# Zyrnol vintage .... what special in this wax?



## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Hello all members

i have swissvax Best of show really nice wax ! my qustion:

Is there a big difference and a large gap between swissvax BOS , zyrnol glasur
and zyrnol vintage ?


Is there a big difference in the look for wax more than 1000$?!

ihave BOS , destiny ,carbon ,concourse all this wax is great except z concourse ithink sutable for old paint .

now .....vintage what more he can bring in the look ? its worth?
if only bring more Protection really no need!




THANKS


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## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

No one really knows, many people will say it adds this or that to the finish and many will say they don't see any difference.

I think (and this is why I want it) that people buy it because they want to, they don't care if others love/hate it, they just want it so buy it.

I personally think too much emphasis is put on 'is this wax better that that one', if there truell was a wax that looked amazing and lasted forever we'd never have anything to talk about.

Many people love Best of Show, but to me it's nothing special and I'd never try it.


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## A20 LEE (Feb 20, 2007)

Its certainly better but a mistake many people make is judging it purely on a glance and say no its not worth the extra. You'll get loads of opinions on this but listen to those that actually own it as its about more than just a shiney car. You get a lifetime of one of the finest waxes which is worth it if your currently using £100+ waxes. The whole application to buy and hand over process makes you realise your joining an exclusive club. You also need to learn how to use this wax too and experiment with getting the better out of it and your technic. Looks wise it actually gets better as it matures on your car and you get an awesome life and vibrancy to your paint in direct sun. Think of the surface of a lake shimmering in the sun. Theres loads of dimensions to a wax like this that only and owner will have time to study and appreciate. Its a tough decision to buy vintage and not worth it to everyone. I don't think i'd have bought mine by myself but as a family purchase is was a very wise decision and i've not bought another wax since.


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## Gleammachine (Sep 8, 2007)

TBH I think you'll notice next to nothing over what you already have in concourse and bos.
Vintage will offer better durability, looks wise there is a very slight difference, we're talking minimal and something you'd probably only notice on darker paint.
I applied Destiny, Concourse, Vintage & Atlantique to masked of sections on my bootlid, the difference was pretty much non existent, but the 2 more expensive waxes lasted a little longer in durability.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Gleammachine said:


> TBH I think you'll notice next to nothing over what you already have in concourse and bos.
> Vintage will offer better durability, looks wise there is a very slight difference, we're talking minimal and something you'd probably only notice on darker paint.
> I applied Destiny, Concourse, Vintage & Atlantique to masked of sections on my bootlid, the difference was pretty much non existent, but the 2 more expensive waxes lasted a little longer in durability.


yes , only more durability i applyed side by side souveran vs destiny
and p21s vs destiny vs concourse
in souveran only lees than one month and destiny stay for 4 month ican see 50/50 line destiny darker than souveran but when iapply fresh coat souveran look darker and after 2-3 wash loss evrey think .

concourse also have good durability 2-3 months.


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## Chris_4536 (Sep 20, 2006)

Find a wax you are happy with and apply it regularly!


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## trhland (Sep 22, 2007)

out of my waxes i seem to keep going back to souveran and pinnacle signature series 2 paste wax.


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

Alex L said:


> Many people love Best of Show, but to me it's nothing special and I'd never try it.


To be fair you cant comment on it until you try it mate...it is stunning and I actually took the attitude you did....then got it for Christmas used it and was blown away,

You honestly cant say its nothing special without actually using it....


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

trhland said:


> out of my waxes i seem to keep going back to souveran and pinnacle signature series 2 paste wax.


and what about your swissvax kit ? what do you think is better souveran or swissvax wax?


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

nick_mcuk said:


> To be fair you cant comment on it until you try it mate...it is stunning and I actually took the attitude you did....then got it for Christmas used it and was blown away,
> 
> You honestly cant say its nothing special without actually using it....


sort of the same firstly a little bit more than i was hoping and i thought i had a gd finish with AG HD, but i have to say SV BOS blows AG HD into weeds in my op. from the ease of application and removal(esp. this one) to the durability and looks...by far the best all rounder...


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Gleammachine said:


> TBH I think you'll notice next to nothing over what you already have in concourse and bos.
> Vintage will offer better durability, looks wise there is a very slight difference, , .


thank you Gleam , itried p21s 100% carnuba and i can say this wax 
very durable and cheaper than vintage .
p21s 100% bring nice clarity and durability better than original p21s 
the p21s original wetter than p21s 100% but the durability very very weak.


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## R31Heaven (Jun 9, 2008)

If you love detailing you car, Durability means didilly squat, as I love spending time polishing my car So durabilty means nothing to me.


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

R31Heaven said:


> If you love detailing you car, Durability means didilly squat, as I love spending time polishing my car So durabilty means nothing to me.


Point taken but, and the thing so far missing from this Vintage thread is the ability to layer and gain much more

Four plus layers really builds the wax look, and the durability gain with Vintage is the ability to wash up week after week looking like the first day it was applied.

Worth the money? - Only in the eye of the individual


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## atomicfan (Jan 21, 2008)

If you compare vintage against p21s you are false.

I have tried every wax except solaris and can tell you vintage is my all time favorite.

It defintely adds something to the finish, that other cheaper waxes cannot.

Beading is also the best i have seen on vintage.

Currently i have 1 layer vintage on my car and after a strong winter with only 2-3 washes in 6-7 months the beading still is very good. The look of course also

I have colly 476 on another car for the same time and even tho the car was parked in a garage the last 4 months the beading is not really good.

Z Royale also lasts very very well. After 7 months and washes in swirlomatics without any special shampoo detailer the water beading is still very impressive.

Try Vintage and you will see what it can make on your car.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

atomicfan said:


> If you compare vintage against p21s you are false.
> 
> .


please , open your two eyes befor you write somthing rong , iwrote p21s 100% very durable i dont wrote i compare toghther!!!


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## supercharged (Feb 1, 2008)

Vintage is offering you unlimited refills, so it pays off for itself.


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

supercharged said:


> Vintage is offering you unlimited refills, so it pays off for itself.


A refil from the UK costs about £250 round trip insured. Worth bearing in mind if your outside the states as i guess it would be a load cheaper there


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## R31Heaven (Jun 9, 2008)

Epoch said:


> A refil from the UK costs about £250 round trip insured. Worth bearing in mind if your outside the states as i guess it would be a load cheaper there


And how much of it would you use over a ten year period? if used on your own car, not a lot.


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## Bluetacker (Feb 6, 2009)

I'd love Vintage, but it will unfortunately forever be a dream for me...


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## Car Key (Mar 20, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> please , open your two eyes befor you write somthing rong , iwrote p21s 100% very durable i dont wrote i compare toghther!!!


How long have you found R222 100% lasting, Maxi? I heard a horror story of it not lasting through one rain storm *gulp*


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## Bigpikle (May 21, 2007)

I've used it twice now so have some personal experiences:

1. there is something about just using it, the way it melts and is a joy to apply

2. it is amazingly durable - easily did 4 months of snow and winter salt etc on my bonnet and would have done a lot more if I had left it

3. it comes clean like nothing I have used before. I have talked about FK1000 cleaning easily, but Vintage blows everything else I have used out of the water - a simply foam and it releases everything :thumb:

4. Looks are so subjective but it certainly looks superb. I wont make any wild claims about it as on both my cars it looked great, but then so do plenty of other products.

There IS something about Vintage IMHO. Would I buy it - well that was tested recently, and i didnt, as I couldnt justify it right now.


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Again, we will be drawn to the argument about whether an LSP adds anything to a _properly_ prepared finish or not... and the answer I stand by, supported through testing and personal experiences, is that what is added is _very_ slight and many will not notice it, on initial application... much is said about the look lasting, being honest here if the addition is so damn slight at the start, try comparing whether you can see it lasting or not (honestly, and be objective rather than dewey eyed)... you cant.

Vintage will offer a special feeling in its use, I can quite imagine, Royale certainly did when I used it but this for me _did not_ translate into tenable on paper performance in either looks or durability... I could convince myself had I spent the money, but being objective I really saw no tenable difference between it and many cheaper waxes.

It is true that waxes will offer subtly difference nuances but a mistake commonly made is that more expensive waxes add _better_ nuances - to me this is simply not true... Eg, the wet look you achieve from Best Of Show, the addition you can also get from Dodo Rubbish Boys Edition and Clearkote Carnuaba Moose (the latter just as durable in my experience, though looser beading)... the glossy edge of Glasur you can get from Victoria Concours and so on and so forth... You can get the expensive wax look from cheaper waxes as well, you just need to know which offers what and remember that the additions are very very slight regardless of the price you pay.. What a cheap wax will not offer is a feeling of expense and a satisfaction of having used an expensive wax, if that is indeed what you are after....


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

I suppose you could equate it to buying a very expensive watch - a £7.99 Casio will do everything a Breitling does (and more probably), but you couldn't compare the purchasing experience, the buzz you'd get wearing it and simple pride of ownership. 
So mega expensive waxes could be seen by some as a total waste of money if comparing them to much less expensive ones purely on a performance basis, but there's so much more to it than that (I'd guess, as I've never owned a mege Zym0l wax) and to the owner, it justifies the purchase? 

You can't put a price on the 'feel good factor' I suppose


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Pit Viper said:


> I suppose you could equate it to buying a very expensive watch - a £7.99 Casio will do everything a Breitling does (and more probably), but you couldn't compare the purchasing experience, the buzz you'd get wearing it and simple pride of ownership.
> So mega expensive waxes could be seen by some as a total waste of money if comparing them to much less expensive ones purely on a performance basis, but there's so much more to it than that (I'd guess, as I've never owned a mege Zym0l wax) and to the owner, it justifies the purchase?
> 
> You can't put a price on the 'feel good' factor I suppose


No, feel good factor does indeed count for a lot... but then, the most enjoyable wax I have ever used is Rubbish Boys Original Edition, because it wasn't a _normal_ wax, but made you work a little bit was was satisfying and enjoyable... I guess different people derive satisfaction from different things - spending large sums of money on a wax doesn't do it for me as I can't see its benefit and I dont enjoy applying Royale anymore than Dodo Juice, but perhaps if I owned it, the bragging rights would be enjoyable... but bragging isn't really my thing.


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## Mr Face (Jan 22, 2009)

OMG:doublesho Ive just looked at the price of Vintage : now I am not tight if anything I am more the other way and from time to time & could even be described as a little on the reckless side on occasions when I 'want' something. 

So, I will buy vintage :thumb: when my four kids have left home  or our lottery number comes up and my DB9 needs some serious love .  it, I may even go for Royale and invite all my good buddies along from DW to have a go as well .


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## Davemm (Mar 9, 2009)

its all well and good bragging about the wax, but its the end result that gets the looks and attention, so if you can acheive the same results from a cheaper wax, and spend the rest on what you want ( more products if wanted ) then i know what id do.


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Davemm said:


> its all well and good bragging about the wax, but its the end result that gets the looks and attention, so if you can acheive the same results from a cheaper wax, and spend the rest on what you want ( more products if wanted ) then i know what id do.


I think that may also be another valid point

When i got my new to me car i washed and decontaminated it properly and then applied a couple of layer of Vintage (Seamed rude not to as i've not put it on one of my cars for 18 months). With no polishing or material removal i achieved a cracking look and gloss that i doubt many other LSP's could achieve.

On DW this appears irrelavant as most would rather remove material to obtain the look.

Destiny, Atlantique, Vintage and Royale were all designed to make very valuable old cars with irreplaceable paint work look good (with out harming the underlying finish). Different ethos to DW.

If you used the products in this fashion, these waxes are IMHO unbeatable.

If however you are not bothered about shortening the life of your every day run around then maybe they arn't worth the purchase price.


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## Davemm (Mar 9, 2009)

if they are so much better for vintage cars, like old wedding cars and such like then yes they may be worth the price, but most cases this isnt the case and has no benefit.


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Davemm said:


> if they are so much better for vintage cars, like old wedding cars and such like then yes they may be worth the price, but most cases this isnt the case and has no benefit.


It's not they are better for vintage cars, more if material removal is not a prefered option they offer a viable solution.


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## Clark @ PB (Mar 1, 2006)

Our Vintage has been one of the best business purchases for us for various reasons that i've explained in other Vintage threads, and 95% of our customers want it applied to their cars even though we charge £100 extra to apply it. It looked immense on my red leon too when there was a good 4 or 5 layers on and durability was easily 9 or 10 months with just washing :thumb:


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## L200 Steve (Oct 25, 2005)

Davemm said:


> if they are so much better for vintage cars, like old wedding cars and such like then yes they may be worth the price, but most cases this isnt the case and has no benefit.


The theory that we are working with at the moment whenever detailing is to remove as little material as possible. The clear coat is designed to be sacrificial. The thinner that it gets, the more chance that you stand of it failing prematurley. This is why 'we' try whenever to try and create a level of gloss by removing the absolute minimum of thickness.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Car Key said:


> How long have you found R222 100% lasting, Maxi? I heard a horror story of it not lasting through one rain storm *gulp*


3-5 months when isaw the sheeting water after 2 months really tight and fast enough and souveran side cant sheeting 1%
note:the weather is humidity alwayes at night and very hot here .


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

L200 Steve said:


> The theory that we are working with at the moment whenever detailing is to remove as little material as possible. The clear coat is designed to be sacrificial. The thinner that it gets, the more chance that you stand of it failing prematurley. This is why 'we' try whenever to try and create a level of gloss by removing the absolute minimum of thickness.


And IMVHO, this is the what _all_ detailers should be working to and is certainly how I work... there is more to paint correction than getting all the marks out, you have to think beyond this and to what the polishing will do to the clearcoat's life, and potential requirements for repolishing in the future etc... Too often I see 100% correction being chased and I worry about whether folks are actually considering the repercusions of what they are doing in removing large amounts of paint.

But of course, one can achieve 95% correction with not too much paint removal by polishing and the RDS ultimately affect the end results very little - the key to the looks is the finishing polish


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Clark said:


> Our Vintage has been one of the best business purchases for us for various reasons that i've explained in other Vintage threads, and 95% of our customers want it applied to their cars even though we charge £100 extra to apply it. It looked immense on my red leon too when there was a good 4 or 5 layers on and durability was easily 9 or 10 months with just washing :thumb:


As a business I can quite easily see it making financial sense, and if on-paper results are being measured in that way, Vintage will rate highly... but being honest here, how much of the success of Vintage in this aspect is down to _name_, and how much is actually down to improved on-paper performance offered over different LSP systems. Based on my experience with a huge range of LSPs, actual durability and looks can be achieved by spending a lot less money.


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Dave KG said:


> And IMVHO, this is the what _all_ detailers should be working to and is certainly how I work... there is more to paint correction than getting all the marks out, you have to think beyond this and to what the polishing will do to the clearcoat's life, and potential requirements for repolishing in the future etc... Too often I see 100% correction being chased and I worry about whether folks are actually considering the repercusions of what they are doing in removing large amounts of paint.


Agreed, and speaking personally on my XR (which will be celebrating it's 20th birthday tomorrow ) which is still wearing it's original paint all over the car, I'd love to be able to get out every last little RDS, but when I think about how many times it's been washed, polished, wiped etc. in 20 years and how thin the paint probably is by now, I'd rather live with the odd one and preserve it's factory paint, rather than chase every little imperfection and end up having to have panels resprayed.

It's all about finding a good balance between achieving what is a realistic level of correction that you're happy with, bearing in mind you might have the car for a long time and need to machine it again at various points in the future.


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

Pit Viper said:


> Agreed, and speaking personally on my XR (which will be celebrating it's 20th birthday tomorrow ) which is still wearing it's original paint all over the car, I'd love to be able to get out every last little RDS, but when I think about how many times it's been washed, polished, wiped etc. in 20 years and how thin the paint probably is by now, I'd rather live with the odd one and preserve it's factory paint, rather than chase every little imperfection and end up having to have panels resprayed.
> 
> It's all about finding a good balance between achieving what is a realistic level of correction that you're happy with, bearing in mind you might have the car for a long time and need to machine it again at various points in the future.


Exactly... alas it is a balance I see rarely being looked for reading the forums...


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## L200 Steve (Oct 25, 2005)

Dave KG said:


> And IMVHO, this is the what _all_ detailers should be working to and is certainly how I work... there is more to paint correction than getting all the marks out, you have to think beyond this and to what the polishing will do to the clearcoat's life, and potential requirements for repolishing in the future etc... Too often I see 100% correction being chased and I worry about whether folks are actually considering the repercusions of what they are doing in removing large amounts of paint.
> 
> But of course, one can achieve 95% correction with not too much paint removal by polishing and the RDS ultimately affect the end results very little - the key to the looks is the finishing polish


I've been working on our Rolls Royce drop head write up for the last couple of nights, which was exactly this type of detail.

We spoke to the 'friend' who the car belonged to - he wanted a level of finish that looked good, but did not reduce to life-span of the paint, or prevent future light buffing sessions to get the gloss at it's max.

We spoke to Rolls Royce, (we ALWAYS speak to the manufacturer now, before taking on the exotica) about the paint system on this particular vehicle. We knew exactly what we should be expecting to find.

We carried out a full investigation of the paint on the car, and highlighted the areas where the paint was not quite as it should have been for whatever reason (a couple of sections seemed to have been hit by a 'Pro Detailer' before we got our hands on it as part of a previous detail. The Roll's was pre owned after all, but unfortunately the previous detailer did not take the same care towards paint life preservation as we do, doing some major carving on certain areas)

Taking these three factors into consideration, it was only fair that we polished the vehicle in the manner in which we did, lightly.

Yep we've got the skills / equipment / tools / experience to pull off a major 'wet sanding' 'heavy cut compounding' type job, and could probably have pulled it off even on this vehicle, but in our experience, this would not have been the best service to offer our 'friend'.

It is exactly this type of car, this type of customer where a high end wax like the Vintage / Royale and even as daftly as it sounds Solaris, come into their own.

I still consider Royale to be a fine and very viable commercial entity as a LSP, much more so than the huge amount of time / skill / experience that I and others in 'our' team have invested in machine polishing / defect removal.

It kind of sends shivers down my spine at the moment reading all of the threads where people are removing 10's of microns of clearcoat by whatever method, then replacing what they have removed with a sub micron layer of LSP. To round it off, they are then selling it as a 'protection detail' WTF? Cool if the car (victim??) is a show car or garage queen, but how often are we seeing this kind of work done to peoples daily drivers? By people claiming to be professional in what they are doing?

Again, in my opinion surely better to remove as very little as possible, so as not to compromise the clear coat, and then apply a wax that not only looks good, but lasts as long as a product like Vintage does? It kind of makes sense to me?

:wave:


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## Bigpikle (May 21, 2007)

L200 Steve said:


> I've been working on our Rolls Royce drop head write up for the last couple of nights, which was exactly this type of detail.
> 
> We spoke to the 'friend' who the car belonged to - he wanted a level of finish that looked good, but did not reduce to lifespan of the paint, or prevent future light buffing sessions to get the gloss at it's max.
> 
> ...


Amen 

at the last Rolls Royce club meeting I attended there were probably 50% of the cars dating back over 50 years, still with original paint and worth £'00,000's that required exactly that Steve. I doubt any of them would be wearing as well as they were if they had been 'detailed' with FCP all those years ago


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## L200 Steve (Oct 25, 2005)

Pit Viper said:


> Agreed, and speaking personally on my XR (which will be celebrating it's 20th birthday tomorrow ) which is still wearing it's original paint all over the car, I'd love to be able to get out every last little RDS, but when I think about how many times it's been washed, polished, wiped etc. in 20 years and how thin the paint probably is by now, I'd rather live with the odd one and preserve it's factory paint, rather than chase every little imperfection and end up having to have panels resprayed.
> 
> It's all about finding a good balance between achieving what is a realistic level of correction that you're happy with, bearing in mind you might have the car for a long time and need to machine it again at various points in the future.


Epoch?

???


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Pit Viper said:


> Agreed, and speaking personally on my XR (which will be celebrating it's 20th birthday tomorrow ) which is still wearing it's original paint all over the car, I'd love to be able to get out every last little RDS, but when I think about how many times it's been washed, polished, wiped etc. in 20 years and how thin the paint probably is by now, I'd rather live with the odd one and preserve it's factory paint, rather than chase every little imperfection and end up having to have panels resprayed.
> 
> It's all about finding a good balance between achieving what is a realistic level of correction that you're happy with, bearing in mind you might have the car for a long time and need to machine it again at various points in the future.


Would you like to see a layer or two of Vintage upon your classic mister?

Maybe we could detail it sympathetically to it's age and condition

bit of paint cleanse with you and a layer or two of nice wax?


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## L200 Steve (Oct 25, 2005)

Epoch said:


> Would you like to see a layer or two of Vintage upon your classic mister?
> 
> Maybe we could detail it sympathetically to it's age and condition
> 
> bit of paint cleanse with you and a layer or two of nice wax?


Perhaps do a full inspection etc with the gauges / microscope etc to show what's left after all of these years?

???

:thumb:

I'm up for it, perhaps a first car to prep in the new shop one Saturday?


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## hotwaxxx (Jul 12, 2007)

Agree with people looking for absolute perfection when having their car detailed.

In all honesty, when detailing, I only remove as little as possible as far as microns are concerned. The customers are always forewarned that not every scratch and swirlmark is going to be eradicated if it is going to compromise clearcoat. The aim of the game is always to remove as little as humanly possible when correcting paint and RDS often remain (unless we have healthy level of paint and more microns can be removed through harsher polishes/grades of pads).

And totally agree that the finishing polish is about the most valuable polish in the range. After correction, gloss has to be restored to get the most perfect looking finish and this is where the finishing polish comes into its own. For me, Menzerna FF P085RD is about the best finishing polish there is. I've tried loads of others but 85RD is still the one I always reach for when tidying up after correction.

Now the wax debate has been done on numerous occasions and I can concur with Dave KG - it is very hard to tell what car is wearing what wax - the difference in finish between a 'cheap wax' and 'expensive wax' is minimal. However, I still believe that some waxes offer greater protection than others (durability) plus I also believe some waxes do offer a (very little) difference in nuance to other waxes on the market.


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## atomicfan (Jan 21, 2008)

@car key

It is not that bad, but after 1 month i had no protection on a car with p21


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## Bulla2000 (Jun 5, 2007)

I have tried Vintage too, a very little goes a very long way. But at the end of the day is not as good and breathtaking as Zym*l Destiny. Destiny smells a lot better and the gloss is unbelievable. Its easier to work with than the Vintage. So if I have to decide between these 2 waxes, I def. would buy Destiny.


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## VIPER (May 30, 2007)

Epoch said:


> Would you like to see a layer or two of Vintage upon your classic mister?
> 
> Maybe we could detail it sympathetically to it's age and condition
> 
> bit of paint cleanse with you and a layer or two of nice wax?


Wow, thanks very much, and I'll hold you to that offer, but it would have to be later in the summer as it's off the road at the moment (not T&T'd) and I've got the front suspension dismanted at the moment as I'm replacing some bushes and changing the brakes.

When it's T&T'd again after the work, I'll let you know :thumb:

Thanks once again - very much appreciated


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Bulla2000 said:


> I have tried Vintage too, a very little goes a very long way. But at the end of the day is not as good and breathtaking as Zym*l Destiny. Destiny smells a lot better and the gloss is unbelievable. Its easier to work with than the Vintage. So if I have to decide between these 2 waxes, I def. would buy Destiny.


agree with you Destiny ...the gloss is unbelievable also the durability more than 3+ months ....in this time my favourit wax is swissvax BOS and Destiny carbon . and disappointment with concourse !


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## Epoch (Jul 30, 2006)

Pit Viper said:


> Wow, thanks very much, and I'll hold you to that offer, but it would have to be later in the summer as it's off the road at the moment (not T&T'd) and I've got the front suspension dismanted at the moment as I'm replacing some bushes and changing the brakes.
> 
> When it's T&T'd again after the work, I'll let you know :thumb:
> 
> Thanks once again - very much appreciated


Offer will stand, maybe we can get something arranged :thumb:

We'll do a full panel anaysis with the gauges and microscope too

Like a full paintwork evaluation


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## Bluetacker (Feb 6, 2009)

I think the attitudes described by Dave KG, L200 Steve and others are the right ones when it comes to looking after daily drivers and frequently used cars. It is all too easy for people to chase perfection, take a big chunk of paint off, and disregard the long term life of the clear. I think that detailers should consider their service about being more than getting rid of 100% of the defects on that one occasion, and more about the long term impact on the car and its condition - even if they'll never see it again.

As others have said, a few RDS are hardly going to have a massive impact on the final finish, and a nice gloss can be brought up by using something like 85rd without removing loads of clear. I have recognised for a little while now that a car used daily is going to have the old mark, so have concentrated more on my wash and protection techniques, and trying my best not to inflict the defects in the first place. Sometimes, less than a 100% removal/protection is exactly what SHOULD be aimed for, and is the sign of someone who has a better understanding of looking after a car, its paint, and a customer IMO.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

hotwaxxx said:


> with Dave KG - it is very hard to tell what car is wearing what wax - the difference in finish between a 'cheap wax' and 'expensive wax' is minimal. However, I still believe that some waxes offer greater protection than others (durability) plus I also believe some waxes do offer a (very little) difference in nuance to other waxes on the market.


agree with you about "expensive wax" the diffreence will start when wash your car the cheap wax lose the dueability and look after few washes .
but when use good quality wax little expnsive wax really you will protect 
you hard work in polish-stage and wash after wash the look still very good
and durability in the best condition .

again !! also agree with you about "GERRARD"
Dont miss next match!


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## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

nick_mcuk said:


> To be fair you cant comment on it until you try it mate...it is stunning and I actually took the attitude you did....then got it for Christmas used it and was blown away,
> 
> You honestly cant say its nothing special without actually using it....


Who says I haven't???

I've tried it and been there when it's been applied, only thing I liked about it was the smell (that 'Quattro' soft drink from the 80's), but the last time I bought a wax on smell alone I wasted £10.


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