# Cautionary tale! Wheel Brightener is strong!



## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

I used WB for the first time the other day, I cut it 4:1 as it says on the bottle, it turned my anodised centre caps white!!! It works great but it is very strong stuff, I won't be using it on my wheels again, I'll stick to PB spray'n'rinse or Virosol. Even Muc-off isn't as strong as WB, I've used all the products mentioned and WB is the only one to turn the caps white!


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## Daffy (Dec 15, 2005)

Did you mix it 4 parts WB to 1 part water or the other way round. Should be 4parts water. You can water it down even more a lot of people go for 10:1 and is just as effective.


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

It does say dont use it on Anodised stuff, must have some amount of acid in it or something.

I don't find it any more harmful than any other wheel cleaner on normal alloys.

Rob


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## adamf (Feb 5, 2006)

WB sounds awesome! is it as powerful as the deadly wonder wheels?

Whats Anodised mean? example picture?


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Means the metal is polished first and then dipped in the solution, either a coloured one or clear i think.

The colour dyes the metal much like dipping clothes in some material dye, the metal actually absorbs the colour. Some wheel cleaners are too harsh and will take this colour out leaving a white looking finish to the metal.

Rob

something that been anodised http://www.fasteronline.co.uk/images/rximg004.jpg


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## Root Ginger (Mar 22, 2006)

Anodising is an electrical process where the part to be treated becomes the anode (positive side) of the circuit. I did this in chemistry at school.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anodising


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## robertdon777 (Nov 3, 2005)

Yeah forgot to mention its done through a charge you can't just go dipping your wheels in a bath full of dye at home 

Rob


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## dino (Oct 26, 2005)

I used it for the first time this morning cut 4:1 but it didn't touch the baked on brake dust 

Will try it 2:1 later on. 

It does say not to use it on anodised wheels though.


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

I just got the sample of it, no instructions on it other than dilute 4:1 written on the bottle, yes I did cut it 4 parts water to 1 part WB, but because I have anodised centre caps I won't use it now, £20 for a new set of caps, WB has ruined them!

Yet another Megs product that I dislike.


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## Solaar (Oct 26, 2005)

I used it a while back and it burnt all the side of my forearm! So it might be wise to wear gloves with it.


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## Neil_S (Oct 26, 2005)

^^ Very good advice, I've got some industrial strength gloves and stay away from the fine mist it generates.


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

I think it would be adviseable for any company selling samples of WB to put some warnings on it since it is so strong, I haven't read anywhere that it wasn't suitable for anodised finishes (since doing a search I found some now - hindsight eh!), it must be on the big 5L container, I can't see WB being very good for wheels if it's so strong, if anyone wants a Megs spray bottle with WB in it, let me know (yes I even got the proper WB spray bottle for it), otherwise it's going in the bin.


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## beardboy (Feb 12, 2006)

What you after for the WB and megs spray?

You could keep the WB, but take your centre caps off each time you clean the wheels.

Mark


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## ChrisGT (Feb 25, 2006)

Ive never tried it but wouldnt mind giving it a go. Ive only ever used wonder wheels


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

Caps are very difficult to remove, you really have to take the wheels off to remove them, stops them being nicked I guess.

I notice the sample bottles of WB shown on the C&S eBay page have printed labels warning about anodised finishes, mine didn't have that label on it, so I have to blame C&S for omitting the warning, no warnings on their site either.

Not worth selling it so I'll just wash the bottle out and use it for Virosol or something else.


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## dino (Oct 26, 2005)

Mine didn't come with a sticky label on the bottle either but had an instruction sheet with it.


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## Johnnyopolis (Oct 25, 2005)

RobDon said:


> Caps are very difficult to remove, you really have to take the wheels off to remove them, stops them being nicked I guess.
> 
> I notice the sample bottles of WB shown on the C&S eBay page have printed labels warning about anodised finishes, mine didn't have that label on it, so I have to blame C&S for omitting the warning, no warnings on their site either.
> 
> Not worth selling it so I'll just wash the bottle out and use it for Virosol or something else.


Rob,

Im sorry that you have had the issues you have with Wheel Brightner today, I am more than happy to refund you the cost of the sample that you bought if you would like to pm me your username.

Your comments have got me thinking about the whole sample thing.

Over the last few hours I have been working out the costings of how much time it takes to make the samples, source the bottles, pack them and deal with the postage etc etc and thats before ebay and paypal fees... To be honest for the return and the agro it causes me I think I am now gonna call it a day and focus purely on C&S.

I have done my upmost to make them as cost effectivly as I can. I think in a lot of instances it has ended up costing me more money than I have sold them for but thats been all good as I want you guys to try as many products as possible!

Perhaps I will get someone in to make some up for the C&S detailing day.

I will be removing the samples from ebay shortly.

Cheers Guys, hope your having a great weekend!


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## Stuart (Nov 26, 2005)

Robdon, You may like to re-read this thread.

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/showthread.php?t=3638


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## Tom1 (Nov 26, 2005)

Rob, 

Im sorry that you have had the issues you have with Wheel Brightner today, I am more than happy to refund you the cost of the sample that you bought if you would like to pm me your username. 

Your comments have got me thinking about the whole sample thing.

Over the last few hours I have been working out the costings of how much time it takes to make the samples, source the bottles, pack them and deal with the postage etc etc and to be honest for the return and the agro it causes me I think I am now gonna call it a day and focus purely on C&S. 

I have done my upmost to make them as cost effectivly as I can. I think in a lot of instances it has ended up costing me more money than I have sold them for but thats been all good as I want you guys to try as many products as possible! 

Perhaps I will get someone in to make some up for the C&S detailing day. 

I will be removing the samples from ebay shortly. 

Cheers Guys, hope your having a great weekend!

I don't think its your problem Johnny, I have read up on here about WB and realised it is quite strong so went for APC. You buy these products and its a learning curve, you make a mistake and its there to see.


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## Johnnyopolis (Oct 25, 2005)

There was a couple of days when I had been so busy that I got the warehouse lads to send out the samples for me, I would never knowingly send something out with out a label or instructions posted up....

Thanks for pointing that post out Stuart :thumb:


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## thechief (Oct 27, 2005)

Rob, you replied to the dilution ratio's thread on 03-29-2006, 07:40 PM where it clearly states 

'NOT FOR USE ON POLISHED ALUMINIUM OR ANODIZED WHEELS.'

I really don't think its fair to blame C&S when you had read this information. If the thread has been edited to include it then i sincerely apologise.


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

I don't think I read everything on the whole post, it was a general comment on it being handy, probably didn't read the WB bit. It's not a huge deal, just a bit miffed it has ruined new caps on new wheels, £20 for a new set of caps. I honestly didn't think that a diluted product was strong enough to strip the anodisation off metal - if i'd known it really was that strong I'd never have touched the stuff.


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## thechief (Oct 27, 2005)

Its definately stronger stuff! 

To be honest mate i'd say the rate most people on here wash their car's it shouldn't be required.

I know the feeling though of having something new ruined, it sucks completely  

From what i've found through experience anodizing is a pretty weak process, won't stop me getting my intercooler done black though :devil:


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

I use Wheel Brightner all the time never had a problem#( for about 2years now), i do dilute with more water than 4:1 for regular use as my wheels are not to dirty 
WB is probably the best wheel cleaner i have used. 

I guess you should be weary of all Wheel cleaners when having anodised caps , as 90% of them contain some kind of strong cleaner. 


I guess bad luck strikes here.


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

Once I get the new caps I'm going to send the old caps off to be chromed or more likely powdercoated black, hopefully they'll be a bit more resilient to chemicals then. I have used Muc-off, Poorboy's spray'n'rinse and diluted Virosol and none of them had any impact on the anodised caps in the way that WB has. I threw the WB away last night and flushed and refilled the WB bottle with Virosol.

I'm assuming all these wheel cleaners must strip any kind of wax or wheel sealant as they are such strong chemicals.

I have decided never to buy any Megs products ever again, usually I'm disappointed with the results they give and some of their chemicals are just too strong for normal non-pro use, too easy to get it wrong, my Megs products are going in the swaps section today.


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## Stuart (Nov 26, 2005)

Yea..... well Wheel Brighter is from the pro range!


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

Thanks for pointing out the obvious.


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## Stuart (Nov 26, 2005)

RobDon said:


> I have decided never to buy any Megs products ever again, usually I'm disappointed with the results they give and some of their chemicals are just too strong for normal non-pro use, too easy to get it wrong, my Megs products are going in the swaps section today.


Well....I think Meguiars designed it for Pros.........Why would they take into consideration a "normal non-pro user" ?


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## Root Ginger (Mar 22, 2006)

I do agree Stuart that RobDon's argument is flawed considering WB is a pro product but everyone has there own views on the different manufacturers, each to their own.

At the end of the day there is nothing at fault with the product. I would think if ha had used wonder wheels, which is the closest you'll come to wheel brightener in a consumer product, it would have caused RobDon the same issues.


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

There is nothing wrong with the product, but my point is that chemicals that are strong enough to strip metal finishes, even when diluted to the correct ratio, should be more controlled (anyone can buy it, it's not restricted to pro detailers in any way), Solaar said he burnt his arm with it too.

I have used Muc-off, PB spray'n'rinse and Virosol on my wheels with no effect on the caps, I had no idea they were anodised until wheel brightener stripped the finish - so my point is not flawed in any way at all.


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## Mr Shiny (Oct 29, 2005)

most wheel cleaners are not to good for your skin, i remember using turtle wax wheel cleaner and i didn't realise that i had some on my arm until it stung like hell and whatever you do don't get it on any cuts that you might have, it kills, LOL. I think every wheel cleaner should say please wear safety gloves with this product wrote on the back to be honest.


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## Alex L (Oct 25, 2005)

Mr Shiny said:


> whatever you do don't get it on any cuts that you might have, it kills, LOL. I think every wheel cleaner should say please wear safety gloves with this product wrote on the back to be honest.


i've done that, not something i'd like to repeat:lol:


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## Naddy37 (Oct 27, 2005)

> Over the last few hours I have been working out the costings of how much time it takes to make the samples, source the bottles, pack them and deal with the postage etc etc and thats before ebay and paypal fees... To be honest for the return and the agro it causes me I think I am now gonna call it a day and focus purely on C&S.
> 
> I have done my upmost to make them as cost effectivly as I can. I think in a lot of instances it has ended up costing me more money than I have sold them for but thats been all good as I want you guys to try as many products as possible!
> 
> ...


 It's a shame this has happened. I always found the samples very helpful and a great way of trying a different product. I found them even more useful seeing as I have half a car...


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## Root Ginger (Mar 22, 2006)

RobDon said:


> There is nothing wrong with the product, but my point is that chemicals that are strong enough to strip metal finishes, even when diluted to the correct ratio, should be more controlled (anyone can buy it, it's not restricted to pro detailers in any way), Solaar said he burnt his arm with it too.
> 
> I have used Muc-off, PB spray'n'rinse and Virosol on my wheels with no effect on the caps, I had no idea they were anodised until wheel brightener stripped the finish - so my point is not flawed in any way at all.


They are controlled, there are specific guidelines that manufacturers have to follow when making these products. They're perfectly safe when handled appropriately and the warnings are followed. Admittedly in your case there was an oversight that meant those warnings were not given to you, but on the original packaging all the appropriate warnings would normally be evident. There are plenty of cleaners on the market that are just as bad if handled incorrectly as WB. Cillit Bang, Oven Cleaner, Bleach. Appropriate warnings should be given and appropriate precautions should be made when using such products.

Out of interest would you have sat down and read through the instructions before spraying on the centre caps of your wheels had the instructions been there? I don't think most people would TBH. Would it of helped you either as you already said you didn't know the caps were anodised?

Not meaning to start an argument but I think this should just be put down to experience and at least this thread might help others be more cautious when using WB which I guess was the original point of it.


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## juli_harris (Oct 26, 2005)

Hi,

I'm sorry that you found WB to be too strong, but this is the first case that I have heard of it stripping off the anodisation from metal.

Our pro range is designed for 'Professional' users, but it is also user friendly enough to be used by serious detailers such as yourselves. We at Meguiar's to try our hardest to make sure that the products are used correctly by giving advice over the telephone, e-mail and forums and also on the packaging.

Wheel Brightener is a strong chemical, but TBH most people find Hot Rims adequate enough as this is the gentlest, but most effective wheel cleaner out there. ASAIK consumer products like Wonder Wheels require you to wear gloves when using them...which IMO are nearly as strong as wheel brightener.

I'm sorry that this has put you off Meguiar's products, but I hope that sometime in the future you will give our products another go, and find them to your liking.

Thanks

Juli @ Meguiar's UK


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

Rob,

Did you know that Virsol is actually designed to clean your toilets !!!!!!!

Most wheel cleaners are likely to be strong at the end of the day they are designed to removed baked on brake dust !!!!. if you clean your wheels regularly you would not need to use a wheel cleaner just shampoo. 

I guess you have been unlucky with the Megs range but Meguiars produce some great products , i guess its just knowing how to use them properly that counts .


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

neilos said:


> It's a shame this has happened. I always found the samples very helpful and a great way of trying a different product. I found them even more useful seeing as I have half a car...


 I agree its a shame that samples wont be available now, i too have used samples to try products of which some i have brought and some i did not like. its an easy way to spend a few pounds instead of spending lots on a product you are not sure about .


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

I do know what Virosol is yes.


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## Brazo (Oct 27, 2005)

WHIZZER said:


> I guess you have been unlucky with the Megs range but Meguiars produce some great products , i guess its just knowing how to use them properly that counts .


Megs is what I cut my teeth on and can still achieve the same results as the latest trendy polishes such as menzerna albeit a touch slower! However given the megs stuf is over half the cost it can make sense!


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

At the end of the day I've had a bad experience with a product and I have a right to voice my opinion about it, I'm not the bad guy here so don't get on my case, the product was diluted correctly but no warnings were on the bottle, not my fault. I've never been much of a fan of Megs stuff, alot less now.


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## Dave KG (Feb 23, 2006)

A lot of it comes down to personal experience and preferrence... Like Brazo I cut my teeth on Megs gear, and still rate it - touch wood I've yet to have a bad experience with any product I've tried, but can understand how a bad experience can certainly put you off of a product range...


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## JimmyChoo (Feb 5, 2006)

RobDon said:


> At the end of the day I've had a bad experience with a product and I have a right to voice my opinion about it, I'm not the bad guy here so don't get on my case, the product was diluted correctly but no warnings were on the bottle, not my fault. I've never been much of a fan of Megs stuff, alot less now.


Like you, everyone else is entitled to have there opinion and comment on yours when you post it on a public forum.... 

Looking at this post, your excuse of no warnings is weak (pardon the pun ) 
Stuart posted a link to a post that you acknoleged (spelling) 10 days before using wheel brightener.....

I have read some of your other posts and can see your knowelegable on lots of products so I am sure you cant be that naive that you want to blame the fact there wasnt a label on a bottle for your centre caps... surely if there isnt you would ask? I know I would.....

And so be my two pence worth 

I use wheel brightener on my wheels and have never had a problem with it, I tried virosol and it was ok, but no where as good as Wheel Brightener, you say your gonna use poorboys as well? Is that as well as the Virosol?

Jimmy


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## 182_Blue (Oct 25, 2005)

RobDon said:


> I used WB for the first time the other day, I cut it 4:1 as it says on the bottle, it turned my anodised centre caps white!!! It works great but it is very strong stuff, I won't be using it on my wheels again, I'll stick to PB spray'n'rinse or Virosol. Even Muc-off isn't as strong as WB, I've used all the products mentioned and WB is the only one to turn the caps white!


you got pics of the caps ??


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## RobDom (Oct 26, 2005)

As mentioned, why bother having a go at me? It's over, subject is finished. No pics no, they are metal caps now white and streaky, can't be bothered taking any pics.


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## Eightball (Nov 21, 2005)

juli_harris said:


> TBH most people find Hot Rims adequate enough as this is the gentlest, but most effective wheel cleaner out there.
> 
> Juli @ Meguiar's UK


Hot Rims is top stuff. Would be even better, and be my wheel cleaner of choice if it came in a decent size.


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## M40COO (Mar 21, 2006)

Guys...I'm with RobDon on this one
- does'nt matter how much homework he may have/have not done regarding reading up on posts ..

Any product (including samples) should come with full instructions, and useage guidance, no matter what.

...also very worth pointing out ... Rob tried it, and got a bad result - but is taking it on the chin.
He's not asking for compensation for the damage.

He's simply telling you his experience with the product.
Just take it as that....I'm sure you've all read this and now know to take a little extra care when using the product.

Give him a break !


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## WHIZZER (Oct 25, 2005)

RobDon said:


> I have used Muc-off, PB spray'n'rinse and Virosol on my wheels with no effect on the caps, I had no idea they were anodised until wheel brightener stripped the finish - so my point is not flawed in any way at all.





RobDon said:


> At the end of the day I've had a bad experience with a product and I have a right to voice my opinion about it, I'm not the bad guy here so don't get on my case, the product was diluted correctly but no warnings were on the bottle, not my fault. I've never been much of a fan of Megs stuff, alot less now.


I glad you did raise the subject on here as unfortunately for you  but perhaps fortunately for others it shows how strong a pro range of product can differ from a consumer range,even if the instructions were on the bottle you would have still used it as you pointed out that you did not know that your centre caps were anodised.

I agree that instructions should have come with the sample but you also clearly read a post about instructions on Wheel Brightner so to blame a sample bottle that had not instructions is a bit unfair.

I can also understand why a bad experience with one product might put you off the range but keep an open mind Megs do produce some really good products ( for a reasonable price) that are equal to some of the more fashionable products out there.

I suppose we all have had a bad experience at one time or another and off topic i hope some of the new Pc users are careful with some of the pro polishes !


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## Rich @ PB (Oct 26, 2005)

The reason I won't stock Megs WB in the store is that in my opinion it's too strong for consumer use. I use it all the time in my role as weekend warrior, as many of the cars I get to do need it if I'm going to get the job done in a day, but there is no way I'd use WB on my own wheels as they are fairly well cared for and a strong cleaner is unnecessary. A few unfair comments aimed at Rob methinks - we don't absorb everything we read, and instructions are a must for any product that can harm if used incorrectly. Good man Johnny for apologising though.


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## BenP (Dec 2, 2005)

WB is IMO the best wheel cleaner out there. Even cut 4:1 it's taken all the crap of everything I've shown it to. It is potent though, and I can easily understand the frustration that Rob has suffered. I've had a similar experience in the past and I think it resulted in me throwing the product across the garage in rage!

If there's any chance that a part of a wheel I'm going to use it on might not like it, I get the P21S out instead, but 9 times out of ten, a shot of WB and a pressure washer is just such a quick way to clean wheels that I almost use it exclusively.

Ben


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## Johnnyopolis (Oct 25, 2005)

I would like to see the pics of what wheel brightener has done to the centre caps though.... 

Obviously if thats not too much of a problem to you Rob  

Thanks to Robs comments it did open our eyes to the exposure we have let ourselves into hence why we have stopped the samples straight away!


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## Admin (Oct 25, 2005)

Right,

This post will just keep going on and on so I have now locked it. 

Robdon, if you could send some pics over to Johnny I am sure he would appreciate it. 

Everyone else, If your going to use wheel brightener make sure its not on anodised wheels! Also as Whizzer has said take care when using ANY wheel cleaner. 

Happy Damn Monday


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