# Who uses Pinnacle Souveran?



## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

After hearing a lot of hype on and off over the years ive been meaning to try this stuff for about 10 years to be honest but I couldn't justify the price tag just to say ive tried it. Anyway I noticed the other day that you can now buy small 3oz jars for 40 quid. Still quite pricey for a small amount but I thought id treat myself. 

It came this morning and I gave it a quick go on one side of the car. OMG this stuff is really good. The finish is even better than my all time favourite SV Best of Show. The red looks so much redder and the wetness is unreal coupled with what I can only describe as reflections that seem to scatter off in all directions.

I don't normally get excited about waxes as every wax ive tried looks pretty similar to me bar Best of Show which IMO has a look of its own but the Souveran seems to give the same sort of look as Best of Show but then some more.

It got me wondering why it doesn't get mentioned on here very often? I wish id bought the full sized pot now


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## MDC250 (Jan 4, 2014)

One on my list to try but quite pricey like you say.

If you buy a big pot I'll split with you


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MDC250 said:


> One on my list to try but quite pricey like you say.
> 
> If you buy a big pot I'll split with you


Try a small 3oz pot. Theres enough for around 10 waxes I reckon. Not sure how it would work on a lighter car but my red looks redder than a fire engine on one side :doublesho


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

it's a fantastic looking wax and sooo easy to use, but durability of 4 weeks if your lucky and the price dues take put people off. would buy it again if it was on a deal. On red and black its fantastic


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

cheekymonkey said:


> it's a fantastic looking wax and sooo easy to use, but durability of 4 weeks if your lucky and the price dues take put people off. would buy it again if it was on a deal. On red and black its fantastic


Yeah I read that durability is poor and using it you can see why. Its not really very waxy its more oily feeling than that usual waxy feel. To be honest im not really bothered as I always put a layer of something on every 2-4 weeks anyway even through winter and as you say its easy enough to use.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

had an old celica, last with pop up lights, in single stage red. looked awesome with it on


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Pinnacle Souveran was my first wax I bought it before +10 years , gives great depth and wetness, super easy to use WOWO , durability 2-4 weeks , Victoria Concours Wax replace my Souveran Jar , as you said it looks similar BoS and I find the colsest wax to Souveran is Lusso Oro .


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## RMM (Jan 9, 2014)

It's incredible on the looks department (especially on dark cars) but it won't last more than a shower or two...in the UK that won't do! 

Perfect for a beauty queen or a car show day.

There is something similar, less expensive and more durable: Pinnacle Signature Series II.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Pinnacle Souveran was my first wax I bought it before +10 years , gives great depth and wetness, super easy to use WOWO , durability 2-4 weeks , Victoria Concours Wax replace my Souveran Jar , as you said it looks similar BoS and I find the colsest wax to Souveran is Lusso Oro .


Lusso oro is another I always fancied trying but I can't find anybody who sells it in UK anymore.

What about wolfgang fuzion? That gets some good reviews in the looks department

Who makes pinnacle,blackfire and wolfgang? I'm thinking they are all same parent company as the wax pots and labels look identical


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## MDC250 (Jan 4, 2014)

Spoony had a GB on the Lusso not so long ago.


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## RMM (Jan 9, 2014)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso oro is another I always fancied trying but I can't find anybody who sells it in UK anymore.
> 
> What about wolfgang fuzion? That gets some good reviews in the looks department
> 
> Who makes pinnacle,blackfire and wolfgang? I'm thinking they are all same parent company as the wax pots and labels look identical


Fuzion is the easiest wax I have ever used: nice looks (Souveran is nicer - as Fuzion has polymers, the look is different from a traditional nuba), more or less durable, not a dust magnet.

Yes, they are all from PBMG.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

RMM said:


> Fuzion is the easiest wax I have ever used: nice looks (Souveran is nicer - as Fuzion has polymers, the look is different from a traditional nuba), more or less durable, not a dust magnet.
> 
> Yes, they are all from PBMG.


Have you tried midnight sun? The name if it's anything to go by makes it sound like it looks very warm and wet which is the type of look I like.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso oro is another I always fancied trying but I can't find anybody who sells it in UK anymore.
> 
> What about wolfgang fuzion? That gets some good reviews in the looks department
> 
> Who makes pinnacle,blackfire and wolfgang? I'm thinking they are all same parent company as the wax pots and labels look identical


All this brands above from same family the game in tint level some lsp gives dark shadow and other gives light shadow.

Wolfgang Fuzion super easy to apply and remove WOWO like Pinnacle Souveran,I prefer Souveran especially for dark colours it gives deeper darker finish , I find Blackfire Midnight wax gives wetter warmer finish on dark colours than Fuzion but Souveran is nicer !


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Hi using pinnacle wax is what got me into detailing world forum,Iam no pro detailer but i think it is one of the best waxes period.I have used wolfgang fuzion,midnight sun,af waxes and other show waxes.I think it is the best,does not last long but not a issue for me.A few coats of it and the car seems to have like a 3d glow if that makes sense,also love the crystal mist qd.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> All this brands above from same family the game in tint level some lsp gives dark shadow and other gives light shadow.
> 
> Wolfgang Fuzion super easy to apply and remove WOWO like Pinnacle Souveran,I prefer Souveran especially for dark colours it gives deeper darker finish , I find Blackfire Midnight wax gives wetter warmer finish on dark colours than Fuzion but Souveran is nicer !


I take your word for it then nasser I know you are wax expert lol


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> .A few coats of it and the car seems to have like a 3d glow if that makes sense,also love the crystal mist qd.


Yes you're right more coats gives deeper darker finish without increase durability I like to use Crystal mist between coats . I notcied the Pinnacle and Blackfire QD smell become very bad after 1-2 years


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Hi using pinnacle wax is what got me into detailing world forum,Iam no pro detailer but i think it is one of the best waxes period.I have used wolfgang fuzion,midnight sun,af waxes and other show waxes.I think it is the best,does not last long but not a issue for me.A few coats of it and the car seems to have like a 3d glow if that makes sense,also love the crystal mist qd.


I was going to ask about the crystal mist for maintaining the finish. Would you say it gives the same look as the souveran?


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Hi i would say it adds to the finish.The slickness of the crystal mist is its high point and the jaw dropping finish over the wax,its expensive and has a strong coconut smell but i would buy it again.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> I was going to ask about the crystal mist for maintaining the finish. Would you say it gives the same look as the souveran?


As I remember Crystal Mist will refresh the and maybe Souveran looks brighter because of that I like to add new coat of Souveran over it . Simply wash your car by DJ BTBM and Souveran will looks fresh like day 1 !


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> As I remember Crystal Mist will refresh the and maybe Souveran looks brighter because of that I like to add new coat of Souveran over it . Simply wash your car by DJ BTBM and Souveran will looks fresh like day 1 !


I don't want any bright silvery look. I prefer just to see the colour red looking wet rather than bright reflection like a mirror. I hate the really reflective waxes. I once tried valentines concours. It smelled like burnt matches and gave a horrible bright silvery cheap looking shine on red.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> I don't want any bright silvery look. I prefer just to see the colour red looking wet rather than bright reflection like a mirror. I hate the really reflective waxes. I once tried valentines concours. It smelled like burnt matches and gave a horrible bright silvery cheap looking shine on red.


I remember Valentines Concours :lol: horrible wax !


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## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

The Doctor said:


> After hearing a lot of hype on and off over the years ive been meaning to try this stuff for about 10 years to be honest but I couldn't justify the price tag just to say ive tried it. Anyway I noticed the other day that you can now buy small 3oz jars for 40 quid. Still quite pricey for a small amount but I thought id treat myself.
> 
> It came this morning and I gave it a quick go on one side of the car. OMG this stuff is really good. The finish is even better than my all time favourite SV Best of Show. The red looks so much redder and the wetness is unreal coupled with what I can only describe as reflections that seem to scatter off in all directions.
> 
> ...


Where is it available for £40 please ?


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## matt-rudd (Jan 4, 2015)

Blueberry said:


> Where is it available for £40 please ?


Just a quick search Kez:


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## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

Brilliant thanks Matt


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## nick_mcuk (Jan 4, 2008)

I have used the wax...its nice to use and gives a lovely warm shine but the durability is not very good at all though...I have my pot still in my detailing kit...the best durability i had out of it was about 3 weeks on the wifes old golf.


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## Daniel Um (Feb 5, 2015)

Souveran is an indeed great wax for dark color cars.
Fuzion is one of my favorite wax due to the easy process and the brilliant result.


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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

Use Souveran on my lava grey pearl effect Audi and the flake really pops.
Also like Midnight Sun but in my view looks better after using BF GEP and AFPP.
Dave


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> I don't normally get excited about waxes as every wax ive tried looks pretty similar to me bar Best of Show which IMO has a look of its own but the Souveran seems to give the same sort of look as Best of Show but then some more.
> 
> It got me wondering why it doesn't get mentioned on here very often? I wish id bought the full sized pot now


Btw SV Onyx gives warm deep oily finish which I expect it will looks great in your red car , I find BOS gives more reflectivity than Souveran , Souveran gives warm slick soft finish while BoS gives dynamic finish , Onyx great wax for who love classic carnuba finish warm and deep without silvery blingy flavour .


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Btw SV Onyx gives warm deep oily finish which I expect it will looks great in your red car , I find BOS gives more reflectivity than Souveran , Souveran gives warm slick soft finish while BoS gives dynamic finish , Onyx great wax for who love classic carnuba finish warm and deep without silvery blingy flavour .


Yes I have used onyx years ago. It did give a nice finish if I remember.

Do you like zymol? I tried a few zymol but they all looked similar with silvery shadow. Concours was like I wrap car in aluminum foil.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Blueberry said:


> Where is it available for £40 please ?


I got mine from Yorkshire car care on ebay which is motorgeek I believe. Are you going to try a pot?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Yes I have used onyx years ago. It did give a nice finish if I remember.
> 
> Do you like zymol? I tried a few zymol but they all looked similar with silvery shadow. Concours was like I wrap car in aluminum foil.


What I like in Zymol water behaviour and natural smell but the finish need some mist of Zymol Field Glaze .

Yes , I have tried Z Carbon , Concours , Glasur , Destiny and Vintage when you pay more for Zymol you will get more bling  more of Silvery shadow , as you know the red car is different it need deep warm finish and I find Zymol cant gives this but Zymol looks good on another colours , the depth in Zymol waxes is not enough and the bling is not enough you must pay more money to get enough bling  means you must pay for Zymol Destiny but you can get this result and better by using P21s Concours wax but without coconut smell .

Maybe Zymol Ital suitable for red car  ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

On my friend Car M3 Imola red we have tried most of waxes and the winner was 
Werkstat Carnuba Jett without doubt the best LSP on Imola Red , but where I can find similar Carnuba Jett ?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> What I like in Zymol water behaviour and natural smell but the finish need some mist of Zymol Field Glaze .
> 
> Yes , I have tried Z Carbon , Concours , Glasur , Destiny and Vintage when you pay more for Zymol you will get more bling  more of Silvery shadow , as you know the red car is different it need deep warm finish and I find Zymol cant gives this but Zymol looks good on another colours , the depth in Zymol waxes is not enough and the bling is not enough you must pay more money to get enough bling  means you must pay for Zymol Destiny but you can get this result and better by using P21s Concours wax but without coconut smell .
> 
> Maybe Zymol Ital suitable for red car  ?


Yes p21s very wet looking but no darkness at all. It's like wiping sunflower oil onto paintwork very greasy. I think maybe p21s is good for silver car?

Clearkote Carnauba Moose Wax was a nice looking wax. Very warm dark and wet but it haze over leaving a cloudy film after a few hours and beading is flat and boring.

I think if the car has just been machine polished then difference in wax is less noticeable. Only when the car has not been polished for a few months and that just polished look goes then difference in waxes start to show more.


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## Stu Mac (Aug 18, 2014)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> On my friend Car M3 Imola red we have tried most of waxes and the winner was
> Werkstat Carnuba Jett without doubt the best LSP on Imola Red , but where I can find similar Carnuba Jett ?


Carlack still do an equivalent to the carnauba jet or maybe try car pro reload which gets great reviews on red


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> On my friend Car M3 Imola red we have tried most of waxes and the winner was
> Werkstat Carnuba Jett without doubt the best LSP on Imola Red , but where I can find similar Carnuba Jett ?


I tried looking for carnauba jett because you told me about it on red cars years ago but it is no longer made.i think somebody must still have old stock of it but where?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Maybe Zymol Ital suitable for red car  ?


Yes maybe red pot means it is optimised for red cars? It is too expensive though to just buy without trying first.

I have 80% full pot of zymol rouge here that my friend gave me. It is supposed to be optimised for red cars but it still gives bright silvery shadow and very messy to use. It stains all applicators and cloths. its horrible stuff and the finish is not worth the hassle. It does not make the red look any redder.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Stu Mac said:


> Carlack still do an equivalent to the carnauba jet or maybe try car pro reload which gets great reviews on red


Do you know the name of Carlack carnuba project ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Yes p21s very wet looking but no darkness at all. It's like wiping sunflower oil onto paintwork very greasy. I think maybe p21s is good for silver car?
> 
> Clearkote Carnauba Moose Wax was a nice looking wax. Very warm dark and wet but it haze over leaving a cloudy film after a few hours and beading is flat and boring.
> 
> I think if the car has just been machine polished then difference in wax is less noticeable. Only when the car has not been polished for a few months and that just polished look goes then difference in waxes start to show more.


Yes , P21s Concours looks great on light colour but many people love blingy finish mirror finish on black too .

CK RMG gives darkest warmest finish even you put P21s Concours over it
the final look shows some depth , actually sometimes I want leave the red car without LSP beacuse oily glaze like CK RMG gives what I need .

This is true 100% after full prep and jewiling the gap between waxes become smaller in the end , but Some polishes like Optimum makes red car very bright ,
Red colour is different the must important step for red colour is Glaze (oily glaze) or good prewax can depeen the paint .


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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> On my friend Car M3 Imola red we have tried most of waxes and the winner was
> Werkstat Carnuba Jett without doubt the best LSP on Imola Red , but where I can find similar Carnuba Jett ?


Rich at Polished Bliss has produced a comparison chart Nasser if you have not seen it
http://www.polishedbliss.co.uk/blog/2014/11/introducing-the-carlack-range/

Dave


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

camerashy said:


> Rich at Polished Bliss has produced a comparison chart Nasser if you have not seen it
> http://www.polishedbliss.co.uk/blog/2014/11/introducing-the-carlack-range/
> 
> Dave


Carlack replace Werkstat Acrylic but which one can replace Werkstat Carnuba Jett Trigger ?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Yes , P21s Concours looks great on light colour but many people love blingy finish mirror finish on black too .
> 
> CK RMG gives darkest warmest finish even you put P21s Concours over it
> the final look shows some depth , actually sometimes I want leave the red car without LSP beacuse oily glaze like CK RMG gives what I need .
> ...


I have a 95% full bottle of red moose glaze. I bought it after I finished first bottle many years ago but it is not the same. First bottle gave a wetter look and the liquid was darker. I bought the first bottle from cleanyourcar and second bottle from shinerama and they are definately different formula. Newer bottle feels like it has wax in it and drys onto paint


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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

The newer version of RMG is now called Machine Glaze


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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Carlack replace Werkstat Acrylic but which one can replace Werkstat Carnuba Jett Trigger ?


Isn't that Carlack Longlife judging from the PB list??


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## Naddy37 (Oct 27, 2005)

It was the first wax I brought when I started chauffeuring.

On a black car, it's stunning.

Yes it's expensive, but well worth it.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

camerashy said:


> The newer version of RMG is now called Machine Glaze


I know but these 2 bottles are red moose glaze both bought around 8-10 years ago. First bottle was awesome 2nd bottle is not bad but not as good as first. Wether it was a slight variation in the batches or maybe somebody in the shop that I bought it from messed with the 2nd bottle as they are not sealed when new.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

camerashy said:


> Isn't that Carlack Longlife judging from the PB list??


Carlack LongLife = Werkstat Jett Trigger Sealant (name Acrylic Jett in the past )

There is Acrylic Jett and Carnuba Jett in Werkstat line .


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> I know but these 2 bottles are red moose glaze both bought around 8-10 years ago. First bottle was awesome 2nd bottle is not bad but not as good as first. Wether it was a slight variation in the batches or maybe somebody in the shop that I bought it from messed with the 2nd bottle as they are not sealed when new.


Try Megs Deep Crystal Polish Step2 it gives nice finish deep and warm contains no cleaner maybe you will like it , easier to use than Megs #7 .

http://www.meguiars.co.uk/shop/step-2-deep-crystal-polish
http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/product/deep-crystal-system-polish


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Try Megs Deep Crystal Polish Step2 it gives nice finish deep and warm contains no cleaner maybe you will like it , easier to use than Megs #7 .
> 
> http://www.meguiars.co.uk/shop/step-2-deep-crystal-polish
> http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/product/deep-crystal-system-polish


I have this one as well nasser. Not used it for years. I think I will try bad bottle of red moose v megs step 2 then souveran and see which is best


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## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

The Doctor said:


> I got mine from Yorkshire car care on ebay which is motorgeek I believe. Are you going to try a pot?


Yes I think at that price it's too good to miss


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## matt-rudd (Jan 4, 2015)

Oops, sorry Kez!


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

Souveran has been my one of my favourite wax for a long time ...


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

I will be buying the full sized pot once this small pot starts getting low. If anyone has used a wax that gives a better finish on red I'd like to know what that wax is. I know victoria concours is quite nice on red but even that doesn't come close to souveran.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

I tried both red moose glaze and megs step 2 polish before souveran. To be honest I wasn't that keen on the megs step 2. It gave too much of a bright reflective finish and spoiled the look of the souveran imo. The red moose glaze looked great and gave a glossier finish whilst being much easier to use.


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Reading this thread just ordered another crystal mist qd.Ooops another £20 down,there is not much that can beat pinnacle wax imo.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Reading this thread just ordered another crystal mist qd.Ooops another £20 down,there is not much that can beat pinnacle wax imo.


I want to try the other products but not sure I can bring myself to pay 20 quid each for the crystal mist and the shampoo. Have you used the shampoo? I have a bit of wolfgang auto bathe here and I really don't think much of it, infact it's very poor imo. Was wondering if if the pinnacle is better?


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Hi never tried the shampoo,too expensive for me,the crystal mist to me is a luxury like zaino z8,just for extra wow factor.Read a few reviews that the shampoo is good but not for the cost.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Pinnacle Bodywork Shampoo - Cocount smell , medium suds , leaves nice finish .
Lusso Autobathe Shampoo similar Pinnacle Shampoo , Lusso Autobathe strong Coconut smell , more suds , leaves deep dark finish  .


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Hi never tried the shampoo,too expensive for me,the crystal mist to me is a luxury like zaino z8,just for extra wow factor.Read a few reviews that the shampoo is good but not for the cost.


Have you used Clearkote Quik Shine detail spray? That is a seriously good product that I think would work well with Souveran.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Pinnacle Bodywork Shampoo - Cocount smell , medium suds , leaves nice finish .
> Lusso Autobathe Shampoo similar Pinnacle Shampoo , Lusso Autobathe strong Coconut smell , more suds , leaves deep dark finish  .


Really would like to try the Lusso shampoo and wax but nobody sells it in UK as far as I know. I love deep dark wet finish.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Really would like to try the Lusso shampoo and wax but nobody sells it in UK as far as I know. I love deep dark wet finish.


Have a word with spoony he may be able to help:thumb:


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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

The Doctor said:


> Really would like to try the Lusso shampoo and wax but nobody sells it in UK as far as I know. I love deep dark wet finish.


OR.....speak to Mark at Raceglaze that's where I bought my shampoo from and although it's not on his website now he may have some left or know where to get some from.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Really would like to try the Lusso shampoo and wax but nobody sells it in UK as far as I know. I love deep dark wet finish.


Lusso Oro gives classic carnuba look deep rich colour but I cant tell you if Oro wax better than Souveran you need to try it , Lusso Oro smell similar Souveran , I think there is cold war between Pinnacle and Lusso company , I asked Lusso Company can you ship to my country ? Answer : Are YOu from AutoGeek :lol:
Very nice customer service :lol:


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Lusso Oro gives classic carnuba look deep rich colour but I cant tell you if Oro wax better than Souveran you need to try it , Lusso Oro smell similar Souveran , I think there is cold war between Pinnacle and Lusso company , I asked Lusso Company can you ship to my country ? Answer : Are YOu from AutoGeek
> Very nice customer service


I think maybe you have to be chosen one to use lusso products. I pm spoony and raceglaze and no reply. Lusso harder to get hold of than zymol solaris!


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Update! I just bought lusso autobathe, oro, and revitalising cream.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Update! I just bought lusso autobathe, oro, and revitalising cream.


I expect you will like Lusso prewax :thumb: enjoy 
Oro wax smell similar Souveran ?

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=2314853&postcount=16


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

The Doctor said:


> I think maybe you have to be chosen one to use lusso products. I pm spoony and raceglaze and no reply. Lusso harder to get hold of than zymol solaris!


I hadn't been on between last night and this morning, still replied within 24hrs 

Lusso isn't too hard to get a hold of. I just wish it'd get more air time. Fantastic few products.


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Update! I just bought lusso autobathe, oro, and revitalising cream.


where from


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

cheekymonkey said:


> where from


From Spoony thanks to your earlier message. Awesome prices as well so I bit the bullet and bought all 3! Always wanted to try the wax but it will have to be special to beat souveran.


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

It's pretty much the very last lusso I could sell. as I still need my personal stash


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Just had a go with the lusso revitalising cream. Very impressed. Really darkens the paint and looks very wet. Even better looking than red moose glaze imo. Smells just like megs deep crystal step 1 to me but maybe easier to use (a while since i used the megs).

The lusso oro wax is nice too, gives a nice dark rich warm wet look. I'd say the finish is similar to Souveran but Souveran is a bit crisper looking and more 3 dimensional whilst the Lusso is a bit glossier but that could be due to the revitalising cream.

Can't wait to try the autobathe now but that will be weekend once the car is dirty again.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Just had a go with the lusso revitalising cream. Very impressed. Really darkens the paint and looks very wet. Even better looking than red moose glaze imo. Smells just like megs deep crystal step 1 to me but maybe easier to use (a while since i used the megs).
> 
> .


As I remember lusso prewax liquid colour like megs deep crystal step 2 .
Did you try megs deep crystal step 2 ?

I expect Lusso shampoo will add some gloss


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## Spoony (May 28, 2007)

The revitalising creme is a great product. I love it.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> As I remember lusso prewax liquid colour like megs deep crystal step 2 .
> Did you try megs deep crystal step 2 ?
> 
> I expect Lusso shampoo will add some gloss


Yes I have megs step 2 but I dont think it like lusso pre wax. Lusso gives much darker shine. I think it's more like step one the way it makes the paint squeaky.

What do you think of the lusso wax? I really like it. Very dark shine and just the type of finish I like. I think souveran looks clearer though. Maybe lusso wax look slightly warmer than Souveran?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Yes I have megs step 2 but I dont think it like lusso pre wax. Lusso gives much darker shine. I think it's more like step one the way it makes the paint squeaky.
> 
> What do you think of the lusso wax? I really like it. Very dark shine and just the type of finish I like. I think souveran looks clearer though. Maybe lusso wax look slightly warmer than Souveran?


Yes , you are right souveran looks clearer and reflect more from some angles , Lusso richer on colour maybe less wetness than Souveran but it gives warm rich flat warm finish , lusso reflect true colour . Werkstat Carnuba Jett gives flat warm finish less wetness but the red colour looks pure , just avoid using Werstat Carnuba glos qd over it beacuse will ruin the look .


----------



## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Spoony said:


> The revitalising creme is a great product. I love it.


Me too, it really is a very nice pre wax treatment. I find it shows up orange peel more though but I don't mind that. I prefer a tiny bit of orange peel as it gives the paint a thicker/richer look IMO.


----------



## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Yes , you are right souveran looks clearer and reflect more from some angles , Lusso richer on colour maybe less wetness than Souveran but it gives warm rich flat warm finish , lusso reflect true colour . Werkstat Carnuba Jett gives flat warm finish less wetness but the red colour looks pure , just avoid using Werstat Carnuba glos qd over it beacuse will ruin the look .


I wish I could get hold of Carnauba Jett but nobody has it.

I also today buy small sample pot of Swissvax Onyx. I remembered when I opened it what I didn't like about it last time I used it. It is too grainy. You cant get it on the applicator properly without it crumbling.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> I wish I could get hold of Carnauba Jett but nobody has it.
> 
> I also today buy small sample pot of Swissvax Onyx. I remembered when I opened it what I didn't like about it last time I used it. It is too grainy. You cant get it on the applicator properly without it crumbling.


SV Onyx gives very nice result warm finish like Lusso Oro but as you said the problem in texture looks too grainy , I thought SV onyx after a few application become better but still grainy .


----------



## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

SV BOS is also grainy but it doesn't cause a problem with application. BMD Sirius is grainy also but isn't detrimental to the performance of the wax. These are both two of my favourite waxes.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

My bos was a bit grainy but nothing like the onyx. It's so bad that little balls of wax fall off the applicator as you try to pick it up. The smell remind me of bos a very powerful pineapple type smell. Very addictive.


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## Blueberry (Aug 10, 2007)

I've got a free sample pot of Onyx coming with an UF order I put in today so I will see how it compares in that respect to BOS.


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## Toto (Oct 6, 2014)

After much thought and john aka doc txn me I have bought a large pot to try.
X2 Porsche Cayman's In black in the next 2 weeks both booked in for machine polishing this will be a good test.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

I read the ingredients in pinnacle wax it says there's a mineral spirit additive , which causes health problems , is this big problem ?

In this video you can see Pinnacle vs Wolfgang vs Megs , he speak about health issue while he open Pinnacle pot .


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> I read the ingredients in pinnacle wax it says there's a mineral spirit additive , which causes health problems , is this big problem ?
> 
> In this video you can see Pinnacle vs Wolfgang vs Megs , he speak about health issue while he open Pinnacle pot .
> 
> Best Rated Car Wax: Meguiar's, Pinnacle, and Wolfgang face off! - YouTube


That's the signature series 2 that hes testing Nasser.

No mineral spirit is in most waxes. Think of white spirit or Turpentine substitute but with all the nasty stuff taken out. Not a major health hazard but common sense needed with it. Don't eat it, can cause drying of skin, dizziness if used in confined spaces etc. etc.


----------



## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Toto said:


> After much thought and john aka doc txn me I have bought a large pot to try.
> X2 Porsche Cayman's In black in the next 2 weeks both booked in for machine polishing this will be a good test.


I hope you don't like it so I can buy nearly full pot for £25 :lol:


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Did you try Souveran Liquid Spray wax ?


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Ordering a pot of the mini pinnacle,used af illusion,but on in my eyes its not even close to the sov finish


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## Toto (Oct 6, 2014)

The Doctor said:


> I hope you don't like it so I can buy nearly full pot for £25 :lol:


you tighter than cramp mate :lol:


----------



## Scooby0775 (Dec 17, 2014)

I've ordered small pot of pinnacle getting quite a arsenal of waxes now but still think it's going to be hard to beat BOS


----------



## Steampunk (Aug 11, 2011)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> I read the ingredients in pinnacle wax it says there's a mineral spirit additive , which causes health problems , is this big problem ?


Waxes are solid ingredients which need to be rendered semi (paste) or fully (liquid) soluble in order to be applied to a vehicle in any volume. This means they either need to be applied hot, or mixed with a solvent carrier that keeps them in a suspended state until the carrier evaporates. The upper limit I have read about for a wax's solids volume is about 40-45% (Most are less), although a wax maker or home brewer would be able to comment more... The rest is a mixture of oils (Natural, like fruit & nut oils, or man made silicones.) and solvents. The higher, and more durable the solids volume of the wax, the stronger, and or greater the solvent volume of the product needs to be in order to keep it spreadable at room temperature. It is possible to make emulsified waterborne spray waxes, but the solids volume in these is very low; sometimes only 5%, with the rest being waterborne polymers and emulsifying/preserving agents.

Solvents in the waxes I have seen vary, with Naphtha being a common one (Camping stove/lantern fuel), as well as Kerosene (Heater fuel), Turpentine (Pine solvent, most commonly used by artists using oil paints to clean brushes.), and sometimes some more exotic refined hydrocarbons like isoalkane blends (These types of chemicals are also sometimes used as octane boosters, and in lighter fluid.). Based upon my own research, none are what anyone could classify as 'good for you'. As has been mentioned by The Doctor, they will dry out skin, can cause dizziness if applied in a confined space (Just like being exposed to any other kind of aromatic solvent, like petrol fumes.), and if you consume them, or absorb a large quantity through your skin over an extended period of time, can be toxic. Various studies I have seen have also shown that some of these chemical compounds can be carcinogenic, although the quantity you have to be exposed to, and the level of refinement they were at in order to become a carcinogen is much harder to determine by reading extractions from lab experiments.

In the world of detailing, everything from waxes, to polishes, to leather treatments can contain some kind of highly processed petroleum. Even hair styling products can often contain some kind of refined petroleum. It's virtually impossible to escape entirely if you are a detailer, but you can be smart about it...

I have taken to wearing nitrile gloves when handling my various waxes, polishes, and cleaners containing petroleum, alcohol, or pH builders that might dry out my skin. With my solvent based products, I also make sure that I am applying them in a space with sufficient ventilation, or in extreme cases (Like with nano-sealants, that can use extremely volatile solvent carriers.) wear a well-fitted respirator rated for organic vapor exposure... I also wear earplugs when I am machine polishing, safety glasses when I'm using anything that can splatter, either a dust mask or particulate filters if I'm doing something dusty like heavy compounding with certain polishes, and take breaks and stretch when working for long hours on concrete floors. These are all very simple things you can do to help make sure you don't get sick, or injured from doing what you love.

If you are worried about the potential health risks of your detailing products, something I would recommend is collecting MSDS sheets from all of the companies you buy from. This will give you an idea about what kind of safety measures you need to take, but you will need to spend some time learning how to correctly interpret them.

Hopefully this helps...

- Steampunk


----------



## Scooby0775 (Dec 17, 2014)

Steampunk said:


> Waxes are solid ingredients which need to be rendered semi (paste) or fully (liquid) soluble in order to be applied to a vehicle in any volume. This means they either need to be applied hot, or mixed with a solvent carrier that keeps them in a suspended state until the carrier evaporates. The upper limit I have read about for a wax's solids volume is about 40-45% (Most are less), although a wax maker or home brewer would be able to comment more... The rest is a mixture of oils (Natural, like fruit & nut oils, or man made silicones.) and solvents. The higher, and more durable the solids volume of the wax, the stronger, and or greater the solvent volume of the product needs to be in order to keep it spreadable at room temperature. It is possible to make emulsified waterborne spray waxes, but the solids volume in these is very low; sometimes only 5%, with the rest being waterborne polymers and emulsifying/preserving agents.
> 
> Solvents in the waxes I have seen vary, with Naphtha being a common one (Camping stove/lantern fuel), as well as Kerosene (Heater fuel), Turpentine (Pine solvent, most commonly used by artists using oil paints to clean brushes.), and sometimes some more exotic refined hydrocarbons like isoalkane blends (These types of chemicals are also sometimes used as octane boosters, and in lighter fluid.). Based upon my own research, none are what anyone could classify as 'good for you'. As has been mentioned by The Doctor, they will dry out skin, can cause dizziness if applied in a confined space (Just like being exposed to any other kind of aromatic solvent, like petrol fumes.), and if you consume them, or absorb a large quantity through your skin over an extended period of time, can be toxic. Various studies I have seen have also shown that some of these chemical compounds can be carcinogenic, although the quantity you have to be exposed to, and the level of refinement they were at in order to become a carcinogen is much harder to determine by reading extractions from lab experiments.
> 
> ...


It would have taken me a week to write that but helpful though


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Scooby0775 said:


> I've ordered small pot of pinnacle getting quite a arsenal of waxes now but still think it's going to be hard to beat BOS


I think you may be surprised. BOS is fantastic but Souveran is like turbo charged version of BOS in looks. Fresh coat of Souveran also beads and throws water off really nice. I foamed the car with Autosmart Highfoam Plus then washed with Dodo Born to be Mild at weekend and when I dried the car it still looked fantastic.

I find BOS and Onyx both make red look slightly more orangey. Not in a bad way but quite a nice way. Souveran make red look more redder like paint has just been sprayed on and still wet.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Did you try Souveran Liquid Spray wax ?


No I'm not a fan of spray wax nasser. They usually look bright and reflective. Is souveran spray same look as paste?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> No I'm not a fan of spray wax nasser. They usually look bright and reflective. Is souveran spray same look as paste?


This is my question too  will be great if Souveran Spray Wax can gives deep daek finish like paste wax .


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## DJBAILEY (May 7, 2011)

The Doctor said:


> I wish I could get hold of Carnauba Jett but nobody has it. QUOTE]
> 
> I have 2 bottles of Carnauba Prime and Carnauba Jett sitting on the shelf. Haven't used either in years.
> 
> I could let you have a sample.


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Good review here of the spray wax

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/product-reviews/62045-review-pinnacle-souveran-spray-wax.html


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

i use there liquid wax which is very bright and reflective. Ok on light colours, but but on dark awful


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Just ordered the spray wax,will update on how good it is

Thanks


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

cheekymonkey said:


> i use there liquid wax which is very bright and reflective. Ok on light colours, but but on dark awful


+1 looks very cold lazy flat and silvery look on solid black , I will try it on light colours .


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> +1 looks very cold lazy flat and silvery look on solid black , I will try it on light colours .


there are better on light coloured, wouldnt buy it just to try it


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> +1 looks very cold lazy flat and silvery look on solid black , I will try it on light colours .


Nasser, have you used swissvax mirage? This wax interest me. I think it is quite new in the range as I never seen it until a few months ago. I am tempted to buy a full pot of onyx after trying the panel pot. It is very warm and wet looking but I dont like how grainy it is in the pot. It's very hard to get a small amount onto applicator without grains .


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Nasser, have you used swissvax mirage? This wax interest me. I think it is quite new in the range as I never seen it until a few months ago. I am tempted to buy a full pot of onyx after trying the panel pot. It is very warm and wet looking but I dont like how grainy it is in the pot. It's very hard to get a small amount onto applicator without grains .


No , maybe I will put SV Mirage in my wishlist  but i would like to try SV shield +Onyx or BoS combo . SV Onyx very nice wax indeed maybe onyx big pot will be less grainy? beacuse you can put more control in applicator pad . Try SV prewax very nice prewax very oily and leaves nice finish like oily glaze and lusso prewax with excellent cleaning ability , 100ml of SV prewax maybe will last for years !


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> No , maybe I will put SV Mirage in my wishlist  but i would like to try SV shield +Onyx or BoS combo . SV Onyx very nice wax indeed maybe onyx big pot will be less grainy? beacuse you can put more control in applicator pad . Try SV prewax very nice prewax very oily and leaves nice finish like oily glaze and lusso prewax with excellent cleaning ability , 100ml of SV prewax maybe will last for years !


Yes I have swissvax pre wax when I had bos it smell like lead in pencils but leave nice finish. Maybe I will buy onyx big pot and then souveran big pot. Souveran small pot lasts a long time because it goes on very thin but I only did half a car and 1/4 of onyx sample pot is gone because it is so grainy. Maybe swissvax make you use more because it is cheaper wax in range?


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

my small pot of souveran turned up today,forgot how good this wax is the smell hmm yummy cinnamon rice pudding,why do i buy other waxes,This wax is just amazing.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Alex , did you try Pinnacle Signature Series II ?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> my small pot of souveran turned up today,forgot how good this wax is the smell hmm yummy cinnamon rice pudding,why do i buy other waxes,This wax is just amazing.


As far as I'm concerned it is the best out there in terms of looks. The shine is so intense and wet.

Of the waxes I've bought the last few weeks souveran looks the best but closely followed by onyx which gives a really soft warm wet look on my red and then lusso oro. Oro is really good but the finish just lacks the clarity of the other two.

Today I tried lusso autobathe and it is a lovely shampoo to use. Very gentle and the coconut smell makes it very pleasurable to use. I would say I prefer it over btbm. It leaves really dark finish that looks conditioned but not blingy and tacky looking like some.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Lusso shampoo 2in1 no need QD after wash it gives real nuba look .


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Alex , did you try Pinnacle Signature Series II ?


 Hi yes it is very good nice tropical scent,look is more crisp and reflective than sov.


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## MDC250 (Jan 4, 2014)

You guys are doing nothing for my wax ban


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

MDC250 said:


> You guys are doing nothing for my wax ban


 Give in to the wax voices,buy a small pot,i actually blame you for me buying the obsession evolution,stop posting pics of your really shiny car lol.


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## MDC250 (Jan 4, 2014)

Ha if only its filthy, there's going to have to be a wax cull at some point


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Buy pinnacle souveran then sell the others! Actually I'm not sure how souveran look on silver. Maybe p21s would be better as it gives bright silvery very wet look.


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Lusso shampoo 2in1 no need QD after wash it gives real nuba look .


I noticed as I wash with lusso shampoo there is a rainbow effect in bubbles like oil in water. I wish i could buy more. Maybe I can twist spoonys arm to sell me more


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

You can see in this picture SV Mirage less grainy than Onyx

Picture from Raven http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=3440425&postcount=20


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> You can see in this picture SV Mirage less grainy than Onyx
> 
> Picture from Raven http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=3440425&postcount=20


Yes it looks smoother than onyx. Maybe I will try 50ml pot of mirage to compare which is darkest shine.

I found the best way to use onyx is rub your finger on the wax so the grains melt then transfer the wax onto applicator with your finger. If you put the applicator in the pot you end up with lots of grains on the pad that don't melt when your applying it. Maybe could cause swirls in soft paint.


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

The Doctor said:


> Buy pinnacle souveran then sell the others! Actually I'm not sure how souveran look on silver. Maybe p21s would be better as it gives bright silvery very wet look.


Hi Doctor, I was wondering, do you prefer Lusso Oro Wax or Souveran ? I'm thinking about buying one of these 2.... my car is a solid red Chevy.... i want the best warm shine finish


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Salo87 said:


> Hi Doctor, I was wondering, do you prefer Lusso Oro Wax or Souveran ? I'm thinking about buying one of these 2.... my car is a solid red Chevy.... i want the best warm shine finish


Lusso oro gives very dark/glossy shine but not very wet looking. Souveran is wetter but also quite reflective. For best warmth swissvax onyx is hard to beat. It gives a very warm/orangey shine.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso oro gives very dark/glossy shine but not very wet looking. Souveran is wetter but also quite reflective. For best warmth swissvax onyx is hard to beat. It gives a very warm/orangey shine.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


I got it, but your favorite wax in terms of finish still Souveran ?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Salo87 said:


> I got it, but your favorite wax in terms of finish still Souveran ?


Yes Souveran gives the best all round finish imo. I would buy it before Lusso.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso oro gives very dark/glossy shine but not very wet looking. Souveran is wetter but also quite reflective. For best warmth swissvax onyx is hard to beat. It gives a very warm/orangey shine.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


Excellent describe for each wax :thumb: I can add Bouncers CTR for extra wet look but also gives more reflectivity than Souveran , for best warmth SV Onyx , Werkstat Carnuba Jett and Lusso Oro .


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Excellent describe for each wax :thumb: I can add Bouncers CTR for extra wet look but also gives more reflectivity than Souveran , for best warmth SV Onyx , Werkstat Carnuba Jett and Lusso Oro .


Chemical guys petes 53 ia like 60/50 lusso oro and souveran. Dark but wet look.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Excellent describe for each wax :thumb: I can add Bouncers CTR for extra wet look but also gives more reflectivity than Souveran , for best warmth SV Onyx , Werkstat Carnuba Jett and Lusso Oro .


what do you think about Bouncer's Vanilla Ice ?


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

The Doctor said:


> Yes Souveran gives the best all round finish imo. I would buy it before Lusso.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


Thanks, one more question... a jar of 8oz ... will last a lot ? considering that I only have one Chevy Cruze to wax with it ... and I'm planning doing once a month.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> Hi Doctor, I was wondering, do you prefer Lusso Oro Wax or Souveran ? I'm thinking about buying one of these 2.... my car is a solid red Chevy.... i want the best warm shine finish


You can see here Testing 10 wax on red chevy http://www.detailparadise.com.au/showthread.php?4046-Testing-10-Waxes-on-one-car-Which-is-the-best


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> what do you think about Bouncer's Vanilla Ice ?


I have tried CTR and 22 wax only .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> I have tried CTR and 22 wax only .


thanks buddy, I'm crazy about trying to find the "best wax" for a deep shine, I've been reading a lot lately.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> thanks buddy, I'm crazy about trying to find the "best wax" for a deep shine, I've been reading a lot lately.


Try 50/50 P21s Concours wax (blingy) vs SV onyx (warm finish) or Vics Collectors vs Concours and see the final result which one you like on solid red , and then you can select your fav waxes easily in future .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Try 50/50 P21s Concours wax (blingy) vs SV onyx (warm finish) or Vics Collectors vs Concours and see the final result which one you like on solid red , and then you can select your fav waxes easily in future .


I'm going to research those waxes, what's your favorite wax among all ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> I'm going to research those waxes, what's your favorite wax among all ?


Depend what I'm looking for , by finish I like Supernatural wax beacuse it suitable for all colours it gives extra clarity and pure reflection , if I'm looking for deep warm finish my fav is Concours wax , CTR for wet look , Collectors and P21s for crystal finish , beading and Sheeting ? I like Zymol waxes .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Depend what I'm looking for , by finish I like Supernatural wax beacuse it suitable for all colours it gives extra clarity and pure reflection , if I'm looking for deep warm finish my fav is Concours wax , CTR for wet look , Collectors and P21s for crystal finish , beading and Sheeting ? I like Zymol waxes .


Do you think that coatings will overcome waxes ? or the waxes will never "die"?
I'm curious about that subject, everyone talks about car coatings, does it really gives a different look ? I know that coatings gives more protection, but my question is related in terms of look department.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> Do you think that coatings will overcome waxes ? or the waxes will never "die"?
> I'm curious about that subject, everyone talks about car coatings, does it really gives a different look ? I know that coatings gives more protection, but my question is related in terms of look department.


This is big question  I use Carnuba waxes and some sealnts only , actually I dont need coating I like to wash and wax my car regulary  protection not important for me .


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## stonejedi (Feb 2, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> Do you think that coatings will overcome waxes ? or the waxes will never "die"?
> I'm curious about that subject, everyone talks about car coatings, does it really gives a different look ? I know that coatings gives more protection, but my question is related in terms of look department.


Waxes will never die,coatings have there place but waxes are the original and the best LSP to use and will never be replaced,all in my opinion of course:thumb:.SJ.


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> This is big question  I use Carnuba waxes and some sealnts only , actually I dont need coating I like to wash and wax my car regulary  protection not important for me .


I live in Brazil, i would like to find Lusso Oro easily here, I already have : all Collinites, Megs# 16, Adam's Buterry, Bouncer's Vanilla Ice, FK 1000p, Wolfgang Deep Gloss 3.0 sealant and Polish Angel Master Sealant.

what prewax do you use ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> I live in Brazil, i would like to find Lusso Oro easily here, I already have : all Collinites, Megs# 16, Adam's Buterry, Bouncer's Vanilla Ice, FK 1000p, Wolfgang Deep Gloss 3.0 sealant and Polish Angel Master Sealant.
> 
> what prewax do you use ?


Supernatural Micro Prime :thumb: the best by :buffer: 
Also I like DJ LPL , Victoria Deep Cleanse , CG EZ Creme .

You have very good LSP , btw Megs 26# and Megs#7 gives warm finish on solid red , if you can find Megs in Brazil try it .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Supernatural Micro Prime :thumb: the best by :buffer:
> Also I like DJ LPL , Victoria Deep Cleanse , CG EZ Creme .
> 
> You have very good LSP , btw Megs 26# and Megs#7 gives warm finish on solid red , if you can find Megs in Brazil try it .


I have : Malco Crazy Plum Glaze, CG Vertua Bond, Werkstat Prime Strong, Prima Amigo

I live in an apartment, so ... i do not have machine... i have to apply all by hand


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> I have : Malco Crazy Plum Glaze, CG Vertua Bond, Werkstat Prime Strong, Prima Amigo
> 
> I live in an apartment, so ... i do not have machine... i have to apply all by hand


No problem You have good prewax :thumb: by hand Victoria Deep Cleanse 3-5 fills light swirls and gives warm finish .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> No problem You have good prewax :thumb: by hand Victoria Deep Cleanse 3-5 fills light swirls and gives warm finish .


let me ask you a stupid question, how much product do I have to put over the pad ? I mean... does a bottle of prewax lasts a long time ? Do you use drops ? If so... how many per panel ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> let me ask you a stupid question, how much product do I have to put over the pad ? I mean... does a bottle of prewax lasts a long time ? Do you use drops ? If so... how many per panel ?


250ml can gives more than 25 coats , I only buy 250ml bottle will last for 2 years easily , you need 3-4 small blob only per panel .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> 250ml can gives more than 25 coats , I only buy 250ml bottle will last for 2 years easily , you need 3-4 small blob only per panel .


that amount of product per panel can be applied on the other prewax products such as : Werkstatt Prime strong, Prima Amigo, Auto Finesse Tripple, Dodo Juice Lime Prime,Vertua Bond 408) .... do you think so ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> that amount of product per panel can be applied on the other prewax products such as : Werkstatt Prime strong, Prima Amigo, Auto Finesse Tripple, Dodo Juice Lime Prime,Vertua Bond 408) .... do you think so ?


Yes , no big difference but maybe you need less with LP beacuse LP oily and spread very well .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Yes , no big difference but maybe you need less with LP beacuse LP oily and spread very well .


thanks, do you think that these stuffs and waxes has really a shelf life ? because I keep all itens at the dark and away from the heat, my main concern is this


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> thanks, do you think that these stuffs and waxes has really a shelf life ? because I keep all itens at the dark and away from the heat, my main concern is this


Easily 4-5 years if you keep it in dark cold place , I found sealant shelf life is short 2-3 years .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> Easily 4-5 years if you keep it in dark cold place , I found sealant shelf life is short 2-3 years .


thanks buddy, by hand... Dodo Juice Lime Prime or Dodo Juice Lime Prime Lite .... both works great ? cause I have got the opportunity to buy Lime Prime of 1 liter ... but i red that the Lite version is better by hand .... what can you tell me ?

I know that Lime Prime has correction capacities ... both version have similar results ? both clean deeply the paint ?

or should I buy the Lite version ? ( cause I do not have a machine)

these products are compatible with any type of wax and sealants ? or just dodo juices waxes ?

I'm really thankfull for all the answers ... you are helping me a lot.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> thanks buddy, by hand... Dodo Juice Lime Prime or Dodo Juice Lime Prime Lite .... both works great ? cause I have got the opportunity to buy Lime Prime of 1 liter ... but i red that the Lite version is better by hand .... what can you tell me ?
> 
> I know that Lime Prime has correction capacities ... both version have similar results ? both clean deeply the paint ?
> 
> ...


LP very good product specially by machine but not for soft paint , LPL by hand cleans very well without correction ability :thumb: Imho Supernatural Micro Prime is the best by hand or machine . If you can buy LPL and SN Micro Prime .


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> LP very good product specially by machine but not for soft paint , LPL by hand cleans very well without correction ability :thumb: Imho Supernatural Micro Prime is the best by hand or machine . If you can buy LPL and SN Micro Prime .


thanks, have you ever used Werkstatt line ? I have Prime Strong from them, what can you tell me about it ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> thanks, have you ever used Werkstatt line ? I have Prime Strong from them, what can you tell me about it ?


I have tried Prime Prep Sealant ( Acrylic ) cleans very well but no my fav I prefer CG EZ Creme or LPL by hand it gives better gloss , I like all Werkstat LSP and QD :thumb:


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> I have tried Prime Prep Sealant ( Acrylic ) cleans very well but no my fav I prefer CG EZ Creme or LPL by hand it gives better gloss , I like all Werkstat LSP and QD :thumb:


thanks again for the answer, do you think that those products( LPL,Prime Strong) can really strips all the wax/sealant ? do I need to use Isopropyl Alcohol to make sure that all the LSP have been removed ? or it's not necessary ?


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

Salo87 said:


> thanks again for the answer, do you think that those products( LPL,Prime Strong) can really strips all the wax/sealant ? do I need to use Isopropyl Alcohol to make sure that all the LSP have been removed ? or it's not necessary ?


LPL and some prewax Can't remove fresh or new coat of wax but can remove old wax , you need prewash APC > IPA > LPL for best result .


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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

Random question guys


I have both souveran and fuzion and both are pretty much the same. Both smell similar Both very hard waxes and both as easy to use as eachother

I no they are both made off the same line if you get me. Only difference i can notice is the colour

Is this right?

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## camerashy (Feb 9, 2014)

MAXI-MILAN said:


> LPL and some prewax Can't remove fresh or new coat of wax but can remove old wax , you need prewash APC > IPA > LPL for best result .


CG CitrusWash CLEAR Shampoo at the right concentration will help to remove old wax/sealants together with what MAXI says


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Kyle 86 said:


> Random question guys
> 
> I have both souveran and fuzion and both are pretty much the same. Both smell similar Both very hard waxes and both as easy to use as eachother
> 
> ...


 Pinnacle is pure ivory nuba and oils.Fuzion is a hybrid with super german polymers.Both stunning also blackfire midnight sun is another cracker :thumb:


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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Pinnacle is pure ivory nuba and oils.Fuzion is a hybrid with super german polymers.Both stunning also blackfire midnight sun is another cracker :thumb:


Yeah there so similar in smell and how they work. Only difference is the ingredients ain't it Al

I was just curious they were both legit haha

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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Kyle 86 said:


> Yeah there so similar in smell and how they work. Only difference is the ingredients ain't it Al
> 
> I was just curious they were both legit haha
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk


 Agree wolfgang and blackfire last longer.I think personally pinnacle is the richest look,blackfire the darkest and Fuzion most reflective.Just wish they were cheaper :driver:


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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Agree wolfgang and blackfire last longer.I think personally pinnacle is the richest look,blackfire the darkest and Fuzion most reflective.Just wish they were cheaper :driver:


Does midnight sun smell pretty much the same aswell al? I've still yet to try my souveran as the cup is still locked away

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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Kyle 86 said:


> Does midnight sun smell pretty much the same aswell al? I've still yet to try my souveran as the cup is still locked away
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk


 Hi pinnacle smells much nicer,don't think there is much between them tbh.


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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

camerashy said:


> CG CitrusWash CLEAR Shampoo at the right concentration will help to remove old wax/sealants together with what MAXI says


Very good shampoo indeed , CG produce new shampoo CG Clean Slate dor same task ! Many shampoo every week they produce new shampoos :lol:


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Lusso revitalising cream is best pre wax cleaner out there IMO even wetter finish than using a glaze.

I bought Chemical Guys EZ Cream Glaze, it is one of the most disappointing products I ever bought for red paint. I got a metallic blue car now so will try it on that.

Maybe P21S wax is good for metallic blue?


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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso revitalising cream is best pre wax cleaner out there IMO even wetter finish than using a glaze.
> 
> I bought Chemical Guys EZ Cream Glaze, it is one of the most disappointing products I ever bought for red paint. I got a metallic blue car now so will try it on that.
> 
> Maybe P21S wax is good for metallic blue?


I need to try lusso revitalising creme but getting it over here is another thing

Agreed with EZ it's pretty pants. Not a CG fan tbh

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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

The Doctor said:


> Lusso revitalising cream is best pre wax cleaner out there IMO even wetter finish than using a glaze.
> 
> I bought Chemical Guys EZ Cream Glaze, it is one of the most disappointing products I ever bought for red paint. I got a metallic blue car now so will try it on that.
> 
> Maybe P21S wax is good for metallic blue?


Doctor, do you know any store that sells both (Lusso Oro Wax + Revitalizing Cream) and have shipping to Brazil ?


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Salo87 said:


> Doctor, do you know any store that sells both (Lusso Oro Wax + Revitalizing Cream) and have shipping to Brazil ?


I think Detailers Domain are the only ones who sell Lusso now? The shampoo is 100% the best there is. Loads of foam, cleans well, smells great and leaves a just waxed finish. I wish I could buy a gallon of it.

Lusso Oro wax is good but its not mind blowing. I wouldn't go crazy to get hold of it but the revitalising cream and shampoo are a must.


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## Salo87 (Oct 22, 2015)

The Doctor said:


> I think Detailers Domain are the only ones who sell Lusso now? The shampoo is 100% the best there is. Loads of foam, cleans well, smells great and leaves a just waxed finish. I wish I could buy a gallon of it.
> 
> Lusso Oro wax is good but its not mind blowing. I wouldn't go crazy to get hold of it but the revitalising cream and shampoo are a must.


Doctor, so... Pinnacle Souveran is the best wax for you ? it's $70 bucks at Autogeek


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## The Doctor (Sep 11, 2007)

Yes pinnacle souveran will not disappoint. Much more WOW factor than Lusso Oro 

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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Can someone explain about pinnacle souveran durability?
If it's layered,topped up with crystal mist,then layered again every other week between coats of crystal mist does durability increase?
I've read that regardless of layering durability is a few weeks?! Confused

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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

durability is poor with souveran, 2 coats lasts 3/4 wks. crystal mist has no durability to it ether. If you dont mind re waxing every few weeks souveran is an awesome wax.


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

Yep cm just refreshes the look,their spray wax is pretty good but pricey.Just buy big jar of the wax and reapply it every couple of weeks.Dont buy the shampoo ,its too expensive imo


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Thanks guys

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## MAXI-MILAN (Oct 26, 2008)

graham1970 said:


> Can someone explain about pinnacle souveran durability?
> If it's layered,topped up with crystal mist,then layered again every other week between coats of crystal mist does durability increase?
> I've read that regardless of layering durability is a few weeks?! Confused
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


Souveran is show wax forget the stamina and durability , always need refresh Souveran look by Crystal mist , Souveran wax for who love rewax the car every weekend . Pinnacle shampoo revive Souveran look and add nice gloss .


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Sounds just what I'm looking for,I have no problem waxing every week...weather dependant, so I'll put a sealant underneath 

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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

I'd go for blackfire midnight sun or Wolfgang fuzion. All very similar including souveran. They are all made at the same place also.....I found R222 to be the best for gloss but thats not durable either 

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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

I have midnightsun kyle, I'm looking for a pure wax,pure glossy indulgence 

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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

I used Pinnacle Souveran on My R32 (Mkiv) exclusively for the time I owned it ( 3years) and just built layers - waxed around every 3 weeks and car always beaded - still my favourite wax of all time


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

WHIZZER said:


> I used Pinnacle Souveran on My R32 (Mkiv) exclusively for the time I owned it ( 3years) and just built layers - waxed around every 3 weeks and car always beaded - still my favourite wax of all time


Thanks whizzer.Been recommended to use some wolfgang v3 underneath, what do you think?

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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

graham1970 said:


> Thanks whizzer.Been recommended to use some wolfgang v3 underneath, what do you think?
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


I Didn't see the need for myself as I kept the car clean and regular re application was all it needed for me :thumb:

But if you have some then im sure it will work great


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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

graham1970 said:


> I have midnightsun kyle, I'm looking for a pure wax,pure glossy indulgence
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


I honestly prefer wolfgang fuzion over souveran. R222 is epic for the money. You won't be disappointed 

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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Fuzion is hybrid,R222 sounds good but I've always wanted to try souveran

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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

graham1970 said:


> Fuzion is hybrid,R222 sounds good but I've always wanted to try souveran
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


Only difference between fuzion and souveran is that fuzion has polymers wheres souveran is more nuba based. Both epic

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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

Exactly mate.

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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Kyle 86 said:


> I honestly prefer wolfgang fuzion over souveran. R222 is epic for the money. You won't be disappointed
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


I think its each to there own as personally R222 is not a patch on souveran, find it better on light or silver, due to its silvery look


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

Kyle 86 said:


> Only difference between fuzion and souveran is that fuzion has polymers wheres souveran is more nuba based. Both epic
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


so souveran is a more pure wax like he wants :thumb:


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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

cheekymonkey said:


> so souveran is a more pure wax like he wants :thumb:


 Its the best imo,any excuse for a sniff of the wax :thumb:


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## cheekymonkey (Mar 15, 2008)

with you there, love the stuff


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> Its the best imo,any excuse for a sniff of the wax :thumb:


Out of interest how many applications do you get out of 8oz....how long does it last?

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## Kyle 86 (Jun 15, 2013)

graham1970 said:


> Out of interest how many applications do you get out of 8oz....how long does it last?
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


Ages its a hard wax :thumb:

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## Ads_ClioV6 (Apr 27, 2014)

graham1970 said:


> Out of interest how many applications do you get out of 8oz....how long does it last?
> 
> Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk


 30 small car easy.Have you recd it yet?


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## graham1970 (Oct 7, 2012)

ADSCLIOCUP said:


> 30 small car easy.Have you recd it yet?


No mate,will probably splash out in a few months.
Motorgeek are kindly sending me out a sample tho

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