# Is my sealant muting my metallic flake popping?



## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

I have a Dolphin grey metallic Audi A4 and have recently given it a good clean and used Lime Prime followed up with Poorboys EX sealant and Collinite 476 over the top. But I feel this is possibly muting the flake pop a bit.

When i brought the car before I had a chance to clean it properly after the first wash I gave it I sprayed some Dodo Juice Red Mist Tropical onto it to add some protection and this seemed to give a better finish with the flake seeming to pop more.

I have looked on Poorboys site and they say EX sealant is suitable for flat/solid colours while EX-P is more suited to metallic finishes.

Should I consider switching my sealant to either EX-P or one of the spray on products like AF Tough Coat,Werkstat Acrylic Jett or Dodo Juice Red Mist/Supernatural Acrylic Spritz?

If switching is it worth getting the correct paint prep to go with them?


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

You want a decent polymer glaze and sealant for flake pop. Try amigo topped with something like blackfires wet diamond, stunning!


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

Anyone else?


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Ian-83 said:


> Anyone else?


You're welcome :thumb:


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## s.bailey (Mar 2, 2012)

stangalang said:


> You're welcome :thumb:


Haha well said. Don't know why some people act like people are here purely to help them. Leave them to it mate!!


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## Guest (Jul 28, 2012)

Gtechniq C1.5 

Dodo juice Acrylic spritz

Werkstat Acrylic Jett Trigger

I have found these give great flake pop and are a doddle to apply, and a thanks dont't go a miss :thumb:


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## msb (Dec 20, 2009)

suspect the 476 was your problem, toughcoat is great and doesn't mute flake pop. Also concours car cares liquidshield is a great alternative thats also great at not muting the flake pop and its slightly cheaper than tc


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

I have found as well 476 does mute the flake from the paint, but the protection it offers is high up the scales, great winter wax.

Stangalang's recommendations are always spot on here, have not tried the products he has mentioned, but would certainly take his advice on board strongly, he knows his products and paint very well.


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## Grommit (May 3, 2011)

stangalang said:


> You're welcome :thumb:


LOL'age


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## Sneak Attack (Mar 1, 2012)

The wax will mute the flake more than the sealant. 

Likewise, any product with fillers/glazing oils will mute flake.


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

Ian-83 said:


> I have a Dolphin grey metallic Audi A4 and have recently given it a good clean and used Lime Prime followed up with Poorboys EX sealant and Collinite 476 over the top. But I feel this is possibly muting the flake pop a bit.
> 
> When i brought the car before I had a chance to clean it properly after the first wash I gave it I sprayed some Dodo Juice Red Mist Tropical onto it to add some protection and this seemed to give a better finish with the flake seeming to pop more.
> 
> ...


476 is your problem it is known to mute the pop a bit.

red mist i would not use really IMHO your simply removing some of the colly tbh.

doing this process is overkill really.

I would go werkstat but that is the product i have experience with and in regard to layering and top ups you can simply use the same products over and over none of this red mist extra jazz.


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## Radlin (Aug 18, 2011)

Werkstatt Prime & Jett or AF Toughcoat IMO and my experience of getting my Met Silver to 'pop'


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

I do apologise to Stangalang for not thanking him for his post, briefly read his reply before I posted seeing if anyone else had any opinions next time I will slow up and thank anyone's advice. Thank you to everyone who has posted recommends

Think I will try the Werkstat route seems from other posts it gives good results and metallic pop.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Lol sorry about that just trying to raise a common problem, which I honestly don't think you have. No thanks required, it's just an unfortunate truth this site has become a place people "expect" answers like it's google or something. I genuinely hope you find some suitable products, and as it's already been said now colli is your problem, there are much better products out there and the fun is in the trying. My best advice is hit the sales thread on here, buy off trusted people and try stuff that's suggested to you. If you not like it you can always sell it on :thumb:

Matt


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## Ninja59 (Feb 17, 2009)

stangalang said:


> Lol sorry about that just trying to raise a common problem, which I honestly don't think you have. No thanks required, it's just an unfortunate truth this site has become a place people "expect" answers like it's google or something. I genuinely hope you find some suitable products, and as it's already been said now colli is your problem, there are much better products out there and the fun is in the trying. My best advice is hit the sales thread on here, buy off trusted people and try stuff that's suggested to you. If you not like it you can always sell it on :thumb:
> 
> Matt


depends how you define "better" there are very few "better" durable "waxes" for winter. But we all know the finish offered by it is not perfect.

Vics concourse and co offer brilliant looks but not so brilliant durability in comparison.

got to be a wee bit careful stating that.


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## stangalang (Nov 27, 2009)

Ninja59 said:


> depends how you define "better" there are very few "better" durable "waxes" for winter. But we all know the finish offered by it is not perfect.
> 
> Vics concourse and co offer brilliant looks but not so brilliant durability in comparison.
> 
> got to be a wee bit careful stating that.


I guess this is where we disagree for once, if something lasts an age, but reduces aesthetics for the duration I don't class it as a good product, I class it as nothing more than durable. Tis just my opinion but I have no problems saying it.


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## millns84 (Jul 5, 2009)

FK1000p would be a good option. It lasts like collinite but doesn't mute the flake IMO. 

Tough Coat's another option as others have mentioned, although I haven't seen the durability tested yet (only applied it a week ago for the first time).


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## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

You have to ask yourself why youve put 476 over the top in the first place? What was the reasoning behind it or was you told it did something magical?


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

HeavenlyDetail said:


> You have to ask yourself why youve put 476 over the top in the first place? What was the reasoning behind it or was you told it did something magical?


Besides some Poorboys EX sealant and now a tiny amount of red mist tropical, Collinite 476 is the only other lsp I have. Mainly brought it when I started out after reading its durability was good specially for winter time. Just used it as course really now but getting into detailing more and seeing products more suitable for my current car I have realised its limitations and drawbacks.


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

stangalang said:


> Lol sorry about that just trying to raise a common problem, which I honestly don't think you have. No thanks required, it's just an unfortunate truth this site has become a place people "expect" answers like it's google or something. I genuinely hope you find some suitable products, and as it's already been said now colli is your problem, there are much better products out there and the fun is in the trying. My best advice is hit the sales thread on here, buy off trusted people and try stuff that's suggested to you. If you not like it you can always sell it on :thumb:
> 
> Matt


Hopefully I can find something in the sales threads that's suitable, just don't want to end up with loads of products not getting used really. Seems a waste for them to just sit unused.


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## HeavenlyDetail (Sep 22, 2006)

Ian-83 said:


> Besides some Poorboys EX sealant and now a tiny amount of red mist tropical, Collinite 476 is the only other lsp I have. Mainly brought it when I started out after reading its durability was good specially for winter time. Just used it as course really now but getting into detailing more and seeing products more suitable for my current car I have realised its limitations and drawbacks.


Yep colly in the world of transport would be described as an oil tanker so good for winter but i would have stuck to EX for the flake and colly for the winter, i wouldnt as your now realising have doubled them up.


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

Ok thanks for that. I might clean a panel back tomorrow and just pop some Poorboys EX on while the weather is still nice and see how it compares to the panels with Collinite on as well.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

OP, if I was in your shoes, I would buy a panel pot of Dodojuice supernatural;, which comes at £15, you will get a 3 too 4 coats on the car or even more, try and error.
You can always step up the mark, and go for DodoJuice supernatural Hybrid, Bouncers 22 or Autoglym HD Wax, which is more money but you get a larger pot of each.

For winter stick with collie 476, it's a very durable wax, and has plenty of stamina.

Thought I would recommend a few waxes for you to try; all these waxes are decent and perform very well for it's price and performance, and I rate these waxes very highly from myself :thumb:

Good luck and keep us informed how you get on :thumb:


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## Sneak Attack (Mar 1, 2012)

Trip tdi said:


> OP, if I was in your shoes, I would buy a panel pot of Dodojuice supernatural;, which comes at £15, you will get a 3 too 4 coats on the car or even more, try and error.
> You can always step up the mark, and go for DodoJuice supernatural Hybrid, Bouncers 22 or Autoglym HD Wax, which is more money but you get a larger pot of each.
> 
> For winter stick with collie 476, it's a very durable wax, and has plenty of stamina.
> ...


Not tried Bouncers so no comment there but SN is over-hyped in my view and AG HD; well that is one overpriced product in my view!

You'd get 2 or 3 tubs of Poorboys Natty's Blue for the price of one HD and the Natty's is about as durable (maybe more durable) and looks just as good.

I never understand the mentality of wax for winter either; a sealant is way, way better.

Think about how a wax bonds to the paint surface; a sealant bonds in a more uniform way and gives far better protection. It also gives a more slick surface, helping to stop dirt, grime and salt bonding and also makes cleaning much easier.

Back to flake pop: does Lime Prime have fillers/glazing agents in it? If so, these could be affecting the flake pop. I certainly notice glazes hide the flake a bit.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Sneak Attack said:


> Not tried Bouncers so no comment there but SN is over-hyped in my view and AG HD; well that is one overpriced product in my view!
> 
> You'd get 2 or 3 tubs of Poorboys Natty's Blue for the price of one HD and the Natty's is about as durable (maybe more durable) and looks just as good.
> 
> ...


Well every one has different views, some people prefer sealants are the way to go, some prefer waxes, each of there own have there place in the car cleaning sector for the individual user.
I would say Autoglym HD wax is not over priced, you can get the package for £30.00 easy, if you try, and this wax has been tested by self, and is a great wax.

As of lime prime, and lime prime lite, this product does contain oil contents, can't see this product muting flakes from the paint, it's like a glaze, slight wetting agent :thumb:

Above was just my personal views of my experience with the waxes I have tried, they work on my paint with no issues :thumb:


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## Sneak Attack (Mar 1, 2012)

Trip tdi said:


> Well every one has different views, some people prefer sealants are the way to go, some prefer waxes, each of there own have there place in the car cleaning sector for the individual user.
> I would say Autoglym HD wax is not over priced, you can get the package for £30.00 easy, if you try, and this wax has been tested by self, and is a great wax.
> 
> As of lime prime, and lime prime lite, this product does contain oil contents, can't see this product muting flakes from the paint, it's like a glaze, slight wetting agent :thumb:
> ...


Natty's Blue: £14. In my experience far superior to HD.

There's always preference and different opinion, but there's also logic and the point I was making about sealants and waxes was that _logically_ a sealant makes more sense for winter.

Glazes, of all kinds, in my experience, mute flake to an extent.


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## dogma (Feb 12, 2008)

I have a metallic red speed6 and I found a lot of products mute the flake on mine.
What I found that doesn't are the following Prima Amigo followed by Hydro,hydro seal and banana gloss. HD Nitroseal and my new favorite wolfs body wrap. For wax I liked vics chaos, sn hybrid , clearkotes cmw.


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

After all the opinions and advice I have decided to give the Werkstat Acrylic kit a try. Can't wait for it to turn up hope the weather is nice this weekend to apply it.


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## s.bailey (Mar 2, 2012)

If you have a DA then IMO you get fastwr and far superior results by machine.


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

s.bailey said:


> If you have a DA then IMO you get fastwr and far superior results by machine.


Not enough penny's in the jar for a DA yet


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## s.bailey (Mar 2, 2012)

No worries its still excellent by hand.


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## Trip tdi (Sep 3, 2008)

Just would like to know, how does Amigo compare to SRP, does Amigo give better correcting ability or more gloss.

Thought I would ask, as I'm not familiar with Amigo, but know the strengths of the old SRP plus the new version as well.


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## dogma (Feb 12, 2008)

Ian-83 said:


> After all the opinions and advice I have decided to give the Werkstat Acrylic kit a try. Can't wait for it to turn up hope the weather is nice this weekend to apply it.


For me Werkstat really muted my metallic ,it did however really darken the paint.
I used prime then AJ and AJ trigger.


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## Scotty Pro (Nov 12, 2008)

Ian-83 said:


> After all the opinions and advice I have decided to give the Werkstat Acrylic kit a try. Can't wait for it to turn up hope the weather is nice this weekend to apply it.


Good choice :thumb: make sure you do the prep work before hand, it will pay off when you lay down the Werkstat.

Oh, and use the colly for your wheels, couple of coats makes the wheels real easy to wash off with the jetwash.


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## Junior Bear (Sep 2, 2008)

dogma said:


> For me Werkstat really muted my metallic ,it did however really darken the paint.
> I used prime then AJ and AJ trigger.


I agree, I found werkstatt acrylic to mute my silver car, but had a really nice milky depth of gloss to it. Which was different 

A sealant that gave me a good flake is gtechniq c1.5

If you like waxes though, try af temptation. Many will tell you it's all in the prep, but I just washed, dried, then waxed with temptation (lazy, but wanted to try the wax for practice, not fussed about durability) and it Didn't mute my flake at all, it amplified it  woweeeee










Beads nice too










Give it a try

JB


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## Ian-83 (Mar 28, 2011)

dogma said:


> For me Werkstat really muted my metallic ,it did however really darken the paint.
> I used prime then AJ and AJ trigger.


Hmm I have seen good results from it but going purely based on what I have seen and reading reviews on here. I don't mind if it gives the paint some more gloss. Can't be any worse than what I am currently using.



Scotty Pro said:


> Good choice :thumb: make sure you do the prep work before hand, it will pay off when you lay down the Werkstat.
> 
> Oh, and use the colly for your wheels, couple of coats makes the wheels real easy to wash off with the jetwash.


Going to make sure the surface is prepped well. Got a few minor RDS to deal with first. As for using Colly on the wheels all ready have Poorboys wheel sealant which is barely used. Sometimes I wish I had done more research when first starting out but the fun of it is trying new products out.


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