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Some solid work going on in here!!!
> 
> Been off this thread for a while but I'll share where I've got to.
> 
> All 5x5 and full rom with proper form. I'm absolutely set on keeping that form perfectas I can.
> 
> Squat - 77.5 (PB)
> OHP - 37.5 (PB)
> Deadlift - 65
> Bench - 52.5
> Barbell Row - 62.5 (PB)
> 
> Smashing my previous bests and feeling stronger than ever now.
> 
> Starting to out squat some people which feels awesome lol


Nice one James :devil: :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 5 De load wee... ahem!  Well it didn't turn out that way 

*BENCH PRESS (50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX1 - 119KGX1 - 133KGX1

DEAD BENCH (1 - 1.5 Min rest between sets) 90KGX1 - 100KGX1 - 105KGX1 - 110KGX1 - 115KGX0

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 115KGX3 - 120KGX1 - 120KGX0 - 115KGX3 - 115KGX2
*

Nice! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Your deload is mighty impressive Doug lol. I'm deloading completely differently this time and will have to see how it goes. Instead of the usual 40%, 50%, 60% as per 5/3/1, I'm actually keeping the inetnsity high but bring my volume back by halfing the reps and volume. So instead of 5x5, I will do 2-3 sets of 2-3 reps. I think this will be better as technique never feels that great when i come back froma deload and from the research I have done, it seems that volume is the contributing factor in how hard your workout is and therefore how hard it hits your recovery. So by halfing the volume but keeping intensity high, I will still keep my technique in check and give my a body a rest.

Bench: (WU 50x5, 70x5, 77.5x3) 95x5, 107.5x3, 120x7 PM 148kg
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,6,6
Pendlay Rows: 72.5x6,6,6,6,6
Dips: BWx17,9,7
Inverted Rows: BWx10,6,6
Prone Trap Riases: 1.25x12,12,12
Iso-Hold Y-W-T: BWx15secsx3sets

Good wokrout but say this everytime lately. I think thats a record for 120kg and can never argue with a PB. Nice to have 4 25s on the bar, good milestone to hit. The weird thing is, where did this record even come from, I had a month off in the UK and then only been back training 1 month so not exactly enough time to work up to a record. It must have been all the rehab and slow eccentric work I did during Defrancos Built 2 last program and the high rep 350 method work Ive been doing on bench as i havent done any strength work in ages on Bench due to my shoulder.

Dips were the only disappointing thing but shoulder went during the 2nd set so I just ended the set, its only for the pump after all. And I made a change to my Incline Bench so would have been more exhausted for Dips. I'm basically never resting at the top on incline to keep tension on the muscle. Most people on 10 reps will say bang out 8, little rest then hit 2 more reps but if I rest then I take that as the end of the set so keeping short of lockout with no rest. Wouldnt mind doing a phase where I make Incline my first exercise and pushing up my strength on this exercise


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 5 intuitive workout 

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 163.5KGX5 - 185KGX3 - 207KGX1 - 215KGX1 :thumb:

DEADLIFT 163.5KGX3X3X3X3X3*

Went in and decided to go for it, the 215KG actually felt that easy I wanted to go to 220KG, however I decided to leave it. No point pushing too hard and injuring myself :thumb:

Finisher sets on the 163.5KG were nice, all reps done with good form :thumb:

This deload week seems to have not transpired, perhaps ill do one next week. But I agree with James, you seem to lose a bit of form after it, if i do deload it will be as yesterdays workout. Heavy enough to keep my form strict. Light weights make me form lazy!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench: (WU 50x5, 70x5, 77.5x3) 95x5, 107.5x3, *120x7* PM 148kg


Mate, that's FG awesome! :thumb:

James you are a rep monster! :devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 5 a session with no name 

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 126GX3 - 143KGX2 - 159.5KGX1 - 170KGX1 - 180KGX Above parallel = FAIL

SQUAT WALKOUT 210KGX1 - 215KGX1 - 220KGX1

Quarter Squat 200KGX1

Half Squat 200KGX Fail, was just too tired to lift *

Even with a few misses this was a very good workout, it was all in the mind on the 180KG as it didn't feel too heavy or daunting, timing was all wrong and i lifted too soon :wall:. The 200KG half squat fail was just down to being tired, it didn't feel to overwhelming after the heavier squat walkouts, i just fatigued myself beyond recovery. No i cant full squat 200KG yet, but if i had the energy i most definitely could have made some positive depth progress which would help greatly with confidence.

The old man needs to rest now


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Mate, that's FG awesome! :thumb:
> 
> James you are a rep monster! :devil:


Thanks mate, Bench has always gone pretty well for me so just need to focus on the Lower body movements now which is what I will do. Its Goal week this week anyway so how I do on this week defines how I progress so hopefully I put up some good numbers but everything has felt good this last month so have no reason to doubt that I will.

Friday workouts:
Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 152.5x3, 162.5x2,2, 170x1,1,1
Deadlifts: 132.5x5,5,5,5,5
Roll Outs: BWx6,,4,3
Pallof Press: Blue Bandx12,12,A-Z

Pleased with this workout again but I need to work on my 1 rep form. My seconds rep always feel so much faster and better form than my first and its not like Im doing touch and go so I feel its the weight pulling me down into a good position.

The 132.5kg back off sets were lightening fast. Training partner even said wow you made that look easy, smashing 5 reps out in a few seconds which is exactly where I want to be, just dominating weights.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 145x3, 152.5x2, 160x5 PM 186.5kg
Squats: 127.5x4,4,4,4,4

I hit the 5 reps I had programmed and at least had another rep in me so cant complain. This also isnt a true 5RM as your actually fatigued from the 3 and 2 rep sets previous. Most looking forward to Deadlifts as the month has been really good for those.


----------



## Leebo310

Yesterday's workout

*Dec Press*
60kgx10, 80kgx8, 100kgx5, 110kgx3, 120kgx3, 125kgx2, 130kgx4

*Dec Drop Set to Fail*
100kgx6, 80kgx8, 60kgx10 (awful numbers as had used all my energy on the new PB of 4 at 130..)

*Upright DB Row*
3x8 @ 25kg

*Front DB Raise*
3x5 @ 25kg
*Front DB Raise Drop Set to Fail*
[email protected], [email protected]

*DB Side Raise *
3x30 @ 7.5kg


----------



## Bokers

Squat
20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70kg x 5

Bench
20, 30, 40, 50, 60kg x 5

Curls
10kg x 10 x 3

Too many months off.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: (WU 50x5, 70x5, 77.5x5) WO 85x5, 97.5x5, 110x10 PM 146.5kg
Incline Bench: 70x10,6,5,5,6
S/S Pendlay Rows: 77.5x5,5,5,5,5

So worst workout yet but this was one of these workouts where you know before you go in that your there to just hit something reasonable and then get out of there. My right shoulder was given me problems for the first time in ages and its not the 120kg bench last week, its my Golf swing causing the pain, who would have thought lol.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench: (WU 50x5, 70x5, 77.5x5) WO 85x5, 97.5x5, 110x10 PM 146.5kg
> Incline Bench: 70x10,6,5,5,6
> S/S Pendlay Rows: 77.5x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> So worst workout yet but this was one of these workouts where you know before you go in that your there to just hit something reasonable and then get out of there. My right shoulder was given me problems for the first time in ages and its not the 120kg bench last week, its my Golf swing causing the pain, who would have thought lol.


Sorry to hear your shoulder is playing up mate, keep at it bud.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 6

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 105KGX5 - 119KGX3 - 133KGX1

DEAD BENCH 1 Min Rest between Sets 87.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS (3 min Rest between Sets) 102.5KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

At last, the 133KG went up nice, not a perfect rep but easy enough so that im happy to progress in weight. I've got some way to go until I get to were I was Nov 2014 (145KGX1 )

Nice solid workout, im itching to lift more on the dead bench, but I know that progressing too fast on dead work can damage the joints/tendons. I will continue to progress slowly as I am and be mindful of any joint issues.

The last work sets felt good, not too sure how to progress as it gets harder, I don't want to keep upping the rest intervals otherwise the workout will be far too long. I think I'm more inclined to reduce the reps so I can get more time under a heavy bar :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 6

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 167KGX5 - 189KGX3 - 211KGX1 - 230KGX0 Made a mistake and loaded 230KG instead of 220KG :wall:, at least it went up....a bit! 

DEADLIFT 173.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1

RDL (1 min Rest between Sets) 123.5KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Good workout and progress is moving in the right direction :thumb: ****ed up on the 230KG but at least I've got a feel of the weight 

I might be forced to do deadlifts in the week to allow for recovery soon.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 6

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 129KGX5 - 146.5GX3 - 164KGX1

SQUAT WALKOUT 220KGX1X1X1

DEAD SQUAT 1 Min Rest between Sets 133.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1
*

Progressing well so far. I tried squat walkouts before the dead squat, didn't seem to be detrimental, but as the weights become heavier I may have to structure the workout more methodically.

Disappointed that i missed the second rep on the 164KG but still im going in the right direction. Still a long way from my better years of lifting (150KGX5, 180KGX3 and 200KGX1) But my motivation is still incredibly high :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

That's a pretty nice full squat session there! Spot on!

Really bummed as I've been away with work until Fri night. Jobs to do Sat, Sunday in-laws round for mothers day...so I've been out of the gym for over a week now. Really p'd off about it.

Going to be hard to get back in I think


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> That's a pretty nice full squat session there! Spot on!
> 
> Really bummed as I've been away with work until Fri night. Jobs to do Sat, Sunday in-laws round for mothers day...so I've been out of the gym for over a week now. Really p'd off about it.
> 
> Going to be hard to get back in I think


James, if you really want to succeed, you must make time, ask yourself do you really have no way of training for 4.5 hours a week?

I've been training now for four years, last year was really crap so in reality I've only been training three years. *But It's all my own fault! and I give myself no quarter for being a lazy unmotivated *

If you really want it, you'll do it. We all have times when the weather is crap, work is busy, home life is busy and life just seems to take over and you allow it to get in the way of your passion. Take control.

Be the guy who turned up, lift on! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3, 167.5x2, 175x5 PM 204kgs
Deadlifts: 140x4,4,4,4,4

I got the 5 reps but they were a lot harder than they should have been. But if I think about it then Im not surprised. Been to the range 6 times this week and trying to get my body into new positions so my back, especially the lower back was quite fatigued which obviously doesnt go well for Deadlifts. 

Havent really liked training for the past 2 weeks so considering a deload but it isnt programmed. Will see how squats feel tonight


----------



## Bokers

DL
60, 90, 110, 130kg x 5

OHP
20, 30, 40kg x 5
50kg x 1
45kg x 5

Cable pushdowns
20, 40, 60kg x 5
65kg x 5
55kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Leebo310

*Monday's workout*

*DB Bench* Was supposed to be regular bench but both were taken so had to use db's instead.
8x30kg, 8x35kg, 5x37.5kg, 5x40kg, 5x42.5kg, 3x45kg, 3x47.5kg, 5x50kg

Happy to get a PB, never gone above 45's before so to get the 50's up and 5 reps was nice.

Seated BBell Press
5x50kg, 5x50kg, 5x50kg, 5x50kg, 8x50kg

Upright DB Row
8x25kg, 8x25kg, 8x25kg

Front DB Raise
6x25kg, 6x25kg, 6x25kg

Side DB Raise
30x7.5kg, 30x7.5kg

*Today's Workout*

*Squat*
8x60kg, 8x80kg, 8x100kg, 5x112.5kg, 4x120kg, 3x130kg, 3x135kg, 8x140kg

Followed by

6x80kg with a 3 second pause at the bottom below parallel
6x80kg with a 3 second pause at the bottom below parallel
6x80kg with a 3 second pause at the bottom below parallel


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 7

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 107KGX5 - 121KGX3 - 135KGX1

DEAD BENCH 90KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1
*

Good solid workout, form was good too :thumb: Cut the workout a bit short just to aid in recovery for this week.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Leebo 50kg dumbells is impressive, I know I couldnt do that.

Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 142.5x5,5,5
Squats: 110x8,8,8,8

So ridiculously pleased with this workout as been feeling a little beat up and not really looking forward to training so was using this workout as a gauge for if I need a deload or not. This coupled with putting the weight up 7.5kg from 1 month ago and I was a little worried but pleased to say I absolutely destroyed this workout, every rep was flying. 

And to cap it off was ripping the Golf ball at the range as well so the 6 sessions last week paid off.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 90x3, 105x3, 117.5x8 PM 149kgs
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,7,7
S/S Pendlay Rows: 75x6,6,6,6,6
Dips: BWx16,11,10
S/S Inverted Rows: BWx10,8,8
Prone trap Rasies: 1.25x12,12,12
Iso-Hold Y-W-T: BWx15secs, 15,15

Good workout, hitting the numbers I need to hit. But its the average workouts that after time create the progress, cant have amazing workouts all the time.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bought two more of these..........I couldnt resist!!!!

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/body-power-cast-iron-olympic-discs-20kg-x2.html

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 7

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 170KGX5 - 193KGX3 - 215.5KGX1

DEADLIFT 178KGX1X1X1X1X1*

Very happy with this workout, the weights are feeling good and my strength does seem to be very consistent since using this new template.

The new plates were used today and they looked very much at home on the bar  I've promised myself if i make 230KG that I'll buy two more 20KG plates giving 5 plates each side = 230Kg :thumb:

Considering a lighter week next week to give my joints and tendons a rest, im not feeling any issues but i'd rather take a slow cautious approach


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 7

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 135KGX5 - 150KGX3 - 168KGX1

DEAD SQUAT 138KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1
*

Very good workout again :thumb:

All the weights felt the easy, I'm not sure if its the squat walkouts or the dead squats, the only difference today is instead of sticking strictly to seven minutes rest between work sets i took a more relaxed approach and rested between 7-8 minutes. Personally I find squats much more taxing than deadlifts from the perspective of how recovered i feel between sets.

As we know the question of what rest between sets is best has been widely debated. From my experience of lifting, i think its best to follow the recommendations (5X5, 5/3/1 etc...) until you truly feel experienced enough to decide for yourself. Its a rock and a hard place, too little rest and you'll not be recovered enough to make your next lift, too much rest and you'll cool down too much and the weight feels heavy again and you fail to lift. For me I have always done well around 7 minutes on work sets, but may take it to 8 minutes on my last heavy sets. Something for me to find out by trying 

Lift on!  :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 7
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 170KGX5 - 193KGX3 - 215.5KGX1
> 
> DEADLIFT 178KGX1X1X1X1X1*
> 
> Very happy with this workout, the weights are feeling good and my strength does seem to be very consistent since using this new template.
> 
> The new plates were used today and they looked very much at home on the bar  I've promised myself if i make 230KG that I'll buy two more 20KG plates giving 5 plates each side = 230Kg :thumb:
> 
> Considering a lighter week next week to give my joints and tendons a rest, im not feeling any issues but i'd rather take a slow cautious approach


Is that 30kg for the bar then Doug?

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 155x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 117.5x8,8,8,8
Roll Outs: BWx6,5,4

Another workout where I ripped the weights up stupidly fast so feel really good progressing through the workout. Nice when 117.5kgs feels like absolutely nothing in your hands.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Is that 30kg for the bar then Doug?


Hi James, my bar is standard 20Kg. Dont forget I have two 25Kg plates wich go on first at all times, so in effect i load 2x25, 6x20Kg, then the smaller plates, if i make 230Kg ill purchase another 2x20KG so i wont have to use small plates when lifting that weight. This will look dam good on the bar and help with motivation etc.. :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James, my bar is standard 20Kg. Dont forget I have two 25Kg plates wich go on first at all times, so in effect i load 2x25, 6x20Kg, then the smaller plates, if i make 230Kg ill purchase another 2x20KG so i wont have to use small plates when lifting that weight. This will look dam good on the bar and help with motivation etc.. :thumb:


Dam! thought I had just added 10kgs to all my lifts lol.

Ya I use 4 25kg plates so when I hit 220kg deadlift then will only be 4 plates per side instead of 5. Still looks good though.

Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 117.5x3, 135x2, 150x3,3,3,3
Squats: 117.5x6,6,6,6,6

Was stupidly tired tonight after the Mrs taking me away for my 30th birthday all weekend on a golfing weekend to play on the number 1 course in Oceania. So was pleased to hit all my reps tonight. Average workouts are what build towards your good workouts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Dam! thought I had just added 10kgs to all my lifts lol.


We both wish 

Confirmed, link spec is 20Kg for the 7FT bar :thumb:

http://www.fitness-superstore.co.uk/body-power-235kg-olympic-weight-set-1.html

The picture is misleading as the 20Kg plates are the same diameter as the 25g plates.


----------



## Leebo310

*Squat*
8x80kg, 8x100kg, 4x120kg, 3x130kg, 3x140kg, 2x145kg, 2x150kg

21x100kg (reps to fail)

*Leg Press*
10x110kg, 
5x170kg, 5x180kg, 
20x80kg, 25x80kg

*Leg Curl*
5x90kg, 5x90kg, 5x90kg
20x40kg, 20x40kg



Bod42 said:


> Leebo 50kg dumbells is impressive, I know I couldnt do that.


Cheers and don't sell yourself short mate! Considering you can do 120 for 7 on a bar, I'm sure you could easily shift them!


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> *Squat*
> 8x80kg, 8x100kg, 4x120kg, 3x130kg, 3x140kg, 2x145kg, 2x150kg
> 
> 21x100kg (reps to fail)
> 
> *Leg Press*
> 10x110kg,
> 5x170kg, 5x180kg,
> 20x80kg, 25x80kg
> 
> *Leg Curl*
> 5x90kg, 5x90kg, 5x90kg
> 20x40kg, 20x40kg
> 
> Cheers and don't sell yourself short mate! Considering you can do 120 for 7 on a bar, I'm sure you could easily shift them!


122.5x7 last night :devil:

Another workout of yours Im impressed with though mate, 100kgs for 21reps. Thats not only impressive phyically, it takes some balls as well :thumb:

Bench: (WU 52.5x5, 65x5, 77.5x3) WO 97.5x5, 110x3, 122.5x7 PM 151kg
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,10,7,7
S/S Pendlay Rows: 80x5,5,5,5,5
Dips: BWx15,13,11
S/S Inverted Rows: BWx10,8,8

Good wokrout as its another heavy rep record. This was actually one of my best workouts as I improved on every single lift. I'm doubly pleased with Inclines and Pendlay Rows as leaving 15 secs rest between Incline and Pendlay then 1 min rest after pendlays before Incline. So doing them at quite a fast pace. Always nice to improve on Dips.

Im happy with my Bench at the moment so this will be backed off slightly so I can concentrate on the Incline press a bit more and i want to really start pushing my pendlay rows a lot heavier. Adding 2.5 every 2 weeks so this will get nice and heavy quite quickly. Want to put 20kgs on this exercise as 100kg dead stop rows has a nice ring to it. And I do these ultra strict, head and upper body dont move at all.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> 122.5x7 last night :devil:
> 
> Another workout of yours Im impressed with though mate, 100kgs for 21reps. Thats not only impressive phyically, it takes some balls as well :thumb:


Ha sorry James, didn't mean to sell you short :thumb:

Cheers mate, I was very happy with it. It took a lot out of me but rewarding for sure! Looking forward to trying to get 22 reps next time! I really like doing the high rep work (be it drop set or just to failure) after the heavy stuff as the weights just feel incredibly light.

*Today's workout *

*Dec Bench *
8x60kg, 8x80kg, 5x100kg, 3x110kg, 3x120kg, 3x130kg

*Dec Bench Drop Set *
9x100kg, 9x80kg, 9x60kg, 9x50kg

*Seated Barbell Press*
6x50kg, 6x50kg, 6x50kg, 6x55kg, 6x55kg, 6x55kg

*Front DB Raise*
6x25kg, 6x25kg, 6x25kg

*Front DB Raise Drop Set*
18x15kg, 12x10kg

*Standing Side DB Raise*
20x10kg, 20x10kg, 20x10kg


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 127.5x6,6,6,6,6

Didnt feel great today so was glad to just get in, hit my weights and get out of there. Was clever as the Mrs is ill at the moment and I can feel my body defending against that illness as feel really run down. May miss squats tonight to make sure I dont push myself over the edge.


----------



## eibbor

Would you guys recommend replacing barbell rows with pendlay rows in a 5x5 routine? Or as an added exercise?


----------



## Bod42

They work the same muscles, just one is a dead stop exercise and one isnt. Go with which ever one you prefer.


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> Would you guys recommend replacing barbell rows with pendlay rows in a 5x5 routine? Or as an added exercise?


Any "Dead Weight" exercise is superior for building strength IMHO, progression is slower and the hit on recovery/tendons and joints is greater. How you incorporte this is persoanl but I would suggest you stick to the 5x5 for 12 months then consider adding dead work into whatever programe you move onto.

A great example of a dead weight lift is the OHP (one thing ive never heard anyone say, which amazes me :doublesho

And I have no idea why they are called Pendlay rows, "Dead Rows" have been used for years before he came onto the scene 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

To be honest, I normally make every person I train at least start with Pendlay rows as a lot harder to cheat which makes form better. Hate seeing really upright upper body rows to the bottom of the belly so the ROM is tiny and its basically just a shrug. You may have seen from previous posts that Im pendlay rowing 80kgs but I have T bar rowed 140kgs just because your body is in an easier position and ROM is reduced.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 109KGX5 - 123KGX3 - 137.5KGX1

DEAD BENCH 92.5KGX1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1X1

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 105KGX5X5X5X5X5*

After a week off I was itching to lift again! :thumb:

I'm not sure if it's due to the week off, but tonight's workout felt underwhelming because the main work sets felt easier than expected, I'll monitor this when I take my next week off. Is this why competing powerlifters are instructed to build up to the second week before a meet, then rest on the week before? Would this then be a good way to build up to your own one rep max week?

After over four years I still find this a fascinating and challenging sport and I'm still learning my craft :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 2

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 173.5KGX5 - 197KGX3 - 220KGX0 FAIL! :wall::wall:

DEADLIFT 190KGX1X1X1X1X1

RDL (1 minute Rest between Sets) 128KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Fail on the 220KgX1 and its all my own fault! The other work sets felt easy smooth and controlled, I picked up the 220 and because it felt like i'd have to work for it and might fail i let it go!!! WTF!!!! It also proves that mastering the psychological aspect of powerlifting is key to success :thumb:

After the fail, I decided to punish my laziness and put 190Kg on the heavy singles to give me more time under a heavy bar 

Also due to using this new weekly template, if I fail a lift I can attempt it again in a weeks time, with the monthly template I would have to wait a whole month, then have the added pressure that if I failed again I would have wasted two months! Yes I will plateau sooner, but for me personally a weekly template is far better for motivation.

Lift On!
:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 2

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 136KGX5 - 154KGX3 - 172KGX1
*

Yesterday's deadlift session left me full of DOM's and that feeling of weakness and in need of recovery today, so my hopes were not high. I forgot that after a week off I should have only completed the main work sets for each lift on the first week back :wall:

But everything went well, in fact so well to the point of WTF? All the lifts felt well within my limits and even though I didn't do more I know I could have completed two if not three reps on the last work set, so something in my previous 7 week cycle is improving my strength. The heavy squat workouts are making my training weights feel lighter as I unrack them. I'm having to be careful whilst unracking as my strength in this part is making the bar fly up as I unrack it, causing a bit of instability. I played around with my stance and noticed more strength using a slightly narrower stance (The one I used when squatting bare foot).

I'm definitely going to have to move the deadlift session to sometime in the week as I'm not feeling fully recovered training the very next day after - No S**t i hear you say! 

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I was ill last week so took some time off and just did a few easy full body workouts to keep me used to all the moves. Back this week and raring to go.

Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 147.5x3, 155x2,2, 162.5x1,1,1
Squats: 125x5,5,5,5,5

Good session. I like the back off sets as they give you time to work on technique and worked on tensing those lats to pull the bar down and lock the back in a better position as my miss on a lift is my upper body getting to horizontal.


----------



## Leebo310

First session back after a weeks holiday - Legs with some biceps too

*Squat*
8x80kg, 8x100kg, 5x120kg, 3x130kg, 3x140kg, 3x140kg, 3x140kg

*Squat drop set*
22x100kg, 8x80kg, 16x60kg - pushed myself to get the 22 at 100kg to beat last session of 21, but this left me nothing for the 80kg at all! Used it almost as a rest to then get the 16 at 60kg!

*Leg Curl*
12x57.5kg, 12x57.5kg, 12x60kg, 12x65kg
20x40kg, 20x40kg

*Seated DB Curl*
10x12.5kg, 10x12.5kg, 12x12.5kg

*Smith Machine Calf Raise*
20x100kg, 20x140kg, 20x140kg, 20x140kg

*Cable Curl Rope Pyramid Superset*
15x55lb, 15x45lb, 15x35lb, 15x25lb, 15x35lb, 15x45lb, 15x55lb


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 110.5KGX5 - 125KGX3 - 140KGX0

DEAD BENCH 95KGX1 - 100KGX1 - 105KGX1 - 110KGX1 - 115KGX1 - 120KGX0 - 115KGX1 - 110KGX1 - 105KGX1 - 100KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 110KGX3X3X3X3X3
*

Failed on the 140KGX1, I just couldn't lock it out :wall:, shame really as usually I fail at the bottom part of the lift. But that is the beauty of this template, yes I will fail more often due to the more aggressive progress but I can de load back a week and build from there :thumb:

Even so I decided to punish myself and kept things nice and heavy on all my assistance work, that'll learn me!!!


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 85x5, 100x5, 115x12 PM 161KGs NEW PR
Incline Press: 70x10,8,6,6,6
S/S Pendlay Rows: 77.5x6,6,6,6,6
Dips: BWx16,11,10
S/S Inverted Rows: 10,8,8

Awesome workout, cant ever complain with a PR and that puts my predicted max over the nice barrier of 160kg. The weights are definitely feeling lighter in the hands. I might have to do some bicep work as biceps are starting to kill during bench but I think thats more to do with my buggered shoulder than anything.

Now Ive hit that milestone, I will be stopping 2 reps short of failure and concentrating on pushing my incline and dips.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 85x5, 100x5, 115x12 PM 161KGs NEW PR
> Incline Press: 70x10,8,6,6,6
> S/S Pendlay Rows: 77.5x6,6,6,6,6
> Dips: BWx16,11,10
> S/S Inverted Rows: 10,8,8
> 
> Awesome workout, cant ever complain with a PR and that puts my predicted max over the nice barrier of 160kg. The weights are definitely feeling lighter in the hands. I might have to do some bicep work as biceps are starting to kill during bench but I think thats more to do with my buggered shoulder than anything.
> 
> Now Ive hit that milestone, I will be stopping 2 reps short of failure and concentrating on pushing my incline and dips.


Well done on your session mate. In regards to Biceps, I think you bench narrow like me, I find the biceps takes a real hammering during heavy benches. It actually reiterates what we say about arm work, you dont need it becuase the Bench press trains them enough.

Lift on! :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Well done on your session mate. In regards to Biceps, I think you bench narrow like me, I find the biceps takes a real hammering during heavy benches. It actually reiterates what we say about arm work, you dont need it becuase the Bench press trains them enough.
> 
> Lift on! :thumb:


Wendler and Dave Tate do talk about training Biceps for Bench. Mine feel like they are going to tear off but I think its more the nerve getting compressed in my shoulder as the bicep pain is in exactly the same place.

Yep I bench narrow, ya it doesnt allow you to work the chest quite as much as a wide grip but far better for your shoulders and I would rather lift for 20-30years with heathy shoulders than 5 yrs with a slightly better looking chest.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Wendler and Dave Tate do talk about training Biceps for Bench. *Mine feel like they are going to tear off* but I think its more the nerve getting compressed in my shoulder as the bicep pain is in exactly the same place.
> 
> Yep I bench narrow, ya it doesnt allow you to work the chest quite as much as a wide grip but far better for your shoulders and *I would rather lift for 20-30years with heathy shoulders than 5 yrs with a slightly better looking chest*.


Mine feel worked hard during heavier bench work and dead benches.But I bench slow and controlled not explosive to keep things safer.

I agree, narrow is more difficult to progress from but shoulder health is very important IMHO, its a very delicate area.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 2

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 173.5KGX1 - 197KGX1 - 220KGX1* :thumb:

One of those days were I wasn't in the mood at all to lift and I mean I really didn't want to lift. Managed to force myself into the powerlifting room and decided to do singles and see how it went, the 220Kg went up I would say medium/Hard difficulty!! Strength is an odd thing! 

I have been reading, that for ultimate strength work sets of heavy singles is the way to go. After all, the traditional deadlift is a set of heavy singles with very little rest. But there is also caution because of recovery and possible increase in the chance of injury if heavy singles are used for too long (Micro tears not repairing and getting larger until they become injuries)

So that's twice ive deadlifted 220Kg, im tempted to use heavy singles just to get to 230Kg, but will use them with caution.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 2

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 139.5KGX5 - 158KGX3 - 176KGX1

DEAD SQUAT 142.5KGX1 - 145KGX1 - 147.5X1 - 150KGX1 - 152.5KGX1 - 155KGX1 - 157.5KGX1 - 160KGX1 - 162.5KGX1 - 165KGX1
*

Really nice workout, all work sets went up well and the dead squats were well within my limits, again not feeling the love to workout today and all went exceedingly well, not sure but I might have a slight virus/cold. didn't do the squat walkouts just as a precaution, I don't want to push my CNS and get a full blown  cold

As you can see I tried a different approach to my dead work, I'm trying to add structure to it so that I can progress/add weight and clearly see my progress, the 10X1 at the same weight seemed ok but a bit boring. I'm going to approach my dead bench in the same way.

:thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

*Flat Bench*
8x60kg, 8x70kg, 5x80kg, 5x90kg, 4x100kg, 2x110kg, 1x120kg - new true 1rm record :devil:

*Seated Miltary Press*
6x60kg, 6x60kg, 6x60kg, 6x60kg,

*Inc Bench*
12x50kg, 12x50kg, 12x50kg

*Front DB Raise*
6x25kg, 5x27.5kg, 6x27.5kg
*Front DB Raise Drop Set*
22x15kg, 11x10kg

*Side DB Raise*
12x12.5kg, 12x12.5kg, 12x12.5kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> *Flat Bench*
> 8x60kg, 8x70kg, 5x80kg, 5x90kg, 4x100kg, 2x110kg, *1x120kg - new true 1rm record* :devil:


Well done Lee, nice to see one rep maxes being posted, lift on mate! :thumb::devil:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Well done Lee, nice to see one rep maxes being posted, lift on mate! :thumb::devil:


Cheers buddy, well happy with that! 
Felt actually weak going into it, the leading sets felt a lot more difficult than they normally do so thought I had no chance of making the 120!


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 160x3, 170x2,2, 177.5x1,1,1
Deadlifts: 137.5x5,5,5,5,5
Roll-Outs: BWx6,5,4

Good workout, form is still slightly off on deadlifts but not to bad.


----------



## Bod42

Records Week
Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 150x3, 160x2, 167.5x5 PM 195.5kg PR :devil::thumb:
Squats: 135x4,4,4,4,4

Hit a record so happy with that. My legs were so strong but was my form that broke down and did the good morning to finish the last rep. Wasnt that knacered after i finished the set, was more form than strength I think but still a record none the less. Happy with 195kg and onwards to 200kgs.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Records Week
> 
> Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 150x3, 160x2, 167.5x5 PM 195.5kg PR :devil::thumb:
> 
> Squats: 135x4,4,4,4,4
> 
> Hit a record so happy with that. My legs were so strong but was my form that broke down and did the good morning to finish the last rep. Wasnt that knacered after i finished the set, was more form than strength I think but still a record none the less. Happy with 195kg and onwards to 200kgs.


 Awesome lift buddy, congrats on the pr!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 109KGX5 - 123KGX3 - 137.5KGX1

DEAD BENCH 86KGX1 - 98KGX1 - 109KGX1 - 112KGX1 - 115KGX1*

The virus and I are in disagreement, I want to train and the virus just says NO! Felt like utter crap, no energy, weak feeling and a bloody headache, still all that being said the workout was OK, the reps felt easy except the 137.5KGX1 wich went up, but wasn't a nice looking rep, actually it was F*****g ugly! I'll stay on the same weights for next week. Hopefully the virus wont effect my deadlift and squat workouts as much as today's.

New structured approach to the dead bench to help with motivation/progress, I'm definitely feeling consistently stronger on the first two work sets, but yet to really feel any carry over to my main work set.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Records Week
> Squats: 50x5, 85x5, 120x3, 135x2, 150x3, 160x2, 167.5x5 PM 195.5kg PR :devil::thumb:
> Squats: 135x4,4,4,4,4
> 
> Hit a record so happy with that. My legs were so strong but was my form that broke down and did the good morning to finish the last rep. Wasnt that knacered after i finished the set, was more form than strength I think but still a record none the less. Happy with 195kg and onwards to 200kgs.


Nice PM record James, your best progress in a long time, I bet your absolutely over the moon mate :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Nice PM record James, your best progress in a long time, I bet your absolutely over the moon mate :thumb:


Ya glad for my lower body lifts to be moving at last and it puts me on target for a 200kg squat and ultimate goal of 220kgs, no other reason than the fact 5 plates either side would be a cool squat :lol:

But saying that did have a set back last night. Hurt my shoulder working on the Quad Bike Tues night so this badly effected bench on Wed night so much so that I had to call time on the workout as couldnt feel my hand and I was just making it worse. I'm pretty sure its nerve and not muscular as just took some pain killers and its fine this morning, if it was muscle it woudl take more than a few hours to go back to normal. Still going to throw so bicep work in on the weekend just to see.

Before my shoulder gave up, I did hit another record.

Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 92.5x3, 105x3, 120x8 PM 152kg Rep Record for that weight
Incline Press: 70x10,10
S/S Pendlay Rows: 82.5x5,5

Please to hit reps of 120kgs as 120 has always been that weight where i start to struggle but feeling a lot better in the hands.

I might change my rows to normal rows to get the constant tension on my biceps as feel like its the sudden pull that makes them hurt and I dont have any constant tention back exercises in my program so can only help.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Before my shoulder gave up, I did hit another record.
> 
> Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 92.5x3, 105x3, 120x8 PM 152kg Rep Record for that weight
> Incline Press: 70x10,10
> S/S Pendlay Rows: 82.5x5,5
> 
> Please to hit reps of 120kgs as 120 has always been that weight where i start to struggle but feeling a lot better in the hands.


Nice lifts again James! :thumb:

Although you've now made my record of 120kgx1 look rubbish! :wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lifts again James! :thumb:
> 
> Although you've now made my record of 120kgx1 look rubbish! :wall:


No it is not rubbish Lee  And its easy for me to explain why :thumb:

1. Your routine is not aimed at pure strength, but it will help build great base strength and help with extra muscle mass.

2. James is a great powerlifter/strength athlete, so although he has done 120KgX8, his predicted maxes are just that and it is widely accepted that the higher the reps whilst using the formula the less accurate the predicted max is, however the predicted max formula is a very good tool for the smarter lifter.

From Wendler's 5/3/1

"How do you compare your 6-rep max to your 3-rep max? How do you know which one is better? Is your new 8-rep max better than your 2-rep max? I've used the following rep formula since high school. It's allowed me to assess where I am and see how my training has progressed without always having to take a true 1RM. *This formula is not necessarily an accurate predictor of your 1RM, but it affords you a good general way to gauge your progress.* Here it is: 
Weight x Reps x .0333 + Weight = Estimated 1RM 
The only constant in this formula is .0333."

This is not to take away from what James has accomplished either, he is a very *smart accomplished and knowledgeable lifter* and knows that an actual max lift is irrelevant as he does not compete (Neither do I). His approach will enable him to lift for many years. I lift heavy because its how I keep myself motivated, I learnt last year that the smarter approach just doesn't suite me as a lifter. Heavy makes me tick, smart makes James tick, neither is wrong or right, but we have both found a way to train that works for us for now, this will probably change as we mature as lifters or we may stay on the same programs, it doesn't matter as long as it helps you achieve your goals 

Lee. You are doing very well in your lifting, especially at your bodyweight, don't allow anyone take that away from you, least of all yourself :thumb:

I hope this has opened your eyes to your progress and keeps you motivated, either way, at least you turn up and train, millions don't. Remember this is your journey with the Iron, enjoy it! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ya glad for my lower body lifts to be moving at last and it puts me on target for a 200kg squat and ultimate goal of 220kgs, no other reason than the fact 5 plates either side would be a cool squat :lol:
> 
> But saying that did have a set back last night. Hurt my shoulder working on the Quad Bike Tues night so this badly effected bench on Wed night so much so that I had to call time on the workout as couldnt feel my hand and I was just making it worse. I'm pretty sure its nerve and not muscular as just took some pain killers and its fine this morning, if it was muscle it woudl take more than a few hours to go back to normal. Still going to throw so bicep work in on the weekend just to see.
> 
> Before my shoulder gave up, I did hit another record.
> 
> Bench Press: (WU 52.5x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 92.5x3, 105x3, 120x8 PM 152kg Rep Record for that weight
> Incline Press: 70x10,10
> S/S Pendlay Rows: 82.5x5,5
> 
> Please to hit reps of 120kgs as 120 has always been that weight where i start to struggle but feeling a lot better in the hands.
> 
> I might change my rows to normal rows to get the constant tension on my biceps as feel like its the sudden pull that makes them hurt and I dont have any constant tention back exercises in my program so can only help.


I'm sorry to hear your shoulder is playing up James, perhaps a slight de load to keep things safe? Having suffered injuries in the past, I do literally feel your pain and frustration. Keep at it mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 2

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 177KGX1 - 200.5KGX1 - 224KGX0

DEADLIFT 200KGX1X1X1X1X1

RDL (1 minute Rest between Sets) 130KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

An ok workout, totally ****ed up the 224KgX1, same as before, gave up as i lifted, so its all my own fault, half arsed approach to the lift :wall: DOH! 

Punishment for being a lame ass was 200Kg 5X1 :devil: which all went well so my base strength is improving very well.

Need protein!!!!!!!


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lifts again James! :thumb:
> 
> Although you've now made my record of 120kgx1 look rubbish! :wall:


Each to their own mate. And if I remember correctly, you are lighter than me and when I trained the rugby lads we always did a ratio of body weight. No point comparing 1RM for a 120kg prop vs a 75kg scrum half.

My max predicted bench is 161kg at 110kg bodyweight so thats only a 1.46 ratio. I'm sure you are above that. Also remember that I have near perfect build for bench pressing, short arms coupled with a thick upper body and strong triceps means small ROM and strong lockout.



ITHAQVA said:


> I'm sorry to hear your shoulder is playing up James, perhaps a slight de load to keep things safe? Having suffered injuries in the past, I do literally feel your pain and frustration. Keep at it mate :thumb:


Sounds strange but more annoying as its not a physical injury anymore, my RC, rear delts, laterals and shoulders are strong so Im sure its just nerve impingement. Makes you want to push through the pain but then you dont want to do damage. Its annoying as I'm at the stage where I'm PRing every week so need to ride those waves when they come as they dont come around often but again dont want to do damage. Oh well I suppose I have done this for years now, hit a small PR, deload for my shoulder to recover and work back up.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Each to their own mate. And if I remember correctly, you are lighter than me and when I trained the rugby lads we always did a ratio of body weight. No point comparing 1RM for a 120kg prop vs a 75kg scrum half.
> 
> My max predicted bench is 161kg at 110kg bodyweight so thats only a 1.46 ratio. I'm sure you are above that. Also remember that I have near perfect build for bench pressing, short arms coupled with a thick upper body and strong triceps means small ROM and strong lockout.


Cheers mate, I was 77.4kg this morning so that gives me a ratio of 1.55 then!


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 3 Cycle 2
> 
> *DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 177KGX1 - 200.5KGX1 - 224KGX0
> 
> DEADLIFT 200KGX1X1X1X1X1
> 
> RDL (1 minute Rest between Sets) 130KGX5X5X5X5X5
> *
> 
> An ok workout, totally ****ed up the 224KgX1, same as before, gave up as i lifted, so its all my own fault, half arsed approach to the lift :wall: DOH!
> 
> Punishment for being a lame ass was 200Kg 5X1 :devil: which all went well so my base strength is improving very well.
> 
> Need protein!!!!!!!


What mini weight plates do you use by the way Doug? At the moment my gym only has 1.25kg as the lowest meaning that I'm always having to round up on my lifts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> What mini weight plates do you use by the way Doug? At the moment my gym only has 1.25kg as the lowest meaning that I'm always having to round up on my lifts.


Hi Lee, I was lucky to have a friend who made loads of stainless steel plates (A few for me and a few for James )

Mini weights I have are 0.50 and 0.25, these are always in use and help with making my calculations as accurate as I would like them :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi Lee, I was lucky to have a friend who made loads of stainless steel plates (A few for me and a few for James )
> 
> Mini weights I have are 0.50 and 0.25, these are always in use and help with making my calculations as accurate as I would like them :thumb:


Yep still using mine over here in NZ thanks Doug :thumb:



Leebo310 said:


> Cheers mate, I was 77.4kg this morning so that gives me a ratio of 1.55 then!


Thete you go mate, pound for pound probably the strongest lifter in here. Nice work.

I'm just going to lose weight to improve my ratio now, well in 8 weeks anyway. Want to run my cycle twice more and then diet 10kgs


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Yep still using mine over here in NZ thanks Doug :thumb:


Always a pleasure mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 2

*FULL SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 143KGX5 - 162KGX3 - 181KGX1

SQUAT WALKOUT 220KGX1X1 210KGX1X1

DEAD SQUAT 145KGX1 - 150KGX1 - 155KGX1 - 160KGX1 - 165KGX1*

Good workout, the 181KGX1 didn't feel as low as normal, I'm certain it was at least parallel or a little below but I don't want doubtful reps. I want to go to each workout with certainty of the previous session being good (below parallel).so I'm going to re do this workout next week. This is were the weekly approach proves great for my motivation, in the 5/3/1 days I would have to wait another month. Probably also a good idea to video my form/depth on the last work set of my squat, then all the doubt will be removed :thumb:

The Squat walkouts felt heavy, so it goes to show that not doing them just for a few weeks has made a great deal of difference, the 220Kg didn't fly up as in the past sessions, i felt sluggish and slow. I will make effort to build back to 220Kg and keep doing them to maintain that feeling of a good base level of core Strength.

Had a play with dead squat weights to get a feel of this new structured approach, the 165Kg felt close to my max, not ideal doing them at the end of the workout, but I can always switch the order of these and the squat walkouts every week :thumb:

And yes I do not intend on doing these very low rep workouts indefinitely. I will go on how I feel, but ideally I would like to get to my one rep goals using this approach, but if I feel a bit broken I'll switch to a higher rep lower weight approach for a month then go back to low rep higher weight. All going well once the goals are reached I will then open up the rep and weight ranges, incorporating 5 and 10 rep assistance sets similar to BBB to add some extra conditioning, either way I'm trying to reach my goals but being mindful of the beating my body will take. Although my joints actually feel healthier doing the low rep work which sort of contradicts what I've read, any ideas why?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Not a new thing but after reading and watching some vids, something tells me that paused squats would help me more than the dead squat. Interest piqued! :thumb:

Check this guy out :devil: Russian power :devil:











Like the idea of high intensity low volume, because im a lazy lifter!


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x3, 172.5x2, 182.5x5 PM 213kgs
Deadlifts: 145x4,4,4,4,4

This equals what I hit before Xmas so hopefully this next month I can hit another PR on deadlifts.

The top set was hard which made the back off sets the slowest they have been yet but at least its with some decent weight now. All my lifts go up 7.5kgs this month so going to be hard work.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 52.5x5, 87.5x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 150x5,5,5
Squats: 115x8,8,8,8

Ok so i havent done a workout like this in a long time. The sort where I was trying to stop myself vomitting between sets and laying on the living room floor for 15mins after the workout. It was dam hard but I finished it. The weird thing is, it shouldnt have been that hard. I recon it was just a load of factors thrown into one that contributed to not being as strong as usual. Still got all my weights and still on target for that 200kg.

Soppose this is the one downfall of my prgramming this time. I am slowly dropping the reps on my record week so I have gone 5,5 then will go 4 and finish with 3 reps but left all my percenages the same, this means you are actually doing a higher percentage as your record week weight is higher. It means my predicted max is only increasing 3kgs per month but my work sets are increasing 7.5kgs, thats quite agressive as over 4 months they will go up 22.5kgs which is a big jump for multiple sets. Will have to see how next week goes but it should be fine.


----------



## Leebo310

*Dec Bench*
8x60kg, 8x80kg, 8x90kg, 5x100kg, 3x110kg, 3x120kg, 2x125kg, 2x132.5kg

*Dec Bench Drop*
12x90kg, 7x80kg, 7x70kg, 8x60kg, 8x50kg

*Seated Military Press*
20x40kg, 12x45kg, 7x50kg, 4x60kg

*DB Front Raise*
5x27.5kg, 5x27.5kg

*Incline Fly*
20x12.5kg, 15x15kg, 12x17.5kg, 8x20kg

*DB Side Raise*
20x7.5kg, 15x10kg, 12x12.5kg

Good workout, the 132.5kg went up easier than I thought it would which is always nice. Controlled clean reps.
Goal is ideally for a twice BW dec press by the end of the year (so around 155kg on current BW) and flat bench a 1.75xBW which is around 135kg. Obviously still a long way to go but I'm making good progress towards both of those.

Looking forward to squats tomorrow :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 4 Cycle 2

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 107KGX5 - 121KGX3 - 135KGX1

BENCH PRESS (1 Minute rest between sets) 110KGX1 - 115KGX1 - 120KGX1 - 125KGX1 - 125KGX0

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 110KGX3X3X3X3X3
*

Really nice workout, the 135KG went up nice steady and controlled :thumb:

I've changed from dead bench to just heavy bench singles as I want to get a better feel for heavy benching to hopefully help with my one rep max as i'm a little weak on the bench. Also it feels very good to get a full workout at higher percentages of my one rep max, i actually feel fatigued from tonight's workout :thumb:

Good to see you guys (James and Lee) lifting well :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Week 4 Cycle 2
> 
> *BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 107KGX5 - 121KGX3 - 135KGX1
> 
> BENCH PRESS (1 Minute rest between sets) 110KGX1 - 115KGX1 - 120KGX1 - 125KGX1 - 125KGX0
> 
> BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 110KGX3X3X3X3X3
> 
> *
> 
> Really nice workout, the 135KG went up nice steady and controlled :thumb:
> 
> I've changed from dead bench to just heavy bench singles as I want to get a better feel for heavy benching to hopefully help with my one rep max as i'm a little weak on the bench. Also it feels very good to get a full workout at higher percentages of my one rep max, i actually feel fatigued from tonight's workout :thumb:
> 
> Good to see you guys (James and Lee) lifting well :thumb:


Nice lift mate, seems it's only us three posting these days!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lift mate, seems it's only us three posting these days!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thank you kind sir :thumb:

The three Muscletears!


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Thank you kind sir :thumb:
> 
> The three Muscletears!


Haha!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

Well its good to have a 3rd mate, Doug and I have been here since the start.

We were ramdonly talking about what life will be like at 50 the other day and I said I will most probably still be lifting lol.

Bench: (55x5, 70x5, 80x3) 87.5x5, 102.5x5, 115x10 PM 153.5kg
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,6,7
Bent Over Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5
Y-W-T static holds between every pushing set.

Ok so had to drop the flatty off at his new car so trained late so this coupled with my shoulder pain it was supposed to be an easy quick pump workout nothing heavy, told myself i would use DBs and probably do some flyes but as you can see that didnt go to plan. I spent ages warming up, foam rolling, warming up the shoulder and RC and felt way better so thought I would work up to a weight that felt comfortable and rep it out but ended up doing my standard workout but just cutting the top set 2-3 reps short which is perfect really. 

The pain is definitely in my bicep which has always been caused by my shoulder BUT heres where Im getting confusd is the bicep pain is in both arms which means it cant be shoulder related. The pain is worse in my bad shoulder side though. But before the workout I walked the dog and did some chin ups on each lap and again this hurt my biceps so maybe it isnt my shoulder after all and actually is just strained biceps or something. Anyway I switched my workout around and didnt superset Inclines and Pendlay rows so I could have more rest between exercises. I also switched out pendlay for standard rows as its constant tension on the biceps and not a sudden shock, well i have to say these felt awesome, hitting completely different muscles than usual. Even though we only done 5x5, still got an awesome pump as we only had 30 secs rest.

All in all very happy with the workout considering my shoulders bad. Going to throw some arm work in at the weekends for a few weeks and see what happens.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Well its good to have a 3rd mate, Doug and I have been here since the start.
> 
> We were ramdonly talking about what life will be like at 50 the other day and I said I will most probably still be lifting lol.
> 
> Bench: (55x5, 70x5, 80x3) 87.5x5, 102.5x5, 115x10 PM 153.5kg
> Incline Bench: 70x10,10,8,6,7
> Bent Over Rows: 70x5,5,5,5,5
> Y-W-T static holds between every pushing set.
> 
> Ok so had to drop the flatty off at his new car so trained late so this coupled with my shoulder pain it was supposed to be an easy quick pump workout nothing heavy, told myself i would use DBs and probably do some flyes but as you can see that didnt go to plan. I spent ages warming up, foam rolling, warming up the shoulder and RC and felt way better so thought I would work up to a weight that felt comfortable and rep it out but ended up doing my standard workout but just cutting the top set 2-3 reps short which is perfect really.
> 
> The pain is definitely in my bicep which has always been caused by my shoulder BUT heres where Im getting confusd is the bicep pain is in both arms which means it cant be shoulder related. The pain is worse in my bad shoulder side though. But before the workout I walked the dog and did some chin ups on each lap and again this hurt my biceps so maybe it isnt my shoulder after all and actually is just strained biceps or something. Anyway I switched my workout around and didnt superset Inclines and Pendlay rows so I could have more rest between exercises. I also switched out pendlay for standard rows as its constant tension on the biceps and not a sudden shock, well i have to say these felt awesome, hitting completely different muscles than usual. Even though we only done 5x5, still got an awesome pump as we only had 30 secs rest.
> 
> All in all very happy with the workout considering my shoulders bad. Going to throw some arm work in at the weekends for a few weeks and see what happens.


Good to see your still able to lift well James :thumb:

However, I'm wondering if you need to take a full week off from training, thoses issues in your Biceps could and I mean could be an indicator that the micro tears are not recovering fully, with the high rep work you do mate your literally tearing yourself appart. I get the very same but on the heavy stuff, thats why when i feel i need it ill take a full week off alow the mucles to heal up. It's bro science but is any of it exact science anyway


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Good to see your still able to lift well James :thumb:
> 
> However, I'm wondering if you need to take a full week off from training, thoses issues in your Biceps could and I mean could be an indicator that the micro tears are not recovering fully, with the high rep work you do mate your literally tearing yourself appart. I get the very same but on the heavy stuff, thats why when i feel i need it ill take a full week off alow the mucles to heal up. It's bro science but is any of it exact science anyway


Only took a full week off not last week but the week before otherwise I would be inclined to say the same thing. It feels a lot better today so hopefully some constant tension work and a little bit of bicep work will help with the pain.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 152.5x2, 162.5x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 122.5x8,8,8,8
Roll Outs: BWx6,6,5
Some arm work.

This was a good workout, weight moved nice and fast especially on the 8 rep back off sets. More pleased than usual that this workout went well after nearly dying during Mondays Squat workout so means thats hopefully just a bad workout and the weights are correct. Will find out tonight though as Squats again with higher weights.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3,3,3,3
122.5x6,6,6,6,6

So pleased to get this workout under my belt after nearly dying last Monday. Spent a week wondering if some of my calculations were wrong or if I'm increased my weights to aggresively but nope the weights are perfect. This workout was hard but not once during the workout did I feel like I was going to fail and didnt have to grind any of the reps. That doesnt mean for a moment that it was easy, still a hard workout doing 9 work sets of squats but felt miles better than last week


----------



## Leebo310

*Decline Bench*

8x60kg, 8x80kg, 4x100kg, 3x110kg, 3x120kg, 2x125kg, 2x135kg

*Decline Bench Drop Set*

19x80kg, 8x60kg, 7x50kg, 9x40kg

*Seat Shoulder Press*

5x60kg, 5x60kg, 5x60kg

*Seat Shoulder Press Drop Set*

11x50kg, 8x40kg, 10x30kg

*Upright Cable Row*

20x45lb, 15x65lb, 12x75lb, 8x85lb

*Cable Cross High/Press Up Superset*

Happy to get a new PB predicted 1rm with the 135kg for 2. 
On the other hand my squat workout earlier in the week was so bad that I'm not even going to list it  
Felt weak going in and proved to be weak in the workout! Struggled on virtually every rep on all weights, don't know why. No pain or anything like that, just literally had no energy so am going to deload a bit and stick at 140kg for my top sets for a few weeks (because I like the look of having three plates on each side  )


----------



## Bod42

Lee what Ive found with weights this past year, especially lower body, is that its not 100% about putting weight on the bar. Lets be honest we all love putting that extra 2.5kgs on the bar every week looking at a black and white figure that shows were improving but Ive started to look at things a different way. Take your 140kgs as an example, you get 5 reps bleeding from your eyeballs its such a hard set but you stick to this weight for a few weeks/months until your throwing it around like its nothing and need hardly any rest. Yes the weight is still 140kgs on paper but have you got stronger.......of course you have. I'm starting to see a lot of merit to this type of training physically and mentally. This is how some of the strongest guys in the world train so cant argue with that. I also find its kind of self regulating, if your having a bad day you know your still going to get your 5 reps but they might be a slow grind but on a good day you can do the reps as fast and hard as possible so you are still getting a good stimulus even will less than your 5RM weight.

Bench: (WU 55x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 95x3, 107.5x3, 122.5x6 PM 147kgs
Incline Bench: 70x10,10,10,7
S/S Barbow Rows: 75x5,5,5,5,5

Bench is lower than usual as decided to leave 2 in the tank from now on. No point grinding out reps when my shoulder isnt the best. I had a birthday dinner to go to so had to cut Inclines short and only got 4 sets in. The weird thing is how weak my DOH grip is, I struggle with 75kg rows due to my grip, have to throw some dedicated grip work back into the mix again.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Good posting going on here guys, ill be back next week, ive been silly busy with IT projects at work and out :wave:

Cant wait to lift again though 

Lee, don't worry, your body and mind are influenced by so many factors its not even worth trying to figure them out, enjoy the ride.

From personal experience I would do some really heavy low rep work to get your CNS trained to lift heavier, then you can work on adding reps to gain strength endurance and add muscle. 

One thing I cannot get my head around is if pure strength is all about the CNS, how can higher reps contribute greatly to overall peak strength, in my mind these experienced lifters are already at a level were they can fire off the CNS to the required degree and the higher rep approach is just a way to stay in the game and of course there is this trend were powerliftiers want to be muscular as well, a lot of the big guys are on chemicals and therefore their training approach isn't for us non cheats.

Remember the higher the rep range the slower your progress in weight and once you get to a certain level your progress will also be slow and progress will go up and down. Peaks and troughs. 

The predicted one rep max calculator is supposed to lose accuracy after 5-8 reps.

Above all Lee, if you think it will work and your program is built around the fundamentals for your goals, it will work. It is ALL about your mental approach :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 152.5x2, 170x3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 132.5x6,6,6,6,6
Roll Outs: BWx5,5,5

Good wokrout, so nice to be throwing some decent weight (for me) around during the reps week. The multiple sets is definitely the way to go for me, I get the volume in but still keep the speed in there as its when I'm grinding reps that I dont progress.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 3

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 109KGX3 - 123KGX2 - 137.5KGX1*

Nice to be able to lift again, IT has calmed down and should stay that way for a good time now yes!!! 

Only doing first work sets on returning week to minimize DOMS, had a play with the reps to see if it made any difference, I would say nothing really noticeable, the 137.5 wasn't as clean as I would like so ill stick with the same weight. One thing I am definitely not fully engaging with the Bench Press as i do with the Deadlift and Squat, need to focus more. Still I have a good foundation of strength just need to start progressing now.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 152.5x3, 162.5x2,2, 170x1,1,1
Squats: 132.5x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, again pleased to be handling some decent weights. Its funny that doing all the heavy work and then after that doing 5x5, its quite a hard workout and the 175kg for max reps is gooing to be a killer next week.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 55x5, 70x5, 80x3) WO 102.5x5, 115x3, 127.5x4 PM 144.5kg
Incline Press: 70x10,10,10,7,5
Barbell Rows: 72.5x6,6,6,6,6
Dumbell Rows to hip: 17.5x10,10,10
Double Band Face Pull, External Rotation & Y press: 0# band x 10,10,10
Band Pull Parts: 0# band x100

So a bad bench day, 4 reps isnt to bad but shoulder really does feel like someone is driving a nail through my bicep on every rep which is getting annoying. My body actually shut my lift down on Inclines as well, loads of strength, going well then just bang drop the weight on the safeties as body muust have sensed I was going to injure myself or pain level was to high. Also my form was terrible tonight but I think that was me mentally trying to get away from the pain.

Anyway, you will see from my workout that I have increased my pulling volume quite substanially. I am also doing 100 band pull aparts every single day. Been doing a lot of reading and it will be a nerve as Ive always thought so need to do more upper back work to pull the scapular back and give my nerve more space.

On another note, anyone who cant feel Dumbell Rows, try rowing to your pocket instead of straight up, really concentrate on pulling back at an angle, makes a serious difference to the way you work your back. Even doing it without a weight you can feel how much harder your back and lat contracts.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> So a bad bench day, 4 reps isnt to bad but shoulder really does feel like someone is driving a nail through my bicep on every rep which is getting annoying. My body actually shut my lift down on Inclines as well, loads of strength, going well then just bang drop the weight on the safeties as body muust have sensed I was going to injure myself or pain level was to high. Also my form was terrible tonight but I think that was me mentally trying to get away from the pain.
> 
> Anyway, you will see from my workout that I have increased my pulling volume quite substanially. I am also doing 100 band pull aparts every single day. Been doing a lot of reading and it will be a nerve as Ive always thought so need to do more upper back work to pull the scapular back and give my nerve more space.


Hope you get this sorted soon James.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 3

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 170KGX3 - 193KGX2 - 215KGX1

230KGX0 :wall: *

After the main work sets I tried 230Kg and failed, but it did go up further than ever before (1 foot of the ground then back down )

I've been experimenting with different rep ranges to see if I can put in one more set, but no matter what I do it seems that after 3 warm up sets and 3 work sets my peak strength is spent. Now this may seem like a daft question but it doesn't say anything about this in the 5/3/1 book. Is the program designed the way it is because after going through the 3 warm up then 3 work sets your peak power is reduced? I somehow suspect it is.
I know from experience after the above I can easily do 5X1 sets with 200KG. But Im sure as I go to around 210KG failures will ensue.

Im trying to find the best approach so i can make my goal, without burning out. I've tried - 5/3/1, 3/2/1 and 1/1/1. From the 3/2/1 to 1/1/1 i didn't notice any difference, but from the 5/3/1 to the 3/2/1 i did feel like I had more power left for the final 1 rep max but still not enough for an extra set. That is for the deadlift.

I've also experiment with rest times but cannot come up with anything conclusive. After 5 minutes or so I don't feel any difference, even though after doing some research this doesn't mean your CNS is fully recovered for the next lift.

So I'm going to trial 3/2/1 further with 5 minute rest intervals between the work sets for both the squat and Bench press :thumb:

I'm really enjoying this experimental stage in my lifting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 3

*FULL SQUAT = REALLY?????  (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 143KGX3 - 162KGX2 - 181KGX0 just above parallel!!! :wall::wall::wall::wall: *

Had major DOMS in my back and my core was shot before I even started, however I don't feel that a valid reason for today's awful workout. I doubt if many of the reps were full. As I've progressed my feel for full depth has become higher and higher. I did notice that the heavier the weight the more I allow my core to go down rather than my legs.

So what to do to force myself into a full squat HMMMM. I'm wondering if I should use pause squats as my primary lift, this would ensure my full compliance!  And then I would be 100% certain of my squat depth :thumb: It may seem an odd way to train, but I have over the years constantly struggled with the squat, my primary fear of injury has well gone, now its my instinct that kicks in as i get close to parallel, that feeling of being out of control and going down and not being able to complete the rep - The fear of failing or possibly the fight or flight mechanism deep within my psyche.

Now you may be forgiven for thinking i'm very disappointed but I'm not, using the paused squat will once and for all force me to go full depth in the squat, yes progress might be slower but the end result will be exceptional confidence in the bottom part of the squat :thumb: And do i bloody need it!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hope you get this sorted soon James.


Did loads of reading over the weekend. So basically it is my low bar squats causing the problem, Dave Tate, Donnie Thompson amoung others talk about this problem and its due to flexibility and the Infraspinatus muscle. So Im now doing upper back work every day and working on my flexibility. I have squats tonight so will do a really intense warm up and flexibility before i get under the bar. It stems from me trying to drive my elbows forward to stop the bar moving when straining on a lift so I know not to do this anymore and should get it sorted.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 152.5x2, 167.5x3, 175x2,2, 185x1,1,1
Deadlifts: 142.5x5,5,5,5,5
Roll Outs: BWx6,5,5

I sound like a broken record this week but just nice to use some heavy weights in my workouts, just a nice feeling in my hands.

I feel the strongest Ive ever been but I just checked my records and I squatted 170kg for 3 reps last May and tonight I need to get 175kgs for 4 reps. Ya its progression but its dam slow progress. I suppose if I can keep that rate of 10kgs per year up then I will be in a good position in a few years. Actually I would hit my goal of a 220kg squat in 2 years.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3, 167.5x2, 175x4 PM 198.5kg PR!!!!
Squats: 140x4,4,4,4,4

Got my 4 reps which is the target I was aiming for so stoked with that.

With my shoulder, made me smile last night as this is exactly why we weight lift, hitting problems and over coming them. So its low bar squat causing the problem and driving my elbows forward trying to stop the bar moving. So last night I pulled the bar backwards and down which had a nice side effect of tensing my lats which makes you feel a lot tighter, this was miles better for my shoulder and didnt have any negitive effect on my lifting, if anything it could have actually improved it. The 175 felt light when i unracked it as i was so tight, so much so that I had to look left and right and ask if we loaded the weights properly, this always fills you with confidence before a lift.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3, 167.5x2, 175x4 PM 198.5kg PR!!!!
> Squats: 140x4,4,4,4,4
> 
> Got my 4 reps which is the target I was aiming for so stoked with that.
> 
> With my shoulder, made me smile last night as this is exactly why we weight lift, hitting problems and over coming them. So its low bar squat causing the problem and driving my elbows forward trying to stop the bar moving. So last night I pulled the bar backwards and down which had a nice side effect of tensing my lats which makes you feel a lot tighter, this was miles better for my shoulder and didnt have any negitive effect on my lifting, if anything it could have actually improved it. The 175 felt light when i unracked it as i was so tight, so much so that I had to look left and right and ask if we loaded the weights properly, this always fills you with confidence before a lift.


Nice lift buddy and glad the shoulder is doing better! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 4

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 107KGX3 - 121KGX2 - 135KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 130KGX1 - 125KGX1 - 120KGX1 - 115KGX3 - 115KGX3

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 110KGX3X3X3X3X3
*

Got to be one of the Best bench sessions I've had for a while, all reps were nice and smooth. On the second work set the 120KG felt well within my capabilities so instead of going too light I stuck with the 115KG for a couple sets of 3. I feel as though this is about as intense as I can train andf im sure im going to feel this for a day or two 

I did try to do two reps of the 135KG but just couldn't get the bar much further than a few inches of my chest


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 140x2, 157.5x3, 167.5x2, *175x4* PM 198.5kg PR!!!!
> Squats: 140x4,4,4,4,4


Nice one James, glad your feeling the love for the iron mate :thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 4

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 172.5KGX3 - 195.5KGX2 - 218.5KGX1

DEADLIFT 201KGX1 - 201KGX1 - 201KGX1 - 201KGX1*

Good workout, but i'm getting a bit lazy as i get stronger and my back was a little more rounded than I would like on the 218.5KgX1 :wall:
I am also at a level were I need to be a bit more mindful of which days I train, I still felt fatigued from yesterdays Bench session, so next week I'll try to train Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday or Sunday. Still overall very happy with my lifting, just need to sort my squat out and that will make me much happier :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench: (WU 55x5, 70x5, 82.5x3) WO 90x5, 102.5x5, 117.5x9 PM 152.5kg
Incline bench: 70x10,10,10,7,7
Rows: 77.5x5,5,5,5,5
Dumbell Rows to Pocket: 17.5x12,12,12
Triple Threat Band RC work: Yellowx12,12,12

So pleased to get back on track with bench, well sort of, didnt feel like my bicep was going to tear tonight and watching Donny Thompsons videos has helped a lot. Never been comfortable forcing my shoulder but its strong enough now so its about time I started pushing that external rotation and it must work as I could Bench. 9 reps is nothing special for me but to do it 90% pain free is a good thing.

Still finished the workout with loads of Upper back and RC work which gave an incredible pump. Also doing 100 Band Pull aparts at work everyday now which seems to be helping. Good fun now my order from America arrived with all the Iron Woody Bands, they are a different level from anything else.

To anybody who doesnt feel one arm DB rows in their back, try taking a lighter weight and rowing to your pocket instead of straight up and hold at the top for a 1-2 count, massive pump.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 2 Cycle 4

*PAUSE SQUAT (WU 60X1 80X1 90X1) - 112.5KGX1 - 127.5KGX1 - 142.5KGX1

Squat testing for depth/strenth ect... 150X1 - 160X1 - 170X0FAIL!*

bought myself a second hand iPhone (£25! Result! :thumb:) to record my squat sessions and sort out my failing once and for all :thumb:

First thing noticed: As it has been mentioned online countless times the time you think your pausing is generally shorter than it actually is, for me my pause was intended to be one second but in reality it was just a momentary pause at the deepest part of the lift. I think I should strive for at least one second before increasing weight.

Secondly: My perception of depth is WAY off! On every video I basically went parallel or just under. I squat with a just wider shoulder stance and seem to be struggling as my legs touch and there seems no way to go lower.

Thirdly: I am a terrible squatter I failed at 170KG, although I'm pretty sure I can build up to in a short time.

Pics of today's form/depth = Not good!

80Kg









90Kg







[/URL][/IMG]

112.5Kg







[/URL][/IMG]

142.5Kg







[/URL][/IMG]

160Kg







[/URL][/IMG]

The 90Kg pic is the most positive squat of the day and the depth I'm looking to be consistent at and work up to 200Kg.

This is a major lesson learned for myself, use the technology. I will be recording all my work sets from now on and work at increasing my depth/flexibility as I progress and I will be very hard on myself in regards progress, if it isn't below parallel it wont count! :thumb:

sorry there is no pic of 150Kg, the Phone fell over 

I would welcome any and all criticism as I really need to sort my squat out :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Nice use of technology there Doug. My flatmate just videoed me the other day and was really pleased to see my depth was well below parallel.

I still think you should revisit your training plan of when you were progressing on squats and if I remember squatting 190kgs+. I still find 1 rep training is an expression of strength not a way to train strength. You dont have to go high rep like Juggernaut as you like training heavy but 3-5 is where its at for a natural lifter which Im sure you were doing when you hit your 190kg+ squats.

With regards depth its easier to get depth when the lower leg is closer to verticle. Just imagine the angle you've creating now and keep that angle exactly the same but make the lower leg more verticle. Suddenly the upper leg is pointing down more. I know your wearing olympic shoes which are designed to allow that lower leg to go forwards easier but then this is why a lot of powerlifters wear chucks as their flat and allow you to sit back more. Neither is wrong, just what you prefer. From years of Box squatting and training more towards sports, I like to see the lower leg more verticle so your sitting back more and therefore using more of the posterior chain.

I think your form is fine though Doug, just look at revisting the 3-5 to train strength, not display it.

What sort of warm up & mobility work do you do?


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Nice use of technology there Doug. My flatmate just videoed me the other day and was really pleased to see my depth was well below parallel.
> 
> I still think you should revisit your training plan of when you were progressing on squats and if I remember squatting 190kgs+. I still find 1 rep training is an expression of strength not a way to train strength. You dont have to go high rep like Juggernaut as you like training heavy but 3-5 is where its at for a natural lifter which Im sure you were doing when you hit your 190kg+ squats.
> 
> With regards depth its easier to get depth when the lower leg is closer to verticle. Just imagine the angle you've creating now and keep that angle exactly the same but make the lower leg more verticle. Suddenly the upper leg is pointing down more. I know your wearing olympic shoes which are designed to allow that lower leg to go forwards easier but then this is why a lot of powerlifters wear chucks as their flat and allow you to sit back more. Neither is wrong, just what you prefer. From years of Box squatting and training more towards sports, I like to see the lower leg more verticle so your sitting back more and therefore using more of the posterior chain.
> 
> I think your form is fine though Doug, just look at revisting the 3-5 to train strength, not display it.
> 
> What sort of warm up & mobility work do you do?


I think using the phone for all my sets will ingrain the correct feeling of a true good squat and just by taking away the doubt it will be an invaluable tool for my progress :thumb:

I agree and disagree on the reps, I think you can use any rep scheme and progress within the bounds of that rep range, I have the mind set for heavy low rep training and I've always struggled with the alien feel of my single reps, more heavy single rep training will give me better form and confidence for the single reps because of the extra single rep work.However I do agree that's once I'm settled in how I'm going to train I will need to add a group of sets at 3 reps and a group of sets at 5 or 10 (BBB) After years on the 5/3/1 I got so bored of the monthly progress. I had to do something to reignite the flame, last years fooling around with lighter weights higher reps just drained my enthusiasm totally. I am after all primarily in this for strength now, I'm big enough TBH.

As for depth, I'm thinking what you say is right 100%. There is the possibility that the Olympic shoes are not helping as they bring the lower leg forward due to the elevated heel, I've always squatted bare foot and felt incredibly secure. I used the shoes as a placebo to get me back into squatting without the fear of re injury, which is now gone thanks to them. I now just have the usual fear of being out of control when going to depth as do many lifters. Next squat session I'm going bare foot and see just how different my lower leg position is and if i go deeper in the hole bare foot :thumb: if I feel better bare foot, the Oly shoes can be sold off  Perhaps the only thing that was truly holding me back was me. But I have admitted to that on multiple times  And If I have to use psychology against my self to succeed so be it 

I must admit after looking at the pictures a few times, yes James my form isn't that bad, considering training on my own and making numerous mistakes on my squat I have to say I'm pleasantly surprised with the consistency of most of the pics, but that doesn't take away the fact my squat needs serous progress this year and I need to buck up on it :thumb: I squatted 200kg once FFS, I shouldn't be such a coward and allow a few injuries put me off from going heavy again :thumb:

Warm ups consist of foam roll 20 times on both calves, both quads and both hamstrings on both deadlift and squat days followed by the three warm up sets as per 5/3/1. The single rep session just gone was just me trying to find a good starting place for my squat again.

Do you have any good advice for my mobility when squatting and dead lifting?

Thank you for your excellent advice James, as I've always said your a smart lifter and I appreciate your advice tremendously :thumb:


----------



## WHIZZER

Chaps keep an eye out we have a competition coming to win some protein drinks


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I think using the phone for all my sets will ingrain the correct feeling of a true good squat and just by taking away the doubt it will be an invaluable tool for my progress :thumb:
> 
> I agree and disagree on the reps, I think you can use any rep scheme and progress within the bounds of that rep range, I have the mind set for heavy low rep training and I've always struggled with the alien feel of my single reps, more heavy single rep training will give me better form and confidence for the single reps because of the extra single rep work.However I do agree that's once I'm settled in how I'm going to train I will need to add a group of sets at 3 reps and a group of sets at 5 or 10 (BBB) After years on the 5/3/1 I got so bored of the monthly progress. I had to do something to reignite the flame, last years fooling around with lighter weights higher reps just drained my enthusiasm totally. I am after all primarily in this for strength now, I'm big enough TBH.
> 
> As for depth, I'm thinking what you say is right 100%. There is the possibility that the Olympic shoes are not helping as they bring the lower leg forward due to the elevated heel, I've always squatted bare foot and felt incredibly secure. I used the shoes as a placebo to get me back into squatting without the fear of re injury, which is now gone thanks to them. I now just have the usual fear of being out of control when going to depth as do many lifters. Next squat session I'm going bare foot and see just how different my lower leg position is and if i go deeper in the hole bare foot :thumb: if I feel better bare foot, the Oly shoes can be sold off  Perhaps the only thing that was truly holding me back was me. But I have admitted to that on multiple times  And If I have to use psychology against my self to succeed so be it
> 
> I must admit after looking at the pictures a few times, yes James my form isn't that bad, considering training on my own and making numerous mistakes on my squat I have to say I'm pleasantly surprised with the consistency of most of the pics, but that doesn't take away the fact my squat needs serous progress this year and I need to buck up on it :thumb: I squatted 200kg once FFS, I shouldn't be such a coward and allow a few injuries put me off from going heavy again :thumb:
> 
> Warm ups consist of foam roll 20 times on both calves, both quads and both hamstrings on both deadlift and squat days followed by the three warm up sets as per 5/3/1. The single rep session just gone was just me trying to find a good starting place for my squat again.
> 
> Do you have any good advice for my mobility when squatting and dead lifting?
> 
> Thank you for your excellent advice James, as I've always said your a smart lifter and I appreciate your advice tremendously :thumb:


Doug not saying your training is right or wrong, just saying take a look back through the logs of when you squatted 200kgs and see what you were doing. It got you there once, it will most probably get you there again. But I agree I was the same with the monthly progress on 5/3/1 as if you miss a weight, you basically miss the entire month and it puts you off. I agree with the high rep stuff as well, I was very underwhelmed by the Juggernaut program due to the high reps but we both know theres a big difference between 8-10 reps and 3-5 reps, especially 3 reps that still gives you that nice heavy feeling.

How about reading Beyond 5/3/1 again Doug and looking at the Joker sets, this will get the volume in with the 5+, 3+ or 1+ weeks but then you get to work up to heavy siingles afterwards. If you dont like the monthly progress then you could just choose the 3+ week with Joker sets.

You still squat low bar dont you Doug? I know it doesnt make that much difference but that few inches does change the mechanics and angles of the body throughout the squat. Olympic lifters use the shoes to increase lower leg angle so they can keep their upper body very vertical and they predominantly high bar squat. With low bar squat, your upper body is more angled forwards so your lower leg is less angled and therefore I think Oly shoes have the opposite effect of what you want. Picture paints a thousand words as they say.

She is actually wearing Oly shoes in this picture but I still think flat shoes make sitting back easier.

While you have the camera, as well as form, check the bar path compared with the centre of your foot to see if it dead verticle thorughout the rep like on the picture. Most people lose the bar over their toes.

But as usual think your being to hard on yourself Doug. Still doing well and form looks good. Just being pedantic lol.

With mobility I do either of these before every lower body workout. 
Defrancos 



I couldnt do Cossack Squats to start with but can now do them perfectly so shows how mobility does improve. They hurt like hell the first time as well lol.

Eric Cressey Warm Up option 1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/ryvmygc8cuaenb7/Maximum.Strength.EC (Warm Up Pages).pdf?dl=0

Nice read as well. http://ericcressey.com/should-you-wear-olympic-lifting-shoes


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug not saying your training is right or wrong, just saying take a look back through the logs of when you squatted 200kgs and see what you were doing. It got you there once, it will most probably get you there again. But I agree I was the same with the monthly progress on 5/3/1 as if you miss a weight, you basically miss the entire month and it puts you off. I agree with the high rep stuff as well, I was very underwhelmed by the Juggernaut program due to the high reps but we both know theres a big difference between 8-10 reps and 3-5 reps, especially 3 reps that still gives you that nice heavy feeling.
> 
> How about reading Beyond 5/3/1 again Doug and looking at the Joker sets, this will get the volume in with the 5+, 3+ or 1+ weeks but then you get to work up to heavy siingles afterwards. If you dont like the monthly progress then you could just choose the 3+ week with Joker sets.
> 
> You still squat low bar dont you Doug? I know it doesnt make that much difference but that few inches does change the mechanics and angles of the body throughout the squat. Olympic lifters use the shoes to increase lower leg angle so they can keep their upper body very vertical and they predominantly high bar squat. With low bar squat, your upper body is more angled forwards so your lower leg is less angled and therefore I think Oly shoes have the opposite effect of what you want. Picture paints a thousand words as they say.
> 
> She is actually wearing Oly shoes in this picture but I still think flat shoes make sitting back easier.
> 
> While you have the camera, as well as form, check the bar path compared with the centre of your foot to see if it dead verticle thorughout the rep like on the picture. Most people lose the bar over their toes.
> 
> But as usual think your being to hard on yourself Doug. Still doing well and form looks good. Just being pedantic lol.
> 
> With mobility I do either of these before every lower body workout.
> Defrancos Joe DeFranco's "Limber 11" (flexibility routine) - YouTube
> I couldnt do Cossack Squats to start with but can now do them perfectly so shows how mobility does improve. They hurt like hell the first time as well lol.
> 
> Eric Cressey Warm Up option 1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/ryvmygc8cuaenb7/Maximum.Strength.EC (Warm Up Pages).pdf?dl=0
> 
> Nice read as well. http://ericcressey.com/should-you-wear-olympic-lifting-shoes


Many thanks James, loads of info for me to go over. Thank you very much for putting time in mate  :thumb:

Yep, I got so fed up with monthly progress or should I say fed up with knowing one fail and the whole month needed doing all over again, so frustrating.

I haven't squatted low bar for many years, I did the 200Kg high bar and found that once i got used to high bar i felt more stable, the low bar had exactly the same effect on me as in the pics and i couldn't get deep into the squat. Great idea to use the phone for taking vid of bar path :thumb::thumb: And next session will be bare foot.

I'm on the mobility info now, will try some tonight and see how they feel :thumb:

Hopefully next squat session will be more like it, bench tonight :thumb:

Thanks for your feedback and support mate :thumb::thumb::thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

The Defranco Vid is great mate, it reminds me of what I used to do, looks like I need to relearn. I think last year messing with lighter weights caused me to allow myself to get into some bad habits.

Could either warm up routines be also done on off days or do you believe that would be too much? 

Once again, thank you for reminding me what I used to do and that I just got stupid over the lat 12 months :tumbleweed:  

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Power clean
20, 40, 60kg x 3 x 3

Deadlift
20, 40, 60, 80 x 5 x 3
100kg x 5 x 2

BOR
20, 40, 50 60kg x 6 x 2


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 4

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 109KGX3 - 123KGX2 - 137.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 131KGX1 - 126KGX1 - 121KGX1 - 116KGX3 - 116KGX3

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 80KGX10X10X8
*

Nice! :thumb:

The 137.5 wasn't as clean as I want it so ill keep at the same weight until I feel the reps are good enough to add weight.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Many thanks James, loads of info for me to go over. Thank you very much for putting time in mate  :thumb:
> 
> Yep, I got so fed up with monthly progress or should I say fed up with knowing one fail and the whole month needed doing all over again, so frustrating.
> 
> I haven't squatted low bar for many years, I did the 200Kg high bar and found that once i got used to high bar i felt more stable, the low bar had exactly the same effect on me as in the pics and i couldn't get deep into the squat. Great idea to use the phone for taking vid of bar path :thumb::thumb: And next session will be bare foot.
> 
> I'm on the mobility info now, will try some tonight and see how they feel :thumb:
> 
> Hopefully next squat session will be more like it, bench tonight :thumb:
> 
> Thanks for your feedback and support mate :thumb::thumb::thumb:


If you high bar then the shoes should be fine. It could simply be down to mobility so spend a month working on that and sure your depth will improve. Jim Wendler even suggests doing Defranco 11 warmup every single day. Wait until you do the SMR Glutes (lax ball), now they are painful lol.

I think the squat to stands from Eric Cressey are awesome as well, I get everyone on those as you pull yourself down and push your chest through as hard as possible and it stretches every muscle to do with the squat.

I cant even do a squat workout properly without doing my mobility work, just doesnt feel right.


----------



## Bod42

Ok so I will start by saying that constantly pushing your body to the limit does take its toll on you, especially when its high volume. In the past few weeks I have had these injuries: 
Shoulder - hopefully Ive mostly sorted with mobility work
Biceps - Think this links in with the shoulder problem.
Left knee - Old golf injury that seems to hurt when I deadlift. Was quite painful sunday but woke up Monday morning pain free
Right scapular - driving to work monday morning, literally stretched and something went pop, couldnt turn my head, straighten it or move it even a few mm without serious pain. Had to sit there all day with my chin basically on my chest which was fun. It loosened up a little and allowed me to squat Tues even if it was painful.

Injuries are annoying but I dont see this as a bad thing, its your bodies way of telling you something isnt quite right. Why did my shoulder and biceps hurt, because my mobility sucked.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 152.5x2, 170x3, 180x2, 190x4 PM 215.5kgs PR!!!!
Deadlifts: 152.5x4,4,4,4,4
Ab Roll Outs: BWx6,5,5

Another PR so obviously pleased with that. But my eye is just on next month when I have to pull 200kg for 3 reps :devil: I havent ever deadlifted 200kg so to do it for 3 reps will be awesome and a nice milestone to hit.

Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 155x5,5,5
Squats: 117.5x8,8,8,8

Killer workout. The higher reps just kill me and coupled with my upper back and neck being extremely painful it made for a hard workout. But it only hurt when unracking the weight, once you start your reps you forget about the pain as you have more important things to concentrate on. Please to get this workout out the way as this was the one I was most dreading.


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: (WU 55x5, 70x5, 82.5x3) WO 97.5x3, 110x3, 125x5 PM 146kgs
Incline bench: 70x10,10,10,9,6
Barbell Rows: 75x6,6,6,6,6
DB Rows to Hip: 17.5x12,12,12
Triple Threat Band Work: Yellowx12,12,12

Crap workout but what do I expect really, my scapular is still hurting and that deals with shoulder stability so never going to do that well at heavy weights. Its sort of pointless what I'm doing, why force through an injury when your not going to make progress when you may as well suck it, take some time off, do your rehab and come back stronger.

On a plus note thats a record on inclines and the DB rows couples with band work took 80% of my shoulder pain away so this is definitely the right direction.


----------



## eibbor

My first workout I feel I should post. Not long started the 5x5 routine but last nights workout felt great.
Squat (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 75x5,5,5,5,5

Overhead press (WU 20x10 25x10 25x10) WO 35x5,5,5,5,5

Deadlift (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 80x5

So as I'm still relatively new to the routine I've been trying to nail my form and last night, every lift felt great. 
My OHP and DL my form is usually a bit shaky but it all came together! 
Hope to post more often here. Every lift is now a PB for me


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Leebo310

eibbor said:


> My first workout I feel I should post. Not long started the 5x5 routine but last nights workout felt great.
> Squat (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 75x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Overhead press (WU 20x10 25x10 25x10) WO 35x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 80x5
> 
> So as I'm still relatively new to the routine I've been trying to nail my form and last night, every lift felt great.
> My OHP and DL my form is usually a bit shaky but it all came together!
> Hope to post more often here. Every lift is now a PB for me
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hey buddy, welcome! Always nice to see someone else joining this thread!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> My first workout I feel I should post. Not long started the 5x5 routine but last nights workout felt great.
> Squat (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 75x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Overhead press (WU 20x10 25x10 25x10) WO 35x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Deadlift (WU 40x10 50x10 60x10) WO 80x5
> 
> So as I'm still relatively new to the routine I've been trying to nail my form and last night, every lift felt great.
> My OHP and DL my form is usually a bit shaky but it all came together!
> Hope to post more often here. Every lift is now a PB for me
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Welcome to our little piece of paradise and pain  :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 4

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3 ) - 176KGX3 - 199KGX2 - 222.5KGX1 = PR! :thumb:

DEADLIFT 200KGX2 :devil: 200KGX1 - 200KGX1 - 200KGX1 - 200KGX1

RDL (1 minute Rest between Sets) 135KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Felt knackered at the start and thought this was going to be a fail workout. But for some reason after completing the 199KgX2 I was fired up and my energy picked up considerably and I ended up with a nice PR on the 222.5KGX1 :thumb: 

So after all that decided to carry on and do 2 reps at 200KG on the first set of my secondary assistance set, all felt dam good, very pleased with this workout. I just need to nail my squat and bench press now.

:thumb:


----------



## eibbor

ITHAQVA said:


> Welcome to our little piece of paradise and pain  :thumb:





Leebo310 said:


> Hey buddy, welcome! Always nice to see someone else joining this thread!


Thank you. Been viewing this thread since I joined. It's actually because of this thread I'm on the 5x5 program!
Always looking for tips and any extra exercises, stretches etc. Going to watch the vids posted back a page. Starting to feel quite tight on days I'm not lifting.

Almost squatting and deadlifting my body weight (89kg) that has been my number one target since starting. Can't wait to pass it.


----------



## Bod42

Welcome mate, always good to see more people in here. 5x5 is awesome, everyone get sput on the program to begin with by me, women, guys, old, young.

Nice Deadlift Doug, Ive read from an experienced lifter once (cant remember his name) that if you feel on top of the world walking into a workout then go home but if you feel sluggish then it will be a good lifting day. Very strange but does seem to work.

After all my injuries I am now ill so having a bad few weeks so will be missing Deadlifts tonight which I hate.


----------



## Leebo310

Awesome lift Doug 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Welcome mate, always good to see more people in here. 5x5 is awesome, everyone get sput on the program to begin with by me, women, guys, old, young.
> 
> Nice Deadlift Doug, Ive read from an experienced lifter once (cant remember his name) that if you feel on top of the world walking into a workout then go home but if you feel sluggish then it will be a good lifting day. Very strange but does seem to work.
> 
> After all my injuries I am now ill so having a bad few weeks so will be missing Deadlifts tonight which I hate.


Thanks James :thumb:

I really feel for you FFS, you were on to lift 200Kg this week too 

Rest well and heal mate :thumb:



Leebo310 said:


> Awesome lift Doug
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks Lee, little bit sore this morning. I was going to put up the video of the lift, but I was so happy making the lift all you see is me lifting. I forgot to pick up the phone to show all the weights on the bar :wall: so bit pointless really :wall:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Just gone through Joe DeFranco's "Limber 11" (flexibility routine)






Many thanks for the link to this James, all felt good and I even managed to do Cossack squats dynamic style but the only thing is as soon as i concentrated on getting my toes to point up i started to lose balance lolz! 

My biggest issue seems to be while performing the piriformis stretch, I can go about half way and no further. Joe seems able to almost touch his leg! I'll investigate this further, but at least this has given me a good indicator of were my inflexibility lies :thumb: Possibly i need to lose some guts? 

I used my knobbly foam roller for the glute massage instead of the ball :devil::devil::thumb:

Here is a great link to the routine with a printable log and pics if you want to make up a document for use while training, I find this makes it easier to follow while your learning the routine until it becomes second nature :thumb:

Linky: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/limber-11-the-only-lower-body-warm-up-youll-ever-need.html


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 3 Cycle 4

*PAUSE SQUAT (WU 70X5 90X5 110X3) - 112.5KGX3 - 127.5KGX2 - 142.5KGX3

PAUSE SQUAT 150KGX1 - 150KGX1 - 150KGX1

PAUSE SQUAT (3 minute Rest between Sets) 100KGX5X5X5*

So, I tried bare foot today and a few things changed.

1. Felt no better no worse.Although bare foot allows you to have a wider stance in comfort.

2. Perception of depth is different, I had to work harder to maintain parallel and below.

3. All my reps today were parallel or just below, but I did notice throughout all my videos that my depth was more consistent :thumb:

4. Perception of time in the hole is still very different from reality 

5. Tried the limber 11 and TBH felt less ready than my own foam rolling routine which I didn't understand 

I tried a part of the pause squat routine from Juggernaut and really liked it so i'm thinking of taking a huge de load and using it as my primary to build my squat strength out of the hole.

Goes like this:
Week 1 3x5 @50% (100Kg)
Week 2 3x4 @60% (120Kg)
Week 3 3x3 @40% (140Kg)

I'll think about this and see :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I hold the power rack while doing my Cossack Squats, can concentrate on the stretch rather than balance in that case.

With the piriformis stretch i do them more like the guy in the BB link, arches lower back, sit straight up and then lean forwards maintaining that spine angle but you cant get very far forwards like this. One of the things to check is balance side to side.



ITHAQVA said:


> 5. Tried the limber 11 and TBH felt less ready than my own foam rolling routine which I didn't understand


The first time you do it will probably make you feel weaker as its strething muscles your not used to but in the future should make you feel better.

Deadlifts:70x5, 100x5, 137.5x3, 157.5x2, 167.5x5,5,5
Deadlifts: 127.5x8,8,8,8,8
Roll Outs: BWx6,6,5

Ok so I wasnt going to workout because I'm ill and its starting to get to my chest so figured a heavy deadlift session really wouldnt help my recovery but........... I opened the garage to work on the quad and my house mate had just started so rude not to join him. Hard to get through the workout but got through it all.

Doug Ive got to wait a few weeks yet before record week but its looking good so far. Im actually hoping to beat the goal of 200kgs for 3 reps, 4 reps would be awesome.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I hold the power rack while doing my Cossack Squats, can concentrate on the stretch rather than balance in that case.
> 
> With the piriformis stretch i do them more like the guy in the BB link, arches lower back, sit straight up and then lean forwards maintaining that spine angle but you cant get very far forwards like this. One of the things to check is balance side to side.
> 
> The first time you do it will probably make you feel weaker as its strething muscles your not used to but in the future should make you feel better.
> 
> Deadlifts:70x5, 100x5, 137.5x3, 157.5x2, 167.5x5,5,5
> Deadlifts: 127.5x8,8,8,8,8
> Roll Outs: BWx6,6,5
> 
> Ok so I wasnt going to workout because I'm ill and its starting to get to my chest so figured a heavy deadlift session really wouldnt help my recovery but........... I opened the garage to work on the quad and my house mate had just started so rude not to join him. Hard to get through the workout but got through it all.
> 
> Doug Ive got to wait a few weeks yet before record week but its looking good so far. Im actually hoping to beat the goal of 200kgs for 3 reps, 4 reps would be awesome.


I'll try holding the rack :thumb:

Same here, but I do want to increase my flexibility so don't mind rounding my back. I think my flexibility or lack of is a contributing factor in my squat depth.

Definitely made me feel weaker, but I plan to keep at it for a few weeks before judging its effectiveness 

Keep going for it James, you've been lifting for five years, it will give you a tremendous boost once you move up to 200Kg and beyond. I'm the same, yes my squat at the moment isn't great, but my deadlift is 227Kg this week, IF successful, next week i'm on 230Kg, which would mean goal achieved. But it doesn't matter how much we all lift, just that we have goals to reach/challenge and motivate :thumb: Personally I cant wait to be lifting 230Kg. It will allow me to then put more focus on my Squat and Bench :thumb:

Personally I think you should be lifting some maxes. Projected maxes are all well and good, but think about it, we all know PM's are just a guide, you don't know for sure what your real max is. You could for instance be actually able to lift more than your PM's, imagine how that would change your training, how motivating would that be. And besides it will allow you to make your training maxes more accurate.

Me personally, I find the PM formula to always work out heavier than I could actually lift. I agree this is more likely psychological than physiological. but either way I'm not psychologically equipped to lift that PM weight. That is why I have found lifting heavy low rep the only way I can progress.

My phone is proving to be an amazing tool for form checking, why the hell didn't i do this earlier? :wall::wall:

Anyhow mate, I hope you recover soon and start smashing those weights again :devil::devil:


----------



## Bod42

Ok so another derailment of my training happened last night. you wouldnt think it but one of the things that hurts my shoulder is Golf. Anyone who knows the Golf swing knows that you need a certain amount of external rotation from your right shoulder to allow for the lag, well my shoulder doesnt have any external rotation but is forced into this position when your swinging at 110+ mph. The result was me ending up in a serious amount of pain, I mean a 8-9 out of 10, dripping with sweat, turning white, trying not to throw up and at a driving range lol.

Anyway I will be dropping all bench work for the time being and going back on my shoulder rehab program but will still continue to squat and deadlift.

In better news, I have decided to enter the Defranco SB911 contest after I hit my records so will be completely changing my training around and concentrating on Fat Loss as after all the contest is about looks at the end of the program. Will be fun to completely switch up my lifting and I find it so much easier to diet when someone else has written the program for you.


----------



## eibbor

All was going good this week, started lifting barefoot last week but tonight after squatting 83kg 5,5,5,5,5, i started to set up for bench. While bending over to lift the empty bar onto the rack to begin a warm up I had huge back pain and could hardly stand up, lots of pain down my leg.
Workout stopped and headed home for an ice pack. Have previous back pain problems but they seemed to disappear when I started lifting.

The only thing I noted that happened in this workout, when warming up 60kg squats, I hit the safety bar at the bottom on one side and it knocked me off balance on the way up. But I re-racked, moved the safety bars down a notch and started again.
Think I hit the bar due to going barefoot and getting deeper in the squat.
Very frustrated as my form has felt great and was well on track to squat and deadlift my body weight next week, my main goal I set once I started.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> All was going good this week, started lifting barefoot last week but tonight after squatting 83kg 5,5,5,5,5, i started to set up for bench. While bending over to lift the empty bar onto the rack to begin a warm up I had huge back pain and could hardly stand up, lots of pain down my leg.
> Workout stopped and headed home for an ice pack. Have previous back pain problems but they seemed to disappear when I started lifting.
> 
> The only thing I noted that happened in this workout, when warming up 60kg squats, I hit the safety bar at the bottom on one side and it knocked me off balance on the way up. But I re-racked, moved the safety bars down a notch and started again.
> Think I hit the bar due to going barefoot and getting deeper in the squat.
> Very frustrated as my form has felt great and was well on track to squat and deadlift my body weight next week, my main goal I set once I started.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I would get those safety bars down low enough so that you never touch them during the lowest part of the squat, i used to use them as a guide for depth, silliest thing i ever did. And apparently hitting the safeties with the bar is a common cause of back injuries. Hope you get better soon mate :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Ok so another derailment of my training happened last night. you wouldnt think it but one of the things that hurts my shoulder is Golf. Anyone who knows the Golf swing knows that you need a certain amount of external rotation from your right shoulder to allow for the lag, well my shoulder doesnt have any external rotation but is forced into this position when your swinging at 110+ mph. The result was me ending up in a serious amount of pain, I mean a 8-9 out of 10, dripping with sweat, turning white, trying not to throw up and at a driving range lol.
> 
> Anyway I will be dropping all bench work for the time being and going back on my shoulder rehab program but will still continue to squat and deadlift.
> 
> In better news, I have decided to enter the Defranco SB911 contest after I hit my records so will be completely changing my training around and concentrating on Fat Loss as after all the contest is about looks at the end of the program. Will be fun to completely switch up my lifting and I find it so much easier to diet when someone else has written the program for you.


Not good mate 

As you have trained using theoretical 1RM (Projected max) for five years, I would say your focus on lifting heavy weights doesn't come across as your priority so why not train with lighter weights? A good 10 rep BBB style program may suite you better? :thumb:

Injuries are horrible and terribly frustrating I hope you have a speedy recovery mate :thumb::thumb::car::thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Not good mate
> 
> As you have trained using theoretical 1RM (Projected max) for five years, I would say your focus on lifting heavy weights doesn't come across as your priority so why not train with lighter weights? A good 10 rep BBB style program may suite you better? :thumb:
> 
> Injuries are horrible and terribly frustrating I hope you have a speedy recovery mate :thumb::thumb::car::thumb::thumb:


My priority is still heavy lifting but this is one of the only things that we dont agree on. I think 1RMs are a sign of strength and do little to nothing to train and grow your strength, I think strength is gained in multiple sets of 3-5 rep range. I think a hard 3RM gives you a good indication of 1RM while still inducing a training response and takes away some of the injury risk. The top guys in the world barely ever hit a 1RM outside of competitions, they use the rep method to build muscle and strength. The natural guys, even when maximum strength is their number 1 goal still do hypertrophy phases consisting of multiple sets of 10 reps, more muscle gives you a higher chance of adding strength.

I have been doing BB work on bench for years, havent hit hard 3-5reps, always been 8-12 reps but its just buggered really lol. I need to start focusing on work that is going to help it. Its definitely instability of the joint as it hurts when I throw but its so hard to find someone who will actually look at the way I move and tell me which direction to go. You watch all these experts online saying look at this guy, his Traps are over active or he's hyper extended etc but finding one of these epxerts proves vert difficult, thats whats starting to frustrate me. I'm quite happy to put the work in but need to know if stretching it out and doing the rehab exercises I'm doing is actually helping. Also deadlifting really helps with the pain so that proves that its a stability issues as deadlifts train the small muscles in behind the shoulder blade.

I'm definitely going to add hanging every day to my program as theres a massive amount of info on how good these are for shoulder health.

My Shoulder rehab program normally puts my shoulder right anyway, just need to keep it up once Ive done the intense 4 weeks. I'm also going to add foam rolling and stretching of all front muscles while getting a massage to relax the back muscles which I'm hoping will help a lot as will take away the pressure.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 100x5, 137.5x3, 157.5x2, 177.5x3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 137.5x6,6,6,6,6

Good workout, pleased to hit all my reps but was hard work.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1 Cycle 5

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 109KGX3 - 123KGX2 - 137.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS 132KGX1 - 127KGX1 - 122KGX1 - 117KGX3 - 117KGX3

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 80KGX10X10X10X6
*

Very nice workout all the weights felt good, I'm getting used to his heavy style and dont feel overly fatigued tonight :thumb:

The 137.5 was good enough to progress :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 160x3, 170x2,2, 177.5x1,1,1
Squats: 137.5x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout but man are these workouts getting hard. The back off sets used to be just some volume and getting a pump, now they feel like an entire workout on their own but suppose I am doing 11 work sets during this workout so it is a lot of volume.

That 177.5 is actually the most weight I've squatted so nice to hit something like that. Ive done 175 for 4 reps but the 177.5 is the most Ive had on the bar. Still on target to hit the 162.5x3 which is a predicted Max of 201kgs. Starting to throw some decent weight around these days, this program has definitely been the best program I have ever done.


----------



## shycho

Bod42 - would you mind throwing up / linking to the program you're currently working on? Apologies for not reading through the entire thread but your workout seems quite different to 5x5 as I know it.


----------



## Bod42

shycho said:


> Bod42 - would you mind throwing up / linking to the program you're currently working on? Apologies for not reading through the entire thread but your workout seems quite different to 5x5 as I know it.


I can throw up the link to my spreadsheet no worries but the program I have designed is kind of in the between Intermediate/Adavanged territory. 5x5 is a program to get you from beginner to the Intermediate stage so depends where you are right now.

Basically 5x5 is medium volume, high intensity, high frequency.
My program is high volume, high intensity, low frequency. The problem with my program is if you try and force it then you can burn out which is actually what Ive done trying to chase a 200kg squat and 220kg deadlift, been knacered for 2 weeks but dont want to pull back even tho I know I should as I only have 1 week left before records week.

Let me know where you are with your training and I can throw up the link.

Doug & I started this thread as 5x5 but peoples training has evolved right through all sorts of programs. So far I think we've tried. (Add in any Ive missed)
All 5/3/1 programs
Juggernaut
GZCL
Maddog
Starting Strength
Defranco - Built to Last
Paul Carters - Base Building
Paul Carters - Maximum Muscle Mass
And next I will be running Defranco SB911.

Oh and sorry for long reply to simple request lol.


----------



## shycho

Cheers for the lengthy reply. 

From what you've said I think the standard 5x5 routine is going to be fine for me to start with. Just recently got myself a power rack / squat stand and an olympic bar for the garage gym, after spending the last 9 months limited to a york bench and 40kg weights. 

Based on my lifts over the last couple of weeks I believe my bench/squat/deadlifts are currently around the 60kg-70kg range. Hence me thinking the standard 5x5 is fine while I continue to steadily improve this. 

Hope you guys don't mind me gate crashing the party with my fairly new arrival to lifting.


----------



## Bod42

More the merrier.

5x5 definitely sounds like its the right program for you especially if youve got your own power rack.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 100x5, 137.5x3, 157.5x2, 172.5x3, 182.5x2,2, 192.5x1,1,1
Deadlifts: 147.5x5,5,5,5,5

Good workout, having a lighter wed for a few weeks has definitely improved my recovery and this workout felt the best in quite awhile. Hitting the 192.5 puts me on target for my record week next week.


----------



## eibbor

So my physio seen me on Monday and sorted me out. Back is still a bit sore she said that another session in a week and I should be fine. Back went because of tight muscles I believe, so perhaps not stretching properly!
The physio I have is a thai woman who is a sciatic nerve and back specialist, she works wonders as I could barely walk all weekend!
She mentioned to me that I should be wearing a belt when lifting so I now have a few questions to ask:

When should a belt start getting used? And what exercises should it be worn during? I'm on the 5x5 routine.
When deadlifting, when should I use the grip I see people in the gym using, with one palm in amd one out?
Finally, while I'm resting my back, what is safe for me to do in the gym? hate not lifting! 
Thanks guys! I'll reach my targets eventually 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> So my physio seen me on Monday and sorted me out. Back is still a bit sore she said that another session in a week and I should be fine. Back went because of tight muscles I believe, so perhaps not stretching properly!
> The physio I have is a thai woman who is a sciatic nerve and back specialist, she works wonders as I could barely walk all weekend!
> She mentioned to me that I should be wearing a belt when lifting so I now have a few questions to ask:
> 
> When should a belt start getting used? And what exercises should it be worn during? I'm on the 5x5 routine.
> When deadlifting, when should I use the grip I see people in the gym using, with one palm in amd one out?
> Finally, while I'm resting my back, what is safe for me to do in the gym? hate not lifting!
> Thanks guys! I'll reach my targets eventually
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


From my own personal experience.

My goals are pretty low, 150kg bench, 200kg squat and 230kg deadlift. If your goals are the same or below I would say never wear a belt. Reliance on a belt can cause weakness in your core.

The alternative grip is recommended imho. But james and I stayed on double overhand grip up to 130-140 kg to help build grip strength.

Unfortunately if you are following any good program you'll find core strength plays an important role on all your compound lifts. So I cannot advise, but if your back problem was caused by soft tissue problems (muscle) I would say follow tbe Bill starr rehab, it works!

Above all its very difficult to advise, however there are some excellent videos on the starting strength site I think about how the top level lifters and coaches repair injuries.

Hope you recover soon mate :thumb:


----------



## eibbor

ITHAQVA said:


> From my own personal experience.
> 
> My goals are pretty low, 150kg bench, 200kg squat and 230kg deadlift. If your goals are the same or below I would say never wear a belt. Reliance on a belt can cause weakness in your core.
> 
> The alternative grip is recommended imho. But james and I stayed on double overhand grip up to 130-140 kg to help build grip strength.
> 
> Unfortunately if you are following any good program you'll find core strength plays an important role on all your compound lifts. So I cannot advise, but if your back problem was caused by soft tissue problems (muscle) I would say follow tbe Bill starr rehab, it works!
> 
> Above all its very difficult to advise, however there are some excellent videos on the starting strength site I think about how the top level lifters and coaches repair injuries.
> 
> Hope you recover soon mate :thumb:


When I hurt my back a week ago my squat was 83kg so nowhere near as heavy as 150 but a PB for myself all the same.
Core strength is what was mentioned when I hurt my back previously a few years ago and was told to squat, squat and squat! I thought that compound lifts built my core too or should I work on that seperately? 
Always had problems with my piriformis especially on my right side.
Thanks for the advice I will look into both sites.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

I agree with Doug, I never let any of the guys Ive trained wear a belt, you dont wear a belt on the rugby pitch so why would you train your muscles to reply on a belt. No one uses a belt properly anyway. People pull them stupidly tight for support but your actually suppose to leave it loose for something to push your abs out into but better to train mind muscle connection to do this.

Backs during squats are usually to do with setup as your holding it static throughout the lift. Try and pull the bar downwards imagining bending it over your shoulders when your setting up. Sounds counter productive pulling down when you want the bar to go up but it will tighten all your back muscles and also give you a better shelve for the bar.

When I seriously hurt my back as a teen (thats what got me into the gym in the first place) back extensions were my savior. I will tell you how I fixed mine and the minimum healthy back tests I do with people but where did you hurt your back?

I basically do Back/Hyper Extensions for high reps and static holds. The test is holding the 2nd picture below for 2 mins, this tests the endurance of your back and its been proven that back endurance not strength is the main indicator of Back health. You can do these for sets of what ever you can manage and work the reps up. Dont do these like the idots in the gym who just throw themselves up, do them very controlled with a 2 sec count at the top nof every rep.




As Doug said with the grip, the one in, one out is called a mixed grip. This just lets you lift heavier weights as the bar cant roll out of your hands but its better to stay with double over hand grip as long as possible. I basically warm up to about 120kgs with DOH and then switch to mixed grip for my main work. If you dont have any problems with grip strength then stick with DOH.


----------



## Bokers

1) Yes you want to do more to improve your core, always. It does improve using compound lifts but you don't want it to be a limiting factor.

2) No belt. There are a few points that can contribute to you squatting properly. 

I personally see:

#1 as warming up properly. DO NOT STRETCH! You want a shortening / active warmup routine, not just standing there pulling yourself apart, lengthening everything. I use Chris Duffin's squat warmup and also his squat queues. Find his youtube channel kabukiwarrior. I'm sure some others have used his stuff also.

#2 Improper technique. Use Chris' videos again to see what that's about. Sitting down inbetween your legs, not over extending your lower back and so on.

And #3 Training load / recovery. Keep it in the sweet spot for your chosen reps /sets. 5x5 is usually around the 70% of your max for example. This works well to allow progression, doesn't over tax the CNS and allows for ample recovery. So make sure you're not lifting too much too often or the opposite. Also make sure you've got good nutrition too. A good PWO shake/meal and quality food all day helps massively.

While this might be over the top, I hope it helps 

Oh and finally... If you want to stay double overhand, try hook grip. That's what I use for my DLs


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> When I hurt my back a week ago my squat was 83kg so nowhere near as heavy as 150 but a PB for myself all the same.
> Core strength is what was mentioned when I hurt my back previously a few years ago and was told to squat, squat and squat! I thought that compound lifts built my core too or should I work on that seperately?
> Always had problems with my piriformis especially on my right side.
> Thanks for the advice I will look into both sites.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


1. You can hurt yourself badly picking up something light just as you can picking up a heavy item. I have used my goals to give you a good idea as to were you can go without a belt as a guide. In fact IF I chose to go heavier than them I would still advocate no belt. A belt is a crutch and can create weakness. Weakness is not what you want when the time comes to lift heavy. James and I are belt less lifters and I think we always will be. We like to lift 100% RAW.

2. IMHO core strength should be trained using compounds, the body works as a whole unit, I believe you should train as a whole unit.

3. Core strength is everything in lifting :thumb:

4. Recovery is everything, sleep is incredibly important.

5. The actual lifting is probably the least important factor of lifting :thumb:

6. If you do have a genuine piriformis soft tissue injury then the Bill star rehab is the thing for you. But you must ensure it is a muscle problem. The BS rehab is for muscle repair only due to its approach to working the injured area and flushing blood through it to speed up a quality repeair. Unsure if you know but I tore a hamstring with 200Kg on my back, in less than 3 weeks i was squatting 180Kg using the BS rehab :thumb: So i can tell you it works :thumb:

7. Muscle injuries can be felt for years after due to the CNS firing fibers off around the area to protect it. Google this and learn more for your own info.

8. At your level it wouldn't hurt to start again with an empty bar to gain confidence. Psychology is a big part of lifting.

Above all I would decide what it is your trying to achieve.

So my question to you is it you want to get from lifting? Once you tell us we can help guide you down the right path and save you a lot of time :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> When I seriously hurt my back as a teen


That will be both of us then mate 

James your just like a young me


----------



## eibbor

ITHAQVA said:


> 8. At your level it wouldn't hurt to start again with an empty bar to gain confidence. Psychology is a big part of lifting.
> 
> Above all I would decide what it is your trying to achieve.
> 
> So my question to you is it you want to get from lifting? Once you tell us we can help guide you down the right path and save you a lot of time :thumb:


The psychology is a good point. Lying in bed last night I was trying to think how I would feel again squatting with weight. 
The main thing I want is strength, and the shape that comes with it. The 5x5 suits my work life perfectly. Don't want to spend days and days in the gym doing isolation exercises the compound exercises feel good.
Not sure how heavy I would like to go yet, my first target is bodyweight 89kg so wasn't far away last week. Unsure if I would like to be up in the 200kg target zone, as I don't want to be 'massive' in size. What size are you guys?
All in all I want to be a clean, strong, healthy lifter. I started this routine to actually alleviate my back pain and it was working, almost 4-5 months and I had zero back pain apart from the usual soreness sometimes.

So much educated, experienced posts here I thank you all

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

eibbor said:


> The psychology is a good point. Lying in bed last night I was trying to think how I would feel again squatting with weight.
> The main thing I want is strength, and the shape that comes with it. The 5x5 suits my work life perfectly. Don't want to spend days and days in the gym doing isolation exercises the compound exercises feel good.
> Not sure how heavy I would like to go yet, my first target is bodyweight 89kg so wasn't far away last week. Unsure if I would like to be up in the 200kg target zone, as I don't want to be 'massive' in size. What size are you guys?
> All in all I want to be a clean, strong, healthy lifter. I started this routine to actually alleviate my back pain and it was working, almost 4-5 months and I had zero back pain apart from the usual soreness sometimes.
> 
> So much educated, experienced posts here I thank you all
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Strength is easy TBH but as you lift more the psychology will be the deciding factor on your success. Today I tried my 227Kg X 1 and failed, it didn't feel heavy but two family members have been diagnosed with terminal cancer and it was a constant distraction today, in the end i decided to walk out of the gym room as distractions can also lead to frustration - injuries - and the spiraling negativity that goes with it etc...I will just de load back to 222.5Kg (Last weeks good lift) And work back up again.

As for getting massive, not a hope in hell, don't believe all the hype sorry LIES! I hear this one all the time "I don't want to get too big" . You will not get that big as a natural lifter end of. The big lean guys are enhanced with multiple chemicals. I am at the moment 17 stone 4 at 5' 10-11", yes i'm a big guy but i'm also around 20% bodyfat. If you can build up to around 105Kg bodyweight with a sub 15% body fat you'll look impressive believe me (I'm assuming your around my height) If your taller the harder it will be for many reasons.

Natural lifters tend to look like they don't lift unless they are reasonably lean/low bodyfat. The sport industry doesn't want you to know this. Imagine how many people would stop going to the gyms, buying equipment and supplements. So think of the industry as it is, just in it to take money away from you. There are some exceptions but the majority of us mortals will just look biggish. All those adds with muscular men and women with the perfect tans and abs ect raise expectations, yes possible but you have to have the utmost determination, hence why abs are a rare thing.

The 5x5 may be all you need, you can get reasonably strong with it and it is a very good simple way to build muscle and lean up a bit with calorie control. Protein is important for growth but more importantly for recovery and try not to be fooled by the protein requirements spouted by many sites, taking 300 gram plus of protein a day is a waste (You'll see if your overdoing it, your pee will foam in the toilet :doublesho - that's protein being flushed out) Strength and muscle size are not as relative as also spouted by the internet. If you check out YouTube you'll see many average sized guys lifting some really heavy weights. Strength is mainly about the CNS and a little to do with muscle mass.

I have condensed this for ease of reading. Hope it helps :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

As others have said mate, I would avoid the belt as I don't think the actual lifting are what's causing your pain anyway. 
The fact it was a "one off" pain suggests you've tweaked something and need to address it, rather than using a belt to effectively hide the issue going forward. Personally I think belts can be used to good effect and have their place, just not in this case. 
I wouldn't worry about actual numbers of kg for your goals either as its all relative to your body weight and what your current max lifts are. 
As long as you're progressing thats the main thing. 

In answer to your other question, I currently weigh 77kg. Squat true max is 155 on the bar for 3, and bench is 122.5 for 1. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

eibbor said:


> The psychology is a good point. Lying in bed last night I was trying to think how I would feel again squatting with weight.
> The main thing I want is strength, and the shape that comes with it. The 5x5 suits my work life perfectly. Don't want to spend days and days in the gym doing isolation exercises the compound exercises feel good.
> Not sure how heavy I would like to go yet, my first target is bodyweight 89kg so wasn't far away last week. Unsure if I would like to be up in the 200kg target zone, as I don't want to be 'massive' in size. What size are you guys?
> All in all I want to be a clean, strong, healthy lifter. I started this routine to actually alleviate my back pain and it was working, almost 4-5 months and I had zero back pain apart from the usual soreness sometimes.
> 
> So much educated, experienced posts here I thank you all
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The nice things about the 5x5 program is its quite agressive loading in that you add weight nice and fast. So even if we said go back to 20kgs to get confident again, you would be back hitting records really fast. You add 30kgs per month on 5x5 but I know me and Doug are happy if we add 2.5kgs per month.

There is a lot to goal setting but theres also a lot to a more relaxed way of weightlifting. Now when I say relaxed I dont mean lazy but your just beginning so make it a goal to workout 3 times per week, work hard while your in the gym and enjoy your time outside the gym and see where you are in 3-6 months. Ive seen people get to 200kgs on 5x5, Ive seen people get to their Bodyweight, all depends on recovery, workrate, etc.

One of my best mates got to a point that hes happy with and just stayed there. He got to 130kgs for 5x5 and now he just does that, he can go in the gym bang it out easily and leave. Funny thing it was a struggle when he first started doing this but now its easier with less rest so even though theres the same weight on the bar, he has definitely got stronger. This is a good way of the average person lifting to be fair, dont put so much pressure on yourself.

Just set short term goal, squat BW for example and then once you smash that one then just come up with another goal.

What I love about 5x5 is it is totally autoregulating so you can stay on it longterm and it will change depending on your recovery etc.


----------



## shycho

First day officially on 5x5 for me.
Squat: 20kg 5x5
Bench Press 30kg 5x5
Bent Over Row 30kg 5x5

Felt odd going back to the lighter weights, but will follow the plan as intended and just focus on form for the first few weeks.


----------



## eibbor

shycho said:


> First day officially on 5x5 for me.
> Squat: 20kg 5x5
> Bench Press 30kg 5x5
> Bent Over Row 30kg 5x5
> 
> Felt odd going back to the lighter weights, but will follow the plan as intended and just focus on form for the first few weeks.


Felt strange for me too. But now I'm back doing light weight again due to injury

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

Dont let it get in your head guys, you add 30kgs per month so if you follow a 12 week program then you will be squatting 110kgs that quickly.


----------



## Leebo310

*Dec Bench*
8x60kg, 5x100kg, 5x105kg, 3x110kg, 3x117.5kg, 6x125kg (new predicted 1rm of 150kg )

*Dec Drop Set*
21x80kg, 11x60kg, 10x50kg, 9x40kg

*Incline Bench*
12x60kg, 8x70kg, 8x70kg

*Front Raise Rope*
Cluster set - 5 reps with a 3 second negative movement, rest for 15 seconds then repeat for 4 minutes in total

*Seated/Standing DB Side Raise Superset*
12x7.5kg, 12x7.5kg, 12x7.5kg


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 165x1, 172.5x1, 182.5x3 PM 200.5KGs
Squats: 145x4,4,4,4,4

So I hit my target of 200kgs. So happy but in some ways disappointed in myself as I didnt go for a 4th rep, yes the 3rd rep was a grind but I should have still attempted a 4th rep. Anyway its still a 200kg Squat and thats a seriously nice milestone to hit. Only 20kgs from my lifelong goal of 220kgs now, just something about having 5 plates on each side when you squat.

Next is the Deadlift record attempt.


----------



## shycho

Great work guys, some serious effort put in there.

Day 2 in the books for me.
Squat: 22.5kg 5x5
Incline Press 22.5kg 5x5
Dead lift 40kg 1x5

Lack of height in my garage means I can't go for the usual over head press so have substituted in an incline press instead.


----------



## eibbor

shycho said:


> Great work guys, some serious effort put in there.
> 
> Day 2 in the books for me.
> Squat: 22.5kg 5x5
> Incline Press 22.5kg 5x5
> Dead lift 40kg 1x5
> 
> Lack of height in my garage means I can't go for the usual over head press so have substituted in an incline press instead.


I had to move gym as I would have put the plates through the foam tiles once they were 10kg+

Forgive me if I'm wrong but would an incline press work chest rather than shoulders?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## shycho

eibbor said:


> I had to move gym as I would have put the plates through the foam tiles once they were 10kg+
> 
> Forgive me if I'm wrong but would an incline press work chest rather than shoulders?


I thought so too, but the incline is minimal and reading around this seems like a suitable alternative, and it certainly gave the shoulders a work out but will see how I progress.

EDIT: Although it's a machine, this probably best represents the angle I'm working with:


----------



## JMorty

I would agree with this.

The less angle the more the shoulder is used and the less chest is used.


----------



## Bod42

shycho said:


> Great work guys, some serious effort put in there.
> 
> Day 2 in the books for me.
> Squat: 22.5kg 5x5
> Incline Press 22.5kg 5x5
> Dead lift 40kg 1x5
> 
> Lack of height in my garage means I can't go for the usual over head press so have substituted in an incline press instead.


I have the same problem in my gym, actually had to cut a few inches off my rack just to fit it in. I just do seated shoulder press without the back support now when I do it.


----------



## shycho

Day 3 done and dusted
Squat: 25kg 5x5
Bench Press 32.5kg 5x5
Bent over row 32.5kg 5x5



Bod42 said:


> I have the same problem in my gym, actually had to cut a few inches off my rack just to fit it in. I just do seated shoulder press without the back support now when I do it.


Will give that a try next time out. Fortunately my was garage is just tall enough for the rack, but not for much elsewhere.


----------



## Bod42

I even had to put the pull up bar on upside down lol.

Deadlifts: 60x5, 100x5, 137.5x3, 157.5x2, 177.5x1, 187.5x1, 200x3 PM 220kgs

So I hit all my goals for this program but glad to be finished as the last few weeks were brutal, way to much intensity coupled with volume meant I was absolutely knackered. 

But that means I finished with
Squats: 200.5kgs
Deadlifts: 220kgs
Bench: 161kgs

These are predicted maxes so take them with a pinch of salt. The Squats and Deadlifts were done for 3 reps so confident that I could get these 1 rep maxes but dont think my shoulder would hold up to the Bench 1 rep max.

Shed load of back work in the next program so hopefully this will strengthen up my shoulder.


----------



## shycho

Day 4 in the books
Squat: 27.5kg 5x5
Incline Press 25kg 5x5
Dead lift 45kg 1x5


----------



## shycho

Day 5 in the books guys
Squat: 30kg 5x5
Bench Press: 35kg 5x5
Barbell Row 35kg 5x5

Weight still feels pretty comfortable, so really trying to nail my form at this stage.


----------



## shycho

How it going guys?

Day 6 is done and dusted for me.
Squat: 32.5kg 5x5
Incline press: 27.5kg 5x5
Deadlift 50kg 1x5

As mentioned before sticking with the incline press for now as I feel it's hitting my shoulders adequately, but will change it up if progress stalls.


----------



## Bod42

So first workout of my completely new program. I actually paid for Defranco's SB911 program. When I'm dieting I like to have my programs written for me as that way I dont mess with it, its written in black and white and I just have to get in and do it.

Close Grip Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 95x3, 107.5x2, 115x5, 102.5x8
Wide Grip Dumbell Push-Ups: BWx20,12,10,8
Bent-Over Dumbell Rows: 37.5x12,12,12,12
S/S Iso-hold Y-W-T's: BWx20,20,20,20 secs
Dead-Stop Lateral Raises: 7.5x12,12,7,6
S/S Single Arm Barbell Curls: 0x5,4,4,4

Realy enjoyed this workout and the back work supersetted with static hold back work made my shoulder feel brilliant. This workout has back work in every workout so should be great for shoulder health. The volume was also a nice change.

I've also entered Defranco's transformation contest, why not really, its free and gives me a goal and challenge to work towards. My goal is to be 99kgs in 11 weeks time. I'm currently 111kgs, actually I was last Monday, after 1 week I'm 108.1kgs so Ive actually put my calories up this week as thats losing weight to fast.


----------



## Bod42

High Bar Squat: 55x5, 90x5, 125x3, 145x2, 152.5x5, 137.5x3
Goblet Reverse Lunges: 25x10,10,10
Barbell RDL's: 70x12,12,12,12
RKC Planks: BWx5,5,5

Ok so what I worked out from this workout is that I absolutely hate High Bar Squats, the feeling on your traps, the feeling of the movement, the way they dig into your neck when your coming up. Everything just feels wrong. I know that I need to change my technique to allow the upper body to stay more vertical so trying to do that. Anyway the reason I'm doing High bar is that I had absolutely zero pain in my shoulder whereas Low Bar squats are the cause of all my pain. So basically I need to suck it up and get used to High Bar Squats.

The rest of the workout was good. Nice to do some single leg work and directly hit the Hamstrings.


----------



## shycho

Seem to have missed day 8 some where, but day 9 is in the books

Squat: 37.5kg 5x5
Seated shoulder press: 30kg 5x5
Deadlift 55kg 1x5

Switched up to seated shoulder press tonight instead of my usual incline press to see how I would cope while the weight is relatively light.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Sorry I've not been posting for a while guys, one of the members of the family that i mentioned had Cancer went into a hospice and passed away so my focus is elsewhere atm.

I plan to lift again next week Tues or Wed as its time to get back to my normal life.

Catch you all soon :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Sorry to about your loss, I hope everything gets sorted for you.


----------



## JMorty

Currently doing 4 week micro-cycles

*Weak 1 (4 Day split)*
12-15 reps

*Weak 2 (4 Day split)*
Increase weight from Week 1 to achieve:
9-11 Reps

*Weak 3 (4 Day split)*
Increase weight from Week 2 to achieve:
6-8 Reps

*Weak 4 (4 Day split)*
Increase weight from Week 3 to achieve:
3-5 Reps

Repeat the cycle but each week you should be able to lift the same reps as previous but with more weight.


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Sorry I've not been posting for a while guys, one of the members of the family that i mentioned had Cancer went into a hospice and passed away so my focus is elsewhere atm.
> 
> I plan to lift again next week Tues or Wed as its time to get back to my normal life.
> 
> Catch you all soon :thumb:


So sorry to hear that buddy, hope you're holding up ok.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Guest

ITHAQVA said:


> Sorry I've not been posting for a while guys, one of the members of the family that i mentioned had Cancer went into a hospice and passed away so my focus is elsewhere atm.
> 
> I plan to lift again next week Tues or Wed as its time to get back to my normal life.
> 
> Catch you all soon :thumb:


Sorry to hear of your sad news Doug.


----------



## Bod42

Best wishes from my side of the world Doug. Chin Up.

Week 1 - Workout 3
Eccentric Incline DB Press 6 sec negitive: 17.5x5, 25x5, 40x6,6,6 
Timed Incline DB Press: 25x50
L-Sit Pull-Ups W/ Rings: BWx12,8,8,8
Prone Incline Rear Delt Flys (Arms Straight): Dumbells Onlyx15,15,15,15
Snatch Grip Barbell Shrugs: 60x12,12,12,12
Empty Barbel Curl: 20x100
Banded or Cable Tricep Extenstions: Blue Band x 100

What an awesome workout, obviously loads of volume but walked out of the gym worked but energized which is actually how a workout should be. One thing thats popped up is my Traps are stupidly weak and this might be part of my shoulder issues.

I enjoyed the volume and challenges.

I also bought some Gymnastic rings and hung them from the rack, awesome for doing chin ups, cant reconmend them enough.


----------



## Bod42

Eccentric Barbell Bulgarian Split Squats 6 sec lowering: 32.5x5, 40x5, 55x5,5,5 
Barbell Hip Thrust: 60x5,5,5,5
Farmers Walk: 45x20 widths of my garage.
1 set x As Far as Possible in 3 mins with 40-50% of BW in each hand

Good workout, great for isolating the legs separately. Hip Thrusts were way harder than i expected.


----------



## Bod42

Close Grip Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 95x3, 107.5x2, 115x6, 102.5x9
Wide Grip Dumbell Push-Ups: BWx20,11,10,9
Bent-Over Dumbell Rows: 37.5x12,12,12,12
S/S Iso-hold Y-W-T's: BWx20,20,20,20 secs
Dead-Stop Lateral Raises: 7.5x12,11,8,7
S/S Single Arm Barbell Curls: 0x5,5,5,4

Really like this workout, the rows Supersetted with Iso holds feel so good and you can feel the soreness around your entire shoulder the next day. 

My body is responding well to this sort of training as well and I'm not surprised as the best way to build muscle and strength over the long term is to do an intensification phase followed by an accumulation phase then repeat. I have just finished a 4 month intensfication phase so good time to do a accumulation phase


----------



## shycho

Day 9 done before last nights England game, horrible hay fever wiped me out this weekend and I struggled this time round as a result. 
Squat: 40kg 5x5
Bench press: 40kg 5x5
Bent over row 40kg 5x5


----------



## Bod42

shycho said:


> Day 9 done before last nights England game, horrible hay fever wiped me out this weekend and I struggled this time round as a result.
> Squat: 40kg 5x5
> Bench press: 40kg 5x5
> Bent over row 40kg 5x5


Nicely done. With lifting its more the consistency than going in and going balls to the wall every single wokrout. Some of the top lifters in the world train well below their maximum and still make gains.

High Bar Squat: 55x5, 90x5, 125x3, 145x2, 152.5x5, 137.5x4
Goblet Reverse Lunges: 27.5x10,10,10
Barbell RDL's: 72.5x12,12,12,12
RKC Planks: BWx5,5,5

High Bar squats felt a lot better this time. Thinking about sitting straight down between my legs instead of the form I use with low bar squat where I squat back keeping the shins vertical. All felt good until I got to the heavier weights and my body wants to shift the hips back to get them more involved.

Still enjoying the single leg work, good for sorting any imbalances and for joint health as well.


----------



## Bod42

Week 2 - Workout 3
Eccentric Incline DB Press 6 sec negitive: 17.5x5, 25x5, 42.5x5,5,5
Timed Incline DB Press: 25x50 4:03
L-Sit Pull-Ups W/ Rings: BWx12,9,9,9
Prone Incline Rear Delt Flys (Arms Straight): Dumbells Onlyx15,15,15,15
Snatch Grip Barbell Shrugs: 60x12,12,12,12
Empty Barbel Curl: 20x100
Banded or Cable Tricep Extenstions: Blue Band x 100

Really liking these workouts, I walk out feeling wroked but energised and I normally walk out of the gym with pain in my shoulder but the way these workouts are supersetted with rear delt and RC work I leave feeling awesome. The test sets, so the 50 reps incline dumbell press and barbell curls for 100 reps are good fun and you can push as hard or soft as you feel on the day. Making awesome progress on the tests as well.


----------



## Leebo310

*Chest/Shoulder workout today*

*Decline Bench*
60kgx8, 80kgx8, 110kgx5, 117.5kgx4, 125kgx3, 132.5kgx2, 140kgx3 new PB :devil:

*Seated Military Press*
50kgx12, 55kgx10, 60kgx8, 65kgx6, 70kgx4

*Upright DB Row*
15kgx15, 15kgx15, 15kgx15,

*Front Rope Raise*
55lbsx20, 55lbsx20, 55lbsx20,

*Standing Side DB Raise*
10kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10, 10kgx10 
25 second rests between sets

*Cable Cross*
55lbx10, 55lbx10, 55lbx10, 55lbx10, 55lbx10, 55lbx10, 55lbx10, 
25 second rests between sets

Very very happy to get 3 on the 140, weight moved really well no grinding required at all. I've hit 140 for a fairly decent 1 rep a while back but this was the first time since then that I tried that weight again and it was good to see such a big improvement. Also lovely to see three plates on either side of the bar


----------



## shycho

Slight change of pace today, met up with a personal trainer I know and had a full body session, just really discussing form and muscle stimulation. 

Squats: 30kgx10 40kgx10 40kgx10
Deadlift: 50kgx10 50kgx10 50kgx10
Bench press: 40kgx10 40kgx10 40kgx10
+Superset with TRX lat pull downs x15

Felt absolutely battered after the superset.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Thanks to all for your kind thoughts :thumb:

Had a quick bench session today, not fully focused and failed the last work set of 135kg, but at least I had a go.

Ill re run the bench session Tuesday and then carry on, if I need a de load I will do one.

It is very surprising how much strength I have lost in three weeks. I also think my lifting focus us well off I felt very distant from tbe weights today. Onward and upward thought :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Eccentric Barbell Bulgarian Split Squats 6 sec lowering: 32.5x5, 40x5, 57.5x4,4,4
Barbell Hip Thrust: 60x6,6,6,6
Farmers Walk: 45x28 widths of my garage.
1 set x As Far as Possible in 3 mins with 40-50% of BW in each hand

Nice workout, the 6 sec negitive Split squat really work your legs without having to put massive load on your back but still allow you to use a heavy enough load due to you being so much stronger on the ecentric portion of lifts.

Big improvement on farmers walks. The only thing I need to complete my gym now is farmers walk bars as I bought another 100kgs of weight at the weekend and some normal dumbells as the Olympic ones are to big/wide for the Mrs to handle.

Nice PR Lee. Always nice when you back off and then try again a few weeks/months later and you smash your goal, always lets you know that your training is working. Once Ive finished this contest then I will be designing a high volume program for the main lift but well below my strength level so it will infact be low intensity and will just concentrate on moving the weight faster and easier for a few months while I concentrate on my golf over summer. I bet though that when I come back to test my strength I am actually stronger.


----------



## eibbor

Back into it today after a mad 4 weeks. 2 weeks doing a back rehab that was suggested on here (superb it was) then became a dad for the first time 2 weeks ago so only made the gym a handful of times.

Squat WO 55x5,5,5,5,5
OHP WO 30x5,5,5,5,5
Almost-straight legged deadlifts WO 55x5

Big deload after my back injury but felt good tonight. Been doing the Limber 11 alot. 

I'm looking into doing alot more core work especially hyper extensions but unsure when I would fit them in, any you guys have any advice? 



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Leebo310

eibbor said:


> Back into it today after a mad 4 weeks. 2 weeks doing a back rehab that was suggested on here (superb it was) then became a dad for the first time 2 weeks ago so only made the gym a handful of times.
> 
> Squat WO 55x5,5,5,5,5
> OHP WO 30x5,5,5,5,5
> Almost-straight legged deadlifts WO 55x5
> 
> Big deload after my back injury but felt good tonight. Been doing the Limber 11 alot.
> 
> I'm looking into doing alot more core work especially hyper extensions but unsure when I would fit them in, any you guys have any advice?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Congratulations on fatherhood buddy 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

eibbor said:


> Back into it today after a mad 4 weeks. 2 weeks doing a back rehab that was suggested on here (superb it was) then became a dad for the first time 2 weeks ago so only made the gym a handful of times.
> 
> Squat WO 55x5,5,5,5,5
> OHP WO 30x5,5,5,5,5
> Almost-straight legged deadlifts WO 55x5
> 
> Big deload after my back injury but felt good tonight. Been doing the Limber 11 alot.
> 
> I'm looking into doing alot more core work especially hyper extensions but unsure when I would fit them in, any you guys have any advice?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Congrats on the little one.

With Hyperextensions and rehab exercises, some I like to include as part of my warm up and others I like to do after my main work. With yours I would just throw them in at the end of the workout. I do loads of rehab and stretches for my shoulders after Ive finished my workouts but dont write them up as their not really working you hard out, just some extra little movements here and there will do the world of good.

I now use all Defrancos warmups before every session which consists of foam rolling and stretching plus certain area warmups, for instance he does a shoulder circuit before you ever bench.

Close Grip Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 95x3, 107.5x2, 115x7, 102.5x10
Wide Grip Dumbell Push-Ups: BWx20,12,11,10
Bent-Over Dumbell Rows: 40x12,12,12,12
S/S Iso-hold Y-W-T's: BWx20,20,20,20 secs
Dead-Stop Lateral Raises: 7.5x12,12,9,9
S/S Single Arm Barbell Curls: 0x6,5,5,4

Good workout, nice to hit an extra rep each week on the heavy work. I still love this workout as I always walk out feeling better than when i walked in. Everyone should try adding the Y-W-Ts between pushing and pulling exercises, so simple but so effective. This is my last week before a change next week as this programme changes exercise selection every 3 weeks.


----------



## Lowerks

Crossfit. I am not motivated enough and I need to get the heart rate up with some high intensity training too. Keeps me motivated 3-4 times a week for an hour.


----------



## shycho

Eibbor - Congratulations on becoming a new father.

Bod 42 - Y-W-T's are these the same thing as Y-W-T-L's ? I've been using these for a couple of weeks to try and stretch out and pull my shoulders back.

Back at it today.
Squat: 45kg 5x5
Bench press: 42.5kg 5x5
Bent over row 42.5kg 5x5

Considering the bent over row is the heaviest i've lifted in a long long time it felt surprisingly light. So while it is light for some, it's certainly showing improvements for me.


----------



## Bod42

Check out 



 they are the same position as Y-W-T-Ls but their Iso Holds instead of going through the movements. I wasnt sold on Iso movements until I started doing these. Just hold for 20 secs in each of the 3 positions between sets.


----------



## shycho

Cheers for the vid bod42 that's exactly what I was after. I've always done the movements standing up, but will add some of those movements to my plans for the coming weeks.

Got a late one in last night, as knew I wouldn't have time this morning. 
Squat: 47.5kg 5x5
Seated OHP: 35kg 5x5
DL 65kg 1x5

Happy that my squats are still motoring along as I always considered my legs a real weakness. Struggled mightily with the seated overhead press but that might be attributed to working out only 90 minutes after dinner which is not something i'm used too.


----------



## jonezy

My workout from tuesday, working towards getting a better deadlift max (currently 160kg x 3) and generally getting stronger:

Deadlift 4x10 @ 105kg
Superset of russian KB Swings 4x20 @24kg / KB RDLs 4x15 @ 24kg in each hand

Leg press 4x12 @ heaviest weight to do all 4 sets (100kg)

Superset of Dumbbell front squats 4x12 @ 15kg in each hand on shoulder / Bulgarian Split squats 4x16 (8 each leg) with 15kg dumbbells in hands

and then i wiped myself back off the floor as i was foooked


----------



## Bod42

Shycho, I always been a fan of Defranco's stuff but lately everything he's been releasing (free or paid) has been awesome. Loving his current program I'm doing and shoulder is feeling great for first time in ages. Is that 100% down to his workout, no, i have moved to high bar squats which takes the stress off but shoulder feels move stable.

Jonezy: Thats an exhausting looking workout there, nice work. If you goal is strength have you thought about trying the lower rep ranges like 3-5 especially for deadlifts.

Eccentric Incline DB Press 6 sec negitive: 17.5x5, 25x5, 45x5,5,5
Timed Incline DB Press: 25x50 
L-Sit Pull-Ups W/ Rings: BWx12,10,10,10
Prone Incline Rear Delt Flys (Arms Straight): Dumbells Onlyx15,15,15,15
Snatch Grip Barbell Shrugs: 60x12,12,12,12
Empty Barbel Curl: 20x100
Banded or Cable Tricep Extenstions: Blue Band x 100

Pleased to get 45 dumbells for 4 reps of ecentrics but man were they hard to get in position. I am using Olympic weight plates that are rubber coated with the EZ grips so they are like 2 foot across so very hard to roll up into place. 

Its amazing how quickly you improve on the challenges. Have to do 50 reps as fast as possible with 25kgs dumbells, first week I took like 10 mins, triceps went and was busting 2-3 reps out per time, week 2 4:02secs, week 3 3:12secs, thats a decent improvement over 2 weeks.


----------



## JMorty

*Week 4 - 3-5 Reps*
Drop set after each final set.

Dumbbell Should Press 24kg - 4 Sets
Cable Lat. Raise - 11.5Kg - 3 sets
Cable Front Raise - 11.5Kg - 3 sets
High Cable Cross-Over - 15Kg - 3 sets
Barbell Shrug - 100Kg 3 sets
Standing Calf Raise - 70kg
Seated Calf Raise - 50Kg

Pretty good workout although I think my build prefers the 10+ reps but i want to make sure I'm structured in training volume AND intensity.


----------



## shycho

14th 5x5 workout complete

Squat: 50kg 5x5
Bench Press: 45kg 5x5
Bent over row 45kg 5x5

Psychologically i'm loving this schedule, as i've always been one who lacked focus and would spend months lifting the same weight. But as it stands i'm starting to hit PBs for Squats, Rows, DL, and OHP each time out now.


----------



## Bod42

Yep hitting PRs is what keeps you coming back to the gym. I've heard multiple people say its not fancy enough and to easy, my answer is always don't worry it will get extremely hard in the end. But it will also build massive amounts of muscles and strength.

Eccentric Barbell Bulgarian Split Squats 6 sec lowering: 35x5, 45x5, 62.5x3,3,3
Barbell Hip Thrust: 60x10,10,10,10

Nice improvement. Decent amount of weight to be doing on one leg as well and the 6 sec negatives turn this into a completely diff exercise. 

Doubled my reps on hip thrusts as well.

Thats 3 weeks done now so all the exercises change. But really really enjoyed that workout and feel really good body wise.


----------



## Bod42

Weerk 4 Workout 1
Board Bench Press: 45x5, 80x5, 107.5x3, 122.5x2, 137.5x5, 125x8
Flat Dumbell Press: 40x10,10,5
Diesel Mass Back Attack Triset 3x
Dumbell Row Iso-Holds: 20x30secs
Prone Dumbell Row: 20x20
Prone DB Posterior Flyes: 2.5x20
Tricep Pushdowns: Blue Band x 150

Really liked this first workout, Board Bench definitely hits your triceps more than chest but the follow up Dumbell press hit your chest. I havent done Board press in years so it does feel nice to handle some decent weight.

The Diesel Mass Back Attack Triset is insane, if you want to add size to your back while improving shoulder health then I would say this is awesome. Also gets a shed load of volume in in a short amount of time.


----------



## shycho

Another one in the books today.

Squat: 52.5kg 5x5
Seated OHP: 37.5kg 5x5
DL 70kg 1x5


----------



## ITHAQVA

Week 1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 103KGX3 - 116KGX2 - 130KGX1

BENCH PRESS (1 minute Rest between Sets) 80KGX5X5X5X5X5

BENCH PRESS (1 minute Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X10 - 60KGX10 - 50KGX10X8*

As you all may know I recently lost my step brother to Cancer and my dad is going through tests for Cancer also so my focus is right off. I've taken some time off but im not happy when not lifting. I'll be taking a very light approach to my workouts until i can get my focus back. I'm taking this opportunity to train almost bodybuilder style with the higher reps and keep calories to around 1800 per day moving down to 1700 within a few weeks.
So in some round about way this is a positive, losing bodyfat was always something i really wanted to do, this will be much easier while training light :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Doug, good to see you up and running (lifting). You know I've always thought the higher rep work will do you a world of good. The way for a natural lifter to make the best progress is an Intensification phase followed by Accumulation phase. Strongest guys in the world train like this.

Rack Pulls: 70x5, 105x5, 145x3, 165x2, 187.5x3, 170x3
Triset:
Romanian Deadlift: 70x12,12,12,12
Step-Ups w/ Knee Drive: 20x10,10,10,10
Band Assisted Pull-Ups Overhand: BWx6,6,5,4
Cable Face Pulls w/ External Rotation: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
S/S Hanging Leg Raises: BWx12,12,12,12

Not the best workout, the deadlifts were from just under knee hight so should be able to pull more tha usual but I really struggled with my grip and nearly lost the last rep from my right hand. Strange as I pulled 200kg for 3 reps from the floor not long ago so 187.5 should have been easy from the knees. Shows how much peaking works.


----------



## shycho

Todays routine:
Squat: 55kg 5x5
Bench Press: 47.5kg 5x5
Bent over row 47.5kg 5x5

Not a terrible session today, although feels like i've strained my iliopsoas muscle. Which suggests too me I need to do more stretching and probably introduce some simple exercises like leg raises to help strengthen the muscles in that area.


----------



## Bod42

Shycho, I always get people to stretch the hip flexors really hard before every lifting session, daily if their tight. Because of our sitting lifestyle, we sit in the car, at work, at dinner, on the sofa, etc all of which shorten the hip flexors.

But remember you will be hitting your legs and abs more than you ever have before so could just be that. Squats do really work the abs as do Deadlifts.

Iso-Hold Flat Dumbell Bench 3 sec Pause in Bottom Position: 17.5x5, 27.5x5, 42.5x6,6,6
Lat Pull Down - EZ Bar Fat Gripz (With Iso-Hold on last rep of each set at bottom ALAP: Black Band Double Wrappedx12x12x12x12 
S/S Band Face Pulls: Purple Bandx30,30,30,30
Wide-Grip Push-Ups with 3-5 sec Slow Eccentrics: BWx10,10,7,7,7
S/S T-Bar Rows with Fat Gripz: 40x20,20,20,20,20
Barbell Bicep Curls
50 reps total with 30-40% of BW: 35x50

This workout was a killer, the push ups supersetted with T Bar rows were hard work. The 5 second negative really pushes the push ups to another level. Good use of equipment tho, I dont have a T Bar row station or a V Bar to use so I tied a strop in a circle and then slotted them through my fat gripz to make handles.

I really enjoyed using the Fat Gripz and they bring another dimension to training and my grip strength sucks so hopefully this will help.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Barbell Bulgarian Split Squats 3 sec Pause in Bottom Position: 60x5,5,5
Triset
Hip Thrusts (Back on Bench): 60x12,12,12,12
Dumbell "Drag" Shrugs: 10 Platesx20,20,20,20
Inverted Bodyweight Rows (Feet on Floor): BWx20,20,20,20
One and Half Rep DB/KB Goblet Squat: 25x12

Good workout but all this volume and trisets are killing me. But it must be doing some good as I'm stupidly sore today. Also doing upper back work 4 days per week has made my shoulder feel amazing.


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 40, 60, 70, 80, 90kg x 5

Bench
20, 40, 60, 70kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 2

Cable row
50, 70, 80, 90kg x 2

Plus leg extensions.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*13/07/2016 - 5/3/1 Pyramid

BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 84.5KGX5 - 97.5KGX5 - 110.5KGX4 - 97.5KGX5 - 84.5KGX5

BENCH PRESS (3 minute Rest between Sets) 84.5KGX5X5X5X5X5

BENCH PRESS (1 minute Rest between Sets) 70KGX10X8X5X4X4
*

With so much time not training I've been re reading a few powerlifting books and have decided to try out the 5/3/1 pyramid :thumb: This will allow for a reduction in focus combined with a slight de load so i keep training while I deal with what life seems to be choosing to throw at me at the moment.

I actually enjoyed the higher rep approach and have noticed a huge reduction in endurance over 3-4 reps since training heavy sub 5 rep work. On the bench press i saw very little benefit to low rep work, only the deadlift seemed to benefit. The squat i cannot judge as ive been all over the place with it.

Deadlift next and it will be pyramid style allowing for a little extra volume to keep me in the game :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug, good to see you up and running (lifting). You know I've always thought the higher rep work will do you a world of good. The way for a natural lifter to make the best progress is an Intensification phase followed by Accumulation phase. Strongest guys in the world train like this.


I agree on this especially for long term training, my recent trial at low rep heavy lifting has re taught me this :thumb:

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

OHP
20, 20, 30, 40, 40, 35, 30kg x 5

Dips
5x5 Full stack helping

Chins
5x5 Full stack helping

Curlzzzz
9kg x 12 x 3


----------



## jonezy

Bod42 - I used to follow the rule of 5x5 and did so for my squat bench and deadlift until i hit a plataeu, im currently following a routine my mate put together, its not as mad rep wise but is getting heavier each week etc.

Im also following the ed coan 10 week deadlift routine alongside it (its a ****ing killer!)


----------



## Guest

Slowly starting to get back into barbell lifting again.

Deadlift
3 x 100kg, 1 x 110kg, 1 x 120kg, 1 x 130kg, 1 x 140kg, 1 x 145kg, 1 x 150kg (less than 1 min rest between sets)

Quite pleased, since I've not lifted over 100kg in at least 2 years. My PR is 180kg, so only 30kg down. 
Currently doing a 50 rep "program" on OHP and DL, to build work capacity. I'll phase in squats and bench at some point.


----------



## ITHAQVA

BareFacedGeek said:


> Slowly starting to get back into barbell lifting again.
> 
> Deadlift
> 3 x 100kg, 1 x 110kg, 1 x 120kg, 1 x 130kg, 1 x 140kg, 1 x 145kg, 1 x 150kg (less than 1 min rest between sets)
> 
> Quite pleased, since I've not lifted over 100kg in at least 2 years. My PR is 180kg, so only 30kg down.
> Currently doing a 50 rep "program" on OHP and DL, to build work capacity. I'll phase in squats and bench at some point.


Good to see you back Phil :thumb::thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> I agree on this especially for long term training, my recent trial at low rep heavy lifting has re taught me this :thumb:
> 
> :thumb:


I like this nice simple article http://www.strengthsensei.com/individualizing-variety-for-each-trainee/.

Weerk 5 Workout 1
Board Bench Press: 45x5, 80x5, 107.5x3, 122.5x2, 145x3, 130x10
Flat Dumbell Press: 40x10,10,6
Diesel Mass Back Attack Triset 3x
Dumbell Row Iso-Holds: 20x30secs
Prone Dumbell Row: 20x20
Prone DB Posterior Flyes: 2.5x20
Tricep Pushdowns: Blue Band x 150

Pleased to increase the weight and get more reps on the back off sets. I dont think decreased ROM training has that much carry over to full ROM training but one think it does is get you confident with heavier weights. For instance I used to hate the feeling of just unracking 120kgs, now I'm easily unracking 145kgs without feeling to much stress on the body.

Week 5 Workout 2
Rack Pulls: 70x5, 105x5, 145x3, 165x2, 187.5x3, 170x5
Triset:
Romanian Deadlift: 75x12,12,12,12
Step-Ups w/ Knee Drive: 20x10,10,10,10
Band Assisted Pull-Ups Overhand: BWx6,6,5,5
Cable Face Pulls w/ External Rotation: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
S/S Hanging Leg Raises: BWx8,8,8,8

So 3 reps isnt an increase but they were far cleaner and my grip wasnt an issue. but good I hate these trisets, feel like I have to lower the weight so much to get through them. But the weight is still dropping and my strength isnt falling anywhere near as fast as usual. And by planning most of my eating around my gym times, I still have energy to train.



jonezy said:


> Bod42 - I used to follow the rule of 5x5 and did so for my squat bench and deadlift until i hit a plataeu, im currently following a routine my mate put together, its not as mad rep wise but is getting heavier each week etc.
> 
> Im also following the ed coan 10 week deadlift routine alongside it (its a ****ing killer!)


As long as your making progress and enjoying it then really thats all that matters.

You will have to let us know how the Ed Coan program goes as always wanted to try it.


----------



## ITHAQVA

*14/07/2016 - 5/3/1 Pyramid

DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 105X5 130X3) - 149.5KGX5 - 172.5KGX5 - 195.5KGX1 - 172.5KGX2 - 149.4KGX5

DEADLIFT (3 minute Rest between Sets) 130KGX5X5*

Made a huge mistake on my calculations and used 230Kg as my 1rm :wall:

Considering that the session went well and its good to be just lifting. I found myself incredibly drained after the first two work sets and the 195.5Kg only went up once. I think I need to deload the deadlift a bit to allow for a good starting point.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Flat Dumbell Bench 3 sec Pause in Bottom Position: 17.5x5, 27.5x5, 45x5,5,5
Lat Pull Down - EZ Bar Fat Gripz (With Iso-Hold on last rep of each set at bottom ALAP: Black Band Double Wrappedx12x12x12x12
S/S Band Face Pulls: Purple Bandx30,30,30,30
Wide-Grip Push-Ups with 3-5 sec Slow Eccentrics: BWx10,10,8,8,8
S/S T-Bar Rows with Fat Gripz: 45x20,20,20,20,20
Barbell Bicep Curls
50 reps total with 30-40% of BW: 35x50

This workout felt so much better than last week, I'm actually enjoying using Dumbells but its so annoying changing them every set. I will still try and incorparate them into my training a bit more from now on.

Knocked 2 mins off my Barbell curls, amazing how quickly you progress a new exercise.


----------



## ITHAQVA

As ive had some time away from lifting I have been reading beyond 5/3/1.

Very, very interesting read :thumb:

Particular interest for me are:

First set last
Joker sets
And the BBB 12, 19 and 27 week templates.

I will take a considerable de load using the following weights. Bench Press 120Kg, Deadlift 190Kg and Squat 160Kg. I'll put together a template using joker sets and first set last sets. I had great success with the original 5/3/1 so hopefully this will allow me to get back into consistent lifting :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

I like your deload on squat, 160kg. That's heavy man!

Speaking of joker sets, I started jokers fir deadlift to break through a plateau. Worked a treat! Added 20 kg. result.

To be fair, I've always really done Jokers. We all have that day where you feel a bit Herculean and try and '1 rep out'. When I do my usual routine, I've not got to my 4 week weight increase point but still have some left in the tank as the last set, I'll Joker until I fail.

It's great for strength *AND* confidence!

As for my routine, I've not been making the progress I wanted on the micro cycling, I think it's for people on roids! lol

So, I'm back on 1 full body day, compound movements, pyramid reps and sets scheme. Then 10-12 rep Giant sets on remaining 3 days.

I make so much progress on this type of training, most likely due to higher slow twitch ratio.

Either way, excited to be back training the way I love.

Happy lifting all!


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> I like your deload on squat, 160kg. That's heavy man!


Considering I've squatted 200Kg about two years ago its  awful, but life is like that. I'm hoping using 160Kg as my 1RM to calculate my squats will allow me to get back into it and then look at progress back to 200Kg.

Good to see you back, hopefully with all the activity on this thread we can all inspire each other and have a good year lifting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 17/07/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 97.5KGX5 - 112.5KGX5 - 127.5KGX5

5 Minute Rest

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) 97.5KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Negative points:
Felt very fatigued after the work sets and decided to not carry on with Joker sets. Due to working in the very low rep range for the last six months, note to self WHAT WERE YOU THINKING! 
Forgot to do 5+ reps on last work set :wall:

Neutral points 
My weakness is at the bottom part of the squat (100% RAW!) so nothing new there 
When squatting below parallel the squat becomes incredibly difficult, I felt fatigued rather quickly. However I'm not sure if this is just me but I find the deadlift easy to manage in regards to energy throughout my workouts. 
The squat for me is like going through hell and then some. I fatigue so quickly!  But its always been like that.

Positive points:
Only one rep was parallel all other reps were below :thumb:
Ego left at door and de loaded to 160Kg as my 1RM% and today's session proved it was a good choice :thumb:
Made it through the workout even though it was tough going at the end using 3 minute rest between the first set last set sets 
Hamstrings feel fried to , so at least they will get worked properly and get stronger.
I'm back to bare foot squatting the placebo effect of the oly shoes worked at the beginning of the new year and got me squatting again :thumb:

Overall, disappointed i couldn't do the jokers sets, but very pleased with the quality of the reps


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Considering I've squatted 200Kg about two years ago its  awful, but life is like that. I'm hoping using 160Kg as my 1RM to calculate my squats will allow me to get back into it and then look at progress back to 200Kg.
> 
> Good to see you back, hopefully with all the activity on this thread we can all inspire each other and have a good year lifting :thumb:


Thats the beauty of 5/3/1 and the + sets, if you start light then you just hit more reps so your never underwokred.

I also thought the 12, 19 & 27 week templates look really good and a nice way to transition into more volume at heavier weights. I think 5/3/1 is a great programme but the one thing I've taken from his latest book is that all his techniques are adding more volume which I think is addressing the 1 shortfall of the programme. I had my best results on 5/3/1 adding back off sets after the heavy work which is exactly the same as his First Set Last: Multiple Sets.

Iso-Hold Barbell Bulgarian Split Squats 3 sec Pause in Bottom Position: 62.5x4,4,4
Triset
Hip Thrusts (Back on Bench): 62.5x12,12,12,12
Dumbell "Drag" Shrugs: 10 Platesx20,20,20,20
Inverted Bodyweight Rows (Feet on Floor): BWx20,20,20,20
One and Half Rep DB/KB Goblet Squat: 25x15

I'm pleased to be doing some decent weight on single leg exercises. I don't know why but think its cool to be doing 60kgs on 1 leg. Also my body is 100% pain free at the moment, shoulder and knee feel amazing.

Its strange that when i talk to people with Shoulder issues I always suggest a 1:3 or 1:4 ratio of pushing to pulling exercises but I've never actually implemented this into my programme. On this program I am training my upper back every training day and why not, training upper back can't be bad.



ITHAQVA said:


> Negative points:
> Felt very fatigued after the work sets and decided to not carry on with Joker sets. Due to working in the very low rep range for the last six months, note to self WHAT WERE YOU THINKING!
> Forgot to do 5+ reps on last work set :wall:
> 
> Overall, disappointed i couldn't do the jokers sets, but very pleased with the quality of the reps


Doug dont be to hard on yourself, first proper session back and remember squatting is a skill at the end of the day so that skill would have been slightly lost during the time off. The feeling gassed will probably be due to lower rep training and/or the fact that your slightly tighter after a few weeks off so puts more stress on you to get into position. I'm been completely gassed before just doing shoulder dislocations as its so hard to get into those positions when your tight.

And don't be disappointed about the joker sets, remeber this is the entire thinking around 5/3/1, back off when you don't feel great and push it hard when you do. Sounds like you made the right choice. Give it 1 or 2 workouts and I recon your progress will skyrocket.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thats the beauty of 5/3/1 and the + sets, if you start light then you just hit more reps so your never underwokred.
> 
> I also thought the 12, 19 & 27 week templates look really good and a nice way to transition into more volume at heavier weights. I think 5/3/1 is a great programme but the one thing I've taken from his latest book is that all his techniques are adding more volume which I think is addressing the 1 shortfall of the programme. I had my best results on 5/3/1 adding back off sets after the heavy work which is exactly the same as his First Set Last: Multiple Sets.
> 
> Doug dont be to hard on yourself, first proper session back and remember squatting is a skill at the end of the day so that skill would have been slightly lost during the time off. The feeling gassed will probably be due to lower rep training and/or the fact that your slightly tighter after a few weeks off so puts more stress on you to get into position. I'm been completely gassed before just doing shoulder dislocations as its so hard to get into those positions when your tight.
> 
> And don't be disappointed about the joker sets, remember this is the entire thinking around 5/3/1, back off when you don't feel great and push it hard when you do. Sounds like you made the right choice. Give it 1 or 2 workouts and I recon your progress will skyrocket.


I agree about more heavy volume, although the original worked very well for me TBH, I would still like to spend more time under a heavy bar, the joker sets and first set last are a great addition :thumb: I'll stick to them for a few months and possibly try one of the BBB cylces 

thanks for your support and sage advise, your right of course and I am starting to get my focus back so I'm hoping my training will progress nice and slowly but in the right direction.

Squatting below parallel is bloody hard work and my hamstrings and glutes were fried all day, still feeling well used this morning!:devil:


----------



## Bod42

Weerk 6 Workout 1
Board Bench Press: 45x5, 80x5, 107.5x3, 122.5x2, 145x4, 130x9
Flat Dumbell Press: 40x10,10,8
Diesel Mass Back Attack Triset 3x
Dumbell Row Iso-Holds: 20x30secs
Prone Dumbell Row: 20x20
Prone DB Posterior Flyes: 2.5x20
Tricep Pushdowns: Blue Band x 150

Added 1 rep again to my top set and back off set so pleased that I'm actually progressing while dieting and my strength is holding up. Really enjoying these workouts.

The first set last for multiple sets is definitely the best bit I took from his book. And if you follow all the strongest people, they pretty much do the same. Hit a hard top set and then back the weight off and hit some volume which is exactly what 5/3/1 plus First Sets Last accomplishes. In Jim's own words "I can’t recommend this variation enough."


----------



## JMorty

With not the most time tonight and having my routine put off i went for another compound day.

ATG Squats:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 20, 30, 40, 50, 40, 30, 20

Shoulder Press: Same reps
Weight: 20, 21.25, 22.5 23.75, 22.5, 21.25, 20

Deadlift: Same reps.
Weight: 40, 60, 80, 100, 80, 60, 40

Bench press: Same reps
Weight: 45, 50, 55, 60, 55, 50, 45

Solid session tonight.

Actually felt great full activation on chest and not much bicep on the bench press so great times.

Just tweaking on the compounds is doing wonders for confidence next session and I feel more controlled during isolation.

Not heavy but good volume and with strict form. Great times.

Happy lifting everyone!

Edit: must have been the heat and the Hygienist but I messed up the bench weights. Whoops.


----------



## Bod42

Week 6 Workout 2
Rack Pulls: 70x5, 105x5, 145x3, 165x2, 187.5x3, 170x4
Triset:
Romanian Deadlift: 77.5x12,12,12,12
Step-Ups w/ Knee Drive: 20x10,10,10,10
Band Assisted Pull-Ups Overhand: BWx7,6,6,5
Cable Face Pulls w/ External Rotation: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
S/S Hanging Leg Raises: BWx10,10,10,10

I really dont like Partial Range deadlifts, i dont believe they have any carry over to full range deadlifts and my form is awful on them, I can feel my lower back buckle which never happened during full deadlifts. I havent progressed at all on this lift and its less than I was lifting from the floor. Oh well that was the last week so I got through it.

I suppose I am holding my strength week to week which is all I can ask during a diet. Already down over 5kgs. 105.8kgs as of this morning.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 20/07/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 78KGX5 - 90KGX5 - 102KGX6

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 107KGX5 - 112KGX3 - 117KGX2

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) 78KGX8X8X8X8X8*

Nice introduction to beyond 5/3/1. De loading will enable for a much more progression for the first month or so :thumb:

I know your supposed to stop on joker sets on the first fail but thought it would be good to do a few extra sets.


----------



## Bod42

Doug what are MRB Sets?

The more I look at 5/3/1 plus Jokers plus Last Set First, it really does look like an awesome program that combines the best of all the programs I like. 

I like GZCL because of the volume, high intensity and PR week.
I like Base Building because your concentrating on improving lower intensity weights over a period of time.
I like Ed Coans program as you slowly get heavier as the porgramme progresses.

I think 5/3/1 with those added techniques now addresses all this aspects at the same time.

I just noticed a few things with Paul Carters programs and Jim Wendlers and the similarities between the 2 actually.

Over warm ups and fatigued singles, sounds a lot like joker sets.
Lower Intensity high volume sets sound a lot like First Set Last sets.
AMAP sets well they sure sound like AMAP sets lol.
Multiple sets of singles sound again like Joker Sets.

The only real difference between the programs is the order of things. Jim does a AMAP set followed by singles then First Set First whereas Paul likes to do his singles at the end of the workout when your fatigued. Actually that depends on the program as during his peaking program he does 3x1 followed by back off sets.

If 2 well reknowned trainers after decades of training have come to the same conclusion then you can bet your ar$e that the program is good. These are the 2 programs I will be settling on long term. I will be throwing Ogus 7/5/3 into the mix next year when I go through a building phase as the volume is extreme so I think I will progress really well on it. Oh and I cant forget that I hit all my PRs on the GZCL program lol. So i suppose I have 4 go to programs. Oh and want to try Ed Coans program as well. Why, simply because its Ed Coan and hes a legend.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug what are MRB Sets?
> 
> The more I look at 5/3/1 plus Jokers plus Last Set First, it really does look like an awesome program that combines the best of all the programs I like.
> 
> I like GZCL because of the volume, high intensity and PR week.
> I like Base Building because your concentrating on improving lower intensity weights over a period of time.
> I like Ed Coans program as you slowly get heavier as the porgramme progresses.
> 
> I think 5/3/1 with those added techniques now addresses all this aspects at the same time.
> 
> I just noticed a few things with Paul Carters programs and Jim Wendlers and the similarities between the 2 actually.
> 
> Over warm ups and fatigued singles, sounds a lot like joker sets.
> Lower Intensity high volume sets sound a lot like First Set Last sets.
> AMAP sets well they sure sound like AMAP sets lol.
> Multiple sets of singles sound again like Joker Sets.
> 
> The only real difference between the programs is the order of things. Jim does a AMAP set followed by singles then First Set First whereas Paul likes to do his singles at the end of the workout when your fatigued. Actually that depends on the program as during his peaking program he does 3x1 followed by back off sets.
> 
> If 2 well reknowned trainers after decades of training have come to the same conclusion then you can bet your ar that the program is good. These are the 2 programs I will be settling on long term. I will be throwing Ogus 7/5/3 into the mix next year when I go through a building phase as the volume is extreme so I think I will progress really well on it. Oh and I cant forget that I hit all my PRs on the GZCL program lol. So i suppose I have 4 go to programs. Oh and want to try Ed Coans program as well. Why, simply because its Ed Coan and hes a legend.


Hi James,

MRB sets (Minutes Rest Between) sets, sorry mate just copied from my workout word doc 

I totally agree, if you look at many of the top programs there are more similarity's than differences.

The 5/3/1 with Joker and First set last sets seems far more aimed at strength than the original. I continued to do an extra joker set after the five rep fail and i'm glad i did. I would recommend this slight change, it allows for even more flexibility and you can put in a few heavy low rep sets adding to the overall volume :thumb:

GZCL didn't suite me because once i get to my heavy sets my strength drops of rapidly, yesterdays bench session is a good example - (I didn't train train till failure but very close)

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 107KGX5 - 112KGX3 - 117KGX2, I am tempted to add another set as yesterday i would have had a go at 123kg and i'm sure i could have put in at least a single maybe two reps. But that is the beauty of the program, do what feels right :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

OHP
20, 30kg x 5
40kg x 5 x 5

Dips
Full assistance x 12 x 3

Cable chins
Full stack x 12 x 3

DB curls
10kg x 12 x 3 RP


----------



## Bokers

Deadlift
20,60, 90, 110kg x 5
140kg x 5
90kg x 5 x 2

Ab circuits.

Happy with the deadlift on the lack of sleep.


----------



## JMorty

Bokers said:


> Deadlift
> 20,60, 90, 110kg x 5
> 140kg x 5
> 90kg x 5 x 2
> 
> Ab circuits.
> 
> Happy with the deadlift on the lack of sleep.


Tidy deadlifts for sure there, especially if you were tired.

Nice work!


----------



## JMorty

Some more pyramid work tonight!

*Chest*

Bench press:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 50, 55, 60, 65, 60, 55, 50

Cable flys:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 12.5, 15, 17.5, 20, 17.5, 15, 12.5

*Triceps*

Tate press:
Reps: 12, 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10, 12
Weight: 7.5, 8, 10, 12.5, 15, 12.5, 10, 8, 7.5

Rope press down:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 15, 17.5, 20, 22.5, 20, 17.5, 15

I did test out chest before I started as I thought I might not have recovered but I warmed up and 40 was easy for 12 so...off I went.
Solid session again, feeling really strong at the moment due to the compound work.

Psyched.

Happy lifting folks!


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Hi James,
> 
> MRB sets (Minutes Rest Between) sets, sorry mate just copied from my workout word doc
> 
> I totally agree, if you look at many of the top programs there are more similarity's than differences.
> 
> The 5/3/1 with Joker and First set last sets seems far more aimed at strength than the original. I continued to do an extra joker set after the five rep fail and i'm glad i did. I would recommend this slight change, it allows for even more flexibility and you can put in a few heavy low rep sets adding to the overall volume :thumb:
> 
> GZCL didn't suite me because once i get to my heavy sets my strength drops of rapidly, yesterdays bench session is a good example - (I didn't train train till failure but very close)
> 
> BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 107KGX5 - 112KGX3 - 117KGX2, I am tempted to add another set as yesterday i would have had a go at 123kg and i'm sure i could have put in at least a single maybe two reps. But that is the beauty of the program, do what feels right :thumb:


Doug Jim says this in the book about Joker sets "Once you cannot get the reps, you are free to keep adding 10% jumps for
singles." so he agrees with what you want to do and personally I think this is a better way of doing it anyway than grinding out 5 or 3 rep sets.

Remember with GZCl that say on the 3 rep week, you dont do your 3RM, you cant as your doing multiple sets. The basis of the program is improving with volume which is the same as Paul Carters thinking. Once youve put in the hard work improving your volume work then you get that 1 all out AMAP set to try and set a PR. I found this program good as you should never really have a chance of failing, just have to get in, do all the volume and get out. No stress really until PR week.

Just rereading the Beyong 5/3/1 book and ive just noticed another similarity. 5/3/1 advanced routine is 5x5, 5x3, 5x1 then you can do First set last and hit a PR on the 1s week if you want. GZCL is 3x5, 4x3, 3x1 then back off sets and PR set on forth week. I've said it numerous times before but I still feel that multiple sets of a top weight followed by back off sets is the best way to progress and all the programs mentioned in this thread address that issue.

5/3/1 Volume Work is the same thinking as Paul Carters work, take an easy weight and increase the volume over time, just getting the work in will increase your max without ever maxing out.

Think I will run 5/3/1 with Jokers and First set Last next year and I will run his "Using Supersets for the Upper Body" as this is a great way to get more back work in and a higher density of training.

JMorty - Good to see your enjoying the Compound work, that volume looks brutal.


----------



## Bod42

Iso-Hold Flat Dumbell Bench 3 sec Pause in Bottom Position: 17.5x5, 27.5x5, 47.5x4,4,4
Lat Pull Down - EZ Bar Fat Gripz (With Iso-Hold on last rep of each set at bottom ALAP: Black Band Double Wrappedx12x12x12x12
S/S Band Face Pulls: Purple Bandx30,30,30,30
Wide-Grip Push-Ups with 3-5 sec Slow Eccentrics: BWx10,10,9,9,9
S/S T-Bar Rows with Fat Gripz: 50x20,20,20,20,20
Barbell Bicep Curls
50 reps total with 30-40% of BW: 35x50

So my back wasnt feeling that great after Rack pulls on Tues so spent a bit longer on the foam roller and a few more mobility exercises before getting into this workout and it was the best thing I did, back felt a thousand times better after 10 mins and made my entire workout that bit more productive. 

I hit PRs on nearly every exercise so cant complain. Great workout again for back work.

The 1 thing Ive taken away from this workout is slow eccentrics and static holds really ramp up the intensity and muscle growth. Holding for a count of 3 in the bottom of dumbell press hits the chest way more than a standard DB press. And who would have ever thought that 10 pushups would be difficult but throw in 5 secs eccentric and suddenly your chest, arms and shoulders are on fire and your core is working over time as well.


----------



## shycho

Back on it after a 2 week hiatus.

Squats: 50kg 5x5
OHP: 40kg 5x5
Deadlifts: 80kg 1x5

Dropped the squats back down to 50kg and then felt pretty light but still gave my legs a working. Noticed that I might be trying to squeeze my glutes to much resulting in me pulling my iliopsoas a couple weeks a go, but no problems today and will continue to try and stretch it out. 

Good to be back at it, and good to see you all progressing.


----------



## Bokers

JMorty said:


> Tidy deadlifts for sure there, especially if you were tired.
> 
> Nice work!


Thanks bud. I wanted a couple of sets but it wasn't happening this week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 23/07/22016

*DEADLIFT (WU 70X5 90X5 100X3) - 123.5X5 - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX5 Forgot to do plus reps again! :wall:

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 169.5KGX5 - 178KGX2 - 189KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) 123.5KGX8X8X8X8X8
*

Workout went very well, strength dropped of pretty quick during joker sets unfortunately so called it a day on 189Kg.

Beyond 5/3/1 with joker and first set last can IMHO become quite brutal as you progress your 1 rm%, I'm not sure if I could do it all the time, one thing I do know I will have to break up my sessions, i cant think doing deadlift sat then squat sun will allow me to train and or recover as the weights get heavier.

Overall I love the new template, even though I know from personal experience you can build great strength and muscle mass with the original 5/3/1 with BBB. I'm very interested to see how I progress on the new template


----------



## Bod42

Doug remember that Joker sets are almost a type of autoregulation as in their not set in stone, if you feel like doing them then you can, if not no worries. Just gives you a little bit of flexibility. But ya I agree I know if I've just hit a hard PR set then Joker sets will be difficult. These are a lot easier when your getting say 10,8,5 on your 5/3/1 weeks as your obviously training at a lower intensity which gives you more room for joker sets. I'm looking forward to doing this workout but will have to wait 7 months before I can try it. Got 6 months of prioritising my golf over the summer months and see if I can start competing again.

I found this http://theblogoffame.com/beyond-531-joker-sets-revisited/ see point 2 about not planning Joker sets.

Phase 3 - Week 1 - Workout 1
Bench Press: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 102.5x3, 115x2, 135x2, 122.5x5
Dips: BWx20,15,12,10
Seated Cable Rows: Green Bandx12,12,12,12
S/S Face Pull w/ External Rotations: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
Defranco Shoulder Shocker 2.0
Iso-Dynamic Lateral Raises, Cuban Press, Curl > L-Lateral Raises > Extend: 2.5 Platesx7,7
Incline Dumbell Curls: 10platesx12,12,12,12

Back to more of a traditional workout style now and must say I really enjoyed it. Pleased with an easy 135kgs for 2 reps as well during a diet and I havent benched in 6 weeks so I imagine this will go up next week. The biggest milestone is zero pain while lowering the bench press so all this upper back work is definitely helping.

For anyone here who has trouble hitting your laterals and feeling the burn in your outer head instead of your traps then try out Defrancos Shoulder shocker 2.0.


----------



## Guest

Tired after a long camping weekend. Thought I'd just do some deads and chins. Ran out of steam too quickly, but something is better than nothing.

Chins: [email protected] - just starting with these again. Was planning on more volume (sets) but my body said otherwise. Roughly a minute rest between sets.

Deads: [email protected] - was aiming for 6 sets, but my lower back started to fatigue and round so called it a day. Rest was enough time to let my heart rate drop enough to perform another set.


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 50, 70kg x 5
90kg x 5 x 5

Bench press
20, 50kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 5

Cable row
2/3 stack x 12 x 3


----------



## jonezy

last nights workout

Back squat [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Bench press [email protected]

Press ups 4x15 superset with Bench Dips 4x15

Pull ups 3 max rep sets

2 sets, rest 2 mins between: DB curls 20kg-17kg-15kg-12kg-10kg (as many reps as possible to form breaks then drop down weight etc go again)

Fridays workout was:

Deadlift [email protected]

Lat pull downs 4x10 @ 60kg superset with side plank hold 4x45s

RDL [email protected] superset with Plank hold 3x60secs

and finished with bicep 21s using the ez bar and total 25kg ****ing near killed me lol

Im struggling to get 3 workouts in with all the wedding madness going on (T minus 2 weeks and 4 days or so im told lol)


----------



## JMorty

BareFacedGeek said:


> Deads: [email protected]


That's pretty tidy for being tired to be fair, nice volume.



Bokers said:


> Squats
> 20, 50, 70kg x 5
> 90kg x 5 x 5
> 
> Bench press
> 20, 50kg x 5
> 80kg x 5 x 5
> 
> Cable row
> 2/3 stack x 12 x 3


Lovely little workout, efficient and hitting a lot with minimal exercises. :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Sunday's routine.

Shoulders

Shoulder press
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 8, 10, 14, 18, 14, 10, 8

Cable side raise
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 2.5, 5, 7.5, 10, 7.5, 5, 2.5

10's were negative only as I couldn't lift it.

Bent over rear raise
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 2, 2.5, 3, 5, 3, 2.5, 2

Biceps

Modified hammer curl
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight:6, 7.5, 8, 10, 8, 7.5, 6

Preacher curl ez bar
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 0, 2.5, 5, 7.5, 5, 2.5, 0

Moved onto some compound moves to stay strong and keep the body guessing.

Bench press
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 5, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 55, 60, 65, 70, 80, 70, 65, 60, 55,

Squats
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 30, 40, 50, 60, 50, 40, 30

Calf raises
Weight: 60
Reps: 10 reps, 3 second rest, 5 reps, 3 second rest, 5 reps.
Sets: 3

Great session, just seem to be going from strength to strength...if you pardon the turn of phrase.

Couldn't get a sesh in tonight so I'l be in tomorrow


----------



## Bokers

OHP
20, 30, 35, 40kg x 5
45kg x 5 x 2

Dips
Stack x 12 x 3

Lat pulldown machine
Stack x 12 x 3

Cable lat pulldown
Stack x 12 x 3

Curls
10kg x 10 x 3 RP


----------



## JMorty

Compound day

OHP: Pyramid Reps
Weight: 22.5, 25, 27.5, 30, 27.5, 25, 22.5

ATG Squat: Pyramid reps
Weight: 30, 40, 50, 60, 50, 40, 30

Bench press
This turned onto a drop set sesh as I just couldn't get the reps today.

Reps: 10, 8, 6, 3, 3, 3, 6
Weight: 60, 65, 70, 75, 70, 65, 60

Deadlift: Pyramid reps
Weight: 60, 80, 100, 110, 100, 80, 60

Was pretty shattered before I started so not too happy with how it went, work was full on and took a lot out of me.

See if next sesh is any good.

Happy lifting all!


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 1 - Workout 2
Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 170x1, 152.5x3
Bulgarian Split Squats: 30x10,10,10,10
Kettlebell Swings: 15x15,15,15,15
Barbell Russian Twists: 20x20,20,20

So this is the first time I have done a low bar squat in like 7 weeks and it didnt go well. **** was shooting straight up from the bottom so I was doing a good morning to get the bar up. Just aweful form. I have never been a person who could change the main exercise every 3 weeks and then come back stronger, I seem to lose the grove to easily. The squat should have been an easy 2 reps, not a 1 rep grind so thats fail.

Luckily friday I have a chance to redeem myself as I have a challenge. Body weight on the bar for AMRAP so that will be 125kgs.


----------



## eibbor

Squat - WU 20,30,40,50,60 all x5 WO 70x5,5,5,5,5

OHP - WU 20x10 25x5 30x5 WO 37x5,5,5,5,5

Deadlift - WU 40x10 50x8 60x6 WO 70x5,5,5,5,5

Chin ups bodyweight 3x5 reps. Just started these tonight as I quite simply want to be good at them.

Hyperextensions 2 sets of 10 with bodyweight 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 1 - Workout 3
Kneeling Med Ball Chest Pass into Wall: 5x3
Chin-Ups with Weight - Neutral Grip: BWx5,5,4,4,4
S/S Lat Pull Downs: Green Bandx20,20,20,20,20
Iso-Hold Dumbell Flyes: 10x10,10,10
S/S Double-Banded face Pull & External Rotation & Y press: Yellow Bands x 20,20,20
As many Barbell Push Ups in 4 mins as possible: 67

Nice and easy workout this one, no heavy lifting exercises but the chin ups super setted with another lat exercise is good for killing the back. I was pleased to get as many chin ups as I did as havent done them in ages.

I don't know why I havent but i should be incorporating more medicine ball throws and jumps into my program so goig to make these a part of my warmup from now on.

Nice challenge to finish as well, I do enjoy things like this and you progress so quickly on them.


----------



## ITHAQVA

31/07/2016 - Beyond 5/3/1

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 90X3) - 97.5KGX5 - 112.5KGX5 - 127.5KGX6

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 134KGX3 - 141KGX1

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 97.5KGX8X8*

At last I remembered to go beyond the designated sets for the last work set!  :thumb:

The difference when your ensuring every rep is good is MASSIVE in regards to the feeling of total fatigue!

Because of the hours of driving to visit family this week, my first week on beyond 5/3/1 has been split over two weeks. Hopefully next week will be a full one and then I can focus on lifting consistently again :thumb:

The Squat for me anyway is so tiring, I seem to run out of air especially at the bottom of the rep. All reps including warm ups were good depth, if I were being hypercritical I would say 2-3 reps were parallel. All in all a good first go at this new workout and I like it. I can see it helping greatly with fitness, were as the low rep work had a detrimental effect.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 1 - Workout 4
Vertical Jumps: BWx8x2
Speed Deadlifts: 122.5x2,2,2,2,2
Squats: 120x12
Hip Thrusts (Back on Bench): 70x8,8,8,8
Forwards/Backwards, Stop-and-Go farmers Walks: 25x5,5,5,5

I do like this Phases workouts, heavy at the start of the week and power at the end. I do like adding jumps and throws into my program as makes me feel more athletic.

Pleased to get 12 reps on Body weight on the bar squats, its by no means a record but felt a thousand times better than Monday and I was pleased that I stopped quite a few reps short of failure.

Doug have you seen Jim Wendlers Beyong 1.1-1.4 wokrout on T-nation? Looks awesome and I will run it start to finish 1 day as the first cycle works on work capacity using 1min rest between sets on your back off sets. If you can do 1min then 3 mins suddenly seems easy. Whats his saying, make training hard so game day is easy.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Doug have you seen Jim Wendlers Beyong 1.1-1.4 wokrout on T-nation? Looks awesome and I will run it start to finish 1 day as the first cycle works on work capacity using 1min rest between sets on your back off sets. If you can do 1min then 3 mins suddenly seems easy. Whats his saying, make training hard so game day is easy.


I'll check it out, thanks for the heads up James :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 2 - Workout 1
Bench Press: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 102.5x3, 115x2, 135x2, 122.5x5
Dips: BWx20,15,12,10
Seated Cable Rows: Green Bandx12,12,12,12
S/S Face Pull w/ External Rotations: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
Defranco Shoulder Shocker 2.0
Iso-Dynamic Lateral Raises, Cuban Press, Curl > L-Lateral Raises > Extend: 2.5 Platesx7,7
Incline Dumbell Curls: 10platesx12,12,12,12

I'm 1 of those people who's strength normally plummets during a diet phase so I'm happy to do exactly the same weights and reps this week as last week. Yes I'm nowhere near my strongest but who is when your on a diet. 

Worked a bit harder on the back work and can really feel it today. A compound back exercise followed by upper back work feels so good for the shoulders. I actually wish I had taken a photo from the side before starting this diet as this workout has really pulled my shoulders back into a more healthy position.


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 2 - Workout 2
Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 170x1, 152.5x3
Bulgarian Split Squats: 32.5x10,10,10,10
Kettlebell Swings: 17.5x15,15,15,15

Ok so watched an Ed Coan video on How to Skwaat and picking up tips from the best powerlifter in history is never going to hurt. Well I've had a problem with my hips firing up without my chest and he talks about that so all I concentrated on with tonights squats workout was exploding from the bottom with my neck and chest instead of firing the legs as hard as possible. This made my reps and bar path almost perfect from the 1st rep but a bit slower out of the bottom until I get used to this. Overall very pleased though. Disappointed to only be squatting 170kgs for 1 rep but please that my strength doesnt seem to be falling as much during this diet and I'm sure that once I go back to a higher volume template that all the 1 legged, hamstring, glute and back work is going to carry over to my squat.

Short rest between BSS squats so these burn and you get a good pump.


----------



## ITHAQVA

03/08/16 - Beyond 5/3/1

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 91KGX3 - 104KGX3 - 117KGX3

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 122KGX2

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 91KGX8X8X5*

Good workout considering i  up all the calculations for the workout :wall:, should have finished on 108Kg for 3+ reps DOH!

But at least i'm lifting :thumb:


----------



## JMorty

Last nights compound routine:

Bench Press
Set 1: 65 kg × 10
Set 2: 70 kg × 8
Set 3: 75 kg × 6
Set 4: 80 kg × 3
Set 5: 75 kg × 6
Set 6: 70 kg × 8
Set 7: 65 kg × 10

Squat
Set 1: 30 kg × 10
Set 2: 40 kg × 8
Set 3: 50 kg × 6
Set 4: 60 kg × 3
Set 5: 50 kg × 6
Set 6: 40 kg × 8
Set 7: 30 kg × 10

Military Press
Set 1: 22.5 kg × 10
Set 2: 25 kg × 8
Set 3: 27.5 kg × 6
Set 4: 30 kg × 3
Set 5: 27.5 kg × 6
Set 6: 25 kg × 8
Set 7: 22.5 kg × 10

Bent Over Row
Set 1: 30 kg × 10
Set 2: 40 kg × 8
Set 3: 50 kg × 6
Set 4: 60 kg × 3
Set 5: 50 kg × 6
Set 6: 40 kg × 8
Set 7: 30 kg × 10

Deadlift
Set 1: 60 kg × 10
Set 2: 80 kg × 8
Set 3: 100 kg × 6
Set 4: 120 kg × 3
Set 5: 100 kg × 6
Set 6: 80 kg × 8
Set 7: 60 kg × 10


----------



## Leebo310

JMorty said:


> Last nights compound routine:
> 
> Bench Press
> Set 1: 65 kg × 10
> Set 2: 70 kg × 8
> Set 3: 75 kg × 6
> Set 4: 80 kg × 3
> Set 5: 75 kg × 6
> Set 6: 70 kg × 8
> Set 7: 65 kg × 10
> 
> Squat
> Set 1: 30 kg × 10
> Set 2: 40 kg × 8
> Set 3: 50 kg × 6
> Set 4: 60 kg × 3
> Set 5: 50 kg × 6
> Set 6: 40 kg × 8
> Set 7: 30 kg × 10
> 
> Military Press
> Set 1: 22.5 kg × 10
> Set 2: 25 kg × 8
> Set 3: 27.5 kg × 6
> Set 4: 30 kg × 3
> Set 5: 27.5 kg × 6
> Set 6: 25 kg × 8
> Set 7: 22.5 kg × 10
> 
> Bent Over Row
> Set 1: 30 kg × 10
> Set 2: 40 kg × 8
> Set 3: 50 kg × 6
> Set 4: 60 kg × 3
> Set 5: 50 kg × 6
> Set 6: 40 kg × 8
> Set 7: 30 kg × 10
> 
> Deadlift
> Set 1: 60 kg × 10
> Set 2: 80 kg × 8
> Set 3: 100 kg × 6
> Set 4: 120 kg × 3
> Set 5: 100 kg × 6
> Set 6: 80 kg × 8
> Set 7: 60 kg × 10


That's an insane amount of volume for one workout....


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> That's an insane amount of volume for one workout....


I think WTF!!! springs to mind! 

Lee you do know there is no such thing as obsessed, your just dedicated!


----------



## JMorty

My body just reacts really well to volume.


----------



## Bod42

35 sets, thats like a weeks worth of volume for the rest of us lol. But what ever works for you mate. I'm actually finding the same especially for lower body that volume is what makes me strong, not grinding out AMRAP as possible sets.

Phase 3 - Week 2 - Workout 3
Kneeling Med Ball Chest Pass into Wall: 5x3
Chin-Ups with Weight - Neutral Grip: BWx5,5,5,5,4
S/S Lat Pull Downs: Green Bandx20,20,20,20,20
Iso-Hold Dumbell Flyes: 12.5x10,10,10
S/S Double-Banded face Pull & External Rotation & Y press: Yellow Bands x 20,20,20
As many Barbell Push Ups in 4 mins as possible: 65

So pleased to get more chin ups and these are proper chin miles above the bar not half forehead to the bar then straight arms at the bottom. I think its a combination of losing weight, healthier shoulders and stronger upper back thats helping with my chin ups. Ya I've got 6-8 chin ups before but I was training them every workout and they never felt nice but now they actually feel like a proper exercise.

When I was younger I was the gym that there was no point going to the gym unless it was balls to the walls setting PRs training but now I'm loving having easier workouts in my program where your not beating yourself up and doing exercises that make you feel better.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 06/08/16

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 133KGX3 - 152KGX3 - 171KGX4

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 179.5KGX2 - 188KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 133KGX8X5X5*

Reasonable workout, disappointing my strength drops so rapidly after three work sets. Only did 4 reps on the 171 to try to help with joker sets, but didn't really do much TBH.

Overall happy to be at least lifting :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 07/08/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 105KGX3 - 120KGX3 - 135KGX4

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 142KGX3

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 105KGX8X8*

Good session, videoed all sets including warm ups and they were "good lift" depth :thumb: 

Starting to feel the benefits of beyond 5/3/1 already, yes the squat is hard work but I don't feel as broken today as in previous workouts.

Kicking myself a bit as the joker set of 142 wasn't that difficult and all reps were below parallel. But still pleasing to have a good squat workout 

I'm hoping to keep increasing joker sets and first set last sets over the next few months.


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 2 - Workout 4
Vertical Jumps: BWx8x2
Speed Deadlifts: 122.5x2,2,2,2,2
Squats: 120x15
Hip Thrusts (Back on Bench): 72.5x8,8,8,8
Forwards/Backwards, Stop-and-Go farmers Walks: 25x5,5,5,5

Got 3 more reps in squats so extrememly pleased with this. Its good to know that I do have the mental strength to push a high rep set when I never train high rep on lower body.

Did the other exercises quite slowly as had someone in for a form check. Good when you change someones form and they hit a PR. Also we moulded his squat form around his body type, not by the book so he's way more comfortable squatting now. He has a long femur and short torso so the standard hips back ques dont work, opening up your groin is a better 1 for this body type.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 09/08/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 90KGX5 - 102KGX3 - 114KGX2

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 120KGX1 - 126KGX1 - 132KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 90KGX8X8X6X6X6*

Nice easy workout. I only intend to go one rep over the AMRAP work sets on all weeks.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 3 - Workout 1
Bench Press: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 102.5x3, 115x2, 135x2, 122.5x5
Dips: BWx20,16,13,11
Seated Cable Rows: Green Bandx12,12,12,12
S/S Face Pull w/ External Rotations: Purple Bandsx20,20,20,20
Defranco Shoulder Shocker 2.0
Iso-Dynamic Lateral Raises, Cuban Press, Curl > L-Lateral Raises > Extend: 2.5 Platesx10x10
Incline Dumbell Curls: 10platesx12,12,12,12

Good workout, just really pleased to be maintaining my strength but my form was all over the place tonight, couldnt get in the groove at all while benching. I do like the workout structure though, heavy chest, high rep chest, medium rep back then high rep upper back just makes you feel great.

Pleased to increase my dips as well, always loved dips.


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 40, 60, 80, 90kg x 5
100kg x 5 x 2

Bench
20, 40, 60kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 3

Little break, not a bad session.


----------



## Alfieharley1

Just out curiosity guys so I can relate to you are these including the 20 or 25kg bars?


----------



## JMorty

Mine are all inclusive of the bar but my weights aren't quite as impressive as most so need the little extra lol


----------



## Bod42

Ya mine include 20kgs extra for the bar.

All the weights in my workouts/spreadsheet are calculated without the bar so you know exactly how much weight to put on.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Alfieharley1 said:


> Just out curiosity guys so I can relate to you are these including the 20 or 25kg bars?


As with James and Powerlifting/Olympic standard, all weights include the 20Kg bar :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> My body just reacts really well to volume.


Does that mean we all need to post in CAPS LOL!:thumb:


----------



## JMorty

ITHAQVA said:


> Does that mean we all need to post in CAPS LOL!:thumb:


Pardon? I only heard the last bit...


----------



## ITHAQVA

JMorty said:


> Pardon? I only heard the last bit...


 VOLUME


----------



## Bod42

Phase 3 - Week 3 - Workout 2
Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 170x0, 152.5x2
Bulgarian Split Squats: 35x10,10,10,10
Kettlebell Swings: 17.5x15,15,15,15

So really disappointed to miss the 170kgs squat considering before this program I squatted a predicted 200kgs. But its been one of the most stressful weeks ever trying to arrange everything as we are trying to buy a house and getting finance is proving a royal PITA so can't expect to be on top form when your stressed and not concentrating.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 13/08/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 142.5KGX5 - 161.5KGX3 - 180.5KGX2

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 189.5KGX1 - 199KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 142.5KGX5X5X5*

Good workout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 14/08/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3)- 112.5KGX5 - 127.5KGX3 - 142.5KGX2

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 149.5KGX1 - 157KGX1

SQUAT (3 MRBSets) - 100KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Very happy with this workout, all goodlift reps, many more below paralel than before. I find having my feet slightly wider apart allows for my torso to go between my legs improving depth.

I've stopped the first set last as it was too heavy for training and focusing on depth/form and getting more volume in, I'll do the same for the other lifts as well :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Phase 3 - Week 3 - Workout 2
> Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 170x0, 152.5x2
> Bulgarian Split Squats: 35x10,10,10,10
> Kettlebell Swings: 17.5x15,15,15,15
> 
> So really disappointed to miss the 170kgs squat considering before this program I squatted a predicted 200kgs. But its been one of the most stressful weeks ever trying to arrange everything as we are trying to buy a house and getting finance is proving a royal PITA so can't expect to be on top form when your stressed and not concentrating.


Head up mate, still some decent weight lifted there :thumb: And you're right, any part of buying a house is a ballache! We moved 4 weeks ago and that was insanely stressful trying to sort the mortgage. :wall: Worth it in the end though

What is your current program by the way? Looking back the weights and reps on your squat look identical to your week 2 workout...



Bod42 said:


> Phase 3 - Week 2 - Workout 2
> Squats: 55x5, 92.5x5, 127.5x3, 145x2, 170x1, 152.5x3


----------



## Leebo310

*Chest/Shoulder workout*

*Bench*
WU 15xBar, 8x60kg
WO 5x76kg, 5x81kg, 5x87kg, 5x93kg, 8x100kg

*Bench drop set *
24x60kg, 12x50kg, 10x40kg

*Seated Military Press*
3x45kg, 3x50kg, 3x52.5kg, 3x55kg, 4x60kg

*Standing DB Side Raise*
7x10 @ 10kg with 30 seconds rest between sets

Happy with the bench, that gives me a predicted max of 126.6kg which is a PR on flat as far as I can tell! Especially happy given that I've been a bit disrupted for the past weeks due to moving house. 
Gym is now closed this week for refurbishment so am going to have the full week as a rest and then come back next Monday. 7 full days will be the longest that I haven't worked out for in around 3 years so it feels very weird already!


----------



## Alfieharley1

I had a week off last week at the gym I had my anniversary and other bits but went back today and felt so much stronger


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Head up mate, still some decent weight lifted there :thumb: And you're right, any part of buying a house is a ballache! We moved 4 weeks ago and that was insanely stressful trying to sort the mortgage. :wall: Worth it in the end though
> 
> What is your current program by the way? Looking back the weights and reps on your squat look identical to your week 2 workout...


Ya I just hope it all works out because I get my dream double garage so thats awesome for the gym and detailing. It must be the month for moving house as thats 3 of us lol.

Ya I'm not too phased by it as had a bit of a refeed the last week as basically couldn't be bothered with the diet and meal prep while dealing with all the stress etc and then last night I hit a CGBP record so it proves how important food is etc.

The program at the moment you keep the same weight and improve your reps then add reps so its 2-4 reps so once Ive worked upto 4 reps then I will increase the weight but you only do each phase for 3 weeks. And Ive lost over a stone in weight so don't really expect to improve on the reps. I'm still on the Defranco SB911 program and must say I have absolutely loved it.

So SB911 is an 11 week program, 9 weeks training, 1 week deload then 1 week testing but really whats the point in testing when you've lost so much weight so I may as well continue with my training so I have started at week 1 again and good to see some progress.

Close Grip Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 95x3, 107.5x2, 115x8, 102.5x6
Wide Grip Dumbell Push-Ups: BWx20,14,12,12
Bent-Over Dumbell Rows: 40x12,12,12,12
S/S Iso-hold Y-W-T's: BWx20,20,20,20 secs
Dead-Stop Lateral Raises: 7.5x12,12,10,10
S/S Single Arm Barbell Curls: 20x6,6,5,5

So its been 6 weeks since I did this phase of the program and I've lost over a stone in weight while simultaneously improving my CGBP, my push-ups, Laterals and Barbell curls so really can't complain.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 17/08/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 79.5KGX5 - 92KGX5 - 104KGX6

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 109KGX5 - 114KGX4 - 120KGX2

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 79.5KGX8X8X8X8X8*

A very good workout, I felt like i could have done some PR's but I'm taking it easy on the progress. I really like the format :thumb:

I did complete 3 reps on the 120 last joker set but the rep was ugly. It wasn't a rep you could count as progress


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 40, 60, 80, 90kg x 5
100kg x 5 x 2

Bench
20, 40, 60kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 3

Little break, not a bad session.

Same as last week, less sleep, more dehydration. Need to sort it out.


----------



## JMorty

Bokers said:


> Squats
> 20, 40, 60, 80, 90kg x 5
> 100kg x 5 x 2
> 
> Bench
> 20, 40, 60kg x 5
> 80kg x 5 x 3
> 
> Little break, not a bad session.
> 
> Same as last week, less sleep, more dehydration. Need to sort it out.


Nice work there! Get them fluids in, beer still counts


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 20/08/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 126.5KGX5 - 146KGX5 - 165KGX6

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 173KGX3 - 181.5KGX2 - 190.5KGX2

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 126.5KGX8X8X8X8X8*

Pleasing workout, I could have gone heavier with the joker sets but decided enough was enough and proceeded with some RDL's :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 21/08/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 100.5KGX5 - 116KGX5 - 131KGX6

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 100KGX6X6X6*

Kept it short today as I had doms from yesterday and I felt like jibbing out 

As usual I recorded the entire workout and all reps were good lift reps below parallel :thumb:

After this cycle or possibly next week I am going to have to move the deadlift session back into a week day.


----------



## Bokers

OHP
20, 30, 40, 45, 50kg x 5
40kg x 5 x 3

Chins
Full task assistance x 5 x 5

Dips
Full task assistance x 5 x 5

Curls
12.5 x 10 x 3 RP


----------



## Bod42

Ok so looks like we have sorted everything for buying our first house so thats the stress over and done with so back to lifting.

Close Grip Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 95x3, 107.5x2, 115x8, 102.5x9
Wide Grip Dumbell Push-Ups: BWx20,15,13,13
Bent-Over Dumbell Rows: 42.5x12,12,12,12
S/S Iso-hold Y-W-T's: BWx20,20,20,20 secs
Dead-Stop Lateral Raises: 7.5x12,12,10,10
S/S Single Arm Barbell Curls: 20x6,6,6,6

Ok so I've lost just over 6kgs now, should have been more but didnt do very well during the house buying stage. Anyway 6kgs lighter and 115x8 CGBP ties my all time record so really cant complain at my progress on this program. Losing weight and keeping 100% of your strength is way more than you can ever ask for. Also I have put some muscle on my shoulders and upper back while dieting. This program will definitely be added to my long term list.

Squats: 70x5, 90x5, 125x3, 145x2, 152.5x2, 137.5x4
Goblet Reverse Lunges: 25 Platex10,10,10
Barbell RDL's: 75x12,12,12,12
RKC Planks: 2 sets 5 reps 5 seconds

Ok so weirdly during this program my squat has tanked big time. I squatted 182.5x3 before starting this program and now I'm at 152.5x2. 30kgs is a big loss but I'm actually positive about it as in 9 weeks I've only done 6 heavy sets of squats so my form and technique are miles off. I actually believe that all the 1 single leg and hamstring work will improve my lower body lifts once I start throwing some volume back on them. Also the high bar squats completely threw my form out as I was trying to squat more upright but from years of Box squatting, i seem to have strong hamstrings and glutes or thats how my body wants to squat anyway. So this will sound weird but my problem has been doing a good morning squat out of the hole, how do you fix this, squat further back and bend over more. So to fix a problem of bending over to much, you bend over more? Sounds weird but its all about loading the muscles. So with an upright squat, my body fires my ar$e out of the hole leaving my upper body behind but by sitting back and leaning forwards more, my glutes and hamstring are already tight at the bottom so I can stand up more connected. It felt so much better.


----------



## Bokers

Deadlifts
60, 90, 120, 150kg x 5

Cable Rows
70kg x 10 x 4

Shrugs
100kg x 5 x 5


----------



## Leebo310

Bench day yesterday for me and first time back in the renovated gym for 8 days.

*Bench*
WU 20x Bar, 8x60kg
WO 3x80kg, 3x90kg, 3x92.5kg, 3x100kg, *7x105kg*
Second set was supposed to 3x87.5kg but in the gym refurb they seem to have lost the 2.5kg plates 
Happy with the 7 at 105kg, that gives me another PR predicted max of 129.5kg (although nowhere near actual record of weight on bar)

Then did a drop set to fail at 60kg, then 50kg before finally 40kg.
Managed 25 reps at 60, then just 10 each at 50 and 40.

Finished off with some side lateral raises of 3 sets of 20 reps with 10kg db's and 3 sets of 15 front cable raises (forgot to note the weight)

Squats tomorrow...


----------



## Leebo310

ITHAQVA said:


> Beyond 5/3/1 - 21/08/2016
> 
> *SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 100.5KGX5 - 116KGX5 - 131KGX6
> 
> SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 100KGX6X6X6*
> 
> Kept it short today as I had doms from yesterday and I felt like jibbing out
> 
> As usual I recorded the entire workout and all reps were good lift reps below parallel :thumb:
> 
> After this cycle or possibly next week I am going to have to move the deadlift session back into a week day.


Quick question Doug - why is the third warm up set at 3 reps so close to the weight of the first proper working set at 5 reps? I thought there was normally a bigger jump between the weights. I notice you also did it in your last bench where you actually did more weight on a warm up set than you did on the first working set (albeit more reps). I guess it's from the master Mr Wendler but was just wondering what the thinking/logic is behind it!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Quick question Doug - why is the third warm up set at 3 reps so close to the weight of the first proper working set at 5 reps? I thought there was normally a bigger jump between the weights. I notice you also did it in your last bench where you actually did more weight on a warm up set than you did on the first working set (albeit more reps). I guess it's from the master Mr Wendler but was just wondering what the thinking/logic is behind it!


lol they are percentages of my old 1 rep max's prior to this years de load on all my lifts , I've just been a bit lazy changing them as they are light anyway. They should be a little lighter in general but I don't see it impacting my work sets. :thumb:

Beyond 5/3/1 - 24/08/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 86KGX3 - 98KGX3 - 110KGX4

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 115.5KGX3 - 121KGX2 - 127KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 86KGX8X8X8X8X5
*

Really nice workout, I've greatly improved my bench technique :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 27/08/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 136KGX3 - 155.5KGX3 - 175KGX4

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 184KGX3 - 193KGX2 - 202.5KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 136KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Nice! 

Improvement was noticeable in my strength endurance today as I worked up to the 202.5KgX1 :thumb:

I just need to get fitter for my squat. I don't know about you guys but for me the squat is incredibly taxing.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 28/08/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 108KGX3 - 123.5KGX3 - 139KGX4

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 146KGX2 - 153KGX1 - 160.5KGX1

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 108KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

All good, very pleasing to be able to actually complete some joker sets on my squat :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

So I have now finished the Defranco SB911 program and what an awesome program, it taught me so much. I now have a 5 week break before i start pushing my golf over the summer so wanted a Linear program to bring my strength back up and I decided on Candito. I really want to do 5/3/1 + Joker + FSL as I actually think this is the perfect workout and sort of what i came up with on my own anyway but with the Candito you are hitting Bench, Back, Squats and Deadlifts twice per week which will bring my lifts back up quicker I think.

Anyway first workout.
Bench: 50x5, 80x5, 110x3, 115x6,6,6
Barbell Rows: 70x6,6,6
Seated Shoulder Press: 40x6
Chinups: BWx4
Incline Flyes: 15x12,12,12
Face Pulls with external Rotation: Purple Bandsx12,12,12

I enjoyed this workout as its back to minimalist training which is always nice after a program where your doing 10 different exercises per workout.

Bench was harder than it should have been really as I went back to normal grip and 6 reps was hard when i did 8 reps of close grip last week and my record is 12 reps at 115 so this should have been an easy as workout.

Changed rows to Ed Coan rows to try and get some proper weight on the bar over the next few weeks. Theres more body movement in them so you can use more weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 31/08/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 92KGX5 - 104KGX3 - 116KGX2

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 122KGX1 - 128KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 92KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Reasonable session, peak strength with six work sets isn't there yet but strength recovery is getting better on first set last sets.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Candito Linear 2nd Workout

Squats: 52.5x5, 90x5, 122.5x3, 130x6,6,6
Deadlifts: 70x5, 95x5, 132.5x3, 140x6,6

Been ages since I have done deadlifts after squats and the 1st set of deadlifts was definitely hard.

Same as the bench workout really, shouldnt have been as hard as it was but got all the reps in. Deadlift form feels good but squat form is still way off. Its just time under the bar and pause squats on fri should help tidy up my form.


----------



## Bod42

Candito Linear Week 1 - Workout 3

Medicine Ball Chest Throw: 5x3
Spoto Press: 45x5, 72.5x5, 102.5x3, 107.5x4,4,4,4,4,4
Barbell row: 70x4,4,4,4,4,4 2 sec contraction at the top
Seated Barbell Press: 35x10
Chinup: BWx5

I have never done Spoto press or rows with a pause at the top and I really liked them. The spoto press is miles harder than I thought it would be but it does really teach you to stay tight at the bottom and explode.

I really liked the rows with pause as nice to know that I can do a really controlled, zero body movement, pause at the top movement with 70kgs and it was quite easy. I think doing 1 workout with more momentum and heavier and then a really strict workout will really add to my row strength.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 03/09/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 146KGX5 - 165KGX3 - 185KGX2

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 194KGX1 - 203.5KGX1 - 213.5KGX0

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 146KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Nice workout, was a little disappointing that i failed the 213.5, but considering this was my sixth work set I shouldn't be too hard on myself.

Beyond 5/3/1 is definitely helping as I don't feel so tired after workouts now, but the deadlift and I seem to get on very well 

Lift on! :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 04/09/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 116KGX5 - 131KGX3 - 147KGX2

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 154KGX1 - 162KGX1 - 170KGX1

SQUAT (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 116KGX5X5X5*

Very pleasing workout for me. To be able to "good lift" 170Kg for 1 rep on my sixth work set is great for my motivation. I could have gone a little heavier but I'm trying to build back up in a steady way, the joker sets already give me added flexibility to the workout without the usual pressure of "Must make this set or else the month is shot" as with the original 5/3/1.

Thats my first six week cycle on Beyond 5/3/1 completed and I have enjoyed it greatly, de load next week then onto another six week cycle :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Pause Squats: 40x5, 65x5, 90x3, 105x2, 110x4,4,4,4,4,4
Pause Deadlifts: 80x5, 110x3, 122.5x2, 130x4,4,4

I was shocked how hard this workout was. I paused for 3 secs in the bottom of the rep which meant i had zero stretch reflect on the reps. They work you in such a different way than regualr squats but the biggest bennefit is for technique, you have to stay tight at the bottom and during that 3 secs you can alter the weighting on your foot to get it perfect before exploding with the weight.

Pause deadlifts were similar, you have to have great form to break the weight off the floor, then pause, then get going again.

Bench Press: 40x5, 70x5, 100x3, 112.5x2, 117.5x6,6,6
Barbell Rows: 80x6,6,6
Seated Barbell Press: 42.5x6
Chin-Ups: BWx6
Incline Flys: 15x12,12,12
Face pulls: Purple Bands x12,12,12

Was so pleased with this workout as last week was a bit of a grind to get all my reps but this week, the reps were faster and felt miles better. Keen to hit 120kgs for 3x6 next week as thats a nice milestone. Its just nice to get back to some simple heavy lifting.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 50x5, 80x5, 112.5x3, 127.5x2, 135x6,6,6
Deadlifts: 90x5, 120x3, 137.5x2, 145x6,6

Squats are feeling slightly better but form still isnt quite there but happy with the workout overall. Just need to man up a bit and get the squats in.

Deadlifts are dam hard after squats.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Deadlifts are dam hard after squats.


James, why not do them on a separate day, are you not limiting the amount of weight you can peak at by training together?


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Pause Squats: 40x5, 65x5, 90x3, 105x2, 110x4,4,4,4,4,4
> Pause Deadlifts: 80x5, 110x3, 122.5x2, 130x4,4,4
> 
> I was shocked how hard this workout was. I paused for 3 secs in the bottom of the rep which meant i had zero stretch reflect on the reps. They work you in such a different way than regualr squats but the biggest bennefit is for technique, you have to stay tight at the bottom and during that 3 secs you can alter the weighting on your foot to get it perfect before exploding with the weight.


I've been doing paused squats for a while too James, they are great eh! I do mine after my main working set though, rather than as a dedicated work out. I find this way it makes the weight seem a lot lighter on the pause sets, given that I've worked up to a heavier weight prior. 
Really gives a burn at the bottom and like you said it massively helps with the explosive strength up using no momentum, just pure leg drive.



ITHAQVA said:


> DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 194KGX1 - *203.5KGX1* - 213.5KGX0


Nice deadlift Doug, even without the 213.5! 203.5kg is impressive :thumb: What is that as a percentage of your bodyweight?


----------



## JMorty

Last nights compound day

Dumbbell OHP:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 4, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 24, 26, 36, 40, 36, 26, 24

Dumbbell Bench Press:
Reps: 10, 8, 6, 4, 6, 8, 10
Weight: 24, 26, 36, 40, 36, 26, 24

Deadlift: Pyramid reps
Weight: 60, 80, 100, 110, 100, 80, 60


----------



## Bokers

Squats
20, 40, 60, 80, 90, 100kg x 5

Xtrainer

Too long a lay off and going to have to up the cardio as it's rugby time.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Nice deadlift Doug, even without the 213.5! 203.5kg is impressive :thumb: What is that as a percentage of your bodyweight?


Thanks Lee, considering before my step brother passed on I was up to 222.5Kg for one (Two times body weight) its not that good, but its progress 

I weigh in at 111.3Kg/244.86 pounds and around 20-22% body fat even though my heaviest about two years ago I was 117.7Kg/259 pounds body fat around 25% :doublesho I've lowered my calories a little as I don't want to get any bigger but be able to maintain progress :thumb:

My Deadlift goal is 230Kg for one :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> James, why not do them on a separate day, are you not limiting the amount of weight you can peak at by training together?


I would normally agree Doug but I have increased my frequency so I'm training everything twice per week at the moment so i have to train them together. I will also be doing 6 months of training them in the same session as I will only be working out twice per week so got to get used to it.



Leebo310 said:


> I've been doing paused squats for a while too James, they are great eh! I do mine after my main working set though, rather than as a dedicated work out. I find this way it makes the weight seem a lot lighter on the pause sets, given that I've worked up to a heavier weight prior.
> Really gives a burn at the bottom and like you said it massively helps with the explosive strength up using no momentum, just pure leg drive.


Ya I think they are really going to help with getting my squat form back and what raw lifter cant use more strength out of the hole. Normally I would pause Squat after normal squats but I as I'm squatting twice per week, I may as well split them up.


----------



## Bokers

Bench Press
20, 50, 70kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 5

Tricep cable push
70kg x 12 x 4

Rushed, but done.


----------



## Bokers

X-trainer

OHP 50kg x 5 x 5

Shrugs 100kg x 5 x 5


----------



## Bokers

Rowing

Kettle bells

Deadlift
100kg x 5 x 5

Cable Row
70kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 100x3, 115x2, 120x6,6,6
Barbell Rows: 85x6,6,6
Seated Barbell Press: 45x6
Chin-Ups: BWx6
Incline Flys: 15x12,12,12
Face pulls: Purple Bands x12,12,12

Now this was a nice milestone to hit, 100kgs on the bar for multiple sets. I'm normally good at an all out top set and then all my remaining sets fall off really quickly but really pleased to get 3 sets of 6. I will now just stay with this weight for a few weeks and concentrate on getting faster and easier reps. My best ever with 120kgs is 8 reps so again I'm pleased to get its for 3x6 and I could have definitely got 8 reps on my first set but the big difference is I am 6kgs lighter as I'm now 105kgs. 

Say the same every week but I actually like the heavier rows, would like to get up to 120kgs on these and I'm sure I can do it back strength wise but even at 85kgs I struggle with my grip. Need to throw in some grip work.


----------



## Bokers

Jog

Bench
75kg x 5 x 5 Didn't feel good. Need to work on the form.

Dips
Full stack assistance x 10 x 3

Incline db press
20kg x 10 x 3

Short and sweet as per.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 14/09/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 81KGX5 - 93.5KGX5 - 106KGX6

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 111KGX5 - 116.5KGX3 - 122KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 81KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Felt very strong throughout the workout however the downside is the 122 came out the j hooks so quick i lost my tightness and nearly dropped the bar on my chest, this totally wrecked the set, but hey I got one rep in! 

Still very happy I took as large de load, I'm hoping by Christmas I will build up to a nice foundation for my goals in the new year :thumb:


----------



## jonezy

Last nights routine as i missed monday so did mondays last night

Back squat 
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

Bench Press
[email protected]

Seated DB shoulder press [email protected]
Superset With
Tricep extensions [email protected]

Press ups 5x15
S/S
Bench dips 4x25

Finished with a dropset of
2 rounds: Attack the rack bicep curls 15-12-10-7-5kg


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 17/09/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 129KGX5 - 149KGX5 - 169KGX6

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 177.5KGX3 - 186KGX2 - 195KGX1

RDL lol DEADLIFT! (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 129KGX5X5X5*

Good workout, strength dropped on joker sets and i'm annoyed i stopped on three reps on the 177.5, have no idea why i just decided yep that's enough 

And I was so focused i forgot to do RDL's and just carried on deadlifting on the first set last sets :waveOH!

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 18/09/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 103KGX5 - 119KGX5 - 135KGX6 = Questionable depth*

Reasonable workout, except for last work set, the reps were not good enough for my liking so I will be doing this months squat weight again next month.


----------



## JMorty

Some very strong work there!!!

Nice work out, RDL's are looking sweet!

I know this is a strength training thread but are we okay to post body building stuff here or would we prefer a different topic?


----------



## Bod42

JMorty said:


> Some very strong work there!!!
> 
> Nice work out, RDL's are looking sweet!
> 
> I know this is a strength training thread but are we okay to post body building stuff here or would we prefer a different topic?


The line between Bodybuilding and strength training is getting closer and closer the more we learn. Both types of training should have aspects of the other type used throughout their program so feel free to post in here.

I think its the geared lifters who actually put training back by quite a sizeable timeframe because if you look at Raw lifters then they train for muscle size and strength.

Also if your goal is to maximise size then you should be switching between intensification & accumulation phases anyway. I know way to many bodybuilders who stall out as they just stay in the accumulation phase forever. If you lift RAW and don't take any "enhancing" substances then still the best way to grow muscle is to add weight to the bar. To get stronger while not putting on muscle is actually extremely difficult.

Squats: 40x5, 65x5, 110x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x2, 150x6,6

Some of you may notice how light my squats are but I am actually most proud of this training session as I decided to pull back due to how i felt. I have been having back pain and never have back pain, I have also been struglling with my left knee so what is the point of pushing through pain when I'm not going to get anywhere near a PR anyway. So I lowered the weight, concentrated on perfect form and moving the weight nice and fast, low and behold the knee was better the next day and I was sore.

Deadifts still feel weird after Squats but we shall get there and my body will adapt.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> The line between Bodybuilding and strength training is getting closer and closer the more we learn. Both types of training should have aspects of the other type used throughout their program so feel free to post in here.
> 
> I think its the geared lifters who actually put back training by quite a sizeable timeframe because if you look at Raw lifters then they train for muscle size and strength.
> 
> Also if your goal is to maximise size then you should be switching between intensification & accumulation phases anyway. I know way to many bodybuilders who stall out as they just stay in the accumulation phase forever. If you lift RAW and don't take any "enhancing" substances then still the best way to grow muscle is to add weight to the bar. To get stronger while not putting on muscle is actually extremely difficult.
> 
> Squats: 40x5, 65x5, 110x5,5,5,5,5
> Deadlifts: 90x5, 125x3, 142.5x2, 150x6,6
> 
> Some of you may notice how light my squats are but I am actually most proud of this training session as I decided to pull back due to how i felt. I have been having back pain and never have back pain, I have also been struglling with my left knee so what is the point of pushing through pain when I'm not going to get anywhere near a PR anyway. So I lowered the weight, concentrated on perfect form and moving the weight nice and fast, low and behold the knee was better the next day and I was sore.
> 
> Deadifts still feel weird after Squats but we shall get there and my body will adapt.


Agree with James, a natural bodybuilder should actually be training like a powerlifter. The body building routines have come from the steroid boys were training a body part more specifically produces result when CHEATING! sorry using steroids!

I do have an old twice a week 8-10 week arm routine that produces excellent results - Stretch marks on a natural lifter on both the Biceps and Triceps :thumb: If you body builders are interested and want to give it a try ill post it here :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

ITHAQVA said:


> Agree with James, a natural bodybuilder should actually be training like a powerlifter. The body building routines have come from the steroid boys were training a body part more specifically produces result when CHEATING! sorry using steroids!
> 
> I do have an old twice a week 8-10 week arm routine that produces excellent results - Stretch marks on a natural lifter on both the Biceps and Triceps :thumb: If you body builders are interested and want to give it a try ill post it here :thumb:


Whats the basic outlined Doug? The best arm gains I ever had (still have the stretch marks now) was to basically do 5x5 on Bench and Rows then follow up with Skull Crushers and Barbell Curls for 5x5 adding 1kg per week.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Whats the basic outlined Doug? The best arm gains I ever had (still have the stretch marks now) was to basically do 5x5 on Bench and Rows then follow up with Skull Crushers and Barbell Curls for 5x5 adding 1kg per week.


Bad news is you'll have stretch marks for ever now mate, join the club 

I'll do triceps tonight a Biceps another night :thumb:

Remember I was in my mid 30's and so youth helped me but it worked very well. Also this all from memory as i threw all my old logs out years ago, but my approach was simple, 5 days a week. After 6 weeks of this i was burnt out and needed 1-2 weeks off before the next cycle, everything was as heavy as possible using progressive overload, 2.5kg for upper body lifts and 5kg for lower body lifts etc...

Once per week - Triceps

Warm up the best way that suites you to get to the first heavy set, but be as frugal as you can because you will need the energy to complete the routine, but be safe!

The progression will rapidly become aggressive and stalling within 6 weeks is not uncommon once you train with your true maximums for each given group of sets :devil: If memory serves 3 cycles of this was enough for entire year. totaling an averaged of 18 weeks training like this.

5 sets of Close grip bench press, use weight that allows at least 1-4 reps but no more, train to around one rep short of failure.

5 Sets of Close grip bench press, Use weight that allows 5-7 reps but no more, train to around one rep short of failure.

5 sets of Close grip bench press, Use weight that allows 6-9 reps but no more, train to around one rep short of failure.

Flexible Progression 
And you'll need it as hitting a wall will happen very quickly! Using the 1-4 rep range keep adding 2.5Kg as long as you can complete at least 1 rep on all sets, you can allow the weights on these sets to vary but go HEAVY! My best and a good example for this week
was 180Kg for 1, 170Kg for 1, 160Kg for 2, 150Kg for 3 and 140Kg for 4. Now as you can see i made at least one rep or more on every set so I could add 2.5Kg the following week for all sets and aim for at least 1-4 reps. You will find very quickly that you will plateau, But as long as you get 1 rep per set you can keep adding 2.5Kg per week :thumb:

The second group of sets, the 5-7 rep range. Use a weight that allows you to achieve at least 5 reps per set (As per above the weights can be varied or the same, its the reps that keep structure and progression) Your goal on this section is to only add weight to any set that you achieved 7 reps on, but you must really fight for 7 reps on each set, as progression becomes more difficult you will find some sets allow progression some will plateau :wall::devil:

The third group of sets, the 6-9 rep range. Use a weight that allows at least 6 reps and build up to 9 reps, on achieving 9 reps on any given set add 2.5Kg. Your weights on each set can vary or be the same as long as you follow the reps rule :thumb:

As you can see the whole session is one huge plate strip routine, simple harsh and very effective due to using a compound movement to produce growth.
Once you've reached the maximum reps on each set and added weight, the following session you must be able to complete at least the minimum rep count on each set, build up to the highest rep number then add 2.5kg and the following session aim for the at least minimum and build your reps to the maximum then add more weight. This is the progression structure.

The biggest problem is I used machine that was similar to a glorified smith machine which allowed a true close grip bench press, my hands touched when gripping the bar and I pushed my arms together and up this involved the triceps in such an amazing way, your arms should look a bit like this at the start of the lift <> you then push up as if you were trying to get your inner elbows to touch then ending ||, the squeeze on the triceps was a huge reason why my bench used to be so good. The problem is you cant do this with free weights especially when they get heavy, if you can find a machine to do this, try it and feel the pain!

Alternatively if using free weights, use a traditional close grip bench press, but you must keep form strict, arms close to torso so to massively involve the Triceps, this way you will benefit from the lift to a very good degree :thumb:

I hope that is clear enough guys, any questions please feel free to ask


----------



## Bod42

Bench Press: 42.5x5, 72.5x5, 100x3, 115x2, 120x6,6,6
Barbell Rows: 90x6,6,6
Seated Barbell Press: 47.5x6
Chin-Ups: BWx6

Got the 120x3x6 again which is good but I know its not all about weight on the bar, grinding out weights week after week doesnt help your strength so will be dropping the weight back down and working back up, its the 5 forward 3 back mentality that seems to give constant gains.

I am loving the Ed Coan rows, even though their not strict, you get one hell of a pump in your back.

Thanks Doug, 15 sets of heavy work will definitely get the triceps growing. Another way to do really close grip press like you did on the smith machine is to use an EZ bar, the angle points the wrists outwards slightly and takes the stress off them so you can concentrate on the exercise. I find skull crushers the best exericse to add size to the triceps but they take their toll on your elbows.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Thanks Doug, 15 sets of heavy work will definitely get the triceps growing. Another way to do really close grip press like you did on the smith machine is to use an EZ bar, the angle points the wrists outwards slightly and takes the stress off them so you can concentrate on the exercise. I find skull crushers the best exericse to add size to the triceps but they take their toll on your elbows.


IMHO there is no better lift than the CGBP as in the style I described because it basically is a very close gripped bench press, as opposed to the traditional version you see on the net etc..which isn't a bench press and it most certainly ain't that much a close grip either  See we had bull**** in the 80's and 90's aswell!  
My version is a bench press but because of the closeness of the hands it involves the triceps immensely, try it and you'll feel the triceps at work as you squeeze to the top :devil:

Using a smith machine or something like it will allow you to load a lot of weight :thumb: And as we all know natural lifters to reach their fullest potential need to use a lot of WEIGHT!:devil:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 21/09/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 139KGX3 - 159KGX3 - 179KGX4

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 188.5KGX2 - 197.5KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 139KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Good enough considering how tired i felt after work, so pleased really :thumb:

I'll keep the deadlift in the week now as i'm finding it difficult to recover from doing both the deadlift and squat over the weekends :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bench day yesterday for me. Have been away with work a lot recently so I've only managed 2 workouts in the past two weeks prior to this one.

*Bench*
WU 20x Bar, 8x60kg
WO 3x80kg, 3x90kg, 3x100kg, 1x110kg, 1x120kg, *1x125kg* genuine PB!!! :devil::devil:

As normal I then did a drop set to fail at 60kg, then 50kg before finally 40kg.
Managed 26 reps at 60, then just 13 at 50 and 12 at 40.

Did a little bit of shoulders after but was pretty spent from the layoff and maxing out on bench so cut it short. Very happy to get a new PB and I'm on course for 130kg by the end of November. 125 actually went up a lot easier than I thought it would. 
Current weight has dropped a little from the lack of consistency in my diet over the past couple of weeks (again due to working away so much) so I'm actually weighing only 76.5kg as of this morning. Makes me even happier that I managed 125kg and give me a better strength/weight ratio :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Bit of a mish mash today as again my workouts are disrupted by other things. This was going to be my last workout till next Monday so after doing chest yesterday, I wanted to get both squats and a decent back session in today! Didn't plan on going quite as heavy with the squats as I did but felt pretty good so did ok. Only thing was that left me completely fried for the back part of the workout!

*Squat*
WU - 10x60kg, 10x80kg 
WO - 8x100kg, 5x120kg, 3x130kg, 2x135kg, 2x140kg

20x60kg, 20x60kg, 20x60kg (90 seconds rest between sets)

*Bent Over Row*
20x50kg, 15x60kg, 12x70kg, 12x80kg

*Seated Pulley Row*
20x105lb, 15x125lb, 12x145lb

*Straight Arm Standing Pull Down*
20x75lb, 20x75lb, 20x75lb

*Lying Cable Curls*
20x75lb, 20x85lb, 20x95lb, 20x105lb


----------



## Bokers

Cycle

Squats
100kg x 5 x 3 Good form

All to short and sweet at the moment.


----------



## JMorty

Legs night tonight.

It's light as it was concentration on the eccentric. Minimum 3 sec eccentric.

Squat
Set 1: 40 kg × 8
Set 2: 40 kg × 8
Set 3: 40 kg × 8

Leg Extension
Set 1: 30 kg × 8
Set 2: 30 kg × 8
Set 3: 30 kg × 8

Front Squat
Set 1: 30 kg × 8
Set 2: 35 kg × 8
Set 3: 35 kg × 8

Leg Press
Set 1: 65 kg × 8
Set 2: 65 kg × 8
Set 3: 65 kg × 8

Lunge (Dumbbell)
Set 1: 15 kg × 8
Set 2: 15 kg × 8
Set 3: 15 kg × 8

One word, brutal.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 24/09/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 87.5KGX3 - 100KGX3 - 112.5KGX4

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 118KGX2 - 123.5KGX1 - 129.5KGX1

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 87.5KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

First weekend bench session, felt good. Stopped on one rep on the 123.5 HAVE NO IDEA WHY!!!! :wall::wall:

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> *Bench*
> 
> *1x125kg* genuine PB!!! :devil::devil:


Nice one Lee :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Cycling

OHP
55kg x 5, 4
50, 40kg x 5
30kg x 8

Shrugs
90, 100, 110kg x 5

Tricep pushdown
75kg x 10 x 3


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 29/09/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 149KGX5 - 169KGX3 - 189KGX2

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 198.5KGX1 - 208.5KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 150KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Work has been insane, message to self, anyone want me to have anything to do with OS2 Warp 4.52 can  off!  I felt tired before the workout but it all went very well, wanted to pull 219Kg for one as my last joker set but i just didn't have anything left and i went about 6-8" off the floor


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 01/10/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 93.5KGX5 - 106KGX3 - 118.5KGX2

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 124.5KGX1 - 130.5KGX1 - 137KGX0

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 93.5KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Nice! :thumb: Slowly building back up, I was hoping to get the 137 but TBH after five work sets I'm not surprised I didn't mange it. The 130.5 was relatively easy which was a bonus. Still loving joker sets as they allow for a two tiered approach to progress although the down side for me personally is I start to lose the energy to go heavier after 4-5 work sets on the bench.

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 02/10/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 119KGX5 - 135KGX3 - 151KGX2

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 158.5KGX1 - 166.5KGX0*

Kept it short today, all reps were good :thumb: Failed on the 166.5 but I think it was more to do with energy which allowed my form to drop off and i losened up at the bottom of the squat :wall:

:thumb:


----------



## Bokers

X-trainer

OHP
55kg x 5, 5, 2
40kg x 8 x 2

Shrugs
100kg x 5
120kg x 5 x 2


----------



## Leebo310

*Bench*
WU 20x Bar, 8x60kg
WO 5x77.5kg, 5x82.5kg, 5x90kg, 5x95kg, 9x100kg

*Seated Military Press*
5x45kg, 5x47.5kg, 5x50kg, 5x55kg, 8x57.5kg

*DB Side Raise Standing*
30x7.5kg, 30x7.5kg, 30x7.5kg

*Front Cable Raise Cluster set*
4:15 - 35lbs


----------



## Bod42

Ok so I'm back to lifting after finally getting the house sorted and moving into our new house. It has a double garage so plenty of space for the gym. Anyway I will only be lifting twice per week for the next 6 months while I push my golf hard and see where I can get with that.

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 122.5x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x10,8,8
Barbell Rows: 80x8,8,8,8
Chins: BWx2,3,2,2

So the idea with this workout is to improve on speed and basically how easy the set is and to never grind a weight so with Bench I always left a rep or 2 in the tank and concentrated on speed which is a great way to train. Remember this isn't actually speed training, your trying to move the bar as fast as possible but it still moves slowly due to the heavy weight.

I will be sticking with this workout for a long time to see where it takes me.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Ok so I'm back to lifting after finally getting the house sorted and moving into our new house. It has a double garage so plenty of space for the gym. Anyway I will only be lifting twice per week for the next 6 months while I push my golf hard and see where I can get with that.
> 
> Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 122.5x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
> 
> Incline Press: 70x10,8,8
> 
> Barbell Rows: 80x8,8,8,8
> 
> Chins: BWx2,3,2,2
> 
> So the idea with this workout is to improve on speed and basically how easy the set is and to never grind a weight so with Bench I always left a rep or 2 in the tank and concentrated on speed which is a great way to train. Remember this isn't actually speed training, your trying to move the bar as fast as possible but it still moves slowly due to the heavy weight.
> 
> I will be sticking with this workout for a long time to see where it takes me.


Nice to have you back lifting buddy 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Nice to have you back lifting buddy
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks Mate. Sadly only twice per week as I'm eager to hit a full on powerlifting program and put some strenth on but I'm 30 now and feel like I should push my Golf 1 last time and see where I can go before I get to old. Also I havent upgraded my equipment in like 13 years so want to be playing well when I get all fit for that as Golf stuff isnt cheap.

I will put pictures up in here once my Garage is complete but it will be awhile. Hopefully building a lifting platform at the weekend.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

So this workout is based on CAT (Compensatory Acceleration Training) and basically it is putting 100% effort into every single rep making the weight on the bar somewhat unimportant. So 120kgs is 60% of my max, 5x5 with 60% should be easy for anyone here but this was 1 of the hardest workouts I've done in a long time, completely different muscles hurt than usual. I just try to imagine throwing the weight off my shoulders through the ceiling meaning I drive the bar throughout the entire rep. Instead of concentrating on a rep goal, you are concentrating on speed and time. To progress you start the timer when you start your first set and the aim is to finish all 5 sets in under 15 mins while keeping every rep fast. Last night I took 17 mins and some reps slowed down so I have some progress to make.

Deadlifts felt good for the first time on ages. Same CAT process with the deadlifts, stick with the weight until you make it look stupid how fast you are lifting it.

One thing I have to say with this workout is you are progressing towards making the reps fast, not easy, really have to stress that as if you put 100% effort into every single rep then its never easy. Looking forward to deadlifts at 160kgs and making it fast for 5 sets of 3 will be a decent weight.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 06/10/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 132KGX5 - 152.5KGX5 - 173KGX6

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 181.5KGX3 - 190.5KGX2 - 200KGX1

RDL (1-2 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 132KGX5X5X5X5*

Started the workout feeling tired but after just two warm up sets my strength just kicked in and every set felt really good, weights felt well within my capabilities.

Very nice workout :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
> Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3
> 
> So this workout is based on CAT (Compensatory Acceleration Training) and basically it is putting 100% effort into every single rep making the weight on the bar somewhat unimportant..


So when one of my cats is sitting on the window ledge watching me while im lifting that's not CAT training 

Seriously though in regards to this approach i have some questions:

Do you have to use *PURR*fect form and should you train to *pussy*tive failure?

Also to be legit do you do stretches on the *scratching post?
*
Does your energy *tail* off really quick after he main work sets?

Can you incorporate rest *PAWS* training in this method?

Would you add just a *whisker* more weight as you progress?

Do you need any special diet for CAT training as i've heard you need to up your* catros*! Especially focusing on eating more *mous*aka, *rat*atouille and *vole*slaw

I'm *itching* to try this workout, but the *meow* I think about it beyond 5/3/1 suites me best, call me a *pussy* but that's how it is.

Seriously though, i think the idea for squatting and dealifting on the same day originally came from the bodybuilder *Tom* platz

The Barrel has been scraped of cat puns and i need to *lion* down and rest 

Sadly if i spent more time writing this I could probably come out with loads more  I am so ashamed right now :wave:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I will be sticking with this workout for a long time to see where it takes me.


If its CAT training, the nearest bowl of Whiskas supermeat! 

:thumb:

I really am a sad individual 

I do solemnly promise not to go there with the cat theme again James but you know me my brain is *littered* with ideas 

Im done I need to lift :wave::tumbleweed:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 08/10/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 83KGX5 - 95.5KGX5 - 108KGX6

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 113KGX3 - 118.5KGX2 - 124KGX1 - 130KGX1

BENCH PRESS (1-3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 83KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

A very good session :thumb: Very surprised that my strength held out up to 130KG as it did with this weeks deadlift session, also ive reduced the rest period between the first set last set sets, i seem to be finding them easier to complete now and don't seem to be so gassed. I'm hoping this is a combination of losing some weight and becoming fitter but maintaining progress to my goals. I am experienced enough though to know that tomorrows squat session will be a different story.

In regards to my squat I have contacted British powerlifting: https://www.britishpowerlifting.org/index To ask for some coaching or assistance from competing powerlifters and they seem very helpful and have already given me two contacts that are within 15 miles from me :thumb:

Hopefully this post will redeem me from this mornings posts 

Please, forgive me but i have to say this!  I am still using the *purr*gresive overload principle! 

I would just like to say that my recent CAT pun incident is not my fault, I have been struck by lightning and the aliens told me to do it, they surrounded me with exploding carrots and forced me into a mental state from which I cannot be held responsible for  Thats me off the hook me thinks


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 09/10/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 106KGX5 - 122.5KGX5 - 139KGX6

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 146KGX2 - 153KGX1*

Had to make it short today, lots on. But what was done was really good, I would have like to have gone for the third joker set as I felt strong, but life eh. I did do 3 reps on the 146 but IMHO the first rep was not as good as I would have liked, although in some federations i see they don't care about a parallel squat and the rep would've counted as good lift.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

I think I may have to change program just to stop Doug and his Cat Puns :lol::thumb:

Thats really cool about contacting British Powerlifting Doug, always good to get an outsiders opinion on squat form etc.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bod42 said:


> I think I may have to change program just to stop Doug and his Cat Puns :lol::thumb:
> 
> Thats really cool about contacting British Powerlifting Doug, always good to get an outsiders opinion on squat form etc.




Yep, looking forward to some help, squatted 153 yesterday all good, but i think i still need a few pointers :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 122.5x1, 110x8,6,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x12,10,10
Barbell Rows: 82.5x8,8,8,8
Chins: BWx2,2,2,2

My workout updates will be pretty boring for a few months as they will be exactly the same weights and workout pretty much. 

Tonights session wasnt the best, my form was off which is definitely strange for bench as I'm normally pretty good. Again I just concentrated on speed and left a rep or 2 in the tank on every set.

Loving the Coan Rows, yes they look loose form wise but they seem to hit your back better than strict rows and let you handle heavier weights. My grip strength will be the problem with these.


----------



## Bokers

X-trainer

OHP
55kg x 5, 3
50kg x 5
40kg x 8 x 2

Shurgs
110kg x 10 x 3

Lat raises
5kg x 10 x 3

Played rugby for the first time in a long time and still feeling it. Expected the lower OHP. Not too bad considering.


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Power clean
20, 40kg x 3 x 3

Deadlift
60, 80, 110, 150kg x 5 x 2

Cable row
50kg x 10 x 4

Leg curl
10 x 4


----------



## Bokers

Bike.

Bench
20, 50, 70, 80kg x 5 x 5 upping next week.

Dips
Stack -1, -2 x 10
Stack -3 x 7 x 2

Cable tricep pushdowns
70kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Leebo310

Bokers said:


> Bike
> 
> Power clean
> 20, 40kg x 3 x 3
> 
> Deadlift
> 60, 80, 110, 150kg x 5 x 2
> 
> Cable row
> 50kg x 10 x 4
> 
> Leg curl
> 10 x 4


Nice deadlift buddy 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 13/10/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 142KGX3 - 163KGX3 - 183KGX4

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 192KGX2 - 201.5KGX1 - 211.5KGX1

RDL (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 142KGX5X5X5
*

Cracking workout, was nice to get the 211.5Kg up and being able to complete six work sets and moving onto the FSLS without feeling drained. The 211.5 was difficult but not as i was expecting :thumb:

In contact with a competing lifter who has offered to help with my squat, which is great :thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Bokers said:


> Bike
> 
> Power clean
> 20, 40kg x 3 x 3
> 
> Deadlift
> 60, 80, 110, 150kg x 5 x 2
> 
> Cable row
> 50kg x 10 x 4
> 
> Leg curl
> 10 x 4


Deadlift is coming on nice bokers :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Awesome lifts Doug 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ITHAQVA

Leebo310 said:


> Awesome lifts Doug
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks Lee. If I could only get my Squat back in the groove then I would be happy


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

Good workout, the squats felt so much better this week, a lot faster and was recovering between sets way faster. I have been having problems with bar placement on my back but I fixed that this week as well.

Strange how the squats went so well but the deadlifts were harder, still got all my reps though so I'm happy with that.


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Squats
20, 50, 80, 90, 100kg x 5 x 5

Chinups
Stack x 10, 8, 6

Curls
10kg x 10 x 3


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 15/10/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 89KGX3 - 102KGX3 - 114.5KGX4

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 120KGX2 - 126KGX1 - 132KGX0 = lol you really know when you miss a lift due to terrible timing :wall:

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 89KGX5X5X5X5X5
*

Another good session apart from the 132 which was so badly timed I laughed at myself :lol: lol im such a noob!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 16/10/2016

*SQUAT (WU 70X5 80X5 100X3) - 114.5KGX3 - 131KGX3 - 147KGX2 good reps and 2 questionable depth reps, this months squat weights will be repeated next month.

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 154KGX1 - 161.5KGX0

SQUAT (5 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 115KGX5X5X5X5X5*

Not as good as I would liked. However one thing i did notice is that it feels like I've not fully recovered between sets especially between the 131, 147, 154 and 161.5. When i was progressing better a couple of years a go I used a seven minute rest period between work sets and even Wendler states that there should be ten minutes rest between the main work sets and joker sets. I moved from a three minute rest period to five minute on the FSLS sets and the difference was significant and my form was much improved.

I'll have to experiment with rest periods for my squat over the next month or so, i definitely been feeling out of puff and un recovered between sets as the weight increases.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 122.5x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x13,8,8
Barbell Rows: 85x8,8,8,8
Chins: BWx2,2,2,2

Good workout, no records but just getting the work in. 

I sound like a broken record but still cant get over how good the Ed Coan Rows feel. Nice stretch at the bottom with a decent amount of weight. Next week I might try straps and see what I can work upto for a bit of a change. I never agree with straps as your only as strong as your weakest link but it will really highlight how much strength I'm losing just through poor grip strength.


----------



## Bokers

X-trainer

OHP
20kg x 10
40, 50kg x 5
55kg x 5, 3
50kg x 4
45kg x 5 x 3

Shrugs
120kg x 10 x 3

Lat raises
6kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Deadlifts
60, 110, 160kg x 5
110kg x 10

Cable row
60kg x 10 x 4


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 19/10/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 152.5KGX5 - 173KGX3 - 193KGX2

DEADLIFT (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) - 202.5KGX1

RDL (5 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 152.5KGX5X5X5*

An OK workout, would have like to have got an extra joker set but ran out of strength at 212.5 and failed it. But hey this is a very different approach and i can feel i still have DOMS in my hamstrings from Sundays squat session.And I should not be programming joker sets in, they are there for when you feel epic enough to do them.

I definitely feel i need next week off to fully recover for the next six week cycle :thumb:

The FSLS are getting harder too.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 160x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

Good workout, for the first time in what feels like months I actually got the bar in the perfect place on my back under my right shoulder. Been really struggling with that lately. I added 10kgs to my over warm up and got the weight. It wasnt a real struggle but was a slight grind which is a bit disappointing as I would hope to hit 90% of my max and this is only 80%.

Good workout, got all my reps but will be keeping the rest periods the same and concentrating on rep speed and time between each rep.


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 22/10/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 95.5KGX5 - 108KGX3 - 121KGX2

BENCH PRESS (5 MRBSets - JOKER SETS) 130KGX1 ugleeeeeeeeeeeee lol!

BENCH PRESS (3 MRBSets - FIRST SET LAST) - 95.5KGX5X5X5X5X5*

In and out a bit rushed but ok, the 130 was pretty ugly TBH but i didn't rest enough to recover.

I've done 12 weeks beyond 5/3/1 and I really like it, i will continue with it for now.

:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

Nothing exciting here weights wise but I smoked the 150 and the 5x5 sets were faster so yes I havent put any weight on the bar but have I got stronger, of course I have. 

I'm even more pleased as I have been hitting the golf range nearly every day so as you can imagine 115mph swing x 100 swings per day takes its toll on your body especially my upper back but its starting to get used to the work load and loosen up. Isnt the thread for it but game is really starting to come together.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 125x1, 110x8,8,5,4,4
Incline Press: 70x11,7,5
Barbell Rows: 90x8,8,8,8
Chins: BWx2,2,2,2

Bench isnt going great but its the consistency of 80% workouts that build a platform over the long term so I'm not worried. Doesnt happen very often but my form and tempo well way out tonight so wasn't ever going to set any records.

I used straps for the first time ever on an exercise last night. I usually never suggest them but I want to do a real heavy phase on my back and dont want my grip to be the limiting factor. Makes a massive difference on rows as my grip has always been my week point. Want to get up to 120kgs on Coan Rows. I need to get used to the straps anyway as will need them for the Coan Deadlift program next year anyway.


----------



## Bokers

Bike

OHP
20, 40kg x 5
55kg x 5, 5, 5, 4, 0
40kg x 8

Shrug
125kg x 10 x 3

Lat raise
7kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Deadlift
60, 100, 140, 165kg x 5

Cable row
65kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

Nothing exciting. Same weights but I easily did this in my fastest time ever at 14:40 and the goal is to get under 15 mins so now I've got the rest periods to where I want them, I will concentrate all my energy on getting the reps and sets to a point where they are just a joke. Then I will add say 20kgs and start again with the longer rest periods and slowly bring it down over a number of months.


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Squats
20kg x 10
60, 80kg x 5
110kg x 4, 2
80kg x 5 x 3

Assisted chinups (higher number, less assistance)
-1,- 2, -3, -4 x 5
5 x 2, 4

Curls
10kg x 10 x 3

Best yet on chins, that's a good amount of weight less assisted. Hopefully I can push carry on removing it!


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 04/11/2016

*DEADLIFT (WU 80X5 100X5 120X3) - 135KGX5 - 156KGX5 - 177KGX6*

:thumb:


----------



## ITHAQVA

Beyond 5/3/1 - 05/11/2016

*BENCH PRESS (WU 50X5 60X5 80X3) - 84.5KGX5 - 97.5KGX5 - 110.5KGX5*

Not the cleverest way to train but I'm trying to make up for lost time this week, felt that ache/fatigue feeling this morning from yesterday quick session (One of the downsides of taking a week off) but managed the reps. Going to be very busy over the next two weeks so ill train as and when i can. I really dislike training this early in the morning!
:thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 130x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x12,7,7
Barbell Rows: 100x5,5,5,5
Chins: BWx2,2,2,2

Far from the best workout, I am grinding reps to keep the reps high which I don't really want to be doing. On a positive note, the 130kgs went up super smooth and fast, easily another 10-15kgs in there.

Thought I would kick the Rows up abit and bring the reps down, nice round 100kgs to work the reps back up on.


----------



## Leebo310

*Bench*
WU 20x Bar, 8x60kg
WO 5x80kg, 5x85kg, 5x92.5kg, 5x97.5kg, 8x105kg
Happy with that, gives me a predicted 1rm of 133Kg which is another pb for me.

*Cluster set Bench* - 5 reps then 15 seconds rest - repeat as many times as possible until you can't do the 5 reps
55 reps at 60kg

*Seated Military Press*
5x47.5kg, 5x50kg, 5x55kg, 5x57.5kg, 12x60kg

*DB Side Raise Standing*
30x7.5kg, 30x7.5kg, 30x7.5kg

*Front Cable Raise Cluster set*
4:45 - 35lbs


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 155x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

I did jumps before squatting today which I think actually took its toll a little bit as squats were slower than last week and my hamstrings were hurting by the time I got to deadlifts which never happens. But its def a good thing adding in jumps before hand. 

Deadlifts were the hardest yet as well but I didnt really drink much during the day and forgot my pre-workout shake so what do I expect really.

I still really like this style of workout as I feel like it is auto regulated to the day. Normally if you feel good you still just do whats written on the page and likewise if you feel awful. With this workout you dont mess with the weight at all, you would just take less rest and move the weight faster in the actual set. So tonight i didnt feel great so I took longer between sets and finished all 5 sets of squats in 1 min longer.


----------



## Bokers

Bike

Bench
20, 40, 70, 80kg x 5 x 5

Dips
Stack -1, -2, -3, -4, -5 x 5

DB pullovers
20kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 125x1, 110x8,8,6,5,5
Incline Press: 70x13,5,6
Barbell Rows: 100x6,6,6,6

Record on bench at last but its probably not really a record even though I did one more rep on paper but I ground the reps out whereas the first few weeks I got 1 rep less but they were all fast and easyish leaving a rep in the tank.

But on a positive note, I was really sore and exhausted but still hit the gym. I practised golf, played a round and then had a fitting for a new fairway wood so I was golfing for 8 hours straight so my upper back was fried. So to still go to the gym when your feeling that crap is a good thing.


----------



## Bokers

Monday RM testing

Squat
20, 60kg x 5
90, 100, 120kg x 3
130, 135, 140kg x 1

Press
20, 40kg x 5
50, 55, 57.5kg x 5


----------



## Bokers

Tuesday RM testing

Bench
20, 50, 70kg x 5
80, 90, 100 x 3
1105, 110, 112.5kg x 1

RDL
20, 50, 80, 100, 110, 120, 125, 130kg x 3


----------



## Bokers

Today's RM testing

Front squat
20, 50, 60, 70, 80kg x 3

BOR
20, 50, 60, 70, 75kg x 3


----------



## Bokers

Incline Bench Press
4 x 5 x 60kg

Barbell Row
4 x 5 x 62.5kg

Strict Press	
4 x 5 x 45kg

Chin up
BW minus full stack x 8, 8, 4.


----------



## Bokers

Pushed for time.

Cycle.
Warm up.

Squats
20, 60, 90 x 5
105kg x 5 x 4

Deadlift
60, 110kg x 5
142.5kg x 5 x 4


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 72.5x4, 87.5x3, 110x2, 135x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x11,7,6
Barbell Rows: 100x7,7,7,7

Pleased to hit an easy 135kgs during my warm up. I know this is way below my max but still nice to smoke it when I'm just doing volume work and far from a peak of any sort. 

Still only doing heavy weights twice per week but doing my golf workout 3 times per week.


----------



## Oats

I'm still checking in occasionally to see how yaw'll doin'  Thought you might like to know the the Starting Strength folk have finally done their weight training book for those 40years+. 7usd off for next two weeks if anyone is interested. Shipping is really steep but Kindle is meant to be following on soon. I just prefer paper copy to read between sets. All the best.


----------



## Mr Kirk

New to this thread. 

Shoulder injury at the moment so will have a total reset on shoulder press and bench wen it feels up to it. Probably next month.

So far this week:
Yesterday squats, warm ups, 131.25x5, 146.25x1, 161.25x1
Sumo deadlifts
120x5, 140x5, 161.25x5
Leg press, calf raises, hamstring curls. 

Today 
Single arm rows 50x5,5,5 
Chin ups 30x5,5,5
Lat pull downs, seated row, reverse fly.


----------



## Bod42

Welcome along Mr Kirk. Some decent lifts you got there. What program are you doing at the minute.

Another boring workout from me.
Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5

Only did squats as I was shattered, this was the 4th time in 48 hours that I have trained as Ive also done 2 golf workouts as I have my first trails in like 14 yrs on Sunday so need to be ready for them so lifting has taken a back seat some what.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Bod42 said:


> Welcome along Mr Kirk. Some decent lifts you got there. What program are you doing at the minute.
> 
> Another boring workout from me.
> 
> Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
> 
> Only did squats as I was shattered, this was the 4th time in 48 hours that I have trained as Ive also done 2 golf workouts as I have my first trails in like 14 yrs on Sunday so need to be ready for them so lifting has taken a back seat some what.


Hi. 
Just a program I've done myself. Did 5x5 a couple of years ago and got to 140 squats, 175 deadlifts, 100+ bench and row, 72 shoulder press.

Broke my leg.

Had to work my way back up. But did 3x5 instead as I had to cut down my gym time cause of kids.

Still doing 3x5 on chest/back/shoulder, 1x5 on squats and deadlifts. 
Up to 190 on deadlifts. 106 row, 102 bench. 65 shoulder. Really struggling to get my shoulders back to where they were.

1 rep maxes which I've not done since before summer, were squat 185, deadlift 225, bench and row 125, shoulder press 82.5.


----------



## Leebo310

Mr Kirk said:


> Hi.
> Just a program I've done myself. Did 5x5 a couple of years ago and got to 140 squats, 175 deadlifts, 100+ bench and row, 72 shoulder press.
> 
> Broke my leg.
> 
> Had to work my way back up. But did 3x5 instead as I had to cut down my gym time cause of kids.
> 
> Still doing 3x5 on chest/back/shoulder, 1x5 on squats and deadlifts.
> Up to 190 on deadlifts. 106 row, 102 bench. 65 shoulder. Really struggling to get my shoulders back to where they were.
> 
> 1 rep maxes which I've not done since before summer, were squat 185, deadlift 225, bench and row 125, shoulder press 82.5.


Welcome buddy and as James said, nice lifts there  
What do you weigh out of interest?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr Kirk

Leebo310 said:


> Welcome buddy and as James said, nice lifts there
> What do you weigh out of interest?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


78kg at the moment.


----------



## Leebo310

Mr Kirk said:


> 78kg at the moment.


Epic lifts then buddy 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bod42

Crazy lifts at that Body weight.

Mate if you need any information on shoulder health then I can probably help. Dislocated my shoulder 7 times during Rugby and got it back to 99% pain free over the years so read and tried thousands of ways to repair it. I find that the RC gets a lot of stick but what I've found with most people its actually upper back strength and I don't mean row strength, I mean all the little muscle around the back of the shoulders so you need to be doing pull aparts, facepulls, static holds, etc.

Best program that have seen results have been these 2.

https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/8-weeks-to-monster-shoulders I use this a few times a year to strengthen everything around the shoulder up.

https://www.defrancostraining.com/3-weeks-to-a-jacked-upper-back/ I basically constantly do this, can never do to much upper back work


----------



## Mr Kirk

Cheers, will have a read of those.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Bod42 said:


> Crazy lifts at that Body weight.
> 
> Mate if you need any information on shoulder health then I can probably help. Dislocated my shoulder 7 times during Rugby and got it back to 99% pain free over the years so read and tried thousands of ways to repair it. I find that the RC gets a lot of stick but what I've found with most people its actually upper back strength and I don't mean row strength, I mean all the little muscle around the back of the shoulders so you need to be doing pull aparts, facepulls, static holds, etc.
> 
> Best program that have seen results have been these 2.
> 
> https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/8-weeks-to-monster-shoulders I use this a few times a year to strengthen everything around the shoulder up.
> 
> https://www.defrancostraining.com/3-weeks-to-a-jacked-upper-back/ I basically constantly do this, can never do to much upper back work


Any recommendations for resistance bands?


----------



## Leebo310

Gym has just had a refurb and they now have a trap deadlift bar so thought I'd give that a try on Monday. Hadn't ever done this exercise before so no %rm calculations here, just literally was seeing what I could do on it.

*WU* - 20x65kg, 10x85kg, 
*WO* - 5x105kg, 3x125kg, 3x135kg, 2x145kg, 2x155kg, 2x165kg, 1x175kg, 1x180kg, 1x185kg

Really liked them, will now be adding them in to my structured strength workouts.

Followed up with some bb rows, pull downs and SAR's

*Bench* was then yesterday

*WU* 20x Bar, 8x60kg
*WO* 5x82.5kg, 5x87.5kg, 5x95kg, 5x100kg, 8x105kg

60kg 5 rep cluster set - 60 reps

Followed up with some shoulder work

Squats today :thumb:


----------



## Mr Kirk

Deadlifts today. 
90x5, 110x4, 130x3, 150x2, 170x1, 190x1, 215x1. 
Sumo deadlifts
150x5, 110x5
Romanian deadlifts
70x10,10


----------



## Bod42

Mr Kirk said:


> Any recommendations for resistance bands?


Iron Woody are the best. I think they are quite expensive from the UK so I ordered from Iron Woody themselfs. But I got an entire set so it was worth the shipping cost. If you just want 1 or 2 bands for pull aparts then just get a cheap 1 from somewhere.


----------



## Bod42

So my gym is all over the place at the moment as I have moved everything so I can paint my lifting platform but i didnt realise that I have to do 4 coats with 24+hours inbetween each one, what a pain in the ar$e. Looks good though, better grip and will stop it getting dirty and wearing out so had to be done.

Anyway due to this I just did one of my old 5/3/1 workouts with a top set to see where I am right now as Ive been concentrating on Golf.

Bench Press: 60x5, 70x5, 80x3, 85x5, 100x5, 115x9 PM 150kgs.

My best predicted max is 115x12 for 161kgs so I'm pleased to be at 150kgs when Ive hardly been lifting. Means Ive lost no strength.


----------



## Bokers

Monday

Squat
20, 60, 90kg x 5
112.5kg x 4 x 4
Rushed, all I had time for.

Tuesday
Bench
20, 50, 70kg x 5
90kg x 4 x 4

BOR
67.5kg 4 x 4

Press
47.5kg x 4 x 4

Assisted chin-up
Stack x 8 x 3

Today

Front Squat
20, 40kg x 5
55kg x 9, 9, 6, 6

RDL
90kg x 9, 6, 6, 6

Leg extension
50kg x 10 x 2

Leg curl
50kg x 10 x 2

Calf raise
BW x 15 x 2

Hanging leg raise
5 x 2, floor 10 x 2


----------



## Mr Kirk

Monday did chest 80kg 5x5. Shoulder hurting. Not good. 

Yesterday squats 132.5x5, 162.5x1, 165x1. 
Bent over row, single arm, 51kg 3x5.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 80x5, 100x4, 115x3, 135x2, 150x1, 120x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 120x3, 135x2, 150x1, 160x3,3,3,3,3

Same old workout but I am definitely improving. The best thing about this workout is once I got to my worksets of 120kgs, I never touched the weight but everytime I unracked the bar I had to check if the weight was right as it felt so stupidly light. A few more weeks and I recon I will jump the weight upto 140kgs and repeat this until I can get all my sets clean in under 15 mins. To be fair, this is a great confirdence way of training.


----------



## Mr Kirk

I got up to 140kg 5x5 and thought I was going to pass out. It's a killer


----------



## Bokers

Cycle

Bench
20, 50kg x 5
72.5kg x 9, 9, 9, 6

BOR
55kg x 9 x 4

Incline DB press
25kg x 12 x 3

Lat pulldown
50kg x 12, 10, 8

DB curl
12.5kg x 12, 8

Rope tricep extension
55kg x 15, 12


----------



## Bod42

Mr Kirk said:


> I got up to 140kg 5x5 and thought I was going to pass out. It's a killer


I will be able to do 140kgs for 5x5, the question is how fast and smooth will the reps be with what rest periods as I am just concentrating on improving rep quality at the moment.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle

Bench
20, 60, 80kg x 5
95kg x 4 x 3

BOR
60kg x 5
75kg x 4 x 3

Press
40kg x 5
52.5kg x 4 x 4

Pullups
BW - stack x 10, 10, 6


----------



## Mr Kirk

Why do you do cycling, and why before your weights?

Still easing myself back in to training my shoulders and chest. 

Shoulders 50 5x5
Chest 82.5 5x5

Shoulder raises front, side & back. 

15kg wide pull ups.


----------



## Bod42

Kirk I do the Defranco Upper body workout before every upper body workout (of course lol) and it has done wonders for my shoulder pain.

Its the warmup taken from the Built 2 Last ebook but its the first 6 videos of this link https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYrUgEL177NU71_SNaIO-Kc53HxPDfPst. The dumbell shoulder circuit is awesome and the laterals are 6 seconds per rep so makes the shoulders feel really good before heavy bench.

Bench: 60x5, 775x4, 90x3, 110x2, 125x1, 110x8,5,5,4,4
Incline Press: 70x13,9,6
Barbell Rows: 100x8,8,8,8

Strange workout, this was my lowest rep total on Bench Press since starting this workout but nearly the best I have done on Inclines. I think I just tired myself out on the first bench set as I was to far back and therefore hitting the holders so had to go out and round them. And I did a shed load of physical stuff on Sunday so cant expect to be hitting records.

Time to up my rows again. They are far from strict but man they hit my back well.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle

Squats
20, 60, 100kg x 5
120kg x 4 x 3

Deadlift
60, 100, 140kg x 3
162.5kg x 3, 3, 2, 0


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 85x5, 110x4, 125x3, 145x2, 162.5x1, 130x5,5,5,5,5 Total time 22:15

So I decided to bump the weight up 10kgs instead of 20 and just work my way back down. First few workouts will be concentrating on speed so the rest was longer between sets then once I have the clean fast reps down, I will start bringing the rest down.

Quite surprised just a simple jump in weight has made such a difference, I'm so sore today and didnt deadlift afterwards as lower back was feleing a bit tender.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Did that shoulder workout on Tuesday. Came to do shoulder press today and my rear delts were burning! 

Only did 51.25kg 5x5

Then chest 81.25 5x5
Close grip chest 51.25 3x8

Chin ups 30kg 3x5


----------



## Bod42

Mr Kirk said:


> Did that shoulder workout on Tuesday. Came to do shoulder press today and my rear delts were burning!
> 
> Only did 51.25kg 5x5
> 
> Then chest 81.25 5x5
> Close grip chest 51.25 3x8
> 
> Chin ups 30kg 3x5


Ya the first time you do the tri-set is like a workout in itself but you soon get used to it and its a nice warmup but I definitely agree that my bench suffered for a few workouts. Saying that everu single person I've suggested using this warmup to has had positive results.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 75x4, 90x3, 110x2, 130x1, 110x4,4,4,4,8
Incline Press: 70x13,8,7
Barbell Rows: 110x6,6,6,6

First workout over the Xmas period so did a slightly different rep scheme and left the last set until AMRAP. This means no matter what you get clean fast strong reps on your first 4 sets.

Very pleased to come back from a lay off and hit a PR on rows. The funny thing is I am doing Coan rows which are definitely loser form to allow you to handle more weight but the other day I went back to strict rows and I am miles stronger which is actually what I want.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Back on 5x5 this week after a **** December and a couple of weeks off. 

Wednesday squats 100kg5x5
Shoulder press 40kg5x5
Deadlift 155kg1x5

Today
Squats 101.25kg5x5
Row 80kg5x5
Bench 80kg5x5

I don't think my legs will want to get out of bed all weekend.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats 102.5 5x5
Ohp 42.5 5x5
Deadlift 157.5 1x5


----------



## Bokers

Back today after illness and Christmas for a light upper.

Cycle
Lots of stretching.

Bench
20, 50, 70kg x 5
80kg x 6 x 4

OHP
40kg x 6 x 6


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats 103.75kg 5x5
Row 81.25kg 5x5
Bench 81.25kg 5x5
Close grip bench 51.25kg 3x5
Pull ups 10kg 3x5


----------



## Bokers

Thursday: Again another light (should have felt lighter) session post Christmas/ill.

Cycle
Lots of stretching

Squats
20kg x 5 x 5
40, 60, kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 3
60kg x 5 x 3
40kg x 5 x 3

Push press
60kg x 3 x 4

Felt better to get something done and move. Still have DOMS though.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Yesterday 
Squats 105 5x5
Shoulder press 45 5x5
Deadlift 160 1x5


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 75x4, 90x3, 110x2, 130x1, 110x8,8,6,4,4
Incline Press: 70x8,6,6
Barbell Rows: 110x7,7,7,7

Ok so I'm back to and up and rolling with the gym again after the Xmas break. Parents came over to see me in NZ so felt bad taking an hour off to go to the gym when their waiting to see me.

Still on the same program but my last golf trials are on Sunday and there are 2 places left up for grabs between 6 of us so I need to put in a good performance but havent played in a month so if I don't make the team then I will put Powerlifting back as my priority training 4 days per week. If i make the team then I wont be concentrating on Powerlifting until April, instead staying with the 2 days per week. I want to practise golf like mad this week but just so happens that I'm busy every night except one so the trials will be stressful.


----------



## Bokers

Late to the party, limited time as the car wouldn't start and I blew up the jump pack. That was a laugh...

Cycle

Press
20, 40, 50, 55kg x 5
60kg x 3 x 2
Went for another three but failed each one.

Very happy though, good session however quick.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Yesterday 
Squat 106.25 5x5
Row 82.5 5x5
Bench 82.5 5x5

Back stiffened up afterwards though, so not a happy camper. 

Will be doing some stretching later to try and ease it before tomorrow.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats 107.5 5x5
Shoulder press 46.25 5x5
Deadlift 161.25 1x5


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 85x5, 110x4, 125x3, 145x2, 170x1, 130x5,5,5,5,5 Time 24:30

First squat workout in over a month so I am sore as hell today. They actually went better than expected considering the time off and had about another 10kgs in me if not slightly more on the over warmup so that puts me 10% down on my max squat of 200kgs so thats exactly where I want to be. They took the longest they ever have but thats to be expected.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats 108.75 5x5
Row 83.75 5x5
Bench 83.75 5x5


----------



## AdamC

Thought I would start joining in here. Been doing 5x5 stronglifts for around 6 weeks now, really enjoying the program.

Today's lifts:
Squat 70kg
OH Press 42.5kg
Deadlift 80kg


----------



## Bokers

Nice one pal. Keep at it


----------



## Bokers

Rugby Saturday. Narrowly lost, but it happens. Especially when we didn't have any subs and the other team had an entire spare team!
Cycled Sunday. Seven miles / 35 minutes. First time out on a bike in a while as my last one got nicked. First time on a 'proper' road bike. Have to say it's rather enjoyable  My aim is to build to an hour or 13 miles as that's the distance to work. So my challenge is to commute at least one way. I'll hopefully built it up to a couple of mornings or evenings a week and try and do the return in the same day. This should help burn some calories and almost as importantly add some much needed fitness.

Plan is still to train 3-4 days a week in the gym until I need to pull it back to achieve the cycling goals and then balance the two.

Sound sane?


----------



## Bokers

Cycle.

OHP
20kg x 10
30, 40, 50kg x 5
60kg x 5, 3, 2, 2

Bench
20kg x 10
40, 60, 70, 80kg x 5
90kg x 5, 4


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squat 110kg 5x5
Ohp 47.5kg 5x5
Deadlift 162.5k 1x5


----------



## Bokers

Cycle.
Banded warmups upper and lower.

Squats
20kg x 10
50, 70, 80, 90, 100, 110kg x 5

That was it. Short and sweet. Squats felt good.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats 111.25kg 5x5
Row 85kg 5x5
Bench 85kg 5x5


----------



## Leebo310

So after two and a bit weeks off with flu (proper flu, not the other deadly "man" variety...) back at the gym this week and I am gutted with how much strength I've lost. Not only am I weaker but I'm out of breath so much quicker than before.
Bench I failed at 120kg, whereas the beginning of December I managed a fairly comfortable 2 reps.
Squat maxed out on 8 @ 100kg - previous best a few months back was 140kg for 7 reps.

Hopefully it's just a temporary thing and I'm weak as just still recovering.... 

Will post again when I've got my numbers back to a respectable level 

Edit - Oh and I lost about 3kg in weight too..


----------



## Bokers

Keep posting mate, no need to worry about what the numbers say.
Get some food in you and get training, you'll be back up in no time.


----------



## Leebo310

Bokers said:


> Keep posting mate, no need to worry about what the numbers say.
> Get some food in you and get training, you'll be back up in no time.


Cheers buddy, that's what I'm hoping too! Figure this first week back was always going to be hard but didn't think it would be this bad. Will see how next couple of weeks go


----------



## Bod42

Dont worry about it Leebo, strength fluctuates up and down anyway but especially when your ill. It will come back real quick so don't stress.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Dont worry about it Leebo, strength fluctuates up and down anyway but especially when your ill. It will come back real quick so don't stress.


Thanks mate, I know you're right! It's just a tough mental hit to effectively loose 3 months of progress in 2 and a bit weeks! 
Going for another bench session today anyway so will hopefully do a bit better 

Amazing, just finished my bench session and managed to smash the 120kg this time :devil:
WU - Bar x 20, 60kg x10
WO - 95kg x 5, 100kg x 4, 105kg x 3, 112.5kg x 2, 120kg x 1

Well pleased to get that and felt a million times better than Monday when I last tried it. Even felt like I could have got the 2nd rep but decided just to leave it at the 1.
Much happier now :thumb:


----------



## Mr Kirk

Yesterday
Squats 113.75kg 5x5
Bench 86.25kg 5x5
Row 86.25kg 5x5


----------



## Bokers

Cycle.
Warmup.

Deadlifts
20, 20, 60, 60, 100, 100, 130kg x 5
150kg x 2, 2, 2, 2
100kg x 5, 5

Dips
Full stack help x 5, 5, 5

Chins
Full stack help x 5, 5, 5

Wasn't happy with deadlifts. No power, slow and felt heavier than it should.
Toys back in the pram for next week...


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

OHP
20, 20, 40kg x 5
60kg x 5, 5, 5, 3, 3, 3

That was it. No idea where the time went, no time for more.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squat 115kg 5x5
Ohp 50kg 5x5
Deadlift 165kg 1x5


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 60x5, 75x4, 90x3, 110x2, 130x1, 110x8,8,6,5,4
Incline Press: 70x8,6,6
Barbell Rows: 120x5,5,5,5

Still here lifting just doing the same thing while concentrating on golf. I felt good tonight so went for a record of 32 reps overall but just couldnt quite hit the last set for 5. Heaviest rows I've ever done and they definitely arent clean but my back always feels so worked after the workout compared with strict rows.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Woke up on Thursday and have somehow jarred my back. Missed the gym Friday. Don't think I'll be able to go tomorrow either. Not a happy bunny.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

Squats
20, 50, 90kg x 5
110kg x 5 x 5. I think this is a rep/set PB. Very happy either way.

RDL
50kg x 10 x 3


----------



## Bod42

OK so basically got pi55ed off with Golf so will play it more social than trying to compete so what that means is that I'm back lifting properly. I have my year and programs laid out to hit my goals by the end of 2017 so I have a few weeks until those programs kick in so I thought I would try something different. Very similar to the original 5x5 and that is DUP. You still do the 3 main lifts each workout but you vary the reps and sets throughout the week.

So without Warm-up sets it looks like this.

Squats: 120x3,3,3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 152.5x5,5,5,5,5
Bench: 100x8,8,8,8

You keep the reps the same through each workout but the exercises rotate so wokrout 2 would be Deads, Bench and squats last. This means each exercise gets hit 3 times per week in a different rep range each time.

My thinking is that my technique feels off due to lack of practise so by doing the exercises 3 times per week then I can fast track my progress.

Anyway the first workout was absolutely brutal.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup

Bench
20, 50, 80, 90kg x 5
95 kg x 5, 5, 5, 3, 3

Assisted dips
-4 x 5 x 5


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x3, 105x2, 120x1, 132.5x3,3,3,3,3,3
Bench: 80x3, 90x2, 102.5x1, 112.5x5,5,5,5,5
Squats: 85x3, 95x2, 110x1, 120x8,8,8,8

Another hard workout but I thought the 4x8 would be really hard but it was quite easy. Need to trust myself more, start working harder this year, basically stop being such a pu$$y and just smash the weights.

Really nice to get back into some proper lifting though, feels good after just 2 workouts.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 50x5, 70x3, 80x2, 90x1, 100x3,3,3,3,3,3
Squats: 100x3, 110x2, 125x1, 140x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 90x3, 105x2, 120x1, 130x6,6,6,6

Loving DUP, its such hard work but still loving it. Once Ive got the hard first 3 weeks out of the way then the intensity will drop slightly as its a 3 steps forward 2 steps back workout so ya your adding weight every week but then you drop the weight so including deload your actually only adding weight once per month. This does seem to be quite a popular way to load these days and Juggernaut seem to do a lot of this, easy first week, hard 2nd, basically die on week 3 then reload and start again. They also add volume though which would change things up quite a bit.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

OHP
20, 40kg x 5
60kg x 5, 5, 5, 3, 2, 1 Will move back down and re-build, maybe.

Seated DB OHP
15kg x 10 x 4

Assisted dips
Stack x 5 x 4

Curls
10kg x 10 x 4


----------



## Mr Kirk

After a week and a half off I went back on Monday and started madcow workout. 

Squat up to 112.5kg x5
Bench and row up to 85kg x5


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 60x5, 85x3, 95x2, 110x1, 120x3,3,3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 110x3, 125x2, 142.5x1, 157.5x5,5,5,5,5
Bench Press: 70x3, 80x2, 90x1, 100x8,8,8,8

The big advantage to doing the exercise 3 times per week is the movement never feels weird. Sometimes on squats, my form feels off and the bar just feel heavy on my back. 120kgs felt like nothing today, kept checking and re-checking that the weight was correct as it felt so good.

Got 5kgs heavier on deadlifts and last week was everything I had to give so thats a geniune 5kg progress.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 2/15/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
36.25 kg x 5 reps 
41.25 kg x 5 reps 
51.25 kg x 5 reps 
56.25 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
98.75 kg x 5 reps 
115 kg x 5 reps 
140 kg x 5 reps 
156.25 kg x 5 reps 
Notes:


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup

Squats
20 x 10, 60kg x 5
90kg x 8, 8, 8, 8

Back extension
50, 90, 110kg x 10
160kg x 8, 8, 8, 8

Leg extension
50kg x 12 x 4


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 2/17/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
70 kg x 5 reps 
83.75 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps 
118.75 kg x 5 reps 
132.5 kg x 3 reps 
97.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
45 kg x 5 reps 
53.75 kg x 5 reps 
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
76.25 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 3 reps 
62.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
45 kg x 5 reps 
53.75 kg x 5 reps 
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
76.25 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 3 reps 
62.5 kg x 8 reps


----------



## Bokers

Warmup + cycle.

Bench press
20, 60, 80kg x 5, 5
90kg x 8, 8, 6, 6

DB press
25kg x 12, 12, 8, 6

Tricep cable
60kg x 12, 12, 12, 12


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 2/20/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
71.25 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
98.75 kg x 5 reps 
106.25 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
55 kg x 5 reps 
63.75 kg x 5 reps 
78.75 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
55 kg x 5 reps 
63.75 kg x 5 reps 
78.75 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Leebo310

Legs and Tricep workout today

*Squat*
WU 
60kg x 10, 80kg x 8 
WO
95kg x 5, 100kg x 5, 107.5kg x 5, 115kg x 5, *122.5kg x 10*
Haven't done heavy squats for a while so very happy with the 10 reps at 122.5kg

*Leg Press*
150kg x 20, 200kg x 15, 240kg x 12

*Lying Leg Curl *
30kg x 12, 40kg x 12, 40kg x 10

*Seated Leg Extension *
40kg x 12, 50kg x 12, 60kg x 12

*Closed Grip Press*
Was going for a max effort to find my 1rm
Bar x 15, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 3, 100kg x 3, 120kg x 1
Then decided that as the 120kg went up pretty easily, I'd try 130kg on a regular bench grip. Have only had 125kg on the bar before a few months back but managed the 130kg easily today! 
*Regular Bench *
*130kg x 1 *
Super happy with that as it's a new PB with real weight on the bar (my predicted is slightly higher) and I had more in the tank so on course for a 140kg this half of the year.

Weight is currently 78.4kg so gives me a ratio of 1.66. Happy with that for sure :thumb:


----------



## Mr Kirk

Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
71.25 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
98.75 kg x 5 reps 
98.75 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
37.5 kg x 5 reps 
43.75 kg x 5 reps 
52.5 kg x 5 reps 
58.75 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
100 kg x 5 reps 
116.25 kg x 5 reps 
141.25 kg x 5 reps 
158.75 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 100x3,3,3,3,3,3
Squats: 145x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 135x6,6,6,6

Squst: 120x3,3,3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 160x5,5,5,5,5

Didnt bench on WO 2 as my shoulder was killing after squats so gave it a miss.


----------



## JMorty

Back on this now. I like to switch routines to keep progression going.

Last Sesh.

47.5Kg 5x5 Squat
65Kg 5x5 Bench
45kg 5x5 Row.

Slow start, as always, but feels great to be back on Stonglifts again


----------



## JMorty

Just done:

50 5x5 squat
30 5x5 OHP
70 5x5 Deadlift

Assistance exercises:
10kg 10, 8, 6 weighted dips
0kg 10, 8, 6 wide chin.


----------



## Bokers

Thursday

Cycle + warmup

OHP
20, 40, 50kg x 5
60kg x 5, 5, 5, 3, 2

Today

Cycle + warmup

Squats
20, 40, 70, 90kg x 5
100kg x 8, 8, 5, 3 Nice.

Leg press
100kg x 12 x 4


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 2/24/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
71.25 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
98.75 kg x 5 reps 
121.25 kg x 5 reps 
135 kg x 3 reps 
98.75 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
46.25 kg x 5 reps 
55 kg x 5 reps 
63.75 kg x 5 reps 
78.75 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 3 reps 
63.75 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
46.25 kg x 5 reps 
55 kg x 5 reps 
63.75 kg x 5 reps 
78.75 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 3 reps 
63.75 kg x 8 reps


----------



## JMorty

Mr Kirk said:


> Date: 2/24/17
> Program: Madcow 5x5
> Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
> 71.25 kg x 5 reps
> 85 kg x 5 reps
> 98.75 kg x 5 reps
> 121.25 kg x 5 reps
> 135 kg x 3 reps
> 98.75 kg x 8 reps
> Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
> 46.25 kg x 5 reps
> 55 kg x 5 reps
> 63.75 kg x 5 reps
> 78.75 kg x 5 reps
> 87.5 kg x 3 reps
> 63.75 kg x 8 reps
> Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
> 46.25 kg x 5 reps
> 55 kg x 5 reps
> 63.75 kg x 5 reps
> 78.75 kg x 5 reps
> 87.5 kg x 3 reps
> 63.75 kg x 8 reps


I'm liking this madcow 5x5, will have to look into it later down the line.


----------



## Mr Kirk

JMorty said:


> I'm liking this madcow 5x5, will have to look into it later down the line.


I'm using the "5x5 Log" app. Don't know how it works when I eventually fail. Guess I'll find out sooner or later.


----------



## Bod42

I had good success with Madcow, 1 top set is definitely easier mentally than 5 sets but eventually I found 2 extra reps between Friday and Monday is a big ask. Now I prefer the 3 steps forwards, 2 steps back approach.

Deadlifts: 70x5, 92.5x3, 105x2, 120x1, 132.5x3,3,3,3,3,3
Bench: 85x3, 95x2, 110x1, 120x5,5,5,5,4
Squats: 90x3, 100x2, 112.5x1, 125x8,8,8,8

Can you believe that I missed my bench by 1 rep, 120 would have been a good milestone as well. That 120kgs is definitely my nemisis, I can do 115 for 12 reps but struggle with 120kgs. Been around this weight for years now.


----------



## Bokers

Saturday

Cycle + warmup

Squats
20, 50, 80kg x 5
100kg x 8, 8, 4

Leg press
60kg x 10
100kg x 12, 12, 12

This morning

Cycle + warmup

Bench press
20, 50, 70kg x 5
87.5kg x 5, 5, 5, 5, 5

BOR
20kg x 10
62.5kg x 5, 5, 5, 5, 5

OHP
20kg x 10
52.5kg x 5, 5, 5, 4, 3

Assisted chinup
-stack x 4 x 4


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 100x3,3,3,3,3,3
Squats: 145x5,5,5,5,5
Deadlifts: 147.5x6,6,6,6

Brutal workout again but I get a deload and take weight off now so this is exactly how it should feel. Medium week 1, hard week 2 and everything you have got feel like crap week 3 then deload and recover. We shall see how it works over the next 4 weeks.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 2/27/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
86.25 kg x 5 reps 
93.75 kg x 5 reps 
101.25 kg x 5 reps 
108.75 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
56.25 kg x 5 reps 
66.25 kg x 5 reps 
81.25 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
56.25 kg x 5 reps 
66.25 kg x 5 reps 
81.25 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps


----------



## JMorty

Squat
5x5 52.5kg
Bench
5x5 67.5kg
Barbell Row
5x5 47.5kg

Assistance Exercises:
Lat raise
3x10 12kg
Romanian Deadlift
3x10 47.5kg


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

Squats
20, 60, 90kg x 5
107.5kg x 5 x 5

Deadlift
70, 110, 130, 147.5kg x 5

Pouring after that! Didn't have time for the rest


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 3/01/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
40 kg x 5 reps 
45 kg x 5 reps 
55 kg x 5 reps 
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
120 kg x 5 reps 
145 kg x 5 reps 
162.5 kg x 5 reps


----------



## JMorty

Nice work on the military press!! 62.5 is great!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## JMorty

Sqwat 5x5 55kg
OHP 5x5 32.5kg
Deadlift 5x5 75kg

All feel good, not looking forward to 70kg bench on Friday...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr Kirk

Absolutely smashed it today. Everything felt easy and got through it in about 35 minutes. 

Date: 3/03/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
122.5 kg x 5 reps 
137.5 kg x 3 reps 
102.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
47.5 kg x 5 reps 
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
80 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 3 reps 
67.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
47.5 kg x 5 reps 
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
80 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 3 reps 
67.5 kg x 8 reps


----------



## JMorty

Nice numbers there!!! Will defo have a bash at this in the summer. :thumb:


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## JMorty

Squat 5x5 57.5kg
Bench 5x5 70kg
Row 50kg

Starting to get a tiny bit interesting now, really pumped about getting in closer to the 100's again.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr Kirk

Another good day. Workouts feel like they're getting easier at the moment. 
Date: 3/06/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
110 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
82.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
82.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Bod42

Kirk they are some great numbers your putting up. How comes your squat drops between the last 2 workouts?

I thought on Madcow that you are supposed to hit the triple on friday for 5 on the Monday or was I doing the program wrong?


----------



## Mr Kirk

Bod42 said:


> Kirk they are some great numbers your putting up. How comes your squat drops between the last 2 workouts?
> 
> I thought on Madcow that you are supposed to hit the triple on friday for 5 on the Monday or was I doing the program wrong?


That's just the way the app does it. Maybe it's not strict madcow routine?

It does a medium squat Monday with 2 heavy sets of chest and back.

Light squats Wednesday with 2 heavy sets of shoulders and 1 heavy set deadlifts.

Heavy squats Friday with 1, 3 rep, heavy set chest and back.

With the weights going up once a week.


----------



## JMorty

Squat 5x5 60kg
OH P 5x5 35kg
Deadlift 5x5 80kg

Really enjoying it still.


----------



## Bod42

Kirk, where can you get the app from as that seems a way better way of doing Madcow. The original is to hit a heavy triple on friday followed by a back off set and then hit it for 5 on Monday. Adding 2 reps in 2 days is a lot to ask when your getting near your limit.

Squats: 125x3,3,3,3,3,3
Deadlifts: 157.5x5,5,5,5,5
Bench: 100x8,8,8,8

This 3 steps forwards, 2 steps back seem to really work as last time I did this weight I was struggling to recover between sets and it was everything I had pretty much. Tonight was a nice workout, not easy by any means but I wasnt completely smashed between each set thats for sure. Deadlifts are starting to feel strong again but squat will suffer for awhile as working on form and it feels awful.


----------



## Mr Kirk

5x5 Workout - Madcow & Reg Park by Charles Vanderhoff
https://appsto.re/gb/AoRq8.i

Link for iOS.

I don't know how it works when it comes to failure yet. So I don't know if it auto deloads or not. I emailed them and asked but didn't get a response.


----------



## JMorty

Mr Kirk said:


> 5x5 Workout - Madcow & Reg Park by Charles Vanderhoff
> https://appsto.re/gb/AoRq8.i
> 
> Link for iOS.
> 
> I don't know how it works when it comes to failure yet. So I don't know if it auto deloads or not. I emailed them and asked but didn't get a response.


Nice, thanks for that! Downloading as we speak :thumb:


----------



## Bokers

Yesterday

Cycle + warmup.

Bench
20, 60kg x 5
75kg x 10, 10, 6, 10 (plan was 3x12)

Row
62.5kg x 12 x 3

Incline DB press

30kg x 5 x 3

Felt like poo. Just got through it.


----------



## JMorty

Bokers said:


> Yesterday
> 
> Cycle + warmup.
> 
> Bench
> 20, 60kg x 5
> 75kg x 10, 10, 6, 10 (plan was 3x12)
> 
> Row
> 62.5kg x 12 x 3
> 
> Incline DB press
> 
> 30kg x 5 x 3
> 
> Felt like poo. Just got through it.


Feel for you fella, been hit by some cold from the office too! Doesn't help things here.

Anywho:

Squat: 5x5 @ 62.5kg
Bench: 5x5 @ 72.5 kg
Row: 5x5 @ 52.5kg


----------



## Bokers

JMorty said:


> Feel for you fella, been hit by some cold from the office too! Doesn't help things here.
> 
> Anywho:
> 
> Squat: 5x5 @ 62.5kg
> Bench: 5x5 @ 72.5 kg
> Row: 5x5 @ 52.5kg


Cheers bud. Good work there :thumb:


----------



## Mr Kirk

So easy again today. Thought I'd struggle a bit on shoulders. And might be tired for deadlifts but blasted out the reps no problem. 

Date: 3/08/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
40 kg x 5 reps 
47.5 kg x 5 reps 
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
65 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
120 kg x 5 reps 
147.5 kg x 5 reps 
165 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Mr Kirk

Hit the safety bar on 2nd rep at 140. Took a second to steady myself. Basically a pause rep. 
Date: 3/10/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
102.5 kg x 5 reps 
125 kg x 5 reps 
140 kg x 3 reps 
102.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
47.5 kg x 5 reps 
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
82.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 3 reps 
67.5 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
47.5 kg x 5 reps 
57.5 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
82.5 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 3 reps 
67.5 kg x 8 reps


----------



## Mr Kirk

Thought I'd struggle more today after going out for "lunch" on Saturday. Manager to get through it though. 

Date: 3/13/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
112.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
60 kg x 5 reps 
70 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
60 kg x 5 reps 
70 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Brick Top

Only just found this thread, does anyone compete or anything in here? I usually compete in powerlifting with British Powerlifting but struggling through injury at the moment


----------



## Bokers

Saturday
Played rugby, watched England, ate all of the Chinese food.

Sunday
Swim and sauna.

Today
Cyclle + warmup

OHP
20, 30, 40, 50, 60kg x 5

RDL
60kg x 8 x 3

BOR
40kg x 8 x 3

Hack squat
BW x 12 x 3

Foam roller and mobility.

Stiff/sore from playing Saturday still so just trying to recover.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Brick Top said:


> Only just found this thread, does anyone compete or anything in here? I usually compete in powerlifting with British Powerlifting but struggling through injury at the moment


One of the trainers at the gym keeps telling me to enter something. Feel like I'd hurt myself trying though!

What lifts and weight category?


----------



## Brick Top

Mr Kirk said:


> One of the trainers at the gym keeps telling me to enter something. Feel like I'd hurt myself trying though!
> 
> What lifts and weight category?


Go for it it's the most fun I've had competitively, everyone's welcoming at whatever level.

210kg squat
152.5kg bench
230kg deadlift

Under 93kg class


----------



## Mr Kirk

Brick Top said:


> Go for it it's the most fun I've had competitively, everyone's welcoming at whatever level.
> 
> 210kg squat
> 
> 152.5kg bench
> 
> 230kg deadlift
> 
> Under 93kg class


Are you allowed to use any belts or wraps?


----------



## Brick Top

Mr Kirk said:


> Are you allowed to use any belts or wraps?


That's with a belt and knee sleeves which don't really add anything, just 7mm neoprene to help keep knees warm and healthy. You can go into "equipped" lifting which would include knee wraps, squat suits etc. but I've never done that

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr Kirk

Brick Top said:


> That's with a belt and knee sleeves which don't really add anything, just 7mm neoprene to help keep knees warm and healthy. You can go into "equipped" lifting which would include knee wraps, squat suits etc. but I've never done that
> 
> Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


Ah, ok. I struggle with grip so use wrist wraps on deadlift.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

Squats
20, 50, 80, 100, 110, 115kg x 5

Lat pulldown
70kg x 5 x 3

Mobility and roller. Feeling better after the weekend.


----------



## Brick Top

Mr Kirk said:


> Ah, ok. I struggle with grip so use wrist wraps on deadlift.


Have you tried mixed grip, one hand over one hand under? Or I use hook grip which is a weightlifting technique, that's brutal on your thumbs at first though until they get desensitised haha, look it up.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Mr Kirk

Brick Top said:


> Have you tried mixed grip, one hand over one hand under? Or I use hook grip which is a weightlifting technique, that's brutal on your thumbs at first though until they get desensitised haha, look it up.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


I'm not a fan of the mixed grip. Tried it a few times and just didn't like it.

Hook grip where you put your thumb between fingers and bar?


----------



## Brick Top

Mr Kirk said:


> I'm not a fan of the mixed grip. Tried it a few times and just didn't like it.
> 
> Hook grip where you put your thumb between fingers and bar?


Yes mate, extremely painful for a few sessions but ease into it and it's painless after a few goes.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Bokers

That's how I pull too. Yes, it's painful for a bit, but so was the first few squats I did with the bar on my back. Nothing you can't get through and then use it for your benefit.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup.

Bench press
20, 60, 80kg x 5 jumps too big and/or not enough warmup for me.
90kg x 5 x 4 Would have been easier if the warmup was longer.

Assisted dips
Stack -5 x 5 x 4 Decreasing assistance week on week!

Assisted chinups
Stack -5 x 2 x 2 Testing how where I am. Not too bad.

Curls
12.5kg x 10, 10, 5


----------



## JMorty

Bokers said:


> Cycle + warmup.
> 
> Bench press
> 20, 60, 80kg x 5 jumps too big and/or not enough warmup for me.
> 90kg x 5 x 4 Would have been easier if the warmup was longer.
> 
> Assisted dips
> Stack -5 x 5 x 4 Decreasing assistance week on week!
> 
> Assisted chinups
> Stack -5 x 2 x 2 Testing how where I am. Not too bad.
> 
> Curls
> 12.5kg x 10, 10, 5


Dips and Chins are a killer!

Made a point of doing at least one set of each, everytime I walked in the gym. Really helped!

Sqwat 5x5 67.5
Bench 5x5 75kg
Row 5x5 55kg

Assistance:
3x10 RDL 55kg
10,8,6 Lat Raises 14kg


----------



## Mr Kirk

Dips started to hurt my shoulder when I got above 30kg so stopped doing them. 

Still do chin ups or pull ups as supplementary exercises.


----------



## Bokers

JMorty said:


> Dips and Chins are a killer!
> 
> Made a point of doing at least one set of each, everytime I walked in the gym. Really helped!


Yes they are! Good idea that. I know I need to do more.

At 146kg BW now, even with dieting and I'm light(er) it would be a decent amount of strength needed to do them unassisted. Which I'm aiming for as a challenge.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Bokers said:


> Yes they are! Good idea that. I know I need to do more.
> 
> At 146kg BW now, even with dieting and I'm light(er) it would be a decent amount of strength needed to do them unassisted. Which I'm aiming for as a challenge.


What's your target weight and what progress have you made so far?

(It's probably been mentioned earlier in the thread before I joined in)


----------



## JMorty

Bokers said:


> Yes they are! Good idea that. I know I need to do more.
> 
> At 146kg BW now, even with dieting and I'm light(er) it would be a decent amount of strength needed to do them unassisted. Which I'm aiming for as a challenge.


I have a massive advantage, only 76kg @14.4% body fat...so I'm cheating really.


----------



## Bokers

Mr Kirk said:


> What's your target weight and what progress have you made so far?
> 
> (It's probably been mentioned earlier in the thread before I joined in)


I don't think I have mentioned it before haha.
I'm aiming to get under 120kg as a base. Probably be happy(er) around 115kg.
Progress is slow, finding the food changes hard. I like it too much haha.

Last week or two I've started to tidy up my food choices and track my macros. We will see how it goes.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Good luck and keep updating. Sure there's people here to offer help and advice.


----------



## Bokers

Cheers pal. Will do.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Struggled today. Shoulders felt weak and my back tightened up a bit on the last set of deadlifts. 

Date: 3/15/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
42.5 kg x 5 reps 
50 kg x 5 reps 
60 kg x 5 reps 
67.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
105 kg x 5 reps 
122.5 kg x 5 reps 
147.5 kg x 5 reps 
165 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Mr Kirk

After struggling on Wednesday I wasn't looking forward to today but it was a bit of breeze. Well, it was hard work but no problems. 

Date: 3/17/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
90 kg x 5 reps 
105 kg x 5 reps 
127.5 kg x 5 reps 
142.5 kg x 3 reps 
105 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
50 kg x 5 reps 
60 kg x 5 reps 
70 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 3 reps 
70 kg x 8 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
50 kg x 5 reps 
60 kg x 5 reps 
70 kg x 5 reps 
85 kg x 5 reps 
95 kg x 3 reps 
70 kg x 8 reps

Wide grip pull ups 10kg 3x5


----------



## Bokers

Yesterday

Cycle + warmup

Deadlifts
60, 90, 120, 140kg x 5
160kg x 3 x 3

DB row over bench
20kg x 5, 27.5 kg x 5, 5, 5 30kg x 5 (one side at a time).


----------



## Mr Kirk

Workout felt hard yesterday. Hopefully just tired. 

Date: 3/20/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
100 kg x 5 reps 
107.5 kg x 5 reps 
115 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bench Press
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Bent Over Row
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
72.5 kg x 5 reps 
87.5 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps 
97.5 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Bokers

Well done for going though, regretting not going myself.


----------



## Hamster12

Hi everyone, first time posting in this thread.

I have been training for the last 8 months starting with Stronglifts 5x5. I've moved onto the GZCL method of training which I now prefer.

My last session was:

Squat: 5 sets x 3 at 107.5kg

Bench: 3 sets x 10 at 62.5kg

Lat pulldown: 3 sets x 10 at 52kg

Leg extension: 3 sets x 10 at 60kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Bokers

Welcome. Keep the posts coming. What is GZCL?


----------



## Hamster12

This sub Reddit explains everything https://www.reddit.com/r/gzcl/

There are multiple programs to suit everyone, I'm currently running the linear progression version as I can still progress after every workout.


----------



## Bokers

Nice, I'll have a read, cheers.


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup. Missed a couple of bits off of the warm up, silly. Also, cycled 5k at a higher resistance and faster, too eager.

Squats
20, 50, 70, 90kg x 5
112.5kg x 5, 5, 5, 2

RDL with pivot bar
60kg x 10 x 3

Some abs.


----------



## Hamster12

Bokers said:


> Cycle + warmup. Missed a couple of bits off of the warm up, silly. Also, cycled 5k at a higher resistance and faster, too eager.
> 
> Squats
> 20, 50, 70, 90kg x 5
> 112.5kg x 5, 5, 5, 2
> 
> RDL with pivot bar
> 60kg x 10 x 3
> 
> Some abs.


What program are you running?


----------



## Bokers

Hamster12 said:


> What program are you running?


Not what I'm actually programmed to be doing haha. It's similar to Westside. I'll dig it out.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Date: 3/22/17
Program: Madcow 5x5
Exercise: Barbell Back Squat
75 kg x 5 reps 
92.5 kg x 5 reps 
107.5 kg x 5 reps 
107.5 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Standing Military Press
42.5 kg x 5 reps 
50 kg x 5 reps 
62.5 kg x 5 reps 
70 kg x 5 reps 
Exercise: Barbell Deadlift
107.5 kg x 5 reps 
125 kg x 5 reps 
150 kg x 5 reps 
167.5 kg x 5 reps


----------



## Brick Top

No training updates yet, planning on making a bit of a run at it again next month though, couple of unplanned months off due to an injury buy feeling good again now though. Will take it easy to start with, probably won't look too compete again until early next year as I'm anticipating a pretty decent drop in performance

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Hamster12

Brick Top said:


> No training updates yet, planning on making a bit of a run at it again next month though, couple of unplanned months off due to an injury buy feeling good again now though. Will take it easy to start with, probably won't look too compete again until early next year as I'm anticipating a pretty decent drop in performance
> 
> Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


Which powerlifting association do you compete with?


----------



## Brick Top

Hamster12 said:


> Which powerlifting association do you compete with?


GBPF or British Powerlifting as its known now

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Bokers

Cycle + warmup. Getting faster at 5K on the bike.

Benchpress
20, 50, 70kg x 5
90kg x 5, 6, 6, 5

Cable triceps
65kg x 10 x 3

Curls
12.5kg x 10, 10, 6


----------



## Bod42

I have used GZCL and thats where I hit my best PRs ever. This is a better link http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2012/11/the-gzcl-method-for-powerlifting.html as it written by the designer himself.

Its not so much a program as a way of thinking but its a very good outline for programming. I will be going back to GZCL later this year and running it long term on a 3 steps forwards 2 steps backwards type of loading.

Dips hurt my shoulders when I get heavy as well but when I look back through my training, my bench has always jumped when I have added a lot of dips into my program. The best was when I was doing 5 sets of 20 after shoulders and heavy after Bench or vice versa.

Brick Top, great lifts for your body weight. I'm at a similar place but I weight 105-110kgs so wouldnt do so well competing.

My goal by the end of 2017 is to hit 
Squat: 220kg
Deadlift: 250kgs
Bench: 175kg
All at a body weight of 99kgs.


----------



## Brick Top

Bod42 said:


> I have used GZCL and thats where I hit my best PRs ever. This is a better link http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2012/11/the-gzcl-method-for-powerlifting.html as it written by the designer himself.
> 
> Its not so much a program as a way of thinking but its a very good outline for programming. I will be going back to GZCL later this year and running it long term on a 3 steps forwards 2 steps backwards type of loading.
> 
> Dips hurt my shoulders when I get heavy as well but when I look back through my training, my bench has always jumped when I have added a lot of dips into my program. The best was when I was doing 5 sets of 20 after shoulders and heavy after Bench or vice versa.
> 
> Brick Top, great lifts for your body weight. I'm at a similar place but I weight 105-110kgs so wouldnt do so well competing.
> 
> My goal by the end of 2017 is to hit
> Squat: 220kg
> Deadlift: 250kgs
> Bench: 175kg
> All at a body weight of 99kgs.


I've never tried GZCL but always liked the principles behind it. I may try one of the high frequency templates he's designed at some point.

Thanks mate, you'll love competing no matter what level you are!

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk


----------



## Hamster12

Another session.

Overhead press: 5 sets x 3 at 50kg

Deadlift: 3 sets x 8 at 100kg

Incline dumbbell bench press: 3 sets x 12 at 22kg each hand

Dumbbell row: 3 sets x 12 at 26kg

Tricep cable pushdown: 3 sets x 12 at 45kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Mr Kirk

Played football yesterday for the first time in umpteen years. 

Went over on my ankle twice and it's swelled up nicely. 

Might have to skip legs this week.


----------



## Bokers

Haha and on that note...

Played rugby yesterday, last game of the season and as such went for it, so my knees are shot today and the whole body is more than DOMS sore haha.

I'll pick up some lighter sessions this week and then go from there to build up strength and fitness in the off season.


----------



## Guest

Bod42 said:


> I have used GZCL and thats where I hit my best PRs ever. This is a better link http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.co.nz/2012/11/the-gzcl-method-for-powerlifting.html as it written by the designer himself.


Thanks for the link, very interesting. Tempted to try that during the later part of this year.


----------



## Hamster12

Bench day.

Bench: 5 sets x 3 at 77.5kg

Squat: 3 sets x 10 at 80kg

Lat pulldown: 3 sets x 12 at 52kg

Incline dumbbell bench press: 3 sets x 10 at 22kg per hand

Tricep cable pushdown: 3 sets x 12 at 45kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Hamster12

Deadlift day.

Deadlift: 5 sets x 3 at 132.5kg

Overhead press: 3 sets x 10 at 40kg

Front squat: 3 sets x 10 at 50kg

Dumbbell row: 3 sets x 12 at 28kg

Tricep cable pushdown: 3 sets x 12 at 45kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Bokers

Feeling rough, lighter session.

10km bike.
Warmup.

Lat pulldown
50kg x 10 x 3

DB row
25kg x 10 x 3

Ab floor.


----------



## Bokers

5k/3mile mile bike ride to 5k/3 mile park run to 5k/3mil ride home... 
I would like to say run but it was around 50/50 walk and run. I won't get better without trying it though.
Oddly felt quite good on the uphill sections rather than the flat or down.

Quite a lot of cardio, for me anyway.


----------



## Mr Kirk

I prefer running uphill for some reason. Hate treadmills though. Shins hurt and calves cramp up.


----------



## Bokers

Glad it's not just me. Had that cramp/pain on the downhill parts.


----------



## Bokers

Feel like poop but it was better to go than not.

Cycle

OHP
20, 40kg x 5
50kg x 5 x 5

Squat
50kg x 5 x 5


----------



## Hamster12

A couple of workouts from last week.

*Workout One*

Squat: 5 sets x 3 at 110kg

Bench: 3 sets x 10 at 62.5kg

Leg Extension: 3 sets x 10 at 62kg

Skullcrusher: 3 sets x 12 at 25kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg

*Workout Two*

Bench: 5 sets x 3 at 80kg

Squat: 3 sets x 10 at 82.5kg

Lat pulldown: 3 sets x 12 at 52kg

Incline dumbbell bench press: 3 sets x 12 at 22kg per hand

Tricep cable pushdown: 3 sets x 12 at 45kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Bod42

So I finished the DUP and it was a really good program, great gains but bl00dy hard work hitting the big 3 every single workout.

Finished with:
Deadlifts: 162.5x5x5
Bench: 120x5x5
Squats: 150x5x5

I am now giving Candito 6 week program that I havent read a bad review about.

Squats: 145x6,6,6,6
Deadlifts: 160x6,6

Bench: 72.5x10, 95x10, 107.5x8, 110x6
Pendlay Rows: 60x10, 60x10, 65x8, 70x6
Shoulder Press: 30x12, 35x12, 40x6, 40x6
Incline Flyes: 12.5x12,12,12
EZ Curls: 30x10,10,10

Some good and bad things came from this workout. Bench was ok, pendlay rows were awesome, its actually amazing how the sloppy form barbell rows have made Pendlay rows feel like nothing and I actually mean nothing. I still suck big time at Shoulder Press but my shoulder didnt hurt at all. I hate flies and biceps but I recon they will help.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Nice lifts!


----------



## Hamster12

Deadlift: 5 sets x 3 at 120kg (Deloaded slightly due to form)

Overhead press: 3 sets x 10 at 40kg

Dumbbell row: 3 sets x 12 at 28kg

Leg extension: 3 sets x 12 at 62kg

Skullcrusher: 3 sets x 12 at 25kg

Curls: 3 sets x 15 at 27kg


----------



## Mr Kirk

Had two weeks off leg work now to help my ankle heal. 

So took the opportunity to write up my own routine on excel. Based on madcow which I was enjoying, but it only did shoulders once a week. I'm going to work in doing it twice a week. 
Set the sheet up to automatically add weight and reload after three fails. Hopefully it will work!


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 72.5x10, 95x10, 107.5x8, 110x6
Pendlay Rows: 62.5x10, 62.5x10, 67.5x8, 72.5x6
Shoulder Press: 32.5x12, 35x12, 37.5x10, 40x8
Incline Flyes: 12.5x12,12,12

You will notice that this is exactly the same workout and thats the way the program sets it out. Its about high frequentcy and volume in the first week so you do Bench & upper body 3 times in the first week.

I'm struggling with my bench form for the first time in years. Rows are an absolute joke, the bar is moving stupidly fast with strict form.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Article I read recently about bench press https://www.muscleforlife.com/how-to-increase-bench-press/

How are you finding the pendlay row on your lower back at heavy weights? I find once I get above 90kg or so it's not so good.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 115x10
Pendlay Rows: 70x8, 75x6
Shoulder Press: 32.5x12, 35x12, 37.5x10, 40x8
Incline Flyes: 12.5x12,12,12
EZ Bar Curls: 30x12,12,12

I had far more strenth than 115x10 but I setup to far back on the bench so every rep hit the supports so I had to push towards my feet instead of the usual backwards. This used up a few reps worth of strength.

I find the pendlay rows absolutely fine on the lower back. You setup with a really hard arch and stretch the hamstrings then I dont move at all. I setup with the bar touching my legs just like a deadlift so if you can deadlift over 200kgs then a 100kg pendlay should be fine.

Ive always been a good bencher but my shoulder blades are coming untucked during the reps which ive never had before.


----------



## Bod42

Week 2
Squats: 145x10
Squats: 147.5x3,3,3,3,3 1 min rest.
Deficit Deadlifts: 110x8,8,8

Very please to hit 145 for 10 reps. Been worried about these higher rep sets for a while now but I actually smashed this set. The heavier short rest low rep sets were harder. On thurs I have to do 10 sets of 3 reps instead of 5 sets so thats going to be brutal with 1 min rest. Definitely making progress though.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Back on squats this week.


----------



## Bod42

Bench: 102.5x10, 110x8, 117.5x7
Pendlay Rows: 70x10, 52.5x8, 55x8
Shoulder Press: 40x10, 42.5x8, 45x6
EZ Bar Curls: 32.5x10,10,10

Some days weight lifting is very strange, the warm up sets were bad, I struggled to complete 110x8 so was obviously worried about doing 117.5 for 6-8 reps but as soon as I unracked the weight, I had to look side to side to make sure I had increased the weight. Banged out a clean fast 7 reps leaving 1 rep in the tank as I have to hit the same workout in 2 days time so can hit 8 reps then.

Shoulder press are slowly feeling better as well.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Squats
Deadlifts
Shoulders
Back
All felt good. First time on deadlifts for three weeks.


----------



## Bod42

Squats: 147.5x10
Squats: 142.5x3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3
Deficit Deadlifts: 115x8,8,8

Ok this workout absolutely killed me. Thats 10 sets with 1 min rest but by the time you've reracked the weight, got out of the rack and then I'm back in the rack at 40 secs rest so I'm unracking and ready to squat on the minute. It was an absolutely killer and one of the hardest workouts I've done in a long time.

Hard wokrouts like this are great mentally thought as I've done all that work so it makes 157.5x6 that I have to do tomorrow sound easy(er).

Bench: 102.5x10, 110x8, 117.5x8
Pendlay Rows: 72,5x10, 75x8, 77.5x8
Shoulder Press: 42.5x10, 45x8, 47.5x6
Chin Ups: BWx3,2,2
Incline Flyes: 15x10,10,12
EZ Bar Curls: 32.5x12,12,12

Gooid workout, hit my goal of 8 reps so pleased with the workout. Hit this workout quite hard as this is the last one with optional exercises.


----------



## Bokers

Bosh! Nice.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Fridays work out to complete my first week:









Yesterday's workout:









Do those sheets make sense to people, as I sent it to my mate and he said he didn't understand it?


----------



## Bokers

Started cycling, half hour 9 mile rides at the moment, building up.


----------



## Bod42

Ya I understand your spreadsheets. Each one shows 3 days and you read left to right for your sets. Way easier than writing it out like I do.

Squats: 157.5x6,6,6
Deadlifts: 175x3,3

Very pleased to get these squats as starting to get heavy and these actually werent to bad. First time I have ever done a peaking program and I must say that they are a lot of fun as your strength skyrockets after you put in the ground work for a few months.

Deadlifts said 3-6 reps at 87.5%. Thats normally my 4 rep max and is most peoples as well so not quite sure how I'm supposed to hit it for 6 reps after doing hard squats before deadlifts. So I did 3 hard reps and was happy with that, this program isnt about deadlifts anyway.

Bench: 120x6,6,6
Barbell Rows: 85x6,6,6
Shoulder Press: 50x6,6,6

Good workout, pleased to get 3 sets of 6 reps with this weight as its a good milestone.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Week 2 done


----------



## Brick Top

Back into my second week of training now, currently on some nerve specific painkillers for the piriformis syndrome/sciatica until the doctor/physio decides what to do with me. For the time being though just going to manage it carefully. Strength is way down but should come back reasonably quick, lots of volume with moderate weight, 75%-85% range, for now to build a decent base again. 

Hopefully get back competing next year fingers crossed 

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk


----------



## Bokers

Good luck with the recovery bud.

Been quiet here for me but I've been cycling and getting through a couple of weeks of sofa to 50k cycling.

Upping the time each week etc. Few more weeks and I should be able to hit the long(er) rides.


----------



## Mr Kirk

Haven't been on here for a few weeks. 
Actually failed some lifts last week. The same week I decided to do a cut. Coincidence or not hmmmmn 
Week 3








Week 4








Week 5 so far


----------



## Bod42

I haven't been around for awhile, still training and did the Candito 6 week program which was awesome. Extremely hard but good results. Bought me back up level with the strongest I've ever been in 5 weeks.

I'm now doing the Ed Coan Bench and Deadline program.

People probably know but the Bench program is
Bench
Close Grip Bench
Incline Bench
Flys
Push downs
Dips

Starts at 10 reps and works it way down to 1 rep. The only thing I found hard is the 1st 4 week are 1.5 mins rest which really effected my performance. From week 5 the rest jumps to 5 mins which is a bit of a jump. The short rest periods are for muscle building but I think I will just be failing on exercises 2 & 3 due to this so not sure to follow the program exactly as written or up the rest periods.


----------



## Bod42

Workout 1 of the Ed Coan Deadlift Program.

I will start by saying brutal. If my recovery can survive 11 weeks then there is no way that this program won't add some strength.

Deadlifts: 80x10, 110x5, 150x2, 155x1, 172.5x2
Deadlifts: 140x3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3 90 secs rest
Circuit 90 seconds rest
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 100x8,8,8
Bent Over Rows: 100x8,8,8
Under Hand Chin Ups: BWx3,2,2
Good Mornings: 40x8,8,8

Every single exercise in this workout is aimed at the posterior chain so I recon it is really going to add some strength. After 3 months, should be a lot closer to my goal of a 250kg deadlift.


----------



## Bod42

Deadlifts: 82.5x10, 120x5, 157.5x2, 167.5x1, 185x2
Deadlifts: 150x3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3 90 secs rest
Circuit 90 seconds rest
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 102.5x8,8,8
Bent Over Rows: 102.5x8,8,8
Under Hand Chin Ups: BWx2,2,2
Good Mornings: 50x8,8,8

Good workout, the heavy stuff didnt feel as easy as it should but I think this is due to tweaking my back and my body is changing my form to stay away from the injury.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Deadlifts: 82.5x10, 120x5, 157.5x2, 167.5x1, 185x2
> Deadlifts: 150x3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3 90 secs rest


Nice deadlifts buddy, especially the triplets on such short rests :thumb:

Haven't posted on here for a while but still building strength slowly but consistently. 
Current true maxes (so actual weight on the bar for 1 rep, rather than predicted) are - 
Bench - 132.5kg
Squat - 170kg - got this yesterday, was very happy to get it!
Trap bar deadlift - 213.3kg

Bench today so will see how that goes.

On another note, anyone here take any pre workout drinks? I've tried a few now and one in particular worked (in fact I felt like I needed to jump off the walls!) but the other few have tasted like pee and had little to no effect on me...


----------



## Mr Kirk

I've used myprotein impact pump blend I think it was. 

It was the only one I could find which didn't have caffeine in. Others have a lot of caffeine in, like 5+ cups of coffee worth. Stupid. 

Anyway initially it made a difference but I think i built up a tolerance to it. So stopped using but might try again.


----------



## Bod42

I find they work short term but I find that they become mentally addictive sort of. Like 1 scoop becomes your norm so when you feel like crap you take 2 scoops and have a great workout so you start taki9ng 2 scoops. I've seen people completely write their workout off just becuase they forget their preworkout, couldn't possibly have a good workout without it.

I use a supplement with zero stimulants - Optimum Nutrition Pro BCAA. It has both BCAA's and L-Glutamine so good for perserving muscle. I normally add a small scoop of Lucozade just so I've definitely got some energy in the body as so times it can be 6 hours since I ate.

Deadlifts: 90x10, 130x5, 165x2, 175x1, 195x2
Deadlifts: 160x3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3 120 secs rest
Circuit 90 seconds rest
Stiff Legged Deadlifts: 105x8,8,8
Bent Over Rows: 105x8,8,8
Under Hand Chin Ups: BWx2,2,2
Good Mornings: 55x8,8,8

Bench Press: 50x10, 72.5x5, 92.5x2, 100x1, 110x8,8
Paused Close Grip Bench: 97.5x8,8
Paused Incline Bench: 75x8,8
Flyes: 12.5x20,20
Push Downs: Green Bandx10,10,10,10
Dips: BWx10,7,5

Its weird, this workout feels like its spaced to far apart, a week between upper body seems to much considering I have been training each exercise multiple times per week lately but I must say that I am getting stronger. Ok I have done 115x12 before so 110x8 is nothing special but it felt easy.


----------



## Leebo310

Decline bench PB today so very happy.

WU 20kg x 10, 60kg x 5, 80kg x 5

WO 102.5kg x 5, 110kg x 4, 117.5kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 130 x 1, 140 x 1, *150 x 1 (PB)*

My training partner also got a pb of 120kg so good day all round. He made his rep even harder by clipping the pegs both on the way down and on the way up yet he still managed it!

Deadlifts tomorrow.... :devil:


----------



## Bokers

Got up to doing a couple of hours / 30 miles.

Bringing the gym back in for some quick lunchtime sessions.

Today's:

Cycle + warmup.

Squats
20, 40, 70kg x 5
80kg x 5 x 5

Felt good to get the bar moving again. More to come.


----------



## Brick Top

Finished my first 5 week training block this week, worked up to a 160kg squat afterwards, probably good for around 170ish at a max at the minute . Fair bit off my best but it's a decent start back to consistent training. I'll work up to a reasonable bench and deadlift single over the coming days then write myself another block when I've got some numbers to work with.


__
http://instagr.am/p/BV5G76Rl-5B/


----------



## Leebo310

Brick Top said:


> Finished my first 5 week training block this week, worked up to a 160kg squat afterwards, probably good for around 170ish at a max at the minute . Fair bit off my best but it's a decent start back to consistent training. I'll work up to a reasonable bench and deadlift single over the coming days then write myself another block when I've got some numbers to work with.
> 
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/BV5G76Rl-5B/


Nice lift mate  
Do you find the belt helps much? I'm thinking of getting one but not sure which to get.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Brick Top

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lift mate
> Do you find the belt helps much? I'm thinking of getting one but not sure which to get.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yeah massively, if you get a proper 4 inch wide, and 10-13mm thick powerlifting belt it makes a huge difference, I wouldn't bother with the fabric or smaller ones though in terms of being able to lift more they won't do much. Once you learn how to 'brace' your core and really fill the belt out with your stomach it's feels so much stronger and stable


----------



## Brick Top

Leebo310 said:


> Nice lift mate
> Do you find the belt helps much? I'm thinking of getting one but not sure which to get.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I paid a fortune for mine because it will last me a lifetime but something like this would be perfect to start with for you
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01N05WCLV/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_6..uzb2R59VY8


----------



## Leebo310

Brick Top said:


> Yeah massively, if you get a proper 4 inch wide, and 10-13mm thick powerlifting belt it makes a huge difference, I wouldn't bother with the fabric or smaller ones though in terms of being able to lift more they won't do much. Once you learn how to 'brace' your core and really fill the belt out with your stomach it's feels so much stronger and stable


Cheers mate. I'm not bothered about lifting more as such, just more for a bit of piece of mind really when getting up to the heavier weights! You use yours for bench too or just deads and squats?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Brick Top

Leebo310 said:


> Cheers mate. I'm not bothered about lifting more as such, just more for a bit of piece of mind really when getting up to the heavier weights! You use yours for bench too or just deads and squats?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I don't use it for Bench, just squats and Deadlifts but a lot of people I know wear it to bench just to feel a bit 'tighter' if that makes sense. It's just a preference thing really on bench but you'll tell a big difference on Squats and deads


----------



## Bod42

Belts are good but do some reading on how to use them, instead of tightening the hell out of it, better to actually leave it loose and learn to expand your belly into it, thats the proper way to brace.

Anyway, I have still been lifting but havent been posting as much as I should. Quick update is that I am doing the Ed Coan deadlift and Bench program, strangly the Deadlift program is going really bad whereas I thought this would have been amazing. Its not the program, my form has absolutely gone to sh!t so when I'm working with heavier weights I have no chance.

Bench program is going well, I thought 1 week between workouts would be to long but I just did this tonight.

Bench: 140x3,3
Paused Close Grip Bench Press: 122.5x3,3
Paused Incline Bench Press: 100x3,3
Flyes: 17.5x20,20
Tricep Push Downs: GReen Band x 10,10
Dips: BWx18,12

Very pleased with this as this is the first time in years that I have actually done heavy Bench, I've always kept the reps higher due to my shoulder but my shoulder is feeling dam good. Its my knee that is randomly hurting now, can never win lol


----------



## Brick Top

Starting to gather a bit of momentum again now. Weights still relatively light, taking time to ramp up the volume and build a good base again before upping the intensity.

Few squats from Saturday


__
http://instagr.am/p/BWkA6wmlc9I/

I've signed back up to Mystrengthbook.com its really helpful for taking your trading, volume, intensity etc.

Was hoping to get back on the platform this year but looking like next year unfortunately due to how the dates drop.

Bodyweights currently around 87kg ish, down from 97.5kg over the last 3 months. I plan on losing a couple more kg's before I ramp up the heavy work and put some bodyweight back on to fill out the 93kg class


----------



## Brick Top

Bod42 said:


> Belts are good but do some reading on how to use them, instead of tightening the hell out of it, better to actually leave it loose and learn to expand your belly into it, thats the proper way to brace.
> 
> Anyway, I have still been lifting but havent been posting as much as I should. Quick update is that I am doing the Ed Coan deadlift and Bench program, strangly the Deadlift program is going really bad whereas I thought this would have been amazing. Its not the program, my form has absolutely gone to sh!t so when I'm working with heavier weights I have no chance.
> 
> Bench program is going well, I thought 1 week between workouts would be to long but I just did this tonight.
> 
> Bench: 140x3,3
> Paused Close Grip Bench Press: 122.5x3,3
> Paused Incline Bench Press: 100x3,3
> Flyes: 17.5x20,20
> Tricep Push Downs: GReen Band x 10,10
> Dips: BWx18,12
> 
> Very pleased with this as this is the first time in years that I have actually done heavy Bench, I've always kept the reps higher due to my shoulder but my shoulder is feeling dam good. Its my knee that is randomly hurting now, can never win lol


Decent numbers them mate. Completely right regarding the belt. It can even differ from lift to lift, I love mine tight on Squats but a little looser on deads. Bracing is an art in of itself.


----------



## leeandfay

What a great thread 

I struggle getting back in the gym due to my horrific working hours and I have a rod in my right femur after a life changing accident and a right humourus snap whilst arm wrestling 7 years ago so my confidence in lifting is shot.

The consultant told me that heavy squats are out forever (2003) 

Trying to get back into it now so cheers for the thread lads


----------



## Bod42

Brick Top said:


> Decent numbers them mate. Completely right regarding the belt. It can even differ from lift to lift, I love mine tight on Squats but a little looser on deads. Bracing is an art in of itself.


I'm looking to hit 175 Bench, 250 Dead and 220 Squat by the end of the year so have some work to do yet. Hardly been squatting and just concentrating on rehab with my knee and that is starting to feel better and my shoulder feels the best it has in 10yrs so time to start really pushing the weights up. 3 more weeks on this program then its full attack for 3 months to see where I can get to.



Auto Allure said:


> What a great thread
> 
> I struggle getting back in the gym due to my horrific working hours and I have a rod in my right femur after a life changing accident and a right humourus snap whilst arm wrestling 7 years ago so my confidence in lifting is shot.
> 
> The consultant told me that heavy squats are out forever (2003)
> 
> Trying to get back into it now so cheers for the thread lads


start light and work from there, no Doctor knows what your body can handle until you try. I got told I would be in a wheel chair by 20 if I carried on playing rugby, told that my shoulder is screwed for life and theres nothing I can do except have it replaced at 21. 10 yrs on I have zero back and shoulder pain and I'm the strongest I've ever been (nearly) and I said no to the surgery I *had* to have according to them.


----------



## Brick Top

Bod42 said:


> I'm looking to hit 175 Bench, 250 Dead and 220 Squat by the end of the year so have some work to do yet. Hardly been squatting and just concentrating on rehab with my knee and that is starting to feel better and my shoulder feels the best it has in 10yrs so time to start really pushing the weights up. 3 more weeks on this program then its full attack for 3 months to see where I can get to.
> 
> start light and work from there, no Doctor knows what your body can handle until you try. I got told I would be in a wheel chair by 20 if I carried on playing rugby, told that my shoulder is screwed for life and theres nothing I can do except have it replaced at 21. 10 yrs on I have zero back and shoulder pain and I'm the strongest I've ever been (nearly)


What bodyweight you at mate? Do you let competitively? Very respectable numbers of you hit them. Hoping to total 600 sometime around Xmas as I just feel short of that before my injury then kick on from there


----------



## Leebo310

Auto Allure said:


> What a great thread
> 
> I struggle getting back in the gym due to my horrific working hours and I have a rod in my right femur after a life changing accident and a right humourus snap whilst arm wrestling 7 years ago so my confidence in lifting is shot.
> 
> The consultant told me that heavy squats are out forever (2003)
> 
> Trying to get back into it now so cheers for the thread lads


You broke your arm arm wrestling too?! I thought I was the only person stupid enough to do that  
Mine happened around 12 years ago, broke in four places and damaged nerves and I now have a metal plate in there. Lifting wise as James says, just take it slow and build up and the strength will be there 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Leebo310

Bench today

WU - 20kg x 8, 60kg x 8
WO - 82.5kg x 5, 90kg x 5, 95kg x 5, 100kg x 5, *107.5kg x 10 *- PB for a PM of 143.3kg so very happy with that.

Accessory work after was shoulders mainly, nothing really worth reporting.

Deadlifts tomorrow then squats Wednesday :thumb:


----------



## Leebo310

Tuesday 

Trap bar deadlift

WU – 83.5kg x 8, 113.5kg x 5
WO – 133.5kg x 5, 141kg x 5, 148.5kg x 5, 156kg x 5, 163.5kg x 5

Lots of back stuff after


Today

Squat

WU – 20kg x 8, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5
WO – 102.5kg x 5, 107.5kg x 4, 115kg x 3, 122.5kg x 1, 130kg x 8 

3 second pause reps as low as possible – 100kg x 6

Other leg bits to finish


----------



## Oats

Hope yaw'll all good. I dip in now and again to see how folk are progressing. Thought it might be useful to mention some clothes I've come accross. Years ago I think it was Bod42 who said shirts fit by going up a collar size but getting tailored cut. Golden advice  The other week I found Levi's do 461 Athletic Fit jeans. Bigger thigh and butt than normal compared to waist. I always wear a 36" with a belt and in the 451 I'm 32" and no belt. Fit really well so might be worth a try if you find jeans too baggy at the waist. £40 at outlet or £90 in main stores (I've bought three pairs lol).


----------



## Leebo310

As per most people, it was bench Monday for me today 

*WU*
20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5

*WO*

95kg x 5, 100kg x 4, 107.5kg x 3, 115kg x 2, 120kg x 4

The 120kg for 1+ reps was supposed to be my final set but given the 4 went up easy, decided to keep on going.

130kg x 1

135kg x 1 (new PB for on the bar for around 3 minutes…) - this again went up pretty easily so thought I'd try a bit more

*137.5kg x 1* new PB again:devil:

Very happy with the 137.5kg on the bar, especially as I managed the 4 reps at the 120kg too. 
Also very happy with the fact that I'd reset my working weights back 6 cycles recently (I do a similar programme to Wendlers 5/3/1). Goes to show that sometimes doing less weight is extremely beneficial!

Squats tomorrow :thumb:


----------



## Bod42

Brick Top said:


> What bodyweight you at mate? Do you let competitively? Very respectable numbers of you hit them. Hoping to total 600 sometime around Xmas as I just feel short of that before my injury then kick on from there


I am 110kgs so the lifts aren't fantastic but my end goal is to hit those lifts at 99kgs. Never lifted competitively but maybe I will one day. I just started lifting to help with rugby, stopped playing rugby but carried on lifting.

600lb is impressive, what body weight are you.


----------



## Brick Top

Bod42 said:


> I am 110kgs so the lifts aren't fantastic but my end goal is to hit those lifts at 99kgs. Never lifted competitively but maybe I will one day. I just started lifting to help with rugby, stopped playing rugby but carried on lifting.
> 
> 600lb is impressive, what body weight are you.


Kg's that mate, so looking to total 600kg with squat bench and deadlift combined. I'm around 88kg at the minute, a little light right now as I compete in the under 93kg class


----------



## Bod42

Brick Top said:


> Kg's that mate, so looking to total 600kg with squat bench and deadlift combined. I'm around 88kg at the minute, a little light right now as I compete in the under 93kg class


Was meant to say kgs, 600lbs isnt that great :lol:

600 would be a good goal for me but I would be in the weight class above. Struggling with my knee at the minute so its effecting my squats but mostly my deadlift which is strange. And before the squats are bad for your knees people jump on board, I've worn it out playing golf.


----------



## Leebo310

Brick Top said:


> Kg's that mate, so looking to total 600kg with squat bench and deadlift combined. I'm around 88kg at the minute, a little light right now as I compete in the under 93kg class


How close to 600 are you currently then mate? 
I'm at a measly 521kg...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Brick Top

Leebo310 said:


> How close to 600 are you currently then mate?
> I'm at a measly 521kg...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Last time I competed I hit 590kg, but I've not competed for a year now due to injury. Right now I'm further off than that because of time off injured but I should be able to hit it when I compete again around December January time.


----------



## Leebo310

Brick Top said:


> Last time I competed I hit 590kg, but I've not competed for a year now due to injury. Right now I'm further off than that because of time off injured but I should be able to hit it when I compete again around December January time.


Fair play that's impressive. How was that made up?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Brick Top

Leebo310 said:


> Fair play that's impressive. How was that made up?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


207.5kg squat, 152.5kg bench and 230kg deadlift.


----------



## Leebo310

Brick Top said:


> 207.5kg squat, 152.5kg bench and 230kg deadlift.


Nice 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bokers

Built up to a slightly unplanned 100K/62M cycle. Back to lifting too this week when this cold goes.


----------



## Brick Top

Worked up to a 140kg bench last night at the end of this training block. Biggest bench since I started back this year and only 12.5kg off my all time pb. Strengths coming back quicker than anticipated which is always a bonus. Weighing in at 88kg too which is the lightest I've ever pressed this weight


__
http://instagr.am/p/BYd86tWHssu/


----------



## Bod42

Havent posted much lately guys as got a new job and trying to sell our house so keeps us stupidly busy but I have still been lifting.

I am following Josh Bryant - Size and strength blueprint program which I'm having awesome results but my god is it seriously hard and I'm finding that my recovery is taking a hugh hit.

But I can't complain as I just hit a record on Bench and over the next few weeks, I hope to hit some more records.


----------



## Robinio

I was doing 5x5 for a while, and getting stronger which was great. 

But here is my question: Has anyone done German Volume Training, then returned to lifting heavy only to find their 1 rep-max has suffered?

This happened to me on Squats last year. Have just started German Volume Training, and wondering if this was just something odd that happened, or whether others have had similar experience.


----------



## Leebo310

Robinio said:


> I was doing 5x5 for a while, and getting stronger which was great.
> 
> But here is my question: Has anyone done German Volume Training, then returned to lifting heavy only to find their 1 rep-max has suffered?
> 
> This happened to me on Squats last year. Have just started German Volume Training, and wondering if this was just something odd that happened, or whether others have had similar experience.


I haven't tried it but I believe it's a common side effect yes.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Leebo310

Couple of new pbs for me, both calculated and real recently so very happy with things at the moment.

*Squat*

WU - 60kg x 8, 80kg x 8
WO - 97.5kg x 5, 105kg x 5, 112.5kg x 5, 120kg x 5, 127.5kg x 15 pm of 191.2kg

Then a genuine 172.5kg on the bar recently too (pb)

WU - 60kg x 8, 80kg x 8
WO - 105kg x 5, 112.5kg x 4, 120kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 132.5kg x 1, 145kg x 1, 160kg x 1, *172.5kg x 1*, 160kg x 2, 140kg x 5, 120kg x 5

*Bench*

WU - 20kg x 12, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5 
WO - 100kg x 5, 107.5kg x 4, 112.5kg x 3, 120kg x 2, 127.5kg x 4 pm of 144.5kg

A couple of sessions before I actually managed to get my genuine 140kg bench too, so was very happy to finally get to three plates!

WU - 20kg x 12, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5 
WO - 87.5kg x 3, 97.5kg x 3, 110kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 132.5kg x 1, *140kg x 1 *


----------



## Robinio

I'm still trying to get to 100kg 1-rep max on the bench press. Then again, I only weigh 78kg, so my 95kg PB is not too bad, really - I guess.

Has anyone here tried body recomposition? I recently completed a programme I designed and managed to put on 8.4lb of muscle and lose 6.2lb of fat.

I wrote a blog about it and had DEXA scans done before and after:

https://www.fitness-savvy.co.uk/build-muscle-and-burn-fat-body-recomposition-facts/

I mixed heavy lifting and hypertrophy, with an upper lower split, and got some great results


----------



## Leebo310

Posting on this thread seems to have slowed down a bit! 
I’m still training though, bench today (as per most of the country…)

WU

Bar x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x5

WO
90kg x 5, 97.5kg x 5, 102.5kg x 5, 110kg x 5, 117.5kg x 6

100kg x 5 3 second pause press

Few cable raises and press-up circuit to finish off. 

Legs tomorrow.


----------



## Leebo310

*Squat last week*
WU
20kg x 10, 60kg x 10, 80kg x 8
WO
100kg x 5, 107.5kg x 5, 115kg x 5, 122.5kg x 5, 130kg x 8

*Deadlift (trap bar) last week*
WU
33.5kg x 10, 83.5kg x 10, 113.5kg x 5
WO
143.5kg x 3, 151kg x 3, 163.5kg x 3, 168.5kg x 3, 176kg x 3, 193.5kg x 3, fail @ 223.5kg

*Bench today*
WU
20kg x 10, 60kg x 10, 82.5kg x 5
WO
102.5kg x 5, 110kg x 4, 117.5kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 130kg x 4 (new PB)
100kg x 15 (again new PB)


----------



## chrissymk3

I'e had about 6 months off the gym but also a truly awful diet too, I popped into the gym last week and realised I've lost so much strength! 

Looking for something structured to work to and remember this thread on here.

Never done 5x5 training before, was always split up into chest / back / arms / shoulders / leg days - any advice for someone like me getting started?


----------



## Leebo310

chrissymk3 said:


> I'e had about 6 months off the gym but also a truly awful diet too, I popped into the gym last week and realised I've lost so much strength!
> 
> Looking for something structured to work to and remember this thread on here.
> 
> Never done 5x5 training before, was always split up into chest / back / arms / shoulders / leg days - any advice for someone like me getting started?


You definitely don't need to split out an arm day for starters! 
Stick with the basics (deadlift, bench and squat) and treat everything else as an exercise to help those three. I split mine into a push/pull/leg and work off a percentage based incremental set structure on the three core lifts. It started as a 531 workout but I've reworked it to what I've found works best for me (added in more sets for starters)
Building a strong base of strength in the three core lifts is absolutely critical to any sort of program and genuine gains in my opinion.

5x5 is a great start before then changing into the 531 or similar.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## chrissymk3

Leebo310 said:


> You definitely don't need to split out an arm day for starters!
> Stick with the basics (deadlift, bench and squat) and treat everything else as an exercise to help those three. I split mine into a push/pull/leg and work off a percentage based incremental set structure on the three core lifts. It started as a 531 workout but I've reworked it to what I've found works best for me (added in more sets for starters)
> Building a strong base of strength in the three core lifts is absolutely critical to any sort of program and genuine gains in my opinion.
> 
> 5x5 is a great start before then changing into the 531 or similar.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks, need to have a good read of this thread hopefully see some progress shots!


----------



## Leebo310

chrissymk3 said:


> Thanks, need to have a good read of this thread hopefully see some progress shots!


I don't think there are any actual shots in the whole thread! Its focused on strength so you'll see plenty of progress in numbers though  
If you have any more questions or need spreadsheet copies of any workouts, just ask.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## JMorty

Hey everyone, I'm back! :wave:

After a having a baby (my wife, not me personally), few stints doing Hypertrophy and the Russian Strength program, I'm back to 5x5's. Such a great program.

Look forward to making progress and jumping on to 5,3,1's



Leebo310 said:


> I don't think there are any actual shots in the whole thread! Its focused on strength so you'll see plenty of progress in numbers though
> If you have any more questions or need spreadsheet copies of any workouts, just ask.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I think you'll see Doug doing some savage deep squats if you look hard enough


----------



## Leebo310

JMorty said:


> I think you'll see Doug doing some savage deep squats if you look hard enough


Haha, oh yeah I forgot about those! 
Congrats too on the baby 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## JMorty

Leebo310 said:


> Haha, oh yeah I forgot about those!
> Congrats too on the baby
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks buddy!

They are pretty good pics, nice eye contact in them...although photobucket has probably sh****d them now. Shame


----------



## chrissymk3

Ok I gave this a go in my morning back earlier and I forgot how busy the gym gets!

Anyway I focused a lot on form for obvious reasons as I’ve not done it for a long time. 

This is what I managed to get through:

Squats:
20kgs warm up 2x 10 reps
40kgs 5x 5 reps

Deadlifts:
50kgs 5x 5 reps

Dumb bell over head press
12.5kgs 5x 5 reps

Safe to say I have a lot of work to do.


----------



## Leebo310

Set some new pb's at the end of November, then got hit by the chest infection bug thing that so many people seem to have had so have only just returned to training...

PB's both bench related -
23rd Nov
*Decline Bench*
WU
20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 8, 100kg x 5
WO
120kg x 5, 140kg x 4, 160kg x 1, *165kg x 1*

Felt strong that week so on my regular bench day on the 27th, I hit the following..
*Bench*
WU 
20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5
WO
105kg x 5, 112.5kg x 4, 120kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 132.5kg x 1, 145kg x 1, *150kg x 1*

Both of those went up genuinely easy. No grinding or anything, which although is a bit "oh how much more could I have benched?!?" the actual feeling of knowing the reps were easy means I'm more than happy with them. Don't know about others but if I hit a PB and it literally takes every single bit of effort then I actually feel a bit deflated knowing I struggled and realistically should've gone a tad lighter. Whereas on these, hitting them so cleanly and quickly feels so much more rewarding.

Currently sat at 77.8kg bodyweight too, so agonisingly close to a double bw flat bench....

Goals for 2018 are -

160kg flat bench - current pb 150kg
180kg decline bench - current pb 165kg
200kg squat - current pb 172.5kg
250kg trap bar deadlift - current pb 213.5kg


----------



## Bod42

Hey everyone,

Still here and still lifting. I took a new job and I'm absolutely swamped at work plus a 2 hour drive each way and trying to do our house up to sell. I have been lifting but don't ever find time to update the thread.

I have been doing GCZLP as its a mentally simple workout which I need at the moment but still allows me to lift some nice heavy weights and I like the progression how you never lower the weight.

Update is basically the same as ever, progressing on Bench, Squats moving slowly and struggling with deadlifts but looking to build back up over the next few months as I'm within 10% of my max lifts ever and I'm sure I can get that when I go back to concentrating on lifting. Got to move house before I can do that though.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> Still here and still lifting. I took a new job and I'm absolutely swamped at work plus a 2 hour drive each way and trying to do our house up to sell. I have been lifting but don't ever find time to update the thread.
> 
> I have been doing GCZLP as its a mentally simple workout which I need at the moment but still allows me to lift some nice heavy weights and I like the progression how you never lower the weight.
> 
> Update is basically the same as ever, progressing on Bench, Squats moving slowly and struggling with deadlifts but looking to build back up over the next few months as I'm within 10% of my max lifts ever and I'm sure I can get that when I go back to concentrating on lifting. Got to move house before I can do that though.


Good to see you back buddy 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Bazza85

Leebo310 said:


> Set some new pb's at the end of November, then got hit by the chest infection bug thing that so many people seem to have had so have only just returned to training...
> 
> PB's both bench related -
> 23rd Nov
> *Decline Bench*
> WU
> 20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 8, 100kg x 5
> WO
> 120kg x 5, 140kg x 4, 160kg x 1, *165kg x 1*
> 
> Felt strong that week so on my regular bench day on the 27th, I hit the following..
> *Bench*
> WU
> 20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5
> WO
> 105kg x 5, 112.5kg x 4, 120kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 132.5kg x 1, 145kg x 1, *150kg x 1*
> 
> Both of those went up genuinely easy. No grinding or anything, which although is a bit "oh how much more could I have benched?!?" the actual feeling of knowing the reps were easy means I'm more than happy with them. Don't know about others but if I hit a PB and it literally takes every single bit of effort then I actually feel a bit deflated knowing I struggled and realistically should've gone a tad lighter. Whereas on these, hitting them so cleanly and quickly feels so much more rewarding.
> 
> Currently sat at 77.8kg bodyweight too, so agonisingly close to a double bw flat bench....
> 
> Goals for 2018 are -
> 
> 160kg flat bench - current pb 150kg
> 180kg decline bench - current pb 165kg
> 200kg squat - current pb 172.5kg
> 250kg trap bar deadlift - current pb 213.5kg


Blimey, they're some numbers mate. Very impressive for your body weight. 
Good luck achieving the targets at the bottom :thumb:


----------



## Bazza85

Haven’t been on this thread for ages!

Love doing 5x5 when I’ve had to have a break from the gym due to work or holidays etc. Gets you strong and fires the muscle memory into action pretty quick. 

I tend to move more into bodybuilding type lifting most of the time (ie fail at 8-12reps, 4-5sets depending on exercise) but probably do a month of 5x5 two or three times a year when I start to plateau or have had a break from the gym. 

Currently at

1RM bench 150kg
(5x5 at 130kg)

Squat
1RM dunno 
(5x5 120kg Needs some Work, my weakest exercise by far!!!!!)

Deadlift (standard, no straps)
1RM 190
(5x5 155kg)

Military Press
1RM dunno
(5x5 80kg)

Not big numbers at all,
But I enjoy it and can certainly fill a t-short out nice
BW 92kg
BF is a steady 15%


----------



## Bod42

Leebo310 said:


> Set some new pb's at the end of November, then got hit by the chest infection bug thing that so many people seem to have had so have only just returned to training...
> 
> PB's both bench related -
> 23rd Nov
> *Decline Bench*
> WU
> 20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 8, 100kg x 5
> WO
> 120kg x 5, 140kg x 4, 160kg x 1, *165kg x 1*
> 
> Felt strong that week so on my regular bench day on the 27th, I hit the following..
> *Bench*
> WU
> 20kg x 10, 60kg x 8, 80kg x 5
> WO
> 105kg x 5, 112.5kg x 4, 120kg x 3, 125kg x 2, 132.5kg x 1, 145kg x 1, *150kg x 1*
> 
> Both of those went up genuinely easy. No grinding or anything, which although is a bit "oh how much more could I have benched?!?" the actual feeling of knowing the reps were easy means I'm more than happy with them. Don't know about others but if I hit a PB and it literally takes every single bit of effort then I actually feel a bit deflated knowing I struggled and realistically should've gone a tad lighter. Whereas on these, hitting them so cleanly and quickly feels so much more rewarding.
> 
> Currently sat at 77.8kg bodyweight too, so agonisingly close to a double bw flat bench....
> 
> Goals for 2018 are -
> 
> 160kg flat bench - current pb 150kg
> 180kg decline bench - current pb 165kg
> 200kg squat - current pb 172.5kg
> 250kg trap bar deadlift - current pb 213.5kg


Leebo, this is bl00dy :doublesho. I was impressed with the lifts then I read your bodyweight and you have got the utmost respect from me for these lifts, awesome mate. My lifts are barely above yours and Im 30kgs heavier so I've got some work to do.

I don't know about others but this is why I started this thread, that is pure motivation right there. I'm pretty sure reading that is the only reason I just finished 122.5 for 3 sets of 10 reps in squats.


----------



## Leebo310

Bod42 said:


> Leebo, this is bl00dy :doublesho. I was impressed with the lifts then I read your bodyweight and you have got the utmost respect from me for these lifts, awesome mate. My lifts are barely above yours and Im 30kgs heavier so I've got some work to do.
> 
> I don't know about others but this is why I started this thread, that is pure motivation right there. I'm pretty sure reading that is the only reason I just finished 122.5 for 3 sets of 10 reps in squats.


Ah cheers buddy, that means a lot!
It was down to you and Doug that got me started on the original 531 workout so credit to you both too! I still have the same spreadsheets you sent me, and the pdf's from Doug. Even after several years now I still absolutely love this style of workout. Even though I've been constantly tweaking small bits, the bones are based on 531 and I'm still getting results year after year. I've given versions to several friends and they love it too, and have seen constant improvement.
Proper form, consistent approach to reps, small increments and realistic %'s and you cannot not get stronger!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## NewLeaf

Hey fellow 5x5ers.

I can't be the first nutcase who has thought about detailing their weightlifting equipment can I? I have a new power rack. barbell and urethane bumpers coming next week and as they will be kept in my garage I am thinking I may apply a coating to stop them going rusty.

So what should I use on the barbell and rack? I could just give it a regular wipe down with carpro echo, or I could go the whole hog and coat them both with cquartz uk V3. What do you think?

Also has anyone tried the shemworks free spotter. I have been using one for a few years now and can't imagine lifting without one. I can post a vid of me using it if anyone is interested?


----------

